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Ask HN: Keyboard Recommendations?
10 points by d4ft on Nov 14, 2009 | hide | past | favorite | 29 comments
Hi all-

I am currently in the market for a new keyboard. I do a fair amount of hacking and am looking for suggestions for comfortable, reasonably priced options.

So, what say you?




I am in love with my Microsoft Natural Ergonomic Keyboard 4000. Of course, if you don't like split keyboards, it is probably not for you. The two things like like about it most are the soft faux-leather palm wrest (very comfy), and the negative slope shim that it comes with. The shim makes the keyboard incline away from you slightly, which I find provides a more comfortable wrist angle.

There is, for me, one downside. I hate the F-Lock key with a passion. It turns the F keys into stupid M$ buttons when it is toggled on. For me, as a Linux developer, this means that my hotkeys start doing crazy stuff whenever I bump the F-Lock key. I really should get around to popping it off the keyboard.

Other than that, it is a good solid keyboard. I work on this thing for around 10-14 hours a day, and it has been pretty easy on my wrists.


I hate the Microsoft Natural 4000 so much - I have one here. Apart from the split layout there's not much for me to recommend.

Problems I've faced on it are: 1) Long spacebar with pressing mechanism in the centre. Pushing from the side (where my thumb is) creates a slight resistance in the centre plastic which then causes a louder clack when it gives way. This is noticeable when working in a silent room, and noticeable on my fingers.

2) Too much key travel on all keys - when I went back to typing on my mac after using my 4000 for 6 months, I couldn't believe how much more relaxed my fingers were after not having to press so far down with the keys.

I think the MS Natural 4000 keyboard is designed for people who aren't aware of their fingers but think they're getting ergonomic benefits just from a split keyboard with a faux-leather palm rest. I tried many of these MS 4000 keyboards and they all had the same design that I consider to be a flaw.


I'm actually quite aware of my fingers. I have been playing piano, banjo, and several other instruments on a fairly regular basis for around 15 years now. If that doesn't make me "aware of my fingers," I'm not sure what would.

I don't see why having to press a key down slightly farther is necessarily a problem. If your forearms and wrists are in a comfortable position, it doesn't much matter how far your fingers have to move. In fact, I tend to think that a bit more movement is actually helpful with circulation.

You're entitled to your opinion of the keyboard, but I think it was just downright rude to say that the keyboard was designed for unaware sheeple like me.


> I hate the F-Lock key with a passion. I haven't managed to hit f-lock by accident. The older Microsoft keyboards didn't remember the f-lock state between reboots. THAT was annoying.


My Kinesis Advantage meets at least one of your criteria. ;)

http://www.kinesis-ergo.com/advantage.htm

And given that I spend so much of my life in front of a keyboard, I'd argue that the Kinesis is reasonably priced, for me. But your mileage may vary.


I would purchase it in a heartbeat (despite its humongous pricetag) if it had dead keys. I live in the US, but speak other languages as well -- to put accents on certain letters, I need to use dead keys.


I've gotten around this by enforcing that kind of thing in software by using the US-International layout.

I speak English and German, so while I can transliterate ä, ö, ü, and ß, I don't particularly want to. Instead, I just type AltGr+q, AltGr+p, AltGr+y, and AltGr+s. There are dead keys for other diacritics.


But there isn't an AltGr key on that keyboard! I actually have AltGr mapped to my right alt. There's only one alt keyboard in that key


Sorry, this isn't very helpful, but I thought I'd take this opportunity to show the world this keyboard:

http://www.walyou.com/img/datahand-keyboard.jpg

Actually, I did have a coworker who used this. He typed absurdly fast with it. However, whenever someone else wanted to use his computer, he went on a search for a regular keyboard.


I was a fan of this for ages, then I bought one from ebay.

Good things: It's a great design and it's easy to pick up since it's a lot like wrapping the top and bottom qwerty lines up around your fingers - the same fingers for many of the same keys, but no chance of misreaching and mashing two keys. The keys are magnetically held, and you push them out through an optical sensor - so there is a definite feel of breaking the magnetic grip, but you aren't whacking your fingers into a solid stop like a normal keyboard.

Bad things: The one I have is old and emulates a serial mouse, and Microsoft took serial mouse support out of Vista. The mouse emulation is serviceable but not brilliant. It's slightly awkward to extract your hand to reach for a mouse without pressing keys. You can't type one handed and hold a mouse/phone/mug of tea. No numeric keypad.

At work, the need for a mouse and phone made it awkward, at home I don't type enough solid blocks of text on a desktop computer (it's not much good for laptop use either).

I still like it and like the idea, but it's in a box, unused, because it's mildly inconvenient.


Another point of experience: out of the box it is pretty poor if you work on the macintosh; by default there's nothing mapped to "command" and there're not enough "keys" on it to remap anything to command without giving up something else you probably need (like shift or alt or control).

You can work around this with a footswitch but it's another point to keep in mind.

Mine suffered a similar fate to yours: in a box, awaiting some future period where I have enough downtime to ride out a month or two of reduced typing speed to train myself.


IBM Model M. Noisy as hell, built like a tank, best tactile feedback around (due to the buckling spring technology). Currently made and sold by Unicomp (http://pckeyboards.stores.yahoo.net).


I've really come to like Apple's default keyboard; the keys are extremely flat, spaced apart, and almost silent. Although, the function keys are half-sized for no good reason.


The apple keyboard is my preference too, but the wired one with the numpad! I have no idea why they didn't make a wireless one with a numpad :(


If you are looking for a Windows-style clone of this keyboard, I have been quite pleased with the Logitech Illuminated Keyboard on my Windows machine.

http://www.logitech.com/index.cfm/keyboards/keyboard/devices...


The kensington slim type is the best kb I ever had out of my 18 yrs or so of computer usage. It's tactical feel best even the Lenovo laptop keypad. It is one of few kbs that has 4.5 stars rating from 100+ users on amazon. It's also one of few kbs that is not a mile wide. I just wish they just drop the numpad all together, or at least make a version that did.

My only quest in finding a better kb is to find a relatively good kb that doesn't have the numpad (I dislike extra travel space to the mouse).

I don't think there are any good kb for < $60 that drops the numpad. I had some el cheapos from Fry's that didn't have the numpad, but they aren't as good and the key placements are not the normal settings. The apple kb is no where near as good as the slim type for me, and it doesn't have delete key and it's well over $60. The only ones I know are ones like logitech makes that comes with kb and numpad separated, but they are close to or over $100.


I use a couple of small form-factor IBM keyboards I bought on sale for about $10 each a few years ago...looks like the Rapid Access III is the current model that looks pretty much the same, and they sell for ~$50. IBM historically makes really solid keyboards with a nice feel. The small form-factor brings Esc and Del/Home/PgUp/PgDn closer to the home row, without losing the number pad.

They're about five years old now, and probably due for replacement (they still work fine, but five years worth of heavy use tends to make keyboards kinda gross and key labels fade and such). I looked at the new Apple keyboards when I was at the Apple store with a friend, and for the first time in my life felt a pretty strong desire for an Apple product. They look amazing. I'm not sure I'll actually like it better than the IBM for long term use, though. But I suspect that'll be my next keyboard, at least to give it a try.


The microsoft internet keyboard has all the trappings of the perfect keyboard. (except it is not USB.) The arrow keys are in the preferred upside down tee, it has a huge delete button, the home and end keys are in the correct logical left to right order, the page up and page down are in the correct up and down configuration. Split keys are there for ergonomics and it is fairly cheap.

http://www.google.com/products/catalog?hl=en&safe=off...

I don't know about those sellers but that is the keyboard that I love.


I've been really happy with my Das Keyboard Professional. I've been using it as my main keyboard since it was first released about 15 months ago.

http://www.daskeyboard.com/daskeyboard_original_professional...

The only downside is the $129 USD price. You'll have to decide if it's "reasonably priced". I got nice discount on a pre-order, but at this point I would gladly pay more. This thing doesn't show any signs of ever dying on me though.

Update: I just checked and it's actually on sale right now for $109 USD.


I own a older version of "das Keyboard" which is actually a Cherry-G80 OEM (which I also own, and a unnamed clicky DEC Alpha Workstation PS/2 keyboard). They all give great feedback and I prefer them for typing larger amounts of text. Of course they are absurdly lound, and I'm happy that my coworkers don't complain (too much).

On the other hand, I detest keyboards that only use a soft rubbery membrane that feels like I'd dip my fingertips into honey (which is basically every keyboard that nowadays is shipped with cheap systems). While it may sound illogical, using those for anything larger than a simple blog-post and my hands begin to hurt. Maybe because the lack of feedback makes me assume a unhealthy hand-posture?


I love the old clicky keyboards. The ergonomic split keyboard feels like mush and these laptop keys are too slick. I do like the latest chicklet Apple keyboards. I went in with the expectation that it would be weird and unenjoyable, but I acclimated quickly and achieved incredible typing speed.


Yes, it's the clicky mechanical switches that make this keyboard so nice. I don't know of any other keyboard that has these in a nice modern package. The sleek black look and USB hub are just icing on top.


"I know why you're here, d4ft. I know what you've been doing … why you hardly sleep, why you live alone, and why night after night, you sit by your computer. You're looking for it. I know because I was once looking for the same thing. And when it found me, I realized I wasn't really looking for it. I was looking for an answer. It's the question that drives us, d4ft. It's the question that brought you here. You know the question, just as I did."

"What is the ultimate keyboard?"

"The answer is out there, d4ft, and it's looking for you, and it will find you if you want it to"


Kinesis Freestyle. I bought mine for $90 from an online retailer, and I turned around and bought the VIP kit for another $40.

In retrospect, I wish that I would've spent the extra bucks on the longer cable connecting the two pieces together. There're nuts on the underside of the thing that look like they'll accept screws for mounting it to half-assed hardware for attaching it to, e.g., a chair.


I really like IBM/Lenovo ThinkPad keyboards, mainly for the trackpoint ("pencil eraser" mouse device), which requires less hand movement than a typical trackpad, mouse, or trackball.

They have an external USB version for desktop use: http://lenovoblogs.com/designmatters/?p=2364


Cool. I wish the trackpoint was available on any of the split keyboards...


I have an old SGI keyboard that I'm totally partial to. The previous one died about a year ago and I searched high and low for another, finally buying a complete indy just for the keyboard.

It's heavy, sturdy and doesn't move around on the desk when I type.

You'll have to pry it from my cold dead hands if you want it though :)


I recommend the happy hacking keyboard professional 2. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Happy_Hacking_Keyboard


for anyone interested in getting the best keyboard possible, check http//:geekhack.org. Nowhere on the net will you find more keyboard knowledge.

I have + ~5 keyboards. Using a kinesis contour now.




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