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Ask HN: How do you manage time between working and “absorption”?
49 points by SergeyDruid on Sept 1, 2014 | hide | past | favorite | 37 comments
So it is Monday and as always I returned to my daily job refreshed by a restful weekend.

Pick up a coffee and zap work like hell.

I don't feel the urge on Mondays on checking news here on HN, neither news/posts/tutorials on the 11 other websites which I follow everyday, by opening their tabs almost mechanically and reading them fast impulsively (after all, I'm at work).

The problem starts when I'm in mid-week, I probably check those websites every 30 minutes, trying to absorb new information.

So a few questions here:

1) How do you manage this urge of knowledge?

2) How do you manage then to balance work / "absorption"?

3) How do you organize this new information? (personally I have 6 distinct categories [(H)news, generic articles, design inspiration, coding tutorials, design tutorials, new coding tools or technologies])

4) I'm alone here with this problem?

Thank you all in advance,

/coffee finished




If I'm honest, I'm well aware of the fact that my motivation to spend time on HN is not to learn things. The way I think is very much aligned with what goes on on HN, so being here confirms my biases very nicely. HN doesn't challenge the way I think so I enjoy being on here and feel quite relaxed about posting. That's not to say I don't learn things, but when I do it's serendipitous rather than intentional.

As such, it seems unlikely (to me) that anyone would be checking back here every 30 minutes in order to find new information or inspiration. It's sounds like you're avoiding something.


I don't think you necessarily learn things here, but I do find a lot of "I should read more on that, it sounds useful".


Hi, thanks for the reply,

I think that I'm trying to avoid 2 things here:

A: disorganization of this information and

B: Procrastination (I dind't mention procrastination in my post because I didn't want it to be "procrastination-centered")


Hi.

I think it is common problem.

With HN and Reddit I got rule that I am reading the top 10 posts and that's all. Not that bottom 20 wasn't worth reading, but there is no limit to absorption if you don't make one.

Second trick is "Stay Focused" Chrome extension. You can add there your favorite absorption sites and set time limit how much a day you can spend on them. After you use your daily quota it shows you "Shouldn't you be working page". Pro tip: change it for redirect to Google or your corporate page. You don't want your boss seeing that page and having first thought: "So, he hasn't been working!". It makes worse impression than seeing you actually reading some tutorial.

For the procrastination enemies use Block Site Chrome extension to block them completely.

At the end, I think it's ok to absorb reasonably in work. Your work is not repetitive manual job. Once in a while, you have to give your brain a rest to be productive. Unless it turns into procrastination (I bet it happens sometimes) I think HN widens your horizons. It's not the same as bing bing and sweet kitten photos - it pays back for your employer too and you need regular breaks anyway.


Hi, thank you for the reply!

"there is no limit to absorption if you don't make one" -excellent suggestion

I cheked out "Stay Focused", very useful extension!


I keep a folder of daily bookmarks that I empty at the end of the day. During my morning coffee / breakfast I look through reddit and HN and bookmark anything that I'd want to read later. Over lunch, I read, and at night I read anything left over / that still interests me. Naturally, I end up reading other things, but I find this method establishes a priority for 'reading time'.

Mind you, I've been in a rough schedule to control all types of information since I work at home and have struggled with stopping work.

I do email / administrative tasks for the day for an hour. Out of that work I have my to-do list for the day that is amended to the to-do list I compile at the end of my day.

I work until 12:30, watch Star Trek TNG and read over lunch, give a brief glance for any urgent emails. I then continue working til the end of day (about 5pm) then check my emails again and add items to the next day's to-do list.

If I'm home after dinner I'll catch up on reading, watch some shows and contribute to different communities.

This isn't set in stone, but it's a rough pattern I've had for years. Before I had this pattern I was spreading myself thin and it was causing a lot of stress.

On slower days I will read more, but I still do my best to maintain the bookmark and read later pattern.


Yup. This is similar to what I do.

Following a pattern helps a lot.


I work from home and the lines are very blurred. I can code for 12 hours one day, and then the next day do no coding at all. Then a few hours on the weekend while the girlfriend is sleeping. Then I make a trip up to the office once a week and put in a 16 hour day (including bullshitting and ping pong, though) and sleep in.

I really like being focused on tasks rather than being busy at work. As long as I accomplish things, there should be no issue about my productivity.

Suddenly, there is no procrastinating. It's just time I happen not to spend working.


I read somewhere that you should try to write a summary of everything you read. This is supposed to help you realize how little new information there is and let you learn avoiding substance-less articles. Or something like that. Can't find the source for this right now, anyone?


One thing that helps me not feel I'm "loosing" out on some great posts I want to read is using a kindle; I still open lots of articles up from HN or twitter but just for a few minutes, if anything grabs my fancy I send it to Kindle, then on the way home or when I'm lounging around with some dead time I can catch up with everything.

(I'm using a chrome extension by klip.me: https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/ipkfnchcgalnafehpg...). I've never had a good experience with code on them, the formatting always messes up, but for lengthy, 'discussion' pieces it's great.


Never had a Kindle, but I think the mechanics are similar to Pocket


Excellent question that probably affects all of us! Try to set a schedule like: 30 minutes every morning and 30 minutes every evening. The most difficult part is to stick to the rule :)


1. Realize that not everything is equally important and you often can't tell what is. Just relax and trust yourself to pick the right parts.

2. I work at home, it depends on the day. Other people in offices check Facebook half the time and stop working at friday noon. Why not read an article in between.

3. I use Chrome and my bookmark bar is organized as follows:

. folder "d" for "daily" -> my reading schedule is rightclicking this and selecting "open all bookmarks". contains about 10 websites, now and then some are added, sometimes I delete some. I don't read all of them all the time.

. folder "a" for "archive" -> general non-specific archive. things I like or maybe want to see again at some unknown point in the far future go in there. Every couple of weeks/months I check the stuff in there.

. some folders for topics or projects, also short abbreviation "mth" for math, "ai" for ai, "ft" for "future", "arch" for architecture and so on. Unicode Symbols as well. "♪" for piano-stuff.

Now the important part: These folders fill up about 15% of my bookmark bar. If I see something and I want to read it, but don't have time right now, I add it to the bookmark bar itself. If the bar starts to overflow and stays overflown for a day or two, I start deleting or reading things in the bar. (Or throwing it in the general archive). Works very well for me.

4. No :).


Thanks for the answer,

I think that the key is that "not everything is equally important to me".

Regarding categories, I use a similar categorization, except for those you call "a" (I call them "session_1" ,2, 3, etc..), I still have the first folders from 2011, and some bookmarks are already dead! :D


There's nothing wrong with reading and absorbing new knowledge. It's doing it before you've done your important work. When you're done, you can (and should) indulge in activities you find relaxing and beneficial. Helps us stay informed and prevent burn out in the long run.

I ran into the same issue a year back and I ended up building a Chrome extension that helps remind you of what you should be doing every time you open a new tab: https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/dayboard-new-tab-p...

It does other things like helping you plan daily, figure out what's worth doing or not, help you cut down switching costs (i.e. when you do end up getting distracted), single handle your tasks, etc - but that's icing on the cake.

It's a different approach to extensions that block distracting sites, which while useful, I think misses the point. (The point is to focus on what you should be doing, not just block what you shouldn't be doing. Plus, there are times I think it's appropriate to read HN, Reddit, FB, Twitter, Wikipedia etc.)

Also, anecdotally, I can tell you a lot of my users fall in the same pattern where they're most productive on Mondays but get progressively less productive throughout the week. You're definitely not alone. I haven't dug into the data and I have a relatively small sample but if you dig around, I'm sure there are blog posts that talks about this already.


Thank you for linking the extension, I'll try it out!

At first glance I think that it can be more useful (for me) in the overall daily/personal tasks instead of the work ones.


Cool - let me know how it works out! :)


I have spent quite a bit of time on this over the past few years, mainly because I know it's a problem for me and for many others.

Like any hacker, my plan is to build something. I've started off with a personal news aggregation site that visits the places I normally go and creates a "Newspaper" of plain-text articles I can read without all the engagement/addiction/distraction stuff.

I find if nothing else, this allows me to consume a lot more! So I'm not sure I'm solving it. But once I get that nailed, I'm going to do statistical text analysis to reduce interesting articles to summaries. I find many times that because I begin reading an article, I feel as if I should continue to the end. If I had only a paragraph, with no easy way of continuing? (With perhaps a "Save for later" button that would make the article available in four hours or something) I'd probably drift a lot less.

This is a very tough problem. Many times I find myself reading some about some obscure topic that does not make either an immediate or long-term positive difference in my life. I fear for too many of us the internet is consuming us instead of the other way around. Good luck!


So this will be an unusual answer but.. I didn't manage it. I realized years ago I was addicted to new knowledge, news, the flow of information, etc. and have turned it into my day-to-day job/passion. If it makes a living for me, it's OK, etc. Not viable for everyone, of course, but there's a whole industry to work in for us die-hard info junkies ;-)


Congrats!

I'll read your blog (later, of course)


How?


I run a series of e-mail newsletters on topics I'm interested in and have about 190k subscribers.

But that's only one tiny way, there are lots of people who do things like blog about news full-time, run tumblelogs, industry analysts, etc. http://daringfireball.net/ would be a top example of one of these. http://www.loopinsight.com/ are another. Lots of podcasts, YouTubers, etc. Generally "indie media" I guess.

It's worth noting, however, that it's quite hard to make a good living in that way and only a small percentage make it to an enviable position. It's certainly a lot easier to make $100k+ per year as a full-time programmer than as someone consuming/producing media.


I myself don't focus so much about keeping and organizing things that I read, I check here in hacker news about two three times a day and had developed a habit of reading only things that really really interests me (I became addicted to HN at first). One more thing is that I don't need to really know every detail about what I have read, I only need to know that such technology/technique/etc. exits, when I need it or think that it might help, I look it up in the internet, google will probably finds it if it was useful to some people by the time I need it. I use often use books to gain moderate knowledge about a topic and try to make a product or use what I have learned in work, I think a good knowledge gaining strategy consists of a short term topic buffer (like hacker news) and a log term one like reading books and doing weekend projects.


This is something I've been dealing with myself. I'd use something like Pulp or any other RSS reader and set up all the RSS feeds of all the sites that you read. Here's an excellent source for RSS feeds of HN that I use - http://ashleyw.co.uk/project/hacker-news-feeds

And then make the habit of only spending a set amount of time before or after work for reading the feed. The plus point of using an RSS reader like Pulp is that you get everything in one place and don't need to spend time loading up every single site. It's hard to make the habit but you can surely do it gradually.

I organise everything by categories just like you do. I don't have a set guideline. I just make them up as I run on new kind of stuff.


Don't kid yourself, you aren't visiting HN/news/tutorials/whatever because of some "urge of knowledge" or because of "absorption". People get bored all the time; everyone has this problem, some people just deal with it more effectively.


I see moments of "absortion" as a threat to my focus. Don't get me wrong, I love to read news (hardware, programming, design, startups, marketing and fashion..yes fashion.) but I don't want to waste my time on it. When you read something, you need to make a use of it. So you need to have more time for work. More time for testing and more time for being focused. I read "the Internet" when I feel a little bit tired - usually in the afternoon. For me, this is the best way to make use of power that you still have. When I'm doing this in the morning, I just feel that I'm wasting my time and energy. I have a few favs but usually want to read as much as I can and like to research for some new sources.


I absorb perhaps more than I should, I use it as a kind of positive procrastination from a not completely engaging job. I break it down similarly to you, spend more time on SO style answers as it looks "codey" if anyone can see my screen and answers my own (work or personal) coding Qs.

Midweek sounds about right for me too, it makes me think that actually a 4 day work week, with Wednesdays off, might actually be a better working pattern, but then, I am learning whilst browsing, so, there's pros and cons...


For me, it's procrastination, plain and simple.

In my better moments, I try to spend my procrastination time "doing" something, so I load my computer with toys such as a new programming tool that I want to learn, an evaluation board for a microcontroller, etc. I give myself little projects. The cycle is complete when I begin to use one of those toys for my regular job.

And to anybody monitoring my activities (which I always assume), it looks just like work.


You are not "absorbing" vital technical knowledge so much as fighting boredom.

My suggestion: go for walks during your work day. When possible, bring someone along from work that you need to discuss business with and make the walking time productive. If you walk by yourself, take advantage of time away from the computer to mentally step back and look at the "big picture" of what you are working on.


1) by setting aside a little time, unless a deadline is looming.

2) 5-10 mins of distraction to 50-55 mins of work (~ish)

3) bookmarks folder (set of folders specific to lang: e.g Java/Ruby/Scale, tools, architecture/infrastructure, project specific folders (i.e one project needs NLP tech so it collects in a relevant folder), math, and finally "interesting" for stuff I pretend I will need to refer back to

4) absolutely not


I do meditation in the morning and go for work. Which is lot of concentration on the computer. Mid day sometimes I see articles on HN, ma.tt etc. To relax. In late evening look at these news sometimes on my tab.

I do have an issue with organizing imp websites for future reading, and am looking for a good bookmarking app that syncs with all my computers!


Hi, thank you for your answer!

How do you started to do meditation? Maybe it coulde be a plus if I'd do this in the morning!


My work computer isn't connected to the internet. It saves on emails pinging in throughout the day too, anyone who needs something right now can phone or walk over.


I think it stems mostly from the fact that the work we do (and our way of life generally) is boring to the point of being tiresome for the brain.

Your brain gets tired of work and boredom, but it still strives to alleviate the boredom. One of the easiest things you can do is read news and bite sized portions of cool stuff. It triggers emotions especially in minds like ours. The only easier thing I know is watching TV (YouTube) but it's less rewarding for me so I only choose it when I'm too tired to read but not tired enough to sleep.

I think what's most important is that reading internet the way we do it when we feel the urge is worthless. You might think you learn stuff that can be useful for you in the future, but for each thing that marvelously hits the spot before you forget it (and that's like one for each 1000 things you've read) there are 50 things that you learn as you go when you need them. You might as well learn 51 then.

So you should be aware of confirmation bias when you try to justify reading internet when you need a kick and don't have energy for anything else. The rare instances when you used something you've learned beforehand on the internet are not enough to justify treating reading internet any different than any other form of recreation.

When you are aware of that, you may try to steer away yourself, when you are too bored to work (and preferably bit earlier) to other forms of recreation. Keep a bit of polymer clay at your desk and sculpt something when you are bored. Have a piece of paper and pencil and draw something (preferably some real object that's in your view than something from your head). Keep some legos and stick them together in random but perhaps weirdly symmetric fashion (don't over-think it). Play few levels of visually nice action game. Or just take a piece of paper and tear it bit by bit into pile of tiny bits. You'll be amazed of what's entertaining for your brain. Get up, walk around, go get yourself coffee or whatever, stare through a window at trees and people. Or just take a quick walk around your company building without any real purpose. Play a bit with some puzzles. Answer some questions on stackoverflow. Touch interesting 3d object with some textures. Jump few times. Basically do anything that's not intellectually taxing but exposes you to various stimuli you were lacking. Obviously try the things that are acceptable at your company. If you see group of friends talking about something interesting join in to listen (but make sure that it actually is interesting).

You can trick your brain into feeling that what you do is not that boring by listening to the music as you do it. But use this trick like coffee, sparsely, only when you need to focus but you can't take entertainment break.

On weekends and evenings you can still go on binges of reading, gaming, exercising, watching TV, sleeping, socializing, creating whatever keeps your brain non-bored.

One last thing, when you use sculpting or drawing as an entertainment please remember that you are not an artist. You are not doing it to create something, or like it, or be proud of it. You do it just to feed your senses for a while. Quality of your output is totally irrelevant. If you start thinking about your output you'll torch this activity as means of entertainment for yourself.


Nice out-of-the-box answer,

The first thing I was thinking about while reading it: http://www.modelships.de/Diana_III/dIMG_6982.jpg

Reading instructions, attach glue, modeling... (it is associated in some way with my past/childhood).


(Non - English speaker)

I loved your amazing reply. But can you please elaborate that why are you suggesting to refrain from reading articles and do something else?

Is it because reading articles drains will power and not enough will power left for doing actual work?


Yes. Maybe not willpower ... but reading tires same parts of your brain that you use for work as a software developer, so after session of reading you won't be able to work very long because you end up less bored but still tired. OP said that he has to read something every 30 minutes. That doesn't look optimal.

Most important reason for me for striving to avoid reading internet is that I fall back on this activity not because it's most efficient as means of getting entertainment but just because it's easiest one to do. Same as eating something sweet is easiest way to quench hunger. But not the most efficient or healthy one when you are interested in the longer perspective.

Also, your body and parts of the brain that interface with the body have only as much fun when you read as when you work so this also looks like there's a room for some improvement in efficiency of entertainment.




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