Hacker News new | past | comments | ask | show | jobs | submit login

So this is something I want to fix about commit messages.

If you screw up and forget to add the documentation to the commit message, there is nothing you or I can do about it. And if the commit log is not uniformly useful in this way, then people start to discount the value of the commit messages.

And then I have to explain to people who keep cutting and pasting code around improperly are ruining our commit history. I often get a shrug.

The first part we could do something about, and I hope we do in the next version control system (there's always a next one). All sorts of metadata should be capable of being attached to a code commit. Some of it stuff we have been relegating to third party tools, which means you can't reason about it as a whole.

Did this commit get a green build? Did it have a code review? What PR was it in? Did we run any static analysis? Did we learn after the fact that this code doesn't solve the problem or is a bad solution?

If all of this is at my fingertips, I've got a better chance of getting a bunch of people (myself included) to have a broader understanding of the code, or at least an easier time getting familiar with it when I need to.




Well there's two things there.

One is commit discipline. People care more or they care less, no tool can truly change that.

The other is how we collect information. I'm not convinced that version control systems are the right place for that, but I know others have explored it (eg. Fossil SCM). Github provides what is a de facto data store for a lot of such annotations through their APIs, I imagine Gitlab does similar.


Commit discipline is a wider issue, but building and relying on tools that require humans to never make an error does not scale.

People always screw up their commit messages. And once they do it they stop trying because if you can't be perfect you're just torturing yourself to try. If there's a way to fix them after the fact you can begin demanding that people have more commit discipline and make them go back and fix it if they don't get it right the first time.

I take it as a matter of Broken Window syndrome. You can try to keep them from getting broken but at some point you have to have a way to fix the ones that break.


I didn't mean to give the impression that I don't think better tools are needed, I do. I feel that automation is a gift: what gets automated gets done. Tools create paradigms of working.

What I was driving at was that better tools are one part of the triad of people, tools and ways that people work together with tools. Commit discipline will always be desirable, because no tool can recover a snapshot of my mind at the time I made the commit.



This is a big part of my problem with git.

The existence of a feature is not the same as a solution to the problem. All of these little tools that exist in the git toolspace are not automatic. Every developer has to add it to their already pretty long set of git rituals.

That's bullshit. We can do better than this.

Point me to a git feature that works when I do 'git push' or 'git pull' otherwise I'm not interested.

I'm also not interested in hearing people imply that people aren't smart enough if the tool doesn't suffice, and there's a very, very large concentration of that sort of asshole in the Git community. I don't make my tool decisions based on what I am smart enough or not smart enough to get. I make them based on what I'm willing to teach, my anticipation of how often I will have to be preempted to support others who don't get it, and what I'm willing to juggle when a production issue has the entire management team hand-wringing on a day when I'm already having a bad day.

Give me stupid-simple and dead reliable or it's not helpful.




Guidelines | FAQ | Lists | API | Security | Legal | Apply to YC | Contact

Search: