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Octopus and Squid Evolution Is Weird (sciencealert.com)
88 points by mooreds on March 9, 2019 | hide | past | favorite | 14 comments



Is there a better article we could link to? "Mother Nature gave RNA editing a try, found it wanting, and largely abandoned it" ... "it looks like cephalopods didn't get the memo" What is that supposed to mean?

The Wired article is slightly better: https://www.wired.com/2017/04/cephalopod-gene-editing/

The original Cell article uses lots of jargon: https://www.cell.com/cell/fulltext/S0092-8674(17)30344-6


> Is there a better article we could link to? "Mother Nature gave RNA editing a try, found it wanting, and largely abandoned it" ... "it looks like cephalopods didn't get the memo" What is that supposed to mean?

The transcription process is DNA -> RNA -> Protein. In the vast majority of living systems mutations happen at the DNA and DNA -> RNA transcription levels, but once you've got RNA it's a relatively straight path to proteins. It's possible to edit RNA but quite unstable and fiddly, so most living systems only make limited use of it, and their "RNA edition pipeline" is quite fixed and limited.

coleoids however apparently edit RNA to an extent unknown of elsewhere, seemingly trading that off for DNA-based evolution: for RNA edition to keep working properly, the source RNA has to be pretty stable otherwise you're building on quicksand, that means DNA mutations will break RNA editions and thus probably viability.

Think of it this way: DNA is source code, RNA is compiler IR and proteins are object code.

Most species edit the source code, they can have optimisation passes on the IR (RNA edition) but it can't be too extensive because the pattern matching will easily break if the source changes too much, and that might break the software entirely.

However coleoids do most or all their coding as optimisation passes working on the IR. And the more these IR passes do, the more they rely on the source code not changing because all of a sudden your "optimisation" passes don't work anymore and it turns out they're absolutely critical to the software working.


The octopus is editing its RNA to deal with different temperatures. Sounds like an overly dramatic way of doing it. Maybe instead of using an `#ifdef TEMP_THRESHOLD 15` they should have used a `int temp_threshold = 15;`


Thanks for those links. I thought you were exaggerating, but the article is indeed very weirdly written.

Edit: the wired article isn't only not much better, it also plagiarised the same source: "The consensus among folks who study such things is Mother Nature gave RNA editing a try, found it wanting, and largely abandoned it." (Yes, it is plagiarism if you use a quote after you mention the source if it seems like you've moved on to your own words but you haven't.)


I am yet to see a follow up from the scientific community on this hypothesis https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S007961071...


While this is cool, there is weird shit in every clade. Mammals have CpG methylation. We are also cool.


It should be noted that ethylation of humans is also cool, because it frequently leads to combination with external DNA.


I am ashamed that* I almost googled ethylation, before I got that.

* He says, fully ethylated... But unfortunately not tonight recombinated.


Comment of the year!


It would be great if they test the memory hypothesis. Perhaps by trying to catch the line of RNA changes that allow a problem to be remembered from generation to generation?


Octopi and squids are just weird.

So does this mean that they're basically the Lisp of the animal world.


I think of octopus as the closest to a truly alien intelligence we will be able to get until we can travel to the stars.


I just said the same thing to a friend yesterday. They are truly fascinating.


Just fYI, since arguments about plurals are frequent: https://en.oxforddictionaries.com/explore/what-are-the-plura...




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