If this is Amazon's solution to missing packages, it's the wrong one.
I've never had an issue with Amazon delivery until they used their own drivers. I now frequently have my packages never arrive (I have cameras on my porch. Not being stolen) and four times in the last six months have received a delivery for someone else. It isn't like a package for my next door neighbor, either. They're packages to addresses up to three miles away.
If Amazon wants to reduce missing packages, they need to hire drivers who actually give a shit or go back to using USPS/FedEx/UPS.
Had some issues with an amazon delivery and talked to the driver about fixing it for next time. They shrugged and said amazon pays like crap and the driver turn over is high. So high that I'd likely not get the same driver for my next delivery.
Does seem like a bad way to run a business.
Seems strange for amazon to propose entering into a house instead of just selling a locked box that you and deliveries could use.
And said box would have to be bolted down and made of very strong materials. Very expensive.
And letting a delivery person into your house is a very bad idea, even if they don't make it past the threshold. They see that 100" TV and then their buddies break into your house 2 weeks later.
Good luck getting Police to look into it.
Amazon is trying to cut losses from stolen packages, and get you to pay for it. Via buying one of their cameras. Unless you have Cameras covering every inch of your property. And they don't allow other brands of Cameras.
Just having packages hidden in a box that is always out there rather than in the open will have an effect. A lock that slows them down by several minutes would also help. A lot of these type of crimes are largely crimes of opportunity.
This is how businesses maximize profits nowadays. Nearly all new jobs since the recession have been unstable contract jobs, and nearly 40% of workers nowadays don't have stable jobs[1]. This is why even though unemployment is incredibly low, inflation has been flat: workers lack the leverage required to experience wage gains.
It's a shame for workers that delivery driving is now a gig. Historically, it was a stable, good paying career, something to work towards within USPS.
But hey, at least shareholders are getting a better value.
edit: It seems like any comment not intensely pro-capitalistic ends up downvoted. You folks need to realize that while capitalism is a fantastic method of maximizing wealth generation, it's not perfect.
Our lower-middle class is shrinking while our lower class is growing because of the loss of jobs like these. The fact that I'm getting downvoted for pointing this out is a bit surprising, given the generally levelheaded comment section this site usually provides.
As in all labor intensive industries that require no particular skill. Turnover is not an issue, it's a consequence.
You can't significantly improve the job and the work conditions, it is what it is. You can't pay more, that'd impact costs too significantly.
The consequence is high turnover and you can't fix the root cause. Lucky you, there is an endless supply of fresh blood that can and are willing to do the job so it's a viable business model.
You seem to forget there were and are companies like fedex and ups that deliver things just fine and don't have these issues. It might have something to do with how they train and pay their employees.
Let's not idealize the situation at other delivery companies. Delivering is not a dream job.
It'd be interesting to see how much business is B2B and repeated addresses for UPS/Fedex vs Amazon.
Amazon is likely to be distinct. High amount of one off consumers. Varying routes every day. Customers being away during delivery. Exactly what ruins a delivery company.
A number of people have already attacked one of your fundamental assumptions about low skilled labor. I think one way to say it is you're making the assumption that what you call "low skilled labor" is in fact "zero skill labor." I think you underestimate the level of skill required to deliver goods efficiently and quickly, and yes, the cost that is involved in it. (to be fair, you seem to be saying that I am overestimating that skill in your first sentence.)
Also, "one off consumers. Varying routes every day." Well, delivery company employees will have precisely fewer of those because their job is to deliver things, seems like the reason not to trust Amazon drivers over Fedex.
>Let's not idealize the situation at other deliveries company. Delivering is not a dream job.
It's not your dream job. My last cab driver immigrated 16 years ago and has been driving 5pm-5am shift for the last 7 years. Full time delivery is a dream in comparison. I don't think he could send his kids to college on Uber.
It's healthy compared to desk work, doesn't require any extensive training, and relatively low stress.
Be cautious when predicting the behavior of others.
Did you ever have to deliver to someone who is away? to an address that doesn't exist? to an address that exists but is located at the wrong place? what when it's inaccessible or has no bell?
That's what you get to deal with every single day, you never know where you gonna be or what's gonna go wrong the next hour. Meanwhile, your delivery time is accounted and customers can complain back about you for anything.
Maybe not now, but it used to be. You say that the job and work conditions can't be improved, but the fact that they were better before proves that your statement is false.
On a single blue-collar income, no less. My father, a lineman for Ma Bell, purchased a house and 5 acres of land for $100,000 (in today's funds), and is still receiving retirement funds. He was forced to retire at 50 - a dream many of us today will never realize.
Agree with this. Amazon drivers will place a package propped on center of door clearly visible from street, where a UPS/FedEx driver will tend to place it in a discreet manner.
Amazon also is still lacking the web access to manage the delivery that I get with UPS and FedEx.
What I'm getting from this is that Amazon hires drivers that don't care, underpays them and can't make sure they don't misdeliver or drop or steal packages. And their solution to this conundrum is for me to give the same set of drivers that can't be trusted with delivering a package the access to my home. What are they smoking there at Amazon?
> If this is Amazon's solution to missing packages, it's the wrong one.
The comments when Amazon Key was announced[1] were also giving good reasons why that's not a great package delivery solution.
But if you watch the video of the Amazon Key annoucement[2], they mention multiple other scenarios: "maybe let in your dog walker, a friend, or maybe to let in a team of cleaning ninjas"
I don't think it's too far-fetched to see the 'friend' here being actually your airbnb guest. Many airbnb homes already use a rudimentary lockbox with code, if the guest can now instead set up something on their amazon account and know they'll be able to get in (at least the initial check-in, and have a key waiting on the coffee table), it could make the experience smoother for the guests, and the host as well.
>But if you watch the video of the Amazon Key annoucement[2], they mention multiple other scenarios: "maybe let in your dog walker, a friend, or maybe to let in a team of cleaning ninjas"
For which solutions from all the major lock companies (and others) already exist. I can give people who need access to my house custom codes on my Schlage lock. It is an internet-connected thing--although it doesn't really need to be that. And I have found punching in my code is easier than dealing with the app on my phone.
Yep. We've had packages go missing, and I've seen amazon packages just left on the sidewalk in the SF Mission. Granted there were problems before, but their own delivery service is not great.
> I now frequently have my packages never arrive (I have
cameras on my porch. Not being stolen) and four times in the last six months have received a delivery for someone else.
It does actually solve the issues you gave as examples.
The driver is at the wrong house, scans the box but the door doesn't open. If Amazon doesn't detect the door being opened and the driver coming inside and delivering the package then they definitively know the package wasn't delivered.
This gives them an automatic way to evaluate drivers. When you complain that you did receive a package they can check the footage and resolve your customer service issue immediately instead of having to contact the driver.
I'm really surprised that we're missing one really simple solution:
Better, real-time truck-tracking information for user expecting a delivery.
When you request an Uber or Lyft, you see where the car is and exactly when it will be at your door. FedEx/UPS/Amazon trucks certainly are being driven with intelligent GPS systems which instruct a certain predictable route... share this data with the user so they know when you're be at the door - and possibly, give them the ability to input preferred time through an app ("I won't get home until 2p.m., can you be an hour or two late")
Because routing is not a simple problem. Uber/Lyft pull it off because the car is in the "neighborhood" but deliveries need to have fixed hours in unpredictable conditions like traffic, people etc. Add to preferred time to the mix and the whole thing becomes even more untenable.
Tinfoil hat time - I think this is Amazon's solution to become as pervasive as they can possibly be. You can buy just about anything that's legal from Amazon, you can stream entertainment, you can automate your house, and anything that they don't provide themselves they let third parties do it in AWS.
I recently had an amazon delivery person submit that they had delivered my package even though they hadn’t. Prompting me to go through the stolen package process, only to find the package on my doorstep a couple days later. Definitely don’t want that dude in my apartment.
If you don't mind my asking, what is that process?
I too had an Amazon next-day (Amazon Logistics) delivery erroneously marked as delivered (last Saturday). When I contacted Amazon customer support, they requested that I file a police report over the missing package. And then even when I did, they refused to do anything.
What's the magic word I have to say to get them to care?
With services like ontrac and their inhouse delivery they are intentionally scraping the bottom of the barrel for small-van delivery operating costs (salary, benefits, recruiting/hiring practices and training, vehicles).
For historical perspective, I remember in 1996 when polls said most people would never use their credit cards to buy things over the internet. Bezos surely remembers that too.
To be fair, lots of people use debit Visa/Mastercard cards instead. If I had a credit card, I don't think I'd be comfortable buying something online with it.
The risk is pretty much the opposite of what you think it is. One gives access to your bank account. The other you are protected from paying fraudulent charges.
If I had a separate mudroom I'd consider it, but having dogs makes it a no-go as it is set up. I'm surprised Amazon hasn't set up a "Amazon Locker" style box that you can get placed on your porch for deliveries. A relatively small one would take care of 90% of my packages.
Amazon doesn't have to set this up. I know a handful of people who bought a durable plastic trunk for their porch, and leave it open with a padlock available. There's a sign on it instructing for deliveries to be placed in the trunk and then padlocked. They have the key and are able to retrieve it when they get home from work.
And, frankly, just asking for deliveries to be put in a plastic bin probably helps a lot at the margins. Never been an issue for me but just not having a package in visible sight can probably be useful.
I don't think that would work out for many people in homes. Many places are under city/county ordinances that would forbid a lockbox solution. For example, those living in Alameda County technically only allowed to have landscaping-related objects in the first 20' from their property line, which is the setback for a typical lot [1]. Unless you have a big porch, you're SOL for a place to put a decently sized lockbox.
This of course varies by location, but the point is there are typically rules in place to prevent people from using the front of their house for storage.
Not to mention HOA ordinances which can be much more restrictive.
Yes. I was looking to build one but I stopped because I have to provide a delivery note. If not major ecommerce website I have to remember to add such note. — will the delivery person sees the note is also a betting game.
This dropoff box is nothing but a larger mailbox. BTW in some states in America, your mailbox must meet certain standard....
I thought about building a box that auto-locks when the weight of a package is detected in it. Can be a simple flap on the bottom that moves a latch. The lid would be a double lid -- an outside lid with a key lock, and the inside frame that the flap-activated latch slides into.
Who are they polling? I think there's a fairly limited amount of people who would really want this, and lot of people who wouldn't.
You need to live in a city, but not in an apartment building, which is a pretty small (and wealthy) proportion of people. If you live in the suburbs or the country, you probably don't mind leaving packages on the porch. In the city if you don't have a doorman, a package is almost guaranteed to get stolen.
Homicidal maniacs who want to kill total strangers for no reason are pretty rare. Packages thieves are ubiquitous.
Actually I think there's a big opportunity for Amazon to convince the building management or condo boards of non-doorman apartment buildings that this is something they want.
> In the city if you don't have a doorman, a package is almost guaranteed to get stolen.
That’s taking a pretty narrow view of ‘the city’ - very few places on the west coast have a doorman for example (I’ve never actually seen one), and there are plenty of cities where you could have a package not stolen. Of course if your definition of a ‘city’ only includes Manhattan then you may be correct.
Not sure why you're singling out Manhattan: Queens and Brooklyn are famously unsafe for packages. Even when I lived in the Sunset (the sleepy half of SF) I had packages go missing.
In fact I would argue that if a package can reliably last 8 hours on your porch you don't live in a city (at least for the purposes of this discussion).
There are a lot easier ways to break into a house than to do it through the front door while access is logged and you are being monitored by a video camera.
To some extent, practical security isn't about closing off every avenue of attack. Obscuring obvious avenues of exploitation is a big part of it since most crimes are crimes of opportunity. I would be worried that an Amazon employee who is somewhat dishonest might feel tempted by the previously inaccessible opportunity to enter my home.
I wish Amazon went for low hanging fruit in select markets.
In Toronto, Canada, if given the option, I always prefer FlexDelivery, when I can choose delivery to any post office even if it is not anywhere close to my home. It is much easier for me to mosey up to the post office steps away from my office in downtown and then bring stuff home, than try to make it to the office in my neighbourhood before closing.
Unfortunately, too many shippers do not support FlexDelivery, and this is a hassle. Amazon could start with that or strategically place the electronic lockboxes around downtown: the ridiculous amount of people work in a relatively small area of downtown core.
I wouldn't allow Amazon or any stranger in my house without me being there.
They're making this optional only if wanted so I this doesn't matter to me I'm sure some people have some value.
For lower-cost items Amazon just puts it under my welcome mat (just got one today under the mat) at my front door that is covered. From the street u can see there is a package as it there is only shade and not well lit.
A few times they have called me especially in bad weather conditions on where to leave.
Like leaving it in the backyard under the covered deck or with the renter in my basement Suite
There is already a solution out there and it works. Japan has something called Takyubin-box. Delivery person arrives at door, nobody home, opens box, puts in package, sets a pincode, puts pincode in person's mailbox, person comes home, retrieves packages. Some T-boxes are enabled with fancy features, some have simple tumbler locks with manual one-time code setting.
I can't believe Bezos and company can't take that concept and retool for the US market.
Yeah, the headline doesn't seem to be remotely correct for the numbers in the poll. I assumed "people don't want" meant that the acceptance rate was some tiny number, like 1%. But no, 15% of adults are "very comfortable" with it, that's huge! Another 13% are "somewhat comfortable," making it even huger.
A better headline might be, "Poll Shows 70 Million American Adults Comfortable With Amazon Deliveries Into Homes."
I would let a delivery drone have access into my house. Not a human.
I would happily install a remotely accessible window not accessible from the street, and give amazon the authentication to open it and close it for their drone to drop stuff in my house, IF losing packages was a recurrent problem for me. It isn't, but drone delivery is plausible in future so worth thinking about.
They have a separate pilot program for letting residences/communities/etc buy one of their 'lockers' - freestanding lockers that they deliver to and give you a code to type into for picking up your package.
Seems better for most situations, but it might be the sort of thing where you need a few dozen people to sign up for your location before they'll give you one.
In a house with multiple people using Prime this could get pretty awkward. I rarely answer my door or even look to see who is there when someone knocks. Last thing I want is Mr.Amazon walking in my living room while I'm on the phone.
I've never had an issue with Amazon delivery until they used their own drivers. I now frequently have my packages never arrive (I have cameras on my porch. Not being stolen) and four times in the last six months have received a delivery for someone else. It isn't like a package for my next door neighbor, either. They're packages to addresses up to three miles away.
If Amazon wants to reduce missing packages, they need to hire drivers who actually give a shit or go back to using USPS/FedEx/UPS.