I think there should be a political movement that retries socialism with AI. Basically nationalize everything and then automate everything. I think people could get behind that. Basically fully automated luxury communism.
Progress in AI definitely makes the question of economic planification at a state level relevant again, at least for parts of the economy, be it for the disruption it causes to market economy (that was already showing lot of cracks btw) or the capabilities it gives to handle beyond human level complex systems.
On what basis do you think that's a good idea? This is a genuine question not a snide comment. I'm interested in your conception as to why it works for you. You're unlikely to respond here but maybe you or someone else will add a helpful link. I will admit that the idea does not 'compute' for me taking into account the nature of human beings - but I'm open to argument.
"Taking into account the nature of human beings" you mean humans' innate desire to help others, to share, to make friends, to spend time working together on shared projects / pursuing shared goals?
Or did you mean "human nature" (I'm using huge air quotes there) as you have experienced it in late 20th century / early 21st century United States?
In the past I've been partial to a society based around self-actualization, like a liberal capitalistic society. However, with the way LLMs are progressing then I think society will turn increasingly technocratic and feudal, with no opportunities for social mobility. I don't really believe that LLMs will create new jobs or opportunities in the long run.
Historically socialism and central planning have been inefficient. With recent technological advancements it may be that the purported inefficiencies are no longer there, and I think a democratic, socialist government will be better at having the interest of the people than private for-profit monopolies. A society where everything is automated and you don't have to work could be pretty nice to live in.
That was a scam or at least overblown in scope, the "control room" you see in pictures was basically a movie prop, and their idea was basically to connect that room to every factory/port/mine with teletypes, it's similar in spirit to what a modern stock should do.
Maybe if they haven't been bombed to death very soon afterwards, control room and everything, for trying to make things better for their population and kicking out foreign neocolonialists, would have gotten an update.
I think there should be a political movement that retries capitalism with AI. Basically liberate everything and then automate everything. I think people could get behind that.
Africa's dysfunction isn't due to capitalism nor would be improved by the alternatives, as evidenced by the total collapse of Rhodesia/Zimbabwe when it was taken over by collectivists. Similarly, the proportion of Indians living in extreme poverty in India has been reduced by ~90% since it shifted to a market economy around '91.
In the book Red Plenty, on the Soviet economy of the mid 20th century, there's a section on an abortive attempt at optimizing the command economy using early computers and algorithms to have more effective production and distribution.
The attempt never materializes because some kindly clerk deliberately buries the letter from the enthusiastic engineer, who clearly does not understand that writing Stalin to tell him you figured out a way to build communism better than him, would be suicidal.
It's a fun counterfactual to think about, given that the vast bureaucracy needed for the command economy was one of its major limiting factors. Anyway, interesting book if you are into economic policy or quirky ways that systems can go haywire.
You think people can get behind that? Like if Trump's US suddenly decided everything is state property and Elon Musk will be helping people automate everything, people will be like yeah that sounds good.
The government does not have an incentive to run anything efficiently as they cannot go bankrupt. Imagine if AI was run like the DMV.
Putting monopoly control of it in the hands of government also makes it extremely likely that whoever is in power will use it to manipulate public opinion + elections as well as encoding their political values into it.
What do you think a Trump-controlled AI would say if I asked about the war in Iran? We’ve already seen examples of companies encoding their beliefs into the system (see Gemini saying nuclear war is preferable to misgendering Caitlyn Jenner), imagine how much worse it would be if politicians were given control instead.
There will always be challenges, as is the case with any system. But I guess I don't really think LLMs will create a bunch of new jobs, so either we look into the future with gloom and doom as we who don't have wealth become part of a permanent underclass as opportunities continue to disappear, or we envision a utopia and work to realize it.
Does the DMV have a reputation for being fast, efficient, or an enjoyable experience?
Personally I remember waiting for hours in a line wrapped around the building for the chance to take my drivers license test.
Another example: have you ever tried to interact with the IRS? The most nightmarish bureaucratic system I’ve ever had the displeasure of interacting with. And guess what my recourse is for them treating me like garbage? Nothing. A company, if they treat me poorly, I can take my business elsewhere. The IRS? The DMV? Not so much.
All of those companies are perfect examples of what I’m talking about.
Chevron: Exxon, ConocoPhillips, BP. From a customer perspective there are tons of competitors which make your life better ranging from QT, AMPM, to Buc-ees (a favorite which people literally LOVE to visit).
Verizon: Starlink, TMobile, ATT, Comcast, etc
Microsoft: Apple, Google, Cloudflare, Amazon (differentiates itself literally on quality of customer service)
The IRS or DMV? No competitor. Unhappy with their service? Go fuck yourself.
Your view of the DMV is outdated. There's been work put in around the country to modernize the system. I remember the hour long wait, but online reservations have made my last few visits in recent years take about 15-20 minutes
The IRS is treating you bureaucratically and poorly because of lobbying from companies and politicians being bribed by said lobbyists.
My point being that you are beholden to a poorly functioning IRS because of capitalism; where companies have lobbied so hard against tax reform and simple filing that it more or less forces you to use their software.
I call the IRS and wait 4 hours on hold waiting to talk to a person. I get disconnected randomly and have to call back the next day only to have to wait another 4 hours. Finally I get in touch with someone and they are extremely rude, unhelpful, and treat me like garbage.
How is this somehow the fault of “capitalism”? Regardless of how the system is structured, the government has a near-infinite budget, they could theoretically staff the agency with enough people to answer my call in a timely manner. They could also train their staff to treat me with human dignity. They don’t do this, and the reason is that they have no incentive to do so. If I am upset by being treated poorly what recourse do I have? Nothing. In fact if I ignore their system long enough, armed goons will show up with guns and arrest me.
There are many examples of government agencies that have this reputation, not only in the USA but the entire world.
“Show me the incentive and I’ll show you the outcome” -Charlie Munger
IRS has been starved of resources following the "starve the beast" playbook.
Also the only reason we have to pay for Turbotax (etc) is due to lobbying. We had IRS Direct File for two years and it was great before being gutted by the current administration.
Prior to Republicans demanding the Post Office fund retirements in advance and various other hamstringing to other services US government was ridiculously efficient
They had to pass legislation to intentionally fuck the books to make them inefficient to fit their preferred narrative because government could be held accountable for inefficiency in ways private corps cannot.
There's no such thing. It'd be dictatorial as every other communist state ever was, and that's hoping the people in power wouldn't also subscribe to the communist ideas of killing a bunch of people to enable the revolution and to do it fast. Or read Terrorism and Communism (1920) and get scared - though most people end up thinking these mad men were nice grandpas.
> There's no such thing. It'd be dictatorial as every other communist state ever was, and that's hoping the people in power wouldn't also subscribe to the communist ideas of killing a bunch of people to enable the revolution and to do it fast. Or read Terrorism and Communism (1920) and get scared - though most people end up thinking these mad men were nice grandpas.
Oh come on.
Here's another thing to get scared about: AI and other kinds of advanced automation has the potential to completely undermine the attributes that made capitalism work for the vast majority of people. Rehashing dated mid-century anti-Communist propaganda tropes isn't going to address that. You're gonna need some fresh ideas.
Also people who want to seriously recreate the Soviet Union don't practically exist (outside of some irrelevant weirdos), except in the minds of some really indoctrinated libertarians.
Socialism failed so hard that the overwhelming majority of socialist countries recognized that socialism is inferior to capitalism, bailed, and adopted capitalism. Now that capitalism has brought about AI, socialists unironically suggest reverting to the inferior system, in hopes that it will have (magically) been rendered superior... by a product of capitalism.
This is the self-defeating contradiction at the heart of progressivism: it is a cult of good intentions. It doesn't matter if the promise of socialism has already been proved, on a global scale, to be illusory. It's the intentions that matter, and in their minds no amount of failure will ever tarnish good intentions.
I'm convinced that susceptibility to such pre-enlightenment "thinking" is a Great Filter.
Communism will work the moment communists understand options markets, specifically call options, which is to say that communism is impossible.
Curiously, capitalism will work the moment capitalists understand options markets, but in their case they need to also understand put options, which is to say that capitalism is impossible.
It's good that all of these benevolent billionaires are bestowing the world with the fruits of their goodness, and make sure that assets, knowledge and access to the market are fairly distributed. Their political involvement is to the benefit of all of mankind, and does thankfully not lead to the centralization of assets or power in one small group.
Well, so if its all the same- why not just say yes to cooperate-socialism? You just accept that the party (company) owns all the things and redistribute them as they see fit (for the benefit of all) - so wether the bossmann is called stalin or bezos- what difference does it make. Congrats, you got socialism speedrun- you are already at the disilusioned stage where you see the endresult. And thats still a efficient version, because the varous corporate-socialist empires have still to compete against one another. Now get in line critizen.
> The sociopaths hijack the centralized assets while exterminating via reallocation all opposition. And the micromanaging from a distance produces catastrophic results.
Am I missing the sarcasm here? The difference from the current system would be...?
