Sometimes stories become big enough that they spill out of their ordinary stream. For example, there is a stream of news about Ebola fever that under normal circumstances is read mainly by infectious disease specialists. But if there is a really big Ebola outbreak somewhere, that starts to be relevant to everyone. What's happening in Gaza now seems pretty serious.
> What's happening in Gaza now seems pretty serious.
Serious things have been happening in that part of the world for more than 2000 years, and will continue to happen long after we're all dead. I think they are given ample coverage on other sites, and there are plenty of other forums to discuss them on the internet.
Or, put another way, say this site had some hawkish Israeli users and some Hamas-oriented Palistinians. Wouldn't it be nice if here, they could just stick to peacefully discussing the things this site is about, rather than getting sucked into an endless, fruitless discussion, which is what 99% of discussions about that area are?
Serious things have been happening in that part of the world for more than 2000 years, and will continue to happen long after we're all dead.
Your argument seems like "This is not my problem, Why do i care" kind of thing. It is very important for smart people to bring out a solution to this serious conflict which has continued for almost 60 years. We can clearly write it off as an conflict which cannot be solved and it will continue forever. I am pretty much sure there is a solution to this conflict and it has to come from a bunch of smart people who want to change world in a good way, HN community looks like that group.
I think they are given ample coverage on other sites, and there are plenty of other forums to discuss them on the internet.
There are tons of sites to discuss Ruby, Python, Erlang etc and there are bunch of other sites to discuss Google, Yahoo or the current Economic Situation. Why should that news even be discussed here? The answer is in HN, we get a different and rational perspective to certain news stories unlike other places. I would pretty much like to say, any news which is serious and impacts lot of people or a region should be discussed here for finding peaceful solutions.
'All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing' - Edmund Burke
Okay guys, listen up. I think azharcs is on to something.
SwellJoe, you're in charge of making contact with the Palestinian leadership. unalone, you'll be writing excellent-yet-slightly-sensational articles that will shake the belief system of the zealots perpetuating this conflict. stcredzero's job is to apply Buddhist techniques to invoke a general aura of well-being and connectedness. pg, you're going to set up an Arc-powered community for Israelis and Palestinians to have constructive dialogs about the pros and cons of calling a truce. And if you rename Arc to Ark then we can use the tag line "drowning hate, one comment at a time".
By our powers combined, we can end this conflict once and for all! Let's do it, people!
When i said we can bring a solution, I certainly didn't keep in mind Power Rangers or Captain Planet. It was more like, why be a pessimist, when you can be optimist about things around which are not right.
Yes, but you didn't say "be an optimist" - you argued that I don't care, because I don't want to discuss it on this site, which is a bad argument. There are plenty of issues that I care deeply about for which this site is not an appropriate forum.
> 'All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing' - Edmund Burke
Discussing the issue on internet forums is so close to "doing nothing" as to be virtually indistinguishable.
Discussing the issue on internet forums is so close to "doing nothing" as to be virtually indistinguishable.
I don't think that's true. People are very much influenced by things other people say, and there is nothing magic about the web that makes this stop working online. I've often been influenced by things I read in forums.
And in this specific case, you're particularly mistaken, because the situation is so much influenced by public opinion. If everyone in the world was talking now about what's happening in Gaza, the Israelis would have to stop.
At the very least, rational U.S. taxpayers may start looking askance at why their money is being conscripted to support this slaughter.
I know some here may take exception to my description of what going on here as slaughter, but all I see is the abridgment of human rights and respect of life on the basis of tribalism,mythology, and a past criminal genocide that the victims being attacked here played no part in. This should not be interpreted as hate or anti-semitism, as it is grounded in the basic respect for all human life. I don't wish to start a flame war here, but feel free to post responses.
> At the very least, rational U.S. taxpayers may start looking askance at why their money is being conscripted to support this slaughter.
Slaughter? If any European country (or the US) had been on the receiving end of the Hamas rocket attacks, Gaza and the surrounding areas would have been smoking piles of rubble years ago. And yes, Israel has the capability.
As to Israel's sins, they pale in comparison and they don't have a history of doing everything that they can to wipe out the Palestinians, something that is within their power. Meanwhile, Hamas' "kill all Jews" charter appears to be representative.
Interestingly enough, it's not just Jews. The reason why Arab countries don't allow significant numbers of political Palestinians has nothing to do with Israel.
The "plight of the Palestinians" is almost entirely self-inflicted. Israel was able to "make the desert bloom" without local help so it's absurd to claim that Israel is keeping the Palestinians down.
> And in this specific case, you're particularly mistaken, because the situation is so much influenced by public opinion. If everyone in the world was talking now about what's happening in Gaza, the Israelis would have to stop.
For values of "world" that equal "United States". It's quite a hot topic over here in Europe, and public opinion is certainly not in favor of Israel. But that's par for the course, and it's the US that doles out the cash, as 'homme' points out.
Also, in terms of postings really influencing things... well, yes, ideas are ideas and can have influence, but on the other hand, some ideas are discussed endlessly without anyone changing their positions much, which would point to the futility of the discussions.
Am I the only one who played Deus Ex through to the end? You know, the whole "manufactured crisis, anticipated reaction" scenario? In other words, what if it's the EXACT opposite?
What if it's only happening to the extent that it is BECAUSE we're all sucked into watching/discussing it? What if the war is not so much on Palistinean civilians, but rather on OUR sense of balance, well-being, confidence about humanity, etc.? What if we're all being psychologically conditioned into a passive, regressive child-like state of mind via the various horrors we're witnessing so that we can be made to wait for some strong, daddy figure to save us all - like when Bush saved us all from the evil terrorists in Iraq? What if this is just one massive, sophisticated psy-ops operation?
Before I get downvoted to Hacker News sub-hell, just ponder this as a possibility, no matter how seemingly absurd. I find the whole situation disgusting for reasons that span the spectrum of "sides" and "issues". But I find myself creeped out as I wonder how I went from being suspicious about the UN after reading 1984 as a kid to now find myself secretly wishing it would "take over" the middle east.
We're being reduced to emotional wrecks by people who seem to be, like some sick experimenters, trying to figure out exactly what reduces the most people to emotional wrecks the fastest. And what's happening in the meantime? For starters, this country's economic infrastructure has been wrecked to well, so quickly that we've gone from object of jealousy to object of ridicule and derision.
The 'ol "watch the horrors in the front while we attack the rear" distraction.
Snap out of the bee-hive mentality. The more we're all on the same frequency the easier we are to control. "But I caaaaare!" Then stop doing the anticipated (caring) and venture out into the chaotic: start a forum calling for the blowing up of the entire middle east.
Go to some embassy and burn Israeli, Palistinean, U.S. and Russian flags. Confuse them.
Gather all your jewish friends and have them wear t-shirts that say "Jews for Hamas", then gather all your arab friends and have them wear "Arabs for Zionism" t-shirts. Call CNN and tell them that if they don't cover your stunt you'll decapitate 50 kittens and post it on YouTube.
Start a cult that promises to sacrifice the first alien that lands on earth to some ancient Chinese deity.
Wear t-shirts that say, "Me me me! Money money money! To hell with the third world! Me me me!"
Do anything but for humanity's sake, break out of this resonance conditioning.
Your "caring" is being used against you. Stop caring every time a kid, whether Israeli or Palistinean, is blown up and my hunch is that "they" will stop resorting to this nonsense to get on CNN and in your living room.
In other words, if WE alL agreed that poetry was a sign of moral correctness, I guarantee you Israel, Hamas and the UN would be flooding YouTube with their top writers trying to outdo each other in poetry.
But precisely because we get sucked into this crap by design we get more and more "Oh no, look at all the children suffering."
If this internet forum existed in when I was an undergrad and I knew about it, the information and conversations shared back then would certainly have shaped my life direction.
I share your fears on the flame war types this can attract, but we weathered a few hundred submissions on economics, libertarianism, etc ok, so maybe this area can be explored with rational, cogent dialogue.
I agree that the Gaza events are very serious and deserve to spill out, but this article isn't particularly good. It's a rather low quality mainstream media article, quoting very biased sources without any mention about who these people are. It's not something that any specialist would read under normal circumstances.
