Would you accept the argument that someone who for whatever reason doesn't have empathy would also not be able to recognize it? For example, watching someone cry over current events would be unrecognizable to a sociopathic person. They may even accuse the person of lying or putting on a performance. Could you also accept the possibility that even if such a person could recognize empathy, they still lack or block the capacity to feel the empathy, and therefore the only use the recognition has is in manipulation (use it to corroborate a point, or use it to spread an attack, or just fuck it, just use it for anything since you can't actually feel it). You don't have to actually do anything with empathy, you can literally just sit there and cry. If you think empathy has a use first and foremost, then sure, I can see why you think someone is using it in a performance. You see, some of us cry because it hurts us.
To get a better understanding, let's use something very analogous - Cringe. When we watch someone do something cringe, we feel it. The same is true for empathy you see, that's what it is. We feel someone else's pain. Psychologists say those that don't feel it are sociopaths.
"Worse still may be those who lie to themselves so successfully that they believe that it's real empathy"
Again, you have difficulty identifying real or not real empathy. This is not a problem for people that were raised without confusion. You can just say I'm from environments where I couldn't figure out if anyone cared about me or not (common). Is there a universe where you can accept this diagnosis or are you pure? We are all a constant work in progress.
The gene expression of apathy needs to be studied as well.
>Would you accept the argument that someone who for whatever reason doesn't have empathy would also not be able to recognize it?
I don't bake cakes, so I of course can't recognize a cake. Everyone knows this. Magical thinking demands that it be true. You have an immaterial soul that connects you to the universe, Jeebus, and the ghost of Elvis Presley.
>watching someone cry over current events would be unrecognizable to a sociopathic person. They may even accuse the person of lying or putting on a performance.
Sure, they might do that if they were lying. Which in many cases they are. So much of the real world around you is inexplicable, isn't it? There are these secret sociopaths all around you, they look just like anyone else and they're all serial killers waiting to Hannibal Lecter you!
Or maybe, everyone's like this, but some large fraction of the population is engaged in this weird cultural phenomenon where you all compete to appear more virtuous to each other than you really are. But admitting it would just ruin the fun, eh? And what if you admit it, and then everyone else doubles down and insists it was real for them, outting you as the serial killer? Can't have that.
Empathy is only possible for people within your Dunbar number. Everyone beyond that only requires and only gets whatever civility is merited for diplomatic purposes. In your way of thinking, these so-called sociopaths... every single human is one. At least to the other 8 billion people who don't happen to be in their Dunbar circle. This explains how the cops can be so callous to the wrongly accused and to the victims alike. How soldiers are so quick to run off and commit war crimes (with or without sanctioning by superiors). Why those schoolteachers abuse the little kindergarten kids. And on and on and on. To you it's mysterious. Invisible monsters out there ready to pounce and eat you. It's why you can't fix any of this, why all those problems seem to grow out of control. Too busy trying to get everyone to pretend they have empathy which they don't.
>We feel someone else's pain.
You pretend you feel it. You don't. This isn't Star Trek, you don't have telepathy. This isn't Harry Potter, you don't have magic. But again, people will look at you weird if you admit you can't.
>Again, you have difficulty identifying real or not real empathy.
I don't at all. I have a superior talent for recognizing it. As in, you have no ability to recognize it, no potential to develop such a skill, and can't even think about it rationally enough to appreciate your shortcomings.
>You can just say I'm from environments where I couldn't figure out if anyone cared about me
"Please humiliate yourself so I can go back to competing in the Virtue Signaling World Championships! Your mama didn't love you nyah nyah nyah!"
Except she did. And I've had a few people in my life over the years who did care about me. I'd say instead it's people like yourself who have the confusion. Constantly complaining about narcissists that you somehow don't see coming a mile away. Constantly begging for updoots on reddit, your entire generation, for whining about how you might have to go no contact with your parents because they won't acknowledge your new puppy as just as important as their actual grandchildren. Hell, the most extreme of your sort have invented entire new crackpot pseudo-religions where you're not allowed to eat food because you're supposed to have empathy for it.
>Is there a universe where you can accept this diagnosis or are you pure?
Are you a licensed psychiatrist? Please private message me about the state you are licensed in, and which business name you practice under. I will accept your diagnosis if I have these details.
Plenty of research out there that investigates and shows nervous system/heart beat co-/dys-regulation amongst strangers. Not that I need any of that to know how I am feeling with others, totally random strangers. I cannot turn it off. Oh boy, I often wish I could. You can choose not to believe me, sure, I'm just inventing this to lie to your face for the kick of it. Or you can choose to look at the research. Or actually experience it for yourself, e.g. in a NVC practice course.
Okay, I understand you. You are wrong, but that is the nature of expression when it comes to agitation and anger. It’s not necessarily your entire being, but such forces can co-opt a person for quite some time. Some people get addicted to indulging in righteous indignation (which somewhat corroborates your point about performance, but I’ll amend the point to include that it’s happening to extremes on both sides. You yourself have wholesale invalidated the emotions of the other side, possibly reciprocally).
Sometimes just acting like something becomes you. So there is your mindfuck. You ever had to fake it a bit until you caught your rhythm? It’s in us to truly feel, just try.
Watch that after taking a deep breath and calmly try to tell yourself that “this is a woman who is probably more emotional than me, and I have seen women cry before over a lot of things. She is also of Hispanic origin and may have additional emotions here. She is also American and is a beneficiary of the labor of these people. I have to try to believe these are real emotions, even though even though my entire being is telling me she is a liar”.
You have to fucking try.
If you walk out with “I still think it’s performative”, then FINE. At least you tried, we’re all still here talking to you right?
I will say one thing though, you sound batshit enough for the two of us to become friends.
To get a better understanding, let's use something very analogous - Cringe. When we watch someone do something cringe, we feel it. The same is true for empathy you see, that's what it is. We feel someone else's pain. Psychologists say those that don't feel it are sociopaths.
"Worse still may be those who lie to themselves so successfully that they believe that it's real empathy"
Again, you have difficulty identifying real or not real empathy. This is not a problem for people that were raised without confusion. You can just say I'm from environments where I couldn't figure out if anyone cared about me or not (common). Is there a universe where you can accept this diagnosis or are you pure? We are all a constant work in progress.
The gene expression of apathy needs to be studied as well.