On: Aluminum batteries outlive lithium-ion with a pinc...

[moron4hire]

> But before the Al-ion battery is ready for commercial applications, its energy density will need to be improved

There it is. No mention of how much. Though they do tell you how much longer it lasts! So apparently we aren't that averse to numbers.

[brohee → moron4hire]

Energy density is only an issue if you move the battery around, grid storage doesn't care so a bit concerning they don't mention that usage either.

[bArray → brohee]

I think grid storage does care:

* Size is important, because they need to be stored and maintained somewhere. The larger the energy storage, the more infrastructure required.

* Weight typically scales cost (the heavier it is the more it costs). If it really weighs a lot, you need to reinforce the ground too.

* Efficiency in charging and discharging. You also need to monitor the state of each cell carefully.

[hedora → brohee]

Grid storage can reuse post-consumer batteries.

Li-ion capacity fall off is a fixed percentage per year, so when your car hits 80% of original capacity in ten years, its battery pack can just be used for another ten years. It’ll provide > 64% capacity at the end of that (grid workloads are less stressful than driving workloads).

So, the alternative battery technology has to cost less than the cost difference between refurbishing and recycling old car batteries. That delta might be negative.

[capitainenemo → hedora]

There's been a few grid storage fires in the news, you'd think refurbishing/recycling would increase the risk. If the aluminium batteries are significantly less explosive, that might tip that balance?

[hamilyon2 → brohee]

At some point scaling up you start to compete with giant pile of heated sand. And it is tough capacity/price benchmark.