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I like this essay but I've found it hard to be idle. I jumped aboard the FIRE train so I could coast the rest of my life, and quit my job once when I was 31 and then when I was 33 after working for a year.

Now I'm working the same dead end job again and I don't mind it. When I'm not working I'm consuming YouTube, HN and reddit. Not sure how to love idleness again.

I used to be able to sit still for an hour at a time (meditation).




You seem to have really misunderstood the essay, then. He uses the word "idleness" to be provocative, but he's not actually saying that people find fulfillment in sitting and staring at the wall. He explicitly calls for efforts to be made to help everyone to learn enough about a wide enough variety of topics that they can choose their own interests to pursue in their leisure time.

From the essay:

> It will be said that, while a little leisure is pleasant, men would not know how to fill their days if they had only four hours of work out of the twenty-four. In so far as this is true in the modern world, it is a condemnation of our civilization; it would not have been true at any earlier period. There was formerly a capacity for light-heartedness and play which has been to some extent inhibited by the cult of efficiency.

> ...

> When I suggest that working hours should be reduced to four, I am not meaning to imply that all the remaining time should necessarily be spent in pure frivolity. I mean that four hours' work a day should entitle a man to the necessities and elementary comforts of life, and that the rest of his time should be his to use as he might see fit. It is an essential part of any such social system that education should be carried further than it usually is at present, and should aim, in part, at providing tastes which would enable a man to use leisure intelligently. I am not thinking mainly of the sort of things that would be considered 'highbrow'. Peasant dances have died out except in remote rural areas, but the impulses which caused them to be cultivated must still exist in human nature. The pleasures of urban populations have become mainly passive: seeing cinemas, watching football matches, listening to the radio, and so on. This results from the fact that their active energies are fully taken up with work; if they had more leisure, they would again enjoy pleasures in which they took an active part.


This is wonderful but I guess what I'm saying is: whether I'm jobbing 24 hours a week like I do now, or 55 hours like I used to, or zero hours, I spend all the remaining time in pure frivolity (what he calls passive pleasures).

Modern civilization's cult of efficiency combined with the ease of frivolous entertainment must have beaten the leisure out of me.


Not all people use their downtime like you of course. Some people make art or music, or go on adventures in new places or the woods. Maybe work on projects at home. One of the downsides of the internet generation is we’ve filled our downtime with things like reddit with an infinite scroll extension vs things that can be more personally impactful perhaps that older pre internet generations would engage with.


It is hard to talk about leisure, when definition is not clear. I’m not sure what yours is, but I try to stick with the one I think the article is using, namely energy to spend on top of survival efforts. I understand that you have energy to spend, but you are stuck in the city dweller passivity the article talks about. Being mindful of the situation is the first step to take action changing it.


People seldom read beyond the title before commenting


Articles are rarely worth reading, so I don't blame them


I've (GP commenter) read the essay several times in the past and enjoyed it each time.

My comment was a self-reflection of my failures in taking advantage of leisure time.

I've backpacked for 8 months and moved to a different country. It's all pretty boring, and I haven't found a hobby to stick to.

It seems like your comment implies not only did I not read the article but that I misunderstood the premise.


In my experience, having kids has had the dual benefits of making my days purposeful and fulfilling, and also more appreciative of idle time. The mind does not do well with the extremes of unlimited idleness or unlimited work. Turns out the rhythm of child-raising can fit the perfect middle ground between work and idleness, and has the advantage of creating a more meaningful cumulative product than either realm. That balance of time is especially true if you're financially independent or have family willing to help during the first year or two of a new baby.


Idleness is not just sitting on your couch watching TV. It’s basically the freedom to pursue whatever’s interesting you in the moment.


Same, I don't think we can lump all different personas and natures into one bucket. Some people thrive, and enjoy doing, building, learning, and not staying in one place. Others enjoy sitting, relaxing, doing little, introspection, etc. It really depends on the individual, each has their own areas that give them meaning and joy.


> each has their own areas that give them meaning and joy

on that note, see https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40256243




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