I have never understood how Apple gets away with it and even more than that gets a huge amount of love. Whereas, if Microsoft just looks at you wrong, pitchforks are out. I'm not cheerleading any company here, but it has been frustrating in my career where people absolutely refuse to touch or even consider anything Microsoft related but love their Apple computer. Apple is probably hundreds of times more agressive, more stubborn, and moat building than Microsoft. Microsoft's dev tools are some of the most open in the world for a big company, certainly more so than Apple and Google.
Apple's iOS and macOS have very similar dark patterns, but they go unmentioned. Yes, Windows has been making some really bad decisions with the Windows and Edge products, and it is really annoying. But at least their dev tooling is top notch, and you can easily interact with actual Microsoft employees in their repos. It's a nice experience.
Yes, I agree. But Microsoft should recieve some kudos for VS Code and .NET. What they've achieved is quite astounding. No one else has done what they have with the transition of .NET. Although, there is definitely an argument that it should have been cross-platform since the beginning.
I don't understand why these companies make the OS level decisions they do though. They make billions. You think they could relax and try to capture users by making them happy instead of kidnapping them.
I was an Apple user and even fanboy for many years. I left because they ignored macOS and then started making it iOS like. I have far less issues on Windows than I do on macOS.
Apple sucks dealing with anything that doesn't have their name on it. External monitors have terrible support because Apple refuses to implement a specific protocol making that nice, like everyone else does. You basically have to use Apple's monitors or their overpriced officially supported LG monitors they sell in the Apple Store if you want an integrated monitor experience. Several other issues with Apple exist with peripherals. I have to make special router settings in my home because my partner's work Macbook can't switch between the mesh network. My partner also had to get IT to give her admin access so that she could rename iTunes because it was the only reliable way to keep iTunes from opening every time her non-Apple Bluetooth headphones connected. Search about what it takes to rename an app like iTunes. It is literally insane.
It's because Apple doesn't have users, they have fanboys. Apple customers aren't there because of the quality of the product, they're there because they've been convinced that Apple is cool.
I think you mistyped the URL - this is Hacker News, not Slashdot. Let's keep the discussion intelligent and not bother with the mud slinging or other insults.
An interesting observation is that users of Apple products rarely go out of their way to insult others based on their choice of hardware / OS, while users of Android (and Windows & Linux to a lesser extent) seem to get quite needlessly enraged at the Apple users. No one is forcing Apple products on you guys, chill out.
As someone who uses iOS, Android, Windows, Linux, Mac, and FreeBSD on a daily basis, I believe all of them have their pros and cons.
On topic:
Apple used to quite strongly prefer (and tell) developers to use web apps when appropriate instead of a native app. As someone that has helped many companies develop apps - the biggest complaint about not having a native app is that they won't be listed in the App Stores without one.
Many of the apps I've helped develop could be web apps, but, companies really want to see their app in the App Stores.
Apple's entire stock in trade is "computing as it should be". Their stuff is the coolest platform ever to exist, which means that developing for their gear is like getting into Studio 54: only the hottest and coolest are allowed in, permitting anything less would tarnish the club's reputation. Which sucks for most devs but it's part of being the coolest.
Microsoft just wants to dominate. They don't care if the UX is garbage, as long as the user doesn't have a choice.
Sorry, but I use Mac and Windows computers (by job requirement). Windows is and has always been clunky and difficult to use. Maybe you don't feel that, but it is a fact. I wound't spend any time with windows if I had a choice.
In my opinion, macOS has an horrific UX especially for power users. It's so bad that there is a cottage industry of third party developers creating apps to refine the bad out of the box experience with macOS. Most macOS users buy several of these apps and it's just an accepted part of the culture around Macs.
Windows isn't great and has other issues but I think it has a better UX overall.
There's ample room to criticize either OS, and given the opportunity I'd avoid either both. Nobody I've ever met will unilaterally defend stock MacOS. You criticize Spotlight, they say "buy Raycast!" You mope about window management and they tell you to install Rectangle. You get jumpscared by the Apple Music popup when you put on headphones, and a concerned user will always chime in with the registry command to disable it. It's a jack-in-the-box of modal advertisements and sophisticated service clients.
On Windows, I get the APIs I want like Vulkan without arbitrary software restrictions. It's also a ghoulish wasteland of service integration and user hostility, but at least they let you do what you want. That sort of immediacy is probably why a lot of users prefer Windows even if it's arguably poorly-designed.
> Maybe you don't feel that, but it is a fact.
Facts normally come with citations. Do you have anything better than your opinion to cite?
Experience is subjective I'd say, I certainly disagree with that after using the old iPhone of my wife for a year to not make more ewaste. I found the whole thing buggy and confusing, I finally got rid of it after an error loop when installing apps meant that I had to format it again to fix it.
I'm sure most users do love it though, to each their own. There's certainly enough space for all kinds of products and all kinds of consumers.
If somebody dared to write a comment on HN criticizing Apple in the 10s, downvotes rained down on that comment. HN's policy is to downvote to express disagreement, among the other things.
That's not been the case anymore since a few years. This very thread would have been nearly impossible 10 years ago, maybe 5 years ago too.
