Dudes a coder who doesn't want to sit at a box all day. I didn't go into programming because it just feels boring doing what he said.
Management allows you to control what you want to work on. OP wants enjoyment. Control provides it.
In fact OP would be the total opposite of normal management.
I'd say your mentality is toxic. People who can't code can ideate. You don't need to know X to be able to lead X. Many programmers actually suck at thinking outside the box and I'd sit on calls where nobody could figure it out. A business manager articulats the problem and it's solved in an hour.
> Management allows you to control what you want to work on. OP wants enjoyment. Control provides it.
Not true. You can set direction and vision only to the extent they align with your company and leaderships goals. If you fundamentally can’t stand what your subordinates do, I doubt you can successfully influence other leaders let alone be one yourself.
Thinking that being a manager will give you “control” couldnt be further from truth. Going into the role seeking control will have disastrous consequences, if not for you, then the people who you “control”. You have far less control and you need to motivate people to properly deliver on the thing which in this case you seem to despise.
> I'd say your mentality is toxic.
Attacking me personally doesn’t validate your argument and does opposite. Leave emotions out and stick with merits of your perspective. Thanks.
You can replace that to say that mentality is toxic. Not an attack on you, just a way of conversation. Dialects and attitudes across the world differ. When I say you, in that context, I'm critiquing your claim, as I don't know you personally.
Your definition of control is different and conformist.
Management control their own destiny. Coder's don't in a business.
If your manager calls you have to answer. If you call them they can ignore it.
Your response is in the sense of the business growth. I'm speaking to your and your coworkers sanity.
I'm referring to having a job where you enjoy what you do. Your response suggests goals of fulfilling someone else's dreams which OP didn't suggest. He was referring to his own QOL.
> Management control their own destiny. Coder's don't in a business.
Execs control destiny. Mid level managers can influence direction and provide a strategic and tactical vision on how to get there, but they have little control.
> If your manager calls you have to answer. If you call them they can ignore it.
”I’m not good at X so better to control people who do X because that somehow lets me have a better quality of life and people will have to bow to me.”
Hallmarks of an incompetent manager who is way in over their head. I question if I want this person as an IC, unless I can fit them into a role where they sit in a corner and can provide value while leaving everyone else alone. That attitude has potential to bring down an entire team.
> I'd sit on calls where nobody could figure it out. A business manager articulats the problem and it's solved in an hour
You'd have to define "thinking outside the box" - if you are suggesting that most programmers aren't creative I'd say you have no clue about most programmers. If its a call about a technical problem - no chance. But a random BA still isn't a tech manager.
Toxic. Rethink this. I had this mentality and it hindered me significantly. Now I listen too the worst idea and I've grown personally and professionally more than ever.
This is the second time someone disagrees with your view, provides a well written response, and you respond back with a personal attack.
I can try to steel man the other side of the argument, even though I disagree with it. nothing in your comment is a coherent, reasonable response to the op.
I’m not a gate keeper of this community but please share nuanced ideas to defend your view point. For the second time now, stop the personal attacks.
> maybe you are part of that group and require introspective.
More personal attacks.
Here’s some advice for your personal benefit:
You can disagree with people and that’s fine. but share your ideas and respond to individual points you disagree with. avoid emotionally charged angry responses. you will only upset your self and drain mental energy thinking everyone else is out to get you. it’s unnecessary and unproductive
This is the cancer that infected big tech. A class of professional managers who provide little to no value but don’t want to leave because the grift is so easy.
Management allows you to control what you want to work on. OP wants enjoyment. Control provides it.
In fact OP would be the total opposite of normal management.
I'd say your mentality is toxic. People who can't code can ideate. You don't need to know X to be able to lead X. Many programmers actually suck at thinking outside the box and I'd sit on calls where nobody could figure it out. A business manager articulats the problem and it's solved in an hour.