Jazz bassist here. If I take my time from the band, everything slows down. I have to follow my own internal time clock in order to maintain a steady tempo. Or, the rhythm section has to do so as a unit.
Former Jazz bassist as well. Blew my mind when I was in school, all of my teachers insisted that I was the timekeeper, not the drummer. The band might listen to the drummer, but the drummer needed to listen to me.
Once I left school, it quickly became apparent that each band has their own preference for who they should follow. But, that pressure on me really gave me a strong sense of time and rhythm that I tremendously appreciate to this day.
It's interesting that the "rule" seems to be that the bassist is the timekeeper in jazz, but in a lot of bands, the players habitually lock to the drummer. I'm ready for it to go either way. In my main band, I have a good rapport with the drummer (we've been playing together for 20 years), and so we are a pretty tight unit. Sometimes if the drummer has to miss a rehearsal, then it's just me, and I don't mind reminding the band that they can trust the bassist. It's kind of like driving in heavy traffic. You might not completely trust the cars in front of and behind you, but choosing your own speed is fraught with risks. ;-)
One of my favorite tracks where I think you clearly hear that the bassist is setting the time is Thelonious Monk's "Green Chimneys": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4C-uJw1AiPA
The bassist is playing incredibly steady quarter notes throughout, except for some liberties during his own solos. The drummer is free to set accents as he sees fit. And if you were to take your time from the piano… may God have mercy on your soul!
There's the whole concept of "ahead" or "behind", although as a keyboardist it's never been clear to me which to go for. Sometimes a tension is counseled, like bass being ahead of the beat and soloist being behind. Or it can be tempo-specific. Curious if you can share more along those lines from a bass perspective?
i'm an amateur drummer, i never fully grasped ahead / behind formally, all I know is that when I practice patterns, there are times where a mishap causing a slight delay will confuse my brain into feeling an acceleration (like sense of time being borked for a second).. I wonder if they play around that sensation.
I am a bassist and do wonky times a lot, I can still recall the feeling you describe — but nowadays I only get it when I have to play really wonky stuff that goes against the tempo of the rest of the band.
So I would say this feeling goes away with practise. The less you have to think about the timing the less weird it feels when you stretch it.
List to some drummers that play with the J Dilla style of beats. For example JD beck. Basically you just play certain beats ahead or behind the beat but do it consistently and it sounds "right" but wonky in a very cool way. It's hard as shit to do for me I have trouble enough playing on time lmao
Even questlove said it Was alienating at first (D'Angelo voodoo sessions).
But beyond the nusoul / nujazz world. I can also sense this in Copeland drumming. But in a nearly invisible feel.
And recently I stumbled upon Taylor McFerrin+ thundercat collab. Their drummer was having fun laying crazy shifted patterns, but not on the bottom level. It was different.
A lot depends on the band. I'm not a pro, so I've played with bands at varying levels over the years. There are bands where everybody is instantly lost, the moment that I start my solo. They either lose the tempo or the "form", so they have no idea when to come back in. These tend to be bands that haven't completely mastered jazz playing.
Then on the other end of the scale, there are bands where it seems like the time is just magically "there" through nobody's effort.
I adapt. If the band needs time during my solo, I play a more chunky rhythmic solo. If the time is "there" then I can take more liberties.
I have some personal rules that the band doesn't always obey, such as no bass solo when people are dancing. Playing for dancers is its own beast. If I'm given a solo while people are dancing, I usually play a slightly more fancy version of the regular bass line, and keep it short.
