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Maybe it's just me, but I can't think doing any meaningful work without access to the filesystem.


Try thinking outside your specific needs. The raw filesystem is an antiquated interface that, honestly, a vast majority of people do not need. In fact, if you observe average computer users, the filesystem is what really impedes their ability to get things done. In fact, the filesystem introduces a huge complexity when the application does not know where its files exist. Did the document you downloaded in the Downloads folder? The Desktop? Documents? Or is it in the last folder you downloaded? Users want to get things done, not hunt for files. The iPad paradigm solves a lot of regular user issues. It was never meant for "power programming users". The car vs. truck analogy.


> The raw filesystem is an antiquated interface

Not really. It has often been tried to find something better, but there really isn't. It works decently on Apple because they set certain constraints and standards. But overall it is like saying a table of contents in books is antiquated. You don't need it for belles lettres, sure. The analogy doesn't fit too well, but there a similarities.

It is actually the most simple way to present structured information. It is not optimal, but decently approaches it. This is a reason why it is so successful and to my experience even normal users don't have too much trouble with it. Alternatives obfuscate this for everyone.


A table of contents isn't the same thing as the raw file system, and is much more analogous to the simplified file system available on iPads.


It is an insufficient abstraction because it gives you less power as a user. Same with everything on iOS. This sadly creeps into MacOS too.

If a table of contents it is a good analogy depends on what you define as content. For me the content is all the files.

A generic way to view data content is a file explorer that lets you explore the file system. Some abstractions can be here too, but it shouldn't be too much and certainly not to a degree like iOS. I can understand why it is there, it is a consumer device primarily.

If you have more than 10 documents, how do you organize them by topic? Into a new folder? Thought as much...


What do you mean with "filesystem" specifically, that isn't available on iPads?

There's the Files app.


Does it allow you to have access to the whole fileystem, unrestricted access?


I think the arguments is non-developers don't really need access to it.

You aren't configuring anything or doing anything that needs access to the file system.

You are simply interacting with documents and online systems/applications that you can do the same as on a laptop. Add the greater mobility and the iPad pro really is a better device for most people.

However, as another commenter mentioned, these individuals who SHOULD really benefit from using an iPad primarily also are the group that struggle greatly with the changes to their overall workflow (see Who Moved My Cheese).


Thats kind of a poor argument that just self fulfils itself. If we mask things like the filesystem and the actual shell, then of course no one will really need to use it. If we unmask these things, maybe paradigms will shift and they will themselves use these things.

IMO so few people know how to code because we have been abstracting it for years, not because its tough to do or anything like that. Plenty of things people do are just as challenging as coding. You just need exposure to coding is all, its easy to write bash or python. Anyone could do it in a week. Hard to get that exposure when a company decides it won't be possible for you, and its a slap in the face considering these features are there in the device but you have to jailbreak the damn thing and violate your warranty to get at them.


>Hard to get that exposure when a company decides it won't be possible for you,

The company decided it was not possible using a specific product. You decided to use a product where it was not possible.


If you are not the most technologically inclined person, its really the company's marketing that is choosing the product rather than you. Its true with any product you lack relevant knowledge in, marketing becomes the dominant factor of choice beyond tooling that you don't fully yet understand. I think what is especially frustrating in this case, is that these capabilities are already there built into the device, they are just not exposed unless you jailbreak the device.


> I think the arguments is non-developers don't really need access to it.

I bought the device, why shouldn't I?


It allows access to a filesystem, just not the root filesystem.

You can do all the basic copy/cut/paste ops and create whatever folder structure you want. Don't expect to edit system files though. People spend lots of time looking for vulnerabilities to achieve that.


The iOS file system is very frustrating. By default, applications can only access individual files in their own sandbox, and if you want to point an application to a folder of media, you can't—it's simply not possible, or if it is it's so burdensome that it's simply not practical. Least of all for images, which for some reason are not accessible from the Files application and have to be manually exported from the photo gallery app, and music, which is not accessible at all: you need to clumsily use Apple's proprietary sync program on an actual computer.

In contrast, Android also doesn't let you access the root file system, but the user folder is yours to do whatever the hell you want with, and if you want to give your audiobook or music app to your folder of mp3 files that you've collected over the years, you can.


My MacBook doesn't either, with system integrity protection, and I'm just fine with it.


why do you need that for meaningful work? anyhow, github codespaces is usable on the ipad. i've done billable hours while traveling on my ipad, as long as the internet is good.


What do you need with unrestricted access to the root file system?


But very few apps built to work files/folders.

Image files?.... they obviously want to be mixed in with your photos!

Media files?.... you don't want those!, would you like to subscribe to Apple Music?


Any concrete examples?

As far as image processing apps, I've been using procreate and affinity designer. Both use the file system and not the photos app.

As far as audio processing, apple's own garage band app works natively with audio files and lets you slice and dice them.


What apps don’t work with the Files App that it would make sense for?


Well, transferring files between an iPhone and a Windows PC is still far more of a pain than it should be.

Still can't just treat the phone as a drive and put files on there.

(edit: or trivially share a folder on the LAN over wifi, without even needing the USB cable, if you're considering the iOS device a 'real computer')


In the same way you can't treat a laptop as a drive and put files on there (transfer from another pc); because it's not a drive.


Except you can on the Mac. Ever heard of Target Disk Mode?


Yes when I want to transfer a few files between Macs my first thought is “let me use target disk mode”.

https://support.apple.com/guide/mac-help/transfer-files-mac-...


Seems pretty simple with iCloud for Windows.


So transferring a file between 2 local devices should require sending it to a cloud server and back?


To be fair, apple devices have airdrop for transferring files, which works much more seemlessly than any kind of network drives I've ever used (and I'm using one right now).

The interface exposed is just not mounting a remote file system.


You can’t connect a laptop to another laptop and treat it like a drive. Why expect anything different from a phone that’s really a computer?


If it was a real computer with a 'real OS', I'd be able to easily set up network shares and transfer files over wifi, without even plugging a cable in.


I've been using real computers with real OSes for a very, very long time, and when someone says "hey, could you send that file to me," I confess my first thought is not, "Why, sure! Let me just configure a network share that you can mount on your system to do it, because that is obviously the easiest possible way I have at my disposal!"


Well I can transfer files wirelessly via AirDrop to my Mac.

You can do it with a third party app

https://mobiletrans.wondershare.com/iphone-transfer/transfer...


Yes you can. It's called Target Disk Mode on the Mac.


Yes and you can also easily share files from an iPhone over Wifi on a Mac. That isn’t possible on a Windows PC either.




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