Ask HN: Programmer Existential Crisis

[reallywhoami]

Been writing code for professionally for about ~15 years now (started programming around ~20 years ago). First startup barely lasted and shut it down (about half of 2012). Plogged (is that even a word?) along on my second startup for about 6 years and sort of got acquired. There were some regular corporate tech jobs in between the startups - but just pure time-wise I've been in startups longer than at a regular programming job. I've hit some sort of wall where I've feel that the last 6 or so years of my career (essentially my early 30s) I've not really learned anything - just bits and pieces of some programming, some architecture, some managing a small team. Never really got any feedback/mentoring on software I designed and wrote or how I managed people. I am now in the state where I feel I've stopped growing as a programmer, not graduated to a manager or an architect.

In my mid-30s now I feel like I am outdated and outskilled. How can I get out of this rut? Has anyone here been in this situation and pulled themselves out of it?

PS: This is the first time posting on HN - not sure if this is the right place for advice of this sort.

[breck]

I go through this less frequently nowadays but it always happens. Sometimes in the short run you aren't interested in programming any more. You think you are bad at it.

My bet is that if you have been in it for ~15 years you're probably going to be in it for another 30. Don't sweat it too much. I think it will turn out that regions of the brain will be like muscles. Sometimes you need to listen to your body/brain and give one muscle a break.

How many books do you read? Even when I'm sick of coding, I try to read some random programming books. There's a great quote, that when you think about who it's coming from, is pretty powerful advice: "In my whole life, I have known no wise people (over a broad subject matter area) who didn’t read all the time – none, zero." — Charlie Munger

[reallywhoami → breck]

I guess I've been "obsessing" about code, programming and software for too long - I will try that break and let it be for a bit.

I actually read a fair bit around programming (maybe too much sometimes) - mostly triggered by something new I read on HN.

Thank you - it really helps to know I'm not alone in this.

[twobitshifter]

Haven’t been in this situation, but if you’re craving some sort of structure there are plenty of places where you could find a salaried job.

Companies value real world experience and having successfully built 2 products gives you skills that someone that came up through the ranks is unlikely to have. You may not have the technical credentials of a manager but you have the skills whether you know it or not.

Overall I would demoralize the importance of a career in your mind. Our society pushes the idea of dream jobs and passions and yada yada, which companies love, but most will be unlikely to find any contentment in employment. You can most likely find it outside of work, so try to find somewhere that you can fit in culturally and still have free time.

[reallywhoami → twobitshifter]

Thank you. I get your point - I suspect that 15+ years of constantly being consciously/unconsciously held up to society's idea of a successful career tends to cause people to simply assume that there is only one (or a handful) of definitions of what is success.

[MilnerRoute]

Do you have any thoughts on what new skills you think you need? One approach might be to either start doing some learning in those areas, or even trying to get a job where you'll learn a bit about them.

Honestly, I usually am able to get a better perspective on my problems if I just take a real break -- get away and stop thinking about them -- along with really getting some exercise and enough sleep and eating healthy foods. Maybe checking in on some friends, if not actually trying to help someone out. Clears the mind.

[reallywhoami → MilnerRoute]

Thank you.

I just about started getting some serious exercise (I really really enjoy running) and the second wave of COVID in my country scared the living daylights out of me - now I am just mortally scared of catching something and passing it on to my dad.

But, yes, I guess taking a break (like you and others suggest) would probably be what the doctor orders - just probably too wound up from 6 years of fighting to survive and make payroll for the team.

[jimmyvalmer]

Can't help with your ontological hangup, but your primary concern should be money which, unfortunately, must be coaxed from other people either bosses or clients. So always look to acquire those skills (via the internet of course) to make them happy. Non-people related ways of acquiring money is generally some form of betting, which calculated or not, is not for someone who asks the question you asked.

[reallywhoami → jimmyvalmer]

Thank you.

Never could wrap my head around betting (except probably do startups - which again is probably a sort of calculated bet). There's some money (not a whole lot, though) through the acquisition + a good salary - for the near term the money isn't a worry (while running the startup it was). Maybe I should just appreciate there's one less big thing to worry about.

[kleer001]

> Plogged (is that even a word?)

"Plodded" I think is the word you're looking for, if it matters. No worry though, your intent is clear and I think you've got some good advice here.

IMHO if the paychecks are coming in, and look like they will continue to, it's all good. Sometimes a simpler algorithm is the most robust.

[giantg2]

"I am now in the state where I feel I've stopped growing as a programmer, not graduated to a manager or an architect.

In my mid-30s now I feel like I am outdated and outskilled."

Me too. I'm not even a senior dev (although I've worked as one and as a tech lead). I'm tired of restarting and getting nowhere.

[p2detar]

So, do you want to be a manager or architect? I left my manager job years ago to go back to programming in a tiny team. Quite happy with my decision. The only reason I can think of changing my position is more money, but I’m fine for now.

Also, I believe the more you learn the more you feel like you don’t know enough. Maybe it’s the same with you.

[reallywhoami → p2detar]

Now that you put like that I think maybe it's just a "feeling" of not knowing enough. That, and probably the situation now where I there is the expectation of being manager in a large organization and I am just anxious about that.

Thank you - that perspective really helped.

[jtchang]

Replacement firmware for IP cameras that has no need to go to the cloud: https://github.com/openmiko/openmiko

[Grakel]

Find something related that you're passionate about. Study it, do some small projects, market them, make that a niche of your professional persona. Become not outdated in a specific thing that you enjoy. It will reinvigorate you as well as your career.

[reallywhoami → Grakel]

+1 to that and thank you. A side-project (makes money or not) would let me not become outdated in something.

[undergrowth54]

This seems like the sort of place where a book like The Subtle Art of Not Giving a Fuck would be a wise read.

[diplodocusaur]

ploughed+plodded=plogged

Is there anything else to do than to make the most of it?

[reallywhoami → diplodocusaur]

+1. Like the aircraft safety message - "Sit back, relax and enjoy"