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A utilitarian perspective judges morality based on total improvements in human wellbeing. From that perspective, is it appropriate to say that the Chinese government is the best government of all time? The sheer numbers of people who are improving is somewhat mind boggling.

Yet, they make moral tradeoffs. We all make moral tradeoffs. I think it is important to keep their moral tradeoffs in context, lest we risk hypocracy or worse, oppositionalism (creating needlessly damaging power struggles).

What is the shared vision of the future where our moral priorities align? Can we realize that future, together?




How dare you use the word "utilitarian" in such an atrocious context.

I've been a "real" utilitarian for almost a decade (as much as is possible to be), and I consider China the single greatest threat to freedom and peace on the face of the planet.

Can you seriously believe that China would not be far, far better off with a democratic regime?

Yes, China has raised up their economy, but they've only done it for the sake of power, and hundreds of millions of Chinese still live in severe poverty.


I'm not sure I understand your argument. Here is a picture that shows china's growth and wellbeing (life satisfaction). Managing the affairs of nearly 1.5 billion people is quite an accomplishment. I like democracy, don't get me wrong -- but I think the Chinese government has demonstrated themselves to be rather benevolent, on the whole.

https://ourworldindata.org/uploads/2017/04/Inc-vs-Happiness-...


I wonder how many Uighurs were included in that survey of self-reported happiness.


What does the ethnic cleansing of Uighurs have to do with economic growth? You think imprisoning people in concentration camps accelerates poverty reduction?


Suggested reading: "The Ones Who Walk Away from Omelas" by Ursula K. Le Guin. It's a short read.


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Ones_Who_Walk_Away_from_...

Is the implication that China is better or worse in this regard than the USA or Europe?


Human freedom and rights are more central to well being than material prosperity.




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