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You're comparing solely based on the weight of the energy storage medium (fuel/batteries). Two problems here: 1) ICE cars have big, heavy engines to burn that fuel and produce mechanical power, whereas BEVs have much smaller motors, so there's a big weight advantage for the BEV. (I see you addressed this, but you're also missing the volume savings with electric motors; gas engines take up a ton of space with all the associated plumbing and systems). 2) In gas cars, the fuel isn't really a big component of the vehicle's weight, which is why Tesla is able to add another 500-1000 lbs of batteries and not have too much trouble with that. That's basically like adding 3-4 adult Americans. Gas cars do not get significantly better fuel economy with empty fuel tanks.

As for airplanes, this discussion is about cars, not airplanes, where things are really different. Power-to-weight-ratio is far more important with aircraft since they have to fight gravity constantly. Aircraft will surely be the last bastion of fossil fuel usage because of this.



But electric vehicles weigh more than gas equivalents. A Model 3 (standard) is 3552lbs. I found that a Camry is similar in weight (3572lbs; similar weights for the Leaf and Volt). But if we compare the range the Model 3 has 220 mi while the Camry has 352/512 (city/highway). We can pretty conservatively say that Camry is going to get approximately twice the range for the same weight. And extra 500lbs on the Tesla only gets you another 100 miles.

So while the gp to this comment and my original comment focus on the weight and density of the storage media this is one of the largest factors. What the graphs I linked to show is that basically the weight for gasoline is not a major part of the vehicle weight. But on the other hand, for electric vehicles it is a significant weight.

The point I was making with my original comment wasn't that electric vehicles won't win (I think they will) but rather that it is a ridiculous notion that they would have won from the beginning. These new batteries take extremely complex engineering to achieve. And only because of these new batteries are they starting to win. If we go back to when everything was made from steel then your electric car is also going to gain more weight. Even from the get go petrol vehicles had longer ranges. My comment (and a lot of people are missing this) was not about NOW it was about the past. I want to stress that it has nothing to do with current tech. It has to do with what technologies they had available to them. Also how impressive the work is that has been done to create these new generations of batteries (and is still being put in). Petrol won because it was the easiest route. But EV is winning because it is superior (with the advancements and the path that it is on).


1) Guilty as charged. It's far from an apples to apples comparison, but if you compare like-to-like models of EVs and similar ICE vehicles you get the same story everywhere. Around 1/2 to 1/3 the range of the ICE vehicle, and 20-25% heavier.

E.g. the Chevy Sonic[1] & Bolt[2] are equivalent EV/ICE vehicles. They weigh 1300 & 1600 kg respectively, have the same cargo volume, but ranges of ~750 km (most pessimistic) & ~380 km (most optimistic).

So that's the like-to-like comparison. We can see that all things added up these vehicles are heavier and have much less range.

2) These volume savings are overstated and if anything work in the favor of ICEs, not EVs.

Look at a cutaway of the Chevy Bolt[3] or other reasonably priced EV like the Hyundai Ioniq or BMW i3[4]. Yes you get relatively more cargo volume in a Tesla Model S compared to other Sedans, but at that point you're paying tens of thousands for a luxury vehicle whose gimmick is things like the frunk. If you drop the same money on an ICE that optimizes for cargo space you'll come out way ahead.

3) A Tesla Model S's 85 kWh battery pack is 540 kg. If that's 3-4 adult Americans they've gotten a bit fatter on average since I last checked :)

In any case, that gets you a 420 km range, which tells you something about how heavy the car would be and how little space would be left for anything else if they were aiming for ICE-like range.

4) "Gas cars do not get significantly better fuel economy with empty fuel tanks": Yeah exactly. The point is that EVs inherently do not share this benefit.

5) Yeah we're talking about cars, but the point of bringing electric airplanes into it is to show how electric vehicles are weight and volume limited in an area where everything is done to bright the weight down, whereas someone might (wrongly) argue that for cars the weight doesn't matter that much.

1. https://media.chevrolet.com/media/us/en/chevrolet/vehicles/s...

2. https://media.chevrolet.com/media/us/en/chevrolet/vehicles/b...

3. http://www.boronextrication.com/2016/04/03/2017-chevrolet-bo...

4. https://www.autoblog.com/photos/bmw-i3-ev-cutaway/


And then there's the cost of the fuel. Electric car fuel is currently about 1/5 of the cost of gasoline and dropping. In addition, the cost of maintaining and electric is also much less than an ICE car so in terms of dollars per mile driven electrics are way cheaper. And that's where ICE really takes the head shot.




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