Like how nobody wants to have their accounts frozen with no notice? Or how people don't want a private company to be able to dictate what they are allowed to buy and sell? Or how people don't want to have to be constantly vigilant to ensure their simple 16 digit number doesn't get into the wrong hands (or that the hands they are required to give it to don't misuse it) and if/when it does they quickly report it to the credit card company so they aren't on the hook for it.
All money systems have tradeoffs, cryptocurrencies are just another option.
> Like how nobody wants to have their accounts frozen with no notice?
This is not a concern for 99% of people. Nobody is getting their bank accounts frozen except for high profile criminals.
> Or how people don't want a private company to be able to dictate what they are allowed to buy and sell
Another fake problem. 99% of people can buy and sell whatever they want. There is a very very small intersection between what is legal and prohibited by the banks. Once again, this is only a use-case for criminals.
> don't want to have to be constantly vigilant to ensure their simple 16 digit number doesn't get into the wrong hands
Do you not see the irony in complaining about vigilance over a credit card number in a response about the work of having to back up your bank cryptocurrency private key? If your 16 digit card number is stolen just cancel the card and any fraudulent purchases will be remedied. Crpyocurrency is clearly worse in this comparison.
> All money systems have tradeoffs, cryptocurrencies are just another option
Cryptocurrency is not a "money system" with "trade offs", it's a hamstrung toy that facilitates some dark-market commerce and that's about it, it is otherwise demonstrably useless and certainly not an alternative for the incumbent financial system.
>This is not a concern for 99% of people. Nobody is getting their bank accounts frozen except for high profile criminals.
I've had my credit cards frozen multiple times because I did something their fraud detection deemed shady. One time I was stuck in another country without any way to pay for things! Yes, I now know that I have to warn my credit card company where i'm going or they may turn my card off again on me, and I now know that I should bring cash with me (at the time I didn't have a ton of money to be able to take a bunch out in cash to carry around, not to mention that it would have cost me tens of dollars to withdraw all of my own money, and the bank can still deny me making it in one big withdraw!), but that is again a lot of work to have to do and worry about just to be able to spend my own money.
(Also, the whole premise there kind of freaks me out. You need to warn the bank where you are going, and then if they approve you are allowed to spend your money there, otherwise you could be stuck somewhere with no recourse... That's terrifying!)
>Another fake problem. 99% of people can buy and sell whatever they want.
And yet finding credit card processors for porn and other adult things is extremely difficult for most companies in that area. Not to mention that your agreement with your credit card company prohibits you from buying a lot of that stuff (porn, sex, donations to politically unfriendly sites like wikileaks, etc...)
And go ask a marijuana shop why they don't take credit cards, and how difficult it is for them to handle money and even pay their employees because they can't get a bank account in the US. How they need to hire armed guards because they have to work entirely via bundles of cash because of the blacklisting of their industry.
Hell, just LAST WEEK there was an article at the top of this very website about how Paypal banned a company and is holding their funds for 180 days. And that thread is FILLED with other examples not just from Paypal but other companies as well.
You can say it's unlikely, but you can't say it's a "fake problem".
>Do you not see the irony in complaining about vigilance over a credit card number in a response about the work of having to back up your bank cryptocurrency private key?
No, because you never have to give out your private key, but you do have to give out and protect your credit card number.
>If your 16 digit card number is stolen just cancel the card and any fraudulent purchases will be remedied.
Unless you waited too long to tell them, or they say you've disputed too many fraudulent purchases on your account, or they mess up the paperwork, or they say the fraudster used your pin and they don't cover charges where a pin is used.
>Cryptocurrency is not a "money system" with "trade offs", it's a hamstrung toy that facilitates some dark-market commerce and that's about it, it is otherwise demonstrably useless and certainly not an alternative for the incumbent financial system.
It's clear you've made up your mind, I don't even know why I'm typing this out, you aren't going to change your feelings.
But I'm not asking you to believe me, I'm asking you to let some of us make different choices. You say 99% of people don't have a concern about these things, what about the 1% of us that do? What about the 1% who are being failed by current money systems, the 1% who have to rely on cash which is EXTREMELY susceptible to fire, theft, and loss because they can't back it up, the 1% who want to try and transact safely without a middleman in some situations, the 1% who think that there is still improvements that can be made in cryptocurrencies and are working toward solving problems with them so that one day they may become more useful to a much larger portion of people.
Also:
>certainly not an alternative for the incumbent financial system.
I never said it was an alternative in it's current form. I don't believe it is. No cryptocurrency at the moment is ready for widespread usage, and I don't believe it is going to ever take over the incumbent financial system ever. But that doesn't mean we can't try to make it easier to use, better, safer, expand the usable situations, experiment with cryptographic protocols, and maybe eventually some of that tech can make it into other money systems in some way to make things better for everyone. Or maybe it will just stay a fringe system for some who have been burned or blacklisted by the current system to use in some situations where they would otherwise be stuck.
You don't need to be involved, you don't even need to like it, but don't make up straw men and act like nobody out there wants some of the benefits of it because you personally don't.
I didn't want to get into fucking arguments about cryptocurrencies today, especially with someone who just decides that the problems it's solving for some are "fake problems" and handwaves them away, so this is the last time i'll reply here.
> I've had my credit cards frozen multiple times because I did something their fraud detection deemed shady
A frozen credit card is not a frozen bank account. Your money is still available in the bank. You can try to paint fraud protection as a negative but the vast majority of consumers disagree with you. Not a real issue.
> No, because you never have to give out your private key, but you do have to give out and protect your credit card number
You're moving the goalposts. Giving out a credit card does not require a user to be vigilant about security, they simply leverage the number when they need to make a purchase, no back ups or additional work required.
> It's clear you've made up your mind, I don't even know why I'm typing this out, you aren't going to change your feelings.
Not an argument. It's clear you've made up your mind, I don't even know why I'm typing this out blah blah blah. See how pointless that is?
> I'm asking you to let some of us make different choices
Nobody needs my permission to do anything. I can assert that cryptocurrencies are useless and you can ignore me if you like.
> What about the 1% who are being failed by current money systems
What about them? They can do whatever they want, I'm not trying to stop cryptocurrency enthusiasts from doing their thing, it doesn't mean I have to agree that its useful.
> Paypal banned a company
Paypal is a private company... what's your point? Coinbase bans people all the time for arbitrary use of their coins. Based on your logic here that means cryptocurrency is failure.
> marijuana shop
Marijuana is federally illegal. Using cryptocurrency doesn't solve any problems that cash doesn't already solve just fine. Cryptocurrency has literally zero advantages for these businesses.
> that one day they may become more useful
Yeah... when that actually happens you won't hear any arguments from me.
> You don't need to be involved, you don't even need to like it, but don't make up straw men and act like nobody out there wants some of the benefits of it because you personally don't.
Talk about a straw man. I never said "nobody out there wants some of the benefits" of cryptocurrency, I said THE VAST MAJORITY of people don't want it, which is absolutely true and something you've already understood based on your response, so I am not sure why you have decided to pull up a starwman argument even though you already responded to my actual argument regarding the "1% who are being failed by current money systems".
> I didn't want to get into fucking arguments about cryptocurrencies today, especially with someone who just decides that the problems it's solving for some are "fake problems" and handwaves them away, so this is the last time i'll reply here.
This is a silly rhetorical trick. You drop a gigantic wall of text and then sign it with a complaint that you don't want to get in an argument and use that as an excuse to avoid responding to criticism. I didn't do any handwaving, I gave detailed specific responses explaining my position, but if regarding my argument as "handwaving" makes it easier for you to ignore it, by all means.
