That seems like a completely nonsense, garbage statement. Brexit is primarily about money and economics, from what I can tell on the outside looking in.
The people who will be hurt the most would be those who are at the bottom of the proverbial food chain to begin with. Desirable areas will still be expensive because people on high income or positions of power will still hold those positions. It's the lower / under paid workers who will see pay freezes and lay offs while the cost of living will continue to rise.
Instead of levelling the playing field, I expect the brexit will just create an even bigger divide between the wealthy and the poor.
Every time someone tries to prove this by doing an unbiased economic investigation, it concludes that the negative effect is either nonexistent or tiny.
Housing competition is fundamentally local - everyone in the world wants London property, regardless of living there. Nobody wants houses in Stoke on Trent.
> Every time someone tries to prove this by doing an unbiased economic investigation, it concludes that the negative effect is either nonexistent or tiny.
That's a pretty bold assertion, not what a quick google reflects
I agree the former poster made a claim of evidence that should be backed up, but you did the same as well. Thus you’re both just as responsible to cite a source when asked.
Incorrect. If I thought earlier posters were intent on engaging sincerely I would continue, but evidence here and previously suggests they are employing derailing tactics masquerading as reasonable argument.
no, Brexit is not about economics and it never was.
Brexit is about having fewer immigrants in the country.
My driving instructor was very honest with me, even if I was a foreigner. He said 50% of his students are foreigners. But he still voted for Brexit even if he knows it will make him worse off financially. He just wants fewer immigrants in the country.
I grew up in a predominantly "brown people" part of the country, I use "brown people" because there were Pakistani's, Indians and other peoples from the crown colonies.
It's worth noting that, we as a country fail to integrate those people. It's not their fault.
It's worth double-noting, that those people are not the people we're removing ourselves from. We're actually removing ourselves from those who are culturally similar enough to integrate independently.
Immigration is /going/ to happen, it's a net positive for the country, in fact it's required to sustain the country.
You've just ensured that it's the "brown people" who get imported.
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Please bear in mind, I have no ill-will to anyone from those countries, but when people argue against immigration it's almost always because of the polish (which was hugely self-inflicted) or "brown people". The majority of leavers I know don't expect this outcome, they think it'll be a net decline in all immigration (including those from India, Pakistan etc;)
because? If it's because we aren't fertile enough, or our education system isn't good enough, or we aren't paying enough for certain jobs, why not address this?
I'm interested to know whether you think there should be any upper limit to the population of the UK: 100m? 500m? more?
Because we have an aging population, and pensions are the single largest government expense. (more than double the NHS, which is also heavily burdened by our aging populaton)
For many people it was about regaining control of borders and reducing immigration. Personally I'm willing to trade off being a little poorer in exchange for being a sovereign nation once again, although the current direction of travel makes it look like we will be getting Brino i.e. Brexit in name only, about which by the way I'm staggered at how blithely people are willing to discard democracy when the result doesn't go their way.
As a Canadian (and I imagine citizen of pretty much any non-european commonwealth country) I had to chuckle a bit. After being treated like a resource-extraction milking machine historically and then maintaining this pseudo-ceremonial allegiance to a royal head of state it seems funny for someone from the mothership to bemoan a loss of sovereignty and self-determination.
No ill-will intended, just struck me as humorous in what is in all other regards a very humorless situation...
I'm basically a small c conservative, and I think the country is a far less pleasant place to live than when I grew up. If we want mass immigration we also need a massive house building programme, which might involve concreting over the countryside, or perhaps a proper regional policy. I don't see how we can have one without the other. If we were as big as Canada it would be a different story!
I went to the beach with the dog on New Year's day - there were thousands of other people, the roads were clogged, and it spoiled the experience. Buying in the countryside is often not an option depending on your career, because many jobs are only available in the South East, hence you are forced to live in a hyper-competitive area, fighting it out with millions of others for your tiny slice of England.
I'm just trying to explain that my reasons for wanting lower immigration have nothing to do with xenophobia, and everything to do with the realities of life in the SE UK. Injecting millions more people is going to make it a massive miserable conurbation, in my view.
It's a little more nuanced than that ... the SE of England was generally the area most in favour of Remain. Pretty much all of rural England outside of the pull of London voted to Leave.
I see Brexit as the losers in the globalization push taking their revenge on the winners.
Sure, I realise I'm something of an anomaly in my views. Something of a tangent I know, but I can't even walk to my local shop without being choked by diesel pollution, and this in a not particularly large southern town. Is this supposed to be progress?
Regaining control of our borders? Have you ever been to a UK border?
We’re not in Shengen. You can’t just stroll across.
This trope about discarding democracy is tired too. A democracy isn’t “choose once and keep forever”. We are free to change our minds. Or are you surprised that we have general elections every so often?
> This trope about discarding democracy is tired too
Imagine the contempt with which calls for a second referendum would be treated if it were remain that had won. Not to mention, we were told that the vote would settle the issue for a generation. Oh whoops, apparently only if we voted remain!
What does this actually mean specifically? What policy changes do you want that you think you can't have within the EU?
> sovereign nation once again
The UK is sovereign. It's just made some international agreements to align with other countries. If you think the EU is bad for this, wait until you see things like TTIP: all of the legislative override, ability to sue the state in foreign courts etc, and none of the democracy.
A points based immigration policy would be a nice start.
> The UK is sovereign. It's just made some international agreements to align with other countries. If you think the EU is bad for this, wait until you see things like TTIP: all of the legislative override, ability to sue the state in foreign courts etc, and none of the democracy.
One wonders how those poor impoverished nations outside of the big trading blocs survive!
> A points based immigration policy would be a nice start.
How aware are you of the current UK visa tier system? What kinds of people do you think are currently immigrating that would not be eligible under a points based system?
>One wonders how those poor impoverished nations outside of the big trading blocs survive!
Generally they are poor and impoverished, yes. Or they have a deal with the EU and US. Or are tiny exceptions like Singapore.
Of course it's not doomed.
But your position on "too much immigrants" is xenophobic, regardless of how you see it.
You're literally ignoring the fact, that most congestion in London and S/E England is due to internal migration. You're blaming EU migrants for your discomfort, the ones that are most likely to work for a bit and go back to their countries.
EU immigration certainly doesn't help. Also please don't throw insults around without foundation, which I see that you've been able to do with impunity, which says something about this forum.
Not to defend GP's post, but NAFTA and EU are vastly different. Without proper visas, I cannot settle in Canada, I cannot work in Canada, I cannot vacation for longer than 6 months in Canada.
I don't see why I shouldn't be allowed to. I think it would be nice to move freely between the NAFTA nations.
Disclaimer - I'm not trying to be hateful.
That seems like a completely nonsense, garbage statement. Brexit is primarily about money and economics, from what I can tell on the outside looking in.
So what was your purpose in writing that?