I hear a lot of "programmers don't do good Ui" as well as "marketers dictate bad UI" in my travels. I used to try to work out some sort of theory about which statement is true, and why. But then I experienced a revelation, Sturgeon's Revelation:
90% of everything is crap.
Therefore, if handed ten UIs designed by programmers, nine will be crap. If handed ten UIs designed by marketers, nine will be crap. Perhaps there is a characteristic way in which the nine programmer crap UIs are crap, but the observation that most programmer UIs are crap is not insightful and doesn't magically justify the idea of turning UI design over to product management.
That's a really good point - but I think a really big issue is that a lot of programmers (and I don't know why) seem to think that a good User Interface (API, Visual, Docs, etc) is just not needed.
That; and the attitudes range from "who cares" to downright hostile "if you can't understand it, you're stupid". I say this as a programmer (who spends a lot of time on the "user" facing components), not as a business person.
That attitude has to change - I don't care that the business people think hackers are Eloi fit for the slaughter while they are the Morlocks - the intelligent ones. Good business people don't have that attitude, good business and product people do care about scalability, supportability and quality. Those that don't will fail.
On the other hand, the constant refrain I hear from people in my own community and profession about making something usable and intuitive just makes me upset. I can't change the broken business people - I can try to make my corner of the world better.
Interesting that you compare "a lot of programmers" to "good business people." It is no surprise that the programmers fare poorly in comparison. What do you have to say about Good Programmers? Or A Lot of Business People?
May I attempt to find common ground between our points of view by suggesting that 90% of programmers have this attitude? And that by the same token, 90% of business people are busy demanding flash web site intros and banners that SCREAM without doing the A/B testing or other quantified analysis to know whether they are generating higher conversions?
But your last statement is absolutely spot on: making what we do better is what matters most. Upmod gladly given.
Well, the larger HN community seemed to not take kindly to my comment, which seems odd in and of itself.
Regardless, I concur with you - I can't speak to business people directly as it's not my particular domain, but yes - I've seen the same behavior that you have.
As a software developer who has at times thought that as long as the user interface is functional by the engineering definition that it is good enough, I've found it enlightening and interesting to go to local CHI (Computer Human Interaction) meetings where UX professionals present to one another. Programmers are a commodity but programmers who can understand and create user-friendly interfaces are less of one.
Take this a step further and join! I was an active member of ToRCHI for a few years and it was an amazing experience. Alas, it didn't make me a fully functional UX professional or even competent, but it did make me consciously incompetent, and that was valuable early in my career.
90% of everything is crap.
Therefore, if handed ten UIs designed by programmers, nine will be crap. If handed ten UIs designed by marketers, nine will be crap. Perhaps there is a characteristic way in which the nine programmer crap UIs are crap, but the observation that most programmer UIs are crap is not insightful and doesn't magically justify the idea of turning UI design over to product management.