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I'm out of the loop. What's the deal with tether?



Issue Tether (it is issued, not mined), trade Tether for Bitcoin, BTC price in Tethers increases, due to stated and believed peg of Tether to USD, BTC raises in USD price due to arbitrage executioners.

More details:

https://seekingalpha.com/article/4129543-bitcoin-one-way-go-...


Failing to understand how you could peg Tether to the USD and have people believe you. I was under the impression that pegging to a currency is something only a very big player, with close to unlimited resources can achieve, see People's Bank of China, Swiss Bank etc. Among others, you have to defend the currency against speculators and that requires a lot of capital.

Even the Bank of England failed to maintain the peg to the German Deutschmark some years ago. Can someone with more knowledge in the FX market area explain this better?


> Failing to understand how you could peg Tether to the USD and have people believe you.

In principle, it's simple: people pay you USD for Tether, you charge them a small percentage fee, put the remaining USD in a reserve account, and issue the buyer a corresponding amount of Tether. You do the reverse to buy Tether back from people.

For the trust issue, you get a reputable company to audit your reserves and Tether/USD transactions.

If you do this, no defense of anything is needed - if someone wants to sell Tether, they can always come back to the company that issues it and exchange their Tether for some of the dollars in the reserve account at an exchange rate of 1:1 minus fees.

In practice however, the auditing and transparency for Tether is not sufficient to be sure that this is what's actually happening. So the "having people believe you" part is definitely an issue right now.

> Even the Bank of England failed to maintain the peg to the German Deutschmark some years ago.

That's not the same kind of peg, at all. A Tether is just supposed to be a proxy for a USD. The pound and Deutschmark were two otherwise completely independent currencies, so the idea of pegging one to the other was dubious to start with. Here's a brief article which covers some of the issues with that peg: https://www.investopedia.com/ask/answers/08/george-soros-ban...


> Tether is just supposed to be a proxy for USD.

That would make sense indeed, so for every tether coin issued they’d normally have to pull a dollar out of circulation. Otherwise they re printing money isn’t it? Even if true, saying that they back it up is not enough.


Too late to edit.

Now that I think of it this would make sense for the FED to actually use the blockchain tech to manage its currency supply. Instead of the printing press they issue cryptodollars which supposedly are better than paper because they can be easily and fastly moved around or whatever. But not for a 3rd party to just say: This is a dollar, but called differently, trust us, we issued it.


> That would make sense indeed, so for every tether coin issued they’d normally have to pull a dollar out of circulation.

Correct.

> Otherwise they're printing money isn’t it?

Correct.

> Even if true, saying that they back it up is not enough.

Right. The original idea was that they would provided audited statements proving they held the necessary reserves. They did start out doing something like this, as described here:

https://medium.com/@bitfinexed/the-so-called-tether-audit-th...

See the screenshot of their "previous release" which showed reserves of $44 million across seven banks.

However, for various reasons, including avoiding regulations which would make running this kind of business much more difficult, subsequent releases were less specific and suffer from a host of issues described in the above article. Nevertheless, the latest release mentioned in the article did show $442 million of reserves backing Tethers.

You're correct that the Fed could certainly use a blockchain. However, there's nothing wrong in principle with the idea of a 3rd party issuing a token representing a dollar, if they provide appropriate auditing and comply with regulations in a respectable jurisdiction. No-one is currently doing that.


The claim is that they are in fact holding an equivalent amount of USD for all Tether. It's an IOU. (No comment on whether this is true.)

Bank of England couldn't maintain the peg because they weren't holding DM for literally all pounds in existence.


You can peg tether to the usd simply by offering to always exchange one tether for one usd and vice versa, no?


The problem is, sonfar they issued north of 800m with no proof of reserves, and no professional audit to support their claims.


That s the thing I don’t get, how do they “issue” tether? Because if one says they peg it to the dollar then it must follow the dollar’s inflation. Otherwise somebody is at a loss because there s more tether value than usd or viceversa, even if they were fully transparent and fair.

Edit

Unless of course tether is not a store of value in any way and just a fancy name for a dollar.


The way it works is, i go to exchange a, and tell them hey i have this cryptocurrency and i have enough cash to back it up. People can withdraw money from me using these.

If you do not verify my claims, you think this is a great idea, because now you can transact with usd(t). Formally these exchanges only used cross-coin exchanges.

Now this is not a problem as long as you have _enough_ money to support withdrawals on an ongoing basis. Nobody knows you dont have enough cash to support all issued tokens, because seemingly, everything works nicely. With the recent hype, money keeps flowing. Until a mass withdrawal happens.


But why do I want tether in the first place? Why bother switching back and forth at all? I don’t see why would I want to hold tether.

Can I buy a can of coke with it directly? What if the coke seller is a bit skeptical of tether and asks for 1.2 tether instead of one usd, just to play safe. Isn t this pressure applied to the exchange rate?


You mean, instead of USD? Because most exchanges cannot and does not support withdrawals - they are virtual.


But every tether "issued" is basically a dollar printed out of thin air if we're to trust Tether that it has the same value isn't it?

> Because most exchanges cannot and does not support withdrawals - they are virtual.

Can you elaborate? I'm not familiar with these exchanges, really curious. You mean exchanges accept cash for coins and don't allow withdrawals? :)


He means they don't support withdrawals of fiat currencies like USD or EUR. Many crypto exchanges only support withdrawal of crypto currencies.

To allow deposit or withdrawal of fiat, exchanges tend to have to comply with international banking regulations, which requires a great deal of paperwork. As a result, only a few exchanges offer this - examples are Coinbase, Bitstamp, Bitfinex, Kraken.

Before Tether existed, you couldn't buy or sell dollars or Euros on a pure crypto exchange. That's a big limitation.

Among other things, Tether allows you to trade in USD on these crypto-only exchanges.

Basically, one problem Tethers solve is allowing exchanges to operate more completely without regulatory oversight. As such, the limitations in their transparency may be acceptable to many users, who know that they're not operating in a regulated market and are willing to accept some risk for doing that.


They do, with the caveat that they are not legally required to do so and there are documented cases of them declining to do so for large orders.


Which BTC/tether market(s) is this happening on? I know plenty of BTC/USD markets, but I’m not familiar with which BTC/tether markets exist.


Bitfinex which is cooincidentally owned by the same people as Tether.


How is it issued exactly? Practically and technically speaking. What is the process?


I haven't read the whitepaper. But Ripple and Dash are similarly centralized I believe.


Tether is supposed to be backed 1:1 by US dollars and function as a non-volatile way to move money across exchanges. It's market cap is ~$815M. Lots of people believe that Bitfinex, the creator of Tether, is not actually holding $815M to back it. Instead they believe Bitfinex is creating Tether out of thin air and could be using it to inflate the price of Bitcoin.


How would them issuing tether out of thin air inflate the price of bitcoin?


By trading tether issued out of thin air for BTC.


Why would anyone want to exchange their Bitcoins that are worth over $10,000 each on Coinbase (and can be converted to real dollars) for some tokens that are backed by nothing?


Tether are, ostensibly, backed by $1 in a bank somewhere.

Having a dollar token is very useful, since you can move in and out of crypto trading positions into a stable store of value, good old USD.

Converting to real money takes a long time so you can't react to the market, and is also taxable and often has other fees on top.


> backed by $1 in a bank somewhere.

Are we sure about this?


No, that’s the point, no one is sure about this. For a token that’s supposed to be redeemable in USD, the tether is extremely opaque.


Yeah you took out the word ostensibly when you quoted me.


Converting to another coin is also taxable. Similar to selling a stock.


It’s used to move large amounts of dollars between exchanges that don’t want to deal with the regulations involved in moving large amounts of dollars.


In my experience, no one has a satisfying explanation for this. Nor why this would affect the USD price of bitcoin.


Also you can trade among yourself and create the illusion of hot market, suck a lot of people in, and use the funds from these people to stay afloat.


Bitfinex can become insolvent, which means people cannot cashout their usdt's. Prices may crash.


Good place to park your gains when the market's volatile.




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