Making high performance teams is part of their job description though, and there is research to indicate that teams with strong social bonds perform better.
Those teams develop strong social bonds precisely because their manager doesn't request (force) them to be 10% more vulnerable. That's a 1-way ticket to a bunch of people not liking you.
You can achieve that vulnerability via being a likable and honest person. I think often us technical-minded people forget that relationships aren't an optimization problem and don't respond like you think they would. Just being decent and trustworthy will take you there, saying things like "you can trust me guys!" often has the opposite effect.
Yeah but you don't form strong social bonds through awkward team exercises. The best team I worked on was super high performing and we did end up sharing personal stuff on our spare time eventually (and some of us are still friends years later). That all happened organically.
What didn't work, however, was the office manager's increasingly awkward attempts to force socialising. When at some point we raised the issue (politely!) that this was often distracting, he became offended and lashed out. We later also found out that he was basically spying on us and reporting back to HQ.
It's one of the reasons why I'm incredibly wary of people who try too hard to be my "buddy" at work, especially if they're not peers.
> They tried to build their product from it and I wasn't able to tolerate that
If I heard this while I was interviewing a candidate, I would write a note to myself: "Be prepared for more of this."
> I also brought up the fact I had security concerns in regards to their systems when I went in person but that was brushed aside/ignored
If I heard this while I was interviewing a candidate, I would wonder whether they lacked awareness of the need to follow established processes.
> she kicked me out after my episode of psychosis
So there's at least one occasion when the person had a break from reality, leading to them being kicked out of a house. I know it's important to avoid stigmatizing those with mental illness, but the person has indicated that they had a bad experience with treatment and are not currently in treatment, so it would not be unreasonable to expect that this psychosis could occur again.
> I was able to social engineer myself into being a 'visitor' at a hospital for the past week
Not exactly legal or ethical. Obviously, they're facing dire circumstances, which might mitigate their culpability, but would you want to hire someone who uses social engineering to deceive people?
> I'm going to go and try to find/steal some food now
Again, they're facing dire circumstances, which might mitigate their culpability, but they're also being quite open about being willing to steal, which is not exactly a desirable trait for most employers.
Edit: My last point was not meant to suggest that under these circumstances, stealing a bit of food is reprehensible. Sometimes you've gotta do what you've gotta do. But broadcasting it is the red flag. It indicates a lack of discretion. I'm not trying to be callous here, but GP asked about red flags, so I was trying to describe some.
I agree with some of the points, but regarding the food and being in the hospital, those statements are really harsh. It's painful, but he said the truth and based on his post those description implied really serious alternatives (dying, getting sick due to extreme cold).
> If I heard this while I was interviewing a candidate, I would write a note to myself: "Be prepared for more of this."
I agree with you, I wasn't able to provide the full story due to the HN character limit. The contract I signed when I took up work with them explicitly stated my public work will remain mine. If that wasn't in the contract I would have said no. As I put it, it might not be a great look. Thanks for bringing that up
> If I heard this while I was interviewing a candidate, I would wonder whether they lacked awareness of the need to follow established processes.
I agree, there probably is an established process I should have spent time looking into rather than raising the issue directly with the staff who work at the place/with the system itself. Like I said, I was a bit frustrated but it's definitely possible I could have brought that up in a more productive way
> So there's at least one occasion when the person had a break from reality, leading to them being kicked out of a house. I know it's important to avoid stigmatizing those with mental illness, but the person has indicated that they had a bad experience with treatment and are not currently in treatment, so it would not be unreasonable to expect that this psychosis could occur again.
That was my first and so far only episode of psychosis, from my point of view it wasn't so much a bad experience with treatment. But a bad experience by nearly ending up homeless after due to my family kicking me out after I stabilized in the hospital/received/participated in treatment for my first ever episode of psychosis.
> Not exactly legal or ethical. Obviously, they're facing dire circumstances, which might mitigate their culpability, but would you want to hire someone who uses social engineering to deceive people?
I lied about being a visitor compared to the very real alternative of freezing to death, shoot me lol
> Again, they're facing dire circumstances, which might mitigate their culpability, but they're also being quite open about being willing to steal, which is not exactly a desirable trait for most employers.
I somewhat agree, I'm not proud of stealing food and I have already went to a foodbank/received $27 to buy some food but that unfortunately only lasted a few days and I started getting hungry again/haven't been able to find more support for food since. Although maybe I should just try harder. Either way, thanks for bringing up that broadcasting that is a red flag, that is something I should be a bit more wary of, I've made a mental note of that but I doubt I'll need it once I get back on my feet
> If I heard this while I was interviewing a candidate, I would write a note to myself: "Be prepared for more of this."
I mean... ok? So don't try to make their FOSS product your own product?
> If I heard this while I was interviewing a candidate, I would wonder whether they lacked awareness of the need to follow established processes.
Ew. I would wonder why the staff wasn't able to tell him there is a process.
> So there's at least one occasion when the person had a break from reality
"years ago" in an unstable situation.
> Not exactly legal or ethical. Obviously, they're facing dire circumstances, which might mitigate their culpability, but would you want to hire someone who uses social engineering to deceive people?
I'm pretty sure "social engineer" here means something along the lines of "yeah I'm visiting my cousin"
> Again, they're facing dire circumstances, which might mitigate their culpability, but they're also being quite open about being willing to steal, which is not exactly a desirable trait for most employers.
Unless they're working for a grocery store or restaurant I don't think their employer will be worried about them stealing food.
This reflects a viewpoint usually rectified by moral quandaries explored in elementary school, certainly middle school, fiction.
Much less, this gem, argumentation that you'd expect a 12 year old in debate class to be able to skewer if they wanted a B.
>> I'm going to go and try to find/steal some food now
> Again, they're facing dire circumstances, which might mitigate their culpability, but they're also being quite open about being willing to steal, which is not exactly a desirable trait for most employers.
While I agree that the food thing is neither here nor there, I didn't find the warning absurd. Once you've been through one of these difficult cases and seen the impact that it can have on the other employees it's hard to unlearn that lesson of caution.
This person needs social and professional help, and the situation is very unfortunate. But based on the content of the OP if you bring them into your workplace (the assumed context here in this particular thread) without those two things then you should be sure you know what you're doing.
"it's a red flag if an employee ever stole food for a meal / camped at a hospital while homeless" isn't.
Upper-class a-human inanity unrecognizable by 90% of the populace. I wouldn't believe it was a real person making an honest argument if I hadn't self-made my way from inner city Buffalo startup to Boston at Google, and found out how sheltered people can be.
Thanks for this bit of sanity. I was losing my mind trying to think up an explanation as to why that comment wasn't flagged or inundated with comments pointing out the sheer stupidity and inhumane arrogance.
I don't want to be overly dramatic, but this has genuinely lowered my view of HN as a whole, and I'll think twice about reading the comments here from now on.
If I were to show this to any well-adjusted person I know, they'd probably think less of me for even being in the same community and profession as the person who wrote that comment.
I don't want to downplay anything you've said because I think you're pretty much on the mark.
>> I was able to social engineer myself into being a 'visitor' at a hospital for the past week
> Not exactly legal or ethical. Obviously, they're facing dire circumstances, which might mitigate their culpability, but would you want to hire someone who uses social engineering to deceive people?
This is an unfortunate reality in Canada, especially in places where it gets cold enough to freeze to death during the winter (which most of Alberta would qualify for). Homeless shelters are full, the wait lists for social support, mental health support, and addiction support are long*, and hospitals are warm, publicly owned, and honestly so long as you're not making a nuisance of yourself they're probably not the worst place to hang out. There's usually public cafeterias and lots of seating throughout. Sleeping there would probably be a problem.
> bad experience with treatment and are not currently in treatment
This is another one of the oddities of the Canadian healthcare system. There's a few different categories of mental health support:
- Social services is free but often there isn't a whole lot they can help with. Employment Insurance (EI) has a pretty heavy paperwork burden and also requires you to have been employed recently and only lasts for a limited amount of time. Long-term disability has a lot of strings attached. If you do manage to find gainful income they take away your financial support 1:1; a woman I know went blind due to cancer when she was a teenager and was living in an apartment provided by social housing. She started making beaded jewelry and selling it at the farmer's market. Over a period of a year she managed to save up $500 to buy herself an iPad, which apparently has excellent accessibility features for blind users. When her social worker came by and saw it she threatened to deduct $500 off of the next disability cheque.
- There are psychiatrists available, for free, through the public healthcare system. They're by referral only and a referral must come from a GP. 20% of Canadians do not currently have a family doctor (~6M people) so their only access to psychiatric help is to convince a doctor at a walk-in clinic to make a referral. In most cases it's going to be months before you hear back. There are occasionally walk-in clinics that do have on-site psychiatrists but it's exceptionally rare.
- Psychologists and therapists are not covered by the public health system. Some do offer reduced rates for low-income patients but you're generally looking at somewhere in the $80-120/hr range. Like OP mentioned about astrology, there isn't a whole lot of quality control around this... you basically have to go interview them (and likely pay for the privilege) and make your own decision on whether or not you think they'll be someone you want to give more money to.
As an additional wrinkle, while healthcare is nominally free, prescription medication is not (although there was a big announcement around this yesterday, so that may be changing). Even if OP did manage to get an appointment with a psychiatrist and get an assessment and a prescription... how the heck are they going to pay for it? There are generally programs in place to provide medication discounts for low-income people but... again, paperwork burden and long turn-around times.
The brutal question that comes up on a pretty regular basis is: what do we do about people like OP? While we, in theory, have more humanity than just letting them freeze to death in the streets, we also do a piss-poor job at helping them get out of the situation they're in.
* Basically the only way to get seen by someone reasonably quickly is to tell them you're suicidal, but that'll probably result in an involuntary hold for a while.
Would you want to get Internet famous for being a homeless programmer, and have that shit come up on Google every time your resume is looked at? Give me a break.
fartfeatures might be a sock puppet account of an 11 year old, no email, pseudonym, and childish bodily functions name. 5 month old account with barely any history of commenting anywhere but this thread, and very low karma for a 5 month old account. Concerning.
Sorry, I wrote 8000+ characters the first time but HN limits the character count on text posts. I'd be happy to add some more details here as I think you raise some great points! I'd tend to agree with you for most things but let me clear up a few things too :)
> there's an undercurrent of "the world is out to get me personally" to it. Everything bad happens to him, he's not responsible for anything that may have put him in his situation.
I'm 100% responsible for choosing to leave a good company to pick up a contract with a company working on something similiar to my FOSS project, a contract that explicitly stated any and all public work I have will remain mine, not to mention the fact my project is AGPL licensed.
> Glosses over why he chose a psychologist who apparently is also an astrologist as well.
I didn't choose my psychologist, they came highly recommended to me by a psychitriast I was seeing who I've had to since stop seeing due to the fact his case load was too much and he moved to a different province. I didn't actually know she was an astrologist until she brought that up, that's when I started paying attention/learning about red flags to watch out for.
> "No" was an option. And he was hired for his work on an open source project. And they wanted to pay him to work on it and sell a product or service around it. And? Why was that so intolerable to him?
I find it amusing you bring up "framing", that's what you are doing. I wasn't hired to work on my open source project, the contract I signed explicitly stated my public work will remain mine, although the reality turned out different :)
> And apparently he left his previous job in such a way they wouldn't have him back.
I did yes, I wasn't working with them for very long and they were quite pissed I left so soon. I'll own that mistake
> exaggerates his own skills. Like the claim he "social engineered" his way into being a visitor at a hospital. Yeah. That's just straight up lying. You go sit in a visitor's area and say you're visiting. It's not difficult or challenging. Most people don't do it because there's no need to.
> management of human beings in accordance with their place and function in society : applied social science
You're correct, it's cold and I don't want to freeze so I lied and claimed to be a visitor. Perhaps I misunderstand this definition found at this dictionary I linked, would you be so kind as to explain it like I'm 5?
> This dude needs to make life traumatic because that's the only thing he knows. It's the only thing he's comfortable with. Everything has to be a confrontation, a challenge, adversarial, because for the first 8 years of his life, that was his life. He thinks that's normal.
I would much rather life not be traumatic, I try my best to be kind to people but regardless I make mistakes sometimes, like all humans do. I'm curious as to what I said that indicates my circumstances are me trying to make my life more traumatic than it already is. Please do explain, I'd love to learn about/hear more about that perspective :)
> You could take him in. Give him a roof, three hots, and a cot. And yeah, for the first few weeks
That's not what I'm requesting, could you please quote what I said that indicates that? Perhaps I need to work on my communication more :) I kind of was more or less just looking for people I could talk to who would be kind/understanding. Someone reached out saying they would be willing to pay for a hotel for me for a couple nights but I replied that I wouldn't really feel comfortable with that coming from a stranger but also that I wouldn't say no and I'd do my best to pay them back once I'm back on my feet
I really do hope you never experience hardship in life, take care of yourself :)
> didn't choose his psychologist. Apparently he was forced to see them. Against his will. He had no choice.
Where did I claim I was "forced" to see them? I was seeking help/support with my mental health so I asked a psychiatrist I trusted for advice. What would you recommend doing for someone in a position like mine? You throw a whole lot of accusations around but seem to offer very little practical advice lol
> left as soon as he learned they were an astrologist rather than giving them a chance.
I also don't think I claimed this but feel free to quote where I perhaps miscommunicated this. I actually kept seeing them probably far longer than I should have because I grew attached to them/learned to trust them depsite them very likely not being a great choice for me and for improving my mental health.
> not gaining access to anything anyone really cares about
No shit sherlock, but if you don't lie about being a visitor you'll get kicked out right away
This clearly isn't going to be a productive conversation and you've made it obvious you have no knowledge or interest in offering any sort of practical advice for someone experiencing hardship, however you're very good at being demeaning, insulting, and rude so I guess this will be my last reply to you. Good luck with your life, and once again, I really do hope you don't experience much hardship in life and if you do, hopefully someone offers you some practical advice/kindness rather than being shitty and demeaning towards you
I specialize in, Backend/Python development — POCs, rapid prototypes, load/performance testing etc.
Server side/DB performance optimizations & design to scale.
Big Data consulting — Hadoop Ecosystem + Cassandra. Have evaluated Mongo, Couchbase, Riak, DynamoDB, EMR and redshift as well for client requirements.
Devops on Linux servers/EC2
NLP/ML/Data Science Consulting — Sentiment Analysis, NER, Classification,Clustering,Statistical modelling
That is not really true, if it was then Linkedin would have evaluated all the clouds in fair process and gone with AWS as the best fit in 2019 if they wanted to move in the first place.
The pressure to move to a cloud and to Azure specifically both comes entirely from MS. Linkedin was perfectly happy then and now running its own setup, this 4 years of trying to move is because of MS ownership.
I left my job in July, and took a bit of break to introspect, focus on my health, spend time taking care of my family members, did a few investments, read up a lot and figuring out what I want to do next.
I have just started to talk to people wrt to different jobs, although I am not sure I want to take up another job. will figure it out in due time.
