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> IMO I think we're doomed to move the goalposts on intelligence for a while

I'm old enough to remember back when we thought language was the defining element of intelligence. Dogs can't talk - dogs aren't intelligent.

Now LLMs can talk, and we've shifted intelligence to mean animal intelligence - being able to predict the motion of a falling ball, wanting to protect your children, etc.

Some people truly cannot tolerate the idea that our intelligence/existence isn't magical, so they'll desperately move it again and again and again... forever. Watch.


I still feel like animal intelligence is completely downplayed.

Dog's can learn new environments and tasks. The simple act of recognizing what a door is and how they work takes quite a bit of intelligence.

As far as I can see, AI still can't make a robotic dog.


There is some conflation between consciousness and intelligence going on. Consciousness is subjective experiences. Intelligence is cognitive ability. There isn’t a necessary link between the two. We can say LLMs are intelligent but not conscious. We could say a lizard is conscious but not that intelligent.

It really is impressive how much he's disliked.

Yes. That was my thought when I first heard it: they're announcing an announcement.

I wish I had a cult that would let me get away with stuff like this.


> It’s a world scale Stockholm syndrome.

There are a lot of those these days.


They're speaking to the lay community. The lay community is not known for using precise language. If they had used language like yours, the lay community probably wouldn't have received the key message: "10x better".

On the other side, it seems clear that the scientific community was able to deduce the intended meaning of "10x fewer".


They needed Musk's pledge of $1B to remain non-profit. When he took back that money, their only choice was to either A) shut-down or B) go profit.

I think most people (aside from Elon) are happy they didn't shut-down.


If I remember correctly, they started a for-profit side business (initially to bring in a little cash) and Musk was concerned about the way it was developing and who was gaining power over the company as a result. Perhaps he just wanted to stay in charge and didn't like other VCs moving into his turf, but it's also apparent that his expressed concerns at the time proved wildly accurate.

Hm. I've never seen anything about a for-profit side business before Musk left. Do you have any references for that?

Yeah, I've Googled around and even asked ChatGPT. There seems to be no record of a for-profit side business. At least before Elon left. Of course they created one about a year after he left, because they're were running out of money, and would need to shut-down otherwise.

I can understand not wanting Elon to be the head of your company. His behavior is a little erratic.


Well - except Elon offered the funding without the contingency of being CEO. It was when he demanded it that they went their separate ways.

> Elon did not force them to choose Microsoft.

By rescinding his offer, he did force them to make drastic changes in order to get new funding.

> Now he can move on with his life.

Are you familiar with Elon?


> They declined to give Elon Musk control when he offered them a billion to save the company.

On the contrary, it was the fact Elon pulled the $1B he had previously offered that put the company in jeopardy.

https://www.semafor.com/article/03/24/2023/the-secret-histor...


> Having Apple dependent on and paying for Microsoft infrastructure is a win for Microsoft.

LOL!

I would love to see your evidence that Apple's new AI offering will be running on Microsoft's infrastructure.


It was a public announcement. https://openai.com/index/openai-and-apple-announce-partnersh...

OpenAI models run on Azure infrastructure. Apple is just a client and will be paying Microsoft via OpenAI to run it.

Apple also has their own models running on their own infrastructure. I'm not saying that Microsoft or OpenAI has anything to do with that.


That's SO WEIRD. When I load that page, I see no mention of Azure.

[flagged]


OpenAI's current infrastructure runs on Azure.

Do you have any evidence that their new Apple services will run on Azure?


It's impossible to discuss this with you as you keep changing your comment.

I never once implied it would run on Apple servers. You're putting words in my mouth. I am asking if you have any direct evidence that they'll be running on Azure.

The fact that you keep dodging that question tells me you don't.


> Holy shit you are a fucking moron. I posted direct links to everything.

Holy shit you are a fucking moron! None of your links say anything about Apple's new services.

I think it's safe to say we're not going to find common ground here. You have a nice day.


Sorry for the shit language but I got tired of you not understanding anything.

Apple's services do not run on Azure. Apple's services run on Apple infrastructure.

OpenAI services run on Azure

Apple is a new partner of OpenAI. Apple will use OpenAI services which run on Azure. Hopefully that makes sense. It is not that complicated.


Yeah, I saw a story that backed up your claims after you left. Sorry I didn't just take your word for it - but that's not how it's done, you know? Strangers on the internet sometimes lie. Perhaps you've never encountered it before.

> Sorry for the shit language but I got tired of you not understanding anything.

Yeah, I wish you had actually offered a citation backing up your claims.

But, it was also the fact you kept changing the text of your comment, to remove the things I was addressing. It would have been better if you'd left a record of all the things you said. Like I said, editing your comments after the fact is dishonest.

Back at the beginning of all this, you had said:

> Having Apple dependent on and paying for Microsoft infrastructure is a win for Microsoft.

In the end it turns out Apple isn't paying for Microsoft infrastructure after all.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-06-12/apple-to-...


I found a non-paywall copy of the article https://www.bnnbloomberg.ca/apple-to-pay-openai-for-chatgpt-...

You are still missing the point and I think you have a persistent mental block. You are overthinking it. It's not that complicated.

The article says that Apple is partnering with OpenAI. It also says that OpenAI runs on Azure infrastructure.

Whatever they negotiate, the deal is intended to be a win-win for both sides in the long run. Obviously both sides are interested in making money. The article mentions future revenue sharing agreements and getting more users to subscribe to the paid ChatGPT.

Any increase of OpenAI/ChatGPT usage means an increased usage of (and dependency on) Microsoft/Azure infrastructure. I don't understand how this is so complicated to understand. OpenAI runs on Azure and more OpenAI usage/dependency means more Azure usage/dependency. Microsoft increases their cut of the AI market share as more Apple users use Microsoft infrastructure and of course they will make profit from that. None of these guys are doing it for charity.


OMG.

You are quite something. Have a nice day.


Fuckin hell. It's like asking for a citation that Microsoft owns Azure. Ridiculous.

OpenAI runs on Microsoft servers.

Apple partnered with OpenAI to use their service which runs on Microsoft servers.

Basic facts.


You take care now.

> To answer your question below: Apple is a customer of OpenAI. They are using OpenAI as a service. The OpenAI models won't be running in Apple data centers.

Don't move the goalposts. I asked you if you had evidence that it will run on Azure.


FYI - It's dishonest to keep changing your comment.

Pretty sure you have the order of events backward there.

The story I heard was that Musk pulled the $1B and THEN they were forced to go profit in order to survive.

https://www.semafor.com/article/03/24/2023/the-secret-histor...


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