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I kind of did. I used to be fairly active on the Fediverse, until I got to join a small community on Discord. Now it feels like a Stammtisch, so a place I can just hop in and hang out with folks I know and I like. Sometimes we even get to actually meet irl, so it's real nice. I still have some "read-only" feeds like twitter, but that's about it.


Westerns unfortunately feel threatened by the rise of socialist Republics because they assume their interests are the same as their elites, so if their elites end up being hurt by China, they will end up being hurt themselves aswell.


Unfortunately?

I feel threatened by an ethnosupremacist regime that would murder tens of millions of its own citizens.

Crazy huh?


Ah yes, socialists are the Nazis now and westerners are freedom-loving sovereignty-respecting anti racists


Because they have elections aswell and they love their form of goverment. But apparently, when you love national sovereignty, you are a dictator and when you sell your own country to powerful oligarchs, you are a democrat.


It's literally a one party state. "You can vote for anyone you like so long as it's the guy from the CPC," ain't exactly a choice.


Other western countries are also one party states, but with western extravagance so you have two parties. You choice? Hitler's or Mussolini's. How brilliant those "democracies" are.


Come on, make your trolling less obvious. Even as bait, that's too stupid.


I'm not even trolling that much lol. When I look at most western elections, you basically "have" to choose between fascists nowadays.


Elections =/= Democracy. Let me know when they have free, independent elections with international observers


Even when they have free, independant elections with international observers (cough cough Venezuela cough cough), they are dictatorships because American Elites say so. Interesting how the world works. It's like there is propaganda in the western world targeted at westerners or something.


Why don't you do us a favor a show the public statement from the Carter Center and the UN related to Venezuela. Or you would rather show me statements from great democracies like Russia, China and Iran?


Because American Elites say so.

You might want to talk to some actual Venezuelans some time. You may find the experience to be quite informative and illuminating.


They would love to be able to trade with other countries, but American Overlords are preventing them from doing so through embargoes. Only Sister-Republics like China or Venezuela dare disobeying the US.


Patently false. Cuba's top trade partners also include: Spain, Germany, Portugal, Mexico, Brazil, Netherlands, Italy, Vietnam.


- Venezuela

- North Korea

- Cuba

Three communist and socialist countries with starving populations.

North Korea trades freely and shares a border with China. Venezuela has no sanctions applied to it by the US.

We can now easily rule out sanctions as the cause of their woes so what is the other common factor between these countries?


I think you underestimate the power of your government and the impact of economic sanctions.

At the end of the day, I don't understand why those countries aren't allowed to be independant.


> I think you underestimate the power of your government and the impact of economic sanctions.

I think you don't understand how the scientific method works.

Venezuela had sanctions removed, they still starved. North Korea trades directly with the massive economy of China, the people are still starving and poor.

The problem is communism and socialism, not sanctions. Stop being a stooge for dictators.


I think you have been propagandized by criminals. I don't blame you, I was the same.

Regarding starvation, it happened under capitalist, slavery-based and feudal regimes aswell. One recent example is how the very capitalistic UK engineered a terrible famine that nearly killed 200mio Indians. For most of the western world, Churchill was very much a saviour, but for Indians, he was a brutal dictator.


I've personally experienced the horrors of communism so no propaganda was needed for me.


Oh have you? Interesting.

If you lived in a low-performing socialist country, I guess it's tough to blame you. But keep in mind that socialism, like any democratic experiment, is different based on the country's initial historic and material conditions.

One can pin point at China, a high performing democratic experiment and say they are doing fairly well, "despite" being a socialist Republic.

However I'm curious what you refer as "horrors" of communism.


> However I'm curious what you refer as "horrors" of communism.

Mass starvation and murders to start.


This is happening right now in Palestine and I'm pretty sure Israel is a capitalist entity.

Oh but I forgot, when we do it, we are the good guys. My bad.


Starvation due to war blockades, not because of lack of food; Gaza wasn’t starving before Hamas invaded.

Unlike in communist countries where famine occurs because there’s literally not enough food to go around.

No offense, but it seems you’re trolling with the way you bring up unrelated points.


"Hamas invaded" lmao, ofc its the locals who got to be invaders, not crackers from the western world.

Also war blockades are illegal, but again, when the west does it, its fine. With such mentality, no wonders they hate us.


Communism has more variables than central-planning vs market-economy: one-party, authoritarian, no private property, no political speech, nothing approaching civil rights, political executions...

Kim Jong Un Executes Officials Over Deadly Floods in North Korea https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxLLk90i-Ek&t=2s


Any news network that cites Radio Free Asia uncritically shouldn't be taken seriously, which is where the news come from.

Next month there will be news how North Koreans are eating their own children with comically large spoons and y'all are gonna fall for it.


I can't discuss anything further with you when you call China democratic. You are basically a flat earther.


Capitalism claims one more victim.


Because famously no one has ever died from being over worked under communism


Outside of the gulag prison system? It would be unlikely.

A common saying that reflected the typical experience was "we pretend to work and they pretend to pay us".


To discredit capitalism is not necessarily to credit communism.

We can surely criticise one without having to immediately complain about the other, can't we?

Edit: To be clear, my problem with this is that to pretend that there is only a choice between 'capitalism' and 'communism' is a false dichotomy.


>To discredit capitalism is not necessarily to credit communism.

For most people a non-capitalist system is necessarily socialist/communist. So the response is apt for most situations.

> there is only a choice between 'capitalism' and 'communism' is a false dichotomy.

I fully agree, there are nuances that are not considered in what is traditionally defined as communism/socialism/capitalism.

But it's important to note that most people understand things only in black and white, and never the shades of gray.


In capitalism thats a wanted and necessary feature, under a socialist system thats an unfortunate accident. I gotta admit, it very likely happened because workers republics had to do what needed to be done to survive relentless attacks of western oligarchies.


I don't really understand the reasoning between implementing E2EE for video and audio but not for chats in themselves. I feel like for those things, its either all or nothing, otherwise its mostly useless.


The video and audio is ephemeral and only for parties which are present. Chats are expected to be stored and available to people who are not available. That's the big thing. Once you've sent a packet of video/audio, you don't need to use it ever again.

People expect to join servers and have the history available to them to search. E2EE means that history is not available, and all indexing happens client-side, all messages are stored client-side, etc.


You know it's possible to store and serve encrypted data, right? It's not a one time use will-self-destruct-in-30-seconds deal. The data is still decryptable after it's been sent.


Except not really with proper E2EE. Go and join a new Signal or WhatsApp group. You'll notice they're empty. As you were not around for a key exchange when the messages were initially sent.

Encryption ≠ E2EE.


It's possible to implement shared history systems where newly invited members of a group can request access to the history of a group, while preserving E2EE security.


> It's not a one time use will-self-destruct-in-30-seconds deal.

Except it kinda is. You need new keys for every participant. This is why the true E2E messaging apps have user limits and no history.


Bringing up the ephemerality of A/V chats is not about security, it's about the user experience.

> People expect to join servers and have the history available to them to search. E2EE means that history is not available

It's more acceptable to Discord users for video and audio chats to be E2EE because Discord has always offered them as an ephemeral experience: unlike text chats, they never offered audio/video chat history as a feature for users.


I would ordinarily have thought the same, but what immediately came to mind was the TOS update that they "generally do not store the contents of video or voice calls"[0]. (I've since forgotten what it looked like before that but remember a big reaction in the userbase.)

I wonder if those terms would be practically nullified in any way if the E2EE is enabled.

Though, maybe they would attempt to implement something like Apple's offline CSAM policing that almost (IIRC?) came to be. There is also the Whatsapp method (albeit for text-based messages) that the app client of the user reporting you will send decrypted messages to Facebook.

[0]: https://discord.com/privacy


Your other comment got auto-killed because m*sturbating is a flagged word.

That aside, I was only referring to private communications. Moderation in a public server is different, and there should be more visibility for server admins. With that said, Discord has been improving moderation tools, and I'm not sure how trolls can be stopped as long as making (or stealing) an account is easy. Remove that aspect, and half the reason for using Discord is gone.


Totally fair, even if I'd argue that Discord far and away aims to be a social platform (that should be prioritizing straightforward and intuitive control for server/guild administrators) over a private messenger. And admittedly, I'll complain to no end about those moderation tools beyond the point of fruitful discussion.

Thank you for pointing out the dead post; it's good to know for future reference (and looks like a guardian angel has since revived it :)


I'd argue it's because there's a lot of problematic content that gets shared in text that just isn't really much of an issue (or isn't viable to detect) in audio/video.


I'd argue the opposite somewhat: there's a lot of problematic content that's an issue with audio/video, but like you said, it's not viable to detect at scale, so it's better to close the door.


The cynic in me agrees with you here - this is likely a way for them to go "oh no, we couldn't see that information, it's *encrypted* so we have no liability, legal or otherwise, to stop any sort of abuse on our platform since we can't see it"


Well, this is why Signal is fine while the Telegram boss is in jail. As long as you haven't done anything illegal (and aren't explicitly trying to enable illegal activity), it's perfectly fine to just say "we can't do this." I'm really for this; being able to inspect users' data should be a liability.


> so it's better to close the door.

I don't feel convinced of this takeaway, at least in the context of being applied across the board.

I help administer a semi-large, public studygroup community that sees its share of trolls and the like joining the channels and causing disruptions (up to and including exposing themselves and masturbating/helicoptering) for shock value, etc.

If anything, I find Discord's moderation tools for server administrators painfully lacking. Discord is not Signal.

I would have liked to see this in some form closer to an assignable privilege to send out/upload E2EE data granularly grantable to server regulars, while new people start out without the privilege.

This press release going into cool technical details in order to tout E2EE and namedropping one of the most reputable consultants in the biz feels a little tonedeaf.


too late to edit, but:

> granularly grantable to server regulars

more sensibly, and of which i would be really receptive to (as a server/guild administrator), granular setting on a per-channel basis.

of course, this sentiment largely takes for granted that there is any open-facing mission on Discord's part to facilitate community moderation; i definitely tend to lean privacy-first in general.


Both parties have to consent to start a call. Chats can be unwanted/unprompted.

They are pretty transparent that they want Discord to be a moderated platform to prevent harassment and the like.


Lovely concept. Just gotta wait until its released for Firefox.


Thank you so much! Yes I'm working on it ;)


"Could we eventually create a capitalist paradise where democratically run companies use their profits for the good of their worker citizens? Could that even replace our existing governments?"

Dude reinvented the socialist mode of production but renamed it "capitalism" instead lmao


I guess that's a weak-ass flex as not lose face considering the US oligarchs have failed to suspend the Constitution of Venezuela.


What the hell are you even talking about in your reference to U.S oligarchs failing to suspend the constitution of Venezuela?


I wouldnt be surprised if in a few years such project would get criminalised


More likely to end up compromised but available - like Tor, where the NSA just runs a sufficient number of nodes to compromise the network.


Only if it can't be infiltrated, which is usually the preferred option.


Doesn't Firechat fit in this conversation, possibly some vague event behind the scenes that shuts anything like this down


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