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It's a numbers game. You need to be pursuing 5-10 job leads at any one time. You can be the perfect fit for the job, but it doesn't matter. Companies will turn you down for reasons which they will never be able to admit to and you will have to learn to turn companies down for certain reasons (which also you probably shouldn't say publicly). Remember, offices range from laid back, low pay, and easy to work with to psychopathic coked up management trying to ethnically cleanse all the people not of their country of origin (and brag about it later). Also, the hardest thing to do, and the most mature, is to always consider it was your fault whether not the right skills or not enough practice. It may turn out not to be, but you have to consider it.

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namenotrequired 8 hours ago | link

> It's a numbers game. You need to be pursuing 5-10 job leads at any one time

It's funny, I don't mean to suggest this is totally untrue, but opposite to the advice I give (albeit based on a sample size of five). The two best jobs by far were those I got (1) by volunteering for a while until they (unexpectedly) offered me a job or (2) by picking one company I'd love to work for, and persistently trying until they made an offer. Admittedly, those were both with small companies (under 100 employees).

I think going for quality or quantity can both work.

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This is the same stuff from 2011 so they've probably seen the drink pouring, hopping on one foot.

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Does anyone else see dedication to a single language as a flaw? When I read "X is a Y language company" all I can think is "that company has a long ways to go." I imagine the people or person there, having found their favorite pet language and some political energy, forcing it upon everyone else and I feel angry. I get recruiter emails "looking for a Java developer" and have to ignore them. The companies just don't get it. Language Y is not going to fit all needs and cases except for very, very small problems. A company dedicated to one language is like a Popsicle with dirt all over it.

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gmjosack 7 days ago | link

I agree with you but I also believe there needs to be limits. I like Google's strategy of N approved languages.

From an operational perspective there's too much overhead to effectively running any language in a production environment.

From a maintenance perspective you want to have common skill sets between a large intersection of employees so you're not the only person doing bug fixes on a system.

There needs to be a balance for sure.

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crusso 7 days ago | link

Good points. I took over management of a software development group that had a four server commercial product that was dependent upon having developers knowledgeable in all of the following: Windows, Linux, MSSQL, PostgreSQL, MySQL, C++, C, Java, C#, PHP, Perl, Bash, and Javascript.

The development team was very siloed. Nobody could work on anyone else's code, not even a little bit.

When a new developer approached me with a module that he had written in Jython, I almost lost it.

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bloat 7 days ago | link

Not sure where you're getting this. The article says they currently do a lot of Ruby work, and they're moving to Clojure for most new back-end projects.

It also talks about how Trapperkeeper works with Clojure, JRuby and Java modules.

You may well be right about single language companies, but I'm not seeing any evidence that Puppet Labs is one of them.

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pbiggar 6 days ago | link

CircleCI is a Clojure company from day one, so there was no need to force it on people. We've found a lot of advantages from this, not just on the code side but also from recruiting.

One problem we've had is that our frontend isn't clojure/clojurescript (its coffeescript+haml+knockout). In theory that means its easier to find frontend developers and designers. In practice it has meant creating a frontend/backend division where the backenders in particular don't like to work on the frontend. We testing out whether a move to clojurescript (and hence being a truly one-language company) will solve that.

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nigelk 6 days ago | link

Your comments apply to the HN link text, not the article or headline.

Puppet Labs isn't a single language company.

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dang 6 days ago | link

Yes, the submitter broke the HN guidelines by editorializing the title. On the other hand, the article's official title is uninformative. So I replaced it with the sentence from the article that most seems to describe its content (shortened to fit 80 chars). If anyone can suggest a better title, I'll change it again.

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nigelk 6 days ago | link

Not sure if you're the one who changed it, but the " Trapperkeeper is a new Clojure framework [...]" title works fine and is much less misleading imho.

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Most blue collar workers turn over in a year, so this is just PR fluff. Companies can and do write them up at any time for the smallest of mistakes and then fire them, often within the first three months. Any statement made about a manual labor job and "After the first year" is ridiculous as is the tuition plan.

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sockgrant 8 days ago | link

Do you have a source?

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codeonfire 8 days ago | link

I worked similar jobs for several years.

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You can try going nocturnal. I did this for about 6 months. Go to sleep at 10am and wake up about 6pm. I did this because I had night school then coding till morning. I can't say whether it was good or bad, but it worked out with my situation.

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Are you saying there are people out there that want to change the world of e-commerce? Maybe someone who owns a large share of an e-commerce firm will feel this way. Some guy waiting for the bus to go to work to pay the bills definitely does not give a shit about changing e-commerce. A more apropos question is to ask if the person wants to become financially secure quickly and not have to take the bus to work every morning. Alas, there's no company that makes that as a goal for its employees.

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We can determine from this story that Apple's corporate email system in 2007 was wholly insecure. If one user can view and forward another users email, the system is broken.

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Can you really expect VC's not to be assholes? I think maybe the article is a little quick to play the age card in regards to the example give. Just because someone acts like an asshole and acts disinterested doesn't mean they're not interested. And, there are other ways to start a business. If someone doesn't like older people, people with kids and families, fuck 'em. Find something else.

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Read through the documentation. Write some simple code to learn toolbox idioms and patterns. Read through the docs again. Look at some simple code. Build something non-trivial. Then read through the docs again and you're ready to go.

Learning something new in your field of study is not different, it is just easier because you have some context.

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This is the quintessential management tactic, FUD it up. "Are you sure managers are playing games and trying to manipulate things?" The answer is yes, there ae hundreds of thousands to millions of dollars in compensation in play, of course managers are going to play games, steal credit, whatever it takes to stay employed and keep the money flowing.

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dasil003 36 days ago | link

What are you talking about? This is not FUD, I'm telling you something that you seem to know nothing about, so maybe you should sit down and listen for a minute.

Why makes you axiomatically claim "of course" managers are going to be sociopaths? That is not a given at all. There are good actors and bad actors on all sides. Do you think there aren't developers who play games to protect their turf and do the minimum to get by while collecting a paycheck from a business that they contribute nothing meaningful to?

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