
HTML5 vs Flash - pixelcort
http://html5vsflash.tumblr.com/
======
mortenjorck
Guys. This isn't funny anymore.

HTML5 is a set of markup standards that, in conjunction with other open
technologies, can be used to create dynamic, standards-compliant web
interfaces.

Flash is a virtual machine. It is good for a lot of things you would use a VM
for. It is not good for a lot of things you wouldn't use a VM for.

Some hardware manufacturers don't want virtual machines in their vertically-
integrated ecosystems, and somehow this turned into a holy war between things
that have no reason to be at war.

~~~
maw
Many people hated flash years before the iPhone came out. Our reasons still
hold.

~~~
mortenjorck
To me, the only reason to hate Flash is that Adobe has continued to market it
as a platform for things it's just not appropriate for.

A VM is not appropriate for banner ads.

A VM is not appropriate for a restaurant menu.

A VM _is_ appropriate for a complex RIA such as <http://www.audiotool.com> .

I think there would be a lot less hate for Flash if Macromedia and later Adobe
had stuck to promoting it as an RIA environment and not as a solution to
everything else.

~~~
olihb
I think Adobe is starting to get it with Flex. Flex is really nice to develop
BI widgets and dashboards. We use it to present interactive data to our
clients. I can whip up a dashboard binded to a DB in a matters of hours.

I'm not sure that's possible with html5 or javafx. I'm not talking about the
end result but the time frame.

But yeah, flash for banner ads, simple video players, etc. sucks.

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coderdude
Sigh. How did a markup language get pit against a vector-based animation
plugin? I know that literally it is not, and that we're talking about _canvas_
here, but the Web is being flooded by this misinformation. I can't even think
of analogy for what this is akin to.

Edit: I just thought about this, but SVG qualifies as a markup language. So
it's not inconceivable for a markup language to compete (at least in part)
with Flash, just in this particular case it is erroneous.

~~~
wmf
Flash is hardly a vector-based animation plugin, although animation and video
do comprise 99% of its usage. Likewise, HTML5 is not just canvas; it's
<video>, <audio>, websocket, local storage, etc.

~~~
coderdude
I think you've made a good point there. Coupled with JavaScript, perhaps HTML5
as a whole can in fact present itself as competition for all that Flash does.

------
est
this demo didn't reach Flash's full capabilities

I'd like to see HTML5 version of these:

[http://blog.alternativaplatform.com/ru/files/2008/04/bunker....](http://blog.alternativaplatform.com/ru/files/2008/04/bunker.swf)

[http://blog.alternativaplatform.com/ru/files/2009/02/hero.sw...](http://blog.alternativaplatform.com/ru/files/2009/02/hero.swf)

[http://blog.inspirit.ru/wp-
content/uploads/fluids3d/FluidSol...](http://blog.inspirit.ru/wp-
content/uploads/fluids3d/FluidSolver3D.swf)

~~~
pufuwozu
The first two have already been solved by WebGL:

[https://cvs.khronos.org/svn/repos/registry/trunk/public/webg...](https://cvs.khronos.org/svn/repos/registry/trunk/public/webgl/sdk/demos/mozilla/spore/index.html)

The last one is capable of being run in WebGL shaders (using the GPU).

Now, I don't think HTML5 solves everything (manipulating binary data, for
example) but the above are all solved by WebGL.

------
BoppreH
HTML5 is not up to Flash at this time. There's no decent IDE, it's sluggish
and it's not even a standard yet. I don't doubt its capabilities, but for
_NOW_ it's not doing enough to deserve the hype.

So, please, stop making this silly comparisons, especially because you are
comparing different PRODUCTS, not only different platforms as you advertise.
You are just hurting the image of the platform.

I'll be glad to use HTML5 in all my works when it's finished, but for now my
answer is "hell no."

~~~
ItarPeyo
If HTML5/Canvas is slugish Flash is a corpse.

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pedrokost
This is just amazing. THis is what i needed. It clearly shows how FLash uses
less CPU and runs smoother than HTML5. Maybe HTML5 will perform like Flash
today in two or three years, but till then Flash will also improve.

~~~
chc
It's hard to tell since there isn't always 100% parity between the two
examples (look at the difference between the Javascript Asteroids and the
line-based Flash one!), but performance seems to be about equal in most cases,
adjusting for the one that looks simpler usually using a bit less.

~~~
mikeleeorg
I would love to see a comparison of apples to apples, where someone duplicates
the same functionality & features using both technologies.

~~~
targz
Did you see the "Yummy Raspberries" demo on this site? It's a pretty exact...
well, raspberries to raspberries comparison. Unless one or the other was
poorly implemented it's the same demo on both sides, again with Flash
outperforming.

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ryan-allen
One difference I suppose is that in order to create these kinds of Flash
applications is that you have to purchase an IDE for the tune of (here in
Australia) about $1200 AUD.

Now, that's not too big a deal given computers cost more than that usually but
Flash is a very unstable and barely useable IDE. I liken it to spending over a
thousand dollars to get slapped in the face.

Disclaimer: I worked with Flash, a lot, for over 3 years. Haven't worked with
it in over 4 years, never been happier!

~~~
Sindisil
Wrong.

There are several free (and open source) tools for creating flash content.

~~~
BoppreH
Not for .fla files, which I think was what the GP was referring to. FLA is a
closed, proprietary format and as far as I know the only way to create or edit
it is using Adobe Flash.

And I have to admit it is quite unstable.

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edkennedy
This seems like it's designed for fun, not a serious comparison. That being
said, this is what I expect from a tumblr blog: fun!

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bloodnok
Argh... all this makes my head hurt.

Nowadays it seems silly to have to have 3rd party plugins for simple
audio/video. HTML5 is good for that.

Then we have a markup language for rendering content for
screen/print/whatever, a fluffy interpreted script language and a
90s-throwback framebuffer emulation trying to pass itself off as the be-all
and end-all of cross-platform application development. Then it gets itself
into a war with a single-vendor browser plugin known for its lack of speed and
gaping security holes.

I choose neither. EndOfRant.

------
Yaggo
I'm sick of this. Really. (Because of:
<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1423903>)

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Encosia
The winner was obvious, viewing that on my iPad.

------
est
While HTML5 can do the same things as Flash, now let's compare the file size.
I present you the 64k Flash demo

<http://www.pouet.net/prod.php?which=53656>

64k is not enough for the html markup alone. Regardless of audio, graphics
recourses, SFX, and animation.

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chipsy
These "comparison via demo" examples seem popular, albeit a bit empty. I did a
feature-by-feature list some months back:
<http://www.ludamix.com/archives/2010/02/entry_5.html>

------
juanefren
The comparison is missing :) html5zombo.com and zombo.com

~~~
BoppreH
You mean the 7th demo?

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jgg
_You’ll need to download Safari to view this demo._

Ahahahaha.

~~~
Flow
Yeah, almost as bad as "You need to install Flash Player 10 to view this".

~~~
jgg
When YouTube tells me to install Flash, it isn't on a page with the words
"HTML5 and web standards" as the header.

------
grails4life
Why is it always HTML5 vs flash? What about using both flash and HTML5? There
is fabridge.js, after all. Its not all or nothing. Granted dependency on
plugins sucks, but for now I see Flash as a supplement to a web application
where I need things like audio, sockets and advanced graphics to work across
browsers.

------
c00p3r
What this page missing, is compare of insecurity, portability and speed
issues. =)

btw, no one think it is enough of flame? After Apple's explanation, after all
those security holes, inability to deliver a working product to platform other
than win32, inability to address performance issues on linux32 and do on.

Isn't it obvious, that flash is poorly designed, non-portable, insecure and
outdated technology, the unnecessary artificial layer which should be replaced
due to evolution of modern web browsers and open standards?

Why I need separate javascript engine when it implemented in browser along
with separate, unoptimized and buggy rendering engine as a some binary blob
which crashes all the time? Because of crappy banners or stupid primitive
games? Hardly.

So, flash will stay around as an optional add-on for windows browsers, but
obviously not as something 'standard', leave alone 'cross platform'.

