
People-tracking wristbands tested to enforce lockdown in Bulgaria - nsgi
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-52409893
======
rindalir
I could maybe, I guess, giving these to people temporarily if they actually
test positive and are legally required to stay at home AND there was a problem
with compliance with that order. But assigning them to broad swaths of the
population would be completely unacceptable. The way that stuff like this is
just being casually proposed and accepted is really alarming to me.

~~~
lvturner
They assign tracking wristbands to everyone entering Hong Kong.

I had one.

Mine was just a paper band with a QR code on it - it was implied it had some
form of RFID chip in it, although it was clear it didn't.

The new ones are a larger grey box that straps on to your wrist - I'm not
convinced this isn't a panopticon too, but have yet to see any firm evidence
either way.

While I know the risks, I'm partly for it - the methods here have worked.

Yes, yes, I know it's a slippery slope, hence the use of the word "partly"

~~~
nsgi
Can you take it off?

~~~
lvturner
Only with scissors - from what I've seen online the newer larger grey ones are
removable, but it's possible you can't put them back on after removing them -
don't know for sure.

Edit: upon entering HK you are put in to mandatory quarantine for two weeks -
it's during this period the wrist bands are used.

------
standardUser
I assumed this would be for people who test positive for infection and are on
a two week quarantine. But this is apparently for the general public? That
seems like a gargantuan overreach and completely unnecessary. Lockdowns are
certainly imperfect and there are plenty of bad actors, but they are still
very effective despite the flaws. If it ain't broke, don't fix it with
compulsory government tracking of all citizens.

------
OneGuy123
There is a point when something makes sense. And there is a point where
something becomes "slightly unsettling".

~~~
cpr
Or "majorly unsettling" in this case.

------
A4ET8a8uTh0
Is the reason for using it, because Bulgaria population has lower cell phone
use? In a very practical sense, cell phone seems like the most logical piece
of hardware government would use here.

For the record, I hate it. And I hate that Poland's Comarch is adding to this
growing panopticon.

~~~
djsumdog
Your cellphone often sits in your pocket. It's not visible, and even when it
is, they can't tell if you have a medical tracking app installed.

A wristband is always on you, visible, can survive weeks without charge (if
they use bluetooth LE and don't have a display) and is impossible to hide.

------
_trampeltier
Each every single counrty in this world had the chance to close the boarder
early. They all failed. And things like that should be the solution now?
Seriously? Even with the wristband people transfer the virus. So it's totaly
useless.

~~~
101404
Here in Germany, the government called Corona "a trick by the political right"
to "achieve border closing". We only closed borders way after every country
around us did. Because ideology is more important than human lives,
apparently.

~~~
amagasaki
At least post a source for such a claim. M understanding is that they managed.
to act _relatively_ good, given the information and circumstances.

~~~
101404
It was in the newspapers in February and first half of March.

The "big switch" was 14to 15 of March. The MSN here ran a fake story about
Trump wanting to buy some German pharma company (all large newspapers
retracted the story around March 17), but it was enough to get people
sufficiently distracted to completely change their previous policy.

It was pretty interesting to watch how it was orchestered.

------
Pmop
What can I, as a techy person, do to fight off these blatant attacks to
freedom, before things get messy?

~~~
m0xte
Well the most obvious solution is to find flaws, compromise them and publicise
it. There is nothing better to fix a government's policies than bad publicity.

~~~
qqssccfftt
Good joke!

~~~
m0xte
Yeah that was a bit tongue-in-cheek. I'm glad someone noticed it.

------
LB232323
Not everyone owns a smartphone, how can they enforce this? High tech fascism
is a double-edged sword, this is certainly a good time to be a hacker.

~~~
commandlinefan
Get ready for your government-issued (mandatory) smart phone.

~~~
m0xte
It'll be more like _" you need to use this app to manage your government
account - look it's easy!"_ marketing and lack of investment in other methods
of accessing government services.

Eventually you'll be unable to function without the app and the smartphone and
be left with no choice.

This is already happening in the UK as a lot of services are fairly difficult
to use if you don't go via [https://gov.uk](https://gov.uk).

~~~
dingaling
gov.uk actually has very reasonable UX guidelines:

[https://www.gov.uk/guidance/government-design-
principles](https://www.gov.uk/guidance/government-design-principles)

 _The people who most need our services are often the people who find them
hardest to use. Let’s think about those people from the start._

------
Vysero
.. and now Californians you understand why us rednecks like our guns so much
XD

------
rasengan
Welcome to 1984.

~~~
vmception
It's a 71 year old book. The omniscience of the state has vastly expanded
further than anything George Orwell imagines, no matter which age you happened
to become aware of it. Time for a new colloquialism.

~~~
fennecfoxen
... welcome to _That Hideous Strength?_
[http://www.lewisiana.nl/orwell/](http://www.lewisiana.nl/orwell/)

~~~
gagege
> For in essence it is a crime story, and the miraculous happenings, though
> they grow more frequent towards the end, are not integral to it.

LOL! This person completely missed the point of the book.

~~~
fennecfoxen
("this person" is Orwell)

~~~
gagege
I didn't notice that. That's cool and I'm glad to hear he liked my favorite
novel. Still, he's quite wrong about it.

------
xkcd-sucks
AKA house arrest enforced by ankle monitors

------
beamatronic
Without debating the pros and cons of religion... Isn't there something in
Revelations like this?

------
qqssccfftt
A global pandemic is truly perfect for a modern government:

\- Good chance to kill off the filthy undesirables (economic deadweights such
as those who dare to be ill or elderly people)

\- Easy to roll out mass increases of police powers and surveillance without
any real opposition

\- Fuck it, you can basically do what you want and sycophants will still go
"now is not the time to critique, we need to be united"

Modern liberal democracies have been absolutely gasping for the chance to roll
out some of these measures. Expect to see a "productive work time tracker"
soon!

~~~
dx87
That's something I've noticed as well, and the worst part is how willing
people are to turn on their neighbors. I've lost count of the amount of times
I've seen comments along the lines of "screw your freedoms, millions of people
will die if you don't give up your rights". People calling the police on
hairstylist neighbors who are trying to do house calls because they can't pay
their rent otherwise, etc. Not to mention the whole "prove that you're an
essential employee, otherwise you'll get fined for leaving your house" that is
the exact opposite of innocent until proven guilty.

~~~
mmm_grayons
It's the same sort of mentality that got Americans with Japanese heritage
tossed into camps during WWII. Collectivism is really, really bad for
individual liberty and nothing drives collectivism like a crisis. People get
scared, and scared people do bad things.

------
m0xte
I can't see anything positive about this at all. Not one thing.

~~~
nerdbaggy
I think it’s bound to happen with how the world is. But a removable wristband
seems better than tracking phones or even the rumored chip implants.

~~~
djsumdog
That's still not comforting. People can see if you're wearing your wristband
or not; unlike a phone.

This disease has leaders treating human beings like we're gears in a machine;
or machines that can be turned on and off. >25million unemployed Americans who
are burning through months of savings, with unpaid bills and rent and mortgage
due, begs to differ.

Humanity cannot be turned off an put in storage. Maybe in the EU there is
relief and good social welfare systems. In a lot of the world, there isn't.
And then the media blasts protestors as right wing gun waving people who want
haircuts. Some of them might be sure, but some of them have also been in food
bank lines for hours and are wondering how they are going to survive without
an income for another month.

We are suffering form two diseases. The first one is the virus killing people.
The second one is ever measure without forethought leading to the suffering of
the poor, increasing poverty and eroding our basic civil liberties.

This disease has shown our leaders don't see us as people. They claim they
care about our lives, but they only really care that people are alive.

~~~
wbl
Taiwan, South Korea and New Zealand have all had effective responses to the
pandemic that haven't required lockdowns. It's just that the West doesnt
believe in survival masks and didn't make them, and can't figure out how to
find and isolate cases.

~~~
djsumdog
I know personally that's not true about NZ. My ex is immune compromised and
they have "Levels" there (L0, L1, etc.) and she most likely won't be able to
leave her place for another two months.

Another kiwi I worked with sent me a video of walking through an empty
Wellington. It's a small nation, 4 million people, plus ACC (health care) and
solid unemployment for all, so it's much easier for them to cope. It's also
easier for them to close the country, as it is a set of islands. The friend
who did that walk said it was still Orwellian though.

~~~
wbl
They are about to have complete elimination of the virus.

