
Things my male tech colleagues have actually said to me - slvv
http://the-toast.net/2015/04/01/things-male-tech-colleagues-have-actually-said-annotated/
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b6
We often say thoughtless things, because we're on autopilot. We don't sit down
and think quietly about how our words will seem to others before we say them
because we don't want to spend that much time, or that much energy, and even
if we did, we're not very good at mentally putting ourselves in someone else's
shoes.

> “Most girls aren’t into this kind of stuff.” No way, do you have the list?
> The list of things most girls are into? I’ve been trying to find that thing
> forever, can you forward it to me? You have my email. Thanks, man, you’re
> the best.

As near as I can tell, "most girls aren't into [tech/programming]" is as close
to an uncontrovertible fact as you could ask for. The author seemed to try to
change that by asking for an entire list .. with a wheelbarrow full of snark.

You can respond to the thoughtless comments of well-meaning, good-intentioned
people in lots of ways. I think maybe "days/weeks/months later, on your blog,
as opposed to the people who actually said the remarks, with heaps of snark,
scorn, and condescension" is not one of the better ones.

~~~
GFK_of_xmaspast
Most dudes aren't into tech/programming either, but you wouldn't expect
someone to say it to you.

~~~
b6
You're right, if taken literally, but I'd bet that the person who said the
remark just meant that far fewer women than men are into tech/programming.

~~~
x0x0
Or they meant, "Hi! Mind if I backhandedly point out you don't belong here
(again?)" Because, you know, that's how people interpret it when you remark
upon their presence or skills. It shouldn't take much empathy to understand
how peers repeatedly being surprised at your presence and/or skills would get
old.

Understanding how others perceive your actions, not merely how you perceive
them, is one of things that (should) distinguish adults from children.

~~~
b6
> Or they meant, "Hi! Mind if I backhandedly point out you don't belong here
> (again?)" Because, you know, that's how people interpret it when you remark
> upon their presence or skills.

I don't think you're right to say that there's a single way that people will
interpret statements like that. Statements like that can be made out of
genuine admiration. I have made such statements out of admiration, and
statements like that have been made about me (about my ability to speak
Mandarin, in China).

It seems to be a fact that women in tech are rare. I have found it to be true
in my life that if you are rare or strange in some way, life will probably be
harder for you in some ways, because it will take a while for other people to
learn to deal with you. You can choose to look at it really specifically as
"sexism", but I prefer to think about it as "people don't handle unfamiliar
situations very well".

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Gustomaximus
At the risk of being perceived as chauvinistic, which I absolutely don't
consider myself having grown up in a household of capable women, this article
seems to be overly sensitive. Some comments are clearly inappropriate and
others are overly sensitive. Or at least would require context to take them as
a negative.

In my sample of one I have never seen sexist behavior in tech world and
typically expect more accepting behavior. Maybe my view is too limited? Have
other people see this as endemic culture in scale?

~~~
smt88
Some of these are context-free. And, here, "context" might mean the person
saying it, and what he's said before. It might be a hugely chauvinistic person
saying some of these things, which colors the interpretation.

I think if the article suggests anything, it's that you think a bit harder
about anything you say. It's also clearly for entertainment purposes as well,
so there's probably some amount of exaggeration to the offense that she's
taken with these comments.

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chucksmart
OMG; you won't believe what boys say when women are not around to hen peck
them for political correctness; sometimes they say what they think!
Unbelievable.

~~~
mpnordland
Perhaps you should consider that not everything you think is the most
wonderful thing ever to happen to the human race. What you think and what is
right are very different things. And if you happen to think stuff about other
people that isn't nice, then you should make a concentrated effort to
understand why and evaluate whether you should continue thinking that way.
It's called self improvement.

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jhwhite
Should we make a list of things men say to other men?

~~~
smrtinsert
yes actually im curious.

~~~
okbake
I'll start with a few:

"How did you learn to do all this?!"

“It’s not ‘P.C.’ to say this, but…”

“Wow, you’re pretty strong!”

“You know about making coffee, right?”

“It doesn’t have all the features; this is the soccer mom version.”

“Let me know when you want to do that so I can help you. No offense, but you
just don’t know enough about it to try it on your own.”

“See, that’s the great thing about you, I know I can tell ‘offensive’ jokes
around you and you won’t care.”

I'm not really sure about the context she was told these things in, and
perhaps they were said to her in a tone that was dripping with condescension,
but most of these seem like fairly gender-neutral things to say. But it all
depends on the tone, and I imagine since she wrote this article that she
perceived the tone to patronizing because of her gender.

~~~
mreiland
I personally think men should get angry and offended when people talk about
your 'John Hancock'. How dare they use a male name to describe a signature.

We can lump it together with the idea behind the term 'soccer mom' and go all
SJW on their asses.

