

Fred Wilson: Startup Visas - cwan
http://www.avc.com/a_vc/2009/09/startup-visas.html

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idlewords
Speaking as someone who has been through the naturalization process, the
current mechanisms for getting permission to live and work in the United
States are ridiculous. But I'm not sure that adding a carve-out for an elite
with access to venture funding is the answer.

Saying "let's let intrepid people come and work in the country if they want to
start a business" is appealing in principle, but any implementation would be
rife with moral hazard.

It would be far better to see this kind of energy (and money!) channeled in
support of general immigration reform.

~~~
davemc500hats
actually, the current EB-5 structure is perhaps subject to the "elite"
criticism, but our proposal is exactly the opposite.

if changed as we suggest -- so that any entrepreneur talented enough to
attract funding can get the visa, not just the investor -- then it's actually
anti-elitist, and in fact democratizes access.

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kgrin
As someone pointed out recently (sorry, can't find the original blog post)
this sort of plan really skews the power dynamic between the entrepreneur and
VC/angel. If you really make this visa contingent on funding, then in addition
to having the power of the purse, the VC will have the power of immigration.

One solution, of course, is to make it independent of funding, but then
distinguishing between "founders" and "people who want to move to the US and
might one day start a company" gets pretty hard, policy-wise. Now, I have no
particular aversion to the latter group either, but plenty of Americans
apparently do.

The real answer, as many have suggested, is to fix immigration policy rather
than carving out exceptions for our preferred niche.

Edit: found original blog post referenced above -
[http://kirkwylie.blogspot.com/2009/09/founder-visa-
ignores-i...](http://kirkwylie.blogspot.com/2009/09/founder-visa-ignores-
immigration.html)

~~~
mikeryan
I'm not particularly vested in this conversation (US Citizen). But I found
Kirk's point the most compelling so far.

The point I particularly found interesting was how the UK and Australia
already have provisions in their immigration policy for "highly skilled"
workers. This sounds like a more equitable solution which would hopefully
cover those like startup founders.

------
old-gregg
Oh please... if you want to start a company in US, just do it - nothing should
stop you. I came here on H1b, my brother applied and got his H1b this year and
a bunch of people I worked with - it's not a freaking rocket science.

There were maybe 2-3 years during the last decade where H1b quotas were much
smaller than demand, so what - it just took some folks a bit longer. I don't
know anyone who wanted to relocate here but couldn't due to visa issues. Lack
of a healthcare system is what actually scares people away, yes even young
ones.

I'm all for erasing borders, promoting "citizens of the world" thing,
whatever. But there are so many _real_ issues we need to solve right now, that
visas for founders seems like an aid for lazy.

We all know a famous saying/advice for first-time CEOs/entrepreneurs: "if you
can't get an introduction, you probably won't be able to run a company",
similarly it can be said _"If you can't get into the US you probably won't be
able to start a business"_.

~~~
heuristix
You came here on an H1B for your own startup? Were you already venture funded?
Because it's next to impossible to come here on an H1B for a startup that
doesn't have signficant revenue and/or a decent number of customers.

Also it's not generally possible to get venture funding for a US based startup
while still in another country. A VC would not want to add "immigration policy
risk" to the extensive list of risks she already takes when investing in a
startup.

Secondly, assuming you are already here on an H1B working for largeco (as I
am), it is also not possible to start your own startup without 1) Having an
American cofounder 2) Raising funding and/or getting a large number of
customers

Getting customers before you start working on a startup is of course
impossible and raising funding before you start working on it full time is
also really hard (unless you are already a superstar in your domain of work).

So, really, on what basis are you calling people who want a simplified process
lazy?

~~~
aditya
That's an interesting viewpoint.

pg says that one of the key qualities in startup founders is being
relentlessly resourceful.

1\. What is stopping you from building a product (and thereby getting
customers) while working for largeco?

2\. What is stopping you from finding an American co-founder to startup with?

One of the risks of #1, of course, is that you run the risk of violating your
H1 status if you work for someone else, but if you make something people want,
and get traction (without charging for it), then you'll have a much easier
time starting a company, raising money for that company and sponsoring your
visa.

It would be much easier if the US just allowed you to come here and set up
shop, but then, how would they know who to let in? (The UK/Canada/Australia
get around this by using your past experience, education and skills and I have
no idea why the US does not - it does, however, have a vastly more higher
requirement O1 visa.)

~~~
ujjwalg
You do realize that if you are out of status at any time, which you will be if
you are working part time on H1B (you obtained for a different company) for
your startup, you are illegally living in US. Moreover, if you apply for an
extension or move the H1B to your own startup, you will have to mention that
you were out of status because you were working for your own company, which
will make you ineligible for H1B. If you dont, and you get caught you will be
barred to enter US FOREVER, because you lied on an immigration document. Do
you also know that you cannot get an H1B visa for your own startup no matter
what, unless you can show somehow that you can be fired (which only can happen
if you give away most of your equity to someone else). Even if you are not
making money when you are on H1B for a different company, but if you signed a
contract, signed a cheque, or were responding to customers, you are out of
status. You can think that how can anyone would come to know that you were
working at the backend, but are you willing to take the risk of getting barred
to enter US forever?

