
Incident: Ethiopian B737 at Dire Dawa on Jan 9th, swarm of grasshoppers - mhandley
https://avherald.com/h?article=4d1de8cc&opt=1
======
ocfnash
"The crew went around, climbed to 8500 feet, depressurized the aircraft,
opened the cockpit side window and cleaned the windscreen by hand."

~~~
madaxe_again
I am slightly scratching my head as to why, unless the pilots were only
qualified for VFR.

I learned to fly with the RAF as an air cadet. I vividly recall the first
lesson in which my instructor whipped out a piece of cardboard, covered the
windscreen, and said “land”.

It turns out that as long as you’ve ILS, you can do it with zero vis.

It looks like they had ILS available:
[https://worldaerodata.com/wad.cgi?id=ET86469](https://worldaerodata.com/wad.cgi?id=ET86469)

I can’t help but think a blind landing is safer than depressurising a cabin
full of passengers.

~~~
fh973
No, you are not allowed to do an ILS landing with zero ground visibility. And
I doubt you get the flare right without any visiblity.

All available categories have a decision height > 0ft:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Instrument_landing_system#ILS_...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Instrument_landing_system#ILS_categories)

~~~
jillesvangurp
Most jets have been capable of doing landing automatically for decades. This
is allowed only on certified planes and runways and actually required for poor
visibility situations. ILS CAT IIIc has no decision height or run way
visibility requirements but no airport actually supports that yet. The main
reason for this is that taxiing blind is kind of tricky. Landing and stopping
the plane on the other hand is a solved problem. CAT IIIb landings are fully
automatic.

The plane approaches, flares, and lands and keeps the plane on centerline (in
some cases). Most (if not all) currently flying 737s are capable of this. The
question is of course if this particular airport was ready for that (if not,
I'm not sure if the autopilot would allow this) and whether the pilots were
certified for this.

[https://thepointsguy.com/guide/aircraft-operating-foggy-
cond...](https://thepointsguy.com/guide/aircraft-operating-foggy-conditions/)

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Karlozkiller
Why're everybody commenting about it being a 737? It's one of the most common,
stable and widely used aircraft families, no?

It does not say it was a 737MAX, which would be quite improbable as they're
still grounded.

Reacting just because it says 737 feels to me kinda like reaction becauase it
says PC or Mac.

~~~
numlock86
> Why're everybody commenting about it being a 737?

Where are you reading comments at, though? Surely you don't mean this HN
discussion ...

~~~
stronglikedan
I presume they're referring to the comments on the posted article.

~~~
numlock86
There are even less comments about 737 in the article, though.

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cyberferret
Kudos to the crew for trying to clean the windshield @ 8500 feet and ~200
knots, but I don't know how effective that would have been anyway.

I once drove through a thick locust swarm in the Kimberley region of Australia
and my car was covered in a thick bug splat paste in very short order, to the
extent that I lost forward visibility and had to pull over. Even after the
swarm passed and I got out to try and clean the windshield by hand using a
towel, the 'paste' just smeared thickly and I needed to scrape it off with a
plastic knife and some water.

And that was stationary and standing outside the car on the side of a road. I
can only guess at how futile it would be leaning out a window with one arm
holding a (presumably) paper towel in blasting wind.

~~~
naz
From the picture in the article the cleaning looks like it worked

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mikejb
It should be noted though that the airplane type is only marginally * relevant
in this incident (I'm saying that because many have other associations when a
B737 gets mentioned in an "incident" context).

* The only relevance is that the ability to open windows / reach other windows to clean them during flight depends on the airplane type. So it's actually a plus for the 737, in this case.

~~~
Symbiote
With a few searches, it looks like the A320 has windows that open (the
expectation is that it's the last-resort method to remove smoke in the
cockpit, or for escape), but the B787 and A350 do not.

[https://scandinaviantraveler.com/en/aviation/ask-the-
pilot-c...](https://scandinaviantraveler.com/en/aviation/ask-the-pilot-can-
the-windows-really-be-opened)

~~~
sshanky
So what would the procedure have been for those planes?

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076ae80a-3c97-4
Here's the Aviation Safety Network page: [https://aviation-
safety.net/wikibase/232079](https://aviation-safety.net/wikibase/232079)

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ogre_codes
TIL I would have never guessed opening the side window on a 737 in flight was
possible.

Good job on the pilots getting the plane safely down in some pretty crazy
circumstances.

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Yizahi
Theoretically - can civil aviation pilots land in "dark room" conditions, when
there is zero visibility from windows at all times? I know that they can
approach at least, but can they actually land in the "dark"?

~~~
t0mas88
No, normally we need at least 550m RVR (runway visual range) for a Cat I
instrument approach. You need to see the runway (or lights) to be allowed to
descend below 200ft and land, if you don't see it at that point you abort the
landing.

The visibility can be lower with special procedures, extra training, and
things like a HUD. But it will not go down to zero.

To land in zero visibility you need "autoland" which requires an aircraft
certified to do that (multiple autopilot computers etc), crew certified and
current (having done it recently) and special procedures at the airport. In
that case the autopilot will control the aircraft all the way to rollout.

~~~
sails
If they couldn't get the bugs off the screen, what might they have done?

~~~
t0mas88
Find a very long runway, fly an LPV or ILS approach. When the radar altimeter
is around 20 or 30ft depending on the size of the plane, reduce power and keep
the nose up. Fly it into the runway at a 100ft/min descend rate.

This is roughly what we learned as a contingency in a small plane when you had
a night landing without lights. You need the long runway because it takes some
time to get down so you're going to waste some length trying to touch down
gently.

~~~
sails
That sounds very tense. Hate to do that on a passenger plane where you aren't
likely to find a runway longer than your destination anyway.

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sdiq
The locusts, rather than grasshoppers, have now arrived in Kenya and causing
havoc. Flights are not the only risk here, in a region that has been
experiencing recurrent droughts and famine, these locusts are going to have a
negative impact on food security. The East African countries seem to be also
short of pesticide supplies and the requisite airplanes for spraying the same.

On a positive but albeit repugnant note, some people are finding these locusts
very tasty. I haven't tried though.

~~~
kazinator
But "swarm of locusts" wouldn't be politically correct since it would look
like a Biblical reference.

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k_sze
Is this kind of scenario available for simulation in any of the
(consumer/gamer) flight sims?

~~~
kawfey
putting a piece of paper over the windshield/viewports would work. Also
setting a pitot/ADS failure because surely the pitot tube would have been
jammed up with bug guts.

------
tmcb
> The United Nation's Food and Agriculture Organisation (FAO) reported on Jan
> 6th 2020: "The Desert Locust situation remains extremely serious in the Horn
> of Africa where it threatens pastures and crops in Ethiopia, Somalia and
> Kenya. Numerous swarms have formed in eastern Ethiopia and adjacent areas of
> northern Somalia. A number of large immature swarms moved south in the
> Ogaden of eastern Ethiopia and adjacent areas of central Somalia and reached
> southern Somalia, southeast Ethiopia and, on 28 December, northeast Kenya."
> The FAO warns a dangerous situation arises at the Horn of Africa and on both
> sides of the Red Sea.

Thinking on the opposite direction, wouldn't it be interesting to have
unmanned drones to eliminate locusts with ballistic impacts?

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polyphonicist
> The crew went around, attempted a second approach but again needed to go
> around and diverted to their ultimate destination Addis Ababa (Ethiopia)

Do they mean "alternate destination"?

~~~
LandR
I think ultimate in this case means the airport where they finally landed.

e.g, if you planned to go to Alices house, then Bobs house but Bob wasn't home
so you went to Eves house.

Your ultimate destination was Eves house.

~~~
sangnoir
I think it's more like you plan to sleep over at Eve's house, but visit Bob on
the way. As you drive to Bobs house, you run into a huge forest fire, so you
turn back and go to Eve's - which was always your ultimate destination, but in
this case you failed to visit Bob. (Also - Addis Ababa is Ethiopian's hub - so
it makes sense for regional flights with connecting legs to terminate there)

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macinjosh
I sometimes to forget to fill my wiper fluid too! /s

But seriously why don't planes have wiper fluid?

~~~
xyzzyz
Bug guts tend to be rather sticky, and wiper fluid doesn't dissolve them
nearly well enough to be removed with wipers. That's been my experience after
countryside drives, where you need to manually scrape the windows every few
hundred miles, as the wipers won't do.

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Quarrelsome
Is there anywhere about where we can track the swarms? Get stories of their
impact?

~~~
gilbertmpanga12
The article states grasshoppers. In Uganda, grasshoppers are a big business!
They're yummy and tasty. Checkout here
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nsenene](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nsenene)

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jcims
Curious what the engine inspection process is like for something like this.

~~~
mschuster91
Taking a wild guess here but power-washing the outer surfaces should do it.
They're bugs, not birds which can cause real damage.

~~~
deepspace
I am no expert either, but I have had the misfortune of driving through a
locust swarm. 1) Every surface that could be reached through an opening of any
kind was covered in muck. 2) Every vent and other opening was clogged with
dead locusts. 3) I was still finding locust residue in the depths of the car
YEARS later.

So I would expect just the opposite, namely that the engines would have to be
stripped down to components and cleaned thoroughly. Now way is an exterior
power wash is going to do the trick.

