
What happens when we work non-stop - vjsc
http://www.bbc.com/capital/story/20180823-how-bad-for-you-is-working-non-stop
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sebazzz
I see this happening with direct collegues of mine. Working in the weekend,
working in the evening. Even parttimers running constant overtime, when it
doesn't appear to be necessary. Having a few work-related phone calls even on
holiday.

I believe this creates a constant "attachment" to work, and does not allow you
to detach. Especially on holidays you should be able to detach and be able to
forget work for a few weeks. (Besides: It also serves as a good practice to
the workplace: What if this person is not here anymore due to illness/finding
a different employer.

As for me, I always to keep work at work. I don't work weekends, and I never
work on holiday. I am a software developer, and do keep on date on aspects
regarding software development. But this is because I want to, and often
involves subjects which are not relevant to my work (I developer ASP.NET web
applications, but privately I like to do stuff with assembly and C++, or
fiddle with an Arduino or Raspberry pi)

~~~
akullpp
Oh boy, exactly the same happens at my company. Everyone is available and
communicating even when on paternity/maternity leave or on vacation somewhere
on an island.

Many people see their value directly tied to their career and one of the major
ways to make you (feel) important is to be present. It also helps your career
since many old companies value presence over other criteria.

I'm three weeks ill now and for the first time, I begin to understand that
I've never been detached from work. In the first two weeks I actually became
so depressed because I couldn't work. I need to do something, don't know what
yet. This is bad for my relationships and for my mental health.

~~~
KozmoNau7
I worked hard to break that habit in myself. My workplace (telco) gives all
employees a phone and home internet, both with unlimited subscription, 100%
free for private use as well, and a cable TV package if we want it. The
purpose is that we can work from home as necessary, and obviously also act as
brand ambassadors. Our phones are eligible for replacement every 3 years or
so, for free.

For a lot of my colleagues, this is their only phone, because why wouldn't it
be? Many of them habitually check their work email all the damn time, and I
can see them online in Skype for Business, even when they're on vacation. I
used to do that as well, compounded by a manager who expected to be able to
reach us at any time.

So I bought a phone and personal subscription for myself, and most days I
leave the laptop and work phone in my locker at work. Now when I'm off work,
I'm _off_ work, period.

A few trusted colleagues have my unlisted personal phone number, in case of
serious emergencies only, but they haven't had to use it yet.

As for what to do with yourself, you need a hobby :-) Something completely
unrelated to work, like bicycling or video games or woodworking. Something you
do for yourself and/or your family.

~~~
distances
My workplace provides a phone too, but doesn't require out-of-hours
availability. I've written down my number in the company internal phone book,
but I doubt any of my colleagues took it from there; I also don't have work
email even configured in my phone, and haven't installed VPN access for my
home computer.

I pretty much can't work outside of the office. Makes it very easy to keep
work and leisure separated.

------
mancerayder
There are a number of factors such as psychological ones that play a role
here, but one major one is distributed teams. I'll go into below what my
solution is to the whole off-hours problem is.

As a DevOps guy, you have to bail people out of situations or assist with a
scary release (because things are rarely sufficiently automated, it takes
years to convince management and fix tech debt, especially in a startup). For
that and other reasons, there's an expectation that 'it's just part of the
job' to 'be available' in case someone in the globe needs you.

After suffering such things for well over a decade, I've chosen the stubborn
consulting route. My health care sucks and it's hard to find roles, but once I
do I get paid hourly and well, and let me tell you something about company
behavior when you're on the clock: suddenly they volunteer OTHER people for
off-hours work, suddenly they're reluctant to let you work more than 40 hours.

That realization should clue you workaholics (employee workaholics, not
founder workaholics) in on what's really at stake here, and the real reason
you're checking Slack nervously at 3 pm Saturday before your colleagues do:
it's free overtime for your company.

And quite frankly I think many of you are doing your colleagues a disservice
by setting availability standards too high. There's no reason to race to the
bottom.

~~~
zasz
Yup, that's how I feel about ever being on-call again. I used to be part of a
four-man rotation for a set of services that regularly went down 2-3x times
during sleeping hours. This was really rough as a lifelong insomniac. I could
never fall back asleep again after being woken up, and was basically a zombie.
(And before anyone asks, I've done a sleep study, melatonin, seen a therapist,
tried SSRIs, light therapy, intense exercise (biking across America did not
help with my insomnia--yeah, biking 8 hours a day, I still couldn't manage to
stay asleep longer than six hours any night, now if you don't believe me I'll
fucking fight you), Ambien (it takes four Ambien to knock me out), Lunesta
(worthless), Remeron (worthless), hot milk (worthless), lavender pillows
(worthless).)

Never again.

~~~
uxcolumbo
Have you tried CBD?

[https://www.thesleepdoctor.com/2017/08/10/understanding-
cbd/](https://www.thesleepdoctor.com/2017/08/10/understanding-cbd/)

~~~
zasz
I have tried weed, and I really, really dislike the sensation of being high.
Just assume that whatever possible drug intervention is out there, I've
already tried.

~~~
TheAceOfHearts
Not to be pushy on this matter, but have you tried pure CBD pills? Those don't
have any THC, so it doesn't get you high.

Although according to Wikipedia [0] it can cause either somnipathy or
somnolence, depending on the individual, so it might not be a viable solution
anyway. Still, I think if you're passing by California or Colorado it might be
worth trying.

I've also struggled with maintaining a proper sleeping schedule for most of my
life. The following is just an anecdote, but I've read of enough cases to
think that further research should be done on this matter. Around three months
back I heard about a carnivore diet and I decided I'd try it out for a month.
Although I didn't stick strictly to the diet and added in tiny amounts of
carbs (mostly in the form of fruits or vegetables), it had a very positive
result on my life. After the month was up my sleeping patterns had drastically
improved and I found I was overall much more energetic during the day. Waking
up and falling asleep was no longer a struggle. I've been sticking with it
since then and have never felt this great. When I cheat on the diet with my
favorite meal (ramen), I always end up paying the price by feeling groggy the
next day. I don't know if this would work for you, but I think there shouldn't
be much harm in trying it out for a month and seeing if it helps improve your
quality of life.

I sincerely hope you are able to find a solution that works for you.

[0]
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannabidiol](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannabidiol)

------
cheschire
How many software developers do you know who say they don't "work" outside of
the office, but then write code at home for personal projects? What is the
definition of "work" then? What would happen if you start to let go of the
concept of "work" as the bad thing, and expand the argument?

I suggest we instead say using the same parts of your body and mind to the
exclusion of the other parts is what is bad for you.

Knowledge workers probably shouldn't spend 6 hours a night learning or coding
after an 8 to 10 hour day in the office. Trade job workers probably shouldn't
go home and perform more tasks that are physically comparable to their day job
without mixing it up.

A construction worker should probably attend night school or study or write
code at night. A coder should probably go home and socialize, be active out in
the world, or do home renovations etc. A manager probably needs to make time
for meditation and non-social activities.

~~~
wool_gather
At least for me a large part of my choosing my career (software development)
is because I love writing code. There's a _huge_ mental difference for me
between spending time writing code for myself, to learn or explore, and being
at the keyboard for my employer. The complete self-direction in the project
changes the character of the time. It really is a different headspace, and I
don't think it's quite fair to say that it's still "working", in the sense of
it being a job.

In my experience, the problem with overworking is not the activity itself.
It's the mental state of doing a thing because of some sense of obligation,
duty, or politicking/competition (or maybe threat, if you're doing it because
you're anxious about job security).

Now that said, I totally agree that physically doing the same activity for
endless hours every day is not going to be healthy -- including mental health.
I think you're totally right to suggest balancing out job tasks with
contrasted activities. It is good for your body, and keeps you from getting
stuck in ruts mentally. As appealing as it sounds sometimes, I'm not just a
brain in a jar. Using the muscles and talking to other humans is also
important for being fully human.

------
lixtra
Working nonstop is a natural state. Think of parents.

Of course you cannot code for 14h every day. You have to vary your work.
Personally I can concentrate for only 5h if I want to maintain that for
several days in a row. I felt very burnt out after 8h of coding. It took me a
while to understand that it’s okay to just concentrate for 5h and use the rest
for communication and socializing.

I also do solve personal problems during work time that would otherwise block
my mind from working correctly. Just like let work issues spill in my free
time if they are serious.

~~~
bitxbit
I am sorry but that gave me a chuckle. So you code for five hours and
socialize for three?

~~~
badpun
I think it's pretty standard in many corporate coding jobs, at least here in
Europe. Often, if you include meetings in the "socialize" coulmn, the numbers
are even switched.

------
jdavis703
I think "work" is a state of mind. If you love what you do, then working isn't
really working, at least not in the classic "I hate the boss" sense. Now I
realize that not everyone gets to work a job they love, but I'm quite frank
with my coworkers and supervisors that if I encounter a prolonged period where
work isn't enjoyable anymore, I will leave.

------
aestetix
> As put by a 2006 academic paper from Ian Towers, a researcher from SRH
> Hochschule in Berlin, mobile technology “increases expectations: managers
> and colleagues alike expect staff to be almost always available to do work”.

A little surprised to see this line. In Germany, there is a law (cannot recall
the name), that effectively states that you cannot be fired if you don't reply
to a work email or phone call between 6pm and 9am. If you _want_ to, you can,
but it cannot be held against you.

~~~
ezequiel-garzon
Probably the employer won’t cite that as a reason...

~~~
reitanqild
I don't know for sure but I guess standards for firing people are generally
high in Germany.

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wolco
No one ever mentions how work is addicting in itself. The amped up feeling can
be hard to turn off.

~~~
noir_lord
I work a 40hr week and I have to be _very_ disciplined because otherwise I go
home and keep working because solving problems is fun.

I find a distraction works, for me that's chess.

------
speedplane
It’s not just the hours you put in, it’s why you’re doing it. Working more is
easier if you’re inspired and motivated. Building a castle sucks if you’re
paid hourly, but is fun if you know you’re gonna live there.

------
mythrwy
Sometimes the best way to hurry up is to take your time.

------
ja66awockeez
never be good, if we are too extreme on one side. Balance is the key to a
successful life.

