

Surface Pricing Announced - $499 USD - codelion
http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/news/Press/2012/Oct12/10-16announcementPR.aspx

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alyx
More competition to Apple/Android is good for us. I'm surprised such a techy
crowd isn't jumping on the opportunity to try out new tech.

I just pre-ordered mine and I'm stoked!

~~~
andere
I for one really like the idea in terms of hardware, but my bad experiences
with the RC of Windows 8 convinced me to not bother.

~~~
amaks
Same here. Besides, people are buying not tablets, they are buying ecosystems.
Apple has the great one. Same with Amazon. Same with Google. What mobile
ecosystem does Microsoft have? Very limited at this point. And virtually no
apps for Windows RT.

~~~
canistr
I disagree. Browser, Office, and a keyboard make a pretty compelling argument
for lots of people. All they really need is a Facebook app (which is
integrated into the People Hub) and it's what most people will really want.
Then they also have Messages (doesn't include GTalk, but different people use
different things. A lot of the world prefers MSN Messenger over AIM for
instance. And many people use FB Chat and Skype. It's not excusing MS for not
having GTalk, but it does cover lots of use-cases and peole)

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maxpert
Battery: iPad 42.5-watt-hour clearly mentioning browsing time (its called
confidence on your quality) Surface RT 31.5-watt-hour Pro 42-watt-hour

WiFi+Cellular: iPad Yep Surface WiFi only

Weight: iPad 1.44lbs to 1.46lbs Surface RT 1.5lbs and Pro 2.0lbs

Applications: iPad Rock solid platform unified Surface Choose between RT and
Pro messed up ARM and x86

For me I think Microsoft has done same mistake again, introduce "complexity"
and if you look closely they are actually selling you a "not a gorgeous
quality stuff" for same price as iPad. I don't see Microsoft dominating the
market! Just getting a market douche on stage that makes you hear sound of
click with no quality in product pisses me off!

~~~
maxpert
Not to mention they are trying to sit between netbooks, laptops and tablets
and they ship a USB 2.0 in 2012! DUH Microsoft!

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jtoeman
I think this is the nail on the already-likely-dead coffin of MS Surface.
What's the market they are going after???

"tablet market"? nope - already dominated by iPad

"enterprise"? nope - 1) not a market, 2) already dominated by iPad

"budget"? nope - priced on par with iPad

seriously, how are they going to push this thing? they don't have a channel
like Apple nor Amazon, so they need to rely on all their other paths.

they should've called this "XPad", made it a mobile Xbox, and sold through
that channel - just like they did with Kinect.

fail fail fail.

~~~
freehunter
Imagine if all other car makers said "Oh, the car market is already taken by
Ford. We should do something else".

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madoublet
Ha, said much more eloquently than I would. I think it is odd that people are
automatically dismissing it simply because it is not an iPad. I guess that is
how the hive mind works now-a-days. I like the Surface because it is a
genuinely unique OS. And, in many ways it is better than Apple's offering. The
gestures are better, it surfaces information better, and it works much better
as a productivity device. When has _better_ become not good enough?

~~~
jtoeman
better is rarely enough. the biggest killer of "great" products? ones that are
"good enough".

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ortusdux
It appears they are using Vapor deposition of Magnesium to make the body. I
hope it is just a texture on the outside. If anything could escalate the
problem of a combusting battery, it would be a metal that ignites at 480°C and
burns at up to 3000°C.

Edit: this reminds me of the NeXTCube. <http://simson.net/hacks/cubefire.html>

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mandeepj
Pro version have USB 3 and mini display port. It is a nice combo of mobility
and ease like iPad + power like a laptop. It is a full blown mobile machine.
Ipad, android are just content consuming devices. You can't do much on them
besides just absorbing content. I am glad MS understood the missing features
from ipad and came with this beautiful product.

~~~
guywithabike
> You can't do much on them besides just absorbing content…

… and writing, drawing, painting, designing, composing and playing music,
editing spreadsheets and databases, building presentations, taking photos,
editing photos, emailing, chatting, editing movies, and so on.

Yep. Only for watching YouTube. You bet.

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readme
Won't compete with iPad on quality. Won't compete with Android on price.

Why should anyone buy this?

~~~
JimmaDaRustla
Defend your first argument.

~~~
tomrod
I reckon he'd make a history based approach. Never seen a Gateway circa 2000
run Mac software. But eh, I'm not him, no so idea to be honest.

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dewarrn1
The "Touch Cover", which I'm assuming is the bit with the keyboard, will run
you an extra $100-120. Given the attention to the Touch Cover in the
promotional material MS has distributed, I'm surprised that it's even
optional.

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davidacoder
No 3G at all? Zune all over again.

~~~
ShabbyDoo
I don't mind this so much presuming it can do Bluetooth tethering with my
phone [vs WiFi due to power usage issues]. If I'm the device's user, I'll
likely have my phone with me, so having a redundant radio in the device
doesn't add value. And, if I let someone else use the device while I'm not
around, the likelihood is that there will be an available WiFi source.

I'd like it-just-works connectivity between my phone and any other devices I
carry with me. Right now, I have to hit a couple buttons on both devices -- a
pain for short-term usage scenarios.

~~~
davidacoder
I can get tethering to work, my mom: never. My parents both got iPads and a
device that isn't just online all the time could never ever work for them.
iPad really set the bar on that one.

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ShabbyDoo
Yeah. Tethering still is too mysterious. If it's not working, which device is
at fault? For awhile (pre-ICS), my Droid RAZR had a bug where it required a
reboot before the hotspot would work. Of course, it failed silently and
claimed to be making itself available!

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tomrod
I see that price point as being too high. I think 399 USD would be right in
that sweet spot (especially considering this will be considered a poor Ipad
substitute in the beginning).

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freehunter
What people in this thread are missing is that Microsoft isn't trying to
capture the entire WinRT market with this device, they're not trying to
outsell their partners, they're trying to set a benchmark. Something for their
partners to compete against, and for those partners to compete against it (and
the iPad) successfully.

The point of Surface is to keep Asus, HP, Samsung, etc from making a not-
quite-iPad for $700 and blogs mocking the demise of the platform. Basically,
if WinRT partners cannot outsell the Surface, they don't deserve to be selling
Windows tablets. That is what Microsoft is implying with this release. Making
it impossible to compete against would actively destroy that effort.

~~~
tomrod
No, I fully understand the claim that Microsoft has designed this and set the
price point to encourage an ecosystem to stay afloat. Yet, Microsoft has done
fine in a number of hardware spheres without serious competition (e.g. XBox--
1, maybe 1.5 competitors between Sony and Nintendo).

I remain skeptical that the better good is the underlying motivation.

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kaolinite
If it was a little less, I'd probably buy this. I'm a huge fan of Windows 8
(don't get me wrong: it's going to be horrendous for regular users, but as a
techie, I think it's a really nice UI). $500 though is just too much for
something that is so easily dismissed. I'd pay that much for an iPad or a
Macbook because I know they will be well built and work well. Surface has to
prove itself to me and as of yet, it hasn't shown me why I should spend that
much on it.

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pixie_
There are going to be x86 Windows 8 tablets coming out that run all your
windows programs ever. A lot of people are going to be pissed and confused
about 2 different versions of windows with entirely different sets of
compatibility. Also x86 tables will probably cheaper, just like netbooks, just
to pour some salt in your wounds you got buying an expensive device that runs
no programs.

~~~
beagle3
If they're going to be cheaper, they are also going to be ridiculously slow
compared to the iPad (and possibly the ARM Win8), or they are going to have
ridiculously short battery life, or they are going to be subsidized by
Microsoft (or all of the above ....)

Have you seen a netbook that can deliver 9 hours of real usage on Windows
_and_ run at a reasonable speed (for $500, or even more)? I haven't. And the
laptops that can are larger and much more expensive.

~~~
madoublet
From what I have seen both the x86 and ARM perform on par with the iPad and
have 9+ hours of battery life. I think you are just making stuff up now.

~~~
beagle3
I am making it up that I couldn't find a notebook with ipad comparable snappy
response times and ipad comparable battery time? I'm not saying I'm all-
knowing and that I survey every single piece of hardware that ever goes on
sale everywhere, but I did spend considerable time looking for a Windows one
(I needed it for a product I'm selling, and ended up with a $2200 HP notebook
instead! and it has less than 6 hours of useful battery life!), and came up
empty.

If you know of such a notebook, please let me know. As they say, put up or
shut up.

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canistr
Should mention in your title that it's $499 for the USD model. $499 doesn't
really tell much about it and making comparisons to iPads are difficult given
the lowest iPad is $499 for 16 GB.

It should also be noted that Office is coming pre-installed. Which is awesome
given the pricing.

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dpcan
Does anyone know if this can be used for development and graphics editing? Or
if it will run Windows Desktop apps?

I could almost see something like this replacing my everyday work computer.

~~~
WrkInProgress
It will not run Windows Desktop Apps.

What you are looking for is Surface Pro which will be available in a few
months. Or you could buy any one of the Windows 8 (not Windows RT) convertible
tablets/hybrids that will be available from the likes of Lenovo, HP, Acer,
Asus, Samsung, etc after Windows 8 launches.

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AndresOspina
Surface I thought was going to be a bit cheaper, but I think Microsoft
occasionally makes good software.

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HyprMusic
So will this be able to run standard Window's programs or just tablet versions
of software? If it could run Windows applications then this could be a great
alternative to ultrabooks, with the added perk of the flexibility of a tablet.

~~~
RobAtticus
The Surface is running Windows RT, so the tablet versions of software. The
Surface Pro (which doesn't have pricing info yet) will be x86 and therefore
run standard Windows programs.

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davidacoder
Also, doesn't have a GPS, so only WiFi location services...

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weiran
Any idea of international pricing?

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ffffruit
499USD will most probably translate into 499GBP unfortunately

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csmeder
What is the resolution?

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gilrain
From AnandTech ([http://www.anandtech.com/show/6377/inside-microsofts-
surface...](http://www.anandtech.com/show/6377/inside-microsofts-surface-rt-
tablet)): 1366x768.

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nirvana
I applaud Microsoft for doing something new-- the new windows UI is very
original. Further, they have managed to meet Apple in terms of pricing for a
comparable iPad, something others have struggled with.

But the big take-away innovation here, and the center of their marketing
campaign, is that it has a keyboard cover.

This seems to be about 5 years out of sync. 5 years ago, everyone expected the
iPhone to fail because it didn't have a physical keyboard like the blackberry.

But after I got my first iPad, the original, I found that I could type at
nearly the same speed (possibly faster due to autocorrect) on its on screen
keyboard as I can at a regular keyboard... my finger just go to the place the
key is, and while feeling a physical key would be nice, the end result on the
iPad was about the same speed.

I think this will sell well into markets that are heavily invested in
microsoft infrastructure... but I don't see how it is going to take
marketshare from the iPad.

\----

Edit to clarify, since several have responded on this point:

I'm not saying that keyboards have no use. I recognize that many people buy an
extra keyboard for their iPad, and prefer that for significant typing.

The point I'm making is what is the differentiating feature here? The UI is
different, true, but then its the keyboard.

There are two keyboard covers- one is flat, with no keys which I suspect would
be much like typing on the iPAd screen (though of course, not actually on the
screen... so a little different) and the other has keys, so similar to buying
an external keyboard for the iPAd, only it is slightly more integrated.

Is that really compelling? Compared to buying a wireless keyboard for the
iPad, the price is about the same (or cheaper for the iPad).... and the
advantage of the Surface is that the keyboard connects to the tablet with
magnets?

I just don't see that as being significant enough to really take significant
share away from Apple. That's all I was saying.

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monkeyfacebag
> But after I got my first iPad, the original, I found that I could type at
> nearly the same speed

Speed is certainly one issue, but the ergonomics of typing for an extended
period favor separate screen and keyboard components. I too use a table for
typing and while I'm pretty quick at it, I can't find a comfortable position
that lets me do this for more than half an hour at a time. For this reason
alone, the inclusion of a keyboard has certainly made me take notice of
Microsoft's offering.

~~~
r00fus
The included keyboard is definitely better than an on-screen one for human
factors, but is it good enough to not be in the trough where an on-screen
keyboard is more available (no keyboard-cover needed) and a full-size physical
keyboard/mouse?

Personally, I think there is some traction in the Transformer style tablet -
but the surface cover seems gimmicky. We'll have to see - if it works, I'll be
thrilled.

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d0m
Who want this?

[http://www.microsoft.com/global/en-
us/news/publishingimages/...](http://www.microsoft.com/global/en-
us/news/publishingimages/ImageGallery/Images/Products/Surface/Surface-Magenta-
Cover2_Page.jpg)

~~~
Timmy_C
I think you'd be surprised at how a color that is SO DIFFERENT could make the
device seem unique and individual. Everyone has either a black or a brushed
metal laptop. Something this bright could sell well because of its novelty.

There was a lot of buzz around the cyan version of the new Nokia Windows Phone
8.

~~~
d0m
This seems like a quick hack version where a variable has been changed to
pink.. My problem with this is not the pink by itself but mostly how it
doesn't fit with the other elements. Try changing the background of HN to pink
to have an idea of what I mean.

The Nokia cyan is different as it still fit with the overall design.

