
How recreational marijuana in California left chemists in the dark - Tomte
https://www.theverge.com/2017/12/22/16808964/california-weed-laws-legal-prop-64-safe-labs
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staunch
> _“It’s not like people are dying from pesticides in cannabis... "_

It's entirely possible that many people are dying from carcinogenic pesticides
in cannabis. Similar to the way people die from impure cocaine, heroin, etc.
Igniting and inhaling petroleum products is not going to be found to be
healthy.

The secondary affects of drugs being illegal and unregulated is one of the
great sins of the War on Drugs.

Commercial cannabis should be highly regulated. Look to startups and
technology to bring the price of pure organic ganja down over a short few
years.

~~~
nightfly
> "Look to startups and technology to bring the price of pure organic ganja
> down over a short few years."

In general I'd prefer small businesses rather than startups with dreams of
going very large dominate in spaces like this.

As is it's already fairly expensive for new players to get a legal foothold.
Regulating it to the point that it requires the type of capital that startup
people can get raise is gonna shut out a lot of people.

~~~
GuiA
Fortunately, as many college students will tell you, weed is very easy to
grow. As long as commercial licenses are easily available, I think small,
locally owned, organic, etc. outfits will be able to coexist with any
potential "Starbucks for Weed".

~~~
petre
Legal recreational weed should be as easy as craft beer.

~~~
bfuller
Easier. All you need is a hole in the ground, some compost, and the sun.

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delbel
the regulations for pesticide in Oregon is so strict, baby food would fail.
Tomatoes and grapes would fail with 10x above level. Some pesticides have no
known toxicity or health concerns were straight up banned. The lab companies
were able to lobby for sampling rate that ends up taking a huge percentage of
the profit. On top of that, they are corrupted, crooked and rumors of taking
bribe for failed tests. Even using certified products you can fail. They had
to change the approved list to "guide list" so you don't know what to use.
Toxic pesticides in baby food is OK in Oregon, but not in the marijuana.

~~~
gwern
The contrast with tobacco and alcohol (both legal) is ironic.

It's also amusing to imagine trying to get something like tea approved under
this kind of regulatory regime - fluoride, heavy metals, questions about China
pollution, addictive with many known deaths from abuse of the deadly stimulant
drug in it (caffeine), unknown potentially synergistic interactions between
its psychoactive substances (caffeine+theanine), a risk to dental health,
regularly adulterated with other substances, potentially contaminated with
coliform or botulinum, and typically consumed in a manner with known health
risks and elevated oral cancer classified by IARC as a probable carcinogen
(boiling hot water). I wonder how many ordinary things would be de jure or de
facto banned these days if they were not grandfathered in.

~~~
tomcooks
> known death from abuse of the deadly stimulant drug in it (caffeine)

Can you name 1 (one) example of tea (or coffee) induced death?

~~~
TheSpiceIsLife
It is feasible to brew enough strong tea, and drink it, to cause cardiac
arrest in a susceptible individual.

It's extremely unlikely someone would do that, and there's probable enough
bitters in tea, especially green tea, to cause the average person to vomit
before they ingested too much caffeine from tea.

But what green wrote is true and correct:
[https://www.caffeineinformer.com/a-real-life-death-by-
caffei...](https://www.caffeineinformer.com/a-real-life-death-by-caffeine)

~~~
vidarh
So it seems these were mainly suicides, and it's about as relevant as blaming
water for people intentionally drowning themselves.

Worth noting that e.g.the doses listed under energy drinks on that page are
well within ranges that have been used in various studies of impact of
caffeine on athletic ability. If those levels are dangerous to some it seems
likely to require a pre-existing heart problem as there seems to be
exceedingly little evidence that those levels are risky to the general
population.

To reach levels toxic to most people with tea you'd likely end up
concentrating it so much you'd end up eating a slurry with a spoon...

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pmoriarty
Just as different psychological effects ensue from cannabis products when
eaten vs smoked, the health effects of eating vs smoking various pesticides
present on cannabis products are likely to differ.

While some testing and monitoring of health effects of various pesticides when
they're eaten from food has been done, we really don't know what effects those
same pesticides will have when they get in to the human body through smoking.
The smoking route of administration could potentially be much worse for some
of them.

Elsewhere in the thread someone mentioned the possibility of growing marijuana
organically. Well, organic pesticides aren't necessarily better for you than
inorganic ones. Their effects really have to be studied on a case-by-case
basis. Simply using organic pesticides isn't going to magically save you.
Going pesticide-free might, but then, well, you have to deal with pests.

~~~
simook
Pesticides are not the only solution to deal with pests, it's maybe the
easiest to understand but is also the worst human made solution. Nature has
solved this a problem long time ago through diversity of plants, insects, and
animals.

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brian-armstrong
At a federal level, I wonder if cannabis will first move down to Schedule II
or lower, or if it'll just skip straight to legalized/decriminalized, whenever
that happens

~~~
taurath
It’s quite a challenge to the states rights people who are also pro drug war
when half the states have legalized it.

~~~
doubt_me
[https://www.congress.gov/bill/115th-congress/house-
bill/1227...](https://www.congress.gov/bill/115th-congress/house-
bill/1227?q=%7B%22search%22%3A%5B%22tom+garrett%22%5D%7D&r=2)

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tomcooks
Can't people grow their own in California?

Isn't being able to inject your self with some marinara reefers the point of
legalization?

~~~
ScottBurson
> inject your self with some marinara reefers

Wow, that gives a whole new meaning to the phrase "hitting the sauce"!

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dreamdu5t
So pesticides are allowed on food consumed by kids with no label or warning,
and no testing required yet they’re not allowed on a product meant to be
incinerated and inhaled and used as a recreational drug by adults?
Okaaaaayyyy....

~~~
petre
By inhaling it, it's absorbed directly into your bloodstream, through the
lungs.

~~~
whatshisface
I'd like to see a 50-year longitudinal study on the effects of different
common chemcals over previously untested lengths of time.

Actually, it'd be nice to see more 50-year studies on the effect of anything
on anything.

~~~
petre
They're probably tainted by some industry lobby. Look at the sugar industry
which has hidden the link between sugar and cancer for 50 years. More like a
50 year cover up, than a 50 year study.

