
Another wave of nootropic supplements is hitting the market - dantondwa
https://www.vox.com/the-goods/2019/7/8/18772467/nootropics-silicon-valley-brain-fitness-goop-smart-drugs
======
module0000
Regular exercise has a hugely noticeable effect on my ability to concentrate
and keep multiple mental plates spinning at once. However, it's not available
in pill form last I checked.

You can do it anywhere, anytime, at any intensity. It's as easy as taking a
walk around the block, or as challenging as 50 pull-ups. You control the
difficulty, handicaps, and every aspect of the activity. Bonus attributes are
_it 's addictive_. Once you do it long enough, your brain will begin to
encourage and reward this healthy behavior. Sometimes, it will even punish you
for trying to skip exercise with negative emotions and nature's great
motivator: shame.

The best TV infomercial for mental well-being would be a 72 point font that
reads: "turn me off and get off your butt!".

EDIT: If you want some help or initial instruction, there is an app for most
smartphones that can help you get started at any level. There are many
variations of this type of app, but I like the "Johnson & Johnson 7-minute
workout" one. You can customize it way beyond 7 minutes, and it has helpful
video instruction and voice prompting. Link to homepage:
[https://www.7minuteworkout.jnj.com/](https://www.7minuteworkout.jnj.com/)

~~~
Balgair
> Bonus attributes are it's addictive. Once you do it long enough, your brain
> will begin to encourage and reward this healthy behavior. Sometimes, it will
> even punish you for trying to skip exercise with negative emotions and
> nature's great motivator: shame.

Maybe I am non-normal here, but I've no idea what that feels like. Mind, I've
run a marathon before, participated in a few organized athletic sports
leauges, been on sports teams, improved my weight lifting substantially, and
just gone for mile runs and bit of basketball.

I've _never_ felt like I _needed_ to go out and exercise. Sitting on the couch
has always been just fine.

It has always been an internal battle to go out and exercise. I feel like crap
after exercising. I'm tired, sweaty, grouchy, my legs are wobbly after any
distance run, and it takes about 3 hours for me to wind down. I do sleep
better, but I can't exercise after ~6pm if I want to get to sleep by ~10pm. My
concentration is shot during the winding down and I can't work or study
either. Truely, honestly, I do not like exercising. Like, I know it's good for
me, but, man alive, it just sucks to do!

Look, I know I am weird here, but based off the data on rates of exercise, I'm
not super certain that I'm too far off the average.

~~~
TuringNYC
I think what some of this discussion is missing is there are _two_ continuous
scales of wanting exercise. There is the axis the GP speaks of of wanting to
exercise (for me, because of the endorphin rush) but _also an orthogonal axis_
of laziness/busyness/inertia/etc that fights the first desire. I’ve found it
common to both intensely want and simultaneously not want to exercise — and
eventually one axis out-weighs the other.

It is similar to the HR principal (forgot the name) where employees can both
intensely like the job but also dislike it — all because the continuoum is on
a single axis one.

~~~
Balgair
>for me, because of the endorphin rush

I think my lack of exercise-wanting is related to this! I don't get that rush
feeling. Sorry to not have mentioned that. I just feel terrible the whole
time. My SO mentioned this too. For my SO, there is this 'glow' feeling after
a workout. I don't believe that I get any such benefit.

------
apo
The easiest way to think more clearly is the one it seems is least tried: a
good night's sleep. The second easiest: periodic disengagement from phones,
computers, and people.

Stimulants such as the ones discussed in the article interfere with that.

~~~
ryandvm
No offense, but that's kind of a load of shit. As someone diagnosed with ADHD,
I can get by alright without Adderall, but there is no denying the profound
intensity of focus I get when I take it. And a good night's sleep doesn't even
come close.

There are plenty of good arguments against enhancement-style use of
stimulants, but to suggest they don't do anything more than decent rest is
just silly.

~~~
justwalt
I have ADD myself, and while I agree that adderall is something of a wonder
drug in this regard, adopting a regular sleep schedule has had absolutely
immense benefits for me. Almost every activity where it’s possible to gauge
performance has seen a benefit.

I think the parent’s point about it being the biggest relative increase in
cognitive function is correct.

------
PragmaticPulp
Mainstream nootropic supplements have three primary ingredients: Marketing,
placebo effect, and very mild stimulants.

The hyperbolic marketing material primes the user for maximum placebo effect.
When the mildly stimulating compounds kick in, the user can actually feel
something. All of the marketing material about enhancing brain function
through combinations of carefully-researched ingredients feels validated. The
user may only feel a mild stimulating effect, but it feels so much more
significant after reading elegant marketing about supporting
neurotransmission, helping healthy brain signaling, and promoting healthy cell
membranes.

It's easy to see why this combination is so effective. Caffeine's stimulating
effects are well-known, as are the rebound, tolerance, and dependence that
come from repeated caffeine dosing. Remove caffeine from the equation and now
the user's expectations are a blank slate, malleable according to whatever
marketing materials the team can dream up.

The BrainGear supplemented listed in the article is a prime example; The raw
ingredients in each drink cost pennies (search Amazon for bulk Acetyl
L-Carnitine, Choline, Inositol, and the other ingredients if you're curious).
Their largest costs are likely distribution, storage, and marketing. Many of
the ingredients can be found in similar quantities in a regular, healthy diet
that includes eggs, leafy greens, and a cup of green tea each day. There is
nothing magic, noteworthy, or particularly valuable in this supplement, yet
here we are reading a vox.com article where a journalist happily links to
their product and fails a strawman attempt to debunk it by solving some Sudoku
for a couple of days. This is a great marketing success story.

------
dpflan
People want an edge, but everyone wants to take the shortest path.
Nooptropics, supplements, etc are perceived path shorteners where perhaps no
such one exists. It seems that the power of the mind (i.e. placebo) is the
only real thing here. I would like to see how meditation/mindfulness apps and
adoption measure against nootropics.

== UPDATE ==

I did not mean to imply that stimulants like caffeine, amphetamines, etc are
placebo. I should have made a clear distinction between such classes of
nootropics and those that do not contain such ingredients or those that are
proven not to have effect. I agree, the coffee I had this morning was not a
placebo for increasing my wakefulness.

~~~
LeifCarrotson
> Nooptropics, supplements, etc are perceived path shorteners where perhaps no
> such one exists.

At least one exists - caffeine. Double-blind studies have proven many times
that it improves alertness, which leads to higher scores on many mental
performance tests. I find it implausible that no others exist.

~~~
ohaideredevs
"Multiple studies have shown benefits of caffeine in improving endurance.
Military studies have shown caffeine increase vigilance in sleep deprived and
one study showed improved shot group tightness."

"Recommended dosing is 5mg/kg of bodyweight. Dosing of 200-300 mg has also
been used. Higher dosing has been associated with side effects that would
decrease performance. Serious adverse reactions have been seen at 2,000mg so
this quantity of caffeine should be avoided."

The military does some cool studies on these. Source is below, but you can
find the actual study with charts on how firearm proficiency rises and drops
with dose.

[https://www.benning.army.mil/tenant/75thranger/content/PDF/R...](https://www.benning.army.mil/tenant/75thranger/content/PDF/RANGER%20TOP%2020%20Supplement%20List.pdf)

~~~
LeifCarrotson
> _one study showed improved shot group tightness_

I refrained from mentioning caffeine's other reported and studied benefits, as
my understanding is they mostly disappear when alertness is compensated for.
Shot group tightness, memory performance, response time, critical thinking and
many other performance criteria have studies indicating that caffeine improves
results, but it's hard to separate the performance enhancement of just being
more alert. Maybe people shoot more accurately or memorize cards better with
caffeine, or maybe they just weren't quite paying attention when not using
caffeine.

------
solotronics
I can imagine that we could use bio compatible chips to accurately measure
blood levels of different vitamins and proteins. With this personal bio data
you could identify if you have an imbalance of anything and address it,
improving congnition and other conditions. Maybe this would be something a
company like Apple or Fitbit develops as it seems like a natural extension of
the health tracking they already do.

~~~
SolaceQuantum
The first thing we'd need to do is evaluate the optimal value of various
vitamins, proteins, minerals, and other supplements for all humans- we're
definitely not there yet. Our current blood tests allow a relatively large
range of 'normal' for pretty much anything the blood uptakes.

~~~
phkahler
So you use the new data gathering system to identify what variations matter.

------
MockObject
My supreme techniques are

* Provigil

* 2000IU daily Vitamin D during the darker half of the year

* Weightlifting, it really improves mental focus

* Get to sleep early enough to wake before the alarm goes off

* Strong coffee

------
alexhutcheson
Scott Alexander at SlateStarCodex wrote a good piece on why these branded
combination nootropic supplements are risky and probably a bad idea:
[https://slatestarcodex.com/2017/08/10/brief-cautionary-
notes...](https://slatestarcodex.com/2017/08/10/brief-cautionary-notes-on-
branded-combination-nootropics/)

------
benhebert
This isn't a new wave. Just the same wave by the same people.

------
NotTheFBI
Please tell me more about where you buy these drugs.

------
tcj_phx
I remember the first time I used a specific industrial gas recreationally. I
felt the arteries in my brain open up, and there was a sort of clarity that
wasn't there before.

Then the benefits faded into the background, and I now don't notice the effect
like I did the first few times.

I think remedial biology hacking works this way. If you're deficient in a
specific area you'll notice a huge benefit right away. If you don't need a
specific hack, you won't notice a benefit.

Another brain-hack that I noticed the first few times was Methylene Blue [0],
a potent MAOI and general metabolism-booster. I started out with microgram-
level doses, and I definitely noticed ... something.

But then it too faded into the background, and I don't notice the benefits so
much anymore. I still use this one occasionally but this too doesn't have
exactly the magic I'm looking for. (I use it on my dog though - she developed
a tumor when my dad took care of her for a few months - he took her off all
the supplements and fed her what I consider junk. He left for the summer and
my dog is back on my supplement program; I think she's got her spunk back.
[Edit: google scholar has some articles about methylene blue having anti-tumor
activity]).

[0] Methylene blue, the cheapest cognitive enhancer:
[https://selfhacked.com/blog/methylene-blue-the-cheapest-
cogn...](https://selfhacked.com/blog/methylene-blue-the-cheapest-cognitive-
enhancer/)

At the other end of the mind-hacking spectrum, the mainstream mental health
industry takes cognitive decelerants and tells certain patients that they have
a chronic condition that requires chemical lobotomization. Today these drugs
are marketed by the prescription drug cartels as anti-psychotics, but
originally they were known as major tranquilizers. Patients can't protest the
side effects of their medications because the psychiatrist will use the
complaint to claim that their patient "lacks insight" into their condition,
which justifies the use of force to make them take the drugs the professional
thinks they require. Psychosis is mostly a treatable metabolic problem, but
patients are much more profitable to the industry by pretending they have
chronic conditions.

Because the best cognitive enhancers are natural substances and safe patent-
expired medications, profiteers swoop in to repackage these vitamins and other
Over the Counter substances. Everyone has to figure out what they actually
need on their own.

The best mind-hack I've had is certain kinds of body work, which helped me
relax like nothing else. Sometimes massage/etc practitioners have the magic
touch that gets my body to turn off, but they tend to not know what they did
and I don't consistently get the effect. It's very frustrating.

