
Ireland donates contact tracing app to Linux Foundation - donaltroddyn
https://www.nearform.com/blog/ireland-donates-contact-tracing-app-to-linux-foundation/
======
quonn
In Germany the app was developed by research institutes. Then canceled. Then
SAP picked it up and charged 10 million Euros for what is essentially a few
1000 lines of UI code. The German Telekom got the same amount, just „because“
and will additionally charge 2-3 million per month mostly for the hotline
(with limited capacity).

So the total cost will be 50-100 millions. Despite the fact that most
technical work was already done by Apple and Google for free.

I‘m not even talking about the fact that my dad got a new phone to run it -
sold by T-Mobile (Telekom) of course.

And hardly anyone complained.

~~~
dividuum
Not sure where you get the 1000 lines from. That's ridiculous. `cloc` counts
16k lines of Kotlin for the Android app and 22k lines of Swift for the iOS
app. That does not even include other aspects like the server side code or
support documentation. Also it's not only the app that had to be build: It
required all the notification infrastructure and coordination to deliver test
result to the app. This is really one of the very few big government projects
where I can't really complain about the costs. There was only one attempt at
getting this done right and in time. They managed both.

~~~
tpush
If only the app were available on the US App Store. Can't use it here in
Germany because of my US Apple ID.

~~~
newscracker
I really can’t understand this for a COVID-19 contact tracing app. You should
find out how to give feedback on this to make them change availability to
global.

It boggles my mind that I have to remind many app publishers that we live in a
globalized world and that it’s a natter of a few minutes work to just select
the countries to make the app available in. More so for free apps where the
publisher doesn’t have to worry about taxes and payments.

Even for apps that are not localized to English or other languages, the
publishers should prefer to get them out to as many people as possible in the
whole wide world who may be visiting or on a long stay in a specific country.

In this case, the app developer can surely include help text that explains
where the app is meant to be used or would be useful (it’s also not like
people with a German App Store account living in some other country would be
able to use this app effectively).

~~~
manquer
Many times it has happens due legal restrictions that developer has in place
in his org . It is worse when the publisher is a government body or contracted
by one

------
marvion
Isn't this just a meaningless ad?

The company is part of the development. Afaik many apps are open source.
"Donating it" means offloading the support and profit from Linux Foundations
status.

Nearform is involved in integrating the backend into the countries health
system... so they offload the app and just do the work that gets paid well. ?

~~~
donaltroddyn
It is PR - maybe I should have linked to the HSE's press release:
[https://www.hse.ie/eng/services/news/media/pressrel/covid-
tr...](https://www.hse.ie/eng/services/news/media/pressrel/covid-tracker-
ireland-app-one-of-linux-foundation-public-health-s-first-open-source-
projects.html)

The app has been open sourced by the Irish Government, not Nearform who were
the developers. The copyright is owned by the HSE (the Irish public health
authority).

The app being open source does benefit Nearform, though, as they can sell
their services customising the app for other governments.

------
cj
Where has a contact tracing app been successfully deployed at a large scale?
Have those places seen any positive effect?

Apple/Google's APIs were widely discussed a couple months ago, but (at least
in the US) it seems to have fallen off everyone's radar.

~~~
rsynnott
Large-scale deployments in Ireland (1.4 million out of 4.9 million people) and
Germany (12 million out of 80 million people), anyway. In Ireland it has lead
to the discovery of a number of positive cases, which is positive; if they'd
been discovered at all through conventional means that would have taken longer
and the people concerned could have been spreading it for longer.

There has also been successful deployments in Taiwan and Singapore, but AIUI
they don't use the Apple/Google API and are far more intrusive.

~~~
tannhaeuser
German app downloads have just passed 16 million [1]. Or do you mean including
those who deinstalled it because it was boring ;?

[1]:
[https://de.statista.com/statistik/daten/studie/1125951/umfra...](https://de.statista.com/statistik/daten/studie/1125951/umfrage/downloads-
der-corona-warn-app/)

~~~
rsynnott
Ah, no, last numbers I saw were about 12m and it seemed to have slowed down a
bit. That's good news!

------
donohoe
Is there an actual contact tracing app for the US or any US states yet?

~~~
onionjake
Utah released one pretty early on (maybe April or May IIRC)? I think I heard
recently they might be shuttering it because of lack of downloads.

~~~
salakotolu
The app failed to gain significant adoption. I believe it no longer trace's
contacts.

------
leommoore
This pandemic is global so anything that helps countries to combat the virus
is a good thing. The Irish app seems pretty good but the great thing about
open source is that you can branch it to make your own app or just use the
code to learn how others resolved the technical issues associated with
creating a decentralized contact tracing app.

Of course an app is not a panacea but as developers we can't create vaccines
or provide medical assistance. Its not perfect, as it depends on getting
enough people to use it. No mean feat when there are people who don't even
believe Covid exists or think it is only dangerous to older people and don't
want to take any precautions like wear masks or socially distance. Even then,
there are lots of technical challenges trying to use a technology like
Bluetooth for a purpose for which it was never intended.

There will be a vaccine at some point (plenty of anti-vaccine people too,
which might be a problem for the future) and there will be better treatments
in the medium term but right now, speed is important and if it helps States to
save time and get a contact tracing app quickly then it has to be a good
thing. That way we are all safer.

------
tester756
I've heard opinion that those apps are _not insanely successful_ project

Even despite having milions downloaded copies, then it wasn't "broadcasting" a
lot of keys

[https://ctt.pfstr.de/](https://ctt.pfstr.de/)

Can someone say something about this? how valid this on?

------
papower
The "worlds most famous" claim is from the website and not the poster

~~~
donaltroddyn
I wasn't sure whether to remove that as a gratuitous adjective. Even without
that claim, it's an interesting development, especially as the app cost only
€850k.

In contrast, our nearest neighbour scrapped their app last month after
spending over £11MM (~€12MM) and are now rebuilding on the Apple/Google API:
[https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-53095336](https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-53095336)

The code is already up on GitHub:
[https://github.com/HSEIreland](https://github.com/HSEIreland)

~~~
Sephiroth87
I wouldn't put the focus on it being ONLY 850k, that seems a competent price,
I would really like to know how in the world they spent 11M on the uk one...

~~~
Someone
I don’t know specifics about the UK version, but most of those costs likely
weren’t on the app proper. They did run a field test, for example.

For comparison, the German version cost millions, too. That included multi-
language support, setting up help lines, security evaluation, load testing
millions of concurrent users and, IIRC, connecting to quite a few of different
hospital computer systems.

Add in time pressure, and costs go up. Germany did get a quality system,
judging by what the spokesman for the Chaos Computer Club said (paraphrasing:
‘we have the unfamiliar problem that there is so little to complain about’.
They never endorse stuff, so that’s about as endorsing as their statements can
get)

~~~
donaltroddyn
It also includes the DPIA, which in itself can be an expensive process. There
was a lot of concern/press in Ireland pre-release about the privacy
implications of the app. It's hot on the heels of a "mandatory but not
compulsory" national ID card fiasco that was determined to be unlawful by the
privacy regulator last year: [https://www.thejournal.ie/psc-no-legal-
basis-4766822-Aug2019...](https://www.thejournal.ie/psc-no-legal-
basis-4766822-Aug2019/)

~~~
ericlewis
You’re not wrong.

------
shintakezou
It seems something like a trojan horse in some core concept about freedom and
privacy. It also helps, I am sure.

