

A Virtual Unknown (moot of 4chan) - nickb
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/02/16/AR2009021601565.html?hpid=sec-tech

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EvilTrout
I have tried to buy ads on 4chan many times. I have emailed them at least once
every two months over the last year. I have NEVER received a reply.

My product is a browser based game that is very popular with the 4chan crowd.
We already advertise on ED. It's as close to a perfect fit for their audience
as anything I can think of.

On their previous ad network (I just learned about the new one), things were
self serve, but every time I bought ads I was told there was a conflict and to
try again.

They seem completely uninterested in doing business with us, or anyone. Maybe
that's why the whole thing is failing from a financial perspective?

~~~
EvilTrout
update: I spoke too soon. Following this article I was able to get in contact
with them and our ads should run soon!

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skorgu
You should be aware that moot has a long habit of being somewhat less than
perfectly truthful with the media.

ED is _profoundly_ not safe for anything:
<http://encyclopediadramatica.com/Christopher_Poole>

~~~
skorgu
I thought I disclaimed it well enough but just in case: THE PREVIOUS LINK IS
NSFW, REALLY REALLY NSFW. IN FACT THE ENTIRE SITE IT'S HOSTED ON IS NSFW.

~~~
boredguy8
"profoundly not safe for anything" sounds like you're saying it exposes liars
(i.e. is not safe for them) but is itself not always trustworthy (i.e. not
safe to believe 100%), especially within the context of your earlier comments
about untruth.

That you were trying to warn that it's NSFW was not at all clear.

~~~
skorgu
Fair enough. Context fail on my part, the phrase "not safe for $foo" is given
to include NSFW regardless of the value of $foo elsewhere it's hardly a
guaranteed assumption.

If pg or someone wants to include an explicit NSFW in that comment I'd be much
obliged.

~~~
msg
Maybe if you'd written it Not Safe For Anything, that would make the brain
click correctly. I too misread your original.

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DEinspanjer
I met him at ROFLCON in Boston and spent a while chatting with him about
career stuff. Sadly, I suspect that the thing they mentioned about Boston
might have been some people I put him in touch with. I never followed up on
what happened there. :/

He is a bright guy and he can/will do great things once he figures out the
right way (for him) to extract a good professional presentation of his skills
and experience from the quagmire that 4chan can be.

My personal opinion is that he needs to find some start-up that is trying to
do something edgy in the social scene and hook up with them to be a
coordinator/moderator/facilitator. He knows a damn lot about how a large
social group like 4chan can ebb, flow, and eddy.

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babul
_If he didn't care so much about what kind of advertising 4chan users have to
look at, he probably wouldn't be worried about money right now._

If this article is an accurate portrayal, it is surprising yet sad someone
with such a site (sole owner, >5M visitors, sustained growth+traffic over
years, source of numerous profitable spin-offs, etc.) is in debt and
unprofitable.

Surely it is better to run ads that are not optimal but make you money (a
balanced comprise), than be unhappy, in debt, and looking for a job?

I don't think he would be happy in most day jobs either (as such people rarely
are) and with an income stream he could pursue other ideas that interest him.

~~~
eli
I think the sort of ads that 4chan would have to settle for would be _far_
less than optimal. Most brands, I think, would pay to _not_ be seen on /b/.

~~~
pavel_lishin
Suddenly, blackmail is a legitimate business strategy.

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radu_floricica
I would pay for advertisement on 4chan. It would be perfect for recruitment,
especially on the more arty boards like photography. But it would take at
least:

\- the possibility to buy small packages, partly because the companies who are
big enough to buy the big package are the ones who care most about reputation

\- the possibility to define your audience, at least by: board, keywords,
country/city of origin

None of which are possible now: <http://www.4chan.org/advertise/>

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visitor4rmindia
> _A baby seal walked into a club._

\- The favorite joke of the creator of 4chan.

I wouldn't trust this guy too much. It seems strange that he can't monetize
such a hugely popular site. Kind of fishy actually. If he has problems with
big flashy ads something like google adsense would work out just fine.

~~~
patio11
Are you familiar with "smart pricing"? Basically, if your traffic isn't worth
anything, you get CPMs to match. This is for the understandable reason that
advertisers will go freaking berserk if they run a Placement Report and see
they're paying large CPMs for no-conversion traffic from a site of very low
perceived quality. (And if you're, oh, advertising manager for a bank, your
level of perceived quality of /b/ is probably lower than you can construct a
number to represent.)

See also: Facebook and Myspace, which have the same monetization issues minus
the whole content toxicity problem.

~~~
pwk
_See also: Facebook and Myspace_

How many millions a year do they spend? 4chan is a lean one person operation,
probably costing less than 100K a year to run. Given the traffic he's getting,
he could be getting miniscule CPMs and still be doing ok.

~~~
jfarmer
In the article he claims it costs $68k/year to run.

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paraschopra
He cannot make money of the site and he cannot get a job? That is the saddest
thing I have read for a while. Not because he cannot get a job but because it
confuses one's mind on what success really means. In a way he is extremely
successful, but in a way he is $20,000 in debt. Irony!

~~~
antidaily
The top post (ED entry for moot) says he's made $3 million - which is probably
closer to the truth IMHO. The site serves ads. I have a hard time believing
he's making no money and is still doing it.

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Shamiq
One page print version:

[http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-
dyn/content/article/2009/02...](http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-
dyn/content/article/2009/02/16/AR2009021601565_pf.html)

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dgreensp
Did the article really end with a sentence about his being a failure on paper?
Ending with the word "failure"? That's harsh.

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alaskamiller
Every time Chris Poole talks to media it's to fuck with them.

~~~
rms
Yes... I think this article is almost entirely not factual. I think it very
likely that moot is making a very decent living and does not live with his
mother.

~~~
EvilTrout
So who was the woman they interviewed? An elderly 4chan user?

