

Do We Really Need Another Smartphone OS? - aynlaplant
http://www.wired.com/insights/2013/01/do-we-really-need-another-smartphone-os/

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moccajoghurt
Wouldn't a real Linux OS on a smartphone be every developer's dream? I will
definitely get a Ubuntu phone. Think about the the variety of options you'll
have...

However I am not sure if the mainstream market will be as interested.

~~~
garuda
Android is a real Linux

~~~
ricardobeat
Trapped in a Java VM

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barik
It is no such thing.

You are correct that there's a VM -- Dalvik is the process virtual machine in
Android, and that a common use case is to use Java bytecode and then convert
it to Dalvik, but this is a far cry from being "trapped in a Java VM".

In fact, at even the fundamental level, the Java VM is a stack-based machine,
while the Dalvik VM is a register-based machine (the merits or criticisms of
doing so are beyond the scope of this post; that's a different discussion).

And if the notion of a VM is still utterly offensive, you are welcome to write
portions of your Android applications in native code, such as through C or
C++, although for many applications there's really no or marginal benefit to
doing so.

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ChuckMcM
Wow, that was disappointing.

It says something about the fashion sense of a reporter if they approach the
question this way. You should ask, "What capabilities are we going to want in
our phone going forward?" and work from there, but fretting over brand
awareness seems, well, a bit shallow.

Do you only buy a car because it has a "Hemi" V8 engine ? And wonder, "Do we
really need another engine for cars?" Of course you don't. I would love a
smart phone that was less susceptible to malware (the tension of
programmability meets actual exploits against my bank account). If the current
OS makers can do that, fine, if there is a new OS that does this better, that
is ok too.

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ricardobeat
Do we really need another model of mobile phone?

Do we really need more screen sizes?

Do we really need more apps?

That's an inane question, and the article doesn't even try to answer it.

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jfb
Why not? I don't see a reason to use it myself, but hey, a diverse software
ecosystem is a healthy one, and good ideas can come from anywhere. So, "yes".

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ladzoppelin
The phrase "A real linux OS phone" is pretty frustrating considering Android
exists and is supposed to be "real Linux". What are the main reasons Android
is not "real Linux"? (Its hard not to be upset with Google for this situation
if the reason is what I think it is).

~~~
green7ea
When people say Linux, they usually mean more than just the kernel. Stallman
insists we call this GNU/Linux since a good portion of userspace comes for the
GNU project. When people say 'real linux' I believe they are referring to the
full userspace that usually accompanies the Linux kernel.

The userspace in Android is very different from the userspace in GNU/Linux. In
GNU/Linux, it is very easy to program using your preferred programming
language. This isn't the case in Android, everything is very tightly wrapped
up around Dalvik. Before you mention the NDK, let me say that it's only a
subset of C++ (no exceptions among other things). Ubuntu on the cell phone
also opens up the possibility of things like shell scripting, local
webservers, etc.

What this really comes down to is programming freedom that you can find in
GNU/Linux that isn't found in Android. You will now have a full fledged
computer in your pocket instead of a limited device.

~~~
jamesjguthrie
Ubuntu can run alongside/on top of Android. Is that still limited?

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ttuominen
I would absolutely love to see Ubuntu and others (Jolla) succeed.
Unfortunately I'm also highly skeptical they will. The reason is that
currently their marketing story seems so far removed from actual consumers:
think about the fact that they're even trying to sell the idea of an
_operating system_ , not a complete product. This seems really backwards
compared to the evidently successful Apple model. Granted, they are probably
having discussions with manufacturers right now, but we'll have to wait for
the results. I'd be happy to hear somebody refute this argument!

~~~
samstokes
Ubuntu for phones is not (yet) a choice available to consumers. I assume their
marketing is currently targeted at OEMs because that's who they need to
convince first.

Hopefully when phones running Ubuntu are available on the market, they'll come
up with a more compelling story for consumers.

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gee_totes
This is the first headline I've ever seen that violates Betteridge's law of
headlines[0], which states that any headline that ends in a question mark can
be answered by "no". But in the case of this headline, the answer is a
resounding "yes".

[0]<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betteridge%27s_law_of_headlines>

~~~
DeepDuh
How about we generalize the law? The answer to headlines ending in a question
mark is whatever the rhetoric question is not suggesting?

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Executor
Pros: \- A real linux OS phone, more open than Android \- Ubuntu getting more
popularity \- Gives Apple, Google, MS less control/power, users more diversity

Cons: \- Canonical likes making big mistakes (mandatory Unity interface,
Amazon search/spyware integration)

~~~
Tmmrn
> mandatory Unity interface

Mandatory?

    
    
        sudo apt-get install kubuntu-desktop
    
     * log out
     * choose kde
     * log in

~~~
moccajoghurt
Who needs a WM anyway? Just use the console.

./call 01 __ __ __

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Proleps
Competition is always good. But I guess some people prefer the dictatorship of
a monopoly.

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general_failure
Do we really need another news site? Isn't hacker news and bbc.com good enough
for everyone?

Why wired? Join the discuss here.

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zobzu
I'm really tired of those articles. Tired enough to complain in a comment.
That's classic FUD.

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mtgx
I'm interested in seeing Ubuntu getting a fair shot at the market. I don't
know what to think about web-apps based operating systems like Firefox OS yet,
but I think it will help Firefox, the browser, become more competitive from
what they learn making the OS.

I don't care as much about Tizen and Sailfish, but I'd rather see strong open
source competitors standing up against Android and iOS, than more closed ones
like WP8 and BB10.

I think, if not Samsung, at least more desperate companies like HTC, LG and
Sony should definitely give Ubuntu a fair try. Asus might do it anyway, as
they are already making Ubuntu laptops, and they have that whole Padfone thing
going on, but they haven't been very successful in smartphones yet.

~~~
slurry
> I don't know what to think about web-apps based operating systems like
> Firefox OS yet,

I think it is a mistake. A modern operating system, particularly on mobile
where power management and security are concerns, needs a mature well-
optimized managed code environment to write middleware and more complicated
applications in - hence Objective-C with automatic reference counting on iOS
and Java/Dalvik on Android.

HTML5 for all uses under the sun is going to either underperform users'
expectations or drain power, or both; and letting unmanaged C applications in
is a recipe for disaster.

I would like to be excited about this, but I do not think the architecture as
presented makes any sense.

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gtufano
Objective-C is not "managed". iOS apps are sandboxed, but obj-c is _very_ near
to C (and most of the Foundation API are pure C). Also, ARC is not mandatory
and there is no garbage collector on iOS.

~~~
slurry
Nonsense. If my Objective-C app is sandboxed, it is "managed". Saying ARC "is
not mandatory" is another way of saying it is "enabled by default". There is
little formal computational difference between ARC and a conservative garbage
collector.

Fact: Objective-C is "managed".

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camus
Do we really need competition ?

~~~
freeduck
Of course we need competition. Android is a nice platform - I use it every
day. But I also would very much like one or more vanilla GNU/Linux phone
platforms. The Linux ecosystem has benefited a great deal from having multiple
distros(fedora,debian,gentoo...) with each their own focus. As long as they
will agree on some common standards like freedesktop.org - diversity is a win.

~~~
edwardy20
I believe he was being sarcastic.

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trimbo
Whether these succeed or not, I simply don't get it.

Android is open source. Fork it. Improve it. Why build something completely
new. Is it just to keep a brand name like "Ubuntu" and "Firefox"?

~~~
madisp
As far as I understand it actually is a fork of Android in the sense that it
runs the Android-flavoured Linux kernel.

~~~
ttuominen
This, and also Android's overall userspace design is kind of idiosyncratic.
I'm sure there are other legitimate designs of a Linux-based mobile OS, which
don't rely so heavily on Java and a virtual machine. Ubuntu will be Qt-based,
for example. That throws out the possibility to reuse the Android application
framework.

~~~
trimbo
Ok, but there's nothing that prevents them from implementing QT on Android
using the NDK. You don't have to throw out _all_ application compatibility to
achieve something like this.

