
GoFundMe Gone Wild - lujim
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/08/fashion/gofundme-gone-wild.html?smid=re-share
======
powera
What does this really mean (and the list of random requests is just
pointless):

Is it a sign of a breakdown of the traditional ways of making money (as a
summary, the replacement of "working the farm" to earn money with "driving for
Uber" to earn money)?

Is it the de-centralization of existing support networks? Asking your friends
for money isn't new, maybe it's just that you talk to your friends over the
internet that's new.

Is it the corporatization of personal budgets, where everything has to have
some nice-sounding reason attached to it, even if it's obviously a waste of
money? (unless you really believe that all the leadership summits in Hawaii
are really cost-effective)

~~~
nostrademons
I think it's an internalization of the "It's always okay to ask" mentality,
which itself is a symptom of a transition from a society built around a few
common cultural institutions to one based on a pluralistic conception that
different people may have different values. It used to be that there were
common norms of behavior, and you didn't step outside those norms unless you
wanted to risk strong social censure. Now, the norm is that anything mutually
agreed upon by two parties is fine.

On the whole, I think this is a good trend - it makes the economy more
efficient, it encourages people to celebrate diversity instead of shunning it,
and it's how the upper classes have operated for a long time, which is the
source of a major power imbalance where corporations & rich people feel
entitled to ask for anything and then working-class people feel ashamed to
refuse. This is just the same attitude filtering down to formerly middle-class
people, likely fueled by desperation as the traditional social compact breaks
down and their previous income stream dries up. It'll take a period of
adjustment as people realize that "No" is a perfectly fine answer that you'll
have to give the majority of the time, though, and many people are very
uncomfortable at the breakdown of unspoken norms (hence the article).

~~~
lsc
I want to know if these people are getting gofundme requests from people they
know. If so, what are they doing differently from me?

Because if you're getting gofundme requests from people you don't know, we've
all been getting hit up for money from shady "charities" forever; it's just
that the internet has democratized the technologies used to ask randoms for
money. This isn't really a change, in my mind.

I'll accept that it's a cultural change when I get these sorts of requests
from people I know, rather than from random strangers.

~~~
morgante
> I'll accept that it's a cultural change when I get these sorts of requests
> from people I know, rather than from random strangers.

I get these ridiculous GoFundMe requests from people I know (including
relatively close friends) on a pretty regular basis.

It's different from the classic "charities" in that the pressure is much
higher when it's a personal appeal from a friend.

------
weisser
> What about the girl seeking $600 for her “personal development journey”?
> (Not much to ask, but she was so beautiful, I didn’t understand why she
> didn’t develop herself into a model and make a whole lot more than that.)

What a bizarre comment.

~~~
bdcravens
I think it sets off the misogyny alarms, but I think the point remains:
someone with a quality that could conceivably be used to meet a financial need
opens up a valid criticism. We'd say the same if it were a developer asking
for money, or a homeless person panhandling when they appear physically fit. I
think there's a resistance when it's based on appearance, not skill, but I
think there's plenty of models who would take exception to the idea that there
isn't work and skill involved.

~~~
kjackson
Misogyny? I do not think it means what you think it means.

~~~
mtinkerhess
Really? The article's suggestion that a good-looking woman should consider her
looks her most employable asset sure set off alarm bells for me.

~~~
akerl_
The article doesn't make the claim that it's her most employable asset, it's
highlighting a trait that's visible from her page requesting donations, and
would potentially remove the need to seek donations.

~~~
r-w
Not everyone is comfortable with selling their looks, so it’s not ironic for a
good-looking person to ask for money.

------
striking
If a close friend's experiencing some incredibly tough times, and he sets his
goal to $125 or something reasonable like that, I'd have no issue with
pitching in. I'm a totally broke college student, but that's the truth.

However, this article really hits the mark. Begging your friends and family or
the internet community at large is actually the last thing you should think of
doing. And if you're asking for thousands of dollars, you'd better be buying
food for a homeless shelter or something. Something that benefits, I don't
know, more than a single person?

~~~
rbritton
It's the digital version of panhandling, and it's unfortunate that the few on
there who have (in my opinion) a legitimate need are so overshadowed by those
begging for a new camera or to go on a trip.

~~~
wyclif
This is what bothers me most about people who can't tell the difference
between wants and genuine needs: the negative effect it has on the people who
do need something that could save their life but can't pay for it, or are
going to perform some virtuous service for others that they won't be paid for.

One of my friends, who has done a lot of writing and I can assure you has not
made much money at all from being a writer while producing a lot of content
for free (and has written a couple of legit books) recently had a stroke that
paralyzed one side of his body. He's now in physical therapy and geting other
serious treatment. He's 48 years old and has four kids; only the eldest one is
out of the house. He's not wealthy by any means, and needs help paying his
medical bills. A friend put up a GoFundMe page for his family, probably
unbeknownst to him, all because of compassion and people are starting to
donate (he's almost up to $1000, which is like a drop in the bucket when it
comes to covering medical expenses in the US).

That's the kind of situation that GoFundMe and similar sites are for. Not for
vanity projects, paying for your dream wedding, funding plastic surgery,
throwing parties, interior design, and springing for fripperies that are not
emergencies and are not virtuous.

These people are ruining the reputation of internet-based, crowdsourced
funding. They have no shame.

~~~
detaro
> _That 's the kind of situation that GoFundMe and similar sites are for._

GoFundMe's website would disagree with you on that. And I don't think asking
for money even if it is not an emergency is necessarily bad. And if people
want to make an ass of themselves, well, now they have a new avenue to do so.

The juxtaposition of all these things on one site is weird though, I agree,
and it would be bad if it stained the reputation of the "better" causes. A
site specialized in "emergency" funds certainly could look more respectable
and potentially add more value as a community. But would process less funds
and make less money...

And that's not getting in the whole "privatizing risks that should be caught
by society" (or not) discussion...

~~~
wyclif
Well, yes. That's _one_ kind of situation it's for. I wouldn't want to limit
it to life-or-death issues. But I'm just saying that people shouldn't be using
it to get skating lessons for their kids, or to fund their "personal
development journey." Those things are extras.

------
chillwaves
Not sure the point of this article. Of course there are more or less
deserving, more or less craven. It's a platform for anyone to use, that's the
whole point. Don't want to give? Then don't.

~~~
HillRat
As far as I can tell, the key takeaway is that the NYT has no trouble shaming
the poor and middle classes for not having the support network the well-off
can mobilize. I know executives who I wouldn't trust to run a bake sale
without FTC oversight, but every time they fail there's another c-suite job
waiting for them somewhere. Their panhandling is just done out of sight, over
a good Malbec at the Capital Club.

~~~
n0us
I think the takeaway had more to do with the shift from "man life really threw
me a curveball and I could use some help" to "my spewcial schnequflake needs a
new violin and we renovated the kitchen last year, someone else please pay for
it"

------
scottmcdot
I'm sometimes a bit sceptical giving money to friends to do fund raising
'challenges' [0] that are in some beautiful part of Australia and require them
to walk a reasonable 20km in a day. I would hope that they cover their own
costs (flying, registration fee, accommodation, etc.) and any donations they
receive go to the charity/cause.

[0] [http://www.humacharitychallenge.com/Charity-
Challenge/Austra...](http://www.humacharitychallenge.com/Charity-
Challenge/Australia/The-Reach-Foundation/Reach-Larapinta-Trail-
Challenge?overrideCountry=AUS)

~~~
goodJobWalrus
Yeah, I personally don't like this bundling of fun activities and charity. If
you want to run a marathon, run a marathon. If you want to give to charities,
just give. Don't make a pretence of charity to do what you find fun.

~~~
dazc
> "If you want to run a marathon, run a marathon. If you want to give to
> charities, just give."

I agree with the sentiment although lots of people run marathons and raise
money for a charity as a motivational aid. I don't see anything wrong with
this.

However, if someone wants to do a parachute jump, cycle the Great Wall of
China, etc, then yes, they should just shut up and fund it themselves.

------
cwmma
At the moment the barriers to asking a bunch of people on the internet for
money is effectively 0 so why the hell wouldn't you do it? the worst case
scenario is you don't get any money and you're no worse off.

At some point (possibly right now with this article) a backlash will develop
and there may be some social costs to doing this because of the numbers of
people doing it have created a tragedy of the commons.

~~~
nateabele
> _[Y]ou 're no worse off._

Except your dignity, maybe?

~~~
cwmma
well that's the key at the moment there isn't too much shame in doing so, I
expect there will start being some soon.

------
NM-Super
Is anybody really surprised by this development? If you create a platform
where people can ask for money, a bunch of people are going to ask for money
they don't really need.

~~~
bdcravens
In my experience, GoFundMe enables it more than other platforms, since they
really don't give you a good way to complain. (I've received spam from someone
with a campaign there)

------
draw_down
The ones I see are not for vacations. They are for school supplies for kids
that need them, medical expenses, that sort of thing. Guess we have different
friends!

------
snake117
This reminded me of something similar: televangelists asking people for "seed
faiths".

If you haven't heard about this yet, check out this video from Last Week
Tonight:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7y1xJAVZxXg](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7y1xJAVZxXg)

------
morgante
I used to get upset about these endless ill-deserving requests.

Then I realized I have a simple option of just not giving. Much like reality
television, I find it pathetic and am unlikely to be friends with someone who
uses it for long, but it doesn't pose an existential threat to society.

------
rogeryu
That link has gone wild:

[http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/08/fashion/gofundme-gone-
wild...](http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/08/fashion/gofundme-gone-wild.html)

------
drchiu
Lol. Just saw this trend on HN after my friend messaged me to help fund his
Kickstarter. I really wonder how many Ks projects wouldn't be funded minus
family and friends.

------
pavornyoh
The article is spot on. Bunch of scams on there with few good people in
between needing real help. I wonder if the admins/Mod on the site vet people
out.

~~~
pavornyoh
EDIT:Instead of down voting my comment, perhaps you should reply to my post so
that we can have a conversation about the topic.

~~~
minimaxir
Don't complain about downvotes.

You likely were downvoted since your comment doesn't add much ("The article is
spot on" doesn't count as having a conversation)

~~~
pavornyoh
>("I agree with this article!" doesn't count as having a conversation)

Did you read my first response? Or are you confusing me with someone? I asked
a question if you saw my first response about the mods/admin.

------
dudul
Who should be more shameful? The ones asking for money for vacation / nose job
/ new car, or the ones actually giving the money?

~~~
pavornyoh
There is nothing wrong donating money for good cause. But when you are giving
money when the intentions aren't good, then you are encouraging whoever set up
the fund that sort of behavior is ok.

~~~
dudul
Aren't you saying exactly what my comment was saying?

~~~
detaro
Was your comment saying anything? I thought it asked a question, to which
pavornyoh gave an answer.

~~~
dudul
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhetorical_question](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rhetorical_question)

~~~
nostrademons
Sarcasm, rhetoric, and other meta-linguistical information doesn't come across
well over the Internet.

------
dredmorbius
The NY Times might want a GoFundMe for copy editors:

"Many on her mailing list _where_ taken aback"

------
SimplyUseless
This story was originally posted here

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10525159](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10525159)

~~~
minimaxir
Reposts are allowed if there hasn't be significant discussion.

If you're upset about missing karma, it's just luck of the draw.

------
patrickaljord
This article was probably written by a well off NYT journalist who doesn't
need and therefor doesn't understand the need for these kind of campaigns,
sounds like a "let them have cake" kind of statement.

