
Asiana Airlines Boeing 777 crashes at SFO - robbiet480
http://www.airliners.net/aviation-forums/general_aviation/read.main/5809207/
======
jcdavis
ATC audio from the crash [http://wandr.me/Audio/AAR214-KSFO-
Crash.mp3](http://wandr.me/Audio/AAR214-KSFO-Crash.mp3)

~~~
ceejayoz
I know they train for it, but the coolheaded professionalism there is
remarkable - tower, other planes, all of them.

~~~
InclinedPlane
That's why airlines like to get pilots with military experience. They are
exposed to more crazy scenarios in training and work and generally keep a cool
head better under stress.

~~~
duncan_bayne
Hmmm - but: military pilots are also known (especially in some cultures) for
an over-strong respect for hierarchy, resulting in a willingness to go along
with dangerous instructions. Also, at least some military pilots are trained
to have a higher risk acceptance than civilian pilots.

Personally, I'd be very happy having an ex-military pilot flying me around; I
think the pros definitely outweigh the cons. But do be aware that the cons
exist.

~~~
coopdog
Actually Korean pilots (civilian) are also known to have too strong a respect
for hierarchy. I remember seeing an episode of air crash investigating where
that was officially reported as a factor, so it isn't even just the military
where that can be a risk.

~~~
mseebach
This is the most famous incident, and the one that lead to the development of
Crew Resource Management, a process to make sure decisions are taken by
consensus, not by deferring to authority. The crew in question, by the way,
was dutch.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tenerife_airport_disaster](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tenerife_airport_disaster)

------
danso
A tweet from a purported passenger:
[https://twitter.com/Eunner/status/353592664526028801](https://twitter.com/Eunner/status/353592664526028801)

> I just crash landed at SFO. Tail ripped off. Most everyone seems fine. I'm
> ok. Surreal... (at @flySFO) [pic] —
> [https://path.com/p/1lwrZb](https://path.com/p/1lwrZb)

------
bryanh
High quality close up photo from
[https://path.com/p/1lwrZb](https://path.com/p/1lwrZb):

[https://pathakacdn-a.akamaihd.net/photos2/f36a5729-6db7-40db...](https://pathakacdn-a.akamaihd.net/photos2/f36a5729-6db7-40db-9c98-99aa8b68df4c/original.jpg)

~~~
Osmium
I can't imagine the confusion that must have gone on when that happened, maybe
it's shock or maybe people just underestimate the severity of their situation
but correct me if I'm wrong... are there people in that photo actually
carrying their bags off the plane? I can't quite comprehend that.

~~~
justin66
The bottlenecks in their escape were the doorway and the crew's deployment of
the inflatable slide. Rushing the door in a panic would have done nobody any
good.

In a situation like that, why wouldn't you grab your bag if it was readily
accessible? It seems like healthy, rational behavior rather than a symptom of
extreme confusion.

~~~
sbierwagen

      The bottlenecks in their escape were the doorway and the 
      crew's deployment of the inflatable slide... why wouldn't 
      you grab your bag if it was readily accessible?
    

Wrong. In order to be certified airworthy, you have to be able to evacuate an
airliner in 90 seconds, in the dark, with some of the emergency exits blocked.
Here's an A380 doing it:
[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4TAkAcQOnQY](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4TAkAcQOnQY)

Here's a 777:
[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4TAkAcQOnQY](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4TAkAcQOnQY)

If everyone stops to grab their bag, it can take ten times as long. If the
plane is on fire, then people die.

~~~
blake8086
You linked the same video twice. (thanks, though)

~~~
sbierwagen
Whoops.

And of course I check back 7 hours after the edit window.

------
bfung
I know this is exciting news and all, but:

[http://ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html](http://ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html)

Hacker News Guidelines

What to Submit On-Topic:

Anything that good hackers would find interesting.

That includes more than hacking and startups.

If you had to reduce it to a sentence, the answer might be: anything that
gratifies one's intellectual curiosity.

Off-Topic:

Most stories about politics, or crime, or sports, unless they're evidence of
some interesting new phenomenon.

Videos of pratfalls or disasters, or cute animal pictures.

 _If they 'd cover it on TV news_, it's probably off-topic.

I'd say trying to rationalize that this story is relevant on HN by saying
"startups use SFO" is a stretch. I'd hope that people taking flights out
actually check with the airport first before checking HN.

~~~
tankenmate
From what I saw it impacted before the runway. This brings back memories of
the British Airways 777 that came down early due to loss of power to both
engines (Speedbird 38, Beijing to London). The cause of that was ice blocking
the fuel filters which starved both engines. The thing to check here was what
altitude the plane was flying at for most of the flight, and what temperature
it was at that altitude along the flight path.

~~~
markdown
That icing issue has since been fixed and so is irrelevant to this crash
(according to CNN).

------
maximz
Here are the most recent FAA Advisories:
[http://www.fly.faa.gov/adv/adv_list.jsp?WhichAdvisories=ATCS...](http://www.fly.faa.gov/adv/adv_list.jsp?WhichAdvisories=ATCSCC&AdvisoryCategory=All&dates=Saturday%2C+07-06-2013&AirFlow=AirFlow&Gstop=Gstop&Gdelay=Gdelay&Route=Route&Other=Other)

And here are three relevant ones already published:

* [http://www.fly.faa.gov/adv/adv_otherdis.jsp?advn=26&adv_date...](http://www.fly.faa.gov/adv/adv_otherdis.jsp?advn=26&adv_date=07062013&facId=SFO/ZOA&title=CDM+GROUND+STOP&titleDate=07/06/13)

* [http://www.fly.faa.gov/adv/adv_otherdis.jsp?advn=27&adv_date...](http://www.fly.faa.gov/adv/adv_otherdis.jsp?advn=27&adv_date=07062013&facId=SFO/ZOA&title=SFO+DIVERSION+RECOVERY&titleDate=07/06/13)

* [http://www.fly.faa.gov/adv/adv_otherdis.jsp?advn=29&adv_date...](http://www.fly.faa.gov/adv/adv_otherdis.jsp?advn=29&adv_date=07062013&facId=SFO/ZOA&title=CDM+GROUND+STOP&titleDate=07/06/13)

------
sethbannon
Someone who was on the plane says everyone seems OK:
[https://path.com/p/1lwrZb](https://path.com/p/1lwrZb)

~~~
jka
Sincerely hope so - it may be a little early to tell though, he likely didn't
have visibility of the full cabin and it's hard to tell what things are like
inside.

~~~
ewang1
That's David Eun, a Samsung exec, so he was probably up front in biz class.

~~~
dnautics
the front section of the plane is theoretically the most dangerous part of the
plane; survivors in plane crashes are most likely to come from just behind the
wing.

~~~
Retric
That greatly depends on the type of crash. The added risk your talking about
has a lot to do with nose down collisions.

~~~
ewang1
I'd factor in the fact that the people density is lower up front, probably
aiding you in getting off the plane faster.

~~~
sylvinus
There's no need to factor in anything, those statistics come from actual
outcomes of past crashes.

------
robbiet480
(latest info at bottom of comment)

ABC reports it was coming from Taipei, linked forum says Taipei. Video of
aftermath.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0dFtmSybpuw&feature=youtu.be](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0dFtmSybpuw&feature=youtu.be).

Redwood City FD responding. Unknown amount of passengers. SFO FD using foam on
entire plane.

FAA has now shut down operations at SFO due to "disabled plane"

3rd alarm called, "red" alarm called.

Multiple reports that fuselage is in multiple pieces. Tail is some yards away.

FAA issues statement: "A Boeing 777 operated by Asiana Airlines crashed while
landing at San Francisco International Airport." No further details.

Asiana Airlines flight OZ214, Boeing 777, registration HL7742
[http://t.co/bSgoVeggrU](http://t.co/bSgoVeggrU)

Better picture: pic.twitter.com/JqLj9OAtzv

#SFOFire Northfield IC, North Field Command, four engines and 3 ambulances
inbound to aircraft, other units staging #CaFire

@rafweverbergh: Confirmed with controller at SFO: "plane is broken in multiple
pieces. (...) a hard landing" SOURCE:
[http://t.co/ghqoLpxfVM](http://t.co/ghqoLpxfVM) @scobleizer
[[http://twitter.com/rafweverbergh/status/353590307402694658](http://twitter.com/rafweverbergh/status/353590307402694658)]

@CarrieMantha: Thank God @OntarioHazards EMS reporting all passengers of the
downed plane at #SFO are accounted for. Injuries but no reports of fatalities
[[http://twitter.com/CarrieMantha/status/353590343624691712](http://twitter.com/CarrieMantha/status/353590343624691712)]

@punkboyinsf: Redwood City Fire is classifying SFO plane crash as 3 alarm fire
and level 8 mass casualty incident. via @lautenbach #YAL
[[http://twitter.com/punkboyinsf/status/353590933515804672](http://twitter.com/punkboyinsf/status/353590933515804672)]

@Emergency_In_SF: SFO AIR CRASH (update): crews report 48 patients have been
rescued so far after 777 crashes on landing. Passengers still on burning plane
[[http://twitter.com/Emergency_In_SF/status/353591197144588288](http://twitter.com/Emergency_In_SF/status/353591197144588288)]

LIVE SHOT OF PLANE NOW AVAILABLE:

@brianstelter: KTVU, Fox affiliate in San Fran, has a faraway live shot of the
plane here: [http://t.co/BXreHtWugm](http://t.co/BXreHtWugm) No anchored
coverage yet.
[[http://twitter.com/brianstelter/status/353591320733941760](http://twitter.com/brianstelter/status/353591320733941760)]

Someone got a picture of the crash as it happened:

@stefanielaine: just realized I have a picture of the actual crash. holy
fucking shit. [http://t.co/5TnOX96Gsi](http://t.co/5TnOX96Gsi)
[[http://twitter.com/stefanielaine/status/353591123958173696](http://twitter.com/stefanielaine/status/353591123958173696)]

@peterpham: 290 passengers on plane, 1 infant - San Francisco Fire and EMS
Live Audio Feed [http://t.co/ZoMhufPNMA](http://t.co/ZoMhufPNMA) via
@Broadcastify
[[http://twitter.com/peterpham/status/353592842385494016](http://twitter.com/peterpham/status/353592842385494016)]

VERY UP CLOSE PICTURE FROM TWITTER:
[https://path.com/p/1lwrZb](https://path.com/p/1lwrZb)

~~~
austenallred
Awesome reporting! Seriously, good job.

I honestly believe that a collection of sources like this is the future of
news; allow people to draw their own conclusions based on the first-hand
content you can collect.

Shameless plug: OK, that's actually what I've been building for a few months.
We had to break it to finish building it (sorry, or i'd just show you), but
our launchrock page is at [http://grasswire.com](http://grasswire.com) if you
want to have access when we launch

~~~
untog
I'm not sure I agree. From those first pictures I saw (charred plane) I drew
my own conclusion that a large number of people must have died. From the
latest reports, it appears I was wrong.

Sometimes we don't know enough to make meaningful conclusions without experts
weighing in. Not to mention bias- first hand accounts are rarely impartial. In
this instance there aren't any "sides" to take, but I'd bet that most of the
photos flowing out of Egypt right now have an opinion behind them.

~~~
austenallred
That's fair, but I think I still disagree. If you are only looking at one
source, sure, it can be confusing, but if you have a good collection of all of
the first-hand sources really you are able to draw the same conclusion that
any reporter might be able to. Right now we have basically outsourced the job
of drawing conclusions from opinionated people to reporters. Given the right
information I believe every person could do that.

But I recognize that's not a belief held by many people. I've just been able
to watch all of the reports come in for a while and feel like that's enough,
if not better.

~~~
anigbrowl
_we have basically outsourced the job of drawing conclusions from opinionated
people to reporters_

Yes, and this is economically efficient. Of course they get all sorts of
things wrong at the outset - the fact that this is annoying is a reflection of
how much we rely on them. But the fact is that in most cases we don't
especially need to know these things immediately; I'm curious about this
crash, of course, but it doesn't affect me directly and there's nothing I can
do about it. It's actually better that I didn't check the news until a bit
later in the day when some time had gone by and the details had firmed up -
I'm a little behind the curve, but I've saved 2 hours of pointless and
probably poorly-founded speculation. If it wasn't for the fact that my wife
watches more TV than I do I'd probably go days at a time without checking, and
just catch up Saturdays when the _Economist_ arrives.

I understand being a news junkie - because I am one. But it's an unhealthy
habit that rarely yields enough advantage to justify the time involved. I'll
check out your startup but really, I suspect it would just be an endless time
sink for me. I already find this a big problem with text-based news.

EDIT: I meant to say internet-based news.

To answer the reply below, I guess my question is 'what benefit is there to me
in following multiple reports as they break? To be good at it requires doing
it on a regular basis, but the economic benefit is questionable. I think it's
a great idea, and if it can build up a sufficient community then it has the
potential to function as a better news bureau than existing sources. The
hurdle to climb is that the number of people who will be both skilled at
analyzing breaking news events and have the time to put in regularly will be
fairly small, and every time there's a major event the interested local
population that joins in will consist largely of -first timers, whose
contributions will amount to (Shannon) noise.

I mention a local event, because I see that while we're worried about this
because many HNers are in the Bay Area, over on the East Coast near Maine a
train carrying oil derailed and exploded in the middle of a small town,
flattening the town center and with 60-100 people missing. So a plane crash
with only two fatalities doesn't seem very important from a different
perspective.

~~~
austenallred
What I'm saying is that if you could use the aggregate cognitive surplus of
the people trying to follow the event as it breaks, you could use that to
create something cohesive and reliable. Then if you're not a news junkie and
don't have any interest in following a story until it has settled down, you're
welcome to do so.

[edit] In response to the question above: So is your question why would
somebody follow something as it breaks?

~~~
anigbrowl
It's not so much why do we follow something as it breaks - that's normal human
curiosity/pattern hunger. But my question is how many people will do it
consistently enough to be neutral, rather than because they're selectively
interested in (but not necessarily informed about) a small set of stories. As
I understand it this has been the problem for Wikinews - it can't function as
well as Wikipedia because the number of people is below a critical threshold,
so it lags breaking news by up to several days.

~~~
austenallred
That's an excellent question. Wikinews doesn't function as well, in my
opinion, because Wikinews feels like work - the people I've talked to that
use/create Wikinews say they do it out of a sense of civic responsibility;
it's not enjoyable, and a lot of the time they say it feels like rewriting the
New York Times (from the couple dozen I've talked to).

The solution, I think, is in making following the news as it breaks
exciting/interesting enough the average person would contribute. Our solution
for that was to show you all of the social media streaming from different
sources streaming in real time related to the event, making it more like
/r/new (Reddit) than wikinews. Watching everything stream in and sorting out
the good stuff is exciting; it's easy to get a lot of neutral eyeballs on it.

------
hrdinsky
Sheryl Sandberg was scheduled to be on this flight but switched to a United
flight [1]

The now famous photo from the ground is by David Eun, a Samsung Executive [2].
Coincidentally at a time when there are talks of a Samsung / Facebook
partnership [3]

[1]
[https://www.facebook.com/sheryl/posts/10152997724435177](https://www.facebook.com/sheryl/posts/10152997724435177)
[2]
[http://www.linkedin.com/in/davideun1](http://www.linkedin.com/in/davideun1)
[2] [http://www.latimes.com/business/technology/la-fi-tn-
facebook...](http://www.latimes.com/business/technology/la-fi-tn-facebook-
leans-on-samsung-for-mobile-partnership-report-says-20130705,0,7256503.story)

------
dnm
Flight path comparison today vs yesterday.
[https://twitter.com/sbaker/status/353611787750494208](https://twitter.com/sbaker/status/353611787750494208)

------
krenoten
Sitting in a plane there now that was supposed to take off in 10 minutes.
Hopefully there were no serious injuries. There's a big plume of smoke where
the 777 is.

------
cinquemb
Incidents like this make me wonder about interesting problems people are
currently solving/or will have to address with commercialized space travel.

Say if this had happened at a docking port to a space station, regardless of
the severity, it would have been fatal for everyone (assuming people in
transit wouldn't be in some kind of suit meant to protect them from the vacuum
of space/or radiation inside of a ship that is supposed to do that).

~~~
jlgreco
Ever since Soyuz 11 depressurized after/while detaching from Salyut 1,
everyone has used rescue suits during launch/landing. These rescue suits are
not good for EVA as they don't provide the same mobility as EVA suits (better
mobility while not in a vacuum, little to no mobility while in a vacuum), but
they provide life support for limited amounts of time.

Radiation is really something you don't worry about until everybody is safely
repressurized.

Edit: Chris Hadfield talks about it:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2gaFXZWhp4k](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2gaFXZWhp4k)

~~~
cinquemb
Do you think (or are) people would be required to wear these suits on
commercialized flights?

As an aside, I wish I could be involved with anything dealing with space and
exploration… it all just seems so fascinating and so much potential not only
for economic development, but even to understand who we are in the context of
what is or may be around us.

~~~
furyofantares
Why can't you?

~~~
cinquemb
I'm on a less than traditional path right now in life, and I'm not sure who I
would even reach out to that would be in a position to listen and give me a
chance. But I'm trying, but probably not in the most direct way… and I guess
pg said it best himself: "If you want to take on a problem as big as the ones
I've discussed, don't make a direct frontal attack on it"

------
richtr
While we are looking at reasons why this crash happened it may be worthwhile
to consider Malcolm Gladwell's suggestion in his book 'Outliers' that Korean
cultural legacy, where the High Power Distance ratio between bosses (the
pilot) and their underlings (such as the co-pilot) were responsible for a
series of Korean Air crashes in the 1990s.

"In addition to weather and pilot fatigue, he blames those crashes on crew
members whose cultural legacy made them too deferential to communicate clearly
that the plane was about to crash"

[http://blogs.wsj.com/middleseat/2008/12/04/malcolm-
gladwell-...](http://blogs.wsj.com/middleseat/2008/12/04/malcolm-gladwell-on-
culture-cockpit-communication-and-plane-crashes/)

~~~
markdown
Asian and Middle-eastern airlines have a huge number of expat pilots.

Let's please let race and culture be speculations of last resort.

~~~
richtr
Absolutely right. I was bringing to the attention of the HN community a series
of Korean airline crashes that occurred in the 1990s that can be directly
attributed to this factor [1].

For the record, there are a number of countries worldwide that exhibit the
same restricted cultural legacy. For example, there is also a High Power
Distance ratio in a number Latin American and African countries [2]. See, for
example, details of the crash of Colombian Avianca Flight 52 [3].

Whether this is a factor _in this particular incident_ is of course for the
authorities to decide. Considering the provenance of this airline as being
from a high power distance ratio country I felt this information might be
relevant or at least of interest to others.

[1]
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_Air_incidents_and_accid...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_Air_incidents_and_accidents#1990s)

[2]
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hofstede's_cultural_dimensions...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hofstede's_cultural_dimensions_theory#Differences_between_cultures_on_the_values_dimensions)

[3]
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avianca_Flight_52#Cause_and_in...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avianca_Flight_52#Cause_and_investigation)

------
martingordon
Tweet/photo from someone who was on the plane:
[https://twitter.com/Eunner/status/353592664526028801](https://twitter.com/Eunner/status/353592664526028801)

------
clarkmoody
Reference photo of the plane, for comparison:
[http://www.airliners.net/photo/Asiana-
Airlines/Boeing-777-28...](http://www.airliners.net/photo/Asiana-
Airlines/Boeing-777-28E-ER/2258365/L/)

------
mittermayr
Isn't it fascinating, how everyone is still exiting with their bags in hand?
In all that chaos, I would probably just freak out and run. But apparently, a
lot of them were picking up their bags before leaving the plane. Crazy. Glad
so many got out though.

~~~
VladRussian2
many of these people are foreigners, ie. visas, passport, cash/cards, etc...
It is night and day difference between having your passport+visa available for
immigration control and the alternative.

~~~
eshvk
My ex once asked me what I would miss the most if my house burnt down. I
immediately said it would be the documents. I would probably worry about this
even after I got an American passport.

------
josscrowcroft
Does this really need to be on HN? Just because it's in SFO?

Everyone will already have heard about this on, I don't know, _any_ other news
channel

~~~
yuliyp
260 people thought yes, so it's up and staying there for a while

~~~
hyperbovine
It never ceases to amaze me the number of people who just don't understand how
a site like this works.

------
mililani
Ugh...my wife is deathly afraid of flying. She is in Canada now and flying
back to SFO next week. I hope she doesn't hear about this.

~~~
AndyKelley
Point out that the fact that this is newsworthy underscores how rare of an
occurrence it is.

~~~
LaGrange
My friend with flight anxiety actually got it from researching airplane
safety. While they did learn about probabilities n'all, they also learned
about way too many details, after which every single sound seems like the
oscillating electron pump failure on Molvania flight 52317 where nobody
survived the spontaneous atmosphere exit. It's not exactly rational, it's your
silly brain suddenly deciding the specific probability of gruesome death went
from epsilon to 99%, and anxiety going through the roof.

Solution: sleeping pills, apparently, or generally anti-anxiety and good
contact with flight staff (thus ability to find "safe feeling" seats). In the
specific case.

~~~
jarfcl
I would recommend trying private airplane lessons (on a calm day) Being in
control of an airplane helps a lot, and that feeling may transfer to
commercial flights.

~~~
saraid216
I suspect this is what makes people feel that a car is safer: they themselves
are in control, and can believe that they'd miraculously dodge any crashes
through skill and luck.

I don't know if that sense of control is transferable, though; paranoid
backseat drivers are still a thing.

------
nashequilibrium
It seems like everyone may be fine, i pray that they all are!
[https://path.com/p/1lwrZb](https://path.com/p/1lwrZb)

------
starpilot
If it turns out it was a mechanical failure, and not pilot error we should
credit them for a successful crash landing.

~~~
justin66
Is there a pilot error that can account for the tail ripping off that plane?

~~~
starpilot
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tailstrike](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tailstrike)

Eyewitness, standard caveats apply:

> “The tail was too low. Instead of coming in flat it was coming in at a
> 45-degree angle, with the tail far too low,”

[http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/07/06/19323541-boeing-7...](http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/07/06/19323541-boeing-777-crashes-
while-landing-at-san-francisco-airport?lite)

~~~
justin66
Thank you.

No kidding about witness reports. At least one news report has claimed that
the plane flipped over, and people are just throwing the word "cartwheel"
around.

------
shanev
Korea's other major airline, Korean Air, has the 5th worst safety record among
international airlines [1]. In that case, cultural issues was the problem:
[http://blogs.wsj.com/middleseat/2008/12/04/malcolm-
gladwell-...](http://blogs.wsj.com/middleseat/2008/12/04/malcolm-gladwell-on-
culture-cockpit-communication-and-plane-crashes/). Wonder if there's any
correlation here, but obviously it's too soon to tell.

[1]
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_Air_incidents_and_accide...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_Air_incidents_and_accidents)

------
bmmayer1
Audio from the air traffic control tower:
[https://www.dropbox.com/s/04qqum874iz4ijr/KSFO-
Tower-18%3A22...](https://www.dropbox.com/s/04qqum874iz4ijr/KSFO-
Tower-18%3A22Z.mp3)

------
Patrick_Devine
The flight path into SFO goes right over my house in Palo Alto. It's funny, I
was wondering why there had been no planes flying overhead today, but hadn't
realized what had happened until I saw this post.

I hope everyone is OK.

------
gdonelli
Instagram:
[http://instagram.com/p/bb0mk0OK84/](http://instagram.com/p/bb0mk0OK84/)

------
rdl
2 confirmed fatalities, and 60 people still unaccounted for, according to the
SF fire chief in a press conference just now.

------
bhickey
I'm hearing more air traffic overhead than usual. I bet there are going to be
a lot of diversions to SJC and OAK.

[http://flightaware.com/live/airport/KSFO](http://flightaware.com/live/airport/KSFO)

------
sixQuarks
I would think that SFO would have a video stream of all plane landings and
takeoffs. In fact, it would be dumb if ALL airports didn't have this
considering how cheap it is to install.

Does anyone know anything about this?

~~~
mwilcox
There's no doubt they'd have footage, but they'd be stupid to release it to
the media while an investigation is being undertaken.

------
ddoolin
I was supposed to be flying into SFO this morning from Seoul, though not on
that flight (would've been AA flight 26). Suffice to say I had a surprisingly
large number of people asking if I was OK.

------
CoachRufus87
KSFO Tower Stream -
[http://www.liveatc.net/flisten.php?mount=ksfo_twr&icao=ksfo](http://www.liveatc.net/flisten.php?mount=ksfo_twr&icao=ksfo)

~~~
jnsaff2
And the Fire Rescue frequency:
[http://www.broadcastify.com/listen/feed/6336/web](http://www.broadcastify.com/listen/feed/6336/web)

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spullara
It is ridiculous that a post so factually inaccurate is still the first post.
A real failure of the HN comment voting mechanism.

------
mgadams3
Some crazy geo based Instagram photos if you search for SFO and click near the
crash site Http://Instahood.meteor.com

------
gt565k
roughly 60 unaccounted for live coverage at
[http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/live](http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/live)

next news conference at 5:30 Pacific time, 8:30 EST

------
nickpinkston
Damn - I was just on OZ214 back in October coming back from Seoul...

------
frozenport
Is this a case for or against automatic airplane control?

~~~
agilebyte
Free flight was supposed to have happened already. But there are obstacles.

As for ATCs if you do not make use of a skill frequently, you atrophy. When
you are suddenly thrown in the middle of an emergency, you perform badly. We
can't have "mall cops" watching computers doing air traffic control.

People do not like automation that much either. Consider the fact that
underground trains have drivers even though technically they are not needed.

And then there are the technical aspects...

So I do not think that this particular crash would bring much new to the
table.

~~~
lgeek
> Consider the fact that underground trains have drivers even though
> technically they are not needed.

The London DLR[0] has been automated since it was opened in '87\. It travels
on the surface too.

[0]
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Docklands_Light_Railway](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Docklands_Light_Railway)

~~~
agilebyte
Ah well done, is it possible that this is because the contract is to a private
company?

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lesslaw
Why is this HN relevant ?

~~~
k-mcgrady
Relevant for several reasons. The main one probably being that it's an airport
a lot of HN members probably use.

Also submission guidelines:
[http://ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html](http://ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html)

~~~
biot
It seems to me this is a disaster they'd cover on TV news (thus off-topic) and
it doesn't gratify my intellectual curiosity (thus not on-topic). Little
different than a jackknifed semi on the highway that a lot of HN members
probably use.

Now a technical analysis of the factors leading to the crash would very much
be intellectually gratifying and I look forward to seeing that posted on HN.

