
Anna Wiener on her book “Uncanny Valley” - andrewl
https://www.theguardian.com/books/2020/jan/06/anna-wiener-uncanny-valley-silicon-technology-political-surveillance
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russler23
Essay from n+1 that led to the book: [https://nplusonemag.com/issue-25/on-the-
fringe/uncanny-valle...](https://nplusonemag.com/issue-25/on-the-
fringe/uncanny-valley/)

(As literary magazine names go, “n+1” is pretty relatable haha)

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BoiledCabbage
Really incredible writing. I can absolutely see why this turned into a book.

Also the self reflection of being in the industry is notable.

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anongraddebt
It's also semi-unnerving for what it portends regarding the possibility of
deep rot in our political economy. Yes, we've seen treatments like this
before. Yes, the author is probably missing the mark a bit (or missing it even
more if you're an optimist or realist or whatever). But still.

I recently read a number of historical treatments of the late gilded age and
the roaring twenties, as well as some notable treatments of 20th century
American history that partially covered that era, or provided additional
insight into it (e.g. "The Glory and The Dream").

There are two strong impressions of that era that jump out from the historical
literature. They are something like: "where are the adults?" and "business
activity at full-speed, moving nowhere at all".

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ChrisMarshallNY
It's interesting. She sounds like a pro writer. I wonder if her four years
were really research for a planned book. That kind of thing is very common. If
so, it's paid off. She's hot news, right now. Being exec producer on a movie
before the book is even out, is sort of...Silicon Valley.

My own perspective is kinda weird, and I don't pretend to be an expert in the
culture.

I started programming in 1983, with machine code, and I've been doing this
stuff a very long time. As I look around at folks in the industry, I see that
it is a _very_ long time, indeed. There's not many people with the length of
time in the industry I have (which is not necessarily something that has been
beneficial to me).

I spent most of my career at a top-shelf Japanese corporation. It was a
frustrating, but also awesome, experience that has almost no analogue at all
with Silicon Valley culture. It was basically a "silo."

After leaving that company a couple of years ago, I have been acclimating to a
vastly changed landscape. It's been rather eye-opening.

The one thing that has struck me the most, is that money seems to have become
rather corrosive, while also energizing. It powers a lot of growth, innovation
and energy, but also brings with it an almost complete moral vacuum. The
Japanese corporation had many flaws, but I was impressed by their focus on
teamwork and almost insanely high ethical standards (It was a very "old-
fashioned" company). I regularly worked (and argued) with some of the most
brilliant scientists and engineers in the world.

I like the energy, and I think some of the tools and techniques that have
developed are really nice, but I have been rather taken aback by the manner in
which our culture is expressed, these days. It's very different from the
rather "scrappy" and hopeful way we thought about things back when.

I'm figuring out how to navigate the new world. I need to learn how to work in
the fast-paced, cutthroat culture, while holding to my ethical compass, and my
workflow.

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6gvONxR4sf7o
>She sounds like a pro writer. I wonder if her four years were really research
for a planned book.

That makes it sound rather nefarious. Rather than the experience motivating a
book, it reduces it to a muckraker looking for drama. Non-fiction p-hacking.
This is a big accusation dressed up as idle speculation, and it's motivated by
nothing other than the fact that she's really good that this? I'm saddened to
see this sitting up here as the top comment.

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ChrisMarshallNY
Sigh. No nefarious intent meant. I suspect that it started off as genuine
employment, but it wouldn't surprise me at all if things changed. I have known
a number of folks like that.

Personally, I like them, and I completely support this. It's far better than
writing from an ivory tower.

In fact, I find it rather interesting that you assign nefarious intent to me.

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6gvONxR4sf7o
Nah, I'm not assigning you nefarious intent ("sigh" but i could find it rather
interesting that you perceive that I am, if that's how we're doing this now).
I'm saying that it would be less innocent of _her_ to go in with the intent of
collecting material, which makes your idle speculation potentially damaging.

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ChrisMarshallNY
Not at all. I think this is just an example of one of those "differences in
culture" that I was mentioning.

We seem to have a "combat psyche" in our communications, these days, where we
start off from a critical PoV, and degenerate from there; always looking for
wrongs and weaknesses.

I see this a lot, possibly because I don't hide my age, and may be perceived
as "ok boomer." It could also be that I simply come across in a rather
"starchy" fashion. That's deliberate. If you knew me personally, you might
(possibly) have a different view, as I might, of you.

No big deal. I'm getting my comeuppance. I used to be a rather..."pithy"
troll, in the UseNet days. I tend to overcompensate for that, these days, and
probably come across as "stuffy."

I just don't ever want to go back into that cesspit again. That's a big reason
that I stick my personal brand on all my work and interactions on the Web.

I want to be held to account for what I say. If I say something that offends
you, you know where to find me (look at my HN account page).

With that said, you actually have a good point. I did not mean it that way,
but it's easy to see why it was interpreted that way. I screwed up how I wrote
it.

However, just because someone misinterprets my intent, does not make their
interpretation correct, even if I screwed up the way I wrote it, and
encouraged that interpretation.

I'll see if I still have time to edit it, and maybe correct it.

 _EDIT:_ Nope. Too late.

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irq11
Whomever changed the headline should change it to something that accurately
reflects the content, like it was before.

Nobody who doesn’t already know Anna Weiner or Uncanny Valley would understand
the meaning of the headline.

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dang
I changed the headline because the site guidelines call for titles to be
changed when they're baity, as "the explosive memoir exposing Silicon Valley"
is.

That doesn't mean I changed it to anything optimal—I'm at an event this
morning and doing moderatory things on breaks, so everything is hastier than
normal. If anyone can suggest a better title—that means more accurate and
neutral, preferably using representative language from the article—we can
happily change it again.

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jagged-chisel
"Anna Wiener, and her book 'Uncanny Valley'"

comma grammar at your discretion

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Wowfunhappy
I like this, but I would change "and" to "on", since it's an interview.

"Anna Wiener on her book 'Uncanny Valley'"

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dang
We'll use that above. Thanks!

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jagged-chisel
Bit of context since the title needs improvement:

Anna Wiener, a former GitHub employee, authors a book titled "Uncanny Valley"
about "Unregulated surveillance, ruthless bosses, sexual harassment..." in
Silicon Valley.

Also, from TFA: "in January 2018, Universal Pictures optioned film rights; the
screenplay is now in its initial development stages and Wiener is executive
producer."

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ollieglass
Anna Wiener will be talking at some events in SF, NY and other places soon
[https://twitter.com/annawiener/status/1205176302149484545](https://twitter.com/annawiener/status/1205176302149484545)

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Zenst
Is Silicon Valley represented solely by startups these days?

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duxup
Perspective is a problem even on HN.

You have the folks who only think of FANG as far as anything tech / coding
practices goes.... or only think of their greenfield startup as how things are
done.

Or that everything is some ultra deep back end computer science project ...
and they bring those points of view to everything (that isn't necessarily bad
or good).

Granted, all that variety is nice, but I suspect a lot of the grass roots
coding world just isn't quite what we see on HN.

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blfr
This common criticism misses the fact that FANG, and greenfield startups, and
even HN, set the tone for much of the tech industry.

It is very likely that these grass root coders are or will be in the coming
years using the very tools, methodologies, and even business practices devised
in the Valley.

~~~
duxup
They certainly do those things.

I think they also are a bit of a rabbit hole / and plenty of their tone never
reaches the wider world while they chase new and shiny things.

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ppod
>To illustrate this point she highlights public goods or services that are
increasingly privatised, like for-profit coding boot camps, which are marketed
as an investment or a substitute for a four-year university degree. “The tech
industry is trying to provide solutions to crises that they didn’t necessarily
create, but that they are now exacerbating.

This is a good example of how lines of thought like the author's that purport
to be democratic socialist are actually committed to maintaining the
institutions that entrench existing inequalities in cultural, social (and of
course, financial) capital.

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TazeTSchnitzel
What's socialist about VC-backed “bootcamps”?

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blfr
Maybe the writeup doesn't do book justice but it all sounds like boiler plate
views journalists have on SV with no real insight. Mike Judge probably doesn't
have to worry about any competition even after the series ended.

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bellme8947
I gave up on SV (the show) when the only female character I saw after several
episodes was a hot assistant. I don’t care what her character arc turned out
to be, that’s a bad look. Hopefully, a show based on a female former insider’s
experience will offer something beyond that.

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Galaxeblaffer
Why is it a bad look ? If you'd actually watch the show they have many female
characters that are not hot assistants and they even touch on the subject
directly later on. It's kind of hard for me to fathom how that particular
aspect can make someone give up on a satire TV-show

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Pigo
It's so aggravating going to these news sites. It's almost as bad as the days
of search bars installed in your browser. I'm not on the biggest screen in the
world, but I can't even see the title of the article.
[https://i.imgur.com/UYT7qpN.png](https://i.imgur.com/UYT7qpN.png)

I've been to plenty of other sites just as bad too. It instantly kills my
desire find the article and read it.

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muglug
If more people paid for journalism, sites like The Guardian’s wouldn’t have to
have those banners.

To turn it around: what journalism have you paid for recently?

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Pigo
I actually am willing to pay for journalism, but it becomes a constant
research project to find out what source isn't on a biased agenda crusade. Any
recommendations on pure journalism source I should check out?

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muglug
There has never been such a thing as "bias-free" journalism. We all have
biases, and so do journalists and their editors.

If you're willing to pay for journalism, find a newspaper – any newspaper –
and buy a subscription. I assume from your posts that you're in America, and
politically right-of-centre. What about the Wall Street Journal? It broke the
Theranos story and many others, and employs a raft of very good journalists
doing important work.

~~~
Pigo
The wsj does seem to not cater as much to opinion pieces or clickbait titles.
I guess that's what I was asking. I get plenty of opinions and editorials for
free these days, I don't want to pay for that even if I agree with them. I
miss the outlets that seemed to focus on straight up news.

We had a local paper in my area, The Western Star, that ran for 206 years. It
was the last source that I was really dedicated to, because I cared a lot more
about local.

RIP Western Star
[https://ohiomemory.org/digital/collection/p16007coll84](https://ohiomemory.org/digital/collection/p16007coll84)

~~~
muglug
Remember that for a paper like the WSJ or New York Times, opinions/editorials
consume a tiny fraction of the budget: an editorial on Theranos might cost the
newspaper $500, but the series of articles that eventually led to the downfall
of the Theranos might easily cost 100 times that.

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commandlinefan
> left her job at the software development platform GitHub

What is it about GitHub in particular that attracts these activists?

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GaryNumanVevo
If by activist, you mean an excellent writer providing an accurate reflection,
that anyone working the bay area the past 10 years can relate to?

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commandlinefan
The headline says "I want this book to be politically useful". Sounds pretty
activist-y to me.

