
My offer to Google Reader - aaronbrethorst
http://fury.com/2011/11/my-offer-to-google-reader/
======
confusedreader
Maybe I'm missing something, but I don't really understand the huge community
backlash to the Reader rework. I spend hours in reader every day, and it
wasn't until they added in G+ that it actually became easy to share.The
addition made it so I could share within a community I was already involved in
rather then a few people in some disconnected Reader community. From my
perspective they actually removed the useless and unnecessary functions that
made the old reader impossible to use to actually share content. I see it as a
good first step, and when G+ actually has a solid API to build upon, they can
evolve Reader to use it.

Also, rabble rabble rabble too much white space rabble rabble rabble. I tried
some of the community created userscripts to see if the "UI improvements"
people were making actually helped and in the large part they don't as the
people writing them don't seem to understand UI design.

~~~
Jamiecon
Normally I'm the person who makes this type of comment. I'm not a fan of
resistance to change, or contrariness in general - especially the particularly
annoying and overly dramatic Internet Blogger brands.

However for me the crucial missing feature is being able to view and comment
on your friends' shared items within Reader.

I'm completely OK with Google requiring me to have a Google+ account, and see
the sense in the merging of the two 'social networks'. I'm also fine with my
shares appearing on Google+. I'm happy to configure a Circle to handle my
shares.

But there's no way for me to read the items that my friends who are Google
Reader users have shared _within_ Reader, as either individual or merged RSS
feeds. This is something I used to be able to do, and now I can't - with no
replacement.

That's why the backlash is justified in this case.

PS - Google you could make me happy just by having a 'Friends shared items'
menu item which aggregates Google+ shares from Reader. That's all it would
take.

I'll have fond memories of pressing 'Shift + S', C, and typing a message to a
small group of mates for a while though. Those were the days!

~~~
ImprovedSilence
You, you just put my thoughts and frustrations into words, thank you. I'm also
usually very open to change and what have you, but I despise the new reader.
Exactly because I like to be in reader, and see what my friends posted from
reader. I don't want it mixed with the rest of my social life, I don't want it
mixed with FB like status updates, I just want to see what people are sharing
in Reader. It's like I had my own "community" in reader, a small but special
subset of people really in the "know". Yeahyeah, that's a circle, I know, but
I went to reader to read what they shared, then I read my own, and shared. The
'dialog' was more circular, if that makes any sense. That, and my Reader
slants heavily on the 'images' and artsy side of things, it was almost like a
micro tumblr that only friends saw, but unlike tumblr, it's not recycled
stuff, we are all pulling from different places, I followed a guy from
finance, a dude that loved astronomy, and chick in advertising, a guy in tech,
a girl into silly comics, and it was all right there, im my reader. It was
perfect.

------
magicalist
I'm a long time, heavy user of Reader, but as a disclaimer: my usage consists
of the letters j, k, m, and v, so I'll admit that I don't care at all about
the lost social features, and my short cuts and usage patterns remain
unchanged.

This article seems no different than any other of the reader articles
submitted in the last few days (especially the one by the _other_ former
googler that worked on reader).

If his offer were serious because he really really cared about the product, he
would have sent an email.

If his offer were serious because he really really cared about other users, he
would have posted some user scripts (which lots of others have already done).

~~~
wyclif
Don't forget the "f" key. Even more frequently used under the new design.

~~~
ajryan
(fullscreen for those who are wondering - removes most of the wasteland of
whitespace up top)

------
ianterrell
Dear God in Heaven please let them take him up on it. Now that I'm a few days
into the new redesign my workflow has become 1. Read RSS feeds. 2. Research
RSS feed readers.

~~~
ChuckMcM
Me too, I am definitely in the market for a new RSS reader now.

~~~
rmccue
What are you looking for in a reader? I develop one called Lilina, which aims
to be pluggable and themeable, so I'd love to know what sort of things I
should be focusing on.

(If you'd like to check it out, <http://getlilina.org/> )

~~~
kasbah
I like it! It is nice and simple. I hope you keep it that way. I think it will
be replacing my Google Reader. Two features that would make it perfect for me:

\- Get rid of the sidebar completely and just allow to navigate through feeds
with j and k keys.

\- Ability to save posts for later.

------
Swizec
For me the only problem with the new Reader is that too much space is wasted
on the header thing and controls at the top. Before the redesign my articles
would come up to almost the top of the browser window, now the top is
uncomfortably low on my screen.

I love everything else from the redesign, it's cleaner and generally takes up
less space but the design should be more about the content and less about
Reader.

~~~
bitliner
I have made a stupid bookmarklet to hide the 140px of header that i don't
usually use. I have called this GoReader:
<http://www.searcheeze.com/it/p/free.musik/bookmarklets>

------
microcentury
It really is astonishing how much bile and vitriol can be caused by a UI
change. I guess it's a subset of the general dislike of change most people
have. And it's also amazing how absolutely certain some people are that their
own view is the right one.

I'm not a fan of the new UI yet, but I suspect in a few weeks I will have
forgotten what the old one was like.

~~~
timwiseman
Perhaps part of it is that it is a reminder of lack of control of cloud based
software? With most traditional software, if I dislike the new version I can
continue using the old. With cloud based software, including just about all
web based programs, when there is a new version my choices are to use the new
version or switch to something else entirely (and if the product has any form
of effective lock in, the second may not really be an option).

People like the feeling of being in control, and a change they did not expect
and cannot undo undermines that feeling.

------
porterhaney
I miss most the confined, small but important social network I had within
G.reader. I wish, in addition to a better UX the follow/subscribe to others
function was imported into the circles concept and reintegrated into G.reader.

------
cavalcade
Wow this is a bit naive and egotistical. I HATE the new google reader but to
think that it takes ONE man outside of Google to fix their product is
downright silly. The redesign was made in the context of Google's near-future
plans to ignore that is ridiculous. A more constructive move is to provide a
short checklist of things to re-consider or build/recommend a competing
product. Its not like Google cant improve it more soon to find a good middle-
ground.

~~~
dylangs1030
Figure it this way: instead of Kevin Fox being pretentious, he's making a
public statement. Could he have sent Google a professional email? Yes (and I
suspect he did, actually). More importantly, he is making a public statement
as an ex-Googler, and thus as an authority on Google engineering, that
sympathizes with the negative feedback from the user base. If the users are
not sending a powerful enough message, here is an ex-employee (who left on
good terms, as far as we know, and was very good at what he did) giving a
personal declaration to the company. That it is public shows his confidence,
and that he feels (correctly) that many are dissatisfied with the recent
change. And from the perspective of a large company like Google, this is not
just some uninformed group griping for no reason, this is a real issue. Kevin
Fox isn't attempting to be arrogant, he's giving legitimacy to an issue that
may otherwise be overlooked in a classic case of a large company missing the
demands of its user base.

~~~
kfury
Thank you for this comment. I really appreciate it.

------
djhworld
Publicly deriding the changes (that a lot of people have put a lot of work
into) and then saying "Hey, pay me, I could do better!" seems a little
arrogant to me.

From Google's perspective I wouldn't rehire this guy.

------
west1737
I was pretty excited about Google moving sharing to Google+ as I like Google+
and I think making it easy to share will be crucial to success.

That being said, I hate the new Google Reader. I used it primarily as sharing
tool, and the new sharing makes that more difficult. I think two fixes would
make this better:

1) Being able to share easily with different circles. While I might be okay
sharing publicly something interesting, there are plenty of less-than-
appropriate funny articles that I only want to share with a few friends. This
is one of the strengths of Google+, and it'd be great if Reader could take
advantage of this.

2) Being able to see shared articles from other people. I understand they want
to increase traffic to Google+, but this was always a great feature of Reader.
In effect, each friend that used reader became their own feed. It'd be great
to still have this feature and even though you're decreasing traffic to
plus.google.com, you'd be increasing the overall use of Google+

~~~
abraham
Re 1: You can choose which circle to share to in the share dialog. It is just
like creating a normal post on the G+ homepage.

------
laserDinosaur
All I will say about the redesign is: Jesus christ so much WHITE. My eyes
BURN. BUUUURN.

------
dorian-graph
Problem? Perhaps for this fellow and some others. They might might not be
aware there are those who don't care for the social side of Google Reader and
use it as a place to keep RSS feeds in sync.

~~~
kfury
Actually, I only made light use of Reader's social features. Aside from their
absence (which I do think is a shame) the visual changes to the more
newsreader aspects of Reader severely impact the product, and are a big part
of what I want to repair.

------
joebadmo
Fantastic, constructive, mostly positive response to a somewhat frightening
problem. I hope Google takes him up on it.

------
taitems
I hate to be that guy, but you need to put your line-height where your mouth
is.

.entry_content needs to be 1.5em at the least.

------
jacoblyles
The new Google Docs was just as bad, but at least they gave us the option of
using the classic design.

------
devnetfx
Currently I have to use "#12C" to make links blue so that I can actually read
the posts! Reader UI is not consistent in that both G+ and Google uses some
blue for the links and heading where as reader just uses black.

------
gord
Why not just launch a startup and build a superb reader that solves the
problem and looks nice?

Wouldn't it be better to have the freedom to implement your own version of
what the ultimate Reader is, especially in newer tech [ websockets, node.js,
realtime updates, drag to rearrange widgets .. whatever ]

Id love someone to make a nice reader [and a nice mail groups] web app, Id
enjoy working on these myself. It must be more efficient to build these things
outside of Google, as a startup.

An RSS reader with nice UI, realtime update, location sensitivity, smart
filters, and unobtrusive social features .. you had me at RSS :]

~~~
brlewis
That might be too much like what he just did:
[http://blog.friendfeed.com/2008/01/another-new-
friendfeeder....](http://blog.friendfeed.com/2008/01/another-new-
friendfeeder.html)

(They sold to Facebook for $50MM)

------
adrianwaj
My only tip would be to make standard this plugin, make it look right, and
have it remember its settings on a feed-per-feed basis:
[https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/khbjahpecnkenngkid...](https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/khbjahpecnkenngkidhioicnfpakihgo)
(Super Full Feeds)

note - the Chrome Web Store has also taken a usability hit, in my view.
YouTube was done fairly well, and I think that team should be moved across to
do other products, or train other teams about what and how to do things.

------
obtino
If anyone's interested in an alternative - here's one:
<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1834305>

~~~
johnx123-up
Direct link <http://www.newsblur.com/>

------
watmough
Someone at Google needs to get a Goddamn clue and look at a UI design manual.

What the hell are they thinking?

Has Larry let the MBAs get out of control? There's clearly something wrong, as
no sensible, actual user of these products surely could believe that this mess
is an improvement?

This is on a par with the del.icio.us mess.

~~~
johnx123-up
It may not be MBAs, but Ex-Yahoo! guys
<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3143054>

~~~
watmough
:) Yeah, I'll take a look at your link, but the new styles are surely
reminiscent of the awful YUI, which much as I love Crockford, I'd have to
write off as crap, due to its convoluted programming model and wretched bad
appearance and inefficiency. (Example: compare the stock charts in Yahoo with
Google's - slow and very flickery)

Here's a concrete example in the form of a comparison between old Gmail and
new GMail.

Page headers for old and new Gmail compared: <http://imgur.com/a/X4gdp>

------
LVB
_I will put my current projects on hold to ensure that Google Reader keeps its
place as the premier news reader, and raises the bar of what a social
newsreader can be._

That's very nice, but I think 'git checkout -f PRE_POOCH_SCREW' would probably
work just as well.

------
GiraffeNecktie
I wouldn't hire any "designer" who center aligns (or right aligns or right
justifies) his body text. Especially not for an application that is focused on
reading.

------
udfalkso
I've resurrected <http://FeedEachOther.com> if anyone is looking for a nice,
social feed reading experience.

------
rsanchez1
Is it really so bad? I would never even have noticed: I use Google Reader
exclusively through client apps on my phone and tablet. I would never have
noticed because these apps function today the same they did last week, last
month, even last year. Pick a client app you like and stick with it. If it's
made by a good developer the app will keep up with API changes. It could only
break if Google decides it doesn't want to allow unofficial access to the
Reader API anymore and doesn't provide an official API.

------
ThaddeusQuay2
[http://kirbybits.wordpress.com/2011/10/21/wherein-i-try-
to-e...](http://kirbybits.wordpress.com/2011/10/21/wherein-i-try-to-explain-
why-google-reader-is-the-best-social-network-created-so-far) (Wherein I try to
explain why Google Reader is the best social network created so far)

