

PR Nightmare: Charging passengers of Hudson plane crash a cancellation fee - vaksel
http://consumerist.com/5134413/spirit-airlines-tries-to-charge-cancellation-fees-on-passengers-it-put-on-flight-1549

======
tptacek
There's a chapter in "The Knack" about this: beware of rules you create in
your company, because even though they're well-intentioned, they rob your
frontline support staff of the ability to exercise common sense. The book's
example is an auto dealership repair shop not allowing a $1MM+ customer to
test drive his just-repaired car before paying; this is another case in point.

A more personal example: AT&T won't sell me FTTN DSL service, which they offer
in my neighborhood and in fact push aggressively, because I have "conflicting"
DSL service. I'm happy to cancel my old service, but they won't schedule an
install date (3+ weeks out) until I've actually canceled it; their order entry
screens won't even enable the "Next" button until they've verified that I
have. Dumb rule!

Probably, every time you see some crazy customer service story like this, the
culprit is an ill-considered rule pushed down on service staff.

~~~
jeroen
Good support staff ignore the rules in situations like these, and good
managers let them.

~~~
potatolicious
Good support staff ignore the rules. Somebody dumber figures out that rules
are being circumvented, and before you know it it's exactly as the parent
poster described: lock out the "Next" button until all rules are followed!

[edit] Might as well relate an anecdote:

When I got my MacBook Pro about 2 years ago I had it built with some custom
options (glossy screen and bigger HDD, FYI), which made it a "custom order" in
Apple's system. It took a little longer to ship, but anyways.

So over Xmas the MBP bit the dust, and I had to get a replacement from Apple.
They offered up a new unibody MacBook Pro, and since the stock model matched
the specs on my custom-built one, I was to get a stock, new, MBP.

This was going to take about a week, they told me. I had an Apple Store some
20 minutes away from my home, and I asked if I could just bring in my broken
laptop and walk home with a new one. Less hassle for everyone. Nope. According
to my support rep, this is allowed if my machine was a standard config to
begin with, but their system would not allow a replacement order to be placed
if the system was custom!

Rules sometimes suck.

------
pj
This is totally unfair. Things like this just happen. Information gets mixed
up, rules don't get changed fast enough, beauracracies don't work fast enough.

This same scenario has happened countless times in the past.

This incident was a tragedy for everyone involved. For the pilots and crew,
the passengers and all of their friends and family -- many of whom were other
spirit employees.

Cut them some slack.

Running a big company like that and reacting to a plane crash, which -- come
on now, it doesn't happen often and look, they got everyone out. Everyone from
Spirit /on/ the plane did exactly what they were trained to do perfectly and
it saved lives.

And now, someone at the front line does what they were trained to do perfectly
and you raise a fuss.

~~~
dcurtis
I would agree with you if this was about any other company. Spirit is widely
considered the worst airline in the industry for many reasons.

A couple years ago, the CEO accidentally replied all to a customer complaint
when he meant to forward it to a customer care manager. All it said was "get
this bitchy asshole off my hands."

It does not surprise me that a company run by a guy with that philosophy would
make such an error.

------
mrtron
Have you ever used Spirit?

They are hilariously low budget. Being a cheap man I used their service from
Detroit->Vegas (it was about 100$ round trip). They have one of the lowest
level of services of any airline in north america (but thats why the prices
are so cheap).

They also are the only airline I have been on that offered bulk discounts for
beers.

~~~
Xichekolas
Can you elaborate on how 'hilarious' the low-budgetry is? I have flown with
RyanAir many a time, and found it to be rather charming despite the low-budget
nature.

~~~
mrtron
They have newish planes that are already horribly shabby (torn seats, worn
carpets). They don't clean the plane between flights. There is very little
legroom. They provide zero food/beverages on even 5+ hour flights without a
large cost. They overbook. They charge for every piece of luggage. No video
screens or audio system in the plane. Very little carry-on space.

I have heard great things about RyanAir, they just tack on the charges after
you take off for every service.

~~~
gaius
A friend of mine recently got a #1 offer from Ryanair, which turned out to be
#80 once taxes and fees where added on, and that's before even paying #5 for a
sandwich on-board. It would have been cheaper to fly BA, and much more
pleasant.

------
noonespecial
All the arguments are good. Automated system, stuff happens, out of their
control, etc. The result is still absurd.

I need to cancel my return trip because the plane you put me on _crashed_. A
_human being_ looked at a computer screen and said, "I'm sorry sir, there's a
$90 cancellation fee for not returning on the scheduled flight."

But, but it _crashed_. I had to _swim_ to a ferry boat in the frikkin'
_Hudson_!

If I really felt like I had to say that to this man on the phone, I'd just
hang it up, get my stuff and walk out. The cognitive dissonance generated by
that level of absurdity would seriously threaten my grip on sanity. If I was
lucky, I'd make it before collapsing into a quivering heap, reciting Dr. Suess
books endlessly...

------
michaelneale
Oh come on - this is just automated systems gone nuts. Happens all the time -
people are used to it but it releases all sorts of stimulants in the brain to
get upset and worked over something.

~~~
vaksel
the post isn't about getting upset, its about something, the actual company
has no real control over, causing a huge PR problem.

~~~
michaelneale
My comment was (mis) directed at the general public and their reaction to
this.

Yes, its probably silly software and rules behind it. Just like angry tax
office bills for $0 etc ;)

------
AndrewWarner
Anyone who bitches about this is NEVER going to be a good entrepreneur.

Good entrepreneurs know that they've screwed up in the past and they WILL
screw up again, so they don't throw the first stone.

It's the same way that Lance Armstrong won't laugh at a cyclist who falls off
his bike on the Tour de France.

------
mattmcknight
Why don't you get anything when the airline cancels your flight and puts you
on another airline? On the way home from my business trips, I used to
volunteer to get bumped when planes were overbooked- I always got something
out of it.

~~~
Dilpil
If the airlines compensated people for that sort of thing, they would have to
charge more for the tickets in the first place. At which point, another player
would come in, not compensate people, and offer lower air fares. Most
customers buy airline tickets based on price, and would choose the airline
which did not offer cancellation compensation. Thus, the "nice" airline is
undercut out of the marketplace.

~~~
jfornear
They _do_ compensate people for that. I was just on an overbooked flight that
was offering volunteers, who would drop out, $400+ in credit and a hotel room
if they couldn't be placed on another flight that night.

EDIT: I was referring to the overbooking policy, not cancellation :)

~~~
ojbyrne
Canceling is different from overbooking. Generally now if a flight is canceled
due to weather or whatever, they don't offer compensation.

~~~
chris11
That's been my experience. This winter the weather has been horrible in the
northwest, and so several of my flights have been cancelled. And the airlines
wouldn't give me anything since it was weather related. Whereas recently I
volunteered to skip an overbooked flight, and ended up getting a free
roundtrip ticket, meal vouchers, and a ticket on the next flight out.

