
Chase did a bad thing, so we did a good thing - zbruhnke
https://www.chaseoptout.com/
======
rkhassen
For me the red flag is them willing to send this letter to Chase, via snail
mail at no charge to you. Nobody gives something for nothing. So I thought,
why would they do this? after reading through the form, at the bottom, it
looks like one of the companies, who sponsors this site, "Radvocate" seems
like they are in the "class action" lawsuit business.
[https://myradvocate.com/](https://myradvocate.com/)

This site is about having enough potential clients are able to sue Chase at
some point in the future, whenever a class action lawsuit comes up - and heck,
they even will have a customer list and a relationship with you from sending
this "free" letter for you in the past.

Usually in those kinds of cases, the end recipient gets very little - perhaps
some subscription to a ID protection service or a few bucks but the firm who
runs the class action makes a lot.

On the one hand, maybe it helps keep them honest (they cite Wells Fargo) so
its good to be able to. But clearly there is some vested interest here on the
part of Radvocate.

~~~
mjkornbl
Radvocate here: We do have a vested interest. Over time, we want to be the
place you come when you have a dispute against a big company because we'll
fight hard for you.

We're excited to partner on this project partly because it is very "on brand"
for us from that perspective — we can help people, get our name out there, and
shine light on an issue that matters to us. We're a business, but we're also
all in this business (instead of some other business) because we want to make
the system fairer for consumers.

ETA: Also, to correct one misapprehension: we are not in the class action
business. We actually help consumers pursue individual arbitrations. We think
more people should know that even if their contract doesn't let them sue, they
actually do have a way to assert their power through arbitration. If anything,
we'll have more customers for our current business if no one opts out of their
Chase clause.

~~~
rkhassen
Good points and I appreciate what you write here.

And an interesting business concept - to help consumers pursue individual
arbitrations. That could be really cool especially against large corporations
when they are abusive. What do you charge as people go through their
individual arbitration process/ how does the profit model work?

I really have mixed feelings about the legal system - on

Also, Radvocate, wondering if you can address the PII concerns other's have
raised, as that is a very big deal.

~~~
mjkornbl
Hi, thanks for the response.

On the business model – we charge a commission currently set at 15% of
whatever compensation you recover. Hopefully that's from a negotiated
settlement with the company before a full arbitration process is necessary.
(More details at bottom). We currently process against 20+ cable / ISP /
wireless companies.

Re: PII, first I want to make clear that I can't speak with legal standing
about the terms & conditions as written. That said, if someone checks the
(optional) box giving us permission to do so, all we plan to store is an
e-mail address (plus an anonymized token?). We at Radvocate don't have current
plans to use that e-mail address, but it is true that it likely would be most
useful for the purpose of putting together a future class action against
Chase. We'd only partner on that with firms we trust and who will make
respectful use of the information.

We think this could be of interest and beneficial to someone opting out of
arbitration. To repeat a point on this thread, it's another way to take action
against Chase. Additionally, while we all have experience with a class action
of being mailed a gift card three years later, if someone does make direct
contact with a lawyer on the lawsuit, that may put them in a different
position (though I'm not a lawyer).

More on our process: The way arbitration works is you usually have to send the
company a notice letter (which we automate) 30-60 days before filing. When you
do that a lot of companies suddenly want to negotiate, instead of ignoring
your dispute, and we provide data and process guidance to help you negotiate
most effectively. If negotiation fails then we automate escalating your claim
to arbitration by filing with the American Arbitration Association, and we
continue to provide guidance as the case moves through their system, including
preparation for the hearing (which will typically happen by phone).

~~~
gricardo99
I don't think you've come close to adequately addressing the PII issue here.
The information you're collecting, if it ends up in the wrong hands, could
lead to some nightmarish identity theft.

Surely you're aware of massive and prevalent data breaches[1]. You're
collecting sensitive information to help people, but not providing any
convincing bonafides on information security, let alone an actual plan for how
sensitive information goes in your web form, then (many technical/logistical
steps later) ends up in Chase's P.O. box, without leaking out to some
unintended party. I don't think anyone should feel comfortable with "all we
plan to store is an e-mail address"

1 - [https://haveibeenpwned.com/](https://haveibeenpwned.com/)

~~~
solarkraft
How would you do any of this without collecting that data? They're lawyers,
how else would you deal in a client's name in the legal system?

------
neilv
Assuming that you're completely legit and utterly competent, there's still a
big security problem here: _it 's encouraging people to put their PII and CC
info into arbitrary Web sites_.

On top of that, it's further identifying them as both Chase CC holders and
receptive to scams, qualifying them as leads for further phishing/scamming.

~~~
zbruhnke
Unfortunately this is the problem that Chase created ... we give users a way
to download a form letter instead, but were just trying to make it as easy as
possible for customers to opt out if they would like to do so

~~~
lozenge
You're teaching users it's OK to give out their account information
"sometimes". Which is much less secure than "never".

~~~
ralph84
I give out my credit card number hundreds of times per year. Credit cards
wouldn't be very useful if you never gave them out.

~~~
WoahNoun
An ecommerce site has a merchant agreement with a payment processor to comply
with PCI DSS. This does not. It is in no way similar.

~~~
zbruhnke
FYI we are complying with PCI DSS when you use this site - you can read
details in the FAQ

~~~
snazz
Do we have proof of that? I think the fact that we're taking your word for
everything so far is the source of the discomfort here.

~~~
toomuchtodo
Sort of humorous comment, as PCI DSS is self assessment and attestation of
compliance. If OP states they’ve met their burden, that’s all that’s required
at their scale.

~~~
gowld
PCI DSS assessments are signed by natural persons, not arbitrary HTML content.

~~~
toomuchtodo
Natural persons who are rarely, if ever, pursued when breaches occur.

------
cdubzzz
Under the "What is the actual language in the agreement sent by Chase?" FAQ
item, it says --

"Can I (the customer) reject this agreement to arbitrate?

Yes. You have the right to reject this agreement to arbitrate if you notify us
no later than 8/9/2019\. You must do so in writing by stating that you reject
this agreement to arbitrate and include your name, account number, address and
_personal signature_. Your notice must be mailed to us at P.O. Box 15298,
Wilmington, DE 19850-5298. Rejection notices sent to any other address, or
sent by electronic mail or communicated orally, will not be accepted or
effective." (emphasis mine)

How does this service handle the "personal signature" requirement?

~~~
mjkornbl
We are relying on legal opinions that the site fully complies with the ESIGN
Act. That act makes electronic signatures on par with physical signatures.
(Disclosure = I'm not a lawyer)
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_Signatures_in_Globa...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_Signatures_in_Global_and_National_Commerce_Act)

~~~
mehrdadn
Just a layman here but that seems like a misinterpretation of the statute? The
idea of the statute seems to be that the _government_ will not void, nullify,
or refuse to enforce the terms of an electronic contract. It does _not_ state
that in any given contract, _private parties_ must accept the terms signed in
any form whatsoever -- that's still left as something for those people to
agree on, and Chase very clearly spelled out that that's not valid for the
contract. So the "reason" for the invalidity of a contract wouldn't be that it
has an electronic signature, but that one of the parties simply didn't follow
the terms it set for validity (whatever they were -- in this case, that they
be personally signed, and mailed by the actual account holder). So I'm very
curious how legal opinions interpret the statute otherwise, since I don't see
any hint that it was intended to be interpreted as allowing one of the parties
to change the signing terms to include electronic signatures.

~~~
DannyBee
Non-layman here, no it's not an misinterpretation of the statute.

It makes electronic signatures as good as regular ones in interstate commerce.
Period. Full stop. Caselaw supports this in spades.

The only meaningful case otherwise is where statutes _explicitly_ require in-
writing signatures (a good example is copyright transfers).

There is an intra-state version of this is UETA.

~~~
mehrdadn
Could I ask which part of this "case law supports in spades"? I imagine you're
not claiming they have to accept emails (?) and otherwise I don't even see how
you could e-sign this to begin with; you have to write the letter that ends up
in their P.O. Box somehow, so you have to make the statement yourself and put
your personal signature on paper (via ink or toner or otherwise is not the
point) and mail it to them. But here you don't even write the letter or sign
the letter yourself in any sense of the word. Like if a judge asked you "you
need to have written and personally signed this letter for it to be valid; did
you do that?" would you just give a straight unqualified "yes" and believe
that would fly?

~~~
jachee
"Yes. I _personally_ filled out an electronic signature for my intent to opt
out, Your Honor."

~~~
mehrdadn
"You did not answer my question" is what I would expect after that.

~~~
DannyBee
The answer to your question would be yes. Your electronic signature, printed
out and transformed to a different medium, is still a valid signature.

The whole point of the act is to say that clicking a button on a computer to
make a signature that is valid. That it later gets transmitted in some other
form is irrelevant.

If i create and print out a docusigned document and mail it, it is still a
personally written and signed document.

It is no different if I fill out a form that makes a document for me and click
a button to sign it.

If this is confusing, answer my reply above and I'll try to start seeing where
the confusion is

------
kileywm
I just want to point out that, as a user, opting out of this portion of
Chase's agreement _could_ result in Chase deciding to close your account. Not
advocating what course of action to take, but merely pointing out that there
is risk associated with this action.

That being said, I have read through the email from Chase, and there is
nothing that explicitly states that they will close it as a result of the user
opting out of arbitration.

Does anyone have experience with similar situations with Chase or other banks
and agreement opt-outs that they could share?

~~~
supernova87a
Yes, just to emphasize this post -- I have read elsewhere that your declining
these terms could lead to your account(s) being closed immediately. What makes
anyone think they wouldn't do that?

~~~
lozenge
Disagreeing with the terms could close your account, but this section is
severable (can be disagreed with separately).

Generally, opt-out is added to reduce the risk that courts will throw out the
arbitration clause as unconscionable (unfair). Companies know that most people
won't opt out, and any class action brought by somebody who opts out will only
apply to other customers who opted out- cutting damages by 99%+.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consumer_arbitration#Unconscio...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consumer_arbitration#Unconscionability_as_a_defense)

------
ziroshima
I was surprised when I received the letter explaining this from Chase. I made
a mental note to write them a letter and opt-out, which I had immediately
forgotten about until now. Thanks to the creators of the site.

~~~
zbruhnke
Thanks! We're hoping it helps a few people spur their memory and get this
done! :)

------
mjkornbl
Here from myradvocate.com, which is partnering on this project with Zach / HM
Bradley. We're psyched for this to go live.

We track news about arbitration pretty closely, and I've been surprised and
impressed by how much this Chase issue has "broken through." I no joke
overheard a random convo about it on BART on Sunday.

------
kevin_b_er
Aside from the issue of trust, the site does a terrible job of explaining how
bad arbitration is.

The arbiter is permitted the following: * To make an arbitrary judgement
outside the scope of the agreement. * The arbiter is not required to follow
any law but the arbitration act. They are permitted a manifest disregard for
the law. * The arbiter is not required to be fair or impartial. They aren't a
judge. * The arbiter may be blacklisted by companies if they rule against the
corporation. The companies know who rules against them. * The arbitrations are
secret. You may research how the arbiter acted in the past. The company knows,
though. You just don't.

To engage in a corporate controlled mandatory binding arbitration is to leave
the rule of law and enter into a dystopia where even the courts of law are
privatized. Consumer protection laws? Gone. State consumer laws? Gone.

------
asimjalis
How secure is this website? What prevents a phishing site from pretending to
be an opt-out site?

~~~
zbruhnke
Hey there,

Maker of the site here! Our servers don't touch any of this data, it goes
straight to Very Good Security and lives in a PCI compliant vault ... We
ourselves are building a new kind of bank so we take security very seriously
and are not phishing.

Happy to talk through in more details but the FAQs do a pretty good job of
that too!

~~~
snug
So how do you send the mail if you never get the data?

~~~
heavymark
As they mentioned checkout the FAQ where it outlines that process under the
aptly named, "How does this site work?" and they also offer a template for you
to mail yourself if your prefer.

------
strangattractor
Do you really want to give a site run by someone you don't know vital info and
a account number. Probably legit but ...

~~~
zbruhnke
totally fine if you don't! we also allow you to just download the form so you
can fill it out and mail it yourself

~~~
macspoofing
You shouldn't even be collecting this info.

~~~
unethical_ban
Perhaps they should discuss that in an FAQ, but let's face it, they are
literally saying "We know you're out of the loop probably, and we know you are
too lazy to write the letter yourself, so we'll do it for you".

Other than "user training", if it's legitimate, it is not unethical.

------
neilv
What did your legal counsel say about liability here? For example, what
happens if a cardholder who used your opt-out service has a dispute with
Chase, and Chase claims they did not receive the opt-out?

What has counsel advised about any risk of federal authorities investigating
you as possible CC phishing operation (perhaps initiated by monitoring for
bank-phishing-like domain name)? (Obviously you have some defense, but the
best case might cost you money and misery.)

Also, do you expect to keep the domain name past an ICANN dispute?

------
PunksATawnyFill
I caught these assholes at Chase doing this and demanded a refund of fees,
which of course they provided. They're just testing your resolve, every day:

"JPMorgan agreed to pay $110 million to settle a class-action lawsuit over its
procedures for charging customers overdraft fees. It was among more than a
dozen big banks sued by their customers for reordering debits from their
accounts to maximize the possibility that the accounts would become overdrawn,
which would generate more fees."

------
mleonhard
I think I'll just close my Chase credit card account.

------
snug
Wait, you want me to put my credit card number and my personal info?

~~~
zbruhnke
We also give you the ability to just download the form and mail it yourself!

Unfortunately Chase forces customers to mail a letter with this information on
it so there's not much we can do

~~~
jasonmp85
> there's not much we can do

Open-source a script I can run locally to generate PDFs with the information
your form uses.

~~~
jjeaff
Geez, or just send a letter.

------
linuxhansl
Is Chase's practice itself legal? Forcing mailing a physical letter that must
contain a lot of personal identifying information...?

That's a really shady move and I'll take note to avoid any business with Chase
in the future.

------
giancarlostoro
I know everyones talking about how sketchy the online forms are. But my
question is what sketchy practices is Chase involved in that they need this to
be part of their agreement. Secondly and its been noted here before why are
such clauses even legal? I really hope we can take the concept to court and
murder it completely.

~~~
techsupporter
> Secondly and its been noted here before why are such clauses even legal?

It's legal because of a staggeringly overbroad reading of the Federal
Arbitration Act that the Supreme Court has said is fine and Congress has
refused to reign in.

> I really hope we can take the concept to court and murder it completely.

Many will enter, zero will win. Virtually every attempt at limiting the
Federal Arbitration Act's scope in legal proceedings has been turned down by
the Supreme Court.

* [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AT%26T_Mobility_LLC_v._Concepc...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AT%26T_Mobility_LLC_v._Concepcion)

* [https://www.scotusblog.com/case-files/cases/american-express...](https://www.scotusblog.com/case-files/cases/american-express-co-v-italian-colors-restaurant/)

* [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epic_Systems_Corp._v._Lewis](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epic_Systems_Corp._v._Lewis)

* [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Preston_v._Ferrer](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Preston_v._Ferrer)

------
dbpatterson
Link to the "full privacy policy" 404s, which is not a good thing, given you
are asking people to enter their full names, addresses, CC numbers.

~~~
zbruhnke
Hi, site creator here - link is here and is not 404'ing for me

[https://www.chaseoptout.com/PrivacyPolicy.pdf](https://www.chaseoptout.com/PrivacyPolicy.pdf)
\- let me know if you mean something else?

------
llaappqq
Question: how do we prove in the court in the future that we've sent them the
rejection letter?

~~~
m-ee
Certified mail with a return receipt

~~~
mkay581
Sending certified mail only can prove that something was sent. Doesn't
necessarily mean that the mail you sent contained an opt-out notice.

------
fooey
Isn't the likely outcome of opting out that Chase just closes your account?

~~~
kevin_b_er
So few will opt out, Chase will get what it wants: No customers can make a
dispute with chase in a court of law. They cannot band together for gross
abuse. They will have achieved removing courts of law from the equation and
replacing them with secret privatized courts that do not have to have any
regard for the rule of law.

------
news_to_me
This is great!

What would be really cool is to see this extended to many types of opt-out-by-
email things — I know it's a pretty widely-used dark pattern by e.g.
newspapers and spam mail companies.

------
adzm
Wow, Chase is acting like they are a gym or something by requiring a snail-
mail letter to opt-out.

------
gortok
One red flag for me is that for Chase, your Credit Card number is your account
number. So we're going to give third parties our credit card number... That's
safe.

~~~
sneak
I give third parties my credit card number a half-dozen times per day. It’s
not secret.

------
jld
Does this only apply to Chase credit cards? Or also to other Chase services?

~~~
zbruhnke
It's mostly cards they changed TOS on but I'd have to advise you to check your
emails to see if it applies to you

------
gene91
Can Chase take adverse actions against customers that opt out? For example,
denying future account applications, closing existing accounts, exclusion from
future promotions, etc.

------
AngeloAnolin
It mentioned that the opt-out requires a specimen signature (from the FAQ as
well _What do I need to do to opt-out?_ ). How would you be able to ensure
that the opt-out process for the customer will be valid / accepted by Chase if
there's no actual human signature?

From Chase's perspective, wouldn't they be asking for more details especially
if their business hinges on retaining people into their business as much as
they can?

Update: Additional wording

~~~
mjkornbl
There are laws around what counts as a signature. A company doesn't really get
to set that unilaterally:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_Signatures_in_Globa...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electronic_Signatures_in_Global_and_National_Commerce_Act)

------
ycombonator
Are you collecting email addresses of your future customers for marketing
purposes ? Whats the guarantee that you don't mine the customer address
information you collect for your new bank venture
[http://pdf.secdatabase.com/92/0001772417-19-000001.pdf](http://pdf.secdatabase.com/92/0001772417-19-000001.pdf)

------
vmurthy
For those of you who do have stamps, the PDF version of the letter is here :
[https://www.chaseoptout.com/ChaseOptOut.pdf](https://www.chaseoptout.com/ChaseOptOut.pdf)

Mailing address: Chase Customer Service P.O. Box 15298 Wilmington, DE
19850-5298

P.S. The website gave the info. Don't sue me :-)

------
axaxs
Thanks, I'd been meaning to do this but couldn't be arsed.

This seems to be, at least in part, advertising for your bank. I clicked on
it, but could get no real information about it. Would be curious for more info
about it, as I'm generally tired of dealing with bad online presence.

------
makeramen
Want to make the same thing for SoFi? They require the same within 60 days
after opening and account:
[https://www.sofi.com/b/policy/arbitration](https://www.sofi.com/b/policy/arbitration)

------
indigodaddy
Any advantages or downsides to opting out of Chase’s arbitration if Chase sues
you for credit non-payment? I read the sites FAQs (only mentioned class action
and if one or more people sue Chase) and appears that situation is likely not
relevant for this opt-out?

------
miguelmota
Cool service. A concern is that scammers can use variations of the domain
(chaseoptout.co optoutchase.com etc) and use adwords to get on top of search
results to trick people and steal personal identifying information if this
thing gets popular enough.

~~~
la_barba
Well, its the same concern with any eCommerce website that takes your CC, or
really, just about any website that has a form input field. Few people in my
office click on pretty much any link random people email them. I've even told
friends/co-workers to reset their PW because they've been breached based on
HIBP, but people never seem to care unless they personally get affected. I've
given up..

------
keehun
I read somewhere that Chase will close out your account if you opt out. Is
this true?

~~~
mjkornbl
Doesn't seem like it:
[https://twitter.com/ChaseSupport/status/1135961244760977409](https://twitter.com/ChaseSupport/status/1135961244760977409)

------
burntsushi
Yup, I just happened to notice this by chance when the email came. I was
really surprised to see this. Fortunately, I do have stamps lying around, so
I've already mailed out a letter rejecting the agreement to arbitrate.

------
kccqzy
I have a feeling that Chase will send a letter to the operator of this website
using some excuse like unauthorized use of the Chase trademark or something.

~~~
mjkornbl
Interesting point. Here from Radvocate (partner on this product). We currently
help consumers take action under their contracts with 20+ wireless / cable /
ISP brands. We are up and running fine.

Corporations do have a stake in contractual and legal systems continuing to
function, as well as in not calling down negative news coverage on themselves.

------
JumpCrisscross
Side note, arbitration is cheaper than litigating in court. The only thing
opting out affords consumers is easier access to class action suits. If you
think you might bring an individual claim against Chase, arbitration is
cheaper and a more level playing field (no countersuit strategy) than state or
federal court.

TL; DR arbitration is not the corporate-controller enigma many seem to think
it is. You trade off real benefits by opting out of Chase's mutual binding
arbitration terms.

Most people should opt out, but not everyone. (Nobody should opt out
unthinkingly.)

------
pbk1
Very nice! I was actually in the process of building the exact same thing but
charging users for the cost of mail and server/API expenses.

------
olalonde
I have nothing better to say than clever marketing for the two sponsors and
nice website design.

------
boh
Give a random website my name, address, email and account number?? Yes please!

~~~
collinmanderson
They have a direct link to the letter here:

[https://www.chaseoptout.com/ChaseOptOut.pdf](https://www.chaseoptout.com/ChaseOptOut.pdf)

------
patagonia
JCrew credit card requires a post card mailed to opt out of arbitration

------
gowld
HN title is contentless and doesn't even match the linked site.

------
the_arun
Does this use Lob under the hood for print & mailing?

------
j_shi
ps can’t click last button on iphone se via iOS hn app

------
GrumpyNl
Nice initiative, but who pays the bill, like the stamps etc?

~~~
zbruhnke
We're covering that for now because we thought it was the right thing to do

~~~
sagres
That was easy. Thank you for creating this!

------
basicplus2
SMAAS

Snail Mail As A Service

------
420basteit
From one media manipulator to another: when you pay the premium price for a
long-standing hacker news account, it's usually more convincing to let people
find the comment history for themselves.

~~~
Nition
Looks suspicious enough anyway if users check their history, considering that
user posted for the first time in a year just to make that comment.

~~~
mirimir
True. But they've never posted very frequently. So maybe this is just an
important issue for them.

Also, are baseless allegations OK here?

~~~
Nition
Well, personally my guess is that it's actually a legitimate user since the
username is based on their real name, and they've linked to their Twitter
account in the past. It'd be pretty silly to sell an account so closely linked
to your identity. Unless it was hacked and sold without the user's knowledge I
guess.

~~~
solarkraft
Plus it'd be really stupid for the buyer to mention it. How about stopping
this thread derailment?

------
rdxm
ok, so this is being provided by a new/competing bank and a marketing agency.
What could possibly go wrong?

A quick read of privacy policy should dissuade anyone form putting information
into this system.

A+ for guerilla marketing

F- for anything related to privacy, etc...

------
yhoneycomb
This seems sketchy as fuck - your website, I mean

Might as well leave a box for the SSN while you're at it

~~~
zbruhnke
Again, I wish we did not have to do this but this is what Chase is forcing
customers to do.

We also give customers a way to just download the form without giving us the
info but then of course we can't mail it for them ... we were just trying to
make this easier for customers to opt out with the shitty options we were
given

~~~
kelnos
Can you make the link for the download more obvious and less dark-pattern-y? I
found it only after scouring the page (somehow the text under the form didn't
catch my eye easily), and then it popped up a modal that unnecessarily asks
for my email address. I closed it, annoyed, just barely noticing the small-
font link to download without entering my email address.

If you actually care about privacy and claim to not be using or selling our
information for anything, why don't you make it easier to avoid giving
information entirely?

Having said that, thank you for creating this. I had left Chase's email about
the terms change in my inbox, starred, so I'd remember to take care of this,
but not having to formulate my own letter makes things so much easier.

~~~
la_barba
>If you actually care about privacy and claim to not be using or selling our
information for anything, why don't you make it easier to avoid giving
information entirely?

Hmm, I don't see it that way. It seems like people are learning about the
chase issue for the first time through this website. Ideally you'd have
another website/article informing you about the issue, and then a link to this
website for sending the letter. And so it would be weird to go to a website
designed to send a letter, and be told that you can also not send the letter
through the website...

------
Xunxi
There's often a sinister motivation for such goodwill. Most often than not.

Are you just going to discard all the data afterwards or is it just a ploy to
build a mailing list for your bank?

~~~
jdhn
I'm betting the latter. If you click on the HM Bradley logo it takes you to
their homepage where it says that they're building a bank for the "next
hundred years". I'll hand it to them, this is a pretty good way of collecting
lots of email addresses.

------
rajacombinator
Very suspicious. Why should I opt out? Why did some companies/individuals
think this was worth spending time building and promoting this service and
spending potentially millions of dollars in print & postage to mail letters?

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mjkornbl
Fact: If millions of people were to take us up on this, we (Radvocate and our
friends at HM Bradley) would get tangible value from the publicity around it.

I'd love for us to have that problem.

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mjkornbl
As for whether _you_ should opt out, I honestly don't know and that is your
decision to make.

