
Show HN: Coffee Chat – Trade your expertise - lw
https://www.coffeechat.app
======
mkl
Interesting idea, though it seems like I've seen several services like this
appear and apparently not go anywhere. How are you going to achieve critical
mass?

Some feedback:

1\. "Our knowledge is the cheapest thing to us" seems way off; my knowledge is
the most expensive hard-won thing I have. That doesn't mean I don't want to
share it, but "cheap" implies low value and seems like the wrong word.

2\. The focus on coffee is a bit strange. I don't drink coffee, or meet for
"coffee" or anything.

3\. The three characters after "Matching" in the animated demo just show up as
missing-character boxes for me (Android Chrome).

4\. I can't tell if it's audio-only on Android. If you included a shared
whiteboard that would make many things, e.g. maths, art, etc. way more doable,
especially with picture/screenshot import.

5\. The quotation marks in the quote bubbles are all over the place. The two
that have them are both inconsistent and incorrect. I think you don't need
them, but if you want them, in English they should be “...” and look like
66...99.

~~~
taneq
> 1\. "Our knowledge is the cheapest thing to us" seems way off

Maybe something more like "Our knowledge costs us nothing to share"?

~~~
lw
Also nice – I slightly altered that wording since, what do you think?

~~~
taneq
"readily available to us" I like it.

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blueadept111
I think "Trade your experience" would be more valuable than "trade your
expertise". If I need expert knowledge of a well-defined domain, there's
always Google. But if I need advice from someone who's had a particular
experience, there's no easy way to find answers.

For example, I'd like to talk to someone who's self-published a book and
overcome the many small challenges associated with that journey. Would this
person identify themselves as an "expert" in overcoming any of those
particular obstacles? Probably not.

And similarly, I have a lot of experiential knowledge to share with others,
that doesn't necessarily fit under the umbrella of a single "expert" label. My
valuable experiential knowledge covers dozens of niche areas.

I'm not sure how a service could effectively act as a match maker for that
type of experiential knowledge, though.

------
Waterluvian
I'm scared off by the voice chat part. I'm happy to take part in a short text
chat with someone who wants to dive into a topic I'm an expert at and wants
some guidance on where to begin or help on a specific sub-topic. Just... no
voice chat please.

~~~
PacifyFish
Huh this surprises me. For me, text chat is worse than voice in every way.

* Less engaging (eg other person can be browsing HN while we chat with zero risk of me realizing)

* Less expressive communication

* Greater anonymity, and thus more difficulty establishing trust

I guess you’re coming at it from the perspective of an expert and I the person
seeking expertise. But the whole value of the platform isn’t in giving away
your expertise for free, it’s giving it away in exchange for the expertise of
someone who can really help you!

IMO it makes the most sense as a user to optimize for a better expert-seeker
experience. The benefit you derive from a super helpful conversation with an
expert is likely to far outweigh the slight annoyance of voice chat when
you’re the expert.

~~~
arendtio
Well, it sounds like you are no introvert ;-)

No seriously, many people are quite uncomfortable when they have to use their
voice for communication with foreigners.

I don't know how Coffee Chat handles the whole 'language' problem (native vs.
English), but for most non-native English speakers, having to speak English is
a higher barrier than having to write it.

So your points are valid too (and I could add that some people can't type as
fast as they want). Therefore it would be a good idea to have 'voice' as the
primary means of communication and 'text' as an alternative.

~~~
sgt
Aside from that, it usually takes less energy to type, and you can do other
things while replying (or in the gaps between). Voice is more of a dedicated
channel, and it's not necessarily more productive. With text you're given a
chance to think about what you're about to send before hitting the submit
button. I think there needs to be a balance here. Voice has its benefits, but
it's not always the way to go.

~~~
Waterluvian
These are the reasons for me. I'm fairly charismatic and well spoken. I just
don't like it for this kind of thing because it doesn't give me little extra
time to formulate the best response I can.

------
huangc10
Cool idea! I personally find talking on the phone obstrusive at times. What
are you guys thoughts about just chatting via a built-in messaging system?

Also as a future goal, it might be possible to leverage large communities on
Reddit where a lot of users want to share their knowledge?

~~~
nukleosome
i think they already have chat, as being shown on the app store pages
([https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=app.coffeechat](https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=app.coffeechat)
, [https://itunes.apple.com/de/app/coffee-chat-
app/id1416814458...](https://itunes.apple.com/de/app/coffee-chat-
app/id1416814458?l=en&mt=8))

~~~
lw
Technically, yes

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proszkinasenne2
Very cool! Keeping fingers crossed.

Speaking to people with domain expertise willing to use their time to help you
is an invaluable experience. A short 10-15 minutes talk can save hours or days
or researching, experiments, proving yourself wrong.

Good luck!

PS. Tried to reach you at info@coffeechat.app, but got:

554 5.7.1 <info@coffeechat.app>: Recipient address rejected: this address does
not exist

~~~
lw
Hey! Thank you for pointing that out! We have now added info@ as an address.
:)

~~~
acct1771
No catchall?

------
beobab
Seems very similar to Scott Adams' Whenhub Interface.

[http://blog.dilbert.com/2018/03/26/say-hello-to-the-
whenhub-...](http://blog.dilbert.com/2018/03/26/say-hello-to-the-whenhub-
interface-app-and-our-public-ico-ito/)

------
pedro1976
I would love some clarity on how they plan to be sustainable. In the FAQs they
claim "We are currently focused on bringing the best possible service to you,
completely free.", which makes me sad. If they deliver a value they should
charge something.

~~~
menzoic
Free means you're the product

~~~
lw
It doesn't. We will not sell data. Right now we are really focused on the best
product and we will find a fair and sustainable business model when it's
ready.

~~~
Ixio
Right, so free means you are bootstrapped or VC-funded and later on... your
users are the product ?

I can understand not wanting to communicate on a business model that isn't
ready but could you maybe point out some leads other than the usual ads or
data-selling business ?

Or if you don't want to be specific maybe you can point out that you are
definitely against selling user data later on even if it means saving the
company ?

I was happy to find a "How does Coffee Chat make money?" section but it's
content isn't very helpfull if you're a user fearing data collection and adds.

~~~
lw
Sorry, haven't seen this question :-O We will not sell data and we will create
a business model without it. Also, we firmly believe that the GDPR is a great
step forward for humanity and that privacy should be a fundamental human
right. We will build a business model that accounts for that.

~~~
karambahh
I'm all for a product in that space.

I've participated in a number of schemes aiming at sharing expertise in the
past and would be glad to share and get some on your platform but, as others
have stated, I think that to see traction, you'll need to specify a business
model else everyone will be inclined to "if it's free, you're product"
mentality.

I'm not distrusting your current statement of "no data sharing" and, if I may,
"won't do evil" mentality but in this day and age, customers will need a
clearer statement right on the product page for it to be trusted.

A quick and easy alternative would be "Currently in beta and free for all
until December 31, 2018" would probably assuage some fears, with expectation
of a coming bizmo, whatever that would be.

------
notyourday
Please get a native English speaker with an English degree to proof your copy.

FAQ: "It feels kind of strange to speak with people I don’t know. Can't I just
not do this?"

Second sentence is a double negative. It sounds even weirder than it reads.

"We have made this experience sometimes too. But people differ, and we see
that there is a substantial part of society – even across all social groups,
career stages, industries etc – who are happy and willing to help others out."

First sentence sounds icky. 2nd sentence applies a Germanic language structure
to English which fails basic English flow.

------
wozmirek
Frankly speaking I was expecting I could get paid through this. Right now it
seems like giving away my advice for free and you making a profit out of it in
the long run. Or am I wrong?

~~~
lw
You make a profit by getting other people's advice in return. Our business
model is not going to be to sell your data. But of course, despite it's not
the focus right now, we'll have a fair and sustainable one in the long run so
that everyone is happy.

~~~
wozmirek
Hm, what if I don't want to receive advice and just to give it? Advice doesn't
equal advice.

------
pedro1976
I usually appreciate reading about your future plans regarding the product.
Maybe you want to publish your roadmap in public, there was a recent article
[0] that I enjoyed reading elaborating on "Publishing Roadmaps".

[0] [https://blog.inkdrop.info/how-ive-attracted-the-
first-500-pa...](https://blog.inkdrop.info/how-ive-attracted-the-
first-500-paid-users-for-my-saas-that-costs-5-mo-7a5b94b8e820)

~~~
lw
Hm, good idea :)

------
jamestimmins
This is awesome, I've wanted a service like this for a while. I really hope
this takes off.

~~~
lw
We'll do everything we can. :)

------
dulse
Couple thoughts.

1) bug report: your input on describe yourself is set to email, which messes
with my keyboard on my phone. Have that be text input, the other to email as
it is.

2) like the idea, connecting influencers can be relevant for sales referrals,
recruiting, or networking. All seem like good monetization opportunities.

3) it feels tricky to get the balance right between in person vs phone call
contact. Looking forward to seeing how you’re going to handle that.

Good luck!

~~~
lw
Thank you for your thoughts and the bug report – just committed the fix

Agree with 2! Can you elaborate on 3) ?

~~~
dulse
It’s an investment trade off around commitment (in person is better for
connecting and relationship building but is more expensive as a time
investment). If it’s more transactional a phone call is better (eg, quick
question or advice about something specific). If it’s something more
potentially meaningful, in person Coffee makes more sense (eg, if I’m looking
to network with someone or trying to hire them / get them to hire me).

The defaults you set could make a big difference in the user experience. Maybe
every first touch is chat/phone, then move to real world? Dunno if there’s a
right answer but feels like something to be thoughtful about.

------
adminu
> "Wir sind zur Zeit darauf fokussiert, den bestmöglichen Service für dich zu
> entwickeln - komplett kostenlos." (Translates to: Right now free of charge,
> as we develop the best possible service for you)

I wonder what kind of monitarization is planned, connecting people to
companies? To paid experts? Showing ads or selling data?

Does anybody know something about that?

~~~
lw
Not selling data (see other FAQ). Probably the first two (at a later stage).
Currently, Coffee Chat is completely free.

------
GoldenPedro
What level of expertise does one need to be in order to participate?

------
swalsh
A question I'd probably ask the coffee experts, what's the difference between
a Chemex and a Mr Coffee? Seems like it's both just hot water going through a
filter.

~~~
finaliteration
Not totally sure if you’re serious, but I’m basically in love with my Chemex
so I’ll bite.

The principal is the same but there are some differences that affect how the
coffee ends up tasting:

1\. Water temperature control. With a Chemex you boil water in a separate
device and then let it cool only slightly (down to around 205F/96C). With a
Mr. Coffee or similar you don’t have any control over the water temperature,
which can fluctuate quite a bit and often doesn’t get hot enough which can
make the coffee taste bitter.

2\. Degassing. A Mr. Coffee-type machine usually won’t go through the stage of
“degassing” the grounds by slightly soaking them for about 30 seconds, so you
don’t really get the full flavor out of the coffee.

3\. Drip speed/motion. With a Chemex you typically pour the water over fairly
slowly with a spiral in and out motion so that you soak all of the grounds. A
Mr. Coffee just sort of shoots water right into the center of the grounds, so
you end up with really uneven brewing.

I also think there’s something valuable in taking the time to slow down and
focus on the brewing process. It really doesn’t take very long, but it’s a
mindfulness-like experience where you focus on a task and see and enjoy the
results of your work at the end.

------
kornish
Out of interest, what's the eventual revenue model here?

Middleman matchmaking services face some clear challenges to recurring
revenue. Homejoy, for instance, still shut down even after showing impressive
user acquisition numbers because it was cheaper for the cleaner and client to
cut a deal amongst themselves. Uber only works as well as it does because
geographic scarcity and immediate need - traits _relatively_ unique to the
transportation industry.

Very cool concept; hope it works out for you :)

~~~
nukleosome
a sustainable revenue model that i can imagine is something similar linkedin;
2 or 3 classes of monthly or yearly subscriptions to reach out to 2 or 3
different 'tiers' of experts. this way you don't have to worry too much about
transactions outside the platform or locking users in.

and nice work!

~~~
Hippocrates
I can't tell if we're thinking the same thing (unfamiliar with LinkedIn's
model), but I thought maybe over time some users would emerge as domain
experts, and this could be made apparent through some review/karma system. At
some point, you could go to a model where to triage calls to those high-value
experts, you charge a fee. Perhaps a share of that revenue goes to the expert
in demand.

------
tekkk
Interesting idea. I started wondering what kind of experts I'd like to talk
with. Didn't really come up with anything as I feel I could just google it so
why bother people. Hmm ok yeah if I had some specific problem like starting a
company I could definitely use some advice. Or change careers. Or move into
another country. Anyway, great idea. Hope to see it work!

~~~
lw
While you can ask any question on Coffee Chat (everything is acceptable), I
agree!

This is where Coffee Chat helps the most, and it has the potential to help
everyone of us. We constantly worry about some complex problem with no clear
answer – I bet you, even you do. While you can google the complicated problems
and get the answer, you will get contradictory, and generic answers to complex
questions.

Most of us have a small group of people we speak with a lot, and we discuss
those complex problems with those people. But these people naturally have only
few areas of expertise. Connecting you with more expertise to discuss
difficult questions is where coffee chat comes in.

------
maroonblazer
I think this idea has promise.

Shouldn't the "Apply as an expert" really be "What are you expert at and what
would you trade for it?" Otherwise how does the matching happen?

I applied as an expert in marketing and music and I would like to trade that
for software design/development expertise. But the form seems to focus on only
the former, not the latter.

~~~
moccachino
The idea is you help anyone that needs your expertise, and in return you can
chat with anyone that can answer your questions. They will probably not be the
same people.

So you don't need to tell them what you want in return, but at some point they
would need to list all experts they have on file so you can ask to chat with
one.

------
sbfriends
Absolutely nothing renders without JS FYI :( noscript is simple to add, at
least warning users it's required.

------
akrymski
How is this really different to Quora? What use cases do you see this being
used for that are more applicable?

------
konschubert
This could be really powerful. Making this succeed will be all about
maintaining a high standard in the community.

~~~
lw
We agree!

------
ThomPete
I build weekendhacker.net which was a pretty successful community for a while
but is not unfortunately dead.

I learned a lot but ultimately decided to wind it down.

PM me if you want to talk about my key learnings about this space.

------
Dowwie
I also envisioned something along these lines but cant chase every idea that
emerges! :). Good for you to make it happen.

There are many deeply challenging and rewarding projects ahead for you.

------
simonebrunozzi
Nice try; I've seen a few (4? 5?) startups try something like this, and it
always ends up as a dating service, even if it might be called something
different.

Not sure why.

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m3nu
Reminds me of [https://clarity.fm/](https://clarity.fm/) except that you get
paid to do the same thing there.

------
bdibs
Very interesting idea, looks good!

As a side note, on Firefox I'm seeing horizontal and vertical scroll bars on
the numbered steps section.

~~~
lw
Thank you for the hint! We urgently need frontend dev support :)

~~~
Fnoord
The background pictures repeat themselves which is... well, I know they're
greyed out but yeah it just tells me the message: "we are smaller than it
seems". My 2 ct, YMMV.

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__initbrian__
What about those of us who aren't experts :'(

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sonalr
How do i get an invite?

~~~
arendtio
> We urgently need frontend dev support :)

Tell them you are you are a frontend dev ;-)

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haseebab
Very cool!

