
Samsung temporarily halts production of Galaxy Note 7 - soupboy
http://english.yonhapnews.co.kr/business/2016/10/10/33/0502000000AEN20161010004100320F.html
======
newscracker
The incidents involving phones that were sleeping and not having the batteries
being actively charged seem to indicate some major design issue.

To battery experts: Is this a one-off design and/or manufacturing error or are
we reaching some limits to what we can do with current lithium battery
technology with respect to Ah rating, size, weight, quick charging ability,
heat generated with fan-less dissipation, etc.? In other words, is it just a
matter of time that other phone manufacturers would hit such issues too?

~~~
ddeck
This is certainly not the first such case and it's unlikely to be the last. I
recall Sony having numerous recalls related to similar issues.

It's the nature of dense energy storage media to run into problems if the
energy is allowed to be released too quickly, but the characteristics of Li-
ion do make it more conducive to cause these type of incidents. Battery
university has a nice explanation of the typical causes here:

[http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/safety_concerns_w...](http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/safety_concerns_with_li_ion)

Also, "Charge and Catch Fire: A History of Exploding Batteries and Other
Product Recalls":

[https://www.thestreet.com/slideshow/13728952/1/samsung-s-
bat...](https://www.thestreet.com/slideshow/13728952/1/samsung-s-battery-
debacle-and-a-recent-history-of-exploding-batteries-plus-other-infamous-
recalls.html)

~~~
tarancato
>if the energy is allowed to be released too quickly

Wasn't this the problem? That the kernel was drawing too much voltage from the
battery, or something like that I read.

~~~
TheSpiceIsLife
I'm no electronics engineer, but I don't think "drawing too much voltage" is a
thing.

As current goes up, resistance has to go down, so there will be a voltage
_drop_ across the battery terminals.

That's my understanding, someone correct me if I'm wrong, or otherwise help
clear this up?

~~~
dietrichepp
Resistance is a simplification of characteristic curves, which themselves are
simplifications. You can easily get a voltage drop across battery terminals,
you just have to put the battery in series with another battery. This is
dangerous. You could also hook up an active current sink. Again, dangerous.
There is nothing preventing the internal battery resistance from causing the
terminals to go negative except for the simple fact that most equipment we
connect to batteries will stop working before that point is reached (unless
you hook batteries in series—which is why batteries in series must be close to
identical, so they run out at the same time).

~~~
Unklejoe
I just want to point out that batteries are often connected in series in
regular devices.

Many devices where there are two AA batteries (TV remotes, etc...) usually
have the batteries wired in series. They need to do it to get the voltage high
enough for some of the components.

Additionally, many batteries are actually made from multiple smaller batteries
wired in series internally. For example, some 9V batteries are actually just 6
regular 1.5V batteries wired in series.

Of course, in these configurations, they generally discharge at a similar
rate.

------
Unklejoe
What gets me is the fact that they did the recall and produced a new version
of the phone which was supposed to fix the issue, yet now there are reports of
the replacement units doing the same thing.

Seems like they either jumped to conclusions and mis-identified the problem,
or they attempted to fix the problem with a band-aid solution with the hopes
of reducing the probability of failure just enough to make the issue "go
away".

On a more personal note:

I hope this gives other Android phone manufacturers a chance to gain some
market share. Primarily, I want HTC to do well. They seem to be one of the
most friendly when it comes to unlocking the bootloader (you can do it via
their website). I really wanted to get the Galaxy S7, but after finding out
that the versions with the SnapDragon SoC will have locked bootloaders, I
decided not to. In my experience, Samsung's version of Android has never been
that great. Without the ability to flash custom ROMs and remove some of that
useless crap, I just couldn't bring myself to make the purchase.

~~~
erikpukinskis
Probably because the nominal situation isn't "no defects", it's that the
defects are below a certain threshold. They can get a sample below a certain
threshold but it's not a guarantee that the actual full scale production would
be.

It'd be smart to give the tolerances some extra headroom on the second go-
around, but I would guess that in order to get additional certainty on their
sample, they would need to run their testing program for longer while the
inventory is piling up. And I have to imagine with a production the scale of
the Galaxy there are immense pressures to get that inventory moving.

But it sounds like they gambled and lost.

------
throw2016
Samsung has been dragging their feet on this. Their response has lacked
clarity and urgency.

Paradoxially this kind of tepid circumspect response designed to first protect
the brand has a far greater chance of damaging the brand permanently than
coming clean unequivocally and proactively taking full responsiblity.

The second approach you take a loss but live to fight another day, the first
the public begin to harbour doubts about your commitment to safety and your
users and that can cast a long shadow on your future products.

~~~
simonh
I don't think they were trying to protect the brand, they were trying to
protect their bank balance by avoiding recalling, replacing and ultimately
scrapping the product line.

~~~
Cthulhu_
But they already had recalled the model, the first version, which can be
exchanged for what was supposed to be a 'safe' model. Didn't work out for
them.

------
gjolund
Hopefully now people will realize that every battery powered laptop and phone
on an airplane is a potential bomb.

~~~
Shivetya
It will be interesting if any major air carriers decide to ban the brand from
flight.

with regards to your comment the industry should strive to show otherwise and
there should not be any reason to not be able to predict this type of failure
occurring at the device level. there certainly have to be some telltale signs
that are detectable

~~~
gjolund
Im not talking about defects, but malicious tampering.

I may not be able to get a bomb on board, but I sure as shit can short circuit
a laptop battery and start a fire.

~~~
izacus
And then the flight attendant will pull a fire extinguisher from storage,
spray it over your laptop and life will go on.

Seriously, no need to overblow the issue to add more security theater.

------
BinaryIdiot
In my opinion, other than the whole catching-on-fire-thing, the Note 7 was one
of the best, if the the best Android device out today. Least amount of
bloatware on a Samsung yet, they unified the software for the S Pen, the S Pen
is better this time around, and it just looks gorgeous.

I'm not sure what the problem is. Maybe Samsung rushed it, maybe it's a defect
in some supplier made component, etc I have no idea but it does seem rather
unfortunate and kinda sad to see such a nice phone not only be effectively
done but it likely caused a lot of brand damage to Samsung in general (lots of
reports of airline employees saying Samsung Galaxy phones, not just notes, are
not allowed which granted is probably a misunderstanding but the brand impact
is there).

My wife currently has a replaced Note 7 and she absolutely loves it and hates
that she'll probably have to give it up.

------
laurentdc
I wonder why, I mean, it's a battery after all. They've pulled off probably a
hundred other phone designs and they aren't new to the market.

What's particularly wrong with the Note 7 that they can't fix in a PCB or
battery redesign?

~~~
mirekrusin
They are probably going to kill the name and wrap fixed internals in new box
with new name.

~~~
venomsnake
Samsung ISIS edition?

~~~
mirekrusin
Samsung Daesh is the new thing this week, no?

------
johnchristopher
What are the financial consequences for Samsung and its suppliers ?

~~~
JumpCrisscross
Given the political leaders of Korea and financial owners of Samsung are the
same: not much, likely.

------
pawadu
This is so sad. I recently saw a Note 7 in action and after only 2 minutes I
was ready to shell out $700 and buy my first ever Samsung phone.

Anyway, maybe this gives other good Android manufacturers (specially HTC and
Sony) a chance to make a comeback.

------
dcip6s
They really need to do a full recall and refund for all sold Note 7 phones as
well.

~~~
brianwawok
T-Mobile at least has a full recall. Would be surprised if other carriers are
not as well.

------
elcapitan
Are those accidents caused by faulty batteries, or by the way the electronics
make use of them?

