
Lime shuts in 12 markets, lays off around 100 - Deimorz
https://www.axios.com/e-scooter-startup-lime-shuts-in-12-markets-lays-off-around-100-d25d44e4-c0f1-4713-9a89-868f4da40e03.html
======
bransonf
Does anyone actually think this is a profitable market?

Electric scooters are expensive, repair and charging is expensive. It’s a
seasonal business. Vandalism/abuse is fairly common.

In terms of any environmental benefit, I highly suspect more gasoline is being
consumed to collect and distribute scooters than the offset of a few last mile
transports.

I suspect the cost to the consumer would have to double for it to maintain any
profitability, and the demand already sucks.

Why did the VCs value these as billion dollar companies? Desperation?

~~~
holler
Very simple, have you ever rode a scooter? Once I took a ride along the beach
in Southern California, it was immediately obvious, and, I was hooked! It's a
disruptive, perfect combination of technologies, that immediately antiquates
riding a bike for short distances. The main problem is that it's too good, and
people with poor balance, poor judgement, or bad luck, have been in accidents
which ruined it for everyone else.

I could see scooters completely wiping out local ride-share, taxi, and bicycle
shares in many places.

But again, people have been injured and because of that, along with the
excessive inventory that has littered some areas, cities are cracking down and
writing new regulation to curb their use. In the short term they will win and
we might not enjoy their full potential for awhile.

~~~
catalogia
Like three quarters of American men, I'm overweight. I'd never use an electric
scooter because the absolute last thing I need in my life is an excuse to walk
less. I'd wager at least a significant portion of that three quarters probably
have thoughts similar to mine. Of the rest, most probably drive instead (which
for the particularly obese, is probably a lot more comfortable than a
scoooter.)

I see a ton more scooters on the sidewalk than I see people riding them. From
my perspective these scooter companies have greatly overestimated the demand.

~~~
holler
Have you ever used one? I get what you're saying, but as an example: my
girlfriend and I have on multiple occasions, in multiple cities, used scooters
to explore local geographic regions that would otherwise not have been
possible in the same time constraint. We would ride across town, then get off
and walk around for a bit until we decided to hop back on and ride way across
town to another place and do the same thing. So it is possible to still get
the exercise etc, with the benefit of being able to cover more turf than
possible strictly through walking. Of course you could do the same thing with
a bike, but it's more cumbersome and less agile imo.

------
Hasz
This whole model is incredibly, impossibly, flawed.

9/10 times, my net displacement for the day is 0. If my net displacement is
zero, I would prefer to own the medium I'm using to move. Bike, car, scooter
etc. Only exception is stuff with really high capital costs, like planes and
trains, in which case I pay a small fee to avoid owning a railway or airline.

For scooters, there are no high capitals costs; the cost of a scooter is
laughably low. It's sold as a quicker-than-walking, less-hassle-than-a-car
last mile solution, but again, 9/10 of my trips are 0 displacement, so, why
not just buy the scooter outright? Cheaper, safer, faster (I know where it is,
no need to walk to it, etc).

They only way Lime, Bird etc survive is by legislation. Lobby for scooter
licensure, buy up all the licenses, and become the taxi industry (except for
scooters, and you have to drive!)

What an ironic loop.

At this point, the only reason to fund these guys is FOMO.

~~~
the_imp
The whole model of needing to own your own transportation devices is flawed.

9/10 times, I'm moving from one location with many other people in it to
another location with many other people. I would prefer not needing to own any
medium in order to move between them, but instead be able to use a public
service to do so. Bus, tram, metro, citybike, scooter. I'd really rather not
own stuff with really high capital costs, like cars.

At this point, the only reason to own anything more expensive than a bike is
bad city planning and infrastructure.

~~~
Hasz
Ah, but public transit is inherently the slowest option. I have no desire to
make 10 stops before I get where I'm going. I also have zero desire to rent my
modes, as that encourages literally rent seeking behavior.

Either we need to figure out how to drop off and pickup passengers at speed,
or penalize individualized transport that is space inefficient (like cars).
Good luck pursuing the latter in the US; punitive measure seem to work
elsewhere.

I think the way forward is compact private transport, like bikes, scooters,
walking, etc, augmented by a robust mass public transit. Unfortunately, that
mix implies a expensive re-configuring of most American cities.

~~~
robrenaud
> Ah, but public transit is inherently the slowest option.

This isn't true if you are in a dense city with good public transit. This is
currently mid day (3 PM), and it's about 30% faster (21 minutes vs 29 minutes)
to go from my current location in Manhattan to a bar I enjoy hanging out in
Brooklyn via public transit than car, according to Google Maps. It would be
even better around rush hour.

~~~
jtcruthers
There are maybe 2 or 3 cities in the entire United States that are dense
enough with good enough public transportation. The vast majority of the
population cannot relate.

~~~
jgwil2
GP is refuting the idea that public transit is _inherently_ the slowest mode
of transportation by providing an instructive counter-example. If the vast
majority of the population cannot relate, that's a product of policy choices
that favor sparse development in most of the country.

------
jeffnappi
Lime has the worst bikes on the planet - they are complete garbage compared to
the Uber/JUMP bikes (and probably others). The Lime bikes seemed to constantly
be falling apart and were actually pretty terrifying to ride. On the other
hand, the JUMP bikes feel very robust and I feel safe riding them. I would
rather walk half a mile to find a JUMP bike than ride a Lime bike. No wonder
they are failing.

Source: Rode both Lime and Uber JUMP bikes in Seattle (rode a JUMP bike twice
last night)

~~~
jeppebemad
In copenhagen Lime is the most robust (and albeit clunky) of the 5-6 brands
present. It seems they are the same as in your town. Wonder why our experience
differ so much?

~~~
jeffnappi
Maybe because Americans treat the bikes poorly compared to the civilized folks
of Denmark ;)

The JUMP bikes are just better made by a wide margin and seem to handle the
abuse well - [https://www.standard.co.uk/tech/london-electric-bikes-
tested...](https://www.standard.co.uk/tech/london-electric-bikes-tested-uber-
jump-bikes-lime-bikes-a4155026.html)

------
TacticalTable
Of the e-scooter startups I've tried, Lime is my favorite. In my smaller city
(Indianapolis) we just have Bird and Lime, and Bird's restrictions on hours,
locations, and parking make them very difficult to use (They turn themselves
off if they leave their range, and many pieces of downtown are considered 'out
of bounds'). Meanwhile, the Limes are better distributed around the city,
easier to park, and have much more generous boundaries. Bird has the stronger
brand recognition, but that's about it.

I'm surprised that it was warmer climate cities that underperformed in the US,
because I would have expected those to have a much better chance for profit,
as cold winter seasons dramatically reduce scooter usage. Too much
competition?

~~~
asdff
Too much competition, but really the infrastructure is not there in warm
cities in the U.S. They also increased the price so you are more inclined to
take an uber or public transport than spend $6 on a bird ride. Riding on a
pothill filled gutter while cars clip you at 35mph in LA is not ideal. If
there were more bike lanes that were longer than 1 block, these things would
be way more popular. Not sure why these companies aren't advocating for more
bike lanes as it will help their brand.

It also doesn't help that these companies let defective equipment remain in
the network. After grabbing a scooter one day that had zero brakes, discovered
only when I was trying to stop at a red light and not get slaughtered in the
intersection, I now do an inspection of the brake lines and the wheels before
I unlock. For some consumers the state these scooters are in will put them off
entirely.

~~~
bagacrap
As someone who spent 8 years heavily biking around LA, I'm glad I got out of
there before the bike lanes became overrun with motorized drunks.

~~~
asdff
Currently far more overran with motorized uber drivers/delivery/meter
maid/mailmen/police/random pricks using it as free overflow parking. The
drunks prefer driving anyway.

------
nahikoa
The VC funded scooter rental companies don't bear the most significant cost of
scooters, public health. Quality studies outlining the risk and costs are
scarce, but there are some:

[https://www.austintexas.gov/sites/default/files/files/Health...](https://www.austintexas.gov/sites/default/files/files/Health/Epidemiology/APH_Dockless_Electric_Scooter_Study_5-2-19.pdf)

Key points: 15% of scooter riders who seek medical attention have a traumatic
brain injury. This doesn't include those transported by EMS. 63% of injured
riders had ridden an scooter 9 or more times before.

Perhaps e-scooters are safe in some markets, but in many they are a death trap
that the vendors will never have to pay for.

~~~
rory096
Cars kill 37,000 people in the United States each year.

------
hinkley
Leaves 12 markets and lays off 8 people per market?

For a company with a physical product and inventory, 8 people per city seems
like somewhere in the neighborhood of sobriety, possibly verging on stingy.
Not the sort of excess we so often find in a tech company that is experiencing
layoffs.

~~~
cnorthwood
They may also have "independent contractors" to do the work

~~~
roywiggins
The guys who retrieve the scooters for these kinds of companies are
"independent contractors."

[https://www.theverge.com/2019/3/15/18267128/lime-electric-
sc...](https://www.theverge.com/2019/3/15/18267128/lime-electric-scooter-
charging-juicers-harvesting-business)

------
jordank
One factor missing from most analyses of scooter companies are the sheer cost
of insuring scooters long term. Insurance rates are likely based on the
assumption that scooter companies can disclaim against any user damages
(injury, death, etc) but companies can't disclaim against gross negligence and
there are many, many legal actions against Lime and other scooter companies
(disclaimer/source: I'm a plaintiff in one of these actions).

Failure rates are known to be fairly high and accidents are common [1]. I was
on a Lime that had a brake failure and I was pretty badly injured. Lime
themselves have indicated that the failure rate was around .00045%, but that's
still 450 brake failures per million rides [2].

[1] [https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/scooter-
use-...](https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/scooter-use-is-
rising-in-major-cities-so-are-trips-to-the-emergency-
room/2018/09/06/53d6a8d4-abd6-11e8-a8d7-0f63ab8b1370_story.html) [2]
[https://www.li.me/blog/safety-update-
february-2019](https://www.li.me/blog/safety-update-february-2019)

------
ghaff
I do a lot of travel and, anecdotally, there seems to be a huge variation in
popularity of rental scooters by city (even just considering the cities where
one or more companies operate). Wide bike/pedestrian paths are probably one
factor and weather is another. But they seem very popular in some places and
barely used in others for reasons that often aren't immediately obvious, at
least to me.

~~~
jonas21
_> they seem very popular in some places and barely used in others for reasons
that often aren't immediately obvious_

I think a lot of this has to do with regulation. Some cities actively
encouraged scooters and bikes, some took a hands-off approach, and others
banned or restricted them to the level where it was difficult to operate.

You can really see the effect of this in San Diego, which at first welcomed
the bikes and scooters, then reversed course and banned them in a lot of
places [1]. Several of the companies left town after that happened, and you
see a lot fewer bikes and scooters around now. It's still the same city, same
weather, and there are more bike lanes than there were two years ago. The only
thing that changed is the regulation.

[1]
[https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/news/environment/story/...](https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/news/environment/story/2019-10-14/new-
rules-shaping-scooter-use-in-san-diego)

~~~
arrosenberg
I don't remember welcoming them, so much as they proliferated over the course
of a few months. They were so "popular" that they were being left all over the
place to the point where it was widely regarded as hazardous. Companies in
this space need to take more responsibility for the impact on the community
and environment - regulation didn't kill them in San Diego, the companies
themselves did.

------
rdiddly
Can we please just make this (scooters, bikes) public transit?

Not profitable - check

Good for society - check

In need of regulation - check

~~~
asdff
I wish, but corruption and graft has lead LA's metrobikes to cost something
like $2500 each and that program is quickly spiraling out of existence.

Greedy contractors and privatization aside, you need infrastructure for
transit, and for these scooters and bikes that means building bike lanes.
Otherwise, it's no surprise that ridership is declining as they aren't safe on
roads with LA drivers who kill more pedestrians every year. The LA bike lane
network is currently an embarrassment with little political support for
improvement, in fact there are councilmen actively working to remove bike
lanes from their neighborhoods.

~~~
Rebelgecko
>I wish, but corruption and graft has lead LA's metrobikes to cost something
like $2500 each

That doesn't seem too excessive to me. What do you think would be a more
reasonable price for purchasing an electric bike* with a fair degree of
customization and a corresponding maintenance contract?

* IIRC the bikes have integrated NFC readers for your TAP card, built in U-locks, probably GPS, and that sweet sweet Metro paint job.

~~~
asdff
Well they are neither maintained nor electric for the most part

~~~
Rebelgecko
Only the pedal assist ones cost 2500, the non-electric ones (still have
batteries, but just for internal stuff) cost like $1200 each

------
vkou
Is this because you can't make money off short-term scooter rentals (Because
the cost of providing this service is > what customers are willing to pay), or
because other startups ate their lunch?

My wife is seriously considering a scooter (Even a non-electrified one) for
her commute (2-3 days a week, 5 miles) - and I can't see a world where we'd
rent one on the daily, as opposed to owning.

My uninformed guess is:

A problem with the rental model is the colossal inefficiency of having to pay
people with cars and vans to drive around, and collect + charge scooters at
the end of the day. This is a huge waste of resources and human time. Even
with VCs p------ a firehose of money into the market, most of it ends up going
to drivers, rather than customers.

~~~
bosie
5 miles one way? Genuine question but why would you want to commute 5 miles on
a scooter multiple times a week compared to a bicycle?

~~~
ckuhl
I think the biggest advantage scooters have over ebikes is that for a lot of
people, there’s a place to store a scooter at both ends of a commute (under a
desk) but not necessarily secure bike storage.

~~~
dustinmoris
Also a huge advantage is the mobility of a scooter over a bike. With a scooter
you are more flexible to changes in your day. Did a friend just message you
during lunch to meet up for drinks in a different part of town? No probs, just
take the scooter on the tube after work. Did the weather just change
drastically? No probs, can quickly change to a different way of commute and
the scooter doesn't feel like a huge showstopper whereas with a bike it all
becomes really really complicated.

Bicycles in big cities are too inflexible. If all you want is to commute like
a sheep from home to work and back to home every day then a bicyle is a great
inexpensive and green choice, in every other case it's a problem. Unless of
course you are in a small village, where a possible change of plans will still
result in a short ride. In London this is not possible. If I was to meet
friends spontaneously outside my daily commute area then it would be
impossible with a bicycle.

~~~
Symbiote
I no longer live in London, but these scooters seem a bit big to go on a metro
train.

The smallest folding bicycles (e.g. Brompton) are fine, but scooters must
either be balanced upright, exposing dirty wheels, or take up a lot of floor
space. No thanks!

In the largest cities like London, if my plans changed I'd just leave the
bicycle at work, and take public transport to the party, home, and to work the
next day (unless my way home passes work, then I can collect the bicycle).

------
jackschultz
This has to depend so much on city size. I'm in Milwaukee and they're perfect
for here, because with everything so compact in the downtown area, if I'm
meeting people to get food, hang out, or even go to Bucks games, it's so easy
to get a scooter to get there rather than walk, uber, or the quick rent bikes
we have.

I was just in Montevideo and Buenos Aires and we took the scooters in
Montevideo, but even that city was almost too big, and also the streets
different from what I'm used to making using them in the roads difficult.

As for Lime scooters compared to the other brands, I just pick the closest one
to me; I haven't picked a favorite.

------
spondyl
Purely anecdotal but in my mind, one of the biggest barriers would be public
sentiment?

I remember when Lime launched here in New Zealand and suddenly, all of these
scooters appeared on the footpaths. Over time, they would go from nice, neat
rows of four to being discarded on the pavement, becoming obstacles to walk
around.

Obviously, it's the customers who have left them strewn on the pavement but in
my mind, I associate that untidiness with Lime. Without their business, there
wouldn't be scooters freely available to be left lying around.

Anyway, personally, I'm glad to see Lime and all of the other scooter
businesses go away. It felt like more of a fad that would go away but I say
that not having used one either. I'd rather walk and listen to some podcasts.

On a side note, I thoroughly enjoyed this talk about e-scooter security from
Matthew Garrett last year:

Part 1: [https://youtu.be/wU5ghVvwfGE](https://youtu.be/wU5ghVvwfGE) Part 2:
[https://youtu.be/BMQnxugfwUI](https://youtu.be/BMQnxugfwUI)

------
tempsy
wow I'm really surprised to see San Diego on the list of "underperforming"
markets that was cut. seems like a huge red flag for the industry if that's
true.

no city have I been to had more scooters everywhere than San Diego. and the
city has been very accommodating in the sense that they created designated
scooter parking areas. it's almost the perfect city for scooters: almost
always warm/sunny, very flat, not great public transportation infra.

left wondering what happened.

~~~
gkoberger
I think that's the problem... there's a huge market for scooters, but there's
so many competitors in San Diego. I love scooters, and even I'm annoyed by how
hard it is to walk around SD without tripping over PILES of them.

~~~
tempsy
seems like a lose lose for the industry then. there are a few cities out there
that are optimized for scooters year round like San Diego, and the barrier of
entry is too low, and then no one wins because there's too much competition.

~~~
asdff
It's not weather you need, it's infrastructure. Scooters clogging sidewalks is
an infrastructure problem. Scooters having to deal with car traffic is an
infrastructure problem.

The solution to these infrastructure problems are to get a can of paint, make
a bike lane, and a scooter parking space. Let the app geofence, and voila, a
functional transit network that avoids all the annoyances everyone states ad
infinitum until local council bans them.

~~~
tempsy
not sure what this has anything to do with my previous comment...

i observed San Diego being relatively accommodating to scooters, including
created designated parking, on top of being a city is flat and usually sunny
and warm - both things that are good for scooter demand, and wondered aloud
why Lime still couldn't make it work.

------
rory096
Curious how many of the scooter-haters in this thread drive cars daily. In my
experience they're a huge boon to walkable, car-free or car-lite lifestyles,
and all but useless in the suburban parking-minimum wastelands that
characterize most of the United States' postwar built environment.

~~~
ProAm
It's makes urban sidewalks look like they are strewn with litter. It's the
reason why Im glad to see they are banned. They make walkable cities less
walkable.

~~~
rory096
This is a myopic view. In my city's experience, when infrastructure like
parking corrals are provided scooter users tend to behave properly. When
there's nowhere to leave your scooter except to balance them in a 5-inch space
parallel to the curb, they become disruptive. The solution is to reallocate a
minimal quantity of the vast space in our cities we currently designate for
the exclusive use of automobiles, not to punish those who chose not to occupy
300+sf of space with their two-ton vehicles.

~~~
ProAm
It's not shortsighted but definitely an opinion formed relative to my opinion
and observations. But that's what all comments are. That solution might work
in your city, but each of these scooter riders did not take one car off the
street so it likely will not work in most cities. I agree there is a solution
but don't feel well ever find one in discussion on HN, a much to biased
audience.

------
baxtr
I counted seven different scooter companies in my town recently. The party had
to end at one point...

~~~
jandrese
It's just like 3D printers a few years ago. Dozens of companies spring up
around the technology and gradually attrition down to a the handful of most
successful ones.

A more direct parallel might be all of the Hoverboard clones that flooded the
market a few years ago. Whenever something is new and hot and the barrier to
entry isn't too high you'll get an explosion of startups trying to make their
name.

~~~
baxtr
Yes, I agree. The big difference is I think: all of these seven startups
needed a huuuge amount of capital to start in various cities.

------
fabioborellini
If it is impossible to run a profitable e-scooter rental service even with the
current terms, imagine how much money the companies would burn if they could
not externalise the costs of accidents to riders' insurance companies and
taxpayers (in locales with public healthcare).

In my home town the scooters have almost exclusively been used to replace
walking. They have not reduced the market share of other means of motorised
transport. People walk less because of scooters. There has been a notable
amount of broken bones and even a few cases of severe brain trauma suffered by
riders, and taxpayers end up paying for everything.

So I could argue that all the effects on the society have been negative.

~~~
jandrese
I'd expect them to cannibalize taxi/bus/subway rides to some degree. They seem
like a pretty good alternative for people who want to travel some middling
distance like a dozen blocks that would be a somewhat lengthy walk but a
fairly short taxi ride. Plus it could definitely be faster if the traffic is
congested.

~~~
asdff
Once you start getting to the 20 minute mark the scooter ride stops being so
cheap, and you were probably better off getting an uber and going farther and
faster for about the same price. I don't think it can replace the subways as
they are used here in la. A scooter can't go from downtown to hollywood in 20
minutes; not even cars hit the 70mph the subway does in this city.

~~~
jandrese
If it is taking you 20 minutes to go a dozen blocks on a motorized scooter
then maybe it is the wrong tool for the job.

~~~
asdff
It definitely is. I think they should nix the unlock fee to further
incentivize this, personally.

------
twoheadedboy
> He said that projection is based in part on improvements to Lime scooters'
> longevity, which in 2019 went from from six months to about 14 months.

That still seems like an incredibly short amount of time.

~~~
chrisco255
14 months for the abuse these things take? I'm impressed they last more than
90 days to be honest.

------
wil421
Good riddance from Atlanta. The City had to start fining people to get the
scooters off the sidewalks. When I worked in midtown I’d have to step over
scooters lying on the streets.

~~~
vkou
Maybe if scooters could be parked for free on nearly any curb, like cars, you
wouldn't be stepping over them.

~~~
wil421
Where on earth do you have to pay for scooter parking? Scooter parking is
free. Slamming them down sideways without using a kick stand is free unless a
cop sees you.

~~~
streblo
Riders don't have to pay for them, but the scooter operators sure do.

------
itqwertz
Good!

These scooters are at best a novelty and at worst a potential vector of
serious injury. I know at least three people who have been injured through
recklessness or malfunction. They also tend to be dirty.

They’re a nuisance in populated areas like San Diego (where I love). People
already act as if no one else is on the road with cars and bikes. Scooters
appeal to (inner) children, and they can really bring out the indifference in
aggressive riders. Drunk scooting is basically a license to be a prick.

The business model was terrible from the beginning. Like should have learned
from its bicycle department (as well as competition) that there simply isn’t
much money in this market.

~~~
hyperdunc
I think they're great. The issue is that most places don't have the
infrastructure for them. Bicycles and scooters should have a dedicated path so
people don't have to ride them either on the road or the footpath.

------
cityofdelusion
I worked in downtown San Antonio, one of the markets being pulled from.
Scooters were very popular when they first arrived, but pretty much none of my
coworkers used them any more. The main issues are cost and time. It takes too
long to open the app and get riding and it costs too much. Downtown here is
also pretty walkable, so the high costs don’t make much sense when I could be
getting exercise. The scooters are also fairly miserable when it’s 104F in the
summer and 40F in the winter, making them very seasonal. They are banned on
sidewalks here, but I had no issues riding them in the slow downtown SA
traffic.

------
danans
Until and unless these replace cars on the road, which is unlikely due to
weather and other cases like grocery shopping, they will be a nuisance for
everyone.

A better solution for private transport over short distances would be low
speed neighborhood electric vehicles (basically, big golf carts) that can
carry more people and stuff, and coexist with cars, instead of taking
pedestrian and bike space. They might not be as safe as cars, but they are
safer than the scooters.

------
irjustin
I use Lime scooters in SF. Too many scooters aren't fully charged in the
morning near Market St - I wonder if the charging incentives are being
slashed.

Separately, it makes sense that an additional cash infusion is unrealistic at
this point. Post WeWork decimation, large D, E, F rounds will be increasingly
difficult to close as we go through 2020. Profitability is the right move.
Whether it's possible or not...

Best of luck to Lime.

------
yalogin
At a high level this will be sold as “Uber for cycles” but it’s not. They own
the hardware which makes it a really tough business to be in. TBH I don’t why
even U ee is in this space. There isn’t enough volume outside of tourist heavy
sites to justify it, even in tourist heavy places I don’t know how attractive
an option this is what not attractive to a select group.

------
m0zg
For the life of me I can't see why people wouldn't just steal them. It's
literally just standing there, not chained to anything, sometimes for days on
end. Sure you probably won't be able to ride it, but even as parts it's likely
worth more than a day's worth of heroin, which dooms their business model
right from the start.

------
lostsock
I used a Lime scooter in Brisbane Australia when I there for a wedding last
year, it was a great experience. Easy to find, quick to get around, convenient
and inexpensive.

Saw both tourists and locals using them and they were always placed neatly and
out of the way.

The weather in Brisbane means they'd be in use pretty much year-round, such a
great idea!

------
jMyles
I wonder how many startup scooters have been thrown away. Have we filled a
stadium yet?

Will there someday be a museum located at a landfill which is full of these
things?

I generally think that this kind of final mile solution is a good one, but I
can't help but feel like a lot of these scooters are experiencing very short
service lives.

~~~
ChrisKingWebDev
Not exactly the same, but these photos are pretty mindblowing:

[https://www.theatlantic.com/photo/2018/08/china-abandoned-
bi...](https://www.theatlantic.com/photo/2018/08/china-abandoned-bike-share-
graveyards/566576/)

------
TaylorAlexander
Okay so how do I get a cheap e-scooter? Or will they just trash the still-
working hardware?

~~~
rtkwe
They'll be collected and sold through an auction company for liquidation
probably or redistributed to other markets.

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mixmastamyk
Indeed why I’ve never signed up for these vehicle rentals. Every week there is
different set of companies in my neighborhood. If they were all on a single
reservation system state or nationwide I’d be a lot more interested.

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gbronner
Surprised that the companies haven't either merged or coordinated to limit
competition in each city. I expect that cities can support a limited number of
scooter companies, but every single vc backed startup.

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matmann2001
After all the lobbying they did in my city to get a helmet law exemption and
then to get the city to install designated scooter parking and no-go zones...

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peter303
$500 wholesale a scooter, $2 average revenue a ride, $5 a day to juice them.
If one lasts several hundred rides it might make a profit.

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whalabi
Does this mean there's a whole lot of cheap scooters being sold somewhere? Any
idea where?

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aminulislam1266
unforeseen is the army of charging slaves that patrol the city at 4 AM for a
few extra dollars at their own expense. E-scooters launched through shop
windows and into streets after bars close.

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FartyMcFarter
Thank $deity. I'm tired of seeing these humongous bikes taking up space on
sidewalks, and threatening to fall onto unsuspecting people and animals.

Here's hoping they fail in other markets as well.

~~~
ravenstine
If you have a cane or a wheelchair then good luck when you come across a pile
of bikes on the sidewalk. Even one of those JUMP bikes tipped over can be a
problem. I used to see this all the time in Santa Monica. Bikes lined up close
together would either fall like dominoes or get kicked over by hoodlums,
blocking walking paths or potential parking spots. What's hilarious is the
number of believers willing to say about anything to defend the the almighty
bicycle, no matter how obstructive and unsightly they can be.

 _No, no!_ _A pile of fallen over bikes and scooters isn 't unsightly!_ _Cars
driving on roads designed for them is what 's unsightly!_

Uh huh. (look up previous HN threads and you'll see that exact argument)

If there's one thing I'm looking forward to with the next economic recession,
it's the disappearance of these bikes and scooters.

~~~
martinald
Compared to a car parking on the sidewalk and totally blocking it which
happens so often?

~~~
ravenstine
I don't think I've ever seen that where I live. The closest I've seen is in
suburban neighborhoods where people don't park their car all the way into
their driveway, but even that's pretty rare.

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ourmandave
That's a blow. There's not a lot of companies employing divers in the gig
economy.

~~~
bransonf
Sarcasm? The vast majority of gig-jobs are driving.

Ride share and delivery make up the obvious lion’s share of gig work.

~~~
bhandziuk
divers. Like for getting bikes and scooters from lakes and rivers when the
drunkards toss them over a bridge.

