
Russian police arrest anti-corruption leader, hundreds in nationwide rallies - JumpCrisscross
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/russian-police-arrest-protesters-at-nationwide-anti-corruption-rallies/2017/03/26/11208e46-10a1-11e7-aa57-2ca1b05c41b8_story.html
======
snitko
What really pains me is that people participating in such protests don't
understand neither the dynamics, nor history and are thus unnecessarily hurt.
Any leader stays in power so long as he knows where the money is (controls
money flows), pays his key supporters and the army/police.

Money in Russia is primarily oil money and this source is not drying up any
time soon. More importantly, the people fighting for changes are rarely the
ones who can later be in power, but are rather used by others to get in power.
Even if they get in power, it's very unlikely they are good at managing
economy and the country as a whole, since they didn't understand the dynamics
of political power in the first place.

For those interested I highly recommend reading "The Dictator's Handbook: Why
Bad Behavior is Almost Always Good Politics". It's eye opening for anyone who
thinks protesting or voting can change anything.

~~~
Const-me
In Ukraine, the corrupt leader controlled a lot of economy, paid his
supporters, and supported the police just fine (Army decided to stay neutral).

People overthrew him regardless.

I have close friends and relatives in both countries, and I think in Russia
that’s nearly impossible. Not because of oil and gas revenues, because people.
They aren’t dramatically different, the cultures are close, but there’s some
statistically significant difference.

Russians are more inclined to believe they cannot change anything, just like
the opinion you expressed in your comment.

Ukrainians are more inclined to stand against violence. When riot police
brutally attacked peacefully assembled teenagers in Ukraine in 2013-nov-30, it
sparked the main phase of the country-wide protests. Today riot police
brutally attacked peacefully assembled teenagers in Moscow, and the only
reaction I see so far is on Facebook.

~~~
snitko
This is absolutely completely untrue. I've heard this so many times from my
Ukrainian friends. If Russia and Ukraine swapped populations somehow, but
leaders would remain the same I guarantee you would do absolutely nothing in
the circumstances in Russia.

In Ukraine, the leader was weak, the opposition well financed, the quality of
life was less satisfying than in Russia and there was a clear window of
opportunity. And even then it all ended up with a different group of corrupt
oligarchs taking control. In essence, nothing changed in Ukraine, at least for
the better. You can't blame war for everything.

> Russians are more inclined to believe they cannot change anything, just like
> the opinion you expressed in your comment.

First of all, this would clearly be considered racist by some, but luckily I
don't care. I'm sure there are people in Ukraine who are also level-headed and
realistic enough to consider how real politics works. Again, I highly
recommend the book to get a realistic perspective.

Finally, just to make it clear, I do not support any kind of war and have
nothing against Ukraine wanting to break ties with Russia.

------
Grue3
I think the more HN appropriate angle on this story is that none of Russian
top news networks have reported on the protests, even though thousands of
people had attended them. Imagine US networks not covering Ferguson protests,
or Occupy Wall Street. Most people wouldn't even know it happened.

~~~
joyofdata
HN is not just tech stuff - it is anything discussed by techies. This
absolutely belongs here.

------
shmerl
* [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I2FhmpoHMiQ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I2FhmpoHMiQ)

* [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4VYCqrCM0gI](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4VYCqrCM0gI)

------
hjrnunes
European media reported opposition rallies happen all the time.

Rallies need permission from city authorities to happen. Permission was
applied for the Kremlin square and denied. Alternative venues suggested by
authorities and refused by organisers, which maintained original plan thus
engaging in illegal activity and defying authorities.

Organiser and several protesters arrested.

Is there a country where protest marches and rallies do not need permission
from, at least, city authorities to happen?

------
notatoad
Is this relevant to HN? I normally kind of like the off-topic stuff that ends
up here on a sunday afternoon, but this seems especially reddit-worthy.

~~~
JumpCrisscross
> _Is this relevant to HN?_

I thought it was relevant, given the changing culture of protest across the
world and their tie-ins to encryption.

This, and HN's attempts to "de-politicize" this forum, remind me of a
conversation a Russian-born Valley-based venture capitalist. I asked why
Silicon Valley seems less politically organized, and thus influential, at the
grassroots level than New York City.

"New York is closer to D.C.," she observed. But that doesn't explain why the
average person from Silicon Valley has less influence than, say, from Los
Angeles.

We're Alan Turings, she said. Turing wanted to be left alone to make things.
Unfortunately, his government didn't see similarly. First, with World War II
and later by prosecuting him for his sexual orientation. Being able to be left
alone to make things is a luxury, a delicate balance almost unprecedented
across human history. We will lose the privilege if we refuse to even discuss
it.

