
'Street Crisis' team to replace San Francisco police on mental health calls - MilnerRoute
https://www.sfgate.com/news/bayarea/article/Street-Crisis-Response-Team-To-Replace-Law-15476580.php
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pmdulaney
I imagine SFPD officers will be happy to offload these particular cases. And
if the Street Crisis team can't handle a particular individual, they can
always bring in the police themselves.

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toomuchtodo
Can’t speak to SFPD, but St Pete in Central Florida is doing something
similar, hiring 25 social workers instead of 25 police officers. I’m curious
to see if this causes contention between officers and social workers. The
social workers are obviously necessary and valuable, but this is likely to
lead to a decrease in power for law enforcement based on force numbers if it
starts happening at scale.

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dmitrygr
I've had to call 911 for such cause once in SF. A hobo tried to stab me with a
needle, and chased after me. I called 911 specifically because i wanted
someone to come and use force to keep me safe, as it would be illegal for me
to use force myself (in modern countries, the state usually has the monopoly
on use of force, and self defense needs to be proven beyond many doubts).

> The response teams will be equipped

> with at least one paramedic from the

> Fire Department and a behavioral health

> clinician and behavioral health peer

> from the San Francisco Department of

> Public Health.

Ok, which one of them is authorized to use force to keep me safe and stab
free?

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redis_mlc
> it would be illegal for me to use force myself (in modern countries, the
> state usually has the monopoly on use of force).

No, it's not "illegal" to defend yourself in the USA.

But get the name of a witness or you could end up in court for years. Many
laws allow a defense, but you're responsible for meeting the burden of proof
and legal fees.

(The castle doctrine in some states was enacted to give property owners a
stronger legal position for self-defense than just the legal defense option.
Of course, that ended up being abused by overly-entitled home owners.)

> i wanted someone to come and use force to keep me safe

It's a common misunderstanding that the police have an obligation to keep you
safe. They don't.

The police can enforce a law, but at the end of the day, they don't have to
keep you safe in any way. An example is that the police can engage in high-
speed pursuits, and if you get run over and die, that's not their problem.

I can't tell if you're outside the USA, or if you missed civics class.

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closeparen
The specific meaning of “the police don’t have to keep you safe” is that you
cannot win a lawsuit against the police because you were the victim of a
crime.

Most communities hire police to do emergency response and would treat a
failure of 911 the same way they treat a failure of water or sewer. San
Francisco just values this less than other places.

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kevin_b_er
It also effectively means they can brutalize you for funsies with little to no
repercussion in the US.

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1DRACOSEA8
And the well to do tech bros coddle up to the testosterone filled
reactionaries. “Round them up!” Easy solution, that’s just lazy, you’re not
even trying. San Francisco is also not equal to the rest of the US, I would
dare say it’s closer to Mexico than anything else, but culturally California
is quite diverse in attitude and flora. San Francisco puts up with a lot,
always have, always will. It’s just embedded in the humanitarian pro immigrant
pro minority passion of our city. I believe there may be remnants of this San
Francisco but it is gone for good. 250 Million for Tech Buses and Two stems at
Safeway, from London to San Salvador in one fell swoop.

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closeparen
One thing I’ve noticed about native San Franciscans is that they just _don’t
go_ to the neighborhoods that lead tech workers to feel this way. It’s not
like they’re actually walking their kids to school past needles and tents and
rape threats and thinking it’s fine. They’re just not experiencing it. Often
leads to people arguing past each other.

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erlich
Why would someone call the police for a non-violent mental health issue?

I can only imagine the need if there is a danger or someone will need to be
restrained.

I can only see this increasing risk of danger to citizens.

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mindcandy
Mostly because they don’t know who else to call.

Not long ago I saw a very ragged man stumbling around and he just curled up
and went to sleep in the middle of a busy road. What to do? I can stand and
block traffic. But, he’s not listening to anyone and I’m not going to grab and
drag someone who is that far gone.

Thankfully, before I called the police another (very likely homeless) person
was braver than me. He did grab the passed-out dude, got him to his feet and
over to the sidewalk to lay back down.

I’m not happy with any aspect of that event -especially not myself. But, I
only had two options: get myself into a potential wrestling match with someone
who was very much out of their mind, or ask a cop to do it instead.

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erlich
I mean this seems like what cops are for. Sending in cou sellors and a
paramedic is just putting them in danger.

Homeless should not be above the law and if they a disturbing the peace they
need to face consequences so they don't do it again or help them along on thr
path to realizing this.

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yc3po
This is wonderful news.

So many times have cops been called when the only appropriate response would
be a mental health counselor, not a bullet into the victim, which they are so
very quick to do.

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apotatopot
I think we did this a few months ago in Albuquerque. They've formed an unarmed
alternative police force thing.

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1DRACOSEA8
Geez maybe they said, “No human being should be allowed to suffer if he is
under the roof of the wealthiest nation in the history of man.” The pain leads
to Police, the fear of seeing a future you, leads to shelter seeking grievance
gazing.

