
SSN Required To Buy Palm Pre - gasull
http://yro.slashdot.org/story/09/06/21/2359255/SSN-Required-To-Buy-Palm-Pre?from=rss
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LogicHoleFlaw
I'll quote the same thing I posted on Slashdot in response to another comment:

 _I'm under the impression that most of this stuff is a complete racket
though. Sure, Sprint can put several thousand dollars on your bill in one
month because you used your data plan in Canada or something. But did that
actually cost Sprint very much? If not, who cares if you cannot pay the bill?
As long as you can at least pay enough to cover Sprint's costs, it shouldn't
be a big deal for them if you simply owe them a lot of money._

Actually, it does cost Sprint money. If a credit card charge is declined the
card issuer charges Sprint a fee. Failed billing is a huge issue for
telecommunications companies.

I wrote billing software for a large telecommunications company and dealt
directly with this issue. Something like 40% of all attempted credit card
charges were declined for one reason or another. That is a lot of money lost
to no good end.

I personally and single-handedly implemented the system which would attempt to
authorize (not withdraw) one month's worth of billing from new credit card
signups. It is amazing how many people hit their credit limit when you check
to see if $45 is there. And even then a large number of those who pass that
check will fail to pay their bill when you attempt to charge.

Asking for (and storing! WTF) SSNs to sign up for a service contract is
heinous, I agree. But there is a _lot_ of money lost to attempting to charge
the credit cards of people who then fail to pay their bills.

~~~
chrisbolt
The fee is insignificant compared to the cost of the bill, or the cost of a
chargeback if a card holder disputes a charge.

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newsio
The arrogance of some companies and their demands for personal information
that has nothing to do with the business at hand is astounding. What's even
more amazing is the surprise and inability to cope with customers' questions
and refusal to give them the information.

My breaking point was reached when the local Snippets -- a franchise that cuts
kids' hair -- demanded my phone number when I came to get my son's hair cut.
When I asked why, the answer was "we need it for our system." I surmise that
they want it for some sort of customer tracking database to use as a unique
ID, but my refusal threw them for a loop.

~~~
robotrout
Glad I'm not the only one.

Radio Shack was my nemesis, as I purchased stuff there often, when prototyping
and not willing to wait for next day delivery. I used to get myself worked up
before I even got to the store. Over the years, I've optimized it to just a
friendly "Nope!" when they ask for a phone number.

Doctors offices and dentists offices are another one. Their little 'new
patient' form demands much more information than they need. I leave it blank
or draw a line through it.

When I'm getting my hair cut, since it's a more intimate relationship, I'm
reluctant to be quite as rude, so I just tell them that I don't have a phone.

~~~
Harkins
I like to say "No thanks". If you think about it logically it doesn't parse,
but I've found that the common phrase invokes the "I just was just treated
politely" part of the brain in almost everyone, saving much hassle.

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padmanabhan01
There is nothing new about this. All post paid monthly plans in US requires
SSN, (Palm/Nokia/Motorola or whatever), (Sprint/Verizon/ATT whatever).

~~~
andr
Yep, a credit check is par for the course, even for SIM-only contracts (ie
bring your phone). This generates some extra cash for the telecoms by forcing
some people to the much more expensive pay as you go plans.

~~~
anigbrowl
Much more expensive? I've used MetroPCS for years and I just pay a flat
$50/mo., which gives me unlimited national calling, texting, voicemail etc. If
I had a blackberry I think the data plan is about $75/mo. I might possibly do
better on some other carrier's plans, but the convenience fact or having a
flat fee and not having to keep track of minutes is worth a few bucks to me.

~~~
mattmaroon
That's not a pay as you go plan. That's just normal service on an MVNO.

Pay as you go is where you have no monthly fee, and buy minutes ahead of time
and have to re-up when you run out. That is way more expensive on a per-minute
basis but much cheaper in total for people who carry phones mainly for
emergency purposes.

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garply
I'm consistently amazed by how much power the telecom companies have in the
US.

I'm living in China, where they use SIM cards, and I just bought my phone and
accompanying phone number completely anonymously, using cash only. When I
recharge the money on my card, I go to a store and pay cash. If I want a new
handset, I just take out the card and swap it into a new phone - keeping my
cell phone number and contacts.

The flexibility has even fueled a boom of tiny cell-phone designing companies
that make all kinds of innovative creations called 'shanzhai' phones.

Is this just a US thing? Or are handsets locked to carriers in most of the
rest of the world as well?

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mattmaroon
Is this not standard fare in the American cellphone industry? A phone is a
line of credit. You can even buy 3rd party stuff with it. I could swear I've
had to do this with Verizon too.

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_pius
What annoys me about situations like this is the sheer dogma involved. Doing
what the person in this story did, offering to pay the entirety of the
contract up front should obviate the need for a credit check. Period.

~~~
tedunangst
Since the people at the store probably don't have direct SQL access to the
database, they have to use the front end to create your account. And the
people who wrote the front end were probably just following the spec. And the
person who wrote the spec probably wasn't paid to consider every possible
scenario with which to bloat the spec and push the project over time and over
budget.

~~~
_pius
That completely misses the point. This isn't about software at all; this is
about good business and good management. Sometimes you suck it up and call
something in if you have to so you don't lose a customer.

~~~
tedunangst
And then you discover that the billing system automatically refunds (or
refuses to charge) people whenever their account credit goes over $500. Or
that somebody added one of those fancy assertion thingies to the code that
simply does not allow Pre accounts to be created without a credit check.

And then somebody from accounting gets wind of it and shits a brick because
the rules are different for money received for a service not yet rendered vs
one that is.

Or maybe it's just a good business call. By not giving this guy his Pre, they
incurred one hit of nerd rage. But they've ducked out on his followups about
how unlimited isn't really unlimited, how megabytes aren't the same as
megabits, how 3G speed isn't 2.99G speed, and so on and so forth.

~~~
_pius
_Or maybe it's just a good business call. By not giving this guy his Pre, they
incurred one hit of nerd rage. But they've ducked out on his followups about
how unlimited isn't really unlimited, how megabytes aren't the same as
megabits, how 3G speed isn't 2.99G speed, and so on and so forth._

Good point. :P

