
Oodi, Helsinki’s new flagship library - sohkamyung
https://www.economist.com/prospero/2019/02/15/inside-oodi-helsinkis-new-flagship-library
======
stevekemp
I can't read the article, but this is a nice piece which shows the insides
pretty well:

[https://www.oodihelsinki.fi/en/what-is-
oodi/architecture/](https://www.oodihelsinki.fi/en/what-is-oodi/architecture/)

It is a really beautiful space, I was there with my child last weekend and
shot lots of videos of the various areas. There are trees inside, play-areas
for children, and many nooks for reading/resting/chatting.

This link (Finnish) has a brief video showing people cleaning the snow from
the roof too, which is a semi-common occurrence in buildings/streets here in
Helsinki:

[https://www.hs.fi/kaupunki/helsinki/art-2000005998579.html](https://www.hs.fi/kaupunki/helsinki/art-2000005998579.html)

~~~
gordon_freeman
Thanks for the main library link. The architecture is beautiful but does
anyone agree that from the outside the building looks pretty similar to the
building of California Academy Of Sciences?

~~~
jccalhoun
I had never seen the building so I looked it up
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_Academy_of_Sciences](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_Academy_of_Sciences)
In the abstract the undulating roof is similar looking closer shows there are
a lot of differences even in where the lumps are located

------
mbrock
It was also featured in the NYT's Art & Design section:
[https://www.nytimes.com/2018/12/06/arts/design/helsinki-
libr...](https://www.nytimes.com/2018/12/06/arts/design/helsinki-library-
oodi.html)

Quote from Tommi Laitio, an executive director in Helsinki city:

“We often think that things like social cohesion or democracy are just words,
but in spaces like these they really come to life,” Mr. Laitio said. “You need
some social infrastructure for communities to work. You can’t build them on
friendship, or this abstract idea of living together.”

~~~
bobl
Another nice quote:

'Oodi “fits very well into the Nordic story of how societies work,” Mr. Laitio
said. “There are so few of us here, so we have to make sure everyone can
develop to their fullest potential.”'

A perspective increasingly lost in Sweden.

~~~
massive
What makes you say that? As a Finn I feel that we lag a step behind Sweden in
many things. Be it little brother syndrome or something else I think it holds
to some truth (e.g. by economic standards)

~~~
bobl
It seem like Finland to a larger extent is still interested in providing good
conditions for its citizens, for example:

* Finland has one of the best school systems in the world. Sweden one of the most deregulated and is average in PISA rankings.

* Finland is one of the few western countries to build a new nuclear power plant. Sweden is set to instead use taxes to deal with climate change while the price of electricity is the highest in a decade.

* While this library was being built they have been arguing about building the privately funded Nobel Center in Stockholm for years.

Finland is also able to take decisions such as working against smoking. This
is one of those "nanny state" public health things Nordic countries are known
for. In Sweden there are half a dozen commercials for online casinos every
commercial break on TV, on billboards and in all the online newspapers.

I can see why especially Stockholm would be alluring, but if you look at the
housing market (or outside of Stockholm) it isn't as fun anymore.

------
carlospwk
I don’t think it’s accurate to call Oodi a library. It’s more of a communal
space for citizens and a sort of a playground/hangout for kids. With some
books. Maybe I’m a cranky old man but I don’t really enjoy these kind of open
spaces. It’s noisy, too relaxed and not geared towards actual studying and
working. Libraries in Finland no longer have any expectations for peace and
quiet.

~~~
tokai
Luckily are public libraries not run on gut feelings and personal semantics.
The purpose of libraries in Finland is defined by the Library Act, which
states that public libraries should provide[0]:

1) equal opportunities for everyone to access education and culture;

2) availability and use of information;

3) reading culture and versatile literacy skills;

4) opportunities for lifelong learning and competence development;

5) active citizenship, democracy and freedom of expression.

You might like a quite place to read, but if society pays it should get more
than sleepy reading halls. I find that the fetishising of books and silent
library spaces is a nostalgic fantasy championed by people that rarely
actually use libraries, while they are unaware that libraries are the most
used cultural institutions in many countries. There is not a single good
reason to limit libraries to disseminate the printed book as the only
document. Other than elitism.

[0]
[https://www.finlex.fi/en/laki/kaannokset/2016/en20161492.pdf](https://www.finlex.fi/en/laki/kaannokset/2016/en20161492.pdf)

~~~
Emma_Goldman
Since when was studying a 'nostalgic fantasy'?

In the UK, libraries are something like social centres: unemployed people go
there to read; retired people read the daily papers; people without the
internet at home come to use the computers; children come after school until
their parents finish work.

It's important that there are public spaces like that. It's a lifeline for
some people.

But most public libraries in the UK are, for those exact reasons, very poor
places to study.

~~~
tokai
>Since when was studying a 'nostalgic fantasy'?

Studying is not a nostalgic fantasy. Giving opinions on how public libraries
should be run, without any relation to reality is. If you go through the
library act I posted you will find that providing silent study places is NOT
an object that Finnish public libraries should fulfil. It makes no sense to
criticise public libraries for not providing what they shouldn't
provide.People that want silent study places can go to academic libraries.

>retired people read the daily papers; people without the internet at home
come to use the computers; children come after school until their parents
finish work.

All things that would be less of, if the public library room were to be a
silent tomb.

>It's important that there are public spaces like that. It's a lifeline for
some people.

Exactly. The nostalgic fantasy I'm criticising carlospwk for is that public
libraries are "noisy, too relaxed and not geared towards actual studying". Not
really a position that fosters the needs of the diverse population of patrons.

~~~
carlospwk
>Exactly. The nostalgic fantasy I'm criticising carlospwk for is that public
libraries are "noisy, too relaxed and not geared towards actual studying". Not
really a position that fosters the needs of the diverse population of patrons.

I could have maybe worded myself better. I don't really care what people do in
a library, I just wish it was silent and peaceful like it was before.

~~~
tokai
I kind of pounced on your comment, as I'm opposed to a restricted view of
libraries. But I think I was a bit too snippy trying to get my point across.
I'm sorry, didn't intent to call you out.

I actually had a laugh at myself just after posted my second comment. As had
to break up a group of patrons where having a teleconference with multiple
laptops, on speaker, in study section. Guess there is a limit even in noisy
libraries!

------
yason
Oodi is quite hideous from the outside: I haven't generally felt the appeal to
walk towards the area. See for yourself:
[https://ibb.co/jkJ4h1B](https://ibb.co/jkJ4h1B)

But Oodi is also not so much of a library than an indoor public space. That is
probably fine and that I think is where libraries are going in general.
However, being born decades ago it's _libraries_ I like.

I'll much rather find my "books and crannies" to spend some quality time a few
blocks the other way in this old library:
[https://goo.gl/8sEdSS](https://goo.gl/8sEdSS) (more pictures on FourSquare:
[https://foursquare.com/v/rikhardinkadun-
kirjasto/4baa99a3f96...](https://foursquare.com/v/rikhardinkadun-
kirjasto/4baa99a3f964a52068783ae3)). It's as cramped as homely, quiet, smells
of old books, and offers a sense of a place unlike the new showroom of design.

~~~
m_t
I really don't find it hideous. This definitely looks like the kind of
building I'd like to check out.

~~~
omnimus
Honestly it looks like a shopping mall. Shame considering the budget and
Finlands rich history of architecture/design.

~~~
nabla9
I hope there would be more shopping mall architecture like this:

[https://www.oodihelsinki.fi/wp-
content/uploads/2018/12/Oodi_...](https://www.oodihelsinki.fi/wp-
content/uploads/2018/12/Oodi_verkkosivut_hero-
kuvat_1920x1080_TuomasUusheimo_07.jpg)

------
jrochkind1
I continue to be curious although happy that libraries are such a topic of
interest on HN. (Also sometimes wonder if the interest is based on a romantic
fantasy not too related to contemporary reality of libraries). What do people
think make libraries so interesting or pleasing to the HN audience?

\--a librarian software engineer

~~~
noir_lord
I go to my local library once a week every Saturday morning.

They encouraged a chess club which was what got me in the door (shamefully for
someone who reads as much as I do I rarely went) and now I use their other
services, it's got a nice little cafe attached and upstairs they have a maker
space.

It's surprisingly progressive for my local council.

As to why I like the library, it provides useful services beyond lending books
(which in the world of Amazon and e-readers isn't enough - however I'm happy
to pay taxes towards the people on low incomes been able to check out books),
mostly it's the people who run the place, they are almost universally lovely
to interact with.

------
terom
My first experience with Oodi was unfortunate: The only publicly available Wi-
Fi network (Stadinetti) blocks all outgoing non-HTTP/HTTPS traffic (SSH, IMAP,
etc).

So much for trying to do any remote working or studying for things like AWS at
the library without your own 4G connection, unless you're content just reading
the docs.

~~~
tuukkah
When was this? I haven't had any issues using SSH and IMAP via Stadinetti
there (latest 3 days ago).

~~~
terom
This was back in December. I tried asking about it, but wasn't able to find
any info about what kind of policy they intended to have on their network.

Who knows, maybe I complained enough that they fixed it? :)

------
stevekemp
Unrelated to the article, but I'm impressed at how many people from Helsinki
turned up in the comments.

Small world ..

~~~
Sharlin
In many nerdy corners of the Internet there's a definite surplus of Finns
relative to the fairly meager total population of our country.

------
kareemm
Beautiful public space. Reminds me a little of the Halifax Public Library in
Canada:

[http://halifaxcentrallibrary.ca/galleries/](http://halifaxcentrallibrary.ca/galleries/)

------
billfruit
I find the lack of subtlity in the architecture kind of off-putting, it is as
if it wants to be in your face and grab you by your eyeballs. There is a quite
grandeur in many building designs that subscribe to an austere concern for
functionality.

~~~
smileypete
You might like some of Rick Mather's projects:

[http://www.rickmather.com/practice](http://www.rickmather.com/practice)

------
dandigangi
Legitimately thought this was going to be a code lib but it's a literal
library.

~~~
tuukkah
_Those_ libraries are here: [https://github.com/city-of-
helsinki](https://github.com/city-of-helsinki)

Including how you make reservations for the rooms in this library building:
[https://github.com/City-of-Helsinki/varaamo](https://github.com/City-of-
Helsinki/varaamo)

------
emilfihlman
I didn't really like the place. It places a _huge_ premium on design vs
functionality in some sections. I mean, sure, it looks cool, but the cost is
away from something this time instead of mutually existing.

~~~
antris
I'm interested to hear what you think the functional shortcomings of the space
are. Also, you are making a false dichotomy of function and design.
Functionality is an _essential_ part of design.

~~~
maw
I agree with you. But what is the correct word for architectural features that
detract from functionality? They're often called "design" whether we like it
or not.

Whatever they ought to be called instead, it looks to me like the space is not
lacking in them--curves and inconvenient angles in particular.

~~~
antris
You might be talking about purely aesthetic design. But I disagree, I've been
to the place and it was a very functional and easy-to-understand building
architecturally. But also beautiful and calming. Aesthetics are a very
important and underrated aspect of architecture and I'm glad that money has
been spent on this project. When the architecture is not only functional but
also aesthetically pleasing, people tend to use it more. And what good comes
from a library that nobody would want to go to?

------
dharma1
Looks amazing. Makes me want to move back to Helsinki seeing all the new
development

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jumelles
This is wonderful. Every library ought to be a palace.

------
Zitrax
Paywalled

~~~
stevekemp
[http://archive.is/c8Zxt](http://archive.is/c8Zxt)

------
hendry
Does it have wifi good enough to play PUBG?

~~~
arkitaip
You joke but I would be thrilled if it had a LAN room you could pop into to
game with strangers.

~~~
tuukkah
Yes, there are a couple of classrooms with gaming PCs on the second floor:
[https://www.oodihelsinki.fi/en/what-is-oodi/the-
facilities-a...](https://www.oodihelsinki.fi/en/what-is-oodi/the-facilities-
and-functions/)

