
Banksy Art Sale in Central Park [video] - jmacd
http://www.banksy.co.uk/2013/10/13/central-park
======
colanderman
Wtf? "Better Out Than In" is a stupid title. Please restore the original
title, "Banksy sells original artwork for $60; valued at $750k". It's
meaningful.

/me wishes mod edits were logged with their username so they can be held
accountable for stupid title edits like this.

~~~
graeme
I logged in just to upvote this sentiment. The original title was very clear.
It let me decide whether or not I was interested.

The new title makes no sense. I'd be highly likely to simply pass over it.

~~~
afhof
Its more link-baity this way. Instead of knowing what the article is about
before clicking on it, you are now forced to waste an extra 10 seconds.

------
TheLegace
If your are all interested in Banksy I'd urge you to watch a film that he
accidentally was forced to make about Street Art and himself, well let's say
because the original Director...well you will see. It's called Exit Through
The Gift Shop, I watched on Netflix.

[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a0b90YppquE](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a0b90YppquE)

I've always been a fan of Banksy's work. Especially the work he did at the
dividing wall on both sides in the West Bank and Israel.

[http://www.stencilrevolution.com/banksy-art-prints/flying-
ba...](http://www.stencilrevolution.com/banksy-art-prints/flying-balloons-
girl/)

~~~
alwaysinshade
"I've always been a fan of Banksy's work. Especially the work he did at the
dividing wall on both sides in the West Bank and Israel."

And this is why I roll my eyes a little when people deride Banksy (not
necessarily on HN - rather in face to face discussions) as boring
artistically, politically, or as some kind of a sell-out.

His works use the environment they're placed in to great effect (e.g.
Bethlehem), use props (higher risk, more planning required, more interest
generated) and are messages rather than trademarks (e.g. King Robbo).

And when someone drops the tired line that he copies others like Blek Le Rat;
when you've had a go at making a stencil you quickly realise that you're
limited by the medium (stencils can convey only so much detail), thus
similarities arise. It's the message that's important, not the piece itself.

~~~
adnam
According to _Banging Your Head Against a Brick Wall_ he came up with the idea
of using stencils when he was hiding from the police and saw stencilled
letters sprayed on the bottom of a truck.

------
jackschultz
On a similar note, there is the story of Joshua Bell (a famous violinist)
playing in a subway station and virtually everyone walked by.

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joshua_Bell#Washington_Post_exp...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joshua_Bell#Washington_Post_experiment)

~~~
habosa
I find that much more amazing because you can hear how amazing Joshua Bell is
as you walk by. You wouldn't hear it and say "that guy must be faking". It's
common for NYC street vendors to sell art that is a copy of a more famous
work, and there's no way to tell by looking.

~~~
kansface
There is no way to tell the difference in a subway station, even for an
instrument as loud as a violin. Moreover, no one goes to the subway to listen
to music.

~~~
sanoli
If you're into this kind of music, you could tell, sure. He begin playing one
of the hardest to master solo violin pieces of the repertoire. If I saw
someone playing Bach's Chaconne on the street, _I 'd stop right away_. There's
no way street musicians would be able to play it like he did. Well, about a
thousand people passed by, and seven stopped to listen. 0.7% of the sample
isn't that bad. Plus, he made 50 bucks in less than an hour.

------
inmygarage
I would like to know where this $750K number is coming from. Generally Banksy
originals of this kind are priced closer to low five-figures, but if someone
has inside knowledge here please share.

This article puts the value at around 20K pounds:
[http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/weird-news/banksy-sells-
origina...](http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/weird-news/banksy-sells-original-
paintings-worth-2368651)

~~~
fennecfoxen
Anyone else take a look at that sort of price tag and ponder whether they're
in the wrong business? :P

~~~
adventured
It's amazing what top-shelf reputation is worth in almost any industry.

------
NathanKP
Wow if his stand was near MOMA I probably walked right by it yesterday without
noticing... I usually just ignore vendors around the park because 99% of the
stuff being sold in that area is mass produced crap that has no value but to
extract money from tourists.

~~~
TylerE
and that's the art.

~~~
timr
Well, also...he's messing with the people who value his stuff at ridiculous
prices, but can't pick it out of a lineup.

This is great not because it was anonymous (that was just a requirement -- if
it weren't, he'd have been swamped by idiots), but because it illustrates the
fundamental absurdity of the art "scene". It's a nice bit of mockery.

~~~
alphakappa
If you listen to his audio commentaries (most of his pieces in
[http://www.banksyny.com/](http://www.banksyny.com/) have a commentary on the
page), he pokes fun at himself and at pretentious commentaries that often
accompany art pieces.

------
thomaspaine
It's a cool experiment but not altogether surprising right? The provenance of
a piece of artwork, and other rare goods, is arguably more important than the
art itself. Especially in the case of artwork which is easily reproducible and
copied.

If you think that's idiotic then ask yourself if you were given the
opportunity to buy the first original Apple 1 or an exact replica, how much
more would you be willing to pay over the replica? If the amount is greater
than zero, then you're admitting that you're really buying an experience and
set of emotional states in addition to a physical good.

~~~
alwaysinshade
"If the amount is greater than zero, then you're admitting that you're really
buying an experience and set of emotional states in addition to a physical
good."

Absolutely, and I think that's the message being conveyed by Banksy. In a
similar project he erected pieces in undisclosed locations throughout the
English countryside - their existence only documented in pictures on his
website. That way money is removed from the equation while the message
remains.

~~~
the_cat_kittles
I feel like no matter what you are doing, you are buying experience and
emotional states. The point is the cause of these particular emotional states
is kind of silly.

------
unhappyhippie
I think, and I am not an expert by far, that this just shows what the market
value of those art pieces are when removed from their context. You won't pay
more than $30-60 for it unless you are told otherwise by someone of authority
- an art critic or a market of affluent and competing buyers motivated by
various reasons. There is also the fact that he did it in NY, where $60 is
acceptable to many buyers. The sales would have been diffirent in rural
Alabama or New Delhi.

------
elyase
More proof of the irrationality of the art market and how artwork is priced.
Reminds me of [1].

[1] [http://blog.priceonomics.com/post/53857118493/is-wine-
bullsh...](http://blog.priceonomics.com/post/53857118493/is-wine-bullshit)

~~~
dbond
Its called positional good.

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Positional_good](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Positional_good)

------
arnoldwh
I hate to say it, but if I ran an art stand, I'd put up a few around central
park right now.

Wouldn't be surprised to see some stands going up to make money off the "halo
effect" here.

------
tvon
Previous discussion:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6544301](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6544301)

------
nilved
The crazy underspray is uncharacteristic of Banksy. It looks like the artwork
was intentionally made to look like ripoffs.

~~~
notatoad
and the best part: he doesn't make any mention of identifying characteristics
of the "100% authentic" pieces he was selling. He's just given every banksy
rip-off a huge boost in credibility, and destroyed the resale market for his
own work.

~~~
cookingrobot
Everyone who bought a piece is featured in that video. If you're going to buy
one of these, you should probably make sure it's from one of those people.

~~~
notatoad
Unless they sold it to somebody else. And they even avoid showing which pieces
were bought, for the most part.

------
rebelnz
So it seems a few people did get lucky - [http://tvnz.co.nz/world-news/kiwi-
unwittingly-buys-80k-worth...](http://tvnz.co.nz/world-news/kiwi-unwittingly-
buys-80k-worth-banksy-art-5647597)

------
auggierose
I love it. This is like the Sci Fi novel (Heinlein I think, Lazarus Long)
where I learnt that for the bank which issues the money, money really is just
paper.

~~~
sneak
This is from The Tale of The Adopted Daughter, which appears in Time Enough
for Love. It's a really beautiful piece and the ending gets me every single
time.

~~~
auggierose
Yes, that's the one. I have to reread that book, it must have been more than
20 years ago I read it.

~~~
sneak
Send me your email address. I can be reached at sneak@datavibe.net.

------
stormbrew
I wonder how many fakes will show up on ebay now.

------
brianjolney
surprised so few stopped. $60 for a canvas knockoff of banksy isnt a bad
price, let alone an original.

~~~
TylerE
98% of people have no clue who Banksy is, certainly in the US.

~~~
Moto7451
I had no idea who he was until Colbert decided to make him part of his schtick
last week.

[http://www.colbertnation.com/the-colbert-report-
videos/42957...](http://www.colbertnation.com/the-colbert-report-
videos/429573/october-07-2013/banksy-s-new-york-reign-of-terror)

Like most things, just getting people to talk about him will raise his
profile. Being mentioned on national TV and the network news doesn't hurt
either.

That said, I must confess my ignorance as I'm unaware of why Banksy is
relevant. I don't mean high level ignorance, as I have googled around and I
get the general idea of his works and some of the social issues his works
relate to. What I mean is I'm unaware of how he became relevant in pop
culture. Does anyone here know?

Banksy's wikipedia article[1] doesn't particularly spell it out. Did his first
works show up in a particularly public area in response to a poignant event
and the British media noticed it? Did his work catch on organically?

[1][http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banksy#Early_career_.281992.E2....](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banksy#Early_career_.281992.E2.80.932001.29)

~~~
anigbrowl
I suggest you just get one of his books and look at the art for a while. He's
been doing his thing for a long time and has built up a following. I've been a
fan for years.

------
fnordfnordfnord
I probably wouldn't have bought anything, and instead assumed that the guy was
selling ripoffs.

------
mattmaroon
I'm curious what effect this will have on the prices of Banksy knockoff works.

------
zenmaker
I'm a fan of Banksy's work. But a huge part of it's appeal at this point goes
beyond a visceral response to the piece and gets wrapped up in social
currency. "Come see my stencil art" doesn't really pull like "you see my new
Banksy?"

That's actually not even a statement about Bansky, in truth, it's about the
way the art world has evolved in general.

------
georgeoliver
It's interesting to compare this to the Joshua Bell (live) 'performance' cited
in @mjn's comment
([https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6544810](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6544810))
considering that Banksy generally makes stencil art. I suppose the performance
here was not about the art products at all.

------
GFischer
420 USD for a day's work is almost ten times more than I make. Should I go to
NYC and put up a stand? :)

I'm glad for the buyers.

~~~
po
That's revenue. Those large canvases he's selling his 'spray art' on aren't
exactly cheap, especially for the larger ones. Also you're going to be paying
NYC prices for your food and transportation. But yeah overall, he didn't do
too badly.

------
neilmiddleton
"When you go to an art gallery you are simply a tourist looking at the trophy
cabinet of a few millionaires."

– Banksy

------
whiddershins
Context is everything.

------
brianbreslin
has anyone revealed who he is yet?

~~~
estel
It's a pretty open secret, but not really.

------
kuldeep_kap
is that banksy in the video?

~~~
estel
Not a chance.

------
rfnslyr
Who cares? I wouldn't pay $5 for that garbage, regardless who it is. Who the
hell is Banksy?

Guess I'm not edgy enough for this art.

~~~
feralmoan
I don't care about Banksy either and don't feel to despondent having known it
was right there, its the kind of crap I'd just walk past every other day of
the week. The question does beg though why the hell this is on the front page
of HN (and how much was actually sold? I'm guessing not a lot!).
[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5LP5-AjCCNw](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5LP5-AjCCNw)

~~~
fnordfnordfnord
420 Dollars worth, according to the video.

~~~
feralmoan
I dumped a lot more than that at Comiccon on people with actual talent (non
derivative works). Banksy is a very strange thing that I really don't
understand at all however I'm glad for him that he knows how to capitalize. Is
the mindless kowtowing to rat stencils really just a tip of the hat to those
without talent but a distinct political advantage? I can understand how some
people would be into that, given the industry we're in.

~~~
tehwebguy
Banksy is probably here because he's sort of a mystery, it seems that no one
knows his true identity even after like 20 years.

Most of his work is illegally painted or pasted onto public walls and he
hasn't been caught yet.

This "installment" is ironic because his art was sold on the cheap as if it
were knock offs, like basically everything else sold on NY streets.

His style isn't entirely original but if it seems tired it's probably from
seeing his imitators. Searching ebay for Banksy and excluding his books turns
up 100,000 results, all of which appear to be ripoffs, bootlegs and tag spam.

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banksy](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banksy)
[http://www.ebay.com/sch/?_nkw=banksy](http://www.ebay.com/sch/?_nkw=banksy)

