
Buca di Beppo, America’s Most Postmodern Red Sauce Chain - objections
https://www.bonappetit.com/story/bizarre-history-buca-di-beppo
======
apo
> Roberts saw an opportunity not just to re-create those bygone red sauce
> joints, but to present the most exaggerated, over-the-top version of them,
> to create an environment where people could feel totally comfortable—as he
> describes it, "... I wanted a restaurant people could look down on.”

>

> He wanted the decor to be tacky, the portions to be enormous, the atmosphere
> to be boisterous. He figured it didn’t matter that he wasn’t Italian in the
> slightest. There were also almost no red sauce joints in Minneapolis at the
> time, so diners wouldn’t have anything to compare it to. This was a
> restaurant, he says, “that was intentionally in bad taste, but good-natured
> bad taste.” The kind of place where the average diner could feel superior,
> and not feel bad about being puzzled over a wine list, or not knowing what
> kind of fork is used for a salad.

The concept of a restaurant that people "look down on" seems both bold and
mean-spirited. It also vaguely reminds me of an article I read about the Old
Spaghetti Factory.

What are some other examples of American restaurants that followed this
playbook?

~~~
cowmoo728
Cheesecake Factory? They're famous for having terrible decor, service, and
food, yet somehow being an essential part of the American high school prom
experience.

[https://www.barstoolsports.com/barstoolu/dude-goes-viral-
for...](https://www.barstoolsports.com/barstoolu/dude-goes-viral-for-tweet-
storm-about-how-much-the-cheesecake-factory-sucks)

~~~
ocdtrekkie
I get so peeved by the treatment of chain restaurants like this as "poor" or
"terrible". Because you know what, Cheesecake Factory, Olive Garden, Red
Lobster, Outback Steakhouse? These are some of the nicest restaurants the
average citizen can hope to afford to go to more than once in their lifetime.

It isn't going to impress folks who have a personal chef at home, but the food
is _pretty darn good_ , and you don't have to saw off your right arm to pay
for it.

~~~
ng12
The value proposition really isn't that great. It's not any cheaper than food
from a local Italian joint. What you're paying for is that Olive Garden
experience, whatever that is worth to you.

A good example is the Olive Garden in Times Square. It's _always_ packed
despite there being better Italian places a few blocks away. Not to mention,
if you're willing to hop on the subway there's significantly better Italian
food available in the outer boroughs for much cheaper. Olive Garden isn't that
cheap, that nice, or that tasty which makes it a mystery to a lot of people.

~~~
dsr_
Olive Garden's appeal in Times Square is the same as McDonald's: you're in a
strange place, but you know what you can expect to find inside, and you know
your kids will eat it while you have a glass of mediocre wine.

~~~
ocdtrekkie
FWIW, if you go to McDonald's in some foreign countries you will be in for a
shock as they serve many region-specific items. (Though in Paris, it's a
pleasant shock, it's mostly the same but all of the food is better/healthier.)

Source: Yes, I traveled to the capital of a country known explicitly for it's
exquisite food and did patronize a McDonald's.

~~~
dagw
_FWIW, if you go to McDonald 's in some foreign countries you will be in for a
shock as they serve many region-specific items._

I still remember getting a surprisingly nice pepperoni pizza at a McDonald's
in the US many years ago. Undoubtedly the nicest thing I've eaten at a
McDonald's anywhere in the world.

 _Yes, I traveled to the capital of a country known explicitly for it 's
exquisite food and did patronize a McDonald's._

Some of the, by far, worst restaurants I've ever eaten at have been in France
so there's a chance that McDonald's wasn't the worst choice you could have
made.

------
Konryan
As someone who lives in Italy, a lot of what seems to be considered "Italian"
in the US sometimes feels like little more than a caricature. It does trouble
me slightly, because it feels like an impersonation of Italian culture.

On the other hand, it's probably just culture diverging and developing in
different ways after migration, which is to be expected. So the problem is
mostly one of identity: the same label - italian - means very different things
to people across the world...

~~~
United857
Same can probably be said of any country's cuisine in America.

E.g. many staples of Chinese restaurants in America (General Tso's chicken,
chop suey, sweet and sour whatever) are not found in China except at super
touristy places.

~~~
culturestate
There are lots of...I guess I would call them "mashup cuisines" around the
world, especially in post-colonial and post-WW2 Asia. Local chefs tried to
recreate western dishes with their own ingredients and techniques and it made
for some interesting results.

Since it's early morning as I write this, I'll use Hong Kong-style macaroni
soup[1] as an example: it's literally macaroni in broth with a slice of
processed ham on top and some white bread on the side. Not Chinese in the
least, but now it's as much a local breakfast staple here as congee.

Also, an aside: sweet and sour pork is a legitimate Cantonese dish and it's in
every Canto restaurant in China. I really miss crab rangoon sometimes,
though...

1\. [https://medium.com/@xinwenxiaojie/in-praise-of-hong-kong-
mac...](https://medium.com/@xinwenxiaojie/in-praise-of-hong-kong-macaroni-
breakfasts-a0b0d1eede6a)

~~~
philwelch
Some “Indian” dishes, like chicken tikka masala, originated in Britain in
similar circumstances to American “ethnic” dishes. And lots of Vietnamese food
has French influences.

------
joshmn
Fun fact! Philip Roberts, who started Buca, sold it and started what is now
one of the best steakhouses[0] in the country. It's the cash cow (no pun
intended) for the other restaurants in his restaurant group Parasole, and is
easily the highest-grossing restaurant in Minnesota.

They're "sperm-to-table" and a treat to dine with. I'm there too often.

[0] [https://www.mensjournal.com/food-drink/10-best-
steakhouses-i...](https://www.mensjournal.com/food-drink/10-best-steakhouses-
in-the-world-20141223/manny-s-steakhouse-minneapolis-mn/)

~~~
strictnein
Manny's is great, but in Minneapolis I'd honestly rather go to P.S. Steak or
Burch Restaurant if I'm in the mood for a good steak. It may be just me
though, as I don't enjoy the traditional steakhouse experience.

------
bpolverini
As an Italian-American, this explains why every time I go to a Buca di Beppo,
I feel like I'm in some kind of merger between a mediocre Italian restaurant
and a minstrel show. To those of us who grew up in this culture, it's
ridiculous (almost bordering on offensive). Thankfully, I grew up in
communities where the Italian's could proudly go to other restaurants that
were more respectful of a 3,000 year old culture.

It's tough to feel proud of what Buca di Beppo has done to popularize Italian-
American culture in the same way it's tough to feel proud of the movie The
Godfather. We aren't all mobsters and we don't all have giant busts of the
Pope and cherubs in our houses. Some of us are just computer scientists who
like basil.

~~~
brandonmenc
> To those of us who grew up in this culture, it's ridiculous (almost
> bordering on offensive).

Both of my parents are half Italian-American, and that's the tradition in
which I was raised.

My relatives who actually came off the boat loved Buca di Beppo. And Olive
Garden, etc. (Of course we all know it's not as good as home cooking, but who
cares when you just want something fast.)

Honestly, Italian-Americans have no one to blame but ourselves for exalting
gangster culture and caricatures. We love that stuff.

~~~
monksy
BUT WHY?! That's just concerning. (After eating at places in Italy, you miss
that italian cooking.. no mushy overcooked pasta)

~~~
brandonmenc
Does McDonalds make the best hamburger? Does Taco Bell make the best burrito?
Does Pizza Hut make the best pizza?

No, but I still eat at every single one of them all the time.

If I'm in flyover country, nothing beats the $19 Tuscan Steak at Olive Garden.
Maybe some day I'll go to Italy and then never eat "fake" Italian food ever
again, but I doubt it.

------
dreamcompiler
Back in the mid 90s my colleagues and I from the warm southern US found
ourselves on the freezing winter streets of downtown Minneapolis after dark.
We had brought coats but were still quite unprepared for 10 below zero F. As
we wandered around looking for a place to eat, we spied a small well-lit door
leading down to a basement. The waitress saw us, threw open the door, and said
"You get in here. You're about to freeze to death!"

Whereupon we had one of the best and most welcoming meals I remember. That was
my introduction to Buca di Beppo, and no matter what anyone says about it, I
will always be fond of the place because it saved our lives that cold winter
night.

~~~
jjeaff
It's amazing how much context, atmosphere, hunger, environment, etc affect our
perception of food.

My most favorite and memorable meals ever were little, low quality places that
I hate after coming back from long treks through the wilderness, or even the
meals cooked while on those treks. As well as many places my wife and I ate on
our honeymoon.

And I have been to a fair number of excellent restaurants including michellin
starred ones.

It seems unlikely that those places were actually that good (probably the same
as your buccas experience). And I have returned to some of them under
different circumstances and not found them particularly amazing.

------
exabrial
I think I enjoyed the 'tacky' decor of the restaurants after visiting Italy
and Rome specifically. Each restaurant, is incredibly unique, amazing to hear
the story behind it.

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thanatropism
... so like Outback?

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evolvedcleaning
How is this relevant on hacker news?

~~~
detaro
Apparently it gratified someone's intellectual curiosity.
[https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html](https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html)

~~~
evolvedcleaning
I may be an Apple user who is interested in such movies as the goonies at the
matrix but I’m not going to open an Italian restaurant called iBuca. I just
don’t feel the article has enough intellectual relevance to be on the front
page of happiness

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PorterDuff
A friend of mine who is about 6'6"\- 350, just loves that place.

I'll pass thanks.

