
Essential Phone, available now - Garbage
https://www.essential.com/blog/essential-phone-available-now
======
zanny
Since no one else has, I'll take the piss out of this "hollier than thou"
bullshit.

> Devices are your personal property. We won’t force you to have anything you
> don’t want.

Devices are your personal property. The SoC is still a proprietary trade
secret, the baseband is still spying on you for the NSA, the GPU is still a
closed blob piece of shit. No mainline driver support, bootloader is closed
source, firmware is closed source. We own this phone, you don't.

> We will always play well with others. Closed ecosystems are divisive and
> outdated.

....

> Devices shouldn’t become outdated every year. They should evolve with you.

Devices become outdated because shitty vendors refuse to open source and
mainline drivers for their components.

> Technology should assist you so that you can get on with enjoying life.

Technology should be trustable, and a device where you cannot tell if or when
the microphone and/or camera are recording and being remotely accessed is
anything but.

Not wanting to single Essential out too much here - every vendor goes on and
on about how great this phone is for you, while holding as much of a vice grip
over the operation of the device as possible to make sure you need to buy
another one as soon as possible through planned obsolescence. It is just the
stick up the ass language announcements like these use is really infuriating
when the people making them know full well how much they are screwing you
over.

The first actually open platform phone is the one that will have longevity.
The rest are snake oil about how good they will take of you because you can't
take care of yourself with your own software that you can trust.

~~~
erlend_sh
> The first actually open platform phone is the one that will have longevity

FairPhone is trying to do that, in software, hardware and way beyond:
[https://shop.fairphone.com/en/](https://shop.fairphone.com/en/)

~~~
cerberusss
A colleague of mine showed me her FairPhone. She then proceeded to disassemble
it, right in front of my eyes. She's a biologist and told me that she broke
the screen during fieldwork. Just ordered a new screen on the FairPhone site
and replaced it herself. Amazing tech.

------
foobaw
As someone who worked in a large OEM company releasing tons of smartphones,
I'm actually impressed it only took 100 people to getting this out. I presume
there was an incredible amount of sleepless nights, as this is no easy task.

To be fair though, Sprint is one of the easier carriers to work with after
T-Mobile. I can't imagine them releasing a phone on AT&T or Verizon, as their
process is grueling. I guess since they're selling an unlockcked version of
their phone, it doesn't really matter to power users. However, most sales for
smartphones are from contracts sold directly from carriers so it'll be
interesting to see how they'll do in the market with their current strategy
(similar to One Plus One).

Props to them though. It's not just about carrier certification. Releasing a
smartphone is a long complex process. Some engineers at Sprint were briefly
talking about how great the phone was, so I have high hopes.

~~~
nicpottier
Pretty sure they used Sharp as a partner, so it isn't like they started from
scratch. That guess is based on this Sharp phone looking mighty familiar
([http://www.gsmarena.com/sharp_aquos_s2_taken_apart_a_bezelle...](http://www.gsmarena.com/sharp_aquos_s2_taken_apart_a_bezelless_phone_thats_put_together_well-
news-26760.php)) and Rubin having worked with Sharp extensively during the
Danger days. (most of the Sidekicks were made by Sharp)

I'm kinda sort interested in this device, but honestly I'm in the sit and wait
given that Sharp isn't exactly a name brand anymore.

~~~
boondaburrah
Sharp for some reason refuses to sell their smartphones outside of Japan. When
I lived there I had a Sharp phone - and it was amazing. Smoothest non-stock
android experience I've had. Recently they were selling [did this finally
happen?] off their phone business to foxconn because it was falling behind.

Man, if you actually tried to sell your phones, Sharp, they might have sold?
Funny concept.

If this phone is indeed a Sharp creation, I'm all over it.

~~~
Analemma_
> Man, if you actually tried to sell your phones, Sharp, they might have sold?
> Funny concept.

Smartphones are a brutal business to be in, especially in North America, where
Apple and Samsung have basically locked up the high end of the market and
everyone else is fighting for the scraps (and usually losing tons of money in
the process). Probably Sharp just realized there was really no way to break
in, especially considering they'd have to start from scratch with channels
like carrier partnerships, retail presence, and advertising.

~~~
aianus
> considering they'd have to start from scratch with channels like carrier
> partnerships, retail presence, and advertising

OnePlus has none of these and seems very successful.

~~~
colordrops
Meh, I bought my first OnePlus phone a few months ago and while the phone
itself is great, I've been thoroughly unimpressed with their support and
unavailability of most accessories, both from OnePlus and 3rd parties. It's a
huge turn off and I won't buy another one.

~~~
throwaway613834
What kind of support do you need for a smartphone? I've literally never even
thought "maybe I should contact support" for a phone problem.

~~~
jacalata
Tons of things, like "my phone is two weeks old and the battery life has
halved"

~~~
betenoire
I'd complain about the battery in that case, not support.

~~~
colordrops
What? If you can't get support to fix the battery for you, that's also a
problem with support too.

------
ariofrio
Give me software updates for 7+ years, then we'll talk about buying your $700
phone. Lasting hardware means nothing without lasting software.

In the meanwhile, I'll keep buying $120 phones (Moto G4 with Amazon Ads FTW)
and keeping them for ~2 years until they break or software updates stop. Even
though as a Catholic (Laudato Si, Rerum Novarum) it kills me to waste all
those materials every couple of years and be part of the environmental
degradation of our planet.

~~~
rl3
> _Lasting hardware means nothing without lasting software._

The Nexus 6P is a perfect example of this:

[https://m.theregister.co.uk/2017/05/01/google_eol_for_nexus_...](https://m.theregister.co.uk/2017/05/01/google_eol_for_nexus_phones/)

I've had mine a year and a half, and it doesn't even feel close to struggling
with things. Performance is great.

Yet, it's going to be artificially deprived of the latest Android releases
starting one month from now, and won't even receive security updates after
September 2018. It's absurd.

~~~
Brakenshire
Lineage OS works very well with the 6P, incidentally.

~~~
magila
Lineage OS isn't a substitute for vendor support. Lineage is dependent on
vendors for updated drivers and firmware blobs. So if there's a bug in the
firmware, like the recent BCM43xx vulnerability, you are still SOL if the
particular chip in your device is no longer supported by the vendor.

~~~
jacobush
True, but I could imagine a situation where Lineage could work arond a bug in
firmware and protect from it.

------
Hasz
You want fixable and well designed, long software updates, and a good price?

Buy an (old) iPhone.

I've got a 5S -- still perfectly fast for what I use it for (email, youtube,
brokerage account, general internet, some small games), and is getting OS
updates and security patches until IOS11. It's $120 on eBay; a new screen can
be had for $13, a new battery for $11. it's solidly designed and there's a
gigantic field of accessories and apps.

Maybe titanium and no bezels are worth a price premium, but there's no way
it's worth a 5x increase in price.

~~~
freehunter
Plus you have a great piece of industrial design.

I love the look of the 5S/SE. It looks premium, it feels nice in your hand,
it's solid, and those chamfered edges are so nice.

It's a shame they went from that to the iPhone 6 design and stuck with it all
this time. It might make bigger phones easier to hold but man it just doesn't
look as nice IMO. It looks like a generic round phone. Nothing stands out
about it at all.

~~~
posguy
Having sold hundreds of iPhone 5s's when I was selling B2B, I have to say I
was fairly unimpressed. Not great battery life over time, if an employee left
with iCloud enabled it was a whole affair with Apple to get them to reset the
device and allow it to be reused, and the brick style design is not very
comfortable overall.

My favorite is the curved back, as is on most Motorola's and some LGs.
Personally, I stick with cheap LG phones ($100 or so) that are
rootable/rommable. If the phone gets damaged or I want a newer phone, no skin
off my back, biggest concern is just moving Signal Private Messenger over to
the new phone I get :P

~~~
scott_karana
If iCloud was your problem, it's because you weren't using an MDM.

That's an OS-independent problem ;)

~~~
lunchables
We use MDM (Air-Watch) and it's still a problem. If the employee uses their
personal iCloud account you cannot remove it. You can unlock the device
remotely via MDM but you have to have their password for their iCloud account
to remove the iCloud account.

You have to contact Apple and provide proof of purchase for the device to have
them remove the iCloud account.

~~~
scott_karana
I'm aware of what happens when Activation Lock happens when personal iCloud
accounts are allowed to be installed.

The issue is allowing that to happen in the first place, instead of locking it
centrally. That's either a limitation in your MDM's capabilities, or its
setup. ;-)

[https://support.apple.com/en-gb/HT202804](https://support.apple.com/en-
gb/HT202804)

------
git-pull
I admire the gumption of making a new phone.

But controlled obsolescence kills me. The real feature that improves in phones
the past few years for me is the software and apps, _not the hardware_.

My wishlist:

\- Give me a lighter, snappier OS. Not something clunkier and slower and uses
more ram, gpu/cpu (aka battery life).

\- Actually support updates to the things for longer than 2-3 years.

\- (Not related to this phone) Use stock android, unless you're _removing_
bloat. Why? Because inevitably there's going to be apps. What I want is a nice
flat surface that includes wifi, bluetooth, and nice API's and permissions for
those apps to plug into.

\- The biggest feature you can give me on a phone? Battery life, Replaceable
battery, Data/Cell reception, Speaker/Microphone quality.

\- SIM card that's easy to get out.

\- Actually, Dual SIM's.

\- Support for carriers globally.

\- And physical keyboards. Something for SSH'ing with.

~~~
feld
> \- And physical keyboards. Something for SSH'ing with.

There is no market for this product. Nobody wants it except a tiny fraction of
the market who work in IT.

~~~
as1mov
Not really. Manufacturers just stopped making phones with PKB because since
Apple wasn't making them, they weren't worth it. It hard to estimate the
demand for PKB phones when no one is making them. I'd buy one in heartbeat if
one launched with low-mid end specs and less than $400.

We've constantly chosen form over functionality. Larger sized phones, fragile
build materials(glass over plastic), lesser battery just so the phone can be
thinner. The keyboard was given up to make room for a bigger screen and
thinner body, and now writing anything more a few sentences on a phone is a
pain in the ass.

Atleast in the era of dumb phones, for all the weird shit (Nokia's taco phone)
that came out that time, at least the phones were distinct, you could tell
them apart just by looking at them. Now they are all the same generic
rectangular glass slabs that cater's to single demographic who want large
screens for media consumption. What if you are not in that demographic? Well,
tough luck.

I know am in the minority and it's not really Apple's fault that everyone
decided to ape them, but a part of me wishes we hadn't given up the variety
just to pander to the largest common denominator, even a little variation
among phones would be a welcome change.

~~~
baddox
What is the draw of a tiny physical keyboard? I can type much faster on an
iPhone than with any similarly-sized physical keyboard. The only advantage I
can think of is the ability to touch type without paying attention to the
screen as closely, but for a phone that doesn't seem like a very big deal.

~~~
hohghitlblkh
I could type faster (and without looking) on the old Nokia style keypads than
I can on a touchscreen.

~~~
merpnderp
So could I. No looking at the keyboard and almost never making a typo. I had
to backspace and correct 3 typos writing this on my iPhone with autocorrect
fixing several more.

~~~
zamalek
Maybe this will change with tactile screens. Touch screen keyboards are the
result of a severe underestimation of the importance of the human element in
hardware design.

------
gnicholas
> _Every year, like clockwork, manufacturers make “design tweaks” and launch
> new features and products that work well if you choose to stay in their
> ecosystem. You buy their phone, TV, speaker, and fridge with the promise of
> simplicity, but more and more often, this is a way to force loyalty._

Good thing they're not doing that!

> _We also plan to release new wireless accessories (like our snap-on 360º
> Camera) every few months. That schedule ensures that the latest technology
> will always be in the palm of your hand without having to replace your
> phone. These accessories will also work with other products like Essential
> Home._

Spoke too soon.

------
lolsal
> Your phone is your personal property. It’s a public expression of who you
> are and what you stand for.

No, it's really not. It's literally just a tool I use for communication.

~~~
notheguyouthink
> No, it's really not. It's literally just a tool I use for communication.

I'm curious, wouldn't that imply you're not the demographic they're seeking?
So are you basically saying, "I'm not in their demographic"? Or is there
another point to your comment that I'm missing. I ask because often I see
people get pissy about statements like this, almost as if they think the web
page was curated for them.

I could make a webpage targeted at guitarists with something like "Your guitar
is something you cherish", and clearly that statement isn't true for someone
who neither owns a guitar nor plays. So what purpose is a statement like this?

I don't make snarky comments at bra commercials on TV about how I don't have
breasts and therefor am not concerned with support. Do you _(assuming you 're
male, of course haha)_?

~~~
lolsal
I don't like the marketing appeal to some sort of deep emotional instinct that
the advertisement is making. I think it's ridiculous that consumer goods
represent who I am and what I might stand for. That's silliness and hyperbole,
right? To say that a person's phone choice defines them in any sort of
meaningful way is extremely silly to me. This feels similar to something like:

"This product stands for freedom! You stand for freedom don't you?"

The guitar analogy is not accurate - your statement about cherishing the
guitar is evaluated internally and is true or false. It's not the same as
saying the guitar publicly and externally (and deliberately!) defines you and
what you stand for.

"There goes lolsal - now there's a guy that really stands for non-branded
personal compute devices!" Give me a break.

~~~
sossles
> To say that a person's phone choice defines them in any sort of meaningful
> way is extremely silly to me.

For someone buying a mainstream product like a Samsung or Apple phone, I'd
agree that it doesn't mean very much. To someone buying a niche product like
this though, it definitely says something about the person's values.

------
Tharkun
Pardon the tangent, but here's a quote from their website:

> There’s a reason titanium is used to build rockets and replace bones. Unlike
> aluminum, which is what most phones are made of, titanium doesn’t scratch,
> dent, or bend.

The reason why titanium is used to replace bones is not its strength (though
it certainly doesn't hurt). It's because titanium is the most biocompatible
metal and has a capacity for osseointegration. Meaning the bone around it will
fuse with the titanium.

~~~
mc32
When mac books needed some pep in marketing, as sales floundered, Jobs also
diverged into Titanium in lieu of faster uPs. After that wore off he went to
the unwieldy 17" Mac Books.

Often times Titanium is just a marketing ploy. Like titanium cards. Titanium
bracelets. Etc.

~~~
filmgirlcw
And Apple moved to using aluminum from titanium in its PowerBooks (the design
would later be the basis of the original MacBook Pro), in part, because the
softness of of the metal, led to warps and bends in those first-gen TiBook
models. I don't know how Essential is using titanium, but history certainly
has examples of gadgets that suffered from using that metal over others.

~~~
Yetanfou
...and if you believe that, I've got a bridge for sale. Titanium is many
things but soft it is not. It can also be alloyed with many other metals for
specific purposes. One thing it definitely is though is _expensive_ which is
most likely the reason for Apple to look for alternatives. That is actually
_is_ possible to use titanium to create form-stable notebooks can be seen by
e.g. the many Thinkpads which sport titanium lids and frames. I have yet to
see one of these warped or bent. This is partly due to the boxy - and with
that, strong - form factor but the material plays a big role as well.

~~~
scott_karana
Thinkpads generally use _magnesium_ frames, not titanium.

[https://forums.lenovo.com/t5/ThinkPad-T400-T500-and-
newer-T/...](https://forums.lenovo.com/t5/ThinkPad-T400-T500-and-newer-T/What-
happened-to-the-Titanium-in-ThinkPad-T-Series-Bring-it-back/td-p/3690)

~~~
sannee
For anyone wanting to brighten their day with some thinkpads, it unfortunately
looks like large chunks of magnesium are not flammable [1].

[1]
[http://www.fishercast.com/downloads/FisherCast_Magnesium_Whi...](http://www.fishercast.com/downloads/FisherCast_Magnesium_White_Paper.pdf)

~~~
mc32
No, Mg is used for alloyed aircraft wheels, so I'm sure its not like Mn.

------
balls187
I found it off-putting that on the home page, the 2nd section about the phone
was an interview with the founder with exposition on his intentions.

Seems unnecessarily narcissistic--tell me about the phone and it's features
first and sell me on your product.

~~~
Philipp__
I got the same impression. It's kinda lame. I mean, phone looks good, real,
good product, but to me it seems it's biggest selling point is the man himself
behind it.

~~~
bdcravens
Given that he founded Android, I think that's the point.

------
agnsaft
At this point, the only thing I care about is whether or not they plan on
releasing quality software updates in a timely manner for a reasonable amount
of time...

~~~
ksk
I can see (though don't entirely agree) why companies feel some pain, when the
customer paid for the phone, but the public's expectation is free updates for
"life" (however you define that). I wonder if having a subscription where they
reduce the cost of the phone for the general population, and let others sign
up for a paid subscription model for updates, backed up by some kind of SLA
type agreement would work. I definitely would prefer a model where instead of
finding other ways to screw you (selling data) they get paid by me and serve
my needs.

~~~
criley2
It's moot.

Apple offers ~3 years of software updates included in the price of the phone.

Right now, Android companies COMPLETELY FAIL to match Apple's update value.

The idea that Android companies should switch to a paid update subscription
model, while iDevices retain free updates for most of device life, would be a
hilariously incompetent decision.

"They're better than us, we know it, so why not subscribe to us and pay us
monthly to help us catch up to what they were doing a decade ago?"

~~~
toastking
What confuses is me is what kind of work needs to go in to updating android on
different phones? If Android is compatible with the architecture of the phone
shouldn't the software update from Google work?

~~~
nradov
Unfortunately there is no real standard hardware architecture for Android
devices. Some pieces are the same, but every device has different incompatible
components. So the device vendors have to re-apply a unique set of patches
every time.

------
maxaf
Why would I spend $700+ on a phone with a dubious fate when I can spend $230
on a Moto G5 Plus and have Lineage OS running on it in no time, for a long
time?

~~~
jedmeyers
Premium materials and true craftsmanship shouldn’t just be for the few, but
for everyone (who has $700+ to spend on a phone).

~~~
nradov
It looks basically the same as every other smartphone and is mass-produced
with no "craftsmanship" involved. The concept of "premium" materials for
what's essentially a disposable device just seems ridiculous.

------
andrepd
They talk repeatedly about how their phone is so much better while still being
affordable. Well, 700$ for a phone isn't affordable, especially in an age
where a solid phone, excellent for 95% of your daily tasks, sets you back no
more than 150$.

I don't get it, what's the draw here? Is it the accessories? A couple other
phones already did that shtick, and the result was the same: release 3 or 4
gimmicky products and forget about it. They talk about maintainability, but
there is no replaceable battery, no expandable storage... I don't get it,
what's the draw?

------
gcb0
wake me up when there is a phone that runs proper linux. with decent drivers.

if anyone told you that you would be using your own computer in "kiosk" mode
with a root password you don't have, you would be laughing your ass off. but
here we are, all using the 90s equivalent of a library computer.

~~~
fooey
Ubuntu tried that, and it was a complete flop

~~~
CaptSpify
I would hazard to say Ubuntu didn't try it, they just _looked_ like they were
going to try it, but never did. Releasing only a handful of phones, not making
a fully functional 1.0 release isn't trying, it's just testing the waters.

~~~
collyw
I bought an Ubunutu phone. It had potential but it was too late to the game.
It didn't get any developer momentum behind it, so it was lacking in apps,
while Android got way better in the year and a half that I owned one.

~~~
CaptSpify
I kind of agree. The Ubuntu phone was the first phone I've had that I didn't
hate. That being said, it wasn't ever stable enough to get developers behind
it, so it didn't have very many apps.

------
pier25
At this price, why buy this instead of a Pixel?

To be honest I'm quite happy with my crap Moto G5 Plus phone. The screen and
camera aren't that great, but hey at this price I won't complain.

~~~
komali2
Well it has a headphone jack

EDIT: Er, did you mean pixel 1 or 2?

EDIT: Oh my god, it doesn't have a headphone jack! lol look at me eat my own
words holy shit

------
gthtjtkt
> Devices shouldn’t become outdated every year.

> Essential Phone will get guaranteed Android OS updates for 2 years and will
> get monthly security updates for 3 years.

That's honestly not much of an improvement, and I'm not aware of any current
phones that are outdated after a year (unless you're one of those gadget
fanatics who _has to have_ the most cutting edge phone).

> we've tried to make our phone as affordable as possible.

$700 is affordable now? What world are we living in!? Silicon Valley, I guess?

> Simple is always better.

> we put nearly a year’s worth of development into making a camera that
> integrates into the body of the phone (without the tell tale camera hump)

Really starting to question their priorities at this point...

Maybe "essential" is the wrong word for what they're doing, because it seems
like they spend a lot of time on things that aren't essential at all. Who
needs a 360 camera? And who cares about a 1mm camera protrusion? And since
when do we all agree that a 3.5mm headphone jack isn't "essential"?

~~~
dschep
Your first point is spot on, and why I'm really annoyed by android phones
these days. A simple, and still fully factual, rephrasing of their statements
makes it obvious just how bad it is:

> Devices should become outdated every other year.

------
free_everybody
Maybe I'm just buying into the marketing hype, but this actually seems pretty
cool and I'm curious what the OS feels like.

~~~
andrenotgiant
Isn't the OS just vanilla Android?

~~~
ghostly_s
Apparently so, according to the specs page. I thought the whole thing with
this company was that they're developing a competing OS not based on Android?

~~~
distances
No, that wasn't their goal, it was stated to be Android from the beginning.

~~~
ghostly_s
What do they need Andy for, then? The press I've seen with him over the past
year seemed to be pushing the narrative that he started this company to
'correct the mistakes' of Android...decided that's too much work?

------
microcolonel
I think this company gets a lot of things right. Frankly, some of their
marketing really speaks to me, like this bit from the home page[0].

 _Your phone is your personal property. It’s a public expression of who you
are and what you stand for.

Just because we played a part in making it doesn’t mean you should be forced
to advertise that fact to everyone in your life. Now you know why we don't
have any logos on the phone._

They've thoroughly outclassed Apple in this and a number of other ways. I
think they've put a lot of thought into matching the thoughts and aspirations
of customers, and if the phone is anywhere near what it's cracked up to be,
it's probably worth the price.

[0]: [https://www.essential.com/](https://www.essential.com/)

~~~
remir
The only problem I see with the Essential Phone is that you'll only receive 2
years of OS updates. For a $700 phone, that's a bit insulting.

~~~
collinmanderson
> Essential Phone will get guaranteed Android OS updates for 2 years and will
> get monthly security updates for 3 years, so your phone will always be
> secure and have the latest features.

Yeah, that doesn't seem that great at all. iPhones are 3-5 years.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/dataisbeautiful/comments/53mizf/iph...](https://www.reddit.com/r/dataisbeautiful/comments/53mizf/iphone_ios_support_schedule_oc/)

------
toast0
> And while costs for such finely crafted materials are usually reserved for
> high-priced, out-of-reach goods, we've tried to make our phone as affordable
> as possible.

$699 may be as affordable as possible, but that doesn't mean it's not a a
high-priced, out-of-reach good.

------
Dirlewanger
No 3.5mm jack, no thanks.

~~~
martin_bech
Does it have a floppydrive?

~~~
WalterSear
Could you recommend a pair of cheap, studio quality, headphones that use
bluetooth? Also a pair of good value, audiophile quality earbuds that use
bluetooth?

Please don't suggest Beats by Dre, or Apple. They aren't either.

~~~
exabrial
How about ones that don't have unpredictable 15ms-30ms latency was well...

~~~
WalterSear
I didn't mention the insertion of shit codecs, either. Or replacing them every
couple of years when the soldered in battery dies (as opposed to my Sony MDRs,
that I've been using almost daily for a decade). Or trying to use them for 6+
hours a day, and keep them charged.

Or the killer feature of knockabout earbuds: that they cost $10 or so you can
use them without worrying about leaving them somewhere, and afford to keep a
pair in every bag.

~~~
exabrial
Another thing, there's simply not enough 2.4ghz bandwidth available in a
crowded environment [like an airplane] for everyone and their pet dog to have
2 channels of skip free low latency high def audio

------
5trokerac3
Freedom from everything except needing a Google account to turn the damn thing
on.

~~~
r3bl
Well, if you stay outside of the Google Play Store, you don't really need a
Google account to get it working. Bought a new one this month, and I was able
to do basic functions + receive a security update before I got home and typed
in the password from my password manager.

------
astrobase_go
at a $700 price point for two years of os updates and three years of security
updates, it seems runner-up to iphones with four year (or more) timelines on
os updates, maybe longer for security updates, for a comparable price point.

~~~
soperj
Generally after 2 years the updates seem to make the Apple product less
useable, rather than more.

~~~
emef
This used to be the case, but I'd argue not as much anymore. I had the 3gs for
~4 years and by the end it was nearly unusable due to updates (noticeably
worse every time). I'm now nearly at the 5 year mark on my 5s and on the
latest ios, no problems. It's not as snappy as my wife's new phone but
completely usable.

~~~
astrobase_go
i would agree here. both of my parents and the wife have just as much time
logged on their full-updated 5s' as well and, save for foreseeable decrements
in battery performance, they think their system performance is generally
indistinguishable from new.

------
briandear
The comment about FaceTime made no sense. On iPhone you can use all the apps
he mentioned. In terms of security, I trust FaceTime far more than I trust
What’s App who, in their policies, make it clear some data is shared with
Facebook. Using What’s App as a counterargument to FaceTime is rather strange
to me. Signal maybe, but you can run that on iPhone just fine as well.

~~~
infinitone
Yeah, i was confused about that... that whole 'closed system' section was much
weaker than i thought. I thought somehow they were going to build a
standardized app that can interface with all these closed apps- but then
again, how would they do that to begin with?

~~~
dreinhardt
Just write an android app that emulates an iPhone.

------
emehrkay
Random but, whenever a new company comes with a dot com that is a standard
word, I wonder how much it cost them. I remember color.com going for something
like a quarter of a mill. Essential.com has to be in that ballpark.

------
nakedrobot2
_It is not available, it is still on preorder / reservation. What is the
purpose of this blog post? Nothing seems to have changed in a couple months!_

~~~
idiot900
Those who preordered can now pay for the phone, as I have, and expect to
physically have one in a few days.

------
tastyfreeze
Not a single mention of the IP rating. For a device that goes with us
everywhere in varied environments the IP rating is important for making a
purchase decision. If moisture is able to get into the device it doesn't
matter how durable the exterior is.

------
tapoxi
Is it just me, or does the selfie camera ruin the display? It comes so close
to being bezel-less and ruins it with a feature I'll never use.

~~~
ktta
You're not alone. Just go to any thread and search for camera. For example:

[https://www.reddit.com/r/Android/comments/6e6f48/exclusive_t...](https://www.reddit.com/r/Android/comments/6e6f48/exclusive_this_is_the_essential_phone/di7ywh8/)

------
PleaseHelpMe
Really dont want to make a joke here but your user name doesn't go well with
the title.

------
toephu2
"your phone will always be secure and have the latest features."

Until 2 years passes...Apple supports their devices much longer than 2 years.

------
hohenheim
I'm not sure what to think of this:
[https://www.essential.com/about#team](https://www.essential.com/about#team)
looking at the security team.

------
wodenokoto
I never buy phones on contract and I don't live in the states, so it can
sometimes be hard to compare prices. But isn't this a fairly similar price to
a similar iPhone/Pixel/Galaxy ?

I mean, isn't this the price range for a premium phone and isn't this premium
specced?

Except for the silly "Everybody should be able to afford craftsmanship" line,
I am having a hard time understanding why people are flipping out about the
price.

I for one welcome what looks to be a great premium phone with better software
than most flagship phones.

~~~
rconti
Yes, it's a premium phone that's premium-priced, same as the competition. I
don't quite get it either.

------
thinbeige
Android is a funny ecosystem. Every month, dozens of new Android phones hit
the market bringing new exciting features like a clippable 360 camera but
still after 10 years, there is no policy in place for direct updates from the
OS vendor (like with iOS or Windows Phone).

Sorry, I was a huge Android fan for many years but I just can't take an OS
serious where 50% of billiona of phones out there won't get any updates
because manufacturers don't get this managed. This is just insane.

------
dahoramanodoceu
Check out postmarketOS. It's porting mobile linux to a whole host of old smart
phones. It's a relatively new (open-source) project, but has already
progressed considerably. A lot of people (myself included) are excited about
the possibilities of having a fully hackable linux phone.

I am not active in the porting side right now, but am prototyping a mobile
computing device that runs pmOS. It's kind of a neuromancer style ono-sendai
portable deck: A rectangular box (approx 11x29x3cm) that you can opem up and
velcro your linux phone into and have a full-sized, stainless steel, porclean,
or plastic mechanical keyboard and foldable mouse with slots for extra memory
and battery life. It is designed to be as compact and as durable as possible,
while staying true to the postmarket name by sourcing from reused materials
whenever possible.

My hypothetical market is mainly highly mobile autonomous individuals residing
in developing world megacities, but I'm interested to know what someone from
the US or Europe thinks about the idea.

Oh ya, one more thing, the profits go to pmOS, to scale up a re-wilding
project, and to getting these hackable linux devices into the hands of
children forced to work in the supply/waste chain of electronics
manufacturing.

------
romanovcode
> Your phone is your personal property.

Oh, come on! It runs android. My phone and data belongs to google.

~~~
mixedCase
I share some of my data to Google in exchange for their services, but I can
flash any OS I want on my phone and I have used Android without Google
services for non-trivial periods of time.

My phone is most certainly my personal property.

------
erikpukinskis
I think Andy Rubin is brilliant, but the more I read about the Essential phone
and its history the more I think Rubin just got used to having a super high
degree of control over his phone over the years, and doesn't feel comfortable
not having a seat at the manufacturer's table anymore.

All of the attempts at differentiation seem muddled. It's upgradeable, not
locked in, except the accessories use a proprietary docking system. It's high
end, but that's an incredibly competitive space.

I would be shocked if this company last more than 5 years before
acquisition/absorbtion.

I can imagine phones that could differentiate against Google/Apple...
something super low end spec wise, that sips power and has a new OS built for
speed. Maybe. I still think a Web Phone is a good idea. Maybe focus on niches
like an exercise phone.

But... Any of this is extremely hard. Rubin just seems to be trying to beat
Google at their own game, which I don't see going well.

------
balladeer
On the surface, doesn't look too different from Moto Z, at least in conception
of modular accessories.

On the other hand I can't charge and use an earphone at the same time which I
often do during long journeys.

And I don't know how much impact will be transferred to the inside parts or
the screen in case of a fall since it's not aluminium body or plastic (or this
aspect is irrelevant?). But a slight fall the aluminium of iPhone SE takes one
more dent or a tiny cut.

Plus, ceramic shatters on impact usually as does glass. Maybe I am missing
something here. Hopefully they have done something to make it not too
slippery. My iPhone SE keeps slipping and for the love of keeping the size and
look as it is I haven't yet started using a case.

Though the clean and sleek look is very good. Hope it succeeds. Though I won't
be waiting for it. I've moved to iOS and it's beyond my price and size range
for a smartphone anyway.

------
baybal2
It literally has a hole in the screen... I thought of that as an april fools
day thing

Who can think of this as a good idea is beyond me

~~~
maxk42
Holy shit you're right.

------
ForFreedom
All these phone hardware manufacturers say their phone is better than the rest
by adding extra. TBH none of the extras are really needed for a common person.

A common person uses the phone for "hello, how are you?" and social
netowrking, games and some productivity. Anything more one would get a GoPro.

I have an iphone 6 and albeit its rather slow at times and receive iOS updates
as the latest phones to an extend.

The android phones in the market takes about a year for an android update to
be out in the market and one would have to be really lucky to get the update.

The phone manufactures in general can claim that the materials used are from
the asteroid or whatever but the phone is actually limited by the OS &
electronics capability

Not sure how Essential Phone is going to change any of this.

------
sandGorgon
If you are buying an Android phone, I am not sure why you wouldn't wait for
phones officially supporting Project Treble . For example , Nexus 6p will get
Android O, but without Treble.

Treble is the framework which could potentially make 0-day Android updates
possible.

------
ocdtrekkie
"And once you turn it on, you’ll find that there are a limited number of
preloaded apps and no duplicative services."

This means every single required bloatware app Google requires in order to
maintain their monopoly. And literally nothing else.

------
bagacrap
"Premium materials and true craftsmanship shouldn’t just be for the few. [...]
we've tried to make our phone as affordable as possible [...] you can get an
unlocked Essential Phone for just $699"

By what standard is this affordable?

------
teekert
Ok, so he starts with a link to his 6 beliefs, I click it, read them then
proceed to read the rest of the post, which contains the 6 beliefs again... I
do like them though, except for the last one ;). Seems like a nice phone, but
it doesn't seem particularly better then my OP3. They talk about freedom yet
it's just Android right? Everything straight to Google right? What's so
different from OP and the Nexus devices which also get updates and are minimal
Android? That screen is nice, 128 GB is also nice. But other than that, I'm
not really feeling it.

------
scblock
Selling but not shipping. No word on actual ship dates on any of the three
linked sites (direct, Best Buy, or Sprint) unless I'm looking in the wrong
place.

Edit: Sprint is currently estimating August 28 on their shipping page.

------
exabrial
Does it have an Ingress Protection (like IP68) rating? Isn't mentioned

------
sytelus
Interesting bits:

\- Dual cameras on back with depth estimation

\- True monochrome images (digital B&W photography!)

\- USB-C port

\- Fingerprint sensor

\- "full" display

Overall it's great to have a phone with foundational philosophy of keeping it
clean, open and play with others nicely.

The biggest missing story is apps. Can I use Google Maps, Drive, Gmail, Now
etc? Out of the box? Will Google Play Store be fully supported? Without all
these apps, phone is just beautiful thin brick. Also, burning question is how
this would stand up against Pixel.vNext which seems to have many (but not all)
of same philosophies.

~~~
minxomat
From your interesting bits, this might just as well be a Xiaomi Mi Mix, wich
has been out for a while and is getting cloned already. No B/W sensor though
(and expansion pins, but I couldn't care less).

It also has a ceramic body and does hold up really well in drop tests.

------
baybal2
Ugh

>You deserve a phone that can resist the trials of everyday use. That’s why we
made Essential Phone out of titanium and ceramic. These materials are harder,
stronger, and more resistant to dents and scratches than the materials that
make up most smartphones. And while costs for such finely crafted materials
are usually reserved for high-priced, out-of-reach goods, we've tried to make
our phone as affordable as possible.

I almost feel how hard he is forcing his engineer self to sound "markety"

------
izzydata
Why are new phones still a thing that people hype over? Until they
significantly allow me to do something new that I can't do on any other phone
it is just more of the same.

------
Grazester
First review: They liked it.

Things I learnt: It uses an LCD(screams, I like AMOLED) and has no
waterproofing. An update for the camera was pushed right before the review was
release which improved it greatly. Seems like a good $500 phone not a $700 one
to me.

[https://www.theverge.com/2017/8/18/16165040/essential-
phone-...](https://www.theverge.com/2017/8/18/16165040/essential-phone-review-
android-andy-rubin)

------
mtgx
> Essential Phone will get guaranteed Android OS updates for 2 years and will
> get monthly security updates for 3 years, so your phone will always be
> secure and have the latest features.

Unfortunately, this is the _maximum_ any vendor can promise to do right now,
as anymore than that depends on the chip manufacturers and such to support
their chips. So until Google changes that somehow by forcing manufacturers'
hand, this will be the best we'll get.

------
tahw
Does anyone know if these phones will work with Project Fi?

~~~
eggpy
From the Project Fi FAQs:

>Project Fi is available on the Pixel, Nexus 6P, Nexus 5X, and Nexus 6.
Currently these are the only smartphones to support our network of networks.
You must have the North American model of the above devices in order to use it
on the Project Fi network.

~~~
coolsunglasses
That's for official support. Project Fi worked fine on my iPhone SE.

However, I had problems with Project Fi sending my calls to random other
peoples' phones across the country even when I was using my sim in my Nexus so
I went back to T-Mobile.

~~~
gaahrdner
I recall it "working" on other phones, but it's stuck on T-Mobile or Sprint
(depending on your phone's hardware), and you lose out on some functionality
since it uses specific bands[0]. Plus you still need an approved phone to
activate it.

0\. [http://arkienet.com/2016/03/fi-on-a-non-nexus-phone-is-
like-...](http://arkienet.com/2016/03/fi-on-a-non-nexus-phone-is-like-mowing-
your-lawn-with-a-weed-eater/)

~~~
bduerst
AFAIK, Fi uses both T-Mobile and Sprint if you have a dual band phone, and
wifi if you're in a building without reception. Most phones have been dual
band for a couple years now.

------
Markoff
display damaged from factory, no waterproofing, no jack, no SD card, no track
record regarding update

no thanks, you are better off with flagship Samsung S8 which cost less

trying to use reputation of someone who was last time around Android in times
of Jelly Bean release and who just copied iOS and completely changed original
idea after release of iPhone, doesn't seem like that good idea for people who
know facts

------
dayaz36
Timing could not be any worse. iPhone 8 will be out next month so even the
people considering buying Essential will at least wait it out another month to
see how the iPhone is. And by then, the spotlight will be turned towards the
iPhone and people will be less excited about Essential. They needed to release
this months ago, as far away from September as possible

------
duncan_bayne
This looks like a 'nice phone' but is nothing like as interesting to me as
Maru ([https://maruos.com/](https://maruos.com/)).

Of course the reason I'm not running Maru right now is that the used Nexus 5 I
bought was a gigantic POS. This phone, plus Maru, would be fantastic.

------
HillaryBriss
_Essential Phone will get guaranteed Android OS updates for 2 years and will
get monthly security updates for 3 years, so your phone will always be secure
and have the latest features._

that's when I stopped reading. does "always" mean "2 to 3 years"?

in any case, AFAIK, that's no better than the Google Nexus/Pixel phones.

------
plopz
Are there any reviews out? From what I can tell reviews are either embargoed
or review phones haven't been sent out.

------
dsr_
If they really made it well, it would come with a declared lifetime.

What it has is a 2 year $99 extra warranty, on top of a $699 price.

~~~
kevinSuttle
Eh, who has a phone longer than 2 years now?

~~~
richardknop
I don't (unless I break or lose phone). I try to keep using the same
computer/phone/gadget for 3-4 years to get my money worth these days.

I just feel like it's a rip off to ask me to shell out £500 every two years
for new iPhone, £600 for new iPad and £2000 for new MacBook Pro (prices are my
best guess, I think new iPhones actually go for as much as £700 with better
specs). So I try to go using my current tech longer.

It's also environment friendly. Bad for companies if more customers start
thinking like this because they depend on selling the same device over and
over again with minor tweaks.

~~~
X86BSD
I'm still clinging to my iPhone 5. Im waiting patiently for the soon to be
announced iPhone 8 and I am only buying the 8 because my poor 5 is starting to
not hold a charge, and is totally out of space and OS updates have ended.

~~~
amartya916
Off topic a bit, but I think this is wonderful. If you are so inclined,
consider trying to replace the battery on the phone. The total cost would be
around $25 (including tools), and you'll have the pleasure of giving the
device a new lease of life (whether you choose to donate/sell later, is up to
you). I recently did this repair myself, and it was easier than I had expected
it to be.

~~~
X86BSD
I thought about that, but combined with EOL software updates its a little
harder to justify just replacing the battery. Ive already had one app I can't
download because the OS is too old.

The OS runs a little slow on the 5's hardware now too. :/

------
natch
I'm sure it's a nice phone, but I cannot unsee that stubby chubby.

Probably a really nice camera though. Other than the look of the camera I
would consider this phone.

Edit: Oh, it's an add-on. So it's like we're going back to the old Danger
Sidekick days when they had that little camera dongle.

~~~
MBCook
Motorola has been pushing their 'MotoMods' as add-on sleds recently too.

'Our phone is so thin! And has a projector and a great camera and a huge
battery! You just need to carry a hand bag of accessories!'

------
user-on1
Essential has any clause like the one mentioned here?

[https://www.xda-developers.com/one-class-action-lawsuit-
agai...](https://www.xda-developers.com/one-class-action-lawsuit-against-lgs-
bootloop-issue-has-been-compelled-into-arbitration/)

------
WatchDog
This phone looks pretty slick, but I really wish it had a headphone jack. My
6p has some issues and needs replacement, and I want a flagship phone with a
close-to-stock Android OS. The pixel 2 is ditching the headphone jack, it
doesn’t seem like there are any other good choices.

------
Mankhool
If you are in Canada, Telus is the only carrier selling them:
[https://www.telus.com/en/on/mobility/phones/essential](https://www.telus.com/en/on/mobility/phones/essential)

------
pbreit
How much different or better is the $700 Essential than the $60 BLU [1]?

1: [https://www.amazon.com/BLU-R1-HD-Exclusive-
Lockscreen/dp/B01...](https://www.amazon.com/BLU-R1-HD-Exclusive-
Lockscreen/dp/B01H2E0J5M)

------
kreetx
I wonder how well this stacks up against the phone Red is making[1], where the
add-on functionality is a major selling point.

[1] [http://www.red.com/hydrogen](http://www.red.com/hydrogen)

------
fiatjaf
Images of the site don't load here. The video of the phone falling on the
ground does, some other images do also, but a lot of the page is gray or black
or blue spaces where I imagine pictures should be.

------
inovica
I replaced my iPhone 6 with a NextBit Robin for $120! The camera isn't as
good, but I love the rest of the phone. I'd rather spend $120 now and see what
else is around in 1 year than $700 on this

------
RcouF1uZ4gsC
They tout the magnetic attachment points as making it easy to add new hardware
accessories.

I wonder if the magnetic attachment points will demagnetize your credit cards
if you have them both in pocket or your purse?

~~~
davemp
I have a wallet with a decently powerful magnet. Modern credit cards and
devices seem to hold up fine. The only issue I've had is a parking garage
ticket getting wiped.

------
homero
I'd pay a lot of money for the latest android with stock root. I thought this
was that but it's not. It's some kind of forked android with no version. Does
it even have Google apps?

------
lucb1e
> Premium materials and true craftsmanship shouldn’t just be for the few.

At that price point, bollocks.

From the title and this subheading I was expecting something around 300, or at
the _very_ least sub-500, but nope.

------
lanius
I'd be interested to see how reliable this will be. I just want a smartphone
that won't freeze/reboot/slow to a crawl seemingly always at the worst
possible time.

------
miheermunjal
Anyone else remember that magnetic accessory connection port? Seems like a
killer feature if done correctly. Or just another "Moto Mod" style feature
that went wrong...

------
bikamonki
Android w/out bloatware is not an "essential" OS. Let me own my OS and I'll
think about spending $700 on hardware specs that I can get for $200 elsewhere.

------
speakeron
I've already got an HTC One M7 that I've had since 2013. It works perfectly
and seems able to continue for another 4 years at least. Why do I need this
phone?

------
1024core
As phones become more and more powerful, the EOL dates should be longer and
longer. Why restrict it to 3 years? Apple supports iPhones for about 5(?).

~~~
iOsiris
Most Android phones use Qualcomm chips, so if Qualcomm doesn't provide long
term support. Neither does any company that uses their chips.

------
PacketPaul
"We guarantee software updates for 2 years"

Damn you Android guys have it bad. Apple pushes the software updates down your
throats years after purchase.

------
tux1968
The battery is too small, only 3040mAh. Just want a phone that lasts a full
day of heavy app usage. No way this is it with that sized battery.

------
georgewsinger
Serious (non-troll) question: How is this phone not (at best) merely
incrementally better than, i.e., Google's Pixel?

------
dcow
I'm still holding out for Ocean Depths.

------
nmbr213
> 5.71"

Nah. I don't get why manufacturers stopped releasing 4" phones. Seems like a
perfect screen size to me.

------
sangd
It's just another high end phone with fancy features. I would like to see more
reviews and its usability.

------
iplaw
I am seeking a dual SIM variant that supports all bands of AT&T and Sprint.
This does not currently exist.

------
andy_ppp
I imagine Essential will get sued by those with big patent portfolios if they
become in any way successful?

------
dwighttk
At Essential we don't promise simplicity... in fact we guarantee it will be
incredibly difficult!

------
csense
I don't care for Android or IOS. Does anyone know of a phone that runs plain
old Linux?

------
codeisawesome
No promises made about privacy even in a honey-talking PR piece, which is
interesting.

------
Aardwolf
No dual sim :( That's basically the #1 feature I want to look for in a next
phone

------
strin
How could this be 10X better than products in the already crowded cell phone
market?

------
antisthenes
Ctrl+F "Removable battery" : 0 results.

Verdict: pass.

No guarantee of software support for 3+ years either.

------
0x8BADF00D
While this is truly an impressive project, both in engineering and vision, I'm
probably not going to buy one. The main reason being that they chose to go
with Android.

They had an opportunity to experiment with offering a FOSS mobile OS, but
instead they chose to go with design-by-committee's poster child.

------
LeonM
It's amazing for me to see that Apple, once lightyears ahead with the original
iPhone, is now being overtaken by small companies with features such as bezel
less displays, wireless charging, high bandwidth data coupling etc.

Of course we'll have to see if Essential can actually deliver on their
promise...

~~~
valine
Essential doesn't need to ship the massive quantities Apple does. And anyway,
Apple is getting ready to announce a bezel-free iPhone in September.

~~~
LeonM
They are announcing after Essential and months after Samsung, so they are
behind the competition.

So, my observation that Apple is no longer ahead of the competition (in terms
of innovation, not volume) holds true.

But of course I am being downvoted into oblivion...

------
aphextron
Can someone explain why this is not just another mediocre $700 Android phone?

------
nkkollaw
A little expensive IMHO.

I've dropped the iPhone a little more than a year ago. I got a Y6II for $179.
Perfect performance, but didn't like Huawei's tweaks to Android.

I just got a Moto G5 Plus with nearly-stock Android and it's the best phone
I've ever owned, and I paid only EUR 280 for it.

~~~
jdmichal
There's also the Nokia 6 playing in that same space. But let's not pretend
that those are in the same "flagship" league as the specs on this phone.
Screen is higher resolution, processor and GPU are faster, more storage and
memory, dual cameras with more MP, USB-C... I mean, almost every spec point
worth caring about is obviously better.

~~~
nkkollaw
I don't know, I can't imagine needing more than 3GB of RAM,>200dpi and 4K
video in a phone.

I'm not saying the phone isn't great, just a personal perspective.

------
nepotism2018
Sounds like oneplus. 700 dollars (540 sterling) is bit steep actually.

------
cedricbonhomme
Someone knows if this smartphone uses a custom version of Android?

------
amelius
What OS does it run? What type of SDK does it provide?

------
lostgame
Umm...we need another Android smartphone, why?

------
legohead
$700 and no headphone jack? what courage!

------
guywhocodes
No 3.5mm headphone jack, never buying.

------
mzzter
Oooh titanium. That's next level.

------
purpleostrich
I'm getting a Piphone, myself.

------
throwaway7645
Anybody have or try one of these?

------
jacquesm
Will it work in Europe?

------
Animats
$699? Why so expensive?

~~~
metalliqaz
Because that's how much iPhones and Pixels cost.

~~~
Animats
Generic unlocked Android smartphones, which this is, run $200-$400.

~~~
metalliqaz
Well, I don't think they want a piece of that market. I think they want a
piece of the high-end market.

~~~
Animats
That doesn't mean they get much of it.

------
sigi45
haha 'essential' and 700$? No.

------
bbtn
Android again?

------
shosko
I was hoping this was a modern flip phone :(

------
arrty88
i bet microsoft acquires them

------
purpleidea
No headphone jack!

NEXT...

------
modzu
all i can see are fingerprints

------
sabujp
too expensive

------
0xbear
Now we'll know exactly how many Andy Rubin fanboys there are in the world. Why
would anyone else buy a $700+ phone from a startup which might not even be
there next year? My prediction: a few tens of thousand units will be sold
mostly in the US, darn near zero anywhere else.

~~~
WaltPurvis
> My prediction: a few tens of thousand units will be sold

Woah. _Tens_ of thousands? I would think a few thousand at most. There must be
more to this story than I'm currently aware of. (This is the first I've ever
heard of it.)

~~~
0xbear
Well, the manufacturing order is probably for a few tens of thousands, and if
sales don't go as they hoped, they could cut the price. As far as Android
phones go it's not a bad phone. But pricing it at the iPhone levels was a
mistake.

------
whipoodle
That's cool... it looks like an Android phone.

------
of
Ugh, I hate the branding. Smartphones are NOT essential. Fuckers.

~~~
dannyr
Ugh, I hate the branding. Smartphone is NOT a galaxy. Fuckers.

~~~
of
Whatever, you know what I meant. But yeah, I do hate branding :P

