
The Rise and Fall of a Vision: Wrightbus Enters Administration - ubac
https://www.londonreconnections.com/2019/the-rise-and-fall-of-a-vision-wrightbus-enters-administration/
======
ch_123
Lots of mention of Brexit in this article, and not many mentions of the fact
that the owners of Wrightbus were pumping huge amounts of money into religious
organizations, as well as giving themselves large bonuses while _at the same
time_ laying people off and declaring large losses.

I'm not saying that business owners should not be allowed to donate to
religious groups, but when the donations in a given year are greater than the
amount of money the company is losing, there is something seriously wrong.

(source [https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/former-
wr...](https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/former-wrightbus-
workers-angry-at-donations-to-evangelical-church-1.4032990))

~~~
earnubs
> In 2018 it reported a loss of £1.7m, citing a difficult UK bus market and
> near non-existent overseas sales aggravated by Brexit.

[https://www.londonreconnections.com/2019/the-rise-and-
fall-o...](https://www.londonreconnections.com/2019/the-rise-and-fall-of-a-
vision-wrightbus-enters-administration/)

> It [Church set up by Jeff Wright] received more than £15m from the firm in
> recent years, most of which was donated while the group was profitable.

[https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-
ireland-49869944](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-49869944)

I'm sure someone smarter than me can explain how Brexit was the cause of
Wright's downfall, especially given Brexit hasn't happened.

~~~
earnubs
> On top of this, comes the inescapable elephant that is Brexit. This may only
> be one of the factors affecting Wrightbus, but it is arguably the crippling
> final blow. Wrightbus is a Northern Ireland based supplier, dependent on
> parts and orders from the EU and beyond, a strong UK economy, and a stable
> period of national and local government. All of those pillars have been
> cracked by Brexit.

None of those things have changed, or been changed by Brexit in this
timeframe.

~~~
michaelt
If you’re an investor making a 5 year investment, or a foreign customer making
an order for delivery over a year and spare parts for years thereafter, the
levels of tariffs are pretty important, no?

~~~
earnubs
If you make a deal to buy a bus (or 1000) today, what tariff would you be
incurring as a result of Brexit?

And if we're post Brexit, what tariff is the UK going to impose on a UK
manufacturer that kills it's business?

~~~
onion2k
_If you make a deal to buy a bus (or 1000) today, what tariff would you be
incurring as a result of Brexit?_

None. There would be no tariff at the moment. Yay!

But... if you buy 1000 buses you don't pay for them right now unless you're a
crazy person. You pay for them in the future, and there might be a tariff
then.

 _And if we 're post Brexit, what tariff is the UK going to impose on a UK
manufacturer that kills it's business?_

If the UK leaves without a deal then the WTO tariffs are applied instead of
the zero-rated EU trade zone agreements that are in place right now. For
'light commercial vehicles' that tariff varies from 10-22%. In other words, a
UK bus manufacturer will never sell a bus in the EU ever again as long as the
WTO rules are in place.

The good thing is that the withdrawal agreement or No Deal brexit is only the
first step on the long and arduous journey that is Brexit. We would work to
negotiate a new trade deal either with the EU or with each individual member.
So, hopefully, that tariff wouldn't apply for ever. Eventually we'd be able to
sell buses in the EU again, assuming the manufacturers manage to survive that
long. It's probably that they'd move their businesses to the EU before that
though, and employ EU citizens instead and pay tax to the new country the
business resides in. It's not good for the UK.

------
calewis
This project was doomed from the start, and was yet another vanity project for
Boris. Great Gaurdian article which references the design flaws from the get-
go: [https://www.theguardian.com/artanddesign/architecture-
design...](https://www.theguardian.com/artanddesign/architecture-design-
blog/2016/jul/27/bikes-buses-bridges-boris-johnsons-biggest-design-blunders)

As I understand, from a friend at TFL, they could have replaced the whole
fleet of buses with electric ones for the same price as this vanity disaster.

~~~
reallydontask
> As I understand, from a friend at TFL, they could have replaced the whole
> fleet of buses with electric ones for the same price as this vanity
> disaster.

This is interesting. Any published analysis, articles. It would be an
interesting read for sure

~~~
calewis
Sadly it was an internal consultation that, unsurprisingly, wasn’t published.
I think there could be good grounds for an FOI request though.

------
vr46
The new Routemaster is really terrible in a few important ways, very cramped
with zero ventilation making it an oven in the summer, although the two sets
of stairs and three doors makes boarding slightly better - yet encourages
fare-dodging. A classic vanity project.

~~~
q3k
> although the two sets of stairs and three doors makes boarding slightly
> better - yet encourages fare-dodging. A classic vanity project.

I don't get it. Many other cities have bus systems where you can enter in any
door and don't have to present any ticket to anyone. Why doesn't this work in
London or Dublin? Is this even a real problem, or is it just scaremongering?

From my experience in the Dunlin, the choke point of having everyone either
validate (or talk to the driver) when entering a bus was _insane_.

~~~
vr46
The bus is part of a system, as you said, but it's only the visible entry
point and when the system is designed around handling individual fares, flat
rates, children, free fares for students and the elderly, as well as making it
fair and equitable (and relying very much on fares for funding), then you have
a bus which must work with that system. Some cities rely on conductors or a
vast fleet of ticket inspectors, but London's public transport system might be
the biggest and most extensive in the world, and some things don't work well
at that scale.

~~~
q3k
I was hoping for actual studies showing that regular fare dodging is an actual
problem in London or in large bus fleets in general. The honor system +
occasional inspection seems to work pretty much everywhere else I've visited,
but again, I'd like to see some numbers on this.

------
tim333
I think it's a shame they didn't leave the back open so you could hop on and
off like the old Routmasters. I guess in the health and saftey age you can't
risk someone falling over but the old ones were really handy for places like
Oxford St where the traffic does like 4mph.

~~~
alex_duf
People walk their child with a leach nowadays, I doubt anyone would feel safe
if that was still opened at the back as you metionned.

------
safgasCVS
The Sterling has fallen by more than any trade tariff that I know of (at least
for any sizeable market where I’ve seen approx 10%) so whenever I read a
business blaming their own failings on Brexit I just can’t take it seriously.
I believe service businesses could rightly claim Brexit as a concern but a
manufacturing business would benefit more from a falling pound

~~~
reallydontask
Isn't the problem that they are sourcing materials and parts from abroad, and
thus affected negatively by the decline?

------
tempodox
At least London continues being a city. New York has long since given up on
that. It's just a collection of car parks and business locations now
(including the overpriced apartments).

------
forinti
Double deckers are awesome. I don't understand why there aren't more of them
in the world: double the density of commuters should be desirable in congested
cities.

~~~
tom_mellior
Many big cities that would be eligible for double deckers already have trams.
And I think there is a problem with the height of the double decker vs. the
typical height of overhead lines for trams.

~~~
chrisseaton
America seems in general to have a lot of stuff hanging over roads - like
traffic lights, signs, electricity lines, phone lines - thing that the UK puts
to the side of the road or buries underneath it. Maybe it's because American
roads are wider so traffic lights at the side of a six lane road don't really
work any more and they have to hang them up for the middle lanes to be able to
see them.

------
cs02rm0
It seems Brexit is the scapegoat for every failure now.

~~~
Jonnax
"The drastic fall of Sterling, as well as the uncertainty over future trading
arrangements with the European Union, have increased both present costs and
future risks for the firm. This has made it increasingly hard to win contracts
outside of the UK."

At the end of the day businesses have higher costs or are leaving the UK
because of Brexit.

There's no point denying the reality. Nobody can argue that right at this
moment Brexit is driving business success.

Bank of America spent $400 million to relocate from UK to Ireland. [1] for
example. And they're not coming back.

[https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.ft.com/content/b9d43bba-2f7...](https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.ft.com/content/b9d43bba-2f7a-11e9-8744-e7016697f225)

~~~
EmbarrassedFuel
Don’t take everything at face value: a fall in Sterling necessarily means that
an exporters products are cheaper overseas, so should boost sales. Unless
their costs were already higher than their revenues, in which case they were
doomed anyway. The reason brexit will be bad for exporters is the possible
future imposition of tariffs. This hasn’t happened yet, so actually in the
short term brexit is relatively good for them. Just to be clear I’m against
brexit, however in this case blaming brexit for the failure is wrong.

~~~
mytailorisrich
Yes, but equally it means that imports are more expensive. We can interpret
the statement as implying that the company imports a lot of parts, etc. Let's
remember that Ireland uses the Euro so they just need to import from across
the border to feel the pinch.

~~~
zelos
If their finished product costs less than its constituent parts, they're kind
of doing manufacturing wrong.

------
rathinmadhu
Awesome

