
Is your city getting ready for autonomous vehicles? - sohkamyung
http://avsincities.bloomberg.org/
======
rrhyne
IMO, making it easier to drive will increase the number of people who commute.
There isn’t enough space to add extra lanes to facilitate the increase in
traffic these vehicles will cause. I think we should be working on other
transportation problems.

~~~
LeanderK
I don't agree. Self-driving cars can solve the "last-mile" problem and I am
convinced that they are actually the most important tool for building the 21.
century public-transportation.

At least in Europe, public transportation is usually pretty good already and
there is a lot of capacity left unused because while trains are going
relatively deep into the suburbs and countryside, they only serve those living
next to it. Self-driving cars could unlock this potential.

Edit: If you look at for example Munich, I don't think self-driving cars will
be a challenge to the public transportation inside the city. But they can help
getting completely rid of your own car (or alleviate the desire to buy one).

~~~
Tiktaalik
Cheaper, more efficient and better "last mile" solutions: Bicycle share in
protected bike lanes, a pleasant walk.

~~~
icebraining
Generally yes, but you still need a solution for the cases not covered by
those, like my 84-year-old neighbor who has kidney dialysis twice a week, and
who can't really walk more than a few meters anymore.

The trick is to cover every case but nudge people to take the less demanding
option if they can. Easier said than done, though.

------
caiob
Ottawa just became the first Canadian city to have a self-driving car actually
on the road. It should be on the list.

[http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/driverless-car-test-
ott...](http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/driverless-car-test-ottawa-
canadian-first-1.4351976)

------
point78
Can we fix polluting vehicles first?

~~~
pavement
Unfortunately, no, because all of the current owners of said vehicles are
incredibly possessive and covetous of such objects, and prone to exerting
their influence of similar attitudes over their peers.

Self driving cars, owned by faceless organizations can be silently converted
after the fact, effectively subverting the psychological ploy of keeping-up-
with-the-joneses style peer pressure, which has held a death grip on the
lifestyles of puny materialistic mortals for decades now, as demonstrated by
beer advertising, cigarette advertising, vacuous fashion trends and so on. In
fact, apply this principle to pretty much every bad habit you can imagine.

~~~
Can_Not
> Unfortunately, no, because all of the current owners of said vehicles are
> incredibly possessive and covetous of such objects

I think most of us can't afford to take out $10,000-$250,000 loans to replace
working assets we already own that have 5-10 good years left on them.

~~~
pavement
Oh, but what about wealthy corporations rendering autonomous vehicle services,
either as their primary offering, or as an ancillary side business?

You could own shares in such a company, purchase a subscription to summon
vehicles at a rate, or buy a vehicle and resell its autonomy, offsetting the
expense. One might view some of these options as a form of collective
ownership, and so it might not just be _you_ owning one on your own, but maybe
contributing to the partial ownership of one or more vehicles.

~~~
Can_Not
I don't live in a place where any of that stuff will be practical or is coming
for the next 5 years.

~~~
pavement
I didn't speak to whether or not this applies to anything expected to happen
within 5 years, or ever at all, or whether you should expect this to be
practical information.

------
manan_doshi
I remember the transport minister of India claiming that he would ban self-
driving cars to protect the jobs of drivers. No city in India is even close to
ready for self driving vehicles.

~~~
kbos87
I can appreciate the core of what he’s trying to do.

Autonomous vehicles can bring about a lot of good. They can also bring about
massive consolidation of work and wealth in the hands of the few fleet owners
that will inevitably emerge.

A society in which driving, one of the principal means of employment, no
longer exists, is going to suffer a long list of negative externalities that
the proponents never take into account.

A better solution would be to encourage the growth of autonomous vehicles but
create an environment in which the ownership of said vehicles is largely
distributed.

------
Someone
That’s not “getting ready for”, it’s “experimenting with”.

Also, cities (mostly) shouldn’t have to “get ready” for self-driving cars;
self-driving cars should start self-driving in current cities.

~~~
fragsworth
But there are a lot of effects on the city as a result, which the city should
prepare for. For example, parking lots will be less necessary in zoning rules,
when people use Uber-like apps and self driving cars.

~~~
Someone
I’m far from convinced we can already draw that conclusion.

People currently are willing to spend quite a bit more than necessary to own
an extension of their home (and, in some cases, their ego) that brings them to
work.

If self-driving cars become affordable, I am not sure that will change. For
example, people who can afford to will still want to store stuff (sports
equipment, spare sets of clothing, and baby seats) in _their_ cars, just as
they do now, so that they have to move it less often.

Also, for driving to work, I don’t see self-driving cars make more than one
trip a day, and cities would likely prefer most self-driving cars to park
during the day, rather than circle around town.

So, given that we don’t really know the effect self-driving cars will have, I
don’t think cities can start guessing at the required infrastructure, given
that it will be expensive and take decades to build.

On the other hand, cities can do one thing that is known to be good,
regardless whether self driving cars will need less parking: build more and
better cycling infrastructure.

------
pouetpouet
Autonomous vehicles and the good city
[https://youtu.be/2kBEvg8bftE](https://youtu.be/2kBEvg8bftE)

------
bonsai80
Interesting lists. Sadly, at the moment all the city links seem to be broken
so I'm not sure what's supposed to be there.

~~~
wyldfire
They worked for me:

[http://avsincities.bloomberg.org/global-
atlas/americas/us/au...](http://avsincities.bloomberg.org/global-
atlas/americas/us/austin-us)

[http://avsincities.bloomberg.org/global-
atlas/americas/us/na...](http://avsincities.bloomberg.org/global-
atlas/americas/us/nashville-us)

[http://avsincities.bloomberg.org/global-
atlas/oceania/nz/auc...](http://avsincities.bloomberg.org/global-
atlas/oceania/nz/auckland-nz)

