
Former Boeing official subpoenaed in 737 MAX probe won’t turn over documents - CaptainZapp
https://www.seattletimes.com/business/boeing-aerospace/former-boeing-official-subpoenaed-in-737-max-probe-wont-turn-over-documents-citing-fifth-amendment-protection/
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jaclaz
I wonder what the actual documents are.

I mean, Boeing should have at least a copy of _every_ document ever produced
by its staff, unless all internal copies of those documents have been
(intentionally or accidentally) destroyed and the only surviving copy is known
to be in the hands of Mr. Forkner.

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meristem
Could be handwritten notes, for example.

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ChicagoBoy11
Your comment about the handwritten note made me think of Feymann's story of
being tasked with find some note that had been scribbled before the Challenger
launch with something akin to "go for it!" or the like. Presumably whatever
was in the note was evidence of some sort of cavalier attitude towards safety.

His conclusion, though, was that this was an extreme distraction and likely
intentional misdirection to prevent them from spending time focusing on the
real questions and systemic causes of the accident. Part of me does wonder how
much of that is happening here. It would do Boeing wonders to be able to
pinpoint as a "root cause" of these failures some sort of cavalier attitude by
a few engineers rather than a very large systemic failure on the part of the
company itself, which includes but is not limited to cost-cutting, regulatory
capture, and abuse of their oversight authority.

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cm2187
It's not necessarily an admission of guilt. If the investigation is about
negligence, and trying to establish whether it was intentional or not, it is a
very grey line and it is understandable that the pilot would be defensive.

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smachiz
Specifically, asserting your 5th amendment rights is _not_ an admission of
guilt in a criminal case.

In a civil case, it may be taken as an admission of guilt - partially because
the rules are different.

There are different standards for guilt (preponderance of evidence vs beyond a
reasonable doubt) for the two. In a civil case, you do not have a presumption
of innocence - and asserting a 5th amendment right can intimate guilt.

According to the Supreme Court, asserting your 5th amendment rights explicitly
cannot be used by a prosecutor as evidence of an admission of guilt -
specifically because you are presumed innocent until the prosecutor proves
otherwise, and you are under no obligation to prove yourself innocent.

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cm2187
But I think the article used "admission of guilt" in the ethical sense rather
than legal sense.

