
Show HN: Automatically Rename HEY's 'Imbox' to 'Inbox' - Mnlfrgr
https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/hey-typo-fixer/caapeklncafkddgbhdhneelnoamcjkin
======
alexwennerberg
HEY looked interesting until I found out they don't support IMAP. When I think
about the problems with email, I don't think primarily about the interface,
but about the fact that the open standards on which it is based are
increasingly being ignored.

~~~
agloeregrets
That’s all super fair, but they also argue this direction allows them to
innovate as well. Notably, their direction resembles a rails approach and lets
the server do more work. (Because Hey is instead just a standard API client,
whereas the client can tell the server things that you just can’t do with
IMAP.)

I imagine with the Apple situation they are working on adding support
currently however, even if it’s reduced. They need an iOS plan B.

~~~
maxsilver
> They need an iOS plan B.

I hope they don't. Apple needs to feel the pain their evil and immoral
behaviour is inflicting on the world.

In a perfect world, the government would force them to behave ethically.
Absent that, Hey's stance here is the next best thing.

If folks like Basecamp don't start standing up to Apple, then nothing stops
Apple from just outright killing the majority of mobile software development.
And while it's not directly their fault, at some point iPhone users need to
recognize that their purchase of an iPhone is directly funding the destruction
of the innovative / creative software they claim to want to have.

If you like Hey, maybe stop buying a phone that's trying to murder Hey. If you
run a company like Hey, maybe stop giving in to the mafia's extortion demands.

~~~
thatguy0900
I wonder if there's any single app company other than Google and Facebook that
could take this stance and have Apple actually care. It's definitely not hey
though.

~~~
maxsilver
> It's definitely not hey though.

For Hey alone, agreed. I don't think they have enough clout.

But Hey is a cool/popular new thing. If the next 20 coolest newest things
_also_ skip Apple as well (because Apple continues this grossly unethical
behaviour) then Apple iPhones might lose their largely-unearned reputation as
the place where the coolest/most-polished apps live.

It doesn't necessarily have to be a huge multinational corporate stance to
make this painful. It just has to be enough of the trendiest new things people
want.

------
_0o6v
I saw "Imbox" and thought, I will never use this product.

~~~
justaguyhere
For me it was their marketing message. Empty, annoying, misleading and filled
with pats on the back, Apple style. Except I can't find anything innovative

~~~
randomsearch
Come on, nothing innovative? It really is innovative. Whitelist screening,
batch replying, proper “reply later” etc

I think imbox is embarrassing, and I don’t like the graphic design, but it’s
definitely innovative and good for them for doing something different.

~~~
alecbenzer
I think there's a subset of tech folks that don't really value UX (which is
like 90% of hey's value-add). It's the same people that don't understand
Slack's value because "it's just over-hyped IRC"

~~~
sqrt17
A surprisingly large subset of those tech folks can and does improve the UX of
their Mail and Chat life using basic scripting on top of a simple but flexible
UI. Both Slack and Hey say F U to that and force you to do everything your
way. No standards compliance, no tailoring of the UX to your actual needs.

~~~
alecbenzer
Focusing on hey for a sec: I understand that some people might prefer a system
where they can take various components and combine them how they like best, in
the same way some people like to cook their own meals.

But what's weird is this sense of anger at products that aren't as flexible.
It's like being upset that a new restaurant opened up because they have a set
menu and don't let you make your own food. If you like cooking your own meals,
great! Keep doing that. This restaurant is for people that want someone else
to make a meal for them.

With slack I understand the frustration a little more, since it's something an
entire company is going to be using and asking you to use.

~~~
pletsch
Counter point: Hey is asking you to commit for a year, if I was going to the
same restaurant every day for a year, assuming the other ingredients are on
the menu elsewhere, I would expect being able to make substitutions and change
meals up a bit.

~~~
alecbenzer
I think the metaphor starts to break down a bit here because variety is
usually specifically desirable when it comes to food, but not really when it
comes to email or any app's workflow.

------
colinramsay
We discussed this at work. It's smug in a way that I can't articulate. Our
first thought was that it was a typo, then we found the actual part of their
website that tells us "no, it's not a typo". Thanks for that guys, I
appreciate you changing my expectation to meet your contrived brand of UX
design.

edit: typo :D

~~~
papito
They committed the cardinal sin of design - not keeping it simple. People will
think IT IS A TYPO, because it looks like one, especially in the age of zero
attention spans. Very few will go on a quest to figure it out.

With new products, humans need an anchor to familiar features in order to feel
comfortable.

What Makes Things Cool
[https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2017/01/what-
ma...](https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2017/01/what-makes-things-
cool/508772/)

------
dsalzman
Not being able to use my own domain name with Hey is a non starter for me.
It’s like not being able to transfer your cell phone number when you switch
carriers. Horrible.

~~~
heavymark
For sure. Their thinking is probably let's see how popular it is before
offering custom domains which are typically for businesses (or techies). The
problem with that is, that the techies are the ones they really need to target
first, since if they get hooked and loved it, then consumers will follow. I
started writing a tweet when I first saw this about the typo then realized
they intentionally misspelled it, and sighed. Reminded me of the days of
working for a company where they felt ever employee needed a special crazy
title. Often clarity is best. Sometimes plays on words work, but in this case
I feel it certainly doesn't.

~~~
andybak
Everyone should have a custom domain. Switching email providers is horrific
without it.

------
DrinkWater
I amazed how much people get annoyed by such a small and insignificant detail.

I also noticed the "Imbox" but i dont believe i thought about it for more than
1 second.

~~~
PragmaticPulp
It's a minor distraction that isn't necessary and doesn't add anything.

When I see a typo, I instinctively go back and re-read the word or sentence to
make sure I didn't misread something.

The last thing I want in my e-mail client is additional mental overhead. It's
a minor detail, but it's also unnecessary, subtracts more than it adds, and
it's easy to fix.

~~~
nhumrich
> doesnt add anything

This entire discussion thread exists because of that one little thing. In
other words, it adds marketing value. Getting people to discuss your product,
even if negative, is still free marketing.

~~~
Brian_K_White
You don't think analysis of exactly that sort of behavior is a valid
discussion or a valid component in evaluation their character? And you don't
think the character & culture of a company is a valid ingredient in deciding
whether to use them and pay them?

I do.

------
klohto
Genuinely need to block Hey in keywords now. The marketing is too much.

~~~
ksec
Are you suggesting the drama with Apple was part of their marketing?

Because I dont see lots of Hey from marketing side, I do see lots of hey on
the argument against Apple App Store.

~~~
dbbk
Of course it is. They've weaponised it to their advantage. The actual solution
to getting their app approved is obvious. But they've decided there's a
greater gain in PR by 'taking Apple on'.

~~~
lghh
> The actual solution to getting their app approved is obvious.

It's not obvious to me. Mind elaborating on what the obvious solution is?
Giving up 30% of your revenue on what's likely to be your largest platform
when your competitors don't have to isn't obvious, so there must be another
option I'm missing.

~~~
dbbk
Yes, the obvious solution is to implement IAP. This is what Apple says they
need to do. That said, they don't have to give up 30% of their revenue, they
could make it more expensive to sign up via IAP if they wanted to offset the
loss. Not great for the consumer, but at least it would work.

~~~
tguedes
No you cannot do this. Apple does not allow you to put a higher price on iOS
than other places. Also the issue is Apple's inconsistency. Netflix and
Spotify do the exact same thing HEY is trying to do but Apple has done nothing
for them because of this bullshit distinction between consumer and business
apps??? Why do consumers apps not need IAP but business apps do?

What they're doing is exactly what mafias do. Look for the weak, force them to
need your help or else, then extract as much money as you can.

I love Apple and all their products but this services growth strategy is
putting a bad taste in a bunch of people's mouths.

~~~
dbbk
They removed the price restriction in 2011.
[https://www.macrumors.com/2011/06/09/apple-reverses-
course-o...](https://www.macrumors.com/2011/06/09/apple-reverses-course-on-in-
app-subscriptions/)

~~~
tguedes
Thank you for the correction, but my point still stands.

------
viktour19
I wonder how much of the annoyance with the term "Imbox" has to do with the
dichotomy between System 1 and System 2 thinking. When I see "Inbox", I put
almost no thought into what it means admittedly because I've been exposed to
the term so many times much less so with "Imbox".

------
trollied
Has anyone used this service, and why should someone ditch their current
provider to use it? All I've seen is the founder kicking off about Apple
murdering kittens, which put me off looking any further.

I've got my own domain hosted on google apps, and it just works. Rarely get
spam, I'm used to the UI, I don't want to change my email address because I
don't need to.

Having said the above, I guess I am not the target audience for this.

~~~
agloeregrets
Apple's behavior here is actually pretty horrible and definitely illegal but
yeah DHH has been hilariously loud in his war here. Granted he probably has to
be to fight the largest company in the world with 50 people.

I’ve been using it for about 3 days so far.

The product is pretty great regardless of the funny spelling, they are
launching a business version in a few months to allow you to bring your own
custom domains. The notable twists I’ve seen so far is the inbox filtering
logic that allows you to blatantly say “I don’t want emails from this address
ever.” Gmail’s “mark spam” stuff doesn’t quite work for this and stuff
eventually gets unmarked. It’s like the worlds easiest unsubscribe with no run
around with unsubscribe dark patterns. The privacy stuff looks pretty good
too. It seems to me that the iOS app is unbelievably fast (ironic
considering...) like time to go from closed app to “see new emails” is easily
A few seconds faster than both Gmail and Outlook. I’m tempted to pay to be
honest. I’ve been really happy. But then there’s the whole “will I ever get an
updated iOS app?” Thing that puts water on that.

Edit: why am I being downvoted? The Head of the House Antitrust Commission
directly called Apple’s behavior out and the EU announced Investigations of
Apple’s behavior. The rest is just my option of a product. Lol

~~~
HatchedLake721
I believe you're downvoted for saying "Apple's behavior here is actually
pretty horrible and definitely illegal" without any substance.

Apple is not doing anything illegal (future regulations might change that),
nor anything horrible.

There might be conflicts of interest between App Store and likes of Apple
Music and Spotify having to pay IAP fees, but there's nothing wrong with
15-30% distributor fee to access a unified market of 155 countries where all
the headache of payments, local sales taxes, APIs, etc are taken care of.

People forget the 2000s with Windows Mobile, CAB files and xda-developers, and
the 50% shops take to get your software/game distributed and on a shelf in
front of customers.

------
brongondwana
We went the other way...

[https://twitter.com/BronGondwana/status/1273790422947487744](https://twitter.com/BronGondwana/status/1273790422947487744)

~~~
brongondwana
More seriously though, I think the internal comment on Fastmail's slack that I
saw straight afterwards nailed it:

"If you have to set up a domain to point to your help pages to explain why
something isn't a typo, you're doing it wrong".

~~~
dewey
> "If you have to set up a domain to point to your help pages to explain why
> something isn't a typo, you're doing it wrong".

It gets people talking, just normal marketing. It's not like people can't use
it without understanding why it says Imbox.

------
d0m
Users of every startups: You have a typo

Founders: Thanks

Users of Hey/Basecamp: You have a typo

Founders: No, this isn't a typo. And we built a website to show you're wrong:
[http://itsnotatypo.com](http://itsnotatypo.com)

~~~
computronus
And, perhaps ironically, that domain name cannot contain the necessary
apostrophe to be spelled correctly, so it itself also has a typo.

------
pgm8705
I am loving HEY so far, but this is one thing I hope they walk back. I get it,
it's not the same as a traditional "inbox," but why does that matter? "Imbox"
is annoying to look at.

~~~
heyoo
It matters because they need to make it very explicit to newcomers that this
is not your normal inbox.

I think they should create a way to rename the Imbox though, so that when
people get it, they don't have to look at the weird "typo" anymore.

------
jahbrewski
Reading the comments and is no one missing out on the irony that simply
choosing "Imbox" over "Inbox" got all of the people on this thread talking
about their product, and onto the front page of HN? Yeah it's goofy. Yeah it's
controversial. That's absolutely the point and that's what gets people
talking.

I think it's genius.

~~~
troughway
Just shows how gullible and hubristic HN really is. "I don't like it so I am
going to complain about it." Good one. I guess every community needs to have
it's own Slashdot moment, at least once.

------
askjdlkasdjsd
Wow, I find it amazing how some innocent founders find their posts/tweets/etc
blocked, ignored or shadowbanned and somehow, if you're someone, you get
attention everywhere for free.

Doesn't seem very fair. I thought at this point hacker news' spam detectors
would flare up and stop bumping everything 'Hey' to the top.

Not trying to put on a tinfoil hat but, there is simply no way in hell to get
this level of PR and attention unless a significant portion of all Hey
activities have been carefully and methodically planned for weeks and months.

I deal with the same difficulties myself and the App store mafia cut is a real
problem but I just don't think I'll ever be able to trust them again with such
aggressive PR tactics.

------
torgoguys
Anyone remember when gmail came out and Google was certain their
searching/filtering/archiving capabilities were so good that they declared you
would never need to delete email again...so much so that they didn't include
delete functionality at first? With enough feedback they thankfully backed
down.

The Basecamp folks are opinionated and strong-willed, so I'm not sure that
they will back down on the unfortunately named "imbox," but I hope they do.
Fortunately this isn't as colossal of a mistake as the no-delete-gmail
mistake, and in the end, it's not a huge deal (q.v., the name of the iPad was
a big deal to some when it came out) but they clearly were too clever for
their own good here.

------
bookmarkable
When Dad jokes turn into UI labels.

------
jnmandal
I've been watching DHH grandstand about this on twitter for the last 8 months
or so. His commentary coupled with the overall marketing message for this
service has made it appear slightly elitist and self-congratulatory but I dont
really mind that since a lot of tech people are that way.

I love rails so I was hoping this would be awesome but between the invite-only
sign up and seeing some of the impractical design decisions they have
implemented, I don't think I will be using it, at least not any time soon.

I really want someone to develop a "better email" for the general populace
that would be intuitive and offer chat-app-inspired improvements that could
really supplant email but seeing what I have this service really seems like
something geared toward techies.

~~~
alecbenzer
It sounds like it's invite-only just until July.

------
marcosnils
Changing my cool and fancy "Imbox" to "Inbox" because I didn't care to test
with users in 3...2...1..

------
janeshmane
Is email actually an urgent problem for people? Most of my personal
communication is outside of email these days. In fact, I have gmail up for
texting more than sending emails. Unsubscribing from commercial email
generally works fine. My inbox feels very much under control. Maybe I am just
not important enough for an Imbox.

~~~
chrisseaton
Yeah almost all my notifications come through apps. I get about five To twenty
emails a day and just action them when they come in. I don’t need to ‘manage’
an inbox.

------
jedimastert
~~I'm surprised no one here has mentioned (or possibly not noticed) that the
developer is an employee of Hey. This is definitely some sort of bad press
marketing thing.~~

Edit: actually, it turns out I'm just an idiot and shouldn't comment on things
before I fully wake up. That's my b.

~~~
dewey
Because he's not an employee of Basecamp / Hey. What makes you say that?

[https://twitter.com/manuel_frigerio/status/12739352538879098...](https://twitter.com/manuel_frigerio/status/1273935253887909889)

~~~
michaelt
jedimastert probably thought that because the developer's e-mail is @hey.com

Which would be a reasonably line of thought, were hey not an e-mail service.

------
samwillis
itsnotatypo.com

~~~
smarx007
This is truly amusing!

------
dvfjsdhgfv
On the one hand, I hate Hey's aggressive marketing, but on the other - any
serious competition to Gmail is a very good thing.

------
shwoopdiwoop
You should charge $9.90 per year for this.

------
solarkraft
I love the name Imbox because it reminds me of Cheems, my favorite character
from Doge lore.

------
saviorand
I endorse this project. Finally, something the world needs (though does not
deserve)

------
blickentwapft
Email is an exceedingly hard thing to change.

Nothing much succeeds in actually changing the way it works.

What does work is developing communication systems unrelated to email ie
slack.

My prediction is that Hey will fail but will pivot into something else which
the developers will take as a victory.

------
makach
This is the extension I was looking for.

~~~
Mnlfrgr
my pleasure :)

------
BiteCode_dev
I love the presentation text.

------
meerita
I saw Imbox and other fancy UI trends and deleted my account the same day.

------
Traster
There is no way that Hey is going to tolerate this 30% tax on their Imbox

------
fortran77
My problem is I associate DHH and the Basecamp folks with the "Web2.0" of
yesterday, and slow, hard-to-scale Ruby and Rails stuff. (Remember the year
when everything looked like the RoR "To Do list" demo app?).

All their branding, personal and professional, is a decade old.

~~~
sho
> slow, hard-to-scale Ruby and Rails

I'm sure the tech teams at Shopify and Sephora, both of which regularly do
50k+ requests per second, or maybe Airbnb, Github or Hulu will be super eager
to hear your opinions about how Rails is slow and can't scale.

------
aurbano
Edit: Missed a word in the quote.

~~~
shhsshs
That sounds like you _can_ export your emails when you’re done.

------
rydre
Lol this is good

------
coconido
Hahahaha love this!

------
robertwalsh0
> But it's not clever. It's just annoying.

To each their own, sure, but yikes there are so many more things in the world
to be annoyed by right now.

