
Ouya Breaks Kickstarter Records - sethbannon
http://www.kickstarter.com/blog/ouyas-big-day
======
eropple
I was one of the earlier folks to put down a pledge for this thing, because it
seems like something I'd like to develop for. However, I pulled it back today
because of the lack of a dev story for it. I was told by the Ouya official
twitter account to just "develop on another Android device", which is a very
shallow answer given the huge differences in gameplay between a touchscreen
device and a gamepad device (and that gamepad-api isn't really viable yet).
That suggests that they don't take the craft of game development seriously,
and to me that doesn't bode well for the platform.

When they have development resources that show me that they're taking
developers seriously, I'll revisit it (and doing so is fairly cheap for me;
I'm using the always-awesome libgdx, which has Android support already). But
my initial experience has been pretty bad, and I'm questioning their
competency right now to the point where I can't give them money.

~~~
bryne
This is pretty telling. You're right on all points from a developer's
perspective, and their line seems to be nothing more than "we're leveraging
the big, wide, Android game ecosystem!"

I think anyone with hardware or Android game development experience should be
healthily skeptical of the tall promises and minimal explanation coming out of
this Kickstarter. I love a good chunk of optimism as much as the next guy who
loves games, but the fervor seems to really be distorting reality and setting
up an inappropriately adversarial tone to these HN discussions.

~~~
eropple
cpuspin: You appear to be hellbanned, though I'm not sure why.

But to reply to you--their pitch may be "working" in the sense that they're
getting pledges, but the amount of the pledge totals is pretty clearly not
going to generate a profit. Without the app store, they're not going to be
making money. Without developers, they're not going to be selling anything in
their app store, which you need to have populated with games _by early 2013_.
Six to nine months is already not a lot of time to put together a game, so you
really, _really_ want to get developers excited for and working on your stuff
_right effing now_.

That's where they're falling over. And it is literally-literally as important
as getting the consoles to consumers.

~~~
jiggy2011
Yes, this is what worries me too. If they wanted to reel developers in on this
what they should be releasing like _right now_ is some documentation for
developers.

Since the hardware is not released yet they should be showing developers how
to emulate as-close-as-possible to this on a regular PC (including which
commodity joypad you should be testing with) so they can be confident that
their game will only require minor tweaking when the final hardware is
released.

OT: It seems to be very easy to get HellBanned from HN which makes it seem
pretty cruel. You only need a handful of people not to like your first few
posts to effectively kill your chances of contributing to the community and
potentially wasting a lot of your time.

Perhaps a system like , you can only downvote comments from users under a
certain karma threshold if you also flag them as trolling/spam

~~~
barista
Its ingenuous how they talk about indie developers. If the founder is as
knowledgeable about the gaming industry as she claims to be then she knows
that game development by indie developers is great and a couple lucky ones
will emerge but the big player come in quickly and take up most if not all of
the profit so any gaming platform that pitches to indie developers is just
creating smoke and mirrors

~~~
jiggy2011
They are advertising this as a platform for existing indie games because these
will be the easiest to get ported over.

I'm sure their wet dream for this is to get an exclusivity deal for a big
juicy AAA title.

------
nicpottier
I hate to be a hater, but can we start taking odds on how big a disappointment
this will be?

I am just going to come out and say that the vast majority of the backers are
going to be really disappointed, this is far too ambitious a project for that
budget, even three times that budget.

If I was Kickstarter I would actually be worrying about this type of project
actually damaging the brand itself.

~~~
wavephorm
I'm absolutely baffled at the HN negativity revolving around this product. If
they deliver what they're promising, I think it is going to be a smashing
success.

I have had a bunch of a neat, simple console game ideas kicking around for a
long time. I want this console to succeed simply so that I have the
opportunity to make them a reality. This console does not need PS3-level
graphics to succeed. Even if Ouya only matched the graphics performance of a
Nintendo N64 I think it could still be a massive success based on the games
that will get created for it.

~~~
cowboyhero
The problem is that this space gets oversaturated easily and the fallout is
quick and brutal. Remember the Jaguar? 3DO? Dreamcast? The Phantom?

All of them had fan support and all of them failed in the marketplace (and the
"open source" Phantom never even made it to market).

There's less vendor lockin with consoles now. Fewer titles are platform
exclusive. Online services are much important than they used to be (notice
there's little to no mention of this in the promo video). The question becomes
bigger than, "How does this console compete with the Xbox?" (which is already
a HUGE question), it becomes "How doe this console compete with Xbox Live?".

This product is going to be openly competing with big, established players
with lots of cash and decades of experience. And it's not just the big 3
console makers. They're competing with SmartPhones and iPad gaming too,
basically any electronic gaming experience you can having sitting on the couch
in your living room.

Fans of hackable linux boxen and hardcore gamers are always super
enthusiastic, but I don't think that demo is large enough to help a company
succeed in the way this company needs to succeed.

~~~
muhfuhkuh
"All of them had fan support and all of them failed in the marketplace"

But the people who are most likely to buy it day one just did, _on
Kickstarter_. Ouya just crowdsourced the customer, the product message, and
the marketplace.

"The question becomes bigger than, 'How does this console compete with the
Xbox?' (which is already a HUGE question), it becomes 'How doe this console
compete with Xbox Live?'."

How does Steam compete with Games for Windows or EA Origin if it is orders of
magnitude smaller than both? How does the iPod Touch and iPhone compete with
(and dominate) the _dedicated_ gaming devices PSP/Vita and 3DS? How did the
Wii compete with the 360 and PS3?

Smaller players with cheaper devices that require no initial player investment
or outlay can be adopted en masse. Think about where HTC or Huawei or LG or
Vizio were before they became near the tops worldwide in consumer electronics.
Vizio wasn't even on the radar 10 years ago, now they are the #1 maker of TVs
in the largest market in the world.

~~~
Arelius
> How does Steam compete with Games for Windows or EA Origin if it is orders
> of magnitude smaller than both?

Did you swap this around? Steam is much larger and more profitable, and has
been around longer than either.

> How does the iPod Touch and iPhone compete with (and dominate) the dedicated
> gaming devices PSP/Vita and 3DS?

The iPhone competes because the hardware as a gaming device has an effective
cost of $0, because you already bought it for it's phone functions.

> How did the Wii compete with the 360 and PS3?

And it seems weird to compare Nintendo with Ouya, Nintendo is a large game
company with a lot of experience in this field, and competes due to a cheaper
console that is innovating in a new and novel way.

------
mindcrime
Oh, this is way cool. Not so much because I care about a gaming platform per-
se, but because it shows that people care about hackable / open hardware, and
that crowdfunding is a viable way to fund development of such hardware.

Given the sentiments expressed in articles like "The Coming War on General
Purpose Computing"[1] - and the debate over UEFI / Secure Boot - it's very
encouraging to see this kind of thing happening.

The availability of things like Raspberry Pi[2] is also encouraging on the
same front.

Here's to the continued development of general purpose computing hardware and
open/hackable systems that anyone is free to use as they see fit!

[1]: <http://boingboing.net/2012/01/10/lockdown.html>

[2]: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raspberry_Pi>

~~~
Sayter
I impulse purchased one because it's a $100 Android console. The "hackable /
open hardware" aspect was honestly irrelevant in terms of the purchase
decision, as a $100 closed hardware console by Sony (Android-based) / Apple
(iOS-based) / Microsoft (WP7-based) would have received the same "shut up and
take my money" response (at least in my case, and that's said as a person with
a Galaxy Nexus phone). It's likely that this view is not unique, so be careful
about mistaking the market as validating a "hackable open hardware $100 gaming
console" and not simply a "$100 gaming console."

~~~
bradfa
It's a $100 gaming console _WITH_ and SDK!

I'm a huge fan of open hardware, but honestly, it doesn't matter if this thing
has open hardware or not, if the SDK is available and they encourage
independents to build games, that's what matters. It's like the Raspberry Pi,
it's open in the sense that they tell you a little about it, I doubt you'll
get schematics and data sheets on all the parts, but that's not the point. The
point is the price and the SDK and the attitude of the company promoting
independent developers.

~~~
pyoung
I think RPi released schematics, see link. On a side note, I bought two of em,
not because I have any idea of what to do with them, but because a)open, and
b)cheap. Just got my first one today!

<http://www.raspberrypi.org/archives/1090>

~~~
bradfa
I said _I doubt you'll get schematics and data sheets on all the parts_

Was in reference to OUYA, not Rasp Pi.

Regarding Rasp Pi, you don't get a data sheet on the SoC though, as you do for
Beagles or Arduino. So, calling it "open" is a bit of a misnomer. Rasp Pi is
only "open" till you want to know what all the register addresses are or
similar, then you need an NDA which is rather "not open."

But now I'm digressing from the point. Being open doesn't matter for OUYA,
just like it doesn't matter for the Rasp Pi. Even without schematics, Rasp Pis
would sell like hot cakes, it's a $30 computer for crying out loud. Same thing
with the OUYA. It's a $100 game system _WITH_ and SDK. That's an unheard of
price the same way $30 for a computer is.

------
physcab
This post says just as much about Kickstarter as a platform as it does about
Ouya. It looks like the time required to raise $1m for a worthy cause is
quickly approaching zero now, which is simply astounding. If I were a VC, I'd
think long and hard about what value proposition I can offer to entrepreneurs
over just raw capital. Because in the (near) future, it doesn't look like
money will be the differentiating factor.

~~~
MattSayar
I don't think VCs should be worried about Kickstarter, at least in the near
future. A VC can see the long-term value of a business idea, whereas
Kickstarter supporters are just excited to get their hands on a shiny new toy.

I think it's a lot harder to get crowds of people excited enough about your
unreleased social app to raise significant capital than it is for a handful of
VCs, who will then have a vested interest in your subsequent success.

~~~
maratd
> A VC can see the long-term value of a business idea

> Kickstarter supporters are just excited to get their hands on a shiny new
> toy.

Every kickstarter project I've supported is always about a product in the
_future_. Including this one. Frequently, that shiny toy is years away.

The only difference between kickstarter and a VC is that consumers are
deciding if the company will eventually deliver a product they want. You just
cut out the middleman. The VC.

~~~
randomdrake
>The only difference between kickstarter and a VC is that consumers are
deciding if the company will eventually deliver a product they want. You just
cut out the middleman. The VC.

I don't know if that's necessarily true.

The biggest difference is that VCs have an interest in the continued success
in the company because they are looking for a return on their investment, not
just the product in question.

------
jhuckestein
Can somebody give an example of a complicated electronics Kickstarter project
that has shipped successfully?

I don't mean to imply anything, I always enthusiastically back these things.
I'm just curious. In one year of Kickstarter pledging history I've only
received two T-shirts (for well over $1000 worth of "purchases"). Some pens I
ordered a year ago are on their way now ;)

~~~
waterlesscloud
Could you give examples of Kickstarters you've backed that never shipped? How
far behind are they? Do you believe they ever will?

My little project today is researching the Million Dollar Kickstarters, seeing
how they're doing.

The Elevation Dock has had some production issues, seems to have some QA
issues. Has a few very vocal critics. But then anything of any size does. It
looks like their main mistake has been lack of communication.

[http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/hop/elevation-dock-
the-b...](http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/hop/elevation-dock-the-best-
dock-for-iphone/)

~~~
jhuckestein
Come to think of it most of them are in the last 6 months and aren't much
delayed. There's Pen-Type A, Ubooly, Pebble, Remee, Blink/Steady, Hickies,
Backpacks by MHM and the Bosavi Headlamp. The only one with a real delay is
Pen-Type A.

------
makmanalp
This one is screaming for a google acquisition, especially with the new google
play brand.

The support from indie devs is pretty nice too, since people have proven
they'll pay for quality indie games with the humble indie bundle, and sony's
co-op with indie devs on games like journey
(<http://thatgamecompany.com/games/journey/>) is a big vote of confidence.

Ultimately, what draws people to a platform are the games, so it's good to
have a bunch of proven games already, and more coming. Now, all it needs is a
few killer exclusives.

~~~
msie
I would be afraid of Google or any other big company acquiring it since it
would result in locking down of the system to satisfy the lawyers. I remember
when certain Little Big Planet levels were not allowed to be distributed
because they contained copyrighted materials: <http://www.1up.com/news/big-
planet-levels-deleted-due>

I want the freedom to load any content from anywhere I want.

~~~
adgar
> I want the freedom to load any content from anywhere I want.

This is completely compatible with preventing the distribution of material
which infringes copyright.

~~~
msie
Please enlighten me with more detail.

------
zdw
I'd love to know which Tegra3 variant they're using - some of them (T33
specifically) have much higher clockspeeds and memory bandwidths:

[http://www.anandtech.com/show/6036/asus-transformer-pad-
infi...](http://www.anandtech.com/show/6036/asus-transformer-pad-infinity-
tf700t-review/3)

As it's a plug-in device, battery life isn't an issue.

Going with the fastest memory/CPU combination would likely be quite attractive
to gaming developers dealing with HD resolution screens, assuming that it
would fit in the budget.

~~~
mtgx
Since they are planning on launching in the first half of 2013, I would _love_
for them to go with Tegra 4 instead, or at least Samsung's Exynos 5, both of
which have new GPU architectures with unified shaders and support for OpenGL
ES 3.0. Tegra 4 is rumored to have 64 GPU cores compared to the 12 Tegra 3
has, and it should have "Kepler DNA". If the GPU cores are at least as good as
the current ones (and they should be), then we're looking at a 5x+ graphics
performance increase, plus the extra features of Open GL ES 3.0 over the 4
year old OpenGL ES 2.0. Plus, it will have a quad core Cortex A15 CPU. It
would be great if OUYA could start directly with these new GPU and CPU
architectures, especially if they don't plan on renewing the console every
year (although I think they should).

Exynos 5250 would also be a great alternative that should be available as
early as this fall with a dual core Cortex A15, and a new architecture GPU
Mali T604, which should also be at least 3-4x faster than Tegra 3, and should
also support OpenGL ES 3.0.

~~~
KVFinn
Every indication seems to show they are committed to the Tegra and it's way
too late to change hardware spec other than adding an extra port.

Barring something like Nvidia stepping in and deciding they'll personally help
out and give them a deal on Tegra 4 for the publicity or something... I can't
see that changing.

It is a bit sad to see that there are 50 dollar Android 4.0 TV sticks selling
from China right now. And they are using Mali 400s which are actually faster
than the Tegra. [http://www.alibaba.com/product-
gs/581994032/hot_sale_mini_HD...](http://www.alibaba.com/product-
gs/581994032/hot_sale_mini_HD_1080P_android.html)

There will probably be 5 more, all faster, by the time this thing launches in
Mar 2013.

~~~
trotsky
While that mali gpu is very nice the extra cores, codecs and ram with the
tegra makes it much more of an all around solution. While the cheap single
core + mali socs that are doing such high volume are damn impressive
performers don't overlook the advantages they get with a bigger name design
including dev boards, long lifetime parts, better qa&docs and the nvidia
developer outreach programs.

------
danso
> _With all our technological advancements, shouldn't costs be going down?
> Gaming could be cheaper!_

Costs _are_ going down. Does anyone remember plunking down $50 to $60 for an
8-bit NES game in 1980s dollars? You don't pay much more than $60 (in highly
inflated dollars) for any game today, and yet you get so much more
_technological_ advancement for your buck.

Whether you get more _value_ is up for debate, of course.

------
olalonde
It's interesting to note that Kickstarter openly admits that 20000 people
_ordered_ the console. I was under the impression that all the money going
into Kickstarter projects were officially _donations_ due to legal concerns.

~~~
shawnc
My thoughts exactly. With that wording, why did Ouya need Kickstarter to do
this?

~~~
cdmckay
I think the difference is, Ouya doesn't have to actually deliver a product.

------
waterlesscloud
I note some enterprising soul added "ouya" to their KS description today so
they show up in searches for the word.

Hop on the bandwagon!

[http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/wizardbox/fall-of-
eterni...](http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/wizardbox/fall-of-eternity)

------
larrys
It seems that even though kickstarter will not fund companies (only
"projects") this is an example of how a company could spin off a stealth
division to organize around a project to get it funded and to prove the market
and pre-sell.

The video done here is very professional and the whole thing just has to much
shine on it.

I'm wondering if projects like this will end up clouding out the original
intention of kickstarter.

The founder (Julie Uhrman) has nice credentials but is described as a "digital
media executive":

<http://www.linkedin.com/in/julieuhrman>

Added: And at least on linkedin ouya is presented as a company and it appears
from here background that that is what she is building.

~~~
jiggy2011
You could also pitch to a VC , "We need $X million to make an awesome video
with an all star cast. We will use this video to raise the remaining $Y on
kickstarter"

------
jwildeboer
They are lacking credibility IMHO. Where's this company located? Whats its
name? Who are the initial VC/Angel investors? Who is on the board?

In their video they show shiny, happy developers, sitting at nice desks etc,
showing prototype boards. This logically means there was a first financing
round to get this far - develop hardware, rent offices, hire people.

The official domain name (ouya.tv) is anonymously registered via dreamhost -
again, no information on the company backing Ouya.

I understand the stealth part of startups, but publicly asking for money
withot any background information is a risky proposition IMHO.

(I did order one though, call me crazy ;-)

------
JL2010
Is it mentioned anywhere that the actual planned pricing (after the product
releases) will be $99? The "$99 Android console!" headlines are great for
publicity, but I wouldn't be surprised if the actual product (if it ever goes
on sale) might be in the neighborhood of $250-$300 while the pledgers are the
only ones that will actually get a $99 console "sold" as a loss for the sake
of generating interest.

~~~
learc83
They've moved up to 80k consoles available at $99, so either they have serious
funding to cover the loss or they are selling them at cost or with a bit of a
profit.

They are taking 30% from all games sold, so it is in their best interest to
get as many consoles out there as possible. I would bet that the retail price
is at or very near $99

------
Aloisius
Am I the only one who doesn't own a TV anymore?

It isn't because I'm pretentious or don't believe in TV, it is just that when
my television broke, I realized my laptop had replaced it for almost
everything already.

I can easily imagine a day when other people won't own one either for the same
reason. The idea of buying a television just to play games strikes me as...
expensive.

That said, I do know of someone who bought a TV just for her xbox.

~~~
jiggy2011
A TV now is more like a large monitor to hook other things upto, whereas in
the past the TV set itself was responsible for decoding the broadcast stream
etc.

A TV still has it's advantages however, they are cheap for their size because
the resolution can remain relatively low (imagine how much a 42" retina
display would cost).

There's also a big social aspect that a laptop does not address, you wouldn't
want to bring your friends round for a movie or a friendly game of wii sports
and all crowd around a laptop would you?

~~~
obtu
A TV is actually worse than a monitor for most purposes, especially if you
want their output to match a video signal:
<http://mjg59.dreamwidth.org/8705.html>

------
Cushman
I wonder if this will light a fire under Apple's ass to finally pull whatever
Apple TV play they've been planning.

------
asher_
I've ordered one, even though I only do occasional casual gaming on my phone
and don't even have a TV plugged in.

I'm wondering how they are able to put all this stuff in a box, with a nice
controller, for their price point. It seems like it would be really hard to
make money on this.

~~~
bradfa
At $100 each for just the systems, I doubt they're making any money from the
Kickstarter. They will make a few $100k from the higher levels, though. What
they're doing is funding the initial build (fixtures, test rigs, plastics
molds, etc) and build hype / excitement.

I assume retail prices will be higher, probably in the $150 range, when
they'll make decent margins on the hardware. Their volumes will be much higher
(probably 2 orders of magnitude) than Panda / Beagle boards (Pandas sell for
$182, Beagle xM for $150, both are profitable). They'll also probably offer
"services" consulting with developers to help them get the most out of the SDK
which will be an alternate revenue stream.

No screen, no battery, no mobile phone radio, no requirement for physically
small size. All allow quite lower hardware BOM costs than equivalent phones /
tablets.

~~~
waterlesscloud
It's something like $90-$95 after the Kickstarter and Amazon fees come out of
it, right?

------
tristan_juricek
Doesn't it seem like a group might be able to use Kickstarter to "speedup" the
something like the process Github used to get to it's Series A? You know,
start a generally profitable business and then work with a very knowledgable
investor to take on a huge piece of pie?

Just seems like a VC might even prefer a group that knows what it wants and
how to get things done. They might be more ready to disrupt. And they might
have a great culture with the right priorities.

I wonder if we'll ever see "Pixar in reverse". A company that can deliver an
entertainment product turn into some kind of revolutionary hardware product
manufacturer.

~~~
veridies
If a Steam console does come out, we'll get to see that for ourselves.

------
dsirijus
I don't really see how their hardware is at all better than the modern
smartphone. Any manufacturer targeted at the same user base and a phone device
designed to support its gaming needs to boot will beat this.

The only way they can spin this is by creating a gaming community around it
which, admittedly, is what they're trying to do. Successfully for now.

------
akmiller
Maybe I'm missing something, but wouldn't it be possible for Google to take
the Q, add more of the Android experience including the full Google
Marketplace, create a nice bluetooth controller for it, and completely squash
this thing? They'd probably need to come down in price about 100 bucks, but I
bet that's doable.

------
maxko87
Just bought one. The technology listed makes it totally worth the money alone.
Not to mention that if this thing has as many developers making (partially
free) games for it as does the Android market now, it seems like this won't be
outdated for quite a while.

------
nhangen
Look at how long it took them to actually talk about the product...wow!
Kickstarter has an amazing ability to talk about themselves as if they create
everything that sells there.

I pledged the $99 level on this one, with limited expectations. I hope they
deliver.

------
emehrkay
Did this thing just shut down any interests with the Nexus Q? I would assume
that it can do just about everything the Q does except the NFC stuff right

------
jiggy2011
I wonder how successful this will be _beyond_ the kickstarter.

I think this will partly depend on who has been donating. How many of these
are developers who want this to develop on, how many are hackers who want some
nice open hardware to build something else on top of and how many are general
gamers who just want a new console?

It's possible that they ship the kickstarter units once they have finished
development but that is more or less it and actual orders0 drop quickly to
almost nothing.

The incumbents have several advantages over this:

They have deep wallets and are able to subsidize their consoles heavily (and
already do). For example they could offer a sale price for an XboX at around
the time that this is released so that the price difference becomes
negligible.

They have retail space, even though many would say that retail is dying.
Walking past a high street shop that advertised a particular product will
certainly increase the perceived legitimacy of that product in the public
eyes. They can also use this hook to wrestle things like this out of the
physical retail space.

It's going to be hard to persuade AAA developers to develop for this, partly
because it is so "hackable". If this does gain some popularity then it's
likely that neighbourhood teenage geeks will do a nice business in taking
these consoles, putting custom firmware on them to bypass whatever DRM and
installing hundreds of torrented games on them, for some ridiculously cheap
fee like $30. XboX gets around this problem by deliberately making this
difficult and risky (having to do a hardware mod, risking loss of XboX Live
service , voiding warranty on a device with perceived reliability issues).

As an example of this a PayTV service was launched in the UK some years ago
but the hardware was made very easy to hack so it was possible to make it able
to subscribe to all premium channels without paying for them. They eventually
went out of business because the majority of their customers had hacked boxes.

All the titles they are gunning for appear to be indie titles, the problem is
that most successful Indie titles will end up on Xbox etc anyway since MS ,
Sony etc are enabling digital distribution. Unless this can get a massive
install base it's likely that Indie devs will only target it as a secondary
platform and will concentrate on XboX etc first.

It's difficult to think of a way to sell this device on it's merits to an
"average consumer" beyond being slightly cheaper than an XBox (but not cheaper
than a second hand one). The only pitch I can think of would be "you can run
pirate games on this". Piracy is also a big part of the reason that the PC was
such a successful games platform, I remember the arguments at school between
console and PC gamers and one frequently trotted out in favour of the PC was
"the hardware costs more , but the games are free because we just copy the
disks".

~~~
waterlesscloud
The biggest question I have-

Say it goes crazy and they sell 100,000 units via KS.

Is that enough of an install base to make it work? Would developers target a
platform of only 100,000 users? How would they get more users?

~~~
vibrunazo
Are all of you guys missing the whole point that this is on Adnroid? They
specifically chose to build it on Android precisely because of this problem.
You're not developing for a platform with OUYA users only. You're developing
for the fastest growing platform in the world with over 1 million new devices
per day.

And on top of that. If you add gamepad support (which will be trivial for most
games, and those which are not won't even bother). And take additional 5
minutes to upload to the OUYA store. Now you're also supporting the OUYA
devices, in addition to all other Android devices.

The OUYA is not just its own single thing. It's just a tiny part of a huge
ecosystem. And this tiny part is helping shape the direction that the rest of
the ecosystem is going. (meaning you'll see more gamepad-friendly games in the
future) You can be sure that the OUYA won't be the only Android console-like
device we'll be developing for. Many more will come to compete with it in the
coming years.

One really big sign of how innovative this is. Is that even many of the HN
cannot grasp what they're doing. Watching the critics argue with each other
here, reminds me of watching the MPAA discuss anti-piracy measures. No offense
intended :)

~~~
jiggy2011
I would disagree that adding gamepad support for existing games will be
"trivial" especially if you care about the game experience at all.

Changing the input type for a game in most cases fundamentally changes what
the game is. It can also mean that the difficultly curve has to be adjusted
significantly because things that used to be hard suddenly become easy and
vice versa.

For a good example of this , look at the original Unreal Tournament on the PC.
The maps on this game take huge advantage of the vertical space and allow for
precision shooting over large distances thanks to the mouse.

Now look at popular FPS games on consoles, most use way less in terms of the
vertical space and typically incorporate some form of aiming assist to make
distance shots possible.

Having the OS based on android will provide some advantage is re-usable game
code but I think this overstates the issues when it comes to porting to
different platforms.

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vibrunazo
Jiggy, it's very clear from your posts on this thread that you are clueless
about both game and android development. You jump from flawed argument to a
different flawed argument after the first flaw is pointed out. You seem to be
more worried about criticizing the ouya out of criticizing's sake, instead of
being worried about the merit of your arguments. Why are you doing this? What
is your motivation to continue with this?

I've already answered your argument in the very post you're replying to. I
wonder if you're even bothering reading. Some games already support d-pad,
others don't. For the ones that do, it will be trivial, the ones that don't,
won't bother porting.

~~~
jiggy2011
Thanks for the Ad hominem.

I often post on HN from somewhat of a devils advocate position (and assume
others do the same), since that's more interesting than the sort of "+1 I love
this!" type posts I see on other forums.

In reality of course I would love this console to succeed and in principle
would prefer something like this to a closed console such as the XboX.

Regards the point about controls: The fact remains that the most popular games
for android currently are designed around touch screen controls since the
overwhelming majority of android devices out there are phones or tablets.

Sure , there are a few Android games that seemed to be designed for gamepads
and were somehow shoehorned onto a touchscreen (the series of COD clone games
who's name escaped me springs to mind). Sure, some of these could be salvaged
into something playable on this console but I would think the difficulty would
still need adjustment since people now have a proper gamepad rather than a
touchscreen pad. Also I would doubt many of these games are particularly
competitive with equivalent games for the XboX etc even with the controls
fixed.

Historically having some impressive launch titles has been an important
precursor to success for consoles. The combination of the release timescale
combined with the lack of concrete information for developers means that it
seems unlikely that such titles will appear in time.

In other words, whilst I personally love this idea, I have no idea how I would
encourage less geeky friends to get one, saying "you can play the games that
you can already play on your mobile phone" doesn't seem like it would cut it.

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scribblemacher
Ouya = Indrema 2012?

