
As Heroin Use by Whites Soars, Parents Urge Gentler Drug War - pavornyoh
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/10/31/us/heroin-war-on-drugs-parents.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&module=second-column-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news
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ohitsdom
A lot of comments here seem against the "racial angle" of looking at the drug
war. But the fact is that the majority of drug users are white, and the
majority of the incarcerated are black. I don't think you can address either
issue independently.

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mc32
Rather than framing this with a racial lens, why not look at this as
evolutionary change in policy given the evidence on europe and numerous
studies showing zero tolerance as being counterproductive.

Coke, shroom, acid, horse users (midfle class)in past decades were dealt the
same zero tolerance policies with no effect, this surge is seeing a different
response in light of new acceptance of recreational drugs and in light of the
failures of past policies.

But you know the NYT will get more views and reactions by framing it as
racial.... But then they fail to look at policies in Latin America or Africa
which are equally punishing, not to mention homogenous places like Japan and
china where punishment is harsher and there are no minorities to oppress.

Is the NYT suggesting we go back to zero tolerance?

It used to be said sex sells, now it's race sells.

~~~
joesmo
Maybe because part of the evolutionary change in policy comes from white
people complaining, an act that's futile when done by minorities in this
country?

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mc32
People including whites, hippies, etc. had been complaining since at least the
70s. We bad similar policies in white countries, we still have them in Asian
countries and African countries. Just because you see coincidence does not
indicate cause.

~~~
task_queue
A small subset complained, but the majority voted for politicians who were
vocal about their intentions to implement harsh laws that would impact the
poor and racial minorities. They also voted for judges and DAs who voiced
their intention to uphold a zero tolerance policy.

They've done this consistently for decades.

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fluxquanta
I was following along through this article right up until the final line:

>Right now she just wants to hunt down the person who sold Chris his fatal
dose. “These dealers aren’t just selling it,” she said. “They’re murdering
people.”

Drug dealers are selling the drugs not out of some kind of malice toward the
addicts. The users want drugs, the dealers want money. Killing the users does
no good to the dealers.

While it's hard to criticize the thoughts of a greiving mother, the focus
should not be "let's punish these awful murderers!" but instead "let's find
ways to eliminate the demand for drugs".

~~~
pmoriarty
I don't agree that we should eliminate the demand for drugs. It's really none
of your business what people choose to do with their own minds or bodies, or
what substances they choose to use, and you have no business trying to
manipulate their desires.

What is needed:

1 - Legalization and regulation like that of regular prescription and over-
the-counter drugs to:

1a - Make sure drugs are pure, labeled property and are not mixed with
undesired compounds.

1b - Stop imprisoning and killing people over what they choose to do to their
own minds and bodies.

1c - Stop the violence and corruption caused by the illegal drug trade.

2 - Much better education about how to use drugs safely and constructively.

3 - An end to the stigmatization of drug users.

4 - A sincere and well thought-through tackling of the issues (like poverty
and mental health issues) that lead to self-destructive abuses of drugs and
other substances.

~~~
fluxquanta
The typical libertarian argument, huh? I don't necessarily disagree, but
there's no chance this would ever happen with drugs like heroin. Marijuana,
sure, but you're dreaming if you think the libertarian treatment of "hard
drugs" is possible in our lifetimes.

There is a chance, however, that we can actually tackle the issue
realistically and improve the ease of access to mental health services and
community programs that decrease the demand for the drugs in the first place,
thereby removing the incentive for dealers to sell the stuff. It's literally
basic economic theory.

~~~
pmoriarty
_" you're dreaming if you think the libertarian treatment of "hard drugs" is
possible in our lifetimes"_

Of course it's possible. Some societies have already done it.

Furthermore, many used to think that desegregation would not be possible in
their lifetimes, that the Soviet Union and Apartheid would not fall, that the
Third Reich would last a thousand years, that a man walking on the moon was
fantasy.

They were all wrong. Those, and many other radical changes have been
accomplished in the last century.

------
clock_tower
If the new heroin users tend to be less violent than the old, there's a case
for being gentler... although I can't help but wonder whether there might be
some substance behind the NYT's clickbait-y racial angle on the matter.

Large-scale use of heroin is pretty terrifying, regardless. Remember that the
Japanese made heroin legal and cheap in China during WWII, as a way of ruining
the Chinese people... It's unsettling to see the US paying through the nose
for the privilege of similar self-destruction.

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gotchange
Was this gentler Drug War demand voiced in response to the perceived failure
of the combative zero-tolerance policy instituted and declared before or this
is just another instance of white privilege?

I'd go for the more logical theory.

More importantly, I'm still opposed to the recreational use of strong drugs
like heroin or cocaine as they're very lethal and can destroy families and
communities pretty easily and I can't see any good use of them.

~~~
mindslight
How do you bridge that chasm between personally not seeing any good use for
something, to declaring that it should be outlawed for everyone?

~~~
gotchange
If not only me who shares the same perspective on something but many others in
the community, I could see a good case for outlawing a certain substance or
certain practice. Of course, it is not about me but the community as a whole

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mfoy_
There was a neat video about addiction on Reddit recently, here's a link to
the discussion:
[https://www.reddit.com/r/videos/comments/3qp6sa/](https://www.reddit.com/r/videos/comments/3qp6sa/)

Video:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ao8L-0nSYzg](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ao8L-0nSYzg)

Disclaimer: The video itself is a bit hyperbolic and some of the examples and
ideas presented are not 100% accurate, but it does support a treatment-first
approach to addiction.

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tonomics
I don't understand the need to use the word 'Whites'.

Heroin has spiked and whites correspond to ~70-80% of the population, so
obviously there will be many white addicts.

The 'Drug War' exists to fight heroin usage overall; it's not targeted at a
race.

~~~
task_queue
Because heroin sale and use was mostly confined to poor and minority
communities. Now a different population is consuming them that happens to be
white and suburbanite.

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gxs
This is hilarious.

First the media beats the drum of, the drug war is evil, the drug war is
costing us millions, the drug war is ineffective, people need treatment not
incarceration..they've been running this campaign for years.

Now that people are waking up to this fact, we're going to chalk it up to
plain old racism.

Give me a break.

~~~
linuxkerneldev
> Now that people are waking up to this fact, we're going to chalk it up to
> plain old racism.

Racism was a significant component of the drug war from the beginning. The
article doesn't seek to "chalk it up to plain old racism", rather the article
seeks to shed light on some of the racial aspects of policy making.

[http://www.drugpolicy.org/race-and-drug-war](http://www.drugpolicy.org/race-
and-drug-war)

~~~
Spooky23
Your link doesn't support the assertion. Yes, crackdowns on crack cocaine
impacted minorities much more proportionally. But remember that the
"innovation" associated with crack was the cheap nature of it. A fast high for
$10.

Overall drug consumers have always trended white. Police resources are focused
on sales, which happens in cities. Retail drug operations are designed around
the laws, so the retail frontline people get swept up as users (because they
carry small quantities), which impacts minority users harder.

