
Does wearing glasses weaken your eyesight? (2014) - walterbell
http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20140513-do-glasses-weaken-your-eyesight
======
drdaeman
> if they don’t have the right glasses they can develop so-called “lazy-eye”
> or amblyopia because they’ve never had a sharp image on their retina

I am not a doctor but this sounds strange to me. (I had amblyopia so I have
read a little bit about it.)

One eye's vision needs to be _significantly_ different from another, to the
extent brain "decides" it cannot merge images and goes mono-ocular.

This trivially happens with e.g. strabismus, when eyes look at different
directions. But with poor eyesight corrected with sub-optimal lenses, it would
require that only one eye sees significantly blurry image while another eye
sees sharp enough (otherwise person would squint or tilt glasses, adjusting
for _both_ eyes - so, no reason for amblyopia to develop).

It is not unusual that a person may have different eyesight with their left
and right eye (IIRC that's called anisometropia), but I think it must be quite
unusual to have glasses that fail to account for this. Even if glasses are
sub-optimal, the difference should be consistent, shouldn't it?

~~~
protomok
You mention you had amblyopia, I'm curious how you got rid of it?

I've had strabismus (i.e. diplopia / double vision) for as long as I can
remember. It's pretty minor and I didn't even wear glasses until my 20s but
it's such a PITA having to wear 2 different pairs of glasses.

I understand there's a surgery that corrects strabismus where they adjust the
eye muscles, just wondering if you or any other HN folks have tried the
surgery. The idea of eye surgery is slightly terrifying but would make coding
(especially late at night) a lot more comfortable.

~~~
drdaeman
> You mention you had amblyopia, I'm curious how you got rid of it?

I had surgery.

In my particular case (large-angle strabismus) this was the only sensible
option - no amount of therapy would've helped in my case.

If you'd consider a surgery, I'd suggest to talk to at least two different
independent doctors (the best you can find and afford) and ask for their
opinions on what your possible options are. I basically got a consistent firm
"no, not for your condition" and that was it. However, I've heard that for
small angles there are ways to fix things with therapy.

Of course, it's somewhat scary but, thankfully, everything went well. The
surgery itself proved to be no big deal - sedatives did magic. I was quite
nervous, but a few pills I was given had really fixed that. However, there is
always a chance of mistake or something not going well, so, of course, one
must be wary.

Actually, I had two surgeries. First one was a little bit off and while it
corrected most of the problem, a very small angle was still left. I've went
through some therapy but, unfortunately, despite my doctor's expectations the
muscle had failed to stretch sufficiently.

However, that therapy had semi-fixed the amblyopia - after some exercises with
synoptophore I was able to mentally force myself to see with both eyes (with
double vision, of course, since alignment was still off). So, after the second
surgely, right after the anesthesia paralysis wore off I got my binocular
vision back. And I'd say, in my opinion that was really worth it.

~~~
protomok
Thank you for the detailed reply!

------
danjc
What an absurd article. It makes a totally unsubstantiated statement near the
beginning:

"Whether or not you choose to wear your reading glasses will make no
difference to your eyesight in the long run..."

Then goes on to conclude:

"But, returning to adults, what I find curious is the lack of studies that
have been carried out in this area."

~~~
codingdave
It substantiated that statement by talking about age-related longsightedness
as coming from the stiffening of your eye, not from any impact given by
reading glasses. You get older, your eyes age along with the rest of you.

------
amriksohata
Everyone in my family said to me as a teen why aren't you wearing your
glasses? You know your eyesight will get worse.

Ten years later as a 27 year old I went to the opticians and they had got
worse by .25 which my optician told me is so nelgigible that people drop by
that in six months.

I know this is hardly a scientific study but I do get suspicious sometimes the
advice to wear glasses is coming from the opticians industry rather than hard
facts, a bit like how dentists work

~~~
dizzystar
I'm pretty sure eyesight, if already bad, degrades the quickest in your
younger years and flattens when you get older. That's how it happened when I
was growing up, and the doctors assured me that I wasn't going to go blind as
my experience was "normal."

I haven't had a significant change in eyesight for a while now. What's
fascinating is how each doctor has a different interpretation of what a proper
prescription is. Some like to give too strong, some too weak.

I switched doctors a while ago, due to a move. The new doctor told me my
prescription and I was a little surprised by the difference. I asked her why
such a change and she showed me what the world would look like if I was using
the prior prescription and it was like seeing a massive blur.

She said she had no idea how I was able to see at all. I was using that
prescription for one year, and I didn't have any problems seeing anything
before.

(I wear contacts and I sort of need to know my prescription so I know what box
goes to what eye as my left and right are different. When I wore glasses, I
had no clue what it was)

~~~
rhinoceraptor
I think you just get used to the glasses you have. For example my current pair
of glasses are a high index lens, and adjusting to them took two or three days
of being slightly dizzy when walking around.

------
ourmandave
Knew a co-worker who'd worn glasses her whole life said her eye sight got
better after she turned 50.

The optometrist told her the muscles around your eye weaken and don't squeeze
your eyeball as well, thus changing the focal point.

~~~
cordite
Someone around that age at my workplace had a moment like that too, in fact he
went from near sighted to far sighted and had to get new glasses.

~~~
walterbell
This HN comment has a good diagram about myopia vs presbyopia:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16196062](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16196062)

~~~
JepZ
That diagram is pretty cool :D

It explains the terms in a visual way with 5 ascii lines (probably a little
exaggerating and not 100% correct, but easy to grasp).

------
walterbell
Previous thread (140 comments) on vision therapy to reduce the need for
reading glasses for presbyopia, which starts in late 40s for most adults:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16194580](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16194580)

------
karmakaze
> Why then do so many people become convinced, anecdotally, that glasses have
> made their eyesight worse?

It's so surprising to me that people never consider their in experience and
wondering. The first time wearing the correct prescription is amazingly clear.
The first time taking them off makes vision much worse than before trying the
glasses. Of course it's natural to question if the latter is 'being caused'.
That of course is only a feeling or hypothesis, so the more results like this
we have the better.

------
bjelkeman-again
I am pretty near-sighted. I started practicing martial arts ten years ago.
When I practice I don’t wear glasses. Several hours a week, where I would have
worn glasses all the time previously. After a few years I noted that I felt I
could see better without glasses than I used to. But my optician says
otherwise. It feels like my brain ha gotten better/more comfortable (?) at
interpreting what it sees, even if I don’t objectively see better. Not sure
what is happening, but I am not complaining.

~~~
walterbell
Vision therapy is only endorsed by mainstream optometry and insurance
companies when glasses don't work, but it has helped some people. You may want
to learn more about the approach you've accidentally discovered.

Neuroplasticity:
[http://www.allaboutvision.com/parents/vision_therapy.htm](http://www.allaboutvision.com/parents/vision_therapy.htm)

Undercorrection: [https://gettingstronger.org/2016/03/faq-for-vision-
improveme...](https://gettingstronger.org/2016/03/faq-for-vision-improvement-
by-hormetism/)

------
fallingfrog
I've always had 20/15 vision in both eyes, so I've always wondered why there
are so many people in the world with bad vision. Actually I can usually bring
the word into focus using someone else's glasses- unless they are the super
thick coke bottle ones, or they have a really bad astigmatism, in which case I
can bring either the horizontal or the vertical into focus but not both. I
wish I knew what I did right, or wrong!

------
logjam11
today there is a pandemic of myopia . if we go to some graduate class of some
university probably more than 50 percent are myopic , though some are wearing
contacts or done laser . if we talk in terms of evolution or genetics ,
clearly these people would not have been able to function before the invention
of specs , and that was may be a few centuries back . So it is not genetics
but something in our environment . That that something is too much near-work
for kids before around 20 years without any opportunity for the eyes to relax
. We are all born with somewhat a smaller size eyeball . The body gets some
feedback from the degree of accommodation from which it elongates just the
right amount . I believe if kids wear weaker prescription , reduce near-work ,
incorporate some good habits like reading from an arms length and taking
frequent breaks then myopia can be avoided or reduced . Myopia has a risk of
retinal detachment , which can be fixed by laser if done within a few days .
For high myopics doing strenuous work like lifting weights or running may be a
risk factor .I believe wearing weaker glasses has many disadvantages , but it
may reduce the progression of myopia for those kids who are prone to it.

------
walterbell
_disclaimer: not medical advice, please consult opthalmologist_

There is a genetic component to myopia, i.e. two people can have similar
closeup/distance/light exposure as children, yet only one develops myopia. If
you are genetically (nature) susceptible to myopia, then lifestyle (nurture)
plays a role in development and progression of myopia. Lifestyle factors
include:

    
    
      % of closeup vs distance vision 
      reducing uninterrupted closeup time
      increasing viewing distance
      light quality/intensity: >10K lux natural vs artificial
      self-awareness of eye strain signals
      outside distance vision (especially with motion)
      sports with fast-moving objects, e.g. ping pong
      use of full peripheral vision
    

Good vision depends on the visual cortex of the brain which processes signals
from the physical eye. Software and hardware. There is a complex feedback loop
between the brain's ability to correct small errors vs. eye muscles
accomodating to change focus and direction. The most advanced work in this
area is vision therapy for veterans with TBI (Traumatic Brain Injury).

Neuroplasticity means that the brain/software can be upgraded with vision
therapy. This is most effective with children where both the brain and eye are
still developing, but it also works with adults. However, it is much more
expensive than eyeglass correction and thus requires special insurance
coverage for behavioral opthalmology. It may be covered by national
healthcare.

[https://aoa.org/patients-and-public/resources-for-
teachers/a...](https://aoa.org/patients-and-public/resources-for-
teachers/a-look-at-reading-and-vision) says: _" Reading requires the
integration of a number of vision skills: visual acuity, visual fixation,
accommodation, binocular fusion, convergence, field of vision, and form
perception. The typical school eye chart test only evaluates distance visual
acuity."_ This means a child can pass the "eye exam" (visual acuity) test and
still have vision difficulty, causing an incorrect diagnosis of learning
disability. Wendy Beth Rosen wrote the only book on this topic:
[https://www.wendybethrosen.com](https://www.wendybethrosen.com) &
[https://youtube.com/watch?v=d-FvbUnxGKM](https://youtube.com/watch?v=d-FvbUnxGKM).

------
brightball
All I know on this is that I was near sighted from the 3rd grade on. My vision
steadily got worse when I was wearing glasses. When I switched to contacts, it
stayed at the same level. Had to go without the contacts for a year and it got
worse again.

Finally got lasik and it’s been perfect for 10+ years.

Anecdotal I know, but still...

~~~
samnwa
My eyesight was perfect for 10+ years after Lasik as well. In the last two
years...had to return to glasses :-(

~~~
walterbell
How much time do you spend on the computer each day? Are you wearing your
full-strength distance glasses when using the computer?

------
jitowix
Of course it does. Go to endmyopia.org. I have improved my eyesight easily in
only a few months. I know I’ll end up not needing glasses because I’ve
understood how it works. Optometrist just want to sell you glasses and don’t
want to tell you how to fix your vision.

------
dingleberry
insufficient light intensity does that

~~~
otterpro
Myopia, at least for children, could be the result of lack of exposure to
sufficient light during the growing phase
([https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DjdkbcOx05A](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DjdkbcOx05A)).In
the research, chicks with exposure to 10000+ lux had prevented myopia, while
the other chicks which didn't get exposed to enough light developed myopia.
The overall recommendation from the study was for children to get at least 3
hours of outdoor activity, even during school. The research showed no
correlation of myopia and close work (reading, computer screen) or physical
activity (exercise, play). Rather, myopia rate was lower among children who
had spent more time outdoor, and also had more exposure to brightness of
light.

I can testify that it seems true, at least for me, because I'm the only one in
the family that has severe myopia, and the only difference between me and my
family member is that I didn't go outside that much and stayed mostly indoor.
Later in life, I had LASIK, but wearing glasses was awful.

~~~
rincebrain
In contrast to your anecdote, my brother went outside far more often than I
did growing up, and his nearsightedness is both much worse and getting worse
more quickly than mine (mine has changed between .25 and .5 over the last 10
years, his has changed by something like 2 in the last 5).

------
constantlm
> There are, of course, two very different reasons why people wear glasses

Actually, three. Probably more. I wear glasses for astigmatism.

------
pfarnsworth
I’ve worn glasses for 40+ years. I’ve never worn contacts. My eyesight hasn’t
changed in over 20 years.

------
emsy
TLDR; no. Betteridge’s law at work

~~~
neves
you missed a dot after "no"

~~~
emsy
Thanks. I inserted a line break but HN handles them weirdly.

~~~
Sharlin
Whitespace gets mostly passed straight to the browser, meaning newlines, tabs,
and consecutive spaces get rendered as a single space. The exceptions are: two
consecutive newlines start a new paragraph, and two spaces at the start of a
line denote a preformatted (“code”) block.

~~~
Sylos
That explains some things. I always thought it was just some badly designed
attempt to prevent comment spam where someone just posts a whole bunch of
newlines.

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logjam11
yes

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rdiddly
TL;DR - They don't know.

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dingleberry
no mention of plus lens therapy

