
The Declining Hotness of Flight Attendants - mshafrir
http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2011/10/the-declining-hotness-of-flight-attendants/246610/
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jrockway
Incidentally, can anyone else believe that the American airlines let these
unions happen to them? They can't even promote employees for good performance
anymore; there is only one criteria that employees are evaluated on, and
that's time in that job at that airline. Change jobs and you're back at the
bottom. Change airlines, and you're at the bottom.

The end result is that the flight attendants that choose the "best" routes
(longhaul international) are the ones that care least about their job: they're
at the top and they don't need to do a good job to stay there. Ironically,
that's where the money is spent, and the people spending that money therefore
get worse service. It's no surprise that anyone who pays for their own flights
chooses the Asian or European airlines.

(My experience flying international first class on AA is that it's barely
worth the taxes on the free flight. OTOH, when my company paid $10,000 for a
flight to Singapore on Cathay Pacific, it was worth every penny.)

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officemonkey
I think you're conflating "poor service" with "declining hotness".

In fact, I think the original article is pretty sad. Does anyone really care
if their stewardess is hot? I don't. I just want them to hand me a can of diet
coke, a napkin, a cup and some ice.

>$10,000 for a flight to Singapore on Cathay Pacific, it was worth every
penny.

Also, $10,000 ÷ 17 hours (SF to Singapore) = $533/hr. For that kind of money,
the hostesses better be hot, naked, and willing to give a happy ending.

~~~
gaius
No, it's a proxy indicator. A 50-year-old can be hot if she takes care of
herself (TV is full of people like this these days, hell the streets are too).
Just as they have stopped caring about their appearances, they have stopped
caring about customer service. If you doubt this, just try flying United long-
haul.

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officemonkey
I'm saying is "hotness" doesn't have a bearing on customer service.

I don't care if my cab driver, dry cleaner, and barrista are good looking.
It's about as relevant as promoting programmers based on what kind of funny
t-shirts they wear.

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jbellis
And yet... there's an awful lot of Mac users on HN.

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elliottcarlson
The amount of jobs listed on HN that are geared toward Mac users is quite sad.
Not that anyone is saying "Mac Only!" but, there have been quite a few posts
that simply ignore that there are skilled developers using other platforms.
When I've brought it up in the past it seemed that my opinion was quite
unpopular though.

Ironically, I am the only developer at my job not on a Mac. Sure I get some
jokes at times, but I am just as efficient as anyone else, and if I had made a
switch to a Mac just to fit in, I wouldn't have been able to hit the ground
running.

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JoeAltmaier
I'm puzzled as you seem to be. I've had to work on many platforms. Mac tools
are immature, buggy and frustrating. The frustration may be due to my
unfamiliarity, but the rest is not.

If so many use these tools, they should be more mature. I conclude that only a
vocal minority actually develop on the Mac.

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mseebach
While the current "un-hotness" of flight attendants might be union driven, I'm
fairly certain there's another dynamic that would kick in if unions go away:
It's simply bad business to fire/not hire good employees because they don't
live up to a certain aesthetic. As the first analysis notes, people probably
aren't willing to pay much, if anything at all, for hotness, while competence
might be valuable.

~~~
brudgers
Throw in greying American demographics, the majority of college graduates
being women, an understanding of the costs associated with hiring and training
personnel, and the work environment changing from Pacific Clippers to Cattle
Cars and the change is unsurprising.

Oh, and don't forget the rise of the MILF meme.

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spodek
"...as much as male customers might have enjoyed the eye candy..."

Statements like this, in the article, annoy me. Men aren't the only sex that
prefers looking at attractive women to unattractive women. Men and women may
have different motivations for our preferences of whom to look at, but we all
have the preference.

~~~
krolley
I don't understand. As a man, would I prefer to be served by a hot man or an
ugly man. Honestly, I don't really care. I can't say the same thing for women,
however.

~~~
nck4222
It's more subtle than that. Studies have shown that babies prefer gazing at
attractive faces rather than average faces.

<http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/3631018.stm>

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airlineuser
From talking to senior flight attendants about how things used to be in the
old days, I think the blogger is correct that strong unions are the reason for
this change in the composition of the flight attendant work force.

As to why you see younger attendants on short flights, that's because long
flights are more desirable for senior flight attendants. The way the flight
bidding system works, a senior fa can fulfill their monthly flying hours quota
by working 8 days of trans-Pacific flights at the start or end of a month,
leaving the rest of the month free.

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rjbond3rd
Southwest Airlines is employee owned and operated, and service is a lot better
(and friendlier) as a result. They love their jobs, and they care about the
experience. That is much more important than physical appearance.

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IanMikutel
So who else thinks Richard Branson read this and sees opportunity for Virgin
Air?

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Corrado
Branson is just the type of owner that could use employee attractiveness to
differentiate his product from the others. As I see it now, the airline
industry is in a sad shape, expensive, homogenous, and bland, not to mention
treating their customers like criminals. It needs something to make me want to
get back on a plane. Attractive attendants might do it.

~~~
mseebach
> It needs something to make me want to get back on a plane.

For me it's getting to my desired destination quickly and without too much
discomfort. If I want to have hot women serve me drinks, I'll go to a
burlesque club.

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jleyank
Two thoughts came to mind: (1) WTF is this doing on Hacker News? (2) If people
are so uncomfortable with unions and labor laws, are they willing to go the
Soylent Green factory when they hit 30, fail to ship or have medical issues?

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jimbobob
I would be interested to see what makes the Asian airlines different... it
seems as though flight attendants there are usually younger and quite
attractive.

~~~
minikomi
I used to teach English in a stewardess school in Tokyo. It is a VERY sought
after position for young ladies just out of high school or short-term language
school. Competition is so fierce, they even teach them how to do their make-
up, part their hair, tie their scarf and ENTER THE ROOM and BOW depending on
which airline they are applying for.

I'd guess it's: competition due to being seen as a glamorous job leading to a
stream of young, attractive new recruits + it not meeting such expectations +
(at least in Japan) girls wanting to get married by 25 and, having English
under their belt and a "desirable" job, achieving this goal and stepping down
to be a salaryman's wife rather than staying on until they're "less hot".

~~~
nandemo
It's not only a glamorous job, it's a very well-paid job in comparison to the
average OL ("office lady"). In fact, the average stewardess annual salary is
higher than the average (male) salaryman's.

So I doubt that the average stewardess is the type that is desperate to get
married by 25 (which would likely imply marrying a guy who makes less than
her!), though you have a point in that when they do get married they'll most
likely retire.

~~~
jrockway
I've always wondered about this, because I've been very surprised that people
that can speak so many languages are serving me coffee on an airplane. But if
the pay is better than sitting in an office and translating instruction
manuals or whatever, then it makes perfect sense to me.

(FWIW, I've never been on an AA flight where all the flight attendants seemed
to be able to speak a language other than English, but every flight attendant
I've seen on Cathay or Dragonair has been able to speak English and probably
Cantonese, Mandarin, and Japanese as well. I always found it very interesting
that people even bother flying US-based airlines.)

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nandemo
(not sure if you're even gonna see this)

I think you underestimate the relative skills/responsibilities of flight
attendants vs. female Japanese office workers. They former are trained in
airplane security and first aid. The latter are just administrative assistants
-- even the few ones that can speak English aren't trained to be translators,
for instance.

For what is worth, I use US or Canada airlines because their Tokyo-N.America-
Sao Paulo flights are _way_ cheaper than the good Asian ones (as in U$1500
instead of $2000).

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itsnotvalid
I still find flight attendants young and attractive (a present fact, not some
dream or whatsoever). The thing is, it's just not so happening in US airlines,
but in Asian airlines. Policies on age requirement have let the state as is,
even there are also unions in those airline companies.

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blackiron
Risking to be downvoted. this article is worthless without pics.

~~~
getsat
Please, go back to Reddit.

