
Show HN: RentEver – Social Rental Marketplace – Rent Anything from Anyone Nearby - usenkanov
http://www.rentever.com/
======
phantom_oracle
This project has big potential to be a very effective tool in neighbourhoods,
but I'm guessing you guys are all techies and not quite sure how to market
this.

Depending on how many of you built this, start populating it by renting your
own stuff and making your area the default location.

As a casual user, I want to see at least _some_ activity on the site.

Also, your landing page is not incentivizing (is that not a word?) renters
enough (or boldly enough).

Create price-points and stuff and draw folks in with money.

Now here comes the interesting part. This might be the first promotion you are
doing. It may pick up on HN (or not) and you may feel shit if it doesn't and
think about abandoning it, but you shouldn't.

Lastly, I'd suggest you try enhancing the "social" side of things a bit more
through something like facebooks graph DB (or "friends of friends").

I won't rent shit to any guy who pings me on your app, but if Tom is a friend
of my friend Jerry, I'll have incentive to trust him because Jerry knows him.

Good luck and keep promoting.

~~~
usenkanov
Thanks for all the suggestions. We are two techies and one more of a marketing
person. How did you guess? :)

Facebook graph DB is a good suggestion that we didn't think about yet. We
won't abandon this anytime soon, though we need more active users to help us
steer in the right direction.

Again, thanks!

~~~
cbeach
I added facebook "friends of friends" features to StreetLend. A nice Neo4J
graph DB powers this. Unfortunately it didn't save the site from the other
issues described in my earlier comment

~~~
usenkanov
That's a very interesting point. We'll probably focus on user interaction
first then. I'd like to think we've done more than enough to make the website
usable for now...

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hurin
Probably the biggest issue here is conflict resolution. How do you deal with
claims, what is expected wear and tear etc. I think this is why in practice
people don't rent or loan their own things to those they don't know.

It's not hard to loan someone a power-tool - but $10 just isn't worth the
potential problems which go with it.

~~~
leereeves
I had the same concerns.

They seem to have chosen to act as a free classified ad publisher and disclaim
any responsibility for conflict resolution, but the business would be much
more valuable if they could improve that.

~~~
contingencies
Valid strategies? Fat deposit, reputation system, other?

~~~
leereeves
It's not that different from trusting an Uber driver/passenger, or Handy
handyman/customer, or Airbnb host/guest.

The strategies are traditional business practices like guarantees, insurance,
and dispute resolution combined with technology to lower costs.

In this case, perhaps an app in which both the owner and renter agree when the
item is loaned and returned, which reminds the renter to return the item,
automatically tracks charges on overdue rentals, and allows some automated
dispute resolution like: "I'm at the owner's address (GPS confirms it) and the
owner isn't available."

~~~
hurin
I think it's not so simple. If someone is renting out an apartment for a month
they can afford to spend time doing paper-work, receiving the renters etc,
because the turn-over per rental is large enough (and Airbnb provides
guarantees for damages).

The question is how is it going to work with the $10/day power-tool. Let's say
even if someone breaks my power-tool it will be reimbursed and I'm 100% sure -
how much time/paper-work will this reimbursement take up?

~~~
leereeves
I agree it wouldn't be worth the paperwork for a single item, but owners could
make a living renting out many items, perhaps even buying popular items to
rent.

And as you suggest, the site would need to make dispute resolution as simple
as possible. Perhaps automatically refunding both sides for disputes, but
banning users with too many disputes.

It's not simple--certainly not as simple as publishing free ads--but that's
why a business that can do it is valuable.

------
cbeach
I created a similar "rent anything" marketplace in 2013.

[http://www.streetlend.com/](http://www.streetlend.com/)

It has some limited traction in London but a very limited number of
transactions. One a month, perhaps. The problem with creating this kind of
site is that seeding two-sided marketplaces is hard. And also, I relied on an
ideal-world culture that sadly doesn't seem to exist in practise. People love
the idea, but when it comes to it they rarely use the product. It's just too
cheap and easy to buy stuff these days.

I spent a lot of time marketing StreetLend locally - flyer and poster
campaigns, local blogs, forums etc. Organic growth won't work. To really get
off the ground you'll need a serious advertising budget.

I wish you the best of luck. It's a product I want to see and use myself.

~~~
usenkanov
cbeach,

I checked your site. It's very interesting. I agree, people love the idea, but
it's not about what people say, it's about what they actually end up doing. It
seems there needs to be a very special approach to crack this nut.

I'd like to chat about this more if you don't mind. My gmail chat:
usenkanov@gmail.com.

------
avalaunch
I doubt you'll get many casual renters because of the friction of having to go
out of your way to meet someone (that might not show up, or might show up
late) for small amounts of cash. I also think not having a good conflict
resolution plan (or insurance) in place is going to be a huge issue preventing
people from using your marketplace. As it is now, I just wouldn't feel
comfortable renting out my stuff without charging a near 100% deposit and as a
rentee I wouldn't feel comfortable giving a deposit anywhere near that amount.

Some ideas:

1\. Figure out a way that I can just drop off my stuff and you'll take care of
renting it out for me, over and over again. I would love to make some extra
cash for my stuff but I really don't want to spend the time and pain of
scheduling, driving to meet the rentees, waiting for them to show up if
they're running late, dealing with it when some of them invariably flake out
at the last minute, ect... I would approach local consignment shops and see if
they'd be interested in being intermediaries where all they have to do is act
as dropoff/pickup locations for your customers. In exchange, you pay them a
either percentage or a flat monthly rate.

2\. An alternative might be a sort of rent it forward strategy, where instead
of returning an item to the owner the rentee holds onto it until someone else
rents it, and then passes it along to the next renter.

Of course, both of these ideas make it much harder to gauge whether the items
are in approximately the same condition as they were when initially rented.
And, at least for idea #1, you'd probably want to add a clause that any item
not rented out within a month needs to be picked up, else the renter will be
charged a storage fee.

3\. Look on craigslist and ebay for professional sellers and ask if they'd be
interested in renting out some of their stuff on your platform instead of
selling it. That might be a good way to populate your inventory in various
cities quickly while making them more money than they'd make by simply selling
the stuff. You might also ask local thrift stores, flea market sellers, and
consignment shops if there are any items they'd like to rent out on your
marketplace.

~~~
qopp
The rent it forward strategy can be completely resolved through just
completely selling the items each time. This resolves the issue of value
depreciation and items getting worn out by using the free market.

For low cost items (i.e. the items on this site)- the price of space exceeds
the cost of the item. In this way goodwill/salvation army could be seen as a
place where you can rent items indefinitely and just pay for the shelving
space.

~~~
avalaunch
Selling the item each time requires each party to research the resale value
based on current condition. It's easier to agree on a rental rate than a
resale value. Also, the original owner might not want to sell it but instead
make a little money renting it when he's not using it. I assume in a tent it
forward system the original owner could request to have it returned at any
point if they needed it.

The cost of space differs greatly per area. In some areas the cost of space
exceeds the cost of certain items but in others not so much. In the Midwest,
for example, a 2500 sq foot house only costs 200k.

------
dopeboy
As someone who started with the same idea and eventually pivoted, I'd highly
suggest focusing on one vertical. Concentrate on solving this problem for a
narrow group (say, outdoorsy people) and move on to other equipment
categories. It will also simplify the marketing and custom acquisition on your
end.

It's a really interesting problem to solve and I'm still bummed to this day I
spent a year on it with nothing to show. I hope you solve the puzzle. Good
luck.

~~~
namenotrequired
Thanks for chiming in! Your earlier part about your experience is popular
among my colleagues.

Out of curiosity, since you say you pivoted, I'd love to see what you're
working on now. Is it public?

~~~
dopeboy
You're welcome! That's really rewarding to hear.

Well the pivot was to a specific product category - audio & video. That didn't
work out either.

Right now, I'm in the process of trying to find a co-founder to pursue an idea
with.

------
ereckers
Is the redirect on the client side? Your link is www.rentever.com with a
redirect to rentever.com and that basically breaks the back button for me.

~~~
usenkanov
Sorry man, we use client redirect for this initial version. We'll try to fix
it in the future releases.

~~~
ereckers
Hey. Cruised back around today. Looks like you got it fixed! Thanks and it
looks like your getting a lot of good feedback on your project. Congrats on
the launch.

~~~
onlyurei
We removed the redirect on client side during the weekend, and a 301 on the
server side is now added so that we always have 1 hostname for all the merits.

Thanks for pointing it out and your warm words!

------
harrumph
Neat! I do echo the suggestion made to focus on a vertical. Here in Chicago we
could really use this as an ad hoc rental marketplace for A/V and audio-music
production gear. Film and event production are stuck with sudden needs all the
time due to bad planning and production variables. If you build in more
protections (insurance jumps out at me here) and focused this squarely on the
local production community, I think you'd seed both sides of the market well.

------
himynameistimli
My suggestion is that if you're focused in Chicago, then market this product
in...Chicago.

I'd like to rent a tent but I'm in Singapore now...and Boston soon.. So you'll
never get a critical mass if it's just alot of people listing things for
nobody else.

Focus on a region where you can build up something (i.e. Chicago) with renters
and rentees, build buzz up in your region and then scale to other regions.

------
namenotrequired
I work for a startup that does something similar. The biggest hurdle will be
to get people to post enough stuff to get a decent fulfillment rate - most
competitors couldn't get beyond 2-5%. Good luck, I really hope you can make it
work.

------
alxndros
Will be fascinating to see how this progresses, we thought about this 2-sided
marketplace problem a lot to all the points that folks mentioned here: is the
risk and time/ effort worth the reward, how do you seed appropriately, etc.

Ultimately we decided to build The Rentaholic, www.therentaholic.com, where
you rent from other businesses. That way availability is guaranteed and the
other businesses are equipped to handle damages and what not. All we do is
provide a platform to connect you and a delivery service so for the renter
it's literally the easiest thing they can do.

Good luck on this!

------
prostoalex
I'm sure you've done your research, but what differentiating factor does it
have from [http://neighborgoods.net/](http://neighborgoods.net/)

------
petersouth
I think this is super cool...but never underestimate just how lazy,
preoccupied, or uncaring people are. I've tried a few two-sided marketplace
ideas and even people who could benefit will still find a reason not to use
it.

Oh, this is industry specific, but there is an unfilled need for ring-saw or
ductile iron pipe chainsaws that can cut clean through 6" diameter pipe.
Called all the tool rental places around and nobody has one. See alot of
construction guys doing way unsafe things because of this.

------
ollysb
People want to own less stuff, we move around more, do less DIY etc., having
stuff is a PITA.

I often want to rent things though, maybe I want a set of glasses for a big
party or a steam cleaner to get the wine spill out that happened during the
big party. I usually buy that stuff now because it's so much easier than
renting.

What I want is amazon for rentals.

------
reustle
Does something like this exist, but for free, and only with my friends (or
friends of friends)? Things I need to borrow probably already exist in that
group, in my area, and I then don't need to worry about weird people,
insurance, money, etc.

~~~
namenotrequired
[http://whyownit.com/](http://whyownit.com/) did this, but couldn't get it off
the ground.

~~~
gloeckler
here's the story about it. put it on google translate.
[http://whyownit.com/blog/we-failed-warum-die-verleih-app-
why...](http://whyownit.com/blog/we-failed-warum-die-verleih-app-why-own-it-
nicht-funktioniert-hat)

------
therealdrag0
Great idea. As a bachelor who doesn't want to accumulate a lot of stuff. I
like the idea of renting a vacuum or iron every once and a while on the cheap.

------
jqm
I think this is fantastic idea. I really hope it takes off.

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UserRights
does exist anything like an open source local sharing app? preferably python,
thanks!

