
Don't like Brexit? We have a plan - beniaminmincu
http://www.transylvaniabeyond.com/
======
lemiant
This is really cool and well done. I'm unhappy with the stats they chose
though.

I thought that 20x less robberies seemed unlikely so I clicked their source.
They were using the absolute number of robberies not per capita. The way they
used it is sneakiness bordering on outright lies. This kind of bad-faith abuse
of stats always irritates me.

~~~
terminalcommand
And not all robberies and thefts are reported to /recorded by the police.
There are vast differences between countries in those numbers. On the other
hand, the car theft numbers is probably accurate, because people need to
report to get insurance.

------
NWDrew72
Let's break down the modern, flashy PR move and check some reality:

LGBT rights in Romania (from
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_in_Romania](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_in_Romania))
\- Decriminalized in 1996 \- Gender identity: change of legal sex allowed
since 1996 \- Discrimination protections: protections since 2000 (still don't
national ones in the U.S.) \- No marriage \- No civil unions \- Adoption
HAAAHAHAAH cmon be serious

LGBT rights in the UK (from
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_in_the_United_King...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_in_the_United_Kingdom))
\- Decriminalized in the 60s - 80s, way before 1996 \- Gender identity: change
of legal sex allowed since 2005, way after Romania \- Discrimination
protections: protections since 2010, way after Romania \- Civil unions in 2005
\- Marriage in 2014 \- Adoption since 2005 / 2013

~~~
vassy
It's very easy for an outsider to judge it like that. You can't compare the UK
with an ex-communist, very religious country. These things can't really change
overnight, it takes a few generations. So yeah, I wouldn't advise any gay
people to go to Romania.

~~~
woodpanel
I echo that. Also, I'm pretty sure that even in such an "ex-communist, very
religious country" there are LGBTs and areas (probably Bucharest) where LGBTs
are rather accepted. If de-jure-acceptance instead of just de-facto is a
dealbreaker for you I suggest come back in a couple of years/decades :-(

------
apopa116
In Romania, companies which have under 100.000 euro / year income are called
microenterprises. Microenterprises have an income tax of 3% which should be
paied quarterly. If they have at least one employee, the tax is 2%. If they
have at least 2 empoyees, the tax is 1%. The tax on dividends is 5% and IT
specialists are free from salary taxes. We moved our headquarters to Bucharest
in Q1/2014, but this autumn the team is moving to Sibiu, Transylvania! Glad to
be here :-)

~~~
woodpanel
This is actually the information I missed on their website. Could you
elaborate on...

... did you move there from outside of Romania? ... if so, how did you
incorporate there? Did you gave your BV/GmbH/Ltd/SA just another address or
created a new company there, that then bought 100% of your old shop?

~~~
apopa116
We're from the US and were looking for promising European land. No, we
incorporated a brand new company(WELOVEHN SRL) not to hassle with bureaucracy.
Which is cool from an administrative point of view. Romanian lawyers seem to
be fluent in English and we still maintain a productive collaboration.

~~~
woodpanel
Thanks for your reply! Do you manage from abroad or did you personally
relocate as well?

Hope your move proves to be a success!

~~~
apopa116
A quarter of our team was working remotely from Romania, so we decided to
relocate. I had plans to go back to CA as soon as everything was in place, but
for a while I wanted a vacation... Then it felt wrong to leave and I remained
in charge. I'll be back, maybe to get more of my friends in Transylvania with
me :-)

------
jstoja
I just find this initiative mind-blowing. In Western Europe, Eastern part has
quite of a bad reputation, especially on subjects like safety or development.
I've recently heard about several good opportunities there and this makes me
even more curious about Romania.

~~~
Fuxy
I Grew up in Transylvania and just took one of my friends with me when I was
going back for a short vacation he loved it.

We actually took the budget flight from London to Cluj and the bus to my home-
town it was a but dangerous at the bus terminal since that's where gipsies
hang out to rob you but if you are careful you should be ok plus there's a lot
of people around so they can't afford you making a scene or the security will
kick them out.

All the other places we went to were quite safe an entertaining.

Mind you I'm a local so I know what places to avoid to not get into trouble so
there's that too however most places are quite safe anyway.

If you avoid bad neighbourhoods and some transport hubs with bad security you
shouldn't have any problems.

------
mariusmg
"Surprisingly high quality of life"

Nope (i'm from Romania). I like the "presentation" overall but some things are
stretched to the limit there :)

~~~
vertis
Care to elaborate on where this website is inaccurate?

~~~
mariusmg
Sure, here's my own personal opinion about some of them :

-Probably the most spectacular nature in Europe

Romania IS a beautiful country (in a old fashion kind of way) but i really
double it that anyone who traveled around Europe a bit would say it has "most
spectacular nature". Dunno, go to Faroe Island (as a example) and tell me
afterwards how "most spectacular" is Transylvania.

-The largest number of tech specialists in the EU

That is actually the most misleading part though. Not sure if RO has the
largest number or not but a potential investor should be aware that most tech
specialist are actually located in Bucharest not Transylvania. And the gap in
salary requirements/ skills between the 2 is actually pretty big (Bucharest
>>> Transylvania). Heck until a few years ago Bucharest was the only IT "hub"
in RO.

-Excellent private healthcare system

Yes and no. If you have a serious health problem , you'll get "shipped" to a
state hospital and those are bad.

-Some of the greatest festivals in Europe

Guess it also depends on music genres. I'm into metal , for instance, and the
metal festivals in RO are definitely not "greatest". It's not like we have
Wacken here.

~~~
apopa116
I fell in love with Romania mainly because of the people. You won't find other
people being so grateful just because you say hi. Next, the nature: sure, Ko
Samui is heavenly, but I'm more into `vampiric` landscapes. We opted for
private healthcare(look into "Queen Mary" \- this is what you'd choose). I
don't know about public healthcare and I don't really care :-) There are two
big festivals somewhere near us: Untold and Electric Castle. I'm a metalhead
too, but Armin van Buuren, Tiesto or Faithless really sound good! Regarding
the number of IT specialists, just read the reports. It's a fact that they
have lower salary expectations, but they're hard workers who eventually end up
in the US. This is why the author of the website is calling for entrepreneurs.
Have a read: [http://teamfound.com/blog/romania-it-industry-
report/](http://teamfound.com/blog/romania-it-industry-report/)

------
davb
This site is pretty broken on latest stable Chrome on Android. As soon as I
start scrolling I see solid white or grey blocks. Sometimes, at certain scroll
heights, I see some text. But mostly I can't actually read the content.

~~~
pmontra
It's worse with Firefox. Scrolling is much less smooth but at least I can read
a little more text (instead of Chrome I used Opera.)

------
bewo001
Yeah, let's move to a corrupt homophobic country.

[http://www.transparency.org/cpi2015](http://www.transparency.org/cpi2015)
rank 58 on the corruption index (behind greece and ghana),

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_in_Romania](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_in_Romania)
54% of Romanian interviewed stated they would never have a meal with a
homosexual. 53% preferred that homosexuality be outlawed. 79.7% of those
questioned would not want a homosexual neighbor

------
dingo_bat
UK is the second largest economy in Europe. That fact is not going to change
just because they no longer count themselves in Europe. If transylvania is a
good place to open an office, it is as good as it has already been. Brexit
shouldn't influence anyone based in London to move to transylvania.

~~~
russelluresti
Did the UK fall below France? So third largest?

------
Artlav
That's odd. First they try to close borders to migrants, and now they welcome
migrants?

How is that supposed to work?

~~~
sampo
They closed borders to migrants who were not likely to set up tech startups.
They try to lure migrants who are likely to set up tech startups.

------
mgalka
Transylvania just earned my respect

------
neil_s
Haha this is amazing! We were already considering moving into a cheaper part
of Europe when we got focused on coding rather than BD, this just makes our
decision a bit easier

------
woodpanel
I like the advertising. I like the timing. But what I like most is that they
have the urge to tackle their future. Without any restraints to make jokes
about themselves to tackle something else: The backwater stereotypes.

This far, I've heard only good things from that area. From people who worked
or studied there.

What I'd expect but didn't see: Is the tax-system competitive? How about the
other performance indicators regarding incorporation, labor costs and legal
certainty?

~~~
apopa116
To answer you tax question, check my previous comment. As for performance
indicators, I quote: "Romania will be an economic growth outperformer in
Central and Eastern Europe (CEE) in 2016, and the second fastest growing EU
economy (behind
Ireland)."([http://www.bmiresearch.com/romania](http://www.bmiresearch.com/romania)).
Also low labor costs, ferm legislation.

------
justinlardinois
Why are they advertising it as Transylvania, rather than Romania?

> Romania is 1st in Europe in terms of number of certified IT specialists. The
> number of engineers per capita in Romania is greater than in the US, India,
> China, or Russia

I've heard anecdotally that tech industry pay is awful in Romania compared to
the rest of Europe. Perhaps the high number of tech workers is the reason?

------
NullCharacter
I'd totally move to Transylvania. Wonder if I can still work remotely from
there... I mean they're only 11 hours ahead of PST.

~~~
apopa116
We're a cyber security company and moved to Romania because around 1/4 of our
employees were Romanians working remotely with us. Sure, if you are willing to
work from home you can find a job anywhere it's available.

------
vlunkr
Ha! That was brilliant. I'm glad the mentioned vampires, because sadly that is
about the only thing I know about Transylvania.

------
srott
The nature is really nice and food is great. But I've been robbed there... And
the way how they achieve the fastest internet connection is really ugly --
cables are hanging from everywhere, historical building or not, it's really
touch to take a photo without cables.

Just google for Cluj cables

------
dyadic
This is pretty and all, but it just seems like an opportunistic ad by the
tourist board of Transylvania.

If freedom of movement between the UK and the rest of Europe is lost by
Brexiting, and they're still willing to accept Brits then I'll be impressed.

------
bronz
this is silly. its a good place to move because its start up friendly? thats
nice and all but its hardly relevant to the vast majority of the population. i
will admit though that most of the people who are so worried about brexit that
they would move to another country are in the age range and socioeconomic
bracket from which most start up people emerge. by the way can anyone list
some of the reasons why leaving the eu will be a disaster? i dont know
anything about the eu.

------
simonturvey
As a Brit I'd just like to say that _that_ is how a country should grasp an
opportunity. Rather than the bitchy whining I've seen from many of my
compatriots so far!

------
reacharavindh
Now that's a way to learn about a country I did not know much about. Great
impression in my mind! Sounds too good to be true though. Any true experiences
here in HN?

------
zaro
Haha.. Funny, I just moved out of there .

~~~
movedx
How come? Anything we should know?

------
hiven
I think it's a great idea

------
ank_the_elder
Author: "R. M. Renfield." Very curious!

------
pboutros
Nice job, Adrian Docea!

------
Fuffidish
Best nature in Europe, sure

