
Why Classroom Technology Is Costing More Than Its Worth (2016) - sdomino
https://thecoffeelicious.com/the-315-billion-waste-why-classroom-technology-is-costing-more-than-its-worth-bdebfcf36026
======
redsummer
Computer tech in education is a con. It is completely unnecessary.

There's a reason Steve Jobs limited his kids access to technology:
[http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-
tech/new...](http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-
tech/news/steve-jobs-apple-ipad-children-technology-birthday-a6893216.html)

In fact, it has opposite effect to what is intended. It gives the child an
avalanche of distraction, when what they need is simplicity. I would say the
same about mobile phones.

~~~
andybak
Doesn't it rather depend on what you're trying to teach? To push an over
simplistic alternative, maybe it hinders the syllabus but necessarily learning
in the broadest sense.

I'm not sure I've thought this through very deeply at this stage but I do have
a deep distrust of formal education. I learned by playing with stuff until it
broke and skim reading chunks of books I didn't have the patience to finish.

Also - the classroom is full of distractions of other kinds. Move here, do
this, listen to this, copy that. There's a huge amount of busy-work at school
that is only tangentially related to learning. Technology might not be a magic
bullet but it's no worse than some of the nonsense kids are put through.

~~~
M_Grey
A huge amount of early schooling is little more than basic socialization,
literacy, numeracy, some vocabulary, and most of all daycare. Later it
ostensibly becomes more focused on learning, but really it mostly just teaches
people _how_ to learn (in theory); that pretty much continues through high
school, and sometimes much of university.

It's a pretty ancient edifice that exists in the current form due to societal,
intellectual, bureaucratic, political and corporate inertia. All of that is
backed by the terror parents feel that if they "get this wrong" the child will
be unable to get ahead in the world (at best) or intellectually/socially
ruined (at worst). This is further exacerbated by parents who, far from
appreciating just how long it takes for real learning to begin (and how much
of it is _always_ self-guided), think the key to raising bright children is
Mandarin in infancy.

------
FireBeyond
The cookware analogy is a really good one.

A similar one can be seen in the arts:

"That's an amazing photo. You must have a really good camera!"

which you see here and there. As opposed to:

"That's an amazing painting. You must have really good brushes!"

(Disclaimer: I'm a photographer and I do know that the quality of the lens and
sensor is going to play some role in the output, leaving aside things like
Photoshop. But my point still stands.)

~~~
rattray
Right, but bad cookware isn't usually so bad it prevents you from cooking.

Bad educational technology can get in the way of teaching and learning.
Errors/bugs and confusing UX can cause lengthy delays in the classroom.

Teachers can easily spend 15 minutes running around playing IT support when
students are using a new technology – out of a 50 minute class which was
scheduled in 5-minute increments.

That doesn't mean it needs to be "beautiful, seamless" software like we tend
to idolize. Or the most featureful or innovative. It _can_ be, but getting
bog-standard basics working without confusion or errors is far more important.
I certainly agree with the author on that.

(Source: previously cofounded an edtech startup, spent time in many classrooms
observing these things).

~~~
mustacheemperor
My mother is coordinator of edtech at a small catholic middle and elementary
school that fully invested in iPad education when it first released. It works
as well as the commenters in this thread can tell you.

The one thing you missed is that plenty of teachers won't spend the 15
minutes. The first time an edtech feature doesn't work in their classroom -
usually because the teacher is using it completely incompetently - they just
stop using it altogether. It took the school almost a semester just to get an
english teacher to stop making the students use paper notebooks because she
resented the tech so badly.

And you can see where the resentment comes from - lots of teachers do NOT tend
towards technical literacy. A lot of them are older and underpaid, and they
aren't going home and plugging away familiarizing themselves with contemporary
tech to "skill up." The reason "kids can't use computers" is no doubt because
plenty of their teachers can't either.

~~~
CaptSpify
To be fair, most classroom software that I've seen is _terrible_. Couldn't her
hesitation to learning tech be more because we've spent a long time giving
them bad tech, so she stopped trying?

~~~
mustacheemperor
You're assuming their technical illiteracy is limited to software. My mother
routinely must explain to teachers over and over that files saved to "their
desktop" are accessible from any computer on the AD, or that Google Drive is
different from email.

~~~
CaptSpify
I'm _well_ aware that there are plenty of teachers who flat out suck at
technology, software, hardware, or any layer in between. But it's not binary,
more of a spectrum.

I'm just offering up a possible reason that someone wouldn't want to learn. I
_strongly_ believe that most of the current "hate on learning new computer
systems" is due to programmers and designers more than cranky users

------
germinalphrase
I'm a high school teacher. I've worked in rural/urban/suburban districts with
wildly varied student demographics and school resources. The largest tech-
related improvements to my teaching have not come from the availability of
"edtech" \- but from run of the mill productivity software (Email/Google
Docs/etc) and students having reliable access to a computer/internet.

I wasn't familiar with K2 Audiovisual before reading the article, so the "free
unlimited training" angle doesn't resonate; however, the base argument being
made is sound. Our tools need to support the work we do; if they are a
distraction or impediment then they will be ignored. I freely admit that there
are some interesting edtech tools being developed, but too many of these tools
introduce significant redundant labor, user friction, and/or force me to
change my goals/processes to fit their vision of what school is supposed to
be.

I have strong feelings on where I think things should go, but I'll just say
that there is a lot of low hanging fruit in just helping teachers accomplish
the things they already know how to do.

There are a lot of teachers out _right now_ saying, "I know [Kid A] would
benefit from [extension/scaffold/resource Y] - but there isn't time to make
that from scratch". Teachers know they should be personalizing their
curriculum, assessment, and instructional performance for what each kid needs.
They will typically even know how to accomplish it.

They are logistically constrained from doing so and most edtech tools aren't
offering solutions to the kinds of workflow problems that teachers face
everyday.

Edit: I have been drilling down on some ideas with another HN member
(andrewwhartion). Principally, focused on teacher workflow tools. Email is in
profile.

~~~
panzagl
Heck, I'd be happy if edtech companies could figure out Sunday evening is not
the best time to do maintenance of their gradebook/lesson plan applications.
Then I might even be able to convince my wife to get rid of her paper
gradebook...

~~~
germinalphrase
I remember getting locked out of our grade book one evening around 5:30-6.
When I chatted with the IT guy the following day he said the edtech company
didn't think teachers worked after 3 p.m. so some unannounced maintenance
should be A-OK!

------
Endama
I work at an EdTech company right now and we've found huge success simply
because we've tried to get out of the way and let teachers do what they do.
Teachers today have a hard enough time without tech companies, policy makers,
administrators, etc. barging into their classrooms and dictating the best way
to instruct their kids.

Like germinalphrase mentioned, I think the best place for tech in education is
to "[offer] solutions to the kinds of... problems that teachers face everyday"
and to make the existing successes even more impactful (e.g. when a student
does well, provide ways for teachers, parents, and students to celebrate
together).

Teachers know their kids and their struggles best, the tech just has to help
them do what they do.

~~~
CaptSpify
Doesn't that heavily depend on the teacher though? I don't disagree with you
in principle, but couldn't the reason so many people try to dictate the best
way to teach is because there are a lot of bad teachers?

~~~
Endama
I'm not going to argue that there aren't bad teachers or there aren't a LOT of
bad teachers. But IMHO a lot of what I have seen at my company is the
following:

If a kid brings home a bad report card - Parents often blame the teacher.
Obviously, their kid is great, the only reason they are struggling is because
of negligent or poor instruction.

If a kid brings home a behavior citation (i.e. teacher/administration called
home and said their kid was poorly behaved) - Parents may or may not recognize
themselves as a contributor to that poor behavior.

But for the teacher, it doesn't really matter. If there is one poorly behaved
kid in the class, it's going to make it harder for that teacher to instruct
every single kid.

It often seems that the problem isn't a glut of "bad teachers", it's that the
structures placed around the teachers all too often seem to be set up for them
to fail. It's no surprise then that 40%-50% of teachers quit the profession
entirely within five years
[http://www.edweek.org/ew/articles/2012/05/16/kappan_ingersol...](http://www.edweek.org/ew/articles/2012/05/16/kappan_ingersoll.h31.html)

~~~
CaptSpify
Interesting. Yeah, I _definitely_ think that generally parent's are much more
at fault than they want to admit. Blaming the teacher is an easy way out.

I'm not knowledgeable in the industry, which is why I'm asking. I know that
for most industries, standards and structures are in place to protect damage
from the _worst_ people, but can definitely inhibit the _best_ people.

------
Jtsummers
While interesting, and anecdotally seems correct to me, does anyone here with
a background in education and/or education technology have any pointers on
actionable ways to use technology more effectively? This piece never seems to
get to that point, other than strongly encouraging training for teachers (that
they provide if you go with their solutions).

~~~
jbob2000
My partner worked at a school that handed out iPads to the middle school
students for use in class.

Hearing what they use them for just makes me think that Apple needed someone
to dump last year's leftover iPads on. It's really dumb stuff. They don't get
access to the internet. They get a handful of stupid "learning" apps to use
and a social network type thing that can be summed up as "instagram where
mommy and teacher watch and control everything".

The devices are so locked up that inquisitive kids ignore them, dumb kids
never figure them out, and everyone in between just kinda lugs them around
because they have to.

I am beginning to think that tech capitalists have milked the general market
and are now turning to the next juicy targets of education and healthcare.

~~~
GordonS
Totally agree here. I'm in the UK and my daughter's primary school has bought
dozens of iPads (which are not exactly the most economical tablet), and they
are used for things that could otherwise be done (and likely with better
results too) in the real world, such as moving objects around for basic maths.
Crazy waste of funds.

~~~
monk_e_boy
I disagree. A school without basic technology like computers and tablets?
Blimey, you want us to go back to slates and chalk?

Most schools have 3D printers, VR headsets, iPads. We need to teach kids about
technology they will be using in 10 - 15 years time when they hit the job
market.

We can't send kids out into a career without having used an iPad. Some kids
don't have access to tech or the internet at home, now you want to take it
away at school? Shame on you.

~~~
GordonS
> We can't send kids out into a career without having used an iPad

Other than 'app developer', what actual careers involve using specifically an
iPad, let alone a generic tablet?

> Most schools have 3D printers, VR headsets, iPads _Tablets_ sure, not
> necessarily iPads. 3D printers and VR headsets?! I'm talking about _primary
> school_ , kids aged 5-11 - it would be rare for even secondary schools in
> the UK to have 3D printers or VR headsets. You used the word 'blimey', so I
> assume you are either English or taking the piss?!

Most kids get enough of tablets at home nowadays. Christ, all too many parents
plonk their kid in front of a tablet and leave them to it for hours at a time.

I'm not saying tech doesn't have a place, it absolutely does, but _sometimes_
the real, tactile world is the best place to learn - like for 5 year-olds
learning basic maths, reading and writing.

~~~
j2bax
I've seen many non-technical professionals using iPad's. In many cases they
are replacing laptops in meetings. They are used in manufacturing
environments. They are used in hospitals, airports etc etc. That said, my 80
year old grandmother learned to be pretty proficient on an iPad in a matter of
a few hours, so I'm not really that concerned about people being able to pick
up general tablet usage outside of school.

~~~
robertlagrant
This is exactly the point - no one needs to be taught how to use an iPad. It's
some MBA trying to push "educational strategy". No one who invented any part
of an iPad grew up with one.

The further into my tech career I go, the more I like a bog standard
whiteboard and a notebook and pen. They let me focus on thinking about hard
stuff, instead of thinking about how to use some oversold software.

------
partycoder
Many schools do not make proper use of computer labs.

While you could teach practical skills such as

\- how to process images, audio, video

\- how to code

\- math beyond silly games featuring anthropomorphic neotenized animals

\- workshops for chess and go

\- use one of the awesome open source software for chemistry, geometry,
astronomy, etc...

Only use for computers is for people to write documents, search online, print
and... waste a lot of time on games, social networks.

~~~
milesrout
>While you could teach practical skills such as

Those aren't practical skills that need to be taught to secondary school
students. They need to learn mathematics, writing, reading, literature,
science, etc. They don't need to learn how to code, they don't need to learn
how to make memes in Paint or youtube videos of themselves playing minecraft,
nor how to play irrelevant (if fun) games like Chess.

>Only use for computers is for people to write documents, search online, print
and... waste a lot of time on games, social networks.

We certainly were not allowed to be on social networks or games during
computer lab time whe{re,n} I went to high school.

>Then, test taking could use more automation. Lots of teachers do their test
taking by hand... Grading tests without an written answer is very easy to
implement.

That's simply not true. Test taking is done in written form for good reason.
It's possible to draw diagrammes, to write emphasis, use italics, etc. without
learning some arcane editor or (worse) syntax when you're meant to be doing a
test.

Marking tests without a written answer might be easy to implement, but that
just encourages more __fucking shit __tests like they have in the US, where
there are few written answers. __EVERY __test should be __ENTIRELY __written
answers.

~~~
partycoder
Those skills that you called unpractical are actually valuable in today's
service economy, and helped me put food on the table for years as well as pay
for higher education.

Then no matter what activity you pick in life, being self-sufficient with
regards to presenting and illustrating your ideas or doing some basic
marketing is always valuable.

Same with code. Even if you do not plan to be a programmer, having a basic
understanding what programming is can help you in interdisciplinary settings.

Written questions and diagrams are a good idea. But tests can be constructed
in many ways. For alternative based questions grading with computer can be
more productive and less error-prone, freeing the teacher to focus in more
important tasks such as preparing lessons.

------
rrggrr
Chromebooks, quizlets, etc. ARE working in my kids schools. There is a lot of
time and money spent teaching the teachers, and there is a high % of teachers
with specialized training to start with. The tech is hard on the parents who
complain about not being able to assist, monitor and support easily, if at
all.

------
jderoner
What a great way to build empathy and connection in a sales conversation.
These are the type of people I love to meet in EdTech!

I couldn't agree more with the author's assessment. A bit of an extension
beyond just training in new tools: we need to help adults in schools
understand the value technology can provide in their daily lives before we can
expect to see the true potential out of the complex technologies schools are
spending billions of dollars on - looking at you blended learning and [fill in
other buzzword technologies].

If an adult in a school doesn't appreciate the value that basic everyday tools
provide (I'm talking things like calendars and organized email), it's a huge
mountain to climb to get them to trust what technology can do to assist their
work with kids. It's quite shocking how many great educators fall in this
bucket. Then add the labels of 'laggard' and 'luddite' to these people instead
of truly understanding them and forget creating any trust and change.

It's a Maslow's thing, honestly, and so much is being spent on things way too
far up the pyramid. There's so many low hanging problems to go after first to
save great educators time and simultaneously build trust in the power and
magic of technology. Right now we're burning all our political (and real)
capital on the promises of 'edtech' without truly solving the needs of the
people in the seats using them. I fear where it will end up, and the missed
opportunity it represents.

Source: I've been working with all types of schools throughout the US, with
heavy exposure in NYC.

------
dayvid
I taught English in Japan for 2 years. I realized that the they spend less on
education than America and have better results.

The solution to education problems isn't throwing money at it. Or at least
spend it on teacher salaries, right?

~~~
Retric
You need to compare the %GDP on teacher salary's vs overhead to see where
America falls down. Remember, the US system is focused on getting as much
government funding into corporate hands. So, paying teachers provide little
value, but textbooks, technology, and testing goes directly to company's that
know how to keep the pork flowing.
[http://www.edweek.org/ew/section/multimedia/map-how-per-
pupi...](http://www.edweek.org/ew/section/multimedia/map-how-per-pupil-
spending-compares-across-us.html)

At a ballpark a 30 student class might be ~12,000$ per student, but a starting
teacher salary is on average ~45,000. Pay the teacher 120k (including
benefits) and that's still only 1/3 of the total cost. (NYC pays over 20k per
student and pays teachers $54,000 - $119,000 annually.)
[http://www.teachingdegree.org/new-
york/salary/](http://www.teachingdegree.org/new-york/salary/)

~~~
GordonS
This is a very interesting proposition - imagine what could happen if you paid
teachers 120k!

Are there any countries that _do_ pay teachers very highly?

~~~
Retric
Tenured teachers can become very expensive in the US, and they have
significant retirement benefits. But, high pay is also in high cost of living
areas.

Luxembourg teacher salaries begin at 73,700 euros (79,920 USD),
[http://www.wort.lu/en/luxembourg/starting-salaries-
of-73-700...](http://www.wort.lu/en/luxembourg/starting-salaries-
of-73-700-euros-secondary-teachers-in-luxembourg-earn-highest-in-
oecd-56979c560da165c55dc5132d) Germany hits second place.

------
scandox
The author needs a good editor. There's something consistently "off" in both
the style and the personality of this article. It made it very hard for me to
assess whether what they are actually saying is worthwhile. Also the
calculation mentioned in the title (and which he strangely calls 'archaic') is
totally spurious.

~~~
ashark
This is a marketing piece badly masquerading as an informative article, after
the pattern of awful "long copy" email/website marketing pieces. That's why
it's "off".

------
paulryanrogers
A family member of mine needed a quick way to grade student work. After a few
dozen hours I had a wiki-like format loading for them to try. With a few more
features tailored to language learning it ended up saving a few hundred hours
per year.

Probably cost me $5000 since I could have been consulting. Still, it was worth
it for love.

Now certain students hate using it, though they do appreciate getting their
grades back sooner.

------
gnicholas
The cooking analogy is tempting, but it overlooks the hardware/software
distinction.

In the classroom, you have (1) the teacher's skills, (2) the computer hardware
purchased, (3) and the computer software purchased.

In the kitchen, you have (1) the chef's skills and (2) the hardware purchased.

If it's true that "software is eating the world", then a good analogy wouldn't
skip over it. Software could be like the recipe, which of course makes a big
difference in cooking outcomes.

------
_acme
"it's worth" not "its worth": it's means "it is". At least try to get the
title of an article correct.

------
ourmandave
Back in my day, when I had to walk to school up hill both ways through 10'
snow drifts (and that was summer school), a chalkboard was good enough.

Get off my lawn!

