

Demoting a Programmer to a Manager - edw519
http://azamsharp.com/Posts/219_Demoting_a_Programmer_to_a_Manager.aspx

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russell
When I was a wee lad, engineers became managers so that they could be promoted
and get salaries sufficient to put their children through college and
eventually retire. Engineers could be bad managers because there were enough
layers of managers to smooth things over. These are not those days and the
hierarchy has collapsed. There are no safe managerial positions for aging
programmers to slide into. If you dont like the prospects of managing stic
with the art. The money oisnt that much better.

~~~
gaius
This is a form of deferred compensation. Old-style companies had armies of
vice presidents who didn't do much, but in fact were being rewarded for work
they'd already done, with a smooth transition to retirement. This is how those
old-style companies encouraged loyalty. Now that that's gone, it's every
employee for himself, hence the rise of contractors.

The value of a company isn't in the stuff it owns, or it's brand, or even in
its source depot. It's that it's a collective of people who can identify and
solve new and difficult problems. Loyalty matters more than ever... Managers
who've never been actual practitioners don't understand this.

~~~
russell
Reminds me of a great cartoon from decades back. The picture was of one of
those small storefront loan offices. There was a sign in the window, sort of
like the lottery signs with replaceable numbers, that said, "37 Vice
Presidents on Duty".

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coffeemug
This is nonsense. When you transition from a programmer to a manager you don't
give up an art, you trade one art for another. Getting a large group of people
sufficiently motivated for a prolonged period of time to build great products
is insanely difficult. I haven't seen evidence that it's any easier than
writing good code. Just try it, and see what happens.

~~~
larryfreeman
True story. I was a manager at Sun for 7+ years. I was on the original J2EE
team and by any criteria you like, I was pretty successful as a manager (I
have no problem lining up an initial interview based on my resume).

In 2006, I decided to leave Sun. Layoffs every 3 months was no fun and it was
pretty stressful working so hard to protect my team (I am very proud to say
that no one who worked for me got layed off).

I hadn't programmed since 1999 and the coding world had changed dramatically.
I discovered that my management record was too good for someone who couldn't
answer the basic programming questions. I couldn't get the Director position
at Google, Amazon, or pretty much anywhere. For that matter, I couldn't get
the engineering position or the Senior Management position either. The
interview usually ended very quickly.

Today, I am very happy as a PHP engineer at a start up. Best decision I've
ever made. I might go back into management if the start up gets big enough.

My lesson from this experience is that to have credibility as an engineering
manager in this internet world, you need to keep your edge. Otherwise, you
better be good at networking.

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cvboss
Nowadays a good developer on a contract can earn more than his full-time
manager. And less stress, and less responsibilities, and also different
projects and different people. Yes, some corps do not treat contractors well,
so, well - look for another contract.

Management? Only for really good money and interesting project with people I
love to work with.

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ramchip
_Developers should get promoted but in a way that they don’t forget the
difference between bit and byte. This means that a developer should be
promoted to Senior Developer then to Architect then to Enterprise Architect
etc._

I don't see what the 'etc.' could be, exactly, without being a manager. Even
the title "Enterprise Architect" sounds like a stretch to me. The article's
point may be valid, but the solution proposed is very vague.

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duskwuff
Management and programming are very different skillsets. The idea that one can
take a good programmer and improve the company by promoting him to manager
seems no more sensible to me than would promoting a manager to programmer.

~~~
rw140
They are different skillsets, but they aren't mutually exclusive. I work in a
company which has dual career paths - technical and people management. At the
bottom of the career ladder, you have OK programmers with OK people skills.
This is the minimum you need to work effectively within a large team. Over
time you improve both areas, but specialise in one. We end up with managers
with technical backgrounds (which helps a lot in that they understand us and
we respect them), and architects who know how to manage a team.

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rantfoil
The one way to stay a programmer and avoid the tyranny of being 'managed' by a
manager is to create a startup for oneself. Sure, you have to do more than
just code -- but you can still code on your own terms, and it feels awesome to
code for your customer instead of some requirements doc written by a manager
with a pointy head.

~~~
xsmasher
I see what you're saying, but at the same time, you're going to get a new
appreciation for all of the "useless" managers, slimy salesweasels, and
busybodies around the office. In a healthy organization, they keep the real
world at bay so you can program.

At your startup, you're going to be doing your own marketing, answering your
own phone, ordering your own supplies from Staples... I bet you'll spend less
time programming, not more.

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maksimka
Good programmers, need good managers. And the best software managers come from
software development background. So do others a favor, don't be afraid to
lead.

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bmj
At my employer, no one in the Product Development group is strictly a manager.
Even the VP does active development (though he still is responsible for
managing the group). Product managers function as cross-functional managers,
driving both the product development and the cross-functional teams that will
support the products.

This seems to make project deadlines more reasonable, since my direct managers
are in the trenches with us.

