

The work ethic of MJ - amazing tales from the studio by his engineers - imajes
http://www.gearslutz.com/board/so-much-gear-so-little-time/401331-robmix-tell-us-about-mj.html

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danbmil99
I was an audio engineer in the 80's, worked with the Buttholes and De La Soul,
and hundreds of artists not lucky enough to be remembered.

Many of them sucked, but almost all of them worked their asses off. A few of
them were brilliant (the Butthole Surfers, IMSHO). I like some of MJ's music,
but frankly I don't think he was a genius songwriter. Great performer, and had
some nice hit songs.

I think something is gone with that era, in that now it's just the artist and
his/her computer. No big setup, no 'control room', no tape assist punching in
the vocals. No girlfriends snoring on the couch. And obviously, no band
playing everything at once (that wasn't even really going on by the time I was
working, though you did do things like bass/drums/guitar together with a rough
vocal if it made sense for the song).

Like stained glass and the Saturn V, the art of making these kinds of records
is going to be lost forever.

~~~
sterwill
Stained Glass and the Saturn V would be a great band name.

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GavinB
If you're interested in audio recording or mixing, gearslutz is the place. I
haven't posted there in a while but there's a lot in common with HN.

This thread is recent but there's some great older stuff that I recall. Check
out this thread from Bruce Swedien - [http://www.gearslutz.com/board/bruce-
swedien/83165-seven-peo...](http://www.gearslutz.com/board/bruce-
swedien/83165-seven-people-have-had-profound-effect-what-i-have-done-
recording.html) (scroll down for the bit about MJ)

Edit: Here's a story from Bruce about recording and mixing Billie Jean -
[http://www.gearslutz.com/board/bruce-swedien/84587-real-
stor...](http://www.gearslutz.com/board/bruce-swedien/84587-real-story-billie-
jean.html)

~~~
mattjung
The Billie-Jean-Story sounds very familiar to me. Improving things a thousand
time until you understand that the first version,closest to the original idea,
was the best...

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catch23
> At one point Michael was angry at one of the producers on the project
> because he was treating everyone terribly. Rather than create a scene or
> fire the guy, Michael called him to his office/lounge and one of the
> security guys threw a pie in his face. No further action was needed . . . .
> .

Interesting management style. We should do that at our startup :-)

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dionidium
_Along those lines, Quincy and Bruce used to have a saying while they were
mixing. One of them would turn to the other and say, "I think we're mixing
past the money", which meant...okay, now we're no longer improving it...it was
better a mix or two ago, and the mixing would stop._

"Mixing past the money" perfectly describes a feeling I often have while
refactoring code. What a perfect phrase!

------
jacoblyles
It always warms my heart when the internet produces a relevant and interesting
bit of original content. Sometimes I think this whole enterprise might
actually have value.

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imajes
look out for stuff from resonater and robmix - totally cool stuff about how
they cut some of his most famous work together.

~~~
madh
yea these stories are amazing.

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sandGorgon
_Once, while we were taking a break, I think we were actually watching the OJ
chase on TV, there was a news program talking about him being in Europe with
some little boy. I was sitting next to the guy while the news is making this
crap up. He just looked at me and said this is what I have to deal with._
<http://www.gearslutz.com/board/4325168-post15.html>

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parenthesis
This is a really interesting in-depth piece about the recording of 'Black or
White' (and the _Dangerous_ album, in general):

[http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/aug04/articles/classictracks...](http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/aug04/articles/classictracks.htm)

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kadavy
What an awesome thread, thanks for this. It's nice to hear some memories
straight from someone who worked with him, rather than filtered through the
media.

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mlLK
Sure as hell beats the crap out of TV Guide's coverage for remembering
Michael.

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cema
This was indeed interesting and enriching.

(And I am not a fan of MJ!)

------
norimaki
In light of how embattled Jackson was by the media and forgotten by the public
until recently, it's interesting to see how his death has changed the
discussion - words like 'freak' and 'pedophile' replaced with 'genius' and
'work ethic'.

~~~
enneff
I've always discussed Jackson in those latter terms, and so have many with
whom I've talked of him. Not everyone is blindsided by the tabloid media.

~~~
electromagnetic
Obviously so many people _were_ blind-sided by the tabloids the first time. He
hasn't been convicted of any crime, over 70 police officers searched his home
and found nothing, but obviously a lack of conviction doesn't mean anything to
you or the media conviction he was given.

The man obviously had a bizarre personal life, in fact his life was outright
bizarre from young childhood when their father forced them to perform. So I'm
sorry, but when parents allowed their kids to stay at his house unsupervised,
the parents should have been under criminal investigation too.

No conviction, no crime. It's essentially how the whole innocent until proven
guilty system works, but obviously you don't care that a man hasn't been
charged for paedophilia, you just want to call an innocent man one anyway.
Kudos on only believing the bad things about people in the media and believing
none of the good things.

~~~
enneff
Are you implying that _I_ thought he was a paedophile? My comment expressed
the exact opposite sentiment. I've always believed him to be a genius and a
gentleman, and everyone I've met who has worked with the guy has corroborated
that.

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schammy
Good stuff. I found the bit about how he was a "huge fan" of NIN's downward
spiral interesting, since a few lines above it said he refused to curse.
Someone who's against cursing doesn't seem like they could like a NIN record.
He must have just really liked the engineering of the album. I'll hand it to
the team that made it, downward spiral is one of the coolest sounding records
I've ever heard.

~~~
rms
Check out the relatively obscure MJ song Morphine from Blood on the Dance
Floor, which is decidedly influenced by Reznor. Morphine is one of those eerie
songs where Michael practically predicts his own downfall. It's incredibly
sad.

~~~
frig
There's a lot of reznor-sound in 'they don't care about us also', at least to
my ears.

------
jacquesm
I fail to see the relevance for HN but it was a nice read anyway... too much
mj coverage alltogether.

~~~
jacquesm
-4 already eh ? Did I offend someone ?

~~~
gabrielroth
Yes, by violating this guideline: "Please don't submit comments complaining
that a submission is inappropriate for the site. If you think something is
spam or offtopic, flag it by going to its page and clicking on the "flag"
link."

<http://ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html>

~~~
asdlfj2sd33
Over time this place has become much more general and wide in scope. Some
people cherish this, some don't.

But it is interesting that those that don't, can only flag and shut up. No
discussion of "is this needed _here_ " is tolerated. But dozens of MJ stories
are perfectly OK.

~~~
jacquesm
Exactly. It seems that a knee jerk reaction ('flag') is more in line with
expectations than any kind of moderate reaction to sense whether or not this
kind of article belongs here. As I said it was an interesting read, which
nuanced my viewpoint.

The bury brigade seems to be more than content to punish any kind of 'non
adherence to the rules'. That makes it simple for me, next time I'll flag,
interesting read or not.

A well thought out response to some question that gets relatively little
traction here will gain you one or two points, but a 'faux pas' in a popular
article that doesn't really belong here will get you -10 in total.

