

MIT launches free online 'fully automated' course - alexholehouse
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-17012968

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bdg
Because the MITx link isn't high enough for SEO to pick up:
<http://www.mitx.mit.edu/> (otherwise you goto some learning exchange site, or
other companies).

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maxmcd
That is a surprisingly well designed site. Love the dynamic layout.

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ShabbyDoo
" But in future, the university says, there will be mechanisms for checking
identity and verifying work."

This increases the value of the certificate as proof of knowledge and
competence. Let's imagine that MIT offered 20 engineering courses in this
format. You go through the effort of honestly taking these courses and add
them to your resume. A potential employer says:

"Well, these courses are really rigorous -- much more so than those for-profit
online 'universities'. While MIT will allow me to verify that a single online
account holder claiming to be this person completed these courses, there's no
proof that you didn't cheat or pay people to take the tests for you. Just look
at how many CS homework projects are listed on Rent-a-Coder! I have to bring
this person into my office and check them out myself to be sure."

I have argued previously that this "checking out" process isn't so expensive
that an impressive resume would be passed over, and I still think this.
However, what if a student had the option of paying a fee to take a test at an
approved testing center which would check identification, take a photo of the
student (available on MIT's site along with the course certificates), and
ensure that this person took the test himself? Those taking actuarial exams
and such already take tests at such locations. For those who didn't want to
pay, lived somewhere without such centers, etc., certificates could be given
which would have a lower level of authentication. If you are taking the time
to complete a course and want to prove to others that you did not cheat,
wouldn't it be worth paying an extra $100?

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keithvan
It's interesting how their first course is actually quite technical and has
extensive prerequisites. I'm worried about not doing well because of these
requirements -- is anyone in the same boat as me? I'm taking the course more
out of curiousity and to be a part of something big than an expectation to do
well.

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neilparikh
Ya, it says AP level physics is strongly recommended, but I won't even start
grade 10 physics until March! I really want to take it, though, so I'll have
to see what I can do.

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archgoon
How are they doing labs? The FAQ mentions that there are labs, but there is no
information how how they are to be accomplished or submitted.

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edtechdev
Since this is a circuits course, I assume they would use a circuit simulation.

I personally think this is the best circuit simulation to learn the basics of
college level analog and digital circuits (it is animated), but I highly doubt
the MIT course will be using it: <http://falstad.com/circuit/>

I used a customized version of it in my own research, and within minutes
engineering students (who had already finished their intro circuits classes
but still showed misconceptions) were better understanding the behavior of
circuits:
[http://usu.academia.edu/edtechdev/Papers/161483/Designing_An...](http://usu.academia.edu/edtechdev/Papers/161483/Designing_Animated_Simulations_and_Web-
based_Assessments_to_Improve_Electrical_Engineering_Education)

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didgeoridoo
Enrolled! Anyone have any opinions on what subjects you CAN'T teach
effectively through MITx's proposed methods?

I'm having trouble coming up with any "intro"-level work that cannot be
effectively handled in this way. Solve the likely engagement issues (perhaps
with well-designed gamification), and suddenly you've replaced all 100-level
university courses -- freeing professors to teach the interesting stuff.

~~~
thematt
In terms of the lecture content, if you go to any large university this is
essentially how those 100 level courses are taught anyways. You're sitting in
a huge auditorium with hundreds of other students just watching the lecture on
a TV screen. The grading of assignment is then done by TA's. The professor has
been abstracted away so far in those classes that I see little difference just
replacing it with a format like this.

~~~
jfoldi
Agreed. However I wouldn't complain if this drives costs down for students.

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ctdonath
FYI: MIT already has the entire curriculum for every course in every degree
program online at <http://ocw.mit.edu>

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mpgoetz
Actually, I don't think all of the courses are available through OCW. I
recently tried to find all the course for the Computer Science bachelor's
degree plan and found all but one: <http://www.gliffy.com/publish/3280755/>

On top of this, many of the course are just lecture notes. My experience has
been that the lecture notes aren't much better than a good e-book.

I'm really excited for the OCW Scholar program
(<http://ocw.mit.edu/courses/ocw-scholar/>) to expand more, as they offer
screencasts, problem sets, and the rest of a fully automated learning package.

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freehunter
>designed to serve as a first course in an undergraduate

>In order to succeed in this course, you must have taken an AP level physics
course in electricity and magnetism.

Do high schools actually offer AP EE Physics classes? I went to a blue ribbon
high school and they sure as hell didn't offer anything that specific at that
advanced of a level. Even the university I went to had EE Physics as a 200
level class.

~~~
lambda
They didn't say EE (electrical engineering). They said electricity and
magnetism (E&M).

The AP physics curriculum has AP Physics B, AP Physics C (Mechanics), and AP
Physics C (Electricity and Magnetism). At my high school (a fairly well-off
public high school), in the AP Physics class, we were supposed to do both
Mechanics and E&M, but we fell behind and had only just started E&M by the
time the test rolled around. Some people just took the mechanics test; I took
both, and got a 5, but the college I went to didn't accept AP Physics for
credit, just for placement in the honors physics track. In college, E&M was
the second-semester physics class in the honors track.

So, I don't think it's too unusual to expect a talented high school student or
first or second year college student to have taken an E&M course.

~~~
freehunter
>They didn't say EE (electrical engineering). They said electricity and
magnetism (E&M).

A lot of people are picking up on that. I didn't type the whole name out
partially because I didn't know a better, standardized abbreviation for it,
and partly because I was typing on my phone at the time and didn't want to
spell it all out. I hoped everyone would know what I meant, but apparently
not. My blue ribbon high school didn't have E&M physics classes.

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ramses
As would be expected, "Design and lab exercises are also significant
components of the course." Sadly there is still no information on how this is
going to be handled. Are you going to take pictures of your breadboard and
multimeter readings to show you did your homework?

What do you guys think?

~~~
vibrunazo
You could have a software to simulate lab exercises.

But I'm curious how they'll solve the "mechanisms for identity checks". What
could they do? If they wanna do real lab exercises and not software
simulation, then both are similar problems. I can imagine either using a
camera, like you said, or partnering with local schools around the world.

Both have many flaws, let's see what they come up with.

~~~
ahage16
I imagine simulation is definitely the route they will go. To be honest, I
would be happy with anything outside of just reading and answering questions.
I am taking a similar course at my university now, and there is absolutely no
lab exercises, simulations, or anything outside of your typical lecture. I've
been learning LTspice in my spare time, but I was pretty disappointed that
there wasn't something like that already in the curriculum.

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seanos
Once they offer a full set of modules, for say a CS degree, this could be very
disruptive indeed.

~~~
jfoldi
I'm looking forward to a full set of CS modules! I've always believed that you
can get a decent education with just a library card so a free, comprehensive
curriculum of this sort would be invaluable.

~~~
EREFUNDO
With the right level of self discipline any one can benefit from this
tremendously, pretty much like everything else in life. The difference now is
accessibility to virtually everyone.

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robomartin
Good step in the right direction. However, you are going to work just as hard,
if not harder, than a local student and not get credit that can be used
towards a proper university degree. I understand that this is an experiment. I
get it. But, maybe MIT could offer the option to pass the actual course with
full credit by examination once a student gets a passing grade on the MITx
course?

It just seems like a lot of work for a certificate that might not carry much,
if any, real weight. There are a good number of online degree programs where
your work will actually go towards a degree.

The model I'd love to see goes something like this: Enroll in MITx. Study on
your own. Pass. Then, on an annual basis, there's an opportunity to come to
MIT, take a test, do some labs and get credit and grade on the real class
towards a degree. People from all over the world would be open to that
approach.

Now, if all you want is the knowledge while participating in a really neat
experiment, by all means, full steam ahead.

~~~
droithomme
I have a degree in engineering from Stanford, which is one of the top
engineering schools in the world. Do you know where I keep it? I gave it to my
mother over 20 years ago since she liked to look at it. She died a long time
ago. I haven't seen it since then, and I don't have any idea where it is.
Would you like to know how many people have asked to see it other than my
mother? The answer is zero. Would you like to know how many coworkers,
employers, acquirers and partners have asked to see my credentials since I
graduated? The answer is zero.

Credentials are completely useless in this field. They mean nothing. No one
wants to see them, unless you are trying to emigrate to another country and
have to prove you have a degree.

The reason one takes classes at MIT or Stanford is because they are known to
have really good programs. The degree doesn't matter. The certificate doesn't
matter. After you graduate, no one cares about that stuff.

~~~
ShabbyDoo
Do you list your degree on your resume? Do those approaching you with
proposals for work know that you went to Stanford? I agree with your view that
a degree itself isn't inherently valuable, but I wonder if you are able to
measure its benefits so easily.

~~~
droithomme
"Do you list your degree on your resume?"

Sure, it's on my CV. But I could say I had a law degree from Harvard there as
well, just listing something proves little. It's been some time since I
actually used a CV in my career, but when I did there was not once an attempt
to validate any claims, my skills and talents were evaluated from the thinking
I demonstrated and rapport I established in each interview, not from
validation of credentials which never once happened.

"Do those approaching you with proposals for work know that you went to
Stanford?"

Those who approach me and talk to me don't know anything about my education as
far as I know, it's just not been discussed in years, my reputation and track
record are what is important. I wouldn't even mention it here except as an
example of a credential which I think that most _assume_ is a big deal, but
which in reality, practice, and life experience doesn't mean anything at all.

Hm, wracking my brain here to think who knows where I went to school. I'm
pretty sure no one I work with. My (life) partner knows, but only because I'm
sure it's come up in conversation, it's probably been years since I've even
discussed it.

Anyway, the point of this is I see the potential of these classes as immense
and able to change the world. I am also a bit cynical that that will happen.
The power of an elite, expensive certification as a validation of class and
not talent is too valuable. MIT is now saying (on their MITx web page) they
intend to, after working out the kinks, start offering credentials with their
MITx program and "validating" students identity. How this will work
internationally one can only imagine. Remote classes can't really be validated
as to who took the class: it's impossible unless they plan to monitor each
student via a video camera, which is unlikely. Given that "identity
validation" proves little, why even bother with it? Why not just allow anyone
to take the class, given that it is intended to be free -- if education is the
goal. But if _certification_ is the goal and not education, then identity is
very important since it's the certification and not what you know and what you
can do that is important.

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drstrangevibes
now the computers program the people

~~~
eru
Read about SuperMemo for another take on computers programming people.

