
'We are all Thomas More’s children’ – 500 years of Utopia - Hooke
https://www.theguardian.com/books/2016/nov/04/thomas-more-utopia-500-years-china-mieville-ursula-le-guin
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IslaDeEncanta
Utopian socialism's failures are the reason Marxism came about as a
structured, disciplined critique of class society. Idealism is no way to make
people's lives better. Instead, you must understand the root causes of
oppression in order to attempt to overcome it.

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MichaelMoser123
disciplined Marxist society also needs a manager class, turns out that
managers have their own self interests - namely they needed stability/lack of
purges and had the urge of turning public property into their own private
property. Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.

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eli_gottlieb
Ah, yes. I remember how that was a major problem under literally every leftist
regime ever tried, and has never been a problem under even one capitalist
regime.

I'm certainly enjoying the glorious capitalist utopia we live in today, where
perfect market competition has eliminated all the old woes of human life! Why,
if I can afford the loan payments, I won't even have to die of old age! /s

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AnimalMuppet
OK, you're saying that capitalism is the problem, not the solution. But saying
that disciplined Marxism is the solution hasn't worked out very well in
practice, either - not better than capitalism, in fact.

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dvh
I've tried to read Utopia but that book is written so dreadfully I had to drop
it after 20 pages or so.

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jhbadger
That would be the translator's fault (unless you can read Renaissance Latin --
which is not quite the the same as classical Latin).

