
U.S. government removes detailed pollution map from internet - arparthasarathi
https://www.popsci.com/story/environment/toxmap-removed-federal-government/
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web007
There was some significant discussion around this and the data sources that
feed it on Reddit:
[https://www.reddit.com/r/DataHoarder/comments/ea0wx2/urgent_...](https://www.reddit.com/r/DataHoarder/comments/ea0wx2/urgent_request_federal_databases_disappearing/)

It seemed from the comments that the Toxmap is going away, but most/all of the
data 5hat feeds it is still available. There are several other related
datasets that were "retired" around the same time, and those seem to be truly
gone.

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segfaultbuserr
> _There are several other related datasets that were "retired" around the
> same time, and those seem to be truly gone. _

This is bad. Another reason that we need to demand that all public data should
be available in a machine-readable raw format, not just a web frontend for
access, and that we need to systematically upload datasets to archive.org.

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CivBase
Before jumping to conclusions, I have some questions that the article didn't
answer.

Is there any information available about how widely this was used beyond the
anecdotes provided in the article? How costly was this to maintain? Is there
an alternative that makes this redundant? Are there plans to replace it which
simply haven't been published yet?

It sounds like the data sources used by Toxmap are still accessible. Was the
visualization provided by Toxmap _useful_ or was it just novel? Judging by the
screenshots, the visualization doesn't seem to provide any insights that
couldn't be easily inferred by simply looking at a population heat map. Did
many people even know what Toxmap was before reading the article?

If this _is_ a politically-motivated play, it's not a smart one. It's very on-
the-nose and will probably do more harm than good to "anti-green political
movement" (for lack of a better term).

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hirundo
> White House officials are working on an executive order that would ...
> require that publicly funded science be obtainable for free immediately [1]

It would be great if that could be extended from science to also include
regulatory agencies. That would include Toxmap source data. Better than an
executive order would be a federal statute. It's even worth a constitutional
amendment.

[1]
[https://www.eenews.net/stories/1061836761](https://www.eenews.net/stories/1061836761)

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Mathnerd314
This looks like an opportunity for some aspiring web developer to put together
their own map. I'm sure there's a nonprofit that would be willing to host it.

~~~
picantePepper
Im sure that a bunch of nerds (me included) would be able to add whatever
sensors needed to upgrade their diy weather stations and upload the feeds
somewhere

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NotSammyHagar
The leaders of the govt have at least basic rights to retract lots of things
that are public, unless there some specific rule requiring something to be out
there. This seems pretty clearly to be bad, is there any defense of this? My
older relatives insist the current us govt 'changes' with Trump are what we
need to succeed in the future. They aren't aware of things like this, but is
there any defense of actions like this? My dad would probably say increasing
business activity is the central goal of the govt, so it's okay not to cause
trouble by pointing out all these pollution sources. But I can't see any good
for this kind of stuff.

~~~
cosmodisk
The people in most governments are quite cheap,so no surprise here.
However,what I don't get is that same people forget that they live in the same
country, breathe the same air and their kids will continue to do so. It's like
trying to burn neighbor's house without impacting your help own,even though
they are both connected...

~~~
ljw1001
> The people in most governments are quite cheap...

Have you seen our budget? <wink>

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Reason077
So long as the underlying data sets are still available, this sounds like
something that could be taken up by an NGO or advocacy group such as the
Sierra Club. If anything it could benefit from better exposure and more
funding.

~~~
SolaceQuantum
It appears based on other comments several related datasets are also gone.

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foolinaround
Could'nt netizens add this kind of data as a layer on OpenStreetMaps? Over
time, it could be comprehensive?

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jacquesm
All inconvenient truths shall be wiped under the carpet. Capitalism is a great
thing and has brought us very far but you have to wonder if at some point it
isn't going to undo all of that progress and put us back where we started or
worse.

~~~
duxup
"All inconvenient truths shall be wiped under the carpet. "

That's more about the motives of people, all people, rather than a commentary
on capitalism or anything else.

~~~
jacquesm
I don't think so. Capitalism is what drives politics in the United States, the
degree to which big businesses dictate the course the country charts is
unparalleled. Everything revolves around the large companies that pollute and
externalize where ever they can, all in the name of profits.

Essentially the United States just removed a bunch of stuff that is
embarrassing to corporate interests, in order to allow them to pollute some
more but this time without any accountability.

~~~
cy_hauser
Interesting. Why wouldn't there be an opposite corporate side that would make
money off the stuff being removed. For example, there are a LOT of companies
in the U.S. making money from environmental and alternative energy that might
benefit from information the corporate interests had removed.

Maybe that _does_ boil down to just the political parties in charge at the
time. If so then does politics trump capitalism?

~~~
jacquesm
That's because resource extraction from the planet is - for now - still
cheaper than doing it in a sustainable way. At some point that will flip but
by then it may well be too late, the 'mines of tomorrow are the garbage dumps
of today' was recognized long ago.

Just think of all the copper in landfills.

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wnevets
You dont have to burn the books, you just remove them.

