
What is it like to be a geek in a prison? - edw519
http://www.quora.com/Prisons-and-Prison-Life/What-is-it-like-to-be-a-geek-in-a-prison?share=1
======
Estragon
I help teach a nonviolent communication program at a nearby prison, and the
technological restrictions placed on the prisoners are pretty shocking to me.
They are allowed an electric typewriter with 7K of memory (down from 16K.) The
only audio media they are allowed are cassette tapes. DVDs are forbidden,
apparently because a shard from one could conceivably be used as a weapon. A
co-ordinator of a college program for the inmates told me that they have a CS
course, but can't find anyone to teach it because the students will not be
allowed to use computers. This despite the fact that there are multiple
roomfuls of computers in the prison school. They get to choose between having
a TV and receiving packages from the outside once a month (no, I don't see the
point of this dichotomy, either, except maybe as a way to save money on
inspecting the packages.)

Some of the guys I know in there are in for decades at least. I can't imagine
them having the education for any kind of gainful employment when they get
out.

~~~
swalkergibson
> I can't imagine them having the education for any kind of gainful employment
> when they get out.

Has this ever been the goal of the justice system in the United States? It
seems to me that the primary function is purely punitive and expends very
little effort to rehabilitate anyone.

~~~
berntb
From a Scandinavian viewpoint, the US prison system looks like the 19th
century in many ways. I have no problem with that, longer sentences for repeat
offenders with many crimes would be better than rebates(!) on prison time,
like in Sweden.

Point is, I'm not that judgmental and still I say: Not trying to rehabilitate
prisoners so they have good job skills is obviously insane. And totally
immoral.

More of the prisoners will fail when released; do drugs, commit crimes and end
up back in prison. This costs an insane lot of money (prison costs, people not
working, health bills, etc). Even worse, it will also destroy the lives of
innocent people -- e.g. crime victims and relatives of the prisoners.

I can only see two reasons for not putting an emphasis on rehabilitation for
job skills: Pure incompetence -- or some economic interest in getting repeat
offenders back into prison.

tl; dr: No rehabilitation of job skills hurts the economy and innocent people
as much as the prisoners. Add extra time to the punishment if more punishment
is merited, instead of shooting society in the foot.

~~~
swalkergibson
> Some economic interest in getting repeat offenders back into prison.

Interestingly enough, this actually exists in the US. As crazy as it sounds,
there are private prisons that are paid on a per-inmate basis. These
corporations typically put their political donations behind candidates who are
"tough on crime" to fill their jails and line their pockets. It would be
terribly interesting to see what kind of impact these companies have had on
the justice system in the US.

~~~
rolux
Indeed:

"In 2012, [the Corrections Corporations of America] sent a letter to 'prison
officials in 48 states offering to buy prisons from these states in exchange
for a 20-year management contract and a guaranteed occupancy rate of 90%.'"

([http://www.annarbor.com/news/opinion/passing-house-bill-
will...](http://www.annarbor.com/news/opinion/passing-house-bill-will-worsen-
already-pressing-civil-rights-issue/))

------
ihnorton
A comment response by the top poster [1] deserves a full read as well, for
observations of behavior, motivations, and recidivism by others in the system.
On the latter note, there is also this sobering paragraph:

 _...Here in Colorado we have what is called "mandatory parole" \- which is
probably not what you think it is. It does not mean that it is mandatory to
release you early, it means that even if you are released after serving your
entire sentence, you will be considered "on parole" and will have a parole
officer assigned and live under the threat of being sent back to prison (even
if you already served your entire sentence). Hence, you could do almost 15
years on a 10 year sentence because if you are released after doing the 10,
you will still have to do 5 years of "parole" and could be sent back if you
violate any of the terms of parole. In fact, nearly 40% of the intake into
Colorado prisons is from "technical" parole violations, which are violations
of parole conditions that are not felony crimes. This system has created a
terrible sense of hopelessness among those caught up in it. My assessment
(admittedly based on anecdotal data) is that Colorado parole officers think it
is their duty to try and find reasons to violate a parolee and get them sent
back to prison. They seem to go out of their way to make success difficult for
a parolee, rather than just expect compliance with the law._

[1] [http://www.quora.com/Prisons-and-Prison-Life/What-is-it-
like...](http://www.quora.com/Prisons-and-Prison-Life/What-is-it-like-to-be-a-
geek-in-a-prison/answers/3504930/comment/3226629)

~~~
dm2
Then why not better train, screen, and pay the parole officers? These people
seem to be a key part of the system which would be overseeing people who have
a high chance to commit a crime. The parole officers should definitely try to
fairly assess the parolee's life circumstances and try to best assist them in
finding a job and crime-free life in normal society.

I've heard stories of parole officers being hard on parolees but the parolees
were also thankful because it forced them to turn their lives around.

40% seems very high but the people who sentence and lock-up parolees who
violate their parole are likely much better equipped and trained to judge the
parolees.

Just my 2 cents.

~~~
guelo
What gave you the impression that it's a problem of training and pay? Parole
officers are doing their jobs as they are trained. The system, run by "tough
on crime" politicians, prosecutors and cops, is geared towards having as
little sympathy as possible.

------
dobbsbob
You get access to Corrlinks email you pay a lot for if in fed prison, and
since min security is where most criminals end up so they can perform nearly
free labour there is barely any violence. If you follow the simple rules of
prison nothing is likely to happen to you. Rules are never talk to guards you
will look like a snitch, accept nothing from other inmates, don't talk about
any other inmate if they arent in front of you and do your own time. A good
example is somebody tells you hey that guy over there called you a goof. This
person is trying to get you to beat somebody up for them but since you do your
own time you laugh it off and reply he can say it to your face, then the
weasel guy slinks away to find another sucker to fight for him.

Prison is just being really bored all the time for the most part and working
menial labor for pennies a day. Hopefully people you know send you books. If
you maintain a prison blog BOP will read it and punish you severely for any
criticisms. Like months in solitary. Don't ever release pictures either and
put them on social media or online even if you get permission. Solitary again.

The most interesting prison is where foreigners are housed in the US @ D Ray.
There is no racism because no Americans so none of that don't eat with people
outside yout race crap and hardly any other silly rules American inmates make
up. The spanish inmates have a union everybody joins to coordinate
disobedience against the guards whenever they crackdown on the library or
other rights you're supposed to get from BOP. Other fed prisons it's mainly
run by illiterate racists and gangs who for the most part leave you alone
unless you break a rule or have money to extort.

~~~
rtpg
Know of a place where we can read up on the foreigner's prison? Seems like an
interesting environment

------
Trufa
I have a far off request. I remember reading a good long read quite some time
ago.

It was of a hacker that was sent to prison, I think federal prison.

He goes into a lot of detail about how life is inside there and how you have
to behave, I remember him advising to fight for your stuff even though you're
going to lose since if not you'll become "their bitches" or something of the
sort.

If I remember correctly (might be far off) the website was mainly black and
orange.

He also mixes in his experience with drugs, I think psychedelic mushrooms or
so.

I was quite a long article but quite catching, by any chance anyone remembers
what I'm talking about?

I read it at least 3, 4 or 5 years ago.

~~~
alex_sf
Agent Steal, maybe?

[http://web.textfiles.com/hacking/agentsteal.txt](http://web.textfiles.com/hacking/agentsteal.txt)

~~~
clamprecht
Incidentally, I was in prison with Agent Steal when he wrote that article.
It's pretty accurate from what I remember. We were in FCI Bastrop (I was there
from '95 through '99), and we were absolutely not allowed anywhere near a
computer. At one point I had a "good" job working in the Unicor factory, which
would have paid me $200/month after a while (good money for prison). But they
fired me when they discovered I had a web page. Apparently they thought I had
set up the web page from within the prison.

As a side note, Agent Steal (Justin Peterson) died somewhat mysteriously in
his apartment a few years ago.
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Justin_Tanner_Petersen](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Justin_Tanner_Petersen)

------
deftnerd
I am a developer/hacker who spent 6 months in prison about a decade ago.

They had a room of old broken computers that were donated and I offered to fix
them up in exchange for increased library privileges. Normally inmates could
only visit the library once a week and check out two books, but I read about 4
books a day during my time there.

I fixed up the computers and supported them once they got a teacher, read my
books, helped people with grammar in their appeal letters, and stayed out of
trouble.

The only stress I felt was from being thrown into an environment with totally
alien social structures and ways of interaction. I was a upper-middle-class
white kid who had learned to talk logically out of situations, and most of my
peers in prison were people who grew up in settings where the only way to
solve disagreements was with intimidation or actual violence.

Once I learned that I should give a little to intimidation so the other party
feels in control and powerful, but refuse to be totally controlled because the
other party wouldn't risk their early release dates to beat up someone for no
good reason, then I did well. It also helped to be able to pay off the local
gang leader once a week with a pint of ice cream from the commissary.
Protection was relatively inexpensive, all things considered.

The library was outdated, but there were enough books on physics for me to
refresh my understanding and my friends and family ordered books for delivery
for me on a regular basis. I discovered a life-long love of Mark Twain,
especially the book he wrote about Joan of Arc.

6 Months seemed to crawl by and was full of home-sickness. Then, all of a
sudden, it was over. After that, the world seemed a lot more magical for a few
months. Everything was brighter and more colorful than I remembered. There was
such joy in being able to listen to a CD or eat chinese food.

All in all, it wasn't a terrible experience. It was very interesting
sociologically and a good experience for me to see how a different ecosystem
worked. I also got to eat a balanced diet and exercised. I was in marvelous
shape back then. I wouldn't recommend it or anything, but if you go with the
right mentality, you can make the most of it.

The obvious downside is that prison sticks to you for the rest of your life.
It takes several months to stop walking without your hands behind your back or
saying "Sir" all the time. Also, the stigma of having a criminal record sticks
to you forever. Even now, in my middle 30's, it's nearly impossible for me to
get a tech job even though my felonious history was from when I was a
teenager. You pretty much have to resign yourself to the fact that you'll work
at 50% of the salary as your peers or have to make your own future by starting
your own companies and projects.

~~~
clamprecht
> You pretty much have to resign yourself to the fact that you'll work at 50%
> of the salary as your peers or have to make your own future by starting your
> own companies and projects.

Fuck that. If you're going to resign yourself to something, resign yourself to
the fact that you will have to work 150% as hard as your peers to make as much
money. I know this is saying almost the same thing, but it's saying it in a
more positive way.

I do like your comment "or have to make your own future by starting your own
companies and projects". They say success is the best revenge. If this
motivates you (like it did me), milk it.

~~~
deftnerd
I appreciate your insight, but I have a family now and it wouldn't be fair of
them for me to put 150% effort into my work life just to try to earn just as
much as someone else who works 100%.

I would rather work for less money as long as I spend time with the people I
love.

~~~
clamprecht
Fair enough

------
onetimeonly
I'm a hacker who served 4.5 months of a 9 month sentence 5 years ago. I was in
two jails in that time, spending the majority of the time in the second, lower
security place. The experience totally changed me, but in a positive way.

First of all, I actually had a lot of fun in jail. My education made certain
aspects of the prison system very easy for me to navigate, such as legal
documentation and debating with guards. My ability to mend broken electronics
very quickly became known. These things made me feel very safe, since people
were actively protecting me. It also made me feel quite important in the
community.

It started when someone came to me and asked what I knew about mending mobile
phones. In UK jails, many people have mobiles, usually obtained by over-the-
fence smuggling. Pay-as-you-go credit vouchers are a major form of currency.
This guy was very important on the wing - he had a crew of other guys who
walked around with him and people often came to pay him. I said I knew enough
about phones, and what did he want? He explained that someone had owed him
money but couldn't pay. He'd taken the guy's phone as payment, but the phone
was pin-locked and he couldn't get in. The phone was an old samsung, one which
I knew (having previously owned one) didn't impose any limit on the number of
pin attempts. So I told the guy: yeah, I know a few tricks. But I need to get
my tools out so I'll do it overnight. (Note: I didn't have any tools). The guy
left me with the phone overnight, and I sat up through the night to try all
10,000 possible 4-digit combinations. Thankfully, the correct code turned up
in the mid 2000s. So the next day this guy turned up and was amazed that I had
figured out the code. He went round telling everyone that I was some tech
wizard and that people should always come to me with their problems. In return
for the job he arranged for me to have a Playstation 2 in my cell for two
weeks, and to get access to a phone whenever I wanted. For the rest of my
time, people would bring me trivially broken electronics and I would retire
for the evening to make it out like I was doing something difficult, then
return the fixed item the next day. It massively increased my quality of life
in there.

Secondly, it opened my eyes to how people less fortunate than me live their
lives, and how terrible the prison system is for most people. Many, many
people in jail were severely mentally ill. There was no support for them. Some
were killed in jail, either by inmates or staff, because they flipped out and
people got scared. Another large group of people were hopelessly addicted to
very harmful drugs. People who exploited this group were the most powerful -
they would have drugs smuggled in, then build an army of addicts who would do
their bidding to get the next fix. It was a really explosive situation. Almost
every act of violence was drug debt related. Immigrants were completely
screwed in jail, because there was no way for them to navigate the
bureaucracy. I helped several people avoid deportation, including one cell-
mate who had a hit contract out on him in Jamaica because he defended his
business when yardies tried to extort him. He couldn't read or write, so he
couldn't fill out the asylum application. His patois was so strong that his
lawyer couldn't really understand what he said, and the border agency was
going to send him back to Jamaica to be killed. I wrote letters to the border
agency, the prison governor and the home secretary and he was granted asylum
and an interpreter was arranged so that his legal visits would be more
productive. Hundreds of others in similar situations go without that help
every year.

Thirdly, I saw some horrible things. For example: 'syruping' \- when someone
mixes sugar into a bucket of boiling water and dumps it on someone's face. The
dissolved sugar makes the boiling water cling to the skin longer, and the skin
peels off leaving the raw flesh exposed. I also saw someone held down by four
guys, who performed anal surgery on him with a sharpened spoon to extract
drugs he was hiding. He later maimed all four of his assailants, stabbing them
in the neck with a pen (saw that too). Another was a guy who was clearly
paranoid schizophrenic. His cell was opposite mine. He started screaming one
night and barricaded himself in. He then stripped off and covered himself with
baby oil, and started setting fire to his cell. The guards came in riot gear
to tackle him, but he was so slippery it was like trying to catch an eel. He
gave them the run around for quite a while before they eventually fired
sedative darts into him and he collapsed screaming. He died in hospital.

Fourthly, I felt so ashamed of myself that I changed my life forever. I was a
middle class white kid with a great education who got obsessed with hacking
and document security as a teenager and went down for figuring out how to
perfectly replicate the driving license, thus throwing away many of the
advantages that luck, society and my parents had given me. Everyone else in
there had no such advantages. Most of them were born to a life where poverty,
drugs, violence and lack of education all being concentrated in their
environment led to them being systematically channeled into prison. I was
there essentially through misplaced intellectual curiosity, while others were
there because their lives were so bad out of jail that crime was actually a
rational survival choice. Society failed them, while it tried to hold me up
with both hands. I was, and am, disgusted with myself. Upon leaving jail I
learned programming, worked freelance to pay for my tuition while I got a
degree, got a PhD, and am now working towards spending my life using my skills
as efficiently as I can to improve the lives of as many people as possible. If
I ever have a lazy moment, I just have to cast my mind back to prison, and the
disgust with myself rises up again, and I launch myself back into work with an
energy I never knew I had before prison.

Finally, I would say that my criminal record has not held me back. I no longer
have to legally disclose it, but when I did I always did so with a letter
explaining some of the circumstances and how deeply it had affected my life. I
had several positive comments about my disclosure, and I have never been
turned down for a job I've applied for. It doesn't have to hold you back -
your attitude has to convince a potential employer that your background makes
you a _great_ candidate, not a worse one.

~~~
seandhi
> I no longer have to legally disclose it

I could be wrong, but my understanding is that this is not a "luxury" that we
enjoy in the U.S. Once you have a conviction, it is there forever. So much for
doing your time and paying your debt to society. I really hope I am wrong
about this, but I fear that I am not.

~~~
auctiontheory
Even in the US, convictions can be expunged or sealed. The requirements vary
by jurisdiction. (I think it's especially common for young offenders.)

~~~
nanidin
When something is expunged or sealed, is it required that that non-government
entities purge the records also?

For instance, it's common for local news companies to report arrests &
mugshots on their websites. I'm assuming there are similar aggregators for
arrests and convictions that span larger areas than a single news company, and
these are the same people that service background checks.

What obligation(if any) do they have to respect the fact that a conviction has
been expunged or sealed by the courts?

------
cj
It's a summary of a Quora thread. Direct link:

[http://www.quora.com/Prisons-and-Prison-Life/What-is-it-
like...](http://www.quora.com/Prisons-and-Prison-Life/What-is-it-like-to-be-a-
geek-in-a-prison?share)

~~~
mjolk
As someone that doesn't have a Quora account, it's nice to have the content
without a Facebook/Google login wall.

~~~
nav1
You can append "?share" to the Quora URL to read it without having to log in.

~~~
mjolk
Interesting, thanks.

I wonder if Quora does this to scam on SEO

~~~
null_ptr
No question about it. There's no difference between Quora and Experts-Exchange
when it comes to SEO deception.

~~~
Theodores
Expert Sex Change - there, fixed that for you.

------
mjolk
"I learned that you should go straight to the person you're upset with rather
than go to authorities."

This is bullshit and dumb advice. If someone steals my bike and I find out who
it is, I'm not going to go to his apartment and beat him to death in the
middle of the day (smart money on confronting a scumbag not leading to a
productive conversation).

Fuck that. The reason we have "authorities" is because we have people that
can't figure out how to live in a society. Why should someone not use the
framework that we've invented to resolve issues?

edit: Whoops, I forgot that the internet is the place in which "snitches get
stitches" and no one reports serious crimes to the police because there's a
batman in each of us.

~~~
johnjay
I agree 100% with you. The best response is always to call the authorities. I
really don't see the benefit of going toe to toe with a criminal.

Also, I'm shocked by the responses you are getting telling you that you are
wrong. Do people really want to confront a criminal. I grew up in a ghetto in
Brooklyn, NY, I'm Hispanic, and my family always calls the police.

Getting into an argument directly with someone has too many times ended with
somebody in the hospital or the cementery.

~~~
mjolk
Yeah, I don't understand most of the responses. I hope that the responses are
either from people that:

a) Don't think that he's saying "here's advice for life" (and if they do,
don't realize that this is advice for how to respond to crimes against you)

b) Are scoping his advice to "while in prison, and because you're stuck there
with violent morons anyway, don't make yourself a target"

c) Are out of their depth and/or don't realize that criminals are willing to
resort to violence over even being told to not yell on a crowded subway.
Further, don't realize that even short fistfights can result in serious
consequences to both parties.

d) Just have no idea how the world really works and see things from this weird
rose-tint of (based on responses to me) "minorities will get often get
arrested for reporting crimes, so they shouldn't report them" and don't really
understand that "don't snitch" just results in higher crime rates in affected
areas due to inadequate police spending.

I'm in Brooklyn too and I've witnessed some pretty aggressive fights over
petty (non-criminal) bullshit. Why give a shit if a criminal respects you? I
get that within jail, it's more important, but how is the system supposed to
improve?

~~~
jcc80
"...don't realize that this is advice for how to respond to crimes against
you"

I missed that in the answer by Anonymous on Quora. Can you point it out?
Anyways, seems like you've attached a meaning to this that most people haven't
and now you're making all sorts of assumptions about those that didn't attach
that same meaning.

------
treenyc
"I learned many things from inmates that I never learned in my prior life. I
learned that you should go straight to the person you're upset with rather
than go to authorities. I learned that giving and keeping your word is the
ultimate measurement of character. I learned that loyalty is easy to promise,
but few really deliver. Don't be that guy. Prison is really a learning
crucible since the reactions are so quick and amplified. If you have annoying
habits, you'll find out fast. If you are not respectful to others, you'll hear
about it and you may get a "tune up" to teach you respect."

Sounds like a better and less expensive education than Harvard and Wharton.

~~~
cstavish
Well considering that California spent almost $50k per inmate in 2008 alone
[1], it's certainly cheaper for the "student", but not exactly less expensive
all told.

[1]
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incarceration_in_the_United_Sta...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incarceration_in_the_United_States#Cost)

~~~
treenyc
still less expensive then the Ivy League MBA Education. Provided yes, you will
get more connections. However, MBA graduate of Ive League has terrible
reputation on horning their words.

This Harvard Professor even wrote many paper on the benefit of horning one's
word:

[http://hbswk.hbs.edu/item/6331.html](http://hbswk.hbs.edu/item/6331.html)

If all things are equal, personally I would rather hire this guy than anyone
who graduated Harvard or Wharton.

------
bg-throwaway
I was sentenced to 10 months in 1998. I was released in 1999, went to college,
got a Master's, and finally, a Doctorate.

When I was originally sentenced, I was sentenced to a "boot-camp" style
facility, with the goal of doing 90 days of boot-camp style labor, and walking
out of prison a free man with a parole term. Due to some paperwork issues, I
was transported to the main prison camp (where the camp's goal was to treat
sex offenders), and ended up doing 99% of my time at that camp instead,
waiting for a bed to open up. By the time a bed opened up at the boot camp, I
had less than three months left to go on my sentence, and chose to stay on the
hill instead of the boot camp, and expired out with no probation or parole at
the end.

Prison itself is a great sociological experience. There are three tiers of
people -- the grunts (who have their own stack ranking system), the
intellectuals, and the guards. Communication between any of the three groups
is a challenge. Learning to talk to the 'grunts' always came with some
intimidation. I ended up getting a job in the law library, helping other
inmates type out legal motions and briefs. Fellow inmates would ask for my
assistance with their appeals, and guards would ask for my assistance with
their union cases. It was an interesting dichotomy, to say the least. You keep
your head down, and only form alliances in which trust is the underlying
factor. Around my 9th month there, there was a massive race riot in the
prison, and I had both an African American guy as well as a Hispanic guy
deflect conflict that was coming my way because of those relationships and the
assistance that I had rendered in the library.

Upon my release, I went head-first into getting an education. I applied, and
was accepted to MIT and RIT when I took the ACT and scored high on it, only to
have my acceptances removed once they performed my background check. Two
smaller religious colleges did accept me, regardless of my background, and I
ended up focusing on engineering.

I graduated in 2003. I couldn't find a job until 2006, surviving on working
small jobs for retailers (merchandising), and eventually going back to school
for an MBA, graduating with my Doctorate in 2007.

Two things to realize:

1.) After each days passes and you stay out of prison, your chances of going
back fall. 90% of recidivism occurs after the first year.

2.) After seven years, they can no longer report any criminal activities if
you are doing a FDCPA based background check. That information will be there,
but they're not allowed to use that information (in the state of California,
at least). Banks and others use a SEC of FBI based background check, and those
will always show.

I ended up getting a pardon in 2009. It cost me about $100,000 and was shady
as all hell, and then took me another 18 months to clean up from the various
background check providers, but, now my background is clean, and I have worked
for big companies and startups alike.

Prison isn't the problem, it is the lack of opportunities that exist after
prison that's the problem. Housing options are closed for you once you're
released because of your record -- nonviolent or violent. Employment
opportunities dry up. Educational opportunities no longer exist, or the
funding isn't there due to your conviction. If you don't hustle every day, a
felony record is the equivalent to a civil death sentence -- you have doors
that close up and things that cannot be fixed until you either die, get it
expunged, or have it no longer work for you.

~~~
eru
How do you pay for a pardon? (I'm not from the US, so don't understand the
legal system.)

~~~
ricree
Being mildly familiar with the US political system, but none of the specifics
here, my best guess is that it was a combination of political donations and
hiring some sort of lobbying company.

As a mild form of corruption, it's fairly common for lobbying firms to hire ex
officeholders, as well as close friends and relatives of officials. Then the
lobbyists have a core of trusted people that can at the very least get the
official to listen to their client's argument.

There (usually) isn't any direct payoffs involved, but if someone plays by the
rules they can generally be assured that there will be a cushy job waiting if
they want it once their career in public office is over.

So in this case, my best guess is that a firm was hired to have one of the
governor's colleagues raise the issue of the pardon every so often until he
finally said yes. It also probably didn't hurt that he was the sort of person
who can afford to hire their services, and there's always some upcoming
election that needs to be financed through campaign donations.

But again, this is mostly just speculation, and I know absolutely nothing
about his particular case.

------
morganf
I was once arrested and in jail for 12 hours.

I saw a big machine opposite my cell. I asked the guards (standing opposite my
cell) what that machine did. They light up with excitement that someone showed
interested in and could have a coherent conversation. They spent all night
explaining to me and showing to me all the cool technology in the system. That
big machine -- apparently for electronic fingerprints to take them and
transmit them to some national database but it never worked, they kept on
mocking the NYC police dept for adding layers and layers of technology and
bureaucratic forms and none of it worked, including that machine. We ended up
having an all-night conversation, we got along great. I asked the guards all
these things I always wanted to ask policemen but never had the chance to:
have you ever bee in a chase (yes, once, on the BQE!). What is the pay like?
(Horrible, so they all have second jobs; he also worked _at Radio Shack_! But
they all want to get jobs on Long Island, where the police pay is awesome!).
It was a very fascinating and enlightening conversation.

12 hours later, when I was released, the policemen I spent the night talking
to, offered to drive me back to my apt. He did and when he dropped me off, he
got out of the car and shook my hand. Bizarre experience.

Conclusion: I think the police treated me well because I treated them with
respect, and I showed in them.

(And because I'm white and dress well. When I went to the court for the court
date a few weeks later... I was the only white person in the entire
courthouse, excluding the lawyers and judges. No exaggeration. The judge ended
up throwing out my case before the trial even started.)

------
rquantz
Of course my self-involved reaction to this discussion is "what does a geek do
to land themselves in prison?" I'm guessing probably mostly drug offenses, and
maybe occasionally hacking related activities. Anything else? I'm sure violent
crime is pretty unusual. Maybe tax evasion?

~~~
e12e
Involuntary manslaughter? (eg: auto accident)

------
shalalala
I bet it's a lot like GOATSE.

------
kro0ub
Exactly like it is to be any other privileged white boy in prison.

------
kimonos
I like this line: being in prison was a chance to learn about so many things..
Sometimes, bad things happen for a purpose. They are blessings in disguise..

------
the1
it is like this:
[http://www.slate.com/blogs/business_insider/2013/12/26/what_...](http://www.slate.com/blogs/business_insider/2013/12/26/what_is_it_like_to_be_a_tech_geek_in_prison.1337.json)

------
eplanit
Hmm. He makes no mention of what crime he was convicted of, and expresses no
remorse, either. Although he does seem to be feeling regret (which I think is
an appropriate function of prison), he sees himself as being a victim -- no
other victim is referred to. It seems he's proud of his murdering, home-
invading comrades.

This is certainly a testament to the failure of prisons (at least in his
case). The education he needs is not in Agile, but in how to be a decent human
being. He has learned nothing in that category.

What a horrible guy.

~~~
bennyg
You literally don't know shit about him or his situation. I honestly feel bad
for you; there's no point in being hostile about somebody's character based on
a short synopsis of somebody else's jail time.

~~~
eplanit
Yeah. "Feel bad for me because I'm in prison. Never mind how I got here. I can
write the DDL for a simple database. I'm a hero! NO DISUSSION ALLOWED".

Simple world you live in, it is.

~~~
ItendToDisagree
No one has ever gone to prison for BS reasons, or been falsely accused. How
can you ever trust anyone who ever did anything wrong in their life? If you've
done something wrong you're obviously a bad person forever. <sarcasm>

Edit: As an aside, it is very likely you have committed a crime punishable by
jail time and not been caught/prosecuted, at least once in your life (with or
without you knowing it).

~~~
robflynn
Exactly. I know someone who received a ticket for a broken tail light. He
forgot to pay it and ended up going to jail for 8 months! 8 months! For a
broken tail light!

I would have expected an additional penalty or at most a week in jail, which
even then I would consider that extreme.

~~~
bennyg
Was that 8 month sentence with a lawyer?

~~~
robflynn
No, it wans't. He (I suppose wrongly) assumed that he didn't need one since it
was such a minor thing. No body expected that to happen.

As far as I can tell, has family name was kind of known in the area for being
trouble makers. He, himself, had never been in trouble with the law, but he
had the unfortunate last name of being associated with some family members
that did.

I suspect it was a "teach you a lesson" sort of thing.

Not surprisingly, he did eventually become a trouble maker and is in jail
again. When he was in jail for the taillight, he was quite upset about it.
He's okay with the fact that he's in jail now because he knows he screwed up
and he feels like he deserves it.

