

Daskeyboard 4 Professional - kyledreger
http://www.daskeyboard.com/daskeyboard-4-professional/

======
dljsjr
I used a Das Keyboard for a little over a year, and I loved it. I have fond
memories of it, and it's a very well built and super solid product. I've long
been a fan of mechanical keyboards. I used to use an Apple Extended Keyboard
II at home, and a Das Keyboard at work, and I thought I was in heaven.

But one day I had to do some maintenance on some random computer in a closet
at work, and the only spare keyboard we had sitting around was one of the old
Microsoft Natural Ergonomic 4000's, and using the split-wave layout was a
revelation. I was officially intrigued by ergonomic keyboards. I've since
tried typing on a Truly Ergonomic and an ErgoDox, looking for the sweet spot
between mechanical and ergonomic, but it just wasn't the same. I have yet to
try a Kinesis Advantage because I don't know anybody that owns one.

I now have two Microsoft Sculpt Ergonomic keyboards, one at home and one at
work. And I love them. _I didn 't even realize that normal keyboards were
causing me pain_ until I had to switch back to my old Das temporarily for a
day and the whole of both of my forearms were on fire at the end of it. But in
spite of all that, I still really really miss the Cherry MX Blue switches from
my old Das Keyboard.

My point is that my dream keyboard, ignoring whether or not it's
possible/feasible, would be a split-wave Microsoft-style ergonomic form factor
with Cherry switches. If somebody out there put up a kickstarter for a
keyboard like that tomorrow, I would empty my wallet backing the project.
Maybe the Das Keyboard folks are here reading this.

A boy can dream.

~~~
subsection1h
> _I have yet to try a Kinesis Advantage because I don 't know anybody that
> owns one. [...] I would empty my wallet backing [...]_

You would empty your wallet backing a Kickstarter project but you won't spend
a couple hundred dollars on a Kinesis Advantage? I don't understand.

I have two Kinesis Advantages and I plan to buy another when the new version
is released.

~~~
dljsjr
The Kinesis Advantage is an unknown form factor, I don't know if it would give
me the relief that the split-wave form factor does.

If I tried a Kinesis and liked it, then yes I would buy it in a heart beat.

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taternuts
I don't really seeing 'thick' keyboards as being a pain-point for anyone
buying mechanical keyboards, but the size of the actual board is. A lot of
people start with a full board like this, then transition to a tenkey-less
board or an even more reduced layout. The Das boards don't offer TKL/Reduced
layouts, and even dwarfs most other full-sized boards as well because of that
stupid bezel around the board. Das makes good quality boards, but they are
just too big and clunky for me; I don't think being thin is going to help that
at all.

~~~
JohnTHaller
I'm not sure that folks looking for reduced layouts are a target market for
mechanical keyboards.

~~~
theOnliest
I switched to a compact version (Poker II) after developing some wrist pain
from keeping the mouse so far from the typing position. The mechanical
switches tend to hurt my wrists a lot less and the compact layout is ideal
(with a bit of customization via KeyRemap4Macbook).

~~~
platz
I went for the Kinesis Advantage (LF).. excellent but not a portable as I'd
like.

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falcolas
Given that Mac keyboards are mechanical keyboards (i.e. mechanical contacts,
not membrane switches), I am not sure they can back up this claim.

[EDIT:] I was wrong. Tore open my mac keyboard, and it's still a membrane
switch, just one with good scissor workings to remove a number of the
downsides of membrane switches.

Even for the claim of slimmest cherry switch keyboards, I believe they'll end
up fighting against Corsair [0] over that right.

[0] [http://www.corsair.com/en-us/vengeance-k90-performance-
mmo-m...](http://www.corsair.com/en-us/vengeance-k90-performance-mmo-
mechanical-gaming-keyboard)

~~~
Wingman4l7
I've found that the scissor-style workings found in many "slim" or laptop
keyboards mitigate nicely the general mushiness of membrane keyboards -- and
as an added bonus, they have a short travel _(if you like that sort of
thing)_.

------
post_break
After switching to a mechanical keyboard that is backlit for night time gaming
I'll never go back. This looks great, just wish they would reduct the
footprint. I tried a Das and it was just enormous. My ducky keyboard even with
the 10key was quiet smaller on my desk.

~~~
numo16
I switched to KBT Pure Pro
([http://imgur.com/CWHD5g2](http://imgur.com/CWHD5g2)) about 6 months ago and
am not turning back. Larger keyboards just feel wrong now.

~~~
post_break
Love it, but you know you can get the ducky's tenkey-less too?

------
silverlake
Why do so many keyboards still raise the back? I thought this is exactly wrong
ergonomically because it forces your wrists to bend up. They should raise the
front of the keyboard so it slopes downwards and leaves your wrists in a more
natural position.

~~~
sp332
Bend your fingers. Now straighten them. See how your fingertips trace out a
curve? That's what the sloped keyboard is for. Your wrists should never bend
up. If they do, either your chair is too low, or you're trying to put your
wrists on the desk and type at the same time!

------
bcarrell
I use a Kinesis Advantage LF (Cherry Red switches) at home and work and it's a
complete dream. I really recommend it to anyone, especially programmers,
though it is pretty expensive. Your coworkers will probably make fun of you
though. Before that, I used an Apple keyboard, and it gave me continuous RSI
symptoms. The ability to hardware remap all the keys is nice too. I doubt I'll
ever use a non-ergonomic keyboard again.

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schrodingersCat
This is a great design! I agree that this would be useful for anyone who is 1)
Design conscious, and 2) enjoys typing on a mechanical keyboard (quite
superior IMO). Will this ever be Available in DVORAK layout? Or, is this
keyboard capable of being taken apart to change the layout (a pain, but I'm
willing)?

~~~
theintern
It's a Cherry MX keyboard. As far as I know, DVORAK keyboards just change
which letters go where right?

Then you can just pull the keycaps off and put them where ever you like.
Aftermarket key caps are big among mechanical keyboard enthusiasts, and so
almost all allow you to pull off the keys and arrange them how you want.

That said, most keyboards have slightly different slopes on the different
rows, so if a key goes into the wrong row it'll feel wrong, so it may be a
good idea to go for the Das Ultimate, with blank keycaps, or any other
mechanical and buy a set of blank key caps, they're about 30 dollars.

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cschmidt
I have a couple of mechanical keyboards, including a Daskeyboard. I love the
feel, but after a few days, my wrists get sore and I can feel the RSI setting
in. I never have any trouble with Apple keyboards, and the tiny amount of
force they require. So they sit in my closet.

~~~
wldlyinaccurate
This is normal after a few days as your fingers aren't used to the high force
required to actuate the switches. Give it a week or so and the pain should
subside -- your fingers will get stronger and you'll probably never want to
use membrane keyboards again.

Edit: It really depends on the switches, as well. Cherry MX greens, for
example, have a much higher actuating force which some people find unpleasant
even after long-term use. Browns and reds have a lower actuating force and are
much nicer as a sort of "introduction" to mechanical keyboards.

~~~
cschmidt
Thanks for the suggestion. I looked and my Daskeyboard has MX Blue switches. I
guess that is one of the clickier ones.

------
Splendor
Daskeyboard makes nice products. I hope they introduce an ergonomic line in
the future.

------
chiph
Time for an upgrade from my current dasKeyboard. USB 3, with a single cord --
yayy! The built-in hub now faces to the back, so I don't hit it with the mouse
-- yayy! Still no palm rest, though...

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darkstar999
How loud are these things? Would I annoy my open floorplan office mates?

~~~
0x420
I work in an open office and my coworkers asked me to take my mechanical home
(brown switches). I think it all depends on how tolerant your coworkers are.
Edit: if you're careful not to bottom out, then it isn't so bad. O-rings can
help dampen the sound otherwise.

~~~
dsuth
Your coworkers must be really sensitive (or mine are really tolerant). I've
used brown switches in a Filco Majestouch for over a year, never had any
complaints. I don't bottom out the keys, but there's a noticeable clack when
the keys come back up to full extension.

IOW, I don't think brown keys are unreasonable for shared work environments;
they're not much louder than a standard Dell rubber-domed KB.

The blue switches in my DasKeyboard at home however... I think I'll have to
upgrade just to get something a bit quieter.

------
0x420
I own the previous version and it's lovely, but the multimedia keys and volume
wheel on this one might just be enough to convince me to update. Shame about
the price tag.

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mmanfrin
Anyone with other Das keyboards and a Mac run in to an issue with the keyboard
not responding if they mac goes to sleep?

~~~
dsuth
Never noticed that problem, although I do habitually click my mouse to wake
from sleep...

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mberning
Looks like they got rid of the dual USB cord which required plugging both
cables in for full functionality. If so, good!

~~~
tubbs
> Now equipped with only one USB cable to power keyboard and USB hub at the
> same time.

yup

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vehementi
The word "thin" does not appear on that page. To what are you referring?

~~~
pettazz
Look at the third slide in the carousel at the top.

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FootballMuse
I'm sad there is no backlight option available like the WASD Code Keyboard.

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snorkel
Huh?

[http://www.pcconnection.com/product/adesso-flexible-full-
siz...](http://www.pcconnection.com/product/adesso-flexible-full-sized-usb-
keyboard-with-ps-2-adapter-white/akb-230w/6574718)

~~~
sp332
That doesn't have mechanical key switches, which is what Das means by
"mechanical keyboard".

~~~
snorkel
Yeesh, mechanical black keyboard, that's rather kind of like bragging about
having a VHS player with fastest rewind feature.

~~~
theintern
You've clearly not typed on one. Many people much prefer the experience of
typing on a mechanical keyboard than a standard rubber dome one. Try one and
see, there is a very tangible difference.

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pcunite
Make a tenkey-less version and I might be in.

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bhhaskin
Nice! I think I will have to check it out.

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zura
No `small backspace; big enter` layout?

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Kiro
Should I order blue or brown?

~~~
drglitch
These keyboards are awesome but pretty loud. Be sure you don't mind people on
the phone not hearing you if you're talking and typing.

Once you've typed on this thing for some time, there is no going back though
(except, maybe MacBook keyboards, which are also superb)

~~~
falcolas
If it's not a Cherry MX blue switch, the only sound is from the key hitting
bottom. Since this is not required for key actuation, you don't have to push
the keys all the way to the bottom, and can actually even add rubber
bumpers[0] to the keys to reduce this noise.

[0] [http://www.wasdkeyboards.com/index.php/products/keyboard-
acc...](http://www.wasdkeyboards.com/index.php/products/keyboard-
accessories/cherry-mx-rubber-o-ring-switch-dampeners-125pcs.html)

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valarauca1
I don't see how thing is a selling point. But then my keyboard is a model M...

