
How do you break the cycle of needing experience to find a developer job? - stepup2stepout
I graduated in 2016 with a degree in computer science. Honestly, I was a crap student at the time dealing with personal issues, plus working my way through school.<p>Fast forward to now, after working in sales for 1 1&#x2F;2 years and realizing I do want to do development after all. Problem is, I have no relevant work experience. I&#x27;ve been unemployed for a few months now and have put out ~150 applications with not one interview or call.<p>I&#x27;m really frustrated. I&#x27;m curious if anyone has any advice on breaking this endless cycle. It makes me feel like I will never find a job doing development.
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itamarst
Beyond building a portfolio, as others mentioned—

You're assuming you have no relevant job experience. This is not necessarily
the case. Lots of skills you need as a programmer are used in other jobs as
well. So things you learned while working in sales might well make you a more
attractive candidate than some other person straight out of school. E.g. being
able to work independently is hugely valuable, and partly it's about technical
knowledge you haven't accumulated, but mostly it's about a whole bunch of
skills that transfer from other jobs.

Compare your skills as _salesperson_ to what they were when you started - what
did you learn? What can you do now that you couldn't then?

(Also, happy to look at your resume - itamar@codewithoutrules.com)

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lmilcin
There are always positions open for less experienced developers. Any employer
will want you to show that you are able to contribute.

I got my first job ever as an IT administrator. I was previously administering
network in my dorm. My new employer was very large, very known company. The
had a test prepared to evaluate their candidates, about 50 closed questions. I
have aced the test and got invited for discussion and based on that I was
hired as a junior admin/helpdesk guy.

My first programming job I got after few years of administering critical
systems at large companies. I was writing some scripts and even small apps to
automate things, integrate systems, etc. I got hired as a senior admin for a
company to admin an application that was still in development. The problem
was, the application development team were missing deadlines. Since they did
not have the application ready I got notified they will have to fire me for
lack of job. I proposed I can try and help them to develop the application
faster, and that's how I got my first development gig.

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potta_coffee
It's incredibly difficult. I applied for a hundred jobs, finally got one. Now
I'm freelance/contract, which I stumbled into by luck (got fired and landed
clients the same day). The best piece of advice I can give, is to keep
building side projects to build a portfolio, meet as many people as you can in
the field (network), and if possible, expand your job search criteria. There
are lots of small companies that have a difficult time finding anyone at all
that can work on their code. If you put your time in at some smaller
companies, you can build your resume and inch up the ladder. These kinds of
jobs aren't glamorous but they've given me a lot of confidence in myself as a
programmer. It also helps that teams are usually tiny and you can get a ton of
experience doing different things that would be someone else's responsibility
at a bigger company.

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tlack
one approach i've seen and used to make hiring decisions:

do a great open source project to show you have the skills w/o the experience.
ideally something relevant to potential employer.

what they really want to know is if you know the shit, not how long you sat in
a desk. people lie about such things so years in a job is a proxy for truth

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innoprenuer
or alternative to working on OSS is to create a product and try to sell it. If
it sells you dont need a job at all and yout are sitting on a money making
startup. And if it doesnt then you can use this product to show case your
skills to the potential employer.

~~~
tlack
YES! Great point! And having known the business inside and out, plus the tech,
plus showing what a hard worker you are - you'll be a triple threat!

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patrickgordon
hey OP I had a similar situation to you, except I was still working while
making the transition.

Background - IT degree comprised mainly of electives from a Law dual which I
ended up dropping. Worked as a business analyst for 4 years and before that in
IT support. All at the same pseudo-govt body.

Over the last 1-2 years working there, I spent my days at work just surviving.
Enough to get by. The nights & weekends were spent building product(s) that I
tried and failed to launch as startups. I had pretty much no programming exp.
but grinded through it. Started with Ruby on Rails, rebuilt the same app about
3 times. Then moved to React front-end and Rails backend. Built that one
twice.

Eventually worked up the courage to start applying. Made sure my
resume/interviewing focused on two things: 1\. my experience working in a team
environment and solving problems (i.e. my BA work); and 2\. my experience
building web applications as seen by examples that were deployed. In answering
most tech Q's I referred to things I had done to get my web app to work which
were similar.

I now work as a front-end (React) dev in an awesome company getting paid well
and building interesting things. I've been there for almost a year now.

You may need to grind and it will be frustrating but you can do it. Good luck.

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LarryMade2
One avenue for that is the non-profit service sector, if you can maintain
their systems it has pretty stable hours tasks are long range and you have
time to develop skills and stuff. You learn a lot about the nuts and bolts of
office work, data management, communication, and reporting.

Downside is pay is not anywhere near the private sector, also if funding gets
cut, as a non direct services position, you may be under cutback
consideration.

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tjt
I worked as a BA until I got work at a non-profit doing lightweight database
admin and legacy app administration. Now in my second year I'm helping rebuild
our internal apps with react and .NET. I'm hoping to set myself up well for my
next position.

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ecesena
I know many companies (mine included) have internal programs to switch career
track. One option could be to step in in sales, and apply for the program. The
downside is that you’ll still have to do sales for a bit. Also, I’m not sure
this is something I’d discuss before getting the job, so I guess another risk
is that you won’t be accepted in the program.

