
Earbuds are bad for your hearing - bra-ket
https://onezero.medium.com/why-airpods-and-earbuds-like-them-are-especially-bad-for-your-hearing-20f32b6e02e2
======
heavymark
Or more accurately reworded (but less exciting) loud music is bad for your
hearing. Many people choose earbuds that are not isolating intentionally
because they want to be aware of their surroundings and thus don't increase
the volume to compensate.

~~~
Anechoic
_Many people choose earbuds that are not isolating intentionally because they
want to be aware of their surroundings and thus don 't increase the volume to
compensate._

That might be true, but I'd bet good money most people chose non-isolating
earbuds because they don't know any better (or know of the existence of
isolating earbuds).

~~~
flukus
A choose not to because the lifetime of expensive "high quality" earbuds is
about the same as a $2 pair from the supermarket, if I'm going to pay for high
end ones I want something that will last more than a few months and I've been
burned a couple of times. The midrange ($30-$40) sony ones are the only brand
I've had that can last a year.

~~~
varren
hm, most "high quality" earbuds nowadays come with detachable cables and i
have 3 200$+ earbuds with mmcx. 2 chi-fi and 1 sony, all of them work for 3-5
years of active use. Yes mmcx chords could break from time to time, but top
notch chords cost like 5-10$ on aliexpress nowadays. anyway i'm probably a
little bit biased here, because after you get several dissent pairs you start
to think what kind of music you what to play today and what kind of headphones
signature you should use for this music, because to be honest there is a huge
difference. And yeah i was exactly like you, buying the cheapest possible
earbuds 5 years ago and i had like 10+ of thous cheap
sony/philips/sennheisers. They all break in a couple of mounts-year. Usually
it is a chord or just some driver problems.

~~~
omnimus
Which chi-fi earbuds fromi aliexpress you recomend?

~~~
punchclockhero
I'm a KZ fan. Most models have detachable cables with several replacement
options, including Bluetooth. My current main is ZS6, very neutral, but the
angular metal body can be quite uncomfortable. Before that I had ZST which was
way more comfortable and had more bass, although the instrument separation
wasn't as good. Still the best $20 I've ever spent on music.

------
rightos
I'm not sure why the 2 options being offered here seem to be either Airpod-
style non-sealing hard plastic or full on over-ear cans. What about standard
IEMs with better sealing silicon tips? Or the foam variants sold by Comply and
similar? Wouldn't that better allow you to isolate external noise and listen
at a lower volume than the separate cans? Especially for public transit use
cases they'd seem to be better, unless I'm missing something?

You should also factor in diminished enjoyment - if you're worried about
bothering your neighbor by turning up the volume and are just keeping it lower
out of courtesy, well, that's not really an ideal scenario either, especially
if you have to put up with barely hearing what you're listening to as a
result.

Additionally, many of the products being suggested here are not really rated
very well and would be hard to suggest to someone listening on even using
cheap stuff like the Philips TX2. I don't understand how these can be
recommended by any reasonable measure.

$30
[https://www.innerfidelity.com/images/PhilipsTX2.pdf](https://www.innerfidelity.com/images/PhilipsTX2.pdf)

A few suggestions from the article, $50 and $200+
[https://www.rtings.com/headphones/1-2/graph#617/2085/463](https://www.rtings.com/headphones/1-2/graph#617/2085/463)

~~~
keypusher
After using in ear headphones for a few years I started to develop fairly bad
ear wax problems. Like, my ears would become completely blocked and I would
have to go have them cleaned by a specialist. YMMV but putting things deep
into your ear canal isn’t necessarily a good idea.

------
dsr_
Simplifying: anything which ends up with long-term exposure to high decibel
levels is bad for your ears.

You can mitigate this by reducing the decibel level. One excellent way of
doing this is by blocking out the external sound, so you can listen to the
sound you want at a lower level.

The easiest way to do that is to use in-ear monitors, IEMs, headphones that go
quite deeply into your ears. Using Comply foam tips or silicone triple-flange
tips can reduce the outside noise 25-35dB.

Alternatively, you can use ear defenders on top of nearly any earphone in
existence.

~~~
whymsicalburito
I got custom molded IEMs specifically for this reason when I started working
in an open office. They are amazing and are totally comfortable being worn for
8+ hours per day.

I highly recommend them!

~~~
ohm
Where did you end up getting them from? I’ve seen a flyer from etymotic a
while back [https://www.etymotic.com/consumer/custom-
fit/](https://www.etymotic.com/consumer/custom-fit/)

~~~
whymsicalburito
I went with
[https://pro.ultimateears.com/home](https://pro.ultimateears.com/home) and
have been really happy with them.

I have a buddy that got some Etymotics and he's really happy with them.

Make sure you get a good carrying case for them. I dropped mine when I first
got them and had to send them in for repairs. Now I keep them in a pelican
case and haven't had any problems.

Oh and DO NOT buy the DIY ear mold kits - go to an audiologist and have them
do it. It's not worth messing up your ears.

------
blunte
What's obviously missing from school is education about actual life concerns -
health (including sexual, at least in some countries that pretend that sex
doesn't happen), financial, social, etc.

It's not difficult to understand that ears are complex and sensitive. Just a
little physical education could help illustrate to children that preserving
their ears is of some importance. The problem is not non-isolating earphones.
The problem is ignorance.

Also, I mentioned social education. Regarding non-isolating "earbuds", god
help us, please educate people that those not wearing the earbuds probably do
not want to hear your crappy music; and if you turn it up loud enough to drown
out the ambient noise, then you will be essentially providing a narrow band
public performance of whatever you are listening to.

Meanwhile, for less than $200 you can have some exceptional Shure in ear
headphones that provide pretty flat and efficient response while
simultaneously blocking out as much ambient sound as active (more expensive
and battery operated) headphones do.

~~~
velp
Agreed, but for most of the country, $200 is an unbelievable amount of money
to spend on earbuds. Even among many of my tech friends, the thought of
spending more than $30 on a thing that they will inevitably lose or break is
stupid.

And this is coming from a guy with ~$1000 headphone setup at work..

~~~
Groxx
Sure, but over-ear headphones and in-ear earbuds start far, far lower than
that. Like, "$12 and available at any Walmart" style "far lower".

edit: heck, they go down to $5, though I'll definitely grant that in-ear ones
were not very common until a few years ago. now they're absolutely everywhere:
[https://www.walmart.com/ip/In-Ear-Earphones-Wired-Earbuds-
No...](https://www.walmart.com/ip/In-Ear-Earphones-Wired-Earbuds-Noise-
Isolating-Headsets-with-Microphone-Heavy-Deep-Bass-Earphones-Ear-Buds-Fits-
for-All-3-5mm-Interface-Device/552979242)

------
greenyouse
Beyond the inefficient audio design of the headphones it feels like there
should also be a better audio feedback so users are aware of how loud the
sound is. Why can't the device read you back the volume level in words when
you change the volume so you have an objective measure of how loud the volume
is? The computer could say a number 1-10 based on the sound level. It makes
sense that older devices wouldn't have this feature but a modern computer or
phone should be able to do this without a custom app.

On linux you could hack something together to speak the alsa volume level like
amixer set Master 2+ && amixer get Master | grep dB | awk '{print $4}' |
espeak -s 300

Do other people use something similar?

~~~
crazygringo
But your volume level isn't your volume level.

Your OS-level volume level is the _maximum_ permitted level.

The volume in your ears is that multiplied by the amplitude of what you're
listening to.

It frustrates me that when I listen to soft passages in classical music, I
literally _cannot_ turn the volume up loud enough to hear it because it won't
go any higher. But then I hear a system beep and it leaves my ears ringing
it's so loud.

What I _really_ wish is that dynamic volume equalization would be built in as
an option to the OS itself. Then "maximum" might actually be something useful.

~~~
markrages
> dynamic volume equalization

The audio term is "compression". And it's unbelievable that it isn't a
standard OS-level feature. It is not computationally expensive to implement.

~~~
MultusSalus
I think iOS has a compressed audio option under Music/eq.

------
_hardwaregeek
I'm very curious on whether Etymotics, with their strong seal and extreme
isolation, are actually way better for your hearing. The company was started
by Mead Killion, who has worked on hearing loss. But I can't say I've seen a
real comparison done between earbuds, headphones (closed and open) and IEMs.
There's quite a few questions here, such as: How much isolation is enough? Is
there a difference in headphone usage in urban environments versus suburban
ones?

~~~
Groxx
Anecdotal and no data to back it up, but I have a pair of Shure IEMs and I
love it. I listen at a fairly comfortable level all the time, and _usually_
when I take them out I'm surprised by how loud the world is around me. Seems
like that should mean I'm listening at an objectively quieter level than
ambient noise.

------
gumby
Gosh, I remember when the _walkman_ came out and the press was full of
articles on how this was ruining kids' hearing (and civilization in general to
boot). Of particular additional concern was how it blocked out exterior noise.

Now we have the panic that these don't block out enough noise, which, _sacre
bleu!_ , apparently makes things even worse!

Though for what it's worth my hearing's been shot since my late 30s. I suspect
loud concerts, gunshots, explosions, and manned rocket launches have been
worse.

~~~
colechristensen
BS Industrial Complex is good at selling "bad for you" especially when it's
something younger people do more than older people.

------
munk-a
The standard Apple earbuds form a terrible seal and encourage people to turn
music up louder in order to hear it... I've been sort of idly waiting to see a
big class action lawsuit targeting them as people raised when iPods were a
thing realize that their hearing is shot.

~~~
ghaff
I suspect many people prefer earphones that aren’t a tight fit. Anecdotally I
have wired Bose noise cancelling ear phones I wear in noisy environments like
planes. But I prefer AirPods for more routine use. They’re just more
comfortable.

------
WalterBright
I read when I was young that the top 3 causes of deafness were gunshots, rock
concerts, and headphones.

Nobody mentioned driving with the window down. Got caught by that.

~~~
toomanybeersies
Unfortunately, I've had a lot of time around all three, plus power tools.

Now I'm not even 30 and I have tinnitus.

~~~
WalterBright
Sorry about that. Doc told me there can be a 20 year lag between the damage
and the symptoms, much like that for skin damage from the sun.

------
im3w1l
The NYC subway is ridiculously noisy. It seems to be concentrated to certain
problem spots along the track where the screeching goes out of control. There
should be targeted interventions to address them imo.

~~~
Anechoic
_There should be targeted interventions to address them imo._

They are targeted. The issue is that in the end, it's a geometry problem -- in
curves, one wheel wants to move faster than the other, which results in one
wheel flange being dragged across the railhead. The treatments range from the
minor (friction modification such as lubricants or sand) to the major
(independent wheels, steerable trucks, wheel/rail dampers) and all have
affects on vehicle performance on tangent track, or high costs.

~~~
hedora
The BART screeches with the worst of them (especially the trans bay tube — you
basically can’t hold a conversation in it).

I heard from someone that rode it when it was new that it used to be much,
much quieter.

So, I’m not sure I buy that the current level of screeching is by design, and
not due to lack of maintenance.

~~~
saltcured
A confounding factor is that I think they have changed the typical operating
speeds in many parts of the BART system over the years. Also, it isn't like
the entire system is made up of 40-50 year old, original parts. Train cars,
wheels, sections of rail, and maybe even bits of rail-bed have been added to
the system, renovated, and/or replaced over the years.

Qualitatively, I think that I have experienced similar painful noises in every
decade since the late 1970s, when I was a little kid and my father worked for
BART. In the early 1990s, I can remember people talking about how they
sometimes got a quiet train or a loud train on a familiar commute. We had
similar observations about different road surfaces put down by Caltrans. I
tend to ride it at least once every 2-3 years during return visits. Also, at
various places in the East Bay, weather depending, you can hear the early
morning trains on at-grade or above-grade track from quite far away. I have
heard very similar noises in recent years when visiting the same places,
giving me a nostalgic kick as it sounded so familiar.

------
kibibyte
Is there a way for the average consumer to measure the sound level output of
their earbuds? There's got to be a better way than just seeing if that volume
setting causes discomfort; I'm sure I'm already acclimated to higher volumes.

~~~
ses1984
If you search for decibel meters, you will find some as low as $20, maybe
cheaper on ebay. You could split it with some friends/family.

You need to simulate making a seal between the meter and the thing you want to
measure. You can put the meter through a hole in a piece of foam to measure
the sound of regular headphones.

For in-ears, I stared with a toilet paper tube and cut it down to a small
cylinder and tried to seal the earbud in there.

I got one and found that my typical listening levels were within safety
threshold, it actually made me confident to sometimes turn up some things a
bit louder without worrying.

Another thing is comparing what you have to a known reference. The decibel
levels of apple ear buds at different volume levels of an iphone are out there
if you search. It won't be that accurate but it will give you a general idea.

>all the way up and only ten minutes is safe

------
nessunodoro
take out one earbud. does the other seem drastically loud? turn down the
volume until it doesn't. voila. ambient congruence.

same goes for lcd brightness. if the screen you're looking at is brighter than
a sheet of paper would be, reduce its amplification.

i still believe in the power of humanity to reclaim its environmental
awareness, and press a button accordingly.

~~~
jagannathtech
I believe in the power of humanity to screw itself and never been let down.

------
acjohnson55
I recommend the TaoTronics TT-EP008s. They're active noise cancelling and only
$40. I bought them when I thought I had lost my trusty Bose QC20s. My Bose's
were found and returned to me, and I can confirm that the TaoTronics are on
par. They sound slightly different, but I don't think most people would
identify one or the other as sounding superior. You can also pair them with
memory foam tips for better passive isolation, which is complementary to the
active noise cancellation (the former works better for high frequencies, and
the latter is only effective for low frequencies).

~~~
anonu
Ehh - I've had QC20s for 5+ years and The TaoTronics you suggested for 1+
year. I would disagree that they're on par.

The QC20s have way better noise cancellation and the frequency response on
them (and most Bose products) is more pleasant to my ear as Bose tends to
sound better at the lower frequencies.

Yes, the QC20s are 5x the cost - but in this case you get what you pay for.

------
Solvitieg
One thing that's often overlooked is the noise levels of our streets (or
environments more broadly).

Often I have to crank-up the volume on my phone because the street I'm walking
along is so loud.

There are dump trucks, construction work, motorcycles, and buses driving and
stopping only a few metres away, it can get loud very suddenly.

And I'm not traveling along highways. I live in downtown Vancouver, walking
along one-way streets like Hornby.

Just something I've noticed recently.

~~~
xeromal
I experience that when riding my motorcycle so I just use ear plugs. That
seems risky, but if you lose your hearing, it's basically the same thing.

------
crazygringo
With the wired headphones, Apple offered stock headphones and separately sold
in-ear headphones for $79, the sound quality of which was actually pretty
amazing. [1]

I'm super bummed we're at AirPods 2.0 and still no in-ear option. It's not
just an aesthetic choice, it's literally a public health concern, as the
article states.

I own Bose QC35's and they're great, but they're bulky so I don't always carry
them with me the way I can small earphones. I _really_ wish Apple would make
in-ear AirPods... I even bought some generic Chinese ones [2] but although
they kind of work, they quality isn't anywhere close (in sound quality, in
Bluetooth reliability, and size and in construction generally).

[1] [https://www.amazon.com/Apple-Ear-Headphones-Remote-
Mic/dp/B0...](https://www.amazon.com/Apple-Ear-Headphones-Remote-
Mic/dp/B00F96OWNG)

[2]
[https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07J2Z5DBM/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b...](https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07J2Z5DBM/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o06_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1)

~~~
cmicali
The BeatsX are as close as you can get right now. Same ease of
use/pairing/sound quality, if you can live with the cord in connected the two
buds.

~~~
EricE
Agreed. And I find the cord to be a benefit - if I want to pull the headphones
out I can just let them hang around my neck and don't have to fumble with them
to put them in a pocket or back into their case.

------
iambateman
This problem seems extraordinarily addressable at a tech-level.

My iPhone can detect decibel levels, plus it knows that it’s been spitting out
100db for 90 minutes. Why not show a warning?

Also the volume on the phone could have a “yellow” and “red” indication to
visually show where things start to get too loud.

There are lots of hard problems in the world, is this really one of them?

~~~
sahaskatta
The new iOS 13 does this! [https://www.theverge.com/2019/6/3/18650755/apple-
health-app-...](https://www.theverge.com/2019/6/3/18650755/apple-health-app-
ios-13-watch-os-cycle-tracking-update-wwdc-2019)

------
elchief
I tried earbuds back in the day but never liked them. They fall out when I run
fast.

I greatly prefer airliner pilot over the ear headphones. They sound better,
block out more noise, and don't fall off

I got some MPOW H5s from amazon. $50. Decent battery life. Bluetooth. Noise
cancelling isn't anything to write home about. Sound quality is decent

------
thatswrong0
I love music, yet I pretty much never listen to it except in a live setting
(with earplugs of course!) because I really really don’t want to lose my
hearing. I _could_ listen to it all day every day while I work like my
coworkers but I know I have a tendency to blast it when I listen to it.. so I
just don’t. Kind of sad.

------
anonu
> do a poor job overpowering noise

This is actually exactly why I use AirPods. You can run and bike with them and
still have some notion of what's going on around you.

When I want to cut out noise, I bust out my trusty QC20s, which actually seal
the ear off and reduce plenty of noise, even before you turn them on.

------
JofArnold
I can’t help wonder if Apple are at least in part behind this increasing
awareness of the impact of noise on wellness. It’s known they are releasing
active noise cancelling headphones (perhaps this year) and WatchOS 6 has a
noise meter as one of the complications...

------
valtism
I love my airpods, but this is the reason I also went and bought some noise-
cancelling over ear headphones. I'd always have to compromise between hearing
what I was playing vs potentially getting hearing damage on my commute.

------
antognini
As a rule of thumb, if you're standing next to a busy street and listening to
a podcast, you should not be able to understand what is being said. If you can
clearly hear the podcast your volume is too loud.

~~~
gen3
Not necessary. If your earbuds (or IEM's) have really good isolation you
should be able to do that at low volume. I have a pair of Shure 215, and they
work like earplugs.

~~~
antognini
Yeah, if you have really good sound isolation then you would need an in-canal
SPL measurement. My rule of thumb is assuming the poor sound isolation typical
of most earbuds.

------
mirimir
I've used earbuds, but don't like them. I mainly enjoy loud music. Metal,
punk, electronic like VibeSquad and Bassnectar, and so on. With lots of bass
and sub-bass. So I can really feel it. I have a pair of ancient JBL L96s,
driven by a clean 100W per channel amp.

So with earbuds, I find that I'm always increasing the volume, seeking body-
shaking bass that they'll never produce.

~~~
thatswrong0
Love me some Bassnectar too.. a Subpac might help you out with that ¯\\_(ツ)_/¯

~~~
mirimir
Each L96 has an 8" bass reflex woofer. They're very efficient, and get very
loud. Maybe too boomy for some, especially in small rooms. But I reduce room
resonance with suitably placed cork and high-density foam absorbers.

For _ad hoc_ testing, I like to use an An-ten-nae mix that includes a slide
down to maybe 20 Hz. I can totally drive a small frame house with that cut.

~~~
thatswrong0
I've never had a room big enough / isolated well enough to flex a proper
soundsystem.. very jealous.

~~~
mirimir
My office is rather small -- ~3m x ~3m x 2.7m high. So I have the speakers
overhead, with their backs ~10cm from the ceiling. So that drives the floor
and ceiling more than the walls. And there's far better sound isolation
between floors than between units.

Still, I can't crank it as much as I could when I lived in a house.

------
michaelbuckbee
Not mentioned in the article (or so far in the discussion here) are bone-
conducting headphones which are great for riding and running.

[https://www.soundguys.com/bone-conduction-
headphones-20580/](https://www.soundguys.com/bone-conduction-
headphones-20580/)

If I had a long subway commute I'd consider using those and a pair of foam
earplugs.

~~~
anonu
I've tried these (not this particular brand) and I did not come away with the
same experience. The sound quality is actually pretty atrocious.

~~~
euske
The thing is that those headphones are the opposite of noise cancelling
(because it is open). But that's the whole point - I want to be aware more of
my surroundings than my music, especially when you're in a public space. If
you care about the sound quality, I wouldn't recommend it.

For the same reason I'm generally hesitant to use a VR headset, as it almost
completely blocks your senses. Total immersion is unnecessary to me.

------
iam_nomad
it is so simple when sound pressure * hour == much stress to your ear. same
logic, if sound origin getting much closer from your drumstick, your ears can
damage. most worries are it won't be suddenly. the habit using earbuds most
hours makes slowly killing your ear. The ear is pretty most impossible to
cure. so, keep volume down and use speaker rather than earbuds.

------
Causality1
You need different ear buds for different tasks. If you're trying to isolate
yourself, use in-ear buds. If you need to maintain awareness of your
surroundings, use canal-adjacent buds like air pods or sony MDR-J10s. If
you're in an especially noisy environment like a party, using a lawnmower or
vacuum cleaner, use a pair of Plugfones with a real NRR value.

------
SquishyPanda23
Here's a PDF of the referenced study on noise levels in subways:

[https://www.nyneuroslp.com/presspdf/Subway%20and%20Bus%20Noi...](https://www.nyneuroslp.com/presspdf/Subway%20and%20Bus%20Noise%20Levels-%20Paper.pdf)

------
drilldrive
Sounds like the market is ripe for a startup for semi-hearing-aids of sorts.

~~~
graphememes
Airpods can actually be used as hearing aids.

------
deanCommie
> “I’m seeing a lot of younger people in their twenties who are coming in with
> ringing in their ears,” says Sarah Mowry, an assistant professor of
> otolaryngology at Case Western Reserve University School of Medicine. “I
> think it’s probably related to this all-day earbud use. It’s noise trauma.”

Citation needed before we dump another criticism on "milinneals" and their
phone obsession.

Arw there actually more young people with hearing problems than before?

Are loud concerts not a more likely culprit? I know I've been to plenty in my
day that led to ringing and clogged ears for a week, and I have super low
level tinnitus as a result (I can hear the ringing in very quiet environments
but not in day to day life).

~~~
egypturnash
If you read further down there are plenty of citations.

"Brian Fligor, an audiologist who has studied the impact of earbuds on hearing
damage, says that people typically listen to their earbuds about 13 decibels
higher than the background noise."

"2014 research, conducted by Fligor and others, looked at the impact of urban
environments on people’s headphone listening levels by measuring sound levels
through a mannequin’s ears. The research involved asking passersby to take
their headphones off and place them on this mannequin at the same volume level
they had been listening to. The average listening level was 94 decibels, 58
percent of people polled were exceeding their weekly sound exposure limit —
and an overwhelming 92 percent of them were wearing AirPod-style earbuds."

"2014 research" links to
[https://www.researchgate.net/publication/261256174_Cultural_...](https://www.researchgate.net/publication/261256174_Cultural_and_Demographic_Factors_Influencing_Noise_Exposure_Estimates_From_Use_of_Portable_Listening_Devices_in_an_Urban_Environment)

"According to the American Osteopathic Association, approximately one in five
teens today suffer some form of hearing damage, a rate that’s 30 percent
higher than it was 20 years ago. The World Health Organization estimates that
over “1 billion young people” are at risk of hearing loss, primarily from
listening to music on headphones or earbuds."

There are links in those two sentences, too.

~~~
thoughtsimple
AirPods didn't exist in 2014. They were released at the end of 2016.

------
fortran77
I use CIEMs that mechanically block out external sound. I can listen to music
at very low levels even in noisy environments. Expensive (mine were ~ $1200
from 64 Audio) but worth it.

------
mensetmanusman
This doesn’t work for everyone, but I can wear air pods under the 3M Peltor
hearing protection (what pro Starcraft players use). Let’s me use them while
mowing.

------
m3kw9
I imagine plane rides are the worse as that is loud as fk and you will be
watching 1-2 movies.

~~~
andrekandre
i used to use in-ear earphones that fit really well and isolated the outside
so i could be fine with 30% or less volume even on the train, but they always
broke after a few months and finally broke down and got airpods (been using
them for about 9 months with no breakage so far) but their fitting is
atrocious and i have to use those plastic attachments that hold them in...
nevertheless i now have to be careful i never go above 50% volume because of
the lack of isolation.... when i’m in an airplane or train... it’s _very_
hard...

------
deathanatos
Why do we make earbuds that are even capable of causing damage to a person's
ear?

------
kanokun
I would read it if medium would let me. Do many people pay to read on
medium.com ?

------
iam_nomad
it's so simple. when sound driver (origin) reaches closely from drumhead your
ear are getting more stress and got damage.

------
dennisgorelik
Earbuds bring dirt with potential infection into listener's ears. That is the
main reason why I do not use earbuds.

------
RyanAF7
Anything pitched by bullshit "tech" companies is going to be bad for you.

How is it that it's taken this long for people to realize these fucking ear
buds are bad for you?

Who thought, "Oh hey, let's shove a speaker directly into peoples ears so they
can hear music louder than otherwise possible and they'll love us for it."

Jesus, leave it to the HN microcosm to pick up on something only after the
"experts" published a bullshit article. lol

~~~
RyanAF7
But then again, anything to the negative in a way that isn't "kosher" with
HN's fucked up overly privileged sensibilities is going to be downvoted lol.

WITHIN 1 minute lol.

How about one of you dipshits run an algo on how long it takes for non-
positive comments to be downvoted and see if it's even possible based on the
user base.

~~~
drdeca
Here's a tip which I find helpful in many forums : If I don't want to be
downvoted, avoiding using an abrasive manner when criticizing many of the
users is something that seems to help.

If you don't mind being downvoted, then one can, of course, disregard that,
but if one does, one shouldn't complain about being downvoted afterwards.

