
How Codecademy (YC S11) Snagged 200,000 Users in Seven Days - kevinwdavid
http://www.forbes.com/sites/jjcolao/2012/03/22/codecademy/
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graeme
I used Codecademy for the first seven weeks. I started learning to program in
January 2012, so the timing was perfect - I was their target market.

It was fun and interesting for a while. But the instructions began to get
cumbersome. You had to read 3-4 paragraphs just to learn that they wanted you
to write a simple, one line loop.

I spent more time reading instructions than thinking about or writing code.

I was using K & R at the same time, and the contrast was instructive. In K & R
you're given a concise description of a feature, and then a short exercise
that forces you to _think_ about how to use it.

In the final few weeks, my only motivation to keep going with Codecademy was
the thought that "at least I'll have these badges that show what I know". That
was a pretty big warning sign.

I stopped when I realized I wasn't even learning the concepts in the lessons.
There simply wasn't enough coding practice for them to stick.

I haven't been there for a few weeks, so perhaps things have gotten better.
But from what I saw, they needed to work on cutting out the cruft in their
instructions. Pedagogy is difficult.

~~~
joeag
I did about 6 or 7 weeks of Codecademy and then stopped also. I found the same
issues mentioned above, mostly just wrote "code" without really understanding
what was supposed to be happening. I like Udacity a lot more and have been
able to stick with that (so far). I think the lecture videos used on Udacity
make a big difference. I guess it's also different in that it's "computer
science" rather than learn to code in javascript - so the Udacity course is
intentionally more focused on underlying concepts. I am afraid I am going to
fall off the Udacity schedule though because it's very challenging/taxing. I
just can't sit and work the lessons or homework in one sitting - my brain gets
too tired!

Both courses/companies have been great for me though as a non-programmer. I
think these companies and others like them have bright futures.

~~~
allisonhouse
Great feedback—thanks a bunch, joeag. I'm so sorry to hear the lessons didn't
keep you on board, but we'd love to learn more about your experience and what
we can do better if you're willing to chat! We're contact (at) codecademy
(dot) com—feel free to drop us a line and one of our co-founders will get back
to you.

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asdfdsa1234
I don't know why Codecademy gets any attention. After seeing a number of items
about it, I attempted to use Codecademy to brush up on javascript. My
conclusion: it's a fine idea poorly executed and basically useless as a
learning tool. Pure hype.

FWIW, I don't mean to be caustic. I honestly can't believe that anyone who
writes posivitely about it has used it.

~~~
AznHisoka
Same here. A lot of hype thanks to it being associated with YC and hackers.

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bitsoda
I'm just poking my head in here to sing Udacity's praises. Their CS-101 class
is phenomenal; it is hands down the best intro to CS on the web. The fact that
it's free is just icing on the cake. The 1 unit per week for 7 weeks pace is
demanding -- and I think users would benefit from the doubling of the course
length -- but the videos, professors, community, quiz frequency, and
challenging homework make for one hell of a learning experience I've never
seen before online.

~~~
WadeF
Agreed. I've been working through their class as well. I've worked through
Codecademy, Coursera, Udacity and a variety of other courses.

Udacity is challenging, engaging and helps me learn better than anything I've
seen yet.

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dsawler
I'm a web designer who really wants to learn JS to be able to fully implement
my designs on the front end (I know HTML/CSS and can edit a jQuery script to
fit my needs). I feel I am in their target market, or close to it, but they
failed at keeping me a student. I stopped going to Codecademy because I could
no longer understand the instructions, and because it was buggy. I often had
to ask my boyfriend, who is an engineer, to explain the instructions to me
because they were so hard to understand for someone with a very limited
programming background.

I've started with Udacity CS101 and it's much better. I still think the
instruction from the professor isn't the greatest, but it's good enough for me
to be able to keep progressing, even if it means I have to repeat a unit to
understand the concepts.

~~~
zds
Thanks for the feedback. I'd love to chat with you in a bit more depth about
your experience if you have a chance - can you email
contact(at)codecademy(dot)com if you have a minute? We're doing everything we
can to improve quality of content as well.

~~~
dsawler
Absolutely.

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apsurd
possibly offtopic but as a non-beginner javascript developer I find some
things taught to be not best practices. its possible that the user is being
guided up to a place where he fully understands "this is why this method is
better". an obious example is the use of global variables and functions whose
main purpose is to act on global variables. while not technically wrong, it is
definitely a no no in modern development.

From what I went through I would say its a good platform to learn syntax and
keyword definitions e.g. "this is a function" but it doesnt address the
application part. and no having a step by step project at the end of the
lesson does not address the application part. application needs to teach how
to think in programming, how to take problems conveyed in english and solve
them with programing.

lastly, ive found technical errors in the way instructions are worded. what
they are asking for in english is not exactly what they expect as the code
solution. needless to say this frustrates beginners.

its very hard to teach.

~~~
zds
thanks, apsurd. it definitely is hard to teach but we're dedicated to creating
awesome learning material that's easy for everyone to use and learn with.

if you have more (or specific) comments, please shoot me an email -
contact(at)codecademy(dot)com. thanks!

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dinkumthinkum
No magic shortcuts. It may seem cynical but please read Norvig's Learn to
Program in 10 Years: <http://norvig.com/21-days.html>.

~~~
zds
We agree - it's about putting the time into learning. We're trying to make it
easier to get started on the path.

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sgdesign
I wrote about the design side of CodeYear on my blog:
<http://sachagreif.com/how-i-designed-codeyear-com-in-1-hour/>

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goatcurious
It would be an interesting study to try and understand the behavior and
personalities behind the 100% completion rates so far. Most of code year
signups happened around new year resolution time - compliance can't be much
different than that of a typical gym with a great offer. But those who have
been consistently at it, must be special.

The 0% completion numbers might look exceptionally bad for Codeyear as there
was so much of hype surrounding it back then (Bloomberg and all..). But that
is understandable, and the founders could not have done much about it.

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vidar
How many are still taking lessons?

~~~
truth_dude
Instructors from the free online classes at MIT/Berkeley/Cal/Stanford are much
better than whoever is writing up code academy lessons.

~~~
graeme
Likewise, the Udacity courses are also much better planned. They put a lot of
effort into making their lessons flow naturally. They pare down the
presentation to the essential.

I find I spend a lot more time coding when doing a Udacity lesson.

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mrtunes
i stopped doing the lessons because of a lot of crashes. things like including
print statements would cause Chrome to invoke my physical printer.

i am curious how far the people who signed up during this big spurt are
getting through the program, and if it can be evaluated against competitors
like Treehouse?

overall i am a big fan of competition in the e-learning space, because it's a
topic that hasn't receive much attention in the past (Kahn Academy is likely
to thank).

~~~
allisonhouse
I'm so sorry to hear that silly bug contributed to your departure! I'm the
Lead Designer at Codecademy. We're a lot more stable these days (that printer
bug was fixed right away)—if you decide to give us another try, we'd love to
hear your feedback about the experience: contact (at) codecademy.com. (Zach,
our co-founder, makes sure the whole team internalizes member feedback. :D)
Either way, thanks for giving us a shot!

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ylem
A strange question--as a service, I like the idea, but how do they plan to
support it long term? Advertising? Grants? Will people pay for it?

~~~
graeme
If they _could_ reliably train programmers, then recruiters or companies would
be glad to pay for skilled graduates or custom courses.

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mkramlich
My guess as to how they got users that fast? A lot of people wanting to learn
programming to make higher pay, plus, a spike in folks wanting to start web
startups but are not already a programmer (with a good percentage of those
excited by Facebook's story). I've had to review resumes and interview folks
for software jobs before, and a surprising percentage can't seem to program or
not know what they're talking about. Lure of money is strong.

