
Now it’s exploding Samsung washing machines - petethomas
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2016/09/29/first-it-was-samsung-phones-now-its-exploding-samsung-washing-machines/
======
kefka
We have a Samsung refrigerator. Worst purchase ever. The condenser coil in the
fridge portion accumulates ice all over the fins and fan, and causes the
fridge/freezer to gradually lose cooling.

Samsung refuses to honor the warranty about this issue.

I've jury-rigged 2 temp sensors with a photodiode to my existing IoT
infrastructure ([https://hackaday.io/project/12985-multisite-
homeofficehacker...](https://hackaday.io/project/12985-multisite-
homeofficehackerspace-automation)). As of right now, if the temp goes over a
set point for more than 5 minutes with door closed, an alarm will be sent to
our lights and my laptop (wherever it may be).

But this alarm means I have to take out the bottom shelves, unscrew the panel,
and clean out the ice with a heat gun. It's better than having spoiled food.

~~~
sqldba
I have a 5 year old Samsung fridge also. It's a piece of shit - since Day 1
the freezer makes ice and everything else stink of chemicals. Even after
numerous air-outs, cleans, baking soda, the works. I can't wait until it dies.
Fuck Samsung.

~~~
ashark
Weird—we've got an ~3 month old Samsung washing machine (uh oh...) that also
smells strongly of chemicals. I'm beginning to doubt the smell will ever go
away.

Don't have any complaints about it otherwise (unless it turns out to be an
exploding model) but I've never had a new appliance smell so much for so long.
You've got an hour, tops, to get the clothes out of it and into the (older,
other brand) drier or they'll stink of Samsung chemicals and you'll have to
run them again.

------
Animats
Is Samsung making washing machines without out-of-balance detection? That was
figured out by 1960. Today, a 3-axis accelerometer chip is $0.86, quantity 1.
If a microprocessor is running the machine, the way it should operate is to
back off the spin speed if it detects excessive vibration. As water drains
out, the maximum speed at which vibration appears should increase. If that
doesn't happen, shut down and sound the out of balance alarm.

~~~
userbinator
Mine is later than 1960 (but not by much), with all-mechanical controls, and I
don't think it has out-of-balance detection since it will jump around and make
loud banging noises long enough for you to notice and stop it. It's happened
to me once or twice. A search of the Internet for "walking washing machines"
reveals that this isn't uncommon, and there are many others discussing the
balance problem with stories of machines moving several feet and shaking loud
enough to be heard throughout the house --- but not any mention of
"explosions", and very little mention of similar damage to the machine or its
surroundings.

That really makes me wonder what's happening with these Samsungs --- the
article has quotes like these...

 _One Georgia mom was pulling clothes from the dryer, with her 4-year-old son
nearby, when she heard the boom and saw the damage._

...which make it sound like the machine was behaving perfectly normally, and
then spontaneously self-destructed with no signs of vibration beforehand. That
is very unusual. Even in the destructive videos on YouTube where the machine
is deliberately unbalanced with an extremely heavy piece of non-clothing, they
still shake loudly and viciously for some time before disintegrating.

~~~
Hydraulix989
If you buy sorbothane pads and put them underneath the washer's legs, they
will dampen the vibrations and prevent it from walking.

------
williamscales
> Some washing machines, the suit alleges, vibrate violently under heavy
> loads, causing the tub to “become unfastened, resulting in a dramatic
> centrifugal explosion that destroys the machine and nearby property.”

Any washing machine, if not level and if overloaded, will shake violently. The
picture in the article showed a very small, seemingly fragile washing machine.
I imagine one must take extra care to not overload such a machine. In fact, I
know that these machines do have warnings to not overload them. What more
could reasonably be expected of Samsung?

~~~
Spivak
> In fact, I know that these machines do have warnings to not overload them.
> What more could reasonably be expected of Samsung?

Standard IANAL.

Unfortunately companies can't always offload all their liability to the
customer in this manner. We will see with the result of this lawsuit whether
this is such a case.

They're likely going to argue that a reasonable person who buys a washing
machine expects that it will continue to operate safely with any amount or
configuration of clothing so long as the it fits in the drum and the machine
isn't modified. Sure, if you 'overfill'[1] the machine one might expect the
quality of the wash to degrade, but not that the machine will become
dangerous.

From a practical standpoint, it's perfectly possible to create a washing
machine that can handle any amount and configuration of clothing simply by
making a tumbler that strong enough to handle many times the weight of
clothes. Or the machine could simply refuse to operate if it detects that it's
over weight or off-balance. So Samsung won't get very far if they try to argue
that it's not possible to manufacture such a machine and that their customers
have no choice but to take precautions. But undoubtedly they will argue that
it's cost prohibitive and that their customers are responsible for taking
those precautions in exchange for the simpler and cheaper design.

[1] I use scare quotes because for sure they will call into question Samsung's
use and meaning of the term.

~~~
ptaipale
I think it's not "offloading their liability to the customer", if company says
that the washing machine can take 4 kg and the customer then loads it with 7
kg. It is perfectly reasonable to assume that if you do this, the machine will
not be able to maintain its balance.

(Seen that happen and customer complain, in no way specific to Samsung.)

~~~
hueving
Would you say the same thing if a manufacturer produced a car that exploded if
you put too much weight in the trunk? Or if it flooded the cabin with carbon
monoxide if you missed an oil change deadline? Both are "covered in the
manual".

~~~
ptaipale
This "explosion" was not actually an explosion, just an imbalance and
mechanical failure.

But if I put way too much weight in the trunk of the car, and start driving,
and the rear axle fails and there is an accident, yes, I'm still saying it's a
user error.

(It's by the way worth considering how much weight you do put in the trunk, or
perhaps more importantly, how much you put in a trailer. I transported some
concrete garden patio slabs and without calculating the actual weight, put a
bit too many of them both in the trunk and in the trailer. It was definitely
not fun to drive.)

~~~
csydas
I think the issue here is, as many other have pointed out, that the
imbalanced/weight problem for washing machines has been a solved problem for
nearly 50 years. It's fine that we're moving away from all mechanical
detection methods and more energy/water efficient washers, but removing the
previously solved operational safety functionality just seems silly. I
completely agree it's an issue of operator error, but that's not the problem -
the problem is that it was a _solved_ issue of operator error that is now a
problem again because it seems like there were no safeguards put in place. It
would seem to me that there has to be a grand number of chances to figure this
out during the QA stage for these washers and determine a simple software
solution, even if that solution is the washing session cancels, drains, and
the LED errors with "Overloaded" or something. The owners may be annoyed, but
at least the machine isn't ruined and it can train them to use the correct
load size.

Honestly, I don't think it's too unreasonable for any given person not to be
able to estimate the mass of a load of laundry. I assume the recommendations
(4kg, as you suggested) are educated guesses at best as it's hard to tell how
much water any given item will retain during the spin cycle. Since it's an
imprecise calculation anyways, wouldn't it make more sense to instead just let
the machine dictate its own limits so the user can adjust their washing habits
subsequently?

edit: mistyped and forgot to write "...because it seems like there were no
safeguards put in place."

------
antod
I hadn't heard of Samsung washing machines exploding before. Catching fire is
what they usually do.

[http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/95yearold-woman-rescued-from-
samsu...](http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/95yearold-woman-rescued-from-samsung-
washing-machine-fire-in-auburn-20160813-gqrvzd.html)
[http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-
post/news/81798360/Thousands...](http://www.stuff.co.nz/dominion-
post/news/81798360/Thousands-of-burning-washing-machines-still-at-large-as-
another-goes-up-in-flames)

~~~
femto
200+ since 2010. Even "fixed" machines are bursting into flame, so Australian
owners are being urged to go for a return rather than a repair.

[http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-08-14/samsung-washine-
machin...](http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-08-14/samsung-washine-machine-
recall-sydney-fire-nsw-white-goods/7732858)

[https://www.choice.com.au/home-and-living/laundry-and-
cleani...](https://www.choice.com.au/home-and-living/laundry-and-
cleaning/washing-machines/articles/samsung-washing-machine-recall-110815)

[http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3505540/Samsung-
face...](http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3505540/Samsung-face-
coronial-inquiry-washing-machines-recalled.html)

[http://www.samsung.com/au/washingmachinerecall/](http://www.samsung.com/au/washingmachinerecall/)

------
brownbat
Reminded me of that story about IBM's Black Team:

[http://www.penzba.co.uk/GreybeardStories/TheBlackTeam.html](http://www.penzba.co.uk/GreybeardStories/TheBlackTeam.html)

And wind turbine fail compilations:

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wfzgIxMEo8g](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wfzgIxMEo8g)

Physics is mean, especially when you're trying to spin heavy things really
fast.

------
merraksh
_The news of another exploding Samsung product offered the Internet plenty of
fodder._

I don't find it useful to reproduce sarcastic tweets in the middle of a
Washington Post article. I believe it does not add any information to what the
article is describing, and actually makes it look more like infotainment. The
issue is already serious and interesting enough.

------
Hydraulix989
It's sad that they knew about it, which meant they calculated that:

E{cost} = P(failure) * {expected lawsuit payout} < {cost of recall and
actually fixing the problem}

Just like in Fight Club...

~~~
AstralStorm
Except loss of brand image and trust is more expensive.

~~~
TeMPOraL
Like any typical customer buying a washing machine will know about this.

Like any shop selling washing machines will actually care.

Like any of us will remember about this six months from now.

Brand image is overrated. A lot of companies know that, and that's why they
get away with all the shit they do.

~~~
Hydraulix989
Brand image is a marketing/PR problem, not a tech/engineering problem.

------
asimuvPR
This seems like an odd case of defective parts leading to an early failure. I
had a GE washing machine fail due to a defective pump (located under the drum
and driven by the motor). There was no evidence of abnormal NHV and it is
placed on level ground. The interesting thing was that the replacement pump
(which cost me like $25 and took an hour to replace) was more robust. It has
lasted twice as much as the original part.

------
redsummer
When buying a washing machine, there is really no point in buying anything
other than a Miele or Bosch product. The same is true of most other kitchen
appliances. They may seem expensive, but it's a false economy to buy anything
else.

~~~
vinay427
If you can afford one, this is good advice in my anecdotal experience as well.
A family member had a supposedly fancy Fisher and Paykel (NZ) dishwasher that
cost more than the Bosch they ended up sticking with, and didn't clean dishes
nearly as well even after servicing it regularly and having it inspected by a
company rep. Meanwhile, the Bosch cleans far better and more quietly though it
does need its filter (?) cleaned more regularly, if I recall correctly.

Also, Miele vacuums are amazing for their reliability and durability compared
to something like a Dyson, which has over the years evolved into an overpriced
and poorly built item.

------
tripzilch
So, almost all situations described in this thread would fall under legal
warranty in the EU. Which is at least 2 years in the case of big appliances
like washing machines.

Importantly, the warranty is between the buyer and the seller, not the
manufacturer. They must either repair (within reasonable time), replace with
equal or better model (at no extra cost) or give your money back. The point is
that the buyer reasonably can expect a certain kind of functionality from the
product when they buy it, such as a washing machine actually cleaning your
clothes, not destroying them and functioning properly at least 2 years. If
not, buyer and seller must come to a reasonable solution (it's all very
reasonable). Although the seller tends to try to point to the manufacturer and
sometimes manages to convince buyer to pay some of the costs, they shouldn't
have.

Anyway, Samsung would be pretty stupid if they didn't pay extra care to
manufacturing quality of products sold in the EU because of this. This implies
that other regions that do not have this legal warranty because the free
market demands it, necessarily must get slightly-less-carefully-quality-
controlled items. Avoiding Samsung because of this seems like setting yourself
up for the next brand to screw you over.

------
fpgaminer
My Samsung washing machine is already on the list of things to replace. It
came along with the place I'm at, and the previous owners apparently didn't
know that front loading machines need to be left open when not in use. Upon
our initial load of the machine we discovered it to be filled with swathes of
mold/fungus. Took a week of heavy, caustic cleaning to get it usable.
Apparently it's a fairly common issue with frontloaders; only recently did
manufacturers get around to including sanitizing features.

Knowing that Samsung is selling machines that explode and catch fire ... I
guess I'll bump our replacement up on the schedule. I do like the little ditty
it plays when its done though. Reminds me of traveling through eastern Asia.
Cute ditties seemed to be very common over there, from vending machines to
garbage trucks. It's a small thing, but it has a way of brightening your
surroundings the way an ice cream truck in America does.

~~~
vmarsy
Front loading machines aren't supposed to be left open, are they? I've used
decades one always closed, never had mold/fungus. Could it depend on the water
quality?

Those were Whirlpool though, not Samsung.

~~~
fpgaminer
Based on my research, prompted by finding the machine filled with mold/fungus,
yes. It's a container filled with moisture, locked behind a water tight seal,
with layers of soap; more or less the perfect conditions for mold. It's a
prevalent enough problem that there were rumblings of a class action; though
it's America, so take that with a grain of salt.

I'm not sure if there's another variable that would lead to different
experiences. Like you say perhaps it's dependent on water. Water in my area is
very hard. Perhaps it depends on soap. Some detergents contain borax which is
particularly good at killing mold in this situation. Maybe some machines are
better at draining and/or airing out when not in-use. Frequent use of bleach
may help.

The previous owners of the machines were not ... the best of tenants. Perhaps
they did something else to compound the issue. Excessive soap is an additional
culprit.

~~~
McKayDavis
> there were rumblings of a class action;

Not just rumblings. A recent settlement was reached and consumers who own
various models of Whirlpool, Kenmore, or Maytag front-loading washing machines
are entitled to numerous clams including a 5% discount on a new purchase, a
$50 rebate, or a $500 reimbursement for previous repairs. [1]

[1] [http://www.washersettlement.com](http://www.washersettlement.com)

------
tellarin
If this happens to washing machines, I guess it either was a pretty good idea
for them to sell their Techwin subsidiary a couple years ago, or they miss
working in that field. :)

------
jbb555
While this obviously is a bad thing, the article seems overly dramatic. "...
could have been hurt" "... count have damaged".... But in fact not.

------
ascorbic
How popular are top loaders vs front loaders in the US? This seems a flaw
inherent to top loading machines. Gravity stops uneven loads in front loaders.

------
theklub
I have a Samsung dishwasher and it's by far the worst large appliance I've
ever had to deal with. I'll never buy Samsung again.

------
mirekrusin
Maybe they should pivot to be an army contractor?

------
known
Is out-of-balance relevant to driver-less cars?

~~~
cheenwy
What do you mean?

------
Insanity
Maybe they are slowly trying to make their way into the weapons industry :D

~~~
AstralStorm
Nah, a subsidiary already produces automated cannons that are then placed on
Korean border.

~~~
AstralStorm
Ah yes, that has been sold and split off more strongly recently.

------
0xmohit
One might say that Samsung products are truly _dynamite_!

