
Progress on /e/, the de-Googled Android fork - indidea
https://itsfoss.com/gael-duval-interview/
======
CivBase
> We are also announcing this week an “/e/ easy installer” that will make the
> flashing process much more easier, by pluging the smartphone to a PC and
> launching a dedicated application that will make most of the job.

Why do phones require device-specific builds and ROM flashing just to install
a different OS? Why isn't there a phone out there with a normal boot loader
that allows me to install whatever OS I want like I can on a PC?

I have a perfectly good phone, but I know I'm going to have to buy a new one
eventually just because the manufacturer will stop supporting the hardware.
Meanwhile, I have decades-old PCs that are running just fine.

Privacy is important. Removing Google from the picture is great. But I don't
see this, LineageOS, or anything else taking off until we have a more
accessible solution for installing mobile operating systems. An application
that streamlines the flashing process is nice, but I don't think that's
enough.

~~~
ryukafalz
> Why do phones require device-specific builds and ROM flashing just to
> install a different OS? Why isn't there a phone out there with a normal boot
> loader that allows me to install whatever OS I want like I can on a PC?

A few reasons:

1\. Proprietary drivers are the norm for mobile devices, whereas (with a few
exceptions) this is not the case for desktops/laptops.

2\. Even when the drivers are free, standard practice among device
manufacturers seems to be forking the kernel for each device and working off
that fork. These things don’t and can’t run on mainline Linux/Android.

See the Librem 5 and PinePhone for what are probably the only two devices
attempting to fix the above problems. And even if you fixed those:

3\. ARM devices typically don’t have the same device enumeration capabilities
as x86 PCs, meaning you need a separate device tree for each one. I believe
there are also efforts underway to improve this situation, but that’s where we
are at the moment.

~~~
kop316
The separate device tree (#3) is not as big an issue as the first ones. If you
are making a Linux kernel for an ARM device, you will have to make a device
tree, and it should not change once written.

~~~
ryukafalz
That’s true, it’s less of an issue than the others, but it’s still a per-
device difference that the kernel needs to know about before you bring the
system online. If you’re trying to make an installer that’ll run on any ARM
device like those on x86, that’s a problem - how does the installation image
know what device tree to use?

~~~
monocasa
The device tree is part of the solution, not part of the problem. The reason
PCs are able to handle this is that the really gnarly stuff (pincfg, gpios,
I2C, SPI, random power management), is handled by per board tables in ACPI,
and device tree handles the same niche.

The problem is that the device trees are half assed since they run against a
hacked up kernel, not that they exist in the first place.

~~~
ryukafalz
Ah, interesting. I think I have some reading to do; there clearly are
multiplatform images out there now (Debian for example
[https://wiki.debian.org/DebianKernel/ARMMP](https://wiki.debian.org/DebianKernel/ARMMP))
so my understanding of the situation was somewhat mistaken.

------
_bxg1
> we replace with a software layout called microG that can still receive push
> notifications and have geolocation data for apps (using Mozilla geolocation
> service)

It's good that they set up microG for you; that's one of the hurdles with
using Lineage this way.

I'm very curious about their Maps app. That was one of the very biggest
problems when I tried to use Google-free Android a couple years ago. The open-
source options at the time were _bad_. If they've made a decent alternative,
that would truly be a game-changer.

One other random thought: the name "/e/" is terrible. Hard to search for, hard
to meaningfully verbalize, hard to interpret.

~~~
lucideer
> _the name "/e/" is terrible. Hard to search for, hard to meaningfully
> verbalize, hard to interpret._

I think I read somewhere that this is a deliberately-obscure temporary
codename pre-proper-branding, during initial unstable development.

That said, they've used it a lot in their branding, so I'm not sure...

~~~
lucideer
_Update:_ From their FAQ page[0]:

> _Why this weird, inconvenient /e/ name?_

> _..._

> _It’s the current project codename, we will probably introduce a new and
> more convenient name for our mobile ROM in few months._

[https://e.foundation/get-support/#faq](https://e.foundation/get-support/#faq)

------
imnothere__
As other user replied and to extend it, /e/ is a rebranded LineageOS with
microG integrated plus some small commits.

Also, it uses a Nextcloud fork which isn't even open source as a replacement
for Google cloud service, and same as another reply, why trust /e/ over
Google?

As that it's mostly stolen work in some sorts(Earn money with OSS devs effort?
Seriously what a disgrace.), instead, please support LineageOS for microG[1]

[1] [https://lineage.microg.org/](https://lineage.microg.org/)

~~~
im3w1l
Last time I checked all phones with lineageos support were made by Google,
China or were like 5 years old. For this reason I never got it.

------
petecox
> the/e/ name will be abandonned for something else quite soon.

Good to know; a word that's more easily duckduckgoable may help with branding.

~~~
netsharc
Wanted to comment on the name too.. slash-e-slash???

~~~
throwawat45637
Obviously a reference to 4chan's ecchi board

------
ghgr
Direct link (since it's not easy to find in the article):

[https://e.foundation/](https://e.foundation/)

------
BuildTheRobots
An ungoogled mobile operating system: fantastic!

> ensure that you have an /e/ account (for /e/ online services such as mail,
> drive, calendar…). You can register for a free /e/ acount here

right - and I should trust E over Google why?

[https://doc.e.foundation/devices/](https://doc.e.foundation/devices/)

~~~
mqus
According to the article you can selfhost... But I don't know if thats
possible right now.

------
jmakov
Um... so how are they making money if we are not the product?

~~~
timbit42
itsfoss

------
terrycody
I guess I read about another similar story posted on HN several months ago? Or
its the same company?

~~~
DonCopal
Maybe you're thinking about Volla Phone.

[https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/volla/volla-phone-
desig...](https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/volla/volla-phone-designed-
with-simplicity-and-security-in-mind/description)

------
throwaway9d0291
Are these de-Googlification changes going to be upstreamed into LineageOS?

~~~
lern_too_spel
Is this forked from LineageOS or directly from AOSP?

~~~
joecool1029
It's forked from LineageOS.

------
ggm
Binary blobs dont have trackers and snoops? Phones have FPGA and need binary
blobs. Certified RF segments for regulatory permitted operation in the mobile
telephony world.

What about the TPM and keystore?

