

Apple patents the page turn - DigitalBoB12
http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/11/16/apple-now-owns-the-page-turn/?smid=tw-nytimesbits&seid=auto

======
btn
I'm a little surprised to see the NY Times perpetuating the hysteria that
typically follows patent issues with exaggeration of their scope and claims.

This is a _design patent_ , meaning that Apple has protection for _this
specific animation_ and not page-turn animations in general. Note that many of
the references cited (a good one is the O'Reilly article from 2004) depict
page-turn animations, but differ from _this specific one_.

~~~
belorn
Is the design of this animation _novel and not obvious for all items_ , as the
requirement for design patent puts it?

To me, this patent fails both. Its not novel, as substantially similar (legal
term) has existed before in animated film. Its neither non-obvious for all
items, ie, its a obvious way to illustrate a turning of a page for any
application that want to illustrate a turning of a page.

~~~
mmanfrin
It's novel only if the book is fiction. :]

~~~
zerostar07
Must be a hell of a page-turning novel.

I would like to propose the twitter test for patents: If the patent can't be
summarized in 140 characters, it has been done before.

------
mrinterweb
A prime example of a difference between Google and Apple both on HN front page
at the same time. "Google Books team open sources a book scanner":
<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4793974>.

~~~
mtgx
Maybe Apple shouldn't abuse the patent system this way.

------
johansch
The Register hints at an interesting new development - name and shame the
"innovators":

[http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/11/13/apple_page_turn_desi...](http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/11/13/apple_page_turn_design_patent/)

"This massively complex concept required three inventors to craft it:
Elizabeth Caroline Cranfill, Mikio Inose, and Stephen Lemay."

~~~
bitcartel
"The trio submitted application D/408,904 on December 19, 2011"

Yes, shame on them. They filed for a patent on a trivial animation, at a time
when it was well-known the system was being abused.

~~~
mbrundle
It's not necessarily the inventors who filed it. More likely, it's an Apple
patent lawyer. Naming and shaming the inventors is a bit unreasonable as
inventors working for large companies may not have much sway over which parts
of their work gets filed for patent protection.

~~~
jblow
I am pretty sure they at least need to sign it, which is why the common
(overreaching and abusive) employment contracts include a clause saying that
the employee will facilitate the filing of such paperwork.

I think naming and shaming is a good tactic. People should not be signing
contracts with clauses like that in the first place, and if there is potential
for future shame, maybe it'll make them think a bit more about it.

~~~
law
> I am pretty sure they at least need to sign it, which is why the common
> (overreaching and abusive) employment contracts include a clause saying that
> the employee will facilitate the filing of such paperwork.

Sadly, that's not the case: "Whenever all of the inventors _refuse to execute
an application for patent_ , or cannot be found or reached after diligent
effort, a person to whom an inventor has assigned or agreed in writing to
assign the invention, or who otherwise shows sufficient proprietary interest
in the matter justifying such action, may make application for patent on
behalf of and as agent for all the inventors." 37 CFR 1.47(b).

~~~
jlgreco
Would the uncooperative inventors' names still be placed on the patent? Name
and Shame seems reasonable to me, if not.

------
ricardobeat
It's a design patent. They own this specific design/style for page turn
animations, much like a trademark. Same goes for the music app icon.

The article also mentions the Apple Store's glass stairs and the iPhone
packaging patents as if they are something ridiculous, when in reality both
were very innovative (the stairs are still an unmatched engineering feat). The
iPhone packaging went on to be imitated by everyone, right now I'm sitting
beside an Asus laptop packaging that looks exactly like the iPad's.

~~~
bane
> the stairs are still an unmatched engineering feat

What in the world are you talking about? It's stairs, made of glass, typical
in high-end civic and commercial buildings the world over. So common are glass
stairs that they have to be pointed out to be noticed.

Here's the patent if anybody is remotely interested in reading about
commonplace construction materials
[http://pdf.ifoman.com.s3.amazonaws.com/staircase_page_patent...](http://pdf.ifoman.com.s3.amazonaws.com/staircase_page_patent_c.pdf)

~~~
ricardobeat
The stairs in the Apple stores are made almost _entirely_ out of glass. There
are no steel beams holding it up, the glass itself bears the load. The ones
you usually see at high-end buildings/shops only have glass steps and/or
sides. And don't forget the curved ones [1][2]. They are also earthquake-
resistant for the japanese stores.

[1] [http://www.macrumors.com/2012/02/29/stunning-photo-of-
glass-...](http://www.macrumors.com/2012/02/29/stunning-photo-of-glass-
staircase-at-amsterdam-retail-store/)

[2] [http://www.eckersleyocallaghan.com/projects/project/apple-
sh...](http://www.eckersleyocallaghan.com/projects/project/apple-
shanghai.html)

------
warfangle
It's an ugly skeuomorph (much like the ugly bookshelf skeuomorph). I won't be
sad to see it not implemented by competitors.

~~~
nsxwolf
I get that it's a skeuomorph, and that skeuomorphs are the cool thing to hate
now, but what's ugly about it? I think it is very beautiful and elegantly
done.

Are books ugly?

~~~
GuiA
Why do we need a metaphor for a physical page on a digital device?

~~~
kennywinker
It helps alert the user to how the data they are being shown is changing.

There are lots of non-skeuomorphic animations that could serve this purpose...
cross-dissolves, flashes, slide-ins, etc. This just happens to be a reasonably
nice one, that fits with the "this-is-a-book" metaphor of iBooks.

Even the name of iBooks is "skeuomorphic". It would be more accurately called
"iMedium-to-long-static-documents-available-for-purchase" but that's a fucking
awful title. Everybody has an idea of what a book is, so calling it iBooks
means users know that there are book-ish-things contained within.

An app called iBooks where the next page trickled down like the title sequence
from The Matrix would be tacky as hell and users would ask themselves why
their "book thing" was doing this non-book thing.

~~~
nilsbunger
+1 for "iMedium-to-long-static-documents-available-for-purchase" !

------
kumarm
To start with its ugly. Also this has been used in Flash since around 2005. It
would be a shame if Apple is granted this patent.

~~~
randomdata
Even the Classics app did it on iOS before Apple.

~~~
taligent
Do you have some evidence that Classics had this before Apple ?

~~~
kalleboo
See the references on Wikipedia
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBooks#Controversy>

"Some have claimed that the iBooks interface is a near exact replica of
Classics by Andrew Kaz & Phill Ryu, released over a year prior and even
featured in Apple's own TV commercials. Apple has made no acknowledgement of
this.[29][30][31]"

------
mmanfrin
I seem to remember Amazon own a patent for just this.

edit: It was Microsoft: [http://appft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-
Parser?Sect1=PTO2&Sec...](http://appft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-
Parser?Sect1=PTO2&Sect2=HITOFF&u=%2Fnetahtml%2FPTO%2Fsearch-
adv.html&r=1&f=G&l=50&d=PG01&p=1&S1=20100175018.PGNR.&OS=dn/20100175018&RS=DN/20100175018)

~~~
btn
That's a patent _application_ , which was rejected earlier this year in light
of a prior IBM patent (<http://www.google.com/patents/US5463725>) and another
of Apple's (<http://www.google.com/patents/US7469381>).

------
Apocryphon
It's a design patent, not an utility patent.

~~~
roc
Unfortunately neither the tech-press, nor the anti-IP-period crowd have a
particularly good grasp on just what utility patents cover, nor any apparent
interest in learning.

So hoping they'll recognize, learn and appreciate the difference between a
utility and a design patent seems a bit optimistic.

~~~
belorn
Design patents are only granted if the design is novel and not obvious for all
items. Utility patent must be novel, non-obvious, and be useful (legal defined
term).

Both has requirements that must be fulfilled. non-novel and obvious design can
not, should not, would not if the patent system worked, be granted as a design
patent.

------
mogop
dated:2002 <http://www.actionscript.org/showMovie.php?id=459> shout yourself
Apple

------
shinratdr
You mean that page turn that was in no other reading apps before iBooks and is
now in the Kindle app for iPhone? The one that doesn't exist on Sony
e-Readers, Amazon Kindles, Kindle apps besides the iPhone one, Nooks, or any
other reading device?

So... Apple doesn't own page turning, or animating the turning of a page, just
this specific implementation of it in this context. Which, for the record is
something they did invent. Nobody else in the market was using a page turn
animation, and it's the first thing people show off about iBooks.

Yeah I'm just not feeling the outrage. I am getting more and more sick of this
"Damn you patent system & Apple!" bullshit though.

~~~
Shamanmuni
What? Nobody else was using it?

Have you seen the Classics app for the iPhone? It appeared before iBooks and
it had page turning. Apple even copied the bookshelf from them.

It's no bullshit, the system is being abused. Silly and obvious things like a
specific implementation of pagination in ebooks are being patented by a
company who wants to go "thermonuclear" with its competitors. And many act
like it's OK. Why? Because it's Apple? They didn't innovate at all with
iBooks.

~~~
shinratdr
> Have you seen the Classics app for the iPhone?

Nope, neither did anyone else. I was talking about major e-book competitors,
not every reading app ever made regardless of popularity.

> Apple even copied the bookshelf from them.

That's funny because if you ask the Delicious Library folks, they would say it
was copied from them. Just goes to show that the concept of a digital
bookshelf looking like a real bookshelf is a good one.

> Silly and obvious things

First of all, the best ideas are obvious once someone has thought of them. Of
course we all want a minimal tablet, right? Well that's news to Microsoft who
was letting 3rd parties sell Windows tablets for a decade. Not one of those
tablets was minimal or boasted a clean design.

Then Apple comes along and does it, everyone ridicules them, it sells like
crazy. Now, suddenly it's obvious. As someone who has stood by them, it's hard
to really give a shit that Apple is getting the patents they filed for.

I find it much more bothersome that the rest of the tech industry gets to use
Jony Ive as their hardware designer than Apple being afforded some small
protection from what is slowly becoming an industry of clones.

> And many act like it's OK. Why?

Because they filed and were granted the patent. Where is the patent from the
Classics team? Exactly. If you aren't going to even participate in the system,
don't be surprised when things don't go your way.

------
smogzer
The photoshop plugins: Kai power tools and alien skin. Already did page turn
effects back in +-92.

------
jpeg
Apple patents the page turn. At first I read "Apple turns the patent page."
But I guess this is not likely to happen any time soon...

------
hcarvalhoalves
Apparently it increases pageviews to talk about patents and Apple in the same
post. It doesn't even need to be accurate.

------
utopkara
Call me crazy, but it seems like the internet will correct the patent system
by calling duds like this one. As specific patents get publicly criticized (be
it design or utility), it not only helps correct examiner errors, but also
puts pressure on patenters to file only worthy patents.

------
bajsejohannes
I can't say I mind too much. I'll be surprised if the book analogy stays
around for much longer.

------
brudgers
Would this be prior art for an animated buggy whip interface when accelerating
an automobile?

------
JimmaDaRustla
Am I being punked?

