
Firestr: encrypted P2P chat and Lua application platform - akkartik
http://mempko.com/firestr/firestr.html
======
edtechdev
Hope to see more p2p application platforms in the future, including ones that
might potentially run in a browser (via WebRTC) - if you know of others,
please comment here.

There's one based on IPFS and blockchain that's a distributed video sharing
app, like Youtube: [https://github.com/eris-
ltd/2gather](https://github.com/eris-ltd/2gather)

And there are some other decentralized / alternative Internet projects listed
here (including Firestr): [https://github.com/redecentralize/alternative-
internet/blob/...](https://github.com/redecentralize/alternative-
internet/blob/master/README.md)

~~~
sktrdie
webtorrent is one that pops in my head.

------
mempko
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NTptZW1wa28uY29tOjgwODA=

~~~
nacs
For those curious, here's what the above message is base64 decoded:

    
    
        d7:address24:udp://192.168.0.100:60602:id36:8158a718-a69b-4551-afc6-a5d42d1651854
        :name9:fannytown4:pkey800:    
        -----BEGIN PUBLIC KEY-----    
        <key gibberish>    
        -----END PUBLIC KEY-----
        ;15:mempko.com:8080

------
jszymborski
Wonder what they mean by encrypted.. haven't been able to find much in the
docs.

"Secure: Fire★ encrypts your connection, so the only people who see what
you're working on are those you want to."

It says that the connection is encrypted, which sounds like SSL/TLS?

~~~
mempko
The creator here. Thanks for pointing out the lack of documentation here. At
the moment, the security is RSA for the handshake and AES for the data once a
connection is established. The security at the moment has obvious problems, so
don't use it where your life depends on it. I have a plan to switch to using
telehash for the com layer instead of my own hand rolled protocol. In the
meantime, I invite any security experts to help improve what I have. The first
obvious improvement is to sign messages. So please help if you can.

~~~
jszymborski
Very cool, and I love your project. I've read your blog and your approach is
very admirable and I love the extensible approach you've taken.

If you're still considering protocols, I'd consider the TextSecure V2
protocol. The documentation isn't crazy in-depth, but it's a really neat
protocol that offers forwards and future security.

[https://github.com/WhisperSystems/TextSecure/wiki/ProtocolV2](https://github.com/WhisperSystems/TextSecure/wiki/ProtocolV2)

~~~
mempko
Thanks, I will look into it. My design internally should allow for multiple
protocols.

~~~
AlyssaRowan
It's _definitely_ worth looking into - TextSecure's Axolotl is best-in-class
for dealing with text messaging or other scenarios with occasional one-shots.

If you want another, simpler transport that works better for more connected
scenarios, like this one, ask trevp who did that: he has a very promising-
looking one in the design phase.

If I can give any advice: security doesn't make a good afterthought,
especially when encryption was the first word you mentioned. It's a
foundational feature; treat it as one. Pick primitives that make the best,
most solid foundations you can get, and do your best to make sure you can rely
on them. As for the rest, extensibility needs careful thought: it can be easy
to extend yourself into vulnerabilities.

Best of luck. You have an interesting project. I might keep an eye on it.

~~~
mempko
Thanks! Yes, this is great advice. security should not be an afterthought and
it certainly has not been here. Also, I did not post this on HN, so those were
not my words.

There are some aspects to security that I took that extend to the code. It is
written using design by contract, where if a contract fails, the program quits
immediately. Security should extend beyond the protocol.

As I mentioned previously, long term I won't be using a handrolled protocol,
which has obvious problems. This software is alpha and I hope to migrate
before 1.0

------
api
I'm on the 8056c2e21cae4b10 network. Edit: not sure it matters... I think it
finds various paths.

I just created one:

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CjsxNTptZW1wa28uY29tOjgwODA=

~~~
mahyarm
And huge blocks of text like this is the reason why this needs some DNS
equivalent.

~~~
mempko
Totally. These huge blocks are a short term compromise.

~~~
evv
I'm hacking around on a distributed version control project, and I think I've
found a cool solution to this problem.

I've created a github gist with my public key and a signature. Now people can
see that gist and verify that the keyholder posted the signature via my github
account. People can fork the gist and put their own signature in. Now I can
easily list the forks of my gist and get a list of public keys that are
cryptographically linked to certain github accounts.

~~~
mempko
Haha, cool hack! link to the gist?

------
samatman
This is a solid idea. Here's me:

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Let's play!

------
bamie9l
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a28uY29tOjgwODA=

------
hollerith
Some people never visit the HN home page, but do visit
[https://news.ycombinator.com/show](https://news.ycombinator.com/show), so
(since this post would seem to qualify for /show) I suggest you get it on
there.

------
whichfawkes
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------
mempko
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------
treenyc
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ZW1wa28uY29tOjgwODA=

------
CodexArcanum
This is an awesome idea! I had been thinking last week about how to build a
distributed package manager, and a platform for running scripts attached to
the package was an idea for later. So neat to see a distributed app platform,
but odd how similar ideas seem to pop up at the same time.

~~~
mempko
I often feel there are no original ideas. What influenced me to make firestr
was various things. The work of Alan Kay is a a big influence on me. I need
real version control in Firestr and have been thinking to integrate git behind
the scenes, or something similar. You are welcome to help!

------
csirac2
Also in this space: [https://github.com/ricochet-
im/ricochet](https://github.com/ricochet-im/ricochet) \- seems to have some
pretty notable people involved.

------
zokier
So are the locators federated somehow or are they isolated islands?

~~~
mempko
Hi, the creator here. The locators are NOT federated. This is by design if you
want to have a completely private network. Also, I haven't had time to
implement federation. If this is something that interests you, you can help
implement it if you want. The locator is less than 300 lines of code, so it
should be easy to understand. My long term plan is to use a protocol like
telehash instead of my own hand rolled one. However, you can have as many
locators in your client as you want. So this way, you can have redundancy.

------
osn
It looks somehow promissing in concepts but I am afraid all such a platform
needs a clear mobile story today..

~~~
api
On Android you could accomplish this, but iOS has some fairly inane
restrictions around running _any_ type of VM. It's enforced somewhat
arbitrarily, but it lets Apple yank any VM or app-hosting type thing on their
whim. It was originally put into place to keep Adobe Flash and Air off iOS.

I also disagree that you always need mobile for everything. This seems geared
toward communicating and collaborating, so yes mobile would be a must for mass
adoption. But if it's geared toward devs or professional work that's not
necessarily true.

------
staunch
This is very interesting. Great work!

------
Fastidious
Could someone post screenshots? (OS X if possible, but any platform would do)

~~~
mempko
If you scroll down on the main website,
[http://firestr.com](http://firestr.com), you can see some screenshots.
Animated gifs actually.

~~~
Fastidious
Wow! I did not realize there was more on the website. Thanks!

