
Norway: 37% of new vehicles sold in January were electric - davidiach
https://electrek.co/2017/02/15/norway-electric-vehicle-market-share-record/
======
digi_owl
Expect the numbers to drop right back down again in a few years. A major
reason for people owning a EV, a law that was introduced back when Thinks were
the big deal EV to have (yeah, right) that allowed EVs to use the bus lanes
and not pay a toll, have been repealed.

Note that it was only when Tesla made the EV comparable to a sportscar that it
picked up in Norway. And that was because now the rich of the nation could
bypass the rush hour traffic and not pay road tolls, while still own something
that looked and drove like the neighbors gas guzzler.

Over time that thinking trickled down to the wider population along with more
practical and cheaper EV designs.

But now the big incentive is gone, and thus i suspect the trend will reverse
soon enough.

~~~
simonz05
Tesla only sold 2 vehicles in Denmark in 2016, dropping from 2800 sold in
2015. This was after the Danish government added the regular registration tax
to electric vehicles.

That supports the commentators point of view.

[https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=da&tl=en&u=h...](https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=da&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Ffinans.dk%2Flive%2Ferhverv%2FECE8516793%2Fteslaboblen-
er-bristet-har-kun-solgt-to-biler-i-2016%2F%3Fctxref%3Dext)

~~~
_delirium
For those skeptical there could be such a big drop, useful background is that
the Danish registration tax for new vehicles is 150% of the purchase price
(with roughly the first €10k exempted). Previously it was 180% of the purchase
price above €10k, but electric cars were exempted. An agreement was reached
among several parties in 2015 to lower the overall rate from 180% to 150%, but
to phase out the electric-car exemption. This hits Tesla's high-end cars
especially hard, e.g. the model that used to cost €100k will end up costing
€200k+ after tax, which obviously is attractive to many fewer buyers.
Previously the €100k tax-exempt Tesla was effectively competing against
gasoline models in the €40k pre-tax range.

I would expect a less dramatic decline for lower-priced electric cars, some of
which do also have sales in Denmark, like the Nissan Leaf or Volkswagen e-uP,
but I haven't found numbers.

~~~
taway_1212
Wow these taxes sound out of this world (in my home country Poland, it's 3% or
17%, depending on the engine size).

Hasn't anyone attempted to go around it by finding someone in say Germany to
register the car as a first owner and then immediately purchasing the car (as
a used car now) from him?

~~~
loxs
Used car imports also get taxed by the same percentage. And you can't cheat,
because they decide the value of the car, not your receipt.

~~~
Strom
What limitations are there for just using a German registered car?

That's one of the main arguments that is being brought up here in Estonia when
the socialists try to create a car registration tax. The opponents claim that
people will just go a bit south to Latvia and register their car there, and
then just drive around with a Latvian registration. There aren't any
restrictions that prohibit this.

Similar behavior exists with alcohol. The Finnish are especially well known
for their alcohol-tourism into Estonia. They come here during weekends and buy
multiple crates worth of alcohol and go back. Two-way ferry ticket from
Helsinki to Tallinn can cost as little as 10 € during sales, so economy-wise
it can be cheaper even if you just want a 6-pack of beer. The funny thing is
that as years have passed and Estonian alcohol tax has risen, we're now in a
situation where southern-Estonians drive to Latvia to get their alcohol.
That's also why the car registration point is so clear to us, because we're
already seeing it with consumables where you have to make regular trips
instead of a single one.

~~~
_delirium
You can drive a German-registered car as a tourist who isn't resident in
Denmark, but if you move to Denmark and become a resident (or already were
resident), you must register the car in Denmark within 30 days of bringing it
into the country [1].

But yes, some amount of this happens. The easiest case to get away with it is
probably if you are actually from another EU country, and just keep it
registered in your home country at a relative's address, and travel back
occasionally to keep your license, insurance, and registration up to date. If
you're Danish and have no foreign address, it would be more complicated to get
it sorted out, especially with insurance, but I'm sure there are people who do
it. Police attempt to crack down on it by looking for foreign-registered cars
that seem to be parked too regularly in the same residential area (e.g. in
front of a block of flats in Copenhagen). That's not illegal _per se_ , since
you might be a longer-term visitor, but they investigate these cases and catch
some number each year.

Besides foreign-registered vehicles, the other most common evasion mechanism
is probably agriculturally registered vehicles (which are exempt from tax).
Hard to do if you have no connection to a farm at all, but in families where
some of the family are genuinely farmers, the rest of the family who aren't
will in some cases end up with all their vehicles registered at the farm.

[1]
[https://www.skat.dk/SKAT.aspx?oId=2068721](https://www.skat.dk/SKAT.aspx?oId=2068721)

~~~
Tade0
I wonder what happens if you're _leasing_ the car? Technically it's not your
property, so you can't register it.

I'm sure there's some kind of mechanism to prevent people from driving cars
leased in another country, but how does it work?

~~~
ptaipale
You're just not allowed to drive that car in the country. The European Union
common market and free movement of goods doesn't apply to cars when the tax
revenue of governments is at stake. Finland has had a somewhat similar car
taxation as Denmark, and here the government breaks EU law at will; when some
procedure is ruled illegal by EU courts, the government replaces it with a new
wording and the circus starts all over. No official is ever held accountable.

How does police find those who drive a foreign vehicle illegally? Stop a
vehicle in foreign plates, ask driver's license; if it is a local national
driving, investigate. Police have very much powers in Nordic countries for
these cases (they can always stop a car and investigate, there's no American
type requirement for a probable cause.)

And of course, there are always people who report suspected tax evaders to the
police.

There used to be a sort of a hunt for these cases between Sweden (who has no
car sales tax) and Finland. E.g. there was a guy who lived in Haparanda on
Swedish side and had a girlfriend in Tornio on the Finnish side, and stayed
too many nights at the girlfriend's place. He got a big fine and had to pay
back taxes because he should have registered himself as a local resident and
imported and registered the car to Finland as well, including paying the car
import tax.

I sold my first car to a Norwegian friend. It was a wreck so I sold it for the
equivalent of 50 € (this was 1990). The friend then moved back to Oslo. She
was asked to pay the equivalent of about 2000 € in car tax to register it in
Norway. She gave it for scrap instead, of course.

------
andlier
The headline and article are a bit misleading, the share of completely
electric cars (no internal combustion engine) is actually dropping compared to
last year as there are some newly introduced tax-reductions and benefits for
hybrid plug-in vehicles as well. Many of the top-selling cars on the list that
is counted as electric are actually cars with a small battery and electric
motor along with a traditional ICE. [0] The topsellers of "electric" cars are
actually big cars like the VW Passat GTE and Volvo XC90, both of which will
probably produce more emissions than smaller ICE-only vehicles through their
lifetime (unless the owner is very concious about charging the battery all the
time.) [0] [http://ev-sales.blogspot.no/2017/02/norway-
january-2017.html](http://ev-sales.blogspot.no/2017/02/norway-
january-2017.html)

------
ebbv
Having owned a Nissan LEAF for the last 2.5 years has been really great.
Maintenance is almost nothing, the battery has held up fantastic and the car
is a real pleasure to drive. Never having to stop for gas or get oil changes
sounds like not a big deal but it is really nice. Every morning the LEAF has a
full charge.

I think the Bolt and other 200+ mile range vehicles that are fairly affordable
will help get more people into EVs. The other thing I think we need in the US
is an affordable EV crossover. There's rumors of Nissan doing an EV Rogue. If
they put a 60KWh battery in it, I think it would sell like gangbusters.

Obviously the last hurdle, and a serious one for many people, is that owning
an EV without owning a house is really impractical in most places in the US.
We need charging stations at apartment complexes, but that's one of those
things that is unlikely to happen until EV ownership is widespread enough to
make it a feature potential renters will care about.

~~~
lukasm
I'd buy electric BMW X1. I don't get why BMW has to put an electric motor in
something as ugly as i3. Why not put it in 3 series?

~~~
sokoloff
In Cambridge, MA, my perception is that the "ugly" of hybrids and full
electrics is a feature/benefit due to the signaling effect.

The original Prius (that looked like a normal Toyota) sold less well than the
second generation that was _conspicuously_ saving the environment.

Disclosure: I drive a LEAF and live in Cambridge. When my wife and I swapped
cars for the day and I asked her how she liked the LEAF, her answer was, "I
really liked the idea that I was saving pollution and that my friends could
see me getting out of a LEAF."

------
rodionos
Norway is an example of a "great rotation" from gasoline cars into diesel and
electrical vehicles. What's also interesting is that it is happening quickly:

[https://apps.axibase.com/chartlab/bbc5e671](https://apps.axibase.com/chartlab/bbc5e671)

Keep in mind, that Norway has abundant hydropower capacity. The wholesale
settlement price for electricity out of Norway has fallen from 50 to 30
eurocents over the last 10 years for a variety of reasons such as Denmark's
successful foray into offshore wind energy production.

As for Tesla, it made it to top-10 by new registrations in 2015:

[https://apps.axibase.com/chartlab/bbc5e671/3/](https://apps.axibase.com/chartlab/bbc5e671/3/)

The annual statistics for 2016 will be released at the end of March, so it
would be interesting to see the progress the country has made last year.

~~~
martinald
30cents a kWh? That seems crazy expensive for wholesale electricity?

~~~
rodionos
Sorry, it's EUR/MWh: from 50 EUR/MWh to 30 EUR/MWh.

------
cm2187
I wonder how many electric cars Norway would have bought if it didn't made
that much money selling oil...

~~~
im3w1l
I see what you are saying, but they could have chosen to pump oil and drive
guzzlers too. Yet they didn't.

~~~
peterwwillis
EVs are a status symbol, either of wanting to protect the environment or
project your pocket book, often at the same time.

Oslo is basically one big outdoor showroom for Tesla. Four of them passed me
while I was waiting for a bus.

~~~
im3w1l
And yet, what is a status symbol is a product of the culture.

------
spikels
Seems like much of the move to electric vehicles in Norway has been driven by
tax incentives (vehicle purchase and fuel). Is the strategy to keep ramping up
these incentives until the vast majority of cars are electric in 2025 then
simply outlaw new ICE sales?

------
johansch
Norway keeps working so hard at building an eco-friendly image.

In reality the oil they pump up from their territory makes them one of the
world's most environmentally unfriendly countries (both in absolute numbers
and particularly per capita).

~~~
lobster_johnson
Annual CO2 emissions per capita, according to World Bank [1], for 2013 (metric
tons), top 51:

    
    
         1	Qatar                40.4
         2	Trinidad and Tobago  34.5
         3	Curacao              34.1
         4	Kuwait               27.2
         5	Bahrain              23.6
         6	Sint Maarten         20.8
         7	Brunei Darussalam    18.9
         8	United Arab Emirates 18.7
         9	Luxembourg           18.7
        10	Saudi Arabia         17.9
        11	United States        16.3
        12	Australia            16.3
        13	Oman                 15.6
        14	Gibraltar            15.4
        15	Kazakhstan           15.4
        16	Estonia              15.1
        17	New Caledonia        14.6
        18	Mongolia             14.5
        19	Canada               13.5
        20	Turkmenistan         12.7
        21	Russian Federation   12.4
        22	Faroe Islands        12.3
        23	Korea, Rep.          11.7
        24	Norway               11.7
        25	Palau                10.6
        26	Netherlands          10.1
        27	Greenland            10.0
        28	Japan                 9.7
        29	Czech Republic        9.3
        30	Singapore             9.3
        31	Cayman Islands        9.2
        32	Germany               9.2
        33	South Africa          8.8
        34	Israel                8.8
        35	Aruba                 8.5
        36	Finland               8.5
        37	Belgium               8.3
        38	Bahamas, The          8.2
        39	Libya                 8.1
        40	Malaysia              8.0
        41	Iran, Islamic Rep.    7.9
        42	Poland                7.9
        43	New Zealand           7.6
        44	Ireland               7.6
        45	China                 7.5
        46	Austria               7.3
        47	Seychelles            7.1
        48	United Kingdom        7.1
        49	Slovenia              7.0
        50	Equatorial Guinea     6.7
        51	Denmark               6.7
    

Total absolute emissions puts Norway at 52.

Carbon intensity [2] for 2011 was the third lowest in Europe among measured
countries.

[1]
[http://databank.worldbank.org/data/reports.aspx?source=2&ser...](http://databank.worldbank.org/data/reports.aspx?source=2&series=EN.ATM.CO2E.PC&country=#)

[2]
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_carbon_in...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_carbon_intensity)

~~~
johansch
For some odd reason this does not include their oil extraction.

------
zxcvvcxz
Can someone provide data showing how electric cars reduce emissions overall?
Having something like this ready would help when discussing with people who
are not sure of the benefits of EVs ("it still uses energy right?").

~~~
madengr
Charging at night time uses base load, so greater proportion of nuclear power.

Maximum efficieny of a gasoline engine is about 30%, versus 96% for an
electric motor, though the battery does have less efficiency.

Electricity generated at a power plant using fossil fuels and steam turbines
is more efficient than locally in an engine.

It's cheap to transport electricity over wires. Fuel still needs to be piped
and trucked.

So even if your electric car was powered by fossil fuels at the power plant,
it's still more efficient.

~~~
majewsky
If one strives to reduce emissions from their EV, it would be better to use a
charger at the workplace when plenty of solar energy is available during the
day.

~~~
ZeroGravitas
You can get chargers that connect to the internet and track the carbon content
of your electricity on a minute by minute basis, allowing you to charge when
it is best for the grid and for the planet.

------
4h53n
And selling 1.6b barrels of oil per day.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_oil_expor...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_oil_exports)

~~~
martinpw
1.6million.

------
frik
How many new power plants are planned? Or do many houses have their own
photovoltaic.

Optimally, one has a house with 10+KW/H photovoltaic panels at home, an
battery storage and an electric car. The battery storage is needed, as one is
usually away at work when the sun is shining. And if you deliver the
eletricity to the grid provider you get little money, so it would make sense
to use the power yourself or store it to power up your car for next day. And
of course your employer would need parking lots to power up electric cars.

(what would be not optimal to have huge coal/atomic power plants in the
neighbourhood that produce the electricity for your car - then a petrol
powered car would make more sense)

And if you own an electric car, do you own the battery pack too? Or do you
have lease the power pack for something like 100$ per months plus all the
costs electricity to recharge? - I would like to buy an electric car, and want
to own the battery myself.

~~~
kalleboo
PV in Norway sounds like a bad joke. The northern parts get zero daylight
hours for 2 weeks in midwinter.

~~~
kwhitefoot
Not a joke at all. Oslo gets more sun than Hamburg.

Also take a look at the Energibygg:
[https://translate.google.no/translate?hl=en&sl=no&u=https://...](https://translate.google.no/translate?hl=en&sl=no&u=https://www.glitreenergi.no/konsern/apnet-
unikt-bygg/&prev=search)

~~~
ptaipale
The problem is that Oslo, like all the Nordics, gets more sun in the summer
when it's less necessary, and practically none in the winter when energy is
needed.

Norway has so much hydroelectric capacity that it doesn't matter, though.

~~~
kwhitefoot
> Norway has so much hydroelectric capacity that it doesn't matter, though.

We have substantial DC interconnects to countries that have little or no hydro
so our prices are no not much different from the rest of Northern Europe. Any
excess solar would be sold to Europe just like excess hydro is now. It could
also be used to drive pumped storage to ensure that the reservoirs are full
for the winter.

~~~
ptaipale
Sure, but it tends to be summer in Germany at the same time there's summer in
Norway. Pumped storage is a nice thing when the nature allows it, and Norway
has plenty of opportunity there.

