
Comcast Declares War on Tor? - doctorshady
http://www.deepdotweb.com/2014/09/13/comcast-declares-war-tor/
======
cjbprime
This article seems seriously confused about how Tor works ("only the ISP used
along with it can ascertain what activity takes place on Tor"), such that I
don't trust the rest of what it's saying. There is probably no story here.

~~~
fru2013
Likely a technical misunderstanding by the author. It is possible for an ISP
to detect tor traffic[1], but not determine the contents of the traffic. My
guess is that the author is not aware of this.

[http://www.netresec.com/?page=Blog&month=2013-04&post=Detect...](http://www.netresec.com/?page=Blog&month=2013-04&post=Detecting-
TOR-Communication-in-Network-Traffic)

~~~
derefr
> but not determine the contents of the traffic.

Not even this much, actually. Tor doesn't do any sort of protection on the
traffic; it just routes it cleverly. The packets themselves are still
plaintext if you're not using an encrypted protocol (e.g. HTTPS) on top of
Tor.

In practice, most people use Tor through the browser bundle, which includes an
HTTPS-Only extension. But if you're routing random other protocols through Tor
(e.g. XMPP, BitTorrent, etc.) be aware that _Tor_ is not doing any protection
of your plaintext; that's the responsibility of your client/protocol.

~~~
panarky
Not exactly.

Tor encrypts your traffic within the Tor network. Even if you don't encrypt,
Tor does automatically so your ISP cannot see your content.

If you don't encrypt, your content will be visible to the exit node, but not
to your ISP.

[https://www.torproject.org/about/overview](https://www.torproject.org/about/overview)

------
x0x0
I live on the peninsula and it boggles the mind that, in sfbay, I effectively
have one choice for wired internet access because dsl is so slow where I live.

As idlewords says:

    
    
       San Francisco is an 8-mile square that aims to disrupt the world but can’t 
       wire itself for decent Internet. I guess it’s a hardware problem

------
naner
I can't believe I'm "defending" Comcast, but this sounds made-up.

Why would Comcast care about Tor and if they wanted to discourage use why
would they _confront_ customers using it?

~~~
smtddr
Totally with you; this story sounds made-up.

 _> >Users who try to use anonymity, or cover themselves up on the internet,
are usually doing things that aren’t so-to-speak legal._

So what does Comcast think about people who use VPN? Maybe VPN also illegal
now? Privacy is dead? Next up, curtains on the windows of your house are also
illegal.

~~~
StephenFalken
It's interesting to read what BBC thinks about that [1].

[1] [http://torrentfreak.com/bbc-isps-should-assume-heavy-vpn-
use...](http://torrentfreak.com/bbc-isps-should-assume-heavy-vpn-users-are-
pirates-140908/)

~~~
smtddr
So it's really going to happen... slowly, in the name of piracy _(but we know
that 's not really why)_, any form of encrypted communication will become
illegal. Oh, and of course this won't apply to affluent.

------
Buge
>A Comcast agent named Jeremy allegedly called Tor an “illegal service.”

Did the customer mention it was started by the US Navy and continues to
received a lot of funding from them?

~~~
rhino369
Talking to a comcast "agent" is like asking a Seaman about Naval tactics.

~~~
JoshTriplett
That's giving far too little credit to the average Seaman.

------
zoba
The article implied, but didn't make clear, that the customers were using Tor
to browse the internet (as opposed to being a Tor endpoint). I could see
comcast having an issue with customers who are endpoints, but, I'm not really
sure why they would care / how they would know that someone was was using Tor.

~~~
david_shaw
_> why they would care_

Not sure. It's not as though using Tor circumvents the need for an Internet
service provider. Maybe it's political.

 _> how they would know that someone was was using Tor._

It's easy to determine whether a user is using Tor based on the (known)
connections that are made. It's the same way organizations can block Tor, or
that the Tor client knows how to reach the rest of the network.

------
Buge
So here's one of their sources:

[https://www.reddit.com/r/DarkNetMarkets/comments/2g2e44/is_c...](https://www.reddit.com/r/DarkNetMarkets/comments/2g2e44/is_comcast_legally_allowed_to_do_this/)

I think it was posted by this user:

[https://www.reddit.com/user/theliberare/](https://www.reddit.com/user/theliberare/)

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jpalioto
Who uses Tor without VPN? When I'm using Tor, all Comcast sees is an encrypted
tunnel to Private Internet Access.

~~~
Houshalter
Isn't Tor supposed to be an encrypted tunnel?

~~~
jpalioto
Yes. But, with VPN it looks something like this:

Me -> TOR encrypts data -> VPN encrypts data -> data goes through tunnel ->
VPN decrypts data -> TOR encrypted data passes through first node -> TOR
encrypted data passes through relay node -> TOR decrypts data as it passes
through the exit node -> swish nothing but net

This gives protection from the ISP and from the VPN provider -- I have to
trust neither.

~~~
Houshalter
It seems excessive; tor traffic already goes through 3 different nodes. And if
the ISP is banning tor there is no reason they wouldn't/couldn't ban VPNs.

~~~
jpalioto
Too many people use VPNs for work.

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shmerl
What other proof does anyone need that Comcast hates net neutrality? It should
be a clear reason to tank any of their plans for acquisition of TWC.

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sroerick
Can anyone explain how this article has more upvotes in less time than the
story about Beamforming, yet is two spots lower on the HN frontpage?

