

Ask HN: How to learn language? - exelib

I know, my english is very bad. I read a lot in english and hear english podcasts, but nothing help, because I don&#x27;t get feedback and therefore I can&#x27;t get better (or very slow).<p>Because of family, full-time job and side project I don&#x27;t have spare time to just sit down and studying language. Only time I have is about 20-30 minutes per day while I travel from my work. Unfortunately, I can&#x27;t memorize if I hear some sort of audio&#x2F;video course. I learn from writing and conversations.<p>What could you suggest me?<p>One idea is to write some blog posts on mobile (n900, with keyboard and git, yeah) and then push it to github to allow pull requests. But I can&#x27;t expect that some one will correct me.
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throwaway1184
> One idea is to write some blog posts on mobile (n900, with keyboard and git,
> yeah) and then push it to github to allow pull requests. But I can't expect
> that some one will correct me.

Ah, but if you contribute to Wikipedia, someone DEFINITELY will correct your
mistakes, AND in a way with rudimentary version control, so you can compare
what you wrote to how it looks after the editors swarm in. Find a page on
Wikipedia in your language about something that interests you and translate it
into English. I personally use this technique to maintain & keep learning my
(non-English) foreign languages, and if I can get a response from non-English
wikipedia you can DEFINITELY get one from English Wikipedia.

~~~
exelib
Wow, that's nice idea! Thank you!

~~~
throwaway1184
Yeah, glad to help!

Remember to try it the other way too, foreign language -> your language.
Feedback isn't as reliable but it's a nice easy break and good for vocab/idiom
acquisition.

Another thought... If you have trouble with active learning from language
tapes, have you tried passive listening? This is where you just put on some
background noise of people chatting in the language you want to learn (radio,
podcast, Let's Play), maybe put some wordless music on over it, and then just
listen for hours and hours while you work or commute with no expectation of
understanding anything, like you're sitting in a coffee shop and the language
is just washing over you. I've been trying this for a while and I do think it
helps to improve the instincts & ear. Also anyone with an internet connection
can do it, you can do it for HOURS at a programming job without anyone
noticing, and it takes so little willpower (you just turn on the radio) that
it's easy to maintain the habit over long periods of time. Most importantly,
you can pick podcasts and games you are interested in... you're not just stuck
with whatever boring situation is in the tape, like anigbrowl said. Maybe not
as efficient as a conversation partner, but it's good for building confidence
and good if you don't have a lot of time to ACTIVELY devote to language-
learning. I'm not sure how well this would work if you knew next to nothing
about the language in question, but that's obviously not your situation. So,
yeah... maybe try audio again, but this time give up "trying". (:

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b6
First of all, your English seems quite good. And English is a difficult
language, especially the grammar. I wish I could express myself in Mandarin as
well as you just did in English. Please don't be too hard on yourself. We're
not language monks. The point is to communicate, and if anyone gives you a
hard time about your ability while you're making a good effort, I think they
probably need to get some perspective.

It's true, people are hesitant to make corrections. For one thing, although
what you said might not have been completely correct, it was perfectly
understandable. Another thing is that they might not know how best to make the
correction without hurting your feelings or seeming pedantic. You just can't
count on people to correct you.

One useful thing I did lately was to get on WeChat and start chatting with my
Chinese friends. Many lines they send to me are goldmines of useful
expressions, expressed naturally. Slowly but surely, I'm building up an
arsenal of fragments I can use in situations that come up a lot. And I think
each little fragment I master tunes my neural network to make learning the
next fragment a little bit easier.

You say you can't learn from audio/video courses. I hope that's not true. I
would think very carefully about why it's impossible. Maybe there's a way, and
if there is, that would very very very useful.

~~~
exelib
> You say you can't learn from audio/video courses. I hope that's not true.

Audio/video courses are to passive. After 5 minutes I can't remember me any
more on rules or how to pronounce. I learn best if I participate actively.

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anigbrowl
I used to teach English. You need to talk to a native speaker who can answer
questions or explain the pattern of mistakes. And I do mean talk - doing it in
writing is going to be much, much slower. On the positive side, your English
is not great but it's not 'very bad' \- I had no trouble understanding your
sentence construction.

I fyou don't have access to a native speaker, the next best thing is to
practice with movies. Audio/video courses are no good because typically you
are dealing with isolated sentences or very artificial conversations - you
don't care about any of the imaginary people or their situations, so your
brain is not doing any work to imagine what things they would want to say.
Pick some English-language films you like a lot (because you are going to have
to watch them many times) and watch them with subtitles in your own language,
then subtitles in English, then without any subtitles. Practice repeating the
dialog to yourself, as if you were going to do the work of an actor. You can
also practice writing out some of your favorite parts.

Repetition has value, in the right context. The story and characters are easy
for your brain to engage with, so they will function as a mental anchor for
the more abstract patterns of grammar and correct usage.

~~~
exelib
I watch "Peppa Pig", "Hello Kitty" and so on in English with my daughter :D
But also watch conference talks (like Google.io) in English. I understand most
of written text (except of Harvard Business Review - authors select not common
used words) and a little bit worse talks in videos.

But it's opposite if I want to speak or write.

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Joona
My suggestion has always been playing games. I learned English purely from
playing Runescape. Pick a (multiplayer) game like World of Warcraft or
Minecraft and find an English-speaking group to play with.

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amacalac
Download duolingo. It's awesome, and you can set goals of 5, 10 or 20 minutes
a day, which sounds like it would fit in perfectly to your schedule.

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owly
What language do you speak? Maybe we can do some cross language chats? I teach
you English, you teach me whatever. I know a fair amount of Spanish and
Japanese.

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Mz
Is it possible to get involved in some kind of online live chat situation
during your commute?

