
My Salary Progression in Tech - GordonS
https://georgestocker.com/2019/03/14/my-salary-progression-in-tech/
======
iSpiderman
> It's always been my intention to retire early, > I'm interested in making
> huge money and retiring early, > I don't begrudge people with their crazy
> salaries but I do get frustrated that I can't find success myself.

I am shocked and surprised at the same time (knowing that I only selected
quotes of a few commentators).

Shocked to see the same mindset as many managing consultants and investment
bankers I have met and worked with. They work a lot with the idea to stop
working eventually. Not a single one of them has retired early. Not a single
one of them I would call happy or satisfied (again: my bubble).

“Man. Because he sacrifices his health in order to make money. Then he
sacrifices money to recuperate his health. And then he is so anxious about the
future that he does not enjoy the present; the result being that he does not
live in the present or the future; he lives as if he is never going to die,
and then dies having never really lived.” - Dalai Lama

Surprised maybe because I hoped here on HN people might have a different
mindset towards money and success. Or: know that there is not a strict
connection between the two. To read all this "Keeping up with the Joneses"
makes me sad...

Choose life, not career. Find something you love doing and do it for the
'work' itself, not for some postponed happiness.

~~~
mettamage
> Choose life, not career. Find something you love doing and do it for the
> 'work' itself, not for some postponed happiness.

Insightful story about the investment banker. Your policy about choosing life
feels like good advice in light of that story. The implementation details,
that’s where it always gets difficult.

My story:

I want to make music. I think of music all the time. Whenever I made music I
was passionate about it.

However:

\- my music training is limited

\- people that I know who are amazing alternate from being homeless to renting
out a place. They are poor.

Do I have that much passion that I want to risk 10 to 20 years of my life in
poor wealth and perhaps poor family life?

No. I want to live a middle class life while making music.

Sounds realistic?

Just follow your passion people, the invisible hand will help you.

Obviously I am cynical about this, I sincerely hope you can prove me wrong,
for I would love to make music.

~~~
elbear
Look for the middle ground. I realized that I want to work on things I like,
but I still need to eat, so I've decided to split my time. I want to work at
least an hour to something I'm passionate about. That way, even if I spend
more of my time working for someone else, I know I still spend some of my time
doing something I love.

So follow your passion, but also your survival instinct.

~~~
mettamage
> So follow your passion, but also your survival instinct.

As far as simple quotes go. This sounds optimistic, yet reasonable.

Based on your advice, maybe I should just go to Thailand and freelance as an
app/web dev for 3 days per week and play guitar / make electronic music for
the rest. I'd wonder how I'd prepare for economic down turns though.

I'd make about: 5000 euro's per month (@ 50 euro's per hour as a freelancer).
Living on about 10000 euro's per year, I'd save 20000 euro's after taxes
(Dutch, high taxes, yay!). Regardless of that, I guess I wouldn't need to
worry about recessions after 2 years of part-time remote freelance work, not
in South East Asia anyway.

Sounds doable, at first glance. I need more glances. Especially the, "what
about my girlfriend, friends and family?" glance.

~~~
edraferi
Worry about a wife and kids when you WANT to worry about it. Living the life
you want is the best way to meet a partner who supports that lifestyle.

Maybe one day you’ll decide it’s time for kids, and both you and your partner
decide to head back to the EU for that. Or maybe you’ll raise kids in
Thailand. Or maybe your partner will get an amazing opportunity somewhere else
entirely and you can be a stay at home parent, making beats while the kids are
at school.

It’s your life. Live it the way you want. Don’t worry too much.

------
dpau
Just for the sake of variety, I started off as a promising young software
developer but let idealism and thirst for adventure get in the way :) Besides
loving to code, having skills in high demand has allowed me to travel and
explore the world for the past 20 years.

1997-1998 - $32k - Programmer for State government

1998-1999 - $86k - Consultant, Phoenix & NYC

2000-2004 - $32k - Software developer for NGO, Amsterdam

2004-2006 - $28k - Developer & Network Admin throughout Asia for NGO

2006-2007 - $14k - Independent remote software consultant while studying
Mandarin full-time in Beijing

2007-2008 - $10k - Manager of ceramics studio in Jingdezhen, China

2008-2017 - $14k - Studio Ceramicist in Jingdezhen, part-time remote developer

2018 - $38k - Part-time remote software consulting while pursuing an MFA,
Alfred, NY

~~~
chillacy
Sounds like a lot of fun stories. Do you have any regrets?

~~~
dpau
definitely not! but the trade-off, of course, is that you'll most likely
always be poor, never own a house, and never retire (not that i'd want to)

------
salarythrow1234
My progression:

    
    
      23 - 45K  (University sysadmin, east coast)
      26 - 60k  (University research systems programmer, east coast)
      31 - 65k  (SWE, small IHV, remote)
      32-42 -- incremental raises up to $145K (senior SWE, same company)
      43 - 425k (Senior SWE, Google, Mountain View CA)
      44 - 390k (Senior SWE, Google, Mountain View CA)
      45 - 350k (Senior SWE, Netflix, Remote)
      46 - 400k (Senior SWE, Netflix, Remote)
      47 - 525k (Senior SWE, Netflix, Remote)
      48 - 600k (Senior SWE, Netflix, Remote)
      49 - 800k (Senior SWE, Netflix, Remote)

~~~
virtualized
What kind of genius does one have to be to earn $800k? Or do you possess rare
knowledge and connections in your industry?

~~~
jypepin
probably TC, including stocks accumulated that got more value over time.

~~~
roberto
AFAIK Netflix doesn't give stocks.

~~~
therealdrag0
According to their website [0]:

    
    
      Each employee chooses each year how much of their
      compensation they want in salary versus stock options.
      You can choose all cash, all options, or whatever
      combination suits you
    

And what's really freaking cool:

    
    
      There are no compensation handcuffs (vesting) 
      requiring you to stay in order to get your money.
      People are free to leave at any time, without loss of
      money, and yet they overwhelmingly choose to stay.
      We want managers to create conditions where people love
      being here, for the great work and great pay.
    
    

[0] [https://jobs.netflix.com/culture](https://jobs.netflix.com/culture)

------
philipp-H
These are unbelievably high salaries. In Germany such salaries are possible
only at management positions (not talking about IB) of large companies only. I
visited US 3 years back and I found everything better - clothing cheaper, food
more delicious, people friendlier and houses bigger. Yes you don't have social
security and have poverty issues but I would still be in US than in Europe
considering the amount of money you guys make. Comparing all this, it seems
like we're are being exploited here.

I work in a management consulting firm (not in top3). Salary progression is as
follows (all in euros before taxes): 2010-2012- Ausbildung + odd jobs - 30k
2012- 55k - full time job 2015-65k- full time job 2017-75k- full time job
2019-85k- full time job

I'm interested in making huge money and retiring early, but seems less certain
to do that at the moment. Compared to you and many others here, I feel like I
should act soon now, to reach such levels. But actually I don't know what I
should do. Any suggestions?

~~~
throw121212zzz
Don‘t focus on the huge money aspect. There is a lot of selection bias here,
only few people make this much outside of some very particular
areas/companies.

Comparing Germany (where I’m also from) and the US, I’d say that Germany still
gives much higher standard of living at the same salary, especially due to
lower rents in the big cities.

FYI my progression

120k joining top3 mgmt consulting after PhD, stayed for 4yrs, left when being
promoted to project leader (200-250k)

200k in mgmt position at e-commerce company in Berlin

Anyway, I think money matters way less than happiness in the job and a good
work-life-balance, at least when you have no debt and aren’t struggling
financially (=there is enough money left for vacations and some savings)

~~~
krn
> 200k in mgmt position at e-commerce company in Berlin

For the context: this is an insane amount of money in Berlin, which used to be
one of the poorest capitals in Western Europe. Most software engineers make
60-70k.

> after PhD,

A quick question: does it matter from which university one received his PhD in
Germany?

I read multiple comments, that unlike in the US and in the UK, most
universities in Germany are considered more or less equal.

But wouldn't a MSc / PhD from Humboldt University of Berlin be considered
above a MSc / PhD from University of Potsdam when applying for jobs and
negotiating the compensation?

~~~
throw121212zzz
In Germany the university playing field is much more level than elsewhere.
While certain universities stand out in certain areas, it’s not a deciding
factor in most cases. Many of the small town universities are actually quite
renowned.

The big divide is Universität vs Fachhochschule (university of applied
sciences), which are in many fields considered inferior unless they have
special profile (eg highly international).

------
tvphan
I am Asian but was born and raised in Australia. I have a Bachelor of Science
and I work as a web developer, e.g. Spring, ASP.NET, React, WordPress, Drupal,
etc.

2013 - 23yo - $45K - First job - Magento developer building eCommerce websites
for clients.

2014 - 24yo - $54K

2015 - 25yo - $70K - Second job - Magento / Shopify / WordPress developer,
building eCommerce websites for clients.

2016 - 26yo - $75K

2017 - 27yo - $80K - Third job - Full stack web developer - Predominantly
using Spring and React to build bespoke solutions for clients.

2018 - 28yo - $85K

I don't begrudge people with their crazy salaries but I do get frustrated that
I can't find success myself. I'm really struggling with savings and building
up a nest egg for retirement.

~~~
rubicon33
Web development and other easy domains like iOS / Android are quickly going
the way of other craft jobs of the past: Blue collar.

If you want to make above average salaries you're going to have to specialize.
Find something that is both challenging (to reduce barrier to entry) and niche
(to demand a higher salary). In other words - specialize. Staying as a generic
web/ios/android dev is only going to guarantee that your salary becomes more
and more diluted by the avalanche of developers entering the field. The
barrier to entry is just too low.

~~~
aerovistae
I really don't agree with this. I'm a 27 year old JS-focused web dev @150k
base.

I understand that the bootcamps and proliferation of web-teaching schools have
made web dev _seem_ like the easy thing, and I agree that what I do is less
complex than these $800k-earning data engineers, but web development in 2019
is no joke. The same goes for iOS/Android.

The types of things these companies are trying to build are not just "slap it
together in a week and done" type projects and it takes experience to
architect and engineer them effectively. Your average bootcamp grad is not
able to do it yet.

iOS/Android/Web development forms the 3 primary portals to a company's
clients, and as long as that's true, the value of such skillsets will remain
high.

~~~
minhaz23
Who is a data engineer here making $800k?

------
salta2019
Some context: PhD in EE, but spend most of my time coding.

    
    
        2011: $100k, industry R&D lab, VA
        2012: $150k, “”, “”
        2013: $150k, “”, “”
        2014: $0, self-employed and didn’t turn a profit
        2015: $100k, academic researcher, Midwest 
        2016: $160k, industry R&D, SV
        2017: $165k, “”, “”
        2018: $170k, “”, “”
    

Since 2016, I’ve been working in SV for a company that pays engineers all
cash, a modest bonus, and no stock. I like the work and people, but I feel
like I’m leaving a lot of money on the table.

Almost anywhere else in the country, I’d be making a considerable amount of
money. In SV, it doesn’t feel that way. Myself and most of my (unmarried)
coworkers are in our 30s-40s and living in studio apartments. I couldn’t
provide a family with the same lifestyle my parents gave me (a house, two
cars, safe neighborhood, good school district, mother could stop working for
several years to raise me), and they managed without college educations.

I’ve recently tried making the jump into a FAANG company or unicorn, but so
far no luck. One company was willing to give feedback: I don’t have enough
experience with large scale systems. It’s tough, because I’ve aged out of
junior positions, but I guess I lack the right experience for experienced
positions. Still have a couple irons in the fire though.

~~~
fma
Honestly, time to leave SV if you want to provide for a family. I'm in
Atlanta. 10 years experience, 135k base, 150k total comp (401k and bonus). You
can easily provide what you parents provides you here for 100k salary, which
can be easily had. No one will judge you if you don't have large scale systems
experience.

~~~
jandrewrogers
As a potentially helpful data point, I've occasionally been approached for
senior technical roles in Atlanta, at large non-tech companies, where they've
opened with $600-700k total comp. While I've never seriously pursued a job in
Atlanta, that market apparently has at least some willingness to pay well for
high-end technical talent that I would not have expected.

~~~
throwaway441
Are you open to sharing which companies? I've looked extensively in Atlanta
and haven't found anything near SV comp. Square was the highest that I found.

------
salaryanony1
Salary progression, no college degree. Cash only comp, no RSUs or anything
like that.

    
    
      20 - $65k   (Office Rural NY, SE)
      21 - $65k   (Remote, 10 Person Startup, SE)
      22 - $75k   (Remote, 10 Person Startup, SE)
      23 - $85k   (Remote, 10 Person Startup, SE)
      24 - $85k   (Remote, 10 Person Startup, SE)
      25 - $225k  (Remote, SF Series B Startup, Lead SE)
      26 - $225k  (Remote, SF Series B Startup, Lead SE)
      27 - $393k  (Office, SF Series C/D Startup, Principal SE)
      28 - $393k  (Office, SF Series C/D Startup, Principal SE)
      29 - $0     (Took a year off)
      30 - $0     (Took a year off)
      31 - $150k  (Founded a startup)

~~~
beambot
You paid yourself $150k in your first year as startup founder? Huh.

~~~
salaryanony1
Yeah, weird situation, good business opportunity + good funding. The barnacles
that come with a high income means that it's hard to cut back. I would have
trouble living on less than this.

------
reallydude
Where you live influences your salary by quite a bit. You insert javascript ad
tags? That's ~70k/yr in southern california, and 150k/yr in New York as
remote. If you have experience building a system to handle a billion metrics
per day, of course you can jump into a Senior Engineer IV position (or
whatever) at 180k... It's hard to talk about salaries when the context is
opaque because titles and skills are so fungible on both sides (employers and
employees)

------
bane
I did something like this once, but from a different angle. Since salaries
usually trend up, it's interesting to look at each salary bump in terms of how
much money it makes for you over your entire working lifetime.

For example, if your first job pays $60k, and your working years are say 52
years total, the payout from sustained employment is $3.12 million dollars (52
years * $65k).

If you then move onto another job 2 years later, and make $70k. The payout for
that jump is $500k ($10k * 50 years).

Or another way is to look at how much each pay bump has made for you till now
(instead of over your entire potential working lifetime).

This helped put into perspective for me how important certain pay increases
were for me and how unimportant others were. For example, big pay increases
that occurred recently haven't yet had time to really make me any significant
money, but even modest ones from 20 years ago have.

It also _really_ puts into perspective how bad bonuses are vs wage increases.
Even a large bonus pales in comparison to decades of small increases.

It also gave me better information when I chose to take a job at lower pay, in
terms of how much I was sacrificing, and when I eventually ended back up where
I was, how much that choice was actually costing me over my lifetime.

------
wtfthrowaway1
Throwaway account; I am currently in my late 30s.

Graduated from Kansas University in 2008.

2008 to 2010 - $50K CTO/co-founder of a small company

2011 - $125K SDE II @ Amazon

2012 - $125K SDE II @ Amazon

2013 - $175K SDE III @ Amazon

2014 - $217K SDE III @ Amazon

2015 - $200K E5 @ Facebook

2016 - $500K E6 @ Facebook

2017 - $800K E7 @ Facebook

2018 - $1M E7 @ Facebook

2019 ~ $1.25M E7 @ Facebook

~~~
gigatexal
I really need to get these skills up to snuff and get my butt back to the US.
These salaries are ridiculous.

~~~
techie128
Not salary. It's total comp. Most of it is stock growth.

~~~
gigatexal
Makes sense actually. Still the tax paid on the sale of stock (held for a year
or more I think) is taxed under the Bush era cap gains values of only 15% IIRC
so that's pretty good.

~~~
mrep
When your stock gets awarded, the full amount is taxed as income. If you don't
sell that stock for a year and then sell it, any gains from the price at the
award date and the sell date are taxed as cap gains so not really.

~~~
gigatexal
Ugh that complicated things for sure.

------
kartan
I have worked in Spain and Sweden. My salary as developer has been in the
range of €32K-€45K in the past 15 years in Spain. It has been around €65K in
Sweden (similar to what now friends make in Spain). And it is below €100K as
an architect.

The cost of living in Sweden is higher than in Spain. And Spanish salaries in
IT has soared. So, economically, it was not worth moving. But, the experience
of living abroad is worth the money.

It is difficult to compare with USA salaries as here there is more taxes but
you get better services. For me the deal breaker is the equality. I know that
people around me makes a living wage. But, I will not discard to move to any
other country in the future for the experience as every country has its own
charm.

~~~
why_only_15
It is difficult to compare, but the reality is that especially at FAANG
companies the company has good services. They provide transport to/from the
office, healthcare, retirement stuff, etc. However, the taxes in Europe are
higher.

~~~
pyrale
There are some benefits in knowing that the people that make your food, drive
you, clean your streets, etc. don't live out of their car.

------
throwaway01505
I've been pretty fortunate. Hard to believe that in 2004, my little family
survived on only $16k. That was a tough year. I was really grateful for
government assistance, as we were below the poverty line.

And last year I made more than $2M. I paid more than $1M in income taxes. I
hope some of that money is going to help little families like mine in 2004.

2004: $16k

2005: $36k

2006: $47k

2007: $53k

2008: $56k

2009: $63k

2010: $53k

2011: $116k

2012: $152k

2013: $160k

2014: $246k

2015: $444k

2016: $556k

2017: $1830k

2018: $2260k

~~~
BadassFractal
Wow! What did you do that led to such a dramatic growth starting in 2013?

~~~
throwaway01505
I don't want to be too specific, as I'd rather keep this anonymous. But I
happened to find myself with some rare and highly valuable skills, and I took
on a lot of new responsibilities. I'm now in technical management.

I don't think my success is necessarily repeatable, I just happened to see
some opportunities and seize them. I've been fortunate.

------
Bahamut
I have no qualms letting people know my comp so they know that is possible,
and helped many developers in my short 6 year career get better jobs/get life
changing comp.

Caveat to my numbers - I am an asian male math PhD dropout from a top 15
graduate program who had hardly coded prior to his first developer job. I also
have substantial open source contributions to major libraries, starting from
my first developer job.

Nov. 2012 - $51k (in DC)

Sept. 2013 - $75k (new job)

May 2014 - $105k + paid relocation (in Silicon Valley)

August 2014 - $140k (laid off from last job, changed to new one in 2 hours)

Jan. 2015 - $145k (raise at same job)

July 2015 - $160k (laid off from prior job in June)

July 2017 - $280k = $160k base, $15k signing bonus, $105k RSUs in FAANG (laid
off from prior job in May)

Sept. 2018 - $303k = $164k base, $14k performance/annual bonuses, $125k
refresh RSUs (annual raise from performance reviews at same job - was band
limited on the base salary)

~~~
bitcoinmoney
Are you counting vested RSU? A 400k 4-year vesting RSU should only be counted
100k/year. Also, why do you keep getting fired? And do you tell your employers
that you got laid off?

~~~
FiddlyPack
Fired =/= Laid-off

------
snrji
As a developer based in Europe looking at these numbers is quite depressing.

~~~
hk__2
Can we really compare them, though? I live in France, where €90k/y puts you in
the top 1% salaries. In the US, you’d need to earn $400k/y to be in the same
position. Standard of living and other social benefits come to mind.

~~~
aristophenes
I don't get this thinking. I think everyone is making the comparison to
Silicon Valley, which is ridiculously expensive because their are too many
people making too much money that all want to be in the same place.

In most of the USA, not only do you make more than you would in France, but
things are actually cheaper, not more expensive. Imagine you make
$150,000/year, a really nice house cost $300,000 (think $2,000 monthly
mortgage/taxes/insurance payment), groceries, electricity, internet, car for a
small family is $2,000 month. And that is with a very high quality of life. If
you want to live frugally cut all the expenses in half. The company provides
health insurance.

I think the biggest difference might be that Americans report their salary
before taxes, and I think Europeans tend to do it after taxes. $150,000/year
with a small family is probably $110,000-$120,000 after taxes in most states.
€90k after taxes is comparable. Just need to consider quality of life
differences.

~~~
throwaway011010
I hardly ever comment on HN (I usually lurk) but I felt compelled to due to
the sheer amount of false claims in this comment.

First off, can we define "things" in your sentence "things are actually
cheaper, not more expensive"? What are the "things" you're talking about?

Education? Eh... not really expensive in the US, is it? the US student loan
debt is swelling at about $1.5 trillion... and counting. It speaks volume as
to how costly education is in the US. [1]

Healthcare? Hugely expensive for a country as "rich" as the US. Unless, of
course, you work for a generous employer and in that case, everything is paid
for. Wait a second, I'm told not all employers provide a healthcare plan along
with a 401k plan? That's unfortunate. Let's also remind ourselves that the US
doesn't provide universal healthcare for all its citizens unlike other
advanced industrialized countries. So if you happen to be jobless? You're SOL.
Awe-effing-some. Let's move on... [2]

Housing? In SF/SV/NYC/Seattle/Washington/any major US city, housing is
extremely expensive as is housing in any major European metropolis such as
London/Paris/Munich/Zurich. I bet the $300,000 nice house you mention in your
comment must be somewhere in the countryside where nobody lives, right? Let's
make this clear: houses located in the middle of nowhere in any European
country also cost zilch. Let's take France for instance: 30K euros gets you a
100 sqm house (even bigger sometimes) in the Creuse region. Yeah nobody wants
to live there but hey at least I can own a large house for the price of a car.
[3]

I could go on and on. I haven't even touched on other topics such as Internet,
groceries, rent or insurance. Your comment comes across as plain ignorant and
downward complacent. I don't get this tendency of always sugarcoating the US,
as though it would make it magically more appealing to the average Joe to move
there.

Please back up your claims next time with articles or sources. Just use your
favourite search engine.

[1]:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Student_debt#/media/File:Stude...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Student_debt#/media/File:Student_loan_debt.png)

[2]: [https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/article-
abstract/26746...](https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/article-
abstract/2674671)

[3]:
[https://www.seloger.com/list.htm?enterprise=0&natures=1,2,4&...](https://www.seloger.com/list.htm?enterprise=0&natures=1,2,4&places=%5b%7bcp%3a23%7d%5d&projects=2,5&qsversion=1.0&sort=a_px&types=2&LISTING-
LISTpg=2)

~~~
aristophenes
I just live and work in the USA my whole life, if anything I'm wrong about
France. I'm not going to bother to refute most of your claims, as the premise
is what are the salaries of tech people, not what are the standards of living
of jobless people in San Francisco. Most of the US population, including
myself and most of my acquaintances, live outside of those major cities, and
that was the point I was making. You listed off literally the most expensive
places to live in the USA, where the majority of people do not live. Education
expenses are whatever you want to pay, we have plenty of choices including
cheap choices, and generous scholarships for those that can't afford it but
are smart.

~~~
throwaway011010
Amazing.

I just caught you out making stuff up and now you resort to making yet again
even more stuff up: "Education expenses are whatever you want to pay" (yeah,
let's just buy 1/10th of a Bachelor degree, sounds like a plan to cut the
costs), "you listed off literally the most expensive places to live in the
USA, where the majority of people do not live" (sure, nobody lives in major
cities) (why the hell are they called major cities then? God knows).

This conversation is leading nowhere so I'm just gonna stop responding.

~~~
dang
We've banned this account for breaking the site guidelines. Your points appear
reasonable, but the personal attacks and nastiness with which you've made them
are unacceptable here.

If you don't want to be banned, you're welcome to email hn@ycombinator.com and
give us reason to believe that you'll follow the rules in the future.

[https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html](https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html)

------
throwaway031419
* 2018 $1,155,000

* 2017 $1,259,000 Senior Staff Software Engineer

* 2016 $661,000 _time off

_ 2015 $1,543,000

* 2014 $1,465,000

* 2013 $1,241,000

* 2012 $876,000 Threatened to quit, got a bunch of stock

* 2011 $368,000

* 2010 $318,000

* 2009 $244,000

* 2008 $192,000 Staff Software Engineer

* 2007 $167,000

* 2006 $165,000

* 2005 $157,000 Senior Softare Engineer, Norcal

* 2004 $246,000 _stock sale

_ 2003 $80,000

* 2002 $76,000 Software Engineer II

* 2001 $102,000

* 2000 $59,000

* 1999 $55,000 Software Engineer, Northern VA

~~~
minhaz23
Still in VA?

Is it typical for senior SWE to make 1.2 million?

How can one reach that point faster?

~~~
throwaway031419
Staff Engineers at FAANG typically make 400-500k/pa. What made the difference
was a retention grant. I got a competing offer and they gave me millions in
stock, which I accepted and stayed. After I was fully vested, I basically got
lucky and found another big company that had a department that was doing some
pretty undisciplined hiring and brought me in at Senior Staff. I'm not really
doing the job at that level, but they don't want me to leave, so we're in
stasis. After the initial grant runs out this will stabilize at ~700k.

I don't know how to repeat what I did. I think retention grants are rarer than
they used to be. However, once you get to Staff, you have a lot of negotiating
leverage. I received multiple offers with initial grants over 2 million.

Build relationships, progress your career, get good at whiteboard interviews,
and change jobs more often to make progress.

~~~
bitcoinmoney
How often you changed jobs? And what kind of work do you do?

~~~
throwaway031419
I've only changed jobs three times. I should have changed a lot more. I do iOS
dev these days.

------
salaryFoo
About three years after graduating I stumbled into some extra freelance work a
school friend passed on to me. Then got lucky again by finding myself in a
well-paid (for UK) devops niche.

\- 2009: £1,000/yr Mostly depressed, unemployed and unmotivated. Some income
from teaching English and arbitraging signup bonuses on gambling websites.
Lived close to rent-free by subletting rooms in the apartment I was living in.
(Spain)

\- 2010-12: £8,000/yr English Teacher (China, full-time)

\- 2012: £20/hour PHP dev (China, freelance)

\- 2012-13: £16,000/yr Rails dev (China, full-time)

\- 2014: £72,000/yr Rails dev (London, contracting)

\- 2014: £102,000/yr Devops (London, contracting)

\- 2015-16: £60/hr Rails+Go dev (SE Asia, some remote freelancing but mostly
not working)

\- 2017: £120,000/yr Devops (London, contracting)

\- 2018: £158,400/yr Devops (London, contracting)

\- 2019: £192,000/yr Devops (London, remote contracting)

~~~
switch007
I've never heard of those 18-19 London salaries. Woah! Finance though surely?

~~~
dsaron
I have a few friends in London, contracting whilst working a Single Person
Business (lacking the proper terminology). Super high wages £500 - £700 per
day, whilst having an effective tax rate or 13%. Boom.

~~~
dtip
Where are you getting 13% from?

If you pay yourself a salary from a ltd company there's ~14% Employers NI,
12%-2% Employee NI Depending on tax band, 20-40% Income tax depending on tax
band. If you pay a dividend there's 19% Corporation tax plus 7.5%-32.5%
Dividend tax.

So 46%-56% tax on salary and 26.5%-51.5% tax on dividends. Nowhere near 13%,
unless you're talking about 'creative accounting' by running non-business
expenses through the company to effectively get them tax free.

~~~
dsaron
Yeah, by all accounts reading online indicates a 45% tax rate for a sole-
trader[1].

I'll have to enquire with the few mates there -- don't see a reason as to why
they'd bullshit me. Frankly I have nfi however, apologies for the cop-out of
an answer.

1: [https://www.highspeedtraining.co.uk/hub/sole-trader-
tax/](https://www.highspeedtraining.co.uk/hub/sole-trader-tax/)

~~~
Nursie
> I'll have to enquire with the few mates there

Sole traders are different to one-person Ltd companies. As a one-person Ltd,
you used to get a lot of tax breaks, but over the last 5-6 years they seem to
have been steadily eroded.

Anyone paying a rate as low as 13% now is probably using a borderline-legal
grey-area scheme, which is dangerous because HMRC not only hit those folks up
for back taxes when they find them, but put fines on top too.

------
11thEarlOfMar
Some random points of advice after 30 years in tech...

First, decide whether you are more interested in pushing forward on technology
or on earning more. Yes, you probably want both, but you should decide which
matters more. Also, note that the answer will likely change if your personal
situation changes, in particular, if you start a family.

These points are primarily for those who put earning more above pushing
technology. I was married early on and that became the priority for me.

\- Always work to make your boss successful. There are a variety of advantages
to this. First, if you make them successful and they rise in the company, they
are more likely to give you a promotion and raise as well. Second, if they
change jobs and go to a place you'd like to work, whether it's in one, five,
ten years or more, you'll be someone they call when they need to hire. Third,
it makes it much easier for them to go to bat for you when you ask for a
raise.

Given all of that, it's also important to work for bosses that you want to see
succeed. If you really don't like your boss, and you find it distasteful to
help them be successful, work towards their success while you look for another
boss.

\- If you want to earn more, ask for more responsibility. I was married when I
was an engineer of 3 years. To earn more, I asked to be made a project lead. I
delivered several projects, then asked to be made a manager. I managed several
people, then asked for a transfer to start and manage a remote sales and
service office. In each case, I was given 30%+ raises.

The point here is that you need to ask. Let your boss and HR know that you
want to be considered for promotion. Once you've asked, remind them at more or
less regular intervals, perhaps 6 months. You want it to stick in their minds
that you are looking to move up and at some point, an opportunity may come up
that you'd be on the short list for.

\- Change jobs or companies. This is typically the most effective way to get a
raise. _The key is to look while you 're still working_. Many people in tech
keep their heads down until the company goes through a rough patch and lays
off or shuts down. Then, if they don't have runway, they have to take the
first position that comes along. If you think you need to move, keep your job
and do your search so you can evaluate each opportunity without being under
pressure.

\- Treat options or other equity as the icing, not the cake. You can be
deliberate about accumulating wealth without windfalls by consistently earning
more than you spend and conscientiously investing your savings. If you're able
to cash in on options, that is great, invest it, buy a home or whatever. But
earn what you're worth in cash.

~~~
mnm1
The only thing I've ever seen work to get significantly more money is changing
companies. Companies used to give somewhat decent raises 3-8% but outside of
that, it doesn't seem to matter what one does. I have a great boss and have
been promised raises multiple times. Instead, our CEO cut our vacation in
half. The only reason I haven't gone somewhere else is because I work remotely
and can put in the most minimal effort. I regret the first few years putting
in a lot of effort, getting RSI, solving many problems ... but for what? For
nothing. Actually, less than nothing. Due to inflation and vacation taken
away, I make less. So I work less. Then people wonder why something like over
80% of workers in the US are disengaged. This is why. Most companies are too
cheap to provide proper compensation, vacation, and benefits. Serves them
right.

~~~
yitianjian
I think you have to get really lucky, or really go above and beyond.

I've been at my company for almost two years and I've gotten a net 70% raise
across this time frame. Although it's only from 60k to 100k CAD so, YMMV
especially in more senior roles.

~~~
mnm1
Oh trust me, I went above and beyond. Migrating a live app from mysql to
pgsql. ALL the devops work for the entire company, then moving all that
infrastructure to Docker and reducing costs so that all our apps run on one
cluster of servers. Migrating multiple live apps from one provider to another
without downtime. Working late and even weekends. Rewriting a server
completely to make it much more robust and less buggy. Rewriting the database
and serializer parts of our API because the original coders used super slow
implementations. Implementing multiple experiments using various databases to
deal with another slow codebase. Dealing with teams of contractors that wrote
code so shitty, it would make one cry, it was so horrible. Then having to take
charge of their shitty mess because they sure as fuck won't. Saving the
company over $100k a year by not using ridiculously priced API gateway
services. Bringing in another dev to help out when our other main developer
left.

I could go on and on. Any one of those things was above and beyond on its own
and I never once got a performance based bonus, let alone a raise. Then we got
new management and they rewarded us by cutting our vacation. I am completely
unappreciated, or at the very least, that appreciation is not shown in any way
that matters. I am, however, no longer at a spot in my life, thankfully, that
work defines my life. I still make good money and I focus on other things in
my life. I let the execs worry about deadlines and bullshit like that. They
can panic and get anxiety all they want, it won't magically get the work done
or get it done quicker. As I said, my bosses are decent in all other ways
other than appreciating their employees with appropriate compensation /
vacation. Who knows, that might change. I'm not holding my breath though.

------
hashhar
I graduated with a Bachelors in Computer Science in July 2017 in India. All
amounts below are the fixed salary without any stock options or bonuses.

2017-2018 - $8k - Backend Dev for major eCommerce 2018-2019 - $10k - same role

Laid off due to downsizing in Nov 2018 with a healthy severance.

Dec 2018-2019 - $17k - Backend Dev for a logistics company

~~~
stfwn
Nice to see a non-US/EU contribution. What is the middle class cost of living
in your area?

~~~
hashhar
I live in a slightly upper class area in Gurgaon since it's walking distance
to my workplace and hence save on commute.

Rent and expenses is almost 30k INR (roundabout $450) a month. Apart from that
it's all takeout food money and any movies or shopping you might do.

My initial pay was a little too low to afford the place I am living at since
I'd almost always run out of money by the end of the month and was living
paycheck to paycheck. The first raise did improve situations a bit and I could
easily save around 10k INR per month.

My current salary affords me very comfortable living with enough to invest for
the future and still have around 30k INR per month in savings.

------
throwawayosiu1
So I had posted this earlier but I'll post again with another update. I'm
based out of Toronto.

    
    
        2012 - small business owner                             - 60k AED / yr (no taxes) - built Wordpress websites in my spare time
        2013 - technical cloud marketing intern                 - 60k / yr CAD            - FAANGish company
        2013 - contractor                                       - 30k / yr CAD            - Engineering consultancy
        2014 - Software Dev Fullstack                           - 22k / yr CAD            - early stage startup
        2015 - Lead Software Dev Fullstack / Architect + DevOps - 55k / yr CAD            - very early stage startup
        2015 - Lead Software Dev Fullstack / Architect + DevOps - 60k / yr CAD            - very early stage startup
        2016 - Software Dev                                     - 60k / yr CAD            - medium stage startup
        2016 - Techincal Consultant                             - 90k / yr CAD            - small public company
        2017 - Software Engineer + DevOps                       - 99k / yr CAD            - medium public company
        2018 - Senior Software Engineer + DevOps + SRE          - 120k / yr CAD           - medium public company
        2019 - Senior Software Engineer + DevOps + SRE          - 135k / yr CAD           - medium public company
    

I was in the process of getting promoted and getting a higher raise, but stuff
(some in my control and some out of) didn't work out. I've been focusing on my
life for a bit.

~~~
tmptdotsre
Thanks for sharing your salary history. I am also located in Toronto and this
is my salary history (all CAD):

    
    
      2014 - Junior System Administrator    $42k    - fresh graduate, large company
      2015 - System Administrator           $55k    - large company
      2016 - DevOps Engineer                $80k    - startup
      2018 - Senior DevOps Engineer         $95k    - large company
      2019 - Site Reliability Engineer      $125k   - medium-size company

------
steven777400
I appreciate the increasing trend toward openness. I think it benefits
everyone to see what's out there.

My journey All USD $ are gross annualized and approximate. No bonuses/stock.
Doesn't include employer-paid health or retirement.

2006, Tenured professor at a community college, $43K to $65K

2011, Developer at a state agency, $84K

2013, Development Team Lead, $90K

2017, IT Manager, $100K

------
wdr1
For folks in the United States, if you want to help, your earnings history is
available via the Social Security website.

[https://blog.ssa.gov/tag/earnings-
history/](https://blog.ssa.gov/tag/earnings-history/)

------
mac01021
Southern New England, not in a metro area. White male, stubbornly refusing to
leave his hometown area for his career.

2009: $25 per hour, contractor, on site at giant pharmaceutical company. Built
a web app using jsp and tomcat

2010: $55k per year, University IT department. Building web apps in python for
university staff. Crazy union contract- 35hr work week and 5 weeks PTO

2012: same job, same benefits, applied for a "reclassification" in the union
levels. $75k per year.

2015: $85k per year. Onsite, big media and entertainment company. Cut my teeth
building highly available distributed systems.

2017: $135k per year. Remote. Jumped ship to do similar kinds of work at a
remote-first startup that could pay more.

2018: same company offered me a raise (without my asking!) $150k per year.

I've never worked more than 40 hours on a regular basis, but production issues
occasionally produce a 60 hour week, maybe twice a year or so.

~~~
cpursley
What stack / tech did you use for "highly available distributed systems" and
do you feel like it helped differentiate your skill set in terms of
hireability?

~~~
mac01021
Sorry if this is too much text, but I feel like I have a decent sense about
this, since I've been interviewing recently. Of course, we all live in
bubbles, and there may be some tech bubbles extremely different from mine.

Your tech stack in a distributed system will often be diverse and wide-
ranging. In my opinion, no specific combination of tools is very important for
hireability, though commonly recurring characters will certainly help your
resume.

I write or work on lots of small services, mostly in Java, some Scala,
occasionally Go or Python. The JVM is probably the most popular programming
platform for this domain but some companies do without it entirely (Go,
Python, Node.js are all somewhat popular).

Most services run in Docker containers on AWS. I feel like almost everyone is
in the cloud these days.

There are lots of REST APIs, so you'll want a good handle on HTTP. In my work,
even more than HTTP, I've dealt with streaming/realtime data coming over
Apache Kafka or AWS Kinesis or AWS SQS. Lots of people use RabbitMQ, but I
never have.

And I interface with lots of different data stores - Postgres, S3, Dynamodb,
Elasticsearch, Cassandra, Redis. And Zookeeper, more for coordination than
storage. Zookeeper is fun, but very niche.

In terms of building a resume to get hired in this domain, these are some
things you want:

\- Be able to work in a few languages and with several data stores. Be able to
talk about which kind of DB is appropriate for what use.

\- Demonstrate proficiency in concurrent programming and asynchrony via
multithreading/futures/promises/channels or whatever the relevant constructs
on your platform of choice are.

\- Have used some kind of streaming solution or message queue (kafka is neat
and widely used, if don't already have one in mind)

\- Have experience with provisioning and orchestration on a cloud platform
(AWS, GCP, Azure,...)

\- Be able to talk about tools and techniques for monitoring, alerting, and
tracing in systems where a request or a stream element must traverse many
services.

\- Be able to talk about typical distributed-systems challenges at a
conceptual level:

    
    
       * Why and how to partition your data, both in a stream and at rest
    
       * How to avoid or resolve consistency issues, when and how to trade consistency for availability, coordinations strategies, CRDTs
    
       * At-least-once processing, at-most-once, exactly-once, idempotency, why you would want each - how and when you can achieve each.
    

As a side note, I feel like, once you've built a decent distributed system or
application, it's easy to make it look good on a resume. Either it's a high-
throughput system and you can say you processed X thousands of requests per
second with no downtime for a year, or else it's low throughput and you can
double down on the fault-tolerance bit "even when we deliberately crashed half
of the servers, the service remained available and end-to-end latency was only
reduced by X amount". Of course, you need measure some stuff in order to have
numbers to brag about. But hopefully you're collecting those metrics anyway.

------
ddelt
I feel slightly motivated, but mostly crushed by these crazy TC levels.

Although I know I'm doing fairly decent for myself, as someone who is very
critical of my own progress or lack of, it feels very disheartening to see
people my age making 10x what I am, simply because they are located in SV,
doing the same work.

In my area, short of being extremely fortunate to land some amazing fully-
remote job, there is not one tech company that pays out anywhere close to
300k+ TC, unless you are in senior leadership or just consulting/doing work on
the side.

I understand the reasons for the big disparity, but still... feels bad man.

~~~
stoksc
Right there with you. I’m doing pretty decent, making 85k but straight out of
college. At a nice start up in a big city. But 800k at Netflix? Good god.. I
should mention I’m ‘straight out of college’ at 27, so that’s contributing,
too.

~~~
awinder
I would not get depressed, you're talking about an extremely small audience of
developers in the field. If anything I'd look at it with aspiration, you're
reading up on hackernews and you're straight out of college at a startup. Keep
hustling no idea where you'll end up, I assume netflix is not paying kids out
of college 800K :D

------
crusader86
I'll throw my experience in government in here because I don't see a lot of
that here, I am a government lead now with a ERP team.

USD, Before Taxes, DC area

2010 - 24k - First 'jobs' working Geek Squad and Helpdesk at a Healthcare Firm

2011 - 40k - Quit second job, started grad school, started working for the
Feds as an intern in the Digital Forensics space

2012 - 45k - "

2013 - 45k - "

2014 - 50k - Graduated Grad school, promoted to a GS-9 started working in the
ERP space

2015 - 56k - Promoted to GS-11

2016 - 68k - Promoted to GS-12, got my CISSP for the hell of it

2017 - 80k - Debated quitting because of lack of opportunity

2018 - 89k - Promoted, given a lot of responsibility and a great opportunity
to learn

------
soulnothing
Honest question has anyone else seen salary decreases. I peaked at ~190k w2
contractor so no benefits. But after death march after death march and
canceled projects. I got down to ~105. One of my biggest stress right now is
due to money. Contributed to by a foreclosure that has a monthly payment. I've
been east and west coast and tried FAANG, but unless I waited the vesting it
was a drastic pay cut, and the midst of the foreclosure I needed hard cash. I
keep on looking at my career and wondering what I did wrong.

~~~
seanmcdirmid
Most FAANGs pay well even without vested stock, Amazon in particular relies
heavily on stock for compensation but provides bonuses the first couple of
years to compensate.

~~~
minhaz23
What does vested stock mean exactly? You can't sell until after a certain
period? If so, how long is that period?

~~~
pjscott
A certain number of shares of stock are set aside for you. When they "vest",
that means you get them.

The vesting schedule varies, but probably the most common arrangement is that
you get 1/4 of the shares per year for the next 4 years. Often you get nothing
until you've been there for a year, then get a whole year's worth of stock in
one big lump sum, and then get smaller amounts more frequently thereafter.

In the US, the stock is taxed as ordinary income on the day you get it. If its
price goes up before you sell it, you also pay capital gains tax on the change
in price that happened while you were holding it. (I sell all my stock
immediately on general principle, so my capital gains taxes are tiny.)

------
sometechie
In the spirit of this discussion, I’ll share my journey. In 2015, my base was
$95k. Today, it is $150k. Including stocks and bonuses, my total compensation
went from ~$140k to $220k. In California, but not the Bay Area. I hold a
Bachelor’s from a pretty good university, but by no means an elite
institution.

White guy from a modest background: grew up lower middle class, single mother
who worked in retail, got free lunch, etc.

It feels odd to have moved and basically move up the economic totem poll to
what I guess I’d call upper middle class. Life for people who stayed where I
grew up is quite different than my life now.

~~~
narcindin
An income over 220k is easily > 90% percentile. I do not know what upper
middle class is supposed to mean. Does it mean 90-95 percentile?

~~~
dragonwriter
> An income over 220k is easily > 90% percentile.

Every source I can find (2014-2018 data from a variety of places) puts it
between 97th and just over 98th; probably hasn't changed more than a couple of
points since.

> I do not know what upper middle class is supposed to mean. Does it mean
> 90-95 percentile?

If by “middle class” one means _petit bourgeoisie_ , then 95th to 99.something
percentile for the upper range of that class is fairly reasonable; the _haut
bourgeoisie_ are a very narrow slice, and economic classes in that classic
sense have overlapping income ranges, because they are more about how one
relates to the economy than income level, though the two are correlated.

OTOH, the language of economic class these days is used in many murky and
inconsistent ways.

EDIT: Just to be clear, the classic idea of the _petit bourgeoisie_ as the
middle economic class of capitalist societies does not mean that they
represent the average or some range around the average; the working class
makes up the _vast majority_ , the _haut bourgeoisie_ (the class of major
capitalists) is a tiny slice that controls most of the wealth, and the _petit
bourgeoisie_ are a fairly thin (though much broader than the _haut
bourgeoisie_ ), largely relatively rich class that is “middle” in the sense of
deriving income from a mix including both a substantial contribution from
personal labor (the predominant support for the working class) and a
substantial contribution from personal capital (the predominant support for
the _haut bourgeoisie_ )—the classic example of that mix being the independent
small business owner whose labor is applied to their own capital rather than
either being rented out to some capitalist, or gaining returns on capital by
renting others labor to apply to it.

~~~
jjoonathan
You could probably draw a quantitative line according to fraction of income
paid as tax, since capital gains follow, ahem, different rules. It's good to
be king!

------
s_t_away
Adding mine, all at Google:

    
    
      2008: Base  $90K, Total $110K
      2009: Base $110K, Total $170K
      2010: Base $130K, Total $330K
      2011: Base $200K, Total $590K
      2012: Base $220K, Total $680K
      2013: Base $220K, Total $830K
      2014: Base $230K, Total $980K
      2015: Base $240K, Total $990K
      2016: Base $250K, Total $1.2M
      2017: Base $250K, Total $1.4M
      2018: Base $265K, Total $1.5M
      2019: Base $280K
    

(edited for formatting)

~~~
minhaz23
The total is after bonus only? Or..?

Any advice for others? Isn't it notoriously difficult getting hired at Google?

Do other non tech positions at Google pay as much?

What about positions like QA?

~~~
s_t_away
Total includes bonus and equity (which makes up the bulk of it, especially in
later years). So some of the increases are also just reflecting increases in
GOOG from grant to vesting.

I'm a software engineer. My impression is that pay for PMs (product managers)
is very similar, although I couldn't say for sure. Not sure about other
positions. And for QA specifically, I believe a lot are hired through a vendor
so I imagine it would be very different.

I don't know if I have particularly useful advice. I think honestly it's a mix
of happening to be good at what I do, working hard, and being in the right
place at the right time (both in terms of ending up Google and being on the
teams/projects that I did which helped me rise quickly).

The only thing I would say is that I very much did not go in expecting this or
with the idea of optimizing for it. When I joined at the end of 2007, Google
was already post-IPO and it wasn't clear (to me at least) that there was "big
bucks" to be made there. At that time, it seemed like going into finance or to
a startup was the way to go to optimize for that, and I thought I was leaving
a bunch on the table picking Google over those. I do think it helped working
with the mindset of doing what I truly enjoyed instead of "doing it for the
money".

~~~
bronxbomber92
What is the nature of your work within SWE?

------
throwaway0906
Didn't feel comfortable sharing on my real account, but thought some might
find this interesting.

Gender: male Location: east coast * 2013 - Graduated without a degree in CS.
Worked at small start-up for 55k, no equity.

* 2014 - Raise to 75k, 0.5%

* 2015 - Raise to 85k, 1%

* 2016 - Quit for a FAANG. 220k total comp.

* 2017 - After 2 promos at the FAANG, ~330k.

* 2018 - After good previous year, received a special stock grant and made 475k. Same eng level.

~~~
thundergolfer
Holy shit you went from $55k to $475k in 5 years with no college degree.

This is a big reason I'm in tech. What a rocketing salary progression.

~~~
minhaz23
Would this kind of progression not be possible in finance?

~~~
el_benhameen
That kind of progression is probably very possible in finance, but not without
a relevant degree.

~~~
minhaz23
So it's possible in tech, without a degree at all(OP says he has an unrelated
degree)? I keep reading horror stories online of people with degrees,
internships/experience, hackathons, projects, all that under their belt having
a hard time in their careers. And also a lot of naysayers saying you can't
make it far without a degree.

------
mettamage
Didn’t read the article, I did read the thread.

How do I get into the USA?

The difference is too big, even when I give 20% to charity.

Or any ideas how to become well off in Europe?

Tech feels so much more difficult than manager or other business roles
(cognitively). I feel like I should switch if I can’t get into the USA.

~~~
DVassallo
I grew up in Europe (Malta), now in Seattle. I think Dublin is the place to be
for tech opportunities and competitive compensation. If you work for a US
company you can transfer from the EU to the US with an L1B visa quite easily
(it’s what I did) as long as the company you work for is okay with the
transfer. The L1B expires after 5 years, but you can apply for permanent
resident while on it.

~~~
mettamage
Thanks for the strategy. I really appreciate it.

------
fitech
Created new account to share since my other could easily trace back to me...

Maybe this isn’t super relevant since this is mostly about tech but I’ve found
my technology skills are what contribute to give me a huge advantage, even in
finance. All figures in USD. All finance jobs are in research.

23: 50k - tech consulting business

23: 90k - same. Relocate to NYC

24: 110k - negotiated at consulting company

24: 160k = 110k + 50k bonus - move to financial company

25: 200k = 110k + 90k bonus

26: 210k = 120k + 90k bonus

27: 150k - joined small team starting new business in finance

28: 150k

29: 150k

30: 500k - business is making money

~~~
minhaz23
Could you elaborate or expand on the business?

This is your business or you're just someone that got in at the beginning?
Like a startup or a division of the company, you were originally at?

~~~
fitech
I can’t answer your question without giving away more information than I’m
comfortable with.

------
throwaway218
Wowza, hard not to look at these things and feel twinges of jealousy. It's
hard to stay grounded in what the important things in life are....

United States - have perfect SAT and ACT scores, went through university for
free

Age 21-28 - Work in NGOs, non-profits - $25k Age 28 Finish Masters degree Age
29-32 - Work in NGOs and non-profits and policy analysis - $32k Age 32-34 -
Suicide Counselor - $35k Age 35 - Bootcamp - become Rails developer -$60k Age
36 - $65k Age 37 - ask for raise $80k Age 38 - $85k Age 39 - Senior
developer/manage projects/do mentoring/keep coding - $90k Age 40 - $92k

Based on these it seems like 5+ years of experience on the backend and
frontend with multiple stacks and the ability to manage 4+ engineers, keep
backlogs groomed, talk to clients to manage expectations and translate
requirements into usr stories and acceptance crtieria, etc should be more than
$95k - and yet $95k still seems high for a developer anywhere outside of the
US

------
quaffapint
I see a lot of these crazy high salaries (there's nothing much higher than
$150 for a sr dev around here on the east) are in SF area.

Are these the exception FAANG salaries or are most companies paying such high
salaries out there? It just blows my mind I can't imagine making such money as
a dev and I've been doing this for a lot of years.

~~~
sytelus
Median total compensation at FB is $240K and at Google $197K as per SEC
filings. Folks with $1M figures are probably in top 3-5% in these companies. I
would also add that if you are in bay area with $240K total comp and have
family, your standard of living is probably not all that enviable.

[https://www.bizjournals.com/sanjose/news/2019/01/15/median-p...](https://www.bizjournals.com/sanjose/news/2019/01/15/median-
pay-apple-salaries-fb-goog-nflx-msft-tsla.html)

~~~
minhaz23
How can one see these compensation data's in the SEC filings themselves? Where
do I look?

Are you saying some of the people here with 400-800k salaries are top 5% at a
FAANG?

~~~
chillacy
Managers will usually pull 400k+, I wouldn't say that's a top 5% salary. Above
300k isn't unusual at all. Check out levels.fyi for some examples of top-of-
band salaries in each level.

~~~
minhaz23
Engineering managers?

Are there any non tech management level positions at FAANG that net these
types of salaries as well?

~~~
chillacy
Yea EMs. I don't know about non-tech.

------
enraged_camel
I agree that we need to abolish the taboo of not talking about salaries. It
creates an information asymmetry that primarily benefits employers.

------
linguae
Currently taking a break from my PhD, although I plan to finish it one day.
Here's my salary progression as a CS researcher in Silicon Valley:

2015: $104k (worked in an R&D lab for an enterprise company)

2016: $106k (laid off at the end of the year as part of reorg)

2017: $115k + $10k bonus (short stint as a SRE at a famous company that
unfortunately didn't go very well....)

2018: Consultant at a startup for $120/hr. Unfortunately this opportunity
didn't last. Ended up taking a research internship.

2019: $95k (promoted to full-time researcher)

I love my current job; in fact, it's one of the best I've had. But Silicon
Valley is a very expensive place, and I'm wondering if there are opportunities
to do CS research in industry outside of Silicon Valley.

------
throwawhale
Canadian Software developer

Salaries in USD, before taxes, including lack of bonus.

\- 2010: Dropout

\- 2011: $0

\- 2012: $33,000

\- 2013: $36,000

\- 2014: $39,000

\- 2015: $42,000

\- 2016: $45,000

\- 2017: $55,000

\- 2018: $0 (startup)

\- 2019: $0 (startup)

What the hell am I doing with my life? I consider myself pretty damn good too.
The "startup" isn't going anywhere.

I think I'll go to university. Maybe in 4 years I'll be able to earn
$150,000...

~~~
peripitea
Without knowing your skills, there's a good chance you've just been working
for the wrong companies. There are lots of companies in Canada that pay
absolute garbage to software engineers. And if you don't have the skills that
higher-paying companies look for (mainly coding+algorithms+data structures in
interviews), you can get that without going to college. Also look into working
remotely for US companies.

~~~
throwawhale
The company I worked for was a software shop. Most people there were
developers.

I don't really have algorithms and data structure skills. I almost never have
to do these things in real life. I have done mostly front-end stuff (web and
mobile). Should I go all-in on LeetCode? Will that guarantee a good paying
job?

It seems like 4 more years without income to get a bachelor's degree would be
worth it considering the crazy compensations people are sharing here. I would
earn more in 2 years there than I did in my entire career here.

~~~
chillacy
If you can solve a leetcode medium in an hour _and_ get a work visa in the US,
then you can easily double or triple that salary. Just throwing this out
there: grinding interview problems sucks but it's the best thing you can do
for your income in industry these days.

~~~
throwawhale
I can't get a US work visa. I need a bachelor's degree.

~~~
peripitea
There are some US companies that will let you work remotely.

------
throwaway999624
2005 - $15k consulting and college

2006 - $16k consulting and college

2007 - $20k Company 1

2008 - $26k Company 1

2009 - $40k Company 2

2010 - $52k Company 3

2011 - $104k Company 3

2012 - $170k Company 4

2013 - $180k Company 5

2013 - $215k Company 6

2015 - $250k Company 7

2016 - $350k Company 7

2017 - $450k Company 7

2018 - $700k Company 7

2019 - $1.6M Company 7 *

* Based on stock remaining at today’s share price.

Only the company >=6 had significant portions of compensation contribution
through equity.

I recently interviewed and secured two offers for around $1.5M but ended up
staying. Offered role were Distinguished Engineer / VP Engineering.

~~~
remify
Is company 7 Amazon ?

------
DVassallo
My progression:

2008: Graduated with a BS in CS from University of London. I grew up in
Europe.

2008: €30K - Joined a small company in Europe as their only programmer doing
vehicle GPS tracking.

2009: €30K - Still there.

2010: €50K - Joined Amazon in Dublin, Ireland as an SDE-1 (entry level) in the
AWS CloudWatch team.

2011: €75K - Still at Amazon, same team.

2012: $120K - Moved to Seattle with the same team. Promoted to SDE-2.

2013: $150K - Still at Amazon, same team.

2014: $185K - Promoted to SDE-3 (senior level), same team.

2015: $230K - Still at Amazon, same team.

2016: $390K - Still at Amazon, same team.

2017: $470K - Still at Amazon, same team.

2018: $511K - Still at Amazon, same team.

2019: Left Amazon last month. You can read more about why here:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19135399](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19135399)

All figures are gross income as shown in my W2. My last 3 year-end (Dec)
paystubs: [http://imgur.com/a/EgIVQln](http://imgur.com/a/EgIVQln)

Ask me anything.

~~~
beamatronic
Graduated in the late 90s with a degree in CS. I read this and I wonder, where
the hell did I go wrong? If this is commonplace, then how did I fail so
spectacularly?

~~~
meritt
A significant portion of his compensation was via recurring Amazon.com stock
grants (RSUs). By year 4+ most employees are looking at least 3 separate stock
grants vesting every single year.

Had you bought $100,000 of $AMZN in 2010, it'd be worth $1.35M today (and
$1.6M in September) which would go a long way toward evening things out in a
similar manner.

~~~
DVassallo
It’s true that a big part of my comp was in stock, but I only meaningfully
gained from stock appreciation in 2017 and 2018. In the other years stock
appreciation accounted for only $5-$15K. I sold all my stock as soon as it
vested, so I sold a lot at $200, $300, $400... etc. Even in 2017, I got it at
all under $1000. Now it’s $1700.

------
stats111
These salaries sound astronomical compared to earning potential in UK
companies. As an Architect, average salaries are around £64,000. Does anyone
know how like for like roles pay in the UK for US companies? I can't see
Amazon paying £200k for a software developer?

~~~
dev-thrwy-593
That figure must be for outside London, no? Since there aren't too many UK
salaries here I'll add mine for London, all in GBP:

\- 2006-2009 45-60k Employee, US investment bank, Analyst

\- 2010-2012 300/day Freelance, full stack web dev

\- 2013-2017 105k Employee, tech lead at a startup

\- 2018-2019 700/day Contractor, Senior Python Developer

~~~
stats111
It's a UK wide average. Specific industries like banking will pay a markup.
Also expect a 15-20% higher pay in London due to increased living costs.

~~~
dev-thrwy-593
Banking pays poorly compared to tech roles at private equity and hedge funds.
Even losing out to Silicon Roundabout and even sleepy Whitehall at the moment,
though it is all fairly volatile.

I suppose trying to work at any of the smaller FAANG offices in London might
be the best you can do in the UK?

------
kthejoker2
Well, yall can have mine.

2005: Graduated with a BA in Political Science and a fairly strong background
in SQL. I've stayed in Texas my whole career.

2005: first job, web dev, $34k, govt pension

2006: salary bump to $40k

2007: new role as data analyst, $55k

2008: cola bump, $58k

2009: data warehouse lead at school district, $72k

2010: cola bump plus a raise, $78k

2011: first contracting role, equivalent of $100k

2012: lead BI architect, $125k, company pension

2013: same role, bonus, $130k

2014: same role, bonus, $130k

2015: consultant with a firm, $135k

2016 and 2017: cola bumps to $140k

2018: promotion, $152k

And I've turned down offers of $180k because I like my work life balance.

~~~
fma
What's a promotion after BI architect? Manager?

~~~
kthejoker2
Well I switched to consulting in 2015, but I'm now a pre sales analytics
architect serving the Southwest.

So my promotion is more technical scope (BI/DW, ML/AI, IoT, Big Data,
"DataOps"), more customers, more leadership, and more commercial
responsibility (i.e. I have a quota.)

~~~
minhaz23
How can one get into this field?

~~~
kthejoker2
I guess my pithy answer is I've never got tired of learning. Four
straightforward steps that you've no doubt heard before, but I can confirm
they do the trick:

Establish internal credibility. That is, the confidence to speak credibly on a
given subject, be it a platform or tool, a technique, a concept, a prediction.
Roll your sleeves up and get dirty coding. Even on-rails tutorials force your
brain to make the connection between the concepts and the technical reality.
Especially for Big Data and ML/DL workloads. Put this all on a public repo.
Search GH for relevant repos, fork them, and code walk them - especially
Python/R/Scala scripts. Compete on Kaggle, that's obvious. Answer questions on
SO, and attempt to replicate problems you find on SO yourself - this yields a
lot of benefits, as most SO questions are edge cases. Join the user
communities and help forums for popular platforms and read the newest entries
- again, you learn the most from others actually practicing in the space. And
still an extremely effective technique is to just directly search for e.g.
"Spark shuffle joins" on Google and look for real people with real opinions -
that you can then test yourself in an environment. When you've already read
the blog post or watched the YouTube video or taken the Udacity course the guy
across the table is talking about - you really establish credibility.

Teach others what you know. True trial by fire; share what you've learned.
You'll learn how to overprepare, communicate and speak plainly, connect with
those different than you in personality, behavior and skill, read rooms,
provide feedback, take criticism, and most importantly - you'll really, really
learn the ins and outs of the material.

Read voraciously. I skim-consume about 25 books a month using my company's
Safari subscription; have built up a pretty good "reading recommender" system
of Twitter users, subreddits, aggregators, blogs, etc; And not just technical
books - books on business strategy, behavioral economics and psych, industry-
specific blogs and journals - if you can't explain what you're doing in terms
of risk, dollars, or time, you're doing it wrong. (Also a good life pro tip:
download every interesting thing you read into a single repo and put a crawler
on top of them. Even if you don't know the answer, you know you've read it
somewhere and can retrieve it.)

Learn from others. Reading is great, in-person is better, mentoring is the
best. Reach out to everyone in the field. Ask them (like you just did to me)
what they're reading, what they did, ask follow up questions, share what
you're doing with them. I find keeping a list of "questions you'd like to ask"
while you're working through material (especially on industry/business) to be
invaluable when you meet someone who can potentially answer them.

These days I spent probably 15-20 hours a week just reading, learning, doing,
in prep for the 20-30 hours a week I spend educating, communicating, and
(hopefully) selling.

One thing to add: I usually am focusing on 2 things at a time, no more, no
less. If you can combine them, even better - learn Kafka for streaming and
Grafana to visualize it; learn Azure SQL DW or Redshift for distributed DW and
Spark for processing; etc.

My real evolution came when I realized I was happy being the dumbest person in
the room, and that curiosity is a superpower.

~~~
minhaz23
Wow, thank you for all that. I really appreciate the advice. I appreciate the
time you took into typing all that out.

I have some follow up questions if you don't mind:

>have built up a pretty good "reading recommender" system of Twitter users,
subreddits, aggregators, blogs, etc;

How can I do this? I follow a bunch of influential people in tech and VC last
I logged into Twitter, is this what you're talking about? One of my favorite
Twitter users is @patrickc, he always has book recommendations.

Any other tips or advice to better optimize my twitter feed?

>And not just technical books - books on business strategy, behavioral
economics and psych, industry-specific blogs and journals - if you can't
explain what you're doing in terms of risk, dollars, or time, you're doing it
wrong.

Any suggestions? Book suggestions for business strategy, behavioral economics,
and psych? I'm into these books too but sometimes it's hard to see the
concrete connection it might have to my day to day dealings.

>(Also a good life pro tip: download every interesting thing you read into a
single repo and put a crawler on top of them. Even if you don't know the
answer, you know you've read it somewhere and can retrieve it.)

Sorry, I'm not THAT technically savvy, is there a tutorial or video i can
gleam to learn this? It sounds super helpful because I do have a habit of
referring back to something I learned online because its in one of many
bookmark folders in my browser.

>These days I spent probably 15-20 hours a week just reading, learning, doing,
in prep for the 20-30 hours a week I spend educating, communicating, and
(hopefully) selling.

What are you selling exactly?

>One thing to add: I usually am focusing on 2 things at a time, no more, no
less. If you can combine them, even better - learn Kafka for streaming and
Grafana to visualize it; learn Azure SQL DW or Redshift for distributed DW and
Spark for processing; etc.

This is good advice, I think. I'm attempting it right now. By focusing on
learning java and selenium. Do you ever feel FOMO about what you're not
learning or reading though? Any way to combat that?

------
wishinghand
Graduated UC Santa Cruz in 2007, did odd-jobs until 2012. All of the following
jobs are in San Diego, CA, USA.

2008-late 2014- Odd jobs and data entry as a temp: ~$28k

Oct 2014- 1st developer job, Touch This Media: $50k, no benefits

Jan 2016- company was in trouble, $35k

July 2016- took 3 months off for a programming bootcamp, took two months after
to find a job

Jan 2017- The Control Group, $75k plus benefits, 401k, paid time off. Worked
as a full stack dev

Late 2017- DiegoDev $91k, remote, front end engineer

Early 2018- raise to $96k

~~~
minhaz23
With a degree, and dev experience, why did you decide to attend a bootcamp?

~~~
wishinghand
My degree was in literature, and my dev experience was very basic. The company
I was at before the bootcamp used git, but did not use classes, SOLID, unit
tests, some sort of CI/CD pipeline or build tools. My resume was only getting
very basic experience, so I decided to speed it up a little, especially since
I was starting my dev career at 28 or 29.

------
strikelaserclaw
I have a bachelors degree in Math & CS from a mid tier state university.

    
    
      2012 - 85k Big Co in NJ
      2013 - 90k Big Co in NJ
      2014 - 95k Big Co in NJ
      2015 - 65k Startuo in NJ
      2016 - 75k Startup in NJ
      2017 - 100k Big Co in NJ
      2018 - 100k Big Co in NJ
      2019 - 130k Big Co in Dallas
    

What i found in my experience:

    
    
      1)Interviewing is a skill in itself, do it regularly
      2)When interviewing, interview for multiple jobs so you can negotiate better
      3)There a max and a min that the company has in mind for a particular position, if they like you enough to offer you a job they will be willing to negotiate. To find out max and min, see roughly what those type of jobs offer in your area. I've found that if you are NOT working in cities in NYC, SF, Boston, then for an senior engineer (i.e 7+ years experience), the range is around 110-140. There is almost a hard cap for IC engineers in non major cities to around 150-160k.

------
Lownin
I have an associates degree in an unrelated field.

For work, I implemented and maintain part of the CI/CD pipeline (AWS Code
Pipeline configuration, pretty simple), spin up and maintain AWS
infrastructure, hack on the cloud formation templates and our internal build
scripts, and do a portion of the helpdesk admin work for some of our large
clients. Troubleshoot individual nodes. I work remotely in a small town in the
US with a relatively mid-low cost of living.

I make 67k/year. I feel like my needs are met. My work/life balance is great
as no one gives me any crap for sticking to a regular work day. I'm not
supporting a family or anything. I'm able to contribute 15% to 401k.
Otherwise, I'm not quite paycheck to paycheck, but close.

Looking at some of your salaries, I feel envious. I'm not sure my skill set
demands more but maybe it does? I don't know if I should feel underpaid. I
also don't want big heavy golden handcuffs.

~~~
tomohawk
Talk to other companies about openings and see what they offer. You don't have
to take their offers, and you can have some good conversations.

------
throwaway0x2398
From these data points/my experience, the only semi-repeatable way you'll make
$350k+ money as salary is senior FAANG employee based in the US (comp outside
the US for the same FAANG positions is usually way less), senior position in
finance in a good bonus year, or contracting working your butt off for
multiple clients

------
throwawayuk
I am a little hazy of the old figures, but they are roughly correct:

    
    
        1997 £12,500 - Visual Basic Developer - Small B2B company in South West England
        1998 £14,000 - as above
        1999 £15,000 - as above
        1999 £17,000 - as above
        2001 £14,000 (6 month contract) Visual Basic - Advertising Agency in London
        late 2001 unemployed for 6 months - dot com crash!
        2002 £21,000 Visual Basic/PHP - South England
        |
        2013 £32,000 same company, just steady salary progression
        During that period I also did some freelance Rails development. Maybe earning extra £3,000 to £8,000 each year.
        2014 £20,000 Quit full time work. Part-time Rails developer
        2015 £20,000 Part-time Rails developer
        2016 ¥6,500,000 Rails Developer - Japan
        2017 ¥6,565,000 Rails Developer - Japan
        2018 ¥6,565,000 Rails Developer - Japan

------
throwaway58264
My progression (pre-tax):

2000 - £8/h (Summer job coding)

2001 - £15/h (Summer job coding)

2002-3 - (Other job)

2004 - £160/day (Freelance)

2005-6 - £200/day (Freelance)

2007 - £275/day (Contracting, London)

2008 - £450/day (Contracting, London)

2009 - €65K (Employed, Europe)

2010-12 - £500-600/day (Freelance)

2013-14 - $100K (University, Bay Area)

2015 - $120K (University, Bay Area)

2016 - $360K (FAANG, Bay Area)

2017 - $425K (FAANG, Bay Area)

2018 - $500K (FAANG, Bay Area)

2019 - $660K (Different FAANG, Bay Area, estimated)

------
mythrowaway232
From [https://secure.ssa.gov/mySSA/start](https://secure.ssa.gov/mySSA/start)

Total income. Never received stock/RSUs/etc. All positions were more-or-less
individual contributor. Never worked in a large city.

    
    
      2000 $ 37,663 First real job (software developer)  
      2001 $ 42,164  
      2002 $ 42,561  
      2003 $ 50,567  
      2004 $ 50,001  
      2005 $ 89,541  
      2006 $100,541  
      2007 $108,299  
      2008 $114,333  
      2009 $122,458 Team lead  
      2010 $133,764  
      2011 $135,101 Went 100% remote  
      2012 $145,651  
      2013 $151,963  
      2014 $152,985  
      2015 $156,734  
      2016 $172,678 ~$50k bonus pre-tax  
      2017 $176,794 ~$60k bonus pre-tax  
      2018 $225,846 ~$80k bonus pre-tax

------
__ralston3
Thanks for sharing. My takeaway is that I'm happy to know that east coast co's
are willing to go to that $180K+ level. Would be _much_ more interested at
that level on the east coast (e.g., VA) as opposed to an AirBnB level ($250K+)
in SV.

~~~
thesausageking
Companies in NYC and Boston will go well above $200k for senior people. I'd
estimate salaries in each of those markets is only ~10-15% below SVBA.
Obviously they have much higher cost of living than VA or most other places.
Having Google, Facebook, etc. open large offices has brought up salaries a
lot.

~~~
minhaz23
How long to get to senior level?

~~~
wtfthrowaway1
it depends on what kind of growth you want and what terminal level you are
able to sit at. If you want to be an IC (individual contributor), then it many
positions in FAANG cap out around $300K unless you do crazy shit. Moving into
technical leadership (either manager or principal) is the key to the next
level.

~~~
minhaz23
What does it mean to be an IC?

How does one move into technical leadership?

------
throwaway784523
In SF Bay Area:

1999-2006 - $55k (starting) to $70kish various jobs at a startup. Began in an
implementation role, moved to software engineer

2006-2008 - $80k-$95k as a QA engineer at NetSuite

2009-20012 - $95k-$105k as a SWE at NetSuite

2012 - $110k as a SWE at an early-stage startup

2013-2014 - $120k-$140k as a SWE at a different startup

2014 - $150k as a Sr SWE at a different C-stage startup

2015 - $158k as a line manager at same startup

2016 - $170k (?) as a line manager at same startup

2017 - $190k as a manager-of-managers at same startup

2018 - $205k as department head at same startup

2019 - $220k as director of engineering at different late-stage startup

All this is base salary, excluding equity and so forth. Very recently, bonuses
have started to be a thing, so base salary is a little less relevant than it
was.

------
tastyface
Here's my fairly unusual salary progression, since we're all sharing:

• 2011 — $80k at a startup in CA, a year out of college

• 2012 — $90k, and we got acquired by an industry big fish

• 2013 — $90k, but got laid off in the middle of the year

• 2013 through 2018 — making random software, traveling, and using up my
savings; made some money, but not enough to count as "salary" in any real
sense

• 2018 — $240k ($180k base) as a senior SWE at a FAANG

Given my long stretch of being a software ronin, I didn't expect to get what I
got in 2018, but I did my research (mostly on Blind), asked for what I wanted,
and then asked for a little more on top when I realized that I was selling
myself short.

~~~
minhaz23
What is Blind?

Do you think your degree helped?

Is $240k a lot or a little as a senior SWE at a FAANG? Don't freshers hired
out of school get offered tht much?

Any advice for others?

~~~
salta2019
Blind is an anonymous messaging app where people talk about their salaries,
employers, and other topics. It’s somewhat toxic.

$240k seems in the range of normal for most of the FAANGs. Of course it can go
much higher.

It doesn’t seem like the typical new hire just out of undergrad gets that much
to start.

~~~
tastyface
Agreed that Blind is a crap community, but their numbers are more accurate
than I've seen anywhere else (including levels.fyi).

~~~
minhaz23
[https://www.teamblind.com/articles/Topics](https://www.teamblind.com/articles/Topics)

this is it? any reason for the toxicity? poor moderation?

~~~
tastyface
Yep. Anonymity is the focus, so people are more than happy to air their racist
and sexist laundry. Lots of 4chan-style garbage. In terms of career advice,
it's also very mercenary and salary-driven.

------
orky56
This is great. It would be beneficial to also see other forms of compensation
including bonus at a minimum, RSUs, etc. Sometimes a dip in salary might be
explained by these other factors, so it might tell a more complete story.

------
salaryowmew343
2008-2010: Waiter: 6£/h

2010: Intern 4$/h

2011: Intern about 6400£ after taxes for 2 months

2013: 28k/year

2014: 40k/year

2015: 55k/year (£)

2016: Contractor with full employee benefits, remote, python, startup -
$75k/year. Small bonus after the startup was bought.

2018: two remote contracts. Working 6 days a week for 12h. After taxes and all
my expenses - I live very comfortable lifestyle - I was saving for retirement
10k USD a month.

Now: 81k$/year. 9-to-5, remote, python. I live in central Europe, so I save up
about 40% for my retirement. Not sure how to invest money, most likely I'll
start my own start up and copy something from US.

My life is really great. I wouldn't trade it for 250k+ Silicon Valley job.

~~~
cpursley
> Not sure how to invest money

Low fee index funds

~~~
KaiserPro
This. virtually all "fancy" funds do worse than the Dow jones index.

~~~
softawre
You probably mean S&P index, which is what most index funds index against.

Dave Ramsey recommends mutual funds with higher fees but that consistently
beat the S&P 500. I have some money in some that I found like that, but still
probably half in index funds.

------
throwhere
18 years old: 4k$ / year (after the first year in the university, Russia)

19 years old: 7k$ / year (promotion)

20 years old: 42k€ (moved to the Netherlands, switched job)

21 years old: 50k€ (promotion)

22 years old: 70k€ (switched job, still in the Netherlands)

23 years old: 81k€ (promotion, this year)

------
bovermyer
My progression:

2004, 23: $150 NZD/day (level designer, NZ)

2007, 25: $45k (web developer, SD)

2011, 29: $62k (web developer, MN)

2013, 31: $82k (software engineer, MN)

2014, 32: $92k (s. software engineer, MN)

2015, 33: $98k (s. software engineer, MN)

2016, 34: $107k (operations manager, MN)

2017, 35: $130k (devops engineer, MN)

2018, 36: $125k (devops consultant, MN)

------
tiraloafuera123
19 - co-op while in well known lower end of 1st tier (not top 5) engr school -
16k/yr

20 - internship at big 5 consulting firm in NYC - 45k/yr (summer only)

21 - full time at same firm - 61k-ish

22-5 some small raises

26 - move to mid size well known federal gov consulting firm in DC - 76k/yr

27-28 - some raises to 86-90k

28 - smaller/mid consulting firm - 125k

28-33 - raises through to 175k

change to independent, and hourly rates, but will list the following as
yearly; however from this point, I have to pay my own taxes, insurance,
retirement, etc. still better off however, as taxes are lower compared to
salary/employee, and rates are higher.

34 - 200k

35 - 260k

36 - 265k

37 - 280k

38 - 300k

39 - 285k

40 - 280k

Last couple years are the same rate, but working fewer hours to enjoy work-
life balance.

~~~
iends
How do you make the leap to consulting? Any special skills allowing that rate?

~~~
tiraloafuera123
How did I? or how does one? ;-)

I feel I got lucky in a way. Along the way I met one small company owner that
I worked with on project to bring in some of their developers onto my team. A
few years later they were looking for a contractor. Right at that time another
coworker bluntly told me that I was way undervalued and literally gave me an
hourly rate that they felt I could easily ask for. I asked for even a little
more ;-) And got it!

The work is _exactly_ the same. Again, lucky. The logistics of starting the
company can be facilitated with a good tax professional/accountant. The
majority of that is paperwork.

The technical skills are a combination of deep expertise in both front end and
back end, which is kind of rare in government contracting, plus the big 5
consulting background, which gives you credibility, plus being honest about
what you know and dont know. Believe it or not, honesty goes a long way. It's
your personal brand, after all.

------
nonayralas
Entry ones are harder to remember, but here goes. Leaving company names out
since they're mostly small and it would be obvious who I am. Numbers are
mostly approximate.

    
    
      19 - ~$20/hr Doing remote web dev for my college in WV.
      21 - $60k Doing GTK/C for avionics place in Milwaukee
      22 - ~$25k Went back to school, MS in Computer Vision, worked as TA/RA
      24 - $68k C++, small science software company near Boston
      25 - $78k same company
      26 - $92k Jumped to mid stage startup (still Boston doing integration of machine learning algorithms (Python/Matlab)
      27 - $100k
      28 - $115k (promoted to Data Scientist)
      29 - $125k
      30 - $136k started leading small team of analytics developers
      31 - $145k started leading both teams of analytics developers and data scientists, also started working remotely from a midwest state.
      32 - $155k
    

Seeing some of these salaries for remote developers for SV companies makes me
wonder if maybe that's the ticket. Do they really just not adjust based on
location? My mid term goal is to be able to save up enough to give a few years
runway to do whatever. It's tough to fathom moving on though because I really
do like the area my current company is in.

EDIT- formatting

------
hamaluik
My numbers: I have a BSc and MSc in mechanical engineering but never found a
job in that field where I want/need to live, so fell back to software dev.
Amounts in Canadian rupees before tax (I pay an average ~25% of my gross
income as income tax)

2011 - $21k/yr grad student scholarship

2015 - $55k/yr startup that died in ~6mo

2016 - $60k/yr contract at a university

2017 - $72k/yr + pension as manager + developer at said university

2018 - $90k/yr startup, software dev morphing into architect / product lead

------
mmriis
Crazy saleries in the bay area compared to EU. How many hours do you guys
work?

------
aoeuhtns
My progression (total comp):

    
    
      India:
      2010 - $7k
      2011 - $8k
      2012 - $10k
    
      2013 - degree
      2014 - degree
    
      US SF Bay Area:
      2015 - $110k - Sales engg
      2016 - $125k - SWE / Devops
      2017 - $150k - Senior SWE / Devops
    
      Changed companies
      2017 - $200k - Senior SWE / Devops
    
      Changed companies
      2018 - $240k - Devops / SWE (FAANG-like)

------
saryant
\- 2012: $60k and a Big 4 consultancy

\- 2013: $65k, first employee at a startup

\- 2014: $70k

\- 2015: $130k, SWE1 at Twitter

\- 2016: $155k, SWE2 at Twitter

\- 2017: $180k

\- 2018: $222k, Senior SWE

\- 2019: $280k

BS from a relatively unknown college. Working out of the Colorado office.

------
vonmoltke
My abbreviated progression (by company):

2002 - 2012: $55,770 + ~3% => $85,000 + ~3% (EE to SysE, Dallas)

2012 - 2016: $78,000 => $95,000 (Senior SWE, Dallas)

2016 - 2018: $160,000 + $20,000 => $166,000 + $26,000 (Senior SWE, NYC)

2018: $180,000 + 20% + $15,000 (Team lead, aborted after five months, NYC)

2019: $180,000 + 20% + $112,500 (Senior SWE, working towards Staff soon, NYC)

I used to have a more detailed history, but I seem to have lost it.

------
tmpsalaryacct
2014: $0 - Dropped out of school

2015: $45k - Freelance

2016: $75k - First big boy job

2017: $90k - Second job

2017: $110k

2017: $125k

2018: $135k - Third job

2019: $155k - Fourth job

2017 was a trainwreck. All positions are generalist (mobile, full stack,
devops, design, etc.) because company sizes have been tiny. Figures do not
include stock or bonuses because that number is pretty much zero.

I live in a major metro area and feel massively undervalued but I don't want
to sell out to BigCo

------
jypepin
A spreadsheet was created last year with french salaries of startups, it's
pretty informative.

[https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Zjvz-
Ud2TR3rco2BTq0X...](https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Zjvz-
Ud2TR3rco2BTq0X0Ovr29ohASCRiAATwmAX5YY/edit#gid=1145296357)

------
throwaway12315
Here's another take. CS degree from a top university, spent my entire
childhood doing Linux and Windows stuff. I only started taking my career
seriously over the past 7 years or so. I'm in the Bay Area.

2012-2015: $100k, sysadmin 2015-2017: $100-150k, random projects 2017-2019:
$150k, devops 2019: $200k, devops manager

I've only started to develop some level of self discipline in the past few
years. Before then, I wasn't even working 40 hours a week. I'd have some brief
bursts of productivity where I'd automate something or crank out a project
really quickly, but most of the time I was messing around with new
technologies.

Given what I'm seeing here, I think I'm going to start looking at working for
a FAANG. It's always been my intention to retire early, and I could probably
operate at burnout levels of productivity for a few years in exchange for
being able to finish funding that plan.

------
jimbobimbo
This is such an odd survey, especially when framed as "White people especially
need to talk about their salaries because marginalized folks in the same
fields often have no idea they're being swindled by employers."

How knowledge of me making $X helps anyone? If you think that you're
underpaid, the only thing that will make difference is a competing offer.
Reducing experience, amount of work, kind of work and value to the
organization, to just 2 variables - race and number - won't make any
difference.

Instead:

1\. Know your local job market. 2\. Make sure you're working on right things.
3\. Be a team player. 4\. Make your bosses happy (usually that goes hand-in-
hand with working on right things and being a team player).

I made good last year, but it's because I happened to be at the right time in
the right place, and put a lot of hours of work. Would putting a number and my
race on that give you any insight into that?

~~~
stuxnet79
> Would putting a number and my race on that give you any insight into that?

I believe your analysis is unfairly reductionist and doesn't really capture
the spirit of the tweet. If I was asking you for advice about salary, I'd
definitely be interested in everything you mentioned, what your skills are,
how you got to your current position etc. The issue is that marginalized
groups often find it hard to advocate for themselves because of issues of
perception and also they lack the knowledge required to properly negotiate.
It's hard to know what numbers to throw out when you don't even have a range
or you don't know what the social protocols / customs are regarding
negotiation.

The point of sharing isn't to trivialize your hard work but it's to help
people who are just as qualified and talented as you not fall through the
cracks.

~~~
jimbobimbo
Software development is a huge professional field, with people doing all sorts
of things, in all kinds of companies. A bunch of numbers pulled off of the
international forum (HN) with such variability in job descriptions and levels,
is just that - a bunch of numbers.

I want to be helpful, but simply throwing the number around is not it.

~~~
jimbobimbo
FWIW, the most useful link from the original discussion on Twitter:
[https://twitter.com/KeirstenBrager/status/109436626260242022...](https://twitter.com/KeirstenBrager/status/1094366262602420226)

------
jamisteven
2004-2008 > 45k - Tech consulting fixing spyware etc

2008-2010 > 80k - SEO / Bartending weekends 50/50 split

2010-2012 > 55k - Building servers for DC's

2012-2013 > 60k - Helpdesk Support - Law firm

2013-2015 > 65k - Cisco VoIP tech - TekSystems

2015-2018 > 70k - Electronic Trading Support - Bank

2018-Now > 110k - Same as above - Different country same company

------
jmchuster
Software engineer

    
    
      Year) Salary - Bonus - Company
       1)  50k - 10%  - Company 1 - small private tech consulting firm (NYC)
       2)  60k - 10%  - Company 1 (NoVa)
       3)  70k - 15%  - Company 1
       4)  80k - 15%  - Company 1
       5)  90k - 15%  - Company 1
       6) 100k - 15%  - Company 1
       7) 105k - 15%  - Company 1
       8) 135k - 15%  - Company 2 - series C startup, sales software (SF)
       9)  25k -  0%  - Company 3 - seed round, business tools, co-founder (SF)
      10)  60k -  0%  - Company 3
      11) 160k - 10%* - Company 4 - series A startup, transportation, acquired a year before (peninsula)
      12) 180k - 15%* - Company 4
      13) 220k - 25%  - Company 5 - series D startup, fintech, acquired a year before (peninsula)
    

*Actual bonus payout was about a quarter of it

~~~
BadassFractal
After reading all of the other posts here I'm shocked you're not making 2M at
line 13. I don't know if there's a bias for the ultra-high earners to post
their income here, albeit anonymously, skewing the perception of what's
normal.

------
QuickBrownCat
I'm a bit late to the party but I can't help but feel overwhelmed by the huge
salaries everyone is making. Congrats to everyone!

2006 - 2014: €16k

2014 - 2017: €21k

2017 - now : €40k

These are gross salaries. I work in Portugal (36yo). I did web development up
until 2016 in agencies/consultancies. Now I'm working for a startup.

------
keithnz
I made a decision somewhere in my career after working at some big and small
companies is that I really like the small company vibe, you get involved with
many aspects of the business and have a lot more freedom to set technical
direction. I also noticed a weird effect in a number of bigger businesses
where money wasn't as much as a problem and as a result people tended to
innovate less.

But I always feel, given my broad old school / new school skillset built up
over decades, I could do better elsewhere moneywise.

Theoretically it would be better for me to start my own business, but where I
am I get to concentrate on product creation and solving a broad range of
technical problems which is super fun!

------
charleshan
It would be interesting to see something similar from someone that worked in
SV for 10+ years.

~~~
alaskamiller
Grew up in Silicon Valley:

1998-2002 High school, Barista, Subways, $7/hr 2003-2007 USMC, $25k/yr
2007-2008 Apple, knowledge manager, $50k/yr 2008-2009 Gawker, BusinessInsider,
writer, $30k/yr 2010-2011 SF startup, marketer, $55k/yr 2012-2013 Google, HR
admin, $60k/yr 2013-2015 Berkeley startup, tech lead, $80k/yr 2015-2017
Started own consultanty agency, $50k/yr 2018-2019 Digital agency, PM, $100k/yr

~~~
minhaz23
you've had a wide variety of positions. how did you manage all that? did you
educate yourself before interviewing at companies or was the purpose to have a
wide breadth of knowledge so you purposefully sought out a variety of
positions?

------
easyease
Here's my antidote to the astronomical salaries posted here:

2012-2014: 25k USD graduated, teach English in Japan

2014: 30k Join startup. Fails.

2015-2017: 25k Back to teaching

2018: 40k try my hand at IT again. Fail.

2019: 30k teaching once again.

If you're worried about your 70k tech salary realise things could be a
helluvalot worse.

------
throwaway3567

      Age  Salary  Job  Title
      ---  ------  ---  -----
      16   ~$10k   1    Software Developer (MI)
      17   ~$10k
      18   ~$10k
      19   ~$10k   2    Research Assistant (MI)
      20   ~$15k   3    Software Engineer Intern (MI)
      21    $35k        Software Engineer
      22    $35k
      23    $45k
      24    $70k   4    Software Engineer (MI)
      25   $130k   5    Senior Software Engineer (Seattle, WA)
      26   $160k        Principal Software Engineer
      27   $165k
    

The ones beginning with "~" were part time jobs that paid hourly. None of the
jobs offered bonuses or stock.

~~~
tasuki
I appreciate you took the time to right-align the salary numbers!

------
ryanstorm
Here's mine. I graduated school in 2013 with a degree in Mechanical
Engineering, but at the time of graduation I already knew I wanted to actually
work in software.

Year - Age - Total Income - Role

2014 - 23 - 36k - Test Technician in Santa Barbara, CA

2015 - 24 - 40k - Test Technician in Santa Barbara, CA

2016 - 25 - 46k - Finally made the switch to software, worked for a couple
different startups in Portland, OR.

2017 - 26 - 38k - Full-stack Developer for couple more startups while I honed
my skills

2018 - 27 - 87k - Landed a contract with a large apparel company

2019 - 28 - 111k - Converted to full-time with large apparel company. Senior
Software Engineer.

------
web007
I've traded $ for time twice so far, and overall I'm okay with that.

    
    
      1999 23k first full-time job, hourly, Maryland
      2000 25k
      2001 28k
      2002 30k
      2003 34k
      2004 36k
      2005 39k promoted to salaried position
      2006 76k moved to Silicon Valley as SWE, Mountain View
      2007 88k
      2008 106k company bought
      2009 158k residual stock
      2010 153k new gig in RWC
      2011 133k
      2012 149k new gig in Mountain View
      2013 146k
      2014 137k
      2015 168k company bought, new gig in SF
      2016 181k
      2017 165k new gig in Santa Clara
      2018 161k

------
Applejinx
Point of contrast:

I'm Chris from Airwindows. I develop audio software and in recent years, give
all of it away for free and as MIT-licensed open source. I've recently been
cited by name in the New York Times in an op-ed about a subject I pioneered.
I've recently worked out a method for dithering to floating point mantissas
and released the code under Unlicense (public domain) after refining and
improving the code in public discussion with Alexey Lukin of iZotope. This is
the (very much a game of diminishing returns, mind you) cutting edge of
digital audio R&D and I got the last word: mind you, I had to, because I
release open source and Lukin's suggestions though brief were not being
accompanied by licensing, making verbatim use of his code legally problematic.
Because of what I do for a living and the knock-on effect of people reusing my
code in the expectation that they can do that safely, I'm compelled to take
that very seriously.

I make $15,204 a year.

I think there is no correlation between capital and any kind of merit, value,
or even basic function. At this point, nothing you do no matter how useful or
significant will change your financial position so it becomes an entirely
separate issue from 'what work can you do' or 'what do you love'. I expect to
die, not soon thank goodness, from issues related to poverty.

Until that time, I get to be Chris from Airwindows, and I'll be able to
continue to do these things I care about. On the other hand, if I hadn't
scratched my way up to $15,204 by now I never would, and I'd be trying to do
the same work (as I'd have many of the same thoughts and ideas) out of a
shopping cart and dying much sooner still.

The really interesting thing is how most of my Patreon (that's the mechanism,
while it lasts: then I die) is composed of people in roughly my wealth
position. It appears there is a class interest: if you as a very wealthy open
source advocate can use my code (as the 'idea making' class) you'll do so
happily, but as soon as you learn I make $15,204 a year, this becomes a
compelling argument for not sending any of your wealth out of your class into
a lower, less worthy class that should not have wealth. That's how it works
out in practice. I think the mental model there is, if my financial position
had merit, it would have far more money, therefore giving it more money would
only lead to things like me making physical stuff and giving it away (or
distributing it at cost to other poor people) thus wasting it or actively
sabotaging the wealthier class by giving resources to a poor class.

And this would indeed be what I would do :D

And so these discussions must be viewed in terms of class interests, sometimes
quite consciously expressed.

(note: Vermont resident, not a metro area)

------
jyriand
It's interesting that in U.S and probably in other countries people talk about
their annual salaries. Where I live we talk about our monthly salaries after
all taxes have been deducted. So when I look at his last number $189,000, how
can I convert it to actual monthly income(or are Americans payed/paid two
times a month?). Probably I have to deduct income tax and health insurance,
right? And there is also this 401k. Or are there any other hidden taxes that
workers in U.S. have to take into consideration?

------
jabloczko
I'll post mine because I know there are other juniours reading this who feel
like shit when they read how much other people are making. All cash
denominated in CAD. I have no degree for what it is worth.

\- 2017: Internship, $3k /month

\- 2018: Sysadmin, 70k/year

\- 2019: Raise, but no promotion, 82.5k/year

I tried to interview in January for some software dev positions, but failed on
the coding portion of the interviews. I'm studying hard to learn to program
and hopefully by the end of the year I'll be able to interview for some $100k
jobs.

------
KallDrexx
In Orlando, Florida except for my first job. All values are essentially total
compensation since any stock I have gotten from any of these companies has had
zero value.

2007 - $42k Junior Game Designer in Australia

2008-2012 - $45k-$55k (QA Programming Lead)

2012 - $70k Software Engineer at a new company

2013 - $80k Software Engineer raise at same company

2014 - $90k Promoted to Software Development Manager at same company

2015 - $95k Software Engineer at a new company

2015 part 2 - $140k via freelancing

2016 - $70k First employee at startup I helped start

2017-2018 - $80k Raise at startup

2019 - $155k Remote for engineering team that used to be based in Boston.

------
tbrownaw
Wow y'all have some crazy high numbers.

Memphis TN (on the low end of the US cost-of-living scale), all at the same
place.

Early 2007 (right out of college): ~$48k (hourly equiv., contractor)

Late 2007: $51k (salary, "real colleague")

...(no notes... IIRC there were like 2 promotions in there, a couple percent
standard raise the other years)...

2013: $81k

...

2017: $96k (promotion / transfer)

I also _started_ with 4 weeks PTO (up to a hair over 6 now), which I hear is a
fair bit higher than usual. OTOH it's a privately held company, which means
there's no such thing as stock options.

------
cody8295
East coast but not big city:

2018: $49k (first SE job) 2019: $52k (first raise!)

~~~
souprock
Aside from the year, that is so similar to my first SE job:

East coast but not big city: 1999 $48k, 2000 $52k

I suppose inflation has been mild. Showing up in the height of the Y2K/web
frenzy sure helped. I got myself a nice embedded RTOS kernel developer job
before even finishing my degree. Meanwhile, everybody else was running off to
invent web development or repair COBOL.

People graduating just a couple years later slammed into a dead market.

~~~
pedrosorio
> I suppose inflation has been mild.

True, but 20 years is 20 years. 50k in 1999 corresponds to 75k in 2019.

[http://www.in2013dollars.com/us/inflation/1999?amount=50000](http://www.in2013dollars.com/us/inflation/1999?amount=50000)

------
tatami
I thought I knew that some people make up to 250k, but some posts here are
jaw-dropping.

Just to share my part, all in (South)West Germany and in EUR as software dev:

2014: 28k

2017: 33k (raise)

2017: 40k (new job)

2018: 46k (raise)

------
bluepirate
IT Security, Established company, East Coast, remote 80%, $ in USD.

2011 - Graduated B.S. Info Assurance, 55k, Security engineer

2012 - New company, 65K + 5k bonus, SOC analyst

2013 - Same company, 75k +10k bonus, SOC lead

2014 - Same company, 100k + 10k bonus, same position (sabbatical for 1 yr)

2015 - Same company, 125k + 12k bonus, SOC manager

2016 - Same company, 135k +12k bonus, same position

2017 - Same company, 145k +15k bonus, same position

2018 - Same company, 172k +20k bonus, promoted

------
loblollyboy
2011-2012 Epic in Madison, WI 60k

2012-13 unemployed

2013-15 grad school position ~1200/mo 20hr a week python developer

15-16 unemployed

2016-2018 29k GBP in London, python dev

First half of 2018 65k usd in DC

Second half unemployed

2019 50k IT staff

I’M SUCH A FUCKUP

~~~
tvphan
You've managed to live in different cities for work, e.g. Madison, London, DC!
That means you've gained invaluable life experience. I'm pretty jealous of
that TBH.

------
jdavis703
Baltimore-Washington Metropolitan Area

2012 - $55k software engineer out of college at a Series B startup

San Francisco Bay Area

2013 - $95k software engineer at same Series B startup

2014 - $120k software software engineer at new Series C startup

2015 - $130k full stack engineer at new Series B startup

2016 - Minor CoLA increase

2017 - Minor CoLA increase

2018 - $140k lead frontend engineer at angel, friends and family round startup

2019 - $150k pay increase at same startup after raising seed round

Edit for formatting.

------
perlperson
"The winner is the one who gives the most away." \-- Larry Wall

Perl bookends the career of the author of this article, so respect pls

------
ergocoder
I never understand why we look at salary only.

My experience in tech companies in Bay Area. The stock is a huge part of the
income, and, as we move up the ladder, the income is skewed toward stock
heavily.

Then, we misleadingly report only salary like this director of Facebook makes
$300K a year. No, they probably make like 10 millions a year with stock.

~~~
gortok
At least in the non SV tech companies, stock and bonuses don’t matter as much.
In large companies that is different, of course; but most developers don’t
work for large tech companies.

------
sailfast
To the author: were any of these cleared positions? Typically those command a
premium and require some sacrifice as it applies to personal lifestyle
choices. CACI often requires clearances for government clients, for example
which is why you might see a drop when moving to Motley Fool (a commercial
customer)

~~~
souprock
It's only a sacrifice if you'd actually want to do things that would raise
concern.

On the other hand, it is a huge benefit if you'd rather not be surrounded by
people with those kinds of concerns. It's nice to know that none of your
coworkers are likely to steal your stuff, commit acts of violence upon you,
spill fentanyl on your desk, embezzle the company's assets, offer you food
items with unmentioned unconventional ingredients, or do anything other than
be calm and level-headed.

~~~
opportune
Those are pretty extreme. For me and probably 90% of other devs who don't want
to get a security clearance, it's because of prior drug use. I don't even do
anything like that other than smoke weed these days (which I would easily quit
if I needed to for a job, though I still think that's very outdated BS) but
the government seems really scared about people who've even previously used
drugs.

No, I'm not going to spill fentanyl, weed, or any other drug on your desk and
I'm also not going to lie during the clearance process to say that I've smoked
weed less than 50 times in my life - but apparently that means I can't get a
clearance.

~~~
tiraloafuera123
it's not the drug use that is the problem. a lot of the time it is about
honesty. If you try to hide anything on clearance paperwork, and they find it
(they always find stuff), that's immediate disqualification.

there are people with all kinds of backgrounds, and some with drug use in
their background, with active clearances. it's not automatic any more. just be
100% honest.

the adjudicator needs to make a determination of whether they think you could
be compromised in some way. just because someone smoked weed in college or got
a DUI once doesn't mean they can be compromised.

~~~
sailfast
Meta, but I wanted to say congrats on your throwaway name. Nicely chosen.

------
robohydrate
South Florida (Fort Lauderdale)

2013 - $45k - test engineer

2014 - $50k - raise

2014 - $82k - new company, switched to software engineering

2015 - $89k - raise + adjustment for finishing masters degree

2016 - $94k - raise + promotion

2017 - $98k - raise

2018 - $105k + $15k RSU - raise + company wide adjustment, also first time
given RSU bonus

I'm fairly happy with my progression, plan to stay at the current company for
the forseeable future.

------
nie100sowny
In Poland, we have a great online forum with a dedicated topic for salaries.

[https://4programmers.net/Forum/Kariera/233131-ile_zarabiacie](https://4programmers.net/Forum/Kariera/233131-ile_zarabiacie)

Do you know similar places for the global market?

------
n_u_thraway
My progression is probably more on the unusual side. Not amazing compared to
folks with 1m+, but I feel I did the best so far with the cards given to me.

2006 - $6k - system administrator

2008 - $14k - webdev

2009 - $18k - webdev

2010 - $32k - swe1, enterprise

2012 - $48k - swe2, same place

2015 - $135k - swe2, relocation

2017 - $150k - swe2

2018 - $200k - swe4 (bigger enterprise)

------
salarythrow0
Sharing my numbers (all numbers include bonus and liquid stock). I graduated
with a degree in computer science. All are in the bay area, all are Android
development.

2016 - $110k + $10k sign on = $120k @ BigCo

2017 - $125k @ Startup

2018 - $155k @ Same Startup

2019 - $225k + $50k sign on = $275k @ BigCo

------
minikomi
As someone working in Japan paid around or below most of your junior
salaries.. oof.

~~~
onion2k
Same goes for the UK if you're not in London.

I'm not in London. :/

------
aripickar
Full disclosure: Im in college right now.

2015: $1.43 per hour (camp counselor) 2016: $12 per hour (Data strategy
Intern, NY) 2017: $23.25 per hour (SWE Intern, OR) 2018: $48.75 per hour (SWE
Intern, SF) 2019: ~$160K per year (SWE NY)

~~~
tiraloafuera123
congrats! you are on a great track. after doing this so many years, the higher
you start out, the higher it goes later

------
wbuacuvyyvcf
SWE, based out of Southern Ontario, postgraduate degree, Asian male immigrant,
all in CAD

2014 $72K junior, a startup in Kitchener

2016 $75K mid-level, same startup

2017 $100K mid to senior level, a startup in Toronto

2018 $108K senior, same startup

2019 $145K senior, another startup in Toronto

------
0wl3x
2016 - Graduated college with CS degree, startup job @ 75k, 1%

2017 - startup shit out, went to 1 company, 85k a year, left that company
(really bad situation), second company 100k a year

2018, 115k (same company promoted me)

2019, 150k switched to a FAANG

------
alkibiades
My progression

Year 1: 230(130+ 40 signing + 40 stock + 20 annual bonus)

Year 2: 265(135 + 50 signing + 50 stock + 30 annual bonus)

switched companies between year 1 and 2. expect total comp to go down next
year but do expect refreshers

------
bizzle1
Europe edition here:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19398192](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19398192)

------
throwaway91039
Throwaway but thought I wanted to share:

BS in UX-related & MBA

2003 BS

2007 65k* (UX @ public)

2008 80k* (UX @ public)

2010 MBA

2012 110k* (Product @ seed startup)

2012 80k* (Product in competitive industry @ funded startup)

2013 0* (Startup @ self)

2015 105k* (Product @ funded startup)

2016 115k (Promotion @ funded startup)

2017 135k* (Solution Architect/remote @ public)

2018 138k

*New job

------
cyrilbenson47
Damn! Right now, I'm making $24k as a Full Stack Developer (remote) for a US
company with 10yrs. of experience. Now I believe that I'm way underpaid.

------
lemper
2016 3000 usd per annum as an it dude. 2017 3500 usd per annum as an it dude.
2018 3500 usd per annum as an it dude. 2019 4000 usd per annum as an it dude.

------
throwaway348418
Throwing myself in the pool here.

My salary progression in SF while working at small/medium-sized startups.

No college degree.

All base.

In my early 20s, 2014 - 105k, SWE

2015 - 110k, SWE

2016 - 115k, SWE

Now my mid 20s, 2017 - 130k, Senior SWE

2018 - 135k, Senior SWE

2019 - 145k, Senior SWE

------
bluedevilzn
Late 2017 - $120k - Amazon Canada 2019 - $200k - Google Canada

If I decided to go to US, I'd make a lot more money in both cases.

------
salaryaway__
24 years as a dev (estimated - can’t remember all these ...)

Mostly SFBayArea...

1995 - 30k (startup)

1996 - 40k

1997 - 60k

1998 - 100k (consulting)

1999 - 120k

2000 - 150k

2001 - 80k (dotcom crash)

2002 - 80k

2003 - 120k (bank)

2004 - 125k

2005 - 90k (startup)

2006 - 125k

2007 - 140k

2008 - 125k

2009 - 140k

2010 - 150k

2011 - 165k

2012 - 150k (contracting)

2013 - 125k

2014 - 1M (startup sold)

2015 - 60k (startup)

2016 - 100k

2017 - 150k

2018 - 500k Eng mgr

2019 - 600k expected

~~~
burlesona
Working as an eng manager where?

------
ozzyman700
pre grad here: 2015:13/hr general purpose it intern (wpf & sql dev, help desk)
2016:15/hr sysadmin intern (wrote bash scripts all day) 2017:15/hr college
help desk 2018:25/hr intern (Python, Angular)

------
megalomanu
My salary progression in Paris:

\- 2009: 35K - software engineer

\- 2010: 37K - software engineer

\- 2011: 39K - software engineer

\- 2012: 41K - software engineer

\- 2013: 47K - software engineer

\- 2014: 50K - software engineer

\- 2015: 55K - software engineer

\- 2016/2017: 35K - unemployment system salary, while I was an entrepreneur

\- 2018: 65K - senior software engineer

\- 2019: ? (I'm now a manager)

\-----

Some thoughts:

\- my salary is very low compared to some mentioned in this thread, and yet I
don't have the impression to be underpaid, in comparison to other engineers in
Paris, and of course, in comparison to other French people. I'm the best paid
among my Parisian friends (and probably among all those who where within my
school class in high school, when I lived in a small French city, where
2000€/month is already great) Of course, I could do a lot more but before this
year I wasn't a manager. To earn more as a software engineer without
leadership responsibilities, you have to be part of the bests. Not my case I
think.

\- I feel it's very hard to exceed 90/100K. I know a few VP at 120K/130K but
it's an elite. It's even hard for them to find a job position.

\- retrospectively, the tech job market in Paris was very depressing before
2011. No start-ups (so no equity), very few tech companies, low salaries. I've
been hired at a low 35K, as almost all the fellows from my engineering school.
Today, an engineer in Paris started at 40 and is at 50 in two years.

\- sometimes, I regret that all my "VIE" contracts (a program that allows
french people to go work in French companies abroad) collapsed in the month of
January 2009, just after the beginning of the financial crisis... But it would
have been to work for the Societe Generale in New-York or for Safran in
Houston, not for Google or Facebook. And I wouldn't have met my wife, so
really no regrets.

\- I also admit that in my first years in Paris, I was almost more in bars and
movie theaters than in an office. Maybe it'd have been different if there was
already a startup scene at this time.

\- the start-up when I worked today tried often to hire foreign engineers.
Everyone is generally very excited to come work in Paris, but has difficulties
to get past the salary barrier. In these moments, I have to be the best
advocate for the French health and unemployment system, which is great but,
let's be honest, doesn't replace the crazy salaries I see on this thread. I
like our system mostly because it helps my grand-mothers to live in a decent
way, but if I was alone here, without a sense of solidarity, and without the
desire to make my life here, I'd think it's a waste.

\- in 2016-2017, I was an entrepreneur. It's been tough and it's been a
failure (not a big failure, but still a failure). But thanks to the
unemployment system, I was paid around 35K/year.

------
castratikron
Wow, from IT Admin to VP of Software in 8 years is very impressive.

~~~
gortok
It was a startup; so being VP of Software didn't feel that impressive, but
thank you. I built the mobile app, firmware, the deployment pipeline for the
site, etc. Since [Jewelbots was open
source]([https://github.com/jewelbots](https://github.com/jewelbots)),
everything we did was on Github. Although if you want to see the firmware, you
have to dive in deeper on the Arduino side to see it (Jewelbots firmware repo
itself is not in the open; though I have no special insight as to why that
is).

------
webaholic
Senior Engineer (EE) in SV: 130,000 base, 25K RSU

------
fhbdukfrh
I'd have liked to read this but the giant popup ad literally covered the
entire screen of my phone. Guess you still get my click for monetization...

------
smnplk
2017: 0$ 2018: 0$

------
p03141519
total comp, C++, white, male:

2018 $197,000 boston

2017 $155,000 boston

2016 $140,000 boston

2015 $64,000 my startup

2014 $137,000 nyc

2013 $117,000 nyc

2012 $99,000 nyc

------
rootsudo
34K.

45K.

74k.

116k.

------
ousta
"Privilege is a large part of the equation; the privilege to not care; the
privilege to be a white dude in an industry that (either intentionally or
unintentionally) caters to white dudes. Yes, this reflects playing the game on
easy mode. I have no doubts there. I’m writing that it’s not enough because I
am too privileged to be able to see what non-white dudes should do. So if
you’re a white dude reading this, make it better for everyone by not being
cheap on compensation (and recognize any potential bias or privilege you may
have)."

\- what a cringy statement. an industry that caters to white dudes. literaly
the CEO of the biggest software company name on earth is an indian. the CEO of
one of the top chipmakers on earth is an asian woman and a big chunk of
engineers are from china and india but ok whatever. what does the end of the
statement means? if you are not white you can be cheap on compensation?

------
expertentipp
This is very American centric. Whites in Europe are lucky to earn half that on
architect positions (please don’t come up with „standard of living” and
„social services and benefits”).

~~~
vecinu
Don't forget that this is before taxes, retirement savings, healthcare and
other deductions.

You can't just hand-wave away "standard of living" and "social services and
benefits".

These may be things you take for granted but a large majority of the
population has to have a large emergency refund in case they get severed from
their company without any notice for any reason (Compare that with job
security in France or Germany).

Consider you need to save a ton of money yourself in government sponsored
accounts such as HSA or FSAs for future healthcare expenses that you can't
possibly estimate when you're 20 years old. (Compare that with the NHS in
England).

Consider you need to sock away a ton of money in 401ks and IRAs so that when
you're 50 with no job prospects, you don't end up on the street and can
actually have a decent retirement. Nobody is paying serious pensions and
hardly anyone can survive on social security. (Compare that with the savings
pillars in Switzerland).

Now considering all this, you still think his salary is HUGE compared to a
Western European one? I highly doubt it, I have already run the numbers
myself.

~~~
falsedan
The biggest thing I missed when working in the US was 5-6 weeks annual paid
leave. 10 days off/year means people are highly incentivised to apply
to/present at conferences tho

~~~
aristophenes
Was that normal? I'm used to 10 company holidays plus 3-4 weeks of paid
vacation.

~~~
falsedan
It’s the standard, some big companies offer a bit more

------
anth_anm
Worked for 5 years at big tech.

Never made it above 180.

sigh.

------
smoyer
Just blacklisted your site at the corporate firewall ... your pop-up ads are
not omay for our 200k users.

