

The Daily WTF maliciously infringes Programming Praxis trademark - igorhvr
http://programmingpraxis.com/2009/08/13/the-daily-wtf-maliciously-infringes-programming-praxis-trademark

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johns
Anecdotally, shortly after The Daily WTF gained popularity I emailed Alex to
suggest starting a sister site for non-programming IT related WTFs and he
tried to poo poo the idea saying he didn't think it would have enough content,
etc. Without support of the Daily WTF, it was a lost cause so I gave up on it.
Shortly thereafter, he started a section on the Daily WTF site for non-
programming stories.

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ajg1977
Since "Programming Praxis" is not a registered trademark then it would likely
be a long and costly battle to legally force The Daily WTF to cease using it.
(Common Law trademarks do have rights, but it's not nearly as clear cut).

That said, if the emails are accurate I do think The Daily WTF is behaving
incredibly poorly and they've just lost this reader.

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micks56
Trademark rights arise once the mark is used to identify goods in the stream
of commerce.

Registration gets you two things: 1\. The scope of your mark applies beyond
your geographical area. 2\. Registration on principal register is constructive
notice to the nation. It creates nationwide coverage and removes defenses of
good faith and lack of knowledge.

If "Programming Praxis" is not registered, then Daily WTF can asset good faith
and lack of knowledge defenses. I don't think that the geographical limitation
issue has much weight on the internet. Those would be the only differences.

Registration also puts a nice, convenient stake in the ground of who was there
first. I don't think that will be an issue here.

~~~
cruise02
I think the prior agreement between The Daily WTF and Programming Praxis would
make a lack of knowledge defense difficult.

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tlrobinson
Alex seems to have some reading comprehension problems. In nearly every email
Phil mentions his desire to keep his blog as separate...

"You and I have similar objectives: you want to extend your already-successful
brand by offering something new to your readers, I want to grow my new blog."

"I like the idea of having a Programming Praxis sub-section on TDWTF, and I
also want to keep my blog at programmingpraxis.com."

"May I ask a favor? Can you please include somewhere in the text of the
exercise a link to my blog?"

"First, programmingpraxis.com will continue to exist in roughly its current
form, as a stand-alone web site with two exercises per week, no matter what
happens with Programming Praxis exercises at TheDailyWTF."

"Regarding linking: If Programming Praxis is going to become a regular weekly
feature on TheDailyWTF, with at least some original content, I don’t see the
problem with putting a link to programmingpraxis.com somewhere obvious."

Alex constantly ignores this until the end when he says:

"I don’t want to come across as abrasive or inconsiderate, but we started this
conversation on the premise of joining forces, and I’ve reiterated that intent
several times. My understanding has been that, if our test(s) proved
successful, then we’d combine blogs; if not, then you’d continue with your
blog, and I would continue with mine."

~~~
jcl
And if he was operating under the assumption that the first few articles were
just "tests" (as he refers to them repeatedly), why is it suddenly so hard to
change the name of the section?

According to the e-mail log, he introduced the new "programming praxis"
section name mere days after Phil asked him to stop using the term. That
strikes me as needlessly antagonistic. He could have avoided the whole issue
by simply picking a different name at that point, but he instead chose the one
name that would sabotage the work of his former collaborator.

While I'm sure TDWTF will triumph legally, I can't help think that the
incident will influence their relations with any future collaborators.

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anigbrowl
The argument from TDWTF that 'it's too late to change it now' is pretty much
an admission of guilt. Lawyer up, spend a few hundred on a C&D and then
register your TM.

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CodeMage
It's astonishing to see how many comments on the blog are not only hostile,
but rude and hateful. I guess I'm naive and overly optimistic, but it always
surprises me to see the Greater Internet Fuckwad Theory [1] proven in
practice...

[1] <http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2004/03/19/>

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ErrantX
Alex is quickly (rightly or wrongly) coming off as a "bit of a dick" in this.
On the Internet you can live or die on your reputation - right. Surely the
logical approach would have been a "sorry dude, ill change it,
misunderstanding"

And of course the cynic in me is saying; well programming praxis will be
getting a shed load of new publicity now :)

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sfk
He can trademark his _site_ name, but it would be ridiculous to forbid the
name "Programming Praxis" as a header for a column or subsection of another
website. It's just too generic.

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ErrantX
Yes agreed. But if the section is identical in theme to that of the
Programming Praxis blog I think he has a legitimate point (or at least has
some rationale for making the point)

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Seiwynd
This story is summed up very well by a comment on the page made by sorryoldman
- "It sounds like this: “You had her first all right, but I slept with her and
she’s way too hot for me to give up now. So bugger off and dont come looking
for her. She’s too sexy and she’s mine now.” I hope this last sentence puts
things in persepctive."

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lincolnq
alex responded on proggit

[http://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/9a7zr/programmi...](http://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/9a7zr/programming_praxis_accuses_the_daily_wtf_of_name/c0bzilo)

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cruise02
He's responding on the blog itself. The user that posted that on proggit is a
brand new account, so I don't know if that's really him.

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metachris
Trademarking the generic title "Programming Praxis" seems a bit over the
board. There are too many trademarks -- everywhere! To me, this seems to be
contradicting the open-source and free knowledge spirit!

As one commenter in the original article put it: "He’s a prick. You’re a winey
bastard. Move on, yo."

~~~
chrismeta
Yeah, I know what you mean. I talk about this a bit in my blog at
www.newsforhackers.com

~~~
jcl
Or, more to the point: <http://hackernews.com>

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alex_c
Is this a registered trademark? (I poked around the USPTO search form a bit,
and couldn't find anything resembling "programming praxis").

I know copyright kicks in automatically, but is there such a thing as a non-
registered trademark, and does it carry any legal weight?

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carbon8
As I understand it, trademarks need not be registered:

<http://www.uspto.gov/web/offices/tac/doc/basic/register.htm>

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Mike2239
Let’s see if there’s an apology coming from Phil now that Alex has changed the
category name (and after he gave a reason for the delay) and whether it
receives as much attention as the attention __*ring post on the site.

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greyfade
Wonderful. More drama. The Internet needs more drama. The babies need their
attention.

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ajkirwin
Wow, that guy sure does have a stick up his ass, doesn't he.

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tamas
Not a trademark.

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DanielStraight
Two things. One, if you don't bother to get legal protection for your
"trademark", don't complain if people "steal" it. You can't have something
stolen from you that you never owned. Get over it. Two, generic terms should
not be eligible for trademark in the first place. Especially, no phrase of the
form adjective-noun and no compound noun should be elgible for trademark.

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theBobMcCormick
Registration is not required for a trademark in the US.
<http://www.uspto.gov/web/offices/tac/doc/basic/register.htm>

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DanielStraight
Nor for copyright, but having copyright does not guarantee legal protection
for copyright. If you can't prove that you have it and had it first, you may
as well not have it at all.

The site you linked to says quite clearly that you should register to get:

""" # a legal presumption of the registrant's ownership of the mark and the
registrant's exclusive right to use the mark nationwide on or in connection
with the goods and/or services listed in the registration; # the ability to
bring an action concerning the mark in federal court; """

So in other words, if you don't register, you don't have these things. Yes,
you have a trademark, sure... you just can't do anything about it.

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unperson
<http://marklaw.com/trademark-FAQ/benefits.htm>

"The owner of a federal trademark registration may sue in federal court more
easily. It is worth noting that even without a federal trademark registration
you still may be able to sue in federal court, but it may be more costly when
proving jurisdiction (i.e. diversity of citizenship & amount in controversy
over $75,000). Even if you can't sue in federal court, you can always sue in
state court. However, attorneys usually prefer federal court in trademark
cases for perceived procedural advantages."

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mrkurt
Flagged this because it's not a trademark. While he might have a legal case
due to first use, and be able to trademark it now, he doesn't currently have a
trademark. Bad title, no biscuit.

Upvoted because it sounds skeezy as hell.

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sp332
He's not talking about a _legal_ trademark, he means his "trademark" phrase
has been co-opted by TDWTF.

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alex_c
He's talking about legal threats and "confusion in the marketplace of ideas".

Definitely sounds like there's some confusion going on.

