
The state of Apple Pay adoption - huhtenberg
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/06/05/us-apple-pay-idUSKBN0OL0CM20150605
======
meesterdude
> Some merchants said they were holding out because they plan to participate
> in a new mobile payment system to be launched by a coalition of retailers
> later this year.

Oh yes, CurrentC.
[http://techcrunch.com/2014/10/25/currentc/](http://techcrunch.com/2014/10/25/currentc/)

> The idea behind MCX was that if enough retailers teamed up, they could
> convince consumers to adopt their mobile payment system that would let
> retailers avoid paying credit card fees in the 2 percent to 3 percent range
> by processing payments through Automatic Clearing House transactions through
> bank accounts that have much smaller fees. MCX’s app could also help
> retailers by encouraging loyalty to participating merchants and possibly
> provide them additional intelligence on their customers.

They want to save money on transaction fees by having your bank account info
on file. But don't worry, I'm sure they'll keep in safe. No history of huge
data breaches or anything to be concerned about. Meanwhile, their app is a
seaspool of their wildest marketing and promotional dreams coming to fruition.
It's purpose / existence is not at all for you, it's entirely for them.

~~~
jbooth
Every product exists to make/save money for its owners. Apply pay and stripe
are no different. The glaring question mark is whether a consortium of
retailers, none of which are that strong in tech, can actually make a product
that holds up and is, as you say, secure.

------
madeofpalk
> The state of Apple Pay adoption

This is the thing that amuses me - Why is rollout of contactless so slow, and
why is it being reported as being specific to Apply Pay?

AFAIK there's nothing for retailers to do to support Apple Pay! As long the
reader the EMV contactless standard, it supports Apple Pay (and PayWave and
PayPass and other brand names). It's all on issuing bank to support 'issuing'
Apple Pay 'cards'.

I added my US credit-card to my iPhone and used it with Apple Pay here in
Australia many times. Even small independent cafes support apple pay because
they just support contactless payments.

Despite being much smaller, Australia is the largest market in the world in
terms of contactless usage[1]. From last year:[2]

    
    
        More than 58 million Visa PayWave payments were made in July
        alone, up from 28 million a year ago and 40 million in
        January with average transactions standing at $31.38.
    
    

[1]:
[http://www.mastercard.com.au/_assets/docs/2014-03%20MCW_RBA_...](http://www.mastercard.com.au/_assets/docs/2014-03%20MCW_RBA_Data_Analysis.pdf)
[2]: [http://www.news.com.au/finance/money/contactless-tapandgo-
pa...](http://www.news.com.au/finance/money/contactless-tapandgo-payment-
gains-popularity-with-australian-shoppers/story-e6frfmci-1227073203032)

~~~
mikepurvis
Support in Canada is also pretty good. I think the only retailer in my regular
routine (Kitchener, Ontario) who doesn't have contactless POS is a building
supply store.

It always boggles my mind being in the US and realizing the number of places
which with either don't take cards at all, or have only stripe-and-sign.

~~~
coldpie
Cards have big fees attached, so many smaller retailers insist on cash so they
don't lose 3% of their income. Even at small, local places that do take cards,
I try to always pay in cash to help support them.

------
bluedevil2k
Why doesn't Apple subsidize the cost of the POS devices that are compatible
with Apple Pay? If the big hurdle for businesses, big and small, is the cost
of upgrading their POS, then perhaps a company with $200B in cash sitting
around could help pay for that. Average POS device is $2000 (1), and there are
10 million POS devices (2) in the US. If Apple covers 50% of everyone's
upgrade, that's $10B. About 3 months of profit for Apple.

1 - [http://smallbusiness.costhelper.com/point-of-
sale.html](http://smallbusiness.costhelper.com/point-of-sale.html) 2 -
[http://www.gaoresearch.com/POS/pos.php](http://www.gaoresearch.com/POS/pos.php)

~~~
TylerE
Your cost per station is wildly undervaluing things, since you are not taking
into account shipping, installation, training, verification, auditing,
disaster recovery planning, etc, etc.

~~~
larrys
Forgetting the exact cost, Apple has enough cash to give retailers an
incentive and may have already done that with those that are already onboard.
Note I said "incentive" not "paid for everything". This wouldn't be something
that they would necessarily disclose either, for obvious reasons.

------
a2tech
The resistance really just boils down to 'we can't track our customers any
more'. Big chains' POS systems almost all have contactless readers built in
(but disabled).

To me this is a feature-I don't particularly want to be profiled by the places
I shop at.

------
jbrooksuk
I find it particularly annoying that Apple Pay isn't in the UK yet, although
we've had contactless for a few years.

~~~
mladenkovacevic
Same situation in Canada. About 80-90% of retailers have contactless payment
terminals. No Google or Apple Pay though. Tapping a credit card is easy enough
though.

~~~
vinay427
If I recall correctly, Google Wallet should work with any of those contactless
payment terminals. I've tried it a few times in the US, anyway.

~~~
cowsandmilk
the problem isn't in the hardware. It is in the backend payment processing.
Both Apple Pay and Google Wallet have hardware support, just not the banking
relationships.

------
S_A_P
In Houston the uptake rate is abysmal. I think Walgreens is one of the few
places I see readers consistently. As a result it's not habitual to pay with
my phone. Even if I am holding it while checking out. I do pay with the
Starbucks app which I believe I would start using apple pay if it showed up
there. The Starbucks rewards system is so incredibly broken that I rarely cash
them in or think to use them. I could get a free drink for going a dozen times
spending 2 dollars or 30 dollars. Does not compute.

------
coob
Apple Pay is literally a win for everyone

* Customers have an easier, securer way to pay than chip & PIN (swipe only will be phased out as it has in Europe)

* VISA/MC/AMEX get a reduction in transaction fraud due to device-linkage (combined with biometrics).

* Retailers can process transactions quicker without them costing more.

~~~
JoeAltmaier
My sister, a retailer, didn't see it that way. It cost her something. Her
normal (coffee-shop) transaction is cash. This scheme is a big loss for her.

~~~
jinushaun
Grrr! Cash only retailers! You don't get my money.

~~~
JoeAltmaier
Didn't say that. She takes plastic too.

~~~
madeofpalk
How would Apple Pay be a big loss for her then? From her perspective it's no
different to regular debit/credit cards

~~~
MadManE
Because cash can be lost in the shuffle, and there is not necessarily a hard
record of it ever existing.

If everything is on the level, then there's no loss.

------
datashovel
I think the right way to move forward with the "payment system of the future"
is to build it on top of a federated network where anyone can participate at
any level without the need to go through some central entity. I vote for no
more walled gardens.

------
huhtenberg
> _Some merchants said they were holding out because they plan to participate
> in a new mobile payment system to be launched by a coalition of retailers
> later this year._

Does anyone know what this is referring to?

~~~
trequartista
CurrentC - which is an initiative spearheaded by Walmart. Unlike Apple Pay
which uses NFC, CurrentC uses the good old QR code scanning technique, which
should in theory make it ubiquitous. But it's not happened so far.

~~~
nly
Wouldn't that depend on the customers phone having a data connection? You need
2 way communication to produce a secure payment protocol.

~~~
calvin_c
The goal isn't to be secure. As far as I understand it would basically be
similar to Starbuck's current mobile payment service, where the scanner reads
the code which maps directly to an account and processes the transaction. No
two way communication.

------
jinushaun
From personal experience, even retailers that are participating in Apple Pay
(Whole Foods, Home Depot, Walgreens) don't accept Apple Pay. Most of the time
only half the machines work. As a result, it has failed to be part of my
routine. Apple really needs to get Starbucks on board to see real traction.

~~~
ceejayoz
My main issue with it is I still have to get my wallet out for the grocery
store's loyalty card, so I don't get much of a time savings.

~~~
DannoHung
Have you tried adding the card to passbook? There are a number of websites
that let you generate a passbook card for an arbitrary barcode/qr

