

Thesixtyone (YC W09) launches version 2.0 - jmtame
http://thesixtyone.posterous.com/making-the-jump-to-hyperspace

======
jessep
I think this is fantastic. The layout immediately reminded me of looking at
the elaborate covers and inserts in my dad's vinyl collection while listening.
Essentially, feels like a more intimate way to engage music.

Definitely still some UI bugs, but I really like the direction.

The biggest UI bugs I noticed:

1) When the next song came on by auto play, the background/info didn't update.
I went into "info" then exited and it updated.

2) Once I clicked for more info on a song, I couldn't immediately figure out
how to get back to the bare, initial layout.

3) Next/Prev buttons disappeared when the info about the artist was up, which
I couldn't close. Annoying not to be able to go to the next song when I didn't
like the current one.

Anyway, congrats, I really like this.

~~~
bradgessler
I'd like to add to that:

3) When I hover over a button/icon for a second or two, a tooltip would help
tremendously to figure out what the button does.

This is a really great, unique design. Well done.

Update: I have run into some usability issues that I can't really describe
because I have no idea how I got into whatever the feature is suppose to be. I
don't think this UI is very forgiving for newcomers like myself. You're onto
something with this "vinyl" look, and I know the improvements you're thinking
about will probably fix most of these issues.

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mkyc
Yes, it feels like "vinyl" - like I'm listening to vinyl except I'm in a
little storage closet and I just tipped a box of records all over my face and
my face is bleeding.

You broke your site. This is a visualization with an interface crowded into
it. Revert and offer this - let's calm down and be honest - _basic slideshow_
as a new visualization.

Imagine that instead of a pretty picture of the band, there was just a white
background. Now look at the interface. It's a nightmare. The song that I'm
listening to is controlled at the top right, except for hearts/comments, which
are on the left side (except when I try to give a heart, the button _slides
away from me_ ). The song-forward and back buttons are on opposite sides of
the screen, well away from play/pause/volume. None of this would be a problem
if the controls were visually/conceptually linked in some non-spatial way, but
they are not.

I'd like to know the user testing process you used, and whether you ran this
by whoever did your already-great former UI layout. I just hope your guiding
light wasn't a small group of hardcore users and passers-by shouting "awesome,
intimate, inspired, daring, and elaborate". It sure as hell wasn't your
community.

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moconnor
Incredible site design, I've never seen "put the content first and get out of
the way" taken to such extremes. Has anyone else got any great examples of
this?

I can see why some dislike the UI, but personally I think it works very well;
it's making me rethink my own web app design to see whether I couldn't learn
something from this.

I bet the conversion rate from views to sign-ups is fantastic. Hear something
you like? Want to favourite it? Sign up and it's done. Very slick, very smart.

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orz
the new ui is a disaster imo - usability is right out (yes lists are useful)

this redesign should have been as a new view on an existing model that is
switched via toggle by the user

not to mentioned they sabotaged groups and they are now an exercise in
futility called 'channels'

edit: <https://old.thesixtyone.com/> is still available for a limited time

~~~
mattdennewitz
"disaster" is a but harsh, but i think perhaps a better implementation
would've been to _supplement_ the existing layout with this as another view
option. i like that its almost purely visual, but imagine if apple entirely
replaced finder's lists with coverflow.

and, impact?! IMPACT?!

~~~
orz
as i said it is an opinion of a user, to qualify i have been using the site
for almost 2 years now with over 5000 plays and a rep of 58588

i was a completely lost as to how to use features that before were very
clearly designed and accessible, which i can find ways around eventually...

however the changes to the social experience are drastic and extremely
negative (based on my a sample set of 60+ users in my current group)

i can attest to the fact that the accessible social groups have been the only
factor in my retention over the past year, (insert reference that shows
correlation between social interactions and user retention)

i understand that ui is subjective to a certain extent but if you are to enact
an entire user interface overhaul it would be best to do it as a skin to allow
a transition and discovery period

i would not mind leaving the current interface running as a 'kiosk' mode at a
party

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revorad
The new UI is very confusing, but the music is so good I don't care.

One way of reducing the confusion might be introduce UI elements gradually
over time as a user keeps coming back. If at first it was just the big artist
wallpaper with a small player controls widget (like the one on top of the old
page), that would be so much more enjoyable. The next time the user logged
back in, there could be a new UI element. This would probably also pique the
user's interest and she might actually click on it. And so on...

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pg
Wow. These guys are not timid about trying changes.

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mickeyben
When I discovered thesixtyone.com few months ago, I was in love with this
website and very pleased to discover new songs and artists.

But after few weeks, I had my ways in the website and used to play always the
same songs/artists/radios, I discovered new artists less and less and finally
opened the website less often using more and more Spotify.

Today, this new design is very focus on discovering new songs what I really
like, the UI is incredible, the songs are awesome.

I think I have a 2nd crush for you,

Thanks,

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mattyb
James and Sam, I commend you for experimenting, but I think you might want to
revert this and seek more constructive feedback from your (very) passionate
community.

<http://www.facebook.com/thesixtyone?v=wall>

~~~
yread
Christ! People are such drama queens! It is kinda buggy but its not like their
life depends on it. Petitions? Seriously?

~~~
teej
You cannot do a complete overhaul of your UI with no warning and expect users
to love you.

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yannis
Just simply not good and with a lot of bugs! I loved the previous version,
which I considered as one of the better UIs around. In addition if you try and
visit the old site link as listed on the blog you get a security warning in
Chrome.

~~~
thiele
and in Firefox

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amo
to me, losing:

\- lists that play even while I browse

\- easy way to discover music, with criterias

\- meet like-minded listeners via their radio, and keep building relationships

are all the good T61 stood for. I like to choose what I want to hear, select
it by different means, etc.. - all you had achieved with the previous version.

Sorry, hope you have success with your new ideas. Wish you well, really.

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jfong
Absolutely sick revamp. It's so outrageous, but it works so well. Bravo.

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Dauntless
It feels a bit claustrophobic to me... also I don't know how to just browse
songs, and most things I touch change my current song... I think you can get
used to it though.

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wavesplash
Whoa. Album covers 2.0. Pure Awesome! Love where you're going with this.

Small stuff: bugs in the paging UI (nav disappears when I open artist info,
etc - on Chrome Dev here). Why not just put fixed <\- -> arrows in the top nav
so it's consistently placed? Also, would love the artist info popup to be
_bigger_.

Great innovation guys.

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kilian
very slick new design, but I'm missing a lot of things that made thesixtyone
so awesome. Where are the playlists? now every next song is a gamble. Two
songs further might be an acousting version or a cover of a song i'd love to
hear. And why are the artist and song title only visible in the title?

~~~
Torn
Click on your name in the bottom left, and you'll get a dark overlay box to
the lower-right of the screen, and there'll be your 'featured' playlist. Note:

    
    
      "it may take a few hours for your playlists to fully migrate over"
    

my playlists are about 40% complete.

~~~
kilian
You're right, but I was also talking about the general playlists, top, latest
etc. which seem to have disappeared in favor of the model they used to have
for moods.

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vdm
I love the innovation in this new site, and how it evokes the vinyl listening
experience. However, I think it is less suitable than the old site for use at
work (NSFW) because it is so colourful.

A more 'bland' page like the old version would work better when one is sitting
at a non-private terminal. Perhaps this option or mode should be offered,
because the site is still a fresh new way to listen to (fresh new) music.

~~~
thiele
Interesting insight regarding it being 'less suitable' for work. That's
something that I don't think about now that I'm not working in a corporate
office or cubicle anymore.

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pavelludiq
I like some of the ideas, but i got too shocked by the radical change. I guess
i got confused because not all of my saved songs appeared in the playlists and
i got pissed off. Im very interested in what the result will be after they get
it polished. I guess im just a "playlist" guy, rather than a "giant picture of
some band" kind.

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sixSecrets
The whole thing sucks and is confusing. There are going to be a lot of people
LEAVE t61 over this so-called "new" re-vamp. What in the name of Hell are
these guys doing to what was, a perfectly acceptable program (admittedly with
a few bugs)? There very well maybe a mass exodus from t61.

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pistoriusp
It's really cool but it's a bit complicated.

I think the main thing that bothers me is that I can't "pin" up elements that
I would like to remain in place:

1) The next/ previous arrows 2) The artist/ song name 3) Song's controls
(Play, pause, volume, etc...)

The randomly positioned text blurb and randomly positioned images seem to stay
forever... I can't see how that text is more important than some of the other
elements.

When you click on the random text blurb/ picture I get stuck. I can't figure
out how to get my green arrows back. Also, there isn't a difference between
clicking on an image or clicking on the text. They take you to the same place
- Which I understand, but I expected to see a larger image.

~~~
JMiao
the first part is addressable with keyboard shortcuts.

left (previous), right (next), space (pause), + (vol up), - (vol down), r
(autorepeat toggle).

we're working on some tutorial-type stuff that'll tie things together. thanks.

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Vindexus
I find this UI very confusing. I think some usability testing is in order. I
used to go to the Recently Posted page and see a list of new songs. Then I'd
take a look at song names and artist names and listen to a few. How do I do
that now?

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TrevorJ
I really like this. The site design is something that will translate very well
to netbook/tablets. If feels very relaxed and puts the music front and center.
A great way to unwind while sitting on the couch. Any plans for an iphone app?

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thiele
That is friggin' striking.

It's not very intuitive to navigate on the first visit, however. Once you've
been to the site a few times, you probably get used to the structure. Also,
the huge background makes for some really pixelated and stretched images.

Essentially, they have created the entire experience to be a visualizer. The
redesign makes the experience more about listening to music and less about
interacting with the community and 'quests'. I don't know if that's
necessarily a good thing. I don't know if they can compete with the other
music sites just based on content.

It changes what makes the T61 unique, for sure.

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Raphael
I think you broke my brain.

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pavs
Excellent! Never heard of you guys before, but I can see myself checking it
out frequently. Great collection of music.

The design itself has a very "indie" vibe to it and I am loving it!

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krupap
I think change can be great if it's coupled with effective user management. On
a site that people use daily, this means giving your users some advance
notice, explaining major feature changes, and having a "how-to" page to show
users how to use the new site. Lacking the above, there is bound to be some
backlash as daily users find themselves stumbling around a site that they used
to know like the back of their hand and, worse, with the very fabric of
community interaction changed.

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qeorge
That is really cool. Great redesign.

FWIW, this makes it feel more like a great radio station then a music
discovery site. More Pandora than Hype Machine. Not a bad thing at all.

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timcash
Add a BIG button that gives a fun tutorial on how to use it. Otherwise love
it. It took me a bit of tinkering to figure things out but, that kind of makes
it fun!

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flaub
Interesting idea, I'm mostly wondering how you're going to deal with different
genres for different tastes. Eventually filtering and targeting seem like they
will become the number one issue for both users and providers.

I actually like how the site reminds me of a vinyl cover, however it might be
too confusing for (some) people to use. I couldn't figure out how to bring
back the info about the artist after it fades away.

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andrewparker
Navigating to old.sixtyone.com brings up a big red "hacker" warning in Chrome.
I tried to dismiss it an go anyway, but I couldn't proceed. Just FYI.

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CivEZ
Clearly these guys don't understand usability. It is SO important for people
to feel "grounded" when they use a sight as intricate and functional as T61
was. The play bar needs to come back. I think a lot of people feel this is
confusing and you get lost in all the "minimalist" design of the page.

They traded usability and functionality for "cool" and "cutting edge" ...
lame.

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RyanMcGreal
I love the new design! I just have one question: how do you save songs now?

Edit: I think I figured it out. The dropdown plus symbol under the logo on the
top right adds the currently playing song to your playlist.

I definitely second the call made in another comment for tooltips so people
can learn what the icons mean.

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somedaywings
this is amazing. i've always been a big fan of you guys, but this is crazy
good!

one piece of advice: the polaroid-type photos flashing in front of the main
picture are annoying. either keep them relegated to one spot on the page or
give me an easy way to turn them off.

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patrickmclaren
I do like it, but perhaps with less mouse-over states. I just want to get the
cursor to the right corner and already half the screen has flashed at me.

Had used the old version quite a bit, discovered some great artists. William
Fitzsimmons, Caitlin Hart, etc.

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fjabre
From someone who wasn't a user before and who has looked at both the old UI
and the new one I'll say this: The new UI is awesome and inspired. Very
innovative and mood inducing. I'm an instant fan.

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gruseom
What I admire most about T61 is that they created an online community that is
amazingly passionate. Case in point: several people have created new HN
accounts just to comment on this thread.

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mhartl
I can't figure out the UI---or even, on first visit, what the site is, apart
from a Flash app that plays music I haven't heard before. I am very
confused...

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rrhyne
Sick play list, love the huge photos, disaster of a UI. I'm going to stick
with it and let them work the issues out.

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coffee
This is my new favorite app - good stuff :)

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hubb
all i can say is wow. my favourite music site on the web just got even more
kickass

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narendranag
I love it. And I'm an old user.

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azsromej
how do you view a list of top songs?

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korch
Kick ass! I really like the minimalist, modal single-page UI. Obviously a lot
of thought has gone into it. This is one of the first sites I've seen that
actually feels more like an application than a web page. I'd love to see this
trend catch on more in web design fads.

~~~
prosa
I agree with your sentiment. However, in this case the site has a long road
ahead of it, to restore lost or buried functionality.

From the top of my head:

\- Tipjar honor roll is hidden in a separate screen, which removes "status"
related incentives to tip (a loss for artists)

\- Social features are buried; the artist doesn't feel like they are "there"
on the site

\- Can't see what's ahead or behind you on the browsing playlists

\- On Chrome, the user account information is occluded by the status bar
whenever you hover on a link

\- "Sliding" effects make the interface feel sluggish

All of these issues can be addressed without the "reversion" people are
calling for... but there are some long nights ahead for the dev team if they
want to match the prior version in raw usability.

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zackattack
astonishingly beautiful, and nice that you greeted me with an acoustic of a
new metric fave. unfortunately the acoustic version sucks and i'm similarly
not a fan of any of the next 10 songs i explored. if it actually played music
i liked, this would be my preferred way to listen - and experience - music
online.

