
A Swede who created a $400K Indiegogo-scam - imartin2k
https://www.breakit.se/artikel/17260/the-swede-created-a-400-000-indiegogo-scam-is-this-his-next-project
======
CosmicShadow
Indiegogo in particular is super sketchy, I did a campaign with them and they
had an employee there contacting me and telling me all the shady stuff they
can do to help me be successful and if that I can guarantee I'll raise x
amount they'll do all these extra things like put it on the front page and in
the newsletter and whatnot. They let you extend campaigns forever if you
arne't about to hit your goal so you can keep saying "ending soon", then if
you do hit your goal, instead of ending, they will let you keep it open to
ride the momentum of that, or they will then let you up (or down) the goal and
change the date so you can keep catching people who want to just be able to
get it, or who want to pile on to a super successful project whose goal is now
1/10 of the original so it looks even more legit. You can also back your own
stuff anonymously for as high as you want, so often you'll see campaigns with
like $1MM and only like 20 backers and most are anonymous or not listed and
you know obviously 20 people couldn't have legitimately backed for that much.

I can't recall a lot of the other stuff you could get away with, including
have no proof of concepts and just using renders and being fully funded
already and such, but I had to unsubscribe from their emails it was so
disgusting. You can tell if you look at their site overtime which kinds of
things just stay up forever or how they instantly are over the goal and
whatnot. One item stayed up for like 8 months, constantly over the goal.

~~~
jen729w
Funnily enough just this morning my inbox has this:

\---

From: Indiegogo

Subject: Your Indiegogo Innovation Award

Hi there!

We're excited to inform you that your project is eligible to receive an
Indiegogo Innovation Award this January!

To honor your crowdfunding achievements, we cordially invite you to reserve
your award, available for pick-up at this year's Consumer Electronics Show in
Las Vegas.

Our theme at this year's CES is "Indiegogo Means Business," and your campaign
is proof that creative ideas indeed grow into successful businesses with
Indiegogo. As only 100 entrepreneurs will receive this gift, we hope you enjoy
it as much as the Indiegogo community has enjoyed your ingenious ideas.

Thank you for being a pivotal part of Indiegogo!

\---

I have never run a campaign on Indiegogo.

~~~
avian
Same here. It must have been sent out to everyone with an account.

------
joshstrange
Never pledge on indiegogo, it's for scammers only. Kickstarter (for all it's
warts) requires a working prototype to post on their site. IGG requires no
such proof that you aren't selling vaporware. Also IGG shows total pledge
numbers from IGG PLUS Kickstarter (and potentially other crowdfunding sites
you might post to) so that their numbers look bigger.

Stop, Drop, & Retro has some really good YouTube videos calling out IGG/KS
campaigns (focused on the retro gaming scene) and he does a decent job
breaking it all down.

~~~
gnicholas
> _Kickstarter (for all it 's warts) requires a working prototype to post on
> their site_

What do you mean by "working prototype"? I ran a successful software
Kickstarter last year and all we had going in was a mockup (created in
Keynote) of what the app would look like.

I expected that it would take hours/days after I "submitted for review" for
the campaign to be approved, but it was instantaneously approved and went
live.

~~~
joshstrange
I'm sorry, it apparently only applies to when the project is going to ship a
physical item.
[https://www.kickstarter.com/rules/prototypes](https://www.kickstarter.com/rules/prototypes)

------
raesene9
Another one in the long line of either over-promised or outright scams on
Kickstarter/Indiegogo.

The oldest one I saw got almost this much funding and that was back in 2012!
[https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/zioneyez/eyeztm-by-
zion...](https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/zioneyez/eyeztm-by-zioneyez-hd-
video-recording-glasses-for)

Every time one of these projects fails to deliver, I'd guess that another set
of people get put off crowdfunding.

Personally my approach has been never to back a project by a first time
creator, unless I already know their work from elsewhere, doubly so if it's
for a physical product.

------
tapland
SSE Student? One of the two SSE-programs is arguably the hardest program to
get into in Sweden. Sometimes the Karolinska medical school has a higher entry
requirement.

Graduating from there usually means you are set and don't need to scam anyone
for a _very_ comfortable life.

~~~
janesvilleseo
Sometimes people don’t steal because they need to, but because they want to.
It’s a puzzle, it’s a rush, it’s fun, and for some it’s their hobby.

------
interesthrow2
These campaign would never be successful without the copywriters on popular
digital media promoting them because they are content farms looking for cheap
"news".

Wired, CNET, and all these prominent outlets, when was the last time they
issued a follow up when something turned out to be a scam? when did they ever
put a disclaimer about the risk of crowdfunding in their article? and let's
not even talk about the fact that they don't even state clearly that the
product doesn't exist and they never even tried it. Without shills, scams
can't be successful, they are the shills, literally by the definition of that
word.

------
1024core
IndieGoGo is a haven for scammers. They have absolutely no interest in
protecting you. Even if you point out that the scammer is actively scamming
currently, they won't do anything.

~~~
interesthrow2
> IndieGoGo is a haven for scammers. They have absolutely no interest in
> protecting you. Even if you point out that the scammer is actively scamming
> currently, they won't do anything.

They actually do protect their backers better than Kickstarter sometimes:

this ongoing scam on Kickstarter:

[https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/stillalive/polygons-
the...](https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/stillalive/polygons-the-
flat-4-in-1-measuring-spoon/comments)

the same project was actually closed by Indiegogo as the creator is a
notorious scammer:

[https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/polygons-the-
flat-4-in-1-...](https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/polygons-the-
flat-4-in-1-measuring-spoon-cool-design--3#/)

Kickstater doesn't protect anybody at all. Kickstarter doesn't get involved in
anyway after funds change hands and they take their cut.

~~~
squidbot
It's a shame that's a scam, it's actually kind of a cool idea.

------
jaggs
I wonder if he's the same Swede behind this attempted scam -
[http://www.redferret.net/?p=55945](http://www.redferret.net/?p=55945)

------
estomagordo
Waiting to pay for a product until it actually exists won't kill you.

~~~
whatshisface
It will, metaphorically, if a lack of funding will kill the product (or
prevent it from ever being made). Crowdfunding is a financing option, complete
with the part where the financiers are exposed to risk.

~~~
estomagordo
It's a rubbish financing option. The financers on average don't seem very good
at comparing their little upside to the risk they're taking.

~~~
jacobush
The ones I hear talking about their sponsoring, is that they know full well. I
hear phrasing such as "shooting some money their way in case they succeed" and
"it's an interesting project, let's hope for the best".

~~~
estomagordo
It's pretty damn stupid, know it or not.

~~~
Mtinie
Why? It’s effectively a patronage; a model which has been used to bankroll
artists, pet projects, and a number of risky ideas throughout history.

~~~
estomagordo
It's effectively investment, but without any of the benefits.

------
andrewjrhill
> and raised in total $800.000 million from approximately 5,000 backers from
> around the world.

I assume this is a typo? Or did a blanket raise almost a billion dollars?

~~~
homarp
[https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/322231573/zen-
blanket-t...](https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/322231573/zen-blanket-the-
blanket-for-better-sleep) ==> SEK 4,149,969 or $460,4330 USD

[https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/zen-blanket-the-
blanket-f...](https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/zen-blanket-the-blanket-for-
better-sleep#/) ==>$806,268

so in total $1,266,728

~~~
juanuys
You might have a typo: 460,4330?

~~~
homarp
yep, SEK 4,149,969 is USD 461,227.55 rounded up to 460,430

~~~
cosmie
Your original message has a typo in it. There's an extra three in the USD
value (460,4330 rather than 460,430).

------
m_eiman
If you find the concept interesting, the same type of thing is available today
at a lower price from e.g. [https://curaofsweden.com/produkt/cura-
pearl/](https://curaofsweden.com/produkt/cura-pearl/) \- no need to risk a
Kickstarter order and delays.

------
bitxbitxbitcoin
What I've gathered from my own and others experiences: Just avoid Indiegogo
and Kickstarter and buy the inevitable Chinese knockoffs if the item is
successful. With this possibly unethical method, you might even get the item
before the pledgees.

------
benrapscallion
An article this long, and no mention of who it is? Feels strange to read this
detailed investigation into the identity of “he who must not be named”, when
the whole point of the article is the identity of the person.

~~~
lb1lf
-Norwegian here - the Scandinavian countries in general have _very_ strong laws protecting the privacy of all citizens.

A consequence of this is that defendants in criminal cases are very rarely
named by the media until convicted, if even then.

~~~
estomagordo
In Sweden, this is not a consequence of any law, but by common journalistic
practices. Media are protected by constitutional writings that extend very far
in terms of the sender's rights to publish. However, Swedish media also has a
long tradition of keeping themselves to de facto standards when it comes to
things such as identifying individuals.

It would have been _very_ weird to see this person named on Breakit.

~~~
pnongrata
Especially since no real link has been made between both companies and the
student. You can't even affirm that the IGG campaign was indeed a scam or just
an utter failure.

------
baybal2
Indiegogo and Kickstarter are doing a very bad job at screening applicants.

At least something obviously physically impossible should've been cancelled.

They are burning their credit of trust.

------
AnnoyingSwede
I bought a product from Aliexpress (12 euro IoT wifi relay) which i later
found in the exact same name and package on kickstarter for around 20 euros. I
contacted kickstarter, who quite abruptly removed the kickstarter. If their
only intentions were faul they would have let it be, but they actually did the
right thing in this case. Just offering another perspective of their work.

------
robertpohl
Help me understand why the consumer protection is not used here?

In order to do card payments the merchant (IGG) need to be able to refund. It
they cannot, the acquirer must do so. Anyways, one of the purposes of Visa and
MasterCard is protection from these scams. If you don't get 100% of what you
bought, you can get refunded by the card issuer, which will collect
acquirer/merchant.

~~~
chenster
Maybe because the consumers are investing in a future product. It is not the
same as buying directly online from ECommerce store like Amazon. Investing
implies risk. The consumers can probably still get a refund for fraudulent
charges from CC.

------
snowplay
Unfortunately, back in 2014, I contributed to an Indiegogo campaign for
DreamQii PlexiDrone 8 blade drone. It has not shipped, though they've been in
a state of almost shipping for about two years. Lesson learned. DreamQii
raised over US$2.2 million.

------
Supersaiyan_IV
But when Canonical's Ubuntu Phone didn't meet its pledge people goal on
Indiegogo people got their money back? How did this even happen? Not that this
individual isn't to blame.

------
snowplay
Unfortunately, back in 2014, I contributed to an Indiegogo campaign for
DreamQii PlexiDrone 8 blade drone. Still not shipping. Almost shipping for the
last two years. A costly lesson.

------
stef25
Aren't these platforms meant to protect against this kind of scam?

~~~
erikb
How can you protect against such kind of scam on such kind of platform?

An airplane can reduce the risk of falling down, but if you want to be
protected(!) against falling down from the sky you shouldn't enter a big piece
of metal that lifts off from the ground.

~~~
w1nst0nsm1th
Entering a piece of metal that can uplift you is a calculated and well-known
statistical risk you can evaluate if it worth being taken for the service it
provide.

Indiegogo seems to not have such statistical intelligence.

~~~
number_six
sending cash, to someone who can't at this time provide you the product you
want to buy, and who makes no bones about not providing you with any
assurances that they ever will is a calculated (and easily avoided) risk. You
can evaluate if it is worth being taken for the product you may or may-not
ever receive.

The fact that a house-fly already has the statistical intelligence for funding
Indiegogo projects doesn't mean that there isn't any

------
huxflux
Big Mike, we are coming for you.

------
abc-xyz
[https://outline.com/xxPp9N](https://outline.com/xxPp9N)

