
Roger McNamee is really sad about Facebook - muzz
http://time.com/5505441/mark-zuckerberg-mentor-facebook-downfall/
======
smacktoward
_> Zuck has always believed that connecting everyone on earth was a mission so
important that it justified any action necessary to accomplish it._

Anytime someone starts telling you that their end is so noble it justifies any
means, you should run away from them as fast as you possibly can.

~~~
Barrin92
It's no wonder that folks in the valley are so fascinated with AIs running
amok and turning the world into a paperclip factory, because apparently that
has been Facebooks business model from the start.

A very relevant article from Ted Chiang:
[https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/tedchiang/the-real-
dang...](https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/tedchiang/the-real-danger-to-
civilization-isnt-ai-its-runaway)

 _" Consider: Who pursues their goals with monomaniacal focus, oblivious to
the possibility of negative consequences? Who adopts a scorched-earth approach
to increasing market share? This hypothetical strawberry-picking AI does what
every tech startup wishes it could do — grows at an exponential rate and
destroys its competitors until it’s achieved an absolute monopoly. The idea of
superintelligence is such a poorly defined notion that one could envision it
taking almost any form with equal justification: a benevolent genie that
solves all the world’s problems, or a mathematician that spends all its time
proving theorems so abstract that humans can’t even understand them. But when
Silicon Valley tries to imagine superintelligence, what it comes up with is
no-holds-barred capitalism."_

~~~
simmanian
I guess in a way, these big valley companies are indeed turning themselves
into superintelligent entities that do exactly what folks in the valley worry
about.

~~~
solveit
This is not new. First it was the militaries and governments, then it was the
financial institutions, now it's big tech companies, and eventually it will
actually be AI (because firms will use AI to guide their actions).

Aligning anything with its stated goals has always been a hard problem, the
superintelligent paperclip factory just happens to be sensational enough to
grab attention.

------
tripnine
If you ever find yourself in a situation where you have to explain to a
relative or acquaintance why FB is bad and they just don't get it, point to
this article, it'll save a bunch of time. Great articulation that sums up
their issues and potential solutions. Sometimes things bear repeating they are
so important.

------
simmanian
Is it feasible to create a corporate structure that would encourage it to act
with the public interest in mind? Are there any known patterns, research, or
tries? My very ill-informed mind is thinking of a parent-child structure where
the parent gets to veto and only veto decisions made by its children that may
be harmful for the general public.

~~~
rescripting
Sounds like government regulations?

Thats typically been the way we've managed these kinds of threats/bad actors,
but technology is changing so fast and policy makers are hamstrung by
bureaucracy, incompetence, apathy or all three.

~~~
simmanian
Yeah, initially my first reaction was "we need regulations" then I realized
that's just not going to possible especially in the future. We need a new
corporate structure that can compete and reproduce in the current market.

~~~
Fishysoup
Or additions to / restructuring of the current regulatory bodies so that they
can respond to such things faster.

------
smsm42
I'm reading all the time about how fake news on Facebook supposedly influenced
the elections, but I haven't heard of any factual confirmation of that. Did it
really happen? Did somebody research that? How much influence did they find? I
have seen research that says convincing people campaigning is pretty much
hopeless - they'd nod to ads they agree with and ignore ones they disagree
with, but won't change their minds :
[https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3042867](https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3042867)

Maybe this research is wrong - but I'd like to see any research if Facebook
fake news did really have any influence at all.

~~~
avn2109
The waters are further muddied by the fact that nobody can agree on a
definition of "fake news."

It's meaningless, sensational claims all the way down.

~~~
kelnos
Sure we do: fake news is the dissemination of incorrect information purporting
to be the truth (and not someone's opinion).

~~~
smsm42
That's "lying" (if intentional) or "being mistaken" (if sincere). People do it
all the time since speech was invented (and probably before that too - I've
read about some animals being capable of lying).

------
BillSaysThis
Cry me a river. He still owns FB stock and AFAIK has not donated prior profits
to charity.

------
crsmithdev
A heavily-recycled story that's been making the rounds since at least 2017. No
matter, have to keep the outrage machine going to drive traffic!

~~~
simmanian
I'm personally glad the story made to the front page again as I find it very
relevant today and I've never read it before.

------
swamy_g
I first thought it was because FB thought his last name was made up.

------
hvs

        I got involved with the company more than a decade ago and have taken great pride and joy in the company’s success … until the past few months.
    

_few months_? Then you haven't been paying attention or are just as bad as
them.

~~~
imjk
He says in the next paragraph that that was from an email he sent to Marc and
Sheryl before the 2016 election.

------
rock_hard
Is there a official confirmation that he really mentored him?

All I saw once is a statement that he knows him

~~~
orgop
Roger's a nice guy and a cool Deadhead, however it's hard to get the guy to
stop talking at times. He was interested in a company I created at one point
and in the few times we chatted (2-3) he dropped Zuck's name a few too many
times in normal conversation. I don't know if it's true or not, but I
frequently wondered to what extent he mentored him, like they chatted
frequently for a few months? It seemed to me at the time that he was trying to
position it as, "would you like to be the next person I mentor post-Zuck?"
Lots of weird red flags all-around in those talks, which later fizzled out.

~~~
rock_hard
yeah, thats exactly what I imagined

------
ilovecaching
I think the right steps are already being taken. Breaking up Facebook would
just decentralize the problem up and make it impossible to solve. At least
with Facebook everything is in one place, and they have the money and
resources to fix things.

~~~
simmanian
Honestly curious: what steps do you see that are being taken?

~~~
ilovecaching
The company is slowing down revenue growth to ramp up more security measures.
Zuck seems committed to fixing Facebook even if it hurts near term
investments.

~~~
acct1771
The data security, while deeply troubling, is not the most troubling thing
about FB.

------
tivert
The post title was changed from the article title, it should be: "I Mentored
Mark Zuckerberg. I Loved Facebook. But I Can't Stay Silent About What's
Happening."

------
renholder
Anyone have a GDPR-friendly link? Wayback[0] won't save the site[1], for some
reason. =[

[0] -
[https://web.archive.org/web/*/http://time.com/5505441/mark-z...](https://web.archive.org/web/*/http://time.com/5505441/mark-
zuckerberg-mentor-facebook-downfall//*)

[1] -
[https://web.archive.org/web/20190117191830/http://time.com/5...](https://web.archive.org/web/20190117191830/http://time.com/5505441/mark-
zuckerberg-mentor-facebook-downfall/)

~~~
thg
[https://outline.com/v8mnmn](https://outline.com/v8mnmn)

------
ihateyoutime
The piece of sh#t bloatware that is time.com just crashed my phone while
loading all the resources to read a text-based article. Go figure.

~~~
michaelmrose
Looking at it via ublock origin the number of things blocked just keeps on
ticking up. At aprox the 1 minute mark its at 108.

