
United Kingdom Budget Visualization - rsp1984
https://uk.wikibudgets.org/w/united-kingdom-budget-2016
======
Reason077
It's staggering to me that £46 billion goes to HM Revenue and Customs. So it
costs £46 billion to administer £506 billion in tax revenue! That's almost 1/3
the budget of the entire NHS!

That doesn't seem like a good ROI at all. A product of an over-complicated tax
system?

~~~
pliny
If you go back a year you can get some detail into what HM Revenue and Customs
spends it's money on (90% of it is under the title 'social protection' which
is child welfare and tax credits). The collection and enforcement looks like
it costs 4 billion at most.

~~~
J-dawg
Tax credits deserve some scrutiny. A significant portion of tax revenue is
effectively being paid as a subsidy to businesses allowing them to
systematically underpay their staff.

------
jsmith99
The National Audit Office also publish a visualisation of the Whole of
Government Accounts (best viewed on desktop)
[https://www.nao.org.uk/other/whole-of-government-
accounts-20...](https://www.nao.org.uk/other/whole-of-government-
accounts-2016-2017/)

The accounts themselves are very readable
[https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/whole-of-
governme...](https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/whole-of-government-
accounts-2017-to-2018)

~~~
alecco
In spite of a mostly balanced budget, the growth of non-current liabilites is
accelerating. I wonder if this just is due to an aging population and it's
effect in pensions or if there are other factors.

[https://www.populationpyramid.net/united-
kingdom/2017/](https://www.populationpyramid.net/united-kingdom/2017/)

~~~
666lumberjack
UK state pensions obey the so-called 'Triple Lock' rule where they increase in
payout yearly according to the greatest of: 1\. the growth in national average
earnings; 2\. the growth in retail prices as measured by the Consumer Price
Index; 3\. 2.5 per cent.

This causes an additional increase in pension costs over time on top of the
effect of the country's aging population and is a source of resentment among
some young people.

~~~
treerock
That's got to be offset by the increasing pension age?

Apparently accelerating the changes saved around £215bn (between 2011 and
2026).

[https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-49917315](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-49917315)

~~~
666lumberjack
In the short term maybe? A forward shift in age threshold is essentially a
one-time reduction to expected future pension expenditures, whereas the triple
lock and increasing post-retirement life expectancy are continuous increases.

~~~
stu432
If you think the raise of pension age is a one-time event, I think you'll be
sorely disappointed.

------
hardlianotion
That is a great idea. Understanding government expenditure on some level
should be a fundamental part of a citizen's participation.

I don't yet fully understand how to read it. It's not really clear to me what
the difference in income and expenditure is - the impression the diagram gives
me is other that income is balanced by expenditure, or that there is a budget
surplus maybe. I think I recall that there is a budget deficit that the
government runs.

Grateful for advice/corrections ...

~~~
barryfandango
Shameless plug colon my company does this for cities.

[http://burlington.openbook.questica.com/](http://burlington.openbook.questica.com/)

~~~
Spare_account
Did you use voice-to-text to type this comment?

~~~
barryfandango
That is an unfounded accusation exclamation point

------
frobozz
There, at the top of "Other Expenditures", Slightly smaller than running the
Office of the Secretary of State for Wales.

That is what's governing the entire political agenda right now.

That's the amount of money stuck on the side of a bus with the suggestion that
we could spend it on the NHS instead

~~~
ackshually
I didn't vote leave because of the money.

I voted leave because I was dubious about the control the elected and
unelected officials and secretaries in brussels had over British politics, and
the rats nest of well paid jobs with crazy benefits waiting for british
politicians in brussels when they retire from british politics, so long as
they play nice with the EU and go along with the will of the government in
Brussels.

The "NHS bus" is a talking point very aggressively focused on by the remain
campaign because it's an easy thing to point at as disingenuous, But I feel
like there's a lot more nuance to the choice to leave the EU than many
"remainers" believe.

It's harmful to national discourse to narrow the argument for either side down
to misinformation or this "they don't know what they're voting for" narrative
(not saying you're asserting this, I've just seen it said a lot) because it
chips away at the very concept of majority rule and proportional
representation.

~~~
gutnor
That's actually a good point and well said ... 3 years ago.

However, today you cannot make that argument with a straight face when Boris
is a PM with a very weak democratic mandate, actively undermining the
democratically elected Parliament, doubling down on the lies made by the
campaigns, pushing for highly damaging (according to the Government own
assessment) economic measure.

From the Cambridge Analytica scandal we know that the bus not only worked, but
it is the tip of the iceberg of a propaganda machine without conterpart in the
remain side.

I can't believe that on HN, Brexit is still seen as a "remainer" vs "leaver"
problem. Brexit has exposed a much deeper rot and threat to democracy, not in
the EU, but in the very heart of the UK institutions. Brexit is not a
liberating process, it is a threat.

~~~
fergie
(Lets call him "Johnson". "Boris" is either patronising or affectionate, and
neither is appropriate for a head of state.)

No Conservative government has served an entire term with an outright majority
since Thatcher in the 1980s. Johnson is in a sense "unelected", but his
premiership is no less legitimate than that of Cameron or Major.

Like it or not, Johnson was the "biggest" voice behind the successful Brexit
campaign, and it is therefore appropriate that he is tasked with making Brexit
happen, and taking responsibility for its success or failure.

Its completely fair to say that Brexit is an economically stupid and possibly
xenophobic project, but its not fair to say that Brexit is a threat to
democracy. Brexit is exactly what democracy looks like at its best: the people
forcing the ruling classes to make decisions that are against the ruling
class's own interests.

EDIT: Johnson is of course the head of government, not the head of state,
since the UK is a monarchy.

~~~
nvarsj
I’m not sure this is true. Cameron had a majority government after the 2015
election. Prior there was a coalition government which also held a majority.
May lost the majority after the snap election and had to build a coalition
with the DUP and others. In Johnson’s case he doesn’t have any majority at
all. It’s a weird situation that only exists afaik because of the fixed term
act, as the PM can no longer trigger an election when he loses the majority.
The current situation is far from normal.

~~~
NeedMoreTea
Correct, the Fixed Term Parliament act was _supposed_ to cure a government
supposedly "abusing democracy" by calling an election at their whim. Well at
least that seemed to be the LibDem line during the coalition.

In requiring a super-majority, and a search for a second government first it's
badly broken the system. As we can see, there is a government 20 odd votes
short of a majority stuck there. Stuck there having lost _every_ vote they've
called. Stuck there because they are trying to evade the extension parliament
voted for, that would take EU membership beyond an election.

I am intrigued though, that neither side has made calls to repeal the Fixed
Term Parliament Act, despite it very clearly not being fit for purpose.

~~~
benj111
"I am intrigued though, that neither side has made calls to repeal the Fixed
Term Parliament Act"

Boris Johnson doesn't want an election. It was suggested after the first vote
that he could table something that only required a simple majority, but he
didn't, you cant really argue it's people against parliament, when you are
(hopefully) a majority of parliament.

Those against a hard Brexit don't want an election now because it impairs
their ability to do that, plus its been nicely illustrated to them why you
don't want too much power to reside with the executive.

------
atoav
For Reference: this type of chart is called a "sankey diagram"

~~~
arethuza
It's a pretty neat way to visualize P&L in a pretty logical way (money comes
in on the left and goes out on the right).

------
the-dude
Dutch budget viz ( different ) : [https://rijksfinancien.nl/visuele-
begroting/2018/jv](https://rijksfinancien.nl/visuele-begroting/2018/jv)

~~~
lucb1e
Some things I found interesting:

\- We spend a billion on water management ("deltafonds"). I had no idea it
took so much upkeep. I also like subsection "experiments" of 21 million euros.

\- 21 million still goes to "healthcare for resistance fighters and victims of
world war 2", plus 246 million for pensions of the same group
([https://rijksfinancien.nl/visuele-
begroting/2018/jv/u/volksg...](https://rijksfinancien.nl/visuele-
begroting/2018/jv/u/volksgezondheid-welzijn-en-sport/oorlogsgetroffenen-en-
herinnering-wereldoorlog-ii) ). We're still paying for the after-effects of
war (though the amount went down by 5% relative to the year before).

\- 13 million (almost a euro per person) of the government's yearly budget
goes towards equal rights for different genders (including LGBT)
[https://rijksfinancien.nl/visuele-
begroting/2018/jv/u/onderw...](https://rijksfinancien.nl/visuele-
begroting/2018/jv/u/onderwijs-cultuur-en-wetenschap/emancipatie)

\- The climate budget section links to this site:
[http://klimaatagenda.minienm.nl](http://klimaatagenda.minienm.nl) If you
scroll down to "Is warmer eigenlijk erg?" ("Is hotter actually bad?") it
breaks it down in a way I haven't seen before. It also drives home just how
little we can oversee the consequences, e.g. going from "30% of species might
go extinct" at 2°C to "many go extinct" at 5°C (I'd say 30% is quite a
disaster already, can't imagine what +5 would bring us). The section below
that visualizes the options: what if we prevent the issues, or what if we have
to adjust to them?

~~~
MuffinFlavored
I see a section for €48b for national debt. I thought the Netherlands was one
of the few countries to not have debt?

~~~
lucb1e
I have no clue how a country can have billions of debt and not be declared
bankrupt or (at least) go through major cost-saving reforms. Many (most? all?)
countries have massive amounts of debt but apparently there isn't anyone who
isn't getting paid (given the amount of debt countries have, everyone should
have an uncle that is still owed $100k or so by their government, but I don't
know _anyone_ that works for the government and doesn't get paid, so
apparently it's not that kind of debt). I don't get it, but I'm not surprised
that we have a huge amount.

------
_edo
There are a couple of good graphs of the U.S. budget on wikipedia as well.

Take a guess at what you think we spend (dollars and percent of budget) on
major categories (defense, Social Security, transportation, education,
Medicare/Medicaid, SNAP, interest) and see how close you get.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_federal_budget](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_federal_budget)

------
hendry
I saw a nice gov revenue/expenditure of Singapore here:
[https://www.reddit.com/r/singapore/comments/cdtf4i/singapore...](https://www.reddit.com/r/singapore/comments/cdtf4i/singapore_goverment_revenue_and_expenditure_2018/)

Wish this UK one was in millions, not billions.

~~~
smcl
This is quite interesting, a sizeable chunk (roughly 16 out of 90 bil) come
from "Investment returns" \- I guess the SG government have substantial stakes
in businesses operating there?

~~~
kalleboo
Yes, including banking, real estate, telco, public transit, media monopoly,
port operations, and Singapore Airlines
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temasek_Holdings](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temasek_Holdings)

~~~
AdamGibbins
See also
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GIC_Private_Limited](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GIC_Private_Limited)

------
virgilp
Nice visualisation. But why is "VAT refunds" an income? And why is "Petroleum
revenue tax" an expenditure? (2.2B, coming out at the top of the 241B "Taxes
on income and wealth")

~~~
jon-wood
I can't say this with certainty, but my assumption here is that the UK
government buys products and services from the EU, for which it then reclaims
the VAT in the same way a business would.

Petroleum revenue tax just sent me down a bit of a rabbit hole - according to
[https://www.gov.uk/guidance/oil-gas-and-mining-petroleum-
rev...](https://www.gov.uk/guidance/oil-gas-and-mining-petroleum-revenue-tax)
PRT is effectively zero rated for any field approved after March 1993, but
because of government vagaries still exists as a concept. Given that I could
entirely believe that it costs the government more to adminster the tax than
they make in revenue from it.

~~~
virgilp
You're telling me that VAT refunds are greater than contribution to the EU? So
basically UK has an immediate net loss from brexit?

------
gorgoiler
It would be interesting to see the loops in this graph.

A few big ones: income tax on state pensions; National Insurance Contributions
taken out of NHS salaries; VAT (sales tax) paid on defence spending.

------
ur-whale
Independent of the amounts, where they come from and where they do, the
visualization methodology is amazingly good and useful.

------
Ambele
I was surprised that £69 billion (9% of the budget) goes to Wales, Scottland,
and Northern Ireland. That was until I found out that all three are part of
the UK and they contribute to the tax revenue.

Overall the budget is nicely balanced. I wish the US ran a deficit as small as
the UK's.

------
LandR
In case it isn't immediately obvious, this is the budget from 2016 it appears.

------
hallihax
Lovely visualisation, but this doesn't reflect the direction of travel
properly. Spending occurs before taxation. Taxation balances the books - not
the other way around.

------
maze-le
I love the zoomable UI, very neat and it gives a perspective on how "small" a
position of 800 million pounds can be...

------
ivanhoe
I like this WikiBudget idea, how do we add our own countries?

------
foobar_
This is really awesome! Needs more breakdowns.

~~~
redlorryyellow
If you look at previous years there is a lot more breakdown

------
catacombs
This is... not a good visualization.

------
davidiach
Nice visualization.

------
nahumba
The "Budget" is 702 billion. The expense is 698 billion. Now the department
expenditures is 702 billion. So they spend 4 more billions then they got. At
that point I laugh.

so you see the Hm treasure.

~~~
smcl
No, look closer. The deficit is £55 billion. What I think you're confused
about is that there's a £698bn allocation that seemingly magically feeds into
a £702bn budget for department expenditures. However the £4bn difference comes
from HM Treasury (it's quite a thin line at the bottom)

