
I own a domain that a big corporation wants to sue me into acquiring. Help - pagliara
http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/kyde9/i_own_a_domain_that_a_big_corporation_wants_to/
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ajkessler
Ugh, it hurts to read this kind of advice. Sue! Punitive damages! You can get
costs! (btw, you probably can't get punitive damages, at least from the little
info you've provided, and costs =/= attorney fees)

The best advice in that thread was to seek out on-campus legal aid. At the law
school I went to, there were clinics that dealt specifically with
entrepreneurship and IP. Look around, I'm sure other schools run similar
clinics. You generally don't even need to attend these schools to utilize
their services.

At the very least, if you can't find something like that, or the deal you're
working on is a little above their pay grade, some professor on campus can
point you to somebody that does good pro bono work or is willing to work on
contingency.

If it just turns into a negotiation, you _could_ do this yourself, but,
honestly, you're probably going to get taken to the cleaners, both financially
and emotionally, if you end up negotiating against professionals. Get a
lawyer. There's no shame in it. <http://www.ajkesslerblog.com/hired-guns/>

~~~
Kudos
I think the best advice he got was to contact the EFF, who are getting
together a list of lawyers who will help him pro bono.

~~~
ajkessler
Didn't see that advice, and don't know much about EFF, but yes, anything that
puts him in touch with a lawyer who actually knows what he's doing is good
advice.

I might also note that when hiring an attorney, you want to shop around, even
if you're getting pro bono work. Check references and ask around (you can ask
the lawyers you're interviewing about the other lawyers you've interviewed).
Don't just settle on the first guy you come across that has a diploma hanging
on his wall.

~~~
Kudos
It's been auto-collapsed somewhere in the thread, direct link to the
particular comment tree:
[http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/kyde9/i_own_a_dom...](http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/kyde9/i_own_a_domain_that_a_big_corporation_wants_to/c2o9qmk?context=3)

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lacker
_Their initial offer was $150. I said no, that I had put way too much money
into it for that low of a price. They came back with $250._

Anyone who's bickering about $150 vs $250 to acquire a domain is not a "big
corporation". The OP is being bluffed.

~~~
techsupporter
I looked around the WIPO site and found an arbitration case that meets the
facts the reddit poster claimed. Either he found a WIPO case and decided to
make it a huge "AskReddit," or, yes, the OP is going up against a quite large
company.

(Not linking here in an attempt to preserve privacy.)

~~~
bambax
Indeed, there is a case that seems to match all elements (domain starting with
a w).

If that case is indeed the right one, the complainants have had a trademark on
their mark since 1953, and yet they let the domain be first registered in
2005, and then bought by the current owner in 2011.

So, they could either have created the domain before 2005 or buy it between
2005 and 2011, but they chose to go against the current owner in June of this
year only.

There should be laws against such carelessness.

~~~
bambax
In fact the domain in dispute is a .org, while the company already owns the
.com; the .net belongs to a squatter.

I think what happened is, the company didn't care about other tlds than the
.com; the .org was bought in January of this year by the current owner,
legitimately, but, I presume, from a squatter (and that's why he says that
buying the domain in the first place was expensive enough).

And suddenly the company decides they need other tlds; from their point of
view they're all squatters; they're wrong, but their line of reasoning is not
absurd.

------
veyron
Every time I see a story like this, I think about <http://nissan.com/>

~~~
ricksta
how did they have so much money to fight the cases against nissan? Their
website seems like it was stuck in 1998. Why didn't they try to sell it to
nissan motors for like a mill or something?

~~~
beedogs
What amuses me is that the prices are all current, so the site is clearly
still being updated... maybe they're going for that "Classic Internet" look.

------
DaveChild
I have some experience of a similar situation, having at one point run a web
dev blog at ilovejackdaniels.com, before the JD legal team contacted me ...
and I'm on a new domain now.

The problem, as explained to me by a lawyer (I am not a lawyer, so don't go
taking this as legal advice, as I'm paraphrasing what I was told), is that
legal departments for really big corporations just care about winning. It
doesn't really matter whether they are in the right or not. What's going to
make it difficult for you is that they have a huge amount of resources that
you don't.

It sounds in your case like they have no actual case for cybersquatting or
similar. But that doesn't mean they won't sue you. And if you can't afford to
be sued, then that's an automatic win for them.

You also need to evaluate what level of stress and trouble you're prepared to
go to to protect the domain. It may suck, but there will be a point at which
it would be better for your sanity and your health to let them have the domain
and get as much as you can out of them for it.

If I were in your shoes (and I was) I would first visit a lawyer. Get some
proper advice.

~~~
masklinn
> I have some experience of a similar situation, having at one point run a web
> dev blog at ilovejackdaniels.com

it was awesome. Is that why the site died?

~~~
scq
It's still around, just called Added Bytes (<http://www.addedbytes.com/>) now.

------
thinkcomp
You can always file a USPTO TTAB opposition to any of that company's
registered trademarks. Or several. It's when you do several that they tend to
get our their checkbook--each opposition can cost mid-five-figures for a big
firm to defend, or in some cases even six.

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larrys
He states "They've already tried going through WIPO and lost. Now they are
telling me that if I don't accept a ridiculously undervalued offer they are
going to file litigation against me. I am a college student and can't afford a
lawyer. Can anyone give me advice? What should I do?"

Something is a little fishy about this. It doesn't make sense that he won the
UDRP without an attorney but hasn't been able to figure out an attorney that
can give him free legal advice on these issues. (Ref: reddit comments) (See
<http://www.esqwire.com> who gives free advice and has probably won the most
cases). In order to respond to the UDRP he would have had to do some research
and would have turned up the obvious suspects in this industry (Berryhill,
Goldberger etc.)

While people have won UDRP's without a response (I've seen it happen) it is
pretty rare.

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rickdale
I had a similar experience with Catepillar. They wanted to buy a domain I
owned for over 10 years, but was just parked at the time. They offered me
$1000 for the domain, I vehemently told them no. They threatened to sue me and
we settled before they took action at $5,000. I always thought the domain was
worth more, but at least its being used for something now.

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sudonim
On the converse of this, someone has been cybersquatting my last name for
about 10 years. Any advice on how to get it?

Details: I own the .co.uk version, but not the .com. My dad has had a company
registered (not in the US) with the name in it. The cybersquatter seems to
have squatted a bunch of dutch last names and isn't associated with the name
at all.

~~~
lemma
I'm on the same boat. In my case, I even attempted to contact using the "make
an offer" form and never received a reply. Strange way to do business.

~~~
cookiecaper
I would never do that. Domain squatters squat just waiting for someone to come
around and ask for the domain, that's why they buy them in the first place,
and then they try to sell at exorbitant rates ($15k-$20k in my experience).
Doubtless some companies pay that, which makes squatting profitable.

If you express interest in a domain name, the squatter knows they should renew
it forever because at some point when your company makes more money or
whatever you'll buy them out for the asking price or something pretty close to
it. If you don't express interest and no one else does either, and traffic is
minimal, the squatter will drop the domain as unprofitable (no money from the
ads on the parking page, no interested buyers = unprofitable domain).

~~~
lemma
I agree with you, but I did wait around a decade or so before I just got
curious one day. It's a fairly uncommon last name and the domain would just be
for personal use. Oh well.

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tomcam
This site may provide some help. They sold licensed fabric items on eBay that
contained Disney characters. Repeat, licensed. Disney tried to take them down
using DMCA and other strongarm tactics. They won against Disney using DIY
techniques--no lawyers involved! I know it's not the same situation but you
would be well advised to visit their site at
[http://www.tabberone.com/Trademarks/Articles/Tabberone/Fight...](http://www.tabberone.com/Trademarks/Articles/Tabberone/FightingBackAndWinning.shtml)

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DiabloD3
The only mistake he made was asking Reddit instead of a lawyer who specializes
in dealing with boneheaded corporate maneuvers.

Otherwise, I wish him luck.

~~~
joezydeco
Why was asking Reddit a mistake?

Put yourself in the OP's shoes. You're a college student and you get a notice
like this handed to you. It's not like you have an IP lawyer on retainer or
cash to run out and hire one instantly.

In fact, one helpful redditor pointed out that his college might have a law
school that would be willing to help with his case as a teaching exercise. I
bet the OP knew nothing about that, and that's worth the price of visiting
reddit alone.

~~~
maratd
Simple. It was a mistake because it looks like the kid would accept the offer
if it was larger. Go to an IP lawyer and watch dollar signs pop out of their
eyes. In a case like this, they'll assist with negotiating a fair price on
contingency. If the kid really doesn't want to sell, he can go to EFF or get a
lawyer to do this pro-bono. They love this sort of David vs Goliath stuff.

~~~
Confusion
You're suggesting an IP lawyer would take the case on a no-cure, no-pay basis?
Why is your HN advice more credible than the Reddit advice? Are you a lawyer?
Have you dealt with this situation? Or are you in fact armchair lawyering as
much as the Reddit commenters?

~~~
maratd
I asked my wife, who is an IP lawyer. That was her advice. Of course, you
would expect a lawyer to recommend to see another lawyer, but in this case, it
makes sense since there's $$$ involved.

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staunch
Even going so far as entertaining an offer could screw him in court. He needs
an IP lawyer familiar with this ASAP.

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jackvalentine
This has just reminded me I need to put up a splash page with my contact
information on my domain, which is myfirstmylast.com

Currently there is nothing there, but I use it for email every day - it'd be a
shame to lose the domain because it looks like I'm not using it to outsiders.

~~~
mjs00
There's no domain registration requirement for .com (that I'm aware of) for
you to have a public web page on a domain.

~~~
RexRollman
Exactly. A domain can be used for many things, not just HTTP.

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meiji
There's some good advice on the reddit thread and some poor. Making a counter
offer to the company could be construed as intent to make a buck on the sale
and end up muddying the water and causing him problems. Best thing in these
cases is to refuse offers.

------
epo
If they are trying to muscle you out of something which is not rightfully
theirs then level the playing field. Get as much publicity as you can from the
media, shame them into backing off or making a decent offer if it is something
they really want.

------
0x12
The fact that they start with offering you money weakens their case
considerably. That said, get yourself a really good lawyer if you want to hold
on to it and you think you have a strong enough case, be prepared to pay them
a lot of money.

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wildmXranat
I hope he kicks their butt.

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pbreit
Hire a lawyer on contingency and get the biggest payout you can, for goodness
sake. Then set up a new domain for yourself and count your blessings...winning
the lottery is very rare.

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cynest
What constitutes cybersquatting or having the rights to a domain you
purchased? When can someone who feels they could better use the domain sue?

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rumcajz
Sell the domain name to their largest and/or most aggressive competitor.

~~~
wdr1
Nobody would bite, as they would likely quickly lose the domain via UDRP.

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opendomain
I have never sold a domain. I have given domains away for FREE to Open Source
for 12 years, but I have been sued. It does not seem that the Big Corporation
has any rights in your case, but they have Big Lawyers, who can sue you into
the ground. Be VERY careful

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md1515
Good luck to him!

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tomelders
sounds like a job for 4chan.

