
A new JPEG format - fgeorgy
https://actu.epfl.ch/news/a-new-jpeg-format-for-virtual-reality-drones-and-s/
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pornel
That's not a replacement nor a competitor for the popular "JPEG" format. The
only commonality here is that it's coordinated by the Joint Photographic
Experts Group.

You'll never see JPEG-XS images stored on disk or sent over the web. This is a
special-purpose format for video signals on the wire (e.g. for transmission
between your graphics card and a 4K monitor). Currently if your cables don't
have enough bandwidth for the full uncompressed RGB signal, you get lower FPS,
or lower bit precision, or subsampled YCbCr. This is an attempt to make
something a bit smarter and apply cheap nearly-lossless compression on the fly
instead.

~~~
bartl
>You'll never see JPEG-XS images stored on disk or sent over the web.

I don't see why not. The image quality is near perfect, according to the
article, for not even double the average file size, and it uses much less
energy to encode and decode, so it's better for your battery life on mobile
devices.

~~~
pornel
Because this would be at least 5 times slower to transfer compared to regular
image formats, and on mobile a lot of energy goes to power the screen (while
user is staring at a blank one, waiting for data) and radios (which now have
5x more work to do).

JPEG XS has severe restrictions of realtime encoding and a 30-line buffer,
which are necessary for its goals, but make it a bad choice for anything that
doesn't have such limitations.

~~~
matte_black
Is it a bad choice, or an _impossible_ choice?

Because if it’s possible to send one over the web, I would like to see it
rendered with my own eyes. Speed be damned.

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matt_wulfeck
> _A new JPEG format for virtual reality, drones and self-driving cars_

The only buzzword missing from that list is blockchain, and I’m sure they
would add it if they could.

~~~
Sileni
_A new blockchain-based distributed image format for virtual reality, drones,
and self-driving cars, delivering maximum company synergy with minimal
downtime, vis-a-vis cloud dependency concerns_

Someone invest in me.

~~~
tombone12
You got a vote, in exchange I want 10% of all your karma for the next year, or
your account password retain the possibility of "correcting" the growth path
of your account.

Also: shit, you're penniless, why did I invest? Whyy?

~~~
therein
Yeah, he has only 40 karma. That's why you gotta do your due diligence. :)

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TazeTSchnitzel
So excited for JPEG 2000. It's the future!

So excited for JPEG XR. It's the future!

So excited for JPEG XS. It's

~~~
phkahler
Don't forget JPEG with 12-bit color depth. It's not clear to me if anything
supports it or not, and I haven't been able to find any image files that claim
to use it.

~~~
exikyut
_Hand-assembles on from raw bytes_

 _Upon receiving the file you discover no program will open it_

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joelthelion
Interesting concept. That said, I don't think the world needs yet another
patent-encumbured image format.

~~~
jbob2000
The patent will kill it in its tracks. mp3 is dead now because of the patent
(well, also because of streaming).

The open source community tends to provide a lot of the system-level
technology for using things like this and I'd expect them to completely ignore
a patented format.

~~~
IAmEveryone
MP3 was arguably among the most successful format in history, surpassed only
by html.

If it is dead now, which it isn’t, the patent has nothing to do with that,
because it actually just expired.

MP3 becoming less important is simply a result of incremental improvements on
its fundamental ideas, like AAP.

~~~
CyberDildonics
I would have to say that jpegs were more successful than mp3s

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qume
In the introduction paper [1], there is no mention of handling of raw images
which haven't been turned into RGB. I.e. it assumes an RGB image, not a colour
filter array (Bayer) image.

This is odd because the use case for this is sending the image from the
sensor, and the de-bayer step would therefore need to be done before the image
is sent, which is a lossy step and also can be quite slow and complex to do
well, which sort of compromises the point of this effort.

This is very much needed and I appreciate that it's happening. Looking forward
to a reference implementation.

[1]
[https://www.ibc.org/download?ac=3823](https://www.ibc.org/download?ac=3823)

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derangedHorse
I'm genuinely not seeing the usefulness here. There's always been a tradeoff
between image quality and the rate of compression. What they're basically
saying is that they are worsening the compression ratio for better image
quality, but they want to be the ones to slap a name on this 'new' paradigm
shift? Sure they're also making their own compression scheme, but it doesn't
matter all that much. We can pretty much gain the equivalent of what their
saying from just streaming images encoded with pre-existing lossless
compression schemes like png.

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niftich
Low-quality, buzzword-filled blogspam for
[https://jpeg.org/jpegxs/](https://jpeg.org/jpegxs/)

Some presentations and/or papers:

[1] 'Introduction to JPEG XS - The New Low Complexity Codec Standard for
Professional Video Production', Fraunhofer IIS & intoPIX SA,
[https://www.ibc.org/download?ac=3823](https://www.ibc.org/download?ac=3823)
(pdf)

[2] 'JPEG XS, a new standard for visually lossless low-latency lightweight
image compression', Fraunhofer IIS,
[http://publica.fraunhofer.de/documents/N-479925.html](http://publica.fraunhofer.de/documents/N-479925.html)
(login and/or paywall) (pdf)

[3] JPEG XS workplan from 2016, JPEG,
[https://jpeg.org/downloads/jpegxs/wg1n71031-REQ-
JPEG_XS_Call...](https://jpeg.org/downloads/jpegxs/wg1n71031-REQ-
JPEG_XS_Call_for_proposals.pdf) (pdf)

Essentially, a low-loss, partially-wavelet _video_ format heavily implied to
be applicable for pro video, in the vein of VC-2/Dirac.

~~~
pvg
It's just different article aimed at a different audience, it's not in any way
'blogspam'.

~~~
niftich
It's an article from a school whose faculty member leads JPEG. It namedrops
VR, space agencies, 5G; vaguely alludes to some upcoming work, links to
nowhere of interest -- it's university press release mixed with quasi-
marketing undertones you'd find in a business magazine.

I think we should strive for better sources than this, so I provided some.

~~~
pvg
Striving for better sources doesn't mean misrepresenting sources. The
university press release might not be to your taste but it's not 'blogspam' \-
it's not a lifted copy of the sources you are suggesting.

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niutech
How does it compare with MJPEG, which performs very well on even low-end
devices and is supported in most web browsers?

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ape4
Are files going to have .jpg extension?

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LeoPanthera
This is not an on-disk format. There will be no files. It's for low-latency
on-the-wire transmission.

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jrochkind1
Can we just skip JP2?

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tjwds
JPEG2000 is currently used in digital preservation and archival digitization,
and I'm not entirely sure if JPEG XS will supersede it.

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zokier
I'm entirely sure that it will not.

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redwolf2
Just use PNG

~~~
mcherm
For streamed video? Don't be daft!

