
Palm – The best small phone for minimalists, athletes, and kids - prostoalex
https://palm.com/pages/product
======
scarface74
Random Thoughts:

1\. If it is shipping with Android 8 - an old version of Android. What are the
chances that it will ever see any updates?

2\. My wife would have been the target audience for this form factor - pre
Apple Watch. Her phone is her least favorite device. She will leave it in the
car in a heartbeat. She won’t think twice if she leaves at home.

But now, she has a cellular Apple Watch and AirPods with a third party ear
clip. She doesn’t have to carry any phone.

3\. The battery life is atrocious. Even the Apple Watch has better battery
life for normal day to day use.

4\. I seriously doubt it has 16GB of memory - the cellular Apple Watch does.
That’s more than enough for local music playback without using cellular.

5\. This is the Zune of phones to me. But, yes I realize that the cheapest
entry point to our setup - phone + Watch is $800 if we did get A cheaper
headset. With AirPods it would be $959.

~~~
smoe
I wonder how bad the battery life is in practice.

They seem to be selling an always on battery saving mode as a quality of life
feature. Which is fine for me having do not disturb activated 90% of time on
my phone.

All the smartphones I had in recent years I had to charge overnight. Not
because they were depleted completely, but enough so that they usually run out
some point the next day. And I prefer to just plug the devices in at home
insted of carrying around cables and charging banks.

And related question: How well does the apple or other smart watches do with
audio interactions only? I have been playing with the tought of instead of
having a phone, using a smart pocket watch. So not even wearing on the wrist.
But just take it out once in a while and use headphones, for things like
accepting call, dictate messages/notes and chose spotify playlist.

~~~
MiddleEndian
I have one. I charge it every night or two. Sometimes it runs out of battery
but I don't care much. Web browsing, emailing, calling for a rideshare, and
other straightforward stuff is fine. If you're using Google Maps for turn by
turn GPS continuously in a car without a way to charge your phone via USB,
you'll run out of battery in a couple hours. If you play a bunch of
graphically games, I imagine it wouldn't be super great.

------
tomxor
This has already been solved... a true phone for "minimalists, athletes and
kids":

[https://www.nokia.com/phones/en_gb/nokia-5310](https://www.nokia.com/phones/en_gb/nokia-5310)

It's only 3cm taller, the battery will last you a week and it has no
distractions, oh and it's 34 quid.

More classic Nokia options here: [https://www.nokia.com/phones/en_gb/classic-
phones](https://www.nokia.com/phones/en_gb/classic-phones) I've had a Nokia
208 for 7 years, I take it rock climbing all the time, it's been crushed and
battered countless times and dropped from 60m - battery only lasts a few days
now so time to get a new one (a new battery not a new phone).

These phones are great for sports because they are so rugged and they are
cheap anyway so you can forget about them and focus on what you are doing. The
stick phone form factor is also better for fitting into a pocket without
restricting movement - I don't always want to take it on route but sometimes
forget it's in my pocket.

~~~
josefresco
Not available in the US?

~~~
plants
I've been looking for dumb phones with just talk, text, and GPS in the US for
years (at least two) now. The closest thing I've found is blackberry. I just
want a phone that 1. can get me to my destination if I'm lost and 2. doesn't
give me the opportunity to distract myself in other ways. I don't want to be
beholden to my willpower - I don't want to be able to download apps at all.

------
laputan_machine
This _looks_ really nice. I'm a fan of smaller phones, I currently own a Pixel
2, and if it was a tiny bit smaller, I think it'd be perfect.

However, saying that I think the challenge with this phone might be the
battery life. It comes with a free phone case with a battery pack(making the
size waaay chunkier than without the case), and the specifications don't
mention mAh, just 'battery life' (which from my experience is rarely
accurate).

According to [https://www.gsmarena.com/palm_palm-
pictures-9290.php](https://www.gsmarena.com/palm_palm-pictures-9290.php) it's
only 800mAh, and from the images it's clear that they're making the screen
look much larger than it actually is. Hmm.

I really dig the concept though.

~~~
chkgk
Local music playback, probably with display switched off, is only 9.5h. For
comparison, modern iPhones claim >60h just playing audio.

Another indicator is that all battery life examples are for activities that
typically have the display switched off.

So, I guess you are right. I like the size :)

~~~
noodlesUK
Has something happened to iPhones recently? My iPhone 8 can barely make it a
full day of sparse use without being charged...

~~~
josuepeq
I’m on a brand new 2016 model iPhone SE A1662. Full charge capacity is 100%. I
rarely get through the day before I have to charge again with moderate use.

I’ve been using a iPhone SE as my primary phone since summer 2016.

If I recall, my original new iPhone SE had great battery life. It was first on
iOS 9.

Up Until iOS 12, Battery life was fine on it. With iOS 12, had to get a
extended battery case; that held up As a workable solution until iOS 13.

At the end of last year, after iOS 13 came out I replaced that iPhone SE with
a brand new one I bought on fire sale.

That had an accident this week, which I replaced with another new iPhone SE.

For it, I set it up as a new device, without any apps, and not restoring from
any backup, I still have the same battery life.

I’m going to chalk it up to iOS background process bloat and third party
background app refresh, etc.

It will be I nteresting to see how iOS 14 Holds up on the iPhone SE 2016.

What can I say, I refuse to use a phone without flat sides, no headphone jack
and not of a reasonable size. I could take a few of those exceptions but all
three has been a no go for me. Really the new “meh” battery life is the only
complaint I have about this device.

Really excited for the rumored iPhone 12 5.4 inch since it may be about the
same size as the old SE; with flat sides.

~~~
ctdonath
“I’m going to chalk it up to iOS background process bloat and third party
background app refresh, etc.”

This. I’ve noticed my 6s is frequently warm, indicating heavy activity.

Top suspicion is Photos processing faces/recognition/etc.

------
shmageggy
It's weird that for a product whose main selling point is its size that you
have to scroll way down the page to get a clear image that shows its scale
relative to something recognizable, and even then it's not super clear.

~~~
tiziano88
When looking at the website on mobile, the first two pictures compare it to a
SIM card and a credit card, respectively

~~~
capableweb
Yeah, true! If you scale your browser window to mobile-size-ish, you'll see a
picture that compares it to a SIM card, that's a great comparison.

The second comparison is also visible on desktop, but it's not a very obvious
one, the CC size is kind of hidden, so could be better.

Weird to display different pictures for mobiles than for desktop, especially
when the mobile picture is way better than the animation desktop sees.

------
butz
Sadly, still on Android 8.1. If anyone is looking for small Android device
with a bit more recent Android version, check out upcoming Unihertz Jelly 2
[https://www.ogadget.com/x/jelly-2](https://www.ogadget.com/x/jelly-2)

~~~
cannam
Hm, some interesting design decisions with the Jelly 2 there. In particular,
if that comparison table is right, it's more than 16mm thick - I daresay none
of us have seen anything like that since the flip-phone days. And the payoff
is that you get quite a chunky battery for the size. I imagine there must be a
few people here who would happily take that.

~~~
GekkePrutser
I have the Jelly 1 and am very happy with it. Will definitely go for the Jelly
2. Thickness isn't so much an issue because the phone is so small. It usually
lives in the 'coincatcher' in my pocket and I hardly notice it's there. Only
issues are battery life and low specs (and no fingerprint!) but the Jelly 2
will solve that.

But the Palm doesn't solve any of those issues. No fingerprint scanner. Only
800mAh battery (Jelly 2 has 2000). Much lower specs, 28nm SoC. Single SIM.
Just nope.

~~~
frabbit
I found the GPS accuracy left a bit to be desired.

~~~
frabbit
UPDATE: according the promo video on their facebook page this one has
"improved GPS". No tech details on what that means.
[https://www.facebook.com/getJelly/videos/3438043796208898/](https://www.facebook.com/getJelly/videos/3438043796208898/)

------
sloshnmosh
WARNING

This device is produced by TCL that has a long sordid history of selling
phones with pre-installed malware, modifying pre-installed system apps to push
ads after firmware “upgrades” and customized social media apps that share low-
level user data with the Chinese manufacturer and reports of TCL devices
performing DNS rebinding attacks to access internal networks.

For more information visit XDA developers under “Joy launcher, no joy”

~~~
api
The entire mobile ecosystem is about spying, with any features these devices
provide being secondary to their primary function of gathering information on
their users.

Of the mobile platforms, Apple seems the least like this. They seem to
actually care about user privacy to some extent, but that's also because they
are the most expensive and therefore have revenue more closely tied to their
users as actual customers. I still wouldn't let Apple totally off the hook
though. They still gather telemetry, and apps on iOS spy as much as they can
possibly get away with. Virtually any mobile app is loaded with as much
spyware as can possibly be packaged with it and tuned to gather maximum data
without being too annoying or visible to the user.

It would be really hard to change this as long as there is such a market for
user data. It's too tempting to load apps (or the whole phone) with spyware
and cash in. Add to this the fact that governments around the world are
certainly in the game both financially and covertly. The only way to really
have a privacy-first mobile device would be to lock it the hell down and not
allow apps to do _anything_ without explicit user interaction... especially
location awareness or any kind of sensor or camera/microphone use. Even with a
really locked down phone apps would still try to find clever ways to gather
data, and there's a lot of exploitable surface area.

The only other way to fix it would be legislation. One way would be to
legislate HIPAA-like protections for intimate user data such as passive audio
recordings or location information. Leak a users' location info or sell it
without their permission? That will be $10,000 per violation, where a
violation is a single location data point for a single user. This would
instantly convert user telemetry data hoards from assets to liabilities. Of
course what would probably happen is all this stuff would just move off-shore
and into shell companies that can't effectively be fined or sued. Legislation
might not even work and might make the industry even shadier than it already
is. There's too much incentive to spy.

~~~
theshrike79
Apple is a hardware company, they don't earn a cent knowing who you are.

This is why they can lean hard on the privacy aspect, Google (an ad company)
can never follow them there all the way.

~~~
russdpale
But the app store allows that apps that collect all sorts of data on you, and
doesn't apple get a cut of the sales from apps? Just because its a few steps
transient doesn't mean apple has clean hands here.

~~~
miskin
True, but arguably they are making spying harder with each ios release. If
profiling and ads were their bread and butter, they would act differently.

~~~
retpirato
It may not be their "bread and butter", but that doesn't mean they don't do
it. Every time I see somebody talking about Google spying on users but 'X'
company doesn't do it, I start to think there just a fanboy to Apple or
whatever the company in question is. You should just assume EVERYBODY is
spying. Just because it isn't their primary source of revenue, doesn't mean it
isn't a source of revenue at all or isn't of value to them.

~~~
theshrike79
There are levels of "spying".

There is "enable microphone, listen in on conversations and adjust ad
preferences" and "upload all photos in the background for analysis" and "check
the clipboard for interesting stuff every few seconds"

Then there is just normal telemetry, anonymised and used for internal product
development.

------
kwhitefoot
IP68 does not mean you can swim with it [1] yet the web page says:

 _IP68 water and dust resistance means Palm is as rugged as it is elegant so
it can stand up to the most strenuous activities—whether you 're running,
swimming, biking or hiking._

Unqualified IP68 just means water resistant to a _static_ pressure of at least
one metre and the manufacturer is supposed to qualify it saying how deep it
can go which the page does not do. But also note the word _static_. If you
dive in then the momentary pressure could be significantly higher.

So I think this is quite clearly misleading advertising.

[1] [https://www.trustedreviews.com/opinion/what-is-ip68-ip-
ratin...](https://www.trustedreviews.com/opinion/what-is-ip68-ip-ratings-
explained-2947135)

~~~
anamexis
As someone who bricked an iPhone XS after swimming with it (in freshwater, at
depths < 1m), I can confirm this. Certainly took me by surprise. It was a $99
fee with AppleCare+ to replace it.

------
twelvechairs
Is this related to Palm Inc. (Palm Pilot PDAs) of the 90s and 2000s?

[edit: Looks like the answer is yes, TCL bought the Palm brand and is funding
this]

~~~
qwertox
Quoting from their page:

> December 11, 2018

> Meet the new Palm

> Back in 1996, Palm released the PalmPilot and forever changed the mobile
> handheld game. Today Palm is back—same name but a whole new company. We’re a
> small San Francisco-based start up harnessing that same innovative spirit to
> help bring people out of their tech and into their lives.

It looks like they bought the rights to the name.

~~~
mofosyne
Slightly disappointing, but hopefully they be able to carry on the legacy.
Even if it's only by name.

Might not be too bad if they managed to hire some veterans from PalmOS

~~~
jmtulloss
AFAIK they have not hired any Palm veterans (I worked at Palm but obviously
only know a small fraction of all the people that worked there)

~~~
neilv
When I saw the headline, I had a moment of hope they did something minimal,
efficient, privacy-respecting, and secure, looking a lot like touchscreen
PalmOS.

------
nihil75
Is this a new model, or the same one that sells on EBay for 80$? (Many were
made to be sold as Verizon-only "secondary device" and are now surplus).

If so, reports are that the battery life is extremely short.

~~~
jccalhoun
It is the same one they released back in 2018 from the specs:
[https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2018/12/palm-phone-review-
fu...](https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2018/12/palm-phone-review-fun-
endearing-and-bad-at-everything/)

------
smattiso
I have been using this as my daily minimalist phone for over 4 months. I love
it, with some caveats.

I bought it for a few reasons:

* Tired of lugging around a monsterous phone.

* Not allowing my Internet/web addiction to follow me everywhere.

* Wanted something small and waterproof for outdoor water sports emergencies.

I bought mine (an original Verizon edition) on ebay for 60 dollars. After that
you will want to run it through some debloat scripts which improves battery
and declutters the phone. Root it if you like, although I did not as I am
satisfied with the mods you can make without root. [https://forum.xda-
developers.com/android/development/release...](https://forum.xda-
developers.com/android/development/release-palm-debloat-fixes-script-t4052477)

I have purposefully crippled the phone and removed Google Chrome, Youtube, as
well as the Play Store.

Basically adb shell pm uninstall --user 0 com.google.____

I personally ripped out the Play Store so that I couldn't be tempted to
download Chrome/YouTube again. I downloaded every app I thought I would want
and now I sideload new apps with adb if I find other use cases.

I have considered the alternative use case of sideloading the store,
downloading the new app, updating my existing apps, and then removing the
store. However given the continuous obsolescence that occurs with phones, my
plan is to only update things as they break rather than constantly pushing
myself to the newest versions until eventually my phone becomes clunky and
unusable.

The phone does everything I want (Uber, Maps, phone, text, whatever!) and I
have 0 access to the web. I love it. You can't do this on an iPhone, I tried
many times and the closest is with parental locking but it doesn't work how
you'd like.

The downside is that the battery life kind of sucks, however I get a full day
of use out of it. I plug it in every night, I plug it in my car when I'm
driving and use Android Auto, and without the Web to distract me I only use it
for calls, texts, note taking, and to briefly look up maps, kitesurfing
forecasts, or to call an uber.

I can't wait for the exact same form factor with a 2x bigger battery. I'll
never go back to a mega phone for daily use.

Happy to answer more questions.

~~~
danial
My biggest problem with owning an Android phone is losing security updates
after a few months/years. Has happened to me before, even on a Google branded
phone (made by HTC).

Are you still getting security updates on this device? Do you think you're
likely to lose them in the near future?

Edit: I'm asking because I'm really tempted to buy. Sold on everything else.

~~~
smattiso
I don't think I'm getting security updates but frankly I haven't checked. I'm
not able to open web pages with my version so I think my risk is pretty
minimal aside from some exploitable silent SMS or Gmail bug.

The phone works for me, and I did a HUGE amount of research into my options
before buying. The Jelly 2 which I was previously unaware of looks to be
pretty slick, but for 60 bucks off ebay I don't think you can go wrong. YMMV

------
jamesliudotcc
I bought one from eBay for about $100 to try it as a minimalist phone. The
camera is bad. The battery life is abysmal. It is super duper slow but still
gets too hot to hold. It doesn't fit in any phone caddies like for driving. In
life mode, it keeps turning off bluetooth when I pause the audio on a podcast
or audiobook, which is really bad when you are driving and want to focus on
the directions for a second: now suddenly you lost your audio entertainment
(and possibly your turn by turn directions being read loud enough for you to
hear) until you can safely fiddle with the phone.

Overall, it was a pretty bad experience. I lost it in my car (probably under a
seat) and did not feel compelled to search for it.

Maybe it was worth the $100 to break the habit of reaching for my phone all
the time.

------
Narretz
Good to see there is a market for tiny phones. That gives me hope there's a
market for sub 5 inch screen phones as well. Or something not bigger as a
Samsung Galaxy A3 2017.

~~~
eloisant
I don't know. All I want is an Android between 5 inch and 6 inch, something
the size of a 2016 iPhone SE.

But all I see is either gigantic phones, or 3 inches phones like this one so
tiny they're barely usable as a smartphone. At that point why not just buy a
dumb phone?

~~~
blattimwind
> All I want is an Android between 5 inch and 6 inch, something the size of a
> 2016 iPhone SE.

That's much larger than the SE (4" screen, 125x60x7.5 mm, 110 g compared to 5"
screen, 140x70x7.5 mm, 150 g for the 2020 SE). Which is a really nice form
factor, and well suited for apps, but not so good for web browsing.

~~~
masklinn
> That's much larger than the SE

Not necessarily if they're talking about the diagonal of the phone: the SE1
has a ~138mm diagonal, which is ~5.4".

At 156mm the SE2 is a bit above 6.1".

Though by that measure the Palm here is hardly "3 inches", it's 4.2".

------
glial
For anyone looking for another alternative for a minimalist phone, I’ve been
following this for a while:

[https://mudita.com/products/pure/](https://mudita.com/products/pure/)

~~~
Fnoord
There's also the Light Phone 2, and arguably, a smartwatch is a "minimalist
smartphone". Personally, I own a Fairphone 3. The ThinkPad of smartphones, as
you can easily open/repair it.

I went to the website of Mudita Pure and found the following:

> Ultralow SAR value

> Mudita Pure is designed to reduce SAR (Specific Absorption Rate) value as
> much as possible, without compromising on the signal strength. In order to
> achieve this, we’ve made our antenna with in-house shielding, using patented
> technology that we developed.

> Good reception and ultralow SAR thanks to a custom antenna

> There are plenty of antennas on the market but none of them allowed us to
> maintain good reception while minimizing our exposure to radio frequency
> energy. We spent quite a bit of time and money (2 years, nearly $1 million)
> to develop and patent our own solution. We built our unique antenna in-
> house, using this patented technology (patent US 9,900,411 B2, EU 3185352).

I wonder what exactly their patent consists of, and how SAR matters. I also
wonder if the device is rugged, which OS it runs, and how good its gonna be
regarding software updates. Light Phone 2, in comparison, runs Android with
e-ink display.

~~~
kgwxd
Fairphone looks like exactly what I want. Why do all the cool phones not work
in the US?

~~~
Fnoord
There are reports about it working (till various degrees) in USA. Till what
extend, I do not know. Consult the forums for more information. Its a friendly
community.

------
Abishek_Muthian
I personally don't buy this premise of 'Improving your lifestyle, by including
friction in our products'. Screen size is not limiting someone from not
leaving Facebook, Instagram, TikTok etc. If they don't want to use it, they
can uninstall it on their existing device. These kind of devices just prey
upon compulsive buyers hoping 'If I buy X, my life will magically get better'.

Buying such tiny screen phones at this point of time would just limit the
productivity as an when needed, if that's all one needed they could dig up
their 10 year old android device with 2.5" screen or better buy a current
feature phone with 4G and 30 days standby time for fraction of the price.

IMO, If a new smartphone manufacturer wants to enter the space with the
premise of 'improving lifestyle', then perhaps they should build devices for
pure Linux smartphone OS like these[1][2] where productivity is available when
needed via web apps, supposed lifestyle culprit apps aren't available anyways
and help build a better ecosystem.

[1][https://store.pine64.org/product/pinephone-community-
edition...](https://store.pine64.org/product/pinephone-community-edition-
ubports-limited-edition-linux-smartphone/)

[2][https://postmarketos.org/blog/2020/06/15/pinephone-
postmarke...](https://postmarketos.org/blog/2020/06/15/pinephone-postmarketos-
community-edition/)

[3][https://puri.sm/products/librem-5/](https://puri.sm/products/librem-5/)

~~~
coffeefirst
I kind of agree. I’ve experimented with every gray screen/app organizing/focus
blocker technique on the hype train, and in the end it’s mostly window
dressing: the hard part is breaking bad habits.

~~~
scarface74
I had some really horrible habits and distractions with my phone. Anytime that
I should be focused on someone else or something else, I leave my phone at
home - or in these days in another room since we don’t go out and just have my
Apple Watch on me.

------
andrepd
It's rather irritating that you either have 6 inch behemoths which simply do
not fit my pocket (and imo promote unhealthy smartphone addiction), and the
only alternative is a ridiculously small phone with loads of practical
drawbacks.

Where are the 4 inchers?

~~~
slim
[https://www.nokia.com/phones/en_int/nokia-1-0](https://www.nokia.com/phones/en_int/nokia-1-0)

~~~
abrowne
I bought one of these (Nokia 1) earlier this year and love it! It was
available in the US from Amazon, but I think it's been discontinued, replaced
by the much larger Nokia 1 Plus.

------
_bxg1
This came out a couple years ago and it got bad reviews:
[https://www.theverge.com/2019/2/6/18212311/palm-phone-
review...](https://www.theverge.com/2019/2/6/18212311/palm-phone-review-time-
well-spent-life-mode-lite-verizon)

------
jccalhoun
I think this is the same phone that has been out since late 2018
[https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2018/12/palm-phone-review-
fu...](https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2018/12/palm-phone-review-fun-
endearing-and-bad-at-everything/)

------
raffraffraff
Well done Palm. I thought you were dead! Shake up the phone business with your
waterproof spotify player. Count me in.

Seriously though, most of the reasons I need a phone are covered by a tiny
device. NFC pay, music, camera, phone calls, oncall alerts...

~~~
eb0la
I was hoping this was made py Palm, Inc (sold to HP?); but It is a different
company: Certificate by Letsencrypt, and the TOS say somethong about "Palm
Ventures Group".

~~~
aasasd
Afaik the olde Palm sold the software, i.e. the OS—while the hardware business
remained with someone else, as if it would do any good by itself.

I seem to remember the logo, even.

~~~
scarface74
Not the hardware business - just the name.

------
hliyan
They could afford to make this a bit thicker and more rounded. At this size,
its ability to fit snugly into your palm (no pun intended) is more important
than any perceived benefit of thinness. I personally believe such "egg-shaped"
devices will become the dominant hand-held form factor, with tablets as
supplementary devices.

~~~
hawski
I'm eyeing Unihertz Jelly 2. It has soap form factor with 2000mAh battery, but
sadly it has Mediatek SoC.

[https://www.ogadget.com/x/jelly-2](https://www.ogadget.com/x/jelly-2)?

~~~
onli
The first one was not great, the display specifically. Maybe that changed? I'd
wait for a review on that.

That Android does not work well with a device that small should remains as an
issue, but at least the gesture controls it has now could help a bit.

~~~
hawski
There is a preproduction unit review and it looks promising:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UxUDmGHl7Eo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UxUDmGHl7Eo)

~~~
onli
Looks a lot better :) The hardcoded buttons at the bottom are a pity though.

------
barrkel
We need the ability to switch phones more easily than a SIM swap.

Getting a paper clip or equivalent out is too fiddly, and the cards are too
easy to drop or lose.

If we can get to a place where your phone number is an account that your phone
is logged into, then your choice of phone can become more like a fashion
accessory for the day, and be selected on the basis of events, rather than
needing to be all things for all occasions.

~~~
scarface74
From a practical perspective, if you have multiple devices with a cellular
data plan you could do this with third party voip services. But you are paying
for multiple data plans.

Of course on iOS devices, you have to have at least one phone as the central
device with a voice plan but then someone calls your phone, your iPad and your
watch will ring. But you still have to have multiple data plans.

Ignoring the cost, my watch ($10/month), phone ($35/month), and iPad
($20/month) all unlimited plans serve the purpose.

My watch when I don’t want to carry my phone or take it out of my pocket, my
phone for the normal use case, and the iPad when I want a larger screen or do
lighter productivity by just pairing my BT keyboard and mouse.

------
sradman
John Gruber prefers the feel of the 2.31” classic width iPhones [1]:

> Feel matters. And to me, the classic 4-inch display form factor shared by
> the iPhones 5, 5S, and now SE [1st Gen] feels the best in hand. This is
> obviously highly subjective, but in my mind it’s not even a close call.
> There are obvious reasons to prefer the larger 4.7- and 5.5-inch models, but
> how they feel in your hand isn’t one of them.

The ultra-mobile Palm is 2” wide with a 16:9 720p screen and almost half the
weight of the 1st Gen iPhone SE (63g vs 113g) but half the battery capacity.

[1]
[https://daringfireball.net/2016/03/the_iphone_se](https://daringfireball.net/2016/03/the_iphone_se)

------
jankotek
I have very good experience with Elari NanoPhone. Only 30 grams and 5 days
battery life. It can serve as a standalone feature phone with mp3 player.

But it can also work as bluetooth headset and dialer for bigger phone. In this
case it synchronizes contact list.

------
adamw2k
I bought one of these on eBay for like $75 and use it as a running companion,
which I pretty much love. Using Google Fi, I throw a data only SIM in and it
runs Spotify and acts as an emergency phone. After an hour run with next to no
screen time, the battery is usually close to 50%, but definitely beats
carrying a jumbo phone along. I wish they could improve on the battery, even
if it was 10-20% larger (typing is really tough), but I don't know of anything
else like this save for the Pebble Core, which never saw the light of day.

------
pmontra
> OS: Android 8.1

Ops.

> Security: Face unlock

Hopefully not the only method.

> Dimensions: 50.6 X 96.6 X 7.4mm

Wonderful.

> Weight: 62.5 grams

More than wonderful.

> GPS Workout: Up to 4 hours and 45 minutes

My old Sony Xperia Compact records GPS all the day long. I used it to record a
8:00 to 20:30 bicycle ride one year ago. Sorry for the Palm.

~~~
tobych
What do you mean by "Ops"?

~~~
capableweb
Android 8.1 was released in August, 2017, so it's very old. Although, it did
have it's latest update just one month ago, so hopefully the security would be
alright, even if it doesn't have the latest features.

But my guess is that the target market for Palm doesn't really care about the
latest features, they care about gear that works and fits normally in a hand.
So probably not a big issue really.

~~~
Carpetsmoker
The device was released in Oct 2018 though, so at the time it was the newest
Android version (9 was just released, probably too late in the Palm dev
cycle).

The $280 price tag is a biggest show-stopper IMO (and according to the Palm
website that's a "sale" from the $400 price tag, although I never quite trust
that). I paid $70 for my basic Android device (Samsung Core A2) and that works
just fine as well (with some minor caveats/limitations of Android Go, such as
the screen not lighting up when there's a notification).

------
ibotty
That's the one, right?
[https://www.gsmarena.com/palm_palm-9290.php](https://www.gsmarena.com/palm_palm-9290.php)

------
peterburkimsher
If it had an SD card slot, I'd be likely to buy one. But without expansion, I
don't see the benefit compared to my iPhone 4S + Third Rail case.

[https://palmsupport.zendesk.com/hc/en-
us/articles/3600345300...](https://palmsupport.zendesk.com/hc/en-
us/articles/360034530092-Does-Palm-have-an-SD-card-slot-for-memory-expansion-)

------
hijef
I was obsessed with this phone a couple years back, but was annoyed that it
was only available as a companion and locked to Verizon. I'm a Google Pixel
lover because of the simplicity, software, and size. But I have always wanted
a phone that was super small and was for essentials.

I think I might buy it!!!

------
HenryBemis
1) my NoScript and my PrivacyBadger lit up on this website, wow!!! The amount
of crapware/scripts running on this website is top shelf tracking!!

2) financing for $280?? Why would someone get into debt to buy a phone? This
is an insult to minimalism

------
agumonkey
I found a bunch of old cellphones, and the smaller form factor was really a
delight (also the inherent sturdiness due to less complex design and less
glass).

Good on them to try.

ps: also for the non young and average person, android is just a bit too deep

------
yodelshady
I really miss my first smartphone - a Galaxy Ace 2 that I got in final year of
undergraduate. The difference between "I can send this email/check this wiki
page" and not is massive. No newer phone has improved on the Ace 2 for that,
but they are _much_ more distracting.

Oh, and it played music to headphones. Through a simple, reliable, well-
supported port that _also supplied power_ , whilst consuming far less.

That said, 3.3" is pushing it. Nor do I have any confidence of support, or -
outside the US - proper 4G (it might work - I'd have to check).

65 mm wide phone with stock android please.

------
franze
Love it!

I for one leaving my iPhone XR at home during my vacation. Taking an old
iPhone 5s with me.

The XR has become my always with me office. Where it is, work is, too. So I
will not bring it with me.

I might be crazy, but I don't think I am alone.

Love the PALM idea.

------
yamrzou
You know what minimalist phone I want to see?

One that has calls, sms, an online chat and video app (like Whatsapp) and a
navigation app (like Google Maps or Citymapper).

No browser, no games, no social media, nothing else.

~~~
bonoboTP
You can uninstall the browser and social media on most Android phones
(sometimes you can only "disable" them, but the effect is almost the same).

------
stewbrew
Is this a Palm branded device by TCL? Who actually made this device?

------
Twisell
Really nice concept the size should rejoice people looking for a practical,
streamlined and small smartphone...

BUT

Why on earth did they have to rippoff both original iPhone design and the
watchOS appscreen??? I hope for them that Apple have learn yet that it's not
worth the energy suing a small player. But still it's maddening that they
can't thing of something else than such obvious copy-paste approach. Next time
hire some designers to produce something more original for the love of earth!

~~~
bayindirh
Because back in the day, iPhone have ripped off both home screen and Today
application's designs (which was a very useful third party tool which provides
an overview of your day with relevant notifications) from PalmOS.

In other words, design goes both ways. There's no ripoff from my point of
view.

If you ask me, they've applied the paradigm in a pretty neat way, which was
Palm's strong point back in the day.

------
uaaiIbab
What's the point of having a small, minimalist phone if it's going to be
roughly the same price as a normal phone anyway?

~~~
josefresco
Exactly. I seriously considered buying to replace my iPhone 6 but at $350 it
was too costly. I would have bought two for $149 though. I also didn't like
how it seemed like an Android "dead end".

~~~
MiddleEndian
The full price is a ripoff, but you can buy them refurbished on Amazon for
cheap.

------
dade_
If the Palm is the only device I have on hand, I want the camera to be very
good or great and his was my deal breaker. It is also V1 hardware which I
never buy because there are always unfixable issues and sometimes companies
don’t survive their first product (this is a startup that licences/bought the
brand).

------
pickledcods
The quality of the site usually reflects the quality of the product because
they both share the same mindset.

Linking to 15 external sites, most of which I not have seen before and reddit
for a single promotion page gives me the impression its less about the product
and more about the clicks.

------
JustinGarrison
I wrote a review of the phone after using it as my primary device for a while

[https://www.justingarrison.com/blog/palm-companion-
review/](https://www.justingarrison.com/blog/palm-companion-review/)

------
nailer
I've been thinking of buying one of these, but waiting for the V2 - the
battery life and large bezels on these isn't great.

But if they keep the size, reduce the bezels, and bump the battery up they'll
definitely have my money.

------
kalyantm
As someone with the iPhone SE, i am waiting (and will forever wait) for a 4',
no bezel, iPhone SE (what should have been the actual successor to the iPhone
SE, rather than the iPhone 8 body)

------
6510
2 x 3.8 inch = 5.08 x 9.652 cm

------
fergie
Looks nice, but I just want an iphone 5 sized iphone with a decent battery.

------
overcast
I was expecting some type of non smart phone. Apparently minimalist just means
take the usefulness out, by making the screen size prohibitively small.

------
11235813213455
I thought it'd have been a joke, showing nothing, since we don't need
smartphones, especially kids, minimalists and people doing exercises

~~~
nailer
Minimists still need to.meet their friends and athletes still need to measure
their distance or reps.

~~~
growt
They already did that before smartphones existet. And minimalists probably
should choose a less technical way to meet friends?

~~~
nailer
Maybe. But a whiteboard, marker, stopwatch, GPS, and a map seem like a bit
much for a minimalist.

------
robertlagrant
Is "Life Mode" basically, "we conserve our small battery's life by not having
any processing while the screen's off"?

------
ahmedbaracat
The "life-mode" is nice, does anyone know if it is possible to create
something like it for Android phones with the current tooling?

------
kstenerud
What is with the font on this site? It's like looking at an out-of-alignment
CRT, and nearly impossible to read :/

------
m1sta_
Life Mode needs to allow calls, but turn everything else off.

I suspect I'd buy one of these if I could play with it in person first.

------
xellisx
I want a new phone with a slide out keyboard that doesn't cost $600, has a
good camera and a large battery.

------
nikdoof
Nothing says "we're lying about the battery life" more than including a free
battery case...

------
coronadisaster
That is a pretty bad font they use, at least on my old monitors, parts of some
letters are almost missing.

------
mnming
It does not seem to have NFC? Ahh, I would definitely buy it if it does.

~~~
MiddleEndian
I can confirm. It does not have NFC.

------
7952
I wonder if this kind of form factor would work as an action camera.

------
nitrogen
Is there any relation to the old Palm, e.g. Palm Pilot/etc?

------
bookmarkable
Is this paid placement? How did this get on the front page?

------
Animats
Is this from the company that did the Palm line of PDAs?

------
Razengan
From a quick skim, it seems like just another phone?

~~~
GordonS
It is, except it's about the size of a credit card - that's a really appealing
size for some people, either to replace their current behemoth, or as a second
phone when you want something tiny.

------
systemvoltage
Plam needs to think about a better logo.

------
markstos
The best phone for kids is your old phone.

------
rgrs
It it available worldwide or only in USA?

------
xchip
The best according to the salesman

------
dwighttk
Pretty sure it’s pronounced PLAM

------
m3kw9
They should reissue the treo650

------
pjmlp
> OS: Android 8.1

Nope, thanks for the effort.

------
rodolphoarruda
If it runs Strava and fits into the back pocket of my cycling jersey, it's
sold.

------
mister_hn
Why not Android 10 ?

------
chadlavi
So... another Android knock off of an iPhone, but also it's tiny?

------
Igor_Wiwi
does it support contactless payment?

------
MiddleEndian
I have a Palm Phone. I've been using it for a year or two now. Full disclaimer
that 80% of my phone activities are timing things, emailing notes to myself,
and informing my friends I've arrived somewhere or will be late (although I do
use other features as well).

The positives:

\+ The small form factor. You can't really comprehend how small and light it
is unless you see one in person. It's almost comical when you first hold one.

\+ Because the screen is tiny. it's incredibly easy to use one handed. You can
use swipe text and swipe from the top for notifications and such with your
thumb very conveniently. It also fits in my pocket effortlessly.

\+ The home screen is kind of like Windows Phone in that you have a bunch of
icons and you swipe down to view them.

\+ It never bothers me, ever. Like Windows Phone (prior to 10), it simply
never notifies me about much of anything. It is designed to be a device that
serves me, rather than actively demand my attention. Nothing changes
unprompted. No notifications that cannot be dismissed, and rarely a
notification at all. Because it runs Android 8.1, I can disable all the
useless notifications that Google added in Android 8.0. Honestly I rarely even
get chat notifications unless I have those programs in the foreground, which I
find to be fantastic. If the screen is off, I can live in peace. It doesn't
even have one of those little lights that many other Android phones have on
the front to insist upon notifying you about about SOMETHING.

The neutral:

~ People in public will ask you what your device is if they see it. I find it
fun but others may not.

The negatives:

\- Verizon. Everything about Verizon. It sells them for some absurd price like
$250, but you can buy them on Amazon refurbished for under $100, which is how
I got mine. Also for some reason they marketed it as a "companion phone" and
for a good chunk of its life you could not buy this as a standalone phone. I
do not use Verizon, but I am not 100% sure if it works as a standalone device
on Verizon's network (which is a general failing of Android in that your phone
provider can somehow control how your device is used). Also because I have
mine unlocked, there is one notification upon restart that tells me I am not
using Verizon that I have to swipe to dismiss, and there is no way to disable
this notification (another failing of Android in general that any notification
exists that one cannot permanently disable).

\- Like most (all?) Android phones, you cannot uninstall a bunch of the
useless shovelware it comes with, like Google Play Movies.

\- Swipe text is a bit harder to use accurately.

\- If you swipe to the side on the home screen, it brings you to an entirely
useless news page. There is no way to disable this (I suppose I could
investigate changing the launcher entirely, but I imagine most won't work well
on a 3.3" screen). If there is a way to disable it I missed in the 15 minutes
of mucking around, there's no community large enough to have discovered it and
posted the solution online. Not something I think about often but something to
keep in mind.

\- Battery life is not great. If you're a heavy phone-user, you won't like
this device. If it were a little thicker, you could get more battery life out
of it with the same form-factor benefit. Also, the little hole to eject the
sim card is so small that no needles I have will fit in it. But honestly I
sometimes let my phone die for a day even when I had a phone with longer
battery life, so I don't really care.

\- The screen resolution is 720p. Some programs are designed for 1080p or
greater, so there will be overlapping text or icons.

\- There will probably never be an update. Nobody knows what it is.

Conclusion:

For me, it's easily the least bad Android phone I've ever had, possibly better
than Windows Phone. I'll be bummed out when it no longer works with the modern
web and programs, but hopefully I'll get a few more years out of it at least.

~~~
hijef
Thanks for this write up. I have also been nervous about the companion part. I
was annoyed when I first learned that and it was locked. I've been wanting a
small phone that was android just for things like Spotify, taxi, Gmail, gps,
and text/phone. just essentials virtually.

~~~
MiddleEndian
It absolutely functions without the companion part (at least on non-Verizon
networks) and can be bought unlocked online. I haven't tried smattiso's
debloating options, but there is a "fold" in the launch screen, where I put
all the useless apps so I don't have to see them often (except when I go past
the fold to look for rarely used programs like the Play Store or Settings).

Overall, it's about as close as I've gotten to Windows Phone on an Android
device, with the bonus of Android ecosystem for some essentials like Lyft,
plus the tiny size.

------
throwway253
These will certainly be popular in prisons

------
dvfjsdhgfv
Unfortunately it's running a system designed to profile and track users, so
you can hardly call it "the best" for anyone.

------
m0xte
I can’t see anything I’d choose in this over an iPhone SE. The smaller size
doesn’t sell it. I imagine it’d be an inconvenience.

