
Australian traffic button pushes beautiful design - oska
http://www.abc.net.au/science/articles/2016/02/09/4401055.htm
======
notzorbo3
There are some places in the Netherlands that have great pedestrian/bike
traffic buttons.

\- They have distinct ticking sounds for: locating them (slow tick), when the
button has been succesfully pressed (slightly faster tick), when you can walk
(very fast tick) , when the traffic light will turn red soon (intermittent
fast tick) so you know to hurry up and then back to the normal slow tick.

\- They have a ring of leds around the button that lights up when you've
pressed it and then counts down by turning of the leds one by one to when the
light is gonna turn green.

\- The ticking can be felt through the entire pole

\- Often there are two traffic lights on it. One big one above and a smaller
one at eye-level.

Here's a button that shows the wait-indicator ring:

[https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/95/Tr...](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/95/Traffic_light_switch_0823.JPG/220px-
Traffic_light_switch_0823.JPG)

They're not available everywhere unfortunately.

~~~
jonshariat
I wrote a post a while back about how count down timers on pedestrian walkways
can have unintended consequences.

[http://www.tragicdesign.com/blog/bad-design/tell-me-when-
to-...](http://www.tragicdesign.com/blog/bad-design/tell-me-when-to-go-bad-
ux.html)

Cars can spot them as they drive and try to run yellows more often.

~~~
jhayward
> Cars can spot them as they drive and try to run yellows more often

They can also be used to avoid panic stops. I watch them and begin braking if
the light will turn yellow before I enter the intersection. Safer an less
stressful.

------
softgrow
When I see one of these I reminded of Jan Gehl saying they are for reminding
people who walk that they must keep asking permission to cross the road
(cartoons at [http://reviewanew.com/2014/11/17/the-cartoon-case-for-
walkab...](http://reviewanew.com/2014/11/17/the-cartoon-case-for-walkability/)
). They might be attractive to some, but you soon tire of them. In the last
five years the design has changed to remove the red light just above the
button to acknowledge your request has been received, so now if it isn't
working you'll never know. As Jan Gehl keeps saying to governments who invite
him over here, you need to remove the buttons but that seems to fall on deaf
ears. However we've been able to detect people who drive and even those on
bicycles now with ease. Sigh.

~~~
ubernostrum
_people who walk that they must keep asking permission to cross the road_

Driving and walking are wildly disparate modes of transportation, and having
them coexist in adjacent physical space and intersect each other inevitably
requires some set of rules describing who will have priority and when.

Many intersections in cities simply have a fixed repetitive cycle of granting
priority to different modes in different directions each in turn
automatically. Those which require explicit "requesting" of priority typically
occur when traffic of a given mode or in a given direction is light enough,
compared to other modes/directions, that the overall highest throughput occurs
from explicit request. It's also not incredibly burdensome to use a button for
this in the case of the pedestrian; detection mechanisms for motorized
vehicles/bicycles on the road are there because a button would be unwieldy for
those vehicles, not because designers of intersections want to force
pedestrians into some type of ultra-lowest-class group. Indeed, the "high
class" (in your view) automatic detection is often unreliable and leads to a
far more conscious feeling of having to work to obtain priority, as vehicles
shift forward and back hunting for the magic spot that will trigger the
detector.

And honestly, the number of buttons which are non-functional but simply exist
to provide a placebo feeling of speeding up an otherwise fixed pattern in
which everyone gets priority in turn makes it kind of a silly argument anyway.

~~~
arghbleargh
It makes sense to control pedestrian traffic in some intersections, but it
just seems like they're not even trying to optimize pedestrian throughput.
What makes the lack of feedback for crossing buttons worse is the fact that
many of them are so conservative about letting you cross that you question if
they are working. I encounter a lot that will refuse to let you cross if the
light is already green, even if there is still plenty of time left.
Unfortunately, lowering pedestrian accidents looks great, while saving
pedestrian time is hard to measure.

~~~
jclulow
I would much rather be safer than a few seconds faster.

~~~
jdavis703
What if you miss the train and have to wait 15-30 minutes longer because of a
red light?

~~~
CaptSpify
Then you shoukd have left 5 minutes earlier.

------
muzster
I prefer the beauty of the secret british pedestrian button.

Source: [http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs-
ouch-22706881](http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/blogs-ouch-22706881)

------
anotheryou
I don't like the doubled arrow and the separate button.

In germany things are worse though: sometimes no feedback at all, feels like a
hard cover plastic without any feedback at all. It seems to register touch (
_some_ do have a "please wait" lighting up when you touch it).

For the blind there is a nub hidden underneath. It has an embossed arrow on it
and because of its horizontal orientation it can point precisely to the right
direction. It vibrates when it's safe to cross. However this is the place that
stays wet the longest after rain and where people smear their chewing gum and
the cleaning personal doesn't even see it. I still enjoy the buttons, so I
don'\- have to focus on the lights all the time.

edit: when you don't know about the nub for the blind, there is no arrow
indication at all. When standing on an isle in the middle of a street and
there are two buttons on one pole opposed to each other, I never knew which to
press: the one facing where I want to go, or the one facing me while I face
where I want to go (I think it's the latter)

~~~
djsumdog
Yea the German ones were weird. My ex (who is legally blind) would use the
blind button, but wasn't sure if it actually did anything. They have no feed
back of visual indicators otherwise.

I really like the New Zealand ones. They're like the Australian ones, but the
red guy on the other side only lights up after it's been pressed (instead of
the little red dot that's on the button for the Australian ones).

Also there were a few Australian ones that switched to the non-button feed
back. OMG they sounded awful. There were like two where I lived. I think they
were an experiment that failed and were forgotten about.

~~~
anotheryou
I also still don't know (living here all my life). It moves in quite a bit
though...

------
bitwize
These things are so much more satisfying to mash than their American
counterparts -- often, a tiny little nubbin that's very hard to push (and may
become completely frozen in winter, meaning you are thoroughly hosed).

Deployment of alternative switches (a convex masher, a touch-sensitive dingus
which vibrates slightly when it detects your press) has been uneven at best
here.

~~~
kevindong
To be fair, not _all_ American models are like that. In fact, a decent portion
of the buttons in my town are very similar to the one described in the
article.

But, then again, I live on a college campus which has higher standards for
accessibility than most areas in the US.

~~~
bitwize
Hence my comment about mixed deployment of alternative switches.

------
woolly
I love the big chunky button on these things, but I have a few implementation
niggles that someone might be able to shed light on.

My main gripe is that the buttons aren't symmetrical with their partner button
pairs on the other side of the traffic flow. If I'm approaching the junction
and there's someone on the other side of the traffic waiting to cross already,
the green man on my side should also activate when the lights change. Means I
end up having to do this jaunty quick-step fencing lunge to stab at the button
if I see the lights changing, which I usually just miss out on then have to
wait to cross.

~~~
partomniscient
Or the annoying behaviour that there's no 'automatic mode' in peak hour, where
there's a whole bunch of pedestrians waiting to cross on both sides every
phase and everyone else assumes someone else has pushed the button, then the
lights change and there's no green man...

~~~
Dylan16807
Why do you need a green man to cross when you have a green traffic light?

~~~
ptaipale
Different places have different practices and different legislation. In some
places, walking at a red light is forbidden and there could even be a fine. In
some others, your red man indicates that even if there is a green light for
some vehicles (going straight ahead), there might also be a green arrow light
that tells turning vehicles have right of way. The green man tells you that
you can go.

~~~
Dylan16807
It's easy enough to see if there's a green arrow. Is that the actual problem?
Or is every other signal identical to the situation where you're supposed to
cross, except for the one on the crosswalk itself?

~~~
riskable
Because of shades surrounding the traffic lights (to prevent glare from the
sun) it is often impossible for pedestrians to see if a turn signal is lit
from their perpendicular position.

So in the event of a red light for through traffic but a green light for
turning traffic you don't want pedestrians crossing the road. That's why it is
important to have separate lights indicating when a pedestrian may cross.

~~~
ptaipale
Right - and even without any shades, there are places where I can't see at all
the light that permits vehicles to cross my path.

For instance, if I'm crossing the road here
[https://goo.gl/maps/favpGxyKTLk](https://goo.gl/maps/favpGxyKTLk) (this is on
my daily cycle commute)

there is no way for me to know when there is a green arrow light for vehicles
that come from opposite direction and turn left (and therefore come my way).

The buttons requesting green man for pedestrians and cyclists is, btw, known
here as "humiliation button" (because it forces cyclists to stop; there is
automatic detection for motor vehicles on the driveway, but for pedestrians
and cyclists they haven't found a reliable way to do it).

------
kalleboo
These are the standard crosswalk buttons in Sweden.
[http://www.prismatibro.se/en/prisma-
daps-2000-eng/](http://www.prismatibro.se/en/prisma-daps-2000-eng/)

The whole front is push sensitive, the lights are circular so they can be seen
from the sides as well, and the side has a relief map of the crosswalk for the
blind.

I didn't realize even these things have NFC in them these days

~~~
ptaipale
We have those in Finland as well, and I hate the lack of feedback when
touching it. The sound seems to be faulty or disabled in many of them. If the
light happens to be broken, there is no telling whether it registers anything.
I end up banging it and then kicking it just in case a harder push is needed.

------
wruza
So many complaints about placebo-or-not buttons in comments. Feels like from
countries that have no such dead simple thing as digital countdowns on traffic
lights. You see infinity or --, you push the button.

Google: traffic light countdown timer.

------
nikatwork
These buttons are horrible from a UX perspective. The old design had a light
that would activate after you pressed to acknowledge your request. Many of
these new ones don't, so pedestrians will stand there mashing over and over as
there's no feedback.

Not to mention the smaller metal lozenge at the top which looks like a button
but does nothing, so people press both surfaces in confusion.

Oh and people are so Pavlovian trained to start walking at the "cross" sound
that when you have these buttons side by side at an intersection people will
literally start walking into traffic when the adjacent button triggers.

The design is pants on head idiotic.

~~~
Sir_Substance
>Not to mention the smaller metal lozenge at the top which looks like a button
but does nothing, so people press both surfaces in confusion.

If you'd ever touched one of these (or read the article properly), you'd know
it provides a tactile mirror to the sound the button is playing, telling deaf
people when to cross.

If I'm listening to music I often stick my thumb over it even though I'm not
deaf, so I don't have to keep looking at the light to see when I can cross.
The top of the button case is just the right size to rest your palm on it and
allow your thumb to drop down and rest on the popper plate.

~~~
babuskov
If you need to rest your hand on it or read an article, to understand how it
works, that's a major fail in the design.

~~~
x1798DE
If it's designed for blind people, I don't think visually signaling its
function is necessarily a great option (though to be fair, it would at least
allow sighted people to point out the device to their blind friends).

~~~
babuskov
Over 90% of people are not blind. Why deprive them of extra information they
are able to use? And even if we wanted, reducing everyone to blind person's
abilities won't work: If there are 5 people waiting for the same traffic light
they can't all hold their finger on the button at the same time.

~~~
x1798DE
Sighted people can see the (much more convenient) lighted sign that says
"cross/don't cross". A tactile device is unnecessary for those people, and it
doesn't really matter if they know that it exists or what it is for. As such,
I would say the biggest design priority with respect to the sighted majority
would be to make sure it's not actively confusing (i.e. it won't be mistaken
for the cross button), and visual cues as to its purpose would be above and
beyond.

------
lucaspiller
The same are used in Ireland. Does anyone know why they choose to use these,
as opposed to the same as the UK?

[http://todayilearned.co.uk/wp-
content/uploads/2011/07/crossi...](http://todayilearned.co.uk/wp-
content/uploads/2011/07/crossing-push-button.jpg)

These not only give feedback when the button is pressed, but also have a
tactile spinner on the bottom for blind people (most, but not all, pedestrian
crossings in the UK beep when you can cross however).

~~~
vacri
There's tactile feedback for the blind on these buttons. I'm not sure I'd
class the button you linked as particularly good - most people know what to
look for with traffic crossing buttons, and duplicating the lesson on every
(quite small) button seems a bit pointless... and useless if you don't read
English (eg tourists etc). It's overall too complex for a simple function.
Using a white light for 'WAIT' is also a wasted opportunity (should be a
regular 'warning' colour instead).

I don't really use either mechanism, but I would _guess_ that the ticker in
the linked article (the metal bit in the middle of the arrow gives a strong
click) would be preferable to touching something _underneath_ a city-dwelling
box, where muck, gunk, and whatever accumulates. That's an edge-case
complaint, though.

Another thing to consider with these kinds of things is reliability,
maintenance, and cost. May not interest the UX people, but will definitely
interest the local councils...

~~~
stuaxo
The newer ones look like this - the indicator with the red or green man is
usually positioned so that you will be looking at oncoming traffic -

[https://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http%3A%2F%2Fi.telegr...](https://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http%3A%2F%2Fi.telegraph.co.uk%2Fmultimedia%2Farchive%2F02209%2Fcrossing_2209318b.jpg&imgrefurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.telegraph.co.uk%2Fnews%2Fuknews%2Froad-
and-rail-transport%2F9241663%2FNew-inquiry-into-Puffin-pedestrian-crossings-
amid-safety-
fears.html&docid=J31kEmkjr52E0M&tbnid=9kbk4fPZsTpRRM%3A&w=620&h=387&client=ubuntu&bih=659&biw=1376&ved=0ahUKEwifkdm79YTPAhUIL8AKHU4YB_4QMwgfKAEwAQ&iact=mrc&uact=8)

------
ajdlinux
As an Australian, whenever I travel overseas I get subtly confused by the lack
of audible and touch feedback on pedestrian buttons in many places. I'm _not_
disabled and I still find the aural and tactile elements of an Australian
pedestrian button to be a key part of my road crossing experience :)

~~~
cylinder
When I visit Australia I am always charmed by the iconic crosswalk sound.
There are a couple of crosswalks in Manhattan that have this sound and PB5.
They're around 23rd st & Broadway next to Madison Square Park apparently due
to a school for the blind nearby.

------
camillomiller
Do these buttons really work? Like, all the time? At some street crossings
here in Berlin I get the impression that they're just some placebo to limit
your impatience and make you less prone to cross with a red light.

That's probably because the buttons here don't have any tactile feedback.
They're touch sensitive and won't make any clic and the light is just a rare
occurrence you might find in some of them (and it's completely invisible
during the day, if it's there). You really feel like you don't have any way to
know if they're even connected to the streetlight system.

Every time I touch them I always try to see whether they're making the light
turn green faster and I never ever have that feeling. One should probably
approach the thing more scientifically in order to have some sort of closure
about them.

~~~
jamesk_au
"In some Australian cities, in the central business district, the traffic
light push buttons don't work at certain times — for example, 7 am to 7 pm,
Monday to Wednesday, and 7 am to 9 pm, Thursday to Saturday.

The rationale is that between these busy hours, the road traffic is relatively
constant, and also, the pedestrian crossings are in continuous use. So the
lights do their own thing.

However, the traffic light push buttons do work outside these hours, including
all day Sunday."

~~~
pretzel
... which is kind of annoying if you sleep on top of one. Endless tocking away
on a hot summer night where you can't sleep is kind of like water drip
torture.

------
clarry
Rather than a "beautiful" button, I'd rather have no buttons and no need to
press anything.

------
eCa
Around here they look like this[1]. They have about the same sound as the
Australian. The entire thing vibrates with the sound.

The blue area on the front is the button (not just the small circle). When
pushed the light lights up[2]. On top is a tactile arrow pointing in the
direction to walk. On the side is a tactile map showing how the intersection
looks (starting from the bottom, at the small arrow): Blocks are lanes/cars,
the almost-ellipse is a traffic island and horizontal bars are the sidewalk.

[1]
[https://cdn1.cdnme.se/cdn/6-2/770231/images/2011/trafikljus_...](https://cdn1.cdnme.se/cdn/6-2/770231/images/2011/trafikljus_175212100.jpg)

[2] But people are happy to push the button again anyway.

~~~
megablast
Wow, that is confusing.

~~~
userbinator
I agree. I thought the yellow light at the bottom is the button, because it's
the only button-like object in the picture (and I've plenty of experience with
buttons that light up when pushed.) The "blue area" does not look like a
button at all, but only a sign to me. If I encountered one of these I'd
probably keep trying to press the light...

------
dghughes
Looking for more info on the sound I found this and had to laugh:

[https://youtu.be/8UxT_UI4_6g?t=133](https://youtu.be/8UxT_UI4_6g?t=133)

------
upofadown
>In some Australian cities, in the central business district, the traffic
light push buttons don't work at certain times — for example, 7 am to 7 pm,
Monday to Wednesday, and 7 am to 9 pm, Thursday to Saturday.

>The rationale is that between these busy hours, the road traffic is
relatively constant, and also, the pedestrian crossings are in continuous use.

That strikes me as a bit stupid. The slight increase in capacity is really
only needed at peak times. They could just do away with the buttons entirely.

~~~
phire
The traffic lights are optimised for throughput during peak times and
optimised for travel time during non-peak times.

Throughput optimisation has the lights cycling at a constant rate, 60 seconds
in one direction, 60 seconds in the next direction and so on. It's easy to
tack the pedestrian cycle on to that (pedestrians walk in parallel with the
traffic, though I've also seen lights which give the pedestrians their own
cycle, and pedestrians can also walk diagonally across the intersection). The
cycle might also be synchronized with other lights.

The Travel time optimisation for off-peak is completely different. Lights are
always stuck onto a single direction (the direction with the most traffic).
When a car triggers the sensor in the perpendicular direction, the traffic
light quickly cycles and gives them a green light within 10 seconds. The green
light only lasts about 5 seconds, barely enough time for a second car to get
through the light. It's impossible to get a third though. But in typical night
time traffic, this mode makes the traffic light only slightly slower than a
stop sign.

Even if a pedestrian did arrive at the traffic light at the same time as a
car, there is nowhere near enough time for the pedestrian to get across the
road. You can't even run across the road in the allocated time.

The button is needed for two reasons. 1) to signal that a pedestrian is
waiting. 2) to request the longer cycle that has enough time for a pedestrian
to walk across the road.

~~~
userbinator
_Lights are always stuck onto a single direction (the direction with the most
traffic). When a car triggers the sensor in the perpendicular direction, the
traffic light quickly cycles and gives them a green light within 10 seconds.
The green light only lasts about 5 seconds, barely enough time for a second
car to get through the light. It 's impossible to get a third though._

Wouldn't it be better for the light to stay at the last direction a car
traveled through? In my experience, traffic tends to be quite "bursty"
(although that could be because of upstream lights causing that) so it seems a
slightly different strategy could work better: as long as there are no cars in
the other direction, the light stays green. If there are, the light will
change immediately if the current direction has no cars; otherwise a timer is
started and forces the direction to change when it expires. This seems to
incorporate both optimisations you describe.

~~~
phire
I live on a residential street with this style of traffic light along it.

I suspect the cycles have been designed this way to also minimise the amount
of noise. One or two cars every 30 seconds is less distracting than 5 cars in
a row followed by 3min of silence.

------
ourmandave
There's a light on a main road near my house that has a one minute cycle. It
only changes for cross traffic if someone trips it, but still does a 15 sec
countdown on the crosswalk every time.

I've lost count of the cars that speed up to beat the countdown timer.

It is useful for my 5 AM commute though, when there's not a soul around, and I
have to turn left. If I come to it and the timer hasn't started I'll do a
right-on-red and then u-turn on the main road.

------
bbcbasic
The new countdown crossings in Martin Place are brutal. If it hits zero you'd
better be across or you're roadkill.

------
cyberferret
My main love for these buttons is the fact that I can trigger them with my
elbow or hip whenever my hands a full with shopping bags etc. I like the mushy
way they depress then seemingly inflate back into place...

------
oska
See also:

[https://theconversation.com/sublime-design-the-
pb-5-pedestri...](https://theconversation.com/sublime-design-the-
pb-5-pedestrian-button-26232)

------
cm3
What's the difference between the arrow button and the concave button?

------
nxzero
Vechicals don't need to push a button to cross an intersection, why do walkers
need to push a button to cross an intersection?

~~~
bonoboTP
It's often better for pedestrians when there's a button. Because the light
usually changes pretty quickly after pressing the button. Otherwise you'd have
to wait until the timer switches the lights.

It's usually used for pedestrian crossings where pedestrians are rather rare.

~~~
nxzero
Placebo Walk Buttons:
[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Placebo_button#Walk_buttons](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Placebo_button#Walk_buttons)

(My point is that just like for cars, there should be sensors for walkers, not
buttons.)

~~~
bonoboTP
Sometimes people stand at intersections and just chat and don't want to cross.
And in Germany and Hungary where I used such buttons, they are definitely not
placebo, because the switch comes quickly and when you forget to press it it
does not switch.

------
vegabook
we've lost the meaning of the word when we describe this banal traffic button
as "beautiful". In my opinion, if anything, the photo, and indeed the entire
article web page, is quite ugly.

