

Google Releases CloudCourse - Blackboard killer? - maco022
http://code.google.com/p/cloudcourse/

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snprbob86
This is not a Blackboard killer by any means:

"We actually didn't design this system with universities in mind - we designed
it as a course scheduling tool for enterprises."

Source:
[http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/google_releases_cloudco...](http://www.readwriteweb.com/archives/google_releases_cloudcourse_an_open_source_learnin.php?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed:+readwriteweb+\(ReadWriteWeb\))

This article, and the ReadWriteWeb article that I referenced both read too
much into this. From what I can tell, CloudCourse was designed to solve the
resource management problems that Google had coordinating internal talks and
training courses. Google is releasing this internal tool as open source as an
example of Google Apps integration and for businesses using Google Apps. The
requirements of schools are dramatically different.

I'm particular interested because I am building <http://www.classlet.com> \--
Luckily, it does not appear that Google is competing with us (yet).

Classlet has a new version with loads of new stuff in the pipes coming soon.
Contact me at brandon@classlet.com if you'd like to know more.

~~~
robg
Why not build off of this base _specifically for schools_? Blackboard is
always going to be hanging over you. Why not get Google in your corner by
relying on their open code?

~~~
snprbob86
We're relying on a number of Google services already. This project is somewhat
orthogonal to what we are building. Many of these features don't apply, so it
is not really directly valuable to us to built on top of it.

------
SlyShy
I hope/wish so. Blackboard is one of the most unpleasant user experiences out
there. It's not even well implemented in the back-end, too.

~~~
adbge
Oh, please God. I hope Google does to Blackboard what Rome did to Carthage.

~~~
Perceval
Ceterum autem censeo, Blackboardinem esse delendam!

------
axiom
I was excited for a second.

This thing is _extremely_ limited, and wouldn't get adopted by an institution
for about 74 distinct reasons (e.g. data is stored in the cloud, which is
illegal...)

Blackboard is a terrible terrible service, and all their customers hate them.
They persist because they have ties to all the major schools and satisfy all
the regulatory criteria required for LMS's.

LMS software is about 90% about sales, deployment and support and only 10%
about the quality of the software itself.

~~~
snprbob86
"data is stored in the cloud, which is illegal"

Which data is illegal to store in the cloud?

Could you please provide a source?

~~~
xel02
In Canada it is illegal to store student information on servers outside of
Canada. At least that is what I was told when I was asked to create a CMS.

~~~
thesethings
There is at least one Canadian school amongst the 8 millions students using
Google Apps as their official suite.

[http://www.google.com/a/help/intl/en/edu/case_studies/lakehe...](http://www.google.com/a/help/intl/en/edu/case_studies/lakehead.html)

I'm betting that Google or a 3rd party will eventually piggy back a for-pay
educational tool on the existing Google Apps school customer-base through
their Marketplace.

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mbthomas
As much as I would love to see Blackboard killed by Google, CloudCourse is a
"course scheduling system" whereas Blackboard (and Moodle) are "learning
management systems". An LMS will have a huge number of features that
CloudCourse won't...

~~~
thefool
Exactly, they are different products.

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bradgessler
I doubt this will cause problems for Blackboard. I say that because schools
don't go to Blackboard for their software; they go for their services and the
CYA aspect of it. Like they say about Microsoft, "Nobody ever got fired for
buying Blackboard".

If anything this poses more of a threat to Moodle.

~~~
subbu
I really wish this gives a good competition for Moodle. Moodle has been the
only decent course scheduling system for years. Competition in this area will
advance the technology.

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jswinghammer
Sorta on topic but it's on my mind tonight so here it goes:

If someone has experience with integrating their application with Blackboard
I'd be interested in hearing about it. My sales people are telling me that
people really want our product to integrate with Blackboard (without defining
what that means).

How do people go about doing that? Are there consultants who just do that kind
of thing?

It seems like the most interesting part of these services is the 3rd party
integration capabilities.

------
jcromartie
Everybody hates Blackboard, any anybody could blow them away if it weren't for
one thing: Blackboard sues most of their competition and buys the rest.

~~~
daniel-cussen
I was going to say. Doesn't Blackboard own like a bazillion patents?

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zackham
Forget Google, Blackboard, or any player looking to personally benefit from
dominating learning management systems. This is the project we should be
supporting: <http://sakaiproject.org/>

~~~
cscotta
Indiana University uses Sakai (<http://oncourse.iu.edu/>). At the time I used
it ('04-'08), it was...better than Blackboard, but still generally a pain. The
design was poor, the UX was awkward - just a deeply unsexy experience overall.

It might be better now, but I have a feeling that most LMS software is doomed
to being, well, LMS software.

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lr
Is it a "Blackboard killer" because it is by Google or because it is OSS?
<http://moodle.org> has been around for a long time, has attracted many
Blackboard defectors, and yet Blackboard is still around...

~~~
falien
Its not, but if it was it would be because it had Google backing it. Lack of a
known corporate support system is Moodle's weakness, and Blackboard's sole
reason for success.

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dzlobin
Good god I truly fucking hope they kill blackboard.

What a horrible service

~~~
Legion
I was gonna say, isn't Blackboard it's own killer?

~~~
ube
Sadly - not fast enough. Moodle is interesting but non techie edu folks don't
touch it.

------
zaidf
Blackboard knows how to do enterprise sales. I'm not sure Google does. Until
then, Blackboard's not going anywhere.

Google should acquire blackboard, keep their sales, fire their engineering.

~~~
falien
Google has the engineers and the legal department to take on Blackboard. If
they took 6 months for a dev team with this as their primary task and were
willing to have actual tech support they could demolish blackboard with a
single sales rep in 5 years.

~~~
zaidf

      single sales rep in 5 years.
    

That's what google thinks about sales and that's why they keep getting it
wrong. They thought for the longest time they can get away with dealing with
big ad agencies without having an office and sales folks in NYC. Luckily they
realized that wouldn't work.

Look, a great consumer product like google.com can spread virally. But
enterprise requires a very focused and elaborate sales effort.

~~~
falien
While I agree in general, my point is that this market is an exception (at
least in the US, I have no idea what the situation is like in other
countries). Universities are dying for an alternative to Blackboard that has
some reputable company behind it. If google had a suitable product they would
have to work hard and hold hands to get the first couple of major universities
to deploy (not even that if the product was deployable rather than google
hosted). After that faculty at other universities would begin quietly
demanding relief from the bane of their student's and their instructional
lives now that there was a justifiable alternative.

~~~
zaidf
_Universities are dying for an alternative to Blackboard that has some
reputable company behind it._

What exactly do you mean when you say "universities"? There is the IT dept,
the students, the staff, the budgeting people--each with their own
motivations. My experience has been that Blackboard has the IT depts. and the
budgeting people across the schools in their pocket. The only people that hate
Blackboard are students and professors. Unfortunately they dont seem to have
much pull _or_ motivation to force a change.

There _are_ good and even free alternatives to Blackboard but that's not
enough to kill or even injure blackboard.

------
ErrantX
Anyone able to set up a demo (never used Google app engine or I would) to
check out?

~~~
stanleydrew
I have this set up on my local machine in an appengine dev environment. I'll
try to push it to appengine now. (Full disclosure: this is my girlfriend's
project at Google.)

~~~
stanleydrew
My demo is here, but it's not working fully: <https://cloud-
course.appspot.com/>. I'll need to figure out what's going wrong. As posted, a
demo that actually works is here: <https://cloudcourseio.appspot.com/>

------
helwr
it is not Google but two Google engineers working on this in their 20% 'side
project' time

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mwilcox
Blackboard is terrible, hopefully this takes off quick

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tewks
Blackboard's biggest feature is document and grades management, which this
does not provide.

~~~
andrewcamel
I currently attend a high school with 800 students looking to use a simple and
efficient organizer for teachers, classes, and students. Because it integrates
with Google Calendar, I'm hoping future versions include support for
assignments; it will be a huge help to our teachers and students. Would it be
very difficult to add support for assignments/homework?

------
Feynman
Blackboard may just be the only piece of software I despised more than
ExpertsExchange...

------
douglasputnam
News items that contain the word "killer" in the title are usually composed by
uninformed local TV news writers, or by hack bloggers who want to drive easy
fanboy traffic to their site with cheap rhetoric. We see the same motive in
headlines that start with "Top Ten Reasons That...", and "Is My Karate Better
Than Your Kung Fu?" or "Python is Dead!?". Sensationalism has its place---the
tech gossip media is built on it---but it's disappointing to see it finding
unquestioned acceptance on HN.

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donw
This is mildly off-topic, but has been on my mind recently because I've spent
a little decompression time recently hacking on my study system project.

I may be alone here, but I'd really like to see some sort of online community
learning site, where students can organize based on the topics they want to
learn, and collectively hire a teacher to assist them. Does this sort of thing
even exist?

~~~
kylemathews
The closest I can think of is <http://edufire.com/>

I'm building an open-source online community software package based on Drupal.
You could use it to build your own community site like you want. Check it out
at eduglu.com

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pjhyett
I'd love to read about Blackboard's sales process. It's mediocre software at
best, but nearly ubiquitous in US schools.

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rm-rf
Looks to me like this app is a relatively simple scheduling app that in no way
comes even close to the features and functionality of a full LMS such as
Blackboard or Desire2Learn (or the other dozens-odd major players)

Not even close.

It will not kill Blackboard.

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warfangle
If anyone can defend against the over-litigious company that Blackboard is,
it's Google.

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oldgregg
Hopefully. With Google behind it they have a better chance of fending off the
patent trolls masquerading as an educational services provider.

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lizzard
I really hope so. Blackboard is unbelievably horrible. It's destructive.

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gte910h
Yay, finally someone large enough to OUT PATENT the patent trolls.

