

Bach on a mobius strip - planckscnst
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xUHQ2ybTejU
A very neat animation of a crab canon by Bach.
======
jazzychad
If you haven't read the book "Gödel, Escher, Bach" -
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G%C3%B6del,_Escher,_Bach> \- you need to do
yourself a favor and do so. It explores the ideas of recursion, logic,
infinity, and so much more in one beautifully written book.

~~~
scommab
If you've read the book it's worth it to also watch the free online MIT coure
material on them: [http://ocw.mit.edu/high-school/courses/godel-escher-
bach/vid...](http://ocw.mit.edu/high-school/courses/godel-escher-bach/video-
lectures/) (and maybe even if you haven't)

They are very non-technical (annoying so at times), but interesting.
Definitely gave me a more in depth understanding of GEB.

~~~
jmatt
I thought it would be fun to watch these when I had some downtime during a
flight I'm taking next week. Two problems - they stream them and they are real
one files. No idea why they make it so difficult.

Solution for .rm files -> VLC [1]

Solution for streaming -> tweak the url [2]

[http://mfile.akamai.com/7870/rm/mitstorage.download.akamai.c...](http://mfile.akamai.com/7870/rm/mitstorage.download.akamai.com/7870/hs/godel_escher_bach/OCW_7.01.07_Godel-220k.rm)

to

[http://ocw.mit.edu/ans7870/hs/godel_escher_bach/OCW_7.01.07_...](http://ocw.mit.edu/ans7870/hs/godel_escher_bach/OCW_7.01.07_Godel-220k.rm)

References

[1] <http://www.videolan.org/vlc/>

[2] [http://all-streaming-media.com/streaming-media-faq/faq-
downl...](http://all-streaming-media.com/streaming-media-faq/faq-download-MIT-
OCW-streaming-video-lectures-to-my-computer-for-viewing-off-line.htm)

------
jberryman
Having trouble finding examples online right now, but composers loved to do
this kind of thing during and before Bach's time. I remember seeing one piece
that was written in such a way that two musicians could sit opposite each
other and play off of the same page, so one player is essentially playing the
piece backwards but reading different notes because the page is upsidedown.

~~~
noahlt
It's a famous Mozart duet for violins:
<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dpktS4rNZC8>

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phoboslab
_"Bach war der erste Hacker. Das Cembalo war sein Computer. Kannst du vorwärts
und rückwärts spielen"_

In English: _"Bach was the first Hacker. The Harpsichord was his Computer.
'Can play it forwards and backwards."_

~23: <http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0126765/>

~~~
bts
The last sentence reads, "Can you play it forward and backwards?"

~~~
kleiba
Not quite - it's not a question, it's a variation of "you can play that
forwards and backwards" which would be a literal translation of "du kannst das
vorwärts und rückwärts spielen". German's free word order allows you to change
the position of subject and object in that case: "das kannst du vorwärts und
rückwärts spielen". The original quote is colloquial speech where the object
"das" (that) is not realized - that's a common pattern. However, it would be
very strange to leave the object out if the sentence were a question.

------
baddox
Is there really anything to this other than the _idea itself_ of playing a
riff backward and forward at the same time? The idea is fascinating, but I
don't think this piece sounds good at all, especially compared to J.S. Bach's
more "conventional" pieces.

~~~
jberryman
Yes it's about the idea, but the idea is hugely important to Bach. Baroque
music was centered around this idea of an "economy of material": letting a
single small kernel of an idea unfold into an entire piece of music. That's
how Bach's brain worked; he could think of a simple theme and improvise a
5-voice fugue based on just a few notes.

This canon comes from his "Musical Offering" which are a set of pieces
dedicated to Frederick the Great of Prussia (a flutist like me :-) ) all based
on a single awkward theme given to him by the king, as a kind of challenge.

So I guess my point is when you look at this as one of a collection of many
variations, renderings, and re-imaginings of a single short melody, with an
eye to the importance that Bach placed on the aesthetic idea of an economy of
material, that this becomes more than just a clever trick.

Although I agree Bach probably wrote it in less time than it took him to write
it down. And I don't think he would have imagined people after his death would
be playing it, let alone making CGI youtube videos and run-on sentences
discussing it on internet message boards. :)

~~~
baddox
I can appreciate this as a piece of constrained writing, like a lipogram or
univocalic, but apart from that context I think it lacks a pleasing musical
quality which is present in much of Bach's work. That said, I would have loved
to have experienced J. S. Bach's harpsichord improvisations.

------
m4wk3r
i dont get it. what difference did displaying it on a mobius strip make? it
seemed the same as when it was being played forward and backward at the same
time.

~~~
phoboslab
The Möbius Strip just makes it an infinite loop. This won't work with music
you can't play backwards.

Edit: Thinking a bit more about it, it is a bit silly. I guess you _could_ put
every musical piece on a Möbius Strip in an infinite loop. Just don't have it
played backwards.

------
diziet
One of the instruments used to play that composition is a Klein bottle.

------
konad
Saoret.One explored Markov chains and Bach

[http://www.caerwyn.com/ipn/2007/04/lab-77-unexpected-
markov....](http://www.caerwyn.com/ipn/2007/04/lab-77-unexpected-markov.html)

as part of his Inferno Programmer's Notebook

<http://code.google.com/p/inferno-lab/wiki/Index>

