
What's New in the .NET Framework 4.5 - Garbage
http://msdn.microsoft.com/it-it/library/ms171868%28v=VS.110%29.aspx
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chrislomax
I actually think there is a lot here to get excited about. .net forms getting
model bindings is quite big, as taken from MVC. Page speed performances, html5
support, web socket support.

It seems to me they are actually taking their head out the sand and realising
the web is not all about Microsoft now and there is a whole world of new
technology happening around them that they need to include in their products.

I have actively pulled my Silverlight projects now and am concentrating on
html5, javascript and websockets since last night. Massive coincidence that
this morning Silverlight is getting a bum deal in other press.

I think this is a prelim release to 5 as they want to show their commitment to
becoming more engaging to html5 standards and other technology.

Also, there is a comment that this is a weak release for 2.5 years work, .net
4 had a massive amount of work done on it and this is a partial release. The
library is already very concise so I would be interested to know what
"massive" changes they could make right now apart from just making the library
more stable.

Consider this the Windows version (in development terms) of the Leopard to
Snow Leopard that Apple released.

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mattmanser
All the html5 stuff is in there because of windows 8, pure and simple.

Also I don't know who in their right mind would chose to use classic ASP.Net
anymore.

But compared to 3.5 there's nothing in here that I find exciting or that's
looking particularly like it's going to make my life as a programmer better.
Personally I find the more they work on MVC the more they seem to be giving in
to the temptation to put 'magic' in there like the old forms, which sucks imo
as it encourages new programmers to write very bad code.

~~~
chrislomax
We actively use asp.net "classic" as you have referred to it. It's an
alternative and in by no means inferior to MVC. We are looking at implementing
MVC3 but to do what we do with asp.net webforms will be a difficult task. We
wrote a CMS framework for our own clients and we use quite a lot of specific
.net webforms controls to do what we do.

The main reason I started moving away from silverlight and more into html and
js, mvc etc was because of Windows 8 not having silverlight as part of the
interface.

This is exactly what I mean by Microsoft getting it's head out the sand
though, they have chosen to use the more adopted methods going forward than
it's own solutions. It's a sign that Microsoft are no longer at the center of
the universe.

I'm not putting down your comment on who in their right mind uses "classic"
asp.net any more but I find it a little closed minded as asp.net webforms is
far more tried and tested. It's a developers choice and it's not a wrong
choice to use forms over mvc.

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hello_moto
I don't mean to be rude toward the .NET community but I'd have to ask this
because it has been bothering my mind a little bit.

Let me begin by praising the CLR and C#. Their latest features are great (both
at runtime level and syntax level). But I have not seen something great (or
notable) coming out from the .NET communities whether a new library, a new
ORM, a new framework, a new paradigm, or even a new tool despite all these
cool lambdas, task, linq, etc.

Why is that?

Coming from Java, a language/platform that is considered less superior, where
there are tons of good tools like Ant, Ivy, Maven (is NuGet comparable to
Maven? or still lagging?), or libraries such as JBoss Netty, JAX-RS, Spring
MVC 3.0 (very close to Rails: routes, return XML/JSON depending on request,
minus the ORM), JAX-WS (with annotation style programming), EJB 3.1 style
programming (which helps a lot!), a few of NoSQL flavours to keep developers
busy (Neo4J, Cassandra, HBase), distributed libraries such as Hadoop, I find
this situation to be odd.

~~~
mattmanser
Two reasons imo:

1\. MS advances their product at a semi-decent rate so people just wait for MS
to bring out a solution. I don't mean this as a dig, it just seems MS is more
plugged into emerging trends in programming. Asp.net MVC came out within a
year of Rails and Django becoming popular and lots of MVC frameworks appearing
for PHP. I also had just seriously started playing with NHibernate when
Linq2Sql and the Entity framework came out. Same with lambdas and all that
goodness. They seem to bring stuff out just as people are saying 'hey, this is
a really good idea'. I don't see that happening in Java. They get it wrong
sometimes, like their over engineered SOAP solution which personally I think
contributed to its downfall. Also WCF and WF are both pretty shitty.

2\. I think a lot of the other tools is because Java came out first so some of
these problems were were already solved when it came to .Net, so we got nant,
etc. I personally have never worked on a project where something like Maven
seemed worth it comapred to some slight customisations to MSBuild which you
can do in VS, so can't comment on that.

~~~
crenshaw
You nailed it. The other thing is that .NET devs generally aren't framework
devs. They're app devs.

With that said, there are some nice frameworks that exist, but competing
against the top framework vendor, Microsoft, is tough. And while most on HN
won't understand this, most .NET devs are actually quite happy with what MS is
doing -- and most generally feel like MS actually does listen to the dev
community.

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tarr11
The Async / Await pattern looks very cool. This will make my code a lot
cleaner and shorter.

[http://msdn.microsoft.com/it-
it/library/hh191443(v=VS.110).a...](http://msdn.microsoft.com/it-
it/library/hh191443\(v=VS.110\).aspx)

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usedtolurk
Looks like the most dramatic changes will be in writing Metro style Apps:
[http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-
us/library/windows/apps/br23030...](http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-
us/library/windows/apps/br230302%28v=VS.85%29.aspx)

