Ask HN: Is there any job more creative than programming? - pedrodelfino
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veddox
Painting, design work (web design, print design, product design,
architecture), poetry, fiction writing, composing music, theater acting... Do
you want me to continue?

Yes, programming is a creative job. But to claim it to be "the most creative"
is rather short-sighted.

~~~
pedrodelfino
I just wanted to think about other creative jobs, didn't say programming was,
actually, the most creative.

The other guy mentioned cooking. I wouldn't think about this hypothesis alone.
You asked if I would like you to continue. I actually would like to ask you
about consulting. Like being a Mckinsey's consultant. Would you consider it as
very creative job?

~~~
veddox
> I [...] didn't say programming was, actually, the most creative.

Then you need to rephrase your question. In normal conversational English, "Is
there any job more creative than programming?" implies that you consider
programming to be the most creative job.

I think we should need to step back and define "creative" before we move on
with this discussion. For me, being creative means doing things that have
never been done in this way before. Writing a poem no-one has ever written,
painting a picture no-one has ever painted, singing a song that has never been
sung. The opposite of creativity is doing things "by the book". If I am just
following a set of instructions, or applying a bunch of rules, that is not
being creative.

Two examples: if I am cooking a meal from a cookery book, that is not very
creative. But if I made the recipe up myself, it is. If I implement quick
sort, that is not very creative - thousands of people have done it before me,
there are plenty of instructions out there. On the other hand, if I come up
with my own, original algorithm, that is being creative.

Being creative means exploring the universe of possibilities. The further away
you get from the comfy planet of "it's-been-done-before", the more creative
you are.

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lastofus
After 2 decades of programming, I rarely feel creative while programming.
While designing an app or UI/UX sure, but rarely while coding.

For me, 90% of coding feels like being a human constraint solver. Take the
intersection of tech being used and defined business rules, and figure out the
path to implement a feature. It's rare I have to get overly creative to solve
a given problem in an out-of-the-box manner.

Maybe I just need to work on more interesting things.

------
brudgers
The question inside the question is "Job for who?"

My sister dances and teaches and makes music and art. She's smart enough to
program, but I doubt it would suit her temperament. Her muse is her muse, not
my muse.

Architects can design buildings that last many years...much longer than most
code. Does that make architecture more creative? Architects tend to design
fewer buildings than programmers write programs. Does that make architecture
less creative?

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factorialboy
This is a subjective question. Depends on the individual performing the
action. To him anything may or may not be more "creative" than programming.

~~~
veddox
Why do you say creativity is subjective? If that is the case, anything could
be creative - even working on a production line in a factory.

~~~
dyeje
Why do you question it's subjectivity? Do you have any metrics you would use
to measure it objectively?

I would argue that any task can be done with creativity, even working on a
production line in a factory.

~~~
veddox
Creativity, as I've said above, has to do with doing things apart from the
norm, doing them differently to how they are usually done or how they have
been done before.

Using that definition allows a relatively objective comparison of the
creativity involved in various tasks. Of course, just how much creativity is
involved depends on how the person concerned actually executes a task. (It is
perfectly possible to write an incredibly uncreative poem, for example.) In
that sense there is some subjectivity involved, but the subjectivity depends
primarily on how the subject executes his task, not how he perceives it.

Going back to the production line: production lines were invented specifically
to get _rid_ of creativity. Ford wanted to ensure that every single car coming
out of his factory was identical. The production line was his way of forcing
equality, sameness - thus, the production line is the very antithesis of
creativity. Of course, you might find a worker here or there who will work
creatively on a production line. But I dare say he won't keep his job for
long...

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informatimago
You would need a meta-creative job, one job where you have to create your own
job. Perhaps enterpreneur would be it.

~~~
shoo
perhaps you can get a bit more creative if you discard the constraint of "job"
and pick some other objectives not commonly valued / pursued by society

------
kspaans
Writing fiction, writing poetry, translating fiction, translating poetry,
debating things on the internet.

~~~
pedrodelfino
The cool point in your answer is that you gave 5 activities and they all
involve "writing" in a certain extent. Coding is also writing, so the
conclusion we might draw here is that writing, in its various forms, is a very
creative task. About "debating things on the internet", though, I would
disagree. Debating things on the internet definitely demands more resilience,
but I really don't think you need to be very creative. Actually, besides being
resilient, you need to be good at rhetoric.

~~~
kspaans
I guess it's probably closer to creative writing than debate on the internet,
but I'd say this is pretty creative:
[http://www.adequacy.org/stories/2001.12.2.42056.2147.html](http://www.adequacy.org/stories/2001.12.2.42056.2147.html)

------
Mimu
I wouldn't consider programming creative at all, it's the opposite for me.
Each problem has a unique solution and do only one thing. None of what you
code can be interpreted in differents ways depending of the person looking at
it or using it.

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yetanotheracc
There are some in theoretical physics.

------
kakakiki
UX/UI designing

~~~
pedrodelfino
Interesting. Why it would be more creative to work on UI/UX than building
tough algorithms on the back-end? Just due to the aesthetic characteristic in
the UI/UX tasks?

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logn
Cooking?

~~~
pedrodelfino
Cooking can be a creative task, but I do not think normal people do creative
things on the kitchen, they just follow recipes... In my life, for instance, I
cook the same things all the time. On the other hand, most of the time when I
am programming I do creative stuff to solve problems. It is quite normal to
think outside of the box while programming, but not while cooking. Most people
must have a similar feeling.

~~~
logn
True but in the professional cooking world, I think it's probably comparable
to programming. In some cases, it may be more creative.

At home, you can experience more creativity by looking up lots of recipes for
the same dish, start understanding what the core ingredients/flavors are and
venturing out from there. Eventually you get a handle on ingredients and
cooking methods like they're the syntax of a programming language.

