
MIT professor's hack to recruit students - iamwil
http://librarylab.law.harvard.edu/blog/2011/06/01/gaming-the-library/
======
ScottBurson
Ah, so Jerry Lettvin died.

I took a couple of courses from him as an undergrad. He was quite a character.
Here's a Jerry quote for you: "The brain is not a computer. The brain is a
gland." I don't even know if he believed that, but he loved to stir
controversy -- and announcing this at the MIT AI Lab c. 1982 certainly
accomplished that!

I would say "RIP", but he probably already has his lab set up and is hard at
work, wherever he is :-)

~~~
thangalin
He is dead, and quite likely was an atheist.

"Now I will have to say that the great Prof. Lettvin could hardly get himself
bent out of shape just because some puny undergrad had come forward with a
puny work product, but I was to learn that day what he might heap upon a
bullshitter."

Your heart is in the right place, but do not foul the memory of such a
beautiful, insightful, and honourable individual with bullshit---metaphorical
or otherwise.

~~~
ScottBurson
I thought a hater or two might come out of the woodwork when I said that.

You people are as arrogant and humorless as the worst fundamentalists.

Jerry was neither arrogant nor humorless. You cannot persuade me that he would
have the slightest objection to my innocent image of him in an afterlife.

~~~
khafra
I'm ok with your colorful counterfactual about his current disposition, the
same way I'm fine reading a Sutra talking about reincarnation, or a Nasrudin
story invoking Allah. I don't think belief should have anything to do with
cultural acceptability; and I think the people objecting to your comment are
rude--but I also think "you people" is a rude way to address them.

~~~
ScottBurson
You have a point. I spoke in anger.

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Joakal
Argh, this reminds me of my frustration with the university library. Students
were 'hoarding' books that I wanted in other sections of the library so that
they could effectively bypass 1 hour or 3 day lending limits (short/long term
borrowing). While a nice hack to get what you want, it's depriving others from
using the resources in the meantime. There was even up to three very helpful
librarians try to even find one book over three days. I'm even paranoid that
it was stupidity that someone decided to mix Economics among Medicine books.

At least it's known who has the book in this case.

~~~
Periodic
I worked at the library at a university library for a while. I hadn't heard
about the issues you mentioned, but the issue of this article was very common.

It stemmed from our lending policy. Undergrads could get a book for two weeks,
but had a two-week grace period on renewals (sorta weird). Grad students and
professors could check out books for the entire academic year, they were
supposed to physically bring in their books for renewal once a year, but many
times they could convince staff to just renew all books on their accounts.
Some professors had over 100 books checked out and many didn't know how many
they had checked out. The common response to inquiries was to tell the student
to go talk to the professor. We were allowed to give out professors names.

~~~
Joakal
At my university, there was 3 day lending policy. With renewals within the day
of return. Due to a limited selection, it was possible for others to put a
'hold' on it. This means library staff would keep it behind counter for up to
a week before releasing it to the next hold request or put it back on shelf.

Since some undergrad books were in heavy demand (especially due to
assignments/exams) when it's common to see holds. Some students have learnt to
put the book somewhere else in the library so they could have exclusive
privilege of reading it.

Conversely, I haven't heard of the professors or anyone hoarding lent books.
All holds I have placed eventually turned up available in <3 days. Your two
weeks policy is very generous and something I would have liked over 3 days
which seems quick.

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ajkessler
I bet many people's first reaction to this story is something along the lines
of "Look what we're losing if print dies!" or "This is why print will never
die!"

But, think about Kindle's bookmarks. You can see highlights and notes from
everyone who has ever read the book. That's insane! That's Lettvin's hack,
scaled to the max. The problem is obviously filtering all that data, but look
how much larger the pool gets: now the professor doesn't just have the pool
from MIT to choose from, he might have the whole _world_ to choose from.

What an awesome time we live in.

~~~
andrewflnr
It's Lettvin's hack scaled to the point of meaninglessness. The whole point
was to get them physically in his office and talking to him, and I'm pretty
sure he was only interested in students to begin with. If he wanted to talk to
everyone who had ever read the book, he may as well just put an ad somewhere.

~~~
ajkessler
Maybe I wasn't very clear: the post made it sound like the point of the "hack"
was to identify and recruit talent (i.e. if you were interested in the book
you were probably talented). Dealing with physical books, on campus, obviously
limits the pool of potential talent. Something like Kindle's notes (or its
next, more refined, version) could not only identify who might be talented
(i.e. who had read the book), but the notes/bookmarks/highlights could also
provide insight into just _how_ talented someone was, whether that person was
on MIT's campus or was some kid living in a village in India.

~~~
andrewflnr
Fair enough. Lettvin's hack backed up and scaled in a different direction...

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zaidf
I checked out some esoteric books and every now and then would look through
the previous due dates and wonder how much in common I may have with some of
these locals I'll never know about. It's easy to meet likeminded folks on the
web and yet with locals who've checked out physical books, there is that
identity disconnect--in some cases for good reasons(I don't want everyone to
know about every book I've been checking out).

~~~
jackowayed
Have you considered leaving something in books you check out? "Hi! I live
nearby and also am interested in X! You should email me at ..."

Not sure how well your library checks things that you return (I know someone
at Stanford who got an email from the library because she forgot to remove a
couple sticky notes from a book), but it might be worth a try.

~~~
Anti-Ratfish
My wife found a piece of bacon in a library book recently, so I'm inclined to
think that in general they don't check books often. Just stick a note in
there.

~~~
impendia
A friend of mine put a $20 bill in his university library's copy of his
thesis. AFAIK it's still there.

~~~
mdonahoe
I am writing my masters thesis now. I know only my 3 readers and my dad will
ever read it. A strange tradition

------
ScottBurson
I've just come across a QuickTime video of Jerry's famous debate with Timothy
Leary about LSD. I found it quite fascinating to hear both Leary's argument
and Jerry's rebuttal. As I understand, Jerry accepted the debate invitation on
very short notice and so had little time to prepare his remarks, and that
shows; he rambles a little. But he makes his point.

Here's the link: <http://neuron.duke.edu/Lettvin/Lettvin_Leary_Deb.mov>

If you find Leary's mysticism tedious and you just want to see Jerry's
rebuttal, skip to about the 60% point. (Don't miss Leary's brief reply at the
end, though.)

Oh, and in an interesting bit of synchronicity, Jerry mentions the Charles
Whitman case, which figures prominently in another article on HN at the moment
("The Brain On Trial").

~~~
ScottBurson
Some more Jerry stories:
<http://jerrylettvin.blogspot.com/search/label/Memories>

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jamesgagan
well - to play devil's advocate, it's clever but if a student hoarded books,
he'd have the book thrown at him/her and academic standards should apply to
all equally.

~~~
true_religion
Well students are expected to come to the university, study in obscurity, then
leave after paying monies.

The context is different for professors, especially tenured ones.

Why do you think this is an "academic standard"? And even if it is one, why
should they apply equally (e.g. its an academic standard that students cannot
use one paper for multiple classes, however professors can use one paper for
multiple conferences/journals/etc.)

~~~
Brashman
Actually, usually one paper can't be submitted to multiple places.

~~~
kragen
It varies a lot by discipline. Law reviews universally accept papers that have
been submitted elsewhere; CS conferences universally don't (unless they were
rejected already, of course). Lots of places, in many disciplines, will
publish material in technical reports or dissertations that's already been
published elsewhere.

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orijing
In theory, why can't some student who wants to work in that professor's lab
just request the books that the professor checked out (or are likely to check
out)?

Seems like hacking the hack.

~~~
djcapelis
Seems like it would've been easier to just swing by his office and tell him
you wanted to work in his lab. That'd probably get you farther than the book
thing anyway.

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signa11
seems like _physical_ version of delicious to me :)

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jamesgagan
if you are doing this shit at 11 you don't need a "life lesson", you are
already ahead of the pack no matter the outcome.

