
With only free software, a Mali G31 chip can now run GNOME - mfilion
https://www.collabora.com/news-and-blog/blog/2020/06/05/bifrost-meets-gnome-onward-upward-zero-graphics-blobs/
======
visualphoenix
Looks like the new odroid c4 (raspberry pi competitor) has this g31 chip.
[0,1]

Might be interesting to try building a cluster with these. [2]

I wonder how much remaining work there is for full upstream support on these
AmLogic chips? The problem with arm chips has always been limited upstream
distro support.

The Linux-Sunxi folks have been working for years to get the Allwinner stack
up to snuff... it’s taken a long time.[3]

Is there any community around the AmLogic and Rockchip stuff as solid and
coordinated as the Allwinner folks?

[0]
[https://www.hardkernel.com/shop/odroid-c4/](https://www.hardkernel.com/shop/odroid-c4/)

[1] [https://www.cnx-
software.com/2020/04/23/50-odroid-c4-raspber...](https://www.cnx-
software.com/2020/04/23/50-odroid-c4-raspberry-pi-4-competitor-combines-
amlogic-s905x3-soc-with-4gb-ram/)

[2] [https://blog.tjll.net/distributed-homelab-
cluster/#network-c...](https://blog.tjll.net/distributed-homelab-
cluster/#network-consensus-and-service-discovery)

[3] [https://linux-sunxi.org/Linux_mainlining_effort](https://linux-
sunxi.org/Linux_mainlining_effort)

~~~
Andrex
I remember doing some web development work for HardKernel/ODROID back in ~2010
and I just did it for free (I loved the idea of an "Android Game Boy," plus
Chris Pruett at Google recommended it for gaming and game development[1]), and
they ended up sending me an ODROID-S out of the blue. I was totally surprised
and felt I didn't really deserve it (MSRP was like $200-300 and I was a poor
college kid), and I'll never forget the gesture.

HK earned a longtime fan with that move for sure, haha. :)

[1] [http://replicaisland.blogspot.com/2010/01/fragmentation-
more...](http://replicaisland.blogspot.com/2010/01/fragmentation-more-like-
fragmentawesome.html)

~~~
visualphoenix
Is there a mailing list or wiki tracking the status of these components and
patches for the kernel for HK? Like the one for Sunxi?

~~~
LargoLasskhyfv
[http://www.linux-meson.com/](http://www.linux-meson.com/) ?

~~~
visualphoenix
Thanks! This looks like exactly what I was looking for!

~~~
mxmilkb
See also
[https://forum.odroid.com/viewtopic.php?f=176&t=33993](https://forum.odroid.com/viewtopic.php?f=176&t=33993)

Re graphics, #panfrost on freenode

------
rbanffy
I wonder if the tests can be used to build an emulation layer that could run
those same tests on any hardware. When that emulation layer is trusted, we can
use it to cheaply test the build on generic hardware before committing to use
actual, less common, real Mali G31 hardware.

------
daneel_w
I have the Pinebook Pro which is built upon the Rockchip RK3399 SoC
incorporating a Mali T860 GPU. The Panfrost open source GPU driver written by
the article's author offers support for this GPU, and on Linux Manjaro with
KDE/Plasma the GPU-acceleration works, but for some reason I cannot figure out
the performance is very low compared to what I've seen on other RK3399 demos
running Linux. Anyone got any ideas what could be wrong?

~~~
8jef
Got a PBP with Manjaro KDE/Plasma as well. Would also be interested in such
optimization.

------
pjmlp
Great work, although I fail to see any mention regarding post OpenGL ES 2.0
support, given that G31 goes all the way up to ES 3.2, Vulkan and OpenCL 2.0.

[https://developer.arm.com/ip-products/graphics-and-
multimedi...](https://developer.arm.com/ip-products/graphics-and-
multimedia/mali-gpus/mali-g31-gpu)

It seems that OpenGL ES 2.0s support is the end goal.

~~~
ac29
GL ES 3.0 support is already being worked on: [https://www.collabora.com/news-
and-blog/blog/2020/02/27/expe...](https://www.collabora.com/news-and-
blog/blog/2020/02/27/experimental-panfrost-gles-3-support-has-landed/)

~~~
pjmlp
Thanks, the blog wasn't fully clear on that.

------
voltagex_
I'm having trouble finding what devices this chipset made it into other than
[https://www.cnx-software.com/2020/02/27/allwinner-h616-tv-
bo...](https://www.cnx-software.com/2020/02/27/allwinner-h616-tv-box-
processor-comes-with-mali-g31-gpu-supports-android-10/)

~~~
DCKing
The Mali G31 is used in some pretty cool ultra cheap devices. Getting good
mainline support for this GPU is really cool because of these ones :)

The Mali G31 is used in the Amlogic S905X{2,3,4} SoCs. You can buy a "TV box"
with a quadcore Cortex A53/A55, gigabit ethernet, 4GBs of RAM and 32GB of eMMC
storage for $30-50 delivered. Think of them as Raspberry Pis with included
storage, case and power supply, preassembled. I wouldn't recommend them over a
Raspberry Pi right now - getting a non-embedded GNU/Linux distro running on
them properly is not easy - but these developments can change that. Right now
it's probably better to spend some extra money on the Odroid C4 with the same
chip and some accessories, because of the better community support.

The Mali G31 is also the GPU used in the Rockchip RK3326 in the Odroid Go
Advance, a $60ish open source tinkering gaming handheld kit from Hardkernel.
The first Chinese clone of this device was released for this with the same
chip, so there's some indication the RK3326 will become a standard platform
for retro emulation hardware. Pretty old MIPS chips were the standard for that
until this year still, because the hardware follows software support.

------
blickentwapft
Could open source graphics drivers become a better option than proprietary?

~~~
imtringued
They are already the better option for Intel and AMD.

~~~
morganvachon
Re: AMD, my experience has been that one needs a very recent kernel (5.4+) for
a good experience on Navi. Even with that, I'm getting some interesting errors
in dmesg on a 5600 XT under Pop!_OS. I knew I'd be unstable on this system for
a while when I built it, so for now it's relegated to gaming and web browsing,
with any "real" work occurring on my increasingly aging but rock solid Core 2
Quad workstation.

~~~
boomboomsubban
>AMD, my experience has been that one needs a very recent kernel (5.4+) for a
good experience on Navi.

I think needing a kernel released after the video card is a fairly reasonable
demand.

~~~
aseipp
5.4 was released in November 2019, while Navi with the 5x00 series was
released in July 2019, so that's actually 2 release cycles or so of the kernel
before hitting stable support. For comparison, Intel already has Gen12
graphics support in place across the entire software stack despite the fact
Tiger Lake/Xe are not available until later this year (Mesa support for Gen12
was merged in Oct 2019!) AMD is just comparatively not as good about this,
frankly, and I say that as someone who has the luxury to (and often does) run
-rc kernels for latest hardware. This is not only true of their graphics
cards, but to some extent their CPUs as well.

They need to get their software support up earlier. I get that there are
issues like supply chains, OEM firmware, and all that jazz, but they aren't
amateurs flying by the seat of their pants here, they're capable of doing
this. If I had to guess I'd say it's simply because AMD's software department
seems stretched pretty thin, where as the competitors have enormous software
teams. Hopefully they can fix that.

~~~
boomboomsubban
>5.4 was released in November 2019, while Navi with the 5x00 series was
released in July 2019

Their specific card was released in January 2020, and the only problems they
list are some strange dmesg entries. They may be lagging a bit compared to
Intel, I am not following closely enough to note, but is Intel even offering
competitive GPUs?

~~~
Shared404
>Is Intel even offering competitive GPUs?

Not yet, but they supposedly are supposed to start soon. I'm pretty happy with
that, more competition is good for everyone.

------
wbsun
This is awesome work! Kudos to the folks making this happen.

But at the same time, so sad the open source community have to spend their
efforts on this while vendors could have made this happen at beginning. (I
know there could be commercial/business/IP reasons, that's exactly why feel
sad, feel like it is not a problem that can be eventually solved at all).

------
WesolyKubeczek
I’m not sure which is it more about, the drivers getting so good, or GNOME
being so bad it needs a decent graphics stack with 3d acceleration just to
draw some application windows.

------
bgorman
Why doesn't ARM understand that having a free graphics stack provides tons of
business value for embedded systems?

~~~
pjmlp
Because they are getting big bucks from embedded vendors anyway.

Also all embedded FOSS OSes use non-copyleft licenses (RTOS, Zephyr, NutX,
mbed,...), Linux hardly matters to most of them.

And the few that actually use it, aren't contributing to upstream anyway.

------
chrissnell
Is there any non-NVIDIA GPU or motherboard that can run Wayland at 5K?

4K would be less than ideal for me but even that would better than crappy
NVIDIA drivers.

~~~
hcal
Almost any gpu. I run gnome on wayland with 4k just fine at the max refresh
rate of my monitor on 5 year old intel graphics. It's not even a slight
stretch.

~~~
sitzkrieg
is that 60hz?

~~~
hcal
yes

