
End of Inception decoded [video] - pavanlimo
http://sourcefed.com/end-inception-de-coded/
======
vidar
Already covered in
[http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2010/07/the_ultimate_explanat...](http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2010/07/the_ultimate_explanation_of_in.html)

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AnonJ
That article seems far-stretched and circuitous, making things out of its own
rather than really explaining what Nolan is trying to say(It's actually not
that complicated. Just a hugely commercial movie which is attached too many
connotations. For example they had to fight their way through, probably just
mainly because the need of cinematic effects). Also it has the very danger of
fashioning out massive escapism. "What matters isn't whether the top stopped
spinning; what matters is that Cobb didn't bother to find out." What total
nonsense. If we live our real life with such an attitude then it's one of the
utmost dangers I can imagine. (For example you may play a game all day long
and claim that is the "reality" you are fond of being in. While in fact doing
so only totally destroys your life as well as lives of people you should be
together with, as I have already experienced). We have to have the will and
courage to face the real life, to face all the things it throws at us no
matter good or bad. True joys only derive from the reality. Any attempts of
escapism will in the end only enlarge the problems you're facing and bring
more disasters.

~~~
kamaal
>>True joys only derive from the reality.

Well a dream is as real as things get.

The whole problem is really in describing reality. Ask any lucid dreamer and
they will explain you than the key to lucid dreaming is to constantly question
your current state(are your dreaming or not?).

And after some time it just doesn't matter. Because every thing is just a
electrical impulse to your brain. If your brain is sent a signal to treat hot
as cold. You will hold a hot iron in your hands and be perfectly OK with it.
The reality of things 'hot being hot' doesn't change, nothing changes but your
perception of things.

If you ponder deep enough when you dream this is what happens in a dream too.
You are perceiving things. Whether they are real are not, is as useless
argument because your knowledge of it is the way your brain is telling you
about it and not what it actually is.

I've had inception like dream within dream, losing lucidity while dreaming
inside the dream and there after. In stages like that its difficult to say
what is reality and what isn't. The safest way is to not do any thing harmful
or dangerous. In fact I didn't know of it until I woke, it was then during a
usual dream recall that I got a surreal feeling that I had woke up from three
levels of 'reality'.

~~~
X4
You know those days that are totally normal, the routine, what you do for a
period of time in your life to just reach to the next level? OK, I had a 4
level deep dream, in which I dreamed that I woke up. I did in glaring detail
what I would do, when I actually wake up, including the stupid things like
opening the fridge just remember what I was about to do. I didn't notice that
I dreamt until a single detail made me curious and I instantly woke up, before
I could notice what it was. However this was the 3rd level of the dream and
much more realistic than the 4th level. I'll skip the 2nd level, but in the
1st level of the dream I could not find a single thing that made me curious,
heck I even did what I would do, if I were suspecting that I was "dreaming",
like washing my face with icecold water, phoning to someone I know, asking
someone to pinch me. Unfortunately the pain and everything else was realistic
so I kept dreaming that I actually woke up now and was somehow fooled to
become relieved by that matter. After my routine day (which of course includes
brushing teeth, washing face, shower, going out, taking a bus ride, going
through the city and such random stuff) I turned back home and was just about
to think about the day, when I noticed something was wrong. I couldn't
remember what a professor said (you'd think that's normal, huh, haha?). And In
the glimpse of an eyeblink I woke up again. This time I was really awake, but
couldn't believe it for several weeks until I gave up finding out what's real
or not, hoping to be really awake. Everybody who had a very very long dream
taking years (in detail), knows that when dreaming there is no time limit. A
second can be an infinity in a dream.

After "waking up" into what I think is reality, I experienced a single
difference between dreams and reality. In every dream that I woke up, I could
see myself from the top and then immediately when my dreaming self opened it's
eyes I started seeing things through that perspective .

>> Is sleeping inside a dream possible? If not, that could be a trustable way
to find out if one is a dream or not. Much more reliable than a ring ;)

~~~
kamaal
All I can say is I'm a little jealous. :)

I hope some day I dream at such deep levels.

~~~
X4
I hope you do not. How will you find out that things are real or not?

It makes you really skeptic and a little more cautions, but also open to risk
than you would usually be. Maybe a good attitude for an entrepreneur, but all
your logic and fear induced by that logic mostly fades away at some times.
That's when you think it could be a dream subconsciously, at that time you
start doing things you never would. It's twisted, it could also make you
overly cautious, because you start valuing real life as something more
wonderful than you thought, a unique thing, something you are deadly afraid of
losing control of. The worst is: "What if you understand your multi-level
dream as bad as you understood Inception?" Just like some friend of yours who
had trouble getting Matrix in example. Could that mean you see draw a pattern
and believe reality is the 5th dream? Could that when you really wake up, make
everything make appear surreal? Would you try to jump from a window or do
something to find out if you're dreaming?

The question that reality is a dream is supported by the Simulated Reality
Hypothesis and that is also factor that makes this film a great one. Because
there is no answer to that question. You could wake up when you die, or you
could die. Using stochastic maths and game theory would suggest to die, but
that speaks against everything that makes a game, a dream or life out. Playing
is winning. Not playing is losing.

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ironic_process_theory](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ironic_process_theory)

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simulated_reality](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simulated_reality)

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gavanwoolery
Personally was not a big fan (hard to say that without sounding snooty) - the
movie was mostly entertaining but was kind of pop-corn sci fi masquerading as
deep sci fi. Too many plot holes filled with arbitrary mechanics. Edit: it may
have been over my head, but I think it is perhaps in a movie's favor to be
very clear in its purpose (without necessarily bludgeoning you with it)?

~~~
snitko
This explanation of Inception changed my opinion completely
[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ginQNMiRu2w](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ginQNMiRu2w)

~~~
StandardFuture
This REALLY needs to be upvoted. This is drastically better than the analysis
in the OP.

~~~
pavanlimo
Absolutely agree! I wish I had seen this video earlier.

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gabemart
The idea of Cobb's wedding ring as his totem has been discussed publicly as
early as July 2010 [1], the month of the film's release.

[1]
[http://www.reddit.com/r/Inception/comments/cvk2i/is_cobbs_ri...](http://www.reddit.com/r/Inception/comments/cvk2i/is_cobbs_ring_his_actual_totem/)

~~~
baby
Exactly, why posting this 3 years after? It has been brought up again and
again for many years...

~~~
_mulder_
Obligatory XKCD. This was all new to me.
[http://xkcd.com/1053/](http://xkcd.com/1053/)

~~~
voyou
Or possibly: [http://xkcd.com/606/](http://xkcd.com/606/)

~~~
Jtsummers
How about a relevant SMBC: [http://www.smbc-
comics.com/?id=3106](http://www.smbc-comics.com/?id=3106)

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kybernetikos
The whole point of the ending is that Cobb does not care about whether he is
in reality or not, as long as he is with his children.

To search for clues as to whether it's one or the other is to miss the point.

~~~
jkscm
Not at all. Nolan let DiCaprio wear the ring with an intent. It is at least
part of his message.

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leokun
No, it could also mean he simply let go of his wife, whether dreaming or not.

~~~
emhs
Post-catharsis, pre-wake, in Limbo to get Saito, he has the ring. If letting
go of Mal got rid of the ring, it wouldn't be there on him in Limbo.

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AnonJ
This explanation is not totally convincing. The main issue is the OP actually
just referred to very few scenes, while there is no proof that throughout
_all_ scenes this difference remained consistent. A more plausible explanation
would be Nolan _initially_ intended to use such a mechanism, but later decided
to leave it out. However, since some of the scenes of the movie were already
filmed, the ring could not be changed. It's obvious that Nolan put the
spinning scene because he _deliberately_ wanted to leave an equivocate ending.
It's possible that in the beginning that wasn't his idea, and he changed it
halfway through the movie. But what's clear is the ending was _intended_ to be
equivocate. He would not let such a vague "ring" mechanism co-exist with the
spinning scene. That's far too strenuous.

~~~
gr3yh47
You state your view as though it's obvious, yet it is far more contrived of an
explanation and is predicated on the idea that Nolan would change his mind
about the ring and NOT fix it throughout, which seems so unlike him

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aredington
The ring is still ambiguous. It is never characterized properly as a totem
(Cobb never uses it awake, that we see). If you interpret it as a symbolic
representation of his mental affiliation with Mal, then:

a) At the end of the movie he is awake, and he really meets his children. The
lack of the ring is consistent with all available evidence prior to this point
because he only has the ring on when he is asleep.

b) At the end of the movie he has successfully escaped Limbo twice. Cobb has
mastered his own psyche; he has achieved closure on Mal's death; he has
finally embraced in his own mind that the Mal in the dream is just a ghost,
and can be in the dream without the ring. He can dream again without Mal
invading from his subconscious.

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dsego
Here's a google talk by Kyle Johnson that discusses different interpretations
of the film:

'Inception and Philosophy'
[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ginQNMiRu2w](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ginQNMiRu2w)

~~~
pavanlimo
All those who think Inception should be considered as just another cool action
flick must watch this video.

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mrcactu5
A kind of Stone-Age version of Inception is "La Vida Es Sueño" by Pedro
Calderón de la Barca written in 1635.
[http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/La_vida_es_sue%C3%B1o](http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/La_vida_es_sue%C3%B1o)

It is a 3-act play where the Prince of Poland, Segismundo was imprisoned since
birth due to a bad prediction by astrologers that he would be evil. However,
Rosaura and Clarín arrange for his release.

    
    
      Nace el ave, y con las galas 
      que le dan belleza suma,  
      apenas es flor de pluma 
      o ramillete con alas, 
      cuando las etéreas salas 
      corta con velocidad, 
      negándose a la piedad 
      del nido que deja en calma; 
      ¿y teniendo yo más alma, 
      tengo menos libertad?
    

Essentially that birds are free to fly around in the sky and naturally look
beautiful. So why do I with more "soul" have less freedom ?

In Act 2, Segismundo contemplates his freedom and his relief turns into
outrage. Indeed he rapes a women, throws a man over a cliff and murders
another one.

In the 3rd act he is captured and thrown back in chains - the astrologers'
prediction has been fulfilled.

\--------------------------

Inception certainly takes this several iterations further putting dream inside
dream inside dream. Yet, metaphysical questions of whather you are awake or
dreaming have been around...

~~~
agos
This sounds more like [SPOILER HERE] Minority Report

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undershirt
I was beginning to wonder if it was just Hans Zimmer's score that masterfully
carried my emotions at the end. But too jarring was the theme of exploring the
depths of a shared psyche with your wife in an absolute, limitless world, then
losing everything in yourself from a single mistake. The dream mechanism was a
wonderful way of taking you from the sublime to the very feeling of hell.

Very glad to have read this subtle message from the director! A masterpiece in
my mind.

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nicholassmith
That was a real common theory around the time of the movies release, something
I noticed on my second (or third) run through it. The bigger tell is that it's
not his totem to start with, it belongs to Mal and as is pointed out you have
to have something unique to _you_ , something only _you_ could know. I don't
think it ever actually reveals what Cobb uses for his.

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ebbv
Inception was a pretty good movie but people treating it like it's some deep,
super-complicated work of genius makes me worry about them.

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dabernathy89
They aren't the first ones to have noted this.

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MasterScrat
Also, this came out a while ago...

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huhtenberg
Wasn't the whole film a dream? How else could Sato buy an airline on a whim?

~~~
MichaelGG
More importantly: The near-richest guy in the world, who hates flying
commercially, just gives up. Instead of, chartering a private flight, he flies
commercial and is visibly upset. He pouts and acts all annoyed. Obviously from
that point on they were all dreaming.

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jjjeffrey
Did anyone else find Inception to be basically straightforward (though
interesting and enjoyable) with an insignificant binary question at the end?

There certainly may be more depth than I'm seeing, but there wasn't anything
that made me need to wonder why anything happened the way it happened. As
mentioned in the thread already, Momento's the one that isn't straightforward.

I'm not intentionally trolling---I suppose I probably am missing something.
There just wasn't anything obviously confusing on the movie's surface for me.

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talles
"since the movie came out 3 years ago"

wow 3 years already?

~~~
albemuth
And babies born in Y2k are teens now

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adamb_
Cinefile article at THE TOP of HN. Love it.

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simias
Yeah, soon we'll just be able to merge this website into its own subreddit and
call it a day.

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PhilipDaineko
the ring could disappear because he finally realized that she died, hence it
does not mean he is in the reality.

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ryangripp
I watched this movie about 13 times in the theaters---and finally someone
figured it out! Way to go!

~~~
adamb_
I must ask... What compelled you to watch a movie THAT many times in such a
short period?

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ryangripp
I would say the first three times were because I enjoyed the movie so much the
other ten: I was obsessed with trying to figure out the ending.

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aufreak3
If the ring indeed indicates dream/reality, why does Cobb bother to spin the
top .. since he already knows whether he's wearing the ring or not? .. or did
he take off his ring even in his dream by that point?

~~~
emhs
Does Cobb know the ring indicates dream/reality?

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sarreph
It only took him 26 playthroughs (66 hours), but by Jove did he figure it out!

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sidcool
I read somewhere that his totem itself was flawed. For example, others totems
had something different; a loaded dice. In dream, the dice would act normally,
in reality it won't, that's the way to differentiate reality. Cobb's totem
would topple in dream as well as in reality.

That's something I read and wondered.

