
SF Engineer Dan Ha Has Been Missing Since 10/31 - coloneltcb
http://techcrunch.com/2014/11/06/sf-engineer-dan-ha-has-been-missing-since-halloween-night/
======
chadnickbok
This sucks, my heart goes out to his family :(

For a brief moment I wondered if this is what I want to see on HN/Techcrunch.
But we're a community, and lots of us live in SF - if it were a friend of
mine, I'd be super happy to see this trending. Seems like the least we can do
is have each others backs.

------
8ig8
This reminded me of another missing person posted here. Does anyone know what
happened to Luke Arduini? I have no connection, but for some reason this stuck
with me.

Here's some background:

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7048249](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7048249)

[http://blog.izs.me/post/72990767417/a-member-of-our-
communit...](http://blog.izs.me/post/72990767417/a-member-of-our-community-is-
missing-help-find-him)

~~~
vitalus
Very sad indeed - his friend's blog post on the subject:

[https://the-pastry-box-project.net/charlie-robbins/2014-sept...](https://the-
pastry-box-project.net/charlie-robbins/2014-september-5)

~~~
shutupalready
The blog says that a 9-year-old girl saw a man matching Luk's description
wearing a purple hoodie jump off the Golden Gate bridge on the very afternoon
he disappeared. The police report about this incident was tracked down _months
later_ by a private detective hired by Yahoo.

Unless I'm misreading the article, it took months to unearth this police
report. (The blog explicitly says that without Yahoo's help he would likely
still be "missing" _as he was for several months_.)

This is terrible!

How is it possible that we have an NSA that is so wickedly super-competent
that they can listen live to any phone conversation in the U.S.A. by clicking
a few keys on the keyboard (per Snowden's claims), and yet the police
department is so utterly incompetent (or uncaring) that they can't do the
equivalent of a grep on the incident reports for Jan. 1 2014.

search 'purple|violet|red' \+ 'hoodie|sweatshirt|hooded' \+ male +
radius(Oakland,25miles) in incident_reports_2014-01-01

------
recondite
You should post this at

[http://www.reddit.com/r/sanfrancisco](http://www.reddit.com/r/sanfrancisco)

as well.

~~~
gkoberger
/r/sanfrancisco mod here. It's a tough call, and one that Reddit Admins (not
mods) have mostly decided for us. The worry is this: an abusive ex could post
a "missing persons" alert for someone trying to hide, and get their location.

So, we have a rule that a news organization (which has more of an ability to
vet a story, as well as a "the cat's already out of the bag" effect) has to
cover it before it can be posted – and you'll notice the story is now on
r/sanfrancisco since one did.

~~~
abroncs
That's a very reasonable approach actually.

~~~
possibilistic
Agreed. Also, in this case, I think the Techcrunch article meets the
requirement for vetting by a news agency. Hopefully the SF-related subreddits
will give this greater visibility.

------
tonyplee
Just curious for case like this:

Can someone take a missing person report from Police department and take it to
Cell phone company and get any cell location traces for those period of time?
Assuming the cell is on.

Can anyone do it or just someone from police department?

~~~
throwaway022009
If only it were that easy... my brother went missing in February 2009 and as
of today it's still an "ongoing" investigation. I was basically blocked at
every turn...

In order for to get a cellphone log or trace, the detectives on the case needs
to file for a subpoena. A judge will then need to sign off on it which takes
24-48 hours. Following that, they need to submit it to the cellphone company
which claims it might take a billing cycle before the data is provided since
it's on the "cell towers" and it's not transmitted yet. Even then, the
information is useless. It's nothing more than what you receive on your
monthly billing statement.

Police has no authority to just do it since it's up to the cellphone provider.

~~~
JshWright
That is (unfortunately) not entirely true. If they have reason to suspect
there is an immediate risk of injury or death, they can locate the phone
(assuming it's on) with a high degree of accuracy (at the very least, cell
tower triangulation, if not GPS activation).

We had a situation a few years ago where a couple kids had skipped school and
gone joyriding in a quarry. Their parents contacted the police, who contacted
the cell phone company, and the cell company gave them a reasonably accurate
fix (I assume this was voluntary on the part of the phone company, given how
quickly it happened).

~~~
shawndumas
in that instance it was likely that the parents were the rightful owner of
that information because the account was in their name so therefore there was
no need to involve a judge

~~~
JshWright
Ah, that's an excellent differentiating factor I hadn't thought of, thanks.

------
gear54rus
Amazing how at this point we can pretty much find anything through digital
means as nearly everything is shared and appears online eventually.

Yet we still fail to find something (or someone) that really matters.

~~~
mrjatx
On the flip side, if you're an adult and trying to "disappear" for.. whatever
reason you've chosen (it's your prerogative), social media has made that
difficult.

~~~
wpietri
An adult trying to disappear would not have a very hard time saying, "Hey,
everybody! I'm going to take some time away from social media and go on a
trip. I'll be back on-line in a couple months. I look forward to reading all
your posts when I'm back." In some ways, I think social media makes it easier
to disappear, as you can give everybody a plausible explanation at once,
rather than trying to talk individually to the many people who might be
plausibly concerned by a sudden disappearance.

~~~
mrjatx
I didn't mean go on a long vacation. I meant disappear and start a new life.
You wouldn't post about that on social media, you'd just pack your bags and
go. But social media will have your friends being detectives about where
you've gone, someone from reddit might see you at the airport or grabbing
coffee, etc.

~~~
throwaway022009
Unfortunately, it's actually not that hard. My brother vanished when he was 23
and to this day, he's still a missing person's case. You'd hope that your
friends would search for you, but most people are just too busy with their own
lives to exert too much effort when it's not their problem.

He was someone with over a thousand Facebook friends, but no one seemed to
notice that he stopped posting. The first few months he was missing, his
friends continued to send him invites to parties, events, etc. As time when on
and he didn't respond, they naturally stopped sending invites. A few friends
sent emails saying, "Hey, I haven't seen you in a while. I'm worried. Call
me." Eventually they too stopped. All it took was a matter of months before
people stopped to reach out.

When news broke that he was first missing, his friends seemed more annoyed
than anything. I suppose most of them thought this was a hoax (not that he's
ever done anything like this before). They were reluctant to be bothered, to
break up their day to simply answer a few questions the detectives had to
paint a better picture of my brother. I don't blame them too much, no one
wants additional drama in their lives.

Of course, the scenario will be unique for everyone. Everyone has a different
group of friends, different resources. Unfortunately for me, I was blocked. I
practically had access to all his accounts with the help of his girl friend,
but at the end of the day, I couldn't get a subpoena to see if there were any
deleted gmail or facebook messages. I wasn't able to get a subpoena to track
the cellphone fast enough. He was just casted off as a statistic, just another
quarter-life crisis suicide case. I sincerely hope the family gets some good
news about Dan Ha, because there's nothing worse than having to wake up every
morning wondering if you could have done more.

~~~
LaFolle
Hi throwaway022009, your story reminds me of Steven Wilson's concept and
inspiration for his new album:
[http://youtu.be/49HxZ8yVpqk?t=51s](http://youtu.be/49HxZ8yVpqk?t=51s)

Hope he is happy where ever he is.

------
rikacomet
If the little bit of time this stays up on front page, would help find him,
then by all means let it be. You have my support for this. I hope, wherever he
is, he is in good health.

------
eastbayjake
I really hope this guy is OK, but the number of young men "disappearing" in
San Francisco is strange and maybe cause for some questions:
[http://sfappeal.com/2013/12/families-of-men-who-
disappeared-...](http://sfappeal.com/2013/12/families-of-men-who-disappeared-
in-sf-hold-candlelight-vigil/)

~~~
jowiar
It doesn't shock me at all -- It's one of the reason's I got the hell out of
SF, and I'm not going back. It's an effect of the monster we've created, the
collateral damage of our industry that the lottery winners, the VCs, the
media, and the politicians all sweep under the rug. It's an effect of the
"don't show weakness" cultural norm that we've created for men, and it's about
time we get over ourselves and tear it down.

~~~
JonMR
You've lost me. You're saying that the city has real problems which are being
ignored due to the successes?

~~~
jowiar
Not the city - certainly nothing that's can be solved by city hall. But tech
as a whole, and even moreso in SF specifically, is a pretty hostile-to-mental-
health place to work. Everyone being shitty to themselves (and those around
them) because of the 1-in-a-some-large-number-here chance of becoming an
instant millionaire.

------
jonalmeida
Sounds crazy, but this is an irrational fear that I have for myself or loves
ones; I'll go out one day but won't make it at my destination without anyone
knowing where I am.

I know share my current GPS location with my family, so that they always know
where we all are, and the last place we were at before going missing.

------
vinhboy
They should link to his facebook group page... I can't find it.

~~~
salina
Public Facebook Page -
[https://www.facebook.com/finddanha](https://www.facebook.com/finddanha)

Facebook Event (where friends and family are organizing efforts) -
[https://www.facebook.com/events/1498483497100432/?ref_notif_...](https://www.facebook.com/events/1498483497100432/?ref_notif_type=like&source=1)

------
hindsightbias
This is getting ridiculous:

[https://www.facebook.com/MissingCalifornia5](https://www.facebook.com/MissingCalifornia5)

Anyone have any contacts at the FBI?

------
mk00
I wonder if Google/Apple can get anything tracking-related from his
Smartphone.

~~~
salina
Unfortunately, no luck. His phone has been off since the night he disappeared.

------
LaFolle
Really sad for his family and friends. But, what could be the reason for his
depression?

~~~
BruceM
Depression needs no reason.

~~~
LaFolle
I doubt that. If there is no reason, it can't be cured. But there are cases of
depression being cured, so there has to be a reason for depression.

~~~
smt88
I try to be polite and respectful when I disagree on HN, but you are honestly
an ass. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt that you're just ignorant and
not an idiot.

When you asked for a "reason" for depression, you clearly implied a human
cause. You may even have implied that he just "felt bad" about something that
happened to him. That is wrong to the point of being offensive. You wouldn't
say, "Why did he get brain cancer?" or "Why does she have Parkinson's?"
Depression is an illness.

It's not considered curable, though it is highly treatable for some people.
And the curability of something doesn't dictate a "reason" or lack of one.
Illness is often senseless and random, especially something with a genetic
factor such as depression.

~~~
LaFolle
Generally what i have seen is that people get depressed because of some
painful event which happened in their lives.

Like, you get depressed when your partner leaves you, or you're fired from a
job or death of a loved one. So, i haven't seen anyone getting depressed
without any painful emotion. Maybe I am highly wrong in that.

Lets say, I clear my ignorance by believing/understanding that depression is
an illness without any reason. But, making a statement like "depression needs
no reason" ain't correct either. Both possibilities exist.

If I may rephrase, I was just curious about the reason, if it existed, why Dan
Ha was depressed.

~~~
tallanvor
First, it doesn't matter why this person is/was depressed - it's not our
business. Depression, like many other illnesses, is a private matter and only
the person suffering has the right to decide who to tell and how much
information to share. The fact that Dan Ha is missing does not change this.

Second, while the onset of depression can sometimes be triggered by one or
more specific events, the truth is that many cases of depression have no
discernible cause. When someone says that "depression needs no reason", they
simply mean that there doesn't need to be any specific trigger. Of course
there is something underlying the condition - whether it's caused initially by
an event, some chemical imbalance in the brain, some combination of the two,
or something else that we don't understand yet, the point is that it doesn't
have to be caused by "some painful event".

Third, don't assume that depression is a sudden condition. It can creep up on
you over time without you realizing it. Or maybe you do realize it, but you do
your best to handle it, to get over it on your own, to hide it from others.
You can have highs and lows (not to be confused with bipolar or manic
episodes), rather times when you feel you are doing better or worse. Maybe you
go a week or a month thinking it's gone, only to wake up one morning with
depression making itself known again. It can be months or years before anyone
else notices, if they ever do. And the ones who do? It's not necessarily your
closest friends - it could be a casual acquaintance or a coworker who notices
the change.

Depression can consume you. You might think it just means feeling bad, but it
can be much worse than that. It can mean feeling dead inside, or not feeling
anything at all.

Even when you make a choice to accept help (whether you seek it out or it's
forced on you - hopefully before you do something extremely stupid), it can
take a long time to recover. Medication often helps, even though we don't no
exactly why - yes, we know approximately how the medication changes things in
your brain - affecting dopamine uptake, for example, but we don't know why it
does it. And it's not a matter of simply going on medication. You have to work
with your doctor to figure out the right level for you - and that level might
change over time. What worked for a time may be too much later, causing side
effects that leave you feeling bad. Adjusting the dose can mean feeling worse
for a couple of weeks while you wait for your body and mind to adjust! You sit
at work feeling like you're about to fall asleep, and when you try to go to
bed you stare at the ceiling for hours. You might be sitting or walking and
feel a wave of dizziness. You gain or lose weight, seemingly without changes
to your diet or routine. Even though you're not as depressed, it can be hard
to go out and do things with people, leaving you feeling isolated.

Therapy can help at times, but it also takes time. You don't just sit down
with a doctor and establish trust right away. It takes multiple sessions for a
psychiatrist/psychologist to make a diagnosis. And they might not be the ones
who can recommend medication either, so you still have to work with another
doctor at the same time. Short term therapy ends up lasting for months, or
years.

Finally, do you know what can be the worst thing about depression? People who
tell you that there's no reason for you to be depressed. People who think it's
easy to "stop thinking that way!" People who think that you ought to know why
it's happening. People who say "get over it, you've got it good."

Don't believe you know what causes depression because even the people who
spend their lives studying it admit that they can't really explain it yet -
they can't put together the puzzle because they still haven't even found all
the pieces!

