

The Amanda Palmer problem - ValentineC
http://www.vulture.com/2013/04/the-amanda-palmer-problem.html

======
taeric
> because another thing the web has done is erode the ability to put something
> into the world that is directed only at interested parties.

And see, I feel the opposite. I don't go to sites like CNN or Vulture or
whatever, _because_ I have little interest in the fire hose of information
that is available there. That is, for many of us, the ability to directly
choose the information we see is the exact opposite of what this describes.

Granted, this is brushing with my bitterness that my RSS reader of choice was
recently tossed. And that too many places are wanting to "reach out to me"
through the social giants. So, yeah, salt.

~~~
vannevar
I think the point of the article is that even if you try to ignore those
sites, mass media leaks through everywhere. The web really hasn't displaced
mass media at all, but merely become an extension of it.

~~~
taeric
But the implication is that this is somehow a new thing. There is _plenty_ of
stuff on the internet that is not seen by the vast majority of folks out
there.

I would actually include this Palmer stuff. Sure, it is well known in certain
circles. In particular, the TED crowd along with Gaiman fans. Outside if that,
though.... Even the kickstarter that rose 1 million only had upwards of 25k
donors, from the stats I recall. Hardly a majority of the internet.

~~~
vannevar
Sure, in fact I'd go as far as to say that most of the content available on
the Internet has been seen by nobody. I would paraphrase the author's point
as, hey, we've been told that the Internet provides a new way for an artist to
communicate directly with her fans, and so it does; but it doesn't change the
fact that even a message intended only for one audience will nonetheless be
judged by another. Consider the recent sorority girl email that went viral, or
the myriad of leaked sexts. The same connectedness that makes it easy to
create targeted messages makes it just as easy to rebroadcast them to
everyone. If the sorority girl had sent a letter 40 years ago, someone
might've made copies and circulated them on campus but that's as far as it
would've gone. The profanity would have prevented the mass media from picking
it up, and while she might still have been fired, she would hardly have been
the subject of worldwide discussion.

------
zethraeus
This isn't a particularly new problem, and it's not all that related to crowd
funding or the internet. It's just the 'haters gonna hate' brand of jealousy.
When you attract attention doing something outside of the mainstream context,
people analyse your actions but don't understand - or plain dislike - their
context.

We don't live in hamlets anymore, subcultures and like minded people can find
each other. This is great. Try to ignore the noise!

------
ChrisNorstrom
I hate to be the one to say this but I feel it's true. If Amanda Palmer were
Adam Palmer he could have messed up a hundred different ways, turned to drugs,
fathered 10 children and abandoned them all and still not attracted the same
lame attempted controversy. Every time I read controversy about Amanda its
more forced and more angry & bitter than the last time. I'm convinced it's
envy and jealousy.

There's a lot of guys who dream of being in a band and seeing a woman (who's
music is good but not great, and whose looks aren't bleached blond porn star)
rise above them so quickly just pisses them off. So they do what they've
always historically done. Attack that bitch and put her in her place. How dare
she make it in this world. How dare she surpass them.

=== Kickstarter "Drag the Bitch Down" campaign list ===

\- Amanda Palmer, Anita Sarkeesian, Susan Wilson & her 9 year old daughter.
(if you don't know about Wilson: [http://kotaku.com/internet-rallies-against-
kickstarter-for-n...](http://kotaku.com/internet-rallies-against-kickstarter-
for-nine-year-old-459542190) \+ [http://www.dailydot.com/news/reddit-
kickstarter-rpg-mackenzi...](http://www.dailydot.com/news/reddit-kickstarter-
rpg-mackenzie-wilson-susan/) )

All 3 successful. At the time of their attack they had not failed to deliver
to their backers. 2 of the 3 had their personal lives viciously verbally
attacked by internet hate groups. Sarkeesian and Wilson were ripped a new
hole. Palmer just invoked anger without the rage, probably because she has a
lot of male fans. Men seem to avoid messing with women who have male fans, due
to the possibility of getting their ass kicked.

Search for "kickstarter controversies" on google and you'll get mostly Palmer
and Wilson.

=== Kickstarter gentleman who are forgiven or forgotten. ===

\- Josh Dibb, aka Deakin still hasn't delivered backer's rewards after 3
years. He isn't really talked about.

\- Schuyler Towne, big delayed delivery, broken gifts, mental breakdown. Have
you heard of him?

\- Diaspora project, failure, long delays, needs more funding, 1 suicide.

All 3 failed to deliver. No campaigns of hatred and revenge.

If I'm missing something contradictory please let me know. I don't want to
believe this is the world we still live in, but that's what current evidence
is showing so far.

Theoretical Lesson: If you're a woman and you're about to make a whole lot of
men jealous. Make sure you have a picture of a strong, tall, beefy alpha male
in your kickstarter video. Your chances of being messed with will be much
lower.

~~~
summerdown2
The thing is, I think you could be right AND there might be an interesting
conversation to be had about Amanda Palmer's business model.

There does seem to be a thing on the internet where women who divert from the
norm get cut down much more viciously than a man would. I think this might be
an interesting conversation to have and I've no idea what the fix might be
other than time and generational change (which I think is coming).

However, I think there is also a discussion to be had about how we fund the
digital age, because it really isn't clear how artists will get paid in
future. And a lot of the attempts so far do look like begging.

My own view is that there is something awkward in the use of unpaid labour as
a business model, but I'm not sure what else can be done. Eventually, the
internet looks like it will trend towards to free access for everyone to all
media at all times.

My personal lack of comfort is that all the payment models I've seen so far
decouple the product from the person. To some degree I would suggest that in
the past we've paid for good product, but in the future we're increasingly
asked to pay for a good person. The difficulty is that this favours the
extrovert publicists over the quiet artists and I wish there was some way it
might look like this latter group had a future, too.

