
Announcing Microsoft Edge for iOS and Android, Microsoft Launcher - bfred_it
https://blogs.windows.com/windowsexperience/2017/10/05/announcing-microsoft-edge-for-ios-and-android-microsoft-launcher/
======
exikyut
TL;DR: it's NOT using its own engine on Android. It uses Blink there.

" _On iOS, we are using the WebKit engine, as provided by iOS in the WKWebView
control. That means that from a compatibility perspective, Microsoft Edge for
iOS should match the version of Safari that is currently available for iOS._ "

" _On Android, we are using the Blink rendering engine from the Chromium
browser project._ "

Source:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15408882](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15408882)
-> [https://blogs.windows.com/msedgedev/2017/10/05/microsoft-
edg...](https://blogs.windows.com/msedgedev/2017/10/05/microsoft-edge-ios-
android-developer/)

~~~
niutech
This is a capitulation of Microsoft - instead of porting their engine to
Android, they made a yet another Chromium/Blink shell. It is not what I expect
from a big corporation.

~~~
flukus
I agree, this is about as impressive as some kid that builds his own browser
in Visual Basic by drag'n'dropping in an IE control.

------
mixedbit
Edge is a good browser, people seem to default to criticizing it because of
its infamous predecessor. We should root for Edge, it is in the open Web best
interest to have several browsers sharing the market.

~~~
remotelifestyle
Edge is not a good browser. It is holding the web back with its slow adoption
of HTML5 standards. (source:
[https://html5test.com/compare/browser/chrome-58/edge-12.html](https://html5test.com/compare/browser/chrome-58/edge-12.html))

Edge still has a spoof referrer header vulnerability that's been known for
more than 6 months now: [https://www.brokenbrowser.com/referer-spoofing-patch-
bypass/](https://www.brokenbrowser.com/referer-spoofing-patch-bypass/)

~~~
kylealden
The version of Edge you're linking to on HTML5Test there is two years and four
major versions out of date. Edge 16 is more than 100 points higher on
HTML5Test.

More generally, there's a lot more to making the web great than a blind sprint
to adopt every API. Just because it isn't shipping doesn't mean Microsoft
isn't a (very) active participant in the standards conversations, testing
behind flags, etc. That is a huge part of moving the web forward.

Take Grid as an example - we were the last browser to ship the updated spec,
so you could say we "held it back." But we also originated the first version
of the spec and worked closely with the community, standards bodies, and other
browser vendors on making sure what ultimately shipped cross-browser this year
was great, useful, and interoperable. Is that holding the web back?

(Disclaimer: Edge employee)

~~~
mixedbit
To add another example, WebVR API cleanup was inspired by Microsoft that
joined the group working on this API. Edge isn't yet shipping WebVR, but they
are helping with the work.

~~~
kylealden
Good example! Though, for the record, WebVR 1.1 is shipping in EdgeHTML 15.
Fair to call it a preview, since consumer headsets won't be available until
later this month with the Fall Creators Update, at which point end-to-end
support will work out of the box.

------
planetjones
I struggle to get too excited about Edge on iOS because it's not really Edge
is it. It will just be like Firefox which uses the built-in iOS WebKit-based
rendering. So it's effectively Safari doing the rendering with some wrappers
around it like syncing Windows favourites and sharing open windows with your
Windows PC?

Maybe some corporations which have Windows on the desktop, but where most
employees use iOS devices on the go, will find some use for this.

~~~
jmkni
I'm guessing this is the case with Chrome as well?

~~~
mtycholaz
Yes, and it's because of an Apple policy. They don't allow other rendering
engines.

~~~
sebazzz
It is not that they do not allow other render engines. It is that APIs to
dynamically execute native code are locked down on platforms such as Windows
Mobile and iOS. If you cannot dynamically execute code you cannot build a JIT
JS engine which makes your webbrowser too slow compared to the competition.

~~~
KirinDave
This is a policy who's primary goal is to ban other browser engines. They make
exceptions for lots of other app types like games.

~~~
jmkni
I guess in theory you could build a browser on top of a game engine, or is
that just insane?

~~~
stephengillie
Tribes 2 had a full web browser in the game. It was a continuation of having a
full IRC client in the first game, Starsiege: Tribes.

(Tribes 2 also had the IRC client. The IRC client initially drove players into
chat channels to help them find ongoing games, and dropped a link when someone
left IRC to join a game. It was decent matchmaking in 1998, and helped build
the community as well.)

The browser itself wasn't as insane as writing the entire game menu in OpenGL,
which at the time was uncommon. Game devs cited this choice (instead of using
a simpler menu) as causing a 6-month delay in the project, leading to much
less testing and a game that crashed frequently for the first few months after
release. The ubiquitous "Unhanded Exception" pop-up became a meme for years
after.

------
IvanK_net
The performance of Edge is comparable to Chrome or Firefox. It is a really
great product. The sad part is, that they were keeping it Win10-only for
several years. I think, that if they made Edge available for every platform
and every OS earlier, they could have 20 - 50 % of the market by now.

The funny part is, that there is NO EDGE FOR WINDOWS. Precisely, Edge is for
Windows 10 only, which is the minority of all Windows devices today. There is
no Microsoft browser for Windows 7 (by a browser I mean the one that is
regularly updated). MS announced the halting of IE development a long time
ago.

~~~
ocdtrekkie
There is Edge for Windows. It's called Edge. Windows 10, is believe it or not,
Windows. Any computer running Windows 7 or 8.1 can still (yes, it can) be
upgraded to Windows 10 for free. So the only Windows PCs which cannot run Edge
were those manufactured prior to 2009.

Contrary to popular belief, there is no good reason to be running Windows 7 or
8.1. All of the telemetry anti-features were backported into those versions,
Windows 10 is inherently better at security, and trust me, if I can get the
legacy software I have running at work running on Windows 10, legacy app
issues aren't a problem either.

~~~
IvanK_net
90 percent of Windows 10 users that I know updated from Windows 7
unintentionally and most of them complained about it. Such updates form
Microsoft have quite bad reputation. You can't just say "Hey do this
irreversible software change and trust us, that you will be satisfied". I am
ready to accept it e.g. from Chrome OS, but not from Microsoft.

~~~
ksk
While I agree that most users (of Windows, Chrome, OSX, iOS etc) are
forced/tricked onto the auto-update treadmill, atleast with Windows and OSX I
can re-install the older version. With iOS and such it is _impossible_ to
downgrade. With Chrome I suppose if you get some kind of non-web installer,
you can go back and then disable the update service, but that probably is an
unsupported configuration and very likely going to break at some point.

To your last point, I would say I am ready to accept it from anyone except an
advertising company whose only primary means of making money is by sifting
through my personal data and spying on my online activities. With MS, I have
little doubt that they "would if they could", but at-least for now, they wont,
since they're making more money selling actual products.

------
satysin
Had to happen sooner or later. I just wish Microsoft had not tied Edge so
deeply into Windows 10 (did they not learn from doing the same with Internet
Explorer?) as at the moment it is limited to updates as part of the OS
(Windows Update) and not the Microsoft Store.

~~~
KirinDave
I think part of the reason for this is that you shouldn't be web browsing with
old software. It's unsafe for you and others that your hardware could damage.

~~~
richardknop
But apps should be update-able separately, not as part of an operating system
update. That doesn't make much sense. Especially on mobile when you might want
to only update single app currently relevant to you without blocking your
phone for 40 minutes doing a huge update of everything. Also limited
bandwidth.

~~~
KirinDave
We've not been in a world where the web browser can be separated from the OS
for at least 7 years.

------
bfred_it
More information about Edge Mobile is available here, however not many
technical details (e.g. whether the Android version is just a WebView or if
it's the real Edge)

[https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/microsoft-edge-
mobil...](https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/microsoft-edge-mobile)

~~~
d2kx
"On iOS, we are using the WebKit engine, as provided by iOS in the WKWebView
control. That means that from a compatibility perspective, Microsoft Edge for
iOS should match the version of Safari that is currently available for iOS.

On Android, we are using the Blink rendering engine from the Chromium browser
project."

~~~
mtgx
So it's more like Faux-Edge. I guess it still provides a benefit for Edge
users who want to sync their data and whatnot. It's just not too interesting
beyond that.

At least Firefox Focus (based on Chromium, too) is a "private by default" kind
of browser, who those who care about that experience and don't want to mess
with settings or don't know how to set it up so that it has maximum privacy.
Speaking of which, it would be nice if Firefox Focus also provided an easy-to-
use option to enable browsing over Tor.

~~~
partiallypro
All browsers on iOS are not using their own render engine, Apple doesn't allow
it.

------
bla2
It'd be nice if they made it open source too.

And it'd be nice if iOS allowed real browser alternatives instead of requiring
everyone to use WKWebView.

------
niftich
Back in the days of the Acid tests and when vendor prefixes for experimental
features were the norm, and a visit to caniuse.com was often met with
disappointment, discretionary users cared as much about a browser's layout
engine as the application's surrounding chrome and features.

But as web engines have been moving closer to feature parity (as well as
Chrome and Firefox's combined dominance of marketshare), the bonus features of
the application are rising in importance. (Some) people want their bookmarks,
their synced passwords, their addons, their (sometimes-captive) integrations;
this is the space that Edge competes in now.

The same applies on iOS, for slightly different reasons. On iOS everything is
slightly different, you get the same rendering engine every which way. There,
the only way to differentiate yourself is by extra features.

------
bsharitt
I wonder if Microsoft will ever pull a Kindle and rollout custom Android
device that replaces Google services and and apps with Microsoft equivalents.

~~~
miguelrochefort
They already sell a Samsung Galaxy S8 "Microsoft Edition" in their stores,
which comes with their apps pre-installed. I wouldn't be surprised to see them
push that even further.

------
ekianjo
I shall add it's funny they keep saying "Microsoft Loves Linux" but refuses to
release any of their major desktop client software for Desktop Linux.

~~~
ygra
“Refuse” is a fairly strong word and suggests there is a Linux version
available and just withheld. Software and features don't just appear out of
nowhere.

~~~
SmellyGeekBoy
Indeed. Not to mention that Office Online works just fine in a browser under
Linux.

------
Sujan
Can Edge for iOS be selected as "default browser" in iOS so it is by default
used in all the places Safari normally handles? The "send to PC" thing _is_
nice, but only if available everywhere and consistently.

~~~
stiGGG
No, App developers are able to find out if Edge (or Chrome or Firefox) is
installed on your device to give you an option to open links inside it, but
most apps don't do that and you still can not change the default browser.

~~~
Sujan
Shame.

Then maybe Microsoft could create a share extension that uses this new Windows
feature to "collect" URLs from an iPhone?

------
nailer
Alas, visiting the signup page [https://www.microsoft.com/en-
us/windows/microsoft-edge-mobil...](https://www.microsoft.com/en-
us/windows/microsoft-edge-mobile) from Edge on Windows 10 asks me to visit the
page using Edge on Windows 10:
[https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DLYLTmHWsAEnlPF.jpg](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DLYLTmHWsAEnlPF.jpg)

Update: they're looking into it:
[https://twitter.com/MSEdgeDev/status/915934723754516481](https://twitter.com/MSEdgeDev/status/915934723754516481)

------
santoshalper
Mobile browsers could use a shakeup, but Edge is not super interesting to me.
The Microsoft Launcher (which is implied to just be a re-branded Arrow
launcher) on the other hand is fucking great. For me it's been Arrow or Nova
for the past few years.

------
arunc
When we have Firefox focus for Android, I wonder why would anyone use this.
Microsoft can dream about capturing the user base unless they open source it
(which won't happen anyway).

------
israrkhan
Why would a user use Edge on iOS/Android when they are using platform native
rendering engines (webkit/blink). what is the value add here (Working with a
windows 10 PC?)

~~~
burkaman
> Microsoft Edge for iOS and Android brings familiar features like your
> Favorites, Reading List, New Tab Page and Reading View across your PC and
> phone, so, no matter the device, your browsing goes with you. But what makes
> Microsoft Edge really stand out is the ability to continue on your PC, which
> enables you to immediately open the page you’re looking at right on your
> PC—or save it to work on later.

This is for people who use Edge on their PC and want everything to sync with
their phone.

------
sergiosgc
Installed, got temperature in Farenheit in the weather widget, found no
settings to use Celsius, concluded it's not near polished enough.

Back to Google Now Launcher.

~~~
kylealden
Per the blog post, we're not localized broadly in the preview, but will be
adding more locales/languages as we head towards a stable release. Hope you'll
try it again!

------
merrvk
Does it make use edgeHTML or Chakra though?

------
grandpoobah
if firefox can't do it, there's no way ms can

~~~
MBCook
It’s no different than Chrome or Firefox on iOS. Standard WebKit rendering
with an MS GUI and syncing features to feel more like edge and integrate with
the rest of their stuff better.

Sounds like it’s the same on Android too (only using Chromium).

~~~
gsnedders
Chrome on iOS is starting to diverge from Safari, sorta: they inject a bunch
of JS to each page to essentially polyfill a bunch of stuff that iOS doesn't
provide.

------
dumbmatter
_One of the most common requests we hear from people who use Microsoft Edge on
Windows 10 PCs is "we want our browser experience to move to our phones"._

That's funny, my most common request is "IT'S BEEN LIKE 5 YEARS, CAN YOU GUYS
FINALLY SUPPORT ALL OF THE INDEXEDDB API? EVEN SAFARI DOES IT NOW!"

So sad when poor multinational corporations simply don't have the resources to
compete with obscenely wealthy organizations like Mozilla. Maybe they should
try open sourcing their browser so the community can pitch in?

~~~
ekianjo
> most common requests we hear from people who use Microsoft Edge on Windows
> 10 PCs

Are there really people using Microsoft Edge out there? I mean, because they
want to, not because they have to?

~~~
dagw
I've been using it almost exclusively on my laptop for the past few month as
an experiment. And honestly it's a perfectly fine browser that basically just
works as well as any other browser. That being said I cannot come up with any
good argument why you should switch to using it instead of whatever you are
currently using.

~~~
sp332
Yeah, I've been really impressed with Edge. If I had started using Edge
instead of having all my stuff in Firefox, I probably never would have
bothered switching.

~~~
omk
The developer tools on Edge are not on par with Chrome or Firefox. That is one
reason I stay away. I don't mind using the browser once in a while when I need
more sessions than my Chrome profiles.

------
martin_bech
Stop trying to make Edge happen.. its not going to happen..

~~~
frou_dh
[http://caniuse.com/fetch](http://caniuse.com/fetch)

------
201709User
No tiles in launcher? Garbage.

------
igtztorrero
lol

~~~
sctb
Could you please not post if it's not going to be civil and substantive, like
the guidelines ask?

[https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html](https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html)

------
amaks
Powered by Bing?

~~~
NiveaGeForce
It allows custom default search engines.

