
Homeless alone - wkoszek
http://homelessalone.blogspot.com/
======
aerovistae
I find this pretty fascinating. Firstly because I'm overwhelmed with sympathy
for this guy, and I stopped to ask why. I live in Chicago and I see the
homeless every day, and I know it's a problem and I wish I could fix it but I
don't know how, and giving a dollar to every person I pass would actually
start to have a hefty toll ($20+/day or more, _easily._ ) So since moving to
the city I made it a blanket rule not to give hand-outs in that form.

But because this guy keeps a blog, because he is articulate and just sounds
like another guy, easily could be me, because he still has his voice, I'm
almost tempted to send him a couple hundred dollars over paypal. I haven't
yet, but the temptation is there. Just because I can hear his story instead of
just see him sitting on a sidewalk. It makes it so much harder to walk by.

I do wish I knew more about how it happened. I always wonder that. I usually
think there must have been some bad choices made along the way. Not that
anyone's free of bad choices. But, why did he instantly become homeless after
his mother sold the house? Why didn't he have any savings at that age? Why
didn't he have any old friends who would take him in to help him out? I know
not everyone is so fortunate as to have those things, of course, but still I
wonder how it happens.

~~~
mgkimsal
I don't know Neil well, but he did speak twice at my conference several years
ago (2010 and 2012). In 2012, he was walking with a cane, and had had a stroke
between those two times I met him. Still in good spirits, but was definitely a
little physically slower.

I'm pretty sure there's more to the back story that led up to this, and I've
encouraged him to write more about this at some point when he's more stable.
If I were to guess, based on the few points he's made in writing, there's some
family rift going on, and I might also presume that he may have been paying
for things for his mother that might have otherwise gone in to savings.

He's been through a divorce, which can certainly have a financial toll on
anyone, and I think it was a bit later in life, which may be harder to recover
from.

A late divorce, some health problems, trying to support a family member - all
of that may quickly deplete someone's funds.

As to the homeless part, I think there's a certain pride involved, and asking
for help may be embarrassing, especially to have to involve friends. It may be
that many of his local friends would be tied to his mother/family, and may not
be as supportive as one might hope.

I sent money to paypal, but it's frozen, and I'm wondering if I can reverse it
and senf via GFM and he'll get access faster. Hrmmm....

~~~
capote
I always have to wonder why people don't work at least minimum wage jobs, to
solve the base problems like hunger.

I apologize if I'm missing something or if I seem really ignorant. Actually, I
realize I _am_ totally ignorant in this respect. I've never worked a job
outside of programming, so I don't know—is it very difficult for some people
to get 'normal' jobs? Is it mostly people with some kind of issue or
disability that affects their ability to get a job who wind up like this? Are
there not as many minimum-wage, or non-professional (or something) jobs out
there as I think there are?

I realize once you get to a certain level it becomes really tough to recover,
but when you're on your way, and savings are going, shouldn't you be looking
around for any way to earn some cash?

~~~
SolaceQuantum
Being homeless and getting a job makes it very difficult, almost impossible.
Where are you gonna keep a nice suit? Where are you going to get shaving
materials? Make-up? Do your hair? Even if you got the job, where will they
send your checks? What if you don't have official documentation (birth
certidicate, social security, etc) because you're homeless? How would you get
around if public transport is unreliable?

And even if you could request them, where would the gov't send the
documentation? Where would you do your taxes or anything?

Where are you going to get enough time on the internet to submit hundreds of
applications? Or where are you going to print resumes to hand them out?

Being homeless makes the basics of getting a minimum wage job a near
insurmountable task for many.

~~~
capote
I suppose ther person at hand and many others had things happen so
unexpectedly and quickly that he might not have had time to mobilize all these
requirements for a job.

It bothers me that a handful of these problems seem possible to be easily
solved with very little tax money. A place to send checks/ids (free PO boxes
with an address for the homeless) a place to help get documentation and
stuff...

Do shelters provide basic makings for a shower and shave?

Even internet access with available hardware, since it's more and more
possible to do everything on the internet, would be reasonable.

~~~
Natsu
Yes, some shelters will provide such, as well as an address to get mail at.
They also will help you search for a job.

------
joeevans1000
It's a bit stunning to some of the philosophical waxing in here, ruminations
and curiosity about what bad choices were made. The guy had a stroke, which he
states. It's so stunning that this isn't enough explanation for some, who
wonder if he didn't save enough. Our culture is so far gone that a stroke
isn't enough explanation for homelessness. To hell with needing reasons... he
shouldn't have to provide them. I think the urge for reasons are just ways to
determine in our minds we couldn't one day be in his shoes and/or remove the
idea that perhaps we should help.

~~~
jacalata
I think a better sign of being "so far gone" is when you find it totally blasé
that a stroke can lead to homelessness.

~~~
nojvek
This. Even though my employer provides descent insurance I still end up paying
quite a bit more out of pocket then I did in Australia or Canada.

Having lived in many cities around the world, I can say if you're poor in the
US, there aren't many options to get out of it. It could be said for many
countries but US is the worlds largest economy. It's a solvable problem.

It's heart breaking to hear stories of people choosing to die than go to the
hospital because the bills will kill them.

------
ck2
When I was homeless and living out of my old car, my biggest problem was
police. Constantly hassling me. I have no idea how they would always find me,
I think people were calling in me sleeping in my car (this was before
smartphones).

They would always insist on searching the car for drugs and I basically had to
give in. Not that I ever had any but they would make a mess since all my
possessions were in the car and they could care less about tossing everything.

And yes, as many people say, getting out of the rut of being homeless is the
hardest thing, it starts to completely change the way you think and everything
becomes day-to-day survival.

------
thesimon
Wikipedia says you only get unemployment benefits for 6 months in the US, is
that correct? Seems quite harsh.

~~~
toomuchtodo
Its dependent on each state, but that's close enough to average, yes.

~~~
Tharkun
What happens after that?

~~~
vt240
At least in Washington State, unemployment payout is almost immediate, within
two weeks of losing your job. You can use the time before it runs out to apply
for other federal or state assistance programs. These may take longer and have
more complex qualifications.

~~~
dragonwriter
> You can use the time before it runs out to apply for other federal or state
> assistance programs.

Which if you are a non-disabled, employable (whether or not employed) adult
without dependents, in most parts of the US, are _extremely_ limited,
quantitatively and, often, temporally, as well.

------
lasermike026
Enough already. This society can provide Walden (by Henry David Thoreau) sized
accommodations for all that need it. There is no reason for anyone to be
homeless.

People need work and healthcare. These are rights not a privileges.

~~~
T2_t2
Except... some people choose to be homeless. There are two in this very thread
(the first comment, and here: sandiegohomelesssurvivalguide.blogspot.com).
It's unpleasant to say, but it's true.

To achieve a goal of 100% home-d, we'd need some REALLY draconian measures,
e.g. forcing people into homes they don't want and forcing people to take
medication against their will. I, personally, am not for measures like that,
for reasons this blog post lays out well:
[http://slatestarcodex.com/2016/04/27/book-review-albions-
see...](http://slatestarcodex.com/2016/04/27/book-review-albions-seed/)

However, the goal to reduce homelessness to 0% for the vast majority in the
set of people who WANT a home is one I can support - even better if that
desire extends beyond white countries.

~~~
lasermike026
We can start by providing homes and medicine to people who need and want
homes. We'll work on the hard cases later.

------
ilyaeck
It's great that so many people are driven to help this guy: donate money, etc.
But stories like this can/should to be leveraged to raise awareness and engage
the society to solve this problem. In a country that prides itself on
abundance and opportunities, homelessness is a disgrace to us all.

Startup folks - looking for a real problem to solve? How about a system to
help pool people like this out of misery?

------
known
This is why I unconditionally support
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basic_income_around_the_world](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basic_income_around_the_world)

------
wkoszek
I appreciate everyone taking the time to read this post.

------
chinathrow
There is a GoFundMe page set-up for this guy - no idea how legit it is. Can
anyone confirm?

[https://www.gofundme.com/NeilTortorella](https://www.gofundme.com/NeilTortorella)

Edit: He's also on Twitter.

[https://twitter.com/ntortorella](https://twitter.com/ntortorella)

~~~
mgkimsal
It's legit. They're working with Neil to get some GFM funds released ASAP. He
had a paypal set up , and I donated, but Paypal has frozen his funds for 30
days (nice).

------
peter303
There a gradation between intermittent homelessness and chronic homelessness.
Intermittent is not that rare - I even experienced a bit of that my self at
one time. Chronic may be due to more deep seated issues and hard to get out
of. It sounds like you have the drive to eventually escape it.

------
lowglow
I recently sold everything I owned and started living out of my converted
dodge caravan while I was prototyping what I wanted to build next. With an eye
on my burn rate, I lived as cheaply as possible. I can tell you without a
doubt that there is no natural system in place for homeless to get out of that
rut, and it looks and feels dehumanizing.

I wasn't completely broke but I couldn't keep affording rent as expensive as
it was. I was able to shower at a gym, and worked out of Tech Shop on what I
was trying to build. But it's hard -- like super hard to just be homeless. The
social stigma associated with the word alone is hard for people to get beyond.
I would often hear, "But you don't seem like the type to be homeless" and then
they would slowly just distance themselves from talking to me. Super weird.

I have been harassed by cops, you feel extremely transient and embarrassed
just to be alive at times. Sleeping in a van sucks too. Street noises keep you
up, cramped for space, etc. On the up side there is a contingent of tech
people that are doing the same thing, so I had the pleasure of meeting some
others like myself.

I've never taken up the opportunity of food, shelter, or clothing offered by
the city, because frankly I'm doing this on my own accord, so I can't speak to
how that part of the system helps people get back on their feet.

After this entire experience my heart breaks every time I see a fellow human
having to resort to sleeping in the cold, wet, outdoors with no shelter and
nothing but some cardboard and discarded newspapers to cover up with. I often
wonder how close I could have come to being completely broken by this
decision, and what coincidences led someone down this path. In the end it has
helped me understand that we must all care more for one another, no matter
what.

~~~
k-mcgrady
I'm not trying to be rude when asking this but why would you choose to become
homeless to prototype a business/product?? I've seen this come up several
times on HN over the last few years and every time it blows my mind,
especially when the person then goes on to talk about how difficult life is.

I'm guessing you're in tech as you're on HN - why not keep your day job and
work on your business from 7pm-3am every night. Save some money while you do
this and then leave your job when you can afford to?

It seems like a lot of tech folks have adopted the whole starving artist
approach to starting a business when it is entirely unnecessary. I mean, even
if you don't want to be an employee and want to focus on your product, move
somewhere inexpensive, work freelance a few hours a day to support yourself.
It just seems insane to me that anyone in this industry would choose to be
homeless when they really don't have to.

If a lot of people are making this choice voluntarily I'd say there's a major
problem in the industry and how people view the path to a successful business.

~~~
lowglow
For me I've noticed a huge difference in creativity and authenticity in my
products when I've devoted 100% of myself to it.

There is a major problem in the industry. There is no one path to a successful
business.

I find my time is more valuable than my comfort. To each their own.

~~~
k-mcgrady
I can understand your point but you're not just giving up comfort - you're
giving up something we all consider a basic necessity: shelter. I'm willing to
bet the end result of your work, whether you do it your way, or do it part
time, will be the same. I don't want to come off condescending but the
attitude (and it's not unique to you, I've seen many other people with a
similar attitude) seems like that of someone who has been brainwashed by the
SF/SV startup culture mythology.

~~~
joslin01
His Dodge Caravan is shelter, which is pretty fancy shelter if you were from a
poor village in Africa so I think he'll be alright. If he's not brainwashed by
pain = gain, then I think what he's doing is really cool.

~~~
xyzzy4
That's not true, because in a poor village in Africa you'd have family to look
after you and keep you well. You also won't have police harassing you all the
time. Lastly, it is easier to find a legal and free place to use the bathroom
in a poor African village.

------
smilingtom
People actually fall for this? He made a long, sob-story blog post about how
miserable he was being homeless and how he wishes he had more money so he
could afford more nutritious food.

And then people sent this guy over $40k? For no reason?

I need to get into the sob-story business.

