
Worried Delivery Drivers Are Eating Orders? You Have Good Reason - gilad
https://www.restaurantbusinessonline.com/operations/worried-delivery-drivers-are-eating-orders-you-have-good-reason
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Rainymood
>The drivers for third-party delivery services have deeper gripes, according
to the research. Their top complaint, shared by 60% of that community, is
getting a lousy tip or no gratuity at all.

So maybe ... they should be getting paid a fair wage then? If literally our
only human interaction is you handing over a box, what am I tipping for?

~~~
unimployed
Typically food delivery service you tip because the delivery person did their
best in the conditions to be quick, not leave the restaurant for extra unpaid
waiting, not leave the restaurant emptyhanded, handle the poorly packed food,
maintain it's temperature, find you through various layers of location that
may not be specifically noted (community, building, wing, level, find the
stairs/elevator, door), contact you because you were too lazy to give all the
necessary info, and the legwork/schlepping things you want to you at whatever
ridiculous time of day or night you were too lazy to go get it yourself.

You know, normal bs stuff you didn't want to deal with, and probably worth
more than the $3 or whatever they were paid for the trip that is supposed to
cover their expenses as well and some dead time between trips. Pretty sure
waitressing pays better after all is accounted for.

Additionally, getting tips on the app (instead of cash) provides almost no
benefit to drivers usually because of the way the apps/algorithms hand out
work. If you start making more in tips, you probably won't break over your
typical takehome for the day/week as it is averaged/washed out in your total
earnings (tips included) that are spread out so no one earns more money (even
if they deserve it for a job well done/hustle).

Finally, what you pay in surge pricing does not usually go to the driver. That
surcharge goes to the app, and sometimes the app has to pay the driver a surge
rate, but usually not (this is called arbitrage). Again the same averaging
applies and surge pays usually don't increase your overall takehome pay.

~~~
blub
"""did their best in the conditions to be quick, not leave the restaurant for
extra unpaid waiting, not leave the restaurant emptyhanded, handle the poorly
packed food, maintain it's temperature, find you through various layers of
location that may not be specifically noted (community, building, wing, level,
find the stairs/elevator, door), contact you because you were too lazy to give
all the necessary info, and the legwork/schlepping things you want to you at
whatever ridiculous time of day or night you were too lazy to go get it
yourself."""

That's the job definition and it's a crappy job. These companies are paying
their employees poorly and try to guilt customers into picking up their slack.

~~~
unimployed
Really not sure what your point is ethically or otherwise. Are you saying you
should not tip? Should you not tip a person for good service? Really hard to
fathom a reason you _need_ to use the service in the first place. I suppose
one could make the argument that if you request/use the service and don’t tip,
you are actively participating in perpetuating the crappy business model of
crappy businesses and crappy jobs that are setup to be unfavorable situations
for the workers while everyone else benefits at the workers expense. That
doesn’t sound very ethical because you simply don’t desire to feel some kind
of guilt if you don’t tip. How about choosing not to patronize a service and
system that is setup to take advantage of said workers? As I mentioned, it is
really difficult to fathom a situation you _need_ to use such a service like
food delivery or selecting a restaurant with wait staff. Just make other
arrangements and don’t patronize those services in the first place. If you do
find yourself using such a service, leave a tip (cash if an app) for a good
job that says I know you probably get screwed over a lot by the man/system,
but I’m more enlightened than others that feel entitled to choose to use the
service and not tip. It’s really that simple.

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geofft
You are conflating two senses of the word "should."

Should you throw out expired milk? In one sense, no, you shouldn't let it
expire. Use it faster, or buy less. In the other sense, yes, why leave it in
the fridge?

Nobody in this conversation is trying to get out of tipping people who aren't
making a living base wage. We all agree it's a moral duty. Our claim is that
wages should be higher so we shouldn't have to tip, eventually.

And, yes, I would in fact disagree with tipping a person for good service.
_Everyone_ deserves a living wage, good service or not. If they don't meet
your expectations, complain to their employer (chances are the cause of your
bad service is out of their hands), and _tip them anyway_ , every bit as
generously as someone who provided good service. This too is a moral
obligation.

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unimployed
Respectfully disagree with your assertion that no one here wants to get out of
tipping people "not making it." The "I don't tip" sentiment is just a
prevalent here as I have heard from drivers themselves that many people will
purposely choose not to tip for going the extra mile. Most people here, just
as in the real world are completely ignorant how the system actually works,
how much the delivery person really takes home, and who is getting the short
end of the stick between the worker, the restaurant, the customer, and any app
service.

You prefer to refer to moral obligations, I prefer to call it like it is.
Don't act like an ass and expect discounted food delivered at some poor
person's expense but your own. Also if you are a bad delivery driver (some
exist, yes) don't expect a tip if you fuck up badly or really sucked... don't
hit my car or my garage door (both have happened).

Put yourself in someone else's shoes and obey the golden rule. No need to
debate right and wrong, shoulds, oughts, and obligations, morals, duties,
ethics, values, and philosophy. Just don't be lazily uninformed, have some
empathy and conscientiousness, and treat other people the way you would want
to be treated.

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Konnstann
I don't get delivery anymore unless it's first-party, which is becoming more
and more rare as time goes on. I don't need to worry about tipping cash vs
credit card/app, people eating my food, delivery time, etc. If the restaurant
has an employee delivering food, it's a much better experience overall.

I've never had any issues with getting pizza delivered, but every single time
I use a third party service the food is late, cold, and has 12 different
service fees attached (as well as tip).

~~~
unimployed
At least one person in this thread is smart.

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kerng
Why not grab a bite when being paid next to nothing? Not too surprising, and
rather practical thinking - since this way one can safe on expenses for food.

Containers should be sealed - I always found it interesting that that isn't
the case anywhere.

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londons_explore
Hot food in a sealed container is a recipe for soggy steamy food...

You'd need to design sealed packaging with vents before it could really work
out.

~~~
siphon22
You just need a normal container with vents which are fairly common and some
tape that tears when the container is opened.

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unnouinceput
Quote: "They also readily cited service snafus. Thirty-four percent of
respondents said they’d experienced a driver refusing to leave his or her car
to hand over the meal. Twenty-nine percent said a driver refused to walk all
the way to their door for the delivery. Nearly 1 in 5 (17%) reported that a
driver had dropped the food at the door and left, without any interaction. "

And that's why I never pay in advance. Pay when delivered, to the delivering
person, receive the receipt and done. And on expensive orders I test what I
get before I pay. Usually this annoys the deliverer but I follow with :
"Either you get this back and I will complain about you to your boss or stick
around for 5 minutes and you get a tip". I don't mind tipping delivery
persons, and on food I do like 5%, which is very much in my country and I can
see their eyes lit. Sometime I get the same driver on my door several times in
a row, apparently tipping is rare hence they make sure they get my order.

~~~
vikingcaffiene
> either you get this back and I will complain about you to your boss or stick
> around for 5 minutes and get a tip

This is terrible and you should be ashamed of yourself. People who work for
tips are at the low end of the power dynamic here and you are exploiting it in
a very gross way. If you really do this, you’ve probably eaten some spit too.
Don’t mess with the people who handle your food.

~~~
unnouinceput
You're confusing my country with yours. On my country people are paid for
their work, they don't live from tips, hence why is rare here.

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JeremyBanks
Back when I used it, it was more surprising to get an Uber Eats order that
included everything I ordered than for items to be missing.

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wyld_one
Eating aka touching my food? off limits! period. Health & safety.

late I can stand - I have a microwave. I Order items that can be.

Do I need it? Most definitely - Especially when I hurt.

Gripes? impatient knocking. give me a min or two to get to the door. It helps
if I can hear them coming up my walk / GPS track helps but it is sometimes not
available or 5min old. see previous reason.

Deliver to the door. required. period. I have left feedback to the third party
delivery sites to add SMS messaging to the driver apps so they can beep me
when they arrive (and keep privacy).

I do quite hate having to tip before performance.

I have only had one non-delivery, and one missing items. On the missing item
delivery, saw the driver goto a separate location entirely (GPS) before they
dropped off my order. - out of about 60 orders.

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unimployed
Nothing would be surprising about this. Pretty standard practice since food
delivery was established. Though if an algorithm is washing out any benefit of
tips, I would not be surprised if said drivers might be helping themselves
more to compensate for the resulting march of lower wages. I suggest giving
tips in cash.

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thatfrenchguy
Or maybe just stop getting deliveries, the food is always worse, you siphon
money from the restaurant into the hands of big companies.

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who-knows95
Living in the UK i always wonder if i should tip the takeout driver.

~~~
newsgremlin
I don't tip, I think they should be paid a fair wage to begin with.

That said, if it's not directly from the eatery, I now try to skip
UberEats/Deliveroo. Saves me money and I don't contribute to the gig-economy
that is keeping down wages.

Tipping is subjective, and when people start to get an expectation of a tip
(automatically added on service charges included) then it's no longer
gratuity. We're doing the companies job for them.

~~~
unimployed
You realize restaurants that directly employ the delivery persons have most of
the same pitfalls as tipping using an app service right? If you don’t know how
to understand how restaurant service persons are typically paid, it is better
to not use the service at all than it is to not tip. You are still possibly
supporting a very shitty business model unless you know that those delivery
people are paid well without tips (most work on a tips basis for a big chunk
of their wages).

~~~
turtlebits
Except the app service is taking close to a 30% cut on your order..

~~~
unimployed
There was a complaint about feeling guilt-tripped into tipping to make up for
the poor wages. That problem doesn't really improve much at all under the "now
my delivery person doesn't work for an app." The tipping norms are still
mostly the same, where the tip still accounts for a large portion of their
takehome pay--basically everything above minimum wage, which is really low and
many use their own vehicles, gas, insurance, etc. Not tipping would still be
an issue... just as not tipping has been an issue 10, 20, 30, 40, 50, 60 years
ago (and possibly longer for food delivery).

The point that most people are missing is: if you don't agree with the
business model of expecting customers to pitch in extra for tips, you should
not patronize those restaurants and not tip. Just don't order from those
restaurants. The issue is not the lowly delivery person, but the business.
That does nothing to solve the issue except you are very likely lowering one
delivery person's paycheck. The business doesn't think gee, I should change
the way I pay people because they still get their delivery order revenue.

I believe the tipping system is shit mostly, but I'm not about to order a
delivery service that is completely voluntary (I don't need it to live) and
plan on not tipping the person that works for tips. I would tip them or just
don't order that delivery.

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pragmaticlurker
pay them a decent salary and things like this will never happen

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zeveb
> Worried delivery drivers are eating orders?

Well, I _wasn 't_ …

