

Logix: Adding macros to Python - charzom
http://livelogix.net/logix/index.html

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jey
Is it just me, or does it seem like everyone and their mother is inventing a
new programming language these days?

~~~
mdakin
They are and it's a direct result of CS's immaturity.

Python is close to something very, very good but not quite there. Logix in
"Base Logix" mode seems to fix some of Python's problems while retaining its
redeeming qualities.

If only a real Lisp would come along that had the leadership, library,
community and documentation of Python.

~~~
AF
> If only a real Lisp would come along that had the leadership, library,
> community and documentation of Python.

Someone was asking for that just the other day. I was thinking myself that it
would be pretty neat to write a Lisp dialect that compiled down to Python, and
therefore you could get access to all the Python libraries, a decent VM, and
also macros.

I've had trouble figuring out where to start, though. Would be a fun project.

~~~
pc
_"I was thinking myself that it would be pretty neat to write a Lisp dialect
that compiled down to Python"_

That would be an incredibly bad idea. The implementation of SBCL (and CMUCL,
upon which SBCL is based) is second to none--it has an optimizing compiler
(available at runtime) with code-generation backends for architectures from
x86 to MIPS; fantastic support for type inference, inline expansion, modular
arithmetic, unreachable code deletion, constant folding, control optimization,
generational garbage collection (doesn't python still use _reference
counts_?)... amongst a bunch of other stuff.

[http://shootout.alioth.debian.org/gp4/benchmark.php?test=all...](http://shootout.alioth.debian.org/gp4/benchmark.php?test=all&lang=all&calc=Calculate&xfullcpu=1&xmem=0&xloc=0&binarytrees=1&chameneos=0&message=0&fannkuch=1&fasta=1&knucleotide=1&mandelbrot=1&meteor=0&nbody=1&nsieve=1&nsievebits=1&partialsums=1&pidigits=1&recursive=1&regexdna=1&revcomp=1&spectralnorm=1&hello=0&sumcol=1)

Benchmarks are of course arbitrary, but no matter what way you dice things,
SBCL is vastly superior to Python's crappy VM. In the case of the link above,
over 10 times faster.

~~~
AF
As I mentioned in another post, I'm aware of the qualities of SBCL. I know it
is a much better VM. That's not what I am concerned about...what I like about
Python is its quantity and consistency of libraries and its overall
consistency period. Common Lisp just doesn't have that, and SBCL isn't perfect
- its full functionality doesn't work across all platforms.

> That would be an incredibly bad idea.

And I'm just wondering...even with SBCL, why would it be an 'incredibly bad
idea' to undertake such a project to convert a Lisp dialect to Python?

~~~
pc
_"I know it is a much better VM."_

SBCL isn't a VM. It's a Lisp implementation with a compiler that generates
native code.

Admittedly, many dynamic languages folks seem to find this concept odd. The
idea that {dynamic typing, garbage collection, your favourite feature from
ruby/python/perl/php} requires a VM unfortunately seems strongly ingrained.

------
AF
The GPL licensing would be an issue for some.

Edit: Unfortunately Logix seems to have been dead since 2005.

<http://common-lisp.net/project/python-on-lisp/>

~~~
omouse
How come?

~~~
AF
Well, if you wanted to ship a desktop application or such, you'd have to open
source your code. That doesn't work for all companies.

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euccastro
Since some of you are asking for the converse:

<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36178>

