
Stories and lessons from working with Jeff Bezos on the original Kindle - prostoalex
https://twitter.com/drose_999/status/1287944667414196225
======
soapdog
I've spent 16 years working for major niche publisher and am a bit addicted to
eReaders. Every time threads like this appear here I see lots of people that
have no idea that there is a whole world of devices outside Kindle and Amazon.
Here are some of the more interesting devices current out there in the market:

Pocketbook Color: yes, a color e-ink device for about $200:
[https://pocketbook.ch/en-ch/catalog/color/color-ch](https://pocketbook.ch/en-
ch/catalog/color/color-ch) You can see the Pocketbook color reading comics
here:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pkufktAQC_E&t=0s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pkufktAQC_E&t=0s)
which beautifully demonstrates its colour capabilities.

Onyx Boox Note 2: 10'' e-ink screen, Android 9.0, touch and wacom digitizer:
[https://onyxboox.com/boox_note2](https://onyxboox.com/boox_note2) It can be
used for school/uni/research. Its large screen and notetaking features pair
well with annotating fixed-layout formats such as PDFs.

I have some strong opinions about Amazon and its eBook business. I really like
their tech but their business practices are not aligned with what I want for
myself as an author. I have moved to Kobo for my personal eReader and am using
a Kobo Forma which is their answer to the Kindle Oasis. Even though the Oasis
hardware with its metal usage feels much more premium than the Forma with its
flexy plastic shell, the device is much more open than the Oasis and it is
easier for me to use it both as a reader and as an author. I live in the UK
and Kobo through its partner Overdrive -- which it owned up until not long ago
but I am not sure they still do -- allows me to borrow books from local
libraries. I have a couple library cards from different library consortiums
and that gives me a lot of catalogs to search and borrow from. Synchronizing
with Pocket is also a godsend, every time I see a nice article here on HN that
I think deserves more attention and care, I just send it to Pocket and read it
from the Kobo in a nice park.

Anyway, this is just some pointers to those here that never experienced ebooks
and ereaders outside Amazon. Yes, Amazon brings a lot of value to the table,
especially for the readers, books tend to be cheaper in Amazon but that is due
to its monopolistic practices and thug tactics. Kindle is not where the
innovation is happening, other devices have better hardware and better
software, other companies have healthier ecosystems.

~~~
chewxy
As much as the Boox is great, they have a lot of GPL issues. Plus the kernel
they are using is very very closed sourced. Sounds like FUD, but I am
generally quite wary of companies in China that do this

~~~
Icathian
Was just gearing up to type this. Onyx is a known GPL abuser and won't get a
cent from me unless and until they fix that. Chinese company or otherwise, the
FOSS community is clearly going to have to help support GPL when the courts
can't or won't.

------
arielm
I think you guys are missing the point of this Twitter thread.

Yes, the kindle itself is mediocre at best. Technically it’s got lot of
issues, and I personally still prefer a physical book over it any day. But...

The thread was about being inspired. You can be inspired even while working on
something that ultimately isn’t great. You can be inspired working with
someone who has the reputation of not being the best boss. You can be inspired
when you want to.

So while working on this mediocre device, which is pretty much the only way to
consume books digitally, this guy loved every minute.

To me, that’s the lesson here.

~~~
amelius
Yes, inspiration, that's how these so called technology leaders trick us
engineers in doing work for them, even, at times, to the detriment of society.

------
mdoms
I consider the Kindle one of the most underbaked products I have ever used,
and it staggers me that no one seems to care. Earlier iterations were truly
ground-breaking, so we gave them a break on the details. But we've been at
this for 12 years now, the product really should have matured more.

I'm not talking about the state of E-ink, but the usability of the Kindle
device itself. I current use a latest-gen Paperwhite but I've owned almost all
of them. The current one, in my opinion, is a huge step backwards in lots of
ways from earlier iterations. The touch screen is appalling and has no place
on an E-ink device. The software is incredibly bad. There's so much scope
there to surface useful information on the home screen but there's nothing of
value there - I can't even see more than a couple of books in progress, much
less find something I may want to read later. It's just astoundingly bad.

~~~
bluejellybean
The kindle could have been the best, no clue what happened but development
just seemed to completely stall. It's sad because the vast majority of
consumers don't even realize there are incredible advances being made to E-ink
displays, they never see it.

Last summer I was sitting in a library and had noticed the person across from
me was using an E-ink device I had never seen before. I showed the person my
kindle and asked if they like their device more or less than mine. I vividly
recall the woman's eyes light up with excitement as she handed me the device
and pen she was holding. Perfect written text on an e-ink device the size of a
paper notebook with what felt like an almost identical weight to my kindle.
Stunning! She told me how she had been using it exclusively for note taking
and the battery life was fairly comparable.

I wish I could recall the name of the device but I think it was something by
Sony. I couldn't help but be stunned though, Amazon is completely missing the
opportunity with these devices and I feel bad for the people who will continue
to purchase their obsolete products.

~~~
moomin
Same is true of goodreads. Amazon have their market lock now, it’s the IE6
phase now. (Except it was way easier to get people off IE6 than it will be to
get them off the platform with all of their books.)

~~~
natrik
I use goodreads as well and find the UI/UX very old fashioned. The lag is
astonishing as well. What are some issues you have with it?

~~~
efreak
The mobile app is horrible. It's a webview or something, and works like total
crap on old devices. If you open a notification for a group discussion post,
it tells you what the title of the discussion is--but not what group it's for.

As much as possible, I find myself interacting with Goodreads through calibre
plugins; I've got a library with zero actual book files that contains an entry
for every book in my library, and I mainly use that to browse my collection.
Since syncing that list takes so long, my actual calibre libraries are also
synced to Goodreads, as that's where I actually make my changes.

With Library thing's recent removal of library limits, I'm thinking more and
more about abandoning Goodreads--except I don't know if there's a calibre
plugin for PT, and I've spent so much time adding and updating book records
for items in my goodreads library, which would have to be redone for LT.

~~~
marvindanig
FYI the mobile opera browser uses the webview and is superfast, but the Kindle
app is all native code.

------
thaumasiotes
> We added a keyboard for search (this was a mistake, but it was worth a try).

I have a keyboard kindle. The keyboard is not a mistake; it's great. I wish
other kindles had kept it.

(The keyboard does _feature_ a glaring mistake -- it doesn't have any number
keys, despite the fact that its primary use is to type numbers. But the
solution is to have number keys, not to get rid of the keyboard.)

~~~
toast0
I've got a kindle keyboard too. Very nice to have buttons to type with for
search. What numbers are you entering, I can't recall doing that very often?

~~~
thaumasiotes
Location numbers, for "go to location".

------
quickthrower2
For me the ability to get the free cellular anywhere in the world was the
sizzle. I remember downloading a book in Tunisia in 2010!

------
alfiedotwtf
Survivorship Bias... please take this tweetstorm with a grain of salt unless
you have backing the size of Amazon’s income to play with

~~~
nojito
Amazon was not that big back in 2003.

[https://www.nytimes.com/2004/01/28/business/technology-
amazo...](https://www.nytimes.com/2004/01/28/business/technology-amazon-
reports-first-full-year-profit.html)

------
cblconfederate
I liked the keyboard kindle, it was the best. Touch really sucks and it's
makes one constantly anxious of not touching the wrong spot on the screen.
Having dedicated buttons for actions makes it more predictable

------
jariel
"Don't believe the institutional no" "Just because someone else has failed
does not mean it's not possible"

So here's the part where we ignore basically all legitimate advice and the
experience of others? Then are we using judgement, or hubris? If there is some
artefact of new technology that changes the nature of the opportunity, then
that's not so much 'ignoring' advice, it's contextualising it i.e. 'well it
failed before, but ink screens are now cheap'. Etc.

------
achow
> _3 / Cannibalize yourself. Steve Kessel was running Amazon’s media business
> in 2004 (books/music/DVD’s). Books alone generated more than 50% of Amazon’s
> cash flow. Jeff fired Steve from his job and reassigned him to build Kindle.
> Steve’s new mission: destroy his old business._

\- In 2015 Amazon's free cash flow was $529M [1], printed books contributed
~$250M to that

\- In 2019 total ebook revenue in the United States $983.3M (overall and not
only Amazon's). [2]

Was Kindle 'distraction' worth it? I love Kindle and eBooks but did Bezos
really make the right call when Amazon was just about beginning to recover
from the severe dotcom crash?

[1][https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/AMZN/amazon/free-c...](https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/AMZN/amazon/free-
cash-flow)

[2][https://goodereader.com/blog/digital-publishing/ebook-
revenu...](https://goodereader.com/blog/digital-publishing/ebook-revenue-
fell-4-2-in-2019-and-generated-983-3-million)

~~~
chillfox
It’s better to cannibalize your own business than wait for someone else to do
it.

~~~
switch11
yes

there is one other factor that people are missing

there are over a million self published authors. They are all sending people
to Amazon to buy books

Those book pages have ads for other stuff

The amount of money coming from that is not insignificant

To give you some idea. I know at least 4 people who were making $50,000+ a
month from affiliate sales

Of course, most of them got screwed like all other affiliates

However, 90% of the money was from stuff other than what they were sending
people to Amazon for

 __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __*

1 million authors, all desperate to get their books to readers, spending money
on Facebook Ads and newspapers and radios

sending readers to Amazon

------
grey-area
The touch screen could be improved, but probably hasn't been because it would
raise the cost and it is good enough. Most other things about the kindle are
pretty good, including wireless syncing the early use of an e-ink screen, both
of which were contrarian and ahead of their time.

The software is just good enough, like most Amazon software, but it does stay
out of the way if you stick to the happy path. I don't really want it to
change, I turn of most of the 'features' they've added over the years, like
highlighting or notes. I want it to do one thing well - present black text on
a white page, and it has done that well for years.

For me the value of a kindle is that it is a cheap single-function device
which performs that function very well. If I want to read, I read on the
kindle by choice, because the screen is a vastly better experience for reading
than an LCD. If it breaks, I buy another, because it's much better than any
other device (including paper) for reading.

------
Causality1
The Kindle 3 is still my preferred eReader. Dropping page turn buttons was
good marketing but horrible for usability.

------
quink
I agree. The original Kindle was revolutionary. But it's been completely
stagnant since then.

The level of innovation to drive forward doesn't have to be that large. After
a lot of time thinking about the problem, the sweet spot for me would be an
e-reader that combines:

* CBR/CBZ/EPUB support

* MicroSD slot for expandable storage (or 32 GB+)

* Yellow backlight

* Robust enough software

* No Android or web browser to speak of (I want a focused device without distractions) (but maybe Pocket Casts built in, with a 3.5mm port or Bluetooth)

* 300 dpi

* 7.8 inch display

And a price point of US$150. Which seems to be impossible with a 7.8 inch
e-ink display. If someone comes out with this device I will buy it instantly.
The Kobo Clara HD comes seriously close and I love mine but it is on the verge
of no longer being on sale.

I think I will just have to wait for the Android e-ink tablets to come down in
price and deal with an absolutely ancient version of Android, which they all
seem to have.

~~~
megablast
It has a web browser. It’s just so slow.

~~~
quink
I know, I love it. It's there, but it's so bad that it's not keeping me from
the eBooks for any appreciable amount of time, the actual intent behind the
device.

------
loriverkutya
The removal of the physical page turning button rendered one handed usage
impossible if you want hold the kindle in your left hand. It is massively
annoys me.

~~~
c1c2c3
You only need to be able to reach about a 1/3 of the way over the screen to
tap the part that changes to the next page. Takes a little time to get used to
but I read left handed all the time.

------
giomasce
I feel a lot of survivor bias here.

~~~
pizza234
Spot-on. While there is definitely a component of genius in Bezos'
personality, for this exact reason, most of the - let's call them -
guidelines, won't work for other people/projects.

Point in case:

> 7/ Set unrealistic expectations

This is a recipe for a disaster for the vast majority of the projects. One
field that pops into my mind is videogames development - this attitude is one
of the greatest and well-known problems.

------
TeMPOraL
The prototype design of Kindle has an eeirly Star Trek feel to it:

[https://twitter.com/abcerra/status/1288076705634988035](https://twitter.com/abcerra/status/1288076705634988035)

In particular, the shape and labels of those buttons on the sides make it look
like LCARS interface with physical parts.

~~~
morelisp
That's the first consumer model, not a prototype.

The keyboard might have been a mistake but the jogwheel was the best possible
input device for the two core tasks of menu navigation and text highlighting.
I miss it a lot.

------
biddlesby
I find the tone of this Twitter post exhausting. He talks as if his work
revolutionized the world and Jeff Bezos is a god among men.

They made a fairly useful gadget that sold well. Seriously, come back down to
earth.

~~~
chadcmulligan
> They made a fairly useful gadget that sold well.

Perhaps a little bit breathless, but it was an amazing thing at the time. I
remember buying one (a DX) from Malyasia, (because they weren't available in
Australia), through a reseller (some company who bought stacks of them and
resold them around the world). It was a talking point for a long time - people
would ask me about it on the train etc. I still have it and still marvel at
its amazingness occasionally.

Edit: remembered some more - laptops at the time had awful battery life, this
thing could carry thousands of books and last weeks from one charge. I could
download any book (mostly) instantly, before that I'd order books from the
states, they'd take weeks to arrive and cost a fortune. It was an amazing
thing.

~~~
esperent
Somebody would have created an ebook if not for Amazon. They were just well
placed to do so, but they didn't invent any of the technology or concepts.

Much like Apple and touchscreen phones, or Tesla and electric cars. The might
have advanced the tech by a couple of years but they were profiting off the
inevitable.

~~~
yomly
IIRC from the Everything Store there was some conjecture that the Amazon "read
the first chapter" feature paved the way to mass digitalization of books. So
they were well positioned to launch with decent selection and ramp up faster
than if they relied on the pace of distributors. If any amazonians from around
that time could confirm that would be cool...

There is art in execution too.

------
cosmodisk
I've read quite a few posts on the thread and all I got is "Jeff did this,Jeff
did that.Jeff is amazing,Jeff is cool. Jeff is brilliant.Jeff,Jeff,Jeff..". Of
course he was pushy and demanding to get the results,but come on,give some
credit to others too.

------
winter_blue
One key takeaway I have from this story is that the core skill of making a
business and making it work – is critical and different from the “business
idea” itself. It means that if you are a good “businessman”, you can start a
new business in a new field, and possibly succeed. That’s why we see so much
“pivoting” and forays into new ideas. Here Bezos and Amazon jumped into two
completely new things they hadn’t done before: the Kindle, and AWS. And they
succeeded! You don’t have to stick with what’s familiar, easy, or what’s your
“area of expertise”. You can jump into new stuff, new project, completely new
& innovative endeavors, and very well possibly succeed!! So HAVE HOPE!!!
That’s my takeaway from this!

------
jeffreyrogers
> He insisted on syncing over cellular, and he didn’t want to charge the
> customer for data. We told him it couldn’t be done, he did it anyway.

This is really interesting. I wish he went into more detail about this.

~~~
nevir
Some fun tidbits:

Every Kindle had a unique phone number.

By the time your Kindle shipped to you, it knew who its owner was, and had
already logged you in and downloaded all your books.

Any time we wanted to push updates to them, we'd SMS it (IIRC) and the Kindle
would connect back to figure out what needs doing.

Original Kindles had an (awful) web browser (and didn't charge for data). It
was not bad at Google maps

~~~
xyzzy_plugh
I recall shaving one or two bytes off one of the cell messages shaved
something like $7MM off the monthly AT&T bill...

------
ggm
The basic stuffups in the GUI are astronomical. Try author search. Sorry.. we
just do what we do. Yes you typed john le Carre but it suits us better to show
you authors LIKE John le Carre.

Whyyyyy

------
wwarner
The story is about a creative response to Apple's decimation of the music
industry's business model. It signalled the time had come to bring digital
distribution to books, and Bezos was one of the few in the business to realize
that. I'll agree that the hardware never satisfied, but while I'm sure it's
been a disappointment to many, it certainly has not stopped the trend nor has
it hurt the kindle project much.

------
ignoramous
> _Jeff fired Steve from his job and reassigned him to build Kindle. Steve’s
> new mission: destroy his old business._

Fun fact for trivia night: Steve, after he returned from his sabbatical, would
go on to head the _Amazon Go_ division. Some amazingly diverse set of
leadership roles over the years for him. His _Kindle_ portfolio was handed
over to Dave Limp, an ex-Apple executive.

------
NewEntryHN
\- Ebooks are the most important invention of the XXIth century.

\- Jeff Bezos is a God.

\- A bunch of weird corporate tactics worked for us at the time so they are
lessons on how to make a successful product.

~~~
dm319
Yes, there's definitely a bit of survivorship bias going on here. The lesson
isn't to compete with yourself, or ignore all of your advisors, or trying to
pivot your business model after a crash etc etc. There are plenty of
businesses who have failed doing all these things. I suspect that Jeff Bezos
had a vision, and these are more side effects rather than the reason for its
success.

~~~
switch11
Some of the stuff they say are completely inaccurate

He claims Kindle as the first ereader to use an eInk screen

Sony ereader launched a YEAR before and had an eink screen

Also this guy seems to be a worshipper rather than an unbiased or somewhat
objective observer

------
tomerbd
Which is the best for programming/math reading and for sketching notes while
reading them?

~~~
person_of_color
Remarkable

------
KKKKkkkk1
It's not clear from the thread what was Rose's role in developing the Kindle.
Is this common knowledge?

I tried to look him up and it looks like he's running a VC fund and is a
former VP of mergers and acquisitions at Facebook.

------
tryauuum
I loved how older paperwhite wasn't flat. I mean the border was risen-up.

Modern paperwhite and oasis have their screen hidden behind layer of think
transparent plastic. You don't feel like your are staring at actual paper
anymore

------
xyzzy_plugh
Fun fact: the original Amazon Echo has a significant amount of Kindle software
in it, developed by the same branch. The later releases switched to Android
for no particularly good reason...

~~~
nevir
I'm so sorry :(

------
saos
A man with a vision. Kudos to him

------
iamAtom
Based on radiocarbon dating researchers say GoodReads is built by Ancient
Aliens.

~~~
switch11
anyone who has used Good Reads loves your comment

------
gigatexal
the bit about 100k books at launch at 9.99 could have been dumping no? He
makes no mention of the publishers coming to an agreement on such a low price.
Usually e-books like that are 19.99 iirc.

~~~
morelisp
At the time, "e-books like that" did not exist.

The publishers were not happy, sued in combination wither other tech
companies, and introduced agency pricing as a response. A story with no heroes
or winners.

------
dutch3000
if only our system incentivized the geniuses to become obsessed with making
the world a better place...

------
rawoke083600
Just give me an affordable 8 inch !

~~~
rawoke083600
So tired, of 6inch everywhere

------
asah
Wait, kindle is a piece of hardware and not just an app?! /s

~~~
xtracto
I had a prs-900 (sony daily reader). I remember at the time comparing it with
the Amazon alternative and the Sony one being way better in both how open it
was, features and speed.

------
LeicaLatte
Bad storytelling.

------
braggaditchio
what's the story with bezos' helicopter crash?

~~~
xtracto
www.businessinsider.com/jeff-bezos-blue-origin-helicopter-crash-2018-3

~~~
bouncycastle
The photo of the wreck [http://www.thesmokinggun.com/file/amazons-jeff-bezos-
helicop...](http://www.thesmokinggun.com/file/amazons-jeff-bezos-helicopter-
crash)

