
The Japanese Urban Zoning System - Osiris30
http://marginalrevolution.com/marginalrevolution/2016/08/the-japanese-zoning-system.html
======
codyb
Very neat. I love reading about cities and urban planning. I have "The Death
and Life of American Cities" by Jane Jacobs laying around which I need to read
and I read another book about architecture here in New York City and how it
has evolved over time in response to things such as fires and 9/11\. Really
really very interesting stuff.

This was a great post. Mixed use cities are generally much more desirable in
my eyes. The American suburbs are a blight on the land which make our nation
so much more carcentric than it needs to be spreading the population out and
reducing the efficacy of our now underfunded and sprawled out public
transportation system.

Of course it's not a shocker that such a system evolved in a nation with such
a staggering amount of land available to it's citizens who live and have lived
in a nation with huge amounts of racial segregation.

The idea of a set of national guidelines makes sense from an engineering
perspective because small towns can't afford engineers often (or may not even
think to seek out their expertise) and in the end you have a group of
individuals with no qualifications determining the fate of their town with
arbitrarily decided rules.

And rating things by their nuisance (traffic plus noise) levels is a really
neat way to quantify whether a building should exist in a given area.

Awesome! Lots of new things to entertain the mind.

~~~
wott
> The American suburbs are a blight on the land which make our nation so much
> more carcentric than it needs to be spreading the population out and
> reducing the efficacy of our now underfunded and sprawled out public
> transportation system. Of course it's not a shocker that such a system
> evolved in a nation with such a staggering amount of land available to it's
> citizens.

Unfortunately the same system was later exported to other countries and
adopted by their citizens, although these countries did not have the same
'free' space. As a consequence the drawbacks of the system are even more
perceptible (and the individual benefits are lesser) in these places.

~~~
spraak
E.g. where? I'm curious

------
arciini
The blog that this article references, Urban Kchoze, is the best collection of
urban policy analysis I've ever found. The author uses great diagrams and
examples to really effectively illustrate his points.

Here are a few really good articles:

\- Why we should tax property by street frontage:
[http://urbankchoze.blogspot.ca/2016/07/city-taxes-as-
urban-g...](http://urbankchoze.blogspot.ca/2016/07/city-taxes-as-urban-growth-
policies.html)

\- Advantages of one-way streets: [http://urbankchoze.blogspot.ca/2016/03/the-
case-of-one-way-s...](http://urbankchoze.blogspot.ca/2016/03/the-case-of-one-
way-streets.html)

\- Impacts of commercial density:
[http://urbankchoze.blogspot.ca/2015/11/commercial-or-
residen...](http://urbankchoze.blogspot.ca/2015/11/commercial-or-residential-
density-which.html)

Strongly recommend it! It's my favourite urbanism blog, although there aren't
usually that many posts thanks to the long length and high quality

------
Animats
Japan's zoning system was modified when, in 1985, there was a crackdown on
love hotels. Revolving beds, mirrors larger than 1 square meter, vending
machines selling sexually exciting products, hallways which lead directly from
a private parking space to a room, lack of a restaurant, or lobbies less than
30 square meters make it a love hotel. Love hotels are subject to additional
zoning restrictions.

Amusingly, one effect was that love hotels put in restaurants to comply, and,
to the surprise of management, their unashamed customers starting ordering
meals. So more regular hotels put in rooms with sexy features, and love hotels
started getting guests who just wanted a place to sleep. The distinction
between the two has gradually disappeared.

~~~
billmalarky
When I stayed in Japan for a few weeks last year I stayed in a love hotel for
a few nights. It was the best deal around Kyoto by far, and I was blown away
with the amenities. It felt more like a luxury hotel than seedy.

One funny aspect is when you order room service, they give it to you via a
little privacy sliding door. I assume so couples can order food after having
already "slipped into something more comfortable."

~~~
rangibaby
Could you leave your room freely? AFAIK that's the only disadvantage of love
hotels compared to hotels.

~~~
sdrothrock
I've never been to one where you couldn't.

~~~
rangibaby
Wow! In what areas? At the ones I have stayed in you get locked in until you
check out.

~~~
sdrothrock
Saitama and Gunma, mostly. I think one in Tochigi.

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nxc18
If this is an interesting topic, check out the book, Seeing Like a State. It
has really great coverage of the history of things like urban planning, naming
of people, mapping, etc.

The standout thesis of the book is that from a birds-eye-view perspective
(what the state sees), cities that were designed to meet the local needs of
people look chaotic, but the ideal clean order from that perspective ignores
needs of people.

For example, a neighborhood with just houses connected by a highway to a
commercial district looks clean and organized on a map. Only with boots on the
ground do you see what a disaster that is compared to the model of having
neighborhoods and boroughs with all of the community resources (housing, work,
food, shopping, parks, schools, etc.) they need.

~~~
snaky
> Alex Tabarrok discusses the case of India’s private city, and the challenges
> — and promise — of a private model of urbanization.

[http://tomwoods.com/podcast/ep-371-private-
cities/](http://tomwoods.com/podcast/ep-371-private-cities/)

------
irq11
Japan's property values haven't risen in the last 20 years because their
economy is in the toilet, they're struggling with deflation, and their
population is declining.

When the economy was growing like crazy in the 80s, Japan had the most
expensive real estate on the planet, and the same zoning they do now.

~~~
ceras
> When the economy was growing like crazy in the 80s, Japan had the most
> expensive real estate on the planet, and the same zoning they do now.

Are you sure? From Financial Times[1]:

> During the 1980s Japan had a spectacular speculative house price bubble that
> was even worse than in London and New York during the same period, and
> various Japanese economists were decrying the planning and zoning systems as
> having been a major contributor by reducing supply,” says André Sorensen, a
> geography professor at the University of Toronto, who has written
> extensively on planning in Japan.

...

> "To help the economy recover from the bubble, the country eased regulation
> on urban development," says Ichikawa. "If it hadn’t been for the bubble,
> Tokyo would be in the same situation as London or San Francisco."

[1]
[http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/023562e2-54a6-11e6-befd-2fc0c26b3c...](http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/023562e2-54a6-11e6-befd-2fc0c26b3c60.html)

* * *

Edited to add: To your first point, if you restrict your consideration of
Japan to Tokyo, you see the largest metropolis in the world with a growing
population -- other cities in Japan are shrinking, but Tokyo is growing, yet
Tokyo prices are steady. I'm not sure about its economic situation, but I
wouldn't be surprised if Tokyo's economy was stronger than other parts of
Japan. Regardless, it's important information that Tokyo alone is building
more housing than the entirety of California (source: same FT article).

~~~
twblalock
> I wouldn't be surprised if Tokyo's economy was stronger than other parts of
> Japan

The GDP of the Tokyo metropolitan area is about 1/3 of Japan's total GDP. The
country is weighted toward Tokyo like the UK is weighted toward London.

In the US, the center of finance is New York, the center of entertainment is
LA, and the center of tech is Silicon Valley. In Japan, Tokyo is the center of
all of those things, as London is in the UK.

~~~
rangibaby
and Nagoya is Japan's Detroit if Detroit hadn't become _Detroit_.

~~~
twblalock
Sort of. Toyota and its suppliers are there, but Honda, Nissan, and Mazda are
not. Detroit was unique because it was the home of every major American car
company: Ford, GM, Dodge/Chrysler, and AMC.

------
smcl
"…[The] great rigidity in allowed uses per zone in North American zoning means
that urban planing departments must really micromanage to the smallest detail
everything to have a decent city. Because if they forget to zone for enough
commercial zones or schools, people can’t simply build what is lacking, they’d
need to change the zoning, and therefore confront the NIMBYs"

Oh my word - when playing the SimCity series as a kid I always thought "well,
this is a kinda _weird_ way to work but I guess it's just a game..." when
laying out the little squares of green, blue or yellow (SC2K colors iirc,
can't remember the others!). I had no idea that this was a relatively accurate
abstraction for real-life city planning in the USA.

~~~
vertex-four
Whereas in games like Pharaoh, they were designed so that you had to have many
things within a certain (close, but not _too_ close) distance of your
population in order for your people to be happy and avoid crime, fires, etc.
Zoning is non-existent. This is much closer to how planning permission works
in my country - there's no specific zoning (though you're unlikely to get
planning permission to put an industrial estate in a city centre), and people
enjoy having shops etc nearby.

~~~
m_mueller
Yep, Japan is much more like Pharaoh than Sim City. If is probably my favorite
aspect of living here. Living on the periphery of Tokyo we pay 900$/m for a
2.5 room and have more train stations, restaurants, shops, hospitals and parks
nearby than any other residential place I've seen outside of Japan.

------
pessimizer
I'm not sure what people are getting out of this post. It's made up entirely
of quotes from a very good blogpost
[[https://urbankchoze.blogspot.ca/2014/04/japanese-
zoning.html](https://urbankchoze.blogspot.ca/2014/04/japanese-zoning.html)]
about Japanese zoning (that was also posted here years ago) wrapped in
completely unsupported declarations of that system's superiority, followed
with some odious racial conspiracy theories in the comments, which are
dominated by a pretty well-known white supremacist.

This link isn't value added over the original post, it's value subtracted.

~~~
blueline
I was surprised to see my neighborhood mentioned as an example that racial
discrimination in housing is a _good_ thing

not surprising to hear that person is a white supremacist

------
saosebastiao
I'm glad Tyler is talking about this, as he tends to be the leading edge of a
lot of policy discussion around newish ideas, and the Japanese zoning system
is a marvel of both efficacy and simplicity.

While the Japanese system is implemented and managed on the national level, I
can imagine this being more effective on a more granular level, while still
being much higher up than the city level as to avoid the political
repercussions of local special interest landowners.

~~~
adrianratnapala
I'd guess the state level is natural -- but then again some states in the US
(and all states in Australia) are dominated by one big city, so the state
government can also be captured by NIMBYs.

Generally I dislike the way top-level governments are becoming the only game
in town. But the point is to have multiple levels of government checking each
other. When it comes to zoning: its the locals who are the "bad" guys.

~~~
twelvechairs
The problem is local governments are awful at planning for growth, especially
in nice areas (where people actually want to live) as they tend towards no
change.

I think the best solution is still planning at a local level but there should
be approppriate rules from a higher level to ensure it works - usually
including a growth target which must be planned for and minimum densities
(allowing for some exceptions) for different kidnds of locations (greenfield,
around train stations, etc)

On your other point - in my experience states tend towards the opposite -
being developer lobby driven much more than nimby

------
masklinn
> in the US zones tend to be exclusive but in Japan the zones limit the
> maximum nuisance in a zone

It's not just japan, I'm not sure the US-style exclusive euclidian zoning is
practiced anywhere else, if only for historical reasons: in most countries
cities grew organically and mixed-use.

~~~
makomk
The UK is mixed-use pretty much everywhere, but you still need planning
permission to change a property from residential to commercial or industrial
use, or to change it between different classifications of each of those uses.
From what I can tell there are legal and possibly even constitutional issues
with handling planning restrictions in this way in the US. Basically, it seems
the US ended up with rigid zoning restrictions because it's impossible to have
the finer-grained restrictions that other countries do.

~~~
masklinn
> you still need planning permission to change a property from residential to
> commercial or industrial use, or to change it between different
> classifications of each of those uses.

I'm not saying other countries don't have forms of zoning (japan, the subject
of the article, certainly does) I'm saying few to no countries have as
exclusive and tight zoning as the US.

------
contingencies
It's not untrue to say that Japanese society as a whole does have a culture of
Confucian orthodoxy/heirarchy, ie. people do not 'rock the boat' or
'aggressively agitate for change'. This means that tradition survives well and
a cultural premium on internalizing discontent and preserving outward peace
rules the land. Urban zoning is probably one of the areas most affected by
this cultural property. That said, in my mind even traditional Japanese urban
architecture is pretty well optimized for high density, itself largely based
on Tang Dynasty Chang'an in China, arguably one of the greatest periods of
multicultural tolerance and philosophical debate in the history of the planet
(terminus of the Silk Road, vast exchange of ideas).

~~~
twblalock
I'm not sure where to begin with this essentialist exaggeration.

First of all, the history of Japanese agitation for change, especially in
Tokyo, has been notable. Consider the massive protest movements of the 1960s
and 1970s over security and labor unoin issues, and the protests against the
establishment of Narita airport in the 1970s. Consider also Goto Shinpei's
ambitious rebuilding of Tokyo, which had been destroyed in the 1923 Kanto
earthquake, with a roads, parks, and a transit system inspired by the great
cities of Europe and the US, not by Japanese tradition.

Japan's current zoning system is a recent innovation, borne of the necessity
of spurring growth during their long recession. The system it replaced was
developed during the 20th century. You would have to look back before the late
19th century to find more traditional systems. This, along with the history of
protest movements and the radical redesign of Tokyo in the 1920s, disproves
the idea that Confucian orthodoxy and survival of tradition have much to do
with Japan's zoning system.

Furthermore, traditional Japanese urban buildings are not a whole lot like
traditional Chinese urban buildings in their exterior appearance nor their
interior layout.

~~~
contingencies
Not sure why you label generalisation essentialism? Your opinion appears
biased in terms of: (a) 20th century; (b) Tokyo.

IMHO, rebuilding can hardly be classed as agitating for change against
tradition. Furthermore, while protest movements have of course existed I would
argue that they are few and relatively late to develop (massive discontent
precedes) relative to other societies. It is a fact that many of Japan's
oldest buildings are direct derivations of Tang Dynasty architecture, and in
some cases (Kyoto) city layouts (urban plans) were directly copied from China.

~~~
twblalock
> Not sure why you label generalisation essentialism?

Because you generalize by deploying tired old tropes about Confucianism and a
conformist, "harmonious" society, which were never really true.

> Your opinion appears biased in terms of: (a) 20th century; (b) Tokyo.

Well, considering that we are discussing Tokyo in the late 20th and early 21st
centuries in the context of the article posted here, that seems appropriate.

> Furthermore, while protest movements have of course existed I would argue
> that they are few and relatively late to develop (massive discontent
> precedes) relative to other societies.

Demonstrably untrue. During the late 19th century, and most of the 20th
century, protests were a significant aspect of Japanese society -- more so
than in many western countries.

> It is a fact that many of Japan's oldest buildings are direct derivations of
> Tang Dynasty architecture, and in some cases (Kyoto) city layouts (urban
> plans) were directly copied from China.

If you were talking about city street layouts instead of architecture, you
should have written about city street layouts instead of writing about
architecture. In any case, Kyoto is unique within Japan. Within Kyoto, the
urban architecture is not really Chinese, even if the street layout used to
be. The primary influence of Chinese architecture in Japan can be seen in
temples, not in urban buildings.

~~~
contingencies
_which were never really true_

{{citation-needed}}

 _we are discussing Tokyo in the late 20th and early 21st centuries_

OK, scope difference. 'The Japanese Urban Zoning System' != modern Tokyo.

 _Demonstrably untrue. During the late 19th century, and most of the 20th
century, protests were a significant aspect of Japanese society -- more so
than in many western countries._

I would argue that extreme temporary conditions (war, forced
modernization/industrialization) are a skewed sample of a society's normal
behavior.

 _If you were talking about..._

The title is 'The Japanese Urban Zoning System': city street layouts are
closer to this than architecture.

 _Within Kyoto, the urban architecture is not really Chinese, even if the
street layout used to be._

I would argue that modern architecture in Kyoto is demonstrably descended from
Tang Dynasty woodworking techniques, courtyard layouts and Chang'an-style high
density urban layout. The street layout is still based on Chang'an.

------
Cyph0n
I read the original article when it was posted to HN a while back. It's a bit
too detailed, but provides a very comprehensive analysis of why the Japanese
system just works.

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atemerev
SimCity is to blame. It cemented the current system. :)

~~~
acbabis
I don't know why this was downvoted so much. This is actually a pretty clever
summary of the article. Have an upvote.

------
ubernostrum
Which one is the zone for people descended from feudal-era outcast groups?
Which one is the zone for people descended from survivors of the atomic
bombings?

~~~
ubernostrum
(by way of explanation, both of those groups are subjected to _heavy_
discrimination in Japan, in a similar way to black people in the US -- any
description of zoning which doesn't include socially-implicit "zones" like
these is inadequate)

