
GoDaddy pulls out of China too - jeffmould
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/03/24/AR2010032401543.html?hpid=topnews
======
siculars
The key takeaway from the article for me was not only that China is requiring
enhanced registrant tracking for new domains going forward but also for
_previously_ registered domains. Not only is this a privacy issue but it is
also an administrative nightmare for GoDaddy.

So how will China manage this? Match a list of .cn domains registered via
GoDaddy? I can only imagine the rats nest of DENY statements all over their
infrastructure. The next step is for China to impose these rules as a
prerequisite for registries when they renew their contracts to dole out .cn
domains.

Question on a tangential thread, would anybody here even use a DNS server
based in China? Hardcode opendns.com DNS addresses (208.67.222.222,
208.67.220.220) ftw. Can you even get port 53 outbound to a non China
controlled DNS server from within China?

I've said it before and I'll say it again, I'm very happy to see companies
take a stand against China and their policies.

~~~
rmorrison
China doesn't shy away from these types of administrative nightmares, here is
one from a few years ago that I stumbled on the other day, which must be an
mess for them to enforce:

 _In one of history's more absurd acts of totalitarianism, China has banned
Buddhist monks in Tibet from reincarnating without government permission.
According to a statement issued by the State Administration for Religious
Affairs, the law, which goes into effect next month and strictly stipulates
the procedures by which one is to reincarnate, is "an important move to
institutionalize management of reincarnation."_

(<http://boingboing.net/2007/08/22/china-to-tibetan-bud.html>)

~~~
anamax
It's not completely absurd. Reincarnation is how some Buddhist traditions are
passed down from generation to generation.

China now has official control over such transfers.

Whether that works out as de facto control is another issue, but they're
trying.

------
darien
Months back I registered a .cn domain using godaddy. 2 days later Godaddy sent
me an email with a refund apologizing that they were unable to register. I
imagine that they were growing weary of that.

------
tkiley
My understanding is that China's upper leadership is largely intelligent and
engineering-oriented. The fact that the Chinese government thinks this type of
policy is a good idea makes me wonder if they know something I don't.

Do they really expect to be able to keep a lid on political speech within
their country long-term? (From a practical perspective, won't this just drive
.cn domainholders to switch to .com?)

~~~
rms
>Do they really expect to be able to keep a lid on political speech within
their country long-term?

No, but they expect to be able to do it in the short term. I think at this
point they are just hoping to delay a more open internet for five or seven
years -- much beyond that begins to seem laughable.

I suspect the leaders of China understand better than we do just how tenuous
their control is, and I think their fear of free political speech is
legitimate. A protest in Tiananmen Square once almost brought down the
government, and I don't think the CCP could withstand another protest of that
magnitude, though of course less-lethal crowd dispersal technology has come a
long way.

~~~
CWuestefeld
This is going to sound tin-foil-hattish of me, but...

Maybe they think they don't need a long-term strategy. They only need to hold
out short-term, until western governments take care of the problem for them.

With all the nonsense going on over kiddie pr0n, copyright infringement, etc.,
we are hearing a lot of scare stuff that would require even the "free world"
to implement the kind of controlled infrastructure that China would love.

~~~
lhuang
I think the CCP is very long-term oriented.

The majority of their policies I think would support this. If anything, the
CCP is willing to give short-term concessions if it will guarantee long-term
success.

This is not so-much the case now as China has more to bring to the bargaining
table. But if you look at China's trade policies in the 80s and 90s they were
very accommodating to western demands, even if it put China in a weaker
position.

------
mbreese
Since this is GoDaddy, why do I just see this as publicity? If it were most
other companies, I'd be impressed, but given that it's GoDaddy, I just can't
take it seriously.

Even though they are talking about Congressional testimony from their general
counsel regarding a very strict set of requirements (and personal information)
for .cn registration, I just can't take it seriously.

~~~
siculars
Bob Parsons was a USM. I'm sure he is enjoying this opportunity to do what he
can. <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Parsons>

~~~
Nwallins
N.B. USM, as in USMC, as in United States Marine Corps.

------
aaronbrethorst
From the article: "[GoDaddy] also believes the rules will have a 'chilling
effect' on new domain name registrations." In other words, 'Chinese citizens
in China won't be registering domains nearly as often as they used to, which
means we can't make money offering services in China.'

GoDaddy is pulling out because it won't be profitable to run their business in
China anymore. The fact that they can make humanitarian claims for free press
is just a bonus.

------
sharan
"...any registrant of a new .cn domain name to provide a color head shot and
other business identification, including a Chinese business registration
number and physical signed registration forms."

Question: Can't ICANN postulate what can and cannot be relevant information
that is gathered?

~~~
wmf
_Can't ICANN postulate what can and cannot be relevant information that is
gathered?_

Maybe, maybe not.

 _The designated [ccTLD] manager must be equitable and fair to all groups in
the domain that request domain names. Specifically, the same rules must be
applied to all requests and they must be processed in a non-discriminatory
fashion. The policies and procedures for the use of each TLD must be available
for public inspection. Generally these are posted on web pages or made
available for file transfer. While variations in policies and procedures from
country to country are expected due to local customs and cultural values, they
must be documented and available to interested parties. Requests from for-
profit and non-profit companies and organizations are to be treated on an
equal basis. No bias shall be shown regarding requests that may come from
customers of some other business related to the TLD manager. For example, no
preferential service for customers of a particular data network provider.
There can be no stipulation that a particular application, protocol, or
product be used._ (<http://www.icann.org/en/icp/icp-1.htm>)

Translation: ICANN won't attempt to contradict local customs.

 _The Sponsoring Organization shall abide by ICANN policies ... that concern
... other topics, in the circumstance that the registration policies for the
Delegated ccTLD encourage or promote registrations from entities or
individuals resident outside the territory of the Governmental Authority, to
the extent those policies are applicable to the Delegated ccTLD, except where
(a) the Sponsoring Organization is prohibited by law from implementing such an
other ICANN policy..._ (<http://www.icann.org/en/cctlds/model-
tscsa-31jan02.htm>)

Translations: Local laws override ICANN policies.

And more damning, it looks like CNNIC has no agreement with ICANN relating to
.cn at all: <http://www.icann.org/en/cctlds/agreements.html>

------
liuliu
It is unclear how they plan to do with the .cn domains that were registered on
the godaddy.com.

~~~
wmf
AFAIK GoDaddy is just a reseller for CNNIC for .cn domains; that contract can
be renegotiated.

------
scotty79
What could stop China from setting up their own root dns servers and issuing
only the domains they want and rerouting queries to IANA and ICANN root dns
server to their own?

------
grandalf
Now Chinese entrepreneurs will have a harder time launching websites. Success!

~~~
jhancock
It is an impediment to running some new site you just want to throw at the
wall and see what happens. This is truly a loss. But for the most part these
rules have always been challenging. I've had to run down to a Shanghai IDC in
years past to show proper company backing for my server. The gov calls the IDC
and says we're going to do an audit next week. The IDC looks through it books
to see who doesn't have their records up to date and calls to try to mitigate
any interruption in service.

For a local Chinese with a plan to launch a startup, you need to get your
corporate paperwork in order anyway just as you would in the U.S. In that
regard, this is just one more set of forms to fill out.

This change is a larger barrier for foreigners that can't read mandarin and
understand current Chinese regulation. For them, they're used to being able to
go to any number of web sites, typing in their credit card and owning a
domain.

------
dogas
Godaddy should just go ahead and pull out of america too.

