
Panda guts not suited to digesting bamboo - billconan
http://www.nature.com/news/panda-guts-not-suited-to-digesting-bamboo-1.17582
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qiqing
The particular bacteria species present (Escherichia, Shigella and
Streptococcus bacteria) are typical of carnivores, not herbivores, but we
don't know how much (yet) how much those strains have or have not adapted to
their cellulose job. From the article:

"Eisen says that some of the microbes in the panda gut might still be highly
efficient at breaking down cellulose. He argues that the study's authors
examined only microbial composition, not function — and microbes can change
function rapidly, making it hard to predict how they perform solely on the
basis of the genera of bacteria present. A 2011 study2 found evidence that
Clostridium bacteria in panda guts contained genes that resembled those known
to produce enzymes that break cellulose down into simpler sugars.

'I’m not convinced at all that there's any limitation to the cellulolytic
activity in this system based upon the data they have,' Eisen says of the new
study.

The researchers say that the most important question of the study is whether
the panda’s carnivore-like microbial structure can still effectively utilize
cellulose. More work will help to provide a complete picture."

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x0054
I was under the impression that in addition to bacteria you would also need a
different digestive system, similar to the 4 chambered stomach the cows have.
Are there any other animals who have a simple digestive system, like the
pandas, but due to their bacterial content can in fact digest cellulose?

~~~
qiqing
Termites can digest cellulose.
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Termite#Diet](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Termite#Diet)

As can rabbits, apparently, via a form of hindgut fermentation.
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rabbit#Diet_and_eating_habits](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rabbit#Diet_and_eating_habits)

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stephengillie
Poor pandas. It's as though Mother Nature has been trying to naturally
deselect these bears for some time. They're such ineffective competitors that
it surprises (and delights!) me that they're still around.

~~~
ffn
Yes, but these bears have very cleverly evolved the ability to seem
irresistibly cute to the current master species of this planet. From personal
observations, they seem to emit some sort of aura that induce people (in
particular post-puberty to adult females humans who I'm trying to date) to
emotionally melt down and make incomprehensible "cooing" noises. This aura
increases in strength with increases in proximity to these bears, and is most
pronounced in younger bears. The effect is particularly strong and can remain
for several hours in the host even if bears are removed. This can and has led
the host engaging in questionable (and often regrettable) activities with me
she would otherwise refrain from doing.

In any case, for all their microbiome weakness, they've evolved a rather
fascinating survival strategy to cope with humans so I don't think these bears
will be removed by natural selection any time soon.

~~~
Red_Tarsius
I'm not sure whether you're joking, but that's actually what happened to dogs.
Unlike wolves and many other beasts, we can empathize with dogs' facial
features (apophenia?), thus making us less likely to endanger them. You can
think of it as some sort of camouflage.

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joshuapants
So pandas were omnivores many years ago, then they became herbivores with
physical adaptations to eat bamboo, though their guts didn't keep up with the
process.

Can pandas still eat meat? Could you, for example, feed a panda in captivity a
carnivorous diet with an expectation that it would thrive?

~~~
jarin
Pandas do eat some meat in the wild, they've been seen catching and eating
birds and rodents.

~~~
x0054
What about in captivity. Perhaps reintroducing pandas to a meat diet would
solve a lot of pandas' problems.

~~~
joshuapants
That's what I'm curious about. I don't presume to know better than zoologists,
so maybe this has been tried and/or rejected for reasons I don't know about
but it seems that it could help. Maybe wild pandas will cease to be, but it
may be possible that a diet adjustment could at least keep a population viable
in captivity.

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mschuster91
Could one do the panda equivalent of a fecal transplant? If so... would this
be likely to improve the panda's health and be transmitted to its offspring?

~~~
minot
I'd like to know how gut microbes get transmitted from mother to offsprings in
other mammals especially humans. I've never thought that the microbes are, in
a matter of speaking, hereditary.

~~~
Tenhundfeld
If you have a child, you'll read about this. A baby's digestive system is
essentially sterile in the womb. There's increasing evidence that important
bacteria are passed to the newborn from the vaginal canal during the birthing
process – and is an argument against C-sections.

Also related is the resurgent practice of placing a newborn directly against
the mother's bare chest immediately after birth, which among other benefits,
is supposed to foster bacterial transference through skin-to-skin contact.

As a disclaimer, I'll just say that this field of knowledge seems rife with
theories but somewhat lacking credible scientific studies that do long-term
tracking of health outcomes. So, I take much of it with a grain of salt.

Here are a couple of studies I found:

Delivery mode shapes the acquisition and structure of the initial microbiota
across multiple body habitats in newborns

[http://www.pnas.org/content/107/26/11971.full](http://www.pnas.org/content/107/26/11971.full)

Influence of mode of delivery on gut microbiota composition in seven year old
children

[http://gut.bmj.com/content/53/9/1388.2.long](http://gut.bmj.com/content/53/9/1388.2.long)

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noname123
"He argues that the study's authors examined only microbial composition, not
function — and microbes can change function rapidly, making it hard to predict
how they perform solely on the basis of the genera of bacteria present. A 2011
study found evidence that Clostridium bacteria in panda guts contained genes
that resembled those known to produce enzymes that break cellulose down into
simpler sugars."

It sounds the authors identified the bacteria flora in the panda gut via
feces, but not the bacterias' specific gene expressions which may vary even if
they are known suited more for carnivore digestion (e.g., but may be
specialized to digest plants cellulose in panda gut environment).

For those involved in genomics, I'm curious as to how one can obtain the RNA
expression (RNASeq) of multiple bacteria present in panda gut; and how do they
go from the raw sequence data sequenced from the multiple bacteria composition
to match the specific gene and then also its host bacteria?

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alatkins
So what's the panda version of paleo?

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okonomiyaki3000
This animal has failed at evolution on practically every level. Such a waste
of effort to keep them alive while continuing to kill off so many other
species. 1000 years from now it will just be us, the cockroaches, and pandas.

~~~
MarcScott
This Gizmodo piece pretty much sums up why we should just let them all die.

[http://gizmodo.com/5841175/should-we-just-let-pandas-die-
off...](http://gizmodo.com/5841175/should-we-just-let-pandas-die-off-already)

~~~
jasonwocky
They also received a grade of 'F' in their official Animal Review.

[https://animalreview.wordpress.com/2008/05/04/pandas/](https://animalreview.wordpress.com/2008/05/04/pandas/)

