
Merrell Trail Glove Failures and Minimal Running in a Communist Shoe - joshrotenberg
https://blatanterror.com/2018/02/08/merrell-trail-glove-failures-and-a-minimal-running-in-a-communist-shoe/
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oblib
I really liked the Merrill hikers I started buying about 10 years ago. I wore
out about 4 pair over the course of about 6 years. Then they quit making them
and the next time I tried to buy a pair of Merrill's none of them were near as
good.

There were a lot of discussions on a backpacking forum I belong to about this
and the universal consensus came to be that Merrill was no longer a shoe we
could recommend. As they got more popular their quality receded and I and
others really mourned that.

Before we started buying Merrill's we bought aftermarket insoles for our shoes
and many of us are back to doing that again. But you can do that with a lot
less costly shoe and Merrill offers no real advantages right now over some of
those cheaper shoes.

Selling a cheaper made shoe for the same premium price may have increased
their profits a bit in the short term, but that cost them a huge amount of
good will.

You cannot fool hikers or runners with inferior quality and they don't care
what your logo looks like. Reputations rise and fall with them and Merrill has
lost theirs.

~~~
abakker
second to that. I had many pairs of Merrills. The last pair lasted ~6 months,
and the interior fabric had torn apart and the padding was entirely ruined. I
don't even exercise that hard, and I don't pronate. the sole wear was fine,
but the uppers were ruined.

~~~
ihnorton
I’m sad to hear my recent bad Merrills we’re not a one-off. I know people who
swear by Keen, but I can’t stand the toe box. Might have to try to get used to
it for the next pair.

~~~
oblib
I bought a pair of Keen's after I quit Merrill. They lasted a long time, close
to two years of pretty heavy use and gripped very well, but they needed an
aftermarket insole right out of the box and cost about $140 or more. They were
good shoes but were never close to as comfortable as the old Merrills.

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voicedYoda
I run relatively regularly these days. My journey of running started with a
marathon. I went from nothing to marathon in 6 months, with lots of training,
weight loss (healthily because I still love to eat), and stamina increases.
But after the marathon, it took over a week to walk normally again. Long runs
sucked, and I really began to hate running. Running shoes were killing me, and
I hated the idea that the shoe was there to help cushion the foot fall.

Then a friend encouraged me to try vibrams. And suddenly I fell in love with
running again. I have huge calves, and these helped tone them a lot more, but
now my strike is mid-front, and it’s comfortable to go 4-6 miles (though I
struggle keeping pace with my dog).

We have a wonderful suspension system built into our bodies, but it only works
correctly when applied correctly. We do not strike the ground the same when
running as when walking. And Vibrams taught me quickly to strike differently
(especially if I wanted to avoid really sore heels). The springiness of
running on our feet transfers to our ankels to our knees to our hips to our
back. I’m not an expert, and I know others can run with a rear strike, but for
my body shape and what I’ve learned to run with, the front strike was
important and I have Vibram FF to thank for it!

~~~
mlevental
i love low drop shoes for normal day to day wear - i hate feeling padding
under my feet (original chucks) but i wore vibrams for 6 months and got to
about 6 miles on em before i gave up out of pain on my tarsals and
metatarsals. if you're running on cement (which most of us are) you just can't
do it in vibrams. i still toe strike but in regular trainers.

~~~
noobiemcfoob
I run regularly on cement with my vibrams. You have to build up to it, and you
can get minute stress fractures in your foot while getting to that level.
Traditional shoes protect your feet from so much of the stress that most
people aren't physically prepared to just switch to a minimalist shoe.

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michaeljbishop
My friend, the company you need to go visit is Vivobarefoot. They are not as
cheap as your Chinese shoe, but they are the wide-toebox, no-support, tough-
as-nails-soles that you have been looking for.

    
    
      https://www.vivobarefoot.com/
    

Because of them, every shoe that I wear for _every_ occasion can be minimal
and I get to feel everything under my feet everywhere I go. I even have fancy
black leather shoes for special occasions.

They are wonderful.

~~~
joncrane
Those prices are astronomical, though. $240 for a pair of shoes, when
according to the author of the original article, something that serves the
purpose is available for a dollar a pair?!

~~~
michaeljbishop
You get what you pay for. These shoes last a very long time.

If you are timid about the price, they have regular clearance sales about
twice a year, usually about 40% off. Just get on their mailing list. And buy
quick as soon as the sale occurs!

~~~
joveian
I got my current pair on sale a couple of years ago and they are not dead yet
(although fairly light use), but this year they didn't have any in stock of
more than six styles I checked within hours of the sale announcement. I
emailed them and they said they had been out for months. So sleazy advertising
and expensive and most of the styles look horrible IMO (and, as the article
complains, any style you like will no longer be made once you need another
pair), but good shoes.

I'll keep an eye out for the cloth shoes. Not many options for thin sole
shoes. Concrete can be horrible on shoes with softer soles, however, and the
Vivobarefoot soles are the best thin soles I've seen for use on concrete.

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biophetik
I'm surprised that the author went with the vapor glove over another version
of the trail glove.

I was another one of those that loved the first version. Ran them through
multiple spartan races, half marathons, etc. They lasted a good 2 years before
the sole really started to wear through. I remember looking for the next
version during that time and seeing they were not continuing with the line.
But they must have changed their mind, because they eventually came out with
the trail glove 2.

I'm currently running with v2, with about a year of minimal wear on them,
although it's mostly been weight training and 4 mile runs. They also seem to
be continuing the line as it's now on v4. It would be interesting to see if
there is any consistency on wear through the versions.

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Eric_WVGG
Just a few days ago I was remembering a pair of these that I picked up back in
the eighties for… a school play? I liked them so much that I wore them until
they disintegrated.

We picked them up from a martial arts store (this was during the Karate Kid
fad), and sure enough, a quick search for "kung fu shoes" on Amazon is all it
took, $10. I'm going to grab a pair as soon as spring rolls around…

~~~
cag_ii
Cool! After reading this article I clearly remember buying "Kung-fu shoes" in
DTLA/Chinatown as a kid, they were a couple of bucks a piece and probably my
favorite shoes at the time.

I also clearly remember they did very little to protect your feet from the
black asphalt playground heat in the middle of summer, lol.

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gumby
I'm not a runner but I am a hiker and what I learned was to buy resoleable
boots (obviously this opinion is of no value to runners).

There are lots of decent midpriced boots but all have the soles glued on.
Typically they don't even last 1000 miles before they wear out and need
replacement. The problem is that by then they have adjusted properly to my
foot!

Now i've had the same boot for almost a decade, having been resoled four
times. (in that time my dog has gone through about 10 sets of boots)

~~~
danielvf
Brand recommendations? The last three half hight hiking shoes I’ve bought have
fallen apart in months...

~~~
gumby
Well I personally don't believe in hiking shoes; I like a solid boot with
ankle support, and find the hiking shoes sacrifice performance.

Yes, they are heavy, but they protect me from all sorts of absurd trail
problems (ice, rocks, mine tailings, "punji sticks", weird grades and rock
edges, etc). The stiffer sole prevents arch fatigue.

(Trick, which I did first for my off the shelf Asolo boots: I had the cobbler
take them apart and put in a device that was basically a plastic half pipe
with a flat plate at one end. The plate went above the boot sole and under the
internal sole (under my foot) and the half pipe ran up the back of my ankle.
Gave be a lot of additional stability on uncertain ground and prevented
pronation). Even those Asolos were only about $300 and lasted a few years; I
had the sole repaired at about 400 mi and then tried again, fruitlessly, after
another couple of hundred. But they were super comfortable.

I had my boots custom made from a guy I met through my (then) local camping
store in the Prenzlauer Berg. Cost about 1000 Euros. Sounds like a lot but on
a per mile basis they have been cheap and they fit my feet like a glove.

Your best bet would be to talk to your local cobbler (what repairs can they
make?) and your camping store because you need a local network who can support
your boot. Also Dave Page in Seattle is THE GURU hiking boot cobbler and may
recommend something. I have found the uppers of Asolo and Vasques boots to be
outstanding, and I use a pair of modified Asolos as my jungle boots.

Oh, and despite what I said about hiking "shoes", I did hike from yosemite to
the desolation wilderness (tahoe-yosemite trail) in Chaco sandals which have
_no_ ankle support. I wouldn't do it again, and all my toes ended up bloody,
but it was actually pretty good.

------
kolbe
I've been a minimalist runner for about a decade at this point. Merrell
disappointed me in this exact same way. They also used to have a zero drop
gore-tex shoe for running in snow that they discontinued.

My best solution has been to turn towards running sandals. I've done a lot of
barefoot (foot to ground) running, but the sandals provide enough protection
from hot pavement and rocky trails. Also, the main reason I've had to throw
away my minimalist shoes is due to how bad they smell after a while. That's
not a problem with sandals.

There's a great company based out of Santa Cruz called Shamma. Leather straps
and made to order for $70. I get a few thousand miles out of them. I've done
hundred mile stretches on the PCT in them and even ran a 50 mile race in them.
And I swear to god I do not work for the company.
[https://shammasandals.com/](https://shammasandals.com/)

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kenm47
A couple of people have asked me separately about where I found these on
Taobao. Here is a link:
[https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?spm=a230r.1.14.135.17cc5590...](https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?spm=a230r.1.14.135.17cc5590iVkkiR&id=537578442226&ns=1&abbucket=17#detail)

I'm not sure it was this particular buyer I bought from, but they are
approximately this. Beware, it's pretty difficult (read near-impossible) to
buy off taobao without chinese because the seller will expect that you chat
with them about the purchase before they ship.

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rpenm
The author is incorrect - his shoe is a Vapor Glove 2, not a 3 - as evidenced
by the design and clearly visibly label.

And the Vapor Glove is definitely not a follow-up to the Trail Glove, it's a
different shoe. Merrell still makes Trail Gloves (though yes, the design has
changed both for better and worse). I'm currently considering the Trail Glove
4.

------
pasbesoin
Last year, I bought two pairs of Merrell boots: A "normal" pair and a winter
pair (bit more insulation, and some extra-grippy bits on the soles).

Unfortunately, trial in the store was not long enough and/or was too
distracting, but on both -- different models -- the "box" of the left boot is
narrow than that of right. And over the course of a few hours and/or more
extensive walking, this causes my left foot to hurt from the constraint.
Meanwhile, my right foot is perfectly cosy and fine.

This is not something I have experienced regularly with other brands. For some
reason, that season, Merrell seemed to be making lefts smaller/narrower.

(Unfortunately, I ended up severely ill for a couple of months, two days after
purchase. By the time I was well enough to consider returning them, I was too
embarrassed at the time passed. And I'd gotten them on quite a good
combination of sales, meaning that the store probably would have had to eat
their cost, if they took them back, due to model/yearly revisions.)

P.S. I'm returning to just buying "decent" stuff from LL Bean. I seem to find
less size variation in their products (e.g. jeans). And even "premium"
products too often seem to be a crap shoot, these days.

Although I do love and baby my Asolo's, bought from an expert who spent an
hour fitting me. Over a decade ago, now. But I'm not going to wear them out on
daily tromps for exercise on our local gravel trail.

P.P.S. I also had a pair of those Chinese slippers -- looked exactly like the
ones pictured. Bought somewhere in San Francisco's Chinatown. They were ok,
certainly for the price, although I wouldn't run in them. Had them until I
took them to a friend's, because they were obsessive about people removing
their shoes. Never got them back. You can't trust your friends, either. ;-)

------
frabbit
I just wish I could get shoes wide enough for my feet. Anything wide enough is
too long (a good 4cm of wasted space at the front). I have tried supposedly
extra wide shoes like Lems, but the only thing that is comfortable is either
the Vibram Five Fingers or Crocs (terrible for running) or some Birkenstocks
(just).

~~~
noelwelsh
I have very wide feet. In the UK shoe measurement system a width of H is the
widest. One of my feet is H, and the other one is wider. I wear Vivobarefoot
[https://www.vivobarefoot.com/](https://www.vivobarefoot.com/) and they
actually fit. I'm no longer buying shoes 1-2 sizes too big to fit my feet. I'm
currently wearing Gobi for every day wear, and exercise in a Stealth II. All
of these needed a bit of time to break in. When I tried on a Primus they were
a bit tight all around, so probably best to avoid that style (or try them on
yourself).

~~~
frabbit
I definitely have what could be (disparagingly?) called Saxon feet. Widest
width on their own are definitely not enough. The overhead image of the
StealthII looks like the most promising thing I have seen for a while.

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meritt
This doesn't excuse Merrell's quality control at all but for a bit of consumer
protection: If you purchase your shoes at REI and they fall apart like this,
they'll happily provide you with a refund or replacement.

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namiller2
I had a pair of Trail Gloves pictured and they were great. Every pair of
Merrells I've bought since have been disappointing. Either wore down too fast
or were uncomfortable.

~~~
sdenton4
I'm kinda confused. I'm wearing a pair of trail gloves right now, and Merrel
has continued to make them, incrementing a version number along the way... I
wear them every day, and have been rocking them for my last four pairs of
shoes, using 'em til the sole wears through.

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giarc
Seems like Toms are pretty similar to the Chinese shows mentioned in the
article.

~~~
gowld
Toms sells $10 shoes for $40, though.

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kevin_thibedeau
He should just coat the soles in ShoeGoo and patch as necessary. Same for the
high wear areas of the cloth.

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joncrane
I'd love a link to where the author found those 布鞋 on TaoBao. that seems like
the best bet.

