
Doreen Valiente: The story of the mother of modern witchcraft - benbreen
http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/doreen-valiente-the-mother-of-modern-witchcraft-whose-spells-are-still-used-today-wicca-brighton-a6973196.html
======
hosh
I'm surprised to see this here on the front page of HN. Seems to me the
audience here would generally be hostile to this, and not necessarily in a
religious fundamentalist way. In other groups I run with, full of brilliant
people who have developed their skills in both rationality and mysticism, this
article might be criticized for other reasons -- not whether this is yet
another example of superstition, but rather, in it's authenticity and whether
it was a fluff piece.

Some comments at the meta level and on a tangent: I still think of that
article posted up about René Girard, his influence on Peter Thiel, and the
fascinating philosophy of mimetic violence. It's something I want to deep dive
into. One of the questions it probes is: why do people create a scapegoat? Why
do people want to say things to put down other people?

Fundamentalists scapegoat non-fundamentalists. (Maybe because it is less
acceptable now to attack someone for their religious beliefs, so it is easier
to attack someone for their lack of religious beliefs). Atheists have
responded in kind. I'm not saying this happens here on this specific forum,
but I have seen this dynamic happen a lot in other places, both online and
offline.

Rational skepticism is one method of inquiry, useful as long as the people
involved remain open-minded. Yet, whether we're talking about rational
materialists, religious fundamentalists -- or even the drama I got sucked into
with that Hong Kong martial arts article -- there is a tendency to
rhetorically _attack_ others. It is as if there is a _irrational_ tendency
attack ideas (and not in the sense of trying to refine it through oppositional
rhetoric, but to dismiss, to destroy, to deny the idea's very existence).

~~~
npiazza83
Lots of people watching jonathan strange and mr. norrel on netflix.

------
Torgo
Over the years, the majority of wiccans I have known (barely double digits, to
be fair) have been quite up front that it was just a metaphor for organizing
their life and worldview, not literally "true" witchcraft. There is a, I don't
recall the correct term, belief that you can will positive outcomes into
existence by visualizing them. This is not unique to wiccans though.

~~~
csixty4
It's less of a fad than it was twenty years ago, which might explain it. The
people who stuck with it are probably the ones looking for a framework rather
than the attention seekers.

------
soufron
Wow. That's scientology-level bullshit.

~~~
sevensor
Scientology is a whole other level of bullshit. Wicca seems a great deal less
predatory. And being wished a happy solstice by a dude with leaves in his hair
is way less creepy than being offered a "free personality test." I'd rather
deal with Wiccans.

~~~
soufron
Are you sure? To me it just looks like your average sect. And having sex with
a man wearing a goat mask does not appeal to me as "less creepy" :)

Also, a few wiccans committed a collective suicide in France some time ago.

I guess it's just less mainstream for now. We need to wait a bit for more
scandals to emerge.

~~~
sevensor
Perhaps so. I'm certainly an outsider to both, and I'm unaware of incidents
such as you mention. Scientology's abuses, on the other hand, are well
publicized.

------
karma_vaccum123
She supplanted mainstream gibberish (monotheistic religions) with fringe
gibberish, that's all.

I've never understood the lofty attitudes of people who engage non-traditional
supernatural beliefs. You're just a different idiot.

~~~
atombath
Everyone needs to find or invent terminology and tools to help define the
elements(including the mystical and undefinable) of their existence. At least
she and people like her are/were courageous enough to throw away the old tool
set in order to define something for themselves.

