
LifePaint Safety Spray - davidbarker
http://www.volvocars.com/uk/about/our-innovations/lifepaint
======
nemesisj
To be honest, I was more impressed with their mission statement of "By 2020,
no person will be killed or seriously injured by a Volvo". What an incredible
goal! I hope they can achieve it.

~~~
BillinghamJ
Given how ahead-of-the-curve Volvo have been so far (e.g. outside air bags,
automatic braking, etc.), I think they're well on track for that.

While they seem to be thought of as an old soccer-mom type car company, I
personally think of them very highly.

~~~
lbotos
I think the soccer mom image comes from their lack of "sport" focused cars. I
looked at their lineup and saw nothing that looked "aggressive" or "sporty".
All of the cars looked pretty even keel middle of the road "nice".

~~~
semi-extrinsic
There are a couple of sporty offerings [1] from their in-house tuning company,
Polestar (like AMG for Mercedes, etc.). And the 240 Turbo is still a entry-
level rally favorite in Scandinavia. You can easily get 300 bhp, 50/50 weight
distribution, manual shift and rear-wheel drive in a '94 model for about
$6000, then spend about $1500 prepping it for the entry level rally class.
(There is an even cheaper rally class called "Folkrally", where there is a
rule to keep the cost down that says at the end of the race, anyone can offer
to buy your car for $1700, and you're not allowed to refuse or you lose your
rally licence.)

[1] [http://www.volvocars.com/us/cars/new-
models/s60/s60-polestar](http://www.volvocars.com/us/cars/new-
models/s60/s60-polestar)

------
spdustin
I do cycle, and I do not see this as a bad thing, nor that it shifts the
blame/burden/etc to me as a cyclist. I _am_ hard to see at night with my tiny
rear light and my reflective vest that barely moves and the thin reflective
stripes on my pants. If I sprayed the legs of my pants with this, the large
area of movement reflecting in headlights would sure as hell make me easier to
see.

I imagine it sure would help collision avoidance systems, and I can't be the
only one thinking that. If it's that reflective for visible light, it's just
as reflective for IR and possibly microwaves, and would make the user stand
out on computerized collision avoidance systems.

~~~
HCIdivision17
That was the first rule of the motorcycle training course: you're harder to
see. Worse, I've had people seem to make eye-contact with me and pull out, and
then saw the shock on their face when they actually _noticed_ me; someone once
described it as a bad check, where they're looking for cars, and since you're
not a car the road's clear. (It's such a confusingly bad heuristic, too, since
people seem to do that to trains and trucks as well.)

So to help things along, it's useful to be _conspicuous_. In overcast, low-
contrast weather, I'd love for this stuff for my chaps when it's cold and
drizzly.

EDIT: I wonder what the high viz stuff triggers in terms of object collision
warnings in the head. Like, perhaps it seems like a sign, and that makes a
person double check they're still on the road? I have that sort of knee-jerk
check when someone with bright blue headlamps get behind me, since that color
in a mirror used to invariably mean police.

~~~
Piskvorrr
Yup. "Nothing car-sized in my left mirror, turning...OH-SHIT-SINCE-WHEN-DO-I-
HAVE-A-TRAM-WEDGED-IN-THE-CAR-DOOR?!?" is the most common collision scenario
for light rail, just as "nothing car-sized in my mirror, let me open the door-
OH-SHIT-THAT-BIKE-LANE-WASN'T-THERE-A-SECOND-AGO!!!" is for bikes.

Also, see that video I posted in response to GP - reflective stuff is at least
an order of magnitude more visible at night than normal (even bright)
clothing.

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dexwiz
Cool marketing, but not a novel idea. There a tons of similar products. I have
been told that the paint only lasts 2-3 weeks WITHOUT washing the clothing. I
am also hesitant to spray any nice fabric with it. Unless you are in a bind,
just use a dedicated riding jacket with reflective fabric.

~~~
amelius
I'm also concerned about the influence on the environment.

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ZenoArrow
Just in case anyone is interested in getting some, Volvo LifePaint is believed
to be a rebranding of an existing product: Albedo100 Invisible Bright. Should
be easy enough to buy some.

[http://www.wired.com/2015/03/lifepaint-reflective-
paint/](http://www.wired.com/2015/03/lifepaint-reflective-paint/)

------
ewood
Cool product. Sadly I don't think it would make a huge difference in London,
as even the examples shown in their video suggest that the driver saw the
cyclist but crossed their path anyway. I find London drivers (and pedestrians)
see cyclists ok but are very poor at judging a cyclist's speed and stopping
distance. Also a big part of getting around in London is about aggressively
claiming space and navigating obstacles, drivers are far more concerned about
collisions with other cars and large vehicles and are quite ok with pulling
into the path of smaller vehicles and assuming they will stop.

------
mattkevan
I got hold of this stuff when it first came out last year, its fun.

Amazon does a whole range of similar products, including one that's safe to
use on animal fur. I've often been tempted to spray the cat - keep him safer
when out at night, and the idea of a shiny cat is pretty amusing.

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ck2
They've been doing this to deer antlers for years now

[http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-
way/2014/02/20/280220511/...](http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-
way/2014/02/20/280220511/these-reindeer-really-do-glow-and-its-for-their-own-
good)

------
andrenotgiant
Before we all get too excited, here is a real-world review of Volvo Life Paint
-
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qpzxGx76VQQ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qpzxGx76VQQ)

I read about the stuff when it came out, and was reminded of a similar
concept: "anti-paparazzi clothing" made with similarly reflective material
[https://www.betabrand.com/mens-reflective-flashback-
hoodie-j...](https://www.betabrand.com/mens-reflective-flashback-hoodie-
jacket.html)

The problem with both of these is that CAMERAS with FLASHES do an
exceptionally good job of exaggerating the effect. So in the real world it
will never be as bright.

------
buro9
I run a cycling forum in London and a Volvo dealer recently approached us to
advertise this and offer it for free for some cyclists to try.

Whilst we don't do advertising at all, and whilst this isn't for me I thought
the free offer may be something people wanted to take up so I asked.

The response was loud and clear: Cyclists see this as victim blaming. As a way
to externalise responsibility away from the operator of a multi-tonne vehicle
to the operator of a 10kg pedal bicycle.

Of those who replied, most were angry that things have already got to the
point whereby even wearing high-vis, helmets and having very capable lights...
one of the first lines in any newspaper report on a cyclist being involved in
a road traffic incident remains "the cyclist was wearing a helmet and a high-
vis jacket". No mention of whether the lights of a vehicle are in working
order, or the driver was paying attention and looking for other road users.

In fact, the onus seems to be wholly on the cyclist to be a beacon.

If a cyclist is hit by a vehicle, then the cyclist is presumed to be at fault
if an overwhelming amount of evidence cannot be immediately proffered showing
how visible the cyclist was.

That was kind of the thing that made me not want to try it either, but others
found the words a hell of a lot better than I and there was real anger there.

All that said, Volvo have taken the unique stance of saying that they as a
company will take responsibility for incidents where the cause was one of
their automatic driving systems. For that they deserve considerable praise,
but for this paint... no.

BTW: Dupes:

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9282607](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9282607)

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9318144](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9318144)

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9288521](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9288521)

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9288896](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9288896)

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9527506](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9527506)

One of those pointed to this road.cc article where the comments are revealing:
[http://road.cc/content/news/147107-paint-yourself-visible-
ni...](http://road.cc/content/news/147107-paint-yourself-visible-night-volvo-
develops-new-life-paint-cyclists)

~~~
johansch
Wow, just wow.

I'm a cyclist myself and this kind of immature attitude just gets to me. I
simply cannot fathom how to begin to justify it.

~~~
rdiddly
I'll give you some help justifying it and fathoming it: 30,000 people are
dying on roads in the US every year. Because of cars, not because of invisible
cyclists. Most of which, there is already a law in place that would've
prevented it, i.e. when a crash takes place there has typically already been a
law broken.

30,000 people, that's TEN 9/11's every year. Enough to justify ten wars, some
would say. So it's well more than enough to justify politely telling you to go
fuck off with your glow-in-the-dark spraypaint. People in cars - YOU go paint
yourself. YOU grow up. YOU take responsibility and be mature.

~~~
johansch
Yeah, that's just batshit insane. Sorry.

Some sort of symbolic protest against car drivers is not going to help your
cause. Your target should be the designers of the road system. Until you fix
that, this is a stop-gap.

Either way, in case you are more interested in surviving rather making a
political point (the wrong audience), it makes no sense to reject something
that can protect you.

------
Luc
Does anyone know what it's made of? Perhaps microscopic transparent beads with
some water-soluble glue?

------
milge
I've been considering something like this for when I'm riding my motorcycle.

------
herbig
Of course being more visible is going to be safer for you, but let's not let
this put even more of the burden of safety on the bicyclist.

If this catches on, riding at night without it will be considered as dumb as
riding without a helmet, when really nothing is going to protect you from a
two ton metal deathtrap coming at you at 20 mph or above.

No criminality suspected.

~~~
Piskvorrr
The only difference from the rest of reflective stuff (armbands, pedals, wheel
wire wraps) is the ad-hoc nature of the stuff. Me, I'll stick to the
traditional reflective strips (plus lights).

The real issue is this: the protective elements are already widely available
(to cyclists and pedestrians alike) and cheap - how is this more attractive to
the current unlit and dark-clad "ninjas" than existing alternatives? In other
words, the product might be useful to people who already _do_ use other safety
elements - how is this aimed at the ones who _don 't_?

~~~
herbig
Yeah, I agree. The only thing this has is being new and "cool." To me, it's
just more inconvenient than wearing traditional stuff.

Bright blinking lights are the best way to increase visibility, and many
people (in NYC at least) don't even bother with those.

~~~
fennecfoxen
Naah. High-visibility fluorescent yellow cycling jackets or similar attire are
better ways: your body is a large blob that is much easier to notice than a
little blinking light, especially if you're going along areas where there are
lots of other light sources competing for the driver's attention.

But there's no reason you shouldn't go for both, of course.

