
Uber won its license back in London - docker_up
http://www.businessinsider.com/uber-wins-london-licence-2018-6
======
gsnedders
[https://www.reuters.com/article/us-uber-britain/uber-wins-
lo...](https://www.reuters.com/article/us-uber-britain/uber-wins-london-
license-but-with-conditions-idUSKBN1JL31G) includes slightly more, IMO,
including:

> Judge Emma Arbuthnot said that while Uber had not been fit and proper when
> that decision was made, an overhaul of its policies in the subsequent months
> had changed its position.

> Uber, which has about 45,000 drivers in London, introduced several new
> initiatives in response to the ruling, including 24/7 telephone support and
> the proactive reporting of serious incidents to police. It has also changed
> senior management in Britain, its biggest European market.

> The license conditions include giving TFL notice of what Uber is doing in
> areas that may be a cause of concern, reporting safety related complaints
> and having an independent assurance audit report every six months.

~~~
willspoke
They have 15 months, I believe, to prove that they should merit a 5 year
licence. If nothing goes wrong, then they would have succeeded in renewing
their licence. Presently they are under probation.

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hacker_9
I'm not sure why this is even news to be honest; I live in London and noticed
zero glitch in the consistency of my Uber rides. I don't think anyone actually
thought this would be a problem when 1) they fulfil a service that everyone
wants (cabs simply do not compare on speed, efficiency, price and ease of
booking) and 2) the company is such a well known global brand, that there
would be an uproar if it was banned and no politician would want that stain on
their time in office.

~~~
paulie_a
I am not in London so it is probably an unfair assumption. But the most
important reason Uber is better is because cab drivers are unequivocally
terrible in every way.

~~~
biggc
> I am not in London

My understanding is that London cabs are held to an extremely high standard
([https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taxicabs_of_the_United_Kingdom...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taxicabs_of_the_United_Kingdom#The_Knowledge)),
as a result they're also extremely expensive.

~~~
gsnedders
Most people weren't using taxis in London regularly (they're too expensive for
that), even prior to Uber; they were using private hires (or "minicabs") which
is the exact same regulatory structure that Uber operates under (and have
existed for 1960s). Uber's advantages in London came about in three main ways,
AFAICT: individual ratings of drivers (massively decreasing variation in
quality), tracking from ordering to pickup, and not having any issues with
card payments (because they're the only way to pay!). Of course, the other
private hire companies haven't stood still…

The most notable difference in regulation from a passenger point of view
between a private hire and a taxi is you can hail a taxi, but can't a private
hire.

~~~
gaius
_Uber 's advantages in London came about in three main ways_

You forgot undercutting the competition using VC cash, oh and evading the
taxes that all their competitors pay.

~~~
geezerjay
> You forgot undercutting the competition using VC cash

I don't understand what point you were trying to make. Why do you assume
incumbents have no investors? And why do you believe it's reasonablr to
complain about how private investors decide where to invest theie cash?

> oh and evading the taxes that all their competitors pay.

Do you have any basis to support your assertion? Because I find it very odd
how entire nation-wide corporativist associations, representing the entrenched
incumbents and heavily invested in preserving their personal monopoly, fail to
make such an assertion.

~~~
gaius
_Do you have any basis to support your assertion?_

Uber drivers being disguised employees is frequently in the news

[https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/oct/28/uber-
uk-t...](https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/oct/28/uber-uk-tribunal-
self-employed-status)

Uber avoids employer’s NI by this mechanism

~~~
geezerjay
> Uber drivers being disguised employees

I fail to see how that can be passed off as tax evasion. The question was
whether Uber drivers were mere service providers earning a few bucks on the
side doing some gigs or should be considered proper employees. I believe it's
easy to understand that the point of this sort of classification has deep
legal implications where tax avoidance are comparatively irrelevant.

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KineticLensman
This doesn't mean that Uber hasn't been operating in London. It was refused a
new license last year but was allowed to keep going pending the decision
reported here (in effect an appeal)

~~~
gaius
_but was allowed to keep going pending the decision reported here_

In other words, no material consequences for the bad behaviour at all, not
even a slapped wrist, just business as usual. London is ill-served by these
weak so-called regulators.

If a private citizen had committed these crimes and told a judge they were now
a reformed character, would they get off Scot free?

~~~
gsnedders
Uber were not convicted of any crimes. The bar for a license renewal being
refused is much, much lower than criminal activity.

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jimnotgym
Well at least Uber can now focus on tax-avoidance as an unfair advantage over
regular cabs.

[https://goodlawproject.org/uber-case/](https://goodlawproject.org/uber-case/)

~~~
paulddraper
> Jo Maugham QC, our director, told ITV: “I’m suing Uber to understand whether
> HMRC treats these big US multinationals including Uber with kid gloves. Uber
> undoubtedly has arranged its business model to minimise its tax liability,
> to dodge taxes if you like, and to minimise the workers’ rights that it has
> to offer to its drivers.”

So, a lawsuit to explore. Interesting, I guess?

~~~
jimnotgym
That's what he does, he is a campaigning lawyer. He is only claiming about
£0.50 IIRC!

~~~
paulddraper
> campaigning lawyer

If you ever wondered the stereotype of litigious lawyers if real...

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tsunamifury
I travel the world over and Uber London is absolutely the best car service
I've ever experienced. Want a bargin BMW 5 series to get you to your place --
Uber Exec. Need to treat a client to a S-Class, use Uber Black in just
minutes. Every experience with Uber was a professional at a relatively low
price. It makes San Francisco Uber seem like a dumpster fire.

~~~
loriverkutya
Probably you didn't used it often enough. I have some quiet bad experience
(never going to get an Uber with pregnant wife), as well as everybody I know
and used Uber in London. Also, the standard Uber car in London is Toyota
Prius.

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cbcoutinho
Are other commenters here comparing uber to regular cabs in London or black
cabs? I always heard that the difference between them all is substantial -
especially regarding knowledge of local streets and motorways

~~~
spiralx
I assume most of the comparisons are for black cabs, which are indeed more
expensive but have unrivalled knowledge of getting around central London, as
well as being allowed to pick up fares by being hailed on the street.

There are fewer differences between Uber and minicab firms in London. Uber is
a bit more expensive on short journeys and drivers lack any local knowledge so
can end up taking longer routes, but cheaper for journeys going a longer
distance because drivers don't have to return to their home area after
dropping you off. Uber's app is better than the others I've tried, but not
unique, and their drivers and cars tend to be nice, but so are most minicabs
that I've used.

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hardlianotion
Provisionally

[https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/jun/26/uber-
case...](https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/jun/26/uber-case-licence-
london)

