
Porsche to Cull Diesels in Shift Toward Electric Vehicles - crunchlibrarian
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-09-23/porsche-to-cull-diesel-cars-in-shift-toward-electric-vehicles
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sremani
For a time I was tempted to buy Porsche Cayenne Diesel, but they have some
weird restrictions on Bio-Diesel fuels.

From :
[http://www.porscheownersmanuals.com/2014-cayenne/10/268-2228...](http://www.porscheownersmanuals.com/2014-cayenne/10/268-22282/Diesel-
Diesel-engine-Fuel-quality)

Risk of engine damage and/or damage to the fuel system if diesel fuel with a
higher concentration of biodiesel than 5 % is used like B11, B20 or B100.

Only use diesel fuel with a blend of 5 % biodiesel (B5) or below.

\----------------------------------------------

If I cannot even put B20 in it, there is not point for going with diesel,
Cayenne Diesel is the slowest and most un-porshe Porsche!

~~~
jhayward
That's pretty old. Around the 2013-2015 model years they upgraded the coatings
in the fuel pump and injectors to accommodate the higher corrosion potential,
mostly due to glycerin-bound water, in biodiesel.

As far as I know everything produced today is B20 rated or higher. The fuel
systems are all made by the same two manufacturers for the most part.

~~~
sremani
This is 2015-2016 manual [http://www.porscheownersmanuals.com/2015-cayenne-
manual/12/2...](http://www.porscheownersmanuals.com/2015-cayenne-
manual/12/276/Diesel)

2017-2018 manual: [http://www.porscheownersmanuals.com/2017-cayenne-
manual/16/2...](http://www.porscheownersmanuals.com/2017-cayenne-
manual/16/253/Refueling)

I do not think there is 2019 Cayenne Diesel model, but I do not see anything
other B5 or less.

~~~
jhayward
That's interesting, thanks for the links. Since they're using the same Bosch
high-pressure pumps and injectors as everyone else I don't see any real reason
for the restriction, except perhaps some conservatism in the specs. There's
nothing about B20 that would bother any part of the engine or emissions
systems once the fuel components are up to date.

I suppose they may simply be running out old spec stock. Anyway, to your
point, it _is_ disappointing. Along with the whole defeat device thing.

------
kenhwang
Makes sense, Porsche's diesel engines were badge engineered from VW, while
their hybrid tech is widely considered to be the best in the "money is no
object" hypercar class. Hybrid also plays better with their electric car
ambitions.

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userbinator
Porsche is not a brand I would associate with diesel at all, except in the
context of "crazy engine swaps".

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Reason077
Porsche has not offered any diesel models in the European market since Feb
2018. Diesel was always a minor part of their line-up and not a great fit for
the brand, so this move isn’t hugely surprising.

It would be a much bigger victory for environmental campaigners if the wider
VW group were to join Porsche, Toyota, Volvo, Subaru and Fiat Chrysler in
announcing an end to diesel in cars.

~~~
blensor
I think the whole Dieselgate affair was a huge benefit for the future of
electric cars. Because at least in consumer cars the uncertainty surroundig
possible limitations with driving into cities (in Austria and Germany) if you
have a diesel car will almost erradicate this market segment in the next few
years.

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hatchnyc
Damn, now I will never be able to live out my dream of owning a diesel
Porsche.

~~~
RickJWagner
Yeah, I was looking forward to a sweet 911d.

~~~
trhway
the VW does actually have pretty much it
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audi_R10_TDI](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audi_R10_TDI)

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xkcd-sucks
Some would contend that Porsche never made diesels at all, but I understand
that sometimes great companies make terrible mistakes like the Macan and
Cayenne

It would be really fun to have a waste veg oil burning Porsche though

~~~
dagoat
Hardly terrible mistakes when they are two of their best, if not their best,
selling models globally.

~~~
snovv_crash
Yes, but what damage has it done to the brand? They're now a manufacturer of
quick family cars, not purely sports cars. Now they are in the same class with
Maserati and Lexus for coolness, not McLaren and Lamborghini.

This isn't something that can be bought back. "I drive a Porsche" doesn't have
the same implications it once did.

~~~
kenhwang
Lamborghini makes a family friendly Urus; guess it's just a quick family car
brand too.

And the Urus manages to be even more flagrant brand engineering since it's an
Lamborghini version of a Porsche Cayenne, which is just an Audi Q7, all based
off an VW Touareg.

If there's a current Porsche vehicle hurts their brand, I think it's the
Panamera. All their other vehicles are either sportiest in class or best in
class, but typically both; the Panamera is neither.

But Porsche haven't gone anywhere near full BMW yet, and BMW is still cooler
than Maserati and Lexus. I think Porsche's brand value is doing just fine. Not
every car manufacturer needs to be
McLaren/Ferrari/Lamborghini/Koenigsegg/Bugatti, and arguably, Porsche was
never part of that group.

~~~
arthurfm
> And the Urus manages to be even more flagrant brand engineering since it's
> an Lamborghini version of a Porsche Cayenne, which is just an Audi Q7, all
> based off an VW Touareg.

The Lamborghini Urus shares the same VW group platform as the Audi Q8 and the
Bentley Bentayga. [1] [2]

[1] [https://www.autoevolution.com/news/lamborghini-urus-meets-
au...](https://www.autoevolution.com/news/lamborghini-urus-meets-audi-q8-in-
switzerland-and-both-are-black-128138.html)

[2] [https://www.quattrodaily.com/photo-comparison-
audi-q8-concep...](https://www.quattrodaily.com/photo-comparison-
audi-q8-concept-vs-lamborghini-urus/)

~~~
kenhwang
The Q8 is just a rounder body on the Q7/Touareg platform with the Audi engine
with the Porsche turbo from the Cayenne instead of an Audi supercharger. The
Bentayga is also a Touareg derivative but with a Bentley W12 or Cayenne Turbo
V8TT. Bugatti is also working on their Touareg clone presumably with a Bugatti
W16 engine.

They're all the same car with different packaging. The biggest giveaway is all
of the clones use Audi's pretty distinctive rear air suspension system, the
odd for Audi/VW rear wheel steering, and the uncharacteristic for
Porsche/Lamborghini ZF-8HP automatic transmission.

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anon49124
There is this guy I know in Los Altos Hills who does this in his driveway. He
always has 2 gas->diesel conversions going at any one time either GMC/Caddy,
VW or Merc. I'm sure the guy could convert the used petrol Cayenne my
stepfather just bought, but there's really no point unless you're biodiesel-
ing / out in the country / carry your own fuel / use lots of generators.

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olivermarks
'Porsche will focus on gasoline, electric and hybrid vehicles because demand
for diesel is declining, the Stuttgart, Germany-based manufacturer said in an
emailed statement on Sunday.'

HN headline is v misleading

~~~
dang
We changed to the article title. Submitted title was "Porsche to eliminate all
diesel models as it shifts to EVs".

~~~
olivermarks
surely 'gasoline, electric and hybrid vehicles'?

~~~
dang
If you can fit it in 80 chars or less, let us know at hn@ycombinator.com. I
tried for a while.

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InclinedPlane
Frankly, every government of a developed nation should have a plan for
complete phase out of diesel vehicles in the near-term with very few
exceptions. There is simply no such thing as a diesel powered automobile which
does not have severe detrimental health impacts. Yes, it's a very challenging
technological problem to tackle, diesel engines have great utility, but that's
no excuse for tolerating the deplorable current state of things.

