
How  to Burn Out Programming - rckclmbr
http://blog.braegger.pw/5-ways-to-burn-out-programming/
======
chasing
Where's "Don't exercise?"

That'd be pretty close to the top of my list.

A quick 2-3 mile jog around the neighborhood can help get me out of work-
related funks. (I work at a home office, though, so it's easier for me to say
"fuck it" and go do something sweaty in the middle of the day...)

My theory is that, since the only real item on your jogging to-do list is to
put one foot in front of the other, your brain is freed up a bit to wander.
Which is helped by the light stimulus of the changing environment around you.
And this brain wandering helps shake out cobwebs and generally make you feel
like a free individual again.

And, of course, it gives you an energy boost, which helps with the simple
exhaustion side of things.

~~~
christiangenco
Exercise, I've found, is probably the single most important aspect of
maintaining "happiness."

The problem is I can't consistently muster the willpower to block out an hour
long chunk of time to go running or workout at gym. I found a lovely
compromise, though:

### The Seven Minute Workout [1][2] ###

It removes literally every excuse my brain can come up with not to work out.
Too cold outside? Doesn't matter, you're not going anywhere. Not enough time?
The time you'll spend coming up with excuses is probably longer than 7
minutes. That's like two songs on the songza workout playlist. Don't feel like
changing? Doesn't matter - you can do it in the clothes you're in. Can't find
the equipment you need? All you need is a chair, a wall, and a 7x3 clear space
of floor.

I figure it's much better to do this every day [3] than to go on a workout
binge where I work out 2 hours at the gym on Monday, take Tuesday off, dread
going there for 1.5 hours on Wednesday, take Thursday off, take Friday off
because I'm still sore from Wednesday, take the weekend off because it's the
weekend, and then forget about working out again.

1\. [http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/05/09/the-
scientific-7-mi...](http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/05/09/the-
scientific-7-minute-workout/)

2\. [http://www.7-min.com/](http://www.7-min.com/)

3\. [http://dontbreakthechain.com/share/christiangenco/last-
four/...](http://dontbreakthechain.com/share/christiangenco/last-four/96970)

~~~
chocolate_
I was skeptical, but now I'm impressed. I just had a great 7-minute workout in
my clothes without leaving my living room. This will definitely become my
routine when I don't feel like going to the gym.

~~~
christiangenco
JOIN ME BROTHER! [http://dontbreakthechain.com](http://dontbreakthechain.com)

------
georgemcbay
My list would be more like --

How to Burn Out Programming:

1) Do it too much for too long while being under stress. The same way you burn
out doing anything.

2) See #1

I do agree with some of the points laid out in the post, but disagree with #2
and #4.

#2 ("Have a negative attitude toward everything") is a bad thing for team
morale and should be avoided but I don't believe it has anything to do with
burnout.

#4 ("Switch jobs often") assumes a very idealized world. The vast majority of
jobs are nothing like PhD programs and you have very little freedom to dig
deep into a problem unless the problem directly involves revenue generation.
I've had to quit a couple of jobs due to the fact that staying there
maintaining the same old code base without really expanding functionality or
otherwise flexing my "programming muscles" would have been what resulted in my
burnout. Part of my issue with this one might be the lack of definition for
"often". Obviously if you are switching jobs every 6 months to a year that's
not great, but the reality of many modern software companies is that keeping
good developers engaged with their job 3-5 or so years in requires very
enlightened management, which is rare now.

#4 also assumes that as developers it is naturally our goal to become managers
and directors. Personally I have zero interest in doing either of those jobs.
And I don't think good developers really have to try that hard to prove
themselves at new jobs, in my experience it is pretty obvious to other good
developers pretty quickly when someone else is good.

~~~
drtse4
The problem with #2 is that the author lists it as something that causes
burnout when instead is one of the likely results.

I agree about #4 and many of the things he lists are a bit subjective and for
some could be again result of being burnout. Your career stagnates even if you
persist remaining in the same useless place forever and sometime starting anew
somewhere else, on new problems, could at least temporarily help someone
suffering from burnout.

~~~
dwd
His points are really the symptoms of doing other things wrong and appear to
be mostly self-inflicted.

------
motters
I'd say the opposite about switching companies. If you want to make sure that
you have no new ideas and increasing tunnel vision with regard to other
aspects of life then stay in the same job for long periods of time doing the
same thing with the same tools, day in day out. Have no outside interests and
work long hours, putting your entire identity and energy into one
company/task/organisation/product, and that's a good recipe for burnout.

Also definitely don't exercise and always eat at your desk.

------
tluyben2
Burn out (and worse) victim here; took me almost 10 years to fully recover. I
would say not or too little exercise and caring too much (about everything,
like the tools you use, the language you use, what people think of you, about
deadlines) are the main causes I have seen in myself and others. The rest, If
you don't do the former, don't really matter too much IMHO. I like working
long hours still etc but I just don't really care about deadlines anymore for
instance. In 25 years working for client I have to meet the first one who
actually had a real deadline beyond that they would 'like' to have it done by
then. And yet that, combined with other things you care about as coder, almost
literally killed me.

The reality is that software is very complex and so are the humans thinking it
up; if they want working stuff in the end, things are done when they are done.
And they cost a lot and you are going to not like your the code you wrote
after you wrote it and there might be better tools etc. Who cares? Only you
unfortunately and if you let that go you'll have happy clients and you'll be
happy yourself.

------
DanielBMarkham
_" Switch jobs often"_

Er, no.

Let's look at the reasons he offers.

 _" Growing in the company (developer -> manager -> director)"_ Yes. You can
become master and commander of how to get along and make a good impression on
one bunch of people. Or you can learn from many. Guess which one is going to
help you once the company lays you off.

 _" Gaining an expertise in a specific area. Considering it takes 4-6 years
for a PhD student to get their PhD, that's a lot of time you need for
learnin."_ You become an expert in a technical field by using some piece of
tech in many different situations. In the vast majority of job-related
situations, whatever situation you've got, you've got. It ain't changing.

 _" You are having to start from scratch often. If you are a good developer,
you have to "prove" yourself (people listen to you) all over again."_ Starting
from scratch, proving your worth, _is a good thing_. We don't want people who
think they can rest on their laurels. Every now and then kick yourself in the
ass to see if you can still hack it -- before life does it for you.

A more interesting blog entry would be "How to work past burn-out" That is,
okay, fine, you've reached the end of your rope. You care about nothing,
you're cranky all the time, you're lethargic, and you're bitter. How do you
get up tomorrow morning and be happy while doing a good job without losing
your livelihood? Because that's where a lot of people are, not making lists of
things to do to avoid burnout.

------
dnautics
I posted a while back about this, but my belief is that burnout stems from a
repeated failure to be timely rewarded for effort that then results in
conditioning to avoid labor to prevent the negative prediction error.

Tips that don't address the root cause are fine but think about the mechanism.

~~~
duochrome
Make sense to me.

Then, burnout is a smart activity.

Burnout is protecting you!

------
benjaminwootton
I also think you can fall into a kind of reverse burnout.

If you work in a slow beauacratic environment with no stress, no
accountability, no change and no challenge then you really do start to notice
all of the same symptoms.

~~~
vog
_> reverse burnout_

This is also known as "boreout".

(However, I can't find evidence that "boreout" is a well-known word outside
Germany. So maybe it's just one of our many German inventions of pseudo-
english words.)

~~~
nbrosnahan
I'm gonna use it now. Question is, how do you find (and keep) a job that
navigates the extremely narrow path between burnout and boreout?

~~~
marcosdumay
Why do you think it's narrow?

(Question asked by somebody that got burnedout by trying to professionalise
side projects just after getting boredout by my job. I see a huge distance
between those.)

------
zxcvvcxz
"5\. Work long hours, ignore your life"

Anyone else getting sick of this false dichotomy of "long hours" and "having a
life"? What am I going to do with that life, visit new restaurants / collect
stamps / try new variations of yoga / go out to bars? Alright the last one
ain't so bad.

Seriously, if someone's in their 20s and want to work/program away while they
build their career, just shut up and let them. Maybe that's what they
_actually_ want to do over anything else. I know, it must suck for you family
guys / slower guys - let's face it, it's more competition because there are
people willing to do what you are not: forgo more leisure activities and
personal relationships. The point is, however, that this is not a sacrifice
for some people, but a preference.

But burnout is not due to "not having a life", it's due to ignoring your
physiology. It's due to "eating like a programmer", doing these stupid all-
night "hackathons", not exercising, not sleeping, and generally being a moron
with your health. I will also add that to avoid burnout, take care of your
psyche. Don't skip that 30 min coffee to catch-up with an old friend if it
will make you happy, for example. Social isolation creates physiological
consequences as well, which can contribute to burnout - but again, this isn't
true for everyone, and there's a wide spectrum of acceptable values which many
like to ignore.

~~~
falcolas
> [working long hours] is not a sacrifice for some people, but a preference.

Its easy to view as "not a sacrifice" now, but like everything else, you are
more likely than not to view it as a sacrifice later. Listen to those with
more experience than you; I personally wish I had, and I'm trying to make up
for it now.

> But burnout is not due to "not having a life", it's due to ignoring your
> physiology

I disagree that burnout is primarily physiological, it's much more a mental
ailment - a state of mind that is exceptionally hard to break out of. Not
having any other buffer than more work to engage your mind with will very
quickly cause you to burn out.

------
shanemhansen
I could be wrong, but rcklmbr and I probably hit burnout at the same time at
the same company. Some of the lies I told myself/was told:

Lie 1. The technology doesn't matter. All languages sucks and are turing
complete anyways. Who cares if it's in perl or enterprise java? Does my
happiness really depend on writing python?

Lie 2. The technology does matter. If I'm working on a Social-Mobile-Location
startup using python with free reign over technology I'll be in developer
bliss right? Wait, maybe if it's all go and protocol buffers I'll be giddy
with joy. Frankly the difference between new and old technology is usually the
choosing between decades old tech and decades old tech. (Oh, you're using
epoll/select/kqueue? The 1980's called, they want their tech back)
(Javascript? The 1990's called, it's for you) Heaven forbid you go talk to
startup folks with your 90's programming language called Java.

Lie 3. (From PHB) "while long term overtime doesn't scale, it's a great tool
to boost productivity in the short term during crunch time, after all a
startup is defined as a way to cram 10 years of life experience into one"

So here's what I believe to be the truth, for me, so far.

1\. Burn out takes longer than you'd ever imagine to recover from. After a
certain point you just don't care if the fire alarm is going off and the
building's burning down because it's _always_ burning down. Once you leave
that situation/job, it's hard to shake that mentality.

2\. New technologies, platforms, and protocols are fun. Learning is fun. I
don't mind writing my own libraries because it helps scratch that itch of
always wanting to know how things work just one level deeper.

3\. People matter exponentially more than anything else. It's not just working
with smart people. I've worked with lots of smart people with the emotional IQ
of a poorly trained Rottweiler. The best engineers I've ever worked with are
usually people who've made the decision that engineering is not the most
important thing in their life. They've also discovered Lie #2 and so are a
little bit less dogmatic. "Oh you want to send binary encoded messages over
UDP to collect statistics, I remember when we did that with ASN1. Here's a
nickel kid, go get yourself a real protocol".

------
jcagalawan
Now how about an article on how to recover from burn out, doing nothing all
day for a couple months doesn't seem to be working out.

~~~
SomeCallMeTim
Ouch.

My theory is that it's related to ego depletion. [1]

If that's correct, you should find things that you want to do, and do them.
_Start small._ And do your best to not focus on the burnout; focus on what you
can enjoy about what you _are_ doing. Look for little victories; I'm convinced
that accomplishing things, _anything_ , can help recharge you.

I also think social connections can recharge you. Not the kind on Facebook,
but the face-to-face kind. Facebook is particularly poisonous because, for the
most part, everyone ends up trying to paint a perfect picture of their lives,
leaving out most of the down parts. The contrast can make you feel worse.

It's also valuable to have a doctor run a standard battery of tests. It might
be that you're really low on some important vitamin or mineral. Or that you
have high systemic inflammation, which is a cause of everything from heart
disease to cancer. (In which case you should eat more fish and/or flax oil.)

This is all (unfortunately) from personal experience (vitamin D was very low
when they tested me, for instance). I'm feeling like I'm just recovering from
burnout right now, in fact. Today was my first really good day in a long time,
and that despite working long hours yesterday to get a last feature in. :)

Good luck. Hope you can find your way back to happy living soon.

[1]
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ego_depletion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ego_depletion)

~~~
jcagalawan
It's just the contrast between the person I was not too long ago and the
person I am now makes it hard to believe that they're the same person.

When I think of the kid who used to tinker around with computers and
electronics, I always see him as another person. There's no way that guy would
ever find learning a new programming language boring, or find it difficult to
get out of bed for classes he was really excited about.

I appreciate the post and will try some of the stuff you suggested out. Glad
to hear you had your first really good day! This isn't the first time I've
felt stuck in a rut and I know how great it is to feel that way. :)

------
mcv
Point 4 is wrong. It says that by switching jobs often, your career stagnates.
Quite often the opposite is true; switching gives you an opportunity to grow,
take on new responsibilities that you don't get at your old place, learn and
compare different ways of doing things, etc.

I've had lots of great jobs where I had a great time and learned a lot, but at
every single one, leaving was one of my best decisions there. Now that I'm a
freelancer, I switch a lot more, and I notice a comparable increase in the
rate at which I'm learning and growing.

------
brianpgordon
> "You don't have to work a lot of hours, but some people choose to." You want
> to impress your boss. Hell, you want to impress yourself. So you go die-hard
> to meet an impossible deadline. You delivered the project on time, with all
> the extra features you wanted. You are the hero. High fives all around. And
> if you're lucky, you'll get that bonus.

This makes me cringe. If you're a developer, it's your manager's job to assign
tasks which can be completed on a reasonable schedule, and to adjust
stakeholder expectations if they don't turn out to be achievable on time. If
you're facing an impossible deadline, that means that your boss hasn't done
their job. It's not your responsibility to dig them out.

And if you _do_ pull through and somehow finish on time, all you've conveyed
to your manager is that the status quo is working. You've demonstrated that
they can move up deadlines in order to get more work out of you without paying
you for it. If your team is understaffed, they can save money by leaving it
understaffed. Soft deadlines (the boss has a meeting on Thursday and it would
be a feather in their cap to have a feature working by then) turn into hard
deadlines when they learn that developers don't push back.

------
bad_user
> " _4\. Switch jobs often_ "

This is true, but the other extreme is also true - being too loyal, stuck in a
soul sucking boring job dominated by internal fights and politics, can also
lead to burnout. Sometimes it gets tough to find work you enjoy doing.

> " _5\. Work long hours, ignore your life_ "

This should be the number one reason for burnout. I think it happens most
often with young developers in their twenties that don't have a family to get
back to at the end of the day. Personally I now have a wife and a 3 year old
son and I'm always happy to return home at the end of the day or to engage in
various activities over the weekend. And because I do that, I enjoy most
Mondays.

Of course, we are software developers, we like what we do, many times we want
to work outside regular hours. But personally I have a general rule that I
always apply -> I never work overtime or on weekends, unless I'm in the mood
for it or if there's an extreme emergency. Therefore, I never cared when some
manager or client told me that the deadline is probably going to be late, so
maybe we should pull longer hours. When asked, I always say "No, sorry". My
overtime is for things that bring me pleasure - implementing a cool feature
that I wanted, or learning something new, or implementing something reusable
and pushing it on GitHub ... you know, works of love.

There's a tremendous difference between working overtime because you're in the
mood for it versus because you have to.

Also missing from the list:

> " _6\. Be dishonest, never ask for help_

I've decided some time ago that I should always be honest with my colleagues,
managers or clients. In my language we've got an expression that more or less
means wasting time - "rubbing the mint". Sometimes I rub the mint - and in
scrums and daily meetings, I now feel no shame in admitting that the other day
I did basically nothing. I also recognize when I'm having problems, like when
I'm not understanding a concept well enough or when I can't find the root
cause of a problem and do ask for help ... though, because of the ego-tripping
or other reasons, this is something that's often difficult to do.

It does help being honest and nobody is bothered when you admit that you were
lazy the other day or that you're having problems, because everybody have the
same issues in their job, even if they don't admit it.

Being honest and recognizing your own flaws helps with not feeling guilty. If
you're lying to your peers that you got work done, that you're close to
solving the problem, etc... that's accumulating debt that you have to pay in
the days that follow and it can lead to a snowball effect.

~~~
girvo
Being honest is something I highly recommend. Of course, there will be
friction: a lot of people seem to be intimidated by it, but it's worth it.
You'll find those people who appreciate and practice up unconditional honesty,
and you'll be a lot happier in your work, home, and love life. Great tip.

------
watchout
[http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2009/10/07/the-gervais-
principle-o...](http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2009/10/07/the-gervais-principle-or-
the-office-according-to-the-office/)

MacLeod’s Loser layer had me puzzled for a long time, because I was
interpreting it in cultural terms: the kind of person you call a “loser.”
While some may be losers in that sense too, they are primarily losers in the
economic sense: those who have, for various reasons, made (or been forced to
make) a bad economic bargain. They’ve given up some potential for long-term
economic liberty (as capitalists) for short-term economic stability. Traded
freedom for a paycheck in short. They actually produce, but are not
compensated in proportion to the value they create (since their compensation
is set by Sociopaths operating under conditions of serious moral hazard). They
mortgage their lives away, and hope to die before their money runs out.

------
thkim
Also worthy to note, some neurologists believe that burn out may be a result
of effort and reward imbalance, more so than physical drain. I believe this is
known as effort reward imbalance theory.

~~~
collyw
Does that fall under neurology? - it sounds more like psychology to me.

------
Fuxy
That's why I never deliver on time for unreasonable deadlines. If you do it
once people will expect it all the time from then on.

If you don't like it fire me i value my sanity more then i do your
unreasonable deadline.

P.S. I never bother to impress anybody I do what i do for myself it that's
impressive to you great if not that's ok too.

------
pcl
_Growing in the company (developer - > manager -> director)_

One of the great things about Cisco (my current employer) is that there's a
really strong technical career path that doesn't force engineers into the
management hierarchy. I hope that this becomes more common at tech companies
as time goes on.

~~~
yardie
As much as I like to shit on Cisco and the price on their devices, according
to the engineers I've spoken to, they have a great work-life balance. As far
as big companies go it's one of the few I wouldn't mind working for.

------
acron0
Number 4 worries me. What's considered to be "too short" a time period between
jobs? I was at my previous job 18 months - I'd say a bit 'too short'. I've
been at my current job 3 years. Is that 'too short' to think about moving on
because I'm bored?

~~~
mcv
To me, 4 years is too long. 2 years is probably perfect for a salaried job.
6-12 months for a freelance contract.

But this can be totally different for other people.

~~~
collyw
The think is, for any type of maintenance programming on a large system, it
takes 6 months to get up to speed and be properly productive in my experience.

------
ChuckMcM
So true, so true.

As someone's manager I want them to know that these things are NOT roads to
"success." Not everyone though has the makeup or fortitude to tell their boss
no, and bosses who take advantage of that are a real problem. What is worse is
someone who was so talented and now they are worthless because they can't find
any motivation to do anything. Its like being so sore from exercising that you
can't walk, and if you can't walk you can't work the lactic acid out of your
muscles and you're going to be incapacitated for a lot longer.

~~~
lewaldman
IMHO the main cause of burnout are managers.

A manager must act as a shield for the people under them and not as a whip
from the upper managemnt (Like a lot of them do, my current one included).

------
sakri
_Challenge yourself a little bit in doing something you didn 't think you
could. Show it to everyone you know, and don't just ask for feedback, but brag
about what you've done._

This did something for me. I'm recovering from a dark place. I recently joined
codepen and as superficial and lame as it sounds, every "like" and "view" is
like a dose of anti-depressant :)
[http://codepen.io/sakri/popular](http://codepen.io/sakri/popular)

------
noname123
Not off topic but looking for people who have a different approach towards
coding and life,

> Growing in the company (developer -> manager -> director)

I recently realized that I really don't want to be a manager or director. Nor
do I have the interest in becoming the consultant or startup route. For me,
the coolest to do is to contribute to open source projects, lean programming
languages/Linux Kernel/Bioinformatics/ML etc. for fun; I'd love to find the
right balance of doing either menial work or mindless web dev work without
being too taxing to fund my own personal interests; and am willing to be
basically work at an livable income (40K in a big metro).

Recently a gentleman mentioned on a thread that he is doing indie game
development while working at a Target warehouse. I'd love to hear people who
are have gone down this route or have the same mindset. Do you guys work say
half a year doing consulting and half a year on your own stuff? Or do you guys
work at a menial job and work on your free mental capacities after work. Or do
you work at a menial web dev job or at a company that offers "summer hours" (4
day 10-hour weeks) or flex-time and work on cool stuff after work. Would love
to hear some of your thoughts and journey should you have gone down this path.

~~~
rgbrgb
You can definitely get paid to do the open source stuff you think is cool.
Getting a day job to pay for your night job seems like a recipe for disaster.

------
romaniv
_2\. Have a negative attitude toward everything._

People who pretend to think that you can simply willfully infuse yourself with
positivity annoy me.

Negativity is how individuals react to certain environments. You can change
some features in the environment and fix that, but simply demanding everyone
to be positive is stupid. It's essentially a demand for suffering in silence.

~~~
civilian
Yes, some negativity will always come up. But I've known people who have a
miserable attitude about everything, or far too frequently, and as a
disproportionate response to their environment. It's like they wake up and say
"I want to be a crummy person today".

I was working data-validation at a big tech company, and the data-validation
tool was under active development. It'd crash ~20 times in an 8 hour workday.
I would happily restart my Tool and get back into it, but other people would
huff and puff and rant. And it's like: What are you accomplishing with this
attitude?

Empathically speaking, maybe it's because they have a hard home life or had a
tough childhood. But it's unprofessional and your negative energy affects me.
So I'll be the mirror you need and throw it all back in your face. :)

~~~
romaniv
_I was working data-validation at a big tech company, and the data-validation
tool was under active development. It 'd crash ~20 times in an 8 hour workday.
I would happily restart my Tool and get back into it, but other people would
huff and puff and rant. And it's like: What are you accomplishing with this
attitude?_

You're communicating to others that you don't consider an app that crashes 20
times a day an acceptable norm. The question is, does anyone listen?

Sure, there are things that are unchangeable and there is no point in
complaining about them. But if you have a positive attitude towards
cockroaches in your food (figuratively speaking), it's no longer positivity.
It's called not giving a fuck.

------
einhverfr
The interesting assumption here is that the programming is being done for
someone else.

I personally go through burnout cycles where I have to take a break for a few
days or (rarely) a few weeks. Most of the programming though that causes this
is programming I do for my own business, not for someone else (i.e. it's not
commissioned work). Part of the reason is that this has to fit between paid
work, and part of the reason is that these projects are far more interesting
and engrossing.

One of the things that does end up on both lists is the idea of pushing the
project to the expense of everything else in your consciousness. That leads to
thinking only about the project and ignoring one's own life (because even when
you are not working, you are planning to work).

------
pramodkdas
"4\. Switch jobs often" As someone has mentioned. the other extreme can also
be dangerous. A familiar style of working can also lead to burnout. What about
team burnouts.. have seen teams experiencing the same because of pressure from
the managers.

------
era86
Point #2, negativity, is one of the more surprising things I've had to deal
with. It leaks into your personal life, and nobody likes "that guy/girl" who
is critical and pessimistic about every little thing.

Great read, thanks for sharing!

------
thu
It is all about balance. For instance it is important to make parts of your
work fun and it is important to do the grunt work. It is important to learn
new things and it is important to recognize that at some point you have to use
what you already know even if it is not perfect. And so on...

Different persons have different ways to balance those conflicting needs. You
have to learn what you can sustain and try to not go too far.

------
lululemon
This post makes a lot of sense in a general context too I think. This is the
way I read it:

How not to burn out doing X:

1\. Don't obsess over X

2\. Stay positive!

3\. Learn new things, experiment

4\. Maintain a healthy life outside X (i.e dont obsess)

------
jbrooksuk
"our job is so find faults in our applications and fix them."

Spelling mistake, it should be "our job is to find faults..."

Oh the irony.

------
scotty79
Isn't "Do long enough things you dont like to do." enough to burn out?

~~~
marcosdumay
Not for me.

\- It's lacking intensity, more like "spend a big enough share of your day on
long enough thigs".

\- The "you don't like to do" part is not required (hell I burned out doing a
side project, in a new language, with an amazing framework - at least, I was
amazed, all th time untill burnout).

\- And it's missing something that I suspect is the "lack of rewards"
described on other posts.

~~~
scotty79
> The "you don't like to do" part is not required (hell I burned out doing a
> side project, in a new language, with an amazing framework - at least, I was
> amazed, all th time untill burnout)

Weren't you just tired? Same way that after few even amazing but long hikes
you don't feel like walking again for some time (weeks, months).

------
jgemedina
another good fact, IMHO, if we apply this doing sth we love, doesn't completly
feel like burning out.. does it?

~~~
cpncrunch
I think if you're doing something you really love, you are less likely to
suffer from burnout.

------
Elizer0x0309
Another passionate-less bloke, spreading the passionate-less gospel. Yay for
averageness and stagnating lazy stupidness!

~~~
cpncrunch
You sound like someone who has never experienced burnout...

~~~
Elizer0x0309
No.16 hrs work days. Sleep, exercise, eat extremely clean and healthy.
Code/Engineer all day and very successful.

------
michaelochurch
#4 seems to be generating a lot of controversy, because the reverse also leads
to burnout.

First, if you expect every job to last 5+ years, you'll often make suboptimal
choices when it comes to balancing your own needs vs. the stated corporate
objectives. Mistakes #1 (single-project myopia) and #5 (long hours, to the
detriment of the rest of one's life) occur when people lose the ability to
look outside their own jobs. If you have it in your mind that you absolutely
must stay with a company for the next 10 years, you're much more likely to
make those sorts of mistakes.

It's ideal that you get a good job and it lasts 5+ years, but you have to go
to work with the understanding that the world might change on you in an
instant.

What you need to do is focus _always_ on your career. Try to kick out as much
of your work to the open-source world as you can. Network before you need it.
You need to play so that if you lose your job tomorrow, you'll be OK. Because
you just might. It can happen to anyone at any time. If you plan your career
properly, though, the next job will be a step up. It's when you're constantly
moving around with no progress-- spending 6 months out of each year "on-
boarding" into parochial corporate knowledge instead of career-advancing
general knowledge-- that you'll burn out.

Leaving a job _stupidly_ is a mistake. If you're learning a lot and something
mildly annoys you, quitting in a huff is the wrong way to go. When you get
something good, hold on to it for as long as it lasts. But don't throw good
time after bad, either, because that will lead to burnout just as quickly.

The truth on all of these is that there are tradeoffs. Is it a good idea to
work long hours? If a month-long burst of 80-hour effort will buy you career
advancement that'd otherwise take 2 years, then suck it up and work. If it's
just going to get you more grunt work (which is usually the case) then blow it
off. Similarly, with job tenure, I think the poker player's maxim-- be very
selective, and very aggressive-- applies. Fold losing hands early, but when
you have cards (i.e. a job that's doing a lot for your career) then play it
hard.

------
kostyk
all true

