
Postal Crisis Ripples Across Nation as Election Looms - aaronbrethorst
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/15/us/post-office-vote-by-mail.html
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jrobn
Can't wait to see the "everything working as normal, nothing to see here"
comments. The hoax virus is a hoax until more and more people know someone
that died from it. Nothing wrong with the postal service until your grandma
dies or is hospitalized (and billed; either she pays all or you pay it-she is
probably on medicare) because her medicine didn't come for several weeks, or
the check sent in to pay your bill and you get late fees, and on and on the
excuses will come for this corruption.

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Judgmentality
> Can't wait to see the "everything working as normal, nothing to see here"
> comments.

This doesn't really contribute to the conversation other than to clarify how
defensive your position is before you even begin stating it.

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chrisbrandow
I’d like to see more reporting on the removal of sorting machines. I’m willing
to believe that there _could be_ an actual reason for doing this, such as
making room of package handling, since that is supposedly an increasing share
of mail.

But I certainly haven’t heard or seen any such defenses made.

This is such madness!

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Daishiman
Why do you allow yourself to believe an excuse when Trump has openly admitted
that he wants to steal an election?

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tuesdayrain
What? Citation very much needed.

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czzr
In an interview on Fox Business Network, Trump explicitly noted two funding
provisions that Democrats are seeking in a relief package that has stalled on
Capitol Hill. Without the additional money, he said, the Postal Service won't
have the resources to handle a flood of ballots from voters who are seeking to
avoid polling places during the coronavirus pandemic.

“If we don’t make a deal, that means they don’t get the money,” Trump told
host Maria Bartiromo on Thursday. “That means they can’t have universal mail-
in voting; they just can’t have it.”

[https://www.tampabay.com/florida-
politics/buzz/2020/08/14/tr...](https://www.tampabay.com/florida-
politics/buzz/2020/08/14/trump-admits-hes-blocking-postal-funding-to-stop-
mail-in-votes/)

~~~
sukilot
Agree or not, Trump's claim is that mail voting undermines integrity. And
whether he's theoretically correct or not, honest or not, the first evidence
from Paterson NJ showed that mail-in voting spoiled _every_ vote for council.
The number of ruined ballots was greater than the margin of victory. People
are calling it a "win" because some of the fraudsters (or misguided people
accidentally violating electionaw) were arrested, but that doesn't unspoil the
vote.

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tracer4201
I’m honestly baffled why people are against mail in voting. I moved to a new
city in 2014. Since then, I receive a ballot in the mail for every election
that pertains to me. They always also send a little booklet that has
information on each candidate and sort of their self published platform.
Because of that, I’m certainly now participating in even the local elections
that otherwise would fly under the radar... I mean I wouldn’t take time off
work for them probably.

It feels like voter suppression to me, especially since we know that a lot of
liberal leaning folks have “opinions” but don’t necessarily vote.

To be clear — I describe myself as moderate. I’m more fiscally conservative
but liberal on social issues.

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dingaling
> I’m honestly baffled why people are against mail in voting.

It's a system that is easily abused.

Traditionally, where I grew up, the problem with postal voting was voter
intimidation. Recipients would be told by 'community leaders' to bring their
ballot papers to a central location where they were completed en masse with
the 'correct' choices made and sent back.

Those who declined were physically assaulted.

Even on a less organised scale it is open to the 'head of household' telling
the others how to vote.

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sukilot
These are valid concerns. Group voting today is easy to combat with phone
cameras and social media, though. But on the third hard, all parts of the
political compass are showing that when crime becomes a national pastime, it's
impossible to stop most of it.

Head of household voting is a problem, especially with candidates with large
differences in support by gender in cohabitating couples.

But accessibility of polling centers is also a problem (for which the only
possible excuse is corruption. Trillions of dollars for war machine but almost
none for securing the democracy the war machine is supposed to be defending.)

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mac01021
I get how the USPS is pretty essential to the entire practice of mail-in
voting.

But, ignoring that one thing, I've always considered the value, to me, of the
USPS to be significantly less than zero.

I'm a little bit surprised that noone else ever seems to voice the same
opinion.

~~~
ohyes
Well, except the value isn't zero to you, even if you don't use it. It allows
a lot of basic government and corporate things to happen (taxes, payroll,
sending of legal documents). And it sets a baseline price for mail and package
sending services. Imagine being priced out of being able to mail something. I
agree junk-mail is a huge pain.

This argument is a lot like not owning a car or bike and claiming that roads
have zero value to you. Unless you're off the grid, then maybe this is
tenable, but if you're getting mail, you're probably not off the grid.

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AtlasBarfed
It's not a crisis if it was explicitly intended. The progenitors aren't even
denying it.

This is a conspiracy.

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Simulacra
There could be two sides to this. What if the postal service is doing this on
its own, without the President's interference? Slowing down service to show
how maybe they are not ready, need more investment, or to counter the
President?

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djmips
It seems like we've seen quotes directly from the president that go against
your hypothesis. The new director of the post office is a Trump appointee.

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sukilot
Not just a Trump appointee, but a significant fundraiser in Trump's campaign.

Also, to parent post the new Postmaster has refused to accept funding Congress
already gave it.

