
On Liberating My Smartwatch from Cloud Services - zdw
https://www.bunniestudios.com/blog/?p=5863
======
Shared404
> The point of open source is not to ritualistically compile our stuff from
> source. It’s the awareness that technology is not magic: that there is a
> trail of breadcrumbs any of us could follow to liberate our digital lives in
> case of a potential hostage situation. Should we so desire, open source
> empowers us to create and run our own essential tools and services.

This is the best phrasing of this concept that I remember having seen.

~~~
smichel17
Yes, FLOSS is about the _power dynamic_ between users and developers.

Proprietary software gives developers power over users. Typically, Developers
seek this power in order to extract money from users (sometimes in reasonable
amounts, other times not). Unfortunately, power is abused. By empowering users
with the _option_ to take control of their own technology, FLO software
provides strong protection against abuse -- developers need to weigh user-
hostile decisions against the possibility of a fork.

~~~
wtallis
I find it amusing to recall that Stallman's Free Software efforts were more or
less kicked off by frustration with crappy closed-source printer drivers. 40
years later, being subjected to abusive behavior from your printer has become
a near-universal experience.

~~~
josephg
When I worked on google wave, one of the most requested features was adding
print support (to allow users to print waves). Printing support is a super
simple feature (especially compared to "make it run faster on IE9"). But print
support didn't occur to us at google because was ... well, of course we didn't
think of it. Google (and most tech companies I imagine) work in paperless
offices. We almost never try to print things ourselves so we didn't think of
it or care.

I have a working theory that any software used by programmers will eventually
get excellent (or be replaced with something excellent). And everything else
stays vaguely mediocre.

Postgresql? Excellent. The tooling to allow non-programmers to edit data in
postgres? Halfbaked. Sound cancellation in macbooks for video calls?
Fantastic. The software bank tellers use? Garbage. Github? Fantastic. Github
equivalent for non programmers (eg people with folders full of Word docs)? 404
not found.

Anyway, the fact that modern printer drivers are garbage should come as no
surprise. Who amongst us cares enough to fix them? RMS was probably one of the
last competent programmers who will bother writing clean, minimal printer
drivers. I expect the world will become paperless before HP cleans up their
act.

I have the same problem at the moment with my Wacom tablet - the hardware is
great but the software is truly awful, and apparently it phones home
regularly. Software for artists is unfortunately off the golden path.

~~~
oever
> I have a working theory that any software used by programmers will
> eventually get excellent

Most programmers rarely using office suites and prefer to use plain text
editors. This has gone so far that developers prefer a sadistically under-
featured file-format (.md) to office files.

~~~
posguy
What you call underfeatured many would call correctly featured. A more complex
format doesn't add value for most use cases, while being harder to reason with
and correct issues in.

.md files avoid the copy paste font/size mess by being plain text and
rendering in the reader's choice of font. Bold, italics, hyperlinks and such
are all explicitly added, easy to Ctrl + F for and aren't hidden behind
finicky context menus as in standard word processors.

~~~
anoncake
Plain text formats do have advantages but Markdown is a pretty bad one.

------
zxcvgm
> A bunch of my paddling friends recommended I try Strava. [...]

> The bad news is as I tried to create an account on Strava, all sorts of
> warning bells went off. The website is full of dark patterns, and when I
> clicked to deny Strava access to my health-related data, I was met with this
> tricky series dialog boxes

I noticed that most apps on the App Store all seem to want you to create an
account. I get that that's how they primarily operate but I'm put off by it.

This might be a controversial opinion but I like that my runs with my Apple
Watch are recorded in iOS on-device, without needing to use any of these
third-party apps. And if you still want to share or even backup your runs, you
can use apps like HealthFit¹ or RunGap² to export FIT files that contain GPS
points and heart rate data, or export them directly via API to the service you
want. If you _really_ want to DIY, you can write some scripts that extract
them from the SQLite files in your iOS backups. But by default, everything is
local only and you have the choice to do whatever you want with the data.

[1]
[https://apps.apple.com/us/app/healthfit/id1202650514](https://apps.apple.com/us/app/healthfit/id1202650514)

[2] [https://www.rungap.com/](https://www.rungap.com/)

~~~
tinus_hn
There’s also open source apps that can do this (but you have to build them and
install using a developer certificate). It’s a shame though exporting workouts
to gpx is not possible using the built in apps.

------
andrewstuart
Aaron Christophel has a YouTube channel in which he shows how to replace the
firmware of P8 smartwatches with custom firmware, over the air.

If you like his work .... you could support him by subscribing to his channel
perhaps.

[https://www.youtube.com/user/12002230](https://www.youtube.com/user/12002230)

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vbPz3WWBuJ8](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vbPz3WWBuJ8)

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgjKaSETY8Y](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgjKaSETY8Y)

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4aFDjymXjOw](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4aFDjymXjOw)

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KGFwQUxhCxc](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KGFwQUxhCxc)

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rRqulnz1nJM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rRqulnz1nJM)

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gUVEz-
pxhgg](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gUVEz-pxhgg)

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c9KMUe6GVLw](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c9KMUe6GVLw)

~~~
ngcc_hk
Great channel and much more than smart watch.

------
walrus01
For anyone that's interested in doing this own visualization of .gpx files.
This is GPLv3 licensed:

[https://www.gpxsee.org/](https://www.gpxsee.org/)

If you have an old Android phone laying around that can run at least android
5/6, there's lots of good tracking applications that can run persistently and
create a .gpx file written to disk in a location of your choice under
/sdcard/. May not even be necessary to purchase a smart watch if you don't
want heart rate.

I recommend this one:
[https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.mendhak.gp...](https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.mendhak.gpslogger&hl=en_CA)

One of the things I particularly like about that app is that it's fully
configurable for how often you want it to get a GPS fix (has a direct impact
on battery life), what filename prefix to create and where to create it,
whether to create a new file every day or every session, and many other
toggles and knobs in the options.

~~~
lazyjeff
GPSLogger (the one walrus01 linked to) is a gem. I've been using it
continuously for 7 years. Not all location trackers are the same.

It lets you log with cell tower but fall back to GPS if the accuracy is poor.
Like walrus01 says, it's very configurable in how accurate you want it to be
versus battery usage, or if you want to optimize it some way (like not record
if it hasn't been moving).

While there were monthly crashes in the first two years I used it, the past 5
years it's been rock solid (running 24/7 with maybe one or two crashes for
basically 5 years). You don't want to discover that one day the app hasn't
been logging data for the past couple days. In comparison, the Android OS
probably crashes about once a month for me.

It can automatically upload to various cloud storage places (Dropbox, Google
Drive, but even FTP) so you can generate charts on a server with a script.

Truly open source, low battery usage, saves in multiple file formats, and the
developer is active on Github with issues. Making a background mobile app is
not easy because Android is constantly trying to reduce background battery
drain or background process spyware.

------
Abishek_Muthian
I've stopped wearing my WearOS watch and it now serves as a smart clock for
notifications on my desk[1] and fitbit or any other heart rate monitor(even
Apple watch) hurts me[2]. So even inexpensive smart watches with open-source
firmware (detailed below) where heart rate monitor can be disabled would serve
my needs going forward.

Shout out to couple of smartwatch projects, which falls inline with the ethos
of the author and anyone who agrees with it.

AsteroidOS[1] - open-source linux based smartwatch firmware. Nice UI/UX,
Wayland, good number of hardware support including MTK6580 chipset based
inexpensive watches. In my tests about a year back, although the watch with
AsteroidOS itself was usable, the sync with the android app was unreliable and
could be due to android itself or manufacturer's kill-policy.

PineTime[2] - $24.99, completely accessible, several RTOSes being built, Apps
in Rust,Python etc.

[1][https://twitter.com/heavyinfo/status/1281998220118249472](https://twitter.com/heavyinfo/status/1281998220118249472)

[2][https://abishekmuthian.com/my-experience-with-fitbit-
charge-...](https://abishekmuthian.com/my-experience-with-fitbit-charge-hr-
numbness-tingling-and-pain-fec85d41d165/)

[3][https://asteroidos.org/](https://asteroidos.org/)

[4][https://www.pine64.org/pinetime/](https://www.pine64.org/pinetime/)

~~~
Abishek_Muthian
Bangle.js - There seems to be another nRF52832 based open-source 'hackable'
watch albeit double the price of PineTime but aimed at JS developers[5]!

Has anyone got this?

[5][https://www.espruino.com/Bangle.js](https://www.espruino.com/Bangle.js)

~~~
dariosalvi78
I have one. It's really nice to develop on and has lots of sensors/features.
Dislikes: it's big, very big, and ugly, doesn't have an hardware step counter
and the step detection algorithm embedded in Espruino doesn't work at all, the
heart rate detection is OKish if you are still, but not very reliable either,
battery doesn't last very long probably because of Espruino not being very
careful at saving power. It's a fun device, but not great for more serious
use.

I hope that the community will improve the software issues and that they will
come up with a nicer hardware. Espruino on PineTime would be perfect.

~~~
Abishek_Muthian
Interesting, I didn't know Espruino (JS) smartwatch as USP has its takers.

It seems to ship directly from UK, Is it made completely in UK? So may be that
explains double the price than other nRF52832 watches.

>doesn't have an hardware step counter

Did you buy an earlier version? Buy page lists pedometer[1].

>Dislikes: it's big, very big, and ugly

Ah! Where tech forgets fashion again...Google Glass(Gulp).

[1][https://shop.espruino.com/banglejs](https://shop.espruino.com/banglejs)

~~~
dariosalvi78
The watch is made in China, but the software is made by them.

The page says there's a pedometer but if you look at the datasheet of the
accelerometer there isn't [1]. So it's computed in software (it's inside
Espruino) but it's really basic. I have proposed Gordon, the author, an open
source algorithm which I developed with some students (Oxford step counter),
and he seems interested, but it takes some time to integrate and calibrate so,
AFAIK, it's not there yet.

About the size, I don't really mind, it's quirky, but it definitely doesn't
follow the latest trends in terms of fashion...

[1]
[https://www.espruino.com/Bangle.js+Technical](https://www.espruino.com/Bangle.js+Technical)

------
huhtenberg
Hold on. So how does one go about _retrieving_ the data from a Garmin watch?

Garmin app's insistence on always needing a connection to their servers has
always been bothersome, but now that the servers are fubared, it turns out
that I can't even get the data off the tracker and onto an iPhone, because
that too somehow needs a server connection. Finding an alternative had
suddenly became a high priority task.

~~~
asimilator
My Fenix 5 shows up as a mass storage device when I plug in the usb cable to
my computer. You can pull .fit files off that, which contain everything the
watch records.

~~~
js2
The Fenix 6 and 945 only support MTP, not mass storage. For those you need a
third-party MTP client on macOS such as Android File Transfer.

[http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:zx-
iTg7...](http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:zx-
iTg7R5joJ:https://forums.garmin.com/sports-fitness/running-
multisport/f/forerunner-945/163453/please-add-usb-mass-storage-option-on-
fr945&hl=en&gl=us&strip=1&vwsrc=0)

------
FloatArtifact
This project is really interesting to liberate your smart watch.

[https://gadgetbridge.org/](https://gadgetbridge.org/)

~~~
mjsir911
And some forks with garmin devices:

\-
[https://github.com/mjsir911/gadgetbridge](https://github.com/mjsir911/gadgetbridge)
(mine)

\- [https://github.com/mormegil-cz/Gadgetbridge/tree/garmin-
wip](https://github.com/mormegil-cz/Gadgetbridge/tree/garmin-wip)

~~~
m-p-3
Just wondering, is the original Gadgetbridge repo not willing to accept code
to merge?

They're also on Matrix:
[https://matrix.to/#/!KlgIJeiotNGZkxSqRi:matrix.org](https://matrix.to/#/!KlgIJeiotNGZkxSqRi:matrix.org)

~~~
FloatArtifact
Nope

[https://codeberg.org/Freeyourgadget/Gadgetbridge/](https://codeberg.org/Freeyourgadget/Gadgetbridge/)

~~~
vanous
The main developer is very open to merging, so there must have been good
reasons to not merge - I presume either code quality or requirements for
network connection, which Gadgetbridge intentionally does not permit.

------
userbinator
_I’ve often said that if we convince ourselves that technology is magic, we
risk becoming hostages to it. Just recently, I had a brush with this fate, but
happily, I was saved by open source._

 _I was very pleased to discovered an open-source utility called gpsbabel
(thank you gpsbabel! I donated!) that can unpack Garmin’s semi-(?)proprietary
“.FIT” file format into the interoperable “.GPX” format._

...and how do you think that utility was created? They probably didn't have
access to Garmin's source code or documentation for the format. They just
"figured it out". Furthermore, whether that utility is open-source doesn't
seem to matter here: it's just doing a format conversion.

 _but it was mostly a matter of finding the right open-source pieces and
gluing them together with Python_

Replace "open-source" with "freely usable", and the author would've probably
been able to accomplish the same end-goal. Gluing together existing software,
treating the pieces as black boxes, doesn't show off any advantages of open-
source at all.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not against open-source; I'm just against this rising
glorification of it as somehow a be-all and end-all of software freedom. What
is worth praise, however, is the rising availability of freely usable
software.

To go back to the author's first point, the best way to not "convince
ourselves that technology is magic" is to start with a comprehensive low-level
education: Computers are just dumb machines executing sequences of
instructions, and in a non-hostile environment, you get to choose precisely
what instructions they execute.

~~~
makomk
I think FIT is actually a (somewhat) documented format that's used by a number
of non-Garmin devices as well, mostly GPS cycle computers. It's not really any
more non-standard than the Garmin extension to GPX being used for heart rate
after conversion. Probably a little harder to implement though, given that
it's a terse space-optimized binary format. (Though maybe not, since XML
namespaces seem to be involved.)

------
jordan801
For those wondering, I just accessed and parsed a .FIT file.

I plugged my watch's charging cable into a USB port on my Linux rig (works the
same for windows). Navigated to GARMIN. And immediately saw .FIT files.

To get to your activities, navigate to GARMIN->ACTIVITY. You should be able to
see when the files were created, so you can figure out which one you want to
view. Each is it's own activity.

Next you need a FIT file parser. I'm a NodeJS guy, so I did an NPM search and
found "fit-file-parser". I made a quick project, and wrote out the code
necessary.

In all of five minutes I had a JSON object with my run.

Maybe I should engineer a simple, single page HTML app to open, parse, and
render the statistics? I feel like when I get done Connect will be back online
and this will be an afterthought :P.

~~~
lightbulbjim
You might like GoldenCheetah.

------
ocdtrekkie
I took my Fitbit off when Google announced the acquisition. Kinda hoping
PineTime will be a good alternative when a more polished version becomes
available.

I still have my Fitbit data and even my old Google location history backed up.
I wish more projects focused on importing from takeouts of proprietary
services.

~~~
fouc
I hadn't heard about google's attempt to acquire fitbit. It doesn't sound like
it's gone through yet.

[https://www.theverge.com/2020/7/3/21312383/google-fibit-
acqu...](https://www.theverge.com/2020/7/3/21312383/google-fibit-acquisition-
antitrust-data-regulatory-eu-scrutiny)

------
Animats
Yes. The screenshots of the dark pattern dialogs from the "anal probe as a
service" site are great.

------
lsllc
As I take my daily runs through the woods (with my Garmin 935!) I have been
thinking about the near future and what a 2nd wave of COVID19 might bring.
What if we end up with a France/Spain/Italy style hard lockdown? Like troops
on the street type lockdown?, can't go out at all except to go directly to the
store, neighbors calling 911 on neighbors who go outside (which is how my
Italian friends tell me it was in Italy).

I could just go run in the woods in the dark, no-one would know right? And
it's highly unlikely I'd be seen at night (a Spanish friend of mine ended up
hiking several nights a week in the dark so he wouldn't be seen as he was
going stir crazy being trapped inside).

But my GPS data would be uploaded to the cloud! They would know! There would
be evidence, fed to the NSA! Would I hear their standard issue kicking in my
door!

Of course I could just leave the Garmin at home, but I like my GPS and stats.
So now I know how I can pull the data off watch, process it myself and remove
it before it can be synced!

Thank you!

/s (a little bit)

~~~
RandomBacon
Yesterday: We need backdoors for everyone's safety.

Tomorrow: We need everything to be cloud-only for everyone's safety.

------
tdhz77
I’ve been following bunnie since I was 11 years old in the days of the
original Xbox. I hope others know how important knowledge sharing is. For me,
I had no idea what was going on, but the fact that I could try to understand
it was enough for me. I’m now 32, and an engineer. I didn’t have money, but
this thing called Linux was free. Such great memories.

------
andrewcooke
if anyone is interested, i have a project that allows you to process and
visualize data from garmin devices (FIT files in general). it includes a
command (ch2 fit records <filename>) that dumps the contents of a file. it's
not got many users and is a little unpolished still, but recently i added
docker support which makes it easier to try out.

[https://github.com/andrewcooke/choochoo](https://github.com/andrewcooke/choochoo)

------
phillc73
I've not seen it mentioned yet in the discussion, but my preferred open source
tool for analysing Garmin FIT files is ActivityLog2[1]. Written in Racket, it
provides some very nice analysis tools for cycling, running and swimming.
Regularly updated and decent blog posts on different aspects by the author.

[1] [https://github.com/alex-hhh/ActivityLog2](https://github.com/alex-
hhh/ActivityLog2)

------
hdasika
"Since Garmin at least made money on the hardware, collecting my health data
is just icing on the cake; for Strava, my health data is the cake."

I dont see a difference between what Garmin and Strava do to your data.
Ultimately, Strava is trying to provide you some more insights using your
health data. It ultimately depends whether you want it or not. Isn't this the
same with all the services these days?

~~~
ogre_codes
I think what the author is trying to say here is that Garmin _has_ a way of
making money off them—selling hardware—and thus doesn't need to sell user data
as well. Strava has no way of monetizing outside of selling user data.

I'm not sure this is entirely true though, I've seen hardware companies sell
out their users for a few bucks. Likewise, Strava has ways to make money from
users—via Strava Premium services.

I have no idea how well these particular companies handle data specifically so
it's hard to say.

~~~
maxerickson
Strava turned off most of their free features and is now pretty much a
subscription service.

~~~
kingosticks
That's a massive exaggeration. They turned off some features. The free
offering is still very usable.

------
205guy
I'm a longtime user of hand-held GPS units for hiking and back-packing. Since
before the time of wireless connectivity and social sports portals, these
units have had USB cables and downloadable files--and fortunately still do.
Garmin provides the BaseCamp software, which is just a local viewer for the
files--admittedly, it doesn't have very good maps. But it has always had GPX
export and seeing your tracks in Google Earth is way more compelling. So you
get your own data on your own machine, and not on someone else's servers.

And this has been one of the reasons I haven't gone to smart-watches (the
other is accuracy in terrain). You have to have the app on your phone and pair
them together. Even if that workflow is still possible (as demonstrated by the
article, it is a fall-back), the default is to require cloud processing. I
don't want my tracks stored somewhere else, and even less so if there's a
chance of accidentally sharing them publicly. I guess I don't get the sports
stats (heart-rate, etc), but that's a small price to pay.

------
solarkraft
> The bad news is as I tried to create an account on Strava , all sorts of
> warning bells went off. The website is full of dark patterns ...

I'm glad I'm not the only one considering these warning signs, but also
puzzled why not _everybody_ thinks like that, especially with services that
could hold your data hostage. Is it a lack of education, lack of care or
careful risk/benefit analysis?

~~~
TeMPOraL
Lack of options - available, or known about. You learn about service X.
Services online are usually non-substitutable (you can't use Fitbit service
with Garmin watch, etc.), and often have network effects (all your runner
friends are on Strava). So what is a regular person going to do? The choice is
almost always binary: ignore the warning signs and sign up, or do without the
entire category of experience altogether.

------
PeterStuer
When I looked into quantified self IoT a few years back the monetization of
the data as the primary component of the business model was ubiquitous. There
was one kickstarter project for an open source wristband but it did not seem
to get traction.

Has this changed at all? I love the idea of measuring myself in various ways
but I want real-time and private access to my data.

------
dariosalvi78
So maybe people now realise they are buying services not devices. These
devices are locked, either you share your most intimate data with their
companies or they're unusable. Garmin is a bit of an exception here because
they at least allow you to get the data via USB.

~~~
submeta
But they are very restrictive with API access. You have to apply for a
developer access, and they won't give you any if you aren't a developer.

All the "modern" companies will give you an API access, a token and even API
wrapper code in many languages in an instant. Garmin is very old-school here.

~~~
dariosalvi78
Very old school indeed. In my job we tried to approach them. They have a very
interesting library that allows your app to connect to their devices and skip
their app. It's for research only. They kindly offered us to use it but when
we mentioned that our app was open source they pulled the offer. We tried to
explain that we could bundle their library in a proprietary module but they
didn't want to listen.

------
holri
There is a free hardware/software Smartwatch project:
[https://www.pine64.org/pinetime/](https://www.pine64.org/pinetime/)

------
j88439h84
Does this take data from the Garmin web API or directly from the watch
hardware, without uploading it to Garmin?

~~~
jordan801
It takes it directly from the .fit file on the watch, uses some software to
parse the file. You can get the .fit file on a windows machine by plugging the
watch into it and accessing it like a USB.

Not sure about linux, but I've heard Mac requires some third party software.

~~~
js2
No third party software needed on mac. The watch mounts as a mass storage
device then you just copy the fit files off of it. You may have to check the
watch settings and make sure that the USB setting is mass storage mode.

Edit: apparently some Garmin watches only support Media Transfer Protocol:

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Media_Transfer_Protocol](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Media_Transfer_Protocol)

[http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:zx-
iTg7...](http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:zx-
iTg7R5joJ:https://forums.garmin.com/sports-fitness/running-
multisport/f/forerunner-945/163453/please-add-usb-mass-storage-option-on-
fr945&hl=en&gl=us&strip=1&vwsrc=0)

For these you have to use an MTP client on macOS such as Android File
Transfer.

------
jacquesl
Thanks for this. It’s exactly what I’m interested in as I play with my Garmin
and kayak this summer! I loved Strava in the early days, but as it tries to be
a full social network, it’s lost much of its charm for me. I’m more interested
in routes and stats, than what some athlete is doing in Chamonix.

------
lightbulbjim
Cool, but you could also just use software such as GoldenCheetah or rubiTrack.

------
OnACoffeeBreak
For a list of various utilities that work with fitness trackers:
[https://www.dcrainmaker.com/tools](https://www.dcrainmaker.com/tools)

------
alex_duf
Anyone knows if it's possible to do something similar with a Fitbit? Basically
extracting the data without having to sync it with fitbit's servers?

~~~
andreashansen
If you have the Fitbit Ionic or Versa, you could develop your own watch app
and companion app, where the watch app will extract sensor data and websocket
it to the companion app, which in turn could pass the data to your own
backend/database. The API documentation is quite good from Fitbit.

------
dTal
>It’s exactly the data I need, in the format that I want; no more, and no
less. Plus, the output is a single html file that I can share directly with
nothing more than a simple link. No analytics, no cookies. Just the data I’ve
chosen to share with you.

I click the link and am presented with the familiar blank page of needs-
javascript. Oh dear. What has uBlock stopped this time?

* maxcdn.bootstrapcdn.com

* cdnjs.cloudflare.com

* rawcdn.githack.com (also a cookie from here)

* code.jquery.com

* cdn.jsdelivr.net

Not quite the "single html file, no analytics, no cookies" that was promised.

~~~
jordan801
They were referring to the output file their code produces... Not the .fit
parser.

~~~
dTal
The link I'm talking about is literally the hyperlink in the text "nothing
more than a simple link". It leads to a file titled
"speed-2020-07-21-16-10-44-map.html" which I assume is meant to be the output.

~~~
maxerickson
It's semantics.

The mapping tool outputs a single html file, _that relies on stuff from other
servers_. But all they have to deal with is the single file (if you view
source, the exercise data is stored in the file).

It's really not an interesting discussion. Maybe they could have used a better
description, but it's not confusing or particularly misleading.

~~~
dTal
I am not sure how "no cookies" used to describe a link which attempts to set a
cookie is anything except misleading.

------
j88439h84
Is it possible to get data off a Fitbit without uploading it to cloud?

~~~
krtkush
I don't think so, unfortunately.

------
montebicyclelo
I mentioned that I do this, with gpsbabel on the Garmin thread the other day,
but got downvoted. :(

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23926528](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23926528)

------
greesil
You could just buy a watch. It comes pre-liberated.

------
matsemann
The long unsubstantiated rant about Strava seemed unnecessary. It drowned the
interesting part about how one can do cool visualizations tailored to one's
own needs.

There are soo many ways to look st data. I use Garmin Connect, Training Peaks,
Strava, Elevate. They all have something the other misses. Making a something
myself tailored for me would be cool.

Edit: the reason I'm downplaying the attack on Strava, is that it doesn't
really know that much. It knows the explicit activities synced, and whatever
it can derive from that (where I live and work for instance). But Garmin,
Polar, Fitbit etc knows sooo much more. My pulse and movements during the
whole day which can be used to corroborate lots of stuff, when I sleep etc.

~~~
davegauer
I thought the Strava rant was appropriate in demonstrating that bunnie was
aware of and tried alternatives before he wrote his own software.

As for "unsubstatiated": part of it is _well_ substantiated: his screenshots
clearly demonstrate Strava's questionable interface choices. :-)

~~~
matsemann
As I've explained elsewhere here, uploading health data to Strava is the core
feature it's used for. Asking for that is not a dark pattern, as it's pretty
useless without..

