
WTF? I cannot cancel my NYTimes subscription online? - danielovichdk
I signed up online and they gladly accepted my credit card, but when I try to cancel my subscription, I am left with 3 choices:<p>Call us
Text us
Chat with customer care (which is btw busy at all times)<p>What kind of BS is that ?
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theculliganman
If you change your address to California to stay in compliance with state law,
it should present an option to cancel online. Unfortunately a lot of print
journalism websites are like this.

~~~
mc3
Data analyst: "Hmm interesting correlation, 50% of people unsubscribed had
moved to California".

They figure it out.

Later.

"Moving to California? We hope you enjoy the change in your life, and hope we
can help you celebrate by giving you a 50% discount for a 6 month prepaid
subscription, and we hope you stay with us and enjoy this great publication.
Thank you for your loyal support."

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BossHogg
This is so their "customer retention" department can run some scripts on you
to try to get you to stay. They will make you wait so I suggest doing the chat
and just keep typing "No thanks, I want to cancel."

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twapi
I noticed this too. So, I changed my payment option to Paypal, from credit
card. Paypal has option to cancel subscriptions from its user dashboard.
Cancelled from there.

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tickerticker
In cancelling my deceased brother's AT&T landline, I had to call the "customer
retention" line. Twice, 30+ minute wait in the queue. When I got through, the
CSR had MANY suggestions about why the line was still necessary. I had to
decline each one rather than have a fit saying CLOSE THE ACCOUNT. Abuse of
power.

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lxgr
It should definitely be as easy to unsubscribe as it is to subscribe (or at
least through the same mode, i.e. make it possible to cancel on the web if I
subscribed there). I think this is already mandatory in the EU.

The worst instance I've seen so far was some big streaming service (HBO or
Youtube TV, I don't remember unfortunately), which simply did not allow
unsubscribing from outside the US due to their entire site being geoblocked.

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bhaskargr
Same with Washington Post :( But at least they picked up my call and was able
to cancel. The online chat rep couldn't do it either. There's a rule by Visa
that states that if someone is able to subscribe to something online with
their card, they should be able to cancel, apparently the Post or Times are
not clued in? There's a class action lawsuit waiting, I will gladly join.

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Bubbadoo
Yes, this is the latest scam. I subscribed to the teaser trial for WSJ for an
introductory of $1.00 for the first month. The subsequent monthly fee
increased to $40. After three months and not really having time to read the
publication (a quality publication, btw), I decided to cancel my subscription.
Well you guessed it, easy to sign-up, hell to pay to cancel. You need to call
the 800-number, go through an extensive menu of options, finally talk to an
operator, who needs to transfer you to... yes you guessed it again, a
retention specialist. After three counter-offers (why didn't they just price
it at $9.99/month to begin with? ), I just kept saying "... please cancel my
subscription."

And yes, the counter offers got better and better until that $40/mo
subscription was down to $9.99. I may have kept it at that rate.

Seems like web services and publishers are all adopting this easy-to-sign-
up/hard-as-hell to drop strategy. It's the scamifying of America.

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tjpaudio
Same with WSJ, gym memberships, magazines, tv providers, cell phone
providers... Lots of things.

While, yes, it is annoying whenever companies do this, it is interesting to me
that OP's life has been insulary enough that this is shocking to them.

~~~
anitil
There was a gym chain in Australia call Fitness First that was kind of famous
for this BS. You had to go to 'head office' to cancel, then head office would
bounce you to your local gym etc etc.

It so severely damaged the brand that the company publicly apologized and
fixed it. But there's a glut of gyms so competition may have played it's part
- I'm a lot more likely to sign up for something if I know I can pull out
easily.

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ufmace
This is a dark pattern that's all too common on slightly sketchy small
businesses. Slightly disappointed, but not terribly surprised, to see that
it's also common in "mainstream" newspapers.

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floatingatoll
It's been like that for a decade. For whatever it's worth, your credit card
merchant can block them from issuing future charges. I found that to be
simpler than trying to deal with them to cancel.

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PaulHoule
It's notorious. If you call that phone number you will talk to a pushy
salesperson who will offer you a discounted subscription for a limited time.
It's like the way cable companies would send you to a "retention specialist" a
few years ago.

When the tide changes in Washington, look for a crackdown on subscription
services.

~~~
trilinearnz
I cancelled recently and was prepared for the hard sell by the support staff.
I was able to bypass it quite easily due to this, but they were quite abrupt
in their conversation style and essentially hung up on me after they
established that I really did want to cancel my sub:

Them: "OK so I am confirming that you wish to cancel your subscription and
don't wish to take advantage of the current low rate you are on."

Me: "Yes that's correct, although I did want to..."

\-- DIAL TONE --

Didn't have too much issue getting through to them on the phone (I am in NZ
though, so may well have called outside their peak hours).

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sp527
Your credit card provider might be happy to help you block further
transactions with NYT and this is the better path to take. If enough people
flag this behavior with their CC provider, it will eventually lead to
penalties imposed on the business.

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fredcy
It's the same with the WSJ. Just last week I wanted to cancel the paper
delivery and get online access only. Even to do only that required a phone
call; not even a chat option was available.

~~~
YourMatt
I loved WSJ online, but I had to temporarily cancel while cutting down on
spending a while back. Their cancellation process left a bad taste in my
mouth, and I decided to not restart my subscription when I was ready.

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sarcasmatwork
[https://myaccount.nytimes.com/cancel](https://myaccount.nytimes.com/cancel)

Same options when you login?

Why not just do it thru chat? Might be the easiest option.

~~~
convolvatron
has been on my list for a while...so I just went through this. Juan was
clearly multiplexing a few conversations with some macros just so I dropped in
every once and a while to see if it was my turn. he asked why, made two
special offers, and then said 'ok, I understand, thanks for being nice'

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warmfuzzykitten
I don't know. I guess the most productive thing you can do, instead of texting
the times or using the other two methods they provide, is complain about it on
Hacker News. That will surely bring about the desired one-click cancellation.

Then you can go to work on "WSJ, gym memberships, magazines, tv providers,
cell phone providers..." (tjpaudio)

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sixhobbits
If you actually want the subscription and are slightly stingy, this is also a
good way to get a vastly reduced price. The people they make you phone to try
get you to stay offer very different deals to what they display on pricing
page.

Definitely a really dark pattern though, and should be regulated against.

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nojvek
Yeah I experienced this too. It took me a month to cancel my subscription. Had
to call several times. They said they’d do it, but I still got a bill next
month.

Signup is a breeze online. Cancelling is almost impossible.

Seriously fuck NY times. Such a bad experience, I don’t want to get any news
subscriptions.

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akeck
Send a certified letter.

[https://www.kalzumeus.com/2017/09/09/identity-theft-
credit-r...](https://www.kalzumeus.com/2017/09/09/identity-theft-credit-
reports/)

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joegreen
I was surprised that they didn't implement a "cancel" button too. Probably a
strategy to discourage people from cancelling. I've managed to cancel using a
chat though and it wasn't that bad.

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garrickvanburen
In a previous life, I did some consulting for newspapers and used difficulty
of cancelling as an example of how they’re out-of-touch w/ customers
expectations of a modern, subscription-based organization.

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bubblethink
BoA used to have temp card numbers that they killed recently since, I think,
they didn't want to move the site from flash to html5. It was a great feature.

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smoyer
Use [https://privacy.com/gog](https://privacy.com/gog) for a discount on one-
time user credit cards.

~~~
gitgud
Cancelling the linked credit card is a great idea, via a one time card, but
it's not a clean solution.

I remember reading there could be legal implications for this, as the card
will bounce and you're still in their contract etc.

~~~
ac29
If you don't formally cancel the subscription, they're probably within their
rights to continue to bill you and send it to debt collections at some point -
could be years of charges stacked up by then.

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fortran77
I just had this with "Malwarebytes" despite the fact that both I and they are
in California and this goes against California law.

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_bxg1
I've had ISPs do this too. As other commenters have said, it's a slimy tactic
to give them one last chance to talk you out of it.

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sergiotapia
Protip for these phone calls is to just say you're moving out of the country.
Directtv instantly let me cancel without any fuss

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supersrdjan
Economist also makes it very hard to unsubscribe.

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dmode
This should be illegal for CA subscribers, but I still don't see the option to
cancel. How do I raise this with regulators ?

~~~
compscistd
Is your billing address California, IP access from California, or both? I
heard Cali subscribers _do_ have the ability to cancel, but not sure what the
access method is.

I have no doubt in my mind that mildly increased barriers to unsubscribe will
increase retention. People are lazy, and if you want to end your subscription
but the options are “call a number/write an email” vs “read an article
(justify your subscription)”/“ignore the problem”, then enough of a subset
will stay subscribed to make this a valid business decision.

If this makes some subscribers angry, it’s an indication that they were going
to subscribe anyway so why care?

The only path forward is the California route (widespread explicit regulation)

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Macha
This is why I've never signed up for the NYT (or others that have similar
asymmetry)

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subsaharancoder
One more reason not to partake of the dumpster fire that is the NY Times..

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wmeredith
Blue Apron does the same thing. You have to email them.

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xwowsersx
Same for my WSJ article. It feels abusive honestly.

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masonic
"Frugality dies in darkness."

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bynkman
That's one heck of a dark pattern.

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dntbnmpls
Subscription services are "strangely" like that. You call and choose the
option to subscribe, someone picks up instantly. You choose the option to
cancel, you get a few rings before you get an automated message telling you
their operators are busy. The same thing with chat. If you were trying to sign
up for the NYTimes, I doubt the chat service would be busy. I sometimes choose
the "sign up" option and ask the operator I want to cancel my subscription. 9
out of 10 times, they'll say we can't do that here and transfer you to the
cancellation department where you have to wait. But 1 out of 10 times, the
"sign up" operator takes your account info and cancels it for you.

Of course it's all part of their shady customer retention practice. Hope their
customers get frustrated and give up trying to cancel.

Subscription services are like STDs. Better not to get it in the first place
than trying to get rid of it later on.

