
Adblock buying ads to advertise Adblock - makeshifthoop
http://thenextweb.com/insider/2013/08/24/web-ad-killer-adblock-launches-crowdfunding-initiative-to-finance-an-internet-ad-campaign/?
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dm2
How likely would advertisers be to refuse to allow the Adblock ads?

I don't really have a problem with ads on websites, experienced users can
easily block them, but I see no problem with providing ads for a free service.

Many organizations only have three methods to generate revenue, either show
advertisements, have paid memberships, or take donations. Google shows
advertisements, Apple has paid memberships, Wikipedia and Apache Foundation
take donations. All three are great companies, they just have different ways
to generate revenue. Many websites have no choice but to move towards an
advertisements method to remain operational,

Adblock is trying to destroy that method of revenue and the online advertising
market, it could destroy many great websites and companies that currently make
money from advertising. While I'm not a huge fan of ads, they do serve a
purpose, and destroying a harmless market such as online advertising without
replacing it or supplementing it somehow isn't good. Plus if Adblock is
actually successful and the online advertising industry collapses, then they
will be putting themselves out of business.

~~~
ErikHuisman
"Plus if Adblock is actually successful and the online advertising industry
collapses, then they will be putting themselves out of business."

Even worse. Some of these companies (not adblock) are asking protection money
from big advertisers to be whitelisted. Mafia style.

~~~
philliphaydon
A free service putting itself out of business...

Can someone explain to me how that works?

~~~
Kudos
> A free service putting itself out of business...

Are you suggesting a free service can't make enough money to operate a
business? Man, how am I getting away with not paying for that Wikipedia
subscription.

Adblock operates on donations and if it were to eliminate advertising, its
current product would become useless.

~~~
pjmlp
> Man, how am I getting away with not paying for that Wikipedia subscription.

Because other people pay for you.

------
joosters
To be effective, the adverts need to be the most obnoxious, loudest, gaudiest
and intrusive designs possible :)

For extra points, they should flaunt their privacy invading features, e.g.
follow you around on all the sites you visit, cheerfully reminding you about
the places you've been and how all the other advertisers are recording this
too.

------
lutusp
This initially sounds crazy and paradoxical, until you realize they'll surely
be able to reach people who haven't yet installed AdBlock.

~~~
notahacker
Yes, it's a good way for them to bombard people who aren't sufficiently
annoyed by ads to actually look for ways to block them with messages telling
them they should be. They already "empowered" people to choose an ad-free
internet by building the app; people that want it download it. Why exactly
_isn 't_ it equally obnoxious and irritating for AdBlock to follow everyone
else round the internet trying to change their behaviour? Or is their
rationale that _advertising serves the legitimate purpose of informing users
about choices they may not realize they have_?

Either way, I'm baffled by the whole exercise, and I have Adblock installed on
my primary browser.

Still, the Kickstarter campaign is a great guerilla ad for the Scouter app...

~~~
kamjam
Luckily for you then, since you already have AdBlock installed, you won't see
the adverts.

 _Or is their rationale that advertising serves the legitimate purpose of
informing users about choices they may not realize they have?_

Exactly. Believe or not, most people on HN are computer savvy. There are some
users who are not aware of AdBlock. Personally I have installed it on a number
of friends and family computers, and guess what, it has reduced the amount of
adware and malware they install.

~~~
lutusp
> Luckily for you then, since you already have AdBlock installed, you won't
> see the adverts.

Actually, AdBlock is making the new ad appear to those who have AdBlock
installed -- I just saw my AdBlock icon light up and, when clicked, display
this ad:

[http://i.imgur.com/Kwi9qmD.png](http://i.imgur.com/Kwi9qmD.png)

I don't think we're in Kansas any more, Dorothy.

~~~
kamjam
_Actually, AdBlock is making the new ad appear to those who have AdBlock
installed_

I saw the same thing, but that's not exactly the same thing as seeing ads,
they're not (AFAIK) only showing AdBlock ads... they're informing you of
something they are implementing in a hidden way.

If you really take offence to what they are doing then you (and not directed
at you per se) \- Uninstall AdBlock \- View ads on websites, maybe click on
them occasionally so click-through rates increase \- Install Adblock Plus,
because it's not the ad blocking that you are specifically against, just the
fact they are advertising

The point is, you have options, and they are presenting options to potential
users. This is how things work in a free-market economy. We're not living
under a totally facist regime just yet...

~~~
lutusp
> I saw the same thing, but that's not exactly the same thing as seeing ads,
> they're not (AFAIK) only showing AdBlock ads... they're informing you of
> something they are implementing in a hidden way.

I think it counts as an advertisement, and I'm not complaining, only
observing. I just thought there was more than a touch of irony in AdBlock
showing an ad within the AdBlock app.

> We're not living under a totally facist regime just yet...

Interesting comparison. A regime that forced us to watch ads could be
described as Fascist, as could one that blocked all ads regardless of people's
tastes. Anything that prevented free choice.

~~~
kamjam
I don't think the irony is missed on anyone, no doubt the AdBlock guys them
themselves... and the ability to watch or not watch ads is not the point I was
making. The point is we have a choice of whether to use or not use, either
Adblock, AdBlock plus, something else or nothing at all. But more so, the
general state of the web and the big brother on everything. It's a slippery
slope :)

~~~
lutusp
> But more so, the general state of the web and the big brother on everything.
> It's a slippery slope :)

I couldn't agree more. I was posting on Usenet before there was a Web, so I've
seen the entire sequence of events. Rather depressing overall. But it could be
worse -- we could be hunted down and killed for expressing dissent, for
protesting, for supporting unpopular causes. When I say this, I'm thinking of
this man:

[http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/narendra-dabholkar-
shot-d...](http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/narendra-dabholkar-shot-dead-
pune-pushing-law-against-superstition/1/300345.html)

This man, this doctor, was an activist against unscientific quackery. He
became too well-known and too effective, so his enemies hired a hit squad. And
this was in India, a country and people that revere democracy and free speech.

------
livestyle
Todd Garland from BSA chimes in - [http://toddgarland.com/where-adblock-
misses-the-mark.html](http://toddgarland.com/where-adblock-misses-the-
mark.html)

Take away quotes -- "Seems to me like this is nothing more than a half-thought
idea because they have nothing better to do and are jealous of AdBlock Plus
taking bribes from ad companies to "white-list" them from being blocked."

"Want to have a real impact on advertising AdBlock? Do something that puts
money in publisher bank accounts and gets advertisers results that's less
obtrusive than the current state of affairs. Be creative.

An ad-free internet is a desert."

(full disclosure I work at buysellads)

------
smegel
How dare they blight the web with hideous banner ads, I'm now going to go and
install....oh.

------
k_bx
I'd understand the use of adblock that only blocks annoying ads, like pop-ups
or animation / sound. But why would sane person block regular ads?

~~~
jkhaxxe
Because I'm paying for the bandwidth, and because I'm there for the content,
not the adverts, and because I can - it's my computer, I can decide what it
does.

~~~
ponyous
It's not your site, you cannot decide what it does. I mean really, blocking
regular ads won't get us anywhere.

It's like receiving free news every morning, but you have ordered a kid who
delivers them to cut out ads.

~~~
jkhaxxe
"It's like receiving free news every morning, but you have ordered a kid who
delivers them to cut out ads."

What's wrong with that? What laws is that breaking? I'm not even sure that's
breaking any social contract.

------
krichman
If they are successful I imagine they will end up as a Yelp-style legal
extortion business that is rent-seeking on advertisers.

------
cLeEOGPw
This makes a perfect sense actually. They want as much people as possible to
use the extension so that more advertisers are forced to pay to adblock itself
to allow the ads through. The ethics on the other hand on such a moves are
questionable, since it makes ordinary advertising either obsolete or makes
adblock the bottleneck of it's effectiveness.

~~~
opinali
Ethics? Ad blocking is facilitation of content stealing. Not one inch better
than, say, a torrent site where the vast majority of torrents are copyrighted
material.

~~~
sp332
_Unlicencesd_ copyrighted material. Most free software and free music/movies
are copyrighted, but they are licensed for distribution.

~~~
opinali
Agreed, that's what I meant of course but trying to simplify.

------
billadoid
A workaround to this would be self serving the ads, in combination with
dynamically named tags / divs etc.

Obfuscating would complicate things, but at least it'd be a workaround.

It's crazy that buySellAds hasn't taken advantage of this.

~~~
liotier
This arms race has already begun.

------
entropyneur
It's actually pretty trivial to detect AdBlock and make your site inaccessible
unless the user disables it. I've seen a couple sites doing that in the wild.
Sounds like a business opportunity...

~~~
Zoomla
I am sure they know about it... but they must have figured it isn't work
blocking them (this Adblock detection technique has been around for years).

------
colmvp
I'm interested in knowing how they'll message the ad campaign.

------
hrjet
Chalk that one as an example of irony.

(The other front page article today:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6274914](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6274914))

------
thewarrior
Coming from the other irony thread , is this an example of irony :P ?

------
petera
When you earnestly believe you can compensate for a lack of skill by doubling
your efforts, there's no end to what you can't do.

------
painki11er
I don't understand how ad-blocking is even legal. It's like stealing -
stealing content for free, IMHO there's no difference between stealing MP3s
and news or any other content. There's some kind of user agreement between
websites and its users - "you can use our site for free, but you have to watch
the ads". Adblock violates this agreement. The people responsible for this
should be in prison, they're thieves. And I'm pretty sure the time will come
they will.

~~~
uptown
If you choose not to read billboards displayed alongside highways, is that
also stealing?

~~~
Kudos
That's not exactly the same as the billboards effectively not existing for you
like with adblock. You still see absorb the advertisement passively.

~~~
ttt_
> _You still see absorb the advertisement passively._

Good thing I have control of my software and can opt out.

I'm already assaulted at the senses all day long in different forms. The whole
concept of advertising I find abhorrent. A service should only offer itself to
me when I want it, otherwise they are just imposing themselves and I will
dislike them for that.

Any way that I can opt-out of ads I will make use of.

Services that rely on just this business model should adapt or fail, simply.
If the service is relevant it will come again from a different source with a
more acceptable model.

