
A Drinking Glass That Can Prevent Sexual Assault - dsr12
http://www.core77.com/blog/object_culture/a_drinking_glass_that_can_prevent_sexual_assault_25343.asp
======
ColinWright
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6122049](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6122049)

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aswanson
_some 400,000 women are rendered unconscious and subsequently raped each year_

This is unbelievable. If this is true, and assuming most of the victims are
not repeat ones, it stands to reason that almost every woman that goes out
drinking for more than a few years will be raped. How can there be _that_ many
rapists out there?

~~~
citricsquid
The 400,000 figure does not seem to exist anywhere else online. Searching
"400,000" and "rape" returns no results regarding date rape, the closest
results I can find relate to the number of rape survivors in the Congo
(400,000). This wikipedia article on date rape suggests that roughly 2% of
date rape victims have been drugged, so if the 400,000 figure is to be
believed that means there are 20,000,000 date rape victims every year? That
seems... unbelievable! This figure seems to be pulled out of nowhere. Also
worth mentioining that the #1 date rape drug is... alcohol! This article
smells a lot like FUD.
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Date_rape_drug#Frequency_of_occ...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Date_rape_drug#Frequency_of_occurrence)

edit: and in the video the project creator claims over a million people are
victims every year, again no citation.

edit edit: found a study that claims 4% of rape victims had been drugged[1]
and according to RAINN there are ~200,000 rape victims every year[2]

[1]
[https://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles1/nij/grants/212000.pdf](https://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles1/nij/grants/212000.pdf)

[2] [http://www.rainn.org/get-information/statistics/frequency-
of...](http://www.rainn.org/get-information/statistics/frequency-of-sexual-
assault)

So assuming the RAINN figure is accurate and the study figure is accurate that
means there is ~10,000 drug involved date rapes per year.

~~~
reeses
I would not be surprised if a factor was mixed in for the "most rapes go
unreported, especially date rapes," estimates.[1] Given these figures, either
the 3% conviction rate or the 46% reporting rate, a person could take numbers
that may or may not already include these adjustments and apply the most
helpful. 10,000 x 33 = 330,000, might as well round up to 400k.[2]

I'm not saying that's what happened in this case, but abuse of confidence
intervals is an common problem, even among those with good intentions and
little idea that what they're doing is misleading.

[1] [http://www.rainn.org/get-information/statistics/reporting-
ra...](http://www.rainn.org/get-information/statistics/reporting-rates)

[2] This guy says 400k, but we know that less than half are ever reported, so
it's probably closer to a million. And so on.

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thecabinet
This would be great if drink spiking was an actual problem, but the
overwhelming evidence is that in most cases the victim simply drank too much
alcohol and then blamed their subsequent problems on their drink being spiked.
(Your drink being spiked also provides a socially acceptable excuse for being
out of control in a way that irresponsible alcohol consumption does not.)
Furthermore, better detection & prevention of drink spiking will only serve to
exacerbate this problem, as young women will have less reason to monitor their
alcohol consumption, safe in the knowledge that their drink won't aid in their
subsequent abuse.

The way to prevent substance-related rape is easy: (1) don't drink excessively
and (2) drink with somebody who will look out for you, preferably someone who
is sober.

~~~
Osmium
> The way to prevent substance-related rape is easy: (1) don't drink
> excessively and (2) drink with somebody who will look out for you,
> preferably someone who is sober.

Maybe some people _want_ to drink excessively (1) and with friends who also
want to drink (2). For that matter, if you want a really easy way to prevent
rape, why not just lock yourself alone in a room all day?

An excessive comparison, perhaps, but I think we shouldn't be so quick to
blame the victim here. The thing is, people should be able to drink
excessively on occasion if they want to without having to justify it. It's a
problem with society that needs to be fixed if they can't do that.

And whether you personally intended it or not, comments like "the overwhelming
evidence is that in most cases the victim simply drank too much alcohol and
then blamed their subsequent problems on their drink being spiked" are
misguided (victims, by definition, don't need to "blame" anything other than
their attacker). Also, citation needed.

~~~
dictum
Those glasses are a pragmatic solution to a moral problem, so there's not
point in discussing the moral problem, and your parent is presenting a
pragmatic (as depressing and curtailing to personal freedom as it is) solution
in counterpoint to the glasses.

The moral problem is _some people rape people who are intoxicated or who they
got drunk with the intent to rape_. The ideal, moral solution is _people stop
raping_. The number of people of who rape (EDIT: and the number of rape
episodes) should absolutely be reduced, but ending rape altogether isn't going
to happen in our lifetimes.

So, to reduce the number of rapes we can use things like the cups (which could
avoid intoxication by date rape drugs) but also try not to drink too much,
especially if you don't have someone to watch out for you.

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redthrowaway
Is spiking of drinks really that common? I've only ever seen GHB or Ketamine
used recreationally. I've never heard anyone say they'd been intentionally and
maliciously dosed, although I've seen people ingest by accident.

~~~
ntkachov
Does it matter if its common? If its something we can prevent, why not?

~~~
DanBC
Focussing attention on something scary but rare leads people into danger when
they ignore the much more common risk.

We know that people make mistakes when drunk, and we know that some people use
alcohol as a rape-drug. In England it's much more common for people to make
bad choices about sex when they're drunk than for a predator to deliberately
spike a drink with a drug.

Having a shot glass with whiskey in it and the label "safe" is just weird.

~~~
mdisraeli
Indeed. Most common thing to spike drinks with? More alcohol.

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jlmendezbonini
Ummm...why not create disposable (or reusable) testing strips or something
instead?. You can carry them in your wallet/purse and you don't have to rely
on the bar/club to buy new glassware.

~~~
SCdF
Because this is automatic, and doesn't require that inebriated people maintain
their own quality controls.

With a strip, ignoring the fact that it's a socially awkward thing to do, when
are you going to test your drink? Before you take every single drink? I know
people who have been drugged this way and they _swear_ they never left their
drink alone.

~~~
smithian
it would be simpler and more effective to integrate this technology into drink
straws and other paraphernalia. Bars will be hesitant to replace their entire
glassware supply.

~~~
SCdF
It _is_ in drink straws.

~~~
smithian
Sorry, where did you see that?

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LAMike
Cool tech, but what bar owner is going to buy these?

Assuming they cost more than regular glasses, why would you want to advertise
the fact that your glasses are Roofie-proof? That's a creepy precedent to set

~~~
vacri
I'm wondering how well it survives repeated steam-cleaning, and whether it
somehow indicated when it's aged too much.

~~~
reeses
I hadn't considered the extra-high heat used in bar-grade dishwashers. I was
thinking about how great a solvent alcohol is.

If these were single-use plastic glasses, I think that would be a best case
scenario, but then you're pretty much limited to ballgames.

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smegel
I remember an Australian study into drink spiking found that out of a pool of
women who claimed to have been drugged, not a single one actually showed
evidence of drugs other than alcohol. Now the definition of "drink spiking"
includes having extra spirits added to a regular drink, or maybe just drinking
too much.

A true urban legend that makes good headlines in a society prone to moral
panic (not to say it _never_ occurs, but the prevalence is grossly, hugely
distorted).

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mdisraeli
Security mindset time!

This invention is cool, but relies on either staff telling customers, or
customers all being informed. In the former case, it is unrealistic to expect
to staff to be able to carry this out at a busy bar, and weird stuff happening
to uneducated customers would only either freak them out, or make them go
"cool new glasses!".

In the case of customers being informed, I go and acquire a range of
interesting drugs that might have the desired effect, and test them until I
find one that isn't caught. Or, y'know, just go back to surprise extra alcohol
and a bit of social coercion when that alone isn't enough (discounting here
any extra kicks from the other effects of any drug on the victim).

~~~
vacri
People would pick it up over time. I think a more serious issue would be that
once these glasses entered the public's mindspace, people might expect that
their glassware has it when it doesn't, creating a false sense of security.

~~~
mdisraeli
Ooooh, nice addition! Also, surprise glass swap-out!

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mh-
that's certainly one of the more productive $50k projects I've seen
crowdfunded.

[http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/drug-rape-prevention-
drink...](http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/drug-rape-prevention-drinksavvy-
color-changing-drinkware)

