
How the Apple Store Lost Its Luster - tysone
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-05-07/apple-store-locations-reviews-show-customer-service-in-decline
======
oldjokes
I went in a few months to get a hardware thing fixed with an appointment set
and nobody helped me. I waited for like 10 minutes past by appointment time
and everyone was booked up. I tried pestering people but everyone was helping
someone else and asked me to wait for another associate.

Eventually I gave up and left the store. I'm sure their analytics never even
noticed me, their data says I just never showed up for the appointment. It's a
bad outcome, I sold the old half broken macbook and switched to a thinkpad.

I still think their phones are better than android, but mainly that's just
because I don't want anything that Google touches anywhere near me.

~~~
usaphp
> I sold the old half broken macbook and switched to a thinkpad

Di you switch to thinkpad just because of this service support issue? Because
I don’t think thinkpad is better in service dept

~~~
yulaow
Thiknpads are easily serviceable and Lenovo often just sends you a replacement
component if one on your laptop fails and you know how to replace it on your
own.

Apple instead is trying very hard to make everything not easily replaceable,
even the failing keyboard is hard to remove for a common user

~~~
StudentStuff
+1, I've benefited from Lenovo sending out parts before. If you want to swap
the part, they will happily mail you the part and send a link to their step by
step guide on how to swap said part.

------
bunderbunder
The absolute worst thing about going to the Apple store is figuring out how to
flag someone down if they're busy. For that reason alone, I've stopped
recommending Apple products to my older relatives. Once upon a time, the
dominant factor was that the walled garden allowed them to feel less
intimidated by their technology, which left them feeling like their devices
were vastly more capable, even when they technically had fewer features. Now,
the dominant factor is that, when they need help, they need the ability to
talk to a human, and Apple is no longer supplying easy access to humans,
they've put all the certified resellers who _did_ offer that service out of
business, and I personally do not scale. Best Buy and Microcenter, on the
other hand, still have a place right at the front of the store, next to the
entrance, where you can go get help from a human without having to make an
appointment on a cleanly-designed-to-the-point-of-being-confusing-for-many-
people website first.

I'm sure Apple believes they've streamlined things immensely by getting rid of
the whole "here's a place you can wait in line to do X" thing, but, like you
said, at least some of the benefit they're seeing is probably illusory,
because it leaves them with no great way to measure how long people have to
wait to talk to someone in the first place, or how many people are giving up
without ever successfully talking to someone. What they really need to do is
put a triage desk right by the entrance of every Apple store.

~~~
sandworm101
>> figuring out how to flag someone down if they're busy. For that reason
alone, I've stopped recommending Apple products to my older relatives.

Be cute. Wear cool clothes. Don't be old. Look like an "influencer" with a
million followers. The more you look like the people in the apple commercials
the faster they will get to you. Above all things, apple stores are image-
conscious. They are welcoming to people who fit the image they wish to portray
and shun those who do not.

Or, if you really want fast service, do the opposite. I wore my military
uniform to an apple store once (picking up a xmas present on my way home from
work). Despite the crowds I had a manager helping me within seconds. She was
very eager to get me helped and back out the door. Camo does clash with iPhone
white.

~~~
madengr
Funny that they should ignore the old fogies without influence, as they are
the ones that can most afford the Apple junk.

I’m pushing 50, and I don’t need a fucking loan to buy an iPhone.

~~~
ultrarunner
Yeah, no interest payments from you. Less profitable.

~~~
colejohnson66
When you lease to own to your phone through Apple with CitizenOne, there’s no
interest

~~~
ultrarunner
For 24 months, which means that there is a non-zero risk of interest. It also
appears to require insurance, precludes you from other offers, etc.

I suspect that these finance deals are still more expensive for the consumer
than paying in cash. After all, you’re receiving convince.

[0][https://www.apple.com/legal/sales-
support/iphoneupgrade_us/](https://www.apple.com/legal/sales-
support/iphoneupgrade_us/)

~~~
colejohnson66
It’s a lease to own, so after the 24 months, it’s yours and you don’t pay
anymore.

------
atonse
My biggest complaint about the Apple Store is the long wait times when your
computer breaks. You often have to wait for a few days to even get an
appointment.

But the award for the most asinine thing about the Apple Store is their
insistence on not having a proper area to pay for things. So people just
wander around wanting to buy something and not knowing where to pay for it.
And they end up wasting a lot more time that way.

~~~
GeekyBear
>The award for the most asinine thing about the Apple Store is their
insistence on not having a proper area to pay for things.

For small ticket items, you can scan, pay and leave without needing to
interact with the staff.

>Thanks to the Apple Store app, you can use your iPhone to scan the barcode of
an accessory off the shelf and use Apple Pay to pay for it. From there, you
can just walk out of the store with your new Apple accessory in hand.

[https://www.howtogeek.com/338754/how-to-buy-stuff-at-the-
app...](https://www.howtogeek.com/338754/how-to-buy-stuff-at-the-apple-store-
without-a-cashier/)

~~~
CaptainZapp
Well, yeah, thank you+) very much, I guess.

So same as with self scanning tills at supermarkets I'm now expected to do the
work for one of the most profitable companies in the world, since they can't
be bothered to have a proper checkout or hire enough people.

+) Not you, personally, obviously.

edit: reformat

~~~
tikkabhuna
Huh? Self checkouts are great! Rather than having 1 or 2 tills you can have
many times that manned by the same number of people. If you don't have any
alcohol you can use it without interacting with anyone at all and its much
faster.

That coupled with contactless payments make it super quick to buy just a few
items.

A "proper" checkout is still king for large shops but for people I know (late
20s), that is becoming less common for more frequent, smaller shopping trips.

Edit: I should say this is for someone based in London.

~~~
bobbiechen
>If you don't have any alcohol you can use it without interacting with anyone
at all and its much faster.

I agree that you can do it without interacting with anyone at all. But I
question whether it's faster.

For a class assignment on usability a while back, I observed self-checkout
users and manned ("proper") checkout at a local grocery store and found that
the absolute fastest of the self-checkout users were only just as fast (per
item) as the average manned checkout user (among 24 users).

 _A few factors increase the speed of manned transactions. First, cashiers are
familiar with common produce numbers, avoiding the need to search for stickers
or slowly look up the number of a particular item. Second, a cashier can begin
bagging items as the user pays by credit card or pulls out cash, so some of
the work is done in parallel. Third, sometimes manned checkouts have a person
dedicated to bagging, which reduces the time even further (though all times
recorded for this project are single cashiers without baggers)._

Self-checkouts definitely feel nicer for me (except when the anti-theft "place
item in bagging area" nagging starts). But now, when I'm in a hurry, I'll make
a beeline for a register with a cashier instead of the self-checkout.

~~~
sgustard
To me, the main advantage is that (at my local store) they implement a "wait
for the next available machine" protocol rather than "pick a cashier to queue
up behind."

------
derefr
I’ve also noticed the “it’s impossible to actually _buy_ anything” problem
with Apple Stores, especially in stores that get any appreciable amount of
foot traffic. (Where I live there is at least one Apple Store in a mall that
hardly anyone visits, and that one is just fine for service.)

However—and I’m not saying this as a defense, just as an interesting fact—at
one point when I was waiting around trying to get the attention of someone to
buy a stupid dongle, a staff member helpfully pointed out to me that I could
just buy the thing myself with the Apple Store app on my phone (i.e. point my
phone at the barcode on it, pay with card), and then walk out out of the store
with the item, having never interacted with a single store worker (except
perhaps implicitly with a plainclothes security guard who observed me doing
this self-checkout flow and so didn’t tackle me on the way out. I don’t think
your purchase is somehow remotely deactivating a magnetic anti-theft tag in
the product or anything, so they’ve got to be doing loss-prevention for this
flow the old-fashioned way.)

And while you can’t complete the entire purchase yourself for big-ticket items
(the kind they keep back in the warehouse section and would have to retrieve
for you), you can still do the “paying” part in advance of showing up at the
store, through the app—or _while_ you’re in the store, through the app—which
turns the process of “finding an employee who has time to both guide you
through SKU selection _and_ ring you up” into “getting the front-door
attendant to notify anyone with a spare moment that one of the devices already
in the ‘waiting for pickup’ pile in the back can be grabbed and brought out.”

Honestly, this seems like it has somehow secretly become the _primary_ flow
that Apple Stores _want_ to do [non-business-customer] purchases through, and
yet they don’t mention it anywhere. They should have big signs in the stores
telling you to buy things using your phone (and/or by using the store website
on any of the demo computers)!

~~~
itronitron
store pickup is very convenient, although Best Buy and Home Depot have an even
better service as you don't have to install an app or use Apple Pay

~~~
shadowfiend
Confused… [https://store.apple.com](https://store.apple.com) lets you buy
anything, pay any way you want, and pick it up at a store, no?

~~~
derefr
Right; the only unique thing about using the Apple Store app is that it lets
you scan UPC codes for small-purchase items when you’re already in the store,
allowing you to just pick something up and walk out with it. For large-
purchase items, it’s the same whether you use the app or the website.
(Although I _think_ that when you show up to a store where you have an item
waiting for you, and you have the app running, it does some kind of automatic
prompting or notification to staff or something.)

------
Spooky23
It's the same problem that they have with most of their products. All design
considerations are controlled by people driven exclusively by thin, light,
minimal. It's getting tired and cliche.

I don't live in a place big enough for an Apple forest grove or whatever. It's
an undersized store in a mall that was remodeled two years ago. The people who
designed it never were in such a store before. It's crowded, too loud, and
stripped of basic functions. The old version of the Apple store felt busy and
energized, the new ones are disorienting.

The old Apple store in the same retail space was much more functional. It had
a nice little kids corner with a lower table and fancy toadstool chairs. It
was a great way for kids to explore iMacs and iPads. Now purged as a lower
table isn't symmetrical enough. The training area is just a table in the
middle, and it's just not as pleasant -- people can't hear and leave.

Apple has a great thing going with people there though -- it's a real asset.
The staff are incredibly friendly, patient and helpful.

~~~
asdff
The sound thing is a real issue. The Apple store by my parents moved into a
larger and renovated space recently with double the height ceilings. It got
way louder, to the point where you can barely hear what the reps say to you.
I'd have a migraine every day if I had to work a whole shift in there.

It's the same problem in restaurants and bars that have this style of concrete
floors, hard walls, and exposed duct work ceilings: there is nothing to absorb
the sound. When people stripped drapes from windows, carpet from floors, and
coverings from ceilings, no one stopped to think why these sound absorbing
materials were used in the first place. You can fix this by spraying sound
insulating foam all over your beautiful exposed ceiling that no one looks at
because it's dusty and painted black and 20 feet in the air, but that's
clearly a cost that's already been calculated and cut.

As a result, you can't hear anyone at breakfast, brunch, lunch, dinner, the
bar, the gym, or even the Apple store.

------
dmart
Yes! The Genius Bar experience has been terrible (especially as a somewhat
socially anxious person) the past few times I've been there. A lot of sitting
while constantly busy employees buzzed around, unsure if I was waiting in the
right place, hoping someone would come by and ask what I there for.

It's like they're emulating the real bar experience, with a bunch of
overworked and inattentive bartenders. Just give me a dedicated line to pick
my stuff up.

~~~
beamatronic
Honestly I have felt many times that the Apple Store could use a vending
machine for iPhones. Anything that somebody might want to just grab and go no
matter how expensive.

~~~
rootusrootus
1000% agree. I don't always want someone to walk me through setting up my
iPhone. I've used them since the very first one, I don't need any help. Take
my money already and let me get out. Even just picking up a set of airpods for
my wife took far longer than it should have. A vending machine would be all
kinds of awesome, maybe like the ones Best Buy has at the airport (which sells
some Apple products like airpods, coincidentally...)

~~~
beamatronic
I had the opposite experience once at the Ala Moana store. Needing the 1/4 in.
headphone adapter (separate rant) I waited patiently, got someone’s attention,
and made my purchase. They kindly informed me that next time I should self-
service with the Apple app. Meaning I should have walked in, pulled item from
shelf, checked myself out, and walked out.

------
ben7799
For me the apple store has basically come to mean:

\- Very long lines/overcrowded store

\- It's all full of Apple Watches and stuff like that and trivial luxury
accessories

\- Not enough Macs anymore

\- None of the really cool displays they used to have like a Mac Pro set up
for music studio or video work complete with a camera or midi controller or
other instrument plugged in.

\- For some reason they always smell like BO. Either it's the employees or
customers they attract, there is something odd about the design of the store
that screws with HVAC, or they're not cleaning well. Very weird thing.

So yah, not much luster. Even when they introduce new products these days I
don't really want to go into the store and try them cause the experience is
bad enough it outweighs the interest to check out the new product.

It is weird cause they are such copycats but I think the MS stores are better
run now.

~~~
pram
I agree with your observations about the Apple store, but I wouldn't say the
MS stores are run better.

At the MS store you can get fast service, but thats mostly because it's empty.
The floor staff descends upon you like hungry vultures when you enter, and you
can't get rid of them. Thats what I've experienced at the Austin one anyway.

~~~
ben7799
Yah I can agree with that completely.

Mostly my observation is the way they run events and stuff seems very cool.

E.x. letting the kids come in and play Fortnite or do coding classes. Seems to
always be free.

Then they've got VR demos or XBoxes setup with car cockpits..

------
pwinnski
"Lost Its Luster" suggests we can point to a decline from peak. The basis for
the article? According to the subhead, "In interviews, current and former
employees..." Oh boy.

The article lays out the high: "As recently as 2017, the retail arm was
generating an estimated $5,500 in sales per square foot, easily outpacing
rivals. But that’s getting harder to pull off." And the low? Not specified.
That number could be higher or lower in 2019, we are not told.

It turns out that a company employing hundreds of thousands of people has some
disgruntled ex-employees who prefer the way things used to be. The writer
suggests that this is the fault of the woman who ran the retail division until
recently, not, say, monumental growth or a human propensity for empty
nostalgia.

I don't see any factual basis for the headlines anywhere in the article. Am I
missing it?

~~~
crsv
The By Line is from one of their main Apple analysts paired with a guy that
covers retail exclusively. Likely the story they're trying to play out is this
general downward trend in retail, but there's very little steak here. It reads
like a hit piece for someone with interest in the stock trading lower, rather
than the meaningful reporting of legitimate news here.

------
asdff
I'm disappointed with the lack of autonomy that the staff has in the Apple
Store. In any interaction with the genius staff, they go off the official
playbook to the point where it doesn't even make sense sometimes.

I have a macbook pro where I've replaced the disk drive with an SSD and boot
off of that. One day it stopped booting from that drive, so I brought it into
the genius bar to see if the drive was dead or if a ribbon cable failed.

After talking about the problem for a while, they finally took it to the back
and opened it up, and just as quickly returned it to me with a grave face.
They saw that the optical drive had been removed and the RAM upgraded to 16gb,
and because of their corporate policies, all they could do to a machine that's
been upgraded is button it back up and return it to the user. Never mind that
the problem with my macbook wasn't the drive or the cable, the drive had
wiggled out of its mount and was just loose in the case.

You could shake the laptop and hear it slapping around, and the geniuses
definitely would have noticed the loose drive as soon as they opened it like I
did when I returned home, but their policy was such that they couldn't even
tell me what they saw in there. Imagine if your local mechanic operated so
rigidly. Looking back at it, it was like a scene out of 1984 and I wouldn't
have been surprised if one of the geniuses slipped me a scrap of paper with
the words on it that they clearly weren't permitted to utter with an apple
lanyard around their neck ("reattach ssd to optibay").

~~~
ibeckermayer
Amazing. Somebody should write a “1984” centered around the sinister stew of
the marriage of corporate/government bureaucratic rot and authoritarianism
we’ve wound up in.

------
jasode
_> [Angela Ahrendts'] overhaul of the Genius Bar has been especially
controversial. Customers looking for technical advice or repairs must now
check in with an employee, who types their request into an iPad. Then when a
Genius is free, he or she must find the customer wherever they happen to be in
the store. Ahrendts was determined to get rid of lineups, but now the stores
are often crowded with people waiting for their iPhones to be fixed or
batteries swapped out. [...] Some employees speculate she’ll [Deirdre O’Brien]
bring back the original Genius Bar._

I don't see how the old _dedicated_ space for a Genius Bar would work better.
The problem is that the old way tied tech support to a spatial _location_ in
the store. The new way assigned tech support to a _person_ instead of a
location. This allows _any and every table_ in the store to become a temporary
"genius bar" for that customer session.

In theory, if you had a dedicated area for the Genius Bar, you'd hope it would
be free of crowds and be very inviting. An example photo showing open seats
ready for instant service for the next customer:
[https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/6a/Apple_Ge...](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/6a/Apple_Genius_Bar_Regentstreet_London.jpg)

But reality turns out differently. In the following photo, notice the long
lines crowding the back of the store at the Genius Bar:
[https://tr4.cbsistatic.com/hub/i/2006/10/03/fce299cc-c3bf-11...](https://tr4.cbsistatic.com/hub/i/2006/10/03/fce299cc-c3bf-11e2-bc00-02911874f8c8/apple_store_07.jpg)

If an Apple exec wants to bring back the dedicated area for the Genius Bar,
how does one avoid the logistical nightmare of those lines? You still have to
work within the same finite retail floor space.

I don't like the new Apple Stores but I do know I'd rather sit down at one of
the retail tables instead of stand in line at the old store layout.

~~~
jonlucc
One way is to make the check-in person more than a dumb data enterer. My
iPhone suddenly stopped getting any carrier signal one day. I took it to the
Apple store that evening because I needed to go out of town the next day, and
I had to have a working phone. I checked in at the front of the store and
waited 2.5 hours for my turn with a Genius. The fix was to press the very
specific "reset network settings button" (which isn't under Cellular settings,
it's under General->Reset). I was relieved it was such a simple fix, but it
was ridiculous to wait over 2 hours to press the right button. The check-in
person should ask what you've tried and do the most basic triage to avoid this
kind of problem congesting the store.

~~~
synlatexc
I can see how this division of work makes sense. Genius training is expensive,
and it's important to quickly check in customers. That said, I like your idea
of equipping these employees with a basic remedy or two. After inputting the
issue, the iPad could display a prompt with common self-solve solutions. The
trick is how the employee frames it. You don't want customers thinking it is
_the_ solution, as no diagnostics have been performed, nor do you want them
thinking less of Genius Bar if it does not work.

------
sombremesa
I went to buy a brand new laptop at the Apple Store, and despite knowing
exactly what I wanted I had to wait for at least 20 minutes - when I walked
in, I was told to wait until an associate was free (whereas in most stores I
could just grab a product off the shelf and go check out), then I was ping-
ponged around at least 2 other people (both of whom I had to wait for - 'just
hang around this area and we'll send someone over' \- they each spoke to me
for less than a minute once they knew I just wanted to buy a thing.

What a hassle. The only reason I went brick and mortar at all was because of a
promotion where you get a free headphone set, and I wanted to be sure to
receive it.

~~~
dangwu
What B&M store lets you freely grab a $2000+ laptop and bring it to checkout
on your own?

~~~
celticninja
In the UK, John Lewis, Curry's, PC world. At the least you can ask someone to
get one from the stock room for you and you can have it and be on your way
within 10 minutes. I bought my last laptop from John Lewis in about 5 mins of
entering the store.

~~~
smnscu
This comparison is almost not fair. I've recently moved back to the UK and
experienced John Lewis for the first time. Now I almost try to avoid buying
from Amazon if I can help it, I can't believe how good the shopping experience
is there. Also, they price match most online retailers if I
remember/understood correctly which is insane.

~~~
celticninja
Yeah and they do a great extended warranty as standard, the others I mention
will increase check out time to hassle you to buy their warranty. John Lewis
has it as standard and their returns is very customer focused

------
chadash
I live near an Apple store and frequent it every few months when I need to fix
a phone or laptop, or buy a dongle, etc.

The store near me gets lots of foot traffic, but the experience is just fine.
There are usually at least 2-3 employees who will come up and ask me how I'm
doing and what they can help with. Given the size of the store, the number of
employees is surprising actually. And it's as easy as ever to book
appointments, in my experience anyway.

I think what's changed is that the novelty has worn off. When Apple Stores
first became a thing, it was new and sexy. Now, they're everywhere and don't
have that wow factor, because it's become a feature of our lives that you go
there every so often if you want to try out, fix or buy an apple product in
person. And with the novelty factor gone, people find things to complain about
if their experience isn't _perfect_ , even though Apple's customer service is
still light years ahead of most anyone else [0].

[0] I say this as an Android and Lenovo X1 user. I personally prefer non-mac
products, but my wife has a Macbook Pro and an iPhone and I'm always jealous
that when things break, she can get them fixed right away, while I worry that
a fix will entail multiple unpleasant interactions with phone agents, followed
by a multi-week repair process.

EDIT: I want to add two ideas here in the hope that someone here finds them
helpful. When I make laptop purchases (for non-apple products), the first
place I look is Costco. They offered the Carbon X1 laptop with pretty good
specs (16gb RAM, i7 processor, 512GB SSD. Similar specs on the Dell XPS 13
that they sell) at a great price, with a 90 day, no questions asked return
policy and an extra year of warranty included in the already great price. Even
if you aren't a costco member, it's probably worth joining for this deal if
you are looking to get a Dell or Lenovo laptop. And in my experience, Costco
is very easy to deal with when problems arise.

A second idea is to buy using a Chase Sapphire Reserve credit card, which also
add a year on to the manufacturer's warranty. Usually, they require you to get
a quote from a repair shop and they will reimburse you. In some cases, they
will just replace the product straight up. And they are _fairly_ easy to work
with. This is the only card I use to make purchases that I know have a chance
of breaking.

~~~
davidy123
Lenovo's onsite service is inexpensive and, in my experience, excellent. I've
used it a few times over the years and it's involved minimal interaction with
helpful, focused staff and techs.

~~~
chadash
In my city, for onsite service, I have two options within 30 miles: one is an
office depot, and the other is a computer repair store. Both seem to contract
with Lenovo. I'm sure that there are some repair centers that provide
excellent service and some less so.

Meanwhile, Apple has five stores within a 30 minute drive. And in my
experience, every single Apple store I've been to gives me a more-or-less
consistently good experience. Is it perfect? Far from it. But they can fix
most issues I've had onsite, and the turnaround time is predictable when they
ship out for repairs.

Meanwhile, with other companies, it's a crapshoot. I had a phone from LG that
broke. I mailed it in and after 5 weeks and many follow up phone calls, I
still didn't have it back. They claimed that they were out of the part that
they needed to repair the phone and were waiting for it to come in. They
initially told me that the repair would take 2 weeks. In my mind, a company
with decent customer service would see that the part is out of stock and just
give me a replacement phone if they can't turn around the repair in a
reasonable time frame.

With Apple, you know what you are getting into. And if they say 1 week, they
usually mean 1 week.

~~~
yasth
Onsite is your site. It is at times a confusing term, but if you get an onsite
warrant you needn't go anywhere, you wait at your place of business or your
home and the tech comes in and fixes it. Lenovo actually does pretty well at
this.

------
derefr
Every Apple Store with a Genius Bar has a receptionist (a guy holding an iPad
with the Genius Bar appointment schedule on it, running interference at the
entrance to the store), and usually _they_ try to get _your_ attention if you
look like you’re coming in for an appointment and/or a pickup rather than to
browse; but I guess they can miss you if they’re busy.

I think the Genius Bar “workflow” might depend on speaking to said
receptionist (either directly, or having someone redirect you back to them.)
Without them, nobody knows you’ve arrived, so you don’t end up in the service
queue.

~~~
groovybits
It sounds like this situation can be remedied in multiple ways:

* Email a customer a reminder email with explicit instructions on who to talk to in-store

* Train the Genius Bar techs to point a customer to the receptionist when looking for an appt

* Put up a sign in-store that points customers to the receptionist

* Have the receptionist wear a differently-styled uniform than the techs (nametag, color, etc)

This does not sound like a difficult problem to solve. Then again, it could
have been the perfect storm of events for OP. Maybe the receptionist had to
step out and take an emergency phone call. You never know what could happen.
At the very least, the techs and associates working the floor should at least
be able to point the customer to the correct place/associate. A 'schedule
appt' service queue should not be mixed with the 'walk-in' and 'browsing'
service queue.

~~~
dylan604
Or, have the Genius bar receptionist near the Genius Bar. Only in furniture
stores am I expecting an employee to grab me as soon as I walk in the door.

~~~
groovybits
Like I said, anything can happen. As far as I'm concerned, it is the
customer's responsibility to show up for the appt. It is then the associate's
responsibility to initiate the required services - whoever that associate may
be.

On a personal note: As a customer, I take the concept of a schedule appt much
more seriously than simply browsing.

With browsing: I am a _tentative_ customer of a product. I am new business.
Whether you want new business is up to you. If I have a bad experience, I'll
go somewhere else.

With a schedule appt: I am a _current_ customer. I have already bought into
your product, and now I have an issue with it. If I have a bad experience, I
am now under the impression that I have wasted _money_ and _time_ with
consulting your associates.

------
evadne
It is almost impossible to pay in person but the Apple Store app offers
ability to scan the barcode on almost any accessory and pay on the spot for it
without ever seeing staff. I do not have many issues with this model, in fact
it makes visits to the Apple Store for the odd cable quite easy. However, I
did find that sometimes specific accessories are simply not presented and one
must flag down staff to have one pulled out from storage.

It is the repair/service story that has really deteriorated over time and
Apple would bode well to remember that although PC vendors need to play catch-
up they will eventually become good enough.

I did find Joint Venture invaluable. Essentially it is a Pay-to-Play scheme
which allows you to book same-day appointments and access the Business Team
(which gives a slight discount).

Anybody remember the good old days when you could have AppleCare send you a
box and a return label?

~~~
balls187
> It is almost impossible to pay in person but the Apple Store app offers
> ability to scan the barcode on almost any accessory and pay on the spot for
> it without ever seeing staff.

After you pay what is the next step?

~~~
BillinghamJ
You walk out with the product. Though you can ask someone if you want a bag.

------
avelis
The in store experience has changed with the staff. Two examples that come to
mind. I remember going in to buy an iPhone 8 after new prices announced. I
spoke to a rep for 2 minutes for him to then to say: “let me get someone for
you.” Then the actual transaction of buying occurred. Are there so many window
shoppers that they have staff just to talk to non-buyers? The second was the
genius bar. A speaker blew-out on my MBP, I made an appointment and I am
trying to get someone AT THE BAR to tell me how long the repair is going to
take before I send it in for service. Meanwhile the person to my left is there
because they ran out of hard drive space and cant check their emails. And the
person to my right has been there for 4 hours about a phone repair only to
trade it in instead. I couldn’t believe the genius bar was inundated with
those requests. I know I don’t need special treatment but I literally need
actual hardware help. /rant

~~~
bjelkeman-again
The issue with the person with a full disk I recognise. A lot of people are so
untechnical/uninterested that they have no idea how to maintain their
computers/phones.

I have a friend who is an electrical engineer(!) no less, who bought a new
Windows machine when the old one was so infected by malware (kids used it)
that it became unusable. Most of my relatives have dedicated siblings or kids
providing tech support. Some people don’t have this support and end up at the
Genious bar.

The number of people I come across who admit to having no backup systems is
mind boggling. People who depend on their computers for work.

------
dyeje
Appointments at the Apple store are a joke. The last 3 times I went in for
one, I was acknowledged by a team member and it still took over an hour for
them to see me. If I wasn't aggressive about it, it would have been much
longer like it was for the half dozen elderly people sitting confused with me.

------
spzb
Strange. The article doesn't reflect my experience of Apple stores at all. The
only problem I have with them is trying actually to get in past the hordes of
kids playing with the latest tech.

------
b3b0p
I walked into an Apple Store twice in the last month:

1\. I walk up to an employee and said, "Want to make an easy sale? I want an
iPad Pro 11" with the keyboard and Apple Care." As we were talking with in
about 30 seconds after he pulled out his device someone came walking out with
the items. I pulled out my phone and payed via Apple Pay. Done.

2\. The next time I walked in, an employee asked me what I was looking for. I
said, "I would like to buy a HomePod." He said and showed me exactly who to
speak with. I walked over, I told him I wanted a HomePod and he asked which
color. I said what do you recommend, as I liked the white, but was afraid it
would show signs of getting dirty. He said black (Space Gray). He grabbed a
Space Gray HomePod. I paid with Apple Pay and was on my way.

Apple Store @ Mall of America both times.

------
Crosseye_Jack
I went in for a battery replacement back in November (Granted this was in the
UK not the US).

Booked the appointment online, Went in at the correct time, one of the staff
in the store told me "Spoke the people in the back of the store with iPads,
they handle genius bar appointments, Spoke to them (took my name), quickly
found me in the system and told me they were very busy atm I could wait or
rebook (It was lunch time in a city centre), Said I'll wait, Told me to take a
seat over there --->, said "tell them to give me a shout as I'm hard of
hearing" (Am a little but not too bad, I just wanted to waste my time playing
on a mac instead of just sitting at a full table twiddling my thumbs (dead
battery on my phone, didn't think about bring my charger with me), told the
person "telling the system I'm here" this they laughed and said OK.

10-20ish mins later (Lost track of time, was dicking about on the net),
someone shouts my name, got his attention and we went to a quieter table
(guess the hard of hearing thing worked :-P). Docked my phone and started
running some tests, while running the tests we talked about Work, games (A
nice discussion on which was our fav build of Counter Strike).

Yup I needed a new battery, Would take 60-90 mins to replace. Agreed to the
repair terms (Yes I took a back up, no I will not sue if you have to wipe my
phone, Yes you may claim my first born, etc etc etc). Told them I had ID (They
wanted a method to make sure that I was me when picking up my phone, asked
"what if I didn't have my ID on me as I don't normally carry it?", said they
have other methods they can use like showing the same Credit/Debit Card I used
to to book in the job.

Went and got some food, went to visit one of my fav bars in the city centre,
went back about 90 mins later and spoke to the same people at the back of the
store who had the iPads. They said "all done, someone will be with you soon" 5
mins later I had my phone back with a new battery (showed my id to say I am
me).

Apart from the genius bar being busy (Would be nice if I didn't have to wait,
but a) I knew I booked a lunch time slot b) I made "plans" not to do anything
that afternoon. So not the end of the world for me. But I could see it being a
pain in the ass if someone was trying to drop their device off during their
lunch break and had to wait around.) I can't say that I had a bad time there.

Store in question if it makes a difference to anyone: New St Apple Store,
Birmingham, UK.

------
jarjoura
Meh, if anything the Apple Store is a victim of its own success. For all the
complaints in this thread about slow Genius bar experiences, it's important to
remember it was originally designed and conceived as a way to teach people HOW
to use their new Mac's and iPhones. In the early 2000s Mac's were still
considered toys and Apple was trying to get around that by allowing people to
learn as much as they can about their new hardware.

Apple consistently gets top ratings for customer service across the industry,
and not saying there isn't room for improvement, obviously there is, but point
me to another electronics company of Apple's size that is doing it better?

------
TheMagicHorsey
This article misses a very obvious point. The reason it takes so long to get
help in an Apple store is because those stores are so popular. This isn't
Apple Stores losing their lustre. This is Apple Stores being a victim of their
own success.

------
ksec
Before iPhone, Apple had ~160 Stores, and were expanding as quickly as they
could, by 2007 they had nearly 200 Stores. And that was only serving ~30M [1]
Mac users and less than 100M iPod users.

So how many stores did Apple add while having an extra 900M iPhone, 300M iPad,
70M Mac _active_ users? 300. As of today Apple had roughly 500 Stores world
wide.

Even if they _had_ 1000 Stores worldwide serving their 1B+ Customers, the
store to customer count is still insanely high.

Apple was actually expanding Apple Store as quickly as they could all the way
to 2015. Given the quality and demand Apple requires it was still opening
nearly 1 store per week. Then from 2015 onward there were only 60 Stores
opened, most ( if not all ) of them were planned before 2015.

I still think giving Apple the brand image make over in Apple Retail were
good, but it doesn't have to a trade off to Genius Bar and Stores Count.

[1]Speaking of Mac users, I have yet to see anyone to point out the number of
Mac unit and Churn rate. Tim Cook said half of the Mac were sold to new
comers, and they are mostly from China. That is roughly 10M. We would then
expect Mac user base to grow at ~10M per year, assuming no one is leaving the
ecosystem at a noticeable rate. Except it hasn't. Apple had ~55M Mac users in
2011, they said they were _close_ to 100M users in early 2017. And only manage
to hit the 100M in late 2018.

Or May be my analysis is wrong.

------
jchw
I was at the Valley Fair Apple Store in Santa Clara to pick up an order
recently. It was very busy; a bit uncomfortably so, but to my surprise I was
helped quickly and went in and out.

Afterwards, there was a survey, which is not surprising. Knowing Apple, they
probably do pay attention to the survey results. If some Apple Stores are
having issues, I’m guessing they should know...

My only real complaint is just how packed they get. I was sure I’d be waiting
forever to reach an employee.

------
Vaslo
I understand what this article's view, and I share the same frustrations, but
every time I go there, it's packed regardless.

~~~
jtr_47
The apple store where i live is packed too. I think many of those people are
in for repairs on their stuff.

Meanwhile, the Microsoft store diagonally located across the mall is usually
empty. But some kids are there to play the games on the Xbox side.

peace

------
bluedino
I love the store itself. The problem is, the ones closest to me are almost 2
hours away, and in HUGE shopping malls that are a pain to get in and out of.

They are packed, but if you make an appointment they usually get to you on
time or even early.

Each mall also has a Microsoft store which is a sad abyss of emptiness.

------
musicale
It seems that it's not scaling out well at all as Apple products become more
popular. It is definitely annoying how all of the appointment slots are
constantly filled, which indicates that demand exceeds supply. However, at my
local Apple store they check you in and then text you when they are ready so
you don't have to wait in the store.

Bizarrely they didn't do this when I bought a phone, and instead made a bunch
of us wait outside in the sun for 90 minutes or so. With Apple-logo umbrellas
and water. This was the preorder group with assigned time slots, mind you
(there was another line for walk-ins.) I would have preferred to check in and
have them text me when my phone was ready, as they normally do with service
appointments.

------
pmcollins
When I want to buy something from Apple I can buy it from apple.com and have
it shipped to me, but the last time I did this their "two day shipping" took a
full week. Never again. Or I can buy it from Amazon, but last time I bought an
Apple product from Amazon, I didn't notice it was counterfeit until well after
the return window. Never again. Or I can buy it from their physical store.
Last time I bought AirPods I drove 45 minutes to the Apple Store and had to
wait for 10 minutes for the employee who was going to check me out to answer
questions for the customer ahead of me, even though all he needed to do was
swipe my credit card (there's a category of products that you can't self-
checkout and it includes AirPods).

------
actionowl
I went to the Apple store in Singapore a couple of months ago, they were
fairly busy but I got helped pretty quickly, got a new device and someone took
me upstairs to get it charged and setup. So just want to add that I had a good
experience at my last trip to an Apple store.

------
CWuestefeld
I have one experience with the Apple store, when I went there to try to get my
wife's phone fixed.

I had no idea that's a stupid thing to do, that you can't just go there and
ask for help. Actually, I had to go there and try to flag someone down. He
told me that I had to make an appointment to get help.

But he couldn't just make the appointment for me. There was a line for _that_.
I was told they'd probably be able to get to me in a half hour or so, so I
should come back then.

At that point I was able to make an appointment to come back a week hence,
when I could get them to actually look at the phone.

They did eventually fix the problem very satisfactorily, but the process to
get to that point was nothing less than infuriating.

~~~
askafriend
You could have booked an appointment sitting at home in your underwear.

~~~
CWuestefeld
I had no idea that "an appointment" was even a thing.

------
carlospwk
Finn here. We don't have an Apple store, but I've been to a few in NYC. Just
wondering around and looking all the staff run around and people waiting gives
me anxiety.

If I buy an Apple product, I either order it with express delivery from the
Apple website (not very often) or go buy it from whatever electronics store
has it in stock for the cheapest price. I have no idea why I'd want to
purchase it from an actual Apple store.

When the keyboard on my MBP broke a few years ago, I just took it to whatever
authorized repair shop and gave it to the guy after being second in line.
First he did some temp fix, but when I told him I wanted it properly fixed
under AppleCare, it was done in a few days.

------
chappi42
> “It’s become harder to buy something, even when the place isn’t busy. Buying
> a product there used to be a revered thing, now you don’t want to bother
> with the inconvenience.”

Hmm, yes. After work I thought I'd 'just' pass at an Apple store and either
buy a new battery or let it quickly replace. No chance: first came the
appointment, then I learned that no batteries would be sold and an exchange
needed about a week. What now? Ended with buying an Anyoneer at Amazon for a
third of the price and not feeling too happy with Apple. (But it started
before, there is a reason I needed a new battery for my old (2013 highly
'loved') MBA and bought a new Thinkpad).

------
clay_the_ripper
Unlike many of the comments here my experience at Apple stores has gotten a
lot better recently. I’ve been in twice in the past month for some hardware
fixes, and both experiences were great. I got an appoinemt the same day,
service was fast and professional and I found there to be an excess of people
wanting to help me. This was in San Francisco by the way so I can’t speak for
other areas. Prior to this I found that appointments were booked more than a
week out and there were long wait times even for when I showed up for said
appointment. I love the Apple store and find it to be the best retail
experience in the biz right now.

------
TheOtherHobbes
Why is Apple Store service a thing at all? Service and repairs should happen
at a service and repair centre, not at a retail centre.

Service Just Doesn't Work if you try to combine the two. You get huge delays,
bureaucratic errors, people waiting and taking up space, and a general air of
stress, confusion, and chaos, with everyone running around trying to handle at
least two unrelated visitor streams.

It feels to me as if the original intent of retail has been overwhelmed by
reality, and the whole could do with a rethink.

The customer experience is usually pretty terrible now, whether it's service
or sales. It's certainly not effortlessly positive in any way.

------
tjr
I've only been in an Apple Store a few times, and have always thought it a
cool store, but just not very practical. At best, I buy a new computer every
few years. I kept my first iPad for about five years before getting a new one.
I buy a new phone maybe every couple of years.

Despite recent design decisions that I find questionable, thus far Apple
products remain the best choice for the work I do, so I don't really want or
need to go to the store in person to be impressed. I just order online
whatever best meets my requirements.

The last time I bought a computer in person was about 14 years ago. I did buy
an iPad case at an Apple store recently...

------
froboy
In addition to all these other things, Apple within the past year or so
changed the bathrooms in (from what I’ve heard) all the stores from public to
“staff only”. What kind of “Town Square” doesn’t have a toilet?

------
apo
> There was the time he visited the Easton Town Center location to buy a
> laptop for his 11-year-old daughter and spent almost 20 minutes getting an
> employee to accept his credit card. In January, Smith was buying a monitor
> and kept asking store workers to check him out, but they couldn’t because
> they were Apple “Geniuses” handling tech support and not sales.

This is nothing new. It was very difficult to just buy a laptop from my local
store in 2014. Apple stores have never worked like any other store. The
purpose is for passers-by to see lots of people inside as social proof.

------
dep_b
Nothing but stellar experiences for me so far in Holland. Everything fixed in
a day, just got a new screen for free on my MacBook Pro 2011 in Haarlem.

But super hard to get appointments sometimes.

------
partiallypro
Every time I go past/in one, it just looks like it's people wasting time at
the mall waiting on someone that's shopping elsewhere, or people there for
repairs. 50% of the people there are all Apple employees, and most of them
don't seem to do anything but chit-chat.

Every time I walk past a Microsoft store there aren't too many customers, but
usually they are hosting a gaming tournament or a code academy with tons of
teens/kids.

It's an interesting dynamic.

------
iamleppert
I had a bad experience at the store in SF. The staff all have this very
pompous “can’t be bothered” attitude and they make you wait a long time in
their creepy indoor seating tree park with other hostages that showed up for
their appointment. Then you finally get to speak with someone, who can’t
really do anything other than replace your device. Why couldn’t one of the
sales people just give me a new device?

What’s the point?

------
aczerepinski
At Christmas time I had to make an appointment to buy a watch. I waited 15
minutes for my scheduled time slot and then learned they were out of stock.

------
totaldude87
USA: Went to apple store to replace my iPhone 6 battery, after waiting for two
hours, an assistant told me to hand of phone and asked me to come back after 3
days (&probably wait 2-3 hours before i get my phone). didn't replace the
battery

UK: Went to buy iPhone, had to wait few mins in "line" , bought and came back
within 1 hour on opening day ..

------
dwighttk
Apple got too popular and needs 5x the amount of store they have near me in
Durham, NC. I can still get service, but it is a chore. Show up before they
open, or book an appointment 2 weeks in advance. The only good part is that I
used to need to talk to a repair person ~2x a year and now I've gone in like
once every 2 years... (still too busy though)

------
alasdair_
The wait times are ridiculous. It took half an hour the last time I was there
just to talk to someone.

I was there to spend upwards of $5000 on new hardware and I knew exactly what
I wanted - I just needed to pay for it and have someone hand it to me. Total
transaction time was over an hour and I would have left if I didn’t need it
that day.

------
benatkin
Two things that were features aren't anymore now that I moved to Miami.

I'm tired of Face ID. Give me back Touch ID please. My sunglasses prevent Face
ID from working when I have them on, and that's quite often here, and I don't
want to switch to a light form of Face ID that doesn't check that I'm actually
looking at my phone. Sometimes I temporarily take my sunglasses off to use
Face ID.

The cooling design makes my MacBook Pro very quiet, but it doesn't always keep
up with the heat indoors here. I've got to the point where I have to suspend
my Vagrant box before I close the lid, or there's a good chance it won't wake
up when I open my MacBook Pro and I'll have to restart it. I wish it used fans
more to keep it cool.

I need to take it into an Apple Store because I think it might be a real
hardware problem and not just a limitation or a software problem that causes
it not to wake, but I'm not sure. Fortunately we have lots of Apple Stores and
the availability is not too bad. There's only one appointment available today
and that's 40 miles away in Boca Raton, but there are appointments at about 5
different Apple Stores in the area with appointments available tomorrow.

~~~
the_watcher
For others who see this and are willing to adjust the settings to use FaceID
with sunglasses - just turn off Require Attention for FaceID [0].

Personally, I prefer FaceID (which surprised me!) to TouchID except in bed,
when I desperately miss TouchID.

[0] [https://www.imore.com/how-make-iphone-x-face-id-work-
sunglas...](https://www.imore.com/how-make-iphone-x-face-id-work-sunglasses)

~~~
acheron
FaceID works fine for me with my sunglasses and "require attention".

I did also have trouble unlocking while laying in bed though. For awhile I
thought it wasn't recognizing me without any glasses on, but then I realized
that when I don't have any glasses on, I hold the phone much closer to my
face, and it doesn't recognize me that way. It unlocks fine without glasses as
long as I hold it at the same distance. Still kind of an awkward process.

~~~
benatkin
Yes, it works with some sunglasses. My sunglasses are Ray-Bans that aren't
very dark. They're a pretty ordinary pair of sunglasses, but they don't work
with the default FaceID setting. I think it's a bit random whether you get
ones that work or ones that don't, if you're looking for a practical pair of
sunglasses and not paying attention to whether it works with FaceID.

------
lowlevel
I find the apple store uninviting and uncomfortable. They're generally packed
with people standing around... you have no idea where to go or who is
available... more obscurely controlled chaos than clear and apparent order. I
feel visiting the store is generally going to be bad experience for most
people.

------
_the_inflator
At my local Apple Store there is now a flipchart at the shop front which
features the new Apple products: iPhone, MacBook, iPad.

This is so sad, and reminds me of cheap and greasy sales people but not of
Apple.

It looks more like a shop that went bankrupt and needs to sell its inventory
ASAP. This impression is really sad.

------
r_singh
And the App Store too.

Advertising on the App Store really broke my heart, I thought Apple just made
money from us all by selling expensive, high quality devices and apps. These
ads are a desperate attempt to now make something over and above by selling my
attention, what a shame!

~~~
wlesieutre
It feels like a way for Apple to claw back even more than their 30% cut. Even
if you have a successful app, now you have to take some of your money and buy
the search ads for it, otherwise somebody else is going to be the first result
when potential customers come to the store looking specifically for your app.

You can try and drive traffic straight to your store page from outside sources
to bypass that search, but that sort of marketing costs money too. And word of
mouth searches are going to be through the App Store search regardless.

It was nice when Apple's search felt like it was just trying to help you find
what you were looking for. But it's 2019 and we need to put ads in
_everything_ now.

~~~
scarface74
While I agree that ad sales are disheartening, App Store search has never been
that great.

~~~
wlesieutre
It's not perfect, but if I search for "GoodNotes" exactly by name it should
give me GoodNotes.

The fact that the search results dedicate most of my screen to Notability (one
of their main competitors) is some bullshit on Apple's part.

[https://i.imgur.com/4T7sLXb.png](https://i.imgur.com/4T7sLXb.png)

It would be one thing if I searched for "notebook" or "handwriting" or
"notes," but I searched for a specific app _by name_ and they're sending
traffic to a competitor because GoodNotes "only" pays 30% of their revenue to
Apple, and Apple wants even more on top of that or else a competitor gets
their traffic.

Sometimes search is bad because search is a hard problem and it's difficult to
know what a user is looking for.

Apple knows exactly what I was looking for. They're just being dicks about it.

~~~
scarface74
What’s going to happen when Apple rolls out the game subscription? Will they
favor those games over publishers that decide not to be part of it?

I think (and hope) that I read that it will be a separate tab. My heart goes
out to the few non scammy, paid up front/pay one time to get rid of ads
publishers that might be affected, but honestly if all apps that are dependent
on ads, in app purchases of coins, power ups and loot boxes disappeared from
the store, nothing of value would be lost.

------
ramon
Answer to the question price tag and service!

OBS: Now I open up regular notebooks myself and fix them when I need to do so.
No need to pay to repair or pray for someone with MacOS to help anymore, I'm
my own service now just spend on parts yay!

------
HillaryBriss
when my Mac had a serious problem, i was so disappointed by the low level of
service at my local Apple Store that I looked on Yelp for a good one. i would
have driven a hundred miles to get away from the smug, the problem denials,
the repeated trips, the incompetent repairs carried out with defective used
parts.

but there weren't any good ones. the Yelp ratings for all the stores in my
area were just meh, or downright bad. i felt like i'd been tricked into buying
an expensive, unmaintainable hunk of aluminum.

i like Macs, but those experiences made me want to avoid any more Mac
purchases.

------
simonh
Lost it's lustre (headline) = So spectacularly successful, they're swamped
with customers and can't keep up with the demand (long waits described in
text).

Illustrated by a picture of an almost empty Apple store.

------
balls187
I suppose because I'm in tech, I have the flexibility of shopping at retail
stores at off-peak hours, as I have had only pleasant experiences when
shopping at the Bellevue Square and South Center malls.

------
frou_dh
When I've seen people doing those sit-down training classes in the store, I
wonder if they retain any information at all, because it's in the midst of a
massively noisy and distracting environment.

------
snowwrestler
"Nobody goes there anymore; it's too busy." \- Yogi Berra

------
uzbit
The most surprising thing about this is how many HN readers/commenters are
actually seeking help at a brick and mortar store full of "geniuses".

------
hourislate
They are successful in spite of themselves. When you can treat the customer
with complete disregard and they still trip over themselves to line up and buy
your product, what is onus to change? I find their employees very smug like
they are just so important that us common folk can fuck off and wait or simply
be ignored until they decide to help/serve us.

I filled out their survey after purchasing two XS Max's (for the fam, I'm a 1+
guy). They never even acknowledged my complaints about the terrible customer
service I received.

I guess it works until it doesn't......

------
jccalhoun
I've never even SEEN an Apple store let alone been in one. Looking on their
site it looks like the nearest one is 90 miles away from me.

------
bdcravens
The only surprise to me about the article is suggesting that this is a recent
thing. I’ve experienced this for years.

------
fit2rule
Need to make an appointment to go to the shop and get up-sold on something?

No longer a shop.

(Note: Store/Shop, same diff.)

I see the Apple Store these days as more of a cult. Sort of like what
religions want to be, albeit centred around a computing lifestyle rather than
a spiritual one.

Sorry, not sorry for the comparison. It _really does feel like going to
church_.

------
Pigo
I've never set foot in one, and I never plan too.

------
vbuwivbiu
Apple store staff have had cult-member aloofness for as long as I can remember

------
runako
TL;DR;

"Nobody goes there anymore. It's too crowded."

[1] [https://quoteinvestigator.com/2014/08/29/too-
crowded/](https://quoteinvestigator.com/2014/08/29/too-crowded/)

~~~
specialist
The fix seems kinda obvious: Increase supply to meet demand.

------
techslave
these kinds of threads are good ones to scan for entitled users. “omg i can’t
park close to the busiest store at the mall / downtown. i have to wait for
help at the busiest store. i can’t find the cashier. i could run this show
sooo much better “

now to just link the hn username to a resume for black flagging.

------
maxxxxx
I think part of it is that Apple doesn’t have many interesting new products. I
used it be excited about iPhones or iPads but now they just release variations
if the same thing I know already pretty well. Why go to a store? And the wait
times for support are way too long.

~~~
pwinnski
> Why go to a store? And the wait times for support are way too long.

"Nobody goes there anymore, it's too crowded."

~~~
brewdad
Filled with people waiting on support issues for devices that "just work".
That should tell you all you need to know about the current Apple Store.

------
yingw787
I think the slam of less user-friendly products, higher comparative prices,
and worse customer support will make any company lose its luster. Apple's done
all three, and unless there's a change in the ship's direction, it'll continue
bleeding out cash in stock buybacks and dividends and losing premium customers
and great employees.

------
ausjke
They could downsize them to street corner booth for repair needs, or even
better just sell some self-help-kits to cover majority of the basic DIY fixes.

I don't use apple, my Dell PC and Thinkpad laptop and Android phones never
needed any repair, if they do, most likely I will just repair them myself or
buy new ones(e.g. keyboard etc).

Apple will be struggling for a while after the iphone era for sure.

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sonnyblarney
The Apple Store is now fully an episode of Portlandia.

It's like a big confusing miasma at burning man where everyone is trying to
'contact' another through signs on the big board "Mine is the pink one by the
bottom!" i.e. to differentiate it from the 1000 other pink notes by the bottom
...

Take a goddam number, or have a station where people can go where they get
that number.

Instead of the stupid trying to find your blind-date/fixer in a crowd, they go
to a _spot_ where you can find them.

The numbers are up on a screen so you know if you have 10 or 30 minutes to
wait and you can tell when you're up.

We figured out lines and numbers maybe 2000 years ago but Mesopotamian
technology apparently isn't hipster enough for Cupertino.

Please - we want to see an Kumail Nanjiani thing about this on Funny or Die.

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burtonator
One main reason the stores anger me is that they're actively disincentivezed
to develop PWAs (progress web apps) or cross-platform technologies.

The App Store makes Apple billions.

By locking you down they get the ability to get a cut of your app.

If you could install a mobile app directly from the web, they're cut out of
the loop.

They also can't use it as a system of control to block apps they dislike.

I agree that there are times where this might be valuable and that there are
APIs that you might want to restrict but then have a fair policy about which
apps you block and also have a way to get PWAs approved easily.

Also, it's VERY expensive to get your app there due to their use of Dunn and
Bradstreet.

You either have to pay $1000 or you have to wait 1-3 months until your company
is approved.

~~~
pwinnski
What does this have to do with the retail stores that are the focus of this
article?

