
How Ketogenic Diets Curb Inflammation in the Brain - dtawfik1
https://www.ucsf.edu/news/2017/09/408366/how-ketogenic-diets-curb-inflammation-brain
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wdewind
The problem with basically all of the keto science (this study included) is
that it doesn't adequately differentiate between the effects of a ketogenic
diet and simple caloric restriction:

> In rodents, ketogenic diets – and caloric restriction, in general – are
> known to reduce inflammation,

While there is some science showing differences in calorically balanced diets
that vary in macronutrient composition, the truth is it is not strong, not
well reproduced and there reasonable logical models that strongly bring the
keto claims into question.

That doesn't mean keto is stupid or not worth studying. It's just that the
interesting things about keto aren't really the metabolic changes (which are
controversial, and small even if existent), but the behavioral controls.
Obviously it's an oversimplification to draw a strict line between metabolism
and compliance, but the point is the important difference with keto is that
for some people it helps them _comply_ to a calorically balanced diet, not
that the macronutrient composition is making a difference.

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0xbear
Another problem is keto seems difficult to sustain over the long term. People
drop off and regain all of their weight.

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sasas
Modified keto where a higher amount of protein is permitted is much easier to
stick to (i.e. 30% protein).. to stay within 0.5-1.5 mmol/L BHB

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albinofrenchy
I thought the only real limit for keto was on non fiber carbs? Is there
typically a max ratio on protein too?

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0xbear
Gluconeogenesis can work off excess protein, too. Also, excess protein raises
insulin, which is tied directly to weight gain.

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trhway
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketogenic_diet](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketogenic_diet)

"The ketogenic diet is a high-fat, adequate-protein, low-carbohydrate diet
that in medicine is used primarily to treat difficult-to-control (refractory)
epilepsy in children. [...] Almost half of children, and young people, with
epilepsy who have tried some form of this diet saw the number of seizures drop
by at least half, and the effect persists even after discontinuing the diet."

doesn't sound like just a fad.

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gebeeson
Definitely not a fad per se. They way it is packaged (Keto) and delivered to
the masses makes it seem fad-ish as all quickly ramped-up-to-make-money deals
tend to be. I've used keto myself several times though only as short-term diet
change. I myself never fully seemed to recover from the Keto-flu even after
months of eating strict keto. Adding back natural complex carbs helped me
immensely in that regard.

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RossBencina
As trevyn says, you need to make sure you get enough sodium. Ketogenic diet
accelerates excretion of sodium ("natriuresis of fasting"). Look up Steve
Phinney's videos or books if you want more info -- he recommends drinking a
few full-sodium stock cubes every day. Another common issue during adaption
seems to be not eating enough fat.

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bgitarts
Won't adding salt to meals and perhaps a pinch to water in the morning be
sufficient?

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pizza
kinda related: Richard Veech (not in OP article) is probably the
doctor/researcher (to my knowledge) has done the best research into ketosis,
imo.

[https://irp.nih.gov/pi/richard-veech](https://irp.nih.gov/pi/richard-veech)

[http://drveech.com/](http://drveech.com/)

He's found some very interesting results about the improvement of cellular
energy efficiency (thermodynamic improvement)/cellular homeostasis due to keto
throughout his career:

\- neurons were less thermodynamically wasteful in terms of excess heat
generated (because more efficient delta-G/easier ionic potentials); and
therefore, due to neuronal metabolic dysfunctions induced by concussions,
ketosis was good for treating concussion. DARPA has apparently sunk quite a
lot of money into his research of the treatment of concussions/TBI (because of
IEDs, etc) - e.g., this paper sponsored by DARPA
[https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5102124/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5102124/)

\- cardiac cells too performed more efficiently with ketone bodies

(- if I recall correctly (which I'm not sure that I do..) some breeds of mice
were able to hold their breath underwater for something ridiculous like 150%
(or more?) of the normal length of time than control group mice could. I can't
seem to find the source for this.. [although, anecdotally, there have been 4
or 5 times when (in ketosis) I could hold my breath for >2 minutes (timed)
with ease, whereas out of ketosis I'd be barely capable of doing so after,
say, 45 seconds..])

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goatmine2
Work in this area is interesting but to me seems like pharma money as the
focus is on messing with things that suck money for a long time and then end
in cancer. Or put another way what happens to the carbs that are blocked from
getting processed. Knowing which cell types are the most resistant to this
intervention may have lots of value, but a new block buster drug would be a
crime. So suck it up and learn to truly get into a ketogenic state then see
where in the world you are. There is little research on multiyear ketogenic
cohorts. Fasting which has many comparators to ketosis has been in most
cultures for years. A general theme here is insulin sensitivity or better put
lack there of. I do not see how this pathway disrupting mechanism helps to
return insulin sensitivity for a person eating the diets recommended by pretty
much all governments globally.

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thisisit
Can someone explain me what does "extreme low-carbohydrate" mean exactly? Is
it 10% 20% of the daily intake?

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unfunco
A ketogenic diet usually means < 20g of carbohydrates per day.

