
Poland in the 80's Through the Lens of French/Swiss Photographer Bruno Barbey - curtis
https://imgur.com/gallery/960KNrY
======
badpun
I grew up in Poland back then. Looking back at those photos, what is amazing
is the serenity due to lack of advertising on the streets and on people's
clothes. The world's visuals didn't scream at you back then (except for the
occasional propagandist poster or banner, but these were not everywhere like
today's advertising is).

BTW later, when I was a young teenager in Poland's nineties, already under
neoliberal capitalism, I dreamt of the commercials on TV being informative and
helpful instead of the brainwashing puke they were (and still are). As an
Amiga fanboy, I especially dreamt of a commercial campain that would convince
people of Amiga's technical strengths :) Ah, the innocent years of youth.

~~~
oblio
Well, I guess all this says is that when people aren't forced, that's what
they want.

I'd rather have billboards than oppression, but maybe that's just me.

~~~
badpun
You think people want advertising? I’d say companies want advertisting, and
people cannot do anything to stop it. There are some exceptions though, like
cities banning outdoor advertising in historic city centres, the reason being
that they’re intrusive and ugly, thus making the location less attractive for
tourists. It’s a shame that a mere ugliness is not enough, it has to be linked
with a financial loss - but it’s a step in the right direction IMO.

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iagooar
Sorry, this has little to do with what Poland looked like in the 80s.

Being born and having lived there for the first few years of my life, these
pictures looks as exotic and strange to me as pictures from Yemen or
Kazakhstan.

I'm not saying they're not real, but these pictures are clearly selected to be
as far from what an average Western person considers to be "normal".

I guess it's like going to the US, only focusing on the Amish and
extrapolating their way of life to the whole country.

~~~
yakshaving_jgt
In that photo with the wicker-basket love seats on the beach — which I'm
guessing is Sopot — we still have those. Also ul Mariacka looks no different.

I'm guessing you're from somewhere prosperous? I mean even today, yes Sopot
and Warsaw are just masses of Porsches and pretty women, but that isn't the
case in some less well-off areas.

~~~
LaGrange
> In that photo with the wicker-basket love seats on the beach — which I'm
> guessing is Sopot — we still have those.

Amish also still exist. The issue is, this portrays a country that was by then
very diverse, through a very specific perspective, that, through a rather
suspicious coincidence, happens to match western stereotypes about the
country, instead of challenging it.

Doesn't change the fact those are good photos, but while there might be true
in their literal content, as a whole they provide a false narrative.

~~~
comboy
Not sure what are you trying to prove. Those photos show what's quaint. Big
cities and places where things look more western seem less unique or
interesting.

~~~
LaGrange
The choice of photos serves a function, build a certain narrative, and they're
not just "huh, look at the bunch of pretty pictures I made". Disavowing that
is, to put it bluntly, dishonest to the conversation.

~~~
mr_overalls
What narrative do you think the photos are trying to build? To make Poland in
the 80's appear more quaint? Your paranoia seems. . . unwarranted.

~~~
LaGrange
I'm not sure you understand what a narrative is. Furthermore, you should learn
punctuation before trying to use an ellipsis for dramatic effect, especially
if you're trying to insult their intellectual abilities.

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wwosik
Just a note - while photos are true, they should not be taken as the
representative or a generalization of how average life looked like. Photos
from an Indian reservation or city ghettos will show how the life in the US
looks like for certain people, but not as all people in the US live.
Obviously, a photographer will concentrate on more exotic topics from his
perspective.

BTW, is that a feature of an old film, but all those photos look very very
grim to me :) Even the ones where people joke and laugh.

~~~
koonsolo
A Belgian photographer once showed that he can create any picture he wants,
using the same environment. Well worth the 3 minutes:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wmbsXussxUc](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wmbsXussxUc).

It has English subtitles ;)

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gadders
I sent these pictures to a colleague in our Polish office, and he sent me a
few before and after pics:

Before: [https://i.imgur.com/18lEoGd.jpg](https://i.imgur.com/18lEoGd.jpg)

After: [https://cdn.flixbus.de/2017-06/Gdansk-
zwiedzanie.jpg](https://cdn.flixbus.de/2017-06/Gdansk-zwiedzanie.jpg)

Before:
[https://pro.magnumphotos.com/image/PAR96165.html](https://pro.magnumphotos.com/image/PAR96165.html)

After:
[http://www.psur.pl/ra/cmm_budynek_okm.jpg](http://www.psur.pl/ra/cmm_budynek_okm.jpg)

[http://navtur.pl/files/news/281.jpg](http://navtur.pl/files/news/281.jpg)

~~~
ido
Feels like a lot of that stark difference in that first pair was due to
particularly present weather in the modern one vs a cloudy/grey day in the old
one.

~~~
contingencies
Also there are trees now.

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aasasd
It seems to me that the photos are selected towards the more exotic to a
Western photographer or viewer. You could also have shots of urban life barely
distinguishable from that of 80s' NY―but that wouldn't be as interesting to
viewers, would it?

It's hard and possibly erroneous to judge from this temporal distance, but the
more I look through cultural artifacts (and what memories I have), the more I
feel that the spirit of the time was similar in many aspects across the US,
Europe and the USSR (and maybe SE Asia too). Probably because the economy
became progressively more global, and because there was a steady trickle of
Western culture into even the USSR proper, since the 60s.

~~~
viraptor
> towards the more exotic to a Western photographer or viewer

I'd go with "distinctly Polish" in many cases. The folklore clothing, wood
art, ceramic heater/oven, trabant, polonez, priests, village houses, etc. are
not just exotic. For me they're very much pictures that identify the set as
100% Poland. There are some exotic things in PL that would be less relatable.

I think the photographer did an awesome job with the selection.

~~~
Markoff
how is trabant distinctly polish? more like DDR or whole eastern block, but
not sure what's polish specific about Trabant

~~~
viraptor
I meant when taken together. Each on their own would likely be more common.

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7723
The photo with the ship being pulled uphill. That still exists to date:

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RDx-
QLW2Tk](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RDx-QLW2Tk)

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elbl%C4%85g_Canal](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elbl%C4%85g_Canal)

------
jetrink
The following site has short captions for many of the photos:

[https://pro.magnumphotos.com/Catalogue/Bruno-
Barbey/1981/POL...](https://pro.magnumphotos.com/Catalogue/Bruno-
Barbey/1981/POLAND-Book-NN144909.html)

~~~
V-2
It's better than nothing, but please note that a lot of these are
unfortunately inaccurate.

Eg. even sizeable cities such as Wrocław are referred to as "towns"... Poznań
is supposedly located in the Silesia region... Sopot is referred to
alternately by its Polish and German name (Zopott), and the German name is
given as the primary one for Frombork (misspelled "Fronbork"), while the
Motława river is named "Mottlau" exclusively for some reason, etc.

~~~
Markoff
is there difference in polish language between town and city? i would think
they distinguish only between towns and villages, cities basically don't exist
and town it's their language equivalent

~~~
V-2
There aren't two different words, you'd just casually say big city, small
city, or "miasteczko", a diminutive from city / miasto.

But English still does distinguish between the two, so when you read about a
"town" in Poland, what you imagine probably isn't the 4th largest city in the
country, home to over 600 thousand people.

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jakubwaw
I grew up in Hrubieszow (one of the eastern-most towns in Poland) in the late
90s and early naughties before emigrating. The photos are very much in line
with the scenes I have observed growing up. It's such a contrast to compare my
current environment to the one portrayed in the photos (and still lived by
some of my extended family members).

If these parts stay unchanged, we will soon see places like (in Poland and
elsewhere) as an oasis from the super-advanced reality most of the population
lives within.

Going off other comments here and stories from my parents, the commercials and
ads back then were thought to present a more modern, futuristic, "better" life
that people worked hard to obtain. Soon, the commercials will present a
simpler, older life that we dream of escaping to just for a moment.
Interesting thought.

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pjf
...a lens biased towards countryside, and that would require captions to
better understand the meaning of photos, IMHO.

~~~
dreta
there's no bias, the photos represent the general state of the whole country

~~~
praptak
No they don't. Source: growing up in said country during that era. There
weren't that many horses then, even in the countryside.

And they did have tractors. Plowing with a horse was a curiosity even in the
eighties.

~~~
dreta
i grew up in Poland too, east, and south-east looked like like this, or worse.
where did you grow up? not everybody had a tractor, still had plenty of horses
around, doesn't mean everybody used them, that'd be ridiculous

~~~
praptak
Warsaw, with parts of family near Ciechanów and near Piła.

No, not _everybody_ had a tractor - that would be ineffective, given how many
small family-owned farms there were. But they did use tractors and combine
harvesters. TBH I don't know whether they were shared between neighbors or
just unofficially borrowed(#) for a bottle of vodka from the state farms
(PGR).

(#)There's this Polish verb "załatwić" which I cannot properly translate to
English. It means obtaining products or services using ones connections,
cunning and possibly transfer of a usual token of appreciation as in "załatwić
za flachę" (obtain something in exchange for a bottle of vodka).

~~~
dreta
you grew up in the country's capital, and had family in the north-west, no
wonder you have no idea how life really was

~~~
V-2
Both - as they're commonly referred to - "Poland A" and "Poland B" comprise of
significant portions of the population. I can't see why life in one should be
considered "real", while in the other, not. There are two sides to this
picture.

~~~
yostrovs
Because capitals are show off places in oppressive countries. The reality is
outside. I grew up in a small city in USSR and sometimes speak to people that
grew up in Moscow or Leningrad. The difference is huge... They often owned
cars, had frequent access to bananas and oranges, and the stores were
generally adequately stocked. Not for us and the rest of the country..

~~~
V-2
That's true, but my parent commenter referred to the entire North West (which
is, generally speaking, more well off in Poland) not being "real". Not just
Warsaw. Ciechanów or Piła, both rather small towns, could hardly be considered
show off places.

Overall the gap was more along the lines of big cities vs. province as you
say; rather than geographical. In a centrally planned economy large urban
centers were overprivileged in the pecking order.

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Jun8
I’ve only been to Warsaw once, a couple of years ago, but has a strong mental
image of ~80s Polish urban landscape formed from Kieslowski’s movies, esp. the
_Dekalog_
([https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dekalog](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dekalog))
Only the last photo in the set, of kids playing on an abandoned car in a grim
apartment complex matched that image.

BTW, if you’ve never watched this series you absolutely should, esp, Dekalog 1
should be required watching for technical people, as an antidote to the hubris
we sometimes feel in describing nature. Now that I have a son at that age, it
strikes even closer!

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aquarin
Another photographer. Poland (and some former socialist courtiers) in the 70's
- 80's [http://chrisniedenthal.com/en](http://chrisniedenthal.com/en)

~~~
d3ckard
Highly recommend those. Photos linked in OP are cool and true, but very...
selected. They show what was already sort of archaic even for Poles.
Niedenthal is way more representative and famous - he was Lech Walesa's
presidential photographer later on if I remember correctly.

------
vondro
Nice photos. They represent personal view of the photographer, as every photo
does in the end. One thing can be captured in many ways, showing different
points of view or emotions. Enjoy one point of view from one specific place,
one photo at a time.

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trhway
political background at the time of the photos
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Poland_(1945%E2%80%...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Poland_\(1945%E2%80%931989\)#Imposition_of_martial_law)

That photo of Lenin with the "Solidarity" newspaper and a sign on the jacket -
nice humor and is pretty telling that Poland definitely was rejecting the
socialism as a foreign object :)

edit: thank you, corrected the link

~~~
conanthe
This is wrong. "Solidarnosc" was more socialist than the ruling party! This
common misconception. If you read their manifesto, you can see they wanted
even more socialism. That movement was only about taking over. In 1988
communists started capitalist reforms similar to China, but fall of the Soviet
Union gave politicians coming from the Solidarnosc a chance. First thing they
did was reversing the free market reforms and moving Poland to be a socialist
utopia it is today and wasting huge potential.

~~~
trhway
>This is wrong. "Solidarnosc" was more socialist than the ruling party!

yes, i know, and you're right in the sense that it is a bit more complicated
than i originally said. The fall of real socialism in 198x in USSR was also
associated with the part of society having that naive/romantic longing of
"back to good socialism as it was originally envisioned by the great wise
fuzzy warm grandpa Lenin" (never mind that Lenin was presiding over and
directing the class- and political based genocide on the national scale as a
natural part of his socialism) as opposed to supposedly incorrectly
implemented real socialism of the time. So the Lenin explicitly embracing
"Solidarity" artifacts on that photo is exactly the symbol of the same "back
to and more of the good original socialism" and a rejection of that "wrong"
real socialism.

The catch of course is there is only one socialism, and it is not the "good
one" as that just doesn't exist...

~~~
conanthe
Well put my friend

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AstralStorm
No picture of any newly built factory... (soon to be torn down or sold) or the
concrete buildings that still make the cities ugly.

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Markoff
More like "poor rural Poland" but I guess it's not so catchy as claiming this
is regular Poland in 80s where you could buy Coca Cola and watch
American/French movies/TV shows. It's pretty sad to see someone pushing their
agenda with such clickbait titles.

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thedaemon
The boy's backpacks in the photo with them by the fisherman at the lake: they
look like $500 backpacks. It's funny how some things have changed in price
perspective.

~~~
aasasd
Eh, they were made from artificial leather with questionable feel, and, though
the seams could be strong, the work was likely rather imprecise, so it's not
quite the same thing.

‘Mass production’ goods from the 80s are now sold very cheaply second-hand,
e.g. you can get these backpacks starting with $5, plenty for $15:
[https://www.avito.ru/rossiya?q=%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%B5%D1%8...](https://www.avito.ru/rossiya?q=%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%BD%D0%B5%D1%86+%D1%81%D1%81%D1%81%D1%80)

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keiferski
I highly highly recommend seeing the film Cold War, which is set in
1950’s-60’s Europe. The cinematography is near-perfect and the set design
really takes you back to communist-era Poland and Paris.

[https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8ImvkXgGVWw](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=8ImvkXgGVWw)

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V-2
Aside from the discussion on to what extent are these pictures actually
representative of the overall conditions of the era, it's worth noting that
the 1980s in Poland were particularly gloomy even by communist standards.

The system was clearly in the final phase of decline, and the crisis had
struck hard.

The living standard had deteriorated considerably in comparison to the much
more cheerful 1970s (when foreign credits helped to boost the consumption).

This shows in numerous statistics such as eg. alcohol or nicotine consumption,
which peaked in the 1980s.

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dariusjs
It still looks like that today

