
The idea of a university as a free space rather than a safe space is vanishing - colinprince
http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2016/03/idea-university-free-space-rather-safe-space-vanishing/
======
noonespecial
The real tragedy is that university used to be a place where you could be
convinced that some of the ideas you had going in might be _wrong_. Now the
only thing that's being taught is that certain people just aren't allowed to
speak at all.

People who used to have their ways of thinking changed at university are now
leaving silent, angry, _and still wrong_.

~~~
vmorgulis
It's not a definitive change and the problem is worldwide.

------
mc32
It is indeed a sad day when people, that is, students, are censored by their
own. It's astounding that this would happen being that through disagreement
and argument is how we find our better ways. My sentiment is that here is the
one place where we should feel free to share our ideas no matter how immature
or adolescent they are. This should be the place where we get to open up and
explore. But, as they say, the left and the right have conspired to silence
discussion and only received opinion is welcome.

Here's the relevant quote: "In other words, and not for the first time in
history, the far left is allied with the far right, and drags the soggy centre
along whimpering behind it."

~~~
hartpuff
Anyone who uses terms like "the left" is pretty much announcing where they are
coming from, and that their argument is almost certainly going to be
simplistic and flawed.

Take this excerpt:

    
    
           Surely the left believes in secularism and despises
           the superstitions that have held humanity back? Not 
           so, and not for a long time.
    

If "the left" believes in secularism and atheism, and the people he's talking
about oppose secularism and atheism, why does does he conclude this means "the
left" no longer believes in secularism, rather than the people he's talking
about are not actually "the left"?

He claims "Feminists, gay-rights campaigners, anti-fascists and anti-
Islamists" are being sanctioned or persecuted. So the left is against
_feminists, gay-rights and anti-fascism_? What do those groups represent then,
"the right"?

If there's one claim socialism and communism can make, it's that it's
diametrically opposed to Islamism, as evidenced in numerous post-war
socialist, secular Arab countries, Afghanistan in the 70s and 80s, and in the
fact that leftists have been persecuted and murdered in every Islamist state
from Saudi to Iran.

    
    
        In any case, the ‘left’ as I suppose I have to call it
    

Why does he _have_ to call it "the left" if even he states they hold
"reactionary views"? Because he's pandering to a right-wing audience on a
right-wing website.

~~~
angersock
Alternately, the accepted shorthand for some groups may well be "the left" and
"the right". Similarly, there are people who will use the term "Social Justice
Warrior" while identifying with the movement, because it is a decent
shorthand.

 _" What do those groups represent then, "the right"?"_

It is possible to have other disagreements with those viewpoints despite what
others might believe. For example, it is absolutely ideologically consistent
that while the left may support atheism in the abstract they would also fail
to support its logical conclusion that Islam as a religion and its
practitioners should be re-educated.

Similarly, the right may support gun owners but still disagree that
felons/minorities should be allowed to own firearms.

~~~
hartpuff
"The Jews" is an accepted shorthand for some people, and like "the left" you
can be fairly certain the argument around the term is not going to focus on
what a great bunch of lads they are.

As to the other point, if both groups are "the left" (even though in this case
one group is not behaving that way) then why argue that "the left" is
censoring/repressing, when it's at least equally true (I'd say more true) that
"the left" is being censored/repressed?

I mean it's pretty funny seeing people on "the right" pretending to care that
feminists and gay-rights activists are being shut down.

~~~
angersock
_" The Jews" is an accepted shorthand for some people,_

Many of those people themselves being Jewish, referring to their own
communities and people! I see what you're driving at, but the simple fact of
the matter is that "leftist" is no more an automatic insult that "rightist"
unless one is misidentified.

 _I mean it 's pretty funny seeing people on "the right" pretending to care
that feminists and gay-rights activists are being shut down._

I think it's reasonable that even the most die-hard reactionary may see the
existential threat posed by policies and behaviors used to silence folks they
might otherwise like. After all, mob justice is never _guaranteed_ to stay in
one's favor.

------
naringas
<tin-foil-hat> Is it just me or is education being slowly but steadily
subverted in many countries at once? </tin-foil-hat>

~~~
bsder
Sort of. But it's more pernicious than that.

What is the purpose of going to a University/College?

The purpose _SHOULD_ be education and enlightenment. The purpose has _BECOME_
vocational training for a job.

~~~
naringas
Do you think that most universities are starting to operate like corporate
businesses? with corporate priorities and corporate practices?

------
csense
Popehat, a blog of free-speech lawyers, is a great source for in-depth
articles on this kind of thing. Two recent examples: [1] [2]

[1] [https://popehat.com/2016/02/19/williams-college-our-
students...](https://popehat.com/2016/02/19/williams-college-our-students-are-
children-and-we-must-protect-them/)

[2] [https://popehat.com/2016/03/08/marc-randazza-something-
doesn...](https://popehat.com/2016/03/08/marc-randazza-something-doesnt-click-
here/)

------
tomlock
The author seems to reminisce about a time when universities were pure outlets
of free thought. At that time women were vastly outnumbered by men in
universities. The time when universities were pure and free for everyone
exists only in the authors imagination.

~~~
CyberDildonics
You didn't back up anything you were saying. It looks to me like women crossed
the majority in 1960.

[http://blogs.berkeley.edu/wp-
content/uploads/2011/05/gender-...](http://blogs.berkeley.edu/wp-
content/uploads/2011/05/gender-college_goldin-et-al-2006.jpg)

~~~
chongli
Read the graph more carefully. That is birth year, not graduation year.

~~~
CyberDildonics
Good catch. That would be 1978 for enrollment and 1982 for graduation.

------
Spooky23
Universities have a lot of overhead these days, and to paraphrase Mel Brooks
in Blazing Saddles, the assistant deputy vice provosts say "we gotta protect
our phoney baloney jobs".

------
matt_wulfeck
We're becoming a society that values having or feelings affirmed rather more
than having the truth affirmed. Is this not at the core of what we're seeing?

------
alricb
I'm not British, so it's hard to judge, but I'm not entirely certain the
interpretation he gives of the events cited are completely accurate.

This is a man who supported the Iraq invasion and accused protesters of
harming the civil rights of the citizens of Iraq.

------
marcoperaza
When moral relativism is your religion, anyone with moral conviction is your
enemy and must be silenced.

What's most pitiful is the cowardice displayed by all who should know better.
University trustees and professors, business leaders, entertainers, and every
last one of us who has ever surrendered to this tyranny in our schools, our
jobs, or our communities. Instead of fighting back, we capitulate and cower in
fear for our reputations and livelihoods. Seeing this in my own country,
America, especially disgusts me. How many good men have put down their lives
to secure for us the blessings of liberty. Today, we lack the confidence and
courage to even raise a word in their defense.

~~~
loup-vaillant
Okay, I'm lost: why the downvotes? This sounds like reasonable comment, even
useful (the first sentence is a good summary of the article's subject). I see
no attack to any particular group.

What in this comment could possibly rub HN the wrong way?

~~~
over
I think it's just that there's a lot of dramatic and hyperbolic words and
phrases in there, here's a list from a quick pass:

> religion, anyone, conviction, enemy, must, silenced

> most, pitiful, cowardice, all, should, every last one of us, ever,
> surrendered, tyranny, fighting, capitulate, cower, fear

> my own country, America; disgusts, good men, put down their lives, secure,
> blessings, liberty, lack, confidence, courage, even, a word, defense

A few of these would be fine.

~~~
marcoperaza
Dramatic is the right tone here. We are seeing the collapse of intellectual
freedom and openness in the places where it was supposed to be valued most.
This does not bode well for our civilization. My generation, the millennials,
holds free speech in much lower regard than previous generations.
[http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2015/11/20/40-of-
millen...](http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2015/11/20/40-of-millennials-
ok-with-limiting-speech-offensive-to-minorities/) . Everyone who values
freedom should be very alarmed.

~~~
indrax
Millenials didn't invent video game ratings, movie ratings, the seven 'dirty'
words, the hays code, or blacklists.

If your generation targets something that's actually harmful, you're ahead of
the game.

Consider a space that becasue all speech is allowed, is dominated by speech
that marginalizes some subset of the population. Is that 'free'?

I think that if you want a place of intellectual exploration, excluding people
is as dangerous as excluding certain ideas. And there seems to be a trade-off.

~~~
marcoperaza
I very recently graduated from a college where these activists were very
active. I can assure you, that there is not some epidemic of racism or any
other kind of discrimination that this is a legitimate reaction to. It's
nothing short of a political power-grab and an attempt to shut down any
discussion by people that they don't agree with. They have successfully
created a climate of fear. The reaction among all of the different
institutions--different academic and administrative departments, student
groups, greek organizations, alumni groups, etc.--is nothing short of race to
capitulate the fastest.

