
US Navy to pay $1M to make Android more secure - ariabov
http://sbirsource.com/grantiq#/topics/87888a
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vabmit
The DoD is committing to Android as a platform in a massive way. Apps 4 Army
is a key example. The push is so large and widespread that I think it will
force the whole US Gov't along with it. Everyone from political leaders, to
soldiers, to doctors at VA hospitals, to employees at defense contractors,
will be required to use Android because of government security certifications
and custom apps. There's a good chance that Android will become the very
dominant winner in the mobile platform space because of this.

~~~
r00fus
I've heard this before. Remember 15+ years ago when the US Army chose
WebObjects because it was so obscure it had no security issues? How is their
adoption of Apple server gear since then?

~~~
mpyne
DoD has a very effective PKI system using smart-cards deployed, so I wouldn't
be as surprised as you to see them develop a baseline of software for Android.

What I would be surprised about is whether it's usable without needing 7
different contractor apps installed, or less than 3 years behind the times.

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shubb
Summary -

The US navy wants to use (near) commercial android devices. These might be
used to display confidential reports (as in a normal buisness), but may also
be used to control the ship.

The navy already have secure versions of Linux and Windows, and want something
similar for android.

This will take the form of additional security layers, similar to the ones the
NSA did for Linux[1].

Some of them will be made commercially available, hopefully increasing
security to the whole platform. If this included e.g. application sandboxing,
you can see that it would be of general interest, particularly to people with
similar needs (Android based control terminal for a power station, or sys
admin wants to roll out policy to coorp devices).

Android is becoming the default embedded OS for a lot of UI, so it's really
nice to see this.

[1]<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Security-Enhanced_Linux>

~~~
jlgreco
Hmm, who actually is the one to usually do this sort of thing?

Clearly it is a good idea, but I don't think it really makes sense for the
Navy to do it for themselves. Isn't this more the sort of thing the NSA should
be doing on the behalf of everyone else in government?

~~~
hallowtech
I think the Naval Research Laboratory is more than capable.

<http://www.nrl.navy.mil>

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jedc
I found it interesting that they specifically called out use on Virginia-class
submarines. As a former submarine officer myself, there certainly are _some_
applications on board where this would certainly make sense. (Not in the
engine room operationally, but in other areas definitely.)

~~~
joyeuse6701
yes, that struck me as odd actually. What about those submarines make them a
good fit with android technology?

~~~
jedc
There's very little space on board a submarine. If the Navy was
willing/interested in putting paper-based workflows onto Android devices, it
could save a good amount of physical space on board.

~~~
mpyne
I just don't see the phone-sized form factor working too well. Maybe for
taking log readings or simple lineups shifts it would be nice, but anything
beyond that is either going to require SUBSAFE certification (e.g. fly-by-wire
interfacing) or need to be tablet-sized or larger (e.g. running DC Central or
looking up operating procedures).

And God only forbid you drop one of those mobiles in the bilge...

~~~
jedc
Like the other commenter, I think the opportunity is more for tablets, too.

There are just so damn many things that need to be logged and tracked on paper
and that don't have anything to do with [reactor operations, SUBSAFE,
emergency/DC procedures]. If you can reduce the stacks of binders and/or
manuals, and also improve process compliance, it would be well worth the
effort.

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NinjaSudo
The fact that this project is "focused on reducing the impact of short life
cycles for commercial mobile devices" excites me as I'm sure many folks
dislike how quickly technology grows obsolete and stale when you just bought a
new phone and a new one comes out a few weeks later. That being said, security
of mobile devices is an increasingly important issue as we become more and
more reliant on information connectivity for our daily lives.

I would be curious to hear the results of Phase I and of course look at the
framework they use to extend the Android OS.

Why not try to commit the Security extensions into the Android project?

~~~
eterm
They didn't say they're lengthening the life cycle, they said they plan on
reducing the security impact of such short life cycles.

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brucehart
The Navy has an SBIR solicitation out for this topic, but it does not
necessarily mean that it is going to put up $1MM. Phase I funding is small
(less than $100k per award) and sometimes no Phase II contracts are awarded
for a topic. Of course, the Navy could also spend much more than $1MM if they
decide to fund multiple Phase IIs (also not uncommon). It really depends on
the results they see during Phase I and the importance of the topic compared
to other funding opportunities.

~~~
cjones99
The average is for them to fund 2-5 Phase 1 awards at $150K and then 1-2 Phase
II awards of $1MM each based on the most promising of the Phase I. Given
recent changes to the SBIR program, note that Phase I SBIRs can now be for
$150K and Phase IIs at $1MM.

It can happen, but is rare, that they would fund nothing on a topic in the
solicitation.

And as you say, compelling results out of the SBIR work can lead to follow-on
work that is >> $1MM.

The short of it is, the Navy is interested in this topic, and if you have a
small tech business with innovative ideas in this space there is a great
funding opportunity here for you to advance your tech and grow your business.

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jiggy2011
Note: By "less hackable" they mean "more secure" and not "less open".

~~~
dublinben
I think the military appreciates the security advantages of open source more
than many other organizations. There's really no way to trust national
security information to black-box proprietary systems. This concern has even
extended to the actual chips running the software, since they're often made in
China.

~~~
jiggy2011
I always assumed the military would insist on having full sourcecode for
everything they used, to protect against an important supplier going out of
business and the like.

I'd be surprised if they didn't have access to all of the code for pretty much
every Windows product for example.

~~~
neurotech1
The problem is support. If DoD actually do a source update to a supported
software package, such as Windows XP, MS is not required to support that
update. From what I understood, if its a security flaw, or major operational
impact, they work with MS to fix it and that doesn't cause support problems to
the same extent.

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out_of_protocol
Raise of android-based embedded devices is coming. Android already ate ~70% of
selling smartphones and now spreading to non-phone areas, like car systems,
fridges, cash machines and so on. I really hope android will become even more
secure in next few years. Otherwise ... imagine it by ourselves

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samspenc
Why doesn't Google apply? :) They get $1 million to improve Android security -
and they can just do it and integrate it into the next release for everyone!

~~~
jjohnson
Google is far from a small business, these are funding opportunities for
companies with less than 500 employees.

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notthemessiah
This comes hot off the heels of the ACLU filing a FTC complaint about lack of
security: [http://www.aclu.org/blog/technology-and-liberty/aclu-
files-f...](http://www.aclu.org/blog/technology-and-liberty/aclu-files-ftc-
complaint-over-android-smartphone-security) Interesting that where the market
and the FTC fails to act, the Navy finds it necessary to pick up the slack.

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derrida
Can anybody comment on how the Navy restriction to US citizens only developing
this plays into the FOSS ecosystem of Android? I assume most of it is GPLv2,
so isn't this immaterial? Why would it matter when the code is completely
FOSS?

~~~
mpyne
Because it's a legal and/or regulatory requirement, which are not required to
make sense in the scope of unusual market environments, let alone normal ones.
:-/

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iam
Seems like a great idea. I expect most of their contributions will make it
back to open source via AOSP, and people will be able to run their own secure
non-proprietary versions of Android.

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rdtsc
The whole device hardware and software needs to be certified. It is hard to
make a secure piece of software and prove it so if the hardware or firmware it
is running on is compromised.

~~~
tptacek
Pfft. Have you ever had a project EALx/Common Criteria certified? The program
is a joke. You can certify a ham sandwich if you document what brand of mayo
you use.

~~~
rdtsc
We had some experience with it but indirectly. EALx is a bureaucratic joke,
but I see FIPS 140-2 more emphasized.

The higher the level of the customer (the more authority they have) the more
flexible they are. Some lower level labs don't really have much of a choice
but accept a standard boiler plate set of certification stamps.

~~~
tptacek
FIPS 140-2 is very narrowly constrained and the parts that aren't crypto-
related are the same kind of boilerplate make-work that EAL2/EAL3 is. But also
bear in mind that you can pull a list of EAL4+ products right now, and quickly
see how many of them have had ridiculous vulnerabilities.

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rdl
Has anyone on hn experimented with the Samsung security stuff yet?

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RexRollman
Fucking Navy. First they waste tons of money on NMCI and then tons more on
Navy ERP. I'm amazed anything works.

~~~
mpyne
NMCI is actually quite successful in meeting most of its design criteria.
Unfortunately said criteria don't seem to include rolling releases to recent
software, or cost effectiveness (the contract seems optimized to ensure you
have to go through the help desk for _anything_ and incur a charge).

I can't speak to ERP but I'd be surprised if it were any worse than our
existing menagerie of mainframe-based "corporate data" systems that run batch
transactions once a day and require tedious manual correction seemingly all
the time.

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jjohnson
For all of you Flipper fanatics, I found a gem of a funding source "To develop
probiotic pharmaceuticals to treat and prevent gastrointestinal disease in
dolphins and improve their health through the utilization of indigenous
commensal microbes of these marine mammals."
<https://sbirsource.com/grantiq#/topics/87793> . Big money to solve these big
problems: <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6S6PPKUDGfc>

