
“Out of an abundance of caution” – An overused phrase (2015) - enos_feedler
http://www.bifurcatedneedle.com/new-blog/2015/7/22/out-of-an-abundance-of-caution-an-overused-phrase
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philwelch
I used to have a deep revulsion for cliches in general, so I definitely get
where this guy is coming from. The thing is, cliches work when they encode
concepts in ways that everyone understands. I don't remember the specific
example, but I remember one conversation where I was tediously trying to
explain and apply a concept that there was already a 3-4 word cliche for, and
the person I was talking to impatiently just blurted out the cliche at me. I
was annoyed because I was trying to avoid invoking cliches, but I later
realized that invoking cliches can actually be an efficient form of
communication.

~~~
ethbro
I noticed NPR commentators in the US (particularly younger, progressive ones)
love the adjective "problematic."

Upon reflection in the car, I literally have no idea what information they're
trying to convey via its use. It seems obviously defined on its face, but
problematically lacking when one tries to characterize it in detail.

Are you saying it's bad? Wrong? Unjust? I have no idea!

~~~
duxup
That word very quickly became nonsensical filler for "it's bad" or "I don't
like it" or "I disagree".

At one point it was useful for some specific cases (like all such words) but
the nature of it being vague meant you could throw it around aimlessly ... and
it lost meaning quickly.

It happens with a lot of new phrases and words that seem to carry with them
some depth and such and they are quickly abused to the point of losing all
meaning and context.

~~~
whatshisface
"I don't like it" sounds like your own subjective opinion, but "it's
problematic" projects your own subjectivity on to the object as if it was a
property of the object.

~~~
closeparen
It's typically used in reference to a well-known criticism or controversy. If
you're the first one to flag the problem, then you would be more precise.

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Stratoscope
(2015) but very relevant today.

The other phrase that gets my goat is "for your convenience and safety". When
I hear that, my first thought is it will be something inconvenient that
doesn't improve my safety.

You could combine these two phrases!

"Out of an abundance of caution, we now require you to $SOMETHING for your
convenience and safety."

~~~
pensatoio
That phrase is the epitome of the United Kingdom these days

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prostheticvamp
What is funny is that is not at all my experience right now. The only people I
see using the phrase “out of an abundance of caution” are the ones who are
massively under reacting, but want to be seen doing something. For instance my
gym just sent out an email telling people to make sure they wash their hands
when they come to the gym. That email was described as being sent out of “an
abundance of caution”.

~~~
dwd
Yeah, there are times and situations where this is appropriate; now is not one
of them. In the current circumstances a 40-70% chance of contracting, and a 5%
mortality rate is neither low risk or low impact for an individual.

If you estimated the risk of something as fairly low probability but with a
large impact: out of "an abundance of caution" is highly warranted. I would
think getting your flu shot each year would qualify saying that.

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josh_fyi
The legal phrase “Out of an abundance of caution” has a technical meaning:
“The fact that I am dealing with this problem should not be taken to imply
that I agree that there is any real legal problem or that I am taking any
responsibility for one.”

~~~
kazagistar
Interesting. That doesn't match my informal understand, but actually explains
a lot about how it's being used today. There is a certain amount of emphasis
on weasely avoidance of liability and not earnestly confronting problems
properly baked right in.

~~~
TeMPOraL
This may be intended to solve/work around the problem of Copenhagen
Interpretation of Ethics - i.e. if you as much as touch a small part of a
problem, you're now considered responsible for solving the whole thing.

[https://blog.jaibot.com/the-copenhagen-interpretation-of-
eth...](https://blog.jaibot.com/the-copenhagen-interpretation-of-ethics/)

~~~
manicdee
This is why nobody goes to the good place anymore.

Such a pedantic concept of ethics means nobody can do any good.

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dionidium
The exact opposite is happening with this phrase in the current situation. The
only people saying they’re doing something, “out of an abundance of caution”
seem really to be saying something like, “this doesn’t seem necessary, but
we’re getting some pressure to do it, so we’re doing it,” or they’re saying it
about actions that are far too limited given the actual threat.

Here’s an example from Chick-fil-A in my inbox: “We’ve instructed anyone who
is not feeling well to stay home out of an abundance of caution...”

That’s not an _abundance_ of caution, for crying out loud! That’s the absolute
minimum anybody should be doing in response. It’s likely far too measured.

~~~
kiawe_fire
It's also a great way to encourage people who may, for example, be skeptical
of everything to take actions they otherwise wouldn't.

Think you just have the common cold and won't be doing any harm by going out
like normal? Well... out of an abundance of caution, stay home anyway.

Your point is well taken that this is probably the least anybody could be
doing, but nonetheless, the actual actions being taken and the end result
seems to be positive, which is far more important than the language behind it,
IMO.

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will_pseudonym
"That's a great question." is another one that you won't be able to unhear.

This Freakonomics podcast was what made me aware of it consciously.
[https://freakonomics.com/podcast/thats-a-great-question-a-
ne...](https://freakonomics.com/podcast/thats-a-great-question-a-new-
freakonomics-radio-podcast/)

~~~
Thorrez
As the blog post points out, "Out of an abundance of caution" is used to hide
the truth and harm people's freedom. I don't think "That's a great question"
has serious problems like that.

~~~
philwelch
"That's a great question" is a filler phrase that lets you stall while you're
figuring out how to answer the question. It also flatters the asker of the
question, so you can kill two birds with one stone.

~~~
csours
Somebody called me on this last week. The thing is, I really do think it's a
good question if I can't immediately answer it!

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mds
The first time I remember hearing the phrase was in 2009 when Roberts flubbed
the swearing in oath at Obama's inauguration. They later announced that the
oath was administered again privately "out of an abundance of caution."

Was that the origin, or was it in use before that?

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hammock
[https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=%22abundance+o...](https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=%22abundance+of+caution%22&case_insensitive=on&year_start=1800&year_end=2018&corpus=15&smoothing=3&share=&direct_url=t1%3B%2C%22%20abundance%20of%20caution%20%22%3B%2Cc0)

~~~
judge2020
Earliest I found (in terms of books with a year next to them) is from 1689:

[https://books.google.com/books?id=4zJWAAAAYAAJ&newbks=1&newb...](https://books.google.com/books?id=4zJWAAAAYAAJ&newbks=1&newbks_redir=0&dq=%22%22%20abundance%20of%20caution%20%22%22&pg=PA23#v=onepage&q=%22%22%20abundance%20of%20caution%20%22%22&f=false)

~~~
richardfontana
Specifically for "out of an abundance of caution", in Google Books there begin
to be usages around 1911, based on a very quick search. As noted by someone
else it's a pretty common phrase among American lawyers.

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duxup
I think folks who make these announcements or send these emails just don't
want to screw up and copy and paste what they see from other emails /
announcements that they see. They just don't want to say something wrong /
stupid...

As for the whole "risks" thing, some random administrator at a school has zero
clue what the real risks are at this point, let alone even medical
professionals who only know of confirmed cases.

This is unknown territory for everyone using that phrase and I'm not sure
anyone knows what will happen in a day, two days, a week.

It seems like a tall order to ask people to " But let’s be honest with
ourselves and others about the risks we face and act accordingly, rather than
out of an abundance of caution. " when they don't know the risks seems like a
loop right back to "an abundance of caution".

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glup
I use this as a heuristic for people/institutions with out of date risk
models. It seems like it usually refers to a Coronavirus response that is at
least 5 days behind the timely response, and often much more than that.

~~~
duxup
Does anyone have any good risk models / do any administrators for say schools,
or anyplace that isn't medical really have any information that would provide
them accurate risk models?

I think it is more, they just don't know / there isn't good data for them.

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michaelmrose
I see your "abundance of caution" and raise you a

"thank you for your anticipated cooperation"

~~~
dwd
Was a Ravenous Bugblatter Beast of Traal involved?

Raise that with a "We apologise for the inconvenience".

~~~
michaelmrose
It was on the public bulletin board for a apartment complex.

The complex changed hands and the new complex management was in the habit of
closing with that remark. We took it as a sign and moved.

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jasonhansel
A few other similarly annoying phrases:

\- "In light of recent events"

\- "Due to unforeseen circumstances"

\- "It has become necessary"

Am I missing any?

~~~
jrockway
"Thanks in advance."

Why not thank me now?

~~~
rglullis
Isn't "Thanks in advance" _precisely_ a way of saying "I am thanking you now
for something I am expecting will be done only in the (near) future"?

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supernova87a
Well, when people have no quantitative risk metric to judge their actions by,
how else do you suppose they explain their thinking?

Would you have them say something like, "given the risk of inaction causing an
incremental 2% infection cases among our customer population, we judged that
imposing an added cost of $5 per employee and customer was a reasonable
choice"?

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FpUser
Police favorite: "high rate of speed"

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sk5t
Oh buddy, I hate "high rate of speed" so much. Speed is already a rate of
travel. This is just adding words and blather in an attempt to sound official,
and not too far from "utilize" in place of "use," or "methodology" in place of
"system." Or "vehicle" for "car."

~~~
Spooky23
They talk like that to sound factual and remove ambiguity in a legal sense.

If you say “he was driving too fast”, “or he was speeding” that’s potentially
a subjective assessment.

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FpUser
What on earth make high rate non objective. Also I am curious why downvotes

