
Apple unveils new iPad 9.7“ with Apple Pencil support - nimeshneema
https://www.theverge.com/2018/3/27/17167054/new-apple-ipad-announced-cheap-price-students-2018
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adpirz
A lot of folks are definitely hitting on the note about not having a keyboard
being a major ding, especially considering they're trying to compete at the
same price point a Chromebooks. But as someone whose worked with classroom
deployment of tech, what makes Google so amazing is not just the form factor,
but how easy it is to manage and deploy multiple devices. Google makes it easy
to create and manage accounts, push apps out, restrict with all sorts of
granularity, and none of it is tied to a device. It seems from today's event
that Apple is just starting to develop that functionality, but they have a
ways to catch up before they get there.

And I haven't even gotten to how useful the G Suite of apps are as well as
Google Classroom.

I highly doubt today's event will do much if anything to change the tech
landscape of the classroom. I would love to see Microsoft throw into the ring,
though, and am surprised they haven't stepped up.

~~~
remir
Microsoft tried to compete against Chromebooks with their Windows S version
that could only install UWP apps. I don't know how the market has responded,
but from what I can see UWP is pretty much a flop.

~~~
akmittal
Failure of Windows Mobile is big reason of UWP failure. UWP make less sense on
Desktop as it is mostly less featured/Buggy version of perfectly good normal
Windows app.

~~~
yakz
Also, unless you can get your users to work their way through enabling side-
loading, you'll be forking over a third of your sales to Microsoft.

~~~
Kipters
Sideloading is enabled by default since TH2 (November Update) that came out
more than two years ago. You just need to sign the package using a valid
codesign certificate.

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phmagic
I think Chromebooks will still dominate because:

1\. Chromebooks have a much better web browsing experience than iPads. The web
is where a lot of classroom exercises and materials are distributed. It also
provides a lot of flexibility in terms of loading new applications.

2\. Physical keyboard means that there's more room to display content. Imagine
typing up a book report on an on screen keyboard, or creating a presentation.

~~~
robterrell
My kids have school-issued iPads and type reports with the on-screen keyboard
filling half the screen. They're totally used to it. They seem to prefer the
iPad to using a chromebook.

~~~
kevin_thibedeau
iPad === status++. Of course they're going to prefer it regardless of rational
merits either way.

~~~
dagw
_iPad === status++_

Still? Maybe it's because I live in a nice upper middle class area and have
nice upper middle class friends, but I don't think anybody, at any age, sees
the iPad as a status symbol.

~~~
kevin_thibedeau
Conduct an experiment and see how your upper middle class kids respond when
their iWant is replaced with a downmarket Google product.

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0xCMP
I love my iPad Pro, but as someone looking to use a device as basically a
powerful remote terminal I think Chromebooks are better. iPad Pro is not what
they released, but I have experience trying to use the device like how they'd
intend for kids in schools and I would never pick iPads over Chromebooks.

In fact I keep almost buying a Pixelbook because it simply would do what I
want better even though nothing would be "native" as it is on the iPad. Solid
keyboard, still has touch and pen input (not that I'd really use it), and full
access to browser and extra stuff.

In school you want them to have access to any of the web tools out there
(chrome is best for web compatibility and developers target it where safari
often lags strangely and is missing features. Try for instance to navigate
[http://amazon.com](http://amazon.com) on an iPad Pro 10.5" and you'll see the
problems) with a single login system so the device doesn't matter that is
easily audited and managed by a teacher with support provided by the IT at the
school.

Chromebooks hands down.

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otalp
What's interesting with pencil support is if it'll affect sales of the iPad
pro. The processors are now comparable for everyday tasks, so is the better
speaker + screen worth 600+ dollars? That is in addition to spending $200+ on
a pencil and keyboard that you might as well get if you're getting a iPad Pro.
At that point it's 3x as expensive as the cheap iPad with the same pencil and
keyboard.

~~~
orloffm
Pros have higher refresh rate, so probably if you take drawing seriously the
"usual" iPad is easily not an option.

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giobox
> if you take drawing seriously the "usual" iPad is easily not an option.

If you take drawing seriously the 60hz refresh is still fine - no artist I
know drawing on the original iPad Pro ran out to upgrade solely due to Pro
Motion/120hz refresh support.

For sure having a higher refresh rate is _nicer_, but not having it is hardly
a deal-breaking flaw. My wife draws voraciously on an iPad and while the
difference was noticeable to me if I really look for it, she didn't even
pickup on the improved refresh at all when she tried a model with Pro Motion
for a while before going back to her launch 12.9" model.

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gordon_freeman
Apple's push to include AR in the classroom setting is what excites me from
this event today. I think AR has tremendous potential in education sector
where it can easily encourage students on applied learning.

~~~
giarc
A trip to the museum, from your desk.

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nimeshneema
The new iPad product page:

[https://www.apple.com/ipad-9.7/](https://www.apple.com/ipad-9.7/)

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notfromhere
Apple continually misunderstanding that you need a keyboard if you're going to
go against Chromebooks in education.

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0942v8653
Apple is already serious competition against Chromebooks in education. I know
of no school district near me which uses Chromebooks, but a few that use
iPads.

Plus, it's easier to add a keyboard to an iPad than to remove it from the
Chromebook (and replace with touchscreen).

~~~
r00fus
I have kids one one district (close to Cupertino) that uses both iPads and
Chromebooks.

I hear the Chromebooks are easier to deploy/manage, but like the iPads, each
kid gets one.

That said the kids prefer the iPads. I'm not sure if/how the Pencil will
change the game.

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gd2
Glad that Apple is making an effort to re-engage with Google in the education
market. In my limited experience, Apple is way ahead in apps that use the
stylus effectively, but the Chrome App "Squid" shows that the tech is there
for Chromebook to do almost zero lag drawing.

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disease
Anyone know if art apps like Procreate will work as well on this as they do on
the iPad pro? I'm happy with my Air 2 and would love to draw on the couch or
on the porch with it, but the iPad Pro is just complete overkill for me.

~~~
Synaesthesia
I don’t see why not it’s got the same processor as the Pro.

~~~
garmaine
A10 != A10X

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Synaesthesia
True but it’s still highly advanced - an improvement on the A9 which was a
major improvement on the A8, which performed quite well already.

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hinkley
I’m still bummed the mini seems to be dead. It’s a great size for hauling
around.

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Analemma_
So it's $299-- unless you want the keyboard and pencil, then it's $450.

Yeah, no. Schools are getting Chromebooks with keyboards included for $199
each. Apple is going to continue getting walloped in this space.

~~~
r00fus
No, it's $450 for consumers, $388 for education

~~~
Someone1234
So still almost twice as much (+$189) as a Chromebook? And with more
accessories to manage/lose. There's a reason why the Chromebook is doing so
well in this space, low price, single clamshell units, not tied to a single
user, easy to manage, sane defaults for education, and does 90% of what a
classroom needs.

Are there compelling iPad apps? Sure. Can the iPad w/pen offer things a
Chromebook cannot? Absolutely. But the price remains too high, and Apple has
yet to prove they can offer a seamless iPad cart experience with limited
setup. The current iPad setup experience is a headache.

~~~
drak0n1c
Apple makes its business selling to the sizable population who has money to
spend and enjoys iOS apps and Apple hardware features. There is a similar set
of premium academies in education. Tesla didn't wait to enter the car market
until it was able to build a cheap car.

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bradgessler
The Apple Pencil is a choking hazard for kids (even adults); I get nervous
when my 2 year old daughter picks it up. I hope they redesign the pencil so
that it’s more kid friendly.

~~~
tlrobinson
Just the cap or is there something else about it? Can you just take the cap
off?

~~~
strmpnk
I've never tested this for obvious reasons but when that pencil is sticking
out of the lightning port during charging, it looks awfully vulnerable.
Damaging the pencil is one thing but breaking the port on the iPad itself is
another.

~~~
flycaliguy
They also ship with a cord adaptor for charging with a plug. I never plug mine
into the iPad, which charges fast by the way, like 15 min.

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__david__
I wish they'd add pencil support to the iPhone. Right now I've got little
pocket sized notepads and a pen, but it would be nice to be digital…

~~~
garmaine
Or the iPad mini;

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rhinoceraptor
Or at least update the iPad mini, I'd say the mini is dead like the Macbook
Air.

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fitzroy
FYI: It's $309 for individuals with the education discount ($329 for the
general public, $299 for schools). The Pencil is also $89 for individual
education customers.

[https://www.apple.com/us-hed/shop/buy-
ipad/ipad-9-7](https://www.apple.com/us-hed/shop/buy-ipad/ipad-9-7)

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slivanes
"What's a computer?". But now Apple want it to behave like a computer in the
classroom?

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lobotryas
Does anyone know how well the iPad announced today compares to the current
$329 iPad (without Pencil support)?

I've never owned an iPad before, but think it's time I jumped on the
consumption device bandwagon.

~~~
owyn
Looks like mainly an upgraded A9->A10 chip, and the support for the pencil.
Since it's the same price, it's probably worth waiting (or getting an older
one when the price drops)

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hartator
I wonder if they have done anything with writting lag.

I’ve used a ReMarkable tablet, and experiencing a virtually non-lag writting
and drawing on an e-ink display is really something.

~~~
garmaine
There is zero observable lag on the iPad Pro. I use it daily. I do wonder
about the 9.7" iPad though, as it doesn't have a 120Hz display.

~~~
eludwig
I own the first 12.9 iPad Pro and it has no Apple Pencil lag that I can
detect. It also does not have the Pro Motion 120Hz display.

I think Apple did something along the lines of doubling the sampling rate (not
sure of the exact number) of the capacitive layer to eliminate pencil lag.
Seems to be fine, at least for me. Maybe they did something similar with the
new iPad?

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iwaffles
For those of you with kids:

1\. Do your kids prefer using an iPad over a computer with a keyboard?

2\. Do you prefer them to use an iPad over a laptop?

~~~
jandrese
My 4 year olds prefer the tablet, but the 8 year old prefers the laptop.

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GeekyBear
At first glance, this seems to be the iPad Pro with LTE at yesterday's entry
level iPad's price.

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falcolas
At that price, I'll buy one, and I'm several dozen years removed from school.

~~~
kylec
This is the same price as the 2017 iPad - what about this one makes you want
to buy it vs buying the previous model last year?

edit: I guess not having pencil support last year was a dealbreaker for
several people

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DanHulton
For me, it's the Pencil integration.

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bsaul
is a pencil able to enter text in a regular UITextfield ? i'm a developer and
i still can't determine whether this pencil can be used in my app for regular
text input without buying one.

~~~
cmsj
No, there's no system-wide handwriting recognition in iOS for regular UI
elements.

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singularity2001
that's really a shame. didn't Samsung have that 3 years ago?

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beached_whale
I hope that the 2017 9.7" iPad will work with the pencil too

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berberous
It needs hardware, so no, they won't backport support.

