
Who killed Olof Palme? - ptype
https://www.theguardian.com/news/2019/may/16/olof-palme-sweden-prime-minister-unsolved-murder-new-evidence
======
kartan
I pass by Adolf Fredrik Church, where he is buried, each day.

It was sad to see two people guarding his tomb all day, even in the rain, in
the day that commemorates his dead.

I have also read a book about his assassination that I will recommend to skip
and read about his ideas instead.

It will be better to share his ideas than to focus on his death. I think that
his world view is more needed now than ever.

~~~
simlevesque
Do you have any source that lay out his ideas ?

~~~
nxcho
I would eye through some of his speeches. A couple of english translations can
be found here
[http://web.archive.org/web/20180524035711/http://www.olofpal...](http://web.archive.org/web/20180524035711/http://www.olofpalme.org/en/documents-
in-various-languages)

------
mongol
Would be interesting to hear how "interesting" this article is for an
international audience. As a Swede I am sick and tired about all speculation
over the years. It is like a wound that never heals. We will never know for
sure. Probably like the JFK assasination.

~~~
IfOnlyYouKnew
I always enjoy these articles (to the extend that one can take joy in them),
because they rarely fail to highlight how different politics can be.

For an American audience, it's unthinkable that a leader of a government would
go anywhere without their own private army. When I used to work in central
Berlin, I regularly saw members of parliament and ministers have coffee or
just walk around completely unprotected. Even Merkel could be seen with only
modest security (usually two people), usually walking to/from her flat about a
kilometre away from her office.

It's a world where a stranger is not primarily a threat, possibly-armed, and
where civility hasn't completely broken down. And it's not even that rare.

Of course, the story itself kinda speaks against this view of the world.

~~~
rurban
I remember when I sat just behind José Manuel Barroso, that time the leader of
the European Commission in a commercial airline, tourist class. I loved that
guy, like the former Uruguayan president.

~~~
PTcartelsLOL
Good thing you like him. People in Portugal don't like him that much.

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mortb
One of the theories about who shot him (there are many
[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assassination_of_Olof_Palme](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assassination_of_Olof_Palme))
points to South Africa. There is also a theory that South Africans killed Dag
Hammarskjöld, the Swedish UN leader
[https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/jan/20/south-
africa-w...](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/jan/20/south-africa-weird-
sinister-apartheid-mercenary-saimr-keith-maxwell)

------
bjourne
The murder of OP isn't that interesting. Everyone who is knowledgeable about
the case knows it can't have been a conspiracy. It was a lone gunman, possibly
a drug addict, seeing OP and his wife, seizing the opportunity to kill him.

But what is interesting is the completely disastrous following investigation.
The police in Stockholm fucked up in every possible way there is to fuck up.
Records were not kept, witnesses were promised rewards for testifying, they
didn't investigate the crime scene properly, chased after wild conspiracy
theories about South Africa and PKK and so on. Eventually they brought in
experts from the FBI, but then it was already too late because it is much
harder to solve a murder three years after the fact than one month after. The
only reason the murderer went free is the insane incompetence displayed.

~~~
acqq
> Everyone who is knowledgeable about the case knows it can't have been a
> conspiracy. It was a lone gunman

Can you please elaborate? I could very well imagine a seemingly lone gunman
who would indeed be a part of a conspiracy, and I have a kind of a direct
experience: I was personally a victim of a robbery where only one man attacked
me, in what at that moment appeared to me as a completely random attack. Only
after that didn't went as planned, a second man came, but not to help me but
to help him, to my complete surprise. By chance and my luck the attack was
ultimately not successful, but their goal was anyway not to harm me but just
to get something I've possessed. Even more interestingly, after reporting the
case to the police and after the investigation based on my previous movements
before the attack it turned out that these two had two more accomplices. In
total, at least four men were involved in one "small" robbery attack. The
police told me they are aware of many such cases, and that there was probably
even a fifth person involved who coordinated the four. And this all happened
in the country and city of more or less comparable overall security and well
being to Stockholm, not somewhere where everybody expects such dangers.

So what appeared to be a random attack is actually often indeed planned and
involves more people. Even the thieves seldom operate alone.

Then what should be the arguments that there wasn't any conspiracy there?

~~~
bjourne
> Can you please elaborate? I could very well imagine a seemingly lone gunman
> who would indeed be a part of a conspiracy, and I have a kind of a direct
> experience:

So much has been written about the murder so I can't really add much of value.
Here are a few facts that makes it obvious that murderer wasn't a professional
- hence no conspiracy:

1\. The murderer tried to shot Palme's wife from a distance of about 2 meters
but _missed_. 2. The murder weapon was a loud and heavy revolver. Real
assassins use (silenced) pistols. 3. The murderer kept the gun rather than
disposing it which professional assassins do. 4. The deed took place in one of
Stockholm's busiest corners on a Friday after salary (lot's of drunk people
out). 5. No good escape routes. I walk past the corner many times per week.
All the streets are wide and you have to run for about 100m to the closest
hiding spot (a small cemetary). 6. OP was often without bodyguards. There
would have been way better opportunities to assassinate him.

Roughly, this was the conclusion of the experts from the FBI, who steered the
Swedish police away from the political conspiracy theory to the "lone gunman"
one. People still cling on to the conspiracy theory though. I think it is
easier for them to digest because then there was some "meaning" to the murder,
rather than a drug addicted street-thug doing it for no reason.

Fun (sad) fact; in the 90's you could often see the main suspect of the murder
Christer Petterson (subsequently released) sitting intoxicated on the subway
or commuter rail. People of course avoided him.

~~~
acqq
> a drug addicted street-thug doing it for no reason

It still sounds much less probable than anybody who would do it with an
agenda.

> the streets are wide and you have to run for about 100m to the closest
> hiding spot

Can you post a link to the location? Not being from there and reading about
these details for the first time, it's hard for me to imagine "one of
Stockholm's busiest corners" but with no place to hide for 100m? No buildings?
No entrances to the buildings? No entrances to the combinations of the
buildings where you enter in one block of houses but can magically appear
wherever across, already dressed in new clothes? That's all very doable in the
busy cities I know, especially if somebody already planned and verified one or
two escape routes.

Additionally, there could be a logic behind using an old gun: an origin of an
old gun could be harder to trace, it could have been never recorded or marked.

~~~
bjourne
Sure. Here is the movie theater were Olof Palme and his wife watched a movie:

[https://goo.gl/maps/TWwgVMsroFnSkNH89](https://goo.gl/maps/TWwgVMsroFnSkNH89)

Here is the hot dog stand the couple walked past. The owner thought he saw
someone following them.

[https://goo.gl/maps/QysTTnjg8ek9PiRy5](https://goo.gl/maps/QysTTnjg8ek9PiRy5)

Murder scene. The killer ran into the street after shooting Palme and
attempting to shoot his wife.

[https://goo.gl/maps/biseEKdGTw9A3mzK6](https://goo.gl/maps/biseEKdGTw9A3mzK6)

The killer ran up this flight of stairs. Another indication that he wasn't a
professional. The stairs were ice-covered and slippery so he would risk
falling.

[https://goo.gl/maps/DMqBznb8jVgTv4ci7](https://goo.gl/maps/DMqBznb8jVgTv4ci7)

After the stairs, it is not known what route he took. According to most
witness accounts, he ran straight. Some believe he ran to the left though,
towards the cemetery and hid there.

[https://goo.gl/maps/UWMHDfSCeoyi1nc67](https://goo.gl/maps/UWMHDfSCeoyi1nc67)

~~~
acqq
Thanks! I still don't see how it's an argument that the attack wasn't planned
by somebody else, but it is at least obvious, if I understand that the route
of the attacke is confirmed, that the attacker himself wasn't prepared to
disappear as soon as possible but to simply run for a while.

------
mongol
Something about Olof Palme himself. I don't think there has been any other
politician in Sweden that have split the opinions in society like him. The
left loved him. The right did not. I don't want to reach out for the word
hate, because it is so often used today. He was certainly hated among some,
yes. But more than that, he was despised probably by the majority among the
minority that did not vote left. He left no one neutral.

How come?

A well known quote of his :

"Jag tror efter de studier vi gjort är korrekt att säga att
Arbetsgivareföreningens propagandister i mycket framstår som hatets och
illviljans kolportörer mot svensk arbetarrörelse"

Basically, this in very sofisticated words describes the Employer
organisation's "propagandists" as agents of hate and ill-will against the
labour movement. Quite an insult against political opponents. Today, we are
perhaps used / more exposed to similar language in social media etc. But
during this time, there was nothing like it.

This should be understood against the backdrop of the politics of the time.
Sweden was at the time significantly more socialist, very high income taxes,
and the right probably felt that there were no limits how far social
democratic politicians were prepared to go. Right or wrong, this was the
sentiment among many.

His language was often arrogant and in ways derogatory, but not similar to
Trump's bombastic tone. In contrast, using much more elegant and precise
prose.

I am certain I will get replies that will defend his deeds and oppose how I
describe him. Understand that just like society appeared during his reign -
two sides who could not understand the other.

~~~
mortb
I remember. I was in my early teens when he was murdered. I did not like his
speaking style. It felt too elitist; distanciated / detached.

------
fermigier
"Les chefs des drapeaux rouges et les chefs des chemises noires ne vont qu'au
pas cinglant de leurs bottes guerrières, le torse pris dans un corset de fer à
l'épreuve de l'amour et des balles. Ils vont, tragiques et le flingue sur le
cœur. Ils vont, métalliques et la peur au ventre, vers les palais blindés où
s'ordonnent leurs lois de glace. Ils marchent droits sous leurs casquettes,
leurs yeux durs sous verre fumé, cernés de vingt gorilles pare-chocs qui
surveillent les toits pour repérer la mort. Mais la mort n'est pas pour les
chefs des drapeaux rouges ni pour les chefs des chemises noires. La mort n'est
pas aux fenêtres des rideaux de fer. Elle a trop peur.

La mort est sur Stockholm. Elle signe, d'un trait rouge sur la neige blanche,
son aveu d'impuissance à tuer la liberté des hommes qui vont au cinéma, tout
seuls, bras dessus, bras dessous, avec la femme qu'ils aiment jusqu'à ce que
mort s'ensuive."

Pierre Desproges

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gumby
I am not Swedish, and had not yet visited Sweden at the time, and yet somehow
Palme‘s murder was shocking and memorable to me.

Perhaps it was that it was a blatant murder in a crowded public place, like
something from James Bond. Or the murder of a major public figure, something
that had seemingly gone out of fashion (I remember Lennon’s murder distinctly
as well, but that was a loonie so somehow lacked the same significance to me).

So odd, since I knew nothing of Swedish politics and honestly couldn’t care
less (though I knew who he was, an internationally famous politician).

So whenever his name surfaces I always check out the article. The 80s were
_weird_ , and seem weirder in retrospect.

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thatguyagain
For all non swedes here, you should check out his speeches on youtube. He is
known as a very well speaker.

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egl2019
Bring Martin Beck out of retirement.

~~~
hollibpmpa
I thought it was Gunvald who left??

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saalweachter
Eh, the JFK assassination is more people wanting a conspiracy over the boring
explanations rather than an unsolved murder.

~~~
JohnStrangeII
I wouldn't say so. The CIA and high ranking military officials certainly hated
him and wanted him dead. There was a strong motive and there many
inconsistencies in the way the case was handled afterwards. The majority of
higher ranking CIA officials really considered JFK a traitor, because he
didn't send air support at the bay of pigs (following through with what he had
clearly stated all along). There were claims that he had been subverted by the
Soviets, was deliberately sabotaging the country, etc.

Personally, I remain agnostic but find it fairly credible that Oswald
personally met a group of conspirators from the CIA a few days before the
shooting and these people encouraged him to do what he did, maybe even made
him some false promises about what would happen afterwards. It's also not
unlikely that the killing of Oswald himself followed a similar pattern.

That's all speculation, but overall reasonable speculation, because of the
existing motives. Many conspiracy theories are weak, because they fail to lay
out a credible motive. JFK is not one of those cases.

~~~
barking
But can a conspiracy of more than a very few people be kept under wraps for a
lifetime? I find it hard to believe that if there really was a conspiracy that
nothing concrete has emerged in all these years.

~~~
toyg
When everyone involved has been explicitly been trained and selected to work
with secrets, in a historical period when such activities are extremely
dangerous and brutal, and under the treath of expedite death penalty or
assassination... it's not that hard to believe any involved party would keep
very silent.

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kleton
The Mossad. Palme was a good friend of Palestine.

