

Ask HN: Programming jobs in India? - crysis

this is a throwaway account. I am 26 years old<p>I am a HN lurker since long, My problem is, I am financially broke due to a serious chronic illness of  my parents. I have a real estate which i get rent from. that is all my income.<p>I have been laid off as a software tester. Currently i have saved up money + real estate income which will see me through atleast 2 years. Please suggest me some solid technology/programming domain which will give me a stable job. I have a BSc in CS, and I can get along with any language in a week or two. I just need a stable pay for 5-6 years, So that I can pay for my family's illness. This is kinda urgent, I am ready to learn anything. Please guide me to something which will be stable for atleast 5 years.<p>Edit: I am from India. (Nashik, Maharashtra)<p>Should i do certifications to get into outsourcing compaines?<p>or should i learn ruby and the rails framework?
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btilly
It strongly depends on where you live.

For instance in Los Angeles, there is an excellent market for Perl folks. Just
south in Orange County you couldn't get a Perl job to save your life.

What kinds of industries are in your area, and what technologies do they use?
Whatever they are using now they will need maintained in 5 years, so don't
worry too much about whether it is a sexy, cool technology. Just worry about
getting the first job in something that is employable in your area.

Good luck.

~~~
ntulip
seems he is in India?

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kapilkaisare
As someone living close to you(Pune, MH), I think I can offer relevant advice:

First, realize - and I think you do already - that the days of the software
tester are over. Only if you are working at the larger firms (read Cognizant,
Infosys, Wipro) will your skills be called for in a full time context; even
here, the scene is rapidly changing.

Second, PHP is very easy to learn and easy to produce something useful in. It
is also in greater demand here than Python or Ruby. This will get you a job
fast. Focus on core PHP5, learn to use Smarty, practise writing a few Joomla
plugins and you will have a sellable skill.

Third: if you choose to go with PHP, get the ZCE certification. This will help
you skip the technical rounds at several companies (This is not a good
practise, but you sound like you need whatever you can get your hands on).

Fourth, learn MySQL to the point where constructing joins is second nature. If
you want to, get the CMDEV certifications.

Fifth, learn HTML5 and CSS3; even if you don't use them alot at work(likely if
you're working at a Joomla shop), knowing these will help you clear
interviews. In any case, being ahead of the curve never hurt.

Sixth, and this is very important during a jobhunt: do not get desperate.
Recruiters can smell desperation a mile away and will negotiate you down to a
horrible wage if you let them. Don't. Also, make a point to distinguish
between companies, and favor those that ask you tougher technical questions
during your interview. You are likely to learn more from such a place.

Finally, if you must stick to testing, learn white box testing in any
particular language(Java recommended) and/or learn Selenium thoroughly. There
are still pockets around that hire skillsets like those.

Feel free to pass me a copy of your resume; I'll forward it to a friend I know
who's doing reasonably well in the testing domain.

Good luck.

~~~
ido
I am surprised you recommend getting certifications - I have never seen
anywhere where those are held to be of any sort of value, especially if you
have a computer science degree (I've been working as a programmer for 9 years
at 4 different companies - I've been through my share of interviews).

Might be an Indian thing?

~~~
rnicholson
A few recruiters and HR departments, that I've seen, do value technical
certifications. Depends on the job.

Personally, I'm not a firm believer in valuing technical certifications as
worthless. Overly valued by some, sure, but not worthless.

~~~
kapilkaisare
Recruiters and HR departments value tech certifications because it means they
don't have to test the technical knowledge of the candidate themselves. This
saves time and acts as a 'useful' filter when they are processing resumes en
masse.

To clarify, you wouldn't expect to see this followed at a company where its
programmers are first class citizens; these guys tend to be real thorough.

------
dschobel
1\. Learn the Java syntax; go through some hello world tutorials and then some
OSS code to guide your way.

2\. Read <http://java.sun.com/docs/books/effective/>

3\. Recite one of the lessons you learned from #2 and impress the interviewer
so that you can land that first job.

4\. Become a decent programmer (this step is optional but recommended for
long-term security)

~~~
yantramanav
Nicely put. here are my 2 cents, if you choose Java 1\. Don't try to do too
much (JSF, Spring, JMS, Hibernate etc) its easy to get lost in the jungle
there. Take small steps. 2\. Try to contribute to some open source project
like Lucene or Play! 3\. Java jobs are aplenty in Pune region, so best luck!

~~~
crysis
what kind of java stuff can i learn in a year for stable employment?

~~~
yantramanav
1 year? Try to nail it in 2 months. Try to learn JSP/Servlets, Spring,
Hibernate or Play! framework. Showcase something on GAE. Usually money chases
talent, so give ur best at building skills.

Subscribe to: Punetech.com, pluggd.in, hackerstreet.in and look for jobs on
<http://sutrajobs.com> and
<http://www.venturewoods.org/index.php/venturejobs/>

This guy has given an excellent post on contributing to open source:
[http://shal.in/post/285909694/why-you-should-contribute-
to-o...](http://shal.in/post/285909694/why-you-should-contribute-to-open-
source)

P.S. Avoid being the 'polite Indian' described by jgrahamc by asking ppl to do
ur work ( <http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1886310> )

P.P.S: if you wish to get recruited for Infy, Cogni, Wipro you've come to the
wrong forum

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jacquesm
I find it hard to reconcile the following statements:

> I am financially broke due to a serious chronic illness of my parents.

> I have a real estate which i get rent from.

> Currently i have saved up money + real estate income which will see me
> through atleast 2 years.

Are you sure that you are broke ?

~~~
crysis
Sorry, English is not my first language. I meant to say that I dont have any
income, and whatever income I get from rent+savings will buy food for 2 years.

~~~
jacquesm
> whatever income I get from rent+savings will buy food for 2 years.

Most people I know would consider that to be a pretty good financial
situation, 'broke' is the opposite of that.

What you should do if you can is as long as you haven't found extra income
(though the response in this thread suggests that won't be a problem for long)
to cut down any and all expenses that are not an absolute requirement. That
way you extend your runway while it still matters, if you do that when the two
years of savings are almost up it will be too late. Like that you might be
able to stretch two years in to two years and change.

Another thing you could do it to consider to liquidate your asset, the house
you've got and are renting out. I realize it is a source of income for you,
but it also represents another chunk of savings. Dont do that until you
absolutely have to though!

Best of luck with all this, I hope your fortunes will change.

------
neeleshs
Stability is a pipedream in our industry. If you are good in you area, you
should not have trouble landing a job in any of the large software companies
in Pune/Bangalore. If you are okay relocating to Bangalore, drop me an email
at neeleshs at gmail.

~~~
crysis
sent you an email.

------
rue
I think the first thing to do is to stop worrying overly much. You have enough
funds for 2 years? You are not broke. You have plenty of time to learn and/or
find another job, take your time. Find folks in whatever area you are
interested in and find out which fields are in demand.

~~~
c1sc0
Can't upvote this enough. Somehow our idea of 'wealth' has become very skewed
in the West. I see the same with my family in China. They have savings, are
able to buy e.g. a house in cash while a lot of my family & friends in Europe
are living hand to mouth, practically wage slaces. A stash big enough for 2
years of living is pretty ok in my world. And your stash can probably be
explained by exactly the kind of thinking you're doing right now: planning for
an emergency 2 years ahead of time. If you continue like this you'll be fine.
Best wishes to your family!

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ars
You should look into other methods of helping your family, specifically, (at
least in my state) someone who needs healthcare and can not afford it can
apply for medicaid, it's specifically listed as one of the reasons - even for
those who would normally make too much.

Edit: I just saw that you posted you live in India. I guess that changes
things. Sorry I don't know anything about healthcare in India.

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jonursenbach
If you're in the Bay Area, we're looking for a QA engineer.
<http://gdgt.com/jobs/>

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paulnelligan
There's something odd about this post. First of all, you'll likely find work
in Java OR Python OR Ruby OR PHP OR whatever mainstream language/framework you
choose. Last time I looked, developers were in demand, I presume the situation
is the same for test engineers.

My advice is simple: find another job

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yaswanth
Hey,

I am sorry to hear about your state. I run an online gaming product company
based out of Hyderabad and we have a good team from IITs and IIITs and we are
on continuous look out for good talent. Let me know if you would be interested
to work with us. You can call me on +91-9849129651.

Regards, Yaswanth

~~~
crysis
Great, I will call you in the evening.

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bartman
Sorry to hear that.

In general web development (Rails, HTML, CSS, Javascript, PHP) is always in
demand and you should be able to find something quickly, but it really depends
on where you are located. Look at possible employers in your area and check
out what skills they are looking for. Don't be discouraged by "x years of
experience" as long as it's nothing too specialized as raytracing or compiler
construction. Get familiar with the tools/languages in 1 or 2 little projects
and apply.

Good luck! :)

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mrjain
email me at mjain@mprofit.in we are based in Bombay and looking for talent.

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iuguy
It might be worth having a chat with these guys:
<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1959041>

They have some iPhone apps that they're looking for someone to take over but
aren't sure whether or not they'd be able to hire someone for their budget.
You might be able to help.

------
crysis
thanks for the replies guys, But I live in India. I am thinking of learning
Ruby and Rails. what do you guys think?

~~~
YuriNiyazov
It seems like people from your area do very well on elance.com and
rentacoder.com

Why don't you check it out and see what kinds of projects dominate, and learn
those technologies.

~~~
cookiecaper
Note that they do well because they charge seriously low-ball rates. The wages
are probably good after the currency conversion compared to what's available
in India, but don't go in expecting to find any decent-paying jobs. This might
be a good short-term fix, but I wouldn't expect it to provide stable income
for 5-6 years anyway, and the income will probably not be very good,
especially since you will be competing with other offshore'd developers.
Practically the only reason anyone uses offshore coders is because they cost
1/3 what American coders cost.

~~~
gregpilling
The original poster is from India, not America.

~~~
cookiecaper
I'm aware; I was working under the assumption that he'd want decent wages even
though he is India because 1) he has expensive medical things to pay for and
2) because he wants a stable income for 5-6 years, seemingly something
salaried or professional-level. You don't usually get those kind of rates on
Elance et al. I wanted to point out that it would be especially hard to him to
get good rates on these sites, since if someone is willing to pay a
respectable wage, they usually don't want to use an offshore developer.

------
iworkforthem
I would suggest you get into Android or iPhone development instead. Make some
app. If it is good enough the income is recurring. Plus mobile is most likely
to be huge in the years to come.

~~~
iworkforthem
Got a few emails on how to get started on it.

\- To get started on Android development, you will need Eclipse IDE, the
Android SDK, a few plugins. All of which are free to download at
<http://developer.android.com/index.html> & <http://www.eclipse.org/> ..

1\. Go through the Developer's Guide.
<http://developer.android.com/guide/index.html>

2\. Start off with the problem.

3\. Think about how to solve it. Simplify it more. Take away all the
unnecessary features.

4\. Explore if it is possible to speed up the development by using these
Resources? <http://developer.android.com/resources/samples/index.html>

5\. Launch it early, and get feedback.

6\. Reiterate.

Once you make it to step 6, you are almost there. Stick with it till you are
really good at it. Once you are at this stage, you can either a mobile
developer job or build your app, etc.

------
matdwyer
Out of curiosity, how much per hour/week/month/year are you look to ideally
make? What languages do you already know?

~~~
crysis
I am good with 20-25k rupees (450-550$)/month. As i said, i was a tester,I
have little ruby and java knowledge. But i can also learn python if required
for work.

~~~
matdwyer
In that case, I'd highly suggest learning the ins and outs of ruby or python.
I'm sure you could get an offshore job with a company for that sort of
compensation, or do freelance work to get in that range. Good luck!

------
twapi
not sure if this can "save" you, but you can contribute to technology websites
as freelancer. this is quickest to start earning, just find few blogs looking
for writers. As you are good with programming, your chances are high.

Best wishes!

------
Tichy
Java is probably still the best bet. Ruby on Rails might be OK.

~~~
kls
If it is the quickest path to money COBOL or any mainframe development is
still top dog. There is virtually no competition in this space from new
developers and has a seriously aging population. While the # of jobs in sheer
volume is lower the jobs to head count is much higher. Just applying to a
COBOL job with no experience but a "I'm willing to learn" will land you the
job many times, if you have previous unrelated development experience. COBOL
programmers are commanding $40 hr in India which is close to on par with a
mid-level Java developer in the states. That said it's not sexy work.

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malkia
I've got a lot of friends that are QA in Microsoft - well paid.

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xtrycatchx
you may learn programming online

i can recommend you one, mostly their topics is on java/j2ee with spring

www.adobocode.com

hope this helps

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krung
I am from India , I would suggest you take the SAP certification and join in
as a consultant . The market for SAP is ever green and it pays way better than
testing

