
If you imagine a business making surgical facemasks is working 24/7, guess again - smacktoward
https://www.dallasnews.com/news/watchdog/2020/04/03/if-you-imagine-that-a-local-business-making-surgical-face-masks-is-working-247-guess-again/
======
catherd
The mask situation in the US is truly fucked up right now. I've been finding
and sending masks and other PPE to the US from China. Started out for friends
and family then it expanded to friends-of-friends, then anybody. It has a
really weird dynamic.

I've contacted over 100 hospitals. They don't want to help themselves. It's
all about pushing people into a web form that fronts a bureaucratic system
that supposedly allocates resources efficiently through a central clearing
authority (never heard back from any of them), covering their ass in regards
to regulatory requirements, and not allowing anyone to take advantage of them
by charging money.

Individuals aren't much better. They've had so much conflicting information
drilled into them that of the few who still think masks are needed by regular
people, many feel so guilty about getting them that they can't bring
themselves to do it. Or can't wear them in public because people will judge
them for taking away from nurses even though the same hospitals the nurses
work at have made it clear they would rather have their employees work
unprotected than buy something not approved by the FDA or stoop so low as to
work with someone who can't donate everything for free.

Have had way better success working with retired civic-minded business guys
who can buy stuff through their local civic group and just get it done. It
takes a surprising amount of almost outright harassment from these dudes to
get the hospitals to either accept a donation or come up with a list of what
they need and arrange funding, but so far getting hooked up with this type of
person has been the only way I've found to get PPE (at least the kind that's
still available) into a hospital.

~~~
samcheng
Hospitals do seem to graciously accept donations, even opened (half-used)
boxes of masks. You can just drive up and hand them off. Second-tier
healthcare facilities, such as elder care centers and rural clinics, are also
desperate for PPE right now.

We just drove up to the UCSF hospital and dropped off a couple hundred pounds
of supplies. No fuss:

[https://www.rinse.com/blog/rinse/covid-19-medical-supply-
dri...](https://www.rinse.com/blog/rinse/covid-19-medical-supply-drive)

Here's an example organization with a long list of facilities accepting
donated supplies:

[https://www.donateppe.org/](https://www.donateppe.org/)

I'm sure it's harder to convince the terribly inefficient US health care
bureaucracy to pay for this. I noticed our local Chinese American community,
combating a worrisome rise in racism, has been active in the philanthropic
distribution of masks. You might try raising funding that way, instead of
through the bureaucracy.

I've also noticed a reluctance to accept the Chinese KN95 standard. People
don't trust it, for better or worse. I think they would rather have homemade
cloth masks, to be honest. Not sure how you can change that perception.

Best of luck in your efforts!

~~~
edge17
The economic reality is that most of the chinese supply chain that creates
most of the masks is KN95 because China mobilized their country for their
needs first. Quality is definitely an issue, but the bureaucratic layers of
many of the hospitals in the US are definitely protecting the business at the
expense of the safety of front line workers. Most of them simply don't
understand what is going on at the ground level of the supply chain.

~~~
dsfyu404ed
As someone who spends way too much time hanging around with cynical lawyers I
am not surprised by the current state of affairs.

We've spent the last 30yr using civil case law to heavily incentivize
organizations to build process and follow that process even when it's stupid,
push decision making higher up and remove the capacity for decisions making
down low (like middle manager level) where they can happen fast.

It's not that the people want to protect the business at the expense of
patients but that the business itself is structured in a way that it's
impossible for the people who make it up to do break protocol that says they
have to meet X Y and Z criteria when sourcing supplies without it being a
fire-able offense.

------
mrosett
One angle that this article missed: anti-price gouging sentiment has a lot to
do with why the factory isn’t running 24/7\. Imagine if he could charge 10x
his normal price (ie $1/mask, which is much less than the value a mask
provides.) I suspect plenty of employees would happily work 100 hour weeks for
the duration of the crisis if they were getting paid $150/hr. Instead, he’s
forced to take a slower, more conservative approach to ramping up to avoid
risking bankruptcy.

~~~
juiyout
Same in Taiwan, mask making has not been very profitable. Taiwan imports 93%
of masks from China.

Govt stepped in quickly on the brink of this outbreak though. Govt called 34
companies together each responsible for different parts of mask manufacturing
from material, machine parts, installation, assembly, etc and govt up front
paid 6 million USD for 62 production lines to be installed and assigned
military personnel to help man the lines 24/7.

Daily mask production ramped up from 3 million to 10 million in 3 weeks. This
is only barely covering Taiwan's domestic needs. Taiwan is now aiming for
daily production of 20 million.

For distribution, govt rations out all manufactured masks. Currently each
citizen gets 9-10 masks every 2 week and I believe each doctor receives 40 per
week. The price of the masks for regular folks is fixed at around 1 USD for 6
masks. It is free for med staff.

As for the installed production line, once the mask maker reached the
production quota of 5 million masks for a particular production line, the mask
maker gets to keep that production line for free. Note that the mask makers,
once involved in this project, pretty much gave their business as usual.

I would think it is tax dollar well spent.

EDIT: Try and include some English references: \-
[[https://focustaiwan.tw/business/202003090013](https://focustaiwan.tw/business/202003090013)]
\-
[[https://www.taipeitimes.com/News/taiwan/archives/2020/03/10/...](https://www.taipeitimes.com/News/taiwan/archives/2020/03/10/2003732422)]
\-
[[https://www.taipeitimes.com/News/editorials/archives/2020/03...](https://www.taipeitimes.com/News/editorials/archives/2020/03/02/2003731896)]
\- [[https://www.straitstimes.com/asia/east-asia/coronavirus-
how-...](https://www.straitstimes.com/asia/east-asia/coronavirus-how-taiwan-
is-cranking-up-mask-production-to-meet-shortfall)] \-
[[http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/front/archives/2020/02/15/20...](http://www.taipeitimes.com/News/front/archives/2020/02/15/2003731015)]

~~~
eaenki
My Taiwanese friend living there that I met at Stanford says 3 masks per
person per week.

~~~
greedgenius
About a 1 month ago it is 3 masks/week. Now it's 9 masks/2 week. I live in
Taiwan and can confirm the information is correct.

------
burlesona
It is shameful that the US has abandoned its manufacturing base and allowed
its productive capacity to be destroyed. The pandemic exposes how weak this
makes us, but I don’t know that things will change when the pandemic
eventually ends. Once things calm down, I doubt people will retain the ability
to see the downsides of always chasing the absolute lowest cost supplier.

~~~
erentz
It is a shame. But what’s interesting about this is that even the
manufacturing base we do have could be scaled up quickly to meet more of the
demand, yet it’s not. So why does it save us to have manufacturing base if you
won’t scale it to meet surge demand when needed.

The hospitals not signing contracts with him is bad. But probably the more
surprising to me is that the government isn’t calling him up to say “hey we
will pay you $BIG to start producing masks for us 24/7 that we will
distribute”. Where $BIG is enough for him to offset his concerns. After this
pandemic slows down the government can continue buying from him to restock
(and constantly refresh) the stockpile.

How has the government not by now started to track all the items we need, all
the items we have, and called every damn company that can possibly produce
those items or know who can to tell them to start cranking? Why do we continue
to hear about discoveries of masks in warehouses and the like? The logistical
failures here seem to be extreme.

~~~
karlkatzke
Depends. What contracts will he have to take on to meet that? I think that’s
his complaint. He can’t get what he needs on the spot market most of the time,
he has to sign a supply contract and machinery maintenance contracts and
everything else. At best, if he can’t make use of the extra capacity when the
world isn’t experiencing a critical pandemic, he breaks even on the pandemic
work. At worst, he loses his shirt again.

The materials you are talking about aren’t usually found on a warehouse shelf
because they deteriorate over time. You wouldn’t want to put expired material
through a machine because it becomes brittle and breaks.

And as for why we haven’t started tracking materials more closely? Kushner’s
running this show. The word you’re looking for is incompetence.

~~~
kevin_thibedeau
Cut him some slack. He's got like 20 jobs.

------
philcrocket
Wow. Looks like he learned his lesson. On the other hand, we American
consumers haven't.

I'll echo what most have said here already: the moment this crisis is over,
we'll be overseas trying to find the cheapest possible price. We don't care
about keeping the local guy in business. We care about _our margins_.

I'd hate to say it but what made us great, could very well be our downfall...

~~~
blackrock
“Your margin is my opportunity.”

-Jeff Bezos

------
mike_h
This is a red herring issue. The problem isn’t that Chinese won’t sell the US
masks. It’s that the US is trying to buy too many too late. We could have
spent the past decade stockpiling them.

American protectionism is actually part of what created this problem: it was
only this week that the Chinese KN95 standard was approved for use by the FDA.

~~~
partiallypro
Ironically USA Today ran a piece (not opinion) about the Obama administration
using the strategic stockpile for various things during his tenure, but never
refilling it.

~~~
weaksauce
yeah I see the rationale for it being that they were developing a new mask
type that would be comfortable and reusable that they could stock up on. they
didn't think that the entire global infrastructure would be so overwhelmed
that they couldn't procure them in time. turns out they should have known to
keep a reserve of them(100m was the number they would have stocked, though
300m is needed for this particular pandemic) now obama's team didn't hoard
enough indeed and he deserves a bit of blame but it's also 3 years into
trump's term... at a certain point you do need to accept responsibility for
your failings and not reupping that supply is a failing.

~~~
lonelappde
Considering how many billions of dollars get spent on military jets, a few
million dollars for throwaway masks seems affordable.

~~~
triangleman
"That's with a B"

[https://youtu.be/CB-hJUtYhxQ?t=608](https://youtu.be/CB-hJUtYhxQ?t=608)

------
jmckib
The question that this story doesn't answer (unless I missed it) is why
hospitals are refusing to sign contracts right now when they are so badly in
need of masks. Either that, or pay whatever price is necessary to get the
factory to produce more masks without a contract. Is it lack of budget?
Legal/administrative hurdles? Something else?

~~~
x0x0
For starters, this guy doesn't actually make the masks hospitals need. They
need n95 masks; this company makes plain surgical masks.

~~~
dwaltrip
Don't hospitals need both?

~~~
x0x0
In general, sure, but since n95 masks protect against corona and plain
surgical masks don't...

------
gruez
I took a quick skim of the article and it looks like all it would take to
solve this problem is for him to raise prices (clearly the current prices are
below the market clearing rate) and forcing customers to pay upfront (or at
least put the money in a trust or something).

>“Last time he geared up and went three shifts a day working his tail off,”
the mayor recalled. “As soon as the issue died, he didn’t have any sales. He
had to pay unemployment for all these people, and he had to gear down.”

Doesn't seem to be a real issue if those extra costs are factored in

>Hospitals promised to stick with him afterward, but they broke their promise.
The allure of cheaper Chinese masks was too great for hospital purchasing
groups to ignore.

Ask for money upfront, or get it in writing and sue later.

~~~
BurningFrog
Raising prices in a crisis is probably criminal under price gouging laws.

~~~
gruez
Addressed here:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22789745](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22789745)

Also, if the situation is really dire, I'm sure the government can grant him a
waiver

~~~
jdminhbg
“Probably” not illegal is a hell of a risk to take. All it takes is one
prosecutor who thinks he can make his career over crushing pandemic
profiteering and you’re screwed. It doesn’t even matter if you somehow win in
the end.

------
Aloha
I cannot blame him one bit, and as a small business, he cant absorb the losses
from having to scale back either.

I sincerely hope the lasting change from this crisis is a changing attitude
towards where we build things.

------
blunte
Buying American doesn't increase shareholder value or executive bonuses.
Reducing costs does. At least, that's the mantra

Walmart became the giant it is because while people agree that supporting
local businesses is important (especially when they and their neighbors own
those businesses), they still could not help themselves and chose to do their
shopping at Walmart because it was cheaper. Then many of the small local
businesses died.

Modern (American/western/and-possibly-everywhere-else) people are really
terrible at balancing short vs long term priorities.

~~~
nojvek
When you're living paycheck to paycheck, every dollar matters.

The problem is things are cheaper from china, because China as a nation
invested in their ecosystem of manufacturing. Ports, roads, tax incentives,
loans e.t.c

US on the other hand did not invest in themselves as heavily. It's like a rich
son having someone else do his assignments and when the end of year exam
comes, he's fucked because he didn't put the effort in learning himself.

The more we take China take the lead and we rely on them, the more we lag
behind.

------
solidsnack9000
For clothing, the Berry Amendment ensures that the US has strategic capacity,
by mandating that certain government purchases are made from suppliers that
assemble US fabric with US labor. Maybe there needs to be a similar policy for
medical equipment.

~~~
ardy42
> For clothing, the Berry Amendment ensures that the US has strategic
> capacity, by mandating that certain government purchases are made from
> suppliers that assemble US fabric with US labor.

Honestly, US government policy should be to buy _everything_ that could be
remotely considered strategic or useful in an emergency from US suppliers that
use US labor and materials. Small exceptions could be made for proprietary
things made by NATO allies, but even that stuff should really have a second
source supplier located in the US.

------
travisporter
>> “Create American jobs. Buy American. … It’s hot air.”

This quote really got me. Being in Texas you would think people value American
made.

~~~
netsharc
It's fascinating to read this article after reading the tweets asking "why are
we depending on foreign manufacturers for protective gear?!?". Well, the
answer was in here, because everyone wants to buy from the cheapest
supplier...

------
ck2
The photos on ebay and amazon of the Chinese factories making surgical masks
(not N95) appear to be 99% automated.

The machines in that article appear rather different.

But it's not just hospitals, all of US is built on "just in time" fulfillment
for decades now. That's why a government stockpile was important for
emergencies, it's not unrealistic to expect government to have that role. You
just can't have people in charge of government that spend all their time
dismantling it and expect it not to fail.

------
sumo89
That is an awful website for people in the EU. 4 different pop ups then 20
seconds after page load a final one saying you can't read the page outside the
USA.

~~~
moritonal
I found a bookmark a while ago that attempts to make sites like this readable.
Not good at all, but almost works.

"javascript:(function() { document.querySelectorAll('*').forEach(function(n) {
var p = getComputedStyle(n).getPropertyValue('position'); if (p === 'fixed' ||
p === 'sticky') { n.style.cssText += ' ; position: absolute !important;'; }
}); })();"

------
jeffdavis
There's no way to win selling cheap but critical supplies on the spot market.
If the price goes down your customers flee. If the price goes up you can't
charge the higher price because that would be "gouging".

So his solution is contracts. The fact that people aren't signing them shows
their true intentions.

What I can't quite figure out is why, during the good times, a $0.10
consumable for a $4000 operation needs to be made more efficient so badly that
the only way to produce the thing is in a communist country with no
environmental controls.

~~~
PhantomGremlin
_What I can 't quite figure out ..._

That's simple to figure out, and it is not specific to hospitals. Some
purchasing manager says "hmmm ... I'm paying $100,000 per year for this
product. But I can buy it overseas for only $20,000". Score!

At the end of the year, that purchasing manager writes a report to his manager
saying something like "saved the hospital $10,000,000 by optimizing our supply
chain". Or some such.

How much some random operation costs doesn't factor into his decisions at all.
That's not what he's being compensated for.

The only way this mindset changes is if _top management_ insists on it. But
usually top management is constantly pushing to cut costs. Their bonuses
depend on it.

~~~
xemdetia
Yeah, this is the kind of way I considered this article. There's so many
operations including medical hospitals purchasers that are trying to follow
the current mantra of as little idle inventory and wastage of inventory on the
shelf as possible for as cheap as possible. This makes sense for people
purchasing finished goods but doesn't make as much sense for people making
finished goods who may need primary material goods in quantities and timings
that do not scale well in increments. It also makes no sense from a machining
and tooling efficiency investment to replace a particular operation with a
machine to do it 100x as fast if making 100x of the particular sub-assembly
completely overwhelms the maximum capacity of the next step unless it is also
improved.

There's just a minimum volume cost to most finished goods below which it just
costs money to do the work at all. Sure if the volumes go way up there's
economy of scale at work and the fixed costs of scaling up go down so prices
can be reduced in a way that doesn't affect the manufacturing business to be
more competitive but there's a bottom in the other direction.

You can insulate that with long term contracts from the buyers so that you can
get favorable contracts with the suppliers, but when you have purchasers going
quarter to quarter and saying lowest price = best value you just are playing a
totally different game for a smaller manufacturer. The current model of a
small American manufacturing business seems to currently reward doing the same
boring product at the same boring volume so that the company will exist in 20
or 30 years by investing in specialist equipment that does one or more steps
of manufacturing better than generalist equipment and creating a niche stable
market for yourself as the depreciation/fixed cost of that specialist
equipment per total units made approaches next to nothing.

------
alphabettsy
Many voters want the government run like a business, and this is a good
example of why you don’t run the government like a business.

------
yellowapple
> “Last time he geared up and went three shifts a day working his tail off,”
> the mayor recalled. “As soon as the issue died, he didn’t have any sales. He
> had to pay unemployment for all these people, and he had to gear down.”

This would be a good time to hire temp labor through a staffing agency; you
pay a bit of a premium for that, but you also don't put the employees directly
on your payroll that way (they're employees of the staffing agency instead, so
said agency is then responsible for finding new work). People need the jobs,
America needs masks, this guy wants to make and sell masks, win-win-win.

Like, I didn't really see a compelling reason in the article why that factory
_isn 't_ working 24/7\. I know of plenty of companies that deal in similarly-
high-demand-in-pandemics products (my employer included) that _are_ ramping up
and running 24/7 and doing everything they can to get those products to people
who need them. Most of them are doing that by hiring temps.

------
JoeAltmaier
Not sure writing the feds is a way to change the free market system. Not for
one guy; not on a dime.

Perhaps a measure allowing emergency part-time workers? Why does he have to be
'fooled again', why not just increase production temporarily?

It sounds to me, this guy is being spiteful. Wants to make a point. Maybe not
the right climate to make his point in.

~~~
zelienople
If you can't make the point now, when can you make it? Once the pandemic is
under control, no one will care.

The bottom line would appear to be that capitalism is, by far, the best system
we have, but only when it operates inside a walled garden.

We should impose tariffs on essential items so as to allow local employees to
be paid a fair and living wage, put restrictions on the multiple between the
lowest wage in a company and the highest, limit growth to preserve the
competitiveness of markets, and ensure that the true cost of production,
including the environmental damage associated with production, distribution,
and disposal is accounted for locally.

Imagine if this small business was allowed to charge a fair price for their
product without competition from a totalitarian state that has bred 1.6
billion slave workers to exploit the planet and conduct a covert economic war
to undermine democratic free-market countries.

Imagine if the earnings of every CEO were capped at 3x the lowest wage on the
factory floor. Imagine people having stable jobs that fulfill a genuine need
while producing something in a sustainable and environmentally-responsible
fashion. Imagine that those hard workers get health care and generous
vacations and a living wage.

Is it so ridiculous to dream of limited capitalism? Sane capitalism?

------
xivzgrev
Smart to have hospitals sign longer term contracts for supply now. Sounds like
he learned his lesson last time.

Also this guy sounds kind of butt hurt about buy American rheteroic. I agree
but if you are charging 5x on a commodity vs china, I mean rah rah America
only goes so far.

------
titanomachy
Seems like a good opportunity to sign 5-year supply contracts with healthcare
organizations.

~~~
jdbernard
The article doesn't give details but it sounds like that's what he tried last
time and is what he trying again:

 _Hospitals promised to stick with him afterward, but they broke their
promise._

And later

 _Now, it’s only selling to U.S. hospitals. But Bowen asks hospitals to sign
contracts. Who can blame him?

Or as the mayor puts it, “He’ll gear back up, and he’ll produce, and they’ll
probably do it to him again.”_

I imagine as a small business he may not have pockets deep enough to pursue
legal action against hospitals that are breaking contacts.

------
jupp0r
How long does it take to build a mask factory? Maybe we should stockpile
machines that can rapidly ramp up production of millions of face masks per day
in preparation for the next pandemic.

~~~
jaclaz
> Maybe we should stockpile machines that can rapidly ramp up production of
> millions of face masks per day in preparation for the next pandemic.

Unfortunately that is not how machinery works, you would need personnel to
maintain them, and also switch them on periodically, and repair them otherwise
your stockpile of machines won't work anymore in - say - three to five years
of stockage.

And BTW you would also need to have a huge stockage of spare parts, as in the
same three to five years the current model (the machines that actually running
in production) will be release/model Mark V, and they have different parts
from the Mark I you have stocked ...

------
Pmop
This is interesting. Being a Brazilian, our government has been always
protectionist. Even in the current New Republic period. "Industries vital to
our country must be protected". And oddly enough, that idea was shared by many
politicians, even when they were opposed to each other.

The govt has been harshly criticized by the recent, new libertarians, for the
import taxes increased prices to the end consumer and scared away foreign
investors. Turns out that we had national mask makers ready to step up. Plus,
textile and other industries decided to also jump in to help. I bought three
masks before taking a flight recently, I didn't have any trouble finding them,
paid less than a dollar for a locally made N95 equivalent; it seems that many
of my flight mates had the same idea. I guess our old politicians nailed it,
at least this time.

------
supernova87a
1\. Domestic production 2\. Low prices 3\. Surge capacity meeting sudden
demand

You get to choose 2 of the 3. This guy wants protectionist policies to help
him stay in a more sustainable business. You can't fault him for wanting to
serve his own interests. But we could've prepared for this by having the
proper stockpile in anticipation of an emergency.

------
nojvek
It seems US is very much going for short term gratification instead of long
term building of industrial nation. Moving manufacturing offshore into China
and other cheaper countries + mega multinational corporations starving small
businesses or buying them up so they can get away with price gorging and
lobbying for favorable laws.

China said no to Google and Facebook, they let Baidu and Tencent build the
technological prowess. China manufactures most of the worlds electronics, they
help their cities foster ecologies. e.g Shenzen, Guangzhou, Tianjin e.t.c

Meanwhile US has been losing its manufacturing edge over time. We can't be
price competitive to China because we haven't invested in the ecosystem
necessary for mass scale production. Our governmental leaders have frequent
conflict of interests because they've worked at previous mega corps.

US can no longer think and take actions for the interest for the whole nation.
Corporate interests are winning out. Seeing how the $2 trillion stimulus was a
giant coop, to Jared Kushner (neopotism) saying "National Stockpile is for us,
and not for the states." COVID-19 is exposing how incapable we are as a nation
to be self sufficient.

Is US a democracy? I am not so sure. Without fair competition, we aren't a
capitalist society either.

------
jariel
There is a serious problem with understanding surpluses here.

Do you really care if your monthly water bill is $1 or $5?

Think - if you're at $5 a month, I mean you could save 500% (!!) by going to
another provider at $1!

No - you don't care at all. At such a low price and vast surplus (the
difference between what you pay, and what it's worth to you) - other
considerations are paramount.

The difference between 10 cents and 2 cents is stupid. They could be 50 cents
and it would not be 'price gouging' because there's tons of surplus to go
around.

If we're going to talk about 'gouging' we need to talk about the _entire
medical system_ \- it's just one big massive gouge.

There basically needs to be a strategy of price regulation and sourcing, as
simple as that.

A simple rule like 'must be bought and fully sourced in the US' is easy,
because it still implies a lot of competition.

For some products there could be a strategic reserve, and also a strategic
production capacity.

Same for the entire military supply chain.

It's time to re-think globalism.

------
hkai
Here in Hong Kong, folks have set up six mask production lines already,
working round the clock to produce surgical masks. Don't know how they managed
to get the equipment but kudos to them.

That's because people don't hate businesses and businesspeople, and are
thankful for their effort.

Low-quality surgical masks here retail for 40-50 USD per box (50pcs), and
there are no plans to introduce any price controls. That means that
resourceful people are stimulated to abandon their family and regular jobs,
and work round the clock to set up production lines, because they want to earn
money.

I assume in America the sentiment towards businesspeople and pricing is
somewhat different.

~~~
mkl
> Low-quality surgical masks here retail for 40-50 USD per box (50pcs)

That seems weird. They're half that on AliExpress, including shipping to NZ.

------
madaxe_again
Article isn’t available outside of the US. I assume it’s about how everything
is the greatest, and they’re working 30/8, not 24/7?

~~~
dredmorbius
[https://outline.com/https://www.dallasnews.com/news/watchdog...](https://outline.com/https://www.dallasnews.com/news/watchdog/2020/04/03/if-
you-imagine-that-a-local-business-making-surgical-face-masks-is-
working-247-guess-again/)

[https://web.archive.org/web/*/https://www.dallasnews.com/new...](https://web.archive.org/web/*/https://www.dallasnews.com/news/watchdog/2020/04/03/if-
you-imagine-that-a-local-business-making-surgical-face-masks-is-
working-247-guess-again/)

[https://archive.is/https://www.dallasnews.com/news/watchdog/...](https://archive.is/https://www.dallasnews.com/news/watchdog/2020/04/03/if-
you-imagine-that-a-local-business-making-surgical-face-masks-is-
working-247-guess-again/)

------
54351623
Why can't N95 mask production be completely automated so production can
quickly scale with demand while also keeping costs down?

~~~
mardifoufs
N95 masks use a special plastic fabric that can only be produced with really
specialized machines. That's usually the bottleneck since it takes months to
make and install the required equipment. Also, keep in mind that the
production process is already highly automated anyways.

~~~
54351623
That level of automation is what I was wondering about, how much it would take
to remove humans entirely. Admittedly I was working under the assumption that
the producer of the masks wasn't also manufacturing raw materials as that
wasn't addressed in the article and may be a separate issue in and of itself.

------
danvoell
Something about this story doesn’t add up. If this were 99% of the
manufacturers I know, they would be operating 24/7 right now. Call every
available temp agency and load that place up. The only fathomable excuse is if
they can’t get enough material. The guy running this company sounds like a
politician not a businessman. Edit: not sure why I’m getting downvoted. I’m
serious. If this company were near me I would be asking if I could run second
shift. In theory this guy is both leaving hundreds of thousands of dollars on
the table per day and contributing to our country’s deficiency of equipment
while trying to argue for some sort of long term agreement because he has
leverage at the moment.

~~~
beerandt
Read the story. It's what he did in 2009 and got burned by it. Almost
bankrupted him. He's learned his lesson.

~~~
hilbertseries
The situation in 2009 is so far from this, that it’s not even comparable. Face
masks are going to be in high demand for the next year or so, probably beyond
that because a rollout of the vaccine is going to be slow.

~~~
Zenbit_UX
I'm sure he's aware, what you're overlooking is that when China starts
producing again he's instantly undercut by a 5x margin and history has shown
him no one in the US cares about buying American if it means paying more, then
he lays off all the workers again and goes out of business.

------
thawaway1837
I don’t really get this article.

If you have the foresight, and money, to pay to transplant an entire industry
from a place which manufacture masks for 2 cents as opposed to one that does
it for 10 cents, wouldn’t it be a lot easier, cost efficient, and sensible, to
simply by 2 masks whenever you need one for a total of 4 cents for the 2
masks, and keep 1 of those 2 masks in your stockpile?

You end up spending about 4cents per mask, and you’ve built up a massive
stockpile in addition to that for emergency situations. And you’ve only paid
20% of the money you would have for the masks the article is advocating.

Frankly, this was a disaster in federal planning. Trying to twist this into
some sort of issue with the supply chain system is kind of ridiculous.

Also, if you actually look at the US right now, the idea that American
companies would be manufacturing anything full throttle is beyond ridiculous.
China in fact manaaged to completely lockdown Hubei province in a way the US
can never dream of, which allowed them to continue their industrial
manufacturing, and actually be able to supply masks to states and hospitals
around the country (of course, life would be a lot easier if the federal
government coordinated the procurement so states weren’t outbidding each other
only to have the Federal government pirate their supplies to ha d off to
private entities that then resell it to the same states for even more...).

------
wonnage
Another way to frame the situation: America is in dire need of surgical masks,
and its top manufacturer is more interested in martyring themselves than to
help out.

It seems like this is what the Defense Production Act is for? It's not like
GM, where invoking the act doesn't seem to speed anything along because they
don't make ventilators normally, and have to spend several days retooling
their factories. In this case, you have a manufacturer that has excess
capacity and is simply refusing to use it.

Also, how is this supposed to make people trust American manufacturers any
more than the Chinese? The Chinese are actually _making_ masks at full
capacity and exporting them... meanwhile, our own homegrown industries are
busy navel-gazing and feeling bitter about some past slights.

~~~
smabie
Probably because China doesn't have (or maybe enforce?) "price-gouging" laws.
This 100% wouldn't be happening if we just let people charge what they want
for their own property.

~~~
wonnage
How does this make any sense? China is not price gouging on PPE, at least not
to the point where this guy's factory pricing is competitive

~~~
smabie
We don't know how much money it takes for a Chinese factory to produce these
masks. Even though they're cheaper, the prices they charge could very well be
considered price-gouging under some State laws. The absolute price of an item
doesn't really matter.

------
lazyjones
Sad story, but if he had kept the employees and built a stockpile at a loss,
he'd quickly recover those past losses and score a huge profit now. So:
believe in your product and mission, pandemics do happen.

A solution for the future would be be high import taxes for products of
"national interest".

~~~
neltnerb
If your creditors and landlord don't believe in your product and mission, I'm
not sure how that's actionable. Small businesses aren't in a position to make
big financial bets.

If Goldman-Sachs wanted to stockpile masks made at 10 cents each and take on
the risk of never being able to sell them, great. I cannot fathom how someone
running a non-diversified business could possibly make such a choice.

~~~
lazyjones
> If your creditors and landlord don't believe in your product and mission,
> I'm not sure how that's actionable

They own their plant, as 30 seconds of research show.
[https://www.prestigeameritech.com/press-
releases](https://www.prestigeameritech.com/press-releases)

They've been in the business long enough and through at least one pandemic
before (see below) to make this something other than a "belief" issue. Even
small companies can build reserves if their business model works.

