
Ask HN: Can new graduates get (good) remote work? - lwithers
Hey HN,<p>Long-time lurker here. I&#x27;m going to be graduating my Computer Science BSc in Summer 2017, and like the idea of getting involved in remote work.<p>There are several companies which actively hire remote workers, however are they less likely to take on new graduates who don&#x27;t have prior experience in a larger workplace environment?<p>Also, for those who are working remotely, do you know if graduate developer salaries are reasonable (I&#x27;m UK-based, not in London)?<p>Thanks for any information! :)
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brudgers
In my opinion and to a first approximation, this is a bad idea. The technical
experience gained in a person's first professional setting have a massive
impact on a person's technical development over the course of their career. I
think of Peter Norvig going to work for Margret Hamilton.

That's the other aspect. Working in an office expands one's professional
network more usefully than remote work ever can...Norvig later went to NASA's
Ames Research.

I'll put it another way. Being a new graduate means lacking the experience to
make highly informed professional judgments. Recognizing that you're in that
position is useful when considering making a radical career decision at the
start of one's career. Don't kid yourself, choosing to work remote has a high
probability of being seen as a negative trait in future hiring because it is
hard to determine if it is a 'real' job. Remote work creates a deficit in
social proof (alongside the deficit in social network and the experience
deficit).

Finally, difficulty finding remote work is symptomatic of a weak professional
network. If it's _really_ a priority, then underpaying freelance work from the
notorious freelance sites are where to start. If that's unattractive then,
it's not a priority.

Good luck.

~~~
bbcbasic
Makes me sad to read this as my first job didn't have any great technical
mentor like that, but was a bunch or regular devs trying to ship a run of the
mill product.

How can a grad tell they are going to work for a top company that is great for
their career within a good team? Especially if outside the US so not
necessarily just going to work for Google.

~~~
brudgers
My take is it was a good right out of school job. But it wasn't Google
awesome. See:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8736450](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8736450)

Anyway, regular devs shipping regular product is, to me, a better first job
than remote work for most people. The people for whom remote work right out of
school is less likely to be detrimental are probably people who were banging
out open source or side projects while in school...i.e. those with a strong
established independent habit.

~~~
bbcbasic
Ok I see. Tangentially, I remember when I graduated I would have hated work at
home as the social side was important, and getting to hang out with other
techies is a bonus. Now work from home would be good for the family life

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scalesolved
So by mentioning salary I presume we're talking indefinite contracts here
rather than lots of different clients.

To be honest you're going to have a tough time, competition is high and hiring
juniors seems quite rare. (You may have more luck with larger remote companies
but most remote companies tend towards the smaller side).

However here are some things you can do to maximise your chances (applicable
to non remote work too).

1\. Be effective and clear with communication, remote work requires you to
over-communicate. Don't assume the person with whom you're talking to via
email/slack has all the information that you do.

2\. Being a grad you've got no real CV experience to fall back on, imperative
that you have a github/bitbucket account with examples of the work you can do.
At least one fully fledged project in the stack that you are targeting. For
example if you're going to work with Rails then having a project where you use
some common libraries, integrate OAuth or some sort of authentication,talk to
external APIs with good test coverage and and documentation.

3\. Almost as important as #2 is to blog with what you're learning, show any
companies of the learning that you're doing and the potential that you have.
We had an applicant once who included a link to all 50 Amazon reviews he'd
written of different tech books, fantastic way to show passion and
understanding.

4\. Be realistic, being a grad and go straight into remote work will be tough.
Have a plan B.

My advice would be to try and work in a larger company for a while, find the
opportunity to work with experienced developers and see how it is, you may
actually like being in an office! Remote work is not for everyone and while it
seems to be perfect it has many drawbacks.

Best of luck!

~~~
lwithers
Your presumption is correct :).

Thank you for this insight. My GitHub has been largely left untouched as I
haven't published many of my projects, I'll prioritise this. I like your
recommendation on blogging too, definitely seems a good way to provide a log
of what I'm getting up to.

I'm fortunate enough to have had a side-project turn into a successful
business, however it's largely automated now and requires very little input,
hence looking for a "proper job" upon graduating.

That said, it's been entirely working by myself, so I lack the experience of
working within a larger company. Based upon some other comments here, it
sounds as though I'll have a real tough time getting into remote work without
some proven experience under my belt.

Thanks for the advice, I really appreciate it :)

~~~
scalesolved
Well having a profitable side project is exactly the sort of thing you should
show off as much as possible, the fact you took an idea, iterated and created
the technology behind it. Sounds like a great idea to blog about it! :) Out of
curiosity what is your side project?

What's your motivation for wanting remote work? If you've already got an
almost passive income then that should allow you to live in the location best
for you and find a company close by in the UK/EU.

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itamarst
Getting a remote job will be pretty hard as a junior developer, since remote
work requires more trust in someone's ability to work independently.

I would also say it's not good for someone in your shoes: you'll learn much
more and much faster if you're in the same room as experienced software
developers.

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csorrell
It's a challenge for an employer to support or train a junior developer
remotely, which is probably why these jobs are harder to find. They do exist
though. I started out working remotely and loved it, but I know I would have
grown my skill set much more quickly had I been around experienced developers
during that first year on the job.

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ThePawnBreak
I tried finding a decent remote job as a new grad. I have 4 internships at top
companies (Microsoft, Google). I applied to dozens of companies, only got one
interview by a NY based company looking for cheap developers in Eastern
Europe.

I gave up, I'm probably moving to London soon.

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petervandijck
Just apply already.

