
What the Airline Knows About the Guy in Seat 14C - petethomas
https://www.wsj.com/articles/what-the-airline-knows-about-the-guy-in-seat-14c-1529499085
======
toomanybeersies
I don't like strangers using my name. Police do that, debt collectors do that.
Flight attendants and waiters should not do that.

I think it's an information asymmetry thing. I don't like it when people know
more about me than the other way round, or at least don't like it when they
make it obvious.

And specifically with birthdays. I'd be pretty annoyed if flight attendants
started wishing me happy birthday, I hate it when people do that. I like to
keep my birthday a private event. I barely tolerate work buying me a cake and
singing happy birthday, and that's just because I get cake and everyone else
in the office enjoys the whole thing.

~~~
joosters
I'd hate the birthday greeting, because it would be completely insincere. The
staff don't know you, they couldn't care less about your birthday and they're
only saying it because their computer told them to. And yet the airline thinks
I'm going to be impressed by the greeting?

~~~
majewsky
I'm positive that a significant amount of people will be genuinely impressed
by it.

~~~
PakG1
I have heard people rave about stuff like that. I think it's a Wizard of Oz
type of thing. Once you pull back the curtain, the magic is lost. For us, the
curtain is non-existent. For people who aren't familiar with computer systems,
the technology is indistinguishable from magic.

~~~
andai
People who aren't familiar with calendars?

~~~
sixstringtheory
There’s a big difference between understanding how calendars work and
gathering the date of birth on whole populations of people and positively
identifying each one.

------
winningcontinue
Privacy invasion and feeling creepy at the airline level is alright. I
registered for the flight and paid for it through my ticket checkout. In
addition, I'm usually part of their loyalty program when I fly. What I don't
appreciate is what happened to me at a high end mall while on vacation in
Spain. Walked into the store, the sales person smiled and me and called me by
my name. I never met her before and that type of interaction was quite
jarring. I was left wondering where have I seen this person for a bit,
striking up a friendly conversation to jog my memory. Then she explained that
a camera had captured and recognized me through my face on her screen. Creepy.

~~~
Animats
People will get used to it. There was a time when American Express phone
agents knew what customer was calling, but wouldn't mention their name until
the customer did. The agent calling the customer by name was considered
creepy. Now it's normal.

~~~
peteretep
Unlikely, in the EU, because who the hell is going to consent to that in line
with GDPR?

~~~
alfredallan1
I think it’d be a lot of (evil) fun to form a crowdfunded entity with the sole
purpose of suing companies that egregiously violate privacy norms. Given the
level of support for the GDPR in many quarters, I think funding goals can be
easily reached. Some lawyers might also want to jump on the bandwagon and make
themselves a name (and profit).

~~~
bkor
> I think it’d be a lot of (evil) fun to form a crowdfunded entity with the
> sole purpose of suing companies that egregiously violate privacy norms.

Enforcement is one dedicated organization per country. See
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Data_Protection_Regula...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Data_Protection_Regulation#Sanctions)
for the possible sanctions such an organization could apply. It can be pretty
minor.

There's a proposed EU law which is pretty much terrible. GPDR is great (IMO).

~~~
alfredallan1
How does it work - can people actually report violations to this enforcement
agency? How hard/likely is it for a company to simply buy their way into these
agencies?

~~~
distances
> How does it work - can people actually report violations to this enforcement
> agency? How hard/likely is it for a company to simply buy their way into
> these agencies?

I can't speak for all of Europe, but in Northern Europe this would be very
unlikely to happen. The governments and agencies aren't flawless here either,
but at least they are quite honest and uncorrupted.

------
cperciva
I think the biggest problem here is one not even mentioned: What happens when
the information is wrong? Passengers swapping seats isn't all that uncommon --
I've done it many times to allow families to sit together -- but the computers
aren't going to know that has happened.

On a recent flight I swapped seats with my girlfriend -- she wanted the window
-- and the service director was clearly flummoxed by the fact that the man in
front of her was "Elena" and the woman sitting next to me was "Colin". (I'm
guessing that they've been told that they should never assume genders based on
names, but she could clearly tell something was off.) In that particular case,
the confusion was quickly remedied; but I can only imagine the embarrassment
which would ensue if flight attendants start singing happy birthday _to the
wrong passenger_.

~~~
user5454
We had a flight once where they had assigned my then six year old daughter to
a seat on a separate row from the rest of us (me, wife and son) so naturally
my wife took that seat and let me sit with the kids.

This was very confusing to the flight attendant. She was like "You need to sit
in your seat!" to my wife and as we explained the error by the airline, she
scolded us and said "but kids can't sit by themselves!" Uhm, no that's what we
fixed... Rest of the flight she looked at us suspiciously as if we were up to
something.

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brownbat
I wish United would spend less time trying to learn my name and more time
actually understanding my complaints about their website. Like about their
online security questions.

I don't have a particular favorite vegetable, and even if I did, a drop down
with a handful of options is a silly way to secure an account.

~~~
jasonkostempski
They are. Soon you'll log in with your face, a flashier silly way to secure an
account.

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FearNotDaniel
IMHO whether or not this is creepy depends a great deal on past experiences
with the same company, whether or not I have built up a relationship of trust
with them, and have come to expect (based on experience, not advertising) good
service that respects me as a passenger and genuinely values my experience as
much as how much more profit they can squeeze out of me.

Hence, if anyone from Lufthansa/Austrian/Eurowings, or the ground staff at
Heathrow T2 used my name, acknowledged my birthday or otherwise used the
personal information that I already know they have about me, I would probably
be quite pleased and delighted. The trust I already have in that brand would
increase.

Exactly the same behaviour from anyone connected with
Stansted/Gatwick/BA/Ryanair/Easyjet would likely make me feel angry and
invaded because all those companies already make me feel like a target, not a
guest. So my negative trust would go further into the red.

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el-patron
[https://outline.com/X8xWw2](https://outline.com/X8xWw2) in case you want to
read the full article

~~~
masteruvpuppetz
blocked in my org. Do you have any other link? :$

~~~
neonate
[http://archive.is/Vgxw3](http://archive.is/Vgxw3)

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moviuro
GDPR should protect (at least) European citizens from this. If I share my
info, it should only be used for necessary things, such as:

* sending my ticket to my place

* checking my identity at check-in

And then, addressing me as "Mr. Smith in seat 14C" or asking me what I want to
drink really isn't a problem. Checking if I have connecting flights can be
done without knowing my name. So, as GDPR dictates: everything else must be
opt-in.

~~~
karthikb
> Checking if I have connecting flights can be done without knowing my name

Not always. Many airlines (for example, American Airlines) will protect your
connection even if you've purchased two separate tickets. And they'll do this
across their entire OneWorld alliance of airlines, not just within the
company. But unless you have added a frequent flier number, the airline needs
multiple matching information (Name, DOB) to be able to make the link between
your two reservations automatically. Otherwise, they would be unable to
proactively rebook, hold the connecting plane, have someone meet you at the
gate to rush you to the next gate, etc.

~~~
moviuro
...or they could add a checkbox "I have a connecting flight [flight number]".

~~~
thisone
flights (at least mine) are often cancelled and rescheduled by the airline
after purchase. Without actively being able to track an individual flyer
between the connecting flights, just setting a connecting flight number (along
with date and time) wouldn't work.

~~~
moviuro
> [...]

> Sorry for the inconvenience ... Note that you will no longer be able to
> connect to the flight you selected [AF1234], please follow the link to
> reschedule with [Air France]
> [https://brokenconnection/?nogo=UA4321&connection=AF1234](https://brokenconnection/?nogo=UA4321&connection=AF1234)

> [...]

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minpur
This is quite a generic rant about airlines trying to make sense of passenger
data. Nothing related to seat 14C. I mostly pay more and reserve the 12/13 row
seats (emergency seats) because of better leg space. I’ve never had a hostess
budge me with personal details.

