
Ask HN: How to initiate or respond to small talk (not the programming language)? - phekunde
I am not able to initiate or respond to small talk. What are your methods for small talk? How do you initiate one?
======
munchbunny
Other posters have already given great tips for questions to ask, so I thought
I'd add my overall approach. I assume that you're not specifically asking
about small talk, but rather about how to hold conversations with strangers,
such as in a party setting, maybe to kill time, maybe to get to know someone
(your date?) better.

I am normally an introvert and I am somewhere between bad and okay at small
talk because it bores the hell out of me, but I hold my own perfectly fine in
conversational settings.

The key for me was to understand that small talk is like kindling, not
firewood. It'll get a conversation started, but it's very hard to keep it
going with just small talk. If you want an interesting and satisfying
conversation that flows (relatively) naturally and where you really get to
know someone better, you have to move past small talk quickly.

So I might start with mentions of the weather (common opener), or if they're
parents, questions about their kids. However, I don't try to have a
conversation about weather. I'm actually rapidly scanning for something
substantial to work with. What do you do in bad weather? Good weather? Oh, you
play pick-up soccer? Are you a soccer fan? Which club? Do you ever bet on
games? Who do you play with? How did you meet them? Oh you're from North
Carolina? Ok, can you tell me what the difference is between your barbecue and
Texan barbecue? I've been told they're different, but I've never tried it.

That takes... maybe two minutes? And now we can have a conversation where this
person spends the next five minutes telling me about how they do their
briskets. When they finish, I either end the conversation so that it doesn't
die a slow death, or I go back to prospecting for topics.

If the prospecting strategy isn't turning anything up but I get the sense that
they're the touchy feely type, I sometimes try intentional vulnerability.
"Hey, can I get your opinion on something? I'm trying to figure out what to
get a friend for their birthday, but I'm bad at thinking of presents and I'm
running out of time."

If I think they're the thoughtful type I might just go straight for something
heavyweight like "so in your work, what keeps you up at night?"

If they're just not really responding, you shouldn't try to force it. There
are people (and some really smart people) who might have to warm up to you
first. If I were a better conversationalist, maybe that wouldn't be necessary,
but I'm not, so sometimes the conversation just isn't going to go anywhere,
and that's okay.

~~~
maxheadroom
> _I am normally an introvert and I am somewhere between bad and okay at small
> talk because it bores the hell out of me, but I hold my own perfectly fine
> in conversational settings._

I have the same problem but I suppose I come off as an asshole to a lot of
people because I can't be arsed to take interest in something that bores me. I
think it equally (or even maybe more so) disingenuous to pretend otherwise
because people can tell when you're faking it. This isn't a "fake it until you
make it" scenario.

There are some people I catch easy strides with and have kept in touch with,
years later - without having Facebook or the like. Those are few and far-
between, though.

So, to my point: How do you hold your own perfectly fine in conversational
settings if it bores you? Any tips you can provide?

I haven't any id

~~~
munchbunny
It was a frame of mind thing for me, and changing my frame of mind helped.

I used to have the problem that too many conversations were boring to me, so I
wouldn't engage. However, I found two key thoughts driving this feeling.

First, some of it came out of my own ego, like thinking I was above trivial
things. The truth is I'm not, I'm just interested in different trivial things.
And that's okay, but I did need to get over myself and learn to withhold
judgement and appreciate the expertise that other people develop in their
interests. There are still genuinely uninteresting people, but they are rare
if you do a good job of prospecting for the things people focus their
attention on.

Second, for me, the disinterest was sort of a social pecking order thing.
However, it was mostly in my own head. In practice the leaders I respected
were the ones who took care to treat me as an intellectual equal, even if they
were formally higher on the hierarchy. A rare few people I know require token
shows of power before they take you seriously, but most people just want you
to relate to them.

I had a third realization that was more functional. I am an engineer because
I've always thought like one (may not apply to anyone else). I've grown up
looking at social conversations a bit like an anthropologist observing a human
social ritual. It seemed like a wasteful artifact, and doing it just didn't
feel natural for me. However, the reality of it is that it's central to how
humans function. I can't opt out, but I can try to deconstruct it into a set
of rules, guidelines, and practices that I can internalize just like any other
skill, so that's what I did.

One key rule is that in any conversation (it's not my own phrase but I forget
where it comes from) the other person first remembers how you made them feel,
and second remembers if you said anything interesting. In cases where it's
entirely a social transaction for me, rule #1 is to make them feel good. That
might seem manipulative, but people who are naturally socially fluent do this
intuitively, so I don't feel any guilt over intentionally doing it.

It's very much a "fake it until you make it" scenario, because our brains in
many cases really do work that way. When you pick up a skill, your brain
rewires itself in a way that over time the skill requires less conscious
thought. Learning to carry conversations followed the same progression for me.

------
saltcod
I’m on the extroverted end of things but I think principles are the same.

First though: some people are simply hard to talk to. They just don’t give you
anything back. If you run into these people, don’t beat yourself up over it.
Just give it a try and move on if you can’t get anywhere.

Now for the meat of my advice: ask questions. Always be asking questions. I
find that people generally love to talk about stuff that’s close to them.

Let’s try just two examples:

1\. Where are you from? \- how big is it there? \- do you live downtown or in
the suburbs? \- what’s traffic like? \- what’s the weather like there? Hot
summers? Cold winters? Much snow? Much rain? \- is it expensive to live there?
\- much to do there? \- do you do road trips from there? Is it close to other
nice places? \- etc, forever

2\. What do you do? \- What do you work on? Who do you work with? Hours? Keep
up to date? Weekends? Evenings? How big is the company? How much time off?
What do you do with your time off?

Basically I find myself constantly asking questions during these
conversations. The more freely they talk, the more questions I’ll ask. I’ll
also ask lots of personal questions later on in the conversation if things are
going well.

How much is your house / car (generally) etc. The easy way to get to these
answers is to offer your own: “The cost of living where I am is great, largely
bc houses are relatively cheap. My house was $300k. I bet you can’t get a
house for that much where you live?”

If you learn to start thinking in questions you’ll start to develop some good
habits here and it’ll get easier.

But again, I can do this all day with the right people, but with the wrong
people even 5 minutes I’d a slog.

Good luck!

~~~
brokenmachine
Can you give any advice on how to politely stop this kind of interrogation?

Personally I hate small talk but sometimes get dragged into these kinds of
questioning sessions. I'd like to just be able to say, "I'd rather not discuss
that", but that would obviously come off as rude.

~~~
munchbunny
Just start asking questions back to change the topic. Whoever is asking the
questions holds the power to control the topic, so if you start asking them
about what they thought of the ending of Game of Thrones, it becomes their
fault that they're making it weird by insisting on asking about your mortgage
terms.

------
a-saleh
It depends.

If you want a book, I recently re-read "How to win friends and influence
people" and it is quite good :-) The basic seems, you listen to the other
person, and indulge in their interest?

In practical terms, I have started dancing, and in the dance hall, small-talk
often happens.

I.m.o. most important is to read the room, and not be too personal?

I.e. if I am going to the bar to get a drink, and I hear somebody discussing
i.e. how they returned from Italy where they managed to find a really good
local restaurants, and it doesn't sound like a private conversation, and we
might know each-other in passing, I might walk closer and ask about that.

If they give me a why-are-you-talking-to-me? look, I apologize for
interrupting and retreat to somebody I know better :P

If they respond in kind we might have like a 3 minute conversation about good
Italian restaurants, and then we maybe go dancing, or they break-of the
conversation, or I break of the conversation.

The thing I am learning is to distinguish whether me starting/interupting a
conversation will more likely lead to a conversation than just awkward silence
_ahead of time_... I am slowly getting better at that :D

------
azhu
Practice. You are a human. You've seen someone comment on the weather before.
Small talk helps people learn enough about each other to feel comfortable
communicating more freely. When you initially meet you do not know what sort
of person you're speaking with and what they may like or dislike. Providing
some training data for interacting with this particular person to your brain
can help it become more comfortable treading into "big talk" territory.

What you can do to best move things in that direction should depend almost
entirely on your unique self as well as the situation and whoever else is in
the conversation. Start with whatever common ground you know you have, get a
lay of the surrounding land, and then you can more safely prospect out for
more stimulating topics.

It may be tempting to codify the process of small talk, but you'd really be
codifying the process of getting to know other people and letting yourself be
known. This can be a valid strategy, but loses some degree of humanity. People
are endlessly unique, and no amount of hard steps can account for the full set
of factors at play. The human brain is an amazing machine for exactly this
problem.

Practice. It will feel risky, but you will survive, you will learn, and you
will improve.

~~~
azhu
Thought of something else worthwhile to add: for myself and many others, there
may be some set of "abnormal" psychological factors that make it exceptionally
difficult to trial yourself by fire. If you are that, I offer you this clip
from one of the wisest television shows ever created, Bojack Horseman.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R2_Mn-
qRKjA](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R2_Mn-qRKjA)

------
smurv
As a person who was moved from zero small talk ability to some, I've found
that it works quite well to sort of repeat what the other person is saying
when responding. I'm not telling you to parrot them, but if person A says "I
really like being in my garden because it's relaxing and lot of fresh air". I
respond "Yes, I also find myself being more calm when digging my hands into a
vegetable patch", instead of just saying "I agree.", if the case is that you
like gardening, you shouldn't lie of course.

That being said, I still don't really enjoy small talk but it still feels more
comfortable to mee if I notice that the other person is receiving the response
they expected. I know that in my example above, both responses says the same
thing, but most people tend to continue talking and feel more comfortable if I
respond in more verbose manners rather than "Yes." "I agree".

And as some others have pointed out, practice.

------
atoav
The trick is to find any issue that interests the both of you. Finding these
on the fly is a little bit like surfing a wave – this also means you will have
to be listening to what they are saying to find cues that can move the
conversation forward.

Starting is usually the hardest thing. Your goal here is to find out whether
they want to talk with you, do initiate this by starting off with something
easy that affects you both: the weather, the daily commute, morning rituals.
The point here is not to convince the other side of your point of view, but to
figure out _if_ they wanna talk and to look for cues that you could use to
move the conversation forward.

Most importantly the whole thing should be really low pressure: if somebody
doesn’t wants to talk or the communication ends unexpectedly early, who cares?
There can be a thousand reasons that have nothing to do with you, I had 20min
talks with collegues on one day, while on another day the very same people
would avoid finding answers and go their way. You also don’t have to be able
to talk with everyone. Some people don’t enjoy talking, others only enjoy it
when it is negative talk about others etc. Make sure not to talk shit about
other people just to stay in a conversation, it pays off in the long run.

------
dorkwood
I think a good time to practice small talk is Monday morning at work.

Ask the person sitting next to you “how was your weekend? Did you do
anything?” This is a great opener because it guarantees at least a little bit
of back-and-forth conversation, since after they answer the question they will
likely ask you about your own weekend.

If they answer the question by saying they didn’t do anything, you can say
that that sounds relaxing.

If they mention they watched a TV show or saw a movie, be honest and say
whether you’ve heard of it or not. Tell them you’ve been looking for something
new to watch, and ask for their recommendation.

If they did actually do something — maybe they caught up with friends, or saw
family, or went hiking — you can say “oh, that sounds nice!” You can even
leave the conversation there if you’d like, or ask follow up questions about
where the activity took place, what the weather was like, etc.

Next, they’ll probably ask you if you did anything yourself, and you can
respond in kind.

My one tip is to always be honest. Don’t lie or make up stories to sound more
interesting than you are. If you didn’t leave the house and just stayed at
home all weekend coding, you can say that. I dreaded small talk when I was
younger because I was ashamed of having an uninteresting life. But I’ve found
that by expressing the things that I feel a little bit of shame about, I often
end up connecting more deeply with other people around me who feel the same
way.

------
adriand
Be yourself (if you're awkward/weird/whatever, that's okay - embrace it), be
kind, be genuinely interested in other people, try to make other people have a
good time, try not to worry about what they think of you and instead turn your
attention outwards to them.

Smile! Most people are quite happy to be around quiet people who project an
air of friendliness, so you don't have to say too much if you don't want to.

The biggest pitfalls I see with technical people in social situations are the
following:

\- trying to demonstrate knowledge (people don't generally care if you're an
expert)

\- trying to be right

\- talking too much, listening too little

It's also okay to be honest and vulnerable. In fact, a great conversation
starter might be something like, "I'm honestly not really the best at small
talk...want to talk about something more interesting instead?"

------
nefitty
For some low-stakes practice find an active Discord server that matches some
general interest you have, i.e. philosophy, sports, gaming, etc. Try to start
and join conversations to get the cadence and refine your mental model of how
conversation goes. Some very active Discords even have voice chats that you
can join to get even better. Face to face conversations give you many more
signals, i.e. body language, environmental context, etc. so it's like moving
from easy, to medium to hard mode.

One thing you can do IRL is sincerely smile and ask cashiers and other service
workers, "How's your day going?" This is super low stakes because, as long as
they're not extremely busy, they are expected to be nice and will generally
appreciate that you're treating them like a human.

------
1e-9
There is a simple approach that I find universally effective. First off, you
need a goal. Aimless smalltalk is unlikely to be satisfying. Your objective
should be to go beyond smalltalk and have a stimulating conversation.
Stimulating conversations usually involve a topic that is important to both
parties, but which the parties rarely get to talk about. Your primary goal
should be to find such a topic. If you find it, you will have a rewarding
conversation that flows easliy. If you don't find it, the process of searching
can still generate good conversation that transcends typical smalltalk. At all
times, make it clear to the other person that you are interested in them,
their wellbeing, and what they have to say, by looking at them when they talk,
smiling often, being animated, nodding your head in agreement, etc. This puts
people at ease and makes them more eager to engage. Here are the steps:

1) Consider what you know, or can observe, about the other person, which might
yield clues about what is important to them.

2) Choose the topic with greatest probability of being important to both of
you, but unimportant to most other people. Example: "When I drove by your
house the other day, I noticed you had numerous garden gnomes. I love garden
gnomes and everyone seems to think I am crazy!" Another example: "Is it my
imagination or do you have a Nova Scotian accent? You're a long way from home!
I spent my summers in Nova Scotia as a child and had a blast!"

3) If you don't see a good candidate topic, ask probing questions to discover
one. At the very least, you can focus your questions on things important to
you in an effort to find common ground, Example: "Do you have any kids? How
old are they? I also have a 3-year-old and finding good daycare in the city
seems impossible! Do you have a solution?"

4) If the conversation is in danger of lagging, go back to Step 1.

------
benheath
I agree it's good to get people to talk about themselves but as an introvert
don't you just hate when someone does that to you? I know I do. I think it
would be better to balance it out a little. Sometimes I try to come up with
some good stories to tell. Keep them short, to the point, and funny. I think
people appreciate that. They will usually add comments or tell their own story
and off you go. I like to prepare a few beforehand. Don't be boorish and let
the other person interject as much as possible. Try to keep away from
controversial or political topics, unless you want to take on that kind of
conversation. If you do be nice and respectful of the other side of your
argument.

------
mprev
A key thing is to know that the subject is kinda unimportant. Small talk is a
social protocol. It establishes trust and a bond and it kinda helps if the
topic isn’t too heavy.

That’s why sport is so great a topic. Most of what people say about sport has
zero original insight. It’s just there as a way to make the bond and I wish I
cared enough about sport to be able to use it for small talk.

------
ketzo
I’m gonna give you an answer that might not work for you, but I think it’s
worth trying. Basically, with small talk, all you have to do is say SOMETHING.
In many situations, people just want to BE talking, they’re not looking for
something to talk about. That’s the first thing to know and trust. It doesn’t
matter _what_ you say (within reason). Once you know that, all you need is
material.

Here’s my weird process. Practice free association. Basically, look at
something in your surroundings. Say it aloud — “bench”. Say the FIRST word
that pops into your head — “wood”. Now the first after that — “grain”. Keep
going as fast as you are able, and go as long as you feel comfortable. It’s
important to say it out LOUD — you might look like a bit of a crazy person
practicing, but it builds your confidence in your own voice.

Now, when you’re headed to an event where you’ll want to make small talk, or
even if you’re bored walking to work, practice this in your head. “Bus” —
“driver” — “Ryan gosling” — “goose down” — doesn’t matter how goofy it is,
just keep the chain going. In fact, goofier is better!

Now, when you feel the need to make small talk — and I mean make, not just
respond to someone else — you play this game. Engage with your surroundings,
with the person you’re talking to, and with what they’ve said. Take a moment
and practice a little association. The first thing you think to say out loud
to them (within reason, of course), go for it.

This works, I’ve found, much better for introverts than for extroverts — and
no, extroverts are not all naturally social butterflies. This method is good
for people who really just struggle with the mechanics of small talk.

As far as responding goes — responding is the easiest thing in the world,
because you just need to keep engaging with what they’re saying! Doesn’t
matter if it’s boring or inconsequential. Ask a question. Mention a similar
experience you had.

I really recommend the classic _How to Make Friends and Influence People_ by
Dale Carnegie — 80 or something years old, and still a wonderful book on how
to, basically, be someone people want to talk to and enjoy your time talking
to people.

------
logari
I have read the other comments which are interesting and useful in their own
ways. Having said that:

The question I have is why should we feel so compelled to taaaawk? I am
assuming small talk is a prelude to talking, which it is in most cases, unless
it is a greeting.

If a greeting, initiating ST is easy: look for clues into the other person.
Whatever they are doing, you can ask the obvious indirect question: oh, you
are watering plants. Or, walking your pets?

AFAIK, weather is too cliche and may appear boring or fake. Unless the weather
has done sth it does not usually do, like pear-sized hailstones.

If someone initiates a greeting ST, you just go with the flow and say whatever
you want. This one depends on what the initiator said. In general, you can
just be yourself and speak honestly. Your metaframe should be: "this is who I
am, therefore this is what I say", rather than "I am gonna respond to your
initiated ST because you initiated it and I must respond".

If ST is not initiated aa a greeting, whether you want to respond to it so it
becomes a real talk depends on who the initiator is.

If it is a wise person with tons of knowledge, some of which is shared by you,
you will have no trouble talking because topics reveal themselves.

But if it is an imbecile with zero real erudition, what is the need to talk to
such a person?

Also, talking is overrated. I talk because I want to, not because I am
supposed to. If I don't want to, then I don't. In that case, I read HN or
write a comment to interesting questions like yours.

------
Raphmedia
Social skills are just that — skills.

How do you normally best acquire new programming skills? Video tutorials,
books, online articles or perhaps podcasts?

Pick the medium that is best for you and then find resources on social skills.

One of my issues used to be understanding emotions. Several books later, I'm a
much more balanced person. We tend to view charisma based skills as something
that people are born with but it's not. They are just regular skills you must
learn and train.

------
indigochill
I'm not very good at initiating, but I'd like to think I'm pretty good at
keeping it going. The golden rule is "maintain initiative". The way you do
that is as follows:

1\. Have a reason for engaging. Maybe your reason is just to practice, and
that's totally fine. Anything goes here. Just be conscious and confident about
your reason. When your reason has been fulfilled, it's a natural time to move
on rather than feeling you need to continue to talk just because.

2\. When possible, ask a question of the other party. If they mention they
enjoy being in their garden, I would ask them about that. What's in the
garden? What do they like to do there? Asking a question gives you the power
of setting the topic of conversation while making the other party feel good
because they're talking about themselves and specifically something they like
to talk about (because they brought it up).

Setting the topic with a question is also a good position for you to be in,
because it reduces the likelihood that the conversation's going to steer into
a topic you're uncomfortable with. The way they answer also gives you some
insight into what they value, which can be a clue for future questions.

------
robgibbons
You could benefit by reading one or more of a few books: How to Win Friends
and Influence People, How to Talk to Anyone, and Meta Talk.

Beyond that, start by taking notice of someone's clothing, hair, or other
notable characteristics/behaviors. Look for anything that stands out to you,
and pay them a polite comment about how you noticed it.

People tend to enjoy talking about things that interest them, especially
things they choose to carry/wear. And people love hearing their own name, so
use it when you address them if you can.

Sports and movies are two topics you can catch up and keep up on that will
give you lots to engage with people over.

Asking about family is a common topic, and those family oriented types will
love you for reminding them and inquiring about their loved ones.

As a general rule, listen 80% and speak 20%. People in general like to hear
themselves talk, and if you give them the opportunity, they will think you're
a better conversationalist, when it's really them doing 80% of it.

When someone says something, see if you can't resonate with what they're
saying and reflecting it against your own experience.

------
reubenswartz
I’ve found it’s helpful to just be genuinely curious about the people you
meet. This seemed hard because although I am curious, I’m introverted and I
don’t like to be nosy. But you don’t have to Start with heavy questions. For
example, asking where someone is from and how they got here, or, if you’re
taking to a couple, how they met, lets them answer however they are
comfortable.

One thing I have noticed is that asking about what people do for a living is
often not as interesting. Perhaps because it’s a very common opening question
in America to assess whether the other person is “worthy”, people often
respond with something canned and sometimes even performative. Once you get to
know them a little it’s easier to have a meaningful conversation about what
they do.

------
noufalibrahim
MY general approach (which I've refined over a time) is to have a set of
standard questions (where you work, what you do, comments on obvious stuff
like dressing style or jewellery, pen etc.) and to open with one of these.
That starts the conversation. I've also learnt to strop cringing when I say
things like "Hi so and so, my name is Noufal and I [insert how you know or are
interested in the person]. Just wanted to say hello and connect."

There are several things that can be used to keep this kind of thing afloat.
Recent news, entertainment (movies, music) etc.

Usually, one of these things leads into a conversation where I can find a
common interest (movies, hobby etc.) and that gives you some kind of rapport.
Then you'll feel more comfortable and can talk smoothly.

This might sound weird or awkward but it gets better with practice till it
becomes second nature. My main problem is these days is to _start_. I still
have a few of a hello being rejected or being brushed aside and that gives me
pause when I want to introduce myself to someone. That's how I behave on auto
pilot so I have to force myself to say hello. That only happens if I'm
energetic and feeling good so I try to make sure that I'm that way before
getting into a situation where I need this.

------
graycat
I learned one approach to small talk from some highly polished rules and
techniques from some intensely dedicated, grand experts in a kingdom of such
experts, the Protestant rural Midwest. There I saw some brilliant people
putting about the most mental energy I ever saw into just small talk!

The first point is, the people don't want to be alone and, instead, want to be
in groups and, there, talking.

The second point is, with rare exceptions, it is inappropriate, a social
mistake, to talk about anything important, to communicate anything like
_information_ , to accomplish anything or make any _progress_ in the small
talk, or, horrors, to say anything at all controversial or even very personal.
So, necessarily an instance of small talk has to be short.

The third point is, use a lot of mental energy to keep with the first two
points while not obviously doing so, and there can be intense competition
here. E.g., need ways to end an instance of small talk that threatens to
violate the rules.

There can be some gender differences: (1) The women prefer to talk about
people. When talking about other people, that can be gossip. When talking
about each other, that is usually about feelings. (2) Men prefer to exchange
information, mostly about things.

So, a Midwest church social can partition into (1) the women talking about
their own feelings or gossip about other people and (2) the men talking about
things and exchanging information. So, small talk between a man and a woman
will be awkward and generally constrained.

At the start of a small talk instance there can be a lot of use of just
_stock_ phrases, e.g., about the weather, and often the instance soon ends.

That's what I saw in the US Midwest!

So, a first mistake in trying to understand such small talk is to try to find
ways to make the instance interesting, productive, significant, meaningful,
engaging, etc. NO!!!! Nearly all of that is deliberately forbidden by the
first two points!!!

------
mikekchar
It's all about practice. It may help you to know that most people studying a
second language have exactly the same problem. You can order a drink at
MacDonald's or reserve a seat at a restaurant, but casual conversation is
quite difficult.

As someone else said here, start with a standard set of things. I often talk
about the weather. Keep track of how the weather has been and make a remark
about it ("It's been hot our recently, hasn't it", etc).

It's also important to consider greetings when you start a conversation. I
talk to people on the street a lot (it helps that I live in a small town). At
first, build familiarity just by smiling and saying, "Good morning" or hello.
I have a very firm personal rule that if I pass someone older than me on the
street and there are very few people around, I will smile and say "Hello".
Smiling is very important, so don't forget that. After a few times, you can
try your opening observation and see if they respond. If they don't, just let
it go. If they do, try for a very small conversation (one or two sentences is
absolutely fine!)

But the real trick is to transition into questions. Most people like talking
about themselves and their preferences. You need to cultivate a curiosity
about the other person. If they respond to the comment about the weather,
think of a follow up question, "Do you like summer", etc. It's important to
_listen_ to what they are saying and to try to ask a question that is relevant
to that that thing. It really takes a fair bit of practice, so don't be
discouraged if you find it difficult.

The other important thing to consider is how to close the conversation. Once
you get to an awkward silence, or if you just want to bail (which is totally
fine), you need to learn how end the conversation and move on. This is also
surprisingly difficult. Again, smiling is really important. If you are not
used to smiling, practice smiling so that it more or less feels normal. Then
just say something like "I'll talk to you later".

If find that elderly people are often very lonely and are very good
conversation partners. Just walk down the street to find some. Or go to a bar
and find someone drinking by themselves. Another thing you can do if you have
time is to volunteer at a retirement home.

If you find yourself in parties, my advice is to pace yourself. Take
opportunities, but don't feel that you have to stay for hours on end just
because you think you have to mingle. Talk to a few people and when you've had
enough, go home. Make sure to thank your host and be fairly candid about
appreciating being invited, but that you have a low party threshold.

One last piece of advice that I think I got from the anime for "Sangatsu no
lion" (Out like a lion). If you are having trouble meeting and making friends,
start by making an animal friend. Then make a friend who is older than you.
Then make a friend that is that same age as you. It's kind of like leveling up
-- making friends in your peer group can actually be stressful and difficult
for a lot of people.

------
netsharc
I read this a few weeks ago and want to implement it, but I've never really
gotten the chance: [https://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/17/fashion/dating-the-end-
of...](https://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/17/fashion/dating-the-end-of-small-
talk.html)

This not-so-serious German article has 9 questions you could try asking
instead:

[https://www.bento.de/haha/smalltalk-zehn-alternativen-
fuer-d...](https://www.bento.de/haha/smalltalk-zehn-alternativen-fuer-die-
typischen-fragen-a-7c5717d5-c979-4aa7-bf01-17bbd20ff139)

I've tried this by prefacing it with "So I read this article about what to ask
instead of small talk...", and obviously people will be intrigued and ask "So
what were the questions?"

Translation of the questions:

1\. What song would you pick to describe your hometown? - Like "Where are you
from? Did you like it there?" but more interesting.

2\. If you were a part of a car, which part would you be? - Better than
animals or superheroes. If they say steering wheel, maybe they're a control
freak?

3\. Who would you bite first if you were a zombie?

4\. Which movie title would you pick to describe yourself?

5\. Muesli (cereal) and then milk in the bowl, or milk and then muesli? (The
author writes if they answer milk first, they've lost control of their lives)

6\. If you could read a book that tells you how the rest of your life will go,
would you read it? - Is the person someone who wants to be prepared, or do
they prefer the unkonown?

7\. Which character of yours would you definitely want to pass down to your
kids? And which do you not want to pass down? - This is basically asking "What
are your strengths and weaknesses".

8\. What would the perfect drug do to you? - "What would you be if not you?"

9\. How and where would you get rid of a body? - You want this to be a
memorable conversation, right? And it would be a starting point for your
relatives to search for you.

~~~
sethammons
I think people should avoid these for small talk replacement. There was a
younger guy at work who led off exactly as you suggested (in fact, I checked
your username to see if you were him). It was received so very poorly. People
were not ready to have "odd" requests of them. There was no natural flow. If
you want to ask questions, they should start in the context of the setting:
have you been here before? Lived here long? What's a good way to do
$something_related?

~~~
netsharc
Depends on the context, I guess. You're right, if you're in a conference
coffee break or a new guy at work it really would be awkward.

I tried this at a company event at a dinner, where we were socializing with
colleagues from other locations and their spouses.

------
andrath
You saysomething about turtles... No wait, wrong smalltalk.

Seriously though, small talk is fleeting. You pick a generic subject
(Something like: what's up? How are you doing? (if the person is doing
something interesting) What are you doing? How does it work? Why are you doing
that?). Just ask questions, don't get too personal at first. Pick up on clues,
ask about what you hear. Keep it light. Backchannel a bit ("oh, I see", "uh-
huh", nod, etc), but don't overdo it.

Oh, and practice, preferably with people that you know well.

------
austincheney
Ask for help with something trivial but not unimportant. Then ask if they have
done something like that before and see where the conversation goes. A little
bit of flattery goes a long way.

------
microtherion
Toastmasters meetings tend to include a section called "Table Topics", where
people get to practice their small talk skills. It's also the one section
where guests get to talk, so you can try it without joining.

TM Clubs can vary quite a bit in their quality and philosophy, and in places
like the Silicon Valley, there are tons of them, so it might be worth
exploring a few of them before joining one (or deciding it's not for you).

------
faissaloo
If you want to initiate small talk don't leave it too long, start with a
greeting if you haven't already, ask 'how's it going' or 'how are you doing',
come up with further questions if they give a complex response otherwise
provide an anecdote about something you're up to (come up with these when you
do the thing otherwise your mind will go blank when you go to bring something
up).

------
leemailll
you may like this [https://www.newyorker.com/culture/culture-desk/my-
struggle-w...](https://www.newyorker.com/culture/culture-desk/my-struggle-
with-american-small-talk)

------
sAbakumoff
more interested question is why do you need small talk at all?

~~~
derpherpsson
Some northern Scandinavian people and especially the Finns do without it.

I tried having comfortable silences with my coworkers. Some like it, some just
go insane. It kind of depends on the person - maybe some people never learn to
appreciate the silence.

~~~
chrisseaton
I've been to conferences in Finland and there's as much smalltalk as there is
anywhere else. Going to a conference and everyone just standing there silently
would be a waste of everyone's time and money.

~~~
derpherpsson
Okay. By having done away with it I guess I really meant that they are not
doing it pointlessly often, when it could just as well be quiet.

Such as at the coffee (fika) break. It might be okay to just be silent. All
you are going to talk about is rather obvious in either case.

------
mhh__
Ask for small talk advice, people like being asked for advice and you can't
fake being good at conversation(Regardless of whether or not you enjoy it)

Talk to more people. Humans are not state machines (?)

------
uwagan
alan kay would have been happy you were talking about smalltalk. he may even
have commented :P

~~~
Insanity
Does he tend to answer on HN? :P

~~~
scarface74
Yes

[https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=alankay1](https://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=alankay1)

------
andrei_says_
Follow your genuine curiosity.

------
ravenstine
Not to undermine the good advice people have already posted here, but HNers
are going to approach these sorts of questions _like an engineer_. Social
interaction like small talk is actually much closer to art than science(though
both are involved), so it's a mistake to assume that there's a formula or
framework that creates better smalltalk. That doesn't work because we never
have even 10% control over the context and all the variables involved.

Basically, you have to learn to not _have_ to think about initiating or
responding to small talk. It has to just be second nature, and if you keep
thinking "What should I say?", then you're sabotaging yourself before you've
even started. By consciously thinking about small talk, your mind will
overwork itself and you won't be as spontaneous. You might even hesitate when
no hesitation is warranted.

Small talk actually isn't _that_ hard, and this is coming from someone who is
known as being quiet and reserved. When small talk is hard, it's our self-
consciousness and insecurities getting in the way. Once you manage to get over
yourself, small talk is really simple and can be basically anything _small_.

If you need practice that has a low risk of embarrassment, it's good to
practice with old people because they are usually glad to have someone talk to
and, in my experience, they have the humility to not give you the stink eye if
you say something dumb. People at grocery store checkouts are good, too, and
they can be either the clerks or the patrons themselves. You can make a simple
remark about an item someone's buying, or even make suggestions based on what
they're buying.

Just say anything! Well, _almost_ anything. It's _small_ talk, so obviously
it's not good to bring up complex, serious, or very controversial subjects.
Lose the "filter" that's preventing you from just making innocuous comments on
things. I'm not going to tell you exactly what to say because small talk is
very context dependent, so remarks about the weather can either be boring and
cliche or the perfect way to break the silence.

There are some good _kinds_ of questions that work I find work generally well,
and they all share a theme of _relatability_. Everyone relates to technology,
and remarks either praise or scoff at technology will generally get a
response.

Is there a some relatively non-partisan current event in the news? _Ask the
other person what they think about it._ People really love that.

"What do you think about <some song> getting banned being played on the
radio?" Everyone's got opinions and strangers will _usually_ take up your
conversation.

Make a positive comment about a thing that a person owns, but be _genuine_
about it. Those are just a few examples.

If you've got a "shower thought" that fits the context, just go with it. And
if that seems bad to you, then you really need to work on losing your filter.

The moral of the story is to _lose the filter_. Everything after that is
mostly up to you, and you can develop your own style that works with your
personality, voice, and body.

Like I said, it takes lots of _practice_ , and nobody out there has a formula
that's going to turn you from someone who can't make small talk into someone
who does.

~~~
munchbunny
For more linear thinkers (that's not a bad thing, engineers have to be good at
it by necessity) turning off the engineer brain is very important, but it's
rather hard to simply stop thinking the way you're used to thinking.

My suggestion is instead to focus your thinking on observing your gut
reactions in social settings. As an engineer you often have to suppress that
in order to focus on rational decision-making, but your gut is still there,
and it's highly attuned to reading other people. You can use that to your
advantage by learning to pay attention to it when you need to.

------
dlphn___xyz
see a counselor

------
Jeff_Brown
Openers are mostly, "Consider X with me. I like it," or, "Consider Y with me.
I don't like it." Picking "the perfect" topic isn't really important. I think
openers are largely about finding something both of you have some perception
of and some feeling about. That's why the weather works -- everyone is aware
of it and has some kind of feeling about it.

That initial share of feelings gives you a sense for whether they want to
talk, and what questions might work next. Those questions are where your
choices get interesting.

Note that someone might be receptive even if they don't say anything
interesting. If they smile and look open to talking, they probably are.

------
mapcars
To initiate a small talk you just open a mouth and make some sounds. If the
other person is lucky to understand your language - you have initiated a small
talk, congratulations xD

I'm waiting for questions on how to initiate breathing or blood flow. Hint:
you don't need to do anything, it just happens.

