

Let's Not Get Carried Away: Anti-Depressants Really Do Help People - tokenadult
http://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2012/06/hey-lets-not-get-carried-away-anti-depressants-really-do-help-people/257976/

======
bunderbunder
Long story short:

Studies said the glass was 40% full. Hype led people to think it was close to
100% full. New re-analysis of the data leads to the conclusion that the glass
is really 30% full. The hype train responds by deciding that the glass must
really be 100% empty.

The moral of the story is that we should listen to Flavor Flav:
<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LK8sxngSWaU>

------
iskander
Regardless of whether anti-depressants are effectual, overprescribed, or
totally useless: I think it's amazing that an article arguing the merits of a
pharmaceutical treatment can be published without reference to any research.

>But that, of course, doesn't mean that antidepressants are dummy pills that
have no real effect; and it's crucial that depressives--many of whom are
suspicious of medication--realize that.

I think the author subscribes to an outmoded view of the placebo effect and
doesn't acknowledge the mind's remarkable capacity to trigger real physical
changes in the body. Antidepressants can be 'dummy pills' and still have a
real effect.

~~~
ImprovedSilence
I don't know for sure one way or the other, but I've seen too many of my
friends mix anti-depressants and alcohol to think that these pills are
placebos that don't have any real affect besides in your mind.

~~~
throwaway_ad
What? You realize anti-depressants like SSRIs modify your brain's chemistry
and can take 6-8 weeks before you'll notice any effects.

I was staying over at a friend's house and had some drinks (2 beers + 2
screwdrivers), and at the time was on SSRIs for about 4 months. My alcohol
tolerance is fairly average and expected a light buzz. Instead I ended up
wasted for the first time since college days. In my scenario, anti-depressants
definitely amplified alcohol's effects.

Regardless of what you _think_ , it's been clinically proven. That's why the
drug's label has a warning about alcohol intake.

~~~
ImprovedSilence
I think you misread my sentence. You are agreeing with me.

------
tokenadult
Because the submitted article mentions back-and-forth about placebo effects,
quoting some researchers on the issue, perhaps I should share here some links
that are helpful for understanding what placebo effects are all about. Some of
these online links cite quite a few useful scholarly publications.

[http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/index.php/michael-
specte...](http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/index.php/michael-specter-on-
the-placebo-effect/)

"In other words, the best research we have strongly suggests that placebo
effects are illusions, not real physiological effects. The possible exception
to this are the subjective symptoms of pain and nausea, where the placebo
effects are highly variable and may be due to subjective reporting."

[http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/index.php/angells-
review...](http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/index.php/angells-review-of-
psychiatry/)

[http://theness.com/neurologicablog/index.php/the-rise-and-
fa...](http://theness.com/neurologicablog/index.php/the-rise-and-fall-of-
placebo-medicine/)

[http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/index.php/placebo-
effect...](http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/index.php/placebo-effects-
revisited/)

<http://www.skepdic.com/placebo.html>

[http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/index.php/revisiting-
dan...](http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/index.php/revisiting-daniel-
moerman-and-placebo-effects/)

------
ImprovedSilence
"I'd tried everything I could think of to cure myself (cutting out alcohol,
cutting out caffeine, practicing better "sleep hygiene," melatonin, etc.);
nothing had worked. "

What about exercise? I'm not here to give an opinion one way or the other
about the benefits of anti-depressants, or what would work for this particular
individual, but I think far far too often people over-look the tremendous
health benefits of regular exercise and eating right. Not saying it's a cure
all/catch all, one stop fix. I just see it being overlooked far too often.
Wanna sleep good, exercise hard for a few days, the endorphins it helps
produce works wonders on the brain too.

~~~
beneth
She mentions exercise later on in the article, and implies that she exercises
regularly.

~~~
tlear
She does not give much details about that. 3 times a week half an hour
"exercise" is one type, preparing and doing a triathlon or a marathon is
another. From anecdotal experience when I just exercised I felt better, when I
became a serious runner I started to feel amazing.

------
tehayj
Of course those drugs have their place. They should be used for quick
interventions before people get cured by proper therapies. Unfortunately there
is so much money in just keeping people on those drugs that just popping pills
is offered as alternative solution as well.

Then after 2-3 years when one kind of drug doesn't work anymore you get the
next one. The problem are not the drugs, the problem are the people
prescribing them and people looking for a quick fix for their problems by
taking pills instead of doing a proper therapy.

~~~
taligent
Please enlighten everyone about what "proper therapy" means.

You do realise that depression is not just psychological and that there are
physical problems in some cases that ONLY medication will be able to solve.

~~~
tehayj
Please enlighten me what persistent physical problems exist for people with
depression?

There are temporary physical problems or chemical inbalances for which the
drugs work great but once people have done a therapy like cbt, act, mbct or
dbt that works for them, those physical problems disappear as well.

