

Ask HN: What colleges out there have good web design degrees? - joshmlewis

First of all, I want lots of answers.<p>Second of all, I'm graduating high school this year and I want to continue my love of web design and pursue a web design degree.  I've looked around and haven't found many schools that have a good degree.  Anyone out there with experience have any tips or advice? And what is a good average salary for a web designer?
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zaidf
Wow, such a good question.

First things first, specific to design, almost no one cares about your degree
in design. Almost everyone cares about your portfolio. Very, very few clients
that I've done design work for even asked for a resume. Almost all ask for a
portfolio right after the "hello".

I think if you do a real study of the best designers, you'll find that very
few have a degree that has "web design" in it. A lot of the designers I know
from school had a journalism/ad degree with a media concentration.

About pay - your average web designer does not make much. I do a lot of
contract work for design and programming and when I quote the same rate for
design as programming, clients balk at it. One prospective client said how he
is paying about 20/hr to a local designer. I simply cannot compete with that
and probably wasn't a best fit for his project.

Now, what do I mean? I think the designers who do pull dough transition into
UX/product. Now you are no longer being hired to convert psds into html but
figure out what you can do to the design to increase conversion or engagement
etc. Some may argue that doing that job is no longer design. May be or may be
not...it's mostly semantics.

So if you are into design, also play with the idea of learning
programming(jquery?) and marketing(seth godin, ab testing etc.). The two
complement design very well and make you stand out from the run of the mill
designers.

Also, a warning about simply picking a program based on your hobby. My hobby
was programming all through high school but I hated comp sci-related stuff in
college. That says more about me - I enjoyed the freedom that came from self-
learning programming on projects I enjoyed. I did not enjoy programming in a
specific textbook order full of theory. Note, I do believe if you do want to
pursue a serious programming career, a degree in comp sci can help you more
than hurt you. But just know what you are signing up for by reading through
the curriculum and talking to alums!

Similarly, most design programs would want you to develop drawing and other
artistic skills that may have little to do with _your_ interest in design. Be
sure you can slog through it and not let that make you hate design(the worst
case scenario).

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bingaman
My advice: don't get a degree in web design. DO go to college and learn about
something you're interested in (or just go to figure out what you're
interested in!). College should not be vocational training, no matter what
your parents or counselors imply. Take the time to think really hard about
things that have no bearing on the 'real world'. Keep designing websites
(there will be plenty of opportunities) and build a portfolio. The best people
practicing what you're interested are working and sharing what they learn
online - not through academic institutions.

Some of the interactive design programs out there do look pretty good (SVA,
for one - though that's postgrad).

(PS - I struggled with this 10 years ago and ended up getting degrees in
computer science and graphic design. Anything I learned about 'web design' was
totally useless by the time I was working, and I had taught myself basically
everything I used day to day. However, the fundamentals of graphic design and
CS do not change.)

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citricsquid
I've never done a degree in web design, but in my opinion they're not at all
valuable. Design is one of the very few things where your portfolio matters,
not your qualifications. I mean sure a degree in design won't hinder you, but
I would personally spend the time and money on building up a portfolio, unless
you believe you will learn enough to justify the cost.

A degree in web design will not make or break you, web design is a skill that
can't be "made" with a degree, unlike some professions.

~~~
vernabee
True that design cannot be "made" with a degree, but I hope by saying that
you're referring to having "the eye." There is a great deal of philosophy,
conceptual thinking, and larger design research that goes into successfully
completing a design degree and being a good designer. Yes, you might be able
to find it on your own -- but going to a good design school will really
strengthen your ability to form your perspective.

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hardik988
A couple of my friends were in a similar situation as you. After a lot of
research, they realized that it's not terribly important to attend a web
design course per se.

Both these guys are pursuing their college degrees in arts, and using the
almost inexhaustible inspiration they receive from the art world.

~~~
Zev
This. I know a few people who have done this -- and have done something
similar myself.

Most colleges have an Art department that offers something like Graphic
Design. I would personally suggest concentrating in something like Studio Art,
rather than Graphic Design specifically. You'll still pick up the same tools,
but it will come from a different angle.

Also, Communications departments (and/or Journalism, specifically,) are very
good at being up to date at technology; advertising relies on technology to
work nowadays.

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pstack
I've never even heard of such a thing as a degree in web-design, so I don't
know if that's a real thing or not. I'd probably suggest focusing on design in
general rather than "web" design. Maybe even things like product design.
Things that you could apply in an artistic and aesthetic context to any career
choice.

The technical aspect is something you can probably pick up on your own, though
it's a bit more of a chore today than a decade ago when you could truly teach
yourself 90% of what was out there in a few months.

Of course, this is all assuming you're talking about being the artistic guy.
If you're talking about infrastructure -- from hardware planning to databases
to writing the engine for sites on the back-end, I'd go for a more CS-flavored
education.

I think the big problem today remains what it was ten years ago, however. And
the same problem fields like the video game industry suffer. Everyone wants to
get into them. That drops your marketability and power of negotiation. Unless
you're a truly top-tier individual who has something to bring that almost
nobody else in the industry can and you can really make a niche for yourself.

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vernabee
You should really check out some of the up and coming (and highly supported)
Interactive Design degrees being developed and offered up at some of the top
design schools. Interactive Design is the greater study of how both product,
UX, and visual communications design all factor into the development of
technologically based products. One of the ones that has been getting a lot of
attention recently is the Interactive Design undergraduate major being newly
offered at California College of the Arts (CCA) - great school. Some info:

About the Interaction Design Program CCA’s Interaction Design Program will
prepare students to create meaningful and innovative designed experiences in
the realms of work, lifestyle, and play—from computers and mobile devices to
interactive physical spaces, games, and social networks.

By learning investigative research, systemic thinking, creative prototyping,
and hands-on building, Interaction Design students will be prepared to succeed
and lead in this exciting field. Students develop technical skills
(wireframes, flows, visuals, motion) for interactive canvases such as mobile,
desktop, car, game console, film, sculpture, clothes, and buildings. The
possible applications extend to numerous industries, from business to
entertainment, education, and health.

Program Leadership Dr. Kristian Simsarian, cofounder of the Software
Experiences Practice at IDEO and adjunct professor in CCA’s Graduate Program
in Design, has been tapped to chair the new program. He commented,
“Surprisingly, there is not yet a consistent source for talent in this field.
CCA, with its interdisciplinary environment, impressive facilities, and great
location at the hub of the digital world, is the ideal place to build a world-
class interaction design program. I am thrilled to be leading this effort. My
passion in education is to be a guide for students to create the future from
their own insightful, well-informed, and personally inspired visions.”

Silicon Valley Connections CCA’s Interaction Design Program was created with
input from thinkers at Google, YouTube, Apple, Intel, Nokia, and IDEO. Such
companies, as well as nonprofit organizations, will take part in vibrant
exchanges with students through sponsored studios and other project-based
courses. Students will also have internship opportunities, enabling them to
gain professional work experience and contacts, and to define their individual
pathways to their future careers.

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nnash
There are a couple CAD schools you can choose from SCAD and MCAD are the most
well known. Other art schools include RISD, Ringling and SVA. I'd also
consider MICA simply because of their awesome study abroad program.

Its slightly tricky with private colleges that offer BFAs, because they may
label a course as Interactive Media or Multimedia, when it really means New
Media Art as opposed to strictly web design. A lot of schools offer a mix of
motion graphics and graphic design as well.

Other schools you can consider are the unaccredited Art Institute, and Full
Sail. I've heard nothing but bad things about the latter so I would avoid it.
If your looking for strictly trade learning and no conceptual new media
nonsense Ai might be good to consider. Keep in mind though that you won't be
able to transfer credits earned there anywhere else.

If you aren't interested in unaccredited schools you should also check out
your local community colleges offerings the credits you earn there will
transfer to private art colleges if you change your mind later and find one
that you like.

Before applying for schools check and see whether or not they require a
portfolio, I think a lot of the private art colleges do. Your portfolio is
very important in the case that one is required; at the college I attend each
prospective student is rated, and accepted, based on a 5 point scale;
portfolio is worth 3pts, letter of interest 1pt and SAT/ACT scores are worth
1pt.

Edit: I'm going to disagree with people who are saying that you should learn
design on your own. Good graphic design needs to be taught you need to
understand grids, hierarchy and be able to create intelligent systems that
accurately convey your information. Unless you're actively involved in these
sort of discussions where you're learning from a peer-group you won't get the
kind of knowledge a design professor with an MFA can give you.

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code
Like many others have said here, majority of the best designers I've
personally had the pleasure of working with or encountering were all self-
taught and had little to no formal design education. The few people I've known
that did go to design school, weren't very good. Of course that's not to say
that people who go to design school can't be extremely good. That's just
personal observation from those I've work with (which isn't representative of
designers everywhere).

Having said that, I've always been impressed with the Design School each time
I've been there (don't actually know if its related to what you're looking
for): <http://dschool.stanford.edu/>

Disclaimer: I am not a design major, my design skills are self-taught, and I'm
a former Stanford student.

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bokonon
I have the same question, except the only difference is that I'm in at a
community college in Souther California right now and I will be transferring
and about a year. Right now I'm on a path to go to some UC and get probably a
B.A. in Computer Science. I don't want to go into programming necessarily
because my passion is really design, especially web related design, UX, and
web development.

I just figured Computer Science would be the best path because I find it
interesting and it will open up more opportunities for me in the future.
However recently I've been discouraged because of all the math I'm going to
have to get through.

I'd love to hear some insight about what would be the best way to get into the
field. What school is best? What major? I'd preferably like to stay in
California.

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jarin
I think it depends on whether you want to be more of a "design-y" designer or
a "UX-y" designer.

If you want to be a "design-y" web designer, I would say go for a degree in
graphic design, take as many web development courses as you can get, learn a
lot of stuff online, and start building sites in your spare time (after the
first few, you can probably get paid for it).

If you want to be a "UX-y" web designer, I would say get a liberal arts degree
(or even a CS degree if you're feeling bold), take as many CS and web
development classes as you can get, learn a lot of stuff online, and team up
with a programmer buddy to start building web applications in your spare time
(after the first few, you can either get paid to make them or you can get
people to pay you to use them).

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t00t
[http://daap.uc.edu/academics/design/bs_graphic_communication...](http://daap.uc.edu/academics/design/bs_graphic_communication.html)
<http://www.design.cmu.edu/>

Two very good programs. They aren't "web design" programs, but will be a more
well-rounded design education.

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ideamonk
Others have already conveyed much of what I wished to repeat. Just to add to
that -

Don't get a degree in web design, this is a thing that evolves and you can
learn on your own. If creating illustrations has been a pain for you, go for a
degree that adds on the missing slices, like a course in fine arts.

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niico
Life University + off course some dribbble, webcreme, smashingmagazine, etc...
:D

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natural219
I think the closest you're going to come to a web design degree is a graphic
design degree. Some art institutes (KCAI is the only one I'm familiar with)
offer a web design track for graphic design majors; I'd look at individual
departments and find one that suits you.

That's for design, though. If you're interested in development, information
technology degrees are going to be the most substantial, although you can
learn most web development on your own (it took me about 6-8 months to become
comfortable enough with html/css/javascript to do freelance work, although I
am taking computer science courses).

In the end, most of what you need for web development you can find online.

