
Chinese Offer to Eat Denmark’s Oyster Problem - hvo
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/04/28/world/asia/china-oysters-denmark.html?_r=0
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cperciva
Although it sounds like the "eat the oysters" solution here is a joke, the
idea of using cuisine to tackle the problem of invasive species is not new.
The Lionfish is native to Indo-Pacific waters but is now established as an
invasive species in the Caribbean; the NOAA and partner agencies enlisted the
help of chefs to publish recipes for cooking these fish, and even convinced
the Catholic church to suggest that their Colombian parishioners eat lionfish
on Fridays.

~~~
nebabyte
I mean it absolutely sounds like a great trade opportunity, if the numbers pan
out.

~~~
yourapostasy
Unfortunately the numbers are difficult to work out, because hunting lionfish
is still predominantly a very labor-intensive activity. Some folks are working
on remotely operated unmanned submersibles to factor out the labor. Also
missing is a grid of underwater cameras feeding a stream to a back-end object
recognition cluster to map out real-time lionfish locations to maximize kill
utilization ratios (too much time is spent looking for them instead of killing
them).

Bootstrap enough of the industry, then build enough of the submersibles to
permanently station around the most sensitive coral reefs and eventually
entire islands and coastlines to "fence them off" from future infestations,
and push them further out into the ocean where large predators can feast upon
them as they have less cover to hide within, if the native oceanic predators
can even eat them. There is some suspicion that in the invasive areas lionfish
have no natural predators other than humans; sharks, groupers and eels can be
trained to expect dead lionfish handouts from divers, but no one has yet
documented them start to hunt the lionfish on their own in significant
numbers. I would settle for pushing them out into the relative desert of the
benthic ocean, and hope they starve out there.

Fortunately, someone has already worked out a filleting robot for haddock, and
modifying its pattern recognition for lionfish requires enough a training
corpus to make it sufficiently reliable, so once killed they can be quickly
prepared and frozen. The most recent research indicates lionfish aren't
susceptible to Ciguatera. Unfortunately, lionfish toxins can also sometimes be
found in their flesh, so they must be cooked (heat breaks down the toxins),
and they can't be introduced into the lucrative sushi and sashimi markets
(though I'm sure enterprising sushi chefs will find delicious ways to prepare
the cooked lionfish flesh).

Accuracy rates on automated classification of lionfish in live streaming video
is so far not revealed in any write ups I've read, and especially false
positives (killing fish that the classifier thinks is lionfish but actually
are not). That's a significant problem, and also the obstacle that I can't
work out to gamifying the killing of lionfish.

The threat of the more capital-intensive automation of industrial-scale
lionfish hunting/eradication also presents a challenge to locals who want to
break into the market. Not much incentive for the locals to invest into
opening the market when they know they could be out of a job within just a few
years of establishing a lucrative market to well-capitalized (and often
foreign) competitors who can tap more credit than the locals.

Currently, economically beneficial lionfish eradication for the locals is
primarily focused upon leading hunts for diving tourists to favored dive
spots, and not for systemic, industrial-scale, broad eradication across the
entire coastline. Personally, I believe leaving it at this is a mistake,
because lionfish represent a threat to our fisheries over the longer term.

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nebabyte
> The post instantly electrified Chinese netizens, who always love to flaunt
> their centuries-long passion for diversifying food resources. > The proposed
> solution was as follows: “Denmark can invent an 'eater's visa' for Chinese
> visitors, offering unlimited entries within 10 years for stays of up to a
> month each visit. The oysters will be extinct within five years." > “Ha!
> Five years? Five months is enough," one user commented.

It's heartening, in a way, to see how fluidly certain interpersonal relations
can move across language/culture barriers in this day and age. We really are
all alike in many ways after all; maybe it's not yet time to give up on a
post-internet era as one that can reach greater heights of intercultural
empathy.

Assuming legislation doesn't gut the net.

~~~
ue_
Very true, that's the thought I had when I saw this. Cross-culture dialogue
and understanding is very important, and it would be nice to see more and
more, especially when it may be threatened by growing nationalism in various
countries.

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Laforet
Am I the only person not keen to eat Danish shellfish? The Baltic is heavily
polluted by all sorts of heavy metals and persistent organic contaminants, and
filter feeders are known to accumulate these substances.

In fact, most of the Baltic fish catch already ended up getting exported to
Asia as fish meal because it is illegal to use them as feed or fertiliser in
EU if the final product is intended for human consumption.

~~~
codingbeer
They are not from the Baltic. It's the North Sea. More precisely Kattegat,
Skagerak and along the western shore.

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Laforet
The western shore of Jutland may qualify as the North Sea but the other two
regions definitely don't.

Morever, the top layer of the Kattegatt has a much lower salinity compared to
the ocean due to significant outflow of warm brackish water from the Baltic,
carrying all the pollutants to the North Sea through the Skagerrak.

To be fair, the situation has actually been improving since the late 90s with
tighter regulation on effluents, however I'd rather wait another 10 year
before this patch of sea clears up itself.

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gtirloni
Seems related to Chinese people looking for imported sea food due to water
pollution:

[http://www.bordbia.ie/industry/manufacturers/insight/alerts/...](http://www.bordbia.ie/industry/manufacturers/insight/alerts/Pages/ImportedoystersgrowinginpopularityinChina.aspx?year=2015&wk=13)

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jameslk
I don't quite understand... Do the locals or larger Nordic/European populace
not eat as many oysters? Why the Chinese versus any other nationality?

~~~
pembrook
The problem is lack of demand for this particular oyster in Europe. Otherwise
this would be considered a boon for local fisherman. The oysters the article
is referring to are of the "giant" variety with many of them being about the
size of a human hand (fingers and all).

Not having eaten them myself, I would guess the taste isn't quite the same as
their smaller cousins served over ice on the half shell. Also, even if they
did taste similar, the sheer size would likely make them unappetizing to even
the most adventurous westerners.

The Chinese on the other hand are very familiar with the giant pacific variety
and have many traditional recipes for them.

~~~
projectorlochsa
Consuming oysters in a larger than usual amounts would result in high amounts
of unwanted metals from the polluted sea (mercury etc.) in the body. Oysters
are wonderful sea cleaners.

It is better for a larger population to consume them all, instead of a smaller
one consuming more per individual.

~~~
mrob
Mercury contamination isn't usually a problem with shellfish because they're
so near the bottom of the food chain. It's more a problem with big predatory
fish like tuna, because each level of the food chain concentrates the mercury.

However, shellfish are very good at collecting micro-plastics, which is an
unknown risk.

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liuyanghejerry
Fun fact, in Chinese recipe, most of the Oyster species can be cooked in
similar ways. So it's easy to let Chinese accept this one. One the other hand,
Oyster seems pretty healthy since it contains protein but has few fat and
sugar, which amuse young people nowadays.

However, since Chinese people already have several oyster-like species
locally, importing this one could probably hurt local fish-men's interests.

~~~
throwaway91111
Fat and sugar are both good for you in moderation; i never got this obsession
with chucking entire food groups out the window as if they're the reason you
have nutritional issues. The issue is always, always you. Or genetics.

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adrianN
You need fat in rather largeish amounts, but I've yet to hear a benefit of
eating sugar compared to carbohydrates that are digested more slowly.

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throwaway91111
Well, the main benefit to sugar is that it metabolizes quickly.

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emodendroket
How is that a benefit to someone living in the modern industrialized world,
though?

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wavefunction
I think it would be best considered as having limited utility, but folks who
need a quick sugar boost like diabetics and endurance athletes can take
advantage of sugar's characteristics.

~~~
snovv_crash
They can take advantage of glucose. Fructose still needs to processed by the
liver, similarly to alcohol.

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nxcho
I'm not sure the environmental impact of fishing an invasive species to
extinction is positive compared to the problems the species itself causes.
Especially if you want that venture to be profitable.

~~~
nebabyte
Could always stop at the point you no longer consider them to be a problem...?

~~~
perfmode
It's hard to hit the brakes on a moving train. Still potentially possible.

~~~
chrischen
And yet we still use trains and train stations.

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perfmode
Point taken. Perhaps I should have referenced Pandora's box.

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fred_is_fred
Having dealt with Chinese tourists in Western US national parks, I'd recommend
you just live with the oysters.

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pyrophane
> "...but for many Chinese, they would not want to eat the oysters without
> grilling them with mashed garlic and chili sauce.”

At first that sounded gross (I, I guess like the danish, prefer them raw with
a little lemon), but now I kind of want to try it. I think I'm going to try to
find a place in NYC that serves oysters this way.

~~~
6t6t6t6
I live in Japan and I stopped eating raw oysters. The oysters that are
consumed in Asia are quite different from the ones that grow in the Atlantic
or the Mediterranean. They are just bland when row. They don't have this
amazing sea taste that you would find in a "plateau de fruits de mer".

~~~
zhte415
There are a great variety of oysters in any sea. Warmer climate facilitate
faster growing, colder slower.

If you're eating bland ones are you in warm seas or eating from such? That
bland taste happens when anything grows faster. Go up north, same in Western
hemisphere.

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nonamechicken
If someone would do the same for India's stray dog problem, our life would be
so much better.

~~~
nonamechicken
Since I got downvoted: More than 20000 people die every year, millions get
attacked. They eat old people and children alive.

Just Google "stray dogs India".

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JoeAltmaier
Ok I did that, and learned:

" A study of dog bite cases conducted at a hospital in Kerala last year showed
75% of the patients had been bitten by pet dogs, and only a quarter had been
caused by strays. A 2013 study in 13 Tamil Nadu schools found that pet dogs
accounted for more than half of the dog bites suffered by students"

~~~
nonamechicken
Posting again in case my other post gets removed:

Please check out this link: (replace [website] with reddit).
[https://[website]/r/india/comments/4yoadk/kerala_senior_citi...](https://\[website\]/r/india/comments/4yoadk/kerala_senior_citizen_attacked_partly_eaten_by_50/d6puufd/)

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dajohnson89
If oysters are so abundant, why are they so expensive where I live, near the
Chesapeake Bay?

~~~
krallja
Different species.

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Safety1stClyde
The Chinese created famine in their country by eliminating sparrows as part of
their so-called "Great Leap Forward". It turned out that the sparrows were
eating pest insects. Now the Chinese offer to gobble these oysters. Can they
be trusted?

~~~
huac
The same happened in the US west, when ranchers killed all the wolves. In
particular, Teddy Roosevelt gave federal protection to the Roosevelt elk, and
hunters shot literally all the wolves in their habitat. No wolves meant no
check on moose/deer populations, which resulted in overgrazing of certain
important flora.

Everybody makes mistakes, and it's hard to tell when the lesser evil is the
lesser evil.

~~~
lucaspiller
The difference is that this problem was created by humans in the first place -
the oysters supposidely escaped from farms.

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thaumasiotes
Whether a problem is "created by humans" has no bearing on what would or
wouldn't be a good solution. If the same problem arises without the
intervention of humans, why would you treat it differently?

