
Dtube – A decentralized video platform using STEEM and IPFS - WhiteRiceWill
https://d.tube/
======
TekMol
Ok, so I'm looking at a website that tells me it's decentralized.

But from all I can tell this is just a good old website. Somebody has control
over the domain name. Points it to servers of his choice. And the servers
deliver content of his choice. What's decentralized about it?

~~~
heimindanger
A good old website? No.

We don't need the domain, you can take the
[https://github.com/dtube/production](https://github.com/dtube/production)
repository, ipfs add -r it on ipfs, and use DTube this way ->
[https://ipfs.io/ipfs/QmRWPnY8h7Eg4v74GtKT6UBy2kUAN139QwYPUrg...](https://ipfs.io/ipfs/QmRWPnY8h7Eg4v74GtKT6UBy2kUAN139QwYPUrgRUiDPMe/#!/ipfs/QmRWPnY8h7Eg4v74GtKT6UBy2kUAN139QwYPUrgRUiDPMe/)
(few bugs but it works apart from /home not being rendered on first load, you
need to click the logo)

What is decentralised:

\- The website (its fully static and can be hosted on ipfs)

\- The video storage (IPFS)

\- The account system / commenting / voting / subscribing (when you do that,
it directly creates the transaction on the blockchain)

What isnt decentralised:

\- The upload endpoints (upldr*.d.tube). You can legitimately avoid it if you
have a local IPFS node running and you add files yourself, however it's really
not convenient for users.

\- The search endpoint (asksteem.com). This is used for the search, tags
browsing, and related videos.

\- Server side rendering stuff for robots only (we enabled that recently)

P.S: I am the founder of DTube

~~~
themihai
ipfs.io it's part of a centralised DNS system(.io cctld) so when ipfs.io goes
down I assume your website will go down as well?

~~~
nannal
run a local ipfs node and replace the ipfs.io part with your IP, it will work
fine.

you can even mount ipfs as a readonly filesystem and cat that hash and get the
content.

~~~
rmc
If you install ipfs-companion browser extension, it will automatically turn
all ipfs.io/ipfs/ links to links to your locally running gateway.

~~~
hobofan
It actually replaces all links of the form /ipfs/<valid hash> , regardless of
the domain.

------
RandomInteger4
Steem looked like an interesting idea, but your content lives and dies with
the platform's whales, which are either insiders or a few people who believe
in the platform. If the whales don't interact with your content, you're not
likely to get much revenue. You voting power -- the amount you contribute to
content you interact with -- is directly tied to your steem power, so unless
you put money into the platform or managed to make money and kept it in the
platform, you're not going to contribute much.

Similarly, as a user, contributing upvotes, comments, etc. nets you a curation
reward, but this comes in trickles mostly unless you lease your steem power to
vote bots.

Also worth noting that the whole steem platform on the currency end of things
is completely centralized, so if that matters to you, this is important to
know.

~~~
synctext
> Also worth noting that the whole steem platform on the currency end of
> things is completely centralized

This is a central Youtube-like clone it seems. I can't scale in bandwidth and
has a central governance model.

Plus the coin is worthless: "The number of Steem available is set to double
annually, making its supply growth exponential - a possible drag on its future
value in the market" [https://www.investopedia.com/news/steemit-disruptive-
blockch...](https://www.investopedia.com/news/steemit-disruptive-
blockchainbased-media-community/)

"IPFS is cool, but there is no magic. Someone needs to seed the files, and
your browser cannot permanently store huge files (local storage is limited to
50MB on most browsers), so seeding through the app directly is not possible as
of today. " ([https://steemit.com/video/@heimindanger/introducing-
dtube-a-...](https://steemit.com/video/@heimindanger/introducing-dtube-a-
decentralized-video-platform-using-steem-and-ipfs) thnx ForkLDing).

Disclaimer: working for 13 years on an academically-pure Bittorrent-based
decentralised solution with my university lab.

~~~
rebuilder
In this instance, heavy inflation might actually be a plus for STEEM. This is
because it doesn't appear to be intended as a store of value, but as an
influence market.

As far as I can tell - and I'm sure there's a lot I've misunderstood - STEEM
is essentially a market for on-line influence. You gain STEEM for upvotes etc.
and the more STEEM tokens you have (STEEM Power), the more influence you have
in terms of who gets STEEM tokens.

Now, this sounds kind of pyramid-y to begin with, but without significant
inflation, such a system would seem doomed to form an oligopoly of a few users
who, by virtue of their "STEEM Power" would gain an ever-increasing share of
the tokens minted, pushing everyone else out and probably killing the whole
ecosystem. Of course, that may still happen even with inflation.

~~~
synctext
> Now, this sounds kind of pyramid-y

Unlimited money creation is never sustainable, history shows. An online
attention coin can't change economics. The future of television probably is
not build on a high inflation economy or destructive hyperinflation.
[https://scholar.google.com/scholar?q=high+inflation+~economy](https://scholar.google.com/scholar?q=high+inflation+~economy)

~~~
DennisP
It sounds like they're not trying to create general-purpose money. They've
made a token to track influence. They use inflation so old stored influence
loses half its value every year. You can't rest on your laurels, if you want
influence you have to have provided value recently.

~~~
truthforce
You are completely wrong, and the above people, about steem doubling every
year for the total amount, it only increases by something like less than 10%
per year.You or someone above you linked an article from 2016 that has very
outdated information.

I figured people here might actually do any amount of research instead of just
saying vague statements like "resting on your laurels". You have no idea what
you are commenting on because it is 2 year old information, but you are acting
like an expert. Pathetic.

------
sschueller
Also checkout peertube which is also federated but doesn't run on IPFS:
[https://github.com/Chocobozzz/PeerTube](https://github.com/Chocobozzz/PeerTube)

~~~
mrschwabe
Another one is bitchute.com

~~~
Pavitra
For the lazy: [https://bitchute.com/](https://bitchute.com/)

------
forkLding
Can there be a general explanation for what all the things including the cash
symbols mean and how all the videos sourced from (like using IPFS) if its not
too privately protected?

Much thanks!

EDIT: Nevermind, found it, link below:

[https://steemit.com/video/@heimindanger/introducing-
dtube-a-...](https://steemit.com/video/@heimindanger/introducing-dtube-a-
decentralized-video-platform-using-steem-and-ipfs)

~~~
dvddgld
Thanks for the link

------
rebuilder
So where does the money come from? This might be a question about STEEM more
than DTube, but I couldn't figure it out.

The DTube FAQ answer for "Where does the money come from" just says "The STEEM
blockchain keeps printing new STEEM everyday. These new printed STEEM are
given out as rewards." I'm hoping there's more to it than that, but I couldn't
find what the mechanism for bringing value into the STEEM ecosystem is.

As far as I can tell, users of DTube don't pay anything to watch videos, or to
comment, or to like videos, but their likes determine who gets paid on the
STEEM blockchain. So who buys STEEM tokens and why?

~~~
chippy
edit:
[https://steemit.com/faq.html#How_does_Steemit_work](https://steemit.com/faq.html#How_does_Steemit_work)
might be better.

"Every day, the Steem blockchain mints new STEEM tokens and adds them to a
community's "rewards pool". These tokens are then awarded to users for their
contributions, based on the votes that their content receives. Users who hold
more tokens in their account as "Steem Power" will get to decide where a
larger portion of the rewards pool is distributed."

------
jwildeboer
Interesting idea, but unfortunately (and as expected) full of antisemitic and
„new world order“ conspiracy stuff by people that claim YouTube is censoring
them.

~~~
Kequc
Why is this a bad thing, let people post what they want to. Also if someone
says YouTube is censoring them why wouldn't you believe it?

~~~
viraptor
It's likely to forever remain a niche for that kind of content only. What
reasonable person would say: "I know, I'll host my video on that website which
opens with a list of conspiracy videos and has antisemitism promoted in the
sidebar next to my content/face." (And even more - which popular company would
do that?)

~~~
hobofan
If there are enough benefits to the platform and semi-popular (likeable)
Youtubers switch to it, the problem should resolve itself after a few days.
Luckily antisemites etc. are a minority of the population and can be easily
outnumbered.

~~~
simonh
That's a really big IF, and semi-popular Youtubers have even more to lose from
association with the existing content on there than most of us.

~~~
hobofan
I think the question is if the risk of very loose association with that
content is higher than the risk of loosing out on revenue by arbitrary
decisions from Youtube.

Given what happend over the last year with the Adpocalypse, most of them
realized that being at the whim of Youtube is a real risk, and are now looking
to diverisfy their income streams (see growth of Patreon).

------
wazoox
How does it compare to Peertube?
[https://peertube.cpy.re/](https://peertube.cpy.re/)

Ah I see, DTube is based upon IPFS, while peertube relies upon good ol'
BitTorrent directly (though IPFS uses BitTorrent too?)

~~~
Quiark
ipfs is a new protocol which happens to do similar things to bittorrent. For
simplicity you can think of it as bittorrent with folders

------
jzebedee
If you're not familiar with STEEM or its currency, you can check the FAQ. [1]

[1]
[https://steemit.com/faq.html#What_is_the_difference_between_...](https://steemit.com/faq.html#What_is_the_difference_between_STEEM__STEEM_Power__and_Steem_Dollars)

------
no_news_is
It rubs me wrong that anonyhack is reposting videos from YouTube and claiming
credit for them, in cryptocurrency and STEEM:

[https://d.tube/#!/v/anonyhack/3w9xsp8j](https://d.tube/#!/v/anonyhack/3w9xsp8j)

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XEBWtbhq0Ts](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XEBWtbhq0Ts)

Can anything be done to prevent or deter this?

Other than maybe leaving comments on the page?

------
kaolti
It amazes me how skilled we are in pointing out what is wrong with something.

~~~
gkya
Well right things need no fixing, so pointing out wrong things is more useful.

------
l2dy
[https://about.d.tube/](https://about.d.tube/) \- A landing page presenting
and explaining DTube

[https://github.com/dtube](https://github.com/dtube)

------
dom96
So this is pretty amazing. But how in the world are they going to survive the
obvious issues such as copyright violations?

~~~
Miner49er
Isn't that the point behind this? It can't be censored. You don't do anything,
because you can't do anything.

------
tw1010
Cool project! But I have a hard time shaking the feeling that a lot of the
content and comments are bots or are paid for.

~~~
erikig
Most new social networks suffer from this issue early on, the only solution is
mass adoption and curation which the STEEM seems to be working toward.

------
kalendos
I like the idea and would love to try it! I have one small concern though.
Since the incentive (money) is given to popular videos, why people should post
unpopular opinions in Stemmit or videos in Dtube?

That is, if I upload a video of a cat doing some funny thing I'll get more
tokens (potentially) that with a super technical video.

~~~
simonh
Having a platform that incentivizes popular content should in theory attract
popular content to the platform. This should attract viewers to the platform,
thus increasing the viewership available to see your less popular content.

Meanwhile, incentivizing popular stuff doesn't take anything away from you or
your content. You're not being penalised, so why complain?

~~~
kalendos
> Having a platform that incentivizes popular content should in theory attract
> popular content to the platform. This should attract viewers to the
> platform, thus increasing the viewership available to see your less popular
> content.

Thanks for pointing that! I didn't though of it this way. To be honest, my
fear is that this platform could turn possibly in some sort of niche. Right
now, popular content is about X, so if I want to make quick profits, I'll
create a video about X. More people will join and do the same.

I'm sure there are ways to fix that like giving people incentives for posting
in unpopular topics. Potentially, each topic could be its own market!

> You're not being penalised, so why complain?

Not complaining at all for now. Just sharing my current thoughts! If I join a
social media, I'd love to have diversity of content and opinion. I think in
STEEM that could be hard, as it is in Reddit unless you subscribe to unpopular
ones. Not a 100% bad thing though!

------
rijoja
I've had a sense that something like this would be the future. However for the
less up to par with cutting edge web technologies, how about a single page
that in a condense manner describes the technology behind this? Even for a
person somewhat up to date with distributed technologies it takes at least an
hour to understand exactly what's going on.

Again not trying to be harsh, but I feel that the UI, in this stages looks a
little bit too much like youtube, giving it a cheap feel, that makes it a bit
hard to sell to "normal" people.

And oh, I feel that having three decimals on the earnings looks a bit weird to
me. Isn't two decimals enough? Say $116.688 is hard for my brain to parse
either it's 116 dollars and 68.8 cents or maybe it's around 1 million
dollars???

------
xstartup
I wonder if IPFS can be connected to Cloudflare such that CF ends up acting
like a CDN for IPFS network. The content is encrypted (so that the CF does not
know what's being served) and users can offer their own Cloudflare API keys to
take part in the network.

Edit: Please tell me why the downvotes.

~~~
ryukafalz
You're likely being downvoted because IPFS is already effectively a
decentralized CDN. By adding CloudFlare in the mix, you've just re-centralized
it - in other words, you've defeated the entire purpose of the platform.

------
g-b-r
[https://decentralize.today/the-ugly-truth-behind-
steemit-1a5...](https://decentralize.today/the-ugly-truth-behind-
steemit-1a525f5e156)

It's rather old (2016-08) but at a quick glance it appears to be correct and
still relevant.

------
avuton
How is abusive content handled on this platform?

~~~
Pavitra
Users can downvote.

------
JaimeThompson
What steps are being done to combat the doxing of individualists on DTube?
DTube doesn't have much of a mainstream future if it becomes a haven for
people harassing others / posting their personal information.

~~~
heimindanger
I believe the same applies to steemit.com. Well once something gets written on
the blockchain, it's hard to remove it. The DTube domain (that we control)
would always be able to block certain videos in extreme cases, but the videos
would still be on IPFS.

And there isn't much we can do about that, it's the same case as when someone
gets seeded on torrent. You can find the nodes seeding a particular content by
doing ipfs dht findprovs <hash> , then you get their ips and you go after them
legally.

------
RileyJames
Is it streaming from IPFS directly? Or is d.tube (website) hosting a mirror?

~~~
diggan
Looking in the "Network" tab in your favorite browser's developer tool, you
can see that the videos are requested from the public IPFS gateways. Example:
[https://ipfs.io/ipfs/QmSDWa2kc2vSpbVBvxswZqcUEFTVPBJQyZyjgjT...](https://ipfs.io/ipfs/QmSDWa2kc2vSpbVBvxswZqcUEFTVPBJQyZyjgjTUQVn1Ta)

Disclaimer: I work for Protocol Labs on IPFS

------
leke
Wow, this is amazing. I think this is a YouTube killer for sure. I'm just
waiting for my account to be accepted.

Just one request. I love the YouTube JKL control keys. Any chance you could
implement this on D-Tube?

------
ekzy
I don't think scrolling on the video to change the volume is a good idea. I
jumped because the volume of the video suddenly changed as I was trying to get
around.

------
rrcaptain
Would this not run into the copyright issues most other distributed hosting
networks run into? Especially since it allows directly monetizing the content.

~~~
corobo
Copyright issues are the easy end of the problem stick too. I'm going to
straight up ask - what happens when a child porn ring starts using this?

~~~
52-6F-62
It appears to already be a home to some fringe stuff.

"Big cities are like financial slave camps - Take a break at the Zenvow
Meditation Resort - All crypto Meditation Resort in Portugal" (of course this
is crazy, but harmless—at least initially)

I would also like to know what solution has been proposed for that problem.

------
harlanji
Good stuff. I posted some technical videos about DTube/IPFS vs. HLS+CDN in the
past few days (2x 20min), and design lectures in the past 90 or so days
(2-3x50min)... I forget etiquitte about posting links but my profile has some
pointers and I use this handle widely on the web. Highly recommend if DTube is
of interest (unscripted+uncut, I rewatch them a few times for myself but
share).

------
KyleBerezin
I've been wondering for a long time, how do you remove illegal content. I
don't care so much about copyright and minor offenses like that, but more
serious offenses like child pornography. If there is no way to remove it,
people and governments will start to take action against the whole website,
decentralized or not.

------
vijaybritto
Just went through the html to figure out the js library that they used but
instead found a lot of elements having the same id's in the page. Looks like
the frontend was hastily written to make it just work.

------
gigatexal
The cash amount by each video mean what?

~~~
thecatspaw
thats what the users earned by getting liked by other users

~~~
dayaz36
cumulatively or is that how much they're earning per month?

~~~
mtgx
It's how much they've earned for that particular video so far. I've been
saying it for a while here but nobody seemed to listen. d.tube is way better
for smaller creators than YouTube is right now, and with a tiny fraction of
YouTube's audience.

Plus, YouTube is only going to get worse for small creators, as Google tries
to cater more and more to the big companies and punish the creators for
"advertiser-offensive content". Meanwhile, d.tube should get better and better
as both it and STEEM (the tipping mechanism) rise in popularity.

The nice part is the creators don't even have to give-up YouTube to try out
d.tube. They can just upload the video to both and see for themselves what's
the difference.

~~~
stctgion
With a new monetised platform, with money being incredibly obvious on the UI,
the incentive is pretty high to just steal popular content from YouTube and
repost it. How do they ensure original content or ownership?

~~~
yAnonymous
If Facebook doesn't care about enforcing copyright, why should such a small
website?

That really seems like an argument that is made only to hurt startups.

~~~
thecatspaw
> That really seems like an argument that is made only to hurt startups.

you're looking at this the wrong way. Yes, startups should enforce copyright.
But so should facebook.

They just get away with it because they are big

~~~
acct1771
Yes, that's the point the commenter is making.

------
throw7
please make making an account easier. not going to give a phone number. email
is easier to bypass.

------
acobster
This is really exciting and has a lot of potential.

The pause button is broken on Android Firefox, though. :)

------
JankySolutions
Wow, nice domain. I wonder how much that cost

~~~
heimindanger
Actually we started out with dtube.video domain and the .TUBE registry owner
noticed and liked our project so much that he offered the domain for a very
fair price. :))

True story

~~~
JankySolutions
wow, very cool.

------
charles_ghost
This is real good work.

