
Netbooks are still a great deal - idiginous
http://www.scripting.com/stories/2010/04/27/netbooksAreStillAGreatDeal.html
======
jamesbressi
The points are kind of silly. I'm not defending the iPad, only challenging the
neglect on the writer's part to fully "adopt" what he has purchased or is
reviewing and use it correctly. It's just a bit misleading to someone who may
not own an iPad or iPhone or iPod Touch or something with a similar
experience. His points are like saying, "I bought a new Canon Rebel, but my
Nikon lenses don't work." It reads like he is a shill (especially with a snide
comment or so and references to XP, Microsoft, etc). I will pick out 5 points
below:

1\. "The iPad doesn't remember my Facebook password, so when I want to check
Facebook I must reach for the netbook. A small thing you say -- but operating
systems are collections of hundreds of small things, and new operating systems
like the one in the iPad don't have them and old ones like XP do."

A: Use the Facebook app...

2\. "I had pictures in my camera the other day. No way to get them up to
Flickr through the iPad. If I had had the netbook with me, no problem. (I used
my Droid instead.)"

A: Use a wifi sd card? Or, buy the adapter if you must use "USB"

3\. "The netbook has a real keyboard. I'm writing this blog post on it. It's
taken a couple of minutes so far. I'd still be on paragraph 2 if I had used
the iPad. And I'd be entering it on one of my WordPress blogs because my
customized content tools don't and will never run on Apple's new platform.
(Unless they change their mind.)"

A: While I cannot stand the iPad's virtual keyboard, if you are going to do
this task get the keyboard attachment. It's not what it was really meant for,
but if you want to use it more like a netbook or laptop or desktop, get the
keyboard. And, with the real estate of the iPad and the external keyboard, it
is not adding that much more bulk to your travel bag if necessary.

4\. "I hate the font they chose for Safari. How do I change it? There does not
appear to be a way to do that. That was a new feature in Windows in 1995. Or
was it 1994?"

A: This is where it starts to sound ridiculous. I understand his point, but
what was the point in the third sentence? While totally ignoring how to use
this properly, he then moves on to a point and opinion with a jab like this
that make him seem somewhat of a shill.

5\. "Apple has a long way to go before the iPad is a useful tool. Lots of
little things to fix and tweak, and a philosophy that's going to keep the
really innovative stuff flowing elsewhere (where -- not determined yet)."

A: Maybe he has a long way to go before writing a proper and useful review?

~~~
idiginous
You are out of your fricking mind -- buy the wifi SD card and the keyboard or
-- buy a netbook and get a CPU, hard drive, screen, battery, etc thrown in for
free.

~~~
jamesbressi
LOL, @indiginous welcome to HN. You will find that comments such as this just
won't fly with the community. Get a better argument or attitude. (By the way,
I didn't down-vote your comment, someone else did, as the original commenter
cannot down-vote replies made to his/her comment)

I will entertain your reply for just a short moment.

1\. Nothing is "thrown in for free" There are always cost associations. Some
food for thought, that also goes for software. - A comment such as that will
make your credibility for intelligent conversation go down the drain.

2\. You are missing the real point of my comment above.

~~~
idiginous
That's funny -- I've been reading HN for a long time and am aware that most
comments are left by lonely idiots with super low IQs. I've tried to adjust
for that, but even so your position is even more inane than most. Keep trying.
:-)

~~~
henrikhansen
May I ask what you gain from calling him inane without any arguments to back
up the point?

------
futuremint
My wife has an iPad. Its completely awesome for our toddler to play games on,
and for the wife to check her e-mail, surf the web a little, and see her
calendar. Adding events to the calendar on the iPad is annoying, best to do it
in iCal on the real computer (though iCal's UI is really weak in my opinion).

I have a 10" ASUS eeePC and its completely awesome for me to do a lot of
typing on (also has great battery life), have an Ubuntu environment setup
running identical versions of the services that the server runs, and for
overall hacking.

They're two completely different things and I think it is disingenuous to
directly compare an iPad to other form factors, much as you wouldn't compare
your iPhone to your desktop in terms of functionality. Just because two
devices have a similar screen size does not mean they are equal!

~~~
blagooey
[http://www.scripting.com/stories/2010/04/27/whatItMeansToBeA...](http://www.scripting.com/stories/2010/04/27/whatItMeansToBeABlogger.html)

------
imajes
As with all winer whining, you have to take it with a large pinch of salt. On
this one, he's made 3 factual errors before he even gets to his point:

> I have both an iPad and a netbook, and the netbook is strictly more useful
> than the iPad. > If I go out with the iPad invariably I hit a wall. No SD
> card slot. No USB. The keyboard is hunt-and-peck.

not so much. SD and USB connectivity is provided by peripherals sold by apple.
Are they fully open and free to use? no. but that's of course the price you
pay to use an ipad. As mentioned below, plenty of people (including me) are
able to use the keyboard just fine.

> The iPad doesn't remember my Facebook password, so when I want to check
> Facebook I must reach for the netbook. > A small thing you say -- but
> operating systems are collections of hundreds of small things, and new
> operating systems > like the one in the iPad don't have them and old ones
> like XP do

Or just get 1Password, shipping with the iPad from day one, which, if perhaps
haphazardly, solves his problems and syncs everywhere.

> I had pictures in my camera the other day. No way to get them up to Flickr
> through the iPad. > If I had had the netbook with me, no problem. (I used my
> Droid instead.)

The usb/sd peripheral is designed specifically for this.

> The netbook has a real keyboard. I'm writing this blog post on it. It's
> taken a couple of minutes so far. I'd still be on paragraph 2 > if I had
> used the iPad. And I'd be entering it on one of my WordPress blogs because
> my customized content tools don't and > will never run on Apple's new
> platform. (Unless they change their mind.)

[http://store.apple.com/us/product/MC533LL/A?fnode=MTc0MjU4Nj...](http://store.apple.com/us/product/MC533LL/A?fnode=MTc0MjU4NjE&mco=MTc0Njk4NzY)
(or, the bluetooth one, which also works). Though, i prefer to just suggest to
him that he learns how to use the new keyboard, and stops trying to make it
behave like the one he has on his netbook.

> There's an awful glitch in the way the clipboard works on the iPad. Try to
> put the cursor on a mis-spelling. > It always selects the whole word. I've
> gotten in the habit of retyping the word when there's a one character
> spelling error. > These little things are of course little, but they mount
> up.

Yes. then you press again to stop selecting and make it go to the misspelling.

I think he's trying to fit a round peg in a square hole again, and that has
limited appeal outside his echo chamber. It's a shame, though, as he has an
abnormally large audience who reads what he turfs out. He reminds me of the
computer professor who refuses to accept obsolescence but insists that all his
students learn fortran and nothing else.

~~~
Alex63
Without implying any particular support for Mr. Winer's views, I don't think
it's fair to say he made "3 factual errors". The point of his post was to
compare the iPad (as delivered) and a netbook (as delivered). To that end, he
points out that:

1) the iPad does not include SD card slot or USB - the fact that you can add
peripherals for this purpose does not invalidate his point

2) the iPad doesn't remember his Facebook password - again, you appear to be
suggesting that an add-on product addresses this concern, but that doesn't
negate the fact that the iPad as delivered is not equivalent to a basic
netbook

3) the netbook has a "real" keyboard, versus the "soft" keyboard of the iPad -
again, the fact that you can add an external peripheral doesn't mean his post
was factually incorrect.

~~~
imajes
Sure. I was commenting more to the between-the-lines idea that he'd make a
comparison between a tablet touch screen and a miniature laptop. It's a bit of
an apples-and-oranges comparison.

He also complains about sd/usb/keyboard/password as if they are unsolvable
failings of apple. I think he seems to miss the point of Apple's approach to
life- the 80/20 rule. Not to mention that _everything_ he complained about is
solved already.

In other words: Winer has a widely read website in which he has used it as a
pulpit to rant about the iPad without doing any research. In other places, he
calls himself a journalist- and I feel offended that he'd do that and show
such shoddy examples of the trade. :(

------
stcredzero
"The keyboard is hunt-and-peck."

Not for me. Only if I'm lying down or carrying it in one hand. In fact, my
one-handed typing speed at this point is probably faster on the iPad than it
would be on a netbook, simply because I have gotten used to using completion
and I can glide over the virtual keyboard with minimal motions, not worrying
about exerting enough force to depress real keys.

If I am sitting down, I can type at full speed on the iPad keyboard in
landscape orientation.

~~~
jws
Strange but true. I also find that I can "dont-touch" type at near full speed
in landscape mode propped up on the folded case. I don't think I'd like to do
it for extended periods, but for minutes at a time it is good.

------
oliveoil
(on typography) I find the little hash signs (#) at the paragprahs' ends to be
disturbing when reading: I always think for a split second I missed a starting
quotation mark somewhere.

------
erikstarck
Confirms my belief that the iPad is for consumption and a laptop/netbook for
production.

EDIT: of course the question then is if an ordinary user can do with an iPad
most of the time or not.

When you look at a user generated site there's a 90/9/1-rule, that is, 90% of
visitors are viewers only, 9% comment or rate or make small contributions and
1% create stuff.

Perhaps a similar division can be seen in how we use the internet during a
day. 90% of the time we only consume - then an iPad is fine. It's the the
other 10% we need a laptop with a keyboard.

~~~
stcredzero
Your comment is biased towards production in the narrow context of
computers/web browsing. That sort of activity, for most people, requires a
computer keyboard, which the iPad lacks, so it's a foregone conclusion.

There are other sorts of activities that do not have a computer keyboard as
the most efficient input method.

<http://hexler.net/software/touchosc>

~~~
hernan7
I'm probably nit-picking here, but TouchOSC doesn't generate sound by itself.
It is just a controller application that you use to send OSC messages to
either a synthesizer or a "real" computer that actually generates the sound.

A question for the iPad musicians: Surely there are pro-audio iPad
applications that generate sound, but does the sound have to go through the
consumer-grade audio output or can you send it to the DAW via the USB add-on?

~~~
stcredzero
_I'm probably nit-picking here, but TouchOSC doesn't generate sound by
itself._

You're probably missing the point. _Interface_ is the whole point of the iPad.
Interface + processing ability is a lot of what the ongoing computer
revolution has been and will be about.

------
csomar
My conclusion is that the iPad is cool (as well as any other tablet device),
but the netbook is more productive: Get Both. Each device has its' own uses.
Both can be useful and fun.

I have a netbook, but I don't feel comfortable taking it everywhere, the
keywords is also annoying when you are in bed and you just want to read or
watch. So if you have money, buy a netbook, if you still have, buy an iPad. If
you don't have money, work and make money or just read and watch people using
those gadgets. (Back to work, so I can save money for the next Sony Rocket ;)

~~~
roc
"Productive" -- depends on what you're producing.

I find myself using the iPad to do research, mockup, sketch and design stuff.
(The sort of thing I've always have a hard time doing at a desk and that has
stubbornly remained 'on paper'.) Then I sit down at a workstation to "do the
work".

Overall, the tablet is making me more productive, even though what's getting
produced on it is never finished work.

It obviates a netbook for me, because it more cleanly splits my computing into
buckets where the netbook pales to the laptop because it's underpowered, or
pales to the tablet because it's burdened by the desktop OS and keyboard/mouse
assumptions.

Certainly, YMMV based on what "work" you do. The rule-of-thumb I've been using
is to ask people how much they still use paper in the course of being
productive. (that is, when you still use it because it's a good solution; as
opposed to merely being stubborn, natch)

If you still use paper in the course of your work, it may help. But if you
generate almost exclusively text, it probably won't.

~~~
csomar
I can't agree more. I'm not against the tablet idea (may be I don't like the
iPad, but tablets seems cool to me).

You can make use of both. For example, when I'm contributing to HN, I feel a
netbook is better for me. When I'm just reading, then a tablet will probably
serve me better.

For writing it depends, if you are typing, a netbook with keyboard is a better
option, if you are drawing things and writing (with a pen), a tablet will
serve better.

------
antidaily
Two words: Facebook app

~~~
omaranto
When people recommend an app that is just a substitute for a website, it
confirms my impression that Safari is not that great on the iPad. I used to
think this was the case on the iPhone solely because of screen size, but if
apps are still better on the iPad I guess not.

~~~
jonknee
Using the apps nets you stuff like notifications, file uploading and chat.

~~~
bobbyi
Why should file uploading require a dedicated application? That has been a
standard browser feature since at least Netscape 3.

~~~
jonknee
Ask Apple, but probably because the iPhone doesn't have a user exposed file
system.

------
Kilimanjaro
Gawd, I have a spoon and a shovel and really need to eat my soup but don't
know which one to use.

Help!

------
ra88it
From the article:

"I hear Asus is coming out with an Android netbook-style tablet in June. Sign
me up. I bet it's a nice computer. Android of course is just as immature as
the iPad."

If Android is just as immature as the iPad, then why does he "bet it's a nice
computer"?

------
ZeroGravitas
Apparently the USB Camera kit dongle supports USB headsets, USB speakers and
USB keyboards to some degree too.

You kind of wonder why they didn't just add a USB connector and SD card slot.

~~~
bitwize
It would disrupt the flawless smooth lines of the device.

Design is important.

