
Popcorn Time repository unavailable due to DMCA takedown - sandes
https://github.com/popcorn-official/popcorn-desktop/issues
======
kalium-xyz
This is clear DMCA abuse, the popcorn time repository itself does not contain
copyrighted content. This is why using a centralized closed source service
managed by a tech conglomerate as the “hub” of our open source movement might
not always be for the best

~~~
eropple
_> This is clear DMCA abuse_

I’m generally skeptical of these claims as the legal system typically doesn’t
look super fondly on technically-correct “I’m not touching you” arguments. So
has this been litigated sufficiently to state this with such conviction? I’m
not sufficiently familiar to know.

~~~
michaelmrose
There is no such thing as a DMCA notice for contributory copyright
infringement. A DMCA take down notice describes a particular resource that the
claimant claims to be their intellectual property.

It is a straightforward I own foo. Using it to take down a tool that helps
people access foo is perjury. It's just that we will actually jail people for
committing the kind of crimes poor people commit but we refuse to prosecute
the crimes rich people commit.

It's entirely possible that in the scope of another legal action the parties
behind popcorn time might lose out THAT unlike this is the actually complex
question.

This is pretty straightforward. You can only take down popcorn time if you can
claim to own it thus its just the kind of crime we allow rich people to
perpetrate upon poor people.

~~~
koheripbal
SCOTUS has ruled that creating a program who's purpose is to circumvent
copyright, is a violation.

> Held: One who distributes a device with the object of promoting its use to
> infringe copyright, as shown by clear expression or other affirmative steps
> taken to foster infringement, going beyond mere distribution with knowledge
> of third-party action, is liable for the resulting acts of infringement by
> third parties using the device, regardless of the device’s lawful uses.

source:
[https://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/04-480.ZS.html](https://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/html/04-480.ZS.html)

~~~
CWuestefeld
_SCOTUS has ruled that creating a program who 's purpose is to circumvent
copyright, is a violation._

This doesn't contradict the claim you're responding to. It may well be that
Popcorn Time is illegal by way of contributing to copyright abuse, as you
claim.

But that doesn't make a DMCA claim the correct tool for taking it down. As was
said earlier, a DMCA claim specifically asserts ownership of the IP in
question, and that is clearly not applicable here.

So sure, there's probably some tool that could be used to get it removed, but
DMCA is not it. I'd guess they'd need some kind of more general cease and
desist.

~~~
koheripbal
...which is there was no DMCA in this situation. The title is wrong. They
didn't file a DMCA claim.

~~~
Gaelan
…what? The repository [0] shows up as "unavailable due to DMCA takedown," and
links to a notice [1] that explicitly references the DMCA.

[0]: [https://github.com/popcorn-official/popcorn-
desktop](https://github.com/popcorn-official/popcorn-desktop)

[1]:
[https://github.com/github/dmca/blob/master/2020/05/2020-05-0...](https://github.com/github/dmca/blob/master/2020/05/2020-05-01-MPA.md)

~~~
koheripbal
That's because Github doesn't have a different message for non-DMCA threats of
lawsuits. If you look at one of the other top-level comments, you'll see that
they didn't actually get a DMCA takedown - but a threatening lawyers letter.

------
saagarjha
The notice:
[https://github.com/github/dmca/blob/master/2020/05/2020-05-0...](https://github.com/github/dmca/blob/master/2020/05/2020-05-01-MPA.md)

The counternotice:
[https://github.com/github/dmca/blob/master/2020/05/2020-05-0...](https://github.com/github/dmca/blob/master/2020/05/2020-05-04-MPA-
counternotice.md)

~~~
FiloSottile
Note how that's not a DMCA notice in the usual sense ("we own the IP of
content distributed on your platform"), but a "strongly worded letter" that
mentions the DMCA but just says "we'd like your assistance in stopping this
illegal activity". At least it's not run-of-the-mill DMCA abuse.

It's interesting that GitHub decided to process it like a DMCA notice, unclear
to me if they had to, and even less clear if the counter-notice is meaningful.

~~~
jhauris
I'm not a lawyer, but I believe this is an actual DMCA notice. It has all the
required components[0] of one. Is there something I'm missing? What makes this
not a DMCA notice?

0:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Online_Copyright_Infringement_...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Online_Copyright_Infringement_Liability_Limitation_Act#Notice_from_copyright_owner)

~~~
wtallis
It's not at all clear that they have identified anything on GitHub that is a
copyright infringement. They've correctly claimed that the software is being
used _elsewhere_ to accomplish infringement, but the URLs they identified
aren't reproductions or derivative works of any movies.

------
hn_throwaway_99
So the question really boils down to "Does the DMCA let you submit takedown
notices for tools which _aid_ infringement, even if the code itself is
original and not an unauthorized copy of something else." IANAL, can anyone
comment on whether the DMCA lets you do this?

It's clear from the takedown notice submitted by the MPA that (a) they are
alleging that PopCornTime aids copyright infringement, not that the code
itself is a copy, however the counternotice from the devs just says that (b)
the code itself is original, but doesn't address that it is used and
configured to scrape torrent files.

In short, though, I wouldn't hold my breath for PopCornTime. Napster and
Limewire got taken down back in the day too for the same rationale.

~~~
loeg
Napster and Limewire were operating commercial entities. Popcorn is just a
bunch of random developers making an open source project. How do you take down
something which can trivially be replicated (Git is theoretically a
distributed VCS)?

~~~
notechback
You can still sue the developers to pieces even if the project lives on.

~~~
echelon
For writing software?

Which torrent or emulator developers have been sued? I can't think of this
having ever happened.

~~~
durnygbur
We are talking about American copyright predators. Few entities on our planet
are more evil and malicious.

------
bkovacev
As a non US citizen I own:

\- HBO Go

\- Youtube Premium

\- Netflix

\- Amazon Prime

However, content absolutely blows. I regularly go to cinemas, but there are
not any tv shows in there. As of today I am going to cancel all of them and I
know it's not much of a "blow" to their cash flow, but seriously, this is
ridiculous. They kill the only platform that lets me watch content that's not
available for me otherwise and that I would have gladly pay for if it was
available. Popcorn time had an amazing support for streaming directly to TV,
which was my main use case. I have a desktop computer in a separate room and I
definitely do not plan on drilling my walls to push an HDMI cable through
them. I guess it's time for Plex.

~~~
thefunnyman
Plex with something like Sonarr set up is a bit of a hassle to configure but
generally works pretty well for this in my experience.

I agree though, it used to be great when you could pay $10 a month for Netflix
and it actually had most content you wanted. Now you pay more than that to
three or four services and still don’t get everything. I wish the film
industry would come up with something like what Spotify did for music and what
Steam did for video games. Make your content easily available legally for a
reasonable fee and piracy rates will naturally go down.

------
sam1r
For those of you curious - you can still download Popcorn time directly on
[https://github.com/popcorn-official/popcorn-
desktop](https://github.com/popcorn-official/popcorn-desktop)
[https://get.popcorntime.app/](https://get.popcorntime.app/)

~~~
KennethSRoberts
And an archived copy of the repo:
[https://web.archive.org/web/20200411155357/https://github.co...](https://web.archive.org/web/20200411155357/https://github.com/popcorn-
official/popcorn-desktop)

~~~
saagarjha
Is this an actual, full archive?

~~~
inyorgroove
Does not look like it to me. Zip download failed, not sure you can git clone
from that url.

~~~
akerro
[https://i.imgur.com/xS7PLmP.png](https://i.imgur.com/xS7PLmP.png) works for
me

made you a copy
[https://gateway.ipfs.io/ipfs/QmeTXtu2U4z7m1yWwU2qco2sUQoxPh5...](https://gateway.ipfs.io/ipfs/QmeTXtu2U4z7m1yWwU2qco2sUQoxPh5tCKaL8WayaVHpPP)

------
xiphias2
I haven't used PopCornTime for a long time, as I have Netflix+HBO
subscriptions, but it's time to reinstall it as a way to disobay the takedown.

~~~
wp381640
You don't want Popcorn Time - you want Stremio

~~~
__float
Care to elaborate?

~~~
wp381640
supports commercial providers (Netflix, iTunes, Hulu) to find content, magnet
links for webtorrent viewing, plugin architecture, no affiliate links or
adware, and their github is currently live

------
gm
This is why I regularly back up my github repos (via git clone --bare, then
compress and archive). Mind you, I do nothing that even comes close to piracy,
and the vast majority most of my repos are private, but it's a nightmare
scenario to have your third party dictate when you have access to your source
code and pop up surprises like this, whether by having some asshole try to
extort you, or by the git repo having a data disaster with your repo.

~~~
ayoisaiah
Why not create a mirror to Gitlab for example?

~~~
Aachen
For someone who casually wants to do this, Gitea is a lot lighter than gitlab
to self host (and in my experience a breeze to install, but gitlab is probably
the same).

~~~
Jnr
For some repositories that probably will be terminated on Github at some
point, I have set up cloning on private Gitea instance. Disabled tree
overwrite on some branches and have them backed up in case something else
happens. So far I have never needed to use it, but it makes me feel better.

And no, Gitlab is not as easy to maintain. You can probably set it up in
Docker easily, but overall it has many moving parts and it requires more
resource, while Gitea is just a single Golang binary and is a joy to use.

------
not2b
Here is my guess: the people who filed the notice know it is bogus, and also
know that to contest it, the PopcornTime authors would have to provide their
real names and contact info, and the lawyers want that info so they can sue
them for contributory copyright infringement.

------
KenoFischer
So the DMCA requires identification of "material that is claimed to be
infringing or to be the subject of infringing activity". It seems pretty clear
that the requested content is not by itself infringing. Is anybody aware of
case law on how the "subject of infringing activity" is to be read?

~~~
maxlybbert
I’m sure the argument is that Napster- and Grokster-style contributory
infringement is infringement. I have a hard time imagining source code
enticing people to infringe copyright, but if the program encourages
infringement, I suppose the repository is a logical target.

I won’t predict whether the contributory infringement argument will win. I’m
sure the law was written with direct infringement in mind, but I don’t think
that rules out creative interpretations by itself.

I believe the clearest approach would be for the MPA to not bother with a DMCA
notice, and just sue the project directly. But if you can get what you want on
the cheap, why not try? And I’m not sure a lawsuit against the project would
do much good: even assuming the MPA were to get an injunction, they’d need to
play whack-a-mole to track down anybody using the PopCornTime code.

~~~
KenoFischer
Right, I concur with the reasoning that contributory infringement could be
argued against the developers, but I think the interesting questions is
whether that reasoning can be extended to the "material" under the takedown
section - particularly as written. If so that seems like the kinds of thing
that could get ugly very quickly. E.g. are instructions on how to google for
infringing material suddenly infringing?

~~~
maxlybbert
I understood that DMCA notice/counternotice procedure was meant to provide a
streamlined process for simple cases, which could be migrated to an actual
court if necessary. I don’t like seeing it stretched to cover cases that
aren’t so simple.

------
gorgoiler
Popcorn Time, at least the last time I was brave enough to use it, was
breathtaking. It was like having a cheat mode for TV.

It looked great. It had absolutely all the content one could possibly want.
I’d love to know more about the creators.

In the end kicking that hornets nest wasn’t worth the risk of having the book
thrown at us.

~~~
dna_polymerase
I once read a good long-form article about him, but I can't find it now. Check
this out though, basically, a webdev from Argentina, fed up with distribution
of movies to his country: [https://www.dn.no/magasinet/popcorn-
time/spotify/federico-ab...](https://www.dn.no/magasinet/popcorn-
time/spotify/federico-abad/pirate-bay/inside-popcorn-time-the-worlds-fastest-
growing-piracy-site/1-1-5453911)

------
SpaceRaccoon
This has happened before:
[https://lumendatabase.org/blog_entries/722](https://lumendatabase.org/blog_entries/722)

Looks like they're trying again since Github was acquired by a big corp
(Microsoft).

------
esarbe
The MPA is not even claiming copyright on any of the files in the repository;
it just complaining about the "extensive copyright infringement of motion
pictures and television programs that is occurring by virtue of the operation
and further development of the Popcorn Time repositories".

Then it links some files as kind of "proof".

I'm not even sure what this is supposed to be.

------
Uhrheber
Streisand effect.

I may have heard of Popcorn Time before, but I never used it. Now I do.

------
Endlessly
What is PopCornTime?

It is the “Netflix” of pirated movies, learn more here:

[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Popcorn_Time](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Popcorn_Time)

~~~
Melting_Harps
> What is PopCornTime?

b7861e52eda1961101b605593fd2b4e8c2210e41

> I haven't used PopCornTime for a long time, as I have Netflix+HBO
> subscriptions, but it's time to reinstall it as a way to disobay the
> takedown.

> only tested it years ago, can't be arsed with the gobshite one gets mainly
> from US.. media junk, like the food. but min this is back up, I will give it
> a swirl.

When will they learn a p2p system/network can never truly be taken down so
long as Human's have personal agency. Furthermore, Github was always a central
point of failure, made even more vulnerable due to its purchase from M$. This
only further proves why that is.

> Out of touch politicians coming up with tech policy in the 90s. Tada!

This is mere optics and one motivated by self-praise as it doesn't really
work. But I'm glad some carry on the spirit of Gene Kan.

~~~
a1369209993
> > What is PopCornTime?

> b7861e52eda1961101b605593fd2b4e8c2210e41

magnet:?xt=urn:btih:b7861e52eda1961101b605593fd2b4e8c2210e41&dn=PopCornTime
doesn't seem to exist, so I'm not sure what you mean by that. But yes; as the
saying goes, censorship is damage; the internet routes around it.

~~~
Melting_Harps
That's the hash to the .apk file, I just checked it again and it actually has
more seeders on it then when I posted. Are you on any viable trackers?

Even googling it takes you to the many search engines where its stats can be
found:

seeds: 33 leechers: 5.

~~~
a1369209993
Huh, doesn't seem to be in DHT for me, not really sure what going wrong there.
Are you sure it's not marked private (aka is a corrupt or invalid infoblob)?
And no, none of top three results on duckduckgo has a working tracker for it.

~~~
Melting_Harps
Shrug, running fine on my end. Try adding these:

[https://extratorrent.cm/torrent_trackers/4023101/popcorn-
tim...](https://extratorrent.cm/torrent_trackers/4023101/popcorn-
time-v3-6-2-apk-watch-movies-tv-apkmaza.html)

Failing that, and you still want the file(s), here it is for all supported
distros [1], download them and re-up and seed and post the torrent/hash here.

[https://getpopcorntime.is/android.html](https://getpopcorntime.is/android.html)

------
Jaxkr
Very interesting. The repository does not contain any copyrighted content, but
it unabashedly promotes copyright violation.

~~~
saagarjha
The precedent the notice cites:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MGM_Studios,_Inc._v._Grokster,...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MGM_Studios,_Inc._v._Grokster,_Ltd.),
specifically the opinion provided:

> We hold that one who distributes a device with the object of promoting its
> use to infringe copyright, as shown by clear expression or other affirmative
> steps taken to foster infringement, is liable for the resulting acts of
> infringement by third parties.

~~~
Thorentis
What an obscene abuse of power that ruling is. Are gun shops liable for the
mass shootings that take place by people that bought guns there? Didn't think
so. Going after the tool-makers is right out of the authoritarian playbook.

~~~
ocdtrekkie
I think there's a valid distinction between a product that can be misused but
has a legitimate use, and a product solely built to enable illegal activity.
If the business knows their product isn't useful for anything but crime, the
only reason they're in business is the crime.

VLC Media Player is a multi-use video player sometimes used to play pirated
videos. BitTorrent is a peer-to-peer file transfer protocol designed to
transfer and distribute large files efficiently. Popcorn Time is explicitly
built to find and play illegally shared content.

~~~
karagenit
Practically I agree with you, but I'm not sure there actually is a distinction
in a legal sense. _Technically_ Popcorn Time can be used to watch legal/non-
pirated content, so they have some form of plausible deniability.

I could go down the street to the smoke shop and buy myself a bong right now,
because _technically_ I could use it to smoke tobacco, even though everyone
knows that's not what 99% of people are doing with them. You don't see the ATF
or DEA shutting them down.

~~~
ocdtrekkie
In this case, I think the reason their plausible deniability goes out the
window is the pre-configured options to search for illegal content.

It'll be interesting to see if removing those files from Popcorn Time does, in
fact, get them reinstated.

~~~
Thorentis
This is (legally) a fair point. If you're linking to illegal content then
perhaps that is grounds under this particular ruling for a takedown.

In general though, I object to links themselves being illegal content. If you
give somebody the phone number of a drug dealer, can you be charged with
selling or distribution of drugs?

~~~
ocdtrekkie
The law fundamentally builds on the concept of intent: Did I give you Steve's
phone number, or did I give you the phone number of Steve, my drug dealer,
because you were interested in buying drugs from him. Criminal law depends on
both the actual act, and the _intention to commit a crime_. That's why most
technical workarounds people claim should exempt them from the law tend to not
work: The intent is the same.

Disclaimer: I do not actually have a drug dealer named Steve.

~~~
Thorentis
Proving intent is the most difficult part of criminal law. If intent was all
that mattered, why does Google remove copyrighted links from its search
results? The intent for Google clearly isn't to distribute illegal content,
but to provide links to as much as possible on the web (or at least, it used
to be). But even DDG compiles with DMCA. A generic search engine is still
required by law to take down links, even if the intent isn't there. Which
proves that the mere act of "handing over a phone number" is enough.

------
Hitton
Related:

 _The Hawaiian company "42 Ventures" has registered various piracy-related
trademarks. The company currently owns the US word marks for YTS, Popcorn
Time, and Terrarium, which it uses to target key piracy services. This
recently resulted in the suspension of the Twitter account of a popular
Popcorn Time fork.[0]_

[https://torrentfreak.com/company-registers-yts-and-
popcorn-t...](https://torrentfreak.com/company-registers-yts-and-popcorn-time-
trademarks-to-promote-legal-streaming-200407/)

------
segfaultbuserr
> Popcorn Software is a multi-platform, free software BitTorrent client that
> includes an integrated media player.

~~~
duemti
"Use it as it suits you on your own responsibility." DMCA abuse.

~~~
segfaultbuserr
Why did you reply to me? I literally just copied and pasted the project
description (the comment section was empty when I posted it, and I didn't even
know what Popcorn Time is...), and I didn't state any position on DMCA (to set
the records straight, I'm not a fan of DMCA). Please do not blindly assume
other people's positions based on what they _didn 't_ say. Thanks.

BTW, I didn't downvote your comment.

------
Aloha
Can you use the DMCA in this way?

~~~
greglindahl
The DMCA is easy to abuse without any consequences. There's no known case of
anyone ever being legally sanctioned for filing a DMCA takedown, even when it
involved lies such as assertions of copyright ownership that were clearly
untrue.

~~~
ikeboy
Depends on what your criteria is. Google settled for 25k with someone who
submitted fake notices to YouTube. Given that most litigation ends before a
decision, it's likely there's been other private settlements.

More broadly than just DMCA, but here's a partial list of successful cases:

[https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/4226764/dynamic-
designs...](https://www.courtlistener.com/docket/4226764/dynamic-designs-
distribution-incorporated-v-nalin-manufacturing-llc/) awarded declaratory
judgement and 37k in attorney fees for a false claim made to eBay (see docket
38) >On November 11, 2011, Mr. Nalin filed a “VeRO complaint with eBay
asserting that the Dynamic Designs speaker adapter infringed Nalin’s trademark
rights.”

[https://courts.state.md.us/sites/default/files/import/appell...](https://courts.state.md.us/sites/default/files/import/appellate/unreportedopinions/2017/2556s15.pdf)
150k jury award of punitive damages, reduced by appeals court to 75k, for a
false Amazon complaint of counterfeiting

[https://casetext.com/case/alexander-binzel-corporation-v-
nu-...](https://casetext.com/case/alexander-binzel-corporation-v-nu-tecsys-
corporation) really old case not involving the Internet, but a $4 million jury
award reduced by the district court to $2.34 million+interest for false claims
of counterfeiting

~~~
greglindahl
Given the large number of attempts at legal sanctions which have all failed,
I'm not so sure that an out-of-court settlement is that interesting. So yes,
that's what I think is important.

Edit: I'm having a hard time keeping up with your edits, can you stop editing
at some point?

You've added 3 links about counterfitting. The DMCA only applies to
copyrights, not trademarks or patents.

~~~
ikeboy
I think I only did one edit to add the cases, won't edit that comment any
more.

I did disclaim that those are broader than DMCA. I'm well aware of the
distinctions.

You're looking only for final judgements? I have a handful where a judge
ordered the DMCA notice to be retracted and ordered them not to refile it, and
then the case settled, presumably on favorable terms.

I agree DMCA cases seem to be harder to win than trademark/patent abuse.

~~~
greglindahl
If you're aware of the distinctions, then why are you bringing up irrelevant
trademark / patent / counterfeiting cases?

A required retraction is not much of a legal sanction.

I love having interesting discussions about this topic, but this discussion
isn't one.

~~~
ikeboy
>A required retraction is not much of a legal sanction.

It gives somewhat of a hint about the nature of the settlement, which in most
cases is private. There do seem to be a decent number of settlements; my guess
is the most egregious cases all settle, and the ones that move forward are
harder to win.

------
throwaway483284
If you are running a torrent site with "links" (.torrent files available) it's
illegal. Torrent site is not hosting any videos, just links to them. This is
exactly the same with popcorn time because they have providers in their code
base. In case of the torrent site interface is a website, in case of popcorn
time it's an desktop application. If they would remove providers (torrent
sites/trackers with illegal content) from their code then DMCA would be
invalid.

------
dvdbloc
Will projects like this switch to using Gitlab? Is there a reason they don’t?

~~~
knocte
Looks like they were already using it as a backup:
[https://gitlab.com/popcorn-official/popcorn-
desktop](https://gitlab.com/popcorn-official/popcorn-desktop) but last commit
a year ago? I guess they will push latest commits soon

~~~
mirimir
Would GitLab resist DCMA better than GitHub?

~~~
rataata_jr
Alteast you can host your own gitlab.

------
sabujp
by that token duckduckgo should be taken down :
[https://duckduckgo.com/?q=watch+movies+online+free&ia=news](https://duckduckgo.com/?q=watch+movies+online+free&ia=news)
. This is literally the only thing I use ddg for.

------
tibbydudeza
Hosting this kind of software on a US based server is just plain daft.

~~~
loeg
It's a distributed VCS. All it takes to push it to another server is 'git
push'.

~~~
Aachen
I think git remote add might be helpful before pushing :-)

------
x3blah
[http://web.archive.org/web/20190402223528/https://github.com...](http://web.archive.org/web/20190402223528/https://github.com/popcorn-
official/popcorn-desktop/issues)

Looks like this was a fork from [https://github.com/butterproject/butter-
desktop](https://github.com/butterproject/butter-desktop) which is still up

------
vajrapani666
Git’s style of decentralization, still requires individual git servers no? Is
there something like git, but based on magnet/torrent architecture?

~~~
donatj
Required? Not really. You can work without a central server, pulling from
individuals machines over SFTP or SMB as we did for a few years in the early
2010s.

It was always awkward and we moved to GitHub shortly before I left.

------
webreac
I think this is a good opportunity to assess the commutment of github
(microsoft) to support free software. I am not a lawyer, but it seems clear
that this an abuse. I bet that the repository will become available again.
IMHO the duration of the takedown is a good KPI of the trust deserved by
github. More than 24 hours would be bad. Less than 4 hours would be good.

~~~
hundchenkatze
From this comment
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23075667](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23075667)
it sounds like they're required to leave it down for 10 days.

------
rs23296008n1
Why is the entity that posted the takedown not identified?

Seems like an important detail.

(And today I discovered there's a bittorrent utility called popcorn time)

~~~
progval
It is:
[https://github.com/github/dmca/blob/master/2020/05/2020-05-0...](https://github.com/github/dmca/blob/master/2020/05/2020-05-01-MPA.md)

~~~
rs23296008n1
Thanks. Didn't see that[1]. So they included links to the "nasty" as files in
the project. That seems like an unwise decision.

[1] just click "publically posted".

------
pmlnr
This is not fun. Github bending over every time is not good for us. The
Instagram API thing was bad enough, now this. Hurray for M$.

------
orionblastar
PopCornTime is a scraper, could one argue that it does not contain DMCA
materials only accesses it like a Doom client accesses a Doom server or you
build your own Doom server.

The DMCA violation is on the Internet from servers that allow web scraping and
hosts the files or P2P Torrent networks that don't store the file on the PCT
software.

I'm not a lawyer.

------
fulafel
Good lesson abut host country related risk involved in using Github, in
addition to the trade sanctions related ones.

------
crad
Looks like they got shutdown on Twitter as well:

[https://twitter.com/popcorntimetv](https://twitter.com/popcorntimetv)

------
choward
I have lost any remaining respect I had for GitHub. The whole point of git is
to be decentralized and this is a great example if why that is important.

------
justapassenger
I do think it makes sense (as, well, majority of people don’t use it to get
free videos about how to install Linux), but it’s very very tricky balance,
and each time they’re being pushed there should be a lot of discussion and
scrutiny.

Compare that to gun rights discussion. Apps like popcorntime are similar to
assault weapons - cool tech, but not much legit legal reason for an average
joe to own it. And they both make illegal activity much, much easier.

Note - before someone says that I equal downloading movie to killing people. I
don’t, but framework of legal thinking is similar.

~~~
TheSpiceIsLife
> Apps like popcorntime are similar to assault weapons

All analogies breakdown under close scrutiny.

What I don't understand is why people contiue to make analogies where none are
required.

The _arguement against_ Popcorn Time is simple and straighforward: It is
overwhelming used to circumvent copywrite / avoid paying for access to
content.

Whether anyone agrees with that argument or not is immaterial to my point: we
don't need to compare the _arguement against_ to anything else because its
meaning is self-evident.

~~~
notechback
I would hope that any gun shop that sells products with the slogan "you can
murder your spouse or neighbour with them, but you can also shoot animals or
walls I guess".gets shut down ;)

------
mullingitover
Does this takedown affect anyone who forked the repo?

~~~
saagarjha
I believe takedowns usually cause forks to be deleted as well.

~~~
mullingitover
Looks like there are still hundreds of popcorn time derivatives floating
around:
[https://github.com/search?q=popcorn+time&ref=opensearch](https://github.com/search?q=popcorn+time&ref=opensearch)

~~~
saagarjha
They’ll go after those too later, but that’s a manual process.

------
jijji
looks like its only the desktop version, which is available on wayback
machine:
[https://web.archive.org/web/20200411155357/https://github.co...](https://web.archive.org/web/20200411155357/https://github.com/popcorn-
official/popcorn-desktop)

------
EastSmith
Can any blockchain hold blobs and more importantly how much it will cost?

For example I know the Stellar blockchain can hold a small amount of text
content called "memo" when making a transaction, but not sure if the "memo"
field can be used _after_ a transaction is made. Probably it is a public field
that can be read by anyone?

I was always wondering what if we start putting content into a blockchain in
general.

~~~
everfree
IPFS does this. It doesn't have blockchain incentives though. Hosting is based
on good will, like with torrents.

------
dilandau
Imagine using githovel.

Just host it yourself.

------
mensetmanusman
Copyrights on movies should not last longer than ‘copyrights’ of new drugs and
technologies.

20 years?

~~~
loeg
Patents? 20 years from filing. But copyright is different and usually
associated with lifetime of the author. Disney has... bastardized this with
aggressive lobbying.

------
api
I've changed my view radically on mass piracy since what I believed in my
youth, and I no longer agree with or have any sympathy with it.

In the information age, most valuable labor is increasingly the creation of
information. "Information wants to be free" means "labor wants to be free." In
other words "I want other people's labor to be free," or "gimme free stuff and
I don't care if anyone else can make a living."

Then there is the effect of everything being free. In the Internet media world
it helped lead to surveillance capitalism, since that's the only viable
business model. Another viable model is propaganda. So if you want more of
those things, by all means undermine simple overt non-sketchy paid business
models.

------
jijji
next they will take down Reynolds Wrap because people can use it to smoke
crack.

------
lqet
Most of the comments here seem to miss the crucial point: it doesn't matter
whether the DMCA really applies here. Github is privately owned. If Microsoft
wants to take down this repository (which they host for free), they are most
certainly allowed to and do not even have to give a reason.

~~~
wtallis
Whether the DMCA takedown procedure applies here _is_ important, because it
determines who to blame. If the procedure is valid to use in this way, then
the MPA is who gets the blame for making it harder to get PopcornTime.

But if it doesn't apply here and Microsoft is acting outside of that procedure
and its protections, then legally and morally it's GitHub censoring a project
because they don't like it. Which GitHub's Terms of Service let them do, but
the ToS doesn't say the users have to be happy about it. (And it would also be
the MPA abusing a legal procedure that was already written to favor them,
which is certainly a topic fit for public debate.)

