
The most feared woman on the Internet - jacquesm
http://dir.salon.com/story/tech/feature/2002/03/01/netochka/index.html
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aw3c2
_Mar 1, 2002_

<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Netochka_Nezvanova>

And here is the coming-out:
<http://www.subtletechnologies.com/2006/symposium/Dan.html>

Sounds like an artsy fartsy egomaniac to me.

~~~
junklight
I had a few run-ins with NN/antiorp/m9ndfukc back in the day.

To be honest I think that "artsy fartsy" is a meaningless cliché. It sounds
like "artists are stupid because they take art seriously"

However - NN was interesting because as well as being absolutely infuriating
she was very knowledgeable about the technology (DSP/CSound type stuff), was
capable of being very poetic and profound upon occasion and genuinely made you
think, often very deeply.

I know from my interactions with the Hafler Trio (Andrew Mackenzie had been
hinted at as having involvement in the NN project - although that does not
seem to have been the case.) that Mackenzie achieves a similar thing with his
online interaction style. By being provoked, questioned and subverted you can
be led to new thinking and ways of seeing things which are often hard won but
rewarding. Like NN it does have the side effect of making people not open to
it very angry indeed.

~~~
aw3c2
Ah, I guess I used "artsy fartsy" in a wrong way. No native english speaker
here.

 _Gheorghe Dan is artistic director and researcher for 0f0003, a phylotically
entwined polymorphic web of covalent potentialities, a multi-
cultural/scientific laboratory, promulgating generative storytelling,
evolutionary design, autopoetic systems and hybrid reality multiverses._

That just sounded so very "I am an artist and use mysterious words because I
am so much ~better than you".

~~~
unalone
The tricky thing here is that some artists do deliberately use big words
because they think they're better, but some honestly don't realize how
pretentious it sounds to use language like that. I've got a friend who sounds
like an old Russian author when she speaks/writes, because those are the words
she grew up with. Not everybody spends time learning how to be easily
digestible.

~~~
sunir
Poor communication only becomes enculturated when it has some larger economic
purpose.

In the art world, it's all a game to win funding. This type of art is not
aimed at the general audience, but--if you bear with what seems like weird
conspiratorial mumbo jumbo--about making a certain class of elites feel and
appear smarter when dealing with their peers.

The elites are the public funding boards and the private patrons. For the
public funders, they need to defend their grants, so they need suitable
language from the artist that makes the art seem incredibly important,
intelligent, etc. so they can defend their decisions. For the private funder,
it's the thrill of showing off. It's the same reason you hang beautiful
pictures on your wall. Sure it's for your own pleasure, but it's also for the
pleasure of seeing others appreciate your taste.

One way to accomplish both goals is to be inscrutable. That confuses and
intimidates people, and can make them afraid to challenge you.

To give you another context where poor communication is used to serve an
economic end, you'll find the same tactic in sales. If you ever wondered why
an enterprise software company's website doesn't make any sense, it's to
confuse you enough to pick up the phone and call a salesperson who can then
relationship sell you.

~~~
unalone
As I said: Half the time I agree with you, and it's pretense for the sake of
pretense. The rest of the time - more often, in fact, in my age group - it's
people who just know big words and use them like it's part of their
vocabulary.

Hell, I'm guilty of the same thing, to a lesser degree. I speak the way I
type, occasional digressions into grander vocabulary and all, and I'm
frequently asked why I use such large words. Personally, I don't think words
like "digression", "voluptuous" (a personal favorite), and "grandiose" are
that difficult, but other people disagree, and I've been called an artsy-fart
more than once.

 _It's the same reason you hang beautiful pictures on your wall. Sure it's for
your own pleasure, but it's also for the pleasure of seeing others appreciate
your taste._

I'm going to have to disagree and defend the honest artist here. As a purveyor
of beautiful things myself, I can say that I don't care about other people's
opinions of my taste. However, I still _do_ seek out said beautiful things,
entirely for myself. I spent this weekend buying diningware and silverware,
and if I hadn't been looking for stuff I really connected with I could have
left the store a hundred dollars richer. As it is, I care much more about
having an emotive connection with the things I own and see and use than I do
about saving money, which I know sounds like bullshit but is a philosophy I
still agree with.

~~~
sunir
Please don't take my comment to imply all art is this way. I'm just saying
that artists who join this culture of obfuscation are doing so because there
are buyers who like or depend on it.

------
Tichy
"Artists use her software, to manipulate video for live performance and
installations."

Clearly she is going to take over the world next. Silly summer hole hype.

------
zby
For the other discussion of Netochka see:
<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=774594>

~~~
jacquesm
Interesting! It seems that more people had their memories jogged by the _why
thing...

