
World wide cost of living rankings for 2012 - rabble
http://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/rankings.jsp
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epoxyhockey
As an aside: The website uses jQuery's grid plugin (
<http://www.trirand.com/blog> ) to present the data.

There is a newer plugin called DataTables ( <http://datatables.net/> ) which I
find to be much nicer, especially when combined with JQuery DataTables
Editable ( <http://code.google.com/p/jquery-datatables-editable/> ).

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cjfont
The interface is horrible, both the table and the map. It's so easy to add
info bubbles on Google Maps, not sure why that was left out.

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devs1010
Well, this is definitely not entirely accurate. It has Phoenix, AZ as being
more expensive than San Jose, CA. Having lived in both places I can say the
cost of living in Phoenix is about half that of San Jose so its entirely wrong
on that. I suppose its just mean to give a general idea overall and maybe was
taking in data in some strange way to where it counted a large rural area that
also included San Jose, or something, against just the urban area of Phoenix.

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jacques_chester
The small map image seems out of sync with the live map.

I'm in Darwin, Australia. The small map (correctly in my view) shows us as
bright red -- quite expensive -- because of the combination of isolation (high
fuel, food, labour costs) and land shortages (ie high rent).

I see people in SV and NYC complain about the rent. Well I pay that much ...
and I don't earn SV / NYC wages. And I don't live in one of the Earth's great
commercial or cultural epicentres.

I would if I could.

So quitcherwhinin'.

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astrodust
Darwin looks kind of relaxed and suburban compared to cities with serious
geographic constraints. Sydney, San Francisco, Manhattan, and West Vancouver
are all jammed tight because of ocean and rivers. They're also stacked to
overflowing with tall towers if not simply wall to wall buildings.

You're certainly right about the isolated part, though. Might as well be half
way around the world from your nearest neighbor!

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jacques_chester
We have legal and political constraints that are not visible on a map, mixed
in with generous lashings of political incompetence.

Basically the same as everywhere, minus the natural advantages to trade.

Apart from the ruinous cost of living, Darwin is a city I like living in. I
just don't like _working_ here.

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Gaussian
Suspect. The grocery index for Chicago is 72 and in Baltimore it's 101. Are
groceries really 40% more in Baltimore than in Chicago? They're likely not
more at all. In fact, on the whole, Chicago is more expensive than Baltimore.
That's just a fact. But the figures here say otherwise.

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sologoub
Agree - looking at 2011 Moscow, Russia, it shows it as way cheaper than most
US cities, but Moscow routinely ranks in top 5 most expensive cities on earth.
Real estate prices there are comparable to NYC and food prices aren't cheap
either (was just there few months ago).

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cema
Have not been to Chicago in a while, from my older (several years old)
recollections it is not drastically different from Baltimore. However: Moscow
is definitely cheaper than its usual "top 5" ranking. For a middle class
visitor or city dweller, anyway (cannot say for a very short-term business
visitor). Caveat: knowing Russian would help greatly but is not mandatory.

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tjmc
I'd like to see where Perth sits on that scale. There's a pub here that
charges $18 (~$19US) for a pint of Hoegaarden and an average pint of beer is
$10.

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cletus
I'm from Perth but now live in NYC and I've lived in London, Zurich and
Germany.

I can tell you that the erosion in the real standard of living in Australia,
particularly Perth, in the last decade is mind-blowing.

The way I see it the resources boom has driven up the cost of construction
both directly (through infrastructure projects) and indirectly (increased
demand for residential housing from net migration). It now costs anywhere from
$1500-2000/m2 to build a house.

That's _insane_.

That cost is then passed on through wage demands, the cost of running any
business and so on. Rent is at or above New York levels (my old apartment in
West Perth is now more expensive than my apartment in _Manhattan_ ).

Apart from roughly comparable rent in NYC, _everything_ else is significantly
cheaper.

Increased population pressure, property prices and construction costs are also
reflected in the skyrocketing price increases in food, water and power.

London is (or at least was the last time I visited) reasonably expensive.

Zurich has a reputation for being expensive but honestly it's not anymore.
Fact is, you can still get a studio in the city for maybe under CHF1000/month
(something you can't in Perth). Yes food is more expensive but you pay lower
taxes and everything else is, at worst, comparable in cost. I look at property
prices in nice towns like Zug or Luzern and (IMHO) it's way more affordable
than Perth.

So ignore whatever the CPI tells you about Australia. IMHO it's not a place
you want to live now unless you have owned property for at least 10 years (and
thus rode the property boom and are reasonably cashed up) or are rich. Either
way it's one of the most expensive countries on the planet now.

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jacques_chester
Perth's main disadvantage is that it is wedged between the hills and the sea,
which is why it is steadily growing into one of the longest conurbations in
the world.

On the other hand, public transport on the north-south axis is reasonably good
thanks to an uncharacteristic degree of planning foresight starting in the
60s.

If you don't have to live in the CBD or adjacent, Perth can be very
affordable. You just have to shop around or put up with a 30 minute commute on
a train (oh noes!).

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ars
Seems to me there is some good money to be made where high and low cost of
living adjoin.

For example Vienna and Bratislava.

If nothing else, if you can work in the high cost of living place, and live in
the low cost area.

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rabble
Or where it's easy to fly from one place to another. It explains why there are
so many hackers in Portland. It's a nice place to live with noticeably cheaper
cost of living than Seattle or San Francisco. I know folks who consider it a
bedroom community to silicon valley, only 550 miles away.

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devs1010
I'm a bit intrigued by this, could you elaborate a bit more? Are they working
as contractors commuting once a month for meetings, etc or doing their own
ventures where they are coming down for meetings with investors?

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kbob
I, for example, am a regular telecommuting employee of a large company in San
Jose. Nominally, I'm in San Jose for one week every quarter, though it has
been less than that lately. I spend a lot of time on the phone and on video
conferences.

PS: Nit. It's about 650 miles from Portland to SJ.

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devs1010
If you don't mind my asking, I am curious if you got the job also while living
remotely or did you live in northern California, got the job and then later
moved out of state to work remotely? I'm currently out of state, looking to
move back to California as its where I'm from so I'm wondering if there is a
possibility for finding a job where I work remotely which would certainly make
the move a lot smoother, already have a job there.

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kbob
Sorry for the delayed reply.

I lived in SJ from 1992-2001. I knew my current boss from that time. Sometime
around 2006, while I was living here in Oregon, he emailed me and asked if I
might be interested in doing X for him.

I've gotten my last seven jobs through friends. The last two have been since I
moved to Oregon. The last time I applied for a job where I didn't know anybody
was 1985.

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hucker
Seeing this makes me wonder, because I've dabbled with the thought of living a
year in NYC ever since I visited this summer, but I have been put off by all
the warnings here on HN and elsewhere stating that the cost of living there is
insane. My current city of residence, Trondheim, Norway is ranking top for
consumer price and second for consumer price + rent in this ranking. And
still, living as a single male on state scholarship and loans (which adds up
to about $15k a year), I live in a pretty ok standard apartment with a room
mate and don't save on food etc. at all. I have zero credit-card debt etc. (I
could easily do the same in Stavanger, Norway, which ranks higher for cost of
rent.)

What am I missing?

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ryusage
Looking at the methodology [1], I have some doubts about the validity of all
these numbers. Apparently they're at least partially user-submitted, which
implies to me that there's likely to be some bias, depending on who actually
took the time to submit information.

For example, the site claims that residents of Indianapolis, IN have the most
(average) purchasing power of anyone in the world, by an incredible margin.
Indianapolis is nice enough, but I'd be shocked if that were true.

Still a cool/interesting site, but I would take it with a grain of salt.

[1] <http://www.numbeo.com/common/motivation_and_methodology.jsp>

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hucker
Yeah, you're right, the methodology doesn't really inspire confidence in the
results.

As an anecdote though, when I was vacationing there this summer all groceries,
restaurants and similar felt incredibly cheap, and although rent on Manhattan
was steep, I found a comparable apartment to my own in Williamsburg that had a
slightly higher cost than what I am paying now. Maybe what I'm missing is
health insurance? How much does it cost a normally fit 21 year old male for
full coverage insurance?

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rabble
Most folks who are fit and 21 just go without health insurance. If you've got
a job and aren't contracting, then you usually get insurance through work.

~~~
hucker
So.. If I got ill, what would happen? In reality I would have insurance by the
norwegian government, but assuming I was american. What does the regular
student that doesn't get help from his parents do?

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ryusage
From what I recall, students can be covered by their parents' health insurance
until they're 26 as long as they're still in school. That's what most college
students do.

If they're not in school, and they don't have their own job that provides
health insurance, well...honestly, if they don't have a job that provides it,
then they probably don't have a job that pays enough that they can afford to
get it independently either. Most of my friends in that situation just gamble
and try not to go to a doctor unless absolutely necessary. If they do have
to...well, then they're going to be in some serious debt.

It's not a very good system, but it works for the people who have influence.

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cr4zy
This totally flies in the face of Wolphram Alpha's data:
[http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=chicago+vs+phoenix+vs+d...](http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=chicago+vs+phoenix+vs+dallas+vs+san+jose+vs+new+york+city+vs+san+francisco+vs+austin+texas+vs+denver+vs+las+vegas+vs+atlanta+vs+los+angeles+vs+seattle+cost+of+living)

Phoenix, where I live, is cheaper according to Wolphram Alpha than Dallas, Las
Vegas, Chicago, and Devner whereas it's more expensive according to Numbeo's
list.

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shaggyfrog
As a Canadian, surprised they didn't include Vancouver. Which I suspect would
be at or near the top of the list for this country.

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pedalpete
Vancouver is on page two, ahead of Toronto by a few spots (but well worth the
cost difference in my opinion)

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shaggyfrog
Bwah, you're absolutely right.

Full blame goes to the UI. If I type a query into a search box, I expect it to
search the full list. Not just the handful of entries on that page.

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wiradikusuma
How do I compare cities? (e.g. Axxx with Zxxx)

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bfung
I think they mean for 2011 (more precisely, Q4 2011), as we don't have data
for 2012 yet. This doesn't inspire confidence in the accuracy of the numbers.

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brc
Use the year drop down at the top of the page. That loads the 2011 data.
You're correct in that the 2012 data is too patchy to be taken seriously.

Any list of expensive cities not topped by Oslo is kidding itself. That place
is insane.

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kirpekar
Does anyone know why the purchasing power is so high in Indianapolis, IN?

Seems odd.

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paraschopra
All indian cities comfortably sit at the bottom of the scale!

