

Hiring is hard - twism
http://getrealordie.com/?p=274

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timcederman
This is the same company that caused all that fuss a few weeks back with their
arrogance about who they would hire and for posting a cover letter to belittle
a candidate. (<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=360574>)

No wonder they're finding hiring hard.

~~~
nostrademons
Cut 'em some slack. They screwed up, hopefully they've learned their lesson,
apparently they've found someone (so it doesn't look like they were hurt too
badly), and the data they post here may help other startups find people.

~~~
timcederman
It was a slightly unnecessarily snarky comment, you're right -- the data
actually wasn't too bad.

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mikeryan
The more I read these "get real or die" folks the more I realize they need a
few more years in the barrel before they're ready to go.

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jmtame
Why are you using "college degree" as a measure of a candidate's "quality"?

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stillmotion
My thoughts exactly. Problem with a lot of inexperienced startups is their
failure to look at people's potential and not their credentials. While a
degree helps, people are more likely to prove their quality through great work
and amazing reliability. When I start hiring--which hopefully is soon--I'm not
going to give a rat's ass about people's credentials, I'll know they're good
when I see their work and how they work.

~~~
brentr
I am curious as to what would count as "work". Would you consider building a
financial library used for personal and academic purposes work?

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stillmotion
Sorry, I should've defined "work". In the web world, work is the designs
you've done, the projects you've developed, and the communities you've helped.
I'm sure building a financial library would fit perfectly in that category.

~~~
brentr
I wasn't busting your chops. I wanted to know because next year I will be
completing my MSFE. My plans are to work long enough to pay off my debt and
get a nice cash cushion and then move out to SV. I haven't built anything yet,
but I am starting to get a financial library laid out in planning.

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bdotdub
This is probably a nitpicky thing, but things you can't rate, you shouldn't
rate.

 _Customer Service 9? (Never had to use it)_

Why a 9?

~~~
cdr
Not to mention the rating for HN:

 _0 (No way to get on the jobs page!)_

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ardit33
"waded through 85+ applicants, calling about 25 of those people, and
interviewing about 10 candidates."

\--For ONE position. It feels like this guy is running "American Idol"
contest. Really, you bring in 10 candidates, to hire one, then you are not
doing enough of a good phone screening.

~~~
auston
Sorry. I should have said "followed up" we didn't actually call 25 people.

Also, you may not be accounting for our geographic location.

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mikeryan
If you didn't call that what the heck was a follow up? An email?

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auston
We called some, IMed others, Facebooked a few, Emailed the rest.

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jgrahamc
This post doesn't talk about what happens when you've actually got a candidate
in front of you. That too is hard.

We're using extensive testing of candidates to make sure that we understand
their technical knowledge as well as traditional interviews.

All our candidates have to do a programming test before they even get
considered for an interview (we made up a test that we think captures the sort
of programming that they would have to do here).

Then when they come in they sit a programming knowledge test before they get
to the first interview.

~~~
neilc
Another consideration is how you actually convince your prospective hire to
join the company: particularly in a startup, the sort of person you want to
hire is very likely to have multiple offers to choose amongst. When
interviewing someone like that, I think it's important to realize the person's
calibre quickly, and then to try to use the interview to show them why they
ought to work for you -- in that situation, routine written programming tests
probably work to your disadvantage.

~~~
estegonza2002
You do have a point there. first of all, I work with Auston, the one who
posted this threat. I think that making the decision to join a company has to
do more with the people and vision of the company I'm interviewing with. At
the same time I think it would be nice to show them my skill set. I'm have
been a consultant for a long time now and there have been times when I didn't
want to do business with the other company after the initial meeting and other
times where I had to proof myself to the company before we could have a deal
together. I think we approached the interviews pretty good. We set up a very
relax atmosphere and talk about more than just programming and skill stuff.

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jgrahamc
You could also consider using a recruiter. I realize it's painful to pay a
large chunk of salary and you really want to conserve cash in a start-up.

But you also have to trade off the speed of finding someone against the
recruitment cost. I'm using both recruiters and social techniques (including
giving a bonus to any engineer on my team who brings in a candidate that we
actually hire).

~~~
mcargian
If hiring is hard, finding a decent recruiter is even harder. My experience,
with recuriters, has been signing a contract to cough up 15% of annual salary
to a recruiter who does nothing more than list the ad on job sites and pass
along resumes. I know there are some recruiters that actually do recruit, and
add value, but they are very hard to find.

~~~
cabalamat
> _I know there are some recruiters that actually do recruit, and add value,
> but they are very hard to find._

Indeed so. I've been on the other side of the fence -- i.e. as an employee --
and the vast majority of the recruitment agencies I dealt with were idiots.
99% of them have no ability to sort of competent from incompetent candidates.

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smwhreyebelong
How about LinkedIn ? Anybody try that for finding potential candidates ?

I have started receiving increasing mail from recruiters/startups there.

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estegonza2002
getting hired is harder!

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phil_collins
Are you writing controls for the space shuttle or building a web based lead
manager? How come nobody is good enough? My guess is you probably don't know
what to look for in a candidate.

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lessallan
Great read.

