
Fast food and obesity in developing countries - ezhil
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/02/health/ghana-kfc-obesity.html
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faghdfuiahsdf
Is there actually any agreement among scientists that there is a causal
relationship between fast food consumption and obesity? I mean at an
epidemiological level -- obviously if I eat ten Whoppers a day, I'm going to
have a problem.

My favorite recent hypothesis for the obesity epidemic is the increase in
snacking [1]. It seems very easy to believe that highly preserved snacks are
becoming more available in these countries at the same time as fast food does.

[1]: [https://www.vox.com/2015/2/17/8051367/obesity-
snacks](https://www.vox.com/2015/2/17/8051367/obesity-snacks)

~~~
wallace_f
A teacher lost ~60lbs on a McDonalds-only diet.(1)

As the article states, the reasons for obesity are "complex," and 'involve
blaming society, and everyone else' for individual choices.

The most interesting thing about this topic is why does if fit entirely into
the "can't blame them category," when there are still so many examples--albeit
on a diminishing list--of other personal choices that one may be acceptably
villified for--many of which don't even involve environmental destruction and
animal rights abuses?

Yes culture, wealth, consumer products, job opportunities, and corn subsidies
all participate; but perhaps the biggest problem is one of personal
responsibility.

By contrast, in Japan obesity wins you an automatic trip to counseling(2).

1-[https://www.today.com/health/man-loses-56-pounds-after-
eatin...](https://www.today.com/health/man-loses-56-pounds-after-eating-only-
mcdonalds-six-months-2D79329158)

2-[https://www.bu.edu/themovement/2011/05/29/the-fats-on-
fire/](https://www.bu.edu/themovement/2011/05/29/the-fats-on-fire/)

~~~
greggman
I think Japan is a great example of personal responsibility. Food in Japan or
at least the major cities is ridiculously easy to come by. Convenience stores
every 2-3 minutes open 24 hours with loads of food, snacks, pastries, donuts,
ice cream, liquor, beer. Liquor and Beer are as low as $1.20 a can. All the
super markets now also carry tons of ready to eat foods and meals (because
convenience stores were eating into their market) as well as chips, desserts,
liquor, etc... Many more restaurants than anywhere else I've lived are open
until morning. And there is fast food of all sorts as well, way more
bread/pastries stores than just about anywhere on the planet. And yes, they
have tons of greasy salty and sugary foods available.

And yet Japanese aren't nearly as obese. That would seem to suggest either
genetics or self control.

Certain things help like often (not always) portions are smaller but you can
always buy 2+

~~~
watwut
Randomly bought bread/snack in Japan (or Europe) has less sugar then
bread/snack in USA. Seriously. Everything in USA is much much sweater and
bread tastes like a cake. At least my personal experience was that when I eat
whatever till I feel full in Japan, I am loosing weight and in USA it is very
much gaining weight.

Even coke (or pepsi not sure) has different amount of sugar in it depending on
region - here comparing eu vs usa.

~~~
dagw
_Randomly bought bread /snack in Japan (or Europe) has less sugar then
bread/snack in USA._

Is that true? When I was in Japan a couple of years ago I found that at least
their 'US/European' style bread and cakes where all sickly sweet sometimes
verging on being almost being inedible. More traditional snacks though did
seem less sugary.

~~~
wst_
Isn't European bread different than the US bread? Even within EU bread may be
totally different based on the location.

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thisisit
One thing people keep thinking is this is somehow a "poor" people problem.
This is true when looked through a developed country citizen perspective - in
terms of lifestyle. But please read the article before applying the same
standard here.

In developing countries KFC and McDonald are costly. Not everyone, specially
the poor, can afford it. For the people who can afford it, the upscale nature,
clean-looking environment and the lure of eating something "western" is the
driving factor.

~~~
furqs
As a person who moved from Pakistan to Germany, I can confirm. In Pakistan an
average person will only eat fast once in a while, on occasions like a
birthday party as the article suggests; in developed countries on the other
hand fast food is a cheap no-brainer lunch and dinner option

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TwelveNights
Honestly, the cleanliness and the "elegant" appearance of fast food
restaurants are factors that add a lot to the allure. I noticed this in China
where even places like Starbucks can really stand out in comparison to the
other venues surrounding it.

Taste aside, people really do value the safety of the food and the amenities
that the restaurant provides. These are reasons why I think Western fast food
restaurants are able to take root so quickly and in so many places. There's
the atmosphere that extends beyond just the food that's sold.

~~~
fastfoodie
Sure, I bet it has nothing to do with the fact that it's quick, cheap, and
addictive. Poor people must really love the elegant atmosphere of their local
KFC.

~~~
chickenfries
Those are for sure factors, but McDonalds just a pretty good place to hang out
if you're poor, especially in the developing world. Lots of them have free wi-
fi, power outlets. They're air conditioned / heated. You can basically hang
out all day for next to free. Really, it has all of the amenities of somewhere
like Starbucks, just at a lower price point.

I'm not a fast food apologist, just saying that you're missing the perspective
the gp is trying to bring.

~~~
Aloha
McDonalds often seems to serve as a local community center for the retired and
young, most of them I go to outside of the PNW, have 4-10 older guys sitting
together for coffee in the mornings.

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gexla
Some of the reason for obesity might be fast food but some of it is just
rising incomes along with unique cultural things.

For example, in the Philippines, you look healthy if you are chubby and people
show concern if you are skinny. People encourage you to eat until you feel
full. The food is generally fattening, but poor Filipino's can only afford
enough that they won't get fat. Much of the fattening dishes are reserved for
special events. Back in the day, a bottle of coke was a special thing. Now
people can afford to keep the fridge always stocked.

ETA: Fast food restaurants are relatively high-end. Even then, the food is
relatively expensive. I see a lot of Filipino's ordering drinks and then
sharing the biggest order of fries on the menu.

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PeterStuer
Notice how all the US diets are always about consuming 'different' and never
about consuming 'less'? I'll leave it at that as the food industry has
successfully manipulated public discourse pointing out the emperor has no
clothes to be taboo.

~~~
NumberCruncher
Consuming 'less' in general is not an option.

~~~
NeutronBoy
Why?

~~~
NumberCruncher
Telling people that they need less not more does not make you revenue. Except
if you are selling self help books.

------
NiklasMort
Same story in Asia. Go to Thai cities and be surprised how many overweight
children and adults you'll see. It's not just fast food, its anything
processed. In India you often see kids eat raw instant noodles as snacks.

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yalogin
What is about fast food that increases waist lines? Is it just the fact that
its cheap so people consume more? At the end of the day its just calories
right? So do people tend to over eat when it comes to fast food?

~~~
thisisit
It is about net calories per serving. For example a big Mac meal with soda is
1050 calories:

[http://www.myfitnesspal.com/food/calories/mcdonalds-big-
mac-...](http://www.myfitnesspal.com/food/calories/mcdonalds-big-mac-meal-
medium-size-with-soda-86722281)

Combine it with average daily average intake:

[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_food_en...](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_food_energy_intake)

Let's take India for example. So 2380 calories a day. The big Mac will
constitute nearly 50% of calories in a meal.

Then people do have other meals too - breakfast, lunch and snacks. That means
the calorie count is near to 3k calories. So a 700 calories or 30% in excess
to average calories consumed.

If this happens for say only for weekends ie 8 days in a month. That is 5600
calories in excess. Without any exercise this is going to hit hard on the
waist line and weight.

~~~
pkaye
But there is nothing special about that McDonalds food. In India, you can buy
street food which is way more caloric that a Big Mac. Fried starchy food,
loads of cheese, salty sauces. And they are just as addictive as the McDonalds
stuff... probably more addictive given how awesome and flavorful some of them
are.

~~~
thisisit
The meal was taken as a reference only. All three things you mentioned would
mostly still go into the category of fast foods. So let me clarify, fast food
is not a copyright trademark of McDonalds or KFC. It refers to general moving
away from a properly prepared meal to using processed and easy to prepare
meals.

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smn1234
Could availability and ease of purchase of alcohol play a role here ? Alcohol
has plenty of calories e.g. beer and wine. Used to be you didn’t have it as
readily available at a corner store.

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luvs2gorge
It's sad there are still many (including in this thread) who minimize the role
of fast food outlets in raising obesity rates by appealing to some moralized
and frankly religious notion of "personal responsibility."

What the science tells us is that if you put people in different environments,
they will behave differently. Especially when the reward is designed to be as
compelling as possible.

Obesity is one of the greatest epidemics in the world today. There is no
reason why anyone should have to compete against thousands of food scientists
trying to tear down their willpower as a matter of daily course. Their failure
to do so is in no way a failure of "personal responsibility." It is a failure
of the designers of their world to be on their side in the first place. To
assert otherwise is not only cruelly ideological, but utterly unscientific.

~~~
darawk
The fact that in an experiment people changed their behavior based on
environmental cues does not disprove the notion of personal responsibility. If
you think you have disproven personal responsibility, then you have disproven
free will. And if you have disproven free will, then who is your comment
trying to convince?

That being said, the truth of this particular matter lies somewhere in the
middle. It's personal responsibility and it's exploitation on the part of the
fast food chains. Saying it's all one or all the other is equally wrong.

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elorm

       Ghana, a coastal African country of more than 28 million still etched with pockets of extreme poverty
    

Ugh New York times.

On the issue of obesity however, like someone has already addressed in the
thread, has more to do with individual choices than the availability of fast
food joints. There have been arguments about people who frequent Macs or KFC
everyday of their lives, and have managed to stay fit/in shape(Though not an
argument for overall good health).

