
Can Dirt Save the Earth? - indigodaddy
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/18/magazine/dirt-save-earth-carbon-farming-climate-change.html
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monkeydreams
Australian farmers, suffering through yet another "unexpectedly intensive"
drought, could learn a lot from this. I mean they won't, but they could.

Instead they will whinge and complain and put their hands out and watch their
stock die and, when rain falls again, they will take the government-aid
cheques and overstock their land and continue the laziest, dumbest form of
farming they could import from the cooler, wetter climes of England.

~~~
ciconia
That's exactly the mindset of Farmers here in Burgundy, France. We just had
one of the dryest summers on record - we're still running a water deficit.
Farmer's response: demand government subsidies!

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jillesvangurp
If it works, even a little bit, I'm all for it. There are similar stories
about e.g. China restoring vast arid lands back into green lands through
simple measures that basically include a little bit of engineering but mostly
letting nature do what it does best. Similarly, Northern Africa is basically
turning land into deserts by letting goats and sheep roam free and to eat
everything that looks even remotely green. Some simple fences keeping the
animals out can apparently restore a lot of that land in years thus making it
possible to farm all sorts of stuff that previously would not grow there at
all.

This suggests that figuring out how to manipulate nature to function more
optimally, can actually be beneficial. Even merely stopping to do things that
are clearly misguided seems to help. Healthy soil does all sorts of things
that are beneficial. Holding carbon is part of that yes. But it also holds
water. Without water nothing grows. If you fix that, bio diversity increases,
the soil becomes richer, more stuff grows. Including the stuff we're
interested in farming.

Much of last century was dedicated to intensive farming and short term yields
without any regard whatsoever to the long term impact. None of that has to be
permanent. If you read science fiction, a popular topic is terra forming.
We'll have an opportunity to terra form earth long before we need to terra
form somewhere else. Might be easier too and feasible.

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ars
Nicely written article, but the author needs to have a conversation with a
chemist on the difference between carbon, carbon dioxide, and hydrocarbons.
The author calls all of them "carbon", making for confusing reading.

Anyway if you need a summary: Spray cow manure on fields to encourage plant
grown. Done right you can actually increase topsoil, burying older plants
under newer ones and store hydrocarbons there.

Basically reverse soil erosion, with benefits in carbon dioxide capture.

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aaaaaaaaaab
Ok, let’s cultivate the Sahara!

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rebuilder
There's a slight problem with water, I believe.

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tonyedgecombe
Only because we removed all the vegetation.

[https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2017/03/170314111320.h...](https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2017/03/170314111320.htm)

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monktastic1
> This view ran counter to a lot of conservationist thought, as well as a
> great deal of evidence. Grazing has been blamed for turning vast swaths of
> the world into deserts. But from Creque’s perspective, how you graze makes
> all the difference.

This is the idea behind this fantastic TED talk:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vpTHi7O66pI](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vpTHi7O66pI)

We're largely focused on high-tech ways to "fix" the Earth, but the Earth has
known how to do it since forever. Finding ways to use her own intelligence
seems like a great idea.

~~~
kiliantics
I remember being blown away by that video but apparently there has been some
criticism of Savory's work. Searching his name returns a few critical articles
such as this one:

[https://www.sierraclub.org/sierra/2017-2-march-
april/feature...](https://www.sierraclub.org/sierra/2017-2-march-
april/feature/allan-savory-says-more-cows-land-will-reverse-climate-change)

He has responded to some of them and sticks to his claims. It seems the
picture is very complicated and we haven't figured it out just yet.

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AngryData
A decent article, not pefect but well done. Too often is wildlife, forestry
and agricultural sciences tainted with the general populous's biases and
misinformation about what is eco-friendly or green despite most people have
almost zero experience in any relevant fields. People get taught some
simplistic model or ideal as children and never get taught anything beyond
that, so they mistakenly believe that they learned all the important and
relevant parts to complete the picture. But in reality 9/10 people have never
grown more than a few lawn weeds or an extremely hardy house plant that you
have to actively attempt to kill. Add in some mass media fluff pieces and
bullshit targeted political ads and you got a whole pool of nonsense shielded
under the guise of 'common knowledge.'

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mooreds
For a book length version of how soil can help the environment in many ways, I
suggest "The Soil Will Save Us". [http://www.kristinohlson.com/books/soil-
will-save-us](http://www.kristinohlson.com/books/soil-will-save-us)

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murrayb
Thanks for the recommendation, just ordered a copy for my wife as a Christmas
present. She's a horticulturalist so I think she will love it.

Hacker News accidental Christmas gift shopping tips?

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JulianMorrison
Aside, but Terra Preta is also well worth looking at, being something that can
be easily made by human intervention, improves soil, and permanently
sequesters carbon in a form that doesn't break down on any short timescale.

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triodan
Doesn't the account in the article run counter to the narrative that cows are
massive greenhouse gas producers? Is there an alternative to grazing that
would not require cows?

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rebuilder
There's the question of what the cows are fed. AFAIK, grazing isn't how most
cows feed these days, and the high methane output may have to do with the feed
they're given instead of grass. There was a post here some time ago about
feeding cows algae, and that also reducing methane output significantly.

That said, even if grazing does result in a net capture if carbon, that
doesn't mean that the problems associated with eating beef like we do go away.
There's not enough pasture to produce the amounts of meat factory farming puts
out.

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strainer
Ive nabbed the cover photograph of a big steaming pile of dirt to fertilize my
desktop environment with - its splendid :D

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cjsawyer
It reminds me a little too much of my family’s cattle ranch. No thanks!

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strainer
I can appreciate, but will see how long it keeps its charm.

...I hardly ever see my desktop anyway.

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fouc
Brown is a great colour.

~~~
strainer
I wouldn't like to do without it. Its not so often I come across a
professionally composed picture of a big steaming pile of plant food.

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scumblr
I love reading about clever ideas like this, but at the same time, I'm leery
of the notion that we can fix the climate at the last minute, a narrative that
stems from the late capitalist imperative to innovate. We don't need to
innovate to find a solution; we need to act.

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ars
> we need to act

What actions are you suggesting?

And keep in mind that any action that reduces standard of living will cause
deaths, and ultimately more emissions because people won't have spare more for
environmental causes.

So bearing that in mind, what actions are you suggesting?

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AnthonyMouse
Tax carbon, use the money to fund a UBI. The UBI increases standard of living
as much or more than a carbon tax in the same amount reduces it. The carbon
tax itself also promotes living closer to work over having a longer commute,
which also improves standard of living by reducing the amount of time
unproductively spent commuting. (We could also reduce carbon/commuting further
by constructing more high density urban housing.) Reducing oil consumption
reduces resources sent to antagonistic OPEC member states, leaving those
resources here to improve standard of living as well.

This is before we get to the benefits of having less climate change.

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majortennis
Sadly not about Keanus latest adventures

