
The Growth Hacker Movement Is Poisonous - stevenklein
http://blog.statuspage.io/the-growth-hacker-movement-is-poisonous
======
ajross
I really want this to be true. I will say that as someone with a corporate job
outside the actual startup community, I really miss the days of "Make
something people want", and "Ramen profitable" (does anyone even _remember_
ramen profitability anymore?). It really does seem that the community has sold
itself out to a process aimed at driving multiround funding toward an
acquisition event and that it's lost sight of the fun of making actual
products.

But my fear is that, no, "growth hacking" really is the path to success in
this world; and that all the ramen was just something that amounts to a
marketing gimick to get the bubble off the ground...

~~~
sliverstorm
_does anyone even remember ramen profitability anymore?_

Interesting thought. If the standard mode is now to get VCs and angels to plow
cash into your venture, is anybody actually depending on the profits of their
venture to eat anymore?

~~~
ahoyhere
Yes, lots of us are. The trick is, we've mostly given up on HN. First of all
because we got tired of the "lifestyle business" sneer/smear. Second there is
almost no content here for us any more.

In May, I organized a 100% bootstrapped product conference:
[http://baconbiz.com](http://baconbiz.com). We had 16 speakers, out of a total
of 65 people. (All lightning speakers bought their own tickets.) Many traveled
for hours to attend.

Why? Who? What happened?

Our trailer:
[http://cheerful.wistia.com/medias/i8my1fqcyt](http://cheerful.wistia.com/medias/i8my1fqcyt)

Once we get all the conf videos posted, we'll be working on a
discussion/community site for product bootstrappers as well, to fill the hole
left by the demise of the early HN experience.

In true bootstrap fashion, we ditched the hotel ballroom and held the event in
our office. Sponsors just paid for our "after" party (on 1st night, Thursday,
instead of Friday, to save costs.) The conf itself was "ramen profitable."

~~~
porter
kinda like micropreneur.com?

~~~
scarybootstrap
Nope, like HN (free, public) but specifically for content related to
bootstrapping and business only. It's for the community, not a business
itself. I don't need another business.

I got hellbanned for just talking about it above! So that's exciting. Let's
see how long this comment lasts.

~~~
eitland
I think the reason for the ban was comments in another thread.

Now, make a note of your new nick. Sad to se the old one go as it was easily
recognizable.

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moocowduckquack
<title> _n_ is really bad</title>

<body>we actually think _n_ is good, but we feel it is getting devalued now it
is popular<p>discuss</body>

~~~
StavrosK
Please close your <p>.</p>

~~~
cheapsteak
Incidentally, Google's style guide actually recommends omitting optional tags
such as the closing </p>

[http://google-
styleguide.googlecode.com/svn/trunk/htmlcssgui...](http://google-
styleguide.googlecode.com/svn/trunk/htmlcssguide.xml?showone=Optional_Tags#Optional_Tags)

------
BigChiefSmokem
Startups now a days are just a cheap(ish) way to conduct R&D for big corps.

Just invest a little money around town with your big-corp buddies and then bid
for the best products that come out of it. All other startup losers can
continue eating their ramen until they age out of the "system" (ie grow up and
get a family) and go to work for said Big Corp, Inc. until "retirement" (the
day before you die).

But yeah, I'm being cynical too.

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hvass
I disagree. Growth hacking is not tactics, it's a different way to think about
marketing and it completely doesn't take away the focus on building a
remarkable product. The book Growth Hacker Marketing: A Primer begins with the
importance of PMF and marketing getting embedded in Product Development.

I do agree however that the '101 tactics to growthack' are mostly B.S. and
take away from the way to think about it.

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LandoCalrissian
I think Growth Hacker debases the work hacker more than anything else...

~~~
kumarski
I prefer to call myself a link-builder. This seems more accurate. Growth
Hacker is loaded with too much controversy and hogwash.

~~~
moocowduckquack
Hmm.. Maybe after a heavy dinner.

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micahroberson
I think the most important thing to remember is that the goal of growth
hacking is to get growth and get more users. The 652 Actionable Growth Hacks
You Can Do Today! type articles lose sight of that and end up with the goal of
growth hacking to growth hack.

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adjunct1234
viddy, socialCam, BranchOut, DoAlbums all used FB open graph when you could
report on content consumption which created fast viral loops (Viral
coefficient >1 ), even todays best growth hacking is going to find it hard to
produce such results, basically retention is key.... if you have retention on
small scale only then do growth hacking!

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krmmalik
Exactly what I've been saying for the past few months. It's just another fad.

~~~
stevenklein
I don't actually think it's a fad per se - startups will always be looking for
new ways to drive growth. The media hype will die down when the next job title
is invented but growing the customer/user base will always be the #1 problem
startups face.

~~~
ChuckMcM
I think you should lead with that next time rather than the link-baity title.
The number one thing "startups" must understand (and that is everything from Y
combinator to food truck) is how are they going to find customers, how are
they going to convince those customers to use their startup, and how much is
that going to cost per customer. "Growth Hacker" is just a meme, but it is a
cherished meme by some, and trying to acquire readers by shooting their meme
(or threatening too) is not a durable way to get readers. Just like selling
cheap imported stuff as a loss leader at a store doesn't make for life long
customers.

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wmf
Speaking of not creating value, repetitive advice blogging is poisonous.

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stevenklein
happy to elaborate and discuss

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jacal
When your self-hype-double-speak stops paying the tabs for the checks your
work can't cash, change the name, it's all the same... a sucker a minute, so
you better sugar up another stick. Follow the money behind a dream. Suck it
dry. Rinse, repeat.

