
Comcast Tries to Derail Fort Collins Community Broadband - ohjeez
http://www.dslreports.com/shownews/Comcast-Tries-to-Derail-Fort-Collins-Community-Broadband-140604
======
patrickg_zill
So the info from people I know who live in Longmont, was that Comcast was as
sleazy as their reputation in dealing with the city.

Comcast executives said in statements to city council that it was physically
impossible to deliver higher bandwidth over the existing cable. Edit to add:
now over the existing cable they are offering higher speeds. YES, that same
cable that pre competition, they stated could not handle higherspeeds.

When Longmont decided to proceed with their own network, lots of FUD from
Comcast both before it was successfully delivered and after, but everyone who
has it, loves it. And it very rarely goes down.

Comcast then tried to say that they had exclusive contracts with the
landlords... but under CO law such restrictions placed on tenants are illegal.

Etc. Etc.

~~~
fludlight
> Comcast then tried to say that they had exclusive contracts with the
> landlords... but under CO law such restrictions placed on tenants are
> illegal.

We could use such a law in California.

~~~
youdontneedit
You don't need one! Exclusive telecom provider agreements with multiple-
dwelling units (MDUs) have been prohibited federally since 2009.

Now, it's a fair bet that the current FCC leadership will flip on this - they
published a "Notice of Inquiry" to "seek comment" on what they're now calling
"multiple tenant environments" earlier this year:
[https://apps.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DOC-345161A1.p...](https://apps.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DOC-345161A1.pdf)

But for now, exclusive provider agreements like this are not actually
enforceable.

~~~
craftyguy
> have been prohibited federally since 2009.

Well, for now, at least. I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if the current
clowns in office reverse it

~~~
tzakrajs
Hey those clowns went to Ivy league schools in some cases! Best clown college
ever?

------
bproven
Comcast did the same thing to Longmont CO about 3-4 years ago. Luckily the
local residents were not fooled:
[https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2014/11/19/longmo...](https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2014/11/19/longmont-
internet-service/19294335/)

I am a former resident of FC - I hope they are able to put a little
competition to Comcast.

~~~
Top19
Those type of executives will be going to jail soon enough.

There is a theory, I think first proposed by Arthur Schlesinger Jr (who won
two Pulitzer prizes, had an equally renowned father, and was one of Kennedy’s
top advisors) that American history tends to move in 80 year cycles divided
into two forty year periods or so. Every 40 years US society shifts from
capitalism and individualism to community and strong federal government.
Neither period is inherently bad, but it’s just that capitalism and democracy
don’t coexist as much as rule independently, taking turns.

Schlesinger dated the capitalism period to 1980 starting with Ronald Reagan.
That means it should end in 2020 or so.

For all the crimes that fall out of the statue of limitations, I can imagine,
not necessarily in a good way and probably will be frowned upon by later
historians, that McCarthy-style commissions will be set up and these
executives blacklisted from business.

~~~
slavik81
> American history tends to move in 80 year cycles divided into two forty year
> periods or so

~80 years ago was World War 2.

~80 years before that was the US Civil War.

~80 years before that was the American Revolution.

I'm hoping this time around will be a little more boring. The previous events
look like a little too much excitement for my taste.

~~~
PakG1
Amazingly and coincidentally enough, when was the last time you had a
president where you were actually worried a multi-regional war might start?

~~~
dredmorbius
Truman, Kennedy, Johnson, Nixon, Reagan, Bush Jr., Trump.

Noting the exceptions: Eisenhower, Carter, Bush Sr., Clinton, Obama.

------
Chardok
_But Colorado is unique in that town and cities in the state have been able to
vote locally on whether to overturn this ISP-lobbying-for-law_

Once again Colorado has impressed me on the level of pragmatism they show in
their state laws. They have been looking very politically healthy compared to
the rest of the US, in my opinion, and I think it is going to pay off for them
in the near future.

~~~
heroprotagonist
We have a lot of citizen involvement. You see it in these kind of local
activities and overrides, but it goes to the state level ballot initiatives as
well.

Sadly, there are some inroads against it. In a rare show of bipartisanship,
both the Republican and Democratic parties supported this 'Raise the Bar'
initiative to make it more difficult to add initiatives to the state ballot.
It doesn't remove the right, but it requires a lot more organization by
requiring 2% voter signatures from _each state district_ within a 60 day
collection window.

It sucks, but I'm not too distraught. A little more authority was ceded to the
political parties but I still have faith that the citizenry are active and
involved. We don't all believe the same thing (it's a swing state), but at
least we act.

What I absolutely love is the freedom to be independent. As an independent
voter, I can vote in the primary for any of the political parties, as long as
I only vote once. I don't need to pre-register for that party to be eligible.
There are a lot of other improvements to the electoral process we could
potentially make, but I'm glad we at least pulled down this low hanging fruit
as a first step.

~~~
ouid
2% from each district sounds like an absurdly high barrier. Can you imagine
how hard it would be to hire enough people just to say hello to 2% of Colorado
in 60 days? I think you're underestimating the magnitude of this.

~~~
sharkmerry
It does seem like a lot but I havent done canvassing before

5.5 mil people about 110k signatures.

Colorado only has 7 districts, 2 (eastside and westside of the state) comprise
of almost 40% of the landmass each. 1 district to the north of denver and one
to the south. 3 that make up the denver metropolis.

It would be alot but its the 2 outside districts that probably would be the
toughest to get

~~~
heroprotagonist
Perhaps I should have clarified that to 'state senate districts', of which
there are 35.

[https://www.census.gov/geo/maps-
data/maps/sldu/st08_co.html](https://www.census.gov/geo/maps-
data/maps/sldu/st08_co.html)

------
drewg123
Sometimes just faking Comcast out with the threat of doing a competing service
is helpful.

The president of the HOA in the neighborhood next to mine was sick of poor
service from Comcast, and put a neighborhood broadband proposal on their HOA
association agenda. Comcast (the only choice for wired broadband here) got
wind of it, and immediately started upgrading their infrastructure and digging
new fiber to the curb. Now they have faster and more reliable service than we
do.

~~~
danesparza
If you could post details of the events leading up to this it might be useful
for other neighborhoods...

------
danesparza
WOW. The really revealing quote in this article is this:

"But it remains easier and cheaper for companies like Comcast and AT&T, with
the help of groups like ALEC, to instead convince clueless lawmakers to pass
laws restricting your right to determine for yourself how your money gets
spent, and what it gets spent on."

I then googled "ALEC" (and looked past the Alec Baldwin twitter scandal of the
day) and was amazed to discover a shadowy group that steers local legislation
just about everywhere. Holy crap!

~~~
nanodeath
13th has a bit on ALEC, or here's a clip:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=buO1KubTfQo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=buO1KubTfQo)

------
irickt
This linked article has much more reporting:
[https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/article/a37v4z/big-
teleco...](https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/article/a37v4z/big-telecom-
spent-dollar200000-to-try-to-prevent-a-colorado-town-from-even-talking-about-
a-city-run-internet)

------
germinalphrase
How realistic is the idea of creating commmunity/neighborhood level wireless
networks to sidestep anti-consumer manipulation?

Anyone tried to do so?

~~~
x0x0
There's at least two people on HN that operate community wired networks. I
have my notes on the wrong computer, but you could probably find them with
search. The economics sound not great.

Fixed wireless may have nicer economics with the right geography. My parents
use it on a farm. I doubt you're going to be able to stream HD netflix/amazon
over it through.

~~~
robterrell
Since the Santa Rosa fires, I have been trying to figure out some combination
of community broadband and/or mesh network that would provide service during
and after emergencies.

Our fire chief lives in Santa Rosa (and lost his house) and his description of
the incredible chaos caused by a lack of communications was heartbreaking.
i.e. People were evacuated to hospitals that were in the process of being
evacuated.

I wish there was a way to run a mesh network on a USB stick Pi Zero sort of
thing. Just spread them around town and have a wifi network for when shit gets
bad.

~~~
sliverstorm
Rather than giving full internet connectivity, some kind of local minimal bbs
might be both more feasible and just as handy.

You could maybe link nodes with ham digital radio, and serve clients with
wifi. Each node would have a mirror of the bbs and sync changes.

------
newshorts
Wait...

Aren’t monopolies illegal? I was under the impression they were, but maybe I’m
wrong to assume that.

~~~
deathanatos
I think we're still (politically) in the phase of convincing people that cable
companies are both a monopoly, and an abusive one.

E.g., here in the Bay Area, I have a choice in my area to go with AT&T[1] for
_Internet_ connectivity, but IIRC, they don't meet the FCC's definition of
"broadband", so really, for _broadband_ Internet access, my only choice is
Comcast. (Now, the FCC was recently trying to re-write the definition of
broadband s.t. mobile connectivity could count, but that's such an absurd
stretch of the imagination when discussing the market of high-speed Internet
access.)

While there is also TWC, I've found that where TWC exists, typically they also
enjoy a similar status.

Chattanooga, TN, interestingly, offers ~50x the speed for the same price as
Comcast here.

As for having abused their status,

[http://www.tennessean.com/story/news/local/2016/10/25/comcas...](http://www.tennessean.com/story/news/local/2016/10/25/comcast-
sues-metro-over-google-fiber-backed-pole-otmr-
ordinance/92748490/?from=global&sessionKey=&autologin=)

[https://www.theverge.com/2015/5/1/8530403/chattanooga-
comcas...](https://www.theverge.com/2015/5/1/8530403/chattanooga-comcast-fcc-
high-speed-internet-gigabit)

[1]: AT&T also has a history of disregarding consumer privacy (e.g.,
[https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/07/08/att-selling-
data_n...](https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/07/08/att-selling-
data_n_3561263.html)), so I avoid them for that, too.

~~~
innesinnes
[https://www.wired.com/story/san-francisco-municipal-
fiber/](https://www.wired.com/story/san-francisco-municipal-fiber/)

------
pascalxus
It's understandable that Comcast wants to shut down the competition. They know
how much customers hate them. If any competition shows up, Comcast is history.

------
visarga
This is the corresponding 'FU Comcast Thread' from reddit.

[https://www.reddit.com/r/technology/comments/792tq3/comcast_...](https://www.reddit.com/r/technology/comments/792tq3/comcast_tries_to_derail_fort_collins_community/?utm_content=comments&utm_medium=front&utm_source=reddit&utm_name=technology)

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user-on1
how to encourage other cities to get such alternate broadband options? can
colorado guide the rest of the cities and states to go through similar
initiatives?

------
jxramos
Wow, I never even knew something like this was an option on the table! Makes
me think of open source infrastructure. So what exactly does it take to get
independent broadband?

