
Some Blizzard employees are dreading BlizzCon - partingshots
https://www.latimes.com/business/story/2019-10-31/blizzard-employees-blizzcon-protests
======
gameswithgo
Corporations being tone deaf is a regular thing, but the evoking of "Every
Voice Matters" so often after shutting down, and punishing, champions of their
tournaments (it has happened twice! remember) for supporting a good cause is
of historic levels.

Many people seem to think you can't be professional and allow things like
this, but you absolutely can. You can let someone who wins a tournament have a
few seconds to say something personal, we see this all the time in sports.
Lance Armstrong was allowed to lie while disparaging all of the people who
were correctly accusing him, Peter Sagan was allowed to make a wonderful
political message.

When sports bodies crack down on this in the name of 'professionalism',
history does not judge them kindly:

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1968_Olympics_Black_Power_salu...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1968_Olympics_Black_Power_salute)

~~~
magashna
It's the difference between a Walmart, which everyone expects to be pretty low
ethically, and Blizzard, which has been using things like LGBT in their
marketing (showing their lead Overwatch character as gay [outside of China at
least]).

You can't have it both ways. You're either progressive in marketing and
action, or you're a hypocrite and deserve the market's backlash when you show
your greed over ethics. It's why Lebron got pummeled so hard for his HK
remarks.

~~~
yourbandsucks
If a streamer had said something, for example, anti-LGBT, Blizzard would have
shut them down the same way and everyone would be applauding.

Depending on your personal politics, any given corporate action is either
'brave, standing up for principles' or 'obviously a sellout to the corrupt bad
guys'.

~~~
TulliusCicero
"If they had done something good instead of bad, I bet you'd be cheering them
on!"

Yes, brilliant catch there, you really got us.

~~~
yourbandsucks
'Good' and 'bad' in your sentence are subjective. Millions of mainland Chinese
Blizzard customers feel differently on the HK issue than you do.

You can think that they're totally, obviously wrong, but that's politics.

~~~
zentiggr
I think it's instructive to realize that mainland Chinese people are being fed
state propaganda about "rioters" destroying HK and demanding independence,
thus their opinions should be weighted lesser on the issue accordingly.

The sparse examples I've seen of Chinese people actually being exposed to the
reality in HK and being surprised, tells me the state media is being effective
in its Ministry of Truth role.

~~~
knzhou
Honest question: have you personally seen the "propaganda" of the other side?
If you've only seen one side, how are you so completely sure you know which
one is right?

~~~
FussyZeus
As a general rule, if millions of people are upset enough about something to
take to the streets and risk being injured or killed by the police, it's a
pretty safe bet that something in their government is fucked and in need of
fixing.

~~~
knzhou
If you apply this consistently, you should also be sure that Brexiteers, the
yellow vest protestors, and the Catalonian independent movement show that
European government is fucked. (If you do, I respect that, but if you don't,
consider why you think some mass anti-government protests are more sympathetic
than others.)

~~~
dsfyu404ed
>you should also be sure that Brexiteers, the yellow vest protestors, and the
Catalonian independent movement show that European government is fucked.

That's exactly what they show.

Whether these groups favored solutions to the fuck-ness are the correct
solutions totally tangential to that. When people take to the streets
something ain't right.

~~~
FussyZeus
> Whether these groups favored solutions to the fuck-ness are the correct
> solutions totally tangential to that. When people take to the streets
> something ain't right.

This, exactly. It takes a lot to get people to resort to civil unrest. I wish
it was respected as being that, the last resort of a populace losing faith in
it's leadership, and not derided as it is so often as just people who disagree
with something. Protests should be a sign of not just disagreement but
profound disgust not just for what is being done, but for the processes and
the system that _permitted it to happen in the first place_.

------
chronotis
When I worked at Blizzard at the beginning of the decade, it was the first
"corporation" I'd worked at where I sincerely felt and believed that the
espoused values were authentically reflected in decisions and actions. The
edges were starting to fray a little bit around 2012-13, as veterans of the
original Blizzard slowly began moving on to other things (or retiring
altogether).

There followed a steady trickle of Activision staff into the holes left by the
departed, which IMHO was also reflected in gradual shifts in recruiting
practices. Morhaime's departure was the final farewell. I can't say what
Blizzard's culture is today, but I'm confident that Every Voice Matters isn't
what it used to be.

~~~
vvanders
Yeah, as an ex-gamedev as well there's a large divide between the values a
devshop tends to hold and the publisher that finances your project. I've yet
to see a studio acqui-hire that doesn't eventually head south as the
publishing culture seeps into the previously independent company.

~~~
SeanBoocock
You say that as if that is always a top down transformation, and not the
result of entrepreneurial founders losing motivation or leaving after a lockup
period. Regardless of cultural differences or how the transition is handled,
the fact that a studio is no longer an independent entity affects how you view
your work and how much value you can extract from a commercial success.

There are some high profile examples of studio acquisitions I’ve had insight
into where the publisher has been blamed for perceived changes in a studio’s
output post-acquisition. The reality on the ground was almost the inverse: the
publisher gave the acquired studio a great amount of autonomy and runway, even
more than than internal studios, and the acquired studio struggled in an
environment where they had relatively more freedom than they did pre-
acquisition. It let bad habits fester and poor managers calcify in roles they
never could have survived in during scrappier times.

~~~
vvanders
Transitions are hard, and I'm sure there's definitely that failure case.

However if you look at EA and the acquire/in-house cycle they go through every
4-5 years, there's no way you can hope to be stable under those circumstances.
Ditto Microsoft and the 2-3 cycles they went through with similar disasters.

Fundamentally the two types of companies have different goals which drive
their culture. Publishers exist to make money, pure and simple. They diversify
risk by supporting multiple developers but at the end of the day they want to
see growth and cash. A developer on the other hand may be happy staying mostly
cash-neutral as long as it keeps them afloat to keep creating the
art/experience that drives them.

I'd argue that those two cultures are at distinct odds(based on what I saw
play out when I was in the industry) and trying to merge them leads to
disaster.

------
ineedasername
They should be dreading it. For an American company, or really any non-Chinese
company to bow down to China's censorship regime is unacceptable. I hope
Congress doesn't let the issue die. It's an increasing trend that will be
harder to curtail the longer it persists.

~~~
RomanBob
It's a private company. How is it unacceptable for them to run the company
whichever way they want?

~~~
Sohcahtoa82
You're confusing what is _legally_ acceptable versus what is _morally_
acceptable.

~~~
RomanBob
the parent asks for congress to intervene.

why is it immoral to play by the rules of a country in order to access that
country's population? the country's people should decide for themselves how
they should be governed. or do you think you know better?

~~~
Sohcahtoa82
Again, you're continuing to insist that morality and legality are equivalent.

In some countries, beating your wife is completely legal. Certainly you
wouldn't argue that it's moral.

Laws aren't written by average people, they're written by politicians who do
immoral things and get away with it. They allow immorality for their own
benefits.

------
cryptofits
I must say that because of Blizzard actions there was x50 more coverage for
the people of HK, so in some strange way, I'm glad they did it

~~~
kuroikyu
The Streisand effect strikes again!

------
helpPeople
How did Blizzard fail in PR where Apple succeeded?

They both were anti Hong Kong, but few remember and care Apple's actions.

Asking in case I ever F up and need to go damage control.

~~~
tenpies
Key differences:

* Apple's decision hurts vast groups of people, not individuals. People have problems emphasizing with huge groups (e.g. Hong Kongers, Ulghurs, Muslims, Catholics) but are very good as emphasizing with individuals. This is why propaganda aimed at appealing to emotion always focus on individuals: especially children/women. Blizzard went after not just individuals, but tournament winners/players.

* Apple's product is less liquid than Blizzard's. I can stop playing instantly. I can unsubscribe from WoW instantly. Selling my phone and moving to another platform is much harder. The alternative offerings are also all extremely pro-Chinese Party, so even if I went off-Apple for HK reasons, I am just making the problem worst. With games, there is competition and there is no lack of good games in each category (save perhaps RTS, but SC2 is tiny for Blizzard).

~~~
smolder
I think you meant to write empathizing rather than emphasizing.

------
creaghpatr
>“BlizzCon is sort of like the Christmas of Blizzard,” one staffer said.

More like the Singles Day of Blizzard now.

------
eternalny1
Blizzard has a problem.

World of Warcraft is growing stale and they seem to not have a replacement (as
far as zero leaks).

Overwatch has been a big success and leaks suggest Overwatch 2 with more PVE.

That's fine and all but that's not going to be the cash-cow that WoW was for
them. I was a dedicated player since launch but left after Legion and won't be
returning.

~~~
piptastic
World of Warcraft just had a classic release, which I would hardly call stale.

[https://www.newsweek.com/world-warcraft-subscriptions-
triple...](https://www.newsweek.com/world-warcraft-subscriptions-triple-
classic-release-1461086)

~~~
MLpractitioner
Ironic we are calling not stale a company that rereleases a game after 15
years

------
duxup
Ultimately this seems like a failure in leadership.

It took four days for a response and then it was sort of half a response.

Individual employees now go and suffer the consequences on the front lines.

~~~
the_duke
This was a pretty standard corporate PR tactic.

* make deleting accounts hard due to "technical difficulties"

* Wait until late Friday night to put out a press release, so publications are less likely to pick it up.

* Have the release contain a meaningless non-apology

* wait for a bit until everyone moves on to the next thing

The outcry was largely contained to a small Reddit and hardcore fan bubble.

The stock didn't suffer at all.

Blizzcon could be interesting though.

~~~
hrktb
> The outcry was largely contained to a small Reddit and hardcore fan bubble.

Didn’t they cancel all their PR marketing for Overwatch coming to the switch ?

Aside from existing fan outcry, it seems to me having them quiet their PR
moves while entering holiday season would be the bigger consequences.

I don’t know for the small bubble, or we should at least include tech sites
and youtube gaming channels in the bubble.

------
jimbob45
I wonder how different this might have been if he'd instead shouted, "MAGA!".
I imagine the next election will present some similar situations for companies
to traverse.

------
huffmsa
I'm hoping id Software works a potshot into whatever they're doing for Doom

~~~
foxX
Aaah, sweet, sweet Bethesda. I would look somewhere else, to be fair.

~~~
huffmsa
Wait got my wires crossed. I was thinking id was a subsidiary of Blizzard.

They're actually Bethesda/Zenimax.

Disregard the GP

~~~
rasz
At least with Zenimax there is no ambiguity about being evil.

------
berbec
Blizzcon 2019: Nothing is more entertaining than a train wreck

------
EpicEng
And Blizz just can't stop stepping in it.

[https://www.invenglobal.com/articles/9488/wow-community-
feel...](https://www.invenglobal.com/articles/9488/wow-community-feels-toyed-
with-amid-blizzcon-prize-pools)

Before people chime in with "but they technically didn't say that they would
add the toy revenue on top", that is exactly how it is typically done by other
companies in the same situation. They made a ton of money and didn't have to
put up a dime of their own.

Who exactly is working PR over there?

------
liquidify
I keep seeing job postings from Blizzard for software engineers. I hope people
are ignoring them, just as I am.

------
backtoyoujim
good and good.

a lot of the blizzard developer interactions with players at blizzcon has been
the developers acting like condescending, down-talking jerks to players during
q&a.

let's see those egos take what they like to dish out.

~~~
loktarogar
there's thousands of devs/staff at blizzard, not just the handful that
interact with the public.

~~~
jeffdavis
So why don't they walk out of work until Bizzard makes a change?

~~~
loktarogar
put yourself in their shoes. you're in the games industry, so your pay isn't
fantastic but you're doing what you love.

say this is the issue that makes you want to walk out. you'd have to accept
that this might mean losing not only your dream job, but a job full-stop -
games is a very competitive industry and you might have a long period of
unemployment.

this would have to be a "I would give up my career in the games industry for
this" issue. it is for some. it's not for others.

~~~
jeffdavis
What's the alternative? It's not like Blizzard has given any meaningful
apology or done anything to remedy the situation.

All customers can do is boycott and protest. Nothing else will cause any
change in behavior. Unfortunately, employees will be hurt in the process.

Wouldn't it be better for employees to stage a big moment now, force Blizzard
to backpedal, and resume being a game company sooner? A long, drawn out thing
is worse for everyone.

~~~
loktarogar
> What's the alternative?

keep working, hope that blizzard reverses course.

this is the first seriously backwards move in 30 years of the company afaik.
quitting immediately isn't the answer to your average employee.

and please reread what I wrote. I know many blizzard employees. as much as it
hurts them to see what their company did, quitting simply can't be an option
to them. not in a massive immediate show of support. not everyone can afford
to be political.

~~~
jeffdavis
A "walk out" is a form of protest that doesn't mean quitting. It does risk
being fired, but the risk is pretty low in this case.

~~~
loktarogar
A walk out when half their colleagues got let go earlier this year is pretty
risky.

------
Asooka
It all returns to nothing. It all comes tumbling down, tumbling down, tumbling
down...

Blizzard had a good run. I don't doubt the company name itself will go on as a
branding on a whole slew of rehashes and remakes, like a little label to be
stuck on a reskin of an original idea from 15 years ago that's been crunched,
mashed and reinterpreted as a mishmash of whatever individual elements are
deemed popular and "the reason X was a success". But for me, it's over.
Blizzard is no more. I would go so far as to say that the company should lose
the Blizzard trademark given how far off they are from what that name
originally stood for.

------
skilled
I expect quite a bit of drama during this event. The actions since last
Blizzcon have left a sour taste in many people's mouths.

~~~
GuB-42
And that includes last Blizzcon itself, when they announced Diablo Immortal.

------
mikenew
I'm at the convention center now. So far I havent seen anything unusual. Not
even a Hong Kong t-shirt.

Tickets were sold out long before the controversy hit. Obviously there are a
lot of us die-hard fans that are upset, but I dont think there's many people
here with the intention of causing trouble.

------
wnevets
Unfortunately it probably won't be too bad, most blizzard fans have already
moved on and are back to giving blizzard/activision money.

------
elisto
Major lesson: Don't put non-trained employees to do PR/client-facing soon
after they were mentally drained by an action you took.

------
ddevault
Paywall workaround?

~~~
errantspark
disable JS

it's in the Dev Tool options (F1) in Chrome

~~~
ddevault
Cheers, thanks!

~~~
Sohcahtoa82
Alternatively, for Firefox users, switch to Reader mode.

------
w-j-w
As someone who likes watching public events go horribly wrong, I have never
been so excited for a videogame convention.

~~~
Shivetya
I just find it disappointing that gamers are far better at organizing and
pressuring a company than other product users. Apple and Tesla both have
gotten a near free pass with Apple only raising some ire when they knocked
down an app but it blew right over very quickly. Perhaps gamers just have more
time and more outlets to get attention?

What will be interesting is if these people even get in and how quickly they
are put out when they do. If they are silent, just in costume, will that
provoke a response as well?

~~~
willis936
See what a little competition buys you? Activision players can always go to
Ubisoft or EA. But the dirty little secret that everyone's wising up to is
that they all suck and indie games are better than AAA in ways that matter to
many people.

When staring down an existential crisis your clients can and will push you
around for misbehaving, even if that misbehaving is out of a desire to get out
of said existential crisis.

Put shortly: fuck corporations.

~~~
lliamander
I discovered about 12 years ago that WoW was essentially a slot machine in
it's construction (reward schedules, rest XP, etc) designed to keep you
engaged without entertaining you.

I've had far more fun playing _Battle for Wesnoth_ than I ever did playing
WoW.

