
Windows 10 Free Upgrade Available in 190 Countries Today - Garbage
http://blogs.windows.com/bloggingwindows/2015/07/28/windows-10-free-upgrade-available-in-190-countries-today/
======
skrebbel
I've been on the "insider preview" for a few weeks now, and I must say that I
think Windows 10 is an absolutely amazing OS. Definitely the best Windows I've
ever used. Also the best desktop OS I've ever used, but I hope you'll believe
me about the "best Windows" even if you can't imagine why a developer would
possible want to run something other than $YOUR_FAVOURITE_UNIX.

If Windows 10 is as well-received as I expect it will, this might really
impact Microsoft's position on phones as well. A core feature of Windows 10 is
an app store that doesn't suck, with apps that can easily be used on devices
that _don 't_ resemble tablets. Windows 8 really had this wrong, and 10 fixes
it. I think the Windows 10 store _might actually get used_.

I've seen a glimpse of that future with the mobile app of Dutch weather site
"Buienradar". They made a new Windows Phone app which totally rocks, to
replace an old extremely crappy one. I didn't understand why they invested in
an app ecosystem that is so clearly on the way down, until I found the exact
same app in the Windows 10 store - just larger and with more info on the same
screen. But it's very obviously the same codebase. My guess is they actually
wanted to make a Windows desktop app, but adding phone support was such a
minor extra investment (because of MS's "Universal app" thing) that they did
it, despite the abysmal market size of Windows Phone in the Netherlands.

~~~
ak217
My experience has been the opposite. To me Windows 10 is the continuation of
the 8/8.1 trainwreck, with the ridiculous Metro skins, a broken start menu,
the half-assed fragmentation of the UIs into Metro/non-Metro, ham-handed app
store/online services integrations, and various new features that do not work.
I'll be going back to Windows 7, in which at least the UI works. And really,
the only thing keeping me attached to the ecosystem is the PC games.

~~~
currysausage
_> a broken start menu_

I love Windows 7, but do you honestly think the Windows 7 start menu is _not_
broken? I believe we just got used to it over time.

In Windows 7, I can either have an unstructured list of "pinned" programs, or
I can manually categorize the real ("All programs") start menu.

Option 1 doesn't scale beyond ~15 items (I have 22 pinned programs and it's a
mess), and option 2 breaks whenever a program updates itself and puts new
links into the top level. Also, option 2 is not an option at all for 99,9% of
users, so it's quite obvious why MS wouldn't optimize for that use case.

The single thing that I like the most about Windows 8.1 machines is how I can
group programs on the start page. Now that it isn't fullscreen any more with
Windows 10, I am pretty much looking forward to it.

~~~
nsgi
Why don't you just search for what you're looking for?

~~~
TuringTest
Muscle memory is easier on the mind than name recall - it simply wastes less
brain cycles.

~~~
corin_
In my experience muscle memory is just as easy to pick up with typing the name
of an app than clicking - apps I use all the time I can open by typing their
name without thinking about what the name is, apps I don't use all the time I
find myself opening the metro start screen and wondering which will happen
first, remembering the name to type or spotting it in my tiles.

~~~
TuringTest
You're right. Though at least on Windows 7, typing to search apps in the start
menu was a miserable experience that takes dozens of seconds to find the
application you're looking for. I hope they have improved it in 10.

------
acqq
Note that the upgrade will remove your Windows built-in DVD player. The right
to play DVDs must be paid for every computer. You paid it when you bought the
Windows 7 or 8 that you'll maybe upgrade to 10. Now the upgrade to Windows 10
takes that feature away from you.

They apparently (the twitter message isn't actually the company statement)
plan to return it "sometime in the future" and "if it might be free or if it
will cost" is TBA:

[http://www.windowscentral.com/windows-10-will-include-
option...](http://www.windowscentral.com/windows-10-will-include-option-play-
dvd-movies-sometime-future)

The Media Player capabilities, if you have them in your Windows edition, will
be for ever deleted. Just so.

Moreover, note that the upgrade can reduce the functionality of your notebook:
Microsoft made the deal with the hardware producers about integrating hidden
partitions to allow the recovery from the hard disk, but the upgrade process
will just make sure that the Windows runs, not that your recovery from the
hard disk functionality, managed by each hardware vendor independently (based
on the recommendations from Microsoft) would be preserved.

I don't use the recovery mechanism, but I do use backup. When the recovery
partitions aren't right, the built in backup (which was kept from Windows 7)
doesn't work on Windows 8.1.

The same story happened with the transition from Windows 8 to Windows 8.1 (I
have such a notebook).

Anybody knows if the "Windows 7" style full disk backup survived in Windows
10?

~~~
inversionOf
_Note that the upgrade will remove your Windows built-in DVD player._

Windows 8.1 had no built in DVD player. Nor did Windows 7 Starter or Basic.
Further, I suspect it's a feature that the vast majority of people have never
used, exactly why Microsoft decided that they wouldn't subsidize the licensing
for no reason. This is a very 2002 discussion.

Not that your point isn't valid -- at least for those users who ever actually
tried playing a video DVD, and who had a supporting version of Windows -- it's
just pretty odd that such a comment sits at the very top of an enormous
technology event.

The Tesla doesn't come with a holder for my buggy whip.

~~~
ironoxide859
As a user I have issues with Windows removing a built-in DVD player. I'm one
of those dinosaurs who still watches his DVDs from his laptop. It was news to
me and I appreciate that it was at the top.

~~~
t0mbstone
But that's just the thing. They _didn 't_ remove it. I have literally never
been able to play DVDs in Windows without installing third party codecs or
programs.

~~~
ironoxide859
I've never had an issue playing on Windows 7 Media Player out of the box (I
skipped 8 and 8.1 chaos).

------
Aleman360
I work on the Start menu. It's just a UWP XAML app with Models and ViewModels
written in C++/Cx, as are most of the new Shell features and built-in apps--
although some of the newer ones, like Maps and Xbox, are in XAML/C#/.Net
Native. Even the UI frame of Edge is in XAML, and the new Office UWP apps are
too. I encourage everyone here to give UWP apps a shot; we dogfooded the dev
platform to ensure it was stable and fast, and XAML really is a pleasure to
use. It's come a long way since WPF.

~~~
tonyedgecombe
What is UWP?

~~~
Aleman360
[https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-
us/library/Dn894631.aspx](https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-
us/library/Dn894631.aspx)

"Universal Windows Platform". Lets you target every Windows 10 device with a
single app, from Raspberry Pi 2 to phone to PC's to Xbox One.

Apps are written in C++/C#/VB with XAML markup or JavaScript/HTML/CSS. Also
FYI, it takes a minimal amount of work to repackage an existing web app as a
UWP.

~~~
tonyedgecombe
Does that support Windows 7/8/8.1? If not I won't be able to adopt it for a
long time.

~~~
shmed
No it doesn't. Only works on win10 (phone, PC, tablet & surface hub for the
moment, but they are expanding it to hololens and xbox one).

~~~
frik
Even Avalon/WPF has been back ported from Vista to WinXP. Afaik, UWP is newer
release of WinRuntime (WinRT).

------
tdicola
Looking at the deprecated features that won't make it to Windows 10 I see:

> Solitaire, Minesweeper, and Hearts Games that come pre-installed on Windows
> 7 will be removed as part of installing the Windows 10 upgrade. Microsoft
> has released our version of Solitaire and Minesweeper called the “Microsoft
> Solitaire Collection” and “Microsoft Minesweeper.”

Does anyone else find it kind of sad that they killed off the old solitaire
and minesweeper games? Part of what made Windows great was its incredible
focus on backwards compatibility and it was always fun to load up solitaire,
minesweeper, etc. in all their classic win 32 glory just like they ran in
Windows 95.

The new games are weird microtransaction/subscription-based things that I'm
sure marketing folks are extremely proud of but seem to have killed a bit of
the soul of Windows. If nothing else the old games should have stayed in to
show people that yes it's still your old Windows and apps written years ago
will mostly just work.

~~~
veli_joza
I really don't care about this, why should we expect MS to support their 20
years old software? Back in '95 internet was not that common so it was nice to
have such time wasters built into the OS.

On the other hand, including Minecraft would be a really interesting decision.

~~~
tdicola
Because for years Microsoft built up a reputation for supporting old software
and old APIs. Read Raymond Chen's Old New Thing blog for some anecdotes about
the amazing lengths they would go internally to keep old software working.
Like with the classic game Sim City they realized its code was buggy and using
uninitialized memory, so the Windows team wrote a special case to detect when
Sim City runs and emulate an older compatible memory allocator. It's not
really clear if MS today cares about supporting software like they used to.

~~~
k-mcgrady
>> "Because for years Microsoft built up a reputation for supporting old
software and old APIs."

That's a reputation they need to lose. It was important at one time but has
been holding them back for years.

~~~
tdicola
Just like the start menu was holding them back and had to be removed in
Windows 8...

~~~
k-mcgrady
The start menu isn't old software/API's.

------
dhess
Anyone here know much about Windows licensing? This seems like a good
opportunity to ask.

I never run Windows on bare metal. I only run Windows on virtual machines on
my Mac desktop and Mac laptop; only for personal use; and only on the rare
occasion when I need to run the odd Windows-only application.

I would like to go legit this time around, but it's nigh-impossible to find
any specific documentation from Microsoft which states, in plain, simple
English, how I would go about getting the proper license to cover my use case.
I find this hard to believe as it's 2015 and certainly there must be countless
others who do the same as I (and at least a few of them here on HN).

The only official Microsoft document I can find about Windows licensing and
virtual machines pertains specifically to business use, and appears to be
focused on running Windows in a "Virtual Desktop Infrastructure" (VDI)
environment, so I don't believe it applies to me. (I confess I did not read
the entire document as it contains so much unfamiliar jargon that I have a
hard time parsing it past page one.)

Anyway, from what I can tell by gathering bits and pieces posted on various
forums by Microsoft community reps or third-party Microsoft "solution
providers," Microsoft expects me to buy a separate, full Windows license for
each virtual machine I create, for each host machine I run it on (i.e., M * N
licenses).

Can anybody here tell me whether that's correct? Because if that's correct,
Microsoft can go fly a kite.

~~~
toyg
_> Microsoft expects me to buy a separate, full Windows license for each
virtual machine I create_

That is indeed the case. Otherwise you can buy licenses meant for ISPs and
cloud-hosting providers. Your "personal use of multiple VMs" is simply not
contemplated. You could probably get by with a MSDN subscription, which gives
you some leeway.

~~~
e12e
The 2012 Server Datacenter Edition is a mere ~6000 USD and allows to run
unlimited VMs on up to two physical CPUs. Who ever claimed the licensing costs
made a real difference between Microsoft and Linux?

~~~
sudioStudio64
They only require a license for VM's that run Windows. You can run as many
non-windows VM's as you want on the free hyper-v server on as many procs as it
will run on.

~~~
e12e
Oh, I didn't mean to imply otherwise. But you generally won't have to pay for
a licence to run Linux or *bsd in a vm. I'd assume one would want/need to run
Windows software on windows (reactos/wine aside).

~~~
sudioStudio64
I dig it. Thanks for being polite. Cheers.

------
thescrewdriver
Be sure to read the licensing fine print about data collection for advertising
etc.

[https://edri.org/microsofts-new-small-print-how-your-
persona...](https://edri.org/microsofts-new-small-print-how-your-personal-
data-abused/)

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9966236](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9966236)

~~~
SmellyGeekBoy
I've been on the preview since the beginning, when I installed the supposedly
"final" build (10240?) about a week ago it ran through a wizard that allowed
me to disable this functionality.

~~~
thescrewdriver
Including the per-device unique id for advertisers?

~~~
logiclabs
Yes, although by default this is on (Express Setup). Customising the setup
allows you to disable it.

------
kozukumi
In case there are people wondering I am using Windows 10 Pro x64 and did the
following -

Downloaded ISO using the media creation tool at [1] then did an upgrade from
8.1 to 10 which complete just fine. I then booted from the USB drive I just
made, did a diskpart clean on the only drive in the machine then did a clean
install.

When prompted for a product key I pressed skip then when asked again during
the out-of-box experience I selected to do it later. I signed in with a local
account. I connected to the internet and it activated without any questions.
Yes it activated using NO product key.

It seems when you do the upgrade from a valid 7 or 8.1 install it stores the
hardware hash they generate on MS servers so when you then do a clean install
it generates the (same) hardware hash, sends it to MS activation servers and
sees it is already validated so it just activates you again. Very nice not
having to deal with horrible product keys!

[1] [https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-
download/windows10](https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-
download/windows10)

Edit: And so far it has been great. Stable and fast over the last 5 hours of
doing updates (fucking Office 2013 has like 2GB of updates after install!).

~~~
stinos
Any idea what would happen then if you skip the upgrade 7/8 -> 10 and start
with clean install? You need a key anyway? The same key as for Windows 7?

~~~
tdkl
The "key" works only when you updated from a Windows7/8 installation with that
key to Windows 10 once. It apparently saves a hardware id on their activation
server. After that you can cleanly install Windows 10 and skip the key entry
and it'll activate based on that hardware id.

What could be done if you change the hardware ? If you had a retail key, then
you'd probably need to install Windows 7/8 and upgrade to 10 again to repeat
the hardware id registering process, but I didn't notice anywhere if this was
tested.

------
woodson
Did anyone with a dual boot configuration already try the upgrade? This
article [1] suggests that, for once, you don't have to restore GRUB after the
upgrade.

[1] [http://answers.microsoft.com/en-
us/insider/wiki/insider_wint...](http://answers.microsoft.com/en-
us/insider/wiki/insider_wintp-insider_install/how-to-upgrade-a-dual-boot-
installation-of-windows/d7ca80ce-96b0-4f0a-9a8e-4038ded592b2)

~~~
nly
This really surprises me. The SHA2 code-signing hotfix released for Windows 7
a few months back won't even install if you dual boot. I still haven't
installed it.

------
donkeyd
Dear marketing people, please stop using "The best <thing only we make> ever".
If you make a new product it should be better than the previous version, it
it's not, you did something very wrong.

~~~
megablast
Maybe they are trying to say this will not be another Windows 8. Or Vista. Or
ME.

~~~
donkeyd
It's not about Microsoft in particular, it's about every tech company now
using this for every new release of an existing thing.

------
melling
Let's hope Windows 10 is a big hit with PC users. Consumers trade in those old
XP boxes and hundreds of millions take the free upgrade. Then maybe within 24
months lots of old IE's will fade away.

[https://www.netmarketshare.com/browser-market-
share.aspx?qpr...](https://www.netmarketshare.com/browser-market-
share.aspx?qprid=2&qpcustomd=0)

Edge appears to be a much better browser:
[https://html5test.com/results/desktop.html](https://html5test.com/results/desktop.html)

~~~
bad_user
The upgrade is not free for XP users.

~~~
melling
That's why I said trade in those XP boxes. New hardware has gotta seem nice
for them by now.

------
batou
I got the upgrade from 8.1 Pro last night:

1\. The OOBE experience ran twice. It rebooted half way through the first one
to apply updates and then I had to do it all again.

2\. It lost the product key and won't activate even though this is a genuine
copy from MSDN. I guess I have to wait for a key from MSDN later today. Not
end of the world but a pain point. If it isn't activated, hardly anything
works now.

3\. However that's all pointless as it hangs solid after 3-5 minutes reliably.
That's not enough time to even roll a single windows update in so I'm shafted.

This is a rock solid Lenovo X201 that has never had a single problem with any
Windows release. It hasn't crashed once since I bought it new.

Not impressed. Spent an hour rolling it back.

I imagine, considering this was quality well tested hardware, that this is
going to be nothing but hell for people. If even 1% of people have this
experience, the media will blow big time and I'd hope that they do.

Edit: on my Sony VPC-J1 AOI machine that fails with "Windows 10 upgrade
failed" after pissing around for an hour. At least that didn't hose the
machine.

------
zokier
Meanwhile actually trying to buy the damn thing seems nearly impossible. MS
rep on their store said that it might take couple of weeks until it becomes
available for purchase. On US store you can order physical copy but download
option is "coming soon". Just seems bit ridiculous...

------
kristofferR
Official ISO downloads: [https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-
download/windows10I...](https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-
download/windows10ISO)

~~~
abrookewood
Presumably you have to do an in-place upgrade if you use these? I can't see
any mention of what key I am supposed to use (from the reservation tool) if I
want to do a fresh install.

~~~
ionised
From what I understand you have to first do an in-place upgrade, which then
gives you access to your license key (via Windows system info or something
similar).

You can then use that to do a clean install.

 _EDIT_

I've just read contradictory information here;

[http://windows.microsoft.com/en-gb/windows-10/media-
creation...](http://windows.microsoft.com/en-gb/windows-10/media-creation-
tool-install?ocid=ms_wol_win10)

 _If you upgraded to Windows 10 on this PC by taking advantage of the free
upgrade offer and successfully activated Windows 10 on this PC in the past,
you won 't have a Windows 10 product key, and you can skip the product key
page by selecting the Skip button. Your PC will activate online automatically
so long as the same edition of Windows 10 was successfully activated on this
PC by using the free Windows 10 upgrade offer._

Which makes it sound like the version of Windows 10 you received as a free
upgrade from Windows 7/8 will not work on any other machine than the one you
first install on.

Which is unbelievably shit.

~~~
chrisan
> Which makes it sound like the version of Windows 10 you received as a free
> upgrade from Windows 7/8 will not work on any other machine than the one you
> first install on.

Any idea what defines a 'machine'? I gradually upgrade my PC. New video card
here, new SSD there, sometimes new CPU (and possibly motherboard)

~~~
bakies
Somewhere else in the thread it was mentioned it used the bios to determine if
it had been activated on the computer. So I would think a mobo replacement
would mess with the activation

~~~
wtallis
And what about when your machine _started_ with a retail motherboard that
doesn't have OEM Windows keys embedded in the firmware? What kind of signature
does it use for the initial registration?

------
lhecker
Does anybody else experience issues with Truecrypt 7.1a?

It displays

    
    
      X:\ is not accessible.
      Incorrect function.
    

and the Computer Manager displays the drive with the RAW type.

\- Even though the filesystem is intact (tested on another Windows 8.1
computer) and

\- chkdsk showing NO errors (yes that's right: it even shows the filesystem as
being NTFS).

Aside from that my UI/UX experience with Windows 10 is great and I'm really
happy. The above thing is a bummer though.

~~~
aparecido
UPDATE [SOLVED]: searching for this problem I stumbled into this thread:
[https://discussions.apple.com/thread/7045334?start=15&tstart...](https://discussions.apple.com/thread/7045334?start=15&tstart..).
. as I'm running windows 10 on a mac using bootcamp, it only took me to rename
c:/windows/system32/drivers/AppleHFS.sys to something else, reboot and get
truecrypt running as before. only side effect until now: I can't see the mac
partition contents in windows.

------
devilmoon
willingly installing botnet, why would you do that?
[https://i.4cdn.org/g/1438152355097.jpg](https://i.4cdn.org/g/1438152355097.jpg)

~~~
krisdol
Here's a mirror, since 4chan files are sometimes auto-wiped relatively quickly
[http://i.imgur.com/QSKsW0G.jpg](http://i.imgur.com/QSKsW0G.jpg)

~~~
devilmoon
Nice, wanted to do that and then forgot it

------
scotty79
I'm really sad about what have they done to start menu. The one Win10 Tech
Preview started with was way better than the current one. It's less functional
and still buggy (doesn't show up from time to time).

~~~
nsns
...and limited to 512 shortcuts.
[http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/07/29/windows_10_bug_alert...](http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/07/29/windows_10_bug_alert_start_menu_breaks_512_entries/)

------
linker3000
Call me cynical, but I have just made a bootable Linux USB stick with GUI in
order to keep working if/when the corporate update roll-out kicks in and borks
my work machine.

Happily running Fedora 22 on my home laptop!

~~~
andygates
"We're still not finished clearing XP, you've got plenty of time before 10 is
on the horizon." \-- Corporate IT.

------
random_2azkXJ
The naked truth about this new Windows from user's perspective:
[http://i.4cdn.org/v/1438148570882.jpg](http://i.4cdn.org/v/1438148570882.jpg)

~~~
FireBeyond
There's a whole bunch of stuff in that that's inaccurate/outdated, re Wifi
Sharing (opt in, even for contacts).

Not to mention a bunch of stuff (Do Not Track) that is set by default that has
been explicitly enabled (or disabled, depending on defaults) to look worse.
You can argue about whether you should have an "opt-in" for some of these
things at all, yes, but this image makes it look like many things are opt-out,
when they are in fact opt-in.

Telemetry is the same diagnostics that OS X and even Linux Mint and other
distributions do.

~~~
yrro
> There's a whole bunch of stuff in that that's inaccurate/outdated, re Wifi
> Sharing (opt in, even for contacts).

So if a random visitor asks for my wifi password, I can prevent it from being
sent to Microsoft?

------
merb
Ridiculously how much things I need to turn off to have the same privacy than
in Windows 7... I don't get it, why don't they just make a slider after the
installation where you could slide between Maximum Usability <-> Maximum
Privacy and still have their "Additional Settings" where you could turn off
everything one by one.

Also even after turning off everything I still need to stop OneDrive from
working and other stuff that still isn't a good default, even for "home users"
I wouldn't recommend sending too much data.

------
nly
I'll be waiting until before a week or two before the one year free upgrade
period is up before I subject any of my family to it. In the meantime, it's
popcorn time.

Btw, Windows 10 now forces critical updates. You can find a registry tweak to
disable this behaviour here:

[http://www.tenforums.com/tutorials/8013-windows-update-
autom...](http://www.tenforums.com/tutorials/8013-windows-update-automatic-
updates-enable-disable-windows-10-a.html#option2)

~~~
theandrewbailey
I will also not be upgrading immediately, though in a few months, not (almost)
a year from now.

------
sergiotapia
I'm really excited for this release and especially excited about Cortana. If
it works as advertised I'll be buying a windows phone. I'm ready for a device
that i can just talk to with a normal voice and ask it stuff.

~~~
pjc50
It works fairly well, in the manner of Siri. It copes with moderate Scottish
accents, which is impressive. The downsides are that you have to have location
services turned on (bad for battery) and, like Siri, everything you say is
recorded and may be farmed out mechanical-turk style for analysis.

------
VinzO
anyone knows when Windows 10 will be released for mobiles?

~~~
VinzO
Could anyone explain the downvotes? I have a windows phone and I am really
interested in the release of windows 10 for windows phones, especially with
the hope of finally having a decent browser on my phone.

~~~
nailer
I think people don't know that Windows Phone 8's follow up is also called
Windows 10.

------
VinzO
If your windows copy is not genuine, can you still get a free upgrade?

~~~
txru
The update isn't available for people with group licenses (i.e. schools, large
workplaces).

So, no.

~~~
rplnt
Not even "personal" MSDN(AA) licenses.

~~~
odabaxok
Are you sure about this? I have this kind of license (for Win 8.1) and in the
"Win 10 upgrade window" it said that my machine can be upgraded. Although, I
have not tried it, yet.

------
hudell
The update only froze once for me (had to hard reset). No side effects from
that. This was the smoothest windows update process I've ever had.

Had some trouble with Asus touchpad drivers, but after fixing that, everything
is running well and nothing was lost. All previously installed software seems
to be running fine.

~~~
thescrewdriver
> The update only froze once for me (had to hard reset). No side effects from
> that. This was the smoothest windows update process I've ever had.

Having to hard reset during an update due to a freeze doesn't exactly sound
like a particularly smooth process. I guess your perspective depends on your
experiences with previous updates.

~~~
hudell
Yes, every other windows update I had before either: a) Failed on the first
try b) Deleted files/software

Windows 10 was the first time I didn't lose anything (except the games that
stopped working)

------
fit2rule
I have a legitimate Windows 7 license that I run on my MBP using VMWare
Workstation .. is this ineligible for upgrade, does anyone know? I've left the
VM running in the hopes I get the little taskbar notification to do a free
upgrade to Windows 10, but its not happening .. I guess us VM Windows users
are out of luck, then?

EDIT: Scratch that. As luck would have it, just as I submitted to HN, I got
the upgrade icon notification in my VM. Looks like I'll be upgrading my
Windows 7 VM in VMWare on a MBP to Windows 10 soon .. leaving my comment in
case it trips anyone else up: patience, I guess!

------
Osmium
Any news on how to get a free 'reserved' copy? The Verge seems to suggest that
you just have to wait, and it might take weeks, since Microsoft wants to do a
gradual rollout...

~~~
lawnchair_larry
Why reserve something for which scarcity is impossible?

~~~
yrro
Their capacity to upload copies of Windows 10 is not infinite (though only
because they have chosen not to distribute via BitTorrent).

------
forgotmypassw
It'd be nice if it wasn't for all the bundled spyware.

------
kev6168
Wait. Until. Service. Pack. 1.

~~~
saint_fiasco
Hopefully they release that service pack before the upgrade-for-free period
ends.

~~~
MLR
Big feature update is pencilled in for late this year I believe.

------
michaelkoz
If you aren't getting Windows 10 pushed out to you, you can follow this
tutorial to force update

[http://goodereader.com/blog/tablet-slates/how-to-force-
downl...](http://goodereader.com/blog/tablet-slates/how-to-force-download-
windows-10-on-your-pc-and-tablet)

------
jdub
If you don't want to wait, you can jump start your upgrade with a moment's
fiddling:

[http://www.redmondpie.com/force-download-windows-10-free-
upg...](http://www.redmondpie.com/force-download-windows-10-free-upgrade-
right-now-heres-how-tutorial/)

------
Shivetya
Looking forward to 10, if only to get parents of XP. However the other issue I
have with Windows is installation methods.

Owning an iMac without a DVD drive what exactly are my options for obtaining
any version of Windows short of buying a DVD drive to copy an install DVD to
USB for bootcamp?

~~~
bbrks
Download an ISO[0], put it on a USB, and then use your key as normal :)

[0] [https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-
download/windows10I...](https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-
download/windows10ISO)

------
crazysaem
The Windows 10 Installation media creation tool is also already out:
[https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-
download/windows10](https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-
download/windows10)

------
Aldo_MX
From the feature deprecation list:

    
    
      If you have a floppy drive, you will need to download the latest driver from
      Windows Update or from the manufacturer’s website.
    

I really wonder if there are manufacturers of floppy drives without a website.

~~~
Kequc
All floppy drives come with a floppy disk with the driver on it. Problem
solved.

~~~
Aldo_MX
You mean like WinRAR installers inside a .rar file?

------
martijn_himself
This looks amazing but I'm disappointed at the absence of 'Windows 10 devices'
launching alongside this release.

If anything this seems like a missed sales opportunity for Microsoft/ hardware
vendors.

~~~
k-mcgrady
Have they ever synchronised the OEM release with hardware releases? I always
thought they released the boxed version and then a few months later it started
appearing on PC's.

~~~
martijn_himself
They haven't, but I thought it would increase adoption and sales if they did-
or if they had 'reference' hardware devices.

It seems kind of strange even their Surface line of devices is not shipping
with Windows 10 on the day of release.

------
bad_user
So when you upgrade to Windows 10, do you get a Windows 10 license key?

~~~
ionised
_If you upgraded to Windows 10 on this PC by taking advantage of the free
upgrade offer and successfully activated Windows 10 on this PC in the past,
you won 't have a Windows 10 product key, and you can skip the product key
page by selecting the Skip button. Your PC will activate online automatically
so long as the same edition of Windows 10 was successfully activated on this
PC by using the free Windows 10 upgrade offer._

From;

[http://windows.microsoft.com/en-gb/windows-10/media-
creation...](http://windows.microsoft.com/en-gb/windows-10/media-creation-
tool-install?ocid=ms_wol_win10)

Which makes it sound like you don't, and can only upgrade or clean install on
a single machine. I hope this is incorrect because I'm planning to upgrade my
machine in 6 months.

------
yAnonymous
Does the key/license that comes with the upgrade allow for a re-install? If
not, I'd rather stick to Windows 7.

~~~
kijin
"How to perform a clean installation of Windows ... you can skip the product
key page by selecting the Skip button. Your PC will activate online
automatically so long as the same edition of Windows 10 was successfully
activated on this PC by using the free Windows 10 upgrade offer."

Source: [http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-10/media-
creation...](http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-10/media-creation-
tool-install?ocid=ms_wol_win10)

I'm burning an old-fashioned installation disk as I type this, using the tool
mentioned in the link above. The tool can also create bootable USB sticks or
ISO images.

~~~
yAnonymous
Thanks. So it's not a full license... too bad.

~~~
kijin
Yeah, it's basically an OEM (single-device, non-transferable) license with
remotely managed product keys.

Most legal Windows users only have OEM licenses anyway, so there won't be any
difference for them. It sucks if you already own a full license.

But if you need to move to a different computer sometime in the next year or
so, I guess you could first install Windows 7/8/8.1 using your full license,
activate it, and then take advantage of the free upgrade to 10. That's
basically what I did with my "student discount" license when Windows 7 came
out. I had a full license of Vista, so I first moved it to a different
computer and then upgraded it to 7.

~~~
yAnonymous
I don't want to be stuck with an OS that I don't have a full license for when
I replace my hardware.

And I found out that Microsoft basically reserve the right for full
access/download of your data and it can't be disabled.

------
farawayea
Didn't receive the update. GWX app is gone now. WU says Windows 10 upgrade is
reserved.

------
higherpurpose
Reasons for why you might _not_ want the upgrade:

[https://www.reddit.com/r/technology/comments/3f060k/anonymou...](https://www.reddit.com/r/technology/comments/3f060k/anonymous_member_releases_reasons_not_to_upgrade/)

------
jcslzr
I use dual boot for ubuntu and windows 8.1, should I worry?

~~~
eridal
not as long as you boot on the ubuntu partition ;)

------
MzHN
I can't believe there is still no clear official statement on how the
licensing works. From some sources[1] they seem to imply that retail licenses
(Win7/8) turn into what is basically an OEM license, but then there are some
sources that state the exact opposite[2][3].

I don't want to lose my retail Win8 license, as they say that it will be
"consumed" by the upgrade (wth is that supposed to mean), so I'm going to sit
and wait on this, maybe try to get an answer from their helpdesk.

They try so hard to make this easy for people, to make windows popular again,
and they still fucked it up. I am disappointed.

[1] [http://windows.microsoft.com/en-gb/windows-10/media-
creation...](http://windows.microsoft.com/en-gb/windows-10/media-creation-
tool-install)

"If you upgraded to Windows 10 on this PC by taking advantage of the free
upgrade offer and successfully activated Windows 10 on this PC in the past,
you won't have a Windows 10 product key, and you can skip the product key page
by selecting the Skip button. Your PC will activate online automatically so
long as the same edition of Windows 10 was successfully activated on this PC
by using the free Windows 10 upgrade offer."

[2] [http://answers.microsoft.com/en-
us/windows/forum/windows_10-...](http://answers.microsoft.com/en-
us/windows/forum/windows_10-win_upgrade/after-free-update-to-windows-10-from-
existing/4ca295b7-54ef-4d40-9b2e-d037cf41a8a7)

"From the Windows 10 end user license agreement:

b. Stand-alone software.

If you acquired the software as stand-alone software (and also if you upgraded
from software you acquired as stand-alone software), you may transfer the
software to another device that belongs to you. You may also transfer the
software to a device owned by someone else if (i) you are the first licensed
user of the software and (ii) the new user agrees to the terms of this
agreement. You may use the backup copy we allow you to make or the media that
the software came on to transfer the software. Every time you transfer the
software to a new device, you must remove the software from the prior device.
You may not transfer the software to share licenses between devices."

[3] [http://www.expertreviews.co.uk/software/operating-
systems/14...](http://www.expertreviews.co.uk/software/operating-
systems/1403593/how-to-upgrade-to-windows-10-and-get-your-new-licence-key)

"After your computer has upgraded to Windows 10 it will have a new licence
key. You'll need this if you want to perform a clean installation of Windows
10, as you can input your existing Windows 7 or 8 code into the installation
routine. To get your key fire up the Magical Jelly Bean KeyFinder app and
you'll see your Windows 10 key at the top of the list."

------
sneak
In other news, MySpace releases a major UI overhaul with several new features.

------
deciplex
Reminder that Microsoft installed adware on Windows 7/8 machines to encourage
users to upgrade to Windows 10. Even if you hid the update from Windows
Update, they un-hid it and reinstalled at least once that I know of.

Don't reward this behavior by buying Windows 10. Or at least delay the
purchase as long as possible.

~~~
0xffffabcd
Upgrade notification is now adware? are you serious? You don't even have to
pay for the upgrade and you'll have a lot to gain from it and for us
developers, it's a good thing aswell since it might reduce the number of old
IEs/plateforms we have to support. I expected more from an HN user..

~~~
batou
It's only a notification until you can't turn it off. It's incredibly
difficult to get rid of it on a non-domain attached windows 8.1 machine.

~~~
0xffffabcd
For me it was an icon next to the clock. Once I reserved my upgrade I just hid
it in the action center and it never popped again.

~~~
batou
It's still there and running though.

That's like you know there's a hissing cockroach living under the sink but you
just close the door and stick your fingers in your ears.

~~~
0xffffabcd
The other option is to remove kb3035583

~~~
batou
Still appears on mine if you remove that and block it. Lots of people have
reported that.

~~~
deciplex
You also have to hide the update to prevent WU from reinstalling it for you,
but actually not even that will permanently disable it.

This is because Microsoft will release "updates" to that package, with the
_totally_ unintended side effect of unhiding and reinstalling the update. So
even if you uninstall it, and hide the update from WU, it will _still_ find a
way onto your system.

So yeah, _like I said_ and despite the downvotes, it's fucking adware.
Bordering on malware.

