
Cyclists should buy a camera to capture accident evidence - jseliger
http://www.slate.com/articles/technology/technology/2017/11/cyclists_should_invest_in_a_camera_to_capture_accident_evidence_when_no.html
======
sharpercoder
I've cycling since 2 years old, and when I was 10 I built my own bicycle from
scratch with my older brother. He's stil running his bikeshop.

The world needs a bicycle for the current age. I see many new ideas on
kickstarter and news outlets presenting new bikes with all sorts of features.
Most take one idea and built a bike around it. Some take more ideas but none
actually solve my day-today problems with bikes:

\- They get stolen

\- They need regular maintenance on the drive train

\- Lighting breaks easily

\- Not robust enough

\- Traffic lights cost a lot of energy

\- Charging is a hassle

On top of that, I'd like some tech bolted on top of my bike:

\- Camera's

\- Safe & usable mapping system

\- Citylight & countrylight

\- Electronic lock

\- Electronic tracker (when stolen)

Lastly, it should use mostly standard parts.

~~~
Pxtl
To me, the ideal bike would be a fixed-frame hybrid or cx bike with an
internal drive shaft (not a belt) and disc breaks to minimize maintenance,
fenders. Basically like a bikeshare bike but without the bikeshare weight and
the upright angle.

Chains and belts, caliper brakes, shocks, are all maintenance pain. Cam shafts
are cheap to maintain but require a bike that is built around a shaft drive -
they're not compatible with a standard frame setup.

Put all the electronics in a detachable pod on the handlebars. Light, horn,
camera - all there. You can easily pop it off and take it with you.

Edit: if I were crazy enough for a hardware Kickstarter, an all-singing
electronics pod would be it. A long-necked bike light with yellow leds down
the side for side visibility and a pair of buttons for horns - a quiet
pedestrian chime and an earsplitting horn guaranteed to cause hearing damage
if used carelessly.

~~~
sharpercoder
Low-maintenance and maintenance-free drive shafts are a solved problem, but
expensive currently. Locks are a necessity where I live, I don't want to put a
€500+ bike without 3 ore more locks. I want a lock to fasten the bike to a
fixed item (e.g. pole) and both wheels locked to the frame. Then I want an
electronic lock.

The electronics are dispersed over the whole bike. frontlight, backlight,
camera's (I'm thinking 3 or 4), integrated mapping,, electronic lock, possible
electric steering make it impossible to put all tech into a detachable unit.
It's simply out of the question for a well-designed bicycle. I can see it
adding some value for current bicycles though.

For the frame I probably want aluminium, because it's cheap and light enough.
Shocks are not needed as my country has excellent biking paths. For most other
countries shocks don't add too much value, especially not when using the bike
in an urban environment. Then they are just maintenance-prone weight-gainers.

~~~
semi-extrinsic
Electric steering? But why?

Lights: I bought a $15 set of lights off eBay ~3 years ago. The alkaline AAA
batteries need replacing a few times a year, nobody can be bothered stealing
them because they don't look expensive.

Why all the cameras?

Why an electronic lock?

As for locking both wheels, in my experience changing from QR dropouts to
something that requires a simple tool for taking wheels off solves that
problem. The tools on my bikes are small enough that I Gorilla tape them to
the underside of the seat on each bike.

As for shocks being maintenance-prone: my daily commute is on a bike with
Suntour shocks from 2002. They've never had maintenance. Basically everything
else on the bike has been replaced except for shocks and frame.

~~~
clort
To be honest, a cheap light is a cheap light.. but I have had my rear light
stolen before now and had to cycle home in the dark without one (in truth, it
was like 1 am and I went via the back roads but I still felt very exposed and
pulled off when a car approached). I currently have a rear pannier frame which
has a built in reflector and have thought it would be useful for that to be a
light, though I can't charge batteries on the bike so they need to be
removeable easily. I'm nervous about leaving anything on the bike that is
easily removable though.. so a small light is enough. The LED ones these days
easily fit in my pocket and are way bright enough for city riding where all
you need is visibility.

I'm intrigued about that chain drive though..

------
hkmurakami
It's actually fascinating to see various constituency behavior in relative
terms. Drivers are often overly aggressive and downright dangerous vs cyclists
on the streets. Then you go to a college campus and cyclists behave as if they
have the right of way over pedestrians (ex: stanford).

Perhaps it is simply a symptom of human psychology and entitlement/power.

~~~
bsder
> ex: stanford

Stanford seems to be particularly bad about this and I really don't understand
why. The only bicycle "bump" incidents I have ever had were at Stanford.

One dude had the misfortune to bump me near my wallet. My city-bred reflex
reaction (which even surprised me with how fast it was) knocked him right off
the bicycle. Of course, he was pissed at me for clocking him. Umm, yo,
douchebag, people will leave you alone if you don't bump into them.

~~~
tonyedgecombe
_Of course, he was pissed at me for clocking him._

So you lashed out at someone because they accidentally bumped into you and
they are the douchebag?

~~~
PhantomGremlin
_So you lashed out at someone because they accidentally bumped into you and
they are the douchebag?_

Yes, definitely the cyclist is the douchebag.

A cyclist is often traveling much faster than a pedestrian and can easily
injure someone. The burden of proper behavior, especially in a mixed
cyclist/pedestrian environment, must fall mainly to the cyclist.

Usually a "clocking" is because a cyclist is behaving recklessly. People often
want to dismiss something as "an accident" when instead it was easily foreseen
"negligence".

------
Z-Widwil
I have two cameras on me when I ride. One is the Fly6 rear cam shown in this
article. The other is a helmet mounted GoPro. I would not ride without them
for a lot of the reason brought up in the article. Not only were they helpful
after the two accidents that I've had, but they also help out for everyday
riding. As folks drive much better when they see a camera strapped to your
head.

~~~
tonyedgecombe
I doubt if many people notice the camera, although perhaps society as a whole
will get used to the idea with enough incidents.

------
hprotagonist
Many do. But this is still fundamentally victim-blaming; growing ridership and
sensible infrastructure design have been shown again and again to be the
drivers of safety, not shame-driven rider-specific pieces of tech.

------
oh_sigh
First day I got my bike cam, I was riding near park slope and coasted straight
through a green light. Almost to the crosswalk on the other side of an
intersection, a kid maybe 5-6 years old just books it right in front of my
bike. I swerved into the center of the street to not hit him(luckily I had
just looked over my shoulder 10 seconds earlier and knew no cars were behind
me). Day in the life of a NYC biker, but the father(who was talking to someone
else when his kid ran away from him) started yelling obscenities at me for
almost running over his kid, and started chasing me down the street. I got
away easily and nothing ever came of it, but I am so glad to have the dash cam
because I would have no way of showing that the kid ran out in front of
traffic, and not that I ran a red light and almost killed a kid.

~~~
tomjen3
I have trouble picturing it - it sounds like the kid went out into a
crosswalk, over an intersection, with a green light. I agree the dad should
keep a closer look at the kid, but that doesn't sound like he was the one at
fault.

~~~
oh_sigh
I was going straight through an intersection with the green light - the kid
ran across the street perpendicular to my motion across the crosswalk which
had the orange hand.

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Pxtl
This is extremely unsubtle payola. It reads like an infomercial. I figured
slate was better than that.

~~~
Piskvorrr
Yup. "You should buy a camera. Specifically this o- [tab closes]"

------
simulate
A couple months ago I mounted an inexpensive (~$140) 360 view camera to my
helmet for my bike work commute. Here's some recent footage:
[https://youtu.be/aTTEEWxJImk](https://youtu.be/aTTEEWxJImk)

It works well and might one day capture an accident. I just need to remember
to charge it. I wear it even when it is not charged because it seems cars are
more cautious around me when they see the camera poking off the top of my
helmet.

~~~
e0
What camera do you use?

~~~
simulate
This is the one I bought:
[https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B071NPLVZH/](https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B071NPLVZH/)

It looks like it might be discontinued, but there are other similar models
available:
[https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=sr_nr_p_36_2?rnid=386442011&key...](https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=sr_nr_p_36_2?rnid=386442011&keywords=360+camera&rh=n%3A172282%2Cn%3A502394%2Ck%3A360+camera%2Cp_36%3A7000-15000&qid=1510550839&low-
price=70&high-price=200)

If you try this a good helmet mount is important. This one works well for my
hardshell helmet:
[https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008BNEXH4](https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B008BNEXH4)

------
plantain
This is a technical solution to a social problem.

Taking video to the police of centimetre close passes (1m is legislated) in
Australia just yields "your camera is not calibrated to measure distance so we
cannot accept this", and stonewalling.

~~~
oihssovhusvoh
exactly. the solution is more people on bikes getting fresh air and exercise
instead of road-rage in their cars

------
u801e
I follow the BikeCammers subreddit. Based on what I've read, it seems that in
a lot of jurisdictions, police have to actually witness the offense in order
to issue a citation.

But if the cyclist has video footage of the vehicle involved in the offense,
and footage of the diver of the vehicle, then I don't see a reason a citation
couldn't be issued if the cyclist was willing to testify as a witness/victim
during the trial.

~~~
rhizome
As in for an infraction? Surely reckless or negligent driving rises to a
misdemeanor, and video is used for those all the time.

------
sAbakumoff
I am riding a bicycle on a daily basis in Amsterdam. No one is using dash cams
here, but I do(YI action cam) and it helped me a lot when a had the accident :
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUY7psClcbQ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUY7psClcbQ)

~~~
exodust
The irony of the driver's vision blocked by a bunch of bicycles parked on the
corner.

What was the outcome of this? I think you assumed right of way a bit too much
in this instance and went flying through without slowing down. Car was moving
very slowly and you still hit it!!

This is exactly where a lot of tension between cyclists and cars comes from.
Cyclists have much better visibility and should avoid accidents like this.

~~~
sAbakumoff
the outcome - I broke a bone in my palm and spent 6 weeks with the cast around
my hand, the car driver fixed my bicycle, his insurance company paid all my
expenses : public transport costs, medical costs("own risk") and the
compensation for "pain and suffering".

~~~
exodust
That's surprising. To me it looks like you sped through an intersection
without slowing down or looking out for cars.

You hit the car, the car didn't hit you.

Also, bicycles at that speed can stop very short if brakes in good order. You
didn't brake! Sorry... I don't mean to be rude. But I ride in the city, and
there's no way I'd speed across an intersection without making sure it was
clear.

Lucky you're living in Amsterdam because in Australia you would be paying for
damage to the car!

~~~
sauwan
Legally, not sure I agree with you. It looks like an uncontrolled intersection
(I don't see any signage requiring the bike lane to yield in any way, although
I'm not familiar with Amsterdam's signage). Looks more like an alley to me
than a road, too.

Cars turning right are obligated to yield to others going straight in this
instance. The van turned into what looks pretty clearly to be a bike lane.

Practically speaking, I totally agree with you though. Bikers need to be way
more defensive.

~~~
sAbakumoff
From my experience cars ALWAYS let bicycles go on those intersections here in
Amsterdam. In my situation the driver's view was blocked or he didn't check it
as it was 8am and I was moving very fast, shit happens.

------
Finnucane
I’ve looked into helmet cams since I had an accident that cost me a tooth
(sideswiped by another cyclist). It seems that most of them only have about 2
or so hours of record time on a charge. That doesn’t seem sufficient. Don’t
need the additional lights, though.

~~~
reustle
Since you're on a bicycle, you should be able mount a reasonably sized battery
on the bike to keep it charged? Any common usb phone battery bank should work
fine

~~~
Finnucane
I have a dynamo hub that could recharge it on the fly, with a USB adapter. It
would mean wiring it to the handlebar, but I suppose I could live with that.

------
flyinghamster
I would have loved to have cameras like that when someone chucked a rock at me
in Milwaukee back in 2005.

Another thing that would be handy would be the ability to quickly transfer
video to my phone via Wi-Fi.

~~~
frik
Transferring files locally is still an unsolved problem. Bluetooth is
cumbersome and slow, WiFi would be better, but something like AirDrop for non
Apple devices would be great.

For SD-cards, many Android smartphones can be used to read it. Unfortunately
iPhone has no SD slot.

~~~
lucb1e
So don't buy an apple phone.

------
graton
Frankly I think this also applies to car drivers. Get a dashcam in case you
get into an accident.

~~~
PhantomGremlin
You would think that by now car manufacturers would make this easy to do. Why
doesn't every car have a convenient way to both mount and power a dashcam?
This whole necessity of snaking a power cable around the edge of a dashboard
to connect to an unused fuse location is complete bullshit.

------
rorykoehler
I would love a camera with a button that when pressed automatically saves the
previous 15 seconds and the preceding 15 seconds into a clip and send it
directly to the police. Every single time I go out I have to deal with
dangerous and inconsiderate drivers clearly braking the law, driving as if the
world only exists in front of the car.

~~~
loeg
A common bike cam feature is to detect crashes and save the previous footage.
Otherwise, they typically overwrite the oldest footage first.

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maxscam
I agree, dashcams,have become very cheap, the main thing is people dont get
around to it

