
New Yorkers Are Publicly Shaming Cars in Bike Lanes - misnamed
http://www.citylab.com/commute/2016/09/new-york-city-cars-blocking-bike-lanes-map/501953/
======
birken
There are a few twitter accounts I follow who post some egregious infractions
throughout SF. There have been some wins [1], but unfortunately I see the same
types of violations by commercial vehicles posted over and over again and I
think those drivers just don't care (and as far as I can tell they face little
to no enforcement).

And for those on the high horse about cyclists breaking laws, just remember
that nearly 100% of drivers break the law every time they drive --- speeding.
Drivers think that going 30mph in a 25mph zone or 40mph in a 35mph zone isn't
a big deal, but those small differences in speed mean a lot to people outside
of vehicles if they get hit [2].

Also I haven't seen any data that shows that the most common cyclist
infraction that everybody complains about, yielding at stop signs, actually is
more dangerous. Yet it is very easy to show that speeding by vehicles is
incredibly dangerous and costs many lives every year.

1: [http://www.sfexaminer.com/uber-drivers-sf-receive-cyclist-
sa...](http://www.sfexaminer.com/uber-drivers-sf-receive-cyclist-safety-
training/)

2:
[http://nacto.org/docs/usdg/relationship_between_speed_risk_f...](http://nacto.org/docs/usdg/relationship_between_speed_risk_fatal_injury_pedestrians_and_car_occupants_richards.pdf)

~~~
wyager
Speed limits are decided under the assumption that people will exceed them
under normal driving conditions.

In other words, speed limits are usually intentionally too slow. It would be
insane to follow them in many situations.

~~~
regecks
Wtf? Is this a US phenomenon?

In Australia people do stick to limits, more or less. At least, speeders are
judged by other drivers fairly harshly.

~~~
grmarcil
Yeah, in the US, it's pretty much acceptable to go 5 or 10 mph over the limit
on any non-residential road. Cops generally don't ticket unless you are going
10+ mph over.

~~~
mercer
That's fascinating. In Holland we use a similar rule of thumb, but in Km/h,
which is significantly less of a speed increase. Fascinating how the choice of
unit of measurement affects behavior like this.

Going 8-20 Km/h too fast (the US equivalent) would definitely not be okay
here. It happens, but if the police notices you're likely to get a ticket.

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paulsutter
What's really needed is to segregate cars from pedestrians. Tunnels for self
driving electric cars, cars otherwise banned. Part of why Venice is so
beautiful.

Yes I know, tunnels are expensive. Surely there's a way to bring technological
deflation to tunneling. For starters, self driving electric cars would emit no
noxious gasses and could have narrower tunnels with higher capacity.

Just for city centers, make up for all that wasted automotive space (parking,
roads) with higher density and more life.

~~~
thwarted
If you're going to build tunnels for vehicles, you might as well put tracks
in.

~~~
paulsutter
But then you need transfers if the destination is out in the burbs, and that's
terrible for door to door transit times.

Underground uber with no stoplights and no pedestrians clogging the
intersections, with nice onramps to regular highways and your door to door
times will be dramatically lower.

------
initram
Are they also publicly shaming bikers who blatantly break traffic laws?

EDIT: I say this as both a cyclist and a driver. I can't believe how often I
see cyclists do dangerous things. But for sure, I see a lot of drivers do
mean, dangerous and stupid things, too. I just get tired of cyclists thinking
that traffic laws don't apply to us.

~~~
orbitingpluto
Before I get all the hate I have to say of course cyclists should obey the
laws. As a cyclist I can tell you it doesn't matter either way to many
certifiably deranged motorists.

Caveat aside, I'm constantly amazed that this argument gets brought up over
and over again.

Traffic laws exist to ensure public safety. So let's cut the bike/car bullshit
about the laws being equal for both.

Let's take a simple offense like running a stop sign at 15 km/hr and suppose
that a pedestrian gets hit. What's the difference between a car doing this and
a bicycle? Both the bike and the car are going 4 m/s. But there's a huge
difference between getting hit by a car that's 1500 kg plus passengers versus
an 80 kg person plus a 9 kg bike. Simple thought experiment, you've just been
hit by something. What outcome would be more favorable? Would you rather have
a Honda Civic on your spleen or some asshat bike courier named Jack? Two
tonnes versus nine kilograms?

The crime may be the same, but the outcome is far different. I've seen a van
run a red light and the cyclist traveling orthogonally ride right into the
side of it going 45 km/hour. Not pretty.

~~~
lpr22
I'd rather not be hit by either of them, period. Cars should not be running
stop signs or lights, but neither should bicyclists, period. Full stop. Also,
having a bike run the stop sign and fly into an intersection out of nowhere
can easily cause cars to swerve, causing accidents, or even strike the
bicyclist.

It's not difficult to drive, ride, or walk safely. Just do it and stop
whining.

~~~
noobermin
There is a compromise, the Idaho stop[0].

[0]
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Idaho_stop](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Idaho_stop)

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jeffwilcox
Cities are funny places. Off topic mildly but still vehicles using bike
lanes...

I often wonder about armored delivery vehicles - ATM/cash movement firms like
Brinks. Do they have some sort of deal with cities to not receive tickets for
blocking lanes, standing in bus lanes, bike lanes, not paying for parking,
etc... or do they actually get tickets, paying them as they come in? Or are
they some sort of specialized vehicle?

~~~
rdtsc
That is an interesting point. Someone probably figured it out they could buy
what looks like an armored verhicle. Setup an LLC with some security sounding
name. Then probably park it around the city whenever they want. Not sure if it
would be worth the trouble with all the cost in fuel, but who knows.

Heard about someone before buying a Crown Vic and getting a taxi package (or
whatever the search comes with) and driving that around. They weren't
impersonating an officer, but cars would regularly slow down around or get out
of his way when he was behind them.

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bikenyc
This is a step in the right direction. A more positively impactful step would
be to stigmatize the ownership and operation of a motor vehicle. No one
actually _needs_ a car in NYC; those who _want_ a car must be treated the same
as smokers: pushed to the fringes by making their behavior socially
unacceptable.

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wyager
When I lived in Palo Alto, every single day I saw delivery vehicles parked in
the middle of a lane in a 2-lane street. The police never seemed to do
anything about it. I think we should encourage a culture of vigilante traffic
enforcement. If someone leaves a car parked in the middle of the road because
they were too lazy to park elsewhere nearby, they deserve to get their vehicle
dinged up a little bit. Hopefully that might actually dissuade them from
parking in the middle of the road.

~~~
jeffwilcox
Or an app for that, being the valley and all... you report a violation, city
enforces via third-party contractors (Uber drivers).

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keyle
Reminded me of this :) [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bzE-
IMaegzQ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bzE-IMaegzQ)

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hoprocker
Looks quite similar to the site one of my coworkers at Meetup had going for a
while (hi Greg!): [http://mybikelane.com/](http://mybikelane.com/)

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mkagenius
In India (Bangalore), motorcycle runs on footpaths when there is traffic. What
a contrast.

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c3534l
That's quite a lot of police cars on that map.

