
Buy somebody lunch - DanielBMarkham
http://www.whattofix.com/blog/archives/2009/08/buy-somebody-lu.php
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blhack
This can backfire in a big way...I will post this in the hopes the person I'm
talking about doesn't read this website (I find it unlikely that she does).

I met a girl who seemed very cool. She was really smart, into computers (she's
a programmer), funny, etc. etc. Basically everything that I look for in a good
friend.

SO I invited her out to grab some beer one night.

Now, the thing is...I'm a bit of a beer snob. I invited her to go to my
favorite beer drinking place...a place which features nearly 500 varieties of
imported and microbrewed beer...all really great stuff.

Well, when we got there, I ordered a beer that is ~$20 a bottle (it is a very
very limited run that new belgium did, and is quite good).

Her, not being a beer nerd at all, found a beer she liked, and ordered 3-4 of
them...(it was a lambic from Belgium).

Now, because I'm a nice guy, near the end of the evening, I got up and talked
to one of the bartenders and paid the check... The reason I did this was
mostly because this girl was not a beer snob in any way, and probably had no
clue how expensive what she was drinking was.

This girl decided that this gesture was me in some way trying to hit on her,
and now refuses to talk to me. :(.

Some people get really weirded out when you try and do nice things for them,
so be careful. Some people even go so far as thinking that you're offering to
buy them lunch because you think they can't afford it.

Tread lightly, that's all I'm saying...

~~~
astine
Even from this angle it sounds like you were trying to hit on this person. For
some reason paying for food with the opposite sex is seen as courtship
behavior. Try it with a (straight) man and see if he thinks that you are
hitting on him. With amusing exceptions, its unlikely that he'll take offense.

~~~
blhack
Well...the thing is that I normally _DO_ pay for my male friends.

If I call them up and say ask them to go out, they're usually all broke
(mostly students). I'll pay because, to me, its worth the extra few bucks to
have somebody to drink with...

(or are you saying that people are just being irrational? Your last sentence
makes me believe so.)

~~~
astine
_Well...the thing is that I normally DO pay for my male friends._

Then you know exaclty what I'm talking about. My point is that gestures can
mean different things when performed for men and for women. There's nothing
irrational about it.

~~~
patio11
I was once friend-zoned by a young lady I was interested in, and got to listen
to a whole lot of talk about other guys. In particular, there was one
gentleman that got upset with her because he thought she was, quote, leading
him on.

"Mary, what do you do with him?"

"Oh, movies, dinner, that sort of thing."

"Who pays for these?"

"He does."

"And he says you're leading him on?"

"Yeah, what's up with that?"

"That's because you're leading him on."

Some time later I realized that Mary (not her real name) had a persistent
habit of using people, and I began spending my time with people who did not
value me solely for what I could do for them.

------
brandon272
When I used to have a lot more disposable income I used to do this kind of
thing all the time. If I would go out to eat with friends, I would very
frequently make a habit of paying for everything.

I'm not sure why I did it, honestly. I think I just wanted to do something
nice. I also figured it would just be a nice gesture to "take care of the
bill" so that everyone else wouldn't have to worry about it and could maybe
relax and enjoy the rest of their evening without the possibility of them
being concerned about how much money they had spent. I think on some level I
felt guilty about other people spending money. And when I would buy someone a
meal or buy them a few drinks I wouldn't want or expect anything out of it. To
be honest, it made me a little uncomfortable if people made a big deal about
it or even said anything more than "Thanks".

I've had times in my life when I've had extra money to spend and had times
when money has been tight. And I know I've experienced occasions where money
is tight and you go out for a meal with friends and spend a portion of the
night feeling guilty that you're spending money. I think that when I had extra
money, I just wanted to make sure that no one was feeling that way. I just
wanted to give them the opportunity to enjoy the night, or enjoy lunch, or
whatever it was we were doing.

~~~
potatolicious
I generally don't pick up the tab when going as a group. For one thing it gets
expensive really fast, and secondly you just don't get the same "mileage" from
it.

The amount of good will you receive when paying for a 1v1 meal is a lot
greater than the good will you receive when paying for the whole table. It's
the personal touch I suppose, the feeling that you did it for him/her, as
opposed to "them".

~~~
brandon272
This goes back to the issue of, 'Why are you doing it?'.

In my situation I wasn't doing it to receive any "amount of good". I was just
doing it to do my friends a small gesture. And if I could do 5 friends a small
gesture, that's probably more gratifying to me than doing only 1 of my friends
a small gesture.

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JoelSutherland
It's interesting to read the responses here from a population that tend to be
more technically focused than people focused. (I'm included)

We're all trying to reverse engineer the intent of the acquaintance. The
lunch-buyers out there are much less calculating; they just like hanging out
with people at lunch!

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philwelch
"Instead of buying things, we should buy memories...Money spent on experiences
- vacations or theater tickets or meals out - makes you happier than money
spent on material goods"

It's funny, because my intuitions always ran the other way--you should spend
money on something you'll enjoy over and over again, not just a single
experience that ends soon. The fallacy, of course, is that a sufficiently good
experience is remembered again and again, and that is often more valuable than
a durable good you've grown tired of (or a higher number on your online
banking site for you to look at).

~~~
PebblesRox
For me, a good compromise is to buy supplies for making stuff. Then I have the
experience of creation, which I love, and I also have the finished product.
When I visit art shows, I often think "I want to learn how to do that." I'd
much rather make art than buy it (with some exceptions that are beyond my
budget for the present).

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edw519
It's a fine line between doing a nice gesture for a friend simply because you
want to and doing it for an acquaintance in order to earn favor. If you're the
least bit phony, it will show and it will backfire. Sounds like your friend
was the real deal. Good for him and good for you!

~~~
jonknee
If I am going to be around a phony person I'd rather get a sandwich out of it
than not. Since the act of buying lunch doesn't actually make someone phony, I
don't see a downside.

~~~
eoyola
In this case, how do you know the act isn't phony? If you know that person is
sometimes phony, you'll be left wondering whether anything they do for you is
insincere, including buying lunch. I couldn't accept it if I smell something
off about their intentions.

~~~
jonknee
I think there are worse things than a lunch paid for someone who is insincere
(such as having to pay for lunch with someone who is insincere). It's not
really worth worrying about to me actually.

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HeyLaughingBoy
I have known someone like this. In his case he was doing it for two reasons
(1) he's a genuinely nice person and enjoys doing things for people and (2) he
knows that it can sometimes "grease the wheels:" that is, it leaves the other
person with a positive memory of him that can be useful later.

The take home message though is that his primary motivation is just his good
nature; the benefit is a side effect.

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staunch
Why did him buying the lunch make any difference? If he didn't buy the lunch
would he be less of a good guy?

~~~
icey
I feel like a real jerk for even mentioning this, so first let me say it
sounds like this guy was a really good guy.

But this is a researched social phenomenon known as the reciprocity effect.
He's done something for you, so now you feel like you somehow owe him
something in return. Often that's "paid back" by positive social feelings. I
really hoped I could find a solid citation for you, but the basis of it is
found in Robert Cialdini's excellent book "Influence: The Psychology of
Persuasion".

[This is as close as I could get for sourcing, I apologize for the lack of
quality on the subject: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norm_of_reciprocity>]

~~~
mhb
There's also the effect that when you do a favor for someone, you feel better
about them.

 _If you want to make a friend, let someone do you a favor._ \-- Benjamin
Franklin

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TrevorJ
I think the main point here doesn't even have to do with the money. Everyone
feel appreciation differently. Many people would think fondly of you if you
just take the time to ask how they are doing, and really care to hear the
answer. It doesn't even have to be of monetary value at all.

------
olliesaunders
Anyone want to buy me lunch?

~~~
mannicken
If you go near Seattle, write me and I'll buy you a lunch :)

~~~
huhtenberg
A frozen one ? :)

~~~
mannicken
A frozen two!

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zaidf
I do this all the time! Yet, I am not sure if the close friendship with these
people is a cause or effect of the lunch. But looking back, I think I get this
cool fun friend vibe from these people at our very first meeting.

I don't use this as a technique. I don't know if it scales:)

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jhatcom
I wonder if paying for someone's lunch might, in some cases, might make them
feel less friendly towards you. For example, if they feel as if they owe you
something and are not in a position to return the favor. They may start
avoiding you in that case.

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dschobel
continuing the fine tradition of blogs extrapolating general principles from
anecdotes...

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huhtenberg
This just goes on to prove that "The way to a man's heart is through his
stomach" :)

As a side note I got to say that I would've stopped going to the lunch with a
person who'd kept insisting on paying all the time. If not for any other
reason, but for the fact that I just feel plain uncomfortable with this kind
of arrangement as it clearly puts me in debt to that person. Paying back with
a friendship feels wrong and "He is that kind of person" is not an excuse
enough.

~~~
orangecat
Agreed. Although it's entirely possible that we aren't normal; I despise debt
in any form, which clearly is not an attitude shared by large portions of the
population.

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xexers
That guy must have a killer network.

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capablanca
I thought you were referring to pay lunch to hungry people...

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nfriedly
Any hackers in Cincinnati? I'll buy lunch sometime :)

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electronslave
I like the fact that the guy's obviously overweight. I'm still giggling, in
fact.

