
It's Time to Fall in Love with Stuffy, Crowded Subways - martey
https://medium.com/s/love-hate/its-time-to-fall-in-love-with-stuffy-crowded-subways-3a92bd93015b
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yostrovs
Article seems to imply that since a highly inefficient monopoly, on which
thousands were forced to rely on and pay handsomely for, is simply going to
turn off service for a year and a half, that's when you'll find out how
wonderful it really is. Traveling to other places with better, working systems
won't do it. Having our system simply fail to function, though, will.

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martey
I think the focus on New York City's L line closure is the least important
part of the article. Far more important is the idea that standard public
transit (subways, buses, etc.) is more efficient than any new solution (Uber,
Lyft, scooters, hyperloop, some future autonomous taxi service) because the
former serves more people.

Most of the people on this site don't have significant personal experience
with the NYC subway. I think that if you are going to write a comment making
claims that are directly contradicted by the article (e.g. you state the NYC
subway is a "highly inefficient monopoly" when the article calls it a
"success"), you should cite reputable sources that also contradict it.

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yostrovs
Take a look at the subsidies that the MTA receives from the state and city.
Add to that the money consumers spend on the service, and divide by number of
rides. Now ask yourself why this number is more than it costs a person in
Dallas to drive across the city in his own car, listening to his own music,
and sitting in comfort while the air conditioner is set to his precise
desires?

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martey
Since Dallas has a completely different population density and size than NYC,
you're making an apples-to-oranges comparison. Do you have data that using the
MTA costs more than having a car in NYC?

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yostrovs
One can never perfectly compare two cities, can they? And I can't compare cost
of car ownership in NYC with and without existence of a government subsidized
subway.

But if you measure dollar spent per passenger mile traveled, the MTA is
incredibly expensive.

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martey
Yes, but you can compare the cost of car ownership in NYC versus the cost of
relying on the subway. I think the fact that New Yorkers think the L line
closure is so momentous belies the idea that they would prefer to eliminate
their "government subsidized" subway and all buy cars.

> _But if you measure dollar spent per passenger mile traveled, the MTA is
> incredibly expensive._

Incredibly expensive compared to what? The article explicitly claims that
public transportation like the MTA is the most effective way to transport
large numbers of people around a dense city. I haven't seen anything in your
multiple comments that suggests differently, other than a throwaway reference
to Dallas (a city whose metropolitan area has a third of the population in a
larger land area) and repeated suggestions that the subway is somehow bad
because it is publicly funded.

I would love to see actual data that private transportation (whether Uber,
Lyfts, taxis, shuttles, charter buses, etc.) are more effective or efficient
that their public counterparts. I don't think that your complaints about the
MTA are properly engaging with the article's thesis.

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yostrovs
You're beating the wrong horse. I'm not arguing against public transport per
se, but against the idea that the MTA resembles any kind of efficiency.
Compare to Hong Kong, Singapore, Santiago, Chile, or really almost any other
subway on Earth. The waste is incredible.

