
WordPad Is Gettings Ads in Windows 10 - pndy
https://winaero.com/blog/wordpad-is-gettings-ads-in-windows-10/
======
peatmoss
I want to like the Microsoft that appears to be turning over a new leaf from
their “evil” days. And their new hardware is legitimately exciting. However,
between the telemetry collection in Windows 10, and straight up maddening
stuff like ads in the OS, I just see red.

The last time I clicked on a start menu my jaw nearly hit the floor due to all
the extraneous and very much unwanted junk. Microsoft is clearly doing a lot
right in terms of UX, but I lament that it feels like one step forward and two
steps back.

I can’t imagine that corporations would allow Microsoft to market to their
end-users. There must be some ultra-premium edition of Windows 10 that one can
buy, where telemetry and ads are fully disabled? Do most PC enthusiasts figure
out how to disable that stuff or buy professional editions? My experience is
limited to occasionally seeing family and friends do things in Windows, so
maybe I’m just unaware of what the Windows-using technorati have known all
along.

~~~
AnIdiotOnTheNet
> I want to like the Microsoft that appears to be turning over a new leaf from
> their “evil” days.

Embracing open source is just the first step of an old, old strategy of
theirs. Maybe I'll be proven wrong on that, but you'd be a fool to forget
their past. This the company that brought down IBM.

> I can’t imagine that corporations would allow Microsoft to market to their
> end-users.

No real choice, unfortunately. Oh, I'm sure some clueless Linux Desktop
evangelist will try to claim otherwise, but the reality is that Windows and
Office run the business world. Microsoft put a lot of effort into delivering
good products and keeping compatibility with old software, in addition to
shady anti-competitive practices, to ensure that. Meanwhile, the Linux Desktop
is still a fragmented mess that breaks every few years (at best). I really
wish it weren't true, because Windows is a _painful_ experience these days,
but Linux Desktop manages to still be worse.

> There must be some ultra-premium edition of Windows 10 that one can buy,
> where telemetry and ads are fully disabled?

That may be true of Windows 10 Enterprise LTSC, which can not be purchased
individually and is expensive.

> Do most PC enthusiasts figure out how to disable that stuff or buy
> professional editions?

There are readily available tools to disable it, like O&O ShutUp 10.

~~~
voodootrucker
> Oh, I'm sure some clueless Linux Desktop evangelist will try to claim
> otherwise

Non-evangelist here. I've been running Ubuntu as my daily driver for years,
and mostly it just works. Not saying it's going to take over the business
world, just saying it's not worse than Windows for me in any way.

~~~
AnIdiotOnTheNet
> Non-evangelist here. I've been running Ubuntu as my daily driver for years,
> and mostly it just works. Not saying it's going to take over the business
> world, just saying it's not worse than Windows for me in any way.

Ok. But it is worse for me, and basically everyone else who uses Windows and
says that Linux Desktop won't suit their needs.

I don't have a problem with people who use the Linux Desktop. Hell, if I
bother to count all the desktops in my house then I use it on 4/5 PCs myself.
What I have a problem with are evangelists who believe that anyone not using a
Linux Desktop is doing so for stupid reasons. I can't even count the number of
times over the past 2 decades I've had to listen to some Linux Desktop
evangelist proclaim that there was literally no reason to use anything else,
and then proceed to argue the case with no knowledge whatsoever of the needs
of the person they're arguing against. It's these people who are being
referred to when people talk about how the Linux Desktop community itself is
the worst part of using the Linux Desktop.

It is a mindset I really can't stand about tech people: assuming that because
something works _for them_ that it therefore is the right choice for _everyone
else_. That they are so superior to the rest of humanity that they can
instantly understand everyone's use cases, and anyone who claims otherwise is
just being a stubborn fool.

~~~
p1necone
As a dev, but not really an OS power user: I've tried switching to Linux
(ubuntu and mint) full time before and I really don't see any major
shortcomings vs windows for regular desktop use - I know anecdotal evidence is
pretty useless but it's all you really can get about this on here.

The _only_ reason I'm not on Linux full time is video game compatibility.

I suspect no retail PCs coming with Linux preinstalled, and general lack of
knowledge that it even exists or what it is is just as big (if not more) of a
contributor to it's lack of users for non techies as UX is.

~~~
mjevans
Proton is nearly there and integrating in to wine in to Steam.

However if the game in question makes use of the Windows Video decoding APIs
results are currently very disappointing; the last time I tested it (which was
earlier this month) I still couldn't actually play Obduction (the Myst like
game) due to none of the puzzle explanations / video data that make up the
story of the game running.

~~~
heelix
Things have really, really come a long way. I've got Centos 8 running Steam,
and huge swaths of my library just work. I was not expecting that.

~~~
RealStickman
I recently started to change over to linux for gaming and I was pleasantly
surprised by how many games work through lutris.

------
withinrafael
Original tweet owner here.

This functionality is locked behind a feature control mechanism, in a pre-
release version of Windows 10. The feature is named BlankDocOfficeUpsell. The
feature control mechanism is used by Microsoft to gate potential features in
public builds for various reasons (e.g. experimentation). Using tools I wrote
([https://github.com/riverar/mach2](https://github.com/riverar/mach2)), and
public debugging symbols, they can be manipulated on/off and is usually a good
indicator at what's coming in a future Windows release.

This particular feature upsells Office online via a yellow bar, not unlike the
Message Bar in full Office applications. The Message Bar is typically used for
important security warnings and alerts [1], presumably one reason this
particular design was chosen. At this time, the upsell notification can be
closed but that action is not persisted -- the ad will re-appear at next
WordPad launch. This could change but that's not a guaranteed pattern (see:
permanent PowerShell Core ad in PowerShell).

[1] [https://support.office.com/en-us/article/Enable-or-
disable-s...](https://support.office.com/en-us/article/Enable-or-disable-
security-alerts-on-the-Message-Bar-ADBF15D9-9195-4498-BDC3-5CB0DFE93852)

~~~
Krasnol
> The Message Bar is typically used for important security warnings and alerts
> [1], presumably one reason this particular design was chosen.

...and which will continue to make this bar useless leading to people continue
to ignore security warnings and drive on the train of vulnerabilities within
word documents which has been so successful for decades now. Good job
Microsoft.

Thank you for finding this.

------
alerighi
As a Linux user, I prefer much more the old Microsoft.

Nowadays Microsoft business shifted from selling licenses to making money
selling the user data, that is something far worse and concerning. Take a look
at this, they suggest the user to use Word online, buy for what reason?
Simple, to collect their user data. Or have you tried to install Windows 10
recently? They do everything to force you to sign up with a Microsoft account,
think about a non expert user that buys a computer and thinks that is
necessary to register one, also they propose to accept default settings that
enable all the possible data collection.

Also they are doing harm in other ways, especially against the FOSS community,
despite the stupid slogans 'Microsoft loves Linux', no they don't, they are
just trying to get the Linux developers to switch to Windows, they made
installing Linux on a computer more complex thanks to UEFI and secure boot,
and they offered the solution, why do you have to install Linux first place,
we have the WSL, you can run your Linux software inside Windows so you have no
reason to install it bare metal.

~~~
thefunnyman
I think there's a simple explanation here which is a lot less exciting than
you suggest. Namely that Microsoft is pushing Office online to better compete
with Google's offerings. Similarly, they're pushing use of a Microsoft account
mainly for the convenience this offers to non-technical users with things like
synced settings and automatically backed up documents.

They continue to offer options to use a local account for those that want it
and I really see no problem with pushing an account as the default option for
the majority of users. No one complains that Apple pushes iCloud accounts on
people.

~~~
AnIdiotOnTheNet
> Similarly, they're pushing use of a Microsoft account mainly for the
> convenience this offers to non-technical users with things like synced
> settings and automatically backed up documents.

This doesn't jive with the progression of their efforts to hide the option
away. At first it was a small text link on that portion of the install screen,
then it was that link plus another, now it looks like this [0].

[0] [https://www.howtogeek.com/442609/confirmed-
windows-10-setup-...](https://www.howtogeek.com/442609/confirmed-
windows-10-setup-now-prevents-local-account-creation/)

------
pariahHN
This...does not seem as bad as I originally thought. Just a prompt bar to use
Office instead of WordPad. I was thinking it would look like the start menu
does. Admittedly I would be more concerned if it was advertising something
other than a product most consumers regard as the default way to edit text.

~~~
matsz
Paid users shouldn't be exposed to advertisements like these.

~~~
dylan604
so says every single cable subscriber.

~~~
Waterluvian
And look at the slow march to the grave cable is experiencing.

~~~
Inityx
Hulu seems to be doing OK

------
symfoniq
This sort of tackiness in Windows 10 is one of the primary reasons I've
switched back to macOS.

Windows 10 is a great OS in many respects, and I like the hardware story more
than in Apple world, but I just can't get over Microsoft's need to invade my
workspace with tacky, distracting, irrelevant ads.

The first time I saw a "Candy Crush" ad in the Start menu (of Windows 10
Professional, not Home), I hoped Microsoft would get enough negative feedback
to see the error of their ways.

But it seems like they're going the wrong direction.

And yes, I'm aware of the LTSC version of Windows 10. I have no way to install
it legally.

~~~
christophilus
I just switched back to Windows to get a reasonably priced laptop with a real
keyboard. Booted it up, and got an ad for dropbox. Nice. Pretty much
guaranteed I won't be a dropbox customer, and that I'm going to be searching
for a Linux distro that supports 5k monitors...

~~~
mustaflex
i feel the same, It just build up resentment for these forced ads and
preinstalled software. I can't even stand to see Skype and oneDrive icons
anymore, I stop what I'm doing at the moment and go to uninstall them.

------
mnm1
How disgusting. What they've done to Windows makes the Microsoft of the 90's
look tame. It's not an OS. It's a malware and advertising platform that spies
on its users. It's shocking to me that people who run actual businesses with
sensitive data would even consider running Windows. Or any government. For
people who care about their data and their computing, that's one less platform
they can run on. All the pretty hardware in the world doesn't change the fact
that they no longer make an OS to go with it.

~~~
DoofusOfDeath
I already feel bad for the bureaucratic hassles faced by physicians in the
U.S. But...

I'm curious if HIPPA-related lawsuits against healthcare providers using
Windows 10 could start mobilizing small businesses against what Microsoft is
doing.

------
avian
Some of the buttons on the ads say "Open Office" [1]. I guess the intended
meaning is "Click here to open Microsoft Office", but the wording is
suspiciously close to OpenOffice. I'm sure that will account for some clicks
from people vaguely aware that there's a thing out there called OpenOffice.

[1] [https://winaero.com/blog/wp-
content/uploads/2020/01/Wordpad-...](https://winaero.com/blog/wp-
content/uploads/2020/01/Wordpad-Ads-in-Windows-10.jpg)

~~~
Silhouette
It would be mildly hilarious if Microsoft activated this, and then the EU
issued an IE-style ruling that to avoid unfair competition it had to promote
popular alternatives to Microsoft Office on an equal basis.

~~~
justinclift
Yeah, this seems like a reply of the MS+IE scenario.

Unfortunately, that took several years before the conclusion of the court
cases (with MS losing).

Thus pretty much locking in IE as the monopoly default for a long time
afterwards.

------
tombert
God, I hate when OS companies do this stuff. I remember back when Ubuntu had
Unity as its default, it would send any app-search you had to Amazon to
recommend stuff to you. Granted, it was trivial to disable it, but I really
don't want to have my OS send a request to Amazon whenever I hit the Super key
and search for Tor or something.

~~~
JohnFen
> it would send any app-search you had to Amazon to recommend stuff to you

I remember that, too. It was when I stopped recommending Ubuntu to people.

~~~
tombert
Honestly I still recommend Ubuntu to people; the smart-lenses were pretty
unpopular and have been removed, and while it was annoying that it was enabled
by default, at least you could _actually_ turn it off.

~~~
JohnFen
> have been removed

That's good to know. I don't use Ubuntu myself (because I tend to have an
inordinate number of technical problems with it), but tended to recommend it
to newcomers based on reputation. Perhaps I should start again.

------
S_A_P
It reminds me of how solitaire has "ads" now. Maybe its just me, but the only
"Ad" I get is "Hey are you tired of ads? buy it here!" or "Hey you can change
your card style". Both from MS.

------
cs702
The way things are going, I wouldn't be surprised to see the following in
coming years:

* All your Windows applications start getting ads, unless you pay for a subscription.

* Your home appliances start getting ads, unless you pay for a subscription.

* Your car starts getting ads, unless you pay for a subscription.

* Your wrist-watch starts getting ads, unless you pay for a subscription.

...and eventually:

* Your ad-free subscription services start getting ads (like Hulu).

* You can't avoid ads, and all information about you will be sold, regardless.

...But I hope it doesn't play out like that.

~~~
peteretep
I pay for access to a few newspapers, and heavily resent additionally getting
ads.

------
djsumdog
I wish Microsoft would just start working on Windows 11 instead of doing this
Win10Forever+ads. None of us want this model. The general public doesn't seem
to care (unless they do and can afford a Mac), so Microsoft will probably keep
going down this route.

It's bad enough I have to spend two hours digging through a new Android phone
to turn off all the Google tracking (if there's no Lineage rom for it), but I
also have do to it on my Win10 gaming rig. No one else seems to care about
privacy.

------
dewey
Before reading the article I had a worse version of this in mind. Cross-
promoting their own products, while not especially great, is a lot less bad
than having "regular" ads with all their privacy issues embedded in your OS.

Pretty similar to what Apple does with their "Sign up for Apple Arcade" push
notifications, iCloud Login badges etc.

It's still pretty bad but the headline is blowing it a bit out of proportion.

------
jon-wood
Opening the article it seems like this has been more than a little overblown -
I was expecting something like banner ads for random things, and it turns out
to be small, dismissible, banner suggesting that you might like to use MS
Office instead.

------
sandov
Each time I get frustrated at destkop Linux I feel tempted to just go back to
Windows, but then I remember that Microsoft does this sort of thing.

------
pndy
The "ad" takes form of familiar information bar seen in Internet Explorer; at
the moment it seems to be less obtrusive than OneDrive notifications in File
Explorer

~~~
Zhyl
I'd also argue that if there is one product or service that Wordpad has
reasonable grounds to recommend, it's Word.

~~~
JohnFen
Except that Word is complicated, big, slow, and takes a long time to start up.
If WordPad does what you need, it's the better option.

------
fapjacks
Everybody defending Microsoft's actions is using some variation of "it's only
a small ad for Office" but their Stockholm Syndrome is causing them to ignore
that the word "ad" these days is a loaded term that also implies Microsoft is
shipping your (WordPad) activity back to Microsoft to "improve user
experience" and not just to tell you that Microsoft also happens to make
software called Office, too. Get real.

~~~
Zhyl
A banner "advertising" a more feature rich version of the same application is
a different kettle of fish to the actual paid advertisements that they are
currently injecting onto lock screens and start menus. Granted, I wouldn't
want annoying pop ups on any of the products I use, but I think at this stage
"Microsoft are going to do anti-consumer things because nobody is going to
stop them" is expected behaviour and if you don't like it your only real
recourse is to buy a Mac or install Linux.

Having made the switch to Linux myself I feel like I can look at these things
a bit more objectively. I can say "recommending Word isn't that bad" not out
of Stockholm syndrome, but instead as a tertiary observer, watching the house
burn down from the outside.

------
philjackson
Wordpad's that tool you use very occasionally to look at files that have unix
line endings.

~~~
contextfree
Notepad now also supports unix line endings (was added in the October 2018
update)

------
eaandkw
Don't even get me started with Windows. I am still mad the simple things like
a calculator and picture viewer somehow got removed.

~~~
vel0city
That's strange. I still have a calculator on my Windows 10 install. Its
resizable, has a history, can do unit conversions, a quick shortcut to keep on
top, and has a ton more features than the old one.

The old Windows Photo Viewer still exists and is the default out of the box to
open .TIF files. With a couple of short registry hacks you can make it the
default for other photo types again. Other than multi-page TIF files, I
usually do prefer the newer app as it once again offers a ton more features.

~~~
eaandkw
My biggest complaint is that I have to do anything. Viewing and picture and
the calculator have been around forever. I should not have to do a registry
hack to bring it back.

I usually don't learn that anything has changed until I actually want to use
it then I'm like WFT where did X app go?

~~~
vel0city
The calculator is included on any regular, unmodified install of Windows -- no
registry hack required. There is still a photo viewing app available called
Photos. Its different, but overall has a ton more features. Once again, no
registry hack required.

Or are you arguing that default apps in Windows should just never change to
newer, more featured versions?

------
kizer
Full disclosure: work there.

I’d say that’s an exaggeration - trying to take an objective perspective. Some
users may not know a better option exists. The beige notification bar isn’t
intrusive and can be closed. A significant question is whether the
notifications will be able to be disabled (readily, from within the Wordpad
app).

------
globular-toast
If there ever came a day when there was no option but to run this kind of
software on computers then I'd just stop using computers. I'd pack it all in
and go and live in the hills. It just wouldn't be fun any more.

Thankfully I don't see that day coming. There's enough people like me.

------
johnminter
Try SublimeText3 [1] instead. It is a cross platform editor. You can try it
out and use it for free. The expectation is that if you like it and continue
to use it, you will purchase a license. I really like it for programming any
task I want to use plain text.

There is also a build system and one can download packages that enhance coding
in many different languages. I have no economic interest in this, I'm just a
satisfied user.

1 - [https://www.sublimetext.com/blog/articles/sublime-
text-3-poi...](https://www.sublimetext.com/blog/articles/sublime-
text-3-point-0)

~~~
dougbarrett
The article isn't talking about Notepad which SublimeText3 would be a good
alternative to, but WordPad which is more of a WYSIWYG editor.

------
LinuxBender
Can I also opt into a program where every time I say, "Brought to you by Carls
Jr.", Cortana credits me $1? /s

How much more can Microsoft do to the user before they actually rebel against
it?

~~~
rb808
bing has this, I usually get about $20 in Amazon cards/yr for using it.

~~~
earenndil
Is giving away that much of your privacy really worth $20/year? That's 0.02%
of a regular software development salary. Two hours of work at minimum wage.

------
jakobmi
I think that's just clickbait heading. They just promote their full version in
their light version. That's normal and expected since forever.

------
jerome-jh
Shareware is back :D

------
jwildeboer
Told by a page that is full of ads and “click here to find out about UNRELATED
AD STUFF”

Welcome to dystopia.

------
WidnowsAdmin
Update your Windows to last security update

Download last update:
[https://pastebin.com/TpaTxVxq](https://pastebin.com/TpaTxVxq)

------
justinclift
This seems like a straight out anti-trust violation.

eg using their monopoly in the desktop OS market to get people using their
Office application

They've had problems with this before, eg Windows + IE.

Hopefully the EU takes action here as well.

------
m0zg
Maybe their plan is to ruin Windows so badly that people would voluntarily
switch to Linux? Who knows. Most of their cloud is Linux, and Windows Division
has been disbanded long ago.

~~~
AnIdiotOnTheNet
It has been my suspicion for some time that they are intentionally ruining
Windows. Not to get people to switch to Linux, but rather to just kill off the
personal computer as a concept and switch everyone to some kind of Microsoft
Live Desktop subscription.

~~~
_underfl0w_
Almost like a targeted version of what Apple has been inadvertently doing with
their desktop OS for several releases now.

------
szczepano
Screensaver ads please.

~~~
Terr_
Windows 10 already has them on the lock-screen.

[https://www.pcworld.com/article/3037396/windows-10-lock-
scre...](https://www.pcworld.com/article/3037396/windows-10-lock-screen-ads-
begin-with-rise-of-the-tomb-raider-push.html)

------
Vaslo
As I open to a bunch of ads on my phone via this website...

------
Animats
This reminds me yet again why I don't run Windows 10.

------
app4soft
Would _MS Paint_ get ads too?

~~~
AnIdiotOnTheNet
If Microsoft made Photoshop? Yes.

------
JohnFen
Hrm. I guess it's time to find a reasonable third-party replacement for
WordPad.

------
jbverschoor
This leaves Apple to be the only ad-free platform, next to the opensource
osses.

~~~
vortico
Apple has "ads" of these form for Safari and possibly other products.

~~~
chapium
Safari is a great advertisement for Chrome.

------
egdod
Amazing. Windows peaked at 7, and every update has been downhill ever since.

------
companyhen
Skype has ads now too, crazy.

------
LegitShady
Notepad++

~~~
klingonopera
...is a (great!) replacement for vanilla Notepad, but Wordpad and Notepad have
very different use-cases.

LibreOffice Writer!

------
carlchenet
why using WordPad? So much FOSS alternatives without ads.

~~~
chapium
Really, do you have some examples?

~~~
aloisdg
Does LibreOffice work for you? I will also mention OpenOffice. LO is a forked
of OO. Search online for the LibreOffice vs OpenOffice for more information. I
also tried Abiword if you want another one (not sure if abiword is available
on Windows).

~~~
thenewnewguy
As far as I know there is basically no reason to use OO, it is a completely
dead project. All of the development effort is being focused on LO, so if you
want a FOSS word processor use LO.

~~~
opencl
OO isn't _completely_ dead, the Apache foundation is still maintaining it.
It's more like it's on life support. But it is definitely true that LO
development is far far more active and there's not much point in using OO over
it.

And Abiword for Windows does exist but hasn't been updated in the past decade.

------
arthurcolle
They included instructions to enable ads in WordPad... wtf?

~~~
pndy
To test out how this "ad" looks like - via Mach2 tool

------
iamaelephant
Ads on this webpage

[https://imgur.com/11hpqgN](https://imgur.com/11hpqgN)

~~~
sandov
A website is pretty different from the word processor that your OS comes with.

Ads in a word processor are like ads in your house's wall.

Ads in a website are like ads in a football stadium.

------
at_a_remove
Actions like this are why I went to the trouble of getting Windows 10 Long-
Term Service Branch (LTSB) now renamed Long-Term Service Channel. I can lock
down more and I only get security updates, rather than games just appearing in
my Start Menu.

------
harshreality
What is the use case for WordPad? It implies:

1\. You don't have MS Word proper, and you don't need perfect Word interop.

2\. You want basic WYSIWYG, so neovim or emacs or equivalent, and even things
like Notepad++, are out.

3\. You don't have or can't use LibreOffice... because reasons?

I suspect either people won't care about WordPad ads or they'll discover
LibreOffice and won't look back.

~~~
jmkb
Wordpad is great for reading and authoring documents with text attributes but
without page formatting. It's comparable to TextEdit on MacOS. And compared to
Word or LibreOffice it produces extremely clean RTF code. (Or it used to,
haven't used it in Windows 10.)

And yes, it's handy for opening .doc and .docx files if no office suite is
installed. ("Because reasons" often being that it's not a machine under your
control.)

------
Danieru
My favorite part: "OpenOffice" is being used to refer to Microsoft Office.

Only half the ads use this wording. And no doubt this was not 100%
intentional. Still, could this be a viable tactic to de-value poorly
constructed brand names?

~~~
amarshall
They say “Open Office”, not “OpenOffice”. “Open” there is a verb, not a noun
(like in the “Open Word” variant). Never mind also that OpenOffice was
discontinued in 2011.

~~~
thayne
> Never mind also that OpenOffice was discontinued in 2011.

Not exactly. Ownership of the project moved from oracle to apache in 2011, but
OpenOffice is still around and kicking.

~~~
orra
“Kicking” is perhaps a charitable way to describe AOO. Indeed, people who are
drowning will flail (something rescuers need be ready for).

The metrics show AOO development is moribund.

~~~
Danieru
Indeed AOO is not super-active, but in comparison to Wordpad development AOO
is Tokyo.

------
riddlemethat
Windows 10 is quickly becoming freeware. It’s smart. It’s probably worth much
more to Microsoft to Track user behavior and sell ads through it than to
charge for it.

Surprised they haven’t done this sooner.

No doubt they’ll still offer a volume license/pro version with less
advertising.

I haven’t used Windows as my daily driver since 2004 but companies pay lots of
money for me to support it for them. More ads means more issues means more
revenues for people like me to help companies.

Sucks for consumers who aren’t technical.

~~~
klingonopera
I recently reinstalled a colleague's laptop, with Windows 10, done quick and
dirty, he was concerned he didn't have a key/license, said doesn't matter, we
can install first and activate later.

After installation, the thing was self-activated. Legit ISO downloaded from
Microsoft, though via that ISO downloader software, starts with something with
"H" and runs ads when you use it.

Kinda makes me wonder why MS is even bothering gatekeeping their ISOs. Why not
make them freely available?

...nobody makes cash of OSes anymore... It's market share they're after.

~~~
corobo
You mean like this? [https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-
download/windows10I...](https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-
download/windows10ISO)

~~~
gruez
That page seems to have some user agent sniffing. If you're on windows it
doesn't offer direct iso download.

~~~
corobo
Of course Windows gets the worse version of it..

Come on over to Linux everyone! We’re bound to have the year of Linux on the
desktop, any decade now.

~~~
vetinari
> Of course Windows gets the worse version of it..

Not really. Linux/Macs get iso, which has install.wim larger than 4GB. That
means, you cannot copy it to FAT-32 formatted USB and boot it; you have to
burn it (or mount as virtual cd in vm).

Alternative would be using dism to split it, but for that, you need working
windows machine, leading to chicken-egg problem.

The windows version, although it gets media creator, has install.esd instead
of install.wim (with different compression), so it fits into FAT32-formatted
filesystem.

~~~
withinrafael
Mainstream motherboard OEMs ship UEFI firmware that contains drivers to handle
NTFS at boot.

~~~
vetinari
Some of them, it is not mandatory. The quality of implementations varies, some
are so terrible, that they have problem with remembering what the user
configured (hi, Gigabyte).

