
Scientists reverse aging-associated skin wrinkles and hair loss in a mouse model - anastalaz
https://www.uab.edu/news/research/item/9607-scientists-reverse-aging-associated-skin-wrinkles-and-hair-loss-in-a-mouse-model
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Nasrudith
Another case of "fixing the problem we created in the mice in the first
place". While good for reproducability and analyzing possible root causes it
is frustratingly disappointing.

I would really want to see is the process on actual senior lab mice - that
would highlight other factors untreated and how transferrable it is to the
general case for mice - let alone humans. If open-ended trial mice reach
unprecedented ages that would have major implications.

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theothermkn
I could not disagree more. As the article states, and this meshes with my
layperson's understanding, mitochondrial malfunction is a key facet of aging.
While we strongly suspected the role of mitochondria, being able to turn them
on and off and observe their effect really cements our understanding that,
yes, they are involved in the ways we think they are. Further cause for
optimism is that toggling the mitochondria toggled other age-associated
behaviors in the mice.

One of the pillars of SENS is allotropic expression of a subset of
mitochondrial genes in the nucleus, to get those genes away from the
mitochondrial furnace. We can speculate that other mitochondrial gene
therapies may emerge from work like this.

I can't be disappointed by this progress!

~~~
reasonattlm
No, this really is breaking the mice, not inducing something that looks like
SENS-relevant damage in mitochondria. The details matter.

Many means of breaking cell biology can produce things that look superficially
like accelerated aging in at least some ways. That doesn't mean it is aging:
given that aging is widespread tissue dysfunction, anything that causes
widespread tissue dysfunction can have overlapping phenotypes, but that
doesn't mean it has anything to do with normal aging. DNA repair deficiency is
the usual example - something that isn't all that apparent in normal aging, in
comparison to the models in which DNA repair machinery is missing or broken.

So, similarly, pulling the rug out from under mitochondrial function can be
done in countless ways that have very little to do with what happens in aging.
I think the onus is still on these researchers to demonstrate that the method
they have chosen has much of anything to do with aging per se.

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theothermkn
To me, this is akin to finding out what happens to airplanes when their pilots
die. If we're wondering about this because they have been dying of
asphyxiation at altitude, we'd still learn something if we ran the experiment
of shooting them dead at altitude. The conditions aren't exactly the same, but
we'll still figure out that pilots are important to airplanes.

The other thing worth noting is that there could be some confusion from the
title. It has "aging-associated" in it. The charitable understanding is along
the lines of my analogy. The uncharitable, and seemingly popular one, is along
the lines of your counterargument, and I think interprets "aging-associated"
as "due to or consequent of aging," rather than "due to a cause that is
similar on one level to causes that come about by aging."

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phyller
The article title should read, "Scientists able to temporarily induce some
symptoms of aging in young mice". If they could have reversed symptoms of
aging in actual old mice they would have done it.

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thermodynthrway
Hair loss cure has been around for a while, at least for MPB. Been taking
finasteride for almost a decade and haven't lost any hair. Most guys are
scared away by rare but serious side effects. But most of the problem seems to
be getting guys to take pills regularly at all

~~~
WilliamEdward
Finasterade supposedly doesn't reverse hair loss, it prevents it.

~~~
ravenstine
That's what seems to be the case with any existing hair loss products; if you
have nearly invisible wisps of hair left, minoxidil and finasteride will
rejuvenate those and prevent further hair loss. Not really a cure. If too much
hair loss has occurred, you're kinda screwed unless you go the transplant
route, which has its own problems.

I do hope for an actual hair loss cure, and I'd pay thousands for it. People
treat bald people really different and don't even realize it. Not in
necessarily a "bad" way, not like a second-class citizen, but I think bald
guys are slightly scarier to the average person, especially if the guy shaves
it or keeps it short. Obviously they are also less attractive on average
unless they've got the muscle proportion and the jawline to go with it.

It's not all bad since it also means that I'm no longer treated like a "young
man" by anyone. But when I wear a hat or a beanie and people don't know that
I'm bald, they're a much nicer and women come up to me a lot more. It's like
night and day. At least that means there's nothing wrong with my face! :)

~~~
smnplk
There is a experimental drug called setipiprant. Theoretically, setipiprant's
DP2 receptor antagonism may counteract the activity of PGD2 in hair follicles,
thereby stimulating hair growth.

~~~
ravenstine
Very interesting. I'll definitely have to keep track of that one since it says
no serious side effects have been discovered yet.

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2_listerine_pls
What a time to be a mouse

~~~
sschueller
I think we have pretty much cured every disease a mouse could possibly have
including aging...

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Joboman555
Look at the picture of the mouse - it’s not aging, it’s dying. Yes, they
“reverse” the condition, but only by the cessation of giving these little guys
poison (doxycycline, a harsh antibiotic). This could have been called “high
doses of doxycycline almost kills mice.”

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pandasun
>doxycycline, a harsh antibiotic

Do you have any sources for it being harsh? I'm curious because I've been on
antibiotics for 2 years (yes really) and this is the one I tolerate the best.

~~~
GordonS
I was also on doxycycline for over 2 years, and barring a slightly dodgy tummy
for the first 48 hours (fairly typical for antibiotics), I didn't notice any
adverse affects. It did transpire that my doctor had 'forgotten' I was still
on it though (I was only meant to be on it for 6 months!), so I did wonder if
there were any adverse affects of taking it for that long!

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jgalvez
Ray Peat proven right once again.

~~~
chuinard
He's the one doctor whose stuff I've read that I think make most sense. You
get a lot of people saying he's crazy, though. Wonder if anyone on HN has ever
had any success reversing hair loss? The ultimate hack, if you ask me.

~~~
davymac
Yeah, lots of stuff on Quackwatch about him. Not exactly flattering. I’ll pass
after reading that stuff. Broken clocks being right twice a day and all.

~~~
jgalvez
It's just absurd to call him a quack. The man is 80 years old, a renowned
biologist, several books published. He has ZERO interest in monetizing his
ideas -- he charges a ridiculously small amount for his bimonthly newsletter,
which is hardly making him richer.

Ray Peat is a true scholar and a gentlemen, he just wants to untangle the
mysteries of our metabolism and sees through what the media and government try
to shove down our throats.

His pieces on the vegetable oil industry are just the start of his many
revelations. I've never looked at the food and drug industry the same way
after knowing his work.

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amriksohata
We hear of these kind of studies time and time again yet never see anything
materialise for humans.

