

Fujitsu Not Pleased With Windows 8 Demand, Either - mtgx
http://allthingsd.com/20121228/fujitsu-not-pleased-with-windows-8-demand-either/

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Lewisham
Honestly, I'm surprised there are still as many Windows OEMs as there are
right now. The consumer PC market has cratered since the iPad, and Apple's
tactic of getting Macs into colleges is paying dividends now those students
are moving into their 30s. How many people really _want_ a Windows machine at
this point? With Valve's aggressive move into taking PC games off of Windows
altogether, I really don't know what market segment is left loyal to the
platform.

Samsung might be taking a hit on experiments such as Chromebooks, but my guess
is its going to be the OEMs that diversify quickly and focus on quality and
not quantity that will stay in the business of selling computational machines
to consumers.

Windows 8 is Microsoft's parting gift to the desktop. I'd put money on Windows
9 going Metro only, and perhaps a revival of the NT brand for enterprise
buyers to keep the desktop around.

~~~
elorant
_How many people really want a Windows machine at this point?_

You know, it's funny that your id says that you're studying video games and
yet you make such a bold statement. Anyone who's into serious gaming wants a
Windows machine. Duh!

~~~
Lewisham
Many people into serious gaming are not necessarily on the PC platform. The
other aspect is that the majority of those that are are buying into the Steam
ecosystem. As I said in my OP, I expect those players will follow Valve away
from Windows to Linux if Valve courts them (and developers) aggressively.

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jkat
How much of this is being driven by issues with Windows 8 versus people simply
being content with what they already have? The core 2 duo era killed the buy-
a-new-computer-every-2-years thing. I think that, not tablets, is the new
reality MS and friends have to realize.

~~~
Zirro
That people are no longer purchasing new computers every two years sounds very
likely, but I think Microsoft (though not their partners) has realised this
already. That's why they've been pushing the new "design language" so hard, to
the point of including it on non-tablets where it (arguably) doesn't belong.

At least among the people around me, the money which would previously be spent
on a new computer is used to buy a tablet (mainly iPad) instead. While I'm not
sure if the way Microsoft is approaching the tablet-market is right, I don't
think they're wrong if they're betting on tablets overtaking desktop/laptop
computers in a not so distant future.

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CamperBob2
_I don't think they're wrong if they're betting on tablets overtaking
desktop/laptop computers in a not so distant future._

Sigh. Yes, when that future includes cerebral neuroimplants, tablets will
replace desktop PCs. Until then, that's as ridiculous a notion as believing
that tractors will replace steam shovels, or that motorcycles will replace
cars.

Touchscreens, and by extension tablets, are not useful for desktop computing.
It ranges from amusing to mildly annoying when people in online comment
threads believe otherwise, but it's a cause for full-blown market panic when
Microsoft executives believe otherwise.

~~~
Zirro
"Touchscreens, and by extension tablets, are not useful for desktop computing.
It ranges from amusing to mildly annoying when people in online comment
threads believe otherwise..."

I can't tell for sure if it's what you are implying, but I don't believe
tablets comes close to replacing desktop computers in terms of functionality,
nor do I think they should be used for "desktop computing".

However, I believe they have the potential to cover the needs of most people.
Saying that tablet-sales will overtake other kinds of devices, and saying that
tablets are fully capable of replacing such devices are very different things.

~~~
ams6110
Yes. Large numbers of home users use their PC for email, Facebook,
browsing/shopping, and maybe skype/Facetime. Tablets are perfectly good for
that and easy to use while sitting on the couch. Those users are likely never
again buying a standard desktop or laptop.

~~~
seanmcdirmid
Kids will grow up on iPads and might...perhaps...graduate to macbooks when
they go off to college. Then they'll use a PC at work and come home at night
to their tablets/devices...

Alas, there will be no one to program these PCs/devices in the future because
kids won't grow up with code capable environments (well, maybe they'll be able
to code on the web ala Kahn's academy).

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vyrotek
I've been running Win 8 on my home machine since it was available on MSDN. I
went through the initial headache and then my old habits were replaced by new
ones and I was just as productive again.

But, guess what. I recently realized that the reason I have no problems with
the new menu is because I've managed to completely avoid it! For a little
background, I'm a C# dev so I use VS 2012. I'm also an avid gamer. But there
are times where I won't open the new menu at all for a couple of weeks. I'm
not sure how I feel about this...

I'm generally optimistic about things from Microsoft, but this one has me
puzzled. I don't think it's a negative thing, it just feels like a feature
that's sort of "just there".

Edit - As far as I understand, it is required to use Windows 8 to develop Win
8 apps. So basically its only use so far is a dev sandbox.

~~~
rednukleus
For the power user -

Windows 7 - press start key and type the name of the program you want to
start, get a list of matching apps in the bottom left corner of the screen.

Windows 8 - press start key and type the name of the program you want to
start, get a list of matching apps in the middle of the screen.

~~~
tsm
Windows 7 - pin all your most common apps to the dock, and press Win-# (where
# is the 1-based index of the app you want in the dock) to launch it.

Windows 8 - ???

~~~
rednukleus
Exactly. If you think the Windows 8 fullscreen start menu is getting in your
way, it means you haven't yet learned how to use Windows 8. For a professional
user this should take a matter of days, or even hours/minutes.

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EwanG
I don't doubt Win 8 demand is "weak", but I understand that app store activity
for paid apps more than doubled after Christmas. So I suspect that a better
measure will be to see where we are in January after all the folks who got new
PCs and other Win 8 paraphernalia begin to be counted.

Not to mention, unlike the reaction to Vista, I don't hear folks asking for
their machines to be retrograded. IOW a reaction of - I may not hurry up to
upgrade, but I'm also not going to go out of my way to avoid it.

Obviously just my .02 on the matter.

~~~
modeless
I haven't piled on the Win8 hate bandwagon in the past, but I'm actually
liking it less the more I use it. The start screen, while not as terrible as
some say, has not proved useful in any way for non-touch devices and is at
best an annoyance. Microsoft have clearly gone out of their way to make it
more difficult than before to switch away from the default Bing/IE combo (the
latest annoyance is that "Microsoft Update" uses a hardcoded link to IE
instead of your default browser, and IE nags you to change your default
browser once it's open). For DirectX development Microsoft has downgraded
their SDK by adding non-optional integration with Visual Studio and charging
money for parts that used to be free (PIX); plus they removed the DX9 debug
runtime so it's harder to debug DX9 apps.

If I was going to reinstall Windows right now, I definitely would choose
Windows 7 over 8. There's nothing in 8 that's a must-have for desktop use, and
there are many things about 8 that are more annoying than 7. Plus,
hardware/app compabitility with 8 is still spotty (I've had a lot of problems
with Boot Camp).

~~~
gabemart
I've been trying to avoid moaning about win8 too because I came pretty late to
the party and I get the feeling it's talked out. But like you, I get more
annoyed the more I use it . The start screen is tolerable (though I never use
it), but I find the "swipe" gesturing and charms bar very irritating. And more
irritating still, I find the fact that there's no obvious way to turn them off
just obnoxious.

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WalterBright
I guess my experience is a little unusual. I went to check out and possibly
buy one of the new Surface tablets. But next to it was an Asus laptop, about
the same size as the tablet, with a touch screen, and a real keyboard. All for
$499. A Surface, with the add-on keyboard that seemed a bit flimsy, cost more.
The laptop seemed pretty sturdy.

So I bought the laptop. I like having a laptop with the touchscreen interface.

Win8 now includes a pdf reader. But it bizarrely does not remember the last
page read, and there's no way to go directly to page 147 without hitting the
arrow key 146 times, making it a real pain to read books with it.

That's probably my main complaint with Win8 :-)

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dbecker
I haven't touched a Windows 8 machine, but the TV commercials make Windows 8
look foreign and unlike anything I already know how to use.

I view it as a Windows 8 ninja rapidly switching between all sorts of tasks I
vaguely understand, and the relationship between the gesture and the
computer's response seems hard to follow.

Maybe the OS is really easy to use, but their marketing would make me think
twice before buying a Windows 8 machine.

~~~
mtgx
No, you feel that way because that's actually how it is. This guy described a
lot of the problems with Windows 8 and he is pretty spot on (although he does
exaggerate a bit in some cases):

<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WTYet-qf1jo>

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WrkInProgress
I haven't watched the whole video but I'm on his first point which is
"Control" (or rather the lack of it) which he says is his biggest issue with
Windows 8.

His example was that he tried to google how to do something and he was
launched into the weather app. His accompanying screenshot was that of the
charms bar with search and he typed in the word Barcelona AND selected the
third option for him (which is the weather app). He spends the next 40 seconds
talking about "goblin farts".

I mean seriously .... what kind of garbage critique is that ?

He is not even close to "being spot on" from the first ten minutes of the
video and I doubt I should even bother watching the last ten minutes.

