
My 2015 MacBook Pro Retina Exploded - zepolen
https://medium.com/@dourvaris/my-2015-macbook-pro-retina-exploded-119ea5ea9d1f#.pgd3f8jme
======
josefdlange
I get the whole "cautionary tale" thing, but you should probably contact Apple
to remedy both your personal loss and so that they have more information about
failing components. In my experience they take this stuff very seriously.

~~~
eddieroger
Same. I had an issue with a failed charger many years ago, and in addition to
getting a new charger, I was contacted by their product safety group for more
information on how it was used to make it stronger in the future. Confirmed,
they take product safety seriously.

> In fact it could be happening to your battery right now.

Yes, any lithium battery in any device could have this problem. Odds are good
that it was swelling before it finally failed, and if the machine hadn't been
restarted and instead had been checked, that may have been identified. Would
this article be getting the same traction if it wasn't a MacBook?

~~~
matclayton
I had the exact opposite experience, I went in to a store with a MacBook Pro
(2013) which had morphed by a good 1-2cm's due to the battery expanding over
the course of the previous hour. They refused to take it and insisted I book a
genius appointment for the following week.

After much insisting (30-40minutes) they finally agreed to take the battery
and keep it in their safe for a week, until the first available genius
appointment was available. There they said it was out of warranty as its a
disposable part and therefore not covered by the AppleCare+ plan I had at the
time. Genuinely it was the worst experience I've had in an apple store to
date.

~~~
CalChris
You might have countered with _I understand it isn 't covered by AppleCare. I
suppose we'll found out if it's covered by Apple liability._

~~~
pc86
But then we couldn't have snarky internet posts about how terrible Apple is!

~~~
koolba
True but we'd get snarky internet posts about the cleverness of their in-house
legal defense team.

~~~
JBReefer
"most valuable company on Earth sues man whose testicles they burned off" is
about the worst PR possible

------
coldtea
> _After reading up on the matter it seems that lithium batteries can swell,
> and there have been numerous reports in the past about older MacBook
> batteries swelling up and catching fire — however with the newer unibody
> laptops there is no way you can see this swelling happening._

That's true. Damn, Apple, how about a bloody sensor for such stuff at least to
give an early warning?

> _If you have a MacBook be careful leaving it unattended on the bed, battery
> fires burn hot and fast with little time to react._

Whereas if you have any other brand it's OK?

 _Millions of computer users were on red alert last night after they were
warned that their laptops could burst into flames at any moment. In an
extraordinary admission, the world 's largest computer firm, Dell, said
yesterday that 4.1 million laptops are at risk. The computer giant was forced
to confess that problems with the laptop's batteries, made by Sony, means they
are a major 'fire hazard'._

[http://www.nbclosangeles.com/investigations/I-Team-
Investiga...](http://www.nbclosangeles.com/investigations/I-Team-
Investigation-Battery-Lithium-Ion-Fire-Laptop-Computer-412459303.html)

~~~
rhcom2
I don't know if it is a sensor or just a timer but my 2012 MBP warns me about
my battery nearing the end of my life.

~~~
extra88
I hope your MBP is not warning you about the end of _your_ life ;)

My thinking about what your Mac is doing is in line with rsynnott, it might be
based on your battery's current charge capacity vs. its original capacity, I'm
more inclined to think the message is triggered by your battery's cycle count.
You can find all this information in the System Information application, under
Power.

------
Animats
How much extra space did Apple allow around the battery for swelling?
Samsung's problem seems to be that they fit the battery in so tightly that if
it ever swells, it's contained by the limited space. Then pressure builds up
until it shorts, goes into thermal runaway, and catches fire.[1]

Maybe it's time to require that anything bigger than a phone use lithium-iron-
phosphate battery technology, which doesn't have a thermal runaway problem.
Most pro power tools already do; it's expected that they will be used hard and
abused. So do "Boosted" brand electric skateboards, and many (all?) second
generation UL approved "hoverboards". If it's going to be banged around, that
seems to be the way to go.

There's a 14% energy density penalty with lithium-iron-phosphate batters vs
regular lithium-ion. They're also more expensive. But the "does not blow up or
catch fire" feature is worth it. Here's a video of someone driving a 3" nail
through a LiFePo battery.[2] Five minutes of heavy white smoke and some runny
black stuff, but no flames or explosion. Compare the standard nail test (done
by remote control) of a LIon battery.[3]

[1] [https://www.cnet.com/news/why-is-samsung-galaxy-
note-7-explo...](https://www.cnet.com/news/why-is-samsung-galaxy-
note-7-exploding-overheating/) [2]
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EMARDvMz62A](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EMARDvMz62A)
[3]
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f30fBFitkSM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f30fBFitkSM)

~~~
Retric
That 14% works out to around a billion + per year in the US which is IMO not
really worth it for the few actual issues with lithium ion batteries.

~~~
mediocrejoker
Can you clarify what you're referring to? A billion what per year? Dollars?

~~~
Retric
Yea, dollars based on approximate US sales. Though I can't find exact figures
so that may be low or high.

------
busterarm
The last time I took my 2015 rMBP on a flight with me, TSA saw my laptop on
the scanner and the guy at the machine's eyes bugged out while he did a double
take. They swabbed the crap out of my laptop, detected nothing and then let me
through.

I was confused and didn't understand why, but I wonder if maybe battery
swelling is why.

~~~
magic_beans
Aren't you supposed to put laptops "alone in its own tray"?

~~~
alistairSH
US: Rule is non-thin laptops go in a separate tray. Tablets and super-thin
laptops can stay in the bag. But, this is enforced inconsistently.

Europe (UK, Ireland, Italy, and Iceland): Separate tray every time I've passed
through in the last 4 years.

~~~
alasdair_
I have a backpack where the sleeve for the laptop pulls out completely from
the backpack itself but stays attached with "rails" to prevent theft. I've
never had an issue with this and never needed to place the laptop in a new
tray. I fly once a month round trip in the US.

~~~
alistairSH
True enough, I forgot about the TSA bags with flip-out sleeves.

------
teekert
Hmm, reading this I think my old Kindle Keyboard has a swollen battery. I
googled a bit and found this excellent write-up [0]. It suggests to stop using
it immediately. Bummer! I have been using it for 2 years now (I think) in the
swollen state...

[0] [https://www.howtogeek.com/244846/what-to-do-when-your-
phone-...](https://www.howtogeek.com/244846/what-to-do-when-your-phone-or-
laptop-has-a-swollen-battery/)

~~~
damontal
do you prefer the keyboard over the paperwhite or are you just using it
because it's good enough?

~~~
teekert
It's still good enough for me :)

------
mynegation
I do not know what happened, but given that bed is in the picture, it could
happen that the laptop was put on a blanket or a pillow, which closed the air
ducts.

Having said that, of course, safety mechanisms should have shut down
everything before the temperature goes into the proximity of the danger zone.

~~~
enraged_camel
>>Having said that, of course, safety mechanisms should have shut down
everything before the temperature goes into the proximity of the danger zone.

Um, they did. It's literally the very first sentence of the article.

The guy decided to turn it back on, which is when it blew up.

~~~
mixedCase
I don't know about Macbooks, but my desktop PC will refuse to POST if temps
are past the critical threshold.

~~~
reitanqild
My lenovo laptop sometimes tests if boil-in-bag might be a good idea for
laptops _now_ even if it hasn't been anytime before.

I'll notice when I open my bag and find a hot laptop with little battery left.

Oh and burn marks in the screen. Lenovo has already replaced one screen.

~~~
beat
I have a Dell craptop from the dayjob that sometimes puts itself into hell
when going to sleep while unplugged. It gets REALLY hot, probably burning 100%
cpu on whatever little nightmare Windows is having, until the battery runs
out. If I notice it, pop the lid, and press the power button, it goes right to
sleep properly.

To the point of a comment above, this is why the article is noticed when a
MacBook is involved, but it wouldn't be if it was, say, a Dell. We just
_assume_ that this obviously shoddy piece of generic Windows crap could just
catch fire due to design flaws. If my MacBook caught fire, I'd be shocked. If
my Samsung Chromebook caught fire, I wouldn't be. If the dayjob Dell caught
fire, I'd call it par for the course.

------
awiesenhofer
Defective batteries aren't that new to Apple, I remember having to exchange
the battery from my white pre-unibody MacBook twice because it was swollen by
over a centimeter. There was a recall even IIRC. Of course, back then you
could swap it out yourself.

~~~
stinos
_Defective batteries aren 't that new to Apple_

Exactly, happened to me as well like 6 years ago (which in combo with the
magnetic power connector made me lose work more than once due to me
continueing to use the macbook without bad battery followed by me/cats/wife
tripping over the cable). Just searching for e.g. 'macbook swollen battery'
gives quite some results.

------
bratsche
There have been a number of stories about laptops and mobile phones exploding
due to issues with batteries. Fortunately the author here managed to get the
Mac into a reasonably safe place just before it really exploded and he got
away with only blistered fingers.

What I'm curious about is, are companies like Tesla able to put some sort of
safety precautions into their cars and their PowerWall to prevent this from
happening and to alert the user that something in their battery is horribly
wrong? An electric car battery is way bigger than a Mac's battery, but at
least the car owner has the chance to get out of the car and get away from it.
But a Powerwall? If it's going to blow up is it going to burn your house down
in the process?

------
ipsin
If unseen swelling is a problem, couldn't you fix it with a simple sensor,
like a fragile paper tape conductor that goes around the battery?

It swells, the circuit goes dead, and that's the signal for the charger to
stop charging.

~~~
RKearney
Correct me if I'm wrong but these incidents are sometimes triggered by
charging, but never escalated by it.

Once the layers of the cell make contact it shorts the entire battery and
causes the battery to discharge quickly, releasing the energy in the form of
heat.

Just because you've removed the power source from the battery doesn't mean the
battery won't stop discharging.

~~~
detaro
Batteries (can, not always) swell quite a while before they "go off", so
detecting swelling would be a useful sign that something is wrong and to stop
charging to not trigger it.

~~~
jononor
A pressure sensor between battery and its enclosure could be used. Or strain
sensors on the pack itself. It should probably just disallow charging
completely, as people have a tendency to ignore warnings.

------
zeveb
This really worries me: I own three laptops, use a fourth for work and thus I
often have three — and sometimes four — laptops fully-charged at home. What
exactly _are_ the parameters under which an unattended laptop may catch fire?
Only when the laptop itself is running? Only if running and heat exchange is
impeded?

I honestly don't know, and that worries me.

~~~
DenisM
I'm thinking maybe purchase a fireproof safe and lock the laptops in there
while not in use?

I can't think of much else, really.

------
evo_9
Unsurprisingly even Apple laptops require ventilation; I thought it was common
knowledge that you can easily destroy any laptop by running it on a soft, heat
multiplying surface like a bedspread....

~~~
mikeash
With modern technology, it's completely unacceptable for consumer electronics
to _catch fire_ when running it on a bedspread. It should shut itself down
when it gets too hot. Worst case, it might break due to being too hot, but it
should never catch fire.

~~~
raarts
I don't think anyone disagrees with you on this.

~~~
SippinLean
Apparently the parent comment does as it appears to be blaming the victim

~~~
OopsieBadidea8
No one knows if this was truly a defective battery before overheating.

The way I read it: CPU gets hot, battery damage from overheating begins,
computer shuts off. User turns it on again not knowing the state of the
electronics inside. Possibly weakened or damaged electronics cause the battery
to blow up.

Bad ventilation weakens electronics and continued use causes catastrophic
failure. This is not new.

~~~
spronkey
It is highly unlikely that thermal runaway was caused by the computer
overheating.

It's far more likely that a defect in the battery caused this. Perhaps the
laptop tried to draw too much power from the battery, and it failed.

------
hasbroslasher
Didn't Samsung already patent this feature?

~~~
devopsproject
They copied it from apple ;) [http://www.digitaltrends.com/mobile/more-
exploding-iphones/](http://www.digitaltrends.com/mobile/more-exploding-
iphones/)

~~~
DonHopkins
Actually the NeXT cube pioneered the prior art of computer hardware exploding
into a inextinguishable conflagration of flames. Apple just refined and
popularized the technology by making it much easier to ignite, without
requiring additional peripherals like a MAP gas torch.

[https://simson.net/hacks/cubefire.html](https://simson.net/hacks/cubefire.html)

------
BadassFractal
Had a portable bluetooth speaker do the same to me while I was in the same
room with it, it was simply charging, wasn't even being used. Also very
fortunate to be able to extinguish it right on the spot before it set the
apartment and consequently the building on fire. I've grown pretty skeptical
of that sort of batteries after the fact, but there's not much you can do
about it at this point since there's one in almost every device you can think
of. It's like sitting on an explosive device that can go off anytime without
any notice.

~~~
stcredzero
Having higher power density is very convenient, but _not exploding_ is a great
characteristic of NiMH batteries. Charging mishaps can happen with those as
well, but I've never heard of a cascade failure overtaking NiMH while just
sitting there.

I've had young programmers sneer at me about my continued use of NiMH AA and
AAA batteries, but there are some advantages.

~~~
spronkey
I wouldn't give Lithium Ion-based stuff to kids to play with unsupervised.
NiMH for the win.

------
PascLeRasc
Is there some way to tell if a battery is swelling using CoconutBattery? Like
some sudden dropoff in capacity?

~~~
tedmiston
Not sure if there is, but if you click the _Battery Info..._ button, it shows
a popup with a field called _Battery failure_ in addition to the normal _OSX
battery status_.

------
jimrandomh
> There was a bang as I backed away causing the back to pop and smoke kept
> pouring out. It kept sizzling for a few minutes and then finally it stopped.

> The house had filled up with smoke everywhere, the acidic stench of melted
> plastic made my eyes water.

> After I had opened up all the windows in the house and cleared out the
> smoke, ...

Wrong answer. The correct answer was "leave the building and call the fire
department". You _really_ _really_ do not want to breathe the smoke from a
battery fire.

------
DenisM
Well, one more thing to worry about. Should I leave my MacBooks in the
bathroom sink when going out?

~~~
admyral
If you're going to be worried about everything that has a small chance of
failing and injuring you, I'm sorry to say you're currently living in a
minefield. But statistically you'd be more likely to break your toe on the
coffee table than your laptop exploding and burning down your house.

~~~
DenisM
My toe will heal, the stakes are low. My house burning down on the other hand
can have fatal consequences for my cat if I'm not at home.

~~~
admyral
Depending on where you live, house destroying disasters like earthquakes,
floods, and storms have similarly fatal consequences but are statistically
more likely to occur. My point is make reasonable preparations and insure any
valuable belongings, but thinking about it too much doesn't make it any less
likely its going to happen to you.

------
rickyc091
One thing I'm curious about is if the author noticed a budge before the laptop
exploded and brought it to the Apple store. I had a similar problem as I
noticed the laptop was uneven as I was typing. Noticed there was a bump on the
bottom and brought it to the store to have it repaired. Not saying it's ideal,
but there might have been a chance it could have been prevented before it got
too far out of hand.

------
dfsegoat
Just curious if there is a manufacturer+model and/or lot number that is still
legible on the battery or an old system report output? Have been having some
weird overheating and "hard off" power-issues with my 2015 MBP --- and now am
pretty concerned about this.

It is a remanufactured from Apple though. So I know the battery was replaced.
But still...

------
doctorwho
This has been a problem since forever. I had one of the first Intel Macbooks
and the damned thing blew up 2 batteries. They swelled up to about 4 times
their original thickness overnight. Luckily, they didn't explode but after the
second incident the Macbook got recycled with extreme prejudice.

------
BWStearns
Similar thing happened to my retina external display the other week and I had
to unplug my monitor and run it out to my balcony while I could see flames in
the display (though I assume the root of the problem was different as there is
no battery). Luckily it suffocated itself pretty quickly.

------
chiefalchemist
One does not a trend make.

How many were manufactured? How many failed in this way? Is it reasonable to
expect perfection? (Hint: Oh hell no.)

p.s. I'm not saying it's right. Simply pointing out that "life happens" and
random events are in fact woven into the fabric of the universe.

------
HugoDaniel
Apple has a page dedicated to batteries

[https://www.apple.com/batteries/maximizing-
performance/](https://www.apple.com/batteries/maximizing-performance/)

------
roryisok
yikes. I have two very swollen lithium batteries in my shed from two old mbps
I've been meaning to ditch. I had no idea they could spontaneously combust.
I'll be getting rid of them tomorrow!

~~~
wila
If they been there for a while then they are discharged and there is nothing
to worry about.

------
partiallogic
I'd be interested to know how the bathroom tiles look and whether people
recommend to do the same in a similar situation.

------
nodesocket
As a shareholder, curious what Apple said and did as a response. Did they
offer a brand new MacBook free of charge?

------
erdojo
If you sit a MBP on a pillow, the fan circulation is significantly reduced,
causing overheating. It also depends on your CPU usage...running with a few
dozen tabs open while editing videos? Yikes, hot.

One other thing: if you smoke, residue can also reduce the effectiveness of
cooling systems and affect system performance.

EDIT: Not suggesting this was the OP's fault, just suggesting there are
logical ways to reduce this risk.

~~~
pdabbadabba
I'm confused. What does this have to do with the apparent battery failure that
OP experienced?

~~~
OopsieBadidea8
Why are you assuming the battery is the source, not the result, of a failure
elsewhere in the system?

No one has done a real root cause analysis and research shows humans are
really bad at it when relying on intuition alone.

Cascading failure here is possible. I've never seen one actually light a
battery on fire. The last encounter was a gaming level video card plowing a
capacitor, starting a fire within the entire desktop.

From the article:

> If you have a MacBook be careful leaving it unattended on the bed, battery
> fires burn hot and fast with little time to react.

If this person was in a habit of leaving it in a poorly ventilated place, like
their squishy bed, the electronics could have become compromised over time.

Also from the article:

> however with the newer unibody laptops there is no way you can see this
> swelling happening.

This is not true. Users have reported that prior to discovering battery
swelling, their trackpad quit working and in some cases began separating from
the top chassis.

------
ZoFreX
Pretty lucky he dealt with it so quickly. A mattress fire is not a trivial
thing to deal with!

------
JustSomeNobody
> After reading up on the matter it seems that lithium batteries can swell...

People really need to be educated on battery chemistry when they buy battery
operated products. Here's a programmer, so I assume he has some technical
abilities/interests, and yet even he doesn't seem to know that some batteries
can do this.

~~~
k-mcgrady
>> People really need to be educated on battery chemistry when they buy
battery operated products.

Or it should be illegal to sell products that can catch fire/explode. I admit
to knowing nothing about battery tech but if there were suddenly massive
penalties for exploding batteries I don't think it would be long until we had
a workable solution. It should not be up to a consumer buying a phone/laptop
to learn about how their battery works and how to identify a potentially
dangerous situation.

~~~
JustSomeNobody
> Or it should be illegal to sell products that can catch fire/explode.

You own a vehicle?

~~~
laythea
"during normal use"...

------
bpsagar
Similar thing happened with my IMac. Heard the hissing noise and smoke started
rising up from behind the screen. Quickly switched off the power supply,
thankfully it didn't explode but couldn't get it fixed after that. They
claimed that they weren't supporting that model anymore.

~~~
vortico
iMacs don't have batteries, right...?

~~~
itg
Could be from a capacitor?

~~~
detaro
hissing noise and smoke sounds like an electrolytic capacitor, yes.

------
pimlottc
This is definitely frightening but "exploded" sounds a bit hyperbolic to me.
Every time I've read about an "exploding" phone or other device it seems like
"caught on fire" would be a more accurate description.

~~~
mrb
" _There was a bang as I backed away causing the back to pop_ "

------
John23832
Given the debacle that was the Note 7 (which came from Samsung's obsession
with thinness), I'm surprised we don't see more of these super thin devices
catching fire. Luckily nobody was seriously hurt.

Next-gen's MPB will be .5 inches slimmer.

~~~
MikusR
It came from defective batteries not thinness.

~~~
John23832
The batteries expanded upon use, and due to the slimness of the phone, they
had no room. This caused the conductive chemical layers within the batteries
to leak through the porous separating layers, and the resulting reaction
caused fires.

To me, that has to do with slimness.

~~~
timdorr
I don't believe you are correct. No device manufacturer has room available
when it comes to internals. They don't leave gaps that aren't physically
required for operation. This isn't like an air-cooled desktop PC, it's a
device that has no affordances for excess space.

The big problem with the Note 7 was the battery design and manufacture.
Nothing within the device itself was the problem. These batteries would have
exploded in any device they were placed in (though they were built
specifically for the Note 7, like any phone battery nowadays):
[https://news.samsung.com/global/infographic-galaxy-
note7-wha...](https://news.samsung.com/global/infographic-galaxy-note7-what-
we-discovered)

~~~
John23832
> (though they were built specifically for the Note 7, like any phone battery
> nowadays)

Samsung requested a battery with the design of the phone in mind. That design
was faulty. Under normal operation the electrodes would expand and due to the
design of the electrodes and the faulty separators, there was a fire.

The slimness/design of the phone necessitated a battery design which was
faulty. I'm not saying that the battery literally had no extra room. There was
no extra room without causing a short circuit and fire.

------
yourapostasy
Perhaps Apple can attach a capacitor sufficient to drive the new touch bar, or
make the touch bar e-ink, then display an overheat warning and prevent the
power button from operating?

~~~
LeifCarrotson
A capacitor of sufficient size to drive the touch bar (even just a few
milliwatts for a minute) would be very large. The application requires a
backup chemical battery (which is already something present on the
motherboard) not a capacitor.

------
WildUtah
_I removed the back plate to observe the damage and hopefully see if the hard
disk had survived._

Apple has solved this problem in the current models. There's no longer any way
for the hard disk to leave you in doubt. It's now fused to the motherboard
permanently so that it cannot be recovered even if it does survive some kind
of trouble.

Keep your backups up to date.

~~~
iSnow
I think they have added a port to the mainboard which can be used to try and
salvage data if the mainboard is fried.

But it's still unbelievable that they soldered the SSD to the mainboard.

~~~
h1d
You would call it unbelievable if Apple made it tiny bit heavier or thicker by
keeping parts more independent but still call it unbelievable trying to keep a
minimal structure.

------
kippfe
heat/ventilation cause it? Using notebook not on a flat surface is the cause
of heated unit

------
theandrewbailey
> After I had opened up all the windows in the house and cleared out the
> smoke, I removed the back plate to observe the damage and hopefully see if
> the hard disk had survived.

> Didn’t look like it:

I agree. This is the first time I've seen a hard drive transform into (what
looks like) an SSD under any condition.

