
Ted Nelson argues the importance of personal computing (1979) [video] - davisr
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RVU62CQTXFI
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angleofrepose
It's been a little while since I've heard this one, but if there's one thing
that I remember hitting me is that the same language used by the interviewer
is used today about privacy, end user programming and any other more powerful
technology, programming language or paradigm. It seems that as an culture
we're always able to go so far, but not all the way. We see the path between
start and end, there's no genius needed for the last push, but after so much
progress we reduce ambition towards the end goal and instead develop arguments
against continuing.

At some point we just don't think people need help with paper based tasks,
"look around you, it's how everything is done" yet here we are with the PC 40
years later. And people look around and think that there is no chance everyone
could be a programmer "look around you, they're all consumers, they couldn't
understand how to make the computer do what they like". In 40 years there's no
doubt this viewpoint will be wrong, but the popular opinion on the matter
can't see that future.

See Bret Victors history of computing. The biggest adversary we have to
overcome towards progress is the mainstream experts of our own field.

We have apps which seem to be like starting from scratch every time, which
can't have abilities known by all because they aren't prepackaged by the devs
ahead of time. Every app reinvents a minimal subset of sorting and search. If
you have a better idea or a different connection you want to make its just not
possible in the app.

Stop pretending that debilitating users is actually good for them in the silly
word games we play. Give users power.

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himinlomax
> there is no chance everyone could be a programmer

There is no chance, even if by "everyone" you just meant "a majority". It's
intellectually challenging, just for one.

~~~
jstanley
Reading and writing is intellectually challenging. Everyone can do it now,
because we make sure to teach them to do it, and because it's necessary to
live in modern society.

~~~
himinlomax
Almost anyone can walk, not everyone can climb mount Everest, or even a much
smaller mountain face. Bad analogies are bad.

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AnIdiotOnTheNet
Are you seriously trying to claim that programming, of any useful sort, is so
hard that only really smart people, presumably like yourself, can do it?
Christ. I really hope the software development industry gets its ego kicked in
really hard in the near future so everything can stop sucking because of
elitist asshats.

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himinlomax
Well on one hand, it could be my massive ego, and on the other it could be the
truth.

You're the one arguing on the basis of value. I don't. Let me just ask you
this; do you think that being a good enough finance trader requires a high IQ?
I'm pretty sure of it, and I'm also of the opinion that what they're applying
their smarts to is a net negative for society as a whole.

Another question, have you read Steven Pinker's _The Blank Slate_?

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ggrrhh_ta
Such an immensely articulate person... His "Computers for Cynics" series is
also very recommendable, the blockchain/bitcoin one particularly so for
outsiders that want to know or need to communicate on related matters (e.g.
journalists). Happy to have been able to hear him in youtube, he feels so
close one feels one knows him personally.

~~~
zandorg
I worked with Ted a few years from 2001 and though we kind of stopped working
together, I knew him! So I do know him personally. He's a great guy though
intolerant of nonsense.

~~~
ggrrhh_ta
He gives that impression from his videos. He seems to speak his mind honestly
and rightfully demands reciprocity.

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bborud
I discovered that Ted Nelson has a Patreon:
[http://www.Patreon.com/thetednelson](http://www.Patreon.com/thetednelson) . I
decided to sign up and perhaps you would like to help out with a few bucks
too.

I've seen talks by him a few times and I think he is worth listening to. He
has interesting ideas well worth understanding.

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wombatmobile
13:40 "The two commonest digital notation languages in the world are musical
notation, and knitting."

Knitting is the perfect analogy for describing how DNA works to your
grandmother.

"Knit 1 purl 2 often enough and you end up with a sweater."

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dang
If curious see also

a thread from 2018:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17376753](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17376753)

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dustingetz
LMAO 8:10 Interviewer: This seems to me first and foremost to be a technology
looking for a problem to solve

~~~
konjin
He's right. The same way that writing was. We had perfectly good oral
traditions before writing and they were good enough to get us to the bronze
age.

I'm a bit annoyed at Ted Nelson for not making that comparison.

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the-dude
An [audio] tag would be more appropiate.

