
Ian Knot - ollyfg
https://www.fieggen.com/shoelace/ianknot.htm
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arijun
Perhaps he is the inventor of this knot in the same way I was the inventor of
short division in grade school--I thought I had invented it since no one had
taught it to me, but I had just rediscovered an existing technique. Since that
was the way my dad learned how to tie his shoes from his father before Ian was
born, I think the furthest one could say is Ian is _an_ inventor of this not,
not _the_ inventor.

However, this website is really cool, and it does do a much better job of
explaining than my frustrated attempts of "you just pull one loop through the
other!"

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anonytrary
It's the Ramanujan Effect.

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ak39
I tried googling “Ramanujan Effect” but nothing turned up. Could you explain
what you meant by that?

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seppoastian
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srinivasa_Ramanujan](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Srinivasa_Ramanujan)

"Though he had almost no formal training in pure mathematics, he made
substantial contributions to mathematical analysis, number theory, infinite
series, and continued fractions, including solutions to mathematical problems
considered to be unsolvable. Ramanujan initially developed his own
mathematical research in isolation; it was quickly recognized by Indian
mathematicians."

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weaksauce
The secure version of this is much better and the one I use all the time.
Doesn't get stuck and is quick to tie and untie.

[https://www.fieggen.com/shoelace/secureknot.htm](https://www.fieggen.com/shoelace/secureknot.htm)

~~~
weinzierl
Talking about other secure knots wouldn't be complete without mentioning the
Granny Knot and what Ian says about the secure knot:

> NOTE: For normal activities, the Ian Knot or other standard knots should be
> quite secure. I believe that many people seek more secure knots because they
> are, without realizing, tying their shoelaces with an un-balanced "Granny
> Knot". Please see my Granny Knot page that discusses this in detail.

~~~
mkl
I think this is right. In ten years of use, the handful of times the plain Ian
Knot has come undone on me were from stepping on and end or similar - it's
never come undone without some external force, and even then it's usually
fine. I just checked and I'm not doing the Granny Knot version.

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hamandcheese
I believe it’s impossible to tie a granny knot using the Ian Knot method.

~~~
mkl
It's definitely possible. It depends on which way you do the initial single
knot (right over left or left over right), relative to which way you turn the
Ian Knot loops (left end towards you or away). The are four possible
combinations, two of which produce Granny Knots.

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jimnotgym
Since this is Hacker News I am going to take issue with some technical points.
This is not a new knot, it is simply a reef knot with the ends slipped.
Generations of sailors know it as a way of reefing (reducing the area of)
sails . What this is, is an alleged new method for tying a reef knot with the
ends slipped more quickly than the boy scouts 'left over right, right over
left' method. I think this is an important distinction.

Actually I love this site! Does one thing, and does it well.

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jacobolus
Who ever said this was a new knot?

The reef knot (square knot) with both ends slipped is called a bow knot
(shoelace knot).

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reef_knot](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reef_knot)
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shoelace_knot](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shoelace_knot)

~~~
jimnotgym
> Who ever said this was a new knot?

> I tie my shoelaces with my own "Ian Knot", the World's Fastest Shoelace Knot
> (yes – I am the inventor):

It says so in the first line. How can you be the inventor of an existing knot?

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amingilani
I learnt this a while ago and haven't stopped using it since. Saves me the
trouble of bending over for too long and is a great party-trick.

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mjlee
I've always been impressed by the lasting quality of this site. It's extremely
simple (the only javascript is for ads), easy to navigate, fast to load and
ranks 1st, 2nd, 3rd and 5th in Google for "shoe knot" and "shoelace knot".

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lifeformed
Yeah, just look at the page source. So clean and readable, no extraneous
boilerplate.

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Declanomous
So, having tried this method in the past, and revisited this again just now, I
don't thing it is actually faster. The set up requires each hand to
independently form a loop with an opposite twist without the benefit of the
other hand to brace the rest of the shoelace against.

The gif of the knot does not show the set up, which is kind of unfair to the
standard knot since that part is fundamentally baked-in to the standard knot.
I'd love to see a video of the creator doing this from the start, because he
probably is pretty good at the set-up which is just as important.

I think part of the reason why I don't find this faster is because I use the
more modern style of flat/ovaloid shoelaces. Round shoelaces don't really get
"twisted", and linen shoelaces are pliable enough for it to not matter, which
means you could roll the laces around in your hand to get them to the starting
position for Ian's knot. With the laces in basketball/running shoes, I think
you need a bit more dexterity to manipulate the laces to get them to the point
where they are 'flat' than could be managed with Ian's knot.

I don't think switching to Ian's knot and round laces would save me much time
overall; the reason I like flat athletic laces is because I never have issues
with the knot coming undone, loosening, or stretching/tightening. I use round
laces on my work boots because flat laces are hard to untie if they get
gritty, and I always have to double-knot them or they come undone. Since this
is identical to the standard knot, I'm sure that would continue to be a
problem, and I think the set-up for the standard knot makes double-knotting
easier as well.

As a final note, my best friend ties his dress shoes this way (with the really
narrow laces), and it is definitely faster all things equal. I think those
narrow laces are probably the best use for this method.

All that being said, I originally found this site while looking for lacing
methods, and it's one of my favorite sites on the internet. It's basically
everything of what I loved about the "geocities" era of the internet (without
the stuff I hated).

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ollyfg
Interesting!

I've switched to using Ian's knot, and have found it to be both faster to tie
and easier to set up. I think once you work out how to 'pick up' the laces in
the right way, so that they are already in the correct starting position, it
gets a lot faster/simpler to think about.

Of course, I haven't been in your shoes - my laces are all the round type and
I haven't tried it with flat ones.

To each their own!

~~~
Declanomous
I like flat laces a lot because they seem to distribute the force a lot better
than round styles. I like my shoes to be fairly minimalist, I don't like
overly padded or heavy shoes, and round styles seem to put a lot more pressure
on the top of my foot.

The oval style with the sharp edges has a lot of the benefits of the flat
style, but is more universally compatible. The flat ones don't always move
well in round eyelets, they work better with loops in my experience.

The completely flat style doesn't tie well if one of the laces is twisted
though. I think it's a great option for athletic shoes though, where you are
more likely to care about a particular level of give, etc, and when you don't
want your shoes to become untied. The round style is cheaper, and if you don't
notice the difference it's probably a more versatile shoelace.

Plus you can do fancy knots with the round style.

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mkl
I've been using this for years - it's great!

An interesting memory anecdote: within two weeks of switching I had forgotten
the method I'd used for the previous 20 years.

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ilozinski
My name is also Ian and I have invented my own shoe-tying method independently
from Ian Fleggen's method. I believe it's faster than the "Ian Knot". Once I
come up with a name for it, I will publish it online.

Taking name suggestions...

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mrspeaker
Ianest Knot. The most Ian a knot can be.

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Dangeranger
This is a Reef knot tied using two bights. Nice little trick and a very clear
explanation.

We would use a knot similar to this when furling the foresail on schooners, as
it easily untied under sail.

If the author wanted a slight improvement in the explanation, mine would make
the finger diagrams use a transparency for the thumb and index finger so that
the reader could interpret the location of the laces behind the fingers.

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jonesetc
Hah, I worked in a grocery store part of my time and college and this is very
similar to the way I was taught to tie plastic grocery bags shut. Sub the two
handles of the bag for these loops, and repeat it a second time after pulling
through. Extremely useful for people on bike.

Practically impossible for the knot to come undone and after 5 minutes of
practice you can do it in literally 1-2 seconds.

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dang
Quite a lot of past discussion:
[https://hn.algolia.com/?query=fieggen.com%20points%3E3&sort=...](https://hn.algolia.com/?query=fieggen.com%20points%3E3&sort=byDate&dateRange=all&type=story&storyText=false&prefix=false&page=0)

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paulrd
Somewhat related: How to tie your shoes TED talk:
[https://www.ted.com/talks/terry_moore_how_to_tie_your_shoes#...](https://www.ted.com/talks/terry_moore_how_to_tie_your_shoes#t-159870)

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vermooten
Poor Ian, bless 'im.

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linkmotif
This is cool and I definitely appreciate that this page exists. Cool page!

However, totally absurd—Donald Trump levels of absurd—to say you invented a
knot. Not only have mathematicians categorized every possible way to make a
knot, but before that hundreds if not thousands of generations of sailors and
knitters certainly discovered every kind of knot that could be made. Very
strange to think you could have “invented” a knot... borderline disturbing to
be honest.

