
GM’s data mining is just the beginning of the in-car advertising blitz - uptown
https://www.theverge.com/2018/10/17/17990052/gm-radio-listen-tracking-habits-advertising-future
======
nathan_long
Every time I see ads in a new place, I think of this quote.

> Leela: Didn't you have ads in the 21st century?"

> Fry: Well sure, but not in our dreams. Only on TV and radio, and in
> magazines, and movies, and at ball games... and on buses and milk cartons
> and t-shirts, and bananas and written on the sky. But not in dreams, no
> siree.

~~~
roymurdock
Great quote

One day we'll engineer a way for humans to survive without sleep in order to
boost productivity, unless the dream ad lobby is strong enough to kill the
anti-sleeper bills and R&D

~~~
no1youknowz
I think it'll be more of an inception type affair.

Where the individual can go into their own world. With time dilation to engage
in whatever they wanted.

Imagine spending 5 years working on a startup, where in reality 8 hours passed
by.

Even better, if you had something like neural lace, where you could have a
simulated reality and interact with other dreamers and even save your progress
to the real world.

This would change everything.

~~~
bigiain
Excellent! Five man years of call centre staffing in every team member's
shift! Think of how much more outbound marketing we can afford to do now!!!

(BRB, calling my patent lawyer...)

~~~
TeMPOraL
> _(BRB, calling my patent lawyer...)_

Can HN comments be used as valid prior art to shoot down patents? I really
wish they could be.

~~~
laingc
They would count as public disclosure, so could be used to invalidate a
patent.

------
nimbius
Speaking as a full-time automotive mechanic, this has been a regular fact of
life for longer than most customers know.

most parts search systems and recall bulletin systems do backflips to get you
to report your customers. Popups requesting the make/model of the vehicle
eventually expanded to just asking for a partial vin, then full vin. Now its
not uncommon for Ford/GM parts search systems or recall databases to ask for
the subscriber code for the vehicles OnStar system. Enter that code and it
triggers a server somewhere at GM to pull vehicle data for the car. Ive called
up a warranty claim or parts hotline to find the person on the other end asked
for _my customer_ by name. Pretty invasive for a wheel bearing.

The good news is, you can permanently disable OnStar and remote data
collection fairly simply:

1\. Theres usually an onstar control box near the radio inside the dash (not
hard to get to.) this is NOT your ECM...look for a box with MAC address data
on it.

2\. Disconnect the box and open it. triple check to make sure its NOT the ECM.
youll find a daughter board with a GPS antenna, and a cellular antenna.

3\. Theres a male/male header bridge between the master board and that
daughter board. pull that bridge, or remove the daughter board, and youve
disabled onstar.

Caveats:

-Most vehicles dont check for the modem. youll not get a service code on the dash.

-This should not affect bluetooth pairing.

\- Onstar calls, both automated and regular, will fail with "call completed."

-Be perfectly certain you want to disable onstar because the box comes with crash detection software that tries to dial onstar and report your crash.

~~~
Shivetya
Having recently owned an Onstar equipped vehicle I had my ire raised early in
the year when they revamped their terms of service and such. They were
basically telling their customers how they would expand usage of their driving
habits and more and then charge us even more for the privilege.

Just look at their plans, [https://www.onstar.com/us/en/plans-pricing/compare-
plans/](https://www.onstar.com/us/en/plans-pricing/compare-plans/)

Starting at $25 a month just for crash reporting and stolen vehicle
assistance. I am of the opinion that if ANY manufacturer can detect a crash
that they legally be required to render assistance. This assistance can simply
be calling local authorities and up to informing the occupants through the in
car system that that has occurred. Even if you don't pay they know it
happened.

Onstar isn't the only plan but it certainly is the most expensive I have
encountered. Then again BMW will charge you not only for map updates but to
use Apple's Carplay.

Manufacturers have realized that if people buy cars and keep them longer then
they need to find means to turn that into a continuous stream of income and
too many are willing to exploit the safety side to do it.

------
weinzierl
In self driving cars (up to level 3) it will be a traffic violation to use any
devices other than the onboard entertainment system. The reason is that the
car needs a reliable way to tell the driver to take over. If the only
entertainment is through the onboard system the car can reliably get the
drivers attention when necessary.

Coincidentally this is also the perfect way to cut out any other advertising
channels and have complete control of the users attention.

 _I don 't know if this will happen, but I'd bet that there are people in any
major car company and beyond who are thinking how they can bring this scenario
into reality._

~~~
pdkl95
Max Headroom, Episode ABC.1.6, "Blanks":

    
    
        [TV shuts off, surprising everyone]
        Janie Crane: "An off switch!"
        Metrocop: "She'll get years for that.
                   Off switches are illegal!"
    

edit:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P9AZZVnNw60](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P9AZZVnNw60)

It's disturbing how many Max Headroom episodes are now _literally_ true.

"Blank is beautiful!"

~~~
ken
Much earlier than that, of course, the idea was already in Orwell's _1984_ :

As O'Brien passed the telescreen a thought seemed to strike him. He stopped,
turned aside and pressed a switch on the wall. There was a sharp snap. The
voice had stopped.

Julia uttered a tiny sound, a sort of squeak of surprise. Even in the midst of
his panic, Winston was too much taken aback to be able to hold his tongue.

'You can turn it off!' he said.

'Yes,' said O'Brien, 'we can turn it off. We have that privilege.'

------
nkrisc
Reading the article I see all the ways data on my listening habits is valuable
to GM and the radio industry and advertisers. How is the consumer rewarded for
helping these industries make more money? Why would I ever want to help them?
So I can get more targeted ads? There is nothing good about this for driver.

I don't want any part in this. I couldn't give a rat's ass what happens to the
terrestrial radio industry or its advertisers.

~~~
Zelphyr
The radio industry is going to be a shell of itself (if it isn't already) in
the coming years as driverless capabilities reach the point at which people no
longer need to watch the road. Then they'll be on their phones and tablets
while the car takes them to their destination.

~~~
sp332
iHeartRadio (formerly known as ClearChannel) already bought up a ton of radio
stations. On the other hand, they also have a popular music streaming app, so
they might survive the transition away from actual FM signals.

~~~
lozaning
I never got what drew people to the I heart radio app. Once im no longer
listening to radio, and am using my phone's mobile data, it feels like either
spotify or pandora would be much more preferable.

Do people actually listen to the Scooter crew morning zoo or w/e the local
station's morning show is on their app?

------
grownseed
My partner and I are the proud owners of a Toyota Corolla CE 2003. We often
joke about how it has to be the most nondescript car ever made. It has no
extra features (with the exception of the CD/radio stereo perhaps), it just
drives, really well, it's very efficient, nobody would ever think to steal or
break into it as long as there's pretty much any other car in sight, it
requires very little maintenance, and when it does we can go pretty much
anywhere and it's very cheap.

There'll come a day when we have to replace it, and I'm dreading having to pay
more for something that most likely won't be as reliable, but will attempt to
squeeze yet more "value" out of me. The corporatization of everyday goods and
services at the expense of consumers absolutely sickens me. I can't go to the
movies without having to watch 15 minutes of ads, even though I already paid
for my seat (and tickets are more expensive than ever). I fear giving my
email/phone number/etc. to anybody because I have no idea how they'll be used.
I have to regularly remind my ISP/phone provider to stop trying to push more
crap and use me as some sort of advertizing platform for my friends. And so
on.

People complain about Facebook, Google, etc. all the time for their
underhanded tactics, but at the very least I haven't already paid for the
product before being amalgamated into it... For all the people on HN who work
for these companies and help them implement these things, I do have to ask,
how do you sleep at night?

~~~
stareatgoats
I've come to the conclusion that ads will, if not countered, invade every
space that has any potential of human attention. It's not hard to see the
trajectory for one who's been around since the 1950's.

This is probably going to demand a new type of GMO human, one that can
concentrate on main content while at the same time processing ad content.

Or, we can stand up as the humans we are and demand that ads be banned from
being shoved down our throats at every juncture. In lieu of legislation (don't
have much hope there): some sort of manifesto that specifies how ads be
displayed (i.e. exclusively behind a 'show ads'-button), coupled with shaming
of the corporations that violate such an advertising 'code of conduct'.

It should really be tried.

~~~
username223
We actually had a pretty decent truce with ads in the pre-commercial-web days
of the 80s and early 90s. Newspapers had some black and white ads next to the
articles, which didn't flash or move around. They also sometimes had a pure-
ads color insert, which you could take out and throw away with hardly a
glance. Magazines sold their subscriber lists to junk-mailers, but sorting
junk mail was similarly painless, and delivering it helped fund the postal
service. TV had commercials, but we had VCRs with a fast-forward button that
couldn't be disabled.

In other words, the ads were easy to ignore if you weren't interested,
everyone understood that, and they were priced accordingly. There was money in
advertising, but not enough that the CEOs of ad companies were competing to
see who could be the first to shoot some poor human sucker at Mars on a
branded rocket. Then advertising turned toward all-out war, first with
annoyances like animated GIFs and pop-ups, then with surveillance-based ads
that started with DoubleClick (a.k.a. Google, a.k.a. Alphabet). Advertisers
became some of the richest men on the planet, somehow convincing people that
tracking every single mouse movement on every webpage made advertising
unimaginably valuable.

What really scares me is what the surveillance companies turn to when slinging
micro-targeted ads doesn't make enough money. Google+23andme health insurance,
anyone?

~~~
dvtrn
_Advertisers became some of the richest men on the planet, somehow convincing
people that tracking every single mouse movement on every webpage made
advertising unimaginably valuable._

Ad-men have _been_ some of the richest men on the planet long before the word
'mouse' referred to something _other_ than a small furry critter.

~~~
shostack
Please look up agency salaries before making that sort of statement. There's
decent executive comp at the top, but there's a reason for the industry
stereotype of being underpaid and overworked. It is also why so many from the
agency side flee to the brand side.

Ad agency pay sucks in general.

~~~
dvtrn
_There 's decent executive comp at the top_

Sorry, I thought "ad-man" was a pretty unambiguous statement that referred
directly to the executives of ad agencies?

------
philsnow
> car companies that wanted to offer _cool new options_ to consumers, like
> enhanced navigation or _remote access_

It was big news when those "car hackers" found a way to control car systems
over 3g. They want to _increase_ that surface area?

Their lack of paranoia is insane to me.

~~~
colemannugent
They want to increase the "feature" surface area as that increases sales.

Eventually this will become a big enough problem that cars will come with a
security rating just like the safety ratings they come with today. Most people
will be happy with their 4/5 security stars, but as everyone in the infosec
industry knows you can never be truly secure, only secure enough relative to
your threat model.

~~~
philsnow
> They want to increase the "feature" surface area as that increases sales.

That's GM in a nutshell, in my experience. I've rented 10 or so over the years
(because for some reason that's what car rental places I've been to
overwhelmingly have) and their cars tick lots of feature boxes but I would
probably never buy one.

------
rootusrootus
If GM doesn't make this data collection very explicitly opt-in (and backs it
up with some kind of audit guarantee) then my '18 Camaro will be my first and
last GM vehicle. Same with ads -- show me one, just one, and you lose me for
good.

Other than that, I don't see why people are in here bragging about their
awesome 15-20 year old cars. My brand new car has a manual transmission, a
knob for the volume control, no built-in navigation, etc. The only real
difference between this car and the one I owned in 2004 is that this is better
in all ways. All.

~~~
smnrchrds
If it proves a lucrative business model, you may not get a choice. Making
"smart" TVs was lucrative, and now almost all TVs are smart. No matter whether
you buy a Samsung,a Sony, or an LG. If advertising in cars becomes successful,
no matter what brand you buy, expect it to come with ads.

~~~
ericd
Sure you do. I've just stopped buying TVs. Projectors, at least, still seem
mostly focused on displaying images.

~~~
bscphil
Yep. I've got a 10 year old Plasma that still works and looks great. I will
never own a car that advertises to me and sells my data. Hell, I'll never own
a car that dings at me until I fasten a seatbelt if I can help it either.

~~~
slavak
> Hell, I'll never own a car that dings at me until I fasten a seatbelt if I
> can help it either.

Serious question: Why? I've never found it particularly helpful myself, but
what's the big deal about a sound that reminds you to put on a critical safety
device that you should already be using anyway? Do you really find yourself
hearing those dings for long enough that it becomes a serious annoyance? If
so, don't you think the ding isn't the actual problem there?

------
phakding
The car is last place I want targeted advertisements and distractions. I live
and breathe tech, but I drive a manual car with no GPS, no Bluetooth and no
remote connectivity. I turn on local NPR or connect phone using aux cable to
listen to podcasts. I never found any use of tech in my car.

~~~
ip26
Simple bluetooth is nice. Skip & rewind without picking up the phone, no need
to get it out of your jacket or backpack pocket either.

------
kjksf
I think people writing those articles apply shallow pattern matching and don't
understand economics of ads.

Have you ever wondered why not every possible business goes for the easy,
incremental revenue of advertising?

Why doesn't Netflix just show some pre-roll video add? It's easy money.

When you buy expensive shoes, why don't they pitch you also buying an
expensive jacket in nearby store and get an ad commission?

The reason is that ad income is extremely low, ads are not exactly welcomed
and degrade user experience.

Netflix makes $120/yr from you. They could make maybe $10/yr more if they were
aggressive with ads. But if you cancel Netflix because you're sick of ads,
then one year of you not paying for Netflix costs them more than 10 years of
ad revenue.

That why ads thrive in a very specific environment: the cost of ad impression
must be extremely low and there is no better way of getting money from the
user.

Robo taxis, the supposed future ad hell, are the opposite. They'll make lots
of money per user ($100+/month) and the cost of ad impression is very high.

If any robo taxi provider will be stupid enough to annoy passenger with ads
then they'll loose big time to another provider who isn't.

~~~
uw_rob
Netflix does have ads! And quite a lot of them too. They are just in the form
of product placement. Sometimes entire scenes will be for pitching a product.
Because of that I refuse to watch any of their original programming.

~~~
robertAngst
Im convinced smoking is a Netflix ad.

Their protagonists are always smoking in their originals.

Now you wont be able to unsee.

~~~
ip26
Could just be a cheap crutch for mood. Can it even be a crime noir without a
trenchcoat and a smoldering cigarette?

------
14
I also just saw a commercial for a Lincoln...something about the "connected"
car of the future. All I can say is that is about 5 years when I am in the
market for a new car, I will specifically be looking for a non connected car.

~~~
ilikecakeandpie
I hope you'll be able to find one. Finding a decent TV that isn't "smart" is
pretty difficult.

~~~
blihp
Don't plug in the Ethernet or give it your wifi password and even the smartest
TV gets dumb really fast. I'm actually going to be plugging mine in soon (only
for a little while) just to see who/where it's sending data.

Same with a car: don't let it connect via wifi. If it has a cell modem, cancel
the service plan. In the unlikely event that there's no plan to cancel, 'mod'
it with wire cutters and/or a dremel. (of course this assumes that you own the
vehicle rather than lease it)

~~~
pdkl95
SoC devices with built-in LTS/etc cellular support have been available for
several years. The only thing stopping a TV from _bypassing_ your LAN is
negotiating some sort of cheap bulk-rate, off-peak with the carriers.

~~~
blihp
Sure, but even with a bulk rate is it economically worth it for them to do so?
My understanding is that the current trend in massive data collection has been
viable because they've externalized significant costs (i.e. consumers paying
for devices and data.) If the company collecting it has to start footing the
bill for the data plan, does it still work for most of them? I don't doubt
this will change over the long term but am skeptical that it will be in the
next 10 years at least... would love to hear if I'm wrong on this. If it does,
then I suppose the way to go would be the hardware hack: snip
off/ground/shield the antenna or otherwise disrupt/jam it...

------
post_break
My GM truck has onstar data. I can remote start it with an app. Through Amazon
I can have packages delivered to my truck when parked at work, they unlock it,
put my package inside the truck, and lock it. I wish it had an API so I could
write a script to start the truck without using their terrible app. That being
said I won't be surprised if Amazon or GM uses this data and sells it.

~~~
BoorishBears
I was able to reverse engineer the Android app and pull out the API key, the
api itself is documented if you make an account on the developer site, but you
can't get an API key without a business agreement

It took talking to a head of development at OnStar over LinkedIn to even get a
response explaining how to get an API key so I wouldn't bother there, getting
the API key from the app is pretty straight forward (just don't share what
you're doing with it I guess)

It's also cool to note you can write apps for your headunit, just HTML+Js+CSS

~~~
post_break
Did you do anything cool with the API key?

~~~
BoorishBears
Wrote a script to start preconditioning when I left my apartment for the
garage in the morning (for my Volt)

------
toss1
This may have just decided it for me.

I drive a 16yo car w/a 5-speed H-pattern manual which still runs great (100mph
is just seconds away anytime, 7500Lb towing capacity), and am considering
whether to go forward or retro, or just fully refurbish this SAV. I love
driving, have held racing licenses & won races & championships, but also look
forward to self-driving cars with the current state of traffic.

In a traffic jam today, I thought it'd be really nice to have Tesla's
automatic lane-keeping & follow tech.

Yet this kind of intrusive tracking and trying to force yet more targeted
advertising at us is just sickening.

There's nothing new with the kind of specs that I have in my garage right now,
and the only downside is requiring 91octane petrol and getting only 21-25mpg.

It is clear that we cannot trust the major manufacturers to not engage in this
tracking&targeting nonsense. Tesla does track very extensively, but I don't
think they're interested in advertising to us or selling our data -- but how
long will that last?

On the one hand, I really want self-driving cars with the current congested
traffic that is no fun. But on the other hand, I feel like I might be one of
the last holdout curmudgeons with a standard shift and round steering wheel as
human driving becomes illegal.

Thoughts?

------
neuralRiot
>That could prove useful to the terrestrial radio industry, which continues to
lose territory and ad dollars to digital streaming services like YouTube,
Spotify, and Apple Music.

You know what would be benefical to the radio industry? To stop playing the
top 4 songs (of any genre) over and over and use some real music innovation
and variety.

~~~
compcoffee
> _stop playing the top 4 songs (of any genre) over and over and use some real
> music innovation and variety._

If this model could make money, they'd be doing it.

Terrestrial radio economics are such that when you tune-in (which far fewer
people do nowadays) you want to hear "that new song you like".

~~~
mtberatwork
That's only an American phenomenon due to severe market consolidation. The
model works when there's competition. In Europe, even the for-profit radio
stations are far more diverse and play a wide variety of songs and genres.
Plus the public radio stations blow anything stateside out of the water. They
bring lots of innovation/musical diversity and aren't afraid to push
boundaries, unlike the pure news/talk/tepidness that defines most NPR
stations.

------
tzs
Has any car company yet tried using the car to take you to ads?

For instance, suppose they know that you like BBQ, and they have a new BBQ
restaurant advertising client having a grand opening. They know from the data
from the in-car navigation service that you have probably not been to a BBQ
restaurant recently so might be particularly receptive to trying the new
place.

They could have the navigation system choose a route that takes you past that
new restaurant. Heck, combine this with in-car advertising. Have the
entertainment system play an ad for the restaurant right as you drive by it.

When we have hands-free attention-free self-driving cars, this could be taken
farther, and the whole route could be optimized around driving you by
advertising businesses.

~~~
mattkevan
The future of self driving cars makes me think of city tours I’ve taken while
abroad.

For example while in Delhi I hired a car and driver for a day to take me round
all the sights. These sights also happened to include shops run by either
family members of the driver, or ones he’d arranged a kickback with.

Imagine entire journeys optimised like the confectionery rack by the checkout
in a supermarket or the floor plan of IKEA. Individually tailored to match
your shopping interests.

The new bidding war won’t be for the top spot on the google homepage but for
companies to take you past their premises. For example it’s late, Google knows
you like a beer in the evening but don’t have any in the house, so the grocery
store willing to pay the most gets you going past. Maybe with a voucher
delivered to the in-cab screen.

------
tspike
I just picked up a 6-speed manual 2015 Tacoma. It's the last of the 2nd
generation that's been in production since the early 2000s, and it's
wonderfully low-tech.

It'll be one of the final vehicles ever produced with the 90s-era focus on
utility and driving experience. Combined with Toyota's inertia for producing
quality vehicles and 11 years of safety refinement, it'll be the vehicle I
drive for as long as it's possible and then hopefully be my last.

------
elihu
This is one of the reasons why I don't want a car with a wireless network
interface. (The other reasons are related to safety and security, and not
wanting anyone to have the capability of remotely disabling my car.)

------
Waterluvian
I feel a very palpable rage when I envision a future where I buy a car and a
few years later ads start popping up on its display.

They're going to make the overly expensive entertainment and GPS packages
standard features and then fill them with ads. I just want a slot for a phone.
Let me manage the car and the computer as separate pieces. Please for the love
of God please.

~~~
liftbigweights
> I feel a very palpable rage when I envision a future where I buy a car and a
> few years later ads start popping up on its display.

How fun would it be if you had to watch a 30 second commercial before the car
starts? Or even to open the car door.

Something like that would drive me insane.

~~~
WrtCdEvrydy
I will die with my fucking Toyota Corolla 2005 when it is pried from my
fucking hands.

~~~
liftbigweights
What if traffic lights turn into ad platforms? And everyone waiting has to
watch the ad before the light turns green and everyone can move?

~~~
WrtCdEvrydy
True story, I actually worked on a proof of concept for something like this
for a mapping application (think Waze-like). It would detect if you were
stopped at a light and switch to an ad.

------
tsomctl
Thank god you can just buy a modern Chevy engine and transmission, and bolt it
into whatever you want.

[https://www.gmperformancemotor.com/category/ENG.html](https://www.gmperformancemotor.com/category/ENG.html)

~~~
userbinator
Most of those are the classic American V8s, but there's also a turbocharged 2L
4-cylinder there, which ironically costs more than twice the cheapest V8s but
produces more power:

[https://www.gmperformancemotor.com/parts/19328837.html](https://www.gmperformancemotor.com/parts/19328837.html)

~~~
tk75x
Cheapest V8:
[https://www.gmperformancemotor.com/parts/88869602.html](https://www.gmperformancemotor.com/parts/88869602.html)
develops both more torque and more horsepower than that 4 cylinder.

------
beefsack
Calling this "data mining" is adding a neutral spin to a horrifying practice.
"Harvesting personal information" is more accurate.

One annoying aspect of companies doing this is the term they steal becomes
encumbered with the negative connotations of the practices behind it. The same
thing happened with "metadata".

~~~
sorokod
"harvesting" is also neutral or somewhat positive, the correct word is
"stealing"

------
ISL
The right to repair is the antidote. Don't like the device software/firmware?
Repair it.

~~~
petepete
"yeah I'll be a bit late into work today, I was flashing a custom ROM onto my
car and I've bricked it."

------
NeedMoreTea
If this becomes endemic across all the manufacturers I'll be ripping out the
GPS aerial or fuse as necessary and they'll data mine a null database. I'll
find a way to fit a DIN stereo. No I don't buy cars new enough for this to
cause warranty issues. If it starts becoming impossible to do, a classic car
is going to be anything before 2005 or so, and I'll take one of those. :)

I don't even listen to commercial radio in the car, or anywhere, because the
ads annoy too much, and there's plenty of BBC stations.

TL;DR over my dead body.

~~~
d1zzy
Cars have been sending data back to manufacturers (which include location,
odometer, etc) for a while now and there's almost no way to disable it nicely
(destroying the radios voids warranty):
[http://www.bbc.com/autos/story/20160809-your-car-is-not-
your...](http://www.bbc.com/autos/story/20160809-your-car-is-not-your-friend)

~~~
ummonk
If I remember correctly, something like this likely won't void the warranty,
except maybe the warranty for electronics in the car. There are pretty strong
laws in the US regarding car warranties.

------
jancsika
What about sitting your own baseband station atop the vehicle's cell device?

Is there a power at which you can broadcast such that nothing outside the car
can detect it but the vehicle's cell device still registers it as the closest
"tower" and therefore connects to it?

Then you could build your own little in-vehicle pihole and man-in-the-middle
your way to an ad-free commute.

------
nichos
If anyone is interested, it's pretty easy to disconnect OnStar all together.
Of course, this also disables emergency services:
[https://www.yourmechanic.com/article/how-to-disable-
onstar-b...](https://www.yourmechanic.com/article/how-to-disable-onstar-by-
elan-mcafee)

------
newnewpdro
They're just aspiring towards turning all cars into the abomination that is
the back seat of a modern yellow cab.

------
jordache
mckinsey is pure bs.. 600GB worth of data per day.. yeah all of them
actionable data for ad and targeting? bs.

------
anonu
If you have an Android phone much of this data is also being captured there in
parallel.

~~~
justtopost
Do non-android phones somehow use a shadow form of communicating with towers?
Apple, etc, are 100% as vunerable as well.

------
torgian
Ugh. If I ever get a car again, it will most definitely not be a new one.

------
autokad
most of the article wasn't about what the click bait tittle made you think.

they are collecting aggregate data to help radio companies fine tune what
songs to play.

~~~
warkdarrior
This is only for now. Once they have the data, they can explore other options.
Ads on the heads-up display? Ads on your dashboard? Ads on your map display?
Audio ads injected into the audio stream from your phone?

~~~
technofiend
I can forsee terrible dark pattern abuse by wrapping a shinkwrap license
around the app that disables ads by making you promise the company can collect
the data anyway.

TheLadders.com forces you to login to their site to disable spam e-mails from
them. When you click "unsubscribe" it drops you back into their "so what kind
of jobs do you want" loop rather than saying "sorry to see you go." So there
is at least one example in the wild of trying to collect more data about you
when you may be (as I am) trying to sever my relationship with a site rather
than deepen it.

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wnevets
if people would just stop opening spam mail, clicking ads and other non sense
this garbage would just go away.

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franciscrick1
When did the Luddites come out of the woodwork?

~~~
sctb
Could you please try to say something more informative? We're not here to play
name games.

[https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html](https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html)

~~~
franciscrick1
Scott, did you flag my other reply to this comment?

~~~
sctb
Nope.

