

China, porn and unintended consequences - colinprince
http://www.ethanzuckerman.com/blog/2009/01/06/china-porn-and-unintended-consequences/

======
novum
The knee-jerk reaction, for many in the west, is to condemn this censorship as
an invasion of privacy, or an unnecessary restriction on free speech, or an
example of the old phase "the tighter you grip, the more will slip through
your fingers".

The single biggest lesson I learned from a comparative cultures & ethics class
at uni is that it is exceptionally, sometimes prohibitively difficult to
analyze the ethical implications of policy in a foreign country. So many of
the base assumptions that we take for granted in the US - freedom of speech,
press, and assembly, for example - are not only less protected in China, but
for many chinese citizens, these freedoms take a backseat to more pressing
concerns like national pride and patriotism.

If anything, "China's censorship is bad" is a phrase that, coming from a
westerner, really doesn't carry much meaning at all.

~~~
tokenadult
Having lived in east Asia, I have to disagree with the idea that the
government censoring news media is without harmful effect. Restriction of free
speech has the effect of keeping lousy governance lasting longer than it lasts
in culturally similar places with more free speech. That, in turn, effects
environmental pollution, rights of the accused in criminal trials (including
show trials for political prisoners), the business climate for start-up
investors, and even the availability of websites like this.

~~~
bilbo0s
Is free speech restricted in the United States?

Because we have had pretty lousy government the past 25 years or so.
Culminating in the late financial system coup de grace.

My point is that the issue of free speech does not seem to be related to the
probability of having poor governance. And this is coming from a person who
was a pretty big believer in free speech being a guarantor of good governance.

On a related note, a story from Ningbo. This is a small place, about 2.5
million people south of Shanghai. If China has an Austin-Berkeley-Madison feel
city, this is probably it. Anyway, the police chase down a guy for theft and
the guy made a such a big stink about it that a crowd couldn't help but to
watch. He protested, vehemently, that the police were brutalizing him. My
Mandarin is good enough to understand that he also had some choice words about
their collective character. Finally, he demanded to speak to his attorney.
What struck me was this . . . the guy never said "there's about to be a gross
miscarriage of justice!", or "You have the wrong man!", or "I didn't do it!"
He said the police were brutal and he wanted his lawyer. That spoke volumes to
me about the rights of the individual in China. It was my ah-hah! moment. I
felt like the young Michael Corleone in the Godfather II. Realizing Fidel
would win, after watching a confrontation in Havana between a group of rebels
and Batista's army. The people of China will be fine. Maybe there are some
wrinkles to iron out here or there, but if criminals feel free enough to cry
"police brutality!" and "I want my lawyer!" when they get arrested, you're
probably doing ok.

~~~
Nwallins
> My point is that the issue of free speech does not seem to be related to the
> probability of having poor governance. And this is coming from a person who
> was a pretty big believer in free speech being a guarantor of good
> governance.

I think it is rather that: free speech is a check against bad governance.

