

Change.org Petition: Tell media not to use 'Hacker' when they mean 'Cracker' - idlecool
https://www.change.org/en-IN/petitions/huffington-post-please-use-the-word-hacker-in-a-positive-sense-and-the-word-cracker-when-you-want-to-talk-about-someone-who-breaches-computer-security-for-a-wrong-purpose

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leephillips
This is probably as futile and misguided as Stallman's effort to get everyone
to say "GNU/Linux". Once a word serves its functional purpose within a
community it's going to be used to communicate whatever idea it communicates.
Words are often used contrary to what their etymology and history would seem
to imply. I don't use "hacker" to mean "intruder," but I'm not going to waste
any effort "correcting" people who do.

~~~
davb
I agree. I think the generally accepted meaning has evolved over time. Hacker,
to most people, now means cracker/intruder.

Perhaps a more positive way to approach this is to popularise a different term
for what we mean by hacker (tinkerer, maker). It's not admitting defeat by
abandoning the original meaning - it's taking the path of least resistance and
evolving with the language.

~~~
imdsm
The thing is, a cracker/intruder is also most likely a hacker, in the more
mild sense of the term. They wouldn't be able to crack/intrude without
'hacking' in order to have that ability/knowledge.

The problem is that people think of A when they read B, because to them, they
don't understand, or care, enough about the history of word to properly use
it.

~~~
rpenm
Most crackers are script kiddies, using exploits or code developed by someone
else. So most crackers are not hackers in the Stallman sense.

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ig1
Earliest recorded usage of the term "hacker" in a technology context:

\----

1963 The Tech (MIT student newspaper) 20 Nov. 1 Many telephone services have
been curtailed because of so-called hackers, according to Prof. Carlton
Tucker, administrator of the Institute phone system. … The hackers have
accomplished such things as tying up all the tie-lines between Harvard and
MIT, or making long-distance calls by charging them to a local radar
installation. One method involved connecting the PDP-1 computer to the phone
system to search the lines until a dial tone, indicating an outside line, was
found. … Because of the “hacking,” the majority of the MIT phones are
“trapped.”

\---

(I wrote an article on this many years ago
[http://imranontech.com/2008/04/01/the-origin-of-
hacker/](http://imranontech.com/2008/04/01/the-origin-of-hacker/))

~~~
hitchhiker999
Yep, sorry guys - I know I'll get crap for this, but:

The word is the clue as it implies 'invasive force'. Any other meaning is only
going to be accepted when enough of you agree 'it is so'. The original meaning
(and I've always known it as such, 30+ years) is perfectly outlined by the
paragraph above. It does not refer to white-hat stuff.

The original word is 'hack':

 _cut with rough or heavy blows._ _hack off the dead branches_

 _a rough cut, blow, or stroke._ _he was sure one of us was going to take a
hack at him " (in sports) a kick or hit inflicted on another player._ _a cut
or gash._ _a tool for rough striking or cutting, e.g., a mattock or a miner 's
pick._

I'm going to catch shit for this. Can't we all just get along? :)

EDIT: Fine down-vote me you evil b'stards - _b 'stard is a person without
married parents_ :)

~~~
nl
Actually, that definition matches the other usage, too: people force a system
to do things it isn't supposed to do; they "hack" at it until it works.

(But I agree that "hacker" has meant invading systems as long as it has meant
anything else)

~~~
hitchhiker999
Fair enough: It will ultimately depend on what the majority decide on. It's
all just another perspective I guess.

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noonespecial
I'm afraid that ship has sailed, returned, unloaded the cargo and then sent
the crew home for hiatus.

~~~
austinstorm
Agreed - it's waaay too late to change this now.

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nl
I'm pretty sure I read this complaint on Slashdot, circa 1997.

Despite what people claim, it wasn't true then and it isn't true now. For
example the movie "War Games"(1983)[1] uses the term Hacker to refer to
someone who hacked into computer systems.

A word can have multiple connotations without causing problems.

[1][http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/WarGames](http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/WarGames)

~~~
keyme
I hope people get this already. Hacking is a skill set, and a general approach
to doing things. As with everything, you can use it to do all sort of things,
some of them less nice.

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kissickas
I feel like this does a great job at exemplifying the futility of petitions on
Change.org.

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IanCal
"Dear media, please stop using a word your readers understand, instead say a
racial epithet that's been used for the last 140 years."

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cracker_(pejorative)](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cracker_\(pejorative\))

~~~
err4nt
I have an idea, let's use the term 'honkey', it even almost sounds like
'hacker'…

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krisgenre
Back in the 90's and early 2000's this is what I thought 'Hacker' and
'Cracker' meant

Hacker - A person who circumvents a walled network.

Cracker - A person who circumvents a walled software.

~~~
davb
By the late 90s this is exactly how I understood the terms.

Even now I don't hear many people in the local tech community (Scotland) refer
to hackers as we mean here (unless it's prefixed with something, for example
"Python hacker").

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MattBearman
We'd have more luck just inventing and adopting a new word to replace hacker,
any suggestions?

~~~
artumi-richard
Craftsman or Artisan strike me as a good place to start.

~~~
waterfowl
oh yes venerated software 'craftsmen' because we don't have enough ego as
programmers.

~~~
sp332
In some countries, e.g. Canada, you can get a serious Software Engineering
degree that's right up there with mechanical engineering etc. In fact, you're
not allowed to call yourself a software engineer without that degree.

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davidgerard
"cracker" was invented as a derogatory neologism to attack one group of people
that called themselves "hackers" by another group of people that called
themselves "hackers".

That ship sailed approximately with the first documented use of the word
"hacker": [http://imranontech.com/2008/04/01/the-origin-of-
hacker/](http://imranontech.com/2008/04/01/the-origin-of-hacker/)

This petition is bad and its creator should feel bad.

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oneeyedpigeon
In my experience, even those who use the term not in the 'Cracker' sense
disagree on its meaning. Definitions range from 'elite programmer' to
'programmer who operates in a disorganised, haphazard manner'.

'Cracker' also has racial connotations in the US, doesn't it? Language is
complicated.

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jacknews
It's just not going to happen.

Either resign to the fact, or simply come up with a better term to describe
what a hacker is.

In fact, what is a hacker anyway, just a talented coder? What about hardware
hackers? A maker? Someone technical, but concerned with beauty? What about
jailbreakers, are they crackers?

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adlpz
I'm afraid I'm just adding to the pile here, but still: this is complete
nonsense.

Hacker is a word that always had several interpretations. And, in fact, the
_network intruder_ one is of the oldest.

In fact, cracking, in software, _is_ a very specific thing: bypassing
copyrights/copy protections/limitations.

If you don't like what Hacker has meant and still means, don't apply it to
yourself.

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pgl
Shouldn't this post title have a "(1998)" next to it?

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mwww
We started using "intruder" instead of "hacker"/"cracker" at Rublon. It seems
to work pretty well.

~~~
hmsimha
I usually refer to 'crackers' as 'black-hat hackers'

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barrystaes
I have seen the term "hacking" been used to describe using a device via its
interface, as intended..

Starting my car with a key is not hacking, starting my neighbors car with his
key is neither. Obtaining the key without consent, might be. But that again
could in fact be social engineering.

In comparison, using another (master)key that happens to fit would be akin to
"cracking". If one engineered the key himself, thàt (along with the required
investigative research work) might be hacking.

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dingdingdang
Listen please: the original meaning of "cracker" is someone who defeats
locally installed software protections through patching/modifying the compiled
program code. "Cracker" as a term is historically unfit for describing online
exploits. Look up "SKIDROW" or "Phrozen Crew" or "Razor 1911" for examples of
groups that (at least originally) worked/works primarily as crackers.

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motters
Finding a word other than "cracker" to designate people using computers for
illegal purposes would be a useful exercise. Otherwise a lot of entirely
legitimate activity gets tarnished and if you describe yourself as "hacking"
then ordinary folks get the wrong impression.

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tool
Rather make a petition to stop people with no real technological skillsets
glorifying themselves as "hacker" every chance they get. Be it on HN, their
own blogs or facebook.

Making wordpress themes isn't hacking, no matter how hard you want to ride the
web 2.0 train.

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xiaoma
I first heard of pg through a slashdot article on his book _Hackers and
Painters_. I remember lots of people writing that that word "hacker" was
utterly lost and should be retired. The mere existence of the petitioner in
this article—Hacker Rank—a company that is taken seriously by the tech
industry shows how wrong those commenters were. That the site I write this
comment on—Hacker News—is so heavily trafficked by creative builders rather
than malicious intruders is icing on the cake.

It's hard to change the meaning of a word, but in this one case a reclamation
is well underway.

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mkohlmyr
Personally I would settle for them not referring to heartbleed as a virus..

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comeonnow
Isn't the definition of hacker infact a cracker?

I don't think a community (not HN, just in general) can just coin a term and
expect to change the definition for all.

~~~
nanofortnight
> Hackers from this subculture tend to emphatically differentiate themselves
> from what they pejoratively call "crackers".

This has been going on for tens of years. Hackers feel like the media has
wrongly appropriated the word, but nothing has changed in the meantime.

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hacker_%28programmer_subculture...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hacker_%28programmer_subculture%29)

~~~
_delirium
I think there's a bit of an attempt to retroactively broaden the historical
scope of this specific usage of "hacker", though, which is part of the
confusion. Until at least the mid/late-1980s, "hacker" in this sense was more
or less local MIT slang, used at MIT itself and at some MIT-linked
organizations (the FSF, Symbolics, Lucid, etc.). I don't believe it was in use
by people doing similar things in other locations, without MIT ties. For
example, nowadays people cite Woz and the Homebrew Computer Club as
archetypical examples of the hacker ethos, but as far as I know, they didn't
use the term themselves in that period to describe what the HCC was doing.

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brador
Cracker also has a racial definition.

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richbradshaw
Thing is that 'cracker' is already two things - a flat savoury biscuit, and
something you pull at christmas. Hacker only has one popular meaning.

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xxs
How to accomplish this: need some group to determine and call themselves
'hackers' and sue everyone for actually associating with crackers by calling
them hackers. Hence it'd be politically incorrect to call them hackers. Done!

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__david__
Am I the only one not concerned about a word having two (or more)
connotations? It seems common in English...

Sometimes I say "painter" and I mean a guy who paints walls, and sometimes I
mean a guy who paints pictures.

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duncans
Whilst you're there, get them to stop using "cyber" too...

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jdg1
At first I thought this is the most pointless petition ever. But then I
realised the whole point of it is to promote their website. It's kind of sad
to see petitions being used in this way.

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Shorel
While we are at it, we can tell modern religious literalists that 'Baal' means
Lord, and that El and YHVH are different Gods as well, and that all three once
competed for followers.

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mynameismonkey
Better to petition them to use the term "malicious hacker".

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jacquesm
Don't sweat it and let context guide you. It's not as if hackers are some kind
of minority group that needs protection. Moniker, no moniker, who cares.

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genofon
I would like to sign a petition not to use 'Hacker' to hype basically
anything. Shorter even banks will look for "Hacker" accountants.

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eli
How about just stop reading the Huffington Post if you don't like the way they
write?

~~~
kanungoparth
It's not just Huffington Post. There are more newspapers and publications
added in the list.

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slowmotiony
I'd also like to petition SV people to stop using the term "growth hacker".

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return0
How do we call "people obsessed with how mainstream media represents them" ?

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jamesrom
No. Own it. Hackers share many of the qualities and flaws. Get over it.

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dethtron5000
Fighting semantic drift is literally the hardest thing in the world.

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smcl
Can we not just accept that "hacker" now has two meanings?

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NaNaN
PLEASE HACK INTO THE ENEMY FIRST

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rpenm
More lost causes on Change.org

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eruditely
Change.org is one of the most accurate signals of "ineffective people".

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ForHackernews
Hackers can be either white hats or black hats (or something in between: grey
hats). The moral ambiguity is part of what makes the appellation interesting.

This whole attempt to make "cracker" happen feels like a bunch of people
desperate to call themselves "Hackers" and feel cool, but without scaring off
boring BigCorp employers.

