
The Last American Baseball-Glove Maker Refuses to Die - mcone
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2017-08-14/the-last-american-baseball-glove-maker-refuses-to-die
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chasely
A really good baseball glove is one of those "buy it for life" purchases. My
dad played college ball in the late 50's and had a Nokona glove. When we
played catch and he was teaching me baseball in the 90's, he used the same
glove as in college.

But, I would bet that the biggest threat to Nokona is not cheaper gloves
produced overseas, but the decline in youth baseball participation compared to
other sports. Though perhaps a rapid decline in the number of kids
participating in football could mean some of them playing baseball instead. I
suspect that my kids would end up playing soccer since it's the only sport I
watch these days.

~~~
bluejekyll
American Football and baseball are generally different seasons. Does
participation in one have any direct effect on the other?

Soccer probably has the best opportunity for growth from the demise of
American Football.

~~~
timw0j
Most kids can/do play a single sport year-round. Yes football is primarily in
the summer/fall, but there are spring leagues for those kids who want to play.
Same thing with baseball. My nephew takes the summer off from little league,
mostly because it's hot here and his family takes vacations, but otherwise
plays the rest of the year in multiple seasons.

~~~
ams6110
It's not a good idea for a kid to play just one sport. It can lead to injury
and burnout. You have pitchers blowing out elbows in high school or even
younger because they have played baseball year round since they were 6. Kids
should play a variety of seasonal sports and not just one.

It is parents with unrealistic visions of scholarships or professional careers
who push young kids to play a single sport year round.

~~~
Lukeas14
As the coach of a fall little league baseball team, no, it's mostly kids who
love baseball and just want to keep playing. A lot of kids also play travel
ball tournaments in the summer which could mean about 5 games over a single
weekend. But the only position a you could get burnt out on is pitcher. We
always keep track of pitch counts and it'd be a serious issue if any coach
went over. It's baseball, a kid is not going to get injured because they had
too many at bats, or spent too much time standing in center field. It's
perfectly safe for a kids to play one sport all season, with the exception of
maybe tackle football, but that's a whole other discussion.

There will always be a small number of parents who push their kids too hard
and it's up to the leagues and other coaches to step in when it could be
dangerous. That said, the vast majority of kids still practicing baseball in
the summer and fall are out there because THEY enjoy it and they themselves
want to get better at their sport.

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savanaly
I understand that the quality of a glove is important and people should have
the option to pay more for a better glove.

Leaving that aside though, what does it matter where it gets made? American
workers are not specially more or less deserving than those in other
countries, and that we have managed to coordinate it so the countries with
comparative advantages in glove production are producing most of the gloves is
something to celebrate, not bemoan.

~~~
mi100hael
Some people place some value in supporting their neighbors and communities
whenever given the option.

~~~
LeifCarrotson
Why is my neighbor or my community intrinsically better than the neighbor or
community of someone on the other side of the globe?

~~~
AnimalMuppet
Intrinsically _better_? They're not.

Intrinsically _more connected to you_ , and therefore worthy of you giving at
least somewhat higher priority on their welfare? Definitely yes.

~~~
LeifCarrotson
I (honestly) don't understand why someone more connected to me is definitely
more deserving of a higher priority.

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randcraw
A reality check: the retail price of a Nokona kid's glove is $170 to $280.

Gloves by Rawlings, Wilson, et al go for $40 to $60, with the top of the line
at $100.

[Source: Baseball Warehouse .com]

~~~
mc32
As mentioned on another part of the thread, baseball gloves can be somewhat
like Japanese schoolchildren's randoseru. You buy it once and maintain it
well. It lasts forever and it's part of your identity.

~~~
JohnBooty
That's utterly impractical for a baseball glove that a kid will outgrow in a
handful of years.

Kids' baseball gloves last as long as they need to: a few years. Because
that's how long it will take for your kid to outgrow it. Investing megabucks
into an heirloom-quality glove for an 8 year-old kid is insanity.

Now, maybe a baseball glove _could_ be a treasured thing you hand down from
kid to kid in the family or the neighborhood. But hand-me-down baseball gloves
are a little nasty.

Your hand, which is invariably covered in lots of unsavory stuff (dirt, sweat,
spit, sometimes sticky substances from the baseball bats) gets stuffed inside
the glove for loooong periods of time, during which it sweats profusely. Being
"gifted" with an "heirloom" baseball glove as a kid would have grossed me out.
I would have enjoyed such a gift about as much as a hand-me-down jock strap.

I also hate to say this (because I like the idea of buying American) but
unless you're playing a hell of a lot of baseball, $50-$100 gloves made in
China also last a loooooooooooooooooooooong time if you oil them once a year
or so. Unless you're playing baseball full-time, you do not need to spend
hundreds of bucks to get something that will last you decades. Making a
baseball glove is not rocket science. It's leather. Made into a glove.

~~~
Prefinem
I had one my father passed to me. It was 20+ years old and worked fine.
(Needed a few leather threads)

I used it when I was 10 and before that, I had a cheap glove.

It wasn't gross. It was broken in, comfortable and much easier to use than a
new glove.

Also, a cheap glove doesn't last as long as you think.

~~~
JohnBooty
Yeah those leather ties also go before anything else, haha.

My experience is that if oiled (I like mink oil, though some say it's too
heavy) any reasonable grade of leather glove, stored _indoors,_ will last at
least a decade of occasional use. My Ken Griffey Jr. glove (Wilson? Rawlings?
I forget) has lived such a life. I think I bought for around $40 in 2001; I
remember it being roughly one tier up from the cheapest glove you could buy.
I've admittedly not played a ton of ball with it, but the leather's in great
shape, no cracking anywhere... this thing might outlive me unless I get off my
butt and join an old man's league every summer.

Recently threw out some gloves I owned as a kid in the 80s. The leather was
dry but not cracked; I was tempted to oil them just to see if they could be
brought back to life.

What's your experience been?

Not saying you do this, but I think a lot of people store their gloves in
their garages or some other place where they bake in the summer and freeze in
the winter. That'll kill a glove for sure and while ultra-high-quality leather
will surely survive this kind of treatment longer than cheap leather, it's no
way to treat a glove of any kind.

I'm sure that inexpensive gloves that see plenty of honest use (2, 3, 4+
practices or games a week) don't live forever either.

~~~
Prefinem
I believe the cheap glove I first had as a kid was not even real leather. At
least, it didn't feel like leather I was used to (Saddles, boots, horse tack,
etc) but the cheap leather you find on well, anything cheap. Almost like a
plastic.

We had them for 3-4 seasons before they got stowed. When I stowed mine, the
weave for the net between the first finger and thumb was coming undone and a
few years later, the gloves were incredibly stiff and tore. We ended up
pitching them (no longer played baseball and they were cheap) but when we did,
I found my father's glove and it still worked (it was stored with the cheap
ones). A little oil and it was back like new (or at least, new when I got it
from him)

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jtraffic
> Plus, modern factories rely more on automation than ever, so even if
> production comes back, it might be done by robots.

I feel this is the most important sentence in the article. The important
question is not about individual products for end-users, but about
intermediate means of manufacturing automation.

I really don't know which countries are most advanced in this area, but it
makes the question of human labor less important. Or, at least it moves it up
the skills ladder, from "making a glove" to "designing a robot".

~~~
mi100hael
Disagree. This argument is a huge straw man. We are still a long way off from
100% lights-out factories being the norm for most industries. Even in IT
manufacturing which is highly-automated, Foxconn employs hundreds of thousands
of people in China. Most automotive factories employ several thousand workers.

~~~
jtraffic
That's fair. But I guess I think of it as a somewhat continuous transition
from human to machine manufacturing. Yes, currently manufacturing uses lots of
humans, but that is changing, and the pace of change has not, AFAIK, reached
any plateau.

What I think matters, is where we are going, not where we are. You give China
as evidence of the human dominated state of manufacturing. I give it as
evidence of the shift toward robot dominated manufacturing:
[https://www.technologyreview.com/s/601215/china-is-
building-...](https://www.technologyreview.com/s/601215/china-is-building-a-
robot-army-of-model-workers/)

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hammock
Hari Mari, another Texas manufacturer, makes some cool sandals with Nokona
leather for those interested: [https://www.harimari.com/pages/hari-mari-x-
nokona](https://www.harimari.com/pages/hari-mari-x-nokona)

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IdontRememberIt
When visiting NYC, I was a little sad to have so many issues finding some
"made in the USA" souvenirs. So finally I bought some stuff online and had it
delivered to the hotel. I did not want to bring back home (Switzerland) made
in China things I can already find everywhere. Not a very convincing
experience. :(

~~~
driverdan
Why buy tourist trinkets? Buy something the place is known for rather than
junk that will eventually get thrown away.

~~~
DanBC
What is NYC known for?

~~~
arkades
Overpriced cocktails and the arts.

Neither is particularly easy to pack in a suitcase.

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brational
Maybe author didn't do enough research? These guys are still around:
[http://www.glovesmith.com/](http://www.glovesmith.com/)

~~~
shanecleveland
Looks like only a small part of their line is US-made:
[http://www.glovesmith.com/glove-stuff/baseball-glove-
manufac...](http://www.glovesmith.com/glove-stuff/baseball-glove-
manufacturing.htm)

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animal531
Side question. Why do you guys play baseball with gloves? I'm from a
Commonwealth country, so we don't really have baseball, only cricket. Growing
up we never used any gloves (although typically we were poor and played only
with old tennis balls).

Usually in cricket only the keeper will use gloves. Is it just a surface area
thing?

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slantyyz
If you like this story, you might also find this one interesting:

How Shigeaki Aso became baseball’s beloved Glove Guru
[http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/mlb/shigeaki-aso-became-
bas...](http://www.sportsnet.ca/baseball/mlb/shigeaki-aso-became-baseballs-
beloved-glove-guru/)

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penland
Nokona gloves are almost comically well made. I've used mine for over 20 years
at this point and outside of a once a year oil'ing it has held up remarkably
well. My dad has his from the early 60's and while it looks worn ( he hasn't
taken care of it ) it's still very usable.

