

Why do we care about Xiaomi? - Doubleguitars
http://ben-evans.com/benedictevans/2015/1/18/why-do-we-care-about-xiaomi

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jusben1369
There's a really major difference between the Windows/PC argument and the
Android/HW one. It's important to remember because without it you end up
describing symptoms as causes and not the other way around. Phones are much
more of a fashion/status/tribe statement for better or worse than your desktop
or laptop was and you use them way more in social settings than you do a
laptop or desktop. So while this is true "PC OEMs mostly failed to
differentiate in design" it's because that's not what drove sales. Corporate
PC buyers didn't care and personal buyers really didn't care enough to spend
$200 for better design because no one saw it (or if you did care you went with
a Mac).

Same goes with "Second, PC OEMs never managed to create any meaningful
differentiation in software" \- Even if you had it's unlikely to have made
much of a difference unless it had productivity differences. Because that's
why you cared - you were (are) on these things for 8 - 10 hours a day trying
to make a living vs 1 - 3 hours on your phone for work/social blend. We're not
arguing that Xiamoni's suite of software makes the user more productive. It's
just a "feel good" thing tied up in "Well I can't afford Apple but this thing
is actually pretty sweet too" and/or "I'm not going with stock Android because
that's too boring/crowdlike" Whatever the exact reasons they're emotional not
productivity driven.

The reason this all matters is that the argument appears to be that Xiamoni
may not be Dell - destined to rise and flame out in a commodity hell - but
something that's neither Apple nor Dell but a third way. However, if the
things it's differentiating on are different to what PC manufacturers
differentiated but only because of unique aspects to this vertical then
they're different barbarians but nevertheless still just barbarians.

~~~
nextos
I also think the smartphone market is quite different from the PC business.

It's much easier now to create a viable platform than it was back then. Apps
are much simpler. You can bootstrap an entire ecosystem by just implementing a
few services (messaging, email, maps & a few others).

Nokia was on its way with the N700-N9/Maemo-Meego series, and afterwards with
Nokia X. Both killed before getting the chance to succeed, but they might have
had an impact had they lived longer.

Jolla is now taking the same route, but also adding an Android VM which offers
almost seamless interop with Android apps. Very interesting approach. Not
fully open yet, though.

If I were Xiaomi, I would go full steam ahead with MIUI. Don't just create
another shallow Android mod. There are too many of those already. Try to
evolve it into a whole open ecosystem free of Google. Think Cyanogen +
f-droid, on steroids. It would really make them different.

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Lx1oG-AWb6h_ZG0
If bootstrapping an ecosystem is that easy, why is Microsoft having such
trouble with Windows Phone? They have perfectly serviceable equivalents for
all the services you mentioned (maybe not compared to Google, but certainty
against their other competitors), so clearly there is something else that is
missing.

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dejawu
Throughout smartphone ownership, the Xiaomi Mi3 is the phone I've liked the
most. Hardware was incredibly solid (and looked great), software worked
smoothly and unlike most phones, I could root it without voiding my warranty.
Once I loaded stock Android, it ran like a dream. Unfortunately the lack of an
SD card slot meant it was a bit restricting, and I did eventually break the
screen by clumsily dropping it. Still - this is the first time I've been proud
of the phrase "Chinese Engineering" (and I'm a Chinese American). I'd
definitely buy another in the future.

~~~
s_q_b
I've heard others (mostly Chinese-American engineers) tongue-in-cheek describe
the Xiaomi units as "Android with Chinese characteristics."

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nemik
"There's a widespread belief that an Android device without Google services
(really, this means Maps and the app store) is unsaleable outside China (I'm
not entirely sure about this, as I wrote here)"

Like you said in that link, Amazon has tried this and I'm not seeing it really
working out all that well for them. I think the only reason phones without
Google Services work in China is because the entire country blocks them and
gives their domestics an artificial advantage. Amazon might be there too but
only because they're too small to even worry about. Not so with Google and its
Android services.

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jusben1369
The failure of Amazon's phone is largely attributable to the fact they
designed a phone _for Amazon_ and not for end users. They became too
enthralled with the buy from Amazon experience. Anyway I don't think anything
Amazon did is useful in terms of this discussion.

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adevine
Not just looking at the phone, though, even the tablets (kindle fire) are
crippled because FireOS is subpar to stock Android in virtually every way that
matters.

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IgorPartola
I reject the premise that Android phones are the same as PC's. You can add a
lot of value to a smartphone that you cannot with a PC and most manufacturers
have not figured it out. Some ideas:

AppleCare equivalent. To my knowledge, Android phone manufacturers still don't
offer comprehensive accident protection. This is the main reason I stay with
Apple products: I can buy this type of protection.

Predictable and fast upgrade schedule. As is, carriers and manufacturers
control the upgrade schedule. That still results in crazy delays in upgrades.
No, upgrade the damn things ASAP.

Make the phone waterproof. Not resistant, -proof. I want to use it at 100 ft
below.

Make it scratch resistant.

Give it better battery life.

Make it look/feel better than the competitors.

Give it a better camera.

I think the list can go on.

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rwallace
Now I'm curious: what exactly is your use case for a phone at one hundred foot
depth?

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IgorPartola
I want to make sure my phone still works after one of my kids dunks it in the
toilet. Or tosses it the pool. 100 feet is definitely overkill, but I would
rather have a rugged device than a delicate one.

~~~
rwallace
Fair enough. On the other hand, the percentage price increase it's worth
paying for that, is perhaps on the order of the probability that your phone
would otherwise die from that cause rather than some other. I suspect actually
making a phone waterproof to a hundred feet (as opposed to just moderately
water resistant) would cost more than it's worth paying.

~~~
IgorPartola
Not necessarily. I would pay somewhat more, simply for having more faith in
the device. After all, a smartphone is the piece of electronics I use more
often than any other throughout the day, and having one I enjoy using is worth
it. Knowing that it's well engineered and won't let me down soon as I sit down
and it slips out of my pants pocket onto the floor, or that my kid can't drown
it, or my wife can't run over it with a car when I drop it in the driveway is
a good feeling I'm willing to pay some amount of money for.

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stefanix
Hold on, does this article really suggest additions to Android by device
manufacturers are anything but bs bloatware born by the desperate struggle of
companies to emulate apple and avoid Google.

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bt3
I posted something similar about Xiaomi about a week back. For me, Xiaomi is a
fantastic company, but I think they are still unavailable to most Westerns...
perhaps this is why we might not "care" about them? Having never lived in
China, I'm not sure how difficult is it to buy a Western-produced good (e.g.
iPhone), but I know from trying to buy an Xiaomi product in the past, it's
rather difficult.

There is no "direct" avenue of purchase, and the only reputable suppliers seem
to tack on huge premiums that all but negate the usual price advantage that
Xiaomi provides. Have you ever tried to explain to someone non-tech who Xiaomi
is?

Same goes when people ask if my OnePlus One is an HTC product.

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blfr
Can't you get their products with minimal markup on AliExpress?

~~~
bt3
You _can_ , and I say that hesitantly because there is no official seller of
the product, and as such, one can quickly become a victim of fraud if they
aren't careful. For the same reason you can't purchase RayBans on AliExpress,
I'm assuming the same holds true for mobile phones.

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jjindev
Convergence devices have a long history. I read in Steward Brand's 1988 book,
The Media Lab, about devices that would converge, collect the functions of our
small electronics. Xerox PARC was starting on ubiquitous computing and "pads,
tablets, and slates" in the timeframe.

A 30 year progression has brought that old dream to hundreds of millions, who
just call it a "phone."

I have a hard time seeing the long history in terms of just one brand, or even
a few. The trend is much bigger.

I actually like the confusion of the Android market, but I chose a purely
conforming Nexus for myself.

Still I like an ecosystem that is really that, and Xiaomi contributes to
diversity, even if I don't buy one.

~~~
Apofis
Grabbed a Nexus 5 myself, because hey, it's pretty hard to beat for $300 and
also because of it's tight integration with Google service, with which I
myself am tightly integrated.

But, for my mother? She couldn't give a damn less, which is where I think a
lot of these smaller manufacturer's will succeed. I actually quite like the
idea of a simplified/dumbed-down Android experience that Xiaomi is offering
and would seriously consider it for my mother and less tech inclined
friends/relatives.

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codyZ
Having worked and traveled extensively in China, I couldn't find a single
person that had good things to say about Xiaomi, other than its price. Western
media seems to be fixated on this company but I've asked so many Chinese
nationals what they thought of it, why they do[n't] have it, etc. All of them
said that it constantly froze, dropped calls, etc. Almost always, they have a
Xiaomi only as a temporary phone before they upgrade to a Samsung, iPhone, or
other

Perhaps there is a bias somewhere, but after nearly 3 years of travel and work
there I have serious doubts about this company...

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mliker
I often ask people if they click on Facebook/Google ads, and they've never
said yes. That doesn't mean people in general don't click on ads. The same
could be said for Xiaomi. Just because the Chinese you've asked don't love it
doesn't necessarily mean it's a company to doubt.

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galuggus
Xiaomis biggest innovation wasn't hardware it was their distribution/sales
model. They were also the first mobile company to really listen to their fans
and do incredibly fast iteration of software and hardware. Their customer
service is incredible for a Chinese company(where the consumer may be right
but has their rights ignored)

I had a xiaomi 1- the thing that it excelled at was china specific features -
spam blocking china, App Store etc many of these features are only just coming
to iOS

Now they are building an ecosystem.

Edit for grammar

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auganov
The main takeaway from Xiaomi's success is that being a ripoff is a valid
business model. Not only valid, it can be better than trying to fake
creativity. Xiaomi badly wants/wanted to be Apple. What they did with Android
might look creative to you, but only if you look at it as an Android. Again,
they want to be Apple. They want to have an iOS, modifying Android is the
fastest way to get there.

To all the people saying Xiaomi is just taking inspiration - watch that:
[http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XODc0OTA0NzY4.html](http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XODc0OTA0NzY4.html)

I think we just have hard time stomaching the fact that people who blatantly
plagiarize can win. We view it as evil and whenever someone does it and wins
we try to explain how they really didn't.

It's okay, it's just globalization.

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wodenokoto
A 70 minute video in Chinese does not count as an argument. It is way too long
to be expected to be viewed even if it was in English.

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auganov
True, sorry, should have gave a brief description. It's Xiaomi CEO's latest
keynote. It mimics Apple keynotes almost one to one. No, it's not just the
same structure. Fonts, graphics, pacing, vids all look and feel the same. If I
didn't know Xiaomi I might have assumed it's some kind of a parody of Apple.

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gress
The irony is that in order for there to actually be a competitor to the
iPhone, Google must lose control of Android.

