
Ask HN: How do you develop internal motivation? - Xophmeister
I believe I have a problem with internal motivation, in the sense that I have none, or very little at best. This doesn&#x27;t lead me to, what one might call, &quot;procrastination&quot;. Rather, it just makes me idle; content in doing nothing. I say &quot;content&quot;, but obviously I wouldn&#x27;t be asking this question if I didn&#x27;t see it as an issue!<p>However, I don&#x27;t just sit around doing nothing, a lot of the time. I attribute this to external motivators. This applies, as far as I can see, to almost every aspect of my life. To give an example: I know how to cook, but if I&#x27;m cooking for myself, I&#x27;ll probably be lazy -- I might just eat something straight out of the packet! -- but if I&#x27;m cooking for myself and others, I&#x27;ll go to the trouble of making something good.<p>I&#x27;ve recognised this in me for some time; the reason I bring it up now is because it&#x27;s related to procrastination -- which was a hot topic on HN a couple of days ago -- and because I&#x27;m interested in doing a PhD. That requires enormous amounts of internal motivation, for several years straight, when there&#x27;s little-to-no external motivation. I see that this could therefore be my downfall.<p>How does one develop and maintain internal motivation? What can one do, for example, to renew their enthusiasm if&#x2F;when it starts to dwindle? Besides &quot;passion&quot; and &quot;enthusiasm&quot;, what are other people&#x27;s internal motivators?
======
calebkaiser
I've felt similar to you for a long time, but have recently (over the last
year) had a fundamental shift. I'm loathe to ever recommend self-help books (I
used to work in publishing, and I know how most of those books get written.
Hint: Not by the author, and not based on real research.), but I'd really
recommend picking up Atomic Habits.

The big aha moment for me was in the separation of systems and goals. I always
struggled with the same kind of procrastination as you--if there was a
pressing need, I'd rise to the occasion, but otherwise was content with the
minimum--despite having large ambitions (am also strongly considering a PhD,
weirdly enough). The book does a nice job of explaining goals as things that
are distant, and so can really never be "pressing" or rewarding short term,
whereas systems can have a pulling effect i.e. I don't have one singular side
project with a schedule that I'm constantly failing to hit, I have a system in
which I write code for fun for at least an hour each morning, during which
time I let myself listen to new music and try random ideas while I have
coffee.

I might not hit peak productivity, but I do it everyday because I enjoy it. I
look forward to it when I wake up. The system pulls me in, and as a result,
I'm actually way more productive overall.

~~~
alok-g
>> Hint: Not by the author, and not based on real research.

I would like to hear more on this. :-)

------
idoby
I find that internal motivation is mostly a myth, that is, the part where
people expect to just have infinite drive out of nowhere.

The cooking analogy is good but here's an IMO better one - would you make a
movie if you knew for certain nobody would ever watch it? I wouldn't.

You want to get a PhD - why? Is the PhD a mountain to climb or is it a pair of
boots that will let you scale a mountain? Both answers are legit, but I think
you do need to agree with yourself on one.

Motivation ex nihilo doesn't exist. Humans are goal-driven and averse to
spending time on teleologically neutral things (enjoyment of the activity
itself is, of course, a legit end on its own).

~~~
muzani
Internal motivation feels a little like fascination.

I do a lot of things that nobody will notice, that give me nothing, because
there's an element of experimentation to it. To use the cooking analogy, it's
like trying to replace butter in a recipe with margarine, making a french
omelet as soft as possible, or pulling a perfect espresso.

I wouldn't say these things are enjoyable in themselves, but they scratch a
curiosity.

One trick is to have different steps to try to follow. For example, I was very
motivated to do a startup, because there were step by step instructions on
what to do, and doing these steps consistently would result in becoming a
billionaire.

It's an absurd idea and it didn't work, but it went much, much further than I
expected, and it was fascinating to see how far it could go. Same with
blackjack/poker - it's grindy and repetitive, but it's motivating to see
whether the theory checks out.

~~~
maps7
Having an defined approach or steps to follow is a thing that actually
demotivates me. I think it's why I don't cook a lot even though I can. I could
follow defined steps and get an expected outcome but I'm just not motivated to
do that.

I got disinterested in chess when knowing that all the best players have most
moves memorized.

------
barrkel
Make sure you get enough sleep. I don't know of a single bigger correlate to
lack of motivation than lack of sleep.

When you do feel motivation and work on something for some time, leave
something undone at the end to pick up on. Something small to get the ball
rolling.

Look after the big issues in your life. If there's something looming or
lurking, you may procrastinate (which might look like enthusiasm for a
diversion) but only at a surface level, like your brain is fidgeting trying to
keep your mind off the big bad thing(s).

For something like a PhD, I think it's unusual for internal motivation to
last. Most people I know who've completed did it to get it done, rather than
relying on internal motivation. They were so sick of the material by the end
that enthusiasm had worn away, like a mouthful of food chewed for too long.

~~~
johnmarcus
This, 1000%. Bad sleep hygiene is behind almost every bad mood or behavior I
have ever experienced.

------
cyberdrunk
Unabomber's [1] writings introduced me to the concept of "artificial needs".
All the things that you list are artificial needs - wanting nice meal when
eating from the packaging satisfies you just fine, doing a PhD when there's
really no need to do it etc. He explained that, since in the West all our real
needs are meet with ease, we've now entered an era of deformation, where
people try to find meaning in their lives via artificial goals (just like the
ones you've mentioned). However, our monkey brain can't be easily fooled into
doing bullshit busywork just to provide "meaning" \- hence your problems with
procrastination. I find life is much easier when I accept this and don't
strive to do things just for the sake of doing them.

[1] He wasn't the original author of this observation as far as I recall.

------
tvanantwerp
You predicament reminds me of The Four Tendencies by Gretchen Rubin. The
tendencies are based around whether you respond or don't respond to
expectations, and whether the expectations are internal or external. From how
you've described yourself, you sound like the common "obliger" type: responds
well to external expectations, not so much to internal expectations. If that
sounds like you, try finding ways to introduce external expectations for the
things you'd like to do but don't. E.g., if you wanted to start working out,
you'd be better off getting a trainer who expects you to show up than just
telling yourself that you'll go to the gym.

It's not a scientific framework, but I think it's a helpful mental model all
the same.

------
pier25
I don't think you're lazy. It sounds like you're probably just avoiding
frustration.

I think we're creatures of habit. If you create a habit you will naturally
have the desire to keep doing the thing, even if it doesn't give you pleasure
right away. If on top of that you add a little curiosity and a bit of desire
to keep getting better you will quickly feel the need to do something with
regularity.

In fact I'd argue most things worth doing will be quite unsatisfactory for a
time until you start feeling pleasure. A musical instrument? Programming?
Painting? Writing? Sports? A new language? Cooking? Yeah you will be crap at
all those until you aren't.

The trick to getting started is having the willpower and the tolerance to
frustration to keep doing the thing through the initial hardships.

I struggled a lot with recognizing frustration in myself when I was younger
which made learning to tolerate it even more difficult. Once you start feeling
frustrated you have to remind yourself that everything is ok and that you will
figure it out. You will never be immune to frustration, but by exposing
yourself to frustration gradually your tolerance will get better.

------
simonsarris
You have to be always drunk. That's all there is to it—it's the only way. So
as not to feel the horrible burden of time that breaks your back and bends you
to the earth, you have to be continually drunk.

But on what? Wine, poetry or virtue, as you wish. But be drunk.

And if sometimes, on the steps of a palace or the green grass of a ditch, in
the mournful solitude of your room, you wake again, drunkenness already
diminishing or gone, ask the wind, the wave, the star, the bird, the clock,
everything that is flying, everything that is groaning, everything that is
rolling, everything that is singing, everything that is speaking. . .ask what
time it is and wind, wave, star, bird, clock will answer you: "It is time to
be drunk! So as not to be the martyred slaves of time, be drunk, be
continually drunk! On wine, on poetry or on virtue as you wish."

(Charles Baudelaire, 1821-1867)

------
exanimo_sai
There is a way to develop internal motivation - in my opinion it is one part
the realisation that you want to be motivated and the other part putting in
the hard yards to build habits. For the first part I always refer to the
concept of the elephant driver as a reminder.

"NYU psychologist Jonathan Haidt uses a lovely analogy to explain both: the
emotional side is the elephant, the rational side is the rider. The rider of
the elephant looks like he or she is in charge, but when there’s a
disagreement between the elephant and the rider, the elephant usually wins.

Chip and Dan Heath's superb book, Switch: How to Change Things When Change Is
Hard, builds on this analogy and talks about directing the rider (rational
brain: responsible for planning and direction, but can get paralyzed
overthinking things) and motivating the elephant (emotional brain: prefers
quick gratification over long term, but gets things done). Numerous
experiments show that the rider can get exhausted trying to motivate the
elephant and needs time to recover. This is why, if you’re trying to eat
healthily while on the road, you tend to make bad choices at the end of a long
day and opt for that extra glass of beer."

For the second part use mobile apps/smart watch to help you build habits.
Being an unashamed apple user I rely on streaks to be my habit builder but
there are many similar applicatons out there. Gamify your own life. Because at
the end of the day life is a game. And if you want to get to the next level
you have to play it.

~~~
chanmad29
Lots of good pointers here. The elephant analogy blew my mind! Somebody on the
internet said life is pointless if we do not set ourselves these goals to aim
for. It is down to us on how well defined these goals are and how we track our
progress against them. Too ambitious or vague, and we've set ourselves up for
failure.

------
DomenicoMazza
\- Basic: Get enough sleep and exercise (just a 30min walk each day is good
enough)

\- Basic: To not get tired during the day I have a good breakfast (I have
overnight (steel cut) oats with fruit)

\- Intermediate: Understand the root of your procrastination. Procrastination
= low-self esteem in the moment and/or making a task bigger than it needs to
be. For example you approach a task and you doubt your abilities straightaway
(e.g. write a paper) and you may even not see the task at hand can be divided
into chunks based on what you know you can do (e.g. topic sentences for each
planned paragraph in a section OR topic sentence for each section in a paper)
and/or practice/learn to get better (e.g. put some sample data into a vis
library)

\- Advanced: Identify and handle self-esteem issues. An app called 'Woebot' I
find really useful in helping recognise cognitive distortions that lead to
being too hard on yourself

Finally, if all the above are down, but you still need a kick. Kick yourself.
I have moments where I feel a bit doubt-y for no good reason and just do what
I need to do. I feel 15min of focused work (i.e. no distractions) will get you
into the zone. If not take a break and break your pattern of thinking in the
moment—don't get sucked into where procrastination takes you.

------
nicoburns
> I know how to cook, but if I'm cooking for myself, I'll probably be lazy --
> I might just eat something straight out of the packet! -- but if I'm cooking
> for myself and others, I'll go to the trouble of making something good.

You do have internal motivation in this scenario. You are internally motivated
to impress and/or do nice things for others.

> I'm interested in doing a PhD. That requires enormous amounts of internal
> motivation, for several years straight, when there's little-to-no external
> motivation. I see that this could therefore be my downfall.

Why are you interested in doing a PhD? It sounds like maybe something that you
like the idea of, more than something that you actually want to do. Why not
focus on the things that you do actually want to do?

> How does one develop and maintain internal motivation? What can one do, for
> example, to renew their enthusiasm if/when it starts to dwindle?

One of the key things is to maintain good emotional health. So things like
sleep, exercise, diet, etc. This won't make you motivated to do things that
you're uninterested in, but it may help you to maintain motivation for things
that you are.

~~~
dri_ft
> You do have internal motivation in this scenario. You are internally
> motivated to impress and/or do nice things for others.

'For others' is definitionally external motivation, no?

~~~
nicoburns
Its external motivation to do the cooking. But is itself internal motivation I
think.

------
gbasin
You cannot develop internal motivation. In my experience, when you have some
vision that you are excited about, motivation is not a problem. That vision
can take many forms, but it's often some concrete outcome that you understand
how to accomplish, and desire to achieve (for whatever reason).

~~~
medialucky20
I completely agree on vision point. every indivisual need to have clear vision
on what you want to be in coming 1 month/year or couple of years. Good to have
both short term and long term goals. achieving shortterm goals motivate for
longterm goals. I give more importance to personal than professional.

I feel motivated when I look at my goals. Definitely I do sometimes feel down
start thinking it is impossible to achieve. For such days I prepared list of
things I achieved so far and I am grateful for. It can be as simple as the day
I got independent and started earning, Bought new jewellery to my mom etc.
These days are very special and bring lot of joy and inspiration to perform
better and work toward my future goals.

Also never compare my journey with other people. everyone's journey is
different. Having few common things doesn't mean you both are same with same
level of capacities. each person's tolerance, will power, IQ different. This
understanding made me to not get demotivated by looking at some peer
achievements.

------
catchmeifyoucan
I don’t think you’re not motivated. For example, I feel the same when cooking.
In fact, one of your motivators might be that you need to do things for others
or else that task has no meaning.

I took an exam called career leader a while ago. Like one of those
professional strengths, exams. It provided a good framework to think about
this.

A few motivators the exam ranks you on are things like “prestige”, “altruism”,
“autonomy”, “recognition”, “lifestyle”, “security” ..etc. you then get your
results with which of those attributes you score highest on. Ultimately,I
think it comes down to what you value more. You should then really question
how what you do aligns with those motivators and optimize for the tasks that
put your motivators ahead.

Here’s a sample report that has them all listed, and framed it better for me:
[https://www.hec.ca/etudiants/soutien-ressources/gestion-
carr...](https://www.hec.ca/etudiants/soutien-ressources/gestion-
carriere/services-et-ateliers/careerleader/exemple-rapport-careerleader.pdf)

------
bfieidhbrjr
A PhD has basically zero value (probably net negative) unless you want to go
in to academia for the rest of your life and retire as the head of department
at an Iowa community college, so double check you really want to do that and
have that kind of life?

You need to double check your mental/emotional and physical health. Are you
getting sleep? What are your serum vitamin D levels? Do you wake up and run a
5k every morning? Have you travelled to a new or slightly dangerous place on
the opposite side of the world in the last 6-12 months to reset your beliefs
about the world? - These are the type of questions you need to be asking. When
you have this stuff figured out and you feel alive, motivation will not be an
issue.

~~~
calebkaiser
I think this is true of most PhD programs, but I think that in certain
fields—lab-centric sciences, for example—doing a PhD isn't a complete waste.

There maybe better alternatives (maybe a Master's or a community bio lab or
something), but when you need access to a lab and resources to do research,
the university provides some value.

Then again, is it $150k worth of value? Probably not

------
teodorlu
Here's how I handle lack of motivation mechanically:

\- I spend time asking why, and allow myself to answer that question before
rushing into an action

\- I allow myself to answer "I'm tired, I want to do nothing"

These two help me work on goals and rhythm. Goals are where you intentionally
want to go, the why. But if you don't have useful habits, you won't get there.
That's rhythm.

Ignore goals, and you might work a lot, but have no control in where you're
going. That might lead to feelings of helplessness. Ignore rhythm, and you
might not learn to do the work. Instead of actually working towards where you
want to go, you might juggle goals, and dream about the future.

------
biophysboy
I'm doing a PhD right now. There are actually a LOT of external motivators:
group meetings motivate you each week, posters and presentations motivate you
each year, and publications motivate you the whole time. You also get some
motivation from your peers and future career prospects. There's also the
thesis proposal and defense.

This all said, I ABSOLUTELY relate to you feeling "flat" or "complacent" or
"content". You might feel like you have no inner fire, that you're just a
Pavlov dog salivating at the world's treats. Here's three things I've kept in
mind for myself:

1) Health is absolutely key (as others have already noted)

2) Keep your head above the water. I'm resorting to a cheesy self-help
metaphor, but if you're constantly receiving external motivators, you're going
to lose a sense of how you're feeling.

3) If you feel a spark to try something, but then lose that spark, maybe keep
going for a bit. Everything has a learning curve, and the first steps are
often more boring.

But also I try to remember that productivity is not necessarily a virtue. You
can always optimize yourself just a little bit more. Productivity obsession
can just as easily be a symptom of my ego or my narcissism. I think this is a
big part of self-help stuff. Marie Kondo doesn't just sell cleaning
strategies, she sells PERSONAL TRANSFORMATION.

Basically, make a couple changes if necessary, but I don't think you need to
panic if you're not obsessed with personal accomplishment. That could be a
good thing!

------
rednum
Probably there's no easy answer. I guess if you could think yourself into
getting motivated you'd already do that.

Some things that help me:

\- right environment. If you want a PhD it's probably good idea to join some
kind of research group you will feel good being part of or advisor you get
with on very well. For the record I don't have a PhD but both of those things
made quite a big difference for me when I was learning stuff throughout high
school/university (though this is something I've realized quite late). Judging
by how you put more effort when cooking for other, I guess you'd also put more
effort when learning with others.

\- setting realistic expectations. Sometimes it may be a good idea to lower
your standards, for example change "cook healthy meal every day" to "cook
healthy meal once a week". I'm a perfectionist so it helps me to say something
like "OK, maybe I won't write a great design doc for the new thing my team is
working but design something where X and Y work well but Z and T are not
working so well". Often it turns out Z and T are not so important or that I
can do iterative improvements on them

\- getting bored from time to time. Planning to "waste" a day (though it's
better to do this not in front of computer).

------
rickpmg
Read the Four Tendencies by Gretchen Rubin.

It speaks specifically to this, and basically says if you are motivated by
external forces, that's how you're wired and you should capitalize on it... it
is a waste of time to try get 'internally' motivated. A lot of people are this
way, and there is nothing wrong with it.

I liken it to a car that runs on gas... retrofitting it to run on diesel (or
electric) is counter-productive... just tune it up so it efficient at burning
gas.

------
aprinsen
Consider building a tolerance for work in the absence of motivation.

My experience is that the sense of deeper motivation you are looking for
follows action, not the other way around.

------
PSNapier
> "I know how to cook, but if I'm cooking for myself, I'll probably be lazy"

> "How does one develop and maintain internal motivation?"

> "... Besides "passion" and "enthusiasm" ..."

Perhaps it's an unwarranted bias on my part, but I cringe whenever I hear
'passion' brought up as the answer in this context, for this reason: it seems
to me there is a distinction between __monkey and user, __e.g. the hedonistic
monkey that drives us towards the easiest dopamine hits and the user that can
override the hollow desires and moves us in a direction of actual fulfillment.
The user can be passionate and it won 't make a lick of difference if you're
still letting the monkey sit in the driver's seat.

Assuming this metaphor makes sense, how does one put the user more in control?
In my experience becoming conscience of this push-pull -- daily, hourly --
makes the most difference. Then it is a matter of learning, training yourself,
to become responsive to the user. During this process I've found it is
important to focus on mentally rewarding yourself for improvements and not
fall into continually chastising yourself for 'not doing enough,' etc.

------
simonpurdon10
You just gotta find something you love. If you're passionate about what you're
studying, you'll look forward to doing it.

Internal motivation basically = being passionate about something.

Everyone's passionate about something.

~~~
ck425
I disagree with this. Passion is the outcome of ability and achievement not
the cause. If you wait to be passionate about what you need to do you'll be
waiting a long time. You need to do the hard work and then the passion
follows, not the other way around.

~~~
burntoutfire
> Passion is the outcome of ability and achievement not the cause.

I doubt that's the case. For one, there's plenty of people who are excellent
at their jobs, but who dislike them. Also, there's plenty of people who are
passionate about things that they are terrible at.

------
jakevoytko
There could be a lot of solutions to your problem, depending on what
personally motivates you.

I personally develop internal motivation by putting myself in situations where
I structurally do the correct thing. When I was living by myself, I'd cook a
ton of healthy food on Sundays. That meant that it was always easier for me to
eat healthy than it was to order out. I've also spent a lot of time asking
myself what type of work I like to do. I like working on things that help
people, and I managed to work at a company where working on the core business
feels like the work I want to do.

But I'm not you. You need to look inside first and ask yourself what causes
you to act and when you avoid it. Going through this kind of list might help:
[https://www.indiehackers.com/post/questions-to-ask-
yourself-...](https://www.indiehackers.com/post/questions-to-ask-yourself-
before-starting-9813f617b3)

It sounds like you might be extrinsically motivated, based on your cooking
example. You would need to find ways to continually hold yourself accountable.
For instance, joining a Mastermind group (where you meet once a week and give
your updates on your progress on something) would give you a reason to try to
make progress every week. People who have gone to grad school can comment on
any extrinsic motivation you might get from the program - I imagine your
advisor would have some thoughts about that, but I don't know how involved
advisors are.

Maybe you prefer having a sense of progress. You could split your work into
smaller milestones, and then work to achieve each of the milestones.

You could also try the Jerry Seinfeld "Don't break the chain" method -
[https://www.writersstore.com/dont-break-the-chain-jerry-
sein...](https://www.writersstore.com/dont-break-the-chain-jerry-seinfeld/)
has more info.

------
mox111
I get this too, and I think it has a lot to do with where your imagination
tends to go.

If you often imagine negative outcomes, such as the negative judgement that
you might receive if you served 2-minute noodles at a dinner party, then your
sole motivation will be to avoid these sorts of outcomes. Life becomes about
hazard detection. The anxiety that comes with this can obscure your 'true'
interests to the point where you are not even sure what they are anymore.

Where does your mind turn when there is no sense of threat? If you bring
yourself to imagine positive outcomes, then so long as they are realistic and
accompanied by a strategy, then it is natural to be motivated to realise them.
Failure to create a compelling future could just be considered a failure of
the imagination.

I'd really recommend the book "Psychocybernetics" by Maxwell Maltz for more on
this sort of stuff.

------
ayh2
What has been helpful for me is the group of friends I usually hang out with.
They are all highly intelligent achievers and as a result, there is always
this peer pressure on me to do better. We are close like brothers and are
supportive of each other though. That turns the pressure into a positive
nurturing force.

~~~
superhuzza
This is one thing that I've struggled with during the pandemic - I realized
how much I relied on friends/classmates/colleagues to motivate and challenge
me. It's just not the same over Zoom unfortunately.

------
cmdshiftf4
>I'm interested in doing a PhD

Are you interested in doing a PhD to do a PhD, or are you deeply interested in
the subject area and doing a PhD is an avenue to explore it?

That's going to make all the difference. If you're doing it to add something
to your resume it'll be a long, difficult and likely unrewarding journey.

~~~
cecilpl2
I'm reminded of George Costanza, "I'd love to be a Civil War buff... What do
you have to do to be a buff?"

------
Mikhail_Edoshin
Apparently deep inside you consider your needs to be less important than other
people's and equate your, well, survival with approval from others.

An interesting thing about motivation is that if you start looking into it you
may realize that you may not need it. First, motivation doesn't do any real
work, it only prods you toward doing it. To achieve that it creates an
emotional tension between "now" and "then" that is supposed to push you toward
the goal. Is this tension really helpful?

Could it push you too hard? Could it instead stiffen you if things do not go
according to plan? And what is the drive behind it? Isn't it fear? And doesn't
the tension takes extra energy you may otherwise use? The time spent to
develop motivation to do something is time spent not doing that something.

------
jfalcon
I find that if you're truly passionate about what you regularly do, there will
be times that you burn out. That's when you switch to doing something else,
traveling or learning something tangentially.

But eventually I then take steps to get back to moving forward. I'm from the
"Stay Hungry" camp of motivation to progress forward.

Plus there's nothing like the clock to remind you that time is wasting. The
one thing that none of us can buy more of is time. We can only rent someone
else's time and with varied degree of success. But since our lives are finite
and the list can be long, there's motivation to continue to check things off
that list before time runs out.

------
z5h
I have thoughts/daydreams/impulses that I used to dismiss as frivolous or
unimportant. E.g. I love to research and read up on new synthesizers. I’m a
bit obsessed. When I’m in a good coffee shop or am baking, I often daydream
about having my own coffee shop. Now, this is not to say I should open a
coffee shop and drop 10k on new synth gear. BUT... it’s worth investigating
why these impulses occur. (Do I want to create? Make customers happy? ...) If
I can tap into urges that occur spontaneously, then I can reframe and leverage
those to motivate myself.

------
christiansakai
Are you even interested in the PhD or in the subject itself? I think if not,
then no internal motivation works.

I tend to think of myself as a really internally motivated person, as I have a
various hobbies that I cultivate that requires disciplines in muscular and
mental side. But I am interested in all of those hobbies, and I never dread
the moment where I have to train, practice, or study related to those
subjects.

No end goal in sight for me, it is purely for internal enjoyment. Maybe one
day create a youtube/instagram channel for fun and showoff but that's about
it.

------
_bxg1
What I find is that my psyche is generally in one of two states: being short
on energy and therefore needing to rest and recuperate (mentally, or
emotionally, not necessarily physically), or having extra energy and therefore
feeling motivated to spend it on things that are fun or interesting. If you're
lacking motivation, it may just be that you need a break (including from the
part of you that thinks you _should_ feel more motivated). Motivation will
present itself when it's ready.

------
ojhughes
As a starting point, try to accept that you find comfort in idleness. Be ok
with sitting and doing nothing. It sounds like your anxiety is being driven by
your guilt in not achieving enough.

------
Scaevus
I am lazy person and that's actually my internal motivation. I want to
complete things as quickly as possible so that I have plenty of time to
procrastinate before I start the next task.

But one thing that is crucial is to do what you love and what you are good at.
Then you feel empowered and motivated to complete the task.

Also, as others have noted, sleep seems to be highly important and in that
sense, besides a healthy amount of night sleep, I find power naps really
helping me to get through the day.

------
tuckerconnelly
Well, my therapist might ask, “what is this procrastination doing for you?”
How do you feel when I say, well, just do it. Angry? Sad? Why? You might
notice you’re getting back at your parents for something. Totally reaching
here, but the Oedipal tendency, obv in figurative sense, is strong in mothers.
Maybe your mom is afraid you’ll be too successful and is unconsciously
threatening to take away her love when you get excited about a project. Idk
man just spitballing here.

------
dhruvkar
Incorporate an aspect of "play".

Cooking -- what's the craziest/funnest thing I can make with ingredients at
home.

Studying -- allow myself to go down rabbit holes and explore them thoroughly

Coding -- build something fun, even though there might be urgent work on my
plate.

Also allow myself to do nothing. This is much harder, because doing something
still feels productive.

Do these activities as a way to recharge and refresh. If I find myself doing
these too frequently, it's time to reflect and perhaps make a larger change.

------
timwaagh
I think my primary motivation is pretty much limited to video games, mating
instinct, food and shiny new things. maybe singing in the shower. the rest is
just social pressure. As for how to develop it, i don't have a clue. I think
it goes beyond the malleability of the brain to develop new primary
motivation. But secondary motivation can often be good enough. true, you won't
love what you're doing but it's not necessary to love your job.

------
jshawl
I've been thinking a lot about this Nietzsche quote lately:

> You great star, what would your happiness be had you not those for whom you
> shine?

This has made me question not a lack of internal motivation, but an abundance
of external motivation. i.e. examining what ways I am motivated by how others
will perceive me.

I am trying to appreciate the "eating straight from the packet" state of mind.

------
Invictus0
Motivation is an emotional spark; you need to use that to create structures
that enforce discipline, the logs that keeps the fire going. I like this blog
post which really breaks down motivation vs. discipline:

[https://www.wisdomination.com/screw-motivation-what-you-
need...](https://www.wisdomination.com/screw-motivation-what-you-need-is-
discipline/)

------
sys_64738
You need to trick yourself. Tell yourself you'll only do 15 mins work per hour
and lounge for the other 45. That will give you a short-term goal to aim for
(the 45 mins) and you'll get there the quicker you do 15 mins work. But once
you get started that 15 mins becomes 2 hours and you forget. Sometime you just
need the momentum of getting started.

------
lcall
To me by far the best thing is to have an enduring, joyful, worthwhile, good
purpose in life, that drives everything else (including maintaining one's
health, balance etc), about which I have written a lot at my simple site (no
JS etc): [http://lukecall.net](http://lukecall.net) for example
[http://lukecall.net/e-9223372036854588981.html](http://lukecall.net/e-9223372036854588981.html)

Also, some related prior discussions. Note that this is an attempt at
collecting useful comments that could relate, NOT at an insinuation that the
OP is lazy, a procrastinator, or other. But some comments were good, like
finding balance, direction, etc.

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23072333](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23072333)
("Extremely disillusioned with technology. Please help (gist.github.com)")

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22919697](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22919697)
("ask hn: how do i overcome mental laziness?")

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22124489](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22124489)
("Procrastination is about managing emotions, not time (bbc.com")

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22096571](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22096571)
("Ask HN: I don't want to be a worker any more I want to be a professional")

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20930439](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20930439)
("how do you keep your programming motivation up?")

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18903886](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18903886)
"Ask HN: How do you motivate yourself to keep working on a project? "

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19777976](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19777976)
"ask hn: how do you stay disciplined in the long run?"

(And I have, actually, put a lot at my web site, like, for finding a family-
like community almost wherever you go, search this page for "no one has to be
alone":
[http://lukecall.net/e-9223372036854581716.html](http://lukecall.net/e-9223372036854581716.html)
.)

For what it may be worth.

------
fergonco
Reduce your dopamine levels. If your live a monastic life you will find many
things to be interesting.

On the other side, a world of distraction and constant stimuli will create a
reference level against which it is hard to compete.

------
jonfw
Health - meaning exercise, sleep, and nutrition is key.

The next most important- direction. If you can't get excited about where
you're going, you sure as hell won't get there quick.

------
poormystic
Concentrating on something for a long period is easy if it brings you
fulfilment, therefore if you study what most interests you, you'll achieve
excellent results.

------
mikece
By reading Stephen Pressfield’s “The War of Art” and realizing that I can
decide to motivate myself anytime, anywhere if I want to achieve something.

------
kerrsclyde
I track my numbers. Tracking, maintaining and improving any number gives me
tremendous motivation. (This works for me but it may not work for you!)

------
mariopt
I believe maybe you could be missing a "traumatic" life experience.

I know a guy who spent 2 years in a call center without finishing high school.
Today he works as a full stack developer and even complete uni.

He says when he feels lazy, he remembers his life in the call center and the
motivation suddenly appears. I have something similar since I work with my Dad
doing deliveries and we had to wake up at 4:30 am.

When you get too comfortable, you don't have the need to do better.

It is no surprise that (most) world-class people came from poor backgrounds
and had to fight for everything they have today (not excluding other
backgrounds). They now how terrible life can be and are not willing to pay the
price of laziness, they know it first hand.

TLDR: You need to have been in a really bad spot in your life, to know the
true cost of laziness and not taking opportunities.

~~~
alok-g
It's the other way round for some. Bad experiences can kill motivation.

------
gadders
You don't need motivation, you need discipline. People don't need motivation
to clean their teeth, they just do it.

Make doing things when you don't feel like it a habit.

------
textread
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i7kh8pNRWOo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i7kh8pNRWOo)

------
Imanari
I often do stuff because I can't stand the feeling of regret. Could fear be a
motivator for you?

------
adultSwim
Do something that actually matters. Making a real difference is motivating.

------
mkbkn
Get tested for Vit D3 and sleep well and sleep early.

------
wolco
Get anxiety disorder. Seems to fear you into working.

------
robomartin
This is because you haven't found something that genuinely interests you.

How do you know you found it?

Time will fly. You will not think about doing that thing at all. You might
dread going to sleep because you want to keep working on it. You want to talk
about nothing else. You are happy and satisfied despite the hard work and
difficulties.

For me it has always been creating technology first and engaging with people
(customers). I discovered the second one later in life as I had to learn to
sell the products I was creating. It turned out that, for me, the combination
of creating the technology and then engaging with customers was my utopia. I
worked so hard I ended-up in the hospital a couple of times from exhaustion
and dehydration (don't do that). I really enjoyed organizing and running our
trade shows and customer presentations all over the world. In fact, I ended-up
craving that level of contact as a way to balance the engineering side.

Not sure how old you are. There are phases to everyone's lives. How you think
of the world when you are younger and single is very different from when you
are older and have your own family. Different yet from when you have
experienced some success and failures. And, sadly, different yet as, later in
life, you experience friends and family pass. What was important at the start
of the journey quickly ceases to be important later in life for various
reasons, experience, pragmatism or perspective.

In other words, there is no easy answer.

You have to consider that you might not be in a field that stimulates you
enough to give you that natural joy that requires no conscious effort. I'll
leave it to others to suggest how you might engage in a search for that unique
thing that meshes perfectly with your DNA. I was lucky in that I had a pretty
good idea of what I wanted to do and what I enjoyed doing very early in life.
For me there is not real difference between work and play. I don't care about
hours of the day or holidays. Other than hanging out with my kids and family,
if I am awake I am doing what I love, which happens to be my work. Still,
work-life balance is crucially important.

I also teach my kids that we can't always do what we want and that we actually
have to learn --and force ourselves-- to do those things we don't want better
and more efficiently than perhaps other things. In other words, if you are
responsible for doing something you don't really like to do, be the best at it
and get it done fast and well.

Two personal examples of this:

I hate shipping. By that I mean, putting things in boxes and doing the
paperwork. This is particularly ugly when it comes to international shipping.
And so, I made it a point to put in systems and tools in place to optimize and
automate as much of this as possible...because I hate doing it but I must do
it.

The big one was one of those "be careful what you wish for" examples. We
decided to remodel our bathrooms. Wanting to save money I decided to do the
work myself. I am no stranger to construction and quite capable, so that
wasn't an issue, I could build a house from scratch. I would soon discover
that crawling on the floor to tile two full bathrooms was, well, a nightmare
and something I did not enjoy at all. The first couple of weeks were as
painful as could be, as my body adapted to literally being on my hands and
knees for eight+ hours per day. In order to get it done faster and correctly I
bought the best professional tools and subscribed to a paid service that
teaches you about this kind of remodeling and answers questions.

In this last case my kids knew, without a shadow of a doubt, that I hated
--absolutely detested, with every cell in my body-- what I was doing. I dug a
hole and I was the only one who could crawl out of it. Teaching moment. I had
them help for a bit so they would learn and also understand what
responsibility means, even in the face of something you detest. We got it done
and it's architectural-magazine perfect. And I am glad it's over. I will NEVER
do that again.

Anyhow, the point is, developing motivation for doing things you hate could be
valuable. This is my experience and might not necessarily apply to everyone.

Explore and see what makes you tick. Don't assume you know what drives you
until it is beyond obvious.

------
RandomWorker
Coffee

------
accurateappL
discipline > motivation

------
hnthrowaway23
If you are particularly content in doing nothing, you may have schizoid
personality disorder.

~~~
slx26
I understand why people is downvoting this, as we shouldn't be doing armchair
diagnostics based on so little information, but it's worth mentioning that
there are technical terms for diminished motivation disorders, which are
indeed common for schizoid personality disorder. Search for abulia or
anhedonia if you are interested in learning more about it.

