
Apple refunding all purchases of Peace - coloneltcb
http://www.marco.org/2015/09/21/peace-refund
======
tempestn
Apparently Marco Arment made an ad-blocking app for iOS called Peace, then
after 2 days decided that he didn't want to be in the ad blocking business for
ethical reasons and so pulled the app. He explains his reasoning here:

[http://www.marco.org/2015/09/18/just-doesnt-feel-
good](http://www.marco.org/2015/09/18/just-doesnt-feel-good)

In this update, Apple has made the (apparently unprecedented) decision to
proactively refund all purchases of the app, rather than requiring users to
request refunds individually.

~~~
PhasmaFelis
There really needs to be some way to pin these "necessary context for
understanding the post" comments to the top of the thread. (Other than just
upvoting, which as of right now hasn't yet achieved that.)

~~~
rajacombinator
Additional context needed: is there something new in iOS 9 that makes ad
blocking possible?

~~~
mehrdada
Yes, iOS 9 introduces a new content blocking API making ad blockers in Safari
possible:

[https://developer.apple.com/library/prerelease/ios/releaseno...](https://developer.apple.com/library/prerelease/ios/releasenotes/General/WhatsNewInSafari/Articles/Safari_9.html)

------
bsder
Translation: "Ad blocking is turning out to be way more popular than we
expected, and it's making some rich friends of mine very scared."

Even I'm surprised at how popular ad blocking is becoming. I would not have
expected the general public to be willing to actually _pay money_ to block
ads.

Of course, when you have ads that try to take over my browser (Android), won't
go away when you hit the "go away" button (iOS), or ads that suddenly play
loud audio (both), I guess it's no surprise that even the general public now
regards online ads as a nuisance to be blocked.

I have to admit, I have uninstalled quite a few apps recently because of
offensively-intrusive advertising.

~~~
digi_owl
Welcome to the Streisand effect.

While it was extensions for browsers etc, it was one thing. But now Apple
(take note) has built it into their most talked about product.

And given how the media production and apple products are intertwined,
suddenly the media people sit up, take notes, and start talking/writing about
it.

~~~
chillacy
That doesn't sound like the Streisand effect. The Streisand effect would apply
if ad networks actively suppressed information about ad blocking technology,
sending DMCA takedown requests and threatening providers who host this type of
software, which creates such a media buzz that people start picking it up,
more because of the suppression than if the ad networks had just ignored it in
the first place.

~~~
digi_owl
The media depend on ads for their revenue, and making noise about how bad it
is has made people more aware that they can block ads...

~~~
chillacy
Eh, I see the relation but it's not exactly it.

> The Streisand effect is the phenomenon whereby an attempt to hide, remove,
> or censor a piece of information has the unintended consequence of
> publicizing the information more widely, usually facilitated by the Internet
> [wiki]

The streisand effect is about censorship, not about propaganda. If the current
coverage is negative, it's a smear campaign at best. Censorship would be
refusing to publish any articles on ad blocking entirely and somehow trying to
get the apps taken down from the app store.

------
solutionyogi
Wow. That's a real example of putting money where the mouth is.

I always felt that he is an opinionated, stand up guy but this move actually
proves that he means what he says and he was sincere about his feelings on ad
blockers [1]. Much respect.

[1] [http://www.marco.org/2015/09/18/just-doesnt-feel-
good](http://www.marco.org/2015/09/18/just-doesnt-feel-good)

~~~
benologist
In the submitted post he says Apple made the decision without consulting him.

~~~
loumf
This makes sense. The App Store is a store and Marco is a wholesaler to the
store -- the customer's relationship is with Apple. Stores refund purchases
all of the time without talking to their suppliers (or asking permission).

Peace uses a block-list that was kept up-to-date on a server -- without it,
the app is useless (defective). Apple would be negligent not to refund it
immediately.

------
coldtea
About this guilt for ad-blocking thing: wasn't Marco's entire fortune (pre
Tumblr buyout) made by selling a service used to bypass content owners
entirely and read their articles without ads, in one page, and in his own
templates?

~~~
adiabatty
Not really. Instapaper's design was such that you had to look at the site —
with all the ads — at least once to save the page to it. This was by design.
Instapaper users wouldn't see ads on subsequent pages or on subsequent
viewings, though.

~~~
coldtea
Yeah, but just once though, and not to read the article there (obviously). You
just saved it to "read it later".

So you didn't spend much time in the site, didn't see all the article pages
(when they break it in multiple pages), and you sure didn't click any ads.

------
blazespin
Surreal. What's wrong with ad blocking? Maybe it would have created a market
for micropayments which maybe it's far superior to ads? I know on my MIFI
which charges insane amounts for wifi, anything that blocks popup videos or
images while maintaining text and formatting is definitely loved by me.

~~~
thisisandyok
There was another post he wrote about Peace a few days ago:

>I don’t feel good making one and being the arbiter of what’s blocked.

He doesn't have a problem with ad blocking, but doesn't want to be the one
deciding what's blocked and what isn't

[http://www.marco.org/2015/09/18/just-doesnt-feel-
good](http://www.marco.org/2015/09/18/just-doesnt-feel-good)

~~~
blazespin
I don't buy this at all! Sell the App to someone who is prepared to fight the
war .. marco has sold things before and knows how easy it is. (I have sold
many apps, etc. Trust me.. it is very very easy)

My little hunch-o-maker tells me there is an untold part to this story and
he's just trying to distract us from his real reasons.

If I were to guess, it was his tumblr/yahoo connections that reached out to
him and asked him not do this. If he made a lot of money off of tumblr as a
founder, than yeah, it'd be pretty sucky to build something that would hurt
that product.

~~~
paulcole
If it's an issue where he simply doesn't enjoy the feeling of creating Peace,
as he says, selling it isn't a solution for that problem.

------
TillE
It must have been annoying for them to deal with thousands of refund requests
by hand. I was expecting Apple would just bulk-approve refunds for this app,
but it's great that they've gone one step further.

~~~
rdsnsca
Apple handles the refund processes completely.

~~~
wingerlang
He did not imply anything else.

------
Retr0spectrum
What this is refering to: [http://www.marco.org/2015/09/18/just-doesnt-feel-
good](http://www.marco.org/2015/09/18/just-doesnt-feel-good)

------
johnpowell
Here is what it Apple said regarding my my refund.

[http://pastebin.com/2zgmekPi](http://pastebin.com/2zgmekPi)

~~~
PJones
Weird. I'm in the UK, and just chose the 'I want to cancel the order' option.

The email confirming my request and the email confirming the refund had been
accepted literally arrived in the same minute.

~~~
skrause
The "I want to cancel the order" option is only available in the EU and a few
other countries (like Taiwan) for up to 14 days after your purchase, but not
in the US.

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prawn
Other things he could've considered:

    
    
      - changing Peace into a more responsible content-blocker, if that was his concern
      - giving the proceeds to charity
      - putting the proceeds towards a new type of ad company, or a new type of new/media business
      - funding scholarships for journalists

~~~
hraedon
1 is explained in his previous article: he doesn't want to be the arbiter of
what is blocked and what is permissible

2 he addresses in the linked piece: which charity?

3: he tried this already with The Magazine and learned that he does not like
those challenges

4: this is a bad solution and I'm assuming you offered it as a joke

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trollian
Are they removing the app from peoples' phones too?

~~~
Synaesthesia
If you've already bought the app you can use it, not sure if you'll be able to
redownload it in future.

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logicallee
(In general "which charity" has a simple answer: any. In general donating
proceeds immediately solves accusations of self-interest, except perhaps for
the component that it's reactionary rather than being announced ahead of
time.)

~~~
coldtea
> _In general donating proceeds immediately solves accusations of self-
> interest_

Well, you still get the tax deducations, don't you?

Plus the goodwill ("here I gave all those to charity") bought with other
people's money.

~~~
mikeash
The tax deduction just cancels out the tax liability from receiving that
money.

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roflmyeggo
The notoriety that this concept has managed to garner in the past 36 hours
only secures the fact that a clone app (and however many more) will be made in
a short period of time.

How much of an effect is removing the app really going to have?

------
blackoil
Do we have any ethical add blocker around. I would love to have an add blocker
that disables tracking but allows ads by default, and I as a user should have
option to block ads in some sites or block certain ad network i find
offensive/creepy/...

