

Ask HN: How do I get my girlfriend to see the beauty of computer science? - rabbitonrails

My girlfriend works in the arts and has never had any experience with computer science or dated an engineer before.  Recently she said that it's impossible for her to understand the mechanics of programming and therefore she finds what is "under the hood" of her iPhone or browser completely uninteresting.  We have all had moments where we found an algorithm or piece of code beautiful in implementation, but what is a good way to express to a non-technical person the delight of something so abstruse?<p>I once had an introductory CS professor who was particularly good at this, but at least he had the benefit of requiring us to complete assignments!
======
ScottWhigham
This is a battle not worth fighting, IMO, unless she is asking/encouraging you
to do it. My wife is an artist and she doesn't care at all about CS and never
will. She doesn't want to know about it therefore she won't begin the process.
I tried for the first year or so to explain this or that but it just wasn't
where our interests crossed, so I stopped. She appreciates my enthusiasm for
it and is happy that I get so much enjoyment from it but that's where it ends.
We have other interests that cross and that's where we spend our time.

------
robfitz
I think you're fighting an uphill battle getting her to appreciate the end
result (e.g. the code), but most artists can appreciate the value of the
creation process itself.

So maybe focus on the craftsmanship and exploration by drawing comparisons to
something like woodworking or sculpture or print making.

~~~
ColinWright
... and in addition, point out that the end result is not simply something to
evoke emotion, as art should, or to be useful, as a piece of beautifully
sculpted furniture would, but something that is active and interactive.

Almost alive.

------
carussell
Richard P. Gabriel has something to say about this.
<http://dreamsongs.com/Essays.html>

Having said that, I'm not sure how effective it can be. I've read some of
Gabriel's essays, and I'm a bit into Patterns of Software, but I don't think
anything there would mean much to me if I didn't write code.

Something else you might consider is to not even mention "computers". Dijkstra
says use "computing", but screw that, too. For the last few years[1] or so,
I've tried to sort of start by mentioning computer science, and then spending
a bit of time qualifying the term and trying to dislodge the images that comes
into my conversation partners' heads. I don't think I've ever been
successful.[2] It's hard getting people to think "computer science" means
something besides either technophilia or sysadmining.

1\. To be fair, a "few years" ago, it's fair to say I wasn't even in my
position to appreciate that I am now.

2\. I might've gotten close one time, by pointing to Luis von Ahn's talk on
human computation, but I can't be sure, and you don't always have the benefit
of an hour to spare.
<http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8246463980976635143>

------
katherinehague
I definitely think that an artist should be able to relate to the idea of
creating things. Its quite possible that her statement of finding what is
under the hood to be "uninteresting" is actually a way of saying that she
finds it complex and intimidating. I think that rather than showing her
complex beautiful code that does crazy things, I'd have her actually try
something simple so that programming is no longer some complicated abstract
concept. Maybe get her to do tryruby.org, or even help her create a basic HTML
site.

While I agree with someone else's comment that you shouldn't force her to do
any of this if she isn't interested...I do think that as your girlfriend she
should be interested in learning more about what you do all day and what you
are passionate about.

Just my two cents...

~~~
actionbrandon
Nah, I don't think she (or you) should be required to be interested in your
job.

I sometimes try to explain things to my girlfriend to see if I actually
understand them. If I can make her understand the concept--then I feel like I
know what I'm talking about. She'll listen and play along, but it's boring to
her. Thats fine. She's a law student and I do the same for her, but I think
contracts and crap are as boring as she thinks algorithmic trading is and
that's fine too.

We both spend all day with people who love that stuff. After recapping our
days, there's plenty of other fun stuff to talk about and do. The key to
making it work is we are both able to tell when the others eyes are starting
to glaze over. Before you try forcing it, try to imagine a two hour discussion
about paint brush selection or something you could really care less about.

------
madhouse
If she's in the arts, she already understands computer science. She just calls
it by a different name: art.

It's no more different than how a poet differs from a sculptor: their ways are
drastically different, but in the end, both are artists. So is a good computer
scientist.

~~~
aniketpant
Totally agree with this.

It's true. My girlfriend is into arts too. She never understood my work but
when I showed her paper.js and some other awesome scripts, she got to know the
beauty of it :D

------
booduh
Do you like the arts? I find it completely uninteresting.

Why, particularly, does your girlfriend have to understand the beauty of
Computer Science? Just keep making cool, useful, possibly world changing shit,
and I'm sure she'll see the beauty there!

------
thetabyte
Clarity. Artists seek a way to define the world through their art. We define
the world through logic. When we make a simple connection between two complex
ideas, we have a moment of clarity that we find beautiful. In the same way a
painting captures the emotion of the image it pictures, a clever piece of code
captures the true, logical connections of the machine it creates. That may not
be the best way to explain it, but it's the way I see it.

------
ac2u
Visual Artists often take inspiration from nature. I've read a few articles on
how someone used primes and other mathematical principles that are observable
in nature and used them in programs to generate tiled images with a more
natural flow to them that is more easy on the eye. Sometimes the best way to
get someone to appreciate something is to frame it in the context of something
they love.

------
dataduck
From none other than pg: <http://www.paulgraham.com/hp.html>

------
pasbesoin
Try the concept of recursion. Then move on to fractal images. That might grab
her attention. (I don't know -- maybe reverse the order of introduction I
suggested?)

Don't bury her in the details. Look for the concepts you already share --
albeit in different media.

P.S. Maybe she'd find something like Edward Tufte's work
interesting/appealing.

------
fleitz
It's uninteresting because it has no application to her.

Knowing how an iPhone works does not help her to make better art anymore than
knowing how an internal combustion engine works. If you want her to be
interested in it you need to relate it to her goals and objectives.

Also, most artists are extremely concerned about what makes the art relevant
to them, that is to say that they are not producing art for mass consumption,
but primarily for the adulation of themselves, and from their peers, and
possibly their patrons.

What makes code interesting to us is the same thing that makes flowers
interesting to botanists. Start by becoming interested in the arts and
applying the skills you have (coding) to the artistic field. I guarantee you
if you make art that interests to her she will become interested in how you
made it.

I was painting with a friend who was an artist and I had a desire to make a
mondrian inspired piece so I took a ruler and started marking geometric shapes
with a ruler and calculator in hand and measuring the dyes according to
various ratios in an attempt to produce complementary colors. She became
extremely interested in my methods and remarked at what a systematic approach
I had to art and we started talking about algorithmic beauty such as golden
ratios, fibonacci, fractals, color theory, all the way to the expression of
general relativity in some of Dali's later pieces and the kinds of quantum
effects that produce color.

If you provide her with opportunities to learn more about a field she's
already interested in you will have no problem getting her interested, if you
start out trying to get her interested in your field you will have no hope.

