
Governor Snyder signs a law to ban Tesla direct sales in Michigan - infinitebattery
http://www.wxyz.com/news/state/governor-snyder-signs-a-law-to-ban-tesla-direct-sales
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MCRed
I believe that this law is in direct violation of the commerce clause[1]. The
commerce clause was designed to prevent tarrifs from being placed on products
from one state being sold in another state. They wanted to prevent inter-state
trade wars. Being forced to go thru a dealer network that (theoretically) adds
no value while extracting a cut of sales is a form of a tarrif (or at least, I
think it is arguably one).

Therefore, I think it might be time for Tesla to take this up as a federal
matter.

I believe Tesla's constitutional rights are being violated in the states that
do not allow them to operate their own stores.[2]

[1] "Congress shall have the power to regulate commerce ... among the several
states ..." At the time the constitution was written, the definition of
regulate was something like "to keep free of obstruction, to allow to occur
without hinderance".

[2] This is completely separate from regulations that require car stores to
operate safely, e.g.: if the state required that service departments have
barriers around pits to keep people from falling in, that would be fine, and
Tesla could comply when they open a service department. But forcing a business
model on people is quite different from protecting public safety.

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abtinf
Michigan is not discriminating against Tesla. They are not saying "only Tesla
may not sell direct to consumer." Instead, they are saying "No auto
manufacturer, regardless of their state, may sell direct to consumer." Thus,
no commerce clause violation.

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gknoy
What would stop Musk from making a company whose sole purpose was to be a
Tesla dealership? It would buy cars from Tesla, sell to consumers, and sell
Service Arrangements with Tesla, etc.

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adamfeldman
Usually the dealer laws prohibit manufacturer-owned dealerships

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poizan42
What about a common owner then?

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piyush_soni
In the country I come from, corruption is rampant, and it makes governments
create anti-public, pro-corporations laws and regulations. But there it's
still called "corruption". Here, in US, it is called "Lobbying", and is
official.

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MCRed
I call it corruption as well. Any time the government violates its own laws,
or violates human rights, that's corrupt.

I think americans believe their government is less corrupt in part because
corruption is not identified as such.

Illegal domestic spying is corrupt, and a crime... yet no charges have been
filed (for instance). This matter here, is possibly in an area where the law
isn't as settled, so corruption is an opinion, rather than a fact, but an
opinion I would agree with.

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sbenario
Another example of regulation being used to protect older, more established
businesses from newer entrants that would supplant them.

Sigh.

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ende
Reglation, corruption, lobbying... Its all the same thing.

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duaneb
How are these people justifying these changes to their constituents? It's
pretty hard to justify mucking with the free markets except to protected
vested interests. Most of the time, these vested interests have very little to
do with the voters.

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dkrich
No justification is required because it's pretty much baked into the mentality
of the Midwest. The auto industry is what drives the Michigan economy (at
least its most populous areas). Therefore most constituents not only don't
mind, but likely fervently support such laws. The same could be said for the
United Auto Workers. Pretty much the opposite of the free market, yet most
people in Michigan support it because either they or somebody they know relies
on the benefits created by the union.

Further, few people in Michigan can afford a new Ford, let alone a $60,000
electric car. If Tesla wants to lobby for free market economics, Michigan is
probably the very last state they should be trying to convince.

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andykellr
Your generalizations about Michigan are misinformed.

There are many people in Michigan that think that companies that sell things
should be able to sell them to people that want to buy them. There are also
many people that can afford a Tesla.

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dkrich
_Your generalizations about Michigan are misinformed._

Not really. I lived in Michigan for several years.

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Falkon1313
Can craftsmen and other non-auto manufacturers sell directly in Michigan, or
are they also forced to hire distributors and retailers? What crime is that
law supposed to prevent?

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yock
Snyder gets a lot of money from Ford, GM, et. al.

 _The United Auto Workers gave the DGA about $1 million, according to MCFN.
The union was the largest donor from Michigan, followed by the Service
Employees International Union, the Michigan Regional Council of Carpenters,
Ford Motor Company and Caidan Management._ [http://www.mlive.com/lansing-
news/index.ssf/2014/10/michigan...](http://www.mlive.com/lansing-
news/index.ssf/2014/10/michigan_governors_race_2014_w.html)

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rabbyte
Couldn't somebody open a dealership that offers Tesla vehicles where dealers
are replaced with touch screens that walk you through all the available
options, scheduling test drives, and settling on payment? Staff would be there
to make sure questions are answered, machines are operating properly, and
verifying paperwork. I know nothing about this industry so I could be totally
off base but that seems like a decent way to jab back at an aging system.

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jinushaun
That's how Tesla stores currently work. But those stores are illegal too.

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mark-r
Does this really surprise anybody? Remember which state Detroit is in?

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numo16
This also blocks GM/Ford/Chrysler from selling directly to the consumer. This
isn't specifically Tesla focused, but is favoring the auto dealer network
which wants to remain relevant and get their cut.

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mark-r
GM/Ford/Chrysler have a symbiotic relationship with their dealers - they both
need each other to survive. Neither wants to see a new upstart that might
someday eat their lunch.

Presumably if the makers had a do-over, they might try direct to the consumer
themselves, but the present conditions make that impossible.

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Igglyboo
Uh no they don't. The dealers need the manufacturers to survive, the
manufacturers could easily open their own dealerships and sell their cars
cheaper while running the old dealers out of business.

The dealerships do not benefit the manufacturer.

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mandeepj
What is his problem? I think they are all trying every-possible-trick-under-
their-belly to slow down the storm called TESLA. The day TESLA becomes
mainstream the mafia of car dealers, oil rigs will go down the drain. NO MORE
OIL.

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_acme
You do understand that electricity is still needed to charge these cars,
right, and that a lot of that energy comes from oil (or worse, coal).

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MCRed
When I was a kid, I saw the movie Logans Run (1970s). They made it to
washington DC and found a car. They didn't know what it was, but they shined a
light on it, and it started to activate and so they conclduded "maybe this
thing is powered by the sun"... and it was.

Well, it's been 40 years since that movie was made. Alas, a solar powered car
may still be many years off... but the elegance of it is certainly extremely
appealing.

One problem: I love the Tesla's expansive sunroof. Would want solar collectors
that are at least semi-transparent to light.

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mikeash
There just isn't enough surface area. A Model S has a roof area of around
9m^2. The sun provides about 1000W/m^2 on a clear day at high noon when
directly overhead, so with 100% efficient solar cells on a perfect day, you'd
get around 9kW of electricity. A Model S goes about 4 miles per kWh when it's
doing well, so in this ideal situation you'd top out at around 36MPH. In the
real world, the sun isn't directly overhead, and real solar cells have more
like 20% efficiency, so cut that number down by a factor of ten or more.

The best way to build a solar-powered car would be to have a battery-powered
car that gets recharged from solar energy. Basically, a Model S and a home
solar generating system.

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ctdonath
I recently ballparked the cost of a home solar charger for my Leaf EV. Came
out around half the price of the car ... not cheap, but feasible for someone
serious about it.

I do have a propane-powered electrical generator for emergency/backup home
power. Some day I'll try charging the Leaf with it.

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mikeash
Have you ever worked out your approximate cost per kWh for the generator? I
imagine it's painful compared to what you get from the power company, but I'd
be curious to know just how painful.

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ctdonath
About $1.23/kWh.

Ad verbiage for the allegedly 3250 running watts generator states "engine run
time of 10 hours at 50% on a common 20Lb (gas grill type) cylinder". So that's
under $2 for 1.625kWh, which is roughly the power draw for recharging the
Nissan Leaf in question, which takes 20 hours - costing upwards of $40. More
to your point, that's about $1.23/kWh. Not cheap, but a 10x markup is
appropriate and acceptable for emergency needs.

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mikeash
Thanks. That sounds pretty reasonable for a generator, considering.

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padobson
Anybody want to start a Tesla dealership in Dearborn?

