
Stop Allowing App Reviews From Beta iOS Versions - vlbeta
http://stuartkhall.com/posts/stop-allowing-app-reviews-from-beta-ios-versions
======
grecy
When a customer submits an app review from a beta iOS, that review should just
be emailed directly to the developer, and not show up on any of the "official"
review lists that other customers can see.

That way the developer is getting feedback about potential problems with the
upcoming iOS, and can fix them, but it doesn't hurt their image for the 99.9%
of customers running the non-beta iOS.

~~~
OvidNaso
Reviews are not solely for the developer. In fact, they are there mainly for
the users. They absolutely should be there for a public beta to let other
users know the status of the application.

What should change is the silly star rating system and they should not be
calculated or even used in the review. There is way too much dependence on a
'good score' for the developer and hiding beneficial information is not a
solution.

~~~
clarky07
It is not a public beta in any way shape or form. The only way to get the beta
is to be a developer paying $99 a year to Apple. The "users" do not have iOS 7
and therefore bad reviews based on an unreleased BETA OS should not be
allowed. Most of these issues aren't even something wrong with the apps. They
will get fixed when the OS stops being buggy.

~~~
diminish
out of curiosity, does apple read stuart's blog or HN? there must be a better
way to signal this to ios7 program management when you are signed up for
beta...do they have a dev feedback option, which many devs would request the
same wish...

~~~
GuiA
They do have a bug tracker to which any registered developer can submit.

~~~
potatolicious
It's really more like a black hole to which you can sacrifice words and pray
for the best.

~~~
GuiA
I've only reported a couple bugs in the past few years, but they got responded
to in a somewhat speedy fashion. Maybe I just got lucky.

~~~
krichman
Well, or it could be that the people that don't get responses are louder so we
think they are lax and you are lucky. Xcode still sucks, despite all our bug
reports, though, so I am inclined to believe they ignore most requests. (Were
your bugs security-related?)

------
ianlevesque
I suspect the reason this hasn't been corrected is because ideally only
developers have beta iOS versions and are intelligent enough not to do this.

Unfortunately pretending only developers have beta releases at this point is
ridiculous.

~~~
Moto7451
I disagree in the case iOS 7 betas. iOS 6 betas spoiled us because they were
so solid. iOS 7 betas 1 and 2 were basically garbage as a general release. One
of our devs had to figure out how to dial into AT&T to get his voicemail until
Beta 3.

Apple's betas are not "Google betas" where they're pretty solid at release and
keep the beta monicker until we've learned to ignore it. This round of Betas
have definitely been early releases so developers can get a grasp on APIs and
UI changes and nothing more.

~~~
ianlevesque
I think you misunderstand, I do not think any end-users should be running beta
iOS releases. It is just obvious from this problem that many are, and Apple
needs to deal with the problem.

------
xutopia
Why would Apple spend the energy to fix this? They'll be happy to see
developers update their apps to work with iOS7 and the sooner the better.

/ __edit __In no means am I saying that it is a good idea. I 'm just saying
that Apple's desires are not aligned with those of well-meaning developers
here.

~~~
oleganza
Variant: only show reviews for the same platform, the user wrote review from.
E.g. iOS7 users will see their reviews, but iOS6 users will see theirs. And
developers will still be penalized if they don't fix problems by the time of
iOS7 release, because reviews now will be visible for many more users. So it
still incentivizes devs to be quick, but does not pollute reviews with
irrelevant for iOS6 users bug reports.

~~~
clarky07
That's still BS. most of the bugs are caused by the OS being beta and not the
app itself. Once the new version does get released the dev gets screwed
because of something he had no control over.

~~~
oleganza
I have to agree. Fortunately, in my experience, we had only fixable bugs with
iOS7, nothing blocking.

------
cenhyperion
This is what happens when non-developers start using developmental OS's
because they can't wait for the official release.

Most people using the iOS 7 beta seem to have nothing to do with development.
It's why immediately after WWDC the internet was filled with complaints about
various tiny aspects of it and why things like this happen.

I wouldn't be upset if Apple limited early access not only to people enrolled
as developers but people with a published application.

------
pudquick
As I stated before on a different article submitted today:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6178515](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6178515)

> I really wish the title of the article was more along the lines "Apple
> should prevent negative app reviews when using iOS beta".

> I felt a little mislead and thought that a developer had somehow figured out
> how to do the current title of the submission (news) vs. what it was really
> about (opinion, that I agree with, but not news).

Sad to see this happen twice today. Only happy about it in the sense that
maybe it will get some traction if enough people complain. This title isn't as
bad as the other one was (which eventually got changed, thankfully), but still
- depending on how you read it you might misconstrue that this article teaches
you how to stop this.

The worst part of it all is that I thought to myself "Title-bait like that
couldn't possibly have happened again - maybe someone really did find out a
solution!" and I fell for it. Fool me once, etc.

It would be better if it was prefixed with "Hey Apple, "

------
vlbeta
The real problem lays in the default trained behavior of the user - leave a
review if _anything_.

Both app developers and Apple have wrongly been pushing users to voice
opinions publicly in app reviews, leaving app developers exposed with no way
to communicate with those users.

The solution is to start pushing users to communicate their suggestions and
issues privately, in the app, where you can better manage conversations, keep
users engaged, and build relationships that can turn upset users into long-
term evangelists.

------
stcredzero
Is it just me, or do people who review apps on the iTunes App Store basically
have no accountability? (With the resulting ethical failings that often
accompany that.)

~~~
escoz
Developers (and I think everybody) can ask reviews to be removed, and in
general I had that done a few times. But, yes, no accountability.

------
RKearney
What people seem to forget is parts of iOS 7 are still under NDA, yet people
race to post videos and full-length articles of how "the new beta has 10 more
pixels on this icon!" That, plus the fact that there are websites that sell
UUID registrations so non-develoeprs can use the betas are the reason this
happens.

So, instead of blocking iOS betas from submitting reviews, how about everyone
as a whole stops breaking the NDA?

~~~
rogerchucker
I just never understood the grand benefits of imposing NDA on iOS/OSX pre-
release versions. I can't picture this giving Apple a big strategic advantage
over its competitors in mobile OS.

~~~
rlanday
I think a big part of the reason is that they don’t want random people posting
on the internet about all the bugs they encountered with prerelease software
and how much it sucks, because it can taint people’s opinions of the final
product.

~~~
rogerchucker
I kinda figured that part but to me that's a very very archaic way of thinking
given that a significant number of people will eventually break the NDA and
hint about bugs.

------
jcampbell1
Can someone comment on what is going to happen when iOS 7 is released? The
upgrade from 5->6 didn't break any apps by default. It appears 7 resizes all
the stock controls, and this breaks tons of apps by default. Will an existing
iOS6 app work unchanged in iOS 7, or will it have to be fixed.

~~~
potatolicious
Without going into too many details, iOS6 apps _should_ continue working, as
anything built with the iOS6 SDK will be operating in some kind of back-compat
mode.

That being said, some of the back-compat modes don't really work due to large
changes in the underlying codebase.

~~~
micampe
_> That being said, some of the back-compat modes don't really work due to
large changes in the underlying codebase._

Which ones?

------
escoz
IMHO Apple should allow these reviews to go thru, and then simply hide/delete
them on the server side. They're testing iOS as well, and I would bet that
they're tracking crashes and bugs on the AppStore app and review process.

------
robmcm
Or just split reviews and only show reviews to users of that OS. Like they do
with versions of the app.

------
rogerchucker
The root of this problem, I think, is that Apple requires the $100 membership
fee (and thus provide a developer account) even for testing apps on one's own
device. If Apple, instead required this fee (and gave developer accounts) only
when somebody has submitted an app for publishing on the App store for the
first time, then there would be a legitimate filter against people who like to
download betas just for experimenting or are plain nincompoops pretending to
be tech bloggers.

As an added benefit, by doing this, Apple would also invite a LOT more
developers into its fold who would like to experiment with apps on their own
device without committing to publishing any.

~~~
escoz
If iOS7 serves as an example, this would be a terrible idea. Betas 1/2 were
nowhere near acceptable for day-to-day usage, and while the new betas are
better, I still get app crashes and even phone restarts every once in a while.
Letting everybody use the beta from the very beginning would be the far worse
thing they could do: all of a sudden, with no notice, every developer out
there would be forced to fix crashes asap to avoid millions of people
complaining about it. And it would pretty quickly cause people to hate apple's
phones, because they "crash all the time."

~~~
krichman
The GP wants to limit the betas to what I will refer to as actual developers,
measured by those who have submitted an app, so you both want it to be more
restricted than it is.

