
Does anyone find frivolous company perks to be insulting? - amichail

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jward
Taking your definition of frivolous to be anything not directly related to my
work, no, I don't find it insulting. Being happy at work makes you more
productive. For me this comes first from having a sense of purpose and
importance.

After that, the little things start to matter. I'd be happier working for a
company that had an on site gym, free food/beverages, and weekly draw for some
gizmo like an iPod. Some things may strike me as a waste of money on occasion,
but never insulting.

It's not like they're holding a can of jolt over your head asking you to sit.
They're trying to make you happier at work and carve one more notch to
differentiate them from another employer.

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amichail
It's almost never the case that you would have two companies that would give
you similar sense of purpose and importance. There's always one that's better
in that regard and that's the one you should pick regardless of perks. And so
the perks are irrelevant, and indeed, insulting.

~~~
paul
Nonsense. The "perks" have a lot to do with improving the culture and
atmosphere of a place. I've worked at a number of companies with different
"perks" (MS, Sun, Intel, and Google), and I can tell you that it is very
important. At this point, I would say that any tech company that _doesn't_
offer things like free on-site food is stupidly shortsighted.

~~~
amichail
You would need to perform a controlled experiment. It may be that some places
were better simply because they had smarter employees or more interesting work
irrespective of the perks. Moreover, you would need to define the sort of
"culture and atmosphere" that you would like to obtain and consider its impact
on individuality.

~~~
paul
The smart employees will go to the places that have a better atmosphere, so
those places will have both things.

It really isn't that complicated. It's like asking whether you'd rather spend
your time in a maximum security prison, or a tropical resort (with good
internet access).

~~~
amichail
I can't really relate to this. I'm pursuing my own startup precisely because
the sort of work I do is infinitely more important than atmosphere or any
other perk.

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rms
But if you HAD to work for someone else, wouldn't the perks make it better?

You're comparing the infinite satisfaction of working for yourself to doing
banal work for the man. Even with the free food, your startup will offer
vastly more personal satisfaction to you.

Forget startups. If you're an employee and choosing between two companies, all
other things being equal, why not take the free food and gym and childcare? I
love those $4 a bottle pure fruit juice drinks. I certainly wouldn't find it
insulting to be allowed and even encouraged to drink as many of those as I
wanted. What's the problem here?

~~~
budu3
"Do they think they can buy me with $4 juices? Mmm But I must admit this free
juice really tastes nice..."

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davidw
At the first place I went to work, they had a masseuse come in once a month
for 15 minutes with everyone. _That_ was a nice perk. Free sugary glop isn't
really that good for you in the long run, but 15 minutes of good massage was
absolutely wonderful after being hunched over the computer all day.

The only downside was when on a whim I asked the masseuse if she could do
hands - she did, and did such a good job that I couldn't bear to go back to
typing and went home a little earlier than usual:-)

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gyro_robo
So like a monthly $10-$15 value... Hmm.

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davidw
Thinking about it some...

What made that such a good perk was that it was something that worked pretty
well "collectively". Everyone, from the boss on down, got their 15 minutes, so
it was spread out evenly. Fatty/sugary glop is of more (short term) "benefit"
to those who consume more of it. In that case I'd rather just keep the money
to spend as I want. Also, a massage isn't something I probably would have gone
to the trouble of signing up for, at least for 15 minutes, so that made it
sort of a pleasant 'extra'. Also, the rates were probably a bit lower, because
the woman had a whole day's worth of work.

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staunch
I want my office-office to be as similar to my home-office as possible. Not
even the perks at Google get anywhere close to being as nice as my own modest
home-office.

Technology companies mine mental energy from programmers and perks are the
water they use to soften the earth. :D

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jey
Insulting? No! I agree that the work should be interesting too, but given two
companies that have technically interesting work, I'll pick the one with the
better culture/attitudes/perks.

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paul
Define "frivolous"

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amichail
Anything that is not directly related to your work. For example, who cares if
you get free soft drinks or not? What really matters is what the work is like.

~~~
SwellJoe
Perks don't make a soul-stealing job less soul-stealing...but if I have a
choice between gourmet food three meals a day (Google) and a coffee maker that
no one ever cleans (several companies I've consulted for--at $125/hour) I'm
picking the gourmet food every time.

It shows a lack of respect for your employees to treat them poorly. It also
shows a lack of foresight to not realize that if you don't feed your people,
they will go out to lunch most days. Have you ever been out to lunch with
people who don't LOVE their job? It's an hour, with drinks, much loudness,
etc. and they all come back a bit dazed and don't get anything done for the
rest of the day.

Anyway, free snacks and drinks (healthy ones please) is the minimum I'd
tolerate. I'm cantankerous, of course, and don't play well with others--I've
worked for myself starting businesses since I was about 22 and don't have any
plans to ever work for anyone else (except in the event of a nice acquisition,
but even that isn't high on my list of desires), but I think a lot of nerds
feel the same way. We can make good money doing all sorts of things, including
working from home in our underpants, why would we put up with a work
environment that is any less enjoyable?

