
Stop punishing your users - pea
http://blog.kivo.com/stop-punishing-your-users/
======
mikestew
And yet there is no "sign up" button that works. Oh, there's a button that
_says_ "sign up", but it takes you to a screen where there is no opportunity
to sign up. You mean the "sign in" button? Well, a user without sign in creds
is going to have to go on faith that if they click that button there will be a
place to create an account.

Pedantic, I know, but I did scroll through the page looking for a way to
create an account. I didn't find one and took the leap of faith that the "sign
in" button would offer an account creation opportunity. And, no, I never did
sign up.

~~~
pea
Hey Mike -- my bad, I just realised that the sign-up button on the blog
actually takes you to kivo.com, instead of actually signing you up (and that
you have to click sign-up there again). I'll get on fixing this ASAP. Thanks
for your feedback!

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Malarkey73
That's great - don't punish users - but I still have no idea from their actual
website landing page (kivo.com) what kivo is...

Something for uploading and making annotations on slides?

Why do I want to do that?

So however easy or un-punishing "it" is, is really irrelevant.

~~~
pea
Thanks for your reply! Sorry our homepage wasn't clear enough: Kivo is a way
to annotate presentations and PDFs in the browser. If you want more info,
check out the video on the homepage or try the example presentation below it.

Re the problem we are trying to solve: giving feedback on documents really
sucks. Emailing around 'Slide 1: change x,y,z, Slide 2: change this' and other
out-of-context comments is a massive pain-point for users, who want to be able
to do it quickly, visually, and in their browser (instead of in an old piece
of desktop software). Feel free to ping me on leo@kivo.com if you have any
more questions.

~~~
wingerlang
I disagree with the one you replied to. I instantly understood what it was
about, and with the example it solidified my thoughts.

~~~
TuringTest
However, it wouldn't hurt if the home page had the above explanation
explicitly written, and if they mentioned who is behind the site.

Also, common questions like "where are my documents stored", "is it secure",
"how do I share the result and who can see it"... remain unanswered.

~~~
TuringTest
As it happens, they do have a FAQ answering those questions; it's _hidden
behind the signup process_. It just didn't occur to them that it would be
useful to have it at the home page. It seems they didn't really learn the
lesson.

~~~
zefi
Thanks for the feedback! I work with Leo at Kivo. We've gone through a fair
few iterations of our home page and we know it's not perfect yet. Right now
we're trying to throw people right in to the product itself and then if they
have more questions after that then they can find them in the site. But you're
right we need to be upfront about a lot of information, it's just a balancing
act, we're trying to find the right point. Thanks again.

~~~
TuringTest
That's the problem - I _couldn 't_ find the information I was looking for at
the site. It took a leap of faith to sign up to find the FAQ, expecting that
the interface for registered users would be more complete; exactly the same
problem you were trying to solve when removing mandatory signup.

The only parts of the site that should be hidden behind the sign up process
are those that only affect logged-in users; learning about the site and
business is not one of those. Most of that information does not _need_ to be
located at the front page itself, but there must be a link allowing the user
to find it.

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moron4hire
I'm pretty sure "lack of constant annoyance" is a killer feature for most
people. At least it is for me.

~~~
TuringTest
Yup. Unfortunately, it seems we're doomed to repeat the browser popup wars and
relearn all its lessons, now from courtesy of the Mandatory Signup and the
Undismissable Floating Div.

------
JacobAldridge
When in doubt, ask 'What will add value to my users?' If the answer is 'I
don't know' then step away from the desk and go talk to them.

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notduncansmith
Coming soon, the response post: "Stop Punishing Your Investors"

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strict9
It's unfortunate they punished me as a user by having a mobile design that
truncates several letters on the right side of viewport on iOS, making article
unreadable.

~~~
zefi
I work with Leo at Kivo. Thanks for pointing this out, we'll be fixing this
ASAP. Sorry you felt punished!

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ulisesrmzroche
I think you guys are overthinking it. The reason why it worked is because you
let your users demo the product, for free, no strings attached. This is a
tried-and-true advertising practice, and it's the same as 'Show, don't tell'.
This is why people put pictures of the product on their ads.

I think that anyone who scraps their landing page (and facebook has probably
the ugliest one in the known internet) and just puts their product front-and-
center will easily increase their conversion by at least 10%.

------
tempodox
I found this passage remarkable: ...signing up is so easy! It takes a few
seconds...

How can any-one come to such a blatant misconception? No, sign-up is NOT easy
and it takes WAY more than a few seconds. I have to think up another effing
password and have my password vault handy for adding it to the cheat sheet.
Not knowing what it is you sign up for doesn't exactly make it any easier,
either.

I still have no idea what Kivo does...

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wahsd
Congratulations on realizing that. Too many sites and services throw all kinds
of barriers and trip hazards in front of you before you can even take a look
at whether you would want to stick around. It makes no sense. People should be
motivated to sign up because they want additional functionality that is an
addition to what they love your product for in the first place or to overcome
a limitation.

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lnanek2
Otherwise known as gradual engagement. Let the users enjoy as much as possible
before you force them through a registration process and then more of them
will be willing to do it. Props to them for doing it. It is certainly harder
than just dropping in a login required on everything like modern web starter
projects make so easy.

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chrisbennet
This is such a obvious insight that I wonder why more companies don't "get
it".

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brianolson
Title is going to need more data to get me to click on this. Stop punishing
your users ... with ugly color schemes? ... with UI of many useless clicks?
... with full motion video autoplay ads?

~~~
aet
or web apps in general?

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rokhayakebe
I too had a content site where I did not ask users to sign up. First 2 years,
83 emails. Then one day I changed that and forced them before clicking
through. First DAY 100+ emails. And it never stopped until I shut it down.

~~~
coldtea
Well, if emails was what you wanted, that's good.

But if users were what you wanted, you could be losing tons of traffic, and
those 100+ emails per day could be insignificant to what you had before.

~~~
zefi
Spot on.

