
The Unified Theory of Ram Dass - adrice727
https://www.gq.com/story/the-unified-theory-of-ram-dass
======
refset
It feels important to emphasise that Ram Dass is not a guru by his own
definition:

 _Unity of God, guru, and Self is the higher truth, and if your veil of
attachment is very thin, you may be able, like Ramana, to penetrate directly
to that essence in the heart._

 _But most of us, to get through our busy human incarnation and the profusion
of forms we find in our lives, need guidance and help. Seeing the guru as
separate from oneself is a way to approach it in steps of lesser truths. It’s
a first step toward becoming the One. The reality of the guru or guide as
separate from oneself is a method or vehicle for coming to God. It’s using a
relationship with a separate entity, dualism, to get to the One, to the
reality that the guru is identical with your inmost being._

i.e. God=Guru=Self, see: [https://www.ramdass.org/god-guru-
self/](https://www.ramdass.org/god-guru-self/)

However, of all the things Ram Dass has said and done, the mantra (from the
article) is all we really need to remember:

 _“So I accomplish the move from head to heart, in part with mantra: I am
loving awareness. I am loving awareness. I am loving awareness.” With each
repetition of the mantra, Ram Dass slowly begins charting the daily process of
moving his consciousness out of his thinking mind and toward his open,
present, compassionate heart—from ego land to soul land._

 _“All the universe is love,” he continues. “And I 'm loving all of the
universe.… Everything—everything—has love in it.”_

<3

~~~
0db532a0
What does it actually mean to say that all the universe is love, and that
everything has love in it? Is this more a way in which he is choosing to view
things, or an actual statement of fact?

~~~
refset
I think that the statement "all the universe is love" is the ultimate example
of a "Darwinian Truth" (I hesitate to reference Jordan Peterson here, but it's
another useful definition:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_Q2qgdYB3I](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_Q2qgdYB3I)).
I believe that in order for us humans to survive and thrive in life,
individually and collectively, it is a truth must ultimately be consciously
acknowledged. After all, we each represent projections of maternal lineage
founded on an unbroken chain of our mothers' unconditional love for us. This
way of viewing things is therefore primary since it has been there since very
the beginnings of individual awareness. The original fact.

As to exactly how you personally should interpret "all the universe is love",
well, it's a very personal thing. Perhaps the most general way to convey how
that feels to me is: extend your deep inner-child maternal love outwards to
encompass the rest of humanity, the Earth's ecosystem, and the natural
conditions that gave rise to life itself. Like the feeling of warm sunshine on
a cold day.

~~~
0db532a0
From what I’ve read of Jordan Peterson, he seems like a reasonable guy on many
topics, but I don’t agree with Darwinian Truth. The only truth is what I
experience. Everything outside of that is a game of language, including Jordan
Peterson’s and Harris’s arguments.

I don’t see how invoking Jordan Peterson’s ‘Darwinian Truth’ gives any weight
to the claim that all the universe is love. I would agree that you could
indeed hold it to be an axiom.

You might believe that it is beneficial for humans to hold this axiom to be
true and act accordingly, but this is still your subjective opinion. It
supposes that humans are a worthy universal end, and the axiom remains an
axiom.

I don’t know what you mean by unbroken maternal lineage. My maternal
experience was very much broken. From what my mother has told me, so was hers.

What is the extension of deep inner child maternal love to encompass the test
of humanity? Is it not just another way of saying that you just wish that
everything were hunky dory? Things don’t seem to work that way in Darwin’s
world.

I don’t want to disregard the idea of unconditional love for family and
beyond. Many people can afford it. However, many people can’t, and it isn’t a
truth that we must strive towards either.

There is a multitude of subjective value systems which man has chosen to live
by, ostensibly, collectively and in private. Some have chosen to build
empires, never having children. Some have chosen to build loving families. In
neither case is it guaranteed that a majority will wake up smiling and feeling
happy every day. That’s fine too.

~~~
refset
> I would agree that you could indeed hold it to be an axiom.

Challenge accepted, I will play your language game :)

> You might believe that it is beneficial for humans to hold this axiom to be
> true and act accordingly, but this is still your subjective opinion.

I live in quiet certainty that one day, eventually, everyone will be holding
this same opinion and hold this axiom to be true. I do not necessarily expect
to still be around to witness it personally.

By unbroken maternal lineage I am referring to the 9 months of sufficient love
and nurturing required for a mother to produce a baby human, as has happened
100% consistently and successfully for millennia to arrive at each one of us.
Any love received post-birth is a bonus. I accept that this view is harder to
appreciate in some circumstances and is often obscured by many layers of
trauma.

> Is it not just another way of saying that you just wish that everything were
> hunky dory?

I think to hold the perspective I'm describing you have to let go of seeing
the problems in the world as problems. Things are simply happening. Suffering
is happening. Life is unfolding. At some level I'm certainly still
entertaining a wish that everything might yet work out to be hunky dory, but
these days I can readily accept that such a wish will only ever be an
illusion. I guess that is my second axiom.

You might enjoy briefly hearing Alan Watts tell The Story of the Chinese
Farmer which beautifully expresses this general acceptance of life as it is
currently:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OX0OARBqBp0](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OX0OARBqBp0)

> Many people can afford it. However, many people can’t, and it isn’t a truth
> that we must strive towards

Many people might think they can't afford to love because life can grow
intense and feel very serious sometimes, even dangerous, but love is free and
it is always the best course of action. What else could each of us be striving
towards if not a world with more love (even if only for ourselves)?

> In neither case is it guaranteed that a majority will wake up smiling and
> feeling happy every day. That’s fine too.

I agree, that's fine. Sadness is just as meaningful a feeling as happiness.
These are just feelings.

~~~
0db532a0
Thanks for linking the video. I completely agree with that mindset.

I’m really not sure what to say regarding the love, though. I’ll leave it
here.

------
pahool
I have always enjoyed listening to recordings of Ram Dass at various points
during his life (much more than I've enjoyed his writings). I have issues with
a lot of his beliefs at various points, but his compassion always shines
through and I feel like he is being honest with his listeners about his
experience of his spiritual journey, even if sometimes he is seeing things
through muddy waters. He is imperfect, and searching, and he is very generous
and genuine in sharing his experiences. I don't usually feel like I am getting
grand truths from him, other than the insight into one seeker's subjective
(and powerful) experiences.

------
zafka
It makes me happy to see this article here. I have always been impressed with
the way Ram Dass has traveled through life.

~~~
everdev
I agree that the message is beautiful. I do have reservations however about
gurus, in that the ones I'm aware of tend to live in isolated places where
they are worshiped. I feel like it's easy to love and support others when you
have peace, quiet, love and support in abundance around you. I'd like to see
how these individuals operate in higher stress situations and if they've
really perfected the art of love or if it's more a product of their
circumstances.

~~~
maxxxxx
Agreed. A lot of famous gurus are just very charismatic people that live a
very nice life and don't really have to deal with the drudgeries of the life
most regular people live. When you look under the cover a lot of them are
abusive and really not nice people.

I think there are only very few people that are really spiritually enlightened
and they are not necessarily the famous gurus.

I know nothing about Ram Dad's but when I was more involved in yoga I saw some
very shady behavior of public gurus.

~~~
eludwig
I agree with you, but I don't necessarily see a conflict between someone
"teaching" me (what a guru basically is: a teacher, in a way) and other facets
of their personality.

I've had many teachers that were superb at imparting their lessons while
living with the foibles and flaws of being real people. You take what you need
from the teacher and move on.

An example in popular culture: someone like Bill Cosby, who I am sure
influenced countless people to be better people. Well, it turned out that he
had major problems (to put it mildly!). Does that negate the "lessons" that he
imparted in another aspect of his life? I would argue no.

I know you aren't negating this argument in your post, but I just wanted to
say this and chose your post to glom onto! :)

~~~
maxxxxx
With self help, spiritual and health people I have decided only to listen to
people who live their own teachings. I have seen famous yoga teachers talk
about the benefits of yoga while popping large amounts of Ibuprofen daily
because their practice injured them.

Same for some gurus who outwardly are serene and friendly people but their
ashram is a dictatorship that terrorizes and manipulates people. There is also
a lot of sexual abuse going on. Ram Dass himself did questionable things.

I think bad behavior negates the teachings or at least diminishes them by a
lot. How am I supposed to know something works if it doesn't work for the
teacher?

Unfortunately there are only a few authentic gurus and teachers.

~~~
madmax96
“There is a false saying: “How can someone who can’t save himself save
others?” Supposing I have the key to your chains, why should your lock and my
lock be the same?”

\- Nietzsche

------
gawin
After a 2 year long burn-out his book ‘Be Here Now’ brought back balance, a
peace of mind, and incredible love and joy in my life.

~~~
moretai
It's a placebo. The peace was always within you.

~~~
dylan604
While that may be true, if it was the reading of this book that brought that
peace of mind to him, why try to discredit his fondness of the book so
dismissively? Everyone needs guidance from time to time, does it really matter
where the guidance comes from?

------
vijucat
I've always been conflicted by these gurus, so let me play devil's advocate
and present some things I found when I researched Ram Dass / Neem Karoli Baba
a while ago:

[http://www.strippingthegurus.com/stgsamplechapters/dass.html](http://www.strippingthegurus.com/stgsamplechapters/dass.html)

Some interesting tales by Ram Dass about how Neem Karoli read his mind,
ingested ginormous amounts of LSD without any effect, etc; here:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yb2BWvRN090](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yb2BWvRN090)

The specific story about the Baba reading Ram Dass' mind and informing him
that he was thinking about his mother and that she had died of spleen failure
stayed with me. Maybe he was informed the previous night that a Professor from
the US was arriving whose mother died recently of spleen failure and the rest
was about creating an illusion of omniscience?

In any case, a large number of these gurus turn out to be sexual predators,
and it is absolutely crushing to those who follow them to discover this.

UG "masturbation is better than meditation" Krishnamurti was a much needed
respite from these masters of bullshit for me, personally.

~~~
fromthestart
>sexual predators

Yeah, these guys give off slimy vibes, but I wonder if this term is a little
harsh. Women associate willingly with these men, and ostensibly enjoy doing
so. If all participants are willing, what is the difference between predation
and normal human interaction? Is it not normal for women to be drawn to power
and influence?

~~~
vijucat
Great point. Unless the guru is advocating the virtues of celibacy, there is
no hypocrisy involved.

------
neonate
[https://www.imdb.com/title/tt2516424/](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt2516424/)
is an interesting documentary about the complicated, ambivalent relationship
between Alpert and Leary, made when Leary was dying. Leary,
characteristically, turned his death into a spectacle, but I find Alpert the
more interesting of the two.

~~~
alexilliamson
I highly recommend How To Change Your Mind by Michael Pollan. He convincingly
illustrates how detrimental to serious research were Leary and his penchant
for the spectacular.

~~~
fmihaila
I wholeheartedly second the recommendation. I also want to point out that
Pollan's treatment of Leary's influence is certainly more nuanced than that.
Here's a key quote:

> _When I asked Rick Doblin if he worries about another backlash, he pointed
> out that our culture has come a long way from the 1960s and has shown a
> remarkable ability to digest a great many of the cultural novelties first
> cooked up during that era.

“That was a very different time. People wouldn’t even talk about cancer or
death then. Women were tranquilized to give birth; men weren’t allowed in the
delivery room! Yoga and meditation were totally weird. Now mindfulness is
mainstream and everyone does yoga, and there are birthing centers and hospices
all over. We’ve integrated all these things into our culture. And now I think
we’re ready to integrate psychedelics.”

Doblin points out that many of the people now in charge of our institutions
are of a generation well acquainted with these molecules. This, he suggests,
is the true legacy of Timothy Leary. It’s all well and good for today’s
researchers to disdain his “antics” and blame him for derailing the first wave
of research, and yet, as Doblin points out with a smile, “there would be no
second wave if Leary hadn’t turned on a whole generation.” Indeed. Consider
the case of Paul Summergrad, who has spoken publicly of his own youthful use
of psychedelics. In a videotaped interview with Ram Dass that was shown at the
2015 meeting of the American Psychiatric Association, he told his colleagues
that an acid trip he took in college had been formative in his intellectual
development. (Jeffrey Lieberman, another past president of the American
Psychiatric Association, has also written of the insights gleaned from his
youthful experiments with LSD.)_

------
empath75
On a personal level I find detachment and neutrality to be helpful for
reducing anxiety and stress, but on a societal level it sounds like a recipe
for mass complacency in the face of oppression.

------
djsumdog
I had his Be Here Now book in University. I didn't know he had a podcast. I'll
have to add it.

I had a friend I was tripping on acid with, back in grad school, and he picked
up the Be Here Now book, read the intro and said, "Wait, did he seriously
change his name to 'Rammed ass?!'" .. I've always wondered about his intent
after that. :-P

~~~
FraaJad
Ram Dass (dāsa=devotee (of Lord Rama)).

You might have known other people with similar last name (eg: Anil Dash).

The most common pronunciation is "Das"

~~~
cuspycode
Why does anyone feel the need to take on a new name just because you change
your religion? I never understood that. I have had epiphanies that
dramatically changed my world-view, but I never thought "Now I must take a new
name". I'm not criticizing those who do this, since people change their names
all the time anyway, but I'm genuinely curious why this phenomenon is so
common when people change their religion?

~~~
sn41
This is what I understand - in the Hindu tradition (perhaps it's similar in
Buddhist and Catholic traditions) you are supposed to enter a new life when
you become a Sannyasi (monk). One of the initial rituals in many schools is to
perform funeral rites for your former self. Through this process, you renounce
your family, relations, and what you think of as your "identity". Then the
guru gives a new name to the monk. Afterwards, monks are prohibited from
talking about their purvashrama (previous life).

------
davebryand
Understanding and living his message (or any other non-dualist teacher) is the
#1 to do if you want a successful startup.

(Really, it's the recipe for a successful life. In fact, when you've tasted
what he's offering, you may find that stock options, sales funnels, and
customer acquisition costs no longer excite you.)

~~~
reidjs
I feel like if you’re excited by those things you will have more success
running a startup, no?

~~~
itomato
Your focus would be completely misplaced.

------
swayvil
Be Here Now is a really great book.

------
moretai
Gurus are people who get paid for just being charismatic. That's it.

~~~
FlyMoreRockets
You obviously haven't met a Unix Guru.

~~~
SteveCoast
We don't have HN Gold to give, so please take an update instead.

------
Nomentatus
The most effective rape drug ever, turning adults into children who can be
exploited.

“I got dismissed from Harvard because I had given psychedelics to an
undergraduate. We had agreed with the dean that we would not give psychedelics
to undergraduates.” Ram Dass flashes a mischievous grin. “He was an attractive
kid.” So do you suspect, I ask, that Maharajji had a hand in making you
attracted to men because it would ultimately lead you to him? “I suspect,” he
replies with a nod. “He's a rascal.” “Maharajji?” I ask. “Yeah,” Ram Dass
says.

There are truths to be seen through the eyes of a child, but there's also the
rape-facilitation, too.

~~~
toofy
Other than this article, I’m pretty much unfamiliar with Ram Dass, so I’m
curious what leads you to believe some form of rape took place. Is there
something in Ramm Dass’ past that the article doesn’t cover? I feel like I
must be missing something, surely it’s not the drug use alone that has led you
to believe this, right?

~~~
brianberns
You really don't get it? He was using drugs to seduce his students from a
position of power and influence over them. That wasn't cool even in 1967.

~~~
toofy
Fair point,

I definitely should have been more charitable in my reading, I got stuck on
this:

> The most effective rape drug ever, turning adults into children who can be
> exploited

I was looking to tease out some clarification, because the implication that
these drugs turn _adults_ into children and prime them for rape seems like a
strange leap from my perspective.

I’ll happily chalk it up to my lack of charitable reading and assume in good
faith the commenter was referring to the drugs combined with the power
dynamics.

~~~
brianberns
I think "turning adults into children" is just a reference to using drugs to
reduce their inhibitions and/or ability to resist. Not much different from
getting someone drunk.

------
Animats
Oh, that guy. See this New York Times article from 1977.[1]

 _" Over the course of several years, Alpert claimed to have taken some 300
acid trips. Inevitably, the problem became one of facing the blandness of
coming down.... Once, he says he and five others locked themselves in a
building for three weeks and dropped 400 micrograms of LSD every four hours.
Still; when the trip was over, it was over. Finished. Done. In “Be Here Now,”
Ram Dass describes the pain: “It was as if you'd come into the kingdom of
heaven and seen how it all is, and then you got cast out again.” Looking for a
way to get up there and stay up there, maybe even without drugs ... Alpert
split for India."_

Today. tuned out, turned off, and dropped out of sight.

[1] [https://www.nytimes.com/1977/12/04/archives/confessions-
of-a...](https://www.nytimes.com/1977/12/04/archives/confessions-of-an-
american-guru-ram-dass.html)

------
qwerty456127
TLDR. What's the theory?

