

Apple iPad biggest news is Apple A4 chip. Now they fully control supply chain - nexneo
http://i.gizmodo.com/5458314/apple-ipad-first-device-to-use-apple-a4-processor

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pedalpete
As far as I know, they aren't making screens, batteries, memory, and lots of
other components, so they are yet to fully control the supply chain, but they
are one step closer.

However, I wonder how the business scale of building their own processors is
going to work for the. Will the A4 move into the iPhone products? If the iPad
isn't a huge success, that processor is going to cost them more than having
bought from a chip supplier.

What tech does the new processor really bring?

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nexneo
Processor is always a harder to produce part and there is only handful of
suppliers. Not true in case of screens, batteries, may be also memory.

Why they choose their own product instead anyother? May be its better, at just
1Ghz 10" interface is super fluid. 10 hours of video on single charge. And
owning supply chain doesn't only mean more profit. Now they control features
and tweak chips to their own needs much more easily.

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ippisl
I'm not sure this is true with an arm processor. A lot of semiconductors
companies are working on an arm version , and optimizations for low power.

And the arm platform is quite an open platform. I bet any successful company
can work with big semi companies to tweak chips.

The biggest advantage is secrecy.If apple has some unique feature - it gives
them the time to secretly do research on processor architectures for it.

But not a lot of value for features everybody are looking for. in this case
open r&d is better.

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aaronblohowiak
There is such an overhead when dealing with an external company. Integration
projects are rarely fun. I postulate that having your hardware designer report
to the same guy as the chip designer makes the process much more streamlined.
No waiting for contracts / bizdev, being scheduled with competing projects, et
cetera. The powervr chip in A9 could be configured to support OpenGL (non-es),
but the TI Omap series has it set up for OpenGL ES instead. Now, if you are
apple, you could probably get TI to change that for you... but then you're
talking about contracts & process management and integration once again.
Wouldn't it be nice to just set directions and have it done?

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joshu
Fully control the supply chain? Please don't editorialize like that.

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hernan7
Maybe he meant "fully control the portion of the supply chain that matters".

Which I'm not sure is the case either...

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potatolicious
Yeah, from the looks of it Apple is running some _seriously_ beefy graphics
hardware that somehow sips power. We know the CPU is in-house, but what about
the GPU (which IMHO is the bigger part of the equation).

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pieceofpeace
The A4 is an System-On-Chip, so no separate GPU.

From <http://news.cnet.com/8301-13924_3-10442684-64.html> :

    
    
      By definition, the A4 is a system-on-a-chip, or SOC, that
      integrates the main processor, graphics silicon, and other
      functions like the memory controller on one piece of silicon...

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soundsop
As a circuit designer, I find it really surprising that Apple has rolled their
own processor for the iPad. We finally confirm why Apple bought PA Semi. But
it also says a lot about Apple and the processor industry:

* Apple predicts that sales will be high enough to justify building an iPad-specific processor. I assume nobody outside of Apple will get to use the A4 or derivative chips.

* Apple feels that there was no external vendor that could cost-effectively get the exact power-performance trade-off they wanted for the suite of applications that they want to optimize.

* Tempering the previous point, this may be a net loss in the case of the iPad alone in terms of pure costs versus going with an external vendor, BUT they now have much better negotiating power for all their other processor purchases from Intel, Samsung, ARM, etc. They can always threaten to roll their own. So even if they lose some money on the A4, they may be in a better position overall

* EDIT: Let me also add that despite what some people are claiming this is likely NOT an ARM, but based on PA Semi's power-efficient flavor of the Power architecture. I believe the Power architecture is in the same family as the Motorola PowerPCs that Apple formerly used and dumped for Intel because of the PowerPC's lower power-efficiency.

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liuliu
The price is tempting. But I don't like the mindset of bigger ipod touch (app
store and the closed OS).

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tfh
The first thing that comes in mind is, if it's capable of running OS X. (or
any other _regular_ OS)

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stonemetal
from other news reports it appears the A4 is just an Arm processor.

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spudlyo
It would kinda have to be to run random pre-existing iPhone apps.

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boucher
It could have an ARM emulator, but I doubt that's the case.

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bitwize
This makes Apple the new Commodore.

(Commodore really took off when they acquired MOS Technology. It enabled them
to develop the custom silicon they needed to make the VIC, 64, and Amiga
world-class game-changing machines.)

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timthorn
This isn't really new for Apple. They used to own a sizeable chunk of ARM (26%
if memory serves) back in the days of Newton but ended up selling out.

Now they own an ARM licensee.

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scythe
They also used to be a major player in the PowerPC line.

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n8agrin
I agree that the A4 chip is interesting. But to me the biggest news is that
Apple is supplying the iPad with 3g access and an unlocked SIM. Not that the
majority of people will buy an iPad, but they are preempting what I think
we'll see in the future with data connectivity, namely that we'll pay a
monthly subscription for wireless connectivity the same way many people now
pay for cell phones instead of landlines. We'll expect a carrier of choice and
we'll expect the service to be available almost everywhere and on almost every
device.

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mixmax
It's just the US that's behind the curve on this. I have a 2Mbit 3g connection
that works anywhere for $30 a month. Which is really great since I live on a
boat, so I'm connected wherever my home happens to be.

~~~
NathanKP
That sounds like a great lifestyle.

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mixmax
Me and three other guys that live on boats are actually in the process of
starting a blog with life and experiences from the boat life. It's probably
not HN material though.

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NathanKP
I can't speak for everyone else, but I can say that I personally would
definitely be interested in reading your blog.

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mixmax
Maybe I can find some nerdy angle and write a blogpost that I would feel good
about submitting :-)

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ssp
So, what does this chip do that, say, a Snapdragon doesn't?

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sschueller
Custom chip makes it hard to hack with no documentation and possible
encryption built in.

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jacquesm
You may be on to something there.

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osipov
True. Now we can start a countdown until they move their proprietary chip into
the iPhone.

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fierarul
It's not that important actually. iPhone is a locked system hardware and
software-wise. Whatever chip it's using now or in the future hardly matters.

On the other hand, adding these in the laptops might be interesting... But I
don't think they are in a hurry to switch architectures so soon.

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jey
What's the A4? Probably some ARM variant design, right?

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wmf
It's ARM. Given the "snappiness" one might speculate Cortex A9.

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soundsop
Where is the information coming from that it's ARM? I didn't see that
information on any of the live-blogging sites. Did someone mention it in the
Apple presentation?

I find it odd that Apple bought PA Semi who were apparently working on a
variant of the Power architecture and had them stop what they were doing and
switch to implementing an ARM.

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wmf
Occam's razor. ARM provides backwards compatibility with iPhone apps.

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soundsop
Occam's razor doesn't apply the same to the hardware equation.

If the architecture is ARM, it would mean that Apple bought PA Semi for the
purpose of getting them to dump their main architecture, which was the whole
reason they were created, and got them to switch over to ARM and develop,
fabricate, and test the chip in the span of a about a year.

I'll place my bets on Power architecture + ARM emulation/JIT/whatever or
iPhone App recompile for the iPad.

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wmf
I considered emulation, but it's _very_ hard to imagine that a PPC running an
ARM emulator could be more power-efficient than the best ARM. Keep in mind
that the PA Semi team has previously designed ARM, MIPS, and PPC processors; I
don't think they have any particular loyalty.

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soundsop
Cool. Thanks for the info that they designed other architectures. I didn't
know that. I guess we'll find out soon enough!

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adolph
I wonder what the 4 stands for? Was there an A1, A2, A3?

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matasar
I assume it's a pun on paper size.

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alex_c
That's what I thought... but it doesn't seem very likely from a US company?

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pyre
Apple has a history in design, where knowing about the A4 format is not
uncommon. Besides, it's not like they could have named the processor Legal,
Tabloid or Letter.

