
HP 15c Scientific Calculator to be Re-issued - mechnik
http://www.shopping.hp.com/store/product/product_detail/NW250AA%2523ABA?
======
craftsman
I first bought the HP-15C before my freshman year at Iowa State. I used it
through my undergrad EE program and after school continued using it for years.
The landscape layout, heft, and feel of the keys were all incredible.

Years later I tried a TI-89 and really couldn't stand it, even though it had
all the cool graphing foo and symbolic algebra which is really useful. So I
distinguish between the usefulness of the features of the TI-89 and the
qualitative feel of the HP-15C.

Even later still I tried the HP-33 for a basic RPN calculator that I could lug
around in my backpack and not worry about losing or damaging it. It's really
light and certainly doesn't have the feel that the 15C does. The keys have a
'toy' feel to them that I don't like.

All that to say that I probably will try this new 15C, but I'm skeptical. It
probably won't have the same heft in the hand, nor the feel of the keyboard as
the original. But hey HP, please surprise me!

~~~
mvzink
The keys often make it or break it for me. I really don't like the keys on the
TI-89 nor the HP-50g. I love the keys on the HP-48 though.

------
Bud
I still have my HP-41CX, which in my opinion is the greatest calculator that
HP or anyone else this side of Calculator Jesus has ever made. Still works
perfectly. I doubt it will ever be surpassed.

I think it's great that the 15C is being re-issued. It's another reminder
(sorely needed these days) that there was a time when HP made truly great
products.

Smart move by HP.

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shabble
I like the sneaky footnote:

 _Addition loop test, completed in HP labs. Up to 100X faster than original HP
15c._

"For at least one pair of numbers, we can perform a single addition about[1]
100 times faster than we could in 1982."

Did any of the original owners complain about its addition speed? I'd have
thought the matrix operations and numerical integration would be the slow
bits. I wonder if you could get this speedup just by better fab technology and
upping the clock rate, or if you'd need to go as far as bumping the process
size down a notch or cramming stuff closer together.

Edit: it's a limited edition, so presumably they're not doing anything too
complicated. I wonder how much a new set of masks cost these days.

[1] if it was more, we'd boast with that number!

~~~
RodgerTheGreat
The Wiki article[1] suggests a far more interesting story than better fab
technology- Apparently these puppies have an ARM core emulating the original
processor and operating system, making it possible to build custom firmware if
you are so inclined.

[1] <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HP-10C_series#HP-15C>

~~~
shabble
Oops, I missed the sentence about the ARM when I was looking it up. Does make
a whole lot more sense that way.

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dreamux
I appreciate the sentiment, but that seems unnecessarily expensive with modern
hardware.

~~~
kqr2
Actually, _used_ HP-15Cs can sell for hundreds of dollars since they are
highly sought after. So $100 for a limited edition run is not too crazy.

Although purists may still want the original since the new HP-15C appears to
be using an ARM processor to emulate the older Voyager hardware.

BTW, HP is also releasing a HP12C 30th Anniversary edition.

[http://www.techpoweredmath.com/hp-12c-special-edition-
hp-15c...](http://www.techpoweredmath.com/hp-12c-special-edition-hp-15c-re-
release/)

<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HP-10C_series#HP-15C>

<http://www.brouhaha.com/~eric/hpcalc/voyager/variants.html>

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alayne
I've used and programmed an HP-15C, but it was a novelty even then, 22 years
ago. I haven't used my HP-48GX since college. This reimagined 15C might be
interesting if you could access the ARM CPU or there are extended features. I
don't see any references to I/O though.

For practical interactive calculation I get a lot of use out of calc
<http://sourceforge.net/projects/calc/>. It's algebraic, but I find that less
error prone than RPN.

~~~
wyclif
Now that you mention it, the HP-48GX is another calculator that found a niche:
land surveying. It's so popular in that particular line of work that you can
barely get your hands on a used one on eBay. There are still third-party cards
for COGO and data collection that surveyors and some civil engineering
professionals rely on. I still have my HP-48GX from college along with the
manual and it's a standard tool of the trade:

<http://www.johann-sandra.com/surveying/hp48gx-hp-48gx-48.htm>

~~~
bane
[https://market.android.com/details?id=org.ab.x48&feature...](https://market.android.com/details?id=org.ab.x48&feature=search_result)

------
mahmud
Science left the limitations of the pocket calculator behind, ages ago. Any
field of analytic research, be it science, engineering, finance, etc. the
values you manipulate on a day to day basis are no longer scalars, but tend to
be matrices, often very large ones.

TI got this part right, sort of: the TI calculators while clumsy for data
entry have 2D screens and make apparent the various interpretations of
mathematical objects, as equations, matrices, and graphs.

~~~
sliverstorm
Pocket or table calculators can still be useful for quick calculations. Of
course you won't use a 15C for any seriously heavy lifting anymore- you have
MATLAB and Mathematica for that now- but M & M are poor tools for spur-of-the-
moment computation.

~~~
w1ntermute
> but M & M are poor tools for spur-of-the-moment computation.

I don't really see how this is the case. The only advantage of a stand-alone
calculator, now that I'm done with standardized test taking, is its
portability. And when most of my work takes place in front of a computer
anyway, I might as well just keep a copy of Mathematica humming so I can use
it as soon as I need to do a calculation.

In fact, having to pull out a standalone calculator, turn it on, and adjust my
frame of mind from "computer" to "standalone calculator" would probably be
very bad for spur-of-the-moment calculations.

~~~
sliverstorm
Well, I was thinking of more when I'm talking over my whiteboard with a co-
worker, or something like that. Also, M & M are not light on the footprint...
I don't especially enjoy leaving them open.

~~~
w1ntermute
That's definitely true when you're in a conference room working over
something, though nowadays I'm just using a scientific calculator app on my
Android phone instead, since that means I've got one less device to keep track
of.

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mcargian
Am I the only one that would prefer a HP 42s? $300 on ebay? are you kidding
me? I know, I've got "RPN Calculator" on my android phone, but it's just not
the same.

~~~
joezydeco
I love my 42s. It's still running great 24 years later. The Free42 app does a
nice job on iPhone.

------
runningdogx
With a one-line segmented lcd display, I wouldn't care that it's flashable
even if it ran linux. There's no way I'd get one.

The 12c I can somewhat understand. It has a niche; it's accepted on a bunch of
financial-related exams where other more advanced calculators are banned, and
many financial geeks can operate it instinctively. Common Finance operations
accessible with one or two keystrokes, combined with RPN, make it invaluable
even though modern calculators are far more expandable and capable than the
12c.

However, I see no place for the 15c. You could buy a HP 50g on amazon for the
cost ($100) of the limited edition 15c.

In testing situations where the 50g is not allowed, there will be no need for
numerical integration or matrix manipulation, so a cheap calculator like a HP
300s or TI 34 would be perfectly adequate at a small fraction of the cost.

~~~
jmspring
You see no place for the 15c? Just because the graphing 50g is in the same
price range? Solely based on "testing situations"?

Kinda sad, actually. I have an original 15c and still use it regularly. For
me, a calculator is about assisting me in the calculations I need, not in
walking me completely through them. A single line LCD display has proven
completely adequate for situations where I need to take logs, calculate n^x,
etc.

Why must a calculator do everything for you? I remember a time when numerical
integration, matrix multiplication, and derivatives were done by hand.
Additionally, we weren't allowed calculators in tests.

Pardon the rant, but it is comments like the statement above that make me
appreciate having studied under people like David Huffman (of Huffman Coding)
and instilled in me the ability and desire to derive things from first
principles.

~~~
jmspring
Oh, and others have stated, the ergonomics and keyboard quality of the 15c are
unparalleled in many calculators (especially non-HP calcs).

~~~
silvestrov
The quality of the keyboard cannot be overstated, both the size and the
physical feedback is perfect.

The 50G is a lot larger than the 15C which fits easily into a normal pocket.

The 15C is like an Apple product: it has the needed functionality and wastes
no space or keys on fancy flashy fluff you're never going to use: "Perfection
is achieved ... when there is nothing left to take away".

Programming it is very intuitive, "getting" the 15C is the best indicator I
had in high school for figuring out who understood math and who just carbon
copied the teacher.

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spitfire
Fucking fantastic! I'm buying one. Now please re-issue the HP-16c programmers
calculator.

~~~
WalterBright
I've had an HP-16c for 20+ years. Bought it new. I've been a programmer all
that time, and probably used it about a dozen times. Unless you're a
collector, there is no point to it.

~~~
epo
It may have been a folly but what a magnificent folly? Still use mine, would
kill to get my hands on an updated model.

------
PigBoyOhBoy
The HP-15C is the only calculator that ever became an extension of my mind. It
is that good. After 20 years the keys became a little unreliable, so the brain
connection snapped; I don't know if I could wire it back in again.

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jonah
I wonder how the durability and longevity of this arm emulated version will
compare to the original. Also, does it use the same buttons cells as the old
one?

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dmethvin
Kind of funny that HP picked the $99 price point AGAIN. Bill of materials
should allow them some profit on this one at least, unlike the TouchPad.

~~~
Anti-Ratfish

       HP Limited Edition Calculator ★

Here’s a $99 tablet from HP we can all love. So cool.

Gruber yesterday.

------
meatsock
idea cool this is. RPN back welcome!

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SamReidHughes
Well this is cool. It really seems pointless, though. There's already the 35s,
and the 48gII is a much better calculator at a lower price, and anybody with a
phone can get a far superior graphing calculator. It doesn't even come with
wifi.

~~~
RodgerTheGreat
You underestimate the value of a polished, direct user interface that users
have been familiar with for decades. My father has an HP-11c that he still
uses on a daily basis, and he can operate it without looking at the keypad.

...And what on _earth_ would you need wifi for on a pocket calculator?

~~~
SamReidHughes
You overestimate the value of a TOY that can only display one line at a time
of a four-level stack and obscure programming lanugage. This is not an attempt
by HP to create something useful to people. It is an art piece, one that
happens to be convenient to make, it's basically a 12C with different printing
and programming. And it's $99. $99 is a ridiculous price for a TI-83, and
beyond ridiculous for a 15C.

~~~
tesseract
It sounds like you shouldn't buy one, then.

Here is a desk lamp. Maybe you have seen one like this before:
<http://www.metmuseum.org/toah/images/h2/h2_1988.236.10.jpg>

A brand new one costs at least $400. It doesn't have wi-fi. It doesn't even
have a CPU. All it does is shine light on your desk, the same way a $5 lamp
from Ikea or Target can. Nevertheless it's still a very popular product and
plenty of people buy it even for $400 - partly because it is well constructed,
partly because of the recognizable classic design, and, yes, partly because of
Artemide's marketing and branding efforts. I don't own one, I have no
intention of buying one, but I don't have a problem with other people buying
them and I certainly wouldn't suggest that the manufacturer shouldn't bother
selling them.

~~~
SamReidHughes
So you agree that it's a useless toy then. Like that lamp.

~~~
tesseract
It's not useless. The use is not to do calculations though - it's to bring
satisfaction to the owner. And I predict HP will find plenty of takers who
feel they'll get at least $99 of satisfaction out of owning one.

Is it a toy? Sure, why not?

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SODaniel
Now HP just need to realize the amazing 'value' created by their flop with the
Touchpad and release it again. At $99! Take a $4-$600 million dollar hit and
create a HUGE base of WebOS users that they can profit off in the next few
years!

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antr
HP 15c: half the functionality, twice the badass

~~~
pbhjpbhj
4-100 times the price?

~~~
mechnik
1/3 of the original price after 30 years inflation.

~~~
pbhjpbhj
I was thinking "of the price needed to by a gadget with equivalent
functionality". But that's an interesting stat nonetheless.

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wslh
Why not maintain this aesthetic but add a secondary function inside, you slide
the screen and have a complete mobile inside.

~~~
SimHacker
How about also making it function as a wireless 1 terrabyte network disk
server?

~~~
wslh
My suggestion was not a joke, they can add some extra to the product.

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gaius
Available in the UK?

~~~
mechnik
"There are units slated for Europe." according to
[http://www.hpmuseum.org/cgi-
sys/cgiwrap/hpmuseum/forum.cgi?r...](http://www.hpmuseum.org/cgi-
sys/cgiwrap/hpmuseum/forum.cgi?read=192618#192618)

------
shithead

        What's in the box?
    
        HP 15c Scientific Calculator
    
          • 	Calculator
          • 	Batteries
          • 	Quick start guide
          • 	Manual on CD
          • 	Protective sleeve
    

_Manual on CD_

Cheap bastards.

~~~
mechnik
"User's Handbook was recreated from scratch. Printed and in box. Searchable
copy on CD. Manual took forever to get it nearly perfect." according to
<http://www.hpmuseum.org/cgi->
sys/cgiwrap/hpmuseum/forum.cgi?read=192618#192618

