
There is an Open Source Rival to Facebook: WordPress - ekaln
http://steveburge.com/blog/wordpress/wp-facebook/
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nchuhoai
I think people on HN tend to forget that most people dont care about the
technical requirements etc. The reason people use facebook because its usage
is clear and defined for what its build.

You go on Facebook to check in with your friends, see photos, chat/message.
You just dont do it with a blog.

It's like saying you could use paper towels as toilet paper. There is probably
some overlap in functionality, but people clearly associate types of products
with their specific use case

~~~
herval
The analogy here would be more like using books as toilet paper....

~~~
nchuhoai
Indeed, I should step up my English skills

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drcube
I don't see how this is different from saying "The World Wide Web is the open
source rival to Facebook".

It's true. There isn't anything about Facebook you can't do with your own
website. Facebook just centralizes it and makes it easier on the digitally
challenged. It's the Geocities of the 21st century. And it too shall
eventually crumble, while the Web continues on.

Make it easy to host, set up, administer and link websites and you will have
defeated Facebook. Unfortunately, that's easier said than done. People have
been trying for 20 years.

~~~
fluidcruft
I think a well designed Google+ API and infrastructure could be integrated
into WordPress effectively to form the missing pieces of a "social" backbone.
That's how Google+ can succeed in my mind--as a view-agnostic infrastructure
that sites can build off of to add the social features. It seems that people
think that G+ must succeed as a specific destination, but I think it can
spread and succeed in more "hidden" background role.

~~~
drivebyacct2
I feel like drcube's comment could be repeated to you here. Anyone's
components could be plugged together to create an identity service and a
synchronized or centralized stream of data ("microblog posts" ala Twitter, a
"news feed" ala Facebook, a photostream ala "Instagram") etc. The hard part is
composing it into a platform or something that appears as a centralized
platform in order to get people to use it.

~~~
ekaln
Yes, the secret sauce here is potentially Automattic. With WordPress.com,
Gravatar and a substantial hold on WordPress.org, they have a rare opportunity
to create a centralized platform.

~~~
drivebyacct2
So the question I've asked elsewhere applies... what advantage is it that
WordPress is open source now? If they're going to turn it into a social
network, they're either going to have closed components (specific to
Wordpress.com) or they're going to have to re-invision (and reimplement larges
chunks of) it as a distributed social network, something that you seem to be
happy to dismiss Diaspora of trying to do. Otherwise, it's just as "closed" as
Facebook if I _have_ to use a Wordpress.com site.

I feel like there is a massive misunderstanding of what Jetpack does and
provides in the way of a social network. All indications I've seen is that
Jetpack just shares to other social networks. It does... effectively
nothing... to provide an alternative free of other social networks.

I mean, you even call out Gravatar as being "owned" by Automattic. I don't
mind Gravatar but it's a bit stale and certainly not in the vain of a
distributed or "open" social network.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding but I don't see how Wordpress is anything like a
social network other than you citing the fact that it can tie into other ident
providers and share to other social networks. That describes... a metric ton
of sites out there.

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ekaln
Sure, it may be that Automattic may need to release more closed products if
they want to implement this vision

It may not even be the vision they have for Automattic ... but I do think it's
an opportunity they have.

For Gravatar, no it's not a social network at all, but it's a potential part
of a bigger, wider identity platform.

~~~
drivebyacct2
>it may be that Automattic may need to become a more closed if they want to
implement this vision

If we're just discussing Automattic becoming a closed Facebook competitor,
sure it's possible. I think they have the position to do so, but I'm certainly
not interested in another closed platform, even if bits of the core software
are free.

Gravatar is a wider identity platform, but it too just piggy backs on email.
It's an avatar platform that piggy-backs on the email identity platform. And
sadly, the avatar platform isn't distributed either.

In my opinion, BrowserID has a much better chance of being the technical and
featureful identity provider. Anyone can be a BrowserID provider and provide
any level of security from literally none to quadruple factor auth with PKI if
they wanted. I would love to see proposals on how to layer functionality like
Gravatar on top.

 _That's_ a social network alternative that I could get excited about!

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kijin
The author seems to conflate WordPress _the software_ and WordPress.com _the
service_.

> You control the source code. You can easily export your site from
> WordPress.com and take your site with you.

Only if you download WordPress from wordpress.org and install it on your own
server (or shared hosting account). The dot-com version contains a lot of
proprietary code.

> WordPress.com has already become a login option on many different websites.

Only if you opt to host your blog with them. WordPress.com is a great service,
but hosting your blog there is mutually incompatible with having complete
control over the source code. Besides, half the WordPress sites out there are
self-hosted, and WordPress.com logins don't work there.

Some of the features the article mentions, like JetPack, may be available for
both WordPress.com and self-hosted WordPress blogs. But that's just comments.
There is no meaningful aggregation between WordPress.com and self-hosted
WordPress blogs when it comes to posts and pictures. Until there's an easy way
to follow a lot of WordPress blogs no matter where they're hosted (hello,
RSS), it will be difficult to make the argument that _WordPress the software_
makes a promising social networking platform.

What we really need if we want a _distributed_ and _open-source_ social
networking platform is improved interaction between independent sites. Not
with newfangled stacks like Diaspora, but something that can be slapped onto
any existing blog, microblog, or photo sharing service as a plugin (again,
think RSS but much more powerful). Why limit your network to WordPress.com
users, or even all WordPress users? Give me a common API that lets me follow
folks on WordPress.com, DeviantArt, and Pinterest at the same time, a gem that
I can add to my Rails-based blog to support this API, and a nice open-source
client that ordinary people can use to access all that data. If a few
companies like Mozilla and WordPress.com started collaborating on this, it
would be a thousand times more viable than Diaspora can ever be.

~~~
dbh937
I agree with you, but I think the author is trying to get at what WordPress
_can_ do, not what is currently in place.

~~~
ekaln
Yes, very much so. This post was about the cards that Automattic hold in their
hands and really is just one idea about how they could play them.

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naner
I see we are continuing the tradition of shoe-horning WordPress into roles it
was not designed for.

~~~
zach
As I understand it, Emacs was originally a text editor.

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motters
The main open source alternative to Facebook is Friendica. It has more
features than Diaspora, encrypted communications, emphasis upon
decentralization and you can install it easily on a LAMP stack. You don't have
to settle for being data mined and sold by Mr Zuckerberg, or owned by the
Communications Data Act.

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dsirijus
Sites aren't people. It's linking wp sites. Don't even see how this stands
even in general concept of 'facebook rival'.

Technically, it sounds plausible (?), but that's irrelevant.

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ekaln
Yes, it's plausible and that's the main thrust of the argument.

I'm not even sure Matt M. has a clear idea of how the direction this might
play out but it might be like this:

\- build a huge set of site running the same codebase (done) \- start to
connect them on the admin level (doing) \- start to connect the on the user-
facing level (starting)

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jaaron
The issue isn't publishing, or even selective publishing, it's _smart
aggregation_.

You'd still need a solution like a feed reader or a site like FriendFeed. And
even then, you don't have the interactivity of FB with the ability to "like"
content, comment, and tag. It's the content that brings people to FB, the
opportunity to see who's up to what, look at funny photos and chat and gossip
with friends.

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hackNightly
This is a very interesting analysis. It's one that I would've never thought
of, but seems accurate. The fact that wordpress powers a great majority of
sites would be a huge factor in their success at playing the "social" game.
Funny, though, that most of those sites also incorporate FB "like" buttons.
Good read.

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k3n
WordPress: PHP-Nuke for the new generation.

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webwanderings
Give me a break. My family isn't using Wordpress and I don't see them use
Wordpress in near or far future.

~~~
ekaln
True, at the moment it's only site owners and WordPress.com bloggers who are
really tapped into this network.

We're talking about potential here.

As more end-users features like comments get added to JetPack, the chance is
there to entice more users like your family.

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danso
Sorry but this just seems to miss the point of how Facevook bested competitors
that, in theory, covered the same ground as FB did (Friendster, MySpace,
xanga, etc). Execution is as important as e idea...and FB, by focusing on a
narrow band of features and customization, created a service that was easy to
use and addictive. Nothing about Wordpress or the plugins required to get it
to FB functionality will match this.

This is like saying that WP is the open-source alternative to Titter, except
that you can write more than 140 characters and even add
photos/tables/anything...Twitter is more than just a text and newsfeed
platform

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benatkin
When you look at open and portable software for personal sites, as people in
the Indie Web community do, WordPress is an obvious frontrunner. Facebook and
WordPress started in very different places, but because they've expanded to
provide a lot of tools for establishing an online presence, there is certainly
some overlap. For instance, some businesses use their Facebook page as a blog.

By the way if you like running your own site and can make it to Portland at
the end of the month, consider going to <http://indiewebcamp.com/>

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paulsutter
The pendulum does always swing away from a walled garden. The author makes a
compelling case for Wordpress as a distributed and open potential social
platform.

Love to hear what Matt thinks about it.

~~~
JumpCrisscross
»" _The pendulum does always swing away from a walled garden_ "

I sympathise with the sentiment expressed but must point out that there is no
market force that prefers un-established open products to established walled
gardens save for a fraction of hackers' tastes and preferences. Most people
don't care, for rationally self-interested reasons, whether the product they
use is open or closed as much as whether it works or not.

~~~
xtractinator
>>I sympathise with the sentiment expressed but must point out that there is
no market force that prefers un-established open products to established
walled gardens save for a fraction of hackers' tastes and preferences.

Oh, yes there is, it's called change.

~~~
JumpCrisscross
The point isn't that established players are immortal. It is that the role of
open v closed in that usurpation process is negligible.

Closed systems overturn open systems just as much as the other way around (or
closed v closed or open v open). Very few people outside hacker culture care
whether what they use is open or closed.

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sadlyNess
<$0.02> Android not WordPress</0.02> Its not about Open 'source' but simply
'open'. Weak proof of this is the Facebook Phone rumors a while ago. What if
FB could at this stage own Android? FB wants/needs hardware presence for
longer term. Too bad Google is too focussed on "Social" as defined by FB.

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mgkimsal
jetpack and buddypress together would seem to give you a distributed-facebook
experience.

~~~
jonnyscholes
Wordpress should take on Buyypress' profile information management system
[xprofile], that would make Buddypress much more attractive imo. The fact that
a user sees completely different information in the wp-admin dashboard from
the data they entered into the Buddypress front end is very confusing and
messy from a UX stand point.

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kcbanner
Nope.

