
‘996’ Is China’s Version of Hustle Culture. Tech Workers Are Sick of It - ls612
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/29/technology/china-996-jack-ma.html
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iKevinShah
Might call it just a "China's version" but I'd rather that its a global thing
than anything.

When you look for any decent startup talks, you have people like Elon Musk and
Jack ma (of course) claiming to work "every waking hour" and that they used to
do it.

Also, being from India, I have had interviews with Startups like:

Them: _technical questions_

....

Them: _do you have any questions_

Me: What about the leaves and weekly working hours?

Them: _What do you mean?_

Me: Is it a 5 day working or 6?

Them: _Okay, we already don 't like you. (For real, their words)._

Me: Ummm.. Thanks?

~~~
krtkush
I have been told that I was rejected for not being a cultural fit. I strongly
suspect that was because I asked them about working hours/ days and told them
that I have interests outside of tech and I take my time off seriously and
don't really believe in 365 days hustle atmosphere.

In India it is very difficult to find developers who have interests beyond
coding, drinking and binge watching TV shows and unfortunately, they expect
the same out of you.

~~~
iKevinShah
> told them that I have interests outside of tech and I take my time off
> seriously and don't really believe in 365 days hustle atmosphere.

Yep, that might be it.

> In India it is very difficult to find developers who have interests beyond
> coding, drinking and binge watching TV shows and unfortunately, they expect
> the same out of you.

Well, the problem here, while looking for a job is that your interests should
not bother them and the other way round too. That is something some
interviewers can't comprehend.

~~~
krtkush
> Well, the problem here, while looking for a job is that your interests
> should not bother them and the other way round too.

You're correct. In my situation the interviewer asked "you're idea of an ideal
company to work for". That is where the whole saga started when I mentioned I
like my down time and hobbies.

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thewileyone
'996' isn't isolated to China. I first experienced this in the late 90's when
startup dotcoms were battling things out with each other. In most cases, we
first pushed ourselves to those levels of enterprise because we wanted to
release new functionality, ahead of the competition. After we started burning
out, that's when management started herding us in this direction because they
don't get that work is not done when you're asked to join pointless meetings.

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JamesAdir
if it's your own business go ahead - build what you like for how many hours
your like. But I'll never expect employees working on a salary to this kind of
hours except maybe for 2-3 days for a specific project a couple of times a
year.

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netwanderer3
That Baidu guy hit the nail right on its head, 996 works when you're in a new
booming industry because the lucrative rewards are going to be worth all those
long hours put in. But when you're in a maturing sector it just feels like a
never-ending grind without getting much in return.

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walrus01
Isn't one of the main points of having a communist revolution (I am fully
aware that China is no longer communist, except in name), the idea that people
should be able to work 40 hour workweeks, 5 days a week?

[https://www.texasaflcio.org/sites/default/files/article/feat...](https://www.texasaflcio.org/sites/default/files/article/featured/8-hours-
labor-history.jpg)

~~~
dragonwriter
> Isn't one of the main points of having a communist revolution (I am fully
> aware that China is no longer communist, except in name), the idea that
> people should be able to work 40 hour workweeks, 5 days a week?

No, which is why your sources identifies it as a union goal, not a Communist
revolutionary goal.

A Communist revolution is about who you are working for, not how much you
work.

~~~
walrus01
Whether you agree with it or not, it's a documented fact that Marxist/Leninst
theory is clear on the desire for a reasonable length of working day.

[https://socialism.com/fs-article/karl-marx-on-the-
struggle-f...](https://socialism.com/fs-article/karl-marx-on-the-struggle-for-
a-shorter-workday/)

Marx gives credit to the abolition of slavery for sparking new life in the
U.S. labor movement in Capital, Volume I, published in 1867, in a section on
the length of the workday.

"In the United States of North America, every independent movement of the
workers was paralyzed so long as slavery disfigured a part of the Republic.
Labor cannot emancipate itself in the white skin where in the black it is
branded. But out of the death of slavery a new life at once arose. The first
fruit of the Civil War was the eight hours’ agitation that ran with the seven-
leagued boots of the locomotive from the Atlantic to the Pacific, from New
England to California.

The General Congress of labor at Baltimore (August 16th, 1866) declared: “The
first and great necessity of the present, to free the labor of this country
from capitalistic slavery, is the passing of a law by which eight hours shall
be the normal working-day in all States of the American Union. We are resolved
to put forth all our strength until this glorious result is attained.”

At the same time, the Congress of the International Working Men’s Association
at Geneva, on the proposition of the London General Council, resolved that
“the limitation of the working-day is a preliminary condition without which
all further attempts at improvement and emancipation must prove abortive … the
Congress proposes eight hours as the legal limit of the working-day.”

~~~
eli_gottlieb
Unfortunately, there is often a great difference between Marxism and Marxism-
Leninism (aka: Stalinism).

~~~
dragonwriter
Leninism and Stalinism aren't the same, though Leninism-Stalinism would be a
better name for the latter than Marxism-Leninism is for the former.

~~~
eli_gottlieb
Stalinism's typical name for itself is Marxism-Leninism, though. I don't think
the etymologies make any sense, but when someone calls themselves a Marxist-
Leninist, that is what they mean.

