
Apple sold out kids' privacy yesterday under the guise of “screen time” apps - Ultramanoid
https://www.androidpolice.com/2019/06/04/apple-sold-out-kids-privacy-yesterday-under-the-guise-of-screen-time-apps/
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olliej
I don't know - I feel this article is overselling how much privacy is
compromised.

Specifically, the _worst_ case is that parents can know everything their kids
do (I think this is extreme, but seems plausibly possible given the available
APIs?). I'm not 100% sold on parents needing this, but we quickly go down the
rabbit hole of "raise your kids to know how not to be bullied, harassed, or
kidnapped" vs "monitor what your kids do and protect them from bad decisions"
(I've tried to be as neutral as possible here, but I know my bias is to the
former and that colors my language)

I think it's important to distinguish the "selling out privacy" when providing
that information to parents, vs the privacy abuse that comes from providing
usage information to arbitrary third parties (google, facebook, ad servers,
etc)

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closeparen
I agree, they are on completely separate planes of severity. Sharing
information in the context of a real-life relationship, especially with
someone who wields emotional, physical, or financial power over the subject,
is _far_ worse than sharing it with some impersonal corporate optimization
algorithm. The main reason to be concerned about corporate surveillance
datasets is that they _could_ , _someday_ leak or be weaponized into the
subject's personal relationships. Surveillance explicitly for this purpose is
beyond the pale.

Like most people I know, I had great parents who would have used this
responsibly or not at all. Others were not so lucky. Whether it was
homophobia, abuse, or simply overbearing parenting styles, some opacity in the
parent-child relationship was critical to their sanity and survival as young
adults. Particularly in college, where parents still have "power of the purse"
(so could force their kids to accept MDM) but tend to back off out of
logistical necessity (until now?).

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olliej
I do forget just how much support college/uni students get from their parents
in the US.

But even in the US I suspect pure financial support is not the norm - health
insurance extending to “children” who live elsewhere is obviously super
important in the US

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closeparen
Sticker price is for rich kids. Normal people require need-based financial aid
to afford 4-year degrees. The federal government computes an "expected family
contribution" based on your parent's finances, and your scholarships and loans
are sized accordingly. An 18-year-old from a middle-class background would
have an EFC far greater than she could pay out of pocket, and to borrow it
she'd need her parents to cosign. Actually, without their cooperation she
couldn't even get the EFC, since they need to open their books and sign the
FAFSA. She'd be staring down sticker price on her own.

Not even emancipation can break the link. She'd have to provide a documented
history of child abuse, serve in the military, get married, or wait until age
25. More likely, reduce her ambitions to a community college associate's
degree she can afford at sticker price on her own part-time wages.

The fact that our government provides a number called "expected family
contribution" is good evidence that, at least officially, contributing to
children's educations _is_ the norm.

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blub
I was always under the impression that messages and browsing history are off-
limits even with MDM profiles.

Does anyone know how they got access to them? And is Apple really adding an
API to access messages? This has been an unmitigated catastrophe on Android.

~~~
zimpenfish
I'd imagine there must be some kind of access to messages and browser history
for managed devices otherwise e.g. banks wouldn't be able to issue iPhones to
employees since (AIUI) they need to be able to capture that to prevent fraud,
etc.

~~~
soziawa
Browser history can be achieved through routing everything through a VPN.
Messages can be disabled and replaced with a compliant messenger.

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closeparen
Hopefully these parental surveillance tools will help to raise a generation
that understands not to discuss anything of consequence near an electronic
device.

~~~
Ultramanoid
Isn't that a ( "the" ? ) major problem with surveillance, though ? People will
change their behaviour when they know they're being observed.

This becoming the new normal is not good.

~~~
closeparen
I'm grudgingly accepting that cheap surveillance opportunities will always be
taken. A population that learns opsec from the cradle seems more likely to
flourish in this environment than one in denial or haplessly assuming benign
intent.

