
A Linux dev who helped thousands needs help to fight cancer - FiloSottile
http://linuxlock.blogspot.it/2012/08/this-is-where-we-are.html
======
eric_bullington
I just donated $50. And as much as I agree with the sentiments on this page
about my country's lacking health care system (and have always voted with this
in mind), I hope we can come together to focus on the problem at hand, which
is raising money for a fellow dev in his time of greatest need. I assume the
Indiegogo account cannot be suspended as easily as Paypal, so I made the
donation through Indiegogo despite the slightly higher service fee.

EDIT: Here's the link for the Indiegogo campaign:
<http://www.indiegogo.com/helios>

~~~
zitterbewegung
I just donated $10. Every little bit helps.

~~~
bdreadz
just did 10 as well. Every bit counts. Keep going people.

------
taknight
Blown away.

I'm simply blown away, as day after day the outpouring of support for Ken
grows. When I put my blog post together, my hope was to help a good friend
with a new monitor, and the rest was kindof a pipe dream.

Now, 8 days and almost $40,000 later, I'm at a loss for words.

Thank you to everyone who has donated, commented, passed it on, or done
anything else to help us out. Both Ken and I are speechless.

Thank you.

------
tytso
The title of the article is not accurate. He is not a Linux developer; for
those who don't know who he is, Ken is the founder of the Helios project,
which is a non-profit which refurbishes old computers and distributes them to
children whose families can't afford computers.

So for someone who has paid things forward, he certainly deserves help. See
the following article from his hometown newspaper in Austin, Texas for more
about the good works that he has done:

[http://www.statesman.com/news/helios-projects-ken-starks-
hel...](http://www.statesman.com/news/helios-projects-ken-starks-helps-kids-
bridge-digital-834613.html)

Update: Thomas Knight reports that they have raised the necessary $50,000. It
looks like the Indiegogo campaign is still open, and there's a note than any
excess that isn't needed for his medical expenses (if all goes well the $50k
should be enough) will go to Reglue, his non-profit which helps children to
get access to computers.

------
gambiting
Say whatever you like about EU, but I can't think of any country here that
would not help this man, or let him die simply because he can't afford
surgery. In the worst possible case he would still have the surgery done
straight away ,but he would have to pay afterwards,not before - he might end
up in debt because of that,but better than being dead for sure.

Anyway, donated some money, really wish he gets all the help he needs.

~~~
mtrn
* Germany: In 2005, Germany spent 10.7% of GDP on health care, or US$3,628 per capita. Germany has Europe's oldest universal health care insurance system, with origins dating back to Otto von Bismarck's Social legislation, which included the Health Insurance Bill of 1883, Accident Insurance Bill of 1884, and Old Age and Disability Insurance Bill of 1889.

* US: According to the World Health Organization (WHO), the United States spent more on health care per capita ($7,146), and more on health care as percentage of its GDP (15.2%), than any other nation in 2008. The United States had the fourth highest level of government health care spending per capita ($3,426).

Source:

* <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Healthcare_in_Germany>

* <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Healthcare_in_the_United_States>

~~~
csense
> Germany has Europe's oldest universal health care insurance system, with
> origins dating back to Otto von Bismarck...

I wasn't aware that a government-sponsored healthcare system this old existed
in the world, because it's always seemed to me that such programs are
fundamentally unsustainable.

So what I want to know is, how do they keep it sustainable? For example, if
there's no longer a market where demand responds to price signals, how do they
determine how much procedures cost? What keeps providers from increasing
prices 5% every year, regardless of cost increases, until they're essentially
looting taxpayers' money on a massive scale? If the government sets prices,
how do you avoid damaging shortages or surpluses when it gets the pricing
wrong? How about moral hazard -- the problem of people who waste healthcare
resources by going to the doctor for every little sniffle, scrape and twinge
since it's free? What keeps people in other countries who don't pay into the
system from getting a burning desire to move to Germany when they find out
they have something really expensive to treat like cancer or AIDS?

~~~
_delirium
I'm not sure about Germany, but in Denmark it's just a service of the state.
Doctors' salary, and hospitals' equipment needs, are assessed and negotiated
the same way as with other sectors of the public-safety apparatus, such as the
police department, fire department, and military. You'd like to keep your
hospitals well-stocked, your fire engines maintained and modern, your air
force state-of-the-art, etc., but without spending infinite money on any of
those, so similar decision-making procedures are used for each. Some services
are contracted out to the private sector on a competitive-bidding basis. For
example, private companies run a number of the ambulance services, and also
the Copenhagen bus system: the government draws up its requirements, solicits
bids, and chooses a bidder, who then gets an N-year contract. In addition,
there are medical-device manufacturers, both foreign and domestic, who sell on
the same competitive-bidding basis. So far the bidding seems to be relatively
clean, especially compared to, say, what happens with U.S. defense
contractors.

Moral hazard doesn't seem to be a large problem with hospital services
(doctors aren't going to order an unnecessary surgery), and there is a strong
culture against unnecessary prescription drugs. So about the worst that can
happen is someone wastes their local physician's time 30 minutes at a time.
Since small-time office visits aren't where most of the healthcare costs go
(in either Denmark or the U.S.), it's a minor concern. As far as foreigners,
that's a concern, and handled by the immigration system (you probably won't
get a visa if that's the reason you're trying to enter). The main current
concern is intra-EU system-shopping of that sort from Europeans, who don't
need visas. There are attempts to standardize something around that (the EU
"blue card" scheme is one), but it's one of those awkward areas that showcases
the EU's quasi-integration. There is also a debate currently about whether
Denmark should start charging tourists, since it's one of the few countries
that provides completely free emergency care to anyone. Many see this as the
right thing to do: if a visitor is injured in a mugging, for example, some
people view charging them for the hospital visit as adding insult to injury,
like sending them a bill for the police investigation would be. But there is
also annoyance that other countries don't reciprocate, so a little bit of a
sentiment of, "well if the bastards are going to charge me for getting mugged
in NYC, let's charge them when they come here".

~~~
sp332
The USA does not have a culture against prescription drugs. On the contrary,
many patients are not satisfied unless the doctor gives them some pills.
Antibiotics are often demanded even for viral infections, which probably lead
directly to MRSA and other drug-resistant bacteria.

~~~
_delirium
That's true; I think there are definitely cultural factors that make such a
system harder to implement in the US. An even bigger one is probably differing
attitudes towards end-of-life "heroic measures". I had in mind more a culture
among doctors, though: Danish doctors will simply not give you antibiotics no
matter how much you beg, if they consider it unnecessary. That's also a norm
among American doctors, increasingly emphasized in med school and by
professional organizations, but it doesn't seem as strongly followed in
practice. That may also be related to the American quasi-private system, which
allows "doctor-shopping": if the first says no, you can always find another
one who'll write the prescription (and some doctors even make a business out
of a word-of-mouth reputation for being lax with prescriptions).

------
mbreese
As an update: [http://linuxlock.blogspot.com/2012/08/it-started-with-
hopele...](http://linuxlock.blogspot.com/2012/08/it-started-with-
hopelessness.html)

While he still needs money, they did find a doctor to perform the surgery. But
don't let that stop you from donating, if you're able.

He also answered a question that I had: he's a veteran, so he should qualify
for VA medical assistance. According to his post above, the VA system moves
too slow to stop his rapidly spreading cancer.

~~~
FiloSottile
Finding a pro-bono doctor was in the plans from the start, if I get it right.
And the doctor should have never been in the $50,000 total. cit: "The cost
just to book the OR for Ken's surgery is $50,000, and that doesn't include the
surgery itself, nor any post-op medical expenses."

~~~
raverbashing
Wow $50,000?!

This is an advice: I think with this kind of money they can fly somewhere else
and do the operation and pay all costs associated with money to spare.

I think they can even try that in Canada

~~~
fsniper
Yes that's insane. I also suggested about health tourism on the blog page. I
think you may have the operation and after care - first world grade - in
Turkey for ~50K. May be even lower.

------
tzs
SSI disability payments should not count against Medicare income limits.

The United States fucking sucks sometimes.

~~~
doktrin
I simply _cannot_ comprehend our [as a nation] almost religious stance vis a
vis public healthcare. Hearing stories like this literally upsets me, because
it is _totally unnecessary_. We are better than this.

~~~
batgaijin
You think our health care is bad?

[http://abcnews.go.com/Health/US/hunger-children-america-
slow...](http://abcnews.go.com/Health/US/hunger-children-america-slow-steady-
starvation/story?id=14328390#.UDhNoDvptIU)

5% of our 300 million population is starving/malnourished children.

~~~
astrodust
Then there's the worrying proportion that's gargantuanly over-weight, and an
even larger proportion in woefully under-performing schools.

Sometimes you wonder if the kids in less affluent countries don't have it
better.

~~~
slurgfest
Then you look at international health statistics and stop wondering.

Lifespan is a good first pass indicator of the quality of health care.

~~~
vacri
Life expectancy != quality of life. Yes, a markedly low LE will mean
something, but apart from that, it's nothing to hang your hat on.

------
glesica
Donated $50. I realize we're trying not to rant about the healthcare system
too much, so all I will say is that this is exactly why the system is a
problem. What's the point of all our technology and "progress" if we still
don't provide reasonable care to all?

~~~
sseveran
How do you define reasonable?

~~~
jfb
How about surgery to deal with a metastasizing cancer that is highly
efficacious? That seems very reasonable to me.

------
callmesocialist
I still question the lack of healthcare in a developed nation.

~~~
FiloSottile
Yeah, in a nation like USA (or actually anywhere, but let's be realistic) no
one should die because they can't afford a standard treatment. I am from Italy
and the first times I couldn't believe it.

~~~
wisty
The danger is that people will over-use the public system. Governments can
solve this by offering a really bad customer experience (Soviet architecture,
putting an experienced nurse at the front desk rather than a cute 20-year-old
girl, bad food, less choices, and so on). People often prefer private
hospitals, even when public hospitals offer superior treatment. This takes the
load off the public system, allowing it to serve the people who need it.

~~~
justin66
> The danger is that people will over-use the public system.

How does that work exactly?

I'm trying to think of how I could even _deliberately_ overuse health care, in
the event that I decided health care were something desirable rather than
something I tend to avoid because it's boring. The best I can come up with
would be to hit myself with a hammer occasionally, necessitating treatment of
the injury. I'm not sure why people with a public system would deliberately do
something like that.

I'm not really trying to be facetious. This seems to be one of the ways in
which health care isn't like any consumer product: people really _do not_ want
as much of it as they can get. In terms of preventative medicine, just getting
them to use it can be quite a chore. In terms of treatment of disease or
injury, I don't see how using it for its intended purpose qualifies as
"overuse."

~~~
lgbr
This is actually a common problem with what is, in practice, an already
socialized portion of American healthcare: Emergency Rooms

Since emergency rooms cannot turn patients away, there are a lot of people to
come to the emergency rooms for things like pains in their big toe, menstrual
cramps, and so on.

This is why the emergency room is so absurdly expensive in the United States.
Health care here really isn't very expensive so long as you go nowhere near
the emergency room.

Sources: [http://www.thenewstribune.com/2011/09/25/1839726/state-
decid...](http://www.thenewstribune.com/2011/09/25/1839726/state-decides-
whats-not-a-medical.html) [http://www.bizjournals.com/albuquerque/print-
edition/2011/09...](http://www.bizjournals.com/albuquerque/print-
edition/2011/09/23/urgency-or-emergency-ads-target-er.html?page=all)
<http://birminghammedicalnews.com/news.php?viewStory=1275>

~~~
antihero
Yeah but in the UK, we go to our GP for such things and it reduces the load on
A&E

~~~
DanBC
Some people go to their GP and that helps reduce the load. But see the need
for out of hours doctors clinics being placed in the same place as A&E units -
Swindon has electronic signs telling you the estimated wait times for each
unit, with big signs telling you where out of hours doctors unit is.

Continuing to remind people about pharmacists, NHS_Direct, GPs, and out of
hours GPs is helping reduce pressure on the NHS, but still.

See also the gently cheeky "Acute admission units" - a method for A&E units to
avoid the penalties for keeping people longer than 4 hours by cycling people
out of A&E and into aau for monitoring and then release or admission into
hospital proper.

Over the past 5 years I have seen many A&E units; and spent many many hours in
them. They have all been very busy, and often with many people who probably
didn't _need_ to be there. (Although I have no way on knowing that; I am not a
doctor and I have no medical training and there's no way of telling just by
looking at someone if they should be there or not.)

The most serious problem in all of them was people turning up for things that
were very minor - a splinter; a bruised ankle; some other very minor injuries.
These are the kind of things that may need treatment, but you don't need to go
right that instant to hospital. I didn't even mind the people who were waiting
quietly, but you hear people grumbling about the wait times. I'm not sure they
realised that there are minors, majors, and resus, and that if there are 8
ambulances outside it's likely that majors is chock-a-block and all the
clinicians are a bit busy tonight.

~~~
antihero
Why don't they categorise people into priorities so someone comes in with a
broken arm, they get seen faster than someone with a graze?

Perhaps this could be solved algorithmically.

~~~
DanBC
They do triage.

But someone with a broken arm is in a lot of pain; someone with X is at risk
of death. And if you have people that need to be triaged that's one less nurse
for treatment (because they're triaging) and the triage queue gets long.

And the people with a graze are likely to have to wait a very long time,
because (for some reason) it's not acceptable to tell people to go and see
someone more appropriate. These people also count against the hospital for the
4 hour wait limit for A&E patients.

------
shirro
It isn't like a health safety net even has to be all that expensive. A good
mixed system looks after the poorest people and everyone else is encouraged
(with tax penalties etc) to have private health insurance. In a wealthy
country hardly anyone should be poor or unemployed anyway so the costs aren't
that great. The US is a triumph of ideology over common sense.

------
DanBC
I really hope paypal don't freeze the account for 180 days while they
investigate.

------
tzaman
Of all the crap we throw money at, I see absolutely no reason not to help this
man out. Donated.

------
FiloSottile
Indiegogo campaign: <http://www.indiegogo.com/helios> (RE-EDIT: IndieGoGo
takes 9% fee but PayPal is known for account freezing, the choice is up to
you)

~~~
BHSPitMonkey
Note that your donation goes 9% further if you just donate directly rather
than through IndieGoGo.

~~~
msie
Phew! If I had read the comments here before the article I would have donated
through IndieGoGo instead of PayPal.

~~~
BHSPitMonkey
But I said IndieGoGo results in a _smaller_ donation... (They take a 9% cut in
addition to PayPal/merchant fees.)

------
eculver
Donated $40.

Two days ago, there was a post on HN announcing Watsi, essentially a
Kickstarter for healthcare (Sorry if I'm discrediting it's overall value in
any way, it's a great idea: <http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4424081>).
Most of us in the Western world aren't the target audience for Watsi, but this
seems appropriate. Can we not make this happen and see a cohesive case to be
made for those asking questions about cause and background?

------
taknight
We have closed donations coming directly through PayPal. Thank you to everyone
who has been so generous. The IndieGoGo campaign will remain open for another
day or so, but we can't keep taking donations when we've now clearly met our
goal.

The $50,000 we collected in 10 days will more than cover all of Ken's medical
expenses as he continues through his difficult cancer treatment. Thank you to
everyone who helped out, you are all wonderful people. :)

Thomas

------
rplnt
I'm sorry to be so ignorant when it comes to linux core (perhaps?) developers,
but the entire blog post didn't mention his name nor his wife signed it with
hers so I could at least assume who he is.

~~~
FiloSottile
Ken Starks. From the post on <http://thomasaknight.com/>

~~~
jorahmormont
$ cd kernel ; git log | egrep -i starks $

Nothing there.

It would help if they told us what his contribution actually was.

~~~
chaostheory
I could be wrong but I don't think he was a developer. From the pieces I've
read it looks like his contribution to linux, seems to be distributing it
through donations of old computers with linux installed to people /
organizations in need.

~~~
rplnt
It's funny how we assume (well, at least I did) how contributer has to be a
developer.

~~~
Shish2k
The title of the story is "help a linux dev[eloper]"

------
ixacto
I would gladly pay 5% more income tax to be on par with Canada as far as rates
go, if the USA got single-payer healthcare.

~~~
streptomycin
It'd cost quite a bit more than that. 5% of the income tax is only like $50
billion dollars, which is dwarfed by our current Medicare/Medicaid spending to
cover a fraction of the population. Maybe something like doubling everyone's
taxes could do it?

~~~
ixacto
That is if we kept spending at current levels. Canada spends much less on
healthcare than the united states. Canadian life expectancy is also higher,
which leads me to believe that their _gasp_ socialist healthcare system is
actually more efficient.

~~~
streptomycin
Our government already spends more money on Medicare/Medicaid than most other
governments spend on healthcare. I don't see how we could possibly lower our
government spending by covering more people.

~~~
oneandoneis2
Friend of mine got charged almost a thousand dollars just for being taken to
hospital in an ambulance. The journey lasted about ten minutes.

This kind of massively-overinflated cost is endemic in US healthcare. Getting
rid of it would easily allow you to lower spending whilst covering more
people.

~~~
streptomycin
You're misunderstanding my point. Our _public_ healthcare systems, Medicare
and Medicaid, are already more expensive than many national healthcare
programs. So forget whatever you friend spends in the private sector. Even if
all people not on Medicare/Medicaid spent absolutely nothing on healthcare, we
would still be spending more money than these other countries in total. So the
idea that we can somehow expand coverage while wildly reducing costs seems
silly.

~~~
ixacto
Well if Mitt & CO win, who knows Medicare vouchers might become a reality.
Then when people are thrown out of hospitals by the ends of their colostomy
bags and IVs, a single payer system might appear to be a bit better solution.
All the VA (socialized healthcare for people in the military-industrial
complex) and Medi* (socialized healthcare for old people/boomers) are doing is
creating an insurance market for people outside these demographics, which
constitutes the nations supply of genx/geny workers. If I did not have
insurance under obamacare I would have to pay $4068.15 so far this year. This
was for one emergency room visit lasting an hour and 2 doctors appointments.
If I didn't have insurance I just wouldn't have paid it.

Do like Mitt does, keep your money outside the country where the Government
can't get it.

------
sharms
Hackernews has been very kind to me through the years, glad I can send a few
dollars to return the favor

------
carbocation
He needs to get himself admitted to a major academic medical center, possibly
via the ED.

------
agumonkey
Quote from indiegogo:

    
    
        8/25 - Update 4: Thank you!
    
        I can't thank you enough. Not only have we found Ken a surgeon, but the surgeon has agreed to 
        do the surgery for a fraction of the original cost. We have raised $47,600 total now, enough 
        to cover the surgery, any and all pre and post op medical expenses, all medication Ken will 
        need for the foreseeable future, and there might even be some left over to go to Reglue.
    
    
        I can't stress enough how thankful I am to everyone who has helped. The outpouring of support 
        is amazing. You are all wonderful people. :)
    
    
        Thank you.

------
chadr
Newer blog post about the surgery:

[http://linuxlock.blogspot.it/2012/08/it-started-with-
hopeles...](http://linuxlock.blogspot.it/2012/08/it-started-with-
hopelessness.html)

------
marquis
I just donated via Paypal given the comments about the 9% vs Paypal fees.
However it got me thinking from reading the indiegogo site:

"The cost just to book the OR for Ken's surgery is $50,000, and that doesn't
include the surgery itself, nor any post-op medical expenses."

What is the total cost of expenses, or is that unknown? Knowing how much is
needed would possibly help raise more funds.

~~~
noahc
In general American health care is a giant black box. Depending on the deal
your insurance company has cut is how much stuff costs. Most doctors offices
cant tell you how much anything costs, which is why i opt out of all tests.

------
sidcool
My donations went to "DragonWing Software", I hope that's correct.

~~~
mparlane
Thomas A. Knight has put up a page that tells Ken's story and he's volunteered
to host the fund raising page for this effort.

I believe it's Thomas' company.

~~~
taknight
Yes. DragonWing Software is my software contracting company. I also publish my
books under DragonWing Publishing.

Thanks!

------
jfb
$50. Nobody should be in this situation. The US system is appalling.

------
sidcool
Ok, I trust Hacker News and I am donating whatever I am capable of.

------
johnrob
I donated $30 (thought I'd add more social proof while I'm here).

------
barking
America does seem to be a country where it's devil take the hindmost but
people who live here in Europe find plenty to complain about in our systems
too.

~~~
keithpeter
Donated £13.06 according to paypal.

In the UK, the National Health Service _certainly_ has inefficiencies, delays
and issues. However, care is _free at the point of need_.

I suppose there are different ways of rationing a resource for which there is
theoretically an infinite need. I prefer the way we do it in the UK.

------
gozman
Set aside the debates on healthcare, the awful reality of this man have to
raise funds to keep him alive, or any other political rhetoric.

Most of us, even the most starving bootstrapper of the bunch, has enough
change in his/her pocket to make an impact on a real human life.

Let's not brag about what we donated, or how much, or if we donated at all.
But please everyone, let's reach out for someone who needs us like every good
human should.

------
hhimanshu
I donated $10, I wish him better health and good luck

------
bunsenhoneydew
I just donated through paypal. Hopefully the account will hold up ok.

Geeks with heart. You're a lovely bunch HN peeps...

Wishing Diane and Ken all the best.

------
bjm1
donated $100, hope he gets better.

------
tylerc230
+$50

------
bstar77
I'm happy to see these kickstarter clones popping up for medical causes. I'm
much more apt to donate when I can better see where my money is going (and
hope I don't get scammed in the process).

------
roma1n
Donated. Now what about fixing your health care system, Uncle Sam?

------
bobdvb
Don't know the man, a little sad that we have to support the screwed up US
medical system, but I've given money because I have it and he doesn't.

------
raheemm
Just donated $35.

------
antihero
Holy fuck is your healthcare system stupid.

------
masmullin
Donated. Get well Ken.

------
simcop2387
You are all lovely people. <3

------
iamanet
Donated $50. Get well Ken.

------
two1eight
donated $40. Get well soon.

