
Spotify: Apple rejected our app update to drive iPhone users to Apple Music - dragonbonheur
http://www.stereogum.com/1885802/spotify-apple-rejected-our-ios-update-to-drive-iphone-owners-to-apple-music/news/
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sctb
Previously:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12009990](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12009990)

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djrogers
Spotify made changes to their app that violate the App Store rules they've
been playing along with for many many years. Specifically around App Store
subscriptions and advertising out-of-app purchase options inside your app.

I'm not defending or denigrating the App Store rules here, but make no mistake
- this is a deliberate move on the part of Spotify to cause a controversy.

What's with iMusic in the title? That's not a product, it's not in the linked
article, and it's not common shorthand for Apple Music.

\-- _edit: thanks for fixing the title_

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lnanek2
Yeah, amusingly, even Google Play has rules against third party payment
processors. So Apple's behavior cracking down on directing app users to go pay
somewhere else than the app store isn't even Apple specific.

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Etzos
Actually... There's a specific exemption for this kind of thing[0] on Google
Play.

[0] [https://play.google.com/about/monetization-
ads/](https://play.google.com/about/monetization-ads/)

Edit: Relevant section: "Developers . . . must use Google Play In-app Billing
as the method of payment, except [when] . . . payment is for digital content
that may be consumed outside of the app itself (e.g. songs that can be played
on other music players)"

Edit 2: To clarify, Spotify services are available outside of the app itself
so I'm fairly certain they can avoid using Google Play's In-app Billing if
they so desired. I have no idea if they actually do or not or if Google would
actually have a problem with this or not.

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daveilers
What Spotify would like is to be able to not pay Apple for use of its store.

It would be as if a product inside a Walmart demanded to be allowed to put up
a display INSIDE Walmart of their product with a large sign saying instead of
buying our mop for $13 here, come out to the parking lot and I'll sell it to
you for $10.

~~~
mikeash
The App Store is not a Wal-Mart. Wal-Mart doesn't let people use its store to
give stuff away for free, for example, while Apple has no problem with free
apps that never require payment for anything. Wal-Mart also isn't the sole
source for products which work with another kind of product, they're just a
store, little different from other big stores. The App Store is the sole
source for software that runs on iPhones, and it exists mainly to drive iPhone
sales, the revenue from the App Store itself is insignificant.

~~~
tdy721
Apple requires all developers to pay $99/yr to publish any applications, even
free ones. They are strictly pay to play. Also, App Store revenue is certainly
not "insignificant", we're talking $Billions of dollars for Apple here...
[https://techcrunch.com/2014/01/07/apple-10b-in-app-store-
sal...](https://techcrunch.com/2014/01/07/apple-10b-in-app-store-sales-
in-2013-15b-paid-out-to-developers-to-date/)

~~~
mikeash
Good point on the $99/year. Still, good luck convincing Wal-Mart to let you
user their stores as a distribution point for your free stuff for a low annual
payment.

Apple is big enough that billions can easily be insignificant. According to
that article, they've paid out $15 billion total to developers. That means
that Apple's cut has been about $6.5 billion. That's over a period of eight
years, so somewhat less than $1 billion in revenue per year. Currently Apple
is making $10-20 billion per quarter in _profit_ , with yearly revenues beyond
$200 billion.

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caruana
As an Apple and Spotify customer I will quickly stop being an Apple customer
if they try to control / influence Spotify. I use it all day at work and at
home on my Sonos. I never knew that if challenged I would be more loyal to a
music streaming company then my main hardware providing company, but, it would
be a non negotiable issue for me.

~~~
stephenr
You're aware that this whole thing is caused by Spotify choosing to violate
the terms which they've operated under for years, just to get attention?

~~~
caruana
As a customer, that is literally of no concern to me. I'm not taking a
position on who is right or wrong. I don't care who did what and to who, the
only thing that matters to me is how my service(s) are interrupted. As the
customer, I will first choose the provider that I perceive as providing me
with greater benefit and then remove any resistance to that provider services.
Anything outside of the equation ultimately doesn't matter and therefore won't
enter into my individual purchasing power.

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TheSoftwareGuy
This sounds like spotify is trying to stir up a public outrage, so it can get
around the rules apple applies to everybody.

~~~
ewzimm
It's kind of amazing how well it works. I completely understand consumers
being upset about anti-consumer behavior from businesses, but competitors
using every tactic they can get away with to out-compete each other,
especially enforcing established contracts, is expected behavior. Nobody wants
monopolies, but the phenomenon of people swearing off a brand forever because
they try to make use of their business advantages is fascinating. It might be
a sign of a need for someone to intervene to level the playing field, but I'd
never be personally offended by it.

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dkuntz2
When you start an article telling me to read an awful book that tries to tell
me it's allegorically easy for a company to turn into a dystopian ruler of
all, you seem more than a little alarmist. Regardless of the rest of the
content.

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robmcm
Title should not say "iMusic", but "Apple Music" like in the linked article.

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nathancahill
Links to [http://www.recode.net/2016/6/30/12067578/spotify-apple-
app-s...](http://www.recode.net/2016/6/30/12067578/spotify-apple-app-store-
rejection)

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wishinghand
Amazon does something similar regarding stepping around the 30% Apple fee with
Comixology and their ebook offerings- you can access them on the app, but you
have to buy them on a web browser. I can't recall if they explicitly say "go
outside the app store to buy" or not though.

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koenigdavidmj
I'm surprised so many businesses ever got convinced to work with a company
that can shut down your entire business on a whim, with no recourse.

~~~
sosuke
Sounds like the same comments I see when Google changes their search
algorithms.

~~~
alttab
Yeah, if your entire product's strategy relies on someone elses platform and
you don't have multiple income streams, or ways to acquire customers, you'll
be exposed to these sorts of things.

I wonder how big Spotify's android base is. I know they get my $10 a month.

