
Is Berlin the new home for tech start-up business?  [video]  - jimmyjim
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/click_online/9739525.stm?
======
twfarland
I'm an NZ expat who has lived in Berlin for the last few years. While Berlin
is cool, let me present a caveat...

I've enjoyed the music scene and cheap rent, but have experienced major
culture shock. It is a very intense place, full of contradiction, i.e.
extremely open-minded in some areas and absurdly conservate in others. Berlin
alternatively challenges and reaffirms one's various values.

Sometimes it seems like the 'adults' have left the city and left the 'kids' in
charge. At other times, it feels impossible to breathe without violating some
ponderous rule. Many are sucked into what is called a 'Berlinquency' - an
existence in which one is spoilt by the hedonism, looseness, and condusiveness
to self-obsession this place affords.

The tech scene is ok. There are a lot of clones. Some great meetups, though.
It all seems to be on the up. Watch this space. And visit for a month before
deciding to move here.

~~~
k-mcgrady
Any examples of what is 'absurdly conservative'?

~~~
TillE
As a New Yorker who's lived in Berlin for four years, I can't think of much.

I've noticed on certain English-speaking forums that there's a tendency to
exaggerate and obsess over _incredibly_ minor cultural differences. Like
jaywalking, which isn't even an issue in Berlin (people do it and nobody
cares).

------
jfaucett
I'm a young developer living in Germany. Here's my perspective. Berlin is
cheap, affordable, has an international culture (I'm an emmigrant) and pretty
much something to offer to everyone, so the city itself just has a good
attraction for young people.

I don't know why the startup scene has started booming here but just type in
"web start-up" at indeed ([http://www.indeed.de/Jobs?q=web+start-
up&l=berlin](http://www.indeed.de/Jobs?q=web+start-up&l=berlin)) and you'll
get 275 results. Plus the UK has cracked down on emmigration laws and Germany
has opened them up, at least for engineers, etc. b/c of the "Fachkräftemangel"
i.e. the fact that the Germans lack skilled laborers. So whereas before for
Europeans and especially Eastern europeans the UK was #1 its now changing b/c
Germany is closer and easier. Also Germany seems more open to Europeans
period, the UK with Cameron is doing all it can to shun the rest of Europe.
The only problem I see, is that you still need to know German to get around (
which no one studies in school), which for instance is why my brother hasn't
come.

EDIT: I guess I exaggerated with the "no one studies in school" bit. My point
is that english is the only language we are all pounded into learning
regardless of whether or not we have an interest in languages or a talent for
them, so we can at least function at some level with english. German, however,
is not the lingua franca I think we can all agree on that. I'm quadlingual (if
that's a word), but not all talented developers like languages as well and
unfortunately whatever the germans say, you still need to know german if you
want to assimilate in germany, get an apartment, go shopping, and live life.

~~~
iconfinder
"which no one studies in school"

In Denmark we can select German classes in both elementary and high school.

~~~
zxcdw
Sure, here in Finland too, but who bothers at that age? Most people couldn't
care less about "learning stuff that could be useful in future", and even less
ever actually start thinking that taking optional classes could be
benefitical. And even less of them think so at high school, let alone
elementary school. So, in essence, no one studies German in school.

~~~
radicalcut
When I was young my attitude was similar but in my elementary school and high
school two foreign languages were mandatory (English, German or Fench) so I
didn't have any other choice. I live in Czech Republic.

At that age I couldn't care less but now that I'm thinking of doing a PhD in
Germany (from what I've heard a very affordable country with many great life
science labs) I'm very glad that I remember at least basics even that I
haven't actually spoken German for six years.

I think that learning two major foreign languages should be mandatory. Almost
everybody can learn one language quite well after +/- 10 years during
childhood and to learn at least basics from the second one should not be that
much of a problem too.

~~~
monopede
"I'm thinking of doing a PhD in Germany"

I'm not discouraging, but once you're considering a particular position,
please try and talk to previous PhD students of your prospective supervisor.
Germany has hardly any fully-funded PhD positions. Instead you typically get
employed as staff and have to combine that with your PhD work. The problem is,
often professors take on lots of PhD students to get more funding and end up
having hardly any time. I've heard stories of a professor having 8 or so PhD
students that still wait on him to read their thesis and give the go-ahead for
their viva (PhD defense). I'm not saying this is the case everywhere, but it's
something to be aware of. So try and find out beforehand.

~~~
radicalcut
Thanks a lot for advice. I have still more than a year ahead before I need to
make a decision so there's enough time to ask around when I narrow my choices.
I haven't even made my mind whether I want to get into neuroscience or stay in
molecular/cell biology.

Sadly, the situation as you decribed is almost the same with PhD students in
the lab where I currently work on my diploma thesis and in some around in the
institute. Having seen what I've seen (troubles with disertations and giving
the PhD defense go-ahead) that's definitely something I want to avoid.

------
MrKurtHaeusler
I am a foreigner who has been working as a developer or manager in the
software sector in Germany for around 10 years. For a couple of years I have
been trying to move towards self-employment, with some ups and downs, but I am
making progress on a project together with my wife. Last year I had the chance
to switch jobs and move elsewhere so I naturally targeted Berlin. I would like
to keep working in a high-paying job while funding the startup that I work on
in my free time. I noticed a few things:

There are a quite a few startup jobs, but they are low end, low paying. Many
pay even less than what I started on 10 years ago. They are looking for those
starting their first job I think. I get the feeling Berlin startups get a lot
less funding that other startups. Even the non-startup jobs that require more
experience seem to pay a lot less, and even with the slightly cheaper rent
than other cities, I couldn't find any attractive options. The official work
experience I have on my CV is more enterprisy stuff like .NET and lots of
stuff startups care less about like Scrum, Kanban, management in general and
agile software development. I do have experience with things like Ruby, Python
and JavaScript, but even startup employers were only interested in what was on
my CV.

Not complaining or anything, just trying to help get a feel on what I found
while looking there last year.

I found a good job near Frankfurt, and who knows, maybe I will end up in
Berlin later, but I feel I might not need to. Frankfurt has a startup scene
(and a rich financial sector). So does Cologne where I used to live.

~~~
NicoleSimon
"The official work experience I have on my CV is more enterprisy stuff"

That already is your point. You are coming from an enterprise thinking and
payment structure - Berlin is everything but Enterprise.

With your kind of payment expectations, they will simply expect you to step up
the game, and that probably is at least CTO if not co founder. If you want to
be your specialized dev, you need to be extra good to work around this area
and _understand_ what startups are about.

Also, judging by your nickname here, your name still sounds German. If you are
from A / CH by definition (and if not proven otherwise on your CV and through
experiences) you are not automatically startup material. Don't get me wrong:
it is just about different skillset and mentality and if you cannot provide
proof that you are not tainted by that obstacle, you will have an even harder
time getting a job in that environment.

~~~
MrKurtHaeusler
I am not an enterprise thinker, but I have developed enterprise salary
expectations. One of my current areas of interest is helping slow old large
businesses be more effective by using e.g. Lean startup ideas.

To be honest though I am not a natural entrepreneur. Or at least I may have
been while younger but I have become soft over the years. I only really
started thinking about startups etc maybe 3 or 4 years ago and it's hard to
break out of the comfortable employee lifestyle.

I am from an English speaking country with German ancestors, but I don't know
if that background makes me more or less startup material. There seem to be
roughly the same distribution if entrepreneurs here as in my home country.

But I am focused now on being founder rather than employee. Already CTO of a
non-profit r&d team with my wife as CEO.

------
webjunkie
Home for start-up business? Yes. For tech start-ups? I don't think so. I have
yet to meet one engineer-driven tech start-up from Berlin. Most founders I met
and know are some business guys with oh-so-clever ideas looking for just the
right CTO guy to make their plan reality. And most German developers I know
also never thought about working for a start-up. They happily flock to every
large German company you may know. The previous start-up I worked for had more
Spanish developers than German ones.

~~~
wickedchicken
Ableton? Native Instruments?

~~~
hfaber
They're not startups.

~~~
nagnatron
How about Bitwig?

------
wondering
On the 'fake it,till you make it' path,Berlin seems to be right in the 'fake
it' part.You guys write about low costs of living,however there are cheaper
places in Eastern Europe with better tech talent availability overall.You
mention the nightlife and a couple of the clubs are indeed world class,but I'd
doubt it that you go there more than 5 times a year.The internet in Germany is
borderline third world quality,in Bulgaria and Romania you get some of the
fastest internet in the world for a fraction of the price you'd pay in
Germany.The women are better than in the UK,but far from the best looking in
the world.

What I'm trying to say with this point is,I don't really see the advantage of
being in Berlin in the early stages of your business too,when you're just a 3
people shop,busting your asses all day to move things forward

Having written all that,I loved Berlin during my few months stay.

~~~
codesuela
>The internet in Germany is borderline third world quality

that may be true for rural Germany but I'm writing this from a 100 MBbit cable
connection which costs me 40 EUR. You can also get 50 Mbit DSL for 35 EUR p.m.
(both including a telephone flatrate)

~~~
wondering
For probably half the price in Romania and Bulgaria,you can get Gbit internet
connection...not to mention that when you start out,you aren't forced with
most providers to sign long ass contracts and on the next day your internet is
up and running.If you ever have issues,they'll sort it out in hours.

Again,loved Berlin,it's just I always see some guys hyping it without being
able to back up their points,so I'm calling their statements out.

~~~
NicoleSimon
And how many people need a gigabit internet connection at home or in the
office?

Plus if you know you are not ready to move into something long term, then you
simply move to a space where you can rent this.

------
DividesByZero
I'm an engineer who visited Berlin earlier this year and loved the city - it's
like my home town of Melbourne, Australia which I love, but just MORE of it.

I already had the itch to leave my 9-5 and go somewhere for an adventure, so
when I got home I set about working out what I'd need to do to head over there
and how much capital I'd need for about 6-months self sustained living in
Berlin (came out to about $15,000AUD, thanks to the current strong AUD).

I found out one of my close (engineer) friends was also looking to leave his
job and do something interesting and exciting, so I've convinced him to come
with me too. Succeed or fail, it really seems like we could be part of
something exciting in Berlin! Any advice on dos and don't would be
appreciated.

------
kellysutton
I've been back and forth from Berlin for a little while now. My company's home
base is in NYC, but I sometimes work out of Berlin.

Even this year while I was there (Feb. - May), the startup scene is exploding.
I liken it to the satisfaction of knowing of a great band before everyone
else: there's no doubt that Berlin will be muttered in the same breath as the
Valley, NYC and London. It's only a matter of time.

The German culture can be a bit harsh to outsiders, but the Berlin startup
scene more than makes up for that. The folks there are very kind and always
willing to entertain a good conversation.

------
graup
I'm from Berlin, so I naturally enjoy the kind of hype that's being created
since one or two years ago. However, I'd like to stress what someone in the
video said: It's just budding and really not yet comparable to New York or
London. There are quite a couple of cool start-ups here now, but still few
with innovative breakthrough technology and also few large investors. But I
see it coming, too.

I guess this will also become a self-fulfilling prophecy. For ten years people
have been telling how cool Berlin is and a lot creative people were attracted.
Now everyone's telling about the new tech start-up scene and that will attract
even more talented people - hopefully also large investors.

Interesting times ahead!

~~~
bojanbabic
I agree on that. I've moved to Berlin together with hype and there is only
handfull of really successful startups. Berlin needs more internet
millionaires and more transparency. By now, afaiks most of Berlin tech
millionaires come from Rocket Internet and people that spawn out of RI have
different mindset from what you can see in Valley. But, I'm pretty sure that
new generation of Berlin entrepreneurs are on good path to change tech scene
from ground up.

------
paulnelligan
Berlin is a FANTASTIC city to bootstrap your project ...

reasons: 1. cheap cost of living, 2. availability of relatively well paid
contract work, 3. A very supportive startup / creative community who are
willing to share info and resources, 4. A very smart and creative demographic,
5. wonderful bars, clubs, and restaurants, 6. German people are actually a
decent bunch :)

disadvantages: 1. over-strict regulations in dealing with Banking and
Regulatory bodies (whatever you do, do NOT sign up for a postbank a/c), 2.
Less than ideal weather.

Overall a win I think, which is why I continue to call Berlin my home.

~~~
wickedchicken
> wonderful bars, clubs

They don't close. They. Do. Not. Close. As a nocturnal developer I could go
out to a club, get back to my hostel at 2, write code for 2 hours and then go
out again. Bliss.

------
spitfire
So if someone wanted to relocate to Berlin to start a company, or to expand a
team into europe, how would they go about that?

Where do people want to live? Where to locate offices? Where do you find good
talent? What are the legal steps to do so? Any pitfalls to avoid? Others
should feel free to jump on this.

------
KilianSchramm
Berlin is ramping up quickly. We get applications from all around the world.
This is great and was much different just 12 Month ago. The hockey stick kicks
in, now!

One comment on English: It is much easier than most non-english speaking
cities and most international talent can manage the daily tasks within weeks.

check out foundfair.de and contact us in case you need help getting settled.

~~~
alexro
"Upload pitch" isn't working for me in Chrome. I think you can benefit by
simply providing a link on top of page for the start-ups to apply.

------
andreasklinger
What's the international position on this? I am living/working in the UK
startup scene and it seems to me Berlin could become europe early stage garage
very soon. Personally i believe London might be still the place to be after
P/M Fit (the place to be in europe…)

What's the US take on this ? Do people actually care outside of the german
speaking areas and maybe Uk?

~~~
bpyne
I'm a US citizen. My take is that if I was still single and not a parent, I
would be in Berlin immediately. In some ways, it sounds better than Silicon
Valley or New York. Transportation around SV doesn't sound like it's based on
public transportation and housing prices are crazy. New York has great public
transportation, especially with the addition of water taxies on the East
River, but housing is out of control.

Learning German, if you're a native English speaker, is easy. Simple sentences
in German can often sound like an oddly accented English. German is highly
consistent, i.e. not a lot of exceptions to grammatical rules. You just have
to get used to word order being different in some instances, e.g. verbs can
appear at the end of sentence, and case endings. (Case endings are no big
deal. Getting them wrong doesn't prevent the person listening from
understanding you. Getting them right is the difference between a great
speaker and a good one.) My experience in Germany around 1989 was that native
Germans were more than happy to switch to English when I was stumped about how
to say something in German. Learning the German language should not be a
barrier.

For anyone thinking far enough ahead about being a parent, situating in
Germany has other benefits. Germany has a better health care system and better
public education. They are large costs/worries for any parent.

~~~
yummyfajitas
By the numbers, Germany's public education system is basically identical to
that of the US (scoring 525 and 524, respectively).

[http://super-economy.blogspot.com/2010/12/amazing-truth-
abou...](http://super-economy.blogspot.com/2010/12/amazing-truth-about-pisa-
scores-usa.html)

What makes you believe it's education system is better? Or it's health care
system, for that matter?

~~~
neilk
Your source fiddled with the PISA numbers for the USA to exclude all students
of non-European descent. I'm not sure what s/he was trying to prove.

This post breaks results down by income segment and suggests that if you
exclude poverty, the USA does indeed do great. Otherwise the USA as a whole is
no better than average, maybe a little below average.

<http://www.schoolfunding.info/news/policy/2011-01PISA.php3>

I have to say this agrees with my anecdotal experience of the USA. If you went
to high school in Palo Alto, you might be having enriching experiences that
even students in rich European countries can only dream about. Or you could be
like the students some friends of mine tutored in North Carolina, who were not
aware of what the Duke University buildings in their city were _for_.

I'm not actually knocking the USA. It faces social challenges that no other
country faces, and often gets a bad rap from critics who've never even visited
and think it's populated by sociopathic Randroids. But it is a country of
enormous contrasts.

~~~
yummyfajitas
_Your source fiddled with the PISA numbers for the USA to exclude all students
of non-European descent. I'm not sure what s/he was trying to prove._

It's trying to prove that US schools are just as good at educating European
Americans as German schools are at educating Europeans. (Sanandaji also
excluded immigrants from the German numbers.)

I.e., any gaps in output between US and German schools are caused by gaps in
the input, not the school system itself.

~~~
neilk
How are native Americans and African-Americans immigrants?

I said I wasn't sure what the author was trying to prove, but I do have a
rather good guess.

~~~
yummyfajitas
_(Sanandaji also excluded immigrants from the_ German _numbers.)_

------
kori23
It all sounds interesting and I've been meaning to drop my corporate job for
some time now. So is there a Berlin startup news site (preferably in English)
so I could get a feel what kind of startups are there?

EDIT: <http://siliconallee.com/> seems to be the thing I was looing for,
anything else?

~~~
NicoleSimon
You need to drop your corporate thinking first. I suggest you get into some
projects to figure out if you are able to work in and with a startup. Note
that I am saying that with a background of 15 years in corporate. ;)

Most of the startups are actually very busy doing stuff (as in they don't are
yet at the point understanding what proper Communcation means _sigh_ ), but
<http://hascore.com/> has a good list of links.

I will be posting an overview posting asap with additional links.

------
kayoone
Main reasons for Berlin are its young and creative culture, affordable prices
(rents, food etc) and overall great quality of live. The city itself is not
the prettiest though, but it has its charme :)

Ive been there a few times at pitch/startups events and always liked the
locations and overall vibe.

~~~
adambyrtek
The modern architecture in Berlin is really astounding. The city also has a
lot of parks and green areas, which make it a pleasant place to live in. Not
to mention perfect public transportation.

------
alexro
In the UK there is no consent among the investors where the action should go.
I was quite surprised to learn than basically every credible accelerator has
it's own view of where my start-up should be based.

Oxygen - Birmingham

Ignite100 - New Castle

Seedcamp - London

I get their desire to improve local culture but hey this is just ridiculous to
ask me to settle somewhere because you gave me some money. Also, start-ups
thrive in a tech-savvy areas only.

This all adds to the problem and Berlin has all the odds to become the answer.

~~~
sim0n
Almost all accelerators do this. YC strongly encourages you to live in the
Valley.

~~~
alexro
There is a difference when YC wants you to live in SV for YOUR success and
other accelerators wanting you to live somewhere for THEIR benefit, right?

------
24pfilms
Wow, timing is everything. I had booked my ticket 2 days ago for Berlin. I am
finishing up my time at StartupChile and heading to Berlin after being
convinced by many at SUP, that Berlin has many things happening. I needed a
high quality affordable city, that was startup friendly and supported my
photography addiction. Berlin hopefully will allow me the time to focus and
finish my two iOS games.

~~~
IanOzsvald
I'm also finishing StartupChile and 24pfilms is flat-sharing with us in Buenos
Aires right now. We're returning to London for a while but Berlin is still on
our list (nowhere else in Europe is on our list).

------
oceanician
I would love to buy one of the 10,000 sq metre mills 5 mins taxi from
Manchester's central Picadilly train station and turn it into startup
accomodation. We're only 2 hours from London's Euston!! (So less than 3 hours
from Shorditch)

Berlin however does seem to have the greatest multicultural vibe going for it
for startups. It's pretty impressive, and I hope to sample it later in the
year :)

------
_ex_
How is life for non white people? I'm from latin-america.

~~~
lacosaes0
It's really hard at least in Berlin.

~~~
_ex_
why it's hard?

------
sbouafif
Any city has its pros and cons. I am currently an intern in a tech start-up in
Paris, the city has many co-working spaces / incubators. The start-up scene is
bigger every day, and yes you won't speak french 70% of the day.

Anyway just saying the document seems to be a nice post card from Berlin but
the same things are happening everywhere.

Last year it was Paris (Wired.com):
<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rt2bHumqDFs>

------
cageface
I enjoyed the time I spent in Berlin last year and I've considered going back
there but this seems imprudent with the Euro on the verge of implosion.

~~~
hastur
That's funny. ;)

Some Euro countries (Greece) might be on the verge of implosion, but there's
no way the general currency could suffer any significant damage and Germany is
the very reason for that.

The German economy is among the most powerful in the world and quite frankly
you're more likely to experience an economic collapse in the US than in
Germany. (Albeit that's pretty unlikely too, obviously. At least for now.)

~~~
danmaz74
The real risk is that a contagion effect could bring about the split up of the
Eurozone, and in that case a new Deutsche Mark would make German export much
less competitive (and Berlin much less cheap). It's not likely, but it's still
a big risk.

~~~
hastur
There's no chance of the Euro zone falling apart. The worst thing that could
happen is Greece exiting the Euro zone.

~~~
TillE
Seriously, Greece is a small and fairly unimportant part of the European
economy.

The Euro collapsing is an apocalyptic scenario that requires quite a lot of
things to go wrong. Much more than just Greece.

~~~
danmaz74
I agree that it would be an apocalyptic scenario and would require a lot of
things to go wrong. But if every eurozone member only thinks about its
immediate interests instead of working together and acting in a decisive
manner, everything could really go wrong.

------
radiospaetkauf
Here's a shameless plug: Listen to the Radio Spaetkauf podcast if you want
insights into life in Berlin from an international perspective.
<http://www.radiospaetkauf.com>

------
yctechmgr
Don't mean to threadjack, but I'd love to team up in Berlin with a biz
cofounder. If you're looking for an early employee or technical cofounder,
please email me: yctechmgr at gmail.com - tell me something about your
startup.

~~~
NicoleSimon
We forward the "looking for co founder" from the Berlin startup group to the
Jobs group:

'Berlin Startup Jobs' <https://www.facebook.com/groups/395011077224173/>

------
kmfrk
Does anyone know how the start-up scene in Berlin compares to that in Paris?
They seem to be two of the biggest contenders for the SV of Europe.

I think Spain tried something similar with Barcelona that ended up fizzing
out.

------
NicoleSimon
One of the things we still need to work on in Berlinis connecting people
better. ;)

So some notes and links.

* Introductory notes

* Entry points / sites

* Finding out about events

* Getting a job

* Got links? Please provide

 __________________ INTRODUCTORY NOTES __________________

Per se there are two different circles of startup folk in Germany. The german
/ Germany oriented ones, what I usually call "the victims of the language
island" (everything in Germany is dubbed - movies, tv, books).

The second, more interesting level is the international mindset, the people
who are mentally oriented toward silicon valley. Both group usually do not
mingle and the following applies for that second group and explain part of the
reason why Berlin is special.

This group has accepted english as their lingua franca and people come from
all over the world, enjoying not only the benefits listed in the other
comments, but the feeling of "being able to make it here". The absence of any
enterprise like structure due to the past with the wall enables in many ways
what Berlin is today.

There is of course an echo chamber effect for this group and once you connect,
you run into the usual startups very quickly. ;)

 __________________ ENTRY POINTS __________________

Your Nr 1. starting point for meeting people ;) English speaking Berlin
startup group on Facebook with ~2400 members.

<https://www.facebook.com/groups/159595270791268/>

Follow that if you are interested in meeting people and or asking questions.
Hint: Do not try to post stuff which is does not have the "Berlin and startup"
relevant connection and do not try to sneak in a "but in theory this is about
startups ...", I will delete the post and ban you permanently.

Looking for a job / employee / co founder does belong into the sister group
(<https://www.facebook.com/groups/395011077224173/>)

__

General sites to read:

<http://venturevillage.eu/>

<http://siliconallee.com/>

<http://www.techberlin.com/>

__

We also have a strong women in tech movement in Berlin:

<http://berlingeekettes.com/> is both interview site and meetup; I run
<http://girlgeekdinner.de/> which will happen more frequently once I am
relocated. ;)

__

Find a Co-Working spaces:

<https://www.deskwanted.com/berlin.html>

[http://www.berlin-partner.de/?id=1243&L=1](http://www.berlin-
partner.de/?id=1243&L=1) is the official place from Berlin

to help people coming to Berlin, they are very helpful too with business needs

with a special attention to startups.

 __________________ EVENTS __________________

Event listings as in "is there something happening ..."

<http://berlinwebweek.de/>

Get the weekly Newsletter with new events:

<http://startupdigest.com/berlin/>

Berlin tech user groups links:

<http://co-up.de/2011/10/14/usergroup-list.html>

Monthly radio show about Berlin Startups

<http://fridayat6.de/>

Not very active but still: Berlin StartUp Employees

<https://www.facebook.com/groups/238420286238628/>

Meetup.com has tons of groups and meetups beyond startup land

<http://www.meetup.com> and then go Berlin

 __________________ GETTING A JOB __________________

If you are looking for a job in Berlin, are a Berlin based startup looking for
employees or for a co founder, this facebook group can be helful for you

<https://www.facebook.com/groups/395011077224173/>

__

Job boards with a special focus on Berlin startups:

<http://berlinstartupjobs.com/>

<http://venturevillage.eu/jobs/>

<http://siliconallee.com/madeinberlin> (this is a list of some startups made
in berlin + links to job pages if available.)

<http://meetfounder.com/> (if you are looking for a co-founder)

__

Finding companies to work for

<http://hascore.com/> limits itself to "Hascore is a job board focused on
Product Development for the Berlin Startup Scene that provides relevant
context for making better decisions" BUT because the way they list their jobs
you can surf through it and find the links to lots of companies.

__

Listings mostly in German

<http://jobslike.me/>

<http://www.gruenderszene.de/jobboerse/>

[https://www.xing.com/net/pridec7dbx/startup-
berlin/jobangebo...](https://www.xing.com/net/pridec7dbx/startup-
berlin/jobangebote-580691/)

 __________________ Any additions? __________________

Happy to take that into the list

Also I am always looking for people to add to my

"English tweeting people from Berlin with startup affinity"

<https://twitter.com/#!/nicolesimon/berlin-internationals>

hth

Nicole

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jdsemrau
Berlin is amazing; lived there for a year.

Plus records produces in Berlin include: U2 (Achtung Baby), David Bowie
(Low,Heroes, and Lodger) , and Depeche Mode (Construction Time Again).

------
purzelrakete
feel free to drop me a mail if you want to know anything about working at
soundcloud. i'm an engineer. rany@soundcloud.com

------
JVIDEL
This seems interesting, but I have one question: what about taxes?

Any tax breaks for tech startups? what about employee/healthcare costs?

~~~
pmoehring
Almost no tax breaks for startups, and healthcare and employee taxes are
regulated very closely to normal German laws. Shockingly, recently the govt
seems to have decided that angel investors and even founders will not be
eligible for certain tax breaks, and instead will be taxed on income tax level
for capital gains.

~~~
JVIDEL
And what level of taxation are we talking about?

------
urgeio
Top 5 reasons why you should move to Berlin, now:

1\. Lowest livings costs with highest quality of living. Stay in gorgeous,
perfectly renovated apartments in pre-WWII residential buildings with high
ceilings, right in the middle of the center and pay a fraction of costs of any
other capital (even cheaper than any Eastern European capital). No need for a
car—Berlin has one of the densest subway nets and wide streets make biking
fun. In addition, Germany has an amazing social health care system including
health, unemployment and pension (when working as an employee).

2\. A vibrant and fast growing ecosystem of smart people. A vast number of new
software talents, founders, software companies and VCs are moving to Berlin,
every day (Twitter, Google, Soundcloud, Early Bird and many more).

3\. People here are open-minded, outgoing, mix well and international—no need
to learn German, everyone speaks English! Making new friends is a matter of
days. Visit tons of networking and startup events, every week.

4\. Easy work permissions—Europeans do not need any and can work from day one
and the rest applies for the hassle-free Blue Card.

5\. Berlin's night life is unmatched, huge and changing every day (plus
ridiculously cheap). Berlin has got some of the most dazzling, naughty, and
original clubs on the face of the Earth.

Now, the shameless plug: Berlin is calling and getting the new tech hub of
Europe. If you are passionate about building great software, we’d love to talk
with you. If you don't live in Berlin yet, we could help to fix that.

=> <http://urge.io/jobs>

~~~
its_so_on
genuine question: if it's so great and the capital of a rich country, why is
it so cheap? (e.g. what you mentioned about apartments in the city center.)

~~~
spaghetti
Anyone spent a winter in Berlin? It's incredibly cold. Traveling around the
city on bicycle, train etc is great during the pleasant summer months but it's
literally painful during the winter.

~~~
graue
Judging by WeatherSpark's history and averages for Berlin, the winter temps
basically hover around freezing at worst, while summers are very mild. That's
a strictly better climate than New York, which has comparable winters, but
hot, humid summers.

I live in a city that gets much colder than that in the winters, but still has
plenty of bicyclists year round. It's all a matter of perspective.

