
Ask HN: How does a junior engineer plan for a managment position? - Raed667
This is my last semester as a software engineering student.<p>And even though I love coding (and I&#x27;m not planning to ever stop writing code), I always saw myself more in a role of &quot;management of some-sort&quot; where I could have more influence on how projects are done, technical choices, policy, technical-design and long-term objectives.<p>My point is, on the long-run, that I don&#x27;t see myself as &quot;just&quot; a coder.<p>My school offers a master&#x27;s degree called &quot;Management and project innovation&quot;, I&#x27;ve also heard good feedback from people that are doing an MBA elsewhere.<p>Do you think that this kind of career-objective should be achieved via school, or do you think that this comes naturally with seniority?
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sudheshk
Having the ambition to be a manager is great, however I'll advise that you
first focus on building some functional expertise (engineering in your case).
Great managers command respect of their team by showing that they understand
what their team is doing, asking right questions and hiring great people. How
will you develop all these without having some functional experience yourself?
I think you should start as an engineer and develop management skills on the
job, through mentorship, reading, taking initiatives etc. (and if needed,
pursuing MBA later). Feel free to reach out if you want to talk more 1:1.

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Jemaclus
Great question, and it's good that you're thinking about your career
trajectory.

School is generally thought to be a fast-track to experience. That is, a
degree translates to N years of experience in the real world. In reality (at
least according to my experience), the MBA degree is merely a ticket to an
interview. If you got your MBA in Management and Project Innovation, you might
have a leg up on non-MBA holders, but you'll still wind up with a bit of
trial-by-fire, since you don't have a lot of real world experience. Plus, grad
school can be expensive.

Another route would be to go straight into the workforce and do some real-
world software engineering. You'll find out really fast whether the coding-to-
decision ratio is good enough for you, or whether you really want to move up
into management. As others will tell you, management is a whole different
animal. For most technically minded people like software engineers, they
usually only want to make technical decisions. Managers, on the other hand,
have to think about a lot more, especially on the business and people side of
things.

Find a mentor and learn as much as you can. At first, this should merely be a
lead engineer. They'll have experience making decisions AND the technical
chops to back it up. If you reach the position of Lead Engineer and you still
want to get into management, find another mentor. (Hint: mentors are a
fantastic way to move up in organizations and learn a lot in the process).

And above all, don't rush into anything. You have your whole career ahead of
you. Enjoy it as much as you can.

Good luck.

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Raed667
Thank you very much for this detailed answer.

Would you care to explain for me a little further the concept of mentorship
especially in a context of a big corporations?

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Jemaclus
At some point, you go to a senior person and you say to them, "I've been here
X [months/years], and I feel like I've learned a lot. Someday I think I could
see myself doing what you do. If my career goal is to have your job in 2
years, what do you think I should do?" Hopefully, this person is receptive and
will give you advice. Meet with them periodically and check in. If you do
well, they'll want to train you as their replacement when they inevitably
leave or get promoted out of that position.

Repeat ad nauseum.

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cscharenberg
Highly recommend you do some reading on Quora. There are many similar
questions, and asking there is likely to get a good set of answers to add to
anything here.

Realize also that many engineers are disdainful of managers and management, so
take any feedback you get with a grain of salt. Explicitly aiming to become a
manager will get a bad reaction from people.

That said, managing people and process is a real set of skills at which people
can be good or bad. You can practice and improve these skills like any others.
There are plenty of people who are managers who are poor at it, but that's no
different than any other job. And no, experience itself won't grow you the way
you want. Adding side training will be essential, whether it is individual
courses, Udemy and similar coursework, reading, or full degree programs.

I think an Master's in this "Management and Project Innovation" would be
valuable. My path was realizing after about 7 years of software work that I
really enjoy the larger activities of businesses even moreso than the software
development, so I got an Executive MBA. That gave me some negotiation power to
finally slot into a leadership role. It also rewired my brain and vastly
expanded my knowledge of leadership and of understanding business concerns to
be effective. It really revolutionized my whole way of thinking about the
world and made me a better person in my personal and professional lives.

So my take would be: if your passion is in _orchestrating_ projects, do
consider that MBA and angling for a Project Manageer role as well. But you
should also get a year or several of software development so you learn the
realities of people working on software projects. I think practical experience
is important to stay grounded when you get with with management theories and
practices. Without real-world experience anchoring you, it can turn you into a
Pointy-Haired Boss personality.

If you already think that is going to be an interest to you, I encourage you
to go work 2+ years as a software engineer, then start a Master's degree
concurrently after you have some experience.

Email me if you want to talk in more detail.

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kaworu1986
Hello

I am in a similar position (7 years of development and getting bored of having
no say in what gets build) and wanted to ask a couple of questions.

\- Is an MBA essential for the transition?

\- Does college name matter when doing an MBA for this purpose?

\- Do you get to recoup the cost of the degree?

\- Did you change employer to make the transition into project manager?

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teamcobby
It really depends on the size of the company you are seeking for. I have
worked in start-ups and one of the largest financial institution.

For start-ups: As long as you are good, you will have a say in most of the
area you mentioned (maybe not policy and long term objectives)

For sizeable company:

How projects are done - as development manager, you will be one of the many
stakeholder in the project. Instead of thinking you will be dictating how a
project is done, your role will more likely in leading some sort of committee
where decisions are agreed upon by all the stakeholders.

Technical choices - the architecture team is responsible for deciding on the
technology choices.

Policy - policy change is usually driven by internal, external audit. You will
be assigned to take care of the aftermath of the audits depending on your area
of expertise.

Technical design - manager usually don't have the technical know-how on the
technical design

Long term objectives - these are coming from the investor level by setting ROI
target for CEO to meet. It will subsequently trickle down to every level in
the organization.

It sounds like you have a romantic notion of what a managerial role entails.
In this day and age, management are usually the ones getting slashed. The
smarter ones usually stay in senior technical roles because the compensation
in the managerial role doesn't justify the risk and the time involved.

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denshadeds
I've been a professional developer for 10 years. Maybe you plan on being more
of an analyst. Managers usually are pushed away from technical decisions.
Don't try to become a manager too soon. Nobody wants a manager that is 10
years younger than the technical staff.

Want to grow quickly? Learn the ropes in big companies for big money, use
small startup companies to grow into new functions. Don't stick with the same
job too long.

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Raed667
What's the difference between an analyst and a manager?

> Learn the ropes in big companies for big money

I think I'm going to do my graduation project in something like that. Should I
push for a contract there after (as a first job)?

> Don't stick with the same job too long

How long is too long ?

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denshadeds
By analyst I mean this:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Systems_analyst](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Systems_analyst)
> Should I push for a contract there after Try to surround yourself with the
best developers and managers out there. Learn their tricks and tales. > Don't
stick with the same job too long I've once spent 2 years at a job learning
nothing, accomplishing nothing and getting insulted on a daily basis. Don't
stick longer than 5 minutes in such a place. As a rule I try to stick 4-5
years. Unless of course I get grossly disrespected or something way more
beautiful comes along.

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cdnsteve
Consider a lead, team lead or architecture based role. If you want control of
technical desicions, a regular management position won't give you what you are
seeking.

Also pay attention to politics. That becomes on of the main items to master
while looking at management, even though places deny this, it exists
everywhere.

