
Fedora 25 to Run Wayland by Default - XzetaU8
https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Fedora-25-Wayland-Default
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prodigal_erik
Does this mean remoting is available? I can't find anything recent and
definitive, but the FAQ still says no. I've never understood how Wayland can
even be considered usable without it. "The user owns exactly one computer"
hasn't been true for a decade or more.

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AnonymousPlanet
I used to think the same way regarding Wayland. But then I realized the
abysmal state of X11 remoting: most applications I would like to use remotely
are basically sending images over the network, instead of just API calls. Try
using Firefox over X11 forwarding. I think some battles have been lost in this
regard.

The creators of Wayland decided that it is not their task to handle remoting.
You could argue that this demphasizes the issue, leaving it to insufficient
VNC, dead projects like NX, or not yet production ready projects like X2Go
(once they support Wayland that is).

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prodigal_erik
> The creators of Wayland decided that it is not their task to handle
> remoting.

That seems to be their decision but I can't imagine what's motivating them.
How is the non-remote use case even relevant at this point? Is Wayland
intended for console gaming?

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SwellJoe
I just got a 4k laptop, but my monitor is 1080p, so I'm excited about Wayland
getting better faster (it's the only good way I know of to have different
scaling across displays). I'm still finding all sorts of weird quirks in Linux
with 4k...but, I'm also still finding quirks in lots of Windows software, too
(games and music software, in particular, are prone to using their own UI
toolkits and end up looking ridiculous because of it). So, I can't blame Linux
for all of those problems; it's just a tricky problem, I guess.

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CJefferson
This is one thing that Mac seems to have gotten perfect nowadays, I connect my
retina laptop to non-retina monitors, and every seems to work fine, all the
time.

Apple made one massive simplification -- apps only run at 1x size, or 2x size,
and nothing else. This isn't theoretically "nice", but (for me) covers most
use cases, and seems to have made the implementation much easier, as you can
still design your interface pixel-wise, and just let the OS double scale
everything.

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jakehilborn
OSX's scaling system is actually more flexible than just 1x and 2x. I often
run my 4K monitor at the effective 1440p resolution. Applications such as
Retina Display Manager let you choose between many more scaling sizes than the
standard system settings.

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anonova
OS X can only scale by powers of 2. If your monitor runs at native 4K
(3840x2160), scaling ~1.28x renders to 6016x3384 and scales down by 2x to
3008x1692. Your example is at 1.5x (2560x1440), which renders to 5120x2880 and
scales down by 2x to 2650x1440. The most efficient scale is 2x (1920x1080)
because that can be rendered natively. So while you can have arbitrary
effective resolutions, it's rather wasteful to render and can have serious
performance implications when you're not using native or powers of 2.

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mixmastamyk
Great, this is an important milestone we've been waiting years for. No doubt
there will be lots of problems, but that's the first step in getting them
fixed.

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oDot
What about Redshift on Wayland :(?

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srslack
Needs to be implemented in each compositor, like most other missing details on
Wayland.

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vertex-four
Actually... Wayland fully supports transparent windows assuming you have a
buffer with alpha transparency, and windows have no decoration by default. It
would take a very small protocol extension to allow overlay windows which
don't accept input of their own, allowing for Redshift (and other tinting
tools, such as those for dyslexia) to implement such an extension without
embedding it into a compositor.

Wayland has a process for standardising extensions - write the XML file
defining it and send an email to the mailing list, then respond to questions -
if developers cared about Wayland, they could do it.

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sunnyps
Redshift (or flux) doesn't work that way. It adjusts the monitor's color
temperature using XRandR.

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vertex-four
Alright, though my latter point stands - standardising an extension for
setting colour temperature would not be terribly difficult. You could look to
libcoopgamma for ideas on managing multiple clients trying to change things at
once, or write a simpler protocol that only allows one client to change
things. At the very least, an unstable protocol definition and a patch for
Weston would be a lot more than what we have now, and doesn't require Redshift
to be cloned for each Wayland server.

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nickysielicki
FreeBSD is making progress on this, too:
[https://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-
current/2016-Aug...](https://lists.freebsd.org/pipermail/freebsd-
current/2016-August/063017.html)

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xorcist
Misleading title. The decision here is to leave Wayland on but it can still
get pulled later if it is deemed to not work well enough.

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rvern
This is correct and the comment should not have been downvoted. (The article
is wrong.) This is essentially just about allowing Wayland to remain the
default during alpha, but it can very well be removed as default later on.

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dczmer
i'll believe it when i see it

