
Lyft says its revenue is growing nearly 3x faster than Uber’s - fstuff
https://techcrunch.com/2018/03/12/lyft-says-its-revenue-is-growing-nearly-3x-faster-than-ubers/
======
Lukeas14
Sounds nice from a PR standpoint but you can't really compare the two
companies based on revenue growth. Lyft is still a smaller company so in a
global industry it's much easier for it to grow faster on a percentage basis.
They're still expanding to cities where Uber already exists. If you started a
rideshare company and gave 11 rides this month you'd be growing 10x faster
than Lyft.

~~~
juicy-fruit
I agree. They just recently entered Canada (and it seems only one province),
so of course they are going to have bigger revenue growth than Uber as they
enter new markets.

A stretch: is Lyft going to use these metrics to go public before Uber to hype
itself up?

~~~
zukzuk
Incidentally, my experience with Lyft here in Canada has been pretty dismal.
On average pretty terrible drivers. I have a feeling Lyft is getting all the
Uber rejects. If that's the case, this is going to derail Lyft's Canadian
debut pretty badly. I wonder if this is a common problem when they come into
an Uber-dominated market.

~~~
hn_throwaway_99
I've seen these anecdotes one way or the other (pro/anti Uber/Lyft/whatever)
and I think they're all pretty useless when trying to extrapolate to the
broader population. One thing that is abundantly clear, at least in the US
city where I live, is that Uber and Lyft are pushing hard for the same pool of
drivers; many drivers drive for multiple ride share services. I'm extremely
skeptical of "one company's drivers are better" stories given they're all
largely the same drivers.

~~~
manigandham
Agreed, every driver I’ve asked is on both apps and switches freely to make
money.

They might stick with one for a bit to get certain bonuses but there’s no long
term loyalty for any of them.

~~~
ccozan
So we need a car sharing aggregator app now? How do I know which is cheaper,
Lyft or Uber, when I ask for a ride?

~~~
arthurofbabylon
You can try Apple's Maps app. (Does Google Maps have it to?) There is a 'ride-
share' choice (or some similar terminology) when choosing route methods, and
selecting it presents both Uber and Lyft (if you have the apps installed) and
side-by-side price comparisons with the ability to book right there. It should
be noted that integration with the Maps app is handled by Lyft and Uber
themselves - they can choose what values to present to the user.

~~~
kakaorka
Google Maps absolutely has this as well.

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ravenstine
I remember when Uber was clearly dominant. That was over a year go. For the
past two conferences I've been to, including the one I'm at now(Ember Conf),
EVERYONE has been using Lyft.

It really is possible for a company to piss off enough people.

~~~
121789
Anecdotally I haven't found this HN-wide negative sentiment of Uber (and
narrative of its decline) to be shared anywhere else in the US.

My extended family in the southeast and northeast US is familiar with Uber
(without using it), but they haven't heard of Lyft. When I lived in Chicago,
most of my peers had Lyft, but Uber was the always the first choice.

Does anyone else see the same trend? The bay area certainly seems to be Lyft-
dominant, but I haven't seen that anywhere else.

~~~
ferongr
True. Here in Europe in general, Lyft is uknown, but, at least here in Greece,
everyone sings the praises of Uber, in comparison to the terrible service
normal taxis provide.

HN is not only a regional but also an ideological bubble, and it seems to hate
companies that are doing well for themselves (except Apple and Musk-affiliated
gigs).

~~~
rtpg
Why do you think HN hates companies that are doing well for themselves?

Doing this is way more exhausting than cheering them on (see SpaceX, people
have fun in those posts). "Oh this company is doing well and I'm jealous"?
Seriously don't know how that's enough.

There's a slightly less nefarious interpretation which is that people have
different values, and disagreement happens.

So many people are extremely happy to see other people's success here, for
example Lyft here. But what you might think is unimportant virtue signalling
is something other people actually care about, sometimes deeply

~~~
johnfn
Are you sure about your first assertion? It is well known that HN is
gratuitously negative about everything. SpaceX is the exception, rather than
the rule - and you'd be hard pressed to find another company with quite such a
positive reputation on HN.

~~~
ethbro
I attribute SpaceX and Tesla love to the "ask a kindergartner what they want
to be" phenomenon.

Everyone, regardless of field, can relate to rockets and cars.

Far fewer people would relate to, say, optimizing insurance benefit payments.

~~~
jschwartzi
It's deeper than that. People here like Tesla because it's forcing other car
makers to build decent electric cars. That's something that needs to happen if
we're going to move away from fossil fuel dependence.

SpaceX is cool because there's a really good chance they'll be more successful
at missions to the moon and Mars than NASA has been recently. They're both
forward-thinking companies.

~~~
ethbro
My point being there are thousands of companies doing interesting and "good"
things. But Tesla and SpaceX definitely seem to get _more_ of a positive
reaction than the others.

Not saying they aren't doing good things. But they get more credit than the
good things they're doing would merit. And probably more than even effective
PR can explain.

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ipsum2
> Lyft provided this stat shot, which also includes some highlight numbers on
> its performance thus far in 2018.

Where's the data for this?

> with a particularly strong Q4 during which its revenue outpaced Uber’s by
> 2.75x

How much revenue did Lyft pull in? Or Uber? This article isn't very good.

~~~
hcnews
+1, was looking for these comparisons. Very vague article.

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TallGuyShort
Agree with all the comments here about how the actual statistic here shouldn't
lead one to the conclusion that it may on the surface. But... Every time I've
visited a big city of the last few years, "Uber" has been the verb for just
grabbing a ride-share. My last 2 visits to a big city over the law few months,
"Lyft" has been the go-to that people talk about. I'm pretty sure the tide is
shifting in Lyft's favor, this specific statistic and its flaws aside.

~~~
LethargicStud
This is very anecdotal. I really wish we had data on market share, costs,
revenues, etc. Obviously we won't have even most of the picture until both
companies are public, but at this point it seems like all of these articles
are just speculation. When I interned at Uber, media estimates were pretty
inaccurate.

~~~
sbarre
> When I interned at Uber, media estimates were pretty inaccurate

How confident were you in the accuracy of the internal numbers being shared?
;-)

Devil's advocate question for sure, but I've been at companies where real
numbers of all kinds were casually inflated internally during communications
for morale (or just to flatter management's ego)..

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whoisjuan
Well of course. What a dumb title. Lyft is smaller than Uber (drivers, user
base, and operating markets). They have more room to accelerate their revenues
because every time they add a market it has a larger impact on their added
revenue. The title is just stupid because I can buy a cab tomorrow and also
claim that my revenue is growing faster than Uber.

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lathiat
If you're in the US it's easy to forget that Uber is very world-wide and as a
frequent traveller I use it nearly everywhere I go. Lyft is mostly US-only
right now.

It's much nicer and easier to get an Uber at most airports and know you're not
getting screwed, communicate your destination easily when you don't speak the
same language and know that they take payment by card -- rather than arriving
at the destination, having already asked if they take card payment, they said
yes, then suddenly they don't.

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m3kw9
Achieving 3x is easy when your revenue was lower to begin with.

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rhino369
I've had difficulty getting Lyft's in DC. They may have to increase prices to
encourage more drivers to fill demand.

~~~
hawaiianbrah
Where and when in DC? I haven’t had a problem in the least, around DuPont,
admo, or even SE, never bothered checking Uber prices/availability.

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neom
My gut says Juno is dark horsing and about to make a splash. I have no proof
for this outside of my gut, but the way they are laying up reminds me of early
day uber. My main point of reference for this feeling is the drivers, if I get
a lyft driver with 4.9 or 5.0 rating, they inevitably try to push Juno during
the ride, however the value prop to the rider is somewhat compelling: the
drivers are compensated to a higher degree (lower fee) however, the must
maintain a 4.9 on other apps, and an equivalent on their app, consequently,
the caliber of chauffeur on Juno is quite high.

~~~
OiNG
the last i heard of juno, they were acquired and drivers were upset about
being screwed over in the deal (their RSUs were almost worthless). Just
googled around and couldn't find any updates, do you know what happened? Are
they seen as driver friendly again?

~~~
neom
I mean I'm seriously not shitting you when I say every single rider I've
gotten on lyft in the last few months who have a 4.9 or above and genuinely
provided great service (one dude still had candy/water!) has pushed Juno on
me. I asked the lady I had yesterday why she isn't using Juno and she said she
wants to, they treat the drivers well, she just can't get an interview to be
accepted as a driver till.. uh... April?! I was pretty surprised.

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AlexandrB
I'm not sure what's impressive about growing revenue in an industry that has
no obvious economies of scale. This seems like a case of "sure we lose money
on every ride, but we'll make it up with volume!"

Looking at it another way, given a huge funding pool (say $10B) a modestly
competent company could outpace both Uber and Lyft in revenue growth by the
end of the year simply by subsidizing rides even _more_. The initial
skepticism towards ride sharing services is gone and there's little keeping
customers and drivers loyal to either Uber _or_ Lyft.

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vit05
UBER has already cemented a path around the world. He is facing legal battles
in an attempt to demonstrate that his business is legitimate and beneficial to
society. All others will have the facilities to travel in this vacuum.

But it will reach a point where the dispute will not be with the old business
models related to mobility. And at this point, it will make sense to compare
these companies. But at the moment it makes no sense to compare revenue.

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meuk
Nitpicking: Does "3x faster" mean at 300%, or at 400%? I would say 300%, but
when you say 50% faster I would interpret it as 150%.

It is a expression with no clearly defined meaning, and really shouldn't be
used.

~~~
sebleon
> Does "3x faster" mean at 300%, or at 400%?

It's 300%. If company A is growing 10% every month, and company B is growing
30% a month, people would call B's growth 3x faster (30/10=3).

~~~
meuk
I understand, but the expression is nonsense.

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dominotw
I can improve my running speed 3x than Usain Bolt in next week if I want to.

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avar
[xkcd: Fastest-Growing]: [https://xkcd.com/1102/](https://xkcd.com/1102/)

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zitterbewegung
Who cares ? Is it profitable or not ?

~~~
sokoloff
That doesn't matter right now. It eventually matters, but when you're in a new
category and fighting for marketshare and brand awareness, it's fine to invest
in the form of losing money today. Nearly every company more complicated than
"selling hours of labor" goes through such a phase.

(No doubt that some companies take it much too far, but profits are not
critical in this stage of any online/mobile ride-hailing company.)

------
banned1
I launched my new app last week, calculated the growth rate this week and I am
growing INFINITY week over week yoohoo!

~~~
TomK32
Is INFINITY the new MOON?

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exabrial
After I rode in an Uber with a self-proclaimed rapist driver, and Uber's
response was "we'll consider limiting his access to uber", I uninstalled.
Fortunately, the police took the case a little more seriously than Uber did.

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chiefalchemist
Pardon the micro-rant, but this is yet another great example of fake news.
It's everywhere.

Factually accurate, but none the less closer to bias / propaganda than truth.
Unnecessary and inappropriate.

Techcrunch (and all others who choose to deny their journalistic
responsibilities) should be embarrassed for being so willing to publish such
click bait-y headlines.

Perhaps greed isn't so good after all?

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heisnotanalien
Uber could (and eventually will destroy) Lyft in one fell swoop. They're just
holding back to appease the government atm.

~~~
bildung
_> They're just holding back to appease the government atm._

Perhaps Uber should first try to get profitable.

