
Drawing as a programmer - cinskiy
http://gameofworlds.tumblr.com/post/76836176462/drawing-as-a-programmer
======
egypturnash
Professional cartoonist here.

If you want to move on to the next step of drawing whatever the hell you want
to out of your head, in any angle, I strongly recommend you go to
[http://johnkcurriculum.blogspot.com/2009/12/preston-blair-
le...](http://johnkcurriculum.blogspot.com/2009/12/preston-blair-lessons-
fundamentals-of.html), get the Preston Blair book, and start doing these
exercises. You will get a lot better, a lot faster.

You can build on the simple cartoon characters in these lessons and do super
realistic stuff, or you can keep on being a cartoonist. Whatever works for
you.

~~~
gk1
(Another professional cartoonist here.)

I strongly disagree with the suggestion of starting with cartoons first. Start
with real anatomy first.

Books that show step-by-step guides to drawing a comic character are only good
for one thing: Learning how to draw that comic character, in that position, in
that style, in that medium. I hate them. One may look at these books and think
that's how all cartoonists (or other artists) learned to draw, and they'd be
wrong.

To be a good cartoonist, in my view, you need a foundational _understanding_ ,
not just technique (which is what these books teach, in a very limited way).
Once you _understand_ anatomy, how bodies move, forms, perspective,
composition, visual weight, ... Then turning your ideas into a cartoon (or any
other form) becomes simply a matter of technique. (And even at that point,
learning techniques from step-by-step instruction books is a lousy method.)

~~~
bitexploder
For someone who just wants to doodle and play around, while still learning the
fundamentals, what resources would you recommend?

~~~
gk1
I received a formal art education, so my answer may be very biased, but I'd
recommend starting with a fundamental drawing class. If you're in NY or SF,
there's no shortage of them. If you're anywhere else, you may be able to find
one at a library, college, school, or artist organization.

But keep on doodling! Even mindless doodling improves your skills.

~~~
jes5199
I had the weird experience that fundamentals classes seemed to assume that I
had much, much more experience than I actually had as a beginner. Is there
some distinction between different "fundamentals" classes that people should
be looking for?

~~~
reeses
Artists love creating other artists. We all mostly remember the hundreds of
a-ha moments that changed our view of the world _again_. It's sad how eager
most of us are to share the knowledge. :)

Depending on where you are, you may do well to find a tiny studio with good
reviews on yelp or, if you're near a school, look for tutors.

In the mean time, definitely keep doodling but occasionally try to doodle
something you can see. Then laugh at it and shade a sphere or a cone. :)

This is one area where everyone has potential. You just need to develop it
with some basic tools, most of which involve ways of _seeing_.

------
martin-adams
I do believe that anyone can draw with enough time. In 2009 I took 8 days
holiday, one per week and dedicated it to drawing. I could see the improvement
vastly:

[http://eightweeksproject.wordpress.com/2008/03/25/projectone...](http://eightweeksproject.wordpress.com/2008/03/25/projectone-
weekeight/)

Then in 2010 my new years resolution was to do a sketch a day. Hard going but
very enjoyable:

[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NFWNlK2H29U](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NFWNlK2H29U)

[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lYtXlhVLYYE](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lYtXlhVLYYE)

[http://martinadams.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/l_640_480_937...](http://martinadams.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/l_640_480_937cc10c-5982-4acf-94eb-8837ce87083c.jpeg)

[http://martinadams.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/p_640_412_cb0...](http://martinadams.files.wordpress.com/2010/04/p_640_412_cb00f9bd-d6b1-4839-86be-1b23f91880bd.jpeg)

I didn't dedicate enough time to each sketch so only got a handful of good
drawings. I've fallen out of it again so would have to get right back to
basics, but it shouldn't take too long before you start to feel fluid again.

Being able to draw is like a muscle.

~~~
sireat
Nice progress! I do note that you are under 30, which means you can still make
progress. There is a famous forum post of someone starting some very basic
drawings and progressing onto higher skill level a few years later. He started
at 23 or 24.

What I am hoping to see is someone starting at a later age.

~~~
TheSOB888
Yes, you can still learn when you're older. Especially if you have an
inquisitive mind like most hackers. The brain doesn't "solidify" completely as
you age, it just solidifies the knowledge you already have. People have
learned languages past 30, just by immersion, which is a very complex task.

------
krick
I really don't like how much that book (and other books of the same author) is
promoted. I am into drawing for quite a long time already (and I also think it
helps me as a programmer etc.) and I've heard about that book like thousand
times, so I've finally read it. I understand why it's impressive: because
author delivers the material like "so, there are some techniques to use your
right side of the brain instead of the left one and woah… you see, you draw
much better now! It's magic! By the way, I have million students who couldn't
draw, but they took my courses and now they are master-artists and own their
own design saloons." And you probably actually will draw better than you
expect (especially when you don't expect you can draw) after some simple
guidance and a few tries.

What I'm saying it's very populistic, but explains many thing the wrong way,
which may cause some problems if you'll want to improve your techniques later.
If you are learning to draw I'd better recommend you start with Andrew Loomis:
"Fun with a Pencil" or even Vilppu Studio tutorials if you have serious
mindset.

~~~
msvan
Agreed. I find that Drawing on the Right Side of the Brain has too much
pseudo-science in it and that the results you get, while they may be
impressive to a complete beginner, are only superficially impressive. Getting
good at drawing takes time.

~~~
philh
Superficially-impressive is better than not-impressive-at-all for keeping
someone motivated.

I'm getting the impression that by analogy, DotRSB lets you play music that
someone else has written; but to be good at drawing, you need to be able to
play music that you've written yourself. And that's a valid criticism, but
playing someone else's music is still fun, while writing music isn't going to
be much fun if I can't play it well. So it seems reasonable to quickly get
good at playing, and then later I can learn to write.

Does this seem like a fair assessment?

~~~
jasallen
I think it's a good analogy. I also think its why everyone who wants to be an
artist but not put in the right-brain work wants to be a photographer now.
It's like creating without being required to do the actual work part. I guess
being certain types of "DJ" is a similar metaphor.

------
lutusp
One can't fault a simple pencil and pad of paper, but I think if technologists
become interested in drawing (which seems both likely and desirable), over
time there will be more ways to do this with a tablet and stencil, with all
the advantages. For me personally, notorious for moving lines around in my
drawings, that would be very nice -- one would be able to delete lines that
didn't work out.

I've always envied people who are actually gifted draftspeople -- people who
lay down the exact right line on the first try, and whose drawings are
paragons of minimalism. R. Crumb, for example -- there's a video showing him
drawing with a pen and never laying down a bad line. Whenever I watch that
video, I have an envy meltdown.

My point? With a tablet and stencil, by being able to delete things, I could
pretend to have actual drawing talent. :)

One of my old drawings:
[http://i.imgur.com/hRQY84G.jpg](http://i.imgur.com/hRQY84G.jpg)

~~~
GhotiFish
I think the trick is that they are using the Bob Ross method. They don't make
mistakes, they make happy accidents.

There's this program for rapid sketching called alchemy
[http://al.chemy.org/features/](http://al.chemy.org/features/) it specifically
has no undo button, for that reason.

It's pretty fun to screw around with.

~~~
gk1
I disagree that there's a trick to it. Laying down a line with precision and
exactly in the way that you planned is a skill. When you watch an architect or
draftsman draw a line, they've drawn that same line thousands of times before.

~~~
adestefan
Being a good draftsman is like being a good painter; it's all in the prep.
There's a lot of work that goes into getting things setup and guides in place
before the first real line hits the paper.

If you watch someone that's really good with a CAD program you'll see they do
more work with things that don't end up on the final drawing than they do on
the actually drawing.

------
kenshiro_o
I'd love to become good at drawing because I believe it can help presenting
your ideas in a very visual and straightforward way. Moreover it is an
activity that stimulates the creative and imaginative part of the brain. My
main issue, aside dedication, is that I "suffer" from a natural tremor in my
hands which I have been unable to shake off, even after seeing a doctors years
ago and undergoing a battery of tests which showed nothing conclusive nor
serious (I also took some pills which showed no results).

So my main questions would be: \- Can I still be good at drawing despite my
trembling? \- How do I cure my trembling?

~~~
egypturnash
As a practicing artist, most of my drawing is really done with the muscles in
my arm, not with my fingers and hand. My hand is fairly relaxed, with just
enough tension to keep the pencil/stylus/pen/brush making contact with the
paper/tablet/canvas. You can force yourself to learn this by holding a common
wooden pencil such that the side of the tip draws a big broad light line on
the paper, rather than the point drawing a thin, dark line.

I don't know the full cause of your tremor, but I know that if you have a
death grip on a drawing tool it will be a lot less steady in your hand. A
light grip may or may not help.

Also of course learning to whip out lines quickly can help. If you tremble
about once a second on average, and get enough control to whip out roughly the
line you want in .5s, I can imagine easily finding a rhythm that avoids a lot
of the tremors.

Alternatively you could just embrace the trembling and groove on a lot of
Edward Koren.

~~~
tripzilch
I have exactly the opposite :) Ever since I suffered a burnout, I have a
tremor in my hands, it's gotten a bit less over the years, but it's still
there.

I can still draw. But I do it explicitly with my wrist+hand, not with my arm.
I never have. Always rest my hand on the paper and draw with my fingers. Then
I don't tremble, I only tremble when I gotta keep my hand still in free space.
But on paper my hand's 100% relaxed and only moves as I want it to. Maybe it's
because I've drawn things all my life and there's a trust in my hand that
allows it to relax in that way.

There's two consequences to this drawing style: I draw best when it's really
small, because of the range of motion of my hand and wrist (although there's a
few ways I can use a marker and draw nice curves and cartoon faces on larger
paper as well). I can't paint :) Because if you rest your hand on the paper
you'll smear out all the paint :) This was already a problem in highschool,
before I burnt out, it's just not how I want to interact with the medium. It's
gotta be up close and personal.

Either way if my movements had to come out of my arm, my fingers would
tremble, and it would suck.

BTW I have a similar fear for starting to learn electronics, I really doubt if
I can handle a soldering iron and those tiny elements accurately enough to
make things without it becoming a hugely frustrating exercise in "accepting
one's limitations".

To the GP I say, try it, and really, try to relax about it (if relaxing helps
with the tremors--it doesn't for me, 100%, which is why I also need to calmly
rest my hand on a surface. but then it's pretty steady).

------
louischiffre
Long time lurker here. I am also a programmer who started to learn how to
draw. I even put a blog documenting the process.
[http://louislearnstodraw.blogspot.ch/](http://louislearnstodraw.blogspot.ch/)
So here is my 2 cent. Drawing is definitely more than being able to reproduce
a 3d object on a 2d surface, it's about understanding how things are
constructed and work. For example if you want to draw a steam locomotive, you
have to understand what are the parts of a steam engine, how power is
generated and transferred to the wheels, how it is built, why the parts have
this shape, ... . If you don't have this understanding, there is no way you
can draw a steam locomotive from imagination. Of course you can do a nice copy
with beautiful rendering that will look nice, but drawing something that is
realistic will be very difficult. Since I started learning to draw, I learned
a lot of things on a variety of subjects: entomology, anatomy, marine biology,
history, technology,... When I visit a new city the first thing I look up are
the museums, where I then go to draw. I could elaborate more on that subject
but I have to run. Let me know if there is any interest.

------
Morendil
Want to make your 10-minute drawing breaks more fun? Try Drawception:
[http://drawception.com/](http://drawception.com/)

~~~
roryokane
Doodle or Die is another site that does the same thing (games of picture
telephone): [http://doodleordie.com/](http://doodleordie.com/)

------
frooxie
From what I can tell, Drawing from the Right Side of the Brain teaches you to
draw things you already see, which is nice, and can help you impress your mom
if you practise a bit, but as far as drawing ability goes, being a human copy
machine is an extremely basic skill.

Don't get me wrong, basic skills are valuable, but reading the book and
practising for a couple of months will not make you a skilled artist any more
than learning to touch-type and adding an existing Javascript menu to a web
page will make you an expert programmer. It can be a first step, but if you
want to be really good at drawing, you probably want to to spend years
practising composition, perspective, anatomy, the emotional effects of lines
and shapes, color theory, storytelling, creating
variation/contrast/depth/movement, etc. There's much, much more to drawing
than just being able to copy what you see in front of you.

(I'm not writing this to discourage anyone, I just want to put the book into
perspective.)

~~~
cousin_it
I agree. I went through that book and then noticed that I can't draw the
things I see vividly in my mind, only copy what's in front of me. Then I
realized that to sketch from imagination, I need to understand the 3D
structure of things, not just how they look from one side. So here's some
exercises I'm doing now:

\- Drawing a lot of boxes, spheres cut in half, cones, other simple 3D objects
in various views

\- 30-second poses using Posemaniacs, and quick poses from imagination

\- Head structure from imagination, like in Loomis "Drawing the head and
hands" (available online for free)

The next problem is going to be color, I can already tell that I'm OK with
structure but will need a new set of exercises for color and value, no idea
yet what they will be. Can anyone who's further along help me out?

~~~
krick
If you are pretty good at drawing already I'd suggest to practice at color
drawing for some short time using your intuition and your eyes, and then move
on to the serious stuff. I mean color theory. You might find useful Gnomon
Workshop tutorials on color theory and Johannes Itten's "The Art of Color".
Also, here you inevitably will need guidance in proper usage of your
instruments, so find yourself a manual for the technique you use (some book
and I find youtube videos on topic pretty useful ofttimes).

------
gk1
Aside from the mental stimulation or distraction drawing provides, it's an
incredible tool for solving or communicating problems... Especially to non-
programmers.

What other tool or method allows you to explain a development challenge or
solution (at a basic level) to a non-developer, in a matter of minutes? Being
able to stand up in a meeting, walk to the whiteboard, and sketch out basic
concepts for everyone in the room to understand makes you a goddamn hero.
You'll go from being just a developer to the developer who can communicate
with the biz guys, the sales guys, the designer guys, etc. That's valuable.

There's a good book on this topic, which I highly recommend:
[http://www.danroam.com/the-back-of-the-napkin/](http://www.danroam.com/the-
back-of-the-napkin/)

(I have no affiliation with the author or the book.)

------
poseid
To me, the important question in this article, is whether drawing (or music,
dancing, acting, yoga, sports), actually helps you solving problems? Not sure,
what helps solving problems is talking about them, discussing them, etc. and
this can be done with social networks (or writing, tweeting, etc.) too.

------
pirateking
I recommend Fast Sketching Techniques by David Rankin. Of course, nothing
beats practice and the book will help you focus your practice in a very
rewarding way. I have been drawing my whole life, and still always keep an
open notebook and pencil right next to my keyboard when I program.

------
b0rsuk
I'm a beginner programmer who is attracted to aesthetic aspects of creativity
('art' is a dirty word for me because of people associated with it). I tried
to learn playing a recorder, because I like the way it sounds, and I adore
music in general. I couldn't stand it, and I learned something about myself in
the process. I'm dreadfully bored by repetitive tasks. For me it leads to
routine, and routine leads to terrible errors. I intend to try this book and
drawing in general.

Drawing has the potential to suck me in just like playing an instrument
failed. I think drawing is to playing an instrument like solving nonograms to
solving sudoku. Sudoku is inherently repetitive to solve, you need to check
for all numbers in a square, one by one, then all numbers in a line, line by
line... In contrast, nonograms usually have non-linear solutions - there is no
single way to get to the final result. This makes the process of solving a
nonogram vastly more enjoyable for me.

I have no illusion that learning to draw won't require days, months, years of
practice. But you can - should - try new things, and you improve in the
process. No endless repetition of one piece until you can play it perfectly.

Sounds a lot like Starcraft, doesn't it ? :> I think Starcraft players who
like to invoke comparisons to Chess have an inferiority complex and can't
enjoy Starcraft for what it is. And it is a lot more like playing guitar than
Chess. It's just that Chess much more accumulated prestige.

One of things putting me off Starcraft is that learning to play it violates
the DRY (Don't Repeat Yourself) principle. A few years from now you may be
vastly better at Starcraft, and I'll be able to draw many /different/ things.

I think it's a wider problem with most games. I know very few that really
reward creative thinking rather than memorization of strategies and their
counters, and practicing to execute them perfectly. Board games have it
easier, in absence of computers they can afford to be less strict about rules,
and the focus in boardgame industry is still on developing interesting
mechanics rather than building on a few established genres.

~~~
tripzilch
> 'art' is a dirty word for me because of people associated with it

lol, once more I see that nobody escapes the tentacles of post-modernism :)

I totally get the DRY principle regarding music btw. Every time I try to play
an instrument (especially percussion), and I get it right, I find myself
wishing for a "repeat" button.

Somehow with drawing this is very different for me. I love zoning out on
penning tiny details, cross-hatchings, or on the computer, handpixeling
sprites.

I think this is also what the article is really about, learning to access this
other "mode" of your brain thinking.

I'm all for DRY, but it's great to be able to stretch the other brainmuscle
and just DRRRRRRRRRRRaw :)

Also there are no terrible errors in drawing. Especially not if you do it
because you love doing it.

------
beobab
I also heartily recommend the book that the author of this piece recommends.
I'm currently about half-way through it, and the reaction to my drawings from
my family has been: "Wow! I had no idea you could draw so well."

~~~
ntaso
I found this book a bit shallow. What I liked a lot were the before-after
self-portraits shown in the book. They are really nice. However, "drawing with
the right side of your brain" means simply: Don't think about the concepts you
have of objects (tree, glass, house), but really LOOK at something:"What angle
is this line compared to that line?" and just draw them.

While this can be a revelation for some and improve drawing skills a bit, it
is simply the first step. There is absolutely no way around learning how to
draw but putting many hours into it. And drawing can be very exhausting. At
first, you won't have the patience to sit through a drawing for more than an
hour or so. It gets better though.

The drawing of the OP is okay, but not particularly good, but then he never
claimed that it was good but just a way to relax a little bit. I will try
this. Drawing as a mental break from coding. But you could probably achieve
the same result with music, taking a walk, doing some physical activity,
meditation etc.

~~~
cinskiy
I tried to squish a warning like "You won't become a good artist after reading
only one book, you still need 10000 hours of practice" into the post, but
couldn't find an appropriate place for it.

------
jaegerpicker
I tie flies, for fly fishing when I'm working from home and it has the same
effect. It's a different way of using my brain that helps me refocus. It's
also really nice to physically produce something. Plus then I have a better
selection for fishing. Doesn't work so well when in an office setting though.

This article does make me want to draw again, I used be an amateur comics book
artist/cartoonist but I haven't drawn seriously in years.

------
euph0ria
Which hacker news article did the post refer to?

~~~
cinskiy
I found it after all!

[http://nabeelqu.com/blog/surprisingly-undervalued-
books/](http://nabeelqu.com/blog/surprisingly-undervalued-books/)

Old HN post now refers to dead link.

------
pjgomez
Fantastic article. As an ex-avid comic book reader and programmer, it
certainly turns on some old hopes to draw better.

------
adcoelho
I bought this book and did find it amazing, the first exercises are very good
in showing how you Can draw, specially the inverted picture exercise. However,
I struggled to find the material with which to do some of the later exercises
and ended up putting it aside.

------
rsl7
I used to keep paper taped on my desk under the keyboard. whenever I was
working something out mentally or just taking a break I'd push the keyboard to
the side and add to an ever growing elaborate abstract drawing.

------
enbrill
I didn't get the bit about the video (the kings speech). I've never seen the
movie. Seemed like a random throw in. Wish there would have been at least one
sentence to tie it in.

------
loladesoto
if you like drawing living things (and you care about proportion, realistic
renditions) studying the underlying musculoskeletal structure helps.

i just try to capture something fleeting. i identify the most salient element
and try to communicate that in my drawing. the most useful exercise in that
book imo was the technique of trying to draw something once, then turning it
upside down and trying again. ("disorienting" the object trains your mind to
better identify spatial relationships.)

------
bharatFNS
Programming is "computer art". We have simple succeeded in making this
discipline a science. All by deciding to call the discipline "computer
science".

------
larve
we have a tiny blog with a friend (programmer too) where we put up our
drawings, both learning to draw from various books and sources on the
internet. I started 4 years ago at 28, don't know about my friend. I'm all for
messy and sketchy, he likes the clean things :)

[http://hackingart.tumblr.com/](http://hackingart.tumblr.com/)

I haven't posted much lately, been in a kind of slump and not producing much.

~~~
poseid
some nice ones

------
nsxwolf
I could never draw that stick figure. It has a certain flair I could never
replicate. That led me to be instantly disheartened when reading this.

~~~
tripzilch
:( I get what you mean (about the "flair") ... and I'm not really sure what to
say.

Except that I hope you do try. A few stick figures. Take a look at xkcd's
earliest stick figures: [https://xkcd.com/6/](https://xkcd.com/6/) and compare
them to the way he manages to put actual emotion into those few lines with his
current cartoons.

Okay yes his other drawings of that time are actually pretty good, but my
point is, even when drawing stick figures, you can get better at it with
practice :) But not if you get disheartened.

------
mcv
Interesting. I used to draw a lot as a kid, and was pretty good at it, but I
now realize that the more I programmed, the less I drew.

------
dusan82
As a programmer, I think (y)our hobbies should be non-visual. E.g. music,
learning spoken languages, etc...

~~~
013
Programmers aren't all the same person. People have different hobbies,
lifestyles, interests. Just because someone's interested in programming, or
their job is a programmer, doesn't mean they should enjoy non-visual things
like music, languages etc. Some may enjoy running, skateboarding, dancing,
stamp collecting. I think what I'm trying to say is, programming is just
another part of someone's character, not their whole character.

~~~
dusan82
What I meant is, if you are staring 16 hours a day on the screen, It is wise
to choose something that will be not as hard for your eyes.

~~~
erokar
Visual activities where you change focus, like drawing and photography, do not
strain your eyes and might be good for your vision. One of the problems with
staring at a screen is that your eyes maintain the same focus distance.

------
sarreph
Wouldn't other left-brain activity, such as playing a musical instrument, have
the same effect?

~~~
RogerL
All this left/right brain stuff is a myth[1]. I don't doubt doing something
other than programming when you are stuck helps. My best ideas come in the
shower, for example.

[http://www.livescience.com/39373-left-brain-right-brain-
myth...](http://www.livescience.com/39373-left-brain-right-brain-myth.html)

~~~
jes5199
Yes, those terms fail to correlate to brain activity. But that doesn't mean
that there's not a real, subjective quality to different kinds of productive
mental activity. Working with your hands (and with shapes or sounds or
patterns) is a great way to take a break from doing heavy semantic/problem-
solving thinking, and it has the crazy side effect of gradually giving you
skills you probably wished you had.

