

The Great Crowdfunding Train Wreck of 2013 - mirceagoia
http://bottomlinelawgroup.com/2012/03/22/great-crowdfunding-train-wreck-of/

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mey
The baseline scenario had another similar take.
<http://baselinescenario.com/2012/03/21/jobs-disaster-looms/>

I disagree with both, are people going to scammed? Sure. Did Madoff scam a
bunch of rich "intelligent" investors? Damn straight.

I personally fall on the line of personal freedom with reasonable safety nets,
to me that is, allowing micro-loans, but continuing social security.

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anonymoushn
It seems silly to be opposed to Ponzi schemes that affect only the wealthy
investors who buy in, but in favor of Ponzi schemes that affect everyone who
pays payroll tax.

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Drbble
Social Security isn't a Ponzi scheme; it isn't even an investment scheme. It
is a welfare program with a funding model loosely designed to resemble
insurance. Your payroll tax today does not entitle you to any promised future
benefit beyond "whatever the SSA and Congress decide to pay in the future."
Contrast that to a pension plan, which is a defined benefit from the moment
you start working.

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jarek
Nitpicking, but a lot of pension plans these days are "defined contribution"
rather than "defined benefit". You put in whatever amount monthly (the
contribution), what you get out depends on how the plan does in the next 40
years.

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mirceagoia
This is an analysis by a known startup lawyer in Silicon Valley. From my point
of view, it's good to hear pro and against arguments, not just the pro.

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thrill
Yet another person who wants to tell me I'm too stupid to decide what to do
with my own property.

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mirceagoia
Yet there are enough people who are "yelling" that the government did nothing
to stop Madoff from doing what he did. That's why it is so hard to be in
balance. How to please everybody?

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thrill
There's no disputing that Madoff committed fraud - and he was prosecuted for
it - and unless we want the government counting every penny we spend then
there will continue to be fraud perpetrated till the heat death of the
universe. All the whining about crowdfunding is telling people that they are
_disallowed_ to take any risk with their own property, but only for their own
good of course. The laws against fraud do not go away because we've allowed
adults to act a little more like they have some common sense.

I have been the victim of fraud, and I spent two years pursuing the embezzler
and collecting evidence out-of-county and testifying in federal court. The man
ended up serving several years in federal prison for his actions. Oh, this was
in a publicly traded company - you know - full of all those supposed
protections. There will be fraud in the future, and there will be people who
get away with it.

It's _always_ caveat emptor - but we prevent a lot of potential good trying in
some misguided attempt to not let people act like the free men they supposedly
are.

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Gormo
My favorite Tacitus quote comes to mind: "The desire for safety stands against
every great and noble enterprise."

Of course, the _real_ winners when new systems of preemptive regulation are
introduced aren't investors or entrepreneurs, but the regulators themselves,
at everyone else's expense.

~~~
Drbble
You think the SEC staff enjoy making rules and enforcing them, for no profit
and guaranteeing to make enemies of one side of every dispute they regulate?

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Gormo
I don't know whether they enjoy it or not, but it certainly pays their bills.
And it's not clear that it makes enemies out of anyone _they have to deal
with_ at all.

