
What legitimacy can be given to the 'Pizzagate' theory? - jdironman
I am curious. I am concerned. I am American. I want proof of evidence, or proof of false evidence. I feel something this profound affects a lot of people. I don&#x27;t want to be a catalyst in &#x27;conspiracy propaganda&#x27; but I need to know if any truly un-biased and credible experts have weighed in?<p>Wikipedia has it listed as &#x27;Debunked&#x27; and a google search returns this as a headline article:<p>&quot;The malicious spread of fake news online had very real consequences on Sunday, when a 28-year-old North Carolina man—inspired by an outrageous conspiracy theory known as &quot;Pizzagate&quot;—walked into a popular Washington, D.C. pizzeria and fired several shots from an AR-15.&quot;<p>from the esquire.com<p>Every link on the first page of search results is demanding that it is &#x27;fake&#x27;, &#x27;debunked&#x27;, etc. But how is it debunked? Why is it debunked? Why is there a die-hard following on reddit.com and voat.co pushing for it to be acknowledged? Is that the &#x27;hive-mind&#x27; at work?<p>I am just looking for answers and thoughts. Thank you.
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throwaway420
To be fair there's no proof of a crime thus far: just a large pile of
circumstantial evidence (creepy instagram pics and comments, many awkwardly
worded emails about pizza and hot dogs and kids in pools being entertainment,
and many other things like that) that people are choosing to interpret in a
specific way. Everybody is obviously innocent before being proven guilty, but
many people who look at so many of the weird aspects of this believe that
there's something going on here: at the very least they could be speaking in
code about something.

Interesting to me that the media wants to jump up and down and is so
hysterical and adamant about saying "it's debunked!" when it doesn't look like
there's any interest by the police to even look into this. Supposedly,
somebody filed a FOIA request to get info on the DC police's investigation
into these allegations and despite previously saying that their investigation
hasn't yielded any proof of a crime, it turns out that they never even
investigated it.

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=omlQHWrgmd4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=omlQHWrgmd4)

But the media swears up and down that it's already been debunked. I don't get
that.

~~~
jdironman
That was the tipping point for me. How readily, without reason / evidence /
proof, that it was debunked by the media. I am not a person who jumps to
conclusions. I draw conclusions based on facts. But when they can say that it
is 'debunked' without facts, while actual material exists that points to, at
the very least, shady material surrounding it...then I have not choice but to
question things. I come to the HN community because anything note worthy is
highly scrutinized here. I appreciate that about HN and it is the only reason
I even bring the topic to the table here.

~~~
ebcode
I suggest you do your own research. Download John Podesta's emails from
WikiLeaks and look through them, and search for the words "pizza", "pasta",
and "cheese". The legitimacy I see is that the words "pizza", "pasta", and
"cheese" in those emails were absolutely being used as codewords.

What those codewords actually meant to their authors could still be up for
debate (depending on your level of skepticism), but they make absolutely no
sense as non-codewords in the excerpt, "Do you think I'll do better playing
dominos on cheese than on pasta."

The word "pizza" in those emails was being used as a codeword for _something_.
That was enough legitimacy for me.

[Edit: Just re-read your question, and you seem to be searching for an "un-
biased" and "credible expert" to weigh in. In this case/investigation, I don't
believe such an appeal to authority will work (because the authorities, such
as we have in this country, are complicit). You have to become your own
expert.]

~~~
jakeogh
Example from: [https://wikileaks.org/podesta-
emails/emailid/32795](https://wikileaks.org/podesta-emails/emailid/32795) "Hi
John, The realtor found a handkerchief (I think it has a map that seems pizza-
related. Is it yorus?"

The Podestas' taste in 'art' is horrible in every way. A _mild_ example:
[http://i.imgur.com/PMVvrRy.jpg](http://i.imgur.com/PMVvrRy.jpg)

------
jakeogh
Thanks for having the courage to ask about it in a honest way. Sounds like you
realize Wikipedia is _never_ a source; It's a perception management platform.
Checkout the revision history for the Gulf of Tonkin for example... Their
9/11/01 omissions will themselves will be the subject of future psychology
(and PSYOP) books.

[http://s3.amazonaws.com/nasathermalimages/public/video/Prete...](http://s3.amazonaws.com/nasathermalimages/public/video/Pretext.mov)

------
DefaultUserHN
Eventually, you lean to stop listening to the so called "experts" and start
doing your own research. Get the facts straight from 1st hand sources like
John Podesta's own leaked e-mails, instead of listening to 2nd hand sources
like CNN.

~~~
jdironman
That has been my only source of info. My searches on it. I don't trust myself
enough to know what I have read though. It could be typos, it could be code
words unrelated, or it could be more.

Although saying "that kids will be there for entertainment", listing their
ages, and saying that they might get in the pool is a mighty odd thing to say.
Although some people do enjoy just watching kids play as it is simple things
that take stress off like that. I don't know their context or relations. I
guess I need to research more.

~~~
DefaultUserHN
Here, some more info, this time, by CBS.

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l5AxV1SrTkE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l5AxV1SrTkE)

