
Ask HN: What does one need to do to get a software job out of University - TictacTactic
It looks as if no one will hire a dev out of university except big companies. What do you do when you&#x27;ve tried all your social connections, contacted your previous internships, applied to all local jobs, applied to several remote jobs and jobs in other cities.<p>Options: hire someone to go over my resume and cover letter to help improve it, hire a company to match me with an employer, increase my applications to jobs in a city with more jobs, obtain online certificates to bolster my resume.<p>I&#x27;m intentionally leaving this question broad as to help future readers but I will include some vague description of my current situation.<p>- I have internships at 3 decent companies and 1 pseudo internship at a very notable company.<p>- I&#x27;ve been applying for 3.5 months. ~50 CL, ~50 without CL. Anythin from startups to big companies intentionally targetting jobs requiring ~1 year experience.<p>- I&#x27;ve had my resume reviewed by a couple professional friends.<p>- I&#x27;ve had 3 interviews and ~7 coding challenges. All interviews were at great companies.
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PaulHoule
Job search doctors will tell you that hiring is an elimination process; if you
are getting interviews then your resume is "good enough" and it isn't the
problem, it is your ability to pass the interview.

Most people make mistakes in the interviewing process that cause them to
interview below their level. Don't be that guy.

One class of mistakes is actions that offend some people: the range of these
are large and if you want the job you won't be leaving posts on social media
complaining that other people are too sensitive. For instance I interviewed
for a job at a company that was making small satellites in Southern NH and got
turned down because I touched the knob of an oscilloscope without permission
and the guy who ran that particular lab thought that meant I couldn't be
trusted and I was passed over, even though everybody else thought I was great.

When you become aware of this you can certainly stress it because any person
you see could blackball you but you have to eliminate any sign of negativity,
hostility, etc. If you radiate "I've been hurt" it is all over.

One way or another you have to face it and you will.

You can certainly try a temp agency like Kelly if the wolf is at your door,
but you can get paid better anyplace else.

Don't think about remote if you don't have experience. If you want to move
somewhere I say anywhere but the bay area. New York City is great in 2018, but
there are tech scenes in cities like Boulder, CO; Henderson, NV; Boston , MA
as well as general areas such as Southern California, New Jersey, Delaware,
Maryland, Salt Lake City, and Research Triangle Park.

If you can get a security clearance (clean rap sheet) you will find work that
is often interesting and innovative for defense contractors who are
geographically distributed and might even move you around from one site to
another in the flyover states.

I'd suggest figuring out a way to live light and move to a low-cost tech hub
and get into that scene and be ready to move again in 6 mo to 1 yr.

I like the SkillIQ tests at Pluralsite for a quick assessment of "how well you
know a technology". I have taken many of them and they reflect my own
assessment of things I am good at and not good at.

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TictacTactic
You make a solid point about what you radiate in an interview. I can tend be
passive which might come across as aloof or uninterested. I could probably be
more active.

I would love to live in Boston but I'm Canadian. Do you think I would have a
chance of getting a visa and job in Boston? I've definity heard that if you
want to progress in the software business you need to move companies often,
unfortunately.

I'm intrigued by the tests you mentioned. Would definitely be helpful for
finding weak points.

~~~
PaulHoule
Many firms that have software operations in the US have operations in Canada
as well, usually in the same time zone.

For instance Pac Northwest firms such as Amazon and Microsoft hire in B.C.,
Calgary has a scene in systems programming, embedded systems that I know of
and probably lots that I don't. Toronto has everything from Geoff Hinton to
internet porn. Montreal has game super-studio Ubisoft as well as ASP.NET and
mainframe programmers, great nightlife, a goth loli clothing store, ...

So far as personality I would be worried more about a person who was too
reckless than I would somebody careful.

If you want to appear interested in people it helps to ask questions. Sitting
on either side of the interview table I would see it as an opportunity to get
information I couldn't get any other way about the state of the industry so I
am always interested. People mostly like talking about themselves and if they
are talking you don't need to think of something to say or open your mouth and
risk scoring an own goal.

To get in the mood you can pretend that you already have the job and you are
coiled like a spring to start and you are going to ask all the questions you
need to start such as "what kind of computer do i get?", "what is the
schedule?", "where will I be working?", as well as getting an understanding of
the job enough to get ready to do it.

If you find that hard to do consider acting lessons at a Meisner school and
they will teach you to be coiled like a spring in the second term!

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Raed667
I graduated a couple of years ago. I sent over 200 application (Linkedin,
custom CV/cover or generic CV and email ...) , all I can tell you is not to
give up, there is a lot of luck in the process but eventually you'll find your
breakthrough.

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jimnotgym
I heard the other day about a partner at a major law firm who despite his
first class degree applied to 500 positions before he got his first job.

As rubbish as it is, send more letters!

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TictacTactic
I was wandering that myself. My numbers seem low. I wrote version control for
my CLs to improve the speed but I need the discipline to sit and create them.

~~~
jimnotgym
You do have to play the numbers game. If you had sent me a dev CV at most
points in the last 5 years it would go in the bin, but suddenly one week I
need a dev...and you would get a shot.

Where in the world are you btw?

~~~
TictacTactic
Eastern Canada. I'm willing to relocate to anywhere west of Toronto or go all
the way to BC.

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HiroshiSan
This question is better asked on /r/cscareerquestions

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btian
Did you ask for feedback from the internships?

Usually intern conversion is the best way to hire new grads

~~~
TictacTactic
All the companies gave a general overview of my ability at the end of the
intership. The first company I worked at was a start up and they folded up.
The second company was pretty great, code/tech was ok, told me they would love
to hire me and the team lead said that I was probably a better dev then some
of the current members on the team but they didn't reply when I messaged them.
The 3rd company I refuse to go back and work for: would never progress my
career, underpaid devs, Nightmare code, etc.

is their any other options beside previous internships?

~~~
btian
I assume you've applied to all the big companies. Try applying again 6 months
after the rejection.

Have you tried AngelList? It's where startups post their jobs.

