
My First Job: Fired and Rehired on Day 1 - lydiahan
http://www.linkedin.com/today/post/article/20131029100222-95015-my-first-job-fired-and-rehired-on-day-1?trk=tod-home-art-list-small_1
======
ignostic
I feel like I'm a different species when I hear someone excited about working
80+ hours a week. Having so little free time and so little time to spend with
friends and family seems like a sad life regardless of the paycheck.

I agree with this: "Have a passion for Doing something rather than Being a
title on a business card." I also agree that "Showing up a lot increases your
odds" (in this case meaning working a lot of hours), but I just don't think
it's worth the trade-off.

Life outside of work is, for many of us, far more meaningful than work. I
thought this feeling was extremely common, but judging by what gets to the
front of HN I'm in the minority here.

~~~
ryanjshaw
If I have to work 80+ hours a week to have the absolute financial freedom to
live the rest of my estimated 40-50 years on this planet in any way I chose,
nevermind ensuring similar benefits accrue to my family, then I think that's a
pretty good deal. I still have down time and plenty of fond memories -- you
just have to plan how you spend that time a bit better.

I live in a part of the world where a lack of financial resources is death.
Every single day I pass by people begging for money and for work, and I live
5min away from my office. My crappy little second hand Fiat is worth more than
combined net worth of every person I pass on the street. I remember seeing a
documentary once where a labourer said something to the effect of: "I work
like a horse so that my children can work like dogs, so that their children
can live like people, and their children can be free."

And before any says your children should take care of themselves: try telling
that to a child born with severe autism or down's syndrome, or some other
disabling birth defect. If you're not planning for your family so that you can
enjoy your younger years a bit more fully, you're taking a huge, selfish risk.

I'm much more fortunate than that guy was - my parents worked like dogs.

~~~
legulere
There's a nice parable about working hard to have free time later:
[http://www.protolink.com/MexicanFisherman.html](http://www.protolink.com/MexicanFisherman.html)

~~~
ryanjshaw
The problem with this parable is that it equates two different scenarios. A
fisherman without extensive financial resources is not the same as a person
with extensive financial resources choosing to fish. Here's some alternative
endings, in a country without social and medical support in place, for you to
consider:

1\. The fisherman develops a serious illness and finds he can no longer
support his family. His wife, who was barely getting by on a fisherman's
income as a housewife, finds herself working at a local bar, serving drunk,
lecherous men every day and night. His son and daughter find themselves unable
to afford an education and really don't want daddy to die. With mounting
medical bills, the son finds himself involved in crime to support his family
and is eventually sent to prison for life for a crime he didn't commit. The
daughter meets a wealthy man and everything is great until he starts hitting
her. But at least she can support her father, lying on his deathbed in
hospital. Daddy eventually dies but by that point she's stuck with 2 kids
married to a man she hates.

2\. Oh but medical welfare would solve the problem in #2? Setting aside that
this is contrary to my stated scenario (a country without medical welfare),
consider this scenario: the fisherman loses his fingers and toes in a freak
fishing accident.

3\. Oh but somehow he managed to afford an insurance policy that paid out on
disability? Setting aside how unlikely this is to be for people barely making
a living wage, consider this scenario instead: the nearby waters are polluted
by an American oil extraction firm, and the fisherman finds himself scrubbing
toilets at McDonald's to support his family. The American happens to come by
one day and leaves him a nice tip.

~~~
z92
On the other hand you can get bankrupt due to:

1\. Share market crash. 2\. Change in government regulations. 3\. Getting
sued. 4\. Or simply bad luck. 90% of all business fail anyway.

~~~
PeterisP
None of these should cause a wealthy man to go bankrupt.

It can cause a business to go bankrupt, and a wealthy man to become much less
wealthy, but otherwise either you are stupid or you are diversified; and it's
easier to 'stay there' than to 'get there'. If a stock market crash or, say,
Madoff hurts you then it's bad luck; but if it destroys you then it's
stupidity.

For example, Bill Gates should still be wealthy even if Microsoft went
completely bankrupt at any point since mid-1980ies. Sure, he probably wouldn't
be on his malaria campaign in that case, but it wouldn't hurt his life that
much.

------
JoshTriplett
> Two weeks before the class was over, the head of the deployment team asked,
> “Steve, are you single?” Yes. “Do you like to travel?” Sure. “Why don’t you
> come to Korea with us when we ship the system overseas.”

The first of those questions was completely unnecessary, and invited a
potential employment discrimination lawsuit; it fairly directly implies they
might not have made the offer if he wasn't. It would have sufficed to find out
if he was willing to travel.

~~~
ars
There is no federal law about Marital status discrimination, only state law,
and not all states.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Employment_discrimination_law_...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Employment_discrimination_law_in_the_United_States)

Note that California does prohibit it, but it seems to be a recent law.

This [http://www.unmarriedamerica.org/column-
one/01-08-07-californ...](http://www.unmarriedamerica.org/column-
one/01-08-07-california-sweeping-bill.htm) implies it was around 2007/2008.

~~~
chii
Its a dangerous question to ask anyway, not because its against the law, but
because it is somewhat ethically grey - the candidate would feel they've been
discriminated if they had answered that question "poorly".

------
peterwwillis

      > Trust your instincts
      > Showing up a lot increases your odds
      > Trust that the dots in your career will connect
      > Have a passion for Doing something rather than Being a title on a business card.
    

So basically, his advice is to just hope everything works out okay. What he
doesn't explicitly point out is that all of the success in his story is based
on being a really good bullshitter. If you can bullshit well, you can get
promotions, you can get jobs, you can get a lot of things. If you can't
bullshit well, you're out of a job with barely any cash in a place you're not
familiar with, and probably soon calling your parents to wire you gas money to
get back home.

I've also been fired the first day on a job. But I had savings to fall back
on, and then got a much better job a few months after. Trust your back-up
plan, not connecting the dots.

~~~
jdbernard
> all of the success in his story is based on being a really good bullshitter.

And then delivering on what he said. You forgot that part.

------
aaronbrethorst
"You’re not so smart, you just show up a lot in a lot of places."

Quite astute. As they say, showing up is half the battle.

~~~
kybernetikos
Maybe, but being the kind of person to hustle your way into a job in a
situation he described is pretty impressive in itself, and he showed a lot of
savvy in a short space of time in gathering the intelligence to work out the
pitch that meant they _had_ to hire him.

So yes, 'showing up' a lot is very important, but it's not the only lesson I
take from his story by a long shot.

------
gregd
As a mid-40s year old male, I can assure you that working 70+ hours a week
will eventually kill you. Your body will respond in ways you never expected in
your youth. And it's insidious. It will sneak up on you and catch up to you
when you least expect it. If you're lucky, there will be time to take
corrective action.

~~~
rfnslyr
Could you elaborate on the tolls it takes?

~~~
gregd
Sure.

For me, the stress has manifested itself in the following ways, I have high-
blood pressure, I have fatty liver, I have high cholesterol, I'm overweight,
my eyesight is horrid, I grind my teeth while I sleep which has resulted in
broken teeth, I have one gold crown and another chipped tooth and have a
really messed up "sleep" schedule.

I have chronic back problems, allergies and get frequent colds.

All of this due to the stress of working long, hard hours. Keep in mind that I
have a diet which is _better_ than the typical American's. I've cut a lot of
sugar out of my lifestyle.

~~~
dennisgorelik
How do you know you wouldn't have all these problems if you worked less?

------
rplnt
> My First Job:

> [...]

> I had quit my job

The "In Silicon Valley" is missing from title.

------
wil421
If I drove all the way across the country and heard that on my first day. My
middle finger would be raised very high as I shouted profanities as I walked
out the door.

But the author kept his cool and it worked out, maybe a trait I need to
develop.

------
mattip
Can anyone summarize? I do not read linkedin articles.

~~~
laureny
What's this guy asking? I don't read stupid Hacker News comments.

~~~
001sky
_Agile Opportunism – Entrepreneurial DNA

Posted on June 29, 2009 by steveblank_

Seems like the guy has a point. Title's been changed. And the meta-data of the
source publication ([http://steveblank.com](http://steveblank.com)) is lost in
the process. About par for the course. Linkedin is a needless re-direct.

