
TI releases Launchpad, a $4.30 (shipping included) microproccessor dev kit - mcantelon
http://hackaday.com/2010/06/22/ti-makes-a-big-bid-for-the-hobby-market/
======
jws
Summary for Reference: Smaller package, 1/8th the memory of an Arduino.

2k ROM, 128 bytes of RAM, 10 IO lines, 8 ADC inputs on one variant, 200ksps
with sample and hold. Very low power consumption (if you make it work that
way).

$0.75 for the microcontroller in volume.

I need to read more about the USB interface. I suspect it can be used to
communicate with the serial controller while the chip runs, which with the
right software could make it be a nice way to build small USB controlled
devices and sensors.

~~~
alnayyir
Thanks for the tl;dr, I'm left wondering about the state of the software to
actually program and deploy code to the device though. From what I saw on
HackADay, it appears the two supported IDEs are Windows only (utterly
unacceptable, for me). (I know, the gcc port is there, but it's pretty
incomplete, from my understanding)

This leaves me, a relative newbie to embedded dev, what kind of pitfalls I'd
run into if I tried to purchase one of these.

It's incredibly frustrating, after years of being in a relative comfort zone
with the realm of general desktop/server software, to try to learn more about
embedded, and then be uncertain as to what materials you even need.

~~~
ganley
I have the same newbie issues, but it's $4.30. Worst case, it's totally
useless to me, and I'm out the cost of a latte.

~~~
nooneelse
Cheaper than going to a movie and, for the hacker-minded, almost certain to be
at least as entertaining as many movies.

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chime
Any hardware hackers on HN? I bought an Arduino board a few months ago and
ended up blowing out the few LEDs the kit came with because I didn't
understand how resistors/volts etc. worked. Can anyone direct me to a guide on
electronics specifically for small hardware hacking? I'm certain taking EE
classes or reading Physics/Electronics books would help but it would also take
a lot of time. I'd rather concentrate on writing neat software once the
hardware is wired up. Is there a guide to learning the basics of hardware so I
can get started with Arduino and maybe LaunchPad?

Edit: Thanks everyone for the links. These are pretty much exactly what I was
looking for. Hopefully I'll hack up some interesting stuff soon :)

~~~
dugmartin
If Radio Shack still sells the Forrest Mims book I'd pick that up. It's a
great book.

~~~
Kadin
I was going to suggest the Mims books as well. He had quite a few of them.

I have several (or did at one point); the basic electronics is a decent intro,
and then there are good ones on op-amps and the 555 timer. If you are totally
new to hardware hacking it might not be a waste of your time to play around a
little with some of those circuits just so you can learn how to wire up an IC
on a breadboard.

Plus even if you only think you're going to do embedded systems stuff,
eventually you're going to want to interface with the rest of the world
without going through a PC, and knowing a little about analog circuits or old-
school TTL will come in handy.

They were great books and it's a sad commentary on Radio Shack if they no
longer carry them.

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boots
Extremely aggressive price for the microprocessor, but there are large hidden
software costs. Their proprietary IDE is listed at $445
(<http://focus.ti.com/docs/toolsw/folders/print/ccstudio.html>)

~~~
zokier
The free IDE should be adequate for this and there is a port of GCC for the
controller.

~~~
rbanffy
It, however, is Windows-only.

I have downloaded it and will try to run it under Wine, but I bet it won't
like the USB.

~~~
azim
Please update us with your findings once you try it.

~~~
rbanffy
Failed miserably. Parts of the software install, parts don't and, in general,
it seems dysfunctional.

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surki
Shouldn't we s/microprocessor/microcontroller/g ?

It looks like these the are the chips we are talking about

<http://focus.ti.com/docs/prod/folders/print/msp430g2211.html>

<http://focus.ti.com/docs/prod/folders/print/msp430g2231.html>

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ErrantX
Bad choice of name IMO considering the market, could easily be confused with:
<https://launchpad.net/>

On the other hand:

 _So here it is: Launchpad will set you back four dollars and thirty cents.
And for now shipping is included._

Holy crap, that's an awesome price!

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cmos
That is an impressive price point. I've always been a bit surprised at how
expensive the arduino is, specifically that as it's become super popular and
companies are actually selling decent volumes of it, the price point has not
gone down remarkably (or at all?).

~~~
sliverstorm
The arduino doesn't seem that expensive to me. It's sure no $4, but $29 seems
fantastically modest. You say 'thats too much to put in a product', but I
don't think it was ever meant to be in shipping products.

The whole shields part gets expensive though.

~~~
cmos
True - but imagine if there was one in all your consumer electronics, with a
usb port and all the code is open source. I think we'd see the pace of
innovation speed up a lot, and electronics would start to be a little bit more
personalized and friendly than they are today.

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zwieback
We use MSP430s at work albeit much larger versions with more RAM and
peripherals. MSPs are pretty nice processors if you need something really low
power and they have some models with built-in USB endpoints, which means you
don't have to add an FTDI chip or similar.

From the looks of it TI used another micro to generate the JTAG interface via
USB. In the past they used a USB chip with built in 8051 to turn USB into
JTAG. It's kind of a hassle but just having the USB part on the experimenter
board is worth the money since you can use it as a USB-serial converter (I
think.)

As to the development tools: CodeComposer is great if you already know Eclipse
and the code size limit is high enough that you can still do some real work.
IAR is good too but the full version is much more expensive than CCS so we're
going with CCS.

Haven't tried the GCC msp backend.

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ygd
Getting started with a Launchpad is actually cheaper than getting started with
a similarly-sized AVR. The 20-pin ATtiny2313 is $2.88 from SparkFun. The
programmer + shipping will throw the cost to about $30.

Although I suspect these "value-line" microcontrollers aren't quite as
powerful as an AVR.

~~~
fhars
The 2313 should be similar in power, it has up to 18 I/O lines instead of 10
and an additional 128B of EEPROM and 2 ADCs, which is two more than the
MSP430G2211 and six less than the 2231 [edit: and the TI ADCs might be
faster]. But at $2.88 you are being seriously ripped off, I pay 1.10€ at
reichelt.de including 19% sales tax, and as far as I can remember, the Euro is
still unter US$2.00

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mistermann
A bit off topic, but related....does anyone know of a website for industrial
automation parts for bulding custom automated "machines"?

Specifically what I am in need of right now is a low cost solution for
automatically proportioning (by weight) pet treats. They are an odd shape and
a bit sticky so our existing machine can't seem to cope with them, and
apparently a proper machine which _can_ handle it is ~ $100k.

So in the meantime I thought perhaps a person could take some off the shelf
parts and build something from scratch.

Anyone have any insight on this??

~~~
HeyLaughingBoy
That's not a difficult task unless I misunderstand you. I have a load cell
with a weighing platform somewhere in my garage and never got around to using
it.

What part are you having trouble sourcing? For general electromechanical
components, MSC, Small Parts, McMaster-Carr are my usual go-to places. Are you
looking to build a machine that can take pet treats from a hopper and bag them
by weight? That's a pretty straightfoward task: the 100k pricetag probably has
more to do with speed/throughput and low economies of scale than anything
else.

PM/email me if you need more help.

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mcav
What would you build with this? [genuine question]

~~~
HeyLaughingBoy
Hmmm:

A complex LED flasher? Maybe one that instead of flashing, smoothly fades the
LEDs in or out?

Want to run that lawnmower more efficiently and cleanly? Be the first on your
block with a mower that has an onboard engine management controller.

Of course: robots, robots, robots.

A Newton's laws demonstrator that times how long it takes from when you
release it to when it hits the floor and uses that to calculate the initial
height. Bonus points if it displays G force when it hits the ground so you can
experiment with different types of padding.

A temperature controller for your overclocked game machine?

And that's just simple hobby stuff without even getting into real industrial
uses!

I love being a hardware hacker!

~~~
83457
Am I right that most uses of this would rely on plugging in sensors and other
devices for it to monitor or control?

~~~
HeyLaughingBoy
Yes, it's just a computer, albeit a very specialized one. And like any
computer, it's useless without I/O

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phaedrus
Am I the only one who can't find a link in the article that actually links to
a store where you can buy it? I can't even find it with a Google search; no
direct hits and the ones that look like they might lead near it on TI.com time
out.

~~~
abronte
It's on the wiki. [http://www.ti-
estore.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&...](http://www.ti-
estore.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=MSP-EXP430G2)

But the store doesn't seem to load :(

~~~
sliverstorm
Their entire store seems to be bogged down right now, probably give it a few
hours.

~~~
zokier
few hours seems at this point bit optimistic. 5 hours later and constantly
getting 502 Proxy Error. At least earlier it loaded after some tries.

This hopefully means also that there will be quite a community when everyone
gets their order.

edit: I made order from Mouser. Free shipping too, and their website actually
works :)

~~~
sliverstorm
Free shipping? Is that cause you got in the order before they were
backordered?

~~~
zokier
Actually no. Mousers checkout page was just buggy (showed 0,00 as shipping
costs), but after few emails the truth was revealed; they want 20 for shipping
apparently

------
plaes
Duh.. tried to order it, but TI's e-store is missing my country (Estonia) :S

------
someone_here
It is strange that the IDEs are not free.

~~~
mcantelon
It says they are free:

>two free IDEs; Code Composer Studio 4 and IAR Embedded Workbench Kickstart

Kickstart is Windows-only and Code Composer seems to be an Eclipse plugin (so
cross-platform, but not lightweight like Arduino's minimalist IDE).

~~~
someone_here
I meant free as in freedom...

------
blhack
TI's site seems to be down. Are there any vendors selling these?

~~~
ganley
I got through eventually. It took several tries, though.

~~~
rajeshamara
I don't know if we can buy this from their website. I contacted one of the
authorized distributor agent. She said she is going to find details and let me
know. I am very excited with the price and ready to buy

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joejohnson
TI just got out of prison too.

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hackermom
The specifications of this board detail that it comes with a 32 kHz crystal,
but the specifications of the MSP430 micro controller family says that they
run at 16 MIPS. Anyone got any details on this? Can the board simply be fitted
with a faster crystal? Please, no "it actually executes 500 instructions per
clock cycle" jokes.

~~~
mkeblx
There's an internal oscillator on the uC.

"32kHz crystal increases MSP430 MCUs’ integrated digitally controlled
oscillator to real-time accuracy for various peripherals and timers"

But even running at 32kHz you can do real work, probably even run a MUMPS
deployment.

