

Goals Are For Losers - taigeair
http://www.taigeair.com/goals-are-for-losers/

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falcolas
I used to agree with this, until I realized that without goals, I had nothing
to really strive for. Nothing to stretch myself towards. Nothing to achieve.

To illustrate, a poor car metaphor: Your system might be to drive yourself
constantly and to keep moving forward. However, without a destination, you
could drive yourself around in circles and consider it to be progress by
process, when you really could be driving to Brazil.

To relate this to reality, my system for a long time was to become great at
programming. To become a mentor, to become someone people would look up to.
Five years later, and this is all true. However, I'm still just a developer.
I've become quite good at my craft (enough so that finding a mentor in my
physical area is truly difficult), but I'm still just a developer. A cog in
someone else's mechanism, my job and livelyhood at someone else's mercy.

Add a goal, however, of running the technical parts of the company I work for,
and suddenly I have a reason to do things. To stretch myself. My days aren't
filled with loosing because I don't run it all yet, but they're filled with
small steps towards that goal. I'm using my processes to achieve the goal, and
every step towards that goal is a win, not a loss. And that's not my final
goal, either. It's just a step towards it.

~~~
egypturnash
Design a goal into your system.

I make comics; my current goal is "finish this graphic novel I've been working
on for the past three years". It's about a half a year off at current
estimates.

The system is basically "work on the GN regularly". A day when I don't get any
work done on drawing a page feels like a day when I got nothing done; I've
tuned my self-rewards to this project.

When I finish this graphic novel, my reward will be that I get to work on the
next one. And the next. And the next, until I say I've said everything I need
or want to say in comics and pick up some new passion, or have died.

~~~
wsc981
I agree with this.

I personally like to see my life as a business. As such, I have an operational
planning (what do I want to achieve today?), a tactical planning (what do I
want to achieve in the coming year?) and a strategic planning (where to I want
to be in the next 10 years?). Of course I have to adapt these plans every year
/ few years or so depending on how my situation has changed, but at least I
got something to look forward to.

In the past, when my parents died in a car accident I lost all my goals to
strive for, which was one of the causes of a depression that lasted around ~7
years. Only after reformulating my goals and creating a solid plan for the
future, my life gained meaning again.

~~~
mercer
Great to hear that you've found meaning after such a terrible situation!

I've also found that the interaction of operational planning _and_ setting
longer-term goals have really helped me get out of the different lows of my
life. I can strongly recommend it to anyone who is having trouble with life.

That said, I suspect I'd have gotten out of my situations much quicker had I
sought help. Talking to a professional who gets paid to be a good listener
(and to give some direction) can be very valuable, even if just to get going.
It's like seeing a personal trainer to help you get from couch potato to
healthy person!

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jasode
The author's characterization of how people utilize goals is too broad. For
many type-A personalities[1], using goals as a focal point works just fine. An
ambitious student has a "goal to be a doctor" and endures 10 years of
secondary education and residency to achieve it.

[1][http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_A_personality](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_A_personality)

For other types, fixating on goals may be counterproductive. For them,
shifting the emphasis to "systems & processes" instead of goals is better. (It
seems like the description of " _systems instead of goals_ " is a modern
rebranding of the timeless advice about " _enjoying the journey instead of the
destination._ ")

For those where goals act more like a self-defeating hindrance instead of
motivator, they can still use them in a different way: use the goal to first
_design_ the system. Then, let the concrete goal fade into the background of
life. As the person works the system, achieving the goal becomes a side-
effect. Instead of a goal to write The Big Novel, the "system" is to write 500
words a every day for pleasure. At the end of the year, you may get a decent
full-length novel as a side-effect.

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dreeves
Ironically, for a so-called goal-tracking website, Beeminder's philosophy
quite agrees with this. Namely, it's not about goals that you'll at some point
reach and be done with. It's about setting up a system to force yourself to
get inexorably awesomer day by day.

Which is also similar to the classic advice to make your goals
S.M.A.R.T.(E.R.):
[http://blog.beeminder.com/smart](http://blog.beeminder.com/smart) &
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4403293](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4403293)

~~~
taigeair
Beeminder is an interesting product! Didn't know about it.

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joosters
Who on earth thought it'd be a great idea to make the whole content on that
webpage shift sideways as you scroll down the page? Thanks for that. I really
appreciate designers making webpages more of a challenge to read.

~~~
chazu
Yeah that definitely gave me a weird moment of vertigo. Decidedly unpleasant.

~~~
taigeair
Interesting. I just wanted to collapse the side panel for less distraction.
Didn't realise it was an unpleasant reading experience.

~~~
Kequc
I would have that happen immediately, then slide open again if called upon
rather than automatically from scrolling. While not truly unpleasant this did
catch me off guard I was forced to understand what happened and that took me
out of reading.

~~~
taigeair
Okay, I'll look into re-designing it. Thanks for the feedback. Yeah it's not a
standard design pattern. Does anyone like it though? Seems like most people
don't from the comments.

~~~
gk1
I noticed and understood why it happened, but I didn't think it helped in any
way. Nice idea, but seems it's more harmful than helpful.

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chuckcode
Hyped up headline about semantics of timing of goals. Sure your longer term
goals are going to be depressing and overwhelming if you don't have smaller
achievable chunks that you can do today. But far from getting rid of goals
they've just created a lot more little short term goals that they call a
system instead. For me to achieve things it has helped to have a longer term
vision of where I want to go and a shorter term series of steps about how to
get there. Also to be ready for opportunity when it knocks but that is another
comment.

Probably best piece of advice in here is that "80% of Happiness is easy, 5
things: eat right, exercise, get enough sleep, daydream an incredible future,
flexible schedule...". Having a kid made me realize that most of the time if
she's slept enough, eaten enough, has a dry diaper and some hugs she's pretty
happy and the same turns out to be true of most people. If you don't take
basic care of yourself you're going to have a hard time being happy.

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Kequc
I agree with this article and the book it is selling to a limited extent.

A mistake I made was creating goals which were grandiose, difficult to
complete and focussing on those. When I did that, I definitely experienced
everything that is summarised here. Eventually after untold stress I did reach
that goal, but then what? Depression or a new huge goal.

It's probably okay to have those goals, but it's important not to focus on
them. Set many smaller more attainable goals that lead towards reaching your
larger goals and focus on those instead. You will complete goals more often
and feel good more often, plus you can work towards completing small goals
while still enjoying recent success.

Maybe that's what a system is though I'm not sure.

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mark_l_watson
What the author calls a 'system', I think of as my 'process', but same thing
really. Basically: trying to be in the moment and concentrate on one thing at
a time.

Best take away: "Positive attitude - exercise, food, and sleep. Avoid
overexposure to depressing news, music, movies, etc."

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hammock
Seems to me a system is just a goal that's behavior-oriented, rather than
results-oriented. "Make the best widget you can adhering to XYZ principles" as
opposed to "Make a widget that sells 100,000 units."

Reminds me of Musk's first principles method.

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szatkus
"80% of Happiness is easy, 5 things: eat right, exercise, get enough sleep,
daydream an incredible future, flexible schedule (do things when you want to
do it)."

Hmmm, complete oppisite of me. And I daydream mainly about getting sleep.

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samirmenon
"goal-oriented people exist in a state of nearly continuous failure"

Is that bad? Perhaps it's okay to fail a lot; for some, it may push them to
work harder.

~~~
kitd
You could have a goal to be a failure. Perpetual bliss!

------
ourmandave
To quote the philosophizer Cyrus,

"Ain't about how fast I get there Ain't about what's waitin' on the other side
It's the climb"

