
Show HN: Pinball Map – user-updated map of public pinball machines - ryantgtg
https://pinballmap.com/
======
ryantgtg
HN suggested I repost this, since last time it didn’t get much attention (cool
feature!).

Here is the description I wrote last time:

Hi, Pinball Map is a hobby project we've been doing in our spare time for the
past 10 years. It's currently listing 7,291 locations and 24,918 machines.
Code is on github[1][2], and we have an API that is used by various folks.

Web Stack = ruby on rails, heroku, tile server on aws. App = React Native
(launched the redeveloped app last June).

We took a relatively slow-growth approach for the first 9 years: we added
"regions" one at a time for places where people demonstrated a strong desire
to update the data, and a volunteeer administrator could oversee it (in fact,
we originally intended for this to just be a map of pinball machines in
Portland, Oregon, but people kept asking us to expand to their areas). This
gave us a pretty strong userbase and a reputation for having clean, up-to-date
data. Each regional map was a distinct, silo'd map. Lately we've de-emphasized
this model in favor of a single map that covers the whole world.

For the first 7 years, all map updates were made anonymously. But after two
instances of abuse, we implemented a user system. We now have about 9,000
registered users. The map gets around 3,000-5,000 edits per month, including
100-200 new locations.

Search experience on the web could use some updating. The app is where it's at
right now. We spent the past 14 months on its design/development, and we think
it came out well. Throughout the 10 years, the majority of our users use the
app rather than the website (but we don't have great analytics).

We have no ads, no analytics aside from the free new relic stuff that comes
with heroku, and no business model.

[1]
[https://github.com/scottwainstock/pbm/](https://github.com/scottwainstock/pbm/)
[2] [https://github.com/bpoore/pbm-react](https://github.com/bpoore/pbm-react)

~~~
codetrotter
The website seems very North America centric. So much so that I thought it was
North America only. Elsewhere ITT you mentioned Japan though.

Have you considered making the site more global friendly? Also, on mobile at
least when I go to look at the map I expected to be able to see all machines
in the whole world but instead it only tells me there are no machines within
50 miles of me and won’t show me any machines at all.

~~~
ryantgtg
The brief history of the site is that for the first 8 years or so it contained
many separate maps, each for a distinct region. These regions were comprised
of places where people had contacted us and said they wanted a map, and that
they would manage the data for. It just happens that almost all of those
regions were in North America.

So, we let the users decide what the map would show.

Additionally, we had a pact with findapinball.com that we’d stay out of
Europe. We recently backed out of that because we merged all the regions
together and wanted to allow people to submit locations anywhere.

We don’t really have the resources to load data for the whole world. But the
code is available, and if you want to figure out a way to cluster data at that
scale...!

Also, I agree that the website search experience needs improvement. Try the
mobile app! We recently redesigned it, and it’s easier to browse the world.

~~~
codetrotter
I see, and I will try your mobile app then :)

------
ryantgtg
Someone just anonymously noted that we need to credit OSM contributors (so I
can’t respond to them, but will respond here). We do credit OSM contributors.
When you load the map, the standard credit is present.

Let me know if more needs to be done to fulfill this requirement.

~~~
vertex-four
Uhh, I just loaded the map and couldn't find this credit?

~~~
misnome
There's a "(c)OpenMapTiles" on higher zoom levels over the map. I assume this
is what they meant?

~~~
ryantgtg
That's not what I was referring to. I was looking on mobile (browser) when I
responded, and there's a little "(i)" in the lower right that you click on and
it says "OpenStreetMap Contributors".

But I'm not seeing it on desktop. We'll fix this! It might just be hidden
behind another div.

OpenMapTiles packages the vector tiles, which we are hosting on our own.
Usually attribution shows up automatically...

~~~
ryantgtg
Ok, this is resolved now :)

------
40four
Cool project!

I never loved pinball growing up, but I played my fair share as I cruised
around the arcade. I think I appreciate it more now as I’ve gotten older.

There is something very satisfying about playing an ‘analog’ game, in a world
where digital video games and the internet dominate our attention.

Good to see the pinball community is alive and well, and people are actively
contributing. Keep up the good work!

------
kjhughes
Love it! Feature idea: Add links from the machines to the Internet Pinball
Machine Database:
[https://www.ipdb.org/search.pl](https://www.ipdb.org/search.pl)

Here's Eight Ball Deluxe's entry, for example:
[https://www.ipdb.org/search.pl?any=eight+ball+delux&search=S...](https://www.ipdb.org/search.pl?any=eight+ball+delux&search=Search+Database&searchtype=quick#762)

~~~
ryantgtg
We’ve had that feature for like 9 years! Click on any machine name in the
location details.

I suppose we could make it more obvious!

~~~
kjhughes
Oh, I see them now. When I couldn't click the machine names in either the pop-
up box on the map or the top-level of the location panel, I gave up too soon.
I needed to click on the location to expand the details first, gotcha. I see
there are also links to Pintips there (example:
[https://pintips.net/games/41](https://pintips.net/games/41)). Cool!

Thanks for building and making this available.

~~~
ryantgtg
Yeah, that first list is just kind of a quick overview of the location, and
then you get more detail when you click into it (as you found).

We worked with Andreas, the Pintips developer, on developing the Open Pinball
Database ([https://opdb.org/](https://opdb.org/)). The games on pintips and on
pinball map both share an OPDB ID. On his other app -
[https://matchplay.events/](https://matchplay.events/) \- you can
automatically populate your tournament with the machines listed at that
location on pinball map.

------
ellyagg
Love it! I always wanted to make this, but for public basketball courts.

------
coreyhn
Love this app. Has helped me track down TAF pinball. Great work!

~~~
calmworm
That’s the first one I searched for, too!

~~~
tptacek
TAF = Addams Family? If so, what’s interesting about it?

(I see Galloping Ghost has it, so I assume it’s somehow great.)

~~~
RoboCheeks
The game is fun for a few reasons.

First, there are two really viable strategies for playing it which are equally
fun. Bashing the bookcase will get to the multiball and hearing Gomez shout
“It’s SHOWTIME!” is super satisfying.

If the multiball strat isn’t for you, then working your way through the “room”
of the mansion are just as rewarding. Completing all the rooms starts a mode
where every mode just plays one after the other. Super satisfying, if you can
get it.

Second, the callouts, art, and design are fun and full of character. Having
thing grab the ball and pull it into his box is a particularly nice touch.

Finally, the layout of the table allows for some nice “flow” where you can
transition between shots nicely.

------
JohnFen
Very nice!

I thought that I knew of all of the public pinball machines in my area. Not
only are all of the ones I know of (around 200 of them) listed, but there are
several more that I didn't know about. Excellent work!

~~~
ryantgtg
Thank you! Some areas are definitely more up to date than others. But overall,
we've tried hard to build a strong userbase, and we're happy that people are
so into updating it.

------
peterhil
This is a cool service, and has surprisingly good coverage of Helsinki. Couple
of places are missing though – I need to check what machines they currently
have, and submit them!

------
keyle
Great to see some pinheads around HN.

If you want to watch some pinball, remember
[https://pinballvideos.com](https://pinballvideos.com)

------
ym705
This is awesome! I want more in Europe as I love Pinball! I'll add the one I
know tomorrow (especially there is a nice pinball museum in Rotterdam, NL)

For the maps feature I'll be happy to discuss with you using
[https://dokomaps.com](https://dokomaps.com) we're making a platform for
anyone to create communities of place sharing!

------
agrocrag
Finally! Now if I could actually figure out how to play pinball well...

Any resources for a beginner or tips on learning how to improve?

~~~
RoboCheeks
Generally, flipper skills are a good place to start. The PAPA website has a
nice guide: [https://papa.org/learning-center/players-
guide/#152269588216...](https://papa.org/learning-center/players-
guide/#1522695882169-f1e0fd96-e0cc)

It’s also a good idea to pick one machine and learn its rules. The PAPA
YouTube channel has guides for most classic games (Addams Family, Twilight
Zone, etc)

~~~
agrocrag
Thanks! Appreciate the links

------
bszupnick
I've been searching for something like this for Dance Dance Revolution. The
only thing I've found was old forums that are now outdated.

I was visiting NYC and searched for any DDR machines left. The last one was in
ESPN Zone but that too closed down.

The last one I found was in a random arcade near a ski village in the Italian
Alps.

~~~
nuliflyer
[https://zenius-i-vanisher.com/v5.2/arcades.php](https://zenius-i-
vanisher.com/v5.2/arcades.php)

This site is very consistent for Pump it Up machines, might work well for you
too.

------
sunnytimes
so cool .. i can verify all the ones in my city , i was in one of the places
last night and my buddy owns one of the other ones.

city of 75,000+ and we have 3 public pinball machines.

~~~
JohnFen
> city of 75,000+ and we have 3 public pinball machines.

That makes me sad. Perhaps there's a business opportunity, though? There are
almost 300 pinball machines in my (admittedly more populated) area, and 150 of
them are in a single establishment that combines a pinball arcade (that runs
on nickels) with a bar (that does not run on nickels). It's been doing great
business for 10 years or so now.

------
colatkinson
Your app has literally just given me plans for the evening. Awesome stuff!

------
ianai
Is there anyone else like the pinball hall of fame in Las Vegas NV?

~~~
oceanghost
Museum of Pinball in Beaumont CA comes to mind, it only opens 3 times a year,
however.

The Pacific Pinball Museum in Alameda is open daily as far as I know.

~~~
ryantgtg
Top 20 sorted by number of machines.
[https://gist.github.com/RyanTG/11b4f4442c6efc4cc58ca8eaaa8c5...](https://gist.github.com/RyanTG/11b4f4442c6efc4cc58ca8eaaa8c5eaf)

Big places like this can be extra-tough to keep up to date, because it's takes
more work to crosscheck between the map and what's actually there. Some of
these locations are actively kept up to date by the owners/operators. That's
the way to go, because they know what's coming in and out.

Also, the Krakow Pinball Museum was just submitted today. Haven't added it
yet, but it has a lot of machines.

~~~
oceanghost
Neat. You're aware the Museum of Pinball (museumofpinball.org) in Beaumont CA
has 500 or so machines? Not sure if it counts since its only open 3 weekends a
year.

I live within driving range and have been there dozens of times...

~~~
ryantgtg
I am aware. I live in LA, so it’s pretty close to me, too. But yeah, it
doesn’t quite seem to count as public since it’s just a special events venue,
open only a couple days a year. I could be swayed otherwise, though, given
that we’re not 100% consistent when it comes to this.

Also, it be tough to keep that location up to date on the map!

For now, we have a link here:
[https://pinballmap.com/la/about](https://pinballmap.com/la/about)

------
rzr
Cool project, may also public virtual pinballs added to list too.

Talking about this, do you know any table under free license that could be
ported to gnu/linux pinball emilia.

Here is a template project if anyone is interested:

[https://github.com/rzr/pinball-table-hurd](https://github.com/rzr/pinball-
table-hurd)

Thanks and sorry for noise if it's not relevant but I assumed that pinball
lovers and developers would like also to play home.

------
elldoubleyew
This is awesome! Reminds me a lot of the Zenus -I- vanisher [0] arcade cabinet
locator. Similar to this but its more focused on Japanese import games.

The site looks quite dated now and doesn't have any geo location support. It
would be awesome if somebody could give this a refresh in the same vein as
your project.

[0] [https://zenius-i-vanisher.com/v5.2/arcades.php](https://zenius-i-
vanisher.com/v5.2/arcades.php)

------
hyssop
I love PinballMap.com. I am a Patreon donator as I felt their service deserved
my support.

------
sporksmith
I wonder if OSM has clean extension points for adding this sort of specialized
metadata. Might be a nice way to create these kind of specialized geo-
databases without having to do as much of your own implementation and hosting.

------
werber
Love the concept, when I put in Detroit and clicked on the red indicator it
listed one machine here and then the next entry was 2 hours away, maybe the
threshold what what is considered close enough to the search location is too
lenient?

~~~
ianai
I think the data is just sparse for either reality reasons or lack of users,
but sadly probably lack of machines.

~~~
ryantgtg
Try [https://pinballmap.com/detroit](https://pinballmap.com/detroit)

I’m not sure why so few locations were found in your initial search. I see 13
places of I search here
[https://pinballmap.com/map?utf8=&address=Detroit](https://pinballmap.com/map?utf8=&address=Detroit)

There’s also a “redo search results when map moves” button. It defaults if
disabled, so you gotta check it on. We’re going to make it enabled by default,
since I think that’s what users expect.

Also, the mobile app provides a better search/browse experience.

~~~
ianai
Mine was New Mexico ;)

~~~
ryantgtg
NM is indeed pretty sparse. We list 20 places with pinball. 11 are in
Albuquerque.

~~~
ngneer
Sister bar is da best :)

------
ngneer
I want the same for pianos :)

~~~
ryantgtg
We like to try and think of other maps that we could adapt the code for. I
don't think we would have ever come up with publicly-accessible pianos!

~~~
ta999999171
Businesses/pubs/clubs where people actually seem to socialize.

~~~
bostik
Please think of the unintended consequences. There's even an ancient saying
about them: "whom the gods want to punish, they grant [his/her] wishes".

I discovered a pub where people actually socialise. This being the internet,
I'm not willing to say which one and where. The last thing it needs is getting
flooded with more seekers than it can handle, and in the process losing its
charm as the locals would be drowned out, eventually taking themselves
elsewhere.

For those who think I'm being unnecessarily over-protective or snarky, I can
only recommend to read this link:
[https://petapixel.com/2019/07/22/photographers-
instagrammers...](https://petapixel.com/2019/07/22/photographers-
instagrammers-stop-being-so-dmn-selfish-and-disrespectful/) (as happens, it
was on HN about 6 months ago).

~~~
tanseydavid
"Nobody goes there anymore -- it's too popular!" Yogi Berra

------
romdev
Named after an In Flames song?
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wCvq8VN9owY](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wCvq8VN9owY)

~~~
ryantgtg
Ha, no they named the song after us! Just kidding.

I have a google alert for the phrase, and have to -“in flames” or else I’ll
get flooded with In Flames stories.

------
Jabdoa2
Any chance you could enable search for countries such as Germany? I.e.
searching for "Hannover, Germany" (a city with 500k people) just shows the
whole globe without machines.

~~~
moepstar
Zooming in on Germany on the map on the main page, it doesn't show any
machines (or pins on the map, rather)?

~~~
ryantgtg
This might be a weakness in how we’re using the geocoder. If you search Berlin
in the Near field on [https://pinballmap.com/map](https://pinballmap.com/map)
you get results. You can also zoom in and check on the “redo results when map
is moved button”. Or use the app. It’s easier to browse on the app.

------
antris
Searched "Bangkok" -> got some specific place called "Bangkok Lounge"

Searched "Bangkok, Thailand" -> 0 results

~~~
ryantgtg
In Asia, most of our listings are in Japan. That's because we have a dedicated
administrator there who is eager to document all the machines. Outside of
Japan, there are only a couple locations.

------
52-6F-62
This is awesome!

It already has a bunch of my Toronto favourites and others I'd never heard of!

How long has this been running?

~~~
ryantgtg
Around 11 years. Sorry, HN suggested I “repost” this Show HN. I should also
repost the description I wrote!

~~~
52-6F-62
No apology needed! It’s great! Glad you did repost it!

------
KingFelix
Awesome!

I have used this before, pretty great stuff!

------
billfruit
The map does not allow me to browse, it requires search. That is not ideal, as
per me.

~~~
Moru
I tried to search thinking, "No, there is no way there is anything here in
Sweden". But yes, just a few kilometers from my house there is a new arcade
where private people put up their flipper games. Members only but anyone can
become member. There was also an old one I had forgotten about.

You can scroll around once you have found one location, the map only updates
if you click the checkbox on the left on higher zoom-levels.

Mabe one solution for this, without putting too much demand on the server
would be to cluster the map points and deliver just the coordinates of the
clusters until you hit zoom level 12 or so?

~~~
ryantgtg
We hope to do some clustering like that in the future.

We're also going to turn on that "redo" checkbox by default (except still
disable when zoomed out too far).

> Members only but anyone can become member.

We only list publicly-accessible locations, but "public" can be very very
tricky to define. This place seems to count because anyone can become a member
(so it's basically equivalent to paying an entrance fee). There are also some
members-only places that open up to the public once a month. I consider those
to be barely public.

------
pabs3
Anyone know if the data for this comes from or is published to OpenStreetMap?

~~~
ryantgtg
It doesn't and isn't. All the location and machine data is generated by users
on this site.

We use OSM vector tiles for the map.

~~~
pabs3
Would be interesting to add the data to the OSM database somehow.

~~~
ryantgtg
For one, that would require regular syncing. The map is updated frequently, so
snapshots get out of date quickly.

There have been 143,478 map edits in the last 3 years.

~~~
pabs3
It seems that OSM has ways to do syncing with external databases, it looks
like the best option here would be to use Osmsync.

[https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Import/Guidelines](https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Import/Guidelines)
[https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Automated_edits](https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Automated_edits)
[https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Osmsync](https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Osmsync)
[https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/GO-
Sync](https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/GO-Sync) [https://github.com/CUTR-
at-USF/gtfs-osm-sync](https://github.com/CUTR-at-USF/gtfs-osm-sync)

