
Nintendo Switch review: pure potential - Tomte
http://www.theverge.com/2017/3/1/14772530/nintendo-switch-review-zelda-breath-of-the-wild
======
danso
As a late Wii U owner, I'm willing to wait until the Switch proves to be a
success. The horror stories of the Wii U's launch, combined with lackluster
support and signs that Nintendo didn't know how to adapt to the Internet age
haven't exactly been mitigated by what we know of the Switch so far: no web
browser, no Virtual Console nor movie services like Netflix at launch.
Everything smells rushed...in the meantime, I got a PS4 to try the VR and have
been more than entertained by the system's regular selection. It's surprising
to me that Nintendo couldn't score Overwatch or a Rocket League, two of the
best multi platform games currently out, which would go a long way in showing
the purported value of console-power in handheld.

~~~
mintplant
The lack of a web browser is I suspect a reaction to WebKit vulnerabilities
having been one of the primary entry points for people hacking the (New) 3DS.
Omitting this functionality reduces the OS's attack surface.

~~~
n-gauge
..and maybe to stop users playing HTML games (Nintendo ripoffs for example).
This is a shame as I felt the Wii U was crippled in this respect (i.e. video
tag supported but not audio!)

~~~
r00fus
Why would I buy a switch to play HTML games? Honestly this argument seems a
stretch to me.

~~~
JoshTriplett
> Why would I buy a switch to play HTML games?

A portable, dockable tablet with a built-in reliable controller? If it had a
browser, I'd be surprised if people _didn 't_ specifically write some games to
target it.

~~~
mbel
3DS has a browser and a built-in reliable controller. I haven't heard about
any HTML game for 3DS.

~~~
JoshTriplett
The 3DS used a relatively deficient browser engine, with much less support for
web standards; it didn't support anything a non-trivial game might need.

A browser based on current WebKit or Blink, with full hardware-accelerated
support for WebGL, a fast JavaScript JIT, WebAssembly, fullscreen, joysticks,
and other such standards would make a compelling platform.

~~~
mbel
Well, the point stands: browser and integrated pad is not enough for third
party browser games to emerge. Nintendo would also have to provide relevant
APIs, some of which aren't commonly used by regular websites (e.g. WebGL).

------
bryanlarsen
The wired review is much more negative, if you want a contrasting view:
[https://www.wired.com/2017/03/review-nintendo-
switch/](https://www.wired.com/2017/03/review-nintendo-switch/)

~~~
JohnJamesRambo
>"At this point, with Nintendo not having commented on or fixeds the issue, I
can only go forward assuming the Switch consoles going on sale this Friday
will all potentially have this problem, and that Nintendo is about to sell you
a $300 game system requiring some kind of fix before it performs its basic
functions."

Yikes, that sounds disastrous.

~~~
Retr0spectrum
It definitely looks bad, but I've seen a few videos demonstrating the issue
and it only really happens if you have the joycon entirely covered by your
hands, or behind your back.

This could be a software bug that is fixable with an update, but that seems
unlikely considering it affects the left controller more than the right one,
which would indicate a hardware design flaw.

~~~
JohnJamesRambo
I'm not following your train of logic where it isn't that bad if a joycon
doesn't work if covered by your hands. For a real product it needs to work in
all cases, not if you put your hands a certain way.

~~~
ctdonath
Sounds like another big-name product, for which the advice "not if you put
your hands a certain way" was touted as a complete disaster.

------
VeejayRampay
If someone can answer that question for me:

Why has Nintendo shifted towards producing underpowered consoles? I used to
play the Super Nes when I was a kid, and it was the most powerful console of
its generation. The N64, the GameCube, the Wii and subsequent offerings were
all underpowered in terms of graphical abilities and raw power after that. I
hear people say "But the gameplay is what matters", which I agree with, but my
question in the end is "Why can't we have both?".

Is it a costs thing?

~~~
GuiA
It is mostly credited to Gunpei Yokoi's philosophy:

 _" Yokoi articulated his philosophy of "Lateral Thinking of Withered
Technology". [...] "Withered technology" in this context refers to a mature
technology which is cheap and well understood. "Lateral thinking" refers to
finding radical new ways of using such technology. Yokoi held that toys and
games do not necessarily require cutting edge technology; novel and fun
gameplay are more important. In the interview he suggested that expensive
cutting edge technology can get in the way of developing a new product"_

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gunpei_Yokoi#Lateral_Thinking_...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gunpei_Yokoi#Lateral_Thinking_with_Withered_Technology)

Nintendo consoles have always been a bit behind technologically; but I think
this became really accentuated with the Wii, which was by design not that far
ahead of the Game Cube- when the rest of the industry went full steam ahead
fighting on specs.

~~~
agumonkey
The SNES CPU was underpowered compared to the Genesis. But the overall system
yielded better gaming experience.

It's similar to Apple lesser RAM numbers compared to the market, yet iPhone
are still smoother globally.

~~~
OD_
The SNES is not underpowered compared to the genesis if you compare them as a
whole and not just spec for spec like comparing mhz on a CPU. Console hardware
is made for running games and are not general computing devices. The snes
hardware had many hardware supported graphical modes that allowed it to push
the envelope without relying on a beefier CPU, the most famous of which is
Mode 7 which allowed the pseudo 3d you see in games like F-Zero, the FF world
maps, Mario Kart, Secret of Mana, Super Mario RPG and so on. And then there
was this very common practice on SNES to embed coprocessors and DSP on the
game cartridge, which is what allowed the graphical effects of Star Fox and
Yoshi's Island notably. There was no such practice on the Genesis.

> The list of Super NES enhancement chips demonstrates the overall design plan
> for the Super Nintendo Entertainment System, whereby the console's hardware
> designers had made it easy to interface special coprocessor chips to the
> console. This standardized selection of chips was available to increase
> system performance and features for each game cartridge. As increasingly
> superior chips became available throughout the SNES's vintage market years,
> this strategy originally provided a cheaper and more versatile way of
> maintaining the system's market lifespan when compared to Nintendo's option
> of having included a much more expensive CPU or a more obsolete stock
> chipset.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Super_NES_enhancement_...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Super_NES_enhancement_chips)

As far as graphical capabilities were concerned, the SNES ecosystem was
definitely more powerful. By the time Sega considered the idea of extending
the Genesis with the 32X it was already too late into the console lifecycle to
matter and flopped (very close to the release of the Sega Saturn and 1 to 2
years before the Nintendo 64, depending on your region [NA, EU, JP]).

There was also the Sega CD but all it did is enable a library of not-games
pseudo-interactive movies.

~~~
matthewmacleod
_The SNES is not underpowered compared to the genesis if you compare them as a
whole and not just spec for spec like comparing mhz on a CPU._

This is literally what the parent said phrased differently.

~~~
agumonkey
I didn't want to state the obvious and be too detailed but yes that's exactly
what I meant. And is what people were trying to assess above too: what are the
reasons behind Nintendo hardware. And to phrase it again differently, Nintendo
tries to be vertical for "entertainment", doesn't really matter how, as long
as they achieve quality fun.

------
_ph_
I am very excited about the Switch and hope my preordered unit arrives in time
:). I do like the WiiU, the biggest complaint being, that it is tied to my tv,
and not always where I want to play it. Playing it on the pad is nice, but the
resolution and range are very limited. I also like the 3DS, and would really
like a faster version of it with a larger screen with much more resolution.

It turns out, that the Switch checks all these boxes. If you design a screen
for a 3DS successor with is slightly larger and higher res, you arrive at the
screen of the switch. It is also the same size as the screen of the WiiU. And
docked, it outperforms the WiiU as stationary console. Of course it falls
behind the PS4, but I think the market for non-portable consoles has been
"won" by the PS4. But while they will continue to exist, the prime time for
stationary consoles might be over too. With the Switch, you are no longer tied
to the TV. Nintendo took quite some care to make sure that the Switch mostly
performs identically docked and undocked. There shouldn't be many if any games
which are tied to one mode only.

The popularity of gaming laptops should tell us, that there is an increasing
number of people who want to be mobile in their gaming, not necessarily as in
playing while riding the bus, but as in taking your gaming hardware with you
when like visiting friends. And that is, where the Switch easily outshines for
example a PS4. Add to it the ability to do multiplayer gaming on the local
network (Splatoon2, Mario Cart,...) and it has a lot of prospect.

~~~
vlunkr
It seems like the ideal system for me as well, as someone who uses the 3ds
pretty heavily, let's hope there are enough of us to save this console.

------
CoolGuySteve
I really wish these reviews would tell us the display's brightness.

It's weird to criticize battery life without saying how many nits the display
is outputting and what the battery life would be at, say, 200 nits with a
demanding game.

So far all I've been able to find is that Zelda lasts 2.5 hours with full
brightness. How bright is full brightness? It's a mystery!

Edit: Digital Foundry says that max brightness is higher than the 3DS XL and
visible in daylight. So 500-600 nits maybe?

They also say that it lasts "just over 3 hours" with the display at half or
low brightness.

~~~
CamelCaseName
I'm more interested in how low "low brightness" is.

I will never forget my Blackberry Bold 9600. Full brightness was quite bright.
No brightness was also quite bright. Not great for checking your phone in the
middle of the night without sunglasses.

------
mortenjorck

      Now I can take Zelda with me wherever I go — not some limited 
      version, mind you, but the full console Zelda experience. I can 
      play on my TV, pick up the tablet from its dock, and continue the 
      game without skipping a beat or compromising the experience.
    

Continue... where, exactly? Modern mobile games work because they can be
picked up for a few minutes in a line at the grocery store and put back down
when you get to the checkout. Can a full Zelda title lend itself to this
pattern of short mobile sessions? Furthermore, the Switch may be a svelte
device, but is it something you'll actually carry around every day like your
phone?

The Switch looks very well suited to a plane or road trip, where you have to
sit for a longer period without anything to do, but it's hard to imagine that
representing a major change in regular usage for most users.

~~~
anthony_romeo
If I recall, a number of studies showed that most people mostly play their
portable gaming devices at home. I suspect the portability of the Switch for
_big_ games like the Legend of Zelda are largely about accommodating this use
case (comfort, extra screens in the home, multitasking).

~~~
crooked-v
I think it's also hard to overstate the parental appeal of "you can get the TV
back at any time without the kid whining about an interrupted game".

~~~
joshschreuder
Or SO can watch TV while you kill some Moblins :)

------
Animats
Now this form factor is what Google's Project Ara should have been. It's a
modest size tablet to which you can attach peripherals. Peripherals big enough
that many industrial sensors would fit. If you need an airflow meter with
temp/humidity/CO2 sensing (HVAC techs use these), that would fit. Or a digital
voltmeter/oscilloscope. (That would be very useful, especially at a Nintendo
price point.) Or an RFID tag reader. (Those are way overpriced now.)

What's the interface to the peripherals? (The base unit has USB-C and the
peripherals have Bluetooth, at least, but it's not yet clear what the wired
connection between peripheral and main unit is.) Can the device take new
software, or does Nintendo have a lock on that?

~~~
kerbalspacepro
Can't you just get those peripherals as plug ins devices for an
iPhone/Android?

~~~
Animats
Then you have dangling cables and need both hands.

------
brightball
Personally, I am a fan of the setup. I like the idea of having multiple TV
bases so that the switch can be moved between rooms easily. My kids are at the
age where they do a lot of family RV trips and we'd be able to get a base for
there too.

I'm much more interested in the Switch as a family console than a personal. I
grew up an only child and played A LOT of online games by myself. Ever since
college I've had a standing rule about not playing games unless it's social -
aka in the room.

This perfectly fits my use case.

~~~
atomicUpdate
It feels like Nintendo is really gouging people on the peripherals though.
Each docking station is $90, which seems pretty expensive for what's
essentially an HDMI port and USB charger, especially just for the convenience
of being able to play it in any room at any time. It doesn't take very many of
those before you've basically paid for a whole new Switch.

~~~
slantyyz
The games aren't really cheap either. $50 MSRP for something like 1-2 Switch
is ridiculous to me.

------
izacus
Hmm, the battery life is kinda disappointing. I'm not interested in Switch as
a TV console (PS4 does that significantly better and has better games for when
I have time to give them) and it seems it's going to struggle as a 3DS
replacement when it can't even live through a rather average flight :/

I do still hope the best 3DS franchises will make it to the Switch and I might
pick it up after price drops under the price of PS4.

~~~
raphaelj
Good thing is that you can use almost any powerbank with it, thanks to it's
charging through USB-C.

~~~
bryanlarsen
According to reviews, it depletes the battery faster than it can be charged so
a powerbank won't expand life as much as it should.

~~~
givinguflac
No, it can charge while playing when using the official adapter. It's just
that people were using low-rated battery packs. USB C can support up to 100W,
the Switch charger is 45W, so if you're using a pack that doesn't output more
than 10-20% of that, obviously you'll have slow charging and probably not
enough to sustain playing and charging simultaneously. I'm not worried, I'm
almost never away from power for more than 3 hours anyhow, though I will be
finding a high capacity battery that can output a good enough charge rate.

~~~
bryanlarsen
Yah, you're right. Quoting from the review: "we’ve yet to find a battery /
cable that can charge the console faster than it drains." So it's possible and
likely that someone will make a capable pack at some point.

~~~
STRML
Looks like it won't take much. A lot of USB-C power banks on Amazon max out at
3A/5V; at 15W, that's just about the top power consumption measured on the
Switch (16W), so it ought to be enough to at least keep the battery constant
as power use fluctuates during regular gameplay.

I expect we'll see 5A+ power packs in the future which will handle it easily.

~~~
voltagex_
I can highly recommend [http://www.banggood.com/ZMI-QB820-20000mAh-Quick-
Charge-2_0-...](http://www.banggood.com/ZMI-QB820-20000mAh-Quick-
Charge-2_0-Power-Bank-with-USB-HUB-p-1112667.html), although I'm hoping
someone with a thermal camera can do a proper teardown and review at some
point - it gets a little warm at ~40W output.

It charges my XPS 9350 just fine, so it should do the Switch no worries.

~~~
STRML
Those are extremely impressive specs for the size. Great find and thanks for
the link.

------
chasing
So I wouldn't buy a Nintendo console as my first console. But I have a PS4
that covers me for most of my gaming (and Netflixing needs) and the Wii U was
a great addition to get access to all of Nintendo's stuff. So I'm excited to
swap out the Wii U for a Switch -- although there's no rush for me.

One thing that has changed my opinion a bit about Nintendo's products, though:
Having a kid. Suddenly it's very clear what it means for Nintendo to make a
family console as a product subtly different from a gamer's console or a more
adult console, which is what I would consider my PS4 to be.

~~~
snowpalmer
I believe this is squarely where Nintendo lives, in the family space. We have
all of the consoles available to my kids. The only ones they play? Wii and Wii
U. Don't care about Xbox or PS because of the Nintendo's first party titles.

------
pryelluw
I see the Switch as a replacement for the DS, which Nintendo was successful
with. The fact that it works connected to a TV is a benefit but not a main
feature. Nintendo is competing against the iPad and Android tablets that kids
get for Christmas and their birthday. Not against the ps4 or Xbox. This is
where I see Nintendo having a chance. Parents can buy their kids a tablet that
is also a game console. Which is brilliant.

~~~
jdcarter
That's precisely why I'll be buying one: my daughter wants a 3DS, but I said
let's wait for the Switch instead. Then we'll get to use it on our main TV
(replacing our Wii U, which we rarely use) and have games that work in both
settings. Win-win.

~~~
slantyyz
If your daughter wants a 3DS to play portable games (with nothing specific in
mind) then waiting for a Switch instead of getting a 3DS is probably
worthwhile.

If, however, your daughter wants a 3DS for specific titles, you're still
better off getting her the 3DS. For example, if all of her friends are
currently playing and trading on Pokemon Sun/Moon, getting a Switch will
basically have her feeling left out.

~~~
swasheck
delayed gratification is not always a bad thing.

~~~
slantyyz
>> delayed gratification is not always a bad thing.

It's not so much about delayed gratification -- when you're talking about a
specific game (especially one that is online) on a specific platform, it's
more like no gratification at all.

------
jhugg
The more I learn, the more I want this as a 3DS replacement. The TV aspect
doesn’t interest me as much. It looks like it might deliver on that promise as
they work the kinks out.

~~~
slantyyz
> The more I learn, the more I want this as a 3DS replacement.

I don't know if that's even possible. The 3DS has pretty good third party
developer support and a huge back library.

The true worth of any system is how many high quality games are on the system
and whether they're the games you want play.

Outside of the obvious "must have" first party titles, I can't see a whole lot
of system-selling "must have" third party titles. If you're not into
Nintendo's own games, you pretty much have no compelling reason to get a
Switch. And if Switch hardware sales aren't strong enough, third party
developers will stay away.

It also doesn't help (especially for parents on a budget) that Switch games
are around $20 more than 3DS games.

~~~
OD_
Some of the niches that the 3DS owned up until now might be disrupted by the
Switch though. I'm one of these old school (as in, thoughtful turn based
combat, whether tactical ala FE or FFT, or more about party building and
dungeon exploration like SMT and Etrian) RPG gamers who bought the 3ds solely
games like the Fire Emblem, Etrian Odyssey, Shin Megami Tensei, Devil Survivor
series, and of these, Atlus has already announced that the next major sequel
to SMT will be on Switch instead of 3ds. The DS and 3ds up until now had all
the major games of the series (Strange Journey, IV, IVA). It's nice to see the
series go back to a more powerful console, we have missed seeing those demons
animated in 3d the way they were in Nocturne on Playstation 2. Can't say I
will miss the 3ds if the other game series follow suit.

Fire Emblem also traditionally had home console releases alongside portable
gamesystems, but the Wii U flopped too hard for niche games to have much room.
Concentrating developer efforts on a single console that does both portable
and home, large screen play is a smart move for Nintendo.

~~~
slantyyz
It really depends on the game genres you like.

For example, I like fighting games, and that's why I bought the 3DS (even
though you can count them all on both hands). Street Fighter IV was one of the
early launch games for the 3DS and holds up surprisingly well.

Meanwhile in the Switch announcement, Capcom announced a rehash of the older
2D Street Fighter II, which is a less than impressive announcement. At least
the Wii U got Tekken Tag Tournament 2.

If I didn't just buy a GPD Win recently (which plays the Windows Steam
versions of SFIV and Street Fighter x Tekken among others at close to 60fps @
720p in a 3DSXL-like form factor), I would still choose my 3DS for fighting
games over the Switch for the foreseeable future. I still play my 3DS a lot
because I somehow started playing Pokemon for the first time (Sun/Moon) and
got hooked on it.

I actually pulled the trigger on the my GPD Win a couple of weeks after being
disappointed with the Switch webcast. It basically killed any remaining desire
I had to get a Switch, but as I mentioned earlier, it all comes down to the
genres you play and which platforms serve them the best.

------
sergiotapia
I'm excited about the switch. My kids will use it in the car, we'll play some
mario kart when we go out to eat at, my son almost exclusively games on his
3ds.

I'm hyped!

------
coldpie
This is a good review. Nice pictures, and some real-world usage scenarios,
especially concerning battery life.

I really wanted to like the Switch, but the addition of and focus on motion
controls during their January press conference really killed it for me.
Alternate input methods for games have failed, but Nintendo keeps pursuing
this. My worry about the fact that the console supports motion controls is
that games will use them. Motion controls killed the Mario Galaxy series for
me, I couldn't get past the first hour or so without having so many
frustrating input problems. I have a Wii U and Nintendo's games insist on
using the microphone for stupid gameplay mechanics, like blowing on it to move
platforms.

Nintendo makes really good games, but they're tied to crap hardware and forced
to use really awful input gimmicks. This feels crummy to say, but I kind of
hope the Switch fails so that they're forced to go third party, drop their
crap hardware division, and put out their excellent software on game consoles
I actually want to own and use.

~~~
jclardy
Hmm, I have to disagree here. I'm actually really excited about the Joy-Con's
and the Switch's portability. Mainly because you take the tablet with you and
you have the ability to do same-screen co-op just like that.

For a game like Towerfall or Mariocart (Or a launch title, like Snipperclips)
that is amazing. And the ability to play Zelda on an airplane sounds awesome.

I do think they flubbed a ton of stuff on the software side (and even
hardware...digital triggers on the joy-cons...) mainly by making 1-2 switch a
$50 title and not a pack-in, so I see that flopping hard. At this point the
only reason to buy is Zelda, so in that regard it seems like a soft launch for
the dedicated fans, then the real launch will be this holiday season.

I do agree on disliking motion controls for a console like this, but motion
controls do have their place in VR, so maybe Nintendo has some future plans in
that space...

~~~
coldpie
Yeah, the portability is really cool! And the ad-hoc networking for
multiplayer seems neat. The joycon controllers seem pretty neat, simple little
controllers, which means you can focus on gameplay. I was really excited for
it.

But... then the January demo happened. It's all dumb mini-games with shit
motion controls. It's an ice cube vibration demo(?!?). It's some poorly-
defined camera vision detection thing. They seem to be doubling down on awful
input methods, instead of showing us good games that I want to play on
hardware I want to own.

~~~
jwcooper
> It's all dumb mini-games with shit motion controls.

Do you mean 1-2 Switch? That's one game out of quite a few games that are
coming out this year. 1-2 switch is definitely heavy on the Nintendo gimmick
though.

I was somewhat surprised at how few 'gimmick' games were announced. Most of
the games are standard controller-type games. Mario, Mario Kart, Zelda,
Splatoon 2, and all the indie games that were announced yesterday.

Edit: You're right..forgot about Arms being motion controlled too.

~~~
coldpie
What I remember from the press conference was 1-2 Switch (motion controls
barf), Arms (motion controls barf), Zelda (getting it on Wii U), Splatoon
(probably actually good), something about ice cubes (what), Skyrim (isn't this
game like 8 years old?), some distant-future titles, and a handful of nebulous
3rd party statements of support.

Maybe I'll pick one up in a year or two if they don't lean to heavily on the
motion controls gimmick after all. But I'm not holding my breath.

------
__david__
It sounds good, but the cartridges apparently taste terrible:
[http://static.giantbomb.com/uploads/original/17/170059/29224...](http://static.giantbomb.com/uploads/original/17/170059/2922480-switchjeff3.gif)

Seriously though, I'm taking a wait-and-see attitude here. The console looks
promising and there's a lot to like, but it also has some potential negatives:
underpowered, bad battery life, poor 3rd party support compared to
Sony/Microsoft, unknown online strategy (having a separate phone app for
social seems very bad).

None of those are deal breakers, but they're a little "red-flaggy". Since I'm
not dying to play Zelda on day 1, I'll be watching how things progress over
the next few months. I'm hoping for my and all gamer's sakes that it turns out
good.

------
notadoc
Let people play all the NES, SNES, N64, Gamecube classics on the thing and I'm
sure it will be fairly popular.

~~~
chadgeidel
This is one of the main reasons I'm interested. Not THE main reason but here's
hoping Nintendo continues to build their Virtual Console library. _crosses
fingers_

------
skdotdan
I reckon it will be a big success. But, honestly, I believe video-game only
hardware should no longer be a thing in 2017.

Almost all features of the Nintendo Switch could have been built on the top of
iOS or Android. Nintendo should pivot to a software only company.

~~~
nsxwolf
Why? They sell massive amounts of hardware. Clearly their customers do not
want to play their games on a smartphone.

~~~
eric_the_read
Based on the response to Super Mario Run, Fire Emblem Heroes, and Pokemon Go,
I'd say their customers clearly _do_ want to play their games on a smartphone;
they just haven't had the opportunity.

Now, if you'd said, "their customers don't mind buying Nintendo hardware to
play their games on," that's much harder to deny.

~~~
nsxwolf
Some customers want to play those games. They're not necessarily the same
customers. It's not proof they could bring their entire customer base with
them.

Those games are made for touch screens. Super Mario Run is proof that no one
will ever crack the on-screen joystick problem - Nintendo knew they would not
be able to make a good game that way. The end result is certainly fun, but can
in no way compete with the experience of a traditional Mario game.

And people will not buy add on controllers for smart phones. Not even for
Nintendo.

This reminds me of the arguments a decade ago that Apple should stop making
hardware and just license OS X to PC manufacturers. We never would have had
good trackpads or mic jacks that can use the clicker on iPhone headphones or
all the other bits of integrated hardware and software on Macs.

Nintendo is much like Apple in that they design their hardware features to
compliment the games they want to make.

------
slim
It seems that you can't use touchscreen while docked. So it will stay unused
because games won't rely on it. Apart from games that have different gamplays
for indoor/outdoor (pokemon switch?)

~~~
_ph_
It looks to me that the dock is partially designed to especially block the
access to the touch screen :). This makes sense, as Nintendo, at least for the
launch, wants all games to work identically docked and undocked. I could
imagine though, that later on, there will be touch based games, once the
system has been established enough.

~~~
nlawalker
They've already announced a game that requires the touchscreen (and thus
cannot be played while docked):
[http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2017-02-27-nintendo-
switch...](http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2017-02-27-nintendo-switch-has-
its-first-touchscreen-only-game)

I think these will be uncommon, but they will exist, because they can.

------
onmobiletemp
Why dont they make a console with really good hardware, yet still affordable,
and simply _make good original content for that console_? Look at breath of
the wild. People arent excited for the switch, a _tablet_, they are excited
for breath of the wild. Look at resident evil 7. Success in games is really
simple: make a good game. Its not that hard. Look at battlefield one. But no,
everyone decides to rely on gimicks and whats already popular.

------
anotheryou
I wonder why they made the dock so bulky... [https://cdn0.vox-
cdn.com/thumbor/MDlcmzBowKNZ425oxRfyJ1-bMBM...](https://cdn0.vox-
cdn.com/thumbor/MDlcmzBowKNZ425oxRfyJ1-bMBM=/800x0/filters:no_upscale\(\)/cdn0.vox-
cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/7803833/nintendo_switch_dock_back_960.png)

~~~
akovaski
Surely they made it bulky so that it doesn't fall over.

~~~
anotheryou
a quick photoshop with the same footprint:
[http://i.imgur.com/Z3QVKRK.png](http://i.imgur.com/Z3QVKRK.png)

edit: oh, maybe that bottom part I reduced is full of weights. Not making the
actual switch stick out further on the top might be a simple design decision
than. They could have squeezed half of that in the back half of the thing
though.

~~~
akovaski
Ah, I didn't even think about the height of the thing. That is curious.

------
PopsiclePete
I'd totally buy a Switch....if it was actually humanly possible. I also wanted
to by a NES Classic, which also proved impossible. Solved _that_ problem with
a Raspberry PI. I loathe Nintendo's idiotic business practices of artificially
limiting supply when there's huge demand. They have something like 2 million
Switches for the launch window. 2. Million.

~~~
slantyyz
>> Solved that problem with a Raspberry PI.

If you're ok substituting a Pi for the NES Classic, you might want to try
substituting a GPD Win [1] in place of a Switch.

Depending on the games you play, the GPD Win is an excellent portable computer
for playing games. After I saw the opening title list and pricing of the
Switch, I just ended up buying a GPD Win and play a lot of my Steam library on
it. For the games it can't play, I can still use Steam Streaming if I'm
playing with it at home. I was pleasantly surprised with some of the 720p
frame rates I could get with it. There's a list of games that are playable in
the GPD Win's Reddit group [2].

1: [https://liliputing.com/2016/10/gpd-win-handheld-gaming-pc-
qu...](https://liliputing.com/2016/10/gpd-win-handheld-gaming-pc-quick-
review.html)

2:
[https://www.reddit.com/r/gpdwin/comments/5a8z2t/games_that_a...](https://www.reddit.com/r/gpdwin/comments/5a8z2t/games_that_are_a_good_fit_for_the_win_nonemulation/)

------
BuckRogers
From a happy Wii U owner (mine is indeed not dusty, we use it all the time)-
Nintendo needs to give up on hardware other than the GameBoy.

The answer for them is to stream their content to any device they choose as a
premium option of sorts through their own LiquidSky copycat service and let
whatever their current-gen Gameboys (3DS?) are act as the controllers. Let the
handheld act as a phone too and they'll have something. Then they keep their
massive portable market, at least the one that has decent battery life and get
a solid answer on a good home console.

It shuts everyone up on 1080P or 4K Mario games, through 'NintendoSky' they
can just pay for whatever resolution they want and access it on their Macbook,
iPhone, iPad, AppleTV, Windows10 or whoever they want to work with. I'm
assuming they could do it on iOS, macOS and Windows10 without any gatekeeping
or royalties at all. And it seems like a really nice value-add that Apple
should be eager to sign onto their AppleTV. I'd much rather not have yet-
another device and just pay Nintendo directly per month for their service. I
can't say it's a great idea for most, because few actually have good enough
games to warrant a monthly fee but Nintendo does.

------
baccredited
Anecdote: my son and all his 13 year old friends can't wait for this console
and are all preordering this week.

~~~
VLM
Same here, but they're completely advertising driven so the excitement is
driven solely by lack of advertising for anything else, rather than the
inherent abilities of the platform.

~~~
DaiPlusPlus
I'm wary the Switch is simply too big and bulky to be a replacement for the
GameBoy/DS form-factor that kids seem to go for (myself included - fond
memories of pining for a GameBoy Color some 18 years ago) - smartphone games
have effectively supplanted that area anyway. I see the Switch as a PSP
competitor, but they'll have to try very hard to succeed.

Assuming this isn't Nintendo's swansong and last hardware product I hope they
release an Android phone with built-in (pop-up?) game controls and an official
emulator/store app.

------
roflchoppa
Can't wait to see the home brew being made for this. Especially how the
exploit will be fed into the system.

~~~
monocasa
It'll probably be a WebKit vulnerability like most initial console exploits
these days.

~~~
Retr0spectrum
I'm also intrigued to see what mitigations will be involved. Perhaps the
browser will run inside a VM?

~~~
pyi
IIRC the Switch doesn't ship with a web browser at all. This could change down
the line, of course.

~~~
Retr0spectrum
Apparently the day-1 update will include a browser applet for connecting to
captive portal wifi networks.

~~~
blkhp19
Hopefully they rushed and used an outdated version of Webkit ;)

------
losteverything
Where I work we expect to sell out......

The review was helpful to the under knowledged ringing up the units.

------
DaveSapien
I've been using the same form factor for PC gaming ala linx vision for a while
now. And I have to say its brilliant! Super convenient way to fit gaming into
my life. When my vision dies, I'm switching...uhmmm to the switch.

------
ptrptr
So is Switch next-gen handheld or home console? Will 3DS series be
discontinue?

~~~
ihuman
Right now, they are saying it's not a 3DS replacement. However, they said the
same thing about the DS, and how it was a "third pillar" to the GBA and GCN.

------
debt
Multiple displays is an theme throughout all at-home consumer electronics. We
need a technology that can be streamed to as an external display instantly
anywhere that can be any size.

~~~
mercer
Is that technically possible, especially keeping in mind the need for _very_
low latency?

~~~
freeone3000
There are several competing standards. "Wireless HDMI" is a gaggle of
unlicensed spectrum, but they manage to get 1ms delay with propriatary techs.
We've had WiDi (with varying lag) and miracast (with awful lag) for a while,
but nobody's been able to manage to standardize the standard, so to speak.

------
zupreme
Apologies to the naysayers and even the inevitable down voters but iOS and
Android have already crushed the portable gaming market. The likelihood of
dedicated hardware EVER getting back its previous glory is unlikely.

Console gaming retains its luster because mobile simply cannot compete against
consoles regarding graphics, audio quality, and so forth. Nintendo Switch
enjoys no such benefits.

There are already controller cases for both iPhone and iPad which are just as
good, if not better, than the one Switch ships with. iOS already has a mature
app store with TONS of quality content (not gaming and otherwise).

I'm sorry but I just don't see a solid future for this kind of thing anymore.

~~~
vlunkr
The 3DS has sold 65 million units. Obviously there still is a market, even
it's not back to the glory days. And Nintendo has jumped into the smartphone
space as well.

------
amelius
It seems a bit silly that they made the cheapest component replaceable. You
could, without much extra cost, have all the benefits by just duplicating the
controls.

------
popobobo
If they come up with this 5 years ago, it will be EPIC...

------
JKCalhoun
Sorry, I feel like the portable-gaming system went the way of the compact
camera, MP3 player....

~~~
flukus
> Sorry, I feel like the portable-gaming system went the way of the compact
> camera, MP3 player

So your saying they will still be bought by people that care about quality?

------
criddell
So it's a PS Vita with an HDMI-out?

~~~
minikites
So the iPhone is just an iPod with a big touchscreen that you can also use
make calls?

So the automobile is just a carriage that runs without horses?

So the airplane is just a bus with wings?

~~~
prodmerc
Yes to all.

Nintendo should probably switch (heh) to only releasing games for Android and
iOS.

~~~
jamespo
said nobody ever

~~~
ihuman
People have been saying for a while that Nintendo should pull a Sega and go
third-party. Just because they're saying it, that doesn't mean its the right
move.

~~~
__david__
Switching to 3rd party development is a far cry from switching to mobile only
development though!

------
diimdeep
Off topic: How much time people spend in public laundry? In post Soviet
countries and Russia almost all families, even poorest have washing machines,
while public laundry used only for complex cleaning.

~~~
evan_
A functional, used washer can be had for $100 in most places, which shouldn't
be a huge barrier to most people (especially people who can afford a videogame
console). Small apartments don't have washers because they simply don't have
the room.

~~~
martinald
I haven't seen a single London or Edinburgh flat (which on average will be
much smaller than the US ones - even Manhattan) that hasn't had a washing
machine in. One of my friends flat was incredibly small but still managed one.

Definitely some weird cultural thing that people rent flats without them. You
wouldn't be able to do that in the UK.

------
rodionos
Speaking purely as a consumer. Have 3 Wii consoles across the extended family.
It was good as a gift, but ended up sitting idle given the demographics in our
households. Hence - skipping Switch, time better spent outdoors, at the gym.

~~~
CamelCaseName
>outdoors, at the gym

Gyms are usually indoor facilities.

Also, you could take your Switch to the gym. Use it between sets or watch
something while on the treadmill.

~~~
slantyyz
I think the parent meant "outdoors and at the gym" as in two separate
activities, not an outdoor gym?

------
acchow
Nintendo didn't get the memo - "mobile" gaming really means smartphone gaming.
What is this monstrosity?

~~~
flukus
Nintendo was doing mobile gaming 20 years before the first smart phone.

------
nvarsj
The switch has been the first Nintendo console I haven't been excited for.
It's hardware is boring (it's just a tablet with a dock, yawn), battery life
is bad as a portable gaming device, and controllers seem to compromise too
much function for form. The Wii-U, while being terribly marketed, was unique
in its two-screened console idea (which originally came from the GBA link +
gamecube experiment), and there are a lot of really unique experiences that
can only be had on it.

Despite my own misgivings, it feels like a smart move by N to try and appeal
to the mainstream tablet/phone gamers. I really hope the switch is successful
enough to let N start doing some crazy things again.

~~~
kibwen
_> battery life is bad as a portable gaming device_

Though it still has better battery life than the Sega Game Gear! And doesn't
require six AA batteries to recharge. :P

