
What were the creepiest declassified documents of the last decade? - sbmthakur
https://old.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/ehhftl/serious_what_were_the_creepiest_declassified
======
hyper_reality
The Panama Papers are a good nomination, the "creepy" part being how quickly
it all blew over. The story was squashed by the rich and powerful, especially
in China where it was wiped off the Chinese internet. Business continued as
usual with top politicians and their families worldwide evading the laws of
their own nations.

~~~
serf
I think the Panama Papers have my vote too.

an aside, I once recently wrote an email to Noam Chomsky. One of my questions
was something like "do you think the relationship betweeen state and corporate
entities has changed recently in comparison to the Vietnam era?".

The answer I received back was (something like) "Corporations have more power
than ever. Read through the Panama Paper leaks and the surrounding news."

It was eye-opening just how far reaching that stuff goes, and for as little
outrage as it generated. I totally agree with you.

I chaulk it up to the publics' 'outrage-fatigue' at the time. Or at least I
hope that's why it got so little attention.

~~~
SpicyLemonZest
I'm not sure the Panama Papers are a particularly strong example of the
thesis. Well into the 1950s, some corporations had the power to get small
governments overthrown. If the worst thing a modern corporation can do is
construct weird offshore entities to confuse tax collectors, we're doing
pretty well.

~~~
BubRoss
The TPP had provisions that would have let tobacco companies sue countries
that did anything to hurt their profits. The TPP had all sorts of insane pro
corporate agreements that would have given them more power over smaller
countries sovereign decisions.

~~~
SpicyLemonZest
The idea of companies suing countries isn't some new thing introduced by the
TPP. Most countries allow it and it's generally seen as a good thing. The
alternative would be that you can't sue the country; that is, that the people
in power can make whatever unfair decisions they like and nobody can stop
them.

~~~
BubRoss
Did you stop reading half way through the first sentence?

It is about suing countries because they do something that effects the profits
of a company. An example is mandating graphic pictures on cigarette packaging.

------
whoisjuan
The Mars remote viewing is honestly hilarious.

> CIA: Hey Mr. Seer, please look into Mars a million years back in this
> coordinates.

> Seer: Oh, I see a pyramid and aliens and shit.

> CIA: Awesome. Here is a check for your services.

Edit: The actual transcript here
[https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-
RDP96-00788...](https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-
RDP96-00788R001900760001-9.pdf)

~~~
aldoushuxley001
wow, that was a fascinating read. Thanks for the link.

Almost guaranteed they're still doing experiments like this.

~~~
Fnoord
Stargate Project was closed in 1995 [1].

[1]
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stargate_Project#Closure_(1995...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stargate_Project#Closure_\(1995\))

~~~
lostgame
And you don't think they've replaced it with a similar program?

I personally think telling the public the program was shut down and didn't
have great results could easily be a red herring.

Truth be told - if there was a lot of success from Psyops programs, and you
were the US military, would you want a lot of people to know?

~~~
Fnoord
Doesn't matter what I think; only thing which matters is if there is proof of
such, or clues which lead to a hypothesis that such exists. Feel free to share
such.

The way it went in history is that the US started with it to bait the USSR
into spending money into a worthless project (which succeeded). Then, the US
replied to that with "what if it is real?" There was still a lot of belief in
"the paranormal" back then; nowadays we know much more about the techniques
behind paranormal scam artists.

I've seen various documentaries on these programs (including about remote
viewing and Ingo Swann [1], a scientologist), and from my memory the results
of these programs were lackluster. Sure, there were some hits, as there are
hits with cold reading and guessing.

[1]
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ingo_Swann](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ingo_Swann)

------
landonxjames
The Afghanistan Papers[0] were published a few weeks ago and didn't get nearly
as much traction as I hoped they would. A stunning documentation of the
incompetence of America's strategy in the Middle East over the past two
decades.

[0]
[https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2019/investigations/...](https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2019/investigations/afghanistan-
papers/afghanistan-war-confidential-documents/)

~~~
remarkEon
This was a frankly heartbreaking read. It feels like everyone missed it too.

~~~
bsanr2
Well, not everyone. There were protests throughout the length of the war. A
lot of people looked at the history of US intervention, of foreign
intervention in Afghanistan, and at the motivations of the people calling the
shots, and said, from Day 1, "This is not going to work out." Aaron McGruder
famously had their number, and reached out daily to Americans whose newspapers
hadn't canceled publication of his strip
([https://www.gocomics.com/boondocks/2016/12/13](https://www.gocomics.com/boondocks/2016/12/13)).

They were right, most Americans were wrong, and I don't know if we'll ever
fully reckon with that fact.

On that note, I hope people are listening to Sarah Kendzior's work these days.

~~~
Cougher
I was reviled for pointing out why the Afghanistan war was wrong and why it
would fail. The American Military Enthusiast Complex was alive and well then
and it's alive and well today, the day (s) after these revelations have come
to pass.

------
tyingq
The CIA putting implants into dog's brains to remotely control them was pretty
creepy. [https://www.newsweek.com/cia-mkultra-documents-files-
remote-...](https://www.newsweek.com/cia-mkultra-documents-files-remote-
control-dogs-1250519)

~~~
rdtsc
> "Such a system depends for its effectiveness on two properties of electrical
> stimulation delivered to certain deep lying structures of the dog brain: the
> well-known reward effect, and a tendency for such stimulation to initiate
> and maintain locomotion in a direction which is accompanied by the continued
> delivery of stimulation.

> "Behavioral control was limited to distances of 100 to 200 yards, at most,"
> they write in the letter

> The letter writer characterizes the work with remote-controlling dogs as a
> success, describing "a demonstrated procedure for controlling the free-field
> behaviors of an unrestrained dog."

That is pretty creepy. That is 1960s, and assuming CIA hasn't evolved a moral
compass since, I imagine they might not have completely given up on the idea
and it's interesting to think what it might look like today with all nano and
wireless technology.

~~~
lostgame
>> I imagine they might not have completely given up on the idea

I also imagine if they would, they wouldn't exactly want that to be public
knowledge.

It's important to remember the military is years ahead of the rest of us,
tech-wise.

I can't imagine, really, the amount of crazy shit we're not supposed to see.

~~~
pluto9
Military tech is not ahead of civilian tech except for a handful of things
that are either useless (stealth aircraft) or illegal (weapons systems) for
civilians. And even in those cases, most of the constituent parts of those
systems are extremely obsolete by civilian standards.

The idea that the military has a vast arsenal of high tech gadgets and sci-fi
weapons is a myth created by Hollywood.

------
thrower123
The Afghanistan papers recently released are pretty damning. It was pretty
obvious that we were bumbling around with no real plan or end goal in sight,
but having the depths of that purposelessness laid out in stark relief is...
wow.

~~~
unlinked_dll
What's more apparent is that the goals of the war in Afghanistan kept changing
and became increasingly ill defined. Which is comical in like the cosmic
sense, since American military doctrine has always held that the most
important part of military strategy is to have a well defined, primary
objective. As well, our greatest political thinkers like Kissinger have
repeated ad nauseam that military force is a political tool to achieve
political goals.

The irony is that Afghanistan is the biggest proof by example of our own
foreign policy doctrine, by way of ignoring it entirely.

~~~
harry8
"our greatest political thinkers like Kissinger"

You lost me. There are gulfs of differing understanding that are just hard to
cross and I just can't see across that one. War criminal. Can you see back? As
weird from either side, I'm sure.

~~~
unlinked_dll
"Great" as in "prolific and influential" not as in "good."

Kissinger engineered our foreign policy for three decades, either directly,
through mentorship, or through his writing and teaching. His voice is a
powerful one, and if you are interested in contemporary geopolitics you should
read his books and listen to his speeches. _World Order_ is a fantastic text.

You don't have to agree with him.

------
3fe9a03ccd14ca5
FBI unclassified documents on “the finders” from 1984:
[https://vault.fbi.gov/the-finders](https://vault.fbi.gov/the-finders)

Includes the stuff of nightmares. Child abuse, satanic rituals. A “school”
with underground tunnels. Fire alarm switch in classrooms for alerting other
rooms.

> _unsure if children had been kidnapped_

> _children were extremely hungry and urinated and defecated on the floor
> during questioning_

> _states they were under the control of the “Game Caller” in DC [name
> classified]_

> _each classroom has on /off fire alarm switch that was used to alert other
> classrooms._

> _45 foot tunnel under school connecting school with nearby triplex_

You can’t make this stuff up. And that’s not even all of the disturbing
things. Excuse the name in the link[1] but it’s a good break down.

And the worst part about all of this? The whole thing was closed down as it
was “stepping on the CIA’s toes” — that’s right. Where are the children???

[https://mobile.twitter.com/davenyviii/status/118786556347911...](https://mobile.twitter.com/davenyviii/status/1187865563479117825?lang=en)

~~~
0xcde4c3db
> You can’t make this stuff up.

As far as anyone can tell, a lot of people did make up allegations strikingly
similar to these [1], and the evidence that people can make stuff up without
realizing it is fairly compelling [2] [3].

[1]
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satanic_ritual_abuse](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satanic_ritual_abuse)

[2]
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confabulation](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confabulation)

[3] [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recovered-
memory_therapy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recovered-memory_therapy)

~~~
fenwick67
The other thing to bear in mind with stuff like this, the FBI investigates
stuff all the time and it turns out there was nothing there. One of the more
interesting examples is their investigation into the song Louie Louie:

[https://groovyhistory.com/louie-louie-kingsmen-fbi-
investiga...](https://groovyhistory.com/louie-louie-kingsmen-fbi-
investigation)

This was the height of the Satanic Panic. Without the CIA papers it's hard to
tell if this was another example of the FBI investigating what was ultimately
nothing, some facts planted on purpose by the CIA, or what.

~~~
3fe9a03ccd14ca5
> _Without the CIA papers it 's hard to tell if this was another example of
> the FBI investigating what was ultimately nothing_

I can't personally come to the same conclusion. This is a documented,
declassified event of a pretty dark and unsettling case that was closed
directly because it was a CIA operation. That's in the signed documents by the
FBI, it's not a theory.

What types of CIA operation scenarios can happen here that make this less
unsettling? A benevolent daycare operation for employees? What does the CIA
do?

~~~
fenwick67
My impression is that they found out the CIA was already involved _in some
way_ and the FBI just closed the book to get out of their way.

The CIA's involvement could have been anything. Could have been an
international cult they were looking into, an experiment to try and get kids
to summon The Horned God, or a brainwashing experiment, or they could have
been involved because some diplomat's kid was there and they wanted to
influence them. My point is that without the CIA docs there's no way to tell
what was really going on or how nefarious this really was.

~~~
AndrewBissell
When I see the CIA discussed in these terms, where people make all kinds of
lawless and insane behavior out to be a routine matter of course, my first
thought is "we should probably abolish the CIA, just to be safe."

------
arethuza
Daniel Ellsberg's _The Doomsday Machine: Confessions of a Nuclear War Planner_
certainly gave me a few nights of troubled sleep.

~~~
freewilly1040
His _Secrets: A Memoir of Vietnam and the Pentagon Papers_ is the one of the
best books about politics and war I've ever read

------
mathiasrw
The OPCW leak about how evidence of a chemical attack in Syria was fabricated.
Maybe the most creepy part is the media blackout.

------
zrth
Probably the "China Cables". The manual used to run the Xinjiang concentration
camps. Leaked just a few month ago.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China_Cables](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China_Cables)

Wiki: The China Cables are a small cache of secret Chinese government
documents contained in a telegram, 4 bulletins and one court document from
2017. The cables were leaked by exiled Uighurs to the International Consortium
of Investigative Journalists and published on November 24, 2019. The telegram
details the first known operations manual for running the 1,300 to 1,400 mass
internment camps of Muslim Uighurs in Xinjiang, which China denied until 2018
and since calls re-education camps.

~~~
winrid
I wonder how they get into the camps? Very strict laws targeting them? The
Uighurs did commit terrorist attacks but I don't think millions of people were
involved?

~~~
zrth
AFAIR: The cables have a few partial answers to your question: There is a
centralized system that can give detainment orders. (supposedly a Blackbox to
the People at least who follow its orders with boots on the ground)

One day apparently it spat out 24k names. They managed to imprison about 9k
the following day.

Naturally the government know quite a few things about what you’re up to and
this is a factor.

Going to the mosque is a supposedly the easy way in. Not sure in what xinjiang
city the mosques are still accessible. All I could find was locked down ones
with all kinds of barricades and monitoring devices.. I would be surprised if
there was in Xinjiang unlike eat china anyone left who would dare to go to a
mosque.

Some of the detainees are used by the state as force labor and leased out to
companies. It’s speculated that this demand also can causes mass detainment.

~~~
winrid
Thanks!

------
pp19dd
Page 155 of that Hitler psychological analysis performed by the OSS in 1943:

> "8\. Hitler might commit suicide. This is the most plausible outcome. Not
> only has he frequently threatened to commit suicide, but from what we know
> of his psychology it is the most likely possibility. It is probably true
> that he has an inordinate fear of death, but being an hysteric he could
> undoubtedly screw himself up into the super-man character and perform the
> deed. In all probability, however, it would not be a simple suicide. He has
> much too much of the dramatic for that and since immortality is one of his
> dominant motives we can imagine that he would stage the most dramatic and
> effective death scene he could possibly think of..."

~~~
Fnoord
> [...] This is the most plausible outcome.

I'd like to know how they got to that conclusion.

Apart from that, the way he committed suicide actually wasn't dramatic:

"The will was a short document stating that they had chosen death over
capitulation, and that they were to be cremated [..]" [1] which is how it
happened.

[1]
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Last_will_and_testament_of_Ado...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Last_will_and_testament_of_Adolf_Hitler)

~~~
pp19dd
Their operating premise was to assume that Germany would suffer successive
defeats. They theorized specifically about what might happen to Hitler as the
war unfolded and Germany shrank, to prepare counter-propaganda efforts. The
list is a mixed bag.

1\. Dies of natural causes - "remote possibility." Best outcome if he died of
a common disease to break 'the myth of his super-natural origins.'

2\. Seeks asylum - "extremely unlikely." They suspected he'd restrain himself
from escaping.

3\. Killed in battle - "real possibility."

4\. Assassinated - "undesirable" because of martyrdom.

5\. Goes insane - "has many characteristics which border on the
schizophrenic."

6\. Seized in revolt - "unlikely"

7\. Captured - "most unlikely possibility of all."

8\. Commits suicide - "most plausible."

Some smart people there, but they're not fortune tellers and didn't claim to
be.

The PDF: [https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-
RDP78-02646...](https://www.cia.gov/library/readingroom/docs/CIA-
RDP78-02646R000600240001-5.pdf)

------
alexfromapex
Project 1794 basically confirming the government tried to build UFOs. Also,
dark side of the moon stuff:
[https://www.muckrock.com/news/archives/2019/jul/16/cia-
moon-...](https://www.muckrock.com/news/archives/2019/jul/16/cia-moon-fouo/)

------
throw123452343
Not a 'declassification', but an insane investigative documentary.

Cold Case Hammarskjöld
[https://www.imdb.com/title/tt9352780/](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt9352780/)

It talks about how CIA/MI5 killed UN Secretary General in the 60s, but
uncovers/interviews people involved with 'SAIMR' a secretive institution
rumored to be under the UK, which was using HIV as a means for achieving
white-supremacy in apartheid South Africa by maliciously infecting the black
population.

The reviews often dismiss this as 'satirical fiction', but quite frankly I
don't buy that. It's just insane how little we know about the evil forces that
the state wrests... and even the though of an organized racial genocide so
many years after WWII is just insane.

