
What So Many People Don’t Get About the U.S. Working Class - gamechangr
https://hbr.org/2016/11/what-so-many-people-dont-get-about-the-u-s-working-class
======
sudosteph
Seems like a lot of the points the author calls out as ignored by democrats
are now talking points in Andrew Yang stump speeches. His campaign hasn't
exactly taken off, but it's certainly struck a nerve with at least some folks.
I expect we will start to see this sort of left-populism continue to grow,
with UBI specifically becoming more popular as a counter to the perceived
unfairness of means tested.

One particular subject that this article mentions, and that I didn't initially
agree with until I read one of Yang's books - is the notion that human labor
markets are actually very inelastic, and don't self correct easily. People
choose jobs for reasons that are often based on identity, not on economics. I
may not agree with this particular author's point on masculinity being why
Hillary lost - I do agree that is the root cause for many working men not
taking pink collar jobs even if desperate. The reverse happens too - many
women would never work construction or truck driving even if it pays well.
With that in mind, it is fundamentally much easier to craft policy that
provides alternative jobs and income opportunities than it is to change a
person's sense of identity or society's sense of masculinity. So again, it
comes back to economic policy (like UBI) needng to be front and center.

One last thing - many working class people are enterprising and do want to
start businesses, even if that's impractical. Min wage increases and paid time
off don't help you do that, and they also dont mean anything for people who
work gig jobs / contract to pay the bills. So while UBI isn't perfect, it does
appeal to that aspirational element more than other left economic policies.

~~~
foogazi
> Seems like a lot of the points the author calls out as ignored by democrats
> are now talking points in Andrew Yang stump speeches.

Not sure how getting government handouts squares with people that want to do
“manly work”

~~~
sudosteph
Look at how Yang is branding it though - he never calls it a "handout" or
"welfare" \- it's a "freedom dividend" for "citizen stakeholders". As goofy as
that sounds (to me at least) - he's intentionally using capitalistic terms
give listeners some mental distance between "thing I received because people
felt bad for me(handout)" and "thing I am deserve because I have made
contributions(dividend)".

And the masculinity thing was mostly in regards to why retraining attempts
frequently fail even if there is demand.

He said this recently, and though it's overly simplistic - I think it does
kinda capture the resistance that people do have to changing their ideas of
themselves and their work dramatically.

> “I was just at a truck stop in Iowa,” Andrew Yang says on Fox. He says if
> you told those truckers you were going to retrain them to be computer
> programmers, they “would be more likely to punch you in the face than to
> sign up.”

------
93po
>Isn’t what happened to Clinton unfair? Of course it is. It is unfair that she
wasn’t a plausible candidate until she was so overqualified she was suddenly
unqualified due to past mistakes

Hah. How is HRC royally screwing up multiple times in the national spotlight
and her losing as a result "unfair"?

> The election shows that sexism retains a deeper hold than most imagined.

Citation needed. This argument is as tiring and boring as the Russian
conspiracy theory

~~~
oceanghost
She subverted the nomination of a more popular candidate (Bernie Sanders),
called anyone who didn't support her (her potential voters) "deplorable" then
dared the country to vote for Trump, and the country called her bluff. She
_still_ might have won without Russian interference, but, if there were no
illegal e-mail servers to hack, she wouldn't have been in that situation.

~~~
Sohcahtoa82
> called anyone who didn't support her (her potential voters) "deplorable"

Not quite accurate.

The exact quote is:

"You know, to just be grossly generalistic, you could put half of Trump's
supporters into what I call the basket of deplorables. (Laughter/applause)
Right? (Laughter/applause) They're racist, sexist, homophobic, xenophobic –
Islamophobic – you name it."

While "half" might be an exaggeration, I don't think she's generally wrong.
Patriot Prayer, Proud Boys, all these other white supremacy groups, they're
all right-wing and love Trump.

~~~
oceanghost
I think you underestimate the number of people who urgently need real,
substantive change in this country.

Voting for Hillary is not palatable to those people.

~~~
Sohcahtoa82
> I think you underestimate the number of people who urgently need real,
> substantive change in this country.

I don't. I just disagree with what "change" they need. It's pretty silly to
think that a rich corporate CEO and reality TV star would have the best
interests of blue collar workers in mind. He preyed on their prejudices to
earn votes.

------
Mathnerd314
[2016], previously
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12938039](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12938039)

~~~
downerending
It'd be very interesting to see a dispassionate update on what has changed and
what hasn't in the last three-plus years. (My guess: not much.)

I grew up surrounded by these people, and I miss them. They were crusty and
had many problems, but they were also the salt of the earth in a way hard to
imagine these days. Mostly blue-collar Democrats. Picture Mike Rowe's show
maybe.

One in our neighborhood, who lived on a main road, would regularly invite
hobos (homeless, for you kids) to their family dinner table, feed them a hot
meal, and send them on their way. Not particularly from some religious
motivation. Rather, it was more like "We're all Americans, and we stick up for
each other". That's an ethos, a feeling, that we all (and Democrats in
particular) need to recapture, in my opinion.

~~~
dfxm12
_Rather, it was more like "We're all Americans, and we stick up for each
other". That's an ethos, a feeling, that we all (and Democrats in particular)
need to recapture, in my opinion._

When you say Democrats, do you mean voters and/or politicians? Why do you
think they don't, in particular, stick up for Americans?

------
atwebb
A bit of a reminder that things don't move as fast as we think they might:

>Otto just delivered the first self-driving truck shipment. In a few short
years, the most common job in what was it, 30 or so states? It'll be all but
gone.

------
goodoldneon
Wow. That should be required reading.

------
otterley
(2016)

