

Netflix takes gamble with Epix film cull - martin_
http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-34110968

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seer
I feel so sad for people forced to use the legal distribution channels - it
must be such a chore to have to be informed which movie or series is available
on which channel, have to switch between different apps / recommendation
engines and have pay to every single middle men his toll, when their part
could very well be free.

Using pirate solutions seems such a great experience in comparison - a global
free peer to peer distribution channel with incredible bandwidth, availability
and full catalog of most of human produced media, one click away. Services
that are so resilient that are actually designed to withstand multiple
governments' attempts to shut them down. No censorship of media, but a lot of
structure and quality controls baked in, where actual people dynamically help
each other police and secure content.

I really can't believe an actual paying customer can't get even close to the
comfort, ease and availability of something like this. It really is
astonishing.

~~~
chasing
I agree completely.

I also always laugh at those suckers standing in line at the grocery store.
The customer experience of just picking out my Mountain Dew and ice cream
sandwich and just walking straight out of the store without paying -- it's
cheap, it's easy. You don't have to deal with pesky middle-men trying to take
their cut. Astonishing.

Such comfort.

~~~
fpgeek
Sigh.

I was hoping you were going for an analogy with self-checkout. That would have
neatly and effectively pointed at the missing piece of the puzzle. Instead you
went for the cheap moralizing, which can make you feel good but doesn't get
anyone any closer to solving the problem.

~~~
mcphage
> which can make you feel good but doesn't get anyone any closer to solving
> the problem

That does a better job of describing piracy.

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dogma1138
Epix holds the broadcasting rights for PPV/VOD/Streaming for Viacom-Paramount,
MGM, United Artists, Lion's Gate, Disney's Marvel Franchise... Yep that's a
big gamble indeed.... All these streaming services are becoming pretty much
Cable TV 2.0.

Today (UK) if you want to watch most things well it's Netflix (with DNS/IP
region hacks to get US and UK content), Amazon Prime Video (probably the
poorest of the bunch at least in the UK as here it's nothing more than a VOD
service sadly), NowTV (Sky) which seems to grab all the new films and probably
a couple of additional players soo to be important.

And this is only if you care about English language content, if you want
regional content in Spanish, French, Italian or w/e you probably need to find
a couple other providers.

So what 2 years ago was a 5.99 all you can stream buffet is turning into the
same bloated cable package from 10 years ago, get basic (netflix) and then add
all the other stuff. Still need to pirate HBO if you don't have Sky or you
want HD, if HBO Go(? or was it live?) launches in Europe that's another 5-10
US/GBP/EUR a month, sheesh...

~~~
LukeB_UK
Aren't all the HBO shows that Sky has available on NowTV? I've not found it
lacking any I've been wanting to watch.

~~~
dogma1138
Yes and a big no, you need the a pass to view HBO content on NowTV. The
problem is that the content disappears after it's been aired and only shows up
again just prior to the airing of the next season (usually 1-3 months before).

The NowTV service is very cable like the movie pack costs 9.99, and the
entertainment and sports packs costs 6.99 each.

They are also seem to be wanting to push exclusive content that is accessible
on their own streaming boxes only as they've stopped adding features for their
smartTV /mobile apps.

I would probably not pay for NowTV if i couldn't get it for "free" trough my
vodafone subscription and since it's a company phone what i do is ask them to
cancel the vodafone package every 6 months and get a new one which allows me
to signup for their offer again (6 months of free NowTV, Spotify Premium, or
50GBP for the Google Play store).

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howeyc
Sigh. This is just becoming the same as Cable TV.

In Cable TV days you had numerous premium channels you had to subscribe to
which gave you access to movies/shows. You needed multiple subscriptions to
get access to "all" the latest movies/content.

Today, you need numerous premium streaming subscriptions to get access to
movies/shows. You need multiple subscriptions to get access to "all" the
latest movies/content.

Nothing has changed. We now have "on-demand" instead of waiting for the
station to play the movie/show we want to see. However, that is now available
on Cable. So there is no differentiation that I can see between going on-line
vs Cable.

The main winner will again be piracy, one place to access anything and
everything. No commercials.

~~~
talmand
It was inevitable. Companies are trying to do their best to maintain their
business models. The customer experience, as always, is the last factor to be
considered.

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Dwolb
I feel like this move is too early for Netflix strategy-wise for non-power
users. Yes, it may be the case that their early adopters plow through premium
TV, but I'd like to investigate more to understand if people choose Netflix to
have the option fo view movies like Transformers, licensed from Epix.

This move would happen eventually as creators gain access to streaming
(distribution) platforms and platforms (like Netflix) start creating. Each
player is only gaining margin and then succeeding in locking in users.

As a user, I would have preferred to see Netflix take the agency approach and
allow streaming titles to take a percentage cut of revenue (although this
would be difficult to calculate and bad for blockbuster hits who seek to
increase risk and reward). This would mean Netflix competes on technology
while content creators compete on price. If I were an investor, again I say
this move is too early but one that, as the article mentions, was inevitable
in the current model.

~~~
dogma1138
With that approach Netflix will still have to setup the same infrastructure
and get a lesser cut of the pie with how much it seems to cost them to stream
as it is i don't see it working out.

Whats worse it won't give them the ability to control their content offering
which means they can't really steer their business.

Also since broadcast licensing is a steaming pile of shit outside of the US
you can't rely on smaller companies handling that it takes a giant to uproot
existing right holders in Europe and in other regions and Europe is already a
mess with tons of streaming providers in every country that have to geoblock
everyone else because the licensing laws pre-date the shared market and also
have to yield to local guilds when it comes to translations and dubbing.

People have chosen Netflix in the past because it was a reliable way to have
something to watch these days it might not be the case anymore. Their library
is much more fluid and much of the content is being rotated in and out every
couple of months to a point were their old 3 months notice period is no longer
maintainable.

2 Years ago i could log into netflix and know for sure there will be something
worth while to watch today I usually have to browse 3 services to find
something. Their original shows are great House of Cards is amazing, and
Narco's that came out just over the weekend and it rocked but it's becoming
not worth keeping a sub if we are all honest.

Gabe Newell said it best - the only way to combat piracy is to deliver a
better service than the pirates and sadly Netflix and the other streaming
providers are slipping behind. When I can get a better library and better
quality from popcorn time why should i pay 20 GBP a months for streaming
providers which force me to go trough 3 different libraries to find watchable
content? Heck I've goot a Roku streamer just so I could have a single place to
search through all the content providers i subscribe too instead of having to
load Now TV, Netflix, Amazon Prime, BBC Player and other nonsense on my TV and
It's still not as slick as PCT....

~~~
jamespo
So what you want is the service to be very cheap and have a massive amount of
content available.

~~~
dogma1138
I would pay much more if I could have a single place to look for content this
is why I sub to 3 providers and also bought a box that aggregates all the
streaming content i can access into a single library.

But considering that no matter how much I pay I can't seem to get a reliable
library these days and the bang for the buck degrades with every passing day I
am more and more reluctant to continue using those services. I got Netflix
with the UltraHD package and it was easier and better to get both Narco's and
Daredevil using alternate means that's something shouldn't happen.

~~~
ascagnel_
> I would pay much more if I could have a single place to look for content

You're describing the traditional pay-TV model in an on-demand world. Every
industrialized nation has one.

~~~
dogma1138
No I want a library like I had 2-3 years ago instead of a shrinking shell that
it is today...

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LukeB_UK
It's worth noting that Netflix has a deal with Disney that states all new
Disney, Marvel and Pixar films from 2016 are licensed to Netflix. This deal
also gives them the back catalogue to Disney films.

Source: [http://www.theverge.com/2012/12/4/3727688/netflix-
streaming-...](http://www.theverge.com/2012/12/4/3727688/netflix-streaming-
rights-new-disney-marvel-pixar-movies)

~~~
barranger
That deal is one of the most interesting, as it seems they've locked up not
just streaming exclusivity, but all subscription services, meaning no HBO

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mcv
I thought Netflix was supposed to be a replacement for cable. Now they're
saying they're an add-on rather than a replacement?

~~~
commentzorro
I agree. I just dropped my cable subscription and switched to Netflix 6 weeks
ago. I switched not because there was nothing to watch on cable but because
the prices had gotten so far out of whack.

Netflix had enough to watch at a reasonable price to make it a good deal. But,
outside of Daredevil, I don't find its own content very compelling. (Too much
"Soap Opera In Disguise" for my tastes. I blame "Game of Thrones" for that
trend ... but I know I'm in the minority here.)

Now they want to become another channel with the suggestion being subscribe to
us and cable to get the shows you want. WTF Netflix!

I want one service where I can stream _any_ show. Not multiple services where
I have to decide which have the most shows I like, subscribe to a few and skip
the rest. I want streaming Blockbuster/Redbox for and and all shows and
movies!

~~~
ZenoArrow
Would you consider switching from Netflix to Hulu?

From the article...

"Rival US service Hulu will take on the Epix catalogue. "Our subscribers have
been asking us for more, and more recent, big movies," Hulu said.

"We listened. Through this new deal with Epix, we are proud to now be able to
offer a huge selection of the biggest blockbusters and premium films.""

~~~
adamc
I wouldn't, because Hulu has commercials, and after years of Netflix, I find
them extremely irritating.

Netflix still has enough programming to be worth $8-9 a month. But as their
movie offerings drop, their value proposition weakens.

~~~
ascagnel_
Hulu only has commercials on their second-run (day-after-air) content from
broadcast sources. They have a substantial back catalogue of stuff that
doesn't include said commercials.

I get why they have commercials: a $10/mo. service that provides shows the day
after they air would devalue that content too much without commercials and
would be uncompetitive when pricing to exclude them. For a comparison: a
season pass for the newest season of Doctor Who (S9) on iTunes/Amazon Instant
costs around $31 (it happens to be a featured show on iTunes), or about $2.58
per episode. It does not include commercials, and can be cached and viewed
offline, and is available the day after it airs. After three episodes, you've
just about met the budget for a full month of Hulu Plus.

~~~
robwilliams
>Hulu only has commercials on their second-run (day-after-air) content from
broadcast sources. They have a substantial back catalogue of stuff that
doesn't include said commercials.

Did they change to this recently? I had a Hulu Plus subscription a couple of
years ago and they had ads interrupting everything, regardless of date.

If they've removed ads from their back catalog I may consider re-
subscribing...

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timdiggerm
This is how you bring back movie piracy

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wickes
Did movie piracy go anywhere?

