

How many of you expect to die? - huherto
http://newoldage.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/07/08/how-many-of-you-expect-to-die/

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huherto
I think is worth reflecting about the last stages of life, and how you would
like to live them.

For me I would like:

1- A Healthy life. There is plenty you can do, nutrition, exercising, regular
check ups, etc.

2 - A productive life. Make sure that every day you produce something of
value.

3 - Prepare to die. Understand that is going to happen no matter what.

4 - The present is the best time to enjoy life. You may become a millionaire,
but all that money will not buy you more healthy time alive.

~~~
byrneseyeview
_4 - The present is the best time to enjoy life. You may become a millionaire,
but all that money will not buy you more healthy time alive._

Incorrect. A huge fraction of medical expenses are from the last few months of
life. That money _will_ keep you alive. It's probably not worth staying alive
at that point, of course.

I also think it's a little sad that you're so ambitious, but you've given up
on living forever. Accepting even a small chance of not-dying, or of living
for 200 years, can radically change some of the calculations you might make.

~~~
wallflower
"Spending on intensive care, which today comprises 30-40 percent of hospital
costs, may go even higher as the population ages, according to a new Mayo
Clinic study."

Here is a tough question. If the bulk of a person's lifetime medical costs are
incurred in the literal last days of their life (ICU), is that right from a
profit (HMO) or ethical (family, loved-ones) perspective?

[http://www.mayoclinicproceedings.com/inside.asp?AID=4088&...](http://www.mayoclinicproceedings.com/inside.asp?AID=4088&UID=)

~~~
byrneseyeview
It's probably a cognitive bias that would not be hard to correct by making
arrangements in advance. I've made it clear to lots of people that I'd much
rather be killed cheaply than be a burden to everyone -- almost certainly not
the choice I'd make in the last few days of my life.

It might help for insurance companies to make it even more broad: to ask
people "Do you think people should spend tens of thousands of dollars on
living another agonizing week, or that they should die?" and use the
customer's general answer as a guide in specific circumstances.

~~~
swombat
I believe that the most precious thing in our lives is being alive, and I spit
in the face of anyone who is cowardly enough to give up on his life at any
point, past, present or future.

Sorry for being harsh, but that's how I feel about it.

Yes, spend every resource on the planet to keep me alive for one more second.

~~~
byrneseyeview
Well, I guess that's a sustainable strategy as long as only one person pursues
it, and everyone else is cool with it.

I don't know what to think of a moral system that dissolves all rights when
one practitioner really, really wants something. Seems like nihilism with a
smiley face.

~~~
swombat
I wouldn't call it nihilism. Nihilism says existence is without objective
meaning, purpose, or intrinsic value. I say the opposite.

To each human being, existence has infinite value, to the extent that nothing
else matters.

Of course, that's an extreme statement, and there might be circumstances where
even with such beliefs, one decides that something else is of more value (or,
conversely, that life loses its value if a life-ending action is not taken).
But the point is that you start from a standpoint of infinite value, which
makes any declaration that "I don't want people to spend tens of thousands of
dollars to keep me alive" completely obscene, a bit like if someone said they
don't want to spend $1 to stop you from going blind.

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olefoo
My life plan includes emigrating to the moon at age 80 because I figure the
first few generations of settlers are going to have a high attrition rate
anyhow and at that age I will be expendable. Also low gravity should be good
for joints and heart...

~~~
mixmax
Yes - low gravity and joints definitely sounds like fun.

:-)

------
dmpayton
"I'm going to live forever or die trying."

~~~
j2d2
I plan to live forever without dying. So far, so good!

~~~
eru
You haven't died before. Just do not start the habit.

------
seregine
As with any other project, constraints motivate progress. Mortality makes life
meaningful.

~~~
huherto
Or as Steve Jobs put it. "Death is life's greatest invention"

~~~
Herring
That always struck me as BS, like lying to kids about your flavor afterlife. I
understand it's nice for coping & all, but none of the people saying it would
choose to die if they could live forever.

~~~
time_management
That brings up an interesting question: if immortality were possible, would
people choose to die, and what would their motivations be? It seems that
curiosity about the afterlife would be a primary factor. Then there is the
question: would this curiosity mount over time, to the point that everyone
succumbed to it? I don't think anyone can answer this question. Peoples'
religious views might change over the centuries-- I know mine have, over mere
decades-- and it might be that nearly everyone comes to believe in a better
life after death at some point, and chooses to die.

~~~
maneesh
or just get tired as hell of living

~~~
time_management
That I don't worry about as much. By the time we've figured out immortality,
we should have cures for fatigue and neurological illnesses such as
depression, which can be treated as small subproblems of mortality. Whereas
curiosity will have to still exist in order for us to develop and maintain the
technological infrastructure.

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rms
It's an existential dilemma I haven't quite solved yet. I don't want to die,
but I can't help but feeling that immortality is a trap. What if I'm really a
12th dimensional being and death is the only way to exit this false reality?
It would be terrible to spend an eternity trapped in a lesser universe. Though
with infinite time and infinite wisdom maybe we can bust our way out.

~~~
ks
I doubt anyone would live for an eternity. Even if we had the techology to
live for a million years, everyone would have some sort of accident before
then. Perhaps you will die in a super nova accident, while visiting another
galaxy in 10.000 years?

~~~
ingenium
Well, you could in theory live forever if you transitioned your consciousness
into a computer. It will soon be possible to simulate a human brain in a
computer (see the Blue Brain project <http://bluebrain.epfl.ch>).
Philosophical issues aside, you can effectively live forever this way as long
as human civilization is able to continue getting resources and energy to
power the computers.

------
eyudkowsky
If you feel like not dying, I would suggest signing up for cryonics with Alcor
or another reputable provider.

Otherwise, frankly, quit whining. It's not like there are no alternatives to
death.

------
jsdalton
<http://www.theonion.com/content/node/39236>

The graphic says it all.

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ph0rque
If SENS is successfull to any degree, it may be possible to live "young" to a
very old age.

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josefresco
From looking at those graphs, I'll take Cancer. What did Cobain/Young say?
"It's better to burn out than fade away"

~~~
cawel
And thus forsaking (statistically) 10 years of your life? For me it's a non-
issue: cancer would be the last option of the three, by far.

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vaksel
I'm fairly young, so hopefully they'll be solutions by the time I get old.

Lets face it, we are in an exponential technological curve, go back 100 years,
and probably 90% of stuff in your house didn't even exist back then.

Then take into account that people want to live forever. So hopefully in the
next 100 years(I'm 20 now, but chances are the current generation will most
likely live to be 150), we'll develop something that can either rejuvenate us,
or store our memories, or cloning.

~~~
cawel
_we'll develop something that can either rejuvenate us, [...] or cloning._

I never understood how cloning could make someone live longer. If you can't
transfer your soul/conscience into the clone, it's not going to get you
anywhere.

~~~
mrdorian
well,for a heart failure patient,he could have a new cloned heart!

~~~
cawel
Just like in the movie The Island, where a powerful insurance company has
clones of all its customers. Those clones stand ready to provide for potential
failing organs in the body of their real-life counterparts.

Immoral as a concept. Excellent as a sci-fi movie scenario.

------
nazgulnarsil
here lies nazgul, the world's oldest man. No one knows how long ago he was
born, but some say as far back as the 20th century. He died peacefully in his
sleep after a strenuous night, several of his girlfriends reported. :p

------
garethnelsonuk
If I read the literal question here (ignoring the article), my response is: "I
expect to die at some point, horrible horrible reality - but i'm going to
fight against it with all i've got"

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helveticaman
Hackers never die...they're just slowly overwritten.

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edw519
I want to die like my grandfather: in my sleep, not screaming and yelling like
everyone else in the car.

~~~
BrandonM
Har har. Old joke.

~~~
BrandonM
For whoever voted me down:

    
    
      1. The joke is old and I assumed that most of us have heard it before
      2a. What he said really didn't comment on the article
      2b. Therefore, I felt the comment didn't add anything
      2c. I would, however, automatically expect to see such a comment on Reddit
      3. The fact that it's being voted up (5 at this point) disappointed me
      4. I voted him down. People always complain when they are voted down without explanation 
      5. I intended my previous comment to explain why I voted him down
    

That's all. I could make the leap and say that the quality of comments here is
going down, but that might be going too far for everyone's tastes.

~~~
webwright
If everyone explained their downvote in comments, how crappy do you think this
site would be? Please don't.

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sant0sk1
There is a way to liver forever, but it cannot be achieved through scientific
endeavor.

~~~
huherto
Yes it can. Think of Newton, Galileo, Einstein, etc. ;-)

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aggieben
I do.

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time_management
I thought this was going to be an article about the singularity.

I believe reincarnation is the most likely afterlife, so I'd much rather have
a young, quick death than rot away slowly, in order to occupy the smallest
proportion of my time with bodily failure. Frailty I can deal with, but
dementia sucks. On the other hand, I don't want to die too young, because I
haven't lived a complete life yet.

I think the reason why cancer gets a bad rap, even though it has the most
desirable dropoff curve, is that it can strike anyone at any time, regardless
of age and lifestyle. Therefore, it scares the hell out of us, all of us, in a
way that heart disease doesn't. (I'm 25.)

I expect to live to be about 80, working and exercising the whole way to that
point. I think that the lifespan itself won't have increased by much by the
time I get there (average will be 85-90) but that late-end quality of life
will be a lot better.

~~~
jey
" _I believe reincarnation is the most likely afterlife_ "

Why?

~~~
time_management
It makes the most sense intuitively, and it's the only one I've seen evidence
(e.g. the work of Ian Stevenson) for.

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ajkirwin
Frankly, I am quite happy to die. To know that, all my achievements and all my
failures, eventually, will cease to matter.

To know that I too will give way to the next generation and that, hopefully,
they can make up for my follies and mistakes, because we are none of us
perfect.

And I hope that, as things progress and I get older and progressively more
sick, that should I tire of my body, I can choose to leave life at a time and
place of my choosing.

Of course, with the way things are going, I'll be in my 50s and the only way
to do it will be to run my wheelchair off a cliff. (I couldn't end this on a
non-cynical note, it just wouldn't be me!)

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TweedHeads
This is the only poll with 100% positives and 100% accuracy

~~~
inklesspen
Really? I don't expect to die.

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lst
Taboo!!

