
Raspberry Pi touch display - benn_88
https://www.raspberrypi.org/blog/the-eagerly-awaited-raspberry-pi-display/
======
rasz_pl
2 years and instead of adapting one of PLENTY DSI screens they opt for
convoluted DSI to parallel conversion, with 10 year old resolution to boot,
color me not impressed :(

This is just like when they released camera module. Instead of opening MIPI
interface to the developers they shipped binary blob locked to one particular
camera module from one vendor, because fuck you thats why (well, actually one
of rpi/broadcom engineers said something like "people wouldnt be able to
figure out how to color correct/debayer because its trade secret of camera
module manufacturers, so why bother")

------
omnibrain
I'm dreaming of general availability of touch enabled e-paper/e-ink displays.
Not just for the Raspberry Pi, but especially with it I would be one step
closer to my always-on home dashboard.

~~~
robgibbons
I would personally pay a lot for an e-paper based laptop specifically for text
editing. For writers, or programmers, I don't think you can beat e-paper. No
eye-strain, outstanding battery life, perfect visibility in direct sunlight...

~~~
masklinn
Pixel Qi tried and failed, though you can still buy 3Qi panels (IIRC 7" or
10") from tripuso (who bought the rights when Pixel Qi folded) and swap the
display of a corresponding-size notebook.

~~~
Vexs
Nice! I've never heard of those. Pretty expensive for a 10" monitor though,
found them on aliexpress/alibaba for ~100$. Adafruit stocks them too for 180$,
but with a driver board included.

------
tudorw
Before shooting this down as expensive can we stick to comparing like with
like, the device is intended to have a long life span so educators can build
quality teaching resources based on the platform.

~~~
rwmj
Expensive? $60 seems really cheap.

~~~
dagw
There are a ton of Chinese brands that sell rasperryPi compatible touch
screens (of very varying quality) at half the price. That being said if I
actually needed a touch screen for a rasperryPi I wouldn't hesitate to spend
$60 on an official screen and save myself a lot of potential hassle.

~~~
Yaggo
The most of cheap "rasperryPi compatible touch screens" use SPI interface
(GPIO) which has very limited data rate, only suitable for 320x240 / low FPS
graphics without any kind of HW acceleration. HDMI compatible touch screen are
typically more expensive than $60.

The official RPi display is great because it uses the onboard display
connector (which has been useless this far).

~~~
userbinator
_typically more expensive than $60_

No, you can certainly get them for less than that:

[http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Tontec-7-Raspberry-Pi-LCD-
Tou...](http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Tontec-7-Raspberry-Pi-LCD-Touch-Screen-
Display-TFT-Monitor-AT070TN90-with-Touchscreen-Kit-HDMI-VGA/1692887583.html)

~~~
Gracana
The $60 RPi screen is higher resolution, mounts with four screws (vs this one
with three separate PCBs plus the LCD), and has an interface designed to be
controlled by the RPi GPIO pins. I don't think saving $17 is worth losing all
of that.

~~~
ne0n
These are 7-inch capacitive touch screens, less than $70 from amazon prime,
same resolution (800x480), mount with 4 screws, and use HDMI for video and USB
for power/touchscreen. The downside is that the touchscreen drivers are
binaries. Somebody online made an open source driver that appears to work
perfectly, so if you're not using Raspbian or something else their binaries
are made for, you might have some driver hacking to do.

[http://www.amazon.com/Waveshare-Capacitive-Interface-
Android...](http://www.amazon.com/Waveshare-Capacitive-Interface-
Android4-2-2-Beaglebone/dp/B00XV9QDNK) [http://www.amazon.com/SainSmart-Touch-
Screen-Display-Raspber...](http://www.amazon.com/SainSmart-Touch-Screen-
Display-Raspberry/dp/B00XXOUIE8)

[http://www.april1985.com/post/2015-06-28-hack-waveshare-
touc...](http://www.april1985.com/post/2015-06-28-hack-waveshare-touchscreen/)

------
veli_joza
Even though most people will use RPi as headless server or connect it to TV,
it is good to have a decent "default" display option that works out of the
box. The display looks very elegant in provided photos. It should be a great
choice for hobby projects.

~~~
netcan
I'm not sure "most people will use it with X" makes sense as way of thinking
about RPi. It's for tinkering and learning and plugging into your projects. As
a starting point, 7” Touchscreen seems like a pretty good way to go for
versatility.

I like how this lets people just tape a RPi to a screen to make a tablet. Nice
first step for young tinkerers. Step 2, lasers.

------
microman
I use RPis for bespoke installations for clients. One of the problems has been
offering an easy way to make adjustments to the apps the RPi is running
without a keyboard/mouse/monitor setup or having to SSH in. This is a great
way to offer the ability to make changes. Looking forward to trying one out

~~~
err4nt
What kinds of installations do you use these in for clients? Automation?
Communication? As a small server?

I have a RPi sitting here and I'm not sure what to do with it!

~~~
elcct
I once created password less WiFi hot spot and served weird texts instead of
websites. For example if someone went to google.com, a person received "No
Google for you today" message instead...

~~~
dalanmiller
Haha, this is great. Do you still have it going? How did you make it work?

------
HNcow
A lot of people are comparing this to just buying an Android tablet and saying
it doesn't make sense. You're probably right :)! The Pi has so many more use
cases outside of just typical Android use however that this product does make
sense for.

My example is that you can rig the Pi to work with your own Receiver as a wifi
flac player with this device:
[https://www.hifiberry.com/](https://www.hifiberry.com/). You have to control
it over wi-fi, but having a console that I can go up to and interact with will
be awesome. Also will be great for people like my Father-in-law, I wanted to
build him a device that has all 60s/70s/80s rock for christmas, but I didn't
want to have to set-up a wifi router and get a device for him just to control
it.

------
antouank
Could you possibly buy only the connecting PCB module, and use a touch screen
from a bricked mobile phone or tablet? Many of those lying around...

~~~
analog31
The trouble with recycling parts like that, is that the more mass-produced
something is, the more likely to have idiosyncratic connectors and signal
formats that mere mortals can't find out how to hook up and program.

~~~
userbinator
Actually, unless you're deliberately looking at the companies who like to
invent their own proprietariness, they're more likely to have standard
connectors and protocols; consider laptop displays, for example. The ones
designing the laptop want to be able to use displays from different
manufacturers, and the display manufacturers want their products usable in as
many laptops as possible. This leads to standards, both normative and de-
facto, and there being only a small number of variations.

I'm not as familiar with mobile device displays but given that standards like
MIPI DSI exist, I suspect it's a similar situation.

------
agumonkey
HN hug => [https://archive.is/GBqGR](https://archive.is/GBqGR)

included video
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6HvWXQsBeHk](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6HvWXQsBeHk)

------
nakedrobot2
this seems expensive, considering you can buy a whole android tablet for this
price.

~~~
GordonS
"When looking for a device, we needed to look for what are termed ‘Industrial’
LCD displays. These tend to have better-quality metrics and guaranteed
availability"

This explains the $60 price, which I personally find to be great value.

~~~
userbinator
Look up the Innolux AT070TN90/92\. It's been in production since 2009 and will
be until at least 2023. There are people using it with the RPi, and no, it
does not cost anywhere near $60.

[http://www.buydisplay.com/default/7-inch-lcd-screen-tft-
disp...](http://www.buydisplay.com/default/7-inch-lcd-screen-tft-display-
module-wvga-800x480-at070tn90-at070tn92)

First one to do a teardown can tell us what panel it contains. I'm almost
willing to bet it's that one, as the specs are close.

~~~
Renaud
Quite cheap but to compare, you also need to add the cost of the touchscreen
and the board to drive all this, and your result would probably not pass EMC
requirements (for a hobby project, you wouldn't care).

Still cheaper to source these parts yourself, you are right, but the official
screen isn't meant to be the cheapest, it's meant to be cheap enough to be
affordable, to workout-of-the-box, to be reliable, of good quality and have
some guaranteed availability.

You can work with other screens and build and write your own interface if
that's part of the pleasure you get from hacking on these devices, but for
people who have other goals, being able to get an affordable screen that just
works allows them to spend their time on other parts of their project.

It's good to have choice.

~~~
makomk
They provide a model with a touchscreen for an extra $7. However, you can't
work with other screens and build and write your own interface because on the
Pi, all the display modesetting is handled by the closed-source binary blob
running on the undocumented parts of the GPU, and the RPi Foundation won't
enable DSI connector support in it for anything other than the official screen
they sell. It's a fairly common hobbyist thing to do on more open boards, it's
just not possible on the Pi.

------
dharma1
Does anyone know why Android devices don't video inputs, or even aftermarket
way of getting video in cheaply? They would be super useful as small screens
for various applications

~~~
malexw
When I used to work on those devices, the arguments went something like this:

"Adding video input means we need an additional connector on the device, which
the Industrial Design guys hate."

"We could multiplex the signal, but then we need some kind of proprietary
connector and the additional cost of that circuitry."

"How many customers want to record video from an external source anyway? It's
not worth adding $5 to the MSRP for a feature that isn't going to get used."

~~~
digi_owl
Hopefully we will see less of those arguments as USB-C gets more available.

~~~
dharma1
usb-c should do video out, but how about video in?

~~~
digi_owl
The wires themselves are agnostic, its all a matter of protocol choice.

------
andyjohnson0
Doesn't seen to be in stock yet at RS or Farnell in the UK.

~~~
whiskers
We have stock and ship from the UK to most worldwide destinations:
[https://shop.pimoroni.com/products/raspberry-
pi-7-touchscree...](https://shop.pimoroni.com/products/raspberry-
pi-7-touchscreen-display-with-frame)

We sell it with our own stand solution (in six colours!) that is manufactured
by us in our workshop in Sheffield, UK.

~~~
SmellyGeekBoy
Vote of confidence here from a longtime Pimoroni customer. Really great
company to do business with. Keep up the good work!

~~~
jsingleton
Seconded. I've got lots of stuff from them.

They also run the official swag store. You can order the display on there.
[http://swag.raspberrypi.org/products/raspberry-pi-7-inch-
tou...](http://swag.raspberrypi.org/products/raspberry-pi-7-inch-touchscreen-
display)

I ordered a Sense HAT from them recently and it arrived in a couple of days.
It's pretty fun BTW, my thoughts are here: [https://unop.uk/dev/raspberry-pi-
sense-hat](https://unop.uk/dev/raspberry-pi-sense-hat)

------
dang
Also
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10184508](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10184508).

------
mentos
Anyone use an e-ink display for programming? Not sure how well Visual Studio
would perform on one?

------
teekert
Wow, I wanted to use that top image on my site and found out it was 1.8MB and
more than 4700 pix wide! Nice way to increase the server load ;)
([https://www.raspberrypi.org/wp-
content/uploads/2015/09/front...](https://www.raspberrypi.org/wp-
content/uploads/2015/09/front-centred.jpg))

------
mrmondo
Was excited until I saw the resolution - 800x600 will struggle to view most
websites, given the resolution it seems rather expensive for $60.

~~~
jonknee
It will view most websites just fine considering the amount of mobile traffic
out there. It won't be super sharp like pixel doubled smartphones, but it will
render them just fine.

------
askinakhan
How about we use the touch display with the raspberry Pi and a windup
mechanism to charge an added battery pack then start a charity to distribute
these to developing countries.

------
yuumei
Looks like there are a few ICs on the adapter board. I wonder if that means
other screens could be hacked in and if the DSI connection is going to be a
binary blob.

~~~
rasz_pl
binary blob all the way

straight from RPI foundation: "No there is no software support for direct DSI
displays."

------
jsingleton
Anyone know if the mouse signals from the touch input go over the DSI
connection? Or if you need to plug in a USB cable? It's not clear from the
post.

~~~
whiskers
They go over the DSI connector.

------
roel_v
Is there a high quality, good looking wall mount available? So that I can use
something like as the control panel for my home automation setup?

------
rhapsodyv
One thing I miss in default raspberry pi is battery support. Today I just use
the filesystem in RO.

~~~
throwaway7767
> One thing I miss in default raspberry pi is battery support. Today I just
> use the filesystem in RO.

It would be easy to put a battery + charging circuit in front. If you still
want to power it through USB you could get increased efficiency by bypassing
the DC-DC converter (just cut the trace from it and solder the output from
your own PSU there).

If the RPi itself had a charging circuit, they would have to decide for the
end-users what kind of battery chemistry, charge rate etc. it should support,
and they would not be able to please everyone as these things are used for so
many different purposes.

------
albertogplus
down,

version in cache of google:

[http://goo.gl/YILqaS](http://goo.gl/YILqaS)

------
IlPeach
Although the resolution might not be the best, this looks like a nice monitor
for a POS system!

------
stuaxo
Seeing that made me feel really nostalgic for gnome 2 and the simple interface
it had.

------
digi_owl
Hmm, a back case, a battery, and we have a "vivaldi"...

------
jokoon
I wish someday they will make their own raspberry terminals.

------
bengale
Anyone know about using it with Windows 10 IoT?

~~~
jsingleton
I've not got the screen (it's only just come out) but I assume it should work.
It uses a standard interface.

I tried out Win 10 IoT a bit. You can find my thoughts in this post and the
others linked from it. [https://unop.uk/dev/windows-10-iot-core-on-a-
raspberry-pi-2](https://unop.uk/dev/windows-10-iot-core-on-a-raspberry-pi-2)

------
mike-cardwell
I can't see an on/off button

~~~
whiskers
Neither does the Raspberry Pi - the user base is pretty used to halting and
pulling the power.

The display driver board backpowers the Pi itself so there is no change of
process for existing users there.

~~~
mike-cardwell
There are a lot of use cases where you want a machine to be running constantly
but don't want the screen to be on constantly.

I can't put one of these in my bedroom unless I can easily and instantly
switch the monitor on/off.

[edit] I have an existing PiTFT which also doesn't have a power button. I can
turn it on/off programatically, but still a power button would be highly
useful.

[edit2] Can this screen be turned off programatically without turning the Pi
off at the same time, if the screen is powering the Pi?

[edit3] Hang on. Is it even possible to turn the screen on/off programatically
from the Pi if the Pi is powered separately?

~~~
whiskers
I've just confirmed with the foundation that the display will be controllable
from software but the current Raspbian image doesn't have it _yet_ \- this
will allow you to turn off the screen and backlight while leaving the Pi
running.

So your use case will be possible!

~~~
mike-cardwell
That makes the screen a whole lot more useful to me. I will probably buy one
when that happens.

------
elcct
Uh, I'd rather see them adding a fast interface to connect SSD drive

~~~
csmattryder
Your best bet is probably going for a Banana Pi board - they come with SATA to
attach SSDs to. It's a close contender to the RaPi, but the software support
isn't 100% though.

I've got one myself as an attempted NAS device. It worked 'ok', wouldn't
advise it as full-time thing though, these things don't provide the AC nor CPU
power to perform such tasks.

~~~
elcct
But does it have a real SATA or is it just SATA over USB?

------
callum85
This is disappointing. This screen is 7" at 800x480, so its sharpness is about
133 PPI (pixels per inch).

For comparison, my original Android G1 (several years ago) was 180 PPI, and it
looked shit.

This is $60 plus taxes and shipping. I just found a 7-inch tablet for £28
($43.10) on Amazon (plus a camera and RAM and stuff). Including taxes and
shipping. Why is this so expensive?

~~~
sangnoir
>I just found a 7-inch tablet for £28 ($43.10) on Amazon (plus a camera and
RAM and stuff). Including taxes and shipping. Why is this so expensive?

Sales volumes determine economies of scale, it is likely the £28 tablet was
made in quantities much larger than the pi screen (I'd guess at least 2 orders
of magnitude).

Also, not all screens are equal. It's not just resolution: there's colour
reproduction, viewing angles, brightness, contrast and response time. On the
non-technical side mentioned on the blog, they mentioned they wanted a
manufacture who would make the panel for a long time. I would bet a dollar
that Pi screen beats the £28-tablet display on all the above parameters

~~~
creshal
> there's colour reproduction, viewing angles, brightness, contrast and
> response time.

Which seem to be all crap for this panel anyway – 70° viewing angles implies
it's the cheapest TN panel they could find.

For a non-profit(!) like the RPi foundation that can neither guarantee sales
nor buy them in advance in massive bulks, availability is the only factor that
really matters.

~~~
userbinator
Indeed. They mention it's an "industrial" panel, which in my experience seems
to mean "low contrast and brightness, narrow viewing angle, but wider
temperature range[1]". The Innolux panel I mentioned in another comment here
([https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10185433](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10185433)
) is an example of this type.

[1]
[http://www.pacificdisplay.com/lcd_temp_range.htm](http://www.pacificdisplay.com/lcd_temp_range.htm)

