
I like Gnome Shell - Thagor
http://malexandre.fr/posts/2012/Nov/10/i-like-gnome-shell/
======
rogerbinns
I tried really hard to keep using Gnome Shell, and even managed to do so for
many months. But then there was the 6 monthly version bump and all the
extensions broke.

I have two problems. The first (shared with Unity) is that I have a dual
monitor setup with large screens. I usually have at least two of each top
level window (eg emacs, browser) and many terminals. A panel has turned out to
be the most productive way of managing them, providing the panel lets you do
drag and drop to change ordering. Every Gnome release cycle the old panels
break, new ones appear, and they keep missing functionality. The only way to
get a decent stable usable one is to use fallback mode which Gnome is killing
in the next release.

The second problem is "random stuff". When I tried Gnome Shell the most recent
time, the System Monitor applet showed up at the bottom and only if you moved
your mouse to the bottom of the screen. That is beyond spectacularly useless -
it needs to be always visible. You get many many niggles like that, that add
up to a whole lot of annoyance.

It seems to me that the whole experience is being optimised for a single 11
inch screen where one program at a time is run. Quite frankly Android is a
better bet in that kind of scenario.

~~~
fmoralesc
>When I tried Gnome Shell the most recent time, the System Monitor applet
showed up at the bottom and only if you moved your mouse to the bottom of the
screen. That is beyond spectacularly useless - it needs to be always visible.

But the System Monitor is an external extension to the shell; the problem you
have with it is not gnome-shell's fault at all.

~~~
rogerbinns
That makes things worse! Am I supposed to not use the System Monitor at all
and count that as an improvement? I believe the System Monitor applet is
somewhat part of the official extensions - ie it is in the gnome-shell-
extensions package.

This is one of many little niggles that add up to an unpleasant experience.
Another example is whether additional workspaces go horizontally or
vertically.

~~~
fmoralesc
AFAIK, there are no official extensions. The gnome-shell-extensions package is
just a collection of extensions which grew together in a development repo
before the extensions website (<http://extensions.gnome.org>) existed.

From the website:

> Since extensions are created outside of the normal GNOME design and
> development process, they are supported by their authors, rather than by the
> GNOME community. Some features first implemented as extensions might find
> their way into future versions of GNOME.

For another system monitor (this one attaches to the panel, so it's always
visible, and is plenty configurable), check
<https://extensions.gnome.org/extension/120/system-monitor/>

EDIT: GNOME's stance on extensions might be changing, see
<https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=685744>

~~~
rogerbinns
I don't actually want a choice! When I use Gnome 2 or Gnome 3 fallback mode,
there is exactly one system monitor and it works. The extensions site lists 3
named system monitor and 3 pages of search results with similar descriptions.
And my prior experience has been every extension breaks on Gnome version
change. And usually they don't end updated so I have to go find another set of
extensions.

I am one of those (apparently few) people who actually agree with the Gnome
approach of less configurability and options. (Right up until one I use is
removed of course!) As standard I do not need a large choice of system
monitors, workspace managers, window switchers, volume menus etc. I need one
good official one, that works out of the box and is still present as Gnome
does its biannual update.

------
xiaomai
I first started using GNOME when GNOME 1 came out. GNOME 1 and 2 weren't ever
very satisfactory for me, so I spent a lot of time trying alternate window
managers (mostly WindowMaker and openbox, but I also spent a considerable
amount of time using awesome).

GNOME Shell is my favorite GNOME so far. I wish the extension system was
documented (I would like to write some of my own, but the intitial investment
is too high right now). I'm currently just using two extensions (Message
Notifier and windowNavigator).

------
acomar
The problem has never been Gnome Shell though, and the flak against would
never have occurred if a few simple things had been done. A lot of people love
Gnome Shell, but many more people simply hate it. But the Gnome developers
insisted that they knew best, and that they alone had the "One True Way". And
this lead to a lot of shoddy PR that everyone involved should have known was
coming -- telling people that they're wrong for disliking something never wins
you support.

------
comice
After some time using (and customizing) it, I now quite like Gnome Shell but
its sudden major change from Gnome 2 left me pretty shell shocked (arf) at
first.

And to be at all comfortable with it I'm using about 15 extensions.

So now I see Gnome Shell as basically the core of a framework to develop your
own desktop system. Not ideal, but I like it more than xfce (and cinnamon,
last time I tried it).

~~~
RivieraKid
My main problem is the lack of task bar: \- I need to see what windows I have
open, it gives me context \- Without a taskbar, I'm not able to switch windows
quickly

~~~
acous
I like the visual context too, some of the dock extensions did a fine job last
time I played with it.

~~~
dagw
The problem with relying extensions is that the Gnome team don't care about or
even particularly like third party extensions and have no qualms about
breaking them every update.

~~~
stephen_g
I think that this is more to do with just the fact that it's so new and
immature that it's going to take a while for things to settle down... I expect
that the interfaces the extensions depend on should stabilise fairly soon.

------
zanny
Like many others I also gave Gnome Shell a chance to impress, I recently tried
3.6 for a few days... but

1\. It is an unacceptable UX to go "I wish I had feature X, but I don't, so
lets go google search for a shell extension that provides it" then use the
extension affiliation for Chrome / FF to install it. I got way too frustrated
after looking for a way to make the super key not take over the whole screen
(like Win7 / Unity don't)

2\. There is a dire lack of a unsettings / Ubuntu Tweak style configuration
editor for Gnome Shell. I don't want to read a book to figure out what my
desktop can or can't do in the form of the shell manpages or help pages. I
don't want to be forced into having the panel only show up in superkey mode,
or to have to scrounge for a setting to enable that behavior, etc

3\. I just plain don't like the usage of web technologies as a way to alter
the desktop. In general, scripting languages inherently waste memory and
cycles in favor of getting something done fast. But when you want a fast
responsive desktop maybe the overhead of jaggermonkey (I think that is the JS
backend they are using) is just insane.

~~~
dtbx
How to disable the super key overview manually:

Edit /usr/share/gnome-shell/js/ui/main.js

Comment this line:

global.display.connect('overlay-key', Lang.bind(overview, overview.toggle));

Restart gnome-shell with this command:

gnome-shell --replace

It's just Javascript, so it's very easy.

~~~
Ankaios
That's an 800+ line, system-wide file under the control of the package
manager. Just because it's "easy" to hack it doesn't make it a good option.

------
donniezazen
I have never enjoyed the idea of extensions for essential functionalities like
power menu. With release of newer versions of Gnome Shell every 6-8 months,
extensions break. Like Firefox, there will always be some extensions not
working. You have to log-out to enable extensions. I don't like to reboot or
log-out my Linux box, not for trivial things like extensions. I only reboot
when there is a kernel update.

I am still unable to understand where do they want to take notification.

I like both Gnome and Unity. Gnome Foundations and Canonical should be left to
pursue their own objective goals as long as they don't destroy projects that
are used by other Desktop Environments like XFCE, etc.

~~~
skbohra123
You don't need to log out to enable extensions, just reload gnome shell. Press
Alt-F2 and type 'r' without quotes.

~~~
aprescott
I actually don't even need to do this, they just enable immediately. (Version
3.6.1, if that's relevant.)

------
Pengwin
I Like (or liked) Gnome Shell too. But to me it is still broken. There are a
lot of whys that i don't understand:

Why is it that some apps maximize, or take up half the screen and lose their
title bar? I like my title bars. This should be an all or none thing.

Why are all the themes I find broken? I found the answer to this myself. The
latest gnome 3 has a lot of changes which essentially break a lot of themes. I
dislike the main theme as i find it is too "fat". Things are bigger than they
need to be, and it makes me feel stupid. an alternate theme would fix this
easily, as things are smaller in certain themes. Sadly my favourite shiki-
colors themes are probably never going to support gtk3 and all the other gnome
3 themes i have found are broken in 3.6.

Why have you removed configuration options that you had in gnome 2? I found a
lot of what i was missing in gnome tweak tool, But it seems like someone has
decided that I don’t need those options, and it makes me feel stupid.

Why has connect to remote server in nautilus become unhelpful? I know from my
experience from linux in teh past few years that i can access windows shares
by going smb:// and ssh with sftp://, but in gnome 2 i had a nice list of what
woul work, and what i required to enter to get to it. It was helpful when i
was learning my way around accessing what i need to at my job. In gnome 3 i
have a location bar to enter a URI, which seems daunting and unhelpful.

All these whys have lead me to drop gnome 3 at the current time and im trying
to get along in xfce on another, which was okay until i found screen tearing
is still a problem. At the moment im still using ubuntu 11.04 on my main work
PC, and its just started telling me it is no longer supported, and im still on
the fence of what to do.

I don’t want to go back to windows, I will miss the terminal dearly, and OSX
is not for me, but i cant find a new linux based OS im currently happy to work
on :(

~~~
nagisa
Disappearing title bar is up to applications developers, not shell but the
trend is to hide them when window is maximized.

> I dislike the main theme as i find it is too "fat".

But you just said you love title bars. They are fat space-hogs by definition.
Regardless of theme.

>Why have you removed configuration options that you had in gnome 2? I found a
lot of what i was missing in gnome tweak tool, But it seems like someone has
decided that I don’t need those options, and it makes me feel stupid.

Because 1. GNOME is not a final product. It'll never be. 2. Regular users
really doesn't miss them.

~~~
Pengwin
I don't think its contradictory that I want title bars and thinner theme. The
title bar serves as the main handle to move a window. When its taken away it
makes it hard to pull the window out of being maximized, depending on where
there is free space that will let me drag a window around to pop it out of its
maximized state. The title bar serves a purpose. The extra padding on tabs,
buttons and menus doesn't help me much as I know what i am looking for.

I fully understand that gnome 3 isn't a final product, and like basically all
Open Source software it is available "as is" and without any guarantee that it
is fit for your purpose. I would have thought that the "regular user" for a
system like gnome was a person like me. I guess that is no longer the case,
which is fine, its just hard finding a new desktop environment that i'm
comfortable in.

------
foenix
I was actually a fan of Gnome Shell until I went to the LinuxCon 2011 and
started talking to the devs. It seems to me that they are trying to turn Gnome
into something meant for beginning users _while trying to train them with
"good" habits_. Example: shutdown can only be achieved by holding alt (without
gnome-tweak). Considering I have limited power when I'm mobile, I usually
shutdown (bootup time is negligible compared to standby power-loss on my
netbook).

That being said, I've switched to Cinnamon and haven't looked back:
<http://cinnamon.linuxmint.com/>

~~~
vacri
'good habits' apparently don't extend to having a quickbar for frequently used
programs. I don't understand the horror of that idea - pretty much everyone
else, including mobile OSes, give the user the opportunity to be able to start
favourite programs with a single action.

~~~
nagisa
GNOME Shell has had a dock for favourite applications starting with 3.0. It's
on the left side in overview.

------
Andrex
Seems like Gnome Shell has been in the headlines quite a bit lately, which is
kind of weird since it's been about two months since the last version was
released.

The articles on the development philosophy behind Gnome Shell are indeed
troubling, but I still think Gnome is getting much better with each release
and I can't imagine using a different desktop environment. As a developer who
is acutely aware of design and user experience patterns, so much so I can't
bring myself to use "ugly" programs even if they might be useful (which is why
I use Sublime for coding), Gnome satisfies all my urges. If I wasn't so vain I
know I'd try a tiling manager like Xmonad or Awesome, and those can be
customized to look decent but Gnome satisfies all my design needs out of the
box (with a couple one-click-install extensions for functional enhancements.)

Linux for the hackery stuff and tools, Gnome Shell for a beautiful and elegant
user interface. And isn't that why OS X has become so popular with hackers
these days? A Gnome installation is pretty much that, but with more emphasis
on the hacking and open source aspect.

------
PuercoPop
I like gnome shell, (although I like kde even more so I use that), but that
doesn't mean I'm going to agree with the outrageous views expounded by the
gnome devs: "Please Remove the tray icon functionality we don't use it
anymore", "You have to decide if you are a gnome app or not", "I'm against
having use themes", etc. I don't think it is the gnome shell that was under
attack recently it was the attitude of the gnome 3.0 towards the
user/contributors.

------
mverwijs
> There is of course the Alt+Tab switch window

To be more precise, the ALT+Tab works as in Mac (I believe). It switches
between windows of the same application. Not between applications themselves.
Which I just don't get.

Whenever doing anything I type in Vim in a Terminal, Alt+TAB to another
application, and check the output. I am almost never in the same application
between an Alt+Tab. It baffles me that this is default behaviour.

~~~
keithpeter
There is rapid change in GS at present, and they are still puggling about with
application switching.

GS 3.6 as on Gnome Ubuntu Remix, no extensions

Alt-Tab switches between applications, irrespective of how many windows a
given application has open.

Alt-' switches between windows of the currently selected application.

<https://dl.dropbox.com/u/8403291/gs-alt-tab.jpg>

In the screen grab above, I've pressed Alt-Tab and reached the terminal
window, then pressed Alt-` and am cycling between the two terminals. In
practice you keep your thumb on the Alt and the pinky switches between the tab
and ` (back-tick is above the tab on UK keyboard, it might be ~ on US
keyboard, my memory fails).

------
buster
I also like it, needs some customizing though. But that's quickly done (and
luckily possible at all.. yes i look at you Windows and Mac Users with the
default settings all over! )

------
keithpeter
_"The only missing point in here is the selection of a window while in explode
mode. Maybe there is a way, but I haven't found it yet."_

Marc has nailed it here for me. On the rare occasions I use the 'exploded
view' I want to be able to tab between the windows.

I mainly use Alt-Tab and Alt-backtick to move between applications and windows
at present, but adding a keyboard mode for switching within the dash would
help with organising workspaces by task irrespective of application...

~~~
Thagor
In the blog's comments, Felipe Morales linked this extension :
<https://extensions.gnome.org/extension/10/windownavigator/>, and it's quite
good. You can use alt+<Number> to select a window while in 'exploded view'.

~~~
fmoralesc
Felipe here: I would also recommend another extension that provided window
search abilities to the overview, so I could type "hacker news" or
"handler.py" and go to the window I needed to, but it doesn't seem to be
updated to gnome 3.6. I've been looking at the code and I can't figure out
what is wrong with it.

[1]: <https://extensions.gnome.org/extension/317/window-display/>

~~~
keithpeter
I rarely use that many windows!

The 'exploded' window view shows windows on _current_ workspace so being able
to select one from the keyboard means I can group the windows by task/project
in different workspaces.

~~~
fmoralesc
Oh, you mean perform actions on the windows without leaving the overview? That
would be nice.

EDIT: I seem to be have been a bit confused before.

------
revscat
Can anyone speak to how this compares to Quicksilver on OS X? It sounds
similar, albeit with the added ability of being able to manage window sizing.

~~~
donniezazen
Never used OS X but Unity search seems to be better than Gnome's.

~~~
Andrex
Unity is probably slightly better, but Gnome Shell's is a little quicker in my
experience. Aside from that, Unity's search is getting Amazon ads and I can't
imagine that's going to be positive for the user experience.

~~~
donniezazen
_apt-get remove unity-lens-shopping_

~~~
Andrex
Like most things in Linux, terminal commands are the solution to everything,
so I like comparing the out-of-box experiences. :)

------
aortega
Gnome 3 is the "Windows Vista" equivalent of Linux. It looks better? yes, but
at what cost? it takes a _lot_ more resources. I hope Gnome 4 pulls a "Windows
7" and comes back as a modern, optimized DE, with a "no 50 watts GPU/CPU
required" mode for people that don't want/have it. Until then, Mate desktop it
is.

~~~
bkor
My GPU is from 2007 or so and doesn't have a fan. It runs GNOME 3 perfectly
fine. At that time it wasn't the fastest; I went for the cheapest fanless GPU
that would still be supported by Linux.

That compositing requires more resources, yes, but IMO you're exaggerating on
the resource requirements.

~~~
aortega
You still are talking about a x86 architecture with a discrete GPU. It would
be nice if it worked fast with no GPU at all like Gnome 2 did, so it can be
used in Virtual machines, OSes with crappy drivers (*BSDs), weird
architectures (MIPS, ARM, etc.)

Gnome 3 sacrificed all that compatibility to gain some nices graphics, I think
it's not worth it.

~~~
Andrex
It doesn't require a GPU for hardware acceleration anymore, Gnome 3.6 uses
LLVM for hardware where GPU acceleration isn't available.

[http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=MTAxM...](http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=MTAxMjI)

~~~
aortega
So it in case you don't have a GPU, it only requires a huge assload of CPU to
work.

Why not turn the damn effects off? it is that hard?

------
coolg54321
I really like gnome shell. My rule of thumb is once you get it working don't
go for updates.

------
HBKN2o1MhO
You've spelt 'thoughts' wrong.

~~~
omaranto
I was about to correct your spelling, but decided to look it up just in case
and learned something: while in the US the past tense of spell is "spelled"
other English speaking countries use both "spelled" and "spelt"...

~~~
pacoverdi
I guess it's ok to mention the spelling issue as the typo is located in the
top bar of the blog, not in an obscure comment.

Another glitch that could be corrected: the Me/Twitter link links to
twitter.com, not to the author's profile.

------
lampe
i loved gnome2 but i dont like the gnome-shell! gtk3 is really really cool and
thanks to gnometk3 we have mate and Cinemone

but the best thing is elementary os Luna this is an amazing distro and the
best desktop for me.

i also like crunchbang linux on slower boxes.

