
HP printers try to send data back to HP about your devices and what you print - darekkay
https://robertheaton.com/2019/09/15/hp-printers-send-data-on-what-you-print-back-to-hp/
======
teddyh
> _Tech Enthusiasts: Everything in my house is wired to the Internet of
> Things! I control it all from my smartphone! My smart-house is bluetooth
> enabled and I can give it voice commands via alexa! I love the future!_

> _Programmers / Engineers: The most recent piece of technology I own is a
> printer from 2004 and I keep a loaded gun ready to shoot it if it ever makes
> an unexpected noise._

— [https://imgur.com/6wbgy2L](https://imgur.com/6wbgy2L)

~~~
odiroot
I still have my trusty Brother HL-2270DW, most of its lifetime connected by
Ethernet cable.

I recently got around to configuring the WiFi and it works. So call me a risk-
taker!

~~~
Uberphallus
Brother printers are amazing. I have a 20 year old laser from them, they
stopped selling toner cartridges, at least around here, but toner refills seem
to be working fine.

------
jeroenhd
There was a time that I trusted HP and their products and would recommend
their business line to friends and family. This has changed over the years.

Crummy software updates (had to install an old version of some Intel tool to
get my laptop to sleep in Windows 10) and the crapware they still bundle with
Windows has made me take a step back from that position.

With this move I'm done with HP. I would have accepted a simple and clear
explanation and toggle to send the same information, but this is just too
shitty.

If anyone from HP is reading this, tell your supervisor that you've just lost
another guy-that-everyone-goes-to-for-pc-advice. I hope you're happy.

~~~
cmroanirgo
Telemetry systems are out of control, and really exploded with the smartphone
era. Personally, I run application level firewalls on all my devices i) to
stop ads & ii) to stop telemetry. Unfortunately, it's too hard/too much
trouble for the average user to maintain.

We need to come up with a better way to (automatically) hobble this nonsense,
probably at the os level.

~~~
colechristensen
Telemetry is fine when it is included with enterprise software with licensing
agreements handled by lawyers and corporate security. Telemetry is actually
helpful and a good thing in that use case.

It is not in consumer products, period. Unless you are paying me for this
information (in actual money, not discounts, not services) telemetry should be
banned.

~~~
justinclift
> ... with licensing agreements handled by lawyers and corporate security.

So it's helpful when it's someone else's problem?

~~~
protomyth
It's helpful when the iSeries calls IBM to get someone out for part
replacement. Both parties know the whole deal since there is an actual
contract with specifics. Consumers don't have 'contract support' unless they
have cash.

~~~
mrep
> Consumers don't have 'contract support' unless they have cash.

So what do you propose then? Every website have a paywall and block poor
people?

~~~
colechristensen
Plenty of people are happy to share information on the Internet and even to
pay small sums of money to do so.

If you aren't interested in sharing information without selling visitors data,
your service isn't viable without charge, or nobody is willing to pay you,
everybody is probably better off without what you're trying to offer.

------
caf
This:

 _I don’t think that “is it OK if we have your printer collect metadata about
your devices and what you print, and then use it online advertising?” is a
question that HP should even be asking. They already know the answer, and all
they’re really doing is giving people who have already paid them several
hundred dollars for a cheap but functional printer the opportunity to make a
mistake._

...is so true, and HP are far from the only culprits here.

------
userbinator
The bloat in HP printer drivers has been well known for a long time, and I'm
not surprised "telemetry" is now part of that. I stopped "upgrading" printers
when they still used parallel ports and standard drivers the OS already had
(no need to even touch the installation CD), so I don't know if the newer ones
can also be used without installing the extra crap.

 _I imagine that a user’s data is exfiltrated back to HP by the printer
itself, rather than any client-side software._

To me, that's a good reason (among others) to use a print server and plug the
printer into it instead of a printer with its own networking; or if you must,
keep it behind a firewall with no access to the Internet. Although I have no
interest in owning one, I'd be curious to packet-sniff one of these.

~~~
reaperducer
_To me, that 's a good reason (among others) to use a print server and plug
the printer into it instead of a printer with its own networking_

That's an excellent idea. I wish I'd thought of it.

I have a couple of old Airport Expresses lying around with USB ports on them.
I wonder if one of them could be pressed into service in this manner.

~~~
NegativeLatency
I did this, just needed to torrent and install an old version of 10.6 on a VM
so I could configure the airport.

Raspberry pis also make decent print servers

------
tempguy9999
My epson printer specifically says this when you install the driver. At least
they're being upfront.

I don't like it but I don't know how to disable it and don't have the time to
look into it.

Arguably much worse than all this is the yellow dots tracking on some colour
printers [https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2008/10/effs-yellow-dots-
myste...](https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2008/10/effs-yellow-dots-mystery-
instructables)

~~~
OrgNet
> I don't like it but I don't know how to disable it and don't have the time
> to look into it.

They know that almost nobody does, so they bank on it... it needs to be
regulated.

------
drewg123
What is a good low-end laser printer or multi-function device to recommend to
non-technical friends that "just works" ? I don't like HP for the reasons
mentioned in the article and other reasons (blaring WIFI-DIRECT interference
from their printers in houses all around me)

We bought a Brother a few years ago, because it supported Google Cloud Print.
The idea was that my son, who used a Chromebook, would be able to easily
print. The problem came when the GCP worked only for a limited time, and then
stopped working a few weeks after we got the printer. I was able to set it up
to work via a Linux machine and the "cloudprint" daemon, but this was supposed
to be _EASY_ and it wasn't.

Assuming this was just a problem with GCP, I recommended a Brother to an
Apple-using friend who was trying to decide between an HP and a Brother. She
uses airprint (I'm not a Mac/iPhone person, so I never tried it). And she has
the same problems with the printer just not being found as an airprint device.

~~~
tannhaeuser
I have only good things to say about Brother printers. My old laser printer
(actually a bigger printer/scanner/copier all-in-one with the option to
autonomously scan to email) died just last year after 18? years of service. If
I were to buy a printer today, I'd choose Brother again, but I just don't do
much printing these days, and it's just a 2 min walk to Staples from my place
where they do all kinds of printing, scanning, and photo services.

~~~
kaetemi
Brother makes printers here with giant refillable ink tanks, instead of
cartridges. Still on the ink that came with the printer when I bought it
almost two years ago. On HP I would've had to replace the cartridge every few
months for the same usage.

~~~
detaro
Except HP also offers printers with giant refillable ink tanks instead of
cartridges.

~~~
woliveirajr
Mine stopped working just after a year and a half. And replacing the printing
head costs more than the printer.

------
leonroy
This is foolish on HP’s part, not just because of the reputation fall out, but
the low value of this data coupled with the massive risk it poses to
governmental departments or journalists.

We don’t know how the data is being sent or stored nor whether it’s being
anonymised sufficiently - if at all.

I would say this kind of data snooping is software malfeasance and could
really pose a serious risk to individuals and organisations printing sensitive
documents on HP printers.

------
mehrdadn
For anyone else looking to quickly block internet access from their printers
(note this is IPv4 only):

    
    
      iptables -t filter -I FORWARD -m mac --mac-source "${macaddr}" \! -d "192.168.0.0/16" -j REJECT
    

Replace 192.168.0.0/16 with your subnet. You may also want to manipulate
chains besides FORWARD as necessary.

------
neilv
When I got a modern LaserJet at home (my LJ5 lasted forever), I intentionally
got one with Ethernet, and without WiFi.

But all the cloud-y firmware features of the new LaserJet looked so sketchy, I
decided not to connect the printer's Ethernet to my LAN.

Instead, I set up a separate little print server, which connects to the
printer's USB.

Of course there are still vulnerabilities, but at least now it's not as
overtly sketchy.

~~~
mirimir
Couldn't you just drop Internet-bound packets in your router?

But yeah, USB is good enough for printers.

~~~
neilv
Yes, and I could additionally filter the permitted traffic to/from the
expected TCP port(s) and directions for each. But my current home routers are
OpenWrt, tend to get reflashed, occasionally lose their configs various ways,
and aren't documented as well as one would like, so I try not to add much
complexity there. A little print server either works, or it fails
conspicuously (unlike rules on my plastic router, which are most likely to
fail silently). If I ever get time to build a bit different router (e.g.,
pfSense or atop a normal Linux distro), I'll revisit that.

~~~
boring_twenties
What I do with untrusted wifi devices like my AV receiver and girlfriend's
printer is put them on a separate network that has all Internet access
disabled by default.

So if I lose my configs, these devices will simply stop working. There is no
way for them to accidentally connect to my real network (since they've never
known the passphrase to those).

Wifi is actually kind of better than Ethernet for this use case, since even if
you set up certain switch ports to be part of a different virtual interface,
if you reset to the default config they'll have full Internet access again.

~~~
neilv
I like the idea of partitioning by networks, as well as a safe failure mode.

BTW, reportedly, there's already at least one brand-name TV in the wild that
will automatically connect to any open WiFi it can find, for the purpose of
phoning home. When I upgrade to 4K, I might have to get a commercial monitor
instead, or do some Dremeling.

~~~
boring_twenties
Do you happen to know which brand or even model of TV that is?

~~~
mirimir
FYI: [https://www.techspot.com/news/81954-new-studies-find-
smart-t...](https://www.techspot.com/news/81954-new-studies-find-smart-tvs-
sending-sensitive-data.html)

------
stallmanite
Good to know that the world and Hewlett Packard are just as disgusting as I
assume they are. I get called cynical but it’s reality.

------
jart
HP appears to only want to collect analytics metadata for product decisions,
asks permission beforehand, grants the option to turn off telemetry, and are
super transparent about exactly what's collected. That sounds reasonable to
me. What does this Stripe employee have to gain from scaremongering people
about HP? If corporations face unfair backlash for being open about their data
policies, they'll just do it in secret.

~~~
unionpivo
My definition of super transparent and yours seem to be different.

> If corporations face unfair backlash for being open about their data
> policies, they'll just do it in secret.

Not in EU. (citation not needed, use google)

(edit: i do not agree its unfair)

They obscured as much as possible while still complying wit the law.

Turning it off is also not easy or straightforward as the article explained.

HP became one of the biggest in the printer market without their printers
collecting so much metadata.

I agree with author, this reality where everything snoops on you pisses me
off.

------
fencepost
HP lost my respect and recommendations for anything consumer level or that
could be consumer level _years_ ago, but I did like their largish printers
(M600 series). Maybe not up to the standards of the older business LaserJet
printers but still pretty good.

The thing that made me decide against HP products was the change on server
firmware updates (bios, management controllers, etc) that basically requires
an active warranty or service contract for updates. I'm just waiting to see a
wormable iLO exploit that's easy to patch... As long as you're a _paying_ HP
customer.

~~~
killjoywashere
As a diver, my personal favorite HP-related disaster is documented in Last
Breath (1), where a saturation diver was almost killed when they support
ship's dynamic positioning system failed. Ultimately, the solution was to
reboot all the control computers. You have to pay attention, but they clearly
show (I don't think it's an accident or a prop) that they're rebooting HP
machines.

That had to make somebody in Palo Alto flinch.

(1)[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Last_Breath_(2019_film)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Last_Breath_\(2019_film\))

------
zaroth
It needs to be a lot easier to detect this is happening and stop it from
happening, _in the router_.

I almost never visit my router's web interface, and when I do it's either to
reboot it because it's acting funky, or check if it needs a firmware update.
There's just nothing useful there. It's absolutely packed full of totally
useless information.

And yet such a golden opportunity to provide actually helpful management
functionality of all the devices on the network.

I'm not saying there aren't good products out there that do this, just sort of
lamenting that routers differentiate on the colorful plastic molding instead
of actually helping to manage, monitor, speed up, secure, and protect my
devices, and when needed, protect me _from_ my devices.

~~~
peteri
Last small office system I ended up using Draytek Vigor ADSL as it had a
sensible max device limit, the ISP one would crap out at around 30 MAC
addresses. The device management was pretty good and I wish I had the same kit
at home (currently using an ISP provider router).

[https://www.draytek.co.uk/products/business/vigor-2862#scree...](https://www.draytek.co.uk/products/business/vigor-2862#screenshots)

------
jawns
We've been using HP's Instant Ink subscription service for about two years
now. Basically, you pay $3 a month and can print up to 50 pages. HP remotely
monitors your ink levels and sends you replacement cartridges automatically
when the cartridges need to be replaced. We tend to print close to 50 pages a
month but have never gone over, so it's not a terrible deal.

Obviously, I would prefer to go with lower-cost third-party ink cartridges.
But the printer companies tend to be doing more and more to make that a pain.
With my last printer, you could use a third-party cartridge, but only after
you dissected the original, peeled off its chip, and glued the chip to the new
cartridge. And even then, you'd deal with the perpetual warnings about low ink
even though you know the new cartridge has plenty of ink.

So Instant Ink is something we've done begrudgingly, sort of like buying
overpriced movie popcorn. And in order to work correctly, it needs to be able
to track how many pages you've printed, and we get occasional alerts when it
gets knocked off wifi and can't communicate with home base.

~~~
kgwxd
Please stop supporting that. That business model really needs to die.

~~~
dngray
> _Basically, you pay $3 a month and can print up to 50 pages. HP remotely
> monitors your ink levels and sends you replacement cartridges automatically
> when the cartridges need to be replaced._

Ugh dollar shave club for printers or something?

I refuse to engage in thing-as-a-service. The only reason companies do this is
because they know if they bleed a little bit out of you each month you're more
likely to say "it's only a couple of dollars". It all adds up costing huge
amounts in your monthly expenses.

They then also know there's a huge portion of customers paying for this who
aren't using their '50 sheets', so wow, they've just built a model where
customers pay for a thing they don't use and they don't have to provision for.

> _Please stop supporting that. That business model really needs to die._

I would up vote you more than once if I could.

~~~
stjohnswarts
My friends love dollar shave club, and I'm like "buy a safety razor for $20-30
bucks and a bulk pack of razor blades and you will set FOR YEARS.

~~~
justinclift
Or buy an electric shaver. Mine probably cost about AU$80, and has lasted at
least 6 years. No sign of it going wrong, and I've never needed to
replace/sharpen the blades, though apparently replacement blades are a thing.

~~~
henkslaaf
Depending on how heavy your beard is, an electric shaver does not come close
to the cleanliness a "wet" razor will get you. Maybe your mileage/needs vary.

~~~
tonyedgecombe
On the other hand you never cut yourself with an electric razor. I used a wet
razor for years but recently switched to electric because of this.

~~~
Izkata
Depends on the model. My first electric razor lasted somewhere around 10-12
years with no issues, before it broke and I needed a replacement. The
replacement was a newer version of the same model, and caused bleeding around
my adam's apple every day guaranteed; I downgraded and haven't had any issues
since.

~~~
dngray
> _The replacement was a newer version of the same model, and caused bleeding
> around my adam 's apple every day guaranteed_

Those rotary ones are notoriously bad, they will cause pulling. I found the
foil based ones like the braun series 3 to be a lot better in that regard,
closer shave too, still nothing like a razor though.

~~~
Izkata
It wasn't a rotary one though. The one that caused bleeding was a Braun Series
1-195s, while the good one is a Braun Series 1-190s.

The blades on the 195s are parallel with the foil though, while the 190s are
perpendicular, so I'm sure it's the same problem.

------
tr33house
HP really lost their way. Now it's all about selling ink and perhaps user
data.

As a side note, I'm always surprised by how bad printer software still is(even
on device). I'd be more than happy to support a startup in this space. HP,
Canon etc frustrate customers by their aggressive actions to sell ink eg
software updates that made it almost impossible to refill ink

------
NetOpWibby
Nice, more fodder for my “fuck HP” list.

I’m just forever bummed about Palm, I _adored_ my Pre.

------
jdkee
Give me an old HP 32S calculator or LaserJet III. Not this post Fiorina crap.

------
greggman2
Gonna rant but other than using 100% open source software what can we do? I
think I kind of wish it was illegal to collect data without very explicit opt
in and no loss in functionality. (Note: HP apparently asked for permission

AFAIK Facebook spies on all Oculus usage. Every app you run on it, how often,
even apps not from their store. Even not VR apps.

There is a law that a video rental store can not share your rental history.
Facebook is going beyond that. Sure they know what apps I bought from their
app store but they also know every non Oculus app as well. They aren't sharing
it, or maybe they are to "trusted 3rd parties", but to me that's like the
video rental store somehow tracking all videos I watch even ones not rented
from them.

Note that I don't know that Steam and Valve are any better but I absolutely
hate the idea that everything I do on my PC (or phone) is tracked.

I have no idea if Apple or Microsoft knows I watch ?? hours of video a week or
what the names of the files are. Even my TV I have no idea if it reports every
network connection back to Sony or that my Apple TV doesn't report similar
things to Apple.

I feel like I want that kind of collection made illegal as an invasion of
privacy with very large fines for non-compliance and I don't feel like my only
option should be run nothing but open source software and by open source
hardware.

...sigh...

~~~
jstanley
> other than using 100% open source software what can we do?

Why is that option not on the table? That is the thing to do.

~~~
greggman2
Because none of the software I want to run nor hardware I want to run is open
source and there are no useful open source alternatives. AFAIK you can't use a
Vive or an Oculus without proprietary drivers that spy on you. On top of which
all the interesting content is also not open source. I don't actually mind
paying for propretary software, especially entertainment software. I just care
that now that all computers are networked nearly all software spies on you.
Even an honest company is probably using 10, 20, 30 3rd party libraries which
might also be spying on you.

------
sammorrowdrums
I elected for HP to gather data in exchange for free ink and up to 15 pages of
printing a month for free. They mail me ink. I know I'm selling my data for
that ink but TBH I rarely print and it makes it free for me.

Instant Ink has really been a positive for me so far, and while at first I was
a bit uneasy about data gathering it seems similar (and probably less invasive
for my use cases) to using a Google product for example.

------
WalterBright
Guess I might as well keep running my old HP printer which uses a parallel
interface.

------
vbezhenar
It's good that I never trust printers to print my master passwords and just
write them by hand. At least my pencil does not send anything yet...

~~~
wolco
HP pencils record arm movement and the eraser has a wireless transmittor.

------
boring_twenties
Hmm, the same printer manufacturers that have, despite no laws requiring them
to do so, entered into agreements with governments to embed secret identifying
information into all produced documents, for decades, are also exfiltrating
user data for profit?

Truly shocking, I cannot believe they have done this.

~~~
Erlich_Bachman
Don't all printer manufacturers do this?

------
dvfjsdhgfv
> But even if you would be perfectly happy to publish all your printing and
> device data to the entire internet, I’d still argue that it’s a grim world
> in which HP feels entitled to take it from you.

But it's Microsoft who started all this. I remember a few years ago the would
politely ask if I want to "send a report" home about a some crash etc. Now
they don't bother. You need to bend over backwards to change obscure settings
and still can't be sure they don't phone home. Moreover, updates introduce new
privacy violations, and people only find it after installing them, so privacy-
conscious people have a tough choice.

No wonder other companies stopped caring about these things if MS can easily
get away with it.

------
arthurcolle
What is the best "serious" office printer that doesn't have this kind of
malware installed? Ideally that has a bay for multi-page document scanning and
can print 100 double sided pages without skipping a beat? Bonus points for
reasonably priced ink!

------
PeterStuer
We have come to the point where 'Informed consent' has become so perverted
that it should no longer hold up. Mostof the trickery companies seem to find
acceptable obtaining it would be outright frauduleus and clearly a scam in
other contexts.

------
rgrieselhuber
Sounds like we need the Raspberry Pi of printers.

~~~
imglorp
I was just thinking more like using a raspberry pi for a home print server.

1\. Load up the Pi with Cups, which has a web interface, and all the optional
drivers and fonts it needs.

2\. make sure ip_forward is off

3\. set all your printers to use your Pi as their default network gateway

4\. profit?

~~~
edoceo
I do this but, I've missed step 4. There is a little more to the cups config
but it "just works" (if you know cups well)

------
jokoon
I have this conspiracy theory that the NSA is using US monopolies to spy on
the entire world.

I mean if you're holding the majority of the computer-related industry when it
comes to making the software, it would be a pity to not benefit from it.

------
chiefalchemist
I don't print much. I bought an HP printer with Instant Ink strictly for the
free tier (10 free pages p/m). This privacy issues concern me.

That aside, I've been thinking about what is the minimum amount data needed to
identify what's being printed. For example, if you knew tbe lenght of the
first X words, how many words would be necessary to identify a source? If you
added the awareness of periods, how many words?

Long to short, it seems to me, simple and basic meta data used wisely could be
used as a fingerprint (or sorts) to identify what's being printed without
actually needing to capture the actual content.

------
aj7
Ha ha coincidence. I live in a high rise, so you can pick up about 10 wifi
signals. My Brother all-in-one scanned three times last night on its own. I’m
turning it off and on manually now.

------
anotherevan
As an aside, I found the opening paragraph amusing and painful in equal
measure, given how I've often been treated by relatives because I, "work with
computers."

------
hyperman1
I wonder if, at this point, it isnt easier to write a service that floods all
these companies with random made up telemetry. MS/HP/FAANG wants data? Lets
bury them in it. We train some AI so it isn't obviously wrong. We start anti
tracking lists like the spam blacklists. We se d GDPR requests to find out
what sticks. With some luck, their firewalls block us and we're finally
getting privacy.

~~~
userbinator
That's been done already with ads:
[https://adnauseam.io/](https://adnauseam.io/)

I've heard that in practice it does get you on a blacklist and they'll start
ignoring what you send, so perhaps it does have some effect.

~~~
drewmol
Point of caution before using adnauseam: I installed and used it on 3 devices
for about 6 months a few years ago. I have seen an increase of about 50 fold
in the amount of targeted spam phone calls and physical mailers I receive
since that time and they've only started to subside in the last year. I can't
prove but highly suspect it's a result of my name getting added to _a lot_ of
lead DBs as an interested potential customer due to adnauseum ad clicks.

~~~
rightbyte
You took shots for the team. Keep up the good work!

Reading about the tool makes me kinda wanna install it ... that should mess up
the targeting profile quite a bit for my ip.

------
ga-vu
No offense, but this guy is overhyping this more than I can stomach.

HP is collecting basic telemetry, analytics, and metadata, similar to... let
me check... EVERYONE.

If you've ever worked in a large company, you'll know that you need that
telemetry for debugging, first and foremost.

It's almost useless for analytic purposes. Let's be honest here. What
advertiser cares about the number of pages you printed on Tuesday. Give me a
break.

~~~
ajb
"If you've ever worked in a large company, you'll know that you need that
telemetry for debugging, first and foremost."

If you worked in a large company before telemetry was available, you know it's
actually possible to make a product that works out of the box, rather ship
something barely working and use users as unpaid QA testers.

------
brokenmachine
It's so sad that every company seems to be willing to do shady stuff like this
just to grab a couple of extra cents from selling their users out.

Technology companies should be leading the way for privacy.

You'd think it'd be very bad for business for a company like HP to demonstrate
that they don't care about their user's privacy.

But they all seem to do dodgy stuff like this, selling people's privacy for
cents.

------
snthd
Are HP doing this in GDPR-covered territory?

Possibly the requirement to download stuff is so they can geo-target?

------
specialist
Would it be feasible to create DIY printer?

As in buy or salvage the imaging and paper handling hardware, add your own CPU
and software.

Or maybe root and reprogram an existing printer, like an OpenWRT for printers.

------
floki999
Are there any open-source telemetry detection tools out there to easily
identify this sort of thing?

~~~
mirimir
You can probably log traffic in your router.

------
perfunctory
Soon, toilet paper will send your stool test back to its manufacturer without
you knowing about it.

~~~
tonyedgecombe
[https://twitter.com/internetofshit](https://twitter.com/internetofshit)

------
maz1b
What are some good alternatives then? Laser, black and white and one that
respects privacy ideally?

------
sitkack
Wouldn’t wire tapping laws apply?

~~~
reaperducer
Maybe not once you "accept" the EULA that you never saw or read.

------
rasz
go to [https://binisoft.org/](https://binisoft.org/) install Windows Firewall
Control, set up your whitelist policy, no more spying. This can even stop W10
telemetry.

------
mr__y
I've never expected that airgapping printers will become a real thing

------
crb002
HP and HPE split. Looks like HP is going to shit.

~~~
jabl
Well, the oldtimers are all saying that HP went to shit when they spun off
Agilent (in 1999, per Wikipedia). And the last remnants of ye olde HP
engineering culture was trashed when the Compaq vacuum cleaner salespeople
took over after the 2002 HP-Compaq merger.

------
agumonkey
neighbor bought a wifi hp aio printer; 30eur, ink included. They must make
money somewhere.. of course.

------
Animats
What do enterprise firewall operators think of this? They must notice.

------
b0blee
We are doomed.

------
inamberclad
The only HP device I own is an oscilloscope from 1994, thankfully.

------
alimbada
They're staunch supporters of apartheid in Palestine so this is not
surprising.
[https://www.foa.org.uk/campaign/rebootyourethics/](https://www.foa.org.uk/campaign/rebootyourethics/)

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raincom
That's good for espionage and other activities. Even photo copies leave meta
data somewhere; that's how one serial killer got caught, iirc.

~~~
reaperducer
Some printers/photocopiers can be configured to erase their data.

For HIPAA reasons we have a Kyocera at work that does this. After each job the
display shows "Erasing hard disk data" or something like that as it scrubs the
buffer.

~~~
tinus_hn
But how about a printer that just doesn’t have a hard disk? What is it used
for anyway?

