
Firefox Focus – a free, fast and easy to use private browser for iOS - st3fan
https://blog.mozilla.org/blog/2016/11/17/introducing-firefox-focus-a-free-fast-and-easy-to-use-private-browser-for-ios/
======
planetjones
Why can't someone take Apple to court and argue that developers should be able
to build native web browser apps without relying on the Web View component? We
have st3fan saying "Firefox Focus" is not ideal because he's had to use the
older and slower WKWebView to implement it.

Isn't this similar to Microsoft when they were forced to allow a choice of
browser, or do Apple get away with it because they allow alternative web
browsers provided they use the iOS rendering system to actually display pages?

~~~
mikeash
Apple gets away with it because they don't have a monopoly. There's a large
variety of non-Apple smartphones and tablets you can buy.

Microsoft's behavior was restricted because they were a monopoly. There were
alternatives to Windows, but the court decided that they were sufficiently
insignificant that Windows was effectively a monopoly. That changes the rules.

Windows market share at the time was about 95%, Apple's smartphone market
share is in the neighborhood of 15-20%.

~~~
benologist
Is a monopoly suit the only legal way to instigate change?

~~~
guelo
A new law could do it. Of course Silicon Valley claims that they are so
ingenious that it would be a crime against humanity to regulate them.

~~~
curried_haskell
Don't worry,they'll just create another start-up to inexplicably solve this
problem with a new trendy web service.

------
st3fan
Code at [https://github.com/mozilla-mobile/focus](https://github.com/mozilla-
mobile/focus) \- feel free to file issues/bugs/questions on Github. We
primarily use Bugzilla for this project, but happy to move bugs around.

~~~
midgetjones
This looks really good!

Not sure if this is worth opening an issue over, but are you planning on
supporting search engines other than google?

~~~
Sk1pp
I only see it supporting yahoo. I didn't try very hard but in the settings
there is no way to change it from yahoo, which is really frustrating. Did I
overlook something?

~~~
cpeterso
For now, the search engine depends on your locale. Mozilla has partnerships
with different search engines in different geographies.

[https://github.com/mozilla-
mobile/focus/blob/49bda35aa3b9b9b...](https://github.com/mozilla-
mobile/focus/blob/49bda35aa3b9b9b6cd28be3ee45934f10f984311/Search/list.json)

~~~
Sk1pp
oh wow, thanks.

------
petetnt
Works really well! First I joked about how it's the perfect browser for
watching adult content on the go (which it is :P) but it's rather impressive.
The execution is really smooth, there's just enough options and it's really
fast; there's even an option for blocking web fonts.

Great work!

~~~
Veen
Certainly less clunky than iCab, which is also pretty good when you're
"looking for an engagement ring" and other such sensitive browsing.

~~~
ribs
Yes, I'd never heard it called that before

------
lazyjones
It works well, but unsurprisingly, they screwed up privacy once again by
sending data to some company
([https://www.adjust.com](https://www.adjust.com)) in the background:
[http://www.theregister.co.uk/2016/11/17/mozilla_launches_pri...](http://www.theregister.co.uk/2016/11/17/mozilla_launches_privacy_edition_firefox_for_ios/)

Doesn't seem to be possible to turn it off (the instructions at
[https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/send-anonymous-usage-
da...](https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/send-anonymous-usage-data-firefox-
mobile-devices#mobile::m50&ios:): do not work, there is no such settings menu
for "Klar by Firefox"?). Perhaps I'm getting an old version from my local App
Store though.

~~~
st3fan
If you use Klar then you have not yet received the 2.0 update. We hope to send
it out pretty soon. Sorry the German market is unfortunately a little
different in this case. Same product but with a different name. Silly reasons.

~~~
lazyjones
OK, but did this pre-2.0 Klar have the problematic telemetry/data collection
without an option to turn it off?

------
DemiGuru
Would you please elaborate how this is different from using Safari in Private
Browsing mode? If I am not mistaken Firefox Focus on iOS would still use
WebKit under the hood.

Edit: I'm not being facetious or sarcastic.

~~~
AaronMT
Private Browsing (regardless of browser) does not prevent online tracking. By
removing trackers and ads, web pages may require less data and load faster.

~~~
LeoPanthera
It _helps_ with preventing online tracking, since private browsing
windows/tabs do not have access to your cookies.

------
walterbell
Is this targeted at Brendan Eich's [https://brave.com](https://brave.com)?

~~~
eriknstr
Speaking of Brave, how does it perform in terms of web standards compliance,
amount of trackers and ads blocked, and RAM and CPU usage compared to Firefox
+ uBlock Origin and/or uMatrix?

\---

Edit: I decided to do a quick test using panopticlick. Here are the results.

\- Firefox with uBlock Origin and uMatrix: fingerprint appears to be unique.
fingerprint conveys at least 17.47 bits of identifying information.

\- Brave: fingerprint appears to be unique. fingerprint conveys at least 17.47
bits of identifying information.

\- Chromium (plain): fingerprint appears to be unique. fingerprint conveys at
least 17.47 bits of identifying information.

\- Tor Browser Bundle: one in 77.02 browsers have the same fingerprint.
fingerprint conveys 6.27 bits of identifying information.

~~~
gbuk2013
Brave performs better in terms of blocking ads - I tried it today vs Focus and
have switched to it now.

------
rubiquity
Add prevention/detection for those annoying modals to collect emails after 15
seconds on a page and I'll marry you.

~~~
Drdrdrq
He might do it if you don't threaten him. :)

------
boynamedsue
Firefox Focus: a privacy-focused browser that sends anonymous usage data by
default.

~~~
past
Anonymous data is by definition not privacy-invasive. That's why it's called
anonymous.

------
schlagetown
"Cannot download. This app is not compatible with your device."

Um…what? I'm on an iPhone 5! Not _that_ ancient!

~~~
HappyTypist
Content blockers require a 64 bit CPU. This is an Apple requirement

~~~
dictum
I expected that, but that's an unfortunate side effect of coupling the new
browser app with the previous content blocker app.

(Just found out that it's not compatible with my iPad 4)

~~~
st3fan
Yes this is unfortunate. I will check if we can somehow release the app for
all devices. But I am afraid that will result in a difficult to message
situation.

[https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1318363](https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1318363)

------
bowlofstew
Awesome work over at the Mozilla team! This is way better than what I would
expect after using Opera, Brave, and others on iOS.

------
newscracker
Test driving it now with this comment. This is perfect for my "search and
browse" needs where I need to use Google (because neither Startpage nor
DuckDuckGo are adequate for that query).

I can also use this without worrying about mix ups that I sometimes end up
with in other browsers where I use both private and non-private tabs.

Edit: Seems a bit slow. Need to use it more to get better measurements.

------
johnydepp
Good to see Mozilla making so much progress lately. Earlier I gave up on
Firefox as the Chrome was faster and better, but now its shiny and solid
again! Kudos to the team!

------
cpeterso
Having tested Firefox Focus for a week already, I'm more aware of little
browsing I do that actually requires a "logged in" browser. Having easy,
ephemeral browsing sessions by default is pretty nice. I hope we can get
similar functionality on Firefox desktop using tab containers.

------
hollander
Does it still use the Safari engine, or is it allowed to use a different one?

~~~
AaronMT
Safari WebKit, yes.

------
cyxxon
Not (yet?) available in Germany, it seems.

~~~
lorenzhs
It's called "Klar by Firefox" in Germany due to the naming conflict with
Focus, the magazine. I haven't seen the update in the app store yet, though.
Probably still rolling out.

~~~
dvdgsng
Rather weird name. Would 'Firefox Fokus' have caused conflicts as well?

~~~
untog
"Klar" in German translates to "Clear" in English. Sounds like a good name to
me. Maybe even better than Focus.

------
zymhan
It is interesting that they're making it seem like a new app, when they're
actually augmenting an existing (and seemingly forgotten) app. I was a little
confused about the app/update at first, given that I'd had Mozilla Focus
installed already. It was an adblocker/privacy plugin for Safari only, though.

It appears they just took the Private Browsing component of Firefox for iOS
and integrated it into the old privacy plugin Focus app, and renamed it
Firefox Focus.

In any case, it has the same features it did before, so I'm okay with it. It
does duplicates my Firefox app's functionality some, but oh well.

------
darrenkopp
Did this replace another browser they had? I woke up this morning and it was
already installed on my iPhone, so I must have had something else already
installed if this was just launched today.

~~~
Caerus
It looks like the Focus adblocker they launched last year [1] has been updated
to a full browser.

1)
[https://blog.mozilla.org/futurereleases/2015/12/08/announcin...](https://blog.mozilla.org/futurereleases/2015/12/08/announcing-
focus-by-firefox-a-content-blocker-for-ios/)

------
codezero
It says we look forward to your feedback - anyone know where I should send
feedback?

They the button in the bottom right opens the current URL immediately in
Firefox (separate app) without a prompt or warning seems against the private
browsing expectation I have.

Edit: also it appears swiping doesn't go "back" :/

~~~
st3fan
There a bunch of places where we take feedback:

    
    
      * https://input.mozilla.org/feedback/focus
      * https://github.com/mozilla-mobile/focus/issues
      * https://mzl.la/2g23JeE (Bugzilla)
    

(You can login to Bugzilla with a Github account.)

We have a bug on file for swiping:

[https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1316949](https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1316949)

------
Humdeee
Looks awesome, can't wait to play around with this. On a separate note, I'm a
sucker for great UI. I love the waveform on the landing page. Browsing through
the repo, I had no clue this was available in the form of a pod. Needed
something like this for a current project.

------
er0l
defaults to yahoo search without the ability to change does not feel private
to me

~~~
tedmiston
I wonder why not DuckDuckGo. Perhaps Mozilla has a sponsorship from Yahoo.

~~~
wmccullough
No, they admitted they ran out of time and just went with defaults of a few
things. They have a ticket open to solve this issue already.

~~~
NeutronBoy
For reference the bug is here

[https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1318359](https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1318359)

------
spinningarrow
Impressively fast. Any plans to support multiple tabs in the future?

------
imagist
Is there any word on this being released for Android at some point?

~~~
icebraining
Why not use Private Browsing in Firefox for Android?

~~~
LamaOfRuin
That was my first thought (and what I think the path would be for getting this
browser experience on Android). It's basically Firefox for Android, private
browsing mode with tracking protection enabled, but it doesn't seem to be
possible to set private browsing as the default. Thus any link from other
applications will automatically open in a tracking friendly context first.

~~~
LamaOfRuin
Scratch that.

I was looking for the wrong about:config value. While you can't have private
browsing mode be the default, it is in fact possible to enable tracking
protection outside private browsing mode, so you can get these same benefits
(privacy.trackingprotection.enabled in about:config).

Wish this would be exposed in the UI settings.

------
headmelted
I'm not an iPhone user, so I can't give this a hands-on test, but it looks
rather nice.

One omission that jumps out though is that this doesn't look like it has TOR
integration/support, unless it comes with it's own onion routing and I'm
missing it.

I'm not advocating for TOR by the way, it just strikes me that the instances
where you would want a private browser are very likely the same instances
where you don't want network intermediaries viewing your communications, no?

------
deanclatworthy
Yes, yes, yes. Even if this doesn't work out in the long-run. This is what I
want Mozilla to be focusing on: privacy-first browsing experiences.

~~~
forgotpwtomain
It seems like too small of a market segment though, especially since it's hard
to make money from browsers altogether.

------
winteriscoming
This is good news. I always wanted something like this in browsers on desktop.
I know this one is for iOS, but at least I can use it on my mobile.

Anyone know why this isn't available on Android or desktop (Linux)? Technical
reasons or is it due to not enough developer bandwidth to implement it (which
is reasonable too)

------
EugeneOZ
Next time please mention in what countries it's available. Bye, have a nice
day, great teaser.

------
cpeterso
If Firefox Focus is a privacy browser, it should bundle something like HTTPS
Everywhere.

~~~
st3fan
It does use an extensive HSTS preload list. So if you go to for example
[http://Bugzilla.mozilla.org](http://Bugzilla.mozilla.org) it will actually
never hit http and go straight to https.

Same list as in Firefox and Chrome. (iOS feature, all apps get this for free)

------
antihero
Is there a whitelist? For some reason they're blocking API access to reddit
entirely which is annoying as I want to browse certain sites that rely on this
API. Why would the reddit API be on these lists?

~~~
st3fan
I filed
[https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1318367](https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1318367)
\- but this may be more difficult than it seems.

Let us know if the Reddit API is incorrectly on a list. We can investigate if
we have a little more info.

------
scrrr
Will universal links and app banners and handover to desktop still work?

~~~
AaronMT
Doesn't look like. I filed a bug.

[https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1318377](https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1318377)

------
ben174
This appears to be an update to a content blocker that has existed for quite
some time. I've had this app installed for a long time, but the integrated
browser is new.

~~~
jamesgeck0
Yeah; it's frustrating. Perviously, I only opened the app to turn it off if a
website was broken _. Now I have to tap another button before I can toggle the
settings.

_ Some Google AMP sites don't load with all the privacy toggles on.

------
broguinn
Is there a good reason the app is not compatible with the iPhone 5C but it is
with the 5S?

I was really looking forward to trying this browser and wonder what the
hardware limitation is.

~~~
cosenal
See comments below:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12978192](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12978192)
Content Blocker extensions only run on 64-bit devices and iPhone 5C is 32-bit.

------
vasaulys
Any reason why this is incompatible with the iPhone 5c?

~~~
vuanotino
It requires a 64-bit CPU, which was introduced with the iPhone 5s.

------
kdamken
Seems cool, but would be better if they included an option for tab
functionality. Can't replace safari without that.

------
etherfuse
Brave is great! I feel like you guys are 1-2 steps behind Brave lately.

------
shmerl
Does it support free codecs for video / audio?

~~~
AaronMT
It uses what Safari uses

~~~
shmerl
I expected that. That's too bad.

------
greatsage
Is there an audit document for this?

------
johnnymonster
seems like another way for firefox to push their integration with yahoo
search.

------
naoquesece
The question is: they block ad's?

~~~
codezero
Yes

~~~
naoquesece
Cool, installing them.

------
joesmo
This is a huge step forward as I assume those trackers they're talking about
include all ads by definition (anyone know of any ads that don't track?). If
that is indeed the case, this seems to be the first browser from a major
vendor to include ad blocking by default (AFAIK). That is huge news. We are
looking at the future of browsers here with regards to such protection and
likely a changing of the guard as Chrome falls out of favor due to Google's
pro-ad (and therefore pro-malware/anti-privacy) stance ... albeit I'm sure
someone will fork Chromium and add such features in at some point. This seems
to be a good first step for Mozilla / Firefox in this direction and I truly
hope that they continue this trend for all their other products. I'm pretty
sure there is no need to explain why having this as the default (as opposed to
plugins that have been available for well over a decade) is a huge deal.

------
semistrophe
The opposite of privacy: every address you type in Firefox Focus gets sent,
live, to Yahoo/Verizon, complete with a User-Agent identifying the request as
coming from Focus, indicating an unusual desire for privacy.

~~~
untog
Since this user's response to their own comment was killed (not sure why) I'll
repeat: this is incorrect. Domains are chosen from a hard-coded list:

[https://github.com/mozilla-
mobile/focus/blob/master/Blockzil...](https://github.com/mozilla-
mobile/focus/blob/master/Blockzilla/topdomains.txt)

~~~
semistrophe
Thanks for that. Not sure why my original reply was killed.

Further info:

1) Appears the Brave browser uses the same hardcoded suggestions list. Why
have such a list?!

2) If you are really concerned about privacy this is still a bad option
because accidental hit of Go/Search/Enter sends an incomplete address to
Verizon/Yahoo -- with no choices to disable this or chose another destination.

------
hhygjgfft
Seems great, I'd suggest making the front page search input box larger (it's
too vertically narrow)

------
emehrkay
Oh so they just used an update to Focus app to put a whole new web browser on
my phone, like a Trojan Horse. Interesting approach

~~~
scott_karana
If it helps, it's just a Safari wrapper, so it shouldn't take much more space.

~~~
st3fan
Actually, it is a UIWebView wrapper. Safari is a complete application that
does a ton of stuff not appropriate for Firefoc Focus. UIWebView is just a
UIKit component to render web pages in a rectangular area on screen.

~~~
scott_karana
I'm aware of the distinction, but wasn't sure how technical the person I was
addressing was. ;)

------
paganel
How abut fixing the numerous FF issues for the MacOSX? But I guess that
doesn't attract eyeballs nor does it bring in new google money. I've spent
more time swearing at my screen in desperation during the last 6 months-1 year
than I used to do back when IE6 was ruling the web, all of this "thanks" to FF
and Chrome. How can such nice products (they were nice in the not so distant
past) could turn into such memory-hoggers in such a short amount of time?

~~~
AaronMT
Different teams work on different things.

~~~
paganel
I'm aware of that, but I also know that management can re-allocate resources
according to the company's needs. I'm just frustrated that said "company
needs" seem to never fall in line with what most of the existing FF users
want.

~~~
dblohm7
You're assuming that your needs are representative of most users.

~~~
paganel
I'm making that assumption based on me reading on other forums about users
complaining about said FF memory issues. And, then again, trying to make a
better product (one which uses less memory, for example) should also be on a
software-maker's list of things to always have under consideration (it's like
a restaurant always having to make sure that their toilets are clean).

But I agree that it's difficult to ask for even fundamental things like "give
your users less memory-hungry programs" in times like these, when a chat
client like Slack does almost nothing when other users complain about it using
1GB memory almost for nothing. We live in sadder times than I imagined 10
years ago, programming-wise.

