
Ask HN: What to do about a boring job ? - f2ender
I am stuck in a job which I don't find very interesting (but I cannot switch).<p>I am working on a side project (about an hour a day) but still need to spend the whole day at the job.<p>Any advice on how to deal with it during the day ? Anybody been in that situation before ?<p>EDIT 1: The workload isn't much and even though I try to read up on the news and stay current, I still have to be at the workplace for 8 hours to keep up appearances.<p>EDIT 2: I am a software engineer. I cannot switch because of personal reasons (which will probably change next year allowing me to explore a little more). The other reason is I am not learning anything new. It's all stuff I have worked on before (at a much larger scale in a startup): the management team here thinks they are doing something that'll change the world but it's more because of their inexperience than anything else.<p>I do have my side-project which provides an outlet but it doesn't discount the fact that I spend 9 hours a day at something that doesn't get me anywhere.<p>EDIT 3: I did some HN searching and I find myself in a similar situation as :<p>http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1246200<p>I worked for an awesome team a couple of years ago on a great product. I was just out of school and it was a huge project which I thoroughly enjoyed, being the major player. Now I am working in a more crony-based organization where the things we are doing are way behind what I worked on before.<p>I was expecting progress, instead I find my judgement being overruled by less experienced people who haven't shipped any products. Anyhow, thanks for all the advice. I guess it's all about making lemonade out of lemons.
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edw519
What's good about it?

What's good about it?

What's good about it?

(I had to ask multiple times because we all know that the first couple of
answers would be, "Nothing".)

Every job, no matter how boring, is loaded with "stuff" that you _can_ use to
contribute to your long term progress.

It may be access to a user who's an expert in their field and would love to
share their expertise.

It may be a project that needs to be done, but no one else has time. And you
can learn a lot of unexpected stuff from doing it.

It may be lots of interesting data on their hard drive that you can learn a
lot from just by transversing and/or organizing.

Hell, it might even be proximity to a quiet coffee shop where no one would
miss you.

It could be anything.

So if you're stuck, then it's your job to turn lemons into lemonade. (Practice
turning lemons into lemonade is an invaluable skill on it's own; just ask any
entrepreneur.)

Now close your browser and make a list of 10 things you can try to get _some_
value out of this job while you're there. Then open your browser back up and
let us know what they are.

~~~
auston
I am with edw519 - make yourself extremely useful, to the point where you are
a "superhero" build stuff that is going to make other people in the company's
lives easier!

------
j_baker
Since you're doing well in terms of workload, I'd suggest using the extra time
to learn new things. Use emacs? Learn vim. Use vim? Learn emacs. Don't use
either one? Learn both. Any skills you need that could be preventing you from
getting your dream job? Learn them.

Seriously, this works as long as your job situation is only temporary. If you
force yourself to use the new things you're learning you can also draw your
projects out a little bit more so that you're not spending all day browsing HN
(or whatever else you read) and you look busier (which is what's really
important to PHBs).

~~~
frossie
I second this enthusiastically. If the workload is not taxing for you, instead
of finding things to fill your spare time, just do the things you have to do
as "inefficiently" as possible. One of the barriers to trying new things is
the drop in efficiency (like switching to a new editor, as per the suggestion
before). If you can take the productivity hit, this can be a great
opportunity. Frustrated by a lack of feature in the editor? Rather than work
around it, fix it and submit a patch. Keep using KDE (or whatever) but switch
your locale to French. If you don't already and you are allowed to do so,
switch your version control to git - that should mess with your mind for a
good while :-)

Basically if you genuinely can't leave, just try and make it interesting for
yourself and make a habit of stepping outside your comfort zone - otherwise
your brain will rot.

The other issue is your actual project. If you have scope, overspec it. Only
you will know, but that should give you back some pride in your work. If you
are taking shortcuts, don't. If you are not commenting and documenting
properly, do. If you can make the code faster, speed it up. If you can deliver
knobs and whistles, go for it.

------
rjett
If you "cannot switch" (hard to believe) then I would suggest going above and
beyond your job description to create value for your employer. This will help
displace downtime and make your job more interesting. Being passive about your
situation isn't going to do anything for you though.

~~~
madprogrammer
"I would suggest going above and beyond your job description to create value
for your employer."

Why in the world would one want to do that? It's not like you are going to get
paid more or get more free time for going the extra mile.

~~~
rjett
That's quite a myopic view of things. Going above and beyond may not offer an
immediate pay increase, promotion or more break time, but it will afford him
an opportunity to learn new things, show that he is fit for more
responsibility, and in the process he'll stand out to all those working around
him. All this will increase his chances later down the road of getting where
he wants to be. Most importantly, it will address his immediate problem of
boredom!

His alternative: Do what his job description says, surf the internet, watch
the paint dry... sounds like a real recipe for motivation, excitement, and
success.

------
strlen
Change the reason that you can't switch. I can only think of two legitimate
reasons.

1) Switching requires moving to an entirely new town where you have no friends
and no family. I'd double check that this is actually true and start working
on building up a social network in a different metropolitan area if this were
the case.

2) Immigration reasons.

Anything else? Options are never a certain "win" (think about lack of an exit,
reverse splits, stock taking a dive). Worried about what your resume will look
like? Worry less about your resume, worry more about yourself. Worried about
loss of income? Don't just _quit_ the job, search passively. "Counted on" to
ship a product? Announce your departure in advance (more than the usual two
weeks), hand your responsibilities over to others. Starting bonuses you will
have to pay back? Money isn't worth not having something to wake up for in the
morning.

So, honestly, switch. However, before you make the switch, very carefully
think what is that you will be looking for in your next position and how to
verify that it provides that.

People claim that you should "work to live" not "live to work". I call
bullshit. Your work consumes plurality of your day and majority of your own
waking hours. When I feel underused, micro-managed or otherwise unhappy _at
work_ , it means I am not looking forward to waking up in the morning.
Personal projects are important (and I try to have several even when I am
absorbed in interesting work), but they happen _at the end of the day_ when
you've already given up your best hours.

------
ccollins
Sure, apply to Airbnb: <http://www.airbnb.com/jobs>

Seriously though, stop making excuses for why you cannot switch jobs and start
doing what makes you happy.

------
JoelPM
I believe your problem is that you cannot switch, not that the job is boring.
I would try to solve that problem.

~~~
angusgr
Is it possible the OP 'cannot' (or more specifically does not want to) switch
because they're waiting for options to mature, or something similar?

That's one reason I've seen people stick out jobs for a few more months.

------
CyberFonic
If you had a heart attack, came to in a hospital bed, would you rip out the
IV, get dressed and go to work???

Didn't think so. So you CAN SWITCH, it's just that you've become attached to
your present circumstances and are not prepared to break free. So stop killing
yourself, quit and do whatever it is that you can contribute greatest value
by.

~~~
ique
That's a rather extreme point of view. There might be contractual obligations
for him to stay (being sued isn't nice even if it won't kill you) or personal
reasons (as stated in the edits), family, friends and loved ones. "Breaking
free" from a family is not what most people want to do.

------
jerf
You say "boring", I am going to assume that is accurate. ("Overruled by
idiots" isn't boring, it's frustating, and I'm assuming that while that may
annoy you it is not the core problem.) Try to automate away the boring; its
what software engineering is for. If you're writing the same code over and
over again, that means it's ripe for refactoring.

If this doesn't apply to you, well, I'm sure somebody reading will find it
helpful. If you're a "software engineer" and writing the same code every day,
stop! Don't do that. It's bad engineering. Write better abstractions. You'll
learn something.

------
btmorex
Why can't you change jobs?

------
tjmaxal
I am currently in the same situation. As my friends keep reminding me, STOP
WHINING! You are employed in the middle of an economic recession. It could
always be worse.

~~~
bdickason
It can always get better! Spend an extra hour per night on your side project
and turn a profit! Then quit :)

------
minouye
Find the overlaps between your side project and your day job. I've done that
and it's really helped--each hour spent on the overlaps makes me look good at
work (since I'm engaged) and also helps me move closer to accomplishing goals
with my side-project.

------
exit
from your submission history (
<http://news.ycombinator.com/submitted?id=f2ender> ) it seems you've been in
this position for a while. did you turn down the offer you mentioned a while
ago? are you saying you "cannot switch" because no offer is available?

------
tiffani
What do you do? (Details aren't 100% necessary, but just trying to get an idea
of what you do so we could perhaps help you make it more interesting in some
way or another--if leaving really isn't an option.)

~~~
tiffani
Same job? <http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1227850>

~~~
f2ender
Yes, I almost ended up accepting the other job offer. However, the management
there (as I found out later) was worse than where I am currently.

------
shikind
Welcome to my club. Like others are saying, use the time to develop.

After a lengthy period of me asking about what my duties were and if anything
was written down and what various policies were, a senior coworker simply said
"Read. Buy some books and read." I spend about one hour of the day on getting
real work done, another hour or two on moving things through the idiocracy,
and the rest of the day is spent on Pylons documentation. :D

------
bfung
I think some other points to reflect upon:

 _...but it's more because of their inexperience than anything else._

Is that really true? Do you know more about the business than they do? Can you
manage a team better? Do you bring up challenges to them, or just scoff and
think they're stupid. Hacking is not just manipulating code. Could you start
your own company and out do the current company?

 _I was expecting progress, instead I find my judgement being overruled by
less experienced people_

Why are you being overruled? Is it emotions based? Title's based ("I'm
_SENIOR_ engineer..")? Where's the logic, analysis, and/or data to prove
otherwise? Why can't you sell your idea to others?

 _I guess it's all about making lemonade out of lemons._

I understand your grievances all too well, but yes; sweet, sweet lemonade.

Final thing is that I think it's better to communicate how you feel about your
situation to your supervisor-type. If the they don't feel like they need to
make a change, and you don't want to be there, easy solution.

------
Eldila2
I would start looking at building systems that could be used internally. If
you are being overruled, you might as well put some time into something
useful. I don't know exactly what your company does, but you might want to
look at building a: \- CRM system \- Specialized Bug Tracker \- Continuous
Integration Software \- Build a Test Harness

I know these system exists, but if you have time it is good experience. Also,
ideally, you should work on things that you can take with you when you leave.
However, this is usually not possible. I have had friends who built open
source projects at home. They then convinced their boss to use it and
contribute to the project. If you keep your mind open, I am sure you can think
of some creative ideas.

------
Cmccann7
I was actually in this exact situation about ~8 months ago. One of the best
inspirational videos that got me through that time was
<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EhqZ0RU95d4> . Caution: Gary is a little loud
and obnoxious but he makes good points.

Even if you have a 8-5 day job, work the 8pm-2am night shift and stop
complaining. Take @edw519's advice and make a list of 10 things you can do to
create value and start doing them. Even if you have to be somewhere for 8+
hours that sucks use that time to your advantage.

There is no excuse for not making it happen, use that free time you do have to
make meaning and create value.

------
angusgr
I've never tried them, and I'm not even sure how I feel about them, but you
might want to try some of the 'Executricks' mentioned in this article:

[http://blog.trailmeme.com/2010/04/four-hour-workweek-or-
exec...](http://blog.trailmeme.com/2010/04/four-hour-workweek-or-executricks/)

" “retire at work,” develop an under-the-radar personal brand, and achieve
covert lifestyle design."

------
rythie
Based on your previous postings, your based in London?

If so, I'd suggest going to one of the several events aimed at startups in
London (e.g. the Techcrunch Europe events). There are always lots of companies
looking to hire people when I go and everyone seems to struggle to find good
people.

------
ams6110
If the workload isn't much, can you work on your side project during the day
after you've gotten your work responsibilities taken care of (or while you're
waiting)?

~~~
zck
Since this would involve getting a signed letter from the company stating that
the company does not own work you do for your side project while you're at
work, it seems unlikely that this is an option.

~~~
ams6110
Yeah that is a risk. But if they're unaware that he's lightly tasked, would
they be likely to realize that he's working on a side project 6 hrs a day?

------
f2ender
Updated the description to answer some of the questions the community asked.

------
anigbrowl
Learn a new language. Or express a desire to become a manager.

------
looprecur
Are you learning? Every job has grunt work, even the interesting jobs. If
you're not learning from what you do, and if your boss doesn't have your
advancement/education as a top priority, then learn. But if you have to put up
with a couple months of boring work in order to get what you want, you should.

------
revoltingx
Minimize your expenses.

Get fired/laid off.

Live off unemployment.

Work on your project.

???.

Profit.

