
I started an online subscription business from Malaysia - patwalls
https://www.starterstory.com/start-online-business-malaysia
======
stef25
Here I am, a 40 something very mediocre webdev with 2 kids and a mortgage,
taking home 30K / year struggling to learn the framework-du-jour my boss
thinks I should be using, unable to find another job cause I'm too expensive,
wondering what the hell to do with my life.

And then there's a kid in Malaysia of all places selling frigging vapers,
taking home every month what I take home per year.

~~~
elorant
You're comparing apples to oranges. He's not a developer, he's an
entrepreneur.

~~~
chosenbreed37
> You're comparing apples to oranges. He's not a developer, he's an
> entrepreneur.

True. But still depressing...

~~~
elorant
Bear in mind that the 60k/month figure is turnover. Not profit. He employes 8
people, has to pay for inventory and packaging, postal, logistics, accounting
and whatnot.

Also, judging from the archive.org records it's a 4 year old business. It's
not an overnight success.

~~~
jbbos
> Also, judging from the archive.org records it's a 4 year old business. It's
> not an overnight success.

This is key, obviously. A lot of people will read something like this and
assume it’s some kind of overnight success. For that, I give kudos to this guy
for what is a business built most likely around long nights and days and
determination.

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heyalexej

       >I coded the web app from the ground up using what
        I’ve learned from the coding bootcamp and launched the 
        service on the 22nd of September 2019.
    

Something doesn't add up here. Ahrefs shows rankings going back as far as
September of 2016 with the first archive.org snapshot on September 14 2015
showing a landing page for a subscription box.

~~~
dragonsh
It's a tobacco and nicotin business without regulatory oversight in MY,
neighbouring Singapore just made it illegal. So there is nothing innovative in
it except the product itself is responsible for selling itself like
cigarettes, just with icing of no regulatory oversight.

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tsherr
I'm all for marketing, but there must be some honesty.

This is a lesson on how to lie your way to success. Which is an option, but
any idiot with no morals can do that. Of course, large companies do this all
the time with no repercussions, so I get why he went this route.

~~~
bradenb
I assume you're referring to building out a store with no inventory to test
the market? This is a pretty common tactic spread by books such as "The 4-Hour
Work Week" so it's not surprising to see it in use for a site like this.

Honestly, I don't really have a problem with it. A more honest approach would
be ideal, but if I had to choose between doing that and bootstrapping an
entire business with stock before getting my first sale I would choose the
"dishonest" method. It's a little inconvenient for the user, but presumably
they want the product, so in the end they just end up waiting a bit for it.

People don't want to help you test your idea, so presenting it in any other
way without rewarding them is unlikely to result in sales.

~~~
maxlamb
I think it's referring to the part where the web page says "that we’ve “sold
out” due to “overwhelming demand”" when obviously there is no overwhelming
demand at first. If you say there is huge demand for your product even though
there isn't any, that's going a bit further than just "we're sold out". But
since in the end the demand does pick up I get the argument that it's a grey
area.

~~~
scotty79
If you are selling nothing and have zero inventory any demand is technically
overwhelming.

It's still a lie though like almost all of his ways of getting a customer. But
I find it refreshing how clear it is.

Advertisers mostly pretend they are not lying which shapes wrong impression
that advertisement can be honest. No, it can't if it is to be successful.
Honest advertisement is just information and that's almost worthless for a
seller.

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chosenbreed37
There may be some dubious/shady aspects of this enterprise or at least the way
it's been presented. I just look at it as an eye-opener. With the view of
challenging my thinking about where I am now, where I want to be and what
paths might be available to get me there. For instance, e-commerce hadn't come
to me as an option. Looking at this account makes me at the very least think
about whether or not it is worth pursuing. It could be a different product,
market, etc. It may well be that it wouldn't work for me. But the exploration
of the basic idea is worth my while.

~~~
stef25
There's a huge rabbit hole you can go down :) Finding products (either
reselling existing ones, having your own made, ...). Many people do this
successfully on Amazon (as many benefits as caveats)

Launching something on your own e-commerce platform is pretty hard, requiring
either an extremely attractive product that spreads with word of mouth, or you
need to invest heavily in "social" or SEO. Otherwise you just won't stand out
anymore.

~~~
TheGRS
The last company I worked at was geared at optimizing recommended items to
customers on a storefront. Working there I kind of realized how saturated
e-commerce has become. There will always be room for new ideas and tricks to
squeeze money out of the space, but I can't help think you're not really
providing a lot of value add most of the time.

------
jmkd
Leaves me very uncomfortable, this combination of honesty as a humblebrag with
ethically-dubious practices.

What lesson does this teach me, an unemployed program manager with plenty of
experience and principles?

~~~
drenvuk
A practical one. Your principles may not be conducive to creating wealth and
if wealth is your goal you should adjust them.

~~~
addicted
That’s backwards. This shows that it’s possible to have a successful business
without the principles the OP adheres to. It does not say anything about
whether or not it’s possible to be successful with the principles, or if there
is a need to adjust them. It’s completely possible the principles the OP
adheres to make success more likely, or is likely to make any success larger.
Or the opposite may be true, but this one story does not tell you anything
about that.

~~~
drenvuk
I like you. I see the logic but now I wonder whether the article hints at the
possibility that the principles aren't helpful. Following your logic it sounds
like the only way to be sure is to wait until OP passes away or we have a
large sample size of people who have similar principles.

What about the opposite though? We have numerous examples where people who
some could argue don't have the best principles but have been very successful.
Bill Gates, Larry Ellison, Steve Jobs, Carly Fiorina, Marissa Mayer, Henry
Nicholas III, Elon Musk, John D. Rockefeller, Cornelius Vanderbilt, and more.
Putting it bluntly, they just do what's needed to further their goals - and
everyone else be damned if it's not helpful to their goals to help them out.
If you go past the puff pieces and dig a bit you see the net effect of their
principles is to let them win.

Maybe lack of evidence about the effectiveness of OP's principles is not
evidence but it's reasonable to consider following in the winner's example.

~~~
TheGRS
This is a really elaborate way of saying that you can sell things better if
you lie to people. I think most of us know that.

~~~
drenvuk
That's part of it. More like, just play the game within the written rules
instead of the unwritten rules.

~~~
TheGRS
Sure, ethics be damned right? I know a few pyramid schemes that are
technically all within the rules as well.

~~~
drenvuk
And I know of a few ponzi schemes that are technically within the rules. There
are reasons laws exist. Follow them and soothe your misplaced guilt by
spending your money on good causes. That's what Elon and Gates are doing. I
don't see a problem with this line of thinking.

~~~
TheGRS
I know we're speaking broadly here and there's a lot of nuance to what
constitutes right or wrong, but I think its pretty reasonable to say that if
you're gaining money from being unethical, you are part of the problem -
that's the issue.

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manbearpiggy
Love how candid this is, real insight into the shady world of e-commerce.

~~~
superasn
The worst part is the more you know it the more unbelievable it becomes to you
and you start to think to yourself "yeah right nobody would believe that."

Then you do a split test and bullshit like this (fake scarcity, benefits not
features, forced optins, etc) show a conversion rate of 8% whereas your honest
to goodness page is at 0.5% you understand that it's not your customers who
are ignorant, it's you and your understanding of how the world works :/

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tzhenghao
“To put things into perspective, the median average household income in
Malaysia is USD1,215. Not too bad for a single unmarried 28 year old chap eh?”

Maybe he should just leave this part out.

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Insanity
Lying about being sold out and asking to share the link is not something I'd
be comfortable with doing myself.. but then again, his business has gained
success through it and I don't have a business :D

Apart from the ethical issues, I do think it was a smart idea. Kudos to him.

------
scotty79
Some of us may think that he's ways of getting customers are dishonest. Please
treat it as a reminder to yourself that there's no such thing as honest
advertisement. If you are seeing advertisemnt you are being lied to. It might
be hard to spot because the parts of your brain that the advertisement lies to
might be far from your conciousness. But you are lied to nontheless.

Honest advertisement is just information and that's almost worthless for any
seller.

There's a great movie documentary "Czech dream" created by two film students
opening fake Wallmart type store.

Especially wonderful is the scene in marketing agency that is to prepare large
marketing campaign mimicking campaigns of other similar stores. They are in on
the joke and are completely fine with decieving the public, except for one
employee that feels strongly about "you won't go home emptyhanded" line on the
advert because there is no store and "you can't lie in advertisement!"

He calms down after students promise that if anyone shows up to the fake store
opening they'll give them baloon so they won't go home emptyhanded.

Your successful advertisement is always a lie. Regardless of whether you can
massage yourself into believing it is not.

------
gilbertmpanga12
Launched September 22, 2019, is that a typo?

~~~
bigwheeler
He also bootstrapped a time machine, but since vaping is all the rage these
days, that’s where the story is.

