

Ask HN: Looking for an engineer/developer "life partner" - jdsadow

I'm a 23-year old "business type" looking to find a true engineering "life partner;" someone who I can work alongside, identifying innovative concepts that we can experiment with, develop, and build into valuable, meaningful, profitable businesses.<p>I've been working on a start-up concept for about 3 months now and we're really struggling to find the right fit with an engineer. Over time, it's occurred to me that what I'm truly looking for is someone who will take the plunge with many different ideas and really go after things. We're coming up with new concepts on a weekly basis, but have no engineer to gut check against or even build basic models to test out.<p>What I am hoping to find is someone who can be the ultimate partner, OWNING the technical development while working with me to outline &#38; pursue the business opportunities.<p>So here's some more about me:<p>--I think I'm really capable when it comes to identifying opportunities. I believe I have a knack for envisioning innovative products and how they can be delivered to users in a valuable &#38; profitable way.<p>--I am extremely passionate and hard-working. Simply put, I will work as hard as anyone to pursue something I believe in.<p>--I know what I'm not: an engineer. I have some design skill and think I have a strong feel for quality user experience and product development, but I'm not looking for someone to do all my dirty work. I want a partner, in the truest sense of the word. Someone who I can brainstorm ideas with, and then together we can go running with them. Someone who will own the development from vision to code, while we work together to analyze the markets &#38; business angles. We both should exploit our strengths.<p>--I live in SF and am really only looking for someone in the Bay area<p>--I'm a pretty good guy to be around and extremely extremely loyal<p>--I currently work for a top tech company (starts with G and has an OO in it) and have a pretty strong set of people &#38; business skills. I've got a really valuable network that can connect us to investors, other entrepreneurs, and resources we might need.<p>At the end of the day, I've learned a ton talking to other start-up founders, developers, etc. over the last few months. I am absolutely determined not to be some business type who is naive enough to play down the value of an engineer, try to tell them what to do, or think that my "idea" is the valuable part (and not the implementation).<p>If any of the developers out there are looking for this kind of partnership, email me. I'd love to chat, share concepts, talk strategy, and just get a feel for the fit.<p>Thanks all, feel free to comment away and ask any questions you want. E-mail is in my profile.<p>Jon
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dstein
I just want to point out there seems to be a lot of Winklevoss-types looking
Zuckerburg-types these days, basically everywhere. I thought this trend would
die down after "The Social Network" came out, but in fact there seems to be
even more now. There are so many startups these days precisely because
developers have realized they don't need business-people, venture capital, or
any of that overhead to grow a business... and this is primarily what's
different about today's tech boom/bubble.

If your business plan is solid enough you would probably need to prove it, by
putting the plan onto paper and begin shopping it around to the VC's and angel
investors in SF. You'd need to show a developer that your idea is solid enough
that you can obtain funding otherwise I can't think of any reason a developer
would join a startup from square one at >50% dilution rather than start his
own project.

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steventruong
There are tons of engineers at Google (assuming the hint). Some of which must
be entrepreneurial. Why not reach out to those you know first rather than
approach strangers? It's one thing for people to not know coders personally or
all their friends are already doing something so they have no choice. It's
another to be surrounded by engineers and not be able to work with that. Sends
a strong signal even if there isn't one.

Not to be a dick about this either but most people think they have a knack for
"envisioning innovative products and how they can deliver value" but most fail
on finding challenges within their own ideas. Of course on the positive side,
you're at least willing to hash things out and explore ideas. That said
though, you probably need to bring some solid value proposition of which I'm
not seeing in the above pitch.

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jdsadow
Thanks for the thoughts everyone. A few responses all around...

DStein2: I've been given repeated and direct advise not to pursue funding
without a functioning prototype; most important reason is b/c terms are never
favorable.

I should add that quite a few of the folks we've talked to have been very
interested, it's been more that the fit really hasn't quite been right on both
sides yet.

And if I've learned anything from the engineers, it's that this game is about
5% idea/95% follow-through.

Steven: I can't really dive into this but it's just not as simple as you
think. Trust me, I wish it were, but employee NDAs and such are major hurdles.

Also, I've not ruled out getting a prototype done, but of of the engineers
I've talked to (>15) most said they would prefer to be involved from the
beginning as opposed to inherit a prototype.

Hoodoof: I am definitely planning to learn as much as I can, and would like to
develop the skills to build a prototype, at least.

I was just pointing out that I have a respect for the experience developers
have. Yes, I think I have a strong work ethic, but that's quite different than
being adamant I'll be able to out program more experienced people.

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steventruong
The problem is you shouldn't even care about NDAs regarding outsourcing your
prototype. It's about as bad as requiring an NDA to disclose your idea to
potential cofounders. In the mass majority of cases, no one cares and if you
outsource overseas, I don't see a high correlation with people jacking your
idea to outrun you in building your startup. I think you're going about it the
wrong way. The likelihood of someone pulling a "social network zuck" on you,
is very unlikely, especially for outsourcing a prototype.

As for possibly getting a prototype done, I don't understand the comment here.
If you outsource the work, you pay X and they code Y and you guys do the
exchange. There's no inheriting or whatever you're referring to. Sounds more
like you're trying to recruit employees or something than to purely just get
the prototype finished.

~~~
jdsadow
Steven, no need to be so antagonistic. The NDAs are between Google & its
employees.

I am not worried about losing my idea. I am not 100% focused on getting a
prototype done. I want to find a real partner to work with on my current
concept or any others.

~~~
steventruong
Wasn't trying to be antagonistic. Was addressing something that comes up very
often. You can't blame me for thinking so at the sight of stating NDA. That
said, NDA between companies and employees are more in reference to what the
company does. I can't imagine it would restrict you from leaving to pursue
your own idea with a fellow employee. But then again, I don't work for Google
so I don't know what they would require you to sign.

~~~
jdsadow
>>"I don't know what they would require you to sign"

Our lives away, basically.

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jdsadow
Hey Jack,

E-mail should be there now, sorry about that.

Everything I've learned from those with experience is that outsourcing is a
poor, short-term fix. I need the expertise & insight of a real engineering
lead, and one way or another when we get past the prototype phase, I'll just
have someone else's code and still no lead engineering presence.

~~~
steventruong
Just this comment here alone would deter me from wanting to work with you or
something like this. Getting a prototype up isn't the same as finding someone
long term to build a company together. It helps to see if there is traction
and better to understand what you're doing. No one ever said that you can't
find a cofounder AFTER you get the prototype done. This is not an either or
type of argument.

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hoodoof
>>>Simply put, I will work as hard as anyone to pursue something I believe in.

Perhaps you should work hard on learning to program then you won't need a life
partner and can do it yourself.

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jdsadow
This is a really great point. Starting teaching myself Java about a month ago
after I got frustrated with finding the right engineer, and plan to continue
to learn as much as I can from the ground floor.

However - and I think many would agree - there are engineers who have been
doing this their whole lives who are far beyond my capabilities and will be
even if I work incredibly hard for many years. I think it's naive (and
somewhat offensive) for me to think I should be able to fully catch up.

I do want to learn as much as I can, but I find it important to embrace the
skills I have. Ultimately, a real team is a requirement if any start-up is
going to succeed.

~~~
hoodoof
>>>Ultimately, a real team is a requirement if any start-up is going to
succeed.

Not true. Keep working on learning how to program and do it yourself. Try
harder.

>>>Simply put, I will work as hard as anyone to pursue something I believe in.

This assertion only has meaning if you actually work as hard as anyone. If you
worked as hard as anyone on learning to program then you would evenutally get
there.

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jackbean
Hey Jon, don't see an email in profile. Also any reason you can't outsource
the technical development?

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steventruong
You don't have one yourself lol

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latch
I'm curious, I'd like to hear the idea :)

You mix 'I' and 'we'...which is it?

~~~
steventruong
Most people use it interchangeably even if it's just them. Chances are it's
just him.

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jdsadow
Latch: shoot me an e-mail and I'm happy to share plenty.

The "I" and "we" is a little tricky. Someone else is involved with the current
concept, but his role really comes into play farther down the road.

The purpose of my post was regarding a partner, not just with this concept,
but with many opportunities going forward. In that sense, it's an "I."

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abbasmehdi
Jon, embrace your weakness by conquering it, not by giving up on it. DIY.

