
Prison Bankers Who Profit from the Inmates - nthitz
http://time.com/3446372/criminal-justice-prisoners-profit/
======
gergles
They also operate the e-mail system that can be used to send e-mail to/from
inmates (using a JPay tablet, of course). You have to purchase _' stamps'_.
For _e-mails_.[1]

1:
[http://www.jpayinc.com/email_videograms.html](http://www.jpayinc.com/email_videograms.html)

"One stamp corresponds to one 6000 character message (about the length of one
handwritten page), or one attachment."

"JPay’s correctional email service is faster than regular mail, with inmates
usually receiving emails within _48 hours_." (emphasis added)

Looking up the pricing for a random facility[2], it's $18 for 40 'stamps',
each one of which is good for 1 small attachment or 'page' of text. This is
fucking extortion.

2: [http://www.jpay.com/Facility-Details/Kentucky-Adult-
Institut...](http://www.jpay.com/Facility-Details/Kentucky-Adult-
Institutions/Kentucky-State-Penitentiary.aspx)

~~~
hueving
>This is fucking extortion.

Not to be too pedantic, but that's not extortion. Nobody is required to buy
them nor are they threatened by not buying them.

~~~
tankenmate
In the EU this would be considered extortion because you have a right to a
family life; unconscionable profit at the expense of this right might be
considered illegal, especially if it was the only service available (e.g.
banking, family visit, letters etc)

------
jMyles
The only question that rings to me anymore about these stories: What can I do?

What code can I write? What broker can I call? What form can I sign? How can I
register my civic will so as to undo this blight?

For me, this is the most embarrassing thing about being a United States
citizen.

~~~
corford
Start a kickstarter campaign to create a not for profit, ethical competitor to
JPay? Providing the prisons still get a similar commission (which according to
the article isn't where the lion's share of the fees comes from), why wouldn't
they opt to go with a payments firm that gives them good PR?

Edit: alternatively, maybe the stripe guys could fund/seed a philanthropic
off-shoot to tackle this?

~~~
felixc
Because of this (quoting from the article):

"To impress state corrections officials and gain their business, JPay spends
heavily on industry conventions attended by agency heads with contracting
authority. During a 2012 convention of the American Correctional Association,
the company threw what it called an “END OF THE WORLD PARTY” at a Denver wine
bar that bills itself as “about you, and your inalienable right to the
unbridled enjoyment of food and wine.”

The invitation, printed on a disposable beer coaster, promised “a bash, JPay-
style: _fuerte_ tequila, hand-rolled cigars, a live mariachi band.”
Conventioneers could catch a JPay shuttle leaving from the hotel “ALL NIGHT
LONG,” it said."

~~~
corford
That actually makes it easier. Build a non-profit competitor, get the press,
charities & public behind it and shame the fuckers in to switching. With
material like that it would be like shooting fish in a barrel.

~~~
felixc
One would hope so, but I suspect that they don't care about public perception,
_and_ a surprisingly large slice of the public would actually be _supportive_
of punitive treatment of prisoners' families.

~~~
jMyles
> large slice of the public would actually be supportive of punitive treatment
> of prisoners' families.

I refuse to believe this.

~~~
jackvalentine
> "Specifically, the stigma' of incarceration and the accusation of
> shamelessness are not reserved for offenders; as recent empirical and
> ethnographic research confirms, the families of convicted and incarcerated
> persons experience a significant stigma as well."

AUSTIN, R. 2004. Shame of It All: Stigma and the Political Disenfranchisement
of Formerly Convicted and Incarcerated Persons, The. Colum. Hum. Rts. L. Rev.,
36, 173.

------
Fjolsvith
The prison phone systems are also bilking families. In the Alaska prison
system, I had to call collect to my family. Phone calls were limited to 15
minutes and they cost my family $33 per call. I hated calling them because I
felt so bad about that cost.

~~~
cgag
They normally charge outrageous amounts for long distance calls, which is
basically all their calls. Last year the FCC limited the max rate of calls to
25 cents a minute, or 3.75 for a 15 minute call. Still outrageous, but at
least not as insane. They usually charge much less for local calls, and there
are a lot of services that will set up a number local to the prison and
forward calls to cell phones. It's easy enough to set a number yourself with
twilio if you're technically inclined, but most people with family in prisons
are unfamiliar with things like twilio or google voice.

[1][http://www.fcc.gov/document/fcc-reduces-high-long-
distance-c...](http://www.fcc.gov/document/fcc-reduces-high-long-distance-
calling-rates-paid-inmates)

~~~
saalweachter
Yeah, there's outrageous and there's extortion.

Like a $0.10 / kilobyte overage charge on cell phone data plans.

~~~
rhizome
Imagine not being allowed to own a cellphone.

------
mindcrime
There is a lot that one could say about this, but let me throw this in the
mix: a big part of the problem is simply that we (the US) have far, far too
many people incarcerated and "in the system" to begin with. The US ranks
second only to the Seychelles in terms of "prisoner count per 100,000 of
population"[1], at 707. And many of those people are in jail for non-violent
crimes, or crimes for which restitution would be a better consequence than
jail.

We need to decriminalise drug possession and sales, and focus on restitution
for cases of theft, fraud, etc. The people in jail should be mostly murderers,
rapists, and people who have shown themselves to be an active threat to
society. And even then I'm not actually convinced that jail is the best
solution, but let's tackle one problem at a time.

(Sidebar: a different Wikipedia page says the US incarceration rate is
actually the highest, not second. See:
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_incarceration_rat...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_incarceration_rate))

[1]:
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_incarcerat...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_incarceration_rate)

------
noonespecial
So they bribe and kick-back their way through the year and then throw a big
party (ahh 'convention') in Vegas where they give each other awards while
sucking down premium liquor, hand-rolled cigars, and no doubt metric tons of
the stuff half of their inmates are in prison for.

The pigs from 1984 would blush over this stuff.

~~~
brudgers
_Animal Farm_ is Orwell 's dystopia with pigs.

~~~
noonespecial
Doh. Dys-topia-phasia strikes me yet again.

------
beloch
This is a state-granted monopoly and it's being abused. The services JPay
offers should either be government run or open to free market competition.

~~~
innguest
How can we trust the government to solve this when it was the government that
created the problem to begin with?

~~~
disposition2
I doubt the government would be doing this:

"JPay is protected from other market forces, as well. When states offer its
music players and tablet computers for sale to inmates, they often confiscate
radios that people already own, according to inmates in Ohio. This leaves
inmates dependent on JPay’s music downloads, which can cost 30 to 50 percent
more than the same songs on iTunes, inmates say."

I'm confused, are you defending this company and its practices are merely
railing against government? Atleast with the government, there is a bit of
oversight. It seems like JPay is a monopoly thanks to bribery and their CEO's
lack of morality.

Edits: spelling

~~~
waterlesscloud
Who is confiscating the radios? JPay?

No.

~~~
donaldsfone
You cant have two devices at a time (prison security) - so if inmate buys an
mp3 player he has to give up his walkman

------
ajiang
For the record, it's this exact injustice that kicked off Bayes Impact. Pyduan
and I sat at dinner talking about my past life in private equity where I spent
a lot of time looking at private prison companies, including JPay. There are
huge barriers of entry into these markets, particularly in having close
relationships with the decision makers: commissioners of the Department of
Corrections.

The answer we came up with was a nonprofit that could develop strong
relationships with civic institutions and be free from conflicts of interest
and profit motives. This is a very poorly incentivized market, and startups
will have a tough time disrupting the existing players because such perverse
incentives exist. If anyone is interested in learning more, feel free to shoot
me a message, and I'm happy to chat.

FYI, JPay is moving into all modes of communications and media, including
email, video chats, music, etc. For families looking to keep in touch with
their loved ones in jail, they are essentially the Apple in jails.

------
mercurial
The cynical way prisoners are exploited is reminiscent of the way prisons in
the middle ages were run, except they didn't have marketers back then.

~~~
innguest
To me it is reminiscent of the way our government (and most others) works.

Both involve a monopoly on banking, granted by the government, to enrich
government-selected corporations, at the expense of non-bankers.

No need to go back to the middle ages to find analogies. :)

~~~
mercurial
I was more thinking of how prisoners used to be nickel and dimed by gaolers
back in the day.

------
discardorama
I don't understand. Why can't the state let a bank put a bloody ATM (or
several) in a common area, and let the inmates use debit cards?

My blood pressure was shooting up as I read that article. I don't mind people
charging a fee for providing _better_ service. But in this case, this human
leech is just spreading more misery. Why must these people abuse others this
way? I hope, when he is on his deathbed, this fucker suffers the most
unimaginable amount of pain for a long time.

~~~
pan69
>> Why can't the state let a bank put a bloody ATM (or several) in a common
area, and let the inmates use debit cards?

This is what you get in a privatised system. Money must be made and an ATM in
the common area is not going to do that.

[http://www.alternet.org/story/155199/private_prison_corporat...](http://www.alternet.org/story/155199/private_prison_corporations_are_modern_day_slave_traders)

~~~
discardorama
Is it any wonder then, that when the prisoners get out, they turn to crime? We
are subjecting them to a selfish, dog-eat-dog world every day; we are
harassing them, taking advantage of them (and their families) when they're the
weakest; and then we expect them to come out and behave like model citizens??

~~~
EliRivers
It's worse than that. As an eye-catching example to lead in, the United States
is the only country in the world in which more men are raped than women. The
U.S. authorities know this is the case, and they know that they have created
lawless societies in which they force people to live, without protection.

You take a man and you spend ten years teaching him that he is beyond the law.
That the law does not apply to him. That he can rape someone and the law will
look the other way, or that he can be raped and the authorities will offer him
no protection, no respite. Theft, robbery, assault, murder. Crimes committed
regularly, all around this man, and he sees every day that he can commit these
crimes and the law will not apply, he can be a victim of these crimes and the
law will not apply. The U.S. teaches a man for a decade that none of the rules
apply to him; that he is above the law is demonstrated to him over and over
and over again.

And then when he's released, having been taught this day in, day out,
brutally, every damn day for a decade, it's a fucking surprise that he commits
a crime?

------
jqm
Another shameful story about the criminal justice system in the US.... I wish
I were more shocked.

I'm not a sociologist and I'm not going to look for links, but I'm pretty sure
there is a strong correlation between poverty and crime. Now certainly
correlation doesn't mean causation... but is keeping people in poverty more
likely to cause or to prevent crime? But this question might make the bad
assumption that the intent of the criminal justice system is to prevent crime
in the first place.

We all pay for crime. Something to keep in mind. Social justice is more than
just feeling good and being fair. It's about practicality also.

------
notahacker
This looks like a nice gig to have too, running an app-store for a (literally)
captive market of over a million people:
[http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2012-08-14/the-apple-
of...](http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2012-08-14/the-apple-of-the-u-dot-
s-dot-prison-system)

------
eltondegeneres
The solution isn't making a more efficient competitor to Jpay. The solution is
abolishing prisons. Angela Davis has written a good short book on this subject
called "Are Prisons Obsolete?".

~~~
mercurial
Well, that may be a bit of a stretch (are you really going to put seasoned
killers in the street?). A first step would be ensure that inmates and their
families are not treated like animals. Unfortunately, this is also a societal
choice, and that's something often difficult to sensitize the citizenry to. A
system like this prospers because both JPay and the authorities benefit from
it, and because neither US citizens or the press, who could do something about
it, care about what happens.

------
trhway
making profit out of prisons, in all shape and forms, is a such unbelievable
conflict of interests. It is the ultimate monopoly - monopoly of force and
violence - that is being abused by existence of any revenue stream associated
with prison system.

------
breitling
_" He says he charges only as much as he must to maintain a razor-thin profit
margin."_

I have a hard time believing this. Does any one have experience in this space?
The way I understand it, it really shouldn't cost $6+ for an electronic
transaction.

~~~
ajiang
I used to do work in this space and personally diligenced JPay for investment
purposes. Their profit margins are low for the same reason most successful
startups have no profit - growth. They're growing incredibly fast, investing
in sales and marketing efforts (as well as the 'commissions'). Take out the
growth aspects, you have a company with very high gross margins.

~~~
jessaustin
Is this company in any sense a startup? They seem like a utility to me. I've
never seen any ads they've run, and I can't imagine an ad volume that would
justify $6 emails, so "sales and marketing" seems to be a euphemism for
"lobbying, bribery, and personal entertainment slush-fund". This much
basically-stolen money being thrown around is bound to erode ethics. It will
surprise no one if multiple principals of this firm get to use these services
personally within the decade.

~~~
donaldsfone
pEOPLe you're all talking out of total ignorance. Jpay has huge capex - since
none of you know anything about business ill explain - they spend millions
upon millions of dollars deploying networks and computer banks in prisons for
inmates to access these services. Now you know why their margins are high?
Understand why they charge for email? If they were gouging customers people
would send snail mail. You are all plain dumb. And I'm a former customer who
used to pay these damn fees!

~~~
jessaustin
Nice sock-puppet, Shapiro. I hope you lose the rest of your hair.

------
concerto
Two stories next to each other on the home page with someone called Ryan
Shapiro in them, in both cases he is 37. One where he is an foia activist [1],
and this one where he runs a company profiting from prisoner's families. Are
they the same people or is this just a strange coincidence?

[1][https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8390642](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8390642)

~~~
jonas21
Coincidence. This is the FOIA activist:
[http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2013/11/foia-ryan-
shapir...](http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2013/11/foia-ryan-shapiro-fbi-
files-lawsuit)

------
bliksem
What an utterly sick, broken system. Cannot contain my despair at this.

------
Fjolsvith
CCA (Community Corrections of America) is owned by a group of judges, I
believe. They run for-profit inmate holding centers across the US.

~~~
7Figures2Commas
> CCA (Community Corrections of America) is owned by a group of judges, I
> believe.

CCA, Corrections Corporation of America, is publicly-traded REIT, as is GEO
Group. Anybody here with access to the American public equities markets can
purchase shares of stock in CXW or GEO.

------
hyperliner
There is a good lesson in this article that is getting lost in the debate. The
lesson is _don 't go around committing armed robberies._ You are screwing your
family. More specifically, you are punishing your mother.

------
penguindev
Amateurs. We're all prisoners to ZIRP, QE, 'collectible' taxes on gold, and
central banking which is all legalized counterfeiting for the .01%

