
Psychedelics could heal brain cells in people suffering from depression: study - pmoriarty
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/health/psychedelic-drugs-brain-repair-lsd-depression-anxiety-lsd-dmt-amphetamines-ketamine-a8395511.html
======
cyberpip
Lately, all this media attention to psychedelics reminds me of this Terence
McKenna quote:

"[W]hy this[psychedelics] is not four-inch headlines on every newspaper on the
planet I cannot understand because I don’t know what news you were waiting
for, but this is the news that I was waiting for. It’s an incredible challenge
to human understanding to try and make sense of this."

from
[https://www.asktmk.com/talks/Rap+Dancing+Into+the+Third+Mill...](https://www.asktmk.com/talks/Rap+Dancing+Into+the+Third+Millenium?query=four-
inch%20headlines)

[https://youtu.be/adDRsqEj4PU?t=1641](https://youtu.be/adDRsqEj4PU?t=1641)

~~~
pmoriarty
_" [W]hy this[psychedelics] is not four-inch headlines on every newspaper on
the planet"_

Psychedelics might reveal to you that the neat little reality that you thought
you had all figured out is a lot stranger and different from from what you
thought it was, that your understanding of it might be all wrong, and that
your place in it might not be all that cozy and secure. The experience could
put everything in to question for you.

A lot of people feel threatened by that, so they try to push it away, lock it
up, turn it off, or dismiss it.

Contrast that reaction to that in some other societies with a long tradition
of psychedelic use. Psychedelic experiences there usually confirm the world
view of the society, and tend to be very positive and accepted.

~~~
cyberpip
Another Terence McKenna quote I'm reminded of!

"The British enzymologist, J. B. S. Haldane in the 1920s, in an essay, said,
"The universe may not only be stranger than we suppose; it may be stranger
than we can suppose," and I suggest to you that as we look back over human
history, every pinnacle of civilizationf whether it be Mayan or Greco-Roman or
Song dynasty, has believed that it was in possession of an accurate
description of the cosmos and of man's relationship to it. This seems to go-
this seems to go along with the full flowering of a civilization. But, from
the point of view of our present civilization, we regard all those conceptions
as, at worst quaint, at best half right, and congratulate ourselves that our
civilization, at last, has its finger on the real description of what is going
on. " from
[https://www.asktmk.com/talks/Psychedelic+Society?query=stran...](https://www.asktmk.com/talks/Psychedelic+Society?query=stranger%20than%20we%20can%20suppose)

~~~
yosito
Eh, I'm not saying we have a full picture of what's going on, but the
scientific method is much more effective at helping us arrive at a real
description of what is going on than any arbitrary religion of the past.

~~~
GuiA
The scientific method is the most important tool that humanity has ever
developed, without question.

That being said, the belief that the scientific method can build up
arbitrarily accurate models of any observable phenomena is without foundation,
yet some behave as if it is obviously true.

Until we have something like a unified model of physics, there is no reason to
believe that statement to be true.

(and in fact, the scientific method has led to results like Gödel’s
incompleteness theorem, which makes it perhaps more likely for it to be false)

~~~
mythrwy
I question that the scientific method is the most important tool humanity has
ever developed.

Maybe numbers and language (especially written) are more important. Oh ya, and
fire.

But the scientific method is way up there in important, no argument there.

------
tranchms
I recommend reading the LSD Clincial Handbook:

[https://www.maps.org/resources/responding_to_difficult_psych...](https://www.maps.org/resources/responding_to_difficult_psychedelic_experiences/185-handbook-
for-the-therapeutic-use-of-lysergic-acid-diethylamide-25)

LSD changed my life, and continues to do so.

If you live in California, check out MAPS and Psychedelic Seminars.

I’m a huge advocate because I have experienced first hand the profound
transformation that occurs as a result of a psychedelic experience.

~~~
alexandercrohde
Not to negate this anecdote, but just to point out your mileage may vary. The
research on this subject is still in its infancy.

I know a lot of people are looking for that "magic-bullet" panacea for all
their small woes (social anxiety, minor depression, etc) and have tried
everything under the sun (exercise, all kinds of diets, all kinds of books).
It's been my experience with the people I knew personally who did
acid/psylocibin didn't always improve as much by my measure as they did by
self-report.

~~~
tranchms
I hear ya. My anecdote is unique. If I provided more context, and told you my
life story, it might make better sense. And it’s impossible to assign
responsibility solely to psychedelics, but after years of hospitalizations and
addictions and depression and suicidal attempts and witnessing a few friends
suicides, there was a turning point in my life, and it conincided with my
experimentation of LSD and mushrooms, something I only put together years
later in hindsight.

I think the psychedelics nurture the ability to recognize that feelings and
narratives are not representative of reality, that there are multiple
realities bound up in which perspective you possess, or which one possesses
you.

The ability to detach from self, to recognize a spectrum of truth, of
perception, is one of the greatest benefits of psychedelic experiences.

I’ve used LSD for years off and on, and I can’t tell you how many times I’ve
taken it. So many I lost count long ago. It’s a beautiful experience, and it
helps me and everyone I share it with to this day.

I have friends who remark what a profound life changing experience it was for
them years after our trip together, and it always catches me off guard. You
never know how profound it affects a person. Sometimes it takes years to
recognize the shift that took place.

Either way, I think there is so much promise. I’m a huge advocate, and I think
people who struggle with mental health issues should definitely explore
psychedelics (I would caution those with schizoid tendencies/ family
histories). Anyone with anxiety, depression, addictions, compulsive
thoughts... there is much promise there.

~~~
Sohakes
>I think the psychedelics nurture the ability to recognize that feelings and
narratives are not representative of reality

>The ability to detach from self, to recognize a spectrum of truth, of
perception

It sounds a lot like meditation and buddhist practice. I mean, I already hear
that everywhere and there are some clinical trials with meditation too. But
your narrative fits nicely. That's cool.

~~~
ycombinete
Yes. In his book Waking Up, Sam Harris (yes, that Sam Harris), makes this same
connection. He does it in a very sensitive way too, without suggesting
psychedelics as a shortcut to mindfulness.

Edit: I've never experienced psychedelics myself, but have had been using
mindfulness/meditation to come to terms with these same ideas.

------
kraig911
I could see this seriously being a net positive in the care of people say
dying from cancer, depression from paralysis etc. Not all of us can lift
weights or simply go for a walk, but our minds yearn to be free.

~~~
benevol
This is already being done. In Switzerland.

Summary:
[https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4086777/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4086777/)

The MD's website [in german]:
[http://www.petergasser.ch/](http://www.petergasser.ch/)

------
jvandyke
I recommend reading "How to Change Your Mind" by Michael Pollan if you're all
interested in the history and details of psychedelics.
[https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/36613747-how-to-
change-y...](https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/36613747-how-to-change-your-
mind)

Based my reading of that, what these researchers are doing is _not_
prescribing psychedelics to patients with mental disorders and giving the
whole "take one time a day with food". What these researchers are finding is
that the drugs can be very effective in a therapeutic setting with a guide
(trained therapist or otherwise) to coach and conform the experience to reach
a goal. In other words to those familiar with these drugs, set and setting.
That is, mindset and surroundings are at least as important as the drug itself
to achieving anything. Without that, it's just a drug experience. This is very
unique compared to the drugs we're used to.

No medication will ever be a miracle drug, and most drugs show a significant
decline in effectiveness once they're out of small trials and methods have
standardized. However, any drug or therapy that sees orders of magnitude of
improvement over existing drugs and therapies is promising and not worth
dismissing simply because of a moral panic from the 60s or the Puritan ideals
of our Western culture. Given time and the leeway to experiment, hopefully we
will find uses for this class of drugs that have gone shunned for decades for
no reason other than someone's moral qualms.

~~~
scythe
The trouble is that talk therapy is already too expensive for most patients,
and unless you plan to have people tripping with a therapist who is a complete
stranger ( _not advised!_ ) you're going to need to charge for some
preliminary sessions. If a typical therapist charges $100 per hour -- and
that's optimistic, in fact I've never paid less than $125 -- then the cost of
treatment quickly runs into four figures.

That's already more expensive than a year on SSRIs, as crazy as that might
sound. Human interaction is shockingly expensive.

~~~
jvandyke
The cost is something to consider, but let that not dissuade us from exploring
the opportunity. There are many therapies that are covered by insurance due to
their medical backing. Insurance companies would rather pay for life-saving
procedures that are hundreds of dollars rather than trauma, end of life care,
or life insurance payouts. The evidence needs to be persuasive, though.

------
ttul
So, precisely the wrong approach would be to block research of any kind by
continuing the severe prohibition of these substances.

~~~
ams6110
Perhaps we need a new category of prescription, e.g. "for use only under
direct supervision of a qualified medical professional"

In other words it could be dispensed in a clinical setting, but not via a
pharmacy or other "take home" pathways.

I'm thinking that must already exists for certain surgical anesthetics, etc.

~~~
Alex3917
> I'm thinking that must already exists for certain surgical anesthetics, etc.

Correct. You can get cocaine when you're at your ophthalmologist, but not from
your pharmacy.

~~~
vidarh
For that matter, heroin is used as a morphine alternative in some UK
hospitals, and morphine itself is another example.

------
kneel
I've had great experiences with LSD, experiences that may have even changed my
trajectory in life.

That being said I would never recommend LSD to someone undergoing serious
mental health issues. IMO not safe at all, you can really end up in a bad
place.

~~~
jonknee
A clinical setting is far different than giving someone some tabs and letting
them loose at a concert or house party.

~~~
artursapek
A clinic, concert, or house party are all terrible settings for taking LSD.
They are confined, crowded spaces. You want something wide open, in nature.
Try the mountains, or the desert.

~~~
3131s
Well, just don't get lost. I've taken LSD hundreds of times and the worst was
undoubtedly in nature (it was my fault, but I'm sure I'm not the first to make
this mistake). I've done it plenty of times at house parties and it's been
fine. My objection to a "clinical setting" is being alone with someone you
don't know that well, and like you said, being confined and expected / forced
to stay with that person.

------
degrews
I'm very excited to see the results of this study [1], testing the effects of
a one-time dose of psilocybin (magic mushrooms) on a sample size of 400+
suffering from treatment-resistant depression.

The podcast episode referenced in the article is also well-worth listening to.
They talk about the current state of the research, the regulatory process,
getting funding, etc.

[1] [https://boingboing.net/2018/05/23/depression-the-
psychedelic...](https://boingboing.net/2018/05/23/depression-the-psychedelic-
cu.html)

------
benevol
Highly recommended:

The Psychedelic Explorer's Guide, by Jim Fadiman
([http://www.psychedelicexplorersguide.com/](http://www.psychedelicexplorersguide.com/))

~~~
Alex3917
If you're interesting in taking psychedelics, this is the best book to read
beforehand. I seem to remember Neal Goldsmith's Psychedelic Healing book also
being good, but it's been too long since I've read it.

------
wincy
I’m really worried about the subset of the population with preexisting mental
disorders such as manic depressive disorder, schizophrenia, and depression who
will suffer a psychotic break from the use of these substances. Maybe I’m
wrong, but from what I’ve heard and read it seems like there’s no way to know
what will happen until you try it. A certain percentage of the population goes
to hell in the most literal sense of the word possible. Anecdotally, the
people I personally know who have tried psychedelics (maybe 6 or 7 people, all
who did no know one another) seem to have a weird mental frailty to them,
where because their ego disappeared(?) briefly and psychedelics were allowing
mental connections that wouldn’t have arisen without psychedelics, they begin
to question everything, almost like a rebuilding of their fundamental axioms
from scratch. There’s also a strange fervor for others to try it, even from
people who have had bad trips.

Joe Rogan had Michael Pollan on recently[0], who wrote The Omnivores Dilemma
and a new book How To Change Your Mind[1] which talks about the benefits of
hallucinogens. They also briefly talk about the psychotic breaks some people
will experience as a result of widespread use and shrug it off like it’ll be
fine. Aldous Huxley wrote a book about his use of mescaline called Doors of
Perception[2] which felt almost unintelligible and very strange to me as a
person who has not (and will not, as my mental health is great but I’m certain
I’m at risk of a psychotic break from hallucinogens due to family history)
done psychedelics.

[0]
[https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=tz4CrWE_P0g](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=tz4CrWE_P0g)

[1] [https://www.amazon.com/Change-Your-Mind-Consciousness-
Transc...](https://www.amazon.com/Change-Your-Mind-Consciousness-
Transcendence/dp/1594204225/ref=mp_s_a_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1528824854&sr=8-1&pi=AC_SX236_SY340_QL65&keywords=michael+pollan&dpPl=1&dpID=41yw3Jt4KaL&ref=plSrch)

[2] [https://www.amazon.com/Doors-Perception-Heaven-
Hell/dp/00617...](https://www.amazon.com/Doors-Perception-Heaven-
Hell/dp/0061729078/ref=mp_s_a_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1528825040&sr=8-1&pi=AC_SX236_SY340_QL65&keywords=doors+of+perception&dpPl=1&dpID=61ybO4ucZvL&ref=plSrch)

~~~
oldgeezr
I have permanent visual disturbances and suffered long-term panic attacks and
anxiety as a result of psychedelic use. Things got better over time, but not
completely back to normal. I'm not advocating for the continuation of our
current legal strategy, but I feel like these drugs need to come with strong
cultural wisdom about their appropriate use and potential for abuse.

Anyone who's been in a psychedelic community for long(stoners, deadheads, etc)
knows at least a few people who have been temporarily(1 day - 1 year) or
permanently fried from having experienced one or many trips. I feel like there
is often a backlash against our regressive legal approach which tends to
accentuate the positives and diminish the negatives but really we need
information. These drugs can permanently change your personality in some ways
that will generally not be seen as positive. Yes, they can have many good
effects but that comes with a small risk of extreme side effects.

~~~
pmoriarty
Are these people "fried" because they used those substances, or because of how
they used them, or how they viewed, integrated (or not-integrated) their
experiences?

A visual distortion is a good example. When experiencing a visual distortion,
it is possible to feel anxious about the appearance of such a distortion, or
instead one could be indifferent to it, or even enjoy and welcome it. It need
not be negative.

More research is certainly needed on the negative experiences people sometimes
have with psychedelics (so far, most of the research has focused on the
positives), but I have a strong feeling that how people approach their
experiences, what they expect to happen, and how they interpret what happens
plays a very critical role on whether the experience is positive or negative
for them. This is the old "set" (or "mindset") part of "set and setting"
that's critically important for their constructive use.

Also, it may be possible to work through any anxiety or negative effects one
experience with a therapist. Panic attacks and anxiety, for instance, are
things that therapists tend to be actually really good at treating.

~~~
AnimalMuppet
Depends on the distortion. A visual distortion means that you aren't seeing
things as they really are. That could be problematic for your ability to
drive, or to ride a bike, or any number of other activities. You could be
indifferent to that, but it could still be a genuine problem for your ability
to function.

~~~
__blockcipher__
Even without visual distortions, none of us ever see things as they are :)

As a fun fact, you can drive on LSD if you’re experienced with psychedelics
and know you can trust yourself, at least under doses <150ug. Absolutely not
recommending it to anyone, but the visuals don’t really get in the way. (I’ve
only driven on acid once, when I witnessed a really, really bad skateboarding
accident and had to rush a stranger to the ER).

IME most people handle psychs fine, some can handle practically anything, and
some will lose connection to reality and basically forget how rational thought
works on an eighth of mushrooms. There’s little indicators that have given me
an idea of how someone might react, but you never know for sure. Thus why the
advice to have a trip sitter is always given - personally I’ve never needed a
trip sitter, but I’ve seen people who absolutely did.

~~~
pmoriarty
_" you can drive on LSD if you’re experienced with psychedelics and know you
can trust yourself, at least under doses <150ug. ... Absolutely not
recommending it to anyone, but the visuals don’t really get in the way."_

It's not just the visuals that are the problem. Temporal distortions are
common -- you can feel like time has stopped or slowed down or sped up or gone
backwards. Also, you might get disoriented or confused -- not understanding
where you are or what you're doing or how a steering wheel works while you're
on the freeway is probably not the wisest or safest thing to subject yourself
or others on the road to. Or you might get irresistibly entranced by a fleck
of paint on your dashboard, which could look like a whole animated world to
you, while you should be keeping your eyes on the road, etc, etc, etc.

You know how there's a warning not to drive or operate heavy machinery on some
medications? Well, that warning should be on psychedelics, only times 1000.

------
GauntletWizard
I tried Psychedelics for my depression, and my roommate has been self
medicating similarly. I think they can help - but they're going to make the
current opioid epidemic look like child's play. I have very carefully limited
my intake - and I'm finding that I don't like a lot of what I've found. I'm
definitely finding my roommate is becoming a worse person, and well on the way
to all of the ugly things that we associate with drug use.

~~~
lalos
What are the ugly things associated with psychedelic drug use? I would think
the 'worst' would be becoming a full blown hippie and remove yourself from
society but still that would be a personal choice. What are the traits you see
as a worse person?

~~~
dqpb
Thats clever! Warp a persons mind with drugs and then chalk up any extreme
behavior change to personal choice.

~~~
lalos
The adjective worse was what I was asking about. What is worse about a person
that decides to live off the grid? or not care about materialistic things? Yes
the decision/change was extreme and caused by the experience of the drug use
but why classify it as worse? I'm not saying drugs are safe, just that I've
never heard of people doing psychedelics and behaving like alcoholics, addicts
of pain killers, etc. That is why I asked what examples of 'worse' did he
notice, I want to hear from his experience maybe he is on to something.

------
bookofjoe
Original article: "Psychedelics Promote Structural and Functional Neural
Plasticity" [https://www.cell.com/cell-
reports/fulltext/S2211-1247(18)307...](https://www.cell.com/cell-
reports/fulltext/S2211-1247\(18\)30755-1)

------
sakopov
I don't know how legitimate these stories are, but some folks swear that
they've gotten rid of various addictions after their trips on Ayahuasca. This
is apparently a mixture of plants that some tribes in South America have been
using for self-medication for ages.

~~~
dqpb
Yeah, let's take medical advice from ancient intoxicated tribesmen. That will
work out great.

~~~
phry
excuse me sir, your western chauvinism is showing

~~~
dqpb
I'm just a rational adult whose skeptical of practically everyone. My comment
can be applied to all cultures throughout history.

Your thought-terminating-cliche however is clearly biased.

------
misiti3780
Sam Harris just did a very interesting podcast with Micheal Pollan about this:

[https://samharris.org/podcasts/127-freedom-
known/](https://samharris.org/podcasts/127-freedom-known/)

He wrote a book about it also:
[https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1594204225](https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1594204225)

------
rjurney
My experience tells me that excessive MDMA use makes the drug not work, and
results in severe depression. I've experienced it, I've seen others experience
it. Neurotoxicity would seem to be the explanation.

~~~
openfuture
MDMA is not a "proper" psychadelic imo

------
rhcom2
An interesting point is that since taking SSRIs LSD and mushrooms have a much
more diminished effect on me which anecdotally seems to be common.

~~~
ttul
The SSRIs cause more circulating seratonin, which means there is less
seratonin waiting to be released by the action of the LSD. Your high will be
diminished, but also will last longer.

~~~
alexbeloi
You're probably thinking of MDMA, which releases serotonin. LSD doesn't
release seratonin, but it does have similar shape to serotonin and therefore
can trigger the same receptors that serotonin does.

------
nsedlet
The possibilities for psychedelic drugs to treat and shed insight into mental
health issues are exciting. But I think it's worth pointing out (especially if
you are a recreational user or are considering it) that we don't understand
the side effects very well. Low resolution, we know they don't kill you or
lead to addiction (though they can cause problems in people with underlying
mental health problems).

But I'm concerned about the subtler, not-obviously-harmful-but-not-
necessarily-desirable ways in which they permanently alter the brain. Slate
Star Codex has a few recent articles that are worth considering:

[http://slatestarcodex.com/2018/06/06/hppd-and-the-specter-
of...](http://slatestarcodex.com/2018/06/06/hppd-and-the-specter-of-permanent-
side-effects/)

[http://slatestarcodex.com/2016/04/28/why-were-early-
psychede...](http://slatestarcodex.com/2016/04/28/why-were-early-
psychedelicists-so-weird/)

~~~
Alex3917
The risk of HPPD seems to be very related to frequency of use, dosage, how
strongly the substance binds to the receptor, and the anxiety levels of the
person taking it.

It's a risk that should be taken very seriously, but if you're just taking a
low dose of mushrooms once a year or so it's not a huge risk.

~~~
rebuilder
This is a tough subject. Like the first link in GP's post notes, HPPD can't
really be caused by LSD persisting in the body. The article presents another
hypothesis, where LSD might kill off important neurons. But LSD and other
psychedelics have been taken by millions of people, and the odds of getting
HPPD seem fairly low, although significant.

Is it reasonable to assume a direct chemical action as the cause here? We
accept that e.g. PTSD results from experienced trauma, and psychedelics like
LSD can certainly induce very intense mental states. Could that not be enough
to explain "flashbacks" etc?

~~~
Alex3917
> Is it reasonable to assume a direct chemical action as the cause here

I don't think so. There might be a chemical cause, but to me the correlation
with anxiety makes it more likely that it's a state-shifting phenomenon, more
like depression.

------
beenBoutIT
There's some evidence to suggest that they could also mitigate or repair TBI
and other types of brain damage. Hopefully the NFL will throw some money at
research and end up becoming a proponent of this type of cure.

~~~
trhway
>they could also mitigate or repair TBI and other types of brain damage.
Hopefully the NFL

they could be especially effective in mitigating TBI if taken right before the
game :)

------
rbosinger
It's just important to understand that it goes both ways. These drugs can also
bring up mental issues. They are powerful in both directions.

------
gm-conspiracy
But how can a drug company patent that?

~~~
Symmetry
It's pretty easy. You just get a specific version you patent through the FDA
and that will be the only one doctors are allowed to proscribe because it's
FDA approved.

[http://slatestarcodex.com/2014/06/15/fish-now-by-
prescriptio...](http://slatestarcodex.com/2014/06/15/fish-now-by-
prescription/)

------
tolgerias
Tell that to Anthony Bourdain...

------
ameister14
This is wildly speculative, as expected. Some mice grew dendrites. That
doesn't mean anything about humans and doesn't come close to meaning anything
about depression. It's not that simple.

~~~
stinos
I don't think the claim is 'it's that simple', but rather 'this warrants more
research into the subject'. As usual. But that's not a bad thing.

~~~
ameister14
Sure - if the underlying hypothesis that it's the plasticity that makes
ketamine effective is true, these things also promote plasticity so it's worth
looking into. Speculative news articles like this though mostly serve to have
people debate and form opinions well before evidence is presented, though, as
is what is happening in this thread.

There's a very long road between showing that these drugs promote
neuritogenesis and proving their clinical effectiveness.

------
User23
Or one could lift weights, which is even safer and has many positive ancillary
effects. [https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamapsychiatry/article-
abst...](https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamapsychiatry/article-
abstract/2680311)

~~~
briga
A lot of people just want a no-effort cure-all. Things like exercise,
meditation, healthy eating--all of which can help with mental health problems
--require concentrated effort over a long period of time, and thus are
unlikely to be preferred over a pill.

Before anyone gets upset, I'm not saying that pills are bad, I'm just saying
that many rely on them without making an effort to make other positive changes
to their life.

~~~
Jare
"Mental health" and "making an effort" are two dangerous terms to combine in
the same argument. Just getting out of bed every morning can already be a big
effort for many people with mental health problems, much bigger effort than
exercise is for many sane folks; it should be appreciated as such.

~~~
User23
Your point is taken, but one must remember that in the end we are all of us
responsible for our own lives.

There's a reason why people who lift joke that the heaviest weight in the gym
is the front door.

One approach that has worked well for many is establishing positive habits to
displace negative ones. That takes a while, but there are tricks to help, like
having a group to hold you accountable.

~~~
Jare
Accountability works for procrastination and things that, as you say, can be
described as negative habits or character traits. Depression is a completely
different beast.

Depression is like I'm sitting on your chest and tell you that breathing is
easy and all you need is to do it rhythmically.

Depression is like that day your brain doesn't function properly after not
sleeping during the night, but every day for years and regardless how much you
sleep.

Depression is not a bad habit, just like the flu is not a warm and fuzzy
feeling.

~~~
mmt
Agreed.

Furthermore, what is somewhat amazing is that, on a Good Day (or less
depressed or in-remission day, or whatever one wants to call it), one can also
look back on a Bad Day, just yesterday, and be mystified why that seemingly
dead simple task [1], seemed completely overwhelming to the point of
impossibility.

Like many diseases of the brain, including dementias and schizophrenia, the
sufferer can seem and even _be_ fully functional when the disease isn't (as)
active, including being prone to falling for the same fallacies as everyone
else.

In the throes of the symptoms, however, the brain just isn't working the same,
so it's not fair, compassionate, nor reasonable to extrapolate about habit
formation or responsibility from an unafflicted brain. It can get a bit too
easy to blame the victim that way.

None of this is to say that encouraging good habit formation or increased
patient self direction/determination can't be helpful, when possible. I'm just
saying not to start with that as an _assumption_ and that it likely isn't even
possible for the more severe cases.

[1] taking out the trash, running the dishwasher, or even just getting out of
bed

------
jotm
Could be, maybe, let's just wait until thousands more die because they were
denied access to these illegal drugs. Then we'll publish some "new" findings
and maybe in 30 years, the filthy peasants will be allowed to use drugs under
extreme supervision.

~~~
dang
Could you please not post indignant rant-style comments like this to Hacker
News? It isn't that you're wrong, but that the genre does more damage to the
forum than the rightness of the comment does good. A lot more, actually, so we
need people to just not do this.

[https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html](https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html)

~~~
jotm
Hmm yeah, shadowban this account then I won't post anymore, at all. I'd be
really grateful, too.

------
foobaw
Having controlled psychedelics could be safer - especially in the raving
community where too often deaths occur from dangerously mixed and pressed
substances.

There has to be a more comprehensive study done on its neurotoxicity. Or more
studies in general. But who will pay for it and why?

~~~
jarmitage
"too often deaths occur from dangerously mixed and pressed substances" \-
citation needed, compared to other risk factors

------
gwbas1c
Can I please get my (giggle) medical LSD? I need to take my medicine before I
go into the Flaming Lips concert. (giggle)

