
MasterCard breaks ranks in WikiLeaks blockade - Lightning
http://wikileaks.org/MasterCard-breaks-ranks-in.html
======
Amadou
Two steps forward.

One step back: [http://torrentfreak.com/mastercard-and-visa-start-banning-
vp...](http://torrentfreak.com/mastercard-and-visa-start-banning-vpn-
providers-130703/)

~~~
mrweasel
I understand that people may have legitimate needs for a VPN, but as someone
who has to deal with credit card fraud almost daily, I can understand their
reasoning.

Sure it sucks if you need a VPN, but if you're someone trying to catch people
trying to defraud you it makes a lot of sense. VISA and MasterCard has rather
high demands from businesses when it comes to preventing fraud, so naturally
we have high demands to them. Restricting access to VPNs is a simple way of
blocking a large number of low ranking fraudsters.

~~~
_delirium
I can see blocking CC transactions that originate from a VPN provider's IP
space, as having a high risk of fraud. But this is about blocking payments
_to_ the VPN providers, which seems somewhat different. Are they worried that
the purchase of VPN services is itself often done via CC fraud? From the
statement it sounds like they're more worried about the existence of VPN
services at all.

It doesn't personally affect me, though, because just about anything you can
do via a VPN you can do by buying a VPS and ssh -D'ing through it. It takes
slightly more technical skill, but anyone who can operate PuTTY can do it
after reading about 1 page of instructions. And I consider it unlikely that
Visa will start blocking payments to Linode or Digital Ocean...

~~~
Amadou
> just about anything you can do via a VPN you can do by buying a VPS

I like my VPN service because my network traffic is mixed in with all the
other users. Makes it harder to distinguish between my web browsing and their
web-browsing.

The other major benefit I get from VPN is the ability to very quickly switch
VPN egress points - so I get a new IP address half-way across the planet. That
makes it harder to isolate my web usage too, it also is a work-around for geo-
blocks on some websites.

I don't think either of those are functions of a VPS.

~~~
justincormack
Well you could use a cloud service to do the second one. The first is harder.

------
il
Note this is likely due to a Supreme Court decision rather than any particular
goodwill from MasterCard.

~~~
reso
No, Mastercard International has now stated that they are ending the blockade.

 _In a letter from VALITOR´s lawyers, VALITOR relates how it sought the
opinions of MasterCard International and VISA on the proposed July 1 cut-off.
In its response MasterCard made clear to VALITOR that it no longer desires to
blockade WikiLeaks. VISA has not responded._

~~~
rocky1138
This is something VALITOR has said, yes? Have we heard directly from
MasterCard? Why the reversal?

~~~
lhnz
>> In a letter from VALITOR´s lawyers, VALITOR relates how it sought the
opinions of MasterCard International and VISA on the proposed July 1 cut-off.
In its response MasterCard made clear to VALITOR that it no longer desires to
blockade WikiLeaks. VISA has not responded.

There goes, I read the article for you.

------
jdmitch
If VALITOR processes both Visa and Mastercard aren't they both breaking ranks?
Sure, MC has "made clear to VALITOR that it no longer desires to blockade
WikiLeaks" but Visa's no response means the same thing. Assuming that the NSA
is now going to be tracking everyone that donates to WikiLeaks through
VALITOR, at least Visa is not commenting on the situation, rather than sending
mixed messages.

~~~
tedivm
Considering the wikileaks donation page is taking Visa now I'd say you're
right- [https://shop.wikileaks.org/donate](https://shop.wikileaks.org/donate)

------
latj
We need an alternative currency to credit cards that is easy to transfer to
other people and anonymous. We need....cash.

~~~
chris_mahan
can gold be shipped? Gold in 1/10 oz coins should be fairly anonymous.

~~~
smellf
Yes. You can legally ship cash and precious metals up to a certain limit,
although I think I read something about the EU trying to ban these kind of
shipments soon.

~~~
stfu
Any source for that? Would love to read a bit up on that EU situation.

~~~
Silhouette
I don't have a specific source, but there was a lot of talk about this kind of
thing in Europe earlier this year, around the time certain governments
proposed or implemented big cash grabs, particularly in Cyprus. Likewise there
have been draconian restrictions proposed or implemented on withdrawing large
amounts of cash from bank accounts, taking currency out of the country, and so
on.

Presumably those governments can't afford for the wealthy to run from
centrally controllable banking systems to tangible assets like gold, because
short of raiding everyone's home the cash grab strategy fails at that point.
If those assets are small enough to be smuggled out, then even raiding homes
wouldn't help.

The problem they now have, of course, is that some places have lost anything
resembling public trust in either the government or the banking sector. The
moment they lift the restrictions, they're going to see a large chunk of
wealth leaving their borders. Moreover, their chances of getting serious
investment from anyone to help their countries recover from the financial mess
of recent years are now very low, and any investment they do get is going to
have all kinds of horrible strings attached and high interest rates.

~~~
stfu
Totally get that. The only thing that somewhat surprises me is why gold /
bitcoins are so that stable despite the ongoing distrust in the system. Either
people don't care or their impact is way to small to impact the markets.

------
pvnick
Awesome! So happy to see some common sense being sporadically applied these
days. Crossing my fingers that Mastercard stands up to the inevitable
"cordial" phonecall from old Biden.

------
minifigure
Mastercard is a US company. They will store personal details of all people who
donate to wikileaks. Isn't that the kind of info NSA would want to have?

~~~
corford
Well at some point you've got to stand up and put your money where your mouth
is.

And if you're sympathetic to the Wikileaks cause, you're probably already on
an NSA list anyway...

------
geekam
I wonder if it is legal in the United States to visit Wikileaks website.

~~~
hedonist
"Legal" in the sense that it's constitutionally protected. In theory.

"Illegal" in the sense that doing so no doubt exposes you to tracking and
other forms of extrajudicial government abuse.

~~~
sneak
Every visit to every website exposes you to tracking, as we've learned.

~~~
hedonist
But when we visit certain websites, we get _extra special_ attention.

------
hkon
That was because the NSA was unable to track wikileaks sympathizers through
PRISM. They just want the credit records.

------
alan_cx
I do hope people who support freedom, openness, and the rule of law now apply
for Mastercard services to show them approval and support. It would be a very
good way to demonstrate to MC that they have done the right thing, as well as
a clear signal to those who stifle freedom and the rule of law.

~~~
_mulder_
I can think of many ways to show "support for freedom, openness and the rule
of law". Signing up with a Multinational Credit Card company is certainly not
one of them...

What about just donating to Wikileaks, Pirate party, or spending your money
doing things made only possible because of "freedom, openess, and the rule of
law". Like filing that FOI request you've always wanted.

------
dudurocha
Why not accept bitcoins? I think bitcoins was made exacly for cases like this,
where individual freedom and state/private regulations clash.

Does anyone knows why not they accept bitcoins?

EDIT: Oh, good to know they accept bitcoins, thanks!

~~~
veridies
They do, in fact, seem to accept bitcoin:
[https://shop.wikileaks.org/donate#dbitcoin](https://shop.wikileaks.org/donate#dbitcoin)

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marcamillion
You know...I must say, although Assange has an aire about him that rubs me the
wrong way sometimes, I must say I admire his conviction.

This man has been holed up in an Ecuadorean embassy in London for the past 2
years, roughly and the USGov't has tried to stifle donations to Wikileaks and
he has stuck through all of that.

Now his stick-to-it-ive-ness is starting to pay off.

Congrats to him for a) Having the conviction of his beliefs, and b) To stick
with his conviction, despite the great personal costs.

Hats off Assange. Hats off.

------
lettergram
I wonder if they are doing it to track who is donating

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antocv
A very convenient way for "security services" of the world and especially USA
to get a very fine list of sympathisers of wikileaks world over has been
opened.

Not that it will stop me!

~~~
rbanffy
You can always donate through a pre-paid card purchased with cash from a store
you never buy anything from, with the transaction done with a throwaway
tablet, also purchased with cash, through an open wifi network you never
connected to.

~~~
antocv
Hm I dont know if we have pre-paid cards where I live, Nordics, but that is a
good idea.

You could save a few bucks by booting into a live-cd on your usual laptop and
using a coffe shops wifi I guess.

~~~
rbanffy
Not if they can trace the MAC address.

