Ask HN: How to find part-time developer work? - wasd
======
drewcrawford
At present I derive all my income from part-time work and side projects.

The first thing is to figure out what _not_ to do. You can't work in a field
where people routinely hire full-time employees with ease. So you can't do
Java work part-time, for example. (Well I mean you _can_ , but it's like
saying you _can_ be elected to Congress. Let's do something easy.)

So, you have to start in some field where 9-5ers can't be easily found to fill
the position. iOS/Android dev are like that. Maybe there are web specialities
that are like that. If you have some deep expertise like machine learning or
computer vision or graph algorithms, maybe those specialties are like that.
But the operative criteria is to find some field that full-time employees are
not easily had.

The next step is to filter by projects where time is not the biggest criteria.
Because in spite of Fred Brooks and his MMM, ordinary people still believe
that if you work more hours the project will get done faster, and will
pressure you to become full-time. So you have to find people who are
unconcerned about delivery dates, or rather, who have overriding concerns.
Quality concerns. Cost concerns. If you find someone who has a fixed budget
for his project, for example, if that person can get a better developer at 20
hours/week than he can at 40 hours that starts to look like an attractive
value proposition. Because not only does he get a better developer, but with a
lower burn rate it's easier for him to get deep visibility into where the
money and time is actually going. Those benefits outweigh the benefits of
completing the project faster, but only for projects that have these sorts of
overriding concerns.

There's more you can do, but those two steps are probably all you need to
start consistently landing part-time gigs.

It's worth pointing out as well, there are a variety of near-part-time deal
structures you can negotiate (for example rotating 1 week on, 1 week off).
These might be worth exploring depending on your specific motivations for
seeking part-time work.

~~~
bigtunacan
drew here has it right. While it is possible to find money on side projects in
more mainstream technologies like Java or .NET; it is easier in specialized
fields.

Depending on where you are targeting geographically those technologies vary a
lot; I personally have seen a lot of demand for iOS/Android, but even more
demand for Ruby on Rails. I think that quite a few Ruby on Rails developers
left the community and flocked to Node.js as the next shiny thing and that has
just made it easier to find Rails contract work.

Not only is it easier to find work in a less mainstream technology, but you
are able to negotiate better rates since it is more difficult for businesses
to locate help. After a certain point you can't scale by taking on additional
hours; so your hourly rate makes a big difference.

And hourly vs fixed rate contracting should be considered. I will negotiate my
hourly rate based on term of contract, but under no circumstances will I take
fixed rate contracts any longer. Quite a few of my friends in the contracting
scene are the same way. I've seen too many times where this just leads to
continual "feature creep" and a strong difference in opinions of if scope of
work has been expanded beyond the agreed contract (in all cases it was). I bid
a fixed rate contract with a couple of associates against my better judgement.
Based on the initial scope of work it should have taken about 3 months.
Instead it took over a year and the lead developer on the project walked away
making a rate of right around $10/hour.

And this point can not be overstated.

Network! Network! Network!

If you are an introvert you are going to have to get over it. It doesn't
matter if you have the raw programming skills of Linus Torvalds or John
Carmack; if you can't get out there and make connections you aren't going to
make any money.

I am very introverted by nature, but I force myself to regularly attend
meetups and conferences; and make a point to connect with new people at those
conferences. You need to grow your real social graph; not your
Facebook/LinkedIn/etc... Nothing makes the same lasting impression as a firm
handshake and 5 minutes of conversation face to face.

~~~
sanderjd
I keep expecting to see a win-win industry where introverts with skills
revenue share with extroverts who can sell their skills. Specialization is a
good thing, it seems inefficient for people who don't enjoy networking to
_need_ to do it in order to make money.

~~~
jiggy2011
But then the best extroverts will want to work with the best introverts and
vice versa, so the introverts still have to "sell" themselves!

~~~
saaaaaam
Or the best extroverts will seek out the best introverts. If you are selling
something, you want to sell the best product around - it makes your life
easier - so you find the best possible thing to sell.

~~~
jiggy2011
Right, but how do they know who the best introverts are if the best introverts
are not marketing themselves in one way or another?

------
leknarf
First, talk to people looking for developers. That part is fairly easy: just
about any networking event in NYC has a dozens of people looking for devs. I
don't know where you're located, but the same is probably true for your area.

Once you're talking, convince them that working with you will be
easier/quicker/more-effective than working with anyone else. That's the hard
part, which definitely requires some practice. Pro-tip: don't try to convince
anyone that you'll be the cheapest option, which is almost always a losing
game to play.

If you prefer, I'd be happy to do the hard work for you. I run a startup that
connects senior freelance developers with high-paying companies:
[http://getlambda.com](http://getlambda.com).

~~~
up_and_up
I was corresponding with you guys and never got an email back from Ken. I was
also asking about part-time work.

~~~
1qaz2wsx3edc
Ditto, my guess is they're just skimming for the top earners.

~~~
jaggederest
Felt to me like they didn't understand how to sell people who aren't "X
experts" \- I'm not a digital media expert, I'm not a wordpress expert, I'm
not an iOS frontend expert, I'm a generalist. I do software development, which
apparently isn't that salable these days ;)

~~~
polymatter
don't think of it as being a generalist. think of it more like multiple
specialisms.

------
woah
Best way is to get a full time job that you really enjoy. After months of
drought, the offers for high-payed consulting work (that you can't take) will
suddenly flow in.

~~~
jaredgeorge
I told my wife this past October that I'd stop taking side work by November
and get our hard wood floors installed.

It's now January and my clients are continually agreeing to more and more
absurd hourly rates, making it impossible to stop.

~~~
rythie
If your rate is higher than the cost of a flooring contractor, why not just
hire one?

------
gedrap
I am making my living doing part-time coding (still doing my degree) for the
last 2 years, was unemployed for only about 3 months. I am doing PHP and
AngularJS.

It's really all about the people you know. I got the best gigs just by asking
people (normally other developers) I know if they know someone who needs a
developer. So, yes, it's all about networking but not the numbers but quality
of connection. No one, who talked to you for 10mins, will vouch for you,
really.

I've tried elance a bit, and getting the first gig there looks like a game of
numbers. If you apply for many jobs, sooner or later you will get one... But
checking new postings, writing decent cover letter is time and mental energy
consuming. I gave up there. I don't know, maybe it's worth the hassle getting
the first one.

If you try to make a living doing part time, the key is 1) high enough pay
rate 2) be strict about the payments.

I used to have a rather low rate and was very trusting (e.g. if the payment is
late by 3-4 weeks I still trusted because I 'felt' that he is trustworthy). I
ended up in the situation when I didn't have what to eat for a few weeks,
while I was getting 'I really made the payment' BS, and 0 motivation and
energy to do anything. But now I am happy that it happened, I moved on, and
got much much better gigs and 1.5-2 times higher pay rate and payments always
on time :)

AMA!

------
acheron
Depends what you mean, I guess. I am "normally" employed with one company, not
a freelancer, but I work "part-time", i.e. 30 hours/week. Getting that type of
gig is likely different from getting the freelance/consultant type work.

(For what it's worth, the way I got mine was that I was hired for full-time/40
hours, did that for about nine months, then went to the manager and said "hey,
how about I only work 30 hours?" and he said "ok".)

~~~
wasd
Your situation is exactly what I'm looking for. Being hired by a company but
only working part time. Consulting is difficult (for me) because it is a huge
time investment.

~~~
acheron
To fill my experience out a bit more, it wasn't something I was planning to do
when I got hired. From a personal standpoint, I had a kid, and my wife got a
higher-paying job so my salary became less important. From an office
standpoint, there were a couple people already doing a similar schedule (I do
three 10-hour days T-W-Th), so I wasn't going completely out on a limb. It
really did fall into place pretty easily.

(I work for a very large company which HN would probably scoff at, plus I work
with very uncool things like Java and Oracle.)

My situation has me fall in-between for a lot of HR things -- my pay has
always been given in terms of a yearly salary, and usually as what it would be
if I were full time. I just get 3/4ths of it. And I'm technically paid hourly,
which helps keep any requests to come in on my days off to a minimum, since
they actually have to pay me for it. I accrue 3/4ths of normal vacation time,
but I still get all the other standard benefits. And I get to spend two extra
days a week with my now two children.

Really the only "bad" thing is that I know it'd be difficult to get into this
situation again, so if my job stagnates, it would be hard to go out and try to
find a new job, unless I am ready to go back full-time.

~~~
SiVal
_I work for a very large company which HN would probably scoff at, plus I work
with very uncool things like Java and Oracle._

Don't imagine that HN is some monolithic group of fratboys obsessed with the
latest cool whatever. Some of us are dads like you, some of us work for big
companies like you (I don't at the moment, but I have no objection to it), and
some of us take pride in being able to use the tools we need to use to create
useful stuff and don't care about hacker fads, fashion, or fame.

------
gkoberger
I've found it's almost impossible to find good work using cold calls or
responding to ads. Try to find people you know. Getting the first job is the
hardest, but if you do a good job -- the referrals will start to roll in.

This has been inadvertent, however I've also gotten a lot of work through
various projects[1][2] I've done that have gotten big on HN. Write it off
mentally as a marketing expense, and spend a few days making something
awesome.

[1]
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5395463](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5395463)
[2]
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6586867](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6586867)

~~~
tdicola
Any tips for actually getting a Show HN post on HN? I've posted a few things
but been frustrated to see them immediately fall out of the new page with only
a couple votes.

~~~
elwell
Not that I do this, but upvote your post with like 10 upvotes in the first 10
minutes. You'll have to use different proxies to mask your IP. Keep in mind
that this is pathological behavior for the community though.

~~~
gkoberger
This is shitty advice. It gets you to the front page, sure -- but something
that isn't interesting still won't be interesting no matter how many votes.

There's a secret to getting your Show HN to the front page: make something
genuinely interesting. Do it, and it's dead simple to get on the front page.

------
thebouv
I suggest looking for local hackathons or even better, startup weekends near
you.

[http://startupweekend.org/](http://startupweekend.org/)

Startup Weekend is a great way to meet connections while helping them build a
fun project for the weekend. Show them you are a badass talent. You'll get
noticed.

------
perplexes
Part-time is easy to come by when you're doing consulting work, since you can
work out the requisite hours with your clients. I did full-time remote
consulting for about 5 years, dropped to part-time consulting for a year to
concentrate on music.

Finding a client that we could be flexible on hours with was difficult,
though. Many clients are tied to the ass-in-chair time cycle. We eventually
found a small company that was made of people who were largely remote and
worked really flexible hours themselves.

Eventually I found a job in SF that offered full-time and part-time, and you
can move between the two. This has been really great since we started a family
last August - I took a month off, then came back doing 4-day weeks.

If you're in SF, we're hiring -
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6477194](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6477194)

~~~
wasd
Hey, I would like to learn more about where you work. I couldn't find your
email in your profile.

------
jorgem
December/January are always the toughest month for me. Lots of companies are
still working out their annual budget.

I usually just go on vacation.

------
ritchiea
I have had some luck finding part time work over the HN monthly freelance
thread and through developer email lists (NYC.rb specifically). In the case of
the email list it was as easy as sending an email to the list describing
myself and my past experience and saying I was looking for part time work. A
handful of people reached out to me.

~~~
dougk16
If you have a minute, could you go into a little more detail about finding
developer e-mail lists? Not sure what you mean here.

Thanks!

~~~
ritchiea
Looking through my email now it looks like most of the lists I'm subscribed to
are through meetups on meetup.com. I'm a member of a number of meetups that
are related to technology I use (e.g. Ruby, Javascript), or topics I'm
interested in (e.g. data journalism, I'm a member of Hacks & Hackers). I
receive either the emails in real time or as a daily digest. I have only
turned to those lists once looking for work and it was a big success.

------
johnrob
The first thing to check is whether your former employer has a need for part
time. Both parties are validated, and there is little to no ramp up needed.

The next I'd look at is mobile development. Now that there are multiple
platforms to support (iOS/Android/WinMo), the demand for part time specialists
is huge. There are a lot of companies that support a subset of those platforms
but would like to add more (if they only had the expertise).

------
mmmbeer
I do about 350-500 hours per year of freelance work ($100 per hour usually) in
addition to normal full-time job. It is all through people I've worked with in
the past who contacted me. If you have previous employers or co-workers, maybe
ask if they have any extra work or side projects they need completed.

------
startupstella
If you have a good online portfolio (a site showing what skills you have, what
projects you've done, and your personality) as well as good client facing
skills, check out matchist. We built it to help awesome freelance web and
mobile devs (in the US only currently) find curated projects.

------
espeed
Become active in developer communities, create and contribute to open-source
projects on GitHub, and people will contact you.

Companies like Toptal ([http://www.toptal.com](http://www.toptal.com)) mine
GitHub and online developer communities looking for talent.

------
ianBlumenfeld
1) Start with craigslist. Lots of ads for people/companies looking for
contract devs. Be cheap if you're not experienced/awesome yet. 2) Do a good
job, so your references are good. 3) Build your network. Once you have that
rolling, you'll never go dry.

------
breischl
For people who are already doing part-time dev work, do you find that people
are curious and/or suspicious about why you're doing it part time? ie, "If
you're actually good at this, why aren't you a full time employee or
consultant?"

~~~
scotty79
Funny thing is when I'm getting really crappy as a freelancer I cave in and
accept some fulltime job offer. So it's the other way around. If you are that
awesome then why are you working 9 to 5? It's easy and pays well, that's why.

------
Moto7451
I've picked up side gigs from Hackathons. Typically if you win you'll get a
few business cards that can turn into leads. Sometimes your teammates hire you
for their own projects.

------
USNetizen
You know PHP? I'm hiring part time. Can be 100% remote if in the US. I know
other people looking for P/T devs all the time for mostly one-off client
projects.

~~~
ciclista
Not OP, but actually looking for something in the 20-25 hours a week range.
Plenty of PHP experience, do you have some more details and a contact address?
(my email is in my profile).

------
deeteecee
i think it's kind of hard to find specific people targeting part-time
developers for a long period of time. they normally want contractors/free-
lancers to help out on the project and then they'll cut you out.

I just randomly found one on elance out of nowhere. all i did was post that i
did django web-dev for a year and bam, client received. I'm learning a lot
though...like... what requirements to set for myself before I agree with the
client.

------
breathesalt
One trick is to start full-time and as soon as you become indispensable to the
company ask to go part-time.

------
fennecfoxen
1\. Get full time job at IBM. 2\. Prove your worth. 3\. Move to part time.

Honestly, I'm really glad I don't work at IBM. But when I did work there on an
internship, I noticed part-time people who seemed relatively respected and
secure in their positions. I haven't seen that very much since.

~~~
iends
I'm not sure this would work very well lately. IBM had a series of layoffs and
are chasing short term shareholder value.

------
gwjp
Can you do C#?

~~~
pc86
If OP can't, I can :) My contact information is available in my profile if
you're looking.

~~~
majc2
Me too - contact info in profile.

------
rileytg
email us at jobs@fcflamingo.com

~~~
dested
Are you a recruiting agency? You dont even know what stack the developer
uses...

~~~
blhack
They're a "design, development, and consulting agency based in LA and NYC.
We're young, dynamic, and take on lots of cool projects."

[http://www.indeed.com/cmp/Fc-Flamingo](http://www.indeed.com/cmp/Fc-Flamingo)

------
notastartup
I find it impossible to find freelance work when everyone thinks that it's
like building a chair, except the chair sometimes turn into tables and it's
still called a chair, and refuse to pay for a table because it's still a chair
in their mind.

Few options remain for folks like me except to build our own SaaS products or
software and hope it pays rent.

------
notastartup
1) How do you guys find contract work? 2) How do you actually write up the
contract and have them sign it? Is there an open service which does this? 3)
How much up front do you charge? 33%? 50%?

------
stratigos
diddnt know such gigs existed

