
The Effect of Cold Showering on Health and Work: A Randomized Controlled Trial - drops
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5025014/
======
cyberferret
We did this in our entire house for about 6 months once when our water heater
broke and we couldn't afford to get it fixed quickly.

UPSIDES: We nearly halved our water bill as all of us (kids and parents) took
far shorter showers because it was so cold. This also meant we had to clean
the shower much less often. I would also be more awake and alert in the
morning after a cold rinse.

DOWNSIDES: I noticed I was getting more headaches and stiff necks, then I
realised that the hot showers were helping me to de-tension and relax my
shoulder and neck muscles which have become tight due to my long work hours
writing code at a keyboard.

Didn't notice any up or down occurrences of sickness in the rest of the
family. Overall, I am glad we have hot water back now. At least I have a
choice which way to go.

~~~
keypress
The best thing about a cold shower is that when you get out, you feel to only
get warmer, and it's very pleasing the sensation of thawing through. Whereas
hot shower to coldish environment just makes me shiver.

~~~
tome
Yes, this phenomenon is really remarkable. When I take a nice, warm shower I
feel freezing when I get out. After a horrible cold shower I feel nice and
warm getting out.

~~~
vram22
It's due to the contrasting temperatures.

------
sytelus
TLDR; 3000 participants study that asked them to do cold showers for 30-90
seconds each day for 1 month. Main difference shown was ~30% reduction in sick
days they took.

On a side note, has anyone here tried wim hof method?

~~~
k4ch0w
I actually went and met Wim. I took one of his seminars. He had us all go
outside into a pool of ice together for about ~1 minute with all of us
chanting who let the dogs out while we froze. I walked out completely red
because it was the coldest thing I'd ever done. At that point I was doing cold
showers for about a year and a half.

I am a very physical person and his method was the first one to put my mind
into a meditative state. You actually feel it in your body and shock it which
silences your regular thoughts. You only focus on your breathing and how you
feel in that moment. It gives me a really quick reprieve when working on a
difficult problem.

You have people that take his method to extremes though, I remember one guy at
the seminar literally pissed himself from holding in too long. It can make it
all seem like pseudoscience. I can confirm that it has a very physical effect
on my body and helps me meditate a lot easier.

A side effect of the ice training is that I sweat in really cold weather. I
live in Seattle and people look at me funny cause I'm rocking a t-shirt and
shorts but if I wear a jacket I'm boiling.

~~~
tomcam
Seattleite here. I am skeptical people look at you funny, at least more than
every once in a while. Plenty of people dress that way in inclement weather.

~~~
k4ch0w
You may be right and it's just how I perceive myself in the world. :-p

~~~
kilotaras
This is known as spotlight effect[0] - people overestimate how much strangers
notice details about you.

[0]
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spotlight_effect](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spotlight_effect)

~~~
vidarh
This always amuses me, because I'm very quiet and introvert until I get to
know people, and people who don't know me sometimes assume this means I'll be
anxious in crowds.

But in fact, while I don't particularly _like_ crowds, I learned very young
that if you don't particularly want to interact with people, crowds are great.
I can sit down in the middle of a party and spent 3 hours just observing
people mindfully and be content, and most of the time people will ignore it.

But you can also act totally outrageous in a crowd, and people will tend to
try to ignore you, not pay attention to you until/unless what you do
personally affects them.

A useful exercise in that respect is to go a day and try to keep a mental
count of how often you notice yourself thinking about your own actions vs. how
often you notice yourself paying attention to someone elses action, and then
at the end of it, try to recall those other peoples actions. Not only will
most people find they spend far more time worrying about their own appearance
or actions, but that they will have forgotten most of the interactions the
noticed with other people _even when trying to keep mental tabs of them_.

Most things that most people do simply isn't that interesting to other people.
Heck, most things that most people do isn't that interesting to themselves
other than in the moment.

------
itchyouch
Dr. Rhonda Patrick goes over cold therapy (along with hot therapy) numerous
times in her nutrition/health/biology/epidemiological research.

cryo usually is -180 degrees F for 2 minutes. But a similar effect can be
achieved with ~40 F (IIRC) exposure for ~4-6 hours. I think she has mentioned
similar effects for immersion in cold water for several minutes as well.

The benefits of cold shock are basically:

* increase norepinephrine up to 5 fold which provides a ton of focus/attention. * induces biogenesis of mitochondria, thus increases endurance. * that biogensis turns white fat brown as fat cells grow mitochondria to generate heat to stay warm

Looks like she has a report on it here:
[https://www.foundmyfitness.com/?sendme=cold-
stress](https://www.foundmyfitness.com/?sendme=cold-stress)

You can also listen to it in bits and pieces in various videos she has posted:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=if-J8w2ay94](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=if-J8w2ay94)

~~~
sliverstorm
40F with or without clothes? 4-6 hours without clothes and Im pretty sure
you're looking at fairly severe hypothermia.

~~~
letlambda
In 40F water for 4-6 hours and you're looking at a severe case of death.

~~~
rrmm
and even a mild case of death can kill you...be careful out there!

------
zzxxkk123
I used to do this every morning... just take a normal hot shower, then at the
end crank it full cold and endure until normalized.

It's a free high, great way to start a day. I presumed endorphins are being
released.

Now I prefer to run a bunch of miles and immediately jump into the (cold)
ocean while still all hot and amped up from the run. The water doesn't even
seem cold, it's great. Normally people wear wet-suits in the ocean here.

~~~
thesmallestcat
Could that induce a heart attack? Like drinking a glass of ice water after
mowing the lawn in hot weather.

~~~
ellyagg
Yep. It's a stressor, which is the point. Strenuous exercise is also a well-
known cause of heart attacks, but you should definitely strenuously exercise
if at all possible.

~~~
tugberkk
Is there any academic study showing this?

~~~
ellyagg
Not sure, but here's the wikipedia page on it, at least:

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_shock_response](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_shock_response)

------
conception
But not a reduction in how many days people felt ill. I wonder if this speaks
more to self-help style "leaders take a cold shower in the morning to get
their day started" jump-start to your day than to any health consequences.

~~~
Zarath
As someone who has taken cold showers. I can say that there are definitely
physiological changes resulting from cold showers. The hard part is forcing
yourself to step into freezing cold water while knowing that relief is just at
the turn of a dial.

~~~
xupybd
I'm interested, can you please elaborate on the changes you noticed?

~~~
dboreham
"shrinkage" ?

------
twobyfour
This is not for everyone. I can do this and enjoy it in summer but not winter.
I have poor circulation and am always cold as it is. In winter, the water
comes out of our pipes at whatever ground temperature is - typically just a
couple degrees above freezing.

Tried it once for a week, and was stepping out of the shower nearly
hypothermic and shivering violently. Immediately came down with a massive head
and chest cold that required my first course of antibiotics in nearly a
decade, followed by a tension related muscle injury that's still plaguing me
three years later.

Never again.

~~~
jack_pp
Try the wim hof method

~~~
twobyfour
No.

~~~
meesterdude
I laughed at this - and totally understand where you're coming from.

However. For me, I have known people who weather the cold very well - unlike
you and I. They'll go for a swim in a cold lake and enjoy it. Generally, I
hate the cold. Even a mild cold is NOPE. My hands especially, get cold very
easily.

But this is what I saw when I looked up the method:

> If you are new to cold exposure, just end your warm shower with 15 - 30
> seconds with cold water only. Begin with your feet and then follow with your
> legs, your stomach, shoulders, neck, and back. An initial shock, shivering
> and hyperventilation is normal. Try to remain calm and breathe easily. Close
> your eyes and really try to embrace the cold. Don't pour the cold water over
> the head if you are not known with cold exposure. If you feel any strong
> physical uncomfortableness, like heavy shivering, numbness or pain, get your
> body warm again as soon as possible. Cold exposure works like weight
> lifting, you get stronger over time. There are little muscles around your
> veins that contract when they get into contact with the cold. After some
> time (only 1-2 weeks according to Wim) these become stronger, making your
> veins healthier and reducing the force that your heart has to use to pump
> blood around your body. You can increase exposure over time. At one point
> the cold will feel just as comfortable as wearing your favorite pajamas and
> you can skip the warm shower completely. Notice how you feel amazing after a
> cold shower and sluggish after a warm one.

When I first heard about this guy years ago, i picked up the yoga side of it
and deemed it BS. But this kind of gradual conditioning he proposes, and not
going overboard with it, makes me think maybe I could try it. In theory, we
should feature some adaptive qualities to better weather the cold. I'd sure
love to find mine.

~~~
twobyfour
No.

I don't want it, don't need it, not interested.

Or are you going be the one to to pay the medical and rehab costs for my next
back injury? Are you going to endure the excruciating pain and sleepless
nights? Are you going to compensate me for the additional costs I'll bear for
the rest of my life due to being unable to lift or carry as much or as far as
I once could? Or for a year's worth of lost opportunities (professional and
personal) due to being unable to remain upright for more than a few hours at a
time? Or for the loss of activities that I once enjoyed?

You go ahead and do that for yourself, but don't pretend you know anything
about my body or what risks I should or should not take with it.

~~~
mdhen
You are really aggressive

~~~
lookACamel
Yeah because he's tired of people suggesting that he try something that is
clearly not in his interests.

------
portlander12345
Can someone tell me if their study design compensates for bias introduced by
not everyone completing the study? It looks like only about 70% completed it.

~~~
fnordian_slip
79% if I understood it correctly, but you raise a valid point.

------
JumpCrisscross
“The total amount of days a participant felt ill (including symptoms of cold
and flu)” responded but “the total number of days of absence from their work
due to sickness“ which the study’s designers view as “the most objective
indirect parameter indicative of illness severity” did not.

~~~
phaemon
That is the complete opposite of the study's findings. The number of days they
felt ill did not change, but they had fewer days absent.

~~~
JumpCrisscross
You are totally correct. My sincerest apologies!

------
chewz
I loved cold showers since beeing teenager. Always liked cold. Not used hot
water sometimes for weeks in winter. In December me and friends regularly swim
in Baltic Sea when it’s 0C outside (hot sauna and generous servings of vodka
surely help).

But I have read that hot shower in morning significantly lowers cortisol
levels so I start the day with hot shower now, when available.

Also since a few years I am living in SE Asia and hot showers taken few times
a day open pores in skin and allow it breath better in this climate.

~~~
mkesper
Sauna combined with alcohol sounds like recipe for disaster.

~~~
chewz
No, it is quite healthy actually. In right doses of course. Jumping into ice
cold water after 15 minutes in 70+C sauna, a shot of vodka, some hot tea.
Makes you feel great and alive in winter.

------
all_blue_chucks
People who take cold showers are just as sick, but call off work less? Maybe
it's because the misery from the cold water masks the misery from the illness?

~~~
amiheines
Or maybe it masks the misery of going to work? ;)

~~~
anjc
"Can't wait to get to work. Anywhere is better than this cold shower".
Plausible...

------
arkaic
I can offer my anecdotal experience. Been shutting off the hot water at the
end of my morning showers and enduring the cold for a few minutes for the past
3 years. I have noticed that I get fewer colds. And with the colds I do get,
their symptoms are lighter, and they go away much quicker, often gone in a day
or two. And I haven't caught anything real bad, like a flu, since.

~~~
jacobolus
Competing anecdote: I once dunked for a few minutes into a very cold bath at a
Budapest bathhouse, and the next few days suffered one of the worst flus I’ve
ever had.

Keep doing whatever works for you, but I don’t think either of these provide
especially convincing general evidence. (Note I’m not blaming the cold bath;
for all I know I would have had identical symptoms either way.)

~~~
Scea91
I don't even think your anecdote is competing. I think it is a common wisdom
that you should allow your body to adjust to cold gradually.

~~~
jacobolus
The “common wisdom” being investigated in this study and discussed in this
thread was whether short and “shocking” cold showers would improve health. The
top-level commenter claims that transitioning directly from a hot shower to a
few minutes of cold shower at the end has made him less susceptible to
respiratory viral infections.

I agree that there are often several directly contradictory pieces of “common
wisdom” floating around about health topics. That’s one of the chief
difficulties with folk advice in general.

------
Fifer82
Does anyone know why I prefer being cold more than others?

I sleep with all the windows open and my other half has pyjamas, a double
duvet and a hot water bottle. Like in December in Scotland.

I also dislike wearing Jackets or Coats under any circumstances. I dislike hot
drinks maybe apart from Soup.

When people go on Holiday and basque in the sun saying it is perfect weather.
My actual perfect weather (I believe I feel like they do when it happens) is
for a low crisp negative temperature with no wind.

For a long time I have wondered why I prefer this side of the fence and wonder
if I have some weird lineage from the North.

~~~
dvdplm
Do you have high blood pressure?

~~~
Fifer82
Not sure. If I do I have always had it. I don't go the doctors often. How
would I know?

~~~
knicholes
Here where I live in Utah, they have blood pressure machines all over, like
inside of Rite Aid or even grocery stores. You just sit down, push a button,
and wait for your arm to be squeezed. Another option is to purchase a
sphygmomanometer and test yourself.

------
flor1s
I feel like the benefits you obtain through cold showers disappear after a
while as you get used to them. That's similar to the benefits I felt of
meditation.

~~~
UncleEntity
IDK, I have yet to get used to cold showers during the last two winters. Still
too lazy to get my gas turned back on in 2.5 years so it isn't all that bad I
guess...but during the deep Arizona winter when the temperature drops to
around 50 those showers aren't even a little fun.

~~~
Scea91
> deep Arizona winter when the temperature drops to around 50

I wonder, is this sarcasm or do you really consider 50 F as deep winter in
Arizona? I get it that you are used to much higher temperatures but still...

Right now we have around 40 F in Prague and it is not even a winter yet. Cold
showers are still fine right now.

------
bksenior
I skimmed the cover page. If you shower at night are the advantages tracked to
be local to only that moment or does it have a prolonged general benefit?

~~~
johnsimer
Sometimes i do cold showers at night, instead of the morning, and I still feel
like I get the same benefits.

interestingly enough cold showers in the morning wake me up, and cold showers
at night relax me. Not exactly how it works, but it does.

------
spodek
Joel Runyon's Cold Shower Therapy is an awesome introduction, at least for
certain types, which includes me.

[https://impossiblehq.com/cold-shower-therapy](https://impossiblehq.com/cold-
shower-therapy)

I've taken cold showers regularly for years. One of the best things I've done
for myself -- creating discipline, self awareness, etc. at zero cost in money
or time.

~~~
nhumrich
This concept is about 100% cold shower, whereas the article is about 1min of
cold at the end of a hot shower. Do you think there is a difference on
effectiveness? I would think the extreme of hot-to-cold would be more
affective, and after 60 seconds, your bodys already adapted.

~~~
spodek
I recommend finding out for yourself by trying each and seeing the results. It
will cost you nothing in time or money. I guarantee you will learn more about
yourself than you would imagine and develop skills applicable throughout life.

I recommend against not trying and finding out through experience. I've found
the results amazing, despite costing nothing. Since I've made cold showers a
regular habit -- [http://joshuaspodek.com/js_blogseries/cold-showers-
rock](http://joshuaspodek.com/js_blogseries/cold-showers-rock) \-- I'd love to
hear your results.

------
simplyluke
Cold/heat exposure are great, cold water immersion in particular. I've
observed positive effects on my physical recovery.

But I have not seen a comment here warning that cold water immersion is
absolutely not something you should try for the first several times alone,
even in very shallow water (IE a bathtub). The risk of entering shock/going
unconscious and drowning is non-trivial.

------
kromem
Because of the study design, there's no control group that would account for
placebo.

The placebo effect in several meta-analyses (Beecher, Haas) showed an effect
in studies of around 30%.

Coincidentally, people participating in this study felt less sick when talking
a hot-cold shower by ~30%.

Without being able to discount placebo, I am highly suspect of the results of
this study.

~~~
aisofteng
And what exactly would the placebo be? This isn't taking pills, it's taking
showers.

------
codezero
In general I am very concerned about what is considered cold. Is this just
unheated?

Depending on the time of year the relative temperature of unheated has a broad
range where I live. I’d be a lot more comfortable if this set a tight bound on
the water temp. If it did and I missed it sorry.

~~~
hellofunk
10 degrees C was used as "cold" in this study, as per the article.

~~~
codezero
Thanks, mea culpa :)

------
DoubleGlazing
I had to cold shower for a January fortnight when we had issues with our gas
boiler.

One thing I noticed was that it got me alert much sooner in the morning.
Typically I would get up at 7:00am, shower, eat and then head off to work to
start at 9:00am, but my brain wouldn't really be in gear till about 9:30am.

With cold showering the brain was in gear far sooner. I felt more willing to
get out and get stuff done. Maybe that earlier alertness helps cancel out a
desire to pull a sickie?

That being said, the extra alertness wasn't worth the sheer torture of a cold
shower.

~~~
yason
I wouldn't _want_ to get alert quickly in the morning.

I much enjoy the pleasant and unique slowness of the mornings and I wish to
wake up slow, get up slow, and enjoy my breakfast slow and let the energy
gradually rush back into my body for the day ahead. Looking from my
perspective, a cold shower in the morning sounds like one of the worst ways to
make your life more miserable.

But on the other hand cold water seems to be otherwise beneficial. For
example, winter swimming is generally recognised to aid in numerous ways, both
physiologically and mentally. I sometimes dip into the cold pool (4-6 C) for a
minute at the swimming hall and it feels great afterwards. But that's at a
time when I'm up and moving already. Doing that in the morning would be just
as punishing than a cold shower.

------
markinthesea
It's interesting they only focus on the cold shower. I would have thought it
would be short and barely give you enough time to get over the initial
shock(cold shock response) - around a minute or so when the gag reflex hits
and what would potentially drown you in open water. After that shock, things
change.

My personal experience is with swimming in the sea year round for 3 to 4
years. 2 to 3 times a week every week. I started in August to help acclimatise
to the change in the temperature as it cooled. Temperature ranges from 18C in
August to 4C in early March, give or take.

The effects were great over all and I thought I was healthier for it. I
understand the tightening of the muscle which some of the others mentioned as
an experience. I got used to this and it seemed to relax me. I never really
got the tight muscles thing except afterwards when I kind of wanted to tighten
up.

I would walk in at a reasonable pace. As others have said, with a meditative
feeling. Once fully emerged and the shock had passed I could swim for a
maximum of around 5 to 10 minutes at the coldest part of the year. Sometimes
it was more a splash around for as long as I could stand it. I generally
stopped and got out when my wrists started to cramp. I'm guessing the cold
water would send the blood circulation internally away from the skin.

It always felt the warmest in late September early October for some reason.
The coldest place I ever swam was between two San Juan islands in August!

Once out of the water I would feel warm and have a feeling of glowing. Drying
off would be a pleasure despite the outside temperature. My overall demeanour
would be very positive and up lifting. I've heard talk of endorphins or
something along those lines being released in to the body.

I never jumped in to a hot shower right after preferring to warm naturally and
slowly. I felt warm for a good twenty minutes after getting out and being
dressed fully whoever cold it was.

The whole experience became slightly addictive which is why I did it so long.
Work has now gotten in the way of that.

There is a serious safety aspect to all this and it should be done with
caution and understanding. This guy, Mario Vittone, was very informative on
what's going on when trying to stay alive in cold water:
[http://mariovittone.com/2010/10/1-10-1/](http://mariovittone.com/2010/10/1-10-1/)

~~~
zimpenfish
Another interesting look at cold water troubles -
[https://www.trainingpeaks.com/blog/know-your-risk-of-
cardiac...](https://www.trainingpeaks.com/blog/know-your-risk-of-cardiac-
arrest-during-open-water-swimming/)

~~~
markinthesea
Interesting, thanks. Ice-baths too. Common in professional sports.

------
hellofunk
> Twenty serious adverse events were reported, that were all considered
> unrelated to the intervention.

Including one death.

------
starchild_3001
I took cold showers for a month. Really liked the effects! I ended up wearing
shorts and tshirt year round (in northern california), whereas the old me
would be wearing several layers of clothing > 6 months of the year. I was
taking cold showers daily for 5 months.

------
gadders
I tell you what has an even bigger effect on the number of sick days you take
- going self-employed.

I've taken one day off sick in the 8 years I've been an IT contractor, and
that was because I set fire to my legs (in too much pain after a dressing
change to WFH).

------
vleroybrown
For the past 2 months my family and I have been forced to take cold showers in
Puerto Rico. I personally stoped showering for almost a month. I got so sticky
it was unbearable so I finally showered again. The cold water was difficult to
relax in.

------
shadykiller
I take cold shower just for the wakefulness. Always beats the morning coffee
for me.

------
mythrwy
Showering in cold water also might keep the skin pores closed causing less
absorption of whatever may be in the municipal water (fluoride, traces of
pesticides, hormones from birth control etc).

~~~
collyw
You are going to be drinking that water anyway, no?

------
NHQ
Cold showering isn't a health regimen; it's a beauty secret.

------
dangjc
I did this for a while. It’s good for increasing your brown fat.

------
BLanen
The problem with researching this is that the patient can't be blind to what
treatment they're getting.

~~~
isolli
But she can be blind to what the expected outcome is.

------
neilwilson
So essentially a cold shower wakes you up.

Who knew.

