
Technical Hiring and Cultural Fit - GarethX
http://blog.fogcreek.com/technical-hiring-and-cultural-fit-interview-with-johanna-rothman/
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itgoon
How do you know that the culture you're hiring for is all that great for
getting results?

Is this culture the one you're going to need in the future?

What if you have a need, and there's nobody that fits your culture? If you're
understaffed, is it really better to keep asking your staff to work extra
while you satisfy the culture requirement, even if it's just while someone
ramps up?

Lastly, "culture" seems to be another way of saying "we don't really know what
works, so we just look for people we personally like".

I've worked with many people I didn't like, or even got along with (I'm sure
others could say the same of me). Focusing on tasks and goals, communicating
regularly, and having decent work habits went very far.

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chollida1
We've done away with "Cultural fit" interviews at our company as we found they
didn't actually do anything for us, maybe we just did them wrong?

Has anyone actually found a use for cultural fit? I mean its not like they
help weed out jerks. If someone is a jerk they'll either be a jerk in all
interviews or be on their best behavior until they're hired.

What should we be looking for in a cultural fit interview that isn't just
"looks like us, works like us plays like us"?

~~~
shaftoe
I use culture fit as a reverse filter. We show the candidate a pretty open
view of what working for us is like and let them decide if they're excited or
turned off.

~~~
jaawn
I think this is by far the best approach. If I were treated this way during an
interview process, I would have a great deal more respect for the organization
and manager.

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buckbova
> When I wanted to hire women, I looked for women. I have been very successful
> in hiring a diverse team.

This never sits right with me. Diversity for the sake of diversity.

> Once you’ve learned one or two computer languages, you can learn any
> computer language.

It helps but going from one disparate stack to another can be troublesome for
many I've worked with. Almost a complete non-starter, ie going from .NET + sql
server to python + django + web services or from Java + hibernate to nodejs +
angularjs.

~~~
outworlder
_Almost_ everything boils down to time.

What I've found difficult to work with is people that think that anything they
do has "magical" properties. I.E., they don't actually understand at least one
abstraction level. That also boils down to time(and willingness, and a proper
mentor). But it is a different order of magnitude, depending on what is
missing.

Learning new programming languages is easy (except Haskell, attempt no landing
there) and is also a matter of time. Learning the ecosystem that goes with it
takes longer (again, time). Learning how to code idiomatically requires
experience (time once more, but only if actively programming).

~~~
liquidcool
Yes, it's like the Niels Bohr quote, "An expert is a man who has made all the
mistakes which can be made, in a narrow field." You have to determine if you
need someone who is an expert now, or can become an expert. If you have a
bunch of experts already, you can relax the requirement for new people because
of knowledge transfer. (Assuming you're good about that.)

But we must acknowledge the amount of time that people spend in jobs now. If
it takes a year to gain mastery and people leave after 2, like you said,
there's just not enough time for people to learn from scratch.

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brobdingnagian
We need to work together to make culture-fit a bad word. "Culture fit" means
discrimination along dimensions that shall not be named, for were they to be
named they would be illegal.

~~~
metamet
What are your thoughts on hiring someone you want to work with vs hiring
someone you don't want to work with?

~~~
Lawtonfogle
What happens when you want to work with is indirectly based on a protected
class (for example, it isn't that you want to work with a man, but you want to
work with someone who fits a list of qualifications that excludes most women
but very few men)?

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geggam
Wonder how many glitches we see today are because everyone gets along and
doesn't know how to fix the issues. Sometimes disagreeable people are like
that because we are tired of the stupid. ( hypothetically of course )

~~~
akilism
What? What does getting along with your coworkers have to do with fixing
anything? Are disagreeable people better at fixing glitches?

~~~
brobdingnagian
He's talking about groupthink.

~~~
geggam
Which is what happens when you get a common culture and hire only those who
fit in it.

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b6
When we say we want diversity, I think we tend to mean we want diversity of
perspective and experience and way of thinking. But when we try to implement
diversity, we tend to do it by body shapes and colors and genders.

> I think the biggest thing is to acknowledge that we are all human and we
> like people ...

This sentence was off to such a good start!

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yanilkr
Jerks and culture misfits need jobs too. If you deny them, one day we might
all end up working for them. Misfits and jerks found the industry. Myers
Briggs personality test, which was a standard practice once is now irrelevant
in the tech industry and its a good thing. Those personality tests would
disqualify many good tech professions.

It has been hard for me to have any strong opinions about hiring. Many people
disproved all previous assumptions. Skills do matter, some people are much
better than others. Some people are good to talk to and are comforting to be
around but they don't get the job done. They can use their soft skills to
convince you why something was impossible to do.

Problem solving skills, learning skills, risk taking behavior, passion for
something, tenacity, optimism etc are also very important in judging a
candidate for a technical role.

~~~
pavel_lishin
> _Jerks and culture misfits need jobs too._

Why can't the jerks learn to get along with people? Why must we, collectively,
bend over backwards to put up with their bullshit?

Culture misfits, sure - some people just aren't super personable, but are
still good at their job. But being a jerk is a choice, and one that not many
people are willing to put up with.

~~~
cholantesh
>Why can't the jerks learn to get along with people?

In some cases, wouldn't the answer be mental health issues (eg. autism)?

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cristianpascu
I'm not from US, but I wonder, in the context of the current cultural shift
and war on gay marriage, how are software companies looking at personal
opinions on cultural matters like this one? Will that guy in the corner, who
politely holds his views on a sensitive matter like gay marriage, make
everyone else uncomfortable and, eventually, he'll have to leave?

~~~
jsprogrammer
This happened at Mozilla.

~~~
jaawn
That was the CEO though. Leaders will always (and should always) be treated
differently than employees when it comes to personal views. Leaders often
become de facto company spokespersons, and being outspoken against a lifestyle
that your subordinates may engage in can have a lot of negative impacts at
work, if your opinion is not clearly the majority opinion. This is especially
true of the CEO—the 'face' of the company and main decision-maker.

So, I don't think what happened at Mozilla is a good example of the whole "guy
in the corner" thing.

~~~
jsprogrammer
I've never been to Mozilla, so I have no idea what actually goes on in there.

~~~
jaawn
We're referring to this: [http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/04/03/us-
mozilla-ceo-res...](http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/04/03/us-mozilla-ceo-
resignation-idUSBREA321Y320140403)

~~~
jsprogrammer
I know, but I'm not sure CEO is a standard unit. Was/is Brenden Eich a "guy in
the corner"? I have no idea because I've never worked with him.

Does the CEO of Mozilla perform any type of leadership role? I also don't
know, as I've never worked there or been there while others were working.

~~~
jaawn
I know right, I mean what is a "programmer," really? What is a job? What is
life? ...Is this the Matrix??

~~~
jsprogrammer
All, excellent questions.

