
A New Face for Pebble - radley
https://blog.getpebble.com/2015/09/23/timeround/
======
taneq
Question for people who own Pebble watches - have you read the Pebble privacy
policy? They track a ridiculous amount of stuff (everything from your GPS
location and activity to what other apps you run on your phone), log it
indefinitely (literally 'for a period of time') in personally identifiable
form, and reserve the right to sell your data to third parties. It baffles me
how people can be OK with this.

~~~
blub
Yes, this isn't an alternative to Android wear or Apple watch, just more of
the same. Fun fact: a few months ago I was looking for a wearable which had
the option to store data locally - I looked at dozens of products and only
three of them offered this. One needs a Windows app to transfer data over USB,
the other is the Oregon Scientific Dynamo, which has a rather poor iOS app and
is quite bulky and imprecise and the third one had a terrible companion app.

Everything else had a mandatory cloud sign-in and sync, with the typical
meaningless privacy policy.

~~~
thomasahle
Google may store your data indefinitely, but it doesn't sell it to third
parties.

~~~
dspillett
Yet. That we know of. IIRC the way the relevant EULAs are written they could
do if they wanted to.

~~~
thomasahle
I can't say I've actually read the EULA, but they do have a nice Privacy FAQ,
which I assume is nearly as legally binding:
[https://support.google.com/work/answer/6056650?hl=en](https://support.google.com/work/answer/6056650?hl=en)

"Google processes your data to fulfill our contractual obligation to deliver
our services. Google’s customers own their data, not Google. The data that
companies, schools and students put into our systems is theirs. _Google does
not sell your data to third parties._ Google offers our customers a detailed
Data Processing Amendment that describes our commitment to protecting your
data."

Another way to look at it might be, given your data is one of their biggest
assets, it would be foolish to sell it.

------
charlie_vill
I've always been a huge fan of "the underdog" Sure this isn't an Apple Watch
or a Moto 360, but Pebble has truly created a beautiful product and I respect
that. Great work to the guys at Pebble.

~~~
lemevi
If the screen is anything like the Pebble Time it wont be beautiful. I love my
PT but depending on the watchface the screen isn't easily readable in anything
other than outdoor or very bright indoor lighting. There's a light up button,
that helps. The colors are also very muted.

The value of a Pebble watch in my opinion is all in its practical utility,
where it really shines. I have been careful to manage what sends my watch
notifications and as such whenever my wrist feels buzzing there's something
that I need to check. I can do so quickly without needing to pull my phone out
of my bag. The time view for what I need to do next is very awesome.

Ultimately my Pebble Time saves me time, makes sure I don't miss important
messages or events and it saves my phone's battery life since I check it much
less often.

~~~
unwiredben
Reports are that the Pebble Time Steel, which uses the same screen tech, is
much more vibrant than the Pebble Time due to the optical bonding. The PT
Round looks to also use that same technique due to its thinness, so I expect
it will look quite good.

~~~
stragulus
Aha! I do own the Pebble Time Steel and couldn't identify with the issue of
the poorly readable screen. I find it reads very well in direct sunlight, and
when it's dark there's always the light button. I guess this explains the
complaints.

------
wanderfowl
It's pretty, but they're continuing to compromise core features
(waterproofness, battery) which make Pebbles unique, while their software and
abilities and displays lag far behind the pack (partly due to vendor lock-in).

I loved my OG Steel. But they won't compete against the Apple Watches and Moto
360s of the world by mirroring their shortcomings and price while providing
none of the deep integration, apps, and features.

I think ultimately, the Pebble line will need to become the leader of the
"Smart-ish" watches. They'll display notifications, and allow some very
limited interactions, but will always be more watch than smart. This will work
great for non-geeky people who would love to get notifications quickly and
silently, while still retaining the advantages of a more conventional watch
(don't worry about charging, water, durability or daylight).

Then, the wrist computers (e.g Apple Watch or Android Wear) will exist for
somebody who wants the geekier, app-ier experience and will take some
compromises for it.

~~~
aetherson
That all sounds right, except...

I don't think that the Apple Watch or at least some Android Wear watches are
aimed at a "geeky" audience.

And I don't think that anyone has found anything more compelling than "receive
notifications" to use Apple or Android watches for.

~~~
amelius
> And I don't think that anyone has found anything more compelling than
> "receive notifications" to use Apple or Android watches for.

I'd like to use a smartwatch for 2-factor authentication.

~~~
zxv
QuickAuth can be used on various Pebble models for 2-factor authentication on
google, dropbox, lastpass, and others.

[http://apps.getpebble.com/en_US/application/53131df8bb31cf87...](http://apps.getpebble.com/en_US/application/53131df8bb31cf87cd00019a)

I feel it's safer than 2-factor using my phone because I might let someone
else handle my phone to make a call, etc., but never my watch. Plus, I can
invoke it faster than I can on the phone.

------
bluthru
2 days battery is disappointing. Making it slightly thicker and getting more
days would have been fantastic. With 2 days you may as well charge it every
night so you don't forget.

Still, this has a wow factor to me due to its slimness. The Apple watch could
have been amazingly thin without the taptic engine:
[http://o.aolcdn.com/hss/storage/midas/26f878cd9a24ea264d064c...](http://o.aolcdn.com/hss/storage/midas/26f878cd9a24ea264d064c40601ccf6f/201929876/apple-
watch-taptic-engine-ifixit.jpg)

Its thickness is the main reason I'm not buying v1.

------
nathankleyn
It's worth noting that this device, unlike any of the previous Pebble devices,
is not waterproof. I was smitten until I noticed this - not having to worry
about getting it soaked while cycling or swimming is a rather nice feature of
my Pebble Time and it looks like I'll be sticking with it for that (even if I
do love the new design).

~~~
old-gregg
Quoting from [1]:

 _Pebble Time Round is splash resistant but not waterproof. Incidental
exposure to water–like unforeseeable rain–won’t ruin your device, but
submerging the watch is not recommended. Pebble’s leather bands are not water
resistant._

[1] [https://pebble.com/buy-pebble-time-round-
smartwatch](https://pebble.com/buy-pebble-time-round-smartwatch)

~~~
differentView
Do people who wear those watches just wet their finger tips when washing their
hands?

~~~
Zarel
Splash resistance generally means it's fine in the shower and while washing
hands, just not while swimming. Or, at least, that's how I've always
interpreted it.

~~~
stronglikedan
Same here. A certain amount of pressure will allow water to penetrate the seal
(e.g. submersion), but it will hold up if it just gets wet.

------
halosghost
When I first saw the announcement, I was really annoyed since I am a PTS
backer. But, with the offer they're giving so that I can test out the new one,
I'm pretty okay with it afterall. In fact, given that one of the reasons
driving my decision to get the PTS was the ~10-day battery-life, I do not
suspect I will even consider the PTR; but I _love_ that Pebble was self-aware
enough to offer me the choice.

Good work Team Pebble! Keep on rockin'!

------
pfooti
Hmm, so this is an oddly-timed launch. I was just wondering if I should
replace my ks-edition pebble with a pebble time, and now here I'm wondering
about the pebble round time or whatever. The new round watch probably looks
nice, although I'm worried about the bezel size and it not being waterproof.
It does look a lot thinner and more watch-like than most other smartwatches,
even before you get to the 7-day battery. My first gen pebble has about five
days between recharges, despite being in constant use since I bought it.

That said, I think I'll stick with my regular pebble for now - I love the
notifications I get on it, but that's its primary job and while the
time(round)? is an improvement to display I don't see any of the features as
must-have at this point. Seems like a great watch to get if you don't have one
yet, but I'm not sure I want to spend $200+ there, especially since my ks
model pebble is industrial orange, and they don't have that color anymore.

~~~
oniony
The new Time Round has a two day battery life, FYI. Even more reason to not
buy it.

~~~
pfooti
Woah, two days? I missed that in the description. Yep, not going to get one of
those at all.

~~~
oniony
Apparently it fully charges in 15 minutes, which may not be so bad: plug it in
whilst in the shower for example. I think it's a bit overpriced for what it is
but I guess you're paying for the fact it's thinner and trendier with its
round screen.

~~~
delecti
Two days is an awkward middle ground. It's not long enough to really get used
to the fact that you don't have to charge it every day, but it's long enough
that sometimes you might forget and end up having it die on you.

------
slg
It looks like half the area of the watch is bezel.

~~~
yellow
I wonder if the bezel allows for a normal square display underneath?

~~~
sahaskatta
The Nest thermostat also had a square screen under a cover that makes it look
round. (Not sure if newer Nest models actually have circle screens.)

~~~
notatoad
i believe the new third gen that was just released a couple weeks ago is the
first Nest to actually use a round screen.

~~~
jeffgreco
It's actually octagonal: [http://www.fastcodesign.com/3050576/3-design-trends-
hiding-i...](http://www.fastcodesign.com/3050576/3-design-trends-hiding-in-
the-new-nest-thermostat)

------
dfar1
Great company, great watch. But boy how they struggle to keep that bezel
small. All generations have that huge bezel.

~~~
BinaryIdiot
Same and many of their images are really, really misleading like when they
show a black clock face with the black bezel makes the watch look AWESOME with
a great sized screen.

------
mooogs
Same price as the Moto 360 with half the features and twice the bezel on top.

~~~
djrogers
And about 1/5th of the "I've strapped a toy can of dog food on my wrist" from
the 360's thickness...

~~~
Someone1234
What's interesting to me, is that people are starting to forget how thick
mechanical watches were.

Here's a Rolex[0] (Sea-Dweller 4000). Here's a Moto 360[1].

And now instead of holding eWatches to the same standard as mechanicals, it
has turned into another thickness race.

[0] [https://imgur.com/TVroPQp](https://imgur.com/TVroPQp) [1]
[https://imgur.com/Vbve1pq](https://imgur.com/Vbve1pq)

~~~
anthonybsd
You picked a horrible example. Rolex Sea Dweller is amongst the thickest of
dive watches because it's designed to be taken to extreme depths (depths no
human will ever descend to in a diving suit).

Here's Piaget Altiplano for example: [http://blog.luxurybazaar.com/wp-
content/uploads/2014/02/Piag...](http://blog.luxurybazaar.com/wp-
content/uploads/2014/02/Piaget-Altiplano-900P-7.jpg)

or

Blancpain Billeret [https://s-media-cache-
ak0.pinimg.com/236x/62/39/fa/6239fae47...](https://s-media-cache-
ak0.pinimg.com/236x/62/39/fa/6239fae477fddf817e2004e535d26e10.jpg)

~~~
micampe
Well, that’s true, but you went to the other extreme of the spectrum: Piaget’s
specialty are ultra thin watches, I don’t think it’s a much better example.

Mechanical watches under 7mm are already considered thin; more usually they
are 9-11mm. Quartz are easily thinner.

I think smartwatches currently around look thicker because of case and lugs
design. For example, the Sea-Dweller is 18mm, but the side of the case is not
flat all the way like the 360, the case back is actually inset, so it’s less
noticeable.

------
wazoox
I have a Garmin watch, it's as smart as it gets (display weather forecasts,
SMS, emails, tracks activity, runs 2048 and Tetris if you care), last a full
week on a charge, is waterproof, and is way cheaper than most "smart watches".
Android wear, Apple watch? Sheesh.

~~~
mgiannopoulos
Indeed, vivoactive owner here.

By the way, Pebble says the time round is "7.5mm thin and weighing just 28
grams". Doesn't define if the weight measurement includes the strap or not.
The vivoactive is 8.0 mm thin, 18g without strap, 38g with strap. So at least
the "lightest" claim is probably not accurate.

------
myth_buster
I don't understand why when we are mimicking analog watch design, can't we
retain the proportions and the aesthetics?

Eg,the ratio of strap and the width of the watch face and the super wide
bezel.

I hope they up their game as competition in this space is getting heated.

[Hopefully constructive criticism from a Pebble owner.]

~~~
smackfu
The Withings Activite does a much better job of mimicking an old watch, but
it's also much simpler (just an activity tracker) and doesn't have an LCD
screen.

[http://www2.withings.com/us/en/products/activite-
pop](http://www2.withings.com/us/en/products/activite-pop)?

Practically, the issue with the current gen is that they need as much battery
as possible. Bezels and weird shapes are both a good way to add volume and
battery.

~~~
jotux
Mondaine has a similar watch (classic look, with activity tracker):
[https://www.mondaine.com/watches/mondaine-
helvetica.html](https://www.mondaine.com/watches/mondaine-helvetica.html)

------
kirk21
The technical info is quite hard to find. Had to click on 'buy' to get this:
[https://pebble.com/buy-pebble-time-round-smartwatch](https://pebble.com/buy-
pebble-time-round-smartwatch)

------
mikestew
Ugh. Now, I've been a big fan of Pebble, and a two-time backer
([https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9101787](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9101787)),
but I'm skipping this one. Truth be told, I'm not even particularly happy with
my current Pebble Time/Time Steel. The screen still has a huge bezel around
it, and the colors don't pop nearly like they did in the pictures. In fact,
I'd describe the new color screen as a bit washed out. Voice replies and quick
replies don't work on iOS (I know what the reason is, and I don't care because
that was a listed feature when they wanted money).

The new ones are delicate, too. I've got an actual scratch on both the bezel
and screen on the Time (thankfully, a screen protector covers that up) from
just brushing against a wall. The Time Steel has a scuff on the bezel from who
knows what.

Now we have the option to have even a bigger bezel, and the battery life has
been cut to about the same as Pebble's competitors. Might as well buy an Apple
or Android watch (or Microsoft Band, if that's your thing). And were I to buy
another smartwatch, Apple is what I'd buy. For $100 more, all of the
advertised features work, and the battery life isn't all that much worse. Or
if I just wanted notifications, one of the Garmin devices, which I could also
use to go running without toting a phone.

For the moment, Pebble's remaining advantages are price and battery life if
you don't get the round one. And Garmin can meet or beat them on both right
now, depending on one's need of other features. I'm interested to see what the
next version has to offer, because it better be a big jump if they're going to
stay competitive.

------
anujdeshpande
This is very weird tbh I mean you just shipped thousands of people something
And now you announce something which makes that look old.

It's scary to own something from a company like this. Am i to understand that
I wont be getting updates on my Pebble Time in the near future because there
is a new kid on the block ?

~~~
dandelany
> you just shipped thousands of people something And now you announce
> something which makes that look old.

So... just like Apple does every year, not to mention pretty much every other
hardware company in existence? The alternative is not to make anything new,
which would just be dumb.

> Am i to understand that I wont be getting updates on my Pebble Time in the
> near future

Well, seeing as Pebble Time is still a brand new product, and I'm still
getting regular updates on my original Pebble Steel, which is another
generation older, I'm gonna say "no".

~~~
anujdeshpande
Apple or Google announcing new flagship phones every year vs Pebble announcing
a new watch in a matter of months ? Can't exactly draw parallels here.
Something similar would be Apple announces iPhone 6S now and iPhone 6S+ in 3
months.

~~~
wvenable
Keep in mind though that this is same watch internals in a differently shaped
case. It doesn't take a year to do that.

~~~
anujdeshpande
True that.

But the thousands of Kickstarter backers might have loved an option

~~~
mbrubeck
They're giving all the Kickstarter backers who chose Pebble Time Steel the
option of exchanging for a Pebble Time Round at no extra cost.

------
vzaliva
I wonder what is viewable screen size in sq. mm. of different Pebble watches.
I suspect they compromised on screen size a lot on this model and make it look
bigger via wide bezel. Anybody have real data? It also would be good to see a
side-by-side picture of Time and Time Round.

------
sluggity
What makes a pebble watch any different from an apple watch?

~~~
vvanders
They use an e-ink display for one which means a week of battery life(or 2 days
in the case of the round).

~~~
ericd
Yeah, this is huge for me. It also charges super fast, so when it runs out, I
can slap it on its magnetic charger, and pull it off 5-10 minutes later if I
need to run, and it'll have enough charge to get it through to a time when I
have 30 minutes to charge it.

------
hadrien01
Still no Windows Phone compatibility.

And their SDK page [1] isn't very helpful to understand what's its purpose,
including if it's useful to create an app communicating with the device for
incompatible smartphones.

[1]
[https://developer.getpebble.com/round/](https://developer.getpebble.com/round/)

~~~
unwiredben
I've seen some Windows developers getting advice on the protocols used to talk
to the watch on their Slack channels. I don't think you'll see Pebble
implement a Windows host app, but they've not been too hostile to the idea.

The watch-to-phone communications methods are the same with the Pebble Time
Round. It looks like the differences are all in how the UI of the watch is
rendered, and those are pretty major. However, outside of the screen, the
hardware is very similar to the already-deployed Pebble Time.

------
microman
I really wanted to pick up a Pebble Time when they publicly launched. I was so
disappointed to see that they were charging €250 (~$280) in Europe while only
$199 in The States. Now, the Steel and the Round are €300. It's just too much
money. Even considering VAT, the difference in price between EU & US seems
excessive

------
Animats
There's no excuse for it not being waterproof to at least the 1m level. What's
their problem? It doesn't need to be openable. The previous models were not.
Just seal it up permanently, preferably under dry nitrogen so it can't corrode
inside.

~~~
fra
Actually there are many mechanical design issues to consider when building a
waterproof product: wall thickness, button design, mechanical seal, ...

"seal it up under dry nitrogen" doesn't even start to describe the process
accurately.

------
KuhlMensch
Saw one in the real - rightly or wrongly I just have some inbuilt revulsion
towards bezel.

------
tiles
Will these still support Smart Straps?

~~~
timdorr
Most likely, since the connector on the back is the same (same USB charging
cable as the Time). However, the band sizes are different (14mm/20mm vs 22mm),
so you would have to make a band specifically sized for the Round vs. the
Time/Time Steel.

Edit: Here's some confirmation on the smart strap support:
[http://developer.getpebble.com/guides/#hardware-
comparison](http://developer.getpebble.com/guides/#hardware-comparison)

