
A New Form of Social Withdrawal in Japan: A Review of ‘Hikikomori’ (2009) - da02
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4886853/
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hikineet
Hikikomori is not only a Japanese phenomenon. I was Hikiki for a year after
dropping out of college.

I lived with my parents playing WoW all night and sleeping all day. I had very
few social interactions.

What dragged me into that lifestyle was the complete destruction of my ego. I
was simply unprepared to live as an adult. It's not much of a surprise I
couldn't cope. In high-school I was coddled for being smart and never
developed a work ethic. College hit me like a sack of bricks.

I'm sure there are myriad reasons why people choose to withdraw from society;
my case is merely a personal anecdote. Nonetheless I think my case is not a
rare exception.

Ultimately what pulled me out of that malaise was successful employment in a
software company. It was only after I recovered a sense of self worth that I
could finally step out of my cave.

~~~
taneq
I did something similar for a few months (right down to becoming a nocturnal
WoW troglodyte). It started when I quit my job to go traveling, and continued
after I returned. For me, it was due to a bit of an existential crisis - my
'life script' had always been 'work hard in school, get good grades, get into
uni, do well at uni, get a job'. I'd finished the script and was lost. What
now, and why should I care?

What dragged me out of this state was the one-two punch of getting a job and
meeting a girl. Neither ended up being particularly good for me but they got
me started again.

~~~
adrianN
How did you get a job and meet a girl when you played WoW all night and slept
all day?

~~~
djanatan
I survived like this by sleeping only 3 hours a night for years. It is
possible.

------
EuroHikikomori
I have been living as a Hikikomori for the last eight years. Every two years I
leave my home for a few hours, but I spend the rest of the time in front of my
computers.

I don't have any friends in real life or online and the only people I interact
with are my parents.

Every meal is prepared for me so the only thing I have to do is my laundry
once a month.

I often think about how fast time flies when living this lifestyle. A year
feels like a month to me.

The sad part is that I have missed out on most things a normal person
experiences. The twenties for most people is about experiences, creating
lifelong memories, parties and fun. It feels like my twenties was over in the
blink of an eye and left a book with empty pages. My youth has run into the
sand.

~~~
Red_Tarsius
I really appreciate you sharing your experience. What made you decide to be
hikikomori?

It's never too late. Tell your parents that you want to change life. Turn
their support into something positive. Go out of your house to buy pizza, ice
cream, whatever. Get your body moving, the mind will follow.

Try to stay in your room without digital devices... for one week. It will
clear your thoughts and force you to deal with reality. You will feel bad, at
first. But it's going to get better. It's the beginning of your new life.
Isn't it exciting? A whole new journey lies ahead of you!

Take a long walk in the countryside, far from other people. Nature is truly
amazing and hiking scratches that same itch of sensory overload (Internet and
gaming).

Everyone makes mistakes. But you should not be defined by them. You're living
a defeatist narrative. Get out of that narrative. Forget your biases and
expectations. Don't let other people define you.

If you want to keep in touch, post your contact info.

~~~
EuroHikikomori
I wouldn't say it was an active choice, I didn't even known about hikikomori
until very recently, but the description fits my lifestyle.

I went to trade school and graduated as a network technician/systems
administrator, but I never got a job and then time just went on and suddenly I
hadn't left my home for years.

I wrote in my first post, I'm sad I missed out on so many things in my youth,
but sometimes I think the reason why I'm sad is because I have been
conditioned by social conventions to believe that I should be.

If I had been going to parties in my twenties, according to social
conventions, I wouldn't have missed out and should be happy, but what if I
should be true to myself?

I have actually never really enjoyed other peoples company and had I been
invited to parties, there is a great chance that I would just stand awkwardly
in the corner waiting to go home.

I do get extreme enjoyment from programming and doing other computer stuff
alone, and I'm able to do it 24/7\. Maybe I actually have the most fulfilled
life that I could ever have, following my personal preferences, but social
conventions are preventing me to acknowledge it?

It's a double-edged sword.

~~~
3131s
Your post is really fascinating to me. I do think it's possible to be happy
living unconventionally. My life is also unconventional, though in a different
way.

Do you socialize online a lot? Do you work freelance at all or are you
financially supported? How do you usually pass the time other than
programming? What do your parents think about it?

~~~
EuroHikikomori
I don't socialize online at all as it would quickly feel like a burden to me.

I don't work freelance or have any income at all, but I'm very low maintenance
as I don't eat much and don't like material possessions. All I own is a few
computers and a toothbrush, but I don't have any debt either. I think it would
be impossible to make my life more minimalistic than it is now.

Once a month I do my laundry and all other time is spent at the computers. I
work on a project for some months, delete it after completion and start over
with a new project.

I think my parents has gotten ‎acclimated to it as the change was gradually
over a long time and not from one day to another.

~~~
3131s
> _I work on a project for some months, delete it after completion and start
> over with a new project._

Damn, that is hard to hear. Is it because you don't think the project is good
enough? Will you get to a point where you don't delete your projects?

I am a little like you otherwise, especially in being low maintenance and
owning almost nothing except for a computer. I don't hang out with much of
anyone besides my wife anymore, but I do go out nearly every day to exercise
under the sun. And I prioritize working as little as possible, just a
freelance project every few months to keep enough money for food and leave as
much time as possible for my own projects (but I don't delete them!).

~~~
EuroHikikomori
> Damn, that is hard to hear. Is it because you don't think the project is
> good enough? Will you get to a point where you don't delete your projects?

It not so much that, I have enough time to work them into perfection, but
there is no use for them after completion. It's not like when an employer
request some work to be done that is going to be used afterwards, it's just me
trying to make op some project ideas.

------
torgoguys
...so is partly a matter that these parents are enablers?

At one time in my life, I'm sure I'd love to have done nothing but stay alone
in my room for months of time sleeping and doing internet stuff, with my meals
and such prepared for me and placed by my bedroom door, but there is no way my
parents would have allowed that.

~~~
Red_Tarsius
> _Another study of 88 hikikomori found that 60% lived with both parents, 18%
> with just their mother, 3% with their father, and 16% in a 3-generation
> household... authors have suggested overprotectedness is more common in
> families of hikikomori._

Enabling parents are one part of the equation. But hikikomori might just be a
cultural variant of Internet fixation. Independent adults are less likely to
be called out on their addictions, because no caretaker is watching over them.
How did the study find 88 hikikomori? They were reported by their parents or
friends.

------
theprop
"Outside Japan, there are just two case reports of hikikomori syndrome, one in
Oman and one in Spain."

I agree that this should be quite common around the world.

In the U.S., there are a lot of 20-year-old men who live with their parents or
have a part-time undemanding job and spend most of their time playing video
games, etc. and don't intend to get married.

~~~
csa
Most/all of what you describe is not hikikomori.

The "pure" form of hikis will rarely even leave their rooms. The idea of a
part time job is very much not something a pure hiki would do.

There is a lot of social maladjustment in Japan -- I've never seen this to the
same extent in the US or EU. It might be possible in some middle eastern
countries due to extreme religious reasons (e.g., Oman), but the underlying
reasons strike me as different.

Anyway, please don't conflate this with "playing a lot of video games" \--
this is an extreme form of isolation that most people have never seen.

~~~
PaulHoule
I dunno.

I do know people with panic disorder (and the associated agoraphobia) and
social phobia who live on a "Non24" calendar (they might call you at 2am in
the morning but not be awake at 3pm.) Depression, anxiety, drug use all
compliate the equation, but it's hard to believe that this phenomenon is all
that different from hikkiomori.

Many cultures take pride in an imagined exceptionalism and Japan is one of the
leaders in that. It serves their ideology to believe that they have a disease
that others don't.

I also have the impression that many people have subclinical agoraphobic or
social phobic disorders. For instance, my dad was high functioning in many
ways but he absolutely refused to go to any kind of retail space, including
the store my mom worked at.

Social phobia has a strong association with bullying; some people survive
bullying pretty well, but it has a devastating effect on many. Behind the
misogyny of the tech culture you might find deep anger about how many smart
people were shut out socially in high school. Some people find a pillar of
stability that helps them get through it, but the experience of being in a
hostile crowd can damage you profoundly.

~~~
csa
What you describe is definitely "an issue" \-- I know people like this in the
US.

This is not the issue that hikikomori is representing.

FWIW, I don't think that this is actually unique to Japan -- I just think that
it has become easier to document in Japan because so many folks in Japan are
starting to think that being a hiki is a good idea, and there is societal
infrastructure there to support it.

~~~
PaulHoule
How do I do the differential diagnosis between "hiki" and the social phobic?

------
konceptz
I played an mmorpg for 630 days of playtime over two years of my life. I had
saved up a good amount and was on a rather generous severance package during
the financial crash.

I recall my moment of change when a girl (irl) asked for a date and I missed a
dungeon run. The missing run meant that I would have to wait in line for the
item for another few months and it completely broke me of my urge to play.

While I know this isn't hikkikomorism in true form, I learned just how
powerful human biology is.

------
nnfy
It sounds like modern technology and culture are just more enabling of the
kind of withdrawal that is typical of depression. In past decades it would be
much more difficult for a human to willingly wall him or herself inside of a
single room for extended periods; now we have the internet.

------
rkapsoro
Awareness of it is becoming part of the culture in Japan too, too:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Welcome_to_the_N.H.K](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Welcome_to_the_N.H.K).
and the anime derived from it come to mind.

------
golergka
One of the most hard things to comprehend in life is how different can you
feel and how different can your own ideals become.

I was like that; as described before in the same thread, a western, light
version of hikki - staying at home, eating tv dinners, spending time in front
of the computer. Almost no social interaction, cut in a loop, 26 hour days,
and happy with it.

And I'm looking where I am now: doing sports, enjoying and throwing parties,
keeping in contact with a lot of friends, a lot of whom said me that I have an
outgoing personality and charisma... And all of that with almost no time left
for TV series or videogames. And I am happy and feel in harmony in this state,
too.

These two people don't understand one another and can't comprehend how the
other lifestyle can be enjoyable. And I don't really understand how the hell a
happy, self-content man can transition from one such state to another - but it
happens. In my experience, people do actually change a lot in their lifetime,
even if they don't expect it themselves, and one of the most surprising things
about this article is how stable the lives of those hikki are over a long
amount of time.

------
jackvalentine
"New"

I don't want to sound dismissive or anything but I remember discussing this
topic in highschool Japanese.. in 2004.

~~~
sotojuan
Yep, this has been a thing since the early 2000s, if not 90s.

------
cleaver
A manga and amime on the topic:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Welcome_to_the_N.H.K](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Welcome_to_the_N.H.K).

It gives a good introduction to the topic as well as other Japanese cultural
phenomena.

------
lapsock
I identify with this a lot, even though I go to college and have a job. But
it's a very, very thin line between the life I have currently and complete
isolation.

------
Animats
On HN last month:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13895134](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13895134)

~~~
sup
Seems like this topic is pretty popular on HN for some reason.

~~~
iplaw
/s/

