
Scientists may have solved a mystery about sea-level rise - Mz
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/energy-environment/wp/2015/12/11/scientists-may-have-just-solved-one-of-the-most-troubling-mysteries-about-sea-level-rise/
======
zymhan
So the mystery was because the original paper had flaws in it's methodology?
That's anticlimactic.

~~~
rntz
Welcome to science!

Also, not just flaws in methodology, but also flaws in its model, which is a
more significant issue. Making better models & checking them against reality
is a big part of science. It's not necessarily that the original author fucked
up; it's that our knowledge of the world improves (we hope) over time.

~~~
zymhan
Ah, okay, that seems like an important distinction.

------
mc32
So they mention that the asymmetrical melting of glaciers contribute to
"wobble". Do commute patterns with millions of vehicles exerting force on the
earth along non cancelling routes, contribute to additional wobble?

~~~
semi-extrinsic
The total mass of all cars in the world is on the order of 2e12 kilograms.
Since most routes cancel, drop that by an order of magnitude or two. The mass
of the ice melting just from Greenland in a year is 2e14 kilograms.

(Edit: the car mass number was 1e3 too small, thanks to mikeash for
correction.)

Edit2: the car mass number was right, but both numbers should have been in
tonnes. Now it's right. I should sleep now.

~~~
semi-extrinsic
So this is quite interesting: could it be that the total volume of ore
excavated per year is comparable to the total volume of new seawater from
melting ice? It looks like 5e13 kilograms of ore are excavated per year [1].
At an average density of <5 kg/l, that is the same volume as 1e13 kg of water,
or 1/20 times the meltwater from Greenland. No solution to rising oceans :(

[1]
[http://www.ilocis.org/documents/chpt74e.htm](http://www.ilocis.org/documents/chpt74e.htm)

~~~
mturmon
OK, I read this and I had some disbelief. It starts with a total of 23 billion
tonnes of ore, and ends with a volume equivalent to 1.5 meters of the whole
country of Switzerland being excavated per year.

That seemed high, but it turns out that independent estimates of just _coal_
excavation are 8 billion tonnes per year. So my disbelief was wrong.

And then, looking at it the other way, this makes it evident how much burning
all that coal could change global CO2.

------
biot
[http://talkorigins.org](http://talkorigins.org) is an amazing resource for
the scientific perspective on Creationism vs. Evolution. It details neatly all
the creationist arguments then thoroughly debunks them with overwhelming
scientific evidence, complete with references. Is there a similar site that
does the same for climate change?

~~~
username3
[http://creationwiki.org/Index_to_Creationist_Claims](http://creationwiki.org/Index_to_Creationist_Claims)
responds to arguments by Talk Origins. Is there a similar site that does the
same for climate change?

Better, is there any site that lists all arguments from all sides and reach a
conclusion? If they don't reach a conclusion, do they have a issue tracking
system and leave the issue open for anyone to find easily and respond?

Debates should have a programming language, have CI for new arguments, have
unit tests to check logic, have issues tracked and collaborated on GitHub.

~~~
ChuckMcM
I would love a site that categorized each argument and the supporting evidence
pro and con for a given topic. Would be a wonderful resource.

~~~
jberryman
How would that work? For creationism/evolution would it be one column with
facts and another with a lot of bunk? What's the point?

~~~
kevinskii
Sadly it would probably never work. Your comment is a good illustration of
why.

------
hanniabu
The comments in the article from the climate change skeptics hurt to read.....

"Are you suggesting that the oscillating ice ages are caused by a slowing and
speeding up at the earth's core?"

~~~
pc86
Always interesting to hear people who openly deny science attempt to reason
about science.

~~~
mikeyouse
I used to work with a young-earth creationist pharmacist who spent a lot of
time talking about how evolution was impossible since the second law of
thermodynamics says that entropy increases over time -- so it's impossible for
evolutionary complexity to increase.

Wasn't sure how to respond to that one.

~~~
rcthompson
This is one of the old standbys. Deleting the clause "in a closed system" and
pretending the 2nd law is still valid without it. I wonder what this person
would say if you asked them why you needed a different flu vaccine each year.

~~~
Caprinicus
Probably "I don't need a vaccine"

~~~
rcthompson
Well, given that the person a pharmacist, I would hope that's not the advice
they give.

------
jdalgetty
so basically we're all going to die.

~~~
Mz
Yeah. But that's true anyway. "Death and taxes" \-- we were all born under
sentence of death. Ain't none of us getting out of here alive.

~~~
jacquesm
Funny to see you downvoted, have an upvote instead. Reality is a harsh
mistress apparently. Makes you wonder if the same people that are harping on
promoting science and only trusting in the facts are the ones that would
downvote a comment that is about as factually true as possible. Uploading and
resurrection are - for now - hard SF and well over the horizon of the final
sunset for everybody living today.

~~~
dhimes
Yeah maybe 'tis the season. I got nailed on a (true) Jesus comment earlier.
Made me LOL.

------
viggity
I thought this may be regarding the effect of ground water extraction causing
coastal cities to sink 10+ times faster than sea level rise.

[http://meetingorganizer.copernicus.org/EGU2014/EGU2014-14606...](http://meetingorganizer.copernicus.org/EGU2014/EGU2014-14606.pdf)

Still interesting though.

