
DR Congo measles: More than 6k dead in world's worst outbreak - mlforlife123
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-51028791
======
Gatsky
This is just a heartbreaking, needless destruction of human life. Measles can
be eradicated, there is no animal reservoir. Eradication of disease is an
incredible gift to the future of humanity, and only gets harder with more
population. The coming population increases in subsaharan Africa are probably
going to take eradication of measles and polio off the map for a while,
especially with anti-vaccine sentiment rising in Nigeria for example.

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rahuldottech
Last Week Tonight has a nice episode on Vaccines:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7VG_s2PCH_c](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7VG_s2PCH_c)

It explains why vaccines are important, why "taking it slow" with vaccines is
a bad approach, and other important stuff.

Please vaccinate yourself and your kids.

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fnordsensei
Every year, I take the vaccine against the seasonal flu, if possible. This is
not primarily for myself, but for the people around me. The goal is herd
immunity, that's how we win.

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jml7c5
Unfortunately, many people in the DRC do not believe that the ebola vaccine is
effective or safe (or that ebola is a real problem). [1]

Fortunately, general acceptance of vaccines in the DRC is quite high:
"Confidence in vaccines in general was high and most respondents believed that
vaccines work (899 [90·7%, 95% CI 87·0–93·4) and are safe (852 [88·5%,
85·4–91·0])." [1]

[1]:
[https://www.thelancet.com/journals/laninf/article/PIIS1473-3...](https://www.thelancet.com/journals/laninf/article/PIIS1473-3099\(19\)30063-5/fulltext)
(DOI:
[https://doi.org/10.1016/S1473-3099(19)30063-5](https://doi.org/10.1016/S1473-3099\(19\)30063-5)
)

------
lolc
And here I am with a sister who thinks that vaccination for a newborn should
be "weighed against the risk". The reason we don't know measles as a deadly
disease anymore is because vaccination works so well!

~~~
Sarki
This mostly comes down to the irrationality regarding risks when you're having
kids.

Out of my own experience, and given the worst cases scenarios you hear from
it's difficult not to fear for your loved ones (and I mean you literally feel
it in your loins) especially when YOUR decision can have even the slightest
chance of ruining their lives. \-- Edit: Please don't get me wrong, I have
kids, and their vaccines are up to date (like mine). A chat with an hospital
pediatrist can help, for me it's when he clearly explained that without
vaccines a kid can be gone within 2 hours. And virtually it's as narrow minded
as refusing to take antibiotics.

~~~
lotsofpulp
It’s not difficult. There’s ample statistical evidence available, and super
high quality resources online such as CDC if one wanted to educate themselves.

It’s people being lazy and wanting to subject the world to their ego of “I’m
so smart because I believe in something contrary to the mainstream or against
the establishment”.

There’s clear proof of fraud by the idiot that started the nonsense rumors of
vaccine harm, and not a single person who knows basic math has shown risk of
harm. There is no excuse, other than wanting to satisfy your own ego.

~~~
Sarki
Nope, you misread me, I clearly stated the term "irrationality".

I consider myself as educated, though having your own kids and being
responsible for their life and well-being is what makes you doubt vaccines,
especially when you read about people developing multiple sclerosis or other
neurodegenerative symptoms following a vaccination.

~~~
lotsofpulp
The cause of the irrational behavior is the idea that one is more qualified
than medical researchers in every developed country after reading a few
websites about vaccine “effects”. To me, that is to satisfy one’s ego. An
educated person knows where the limits of their knowledge is, and becoming a
parent does not endow you with the ability to analyze vaccine efficacy, or any
other subject matter.

~~~
philipps
For some parents it may be ego or hubris, for others irrational fear, and in
many cases it may be driven by the consensus of a social group that someone
identifies with.

The fact that individuals are making decision contrary to available evidence
and data may be hard to accept (esp. for the HN community) but it happens all
the time.

In order to convince people to change their behavior, appealing to the
emotional and pro-social drivers may be more effective than providing better
rational arguments.

To be clear: I am not endorsing people making obviously bad decisions, it
drives me crazy, and I am 100% pro vaccines.

------
adreamingsoul
Today, my child had their second dose of the MMR vaccine. I'm thankful for the
access that we have to healthcare here in Norway. I can't imagine what it is
like in the Congo, but I'm grateful that people and organizations are working
hard to provide help to people in need.

~~~
ganzuul
Yesterday I read about someone paying 4000 USD for an operation for their old
cat. People have strange priorities. Perhaps it would be good to see what
poverty is like.

~~~
booblik
I am sorry, what is the point of your comment? Are you saying people are not
allowed to love their pets and should let them die, and not care for them when
they are sick?

~~~
andrepd
The life of ten thousand sick pets does not reach the value of one human life.
I think the point of that comment was simply how some people have no access to
basic medicine, while at the same time a team of highly trained people are
dedicating their time and effort to saving a cat. Of course, this can be said
of many things: jewelers, yacht - builders, sports car engineers.

~~~
scoutt
> The life of ten thousand sick pets does not reach the value of one human
> life.

At the same time complains like the OP is just hypocrisy, since we've spent a
lot of money in things we don't need (a simple smartphone) while we can feed a
family of the 3rd world for 1/2 year with the same money.

And (not trolling and not personal) I still prefer my pets' lives over yours,
as many of the users here would prefer their pets over the life of a random
dude on the internet (like mine).

But this doesn't mean that we should stop caring about our pets. I believe
that the initial statement (human life > pet life) is wrong since we should
all be caring about all living things (maybe?).

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kresten
I have infinite sympathy for children infected with preventable diseases
because adults chose not to vaccinate them, and for adults who cannot be
vaccinated. Heartbreaking.

I have pretty much zero sympathy for adult antivaxxers who get infected - let
evolution do its thing here.

~~~
DanBC
> I have pretty much zero sympathy for adult antivaxxers who get infected.

Why? Some of them will have been lied to by people who have considerable
amounts of money to spend on disinformation, and we (who support vaccination)
have done a poor job of explaining that vaccination is safe and effective.

[https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2019/nov/13/majority-...](https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2019/nov/13/majority-
antivaxx-vaccine-ads-facebook-funded-by-two-organizations-study)

[https://khn.org/morning-breakout/important-donor-to-anti-
vax...](https://khn.org/morning-breakout/important-donor-to-anti-vax-movement-
has-been-cashing-in-on-alternatives-to-vaccines-as-measles-outbreaks-surge/)

We know that many people struggle to understand health information. In England
we see:

[https://beta.nhs.uk/service-manual/content/health-
literacy](https://beta.nhs.uk/service-manual/content/health-literacy)

> More than 4 in 10 adults struggle with health content for the public and
> more than 6 in 10 adults struggle with health content that includes numbers
> and statistics.

Attacking people with anti-vaccination views _does not work_ to change their
minds.

~~~
kresten
Adults are responsible.

I’m not trying to change their minds.

~~~
MiroF
Most adults are just grown up children and should be treated with compassion
even when they make idiotic decisions.

~~~
kresten
That would be a reasonable outlook but antivaxxers spread cult like anti
scientific beliefs that endanger the lives of many people beyind the
individual antivaxxers.

This cult like behaviors isn’t deserving of ordinary empathy it needs to be
seen for what it is and stopped. Fortunate many countries are doing this.

~~~
MiroF
Absolutely it needs to be stopped - all I'm saying is that those unfortunate
bumpkins who have fallen for it don't deserve to die (or have "evolution take
its course") simply because they are naive and gullible.

Not everyone is smart, some are easily manipulated or prone to irrational
anxieties. They are still deserving of life and happiness.

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aaron695
For Fucks sake.

The awful people in this world are the ones who know vaccines are important
but just go on about anti-vaxxers while millions die who couldn't afford
access to vaccines.

Any chance we could skip bullying anti-vaxxers, it's not on topic to this
article and talk about how you can get vaccines to the people in the DR Congo.
And it's not drones..... probably something to do with refrigeration and
money. Or hiring remote people.

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Cthulhu_
I'll sound like a conspiracy theorist here but hear me out.

The anti-vaxx movement is a successful underground propaganda attack by the
Russians to weaken the population. They are also behind the election of unfit
leaders and anti-European (read: anti-unity) sentiments, or more broadly
speaking, making people argue about internal affairs so they're no longer a
strong front against the outside world.

Where's the state funded counter propaganda? There used to be propaganda
posters that portrayed not vaccinating as un-American and / or working with
the enemy.

~~~
MiroF
Evidence? I think most of these "Russian funded propo attacks" are vastly
overstated.

We have our own monied interests to do that for us

~~~
corrigo
It's funny, this might be the one-in-a-million case where a conspiracy
theorist actually hit the nail on the head.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Infektion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Infektion)

Of course this was in the 80's, and probably stopped now

