
Ask HN: My father is so obese he'll likely die from a heart attack this year - DYZT
This is not a a technical or technological question but I need advice.<p>My 60+ year old father is obese, he&#x27;s over worked (works close to 15 hours a day for many many years), sleeps very little and lately started suffering from pains in his chest. The doctor said he doesn&#x27;t think he&#x27;ll last it until the end of the year. He said it 6 months ago.<p>Today he&#x27;s been submitted to hospital suffering from mild pains in his chest. The doctors checked him and everything seemed to be alright. He didn&#x27;t agree to stay for examination over the night and left a few hours after the tests results arrived.<p>My father is very intelligent, he&#x27;s hard working and has a very strong will. Non the less he isn&#x27;t willing to do anything active to lose weight. He&#x27;s been dieting this last half a year. He hasn&#x27;t gained weight but hasn&#x27;t lost anything either.<p>He won&#x27;t go to a dietitian, won&#x27;t do sport.<p>What can I do (I&#x27;m 25) to get him to take this thing seriously. How can I help him to lose weight? Each time I raise the issue he treats it as though it doesn&#x27;t exist.<p>Any advice is welcome, thank you.
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epc
Confront him bluntly with discussion about burial details and his will. Ask if
he would record a message to his grandchildren he'll never see. Ask about his
living will, does he want to be on life support? How about if he is brain
dead?

Sorry to be so blunt, I went through something like this with my father. He
refused to change his ways until he had a massive MI resulting in a heart
bypass which he never fully recovered from, dying at 57 (I was 30 at the time
of the MI and CTO of ibm.com).

To fully change he needs the support of the family, but he needs to accept the
need to change. Without that you will just frustrate yourself and your family.

~~~
beat
Yes, exactly. The living will conversation. It may not change his ways, but
it'll make him respect how you feel about it, hopefully.

For me, it was 2009, the year everyone died. I lost so many friends and
family, and so many of my friends lost friends and family, I couldn't even
count them all. My bandmate in particular struggled with a father who had been
a lifelong hermit, and was utterly uncooperative in his own care. He had no
will, and my bandmate was the sole heir of a house that had been in the family
for generations (since the 1850s). It was a legal mess waiting to happen.
Meanwhile, I lost another bandmate, just a few years older than me, to cancer,
and lost a friend of 15 years to suicide. Terrible, terrible year.

This led me to a conversation with my children, who were 15 at the time. I
told them that if I ever get to where I can't take care of myself and their
mother can't take care of me for whatever reason, that they should do
_whatever it takes_ to take care of me. Take away my car, take over my
finances, put me in a nursing home, whatever. I warned them that I'll tell
them not to do those things then. They shouldn't listen to me then, because
I'll be senile!

But seriously, parents may not do what is best for their children, but they
can at least care that that's their choice.

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ScottWhigham
_What can I do (I 'm 25) to get him to take this thing seriously._

I struggled with this with both my parents (one a smoker, one obese). I talked
to both until it became a strain on our relationship (both were younger than
yours is now though - they were maybe 48ish when I was 25). In the end, my mom
just flat out told me that she knew it would kill her but that her parents
died young and that's just okay with her. How do you respond to that? This is
an intelligent woman - a professional DBA for 10+ years and an IT manager for
another 15) - yet she is superstitious without cause ("My parents died early
so that must mean I will too no matter what I do").

In the end I opted to just live and let live - no more preaching, no more "Are
you kidding? You can't eat that! You're already 280 pounds!". I don't know
what else I could do - I can't make them do the right thing and they know the
"right thing" but willfully ignore it. It's frustrating, sure, but I enjoy the
time I have with them. I ultimately chalked it up to "personal weakness" \- my
dad would sabotage his diets and avoid actual health knowledge in favor of fad
diets, and my mom just didn't want to work that hard to quit smoking.

Bottom line: he made the life choices of the past 20+ years with full
knowledge of what might/will happen.

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lukevdp
Spend time with him and savor being around him. We all die eventually, it's
what we do with the time we have that counts. My advice would just be to do
the things to ensure you won't live with regrets in the future.

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Choronzon
If he wont listen to you effectively nothing. I know this is not the answer
you want to hear but you can only help people who help themselves. He sounds
like he is in nowhere near the shape required for any kind of sport but an
hour or two walking a day would be excellent workout. If the diet is failing
then quality of food is probably an issue,high quality vegetables and
meat/fish cooked simply (no sauces ),no vegetable oils,minimal milk and bread
products.The more boring and tasteless the better.

You can consider a low carb diet as well(provided its clean),humans are
normally perfectly adapted to eat carbohydrates but he might find it easier if
he has problems with insulin regulation. And he should stop working
already,time for health related retirement.

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peachepe
I'm 25 too. My father died in January, it was almost the same story. He was
not obese, but had heart issues, and the doctors had told him 2012 would be
his last year. And he kept that from us.

Even 15 seconds before dying, he told me it was just asthma bothering. (While
being in ICU).

The first thing that called my attention was that when I logged into his
computer to close his facebook and etc, the computer was clean. He had removed
every password, cache, social media app. And he removed them 1 hour before
going to the hospital.

What I'm trying to say is, that sometimes people just wants to let go. And
maybe, sometimes, we should just be with them, and say how much we love them.

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DYZT
After a sleepless night, I think I've come up with a multi stage plan to help
lose the extra weight, until he's out of the danger weight zone (he doesn't
have to be slim, just not obese). Would love some advice:

Conduct several changes to effect his lifestyle and make it healthier

1\. Disconnect the TV and get the 3 seat sofa of the the living room. This way
he won't fall asleep in front of the TV. This will help him with regular
sleep.

2\. Not buy unhealthy food. Sign up for a service providing fresh salads each
day. Put a salad in his car. For him to always have a healthy alternative
that's easier to obtain than other fatting alternatives.

3\. Blocks his drive way with wood a metal. Should make him look for parking
that atleast 15 mins away from home. 15 mins in each direction is a 30 min
daily walk. Force him for some exercise.

4\. Fill the house with scales. In every room. Scales that can support his
weight. For him not to avoid it.

5\. Define together with him his weight target. Find a dietitian willing to
come to our house at 9 pm when he finishes working to help him estimate his
progress.

6\. Getting his brother involved. He appreciates his older brother and enjoys
talking to him. Ask for his brother to come over once a week and go walking
with him (he lives near by).

7\. He also has a very good friend from work (they've been working together
for 35 years or more). Not sure how he can effectively help though. Ideas?

8\. I Built up a weekly table, each of the family members (we're a few
brothers married with or with girlfriends, and I've got a healthy mother). In
each hour or two someone else needs to phone him to ask him how's his day /
diet going and what he's had to eat today. When he's coming home and when he's
going walking.

Any other ideas will be greatly appreciated. Thanks

~~~
BlackJack
You should try to understand what he eats and why. Is it just a lot of junk
food? He might not be feeling full, because fast food is not very satiating.
Try adding more protein and fat in his diet and reducing carbohydrates. I'm
not saying a ketogenic diet - just changing the proportions a bit to see if he
feels fuller.

You can try to help all you want but he's a grown man and will have to decide
by himself. Show that he can eat yummy things that will keep him full - as
long as he has a caloric deficit, he will lose weight. Eating salads all day
won't satisfy anybody. Try eating meals with him.

Good luck!

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teyc
Is your father still working? What's his height and weight?

If he has high intelligence, then don't bother prescribing him what to do. You
only need to pitch and convince him that hitting a certain BMI is a necessary
business outcome. Some men are hunters, not farmers. They need something to
chase, not just hang around and tending gardens.

Exercise has been not shown to contribute much to weight loss. On the other
hand, lack of sleep has been associated with weight gain.

Ask your father to consider replacing soda with water. It's magic for most
people. The first few days, water will taste terrible. If he can't stand it,
make a spritz by adding fresh lemons. Buy a set of scales because he will
definitely see the results of this one small change. Also, drink more water.
It helps cut down the appetite.

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giardini
Accept and implement what ScottWhigham and epc have posted. Don't try to
control something that you can't: he's over 60, has lived a long life and may
not see much reason to continue.

Meanwhile, if he wants to try, I recommend "playing to his strengths". Likely
some of the largest muscles in his body are in his legs (obese persons often
have incredibly strong legs that can burn lots of fat) and if he simply begins
walking then it's the best first step to a cure.

Offer incentives if necessary: take him to parks, malls, museums or wherever
he might enjoy a change of scenery while walking. Someplace with lots of young
women usually perks up the older guys. Of course if he went to a gym that
would be great, but I wouldn't buy a gym membership yet.

------
huxley
It might be worthwhile finding out if your dad is suffering from panic attacks
(I can testify that it can give you pretty freaky symptoms). It might also
explain some other things like the 15 hour work day and even contribute
towards his weight issues.

There are no advantages to fighting with your father if you are worried about
him dying this year. His health problems didn't start yesterday, so any change
will take time and effort.

Helping him get regular sleep may be the easiest first thing to begin. Lots of
good things to try to help with sleep including limiting exposure to blue
light.

Having a friend who he can buddy up with might make light exercise easier. It
will probably feel like criticism and nagging if it comes from you and your
family, but if it comes from a peer (who also needs some exercise) it might be
easier to take. If he is very overweight and there concerns with his heart,
jumping into heavy exercise is probably not a great idea (nor realistic).

My dad was a 2-3 pack a day smoker for most of his life. I don't actually
regret the fact that I didn't get him to quit sooner(though I tried), I regret
that I didn't spend more fun moments with him (which we did have, but not
enough). Find the things he likes doing and see if you can do some together.
If he is happier and enjoying his life more, it might give him the motivation
to change things.

------
krob
Well, to be honest. I think it's all about the guilt trip. Guilt-tripping
people usually has this way of making them obligated to do stuff, atleast for
me. So guilt-trip the hell out of your mom & dad. Let them know that they
won't live to see your future children/their grandchildren. That you want to
see them learn from their grannies. Or a good kick in the ass might help?..
Basically you need something to kick these people into high gear. Find out
what scares the daylights out of them, and do that, something to put them in a
different mental state.

I know how you feel btw. My dad was brilliant, but he was very set in his way
because he felt he knew everything.

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waivej
I hope this helps. Eating and working too much can be addictive and I don't
think you'll be able to force him to change. Maybe try connecting and maybe
learning some of his personal dreams. Real change has to come from him, but
maybe you could gently establish a keystone habit that others can build from.
"The Power of Habit" is a good book/audiobook that talks a bit about this in
the first chapters.

On the other hand, it's hard to accept, but maybe just try to connect while
you can.

------
genwin
Suggest he take a walk with you. If he does, keep it up. If he won't even take
a walk with you it's probably hopeless, sorry to say. I went through such with
my father.

~~~
DYZT
he will very rarely agree to take walks with anyone

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nicholas73
Try spending time with him and suggest walking whenever you can, like when you
are going to the store. That way it's not just exercise. My gf got her cousin
to lose 30 lbs or so over the course of a year.

The hardest part about exercise is getting over the hurdle to actually go do
it. Having a partner makes it much easier. Even if I am fit I have a very hard
time just going to a gym - I have to go play a sport.

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codemonkeymike
When you are younger you have more power over your parents. Like when I was in
my early teens, I was able to guilt my mother out of smoking and drinking. If
it was today (Now I am 21 and moved out of my house) I believe I would be much
less successful. My thoughts, make your father feel like you need him for
support.

~~~
DYZT
fantastic. Thanks for this

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jfoster
Careful not to spoil your relationship with him over it. Try to have some
serious conversations with him about it. Unless he is bought into your plan,
it might be impossible to do anything about. People have a hard enough time
losing weight when they are actively trying to.

