

Is Forced Fatherhood Fair? - ryfia
http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/06/12/is-forced-fatherhood-fair/?ref=opinion

======
dredmorbius
Another thought is: what effect do laws such as this (and others which tip the
scales in favor of women in areas such as divorce and domestic violence) have
on the dating and mating pools?

I've known men who've been entrapped by women into having kids (she went off
the pill, didn't tell him ...). The one I'm thinking of should have finally
been freed of his childcare obligations a year or two back. Her moving across
the country meant he had virtually no access to the child. She's gone on to
scam a few other men. And that's only one story.

I've known men (and women, for what it's worth) who've fallen prey to the
immigration green-card marriage scam. Makes you think long and hard about
getting involved with someone who doesn't have permanent residency (itself a
significant pain in the US now). The good news is that you're fairly safe from
risks in this case so long as you don't get married.

And of course, there's the divorce situation. One joke making the rounds after
the 2008 financial crisis was: "It's worse than a divorce: I've lost my house,
my car, and, half my retirement, and I've still got the wife". Divorce isn't
easy on anyone, but the financial hit can be severe. Even in states with
formulas for asset distribution, one vengeful party can drive legal costs
through the roof.

The decreased level of financial security facing both men _and_ women today
may also be having a negative effect on relationships and marriage.
Marketplace Radio is running a special program this week (which I hope they
extend) called "Consumed", asking questions about our consumer economy,
starting with "is it sustainable" (spoiler alert: no). On Wednesday's show, a
story focused on a 43 year old adjunct art teacher. Working part-time, one of
the sacrifices she's made is having a family: "At some point I had to think
about having kids, and it's not been financially feasible for me to support
anybody besides myself."

[http://www.marketplace.org/topics/sustainability/consumed/pa...](http://www.marketplace.org/topics/sustainability/consumed/part-
time-career-changes-lifes-expectations)

I've also known quite a few families who _have_ tried to live like it was the
1980s all over again, with mortgages and credit cards and HELOCs. For many of
them, _that_ path is ending in bankruptcy, divorce, extra jobs, and/or little
or no retirement savings.

We're seeing the cracks all over the place, but you can't apply pressures as
we have without them appearing in multiple places.

Including on the dating and mating pools.

------
te_platt
I wasn't quite sure what to make of "If a man accidentally conceives a child
with a woman...". I'm aware that in some cases a sperm donor has been forced
to pay child support and I suppose there could be ways a man could unknowingly
father a child but the article seem to imply cases where the father willing
had sex but for some reason thought there wouldn't be a pregnancy.

There's just not a subtle way to put except that when a man has sex with a
woman there is always the possibility of pregnancy. Condoms break, the pill is
not 100% effective, vasectomies sometimes fail.

That's not to say there aren't problems with how paternity is treated in our
current legal system. I just don't think downplaying the responsibilities men
face is a good strategy here.

~~~
stray
But a woman can choose to not have the child.

It is only fair to give the man the same right.

~~~
Gobitron
This is not right. You're right in that many cases a woman can choose to not
have the child with or without consent of the father, but she is then faced
with the real consequences of having to have an abortion, whether emotional,
physical, or other. Every woman will deal with an abortion differently, and
I'm not arguing that all women feel consequences, but certainly there is a
burden there that must be dealt with. A man would not have to deal with these
consequences - he could just literally walk away. To me, this is a significant
moral hazard.

------
ScottBurson
This is an interesting argument.

I could see a rule something like the following: in case of an unplanned
pregnancy, the woman must inform the man within the first trimester that she
is pregnant, and obtain a written (and perhaps notarized) agreement from him
to the effect that he is willing to pay child support. If she doesn't tell him
or he doesn't sign the agreement, she will be unable to legally compel him to
pay. If she tells him and he doesn't sign, now she knows what to expect, in
time to abort the pregnancy if that is her choice.

Probably very few men would sign such an agreement, but the few who did would
probably be relatively easy to collect from.

