
Yoshi (YC S16) launches “set it and forget it” vehicle re-fueling service in SF - katm
https://techcrunch.com/2016/07/11/yoshi-launches-set-it-and-forget-it-vehicle-re-fueling-service-in-san-francisco/
======
danhak
I've never owned a car in a city as dense as SF or New York so maybe it's
different in places like that, but this strikes me as yet another example of
the "Uber-For-X" SV startup that doesn't solve any real problem. Stopping by
the gas station once a week on my way home is simply not a big enough
annoyance for me to subscribe to yet another service.

I'm also skeptical of the long-term prospects of this business model based on
the rise of transportation-as-a-service and the inevitable demise of gasoline
in favor of EV's. Both of those factors will be especially pronounced in the
Bay Area, where this startup hopes to gain a foothold.

~~~
technofiend
I guess I'm one of those weird outliers who has a use case but still won't use
the service. My wife works nights and rarely remembers to fuel our vehicle. I
commute via Uber or bus so I never have it either. $15/mo is still too much
for the service. Sooner or later my wife will run out of gas and then she'll
do a better job of remembering to fuel the truck.

~~~
nostromo
I imagine it's quite a bit more than $15 a month. They probably bake some
healthy margins into the price of gas.

~~~
rconti
I had never heard of this kind of service until a couple of weeks ago when I
saw a Booster fuels truck. The advertised prices on the truck were a good 20
cents/gallon lower than the Chevron across the street from where it was
parked.

OTOH, I don't know if they use top tier fuels with whatever detergent packages
or if it's Arco-quality gas, or what.

~~~
shostack
Having seen but never used Arco--is there a significant difference in gasoline
quality? I had always been under the impression that it was largely a
commodity product with the various additives largely being used to help
differentiate from a branding standpoint and not actually doing much.

~~~
ams6110
There is basically no difference in gasoline brands. They all buy from the
same area wholesalers. Some may vary on ethanol percentage and other additives
but generally it's nothing significant.

~~~
rconti
Back when I lived in WA, Arco was the "cheap gas" because they used the winter
10% ethanol blend (== less power and less fuel economy) year-round, whereas
'good' gas stations switched to ethanol-free in the summer.

Now that I live in CA, everyone does 10% ethanol anyway. More and more it's
hard to find non-ethanol gas anywhere.

Supposedly the top tier brands use 'better' detergents, but I'd say the
differences in brands are smaller than ever.

------
aresant
I think the HN crowd underestimates how valuable target users consider their
time.

I probably average 2 trips to the gas station a month and I have a below
average commute.

Each trip takes me 10 mins out of my way + 10 mins of fueling depending on if
there's a line or not.

And it's always before work (I'm in a rush) or after work (want to get home to
family).

Paying a startup $15/mo to reclaim even 40 mins a month of my personal time is
a no brainer.

~~~
untilHellbanned
I think you underestimate how valuable _the vast majority of the world_
considers their money. All this use of "My". Sorry to be blunt but you are
irrelevant. Spend some time outside of the bubble, St. Louis for example.
People here ain't gonna pay $15 to reclaim 40 minutes a month. This strikes me
like the gig economy spend a $1 to get $0.90 strategy. There are huge costs
for physical presence businesses that can only solved by charging a
premium...or spending VC money. So you are fated to be a lifestyle brand or
brace for the pump and dump.

~~~
beachstartup
_> People here ain't gonna pay $15 to reclaim 40 minutes a month_

are there no hand car washes in st. louis? a full service carwash saves about
40 minutes of labor that you can use to catch up on work or other activities,
and costs about 15 bucks.

and how about a cheap lunch at the diner for 1 or 2? wouldn't that be about
$15? and saves you about 40 minutes of prep, cook, and clean?

$15 in a taxi cab or uber would save you about 40 minutes of walking.

~~~
untilHellbanned
You're missing the point. Most people don't think through this. They stop at
"That costs me $15. Not gonna do it."

~~~
beachstartup
i think you're missing the point, people spend $15 all the time without
thinking about it... hence my examples.

~~~
untilHellbanned
No. My point is people value their money over their time despite their time
being more valuable than the money they save. Remember people drive 10 minutes
out of the way to save $0.05/gallon on gas. People waste time and money to
save money! My mom does this. There is no amount of analysis that will make
her stop. People just don't think.

And yeah people do part with $15 on known entities in brainless ways. This is
a new behavior though. This gas refueling scheme ain't gonna make sense to the
vast majority of people, hence once again cue the Dana Carvey George Bush
skit...."Not gonna do it."

------
OoTheNigerian
Guys, guy, can you look beyond what you see today? Filling gas is merely an
MVP. The goal at the minimum is to manage every car post purchase

Gas is merely a way to start the relationship between the car and the owner.

car servicing is a massive low hanging fruit after the gas one. Presently my
car is over a month due for servicing, I'll happily pay 15% more to get
someone come do it where I parked it.

My suggestion to the founders would be to test switching between "refuelling"
tagline and "serving where you are" and see which converts better. I believe
too many people who need the second will dismiss you on seeing the mundane
first.

Best of luck!

~~~
fweespeech
I agree with you and it seems to be a semi-proven model with
[https://www.yourmechanic.com/](https://www.yourmechanic.com/) being the
leader in that sort of thing atm.

~~~
whamlastxmas
I've tried two of these services and both never responded to my request.

~~~
fweespeech
Really?

I've had no trouble with YourMechanic.

I've never used Yoshi...but I have a gas station at the end of my block and I
talk to the owner every so often so I'd feel weird cutting him off like that.
xD

------
macandcheese
How do they open your gas tank? I think the most interesting part is their
partnership with Firestone... On demand car servicing while you are at work
seems like it solves a bigger problem than filling up with gas.

~~~
city41
I wonder if there has been a roadblock to that that needs solving. Because
replacing auto glass while you're at work has been a thing for a very long
time.

~~~
macandcheese
My guess?

Quick-service car maintenance is profitable because they can be efficient.

They have a guy at Jiffy Lube "below deck" so the car doesn't need to be
jacked, lifted, or crawled under to start draining the oil.

The second you lose "home court" you lose any procedural efficiency your
business has.

I have enough trouble crawling under my car in my own driveway, I can't
imagine having to work on a car in a corporate parking lot, surrounded by
others.

It's also messy, so I'd imagine it's pretty hard to do anything while making
sure the cars parked half a foot away, are clean and untouched. Glass
replacement at least is relatively self contained.

------
toephu2
Unfortunately this sounds like another startup that won't exist 2 years from
now. They are solving a problem that isn't really a problem. And super long
term when everyone has an electric car this won't even be an issue. The
potential client base seems really small. They would have to pivot like crazy.

~~~
unclebucknasty
I wonder if their success will be inversely proportional to the success of
Uber.

------
fred256
This article from a few months ago comes to mind:
[http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-05-02/gas-
delive...](http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-05-02/gas-delivery-
startups-want-to-fill-up-your-car-anywhere-is-that-allowed)

~~~
tlrobinson
I'm adding gasoline delivery to the list of startups which should absolutely
not "move fast and break things" or "beg for forgiveness rather than ask for
permission"

> "We haven't talked to them. I don't know about that. It’s news to me"

> "You can never ask for permission because no one will give it"

~~~
aianus
> I'm adding gasoline delivery to the list of startups which should absolutely
> not "move fast and break things" or "beg for forgiveness rather than ask for
> permission"

The status quo is that every half-drunk, chain smoking, Joe Regular is allowed
to fuel up his tank unsupervised. This is unlikely to be any more dangerous.

> "You can never ask for permission because no one will give it"

This is the unfortunate truth.

------
ohitsdom
> Today, the company’s fuel delivery drivers are 1099 contractors

Why? Even if truck driving jobs tend to be contract positions, this isn't any
driving job. And it certainly isn't uber.

~~~
Animats
That may not fly for long. DoL is cracking down.

Their drivers need a commercial drivers license with a hazmat endorsement.[1]
There's also a TSA background check before you get to drive a gasoline tanker,
even a small one.

Why doesn't the fueling vehicle have a full-sized hazmat diamond, like every
other fuel truck in the US?

[1]
[https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/dmv/detail/pubs/cdl_htm/sec9](https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/dmv/detail/pubs/cdl_htm/sec9)

~~~
forgetsusername
> _Why doesn 't the fueling vehicle have a full-sized hazmat diamond, like
> every other fuel truck in the US?_

HN generally assumes such regulations are merely the work of corrupt
politicians in the corporate pockets trying to slow disruption.

------
gnicholas
Having started driving in the age of 99¢/gal gas, I am highly sensitive to
price differences between stations, and I choose between 3 stations that are
always within 5¢ of each other. I am typically not so price sensitive (with
other purchases), but with gas I make minor schedule/route deviations to save
<75¢ on a fill up. Curiously, because this startup charges a monthly
convenience/subscription charge—instead of an incremental fuel charge—I was
actually willing to consider it. But when I did the math, it didn't come close
to making sense.

Having a service like this would save me some amount of time, I suspect that
if I significantly relaxed my fueling station choices, it would cost me much
less than $15/mo, and the inconvenience of filling up would be diminished
nearly to zero. There are stations very near where I live, so route deviations
would disappear, and the lines are never very long.

Basically, I think part of the allure of a service like Yoshi is it removes
the decision paralysis that results from having many different gas stations
available, and having to choose when/where to fill up. Ultimately not a game-
changer for me, but I appreciate that it makes me consider alternatives!

~~~
pbreit
You have that degree of decision paralysis over 50 cents?

~~~
megablast
Probably spends more shopping around than he does saving money.

~~~
gnicholas
Nope—all three stations are on the same road, in a 1 mile stretch that I
travel frequently. Note the "minor" deviations that I indicate making. I don't
ever drive out of my way to get gas; it's always a timing issue.

------
dougdonohoe
Another startup for things your parents used to do for you.

~~~
tantalor
Your parents pumped gas for your car...?

~~~
sliverstorm
I think he's referring to when you were little, and they were driving.

~~~
ars
When I was little and they were driving I used to fill gas. It was great fun
using the credit card and everything else.

Very sad to see "must be a licensed driver to pump gas" signs everywhere these
days :(

~~~
ams6110
When I was little you pulled into the gas station, and a teenage kid sprinted
from the garage, pumped your gas, washed your windows, and checked your oil,
took your payment, and you never had to leave your seat.

~~~
op00to
The past is the present in the great state of New Jersey. Though it's usually
a gentleman of indeterminate Asian origin instead of a pimply faced teen. I
love not pumping my own gas.

~~~
ehnto
In a few states it's due to regulation rather than good service. If customers
are setting your gas station on fire too often, maybe having a staff member do
the pumping makes sense.

Darn customers, always with the fire.

------
trevorcreech
"... allows Yoshi to access any car’s tank, even if the gas flap is locked."

Very curious how this works.

~~~
nick007
Good question. We created a device (that we call a "Fuel Vault") that we can
install in your car's "gas flap." We'll require that you leave your car's gas
flap popped open for your first fill-up so that we can install it. After that,
we'll be able to get into your gas flap anytime. It doesn't require any
permanent modifications to your car, and can be removed anytime.

~~~
maxerickson
Does your device have the same security properties as the typical fuel door?

~~~
CamperBob2
Locking gas doors are pretty pointless these days, unless you're worried about
someone giving you the sugar-in-the-gas-tank treatment. All cars made for the
last several years have anti-siphoning measures built into the line to the gas
tank.

~~~
rapind
1\. Paint Yoshi sign on Truck so it looks like you're _supposed_ to be there
messing with the car's gas.

2\. Use something like GasTapper (literally first google hit) on apparently
uncrackable gas tanks.

3\. Profit?

~~~
CamperBob2
Interesting, thanks. My understanding was wrong -- I thought the automakers
were using actual metal mesh screens to block the passage of siphons.
Apparently (according to the GasTapper video I just watched on YouTube) you
can just ram the smaller hose right through the obstruction.

~~~
rapind
And thank you. I wasn't even aware gas tanks had security measures, let alone
gadgets to circumvent it until your comment piqued my interest. Pretty
interesting.

------
mwfunk
I'm curious about trademark issues WRT the company having the same name as a
well-known Nintendo character. IANAL, and I know that the context in which a
name is used affects whether or not the name is protected, but I've got to
think that if (for example) I started an extremely not-video-game-related
company named "Pikachu" that I would likely get some heat for it, even if it
was just a toothless nastygram from a lawyer asking me nicely to not use the
name.

Is the name "Yoshi" not as protected for whatever reason (more common
name/word/etc.), or is this just a case where the company is in a different
industry therefore Nintendo's protection doesn't apply, or is this a risky
thing to do? I'm just genuinely curious about how this stuff works, I have no
stake in any of it. It's a great name and I wish the startup the best.

~~~
TillE
Yoshi is an actual Japanese name.

~~~
hkmurakami
It's only part of a name. Examples of a "full" name including Yoshi: Yoshida,
Yoshinori, Yoshiko, Yoshimoto, etc.

~~~
ehnto
Still, I can't trademark Ben, part of Benjamin.

------
killion
I've had a couple of fill-ups with Yoshi since signing up a few weeks ago.
It's been great for my Mountain View commutes so I don't have to lose more
time with my family because I had to stop for gas on the way home.

------
physcab
I've seen Booster Fuels trucks around at a company I used to work at. To me
this makes the most sense as a perk offered by a company not in a major city,
that has huge parking lots of cars. I used to commute to Santa Clara 3x a week
from SF and needed to re-fuel every week. If the company offered the service
as a perk with me just paying for gas, that would be pretty convenient no-
brainer.

~~~
MBlume
I'd be a little angry if I worked at that company. What are they doing for the
folks who don't drive in every day?

~~~
jessaustin
Whenever I've mentioned all the health costs associated with offspring (which
I don't have!), the HR dude has always referred me to the Parable of the
Vineyard Workers. I'm not sure it really applies, but I get the feeling we're
not supposed to complain about that sort of thing...

~~~
louprado
You can take the larger view that your co-workers' children will one day pay
your Social Security. That seems like a huge net plus for you.

But seriously, the remarkable part of your comment is your HR department. If
someone in HR hears a valid complaint about fairness and then tells you to
read the "don't be a whiny bitch" parable in the Bible, you should be able to
get away with murder at that company. Why not clock-in a 4:50PM and call it a
day after 10 minutes per said parable.

~~~
jessaustin
Haha I've never heard that parable TLDRd like that. That's _almost_ as funny
as the idea that I'll get social security.

------
nick007
Hi, I'm one of the founders. Happy to answer any questions!

~~~
mring33621
I actually think this is a pretty good idea, especially if you can also handle
the annoying, piddly maintenance stuff, like tire pressure, fluids and perhaps
oil changes for me.

~~~
Alupis
> fluids and perhaps oil changes for me

You're wanting a full service mechanic to come out to you. That's not what
this service is (nor do I think you can commercially change oil and other
fluids in random parking lots).

~~~
softawre
Here you are, on HN, saying why things aren't possible. Yet these guys are out
there making them work. Food for thought.

~~~
Alupis
> Here you are, on HN, saying why things aren't possible. Yet these guys are
> out there making them work. Food for thought

Just because someone has an idea doesn't make it a sound idea, nor legal.
Changing vehicle fluids commercially in random parking lots is not allowed in
a lot of places, for fairly obvious reasons.

And frankly, the company this thread is about even acknowledges the legality
of what they are doing may be shaky. Driving around town with hundreds of
gallons of fuel is likely to make certain regulatory bodies unhappy.

In another article, the San Franciso fire department stated fuel delivery
services were not permitted[1].

[1] [http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-05-02/gas-
delive...](http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-05-02/gas-delivery-
startups-want-to-fill-up-your-car-anywhere-is-that-allowed)

~~~
CamperBob2
Easier to apologize later than to get permission first.

If you disagree, and it sounds like you do, there are plenty of other sites.

------
a_small_island
When I saw the first picture of the article, I thought the premise was that
you could get your gas filled while you were actually driving like a plane
refueling in the sky. That's not what it is though.

~~~
nick007
Not quite... I like that idea better, it's just a lot harder unfortunately.
We're starting with stationary fill-ups only

------
zappo2938
They have had this service in yachting for years.[0] The best is being close
enough for a fuel truck to reach.[1]When I was in St. Thomas Carlos Slim's
crew were fueling his yacht Helo[2] with the only line that would reach far
enough down the dock which only pumps about 25 gallons a minute. The engineers
had to hold watch day and night until it was filled.

[0] [http://www.petersonfuel.com/](http://www.petersonfuel.com/)

[1] [http://www.lukfuel.com/](http://www.lukfuel.com/)

[2] [https://s-media-cache-
ak0.pinimg.com/736x/61/f8/9a/61f89a5b5...](https://s-media-cache-
ak0.pinimg.com/736x/61/f8/9a/61f89a5b5b122c18ff0f6bd0f193905d.jpg)

------
kirykl
Even if this never nets a profit on the service, big Gas has deep enough
pockets to make it worth a potential sell out exit

------
tlrobinson
Seems like there's potential for partnerships with car-sharing companies like
Zipcar, Getaround, etc. Do they currently outsource refueling?

~~~
superuser2
Yes, to their customers. With Getaround you need to go to a gas station and
refill the car to a specified level (typically full) every trip, no exceptions
ever, even if you only used it to move your groceries 10 blocks. OTOH, the
hourly price is lower.

With Zipcar you must return the tank at least 1/3rd (maybe it's 1/4th) full,
but there is a gas card in the visor. They're apparently using some kind of
fleet management system, because the gas pump itself prompts you for the
odometer value and your "driver ID" number (on your Zipcard) before fueling.
Same interface at competing gas stations, so it's apparently a standard thing.

It's a bit unpleasant because you can't cut the reservation time too close to
your needs - need to allow extra time to go to a gas station and back.

~~~
tlrobinson
I guess I'm just lucky, I've never gotten a Zipcar that was close to the
minimum fuel level.

For some reason I thought at least Zipcar augmented customer refueling with
trucks that refueled the fleet.

------
tinbad
I'm probably the only one here who actually enjoys taking a break from my
commute to pull over, refuel and get a drink/snack while I'm at it. But I can
totally see where this would work (depending on how much one drives). I can
see my wife use this to not have to deal with getting gas, especially when she
drives our two babies around. I wonder if they offer both regular and premium
gas as my car needs premium (would be good info to have in their website
before I'm forced to download the app). Also, reading on their website they
claim it's better for the environment to not have to drive to a gas station.
Again, this depends on the location, but where I live (SF Bay Area) there's a
gas station on almost every main intersection of roads so it's hard to believe
that that would take me more gas than for them to have it drive out to my
office.

~~~
yeukhon
You are not. When I drive down to West Virginia from NY, getting fresh air on
foot is exciting because I feel safe walking around gas station more than
driving on the road. But that's outside of city. City gas station is
competitive enough I feel stressed about going into one.

------
noonespecial
For all of the ridiculous "fire professionals" _because safety hrmmm huuhh
drep_ mentioned in the articles, let me just point out that this(1) is a thing
that already drives fairly recklessly through the neighborhoods in my town
delivering fuel and doesn't seem to do half of the things these car-fuel
delivery companies do to deal with spillage issues.

(1)
[http://jamesheatingoil.net/Members/1/galleries/Oil_Truck/oil...](http://jamesheatingoil.net/Members/1/galleries/Oil_Truck/oil%20truck.JPG)

Edit: Also and aside... the last driver I saw hop out and fill a tank from one
of these trucks chain smoked during the entire fill. _?!!!_

~~~
refurb
I was thinking the same thing. You see a lot of construction vehicles driving
around with large tanks in the back of the pick-up. I wonder what
certification they require?

That said, gasoline is a LOT more flammable than fuel oil or diesel. The later
two burn, while gasoline vapors almost explode when ignited.

------
jedmeyers
That's kind of similar to how airplanes are getting filled up at KPAO. Fueling
truck comes by, doesn't see a white mark on the right tire - refuels to the
max. In the end it saves a lot of time, because you don't have to worry about
filling it up.

~~~
mikeash
That's pretty weird, since the importance of weight makes it common not to
fill airplanes to the top.

~~~
jedmeyers
I guess that's mostly consistent with the rental plane use case, since they
usually fly with only one or two people on board several times a day.

------
naveen99
I like it. Gas stations can be unsafe places in some cities. Not to mention
the pain of having to get out of your car in -20 degree weather in other
places. Also air sensors are frequently inaccurate at many gas station air
pumps.

------
fsaneq2
It's funny seeing all these people vehemently defend their $15/mo. In the bay
area, where this launched, that's like what, two beers at a bar?

I don't get the money argument at all. Negotiate yourself a $15/month raise,
if you feel that bad about it. And yes, no shit, in some places in the world
(like back home for me) this won't make sense -- so what?

The one thing I'd want to have is some kind of ceiling on the gas price. I
checked this morning and the prices seemed quite good, but what guarantee do I
have that they won't randomly jack up the price when I'm not looking?

------
chucksmash
If you aren't marking up the gas then the operating costs and profits must
(eventually) come from the $15/mo, correct?

So does this work similarly to the gym business model (i.e. over-subscribe the
service with the assumption that some portion of subscribers won't use it very
often and will subsidize the heavy users)? The requirement to plan ahead
instead of offering on-demand delivery seems like it might encourage that
dynamic ("Crap, I'm nearly out of gas and forgot to put in my Yoshi order.
I'll just fill it myself this time").

------
tjsnyder
The safety issues of this seem far too high to ignore.

What happens the first time something catches on fire? Will they fill up
inside of a parking garage? What about a home garage?

How do leaks get handled, small and large?

~~~
nick007
Safety is our #1 priority. Our trucks and all of our components have been
inspected and approved by several industry experts and authorities.

There are a lot of details here, but the "tldr" is that transporting gasoline
and refueling cars requires caution, but it's a solved problem.

~~~
tjsnyder
I'm curious about the steps taken actually. Are you approved in the State of
California by the state board as a fuel delivery/transportation company? Do
you intend to go to court if not?

[http://law.justia.com/codes/california/2015/code-
hsc/divisio...](http://law.justia.com/codes/california/2015/code-
hsc/division-26/part-5/chapter-1.5/section-43026/)

------
elmar
I am seeing a bigger picture here, on-demand services for your car, mechanical
repairs, washing etc the gas is only to get the ball rolling.

Yoshi is a really cool name :)

~~~
joelg236
Also relevant [0]

0: [https://www.yourmechanic.com/](https://www.yourmechanic.com/)

~~~
elmar
it's a several trillion market, loots of room for "me too plus some
functionality extra" companies, or simply a better product than competition.

------
tdaltonc
I have automatic in my car, and it can read my gas gage. Could I just loop it
in on this process and never have to think about gas again?

~~~
nick007
We don't have an API yet that something like automatic can report your gas
gauge to. Though it's something we're thinking about.

However, the way that the service works now, it wouldn't save you anything in
the average case. We come by and fill your car up regularly (usually once or
twice a week) without you having to "order" when you need it. Unless you take
a long trip and need a fill-up off-cycle, you shouldn't need to ever use the
app to call for gas once you are setup.

~~~
ars
Do you tune the frequency (i.e. lower it) based on prior usage?

~~~
nick007
Yes we do. Our median member is on a weekly frequency, but we have people
getting filled-up more and less frequently than that depending on their need.

------
avree
These guys should talk to startups like Turo and Getaround. Will be a huge
help to the peer-to-peer carsharing companies.

------
ipsin
The reason this seems crazy to me is that a fixed appointment time is _way_
harder for me to meet (even though I keep a calendar). I'd rather just
schedule my own time.

If I could give the service a key to the car (and trust them to figure out
when I needed service), it might be worth doing, but I am not a dedicated car
commuter.

------
maitrik
We are working on a similar idea in Texas area. You can check us out at
[http://www.fyuldelivery.com](http://www.fyuldelivery.com)

We are still in the beta stage though and learning a lot from customers.

As someone mentioned, fuel is just the gateway to get into car servicing
market.

------
doublerebel
There are already self-driving cars and robotic gas pumps [1], how long before
this service runs itself?

[1] [http://www.popsci.com/article/cars/robotic-gas-pumps-are-
com...](http://www.popsci.com/article/cars/robotic-gas-pumps-are-coming-soon)

------
ryandrake
I'm curious about how the customer knows they are getting the grade of
gasoline that they paid for. The stuff that comes directly out of the pump is
periodically measured by regulators. What assurance does the Yoshi customer
get that they are not getting 87 after paying for 91?

~~~
xyience
How do you know the stuff at the gas station is actually 91 and not 87, how do
you know the regulators do their jobs properly and aren't bought out by Big
Oil?

The answer to all questions is that random private individuals or groups do
the tests. If it's a big enough concern among their customers, some of them
will do it. Some customers at regular gas stations already do these tests on
their own because not all gas stations are the same. (A few people even make
their own gas.)

------
skynetv2
solution in search of a problem? Gas stations are not sparse, there is one on
every corner.

~~~
gberger
Or is there?

[http://www.wnyc.org/story/say-goodbye-manhattans-gas-
station...](http://www.wnyc.org/story/say-goodbye-manhattans-gas-stations-
heres-map/)

~~~
mjmahone17
Not sure I want a gas truck driving into parking structures in the middle of
Manhattan to top-up private cars. That seems like a serious health and safety
hazard. And there really is no excuse for Manhattan needing to have numerous
gas stations: the island is small and accessible to vehicles from other
boroughs. Plus Manhattan has more than a gas station per square mile, which is
more than most suburbs I know of.

------
walrus01
How are you supposed to do gasoline delivery without keys to the vehicle, when
the driver is absent, if nearly every car sold these days has a fuel cap door
that can only be opened from a button inside the vehicle?

------
bernardom
Have you guys thought about partnering with metromile? Then you'd know where
my car is and its current fuel level.

------
hiou
_> You could imagine what could happen if a fueling truck went into a parking
garage under a commercial or residential building, it would not be a good
outcome._[0]

[0] [http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-05-02/gas-
delive...](http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-05-02/gas-delivery-
startups-want-to-fill-up-your-car-anywhere-is-that-allowed)

------
jsprogrammer
What are the carbon costs of this service? Is less carbon burned into the
atmosphere because of this service? Or, more?

Is there a public analysis that we can view?

Edit: Really? Buried to the bottom for environmental concern questions? Is
this another case of YCombinator being unable to adequately respond to
critical questions?

~~~
rdl
Probably close to neutral; maybe better, if their truck is diesel, and it
keeps people from driving out of their way to find the cheapest gas in stop
and go traffic.

It's a pretty insignificant concern, though, relative to the positives (time
savings, convenience) and negatives (safety).

~~~
jsprogrammer
I don't see how hauling the gasoline to vehicles could possibly be better
unless the tanker was acting as a mobile, stationary (until the tank is
emptied) station _and_ came directly from the same place current tankers do
(no intermediate storage). In such a scenario, it's possible that there might
be a slight improvement. However, from what I can tell this service seems to
go wherever someone has parked; meaning lots of traveling and one-off trips
for the tankers.

>It's a pretty insignificant concern, though, relative to the positives (time
savings, convenience) and negatives (safety).

It seems pretty convenient that the only beneficiary is the person responsible
for the negatives (which we will all suffer from).

------
drewm1980
Starting a company to make gasoline powered cars MORE convenient is absolutely
unethical. Any engineers working on this project should be ashamed for using
their skills to make the world a worse place.

~~~
dgobaud
Hi I'm one of the founders. Many people think this upon hearing about the
service but the logic is flawed because:

A) It does not consider that we are building more cost effective alternative
fuel delivery infrastructure that can help accelerate the adoption of
alternative fuel vehicles other than electric such as the Toyota Mirai and
Honda FCX Clarity.

B) Does not consider that efficient gasoline delivery can reduce carbon
emissions and the number of polluting underground gas station tanks.

~~~
jsprogrammer
>B) Does not consider that efficient gasoline delivery can reduce carbon
emissions and the number of polluting underground gas station tanks.

Can you please share your analysis of how much your company reduces carbon
emissions?

------
HamSession
This is a rolling lawsuit waiting to happen. Those that invested must really
be hungry for something unique.

------
princetontiger
This is like the late 90s. Startup bubble. The world is moving to EVs. Not
sure how this is a tech startup?

~~~
CamperBob2
I think a dozen people have made this comment so far, and I don't get it at
all. Is there some reason why the refueling services can't drive around with a
truck full of batteries, instead of a truck full of gas?

~~~
joelg236
I'm assuming the argument is that at home, you'd just recharge from your
house's power. So the use case is diminished in that sense.

------
Alupis
> The company has engineered its own gas delivery trucks with a proprietary
> system, called the Fuel Vault, which allows Yoshi to access any car’s tank,
> even if the gas flap is locked

I'd like to know what a glamorized fuel cell has to do with somehow
circumventing the lock on many gas caps.

I imagine it's some sort of tool that somehow defeats the locks on such gas
caps and flaps, which poses interesting questions about legality (as they
acknowledge in the post). I certainly would not signup for a service that
risks breaking or damaging my vehicle, nor am I about to hand over keys to my
vehicle either.

How large of a market is there for this really? Frankly, is this a problem
really needing solving? This company must charge a premium for the service,
which makes your fillups cost more than if you just spent the 2 minutes it
takes to pump your own gas.

~~~
teuobk
This is just a guess, but perhaps it's a very strong magnet?

Many gas flap locks seem to be simple solenoids, and it's often relatively
simple to change the state of a solenoid using a powerful magnet. Certain low-
end electronic-lock safes are susceptible to similar attacks (that's part of
the reason why better electronic-lock safes use motor-driven bolts instead of
solenoids).

~~~
Alupis
My car (a 2015 Ford Focus) has an actual metal tooth + clamp style lock (like
a seat-belt kind of). Without putting something into the lock that prevents it
from catching, I don't see how they can unlock my gas flap without somehow
allowing other's to unlock it as well.

