
Large collection of Nazi artifacts discovered in Argentina (2017) - foxh0und
http://www.dw.com/en/large-collection-of-nazi-artifacts-discovered-in-argentina/a-39321775
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dang
The users unable to contain themselves without launching into Nazi-swastika-
flamewar make it impossible for HN to discuss this at all.

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rdiddly
Like George Carlin said, "Symbols are for the symbol-minded."

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TomMckenny
The injustice aside, I wonder if Nazis fleeing German might have had the side
effect of making German reconstruction easier while limiting those who fled
into making chocolate in Bariloche under fake names.

But on the other hand there was Klaus Barbie.

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IAmEveryone
That's unlikely...

Those who fled probably did so for a reason, namely the fear of serious
prosecution. They would have had a rather difficult time to continue exerting
any influence after '45\. It may have had an influence in reducing the number
of trials and possibly resentment in the German population, but from what I
gather there wasn't ever a risk of widespread open disagreement with the
Nuremberg trials etc.

In a certain way, the most significant effect on reconstruction (and de-
nazification) may have been their use as a reservoir for prosecutions in later
years. The Eichmann trial, for example, had a lasting positive influence for
German-Israeli relations, provided us with one of the most meticulously
researched accounts of the bureaucrats' guilt, and an excellent treatise on
responsibility. In Hannah Arendt's seminal work "The Banality of Evil" it
changed the narrative from "Some Germans were evil" to today's "it happened
once, so it can happen again".

The dark truth of de-nazification was that large parts of the German upper-
middle class almost seamlessly continued their careers after the war. There
were simply too many to prosecute them all, or even to shut them out of
leadership positions. The rise of the cold war also changed the incentives for
the western powers to quickly rebuild the country's economic and political
strength. A few hundred or thousands in Argentina simply didn't matter in the
grand scale of things.

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gressquel
is it weird to find them fascinating? I am a millenial and WW2 and its horror
is something that I have learnt, but to meet survivors (of holocaust) and
surviving items is very exciting.

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ralusek
It's weird to read "The haul provides more evidence of the presence of high-
ranking Nazis in South America." I thought this was well-known?

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geuis
These are historical artifacts now, right? Is it illegal in Argentina to own
things like that? I can see the reasoning if so, just curious.

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kshmir
It is indeed!

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dopamean
Which part is illegal? The historic artifact bit or the Nazi bit? It seems
weird to have so many resources dedicated to tracking down someone collecting
hour glasses and statues.

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blatherard
(2017)

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dang
Thanks. Added.

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tcbawo
Is there anything sadder or creepier than an hourglass with a swastika on it?
What a horrible time for humanity.

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wallace_f
Although I don't believe this is worse than the injustices of generations
past, it's certainly sad to witness politics in 2018 contain a plethora of
virtue signalling, charades, and ineffectual action. We support the killings
of innocents with our military industrial complex, and our media tells us its
necessary because otherwise we will lose jobs[1]. Where is the investigation
of 500 million missing dollars of charitable relief to Haiti[2]? Not to
mention, where is the media coverage of the CLOUD act, and why did congress
underhandedly sneak a law that harms Americans rights into a "must pass"
omnibus spending bill without[3]? The war on drugs and prison state? Or any of
the homeless crises? Unjust and corrupt healthcare and public health? Cities
with murder rates higher than anywhere in Africa or the Middle East? Surging
suicide rates[4]? And we are just scratching the surface here, and when you
get to the bottom there are things you can't even talk about, like human
rights for Palestinians[5]

Tyranny, injustice and oppression were not simply eliminated at the end of
WWII. And living today to witness the convenient virtue signalling about a
historical artifact of a long-defeated tyrant, juxtaposed with the willingness
to tolerate current injustice, is really sad.

But isn't that what made Nazi Germany possible? Our willingness to tolerate
injustice, so long as it doesn't happen to us? Our desire to follow authority
--to serve in the court of despots? That is the irony here, which calls to
light the real meaning of this kind of virtue signalling: If we lived under
the reign of any of those _other_ tyrants, in Imperial Japan, Nazi Germany, or
wherever, _would we all suddenly be among activists, not just mere virtue
signallers championing the virtues of our leaders?_

I don't mean to come down hard on you personally; I just personally wish to
see the conversation move away from moral grandstanding to moral
responsibility.

1 - [https://theintercept.com/2016/09/09/wolf-blitzer-is-
worried-...](https://theintercept.com/2016/09/09/wolf-blitzer-is-worried-
defense-contractors-will-lose-jobs-if-u-s-stops-arming-saudi-arabia/)

2 - [https://www.npr.org/2015/06/03/411524156/in-search-of-the-
re...](https://www.npr.org/2015/06/03/411524156/in-search-of-the-red-
cross-500-million-in-haiti-relief)

3 - [https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2018/03/responsibility-
deflect...](https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2018/03/responsibility-deflected-
cloud-act-passes)

4 - [https://mobile.nytimes.com/2016/04/22/health/us-suicide-
rate...](https://mobile.nytimes.com/2016/04/22/health/us-suicide-rate-surges-
to-a-30-year-high.html)

5 - [https://theintercept.com/2018/04/02/israel-killing-
palestine...](https://theintercept.com/2018/04/02/israel-killing-palestine-
civilian-liberal-humanitarian/)

