

YC applications open for summer 2010; note earlier deadline - pg
http://ycombinator.posterous.com/applications-open-for-summer-2010-note-earlie

======
daeken
PG: Would you consider funding a startup aiming to take on a massive but
completely monopolized market, e.g. desktop OSes? Being one of the developers
on a completely new OS, I frequently wonder about how it could be
commercialized and pitted against the likes of MS, and it seems that it would
be effectively untouchable from a funding perspective, with the way things are
now.

I know investors like risk, but it seems like the chances of success are such
that 99% of the time, you're going to be throwing your money way. Any insight
here?

~~~
billclerico
that's sort of a vague question. some of history's biggest monopolies have
been the most vulnerable to disruption (telecom, anyone?).

i don't want to speak for PG, but I think when YC considers applications they
weigh risk against potential return. m$ certainly has demonstrated there is a
tremendous market for desktop software (though with the onset of cloud
computing, perhaps it is becoming obsolete).

~~~
daeken
I perhaps made it a bit too vague in an effort to make it applicable outside
my specific case (I work on a pure-managed OS focused on desktop/mobile
applications). Even though I fully believe in the project, the chances of it
ever becoming the Next Big OS (TM) are slim to nil, so I'm curious if any sane
investor would touch it. Obviously there's a profit to be made with it in
certain niches, but I don't know if that would be big enough for anyone to
fund it.

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chrischen
I really hope there is significantly more engagement this time. I'm not real
good at explaining things the first time so a question-response type situation
would give me a good chance to properly explain my self a one-time application
wouldn't.

I do have a question for Paul Graham though: should I assume you guys know
nothing about previous applications?

~~~
pg
That's a good assumption, though we sometimes look at previous applications.

------
alanthonyc
PG's point about the size of the YC founders pool makes me curious what the
effects of hitting some kind of Dunbar number will be.

~~~
pg
I wonder about that too, but we may not hit a limit. I think limits like
Dunbar's number are consequences of hierarchical structure, and the YC founder
network is completely distributed.

~~~
Alex3917
Dunbar's number generally applies to communities that are organized around
content or ideology.

So for example, a web forum gets too large for everyone to agree on what's on
topic or off topic, so it splits in two. Or a democratically run government
can't agree on whether the society should be gemeinschaft or gezellschaft.

The YC network is more like a dating site than a polis, so while there may be
some limiting factor I don't think it would be Dunbar's number.

~~~
alanthonyc
_The YC network is more like a dating site than a polis_

Is this true? I may have a utopian view of things, but my impression is that
of a community that helps each other out in order to make this new model of
work succeed.

If my impression is accurate, then I can see how the society could change or
break down once it gets past a certain size. Cliques, subgroups, etc. could
form.

I see this support group structure as one of the main reasons to apply to YC.
The money would be useful, but the support would be invaluable.

~~~
Alex3917
"My impression is that of a community that helps each other out in order to
make this new model of work succeed."

In YC when you have a problem you generally find another startup who can help
and then pair off with them to work alone, like on a dating site.

Alternatively, there other seed programs where all the startups sit around a
big table and talk about each person's problems one at time. This is more like
a polis, because different discussions create value for different people.

The latter exposes you to more new ideas, but it also wastes enormous amounts
of time. (And a lot of these new ideas don't end up sticking because you
haven't already tried yourself and failed first.) I think the YC model
probably maximizes your chances of success after three months, but only if you
already have a pretty good chance of succeeding. If you still have a bunch of
missing skills you need to fill in, then looking into non-YC options might
make more sense.

~~~
alanthonyc
I see. Thanks for the feedback, it's nice to know a little bit more about it.

------
arfrank
The apply link in the footer below is now dead as it links to the w2010.html
page. Should be s2010.html

Also clickable link to the apply page at: <http://ycombinator.com/s2010.html>

------
follower
Should "It will take place in Mountain View, CA from July through August 2010"
actually say "June" rather than "July" given point #4?

~~~
pg
Fixed, thanks.

------
bretpiatt
I like the effort to move the date and sync up with the other programs out
there. It really feels like everyone should get together like the colleges
have with application deadlines and acceptance notification back to
applicants.

~~~
pg
We're hoping this move will cause that to happen de facto. The fact that YC
etc have cycles with similar, fixed dates makes it structurally like college
applications, so customs should be similar. It is much worse to use exploding
termsheets in that context than in something asynchronous like VC series A
rounds.

~~~
araneae
Unless something like early admission happens...

It's advantageous to be early in the cycle, so you could have a continual
creep up of deadlines, and continual asynchrony.

~~~
pg
In fact one of them already has something they call early admissions. I can't
imagine why any startup would think it was to their advantage to limit their
options that way, though, so as far as I can tell it is just a negative IQ
test and thus nothing to worry about.

~~~
rms
It probably makes sense for those founders living in that specific geographic
area that can't move for whatever reasons.

------
paraschopra
Hi PG, I really want to apply to YC this time. I browsed through the
application but I am not sure if you will consider my case for the
application: single founder and based out of India?

~~~
ewjordan
From <http://ycombinator.com/faq.html>:

Can a single person apply for funding?

Yes, but the odds of being accepted are much lower. A startup is too much work
for one person.

Do we have to be US citizens?

No, as long as you can get here for at least three months. We've funded many
startups founded by non-citizens.

Can you get us visas?

No, sorry, we don't do that. You'll have to figure out visas for yourself. If
you know people from previous YC-funded companies who came from outside the
US, we suggest you ask them for advice. They understand the options better
than we do.

~~~
levesque
So basically what one can do is apply, then if accepted arrange the details
for coming during the said three months in the US?

------
discolemonade
It would be interesting to see stats on the composition of groups that YC has
funded since inception; ie, percentage of all programmer groups vs
programmer/biz guy vs all biz guys, etc. Any insights PG?

~~~
pg
I would say about half the groups have one or more non-programmers. I remember
2 that had no programmers, though I may be forgetting some.

The optimal configuration is one or two programmers plus one person who can
sell really well. Best of all is when the person who can sell is also a
programmer.

~~~
discolemonade
Just out of curiosity, how did those groups with non-programmers develop their
product? Did they go out and find programmers? What did they spend most of
their time doing?

~~~
pg
One group found programmers, the other (in the current cycle) is doing
something that doesn't require significant amounts of hacking, at least at
this stage.

------
hypermatt
"submit successive drafts of your application as you modify it"

My favorite quote, I like that. I've never been a big fan of college
applications in one shot.

------
danielzarick
PG- Will there be RFS ideas again? I'm not necessarily looking for ideas, but
it is always interesting to see what you and the crew are thinking about.

~~~
gridspy
Yes, there are a few interesting RFS ideas from 16 August 2009 :
<http://ycombinator.com/rfs.html>

------
pmjordan
Engaging with applicants before the deadline seems like a great move. From the
stories from previous YCers it sounds like this sometimes happened already,
but it's good to have it spelled out.

Oh, by the way Paul: the "Apply" link in the footer is still the W2010 one,
which now 404s. It shouldn't stop anyone serious about applying, but... :)

------
dzlobin
PG, Just how much of a minus would it be that both founders would have to
return to college in the fall? Given they can reasonably continue to work in
school.

------
lloydarmbrust
I can't imagine how the YC partners have time to make this happen, but then
again, I'm not sure how they fulfill their current responsibilities.

------
samd
"Are any of the following true? ... (e) None of the founders are programmers."

Isn't that basically automatic disqualification?

~~~
pg
No; we've funded a couple groups that didn't have any programmers.

~~~
samd
That's interesting and surprising. What did those groups do; go out and hire a
programmer, find a technical co-founder after getting funding, or did they
outsource what they needed?

~~~
pg
<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1077170>

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kuvkir
Just out of curiosity – is there any list of YC participants of past years?

~~~
chrischen
<http://ycombinator.com/faq.html> There's a list. I'm not sure if it's
comprehensive. I know there's another list somewhere out there that also
details the status of the companies. Can't seem to find it right now.

~~~
ig1
[http://blog.awesomezombie.com/2009/12/analyzing-y-
combinator...](http://blog.awesomezombie.com/2009/12/analyzing-y-
combinator.html)

------
DanielBMarkham
Woohoo! I think I actually think I might be in a good spot to apply this time
around.

------
gkoberger
Good luck, everyone! :)

------
benologist
Fantastic news and timing. :)

