
Red Hat, Jetbrains and Unity Join Dotnet Foundation - oblio
http://www.dotnetfoundation.org/blog/tsg-welcome
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oneweekwonder
I'm uninformed on this topic, but with all the movement in the .net community.
How will it play out for Oracle and Java?

This is pure speculation I know, but would be interesting to read some
opinions from people that is more informed. Any links or comments would be
appreciated.

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pjmlp
I have a foot in both communities.

Around 10 years ago, developing Java enterprise desktop applications was a mix
of pure Swing, SWT, Eclipse RCP and Netbeans Platform.

Nowadays, just speaking from our customer projects, it is .NET for Windows
only applications and Web for everything else.

The only place where Java based UIs still matters are on Android.

And on mobile OS, thanks to Oracle not caring about iOS and Windows Phone, C++
and C# are the languages to go for portable native apps. With Xamarin being
made available for free, this will increase C# (including F#) usage for such
applications.

Currently .NET Core lacks a story for portable UI framework, but if it gets
one, it might win some adoption outside Windows for desktop apps, at least
more than Java, as JavaFX doesn't seem to be wining much mind-share.

Another advantage of .NET Core is that Microsoft is having AOT compilation for
free, while on Java world the best AOT compilers are commercial.

However for server side UNIX applications, mainframes and embedded devices,
there Java might still rule, specially thanks to the existing developer base.

Also pure speculation from my part.

~~~
javajosh
Well all this has been true for 10 years. There is still a little life in Java
desktop GUIs because all the Java IDEs are written in Java (Netbeans and
IntelliJ on Swing and Eclipse on SWT), but no one wants line-of-business
software that is thick client, and they haven't since they realized they could
reduce administration costs, and lose little functionality. (The exception in
my experience being JPL which does some SWT work).

The two interesting things that _actually_ compete with Java (JVM) would be
LLVM and WebAssembly (or asm.js if you prefer).

On another front there is the thing that is competing with a big chunk of the
SmallTalk OOP GUIs, a little thing called React. And actually Redux (or
something like it) may turn out to be even more influential.

My take is that the functional dynamic DOM environment of the browser complete
with run-time remote linking and compiling is like the harsh environment of
Arrakis, which was the only thing that could have given rise to such hardy
technology.

P.S. I really have to wonder how much a combination of `System.out.println`
and `public static void main(String[] args)` cost the Java ecosystem. Not to
mention the Date and File 'idioms'. Having nice collections and solid vm spec
and implementation doesn't mean you get to ignore API usability. Sigh.

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supercheetah
Honest question, how many .NET developers actually write stuff for Linux on
the server side? How many have a significant user base?

I know there are a few desktop Linux apps (e.g. Tomboy, and Banshee), but I
haven't seen many used in a daemon or as an Apache mod or the like.

~~~
traskjd
We ([https://raygun.com](https://raygun.com)) use a lot of .NET on the server
side. We also use golang, node and a few other things, but a lot of .NET,
specifically with C#.

We're very excited about being able to run on Linux. There's plenty of our
back end worker processes that are in C# and being able to move them to Linux
will be a big win for us (manageability, cost, etc).

I'm not sure what you consider a significant user base, but we do have 40k+
devs on our platform, and we process billions of interactions and software
exceptions every month from many of the top 100 web sites and apps globally.

~~~
JBReefer
After looking at your site, you guys should definitely open a New York office.

~~~
traskjd
Thanks :-) I've just relocated to Seattle to open a second west coast office.
East coast or Dublin is next!

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TheLogothete
I would have loved it better if MS chose Cent over Ubuntu.

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psibi
The post doesn't refer to Ubuntu's unity but the game engine Unity.

~~~
TheLogothete
You don't say!

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_pmf_
Jetbrains will be acquired by either Microsoft or Google; I think it's a
matter of weeks rather than months.

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andor
Why do you think so? Microsoft has good developer tools of their own, Google
is already building Android Studio on the IntelliJ platform without owning the
company. Making IDE's is neither company's core business. I'm sure Jetbrains
is a healthy business, but for Google or MS it's peanuts. I don't see the
benefit of them owning Jetbrains, whereas on the contrary it would be good for
Jetbrains to stay neutral.

~~~
quicklyfrozen
Resharper and Jetbrain's other .net tools may be enough of a reason, would be
a nice add to VS. Also, MS is clearly showing an interest in Linux ATM and I
doubt VS is going cross platform anytime soon, and they know the value of good
developer tools.

