
Ask HN: What is the best “dumb” phone? - goldemerald
Due to privacy and time management concerns, I have decided to take the jump and get rid of my smart phone. Unsurprisingly, there are very few of resources online about which dumb phones are the best. Those of you who use a non-smart phones, which model is it and how do you like it?
======
perlgod
You will be in a tough spot if you're in the USA. All the nice Nokias and
decent low-tech phones are rapidly becoming useless as carriers phase out 2g
(and even 3g) coverage to free up bands for LTE and now 5g.

If your "dumbphone" doesn't support VoLTE you'll be frustrated with dropped
calls and spotty service everywhere. I know this from experience.

I settled on T-Mobile's only "dumbphone" \- the Alcatel GoFlip [1]. It
supports LTE, the battery lasts for days and it even has a rudimentary IMAP
and CalDAV client.

I tried turning my smartphone into a "dumbphone" and using it less, but I
honestly lacked the self-control to put the stupid thing down. Having a kid
made me realize how many moments I was pissing away just scrolling.

These things are designed to be addictive, and some people (like myself) can't
compete with the entire teams of "engagement engineers" many tech companies
employ to exploit your dopamine-reward cycles.

I had forgotten what it was like to be alone with my thoughts. I feel as
though I am rediscovering a part of my brain that was suppressed by having a
boredom-prevention device at my fingertips all these years. Also other humans
now look like phone-zombies everywhere I look. It's kind of dystopian
honestly.

[1] [https://us.alcatelmobile.com/alcatel-go-
flip/](https://us.alcatelmobile.com/alcatel-go-flip/)

~~~
crazynick4
> I tried turning my smartphone into a "dumbphone" and using it less, but I
> honestly lacked the self-control to put the stupid thing down

Did you remove the browsers and app store as well? I got rid of everything
except for phone/texting, Slack (for work), and non-bingy convenience apps
like Maps/Yelp/etc. On Android, it can be done with the adb shell without
rooting, even the 'uninstallable' apps like Google search and the Samsung
browser. Not sure about Apple.

I tried this before without getting rid of the Play Store and found that I
would just cheat and download FF Focus when I felt like binging and then
deleting it again when I was done. Now if I think I need a new app, I actually
have to go on my laptop, download the apk, and move it to my phone to install
it. It's not foolproof but it's enough extra steps to where I don't act on it
on impulse.

It's worked really well and I don't binge like I used to . I still have some
compulsive phone-checking habits but it's way less time consuming than
compulsive-random-article-reading/scrolling. And I also get to keep the nicer
benefits like the good camera and the large screen for when I need a GPS.

~~~
paulcarroty
> Did you remove the browsers and app store as well?

It's possible with adb or root, but buy a $500-$800 device for removing basic
apps? Failed logic IMHO.

> Not sure about Apple.

You can't.

~~~
Double_a_92
You can get a decent smartphone for under 200$.

------
kpmcc
Nothing compares to the Punkt MP01 and MP02 IMO. I've had the MP01 for years
and it's fantastic, the only issue has been with service and I imagine that
would be resolved with the MP02 and 4g.
[https://www.punkt.ch/en/products/mp02-4g-mobile-
phone/](https://www.punkt.ch/en/products/mp02-4g-mobile-phone/)

There's also the Lightphone and forthcoming Lightphone II.

That being said, these won't really address privacy concerns per se. They
don't support signal or other encrypted messaging (the lightphone II may in
the future???). So the only way they would be more 'private' would be due to
the fact that you'll use your phone for less and in so doing, share less data.
Your texts and calls will still be pretty visible if that's a concern.

~~~
rinchik
And it runs Android. What a bummer. Otherwise this phone looks perfect

~~~
davzie
Check this thread out that explains Google really has no control over the
device:
[https://twitter.com/punkt/status/1103276818340212737](https://twitter.com/punkt/status/1103276818340212737)

~~~
ixxivvix
Just an aside, but that’s a concerningly long thread. Responses like these are
kind of important enough that they shouldn’t be easily lost or hardly seen
(especially since it’s a reply to someone). Case in point: the way I found
this thread since you linked to it, but I could be wrong and it might’ve been
said somewhere in their website

------
MichaelMoser123
Ultraorthodox Jews buy dumbphones only because of religious considerations.
These are known as Kosher phones. Here is a shop that sells them
[https://www.zipy.co.il/s/אליאקספרס/-/-/טלפון/?aspect=:::2000...](https://www.zipy.co.il/s/אליאקספרס/-/-/טלפון/?aspect=:::200000563:200000563_200005437:Not+Touch+Screen/&gclid=Cj0KCQjwg73kBRDVARIsAF-
kEH-
CCwlrFTBvvW3jpvwk6FdC3WAj0RfzSwDxjKpQ9EXAb6-1IqKNYpYaAqteEALw_wcB#coil&data1=PhoneHe&data2=HE_PHO)

~~~
mac01021
What exactly is the nature of those religious considerations?

Is it just that you can use a dumb phone on friday night without violating the
sabbath (can you?)?

Is there a religious doctrine that explicitly prohibits general purpose
computing devices in the home?

~~~
dijit
Phones stripped of anything that could be corrupting. Browsers, etc;

More information here: [https://www.quora.com/What-are-Kosher-cell-
phones](https://www.quora.com/What-are-Kosher-cell-phones)

------
subway
Dumbphones effectively no longer exist.

Anything with LTE (aside from iDevices) seems to run a Linux kernel with a
stripped down Android or FirefoxOS on top. They have simplified UIs if that's
what you're looking for, but they also have security holes out the wazoo (you
can frequently get a root adb shell via usb with a stock config), and will
never see updates.

To top that off, the available "dumb" phones with LTE often don't support US
LTE bands. ( _glares at useless nokis 8810 4g_ )

You might get away with a pre-LTE device that's a legit dumbphone, but those
networks are rapidly dying. :-(

~~~
dontbenebby
> _Dumbphones effectively no longer exist. Anything with LTE (aside from
> iDevices) seems to run a Linux kernel with a stripped down Android or
> FirefoxOS on top. They have simplified UIs if that 's what you're looking
> for, but they also have security holes out the wazoo (you can frequently get
> a root adb shell via usb with a stock config), and will never see updates._

This has been a concern of mine, and why instead I've moved to simply turning
off my wifi and cell service when not using them.

I installed "HereWeGO", a GPS app with great support for offline maps. Between
that, podcasts, and music I can go quite long without using any data.

(Or as a middle ground I drop down to wifi with DND on, and check for incoming
messages every once in a while)

~~~
bpye
Check out OsmAnd. It uses OpenStreetMaps data and all the map data is stored
offline. OSM has great footpaths in my experience and it does turn by turn
navigation and all that fun stuff to.

~~~
dontbenebby
Thanks for the suggestion, I like that it's open source.

------
miki123211
IMO a dumb phone is usually not what you want, unless you care about battery
life that much. Most dumb phones are worse for privacy than a properly
configured iDevice without location services and all those other gimmicks you
don't probably want. They're not encrypted, easier to hack after being stolen
and you're forced into normal calls and sms messages which are notoriously
insecure. You'd be better off with an iPhone and iMessage/Signal or even
Matrix on your own home server if you care that much. That setup gives you
much, much more privacy than anything else could.

------
ddebernardy
Consider taking this a step further and trying no phone at all. But instead of
doing something extreme like dumping your smartphone, just turn your current
phone off unless you're OK with being reached and at home or at work. Anything
in between, the phone stays off.

This makes your smartphone a de facto land line for all practical intents, and
you get to keep the potential to make exceptions and use it for e.g. GPS and
maps or a restaurant lookup when you need to.

~~~
pmoriarty
Another possibility to consider is carrying a pager. That way you'll at least
know when you've got a call or a voice mail, and then you can turn your phone
on temporarily to call back or check your voice mail, instead of having to
periodically turn on your phone to check for missed calls.

~~~
hutzlibu
Then you can also just go into Airplane mode. But that takes discipline.

Much more liberating is, to have a smartphone where you can put out the
batterie ... then it is off. And since putting it back together takes time,
the temptation to just check something is way less.

~~~
dontbenebby
I just wish there was a better middle ground. iOS's DND is great in letting me
whitelist contacts who can punch through, but that only applies to calls and
texts, not signal :/

------
stuntkite
I have been buying dumb phones from china for a few months (mostly using ebay
and banggood.com) and since most cost between $15-$35, I've bought six and
plan to buy a few more. I might throw up a Medium blog reviewing them because
they are hilarious and sometimes really innovative.

My favorites have been:

\- Fidget Spinner Phone [0] | It's a fidget spinner and basically a classic
Nokia clone with video, mp3, and bluetooth. It is comfy to carry in the
pocket, has dual SIMs and SD card storage. Also an FM radio (that doesn't use
hadphones as an antenna). The best part is that is has "HORSE RACE LIGHTS"
that run to the beat so you can fidget spin to the radio.

\- Super Tiny Phone [2] | Can be a bluetooth earpiece, is super tiny, and has
a voice changer option that is just hilarious. Call with autotune! Also it's
clearly made for crime, but I like to call my mom as a robot.

\- Pen Phone [3] | It's a pen!

[0] [https://www.banggood.com/Servo-S08-1-3-300mAh-Christmas-
Gift...](https://www.banggood.com/Servo-S08-1-3-300mAh-Christmas-Gift-
Bluetooth-Dual-SIM-Fidget-Spinner-Finger-Gyro-Reduce-Stress-
Phone-p-1216799.html)

[1] [https://www.banggood.com/V2-0_66-OLED-260mAh-Smallest-
Blueto...](https://www.banggood.com/V2-0_66-OLED-260mAh-Smallest-Bluetooth-
Dialer-BT-Music-Voice-Changer-Single-SIM-Mini-Card-Phone-p-1295837.html)

[2] [https://www.banggood.com/SERVO-K07-0_96inch-300mAh-
bluetooth...](https://www.banggood.com/SERVO-K07-0_96inch-300mAh-bluetooth-
Dialer-Recording-Pen-Handwriting-Pen-Flashlight-Camera-Dual-SIM-Mini-Card-
phone-p-1417825.html)

------
rakic
Punkt MP01 [https://www.punkt.ch/en/products/mp01-mobile-
phone/](https://www.punkt.ch/en/products/mp01-mobile-phone/)

Punkt MP02 [https://www.punkt.ch/en/products/mp02-4g-mobile-
phone/](https://www.punkt.ch/en/products/mp02-4g-mobile-phone/)

Light Phone [https://www.thelightphone.com](https://www.thelightphone.com)

Light Phone 2 [https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/light-
phone-2](https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/light-phone-2)

Nokia 3310
[https://www.nokia.com/phones/en_int/nokia-3310](https://www.nokia.com/phones/en_int/nokia-3310)

~~~
wyclif
I considered going retro and getting a Nokia 3310, but 2G only was the show
stopper.

~~~
tlburke
They have a 3G model, I'm using right now! They also have a 4G 8110
"Bananaphone" that runs KaiOS, a sort of 'inbetween' smart-and-dumb phone.

------
JohnFen
I was looking into this exact problem last year. I couldn't find a reasonable
solution, so I had to take extraordinary steps instead -- I'm building my own
phone.

There is literally no phone on the market (that I can find) that is acceptable
to me anymore.

~~~
Diederich
> I'm building my own phone.

Can you elaborate? This sounds pretty interesting.

~~~
JohnFen
It's essentially simple. What I have breadboarded and working right now is
based on a Raspberry Pi (although I won't be using the Pi in the end, as it's
too bulky -- I'll be using the functional equivalent on a board I'm
designing). I'm using a 4G module to provide the cell functionality (you
communicate with it much like with a modem) and a 4" LCD touch panel for the
display. It is running Linux as the OS, with some custom code for things like
the phone dialer, etc. It also has the other usual features like WiFi,
Bluetooth, etc.

It's really nothing more than a small Linux computer with a cell phone module
attached. That was one of my design goals -- I wanted a real OS rather than
something like Android. The only thing that I'm not entirely happy with at the
moment is power draw, but I can greatly reduce that with a bit more work.

~~~
borgel
Whose 4G modem did you go with?

~~~
JohnFen
I'm using a Quectel EC25-E 4G/LTE.

~~~
borgel
Interesting part! Looks like Mini PCI-E is the common formfactor, but some
come on a little USB dongle. Is that the version you're using?

Will it do voice/SMS? I haven't found any indicators either way.

~~~
JohnFen
I'm using the Mini PCI for development, but I really need something that is a
bit smaller for the final product. I haven't yet determined if this means that
I'll need to use a different chipset.

> Will it do voice/SMS?

Yes, it does.

~~~
borgel
Cool thanks! It's exciting to run into an inexpensive LTE modem that can come
in an easy to use package to use for stuff like this.

If you get to a point where you've learned some interesting things and
generated documentation/video/etc send me a note on Twitter (@ borgel). Might
make a good Hackaday writeup!

------
runjake
In my mind, the best "dumb" phone is something like the iPhone SE.

Aside from the issue of limited options, traditional dumb phones contain junk
like seriously insecure baseband processors, shadow SMS commands, carrier
bloatware that does god knows what, BREW, and J2ME. They're often slow and
cheaply-made.

If you're concerned about time management, then you have a few options:

\- Improve your self-discipline and impulse control, eliminate FOMO. This will
pay dividends in your life.

\- Uninstall any app you absolutely do not require. In the latest versions of
iOS you can uninstall many of the apps the device comes with.

\- Configure Screen Time(tm) and Downtime(tm) under Settings->Screen Time.

\- Configure Restrictions under the Settings app. Make them as draconian as
you want and set up a complicated passcode.

The problem isn't the phone, it's you.

~~~
chansiky
I use a "dumb" iphone SE as well, heavy screen time restrictions and very
limited apps. Its great because I get to keep Uber and Venmo and Maps so I
still have full functionality if I need it.

I disagree though when you say the problem isn't the phone and to improve
self-discipline. If you have a cocaine addiction, and bag of cocaine in your
pocket, the problem isn't your self-discipline. It's that you have a bag of
cocaine in your pocket.

------
nfoz
[https://puri.sm/products/librem-5/](https://puri.sm/products/librem-5/)

This might count as a dumb phone for your intended purposes, given how it
separates the baseband from the CPU and has killswitches.

~~~
rabidrat
Not yet released, unfortunately.

------
rinchik
Oh great question! I have tried asking almost the same thing here[1] with no
luck. 8 upvotes, 0 replies. Very curious to see if this thread will get any
traction.

Personally, I was eyeing Nokia 3310 (relaunched version)[2].

[1]
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15261955](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15261955)

[2]
[https://www.nokia.com/phones/en_int/nokia-3310](https://www.nokia.com/phones/en_int/nokia-3310)

~~~
fastbeef
I bought the 3G version. It was bad. Really bad. I think we've collectivley
forgot how much of a UI bump the iPhone was.

I ended up never using it because there wasn't any way of of getting my
contacts from my iPhone to it and I'm not spending several hours keying in my
contacts.

~~~
rinchik
UX/UI is not much of a concern for me, my personal usage intention is only for
occasional texts and calls (mostly for 2FA, personal projects). I was actually
looking for a "brick" of a phone.

------
frio
Not strictly a dumbphone, but KaiOS phones
([https://www.kaiostech.com/](https://www.kaiostech.com/)) are sort of smart-
ish. They're forked from FxOS, are easily hackable, are compatible with modern
telephony standards (so the death of 2G won't kill them), and come from
multiple suppliers.

They hit the "just enough" functionality for me: phone calls, access to smart-
ish messaging, a music player, and the ability to act as a hotspot for a more
dedicated device.

I haven't got one myself (there's a particular model I was waiting on 6 months
ago when I last sniffed around), but I intend to this year.

------
dddddaviddddd
I used a Motorola FONE for a few years. E-ink display, the most basic basics
(single-case text messages, twelve characters at a time). Pretty good battery
life, nice form factor.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motorola_Fone](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motorola_Fone)

~~~
abrowne
I did too! I loved the e-ink, but battery life was surprisingly bad
considering the premise. I still loved the simplicity and durability.

------
q845712
I have an antique samsung flip-phone from sometime in the 2006-08 years. My
carrier is T-mobile.

I had one that I used until it was really dying a couple years ago (growing
blob of dead pixels in the middle of the screen, declining battery life),
which I commented on during a visit home, to which my mom replied, "wait! i
have the exact same phone in a drawer somewhere" ... so now i'm still using
it, just, the one that she held onto for some reason.

The comments about dropped calls are true -- my phone has gotten progressively
worse at being a phone in the last couple years. I wasn't sure whether it was
hardware degradation or what, but I trust folks on this thread are more
knowledgeable than I am and are correct that it's due to networks being phased
out. To be honest I have no idea which 'G' my phone uses.

Pros: \- battery lasts for most of a week between charges \- is not
distracting at all \- I don't feel bad when I drop it \- the alarm-clock
feature works \- most people are very kind about giving me directions if i get
lost and ask them for help, after they hesitate and say "... can't you look it
up on your phone?"

Cons: \- not all text messages reach me \- I have to manually delete texts as
the phone only wants to store 30 texts at a time. \- some phone conversations
include redialing a few times \- I don't have a camera in my pocket \- I don't
have a GPS in my pocket \- My current employer had to buy me a cheap (no sim
card / no linked google account) smartphone anyhow for 2FA apps! \-
distraction is more of a general habit -- i still waste plenty of my own time
browsing the internet on a laptop.

------
paulcarroty
I bought Alcatel Go Flip for $25, works fine. If you need to read web from
2.8" display via 4G or Wifi one-two times per year, this is good choice.

~~~
mrweasel
That looks nice, to bad it's KaiOS... Well no, to bad Google had to go mess
with KaiOS. I'm really annoyed that Google Assistant got put into KaiOS.

~~~
paulcarroty
KaiOS 1.0 was released _before_ Google invested their money, no preinstalled
google software on this phone.

------
GorgeRonde
I own a YotaPhone 2 since a little more than a year now, and I am very
satisfied with it.

It's a dual screen from 2015 made in Russia: it has an e-ink screen on the
back that can display both dedicated widgets and the android OS, like the
normal screen.

The OS (Android 4 up to 6) has been adapted for the screen and special care
has been taken to make the system consume as few energy as possible if
configured so. Think of it as the phone you dumb down when you go on a week-
long trek in the Siberian Taiga.

I love it because of the extreme readability of the screen under full
sunlight. I don't need to find a shadow or make some with my hands in order to
select a song in a playlist, check my position on a map or reply to a text
while walking.

There are also some cool features, like mirroring the camera's view on the
back screen so that people who are photographed can have a preview of the
final result.

The phone can also flash your contact info on the e-ink screen before shutting
down (since it's e-ink, the image gets persisted even though the battery is
flat), just in case some good samaritan finds your phone.

And now that the YotaPhone 3 is out, you can find it for 150$.

------
isignal
Not a dumb phone, but I would recommend the Unihertz Atom[1]. It packs Android
into the same form factor as a flip phone. The advantage is that it supports
most carrier bands, including Verizon, and modern standards like VoLTE, Wifi
calling (dumb phones are generally carrier specific and rely on 2G/CDMA bands
for calling).

The great thing about this form factor is that browsing and extended typing
are very difficult, so you end up using your phone to get notified and for
utilities like navigation, music playing.

Privacy-wise it does not solve your concern because it runs Android and it
does not track the latest security updates as well as the Google branded
phones.

[1] [https://www.amazon.com/Unihertz-Smallest-Smartphone-
Android-...](https://www.amazon.com/Unihertz-Smallest-Smartphone-Android-
Unlocked/dp/B07KP8J8YN/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8#customerReviews)

------
syntaxing
I haven't used it but the "new" (remake) of the Nokia 8110 seems to fit your
requirements [1].

[1]
[https://www.engadget.com/2018/08/24/nokia-8110-4g/](https://www.engadget.com/2018/08/24/nokia-8110-4g/)

~~~
bwood
I've been using the new 8110 for nearly a year and it's exactly what I was
looking for. Battery lasts for about a week, no ridiculous restrictions on
texts or contact name length, and it can even create a wifi hotspot. It's the
perfect balance of smart and dumb, IMO.

------
spricket
If you care about privacy and have about $100 + 4 hours you can get a Galaxy
S5 running LineageOs without GApps (use F-Droid store) .

Almost completely OSS besides a few manufacturer blobs you can't really work
around.

I have a "normal" Android phone I use for work but my S5 is my daily driver
for everything else. Works great, hardest part is setting up stuff to replace
FAANG.

I use ProtonMail, Open Camera, Matrix/Riot for family chat.

Haven't found a good calendar yet but overall way more usable than a dumbphone
and privacy concious

There's some "nicer" options like One plus for LineageOs but you will probably
find the S5 fairly snappy since its based on Android 8.0 . IMO the last few
versions of Android make a much larger performance difference than a few CPU
generations

~~~
paulcarroty
LineageOS still use Google services for DNS and connectivity checks. I'd be
non surprised if this number will be much more. Also, every third-party app
can easily track you and steal data, check the news.

~~~
spricket
You may be right about connectivity checks although I thought they recently
removed Google from those.

Lineage has built on top of Android permission system to prevent most apps
from stealing data (Android location permission is probably the most
notorious). If you have a rooted device with lineage you can also run
XPeivacyLua which fakes out any data that apps "require" to install

------
tomxor
I've used a Nokia 208.1 for 5 years, it's not very big, it has not features
worth mentioning, it lasts for ages (usually at least 1 weak depending on
usage)... The interface is not horrible to use and doesn't get in the way -
which is all I really care about with this kinda phone (cheaper dumb phones
will really piss you off getting in the way).

RE privacy, phones aren't private, not even dumb phones, use a dumb phone for
privacy in terms of doing less on it (i.e internet), cell networks voice calls
are wide open of course. My main reason is lack of distraction though.

RE network compat: I've taken this phone to China, Thailand, Laos, Mexico,
France, Germany - it always worked - Never been to US though.

------
leethargo
I got the cheapest phone available at MediaMarkt (German electronics store).

It's a SwissOne (don't know which model exactly) for about 30€. The battery
life is great (runs more than a week) and it even has dual SIM support.

Interestingly, I could not find (in that shop) any phone without a color
screen and camera. Really, I just want a phone for calls and SMS.

The one downside of that phone is that the audio volume on calls is really
low, even when set to the maximum. That makes it difficult to have
conversations on busy streets. In the future, I would pick one of those phones
targeting senior citizens (with the huge buttons).

~~~
roadbeats
I think you're talking about Swisstone SX 567
[https://www.amazon.de/swisstone-DUAL-SIM-Mobiltelefon-
Strahl...](https://www.amazon.de/swisstone-DUAL-SIM-Mobiltelefon-Strahlwasser-
resistent-
rot/dp/B015CGWP90/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1552938621&sr=8-1&keywords=swisstone+567)

~~~
leethargo
It looks different, but that's probably close enough.

------
mar77i
I'm using the new nokia 8810. The keyboard is annoying, but otherwise with
this phone you have a hotspot turned phone in a classic shape with you. KaiOS
isn't too bad either (no google stuff on my phone too).

~~~
lewiscollard
woohoo, somehow I managed to miss this existing. I had an original 8110 back
in the day and every now and then since I've daydreamed about just how cool it
would be to have that same form factor with modern internals. It's real!

Yeah, I might just have to pick one of those up. :) What do you object to
about the keyboard? And is it squishy rubber like the original 8110 or
something harder?

~~~
mar77i
It's definitely hard, with something squishier underneath.

Maybe I have a manufacturing one-off, but for me, the keys tend to trigger
multiple times when I press them. I can hardly enter an entire phone number
without accidentally double-hitting at least one of the numbers.

------
ghostbrainalpha
I'm a huge fan the The Light phone if you are trying to embrace minimalism.
The second version is adding some features that hit the balance better for
people who want to use their phone more consciously but still need to use an
Uber every once in a while. But the first version is still for sale at Macy's
I think.

[https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/light-
phone-2](https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/light-phone-2)

It's not as cheap as most "dumb" phones (~$300), but I for me its exactly what
I wanted to reclaim my attention.

------
interfixus
Being frivolous, not answering the question, but for my money, the best dumb
phone is the analog one we used to have, plugged into a socket in the wall.

It was often noisy, sound was crummy, it was unwieldy, and it cost a small
fortune to run, but it was without perceptible delay, it was fully duplex, and
it far better approximated real face to face conversation than the weird false
starts and constant stuttering interrupts we have learned to take for granted
these days.

Also, you could walk out the door and ignore it.

~~~
dredmorbius
Without some means of call-screening, telemarketing is making this all but
untenable in the US.

Oterwise, agreed.

------
apo
have you considered going phoneless?

The perspective it will give you on modern life will likely make you want to
stay phoneless.

Remember when everyone smoked? I mean everyone. The experience of being
phoneless today reminds me of what it was like to be a non smoker 25 years
ago. Nauseating.

~~~
rabidrat
I've considered that, but times have changed and unlike 25 years ago, there
aren't payphones dotting the urban landscape, and people make plans expecting
to be able to contact you when you're already out in the world and away from
your computer. For the once or twice a month that I need a phone, it's a
necessary evil.

------
alexcnwy
I’m in Tokyo for work and it is surprising how many flip phones there still
are here. Not sure if they work in the US but might be worth looking into
shipping from Japan.

------
andolanra
I've been using the same Nokia 301 since 2013, and I've been content with it,
but it's not sold any more so I don't know how much it's worth recommending
it. Some notable problems I've had—and there might be similar problems with
other non-smart-phones, which is why I think it's worth mentioning them—are:

· It has some size limit (I'm not sure what) on the attachments it can
feasibly receive from other phones, and the default photo size for iPhones is
larger than that, which means if a family member texts me a photo, I often
can't download it. This isn't a big problem for me, because I tell them to
email me instead, but it's still present.

· It lacks many newer emoji characters, which is only a problem if I'm texting
people who use a lot of emoji, in which case their messages will have a bunch
of mysterious blank boxes at the end.

· It has some kind of problem validating newer SSL certs, so the handful of
services that do talk to the internet are at this point broken. I don't use
any of them, so it's not a problem for me, but if I did, I'd have been out of
luck.

I should also add that dumbphones are a real mixed bag when it comes to
security. If I wanted to communicate with someone without eavesdropping, then
I'm out of luck with a dumbphone: everything is just not-particularly-secure
texting and calling. In my own case, I simply don't think of my phone as being
a trusted device: that's what my laptop is for. However, if you really want to
be security-conscious with your phone, I think the right thing might be to get
an Android phone, install LineageOS on it, don't install any of the Google
services, and be very limited in what apps you add.

------
catherd
You might consider a WiPhone a few months from now once we're shipping them:
(project preview link)
[https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/2103809433/338898127?re...](https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/2103809433/338898127?ref=761478&token=f27f373c)

It's intended to be hackable. The base phone is pure WiFi, but there will
probably be an LTE add-on.

~~~
squarefoot
I'd be hugely interested in this phone if only it had some form of cell
connectivity; even 2G would suffice for my purposes. While we wait for cheaper
4G modems, why not a pluggable SIM800 (cost: a few bucks) module for the rest
of us?

~~~
catherd
The current plan is to ship the basic model first, then add things like modems
if the reception supports the development effort.

So far it looks like most people want 4G, even though it's quite expensive to
add. I think too many marketing dollars have been spent convincing consumers
that's what they need, so we may end up doing 4G before others. But you're
right, 2G (or 3G) would both be cheaper and probably all you need for a dumb
phone.

The nice thing, though, is unlike most phones it should be pretty easy for
anyone with electronics skills to make a daughterboard that expands the phone
hardware capabilities.

------
amrrs
A discussion worth mentioning:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16912679](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16912679)

Of the blogpost on how to make a __dumber phone
__[https://nomasters.io/posts/dumber-
phone/](https://nomasters.io/posts/dumber-phone/)

------
retsibsi
I'm in Australia, so if you're not then we might have a completely different
range to choose from. (Hopefully your dumbphone market is better than ours!)
But for what it's worth:

\- My previous phone was a Nokia 3310. It was terrible, but that was partly
because I (presumably) got a dud unit -- the sound output was intermittently
(but frequently) badly garbled. Setting that aside, I would still not
recommend it. When it ran out of memory it had the delightful habit of
allowing me to obliviously (and laboriously) type out a long text message and
hit send, only then notifying me that was too full to do that, and dumping me
back to the menu (or a newly-blank message window, I forget) with the message
lost. The interface was generally a bit annoying, and the retro styling was
just a gimmick -- I don't think it had much in common with the original aside
from being a dumbphone. From memory the battery life was pretty good though.

\- My current phone is a Nokia 8110, aka the bananaphone. (And no, I really
didn't want to get another Nokia, but there were very few alternatives and the
ones I wanted to try had too many worrying reviews.) It's been fine so far.
It's pretty big, but fits comfortably in my pocket. It's not a flip phone, and
the screen is always visible (so you can check the time just by tapping the
power button on the side), but it has a cover that slides back to reveal the
keypad. I haven't used it for much, just very occasional calls and texts, but
I haven't had any serious annoyances yet. It runs KaiOS, which is
significantly less annoying than the 3310 firmware (and probably makes using
the 8110 as a semi-smart phone feasible -- the 8110 has Wi-Fi, which worked
fine when I tested it), though it does take a frustratingly long time to start
up. Battery life seems good, though I haven't tested it aside from leaving it
on standby for longish periods.

------
throwaway8879
I have the original Nokia 3310, which is not being used right now. Daily
driver is the reissue 3310 that came out a couple years ago. It's still a
little too "modern" for my tastes but something I can live with. The great
thing is that the battery lasts forever. Probably close to a few weeks. Well,
I don't use it at all, so there's that.

~~~
marttt
I used my 1st gen 3310 daily for 13 years. Eventually the antenna died and it
turned out to be impossible to find reliable batteries.

Mom, on the phone: "I can't HEAR you again! Go and GET yourself a DECENT
phone! I am going to BUY you one myself! ..." After this, my phone almost
always died.

An excellent phone, though. Saved me from smartphones (I've never owned one).
It also served well as a bottle opener when I was a student.

~~~
quickthrower2
Damn how did I not know about using the 3310 as a bottle opener (being a
20-something when I had one). Anyway here is the proof:

[https://metro.co.uk/2015/04/18/this-is-how-you-use-your-
old-...](https://metro.co.uk/2015/04/18/this-is-how-you-use-your-old-
nokia-3310-as-a-bottle-opener-5155965/)

~~~
marttt
Haha, I can't believe there actually is a video for this. I'm from Estonia and
it seemed like a a standard skill among 18+ year olds here in the early 2000s.
You had to try beer, and you had to try opening the bottle with a 3310.

I suppose I should say "timeless Finnish design" now. :)

------
post_break
Cant you just turn off mobile data and wifi on the phone? If it can't connect
to the internet, it can't violate any privacy.

~~~
torvald
I might increase the battery life by some, but I guess you still need to bring
your charger for a weekend trip.

------
sloum
I have greatly enjoyed my Nokia 3310 3g. I have had intermittent sergice
outages, but for the most part it works well. I live in a major metropolitan
area though... so if you are more rural you may not have the same experience.
I only use it for the following: calls, alarm clock, and the occasional text
(but I hate it when people text me and usually just call them back - yes, I
know it is frowned upon). While an LTE version of the 3310 exists in europe, I
do not believe it opperates on American bands. Which is a bummer and I really
wish they would release it here. Having buttons again is so much better than
the touch screen plague that has grabbed everyone.

If the WiPhone ([http://a.wiphone.io/](http://a.wiphone.io/)) manages to see
market, I may move in that direction as I am almost never outside of wifi
(plus the promise of writing apps in either MicroPython or Wiring or the like
sounds great).

------
trhaynes
Related question – Is it possible to have two phones with the same phone
number? Maybe an iPhone and a flip phone, for example.

~~~
ctdonath
Number sharing is a thing. That's how Apple Watch operates, sharing the # with
its host iPhone.

------
pbreit
Why not like a cheap ($40) BLU phone and just not use the "smart" features?

[https://www.amazon.com/BLU-Advance-Unlocked-Smartphone-
Black...](https://www.amazon.com/BLU-Advance-Unlocked-Smartphone-
Black/dp/B072N6BD9V/)

------
b5
I still primarily use an iPhone SE, but every couple of months I'll
"disconnect" by using a dumbphone for a week or two at a time. I use the Nokia
106:
[https://www.nokia.com/phones/en_int/nokia-106/](https://www.nokia.com/phones/en_int/nokia-106/)

I like it a lot. It's cheap, simple, and has great battery life; I charge it
perhaps once during the week or so I'm using it. I paid £18 for mine unlocked.

My favourite antifeature is that _it has no camera_. Most dumbphones have a
camera in them that's so poor it's not worth having. This one doesn't bother
with one at all, which means there's no camera option cluttering up the menus.

------
theli0nheart
I can't say there's a "best" since we're talking about dumb phones, but this
is one that I bought a few years back and it works great. You'll need a pay-
as-you-go plan, but other than that, it's been smooth sailing.

[https://www.amazon.com/BLU-GSM-Unlocked-Dual-
Black/dp/B07MZD...](https://www.amazon.com/BLU-GSM-Unlocked-Dual-
Black/dp/B07MZDNBDJ/ref=pd_sim_107_5/140-3315598-1741854?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B07MZDNBDJ&pd_rd_r=5f45e91f-49c6-11e9-a75b-d90d22588c43&pd_rd_w=aVPgx&pd_rd_wg=3nKs4&pf_rd_p=90485860-83e9-4fd9-b838-b28a9b7fda30&pf_rd_r=CJ6JSY813KMT2N2ZNFYY&psc=1&refRID=CJ6JSY813KMT2N2ZNFYY)

------
wprapido
I got multiple dumb phones. The new Nokia 3310 being my favorite. On top, it's
dual SIM.

~~~
dvfjsdhgfv
How does it compare to the original re battery life?

~~~
torvald
I also have a Nokia 3310. I guess I charge it every other 4-5 days.

------
jacquesm
Nokia (the new, not the old) makes a neat little phone that has good standby
time. I still use my old one but stocked up on the news ones 'just in case',
as long as my old one is still working I'll stick to it.

The 3310 is the new one.

------
war1025
Anyone have suggestions for dumb phones that will work with Verizon? I'm still
on a Samsung Intensity II from ~2011 because from what I can tell there aren't
any non-flip-phone dumbphones that work with Verizon anymore.

~~~
_eht
They have quite a few options at [https://www.verizonwireless.com/basic-
phones/](https://www.verizonwireless.com/basic-phones/)

I have used the Exalt and the Kyocera DuraXV. Both are great phones and even
allow you to create hot spots with them.

~~~
war1025
Those are all flip phones though. I want something in the old candy bar style.
I guess technically there is that Sonim phone, but it's ugly as sin.

~~~
drdeadringer
Perhaps one of the other non-flip phones presented here may work in the "bring
your own device" option presented on that Verizon Basic website.

~~~
war1025
The problem I've always found before when I look is Verizon uses different
frequencies than most other carriers, so the phones tend to work on everything
except Verizon

------
ThrustVectoring
It's a dumb phone. Pretty much all you need to to be able to make calls and
maybe send texts. Walk into a Target or whatever store sells flip phones, pay
for the cheapest phone + prepaid plan there, walk out.

For what it's worth, your location metadata probably uniquely identifies you
(nearest cell tower to work + home), and Target probably knows who you are
just from their security cameras, so this still isn't paranoid enough if
"state actors are interested in me personally" is in your threat model. The
"correct" thing to do in this case is to leave your phone at home and/or at
work.

------
Marsymars
I used a Kyocera DuraXE for a bit while travelling. It's rugged, and supports
LTE/tethering, but I abandoned that experiment due to how unpleasant I find T9
texting.

I was recently looking for a new phone for my father... he currently uses a
Gingerbread-era LG slider phone with keyboard. He's _never_ connected it to
data or wifi, only uses it for calls and texting. Doesn't look like there's
much available to serve his uses anymore. Maybe a (significantly more
expensive than his slider) BlackBerry KeyOne or Key2 which he can also leave
disconnected from data.

~~~
frosted-flakes
Look into the BlackBerry Classic, which was released in late 2014 or early
2015 and runs BB10. It's discontinued, but you should be able to find it on
ebay for much cheaper than a new KeyOne/Key2 (which are quite large compared
to the Classic). It has a great keyboard and all the built-in stuff works very
well and is easy to use (SMS, phone, camera, calculator, calendar, notes,
music player, maps, etc.). Battery life is pretty good too, or at least it was
when new.

I used this phone until the end of 2017, at which point the outdated browser
and dead app store (free apps only) started to seriously limit its
functionality, but if you don't need those it would work just fine. I use a
KeyOne now, but I miss the Classic's smaller form factor.

------
nickjj
I've been using the LG Xpression C410 for years:
[https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00YRDCLIU](https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00YRDCLIU)

But I'm not really sure what's out there now to compare it to. I never used
anything else. This one deals with calls and texts fairly well and I charge it
about twice a week with a low amount of texting and very few calls. I don't
use it for anything else.

I also dropped it once from chest height and nothing bad came from it. It's
built like a tank.

------
mwachs
My suggestion is for a Blackberry Q10. It has 4G (so it'll last a long time),
swappable batteries (very cheap), a great UI, useful functionality (calendar,
notes), and a completely worthless app store.

~~~
frosted-flakes
I second this suggestion. Or the newer BlackBerry Classic (late 2014), which
is almost identical except for the larger, non-removable battery and the
addition of a thumb track pad and call/menu/back/hang up buttons.

------
Xixi
Stupid question: would that really be better (from a privacy perspective) than
a smartphone, without using the "smart" part of it? Arguably by using a dumb
phone you would avoid sharing data with either Apple or Google, but you will
still share everything (location, phone numbers, who you are calling, etc)
with your telco company.

Calling/texting with a dumbphone might actually be worse, from a privacy
perspective, than using something like Whatsapp (until Whatsapp was acquired
by Facebook).

~~~
darkpuma
Battery life. Phone batteries used to last for two weeks or more with light
usage.

Though to be fair to smartphones, my Samsung galaxy has an "ultra power
saving" mode that puts the display into grayscale, uses a special app launcher
and only allows access to a handful of applications. In that mode I can get
about two weeks of battery life.

~~~
Xixi
Battery life is a good point. I forgot that my good old Nokia used to last
something like one month...

------
abrowne
I've been wondering if you could use a cellular Apple watch like a dumbphone,
initially setting it up with a friend/family member's iPhone (restored to get
a fresh account, swap SIM and set up watch, then restored back to their
backup), and then only using time/alarms and phone. Anyone know if that's
possible? Could you update the contacts via icloud.com? Install software
updates without an iPhone or Mac/Windows?

------
max76
Using an LTE Apple Watch exclusively will address all time management concerns
while still allowing you to do things like order an uber and stream music.

~~~
pensatoio
Is that even possible? I thought you had to have an iPhone to set the watch
up?

~~~
abrowne
I know enough people with an iPhone that if it's needed for _setup only_ ,
that'd be fine.

~~~
abawany
AFAIK, it will link their Apple ID with the watch, which means that if they
uninstall an app, you might lose it, and etc. The LTE Apple Watch needs a
minimum of an iPhone 6 or something to complete setup vs. the non-LTE that can
be setup with a 5s.

------
croisillon
in the Netherlands I discovered a very cheap one from the mark Kazam, allowing
2 SIM (useful since I have 2), no memory but a microSD slot. I first used it
without the microSD but then I wanted to have at least an acceptable ringtone
so I installed the microSD... and I discovered that the phone (can) record all
the calls I made on the microSD. That came very handy about once a year, I
love the concept.

------
willnz
I haven't used one myself, but perhaps The Light Phone would meet your needs?
They recently launched an updated model -
[https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/light-
phone-2#/](https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/light-phone-2#/)

Doesn't deliver until July 2019 though...

------
paulcpederson
This might be of interest to you: [https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/privo-
mobile](https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/privo-mobile)

Looks like they are trying to make a dumb phone that has better UX like a
smart phone.

~~~
thoughtstheseus
What are the odds this project works? Just curious as making a functioning
cellphone sounds difficult.

------
truckerbill
What about an iPhone 3Gs? Its essentially locked out of the app store at this
point.

------
jaclaz
I use a Nokia 1280 (EU/Italy):

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18255904#18262362](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18255904#18262362)

------
santoriv
I have the Nokia 3310 and like it. Aside from not being great at receiving
multimedia texts, it works pretty well. Also it has Snake, but sadly not the
original version.

~~~
torvald
I second this.

------
renholder
If it were me, I'd go with a pager. Probably too old school for what you're
looking for but it's purely passive, from what I remember.

------
roadbeats
I'm curious if anyone tried to hack Palm Mobile into some sort of semi-
dumbphone by removing its OS and installing an open source mobile distro?

------
LearnProg17
My smart phone is 4 years old, and the battery now lasts 1-2 hours,
effectively discouraging me from installing any heavy app. Problem solved.

------
ForHackernews
One to consider:
[https://www.thelightphone.com/](https://www.thelightphone.com/)

------
baybal2
Aliexpress is flooded with simple 2g phones that just do voice, sms, and
address book.

Pick a few, and try. Some are like 50 bucks only.

------
watersb
We use Samsung Gusto 3 phones. They are tiny and just work. Cost about $10 at
the grocery store.

------
agumonkey
I found an ericsson ga628 looking phone, maybe I should pimp it with a rpi
zero

------
PereDamienOmen
The best dumb phone is a payphone.

~~~
renholder
Sadly, the Matrix has caught on and those are being removed. =[

------
wwqrd
Just glue your mobile to the wall in the hallway.

