
Tell HN: Call Mom - benatkin
I remembered this post from six years ago, and thought it would be good to have a post like it on HN today. It&#x27;s especially important to call important people in your life today with the pandemic, both for the caller and the person (or people) being called. It may also be worth setting up a Zoom (or Jitsi Meet, or Google Hangouts, or Facebook, or another group video call service) gathering. I joined one for my little brother&#x27;s birthday late last month, and it was really good for feeling connected.<p><a href="https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=7728411" rel="nofollow">https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=7728411</a>
======
loufe
Well this thread did not have the comments I expected. At least in my case I
have a mom who gave us her all and continues to be a part of my life. I call
her pretty frequently but I appreciate having a holiday as an excuse to remind
her how much I love and care about her - and how lucky I am to have that.
That's what this holiday means to me.

------
mooneater
I was 22, that was the last mothers day my mother was alive for. Of course I
didn't know at the time, but I didn't call. Im 44 now and its one of my
biggest regrets.

Dont be like me. Call her.

~~~
WarOnPrivacy
I was 21. My mom was in a permanent state of postoperative delirium and I was
nursing her into her last days. It was just the two of us & I wasn't up to the
task. I doubt I knew it was Mother's day.

A few weeks earlier: My older siblings and I sent a bright, aware, career
budget analyst into cancer surgery. The hospital returned a woman who no
longer recognized us or even where she was. We were sent home and some home
health aides helped us get her settled & setup care routines.

After some time my sister went back to her life (she & mom didn't get on).
Then my brother drove back to his home two states away and it was just me and
mom & feeding her & helping to the bathroom & cleaning up when she didn't make
it.

Some days or weeks later, I had a phone call w/ mom's sister and that aunt
drove down & took over whatever it was I handed to her. As a guy who struggles
to keep the dishes washed, I imagine it wasn't great.

The last few months of mom's life proceeded in a more orderly manner. Mom
turned 64. I turned 22 & three weeks later she died.

In case anyone is tempted to lionize the kid in the above picture, let me
complete the picture. If I could have slipped away and let someone take point,
I would have. In this thing, my siblings & I were my dad's kids (tho he was
gone & dead, many years). As I was living with mom already, I was the one left
holding the colostomy bag.

So I wasn't really responsible but I was lucky. Taking care of an ailing
parent for 6 months can be a privilege (as opposed to, say, 6 years). I'm
grateful to have escaped the guilt that I suspect my siblings have. I also
learned I might not be terrible at other big life challenges, like being a
parent (I was anyway but not forever).

However, for anyone beating themselves up this Mother's Day, let it go. We are
what we are until we aren't & the weightiest factor that changes that are the
circumstances beyond our control.

'Will' is critical but I've found it's a poor tool for making deep, lasting,
healthy changes - unless supportive environments are also present.

~~~
istorical
I think you should be proud of the dignity you gave her. No one can stop death
but we can give dignity to people we love or feel gratitude towards, and it
sounds like whatever job you did, no matter how good or bad the fact that you
were there gave her dignity at the end of her life.

------
Kye
I think people who at least had a bearable relationship with their parents
can't even imagine the horrors a parent can unleash on their children, so
can't imagine a scenario where someone would want to cut contact. They can't
conceive of not having a connection with them at all because the parent (or
parents) prevented one from developing with their behavior. They don't know
the warden-terrorist spectrum of parents.

 _Some_ of those people make a friend or two who had a different experience
and at least develop a little empathy. I don't expect you to understand, but I
hope you can at least understand that many people lashing out in this thread
are projecting a diminished form of the horrors done to them. It's not meant
to be personal.

------
nr152522
My mum passed a few years ago. I miss her deeply, she was just 59 and she
missed the chance to meet her first grandchild.

I live in London and she lived in California, we’d speak to each other a few
times a week.

Since she left earth and moved to the universe, she’s become a super awesome
space mum! I speak to her everyday.

I do miss the hugs, the laughs and life lessons mind you. Her greatest lesson
was when she left this world. It taught me a lot about how I go about my life.

So before I sound too cliché, call your mum and tell her you love her, that’s
way cooler than the learning the latest tech!

Love you mum!

~~~
movedx
> Since she left earth and moved to the universe, she’s become a super awesome
> space mum! I speak to her everyday.

Oh man... right in the feels.

I hope you can your family are doing well over in London.

~~~
nr152522
Thank-you for your kind words.

------
dorkwood
I'm envious of people who have a kind of "best friend" relationship with their
parents. My father, for example, I have almost nothing in common with. He's
the political opposite of me, doesn't have any hobbies or share any of the
same interests, and doesn't have the same sense of humour, so our conversation
always falls flat. I bought him a laptop and introduced him to the internet
because I thought he might find some new interests, but it just resulted in
him watching radical YouTube videos and ranting about politics even more.

For the people in this thread saying they call their parents every second day,
is it because you genuinely like talking to them, or is it more out of a sense
of obligation? Do I still have a duty to call my parents multiple times a
week, despite us never having anything to talk about?

~~~
kerkeslager
It shouldn't be a surprise that the same culture that brought us deplatforming
and canceling, would bring us cutting out your parents because you disagree
with their politics.

Do it for yourself. Your parents are a huge part of your psyche: they made you
--100% in a genetic sense, and in most cases they made a lot of your
personality traits by the way they raised you. And they made you in their
image, because they could only give you what they had. In a sense, making
peace with your parents is making peace with yourself. It's not comfortable
but many things that are worthwhile aren't.

Maybe set a boundary where you don't talk about politics. Or do talk about
politics if you can keep it polite and productive: it's pretty fucked up that
so many people just write off people because they hold radical political
views. One of the most effective ways to change the political landscape is for
people to talk to radicals and explain to them patiently why their views are
wrong. And that's most effective when coming from loved ones, I think. Don't
try to do it if you can't do it in a healthy way, but it's certainly a
worthwhile endeavor if you can do it.

~~~
tempestn
> explain to them patiently why their views are wrong

Good luck with that. Best I think is reasonable to hope for with that much of
a gulf is to model the attitudes you believe in, and hope the other person
eventually comes around. Don't think anyone with radical views has ever been
convinced by someone explaining - calmly or otherwise - why they're wrong.

As to the OP's question of whether he's obligated to talk to his father, with
whom he shares no interests and disagrees on strongly-held beliefs, multiple
times per week. My answer would be a hard no, but that's far from cutting him
out of his life.

I agree with you that it's emotionally beneficial to have a connection with
your parents where possible, and that OP could try to have contact with his
dad. But forcing it on a very regular basis when it's unpleasant and
uncomfortable seems counter-productive.

~~~
kerkeslager
> Don't think anyone with radical views has ever been convinced by someone
> explaining - calmly or otherwise - why they're wrong.

Well, I can disprove that: me. I grew up with some pretty homophobic views,
and due to some very patient people in my life, I realized I was wrong. And
I've had similar conversations with other people and seen their views change
over time.

> As to the OP's question of whether he's obligated to talk to his father,
> with whom he shares no interests and disagrees on strongly-held beliefs,
> multiple times per week. My answer would be a hard no, but that's far from
> cutting him out of his life.

I don't think there's any obligation.

> I agree with you that it's emotionally beneficial to have a connection with
> your parents where possible, and that OP could try to have contact with his
> dad. But forcing it on a very regular basis when it's unpleasant and
> uncomfortable seems counter-productive.

There's a range of unpleasantness and discomfort, and I think some level of
both is a necessary part of growth. If every conversation turns into a
screaming match--sure that's counterproductive. But if you're at a point in
your life when you can handle disagreement in a healthy way, disagreement
doesn't need to be avoided.

------
Endlessly
Worth noting while 40+ countries celebrate Mother’s Day — per country, the
holiday’s actual date varies.

See the wiki page for more information:
[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mother%27s_Day](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mother%27s_Day)

~~~
anomaloustho
Also worth noting that today is considered Mother’s Day in ~96 countries based
on the entry, making this date the single largest alignment of Mother’s Day
celebrations in the world.

The second place goes to March 8th (International Women’s Day) which has 20
countries.

~~~
Endlessly
For clarification, “the entry” appears to be the wiki page I linked to. The
count of 96 countries appears to come from the list of countries per time of
year.

My 40+ countries came from the same page, not sure why it says 40+.

------
throwawayaloo
I can relate to some of the grief that people have with mothers that didn't
fit the stereotype. I'm one of them: I know mom loves me (or at least I'd like
to tell myself that) but she's been abusive to me and my siblings in ways that
few can imagine. We've tried our best with interventions, but nothing really
helps.

Here's how it's different for me: I'm a practising Muslim and there's strong
exhortation in the religion to be kind and respectful to your parents, no
matter how they are (e.g. "and to parents, good treatment. Whether one or both
of them reach old age [while] with you, say not to them [so much as], "uff,"
and do not repel them but speak to them a noble word.") Note it doesn't say
you have to love them, because you can't really control that. My learned
experience (I'm 41 now) has shown me that on the whole, this approach and
advice has been immensely helpful. I feel that despite the worse that's been
dished out to me and my siblings, by controlling how I choose to react is very
empowering. Plus it sets up a good example to our kids (my mom lives with us
since my dad passed a few years back) on how to deal with difficult people.

~~~
jelliclesfarm
I find most mothers(yes, I am generalizing) manipulative and toxic. I think
going through the traumatic process of biological procreation does something
to their psyche and damages them forever. Like PTSD. And they don’t get help.
They get Mothers Day cards and flowers instead.

Different women deal with it differently. The glorification of motherhood and
the enormous pressure on ‘being a good mom’ and creating gods from mere
mortals is only making things worse.

Women would benefit enormously physically and mentally and spiritually if..as
a society..we stop gaslighting half the human species into believing that what
women have to go through physically is ‘normal’ and glorious because honestly
that’s the only way they’d continue to keep getting pregnant and having more
babies. Of course, physically, hormones also conspire against them creating an
addiction with happy chemicals and endorphins and oxytocin and dopamine etc.
But that’s nature. But nature doesn’t have Hallmark moments. It’s evolution.

I am not a feminist in the traditional sense. I dont think women are ‘equal’
to men due to evolution. Our collective biological evolution has made the
female of our species superior due to their higher ability to perpetuate
humanity as a species, but it has also made one gender biologically weak and
vulnerable. Fix that. A true feminist would want to fix that and hack biology
and evolution so we are truly equal. Everything else is fluff.

Having said all that..it is always a good thing to respect and love your
elders and parents. After all, they are you and you are them. If you are your
DNA, an unbroken chain of code...your source code must be treasured and
thanked. It’s not going to be perfect but it’s key to understanding yourself
and especially when you want to replicate that code.

But it doesn’t have to a mass ‘celebration’ of one day in a year that has
become a caricature of sorts rather than anything meaningful.

~~~
orestarod
A true feminist would genetically engineer the human species? Why not erase
sexes while we're at it?

~~~
jelliclesfarm
No. That’s not what I meant. I said that a true feminist would want to fix the
biological inequalities and not social inequalities. Hence feminism ..as we
know it..is mostly fluff.

Having said that, I am in favour of genetically engineering the human species.
If we are to be a space faring species, we will most certainly have to
genetically alter the genome.

I don’t know if we can erase sexes. However, there will be a greater degree of
feminization. The default gender is female. Y is a ..how you say..I want to
call it a mutation.

Patriarchy..as the feminists call it..is just the mutation gone rogue.

------
dgreensp
And if your mom is toxic and/or abusive and you are not in contact, or you
have no mom, or for some other reason you can’t or know better than to call
your mom: Don’t call Mom!

Somebody needs to hear this today. :)

~~~
Ewigkeit
Thanks, it does help to hear that.

------
sneak
Why are other people concerned about the relationship dynamics in the families
of others that do not affect them?

Won’t people who already want to do this do this without prompting? Will
people who don’t want to suddenly change their mind because they were
prompted?

What is the intended goal of this post, benatkin? Do you wish for people who
don’t want to speak to their mothers to do so anyway, because you told them to
do so? Are you worried that people who do wish to do so will forget?

In either case, these sorts of societal nudging always struck me personally as
really quite rude, the sort of thing that might warrant a “mind your own
mother” sort of reply.

It seems to me that it warrants a reminder that your cultural norms and values
and priorities need not be the same cultural norms and values and priorities
of those around you, and those others are not wrong for diverging from your
own views.

~~~
benatkin
My goal is to give people a nudge in the direction of calling their mothers,
or a mother figure in their life. This is actually what I intended by saying
"call important people in your life". I didn't intend to imply that everyone's
mother has an important role in their life today. I thought it would be a
valuable prompting for many people in the tech startup community to receive,
because the pandemic is making people feel less connected.

For those on the fence, I would like to nudge some of them, but not all of
them, to call at least one mother figure in their life. For those who were
going to call a mother figure, but were going to wait until the last moment, I
would like them to call earlier. Mother's Day is traditionally celebrated in
the morning, after all. I also had in mind people who were going to forget.

My views have been shaped in part by self-help books I've read, as well as
what I've learned by taking yoga, improv, and meditation classes. I think it's
better for most people to remove any protective shell they have around them,
if they can find a safe way to do so. "The Untethered Self" by Michael Singer
[1] gave me a lot of insight into it. When I'm aware, I try to let thoughts
come and let them pass. I find I have an easier time doing this when I have
good habits (including yoga, improv, meditation, running, and music).
Sometimes I do build up a shell around myself, but I eventually open back up
again.

[1] [https://www.amazon.com/Michael-
Singer/dp/1572245379](https://www.amazon.com/Michael-Singer/dp/1572245379)

------
spicyramen
I used to call my family every weekend, since I became a dad we talk 2-3 per
week, the newborn has rejuvenated the family relationship and on my side I
understand more what being a mum means. My boy is 1 year old and I would never
understand some of the things mum did until I saw this little one grow. Call
your mom's regardless.

~~~
tanzbaer
Can you give an example of something you understand better about her behavior?

------
helpmesee123
Can someone please help me understand?

I feel such a strong aversion to acknowledge almost every holiday, especially
marketing-driven ones like Mother’s Day. Frankly saying “happy Mother’s Day”
feels like I’m defiling myself and mindlessly buying into propaganda.

Isn’t it enough to treat mothers/fathers/etc well on a regular basis? Doesn’t
that mean more than a call/card once a year?

I don’t want to be this way. Help me.

~~~
rootusrootus
I hate hallmark holidays too. So don't buy a card. I don't. But I do take an
extra moment to pick up the phone and wish my mother a happy mother's day.
Just because it's formal and seems trite doesn't mean I deliberately go the
opposite direction. I love my mom and I make sure to communicate that every
time we talk, so this is just icing on the cake.

------
RspecMAuthortah
Anyone in different time zone that our parents are, how do you effectively
deal with it? I have about 10hr time difference and whenever I have free time
either they are sleeping or I have to stay till late hours at night. Not
great.

~~~
perilunar
10 hours is easy. My brother lives in Europe and calls our parents in Aus
every week (9-11 hours difference depending on DST). Usually his evening/their
morning, but the reverse works well also. Just message them and set a time in
advance.

------
BrandoElFollito
A lighter comment then the others.

My mom would often drive me and my brother crazy by having views completely
opposite to ours. On purpose. To force us to discuss and defend our point.

When we were teens all topics were addressed, she would be anti abortion when
we were pro (she was too), against euthanasia when we were for (she was for)
etc. Since we had in reality very similar views it of was a heck of a job for
her to defend the other perspective.

That was awsome. I almost went to study law (but choose physics) and I am
doing the same with my children.

Our discussions were very "latine" as we say in France. Quite quickly we would
jump on each other and it seemed that there would be manslaughter. In the
middle of that was my father who was emotional as a fish and liked to watch
the show.

When I met my future wife, we invited her father home for lunch. I told my mom
to not talk about anything controversial so that we look like a normal family.
She completely agreed and we settled for art or something.

He came home, everyone was smiling and then my half brained brother (20
something at that time) brought to the table the subject of elections. After
some time we were ready to kill each other with my mom. The future father in
law quietly said that maybe it is time for him to leave to which we both
jumped all in smiles telling that no, sorry, this was just an accident and
other chit-chat. Some more cake maybe? What do you think about Picasso?

He much much later told us that he thought he was in a psychiatric ward.

I love my mom and dad, calling them right now!

------
grawprog
Have they invented ghost phones yet then? I would totally call my mom if those
existed.

~~~
devchix
I know you jest, but of interests, there's a phonebooth someone set up for
folks in Japan who have lost family members in the 2011 tsunami to "call" and
"talk" to them.

Scroll down to "Really Long Distance".

[https://www.thisamericanlife.org/702/one-last-thing-
before-i...](https://www.thisamericanlife.org/702/one-last-thing-before-i-go)

Everything we do for the dead is a ritual for the living.

~~~
grawprog
I actually find that a bit, I'm not even sure of the word I'd use, not quite
creepy, not quite disturbing, but not something I'd want to do.

I'm not sure if my mom would have liked that much either. She didn't want us
focusing on things like that after she was gone. She didn't want to be buried
so we wouldn't waste time going to a grave stone.

>Everything we do for the dead is a ritual for the living.

Yup, that it is. To help people come to terms with loss and generally confront
the idea of mortality. Personally, i've gone through lots of different
feelings towards it over the years. I'm not sure if it's something you ever
really deal with, you just learn different ways of thinking about it over the
years, and it's not always a steady progression of, feeling bad-being ok or
something like that. Sometimes I feel like I dealt with it better when I was
younger than I do now.

------
rohanaed
That's a good tell HN topic.I am from India , and I called my mom in morning.

------
wizardofmysore
I literally have been calling my mom every single day for the past 8 years
I've been away from home. In India we are very close with our parents, they
make a lot of sacrifices to give us a good life. Most kids in India usually
call their parents atleast 2 times a week.

------
jelliclesfarm
I hate collective kumbayas like this. Moms, dads, pets, god,
children...birthdays, wedding days, anniversaries, Valentine’s Day...these
celebrations are crude and unnecessary. If it’s something or someone one
treasures, one ought to keep such celebrations about that private.

Isn’t anything sacred anymore that it can’t be made into a hallmark card
moment or be up on social media?

There are so many people out there..And everyone’s life circumstances are
different. I find this..how you say..not socially classy and utterly clueless.

Keep it private. No one cares. Or rather..no one should care. That is true
freedom.

~~~
axiom92
>Keep it private. No one cares. Or rather..no one should care. That is true
freedom.

This.

I dare say I find it offensive that the post is asking me to do something that
might very well be irrelevant, hurtful, useless, and all in all detrimental to
my mental well being. I don't know why people generalize things like this.

~~~
jelliclesfarm
fair enough.

------
tito
I love my mom! Called her this morning :)

------
whiddershins
Thanks! I had almost forgotten.

------
kbk
I'm sad. I cannot understand how the question is reduced to a call on one day
over the year! Cannot say more!

~~~
luckylion
It's not "call her only today", it's "call her today".

------
known
"You don't have to be famous; You just have to make your Mother proud of you"
\--Meryl Streep

------
reeealloc
I'm fortunate enough to be a student and have a mom to go home to between
semesters. Call her :)

------
always_left
If this day really mattered to someone, they wouldn't need a post to tell them
to do so.

------
speedgoose
Check first if it applies for your mom. Many but not all countries celebrate
it today.
[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mother%27s_Day](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mother%27s_Day)

~~~
bigdict
If you are on the phone already when you realize it doesn't apply, just say
"Sorry mom, you are not eligible today" and hang up immediately.

~~~
speedgoose
And forget her next mother day.

------
bdcravens
Last month my wife's family did Zoom calls on various birthdays in the family
(I think there were 3 of them). By this point they're Zoomed-out and they just
did individual calls to her mom.

------
abinaya_rl
Usually, I'll call my mom weekly 3-4 times. Even if we live separately we
kinda feel like living together by sharing the events.

------
cafard
Did, five minutes before seeing the post, but thank you for the thought.

------
J_cst
Thank you for reminding me

------
MattGaiser
Is there an Uber for Mother's Day app yet?

~~~
binaryblitz
Favor? haha

------
thewebcount
If your mother is a kind person whom you love, then by all means reach out and
tell her.

To others like me who may have a gaslighting c* * * of a mother, don't be
bullied by societal norms into feeling like a bad person just because you
don't want to connect with an abuser. It's perfectly fine to not call your
mother on mother's day if you don't have the kind of relationship that will
benefit from it.

~~~
voisin
FWIW, I think your life would be vastly improved if you can turn the anger
evident in your post into sadness for whatever caused her to act like that in
the first place. It’s worked for me. Pity feels like a healthier emotion to
experience than anger or bitterness.

~~~
Woberto
I see people downvoting so I just wanted to say, as a person with anger
towards my dad, this makes some sense to me. He was a terrible father, and
surely a large part of that is due to something like poor mental health from a
rough upbringing. It really sucks that my siblings and I suffered from it, but
I can also sympathize with what he went through.

It's still really tough to know where to go from here. I feel like I've
learned from his mistakes, but is the same true for him? Why hasn't he tried
to change, is it the society/culture he grew up in? How much is his fault?
Still figuring out how to deal with these questions. But I can be angry, and
have pity too.

~~~
blueberry_47
If your old man did you wrong Well maybe his old man did him wrong
-mewithoutyou, Allah Allah Allah

~~~
marnett
Never thought I’d see a mewithoutyou lyric on HN. This community never ceases
to surprise me! (:

The Fox, the Crow and the Cookie is still one of my favorite songs.

------
popotamonga
Is it a cultural thing Americans are so detached? Its usual here to call your
family 2 to 4 times a week

~~~
chrisseaton
> Its usual here to call your family 2 to 4 times a week

Yes like many things it varies culturally.

Calling family 2-4 times a week seems extraordinarily excessive to me. What
possibly changes that often that you have anything to tell them about on a
call that frequent?

I don't think I call my _wife_ that often when I'm working away.

And I'm British so it's not just Americans.

~~~
johnydepp
I dont wanna be rude. But if you cant find words to talk for 2 minutes every 2
days, you are very disconnected.

~~~
exolymph
wtf is the point of a two-minute call? text me

~~~
wuunderbar
Maybe the other person enjoys being on the phone and hearing your voice.

~~~
InafuSabi
phone calls (POTS voice) are better than text, thats not only my opinion, but
also for those on the receiving end of the call

------
2008guy
Please get rid of this

------
greggturkington
She's dead. I needed another reminder today, thanks. On a tech site.

~~~
dvtrn
I am sorry for your loss and the pain you’re having conjured up today.

------
stakkur

      def mom(believe_hallmark = False, mom_exists = False, mom_cares = False):
        if (believe_hallmark == True and mom_exists == True and mom_cares == True):
            print('Call Mom')
        else:
            print('Nah')
    
      mom(False, True, False)
    

License: This code is open source.

[EDIT] I'd forgotten how poorly humor fares on HN.

~~~
Liron
`== True` is triggering

~~~
therealdrag0
I have mixed feelings. I prefer “if (condition)”, but I dislike “if (!cond)”,
since the exclamation looks sneaky, especially when the condition is a method
call or a long variable. But I dislike the dis-symmetry of using != but not ==
. Programming syntax taste is hard!!

~~~
dragonwriter
But it's clearly Python, so it would be the very not-sneaky “not” instead of
“!”.

