
My Pixel has a manufacturing defect - ivank
https://9to5google.com/2016/12/09/google-pixel-screen-peeling-support/
======
ssijak
Google support and customer relationship is horrible. One day I enabled
Youtube partnership out of curiosity (it was enabled for my country so I
enabled it than on my account to see what it is about). Few days later I tried
to login to my adsense account only to find it disabled! Problem is I have
never enabled adsense on any website, I do not have or post youtube videos, or
have done anything to violate the terms.

I am paying customer of gsuit, gcloud, google music, adwords, etc. I first
tried with adsense complaint form, there are 2 of them, one if your account is
disabled for invalid activity and one if you violated policies. I tried with
invalid activity form because that is what my adsense login page says why my
account is banned (evene when I do not have adsense enabled anywhere), but I
get automated answer every time that the account is not disabled for invalid
activity but for policy reasons and that is that. When I try the policy form,
it sends automated answer that the account is disabled for invalid activity
and that they can not investigate further...

Because I am paying customer of gsuit I tried support there. Guy from support
tried for almost a week to get any human support from google regarding my case
and he could not!!! Imagine that, support guy for a paying customer could not
get help from inside his own company. That is such a fail for Google. He
directed me in the end to the Youtube team to appeal there and wished me good
luck.

Google must do something about it, this customer relationship is so bad. Why
would I continue to pay for their other services if I can expect that they can
ban me from them for no reason and without explanation or support?!

~~~
cylinder
I've had excellent experiences with Google on the hardware warranty side
(Nexus) FWIW.

~~~
aewnjfksd
Cannot confirm that. Google denied warranty for my Nexus 7 because I was in
Germany and not in the UK until I got EU customer protection authorities
involved.

Note: I bought the Nexus 7 while in Germany through the Google Play Store
website.

~~~
kuschku
For me, they required me to send it in (and pay for shipping), then refused to
fix it, required me to pay for them to send it back, and when it came back, it
was entirely broken (motherboard was snapped in half, before the screen had
only a few stuck pixels).

I still bought a few Google devices later on, but I won't let their customer
support handle anything ever again. Fuck Google.

~~~
cylinder
They sent me a replacement phone next day air before I returned the defective
one, so I would not have to be without a phone.

~~~
kuschku
This was an original Nexus 7, in 2012, a week after launch. It was the worst
return policy I'd ever seen.

------
rfrey
If Google wants to charge Apple iPhone prices, they can't continue with Google
level service.

~~~
snvzz
Implying Apple service is any good. (See: bendgate)

~~~
nothrabannosir
Apple service is next to perhaps only Amex, if any. Perhaps.

~~~
vinay427
Along these lines, Discover has also been fantastic in my experience. One of
the only no-annual-fee cards that gets you a person on the phone with no
automated button pressing.

~~~
jakebasile
I've moved all my banking (credit card, checking, savings) to Discover and
I've had great experiences any time I had to call them - except they refuse to
lower my APR despite great credit. Oh well, I don't carry a balance so it's
just the principle of the thing. And for no annual fee, the cash back is quite
nice, and it has extended warranty and purchase price protection too!

I'm not a shill, I promise. I just really like my Discover relationship.

~~~
vinay427
As a student currently building credit, they've also been quite helpful with
increasing my credit limit when requested or giving me useful feedback on what
I should work on before I request another increase.

------
X86BSD
First google is no apple. Don't expect that level of service. They simply
don't care.

Second it's not just with their new phone the pixel they support poorly. Try
having problems with google fiber. The stories of them taking a year and a
half or over two years to deploy fiber 400 feet or to a house next to a house
with it or an apartment already wired for it is insane. I don't think they
have they really care about supporting their services or products. They just
want you use them so they can monitize your data. Beyond that they aren't
interested and it shows.

Their core soul is how to make money off data. That's it. Making the pixel was
just another finger to capture more data. Android is a tire fire IMO. Google
fiber is fast but pray nothing goes wrong. Any of their other services and
you're pretty much on your own. I don't think google deserves to be anywhere
as large as it is. But time will tell if they are able to stay relevant.

~~~
vidoc
> First google is no apple. Don't expect that level of service. They simply
> don't care.

In my experience, Apple support isn't great either, unless you are a paid
customer. When I bought the Iphone 3G, it had dead pixels upon arrival, I got
a replacement, same thing, then went for another replacement, but at this
point they started to argue, talk about "half-dead pixel" (a new concept), etc
.. I had to insist heavily and make a bit of a scandal in front of other
customers to make them replace my phone, which they did (finally, my 3rd phone
also had a dead pixel, this time I gave up).

I also remember dropping close to $2k for a macbook pro 2 years ago, upon
arrival the hinge of the screen was loose, this time tech support told me that
'unfortunately', that kind of stuff requires a screen replacement, and that's
not going to happen for such a small thingy.

I've always assumed that for the kind of money Apple charge, I deserve
perfection, the reality is kinda different. Best way I found to prevent
insulting myself too much when I order from them is to falsely claim I am a
student and pay with a discover credit card. It's still a robbery but 15%
cheaper.

~~~
ricw
Interesting. I've always had a very pleasant experience with support for my
apple devices. To the degree that I've had two laptops repaired for free that
were out of warranty. Getting an iPhone screen officially repaired on the spot
is something that still amazes me.

In the end, googles lack of support is one of the major factors I'm willing to
pay the extra cash for Apple devices. That plus privacy and thought out
security.

~~~
X86BSD
Same here. The fact the above poster got two replacement phones for free is
proof they have good service. You think a dead pixel on a google pixel phone
will get replaced? Let alone twice. I don't think so.

Apple has good service but they won't repair/replace everything. But i find
them more than reasonable when something goes wrong.

~~~
Dylan16807
> The fact the above poster got two replacement phones for free is proof they
> have good service.

Not it's not. A replacement for a hardware problem is only good service if the
new one does not have the same hardware problem. Replacing a broken part with
a broken part is slightly worse than doing nothing at all.

------
Lazare
It's a persistent story: Google reliably has the worst customer support of any
large company, to the point that Comcast or your local DMV starts to look good
in comparison. It's impressive, in its own way.

And as long as their consumer facing products were things like free webapps,
they could get away with it.

...but if they want to sell a premium-priced handset, they can't get away with
it. It's a USD$750 phone, come on. Telling the user that it's probably just a
non-existent screen protector?

~~~
AlexB138
Very true. I use Google Fi, but am about to drop it because the support has
been horrible. They're friendly, but I constantly miss calls and their
support's solution is to ask me to get another working phone to test with and
spend a couple of hours filling out diagnostic tests and bug reports. They are
also unwilling to do something as simple as send me a new SIM card until I do
this.

This, along with they they gave the middle finger to the Nexus line, has
turned me from a strong Google supporter into someone who will give a second
thought before considering using their services.

~~~
tuxracer
Google Fi support is extremely friendly and often almost zero hold time. The
actual substance of the support however is very much lacking. Google Fi sent
me somebody else's SIM card with my Pixel. It turns out Google Fi pairs a SIM
to a specific Google account. So when I booted my Pixel for the first time the
email field was pre-populated with someone else's email address (but not the
password luckily) and I got a "B010" error trying to activate. This is a very
specific error code which I later found out means that I was sent the wrong
SIM card (or trying to activate someone else's SIM card). But they didn't have
this properly documented so they spent a long time on the phone with me
factory resetting it, clearing data for certain system apps, booting in safe
mode, etc... before escalating the issue and saying someone will get back to
me later. A _week_ later they contact me and say I was sent the wrong SIM and
send me a new one. It was a terribly frustrating introduction to using their
service. Also seems a needlessly frustrating experience if their support
documentation and call back times were better.

~~~
PhantomGremlin
_A week later they contact me_

I really don't understand how people tolerate this. I can't be without a
cellphone for a week, my family and I use ours to coordinate many of our
activities.

I've not been disappointed when I've walked in to an AT&T or Verizon or Apple
store and said "here's the problem ... fix it". And they fix it!

------
shakna
Waiting to see when this crops up here, and how it'll fly considering Consumer
Rights [0]. It falls into minor, so Google will have to:

* free repair, (with a repair notice describing the fault)

* replacement (must be the same condition as the purchase, so no second hand!)

* refund (the same amount you have already paid, provided in the same form as your original payment.)

And of course, the kicker:

> You are entitled to return a product if you believe that there is a problem.

And the business you purchased from has to foot the costs of said return.

All of these things are things Google has tried very hard to avoid, but
they're selling the Pixel here, so they have to play by the consumer-oriented
laws.

It'd be interesting.

[0] [https://www.accc.gov.au/consumers/consumer-rights-
guarantees...](https://www.accc.gov.au/consumers/consumer-rights-
guarantees/repair-replace-refund)

~~~
grennis
You probably could mention where "here" is.

~~~
shakna
The link points to the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission.

Sorry if that wasn't clear.

------
csallen
As a counter data point, my Pixel XL's speakers started malfunctioning about 3
weeks after I bought it. I called customer support, waited on hold for about
10 minutes, went through a series of debugging steps with the guy on the phone
("Have you tried restarting the device?"), and then they shipped me a
replacement for free.

Also important to realize that the denominator matters. Seeing a murder on TV
every day doesn't necessarily mean that the world is in chaos. And seeing a
couple of anecdotes about an issue doesn't necessarily mean it's widespread.

That said, if I were the OP I'd be pissed and blogging about it, too.

~~~
vinay427
This was about equivalent to my experiences with the Nexus 4 and Nexus 5,
which is why I was also mildly surprised with this post. They even adopted an
unofficial one-time accidental damage replacement policy after a while.

~~~
csallen
People with good experiences don't write angry blog posts, so those data
points are often left out of the discussion.

~~~
justin66
Those data points don't matter.

A customer service organization that only wastes the time and money of _some_
of its customers, with no escalation path to get a proper resolution, is still
horrible. It doesn't matter that it worked for you.

~~~
vinay427
(Not the user you replied to.)

I agree, but I think that it's difficult to accurately evaluate the quality of
a customer service department with these anecdotes because every large company
will have the occasional misstep. I have personally heard of bad stories from
every company mentioned in this thread that supposedly has good customer
support. What's less obvious is whether there is a bias between different
types of users. I'm just throwing out a theory here, but perhaps Pixel users
are more technologically minded than iPhone users (this wouldn't surprise me)
and so they are more publicly vocal about their issues because they are more
invested.

For instance, Nexus devices were probably more common among Android developers
and reporters on blog sites, so Nexus problems were important to them and were
popularized by the online media more than an equivalent problem would be in a
more mass-market phone that might be popular in a different country.

tl;dr Every company has had missteps, and I don't think anecdotes provide a
clear picture by which to rank them.

------
joecool1029
Would love to hear if someone actually has had a positive support experience
with Google.

My company has faced a bug in their location dashboard for over a year. We
support local businesses and often get asked to update their Google business
details. We're unable to delegate location dashboard access inside our Apps
domain. My partner can send the invite to any gmail account, but can't send
access to me inside the company. I can't even access my own company's panel
through my paid Apps account.

We've had calls, emails, sent tweets. Repeatedly asked for supervisors or for
the issue to be forwarded to an engineer. The typical response is to get
blamed or deal with support confusion in India over what we're trying to
achieve.

The end result of 'partner' support? They gave a 2 hour notice over a major
rebrand to GSuite. The only way they could do it better is send us a postcard
simply saying 'FUCK YOU!', and in smallprint 'but thanks for your money and
information'. As said in other threads on this topic, Comcast offers better
support. That's telling.

~~~
throwaway70341
I have had mostly positive support experiences for Google Cloud. Granted, my
employer is a big customer so Google is making a lot of money out of the
relationship, and gcloud is a new and growing platform that you can tell
Google is actively investing in (unlike say, Gmail).

High-priority support tickets typically get a very fast response, although it
may take several days to debug the issue and fully resolve it. The technical
support people are very open about infrastructure issues on their side
(although sometimes they don't publicly announce them as early as I'd like).
They sometimes even help debug issues in our code when we determine that the
problem isn't on Google's side.

We get invited to participate in user feedback meetings (through Google
Hangouts of course). During these, we make feature requests that often
eventually show up in releases and help prioritize features that are already
planned or under development. I've even had one-on-one meetings with gcloud
product managers.

Google BigQuery's public issue tracker[0] is also pretty decent.

All that being said, this is a (very welcome) exception for Google. Every time
I've had to interact with the support system of a non-gcloud Google
product/service I've walked away disappointed.

[0]: [https://code.google.com/p/google-
bigquery/](https://code.google.com/p/google-bigquery/)

~~~
joecool1029
To be fair, I'd expect Cloud to have better support since they are competing
(and losing) against AWS and Azure.

We won't be in a rush to use Google Cloud, even with the savings.... just
knowing they are waiting to pull the rug out from under us once they start to
gain market dominance or change course is a massive turnoff.

------
lgeek
I'm not saying that he's necessarily dropped it or that it's okay for the CS
rep to have accused him of that, but my 4+ year old Galaxy S3 has the same
sort of bubbles in two corners on which it has been dropped so I get why that
was the first question asked.

~~~
tdkl
Isn't there a burden of proof to claim the device was dropped ? If there's no
visible damage from a supposed impact, then any company can just use this as
an excuse.

~~~
AstralStorm
No they cannot under EU law, they have to demonstrate damage came from an
impact.

------
stryk
Anecdotal of course, but my one and only interaction with Google support was a
positive experience. This was on the retail hardware side rather than in
software/services (IDK if there are different support depts., I would assume
so). I bought one of the v2 Chromecasts direct from Google Store when they
came out. FedEx delivered it to the wrong address. Called support (which was,
to my surprise, easy to find an actual phone number for, and I was speaking to
an actual human being. Probably because this was 'retail' related), and after
1 phone conversation and 2 email exchanges he filed a case with FedEx - which
required no involvement from me - and i was sent a replacement free of charge.
About a week later my across-the-street neighbor knocks on my door and gives
me a FedEx package with my name and address on it, it was the Chromecast.
Turns out the FedEx delivery driver mistakenly delivered it to his house,
which has only a 1-digit difference in Address. Honest mistake, it happens. I
e-mail the support guy I talked with before -- to my surprise again, this was
a direct e-mail address of his, not a randomly generated 'post only' email, so
he actually responded. I explained the situation, and asked where I should
ship the replacement one they sent back to. They tell me to just keep it and
do whatever I want with it (the guy even specifically said "give it away, sell
it on eBay, do whatever"). Granted, it's only a $35 device, and it likely
costs Google far less than that, but still - I did appreciate it, and my
sister does as well because she got a free Chromecast.

------
dangero
This is something I cannot understand about Google and I think definitely
needs to change. Here's the absolutely great thing about customer support that
Google hasn't grasped yet: You let your customers talk to you and in turn you
get the chance to remedy their problems and allow them to love your brand
more. If you're getting a lot of support calls then you can know customers
want something fixed and aren't happy. It's a feedback loop that in the end
strengthens your brand. Apple has proven this. Since Google has the money, I
cannot understand why they don't get this.

------
eganist
If Google won't repair a manufacturing defect, consider a chargeback (assuming
you bought it from Google).

Services like American Express have purchase protection, but the limits I
believe won't be enough to cover the Pixel. If you were sold a lemon and
Google won't hash it out, go ahead and let the card company fight that battle
for you.

If enough people start doing this, you can bet Google will double down on
customer service as proper cost avoidance.

~~~
fsckin
Initiating a chargeback is tantamount to terminating your Google Account at a
random time in the future when they find in your favor.

~~~
eganist
...hmm, you're likely right, but I'm actually quite curious to see if anyone's
willing to challenge that in court if it happens given that Google doesn't
really give anyone an easy way to migrate an entire life to another service.

~~~
chillydawg
Google will let you export all your data. Google "google takeout".

~~~
eganist
Nice. My google-fu's failing me on finding any services which can import some
amount of it and re-establish equivalent services, which suggests either some
important details are missing (e.g. account configs) and/or no one's seen a
business case for setting up that kind of migration service with any of the
other major platforms e.g. Microsoft's cloud apps.

Heh

~~~
sipos
The latter I think.

------
imchillyb
That phone was dropped.

Deep scratches are clearly visible, as are bits of concrete or asphalt that
are embedded between the glass and the bezel.

The coloration of the plastic bezel is changed where a /buff-job/ was done in
an attempt to remove said scratches.

That is a human error problem, not a manufacturer defect issue. I hope they
take you to task for lying so blatantly and attempting to stir up trouble. If
you've damaged their brand, I certainly hope they sue you for libel.

\---

In case OP deletes the original pictures:

[http://imgur.com/a/PN2CV](http://imgur.com/a/PN2CV)

\---

~~~
justin66
Oh, bullshit. That's lint or something, and those scratches are totally
normal. Buffing leaves circular scratches.

It looks better than most phones that have been in use more than a week or
two.

~~~
sigmaml
To my eyes, they don't at all look "totally normal". That is the wear and tear
you would develop after several months (or even years) of normal use.

In this case, the phone does look as if it had either a hard fall, or a hard
hit against something.

~~~
justin66
The person I was responding to was claiming that the guy had buffed the
plastic, which is obviously crazy. All I can say in response to your claim
that it looks like the phone has had rough use is that I'm pretty sure most of
my phones with plastic edges were worn more than that very quickly, through
normal use.

In addition to the defect the guy called them about I see unscratched glass,
unscratched metal, lint, and some abrasions on one of the three edges of
plastic that don't go deep at all (I bet you couldn't feel them) which are
probably only visible because the phone is being lit from above. None of this
is a big deal.

------
e40
It's not the first bad story of Pixel support I've ready, and for the money
you have to pay for a Pixel, I think it's a deal killer for me.

I will say that I had my Nexus 5 replaced twice, the last time was on the last
possible day of the year warranty (I didn't realize it until the guy told me
I'd called a few hours before my support ran out).

Both times I got a new unit (refurb that was like new?) sent to me, before I
sent my 5 back. Once I got the new 5, I boxed up and send the old one back. I
would have had to pay for the new phone had I not returned it after 30 days.

My question: why don't they do this with the Pixel? Was this part of the Nexus
support plan?

~~~
bdcravens
My understanding is that the Pixel is different than the Nexus: it's not a
"developer" device, it's in the standard consumer channel, so return policies
are typically based on the carrier.

------
daveheq
I don't know how many times I've heard of people going to Apple for a defect
or problem and Apple will just switch the phone out; it doesn't cost them much
to fix it and resell it. Google on the other hand still seems like amateurs
that are treating their products like experiments, not professional products
people rely on. Until they realize they need to put customer satisfaction
first, they're going to keep stumbling and pulling us through this small-time
garbage they think is good enough for their products and customers.

------
kbd
This is one of the most practical reasons why I always intend to own an
iPhone. If I have a problem I can walk down to the Apple store in my local
mall and get it fixed.

Recently, the battery in my old iPhone 5 was starting to swell. I got it
replaced in a few hours. If I had an Android phone, I have no idea the hoops
I'd have to go through.

A cell phone is an essential at this point and it's not worth using any brand
but the most reliable and easy-to-get-fixed.

------
WhitneyLand
The "easy" part of great support is top down commitment, and investing good
money. The hard part is spending it optimally so it produces real value.

For example, do Google call center reps make $20/hr like Apple reps or close
to minimum wage? Hire a little less, and pay a little more to avoid cable
company quality.

How to make do with less reps? Use a fantastically convenient online system
and drive people to it. Use machine learning to detect when a ticket should be
immediately escalated to a real supervisor, or actually to an exec or the
product team.

Constant social media scan and preemptively open tickets or escalate based on
content.

All reps required to maintain a satisfaction review score of >= x. This rule
would require empowering them to make good faith decisions as in case above.

------
dbg31415
Friend I work with has this same problem. Will pass this on and ask him to
post pictures here. His phone is white, bubble is smaller and harder to notice
but you can see it if you tilt the screen just right.

He was complaining the other day because he took it back to where he bought it
and they told him that he must have dropped it -- similar story -- and so they
wouldn't let him exchange it.

------
bluedino
Take it to some store I've never heard of? This is why I will only buy a phone
from a brick and motar, or online from a place with a brick and mortar
presence (Apple, Verizon, Best Buy)

~~~
Fnoord
Why don't they have some kind of postal address where the phone can be send
to? The phone was send from one, why don't they have a return address for RMA?
And, (FWIW, in NL) if it does fall under warranty, the additional S&H costs
would be on the seller; not the buyer.

------
jdavis703
I have to add an anecdotal counter point to the Google support is so terrible
line.

My Nexus 6P had a screen defect (couldn't detect touches anymore). I called
support and 20 minutes later they were shipping me a new phone and a box to
send in my damaged phone.

I also had to contact them for support on their DFP product. Received an email
back a couple of hours later with a detailed explanation of what was happening
that answered all my questions.

Maybe I'm just an outlier, or maybe people don't write about their good
support experiences.

~~~
justin66
The good experiences don't especially matter in evaluating the quality of a
support organization, the outliers do. It kind of goes without saying that any
support organization will not completely hose everyone who calls. Most cases
are easy, most people on the front lines know what they're doing well enough
to handle the easy cases, most supervisors can spot a mistake and fix things.
That's not excellence, that's the baseline.

The difficulty involved in the outlier cases getting a proper escalation up
the chain of command to someone empowered to make the right decision is how to
measure the value of a support organization.

------
andr
This is certainly an area where tech companies can learn from retail. You've
probably heard of the Nordstrom employee who allowed a customer to return a
Bloomingdale's purchase. And it's no isolated accident - stores, hotels and
other experience-oriented businesses give their employees a per-incident
budget to make things right for the customer, even if it's entirely the
customer's fault.

It's another question how to do that at scale and over the internet.

------
sergiotapia
Just like everything related to Google their support sucks ass. It's why I
won't use their new Domain registration service, why would I pay money to hop
through automated support hoops.

They are automated to a fault, and people still fall for it.

------
warrenmiller
The Pixel also has a major camera problem:
[https://productforums.google.com/forum/m/?utm_medium=email&u...](https://productforums.google.com/forum/m/?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer#!msg/phone-
by-google/9W8AiqBIg3c/RlUdQngRDQAJ)

------
ohyoutravel
This is pretty disturbing. I have a nexus 5x on Fi and would love a Pixel, but
because of stories by this I haven't upgraded. Since I'm on Fi, I'm kind of
stuck with Google phones unless I switch. But Fi is too friendly for
international travel and data rates, and it's cheap generally.

~~~
op00to
I am an Apple user primarily for support reasons, but I have never heard of
someone having this problem with a Pixel. You are probably safe from
experiencing this problem if you decide to buy it. If you buy the phone with a
good credit card, you can get an extra year of warranty service too.

------
donretag
"but in fact had never taken the plastic “screen protector” off of the display
when I received the device"

Notwithstanding the awful condescending tone from the CS rep, I once did
actually have this issue.

I purchased a cheap smart phone for an around the world trip since my
CDMA/Sprint phone would not work overseas. I knew that the camera would not be
iphone quality, but I felt that the images (8MP) could have been better. A
couple of weeks into my trip, I discovered the thin plastic protector on the
lens. Images were much better after it was removed!

~~~
tzs
I've seen devices where there was no mention in the "unpacking and setting up"
section of the manual that you should remove the protector, and there was no
tab or flap sticking out to make it obvious to do so.

Given that there is a thriving market for third party screen protectors, it is
not unreasonable in such a case for the consumer to think, "Cool! They
included a screen protector so I don't have to go buy one myself!" and leave
it on.

~~~
donretag
People read the manual? ;)

------
annerajb
Scary This days i rather pay a good premium if it has better support.

On the good side my Nexus 5x broke 1 week before it's 1 year warranty expired.
Apart from the hassle of them not shipping replacement to Puerto Rico they
sent me a 1 day replacement. After forwarding from Florida to Puerto Rico
+4days. it was a brand new phone and didn't give me any trouble I did have to
spent like 5 days without phone while I did their troubleshooting steps.

I missed the days I had sprint where I would just go to the store and be out
with a phone in a few hours.

------
sathackr
My droid Turbo 2 (with the 'indestructable' screen) is doing the same thing.

I thought it was a defect, but I had to replace the phone for a different
reason(went swimming with it) and the new replacement is doing the same thing.
It seems like the top layer of the screen is not adhering well.

I can make it go away for a couple of weeks by just pressing it back on with a
fingernail and a good bit of pressure. Verizon told me to call Motorola, but I
haven't bothered yet.

------
alkonaut
Compare this to buying a Samsung TV (exactly the same product only the screen
is larger) - they answer the phone right away and are at your house with a
friendly service guy in 1-2days.

They should obviously just take the phone and give him a replacement. If they
saw obvious signs he dropped it they could just send him the bill.

This is a premium product (on the sticker). The service doesn't feel premium.

------
brador
Some tablets also have this issue.

We had it with the Iconia W700p tablet line from Acer. Bubbles form at random
under the digitizer (months to years, single small bubble to multiple large
bubbles). They move when heat is applied and over time, hinting that it's a
digitizer glue issue as the product produces heat it is not capable of
handling.

------
npstr
My experience with Google Customer Support in Germany:

I had a Nexus 5 with a broken dispaly (my fault), that also at one point after
about 1 year and 9 months of usage got that nasty sticky on/off-button issue
where it would be stuck in a bootloop with no means of me accessing it. The
broken on/off-button is clearly a manufactoring defect. German laws demand
that all stuff has to work properly for at least 2 years, if used correctly by
the user.

So when I phoned Google about fixing that button I also mentioned that I had a
crack in the display, but the display was working perfectly fine, and what I
want them to fix is obviously only the button that's been a big issue on the
internet and not related to the display crack, and not fix the display. Google
then proceeded to tell me, that their warranty would not cover that, I need
first to get the display fixed on my own cost, before they would fix the
button (which they admitted is definitely a manufacturing defect). This is
absurd. Here's a shitty analogy: Imagine you buy a toaster, and it's button
stops working. You also made a minor scratch on it's hull. So the company
making the toaster refuses to fix it's button unless you fix that scratch
first. Ridiculous.

German legal stuff: In Germany, you have two choices when your product shows a
manufacturing defect before the two years are over: Demand a brand new
product, or a demand a repair from the dealer (not the manufactorer, thank god
I bought my nexus at the play store and not at some shitty dealer). If two
repairs don't fix your product or the dealer declines to fix/give you a new
product you may demand the (usually) full price back.

Let's call this German 2-year-protection the legal warranty. There is some
minor stuff involved about proving that it actually is a manufacturer defect
(first half year the dealer has to prove it isn't, last one and a half years
you have to prove that it is), but this wasn't an issue as Google had already
confirmed to me that it indeed is a manufacturers defect, which I had asked
them to confirm me in an email. Some dealers may try to trick you demanding
expensive 3rd party surveys of the problem during that second phase where you
have to prove it, thus scaring many customers away from executing their
rights. Sadly this works in many cases, while the only 'proof' you would
actually need is to say that you always used the device to its specifications,
an expensive 3rd survey is just overkill.

So, what Google does is, they offer an additional, voluntary guarantee (I'm
gonna call it like this because in German it is called "Garantie", while it
usually in English is called warranty, to differentiate from the legal
warranty which we call "Gewährleistung"). That's that little booklet that you
usually find in the original package of your phone saying something along the
lines of 'warranty for some stuff, but not water damage and not broken
displays'. German laws say that additional, voluntary guarantees like this are
super awesome and totally allowed and stuff but they may never touch any
rights that you have from that legal two-year-warranty.

So, Googles process of executing their additional guarantee is usually that
they immediately send you a brand new/refurbished phone, while you have a
couple of weeks to send them your old one. They require you to provide a
credit card, and it will be charged full price of a new phone if you don't
send your old one in/it happens to not fulfill their requirements for their
additional guarantee (this is pretty brash imo btw, personally I used an empty
prepaid credit card in case they were going to bitch about my phone when I
finally was allowed to send it in).

Note that they do not have implemented a process to handle repairs. You will
always get a different, brand new/refurbished phone than your old one. And
this is where they clash with German law. While I theoretically could be a
bitch and demand them to repair my specific device, and get the full price
back because they wouldn't be able to, I did not. I said I'm willing to adapt
to their existing processes, and allow them to send me that brand
new/refurbished phone instead of doing a prefered repair. This conveniently
would also mean I get a crack free display as a result of the process. But
that is not my fault. I'd have been happy to have only the button repaired,
but it's entirely Google fault that this was not possible.

So, the clerks at the phone were trying to keep me from sending that phone in,
because Google doesn't want to eat all these probably very frequent display
damages, while it is their own fault that they do. Also not a single of the
phone clerks I reached (3 calls in total over several weeks) did knew of that
legal two-year warranty, they were always refusing to give me a retour label
or even an address to manually send the phone in referencing their additional
guarantee that does not cover display damage (which, again, I was always
emphasizing, was not what I wanted to be repaired). All of them admitted that
they had not been taught about the German law of legal warranty, not even the
supervisors.

So what I did is I set up a registered letter citing all the paragraphs by
which I demanded a repair, or if not possible a new device, or if not possible
my money back. Weeks of phoning did nothing, but two days after sending the
letter I had that retour label without further comment in my inbox and
everything went smoothly after that (with additional precaution of mine using
an empty prepaid card; pretty sure that practice of Google is illegal by
German laws too, but I had my low effort work around).

This happened during the fall of 2015. Refurbished phone is working alright.
Additional benefit for the customer of getting a new device instead of a
repair: your legal two-year warranty is reset.

~~~
npstr
To clarify the display was not "broken", it was really just a crack, it's
performance was not hampered at all.

~~~
bflesch
This should be a Verbraucherschutz court case in Germany. A lot of them
disregard the 2yr warranty.

------
novaleaf
To contrast, here's my experience with the Moto G4 I bought from Amazon:

1) Ordered a G4, free 2 day delivery, see that occasionally when it gets hot,
it freaks out and registers false taps. RMA'd to amazon. RMA'd to amazon and a
replacement arrived in about 2 days.

2) Replacement G4 spontanously reboots every day or two. RMA'd to Amazon and a
replacement arrived in about 2 days.

3) New replacement works fine.

I'm honestly a little worried about the fact that the first two devices had
defects (they arn't supposed to be refurbished or anything), but given a 1
year warranty and ease of RMA, I'm still a pretty happy customer

------
JoeAltmaier
My friends Grandpa (I know, hearsay) couldn't wear a regular watch, because
the innards would become green goo in a couple of weeks and the watch would be
ruined. So some people may just be out of luck on this one.

~~~
johnhenry
Please expand further?

~~~
JoeAltmaier
Not a lot more to say. Was it skin Ph? Some kind of acid sweat? He apparently
didn't sweat a lot or anything. He didn't work in a manual labor job that
exposed him to anything - he was a publisher (Garden Way magazine).

The works of the watch would corrode green and that was it.

~~~
adrienne
I know at least two people who have a similar issue, including one who can't
even wear most jewelry except very pure precious metals because her skin
corrodes it (i don't mean the usual "turns your finger green" thing, i mean
black and pitting). I've seen the results, it's amazingly weird.

------
ak217
To be fair, I've had the opposite experience with Google Play Store support
for my Nexus 5. I'm on my 4th Nexus 5 chassis, the previous 3 were taken back
by Google (one broken glass, one sticky power button, and one water intrusion
taken back due to a one time courtesy replacement policy). I don't feel great
nor terrible about the phone, but clearly Google has spent substantial
resources supporting my purchase. My phone calls with them were always very
fast and to the point. (Their new hardware division in charge of Pixel may be
doing things differently though.)

------
cybernytrix
This seems to be cultural at Google. Apart from this, there are many instances
that I've been hit by their "we know best, just deal with it" mentality. AMP
debacle comes to mind.

------
Mikeb85
While I can't say anything about Google consumer service (all the Nexus
products I've had performed flawlessly and admirably), there is one advantage
to getting a device on-contract - they often have replacement plans which are
quite abordable (and even cover damage), and take away the hassle of dealing
with the manufacturer.

------
dkarapetyan
A manufacturing process which produces millions of phones manages to produce
some with defective covers. Owner of one of these defective devices tries to
rectify the situation through google's awesome customer service process
because that is what google is known for. Results are less than stellar.

------
hagope
Mine does too, I'm on the phone with Verizon ordering a replacement. My
problem, the audio just went out all of a sudden with a pop when I was on a
call. Now none of the audio works. I started with Support on Google, they were
good, then I transferred to Verizon, they were good too.

~~~
Lewisham
I had a Pixel which literally slipped half an inch to the floor and the screen
cracked. Verizon told me that it was damage that I did and thus they wouldn't
replace it. I complained that no phone should just crack from such a small
fall; that the phone isn't made right if that happens.

No dice. Had to replace the screen. Which I did. Then I returned it for an
iPhone SE. And that iPhone has survived much harder drops with no damage
whatsoever.

~~~
jc4p
How much did you pay to get it replaced? Did you use ubreakifixit? My Pixel
died in a similar way, fell out of my hand while pulling out of my pocket,
fell on the floor, screen dead. I went back to my iPhone 6s but the day after
my Pixel died my Daydream headset arrived and I'd really like to try it at
least once...

~~~
Lewisham
ubreakifixit is the only place that can do a glass replacement and keep it
with warranty. If your screen is dead, and not just your glass cracked, I
don't know. A screen replacement was $160.

------
martin-adams
Microsoft did a similar thing to me with the Surface Book. It wouldn't charge
properly and they tried to blame me.

Fortunately for me I got a free Surface Book out of the mistake!

[https://youtu.be/xShbqpPW65I](https://youtu.be/xShbqpPW65I)

------
intrasight
>don’t like cases because it takes away from the premium build and feel

One forsakes a case at one's own peril. No matter how much you "baby" your
small, fragile, expensive phone, it's an accident waiting to happen if you
don't have a case.

~~~
lcmatt
Or you just mishandle your devices. Never had a case/screen protector or
anything on every device I've ever owned and they're all still spotless (my
iphone 6 is 2 years old and I still get comments regarding how new it looks).

Look after the device and don't go throwing it around.

~~~
intrasight
Sure. But my point is that "accidents" happen. Would you choose not to have
health insurance because you never "mishandle" your body?

------
parfe
Wonder what the odds are a phone review blogger receives a defective flagship
device.

------
lightedman
Moxee has the EXACT same problem. The glass is so thin and not secured on
properly, so when the phone heats up, the glass cracks where the adhesive
failed.

So looks like the lesson to learn here is do not buy Google or Moxee-branded
products.

------
jay_kyburz
You guys need an ACCC like we have in Australia. Refund or replacement for
defective product is the law.

[https://www.accc.gov.au/](https://www.accc.gov.au/)

~~~
jay_kyburz
I didn't realise this was happening here in Australia! Hope to hear the follow
up!

------
mbrameld
Would a small claims court suit be a reasonable way to get relief here?

------
vacri
Something about the story doesn't smell right. The defect is probably genuine,
but comparing "I baby my phone" against the weathered-looking edging?

~~~
imchillyb
The edge directly under the bubble looks heavily scratched/scuffed and it
appears a different tone coloration than the rest of the plastic edge, which
suggests a failed buffing to remove said scratches.

The edge of the bubble also appears as if there was contact with an abrasive
surface, IE concrete or asphalt.

I do not believe that this was a manufacturing defect, not after viewing those
photographs of the affected area.

[http://imgur.com/a/PN2CV](http://imgur.com/a/PN2CV)

------
gcb0
> single defect

lucky you!

my nexus one had a dozen or so. Half could have been fixed in software, like
everyone claims google is good at, but never were.

------
Tempest1981
Can't you take a Pixel phone to Verizon for replacement? I thought Pixel was
exclusive to Verizon.

~~~
rspeer
No, Pixel is not exclusive to Verizon. Verizon may be the only carrier with a
promotion for the Pixel, but on other carriers (or on Google Fi) you can just
buy a Pixel from Google and put your sim card in it.

------
hifier
This is what happens when you do business with a company who views you as the
product.

------
csours
Why don't phones have accelerometer telemetry? Tesla's cars do!

~~~
greglindahl
Phones do have accelerometers, they're generally MEMS devices and are quite
tiny. Many games use them as controls.

------
ldev
Well, next time just buy an iPhone, the price is the same...

~~~
protomyth
and get screwed by Apple when they have a manufacturing defect and want you to
pay for the fix. See [http://money.cnn.com/2016/11/18/technology/apple-repair-
touc...](http://money.cnn.com/2016/11/18/technology/apple-repair-touch-
disease-problem/)

------
sigmaml
From the image at the top of the article, to me at least, it does look as if
the phone had a hard fall or a hard strike against something. The upper edge
of the phone looks quite chequered.

------
kutkloon7
Sorry for my pessimistic views, but I think big companies always have had the
power to screw over anyone they want. This is especially the case in the US,
where it seems to be quite accepted for companies to screw you over. Almost
all countries lack an easy option for non-billionaires to take action against
big companies. If you go to court, they will deliberately make the costs too
high to pay for normal people, and even when the company is wrong, they will
usually win the case. In the best case scenario, they will settle, and you
become rich by being screwed over.

~~~
protomyth
Well, considering Apple wants me to pay to fix a manufacturing defect in the
iPhone 6, I have to agree. I will say HP was cool with fixing a lot of
netbooks when we had 100 out of 120 failures.

Basically, American consumers yell on social media or popular boards, wait for
the class action suit to force a fix, or go without.

------
funnyfacts365
And now, after the PR shitstorm for reaching HN's frontpage, all will be
solved in a couple hours...

~~~
vesinisa
The sad part here is that these phones cost like $200 (edit: sorry, read $20)
to manufacture per unit. The $750 price tag is mostly in the SW and supporting
infra. The guy talking for a couple of hours with customer support actually
soon becomes _more_ expensive for the company than just taking their word for
it and shipping a replacement. And that's before you count in the brand
devaluation when the guy finds out their 'premium service' is just thin air,
and especially the PR damage once you happen to screw a tech reporter over.

Where I live most home insurance companies have adopted a better approach to
customer service. They maintain a central registry of claims. Most of the time
if you submit a claim they just pay you without requiring any proofs of damage
or receipts. But once you start abusing the system (unusually large or high
number of claims), they will get difficult. But for the honest, average guy
the customer service experience is just phenomenal most of the time (submit
claim online and receive insurance to bank account only hours later.) The
brand value for having a 'nice' insurance company exceeds the small number of
invalid claims that happen to slip through in the process.

~~~
JshWright
It $20 a typo there? The bill of materials alone is likely in the $250 range.
Then add the actual assembly cost, shipping the products to the US, etc, and
the basic "manufacturing" cost per unit is likely somewhere around $300.

~~~
vesinisa
Sorry, meant $200.

------
sickbeard
Customer service people aren't experts (even the higher level ones). They have
scripts, list of defects and how to help you resolve them. This "bubble" is
obviously something they have never seen before, unless a 1% of the phones
start having this issue they will just blame you for it.

------
davidf18
Very sorry to hear anyone going through this kind of trouble, but at least for
US users and most readers of HN, they should be getting up-to-date iPhones on
the Verizon network.

The costs are minimal and it helps to avoid hassles. I've had iPhone 5, 5s,
6+, 6s+, 7+, ever since iPhone had LTE on Verizon.

Each phone version is an improvement on previous models and the Verizon models
are now much improved over the ATT/T-mobile, using the Qualcomm baseband modem
over the Intel version. But Verizon has more spectrum in NYC at least and they
have been investing in their network whereas AT&T has not been so much.

There are yearly upgrade programs offered by Apple and Verizon and perhaps
others.

That said, I've had to bring iPhones into the store and they were replaced 3
times. The store is 10 mins from home and work and the service is excellent.

The only time there are problems with getting phone support generally is after
they release the new iPhones in late Sept.

I've also had great service on Mac laptops since 2011.

If for some reason, you must use Android, then by all means....

But if for some reason, you do not absolutely have to use Android, then iPhone
on the Verizon network is the way to go.

As for shopping, at least in my local store, it is very easy to just purchase
something. If you want, you can also purchase things for in-store pickup.

In NYC where I live there is an Apple Store open 24/367 which shows Apple's
dedication to service.

~~~
davidf18
Instead of down voting, why don't you state specifically why you don't
agree???

~~~
Dylan16807
You're stating a product preference like an objective fact, ignoring the many
many reasons to want different hardware, OS, or network.

------
sabujp
Yes, I agree the service was terrible, but if you can afford a $750 phone, you
can afford to buy another one, and if you can't then you shouldn't have
purchased a $750 phone. I buy my tech (esp. phones) cheap and hold onto it for
years.

------
Waterluvian
That's quite a first sentence. I always felt that cases are expected and the
design is based on letting the user decide what the case will be like.

~~~
Insanity
I am in the same camp as him actually. I dislike using a case and prefer to
use the phone as it was (afaik) intended to be used. Cases change the weight
and feel of the device.

I also would like to add that in all my years of smartphone usage (probably
about 4 years, quite late adopter) I never broke my phone or screen.

~~~
Retric
I did break a phone scene once by dropping it. But, running the numbers
replacing it was actually cheaper than buying a new case for every phone, so
IMO they are simply not worth it.

A simple plastic screen protector might be, but those always get bubbles.

~~~
ericabiz
Tempered glass screen protectors have been out for _years_ now. Applied
correctly, they don't have bubbles, and they really do help with impact
damage. They also help with keeping the screen protected against key/other
sharp object scratches.

------
Tech1
I'm a pixel xl 128 owner too. As long as we're going down this route, has
anyone else noticed weird 'refresh' lines drawing over top of images? They
appear very briefly and very faintly (and only in chrome as far as I've
noticed, may be a chrome(ium) bug).

------
protomyth
At some point a NTSB style part of government is going to be created to issue
recalls on defective electronics if companies keep this crap up. I expect it
to happen after the first IoT device defect affects a politician directly.

I don't want to see that because of possible affects on open source, but I get
the feeling that won't matter.

