
Farewell Etaoin Shrdlu (1978) [video] - truxs
https://archive.org/details/FarewellEtaoinShrdlu
======
Taniwha
My dad was a linotype operator before WW2, his dad was blind and during the
depression as the oldest he had to leave school at 15 to support the family
(this was in NZ)

Skilled lino operators were the programmers of their days, in short supply,
they were paid really well (for the time) and could quit, travel for a while
and find a job almost anywhere.

When dad signed up for WW2 he was almost immediately seconded to a HQ company,
men who could type were as scarce as hen's teeth, too valuable - he was shot
at occasionally but they generally weren't sent right to the front line,
mostly one row back - people had to be paid, orders had to be intelligible

~~~
Taniwha
BTW if you ever get to see a linotype machine operating in a tech museum get
someone to show you - especially look at how the type molds are mechanically
sorted after use, how automatic line justification is done - see how a line of
type (hence the name) is cast in molten type metal - it's absolutely brilliant
and completely mechanical machinery

Dad could read type backwards, it was part of the job, he still worked for the
newspaper after getting an accounting degree after coming back from the war, I
spent a summer working there, got to see a full hot-metal system working
before computers came along and made lots of people redundant (used to be a
reporter's copy was checked by 3-4 people: lino operator, reader, copy holder,
sub editor) now it's just spellcheck ... and before the evening paper was
essentially killed by TV

------
segfaultbuserr
07:54 - A pure-mechanical teletypewriter (Baudot/Hughes style, with a piano
keyboard) is controlling the typesetting apparatus automatically, reading
characters from a paper tape. The characters are encoded in ITA-2, a revised
version of the original 1870 Baudot code. It's how a real /dev/tty looks like,
and what we used before EBCDIC and ASCII. Digital communication in the
Victorian era.

24:35 - PDP-11. a quick flash among a lot of other computers. Only a single
row of the keys on the front panel was showed, but I can't be wrong - you know
just from its color.

~~~
082349872349872

        ___________
        | ooo .   |
        | ooo .   |
        | ooo .o  |
        |  o  .   |
        |  oo .o  |
        |  o  .   |
        | oo  .o o|
        | ooo .oo |
        | oo  .  o|
        | oo o.   |
        |    o. o |
        ___________

~~~
pleonastic
That "baudot" code looks like it's 7 bits wide (4 bits to the left of the feed
holes represented by "." and 3 bits to the right)

Were there extra spaces inserted somewhere?

~~~
082349872349872
It's meant to be an homage (programage?) to /usr/games/ppt but my memories
could easily have suffered bitrot.

There was an extra newline.

(according to
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baudot_code](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baudot_code)
AT&T used post-1963 encodings)

~~~
pleonastic
Oh right, it's just ASCII.

I initially thought that it was a 5-bit Baudot code until I realised that it
didn't make much sense in any 5-bit encoding.

I was trying to work out how an editor would've screwed up the formatting
without breaking the vertical line on the right which probably why I was so
confused.

I'm amused to see that ppt(6) is still kicking around in OpenBSD (in the
"games" base installation package) and is probably still sitting quietly on
many machines today (have Apple removed it from OS X?).

~~~
082349872349872
yes, they have :(

------
bregma
I worked with some former hot-metal compositors from a daily newspaper. They
had taken their savings when they were made redundant and started up a
computerized compositing firm just as desktop publishing was taking off. There
was an art to composition and layout and these guys were experts. They made
book for a while (pun intended).

Nowadays we have lost the artistry and elegance of knowledgable compositing
and layout. Algorithms automate us 80% of the way there and we swim in a sea
of crap with few people aware of it because it looks, well, okay if you prefer
to excel at mediocrity.

~~~
pleonastic
For those uninitiated to the artistry and elegance of careful compositing and
layout, do you have any examples?

It seems to be fairly easy to find exemplar typesetting on the internet
(probably due, at least in part, to the phenomenal effort that has been poured
into TeX/LaTeX and their ilk) but it's hard to find much that is considered to
be a good representation of what careful human composition and layout can
produce.

The only example that I could think of would be many of the books by Edward
Tufte but I think much of that compositing has/was automated and "just" guided
by a particular style that the author wanted to achieve.

The algorithmic approach to replacing human judgement has definitely resulted
in a sort of race-to-the-bottom simply due to the economics (think about how
few eyes would review a story before "print" today versus when this video was
shot) so I wonder what sort of skill might've been lost and how it might be
able to be recovered.

~~~
acqq
> For those uninitiated to the artistry and elegance of careful compositing
> and layout, do you have any examples?

I often see both the examples of the older "pretty" typesetting and the
examples of older "just make it fast" practically "no" typesetting texts (e.g.
the material typed on the cheap typewriter and additionally "fixed" with the
hand). The last I've seen, at the moment on HN first page is:

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23549203](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23549203)

Printed in 1975, I don't believe it's "desktop publishing" and even if it at
the first sight it looks like a bland Word document made with Times New Roman
or whatever, I believe I see some differences, e.g. in the tables? See the
plus sign there. I'm not an expert in typography though.

For more interesting examples, look at the stuff printed e.g. 300, 200 or 100
years ago. I believe I always see the interesting examples of care of details
or simply somehow "prettier" use of typefaces or something that looks
differently -- it's hard to me to explain what, but that simply disappeared
since.

~~~
jbay808
When I bought my first e-reader, I loaded it with free PDFs of old book scans
from the internet archive that I searched for keywords of interest (science,
machining, novels, etc). Since the works out of copyright are all a hundred
years old or more, I ended up reading through volumes and volumes of old books
about blacksmithing, precision metalwork, life in the countryside, and all
sorts of other things.

One thing I was struck by (for the PDF versions) was that the typesetting were
sometimes absolutely gorgeous, and often used fonts I'd never seen before.

------
Baeocystin
This was a great watch. I fully understand why they aren't used any more, but
what a mechanical delight! Watching people work at the smooth speed of
practiced efficiency is a joy to see, too.

(Couldn't help but notice how black with lead everyone's fingers were as
well.)

[edit] I am impressed with the printer's comments at 14:10 re: the
inevitability of computers

------
tysone
Useful context about the film, from the New York Times's in-house historian:
[https://www.nytimes.com/times-
insider/2014/11/13/1978-farewe...](https://www.nytimes.com/times-
insider/2014/11/13/1978-farewell-etaoin-shrdlu/)

------
zucker42
I really like listening to the worker talk about computers at 14:28. He
conveyed much of the same thoughts we still have about computers and
automation.

~~~
segfaultbuserr
Transcript:

\- Over 49 years, being a member of the composable, a senior member of the
priority list, the No. 1 man on the priority list. "How do you feel this
change?" "Well I feel that... They call it progress, I would like to stay the
way it was, keep the machine running." "How long have you worked here?" "49
years." "How old are you?" "75 and half." "Are you retiring tonight?" "Yes."
"This is the last time?" "Yes." "Let's have a drink, buddy!"

\- This worker chalks up his sentiments: End of an era, it was good while it
lasted. Crying won't help.

\- "I find it very sad. I planned the new stuff, the new processes, and all,
but I've been printed it out for 26 years. I've been in this place, 6 years
for apprenticeship, 20 years journeyman, and these words that aren't just
tossed around. They've always to us. I hate to say it, it's inevitable that
we're gonna go into computers. All the knowledge I've acquired over these 26
years, it's all locked up in a little box now called the computer. And I think
probably most jobs are gonna end up the same way." "Is computer a good idea in
general?" "Oh there's no doubt about it, it's gonna benefit everybody,
eventually, how long will take? I don't know."

\- "When is this operation gonna closed up?" "It closes up in the morning."
"How do you feel about it?" "Another intervention. I knew there are new
process for moving into. Well I think of these machines plus another $100,000
a piece to be junked [...]"

------
dand3
My favourite quote:

"I hate to say it. It's inevitable that we're going to go onto computers. All
the knowledge I've acquired over these 26 years is all kept in a little box
now called a computer, and I think probably, most jobs are going to end up the
same way.

Do you think computers are a good idea in general?

Oh, there's no doubt about it. They're going to benefit everybody eventually."

------
sb057
If you liked this, be sure to check out the 2012 documentary 'Linotype: The
Film', featuring Carl Schlesinger and footage from 'Farewell Etaoin Shrdlu'.
One of my all-time favorite documentaries!

[https://linotypefilm.com/](https://linotypefilm.com/)

------
mulmen
In high school I was in a computer tech class. In the second semester each of
us were assigned one of the labs in the school. I was sent to the journalism
room where the school paper was made. It was a fascinating and formative
experience.

It was my responsibility to generate the CMYK output and FTP it to the
printers. It was an awesome responsibility to be the last pair of eyes on the
pages before we released them to the world, regardless of the technology.

It was just a goofy student paper in a small Idaho town. I can only imagine
how it would feel to be responsible for the front page of the New York Times!

------
js2
Previous discussion:

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16904770](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16904770)

The link submitted then
([https://vimeo.com/127605643](https://vimeo.com/127605643)) was to a slightly
different version of the film on Vimeo as part of the "Linotype: The Film"
collection:

[https://vimeo.com/134626010](https://vimeo.com/134626010)

------
fortran77
I'm old enough to have learned how to set type by hand, in a composing stick,
in a high school shop class. We printed stationary, cards, etc, as part of the
assignments. And I still remember the ordering of the letters in the
"California Job Case." We took a field trip out to Newsday, a Long Island
newspaper, to see their hot-type machines (and probably breathed in a lot of
lead!)

------
akamaka
The video shows some photo plates embedded into pages alongside the text
plates made from lead. Does anyone know what type of machines created those?

~~~
projektfu
I can’t find a picture of the particular machine but it’sa form of relief
printing using etched metal.

[https://printedpicture.artgallery.yale.edu/photography-
ink-r...](https://printedpicture.artgallery.yale.edu/photography-ink-relief-
and-intaglio-printing)

~~~
082349872349872
My brief stint in journalism was after hot metal but before full
computerisation. We typeset by keyboarding into a machine that produced
column-wide printed output. Afterwards, to do layout, 'Cut' was done with a
blade, and 'Paste' was literal. (in this vid, too: 25:32)

Never saw how the actual back-end printing was done, but we did cadge used
printing plates from the big paper downtown when we needed thin aluminium
sheet for other hacks.

Are 24:32 cordwood modules?

25:13 the days when storage was dangerous if it fell on you (now it's probably
riskier that you might choke on it).

~~~
projektfu
It was probably offset printing. The plates were etched metal positives from
film negatives. A soft intermediate picks up an even layer of ink from the
plate and deposits it on wet paper. The paper is then oven dried. (IIRC, it
has been a long time)

------
cafard
I remember seeing linotypes in operation at a Hirschfeld Printing in Denver,
which is now out of business. They were fascinating to watch. On the other
hand, if you happened to choose, oh, ten-point Spartan, then discovered that
it looked a bit small, you had to have the whole item reset. And wrapping
lines around illustrations was not simple.

But they were great in their day.

------
arafa
Today I learned that this name was actually an inside joke/reference in Godel,
Escher, Bach:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Etaoin_shrdlu](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Etaoin_shrdlu)

I definitely didn't understand at the time I read, but it's so much easier to
research stuff like this now.

~~~
twirlip
It was also an inside joke in _Mad_ Magazine. I had initially thought it was
Yiddish or a Don Martinism.

------
ejones
Apparently the Saguache Crescent in Colorado is (as of this video in 2016)
still using the linotype, the last known newspaper in the US to do so:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DNa9XRoNRUM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DNa9XRoNRUM)

------
fb03
Everytime I see Etaioin Shrdlu I remember of Nethack (there's a scroll in the
game named like it - the effects are specific to every game since nethack
randomizes everything, tho).

Btw I cannot recommend NetHack enough if you're into Roguelikes.

------
rbanffy
I'm in love with those terminals. Reminds me a bit of the Corona portable PC
or the Epson QX-10, but more elegant and balanced.

And, also, available on multiple sizes. Those things must have been very
expensive.

------
hprotagonist
An absolutely amazing film.

Hot metal typesetting is fantastic stuff.

------
chx
It's 1978, not 1980.

~~~
dang
IMDB has it as 1980. Why do you say 1978? If you're right, we must change it!

[https://www.imdb.com/title/tt2238777/](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt2238777/)

~~~
mulmen
The publication year is cited on the archive.org page. It is indeed 1978.

Maybe some difference between publication and release date?

The description starts with "On July 2, 1978, the last hot lead edition of the
New York Times rolled off the presses."

~~~
dang
Ok, 1978 it is. I wonder why it seemed like 1980?

~~~
mulmen
IMDB definitely says _released_ in 1980 but I can’t find any other reference
to that year.

Everywhere else online says _filmed_ in 1978, including the Times website
itself:
[https://www.nytimes.com/video/insider/100000004687429/farewe...](https://www.nytimes.com/video/insider/100000004687429/farewell-
etaoin-shrdlu.html)

I’m gonna tell myself they filmed it in 1978 and released it to the public in
1980.

------
inetsee
When I saw the title I thought the video was going to be about Terry
Winograd's SHRDLU natural language understanding program
[https://hci.stanford.edu/winograd/shrdlu/](https://hci.stanford.edu/winograd/shrdlu/)

Then I was wondering if there were any videos about the SHRDLU program. There
is one very poor quality screen capture video on youtube showing SHRDLU in
operation. I stumbled on another fairly short video (2:13) of Terry Winograd
discussing his career as a technologist working in AI. I think it's an
interesting alternate view of technology and its effect on people. The video
is here
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oW5la8ZZJCE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oW5la8ZZJCE)

~~~
dang
SHRDLU, sans Etaoin, has been discussed on HN too:

2017
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14351485](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14351485)

2014
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8219409](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8219409)

... though maybe not as much as one might have expected.

