
The Apple Pencil; a lot of semiconductor content in something so small - ingve
http://www.chipworks.com/about-chipworks/overview/blog/the-apple-pencil-a-lot-of-semiconductor-content-something-so-small
======
DiabloD3
To jump on the Wacom/N-trig bandwagon, I also think that the logic should be
in the device.

In the 80s, Wacom developed a technology that is basically a grid of wires
being a transceiver antenna, that does highly accurate positioning of an RFID-
like induction coil (sometimes 2 or 3 in the same pen, one for each set of
functions).

Thats it, the pen is basically RFID tags. No battery, no logic, no weight, the
pen can be shaped nearly like anything (although early ones were a bit bulky).

N-trig developed their own variant of this technology, and Microsoft just
recently bought them, to further integrate their technology into the Surface
line.

The only problem I have with current Surface pens is they require an AAAA
battery, instead of powering it like you would with Wacom's RFID-like signal.

~~~
tenfingers
It's awesome, but if it weren't for patents, we would have pens on every
device with a touch screen now. I use wacom styluses for work, and mind,
they're egregiously fine, but wacom is trying to protect their own interest
with the cintiq series.

It's about time there's some _active_ competition in the field.

The new X1 Yoga, shipping with a pen, makes me think it's actively the _best_
device for notekeeping just besides the Microsoft Surface (and comparatively
cheaper to booth).

I only wonder if they improved on their pen accuracy though.

[https://answers.microsoft.com/en-
us/surface/forum/surfpro3-s...](https://answers.microsoft.com/en-
us/surface/forum/surfpro3-surfhardware/surface-pro-3-pen-
issues/0cd2d6ee-3b22-47f0-8cd7-023da7700966?db=5&auth=1)

I also found the 256 pressure levels offered by n-trig to be generally
insufficient for artistic work (for comparison, even the cheapest wacom tablet
has 2k).

That being said, it's awesome that we're finally getting a _pen_ in these
devices, and not some toy that you need to use with a glove.

~~~
vezycash
The pen on surface pro 4 has 1024 pressure levels instead of 256.

~~~
tenfingers
Do you have direct experience with it? Any improvements in the tracking
quality of slow lines?

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kyriakos
I think the 'logic' and 'electronics' should be in the device rather than the
pen (or pencil in this case). My reasoning is that the pencil should be
something light/cheap/disposable that you can lose and not worry about it.

~~~
pjc50
Given the Thunderbolt connector, Apple probably prefer to put as much as
possible in the pen to increase the profit on replacements.

~~~
stcredzero
Phone plans have gotten to the point where no lock-in is a compelling feature.
What's keeping Apple at the point where people don't mind lock-in?

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creshal
How's it different from active pens that graphics tablets have been using for
some 20 years now?

EDIT: Yes, wacom mostly uses passive pens. But active pens are _not_ new,
Wacom has been shipping them for a few years, too, as has been the
competition. Cf. the pens of the Surface and Yoga notebooks.

~~~
grabcocque
It doesn't appear to work much like a Wacom stylus at all. Wacom styluses are
fairly passive, dumb devices, basically an induction coil in a plastic case.

This appears to be a rechargeable, active-sensing device.

I don't think this is unintentional. iPad Pro and Apple Pencil is Apple's
warning to Wacom: we are coming for you.

~~~
glasz
> I don't think this is unintentional. iPad Pro and Apple Pencil is Apple's
> warning to Wacom: we are coming for you.

spot on. i've heard that designers at apple are so fed up with the crap that
is any wacom tablet because wacom doesn't innovate in any way anymore. their
devices are clunky, ugly pieces of plastic. if not for public release, they'd
be making the pro/pencil for their own.

let's see what wacom does, now.

~~~
LazyAssasin
Yep. I bought one for my wife – an illustrator. I enjoyed it so much I bought
one for me (UX/front end dev) and am Craigslist-ing our Wacom Cintiq and
Intuos. The Cintiq lag is awful, while the disassociation between screen and
tablet of the Intuos was always “best of a bad solution”. Personally, I always
found the “give” in Wacom’s styli to accommodate pressure sensitivity too much
for my liking, but my medium of preference was always lead holders; I suspect
those who prefer painting, pastel or other softer medium might have the
opposite opinion.

It’s not perfect, there’s still some lag in different apps. Wacom also had a
slightly better “tooth” on the drawing surface. The omission of an “eraser”
can be annoying, though I would imagine less so for artists who wouldn’t use
the eraser on a drawing implement anyway. The various buttons on both the
Wacom tablet and the pen were also really helpful, though a bit overwhelming.
Wacom also has a variety of nibs for different feeling brushes. My TL;DR the
Wacom is a more productive and perhaps more capable tool, but the iPad Pro +
Pencil combination is the closest any technology has come to replicating paper
& pencil.

When you compare the costs $799 for the cheapest 13" Wacom Cintiq vs $898 for
the iPad Pro + Pencil it’s going to be a no-brainer for a lot of artists who
aren’t deeply entrenched in a Wacom workflow.

------
musesum
Will be curious to see how many levels of pressure. Wacom Intuos pro claims
2048 levels. Dynamic range is important. I've spent several thousand hours
writing visual synths on top of various Wacom tablets, which feels amazing!
Have only had a few hours with Apple Pencil, but feels promising.

Tilt is also very expressive. Imagine a joystick with 5 degrees of freedom.
Couple that visual targets on the pad to instantly change contexts.

Wacom tablet also supports multiple stylus's, in which case you have two
semantically assignable 5dof joysticks. I don't know if multiple Apple Pencils
are supported.

~~~
archagon
I noticed that pushing down too hard with the Pencil causes distortion in one
spot of my iPad's screen, presumably where a chip is just a little too close
to the surface. So it's probably not a good idea to press (nearly) as hard as
you could a Wacom stylus.

As an aside, what kinds of visual synths have you worked on? I just added
(basic) Pencil support to my iPad sequencer[1] and it works quite well! (With
a few caveats[2]...)

[1]: [http://composerssketchpad.com](http://composerssketchpad.com)

[2]: [http://beta-blog.archagon.net/2015/12/05/ipad-pro-plus-
penci...](http://beta-blog.archagon.net/2015/12/05/ipad-pro-plus-pencil-slow-
motion-bug/)

~~~
musesum
Looks pretty cool. Will check it out. Oddly, I have an App that crashes only
on the iPad Pro, so I cannot return the favor. :(

Have you posted on stack overflow? I have a question, but that may be a better
place to ask.

Here's is my app, circa 2005:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXlkzZubHnM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXlkzZubHnM)
I used to VJ a lot. Here's the app in action at Thump Radio, circa 2001 (for a
clear view, goto 0:40 sec):
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5W1jmovV5SM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5W1jmovV5SM)

EDIT "only"

~~~
archagon
Oh, I see! I didn't realize that "visual synths" were a thing — I thought
there was a musical component to it. That's fascinating! Are you planning to
release something like that for the iPad Pro?

"Have you posted on stack overflow" — do you mean regarding my slow motion
issue?

~~~
musesum
>> "Have you posted on stack overflow" — do you mean regarding my slow motion
issue?

Yes. Was wondering if you tried capturing UITouches on a nil view to get
global coordinates. Just a stab in the dark, since I'm fully occupied on an
Apple Watch project.

> Are you planning to release something like that for the iPad Pro?

Short answer is Yes! I'm starting from the ground up by rewriting the
underlying functional ontology, called Tr3, which will be open sourced under
MIT license.

------
amelius
So what is the difference, functionality-wise, between an Apple Pencil and a
Wacom Stylus?

~~~
dragontamer
The Wacom Stylus works on PC and Mac OSX Pro, and therefore has access to
actual software.

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justin66
"Design wins." Who talks like that? Oh, a "patent and technology partner."

