
Homeschoolers' setback sends shock waves through state - gibsonf1
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/03/07/MNJDVF0F1.DTL
======
delackner
The money quote is that one of the explicit purposes of public school is to
indoctrinate our children to be patriotic and to defend the nation. That is
nationalism folks, the movement that helped cause most of the wars in the last
century. The movement that is right now causing riots in Serbia.

It may not sound like such a huge thing, but even in second grade I remember
refusing to say the pledge of allegiance, despite my parents never pushing any
kind of left OR right wing ideology on me.

~~~
noonespecial
I remember in 4th grade or so, the pledge started to sound a little spooky to
me as well.

I think home schooling is an important right because it's the last, best
defense against a total fail in the public school system. It also makes it
possible for middle and lower class children to have private education rather
than having that option end up a further luxury for just the rich.

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andreyf
Woah! Before bashing and mindlessly reinforcing each other's libertarian
ideals, let's all back up and Google the background one second. (don't get me
wrong: I'm a big proponent of home schooling, I'll probably be home schooling
my kids (probably while teaching in public schools at the time (go figure)))

Original ruling: <http://www.courtinfo.ca.gov/opinions/documents/B192878.PDF>

Alternate explanation of original ruling:
<http://ace.mu.nu/archives/257230.php#257230>

The "money quote", as someone called it, is cited, and that's how law works -
it repeats precedent. If you follow the precedent, it doesn't end in '61. The
'61 case cites a 1938 case, which says:

"The legislature has conferred upon school boards broad plenary powers to make
all reasonable regulations that will in the reasonable exercise of judgment
promote the efficiency of the school system in performing public welfare
duties, which are limited not merely to the development of the mind in
academic fields, but the sphere of which is much broader and extends to those
subjects which will tend to [12 Cal.2d 92] develop and quicken the civic
conscience in ways of attachment for home and country."

See here:
[http://www.claralaw.cpda.org/om_isapi.dll?infobase=cases2.nf...](http://www.claralaw.cpda.org/om_isapi.dll?infobase=cases2.nfo&jump=12%20Cal.2d%2092&softpage=Document_Case)

That was written in 1938. And see that "12 Cal.2d 92"? That's a citation to a
yet earlier case. In other words this idea has been around for almost a
century, and there is nothing new or newly-frightening about it. It was cited
because the incompetent defense had a really backwards argument about what was
going on at home. Legal action came around when one of the eight children
reported "physical and emotional mistreatment". SFGate only reported the last
word.

So here's my take on what happened: libertarian think tank intern scans legal
briefs for quotes he can write a story around to rile people up. They find a
resolution with a quote that uses scary 60's cold-war language to describe an
idea that's been around for at least 80 years. Voila! That's our reality-hook!
The rest is already in people's minds, so they won't double check it... now
let's just write the story to reinforce the ideas we are promoting. There's
always lazy journalists who will publish a paper around this, and controversy
will only bring more readers to the paper, so who cares if it's true, as long
as it "riles people up"? Lew Rockwell jumps all over it, of course:

<http://www.lewrockwell.com/greenhut/greenhut52.html>

That's it! They're taking away our guns! To arms! To arms!

Oh no! They're going to ban abortions everywhere!

Oh dear! They're going to take away our children for indoctrination!

Don't get me wrong, I completely support Roe v. Wade, but I think it's
despicable how those who support it have no idea why people oppose it.

~~~
curi
Please don't hold all libertarians accountable for Lew Rockwell. Some of us
are "classical liberals" in the style of the Enlightenment. The libertarian
movement is far from a perfect fit, but it's closer than the other parties.

~~~
dfranke
You're right, it's definitely not. If you consider yourself a classical
liberal, you probably shouldn't call yourself a libertarian at all, at least
not when speaking to educated libertarians. While the two schools share a lot
in common, their philosophical underpinnings are quite different: self-
ownership versus "life, liberty, and property". In today's climate it makes
perfect sense that the two groups should be political allies, but they
shouldn't be conflated.

~~~
curi
libertarians are mostly very pro-free-market, and pro-small-government, as am
I. I like Rand and Hayek. I can communicate these things better with the word
'libertarian' than with the word 'liberal' which few people understand in the
way I'd mean it. I'm closer to right-wing than left-wing, by present day
American standards. meh. avoiding labels requires a lot more words.

PS I'd upvote you if I could vote.

~~~
dfranke
I've never quite understood people's aversion to being labeled. I'm happy to
be labeled as a Rothbardian. My political thinking basically conforms to the
framework laid out in _The Ethics of Liberty_. The fact that I accept the
label doesn't mean that I accept every word that Rothbard ever wrote as
gospel. I wouldn't expect any reasonable person to infer that I do, and nobody
(reasonable or otherwise) has ever confronted me with such an accusation.
Labels are just macros, and as such they're useful.

~~~
curi
well didn't you basically just tell me to avoid the label libertarian because
it's too misleading? i don't entirely agree, but thought you had a point. it
is misleading. so are all the others. the only half-decent ones for me are
pretty specific like Popperian.

~~~
dfranke
I was just advising you to avoid the _wrong_ label, not to avoid them
altogether.

~~~
curi
But I don't think libertarian is the wrong label (no worse than others). if
"classical liberal" makes you think it is, maybe _that_ is the wrong label?

~~~
dfranke
I think libertarian is the wrong label, and classical liberal perhaps but not
necessarily the correct one, if you identify more closely with Thomas
Jefferson than with Robert Nozick.

~~~
curi
I don't know early American philosophers very well offhand. But wikipedia says
Jefferson sympathized with the French. The dates are around the time of the
French Revolution. So, my guess is I dislike him. The French Revolution was
really awful and revolutions in general are bad.

~~~
dfranke
Bear in mind that the French Revolution began as something very different than
what it became. Thomas Paine, arguably the most libertarian of any of the
founding fathers, was one of the French Revolution's most ardent American
supporters in its early days. After the revolution got hijacked by the
Jacobins, Paine ended up in a French prison.

If you'd like, substitute Locke for Jefferson.

~~~
curi
Thomas Paine I know about. I read his book about the French Revolution -- the
reply to Burke. It's really bad stuff. He doesn't understand Burke at all,
makes bad arguments carelessly, and throws in lots of insults. (I realize I'm
being insulting. Besides the low quality thinking he made excuses for massive
bloodshed as well as glorifying some of it. And I have detailed notes with
which I could back this up.)

~~~
dfranke
Interesting. If you sympathize with Burke then I have no idea where to place
you. He's pretty much universally reviled by every modern school of thought
that I'm familiar with.

Anyhow, we're quickly veering away from the topic and toward the right margin.
We should probably take this to email. My email address is on the page linked
in my profile.

------
patrickg-zill
The pleasure of the teacher's union shows it is not about making sure children
are educated, but about keeping and retaining political power.

~~~
cstejerean
You are correct. From the article:

Heimov said her organization's chief concern was not the quality of the
children's education, but their "being in a place daily where they would be
observed by people who had a duty to ensure their ongoing safety."

------
Spyckie
Combine this with the recent article on how terribly wrong math is taught in
school and we have quite a grim outlook of our nation's future.

