

Google TV relaunches with Android Market - tilt
http://gigaom.com/2011/10/28/google-tv-relaunch/

======
Pewpewarrows
Now things are going to get interesting. Games distributed to the Google TV
via the Android Market, using an existing Android-powered smartphone or tablet
as a controller. Hell, developers have already figured out ways to get the Wii
remotes and other console controllers to work with Android.

If Google plays their cards right, especially with some more powerful hardware
in their next iterations, they could accidentally become the next big
contender in the Console Wars. If nothing else the Wii proved that the casual,
indy market was a completely untapped niche that exploded overnight. The
machine basically printed money for Nintendo for the past few years.

~~~
nextparadigms
Actually, Google TV 2.0 has native support for game controllers and USB host,
too. They could really push Android/Google TV into becoming a "console
platform", too. They could use the same strategy they've used against the
iPhone to beat Xbox, PS3 and Wii - just get everyone to make TV's and set top
boxes with high-performance ARM chips.

Everything is laid out for them. They just need to act on it. So far I don't
see them promoting it too hard, which is a shame, because Apple will probably
hype it up hard when they launch Apple TV with iOS apps and games, and then
everyone will think Google is playing catch-up again.

What's sort of ironic, is that Google "TV" might actually be a lot more
successful as a console platform than a "TV" platform, meaning that there
would be a lot more customers buying it for the "console" promise, than for
the "improving TV experience" promise. If they were smart, they would take
full advantage of that, get millions of units in people's homes, and _then_
figure out the TV part.

~~~
mikeryan
_They could really push Android/Google TV into becoming a "console platform",
too_

This strategy can be problematic. Google and their hardware partners will have
to choose if its going to compete with consoles on the high-end or with
cheaper internet boxes (Boxee/Roku) on the low end. Currently its price point
(when it was first launched) is the same as the Xbox and PS3 and I have no
idea why you'd get a GoogleTV box instead of an Xbox. If they can get down to
$200 they'd be closer to Boxee but this wouldn't be a "console gaming"
machine.

Remember the Consoles (Xbox/PS3 even Wii) are all subsidized platforms and
sometimes the consoles themselves are actually sold at a loss since
MS/Sony/Nintendo can make up the difference with game license fees. So its not
as simple as you lay out.

~~~
nextparadigms
I don't think Google TV set top boxes should be higher than $150 anyway. They
can probably make it for $100, too, and it might be possible if Apple is going
to put an A5 in their Apple TV, while keeping the price.

Android already has quite a few console-like games, that to be honest would be
played a lot better with a gamepad than on a touch screen. I'm sure it would
open up another market at the $100-$150 price, and disrupt all the other
consoles. It doesn't have to compete with them at the "high-end" on
performance.

All I'm saying is that they shouldn't treat it as an afterthought, when it
will still use more or less the same hardware that is going into a set-top
box. They just need to show intent and support it, and get developers to
modify their phone/tablet games for TV. There's a difference between letting
it happen by itself, which Google tends to do in general (unfortunately), and
announcing it all at launch, like Apple does, and with many partners.

~~~
mikeryan
Without subsidizing the price they can't sell GoogleTV boxes for $150 bucks
they'd be losing money. Not with any decent sort of processing power. Remember
all those Android smart phones out there are subsidized by contracts. Apple's
box is subsidized by iTunes sales.

I'm telling you a lot of those console like games on Android smart phones
aren't going to work on a GoogleTV with a $150 price point.

EDIT: I'm not saying the BOM on the boxes are over $150 but total costs
involved (marketing/manufacturing/support) would run at a loss. Or even that
Apple is selling their box at a loss but the platform is subsidized.

~~~
Pewpewarrows
Really? The smartphone bill of sales comes out to about $200 per device. After
you take out the battery, baseband, transceiver, GPS, gyroscope, display, and
touch-screen components, that price gets slashed in half to around $100.
Granted there are a lot of other costs to associate with it, such as
additional output and input controllers, marketing, distribution, and profit
margin. But still, it's not out of the realm of possibilities to see the new
models go for $150-$200.

~~~
mikeryan
There's not a lot of CE manufacturers selling devices with a $100 BOM for
$150-$200. Those $200 Smartphones (iPhone 4S is ~$189) retail for $600
assuming the same markup even with your number of $100 your looking at a $400
box. Boxee's box is $200 bucks and is pretty decent so you have to assume a
$200 box is possible, but GoogleTV is a significant step up in performance and
hardware features to Boxee.

------
martythemaniak
Doubling down on GoogleTV is exactly what they should be doing and I think the
device has great potential with the Market.

The Aljazeera and Netflix apps are already a good way to watch stuff on
Android, so I'd imagine a small collection of good quality apps will make this
a very attractive platform.

~~~
voidfiles
I love it too. After years of harassing wife with different tv add on boxes,
plain Linux, apple tv, boxee, I came home to find her just using the thig with
no input from my self. She just got it. That is why Google TV is so awesome.

------
rmrm
I like my Google TV, but there was room for massive improvement literally
everywhere -- performance, UI, features. I hope they really hit on a lot of
it.

------
ethank
The best thing about GoogleTV is that it has HDMI passthrough, so for the most
part you don't have to use it unless you really, really need it.

The only time we use it on our set (we have the Logitech Revue) is for Amazon
VOD.

I'll upgrade to the new firmware, but....that keyboard as an HID device for a
television is such a pain I can't see this ending well.

~~~
ConstantineXVI
I never use the keyboard. The phone (Android/iOS) app is solid.

~~~
justinchen
It's great except for 2 annoyances: (1) the d-pad just doesn't feel natural to
me still, (2) the constant crashing of the app and google TV when connections
don't establish correctly. That being said, I use both the iPhone and android
tablet versions all the time.

------
nextparadigms
They really need to think about how to improve interaction with it. Virtual
apps? Voice commands? Kinect-like actions? Pretty much any of those is better
than a full blown keyboard for controlling it in my opinion. And why do they
still have a mouse pointer in there for crying out loud??

As for the virtual apps, it might be best to use a complete interface inside
the phone or tablet, rather than a simple "remote app". Stop replicating stuff
from other paradigms. Just take advantage of the current paradigm you're
working with.

My idea would be to show the complete Google TV interface inside an app on
your Android phone, and control it from there. When you touch an element on
the phone, it should on the TV. I think that would be even faster than using a
"remote app", which means you still have to go from one app to another until
you reach your target, rather than simply selecting it on the phone.

~~~
lftl
That's exactly what I've wanted to build. I haven't peaked inside the API
enough to see if anything close is even remotely possible, but the absolute
best feature of Google TV is using my phone as the remote. The current remote
app sucks, and it's still so much nicer of a way to control my TV. If
something can be built to have really solid integration between a phone/tablet
and the TV it would really make a phenomenal experience.

------
lukin0110
I really like the on going developments around Google TV, Apple TV, Netflix,
... for now the world is not ready yet for such services but will be in a few
years. After the mobile, the next battle will be TV.

------
scottmp10
GoogleTV blog post:

[http://googletv.blogspot.com/2011/10/update-on-google-
tv.htm...](http://googletv.blogspot.com/2011/10/update-on-google-tv.html)

------
axiomotion
So... can Google TV finally catalog what I have on my HD and stream it to my
TV?

------
jonhendry
Drat. Apple could have done that first. Kudos to Google for taking that step.

~~~
nextparadigms
They could've done it much earlier, too, if only they didn't waste all that
time porting both Android and the Dalvik VM to x86. They should've used ARM
from day one. Hoping there will be some Tegra 3-based set top boxes launching
with Google TV 2.0.

------
VikingCoder
Many people think GoogleTV is pointless, because they can't imagine throwing
away their current TV (or blu-ray, or DVR) to buy one.

That's not the point.

The point is that it's a good feature to have, and soon enough it will be
silly for you to buy a TV that can't do those same tricks.

It's like a TV remote on old TVs. You probably wouldn't throw away your old TV
just because it didn't have a remote. But when you bought your next TV for
whatever reason, you probably wanted the one with the remote.

------
rburhum
From the comments, I must be the only one that thinks that adding new features
to something that is already a complete mess, is just a terrible idea. Google
TV is not a real consumer product. It sucks big time. I cannot even gift it to
my parents because they (as well as I) dont have a cable box and most (all??)
Google TVs use HDMI (reminder: my cable provider doesnt have an HDMI cable
coming out of the wall).

So what am I supposed to use this junk for?

\- Browsing the web? I guess that is what my cursor and the big ass keyboard
on my lap is for.

\- Netflix/Vudu whatever other streaming service? My PS3,Wii XBOX 360 do that
already.

\- Games? That crap doesnt even have decent accelerated hardware support, and
did I mention that I have a PS3, Wii and XBOX 360? Any of those devices (which
by the way are mostly at the same price point) can do 1000 times better.

\- Apps? I like my apps in my tablet or phone. Since I usually have to read to
use them and it is a horrible experience to read anything on a TV screen.

I know I am going to get downvoted like crazy, but I dont care at all about my
HN score.

Face reality - Google TV is a piece of junk that does several things - and it
sucks at all of them.

~~~
patrickaljord
> I know I am going to get downvoted like crazy, but I dont care at all about
> my HN score.

I downvoted you because this kind of baiting is extremely annoying and is the
kind of thing I would expect from reddit but not HN. It also goes against the
HN guidelines:

<http://ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html>

> Resist complaining about being downmodded. It never does any good, and it
> makes boring reading.

> Please don't bait other users by inviting them to downmod you.

