
Ask HN: What should I do if I feel depressed in my job? - nojvek
I work at one of the world&#x27;s largest software companies. I feel like I am a code monkey with no future of promotion or compensation. Just churning code in and out. I have a family and the job pays the bills. Wife doesn&#x27;t quite work yet. I can&#x27;t quite quit or switch companies, as I am on an L1 visa.<p>I feel I am spinning wheels and feel low most days.
======
the_economist
The following things are proven to make you happier (and smarter!). I try to
do all of them.

1) Exercise for at least 60 minutes/day. I recommend getting a pedometer and
walking 12,000 steps/day, plus working out with weights 2-4 times/week 2)
Gratitude -- try to spend time every day thinking about the things you are
grateful for 3) Meditation -- 10 minutes/day. It works. Studies prove it! 4)
Relationship with the sun -- try to get outside at noon every day 5) Eat an
anti inflammatory diet. Inflammation is heavily correlated with depression. 6)
Try to do something nice for at least one person every day. 7) Research sleep
quality and follow all the best practices. 8) Take a Vitamin D supplement,
just in case :)

If you do all those things, you'll probably find yourself a lot happier at
your job!

~~~
griffinmahon
I know that diet is important, but could you specify about "anti-
inflammatory"? Just interested, thanks!

~~~
mendelevium
Inflammation is linked to depression
[http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/288715.php](http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/288715.php)

14 Foods That Fight Inflammation
[http://www.health.com/health/gallery/0,,20705881,00.html](http://www.health.com/health/gallery/0,,20705881,00.html)

------
AdeptusAquinas
I went through a dark phase like this a while ago. Similar situation, with a
mortgage that effectively trapped me at my job. I eventually figured out
though that my depression was linked to the frustration with the pointlessness
of the job - you are not exactly doing anything meaningful when each day is
building pointless features into monolithic intranets for companies and
government departments who are motivated more by using up budget than real
needs :)

Once I realised that it was, for lack of a better term, 'caring' for work that
shouldn't really be cared for that was the problem, I got much happier. Became
very laissez-faire, committed only to doing a good job and not associating
myself with the company. Don't be loyal, just be professional in other words,
and live for the time when you are not at work.

Seems to be working for me so far. My work and mood has improved, which leads
to better things both at work and home.

~~~
efewf
Good advice. The only issue I see is that I might find myself unmotivated to
progress in my career. If I become laissez-faire, I might not go for the
promotion.

Have you had this be an issue?

~~~
drblast
Progress, the way you think about it, is defined externally. It's drilled into
us that we have to get good grades, get into a good school, get the best job,
keep working and moving up, up, up.

Even if you do those things perfectly it probably won't make you happy because
you're letting someone else define what success and progress is for you. And
there will always be more to achieve and a higher level to climb.

If the progress treadmill is meaningful to you, power to you. Otherwise, you
have to find your own meaning. When you do your pointless job won't seem so
pointless.

I make a good salary at a large software company and I have an amazing family
and friends. Every day I feel like I'm growing as a human being in my
relationships. My job pays the bills and my family is comfortable. We drive
old cars and live fairly frugally. I'm much happier now than I ever was when I
was trying to make progress according to someone else's rules.

Also, if your job is boring, do the hell out of that job. One of the happiest
people I've ever met served pizza and did it better than anyone I'd ever seen;
she remembered every customer's name, made all the kids laugh, and had a good
thing to say to everyone she met.

There's a lot of satisfaction to be had from taking something that doesn't
matter and making it matter.

------
gxs
Depression is a word that gets thrown around quite casually.

If you think you are clinically depressed, seek the advice of a professional
as it only gets worse. The usual things apply here: make sure you sleep well
(not too little or too much), eat relatively healthy, and exercise plenty).
Spend time with friends.

If you're "just" going through a rough patch and are unsatisfied with work,
then rest assured this is just part of being a professional. Some days I hate
my job, other days I feel like the most fortunate person in the world. The
professional part is that I show up regardless of how I am feeling and always
deliver the best work I can.

If you find yourself having more bad days than good days, then maybe it's time
for a change. Start with an easy change- maybe ask to be put on a different
project (ask in a tactful way) or team. Then if it still doesn't get better
after a meaningful amount of time (6 months?) then you probably need a bigger
change of scenery and should hunt for a new job.

------
zem
caveat: the following advice works very well for me; it might not for everyone

the main idea is, do not tie your identity or sense of self-worth to your job.
be very clear that your job is what you do to get enough money to support your
"real" life, and concentrate on making the rest of your time enjoyable. the
side project is a good start, but also exercise more, take up some non-tech-
related hobby (maybe one you can share with your wife), take short courses in
random, interesting skills (e.g. cooking), develop an active community of
friends (host dinners, board game nights, regular "check out a new restaurant"
outings, walking tours of interesting neighbourhoods, etc.)

that takes care of the life side. as for your career, you might be stuck in a
rut right now due to visa restrictions, but that won't always be the case.
when it isn't, will you be prepared to interview for a better job? if you
don't feel so, then why not? and if you can identify the reasons you might
fall short, it's well worth putting in some time building up your skill set,
so that as soon as you are able to move jobs, you are also prepared to do so.

~~~
bbarn
Surprised I had to scroll down this far to find this comment. I came to
essentially say the same thing. You don't have to love your job. It's great
when you can, but sometimes, it's worth just looking at it for what it is -
the means to support your family, and focus on friends/interests outside of
work. Often I see "Start a side project", and while that can be a worthy
endeavor, it might just make you feel like you work all day, then work all
night, and hurt those relationships at home.

Find happiness in your life outside of what you do, and some day that will
force itself into your career, even if it has to do it without your knowledge.
Happier people interview better, look healthier, and generally find a way to
do things better. Be careful tagging it with "Depression", unless you've shown
symptoms of clinical depression throughout your life, and likely if it is
clinical, this won't be the first time, and your job isn't the cause. If it IS
clinical, then seek help.

------
mrcold
Welcome to the club. We don't have free drinks or anything. Only endless
depression and no will to continue.

But seriously, things are fucked and it's only getting worse. I'm in the same
shoes and I'm trying a startup in my spare time. Plus, the guy running our
project decided to quit and leave me alone with a monster made out of
spaghetti code. Just finished updating my resume, hoping I won't need to use
it.

Don't have any advice that could help. Because the problem is pure greed.
Everybody is acting like a vicious greedy fuck, chasing money like there's no
tomorrow. Life is now a river of shit and we're all just floating on the
surface, waiting for an island or something. People don't seem to care about
it either. Complacency is everywhere. Can't say I blame them.

Anyway, the west is crumbling. Go to a cheaper country. With an IT job you
will have enough.

~~~
EC1
The fuck? We're programmers. We have the _easiest_ lives of the working class.
I'm literally sitting here in my underwear, unshaven, drinking a beer, making
stupid money for coding objectively pointless crap much like 99% of us. It's
absurd. Lighten up.

~~~
mrcold
I would be happy too if I was a freelancer working from home. Try cutting your
income in half and going every day to an office to answer to a manager dumber
than you. See how much you like it then.

~~~
EC1
I hated it and I quit, this was two weeks ago and I'm actually sort of
struggling for income lol. I have like two months to make this work. But
simply having that option sit in the back of my head made it easy enough to go
to work, because I knew that if it got bad enough I can just get up and leave.

~~~
johnchristopher
So in one hour you went from making stupid money to struggling for income.

~~~
EC1
Once this contract runs out theres no guarantee of a next one ;)

------
ghettoCoder
If you truly think it's depression then please see someone about that. Don't
mess around. If you're just feeling blue and down about your current station
in life and powerlessness to resolve it at the moment then ...

Not to be snarky, but congratulations, you've arrived at the prerequisite
state before figuring out what you really want to do. Use this time to plan.
Do something. Anything.

And get a hobby you enjoy. Seriously. You need to feel personal growth and
progress. Work or hobby. It's all the same.

------
proee
You need to spend some time counseling yourself...

1\. Go to a coffee shop or somewhere fun and start a list asking yourself
"what do I REALLY want to achieve in my life?" (financial freedom, promotion
within a company, launch a startup, run a marathon, etc.)

2\. Wake up each day and start working toward achieving your goals.

3\. If you're still not happy, then you need to re-evaluate your personal
goals.

4\. If you don't feel like you're making progress toward your goals, then
maybe you're not taking enough risk.

If you feel stuck in your current position, then start networking with other
groups inside the company and express your desire to grow your career. Many
companies allow you to transition between groups.

------
peterwwillis
No offense, but you probably are a code monkey, and that's not necessarily a
bad thing. You may just need to reorient your world view.

Consider a homeless person. If they had your job and your paycheck, they would
be excited for the opportunity to afford shelter, food, and the stability that
comes from a salary job. Looking back at living on the street, hobbling soaked
wet through intersections begging for change, your job is a veritable dream
come true.

What's the difference between you and the homeless person? Perspective.

Now consider the CEO of your company. He probably makes tens of millions a
year. But do you think his first gig at a corporation was a starting salary
with seven figures? Heck no; he probably had a boring job with a crappy boss.
Yet it seems that his situation changed along with his fortunes.

What's the difference between you and the CEO? Time.

Now, i'm not saying you should just suck it up and deal with your lot in life.
What I am saying is that the depression you feel now is a by-product of your
perspective being locked at looking at your situation as a disadvantage, and
the lack of vision of a better future. It's possible to reorient the way you
look at your situation to be happier with where you are, and be happy about
how much better it can get with time.

Part of this improved mental state requires introspection, mindful awareness,
and emotional growth. You can read various books or take workshops to help
with this. It's also useful to find outlets for your restless mind and body,
such as exercise, art, music, reading, etc. There's also growth to be had by
being active with your family members [though I don't have any useful examples
as i'm single].

Finally, therapy works, and I highly recommend talking to someone, both about
your job and personal life. Personal growth in general will help you
understand why you feel the way you do and how to work towards a better
situation.

Best of luck to you!

------
atlantic
I was in the same kind of situation as you 5 years ago. Decided to resign,
sell my apartment, and move back to my country of origin, with a wife and
kids, and no prospects of work. Just a leap in the dark. Went through a rough
patch, eventually found enough remote work to make a living, with plenty of
time to spare for the family. What can I say? Follow your heart.

------
DanBC
Feeling low at work or because of work really sucks. I am sorry to hear you're
going through a rough patch. There's some good news: you have recognised this,
and you want to change things.

In England: your employer has a duty to protect you from harm in the
workplace. This includes stress, anxiety or depression. Your employer may have
an occupational health telephone helpline. Some people say they don't trust
employer provided helplines. You could go private: BACP are reputable
accreditors for psychological therapies. Or you can use NHS services: do a
websearch for your county name and words like "talking therapy" or maybe
"cbt". These should take self-referral, but if not you go to your GP and ask
for a talking therapy.

Early intervention is important: recovery is quicker and stronger if
intervention is early and good.

There are also self-guided systems if you don't want to see anyone. Search for
"books on prescription" to see curated lists of sensible books. "Mind Over
Mood" is one that's frequently recommended.

There's an Austrailian website:
[https://moodgym.anu.edu.au/](https://moodgym.anu.edu.au/)

I recently spoke to about 50 different local employers about mental illness
and work and they were all keen to do the right thing and to learn about
mental health. So if you recognise something that would improve things for you
at work it might be worth just having a chat with them.

Finally: if you find things getting worse it might be worthwhile to create a
"rainy day action plan". This would be a list of things that would trigger you
into going to see your GP. For example, if you start having suicidal thoughts
you should go and see someone. The rainy day action plan is normally used with
severe enduring mental illness and can cover Advanced Directives, but they're
useful for mild to moderate illness too.

------
nathell
1\. Seek professional help if you can afford it. I'm not sure how public
funding of psychological counselling / psychotherapy works in the US, but if
money is an issue, try to find a local support group. Or start one, if you
feel up to the task.

2\. Have an honest conversation with your manager. If you have a problem, it's
no use swiping it under the carpet and hoping it will just go away on its own.
Tell the manager how you feel and what impact this feeling has on your day-to-
day job. If you have already applied for help (see above), mention it. This
way you are sending a positive message that you are aware of the problem and
proactively working towards fixing it. Try to be open, honest, and speak in
terms of how to improve the state of affairs, rather than complaining how bad
it is. Try to work together with your manager to seek a solution.

It is natural to be afraid of this conversation. Work it through in your head.
You may feel that your manager is not understanding enough. If in doubt, try
to talk to a colleague first. Alternatively, you might find someone else in
senior management whom you consider more approachable.

3\. Exercise, meditate, sleep and eat well. Others have already mentioned the
importance of this.

------
PublicEnemy111
I'm still early in my career, but my impression is that you can't code
forever. At some point, you have to move into the business side of things in
order to advance. I've heard rumors that there is a programmer making $3
million at Google, but the rest of us have to move into management to advance
our careers.

------
latj
EXERCISE.

Study something with the goal of mastering it.

Get involved in a non-profit that does something you think makes the world a
better place.

Teach your kids to grow up and live their life knowing that "the normal way"
(go to school for 20 years, then sit in office majority of week days until you
die) to live life isnt the only way to live life.

------
grecy
How long will you be on the L1 visa?

Make a plan for what you'll do when you are no longer on that visa and free to
get a job elsewhere, then start planning and preparing for that future.

It will change the color of your days to know you're doing it with an end-goal
in mind and you're not "stuck here forever".

------
vertis
Along with all the other suggestions:

\- Go a little bit rogue. Focus on what you think it's important for the
company/team to be doing regardless of what "smarter" people are telling you
to do.

\- Find non-tech people within the company and solve their problems. Write
small in-house applications to make their lives easier.

\- Take time to learn something new, and then share what you've learned with
your team with a tech talk. e.g: Machine Learning, Continuous Delivery,
Functional Programming

\- Find someone either inside or outside the company to mentor: I like to
start with the RailsGirls guides and expand out from there.

------
nojvek
Thanks guys. I definitely will start a side project and start working out.

------
tunesmith
Assuming this isn't clinical depression (others have advice on that), I'd
recommend to take a close look at what your goals are. Basic philosophy: Don't
make your happiness dependent on things you can't control. In a large company,
there are going to be a lot of things you can't control. Make your happiness
dependent on things you can control, like how you spend your free time, how
good a job you do at the stuff you do, and other things you individually can
do to improve your future career mobility.

------
someotherdb
The first step is a pen and paper. Sit down and think about a step-by-step
achievable plan to change the situation. Actually committing small but real
steps and figuring out realistic incremental changes will make it real in all
senses.

First thing on the list might be a skills inventory - what would you like to
be doing? Can you then start a small project to start learning or developing
the skill?

A walk each day - rain, wind, sun or snow - is very important. Away from the
office, you will get time to think about positive things, and how you work
towards them.

I am sure you don't, but try not to portion any blame on the wife as she is
not yet working. I am saying this as a witness to a friend who did the same
when he felt trapped and alone in his work situation. One day, you may make a
big pivot in life, and your wife will be working and supporting you whilst you
do.

Selfish note - the company survived before you and will survive after you.
Therefore do what work is required, but if you find yourself with free time
then pick up things loosely related to your job, that give you a chance to
learn new skills on their dime and their time.

If you are truly experiencing depression rather than a solid realisation that
life in the big corps can suck royally, then you do need to find someone
qualified to sit with you and address that specifically. But doing so should
not stop the daily walks or the small step situation improvement plan.

Good luck.

------
edoceo
I've been coding for 20+ years; for a while I felt like it was just spinngin
wheels. Starting my own project has improved my passion for the code I write
but for just feeling better in general the excercise is the biggest deal.

Some times new employees seem to have this non-enthuastic drive. I know they
don't have an excercise regimen.

I take meetings with the team now with a hackey-sack. It's easy but gets the
blood moving. 15m of hack, 2x or 3x a day can make a huge difference in your
emotions.

------
jes
There are many good comments on this thread, so I hope that you consider them
carefully.

One point I'd like to add is this. Try to find small things that you can start
and finish in a reasonable amount of time. Maybe something you can do in an
hour, as against, starting yet another task that will take days or weeks to
finish.

In my experience, actually finishing tasks that have some value to me give me
a little hit of dopamine or some other brain chemical, and that often improves
my mood.

I wish you the best.

------
plikan13
It's funny how many people recommend exercise or meditation as if this is
going to make you forget that you hate your job. If anything, meditation is
only going to make this more clear. Hating your job is a pretty big problem
that you will only solve by changing the circumstances of your employment. You
don't owe anybody unhappiness, not even your wife or kids.

------
nazgul
Definitely see a professional. They are the only ones that can tell how
serious your depression is and recommend actual therapies for it.

------
moneytide
I was a warehouse worker at Amazon for a year and I made sure I sweat every
day there. I would challenge myself to move product quicker and avoid forklift
duty (standing in place). Requesting the labor intensive duties allowed me to
use the chemical energy (food) I was inputting instead of it all going into
storage from sitting in a chair all day.

After a while, I started feeling depressed. It was a combination of the
monotony and a lack of purpose, and it wouldn't help when I would encounter
the occasional order of cat toys or extremely overpriced items that could have
been purchased at a dollar store for 400% less. I was enjoying the constant
movement but there was no pride in my work. Its not like building a structure
where you can witness the fruits of your toil. Because everyday was
predictable and simple, I would say that I felt that my mental facilities were
deteriorating at an accelerated rate which prompted my abrupt leave (without a
notice).

Sometimes I would research the internal Wiki for what the AWS engineers were
saying to each other. It was interesting, but I'm sure I was only doing it
because I knew they made more money than me. This is where I went wrong
because comparing yourself to someone else is an inefficient use of your
brains resources.

My duties were simple and I felt like a grunt but I've always been in shape
and never get sick. I'm fundamentally opposed to the idea of gyms because
you're paying a group of people to make sure theres a place with air
conditioning where you can pick up iron and put it back down in the same
place. Or run in place like a hamster (some places have tracks, I know, but
round and round it goes). I understand that sometimes weather will prevent an
outdoor run or hike, but just do something. Rearrange the house. Build
something with heavy parts. Run up your stairs every time you use them. Theres
always a way to get your blood flowing without allocating a specific hour of
your schedule.

------
cylinder714
I got myself fired from a job a few years ago, and it occurred to me recently
that seasonal affective disorder (SAD) was probably a contributing factor. I'd
been feeling low and bored for quite a while leading up to the event, working
in a darkened room with a desk lamp, as no one wanted the fluorescent lights
turned on.

I like the_economist 's advice in general, and particularly the bit about
getting outside, but suggest that longer meditation is fine, too, and perhaps
try bodyweight workouts before getting into barbell/dumbell training. I just
got a copy of Convict Conditioning and find it and the idea of bodyweight
exercise compelling, and you can't beat the price. (See the FAQ at
/r/bodyweightfitness for more.)

------
lettergram
I actually recommend a comment by the_economist. Work out, walk, try to think
positively, etc.

A bit of a plug, but:

I also created a Kickstarter for my project, which is designed to help people
feel better via a method called neurofeedback. Usually it's thousands of
dollars, but we automated it and brought it down to ~$30 per month (or $15
through the kickstarter).

[https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/synaptitude/thinksuite-...](https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/synaptitude/thinksuite-
brainware-not-software)

------
loumf
If the goal of promotion or more compensation is literally impossible, then
choose another goal that isn't. For the purpose of enjoyment, goals are
arbitrary.

Eventually, you'll be free to leave, and you can start pursuing other goals.

Or ... Ask your boss what you need to do to earn whatever is is you want, and
then pursue that. Make it reasonable and achievable in 3-6 months -- to do
that, ask for the appropriate thing (a small step towards a larger goal)

------
a3n
See your doctor and explore all the options. You might discuss drugs,
counseling/therapy, prayer, meditation, diet, exercise, hobbies/diversions,
any number of things depending on your specific situation. You might choose to
try any of those or other options. But see your doctor.

------
taf2
Take a day off. Make sure you don't work on the weekend. Pick something easy
to work on during the day that you can finish and feel good about. When home
focus on the kids, try and find something non-tech related to focus your
energy on outside of work... Exercise helps a lot

------
ElijahLynn
Go read "The Dip". It can be helpful in determining when to call it quits and
move on or to stay put and wait for the sun. But yeah, exercise helps megatons
with this too, read the book "Spark" to learn about the science of exercise
and how it affects the brain.

------
O____________O
_I have a family and the job pays the bills._

Sounds like you have a pretty good life!

If we spent more time appreciating the things we do have, and less time
lamenting the things we don't (promotions, specific career trajectories), then
we'd all find more satisfaction in life.

------
iblaine
Have a hobby to make you happy, another for fun and another for health.

------
krazydad
Read about Dropbox's crazy code review policies a few articles down... Your
job will feel awesome by comparison.

------
Animats
Text “START” to 741741. They can help.

------
brianwawok
Is it cold where you live? Vitamin D may help last you till summer. If not,
consider a vacation ;)

~~~
DaRaam
For anyone feeling depressed about earning top Dollar in a cosy secure job
think of how it could be.. I am a student part time and work full time 6-6 in
a factory getting covered in egg mess every day for £280 a week You heard that
right not per day. Per week. I hope to become a developer someday. Work is
work i will code for anyone who will pay me especially if the are offering a
weeks pay per day to type at a desk in a nice office. My advice is to keep in
mind that you are being paid for your time. Leaving would obviously as more
stress to your life. So find something interesting to do side project or hobby
until you can leave your current position. Also remember it could be a lot
worse. You could be scrapping by on the bottom of the ladder.

------
ParanoidShroom
And I though I was a unique case with this. Anyone think this is growing
larger than normal ?

------
jheriko
find a new job. simples ;)

------
shravvmehtaa
www.hired.com

------
freeasinfree
Just go in every day and do it really half-assed. That's the American Way.

------
yarou
Mindful meditation will do wonders for you. So will smoking weed (waits for
inevitable downvotes by puritans, conservatives, and charlatans of the highest
order).

Weed will give you the emotive catharsis you desire, in a healthy and positive
manner.

