
How Hard Could it Be? (Joel on Leadership) - swilliams
http://www.inc.com/magazine/20081201/how-hard-could-it-be-my-style-of-servant-leadership.html?partner=fogcreek
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boredguy8
I'm loathe to criticize Joel, but:

I don't see how taking 2 days and leadership time demonstrates concern for
employees. Getting someone in who can take care of the problem quickly and
efficiently* seems like it's better 'staying out of the programmer's way' than
taking two days.

I think the lesson from the toilet cleaning was, "Look, if I'm going to
require perfect inspections, I'm sure as hell going to have an immaculate
bathroom. I also recognize that I need to show you how to perform to the level
I expect. So here's how it's done."

That hands-on, know-what-you're-doing leadership is what's respectable. Making
an object lesson, on the other hand, is hardly laudable.

*This falls into the "why I hesitate": if Joel could do it faster and more cheaply than having someone else come in that knows what they're doing, my criticism is less harsh, though I still think he's taking the 'wrong' lesson from his military experience.

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mixmax
I think you're missing the real point of these exercises. A good hacker, and
anybody else for that matter, performs best when he is secure in the knowledge
that he is being trusted and supported by peers and management. putting up
drapes is a subtle way of showing thet the CEO will do anything to make you
comfortable and make sure you can get work done.

It's not about the most efficient way of cleaning toilets or putting up
drapes, it's about psychology.

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boredguy8
My point is that most good hackers I know see through things fairly easily,
and it undermines the message of "you're supported" when that support is not
functioning in the best way possible. For instance, why does it take "days" to
realize the sun is shining through the window and then two more to have
someone who's not that great at putting up blinds put them up? Get someone in,
fix the problem, get them out, bing-bang-boom, and you have a happy hacker,
given most hackers I know. Take 5 days for something that should take 2 at the
most (1 day to see the sun issue, 1 more to put up blinds) doesn't make people
"secure in the knowledge that he is being...supported."

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mixmax
Hackers laugh, cry, have girlfriends (or boyfriends) just like everyone else.
And they are suspectible to the same psychology as everyone else. They just
often don't realise it because they think the world revolves around logic.

I've managed hackers in different startups, and my experience is that they
aren't that different from anyone else in this respect. The primary difference
is that they think these rules don't apply to them, which of course makes it
much easier to apply them.

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boredguy8
I'm not saying they don't have emotions, but nice try. Nor am I saying there's
no such thing as hacker psychology. I have no idea what you mean when you say
something like "same psychology as everyone else", My point is that the
psychological boost support provides still needs to be actual support.

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sabon
* When you do something humble - is it still humble when you waste a few more hours writing about it and showing it off to the world?

* When you do something humble and it's rather unnecessary waste of time and effort - is it positively humble or genuinely pointless?

* When you want to send the frugality message to the team - do you first spend a few Ks on the blinds, then tear them down and then ruin the ceiling trying to undo what you did previously? Is that the "I'll do anything for your comfort" message?

There are million other ways to show support and make your people feel good.
Pointless and unnecessary stuff is not among those ways.

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helveticaman
Keep in mind Joel might have gotten his hands dirty at other times as well and
kept it to himself.

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pchristensen
The prim sergeant cleaning the toilet story is getting old, but the rest of
the article after that was actually pretty good. Persistence, reluctant
readers!

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fallentimes
The only part that bugs me is: what kind of leader does something like this
and then writes about it to brag?

I think Joel's actions, by themselves demonstrate humility and the quality of
being down to earth. But the article...I think it would it would have come off
a lot better if someone else wrote it about Joel.

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kamens
Speaking as one of the developers who watched Joel put up the blinds, I know
that this one shared instance of "servant leadership" falls in line with
plenty of others that go unmentioned.

Just off the top of my head, I remember one Fog Creek get-together when one of
my guests (Joel barely knew her) mentioned to me that she was thirsty, and
before I could do anything about it Joel rushed off to get her a glass of
water. While not a huge deal, fetching water for his developers' guests is not
something that Joel really has to do.

...and even if I were to assume the basest of motives (that Joel wants to keep
his developers working at Fog Creek so they make him lots of money), it's
still a compliment as a developer and the type of attitude that makes me enjoy
working hard.

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fallentimes
Thanks for chiming in - that means a lot.

Since self promotion is more rampant than ever, it's very hard to separate the
marketing from the information.

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pchristensen
How is self promotion different than marketing the company you own?

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fallentimes
Jason Calacanis.

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teuobk
I'm all for leadership by example. I think that Joel led by example when he
was still actively developing code.

Hanging blinds? Not so much. Hanging blinds strikes me more as an entertaining
diversion from normal work than as a way to show leadership.

I enjoy Joel's writing and think he sounds like a good guy. I'd be curious to
see what he did if some of his employees left Fog Creek to start a company.
The reaction would be a good measure of leadership.

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ConradHex
I think the right way to handle that crisis would be to support them in their
decision, but make sure they aren't directly competing with Fog Creek.
Maintain contact, and make a gentleman's agreement that they won't poach
people from Fog Creek. Keeping things friendly would be far more beneficial in
the long run.

A lot depends on how many people would be leaving, too. If it's 2 or 3 people,
it's not a huge deal, but if it's half the company, and if they are going to
be making bug-tracking software, I think they might have to try to take a
harder line.

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iamelgringo
I think the article is right on the money. We've been inundated the past few
months with articles about a__hat CEO's in the financial services industry who
were absolutely clueless, allowed their people to take financial risks that
have brought their companies to their knees, while taking tens of millions of
dollars in bonuses.

Meanwhile, Joel says that sometimes as a CEO, it's helpful if you put up the
blinds and not just say that you care about your employees. CEO's get stuff
out of their way so their people can do the work.

Hell, a CEO just using the term, "servant leadership" to describe their
philosophy of management is a pretty idea these days, considering what the
financial sector is going through.

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lemonysnicket
did anyone else wonder why he is wasting so much time on money on stupid
blinds.

so much for cash & time efficiency.

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staunch
If he wasn't profitable and was blowing VC cash it'd be different. He's
spending money he earned.

