
Hello World: Windows 10 Available on July 29 - tolt
http://blogs.windows.com/bloggingwindows/2015/06/01/hello-world-windows-10-available-on-july-29/
======
kozukumi
I have been running the technical previews since the very start and I have to
say I am quite surprised at the July 29th release date. Even today's builds
are riddled with problems. They have a lot of work to do if they really think
it will be consumer ready by the end of July.

~~~
melling
I'm a Mac user so I don't care too much. However, a lot of how Windows 10 will
be perceived is from the online perception created. Most people in the world
don't care about the little bugs, features, etc. They simply want to know if
it's worth getting. If Windows 10 is reasonably good and tons of people
upgrade from XP, for example, this will be a huge win for Microsoft and the
entire community. If "reviewers" complain that Cortana can't read your mind
and people start comparing her to Clippy, it will generate bad buzz that's not
really justified.

9 out of 10 computers run Windows. Let's try to make it a version that's from
2015.

~~~
zanny
Unless MS changes their free upgrade policy to be every version of Windows
since XP instead of 7 nobody using Vista / XP will upgrade because its
expensive.

Though the market share of XP has been dropping. The only real users left are
those who don't know what an OS is and only uses it to check AOL in ie6 and
businesses who are too stupid to upgrade their horribly dated software.

~~~
userbinator
As someone who is still on XP after having tried all the newer Windows
versions (and forced to use some), I don't think it's worth relearning
everything and finding out that a lot of the functionality that you used to
rely on is now either completely missing or terribly dumbed-down. All the
little irritations add up.

We've probably long passed the point of "sufficient for the average user" in
terms of OS features, as things like Chromebooks have shown, but even for not-
so-average users like me who do mostly embedded work with some desktop
application stuff, it does what I need without getting in the way.

I'd sooner switch completely to Linux, which I've been working with on my
servers, than "upgrade"...

~~~
zanny
> I'd sooner switch completely to Linux

I do local IT. Word of mouth side job stuff. Its nice to remind myself why
Windows is shit down in the trenches sometimes, and its a lot easier to
manually uninstall a half dozen viruses and edit out registry rootkits for an
hour after a week of coding.

I normally bill pretty standard in home support freelancer rates, $60 an hour
with a minimum $80 to come. If I ever find a computer running Windows XP, I
always offer and implore the owner (assuming they are not dependent on some
software that has no Linux surrogate) to let me throw Lubuntu 14.04 on the
thing. I do it for free, and offer up to three hours of tutoring also for
free, because Windows XP is literally cancer. Its a tumor you don't know is
there until it goes malignant and kills you by having some unpublished never
to be patched exploit used to wreck your PC and steal all your personal
information or lock you out. Its more unsafe than unprotected sex in a sleazy
strip club.

Feature wise, Lubuntu matches pretty much perfectly, and even people still
using XP often have Android phones, so the Lubuntu software center makes a lot
more sense to people than have Play Store experience. Its not like anyone
using these computers needs performance out of them - if they were trying to
run a business or do anything intensive enough to require proprietary Windows
only software they would have certainly updated the machine once in the last
decade. They almost always are exclusively doing word processing and email,
often not even web browsing because these are systems stuck with IE8 at best.
And Lubutu does both of those things much better than XP ever did with auto-
updating Firefox / Libreoffice and one click system upgrades every two years
for LTS releases.

So yeah, switch to Linux, please. Your OS is hugely insecure and nobody is
ever going to fix it.

~~~
userbinator
Stupid users manage to infect themselves no matter what OS they're running. If
you do IT you will see the worst of it.

XP is only "insecure" if you're the kind of person who would download and run
random executables without any real thought, or use IE on default settings.

The "treat the user like an idiot" "security" of newer Windows is precisely
why I'm still using XP. I don't need a nanny of an OS. I rarely need to
install new software anyway.

In fact I'd say that malware is increasingly going to target features found
only in newer OSs... when the WMF exploit (remember that?) was going around, I
was still using 98SE, which was completely unaffected by the exploit code
since it used NT-specific features and attackers were targeting those OSs at
the time. A lot of the rootkit-y stuff won't even run on 9x because of that.

~~~
yuhong
UAC can be set to always automatically elevate without any prompt even in
Win10 (disabling UAC completely would kill Metro apps). I prefer the "Always
Prompt" configuration myself and it is unfortunate it was ignored when Win8's
task manager was designed for example. Win9x was not affected by the WMF
SetAbortProc escape problem at all unless you are printing (I think the
escapes were simply ignored). Linux is better on older machines because it
gets security updates and has ASLR and other exploit mitigations etc (though
not all are useful without NX) and it happened to be free.

------
getsat
Will there be a way to buy a digital download of it?

I recently wanted to bootcamp my Macbook Pro to play some games Windows-only
games. I went to Microsoft's website and looked at the options for buying
Windows 8. The only options were a retail DVD which would be shipped (and I
don't have a DVD drive) or to upgrade from Windows Vista/Windows 7 which I had
neither of.

I ended up pirating it because I couldn't figure out how to get a legitimate
copy that I could actually install. :(

I haven't used Windows since XP, and 8 is really nice. I'm legitimately
excited for Windows 10 especially due to all the open sourcing of .NET-related
code recently.

~~~
yRetsyM
You can get a digital download of the Technical Preview now - I'd do that.
They've announced that Windows 10 will be free to all Technical Preview
participants. That way you can upgrade to the latest version and away you go.

~~~
nly
> They've announced that Windows 10 will be free to all Technical Preview
> participants

Got a source on this?

~~~
yRetsyM
[http://m.windowscentral.com/windows-insiders-will-be-able-
up...](http://m.windowscentral.com/windows-insiders-will-be-able-upgrade-
windows-10-rtm-free)

~~~
nly
That just implies that we'll be able to install it, not keep it for free. My
current evaluation copy claims it expires in October.

------
venomsnake
Why all of their screenshots are on laptops? Doesn't anyone use real computers
anymore?

~~~
BinaryIdiot
Hmm it seems difficult to find statistics that separate desktop boxes from
laptops (I see separation of desktop and laptop va ultraportable) but I think
the trend is less desktops and more laptops. So I'm not entirely surprised.

Honestly I constantly built my own towers for years but these past 3 or 4
years I haven't even booted a desktop tower; laptops are just so good nowadays
and I can pick it up and go or dock it with multiple monitors it almost seems
silly to do a tower anymore. Obviously there are still plenty of power user
use cases or high end gaming to consider but many laptops can do a lot of that
well enough.

~~~
baldfat
I like my keyboard and mouse with two screen that are there 100% of the time.

Frsutrating that Firefox and Chrome boot slower than my phone and tablet!

I will stop using a desktop computer when you pry the mechnical keyboard out
of my cold dead hands.

P.S. Never personally owned a laptop and only use one's provided by my work.

~~~
tracker1
Not to detract, but are you booting on a hard disk or SSD.. the HTPC in my
livingroom does a full reboot in about 12 seconds (ubuntu 15.04) and my
desktop isn't much slower. Both of which are way faster than my 1+1 android
phone.

I also prefer a mechanical keyboard, have my own at work as well... I hate
when I'm on my rmbp, which is about as good as a laptop keyboard/touchpad
interface gets...

------
stinos
Is this always an in-place upgrade, or would there be a way to do a clean
install (possibly on another pc - IIRC windows licenses are per OS instance
not per machine?) for free as well?

~~~
cyxxon
I always wonder why they never mention how the supposedly free upgrade works.
From this article and the linked FAQ I get the impression that I do not
qualify for free Windows 10 forever, but that I can upgrade my Windows 8.1
installations via Windows Upgrade for a year after launch, but that my Windows
license is not generally upgraded to a Windows 10 license. I take this to mean
that after a year and a day, when I want to reinstall, I cannot use my current
key to install some Windows 10 install image, but have to use my Win8.1 image,
and since the year for free upgrades has passed, I cannot upgrade that install
to Windows 10 anymore.

Or are there other infos out about this very typical scenario among IT people?

~~~
joshuapants
I seem to remember Paul Thurrott saying that the free upgrade window is open
for a year, not that your license is only good for a year of use.

~~~
cyxxon
Yes, it seems Thurrott has some info:
[https://www.thurrott.com/windows/windows-10/3898/a-few-
more-...](https://www.thurrott.com/windows/windows-10/3898/a-few-more-answers-
about-windows-10-upgrades)

Basically it seems to be that MS saves the info in the Windows store and lets
you reinstall a fresh Windows 10 if you upgraded. If this information is
correct.

------
gnud
Can you reliably turn off web search from the start menu, and one drive
integration, yet?

~~~
7952
I have that on Ubuntu and it annoys the hell out of me. No I don't want to
wait 0.5 seconds for a search result about Firefox just to open a browser!

~~~
xcogiz
Surely you can disable that in a relatively easy way? I'm thinking about
trying linux and such comments kinda scare me.

~~~
joshuapants
It is easily disabled and is only a feature in Ubuntu's Unity desktop. If you
use a different version of Ubuntu (GNOME, Mate, KDE, whatever else they offer
now) it won't be an issue.

~~~
atap
Don't make excuses for something that's very obviously antithetical to very
premise of Linux and free, open-source software.

~~~
tracker1
Considering how many people liked google's desktop search widget, and similar,
I'm not sure I agree... not to mention that seeing repository matches that
aren't installed (yet) can be useful too. Not that most of those features
require integrated online searches... but I can see how someone, even most
casual users would prefer it that way.

Hell, look at how many people type in website addresses into their search box.

------
yuhong
Notice that even Win7 starter gets an upgrade to Win10 Home for free, for
those of you with netbooks.

------
netheril96
Any words about the supposed amnesty for illegitimate copies of Windows 7/8?

~~~
dspillett
Also on whether WinXP users are going to qualify for the free upgrade?

My lodger's old laptop is in desperate need of _something_ before I let it
have more open access to my local network... (I've been thinking Ubuntu but
that might take a little more retraining so Win10 might be preferable _if_
free and it'll run OK on that elderly machine without driver and/or
CPU/RAM/space resource issues)

~~~
fname
_> Also on whether WinXP users are going to qualify for the free upgrade?_

Nope. There is no upgrade path from XP -> Windows 10. You will have to go from
Win7/8 to qualify for the free upgrade to 10.

------
angry-hacker
Does anyone know if I have to be with that update notification icon until
then? I already gave them my address and said yes I'm interested in upgrading.
Why haven't MS learned and why does it have to be standard that every program
from Microsoft or anyone else needs to shit the system tray?

~~~
stinos
Follow the link to the FAQ, [http://www.microsoft.com/en-
us/windows/windows-10-faq](http://www.microsoft.com/en-
us/windows/windows-10-faq):

 _Can I turn off the notifications?_

Yes. Click “Customize” in the System Tray and turn off the Get Windows 10 app
notifications in the menu that comes up.

~~~
chli
That's not really a solution if I have my taskbar setup to always show every
icons and notifications.

I guess one could uninstall :

[https://support.microsoft.com/en-
us/kb/3035583](https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/kb/3035583)

Looks like this thing was sleeping all this time on my computer and then woke
up on a given signal. Sounds like a virus to me... !

------
andrewchambers
I am really liking the technical previews, I have had very few issues and
think it looks pretty slick.

------
xyby
Is Windows a good citizen on the harddisk nowadays? I stopped trying Windows
releases because they used to change my bootsector or something, so my machine
suddenly only booted Windows. Instead of showing me a menu (grub?) of
partitions to choose from.

~~~
rymate1234
That's mainly due to the old BIOS mbr only supporting one bootloader at a
time. I know on my old BIOS PC that when I installed a linux distro it would
displace the windows bootloader with grub, and vice versa. On UEFI based
systems, this is less of an issue, as I believe you can have multiple
bootloaders.

------
doczoidberg
I like it just to press the win key to do a (cortana) web search.

If they stay with bing as the only web search integrated into cortana google
will lose some users. Nevertheless they should implement google as an option.

~~~
castell
Microsoft had to change Vista's startmenu search function to allow also third
party desktop search vendors like the free "Google Desktop Search".

 _" Two areas have seen changes in SP1 that have come as the result of
concerns from software vendors. One of these is desktop search; users will be
able to change the default desktop search program to one provided by a third
party instead of the Microsoft desktop search program that comes with Windows
Vista, and desktop search programs will be able to seamlessly tie in their
services into the operating system. These changes come in part due to
complaints from Google, whose Google Desktop Search application was hindered
by the presence of Vista's built-in desktop search. In June 2007, Google
claimed that the changes being introduced for SP1 "are a step in the right
direction, but they should be improved further to give consumers greater
access to alternate desktop search providers"."_ \--
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Vista](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Vista)
and
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Desktop](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Desktop)

Win10 should support third party personal agents like Google Now and others!

~~~
bad_user
Third party search providers are not supported in Windows 8.1 and you're
talking about Vista. So no, Win10 will probably not support third parties.

~~~
castell
In in Windows Vista SP1 and Windows 7 RTM.

Microsoft had to offer a browser selection dialog with several third party
browsers in Windows 7 - in Europe (EU). Though the removed it again last year.

------
pibefision
Does Windows 10 includes a better Terminal or we need to install Putty?

~~~
bane
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_WAHFsAboTY](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_WAHFsAboTY)

~~~
maratc
Now we only need non-trivial tab completion, command history that survives
restart, and ssh in a prompt, and we can feel like the nineties have arrived.

------
Mithaldu
As a windows 7 user i have to wonder: Exactly why should i upgrade?

Does Microsoft have some kind of comparison table between Windows 7 and
Windows 10 i can use to make an informed decision?

~~~
Someone1234
Someone posted this on Reddit:

List of features (vs. 8.1):

\- Package manager (OneGet).

\- Virtual desktops.

\- Improved conhost (cmd and powershell "window").

\- Improved multi-monitor support.

\- Start Menu is back (but the 'Power User' right click menu remains!).

\- Settings app (improved Control Panel experience).

\- 2F auth, better biometrics, face and iris support.

\- Lower disk usage (reduced 2.6 GB on 64 bit).

\- Edge browser. Cortana. Improved Windows Explorer icons & folder favourites.

\- Notifications UI.

List of features (vs. 7):

\- Faster boot (inc. hybrid boot).

\- Improved Task Manager.

\- Improved Copy/Move dialog boxes (pause, graphs, prioritisation, etc).

\- Better touch screen support.

\- More login options (pin, picture, etc).

\- Improved multi-monitor support (taskbar options).

\- Up button and ribbon in Windows Explorer.

\- Native support for ISO, IMG, and VHD mounting.

\- Better on-screen keyboard.

\- Peek passwords.

\- File History (UI mostly).

\- Refresh, Reset, etc restore options.

\- "Basic" biometrics.

\- Improved encryption.

\- Client Hyper-V (on Pro and above).

So for 8.1 users, the improvements to 10 are mostly graphical with a handful
of very nice to have functionality improvements. For Windows 7 users, the
improvements are substantial and across the board. 8 and 8.1 actually improved
7 a lot, people just ignore it because "omg the Start Screen."

So to the people saying "Windows 7 is until 2020, why upgrade!" I say: you're
missing out on a lot of improvements that you could be taking advantage of, in
particular improvements 8 and 8.1 brought that you ignored.

------
snomad
Has there been any word on a 'Server 2015' release? There was a passing
comment, I believe at Spark / Build, but no real details.

Will Office 2016 be released the same day?

------
bovermyer
I'm surprised by how early it'll be released, but excited about it
nonetheless.

The only reason I haven't installed the tech preview and used it as my sole OS
(on my gaming PC) is because I don't want to have to reinstall 8.1 in order to
upgrade back to 10 once it launches.

I survived Windows 95, I can deal with BSODs and wonky features. I just want
the latest. And Windows Hello, because Jarvis.

------
tbrock
Where can I buy the laptop pictured in the announcement? It would be great if
a quality PC hardware manufacturer emerged that actually made Windows 10 based
laptops like this.

[1]
[http://az648995.vo.msecnd.net/win/2015/06/1.png](http://az648995.vo.msecnd.net/win/2015/06/1.png)

~~~
bonesinger
The bezel looks like a Dell XPS 13" but the unibody metal like frame looks
like a Razer Blade 14"

------
arenaninja
Do we know what "free for the first year" means yet? What about the second
year? I've been running Ubuntu for personal use for about a year now. I miss
steam so I might jump onto Windows 10, but not if I only find out the price
after I jump in

~~~
StavrosK
What's wrong with Steam on Ubuntu?

~~~
slantyyz
>> What's wrong with Steam on Ubuntu?

That you can't run the big titles that only run on Windows?

~~~
StavrosK
That's not a Steam issue, Steam runs fine. It's that some games aren't
available on Linux.

~~~
arenaninja
You're right, I meant Steam games where I wrote Steam. Even though I've had a
ton of fun with Legend of Grimrock, I wish for a lot of the bigger titles came
over. It's much better from 4 years ago, but I still can't play Shogun 2

------
rl3
> _Microsoft Edge, is an all-new browser designed to get things done online in
> new ways, with built-in commenting on the web – via typing or inking —
> sharing comments, and ..._

I wonder what Adobe and Genius think of that.

------
seanalltogether
Seeing as the apps they showcased were all desktop and no metro, does this
mean the app store will now sell desktop apps going forward? Any word on
different sandbox restrictions to go with it?

~~~
numo16
Devs will be able to turn their existing win32/desktop apps into windows app
store compatible apps using "Project Centennial" from the sounds of things.

[http://liliputing.com/2015/05/this-is-how-win32-apps-can-
bec...](http://liliputing.com/2015/05/this-is-how-win32-apps-can-become-
windows-store-apps.html)

------
oliverjudge
Is there any word on Windows 10 pricing outside of the upgrade program yet?

~~~
pionar
Newegg leaked it accidentally. Home OEM - $109, Pro OEM - $149.

------
suvelx
Is that a 21:9 laptop they used in the demo?

I want that one.

~~~
joshuapants
Interesting question. Obviously it's a render, but why did they choose those
proportions? Tease of new MS hardware?

~~~
pbz
Kind of looks like XPS 13 with the "bottom" (that has the DELL logo) cut off

[http://techranker.net/dell-xps-13-review-pros-and-cons-
best-...](http://techranker.net/dell-xps-13-review-pros-and-cons-best-
ultrabook-available-video/2/)

~~~
joshuapants
And with a webcam added at the top in the thin bezel. It does certainly look
inspired by the XPS.

------
lingben
can you reserve and then change your mind and not install or upgrade to
Windowns 10?

------
jamisteven
Anyone know what laptop is being used in the pics to display the OS? Shit
looks clean.

------
oldpond
If microsoft release their own linux distro I might try that. Otherwise this
is a non-event for me.

------
gd2
Besides the yawn factor, this blog announcement's structure and language lacks
skillz. Not good.

------
xcogiz
Looks like start menu won't work properly without an internet connection. Can
we get one that doesn't try to constantly distract you?

------
tragomaskhalos
I admit I haven't been paying _close_ attention, but I was under the
impression that 10 was going to be dispensing with that crappy Metro
interface: apparently not.

~~~
xcogiz
I agree. I will be replacing the start menu with a third party alternative as
soon as possible. I don't need constant trivial updates that distract me and
take resources.

~~~
rplnt
All of the active tiles are of course optional.

