
Sinister 'hunger stones' with dire warnings have surfaced as water levels drop - fahd777
https://www.businessinsider.com/sinister-hunger-stones-dire-warnings-surfaced-europe-2018-8
======
lordgrenville
Not trying to cause trouble, but this story leaves out a pretty important
detail[1]:

>> Also, because of a dam on a tributary of the Elbe, it's seen more often now
than it used to be — although the current river levels are still exceptional.

[1] [https://www.npr.org/2018/08/24/641331544/drought-in-
central-...](https://www.npr.org/2018/08/24/641331544/drought-in-central-
europe-reveals-cautionary-hunger-stones-in-czech-river)

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teh_klev
Original article on Science Alert instead of this BI reheat with its annoying
adblocker popup:

[https://www.sciencealert.com/sinister-hunger-stones-dire-
war...](https://www.sciencealert.com/sinister-hunger-stones-dire-warnings-
surfacing-european-heatwave-czech-drought-elbe-decin)

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ateesdalejr
If you disable JS you don't need to worry about it. ;)

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anonytrary
You also don't need to worry about 90% of the web, either. ;)

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parliament32
Good thing the 10% that actually matters doesn't require JS. If your content
is actually important, it'll be accessible without JS.

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nickthemagicman
You guys dont use Google Docs, Netflix, or Youtube?

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ateesdalejr
Not surprisingly, I don't use 2 of those things. I find YouTube to be too much
of a distraction so I've gotten rid of it. I don't use google docs because
it's too slow (in comparison with native word processors.) and I don't have a
google account. Netflix, I watch on my Amazon fire. :)

Edit: oops the rest of my comment contradicted my first part.

~~~
morganvachon
Same, on my laptop I run OpenBSD. Like you, I don't care for Youtube but if I
do find myself wanting to watch a video there, I use youtube-dl. I also don't
do Google, and instead of a word processor I use a text editor for just about
any text manipulation; if I need "pretty printing" I use Markdown and send the
output to a PDF. Netflix I get through my TV's Netflix app, or my Fire tablet.

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codewritinfool
Reminds me of the stones in Japan warning not to build homes below them.

[https://www.amusingplanet.com/2015/03/ancient-tsunami-
warnin...](https://www.amusingplanet.com/2015/03/ancient-tsunami-warnings-
carved-in.html)

~~~
thedailymail
I was thinking the same thing. There is also the interesting discussion about
how to label nuclear waste disposal sites with signs that need to be
understandable for ~10,000 years. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long-
time_nuclear_waste_warnin...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long-
time_nuclear_waste_warning_messages)

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sattoshi
Our ancestors were not dumb people. This is terrifying as it didn't happen
just once, but multiple times. We have a working model here.

"If you see me, you will weep. So low was the water in 2018."

~~~
Smushman
I get the feeling that droughts have happened before, are happening now, and
will happen again; and we are just not able as humans to control the climate.

In fact I found this study that proves that history does repeat.

[https://www.clim-past.net/9/1985/2013/cp-9-1985-2013.pdf](https://www.clim-
past.net/9/1985/2013/cp-9-1985-2013.pdf)

Thankfully, due to technological advancement though - it is nowhere near as
damaging as it once was - in fact now these are barely a blip on the radar on
human life. In times past, it is easy to forget that a simple drought halted
all commerce, caused great famines, and without transportation and local food
sources available, people were dying.

Just take a look at the history and see the trend lines for the evidence of
improvement that advancements like electricity and internal combustion have
given us:

[https://ourworldindata.org/famines](https://ourworldindata.org/famines)

Here's one for technology!

~~~
glhaynes
_I get the feeling that droughts have happened before, are happening now, and
will happen again; and we are just not able as humans to control the climate._

Great! Hope you're not wrong. The vast majority of people who are in the best
positions to know think you are.

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practice9
> "Neplac holka, nenarikej, kdyz je sucho, pole strikej." (Don't cry, girl,
> don't fret. When it's dry, just spray your field wet.)

Is this some weird Czech euphemism?

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yread
no, it doesn't work in original

~~~
jonathanyc
Huh, so is it just a rhyme? The translation definitely makes it sound like it
was originally a euphemism, if only because it seems such a strange thing to
write :)

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WaltPurvis
Pedantic quibbling: is "ancient societies" a proper designation for 15th
century Europe?

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holstvoogd
only if you consider the 15th century the very distant past. へ‿(ツ)‿ㄏ

~~~
evincarofautumn
As far as some people are concerned, it was ~8–10% of the Earth’s entire
history ago, instead of 0.0000001% of it.

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dillondoyle
Reminds me of Japan's Tsunami Stones [1]. There are other examples around the
world.

I spend a lot of time in Guatemala at Lago Atitlan. Only the white people live
at water level, the indigenous generally live up higher given the ever
changing water line. Probably a combo of white colonialists 'know better'
mindset + more $$ so it's not as much as a big deal (waterfront premium as a
vacation versus subsistence home).

Too bad we repeat the same mistakes over and over again.

[https://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/21/world/asia/21stones.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/21/world/asia/21stones.html)

~~~
senorjazz
I was there in 2005 and again 2012 and was astonished at how high the lake had
risen, buildings were swamped out, beaches w1here we used to go gone.

The lake was also getting dirty. Actually saw a documentary the other day on
how this has only gotten worse. Some terrible pictures of how the lake looks
at certain times of the year.

~~~
dillondoyle
The lake is in a precarious position. Sorry I started writing a reply and this
got really long. I'm very passionate and really wish I could help. I have a
goal of buying a 2nd home on the lake in the near future...

\--

There are periodic 'outbreaks' where the bacteria (I think I don't know it
might be some other organism) cover the lake and kill it even further. It's
very sad.

If you don't know the history, it was actually white Americans that decided it
would be a great idea to bring in non-native fish to turn the lake into a
fishing tourist destination. Ended up killing the ecosystem. Combined with a
growing population moving to towns around the lake instead of the high
farmlands, waste dumping straight into the lake, and very little ecosystem
left to clean itself up I'm afraid the lake is in dire need of help.

There was a study recently by the Rotary that examined possible solutions and
they came up with building hydro power (the lake sits a a high elevation with
a natural 'dam'; it's almost perfectly setup already for this). I forget the
mechanism but somehow this was one ID'ed as a top opportunity to clean up the
lake, I assume since it would generate revenue.

The problem is corruption and $$$. Everyone has their hand out and there are
countless examples of past efforts of small and large scale projects failing
for lack of organization and corruption.

I think estimates for the hydro plant was low couple hundred million. It seems
so doable especially right now (leverage China vs. Israel/US/Taiwan).

Except for the corruption.

Not sure if I believe this is a bright side or a dire warning: there is a loud
and coordinated attack on the CIGIC even in US media big papers are publishing
opinion pieces. It's disgusting to me given all that CIGIC has accomplished.

But the potential bright side is clearly the corrupt power class is very
worried and maybe with the protection of a few US politicians and Israel CIGIC
can fully clean house and Guatemala can continue to improve.

Anyways sorry about this reply again, I started to write a short reply and
couldn't stop I'm sure you're not interested but I clearly am lol

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emiliobumachar
I guess if the Great Barrier Reef starts recovering, we could etch some dire
warning into the rock about to be covered by life, to be seen the next time
things get this bad.

"If you see me, you will weep. So barren was our ocean in 2018."

If only, the Reef is likely irreversibly dying by now.

Any other applications?

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adrianN
Areas that used to be covered by glaciers.

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jtbayly
Seems like in front of a glacier's path when it's about to start growing is a
bad place to put something that you want to survive for future generations to
read.

~~~
adrianN
You'd have to carve it fairly deep into the rock.

~~~
jtbayly
Also, you'd have to anchor it _really_ well if you didn't want it to move with
the front of the glacier and reappear the first summer the glacier retreated
by a couple of feet, instead of when the glacier shrunk to disastrously small.

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userbinator
It's so odd to see this article appear on HN alongside
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17868840](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17868840)

~~~
InitialLastName
What's weird? The landlocked Czech Republic has different water level trends
than coastal Miami?

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phkahler
>> As Europe wilts in the sweltering, record-breaking harshness of summer
2018, strange things are happening.

Obviously it's not record-breaking now is it? They were here before and left a
warning in stone.

~~~
l0b0
I was under the impression that stones sink…

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soperj
It's almost as if this has happened before... But no, it's record breaking
drought.

~~~
mywittyname
The associated study claims that these stones have been seen many times - they
are likely to appear about five times per century. The study points out that
the causes of droughts have changed. Previous droughts were largely due to a
lack of precipitation. The current levels of precipitation is actually as high
as it has even been.

The cause of the current drought is record levels of heat. Despite
statistically high levels of rain fall, the temperature of the region is so
high that the rivers are drying up anyway.

~~~
pydook
Not entirely true, at least locally. Precipitation in Czech republic in August
is just 40% of normal state for this month [1]. The lack of rains is a big
deal here.

[1]: Report about draught from Czech meteorological agency,
[http://www.chmi.cz/files/portal/docs/tiskove_zpravy/2018/TZ_...](http://www.chmi.cz/files/portal/docs/tiskove_zpravy/2018/TZ_sucho_22082018.pdf)

~~~
pydook
Edit: wrong link, correct one is
[http://portal.chmi.cz/files/portal/docs/tiskove_zpravy/2018/...](http://portal.chmi.cz/files/portal/docs/tiskove_zpravy/2018/TZ_sucho_28082018OS.pdf)

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RickJWagner
Hmmmm, 'Science Alert' has a headline that calls stones 'Sinister'?

Methinks science has taken a backseat to rhetoric, regardless of the substance
of the story.

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nonbel
Perhaps that water ended up in the great lakes, which currently contain near
record high amounts of water?

[http://www.uppermichiganssource.com/content/news/Lake-
Superi...](http://www.uppermichiganssource.com/content/news/Lake-Superior-
water-levels-nearing-record-high-479936713.html)

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notatoad
AFAIK, the Elbe doesn't drain into lake superior.

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microtherion
They'd probably call it Über-See over there.

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Xylakant
I realize you’re joking, but Übersee is a german word that denotes everything
across the ocean. (Der See => the lake. Die See => the ocean)

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microtherion
Ah yes, I'm a native German speaker, but it hadn't occurred to me that
"Übersee" does indeed mean "Overseas". It's a different meaning for both
"über" and "see" than I had in mind.

