
A Government Error Just Revealed Snowden Was the Target in the Lavabit Case - runesoerensen
http://www.wired.com/2016/03/government-error-just-revealed-snowden-target-lavabit-case/
======
zik
So an American government agency destroyed an American business merely as
collateral damage of trying to persecute an unrelated guy who'd revealed their
wrongdoing. And they won't face any consequences for doing this. Something is
very wrong with this.

~~~
EC1
I was a lot happier a long time ago before I started reading HN / news in
general. The "spark" that lit everything is gone.

~~~
anonbanker
Is it better to be happy, or informed?

~~~
calvins
"It is better to be a human being dissatisfied than a pig satisfied; better to
be Socrates dissatisfied than a fool satisfied. And if the fool, or the pig,
are of a different opinion, it is because they only know their own side of the
question. The other party to the comparison knows both sides."

\- John Stuart Mill

~~~
EGreg
Can anyone really know what it's like to be a pig?

\- Thomas Nagle paraphrased :)

~~~
jessaustin
Lots of people seem to be perfectly placed to know this. Much easier than
knowing what it's like to be an eagle, for instance.

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jdavis703
This is the same kind of government we're expected to trust with private keys
and source code from companies like Apple and Google. Of course there's been a
long history of government not knowing how to secure IT infrastructure,
including a data leak that exposed the identities of it's own undercover
spies: [http://money.cnn.com/2015/09/30/technology/china-opm-hack-
us...](http://money.cnn.com/2015/09/30/technology/china-opm-hack-us-spies/).

~~~
joering2
In the latest Testimony, Comey tried to brush-off Apple's statements saying
that it is not Apple's business or place to decide or judge whether or not FBI
is doing good job keeping citizen's data safe.

I cannot imagine statement more de-attached from reality than that. If the
companies like Apple who sells millions of products to customers and rely on
customer's trust are not a good indication or source of information whether
the Gov is doing good job, then I don't know who is...

"We the People".... you'd think.

~~~
markdown
They don't like the concept of corporate personhood when it doesn't suit them.

~~~
guelo
I'd rather we be precise in these type of conversations instead of using the
general 'they'. Corporate personhood was a decision by the supreme court, a
separate branch of government than the FBI. The FBI doesn't seem to like the
Bill of Rights whether it applies to people or corporations.

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jacquesm
If the mountain of papers is high enough _someone_ will mess up. The funny
thing is that this is symmetrical, the same kind of math that underlies 3
felonies a day applies to court filings like these. The more opportunities to
mess up the bigger the chance that someone _will_ mess up.

That said I don't think that there is anybody out there who is shocked by this
confirmation, it was as far as I'm concerned a certainty, the timing would
have been too much of a coincidence.

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caf
Why is Wired telling me I'm running an adblocker when I try to view this
article? I'm not...

(edit) Ahh - it turns out that Firefox's built-in "tracking protection"
feature triggers their ad-blocker-blocker.

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drakenot
If you temporarily disable javascript you can view the story.

~~~
Houshalter
Someone shared this a long time ago on an HN thread. Put this code into the
url of a bookmark. Then click it to get rid of annoying popups and grey outs.
It works on Chrome at least:

    
    
        javascript:(function(){document.styleSheets[0].addRule(".highlighted_to_remove","background:red !important");var e=function(e){if(e.keyCode==27){i()}};document.addEventListener("keydown",e);var t=function(e){e.stopPropagation();this.classList.add("highlighted_to_remove");return false};var n=function(e){e.stopPropagation();this.classList.remove("highlighted_to_remove");return false};var r=function(e){this.parentNode.removeChild(this);i();e.preventDefault();e.stopPropagation();return false};var i=function(){var i=0;var s=document;while(s=document.body.getElementsByTagName("*").item(i++)){s.removeEventListener("mouseover",t);s.removeEventListener("mouseout",n);s.removeEventListener("click",r);s.classList.remove("highlighted_to_remove")}document.removeEventListener("keydown",e)};var s=0;var o=document;while(o=document.body.getElementsByTagName("*").item(s++)){o.addEventListener("mouseover",t);o.addEventListener("mouseout",n);o.addEventListener("click",r)}})()
    

The only downside is you lose the ability to scroll. : / I don't know how to
fix that.

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peterkelly
I wonder if the government employee who screwed up the redaction will face the
same penalties of jail time that Ladar Levison was threatened with.

~~~
pserwylo
I was thinking the same thing. Particularly because it was human error which
released the information. If there was genuine human error on Ladar's part
then I guess there would not be a lot of leniency. I don't know how the
government expects human beings to keep secrets from everybody they ever know,
until the end of time.

The amount of times little things slip out in conversation when you don't mean
to makes me think that it is only inevitable that somebody, someday, will make
a similar mistake to the government here. I don't think they will get treated
lightly when that happens, either.

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duncan_bayne
It's worth noting that the same bunch of people responsible for this mistake
are those who want the public to believe they're sufficiently responsible and
trustworthy to:

a) Safely store and analyse the results of mass public surveillance.

b) Hold 'master' keys to encrypted systems.

Of course no-one in the know seriously believes either claim, but this is a
great counter-example to put to the general public.

~~~
elpasi
Oh, but we'll take WAY better care of the master key! We promise! Believe us!

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ipsin
Does this increase the chance of the order being vacated?

What things can Levison still not talk about, aside from the identity of the
target?

~~~
nfbush
If we knew you wouldn't have to ask haha, he talks more about it in this mail
[http://www.metzdowd.com/pipermail/cryptography/2016-March/02...](http://www.metzdowd.com/pipermail/cryptography/2016-March/028669.html)

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fixxer
Beyond the case itself, doesn't this sort of ineptitude illustrate exactly why
we should not want the government holding the keys?

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hartator
It was an open secret that Lavabit was targeted because of Snowden account
there, but that's a really good thing to be sure for real, just for the sake
of transparency.

Even if in this case, it was non-intentional transparency.

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aranw
Couldn't even read the article due to Wired's anti-adblock banner.

~~~
bithive123
Indeed. The appropriate response when someone renders their own site unusable
is to close the tab and go on about your day. Hopefully their analytics tools
will help them refine their design.

~~~
JohnTHaller
If they use 3rd party analytics tools, you're already invisible to them and
don't matter.

~~~
paulryanrogers
Resources consumed by non-subscriber blockers do increase their costs.

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twobuy
This is important information, but man, I really applaud the writer for
stretching the story "they forgot to redact his email" and repackaging it into
10-15 paragraphs.

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subverso
Hello, I'm from Brazil. First time I read about this case. I'd like to know
how Gov. managed to shut down the Lavabit. Which were the arguments?

~~~
e12e
As I recall, FBI contacted Lavabit, and asked for information on a single
user. That would entail altering their system at the behest of the FBI, and
they said no. Then FBI asked for the TLS private key, so the FBI could
intercept users themselves. Lavabit said no, and ended up shutting down.

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wsha
Is anyone else surprised that the government wanted information about
Ed_Snowden@lavabit.com rather than cincinnatus@lavabit.com? Maybe they wanted
both and just redacted cincinnatus@lavabit.com properly. I thought that was
the account he was using for distributing information about the NSA documents
he took.

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oceanswave
Just shows that the FBI can't keep their own secrets, not to speak of keeping
anyone else's.

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thinkcomp
Documents at:

[http://www.plainsite.org/dockets/2y256314e/virginia-
eastern-...](http://www.plainsite.org/dockets/2y256314e/virginia-eastern-
district-court/usa-v-in-re-information-associated-with-redacted/)

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fit2rule
The US Government just demonstrated exactly _why_ we do not let technology
decisions be made by government bureaucrats: mistakes get made.

Today, its just an un-redacted email address. Tomorrow, it could be the keys
to the back-door that the government wants to impose on the world.

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mnw21cam
Web site broken - it says I have an ad blocker when I don't.

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tptacek
Wasn't this already known?

~~~
garrettgrimsley
First sentence of the article.

>IT’S BEEN ONE of the worst-kept secrets for years: the identity of the person
the government was investigating in 2013 when it served the secure email firm
Lavabit with a court order demanding help spying on a particular customer.

We all knew it, but it hadn't been confirmed by the government until now. See
[0] for example:

>The name of the target is redacted from the unsealed records, but the
offenses under investigation are listed as violations of the Espionage Act and
theft of government property — the exact charges that have been filed against
NSA whistleblower Snowden in the same Virginia court.

[0]
[http://www.wired.com/2013/10/lavabit_unsealed/](http://www.wired.com/2013/10/lavabit_unsealed/)

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strathmeyer
No Wired I'm not paying $1 to read your article.

