
Show HN: HTML5 guitar lessons with pitch detection - b1ake
https://getinstinct.com
======
b1ake
We first launched here on HN 1.5 years ago, and we're pretty excited to share
v2.

Our goal with Instinct is to add deep interactivity to any music lesson. We
think that one day, every lesson on YouTube might have pitch detection,
scrolling notation, a scoring system and personalized feedback.

This v2 is a big first step in that direction. We've teamed up with a bunch of
online teachers to create fully interactive video courses, as a way of showing
what's possible with the tech.

There's much more to do though! At this stage, we're looking for as much input
as possible from users and teachers.

~~~
it_learnses
I bought a guitar 3 years ago and I've tried to learn it on and off but never
really went past the c chord because I always lose interest.

I just finished my first lesson and this is superb for me. I love the scoring
system which motivates me to try and do better each time and just the ease and
simplicity with which I can immerse myself into learning it at my own pace.

Just a minor thing that confused me was that the music tab layout(maybe that's
the standard) is different from the layout of the strings in the animation
(which is the same as my guitar). I think both should be the same as the
guitar.

~~~
bmelton
I haven't tried Instinct, but having learned guitar off and on many years ago,
the biggest 'leap' I made between knowing a few chords, and a few riffs, and
actually learning enough to pick up a guitar at a party without embarrassing
myself occurred when I started learning full-length songs.

There are a plethora of very simple songs that are super easy to play, and if
you learn some that people might like singing along to (even guiltily, like
"Bon Jovi's Wanted Dead or Alive"), you'll likely bound ahead in skill by a
lot.

To that effect, I'd recommend hitting up YouTube for an instructor like Marty
Schwartz (user 'martyzsongs') and finding some of his easy tutorials, then
learning a few songs to string together. Get 15-20 of those easy songs under
your belt, and everything starts getting a lot easier from there.

[http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=martyzsings+easy](http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=martyzsings+easy)

~~~
vacri
_the biggest 'leap' I made between knowing a few chords, and a few riffs, and
actually learning enough to pick up a guitar at a party without embarrassing
myself occurred when I started learning full-length songs._

I am in the middle of that journey myself. I bought a guitar a little over ten
years ago, got some starter pointers from a passing acquaintance, then spent
ten years picking up the guitar every few months, pounding out some open
chords reading tabs, and not progressing at all. Bought various software to
help (guitar pro, rocksmith) which is good software, but doesn't correct bad
habits.

Finally I got tired of just being shit and went to a teacher. Almost every
lesson he's correcting a bad habit or providing insight into what I personally
am doing incorrectly, and the practice I'm am given each fortnight relates to
improving those specific weaknesses. Rocksmith is a hell of a lot of fun, but
it's also quite sloppy in what it expects and you can get away with horrible
habits (despite this, it's a very impressive bit of software). Guitar Pro is
good for isolating the track you want to play in a popular song and repeating
things to get the timing right. But for me, personally, it's a meatspace
teacher that is making the difference. A teacher isn't cheap - one lesson is
roughly the same as the software above - but I can see which of my skills are
progressing and by how much.

The journey is interesting. I'm smart, but have no penchant for applying elbow
grease. I'm used to picking things up quickly... and the skills in playing a
musical instrument well can't be gained in a short time - you have to put in
the hours. It's also interesting that the more I learn about the instrument,
the further away the target of 'doesn't suck' seems to get :)

~~~
rrss1122
I've been using Rocksmith. I think it only lets you get away with bad habits
as long as you are comfortable with whatever rating it gives you. I know I was
stuck in terms of progress until I learned proper technique elsewhere, then I
could do the fast and difficult passages and getting 100%s on more songs. I
learned those proper techniques off YouTube, but am also thinking of getting a
proper teacher.

------
hpeinar
I got a acoustic guitar for birthday and from since I've sat hours before
Youtube videos and tried to learn it. It has been a bumpy ride and I've merely
learned anything. Mainly because it's hard to learn from the people who are
already good players. They play fast and keeping track with them using YouTube
video player is really annoying.

Today I found GetInstinct and tried it out for like 30 minutes. I feel I've
accomplished something and what is more important for me, I feel I've learned
something.

It's easy, understandable and really enjoyable.

You'll make dozens (if not millions) of people enjoy playing guitar and
hopefully other instruments. Keep up the good work!

~~~
elwell
Is testimonial writing your profession? But, seriously, this is a pretty nifty
app.

~~~
hpeinar
Heh, no. I'm a professional programmer (go figure...)

~~~
darren884
You should go to a music school, thats what I did and in 5 months I'm playing
pretty decent (I'm a professional programmer too).

------
misnome
> Sorry, Flash isn't playing nice with your browser. Try refreshing or use
> another browser.

HTML5 indeed. Though I suppose taken literally the title doesn't claim html5
for the pitch detection part.

~~~
robmcm
To be pedantic Flash is included in the HTML 5 spec via the object tag.

~~~
SimeVidas
Flash is embedded into HTML via <object>, but that has nothing to do with the
HTML5 spec. Flash is not part of the Web Platfrom or HTML5.

------
ozten
Firefox 30, Shockwave Flash 11.2 r202 enabled, Ubuntu 14.10 - I see the flash
dialog, but am unable to allow access to my microphone.

Why not use getUserMedia({audio:true}) instead?

~~~
carlesfe
I second that. Flash does not work well for me, a fully functional HTML5
version would totally get my money.

~~~
b1ake
Yeah we like HTML5 / WebRTC a lot better too. In Chrome, Instinct actually
uses WebRTC instead of flash to access the mic.

We had a few issues with Firefox WebRTC though, still trying to work through
those.

~~~
padenot
Would you mind telling me your issues? I'm a Firefox dev, working on
getUserMedia/Web audio api. I'm sure we can fix them so that Firefox users can
enjoy your app without flash as well. I'm padenot at mozilla dot com, or
padenot on Twitter.

Great app anyhow!

~~~
b1ake
Hey, thx for writing! So the Firefox issue is that the browser asks for
microphone approval on every lesson, which can get a little annoying as a
user. Is there a way to get Firefox to ask only once and remember what the
user chooses?

To see what happens, try a few lessons in real guitar mode on our staging box.
This box allows getUserMedia() even for FF:

[https://stage.getinstinct.net](https://stage.getinstinct.net)

(also just a heads up that our staging box is small, so if a lot of people hit
it, it might get slow)

~~~
padenot
So, this is known, and tracked in our bug tracker [1]. In the meantime, you
can ask your users to use the drop-down in the doorhanger (the little panel
that come down), they can whitelist your site this way (it says: "always share
with this website" or something).

As you see in the bug (and in a duplicate [2]), this behaviour may change in
the future. As you can understand, this need to be changed with care, it's
rather easy to screw up, and could have serious privacy implication for our
users (of course, your use case it absolutly legit, but websites get hacked,
and some website are clearly malicious).

In general, if you want to talk to the team because you suspect a bug in
Firefox, or anything, really, come in #media on irc.mozilla.org, or come and
talk to us on the dev-media mailing list [3]. We don't bite, and love to hear
about the crazy stuff people make with our APIs :-).

Keep up the good work !

[1]:
[https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=819413](https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=819413)

[2]:
[https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=893945](https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=893945)

[3]: [https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/dev-
media](https://lists.mozilla.org/listinfo/dev-media)

------
dbalatero
Not sure how closely you pay attention to what fingerings are shown, but on
this lesson: [https://getinstinct.com/courses/intro-to-guitar/low-
strings/...](https://getinstinct.com/courses/intro-to-guitar/low-strings/game-
over-riff-on-the-a-string)

I noticed the last 4 notes are fingered 2-1-1-open, which has a slide on the
first finger. Probably better to not encourage sliding on first finger unless
needed. I wonder if other lessons might have less than optimal fingerings
shown?

edit: but, very cool! :)

------
simonsquiff
Any plans for other instruments? Would be really interested in a piano version

~~~
b1ake
Yeah I'd love for us to make a piano version too. We haven't started it yet,
but maybe it's percolating - I've been spending a ton of time on the piano
lately. :)

~~~
selmnoo
I would be really, really happy if you can get a piano version out soon. :)

------
pbhjpbhj
Really great - played first lesson. Second lesson crashed on
[https://getinstinct.com/courses/intro-to-guitar/amazing-
grac...](https://getinstinct.com/courses/intro-to-guitar/amazing-grace/part-2)
before I could play along with the review of part-1.

Would like regular music notation as I already know that. Also it's a bit
quiet, would love to have a voice guide rather than just reading the prompts.

One slight problem is that on parts where the section to play starts on the
same note as the end, and uses an open string, the sustained note of the
string automatically skips the first note of the repeat playthrough. Perhaps
the algo needs to look for an amplitude peak at the start of the students
playthrough to avoid this?

Incidentally the tuner is better than any of the simple tuners I've used on
Android, haven't tried it on my phone however. It coped with my children
talking over it and still helped me tune very quickly.

~~~
b1ake
Great points, and thanks so much for the kind words about the tuner.

Agree that sheet music would be great, and also that the lessons do feel a
little quiet / less lively than they could. Your voiceover idea is really
cool. We've also thought about adding backing tracks as another way to
increase the energy level.

We've also run into that wraparound issue you describe, where a section that
starts and ends with the same note can cause an issue when you get to the end
and sustain the note. I think you're right about the solution, i.e. better
attack detection by looking at the amplitude of the signal.

~~~
pbhjpbhj
I'm sure it's on your list of possible future enhancements but I'd be
interested in a Ukulele version.

Now I've done 4 full lessons and some riffs - I'm finding the scrolling on the
tab a bit hard to follow, TBH I think it would be fine if it were a bit more
compressed (so less scrolling were needed) and also possibly you could but a
visual break [like a coloured vertical bar or similar] so that the eye can
more easily pick out the move? Happy to give further feedback, I'm pbhj on
your system.

~~~
b1ake
Sure, please do keep the feedback coming. You can message us thru the site
when logged in (we use Intercom for this) or email us at hello@getinstinct.com
.

------
Killswitch
How do you even play the demo? I move my mouse and the hand moves with it, and
it tells me to play the string, but I click, hold, press buttons, the hand
just moves and nothing happens... A help screen would be very beneficial...

~~~
b1ake
Ah in demo mode, just move the mouse over the highlighted strings at the
bottom and they will play. No need to click or anything.

~~~
Killswitch
Did that, nothing happened. Just air guitar like a gangsta.

~~~
b1ake
Haha, sorry about that, probably a bug.

If you don't mind sending us OS / browser / version + the lesson you played,
we can try to debug. Our email is hello@getinstinct.com.

------
mrcharles
Pretty neat! I plugged in my rocksmith cable and it just works. One thing
though, it needs some kind of calibration. The tiniest bit of string noise and
the lessons shoot off without me, even when I have my strings muted.

~~~
b1ake
Yes it does work with the Rocksmith cable and we've seen a bunch of users
discovering that. As you point out, pitch detection can be a little sensitive
with that cable (depending on the guitar), and you're right that we could /
should do some calibrating to improve it.

------
KevinBongart
Wow, really impressive. I tried the first Jazz lesson, completed it, was
prompted to register, happily signed up and I'm very excited about the other
lessons!

------
maguirre
Ha, time to dust up my guitar. I've always wanted to learn but know nothing of
musical notation. This should give me another excuse get back to learning

------
bwindels
Wow, I love this. Played around with it this morning and works surprisingly
well. Great idea and great execution, wish you all the best.

------
sjs382
Looks great. Can't wait to try it after work!

------
markbnj
This is pretty awesome. Nice work! I've been playing for 30 years but I am
eager to try it out and learn some new stuff :).

------
zapt02
Any ukulele lessons coming up? :D

~~~
b1ake
Haha - Actually, we've thought about it multiple times. With the right
teacher, it wouldn't be that hard!

~~~
chrisstanchak
+1 for the Uke.

Nice stuff, Blake.

------
sitkack
I wish you a resounding success, thank you for making more art and artists in
the world.

------
stravid
easydrum[1] is a similar student project dedicated to drums. As far as I know
it uses MIDI and the flash plugin to connect to electronic drums.

[1] [http://easydrum.binsofrei.at/](http://easydrum.binsofrei.at/)

------
riffraff
any chance you have ukulele coming up next? :)

