
Let's rally for Lavabit to fight for the privacy rights of the American people - welder
https://rally.org/lavabit#post_0HNWFXPPKeq
======
Joeboy
Strategically Ladar's fight seems like a good thing for all of us, but in
general I am bothered by the focus on "the American people", and the idea of
political fixes based on the US constitution. I hope that HN type people are
thinking strategically about the big picture and not seeking to promote the
rights of a minority, potentially at the expense of the rest of us. I can't
really tell though.

~~~
mixmastamyk
You're right... however I can certainly imagine every country of means jumping
on the surveillance bandwagon if they haven't already.

At least the US has a constitution that forbids this. It's a good time to take
a stand. It won't be solved globally, but piece by piece.

~~~
dingaling
The question that the wording of the appeal raises in my mind is: if the
warrant first presented to Lavabit related to a non-US citizen who was using
the service, would Mr Levison have followed the same course of action?

~~~
mixmastamyk
I think so, how could you sell a security service with a backdoor only for
foreigners? Doesn't make sense from a technical point of view.

Also, it doesn't seem that he had a problem with warrants, just opening it for
everyone at once.

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pvnick
Just donated some more at
[https://rally.org/lavabit](https://rally.org/lavabit).

Godspeed Ladar. You're an inspiration to us all.

~~~
generj
Amen.

I'll admit to glancing woefully at my purse-strings, then tightening them the
last time I saw Lavabit's defense fund.

Between the EFF, ACLU, and other organizations I have suddenly have found
great cause to donate to, I didn't feel like I was ready then.

Now that most of the full story is out, I read it, laughed out at Ladar's
shear balls, and donated, deciding to skip some meals to make the budget meet
if necessary.

I mean, that 4 point text ploy is straight out of a smart-ass-high-school-
student's attempt to cram as much as possible on his "1 index card allowed"
cram-sheet.

~~~
RodericDay
_Within a month, Lavabit still had not complied to the court 's
satisfaction—in fact he handed over pages of the key typed in 4-point font—and
Levison was ordered to pay a $5,000 fine for each day he did not comply. On
August 8, he shuttered Lavabit entirely, destroying the company’s servers._

[http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2013/10/lavabit-defied-
or...](http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2013/10/lavabit-defied-order-for-
snowdens-login-info-then-govt-asked-for-sites-ssl-key/)

just in case you're wondering (I was)

~~~
OmleteDuFromage
He should have done it in Wingdings too

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malandrew
Donated.

Normally I'm hesitant to post one word comments like that, but in this case
showing your donation breaks conformity behavior in large anonymous groups
like the innocent bystander effect.

------
DavideNL
Well i've decided to donate a little for the good cause BUT i also don't like
the "American" word in the title.

It seems to be a typical American thing to state it like this (i read it in
many news articles about the mass surveillence topic) and I find it very
repulsive because it somehow states "we, the Americans, are superior". That's
a disgusting thing to say about oneself in my opinion.

"Let's rally for Lavabit to fight for the privacy rights of the people on the
internet"...

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RexRollman
I donated earlier tonight. I am thinking I will send a matching donation to
the EFF as well.

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talon88
It just feels so juvenile — first he doesn't comply, then he says he'll
comply, then he refuses to comply, then he's ordered to show cause and
represents himself (!), then he prints out the encryption key in 4-point font
in a clearly noncompliant gesture.

Yes, there are privacy issues at stake, but there's a much more mature and
reasonable to way to conduct oneself than it seems like he has.

~~~
kijin
Suppose you're a typical nerd who lives buried in software all day long with
relatively little contact with the big bad world. (Need any more proof of
Levison's nerdiness? Lavabit used to be called Nerdshack. By the way, I don't
mean anything negative by "nerd".) All of a sudden, you find yourself in the
middle of the Snowden controversy, with a very real possibility of going to
prison. You don't have much money, either. You don't know what to do. Under
such circumstances, are you sure you would respond any more "maturely" than
Ladar Levison did?

Levison made mistakes. Today's Wired article makes that clear. He was probably
scared and confused. He should have sought legal counsel as soon as he
received that first court order, preferably by calling EFF right away, but for
some reason he didn't seem to have done so. His failure to work with a
competent attorney (or maybe he ignored good legal counsel) probably caused
more damage than what was strictly necessary.

But what happened, happened. What matters is what's going to happen next. If
we're willing to stand up for a child pornographer's right to keep his hard
drive encrypted, I think we should forgive Levison for his confusion as well.
Thanks to his blunders, the case has now blown up into something completely
different: for example, the Government's right to require the disclosure of
SSL keys.

~~~
adamnemecek
Way to be condescending about it dude.

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heja2009
Only the American people?

~~~
sitkack
Anyone can donate, this isn't running for political office. It is a legal
fund.

~~~
Joeboy
Maybe the question is, why would I donate to fight for the privacy rights of a
small minority of the world's population (which as it happens doesn't include
me)? Potentially, the answer is that by making it harder for the NSA to spy on
Americans we make it harder for the NSA to spy on the rest of us. The concern
is that focusing on US political / legal fixes potentially still leaves the
majority of us vulnerable to mass surveillance. I haven't seen as much
exploration of this question as it seems like there ought to be.

~~~
eru
At least, the Americans should fix their constitution to say that their
institutions ain't allowed to spy on any human without proper judical
oversight. Otherwise, as you, I don't care about their legal system.

~~~
sitkack
That is actually what the constitution says. The US government should get
warrant when spying on anyone regardless of who they are or where they are.
The limitations are placed on the government, not the other way around.

It is only by legal convention that the US government does warrantless spying
on non US citizens and gets away with it.

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WhoIsSatoshi
proud to help fight the good fight Ladar - thank you for standing your ground!

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ivanbrussik
donated - lets give this guy some help

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lotsofcows
I assume by American you mean USAian? Either way, doesn't everyone else
deserve privacy too?

