
Which oils are best to cook with? - 7952
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-33675975
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ericson578
When I switched to a keto diet I researched what kinds of oil to cook with and
came to similar conclusions. I ditched all of the veggy oils in my pantry
except olive oil. I buy a small tub of grass fed beef tallow that lasts about
3 months. A teaspoon for sautéing goes a long way.

Typically I combine an animal fat like the tallow, or butter with some olive
oil when cooking. Occasionally I'll get fancy and buy goose or duck fat.
Sometimes it's a pat of butter, or a scoop of coconut oil.

The food tastes better, and I feel better. It was hard to unlearn all of the
bad science that came out of the last few decades about saturated fats, but
hopefully I'll end up being better off for it.

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jwr
Over the years I've learned to take advice like this with a large grain of
salt. Every couple of years this sort of advice seems to get reversed. I still
remember reading about olive oil being bad for frying because it was
supposedly less resistant to high temperatures and decomposed into something
not too healthy.

It's been the same with eggs, coffee, and many other things.

~~~
forgetsusername
> _I still remember reading about olive oil being bad for frying because it
> was supposedly less resistant to high temperatures and decomposed into
> something not too healthy._

This hasn't changed. Olive oil has one of the lowest smoke points of all
cooking oils. Once it's burning, you're eating all kinds of things, some of
which aren't good for you.

[[http://www.seriouseats.com/2014/05/cooking-
fats-101-whats-a-...](http://www.seriouseats.com/2014/05/cooking-
fats-101-whats-a-smoke-point-and-why-does-it-matter.html)]

~~~
jballanc
Olive oil's smoke point is highly dependent on the variety. Refined olive oil
is just as useful for high-heat frying as just about any other. Extra virgin,
on the other hand, is not something you want to cook with.

In Turkey we have a variety known as "naturel sizma", which is what comes off
the olives before pressing even begins. In contrast to other olive oil
varieties, it's appearance is cloudy, and you can barely warm it before it
starts smoking.

~~~
gambiting
Really? I only ever cook with extra virgin olive oil. I really can't tell the
difference :P

~~~
baldfat
You need this: [http://www.oreilly.com/free/cooking-for-
geeks-2ed.csp](http://www.oreilly.com/free/cooking-for-geeks-2ed.csp)

Seriously your cooking can get a lot better aka will taste a ton better
because your not cooking at the right temperature for most of your food.

PS My wife said the same thing when we got married. She would now slap out of
any one's hands if they even tried to use Virgin Olive Oil on anything besides
salad dressings and hummus.

PSS Food channel quick cooking shows are really poor.

~~~
DerKommissar
I agree in general, but in many parts of Italy they generally fry everything
in extra virgin olive oil.

~~~
baldfat
Olive Oil and Virgin Olive Oil have different smoke points. Are you sure it is
Extra Virgin Olive Oil???

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eitally
This article is very hard to draw conclusions from. For one, when they talk
about frying, are they literally meaning deep frying / pan frying, or also
including sauteeing and similar? Secondly, for Americans at least, they don't
mention canola/rapeseed oil at all, and that's by far the most commonly used
here. Thirdly, most people have absolutely no clue how hot their pans get when
they cook, but I suspect the majority have burned butter or smoked their olive
oil. Fourth, I know peanut oil is very common in Chinese/Asian cooking. I
wonder how it fares.

We use coconut oil for a lot of stuff (high heat in pans, but also for baking
& grilling), and olive oil for the rest.

~~~
Grue3
They do mention rapeseed oil, and it's one of the best along with olive oil.
And it has higher smoke point, so I suspected it's the best oil for frying for
quite a while. Unfortunately it's very rarely sold in my country.

~~~
lambda
And for anyone who's not familiar, rapeseed oil is sold as canola oil in the
US and Canada.

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kom107
Many years ago, worked as a line cook in a high-end restaurant. TL;DR version
of what I learned there (and still my rules of thumb):

-EVOO is best for salad dressings, oily dipping sauces.

-Olive oil is best for raw emulsions (aioli, etc)

-Canola for high heat stovetop

-Vegetable for baking and deep frying

-Sesame for Asian

-Don't worry about flavored oils until a recipe calls for them or you're comfortable experimenting

One of my favorite books for cooking is by Harold McGee, 'On Food and
Cooking'. He takes a wonderful look at the science (chemistry and physics)
behind your food and cooking, and I learned quite a bit from it. If you get
the chance, it's worth picking up.

~~~
3minus1
just be careful not to overdo it with sesame oil, because it can overwhelm a
dish.

~~~
kom107
This is definitely true. Hence why you should ALWAYS be tasting your food as
you are cooking it...not just at the end, but during the process, adjusting
your seasonings. Again, Harold McGee does a better job than I, but the points
at which one adds, say, salt to a dish, actually make a difference in the
outcome of the final flavor.

And remember: you can always add more flavor, but you can never take away when
cooking. That's another good rule of thumb.

So a lot of us here are tech inclined and, I think, startup inclined. Think of
cooking and learning to cook this way: it is an experiment. You are learning.
The fastest way to learn is to talk with people who have done it before
(follow the recipe). If you're smart and want to learn really fast, each time
you make a recipe, you'll make little notes to yourself about what you learned
or noticed about the different ingredients. Then, next time you make the dish,
you can tweak it (pivot your idea). If it works, you've learned something that
will probably stick with you for a long time.

Have fun in the kitchen guys.

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ousta
has he already tried frying with olive oil? this is literally one of the
shittiest oils to fry in. First the olive flavor dissapear even before it
becomes frying temperature, second it is being replaced by a rancid taste that
is totally awful due to the low heat resistance of olive oil. I don't care the
study it is quite obvious that Olive OIl breaks down much before Sunflower oil
and as such produce nocive substances faster than Sunflower even if this guy
prowed that sunflower oil was more nocive (which i don't doubt)

The best oil ever for frying is coconut oil. it is heat resistant like no
other oil and the cell do not breakdown as easily than olive oil plus this
taste good.

frying or deep frying with olive oil is a no go. if one had to fry something
with an oil similar to olive but much more resistant then one should pick
Avocado OIl which is truly a marvel of an oil.

Also what is not written there is that olive oil is not light resistant and
one should not buy transparent bottled olive oil because there are chances
this oil is already damaged by sunlight and lost lot of its benefits.

ghee is also a safe alternative and much higher resistance than butter

~~~
Oletros
> has he already tried frying with olive oil? this is literally one of the
> shittiest oils to fry in

What the heck?

> First the olive flavor dissapear even before it becomes frying temperature,

All the people I know must be doing something wrong because that doesn't
happen

> second it is being replaced by a rancid taste that is totally awful due to
> the low heat resistance of olive oil.

All the people I know must be doing something wrong because that doesn't
happen

Or perhaps they are not doing anything wrong and this is just nonsense

~~~
RobertoG
"All the people I know must be doing something wrong because that doesn't
happen"

I'm so perplexed like you.

It seems that all the Mediterranean cultures have been doing something wrong
for some centuries.

Maybe the problem is in an obsession with frying.

------
scurvy
To me, the largest problem I have with olive oil is the counterfeiting and
adulterous nature of the industry and its infiltration by organized crime. I
stick with ones made in California, but wasn't Costco busted for selling fake
olive oil? I realize it's possible to get good stuff and probably avoid the
bad, but I'd rather steer clear of the entire mess and use a better
alternative.

~~~
Enzolangellotti
I'm starting a new import startup/e-store for original italian (Apulian,
Campanian, Umbrian and Sicilian) olive oil aimed at the food lovers niche as
my family hails from there, moreover I'm on friendly terms with some family
producers. So far the biggest issue (other than those export regulations) has
been finding a decent packaging. I wanted those nice Vietri/Positano/Amalfitan
ceramic bottles ([http://www.ceramicpositano.com/data/images/vaso-a-collo-
stre...](http://www.ceramicpositano.com/data/images/vaso-a-collo-stretto-
decorato-in-maiolica-e-smalti.jpg)) but I fear the cost might be too high for
the buyer.

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VeejayRampay
I've found that clarified butter (or its close cousin ghee) offers a very high
smoke point (around 250°C or about 480°F) and is good for lactose-intolerant
people. It's also extremely easy to make.

~~~
athenot
And when it comes to browning, or making a crust around the edges of what's
being pan-fried, butter is the best.

Also, I'm not sure why but I've found that adding sesame oil to butter helps
keep its properties a bit longer under heat.

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AndrewDucker
I switched to Lard a couple of years ago, and have never looked back.

Less oil droplets sprayed everywhere while cooking, copes well with high
temperatures, and tastes great!

~~~
zhte415
Absolutely, and awesome in baking to get fluffy crusts and textures too.

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AdmiralAsshat
I'm disappointed that this article did not evaluate avocado oil or peanut oil.
The latter is increasingly used in frying in the US due to its very high smoke
point, and I've been personally using the former for that purpose.

~~~
logicallee
how would you describe the taste? I googled and saw that it's kind of like
olive oil - if so it's interesting because I can't normally cook with olive
oil. (precisely because of its low smoke point - i like the flavor though.)

~~~
stdbrouw
Peanut oil can be somewhat nutty, but it's a very, very mild tasting oil.
Precisely on that account, peanut oil is actually great on salads too, because
it's not as overpowering as olive oil can be. No idea about avocado oil.

~~~
logicallee
thanks, but of course I was asking about admiral's avocado oil preference! :)
I've never tasted avocado oil.

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Jedd
This is very frustrating... I've always known lard is healthy, but I also
thought I'd always known you shouldn't heat olive oil (low smoking point).

~~~
brycemckinlay
This rule mostly applies to Extra Virgin Olive Oil. Refined olive oil (Which
is what you'll get if you buy something just labeled as "Olive Oil") has a
smoke point that isn't much different to most other oils.

~~~
Jedd
Thanks for that clarification (I see it's come up a bit here, but
nonetheless). I'm part-owner of several dozen olive trees, but sadly they're
table varieties, not oil. I shall have to do some more investigation on this
front ... though I'm likely to just embrace, even more, avocado, grapeseed,
and macadamia oils, as well as lard -- that seems easier than keeping more
than one good olive oil in the pantry : )

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hedgew
Some practical lessons about cooking oils for amateur chefs:

\- Learn to understand what's meant by "neutral oils". They are the most
versatile, and best for amateurs.

\- Extra-virgin olive oil has a strong, complex taste. It's difficult to use.
Get normal olive oil instead for dishes that need it. (NEVER make mayonnaise
or cook eggs with "EVOO". Try it once and you'll understand.)

\- Different oils will combust at different temperatures. Get a neutral oil
with the highest smoke point you can find for deep frying and pan searing.

\- Toasted sesame seed oil is my most commonly used non-neutral oil because it
has a strong but simple taste which works well in many dishes. Walnut & other
oils can be nice but usually not worth the extra cost.

~~~
brycemckinlay
You shouldn't really cook anything with Extra Virgin Olive Oil. Not the good
quality stuff, anyway. It's for dipping your bread in, salads, drizzling on
soups or pastas, etc.

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will_work4tears
No mention of Avocado Oil? I find this oil tastes great and looks like it has
a ~500F smoke point. It's similarly "good for you" like Olive oil and is
relatively inexpensive at Costco (though nowhere near as cheap as Canola or
Peanut oil).

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leni536
Frying in lard is quite traditional in Hungary (though not in all family).
Certain dishes made using vegetable oil would feel wrong for me (goulash for
example). Healthiness aside I like it more than sunflower oil and in Hungary
it's well priced.

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carlosrg
Good olive oil, as any mediterranean knows ;)

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Udo_Schmitz
For frying I recently decided to try clarified butter (german: Butterschmalz)
as recommended in a classic cook book and am very happy with the results.

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athenot
It would have been nice if the study included sesame oil. It has a high smoke
point and it's used in many Asian diets.

Frying in olive oil _can_ be done if it's a low temperature fry, I've only
done it for pan frying potato slices or cubes, with generous amounts of dried
herbs. But I consider that an edge case of using olive oil. The smoke point is
just too low to do much frying.

~~~
jpatokal
In Japanese, Chinese and Korean cooking, sesame oil is typically used in tiny
amounts for the flavor and is typically added after/at the very end of
cooking. It's never used as the sole cooking oil, you'd use peanut oil or
something for that.

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jwmerrill
Harold McGee wrote about this subject from a flavor perspective in 2010

[http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/17/dining/17curious.html?_r=0](http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/17/dining/17curious.html?_r=0)

His conclusion was that most oils taste the same after you heat them to frying
temperatures.

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codexjourneys
Extra virgin olive oil isn't good to cook with at high temperatures. I like to
put it on food after it's cooked, such as drizzling it over pasta or salad.
Light olive oil has a higher smoke point, I think.

I usually cook with sesame oil, ghee (clarified butter), and butter. Sometimes
coconut oil too.

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qznc
Hm, I always heared sunflower oil recommended because of the higher smoke
point. Smoke is easy to detect when frying, so maybe I should try olive oil
with some usual dishes. As long as it does not smoke, it should be better for
me.

~~~
weego
Most olive oils will smoke/burn afaik due to the higher particulate content
compared to other oils.

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scurvy
Considering the nerd obsession with bacon, I'm surprised no one has mentioned
reclaimed bacon grease? Or does that get lumped in with lard?

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nogridbag
I've been pan frying with grape seed oil as it has a high smoke point but it
wasn't mentioned in the article. Should I be worried? :)

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fdomig
This is the essential thing. I do prefer fat over carbohydrates and I am quite
healthy with that.

    
    
        "After years of being told, and telling others, that
        saturated fat clogs your arteries and makes you fat,
        there is now mounting evidence that eating some
        saturated fats may actually help you lose weight and
        be good for the heart"

~~~
ousta
this saying is true for healthy people. definitly not true for overweight
people fed with corn syrup colas where saturated fats can be lethals paired
with the high carbohydrate intak

~~~
weego
There's literally no science behind the notion that fats and carbs together
are any worse/better than separate.

~~~
rebeccaskinner
I think they were referencing diets that are generally higher in fat and carbs
rather than meaning that they are worse eaten together at a specific meal. I
have seen a study that supported that, but in all of science and nutritional
science specifically a single study (that I can't find a reference too right
now unfortunately) is about as reliable as "my cousin's brother in law's dog
told him that..."

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andy_ppp
The answer to all of this of course is don't eat fried food. It's all very bad
for you!! Try a nice salad instead, I can recommend any of the Ottelenghi
cookbooks if you don't have any good ideas!

~~~
mishkovski
For most people not eating fried food is not an option. Fried food tastes
great and we love it. Yes it is not as healthy as a salad but it is much more
fun. Being healthy is only one part of the equation. Eating is a complex
process and very important part of our lives which can be adversely affected
by any type of limitations. Probably moderation is the key to a healthy and
satisfying diet.

~~~
andy_ppp
I'm only teasing with my comment of course, but some people seem to manage
just fine avoiding fried food. You are right - it is socially the accepted
norm to eat fried foods, very difficult to adjust that normality from a hacker
news comment.

If you stopped eating fried food for 30 days I bet you'd think it was
disgusting to go back to; it would certainly taste very weird after a break.

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jwmoz
Can we have a tl;dr for this article?

Yet again another nutrition article that does not really much other than
confuse.

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moron4hire
Uuuuh, depends on the flavor you want to impart?

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tkyjonathan
This whole article is a bunch of BS/broscience that does not consider the many
many aspects of increasing processed fats into your diet.

