
What Is Scuttlebutt? - bottle2
https://adecentralizedworld.com/2020/03/what-is-scuttlebutt/
======
merricksb
Related discussion earlier today:

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22909984](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22909984)

Previous related HN discussions:

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16877603](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16877603)
(2 years ago)

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16273096](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16273096)
(2 years ago)

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20828356](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20828356)
(8 months ago)

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15890911](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15890911)
(2 years ago)

------
basicplus2
-Patchwork-

(Windows, MacOS, Linux)

Standalone, beginner-friendly social view of Scuttlebutt.

Recommended for first-timers.

-Patchbay-

(Windows, MacOS, Linux)

Bleeding-edge, tab-based interface with experimental features.

-Manyverse-

(Android)

Off-grid mobile app, currently in beta.

-Patchfox-

(Firefox Add-on)

A new way to access Scuttlebutt packaged as a Web Extension for Firefox. Needs
you to run sbot, or have Patchwork/Patchbay running.

[https://scuttlebutt.nz/get-started/](https://scuttlebutt.nz/get-started/)

~~~
kseistrup
The is also Oasis, which is web-based and runs whereever nodejs runs. It has
ssb-server builtin, so you needn't run sbot/ssb-server yourself.

⌘ [https://github.com/fraction/oasis](https://github.com/fraction/oasis)

Under heavy development, but works well and is easy to use.

------
upofadown
That was mostly about what it wasn't. This might be a bit more to the point:

* [https://scuttlebutt.nz/about/](https://scuttlebutt.nz/about/)

Added: I found this descriptive article that talks about how it works:

* [https://boingboing.net/2017/04/07/bug-in-tech-for-antipreppe...](https://boingboing.net/2017/04/07/bug-in-tech-for-antipreppers.html)

------
dorianmariefr
cached version:
[https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:K8ZviV...](https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:K8ZviVxFPlkJ:https://adecentralizedworld.com/2020/03/what-
is-scuttlebutt/+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=fr)

------
socceroos
Scuttlebutt is what you use until GnuNet goes stable. Just like Hurd.

~~~
olah_1
GnuNet sounds really cool. I've been reading about it. Are there any alpha
versions of app implementations? Anything that a user can try at all yet?

~~~
rambojazz
Gnunet has been in alpha for decades. You can install it from any OS package
manager.

~~~
olah_1
Any idea why there's no usable app running on top of it yet?

Even in alpha, it should be able to handle basic identity and message sending,
right? Secushare still not a working app?

~~~
socceroos
CADET, the end-to-end data transfer system for GNUnet, still needs to go
through some API changes before seeing a stable release. Building an app on
top of it as it stands right now may be wasted effort.

I'm keen to see it go stable.

------
chrononaut
One of the things I find most fascinating about this application and protocol
is that information can be exchanged and updated without the Internet over
USB[0] and the protocol is designed where it could be implemented to pass
information over devices like goTenna.[1]

[0] [https://boingboing.net/2017/04/07/bug-in-tech-for-
antipreppe...](https://boingboing.net/2017/04/07/bug-in-tech-for-
antipreppers.html) [1] [https://community.gotennamesh.com/t/using-gotenna-for-
scuttl...](https://community.gotennamesh.com/t/using-gotenna-for-scuttlebutt-
data-exchange/1592/7)

------
TimJRobinson
OP of the article here. Sorry the server got hugged to death, I launched the
site a few weeks ago and wasn't expecting it to end up on the HN front page.
It's back up on a better server now (and will be seeded to Scuttlebutt soon).

Happy to answer any questions.

------
mint2
The link is down I’m guessing it’s not the scuttle butt of the outdoor world.
A Scuttle butt is the protective fabric put around a climbing harness when one
is canyoneering and will be sliding down and scraping against abrasive
material like sandstone.

------
miohtama
How does it compare to Mastodon or Diaspora?

~~~
vicheiJ2
Mastodon and Diaspora are federated softwares, which means there is still a
server/client model, but many servers (a more well known example of federated
decentralization is smtp).

ssb (common short for secure-scuttlebutt) is fully decentralized, which means
that there is no server/client anymore, everyone is a node (like the initial
idea of bitcoin).

I'm biased in favor of full decentralization, but here are the main
differences I can think of :

* federation tends to lead to centralization again, because everyone use the same server (like gmail for smtp)

* full decentralization makes it easier to build custom software (you have access to the whole data, without being constrained by an api). But this is not true for ssb, because it's harder than it should to build software on top of it.

* it's easier to change software with full decentralization, because you don't have an "account" owned by a given server (think: it's hard to migrate from a mail address to an other)

* onboarding is more difficult with full decentralization, because you have no easy entrypoint like a server is

~~~
miohtama
Dose every node need a full copy of data?

------
sylvain_kerkour
What happen if I receive message N+1 but not message N (due to gossiping)?

Can I still read message N+1?

~~~
black_puppydog
usually the gossip works in a way that you should receive each feed's messages
in order. Essentially, your client will talk to a peer and say "I have
everything up to message M from feed F, got news?" and then the peer will go
"Oh, I'm caught up to message M!" and then your client will realize that N >
M, and ask for the messages [M+1...N] in order.

Of course, there _are_ ways to mess this up if you try really hard. :P

But to answer your question: Yes, you can read it. You won't be able to verify
that it is part of an unbroken signature chain, but you _will_ be able to
verify that it was signed with the feed's private key.

------
eschaton
Other than the cryptography, how does Scuttlebutt really differ from UUCP?

------
abol3z
The blog design is painful to read!

~~~
TimJRobinson
How so? What Browser/OS/Resolution?

------
arkanciscan
I understand what scuttlebutt does. What I don't understand is why. What kind
of information benefits from decentralization? The only answer I can think of
is child porn.

~~~
detaro
Anything you don't want to be at the whims of a central service shutting
down/changing their policies/...?

Using a system centered around identity and immutable records for illegal
things would be quite stupid.

~~~
arkanciscan
I can already host my own blog and have it safe from the whims of a central
service.

I'd like to hear more about how this is tied to identify, but the immutability
is my main concern with regard to illegal activity. Once your daughters nudes
are leaked on scuttlebutt how do you get them taken down?

~~~
davefp
> I can already host my own blog and have it safe from the whims of a central
> service.

Depends which central service. You aren't beholden to social media companies
at that point, but you still have to:

* play by the rules of your ISP (If you're hosting on your home connection)

* trust that your hosting service won't arbitrarily turf you out

* make sure that your domain is safe from unauthorized transfers, sudden price increases, etc.

If the convenience and ease-of-use of current systems is worth those downsides
(And for many, it is!) then fine. But it's not entirely accurate to say that
you're safe from any central service.

To your second point, legality shouldn't be the final word. There are lots of
governments with laws that are either actively or inadvertently used to
silence dissenting opinions, or used to root out various undesirables. "You
can do crime easier using it" isn't a great argument IMO.

