
Android’s Hugo Barra Departs Google for China’s Xiaomi - MekaiGS
http://allthingsd.com/20130828/androids-hugo-barra-departs-google-for-chinas-xiaomi/
======
KevinEldon
This is an interesting story. Barra leaves for Xiaomi. Ok, so that's
moderately interesting... anyone who chooses to leave Google for anything else
tends to get some kind of news (a tweet or two?) b/c Google is supposedly an
amazing place to work.

Xiaomi is a Chinese company... plenty of xenophobic, insightful, or whatever
comments to cover that topic in this thread.

The story sort of hints that Barra's girlfriend was either poached by or
traded-up for Sergey Brin (forgive my language, it's terribly sexist... but
that little tidbit in the middle of this article is not there by accident and
kinda paints that picture). Who knows? I don't... and other than being an
interesting HR case study who cares?

What's completely missing from this article is how Barra impacted Android?
I've seen him at I/O. Ok? So what else? He's a quick riser... must have done
something... but what? What's not going to get done w/ Android now that Barra
is not at Google? Perhaps that kind of information will be forthcoming.

EDIT: Spelling, grammar

~~~
rgbrenner
"anyone who chooses to leave Google for anything else tends to get some kind
of news (a tweet or two?) b/c Google is supposedly an amazing place to work."

I don't know if leaving google is news anymore. The average google employee
only stays just over a year before moving on to something else.

[http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-07-29/why-are-google-
empl...](http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-07-29/why-are-google-employees-so-
disloyal-.html)

[http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/07/24/least-loyal-
employe...](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/07/24/least-loyal-
employees_n_3641487.html)

~~~
Retric
Your reading that wrong. Google has 54,000 people working for them and the
meadean person working there right now has been with the company just over a
year. However, compared to say IBM nobody has been with the company 20+ years
and they only had 30,000 people in 2012 so the average is vary influenced by
new highers and few long term people to balance it out. Worse there data is
stale as people don't keep updating how long they have been with the company.

PS: The real number you want when comparing working conditions is turnover and
even that get's influenced by rapid growth.

~~~
fatjokes
54K... I'm guessing that's including temps and contractors, which might also
include the 1-year average duration.

~~~
ori_b
2 years ago, that was 30k. So, if you assume that the growth is linear, that's
20% of the workforce that has been there less than a year.

------
jmomo
Not to get all anti-Chinese here, because I'm not, but Xiaomi is a big-time
GPL and intellectual property/license violator. Not like that's unusual with
Chinese companies, but Xiaomi in particular has been publicly called out a
number of times on the issue.

[http://www.thepowerbase.com/2012/11/android-community-
demand...](http://www.thepowerbase.com/2012/11/android-community-demands-miui-
rom-comply-with-foss-licenses/)

If you thought some of Samsung's early Android phones were too close to
copying the iPhone, you've seen nothing. Xiaomi phones blatantly rip off
design of other manufactures, especially Apple. They are not even coy about
it.

[http://www.nytimes.com/2013/06/05/business/global/in-
china-a...](http://www.nytimes.com/2013/06/05/business/global/in-china-an-
empire-built-by-aping-apple.html?_r=0)

As far as the OSS comunity goes, this is probably a career limiting move by
Barra right here.

~~~
Cookingboy
I really don't want to sound arrogant or rude, but this comment really worries
me a bit since it represents the kind of arrogance that's prevalent in the
American tech industry. Stories like this represent a global shift of power,
financial resource, and more importantly, talent. This trend is only
accelerating as far as I can tell, whether people like it or not. The global
competition in tech space is heating up to an unprecedented degree.

Yet not even about Android or the mobile market in general, a comment about
the feeling of OSS community gets voted to top...

~~~
kailuowang
What do you think Hugo Barra can bring to Xiaomi? I mean as you said in the
other comment, culture in Chinese tech industry is completely different from
in U.S. not to mention Google. So I am curious on your opinion about this.
Honestly speaking, given Xiaomi's marketing style, I wouldn't be surprised if
there is a brand image consideration of this high profile hiring. What do you
think?

~~~
Cookingboy
Brand image would definitely be important, but not for the Chinese market
there. I doubt that many people in China know who Hugo is. I even know quite a
few people who don't know what Google is. If I have to guess, it's for
building infrastructure (connections) of Xiaomi breaking into the North
American market. Xiaomi's CEO is extremely ambitious and there is no way he'd
sit out of THE most profitable mobile market in the world. So he starts by
making a high profile hiring first, good PR move and a practical move.

~~~
ZeroGravitas
From Hugo Barra's G+: "In a few weeks, I'll be joining the Xiaomi team in
China to help them expand their incredible product portfolio and business
globally — as Vice President, Xiaomi Global."

[https://plus.google.com/u/0/+HugoBarra/posts/BzZMqRht1xQ](https://plus.google.com/u/0/+HugoBarra/posts/BzZMqRht1xQ)

So expansion outside of China seems to be the reason.

~~~
sirkneeland
Ironically, the social network from which he posted is blocked in China.

------
GuiA
Are there any China-based HNers willing to give a perspective on the startup
situation in large Chinese cities? How friendly is China to entrepreneurs and
their ilk? How likely is it that in a few years, it will be common for SV
engineers to move to China for better opportunities?

I have several friends who have lived/worked in China, and I always hear very
conflicted reports. On one hand, that there are plenty of smart, capable
people, that the tech industry is booming, that it's well on its way to
displace {Silicon Valley|USA|etc.}.

On the other hand, I also hear that it's impossible to do business without
running into corrupt organizations/officials, that ruthless copying is
celebrated more than true innovation, and so on.

Would love to hear more takes on the topic.

~~~
Cookingboy
I'm not China-based, but I grew up in China, is now working in Silicon Valley.
My father now runs a medium sized tech company in Nanjing and he used to be a
high level exec at one of the largest Chinese tech companies. I actually
follow the Chinese tech scene relatively closely due to this.

What you heard is all true, and those are actually not really conflicting
point of views. The situation in China is very unique and cannot be fully
explained without going on and on about the culture and its current
political/economical climate.

A few points to note though: Tech people there are smart, educated, and very,
very hard working. However the number one thing they all value is
"efficiency", or rather: "the efficiency of getting things done". I've talked
to people from Tencent, and one guy laughed at American companies approach of
writing good, scalable, maintainable but very often over-engineered code. Over
at Tencent they very often do whatever it takes to be first to market, and if
needed to be, refactor everything 6 months down the road, and rinse wash
repeat. It's the only approach that works for them in a hugely competitive
market (also the largest one in the world). Company management wouldn't
tolerate coding practices that very often serves no purpose other than to
stroke the ego of senior software architects.

One may argue the merits of that approach, but if you look at how well
services like Weibo, QQ, and Taobao scale (I think Taobao handled the largest
E-commerce single-day-ordering in the world last year without having any major
problems), it obviously works just as well as the western approach.

So an extension to this mentality is that whatever method it takes to get
things done is the best and most celebrated method. Even if it includes brutal
copying of a competitor's business model, or bribery of a government official,
or direct corporate espionage being employed. The Art of War never mentioned
any code of business conduct.

I have a hypothesis that a hardworking American engineering with a super-
competitive dog-eats-dog Wall Street mentality may do very well in China, or
even enjoy it, but I would never go there with any sort of idealistic vision
of an "utopia".

Things happen there happen very fast, and a lot of money flows around very
quickly, countless opportunities come and go on a daily basis. It's an amazing
place that can make and crush people in the blink of an eye, so in the end,
it's really up to what kind of person you are and what kind of lifestyle you
want to pursue.

~~~
CitizenKane
I can definitely back this up. Though, I've been living in Nanjing and I can
say that I would not want to be a technical worker here. Overpaid and
underworked seems to be the norm, at least out of the ones I'd met.

Would have liked to get the chance to meet your father, sadly I'm leaving
Nanjing on Saturday.

~~~
reedlaw
You mean overworked and underpaid I presume?

~~~
CitizenKane
Indeed I did. That's what I get for commenting before having any coffee.

------
colmvp
"Sources in position to know tell AllThingsD that Barra recently tendered his
resignation, but that it came before a recent personal situation related to
the end of a romantic relationship he had with another Googler, and is
unrelated. That Googler is now seeing the company’s co-founder Sergey Brin. As
AllThingsD reported earlier today, Brin has split with his wife, and is in
that new relationship."

Whoa. Doesn't that seems like weirdly intimate details that really didn't need
to be mentioned in a published article?

~~~
danso
In this case, I think the personal details are relevant. The premise of this
article raises the question, "Why him? Why resign? Why now?", which, if you're
operating completely from the business/professional mindset, leads you to
wonder if something is wrong in the Android shop.

But if he left because of an uncomfortable personal situation, then that is
highly relevant to onlookers, because it removes unwarranted questions about
the state of Android at Google.

~~~
yohui
But didn't the article note that the salacious details were irrelevant
immediately after introducing them?

And if the suggestion is that perhaps personal issues nevertheless _were_ a
factor, then they still could have done without most of that gossipy detail.

It's distasteful, no excuses.

------
petermcd
Xiaomi's founder, Lei Jun, is an experienced Internet entrepreneur, and
Xiaomi's management has a number of ex-Google China and ex-Motorola China
folks. So, as a tech entrepreneur in Beijing, I see Xiaomi as more
international than most Chinese tech companies (and way more of a tech company
than any of the Chinese State Owned Enterpriese (SOEs) that operate in the
tech sector).

It's interesting to me that they hired Mr. Barra away from Google. Perhaps he
already had a working relationship with people at Xiaomi?

Welcome to Beijing, Hugo!

~~~
seanmcdirmid
Most of the laowai (foreigners) I've known to work for Chinese companies get
really good compensation but last only 6 months or so...there is something
about a company (Qihoo...) that uses timecards for all their programmers, and
expects 6-day work weeks, that is quite dehumanizing. Maybe Xiaomi is
different, but just having ex-Google/Moto China talent wouldn't be reassuring
to me, especially if management is all Chinese, or worse, he would be the only
laowai in the company. The culture issues would just be so huge.

Who knows why he chose to come here? This is quite a personal decision.

------
tianshuo
I can give some insider perspective on Xiaomi as a Chinese guy(Xiaomi user,
but not fanboy). Xiaomi was recently evaluated at ten billion dollars. They
are THE HOTTEST series of smartphones that young Chinese people and recently
their parents are trying to get. Since 2011, it has brought several
competitive phones to market, usually priced 300 dollars, selling millions
within minutes online. And the quad-core 4.7 inch RED-MI which was partnered
with Tencent sells for about 150 dollars, which is winning over the lower end
market in China. It has this beautifully polished MIUI OS, which is much
better than the original Android, and most other distributions(there are
places better than iOS). At the same price, most Chinese made phones, incl.
Lenovo, Huawei, Coolpad, have mediocre hardware and software. Xiaomi is often
sold at 10% the price online at Taobao, since you need tremendous luck to buy
one online (The first batch of Red-MI was sold in 90 seconds, 7 million users
were waiting for it, only 10 thousand got one). So to say, Xiaomi is a company
creates pretty good smartphones at a fraction of the of ip5 and S4 that mostly
everyone in China wants, while mostly everyone outside China has never heard
of it. I guess Hugo Barra would be a boon for the internationalization of
Xiaomi smartphones.

------
Roritharr
This reads like the beginning a shakespearean drama, filled with betrayal,
vows for vengence, unexpected twists...

I hope most of it isn't true.

------
senthilnayagam
Two posts today about google romance, Hugo is leaving as he broke up with his
girlfriend a googler And Sergei Brin is romantically involved with a
subordinate .

~~~
Cookingboy
I can't comprehend the second part of your sentence :(

~~~
senthilnayagam
[http://allthingsd.com/20130828/google-co-founder-sergey-
brin...](http://allthingsd.com/20130828/google-co-founder-sergey-brin-
and-23andme-co-founder-anne-wojcicki-have-split/)

------
alek_1982
here is it from China: xiaomi is a pure e-commerce phone manufactor,it put a
very cheap phone to market with highest chips from qualcomm.

how it succeed? it has a miui os, it is 10% owned by qualcomm,made them get
cheapest and newest chip, and it's pure sales is online, which made it a huge
treat to other mobile phone maufactor.

------
moca
Since Hugo's departure happened right after Nexus 4 price cut, they are very
likely related. It is embarrassing + losing money for Google to sell 16GB
Nexus 4 at $249 while 16GB iPhone 5 at $649. As the product VP, Hugo did a
poor job on Nexus product quality, marketing/sales, and inventory management.
Not surprised to see him leaving the ship.

NOTE: Nexus 7 2013 recently had GPS and touch problem and required another OS
update to fix them. In fact, Nexus phones never had good product quality ever
since Nexus One.

~~~
xur17
Do you have an evidence to back this up? They reduced the price on the Galaxy
Nexus in a similar fashion last year, so I assumed this was a normal price
reduction.

~~~
moca
As an observer of mobile market, I don't think this is normal price cut.
Galaxy Nexus was more reasonably priced, $399 initially, then $349, see
[http://www.theverge.com/2012/6/27/3120987/galaxy-nexus-
hspa-...](http://www.theverge.com/2012/6/27/3120987/galaxy-nexus-hspa-
unlocked-price-drop-349). There is no chance for Google to make any profit on
Nexus 4 at $199, if warranty and customer service cost is factored in. If the
product is good, price cut to $249/$299 would be reasonable. There is
obviously serious issue to justify such aggressive price cut. NOTE: Microsoft
wrote off $900M after Surface price cut.

Regarding Nexus product quality, it is well known problematic. I never saw any
Nexus phone with good camera, battery life, wireless reception. The customer
service is problematic at best. These problems existed ever since Nexus One.

~~~
dannyr
Yeah. It's not possible that components this year could be cheaper than the
year before.

#sarcasm

~~~
moca
Cheaper, but not that cheap. Moto X, comparable spec with Nexus 4, has
$210-220 Bill of Materials (BOM). Adding cost of sales, warranty, customer
service, there is very little margin left, if any.

