

Dune Genesis (1980) - walterbell
http://moodleshare.org/mod/page/view.php?id=2453

======
JonnieCache
It probably doesn't need to be said here, but if you haven't read Dune, stop
what you're doing and read Dune. If like me you enjoyed the idea of LoTR but
found the writing irritating, you're going to bloody love Dune.

Don't worry too much about the many sequels, they can get a bit too weird. The
first book stands alone just fine.

~~~
tspiteri
_Don 't worry too much about the many sequels, they can get a bit too weird.
The first book stands alone just fine._

True, but if you decide to read the sequels, only read the Frank Herbert
sequels. The Brian Herbert/Kevin J. Anderson novels are more like poor
fanfiction than sequels.

~~~
ekianjo
Even the Herbert sequels are not really that good. I'd recommend new readers
to stop at Dune to avoid destroying their image of the Universe.

~~~
jerf
My stock recommendation is: The first book is a classic for a reason. However,
if you don't like it, stop here. The subsequent books will not change your
opinion. In fact Herbert may really not be your thing. (He has a certain
unique feel to his writing, I think.)

The rest of the first trilogy is definitely more hurried and rather than
"justifiably classic" are merely pretty OK if you like that sort of thing. A
lot of people jam up here.

God Emperor of Dune is one of those books that is more fun to read the second
time than the first, because the first time you really want the primary plot
line to finish up and it feels like it is dragging. It really isn't, the rest
of the content is quite worthy and the book would be made worse for removing
it, but the first time through it doesn't feel that way. I like it better on
re-reads, but this is a lot to ask of a reader. (Another one I feel this way
is A Deepness in the Sky by Vinge. It's _packed_ with goodness and I love it,
but in the first read the middle half of the book can really drag since the
goodness isn't in the "A plot".)

Finally, if you make it this far, Chapterhouse and Heretics are once again
quite fun reads and re-reads. But it can be hard to get this far in the first
place.

My suspicion is that a lot of people who blanket bemoan all the sequels never
made it as far as Chapterhouse Dune. But then, it's perfectly understandable.

Oh, and I'll edit this to include my video recommendations: The classic Dune
movie should be considered only loosely related, IMHO. The Sci-Fi (before it
was "SyFy") miniseries of the book is good _if_ you've already read the book
_and_ you view it as a filmed theatrical production rather than a "movie".
Which, IMHO, actually works, as theatrical tropes are a better medium for Dune
than conventional movie tropes in a lot of ways, but if you don't know what
you're getting in to can be a shock. The miniseries of the second two books is
better produced, but IIRC still requires you to have read the story first to
really understand it. I definitely don't recommend them as your intro to the
series.

~~~
shabda
Like the comment below, I prefer God Emperor of Dune to Dune. In the first
book, the universe is not specced out, the characters don't have enough
backstory.

By the later books, you start feeling the expanse of the universe, the
incredible loneliness the universes most powerful entity must endure until the
golden path is secure.

------
andyjohnson0
The July 1980 edition of Omni, in which the Herbert's article appeared, is
available on archive.org in various formats [1]. The full collection is at [2]
and was discussed a few years ago on HN [3].

[1] [https://archive.org/details/omni-
magazine-1980-07](https://archive.org/details/omni-magazine-1980-07)

[2] [https://archive.org/details/omni-
magazine](https://archive.org/details/omni-magazine)

[3]
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4741619](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4741619)

------
ilamont
Reading Herbert's thoughts on Dune and the all-too-human nature of superheroes
reminded me of "The Bureau of Sabotage" (1) from two of his other books, _The
Dosadi Experiment_ and _Whipping Star_ :

 _In Herbert 's fiction, sometime in the far future, government becomes
terrifyingly efficient. Red tape no longer exists: laws are conceived of,
passed, funded, and executed within hours, rather than months. The
bureaucratic machinery becomes a juggernaut, rolling over human concerns and
welfare with terrible speed, jerking the universe of sentients one way, then
another, threatening to destroy everything in a fit of spastic reactions. In
short, the speed of government goes beyond sentient control ... Founded by the
mysterious "Five Ears" of unknown species, BuSab began as a terrorist
organization whose sole purpose was to frustrate the workings of government in
order to give sentients a chance to reflect upon changes and deal with them.
Having saved sentiency from its government, BuSab was officially recognized as
a necessary check on the power of government. It provides a natural (and
lucrative) outlet for society's regular crop of troublemakers, who must be
countered by society's regular crop of "do-gooders"._

FWIW, I find _Dune_ and many other classics of sci-fi (extended to film, TV
and videogames) so compelling because it's a solid story built on the
foundation of a carefully imagined and visualized universe ... down to the
political power structure. There are a few other universes worlds that also
hold up, despite some poor sequels and side projects ... Urth, LOTR, Star
Wars, Half-life, etc.

1\.
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bureau_of_Sabotage](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bureau_of_Sabotage)

------
consultutah
I just finished re-reading the series last week, including the last 2 books by
his son. Those last 2 weren't completely awful, but they certainly didn't live
up to the standards set by the original author. The only point that I was
truly disappointed with the writing was when I read the following words: "male
bene gesserit".

There were plenty of other inconsistencies as well, but as when watching any
good movie, you need to suspend reality (in this case Frank Herbert's reality)
and allow the story to play out.

I don't think I have the stomach to read the prequels, but I'm sure I'll come
back and re-read the series again and again. Very few authors take the time to
create such immersive universes.

~~~
syntern
You'll find this a fascinating read:
[http://www.oreilly.com/tim/herbert/](http://www.oreilly.com/tim/herbert/)

Tim O'Reilly made an interview with Frank Herbert on how he created his
universe, and describes the huge effort that went into it. Worth to read.
Unfortunately they don't print it anymore, but hey, at least it is available
online.

~~~
consultutah
Thank you!

------
Hasu
I have never understood why Frank Herbert isn't enshrined as the 20th
century's best science fiction author, since that's exactly what he was.

He always gets overshadowed by Asimov, Heinlein, and Clarke, who are
undoubtedly all very good. But Herbert's works have depth and timelessness
that few other writers in any genre can match. The Dune series is genius, the
ConSentiency series(only two novels and a short story or two, sadly) nearly
reaches Dune's level, and there are portions of _The Dosadi Experiment_ that
exceed anything in Dune.

~~~
AceJohnny2
He didn't write as much?

------
babuskov
Wow. I remember the first time I read it, I made a list of Herbert's gems from
Dune books:

[http://abrick.sourceforge.net/dune.points.html](http://abrick.sourceforge.net/dune.points.html)

Warning, ugly 1999's HTML and design :)

It's amazing that this page is now in top-10 when you search for "Dune Quotes"
on Google.

------
walterbell
There's a good documentary about the Dune movie that was never made,
[http://www.rogerebert.com/reviews/jodorowskys-
dune-2014](http://www.rogerebert.com/reviews/jodorowskys-dune-2014) &
[http://jodorowskysdune.com/trailer.html](http://jodorowskysdune.com/trailer.html)

~~~
jameskilton
Fantastic documentary, but to be fair, Jodorowsky never actually read Dune.
The story and message were completely different from Dune the book.

~~~
mwerd
Jodorowsky did read Dune according to the documentarian:

"The truth is that he had not read it when he had the idea to make the film.
At that point, someone had told him it was good. Hilarious. But once he
embarked on his mission, he of course read it as he did the screenplay
adaptation before anything. His film would have been remarkably loyal to the
novel, of course with some of his own genius in the mix."

[http://www.reddit.com/r/movies/comments/2csd3c/frank_pavich_...](http://www.reddit.com/r/movies/comments/2csd3c/frank_pavich_here_director_of_jodorowskys_dune/cjimbe2)

------
hownottowrite
Not one mention of The Seven Pillars of Wisdom by TE Lawrence? I'm actually
reading that book right now; so many parallels. It's a shame Herbert didn't
mention Lawrence in this essay.

~~~
walterbell
a.k.a. Lawrence of Arabia,
[https://archive.org/details/SevenPillarsOfWisdomByT.e.Lawren...](https://archive.org/details/SevenPillarsOfWisdomByT.e.LawrencewithIllustrationsAndMaps)

------
peter303
I re-read Frank's Dune books every decade and they still speak across a half
century of time. In the 1960s pollution and over population were the
environmental issues. But now others like global warming predominate. Plus
there is a lot of Arabism in Dune and mid-East wars have been growing in the
past 20 years.

------
alexfisher
Read all the Dune books through Mentats of Dune by Brian Herbert and Kevin J.
Anderson. Loved them all! Favorite series ever-- love, politics, philosophy,
technology, fantasy. Brilliant.

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__david__
That was phenomenal. I've always loved Dune and it's complicated, detailed
storyline. Herbert's comparison to a fugue is incredibly apt.

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paulbjensen
I grew up reading Dune, and then reread it when I was in University. Thanks
for sharing this, especially liked how he likened the themes in the book to
existing problems of that time.

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whoisthemachine
His writing is always of the highest quality.

