
Young Americans Are Killing Marriage - JumpCrisscross
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-04-04/young-americans-are-killing-marriage?cmpid=BBD040417_BIZ&utm_medium=email&utm_source=newsletter&utm_term=170404&utm_campaign=bloombergdaily
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ramenmeal
That title is ridiculous. I just skimmed the article, but do they think that
young americans want to live with their parents? It's all just an affect the
recession we're still coming out of. People want to have a stable platform
before having a family, and that's harder to have when the job market is down.

~~~
thyrsus
The subtitle is much better: "Millennials are lagging behind on the
traditional markers of adulthood."

Also:

"There's also no sign that young people today are lazier than three decades
ago. In 1980, 74 percent of baby boomers reported that they had worked in the
past week, the Census data show. In 2015, slightly more millennials, 77
percent, said they'd been to work in the past week."

~~~
mikekchar
TL;DR: It seems to me that this is a misleading evaluation of the data. It
appears to me that more people are being financially supported by their
parents.

In 1980 the unemployment rate (according to a quick google search) was around
7%. In 2015 it was around 5%. If I understand correctly, the unemployment rate
measures the number of people actively looking for work. So I guess this means
that in both cases the population between ages 25-35 who are not working, but
also are not looking is pretty close to 20% (!?!?!)

So, if I look at the pretty graphs in the article, the percentage of married
people in 1980 is nearly 70%, while it is roughly 40% in 2015. It's
frustrating because I have no idea if they are counting "equivalent to
married" status here (or if that's a thing in the US). The number of people
living with their parents (and presumably not in an "equivalent to married"
situation) is about 10% in 1980 and about 20% in 2015.

So what I'm getting at here is that some part of the 20% that are not looking
for work is because their spouse (or equivalent) is working, some part is
because the parents are working, and some part is because the people are
independently wealthy or living on the streets.

I couldn't get poverty rates for 1980, but it appears to have been relatively
consistent for the last 30-40 years (with a reported dip in the 1990's). So,
it appears to me that, indeed, there are more people being supported by their
parents in 2015, while in 1980 there were more people supported by their
spouses. I think this probably _does_ indicated a problem in the future,
though less to do with the institution of marriage and more to do with the
financial outlook of the population.

Aside: for an organisation built on financial data, Bloomberg publishes some
pretty awful articles data-wise.

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tenpies
Supplementary factor: growing up hearing that 50% of marriages will fail and
then seeing what a bad divorce does to everyone involved.

As a man, I've heard enough horror stories to never want to marry.

~~~
devoply
In the recent come back tour a comedian, Dave Chapelle, said marriage is a bad
contract that you should never sign. He's right. Marriage in the US is an
extremely shitty deal from the perspective of finance and business.

~~~
pmiller2
We should also note that Dave Chappelle has been married for over 15 years.

~~~
jcslzr
yes but for his own dialogues, he is kind of in an open marriage, so it is
much easier (I mean the guy talks about going to the club, and trying to get
other women) I dont know many married man at the club chasing women and their
wifes being ok with it.

I am not saying its wrong, just saying a marriage like that does not seem
really difficult to last 15 years.

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a3n
Since in America we no longer need kids to till our fields, pick rags or
otherwise make a living, there's no economic incentive to having kids. So if
you have a kid by choice, you probably feel at least optimistic enough that
you'll be able to raise your kid under a roof.

But if you're always hearing that your generation is worse off than your
parents and grandparents (in some way), that has to discourage a lot of people
from having kids, and so there's less incentive to marry. Not zero incentive,
but, one incentive has been weakened.

And then, if you actually _are_ worse off than your parents, evidence being
that you're living with your parents, that has to also discourage yourself
from wanting to marry (can't afford to move out, don't want to honeymoon under
my Star Wars poster) or discourage someone else from marrying you (don't want
to honeymoon under their Star Wars poster).

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cheez
Uh. No. Sorry. The previous generation murdered marriage. Who wants to be
under the sword of Damocles every day...

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briantmaurer
Better birth control is probably a major factor that is often forgotten. The
efficacy rates of a Progestogen IUD paired with a condom are high enough to
eliminate fear of an unexpected child. I assume eliminating that fear removes
a marriage incentive for many people.

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camelNotation
This seems like a necessary next step in the iconoclasm of western
civilization. Like all social and cultural norms of our era, marriage must be
called into question. We (society) will question its value and determine
whether or not its purported value still exists. I think it does, but the only
way to really convince most people is to remove it and see what that does to
society. The same goes for gender, democracy, religion, and other structures
we take for granted in the modern world. They will first be destroyed, then
either rebuilt with greater purity or discarded altogether. These changes may
be harsh, damaging, or even violent, but that's the course we've all chosen
(not me personally, but the modern world in general). These changes will
happen, so I am not surprised to see these results.

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soulnothing
The headline of this piece seems clickbaitey in a way.The article just seems
to be several loosely correlated statistics.

To me, being a evil lazy millennial, it sort of feels like we inherited a
scorched and salted earth. We're trying to till the land to the best we can.
But it's not working.

On living with parents/home owners. I did that until 27 to save money. I then
bought a house, as per my prior comments worst mistake in my life. It's not
just me several of my friends, bought homes and are in a similar boat. The
general wisdom I hear from people in my age range about owning a home is F
that noise. As I've said it can work, but be smart on it.

So due to rising real estate prices. What do you do stay with parents, room
mates, or live pay check to pay check. Our living situation has changed
drastically over the past several years. Jobs are centralizing in certain
areas. While jobs leave another area. I can attest to companies leaving one
area, killing a city.

Continuing on that I feel we're in a fight or flight mode. There have been
other articles about the increase of male suicides, burn out, increased
therapy attendance, decrease in intimacy etc. I mean I didn't grow up in the
80s. But were there a plethora of articles like that at the time.

We are not staying in one place long enough. A job is no longer a guarantee
like it was. It's now you pay me enough to get by, my bills but that about it.
So it sorta comes to do we dig in and fight for what we want. Or try and fly
to some where better. Then we start life because of college with one sword
over our head.

Then we have dating, relationship and social dynamic changes. Technology has
changed how we socialize and interact. Now we are no longer tied to just our
group of friends. We can access anyone, a myriad of people.

Dating has become almost a shopping experience. I've had a number of friends
rattle off a list of ingredients they want out of their partner. There is
nothing inherently wrong with that. Comparatively older love tales just seemed
simpler. I've also seen more non monogamous relationships crop up. Which I'm
still trying to determine if that's due to more relaxed social standards, the
aforementioned, or I hang out with esoteric people.

Moving to kids, I know a number of people. Who fall into the we don't want to
raise kids in this world, finances, health, or I don't where I'll be 6 months
from now. Doing the math for retirement on a 6 figure salary, home with 1k
mortgage, and a wife. With an intent of one vacation a year, three date nights
a month, and retirement savings. Kids didn't factor into the budget.

I didn't grow up with many broken homes. But I had friends who did. My concern
with marriage now is more the sue happy nature. I also feel like I live on a
tectonic plate, and don't know which way it's going to shift next.

I'm not crying that millennials have it difficult, or are overwhelmed. I just
dislike these articles shifting blame solely on the younger generation. We are
at an inflection point. Alot, alot has changed over the past two decades. Yet
we're still trucking on with standards of living from several decades ago.

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dougmwne
Interesting tidbit: marriage rate has dropped by about 30% while living with
child rate dropped by only 15%.

