

EU recognizes Internet access as a fundamental right, on par with freedom of expression - andr
http://news.zdnet.com/2100-9595_22-299414.html

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ivankirigin
Positive rights are very different than negative rights. Right to free speech
means no one can oppress your speech, essentially barring action, so it's
called a negative right.

A right to a trial by jury is the only positive right in the US Bill of
Rights. It's a huge pain in the ass to do jury duty, in part because law
mandates we take action.

A positive right to health care coverage or internet access are ridiculous,
because it is a mandate for someone to provide service to you.

Instead of people operating in good faith through mutually beneficial
exchange, the government steps in and makes people do it. That kind of
violence or theft is bad.

I'm all for greater access to the internet. Calling it a right is a bad idea.

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anigbrowl
this is a naive viewpoint. government is not necessarily an 'other' which
impinges on us; rather, it's an organization to which people can outsource the
largest scale tasks, such as infrastructure or military defense. It would be
nice if all commercial exchanges were mutually beneficial, but they're not.

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anamax
this is a naive viewpoint. It would be nice if all govt activities were
beneficial, but they're not.

Also, commercial enterprises can do very large scale tasks such as build dams,
road systems, and the like. It's not much good at doing military defense, but
for making stuff....

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ivankirigin
If I started a country, I'd keep defense lightweight by training people in
small arms and getting a contract in place with Blackwater. Private
warfighting and defense are already viable and popular.

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donaldc
It is actually hard to tell from the article whether the EU parliament
recognized Internet access as a fundamental right. The article itself did say
that's what it did, but there was no actual quote from what the EU parliament
passed that corroborated that they actually said this.

In any case, I think that holding Internet access to be a fundamental right is
confusing means with ends. Freedom of expression is a fundamental right. One
could argue that freedom to pursue education and better oneself is a
fundamental right. Internet access is an implementation detail of ensuring
these rights in the 21st century.

Fundamental rights are about principles; something like universal Internet
access is about implementation.

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johnnybgoode
I believe Estonia did this first, a few years ago. This only dilutes real
rights, such as freedom of expression.

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alnayyir
Wait what?

What makes freedom of expression a real right and not access to internet?

Who made you king of the universe?

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johnnybgoode
If one can simply make up any rights someone feels like having, even when they
contradict fundamental rights (see my earlier post), I don't think they can be
considered "real".

If you believe in _equal_ rights (i.e., _nobody_ is king of the universe) then
you can't support the infringing of some people's rights for the benefit of
others.

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gort
Isn't taxation precisely that? I mean, if the government coming and taking
some portion of your stuff isn't an infringement of your negative rights, what
is?

Yet I'm all for tax, if it pays for necessary stuff.

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johnnybgoode
Assuming you didn't agree to it, it sure is. But it's possible to want the
necessary stuff without favoring a tax.

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Ardit20
Unfortunately the EU Parliament has no legislative power. The Council of
Ministers, which according to the article seems to contest that resolution is
the final arbiter. However it seems quite a nice move and perhaps if it gets
publicity and support the council of ministers might find their hands
tightened.

