
Ask HN: I can't do this anymore, I need help - kriptonic
Hello.<p>I&#x27;ve had enough.<p>Hear me out. I&#x27;ve spent the last 5 years of my life slaving away on startups and new business ideas and I&#x27;m failing, bad. So tonight I&#x27;ve come to the conclusion that I clearly have no fucking idea what I&#x27;m doing. I&#x27;ve lost pretty much all my friends because of the time I&#x27;ve spent trying to make my ideas work. I have spent money I can&#x27;t afford on ideas that have never came to light. And now it&#x27;s 2:31am on a Sunday evening and my girlfriend is in bed wondering why I won&#x27;t come give her a cuddle, but I can&#x27;t. Because I know I have to wake up tomorrow morning and hit the repeat button on my life again. I have to work all day just to put a roof over our heads. She wants to travel and damn I want to take her so bad, but I can&#x27;t. I hate what my life has become.<p>But I have a solution, because I know complaining won&#x27;t change this. Truth is, I have no idea about business. That&#x27;s why I can&#x27;t do it. I come from a working class family, I have working class friends, no one I know has any idea about business or even any interest in the topic. I&#x27;ve read a lot though: on business, development, management &amp; self help. I can do it, I know I can, I just need some guidance. So here I am; asking for guidance. I have about $5000 and I&#x27;m willing to put that into an idea, and I have some of those too. So who&#x27;s ready to play ball with me? I can guarantee the technical skills, could you guarantee the business skills? Maybe together we won&#x27;t need to press the repeat button on our alarm clocks next Monday.<p>Let me know,
hnineedhelp [at] gmail.com
======
pyrrhotech
Here's the better idea. Get a 9 to 5 six figure job. It will be boring, I
know. Life sucks like that sometimes. Most of us have one.

Next, live like a pauper, saving 60-70+% of that income. Spend your free time
doing exactly 3 things 1. working on a side project 2. spending time with your
girlfriend. 3. exercise (never count this out, no matter what your life
circumstances otherwise)

Then just wait 5 more years. You will either have something going from your
side project or you will have enough money saved to legitimately work full
time on something without worrying about bills

As far as the idea, go for something as boring as possible. Preferably
something that someone else is already paying money for but that the incumbent
product is shitty or lacking in some major way. Fix it or make it signficantly
cheaper. Business is just a wrapper around value.

Create value, get paid. That's how capitalism works.

~~~
davedx
> As far as the idea, go for something as boring as possible. Preferably
> something that someone else is already paying money for but that the
> incumbent product is shitty or lacking in some major way. Fix it or make it
> signficantly cheaper. Business is just a wrapper around value.

I made something boring:
[https://invoicerunner.com](https://invoicerunner.com)

Nobody wants to use it because most people make boring things. The market of
boring things is saturated in most cases.

I feel like I'm back at square 1 personally.

Building a successful business is _hard_. You don't just "build it and they
will come". There is no one-line answer to success.

~~~
HeyLaughingBoy
Nobody's buying it because you're not marketing it.

This "Start managing your invoices today. Take the stress out of tracking
what's due, when, and to who" should be at the top of the page. The photo of a
woman at a computer does absolutely nothing to explain what you're selling. It
was pure curiosity that made me page down enough to figure out what you were
selling. Most people who come across the page after googling "invoice
management" or the like will just hit the back button.

Typing fast, gotta leave, don't mean to be rude, but that's my feedback.

~~~
davedx
Thanks for the feedback! It's appreciated. I'm going to remove the woman with
the iPad.

------
thekenwheeler
You're trying to force it. That's not going to work.

Stop. Get a job. A job that you like.

Then just be good at it. Better yet, be the best at it, and make sure it is
something you are passionate about and talented in.

It really is that simple.

Nobody wants to invest in somebody with a bunch of failed entrepreneurial
ventures. But if you sit back, take a check, work on cool shit and build an
impressive body of work, well then perhaps people will be more willing to
invest in you.

And for god's sake, go bang your girlfriend and give her a massage.

~~~
Skovy
You sir, deserve my upvote for making me laugh on HN.

~~~
dang
This is a bad comment for Hacker News. We want to optimize for signal/noise
ratio. It's good to laugh, and to upvote; reporting that one laughed, and
upvoted, not so much.

~~~
vxNsr
Not to derail this anymore but:

I've often wondered about that, I know that in reddit and even slashdot these
type of comments are lauded even though they add nothing to the dialog people
like them, because well, they do do give us another comment to upvote, because
you can add one point to the original comment. Still they deal with all that
extra chaff by physically minimizing comments that don't get enough likes thus
they don't interrupt the flow of conversation as much. HN doesn't have such a
feature so I understand why, you're against it, I personally only downvote
these type of comments if the user has a history and the comment is >2 words.

~~~
dang
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7494756](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7494756)

------
kiddz
I'm super concerned for your well being and I don't even know you. What
screams to me is that the last thing you should do is to try to do anything
like start a business. It does not matter if you follow the best advice, and
even do everything that you had done wrong right going forward. When you say
things like "I hate what my life has become," then just stop what you're doing
for a while.

Really. . . just stop.

Now, I know this will be hard to do. You've probably defined yourself as
something different than your peers, and your peers (although not doing start-
ups/tech etc) probably admire you. Hell, even your girlfriend lying in bed
alone is probably saying that you're a mad genius and that's why your on your
computer. Anyways, still even with the social pressure to go on, I suggest you
just stop.

Spend the rest of the year focusing of feeling better not doing better. Grab
some books, take that trip, and just give yourself a break. I'm not one to
suggest self-help books but Stephen Covey has this excellent metaphor in 7
Habits about keeping the saw sharp. The saw is you. Right now it seems like
the blade is pretty dull from excessive work. So stop and reread what you
posted hear and see how you have described what you have lost.

Grab beers with your friends. Spend time with your gf. Save that 5K because 5k
is far better than 0k. And on a side note, any person who e-mails you saying
that they want to work with you, given how you have expressed your current
state, should stop too.

------
hnriot
* I've lost pretty much all my friends because of the time I've spent trying to make my ideas work.

I suspect that work has nothing to do with this, more likely the negativity
and _the real reason_ why you're so obsessed with work. I think work is your
crutch, not your problem.

* And now it's 2:31am on a Sunday evening and my girlfriend is in bed wondering why I won't come give her a cuddle, but I can't.

Most people are asleep then, that, by no stretch of the imagination is
"evening".

You need to stop whining and get a job. Learn how to be a person, relate to
your girlfriend, balance your interests, sort your shit out. Whining to the hn
crowd is not the way to sort your life out, you need to stop looking to others
to sort things out for you.

No business person with any chops is going to read this and want to go into
business with you. You can't sleep, you can't keep your end up in a
relationship with your girlfriend, you've been working five years and have
only $5k to show for it, you've admitted to failing at everything!

~~~
kriptonic
Hello.

You make a lot of assumptions about me.

I'm not trying to whine, I saw a problem and I'm asking for help fixing that
problem in return for my time and money. Also, I have a job.

Me and my girlfriend have a great relationship and I do everything I can to
make sure she's happy.

I have a lot more than $5000 to show for it. That's is just what I have for a
side project.

I don't fail at everything. I'm only 23, and I think I've achieved quite a lot
for my age. I wouldn't say all of my ideas have failed, but I aim high and I
feel like I'm failing overall.

~~~
meric
"I do everything I can to make sure she's happy."

That's the wrong way around. Do everything to make sure _you_ are happy, with
or without her. It's up to her if she wants to be happy with you.

~~~
wmboy
Wow, maybe if you're in it for the short term, but if you want a long term
relationship or marriage, that "make, sure I'm happy" mantra sure ain't going
to work.

Imagine if we had that attitude with our children? Or mother?

~~~
meric
If you're not happy, whatever you do, your unhappiness will be contagious, and
people close to you will catch it too. Have you ever talked to someone unhappy
pretending everything is fine, and how comfortable were you in talking about
happy topics about you to said person, and were you tempted to ask the other
person what's bothering them?

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emotional_contagion](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emotional_contagion)

Therefore, for others to be happy, you must be happy first. You cannot rely on
other's happiness to lift you up and IMHO you should not let your own
unhappiness fester and drag everyone around you down.

Imagine a child, whose parents come home in a bad mood everyday, though they
do everything to make the child happy except changing their own mood, will the
child grow up as a well-rounded individual?

~~~
jtheory
Eh, your above comment was still pretty misguided:

> That's the wrong way around. Do everything to make sure you are happy, with
> or without her. It's up to her if she wants to be happy with you.

...though you're pulling in the right direction here.

It's not either/or; you & your partner have to take care of yourselves, in the
context of taking care of your entire family unit. I've been married for 14
years and have 2 kids. If I ignore the balance and either forget to suss out
(and attend to) the needs of my partner & kids, or if I try to "do what they
want" with no attention to my own needs, it goes poorly for us all. My wife
has to do the same thing.

There's work and short-term sacrifice involved; sometimes I do things I
wouldn't do, on my own, because I have longer-term goals in mind that rely on
my relationships w/ wife & daughters.

But the same applies to us all, and this is something we discuss with our kids
all the time -- e.g., "sure, I _could_ clean up all this stuff myself, but I'm
probably going to be cranky about it, and we'll have less time to read
together this afternoon...".

------
austinz
It would help to know why you're failing.

\- Do your project ideas never get finished?

\- If not, is it because of technical issues that make it difficult to get
your product working?

\- If not, is it because you lose interest or the people you work with lose
interest?

\- If not, is it because there are non-technical factors outside your control
that you cannot successfully deal with (e.g. licensing agreements)?

\- Do your startups not get traction in the marketplace?

\- If so, is it because you're trying to unsuccessfully compete with a larger
player in the field?

\- If so, is it because you're not waiting long enough, or your expectations
are too high?

\- If so, is it because you've tried the standard promotional channels and
nobody is paying attention?

\- If so, is it because the market has shifted in the period between inception
and release in such a way your product is now redundant or obsolete?

\- Are your projects torpedoed by issues related to the people you are working
with, if any?

\- Are your projects torpedoed by the fact that you run out of living expense
money before they have a chance to catch on?

Although all startups face some similar base set of failure modes, the
challenges facing (e.g.) a robotics startup can be very different from those
facing a consumer web-services startup trying to build the next Instagram.

~~~
mjolk
I like this post -- it's like an _anatomy of a failed run_.

If I may, to split your into groups:

Things you don't finish: > \- Do your project ideas never get finished? > \-
If not, is it because of technical issues that make it difficult to get your
product working? > \- If not, is it because you lose interest or the people
you work with lose interest? > \- If not, is it because there are non-
technical factors outside your control that you cannot successfully deal with
(e.g. licensing agreements)?

Ideas that fail because no one else is interested: > \- If so, is it because
you've tried the standard promotional channels and nobody is paying attention?
> \- If so, is it because the market has shifted in the period between
inception and release in such a way your product is now redundant or obsolete?

Ideas that launch, but fail because of money/scaling issues: > \- Do your
startups not get traction in the marketplace? > \- If so, is it because you're
trying to unsuccessfully compete with a larger player in the field? > \- If
so, is it because you're not waiting long enough, or your expectations are too
high? > \- Are your projects torpedoed by the fact that you run out of living
expense money before they have a chance to catch on?

Reasons that fail primarily due to interpersonal/stress reasons: > \- Are your
projects torpedoed by issues related to the people you are working with, if
any?

------
einhverfr
I have a bunch of feedback to this.

1\. You have to support yourself before you can do other things. If that means
getting standard employment, that is what you have to do.

2\. Being from a working class family is no obstacle. You _can_ do some work
on the side (make sure you check your employment contracts, make sure no
conflict of interest, and if necessary discuss with your employer). But avoid
living in the machine. Get out, spend time with friends. Maintain social
relationships. Those are important, and nevermoreso when you are in business
for yourself.

3\. Go to garage sales. Pick up used accounting textbooks. Learn enough
accounting that you can keep your own books. Accounting is the language of
business, and it is one thing you have to have at least a basic grasp of if
you are to get back into business for yourself.

4\. If you still have time, get involved in Toastmasters, to develop public
speaking ability.

5\. Surround yourself with people who will support you when you start
something but challenge you before you do. This is vitally important because
you want a clear view of the problems before you begin but you also want
people who will help you overcome problems rather than drag you down to them.

6\. You don't have to know everything yourself. You need to know people who
can help with things.

------
stevewilhelm
Below are some stats regarding starting your own business in perspective. [1]

Starting a business is hard and takes a long time. It also takes a fair amount
of luck.

May I suggest, next time you have a business idea, you pitch it to as many
successful business people you can find. They don't have to be VC's or Angel
investors. Pick any successful business owner in your community.

Ask them for their honest opinion. If they say they like it, see if they would
"put their money with their mouth is" and would invest in your idea.

In the mean time, do as others have suggested: get a good paying job and start
saving as much as you can. You are going to need much more than $5,000 to pay
for living and business expenses when you go all in on your next venture.

[1] [http://www.statisticbrain.com/startup-failure-by-
industry/](http://www.statisticbrain.com/startup-failure-by-industry/)

[http://www.forbes.com/sites/elainepofeldt/2013/06/29/the-
ris...](http://www.forbes.com/sites/elainepofeldt/2013/06/29/the-rise-of-the-
million-dollar-one-person-business/)

------
pedalpete
I'm a bit confused. You've spent the last 5 years on your own start-ups? Or
working on other people's ideas?

If you've got the technical skills, why is the $5000 so important. I'm sure
you've read about being 'lean', why do your start-up ideas require such a cost
input, if you already have the technical skills.

Where in the world are you? Technical skills seem more in demand than business
skills, but you also say that the people you know, know nothing about
business, so I suspect you aren't in one of the technology hubs.

I'll bet that if you look around in your community, you will find business
leaders. They may not be running multi-million dollar ventures, or start-ups,
but they know the basics of business. See if one of these people can help you
flush out your ideas. You'll probably find somebody willing to do it for free.
Maybe they'll even want to invest in you (later) if they see you getting the
job done and believe in your business.

Don't go blowing your $5k, but make sure you are doing what will make both you
and your GF happy. A vacation doesn't have to cost a ton, you can get creative
and have an amazing experience.

------
hoodoof
I have been where you are. If you have $5K then you are doing well. It may
sound insane but here is what you should do:

1: what's something that your girlfriend wants/needs? A bike, a computer, how
about a silver necklace. Go buy it for her and give it to here. It should cost
you about $1,000

2: When you give it to her, tell her you are taking her on a holiday. You are
paying. Spend the $4K on the holiday.

3: Do steps one and two NOW. Get up from your chair and do it now.

After this, you will have a very happy partner who will love you more because
you put your relationship ahead of stupid business.

Alternatively you could spend your last $5,000 on one of your ideas or you
could spend your $5K on someone elses idea. In either case the idea probably
won't work, and even if it is a good idea it does not need your $5K. Your
money will be gone. You will never have invested any substantial money into
yourself/your girlfriend/your relationship which will fall apart because it's
no fun and there's always money pressure and you are always stressed because
you never have a holiday and are always working. You'll be in exactly the same
position you would have been if you'd spent the $5K on her.

In the meantime, pursue your personal business ambitions as a hobby and stop
gambling everything you have on it.

~~~
kriptonic
Hi.

Thanks for the advise and you're right, but this isn't my usual nightly
routine. I took her out this weekend, like I do most weekends and I'm taking
her away to Germany this summer - she wanted to go ever since I've known her.
I'm not the perfect boyfriend, but I really do love my girlfriend and I do
everything I can for her. Mine and her happiness comes first, period. The only
reason I'm up tonight is because I wish I could give her more.

~~~
joedavison
It sounds like her expectations are way too high, and it's taking a toll on
you. Is she your girlfriend, or your wife? It might be a good idea to think
long and hard about that.

------
RollAHardSix
Better idea. Give up on some fake dream, put in the hours now at your job.
Give your girlfriend the attention she deserves or do her a favor and get away
from her. Find your own mental stability, and go from there. You'll feel a
hell of a lot better.

------
vbrendel
At 23 I was still at Uni, a nerd failing at all non-nerdy subjects, no
girlfriend, no money, no car. I had hardly any ambitions and failure was the
norm I set for myself. But I was pretty happy nonetheless.

Don't let all the hype get to you. Life is not about building Instagrams or
WhatsApps, you might as well play the lottery.

So say you can't do it and then you can... sounds like you just have a pre-
life crisis.

Set yourself up for a tiny win, like, try and run 10km, or get a first-aid
diploma. Fist pump, you're not a failure. Then set your next target. Enrol for
uni, flip some burgers. Life is the same for everybody, by the way.

The problem is, you are pretty smart; the nice thing for dumb people is that
it's easier for them to be happy but you'll get there, too.

------
RandyH
Alas, and contrary to what others are saying, being from a working class
background _is_ an obstacle. If you would have had a legacy admission to
Harvard (which you could have then most hip-ly dropped out of) and had a bunch
of frat brothers with VC dads, it would have been a different story and
everybody here knows it.

Escaping from the working class is a matter of luck, not hard work, and that's
a brute fact of reality. So don't beat yourself up about it, its not your
fault.

Whether you want to keep rolling the dice is up to you. Eventually, you would
figure it out if you keep trying. And eventually you would flip 4 heads in a
row if you keep trying. But it might take decades, literally decades.

~~~
enjo
_Escaping from the working class is a matter of luck, not hard work, and that
's a brute fact of reality._

Bullshit.

It may be harder, but it's certainly not about luck. I went to a shitty state
school (not even the flagship) in Arkansas. While I was a "frat boy" unless
I'm interested in managing a cracker barrel they are of little help.

Instead I worked my ass off to develop meaningful skills. Then I intentionally
found work with incredibly smart people who could help me. It may have taken
me _longer_ to reach my goals than someone with a Ivy League pedigree I was
absolutely able to do it. No luck involved.

I absolutely believe that anyone else can do the same. I see it every single
day.

~~~
Squarel
How were your parents in encouraging you?

Were you surrounded by an environment where the prevailing attitude was "I
never needed that skill, I do not see why you do"?

Luck determines whether your parents want you to drop out of school at 16 and
join them in the factory, or have you reading by the age of 3.

------
h1karu
Get some treez and stay blazed for a few daze to decompress, then get back to
your grind. Build a product. It doesn't have to be software.

 __I 'll give you the keys to the kingdom.. __

start selling webinars... paint yourself as someone who is qualified to teach
WHATEVER and get people to join a free 1 hour webinar where you 're going to
teach them whatever.. give them a taste and then upsell them on a package of
additional 2 hour long webinars. $200 package.

Start advertising your free webinars via social paid distribution channels.
Once you tweak it perfectly and build up some experience you'll be able to
spend a certain amount on advertising to acquire enough customers to fully
book your webinars each week.

20 people per webinar shelling out $200/each.. doing it again every week with
a new batch of people.. every time you do it you build up a video archive that
you can to build a non-webinar based video product down the road...

People feel good about spending $$ on webinars because they can get
personalized education not just a pre-packaged info-product.. all you need is
a niche people care about and some life experience that you can market as
being valuable.

This one 35 year old lady is selling webinars for $400 to teach people how to
"leverage instagram to better market your business". That's just one example..
she didn't even have any material written down when she started selling her
first webinar she just kind of learned as she went along. She's doing well
because her product is about teaching small business owners how to make more
money. You want your info-product to appeal to people who already have money
to spend.

good luck

------
ISeemToBeAVerb
Here's my 2 Cents...

First of all, DO NOT quit your job unless your new business is making money.
You know what's worse than working a job you hate? Not having any money at
all.

Secondly, stop trying to start the process with an idea. The best way to come
up with a solid business idea is to pick a market (preferably one you know
something about) and learn as much as you can about it. Observe what people
are saying. Write down what people are complaining about. Get to know them
inside and out. Once you've done the market research, THEN brainstorm ideas
based on that research. Start small. Build a landing page with an email submit
and shop the link around to your market. If they bite (which they should if
you did your research properly), then work on building out the product.

All that work should cost you nothing more than time and hosting/design. Save
that $5000 for when you'll really need it—after your product has been
validated and you have interest/pre-orders.

Good luck!!

------
lquist
Sorry to hear about your situation. For what it's worth, my advice:

Stop trying to build a startup. Build a business instead. A bootstrapped,
makes cash today business. Maybe it's a consultancy specializing in bank
software or maybe it's something else that you have expertise in, but stop
trying to build an all or nothing startup.

------
comlonq
Here is some short and sharp advice for you:

Quit this startup crap

Get a job at a large consulting firm e.g. Accenture (you will get to work with
smart and highly motivated people)

Spend time working on big enterprise projects getting paid well.

You will soon see all the complex problems that enterprises have to deal with
on a daily basis. This will fuel your next startup idea.

Fix a pain point for one of your big consultancy clients and base your startup
around that, you'll have a network of smart people and a market that's in need
of your solution.

I've spent a few years working for a large consultancy, I've worked with mega
ambitious and smart people on massive projects that I would have never seen
otherwise. I've learnt so much about tech and business that I'm now ready to
break out on my own and I have a massive network and a huge amount of savings
to do it.

Also, don't think your life has to revolve around startups. Great careers are
just as exciting.

------
nchuhoai
I don't know whether this is going to be useful to you or not, but I have been
thinking about this a lot lately, and your situation is weirdly a situation I
desire to be in and a situation I'm trying to avoid.

I want to avoid your situation, because of the large variance and unhealthy
unsustainability that accompanies the startup lifestyle.

I desire your situation, because working on new products and ideas is my
(currently) most ideal working arrangement, I value being in charge and be
flexible.

So for me the solution I have thought about and try to implement in the next
couple months is to do a split:

X% involves "mercenary labor", freelancing/remote work Y% involves working on
my on side projects Z% do other awesome things

Minimize X with the restraint of providing enough sustainable income and
maximize Z% with continious estimation of whether Y can actually make some
money realistically.

Would love any feedback

------
adamzerner
2 thoughts:

1) Try being more specific -
[http://lesswrong.com/lw/bc3/sotw_be_specific/](http://lesswrong.com/lw/bc3/sotw_be_specific/).
Perhaps you've been failing because you've been building things people don't
really want? If so, being more specific will help.

2) Perhaps it isn't worth "slaving away" on startups. I believe that the 80/20
rule is very powerful, and is applicable to startups: a small amount of the
work leads to a majority of the success. Maybe you could live a less stressful
life, and still work on startups.

If you ever want to brainstorm any startup ideas before pursuing them, HMU -
azerner3@gmail.com.

------
katelynsills
Your girlfriend should care much more about your mental health than travel.
Have you tried talking to her about what you're feeling?

------
looser
I often hear people say: Get a 9 to 5 job... But a job probably will not teach
you much about business.

I have a different advice that will give you two important lessons at the same
time:

"Sell something, as soon as possible."

If you have a product that you can build quickly. Build it and sell it, ASAP.

If you don't have a product... Good. Use the money you have and buy some
product that you can sell for more... Repeat it.

Sales is the quickest way to make money and consequently will teach you about
business.

PS: At this point it is preferable to find cheap products, so you can buy <->
sell quickly, until you have a good sum of money... then, you'll be able to
elaborate the perfect product/business you have in mind.

~~~
insuffi
2 counterpoints: 1) Lack of liquidity in "selling products". 2) Personal cash
flow issues.

~~~
ZoF
Selling software doesn't have either of these issues.

~~~
insuffi
1) Who are you selling it to? Can you find a buyer instantly? 2) Buying a
product or whatever with the aim of selling/flipping it means your money is
tied up in your product.

------
ckrailo
Hi kriptonic,

I've got about 5 years on you age-wise. I currently run the Dallas Ruby user
group. The biggest two pieces of advice I can give you are:

1) Stop stressing out over finding the next big startup idea. You're young and
have plenty of time to find the problems that you can solve in exchange for
money. Keep training your eye to find them and explore them. Read the bits
about finding out if the market is viable, testing quick-and-dirty prototypes,
etc etc. You have plenty of time. If you have a group of people you can ping
ideas off of, do so. If not, my email is in my profile and I'm happy to be a
confidential idea discusser. If it takes two years to find the next good idea,
it should be more motivating and exciting than spending two years writing
products nobody wants.

2) Get promoted. It sounds like you have a lot of skills but aren't making
enough in your day job. Figure out what it takes, like moving or improving an
essential skill or two. Maybe find a different language that pays better and
then work on that for 6 months or a year and then switch your day job to that.
This will expose you to more industries, which will gain you knowledge of
other people's problems in their industries, as well as gain you vacation
monies. If you save, you should be able take a year off when you're feeling
super confident about your next startup.

I'm also emailing this to you, but I wanted to post here for others too.
(Others: feel free to email me... it's in my profile.)

------
aviral
I guess it’s not about Business class or working class. Sometime people get
overwhelmed by an idea, and this idea has its inception from what other people
are doing. This makes you look what you are doing is not good. Business, Job,
Status, Money etc. it’s all work and just a small part of life (Life has many
more aspect). If something does not work for you, then let it go. Start new,
which bring backs balance to your life. By starting new I mean not only work,
if your work does not bring money then switch (there is no shame); if your
current job gives you a lot money but now time to spend with your loved you
are still doing a stupid thing; if your individualist character don't let you
pursue grouping (family/relation), bring a change in you (how much you devote
to life that relation)... It’s all about balance. When you are standing at
such a point in life, people can just give you advice; it’s just YOU who can
help YOURSELF. No work is big or small, real status is being a good
person…..etc.…

So my friend, let it go, start with something which will --> work for you <\--
and which will get you what ever really matter for you (your Girlfriend, time,
family). It's your time which is getting consumed and time is the most
precious thing.

It’s my recent realization after I feel in love (with my family, a girl, and
me :D )!!!

Balance is the keyword!!I guess :)

------
pawelkomarnicki
Sorry dude for being brutal, but your life attitude just... sucks :( What
about skipping the startup fever alltogether or getting a real job with
constant income and not the "you get this _generous_ equity package" (it's
never generous, it's never worth it to be honest, it's always better to have a
hard cash on your salary account). Like pyrrhotech proposed, get a job, save
some cash and spend 1-2 hours a day max on a side project. That's the only
sane way.

------
Kequc
You've got the right idea, sooner than I did. As developers we have the
capability to create amazing products. Unfortunately an amazing product isn't
even remotely close to all you need. Ideally good products would bubble to the
surface and people would just use them because they're better products but
this is not what happens.

You need the business side of the startup handled for you. It's a huge task,
maybe as big as developing the product you are working on. They need to be
seducing clients, making phone calls, betting on marketing strategies, setting
up events to showcase what you have, and on and on and on.

It's the same reason a big budget movie gets millions of dollars spent just on
marketing. Because people don't go to see good movies. They go to see what
they've seen before, what they know, or what is marketed to their face all day
every day for weeks.

Especially in tech. Facebook is still going strong because it is what people
know how to use. Lots of people don't browse for new software unless what they
have either stops working or disappears. If you've been doing this for a long
time maybe getting a secured salary for a little while is the boost you need.
Before you jump back onto startups, but when you do, definitely get this
business minded person that you are looking for.

------
asterfr
Hello,

Please forgive me if the content of my message is already in others.

Maybe I could have written your message, a couple year ago. I am not
succeeding now to our hacker/entrepreneur/whatever startuper's standards, I am
just cooler about it.

First point, you may have talent, you may work hard, and you may just miss the
point. Don't ruin your days, enjoy what you are doing. The point of life is
not money or fame, or other form of success ; it's happiness. You may work
hard on a smart idea and fail, luck is in the game too, admit it. Work, skills
and being smart are playing, but luck still be here.

I have read that Rovio's last try was called Angry Birds, I don't think they
radically changed something.

One of the biggest benefits I have in my life wasn't a book, it was two weeks
break from any internet access, and phone. I had my computer though. You are
in the middle of a battle in everyday life, the Braveheart like. Have a break,
see the big picture. Do not hit the repeat button by habit, habits are bad
when they are here for intellectual comfort. Use your brain, question what you
do and how you do it. Have breaks, breaks are important for those things.

Take care of your family, friends and girlfriend. They are invaluable, they
may be the source of that little luck you need, they are a good point of
reference. Don't become that jerk that place eveything behind his work!

Don't be ashamed to come for a working class environment, you may know more
about life and business than those spoiled children we see everywhere.

------
andretti1977
Please, give your life a higher priority! This means spend time with your
girlfriend, with other people and enjoy life in general: outdoor activities,
creative activities, entertainment, readings and so on. I think nobody can be
successfull in work (9-5 job, startups and other forms of jobs) if he is not
happy with his life.

And it seems to me that you are not so satisfied.

So first of all change priority: satisfying life first then business.

Obviously work is an important part of our life because it takes lot of our
time and because it is very important in self realization. But it is not the
most important part of life so you cannot allow it to overcome everything.

So if you want to balance high motivations job and good revenue, start
freelancing (even if you live in a so strange country like italy!): it is not
standard 9-5 job (but please don't let it become 7-11 job!) so it is more
motivating (at least for me it is because you are always facing new
challenges) and it pays good and have your side projects grow in a susteinable
way.

I think i know what you are feeling...years ago i felt something similar...it
is not easy to accept for people with "fire in the veins", but you must put
serenity and order in your life priorities! Enjoy! Then start-it-up!

Wish you best luck!

------
ForHackernews
Just get a damn job that pays well. Relax, work 9-5 and earn pretty darn good
money.

Accept that you will not be the next Mark Zuckerberg because 99.99999% of
everyone will not.

------
alecsmart1
I just read through it all and realized you're just 23! I don't think you
should be so hard on yourself. I thought you were like 40 and lost with no
hope. But at 23? Come on.... Just get yourself a simple job for a bit. Take a
break. What do you have to lose? Once you sound a little less burned out, you
can give startups a shot again. Have some patience, and please enjoy your
journey; you only get to do it once.

~~~
sdesol
I had the same reaction as you and I did a search for 23 in this thread and
nobody else is talking about this. Has Zuckerberg really skewed a generation.
The odds of you making it big at the age is insanely low.

Taking 7 years to get good at something is actually a smart thing to do. The
best thing to do is always look for a room where you are not the smartest so
you can learn and when you can't find anymore rooms, you'll know it's your
time.

------
jpwgarrison
First, make a calendar invite for yourself and your girlfriend. Call it
"kriptonic career and family budget meeting." Make the event for an hour, next
weekend. Send her an invite too.

Then go to bed and cuddle. Immediately.

In the morning, on the way to work, start to think about how you could reframe
your plans on a twenty year scale, optimizing for happiness at home.

------
corkill
You don't need more ideas, you've had plenty of those. You need to learn how
to get a customer and solve their problems.

Money is abundant if you are solving people's problems so you need to start
doing that. Read lean startup as well but most importantly start talking to
potential customers every single day and STOP generating ideas, lets customers
do that.

Watch this video to see why an idea is worthless
[http://thefoundation.com/](http://thefoundation.com/)

If you want to take your GF travelling then do it. Sounds like you need the
break as well. Read
[http://www.fourhourworkweek.com/](http://www.fourhourworkweek.com/) and leave
next month, get a job overseas, do freelancing etc. Stop worrying about money
and live.

The job route is also good but only if it will be directly teaching you skills
that will further your goals, if your not learning then don't waste time on
it.

------
palidanx
I've been in the same boat also. After my first start-up tanked, I was kind of
lost and didn't know what to do. I ended up working for a consulting firm
doing software. Unexpectedly, I picked up a lot of soft skill sets in selling
and communication along the way. I eventually quit that consulting firm where
now I am doing my second start-up which is doing much better than the first.

I think when a start-up fails, there is the pressure to immediately continue
and try to force a situation for something to work. But what I'd suggest is to
go with the flow, and perhaps first restore your capital cushions with a full
time job.

Try to pick a full time job that can hone your software skill sets, but also
allow you to learn some soft skills. As you get back into the groove of not
worrying so much, that start-up itch will come back. But at that time you will
be in a much better place hopefully~

------
cj
> I can guarantee the technical skills

What are your technical qualifications?

~~~
kriptonic
Thanks for asking.

I work as a web developer. I have been building eCommerce sites since I was
15~, I'm 23 now! I can do frond-end and back-end development, although I think
I'm better at back-end development. I have good experience with
HTML/CSS/Javascript, PHP/MySql, Java & Node.js. I also have some experience in
building AI systems using ANNs, GAs, etc.

~~~
karmajunkie
Congratulations, you figured it out.

You don't know anything.

Come on man—you're 23! how many real problems have you even encountered in
your life? Let me rephrase that in a way that sounds less dismissive of any
_personal_ problems you may have in your life (which are important but not the
basis of a startup)—how many problems have you encountered in your life that
could be solved by technology or automation that are also shared by people
with money who are willing to pay for them?

Get a job that pays well. If you can get a job that pays you well enough to
save a little something AND lets you work part-time, that's even better. Take
the extra time to work on your ideas, work on learning a new language, read up
on things you know nothing about. Because THAT'S where successful startups
play. Until you get out and see the world around you, you're not going to see
problems you can solve. Its the biggest mistake I made in my 20's, and the
biggest mistake I see most people your age making. Work at a crappy job for
awhile, learn an industry that has a lot of sucky parts to it, and figure out
how to make them better.

Also, FWIW (and something I wish I'd figured out a lot sooner)—most of your
friends probably don't share your values, so find some that do, and things
like paying your rent and going on vacation to Germany with your girlfriend is
as much her responsibility as it is yours. Don't be that guy.

Email's in my profile, feel free to contact me for lots of cranky-old-guy
advice.

~~~
sizzle
Your advice really resonated with me aswell, thanks for sharing your wisdom.

------
vellum
_I have to work all day just to put a roof over our heads. She wants to travel
and damn I want to take her so bad, but I can 't. I hate what my life has
become._

Why don't you try freelancing? You can make money, travel with your
girlfriend, and work on your own projects in between gigs.

------
mangostep
I think you need to slow down. Don't be in a hurry to have some breakthrough
moment where you suddenly get success. I've been through this phase, where I
constantly feel "if only I had X", maybe things will change. In your case, the
X is a "business partner".

This kind of sudden change mostly only happens in movies.

Like others have suggested, the number 1 thing I'd do is make some money. Get
a job, do consulting, whatever's easy with your existing skills. Just fill up
that bank account. It will do wonders for your sanity and self-esteem. And
restore some stability and happiness in your relationship.

When you feel a bit chilled out, then try getting a business going again.
Right now, you're too stressed and burnt out to think straight.

------
msutherl
I agree with most of the other replies here, but also:

consider (1) seeing a therapist and (2) reading the _Tao Te Ching_.

If you're so stressed out about your work that you can't lead a joyful life,
and you can't even give your girlfriend the attention she deserves for
believing in you – this is the most important thing in the world – then this
could be a _personal_ issue and in that case I would recommend seeking a
professional outside perspective to help you sort it out.

------
michaelkoz
I recommend working at other startups to get a sense on how people can
properly execute ideas. You will also broaden your friend network and make
friends with more startup minded people. This will assist you in your own
endeavors.l Your problem is you have no one to talk to about business and no
real connections. The most successful startups were people working in that
culture, branching off, taking a few people with them and starting something
great.

------
mansa
Man, you seriously need a break. 5years is long term. I have been part of
startup from past 2 years and i am like totally burn out due to excessive
amount of work.

For you is better to find a job that you love to do, earn some money and get
your life back, go get your girl friend to some trip.

After 2-3 years you may again thought of startup, at that point of time you
have more knowledge and experience.

------
matiu
Do a small business management course, they teach good stuff like market
researching an idea before you overcommit to it, and doing cashflow forecasts.

I had some brilliant ideas, (and they still are), but after doing a business
forecast on them, they're not good for business. I'm guessing you may be in
the same boat.

To make your brilliant idea work, you need a business head and luck.

Good luck.

------
stevenkovar
Be mindful, be grateful, and fail forward.

By that, I mean to take a step back and give yourself a 'big picture' view of
the world around you to gain some perspective. Some call it meditation; some
call it getting some fresh air. You're 23; you need to learn that being an
entrepreneur is a marathon (not a sprint) before it kills you—and it will.

Learn to create the time for yourself—to switch off. Your logical mind needs
down time to compartmentalize your ideas and arrive at that 'aha!' moment; you
can't always be "on." Your body needs to strengthen (work out) and rest
(proper sleep). Your social mind needs time to take in the world and discover
joy. I can't emphasize the idea of "creating" time enough. It won't fall into
your lap. You have to make it.

Then look at how far you've brought yourself to this point and appreciate it.
Don't compare yourself to anyone else, just to the person you were yesterday.
Appreciate and get inspiration from the little things. Show people you are
grateful; hug them, buy them coffee, do them a favor. These acts will make you
happier than money or material wealth.

Consider taking a job where your talents help make a team stronger. It's
important to be challenged in your area of expertise, but it's more important
to take a notepad and to observe your colleagues and learn what makes them
good at what they do, because they have the skills that can help your future
business(es). Learn what to do and what not to do. It's not about the money,
it's about the process.

When you screw up and get yelled at or feel embarrassed, that's a good thing.
It's another experience under your belt; another data point to reference. When
you don't get yelled at or feel embarrassed, that's very bad; it means no one
cares to push you forward—including yourself. Always find something to improve
and when you fail, fail forward.

As for your business, it takes $0 to validate an idea. Find three customers to
pay for your product or service before building it (just a rule of thumb). You
can do this while holding a full-time job. Don't build something you think
people want; build something you know they want. As PG says, do things that
don't scale. That's how you learn what your customers want. When you run out
of time in the day to keep up with the unscalable work, considering what "big
wins" will help free your time up to do more unscalable work.

------
kevonc
the only thing i want to say is, why rush? why do you sound stressed?

the majority of successful people start doing big things after 35 years old
when you have the experience and network, you still have 12 years to get
there. Take baby steps, and you will succeed.

I'm 23 years old as well, working at a dev house as software engineer. Just
keep going and take it easy bro.

------
nkskalyan
You have the technical skills, don't push to startup. I had say things work
better when you get a 9-5 job and learn the field you are in, and once you
know enough about the domain you are working in, you can startup in the same.
We rarely here of vague startup ideas without domain knowledge succeeding.

------
LazerBear
Just wanted to say that this thread has made me want to read and participate
in HN more often. Best of luck, OP.

------
methodin
I am curious exactly where the sentiment that passion for an idea, and the
success thereafter, has to come from the sacrifice of everything else in your
life. Is this simply propagated through the romantic biographies of the few
people who managed to turn these unfortunate circumstances into success?

------
phektus
Get a 9-5 job, take a breather, save some money, then try again after two
years.

------
soneca
kriptonic, just sent you an email with a partnership proposal for a SaaS. Take
a look...

My advice would be: try to do something small and with value. Don't try to
start out the next big thing from the start. Try to start out the next useful
thing, no matter how small.

Also, keep this $5,000 for yourself. If you can't create something of value
without the money (more true as you can code), it is not $5,000 that will make
it work.

------
rokhayakebe
Keep going. Keep going. Go to bed too when your gf looks at you and says "I am
going to sleep." Next morning, Keep going.

------
momedalhouma
you said that you have the skills, my advise to you create game like flappy
bird you wil be rich like the founder of flappy bird.

------
notastartup
I'm in a similar situation but without the girlfriend except I'm not trying to
do a large startup, I'm trying to get a positive cash flow going through a
SaaS and it's hard as hell to even get started! I mean I tried for the past 5
years, on and off, but I've been doing the same god damn problem everytime and
it's recently that I realized that I don't know shit about business and
marketing. I focused some time on that by researching and doing brainstorming.

I'm not ready to give up but it's just staggering how long it has taken me and
each year, it has been a mediocre, mostly due to me burning out when it came
time to do the business stuff because I spent all my energy on building the
damn product and than kept on adding new features so that it would entice
customers from the sheer list of features.

Take the $5000, save it. Do not spend it on a new startup idea. I've spent
about $50 in total for my 12th attempt. I spent about $3000 on my 5th attempt
in 2010. Didn't do jack shit. It's not really about the money you throw at it,
it's about being not burnt out when it comes to do the important things I'm
learning.

------
paulhauggis
It took me many years to find an idea that worked.

I took jobs that didn't require many more hours beyond 9-5 (IE: boring
programming jobs) and used my free time to work on business ideas.

Weekends were for friends and family. You need to learn how to balance your
life, or it will be very difficult to succeed.

