
Apple Watch Series 3 - mercutio2
https://daringfireball.net/2017/09/apple_watch_series_3
======
AVTizzle
>> "When are you separated from your iPhone? When you’re exercising. What do
you miss most when you’re away from your phone? Messages and phone calls."

Anecdotal, but personally, this is one of the most refreshing and cherished
qualities about my exercise time: it's ME time. No messages, no phone calls.
Phone goes on airplane mode, and I'm in my own zone for those 60-90 minutes.

After reading My Year with a Distraction Free iPhone* I took steps to
drastically reduce notifications and social media apps from my phone (not as
drastic as the article, but way quieter than before), and I feel happier for
it.

Maybe it's just me, but MORE notifications, messages, and calls to my wrist
sounds like exactly what I _don 't_ want.

* [https://medium.com/time-dorks/my-year-with-a-distraction-fre...](https://medium.com/time-dorks/my-year-with-a-distraction-free-iphone-and-how-to-start-your-own-experiment-6ff74a0e7a50)

~~~
robterrell
I do like having a distraction-free iphone, but I also like to run and hauling
a huge phone with me is stupid. But I like to run on the trails on Mt Tam and
it can feel surprisingly remote quickly, so I want to keep the ability to make
phone calls somehow. I am looking forward to trying the watch for just this
use case. (Also, music while running!) I'm assuming I can turn off notifs on
the watch just like on the phone.

~~~
gnicholas
In The Verge's testing, the cellular range was not great. I wish they'd done
side-by-side testing with an iPhone. Something like: "if your iPhone has one
bar, your Watch will have none. If two, then either one or none."

[https://www.theverge.com/2017/9/20/16334066/apple-watch-
seri...](https://www.theverge.com/2017/9/20/16334066/apple-watch-series-3-lte-
new-features-review-2017)

------
alienreborn
Verge[1] (5/10), WSJ[2] has pretty negative reviews esp reg. battery and LTE
reception and Apple acknowledged that problem in their statement. This has to
be one of the worst reviewed Apple products in a while. However Wired[3] has
good things to say about it and NYT[4] found it alright.

1\. [https://www.theverge.com/2017/9/20/16334066/apple-watch-
seri...](https://www.theverge.com/2017/9/20/16334066/apple-watch-series-3-lte-
new-features-review-2017)

2\. [https://www.wsj.com/articles/apple-watch-series-3-review-
unt...](https://www.wsj.com/articles/apple-watch-series-3-review-untethered-
and-unreliable-1505905203)

3\. [https://www.wired.com/2017/09/review-apple-watch-
series-3/](https://www.wired.com/2017/09/review-apple-watch-series-3/)

4\.
[https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/20/technology/personaltech/a...](https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/20/technology/personaltech/apple-
watch-series-3-review-cellular.html?mcubz=0)

~~~
jhugg
It says this has something to do with connecting to unsecured Wifi networks.
That seems, amazingly, like something Apple testing might overlook. Who has
unsecured networks these days?

It also sounds like a bugfix that could come shortly and make the review seem
pretty dated.

EDIT: To clarify whoever is downvoting me, I’m not arguing that Apple
shouldn’t have tested this. They really really should have. I just can see how
they might not run across too many unsecured networks in their employee real-
world tests.

~~~
makomk
Pretty much every location with publicly-accessible WiFi has an unsecured WiFi
network - places like malls, hotels, coffee shops, restaurants, pubs.

------
goodroot
_Phone anxiety is a weird, and, for me at least, irrational thing. I know that
mankind survived for millennia without the ability to communicate with each
other out of earshot. But once you get used to having your phone with you at
all times, you get used to feeling that if anyone needs you, they can get
you._

 _Apple Watch Series 3 with cellular networking completely alleviates this
anxiety. It is not a replacement for a phone, and is not supposed to be. But
it lets you leave your phone at home when you go for a run, or in your locker
while you’re at the gym, or in your hotel while you go to the beach, and not
worry in the least that you’re out of touch._

It alleviates the anxiety of leaving your phone at home by... further
conditioning your dependence on interconnectivity? Blind logic is the dark-
side of the reality distortion field.

Applied differently: To help me with my alcoholism, I leave my 40oz at the
hotel or in my locker-room. Now, I just sip on it from a smaller container
filled with liquor that I keep on my wrist.

If your phone generates anxiety, _fix the issue_.

~~~
eridius
The phone doesn't generate anxiety. _Not having_ the phone generates anxiety.
The Apple Watch series 3 with LTE fixes the issue. So what's the problem?

Your comment seems to be implying that being used to always being available if
someone needs to contact you is a bad thing (e.g. is the same thing as
alcoholism). But why? Personally, I'm all for disconnecting, but even when I'm
not available to anyone else, I still want to be available if my wife needs to
talk to me. And even if I didn't have a wife, that doesn't mean it's
unreasonable for other people to want to be available at any time. And
finally, even if you want to disconnect regularly, you may still want to
disconnect on your terms rather than being forced to disconnect because of the
activity you're doing at the moment (e.g. going for a run).

~~~
goodroot
That is the implication. Alcoholism is an affliction wherein something that's
fairly benign in small doses can be a significant detriment to the individual
if consumptions falls out of balance. In this way, being ever-available and
ever-connected is a bad thing; there's nothing intrinsically wrong with it in
small and balanced doses, but in high doses it can cause significant neuroses
through withdrawal. It follows that, just as alcohol is the cause of
alcoholism, the phone _is_ the ultimate source of anxiety. It provides
dopamine, you feel bad when you don't get it.

An alternative angle is this:

If you're an addict and you get withdrawal symptoms, having more of your
substance does not alleviate your addition. The symptom of withdrawal, not
having the phone, generates anxiety. By increasing the time that you're
connected and removing natural/forced break periods, you're raising the
threshold that you need to maintain to not feel anxious. In doing so, you've
created a situation where it will be harder to make break time and when you
do, it'll feel worse.

Here's an excerpt, link at the bottom, of one of an increasing number of
studies that describe the negative health impact of communication technology
dependency:

> The results indicate that depression, anxiety, and sleep quality may be
> associated with smartphone overuse. Such overuse may lead to depression
> and/or anxiety, which can in turn result in sleep problems. University
> students with high depression and anxiety scores should be carefully
> monitored for smartphone addiction.

Yet, we want to sell everyone smart-watches so that they'll never miss a
beat...

[https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26132913](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26132913)

~~~
eridius
Just reading the abstract of that study it sounds like bullshit. Nobody is
addicted to a smartphone. People get "addicted" to their social networks, but
the social network isn't the smartphone. Take the smartphone, reset it back to
factory defaults, and block the ability to install new apps, and you'll find
that the "addicts" aren't going to be as interested in it (block the browser
too and they probably won't even use it).

And making yourself available to be contacted isn't the same thing as being
"addicted" to social networks. You'll notice the study you linked was looking
at university students (which itself means its conclusions aren't necessarily
applicable to the larger world), people for whom "being connected" means
Snapchat and Instagram and other social networks. But for most adults, "being
connected" means someone can reach them if necessary, as opposed to sitting
there for hours browsing a stream of social network posts.

Personally, I've disengaged from basically all social networks. But I'd still
like to "be connected" because people do sometimes contact me directly and I'd
like to be available for that, or sometimes I get an important email that I
want to handle sooner rather than later. And the only reason I'm not getting
the LTE watch is because I always have my phone with me anyway and the LTE
isn't worth giving my carrier $120/year.

------
sisk
Perhaps I'm in the minority but I've decided to purchase this _precisely_ to
stay connected while running. To be fair, it's not the _during_ that I'm
worried about, it's the _after_. I've never been able to get used to running
with a phone (or really anything other than a watch, for that matter) so I'm
always disconnected while exercising. I often, however, participate in races
with a handful of other people and have learned that standing in a
predetermined meeting spot after a race for an indeterminate amount of time
isn't a great solution.

When pebble announced the Pebble Core, I thought I'd finally found the answer
to my problem: complete a race—having been completely disconnected—while still
have the option to connect afterwards as a means of coordination.

When that product was killed off with the sale of Pebble to Fitbit, I was back
to hoping someone would fill that niche. This watch now makes that viable.
Yes, it's an expensive price to pay (particularly as compared to the Core) but
you only have to stand around windy, 20℉ weather in running shorts for an hour
once before the price becomes of less consequence.

~~~
gamblor956
A number of my friends purchased the AW2 for running, and none of them use it
anymore. It simply doesn't have the battery life for long runs (>3 hours) if
you're actually using the GPS. This rules it out for marathons, as it dies
before you finish (even for BQ-qualifying times. And note, this was the non-
LTE version of the watch; if the LTE version has worse battery life, you're
not going to be organizing anything post-run with it.)

Additionally, they noted that sweat made using the AW2 problematic, due to the
way the touch screen interacted with sweat. It's not a problem once you finish
and can wipe it off, but it's a definite issue during the run itself.

Finally, the GPS on the AW2 sucks. It's the quality of early-2000s GPS
watches. The watch is great for tracking time, but if you're trying to track
pace or distance, you're going to need another data source.

Best bet post-race: keep your phone in your race bag, grab the bag after you
finish, and use your phone to coordinate.

~~~
photojosh
What do they use for actually recording the GPS tracks? As we can probably
agree the built-in workout app sucks for the serious runner.

And I never saw any good assessments of the GPS quality of the watch even
though I've looked, do you know of any online?

Now that watchOS 4 can connect directly to Bluetooth sensors, I'd be very
interested in a GPS app that derived pace and distance from a BT footpod, much
like you can do with a Garmin to get better accuracy.

------
5_minutes
Though always well written, Daring Fireball’s articles are always sprinkled
with some fanboyism, I do miss a real critical and objective voice in his
writing.

Because somehow the voice pretends it is.

But actually the glass is always a bit more than half full, no matter what.

~~~
joselreyes
Yes, but he is consistent. So you can always read his reviews and peg it down
a notch if you regularly slightly disagree with him. I don't mind biases in
reviewers if they're consistent in their takes.

~~~
ben_jones
I'd argue that writing is influential and can strengthens cognitive biases. If
someone is poor and teetering on the edge of buying a luxury Apple watch
they're going to be looking for that one shining article that goads them into
doing it. When society accepts such influencers as role models and people to
listen to / follow then we have a problem.

------
m_st
My wife ordered one, upgrading from her first gen model. The single biggest
reason is GPS tracking while running without being forced to carry her iPhone
6S Plus. And the (much) improved battery life over her first gen model.

She ordered the Series 3 with cellular, just in case it becomes affordable.
But boy do we both agree that this red dot looks ugly. As Gruber mentions, we
also worry that it won't work well with the otherwise really nice watch bands.

Can't have it all...

~~~
bpicolo
Can it be painted over, or does it serve a purpose?

~~~
ChrisLTD
It's purely cosmetic. The new LTE antenna is part of the main body of the
watch.

~~~
Eric_WVGG
Not just the body, apparently the screen itself.

------
nfriedly
Question for Apple Watch wearers: is Siri on the Apple Watch the exact same as
Siri on the iPhone?

I ask, because it's not the case with the one on Android Wear - the watch
version can't answer factoid-style questions ("What's the tallest building in
Dayton, Ohio?"), can't identify songs, can't perform simple system commands
("Increase scree brightness"), etc.

It's still convenient and useful, but it's just not as good as I had expected.

I'm due for a phone upgrade sometime soon and starting to seriously think
about switching from Android to iOS.

Update: it looks like phone version has regressed and can't identify songs any
more :(

~~~
matrixtransform
Siri is much the same on the watch, except for when it can't answer a question
- on the phone, it says "I found this on the web" which the watch can't do as
it doesn't have a browser

------
gallerdude
With iOS 11 and watchOS 4, it feels like watchOS is taking aim for iOS, and
iOS is taking aim for macOS. What’s Apple’s endgame here? The whole Mac Pro
mini-crisis last year proved that professionals are a super loud minority, so
they can’t flat out kill macOS.

I think they’ll just make iOS more and more attractive, while they make macOS
more... iOS-like? And in turn, watchOS is an added benefit to iOS that macOS
won’t fully utilize.

There’s some sort of uneasy tension here, I’ll be interested to see how it
(slowly) develops.

~~~
matrixtransform
I notice that the watch now covers all 3 tentpoles from the original iPhone
launch:

a phone, an ipod with touch controls and an internet communications device.

Of course, the iPhone is now marketed as a multipurpose computing device, a 4k
video camera and an AR viewer, so things have moved on.

It would make sense to me to add more power-user features to MacOS in future,
rather than making it more iOS-like? Apple made that mistake with Lion and the
app grid with folders and massive icons that can't be resized is crappy to
this day.

iOS won't be a MacOS replacement at least until all Apple's professional apps
are available on it. Processing-wise they are probably only a couple of
generations away from being able to support Final Cut Pro, Logic X and XCode,
but interface-wise there is a huge amount of work involved in reinventing
those apps as touch-first.

------
js2
> But it lets you leave your phone at home when you go for a run, or in your
> locker while you’re at the gym, or in your hotel while you go to the beach,
> and not worry in the least that you’re out of touch.

I'm a big fan of Apple. I own their stock, and I can count at least 10 Apple
devices in my house at this moment. But the Apple Watch is not for me. I
tried.

When I go for a run, I want to be out of touch. The only reason I ever take my
iPhone on a run is so that I can take pictures or that I can reach someone
else if I have an emergency. Mostly I don’t take my phone and when I do, it’s
in do not disturb mode.

I'm a serious runner. I tried the first Apple Watch as running watch. It was
inferior in that role to my Garmin at the time. But that Garmin wasn't a
proper watch, it was really just for running. I liked the Apple Watch's
fitness tracking features and that I could wear it all the time. But it just
wasn't suitable for running with. So I would take it off when I went for a run
and put on my Garmin, which means Apple didn't think I exercised at all. That
was a bummer.

When Garmin came out with the 230, I immediately bought it. It could replace
my existing Garmin for running, it was the size of a proper watch, battery
life that lasts a week or more, and fitness tracking. Notifications if you
want them.

I've since upgraded to the Garmin 935 and I love it. I don't see anything
about the Series 3 that would compel me to purchase it. The touch screen is
still an inferior interface to physical buttons if physical buttons will do
the job. (In fact, the thing I hate most about taking my iPhone with me as a
camera is that I can't take pictures with it when my hands are covered in
sweat, which when I run, is mostly the case.)

The ironic thing is that it's the Apple Watch which got me used to the idea of
wearing a watch all the time, and that made me realize the important of
physical buttons, and that I don't want notifications on my watch.

~~~
bgun
> The only reason I ever take my phone is so that I can take pictures or that
> I can reach someone else if I have an emergency

That doesn't sound like you really want to be "out of touch" at all. When I go
for a run, I want to become fitter, healthier, and a better runner. Apple
isn't suggesting that the purpose of the device is to let you surf Facebook
while you run; it's to do exactly what you said - have access if you need it.

~~~
js2
Having access isn't by itself compelling enough. The Apple Watch still isn't a
camera and is still worse than my 935 for running. And I'm even doubtful about
using it for emergencies: the cell signal in many of the places I run is weak.

~~~
dkonofalski
What makes it worse than your 935? I'm not familiar with the Garmin watches
but every test that I've done against GPS and step-trackers has been pretty
even or in favor of my Apple Watch.

~~~
gamblor956
Garmins are generally much more expensive than smart watches (i.e., the
relatively basic Garmins cost $200-300), but if you're an outdoor athlete,
they're worth the premium.

A typical Garmin watch has better GPS accuracy than an Apple Watch (US and
Russian geosat networks), mobile alerts if you really want them (but no reply
functionality), music player controls, camera controls (for Garmin cameras),
and multiple dedicated specialty sensors. The newer low-end watches (ending in
5, i.e., 235) and the higher-end watches have best-in-class wrist heart-rate
monitors that are accurate to within 2 beats of chest-based straps even on
dark-skinned individuals.

Almost all Garmins, except the new activity trackers, are "water-proof" and
can be used in most water-based activities except for SCUBA diving (which
voids the warranty since they're not rated for those depths).

Oh, and they literally last for 2 weeks on a single charge for normal watch
use, or roughly 8-24 hours with GPS in constant use, depending on the model.
My Garmin Fenix 3 lasted through a 16 hour hike with battery to spare, and
that's before I even tried using the battery-saving features. (My biggest
issue with the battery is remembering to charge the watch because I need to do
so infrequently that it's not an ingrained habit.)

In another comment I noted some of the problems my friends had with their
earlier-model iWatches. Basically: bad GPS, poor battery life (in many cases
dying before the end of a marathon, i.e., <5 hours), essentially unusable
during sweaty activities or during water-based activities due to the poor
touchscreen functionality.

------
JKCalhoun
A year or so ago I saw that the Apple Watch is a stealth product category.

When Siri was capable enough to answer the things a Safari search would have
provided me and when the watch got a cellular radio I might actually ditch my
phone and just wear a watch.

One down.

~~~
albertgoeswoof
I don't think siri will be capable of that for a long, long time, if ever

------
cschep
I really like the automatic audio remote. I am a very happy AirPods user, but
I missed being able to adjust the volume easily. Now I can glance at the watch
and use the digital crown to change the volume, very slick!

~~~
rconti
I just upgraded my iPhone to iOS11 and my Series 2 Watch to WatchOS4 (which 2+
goddamned hours, but I digress), and noticed that Sonos allows me to use my
watch to control volume!

I'm not sure what the various parameters are, but I fired up a podcast on the
Sonos controller app on my phone, walked partay through the house, raised my
wrist to check the time, and I had control for the sonos right there -- turned
the crown, sure enough, volume went up! It was really cool. Hopefully the UX
is intuitive enough that it won't be popping up all the time when i don't want
it.

------
minimaxir
So why _does_ the LTE Watch have the red dot anyways? I asked on Reddit and
_no one has any idea_ :
[https://reddit.com/r/apple/comments/70homi/so_why_does_the_a...](https://reddit.com/r/apple/comments/70homi/so_why_does_the_apple_watch_series_3_w_lte_have/)

The most sensible theory is that it’s related to the LTE antenna, but Apple
admitted in the Keynote the Watch screen is the antenna.

~~~
jhugg
It’s because in many parts of the world, people won’t buy expensive things
unless there is some way for people to know you spent a lot of money and have
the newest thing.

I hate the red dot too. Already ordered my WatchDots.

~~~
eridius
Exactly this. China is a great example. Many many people will buy the LTE
model strictly for the red dot, with no intention of actually using LTE,
because it's a status symbol. I'm really surprised Gruber doesn't get that.

There was a post I saw recently, that I thought Gruber linked to but I can't
find it anymore, about how Apple's strategy of taking old phones and selling
them as the lower tier models is great because it means people can buy those
phones and nobody can tell that they bought a lower-tier phone (because it
looks like they could have just bought the top-tier phone last year and not
gotten around to upgrading yet). This was also used to explain why the 5C was
apparently a flop, because it was immediately obvious to anybody that a 5C
owner bought the cheap phone.

Status symbols are important.

~~~
matrixtransform
It's the same reason why earpods only come in white. It makes them stand out.
White iPod headphones were a walking advertisement/status symbol for years.

~~~
photojosh
I will buy AirPods the moment they come in black... so I'm guessing I probably
never will. :)

------
smakkadoula
I suspect the person who wrote posted this blog isn't into fitness on any
serious level beyond 'how many steps did i get in today'.

The first and second generation Apple Watches were average fitness companions
at best. Even the weakest Garmin did the job far better. More specifically,
the accelerometer was just awful unless you run at one pace, forever. For
anyone who is actually interested in tracking real-time their peformance there
are too many cheaper alternatives to justfiy this thing for fitness.

Apparently, this is not just my opinion:
[https://www.dcrainmaker.com/2016/02/apple-watch-
review.html](https://www.dcrainmaker.com/2016/02/apple-watch-review.html)

------
spiderfarmer
Why does Gruber refuse to make his website responsive? For someone so focused
on the elegance of Apple’s products, it seems strange that he forgets that his
website looks like a forgotten/neglected website from the early 00’s.

~~~
KSS42
Does it need to be "responsive"? I just double tap the text and it is
readable. I much prefer his layout to others.

------
folksinger
I read this as,

"Do you hate freedom? Buy yourself an Apple Watch and always, literally
always, be shackled to someone else's priorities!"

I realize this is not a charitable interpretation but I feel like it deserves
a counter-narrative.

------
ksec
I am still waiting on the report of W2 and Intel Modem. The first one i am
hoping someday Apple will make their own 802.11ax WiFi Chipset for Router /
Apple TV / Mac and iPhone. The latter because I am not aware of any Intel
Modem that can be fitted inside a Apple Watch. It shows Intel aren't really
far off in Modem space compared to Qualcomm if true.

------
brentis
This guy must get a monthly paycheck from Apple. He always comes out swooning
over new Apple hardware despite everyone else slamming it. It’s a tired
routine.

This is coming from someone with more Apple devices than I care to mention and
even last week bought a new iMac. My personal phone however, is a Pixel.

------
stepcellwolf
I will buy it only when they fix the issue swimming in an ocean and loosing
your watch. It happens to me in an open ocean. First fix the wrist and then
I'll buy a new one.

~~~
TomSawyer
Were you swimming with a band that uses a magnetic clasp?

~~~
xutopia
I have the band that comes with my watch and I lost it carrying luggage
(thankfully someone found it and I got it back). It's easy to lose it.

~~~
abritinthebay
I’ve swum in the Pacific, Caribbean, and Atlantic with mine. Travelled 1000s
of miles with it.

Never even fallen off, let alone lost.

You’re doing something _very_ wrong.

------
eugenekolo2
Do you guys actually read this website at the default size? The sites much
more enjoyable at 150%...

~~~
mturmon
I read it at 14pt, default is 11pt. Change default using link at bottom of DF
homepage.

~~~
eugenekolo2
Interesting. Thanks for the tip.

------
martijn_himself
_A camera is the one thing I miss when I leave my iPhone at home and go for a
run. I have no idea how a camera could work ergonomically on a watch. Maybe
it’s just not feasible. But it is mildly frustrating when I’m out on a run and
see something interesting that I’d like to photograph._

Why can't you just _enjoy_ that something interesting there and then? Do we
really need to capture everything and share it with everyone?

EDIT: slightly tongue in cheek but curious nonetheless.

~~~
sp332
Some people have a creative impulse. They get inspiration and want to express
what they're feeling or get an urge to make something. And he doesn't even
mention sharing the photo.

~~~
martijn_himself
My comment was slightly tongue in cheek as I get where he is coming from. I
suppose it could be an optional feature, or a way to differentiate the
product.

------
wyatte
> "When is the right time to ship a product? In particular, a hardware
> product? The answer, sometimes, is not when it’s done, but rather when it’s
> useful."

Or rather when it's able to steal the last remaining privacy mankind holds.
I'm sorry, but for me the cellar capability is the final straw and I will
never buy one. I truly feel sorry for our newer generations who will suffer
the consequences of us letting these organizations take that privacy so freely
without even a fight.

