
The married couples in Hong Kong who live apart - mih
https://www.bbc.com/worklife/article/20190903-the-married-couples-in-hong-kong-who-live-apar
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ChuckNorris89
I'm from Europe and I also live apart from my long term SO. The reason being
our job commutes.

We work in completely opposite parts of town and due to the city lacking fast
public transport and her job lacking flextime she has to wake up way earlier
than I'm use to if I want to be productive at work and so far we haven't found
a middle ground where one doesn't have to compromise too much.

Honestly, remote work would ease a lot of modern urban problems like traffic,
rents, relationships, childcare, etc. If only our corporate masters would
allow it.

World governments need to start incentivizing employers to offer remote ASAP
as infrastructure in the cities is not keeping up with population growth.

~~~
xwolfi
I'm from Hong Kong, funnily enough, and what we do with mine is that we switch
every 2 years. Renting here is easy (albeit expensive), so we just move to a
flat near her work, spend 2 years of me having 3 hours of bus, and then we
move near mine, when I am 10 minutes away by foot and she has the 3 hours of
commute per day.

What's nice is we can pay the 4000 euros per month of rent. If not we'd find a
2000 euros flat mid-way. The main issue is that hker are either too stingy to
rent, or really don't earn enough to spend that much on it. Don't
underestimate the number of people here who can't pay rent by sheer ideology,
and live at their parents while extremely overpaid compared to Europe.

Also, as a side note, city incentives to companies come either from your
salary (via taxes on companies) or your taxes, not the sky, so it's not a
solution. Real solutions are sacrifice, like changing job, changing girlfriend
or changing flat. Would you ask for the country to give incentive to companies
to help you work 300 km apart your gf ? Sometimes life's unfair and the
government isn't your mom, you'll have to solve the problem yourself.

~~~
localhost
Would love to better understand the ideology. Could you elaborate? Is it the
"you will build equity through real estate" argument? Are the people living at
their parents saving up for a down payment on real estate so they can get in
on that game?

~~~
emmanuel_1234
"Saving to buy later" is not really a good strategy in Hong Kong, as the
increase in market price is faster than what can save. The only option is to
get a sharp increase in one's income. This is very disheartening, as the goal
post keeps moving.

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drakonka
Aside from the financial aspect I've been thinking about the topic of living
together with your long term partner recently.

I am re-evaluating the whole concept that couples eventually living together
needs to be some kind of long term relationship default or goal. I love my
personal space and having an apartment to call my own to come home to. I also
love having my boyfriend visit, sometimes for days at a time. I'm not
completely against eventually moving in together, but am kind of unsure when
or why we usually consider it to be some sort of inevitable goal of a
successful relationship that is progressing. Can't we just live separately,
enjoy our own space, and see each other whenever we want? Maybe gradually the
time we _want_ to spend together will increase, and then nothing is stopping
us from doing that. And maybe we'll go through a phase where we want more
personal time, and then we'll still have the option to do that, too! This way
we could see each other simply because we want to, not because we happen to
live in the same apartment and don't really have another option anyway.

Of course this becomes more complicated if the couple chooses to have
children, but as someone who intends to stay childfree I guess I just don't
see much of an incentive to move in together 'permanently'.

~~~
jschwartzi
Speaking as someone who intends to have children with my partner, you're
basically right about why we want to move in together. That, and it simplifies
a lot of the logistics of being in a long-term relationship for us. Right now
I have to haul overnight bags to her house and plan how I'm going to get fresh
clothes and stuff during the week, because I'm usually spending the night at
her place. But when we move in together all my things will be colocated at her
place. And I'll be able to cook dinner and help take care of us, which is more
difficult when living separately.

We still both recognize the need for personal space within our shared home so
we are discussing how we can accomplish that as we also decide how we're going
to move in together.

I think the discussion of what your goals are is a critical part of any
relationship, and personally as someone who doesn't share your goals I still
think it's great that you know what they are and that you've discussed them
with your partner. Because the communication is actually what defines a good
relationship, and not this stepwise cultural treadmill toward cohabitating and
having kids.

~~~
drakonka
Thanks for sharing. Best of luck with your plans and your future move. You're
right that discussing this properly is key - I'm not totally against moving in
together one day. I'd just really like for it to be a conscious choice on our
part, one that is untainted by default cultural expectations and with living
apart still being a perfectly valid choice in itself.

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pcurve
"Nearly one in 10 married couples in Hong Kong are not living with their
spouses."

In the US the figure is 7 percent so it's not unusual for couples to live
apart. I'm curious if the embedded study written in Chinese accounts for this.

~~~
mc32
Hong Kong is rather small, so living apart would seem less influenced by
geographic separation (though you might have couples split in HK and mainland)
due to jobs, but might indicate something like what also happens in the US
that it’s economically favorable to stay together in a legal sense.

Edit: looks like in HK there is a large component of this which is caused by
housing unaffordability —so couples keep living in their respective parents’
homes.

~~~
thaumasiotes
> you might have couples split in HK and mainland

I have no direct knowledge of this, but HKers working in the mainland is
common enough that I suspect this could account for quite a lot of split
couples.

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Yuval_Halevi
For those of you who want to get some in-depth statistics about the situation
in Hong Kong

[https://www.bycensus2016.gov.hk/data/16BC_Youth_report_2018....](https://www.bycensus2016.gov.hk/data/16BC_Youth_report_2018.02.12.pdf)

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mymythisisthis
We need a 4 day work week with 1 day of mandatory/paid retraining. Unskilled
labor can be found anywhere, there are 7.7 billion people on the planet.

By having programs in place for training we can move people into careers where
they can grow and move up.

German is moving to a 28hr work week for some workers.
[https://money.cnn.com/2018/02/07/news/economy/germany-28-hou...](https://money.cnn.com/2018/02/07/news/economy/germany-28-hour-
work-week/index.html)

~~~
SolaceQuantum
I don't know if we should do mandatory retraining- I would also be down for
this to be a "free" day to do things like home projects, rest and recovery if
you are mentally/physically ill, do some grocery shopping at a farmers'
market, volunteer at a shelter or retirement home...

~~~
xwolfi
As long as it's unpaid, sure. Most company allow you do take unpaid leaves and
rest and recover.

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vivekd
So the cost of an apartment is $4000 and medium income for new employees is
$10000 according to the article.

Am I missing something - that seems more affordable than most major
metropolitan areas. With two incomes that would be more than enough.

~~~
a_c
> [for] a single unit within a subdivided flat

that's around 100-200 sq. ft.

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ksec
I could bet $4000 ( $510 USD ) that it is not 100-200 Sq. Feet.

$4000 tends to get you Sub 100 Sq Feet Space.

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option_greek
Living in those tiny flats (29sqft, 5.5sqft) sounds inhumane. I always thought
Hong kong as developed. What is the point of all that development if people
have to live like this :(

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chaostheory
From personal anecdotal data, it’s also common for HK couples to live even
further away; as in different countries for years. I’ve know several families
from HK where the husband stayed behind just so his family could leave for
western countries before the handover years back

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alistairSH
How are the parents affording a 2-bedroom apartment? Is there a massive
(relative to what we'd expect) income gap between 50-60 year olds and 20-30
year olds? The article mentioned incomes for the younger demographics, but not
the older.

~~~
tvanantwerp
Hong Kong has many public housing estates with greatly reduced rents. It's
likely the parents live in one of these. New construction has not at all met
demand in recent years, so there's less and less new public housing available
for younger generations to try and get. Private housing is, for most,
completely out of the question. Living with parents is very common in HK.

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crimsonalucard
This makes it easier for people to have multiple SO.

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rdlecler1
I’ll continue saying this until it happens. We need an Elon Musk for housing.
Imagine how much capital could be freed up for non rent-seeking purposes if we
could fix this broken system. Note I would expect driverless cars to help here
as many people may be able to work-commute, and even if you’re not afforded
that luxury it may ease housing pressure on those that can not.

~~~
100-xyz
Can you elaborate on what you mean by Elon Musk for housing? What kind of
solution are you aiming at? Serious question.

