

Annual Developer Income Report - kreci
http://www.kreci.net/reports/annual-developer-income-report/

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bgraves
Chris - your posts are one of the highlights of Hacker News for me. A few
comments/suggestions:

1\. It would be great if you could organize your revenue/expenses a bit more.
Something like BCC Stats [1] would be great. Perhaps just take the metrics you
are tracking now, put them in a Google Spreadsheet, and create some simple
Google Charts that are automatically updated and published. It would take a
few hours to set up, but your stats would be much easier to gather and publish
going forward.

2\. Have you thought about ways to make website flipping _more_ passive? What
are the sticking points on this income stream and how can they be removed? I
have given this a lot of thought and was able to go from a website idea to
gathering sign-ups on a website in less than 6 hours. My idea was not
successful, but I wasted very little time/energy by using ThemeForest, AdWords
coupons, and a simple email script to validate it. If the site became popular,
I would have developed it more fully and perhaps sold it or just collected
income passively.

3\. On a more personal note, how does your wife/family view this "work"
situation? I assume that they are happy, but I have found that sometimes
family and friends do not understand how this type of stuff works. I'm married
with kids, too. In my experience, most people equate hard work with high pay
-- but we have found a way to work _smarter_ not necessarily _harder_.

Thanks for sharing this information!

[1] [http://www.bingocardcreator.com/expenses/profitability-
pie-c...](http://www.bingocardcreator.com/expenses/profitability-pie-chart)

~~~
kreci
Thanks for such long comment. Ad.1) I will consider adding costs. But those
are very little - hosting $30, some domains I buy and renew. Plus tax and
health insurance that is specific for each country. Ad.2) It looks very
interesting to flip websites based on my stats. But what really matters is the
good idea that sells. And it is hardest to get plenty of such. Ad.3) She is
happy that I am at home. It is harder to work like this because there are many
disturbances. But it is a way better to be your own boss + in my case double
the income + have a lot more free time.

~~~
bgraves
You are welcome :)

1\. I meant to ask how you might be able to streamline/automate your monthly
reports like BCC has done.

2\. What is your idea generation process? If that really is the sticking
point, then consider reducing the friction or cost of going from idea to MVP.
My example of going from idea to MVP in 6 hours is very streamlined. If I had
enough money to spend on AdWords, I could potentially test 1 idea per week and
dump the low performers. My point of friction here is traffic. The only
honest, reliable way to get traffic (and potential interested customers) is
with AdWords, which is not free.

3\. Very good to get your personal experience on this subject.

Thanks as always...

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nasmorn
I know you live in Poland and you already crossed your living cost threshold
but in a more expensive country your report means I need to save up at least a
year of living expenses because what you brought in would simply not pay my
bills.

While I certainly don't live frugally I don't own a car and the money is
merely for things like rent, food and such. I have a baby girl though and my
wife is currently at home. When she starts working again the picture would
certainly change.

TL/DR Not so easy to replicate if your cost of living is higher.

~~~
patio11
_Not so easy to replicate if your cost of living is higher._

I used to get variants of this comment all the time. "Pfft you people living
in low-cost countries like _Japan_ have things so easy..."

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acabal
I know what you mean--I get these comments too, and I've been living in places
like Germany, Belgium, England, Mexico (Mayan Riviera ain't as cheap as you'd
think) etc., while earning _dollars_ , and still making it happen.

People always ask how I can manage to travel so much and live independently
when my take-home pay is so low compared to a salaried developer. The answer
is that just like everything in life, it's about priorities. One person might
prioritize cable TV and an iPhone for $200/month, whereas I'd put that money
to a plane ticket. Granted sometimes things like babies or health problems
don't give you a choice, but for many people, it _is_ a choice to be chained
to desks job they hate.

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djb_hackernews
Quick question, are you taking those stock photos yourself? Or contracting out
to photographers, buying the rights, and just running the istock account?
Seems like some solid stock photos there.

~~~
SomeCallMeTim
He mentions on his blog that he's a photographer, so it's likely they are his
photos.

Also, it's always the same woman in his photos--I'm betting it's his wife. :)

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robjohnson
This is great representation of how the Internet has flattened the playing
field. Thank you for sharing this information so openly.

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kreci
As usual comments are welcome and strongly desired =)

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bobbles
nitpicking... first line "It is over a one year since "

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kreci
I am not native English speaker. I live in Poland. Would be glad for showing
me my language mistakes.

~~~
delta1
I believe it would be corrected as "It has been over a year since..." :)

Thanks for all your hard work documenting these findings! You're an
inspiration to all of us waiting to get started for ourselves.

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bemmu
I was surprised to read that the ebook is only marketed in your blog. It seems
like a great product for an affiliate program like clickbank.

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cygwin98
Didn't mean to bring in an iphone vs android battle here. But I'm curious to
know the reason why the author targets at Android rather than iphone. There
seems to be a concensus that iphone users are more willing to pay for apps.
Does that mean he should have made a lot more, should he work on iphone apps
instead?

~~~
kreci
It was easier for me to buy an Android phone when I was starting my online
business. But in future I am planning to release some apps for iPhone as well.
Moreover as being said I can not sell paid Android apps (not allowed by
google) - but can sell iPhone apps.

~~~
cygwin98
Maybe I am wrong. I thought you can create a LLC in the states via those shell
companies. Then you can sell apps via the LLC?

~~~
kennethologist
Sorry to hi-jack the thread slightly. But where can i find out information
about creating a shell company? I am in a country outside of the US. Thanks

~~~
metachris
Talk to a lawyer!

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r00fus
The iStockPhoto revenue looks amazingly good. I took a look at your photos and
they're pretty well done (not too abstract, good model, very grounded).

Makes me wonder if this is an arena where we can all make some extra money?

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jaryd
is there room for more people to share their monthly/weekly/annual income?

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kreci
If someone is interested I can accept guest post on my blog.

~~~
jaryd
my question is more of a general one about the current world-state. in America
it is typically taboo to discuss compensation. to ask often evokes physically
palpable feelings of discomfort and sometimes outright aggression. my belief
is that these feelings derive from the widespread association between self-
worth and compensation. the fear is if my compensation is low (or lower on a
relative scale) then i am worth less. i don't believe this is true, and i see
it is an impediment for having an open and stress-free discourse about pay.

do these ideas resonate at all with you personally? have you experienced
anything like this in Poland? did you have any second-thoughts or misgivings
regarding sharing your pay?

~~~
conradev
Its also taboo because we don't want to alter others' views toward us based on
how much money we make.

~~~
jaryd
That's precisely what I think is so flawed about these feelings. The amount of
money that you command makes a statement about your value beyond money.

So the question is, what happens to those of us whose pay is already public
(state employees, professional athletes, C-executives at publicly traded
companies, movie stars), and for those of us who freely divulge the
information?

Is there backlash from this behavior? Is the taboo justified?

~~~
EponymousPower
I make a much higher income than almost all my friends and most acquaintances.
(I'm a programmer, employed full-time by a company, got about $350k in 2010,
living and working in NYC.)

I never really took the taboo against talking about income seriously either,
until I realized that answering these kinds of questions honestly was
seriously poisoning my interactions with people. Some people would just get
jealous and resentful, others would make silent, unwarranted assumptions about
me, still others just became more prone to "hey, can you cover me and I'll pay
you back?" me with no intention of doing so and for higher and higher amounts.

So, I now discuss my income only with people who I know have a high one as
well. Everyone else gets a very frank "I'm sorry, but that's none of your
business." What's interesting is that I get more pleasant reactions now than
when I answered honestly.

So yeah, based on my experience, it is in your interest to obey the taboo and
keep your mouth shut.

~~~
conradev
Instead of being frank and saying "I'm sorry, but that's none of your
business.", I just say "A good amount." and no one has the balls to pursue
further. :P

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cpeterso
Has anyone here read Chris' _Make Money on Android_ ebook? There are quite a
few ebooks about "make money fast on Android". I'm curious how Chris' ebook
compares.

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afroCoder
How many Ad impressions do you serve per month? If you don't me asking. I made
almost $4 yesterday which is one of my biggest days yet lol.

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spoiledtechie
Anyone know what the Android Apps are and how many downloads he has had for
each?

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asmithmd1
I am amazed at his income for 4 prank apps and a couple other very simple
apps. I need to get something (anything!) up.

From his website:

X-Ray Scanner for Android (joke)

Cracked Screen (joke)

Detector Pro (joke)

WP Stats for Android (blog stats)

Virtual Drums Don’t push it! (joke)

Daily Beauty Tip (RSS Reader)

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Pakourama
Android dev making 2k a month? Come to the Bay, you'll make 5x that.

~~~
nandemo
But he's in Poland. What about his expenses? I wonder if that would be
multiplied by a number less or more than 5? (see other subthread here)

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klbarry
Average polish wages, according to his post, are about 12k a year. Average
american is around 50k, he would have to multiply his salary times 4 here to
match cost of living increase, roughly.

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mootothemax
_Average american is around 50k_

I thought that's for the entire household? And that for individual earners it
was closer to $25-$30k? I only ask as $50k seems really high for an average
salary - might have to investigate moving over, even ;)

~~~
klbarry
According to Wikipedia, you're right, but for a man the individual median is
still pretty close: 45,000 for full time work.

