
Windows 10 IoT Core Support for Raspberry Pi 3 - ingve
https://blogs.windows.com/buildingapps/2016/02/29/windows-10-iot-core-support-for-raspberry-pi-3/
======
symlinkk
You know what's funny is you can't even flash Raspbian on an SD Card on
Windows without a third party application [1]. If Microsoft is going to be all
gung-ho about open source and about the Pi, maybe they should ship "dd" with
their command prompt...and bash / coreutils while they're at it. Until they do
that, development on Windows is going to be a pain outside of the Visual
Studio walled garden, and barely anyone is going to want to develop on Windows
when 99% of the tutorials and documentation online is written for a bash
prompt. And I'm not talking about just Pi development - developing __anything
__on Windows is a huge pain without a Bash prompt and proper coreutils
support.

[1]
[https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentation/installation/insta...](https://www.raspberrypi.org/documentation/installation/installing-
images/windows.md)

~~~
Someone1234
> And I'm not talking about just Pi development - developing anything on
> Windows is a huge pain without a Bash prompt and proper coreutils support.

You haven't used Windows in a very very long time I take it? Powershell is
likely a better shell than Bash and Microsoft freely provides compilers for
C/C++/.Net and you can trivially get compilers for most other major languages
on the platform.

All I am reading from your complaints is that you're scared of learning
something new.

~~~
omaranto
I might add that the C# compiler seems to come pre-installed on windows,
nowadays.

~~~
ygra
The (old) C# compiler, as the VB compiler, was actually part of the .NET
framework starting with .NET 2. Since .NET comes pre-installed on Windows, you
also have a compiler. However, the new C# 6 compiler is no longer included in
the framework, I think. When you install .NET 4.6 it even adds a notice to the
old compiler's greeting message:

This compiler is provided as part of the Microsoft (R) .NET Framework, but
only supports language versions up to C# 5, which is no longer the latest
version. For compilers that support newer versions of the C# programming
language, see
[http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkID=533240](http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkID=533240).

~~~
omaranto
Yes, that's right.

------
ilurkedhere
Pi user here. Anyone know what the point of Windows 10 IoT is?

~~~
skykooler
If you're more comfortable with Windows development than Linux development,
it's a way to get things running more easily. (Although I expect that for many
HN readers it's the other way around.)

------
hnur
I'm not entirely up to speed on the situation of UEFI secure boot for ARM;
didn't Microsoft mandate that it can't be disabled for such devices to boot
Windows? Is that the case here?

~~~
callesgg
it does not actualy run "normal" Windows.

~~~
cptskippy
Has anyone taken a close look at what's actually running? I suppose it could
be a version of the Windows Kernel since they have it running on ARM for Phone
and RT but I frankly wouldn't be all that surprised if they were running Linux
with .NET Core on top.

~~~
mey
I've loaded up Windows 10 IoT for RPI 2 previously. It is a Windows kernel,
but otherwise massively cut down. It limits the system to a single running
"foreground" application at a time, plus some system services. If you wished
to dedicate the device to a single purpose, it's fine, but don't expect a
robust shell environment like you would see on a bare bones linux box. It
certainly won't support a user using it as a desktop environment. Think of it
more as embedded Windows offering, great for being a single app server,
robotics platform or kiosk.

~~~
Corrado
Which just makes me wonder what the point of it is. I guess if you _really_
love Windows and want to build an embedded system this would be the way to go.
I'm betting that most people that build embedded systems are not Windows
developers and I'm not sure that this IoT offering changes anything.

~~~
cptskippy
I'm starting to wonder the same thing. I've been looking for a project to try
it out on but every time I think I find one, I realize that it's something I
can't do with Windows 10 IoT because it lacks a key feature (e.g. printing)
and the time it would save on other aspects would be wasted trying to work
around it's inadequacies in other respects.

------
ikeboy
It is not available in the Microsoft store, the link there doesn't go to the
product.

~~~
protomyth
They have the 2 but not the 3 yet.

[http://www.microsoftstore.com/store?keywords=raspberry+pi&Si...](http://www.microsoftstore.com/store?keywords=raspberry+pi&SiteID=msusa&Locale=en_US&Action=DisplayProductSearchResultsPage&result=&sortby=score%20descending&filters=)

~~~
protomyth
Followup: the 3 is live on Microsoft's site.

------
ThinkBeat
Will Windows 10 IoT phone home with as nuch information as Windows 10 PC
edition does?

It makes perfect sense that Microsoft would want to mine the data they can
fetch from the IoTs in your house as well as your computer.

------
HeyLaughingBoy
I'm really interested in this as I have a project that would be perfect for
it, but I don't see any licensing information available. Anyone know anything
about that?

~~~
chadzawistowski
There are two licensing models for Windows 10 IoT Core
[https://www.microsoft.com/en-
us/WindowsForBusiness/windows-i...](https://www.microsoft.com/en-
us/WindowsForBusiness/windows-iot)

> There is a SKU ‘Windows 10 IoT Core’ available at no royalty cost for all
> our device makers that enables automatic OS updates via Windows Update when
> connected to the internet.

> In addition, we also have an OEM exclusive SKU ‘Windows 10 IoT Core Pro’
> which provides an ability to defer and control updates. This SKU can be
> licensed via distributors. Except for the servicing model difference, the
> features are the same between these two SKUs of Windows 10 IoT Core.

So it's free for most everyone who would be browsing Hacker News.

I work for Microsoft on IoT Core, so it's exciting to see some exposure! :)

~~~
pgeorgi
Note that the EULA related to this edition (at [http://ms-
iot.github.io/content/eulas/dashboard_eula_en-us.p...](http://ms-
iot.github.io/content/eulas/dashboard_eula_en-us.pdf)) also states in section
2 that "You may not" ... "transfer the software or this agreement to any third
party".

(plus some more restrictions of a similar kind)

So this is a development license, not a "ship a product" license. Which is
fair, but it's less universal than what your post could be interpreted to
mean.

~~~
chadzawistowski
I think that's just the default EULA. I also found this page where you can
apply for commercialization
[https://www.windowsforiotdevices.com/](https://www.windowsforiotdevices.com/)

Here's an excerpt from the commercial terms of use for the non-Pro SKU:

> Subject to the requirements in Section 3 and restrictions in Section 4 and
> the other terms and conditions of this Agreement, Microsoft hereby grants to
> you a royalty-free, worldwide, non-exclusive, personal, non-transferable,
> non-assignable, limited license to install a Runtime Image into an Embedded
> System and distribute your Embedded System to End-Users.

------
godzillabrennus
Why does Microsoft care about the Pi? What would make them invest in a version
of Windows for it?

~~~
tonyedgecombe
If kids start playing with Windows early on then they may grow up with a more
positive view of MS.

~~~
CalRobert
To be fair, this is exactly why I got my 14 year old cousin on Ubuntu two
weeks ago. So far he loves it.

~~~
Cartwright2
Why filter your cousin's world view when you could show him all available
options and let him make an informed decision himself?

Microsoft isn't so "bad" any more with their shift towards open source.

~~~
CalRobert
Allow me to clarify

Cousin: "Ugggggg my laptop is garbage since I put on Windows 10 and it's so
slooooooow, can you fix it? I can't even play Minecraft!!!!"

Me: "Umm, I haven't actually used Windows in about 5 or 6 years and have no
idea what's wrong - I also don't feel like spending my limited time visiting
family messing around with your laptop. Here's a USB drive with Ubuntu, give
it a shot"

Cousin (next day): "DUDE that's amazing it's so fast! I had to figure out UEFI
stuff but I installed Ubuntu and Minecraft is faster than it's ever been
before! I have a great dual boot setup going!"

Anyway, I don't feel too bad about it.

Incidentally, UEFI is one of the many reasons MS puts me off.

------
iamcreasy
Why it's $49.99 on Windows store instead of $35?

Is Microsoft is charging extra for the Windows license?

~~~
chokolad
Because it includes 16GB SD card I suppose.

------
cordite
"Puts a head on a headless device" That's actually pretty neat.

