
U.S. Moves Forward on $200B China Tariff - samspenc
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-07-10/u-s-is-said-to-move-forward-on-200-billion-china-tariff-list
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JumpCrisscross
The tariffs against Europe and Canada are stupid. The tariffs against China,
an emerging dictatorship, make sense. Their admission into the WTO was a
mistake [1].

[1] [https://www.economist.com/leaders/2018/03/01/how-the-west-
go...](https://www.economist.com/leaders/2018/03/01/how-the-west-got-china-
wrong)

~~~
rdlecler1
This terms like a strategic decision: Trump now has a bargaining chip with
Europe/Canada that he can use to pressure them into ganging up on China.
Without that pressure Europe/Canada would not be eager to take on China.

~~~
tryptophan
Or you know...he could just ask them to cooperate, as they have been our
allies for a very long time. No reason to use coercion.

~~~
rdlecler1
I was making an assessment of the strategic reasoning, not making a normative
judgement. In discussions about Trump people seem to have difficulty
separating the two.

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propman
Smart move IF we weren’t doing the same to Europe and Canada at the same time.
Europe is completely unreliable in terms of a united front against China,
everyone has failed on that. They delay, delay, empty promises almost as bad
as China so we don’t need them per say but we don’t want to get retaliation
from them either.

And Canada is awesome.

~~~
the_duke
Well, the US leadership has made it quite clear that US is only in for
themselfes and not a reliable partner anymore, at least in the current
presidency.

China already is a very important trading partner for the EU, so it makes
sense to look east if relationships to the west deteriorate.

Apart from practical reasons, I actually think facing off China on their
extremely anti-comptetitive and protectionist behaviour is long overdue and
something the EU should do as well.

~~~
qaq
"the US leadership has made it quite clear that US is only in for themselves"
as opposed to EU always looking out for US :)?

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slededit
The old world order was the US would be mostly fair to its allies, and in
return everyone would turn a blind eye as it pursued whatever it wanted in the
third world. Because the west would never seriously challenge the US it never
had to be concerned about the UN or any international body that constrains the
actions of most nations. The US is the most powerful single country but alone
against a united world it would not have nearly the same freedom of movement
it has now.

~~~
qaq
You see the "blind eye" thing for EU is complain loudly and do nothing and
thats not specifically related to US either. Russia invades a country "voice
concern" Russia shoots down a plain with many EU citizens now it's "deep
concern" while still laundering money for russian politicians and oligarchs
etc. So at some point none cares any more if EU voices "concern", "deep
concern" or "very deep concern".

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module0000
Meanwhile... nasdaq prices were within 20 points of all time highs today.
Tariff's aren't having decimating effect on the economy(yet?) that mainstream
media would have us believe. Not saying they are good/bad/etc, I don't care,
I'm only interested in their effects on markets.

This whole tariff brouhaha has created the best summer for day traders I've
ever observed. Normally, market participants take all of summer off...because
it's horrible. No volume, no volatility...etc. This summer has been
gangbusters in the market.

~~~
542458
The stock market is not the economy. The two can (and often) do very different
things.

[https://www.betterment.com/resources/economy-vs-stock-
market...](https://www.betterment.com/resources/economy-vs-stock-market/)

~~~
wtvanhest
Today's stock market performance shows investor views of the future. The
author of that articles seems to think its the reverse which isnt true.

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dragonwriter
> Today's stock market performance shows investor views of the future.

...of returns to capital, which, again, is not the whole of the economy, or
guaranteed to be representative of the whole of the economy.

~~~
dllthomas
Moreover, "... of returns to capital, in comparison to doing other things with
the money."

Still, I _would_ suspect tariffs to generally hurt that.

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clay_the_ripper
What are the real world implications of this? Is stuff at Walmart suddenly
going to get more expensive? Or is that not how this works?

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thecolorblue
Anything that is made of inexpensive electronics will increase in price. Then
anything that uses electronics will go up in price.

It is tough to say how much, as demand will shift to equivelant products as
the cost increases, but it's safe to say the any computer hardware will have
some increase in price. Since computers are used in every industry it could
cause any other low margin product to increase in price as there is no room
for the company to eat the cost of the tariff.

The interesting part is that we don't know how the economy will respond to
tech becoming more expensive as that is not the trend. Technology usually gets
less expensive.

I'm only focusing on the tech side of things. There could be different affects
in other industies.

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microdrum
Reminder: this isn't a "tariff" in the 19th century protectionist sense. It's
a tool to combat bad behavior.

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DeonPenny
Smart move, literally the only thing I agree with Trump on. China has been
doing the same for years harming other countries industries.

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mozumder
If China's retaliation harms the Trump base the most, via tariffs on US farm
products and manufactured goods, then I'm all for it.

We need free trade and open borders, so let this be a lesson to the Trumpers.

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zip1234
The goal of the tariffs IS free trade and open borders. You think they are
wanted by the administration? They are a tool to get China to play nice, which
they haven't been.

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mozumder
> The goal of the tariffs IS free trade and open borders. You think they are
> wanted by the administration?

LOL this administration definitely does not want free trade and open borders.

