
The forgotten joy of soap - whatami
https://www.spectator.co.uk/2019/07/the-forgotten-joy-of-soap/
======
detritus
I've been using bar soap for a good few years now as it was the means of
cleaning that I could most-easily buy locally that seemed to incur the least
plastic impact. I like to imagine that the invested energy density and cost of
transport is better too, compared to gels and liquids.

Regardless of all that worthiness though - I just prefer using the stuff and
am gently delighted when I walk into my bathroom and minded of the smell of my
grandmother's house, decades ago.

As the article implies, it comes with a certain fondness.

-

Added bonus - it works great on clothes that have been fouled by baby mess or
food splatter.

~~~
11235813213455
Same here, the joy of a good Marseille soap (I'm in France). It lasts at least
3 months for showers, washing hands, and everything (hair as well)

I heard some people wash their teeth with soap, I'm not there yet :))

~~~
detritus
Oh Good Lord, no - I don't know if it's a particularly British thing, but
children were threatened with having their "mouths washed out with soap" if
they said rude words!

~~~
merpnderp
I'm American and as a kid definitely had my mouth washed out with soap by my
grandmother.

------
Negitivefrags
Does anyone else find shower-gel just completely ineffective?

After using it I don't feel clean. I feel like I just rubbed cooking oil on my
body.

With regular soap bars you get the "clean" feeling which no other product
seems to match.

~~~
jazoom
What you're interpreting as "clean feeling" is likely stripping your skin of
its protective oils. That's why we (doctors) don't recommend soaps as a
general rule. That oil is there for a reason.

~~~
amelius
Good point, but what does that mean for the war against plastic gel bottles?
From the article:

> Given the war against plastic, maybe there will be a reaction to all these
> bottles of handwash. The bar of soap might yet stage a resurgence.

~~~
jazoom
My wife (also a doctor) actually started buying some bars for exactly that
reason. Unfortunately they were too harsh. It's an unsolved problem, as far as
I know.

Once there's enough demand, I'm sure manufacturers will follow the dollars.

~~~
abainbridge
I "solve" this problem by using soap but in smaller amounts. It doesn't need
to form a lather.

------
gpvos
I once had a bar of Greek olive soap that left a very slight oil-like residue
on my skin after use, and I _totally loved_ how that felt. I'm not quite sure
why the soap was that way; maybe the oil hadn't saponified completely or
something. The bar looked perfectly normal though, dark green with maybe a
slight transparent quality to it (it was long ago, my memory may be slightly
incorrect). I have never found such a soap again (my parents had brought it
back from their vacation and I have forgotten the brand name by now; this was
from before every shop was on the internet), but if anyone can help me find
one, that would be really great.

~~~
Crinus
Chances are it'll be Papoutsanis soap. These are available in many places with
Greek stuff, especially tourist places.

For a more hand made one check this one too: [https://www.ebay.com/itm/Greek-
Traditional-Pure-Olive-Oil-So...](https://www.ebay.com/itm/Greek-Traditional-
Pure-Olive-Oil-Soap-from-Samos-island-2x250gr/202098847542)

~~~
gpvos
I think I tried that one already, but no luck. Maybe it was just a one-off
production error. :( Thanks for the suggestion though.

~~~
Crinus
Note that i recommend two "brands" in my comment above, the link isn't to
Papoutsanis soap but some smaller one :-). It is very easy to find Papoutsanis
soap with a Google search so i didn't link to it.

------
NeedMoreTea
It's quite remarkable how successful the marketing campaign against bar soap
has been such that it's somehow thought of as unclean. All to get us to switch
to far, far more wasteful liquid soap.

~~~
stinos
_somehow thought of as unclean_

To be fair: if your hands are dirty like from gardening or working on a
bicycle then some of that dirt will stick to the soap and stay there until
after a couple of 'clean' uses. But in my mind that doesn't mean the soap is
unclean. After all, the visible dirt is normally a lot less to worry about
than the stuff which you don't perceive with your bare eyes. Of which I
actually don't know whether it's present on a bar of soap or not - wouldn't be
surprised if there are higher levels of bacteria on the surfcae - but whether
that actually has a negative effect is something else.

~~~
Vrondi
Just rinse off the bar of soap under the running water as you finish washing
your hand, and problem solved.

~~~
stinos
I'm well aware, but I find that a waste of soap. Also (maybe should have made
that more clear) I don't care if my soap bar looks dirty, that doesn't really
hinder it's functionality.

------
londons_explore
Bar soap has died due to a perceived lack of cleanliness.

People look at a half used bar of soap lying in a shared bathroom and think
"Some other dirty person has rubbed that in their private parts. No way I'm
touching that!!!".

Soap, unless stored in a well designed soap dish, also always has a partially
dissolved slimey bit that's pretty icky.

~~~
crispyambulance
What! When did this happen?!

Never heard of soap bars being considered dirty ever. That slime is just
because the soap has been sitting in puddle of water in a soap-dish.

If the soap bar has "stuff" on it, you just rinse it and rub that stuff off in
a second.

~~~
organsnyder
Perhaps it depends on location? Where I live (Michigan, US) I feel like an
anachronistic rebel having soap bars at the sinks in our home instead of
liquid soap dispensers. I think the perceived lack of cleanliness is one of
the main reasons (along with the Bath and Bodyworks marketing machine).

~~~
Loughla
That is maybe true for location. In my location (west-mid-west US), the sinks
you buy to install in your home mostly have little dents with drainage to be
soap-dishes for bar soap. They're pretty standard everywhere.

------
throw0101a
Soaps can strip oils from your skin and kill the biome. I recently ran across
the book _Beyond Soap_ by Dr. Sandy Skotnicki, a dermatologist who has a
practice and teaches in Toronto:

* [https://www.amazon.com/Beyond-Soap-Truth-Beautiful-Healthy/d...](https://www.amazon.com/Beyond-Soap-Truth-Beautiful-Healthy/dp/0735233608)

Most of the products we use may get the job done, but they tend to be heavy
handed in the chemicals they use. A list of products she recommends that her
clients use:

* [https://www.producteliminationdiet.com](https://www.producteliminationdiet.com)

You don't want to be dirty, but there may be something to the idea of cleaning
too much:

* [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hygiene_hypothesis](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hygiene_hypothesis)

An interview on a local public broadcaster:

* [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xGl19JJnaK0](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xGl19JJnaK0) * [https://www.tvo.org/video/the-trouble-with-soap](https://www.tvo.org/video/the-trouble-with-soap)

Generally: wash your hands and clean your (private) bits. Most of the extra
scrubbing modern (office) workers do is probably unnecessary.

~~~
reggieband
That interview was really interesting. She mentioned light-bulb moments but
her description of the skin biome really hit for me. I think she is right that
the next 10 years of body science is going to focus on bacteria biome in guts
AND skin.

She also hit the nail on the head about how men shower. I cover every inch of
my body with soap at least once a day. I have one soap for my body, one for my
hair and another for my face. I believed that is how I'm supposed to do it,
but now that I think of it I don't remember being taught. I've never thought
"What is the science of self-cleaning?"

It is strange the taboos we have around critical aspects of our life. I never
talk to my friends about their cleaning regimes just like I don't have serious
discussions about defecation. It's like these things are "dirty" so we avoid
even talking about them. Yet it seems to me that skin health and gut health
are both equally essential to overall health.

~~~
darkarmani
> I never talk to my friends about their cleaning regimes just like I don't
> have serious discussions about defecation.

I'm here for you, man, when you want to talk.

~~~
reggieband
Want to start a podcast?

------
geolqued
Surprised to see this on HN, it's not my main gig but recently I've been
getting into the details of exporting and selling coconut oil soap from my
family's business.

It's a remarkably simple process to make soap from oil or fat. just heat and
add a caustic agent. Sodium Hydroxide for bar soap or Potassium Hydroxide for
liquid soap.

When I check out the competition and look at the ingredients list I'm
surprised at how many different things that are in most products. Most body
washes are technically detergents not soaps.

~~~
pivo
> Most body washes are technically detergents not soaps.

Many bar "soaps" you find in pharmacies and grocery stores are detergent too,
at least in the US. If it doesn't say "soap" on the label, it probably isn't.

------
arethuza
I thought for a moment this was going to be about SOAP - don't remember there
being much joy to forget with that!

~~~
tzakrajs
Literally impossible to have joy from SOAP

------
floren
I recently made my own soap. I rendered tallow from beef suet, mixed in some
coconut and olive oils, then saponified it with plain old lye from the
hardware store. It's a magical process and it made me appreciate soap a lot
more. Now I use it in the shower instead of my trusty old bars of Irish
Spring. I wouldn't say it's any better for my skin than the store-bought bars
I used before, but it's quite satisfying to use soap I made myself.

------
jdlyga
I'll speak for the silent majority here who loves body wash. Unlike soap, it
moisturizes your skin and makes you feel really clean.

~~~
isostatic
It's only america that has theis strange obsession with bar soap. Go to a
hotel anywhere else in the world and you get bottles of gel.

~~~
overcast
That's not true at all. I've traveled to most corners of the world, and the
vast majority are little blocks of bar soap. Shampoo and Conditioner are
usually the only in liquid form.

~~~
isostatic
The only time I've encountered soap rather than shampoo has been in the US
(not even Canada) and Gaza (for some odd reason, but I always stay in the same
hotel there)

Hotels from Brazil to Kenya, from New Zealand to China, from Pakistan to
Denmark, have always had liquid soap for the shower.

~~~
pessimizer
I think it's more that they understand their customer base rather than a local
practice.

------
Semaphor
I used to have bleeding between my knuckles after moving away from my parents
in winter. At first, I thought it was a difference in humidity. Until I
started using bar soap (which is what my parents had) instead of liquid soap.
Since then, no more problems. I usually buy handmade soap at craft markets on
medieval and metal festivals and really enjoy the smell :)

------
noisy_boy
I use the Mysore Sandal Soap[0] made by a hundred year old company. I have
very oily skin so the traditional bar of soap works like nothing else.

[0]:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mysore_Sandal_Soap](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mysore_Sandal_Soap)

------
dekhn
I use Dr. Bronners, love the stuff. Cheap, high quality, and dilute, dilute,
OK!

------
batbomb
Most my adult life I’ve used Ivory (usually bars), or Dr Bronners (liquid)
with a handful of other things at random. The only wash I like besides those
would be the Kiehl’s Musk wash, but I’m slightly interested in abandoning soap
altogether except for the nasty bits.

------
SolaceQuantum
I'd recommend anyone who has chronic skin issues to give african black soap a
try. I'm not sure what exactly is in it that makes it work so well, but it
works wonders for a variety of chronic skin irritation resulting symptoms like
eczema.

~~~
KozmoNau7
I've used Dudu Osun for a while now, and I think the key points are that it's
super-fatted and has shea butter mixed in.

------
Japhy_Ryder
I thought this was going to be about SOAP (Simple Object Access Protocol).....

------
sfmike
Surprised no one's mentioned Mother dirt.

[https://www.amazon.com/Mother-Dirt-Microbiome-Plant-Based-
Pr...](https://www.amazon.com/Mother-Dirt-Microbiome-Plant-Based-
Preservative/dp/B07RYBPLJV/ref=sr_1_3?keywords=biome+friendly+soap&qid=1562744378&s=gateway&sr=8-3)

Soap that doesn't kill the skin biome. Unlike antibacterial which just mercs
everything.

------
parentheses
Squirty soaps are more presentable and I'm told don't dry out your skin (I
have no proof of this).

I recommend watering the soap down. The amount of soap needed is usually a
fraction of the travel of the pump. Additionally when you add water, you
needn't rinse before soaping - the soap mixed into the water enables lathering
(thus saving water and soap).

~~~
KozmoNau7
I bought a foam dispenser, which I fill with very dilute Dr. Bronner's. It
works amazingly well.

------
Wildgoose
Soap strips away all the barrier oils produced by your skin to protect itself.

Natural skin is slightly acidic with a pH of around 5.5 and so for the last 30
years I have used tablets of a soap substitute with the same pH value. These
are called "sebamed", (manufactured in Germany). Highly recommended.

------
rangibaby
I replaced my shower gel, shampoo, and face wash with Dr Bronner’s a few
months ago. It is so good!

~~~
twic
I'm so glad to see the Dr Bronner's Evangelism Strike Force turning up on this
thread. It really does have everything a soap should have: effective cleaning,
lovely fragrances, AND far-out religious teachings!

------
towelthrower
1st i thought it was about the 'Simple Object Access Protocol'...

But is it about the old searchengine-gag that there are more pieces of soap
found - than towels ? [rolleyes]

------
physicsguy
Lush sell bar soap and shampoo bars nowadays which are nice!

------
neonate
[http://archive.is/ySMel](http://archive.is/ySMel)

------
kstenerud
I stopped washing with soap 6 years ago and never looked back.

For the first month, my skin was so greasy all the time that it felt like I'd
been wearing the same clothes for a week, just an hour after putting them on,
but then my skin finally adjusted to the new normal.

My skin is soft - much too soft for a man of my age, according to my wife. I
have no body odor, even after a heavy workout where I'm still covered in
sweat. I can (and have) gone for week long hikes and come back not smelling
bad. Contrast this to before where an hour after a shower I'd smell terrible
if I didn't put on that nasty underarm deodorant (I don't use that stuff
anymore, either).

My father was skeptical when I told him, but eventually I won him over and he
experienced something similar when he stopped using soap to wash.

Soap is only for things you can't remove any other way (like motor oil), or
for when you need antiseptic conditions.

~~~
mlevental
the 65 million dollar question: do you only wash your butthole with water as
well

~~~
freejak
this is why i visit hacker news

edit: i'll also add that i too use soap minimally when showering (nether
regions). i'm asian so BO has never really been an issue but i did notice that
my athlete's foot has not reappeared since i stopped washing my feet with soap
for a few years.

~~~
PakG1
No kidding? Did you do anything else to treat it? I thought diligently
cleaning my feet with soap would be helpful. I think it has been, but it's
recently started coming back a little bit, so I'm not sure. I've tried a whole
bunch of other things too, but didn't do anything other than constantly soap
for a while because it didn't come back for so long. And now it's coming
back....

~~~
Renaud
I started using boric acid about 6-7 years ago. I’m nit talking about those
ineffective foot powders, just straight pure boric acid (looks like powdered
sugar), about a teaspoon every 2/3 days in my shoes.

Basically stopped all smells, no fungal infection of any kind for years, and
at the end of the day, my socks still smell of fabric softener.

Doesn’t prevent sweat but the boric acid completely blocks the proliferation
of bacteria, so no smells and no fungus can grow.

It’s more effective if you start using it on new shoes as they will never be
contaminated by bacteria.

Truly amazing how effective it has been. Just give it a few weeks.

~~~
PakG1
That's interesting. I presume it needs to spread evenly over the entire
insole?

~~~
Renaud
Just shake the shoe to spread the powdered boric acid. Doesn’t need to be
precise, over time it will spread everywhere.

------
asdfasdfasdfa
Oh no millenials are killing bar soap.

------
unixhero
This may be a very cool hipster topic and I don't want to disregard the art
and skills involved with concocting a great line of soap bars... However, soap
bars are not particularly hygienic. This is due to the fact that

[1] they are shared between people in the wash basin and the shower or tub

[2] they are used repeatedly but in reusing it, the user is potentially
exposed to old grime and bacteria.

~~~
everdrive
How well does bacteria live on a bar of soap?

~~~
unixhero
Well enough for hospitals to agree with my OC.

~~~
Tepix
Hospitals have different requirements, they have patients with a weakened
immune system.

The bacteria that are in a normal household pose no threat to healthy people.
Which is why you shouldn't use antibacterial stuff in your everyday life.

With regards to soap in hospitals: They also have special liquid soap
dispensers you can use with your elbows. Again something you don't need in
your house.

