
Italy Quake Rescuers Ask Locals to Unlock their Wi-Fi - yitchelle
http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-37186290
======
Tergmap
It would make much more sense if the mobile phone operators offered free
mobile data access.

It is messy to make changes to router settings to most users.

~~~
27182818284
I think shortwave (and a strong group of local hams ahead of time) is a
possibly better approach

The hams in my area are routinely involved with disasters big and small.
They've responded quickly in disasters with volunteer patrols and stations.
They routinely help out at events like marathons, fairs, and more. When a fire
took down a place's cell towers, they were there to facilitate communication.
When the 911 call system went offline, they were around the city to help out
(i.e., could place direct emergency calls for folks)

~~~
kalleboo
HAMs are great but imagine if everyone had a shortwave transmitter after a
disaster - if 4G networks can't handle the traffic, amateur radio would be
pure noise. Getting wifi and mobile data working means everyone has a shot at
communicating

~~~
Steltek
If you could funnel local traffic into more sparsely distributed HF packet-
based transceivers, it might not be too bad. You wouldn't be relaying general
Internet traffic, just disaster related info. Think 1990's web form for family
contacts and medical status.

------
mixedbit
The rescuers in Italy are asking people to remain completely silent once in a
while to try to communicate with trapped victims. I wondered if in a similar
manner it would be technically possible to detect signal from phones that
belong to trapped victims, if all not trapped people were asked to turn off
their mobile phones.

~~~
boredpudding
Most of the phones have likely ran out of battery. Also, there is a big chance
that there are phones without victims. Not a good way to find people.

~~~
mixedbit
I don't think that false positives disqualify such approach.

~~~
OJFord
It would be a waste of resources to rescue an ownerless phone.

~~~
mseebach
Which is why you'd correlate with lists of known missing and known not-missing
people before digging in.

~~~
OJFord
Missing people won't lose their phone in a disaster?

------
_ph_
Maybe events like this can trigger politics to review the very laws by which
they force us to lock down wi-fi networks in the first place.

~~~
dkns
What do you mean?

~~~
toyg
In Italy, there are laws making wifi network operators responsible for the
actions of people joining their networks. At one point, public network
operators (cafes etc) were required by law to record the ID card of anyone
requesting access. This provision was eventually dropped, but I think the
overall concept of network owners' responsibility is still there.

~~~
rplnt
I think there's EU-wide push for not allowing free public wifi. Heard about it
in at least two other countries. Not sure if any law was passed though.

~~~
toyg
Italy spearheaded this approach because of content piracy, under the pretense
of organized-crime prevention. It was eventually seen as holding back tourism
and economy, so it was dropped; but by then, the seed was planted (European
law-enforcement agencies co-ordinate a lot, in this day and age) and found
roots elsewhere in the wake of terrorist events. I don't think there is an
explicit EU directive yet, though.

~~~
ramblenode
Sad that preventing piracy is considered more important than easy access to
free information.

------
nly
Guest network anyone?

A distinct SSID, WPA2 password and subnet dispatches with most of the personal
risk.

~~~
pilif
Not really. You'd still be liable for any misuse happening from external
users. Or if not liable, you'd at least have an uphill battle to fight in
order to prove that it wasn't you that did the thing that got you into
trouble.

Additionally, depending on your ISP, you might violate the TOS by providing a
public WiFi. If you live in a place without real choice of ISP, that would be
bad if they then cancel your account.

~~~
jstanley
> you'd at least have an uphill battle to fight in order to prove that it
> wasn't you that did the thing that got you into trouble.

Aren't you innocent until proven guilty? Simply saying "I have a guest
network" surely constitutes reasonable doubt, in the absence of any other
evidence against you.

~~~
Proof
Sadly, the way Justice System is working nowadays is that majority of cases
end with a plea due to overwhelming pressure from the prosecutors.

So, theoretically one could ride the reasonable-doubt-train all the way to
court but at that point, the prosecutor would stack any charge possible
leaving the jury to deliberate on all them. Modern day juries still most
likely are not computer savvy so, merely stating "IP Address" would most
likely be enough to convict. It is also needs to be added that if the charges
are severe enough, even though every defendant is innocent until proven
guilty, in reality it is the opposite way around if the said crime is
vehemently disliked by all.

~~~
icebraining
Do they use juries for these matters in Italy?

~~~
qubex
No.

------
peter303
This quake happened at 4AM. Most people probably had phones on bedstand or
charging stations rather on person.

I suspect most people knew where their neighbors were at this time which may
have aided searches. Pretty much didnt need to bother with any public
buildings.

P.S. I was in the 4AM 1994 Los Angeles quake. Night quakes have a little
different psychology than day quakes.

------
burnbabyburn
I wonder how this works, given that is illegal to share your internet
connection with others in IT.

~~~
kwhitefoot
Lots of things are illegal in Italy, and elsewhere, that are nonetheless
common done.

------
dewiz
Here's the tweet
[https://mobile.twitter.com/crocerossa/status/768387275654885...](https://mobile.twitter.com/crocerossa/status/768387275654885376)

which is also confusing about the how to "reset" the router, not sure if some
models might go back to factory settings holding the reset for 10 secs...

------
alexandre_m
It's time we start looking at Internet mesh networking more seriously.

~~~
amazon_not
Mesh networking wasn't exactly a raging success last time around and not much
has changed since then.

------
melling
"Hey Siri" ... "Enable my emergency beacon"

Of course, phones and watches don't have that feature yet but an open (low-
power) broadcast standard could help save lives.

Finding people who are lost in the woods would be much easier.

[http://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/hiker-pavlina-pizova-
survi...](http://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/hiker-pavlina-pizova-
survives-30-days-new-zealand-wilderness-n638176)

[http://www.wlox.com/story/32833377/woman-found-after-
being-l...](http://www.wlox.com/story/32833377/woman-found-after-being-lost-
in-the-woods-for-hours)

------
ramblenode
I wonder if devices implemented a communication protocol based on UWB we could
leverage it for rescue operations. Along with other advantages, it has a much
greater ability to penetrate physical barriers [0].

[0]
[http://www.thetrackit.com/library/UWB%20Defin.pdf](http://www.thetrackit.com/library/UWB%20Defin.pdf)

------
y04nn
It would be awesome if in case of emergency, WIFI AP could build up a
cognitive network to assist rescuers. We can even think of phones workings a
relays to an available Internet connexion.

------
touristtam
This article is quite poor; this is probably something barely re worded from a
need provider (like Reuters). Can anyone find an article with more depth to
corroborate this?

Edit: it looks like it isn't anything to do with the rescue effort in itself;
the Italian red Cross is asking to open private wifi in order to allow people
to communicate. I naively thought it would have to be something with
exploiting wifi in a novelty manner, but no.

Quite disappointed.

~~~
kfk
Right, 270+ people dead and counting and you are disappointed. I don't know,
maybe a bit of reality check sometimes?

~~~
touristtam
What are you going on about? This is HN, not your classic news bulletin board.
If I wanted to have succinct news reports from a general news outlet, I would
go to one. Feel free to do the same.

~~~
kfk
Wow, this is HN and what? Your comment is still completely out of touch with
reality, there are lots of Italians reading HN, some might have lost their
friends or family members and look, people are even downvoting my parent
comment. Is this really the place you want HN to be? You want to change the
world but you can't see things from another perspective? Or show some
understanding and compassion? It's not just you, but the whole thread here is
terrible, it's like if you had another 9/11 and I spent my time commenting on
why mobile reception is so bad there in the area of the disaster.

~~~
mtmail
To rephrase what touristtam said, HN is a place where stories about shootings,
terrorist attacks, catastrophic events and other current news get flagged
regularly. Just like celebrity and sport news. Plenty of news outlets already
report about the earthquake. This article is about the technical aspect of
enabling wifi and I see people discussion wifi and cell coverage, privacy and
legal aspects of opening networks, thermal imagining systems. I don't see
people disrespecting the victims or families. The event itself and the human
stories/tragedies behind that - and sorry that might be hard to swallow -
isn't discussion-worthy to a lot of people on HN.

------
Ind007
Heat source scanners like they show it in movies does really exist? Will be
really helpful in these scenarios if they do really exists.

~~~
mtmail
They exist. I can't tell how deep they can detect heat and if it's enough for
body heat. [http://thermalvisionresearch.co.uk/thermal-camera-
products/t...](http://thermalvisionresearch.co.uk/thermal-camera-
products/t-650/)

------
newscracker
Wouldn't peer-to-peer apps like FireChat [1] also help?

[1]:
[https://www.opengarden.com/firechat.html](https://www.opengarden.com/firechat.html)
(Currently throwing an invalid certificate error)

~~~
hunter
You might need at least a user every 70m (210ft) for FireChat to work
properly; not feasible in these circumstances.

During such catastrophes setting up a temporary airMAX as an open access point
would be a more speedy and reliable solution; only need one telephone line to
operate, the teams don't have to waste time installing other apps, and the
antenna's wifi coverage is greater than a cheap router's.

------
Raphmedia
They should rather use a solution like one of Google's WI-FI blimp and fly
them hover the affected areas.

------
byteface
maybe all routers should have an emergency login

