
Post Flat Design - avree
http://blog.collectiveray.com/post/82108622609/post-flat
======
ztratar
I said this very clearly before and was downvoted into oblivion, but I think
it needs to be said:

This article advocates for some balance between flat design and skeumorphism.
Granted, the article is written decently well, but it does not go into _any_
detailed analysis as to where that balance should lie.

It simply states: Hierarchy should use composition and color. Cool -- basic
design principle, check. Beautiful, readable typography? Yes -- sure. Strong
emphasis on content, not ornamentation. OK. I've read this 1000x times
already. What is new? Where are the analyses or case studies to support the
principles?

We need to start talking about where the balance lies and why it lies there.
Different interactions will require different balances to find optimality.

~~~
nsmartt
> _it does not go into_ any _detailed analysis as to where that balance should
> lie_

That's very much part of the point. From the article:

 _Without strict visual requirements associated with flat design, post flat
offers designers tons of variety to explore new aesthetics – informed by the
best qualities of skeuomorphic and flat design._

~~~
secstate
Well then this is just post-modernism applied to flat design. An amorphous
ball of nothing that has no rules so do whatever you want. Want drop shadows
in two directions, cool, cause we can do whatever we want now!

I'm not buying it. Post-modernism has been exposed as a joke by fake academic
paper generators. Design loosed from it's moors is called experimentation, not
post-flat, or whatever's cool right. Please, experiment, just don't claim
you've re-invented magic.

~~~
nsmartt
I thought of it as being more akin to the programming mantra of “use the right
tool for the job.”

The part about the pendulum swinging back to some degree seems like a
reasonable progression from flat design.

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koyote
The iOS keyboard is not the best example of flat design.

It always bothered me that it does not follow the usual convention of
displaying the letters in lower case when the shift/caps lock is not turned
on.

~~~
IbJacked
I also don't like that it's harder to tell if shift is on or off, now. Pre iOS
7, at least it went blue. Now it goes from black on white to white on gray, I
still couldn't tell ya which is which. The case of the keycaps changing with
the state of shift would fix that, too.

~~~
josefresco
Couldn't agree with this more. I still don't get it and have to toggle it
on/off a few times before I remember.

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MrZongle2
DL;DR: the current 'flat design' fad is a reaction to skeuomorphism overuse
and abuse. Flat design isn't really the solution either, since close adherence
can hinder intuitiveness. Therefore, a compromise the author calls "post flat
design" is a fusion between the two styles with a focus on content and
intuitiveness rather than implementation.

Personally, I don't know if "post flat design" is _the_ solution, but I'm sick
of flat design. I prefer skeuomorphism, but agree with the author that it has
been overdone: I don't need a photo-realistic leather binder for my note-
taking app, for instance.

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josefresco
I'm going to go out on a limb here and suggest that design, like fashion or
any other type of art can't be rationalized or justified using scientific like
processes.

What "looks right" today looks out-dated and clunky tomorrow. There usually
isn't any logic behind it, only changing tastes.

Flat looks/ed good because we were so entrenched in a skeuomorphic world and
were sick of it. Just like wearing baggy jeans with teens morphed into skinny
jeans, or grunge music supplanting glam-rock, tastes of humans change over
time and no matter how hard you try to break it down and analyze why one art
replaced another, there isn't usually an answer to be found.

Extreme flat design has brought about horrible interfaces (see iOS7) yet it
has also brought wonderful innovations due to it's tendency to break free of
the physical world.

Were gradients and company names without vowels of the Web 2.0 era superior to
the ones prior? No, but it felt right because of where we had come from. I
suspect that trend will continue forever.

There wont' ever be a "final" design aesthetic that we all agree is the best,
and art will never reach some sort of pinnacle that will never be surpassed.

Make your own art, don't worry about what is trending ... you might find
yourself on the "right" side of design if you focus on making your art the
best it can be.

~~~
wavefunction
I would disagree. I think good design is timeless. It's why eras where design
was preeminent like "art-deco" and "Hellenic Greece" still resonate so
strongly with audiences today.

I think design aspires to a Platonic ideal of simplicity, function and form,
but that the fashions of the time influence how that aspiration is expressed.

It's why Steve Jobs and his vision were so successful in my opinion, paring
the complexity of modern consumer electronics and attendant functionality back
to what a user actually wants and needs from a device. If you disagree, I'd be
interested to hear why (re: simplicity, not so much Steve Jobs) as I use
external opinions to shape and refine my own.

~~~
josefresco
"good design is timeless"

Then why does design move on, evolve or change about-face? Also how do you
know that your design is good, and will stand the test of time? I think what
you're witnessing is design that still appeals to your modern tastes. This I
attribute more to luck than some superior logic.

"design aspires to a Platonic ideal of simplicity, function and form"

If you believe that than you're throwing out an entire category of design that
isn't simple. Some design is incredibly complex ..even messy yet at the time
it's considered beautiful and rich because it reflects and invokes human
emotions of the time.

Simplicity can stand the test of time because it lacks elements that we
associate with the time which can fall out of taste. That doesn't make it
better, it just makes it ... simple.

The best design reflects the current tastes of your audience, it does not need
to be timeless or even make sense to future generations. Good design evokes an
emotional response and that response is dictated by many factors which take
into account context.

~~~
bobbygoodlatte
Trends and fads move on, but great design is timeless. Great design solves a
problem completely.

The Eames Lounge Chair was designed in 1956. At no point since then has it
looked dated. And it never will. It's timeless (and comfortable as well).
[http://www.hermanmiller.com/products/seating/lounge-
seating/...](http://www.hermanmiller.com/products/seating/lounge-
seating/eames-lounge-chair-and-ottoman.html)

Its difficult to make timeless work with software because the capabilities and
mediums change so rapidly. But we'll get there eventually.

~~~
dublinben
As great as the Eames Lounge Chair is, I think it looks like it was created in
the 1950s. A better example of a timeless piece of design would be the
Barcelona Chair, which predates even the Eames Chair. It still looks modern,
nearly a century after it was created.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barcelona_chair](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barcelona_chair)

~~~
yofred
Add Le Corbusier's LC2 (to the eames and barcelona chair) and and you have a
few timeless designs, all from mid-century.

[http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41a30HNuKeL.jpg](http://ecx.images-
amazon.com/images/I/41a30HNuKeL.jpg)

To the people discounting timeless design: yes most of contemporary industrial
design is disposable, but some pieces from Braun and Apple will be considered
classics.

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JGuo
Designers have been using animations to signal affordances in buttons and
actionable elements. Drop shadows are still effective in doing this. Every
design trend has been a reaction to the previous one. As interaction
designers, we should always be thinking about the end user.

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eyevariety
The conclusion is a total let down.

"Dust off your drop shadows and gradients, and introduce them to your flat
color buttons and icons. Do your absolute best work without feeling restricted
to a single aesthetic."

I feel like the author is admitting that they are completely constrained by
the rules or whims of trend- and that breaking out of them is some kind of
crazy paradigm shift- and that breaking them only involves mixing in the tired
tropes of the last fashion into the tired tropes of the new one.

My experience is that its only the non-designers that feel constrained by
fashion. The professionals push the boundaries - they are the ones that define
it.

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ricardobeat
> Can you tell which Shift key is enabled?

I've been on iOS7 since release, and I still can't tell when caps-lock is
enabled :(

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davidw
Maybe we'll get a retro look. Say, the X windowing system in the 90ies... like
Motif:

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Plan_Open_Motif_screensho...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Plan_Open_Motif_screenshot.png)

[http://qt-project.org/doc/qt-4.8/images/qmotifstyle.png](http://qt-
project.org/doc/qt-4.8/images/qmotifstyle.png)

~~~
sprobertson
Hell, why use GUIs at all anymore? A tired fad if I've ever seen one.

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sic1
Well it looks pretty...

But in terms of the web... if you can't create it with CSS3, its not worth it
IMO. All those extra little shadows and light reflections... yeaaa. No thanks.

More designers should learn CSS and build out little things like this
themselves so they can see how far they can take it without using an image.

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mikek3
Your username -> twitter profile links on the blog page are borked. :(

~~~
avree
thanks, fixed

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Dirlewanger
So...flat design with shadows? OK.

Everyone just wants to start a trend, don't they?

