

An open letter to Rockstar Games - MattBearman
http://pastebin.com/KdjUH5y4

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MattBearman
Author of the paste (and post) here:

Wow, didn't expect this to reach the top of HN! To answer some points raised:

Maybe I am taking a game a bit too seriously, but my friends and I have put a
lot of time into GTA online, and had a load of fun. I just don't want RS to do
something that could ruin that.

I agree that in the GTA world $500k isn't really 'rich', maybe the title was a
little link baity, but my point remains, I truly believe that $500k would have
a detrimental effect on the game.

If this never reaches rockstar, or they ignore it, I will simply have to
exercise some self control and keep my bank balance > $500k at all times.

I too wouldn't actually be that averse to Rockstar wiping the servers clean,
as long as I didn't have to play through the tutorial again :)

And finally - loose / lose - damn it, and I'm usually a stickler for grammar,
my only excuse is that I wrote this pretty quick.

Thanks for all the feedback, and if any one on HN is from Rockstar or knows
someone, I'd love to hear what they think about it.

~~~
lifeformed
An alternative would be for you to blow that $500k on some expensive cars, and
then drive them all into the ocean.

~~~
brokenparser
This.

It's an extra mission: You just got some illicit bag of money you have to get
rid of, so buy cars from a shady dealer and drive em to the compactor (there
is a car compactor in GTAV, right?).

~~~
lucisferre
The Brewster's (half) millions mission

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sbarre
I really like this idea, and I hope Rockstar considers this because making it
optional is probably the best of both worlds for the player base.

Personally I will use my $500k to buy a nice apartment and a nice car
(honestly $500k in GTA:O is not what I would call "rich" money - many cars
cost way more than that), and then I'll be back to having $100k or less in the
bank, so that making $10k on a mission _will_ feel good.

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CrunchyJams
It's funny how analogous this is to the underlying debate driving modern
politics.

Should the state (Rockstar in this case) offer direct monetary provisions to
the citizens without requiring productivity in exchange? The tough part is
that both sides of the argument make sense. It's not fair that some players
have had an unduly difficult time getting started, but it would also be unfair
to diminish the value of the achievement of people who have succeeded by
distributing gobs of cash to satiate the masses.

The analogy breaks down in that there's no inflation in GTA (as far as I'd
guess, haven't played), but interesting nonetheless.

~~~
acjohnson55
I think the analogy also breaks down with regard the opportunity gap that
exists in the real world between those born into at least some level of
affluence and those born into poverty.

In some ways, you could say being gifted $500k is more like inheriting money
versus those who've had to earn it themselves.

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nwh
'Loose' and 'lose' seems to be the new their/there/they're.

~~~
Ellipsis753
Wow, I do this all the time (and it really annoys me to no end when I notice).
But I've never seen anyone else make the same mistake. I'm kind of happy to
know I'm not the only one.

~~~
Blahah
I notice people using "loose" when they mean "lose" probably twice a day on
average, but I get unusually distracted by spelling mistakes. I don't think
I've ever seen the reverse mistake.

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jbrooksuk
My account has been deleted about 4 times now. I've given up trying to earn
money and have resorted to blowing people up. I'm limited to a .50 gun and a
crap car. It sucks for me.

Today I was offered a chance to change my character. I took it because I had
to do it so many times I randomised everything. Hopefully it stays.

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brador
Similarities to the basic income idea are there.

500k makes things easier to buy, but will players who would have played more
play less? It will make for some interesting datapoints in the basic income
conversation if they go ahead with it.

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ced83fra
This is a truely interesting paste. Thanks for sharing. GTA is meant to
replicate the real word (to a certain extent).

So, when you try to replicate his argument to the real word, you you get the
point. This guy has just given some real reason why people shouldn't hope to
be magically rich in real life. Why try to win at Euromillion ? By translating
to the real world, it would give : "Giving [me] $500,000 will shit on that
whole process. Completing a [job] and getting $10,000 wont feel like such an
achievement when [I]'ve already got half a million sitting in the bank. I
really feel that suddenly getting wealthier would make the game less
enjoyable"...

""Look for the bare necessities The simple bare necessities"" \- Balu - The
Jungle Book - 1967

~~~
zipppy
A sense of achievement comes from two different places when comparing GTA to
real life. 10k in real life doesn't feel like an accomplishment to people
simply because they don't have 500k in the bank, it's also/mostly because it's
usually hard to earn and takes a significant investment of time and effort.

Also, there are no real consequences in GTA for running out of money, like
there are in real life. People want to win lotteries for the security (which
ironically they so often piss away if they do win), something that people
don't need in a video game.

~~~
RodericDay
I admire your composure in replying to that post.

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DigitalSea
I think the author misses the point here. The cost of purchases in GTA Online
adds up so quickly that $500,000 isn't actually that much in the greater
scheme of things. It might get you an apartment or a cheap car, but once it's
been spent, you need to earn more. Some of the cars in the game are over $500k
as well. Seems like complaining for the sake of complaining without any real
facts to back things up here.

Rockstar are doing it right in my opinion. It costs them nothing to give users
fake $500,000 and it keeps the users happy and in the game, which means more
users online which means the higher the chance of Rockstar making real money
off of your presence.

~~~
BashiBazouk
It will get you the apartment of your choice. The most expensive is something
like $422,000. Or any car under the top tier. My fear is it will get those who
already have a decent bank account closer to the tank, fighter jet, or attack
copter. Too many of those in the game at once could cause problems but it's
only a matter of time before that happens anyway...

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mentos
I was hoping Rockstar would do the opposite and wipe all of the servers once
they were stable.

While some players would be upset I think the majority of players would like
to see the ones that got out in front by unfairly exploiting missions be
pulled "back in the race".

In fact I'd like to see them wipe the servers every 3 months or so and declare
"winners" (player with the most $, clans with the most $, player with the most
kills, etc). Theres nothing more exciting than opening day so why not try to
have one every 3 months?

~~~
klausa
Because people have wildly ideas of fun than you do.

While many hardcore gamers might like the idea of complete wipe every three
months (and is has been successfully done before, see ladder in Diablo 2), the
hard truth they need to face is that 'hardcore' crowd is not a majority of the
market, and hasn't been for a long, long time.

People like to think that average gamer is 20-something college guy, right?
That's cute image, but completely wrong. Average gamer 30 years old. People
who buy most games are 35. 45 percent of gamers are woman. There are more
woman >18 playing games, than boys <17\. [1]

Frankly, even though I'm only 20 years old, I'm increasingly identifying with
casual market than with hardcore-tru-gamerzzzz.

I find it hard these days to spend >10 hours on a single game.

I think most games have really ridiculously tuned difficulty curves with crazy
spikes in places where it makes absolutely no sense.

I can think of three, maybe four games that I spent over 15 hours in last few
years. That would be Diablo III, GTA V, Cookie Clicker (does that count?) and
Super Hexagon.

And frankly, if Rockstar wiped Online servers after I (and many, many, many)
more people put ~20 hours into it, as much as I love that game, I would quit
and never look back. I just don't have patience to grind all day long anymore.

You also have to remember that you can purchase in-game-currency with micro
transactions - paying fifteen bucks for GTA$ and then seeing it vanish next
day because ladder season ended would be... frustrating, to say the least.

/I'm sorry if my rant is a little bit incoherent, but video-games and hardcore
gamers demanding developers to cater to them are my pet-peeves./

[1]: [http://www.theesa.com/facts/](http://www.theesa.com/facts/)

~~~
mratzloff
I agree, but a quick point about those statistics I see trotted out
repeatedly: they include casual games. The people playing Bejeweled clones or
hidden image games are not the same people playing Grand Theft Auto.

~~~
poolpool
Not but there are many people who take a laid back approach to the game, not
unlike how one could play a game or two of bejeweled then get on with their
day.

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georgemcbay
There's no way they are going to back off on this because they have been
advertising it in the game via the MOTD status messages. If they suddenly
decided not to do it, the backlash from entitled online gamers would be
legendary.

Having said that, Rockstar giving everyone $500k GTA$ is pretty much a non-
event in the face of the fact that they will be selling GTA$ for real money.
The $500k of GTA$ money they are giving away will be purchasable for 10 bucks
in as many $500k increments as you wish to buy. And while in the case of
buying the money outright you can more easily choose to not participate, the
fact that tons of other people will participate (I've seen people waste
ridiculous amounts of money on COD Black Ops 2 "camos" for example, things
that don't even give them an in-game advantage the way money does in GTA V
Online) will already make the overall game economy incredibly loopy.

If you really don't want the free money, when it appears in your bank account
just use it to put super high bounties on random people. You'll burn through
the money nearly instantly with nothing personal to show for it and cause epic
havoc on the server you're on at the same time, which is very much in the
spirit of GTA.

~~~
kpapke
Totally agree with your point about selling GTA$

One small correction - the max bounty you can place is $10k and the max you
can gift is $5k

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ChikkaChiChi
Online in this game is the biggest "beta" I've seen in recent memory.

There are a lot of basic mechanics to what a Rockstar MMO would have, but none
of them are implemented to the point that I think people are expecting.

Rockstar hasn't mentioned anything about developing the in-game economy any
further than it already has. The game is more online deathmatch and less
MMO...welcome to the world of console gaming, I guess.

Enjoy getting run over by folks who flag passive after you kill them for the
time being, but don't expect the fully-realized world in the trailers.

In short, if you don't want to spend your 500k, then...don't?

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junto
Completely off topic, but when I visit that page on an iOS device, once the
advert loads it then automatically opens the iTunes store for "Game of War -
Fire Age"?

Annoying. I've not seen that before.

~~~
nfoz
Sounds like a good argument against the iOS user agent.

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tron_carter
This reminds me when I was playing Oblivion on Xbox 360 and there was a bug to
get a ton of money from a specific NPC. It completely ruined the game for me
by removing all motivations and rewards to participate in the economy through
looting, stealing, and selling.

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0ptical
Dear Rockstar,

Please do some additional programming and infrastructure work so I don't have
to exercise a few seconds of self control.

-Somebody who already bought and is enjoying your game.

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kayoone
Given the choice, i am pretty sure 99% will just take the money. We are
talking about mostly teenage guys here and most dont have your noble
ambitions.

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pearjuice
Has GTA changed this much that money became a real thing? Real as in used to
buy gear, finite amount and has an economy? What happened to memorizing game
pad combinations whenever you needed some quick cash for your escapades?

~~~
tehwebguy
It's GTA online, which is sort of like an MMO

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Dogamondo
A metaphor for life, it seems.

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Kiro
And this is why basic income is such a bad idea.

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buster
Or just don't be so obsessive with computer games and don't care so much what
is happening in some virtual world. That'd be my advise.

