
MainStreet – $10k to Leave Bay Area - jermaustin1
https://workonmainstreet.com/
======
beauzero
Atlanta for $ to cost of living/quality. Rural Alabama like Sylacauga
(metro/eletric company fiber to your home) for "work from home". Both my wife
and I work from home in rural Georgia (Carrollton)...$300k bought us 25 acres,
a refurbished 2500 square feet farm house, 6 stall horse barn, 1/2 acre pond,
and shop with concrete floor and electricity. There are options out there,
lots of them.

~~~
BoorishBears
My first thought about Rural Alabama is how much I'd hate that sociopolitical
environment (I'm black)

Granted I googled Sylacauga and the first line on their website is

>Sylacauga (syl-a-cau-ga) is a progressive community where all the pieces fit.

So they're aware of the image which is a pretty good sign...

But I'm not doing these cities/towns that are "progressive" oases in vast
deserts of backwards communities ever again.

At the end of the day, the people in backwards communities are still numerous.
They still end up dominating state-level politics.

Instead of embracing change and the wealth that not being a backwards
backwater can bring, they actively fight it and if anything become more
emboldened in trying to band together against the "common enemy"... that is
progressive people (read: non-white, non-straight and/or non-Christian).

In a more ideal world, the answer to these people would be exactly what
Sylacauga seems to be, forcing them to co-exist with people who are in the
21st century, but I now feel like the answer is to let these areas wear
themselves down. When the pie of wealth grows and these people are locked out
for their views, they'll eventually lose the power they had.

~~~
pm90
I somewhat relate to your view as a non-white POC. However, I don't think

> they'll eventually lose the power they had.

would do much to change the situation. Georgia, Virginia and Texas are states
that are being fundamentally changed because of the influx of progressives
from both rural areas and urban coasts. The fastest way to change seems to be
to move to these places and use the democratic process to introduce real
changes, and these folks will have no choice but to change their views or
retreat to more rural areas of their states (usually its the latter).

The other aspect is that a lot of the southern states do actually have
sizeable populations of African Americans...I really do hope that we don't
just ignore them as successive generations seem to have done....

~~~
theflyinghorse
> Georgia, Virginia and Texas are states that are being fundamentally changed
> because of the influx of progressives from both rural areas and urban
> coasts.

Why are progressives moving en mass so much that that are able to replace the
local population and fundamentally alter voting patterns? What is happening to
drive people out like that? I'm not an American for the record and likely am
missing parts of the context here.

~~~
tropo
They made their own states too expensive, by choice, and then couldn't live
with the result.

They are moving to affordable places that vote against taxes, regulations, and
government services. Oddly they continue to vote for the policy that caused
them to migrate, and so eventually they must migrate again.

------
blakesterz
I'm not sure if this is a real site or not... but let's assume it is, what's
the deal with "Stop waiting in line for brunch"? I get the commute and own
your own home things, these seem like BIG deals in life. Is standing in life
for brunch really the 3rd biggest problem with living in the Bay Area or is
this an inside joke or something like that? Everything I know about living
around there I've learned from HN and I don't think I've ever seen someone
complain or even joke about troubles at brunch.

~~~
JumpCrisscross
> _Is standing in life for brunch really the 3rd biggest problem with living
> in the Bay Area_

It's not a problem. More another manufactured nuisance of the kind San
Francisco seems to enjoy creating.

New Yorkers have brunch later, brunch boozier and--broadly speaking--brunch
with a reservation. San Franciscans (or at least my friends in San Francisco)
eat brunch at the crack of dawn at establishments that prefer lines out the
door to taking reservations. (They may claim to take "reservations" at the
door. Those aren't reservations. They're names on a wait list. Lots of
waiting.)

It's a cultural factor loosely related to (a) recent population and affluence
increases outstripping a locale's (b) ability to build new businesses in the
midst of (c) a greater value placed on exclusivity than time. (It's also
present in Brooklyn and parts of Los Angeles.)

~~~
Reason077
Having a line out the door also serves as a sort of free advertising for the
restaurant. If people are willing to line up and wait for their brunch, it
must be good, right?

~~~
muststopmyths
Actually, I appreciate the places that don't take reservations for brunch. The
number of prospective patrons is wildly out of proportion to the number of
really good brunch spots. If they took reservations, you wouldn't be able to
get in for a month to a place like Plow.

Instead, I can grab a coffee (or mimosa) while I stand outside chatting with
my friends or wander around the neighborhood.

If you want convenience, there are plenty of places that take reservations or
can take walk-ins immediately. Some of them are pretty damn good too.

~~~
arcticbull
And there's always the "hidden gems" like Wayfare Tavern that only started
doing brunch recently, so no line-ups yet.

------
gwbas1c
I got a laugh out of the picture of the house; a stereotypical Eichler.

([https://www.realtor.com/advice/buy/what-are-eichler-
homes/](https://www.realtor.com/advice/buy/what-are-eichler-homes/))

Eichlers are very common in Palo Alto, but not so common throughout the rest
of the US.

(Edit: And yes, I left the Bay Area, and bought what most people living in the
Bay Area would consider a mansion, in a high-cost-of-living state. I paid less
then my Bay Area rent for a 1-bedroom with a loft.)

~~~
i_am_nomad
Thanks, I never knew there was a name for this, though I've seen this kind of
house all through the Peninsula - there are also a lot of them in the hills
west of San Mateo. And, now that I think of it, Erlich Bachmann's house is
one.

~~~
0xEFF
Likely intentional because Steve Jobs grew up in a similar home.

[https://www.eichlernetwork.com/article/jobs-likeler-no-
eichl...](https://www.eichlernetwork.com/article/jobs-likeler-no-eichler)

~~~
sharkmerry
The link's headline that you posted says

"For the record: Steve Jobs wasn’t raised in an Eichler—but partner Steve
Wozniak was."

~~~
0xEFF
The article is entirely about Steve Jobs growing up in a home very similar to,
but not technically, an Eichler.

------
kfk
The idea is sound. There are a lot of amazing places in Italy where I am from.
Some of these towns sell houses for few thousands. Just think about it. No
traffic. No over-crowded restaurants. Your own property. Sun. Sea side.

I think this is more an issue of community. Of course if you are the only
remote worker in a place with aging population is not fun. But if some start
up would be able to build a community of remote workers in a specific
location, wouldn't that make a lot of sense? Also once you have a bunch of
highly skilled people in a specific location it gets easier for companies to
hire there.

~~~
RomanPushkin
> Some of these towns sell houses for few thousands

Name of the place or it didn't happen :)

~~~
kfk
Here you go: [https://casea1euro.it/case-a-1-euro-in-
sardegna-a-15-minuti-...](https://casea1euro.it/case-a-1-euro-in-
sardegna-a-15-minuti-dal-mare-ecco-come-fare-per-averle/)

You buy the house for 1 euro but then you have to fix it. So I guess you have
to invest few thousands.

~~~
marcinzm
I don’t know about Italy but in the US fixing up an old house in bad condition
can be extremely expensive and time consuming. Cheaper to buy empty land and
build a new one.

~~~
dsfyu404ed
A significant portion of homeowners do a significant portion of the work
themselves. I wouldn't say it's expected that you'll DIY everything but
someone buying a house that needs substantial work without the intention of
doing at least some of it themselves would certainly raise eyebrows.

~~~
marcinzm
Which is why I said time consuming. Since time is finite you also can't simply
discount it versus spending money and consider it a net savings.

~~~
dsfyu404ed
It's a massive net savings for most people because the opportunity cost of
free time is very low. Very few people are forgoing income by spending their
free time on home improvement versus other things.

You're making the same error about opportunity cost as the classic "it's not
worth Bill Gates' time to pick up a $100 bill" fallacy.

~~~
Mountain_Skies
Plus if you're a knowledge worker it can help to engage in physical activities
and even mental ones that exercise your mind in different ways than your job
does. Seymour Cray famously used dig under his backyard when he was stuck on
design problems for his supercomputers. He claimed elves from the nearby
forest (the destination of the tunnel he was digging) came into his study and
solved his problems while he was out digging the tunnel. He considered the
digging to be an essential part of his design process.

------
i_am_nomad
"To collect the $10,000, you’ll need to become a MainStreet Member and work
out of one of our MainStreet offices for at least 12 months."

This is raising red flags, somehow.

~~~
harikb
I think they meant to write work at of one of our _MainStreet companies_ (who
hired you) for at least 12 months. This might be a _recruiter_ \+ _wework_
deal

------
mjlee
From the contact details:

105 North 1st Street #28, San Jose, CA 95113

I'm certainly not an expert, but Wikipedia claims that's in the Bay Area...

Are they paying their own team to quit?

~~~
jweir
I was surprised to see that too. They aren’t walking the walk.

~~~
steveklabnik
Extra cynicism: by getting others to leave, they can stay and it gets better
for them.

~~~
jrockway
If I owned a house in the bay area, I would be asking anyone and everyone to
move there. More money for me!

Rent in downtown Mountain View is higher than Manhattan.

------
nkrisc
> To celebrate our company’s launch, we’re passing along our fees back to you
> in the form of a $10,000 check. To collect the $10,000, you’ll need to
> become a MainStreet Member and work out of one of our MainStreet offices for
> at least 12 months.

But what is a "MainStreet Member" and how does one become one? What/where are
"MainStreet offices"? So is it remote or not? You're working remotely for a
customer out of one of their offices? Is one an employee of MainStreet and
contracting with their customers? What happens when I give them my email
address? Their site raises more questions than it answers.

~~~
yegle
So this requires 12 months commitment... Isn't this $10k a form of sign up
bonus that's widely available from many Bay area companies?

~~~
nkrisc
On the surface, seems so. But then there's the other strange requirements they
don't really explain.

------
realbarack
I'm glad to see innovation in this space. I work remotely as an ML engineer in
a "Main Street"-ish city (not really, but it's a middle-class city with a
reasonably affordable COL that's part of a large MSA).

Remote work has generally delivered on all its promised benefits for me. I
make much more money than I would if I got a job in the city where I live, and
my apartment is much nicer than what I could afford if I still lived in the
Bay area. I had hoped to move somewhere with great access to the outdoors
(this is what initially made me interested in remote work), but ultimately
ended up moving for relationship reasons and had to give up the outdoor mecca
dream for the time being.

Now, I'm thinking of going back to office life. Since taking the remote plunge
I've struggled with loneliness and anxiety about career stasis, and haven't
been able to find a critical mass of educated, ambitious, like-minded friends
where I now live.

There's a tremendous opportunity for whoever can make it easier to build and
find in-person communities of ambitious remote/satellite workers. Offices and
cities are blunt instruments for matching people on ambition and
education/intelligence. If it were easier to find and integrate into smaller
(but equally ambitious) hubs, it would make remote work a more attractive
option for many more people.

Feel free to get in touch if you'd like to speak more on this subject.

------
jrochkind1
Weird. The splash page says:

> help you find a job you love in a city you can afford

But the "About", "For Companies" and "How it works" pages are pretty focused
on remote work:

> Companies are more ready than ever to utilize distributed workforces, and
> this is creating opportunities for workers everywhere to be part of the
> digital economy... MainStreet provides the community, communication, and
> career tools you need to be happy and successful as a remote employee.

> Interested in expanding your remote workforce? ...All our candidates have
> been evaluated for remote-readiness so they can hit the ground running from
> day one.

> The companies we work with pay us to help successfully recruit and retain
> remote talent.

Sounds like it's REALLY about setting up remote work, which is not what the
home page implies, right?

Doesn't make a hell of a lot of sense to me. Ah right, the "About" page leads
with:

> We are three former Googlers who are on a mission to help create jobs in
> rural and suburban cities around America.

OK, it's just the usual engineer-entrepeneurs trying to "get rich by doing
good," with a plan that may or may not make sense either on the business or
the pro-social end.

I suppose the _employer 's_ interest in paying them to help recruit and
coordinate remote workers is... paying them less then they'd have to in the
bay area? (plus less overhead compared to on-premises in the bay area, office
rent etc).

~~~
TheMagicHorsey
I think its crystal clear.

They are making remote work easy for employees and employers, which enables
you to work from cities other than coastal ones.

Is that really such a hard thing to understand? I Think most people connect
the dots. It doesn't need a mini blog post to explain.

~~~
nkrisc
Sure. But what's not clear is how, especially you read further about "Main
Street offices" and "MainStreet member." It's not clear if they're just
remote-focused recruiting agency or something else.

~~~
TheMagicHorsey
I'll agree with you there. They are incredibly opaque about what, where, how
much, etc.

I came away thinking ... hmmm I'm interested in remote work. I'm really
interested in convincing my current employer to use a program like this.

BUT, I'm not going to take the trouble to email people because I'm an
engineer, and I'd prefer to just send a link to HR.

But this link has no information. So meh.

------
et2o
So it looks like you have to join one of their "Main Street Communities" and
work remotely from there for 1 year, but I can't find a listing of the
community locations anywhere. Do they not exist yet? What gives?

Terms: [https://workonmainstreet.com/incentive-
terms](https://workonmainstreet.com/incentive-terms)

~~~
flowersjeff
So...basically good luck ever collecting on that 10k.

------
dmode
Let’s be honest, $10k is chump change for engineers pulling $400k. If you want
people to move, how about offer $400k ?

~~~
themagician
I doubt there are more than a few hundred engineers with that salary in the
entire Bay Area and they aren’t the ones who complain about cost of living.

This is the software engineer making $80,000 a year who tries to live alone
and has to spend half their paycheck on a studio.

~~~
jrockway
That is quite false. When I worked at Google, my W2 income was about $270k
every year, as a nobody senior engineer. I worked with multiple people that
made at least $600k a year. There are thousands of engineers at Google making
that kind of money, and no doubt Uber/Lyft/Facebook/Apple/Netflix/Microsoft
are paying similar salaries.

This was not the Bay Area, rather New York, but the salaries are about the
same in both areas.

The people that own homes in the Bay Area are Googlers that married each
other. That is some good income. Enough for a shed in someone's backyard
anyway!

------
tempsy
It's really hard to beat living and working in San Francisco. Having lived
here a few years I find costs highly overstated _for single people_.

e.g. some costs:

Studio in Lower Haight (water + trash included): $2100/month Utilities: $50
Monthly Muni: $81

Groceries are no more expensive than anywhere else. Eating out is similar vs
other cities I've been to, and if anything the quality of the food is better
here at the mid price range.

If I lived in a smaller or mid-sized city there's a good chance I would have
to get a car, so any savings in terms of rent would just go to owning and
maintaining a car.

~~~
mdszy
I live in a medium sized city in Wisconsin (~100k population) and my costs
are:

\- $850 for rent for a 2 bedroom 1200sqft apartment

\- ~$70 for utilities (i have free heat so it's less in the winter and more in
the summer)

and if i still had the car i previously had, my only expense would be gas
(~$100/mo) and the minor maintenance it needed, which was less than $1000/yr
(i tracked everything each year i had it). I bought a newer car recently and
am financing it. I pay $350/mo on it and gas is closer to $200/mo for it but
that's still well within the over $1000 difference in living costs.

I think you vastly understate just how insane $2100/mo for rent is, and
overstate how much it costs to own a car. If $1k a month in savings isn't
enough to own/maintain a car and that's a problem for you, you need a car that
doesn't cost over $1k a month to own.

~~~
realbarack
Paying an extra $1.5k per month on rent isn't insane when it gets you $50 or
$100k additional annual salary.

~~~
danielschonfeld
Generally speaking true, but what happens when you deduct state taxes, in a
place like either California or New York. Suddenly the budget seems just about
right and nothing too extravagant to write home about

~~~
0xffff2
What happens is you still come out way ahead. I'd dearly love to get out of
the bay area, but even as a relatively low paid government contractor it's
very hard to find an interesting job elsewhere that leaves more money in my
pocket.

~~~
souprock
You may come out way ahead if non-local expenses are a large portion of your
budget. Everybody else loses.

I'm out of the bay area, at a government contractor, with an interesting job.
I can afford a huge family, currently with 14 people in the household
supported on one income. Life is just easier where the houses are affordable.

I don't know what you'd consider an interesting job or what you'd qualify for,
but how seriously have you looked? People can have a bias that stops them: if
you allow that the interesting jobs exist, then you have to seriously consider
them and ultimately act by moving, but that is a lot to think about and a lot
of bother, so therefore there aren't any interesting jobs elsewhere.

------
markbnj
The main reason why we remain in a high cost area (North-central NJ) is
opportunities. Yeah I work remotely now and have for awhile, and I doubt I
will leave my current company any time soon... but things change, and I would
hate to relocate to an idyllic rural paradise (I grew up in very small towns),
lose this job and be unable to find another remote gig. At least in the NYC
area I know there is going to be _something_ available within commute distance
if I have to do that again.

------
thomascgalvin
I moved to Boston about 18 months ago, and while it's not as crazy out here as
it is in the Bay, I really don't think I want to spend the next ten years with
a 3 hour daily commute, living in a house that costs four times as much, for
half the square footage, as the one I had in rural New York.

~~~
sfkdjf9j3j
A 1.5 hour commute is pretty unusual, how did you end up in that situation?

------
sct202
Are recruiting fees that high that they are able to pay their own staff and
the recruits $10k (plus the "member" benefits) and make money?

~~~
auspex
Usually 30% of the first year salary. Hire a $150k dev the recruiter gets $50k

------
flowersjeff
I just hope that if you're thinking about a move, read comments from folks
that either grew up in the area being considered and/or those that moved back
from.

There are very real reasons why people move into the Bay Area - and put up
with all the "problems". This is coming from a person that grew up in the
South and would rather not move back.

------
tootie
At the risk of sounding overly woke, houses and cars are terrible for the
climate. Also, there's a reason that big businesses and highly-educated
professionals gravitate towards. More fluid labor and job markets. I'd think a
better goal here would be build up technology industries in smaller cities.

~~~
deadbunny
Houses are terrible for the climate?

~~~
helen___keller
sprawling suburbs that necessitate driving everywhere are terrible for the
climate

Houses themselves aren't great for the climate (there's CO2 emission in
materials productions, heavy machinery operation, etc), but they're necessary
for human survival so it's hard to claim we have an alternative

~~~
dublinben
>it's hard to claim we have an alternative

The alternative is apartments, which use roughly half as much energy as
single-family houses.

[https://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=11731](https://www.eia.gov/todayinenergy/detail.php?id=11731)

~~~
helen___keller
Oh sure, I was counting that as "house" but you're correct that denser housing
is absolutely more environmentally friendly

------
JDiculous
As a remote worker who left a high cost of living city (NYC) myself, I'm all
in favor of promoting remote work, but I don't see the value add in me adding
my email there. What exactly do I get? Job listings? The site doesn't really
make it clear.

I guess every startup these days starts off with a fancy landing page who's
goal is to get you to input your email, which they then use to gauge interest
and decide whether or not to actually build out the product. Doesn't really
tempt me to want to sign up.

Also I'm all in favor of promoting underdeveloped communities in America, but
my #1 hesitation would be boredom. America seems extremely rural outside of
the big cities and you need a car to do anything, and I'd imagine there isn't
much of a sense of community. I grew up in the suburbs of Washington D.C. and
even that I found very boring. I'd love to be proven wrong, but in any case
that's why I choose to work remotely from outside the U.S.

------
333c
I do think it's funny that the footer lists an address in San Jose.

It's also unclear from the "how it works" page whether it's actually required
that participants initially reside in the Bay Area to be eligible for the
program.

~~~
readyp1
Yeah, they should definitely clarify that on the "how it works" page. However,
they do state residency as a requirement in section 4(a) here:
[https://workonmainstreet.com/incentive-
terms](https://workonmainstreet.com/incentive-terms)

------
jefftk
More details seem to be in [https://workonmainstreet.com/how-it-
works](https://workonmainstreet.com/how-it-works)

------
guitarsteve
Fine print here [https://workonmainstreet.com/incentive-
terms](https://workonmainstreet.com/incentive-terms)

------
usaar333
Who is this targeting? An engineer already saves far more than this moving to
a lower income tax state with lower COL (e.g. Washington, Nevada, Texas).

~~~
jiveturkey
It's targetting people that don't want to move.

"How it Works":

> A free remote-first office, designed specifically for the needs of remote
> workers

So what it is, is a we-work like space aggregator, positioning themselves
somewhat above the value chain of just empty space.

------
bryanh
We (Zapier) did this a few years back, its been really cool:
[https://zapier.com/blog/move-away-from-sf-get-remote-
job/](https://zapier.com/blog/move-away-from-sf-get-remote-job/)

I hope it continues to catch on! Major metros certainly have a lot to offer,
but minor metros or rural America does too -- it's a little odd that all the
online "tech" jobs land in the former. If you have a decent internet
connection, you can do your work from anywhere.

------
sgarrity
Where does the money come from?

~~~
Finnucane
It is not entirely clear from the website, but it basically seems to be a kind
of employment agency--they set you up with a workspace, and get you jobs with
their paying corporate clients. So the deal they're offering is to give you a
cut of the fee in exchange for moving, because they need to have workers to
sell before they can make any money.

Also a little odd is that they want to bring jobs to non-urban areas, but
they're selling themselves as an escape for people in expensive urban areas,
rather than an opportunity for people in non-urban areas who need jobs. And it
also leaves aside less expensive urban areas that need jobs.

