
Fitbit Acquires Coin - daddy_drank
http://www.engadget.com/2016/05/18/fitbit-buys-coin/
======
madelinecameron
I never really understood Coin.

It is basically all the negatives of having one electronic payment method (If
you lose it, you have no money unless you have cash on hand or can somehow get
money out of the bank... if your bank even has a physical branch nearby) with
all the negatives of having multiple credit cards (It is a lot more attractive
to thieves / skimmers)

With a whole bunch of new negatives like, if you lose your Coin, that means
someone has access to _all_ your cards and even if you don't lose it, you are
essentially handing people your entire wallet when you use it. Skimmers
probably _love_ this thing. Oh, and not to mention: You can't use it online.
So all those _pesky_ credit cards; yeah, make sure to keep those around
because you still need them.

It just didn't make any sense to me. Pay $100 for no real upsides and a lot of
really terrifying downsides.

~~~
smellf
It's moot because the product is now dead, but if I understood Coin correctly,
all of your criticisms are invalid.

> If you lose it, you have no money unless you have cash on hand or can
> somehow get money out of the bank

You keep the actual cards at home. So if you lose your Coin, you just go back
to your separate cards.

> It is a lot more attractive to thieves / skimmers

The Coin was secured through your phone's passcode/biometrics/pattern, so yeah
if they broke that you'd be boned. The same as with GWallet/iPay. A
sophisticated mugger could do it I guess.

> if you lose your Coin, that means someone has access to all your cards

Not without the phone.

> you are essentially handing people your entire wallet

No, before you hand it to a waiter or whatever you lock it into the card you
want to use.

~~~
koolba
>> It is a lot more attractive to thieves / skimmers

>>The Coin was secured through your phone's passcode/biometrics/pattern, so
yeah if they broke that you'd be boned. The same as with GWallet/iPay. A
sophisticated mugger could do it I guess.

Mugger A: " _Give me the wallet!_ "

(Hands over wallet)

Mugger A: " _Now unlock your phone and give it to me!_ "

(Unlocks phone and hands it over)

Mugger B: " _Better chop off his thumb too ... might need it to unlock some
apps!_ "

(Gulps)

~~~
TeMPOraL
Holy shit, you've just convinced me to reconsider having fingerprint unlocking
active on my phone...

~~~
DonHopkins
That's why I use my toe.

~~~
thomasfoster96
Same.

Also, my iPhone 5s seems to read my toeprint better than my fingerprint.

~~~
TeMPOraL
You guys are joking, right? _Right_?

~~~
thomasfoster96
I did it as a joke at first but it actually works quite well.

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ndaiger
The promise of Coin is that you don't have to carry anything else. It is a
fantastic idea.

However, unless it worked at least 95% of the time, it's useless, because you
have to carry at least one backup card.

My experience with the Coin 2.0 is that it worked about 20% of the time and
was very, very frustrating in every respect. It went in a drawer after a week.

~~~
eterm
I don't understand coin.

I have a debit card, I don't need to carry anything else.

It does contactless payments, chip + pin payments, ATM widthdrawls, verifies
who I am at the bank and has my account details on it.

What else could I want, a credit card for things which belong more on credit?
OK so now I have 2 cards, but really beyond that what else is there?

No amount of mobile hardware / phone apps are going to replace 2 cards both of
which fit easily in a wallet and don't require charging, don't wear out for 5+
years (by which time the bank has replaced it free of charge), and I don't
need to take out of my pocket for any other reason (so I'm not likely to lose
it or leave it elsewhere).

~~~
jodah
> I have a debit card, I don't need to carry anything else.

If your card hasn't been stolen (via a hacked merchant) and your account wiped
out yet, consider yourself lucky. You might want to carry a credit card as
your primary instead. When (and I do mean when) it is stolen, at least it's
only credit instead of your bank account balance that is impacted (and which
can takes weeks or more to get back).

~~~
bduerst
Have you actually ever had a card stolen or skimmed?

It's not as bad an experience as you're making it out to be. My credit union
handled everything the last time I was skimmed, including giving me the money
back and overnighting a new card.

~~~
antsar
There's a difference between credit and debit here.

Stolen credit card = bank is missing money; bank is incentivized to retrieve
money.

Stolen debit card = _you_ are missing money; bank _may_ choose to help
somehow.

~~~
bduerst
They would need to know your pin code too (for authorizing debit transactions)
right?

For the record it was my debit card that was skimmed.

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gherkin0
Well, that's just great. I was an original backer and got a Coin 1.0. They
kept saying they'd ship me a Coin 2.0 due to the problems with the 1.0, but I
never got it. Now it appears all mention of that has been scrubbed from their
website.

It is kind of humorous that their website now as a big "Sold Out" banner right
at the top next to this announcement.

~~~
jes5199
I also got a Coin 1.0, but by the time it arrived I couldn't remember why I
wanted it. I literally never tried it.

~~~
gherkin0
I just use mine for loyalty cards and magstripe gift cards (so they don't
collect dust because I don't want a fat wallet). Might be worth a try if you
haven't tried it for anything.

------
messick
I was an early backer of Coin, but by the time it actually shipped to me,
years late, Apple Pay had been out for months. My Coin box went unopened into
the recycling bin. And this was before I read reviews saying it only worked 1
in 5 times.

~~~
gherkin0
Honestly, I just used mine for gift/loyalty cards. Never loaded a real credit
card to it.

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DaiPlusPlus
Does Coin have a future business model given the introduction of EMV? Did
Fitbit just waste money buying them?

~~~
Sidnicious
Coin 2.0 supports it via NFC (through agreements with banks, similar to Apple
Pay, AFAIK). That's what Fitbit would want.

~~~
abalone
Coin 2.0 does not support EMV. They used slippery marketingspeak to dance
around the subject (saying NFC enables "EMV payment standards") but the bottom
line is your chip card would only work with Coin by reverting to traditional
static magnetic stripe data.

~~~
Sidnicious
Could you elaborate on this? Apple Pay et. al are "contactless EMV", and Coin
very explicitly says that they support it for some banks:

[https://support.onlycoin.com/hc/en-
us/articles/207353218-Wha...](https://support.onlycoin.com/hc/en-
us/articles/207353218-What-is-EMV-and-NFC-)

~~~
abalone
No, they don't say that on the page you linked.

~~~
Sidnicious
> _Coin 2.0 is equipped with contactless NFC technology that increases
> merchant compatibility and allows users to transact using EMV payment
> standards._

~~~
abalone
That is what I referred to as "slippery marketingspeak". It makes no mention
of bank support.

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jlas
Is there any mention of how much the deal was worth?

Seems like mostly an acquihire, does Coin even have a steady revenue stream?

~~~
brlewis
Nothing about how much the deal was worth. Regarding acquihire, "the
acquisition accelerates Fitbit’s ability to develop an active NFC payment
solution that could be embedded into future Fitbit devices, broadening its
smart capabilities. The acquisition excludes smart payment products, such as
Coin 2.0."

[https://investor.fitbit.com/press/press-releases/press-
relea...](https://investor.fitbit.com/press/press-releases/press-release-
details/2016/Fitbit-Inc-Acquires-Wearable-Payments-Assets-From-Financial-
Technology-Company-Coin/default.aspx)

~~~
valarauca1
Sounds like an acquihire + hardware tech. Coin has a decent NFC lower power
transmitter and I'd guess some smart embedded developers.

I'm also guess getting NFC transmitter though FCA inspection/compliance isn't
cheap nor easy.

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alexeckermann
I remember in September 2014 when Apple announced Apple Pay watching the
keynote live on TV. I was visiting San Francisco at the time, staying in SoMa,
and out the window adjacent I had a clear view of the Coin office. To be a fly
on the wall during that time…

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antirez
I don't see much a fit for payment features in fitbit products. They should
probability focus on iterating the hardware and experience regarding the
"sport watch" idea. Their strength is also the simplicity of the product.

EDIT: interesting examples provided in the replies, thanks. To buy things
while running without having anything with you is a good thing, also if this
technology allows to, like, register in a gym or alike and enter without any
other token.

~~~
VLM
I'm not saying I want this, but it would be possible:

Imagine your access card for the gym doesn't provide free access to
everything, but every time you enter the sauna it bills you one dollar, or
physically walking into a class bills you the individual class tuition.
Unlocking the racquetball court door costs three dollars. Then after your
workout you walk up to the vending machine to get your bottled tapwater or
fancy water or whatever and pay with your gym access card. Inevitably there
are not enough treadmills for peak times, so something is set up today like
signup sheets and time use limits, but crazy as it sounds you could pay per
use or bid to reserve, high bid on treadmill #7 from 6:00 to 6:30 tonight is
two dollars, wave your magic token thingy here to give you the new high bid at
three dollars. Gamify things such that every 100 miles on the treadmill means
a free run next time. Insert anecdote of people hooking up their fitbit to a
cordless drill to get 100 miles per day so as to get free treadmill time.

~~~
jrockway
Why do you need to buy a company to do this? This sounds like the kind of
thing one person working alone could bring to the market, modulo sales.

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Johnie
This smells more like an aquihire. FitBit doesn't need any of Coin's IP to
provide payment functionality in their wearables.

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coldskull
so only other player left here is swypcard

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funwithjustin
"Acquires."

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untilHellbanned
jump the shark startup edition

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PaulHoule
Ouch.

Coin was a company that stood by it's products, Fitbit is the kind of outfit
that will find any lame excuse to not issue you an RMA.

~~~
taylorwc
Interesting. I've had a Fitbit since 2012 (the Ultra) and have had almost
uniformly positive experiences with customer service.

~~~
iamdave
Echoed. Bought a Fitbit Charge a few years ago, band started separating, I
_tweeted_ them and got a response within 20 minutes, and a new Fitbit Charge
about 8 days later. I've since upgraded to the Charge HR.

