
Exposure to the bacteria in soil can be good for mental health - tenkabuto
https://qz.com/993258/dirt-has-a-microbiome-and-it-may-double-as-an-antidepressant/
======
bmelton
The real takeaway for me as a parent here is that the more and more we prevent
our kids from being actual kids, the more subtleties we might be depriving
them of.

Dating myself a little, but growing up as a kid in Virginia, 'outside' play
was a mainstay. We went out into the woods, we built tree forts, we dug holes,
we made tire swings. Nowadays, the parents of my children's friends are
completely unwilling to let their kids engage in such behavior, whether
because it's potentially dangerous (it is), or dirty (that too), the kids are
expected to meet up in a sanitized location, play in a playroom, or possibly
on a playground with rubber mulch as the surface material, and seldom are kids
allowed or expected to just go play.

Meanwhile, we've got more and more kids being prescribed more and more things,
and while I honestly haven't the slightest clue whether to attribute it to the
lack of outdoor play or the miracles of modern medicine, it seems possibly
correlated.

~~~
agumonkey
It's a weird situation to be an adult. You got cautious along the years (for
good or bad reasons) and somehow forgot what you did. When I remember all the
crazy things we did as 5yo .. climbing trees out of the blue, alone, no
supervision, no phones. We're all alive and well.

~~~
MikeTheGreat
True, we're all alive and well.

Simultaneously,

that's the definition of survivorship bias / selection bias right there :)

~~~
24gttghh
I hate to say it but...what about Natural Selection bias?

------
contingencies
I spent half of this week researching industrial food processing methodologies
and the cleanliness you can get to is obviously unhealthy. It's like humans
look at biology and see 10 major pathogens and over-optimize for that chunk of
biology what-ifs they better understand due to macro effect. They then shut
their eyes and bury their heads in the ... chemically clean and white fluffy
pillow, eat a salad bathed in chlorine, sit inside in air conditioning, and
wonder why they get ill. Let them eat dirt.

~~~
emmab
> sit inside in air conditioning

What's wrong with air conditioning?

~~~
j_s
There are definitely positives and negatives. This may have been mentioned in
part due to this recent discussion:

The far-reaching effects of air conditioning |
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14485962](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14485962)

------
sdiupIGPWEfh
I'd rather avoid much of the residential dirt on the eastern coast of the US,
especially in older towns, due the accumulation of decades, if not centuries,
of lead paint in the soil. In these parts, unless you've had it tested or
you're living in a newer home with virgin soil, I'd think twice before letting
the kids dig around too much. Lead exposure will negate any positive
psychological effects of the dirt microbiome rather quickly.

~~~
rconti
Maybe don't let them dig around the foundation of a house with old paint on
it... but just general dirt in the environment seems really unlikely to
contain much lead. Not speaking from experience here, just speculating...

~~~
sdiupIGPWEfh
Which is fine and all if you're acutely aware of the risk, but most
residential dirt readily available for digging in happens to be in the garden
beds around houses and garages, right were flaking paint has been
accumulating. The dirt people are likely digging in, if they're in an older
community, isn't just any old random dirt. Also, most parents I've known
aren't too keen on holes in the middle of the yard, away from the house.

[https://www.epa.gov/lead/protect-your-family-exposures-
lead#...](https://www.epa.gov/lead/protect-your-family-exposures-lead#soil)

Rather than take my word for it, there are plenty of federal, state, and
county resources which can give you some idea of the likely lead levels to be
found in your area and extrapolate from there. I'm not in the safest area
myself, but I hope you find it's not something you yourself have to worry
about.

------
amelius
I can feel a new startup coming up, selling packaged soil dirt on a
subscription basis.

~~~
gadders
My first thought was bullies making kids eat dirt and shouting "It's good for
your mental health!"

------
pc2g4d
In the article they cite as evidence for serotonin deficiency's depressogenic
effects:

"Overall, this evidence suggests that impairing serotonin function can cause
clinical depression in some circumstances, but is neither necessary nor
sufficient."

From Wikipedia[1]:

Since the 1990s, research has uncovered multiple limitations of the monoamine
hypothesis, and its inadequacy has been criticized within the psychiatric
community.[44] For one thing, serotonin system dysfunction cannot be the sole
cause of depression; antidepressants usually increase synaptic serotonin very
quickly, but it often takes at least two to four weeks before mood improves
significantly. One possible explanation for this lag is that the
neurotransmitter activity enhancement is the result of auto receptor
desensitization rather which can take weeks.[45] Intensive investigation has
failed to find convincing evidence of a primary dysfunction of a specific
monoamine system in patients with major depressive disorders. The
antidepressants that do not act through the monoamine system, such as
tianeptine and opipramol, have been known for a long time. There has also been
inconsistency with regards to serum 5-HIAA levels, a metabolite of
serotonin.[46] Experiments with pharmacological agents that cause depletion of
monoamines have shown that this depletion does not cause depression in healthy
people.[47][48] Another problem that presents is that drugs that deplete
monoamines may actually have antidepressants properties. Furthermore, some
have argued that depression may be marked by a hyperseretonergic state[49]
Already limited, the monoamine hypothesis has been further oversimplified when
presented to the general public.[50]

1:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biology_of_depression](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biology_of_depression)

------
jerkstate
Finally, scientific proof that wandering barefoot is good for the soul.

~~~
aaronblohowiak
And good for the Hookworm

~~~
misja111
Actually the hookworm is also good for us, it seems to reduce some allergic
responses!

See also:
[http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/244238.php](http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/244238.php)

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c3534l
This sounds like preliminary research spun into health recommendations that
are unjustified and possibly dangerous. What else is new.

~~~
cpncrunch
Well in this case the preliminary science looks plausible. In the 10 years
since this preliminary trial nobody has bothered doing a placebo controlled
trial of this bacteria for depression, so it's probably reasonable to spin it
a bit.

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killjoywashere
Lovely, another AFB I have to memorize. Damnit!

~~~
eicossa
AFB ?

~~~
pseud0r
I think he's referring to Armed Forces Bikers, a UK-based motorcycle charity
to assist former members of the armed forces.

~~~
killjoywashere
Nice, I'll look them up :)

But, no, AFB = Acid Fast Bacillus.

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djr96
Think I'll stick with the pills...

~~~
andai
Why, though? (Unless, by any chance, you mean pills for enhancing gut flora?
:)

