
A small town that kept Walmart out now faces Amazon - artsandsci
https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2018/03/amazon-local-retail/554681/?single_page=true
======
dugmartin
I live 10 miles from the town featured in this article and its publication has
caused quite a few folks I know around here to renew their effort to buy
local. To me though the frustrating thing is this line in the article:

> I twice stopped by Wilson’s, the department store, to try to meet the
> manager, and saw no shoppers inside the store the entire time I was there.
> (Wilson’s did not respond to multiple interview requests for this story.)

With a switch in marketing Wilson's could become a destination store as going
in feels truly like going back in time. It's a real department store with
separate registers in each department staffed by folks who know about what
they are selling. Wilson's still puts huge full page ads in the local paper
but I've never seen a single online or social marketing message from them.
If/when they go out of business it is going to put a huge hole in the fabric
of downtown Greenfield.

~~~
jseliger
_its publication has caused quite a few folks I know around here to renew
their effort to buy local_

"Buying local" is the kind of thing everyone is in favor of and no one
actually does. Well, okay, not "no one," but far fewer than favor it in
theory. Like "giving up Facebook," "switching to Linux" and "always using a
condom," the number of people who make the claim in order to signal something
about themselves is much smaller than the number actually engaging a behavior.

See further Seth Stephens-Davidowitz, _Everybody Lies: Big Data, New Data, and
What the Internet Can Tell Us About Who We Really Are_ (
[https://www.amazon.com/Everybody-Lies-Internet-About-
Really/...](https://www.amazon.com/Everybody-Lies-Internet-About-
Really/dp/0062390856?ie=UTF8&tag=thstsst-20&linkCode=as2&camp=1789&creative=390957)
).

~~~
ganeshkrishnan
>"switching to Linux"

Been using Ubuntu for close to 5 years now. I tried, I really tried to love it
but the drivers are horribly outdated. Nvidia graphics broke everything in my
Dell 9560. Even a fresh install of Ubuntu LTS is practically unusable. Each
keystroke takes around 3 to 7 seconds to register. The screen lag is horrible.
I tried fresh install and still everything looks pathetic compared to OSX or
even Windows 10.

After Windows 10 got native Ubuntu 16, I just moved to it and though I have to
run Linux startup services manually I am pretty satisfied with it.

We can't fight the inevitable just because of personal vendetta. Walmart was a
small time store once. They got big because of the ease of use. Same with
Amazon. To me it's just stupid to go out of the way to "buy local" when it's a
losing game.

~~~
psyc
I’ve also earnestly tried switching to Linux many times, over 15 years. My
most recent attempt was just a month ago, after becoming infuriated by Windows
Update.

It’s not terrible, but taking all of my daily work into account, it’s still
not feasible on the whole. And the problems are about the same as always.
Hardware compatibility, arduous installations and config (yak shaving), and
stuff just not working. And the pervasive pattern, inherited from open source
itself, that things have recursive dependencies, each involving their own
incredible journey of configuration and workarounds. Always the journey, never
the destination of getting work done. In the end, I clean installed Windows,
set it up to minimize annoyance, and got on with work.

I feel that, much like Blender, Linux requires a certain mindset. I suspect
that mindset resembles either masochism or Stockholm Syndrome. I still have no
complaints about MacOS.

~~~
secabeen
Linux runs fine on desktop. I haven't had a significant issue in years on
hardware that has the benefit of reliable wall power.

~~~
psyc
That’s good to know. It’s true my last attempt was on a low end laptop. My
qualms about my daily applications remain. I’m sure I’ll keep trying.

~~~
SlowBro
Linux SysAdmin here with 20 years’ experience: I love it on the server and
hate it on the desktop. Always use the right tool for the job.

But that’s a good analogy for this article. UNIX-like devices did eventually
dominate the world, just not in the form factor we were expecting. I’m writing
this on my pocketable UNIX device. You’ve probably heard of it; it’s called an
iPhone. If one adds up all the devices in the world, Microsoft only owns a
fraction of all of the operating systems installed.[1] Like the store keepers
in this article, Microsoft failed to adapt but continued to rely on an
increasingly failing business model (desktops). There will still be a place
for Windows in 20 years but it will be a niche product like macOS is today.
Unless they quickly adapt.

I certainly prefer to Amazon something than go to a store. This story is one
of struggling to protect a failing business model. Were I one of those
business owners I would spend all of my (increasingly) free time learning to
either sell online or tweak my service so that it’s so compelling that people
would willingly dress, drive out, risk crowds, and pay more. I would get
online (hah!) and find the world’s best retailers, find out what they’re
doing, and emulate their success.

There are still buggy whip manufacturers[2] but they learned what was needed
to adapt. Adapt or get run over.

[1]
[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_share_of_operating_sys...](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_share_of_operating_systems#)

[2] [https://www.uswhip.com/product/buggy-
whips/](https://www.uswhip.com/product/buggy-whips/)

~~~
ganeshkrishnan
> I love it on the server and hate it on the desktop

It's an equal nightmare to develop on windows and deploy on Linux. But it's
true. I have Linux systems running for couple of years with no downtime at
all.

~~~
SlowBro
Not even for kernel updates?

~~~
ganeshkrishnan
Yes it requires an restart for kernel but for one machine I never did for an
year

------
danso
> _Online retail—including selling through Amazon—has helped him keep the
> doors open. (He bemoans the fees he has to pay Amazon for the privilege,
> however.) He estimates that half of his revenue comes from online sales; the
> other half is a mix of in-store transactions and pop-up sales he does in
> busy locations like downtown Boston. “I go where the customers are,” he told
> me. But his Greenfield location produces only a small part of his
> revenues—if he makes $50 in a day in his store, it’s a good day, he said._

$50 a day at a brick-and-mortar location? That sounds unsustainable, I wonder
why even bother keeping it open? Does it help his branding/online reputation?

~~~
claudiulodro
It's probably also the warehouse for his inventory (or at least it should be)

~~~
trendia
There are some cities that consider warehouses "Industrial" zoning and retail
as "Commercial". Keeping a storefront could help you stay in a commercially
zoned area if you prefer it for some reason.

~~~
Mountain_Skies
To add to your comment, many if not most municipalities tax industrial
buildings at a higher rate than they do commercial buildings. This could
indeed be a nice tax saving strategy for the business.

------
hosh
There were articles related to this on how shopping and branding is shifting:

(1) An article about an Independent Bike Vendor that shifted its business
model to an Independent Bike Services. They make their money primarily from
servicing bikes, making recommendations. Releasing pressure from having to
make their most revenue from selling bikes allows them to make the best
recommendation for the biker. Bikers who buy direct from manufacturers will
still want an expert to service their bikes.

(2) An article about Nike and some of the major brands shifting to a different
business model where in-store shops are no longer _distribution_ channels but
rather _marketing_ channels. These shops provide an in-person experience. They
are paid by the overall revenue for the brand rather than what gets sold
through the store. This aligns the incentive structure to what consumers are
now doing: trying them on in a local store and then buying them online.

Where do small business owners fall into this? I don't know. Bikers and
commuters tend to have a lot of attachment and affection for their bikes, and
are willing to pay for services. Clothing in a department store, perhaps, not
so much. Books? Toys?

------
rb808
I wonder if internet shopping will one day help small towns rather than hurt
them. One of the things that really sucks about living in small towns is that
its difficult to buy the stuff you really want due to limited products
available. When small town residents have access to unlimited ranges of goods
and services at cheapest prices, its one less reason to travel to, or even
move to the nearest city.

~~~
oij82asd38
That problem was already solved by catalog and QVC.

The problems in rural areas stem from lack of new job growth since 2008
implosion, and jobs with poor wages (and not enough of these even). Not gonna
help people buy much online.

Logistics around literal access aren't the issue. It's the same old tune:
financial access.

Putting a website up in place of a catalog doesn't solve that problem.

~~~
TulliusCicero
> That problem was already solved by catalog and QVC.

This is like saying that playing video games over the internet is nothing new,
because hey, people already played games over distance in the form of chess by
mail.

~~~
oi23wei535oj
Playing video games over the internet is nothing new, because hey, people been
doing it for decades.

------
TYPE_FASTER
> How might local businesses respond?

1\. Convenience. I used to stop at a local toy store on the way to a birthday
party, or the day before, to buy a wrapped present. They closed, so now I
drive ~15min each way to the next closest toy store.

2\. How do I know what local stores have unless I go there and ask? I'd like
an app that would allow me to comparison shop across
Amazon/Target/Walmart/local stores. Let me know if you want to work on that
with me, sounds interesting.

3\. Add value - online reviews are sometimes useful, honest expert advice is
great.

~~~
dalfonso
4\. Price match. This can be a double-edged sword and it may be unsustainable
but if I'm the shop owner I'd lose a bit of margin rather than the entire
sale. As a customer, who wouldn't want the item now vs. waiting 1-5 days for
it.

~~~
chii
a reason they can't price match is that their prices are already at razor thin
margin, since their economy of scale doesn't kick in like the big co's.

------
X-Istence
I'd shop local more often, if only it weren't for the shopkeepers always
intruding on my thoughts and thinking by asking if I need anything.

Not having to interact with other humans beings is the best thing about online
shopping.

~~~
8_hours_ago
That's a benefit of shopping in a brick and mortar store! I used to always get
annoyed and say "no thanks, I'm good" when the employee approached and asked
that question, but then a friend told me that I should take their help. If you
tell the employee what you are looking for, or that you don't know exactly
what you are looking for, they will usually (about 75% in my experience) be
very helpful. The employees tend to be very knowledgeable about what they are
selling and have good advice about what to buy or what not to buy.

~~~
dragonwriter
> The employees tend to be very knowledgeable about what they are selling

That's often true of specialty stores, especially independent local ones. It's
often not true of big chains and stores that don't have a narrow focus.

It's also often the case that they will steer you based on their knowledge of
their sales incentive structure, which is often _much_ better than their
knowledge of product.

~~~
tomtang0514
Yep, best example: car dealership.

------
empath75
Ultimately, if you're a business that isn't providing what people want at a
price they're willing to pay, you're not going to stay in business. I don't
know that there is anything to fix here, other than making sure that the
people that depend on places like this for work get a soft landing and help
finding new work.

~~~
moate
IDK man. "Free market will decide" is great, but the issue is becoming that
the free market has decided that low wage, non-skilled jobs are low hanging
fruit to cut. Replace someone with a kiosk or a robot or just outsource the
whole store to an online location and a warehouse/shipping department.

The biggest issue with these sort of stories are that there are these Neo-
Luddites who think that we can keep/make jobs in the face of online retailers
killing many types of work. Giant corporations don't hire the same number of
people that they used to, and the people they do hire don't tend to be low
skill positions.

Retail is dying by inches, but it's dying. People can make "customer service"
a rallying cry, but "customer convenience" seems to be the actual metric that
matters. We're getting rid of these jobs, and too often we're either not
replacing them or we're dealing with people who were in _JOB X_ for 10+ years
and are unwilling/unable to change to a new field.

I'm not saying any of this is "bad", just that "soft landing and help finding
new work" is a cute dream, but not likely. This is what disruption does. It
ruins the current paradigm.

~~~
sseveran
So it turns out that "customer service" is actually a good in and of itself
that has a price and needs customers willing to pay that price. A Walmart
shopper is typically not willing or able to trade some of their disposable
income for a more knowledgable/helpful employee. There is a reason that Trader
Joes, Whole Foods, and Walmart pick the inventory mix they have, where they
locate, and who they hire. They are all different business models with
different customer groups.

People with less disposable income have increasingly prioritized physical
products over paying for any meaningful interaction with employees which is
fine. It is their choice to do so. If people actually value having meaningful
interactions on main street in small town America they will still have them.
But I suspect that most people don't value that, which one could argue I
suppose is bad, but it should ultimately be left up to the individuals that
live in small town Vermont, not me.

I rely on a couple of small businesses near me, one of which is my butcher.
One might say well the butcher is an unskilled job, but he is selling me two
things. First is better meat than Whole Foods. Secondly he is quite a good
cook so he can recommend cooking techniques or I can say "I want to do the
brisket sous vide" and he will trim it so just the right amount of fat is on
it. Obviously this works better with organic products rather than something
made of plastic where everything in the same box is a perfect substitute.

~~~
macavity23
Not to disagree with anything else you wrote, but anyone who says butchery is
an unskilled job has definitely never tried it. What other C21st job has a
legitimate need for chain mail?

~~~
sseveran
I don't think butchers are unskilled, but I have run across people who do.
Having an actual butcher has made me a better book :-)

------
amyjess
In a lot of ways, they brought this on themselves. Small, local businesses
don't have the selection or the prices that large national stores have.

In the end, it's going to be Walmart or Amazon. Walmart will at least hire
local people to staff the stores, and local stores might be able to survive as
ultra-niche places that will carry all the oddball "long tail" stuff Walmart
won't bother with. But if you don't let the population have a nearby store
that has good prices, good customer service, and a good selection of the
things the bulk of the population wants, they'll go online for it, they'll
discover that Amazon actually does have everything (well, except for a
Chromecast or a Nest), and the nearest fulfillment center will be too far away
to hire anybody local (I say "will" rather than "may", because if they're
keeping out Walmart, they'll keep out Amazon fulfillment centers too).

And let's not just talk about the selection and the prices. Let's talk about
customer service. Big companies prioritize the bottom line, so the last thing
they want to do is turn away customers or risk a black eye on social media
that can spur a boycott. Small businesses tend to take an attitude of "I'll
run my business _my_ way, even if it hurts the bottom line!". Case in point:
Macy's has fired multiple employees for telling trans women that they're not
allowed to use the ladies' fitting rooms. They have a corporate policy of non-
discrimination, and employees who break that policy get canned. Why? Because
turning away customers is bad for business, and the last thing they want is
for "boycott Macy's for transphobia" to trend on Twitter. A small businesses
may very well take the attitude of "I'm not treating you freaks like women, so
get out!", they're willing to lose the business for the sake of their
principles, and they're not going to face much backlash in a conservative
small town. Or you see all the cake bakers who refuse to bake for LGBT people;
you won't see that kind of discrimination at Kroger. I am 100% fine with these
small businesses going away. They actively make life worse for marginalized
people like the LGBT community (I'm a lesbian trans woman myself), so I'll do
whatever it takes to accelerate that process and replace them with bigcorps.

And let's not just talk about how small businesses are worse for the customer.
Let's talk about how they treat their own employees. Laws requiring employers
to provide insurance benefits to their employees don't kick in unless the
employer is over a certain size. And it's precisely because of small
businesses that the US doesn't have as many employee-friendly laws: it's the
small businesses, not the big corporations, who are terrified of the
government mandating that employers provide large amounts of vacation time or
comprehensive health coverage. Big businesses are big enough to soak the cost;
mom-and-pops aren't. And it's not just about benefits: think also what HR
departments can do for you. If you work at Walmart, and your supervisor is
sexually harassing you, you can file a complaint with HR. If you work at a
local shop... your supervisor is probably the owner, so your choice is to
either live with sexual harassment or find yourself unemployed. And there's
evidence showing that the gender wage gap among pharmacists almost completely
went away when pharmacies shifted away from mom-and-pops and towards big box
stores that hire people to work shifts.

Whenever I hear stories like this, I think of a handful of strips from
_Something Positive_ back in 2004:

[http://somethingpositive.net/sp09082004.shtml](http://somethingpositive.net/sp09082004.shtml)

[http://somethingpositive.net/sp09092004.shtml](http://somethingpositive.net/sp09092004.shtml)

[http://somethingpositive.net/sp09102004.shtml](http://somethingpositive.net/sp09102004.shtml)

Small businesses are strictly worse than megacorps, and they're finally
getting what's coming to them.

~~~
dragonwriter
> And it's not just about benefits: think also what HR departments can do for
> you.

As an employee, your employer’s HR department exists for the sole purpose of
maximizing the net value that the employer can extract from you, the “human
resource” being exploited by the company (and if that maximum turns negative,
that can be rephrased as minimizing the net harm you can do to the company.)

If they happen to do something that actually benefits you, that's a side
effect, not the main goal.

~~~
sokoloff
In the phrase "Human Resources", never forget that the first word is an
adjective and the second the noun.

------
shmerl
_> She told me customers come in and browse, find something they like, and
compare prices online when she’s standing right there. _

This is pretty unethical.

~~~
sigzero
What exactly do you think is unethical about it? The store either has the best
price or not and it is certainly within the consumers best interest to get the
best usage of their money. Is it the fact that "she's standing right there"?
Poor behavior doesn't make it unethical. There is no obligation to buy a
product just because I am standing in the store.

~~~
hfdgiutdryg
It's unethical to use a store as a showroom and then order the item at a lower
price from someone who doesn't have to cover the cost of maintaining said
showroom.

Either take the gamble and order online sight-unseen, or pay the higher price
involved in maintaining floor space and inventory.

~~~
moate
So you feel it's unethical to go into a store and compare prices? Disregard
the ethics of 2 different sales channels being able to compete on pricing
because of different distribution set ups, but in what universe is it the
consumers job to make sure "joe from around the block" has a job at this
specific store?

Is it impolite to bust out a phone right in front of a sales rep and say "hold
on, let me check amazon", sure. But there's no moral responsibility on the
customer's part to do business with anyone because "hey man, it's more
expensive for me to run this business".

This isn't some surprise to retail. This has been going on for over a decade.
You can't compete with the internet on price for (many) things. But you can
compete on immediate availability, customer experience, etc. If you're
fighting a price fight with the internet, gtfo of retail.

~~~
hfdgiutdryg
_So you feel it 's unethical to go into a store and compare prices?_

As I said, it's unethical to use a store as a showroom and then buy elsewhere.
It's a simple concept, and I believe you're being intentionally obtuse and
disingenuous in your reply.

