

Apple Announces Mac OS X 'Mavericks' - fraXis
http://www.macrumors.com/2013/06/10/apple-announces-mac-os-x-mavericks/

======
neilkumar
I'm glad they are _finally_ solving the multiple desktop issue, its definitely
the most frustrating aspect of OSX. Also, loved how it worked with AppleTV.

~~~
eieio
Did I miss something and they've gone back and un-broken spaces/virtual
desktops? Or are you talking about multiple monitors?

Obviously multiple monitors have needed a fix for ages but spaces are my pet
issue so I have to ask.

~~~
X-Istence
Yes, they have un-broken it.

Each display can now have it's own virtual desktops, and each screen can have
their own full screen app without showing linen on the other.

Easy dragging of apps from one screen to another and more.

------
ipostonthisacc
Somewhat more technical information found 2 links deep on Apple site
[http://images.apple.com/osx/preview/docs/OSX_Mavericks_Core_...](http://images.apple.com/osx/preview/docs/OSX_Mavericks_Core_Technology_Overview.pdf)

~~~
binarycrusader
With at least one questionable statement:

    
    
      OS X was the first operating system to ship as a single
      install that could boot into either a 32-bit or 64-bit
      kernel, either of which could run 32-bit and 64-bit
      applications at full native performance. OS X now
      exclusively uses a 64-bit kernel, but it continues to run
      both 32-bit and 64-bit applications.
    

I believe Solaris was actually the first to do this:

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solaris_%28operating_system%29#...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solaris_%28operating_system%29#Version_history)

~~~
millstone
The key phrase is "either of which could run 32-bit and 64-bit applications."
OS X supported 64-bit apps on a 32-bit kernel. This enabled users to run 64
bit apps, and use >4 GB address space, without any device driver
incompatibilities.

I think Solaris (and Windows and Linux) require a 64 bit kernel to run 64 bit
apps. Correct me if I'm wrong.

~~~
binarycrusader
Fair enough.

With that said, OS X's hack support for 64-bit applications on a 32-bit kernel
certainly wasn't at the same performance level as a 64-bit kernel as they
claim. It's a dubious achievement at best given the performance tradeoffs.

~~~
millstone
It seems like you are casting aspersions. In what way was it a "hack" and what
performance tradeoffs were there? Apple's claim is that 64 bit apps ran at
native speeds, which is true, since they just used the native ISA.

Apple lists a few benefits of K64 at
[https://developer.apple.com/library/mac/#documentation/MacOS...](https://developer.apple.com/library/mac/#documentation/MacOSX/Conceptual/OSX_Technology_Overview/SystemTechnology/SystemTechnology.html)
, specifically more efficient support for systems with lots of RAM, a larger
buffer cache, and better support for multiple video cards with over 2 GB of
RAM. These are pretty specialized, and I certainly don't remember my Mac
getting a lot faster when it switched to K64. (I sure wish it had!)

~~~
binarycrusader
I don't need to cast aspersions.

Apple's claims about performance primarily applied to OS X when run on a
specific version of the PowerPC processor:

[http://www.ece.uprm.edu/~nayda/Courses/Inel4215F03/power64.p...](http://www.ece.uprm.edu/~nayda/Courses/Inel4215F03/power64.pdf)

(See pages 304-306.)

But, there was a cost to that dependent on architecture. If you read the
document I linked above, you'll see that there is a cost to this 64-bit
translation -- the performance is not completely equivalent to a 64-bit
application running on a 64-bit kernel where there is no need for translation.

And yes, there were performance tradeoffs. A 64-bit application running on a
32-bit OS still had all of the 32-bit limitations enforced (limit on maximum
process size, number of file descriptors, etc.).

And once Apple made the transition to x86 from PowerPC they lost the built-in
hardware advantage. x86 can also run 64-bit applications on a 32-bit kernel,
but the cost of doing that hardware switch is not as cheap as it was on
PowerPC. I also think it's very telling that Solaris, Linux, and Windows opted
to never do this as well.

And now that OS X no longer offers a 32-bit kernel, this all seems moot
anyway.

------
seclorum
Store my keychain on the iCloud, eh? Is this going to be the default behaviour
now?

If so, I guess I'm abandoning Apple faster than I thought I would, a day or so
ago .

~~~
JosephBrown
Lots of people are already doing this with 1Password either in iCloud or on
Dropbox. As long as it's encrypted with the appropriate algorithms, what's the
issue?

~~~
cake
Yes or [https://lastpass.com/](https://lastpass.com/) encrypted and free.
Works wonders.

~~~
zevyoura
*free for desktop use; you do need to pay to use it on mobile.

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thinkling
I would have preferred OS X Sea Lion.

~~~
stock_toaster
Can't wait for "yosemite"

~~~
jfb
It's been done [1].

[1]
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_Macintosh_G3_(Blue_%26_W...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_Macintosh_G3_\(Blue_%26_White\))

------
asveikau
Not a lot of technical specificity around "memory compression". _Edit:_ Ok, I
stand corrected, somebody's done some research and found the code.

Windows 8 does a similar-sounding trick. At some timer interrupts they de-dupe
pages and make them copy-on-write when they are identical. I seem to recall
also reading that some VM products (VMware?) do this - so if you have a few
instances of the same OS, only unique pages end up getting stored.

From the presentation I wonder if they're doing this, or if they might be
putting the pages through a compression algorithm. (I hear "compression" and I
think this, but it seems like that would make page faults needlessly costly.)

~~~
DiabloD3
Google added this to the Linux kernel quite some time ago for Android.

Basically, it inserts a step before the "move to swap" step where it
compresses the page. This a) allows Linux to write a compressed page to swap
which allows both faster writes but also faster reads, b) allows you to use
more memory before hitting swap.

Major distros are considering enabling this functionality in their kernels by
default.

What you're describing sounds like samepage detection, which Linux also has
thanks to Google and Android.

~~~
asveikau
I guess what it costs you in CPU is easily regained by what it saves you in
I/O.

~~~
calinet6
Yes, it would seem to be more efficient all around. One of those "why didn't I
think of that?" things that sounds really simple and nice in hindsight.

------
joejohnson
I am so happy to hear that OS X Mavericks will fix fullscreen apps across
multiple displays!

~~~
rsync
How was it ever possible that this was broken in the first place ? Incredible.
Stupefying.

~~~
sneak
Most users don't use multiple displays. For the vast majority of users,
nothing was broken. Also, the multiple-menubar thing illustrates that it's not
exactly a simple or uncomplicated fix following the introduction of fullscreen
app support.

~~~
taude
I would think that Apple devs would use multiple monitors and would have coded
the base functionality so that it made sense working.. Even Windows has had
pretty decent multi-monitor support for about 5 years now.

Anyway, I look forward to proper multi-monitor support without have to
purchase an expensive 3rd party add on, or manually resizing my windows on
different screens.

I'm also hoping that like windows, OS-M will remember what apps are where when
I plug in different screens (like home vs office).

~~~
mey
Windows has had excellent multi-mon support since at least the XP era, (when I
started using dual monitors at work and home in, I think Win98 wasn't that bad
either), and to make you feel old, realize that WinXP has been out for 11
years.

------
dakrisht
Are Goose and Iceman the next releases?

Sea Lion was 100x better

And Keychain stored in iCloud, yeah, nice try there Apple.

Finally - the new MacPro looks like a roll of toilet paper encased in glossy
plastic. What is that thing.

~~~
protitap
The new Mac Pro looks like the part of a vacuum cleaner that stores the dust.
It's going to take a while for it to grow on me, if that ever happens.

~~~
rz2k
It looks like the center is a separate zone entirely, so that the heat sink
could gather dust, but there is little air flow over the actual components
themselves. In other words you might be able to pull a Swiffer pad through the
center fins, where you'd risk damaging things if you did that over a circuit
board directly.

------
hayksaakian
Everything announced so far was well within rumors and speculation. What was
John Gruber talking about?

~~~
lukifer
We all knew a UI refresh was coming, but most of the iOS7 interface concepts
were unexpected. Same with trashcan Mac Pro and 12hr Air: we knew there'd be
refreshes, but the details were surprising.

Also, while there's not much glitz to 10.9, the list of iterative improvements
is extremely promising, assuming it delivers.

~~~
meerita
Also, how can we forget the infamous and most hyped iWatch. I was so happy
they didn't make it.

~~~
lukifer
I love my NanoWatch to pieces, and eagerly await any company that can make
something better. But it's not really something I see fitting into the Apple
way.

------
cpeterso
Any guesses as to when Apple will drop the "X" from "OS X"? The name "OS Ten"
is getting a little long in the tooth. I hear people pronouncing it "OS Ecks"
more frequently these days.

At the code level, I assume we will live with the 10.x version numbers
forever, like Solaris 11 is also "SunOS 5.11".

~~~
grecy
I've always thought 10.9 would be the last, before they go to 11.0

I just don't think Apple marketing would go for "Ten point ten" or "eks point
eks" or even "eks point 10"

~~~
petercooper
Note that the "10.9" part was extremely diminished in today's announcements.
While those underlying version numbers may live in, I suspect they won't be
using the numbers in public in future.

------
chimeracoder
I'm kind of surprised and amused that they chose the name of an old Ubuntu
release (October 2010): [http://old-
releases.ubuntu.com/releases/maverick/](http://old-
releases.ubuntu.com/releases/maverick/)

~~~
czhiddy
I'm kind of surprised and amused that Ubuntu chose the name of a NBA expansion
team (1980):
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dallas_Mavericks](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dallas_Mavericks)

~~~
nlh
I'm kind of surprised and amused that the NBA expansion team chose the name of
a surfing location in Northern California (1961):
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mavericks_(location)](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mavericks_\(location\))

;)

~~~
alex_doom
If the next releases are all California surf spots, I'm all for it.

~~~
joyeuse6701
I'd be more excited if they used fictitious navy pilot call signs, maverick,
goose, iceman, merlin... Who's with me?

~~~
stock_toaster
Top Gun?

~~~
fakeer
Yeah! Want the next one names _OSX Cruise_? :-)

------
robomartin
I really hope iCloud can be disabled in OSX-M. As far as I am concerned iCloud
is a disaster. It causes all manner of data loss on iDevices, generally
without the user having a choice. For example, my wife lost her entire
calendar -all events- just for turning off calendar synchronization. All
events had been originally entered through her phone. Somehow iCloud decided
to delete anything that was also stored in the cloud, which meant everything.
I really don't get the logic behind this behavior. It's really dumb. You never
loose user data. So, I don't trust it now. I don't care to have anything to do
with it.

~~~
RexRollman
Historically, use of Apple's online services have been optional, even in iOS.
I would be surprised if that has changed.

------
DAddYE
I really really hope, they improved the dog slow of Terminal.app

~~~
Watabou
1\. Download iTerm.

2\. Forget about Terminal.app

~~~
zeckalpha
Or iTerm 2.

------
th0ma5
Funny thing about the iMac I have, you can't turn off the embedded monitor and
just run an external monitor. It seems the new multiple monitor situation
doesn't have any call outs for the iMac or anything sensible. I actually think
they prevent this specifically in the sense that I should just want a Mac Mini
or Apple TV and shouldn't doubt the ability to buy a way out of the problem.

------
JoshGlazebrook
It takes me back to 2008 with Sarah Palin and John McCain. Ick

------
meerita
They will kill 1Password with the new keychain in the cloud. I'm a total fan
of 1Password and I dislike this a bit.

~~~
ceejayoz
Hardly. Anyone who ever has to use a non Apple device - Windows desktop,
Android phone, etc. - is going to still need a cross-platform solution like
1Password.

~~~
Friedas_
Maybe this will be the kick up Agilebits' ass to fix their Windows and Android
apps, and perhaps even deliver a Windows Phone app as well. The Android
1Password app in particular is embarrassing.

------
bitwize
Guess they finally ran out of cats.

~~~
sneak
Technically they ran out some time ago, a mountain lion and a panther are the
same animal.

~~~
bitwize
A mountain lion (10.8) and a puma (10.1) are the same animal. A panther (10.3)
is a subtype of leopard (10.5).

But even with these redundancies, they are running out of large cat names to
use and would have to go with the likes of "jaguarundi", "serval", and "manul"
to keep the theme going. These are cool animals, but have nowhere near the
emotive power that "Jaguar" or "Lion" had.

