

The truth about cold water - helwr
http://gcaptain.com/maritime/blog/cold_water?11198

======
jokull
There's an Icelandic legend that beat all this crap in 1984. His ship sank
with all his friends and co-workers. He swam to shore, walked bare feet on
razor sharp lava and walked to town. Guðlaugur Friðþórsson.

His descriptions are chilling. "When the ship sank from underneath us and we
were submerged for the second time we decided [the three of us] to swim. We
decided not to help each other which would have been hopeless. We spotted the
lighthouse and started swimming towards it. Soon there was only the two of us
left calling between us, but soon enough I stopped hearing any calls."

More amazingness: On his way to shore a ship came within 100m of him. He spoke
to "múkki" an imagined sailor's friend on the way, told himself jokes and said
some prayers. When he came to shore he had to hold onto a rock wall while
waiting for the tide to recede. While walking he spotted a bathtub used for
lifestock feeding he punched through a layer of ice to get drinking water.

~~~
cromulent
Apparently he survived because he was fat.

[http://books.google.com.au/books?id=rYIJJP7audkC&pg=PA26...](http://books.google.com.au/books?id=rYIJJP7audkC&pg=PA26&lpg=PA26&dq=gudlaugur+fridthorsson&source=bl&ots=vaeOLOEykf&sig=cPCPEvKE3pD4hPNM4DAXH0GrmJM&hl=en&ei=BxA3TKSBLI-
lOL2IoMEE&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=6&ved=0CDEQ6AEwBQ#v=onepage&q=gudlaugur%20fridthorsson&f=false)

~~~
avar
I can't find a citation for this now, but I recall reading somewhere that he
had a higher ratio of brown fat than is normal. I.e. just being fat isn't
enough, it has to be the right sort of fat.

~~~
Loy
<http://www.vikingrune.com/2009/03/true-viking-grit/>

_However, a startling fact was discovered by the researchers from the
University of Iceland: Guðlaugur’s fat is almost like seal fat. It is more
solid and two or three times thicker than human fat._

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TGJ
A very good article that shows some perceived misconceptions about cold water
survival. I spent 4 years on 20 different large marine seismic exploration
boats with most of them operating in the North Sea. I have taken 3 North Sea
Survival courses and a many safety meetings for good measure. Every person
that I have worked with has been well aware of the consequences of falling
overboard in water barely above freezing. Larger boats take at least an hour
to turn around and at least 10-15 min for the rescue boat to hit the water.
Then, only if your lucky, will they be able to find you as you bob in and out
of view from the waves. All of this of course, relies on someone seeing you
fall over in the first place. Never work on deck unless you are working with
someone, have an immersion suit, or are attached by a safety chain.

Another problem arises when you are rescued as he points out, but the stories
I have heard are about the survivors being put in showers to raise their body
temperature back up and collapsing and drowning in a puddle of water in the
shower.

The whole thing, on the other hand, seems fairly moot. It's like telling
someone that when you get shot, it's not the bullet that kills you, it's the
bleeding.

~~~
drats
I particularly like the tone in "I know that you think you know all there is
to know about hypothermia already (and maybe you do), but read ahead and see
if you aren’t surprised by something" given that someone actually downvoted me
when I took exception to the line "whatever you just said, it's wrong" in the
"Where Does A Tree Get Its Mass?" article[1] when it was posted to HN.

There is no need for all the hyperbole and Zed Shaw-like drama on HN, articles
can be interestingly written without all that baggage. That someone such as
yourself, who knows a lot about this, and someone like me who doesn't can both
enjoy the article is a testament to the style.

[1][http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2008/11/where_does_a_tree_get...](http://thelastpsychiatrist.com/2008/11/where_does_a_tree_get_its_mass.html)

~~~
ErrantX
You should have read on; it was just an attention grabber :)

~~~
drats
I don't want to offend anyone but that article was extremely boring (I did end
up reading it). I suppose I'd seen the Richard Feynman video on fire and trees
quite recently beforehand and was in an intolerant mood. But it's impossible
to stay in any kind of negative mood if you watch Feynman, his love of
knowledge is just infectious.

<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N1pIYI5JQLE>

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pge
A great rule of thumb I learned in Wilderness First Responder training: "1
minute, 10 minutes, an hour"

It's catchy and easy to remember, and it means: * 1 minute to deal with the
panic response (i.e. first keep yourself alive for the first minute, you have
plenty of time, and lots of people die quickly because of panic and
inhalation.

* 10 minutes - that is roughly the amount of time you have to get yourself in a stable position before you lose motor control. Get yourself in a position with your head out of the water that doesnt require active support anyway you can - flotation, freezing yourself to an ice shelf, etc).

* 1 hour - that's how long you'll live (roughly) in 32F water. You may have a lot longer depending on water temp and your body.

There's a prof that did a lot of this research on his poor grad students (and
you thought your thesis advisor was hard on you!).
[http://www.umanitoba.ca/faculties/kinrec/research/people/gie...](http://www.umanitoba.ca/faculties/kinrec/research/people/giesbrecht.html)
He's the source for much of the recent research.

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tomerico
Much of the knowledge we have about the effect of cold water on the human body
comes from the Nazi's human experiments.

[http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Judaism/naziexp....](http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Judaism/naziexp.html)

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lkozma
I wonder if people who have training with cold water resist significantly
longer. I knew Finns who would go in mid January to swim for ten minutes in a
hole cut in the ice of a frozen lake, then sit around for a while, dress up
and go on with their day. And that was without sauna.

~~~
wallflower
Lynne Cox, the only person to have swum a mile in Antarctic waters and to swim
the Bering Strait.

"Dangerous marine animals aside, the [Gulf of 'Aqaba] swim was among Cox's
most physically challenging. A battery of scientific studies done on Cox over
the years has revealed some startling facts about her physiology. First, the
muscle and fat in her body are so perfectly balanced that she has neutral
buoyancy, meaning that she neither sinks in water nor floats. As one
researcher told her, "You're at one with the water" - a critical energy-saving
advantage during long-distance swims.

More remarkable, however, was the discovery that Cox's body is superbly
adapted to cold temperatures. On entering cold water, a person's surface blood
vessels constrict, forcing warm blood to the vital organs at the body's core.
Normally, however, this is a stopgap that works for only a short time. By
contrast, Cox's vital organs are insulated by an evenly distributed layer of
insulating fat. Warm blood shunted to her core remains warm dramatically
longer. So effective is this "internal wet suit," that Cox's temperature
actually rises during a hard swim in cold water."

<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lynne_Cox>

~~~
mahipal
But apparently she had been swimming for decades -- a lot of it in
(progressively colder?) ocean water -- and she was studied "over the years."
So it seems pretty possible that her physiological adaptations were a result
of, not a cause of, all that cold-water swimming.

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Groxx
A good complement to the recent drowning-related post. In fact, it's the
"prequel". Worth a read, followed by a warm bath.

~~~
powrtoch
Indeed. Why does HN suddenly want to make me a lifeguard?

~~~
epochwolf
Because the media wants to make you an idiot where drowning and cold water are
concerned.

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kqr2
The video _Cold Water Boot Camp_ linked to at the end of the article strikes
home the points very nicely.

Volunteers jump into cold water and demonstrate the _1-10-1_ rule of cold
water exposure.

    
    
      1  : Initial cold shock will last for about a minute
      10 : Physical incapacitation will occur after about 10 minutes
      1  : Unconsciousness from hypothermia in about 1 hour
    

<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1xohI3B4Uc>

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unofficial
The author, USCG Rescue Swimmer Mario Vittone, is a nut. He once submerged
himself in Lake Erie in the middle of winter to prove that it takes about an
hour for your body to reach hypothermic levels.

After he did it I asked him "How did it go?"

He replied. "I survived, but it was close!"

~~~
nas
Reminds me of Dr Popsicle: <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nH29uzBvR1s>

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pclark
So the advice to survive in cold water:

wear a life jacket?

~~~
tomjen3
Absolutely (though it may not be enough), but not just for the reasons you
think: a life jacket will keep the back of your head out of the water - which
will help prevent damage to the brain.

You don't want to know where this research comes from, believe me.

~~~
ciupicri
Maybe he doesn't want to know, but I'm curious.

P.S. I'm also curious about what kind of damage can occur to the brain and
from what exactly?

~~~
stan_rogers
I believe he's referring to this:
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_human_experimentation>

Much of that has been confirmed more recently by somewhat more humane (and
more than somewhat more voluntary) experimentation by folks like Gordon
Geisbrecht (U of Manitoba) and the Canadian Defence and Civil Institute of
Environmental Medicine (DCIEM).

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jonpaul
You have to watch this TED talk where Lewis Pugh swam in the North Pole. It's
fascinating.
[http://www.ted.com/talks/lewis_pugh_swims_the_north_pole.htm...](http://www.ted.com/talks/lewis_pugh_swims_the_north_pole.html)

