

Nori Lights - Bicycle Illumination System - davidclopez
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/254749710/nori-lights-bicycle-illumination-system?ref=live

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ken
I hate to be that guy, but this looks just like an existing product:
<http://www.lunasee.com>

The major difference seems to be that Lunasee is powered by a hub dynamo
(rather than batteries). It's also currently only available pre-installed on
some bicycle models, and as an aftermarket part for motorcycles, but they say
they plan to sell an aftermarket bicycle part, too.

~~~
lunasee
Thanks for pointing this out ken, and i would like to add that we have several
patents around this in US and Canada, and several pending in other countries.

We would also like to do a battery aftermarket version, but it does come with
complications (rim, battery life, etc).

Thanks for your comments... Lunasee team

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dkarl
Reflective tape on the rims is a common solution. There's reflective tape that
looks black in daylight and is available at any bike shop. There are
reflectors you can put on the spokes, too, also available at any bike shop.

Here's a video showing what reflective tape looks like in the dark:
[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bm5muia44XI&feature=relmf...](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bm5muia44XI&feature=relmfu)

As for actively illuminated lights, there are a large number of commercial
products available. I'm too lazy, but anybody tempted to donate to a project
melodramatically promising to "save lives" in the name of somebody's beloved
grandfather should first drop by their local bike shop and see if perhaps it's
already possible to light themselves up however they want for a modest amount
of money.

~~~
jrockway
Indeed. Pretty much all Schwalbe commuting/city tires have huge bands of
retroreflective material around the sidewalls that make your bicycle quite
visible to anything beside you with a light. (They're really good tires, too.)

Most bicycle lights also intentionally spit out a little bit of light to the
side to also make you more visible. I'd recommend investing in a good front
light and good rear light (with built-in reflector) before bothering with
wheel lights. Wheel lights are cool if you're willing to maintain twice as
many lights as you need (batteries, remembering to turn them on, etc.), but I
prefer ease of use and so will not be getting these. (My rear light
automatically turns on when there is both darkness and vibration, and it's a
reflector, so there are few cases when I ever need to think about it. I keep
my front light with me at all times and just need to press one button to turn
it on. And I carry spare batteries, just in case.)

~~~
dkarl
One thing I don't like about the reflective strip on tires is that it can
create the illusion that the bike is stationary, because you don't see the
wheels turning. The Nori video shows the same problem. I suspect anything that
makes the turning of the wheels evident is a big improvement.

Some people have a lot of fun with it: [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YU_O-
OKuaeI&feature=relat...](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YU_O-
OKuaeI&feature=related)

~~~
jrockway
I don't really understand that. If the bike is moving, it will look like a
pair of moving circles because the bike is moving through space, not sitting
on a repair stand.

Anyway, wouldn't you take the same action for a stopped object in your path as
for a moving object in your path?

~~~
dkarl
I might not be in their path yet :-) I don't want to get hit by someone
rolling through a right on red because they thought the shiny circles were a
reflection from a sign across the street or what-not. Depth perception in the
dark is greatly aided by knowing what you're looking at, and lights are
especially tricky to identify and locate when there's water on the road, lots
of illuminated signage around, etc.

I still worry that a driver is going to see my obviously spinning wheels and
not understand what they're looking at. I want my reflection in the dark to
immediately suggest a cyclist, not a set of mysterious floating lights, since
depth perception is aided by knowing what you're looking at. A car can travel
a long distance in the time it takes to go from "WTF is that spinny thing in
my field of vision?" to "Oh, a cyclist in the right lane." (It doesn't help
that I'm in Texas, where cyclists are still an oddity to many drivers.) I'm
considering putting some reflective tape on my helmet -- I wonder if that
would help.

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scoot
The single biggest problem seems to be that the adhesive phosphorescent strip
is attached to the rim, which on most bikes is what the brake blocks press
against to stop the bike. If you look closely in the video, his bike _has no
brakes_!!! (You even see him use his feet to stop.) So much for "saving
lives"!

Disc brakes would overcome this, but that's going to be an expensive retrofit
for most cyclists.

~~~
nickbarnwell
As it's a cruiser the more likely explanation is that it's equipped with a
rear coaster brake. Not sure why he's not running anything up front, however.

~~~
scoot
I wasn't familiar with that type of braka, and had to look it up. I can't see
a hub on the back wheel, and I don't see him using any type of back-pedal or
braking action to stop (just his feet).

So, yes, for those few bikes that don't have conventional brakes, this
lighting system may be an option.

That doesn't change the fact that this product will be useless to the majority
of people who might purchase (sorry, _sponsor_ :-) it through KickStarter, at
least without sacrificing the ability to stop.

The fact that this isn't called out in the video or text is deceptive. There's
no way he isn't aware of this serious shortcoming.

~~~
nickbarnwell
It's entirely possible that you could mount the strip below the brake track.

~~~
scoot
The one demonstrated in the video or described in the pledge page wouldn't.
I've since learned here is an alternative flawed solution in the updates
section.

Other than for the "cool" factor (which suits his old-fashioned bike), good
old fashioned clip-on reflectors will do a far better job.

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maartenscholl
I like that bicycling is gaining in popularity outside of my country (The
Netherlands), but do you need to re-invent the wheel every time? Simple
(theft-resistant) reflector strips have been the norm here for a long time:
[http://www.fietsen.123.nl/thumbs/300x205h/2010-03/2bs_bicycl...](http://www.fietsen.123.nl/thumbs/300x205h/2010-03/2bs_bicycle_mudgard_003.jpg)

~~~
unconed
The answer: yes, they really think they do. As a Belgian living in North
America, I find myself repeating the same thing over and over again: Europe
figured this shit out 30 years ago. Just do what they are doing.

But then they insist it couldn't possibly work. So they do dumb things like
requiring bike helmets, but not reflectors or brakes.

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rexreed
I don't understand why certain for-profit products are allowed on Kickstarter
and others aren't. Is the decision-making process totally random? Or is it
just up to the particular whims and desires of those at Kickstarter making the
decisions?

Sorry to gripe, but I've seen far too many undeserving products (I'm not
making any judgment about this particular one) make the cut while deserving
ones get rejected. And if you have a web app you're trying to fund, forget it.
Why hardware products make the cut and software ones don't is a complete
mystery.

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dexter313
This is genius, how come no one thought of this before, it is cheap, provides
more safety for bicyclers and freaking looks like tron bikes! This guy
deserves to make money.

~~~
nachteilig
Actually there are several similar solutions out there already. Check out
<http://www.monkeylectric.com> or <http://revolights.com>

Still, this is a pretty neat addition to this increasingly crowded bicycle
light accessory space.

~~~
apendleton
Yeah, I was also struck by the similarity to revolights (which, incidentally,
was also kickstarter-funded). This one seems somewhat less effective (no
forward or rear illumination, and no easy way, from the side, to distinguish
the front wheel from the back to guess the direction of travel), but on the
other hand, I suspect it will be cheaper, easier to install, and get you much
more use on a charge.

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ddrmaxgt37
Not sure how legal this is in most places. I think colored lighting on the
rodas is generally banned in most states.

~~~
freiheit
Laws for lights on bicycles are generally separate from laws for lights on
motorized vehicles. For instance, in California, the law requires 5-9
reflectors and a white headlight, but only disallows a blue light. Any light
of any kind other than blue is allowed.

<http://dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d11/vc21201.htm>

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lunasee
Hi guys. Yes this product already exists at www.lunasee.com and we have
several patents around this technology. We have not produced an aftermarket
version for bicycles yet primarily due to many of the complications addressed
in this string. We do have aftermarket versions on the drawing board though.

We have tried to contact Nori Lights with no response so far. We have invested
time and money to protect this -- and hope Nori Lights and interested
consumers will respect this.

We appreciate all feedback.

Lunasee Team

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omegant
If you look at the video you can see how the amount of black light in a given
spot changes the brightness of that spot. It could be cool to create different
light patterns, changing the intensity of the leds with the speed of the bike.

~~~
revelation
No. Most countries rightfully regulate light sources on vehicles. That would
only serve to irritate drivers, not warn them or make it easier to identify
you.

~~~
jrockway
The US is not one of these countries, though some states and localities
require lights on bicycles and that they be particular colors. Germany
specifies that the rear red light must not be constant-on, but many people
believe that blinking rear lights confuse drivers at night (attract drunk
drivers, affect distance perception of normal drivers, etc.) and since the
jury is still out, it's nice to be able to make your own decisions rather than
require the government to make them for you.

I don't see any safety problem with "pimping out" your bike with rim lights
that change color with the bike's speed. Just realize that you look like a
twelve year old kid when you do. And make sure you have real lights for actual
riding.

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blehn
These systems look neat, but I find them inelegant in that they're only
visible from the sides, so they're more of a supplement to front and rear
lights than a complete solution.

~~~
milesokeefe
He acknowledges that in the video, and I think it's perfectly fine. I can't
imagine a system for bikes that can accomplish both.

~~~
blehn
how about two flexible strips of LEDs? one wraps around the seatpost, the
other around the stem. same overhead as front and rear lights, but you can
easily see them from the sides.

~~~
DasIch
Imagine both solutions at night in 50m distance. In which case can you
identify that the light source comes from a bicycle?

The nori lights while novel make it immediately obvious that you are looking
at a bicycle and that allows others to take appropriate action.

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marizmelo
Great idea, it does look like the Tron bikes. I think putting the front and
rear lights will attract more pledges.

