
Ask HN: Declining the job offer after accepting - gandutraveler
I recently interviewed with major tech company and accepted their offer. Company has already started visa transfer. I like the company, compensation and perks. However just few days back a friend of mine pitched an startup idea to me and I  feel strong inclination to join his startup. Now I have to decline offer which I already accepted. I know it is unprofessional but is there a right way to do it ?
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ChuckMcM
Is there a right way? Not really. When you decline post acceptance the company
will create a record of this in their applicant tracking system (its a data
base) and they will never offer you a job again (because they aren't sure
you're going to take it even if they did). The recruiter(s) you worked with at
that company are probably contractors. They will move around to other
companies in their careers, if you are the in the unlikely situation where you
are interviewing at a company and suddenly they decide not to proceed. That
could be why. Generally recruiters work with thousands of people, but only a
small number of them actually accept an offer and then later just back out. If
you are fortunate and don't have a very unique name then it might be a problem
but, if there are very few engineers with the same name it can be a bigger
problem.

If you are exceptionally unlucky and you decide to not work at this major tech
company and then your friend who pitched the startup can't come through. You
are doubly in trouble (can't go back and don't have a job) not to mention a
partially transferred visa.

The smart thing to do is to take the job at the Major Tech corp, spend a
couple of years saving some money and learning what you can, and _then_
joining your friend with the startup if they still look like a viable offer.
That strategy maximizes your future value. You have additional work
experience, your friend knows that you will stick with your word even when you
might not want to, and you will have a bit more knowledge of how well your
friend can put together a startup or not.

~~~
arikr
None of the "good" startups that I know would ever blackball someone for
declining an offer after accepting.

I agree with the other commenter - to people reading, this does _not_ apply in
many places. Maybe in massive bureaucratic old-school tech firms, but not
younger ones like Airbnb etc.

~~~
ChuckMcM
I appreciate you not deleting your comment (so far I've seen two).

It is completely legit to see it differently and to have a completely
different experience. All I can relate is what I have seen in the last 25
years in the Bay Area. Having seen the effect in action early in my career
(both people opting out after they said they would and other sorts of moves
which affected relationships) I sought to understand it and came to my current
appreciation of the various points of view.

Before I posted I had checked in with a friend of mine who is a contract
recruiter and they seemed to feel my understanding of the situation was both
correct and that this effect is fairly universal. It doesn't mean that it is
of course. The next time you have a chance to talk with someone, in a safe and
informal matter, who is in the hiring 'food chain' of something you consider
"good" startup, ask them what they think. Nothing feeds a discussion like good
data.

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elmerfud
Don't worry about it. You won't be the first nor the last person who changes
their mind on a job change, and I promise they have had it happen before. To
retract your acceptance you should just need to terse but professional. The
general format would be:

\- A sentence indicating you're withdrawing your acceptance of the offer.

\- One or two sentences explaining you have an unforeseen unique opportunity.
No need for great detail.

\- One or two sentences thanking them for their consideration, and hope for
future opportunities together.

That's really all there is to it. A professional company that values it's
people will understand that these things happen in life and will not hold any
thing against you.

~~~
jlarocco
And don't wait around too long. Try to send the email as soon as you know for
sure you're not taking the job, so that they can get back to searching and
don't spend too much time and resources getting ready for you.

~~~
zhte415
And tell them you're letting them know you're conscious of their efforts and
are informing them ASAP.

------
sokoloff
I was working on a startup and we were out of money. I applied for and found
another job and let the founder know. On the Sunday before I was to start at
the new place, we secured another round of funding, so the first thing I did
on Monday was report to my new job and the second thing I did was resign from
that job.

New boss was pissed, but it was the right call for me (and I couldn't have
done it any earlier).

In your case, I'd give careful thought to the visa issue; I wouldn't sweat it
on behalf of the major tech company at all. They've no doubt had worse
behavior from candidates and they'll survive the loss. You probably won't be
blackballed at that company, but do expect a question about it if you do
decide to apply later.

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pkaye
As a hiring manager I never take it personally if they decline the offer
before the start date. There are a few that never mention it till the starting
date and at that point feel they were just hanging on for a better offer and
wasted my time so personally would never hire them again in the future.

~~~
gandutraveler
Thats great to know. I am planning to also call the hiring manager and explain
myself.

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wallflower
I don't know you, but I strongly feel that you are making the wrong decision.

Let's go over the points...

Your friend pitched a startup idea. Based on your wording, it sounds like it
is more an idea than an actual company. Either way, unless your friend's
startup has the legal resources to sponsor a H1B visa and the financial
capability to pay you a prevailing wage, you run the risk of not being able to
transfer your visa. The government agency can reject your visa transfer, as
well.

By declining the offer, you are putting yourself in jeopardy of losing your
ability to work in the country.

I assume you are not married, but for the sake of this response, let's assume
you are. What would your wife think about this? Don't be so selfish, imagine
that others would be affected.

You are assuming that you will be able to work at the startup legally (H1B
transfer). I don't believe you can assume this. Does your friend even know
what is involved in sponsoring a H1B? Major tech companies have dedicated
departments for managing the H1B process for their employees.

Good luck!

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pm24601
If you have visa issues... how is your friend's cool startup going to help?

Visa issues even pre-trump were hard.

Does your friend have funding?

Does your friend have market validation?

What will happen to you personally if the startup fails - like so many do?

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smt88
Do it ASAP. Details are mostly unimportant, but be honest.

The more time and money they spend on you before you tell them, the angrier
they'll be. They may already have grounds to sue you, although I've never
heard of a company doing that in such a situation.

~~~
gandutraveler
Thanks.I plan to do it on Monday

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bsvalley
How can you join a startup (idea stage) on an H1B? Cause make sure you can
actually work legally for that startup before doing anything. Technically, you
can't unless the startup is already established.

~~~
gandutraveler
My plan is to join the startup in 4-5 months time frame and only then initiate
my H1B transfer. Till then ill continue with my current employer. Any idea on
what USCIS looks for in H1B transfers ?

~~~
bsvalley
Then it's a no brainer. Start with your new employer, then apply to your
friend's startup whenever they're ready. So you don't miss an opportunity with
the big company. You can transfer your H1B as many times as you want as long
as you have at least 6 months remaining on it. They will use premium
processing, you can be done in 15 days. Then if you're into your first 3 years
on your H1B, they will be able to extend it for 3 more years during the
transfer.

~~~
pkaye
I thought USCIS stopped premium processing earlier this year due to backlog.

~~~
bsvalley
You are right. The suspension also includes h1b transfer too. I wasn't aware
of that.

~~~
pravula
There is an option called "bridge petition". More risky, but doable.

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dudul
If you need a visa to work it's probably safer to go with the bigger company.
Does your friend realoze they'll have to apply for your visa?

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CodeWriter23
No judgement here. I suggest you check yourself out to make sure this isn't
about fear, cold feet, etc.

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atsaloli
I did that once. I had asked for a raise and didn't get one. I let my boss
know I'd be looking elsewhere. Still didn't get one. Found another job and
accepted it and quit the old job which promptly resulted in an offer of a
large raise on the old job - larger than the salary at the new place. The old
job was right next door to me and the new one across town.

I went to the new place with a huge gift basket and apologized and explained
that I wouldn't be starting after all because I got a counter offer I couldn't
turn down. They looked stunned. I left. I worked at the old place another
several years and ended up rising to Director of Operations before leaving to
work on my own company. I still feel bad about it but it was the right
decision overall.

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anon543210
I would suggest you keep the job and work on the startup in off hours. Until
you have a good idea of how viable the startup will be, just stick at the big
company

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mahesh_gkumar
If you really want to go with the startup, I recommend offering to pay back
the money the tech company is spending on doing your visa transfer. This might
keep a thin bridge alive between the two of you. Also, make sure the startup
knows what is involved in doing a visa transfer, GC after that etc. Good luck!

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late2part
Renege as you see fit. The employment offer was at-will, right? I accepted and
then turned down employee #5 at a multi-billion dollar company and never
regretted it and it has never been an issue.

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cvaidya1986
I would do the big co whilst moonlighting and only after funding comes in jump
ship esp. considering the visa.

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probinso
Do it quickly. rip off the Band-Aid

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fancyfredbot
Have you signed a contract?

~~~
gandutraveler
I signed the job offer. There is no legal obligation in the offer letter to
join.

~~~
fancyfredbot
In that case you are free to leave. You'll dissapoint them, but I think many
outfits would do the same to you if circumstances changed before the contract
was signed.

