
The Liberty City - danso
https://www.npr.org/templates/transcript/transcript.php?storyId=771371881
======
kauffj
I'm on the board of directors for the Free State Project
([https://fsp.org](https://fsp.org)) mentioned in the article, which aims to
concentrate those who support liberty in one place (NH) for greater
effectiveness.

If anyone has questions about the Free State Project, you can ask them here or
email me personally at kauffj@gmail.com. I'm always happy to assist fellow
hackers that are interested in the FSP.

~~~
AnimalMuppet
How close are you to actually having any effect on the politics of NH? To
having a controlling effect?

~~~
kauffj
There are 15 reps in the state house and a much larger number in local
positions. There are some well developed machines to help people get elected.
Perhaps most importantly, I think NH is relatively established as the
Schelling point for concentration.

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Spooky23
This isn't very unique, it's called a suburb. It's just a little more extreme
and poorly governed.

A common suburbia pattern is to build a shopping hub in a county or other
subdivision on an interstate adjacent to a bigger community and exploit the
increased revenues. The community starts keeping costs down by leeching on
state and county level resources for police, allowing undesirable business
etc.

There are variants in different states because of how land in allocated. For
example, New York doesn't have unincorporated land, you're always in a town or
city.

~~~
danso
Suburban areas that become incorporated cities aren't unique. But AFAIK, Von
Ormy is unique for its aversion to taxes. Here's another story about it from
2017: [https://www.texasobserver.org/the-rise-and-fall-of-the-
frees...](https://www.texasobserver.org/the-rise-and-fall-of-the-freest-
little-city-in-texas/)

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jefflinwood
It sounds like their preferred method of financing city government (being a
speed trap on I-35) goes back at least 50 years - here's an interesting
article from 1974 about Selma, TX, which is on the other side of San Antonio,
but also on I-35.

[https://www.texasmonthly.com/articles/the-perfect-speed-
trap...](https://www.texasmonthly.com/articles/the-perfect-speed-trap/)

~~~
Ididntdothis
Relying on speed traps seems a terrible way of financing a city. I can’t
imagine this being stable. If people start speeding less (which should be the
purpose of speed traps) what are they going to do?

~~~
dsfyu404ed
Yes, everyone hates speed trap towns (rightfully IMO.)

The schadenfreude of small government failing to produce a thriving city with
that particular cherry on top is why this is on the front page.

If this city had connected to the sewer, got a Walmart and become a normal and
forgettable suburb other than its tax rate nobody would be interested in its
story but because the insistence on low taxes and small government created
what many here would consider bad results it is of interest.

~~~
hedvig
Yes, and it deserves to be pointed out, no?

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linsomniac
The link is a transcript of this NPR Planet Money podcast:
[https://www.npr.org/2019/10/18/771371881/episode-945-the-
lib...](https://www.npr.org/2019/10/18/771371881/episode-945-the-liberty-city)

TL;DR: A rural city was afraid of being taken over by San Antonio, they
decided to become a city to defend against this. They wanted to keep city
taxes low, and the plan was to attract big chains, to monetize the traffic on
the Interstate via sales taxes. None of the chains would build because there
was no sewer system. Residents generally feel the "liberty city" experiment is
failing them, but the guy behind it feels it is succeeding because they have
very low taxes. Now, however, they are starting to make money off speeding
tickets.

(from memory, listened to it yesterday or the day before)

I highly recommend Planet Money, it's one of my favorite podcasts.

~~~
HarryHirsch
They want to increase the revenue from speeding tickets from 60 kUSD to 250
kUSD. That sounds promising, wasn't there a town in North Florida that got
slapped with a consent decree because it relied on traffic fines as well for
revenue and went completely overboard with speed traps?

Farming motorists for revenue really does wonders for the perception of law
enforcement.

~~~
rhizome
Here's a recent dive into the problem:
[https://www.governing.com/topics/finance/gov-addicted-to-
fin...](https://www.governing.com/topics/finance/gov-addicted-to-fines.html)

------
Empact
I hope they eventually look into cooperatives for sewer/water/energy. They’re
a great way to manage larger projects on a consensual basis.

~~~
linsomniac
This is an interesting case because it is the city that benefits from having
the sewer (through sales tax revenue of attracting big stores), and the
individuals who'd be served by the cooperative already have septic systems. I
guess the individuals would indirectly benefit via the improved city services.

~~~
Empact
I would seek to bring in several new stores as the initial members, and borrow
against the agreed-upon future revenues. No city borrowing, efficient
infrastructure development, and if the project fails somehow the city has no
obligation to act.

