
The Imprisoner’s Dilemma - danso
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2020-07-22/as-virus-surges-so-do-calls-to-release-prisoners
======
zozin
The cynic in me assumes that state governments are using this crisis as an
opportunity to lower expenditures because of looming budget crises. Releasing
tens of thousands of prisoners without sufficient support into a flailing
economy is setting them up for failure.

~~~
pantaloony
Unfortunately “adequate support to help people reintegrate so going back to
crime isn’t their best option” looks a lot like “rewarding criminals” to a
good portion of the electorate. Maybe in part because social services in
general are so bad that anything at all looks like a lot of aid.

Dunno if it’s still the case but I at one point a tax guy asked me if I’d been
convicted of (IIRC) any drug offenses because if I had I’d have been
ineligible for certain education-related tax assistance. Dafuq? Yes let’s make
it _even harder_ for people to do something other than dealing drugs, when
they get out. That makes a ton of sense.

~~~
Vinnl
I recently tried to buy travel insurance. I had to check a box that I'd never
been suspected of criminal activities, _even if I was found to not be guilty_
(!), otherwise I wouldn't have been allowed to buy the insurance.

This was in the Netherlands, btw.

~~~
chias
Hi Vinnl! I hereby inform you that I suspect you have committed a crime at
some point.

Congratulations you are now ineligible >:]

~~~
lowdose
The ultimate free lunch in insurance.

------
granitDev
How about we legalize the drugs, because the drug war has helped exactly no
one, and release everyone convicted of a non-violent drug offense, AND wipe
the conviction from their record and offer them free educational assistance?
That would be a start, would probably get rid of half the prison population,
and would prevent a whole lot of future arrests, and would defund the gangs.

~~~
coldcode
I always said if Walmart/Amazon could sell Pot, crime would be cut in half.
The point is that "illegal" drugs still have people who want them, thus
economically someone will provide, and getting arrested is part of the cost,
and killing rivals part of the business. But if buying/selling/using is legal,
then supply goes to the whoever can do it the easiest/cheapest, which is
usually regular retailers. Thus arrests for these now legal drugs (like
Nicotine and Alcohol are) are limited to misuse (like DWI) and police can
focus on regular crime. Also enforcement of rules (don't sell to minors etc.)
can be managed easier since it's the retailers that are being managed.

~~~
SquishyPanda23
I'm a long-time fan of legalizing drugs, but it's not entirely an easy problem
to solve.

Eliminating the black market is good. Having huge corporations pushing drugs
is maybe not so good, or at least we should think through the consequences.

~~~
merpnderp
Exactly, we'd want to model it on successful systems. Like having drugs
dispensed at government facilities where users were offered counseling and
rehab, and an area specifically for getting high. We don't want there to be tv
advertisements for heroin or meth targeting kids (or anyone).

~~~
leetcrew
> Like having drugs dispensed at government facilities where users were
> offered counseling and rehab, and an area specifically for getting high.

I've read that this approach has been pretty successful where it's been tried.
the theory is that doing it in a controlled environment removes a lot of the
"fun" for the users so more of them eventually quit. additionally, it makes
the use of hard drugs less visible, so fewer people end up picking up the
habit.

I have to suspect that there's a point where you introduce too much friction
though. if it's too annoying to go to the government facility, it might become
tempting to just buy illegally. for instance, there is still a market for
bootleg cigarettes even though anyone 18/21 or older can buy them at any gas
station or convenience store. for some people it's worth buying them illegally
to either evade the tax or purchase less than a full pack at once. I've also
heard from my friends in CA that there is still a thriving illicit weed market
for similar reasons.

------
neonate
[https://archive.is/YkuAp](https://archive.is/YkuAp)

------
jojobas
The people advocating to release ~1 million violent criminals are least likely
to suffer at their hands. Hand on heart, nobody wants to leave next to a
convicted murderer or drug dealer.

Mass incarceration is a symptom, abolishing it is not a cure.

~~~
Sharlin
Drug dealer? Seriously? You mean those people who happened to sell a couple
joints worth of marijuana to a friend while black? Or those who just happened
to possess a bit too much to be considered "for personal use"?

~~~
Cthulhu_
Both you and the grandparent are making sweeping generalizations; as with
everything, there's various gradations in a crime and it's not a boolean
equation.

That said, I do agree that there's a large amount of people in prison that
shouldn't be there, and the US prison system ensures people stay or return to
prison later on.

~~~
Sharlin
I should probably have been clearer, but that was my point--the fact that
"drug dealer" is too broad a concept. Even though some dealers are definitely
career criminals, and some might _also_ commit violent crimes, lumping a large
majority of them in the same category as _murderers_ is what got you (and
other countries to varying degrees) into the whole mess in the first place. It
is rhetoric only meant to scare people and shut down thinking.

