

Austrialia censors 90% of web censorship plan to avoid "unnecessary debate" - mcantelon
http://www.smh.com.au/technology/technology-news/no-minister-90-of-web-snoop-document-censored-to-stop--premature-unnecessary-debate-20100722-10mxo.html

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zmmmmm
The meta-issues (how the plan is being negotiated and managed) are almost as
bad as the actual issue (censorship, privacy invasion) here. There are a lot
of people who _can_ come to terms with the idea that there is at least some
kind of content that might, in some circumstances, be worth blocking or
monitoring on the internet (I'm not saying this is my position). But not this
plan, not the way it is being done - zero transparency, zero accountability,
zero consultation, zero acknowledgement of real criticisms by honest well
intentioned people. If the government wants to do this then they need to be at
their _most_ open and transparent, their most considerate of well reasoned
objections.

~~~
peterwwillis
i love how they're openly stating it's confusing and controversial so they're
going to keep it secret so no one can object before it's completely finished.
this will become a barbara streisand pretty quick.

~~~
fungi
> they're

luv how "they" are a friken bureaucrat... like it's any of their business what
is and is not debated and discussed in democracy.

have spent many years in commonwealth and state bureaucracies and have never
heard anyone even entertain the idea that silencing debate (although in my
view that is often the point) would be used as the publicly stated reason for
censoring or denying an FOI.

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beilabs
I'm a European citizen, I've lived in China for a number of years behind the
"Great Firewall" which is easily circumvented.

The last thing I expected when I moved to Australia was to be behind the
"Great Barrier Firewall".

Not sure if many reading this realize that there is an election coming up in
the coming weeks, the current government probably does not want to give
ammunition to the opposition about this whole sordid affair.

Stephen Conroys office has spent an obscene amount on why he thinks the
Australian filter is a good thing. Any kind of back-down or debate on the
issue would just go against the current regime.

My only hope is that if the party goes back into power after August that this
firewall business will die a slow death.

~~~
dublinclontarf
Sorry you're mistaken, the Great Firewall of China USED to be easily
circumvented, now the only method is with a paid VPN connection (or a very
kind person to share their bandwidth).

Even Tor's been taken down.

~~~
beilabs
@DublinClontarf, yeah, I used to use TOR hosted on a private slice, but thats
also insecure. I'd use a paid VPN to buy pass it these days.

Btw, I used to live in Clontarf for quite a while..

~~~
dublinclontarf
Was it East point business park that you worked?

~~~
beilabs
Yeah, for about a year...then moved over here to Oz.

Catch me on twitter @beilabs

~~~
dublinclontarf
Yeah everyone who can is leaving, theres nothing happening there now(Ireland
not Oz, stayed in Oz for a couple of months with my aunt, great place, love
the poisonous animals). Will do.

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spamizbad
What is the Australian government's political rational behind implementing
this plan? I highly doubt Australia has a contingent of voters who demand
Internet censorship, and unlike China it's not like there's some sort of
regime that needs to purge unfriendly ideas from circulating. This whole
endeavor seems completely unnecessary. Any Australians know what the heck is
behind this?

~~~
lkjhgbvbhnjmk
It's a hung parliament with the balance of power held by a small group of
bible thumping right wingers. They wish to show to their voters that they are
doing something to fight the waves of terrorism and filth that are warping the
tiny minds of vunerable australian children.

And to distract anyone from finding out about their affairs, dodgy real estate
deals and child abuse.

~~~
brc
That is an entirely inaccurate description of Australian politics. Bible
thumping rarely appears in Australian political life. The current Prime
Minister is a declared aetheist, and they can get just about any laws through
with the support of the left-wing Green party.

~~~
lkjhgbvbhnjmk
The communications minister in charge of the filtering is a follower of the
famous Jewish zombie.

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jdub
Note that this document and story are actually about a recent EU-style data
retention proposal, not the internet filtering / web censorship policy (which
has been bumbling along for quite a while now).

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jakevoytko
The citizens of Australia should obviously skip straight to the Molotov
Cocktails to avoid more "unnecessary debate"!

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Gianteye
I often wonder what is at the heart of massive snooping/censorship schemes
like these. I'm still waiting on the data that supports a link between violent
media and violent people, sexually explicit pictures and acts of sexual
violence, and transparency sponsoring open debate leading to anarchy.

~~~
mkramlich
Exactly. I'm pretty sure Hitler had exposure to neither video games or the
Internet and yet look what he went on to do.

~~~
froo
Godwin's Law, never fails.

~~~
luke_f
Actually I was going to suggest Genghis Khan to circumvent Godwin.

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yewweitan
Well, as an Aussie myself, I'd certainly like to see this issue raised a
little more, especially with the election coming round on 21st Aug.

Let's hope movements like Election Wire <http://www.youtube.com/youthscape>
will change things.

~~~
jlcgull
Upvoted.

Seems like a positive way make dent on the incumbent censor-happy morons.

Good luck Australia!

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magma
I'm curious as to how the elections are going to change this policy. As
suggested in the thread, they are trying to keep things quiet until the
elections.

However what happens if the Labor party loses. Is the opposition going to
support this as well?

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luke_f
The filter can't be about anything other than shoring up political support.
Hopefully the incumbents pick up a few seats in the election and they'll be
able to drop the legislation.

We love to call politicians stupid, but they're not _that_ dumb. It's been
pointed out ad-nauseum that the filter wont achieve the stated purpose
(eradication of online child porn). The rationale has moved to making sure
kiddies don't 'stumble' upon the internet nasties.

More sensible legislation would be to mandate that ISPs offer filtered &
unfiltered connections. Individual households could then make their own
choices.

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sown
Who keeps making these rules?

~~~
fungi
the ALP.

the real question is who has their ear, for internet censorship i would say
it's the christian lobby, for this logging crap would say both state and
commonwealth law enforcement agencies (chiefly AFP???).

the latter certainly have form (e.g.
[http://www.theage.com.au/national/investigations/private-
spi...](http://www.theage.com.au/national/investigations/private-spies-hired-
by-police-20081125-6hh7.html))

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Yaa101
bye bye democracy, it was nice to have known you...

~~~
fungi
we get what we vote for. do something... anything... stand up for yourself.

~~~
Yaa101
We get to vote for either dictator 1, dictator 2 or dictator 3. There are no
democratic flavors left.

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jlcgull
Australia, is turning into an e-Tibet ... Get ready for millions of innocent
websites dying at the hands of OberFuhrer Robert McClelland.

Yeah, that statement may sound over-hyped today, but come talk to me a year
after that thing gets signed into law.

Aussies have gone soft, in the balls (they were already soft in the head --
which was the only good thing keeping democracy alive in Australia until now).

edit: an attempt at preventing godwin's law invocation and a visit from the
anti-defamation league. ;-)

~~~
tkahn6
I think you will understand how offensive and unnecessary your first statement
is after looking at this photo: [http://www.hollow-
hill.com/sabina/images/auschwitz-corpses.j...](http://www.hollow-
hill.com/sabina/images/auschwitz-corpses.jpg)

~~~
lkjhgbvbhnjmk
Yes Australians had the decency to slowly wipe out the indigenous people out
of sight over a century rather than being all teutonic and efficient about it.

~~~
phob
Yes, Americans had the decency to slowly wipe out the indigenous people...

