
Wil Wheaton: Yo Hollywood, Let Me Download Ubuntu - macco
http://wilwheaton.typepad.com/wwdnbackup/2012/05/an-example-of-the-usefulness-of-bittorrent-for-entirely-legal-purposes.html
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ender7
I just installed Diablo III, most of which was delivered to me via BitTorrent.
It worked pretty great.

In theory, Apple et al could also use BT to distribute movies, yes? Have
iTunes run a modified BT client that only connects to other approved clients?

~~~
MartinCron
I've often thought that Podcasts should be distributed over BitTorrent. Every
so often Ira Glass comes on the This American Life podcast and mentions that
it costs over $100K a year (or whatever) for just the bandwidth of hosting the
podcast.

 _This isn't to say that you shouldn't give directly to support your favorite
public radio shows and/or your local public radio station, naturally._

~~~
legulere
There are two problems with it:

First you have to create the possibility for the people to download your
podcast as a torrent. This sounds easy but is additional work. A new project
that wants to tackle this is <http://bitlove.org/> where podcasters just have
to add their regular feed and the site will create a bittorrent feed and seed
the torrents (extensive German descrpition:
<http://metaebene.me/2012/05/06/bitlove/>)

The other problem is that users need to be able to easily download the torrent
feeds. Some bittorrent clients support feeds, but right now only one podcast
client understands bittorrent: <http://http://www.getmiro.com/>

~~~
MartinCron
If Apple were to take a leadership role here, that would help. If iTunes on
desktop and mobile supported torrent downloads, the iTunes podcast directory
would seed or link to seeds, and if there was some sort of protocol for
pinging a centralized place to let content providers know how many times
something was downloaded.

------
snowwrestler
I think this is a bit of a straw man. Hasn't the FCC already made it clear
that blocking entire protocols is illegal?

And, I don't know that I can recall many content folks arguing that BitTorrent
as a whole should be blocked. My memory is that they complain that BitTorrent
is heavily used for piracy (which is factually accurate), and propose ways to
stop the piracy. For example SOPA did not target BitTorrent as a protocol or
technology, but instead tried to shut down foreign websites that provide links
to pirated content.

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whalesalad
The funny thing is, as far as I can tell, these are the _only_ two widespread
uses of BitTorrent.

1) Pirating movies, music, etc...

2) Downloading Linux distributions.

~~~
aphistic
More and more games are using it as a patching tool these days. Blizzard has
been using BitTorrent to distribute patches for years with WoW.

~~~
whalesalad
Indeed I have noticed this. I think it's great technology and more services
should be using it. The Blizzard case is a great example of it being used
pretty transparently/behind-the-scenes. I'd love to hear more non-transparent
cases though. I genuinely cannot think of a time i've used it aside from
stealing an album or grabbing debian.

~~~
cryptoz
> I genuinely cannot think of a time i've used it aside from stealing an album
> or grabbing debian.

It's definitely not stealing. I'm not sure what the preferred legal term for
"pirating" is right now, but it's something like "intellectual property
infringement". Stealing implies that you removed the original from the owner
and refuse to give it back. That is not the case.

~~~
stinkytaco
Every time someone makes this argument I feel like they're undermining the
point they are trying to make. You sound like a politician trying to couch his
corruption in some legal technicality ("depends on what the definition of "is"
is").

There are lots of reasons to look at the content industry and say "You are
screwing us over, taking our rights and laughing all the way to the bank while
you cry to our faces, you suck" but making up bullshit only makes you seem
like you’re pedaling it too.

Instead of buying it, you took it. That's basically stealing.

~~~
cryptoz
Wait a minute, slow down. There's a real difference, a big one that seriously
matters. I live in Canada. Stealing is a crime. You can face jail time, a
permanent criminal record, and be removed from society for a very long time if
you are found guilty of stealing.

 _None_ of that can happen to you if you pirate an album. Framing the issue to
make it sound like you can be a criminal facing time in jail for downloading
an album is absurd. It's very far removed from reality and builds a culture of
hatred and fear that is not actually present.

Stealing and pirating music are very different things. It's wrong to talk
about them as though they are the same. That's the only point I'm trying to
make.

Pirating digital content is wrong. It's an issue that urgently needs
attention. I'm not trying to justify the actions or call out in support of
pirates. I _am_ trying to make sure everyone knows that "stealing" has an
important legal definition that is irrelevant to pirating music.

~~~
stinkytaco
It's not the terminology _per se_ that is the issue, but insisting on
correcting everyone who uses it.

In the minds of everyone who is not in the group that makes that distinction
it sounds like you're trying to justify something. It's essentially
_identical_ to the argument college kids make to me all the time: "I'm not
stealing anything, I'm pirating it." Of course you are, but if I explained
this issue to, say, a Senator, they would say it's stealing. At that point,
yes, correct said Senator, then you're in a real discussion about a real
issue. Swooping in and correcting some guy who casually uses the term
"stealing" on an Internet form just grates on me because you sound like those
college kids trying to justify themselves.

~~~
moe
_but insisting on correcting everyone who uses it._

We correct you because you're using misleading terminology, as cryptoz
explained.

Language matters and it's hard to have a useful discussion when either side
keeps on falling back to prejudiced terminology.

~~~
freehunter
To take it to an extreme, it's like saying you murdered someone when you ran a
red light and hit their car. Yes, they died, but you're only really guilty of
involuntary manslaughter. Manslaughter gets you 5-10 years, murder gets you
life. Two sides of the same coin, maybe, but wildly differing laws,
punishment, and intent.

Stealing and pirating are both taking something that is not rightfully yours,
but they are barely in the same category of crime.

~~~
Drbble
Pirating is sharing something not rightfully yours, not taking. Making and
circulating copies is illegal, not receiving copies.

------
B-Con
> One of the things that drives me crazy is the belief in Hollywood that
> bittorrent exists solely for stealing things. Efforts to explain that this
> is not necessarily true are often met with hands clamped tightly over ears,
> accompanied by "I CAN'T HEAR YOU LA LA LA."

When has this actually happened? I don't know of anyone who has said that
bittorrent is inherently illegal, they've just argued that it's mostly used
for illegal activities. It's not that bars are illegal, it's that 80% of the
people in that bar meet to smuggle things on the black market. That invites
attention toward the medium.

It's a valid complaint. Bittorrent _is_ abused for piracy _a lot_. It's silly
to pretend otherwise. But this is a case where you can't shut down the medium
just because it's abused. In some cases it actually is a perfectly valid
solution, but this just isn't one of them.

I think that they might come to understand that, but I don't think they assume
bittorrent is itself illegal. They just see it as a medium for copyright
infringement. Who wouldn't at least consider attacking a widely abused medium?

------
throwaway54-762
What's faster than one mirror and works when bittorrent doesn't? Twenty
mirrors:

    
    
      aria2c --split=20 MIRROR1 MIRROR2 MIRROR3 MIRROR4 … MIRROR20

------
megaman821
Why do ISPs even bother try to shut down BitTorrent? It is not the protocol
that makes people share files. If file-sharers had to they would be sharing
files over SMTP. Instead the media companies and ISPs should be using
BitTorrent as a way to reduce their distribution costs.

~~~
nkassis
Because it's very bandwidth efficient. It will try to maximize the bandwidth
it has available to download and upload which ISP do not want. Sustained 100%
usage of your bandwidth is not what they optimize for.

At least that's what I think is their reasoning.

------
readme
Of course the people who wont listen to you are probably ignorant enough to
think that using free software is stealing the opportunity of a proprietary
software developer to make a sale.

------
radarsat1
It's too bad debtorrent hasn't taken off. It won't happen until it's made
available by default.

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rglover
I think Hollywood should try one of the following:

1.) Limited, free, online streaming of films (a la NPR doing previews of new
music releases).

2.) Seed torrents of films that are heavily advertised. Essentially, give
consumers the whole film, but overlay ads during it or edit in commercial
breaks.

3.) Post the first :30 minutes of new films as torrents/streaming and offer a
few bucks off your movie ticket if you check it out in theaters.

Any of these could easily be attempted for a new major release. Pick a film
that's almost guaranteed to be a hit and try one of the above. You're bound to
get some interesting data either way.

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todd3834
Ubuntu is the only thing I ever use BitTorrent for and I'm so happy BitTorrent
exists when I need to download Ubuntu

------
mcos
I've always thought that using some sort of internal torrent mechanism would
be a good way for applications to download their updates, especially something
like Chrome, which updates quite frequently.

------
yalooze
Bittorrent integration with Steam would be a godsend on release days.
Obviously they would need to consider those users whose uploads count towards
their limit, but still.

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mjwalshe
No one _realy_ needs to use bit torrent to download distros I must have built
10 od machines from distros in the last 9 months - just dowload the net
isntall (which is tiny) and do it that way

Will is clutching at straws here

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gcb
you just made their case against bittorrent easier!

Ubuntu have a bittorrent client, and everyone knows that's only used to pirate
movies and music! so it's a facilitator.

------
paulhauggis
Yo liberals, let me go hunting with an AK-47.

~~~
sp332
An AK is an assault rifle, not so good for hunting. A nice Remington 700 will
do you better. But if you really want to... who's stopping you?

~~~
nfriedly
It is illegal in at least some parts of the USA... still not sure how it's
related to bit torrent and Linux though.

~~~
jack-r-abbit
I believe they are trying to compare the argument for not blocking BitTorrent
to an argument for less gun control.

Argument A: While BitTorrent is widely used for piracy, it has practical uses
too so please don't ban it outright.

Argument B: While the AK-47 is widely used for mass shootings, it has
practical uses too so please don't ban it outright.

Argument X: While [some thing] is widely used for [some bad stuff], it has
practical uses too so please don't ban it outright.

But as others have pointed out, the AK-47 is not a suitable hunting weapon...
unless you plan to totally mess up the deer.

~~~
subway
Totally mess up the deer? I'm not sure how you've come to that conclusion.

An AK-47 fires a 7.62x39mm round, which is smaller than rounds like a .30-30
(7.62x51) or .30-06 (7.62x63), commonly used for deer hunting.

And as I mentioned in another comment, while an AK-47 is not an ideal rifle
for hunting, it is a very cost effective choice.

~~~
jack-r-abbit
The AK-47 is capable of getting out more rounds in less time than a
traditional hunting rifle. So you'd be able to shoot the crap out of something
a bit easier. So if that was your plan then the AK-47 is ideal. Otherwise...
not so much. That was all.

~~~
subway
You do realize the vast majority of AK-47s (at least those available in the US
for less than $10k) are semi-automatic, right?

~~~
jack-r-abbit
Doesn't matter. Parent post made no mention of what type of AK-47 they were
using and where. The fact remains, AK-47s can be full-auto thus are capable of
putting out more rounds faster. If you would like to go with the assumption
that the parent post was referring to only a semi-auto AK-47 (in the US?) then
we can certainly agree that it would not mess up a deer any more or less than
a traditional hunting rifle. I'm cool with that. ;)

~~~
maxerickson
A typical AK-47 is select fire. So someone hunting deer with a fully automatic
capable AK-47 would likely set it to semi-automatic.

