
'Acoustic attack' report on US diplomats in Cuba is flawed, neurologists say - pmoriarty
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/aug/14/cuban-acoustic-attack-report-on-us-diplomats-flawed-say-neurologists
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MsMowz
Let's just consider this for a second from a political standpoint. What does
Cuba have to gain from sabotaging the improving relations with the United
States? The embargo is still a huge, huge burden for them, and they have no
major allies (a la the USSR). Why would the Cuban government do this?

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carloscarnero
Cuban here (and actually living in Cuba, if that's even important or
relevant.) This whole thing was puzzling for me from the get go, as I never
thought our government could do something like this. If they wanted to freeze
back relations, it would be simpler to just say "F __* off! " (and believe me,
they can dream up a thousand somewhat-plausible explanations for that
decision.)

It doesn't make sense from an Intelligence o Intelligence Gathering point of
view. They have cheaper and better ways (like... actual people?), so I don't
think that this wasn't some kind of (Cuban) intelligence equipment
malfunction. Plus, from the reports it seems that the presumed attacks were
taking place on diplomatic personnel residences and hotel rooms. In that
environment the attackers do not have much control: what if there's an asset
there? what if there's a child?

But what really makes me to think that this was not a Cuban operation or
attack, is that Canadian personnel were also reported to be affected. That's a
big huge no-no.

Since this whole thing was interesting for me, I have asked several people on
their opinions. People from all walks of life and political leanings. Most of
them just told me that they did not think it was Cuban behind the attacks, if
there were attacks at all. The more cautious just waved off with "We need more
information." Not one person, no matter where they stand, thinks we actually
did this.

(Sorry for my English.)

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ribble
who says it was the cuban government?

could've been any government's agency that had infiltrated cuba.

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Pyxl101
This is the first article in which I’ve heard the sonic attacks described as
the buffering of an open car window.

In one car that I owned, if I opened one of the rear windows while driving on
the freeway, the buffeting was so “loud” as to be almost painful to everyone
in the car. It wasn’t exactly normal sound so much as some kind of oscillating
pressure wave.

If diplomats are describing the sonic attack in terms of a buffeting car
window then that raises the chance in my mind that these really were sonic or
pressure attacks of some kind. I’ve never heard anything produce sound like
that naturally.

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Digit-Al
I have suffered from tinnitus (which is thankfully clearing up as my ear
heals) and I have experienced such sounds. Not the actual pressure waves, but
noises in the ear which emulate such noises to a certain extent.

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ObsoleteNerd
I've had severe tinnitus for over a decade, and know exactly what you're
talking about. It's not just an audio tone, but I very much get these
"pressure" feelings inside my skull that line up with the audio tone getting
louder at times (the perceived volume of my tinnitus tone gets louder and
softer depending on the day, tiredness, weather, etc).

I don't know how this could possible be related, as I've never heard of groups
of people getting sudden tinnitus together, but I do agree with you that the
explanation sounds similar to what I experience.

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Digit-Al
I wasn't suggesting that they all had tinnitus. The parent comment mentioned
not hearing of anything natural that could cause such a buffering effect. I
was pointing out there are natural phenomena that can cause such effects.

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marcoperaza
It’s always good to have more analysis and disagreement. But I’m not going to
take the word of a few critics—who have never examined the victims—as
disproving the thorough work of the excellent doctors at UPenn—who did. The
next step would be to wait for those doctors to respond to the criticisms of
their methodology and take it from there. It looks like they are in the
process of doing that, so I’m looking forward to it.

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geomark
I read a story, wish I could find the link but can't, that at the same time as
these "attacks" were appearing there was an ongoing special program at the CIA
involving agents taking some kind of experimental nootropic. I guess the idea
was to create some kind of super agents. The story suggested a link to the
reported attacks, that the symptoms were actually an unintended result of the
nootropics. I see no mention of that theory in the comments here. Anyone else
see that story?

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theyinwhy
Noise levels are easily measured. Apparently, no one measured noise levels on
site.

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basicplus2
In my view the symtoms match very well with the symptoms of microwaves..

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erentz
> explanations such as mass psychogenic illness

Rheumatoid arthritis used to be a psychogenic illness. Parkinson’s. MS. Etc.
It seems most psychogenic illnesses over time prove to be real. Doctors need
to stop using this as a crutch when they can’t explain something, it’s
harmful. Just say “we don’t know, this doesn’t make sense to us based on what
we know at this time.”

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Angostura
> It seems most psychogenic illnesses over time prove to be real

Does it? Really? Should I be worried about Korean fan-death?

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abenedic
You can be dismissive of fan-death, but please know that the people who
believe in it do so more out of national identity than reason. I have met many
very smart lovely people who believed in it. Think of it more as regional
pride in local barbecue than an actual belief. That said South Korea is far
too hot in the summer to have a fan shut off automatically.

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tomjakubowski
Could one compare it to the continued use of imperial units in the UK/US?

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zdragnar
Imperial units are used because they're generally easier to relate to and use
than the metric counterparts- simpler divisors, that sort of thing. It's the
same reason we have 24 hours, 60 minutes, 60 seconds.

Even if you don't agree with that statement, it's what people who prefer
imperial units will say, not that there's some mass delusion / patriotic
identity.

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sparkzilla
Obligatory Hawkwind reference:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a8pGS4cWbHo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a8pGS4cWbHo)

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ggm
Canada and USA both in five eyes. If Australia New Zealand and UK Diplo say
they have the same symptoms I'm going to go with malfunction in five eyes
equipment.

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anoncoward111
The tinfoil conspiracy theory is that this is the 2018 version of the Anglos
manufacturing another Spanish American War type of situation.

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jaclaz
>“Functional neurological disorders are common genuine disorders that can
affect anyone, including hardworking diplomatic staff,” the doctors wrote.

Isn't "hard-working diplomatic staff" an oximoron?

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antpls
Would a device from space, like a satellite, be able to produce this attack
remotely anywhere on Earth?

