

TSA complaints are getting absurd - wohladki

It&#x27;s ridiculous the amount of people complaining about TSA on a regular basis. Yes you have to get to an airport early and submit to some waiting in line and checking of luggage. Guess what? Seems totally reasonable if it reduces the chances of letting someone dangerous on a plane with you. You wait in line for hours for a lot of ridiculous things like black friday shopping, a particularly crowded fast food joint, buying the latest and greatest iPhone (or other tech gadget). Waiting in line a little bit longer just to make the plane more safe than not is NOT A BAD DEAL! As for the privacy issue, yes it does suck to be patted down or have to walk through a body scan. But honestly, grow a pair and just walk through the damn thing. I have never felt harassed by a TSA agent and I&#x27;ve had the &quot;lovely&quot; experience of both a body scan and a pat-down... They are professional, do their job, and send you on your way. Doesn&#x27;t take long, no one gets any pervy pleasure out of the experience, and the 2 whole minutes is not a huge inconvenience to my day. Plus, i&#x27;m a lot easier to racially profile than the lot of you complaining about the TSA and am pretty positive you don&#x27;t have to put up with as much checking as I have.<p>And for the people making arguments about whether TSA checks actually reduce threats on a plane or just substitute them with other non-plane threats, I fail to see how just letting someone buy a ticket and walk onto a plane would be a positive change. Letting any Tom, Dick, or Harry on a plane with no safety measures would increase risk of random violence on a plane, fire arms&#x2F;weapons on a plane, hijackings, etc. I would rather spend some time inconvenienced in a TSA security check 100&#x2F;100 times than spend time on a hijacked flight 1&#x2F;100 times (numbers are used to make a point, not depict an accurate probability of occurrence). I&#x27;m sure many of you would agree...
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mrjatx
Have you ever had an ACTUAL issue with a TSA agent, not simple
search/bodyscans?

Earlier this year I had a planned vacation and unfortunately lost (stolen
wallet) my drivers license prior to the flight. I had enough time to goto my
License office to request a temporary which here in Texas means you get a
paper ID with your picture on it for 3-5 weeks until the new license arrives.

So I showed up with my paper ID and all I had to do was fly from Austin to
Miami. I knew the paper ID would get scoffed at but assumed they were well
trained in the various temporary/permanent IDs that states provide for
emergencies. Ha! I decided to bring my birth certificate, social security
card, and a utility bill (my passports expired, else that would have been
logical) in the event that TSA had a problem with the paper ID. Figured I'd go
prepared.

Well, lo and behold every single TSA agent outside of Texas not only grilled
me about the paper ID, they didn't care at all about the fact that I also had
the other items (birth cert, ss card, util bills). Because I had a temporary
ID I was pulled out of every line, called a "No ID" (this became so frequent
that I eventually wound up walking up to every agent and stating "Hi, I'm a no
ID, here's my paperwork"), privately searched over and over and in two cases
missed my flight that I'd arrived 2-4 hours early for. These were FTL to
Austin flights that evidently only happen once or twice a day with the carrier
I had my ticket through (Jetblue I think). I wound up in Miami an extra two
days and basically lived at the airport at that point. I ALMOST missed my
cruise completely, luckily the bulk of my issues were getting BACK home after
it.

It took that much time for them to decide that I was who I said I am. I would
get bounced from agent to agent, each who would personally search me, the one
step below strip search search- not the pat on the back type. They'd offer to
do a private search (meaning in the security room) but after mutiple searches
in one-two hours I just said screw it, do it here in front of everyone and get
it over with. Then I'd have to wait for a superior to come out and decide
whether or not I was legally allowed to pass. The most amazing thing to me was
that every single TSA agent seemed like they had NEVER, EVER dealt with a
temporary ID before. Like I was this black plague that wasn't covered in their
rule book at any point in time, or they were told that, my god, if somebody
ever shows up with a temporary ID they are CLEARLY up to something.

Prior army, raised on Army bases all over the world, I've never felt like such
a non-citizen in my life. I have the utmost sympathy for people who are
systematically treated poorly by the TSA due to their attire/skin color.

I do absolutely everything I can to NOT fly nowadays. I also do not wait in
line during Black Friday nor do I wait in line for a fast food restaurant.
Those are pretty weak assumptions.

I went on a cruise and the Customs officers had absolutely no issue with my
temporary license and documentation.

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headShrinker
Your justifications are misguided or just plan wrong for every reason of TSA
existence and performance. You assume they are necessary. You assume they do a
good job protecting us. You assume they are professional. You assume body
imaging and body searches are not a bad deal. There is no evidence to prove
this, and there is plenty of evidence to prove the opposite.

> but honestly, grow a pair and walk through the damn thing.

It takes pair to not walk through. You seem to be confused about that.

Furthermore, I will never walk through your full body scanner for these
reasons:

1) They have not been studied and properly tested medically over a mid to long
time period. We have the word of the company who created them, telling us they
are “safe”. You know what else was “safe” said the manufacture? Asbestos, DDT,
mercury, X-rays, etc. Millimeter scanners are shooting high energy particles a
the body’s dermis. High energy causes DNA replication issues.

2) These machines are medical imaging devices being implemented by high school
educated people.

3) These machines can be fooled. Pancake devices slip through undetected.

4) These machines DO NOT detect PETN. I will say that again, they do not
detect plastic explosives! This makes them useless and trivial.

5) We have the right to travel, unsearched, unless there is just cause. Times
have changed from when the Bill Of Rights was written, thus the advent of
metal detectors and bomb sniffing K9s. When we talk about “the slippery slope”
these machines are about as far as you get before for things get out of
control, ei: suspension of meranda-rights, torture, warrent-less wire-taps,
militarization of local police, etc.

No, I will not pass through your body scanner, EVER! I will protest their
existence forever in the form a polite “Opt Out” and a silent but complete
disrespect for the TSA. They institute insulting useless security theater and
I am not amused or fooled.

You should educate yourself about all the ways the government is invading your
privacy, and where governments go from there. Then grow a pair and start to
fight back.

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drstewart
I opt out of the body scanner every time but I find your mentality towards the
TSA somewhat childish to be honest. I find it analogous to people who belittle
and scream at fast food workers as if they're beneath them. You are not better
than someone because they have a high school education.

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headShrinker
I never insinuated that I was better than a high school education. I
insinuated that someone operating medical imaging equipment should have some
credentials in the medical field. I have a distrust and dislike for anyone who
compromises my civil rights.

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mkautzm
Except death due to terrorist activity is so, so low, as to be virtually
unmeasurable. We have better statistics about death's caused by lightning
strikes than we do about death's caused by terrorist activity.

If the TSA was needed, I'd probably be a lot more acceptable, but at the end
of the day, there is no evidence that suggests they stop terrorists attacks
and there is no evidence that they make flights safer.

~~~
wohladki
I think people are losing a basic grasp of safety precautions in favor of the
immediate gratification of easier travel. If we didn't have any checks at all,
it would be far easier to disrupt flights and more likely than not increase
dangerous occurrences. If TSA is an ineffective means of instituting these
safety precautions, then let's propose an alternative solution. Would be much
more productive than endlessly harping about how much TSA sucks.

~~~
jcape
The phrase to describe this view is "false dichotomy": the answer is either
someone sticks their fingers in my pants or taxis are allowed to drop people
off at the stairs to the plane, 1950s style. There are shades of gray, and
complaints about the TSA tend to take the form of "you are nearly black to no
effect." I should also note that your language about "if the TSA is an
effective means of instituting these safety precautions" is pure question
begging. As though the only way to ensure security of travellers is to
(effectively) strip search them all, but maybe if the TSA had an IG they would
get around to deciding that nail clippers are not a problem sooner. Or perhaps
the Bureau of Prisons would be better trained to handle airport security.

Regarding proposing solutions, Bruce Schneier, who was describing TSA efforts
as "security theater" at least 5 years ago, is perhaps among the most famous:
he's been on 60 Minutes over the issue, publicly debated the former head of
the TSA, and testified before Congress as to what measures real security would
entail. Just last week there was a humorously worded rant about the TSA's
stunning lack of competence by the former head of Israeli airport security,
Rafi Sela.

It's also worth noting that the biggest objectively measurable improvement to
travellers' security is the change in attitude of travellers themselves. The
belief of passengers that they will be flown to Cuba and a release negotiated
was dispelled even before 9/11 was over. These days, when someone tries to
light their shoes on fire, passengers can be reliably counted upon to beat
them down. Literally.

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Segmentation
I read an insightful comment on Reddit regarding yesterday's Russia train
station bombings. It went something like "Because of the long lines due to
slow security screening, terrorists are opting to target the long lines at
airports or train stations instead of targeting the planes."

So, yea, TSA isn't going to fix that unless you have screening before the
screening, and then you just have another line.

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pedalpete
Look at the history of hijackings in the US
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_aircraft_hijackings](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_aircraft_hijackings).
I was surprised to see that over time, the number of hijackings has been
fairly flat through the 90s and the 00s, while there was a considerable drop
from the high level of the 70s and 80s.

I don't think anybody is suggesting getting rid of airport security all
together, but rather that we be smart about it. The current system is too
invasive and annoying without providing any more protection than the old
system.

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a3n
It would probably be more effective to spend that money on preventing deaths
from heart disease or cancer. Who gives a shit about "terrorism" except that
it causes loss of life and economic disruption. The two things I mentioned
cause much greater, measurable, and more disruptive loss of life than
terrorism ever will. In fact the thing that is supposed to prevent terrorism,
the TSA and its practices, is much more disruptive than the almost
immeasurable increase in aircraft crime that would result. Based on how much
there was before the TSA.

