
Work Shorter Hours in Winter - nbrempel
https://www.wired.com/story/science-explains-why-we-should-work-shorter-hours-winter/
======
danielovichdk
The peasant's free time extended beyond officially sanctioned holidays. There
is considerable evidence of what economists call the backward-bending supply
curve of labor -- the idea that when wages rise, workers supply less labor.
During one period of unusually high wages (the late fourteenth century), many
laborers refused to work "by the year or the half year or by any of the usual
terms but only by the day." And they worked only as many days as were
necessary to earn their customary income -- which in this case amounted to
about 120 days a year, for a probable total of only 1,440 hours annually (this
estimate assumes a 12-hour day because the days worked were probably during
spring, summer and fall). A thirteenth-century estime finds that whole peasant
families did not put in more than 150 days per year on their land. Manorial
records from fourteenth-century England indicate an extremely short working
year -- 175 days -- for servile laborers. Later evidence for farmer-miners, a
group with control over their worktime, indicates they worked only 180 days a
year.

~~~
WarDores
I'd love to see the source for this. I'm interested in early labor
arrangements.

~~~
starpilot
[http://groups.csail.mit.edu/mac/users/rauch/worktime/hours_w...](http://groups.csail.mit.edu/mac/users/rauch/worktime/hours_workweek.html)
is the source of GP.

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16656903](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16656903)

If you search for "medieval peasant" on HN, we've had various articles along
these lines over the years.

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remarkEon
I've been altering my sleep schedule the past couple years to be more in sync
with the seasons (more in the winter less in the summer, essentially). This
was the first year in a while that work got in the way of that in the winter
and it has been _miserable_. My lifting/workout schedule is out of wack again,
and my diet isn't as good (more cravings for bad stuff). Usually I can dial it
down during November/December because of the Thanksgiving and Christmas
holiday but I work in a more "global" role now and can't really do that
anymore. Definitely considering moving on to something else soon.

Can't emphasize the sleep timing thing enough. It's been a game changer,
especially in the summer. Productivity through the roof and I am generally in
great shape July - September.

~~~
ck425
Does this mean you sleep less in Summer? And what latitude do you stay in? I
imagine this would be more difficult in Scotland where in winter there's only
7 hours of sunlight but in summer there's over 16 hours of sun.

~~~
remarkEon
Yes, closer to ~7 hours in the summer. 8 to 8.5 in the winter. I'm at ~47" N.

~~~
lb1lf
Here at 63N that is a bit more challenging. Sunrise today was at 10:05, sunset
at 15:05.

(In six months it rises at 03:40 and sets at 23:36)

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DanielleMolloy
I’m more effective and more detail-oriented in dark, cold winter months. If
there is bright sunlight outside I get distracted because I want to go for a
bike ride, and above 25C I’m just less effective.

Daylight lamps sometimes triggered headaches for me.

Probably I should move north.

~~~
unglaublich
Just take a few hours off during lunch. Go for that bike-ride. Tire your body,
free your brain.

That (with few exceptions) is what keeps me going and happy for years now.

Job's that don't allow me this little bit of flexibility, are just not my kind
jobs.

What's a big happy purse with a sad person to wear it?

~~~
rhn_mk1
Summer cycles can easily stretch into a few hours. That's a significant amount
of time out of the workday already, and they leave the mind thinking about
personal stuff as often as about work. Much as this is a nice freedom, it
doesn't come for free, even in taking into account the difficult problems
worked out while working out.

~~~
jschwartzi
If the personal stuff is hampering work stuff, then perhaps it should be a
priority for a while, no?

~~~
rhn_mk1
You're surely on to something, but then scope creep (of personal stuff) would
put some people out of work :) Otherwise, crap jobs exist for a reason, and
not everyone can afford what's optimal for them.

------
pts_
Overall work culture needs a massive thrust to change from a face to face
politicking culture to an efficient, asynchronous, remote culture, especially
in these times of extreme weather, considering more than a few workplaces had
to switch to remote due to weather exigencies (but they promptly switched back
when employee pushback relaxed).

------
zitterbewegung
For three weeks this month I either have 3 day weekends or a significant part
of the week as time off. It has made me much happier

~~~
nbrempel
Nice! Do you mind me asking what that looks like? Are you an employee or do
you set it up as a contractor?

I'm curious since I'm building
[https://30hourjobs.com](https://30hourjobs.com) and I'm always looking for
new resources and companies that support this.

~~~
techbio
Too much of a good thing? Couldn’t find a search bar to narrow down jobs to my
preferred locations.

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hirundo
At some threshold of productivity difference it becomes cost effective to move
employees to the antipodes for a season each year.

~~~
A_Parr
Could just move them to the equator once.

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firethief
Is it good for us to need more sleep in winter, or just lost time? Because we
can fight this with bright lights and other means of advancing the circadian
clock (anything that works for SAD).

~~~
luckydata
"hacking" your body is recipe for doing damage. Just relax and do what
evolution has built you to do, sleep a little more and get ready for spring.

~~~
firethief
That settles it, I'm throwing away my eyeglasses and not doing anything a bear
wouldn't do.

~~~
luckydata
Flippant retort that completely misses the spirit and the substance of my
comment. If you think there’s a way to safely “hack” your body to somehow undo
evolution be my guest. As a culture with a proud tradition of ignoring nature
and fucking ourselves up, we should rethink our approach to our bodies and
health. If your body asks you for some rest, your first instinct shouldn’t be
“what kind of meds can I take to avoid resting”, should be “how can I change
my lifestyle so I can rest a little more.

~~~
firethief
When I asked the original question, I was looking for more than a poll; I was
hoping someone had some insight into which of the two views to go with here
(i.e. whether the evolutionary reasons for the sleepier-in-winter phenomenon
are still applicable today or not). You've made it clear which side you're on,
without any substantive argument yet. In hopes of eliciting one, I'll play
devil's advocate.

Food has always been scarcest in winter. The smart move is to invest less when
risk/reward is poorer. A straightforward way for mammals to do that is to
conserve energy by sleeping more in the winter. So, there's a reason I'd
expect mammals to have evolved to sleep more when there's less light, but this
reason is no longer applicable in modern societies. Right?

~~~
luckydata
That's somewhat pointless. You have an extremely complex system of hormones
and circadian cycles that might have evolved for obsolete reasons, but you're
still bound by it. It might be intellectually interesting to understand why
(necessary even) but you're still better off avoiding the urge to "hack it".

