
Windows 10 is making too many PCs obsolete - imartin2k
http://www.computerworld.com/article/3209977/microsoft-windows/windows-10-is-making-too-many-pcs-obsolete.html
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PaulHoule
Blame Intel more than Microsoft for this one.

Intel has been turning out Atom chips and machines based on Atom that are
purposefully crippled in various ways. For instance I had a Netbook that had a
crummy screen (too small to run some programs that expect a larger screen) and
would let you plug in a VGA monitor, but not run in a dual-monitor mode. You
could plug it into a monitor, keyboard, and mouse and use it as a mini-
desktop, but it would not boot unless you unfolded the machine first, etc.

In the case of "Clover Trail", Intel packaged a PowerVR GPU instead of an
Intel GPU and their contract with Imagination didn't come with continued
support to update drivers.

On the other hand, WDDM drivers have been pretty stable since Vista so why
exactly Win 10 Creators Edition needs updated drivers is an interesting
question.

Unlike the ARM ecosystem, Intel makes a very limited number of SKUs (and can
afford to spend much more developing each SKU, thus get higher performance)
and those SKUs themselves are frequently variations of the same die where
various features are artificially fused off.

On some sense "pay for the features you use" makes sense, but on another
level, it's anti-consumer behavior.

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strictnein
At this point, I wonder why Intel doesn't buy Imagination.

~~~
PaulHoule
Intel makes it's own GPUs now. (Barely) good enough GPUs that mainstream users
don't feel the need for a discrete GPU; this might have starved NVIDIA for
business if it wasn't for the "Deep Learning" boom. That doesn't stop Intel
from starving their platforms of PCIe lanes to limit the usefulness of
discrete graphics.

~~~
strictnein
Oh, I know, just thinking from a patent, acquihire perspective. Imagination is
for sale, at one would assume a bargain price, after losing Apple as a
customer.

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aylmao
You got to give this to Apple, wether you consider their computers overpriced
or not; their newest OS is still officially supported by computers going back
to 2009. That's 8 years, and 8 major OS releases.

There are certainly many more moving pieces in the Windows realm though,
simply considering how backwards compatible Windows tends to be, how much it
has changed in the past few years and how many different systems it runs on.
I'm very curious to know what the reasons behind Windows CU's incompatibility
are.

~~~
betaby
On other side update iphone 4s (2011) to ios 8 (2014) makes it horribly slow,
while technically still 'works'.

~~~
ksk
Its even worse than that. Apple blocks you from going back to the older
version of the OS. I had to literally throw away my 4s, (it was working fine
otherwise) because it had become unusable for me after updating the OS.

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quaffapint
I'm still running an 8 yr old PC with an Intel Core2 that continues to be
supported by Windows 10 and all its updates. I would say it's more chip based
than MS fault.

~~~
lostmsu
According to wiki, processor in my wife's PC is from 2009. Windows 10 runs on
it no problem.

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astrowilliam
A machine from 2013 is older, it's slower, the hardware has seen better days
and there are features built into a modern OS that just won't work with a chip
set that the user bought from Best Buy at the bargain rack.

We all wanted Windows and MS to push computing forward for the longest time
and now that they actually are, people are bitching about it. Not because it's
bad for business, it's bad for them personally and anecdotally. Go figure.

This article seems like a rant and not supported by data.

~~~
ivanbakel
And yet none of those things will totally preclude it from running a modern
OS. I've got a CPU and motherboard in my desktop from 2012, and it's never
been taxed enough to make me upgrade. What features does Windows 10 have that
require a chipset upgrade?

~~~
astrowilliam
If it runs fine with its current OS and hardware, there's no need to upgrade.
Keep your current OS, your current hardware and you're fine. It's not
Microsofts duty to support very old hardware.

~~~
YawningAngel
Actually it is, Windows 10 is supported until 2020 and I think it's entirely
reasonable to expect all Win10 hardware to be updateable until then as MS very
clearly say the OS is not supported without all updates installed. Cf
support.microsoft.com/en-gb/help/13853/windows-lifecycle-fact-sheet

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xena
I think this might be related to the fact that the GPU used in those machines
is normally a smartphone GPU and it's a bit of a pain to support.

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lousken
I don't get how - if MS will give them support until 2023 then it means 10yrs
support which for those low end PCs is enough. And if somebody wants to use it
after that date - LXDE/XFCE might be better anyway for this type of HW.

~~~
undersuit
It is better. I bought an Intel Compute Stick when they first came out. Used
Windows 8 on it just long enough for someone, Ian
Morrison([http://www.linuxium.com.au/](http://www.linuxium.com.au/)), to get
the Linux version on the internet. Besides some occasional wireless issues,
mostly Bluetooth now, Lubuntu 17.04 works great. I use it on vacations all the
time just plug it into the hotel TV and load up Netflix and wait for the
buffering to finish over the overloaded hotel Wifi.

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Analemma_
I'd like to see discussion about this on the front page, but I'd prefer
articles with more substance. This is just a rant.

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bitL
Did the graphics driver ABI change in Win 10? If not, what's the problem? So
if Intel is not willing to support PowerVR GPU, we still have old tested
driver that works under Win 10, right? So it's more about MS' willingness to
test newer versions of Win 10 for compatibility with last Clover Trail
drivers. They can probably dedicate 5 people to do that without experiencing
significant dent to their revenue and the one employee/multiple revenue
streams philosophy they adhere to, right?

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mmphosis
LXDE

~~~
nthcolumn
Doesn't even have to be light. Gnome and/or KDE will run happily on any PC -
they are monsters for goodness sakes! Totally OP for most distros. A lot of
the early linux adoption compatibilty issues (winmodems stole too much of my
youth) are gone now. Everything just works. Just wipe Windows.

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zython
In other words Windows 10 is making itself obsolete.

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mobiletelephone
Linux is a better fit for netbooks anyway.

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Phenomabomb
I'm a bit confused by the author's position here.

They complain about MS "forcing" Win10 down their throat, and then again about
them not supporting Clover Trail and so not being able to force Creators down
their throat.

It all feels a bit incoherent to me. I mean sure we all love a good incoherent
rant about how Microsoft are the devil, but I really do have to question why
some people are so fanatically anti-Microsoft, and yet somehow still end up
owning Microsoft devices.

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mtgx
First with the Skylake CPUs only being supported on Windows 10, now with these
Atoms not being supported anymore. That makes two.

Strike three and you're out, Microsoft! And I mean if this happens again soon,
it should be clear to everyone that Microsoft is indeed abandoning hardware at
a much faster rate with Windows 10.

~~~
gorkonsine
I fail to see the problem. If you don't like Windows, don't use it. They're
under no obligation to support whatever hardware you want to use. In reality,
people are going to do whatever it takes to keep using Windows, and if that
means having to run out and buy brand-new hardware to do so, that's what
people will do. Microsoft could restrict Windows to a small number of
allowable systems and customers will happily toss their old stuff in the trash
and buy these approved systems just to keep using Windows.

~~~
abiox
i have nearly 2000 games in my Steam account. i'll stick with windows for
that.

~~~
gorkonsine
That's fine, just don't complain about it then.

~~~
abiox
hmm.... but why?

