
How We Designed the Librem 5 Dev Kit with Free Software - aquabeagle
https://puri.sm/posts/how-we-designed-the-librem-5-dev-kit-with-100-free-software/
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AdmiralAsshat
A mini-HDMI port seems like an odd choice. Considering most people who might
use it will probably have to buy some kind of adaptor anyway, it seems like it
would've been easier just to require a USB-C to HDMI adaptor and leverage the
MHL Alternative Mode spec.[0] That, in my mind, would be preferable to adding
another port that hardly anyone will use to the phone. Pretty much every
smartphone/tablet I've ever owned supported some form of MHL, even when most
of them only had MicroUSB.

[0][https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_High-
Definition_Link#US...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_High-
Definition_Link#USB_Type-C_\(MHL_Alternate_Mode\))

~~~
kgwxd
I wish they'd just drop the idea of external monitor support. We desperately
need an open phone in our pockets. Everyone keeps trying to make an all-
purpose device and the gimmick features keep holding the projects back and
killing them. Just make a thing that supports the built-in screen, can handle
calls/text, and that's it. I'll buy it, for a lot of money. Increment from
there.

~~~
chrisseaton
> can handle calls/text, and that's it

The number of people who just want a phone to call and text is I'd imagine
vanishingly small now. It won't replace anyone's proprietary smartphone like
that.

~~~
ploxiln
True, but good video drivers, and good calls/texts, are often the very hardest
parts for an open-source phone project. The rest _can_ be improved later, by
community contributors even.

Historically the case has often been "well it can do wifi and browse the web,
has some built-in chat apps, it's just a bit slow to scroll around, cellular
data kinda works sometimes ... not worth trying to call with it, maybe next
rev will have better modem support". Without calls and texts you really need
another phone, so the project never gets a big enough community.

~~~
voltagex_
It's got a low res screen and a slower processor than 2018 phones, and it
costs $700 US - I don't think it's going to get a big community.

I owned an OpenMoko and a N900, too - but sometimes you just need to get stuff
done.

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Maskawanian
Once this is shipped as a real product, with reviews that it is functional and
doesn't require tinkering constantly. I will drop money on it. I'm getting
excited!

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caffed
Anybody remember Openmoko? Ubuntu Edge?

It's a great and noble idea, but really hard to pull off.

Also, there's no final specs for the Librem 5 yet they have a 4/2019 ship
date. Sure... Hats off to them if that actually happens.

Does anyone have a Librem dev kit? Thoughts?

I like the Linux distro + e2e encryption support and would consider this in
the future when they ship.

~~~
hawski
Am I the only one more excited about Librem 5 than about previous efforts at
the time? When Openmoko shipped, I haven't even yet considered buying any
smartphone. Then when Ubuntu Edge was a subject I had a phone, but thought
about the project as a me-too kind. At the time there was a plethora of
alternative platforms. Now I feel that things settled with mobile OSes, so it
seems that there is a place for moderate hype. I had higher hopes for
FirefoxOS, but devices were weak and nothing better came up. FirefoxOS set too
high expectations.

With Librem I feel it's a bit more straightforward. There will maybe be also
Necuno Mobile with similar software stack, but cheaper hardware. So it's just
maybe more realistic this time?

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fest
I'm also using KiCad for personal projects and small prototypes at work.
Version 5 with a proper 3D export and interactive routing mode is definitely
good enough for me. I find it much easier to use than Eagle and I don't really
feel the need for Altium (for relatively low complexity things, but I don't do
latest gen SoCs).

What really helps for hand assembly is interactive BOM viewer plugin:
[https://openscopeproject.org/InteractiveHtmlBomDemo/](https://openscopeproject.org/InteractiveHtmlBomDemo/)

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nrp
It seems the High Density parts of the system are on a separate off the shelf
SoM (System on Module) that was presumably not designed in KiCAD. It'll be
informative to see if they can continue to use KiCAD when they do the final
integrated version of Librem that will presumably have the SoC on the
mainboard. I'd very much like to use KiCAD for projects like that in the
future, so hoping they can prove it viable.

~~~
AWildC182
KiCAD and Blender (to name a few) consistently give me so much hope for the
future of open source. The world is moving towards an information based
economy so having free(dom) applications that allow you to design and shape
the world around you without any access to capital is effectively "seizing the
means of production" in the best way possible. Everyone should have the power
to learn and build whatever they want with enough time and effort. $1000+ CAD
packages are not the way forward...

~~~
newnewpdro
I'd like to add SolveSpace to the hope-inspiring list, it's excellent for
quickly slapping together and iterating engineering designs. Even with it's
quirks...

~~~
TaylorAlexander
I’ve played with SolveSpace. I would love to see it grow. Is the dev on
Patreon?

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Phenomenit
My biggest concern with using a phone sans ios/android is not being able to
use the ID app used in Sweden for basically everything important. It's used
everywhere now, banks, government, my kids preschool, insurance etc etc.

As soon as I can figure out a way around this I'm going back to a feature
phone.

My dreamphone is iPhone 3gs sized, has gps and maps, Hotspot and the app I
mentioned before.

~~~
tfolbrecht
You could run Android in a container. I run an android container and Linux
container, thought not at the same time on a computer with mobile specs: Intel
Celeron N3060, RAM: 2 GB SSD: 8 GB and I can use Snapchat, Instagram, VS Code,
etc

A well configured OS is magic, and with Lamby on the purism team, I'm sure
it's going to knock socks off.

~~~
znpy
That's interesting. How did you get that container running? I tried running
Android via anbox and my laptopb basically exploded as the Android container
suddenly allocated more than two gigabytes of ram (having been running Firefox
didn't help...).

Have you got some notes or a blog post about that? I would really really be
interested. TY in advance!

~~~
solarkraft
Agreed! I'm curious about how well it will run on the phone!

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herodotus
I wish the article started with a one-line description of what a "Librem
DevKit" is. Then I would at least know if I wanted to read the rest of the
article.

~~~
gregknicholson
Librem 5 is going to be a phone that runs free software (Purism's Debian-
derived, FSF-endorsed PureOS) on mostly–open-source hardware; any closed-
source hardware will be physically separated and kill-switched.

The dev kit is essentially a late-alpha version of the hardware, capable of
running the software.

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winslow
Does anyone know what language(s) will be used for app development? My
understanding from reading the documentation is that it will be GTK+ for the
UI and there are 2 examples of C/GTK+ apps. Since this is a debian linux
distro and applications will be distributed via a debian repo, could you
theoretically write it in any language ex: python, java, c++ and use GTK+ or
QT?

Doc Source:
[https://developer.puri.sm/Librem5/Apps/index.html](https://developer.puri.sm/Librem5/Apps/index.html)

~~~
znpy
If the examples are in C/GTK+ that means that as long as your language of
choice has a runtime on (or can be compiled to) the Librem 5 CPU architecture
AND has a binding to GTK+ available, that should "run", if my understanding is
correct.

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shmerl
Doesn't miniHDMI require paying a license? Probably a waste of resources, if
there is a way to route DisplayPort over USB-C?

~~~
craftyguy
This is for the dev kit. I don't think there are any plans to put an HDMI
connector on the final product...

~~~
shmerl
I guess, but it's still a waste for a dev kit I think.

~~~
craftyguy
Not really. The onboard/integrated display panel on the devkit does not have a
working controller driver, so the _only_ way we can get a display on the
devkit right now is over HDMI. I wouldn't consider that a 'waste'.

~~~
shmerl
So it can't drive DisplayPort over USB-C? Then sure, something else is needed.

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Karupan
Question as a cautiously excited potential buyer: Do we know what apps it will
be launched with? Is there documentation on that somewhere?

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dman
Having ordered one, I am waiting for them to ship!

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emilfihlman
This is great!

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NedIsakoff
So I'm reading this and I'm wondering, is Librem pulling a BlackBerry here?
When the BlackBerry PlayBook came out it had no native email or calendar or
contact management capabilities.

Purism is going to ship the Librem 5 without the ability to do calendar, notes
app, calculator app, and PDF viewer. My question is why? Why is this a good
idea?

Edit: Reference their site: "Upon initial shipment of the Librem 5 in 2019, it
will offer the essentials: phone functionality, email, messaging, voice,
camera, browsing. The featureset will expand after shipment and over time to
more free software applications. Your user experience will improve as we
incrementally add commonly requested applications and features (such as
calendaring, notes, calculator, PDF viewer, etc.) while keeping performance in
mind."

~~~
ams6110
The phone is going to be niche regardless, and its likely users will be able
to solve those problems their own way if GNOME apps are usable.

Everyone is different, but for me, 90% of my phone usage is: phone calls (I
have no landline phone at home), text messages, and maps/navigation.

If there's no maps, I'd pass on this phone.

Calendar, notes, calculator, etc. are relatively unimportant for me.

Other apps are relatively unimportant to me. I don't use Facebook or other
social media on my phone. I don't use ride-hailing services. I don't rent
bikes or scooters. I don't use my phone to make retail payments. So none of
that stuff matters to me.

~~~
kgwxd
I'm willing to go back to paper maps, I just want a damn Linux phone and I
will gladly pay more than iPhone prices for it.

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O_H_E
Fortunately nobody will have to, as this phone supports the internet. In
addition, I am sure there are many OSM maps that will work on it anyway.

~~~
kgwxd
What about the location and GPS hardware and the security and privacy concerns
that come with them? I'd rather just give up nav. Again, I'd still pay more
than an iPhone without the location hardware. Could still do manual direction
searching on the web, though I secretly _want_ to go back to paper maps.

~~~
megous
That's only a problem if you don't control the software.

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int_19h
When you're using web maps, you do not control the software - they request
location, you give access to it (because you want your maps to show where you
are), and you don't control that location information once it leaves your
phone.

~~~
megous
You don't need webmaps. OSM data are free to download and render locally.
Navigation devices have offline maps, typically.

