
Microsoft says antitrust bodies need to review Apple App Store - elsewhen
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-06-18/microsoft-says-antitrust-regulators-need-to-review-app-stores
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koheripbal
The huge tech companies that have emerged in the last couple decades have been
anti-competitive than Microsoft ever was.

Remembering back to the Microsoft Internet Explorer vs US Gov't anti-trust
case is almost comical next to the trillion dollar app monopolies that Google
and Apple have setup.

As endless threads talk about the free-speech vs hate-speech angle, the real
damage is being done thru these near-monopoly/oligopoly tech companies.

The governments of the world are either going to co-opt them into puppets or
force their break-up. ...at least I hope it's one of those two, because the
alternative is for them to take over and obviate any democracy we have left.

~~~
s3r3nity
>trillion dollar app monopolies that Google and Apple have setup.

How does Apple have a monopoly? They only own 25% mobile market share
globally.[1]

[1] [https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-
share/mobile/worldwide](https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-
share/mobile/worldwide)

~~~
koheripbal
First of all, the jurisdiction of the US justice department means you need to
look at the percentage market of _smart_ phones in the US - not globally and
not on non-smart phones.

But more importantly - It is no different that when Microsoft tied Internet
Explorer to Windows. They didn't have a monopoly either - and you don't need
one to run foul of anti-trust laws.

To break the law, you simply need to use your position to put anti-competitive
pressure on your competitors, exactly by pressuring and tying products
together like Apple has done.

The only reason phone manufacturers have forced users to their app store is
exactly to create a little monopoly on their platform.

~~~
coldtea
> _But more importantly - It is no different that when Microsoft tied Internet
> Explorer to Windows. They didn 't have a monopoly either - and you don't
> need one to run foul of anti-trust laws._

They did. Windows had > 98% of the desktop market.

~~~
plerpin
What more proof could you need? In what universe would Windows' market
penetration NOT be considered a monopoly?

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Barrin92
Imagine if Microsoft would have shut down every external program on windows
and charged every software developer 30% merely for running software on
windows. That's the world of app stores and Apple and Google.

I have absolutely no idea why Microsoft is often hated, despite the fact that
I can run whatever I want on my windows machine, compile software, download
stuff from the internet, doesn't matter, and that's despite almost universal
market share for decades.

Windows at the end of the day may be proprietary software and they've pulled
their share of nonsense but Windows was pretty much always a genuine platform
that lets you do what you want. The state of the smartphone market is
unacceptable.

~~~
jbverschoor
It would’ve been great. No malware on windows. No shady creditcard transfers

~~~
RealStickman_
The fact that there are apps in both stores that turn out to be malware makes
this claim demonstrably false.

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1cvmask
A simple solution for Antitrust authorities would be to allow users to
download apps from outside the app store like on Android phones.

~~~
skinnymuch
Do people do that on Android in the countries where Apple has more than a 1/3
share? I’m not sure of the exact countries, but there’s likely only a handful.

Other issues arise based on the app too. Like Hey’s app fight. I’d think any
area with a culture to side load apps wouldn’t be a place that would get too
many people [able to be] paying $100/yr service.

~~~
bitwize
F-Droid is a thing. Amazon had its own app store for Fire devices. Gamers
sideloaded Fortnite onto their Android devices.

It's not super common, but it happens.

~~~
RealStickman_
While we're at it, there should be an officially supported API for app stores
so you don't have to root your phone and install privilege extensions just to
get the same convenience with F-Droid as with the Play Store.

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whereistimbo
> Microsoft Corp. President Brad Smith said it’s time for antitrust regulators
> in the U.S. and Europe to discuss tactics that app stores use to take
> advantage of those who want to distribute their software.

I agree. Microsoft store on Windows 10 should accept browser engine other than
Microsoft Edge like Firefox. It's insane on Windows 10S you can't use any
other browser other than Microsoft Edge.

~~~
JamesBarney
Has Firefox released a UWP version for the windows store?

~~~
shakna
> No. When you're using Windows 10 in S mode, Microsoft Edge is always the
> default web browser, and Bing is the default search engine. But you can
> access other browsers and search engines while in S mode. You can download
> any browser available in the Microsoft Store in Windows, and you can
> navigate to any other search engine website. [0]

Would it matter if it did, considering that it cannot become the default
browser? If you cannot modify the default (without permanently switching out
of S mode) then in all likelihood, even if you have downloaded a different
browser, you'll end up using the default eventually.

[0] [https://support.microsoft.com/en-
us/help/4020089/windows-10-...](https://support.microsoft.com/en-
us/help/4020089/windows-10-in-s-mode-faq)

~~~
JamesBarney
I think it matters whether a platform disallows an app or just disallows
setting that app to default.

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perryizgr8
Microsoft should know. They got burned to the tune of tens of billions of $
trying to fight against Apple/Google duopoly with Windows Phone. I still miss
it. It was truly a better designed system than both ios and android.

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bitwize
Microsoft, like many companies, wants the law to work one way for themselves
and another way for their competitors.

Fun fact: Microsoft filed an amicus brief in favor of Google in _Oracle v.
Google_. Yet in the 90s, they themselves asserted copyright over an API when
Sun tried to get the Windows API published as an ECMA standard.

~~~
chirau
What you mean? They were punished for a crime and now are asking if someone
doing similar things to what they previously did (not anymore) should not face
consequences as well.

If I ran a red light 10 years ago, and got ticketed, surely I can demand that
you be ticketed as well if you run a red light today.

