
A million people live in underground nuclear bunkers in Beijing (2017) - Jerry2
https://www.nationalgeographic.com/photography/proof/2017/02/atomic-rooms-beijing-china-housing/
======
crazygringo
A _million_ people living in bunkers? That means one of out twenty. That just
doesn't pass the smell test.

The linked NYT article [1] says it's "well over 100,000" which is a whole
order of magnitude lower. But more importantly, it also seems to conflate what
is a true bomb shelter, versus what are merely regular basement apartments:

"Nearly every apartment building in the Digua Shequ center’s neighborhood has
a former shelter or a basement... If you get rid of these basement units,
where will the migrants live?... A lot of landlords have spent money
renovating the spaces they lease, so they don’t want to stop renting out
basements..."

I mean, c'mon -- people live in basement apartments in Manhattan too, it's not
that bad. And then, yes, I could maybe believe that 1/20 people in Beijing
lives in a basement apartment if the average building is 10 stories tall with
a single-story basement. And that then a much smaller number live in the
actual bomb shelters that aren't just basements.

[1] [https://www.nytimes.com/2016/03/22/world/asia/beijing-
bomb-s...](https://www.nytimes.com/2016/03/22/world/asia/beijing-bomb-
shelters.html?_ga=1.4562097.385821338.1462107904&_r=0)

~~~
dis-sys
> I mean, c'mon -- people live in basement apartments in Manhattan too, it's
> not that bad.

The underground space discussed by the OP article were actually
designed/built/maintained as shelters for nuclear war. They are not fancy
Manhattan apartments, you can't get it connected with broadband/water through
official channels. If someone lives there, their kids can't even go to local
public schools, as they are never considered as local residents.

There are of course actual basement apartments in Beijing, but a 70 sqm
basement apartment can has a price tag of $1.5 million USD [1]. That is
something for the middle class, not those people mentioned in the OP article.

[1]
[http://www.sohu.com/a/229312750_100070963](http://www.sohu.com/a/229312750_100070963)

~~~
crazygringo
I'm not disputing they exist... I'm disputing that a full _twentieth_ of the
population of Beijing lives in them, which the article claims.

That number doesn't sound plausible and it's not linked to any credible source
or methodology.

------
yegle
These are not normal basement rooms. Builders in China are required by law to
build these bunkers that can withstand air strikes.

E.g.
[http://www.sz.gov.cn/yjzhzx/ywgz_54281/rmfk/201711/t20171121...](http://www.sz.gov.cn/yjzhzx/ywgz_54281/rmfk/201711/t20171121_9904486.htm)

Those bunkers are actually owned by the government. Using those bunkers for
other purposes are against the law.

[https://baike.baidu.com/item/%E4%B8%AD%E5%8D%8E%E4%BA%BA%E6%...](https://baike.baidu.com/item/%E4%B8%AD%E5%8D%8E%E4%BA%BA%E6%B0%91%E5%85%B1%E5%92%8C%E5%9B%BD%E4%BA%BA%E6%B0%91%E9%98%B2%E7%A9%BA%E6%B3%95/1226515?fromtitle=%E3%80%8A%E4%B8%AD%E5%8D%8E%E4%BA%BA%E6%B0%91%E5%85%B1%E5%92%8C%E5%9B%BD%E4%BA%BA%E6%B0%91%E9%98%B2%E7%A9%BA%E6%B3%95%E3%80%8B&fromid=11178372)

You can even find the build code for those bunkers with keyword GB50038 (Code
for design of civil air defence basement)

~~~
seanmcdirmid
A lot of the ant tribe lives in the basements of otherwise luxury apartment
buildings, there is also a large network of older bunkers within the 2nd ring
road.

Law doesn’t mean much in China, just if the officials are in the mood to crack
down on it or not.

------
sbenitoj
“In Beijing alone, roughly 10,000 bunkers were promptly constructed...Now when
night falls, more than a million people—mostly migrant workers and students
from rural areas—vanish from Beijing’s bustling streets into the underground
universe, little known to the world above...Local laws require a minimal
living space of 4 square meters (43 square feet) per tenant, which, in many
cases, go ignored.”

Something about this story doesn’t add up — many bunkers are less than 43 sq
ft per tenant, but somehow the average number of people living in a bunker is
~100 (1,000,000 people / 10,000 bunkers)??

~~~
ycui1986
These bunkers has multiple rooms. It is not uncommon to have 8 people living
in one room, and a large bunker site can have 20+ rooms. A bunker site can
have living area similar to a 20 room motel, underneath a much bigger building
on top (at least when they are inside the city).

Since these bunkers were built, they were build for war, some of them have
very thick gas tight door to complete seal the environment from outside.

~~~
sbenitoj
Citation?

~~~
seanmcdirmid
Think about how many apartment buildings are in Beijing. All of these have
basements, each basement level has multiple rooms, and most apartment
buildings have multiple levels of basement. A million people easily could be
sheltered under that context.

------
hyeonwho4
Of the pictures at the top of the article, almost every bedroom captioned as
being in an underground bunker had a window visible in the frame. One of them
had something that looked like the door to a residential apartment next to
that window. Another one had nice mouldings between walls and ceiling, which
is not a detail I would expect in a bunker. To add to that, basement
establishments are not exactly rare in Asia's big cities. I'm very skeptical
of this story.

~~~
Jerry2
> _window visible in the frame_

Take a closer look. These windows are not windows to the outside. They're
windows to hallways inside of massive bunkers. You can even see giant
steam/water pipes in some of the pics (say pic #1). Also, notice the window
frames... they are not the types of window frames that would last even a week
when exposed to outside elements like snow, wind and rain.

Large pic #1:
[https://www.nationalgeographic.com/content/dam/photography/P...](https://www.nationalgeographic.com/content/dam/photography/PROOF/2017/February/atomic-
rooms-china/22-atomic-rooms-faccilongo.jpg)

------
zachguo
It reminds me of the sci-fi novelette Folding Beijing.
[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Folding_Beijing](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Folding_Beijing)

~~~
samcheng
Thanks for the referral!

Here's a link to the story, translated to English:
[https://uncannymagazine.com/article/folding-
beijing-2/](https://uncannymagazine.com/article/folding-beijing-2/)

------
newnewpdro
This article made me ponder the utility of, as a nation, having an
independently functioning portion of your economy and society underground at
bunker depths, as a component of national security.

If the shit ever did really hit the fan, and you had something on the order of
10+% of your population entirely self-sufficient underground, these would be
the survivors and they'd already be entirely acclimated to, and prepared for,
the situation.

It's some food for thought...

------
forkLding
Wikipedia page on this place:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Underground_City_(Beijing)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Underground_City_\(Beijing\))

Wikipedia page states that is 85 square km.

Also another much longer and detailed Vice article of it:
[https://www.vice.com/en_uk/article/nnmk8b/chairman-maos-
unde...](https://www.vice.com/en_uk/article/nnmk8b/chairman-maos-underground-
city)

------
justin66
Some of the bomb shelters are above ground, as shown in the photographs, which
is part of why the "million people underground" thing is just hyperbole. It
doesn't make this an uninteresting article.

One of above-ground shelters is architecturally a little strange, with steel
security cages built over first, second, and third story windows where you'd
ordinarily just put a railing or balcony. It looks cool but I wonder what the
actual purpose of it could be.

------
lanrh1836
Can someone explain why Beijing is so expensive as far as rents go? I’m
surprised given how sprawling it is.

~~~
cgb223
Imagine a city with so much housing demand that there are literal laws about
who can and cannot move there for the sake of population control

Also, a lot of the people in the bunkers are not supposed to be there in the
legal sense above, which is why they end up there.

~~~
sabalaba
The Hukou (户口) system that you’re talking about wasn’t established because of
demand for housing in Beijing. It’s not really clear why it was established
and has origins that date back hundreds of years. It essentially serves as a
social control mechanism and to promote people living, and thus laboring, in
rural areas. Though it dates back to immigration control between states in
“China”. (When they were different sovereign entities.)

They’re all migrant workers and are allowed to be in Beijing without Hukou.
Hukou Just establishes certain privileges like home ownership and school
access.

The best way to think about Hukou for Americans is that Hukou is like if
California required a Texan or Floridian to get a Visa or become a “California
Citizen” before working there, buying a home there, or using public services
there.

~~~
onethought
It seems Hukou is being used to somewhat control the urbanisation plans CCP
have been implementing. They create “Hukou free” regions like Shenzhen for
periods of time to cause mass migration and economic growth.

But it’s also created this strange “illegal migrant” issue in all the top tier
cities (PK, SH, GZ, etc).

------
SubiculumCode
Too bad the excess in housing in China isn't being utilized to solve this
issue.

------
retube
there's something on that page that autoplays. can't find it to stop it on
mobile, so unable to read.

------
myself248
Yes, yes this weekend is a perfect time to pull my copy of City Of Darkness
off the shelf.

~~~
bredren
Or the Imperial Radch series—the undergarden.

------
RandomInteger4
We're over here playing Fallout Shelter; they're over there living fallout
shelter.

------
rayiner
I hear 1BR underground bunkers are going for above asking price in Mountain
View.

