
Bobby Fischer: from prodigy to pariah (2011) - wallflower
http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2011/may/15/bobby-fischer-chess-downfall
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johan_larson
"...Garry Kasparov, Fischer's only rival for the title of best-ever player..."

That's not quite right. Both Kasparov and Fischer are definitely among the
best players ever, but the list of contenders for the top spot is definitely
longer than that. One might easily include Lasker, Capablanca, Alekhine,
Botvinnik, Tal, and a couple of others.

It's not really possible to say who the best player of all time is; some of
the plausible candidates never played each other in their primes. One can
estimate of course based on intervening games, but I'm not ready to put a lot
of confidence in a model that has to judge how the Lasker of 1910 would fare
against the Fischer of 1972, extrapolating over a span of more than sixty
years.

~~~
Lordarminius
Well you are entitled to your opinion but it is very likely you are wrong. The
consensus among very many strong chess players,and historians is that the
mantle of 'greatest player ever' is a toss-up between GK and RJF. This is
based on many factors: peak rating,percentage wins/losses, fighting spirit and
aversion to draws, quality of the opposition, quality of play, raw talent,
statistical analysis of elo ratings, their contribution to theory and other
factors. The phrase is not a whim of the reporter.

~~~
johan_larson
I am saying what I am saying for good reason. Back when I was active in chess
(a decade or so ago), I read all kinds of articles and books about the great
heroes of the game. There was general agreement in the chess community about
who the dozen or so greatest players were, but no particular agreement on who
was the very best. In a typical discussion, the cults of Fischer and Kasparov
would always make themselves heard, but there were also advocates of Lasker
and Capablanca, and some oddball who would insist on Morphy.

But perhaps things have changed. Got a pointer to a solid writeup on the
issue?

~~~
Lordarminius
I saw a good one once I think on ChessBase. I'll search for it.

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MaysonL
I've been pissed off at Fisher for over 60 years!

In kindergarten or first grade my father taugh me how to play chess. A few
months later, I beat him, and he never played me again, and I didn't play any
more for quite a few years. My parents had been frightened that I would become
a Bobby Fisher-like chess monster. It still rankles, even thought they may
well have been right.

~~~
tamana
Have you seen the movie "Little Man Tate"? You might appreciate it.

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Overtonwindow
A great, troubled man. It saddened me that I was the only person in the
theater when the recent movie came out. As crazy as he was, I still think he
deserves our respect.

~~~
reefoctopus
Marketing my have been an issue. My father and I would both have been
interested, and this is the first either of us have heard of it. He spends a
great deal of time on chess computing forums so I have no idea how this one
slipped by us. Tobey Mcguire?!? 'Pawn Sacrifice' is probably the biggest
budget chess movie in 2 decades!

~~~
Overtonwindow
I thought it was a very well-made movie. You're right it probably was
marketing. I really hope the film "the Queens gambit" can be made someday.
That was going to be Heath Ledger's next project before he passed away.

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lern_too_spel
The story of Morphy dying surrounded by women's shoes is apocryphal.

~~~
fabriceleal
That one is an urban myth of sorts i believe

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wmccullough
I've listened to a few interviews with Josh Waitzkin and I have to say, not
impressed with him as a human being. In his case, he is highly intelligent,
but it doesn't escape the fact that he's kind of a lousy human being. Go
listen to his interview with Tim Ferriss for example; he talks like he's
robotically trying to figure out how to sling vocabulary words together to
sound smart. At once point (paraphrasing here), he says something like: "we
have create a sense of agency for the kids". Not long after, I stopped
listening.

Just listening to him describe his life, he's a very self important type of
person.

~~~
tim333
He seems to have had that in common with Fischer then.

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shadgregory
I wish this "chess makes you crazy" line would just die. If anything, chess
kept Fischer sane. Chess gave Fischer focus and forced him to interact with
people. He only truly went off the deep end after he stopped playing.

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artur_makly
[https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LSWau3pTyIg](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LSWau3pTyIg)

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pmoriarty
Have there been many great, mentally ill Go players?

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soyiuz
The mystery of HN front page... a 2011 article from the Guardian about a known
topic not related to technology.

~~~
nsns
I've learned there's always a(n associative) trail of comments (sometimes from
more than on thread) leading to such apparently random posts.

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sotojuan
My understanding is that if it's in the front page, the community has decided
it's interesting and a cool read, so no need to complain.

~~~
eterm
Sometimes that's true, sometimes it's just an uptick of submissions for the
same url (multiple submissions count as upvotes) because it's popped up
somewhere else such as reddit.

