
What is the oldest living organism on the planet? - miraj
http://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-40224991
======
excalibur
I've been under the impression for many years that the oldest living organism
on the planet was the giant underground fungus in Oregon.

[https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/strange-but-
true-...](https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/strange-but-true-largest-
organism-is-fungus/)

It seems to have the title of "largest" locked down, but it's a viable
contender for "oldest" as well. It's at least worth a mention anyway.

~~~
EGreg
I think clonal colonies like Pando are some of the the oldest LARGE organisms.
But can one say they are organisms?

Probably a few rotifers and tardigrades are the oldest organisms since they
can lie dormant for many years and then be reanimated with water. Perhaps
millions of years!!!

~~~
theptip
From [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_longest-
living_organis...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_longest-
living_organisms),

> "Humongous Fungus", an individual of the fungal species Armillaria solidipes
> in the Malheur National Forest, is thought to be between 2,000 and 8,500
> years old.[33][34] It is thought to be the world's largest organism by area,
> at 2,384 acres (965 hectares).

So it may be the oldest organism, but it also has the crown for largest.

------
Diederich
The main Bristlecone Pine grove in California is a lovely place. It sits near
10,000 feet, and yet is pretty easy to drive to. It's about five or six hours
east of the SF bay area, depending on whether Tioga pass is open or not. (This
year, the pass will be opening quite late.)

I strongly encourage a visit if at all possible. It is truly like another
world up there, and the silence is magnificent.

~~~
TACIXAT
While I was there I asked how the trees got so old (3000 - 5000 years), if it
was a special kind of tree or what. The ranger told us that trees don't die of
age, if they have roots, bark, and leaves, they can keep on going. It was the
environment of that area that allowed the trees to grow live so long. It's
relatively high elevation, so there are few bugs and other predators. The
biggest threat they faced was from erosion, and wind taking the bark off over
time. Absolutely awesome place.

~~~
bcbrown
> The biggest threat they faced was from erosion

I've always thought that was incredibly cool. These trees live so long that a
primary cause of death is _the mountain literally eroding away from beneath
them_.

------
hplust
is it just me or is this article written like someone who did a few google
searches for old organisms and then writes down their speculations in the form
of what some would call an article?

tl;dr
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pando_(tree)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pando_\(tree\))

"However, the oldest, precisely measured organism living on Earth today
remains, for now, a Great Basin Bristlecone pine tree. Pando the quaking aspen
and Antarctic glass sponges could be much older but their ages are assumed
from indirect measurements and educated guesswork. "

~~~
ComodoHacker
To me, it's just an indicator of what an amazing time we live in, when almost
any kind of information is just a few Google searches away (no sarcasm).

Also, I probably would never make these searches myself if this article wasn't
written and appeared here.

That said, I admit Antarctic glass sponges deserve mention in the article.

------
mtdewcmu
It seems that one could argue that the first single-celled organism has never
died. Single-celled organisms reproduce by dividing, and there's no
distinction between parent and offspring, right? So if any offspring survives,
then the original organism arguably has not died.

~~~
qbrass
And when it becomes a multi-celled organism through various mutations?

If you could trace your lineage back to the first single-celled organism,
would that make you the oldest lifeform on the planet?

~~~
Karellen
There's a good argument to be made that organisms which reproduce with haploid
gametes (animals and plants) truly generate "new" individuals when the sperm
and egg fuse to create the first cell with a nucleus containing a truly unique
genotype. However, organisms that reproduce by fission, where one complete
living cell divides into two identical complete living cells (minor single-
site mutations aside) have a much stronger case to claim that they are both
still "the same" organism, as old as the original. So, no, you aren't the
oldest organism on the planet, but many bacteria could be considered to be a
billion or two years old.

~~~
sophacles
It always amuses me how rapidly discussions about life (define life, what
constitutes a different species or organism) end up at ancient philosophical
discussions. In this case:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_of_Theseus](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_of_Theseus)
is just a breath away! (In this case: would those cells be a billion or two
years old? Have all of their atoms been replaced at this point? Does it
matter?)

------
simen
Somewhat related: last year a study showed that the oldest living vertebrates
are Greenland sharks, which can attain ages of 400-500 years:
[https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/08/160811143218.h...](https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/08/160811143218.htm)

Saw a documentary that mentioned this recently. Interestingly, these sharks
are born with great eyesight, but nearly all of them that have been studied
have these parasites
([https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ommatokoita](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ommatokoita))
embedded in their eyes that literally eat their corneas.

------
reasonattlm
The AnAge database may be of interest to those who like to think about this
sort of thing.

[http://genomics.senescence.info/species/query.php?search=Ani...](http://genomics.senescence.info/species/query.php?search=Animalia&show=1&sort=4&page=1)

[http://genomics.senescence.info/species/nonaging.php](http://genomics.senescence.info/species/nonaging.php)

Note the sponges, particularly this one:

[http://genomics.senescence.info/species/entry.php?species=Sc...](http://genomics.senescence.info/species/entry.php?species=Scolymastra_joubini)

"Animals of this and similar species of Antarctic sponges grow extremely
slowly in the low temperatures. Estimates based on growth rates suggest a very
long lifespan in this and similar animals. One two meter high specimen in the
Ross Sea was estimated to be 23,000 years old, though because of sea level
fluctuations in the Ross Sea it is unlikely that such an animal could have
lived for more than 15,000 years. Even if 15,000 years is an overestimate,
which may well be the case, this specimen appears to be the longest-lived
animal on earth."

------
lenkite
Why be merely old when you can be immortal ? [http://immortal-
jellyfish.com/immortal-jelly-fish-life-cycle...](http://immortal-
jellyfish.com/immortal-jelly-fish-life-cycle/)

~~~
pavement
I'd suppose you have to be both, for immortality to matter, since immortality
alone doesn't confer invulnerability.

------
Razengan
A related question which has always intrigued me:

Can long-living organisms, or hard-coded behavior across generations of short-
lived organisms, be used to _transfer data or preserve knowledge_ across
incredible stretches of time?

For example, the rings within trees that live for thousands of years.

Or, the elaborate art made by creatures like the Japanese Puffer Fish. [0]

[0]
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p1PID91sEW8](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p1PID91sEW8)

~~~
VLM
DNA is probably your best bet for bottom up approach.

Its surprisingly difficult data to find and the rate probably varies a lot,
but wikipedia claims:

"The human germline mutation rate is approximately 0.5×10−9 per basepair per
year"

My RAID array does better, polaroid pictures somewhat worse, etc.

A bit error rate of 1e-9/yr is something that can be worked around over a
lifespan but probably not over a million years.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mutation_rate](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mutation_rate)

~~~
Chaebixi
But if you're just storing random data, like text, it probably offers little
to no fitness benefit to the organism. So it could all be lost with a random
deletion and no one but you would care.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deletion_(genetics)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deletion_\(genetics\))

~~~
Razengan
_> if you're just storing random data, like text, it probably offers little to
no fitness benefit to the organism._

Wow, this makes me even more interested in the idea of using _mating rituals_
as a mechanism for very-long-term knowledge storage!

Things like birdsongs, dances, and the aforementioned courtship art... If an
individual can only reproduce if it correctly retransmits the "data", then the
data will survive as long as the species does..no?

------
gedy
I thought the oldest may be this 13000yo bush near Riverside California?
[http://articles.latimes.com/2009/dec/22/science/la-sci-
oak23...](http://articles.latimes.com/2009/dec/22/science/la-sci-
oak23-2009dec23)

------
theprop
Yes, I believe the oldest trees on Earth are around 5000 years old. Some Fungi
systems could be extremely old...but they sort of clone each other so it's not
exactly the same organism living...but that said most of your cells except
neurons seem to die and get replaced, so continuous living is open to some
interpretation. You could say the creator of the Venus Willendorf is the
oldest "living in our memory" human being...the sculpture is thought to be
35,000 years old and continues to influence artists today like Jeff Koons.
[http://arthistoryresources.net/willendorf/willendorfdiscover...](http://arthistoryresources.net/willendorf/willendorfdiscovery.html)

------
tscs37
There is an interesting video from It's Okay to be Smart on this topic;

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgspUYDwnzQ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jgspUYDwnzQ)

It seems they point to a group of bacteria living under Siberian Permafrost
for the past half million years. As the video also points out; not in
suspended animation, they're rather alive and repairing themselves.

------
Razengan
The oldest living organism may well be the planet itself, though it may
require a review of the term "living organism" :)

------
yitchelle
Although I haven't seen any post lately, I have been following this blog that
describes some very old organisms around the world.

There is a description of Lomatia Tasmanica which is claimed to be 43000 years
old. Obviously, growing clonally.

[http://oltw.blogspot.de/](http://oltw.blogspot.de/)

------
samirillian
An American geographer killed the oldest confirmed bristlecone, Prometheus,
which was even older than Methuselah.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prometheus_(tree)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prometheus_\(tree\))

------
4ndr3vv
Radiolab had a show on this story back in the day:

[http://www.radiolab.org/story/91722-be-careful-what-you-
plan...](http://www.radiolab.org/story/91722-be-careful-what-you-plan-for/)

~~~
coldpie
The Skeptic's Guide to the Universe also discussed the 80,000 year old clonal
tree in a recent episode (I think the latest?).
[http://www.theskepticsguide.org/podcast/sgu](http://www.theskepticsguide.org/podcast/sgu)

~~~
scott_s
Another Skeptic's Guide listener on HN! I've posted various comments linking
to SGU segments or Steven Novella posts, but I have yet to see anyone else do
so.

~~~
coldpie
I heard about it here, actually, in some podcast thread a year or two ago. It
rapidly became my favorite podcast. 90 minutes every week!

~~~
scott_s
I actually stumbled on it 4 years ago while having a discussion on HN. I was
looking for explanations on the biological approach to mental illness:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5829068](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5829068)

~~~
coldpie
Heh heh, how on Earth did you dig that comment up?

~~~
scott_s
HN's search function is good! I just looked for "scott_s Steven Novella",
changed it to look at comments (default is stories, which, unsurprisingly,
there are no hits), then sorted by date. It's usually easy to find a comment
you or someone else made by just searching for the username, then some
keywords.

------
fs111
a book about this very topic:
[http://www.rachelsussman.com/oltw/](http://www.rachelsussman.com/oltw/)

~~~
jlewallen
Absolutely fantastic book. I was surprised to learn there were a few examples
closer to me that I had expected. Of course, their precise locations are
usually obscured.

------
atka
The transmittable dog cancer? It started about 11000 years ago. The cancer is
an STD and the cells are all the same from the original dog.

------
sunstone
Does 'reviveable' qualify as living? Some small organisms have been revived
after over 100k years if I remember correctly.

------
codazoda
There was a tree. Someone was trying to check it's age and his bit got stuck.
He cut the tree down to retrieve his bit, finding the tree to be the oldest
living (something). I don't have a link. Probably on Atlas Obscura.

~~~
itp
There's additional information on this incident in the link being discussed.

------
otempomores
My vote would go to the cloning bacteria.

------
HillaryBriss
a programmer above the age of 37?

------
Shalomboy
Gymnosperms – the marathon runners of the botanical world. Tré dope, mon dude.

------
babesh
How cavalier we are about taking life of other species.

~~~
criley2
We're arguably the least cavalier about taking life of any life on earth.

In the wild, life is so cheap and valueless that when we witness unspeakable
acts of horrific wild violence, we have to condition it: wild is wild, nature
is nature, human expectations and morality don't apply.

~~~
abhishivsaxena
Really? What did you have for lunch today?

All the herbivores in Animal Kingdom would disagree with that statement.

~~~
mikeash
Plants still count as life.

~~~
mod
In many (most?) cases herbivores aren't taking the life of the plant.

Think of a squirrel, perhaps, and how it feeds on plants.

(Still don't agree with the GP)

~~~
mikeash
Good point, but I think squirrels are a bad example. They're not only taking
lives, they're killing the babies!

~~~
mod
On the contrary, I imagine a lot of the nuts are planted by squirrels! In
either case, many plants have an implicit bargain with animals: eat my fruit,
but you must carry my seeds out beyond where I can reach and deposit them
there.

Which happens when they pass through the gut, essentially.

