

9-5 by day, startup by night. How do you cope? - pumpkinattwelve

Here I am working on a startup at nights and am close to launch but my day job is eating most of my time and energy. The feeling as it is so close to release is butterflies and excitement but then remember the day job and then it hits me; feelings of stomach churn as I can only dream of how cool it would be if I 
could work on it full time.<p>I don&#x27;t believe that I am the first founder to experience this so I am asking HNers: how do you cope with the emotions at this level of the game?
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2D
I feel your pain, although here in Asia many work 9-830 and then somehow on
the weekend try and do stuff that matters. My experience is that it's good
pressure as it forces you early on to be judicious with your time and only do
what really needs doing NOW and with some kind of order. It also prepares you
slowly for the discipline and loneliness of being a full-time entrepreneur. So
try and be positive as sounds like you have reason to be! Lets face it when
you grow up its harder to find butterflies:)

~~~
pumpkinattwelve
9-8:30? that's tough. I guess I shouldn't be complaining.

I can relate to forcing focus on time management. I've got little for
everything else but I'm only focused on the long term so I know there is light
at the end of the tunnel.

You are completely right. These days and with my hormones completely abnormal,
butterflies and raw emotion are non-existent. I almost feel robotic.

~~~
atmosx
I've been in China, they really work lots of hours but don't have _western
world_ work-intensity and stress. That's at least what I've seen in a couple
of factories and commercial centers.

~~~
pumpkinattwelve
Does the work ethic and intensity follow the western world in the technical
fields like startups? Or are long hours and cheap labor only for factories?

~~~
nicholas73
Even migrant factory workers are well paid compared to what they would make at
home in the interior. They would actually complain if you cut hours because
they would earn less (assuming no other company does the same and let wages go
up).

Not to make light of their situation, but I imagine it wouldn't be so
unbearable if one worked at Google and is highly compensated, and still had to
work on their start up on the side. The crux of the problem is dissatisfaction
of the day job, not the amount of work hours.

Generally migrant workers know that they can save money and live better,
relatively. Whereas in a dead end day job you know your situation doesn't
improve, even if it is in absolute terms better than a migrant's life.

We're made to look forward to something better.

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exelib
Full time job and start-up project works fine together for me. Things become
more complicated since I have a family and studying computer science. I don't
touched my project for one month and can't do it for at least one or two next
months because of a seminar. I hope, I release my project at decembre-january.
Emotions? I don't have time for emotions :D

------
mkal_tsr
I was at this point until I quit my job to go all-in on my start-up. My
management technique was pretty much to remind myself that if this fails, I
have a full-time job to fall back to. Remember, you may be splitting your time
and energy between 2 jobs, but that's also 1 more job that you don't have to
worry about failing (for the purposes of financial security). The further you
get now, the less distance you'd need to worry about if you wanted to do this
full-time. Try to balance the urge to do this full-time with the "safety net"
of your full-time job and focus on your health and enjoyment more than the
company (you can decide to f-over your health later, but while you're still
salaried at another job, there's no reason to).

Above all, enjoy the experience, have fun, and learn about yourself and
others. Good luck and keep asking question when you have them, just one easy
way to learn more than you knew before!

~~~
pumpkinattwelve
I am totally enjoying it as the light at the end of the tunnel is almost there
and have learned a bunch. But I'm not yet ready to pull the cord and go full
time until it has replaced my current income and then some.

~~~
read
> until it has replaced my current income

The metric to watch isn't how secure it makes you feel. It's growth. A startup
is a company designed to grow.

One advantage a full time job offers is you can afford to take the risk of
building something daring that takes more time to identify. A funded startup
pressured for growth might otherwise miss this part.

The constraint of having little free time makes you work only on what's
important. Which incidentally is how some of the best skunkworks projects
produced results. Constraint is an advantage in creativity.

As for coping with the emotions, launch sooner rather than later so you know
how far off you are from something useful. One of the worst emotions is
launching late and realizing you could have stayed in a mode of building
without feedback nearly infinitely. The launch is good training for the
emotions because you'll realize how unreliable they can be in the absence of
data. And always have at least one active user.

And exercise, and grow disciplined with sleep, preferably starting the day
hacking because not only does it awake your mind but you give more of the
benefit of new ideas to your startup rather than the day job.

~~~
pumpkinattwelve
Unfortunately I can't pay the mortgage based on revenue projections :)

I have noticed that by being constrained on my time that I have not touched
frivolous features. The core product is quiet lean but is working great so far
as an MVP.

Thanks for the great comments.

~~~
read
You can pay it based on revenue: launch and get users.

The fear of putting something out in the world isn't only an inevitable part
of creation but also a necessary one.

[http://blog.redbubble.com/2014/04/daily-inspiration-agnes-
ma...](http://blog.redbubble.com/2014/04/daily-inspiration-agnes-martin-
inspirational-quote/)

[http://www.brainpickings.org/index.php/2014/03/31/agnes-
mart...](http://www.brainpickings.org/index.php/2014/03/31/agnes-martin-john-
gruen-interview/)

------
aviral
If you can take Some Risk: Take admission in college, quit the job and work on
your startup.

If not: The only key word is "Determination","Where there's a will, there's a
way"

Still I have some tips for you:

1) Increase your physical activities(Imp), go to job and in night work on
startup.

2) "Time is money", Move near to your work place.. etc

3) Live with your co-founders (or Girlfriend or Love ones)

4) Keep some spare time to meet your loved one, it keeps you motivated.

5) Focus on correct things, 80-20 Rule. 20% Task get your 80% work done.

6) Work with a velocity that you can control. One should know his/her limits.

7) There are points in time where things don't seem to be going well, in such
times its only you who can help yourself. Be determined

:) Cheers & Best of Luck !!!Eat good Food :)

~~~
pumpkinattwelve
College is probably the wrong place for me right now. But apart from that your
advice is very much welcomed and appreciated. Unfortunately loved ones and
physical activities have had little attention lately. I'll keep myself in
check here.

------
Cerridwen
Suggestion 1: try to steal time from your day job to work on your dream.

Suggestion 2: be creative and think of alternative ways of financing your
startup work that are less demanding of your time. For example, find a job
that pays better so you can save more for later when you want to start your
enterprise.

~~~
pumpkinattwelve
1) I'm not even going to entertain that one. I'm doing this the right way.

2) That's a good point. I have considered looking at the funding route but
with being so close to launch it feels like I'm wasting equity when all I need
to do is just temporarily put aside these emotions and keep on trucking.

~~~
collyw
For point 1) I don't think they necessarily have to be mutually exclusive. If
there is a new tech that would be useful to learn for both work and side
project, then try to get a chance to learn it on work time.

------
staunch
#18
[http://paulgraham.com/startupmistakes.html](http://paulgraham.com/startupmistakes.html)

 _" Statistically, if you want to avoid failure, it would seem like the most
important thing is to quit your day job. Most founders of failed startups
don't quit their day jobs, and most founders of successful ones do. If startup
failure were a disease, the CDC would be issuing bulletins warning people to
avoid day jobs."_

------
digita88
I was in a similar situation some years back, I ended up burning out big time
and completely pivoted my whole career outlook. It ended up turning out for
the better and now diving back into a similar game but with some lessons
learned. Only advice is to tread cautiously, you don't want to be completely
burned out.

------
kinj28
I feel you are probably not giving your 100% to any. If you believe in your
idea, dream...live it thoroughly.

~~~
pumpkinattwelve
Unfortunately I can't pay the mortgage by hopes and dreams.

------
shopinterest
Coffee is your friend. Lack of sleep is probably messing with your emotional
status (too high, too low). Besides, you are doing it right. Don't jump off
the plane until you finish the Parachute. Good luck and let HN now when your
baby is ready to be ripped apart in pieces here.

~~~
pumpkinattwelve
Trust me. Coffee is my best friend but I do know that my body has completely
undergone hormonal swings. Even my partner says that my lack of sleep and
increase in coffee and Red Bull has changed me.

~~~
atmosx
IMHO sleep + physical exercise can get you way further: Will make you work
smarter, healthier and better thinker.

I'd say try to adjust your schedule to allow (at least) 7 hour _good quality
sleep_ [1] and at least 45-75 minutes of exercise daily.

You'll have 15:30 hours free :-)

[1] Getting a good sleep involves a good bed, freshly oxygenated room, right
temperature, no room, no iphones/ipads/e-devices, no video-games, no-movies
etc.

~~~
pumpkinattwelve
I meditate for about 30 minutes each night before sleeping and it does make up
in multiples in lack of sleep. Without any scientific evidence but at least I
feel more rested the next day.

7 hours of sleep with a full time job, a startup, kids and exercise? Is this
even possible! One great life-hack we have is to sleep with the windows open
and with thinner sheets. We both feel more refreshed the next day. And apart
from the alarm clock, there are no devices :)

~~~
atmosx
Sorry mate, I didn't take "kids" into account :-)

Whatever works for you!!! Meditation it is!!! (will try also!).

------
kinj28
i did this 8 years ago. for us it went a bit beyond. 9-5 by day & startup
otherwise (including weekends). It definitely gets very tiring & exhaustive.

Some of the things we practiced were: a. keep aggressive but realistic goals
for every week. b. utilize weekends to achieve 70% of the goals c. in our 9-5
day, we had atleast an hour or two of opportunity where we could have done
some additional work to meet our weekly goals. for eg - talking to freelancers
& reviewing their work just after lunch, talking to prospective clients during
some coffee breaks, etc. d. do give yourself a couple of lighter days to relax
& look forward to the thrill of your excitement.

Cheers buddy & good luck.

------
d0m
I'm surprised nobody suggested to raise money. You can then pay yourself a
good salary AND work on your startup.

A MVP with some traction and a solid business model is all you need.

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CmonDev
It is basically borrowing your health while you are in your twenties in a hope
to win big when you will be in your thirties. There is no magic trick to get
around this.

~~~
pumpkinattwelve
Twenties? Try mid thirties :)

I am glad that I waited to work on a startup now because my knowledge and
experience have given me confidence that I can pull it off. Earlier on in life
and I would have been running on pure hubris.

~~~
pl3as3
Single or do you also have family obligations?

~~~
pumpkinattwelve
Partner and three children. Life isn't quite balanced right now but my partner
and I agree that my startup is the right thing to do at this stage in our
lives. The unbalanced lifestyle is hopefully only temporary.

~~~
dirktheman
A word of warning here. When I grew up my parents weren't around much because
of their business. They did allright businesswise, but my brother and I grew
up very independent. Not neccessarily a bad thing, but we don't have a strong
bond. This is something I didn't realize until I met my wife, and her amazing
family.

What I'm trying to say is: if you don't make sure your work/life balance is
balanced right now, it probably won't be balanced in the future. And it
probably will leave a mark on the bond between you, your spouse and your
children. Realize that you can never get back the time watching your children
grow up.

We're in the same situation. I'm also in my mid-30's, two kids, a job and a
mortgage. I spend my commuting time on my startup, and all the time I can get
when everyone's asleep. It was hard at first, but now I have developed a
routine that works for me. I may not be able to work as many hours on my
startup as someone with less obligations, but the hours I do have I spend
incredibly productive and efficient. I love working on my startup, but until
it makes enough money for me to quit my job, it's family first, startup
second.

~~~
pumpkinattwelve
Damn this one hit hard. I am giving myself another month to get it out of the
gates then I'll regroup and give my family a big "forgive me" hug. Thanks for
reminding me of this.

------
jamielee
Ask for a leave of absence?

