
A Chess Novice Challenged Magnus Carlsen - mudil
https://www.wsj.com/articles/chess-novice-challenged-magnus-carlsen-1510866214
======
robax
I agree that this article was superbly written, but hubris really is the best
word I can find to describe Max. Blundering a knight on move 11 is rookie
chess. This is not an impressive feat. His pullup "success" is laughable.
Lastly, can we kill the trope that solving a rubik's cube is impressive? It's
deceptively simple and the algorithms are well within reach (google).

~~~
ronilan
How bout landing a standing backflip. Isn't that impressive? I know robots can
do it, but Max is just meat.

~~~
gamegoblin
Learning to backflip is almost entirely mental. With the proper coaching just
about anyone in average-to-good shape can learn it in an afternoon (though not
necessarily with great technique).

[https://youtu.be/eMKoU_I4F1A?t=34](https://youtu.be/eMKoU_I4F1A?t=34)

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sethbannon
I once challenged Magnus and, while I lost, did much much better than Max.
Where's my WSJ puff piece?

[https://youtu.be/sZFZBf6aTF4](https://youtu.be/sZFZBf6aTF4)

~~~
brucephillips
Yea but did you write a Magnus-crushing ML algorithm then simulate it IN YOUR
MIND?

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ggggtez
Except, this guy never finished the ML algorithm either... So he had nothing
to simulate. I don't get the purpose of this piece.

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gk1
This is like reading about someone who thinks they can learn enough basketball
in one month to beat the US Olympics team 1vs5.

The first few moves were “textbook” moves, meaning they are completely
standard and neither side has an advantage YET. It’s like giving the
“basketball player” credit for dribbling to half-court when nobody was
pressing.

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dash2
Alternative headline: "Silicon Valley Internet Person Is Vain, Amateurish".

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nicpottier
Fun read, but man, the hubris! I play chess a fair bit and have gone through
various stages of study, though admittedly never a month full time. But man,
no way do I think Max could beat even an intermediate player (say 1800 ELO) 3
out of 5 games. It just isn't something you pick up in a month.

~~~
conistonwater
At least he developed his pieces. What I found interesting is that he decided
to go the weird ML way, instead of spending the whole month solving tactics
puzzles. The only thing he did that I recognize as advice that I already
thought was good is playing against moderately stronger opponents and
reviewing those games. As far as I know, chess and go take about a year of
decent training to get to a "competent amateur" level.

~~~
noobhacker
That part really irks me as well. It sounds like a move for the cool factor
that will go into a Medium post or book later, rather than a move to optimize
for the best chance of beating Magnus.

Building a ML algorithm to beat Magnus is really not something to do in a
month, not to mention replicating the ML algorithm by _computing in his head_.

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gmiller123456
Beating Magnus seems very out of whack with the rest of his goals. Things like
solving a Rubik's Cube in 14 seconds, and 40 pull ups are descent results, but
far from world champion status. Maybe I missed the part where they explained
why he was so ambitious on this challenge.

~~~
gitisstillhere
You can easily learn to solve a rubiks cube on the order of twenty seconds. It
takes about a month of practice.

I have no clue why the pull ups are mentioned at all.

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theklub
FYI the speed chess championship is ongoing and Magnus plays tomorrow...
[https://www.chess.com/article/view/2017-speed-chess-
champion...](https://www.chess.com/article/view/2017-speed-chess-championship-
information)

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chrisoakman
I was casually reading this article when I noticed a familiar bug when quickly
moving the pieces. A quick "Inspect" reveals they are using one of my
JavaScript components :)

[https://chessboardjs.com/](https://chessboardjs.com/)

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soVeryTired
I think his machine learning strategy goes to show how overhyped the field has
become. Faced with an impossible situation? Machine learning! In my head!

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misotaur
A fraudster managed to devise a scheme to get famous,probably thinking his new
found fame will net him some money.Weird WSJ is promoting this individual and
that Magnus accepted his bogus "challenge".

~~~
Jach
I don't really get all the negative dismissal here and I'm frequently saying
"meh" to myself at a lot of things people get excited about. (For example,
Max's shock-level-2 level of excitement and thought about the future.)

How is he a fraudster? Who is he deceiving? Will any one of us think about him
in a month? How exactly does a goal of solving a crossword puzzle fit into
trying to get famous after 12 months?

He's got daily posts about this stuff, it's not hard to evaluate his honesty.
I was curious how he managed to learn enough Hebrew to converse for 30 minutes
on a topic. In the intro post he states: "Like most other challenges, I’m not
starting from zero: I studied Hebrew at Brown for a few semesters, and also
lived in Tel Aviv for six-months during my junior year of college." That's a
huge advantage to have. But he's not being secretive about it. Maybe the
inference of not actually starting from scratch is lost when being reported by
media, but I'm more likely to blame the media than the individual. It's a fun
human interest story and serves as a good reminder that rapid advancement in a
skill is possible even when you work full time. Especially when you work full
time and can afford to pay for assistance, in fact.

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jamestimmins
This was a really pleasant read, and everyone in the situation looks good
afterwords. Clearly it's two people who are challenging themselves in their
own ways, and you can't help but think "what if I really pushed myself that
hard?" after reading it.

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Overtonwindow
This is a very well written article but I think it's less about Chess, and
more about the ideal of being able to learn anything, and with a short amount
of time, upload that learning directly into the brain. Matrix style, or at
least Limitless. Chess is an extraordinary complex game for humans, and I give
Max many points for having both the audacity, and mental fortitude to try it.

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Simulacra
This does seem a little bit of a puff piece, more like a human interest story
wrapped in some compelling writing. However, there is a part of me that wishes
he could have at least drawn Marcus. To beat him would have probably crashed
HN... :)

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brucephillips
These are Max's pullups for his "40 pullup challenge":
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-3t9KuGhuo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-3t9KuGhuo)

Something tells me this guy is cutting a few corners.

~~~
jamestimmins
Is the issue that he's not going low enough? Or that he's swinging his body?

~~~
brucephillips
Not going low enough. A pullup requires you to straighten your arms completely
to 180 degrees. He's not even getting to 90 degrees. It's not anything
resembling a real pullup.

It was the one challenge video I clicked through because it seemed like the
most difficult. 40 pullups is a hard task.

I wish Max wouldn't lie to market himself.

~~~
schoen
His definition of a pull-up for purposes of the challenge was to reach 90°,
but I agree that he doesn't do so in this video.

[https://medium.com/the-mission/my-month-long-quest-
for-40-pu...](https://medium.com/the-mission/my-month-long-quest-for-40-pull-
ups-e37a00e1d0d)

You can look at his other projects, and he seems to do well under his
definitions of success. He emphasizes that he's not starting from zero with
respect to (almost) any of these skills.

[https://medium.com/@maxdeutsch/m2m-day-1-completing-12-ridic...](https://medium.com/@maxdeutsch/m2m-day-1-completing-12-ridiculously-
hard-challenges-in-12-months-9843700c741f)

~~~
brucephillips
I could define an apple to be a banana. It doesn't make it accurate.

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gcbw2
what's up with HN and these personal-marketing puff pieces? read almost like
any old Wired article.

it is a well written fiction, that stretches reality far and wide. Should be
in the literature section of the newspaper. why is this even near news?

spoiler: He lost every single game he ever played with his month of
"training". And here is a golden passage on the "article":

""" Max played three matches [with amateurs in a park] that day. He lost all
three. The only sign his month of preparation might not be an epic waste of
time was that one of his opponents happened to be wearing jeans made by
G-Star—the same G-Star that once sponsored Magnus Carlsen. """ ...what does
that even mean?!

