
Airbnb Victim Speaks Again: Homeless, Scared And Angry - jamesgagan
http://techcrunch.com/2011/07/29/airbnb-victim-speaks-again-homeless-scared-and-angry/
======
bignoggins
I'm using airbnb in Berlin right now. Two days ago I received a knock on my
door. Turns out it was the real owner of the apartment and he had the
Paperwork to prove it. Fortunately he was nice enough to let us stay without
compensation. When I went to the airbnb website to try and call them all I got
was a web message box. I filled out a message and sent it on its way but
that's a pretty lousy system. Luckily for me my situation is nowhere as bad as
ej but airbnb really needs a 24 hour hotline. I've had many good experiences
but all it takes is that one time.

~~~
dlss
Exactly.

Based on EJ's description of AirBnB customer service, and the _2,000,000_
bookings the founders cited earlier today, we'd be fools to think this was the
first time someone broke the law using AirBnB -- I'm guessing the others just
gave up on support after being ignored, and focused on talking to the police.

The real black eye here is the kind of support EJ received _before_ she wrote
her blog post -- most people can't write that well and don't have readers who
will submit the story to HN.

~~~
bignoggins
I am giving a statement to the police later today along with a lawyer and the
real owner of the apartment. I'm not sure how far this will escalate here in
Germany but I'd imagine as airbnb has facilitated a transaction with a
criminal the German authorities will want to pursue further. I'm not the
victim here, but the owner is.

~~~
dlss
Right -- I'm pointing out that experiences like yours are probably fairly
common.

In the comments to the other story, people kept talking about how it is safe
to rent using AirBnB. If the owner here had been less understanding, I'm
guessing you would have at least spent the night in jail (assuming you speak
German and everything else went well).

~~~
bignoggins
yes I am extremely grateful that the owner is a nice and understanding guy. We
are doing whatever we can to help him in this situation because it just sucks
for him. Funny thing is I had just visited checkpoint Charlie so I was in a
cold war state of mind. Then a few hours later this guy in a thick Russian
accent knocks on my door demanding what I'm doing in his house. For a moment I
thought I was in a bad 80s movie.

------
markbao
Wow. I love AirBnB, and I hate to say it, but that was a completely boneheaded
move. There is absolutely no doubt that EJ is very public on this issue. If
it's true that AirBnB tried to cover up the problem, then why? Did the
founders think that EJ wouldn't turn around and say that they're asking her to
remove the post?

Handling this situation should be a top priority for AirBnB. There's the
potential that the mainstream media could have a field day with this. The
incident will undoubtedly be part of the hotel lobbyists' list of reasons
AirBnB should be made illegal. And if the investigation reveals that they were
cooking drugs in the place, that's even more damning.

It's disappointing to see this happen to one of the most interesting startups
as of late, and I hope they turn around their attitude for the better. This is
already really damaging, but it could be way worse if things don't change.

~~~
watchandwait
It isn't disappointing, it is predictable. AirBnB has skirted the rules from
day one, when they launched by spamming Craiglist. AirBnB brokers a service
that is illegal in many jurisdictions, and they go out of their way to mask
the serious risks their users (both renters and owners) are taking. And when
the obvious happens, their response is self-serving.

~~~
singular
Actually that was apparently not sanctioned, rather the work of some
contractors acting off their own back.[1]

[1]:<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2815183>

~~~
sixtofour
Ah, the News of The World defense.

~~~
singular
Ok I'll bite; actually quite different - there are (very) strong indications
that the NotW's problems were part of the culture there which makes the idea
that the bosses did not know seem very unlikely. In this case there are no
such indications afaik.

In any case I wasn't taking a position (I simply do not know enough to do so),
rather I wanted to provide some balance to the assertion that they spam which
was stated as if it was absolute fact.

~~~
sixtofour
The scale is obviously different, so in that sense I wasn't fair. But the
defense is exactly the same, disclaiming responsibility for the acts of your
contractors. I don't think any victim (Craigslist, NoTW phone hackees) cares
about the fine point of the employment relationship.

EDIT: took EJ off the parenthesized list of victims, as she was not the victim
of a contractor.

~~~
singular
I think things differ in 3 main respects -

1\. Whether there was an ongoing culture of doing the wrong thing - NotW yes,
AirBnb not so much (afaik).

2\. Whether there is an indication that the defence is actually completely
false (i.e. whether the guys in charge actually _did_ know and sanction these
things) - again there are some strong indications that this was the case at
the NotW, especially if you take the culture into account (i.e. - how did that
culture come about if there wasn't some degree of either asking for hacking to
be performed or not wanting to know whether it was - both equally worthy of
blame). Again AirBnB - not so much.

3\. And of course, scale, though I didn't mean to criticise that particular
difference.

The victims might not care about the finer points, but in terms of determining
who is to blame it _does_ matter. Obviously there is the point that employees
are the responsibility of the company, however if they do something the
employer was not aware of then that seems to me to be a sort of technicality.

Anyway, getting into [1] territory now so should probably just leave it at
that :)

[1]: <http://xkcd.com/386/>

~~~
mgkimsal
"1. Whether there was an ongoing culture of doing the wrong thing - NotW yes,
AirBnb not so much (afaik)."

When you're first starting off a company, anything you do _is_ your company
culture.

------
vessenes
This is a seriously damning essay from someone who's clearly working through
PTSD issues (or is an amazing liar).

Part of the issue is that young fast-growth CEOs don't major on empathy,
typically. It's somewhat contrary to the necessities of the job. These co-
founders have absolutely no concept of how this woman feels, or if they do,
they have determined that they won't let her know about it. The best thing say
Paul Graham could do would be to hire them a crisis management coach, stat.

While the co-founders are reportedly worrying a bit about valuation right now,
they could (and should) be turning this into an amazing PR story; massively
over-compensating her, setting up a Lloyds-based insurance coverage program,
appearing on something like Oprah to talk over how it felt, and what we can
all do as we're moving into this awesome social-based home sharing..

~~~
pseudonym
>>or is an amazing liar

I know that people were doubting the veracity of the story in the first place,
but I think the initial AirBnB PR statement laid that to rest. At this point,
what would EJ gain by lying? Anything that's a blatant lie could just be
replied with by "Nope" by AirBnB, and she could only hurt her case by lying
about anything right now.

Honestly, after what appears to be a month with no help, no reply, no customer
service, veiled threats, and an offer to "get a cup of coffee"...I'm honestly
surprised this essay isn't more vitriolic.

~~~
fab13n
(Disclaimer: I'm not saying that she's lying, and I see no element that makes
me believe that she lies. I don't even see any concrete element pointing to a
conspiracy, I'm merely pondering how credible it might be).

> what would EJ gain by lying?

AirBnB has the potential to become very disruptive for the whole hostel
industry. This means that there are people, some of them with deep pockets,
some of them less than honest, and some of them both, who really want them to
fail.

What's AirBnB's main challenge? It needs people to trust each other, in a
society which promotes mistrust. The easiest way to destroy them is to prevent
this trust from being created and maintained. If you wanted to destroy them in
a shady way, your best bet would be to create a smear campaign based on a
traumatizing violation, exactly such as what allegedly happened to this woman.

Moreover, if you were to create such a smear campaign, your best bet wouldn't
be to have an accomplice playing the victim: it would be to choose a perfect
genuine victim (likable, vocal, blogging, emotionally sensitive, and with good
writing skills), and send real thugs actually destroy her home in the most
traumatizing way, including psychopathic "nice" e-mails sent while wrecking
the place havoc.

~~~
silverlight
There's only one problem with your thought process: even if the "thugs" were
sent by the big bad hotel industry, they have no influence over the way that
AirBnB responds to the incident. If they would have handled it in a
responsible, savvy way this would be a non-story, or maybe even a big PR win.
The "devious" plan only works if AirBnB bungles the ball, which they have
done. They have no one to blame for that but themselves.

At the end of the day, it doesn't really matter who caused what to happen to
this woman, does it? AirBnB have obviously given credence to the basic tenants
of her story (she is a person, she used AirBnB, she was ransacked), that is
enough. The only thing that matters after that is the way they handled the
situation.

~~~
fab13n
I never discussed the appropriateness of AirBnB's response, neither to defend
nor to accuse them.

I only said that if one wants to destroy them in possibly illegal ways, making
such an event occur looks like an excellent move.

Bonus point, from the attacker's point of view, if AirBnB reacts
inappropriately of course. But even if they had been faultless, people would
still have remembered this story every time they considered renting their
home. Notice that the focus is on the emotional harm rather than the financial
one, i.e. the one AirBnB cannot fix even if they want to.

------
farrel
AirBnB gives the illusion that you can just rent out your apartment without
any precautions. I've stayed in a few dedicated holiday apartments and almost
without fail:

1) They are furnished with the basics and that's it. No valuables and nothing
that can not be easily replaced.

2) The owner or an employed managing agent interacted with us (either at the
apartment or when we fetched the keys) when we arrived and left.

3) They had insurance in place and 80% of the time when I signed for the
apartment I was also signing my own liability.

If you are prepared to rent out a fully furnished (and in this case full of
valuables) apartment to strangers you need to be prepared for the potential
massive downside. 99% of your guests may be hassle free but it just takes that
1% to wipe out any financial upside and even then they may not even do it on
purpose - accidents can and do happen.

~~~
hussong
I'd say your last sentence applies to renting out any kind of apartment. Once
you catch the occasional deadbeat tenant (not paying rent for months, damaging
the floors etc.), your business case is FUBR.

------
ColinWright
This article on TC adds nothing at all.

Original blog post: [http://ejroundtheworld.blogspot.com/2011/07/airbnb-
nightmare...](http://ejroundtheworld.blogspot.com/2011/07/airbnb-nightmare-no-
end-in-sight.html)

HN submission of that blog post for discussion:
<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2820615>

========

ADDED IN EDIT: Clearly this is contentious - it went up to two points, now as
I write this it's down to zero, and who knows where it will go next.

Yes, I agree, sometimes TechCrunch adds information, but I claim that in this
case it doesn't. Further, I claim that by reading only the excerpts they
include, you are not being given the whole picture as written by the blog
author. The post is well-written and well-crafted - providing summary excerpts
does not give the full impact or the full situation.

And, given that the crunchy bits don't actually add anything, let me quote
from <http://ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html> where it says:

    
    
        Please submit the original source. If a blog post
        reports on something they found on another site,
        submit the latter.

~~~
jamesgagan
I disagree - people are always interested in TechCrunch's take on things.
Indeed, AirBNB used it as their PR channel the other day (
[http://techcrunch.com/2011/07/27/on-safety-a-word-from-
airbn...](http://techcrunch.com/2011/07/27/on-safety-a-word-from-airbnb/)) so
linking to the TC article certainly has value.

~~~
ColinWright
Agree to disagree - I'm content with that. In my opinion sometimes TC actually
adds something, but this time it really doesn't.

------
sriramk
If that AirBnb co-founder really asked her to tone down her post because it
would mess with future financing, that's just sad. Talk about inappropriate
timing and priorities

~~~
speckledjim
It's all about money and greed. Sad indeedy.

~~~
veyron
Airbnb is a business. And honestly their behavior is exactly what I would
expect from them: dont admit any liability, offer words of consolement.

~~~
speckledjim
This isn't an isolated incident though.

Their whole business model pretty much is built on the fact that things like
this will happen. A lot.

~~~
veyron
Given that they control the communication, the implied business model is that
trustworthy people will be using the service.

If they truly expected these types of incidents to happen a lot, they would
require more information from people (to be able to trace and hold visitors
accountable) and have some sort of legalese to ensure that they would never be
held liable.

------
jamesgagan
I find this bit particularly damning: "During this call and in messages
thereafter, he requested that I shut down the blog altogether or limit its
access, and a few weeks later, suggested that I update the blog with a “twist"
of good news so as to “complete[s] the story”.

Seems like we are all still waiting for the "good news" ending to this tale.

~~~
freddealmeida
I'm more disappointed with airbnb screwing this up than that there are bad
people using the site. They should have dropped everything to fix this.

I wonder what pg thinks about this.

~~~
palish
I doubt Airbnb cares what pg thinks.

I'm just guessing, but it seems likely Airbnb see themselves as "underdogs,
displacing the hotel industry". The fact that they care so much how EJ phrased
her post _after her home was completely destroyed_ (look around you right now
--- imagine all of that being gone and never coming back) indicates they have
an ego to match. So no, pg can't help them, and no one else can either. It's
up to them to fix or break their billion-dollar company.

~~~
pseudonym
It's obvious that AirBnB only cares about attempting to spin it. I'm more
curious if pg is going to work "how (not) to handle a PR crisis" into the
YCombinator syllabus.

------
BasDirks
Acquaintances have said they'd probably not use Airbnb for fear of problems
like this. After this incident and Airbnb's response, they will never even
consider it. And they will tell all _their_ acquaintances, etc, etc.. Airbnb's
Achilles' heel is the deep-rooted fear of someone fucking up home. That they
did not patch this with a good backup-plan should be a warning to investors.

~~~
sp332
What backup plan can you have for someone destroying your house, copying all
your documents, and stealing your grandmother's jewelery?

~~~
BasDirks
Airbnb should have had a backup plan, not the victim.

Note: i feel terrible for the Airbnb folks. I hope they get out of this mess.

------
JacobAldridge
Worth noting that, despite recent large valuations and funding rounds, the
founders of Airbnb are still driving their baby and have a massive emotional
attachment to it. (As do all business owners.)

This is their first significant black eye (the Craigslist stuff was far more
limited in its audience reach), and has the potential to derail a company
that's only 2 years old. Of course they're going to be responding emotionally,
and unfortunately that means perhaps doing too much or doing the wrong thing
(like suggesting to meet for coffee without asking how EJ is coping).

Now, that emotional involvement with the business is considerably less than
the emotion of coming home to discover your house has been ransacked, so I'm
not trying to compare. I'm just observing that Airbnb's response (for better
or worse) is not devoid of emotional triggers either. I do hope EJ is
receiving the support she needs and am sure she will get through this. I
similarly hope the ongoing support the Airbnb founders are receiving
recognises the feelings element of running a large business through the prism
of their emotional attachment.

~~~
Maro
I donwvoted you. I don't see how what you write is relevant. Everybody is
emotionally attached to their startups, including me, so?

~~~
JacobAldridge
So ... I don't believe that level of emotional attachment is well understood
by people who don't have their own business. There's criticism - in this
thread and elsewhere - of how Airbnb have handled this whole situation,
especially some of the information in the OP. I think there would be less
criticism if more people understood the emotions of being a business owner -
emotions lead us to do non-rational things.

Edit: To add how good it was to see someone explain a downvote, so we could
continue a discussion.

~~~
Maro
Yes, the emotional attachment that founders have with their startups is pretty
crazy. I think that rational founders learn to normalize it over the years
though, at least that's what happened to me.

Criticism sucks, but with a company like Airbnb that's the deal, and the
founders knew it from the get go. This is the price (one of many) they pay for
their eventual big payday. Overall, it's a pretty good deal though =)

~~~
hack_edu
> This is the price (one of many) they pay for their eventual big payday.

"Screw clients, acquire currency!"

------
rdouble
This is a ridiculous article. Instead of just quoting an anonymous blog post,
TechCrunch could be calling AirBNB, calling the victim, digging up the police
report, locating the relevant profiles on AirBNB, and so on, and so forth.
They have the resources, they could contributing to the understanding of this
event, rather than just spreading FUD. There is no journalism present
whatsoever, it is pure spin.

~~~
Maxious
TechCrunch and FT are reporting on this but EJ's latest post says "2. Other
than occasionally sharing the link to my blog, I have made no statements to
nor have I been interviewed by the press - yet." I'm sure the FT must have a
code of conduct around victims of crime (see the BBC one @
[http://www.bbc.co.uk/guidelines/editorialguidelines/page/gui...](http://www.bbc.co.uk/guidelines/editorialguidelines/page/guidelines-
crime-witnesses-victims/)) to ensure they don't complicate matters but surely
they could have tried to contact EJ to confirm what they were going to print
was correct.

------
yardie
Airbnb is one of the good ideas that came out of the SF/SV area that wasn't
really means tested and a cock-up like this was bound to occur. It places an
incredible amount of trust in the hosts and guests. This is alright I guess
for some places but definitely not others.

I assume that if Airbnb got its start in Detroit, for example, and not San
Francisco then safety and security would have a different context. For me,
when I was in university I left the door to my apartment unlocked, a lot. I
knew everyone in our building and had so many people coming and going from my
place that it was easier that way. Plus, being a broke college student the
most expensive thing in the apartment was the bottles of liquor :-). But this
is definitely not something I would do in any other city.

EJ assumed that keeping valuables in a locked closet would be enough. Severely
overestimating the role a locked closet plays in a house. Being a traveller
myself I am constantly worried about the security of my house. Renting it out
to a stranger with my valuables still inside would drive me nuts.

I like the idea of airbnb but I haven't used them because they don't have
listings for the places I go. And the thought of having to move all the
expensive stuff out of my place, pay for storage, and move it back when I
arrive is a bigger hassle than I can deal with.

------
compnerd
I'm starting to get the feeling that the Airbnb founders will do "whatever" it
takes, to see their business succeed.

~~~
chubot
Yeah, first the craigslist thing, now this. They seem unconcerned with "evil".
I guess that's how businesses succeed in our system.

I get the feeling that it's pretty chaotic over there. My first AirBNB
experience was filled with crazy bugs (the messaging system, logins). It seems
they're trying to get huge fast rather than taking the time to polish the
experience.

------
preavy
The story is on the front page of this morning's Financial Times (UK edition):
[http://www.politicshome.com/timthumb.php?w=450&src=%2Fim...](http://www.politicshome.com/timthumb.php?w=450&src=%2Fimages%2F%2F1.1.Front_Pages%2Fft_29711.png)

Story here:
[http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/9aac5f80-b924-11e0-bd87-00144feabd...](http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/9aac5f80-b924-11e0-bd87-00144feabdc0.html#axzz1TJLQ6rSb)

~~~
TeMPOraL
That's the old story. They haven't seen yet the newest post. When they will
have, all hell will break loose for AirBNB.

------
sixty
airbnb need to realise this will not go away. The way I see it, their two main
options are:

1) hire a PR firm, lawyer up and let the spin doctors handle things. With the
amount of money they have, this is a real option. They could probably convince
or coerce (bully?) the victim into accepting a settlement in exchange for
keeping quiet. The PR machine would then be free to write (or rewrite) the
story as they see fit.

2) Come clean. Realise that it's never the victim's fault. Compensate her
financially for her loss. Offer to provide counselling. Help her with the
logistics of finding and moving to a new place. Work with the victim (and
other airbnb users) to figure out how to reduce the chances of this happening
again. And all the while, document everything. Brian C speaks of openness and
transparency - show us, don't tell us.

~~~
rrrazdan
Not a reflection on Brian, ( I know nothing about him) but it is my
observation that 'talking' about openness and transparency is easy.
Implementing it in a competitive environment is difficult.

------
beedogs
Airbnb really needs to pull their head out of their ass on this one. This
seems like it could literally destroy their company.

------
ISeemToBeAVerb
This is one of those sad instances where you see a really great company forget
their roots and give their soul wholeheartedly to the idea of becoming huge.
This was going to happen eventually. In fact, this issue is the biggest chink
in the chain of the whole collaborative consumption ideal. The idea of social
sharing is amazing, but the companies working in this space should know that
eventually someone would come along and exploit the system for nefarious
purposes. It's great that some of these companies are getting funding to grow,
but did no one think that this was a possibility? Did no one think this could
happen? I love the idea of AirBnB, but they need to understand that they have
a responsibility to their community that far surpasses their responsibility to
any funding they receive.

------
JoachimSchipper
This should not be [dead] (and please don't downvote _me_ because you disagree
with _him_ ; on the other hand, perhaps someone should tell him):

"brianchesky 3 minutes ago [dead]

Brian Chesky (Airbnb CEO) here. My heart goes out to our host. My co-founder
has contacted her multiple times, as recently as last night, and we have again
offered to help her in any way that she needs. We will continue to make
ourselves available to her to do whatever she asks of us in this time of need.
We have encouraged her to reach us so that we can help her through this, and
we are standing by."

~~~
sp332
It's dead because he copy&pasted the exact same text on the other thread.
<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2821305>

------
ig1
Try googling for "craigslist murder" or "gumtree stabbing", crimes happen. The
classified industry is still alive. Foursquare and Twitter stalking didn't
kill either of those products.

The London Metropolitan police typically deal with 50-100 crimes related to
online classified ads a year.

People are incredibly poor at judging risks so things like this get blown out
of proportion. You need to look at the context and compare against other
risks. For example what's the risk of your house get burgled if you go on
holiday and leave it empty for a few weeks ?

------
bprater
I'm surprised the mainstream media hasn't picked this up. It has all the right
plot points to drive a story -- over-the-top crime, police can't find the
persons involved, the victim is striking back at the company who started the
mess.

~~~
prof
Did the company start the mess?

------
cageface
This is bad enough but what happens when the inevitable assault, rape or
murder finally occurs? Screening people is a chicken & egg problem because if
you only rent to people with a ton of positive history nobody new gets in.

The only solution I can see is digging way deeper into the personal background
of a prospective tenant than any hotel would dare.

------
mxavier
A little OT from the actual story but I find it annoying when TechCrunch and
similar sites find a random picture to put near the headline. I suppose the
point of this is to attract more eyes to the article, but when the story is
about someone getting their home trashed and you show some completely
different house that looks like a bulldozer drove through it, I can't help but
think you're creating an association that is a best worthless and at worst
misleading. Pictures in articles serve a purpose and that purpose certainly
isn't to remind me what a trashed house is.

------
niekmaas
How does this work legally? Is it still burglary when the people were allowed
in the house? Of course taking things that do not below to you is theft. But
going through someones documents, is that illegal?

~~~
pseudonym
I'm pretty sure AirBnB is already pretty sketchy when it comes to legality,
just from the fact that a lot of apartments explicitly disallow subletting. I
wouldn't be surprised if there's a later follow-up saying that this lady is on
the hook for any damage done to the apartment.

------
ck2
If you care for the reaction from someone who doesn't really know/understand
what Airbnb is:

 _"Who lets strangers into their home, unsupervised?"_

Does make some sense, right? Who would?

~~~
Osiris
I have never used the service, but I always assumed that they pre-screened the
customers and the hosts. I'm really surprised to hear that they don't have a
screening process, like background checks, and that they don't carry some for
on insurance to cover damages.

They certainly don't seem to make the effort to inform hosts of those two
points. Hosts should be completely aware that AirBnB, 1) does NO background
checks or verifications on possible tenants, and 2) does NOT insure _any_
damages.

~~~
Jilly
If people are unable to read the TOS, which states Airbnb does no background
checks not sure how it's Airbnb's fault when something goes amiss. They do not
vet either the hosts or the renters. Either party could be throwing major
shade and basically if you're a person devoid of common sense and good
judgment the services provided by Airbnb probably aren't for you. Personally,
I could not use either because my HOA expressly forbids short term leases for
the reasons driven home by this incident.

------
Jilly
I'm sorry, but very little of this story rings true for me. "EJ" reminds me of
a roommate I had in college who was a serious drama queen. If she felt wronged
by you there was no remedy short of spending every moment lavishing her
attention and apologizes (and who has time for that?) that would appease here
and it was never enough. I don't doubt AirBnB offered assistance and "EJ"
herself said so. However, with a drama queen it is never about finite forms of
attention (money, vindication, etc) but renewable sources where she is able to
maintain victimhood without taking a shred of responsibility for her part (no
matter how small) in the events that are alleged to have unfolded. I mean what
kind of drama queen psycho ex carries on about a CEO wanting to meet her for
coffee, but not asking about her feelings? What are they dating or something?
Nobody cares about her "feelings" feelings are transient and not fact. What
they want is to solve the problem and since they are men, they're having some
real problems understanding what a losing game they're playing when the
opposing side is a drama queen.

------
braindead_in
I wonder how CouchSurfing managed such issues. I am sure it must have happened
with CouchSurfing too. I know that they have ratings for members and past
history. I guess you can get an impression of the trustworthiness. But then
this sort of thing can happen too.

~~~
kyleslattery
The thing with CouchSurfing is that the guest is not generally alone in the
apartment--it's a more social interaction, where the host is entertaining you,
showing you around, etc. In Airbnb's case, the guest is left alone in the
apartment, and there isn't as much interaction between the host and guest.

------
shawnee_
The headline is a bit too much, even for TechCrunch.

EJ is not "homeless". She almost certainly has never been homeless and will
never be homeless; this is an insult to people who _have_ been homeless,
broke, and literally have nowhere to go. _Choosing_ to not stay in a $3.8K /
month loft in SF does not a homeless person make.

And she's at least a bit responsible for feeding the sensationalism of this;
it is coming off a bit Drama Queen.

~~~
jgmmo
Her nickname is EJ, and she is indeed homeless. Her home was destroyed and
ever since she has been bouncing around staying with friends. She is now
without a home - that doesn't mean she is sleeping in the subway station, but
it does mean she doesn't have a permanent residence anymore. Hence, homeless.

------
blackiron
Some strange things to note about this case:

\- she rants about airbnb, but not so much about the thieves.. in those Ebay
scam cases the victim usually directs his/her anger and takes action toward
the scammer, not towards ebay. She reports very little about the thieves and
the progress of the police investigation.

\- Are these psychotic rockstar thieves so expert at hiding their identity?
its a very 'proffesional' job then.. which can raise more points to the hotel
lobby conspiracy theory.

\- I thought that you use airbnb to rent extra properties; not your home with
your documents, jewels, money, personal diary and what not in there.

~~~
awa
Regarding - I thought that you use airbnb to rent extra properties; not your
home with your documents, jewels, money, personal diary and what not in there.

Nope. You use vrbo or an external agency for your extra property. You use
airbnb for renting the extra room in the house or a week you're away from your
place. That's how airbnb spins it and that's how most places are listed on the
site

------
int3rnaut
I don't know why but on top of feeling bad for this woman, I feel bad for the
AirBnB guys because the whole concept is so idealistic and believes in the
good in people--if only everyone represented humanity the way they envisioned
this from the birth of their idea; that would truly be a good world.

------
iamdave
I'm a little less worried about what the MSM will do here (editorialize and
paint the hotel industry, as some other HNers have said as golden boys), I'm
actually curious to see how someone up on Capitol Hill is going to react to
this.

------
Maro
This reminds me of Paypal, where the founders said they won the online
payments game because they figured out how to deal with fraud.

Maybe that's one of the keys to success here, figuring out how to deal with
these cases at the business plan level.

------
ivankirigin
Can we all admit that techcrunch gets page views by spreading FUD? Read
original sources for this case

------
arepb
I barely invite my friends over, why would I let a random into my house, even
for $(amount)?

~~~
gwern
Everyone generalizes from one example; at least, I know I do.

------
dreamdu5t
If this was bound to happen, I wonder why AirBnB didn't have a better
contingency plan.

------
nodata
This is really crappy and airbnb fucked up big time, twice now.

But... there's something odd about the way the victim writes, and I don't
understand why it's jumping out at me:

" _bouncing_ between friends’ homes".. " _clutching_ my pillow".. " _breathing
through_ panic attacks".. " _scouring_ the city’s pawn shops".. " _this too
shall pass_ and I will be _made whole again._ "

~~~
VladRussian
as one smart commenter <http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2820778> has
finally got it (and as usually - once somebody was able to get it and
explained to the rest of us, it seems obvious ) - PTSD

~~~
hluska
I'm sorry, but I disagree with you (and upvoted that post). While post
traumatic stress disorder is highly individualistic, one of the classic
symptoms is a desire not to be reminded of the trauma (especially only five
weeks after). Usually, at this point, a victim would be doing everything
possible not to think of it.

Granted, PTSD is highly individualistic, but if you read the relevant medical
literature, this is not a classic case.

~~~
VladRussian
another classical symptom is flashbacks, and they aren't necessarily separated
by any specific time period from the original event.

~~~
hluska
Excellent point!

The thing though is that flashbacks are involuntary (though most often brought
about by a sensory trigger). The way this victim is seeking to bring this
forward is voluntary.

I'm not trying to attack the victim, merely I'm agreeing with this thread's
parent comment - this case is nowhere near average.

------
stef25
As much as this sucks for EJ, she is being quite the crybaby. This has nothing
to do with AirBnB and everything to do with the fact she handed over the keys
to her personal flat (containing many expensive items and personal documents)
to a complete stranger. The medium through which this stranger found you, be
it a pinboard at a supermarket, craiglist, airbnb or through a foaf, is
irrelevant.

Initially AirBnB may have been populated with California Apple fan boys (you
can trust), but it's just a matter of time before Joe six-pack (who you maybe
can't trust so much) gets on there.

If you rent out your place through AirBnB it should be YOUR responsibility to
vet the person and / or make sure there is little to steal / destroy. This
isn't the responsibility of the founders of AirBnB.

~~~
tygorius
_This has nothing to do with AirBnB_

Yes, so far as we know, the persons who robbed and trashed EJ's home were not
employees of AirBnB.

In just about every other respect, however, this has _everything_ to do with
AirBnB. Four big points that have struck me:

* From a business perpective, such incidents were inevitable and yet the company seems to have had no crisis management plan in place. That is simply astounding.

* From a consumer perspective, it's worth warning potential users of the service that the company's prior attitude was "Don't worry, no one will steal your grand piano". As EJ points out, if AirBnB's "service" offers no more protection and fewer warnings than a free Craigslist alternative, you may want to reconsider using them.

* Given that some small percentage of renters are intent on breaking through your locked doors and storage cabinets looking for valuables, you might just want to reconsider renting your home out to people you don't personally know and trust. At the very least, a viewing of "Pacific Heights" is in order. (A landlord acquaintence suggested the film be required viewing for anyone who is considering becoming a landlord.) This might not seem AirBnB-relevant at first, but when you consider AirBnB's facile "grand piano" Web page, it seems quite relevant.

* Imagine if EJ had gotten suspicious and decided to check up on the renters herself or asked a friend to do it for her. Scenarios escalating to rape and/or murder are not farfetched. Even if you can ignore the pain and suffering of the victims, imagine what a PR disaster that would have been for AirBnB. (Which brings us back to the first point.)

------
latch
I was the main anti-AirBnB poster last time around...but..

I gotta say, something about all this now seems like it's a set up for a big
fat lawsuit. I've never been violated this way (or anything close to it), so
maybe I'm being insensitive, but this is crossing into whining territory to
me.

If you want to complain about a _really_ bad experience, a lack of customer
support, and insensitive and money-focused founders, that's fine. But I don't
really need to hear about your pillow-clutching and fading normalcy.

~~~
dasil003
Well, if it's fraudulent that's one thing. But if the story is entirely true,
then who really gives a fuck what _you_ need to hear?

