

Ask HN: How to avoid being "taken lightly" at work? - wythrep

I dropped out of college and worked in the services industry.<p>I felt inferior because of my work.<p>I thought, those guys with the IT jobs, they get paid well and people respect their intelligence - I should learn how to do that stuff.<p>So I went to back school, learned programming and became an in-house code monkey only to discover that my supervisor and everyone making any kind of decisions in my department wanted to hear from my know-nothing supervisor and to hear not a squeak out of me or any of my fellow techies.<p>Ultimately this field uses my talents better than my previous work did so I believe I should stick with it for that reason.<p>But I question whether I might be just as happy if I returned to a lower paid, menial job since, for the most part, I got about as much respect as I do know and no longer feel like I need to prove something by being in IT. 
I think I would be happier as a project manager than as a coder but I don't know how to make the transition. All of my requests for promotion at my previous job were turned down because I was "too vital" in the role I was in.<p>All of this probably sounds like a big whinefest but my question is whether anyone has discovered some strategies for being taken more seriously in spite of being a code monkey or whether you really need to move up the ladder to get any 'props'? If so, what's the best way to start this process?
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tjr
There was an episode of _Happy Days_ in which Richie got into a little
trouble, and Fonzie gave him advice on how to act tough and command respect.
It didn't work for Richie. Fonzie then remembered the key component: it wasn't
just acting tough; at some point in time, you had to have actually won a fight
to prove it.

Consider programmers that you respect; why do you respect them? Is it their
in-depth knowledge? Interesting projects they've worked on? Publications
they've written? Their ability to teach? I would venture to guess that most
people don't just set out to be a respectable person in the abstract; they
work to excel at particular things in their life.

~~~
wythrep
_Consider programmers that you respect; why do you respect them?_

The expertise and dedication that I consider respect-worthy have not been
deemed so by others.

 _most people don't just set out to be a respectable person in the abstract;
they work to excel at particular things in their life._

Again, you assume a meritocracy in which those who excel are appropriately
rewarded. In my experience of the corporate world the rewards are distributed
according to a different set of rules and I would like to understand them so
as to be better served by them.

Your assumption here is that I did nothing to deserve respect but expect it to
be delivered free of charge. This is untrue and an ungenerous reading of my
statement. I worked my ass off in that job for many years, betting that it
would pay off eventually. I lost that bet. Next time I would like to fare
better - your suggested approach did not work for me.

~~~
tjr
My apologies. I did not think you expected respect free of charge. Your
description of your job as that of a "code monkey" suggested to me that you
were at the most entry level of programming work, and had yet to "pay your
dues", as it were.

Since you've been working hard at becoming a good programmer, I suspect you'd
have the respect of a lot of folks on this forum, but obtaining the respect of
those who control the corporate world is a whole other story, and one that I
don't claim to understand. I will thus leave you with one more apology for
misunderstanding your initial post, and bid you a welcome to Hacker News.

~~~
wythrep
No problem. I probably didn't make it clear.

------
ambition
It sounds like you're looking for a primer on career management in a large
company. I recommend Jack Welch's book Winning. Available in the business
section of most public libraries, and cheap on Amazon.

~~~
wythrep
Sounded cheesy when I first came across it but if you found it useful I will
give it a more open-minded second look. Thanks.

~~~
ambition
There is cheesy stuff but also very solid advice.

