
Children Are Abandoning Baseball - prostoalex
http://www.wsj.com/articles/why-baseball-is-losing-children-1432136172?mod=e2fb
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douche
Let's see...

1.) You need a shit-load of people to play baseball anything like for-real. At
minimum 15-20 people for two teams. Pretty tough to do as a kid, unless you're
free to roam free all over town to gather a crew, which approximately 0% of
kids have license/protection from CPS to do.

2.) You need a big enough area for a baseball diamond, where you don't have to
worry about knocking out a window with a foul ball or an errant throw. Mostly,
you aren't allowed to use the actual baseball fields to just play pickup.
Compare with soccer or football, where any old open area is good enough, or
basketball, which needs a hoop but probably takes the least space.

3.) Everybody needs at least a baseball glove. You also need a bat and a ball
or two. Compare with sports that really don't require any specialized
equipment, like soccer, football(two-hand-touch or recess-tackle style), and
basketball.

4.) If you live in the northern half of the US, the season for playing
baseball is almost exclusively during the summer months, when school isn't in
session.

5.) Baseball on TV is maybe a half-step better than watching paint dry, and
you have to pay for the privilege. Since they cleaned up the steroids, it's
boring as hell.

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agumonkey
Makes me wonder why did this sport ever become so famous. It's like cricket,
except there are two large competing sports (football and basketball, even
hockey and tennis somehow).

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yareally
Baseball, in its original form (circa 1860s and 70s) was played with a softer
makeshift ball and a modified axe handle and no gloves. It was an activity a
small town could play together as well as a community event where two nearby
communities would come together to play. I believe the American Civil War
played a part in spreading it thoughout the country in a time where news
didn't travel as fast. Basketball also came after baseball and not sure if it
was quite as casual in its early form.

My brothers play for a historic reenactment team of that era and the game
resembles present day softball than baseball with its casual play. There's
players on their team age 18 to 70 and most of the teams they play are
composed of people in smaller towns doing what they did 140 years ago, today.
One of the more interesting games they hold every year is played on the
statehouse lawn against our state representatives after work.

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jlgaddis
I'm not a big fan of baseball anymore but we watched one of these "historic"
games a few years ago at a casino/resort we stay at often.

It was pretty neat to watch, although it took me a bit to understand it as the
rules then were significantly different from present day rules.

~~~
yareally
Oh yeah, they're quite different. I don't believe they really count strikes
unless you swing and no ground rule double means that if a ball gets caught in
a hole or brush, the runners almost always end up with an in the park home
run.

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Yhippa
I get the feeling that having so many games dilutes the quality. I can't watch
regular season basketball, baseball, or hockey because you get the feeling
players sleepwalk through the season until it gets closer to playoff time. The
playoffs of these sports are very exciting to me usually because if you don't
win you're done.

Add to that the idea of intentionally tanking your season so you can do well
in a draft (happens in the NFL too e.g. "Suck for Luck") and I have no idea
how people can be interested in the regular seasons of these sports.

~~~
PhantomGremlin
_you get the feeling players sleepwalk through the season until it gets closer
to playoff time_

I've also had this feeling. What I think should happen (so of course it won't)
is for players to only get paid their absurdly high salaries for the games
they win. Lose and only get league minimum. This would give players an
incentive to play hard each and every game. I'm sure there's a lot wrong with
that idea, and I haven't really though it through.

I don't think that sort of salary structure would work quite as readily in the
NFL. There's much less guaranteed money, and marginal players are always
getting cut. So most on an NFL team do play pretty hard. Also coaching
decisions affect football far more than basketball. Suck for Luck is more on
management than on the players. How do you disincentivise management from
doing that?

And, every so often in the NFL, an Albert Haynesworth comes along and stops
playing after getting a lot of guaranteed money. But that's mostly owner
stupidity at work. Probably a little of that going on this year with Ndamukong
Suh. Certainly a lot lot more of that going on in baseball and basketball with
their ridiculously high guaranteed contracts.

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rogerthis
Didn't read it but, as a non-american, non-japanese nor venezuelan, i wonder
what is the fun of playing baseball, as it is mostly a still sport, with some
sporadic movement. I really enjoy watching it because I can easily read a book
without paying much attention to the game, which I can't do by watching
basketball. But I usually sleep over the book and when i wake up, the game
hasn't finished yet.

~~~
MisterBastahrd
I can do this while watching soccer, too. A lot of movement, nothing actually
happening.

~~~
rogerthis
Me too, but playing soccer is a lot more fun, even for one of the worst player
in the world (myself), who can run the entire field during the whole game
without ever receiving the ball. At least, I do my physical exercises.

~~~
valleyer
Fun is subjective.

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diego_moita
It is not only baseball. The graph on the article shows decline for soccer and
baseball, too.

And the same decline is happening on Brazil and some European countries (for
soccer).

I'd suggest another reason: computer/phone games and internet.

~~~
IVDV
Competitive gaming (esports) is growing rapidly among the typical varsity high
school sports audience. I used to run a high school varsity esports league
around this: [http://www.hsstarleague.com](http://www.hsstarleague.com)

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pool
When my father was growing up, teenagers in the towns around were self-
organizing and played baseball on their own, the guys from this town against
the guys from that town. All summer.

When I was growing up, the grown-ups organized everything and decided who
played when, and we had...maybe ten? games in a summer, with a few practice
sessions before that. It's been a while, but I have the idea that if you were
good enough to be in the lineup regularly, you'd get something like 25 chances
to hit a baseball per year. Or wait, I think we had games that were more like
seven innings. Maybe 25 was an overestimate.

PS Also, something about the death of the baseball card and how the major
league strike of 1994 led a generation to move on.

PPS I remember it being fascinating to learn that teenagers were allowed -- or
had the idea it was possible -- or something -- to do something so on their
own.

~~~
jlgaddis
Baseball was my favorite sport as a kid. I followed it very closely, had
thousands of baseball cards, and could rattle off statistics for hours. I was
about 15 when the strike took place, just old enough to understand what was
going on and decide that I didn't like it -- it really struck me wrong and
made me not care about baseball anymore. I stopped watching it and haven't
cared for it since.

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w1ntermute
That's because baseball is terribly boring, especially compared to football or
basketball. Who wants to spend 90% of the time standing around?

~~~
brandonmenc
> Who wants to spend 90% of the time standing around?

If you've never managed to throw a nice curveball, or hit a homer, or make a
great diving catch, you'll never understand.

You do something like that once, and you can easily get hooked on standing in
line for another chance to replicate it.

It's kind of like golf, but it sounds like you probably don't like that game
either.

~~~
jlgaddis
You're probably right. Like w1ntermute, I find baseball incredibly boring
(even though I did play baseball for a few years when I was younger and quite
enjoyed it). Golf? Even worse.

Probably related, I am an incredibly impatient person. I absolutely cannot
stand to be sitting around "idle" or doing something I perceive to be a waste
of time. It even bothers me to be having a conversation with people who take
forever to tell a story ("just get to the damn point already, I don't need to
hear every little detail!"). Baseball and golf fall into that same category
for me. Why would I want to spend three hours watching a game when I could be
doing something productive?

On the other hand, I ride my Harley every chance I get (to the tune of almost
10,000 miles this past summer). Many days I don't even have a destination when
I leave home. I jump on and just ride. I have many friends I ride with and
occasionally we'll ride a few hours together just to have lunch somewhere and
turn around and come back. Really, I _should_ consider this just as much of a
waste of time but, for whatever reason, I don't see it that way. People who
haven't ever rode a bike can't/don't understand the allure of it or why I
enjoy it so much.

Different strokes for different folks.

~~~
astrange
Taking long drives to nowhere needs constant short term attention, so you're
engaged even though in the end it was an hour you could've done something
better in.

By the way, if you find yourself unable to do anything without a constant
reward or threat of death if you stop paying attention, you have ADHD and
should see a doctor.

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supercanuck
In my neighbourhood, I was shocked to learn that the little league has to
actually pay the city to use the community ball fields.

This came up in a conversation during AYSO soccer game where we were
discussing the rising fees associated with the game.

To add to that, aluminum bats are $100+ and kids get to keep their jerseys.
When I was young, the league recycled jerseys and had community equipment
bags.

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wycx
I wonder if the fact the the US is largely a sports-isolationist is part of
the problem.

Growing up in Australia, the summer was defined by international cricket.
Everyone grows up supporting the national team, everyone can watch the game on
free TV, and an international summer comprises as little as 5 tests and 8 one-
day matches, so it is tractable for kids to watch most of the games. (1990s
era fixtures, things are a little different today: less one-day
internationals, more 2020, and the BBL, though still on free TV). The lack of
constant cricket on TV gives kids time to play it in between watching it.

Contrast with baseball without (1) season-defining international fixtures, (2)
a clearly-defined pinnacle of the game, (3) a national team for all kids to
get behind. Are those hundreds of MBL fixtures largely hidden on cable TV?

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burmask
When you fly over the US, there are thousands of baseball fields. Sadly,
however, there are more options (video games, computers, etc) for how kids
spend their time. Most new baseball players are in-sourced from the Dominican,
Columbia, etc, too. There are still 13-15 million people playing little league
in the US.

Want to see decline - take a look at US Slow Pitch Softball -
[http://www.athleticbusiness.com/Recreation/slow-pitch-
softba...](http://www.athleticbusiness.com/Recreation/slow-pitch-softball-s-
participation-decline-challenges-rec-professionals.html)

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remarkEon
I've heard this sentiment more and more and I don't feel like arguing about it
being boring (I don't think it's boring at all...)

...But I do wonder if there may be a reversal of the trend on the horizon as
the backlash against football grows.

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torbit
I created a "baseball" game that only involves a ball and 2 gloves. The point
is to make the other miss the catch. Fun times creating backyard games.

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lovelettr
Pay walled

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flakie
I googled "Why Children Are Abandoning Baseball" and opened WSJ link there; it
worked. Might give that a try.

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stock_toaster
Or just click "web" under the link here in hackernews.

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ColinWright
Registration required - I can't care enough to bother finding an alternate
source.

Closed.

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alistairSH
Use the "web" link under the title. It does the search for you.

(I wish HN would rename the link, as I see these posts several times a day and
it's a useful feature).

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jlgaddis
It definitely needs renamed, I didn't know about it until just a couple days
ago when someone else mentioned it.

