
Magic Roundabout (Swindon) - franze
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magic_Roundabout_(Swindon)
======
mcv
A better solution for high traffic flow is the turbo roundabout[0] which is
getting increasingly popular in Netherland. Before you enter the roundabout,
you select the lane for the direction you want to go. You only cross traffic
when entering the roundabout for the first time. After that, you simply follow
your lane and it delivery you where you want to go.

It looks complicated from above, but it's very simple once you're on it. It
can handle a much higher traffic flow than other kinds of roundabouts. The
only potential downside is that you need to know where you want to go before
you enter the roundabout. There's no possibility to keep going around until
you figure out where you want to go.

[0]
[https://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turborotonde](https://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turborotonde)
(In Dutch, but with images. "Rotonde" is Dutch for roundabout.)

~~~
dghughes
I don't understand how the turbo roundabout is any different than a typical
two-lane roundabout. It looks like a regular two-lane roundabout from that
picture in your link.

~~~
DanTheManPR
I'm not seeing the difference between this and two lane roundabouts. We have a
bunch of these in the southern suburbs of Minneapolis/St Paul, and they work
well even on roads with moderately high traffic. My only issue with them is
that I find them somewhat scary as a pedestrian during winter.

The first few times I encountered a two lane roundabout, I had some concerns
about whether you had to cut across lanes to exit in some cases (especially
when going straight across the roundabout). But after using it a bit, it's
clear that it works pretty well, and that it's no worse than a 1 lane
roundabout.

~~~
zamadatix
[https://www.google.com/maps/@39.9561738,-86.1623079,150a,35y...](https://www.google.com/maps/@39.9561738,-86.1623079,150a,35y,359.17h/data=!3m1!1e3)
is a "standard" two lane roundabout. Roundabouts like
[https://www.google.com/maps/place/Minneapolis,+MN/@44.883386...](https://www.google.com/maps/place/Minneapolis,+MN/@44.8833864,-93.2865412,111m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m5!3m4!1s0x52b333909377bbbd:0x939fc9842f7aee07!8m2!3d44.977753!4d-93.2650108)
are more similar to a turbo roundabout but does not force traffic out after 3
exits or less, the inner lane could be followed indefinitely.

~~~
mcv
On that second link, I don't see any roundabout at all. It looks like a
regular intersection to me.

~~~
Ajedi32
Maybe the aerial imagery is out of date? It looks like a regular intersection
on the satellite view, but Google Maps has it marked as a roundabout.

~~~
zamadatix
This is interesting, I seem to be getting newer aerial imagery than either of
you [https://i.imgur.com/tC6fsQm.jpg](https://i.imgur.com/tC6fsQm.jpg)

~~~
bena
If you switch to globe view, the image changes.

~~~
zamadatix
Yep that's it, globe view has the newer image and legacy mode has the older
image.

------
djaychela
I first drove this back in the early 90s when I happened to be near Swindon
(for some training), and a friend (who often worked in the area) had told me
about it, so I deliberately went to it. Bear in mind this is pre-common-
internet use era, so everything was hearsay and so on...

He told me it was a 'nightmare', and 'weird' and so on. I was actually pretty
underwhelmed when I drove it - it seemed really logical to me, and it was a
bit of a non-event - I was expecting some kind of white-khuckle 'driving in
Marrakech' sort of experience. I think people's perceptions of it are
significantly different from reality, but maybe that's because it makes sense
to me, but if it's as safe as they say it is, maybe not...

~~~
vanderZwan
I wouldn't be surprised if it is safe partially _because_ people think it's a
nightmare to navigate

~~~
superhuzza
That's pretty much what the Wikipedia article claims, the roundabout has an
"excellent safety record, since traffic moves too slowly to do serious damage
in the event of a collision"

~~~
TheOtherHobbes
I used to drive over it occasionally. It was _always_ decorated with broken
glass from a collision.

It's true it has a good safety record if you consider fatalities/injuries. But
that's because it's impossible to cross it at speed unless it's completely
empty.

I suspect its record for minor collision damage is less reassuring.

The fundamental problem is situational awareness. On a normal roundabout you
only have to look in one direction. On the magic roundabout you have to be
aware of traffic from the left, right, and front - and if you're not a regular
user, you have to do this while trying to navigate the design.

~~~
hermitcrab
I've lived within a mile of the 'magic roundabout' for about 10 years. I
traverse it frequently. I have never seen a collision or broken glass on it.

Although it is a bit intimidating the first time you use it (especially if you
are from a country that doesn't have many roundabouts) the locals like it. It
works very well and the traffic keeps flowing even at busy times. They even
put the fire station right on the roundabout. ;0)

------
snowwrestler
> however, the roundabout provides a better throughput of traffic than other
> designs and has an excellent safety record, since traffic moves too slowly
> to do serious damage in the event of a collision. In 2010, the National
> Cooperative Highway Research Program concluded that the roundabout reduces
> injurious crashes by three quarters.

One of the hardest things in local democracy is that the best traffic patterns
are often also traffic patterns that are unpopular with motorists. Sometimes
that is directly linked (e.g. “road calming” where narrowing the road forces
drivers to pay closer attention to their surroundings) and sometimes it’s just
that the aggregate statistics are counter-intuitive (e.g. “road diets” where
trading 2 lanes in each direction for 1 each direction + center turn lane
often has no impact on total throughput).

~~~
ken
The problem, as always, is that parties disagree on what "best" means.

Governments and safety organizations are pushing for "Vision Zero", i.e.,
safety at any cost. (My economics professor once pointed out that if you
really want zero traffic deaths, just limit all cars to 5 mph everywhere.) For
people driving on the road, the current level of risk (roughly 1 death per
100M miles) is acceptable, and arriving quickly is desirable.

Once you get to the point where the numbers are really tiny, safety is hard.
It's tough to make people follow procedures when they've never seen any
problems from violating them.

I see this effect happen with software, too.

~~~
caconym_
True, but in this case (apparently) there is the added wrinkle that this
roundabout has better throughput than other designs, so what’s the downside? I
guess it forces people to think harder than they’d normally have to while
driving?

I definitely find myself taking slightly longer routes that let me avoid
stressful situations, e.g. turning left onto a busy road.

------
njb311
I lived in Swindon for 2 years and while drivers can find different things
challenging, I would venture to say that it's a lot more straightforward when
you're on it than you might imagine. It separates traffic effectively at peak
times according to which roads they enter/leave, and as many have mentioned it
slows cars down so you aren't pressured to make snap decisions either if you
aren't sure. If all else fails, you can follow the car in front of you and if
you picked the correct lane at first entry the chances are you will be led to
the correct exit point.

Pedestrians don't really feature from a safety perspective because there are
light-controlled crossings all the way around the fringe. The problems I saw
were when arrogant/impatient people (as opposed to first-timers) saw a gap
that was intentionally left because of the way traffic flows from one
roundabout to the next, and would speed past two or three cars then push in.
But those people cause problems everywhere.

~~~
swarnie_
I grew up in Swindon and took my driving test there. The only complication
usually is drivers who don't know ho to use it / are timid.

Also the football ground on the corner doesn't help when 1000s of people all
arrive at those lights at the same time it can cause chaos.

------
scoot
For a real nightmare roundabout, the winner has to be Place Charles de Gaulle
around the Arc de Triumph in Paris[0].

It is about 8 lanes across, with no lane markings, and with vehicles entering
the roundabout from one of 12 junctions having right-of-way.

I'm not sure what was happening on the day the Google maps aerial photo was
taken, as it unfortunately it doesn't show the chaos that normally ensues.

[0]
[https://www.google.com/maps/place/Arc+de+Triomphe/@48.873766...](https://www.google.com/maps/place/Arc+de+Triomphe/@48.8737669,2.2943922,208m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m5!3m4!1s0x47e66fec70fb1d8f:0xd9b5676e112e643d!8m2!3d48.8737917!4d2.2950275)

~~~
jandrese
I've never looked at the Google Maps image of the Arc de Triumph before so a
question immediately comes to mind upon looking at it. How the hell did all of
those tourists/pedestrians get there? There doesn't appear to be parking on
the inside of the circle, nor any apparent crosswalks at that 12 lane circular
nightmare. Is there a tunnel hidden underneath you can go through? There's no
apparent exit unless it is inside of the monument. Is there a shuttlebus that
just straight up blocks the inner lane when it shows up?

~~~
roberto
There's a tunnel. I was there with my dad in 1993, and we only discovered the
tunnel _after_ we crossed the 8 lanes to get to the monument.

------
chrishannah
That's not even the best "Magic Roundabout", the one in my town is much
better!
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magic_Roundabout_(Hemel_Hempst...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magic_Roundabout_\(Hemel_Hempstead\))

~~~
mabbo
I'm Canadian. We had a work trip to the UK. My manager kept saying "I think I
can handle driving in there, how bad could it be?". I told him we'd die.

As we went through the Hemel Hempstead magic roundabout in the back of a cab,
he turned to me and said "Okay... you might have been right."

~~~
Reason077
Statistically, you are less likely to die compared to driving in Canada. UK
roads may be confusing, but they are significantly safer than Canadian roads,
as measured by fatalities per billion km driven.

(And Canada is already among the safest non-European countries, with
significantly fewer fatalities compared to the USA)

~~~
mabbo
This was years ago and I have actually now driven in the UK myself. Yes, I'm
sure overall I'd be less likely to die if I were driving every day in the UK
vs driving every day in Canada.

But let me tell you, the _first_ day driving on the other side of the road is
a real doozy. And I nearly died a couple of times. And I was doing my very
best to avoid "magic roundabouts".

(I actually drove all week through rural Wales, which was a different kind of
adventure)

------
kaffeemitsahne
Imagine coming from mainland europe and having to drive on the other side of
the road (thus also taking roundabouts the other way round), and then
navigating this baby...

~~~
Sean1708
I strongly believe that the biggest reason people struggle with the Magic
Roundabout is because it's called a roundabout, when it's actually just a
collection of 5 roundabouts. If you tackle it one roundabout at a time it's
actually not that bad at all, it could be much much _better_ , but it's not
_bad_.

~~~
VBprogrammer
I prefer magic roundabouts to the strange concoction which I've only ever seen
in the Staines / Heathrow area; A roundabout with one road continuing straight
through the roundabout. In order to run right you need to be left most lane
approaching it. Turning right from the side road, it's ambiguous whether you
are supposed to turn right onto the section of the main road going straight
through or continue all the way around.

------
kerkeslager
I guess what this shows is two things:

1\. Scaring people into slowing down is a viable way to avoid accidents.

2\. Perceived scariness of an intersection is not indicative of how dangerous
it actually is.

~~~
TheCapn
RE: #2

Absolutely. Within Saskatchewan, east of Regina, we just completed three new
bridges for suburban communities to access the main highway. In two of the
three bridges were atypical designs using a Diverging Diamond at one point,
and dual roundabouts at the other.

When announced lots of people were fearful of the new designs and there was
unsurprisingly a lot of outcry from ninnies who were afraid of the unknown.
There's been _a couple_ instances of people taking improper directions on the
bridges but they're typically by elderly drivers who probably shouldn't have
been behind the wheel in the first place.

I personally have my own qualms with the design of one of the bridges but
that's outside this discussion. I like the concept enough that I hope to see
them use diverging diamond more and more roundabouts as people get used to the
efficient flow.

~~~
kerkeslager
Another example of this is the downtown area of a small PA town I stopped in
recently. They had recently re-paved the entire center street with brick and
stone. The sidewalks were wide and there were no curbs, only rubber-covered
metal posts marking the boundary between car and pedestrian areas. As a
driver, I found this design scary, because it was hard to visually see where I
should be driving. But I noticed that the natural result of this was that I
drove around 15mph despite signs coming into the town saying 25mph as the
speed limit. Another cause of this is that the sound of bricks under your
tires gives the impression that you're going faster than you actually are. It
was scary, but it put my focus as a driver on not hitting pedestrians, poles,
or other cars, rather than slavishly following lines and curbs. Not hitting
pedestrians, poles, and other cars is the entire point of the lines and curbs,
so it's a more direct way to solve the problem.

I think the fear aspect comes from the fact that hitting a pedestrian seemed
like a real possibility the entire time I was in the town. But that fear is
rational: there _is_ a real possibility of hitting a pedestrian, and a high-
foot-traffic area shouldn't be designed to assuage that rational fear. Drivers
_should_ be afraid of hitting pedestrians.

A placard commemorating the redesign in the town square said that since the
redesign in 2017, car/pedestrian accidents dropped from 279 to 43.

* I'm citing numbers and locations from memory here so take this all with a grain of salt. I only stopped in the town for lunch on a long drive, so I don't remember all the details. My memory for numbers is usually good, but is not infallible.

~~~
JdeBP
This is actually a fairly common redesign that one can find in several
countries around the world over the past decade or so.

------
dijit
I grew up near a city called Birmingham in the UK which has it's share of...
disturbing junctions:

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Five_Ways,_Birmingham](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Five_Ways,_Birmingham)

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravelly_Hill_Interchange](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gravelly_Hill_Interchange)

They look insane on a map, they must have been hellish to navigate before GPS.

~~~
camjw
Spaghetti junction is still hellish...

~~~
eps
It looks like a fairly routine Japanese highway junction though.

------
satori99
The traffic engineer who managed to convince authorities that this was the
solution to their problems must've been very charismatic.

~~~
laumars
They look scarier than they are in practice. What I hate more is those massive
roundabouts with traffic lights on where dual carriageways meet. On those
things you still have a mix of cars who don't know where they're going and
lanes to be away of, but in addition you have traffic lights and cars moving
at much higher speeds than on magic roundabouts.

~~~
dmitriid
Barcelona. It's fine to have a roundabout where several roads meet, each with
multiple lanes, and the circle itself to have 6 or more lanes [1]

[1] As an example
[https://www.google.com/maps/@41.3748215,2.1491456,232m/data=...](https://www.google.com/maps/@41.3748215,2.1491456,232m/data=!3m1!1e3)

~~~
laumars
That does look a busy junction but I was thinking more like when motorways
cross.

[https://www.google.com/maps/place/Stansted+CM24+8JT/@51.8715...](https://www.google.com/maps/place/Stansted+CM24+8JT/@51.8715988,0.1993421,304m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m5!3m4!1s0x47d88f64abc6132b:0xe9579511ff3bb274!8m2!3d51.905225!4d0.19691)

This example is by no means the worse in the UK -- far from it -- but it does
illustrate how cars can be going round at high speeds even when it's not
really safe to.

It amazes me there aren't any fatalities on these kinds of junctions because
it's a horrible mix of speed, heavy traffic, lighter and heavier vehicles (eg
you get plenty of lorries on there too) and clueless drivers. A real bad
recipe. But it might just be my lack of faith in other drivers that makes me
nervous on those junctions rather than them being inherently unsafe.

------
SmellyGeekBoy
I bought a DEC MicroVAX on ebay a few years ago and the seller lived in
Swindon. I passed through the Magic Roundabout on the way there and the way
back (during rush hour). Having never encountered anything like it before it
was... Well, I'd love to tell you a horror story, but to be honest it was all
very logical and flowed very well.

------
colourgarden
My favourite part of the entry is that it lead me to the discovery of the UK
Roundabout Appreciation Society. Never change Britain.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roundabout_Appreciation_Societ...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roundabout_Appreciation_Society)

~~~
Symbiote
Someone gave me the book "Roundabouts of Great Britain"[1].

I haven't read it for a while, but I think there's an explanation in the book
from the printing company -- they wanted to test out their new colour printing
press, so sent someone round the industrial estate with a camera and made a
calendar. Potential clients were given it as a sample, but they then received
requests to purchase them, and eventually made the book.

[1]
[https://books.google.dk/books/about/Roundabouts_of_Great_Bri...](https://books.google.dk/books/about/Roundabouts_of_Great_Britain.html?id=C9n8AAAACAAJ&source=kp_book_description&redir_esc=y)

------
jzwinck
I recently cycled some of the south coast of China. Some small towns there had
roundabouts which served to slow traffic down but had a different pattern than
westerners are used to. They drive on the right, but people who want to turn
left would do so immediately, keeping the centre island on their right side.
People turning right or going straight would use the roundabout the same as
westerners.

I also encountered a T junction with three lanes in each direction and traffic
lights. When the lanes coming from the bottom had green lights they were one
right and two left, and at the same time the rightmost lane coming from the
right had a green light to go straight. Three inputs and three outputs, but
sure surprised me. Traffic patterns are very local and often undocumented.
Just like code.

~~~
mumblemumble
Chicago has those as well. I believe you're supposed to go all the way around
the central circle when making a left turn, but nobody does.

My favorite roundabout ever is a large traditional one with only two
entrances/exits. Reminds me of a lot of codebases I've encountered.

------
skrebbel
Little detail, I love that they actually call it the Magic Roundabout in eg
the traffic signs. I mean, it's a children's TV reference. Super nice, not
everything official must be boring and dull.

------
tomohawk
When I was visiting the UK, I ended up driving through this intersection a
couple of times. It wasn't really a big deal, even for someone not used to
roundabouts or driving on the left.

~~~
chrisseaton
Right - people tell me they find roundabouts really confusing but I say:
imagine a one way street, and you're joining it at a T-junction. If you're in
the UK the one-way street is going left. If you're in Europe or America it's
going right. That's literally all a roundabout is. You can forget about the
fact that it's circular. There's no extra rules I believe.

~~~
andybak
What about the fact it has two lanes?

~~~
chrisseaton
How's is it different to any other road with two lanes?

If you're about to turn off then be on the inside lane. If you're not turning
off then be on the outside lane.

~~~
andybak
On a roundabout there's usually not enough time to consider turning off as two
separate maneuvers. Instead you follow certain rules and it "just works".

i.e. join on the outside lane if you're turning off immediately and join the
inside lane otherwise.

------
OliC
My driving instructor sketched The Magic on paper and asked me to draw various
routes before he let me drive on it. My driving test went over it, so at least
I was prepared!

------
cognaitiv
with overhead video...

[https://youtu.be/6OGvj7GZSIo](https://youtu.be/6OGvj7GZSIo)

------
beerandt
Metrics at work:

>however, the roundabout provides a better throughput of traffic than other
designs and has an excellent safety record, _since traffic moves too slowly to
do serious damage in the event of a collision_.

~~~
Renevith
Indeed! This is a great example of why it's important to actually measure the
things you care about, and not use a proxy or your gut feeling. If you just go
by perception, the slower-moving traffic might fool you into thinking the
roundabout has _less_ throughput.

------
Reason077
The Swindon Magic Roundabout is a frequent topic on HN:

2012:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4915586](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4915586)

2016:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11652868](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11652868)

2017:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15211579](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15211579)

------
fit2rule
I've navigated this thing a few times. The first time I just stayed on it for
20 minutes, trying to work it out, and yeah .. basically just confused as hell
for a while.

Subsequent trips were easy. If you're intimidated, just get on it and stay on
it until you feel like you get where it's going. Those crossovers are dodgy AF
though, especially with irate lorry drivers who are, most likely, also pretty
stressed for having to do the thing ..

------
Vaanir
I live close to this magnificent piece of engineering, AMA.

~~~
smcl
It’s not easy to understand _why_ it is structured this way. As a local do you
have any idea why it’s composed of five mini roundabouts instead of just a
single one? Does it feel like it handles high levels of traffic better?

~~~
Vaanir
I'm not sure on the _actual_ design decision reasonings, however you can reach
many of the exit junctions with multiple routes. So if everyone drove around
it sensibly, there _would_ be fewer cars stuck in traffic.

~~~
clarry
I'd have to see a study or simulation. I can't take it on faith, because what
I see is very many points where cars have to stop and yield. Multiple routes
could just imply packing more cars into one ginormous intersection where they
block each other trying to get in or out. And where you have multiple routes
to one junction, you have merging.

------
dghughes
My Canadian province has been on a big roundabout building spree. Nothing
fancy just one lane or two lane types. I like them but many people fear them
for some reason I suspect because they don't understand them. Some people
actually go the wrong way when entering (against traffic). Some people will
cross from an outside lane over the inner lane nearly crashing into cars.

~~~
blackearl
If you live or learned to drive somewhere that doesn't have them I can
understand being confused or scared by it. I love them but frequently see
people stop in the middle of one because they think they need to yield to
those entering

~~~
pashky
This was the default rule in Russia until very recently. Most (but not all) of
roundabouts had yield signs on each entrance essentially enforcing “normal”
rule, still it’s an utter source of confusion as many larger roundabouts have
complex priority signs and lights systems, so it couldn’t go into muscle
memory.

------
zabzonk
Hanger Lane Gyratory System - the most frightening roundabout in the UK (or
possibly anywhere) - [https://www.mylondon.news/news/west-london-news/ealings-
noto...](https://www.mylondon.news/news/west-london-news/ealings-notorious-
hanger-lane-gyratory-14637375)

~~~
mft_
Having commuted through it every day for 2.5 years, I’m genuinely not sure
what the fuss is about. It’s just a big roundabout. (And while this isn’t a
pure positive!) if you were unsure, it was usually so slow moving you had
plenty of time to figure out what to do.

The only disturbing aspect it brought to my life wasn’t navigation stress, but
rather its unpredictable effect on my commute. :)

~~~
zabzonk
> if you were unsure, it was usually so slow moving you had plenty of time to
> figure out what to do.

I don't drive, so I wasn't unsure, just terrified, as you would be if you
being driven round it by my then girlfriend, who combined the driving skills
of a rally driver with the mentality of Mr Toad from Wind In The Willows.

------
larntz
If this was voted the 4th scariest intersection where the first 3?

NVM: Found the answer in the wiki.
[http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/london/7140892.st...](http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/london/7140892.stm)

~~~
capableweb
In usual fashion, Wikipedia links sources where they can. In this case, this
is the source:
[http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/scotland/glasgow_and_west...](http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/scotland/glasgow_and_west/8382506.stm)

------
logifail
There's one just like this North of Hatton Cross Station (just outside the
perimeter road of Heathrow Airport) ...

[https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=18/51.46733/-0.42398](https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=18/51.46733/-0.42398)

------
mattlondon
These are actually pretty easy to drive around: just think of it as a tiny
ring road with round-abouts along it.

The only difference between this and a "normal" ring road with round-abouts is
that the distance between roundabouts is 50m not 5km :)

------
dboreham
A sign of globalization: there are now many roundabouts in Montana. I get the
impression that every new road construction project, where there is space,
uses roundabouts. Many drivers still don't understand how to use them however.

------
jeremiahlee
The linked page didn't explain how it worked well, but this Wired video does:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6OGvj7GZSIo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6OGvj7GZSIo)

------
wexxy
The closest thing to this I've seen in America is a 5 points intersection,
which most of just have a sign that says "keep right" or something to that
effect. Might as well just say "Good Luck!"

~~~
osullivj
Columbus Circle in NYC, on the corner of the park [1]

[1]
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columbus_Circle](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columbus_Circle)

------
oppositelock
I build maps for a living. This roundabout complex has been a test case for
map building systems for at least the last fifteen years. It's positively
brutal in its special cases.

------
BurnGpuBurn
Never change, you brilliant British bastards.

------
benjamta
This roundabout still gives me shudders after learning to drive (well trying
to learn to drive) in Swindon in the 90s.

------
dsfyu404ed
I find the whole "inner ring for people who know what they're doing and outer
ring for people who have no business driving in heavy traffic" concept highly
attractive but the fact that the safety claims revolve around injuries and
makes no mention of overall accidents (if it reduced overall accidents surely
they would mention it) makes me suspect this thing is a fender bender (and
therefore traffic jam) factory.

~~~
oskarpearson
From tfa:

> In 2010, the National Cooperative Highway Research Program concluded that
> the roundabout reduces injurious crashes by three quarters

~~~
dsfyu404ed
>From tfa:

> In 2010, the National Cooperative Highway Research Program concluded that
> the roundabout reduces injurious crashes by three quarters

Since you seem to find it fit to question if I read the article I may as well
question whether or not you even read my comment.

I specifically mentioned the article's claims about injury reduction (which I
don't doubt). How could I possibly question what is omitted from those claims
(overall accident reduction) if I didn't read the article to read those claims
in the first place?

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pow_pp_-1_v
I wonder how people with a terrible sense of direction (like me) handle this
roundabout. Seems like a nightmare.

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adblu
Fucking britain. Only then can invent such pointless solution.

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twodave
A valuable thing to remember about roundabouts is that they are generally
meant to slow down traffic in areas of high pedestrian activity and are, above
all else, a safety mechanism.

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clarry
There are roundabouts in places with no pedestrians at all.

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twodave
I never implied there weren’t.

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_pmf_
I'd crash so hard ...

