
Microsoft announces new Surface Duo phone - aminecodes
https://www.theverge.com/2019/10/2/20895128/microsoft-surface-phone-foldable-screen-features-specs-price-release-date
======
mwsfc
Between this and the Samsung Fold it feels like we have entered into the
netbook (form factor) era* void. We're past peak smartphone development and
are in this space where manufacturers are stumbling around for the next "it"
device but creating nothing that is truly revolutionary. Yes, there are "some"
use cases where a larger screen on my mobile device would be useful…. But by-
and-large I still want it to fit in my pocket and be comfortable navigating
single handedly . Adding dual screen & doubling the device thickness is not
the solution I am looking for.

*Netbooks were low-powered mobile devices (basically mini laptops) that launched in 2007 and basically disappeared (as a viable market category) after the iPad and its kind were launched in 2010.

EDIT added "form factor" for clarification

~~~
sixstringtheory
I think the future is less/no screen. Typing on these folding phones seems
like a worse experience. Typing at all isn't really natural, and neither is
staring at planar, glowing glass.

I think the future is conversational computing. I don't own an
Alexa/HomePod/etc (yet... maybe some open source on prem thing at some point),
but I think that's where the puck is moving. It's just that today their
capabilities are somewhere around a rotary phone vs. an iPhone. Better than a
telegraph (which I guess in this analogy is _typing_ your words into a
document) but still very rudimentary. All it needs is time and effort.

Similar to HomePods, we have AirPods and their equivalents. The phone is just
a conduit through which can pass the data necessary for the OS to talk with
you, to do what you need.

~~~
untog
Strongly disagree with this. As someone who does own a number of Google Home
devices at home and uses Siri on my phone... voice is a terrible interface.

For one, there is zero discoverability. I can ask Google today's weather. I
can ask tomorrow's weather. I cannot ask yesterday's weather. Leaving aside
why that would be (I would find it useful to know that it's X degrees
hotter/cooler than yesterday) there's no way for me to know that without
asking. It's the audio equivalent of fumbling around on a keyboard in a pitch
black room. Just imagine placing a food order. It's going to have to read a
menu to you and you're going to have to remember it all. No amount of tech
improvement is going to change that fundamental fact.

Secondly, you can't multi-task. Or have more than one person using it
simultaneously. Right now my wife and I might be looking at our phones at the
same time, perhaps looking stuff up, maybe tapping out an e-mail. We'd have to
go to separate rooms to do that.

But if I want to know today's weather or play a song, it works fine. As long
as it recognises my voice correctly and there isn't too much background noise.

~~~
sixstringtheory
We definitely agree that voice interfaces are very rudimentary today. I try to
run lots of things through dictation first that normally I would type out with
my thumbs on the smartphone or on a keyboard on my computer. Text messages,
search terms, commit messages, Slack conversations. Still, it can't perform
very basic tasks like changing or backspacing a word or phrase, either because
it misheard it or because you want to change it. (And actually as I dictated
this paragraph on my 2018 MacBook Pro, it typed out everything I said twice
and still required typing interventions, and eventually I just fell back to
typing everything.)

You've laid out some good criteria though. I wouldn't say voice interfaces
have really "made it" until it gets to the point where you don't have to ask
how to ask it to do something (discoverability). You just ask it to do
something and it does it. Although that's just one of many criteria.

The food menu problem is interesting, but pretty much everything that prints
out on a ticket in a kitchen is structured data–it should be able to be
efficiently conversationalized (preference notwithstanding, of course).
Certainly there are many ways you could talk to someone about a menu: what
kinds of dishes are there? Appetizers, grilled entrees, pasta, salads,
desserts. What kind of entrees? Vegetarian, pork, beef, seafood. OK, but what
styles of cuisine? Jamaican, Italian, Szechuan. There's probably an analog to
the 5 Why's for figuring out what someone wants to eat! Asking yesterday's
weather, though, is a specific case that could probably be solved by an
intern, provided that data is easy to find on the Internet (FWIW, I've
searched for the very same thing many times and it's much harder to find vs
forecasts).

I concede that there will always be a need for graphical interfaces. How do
you "speak" a map, or a CAD model? I guess I was just thinking of things that
can accomplished with a keyboard. You can speak anything you can type, even if
it's as rudimentary as today, where you have to say "period newline newline"
to end a sentence at the end of a paragraph while dictating.

I agree it might seem tough to multitask. But consider WiFi routers serving
multiple computers, or hell, even CPUs serving different processes,
"simultaneously." If voice recognition and NLP become sufficiently
sophisticated I could foresee being able to isolate multiple overlapping
voices in an audio sample. If not, consider that you could ask it to look
something up, immediately followed by your wife dictating an email to send–or
one of you could even interrupt the other–and it could be able to handle the
context switching and queuing at speed.

And I understand there's a lot I don't know, and I do remain skeptical that
this could ever be perfected. Would it really be able to dictate poetry? Would
the forms I create or creatively destroy in free verse just totally confuse
the voice interface? Would it be smart enough to side step the confusion via
some pseudo-meta-cognitive process and ask me what the hell I'm doing?

~~~
untog
> Certainly there are many ways you could talk to someone about a menu: what
> kinds of dishes are there? Appetizers, grilled entrees, pasta, salads,
> desserts. What kind of entrees? Vegetarian, pork, beef, seafood. OK, but
> what styles of cuisine? Jamaican, Italian, Szechuan. There's probably an
> analog to the 5 Why's for figuring out what someone wants to eat!

To me this is the core of why voice interfaces will always be inferior. In the
time it would take that voice conversation to happen I would have been able to
scan a menu a dozen times over. Our brains are incredibly adept at picking out
visual details - identifying the headers that note each section of the menu,
picking out key words that may interest us and so on. There is no
technological improvement that will help a voice interface rival that.

~~~
sixstringtheory
Have you ever watched a person with vision challenges using VoiceOver with the
speed cranked up? I bet they could absorb the info they need to know about a
menu before the average reader could, even before any hierarchical
organization is exposed to the text-to-speech process. The visual hierarchical
and keyword navigation you describe is just what I'm talking about with a
voice interface, too.

Just yesterday a colleague I was pairing with was VoiceOvering JSON packed
with API keys and stack traces. I, conversely, have many times stood with the
fridge door open trying to find something that was plainly front and center.
Of course, the answer for many things may be a combination of both hearing and
vision.

I also wonder if this easily navigable menu you are thinking of is already
cognitively mapped in your mind, and you know what to look for. What if the
menu is in a foreign or second language, that the voice assistant could
translate for you? Or is a completely foreign-to-you cuisine, or just
creatively organized in a way you aren't used to, like by seasonality, emotion
or geography? I've sat and stared at some dense menus, that I've had to reread
multiple times to remember just a subset of the items. In the end I asked the
waiter something like in my example: "something with shrimp" or "what do you
like?"

I'm not so sure about the things you say will never or always be, and I don't
even consider myself an optimist. Finally, thanks for taking this ride with
me, it's definitely made me consider more things!

------
canada_dry
IMHO, the hinged - but separate - displays are a much better idea than the
Samsung foldable display. At least for now.

I don't think the reliability of a truly foldable display (e.g. Samsung's
Galaxy Fold) will be very good until another couple versions of generational
improvements.

~~~
aylmao
+1. IMO the move is to focus on this type of devices and then move to foldable
screens if/when both the technology matures, and there is solid demand for
this form factor.

The foldable display seems cool, but also seems to be, IMO, an expensive
solution looking for something we don't know to be a problem yet. The problem
is having no screen at the hinge. How big is this problem though? In theory
it's nice but people don't even have foldable devices in these form factors
yet. For all we know, most people might not mind the dual-screen approach,
just like a lot of people have not minded the notch or other shortcomings of
previous and current devices.

------
pier25
Personally I don't see the attractive in dual screen devices unless we reach
Westworld-like devices that are super thin and can go from phone to large
tablet that can potentially replace a laptop.

Otherwise it's just a thick phone that converts to 2 phones...

In case anyone hasn't seen Westworld:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q3dD7jOLaes](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q3dD7jOLaes)

~~~
BOBOTWINSTON
I'm excited for two reasons.

I find the ability to completely "close" my phone really appealing. It feels
easier to ignore it, and the screens feel more protected to me.

I can also only describe the second benefit as "its like two monitors". I can
watch TV on one and respond to messages/browse on another. I use a Note8+
already, so big screens for watching crap are already my preference though.

~~~
GordonS
Clamshell phones let you close your phone completely, and have been around for
a long time. Actually, are they still a thing?

~~~
smush
So Clamshell Android phones are a thing. The Freetel Mushashi is a T9-style
Android phone with dual touch screens on either side.

Samsung has the Android W series phones which have a similar format.

Regarding the sibling comment, after the Droid 4 and the Motorola Photon Q,
there has been a drought of physical keyboard landscape slider phones.
Portrait sliders have been available for the Blackberry Priv and KeyOne/Key2,
but aside from the soon-to-be-released Fxtec Pro1, not much landscape slider
android phone action is going on.

------
bhauer
I'm going to pick one up regardless, but if they can bring Windows 10 X to
this device, and provide a docking experience that expands to approximate a
full PC, the result would be fantastic.

~~~
chooseaname
This is still my holy grail of computing device. I want a portable device
(phone) that gives me a phone style interface when portable, but when docked,
a desktop-like experience. Yes, there have been efforts, but I want this to be
mainstream and well thought out.

~~~
ijidak
Agree! Will somebody please make this!

I want to simply have a keyboard and screen that "looks like a laptop" but the
brains is actually in the phone in my pocket!

And then when I have a proper dock, I just get a larger monitor(s) and larger
desktop keyboard.

But the brains are still in the phone!

The key benefit (of the dumb laptop, especially) is I still want a laptop on
the go, but..

1\. Why manage data flow across two separate devices. My phone becomes truth,
always.

2\. My phone already has always-on data. Why worry about data for two devices.
(To 4/5-g subscriptions, etc.) Searching for wi-fi.

3\. Better power consumption for my "dumb laptop" device. (Less processing
power in the laptop, hopefully space for a bigger battery)

I would buy this in a heartbeat!

~~~
i-am-cjc
I have a NexDock that I think was a kickstarter a few years ago that is a dumb
laptop (hdmi in, usb for charging, bluetooth keyboard and mouse) that could be
plugged into a phone. Used it for Raspberry Pis and Intel Compute sticks for a
while.

I am hoping I can do this with the librem5 and a dock.

------
danielovichdk
I miss Windows Phone everyday.

The best designed UI imo, and a great alternative to Ios and android.

~~~
chooseaname
I wasn't a fan of the UI, but I can still appreciate the speed and fluidity of
the phones I saw my friends using. We certainly need more than just iOS and
Android in the market. But, I guess I'm wrong as the market spoke...

~~~
WorldMaker
It wasn't even "the market" that spoke so much as US telecom companies. ("Vote
with your wallet just means the rich and the mega-corporations have more
votes.") Windows Phone had a good enough market share in Europe and Asia to
remain a viable and competitive third place contender for a long time. It was
the US where Windows Phone got locked out of the market duopoly by bad deals
with AT&T and Verizon, and indications existed that all of the US telecoms
were much happier with a duopoly than training/sales/marketing anything beyond
that (whether or not that was an anti-competitive trust is left for your own
imagination, it's not like the US has strong anti-trust teeth right now).

~~~
Faark
What you are describing is the usual problem of establishing a two sided
market. You need users to make app developers care. You need apps to get users
in the first place. From what I remember, MS already had to build some apps
themselves / offer significant financial incentives [0]. This seemed hardly
sustainable and thus the death of the product was, while disappointing, not a
surprise.

So yeah, you don't need a conspiracy to explain this failure.

[0] [https://www.pcworld.com/article/2031384/microsoft-stokes-
win...](https://www.pcworld.com/article/2031384/microsoft-stokes-windows-app-
development-with-cash.html)

~~~
WorldMaker
You can't get users for a product no one can buy. Calling it a conspiracy was
largely a gag, but if anything it _was_ a conspiracy of dunces.

Verizon refusing to sell _and_ refusing to allow on their network the Lumia
950 because of a hissy fit that they didn't like how the previous flagship
performed and that Microsoft got an almost favorable AT&T deal for the 950 was
dumb on several levels.

AT&T getting bored with their 950 deal and then refusing to
advertise/market/sell the phone, was certainly _a_ death nail, partly because
it was so much easier and cheaper to just micro-manage the Android platform.

It might not have killed the platform in the US if there were more than one
phone manufacturer in Windows Phone at that point in time.

(That calls into question if the Nokia buy out was the right move. Which with
Nokia last one standing already, it was probably the only move, but the
platform had enough market share before Nokia was at risk of tanking that had
a couple Android manufacturers gotten fed up with Google at the time things
_could_ have gone differently. Though admittedly, armchair quarterbacking is
easier with hindsight.)

The app situation was always something that could have been addressed if
people were (capable of) buying the platform. The lack of OEM manufacturers
and the lack of support/interest from the carriers certainly mattered more
than apps at crashing marketshare of the platform below the critical threshold
for active application development.

~~~
wayfinder
I don't think people were ever going to buy in to the platform. I liked
Windows Phone, but it had basically no substantial feature that made people
think "wow, it's worth it to drop Android and iOS for /this/."

You got Android if you overwhelmingly wanted the customization. You got an
iPhone if you overwhelmingly wanted something that was smooth and worked well.
I tried WP for a while and I missed nothing major by switching away.

------
jbigelow76
I like how on the Duo and larger Neo Microsoft just embraced the fact that
foldable OLED isn't ready for prime time yet and instead tried to engineer the
seam with as much aesthetic and engineering quality possible.

~~~
r00fus
It is definitely the right approach to the question "how do you engineer a
folding display?".

The bigger question is "what do you need a folding display for?"...

~~~
baby
I think this is the wrong approach to think about. Nobody needs a folding
display.

What people need are actually two contradictory (until now) goals: compactness
and large screen size. Folding is one solution to solve this contradiction.

~~~
r00fus
Agreed. Which is why most people thought phones would have projection displays
and/or keyboards a decade ago... I wonder where that all went?

------
atjamielittle
It took almost 30 years since the kernel was released, but Microsoft is
officially releasing something with a Linux based operating system. Pretty
wild to think about.

~~~
com2kid
They've had Linux Azure offerings for quite a few years, and famously
contributed a fair bit of code to the Linux kernel to make some of that
possible.

They also released those Nokia branded Android devices.

It is not like MS has been doing consumer hardware releases for that long or
anything!

It'll be interesting to see the support, IMHO one thing that keeps people
(software devs and consumers) from buying into a new Android OEM that is
selling an "Ecosystem" (e.g. Samsung Note) is the fear of a product line being
dropped.

------
yRetsyM
"Partnering with Google" \- Be very interesting to see what that partnership
entails.

~~~
aminecodes
It seems it can run Android apps.

~~~
styx31
It seems it runs on android (with a windows theme).

~~~
aminecodes
True, I wrote that comment as I was watching the announcement live stream.
It's still pretty much a prototype at this point but I hope they don't mess up
that windows theme a lot.

------
knolan
Remember the Courier?

[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Courier](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Courier)

~~~
mc32
I remember reading something like:

Exec1: does it connect to Exchange?

Exec2: no.

Exec1: nixed!

Exec2 should have said: it will in the future!

------
ropiwqefjnpoa
I was excited for moment thinking they were bringing back the Windows Phone OS
as well, bummer...

------
fortran77
I'm so glad Microsoft is trying again in the Phone space. I wish Amazon would
try again, too. It's nice to have choices.

~~~
scarface74
No. Microsoft is much better at handling an ecosystem than Amazon. As far as I
can tell, MS is using standard Android with Google Play Services(?) Amazon was
trying to create its own ecosystem.

~~~
fortran77
Amazon has a nice suite of services. A phone that has Music, Books, Shopping,
Cloud Storage for Photos, and a few key apps (Uber, Lyft, popular games) but
somewhat constrained otherwise, would be great for Seniors or people who don't
need a high-performance general-purpose computer in their pocket.

~~~
robocat
> would be great for Seniors

How do seniors learn to use devices?

Mostly from peers or mostly from children? If from peers, how do they seed the
ability?

I can't see how you could get seniors to start to use a "dumbphone" specific
to them, unless the UI was spectacularly easy to use.

------
belltaco
Video of announcement.

[https://youtu.be/dmaioTs0NH8?t=5111](https://youtu.be/dmaioTs0NH8?t=5111)

The bigger dual screen device is the Surface Neo.

~~~
bhauer
Correction: The bigger device is Surface Neo (running Windows 10 X), the
smaller device is Surface Duo (running Android).

~~~
belltaco
Corrected, thx.

------
SketchySeaBeast
Given how badly they flubbed their entries into smartphones, I'm kind of glad
they are trying again in this new form-factor. Given that it's relying on
Android, it should have more staying power than before (and an app store that
isn't awful).

~~~
WorldMaker
Given it's relying on Android now and doesn't seem to have (based on this
announcement) any compelling reason to exist long term in the ugly, over-
crowded OEM market of Android marketing, it's a gimmick and shouldn't have any
staying power at all.

------
mrpippy
It's odd that they would announce it's powered by a Snapdragon 855--a chip
which is already a year old, and will be two years old by the time this device
actually launches. Hopefully they'll upgrade that before launch.

~~~
h4waii
A high-end SoC from 1 year or 2 years ago is hardly the constraint on modern
devices.

I doubt the average person can even tell the difference from a 660, to a 835,
or an 855, given all the rest of the components (mainly storage) are the same.

------
nemothekid
1\. Is Windows Mobile Dead?

2\. Does anyone remember the name of a similar Microsoft notebook that was
teased 5-10 years ago? It was a foldable notebook and notetaking device kind
of like Remarkable. I wonder if this is the spiritual child of that.

~~~
FreakyT
As for 2, you're thinking of the Courier concept, which got killed in favor of
Windows 8: [https://www.cnet.com/news/the-inside-story-of-how-
microsoft-...](https://www.cnet.com/news/the-inside-story-of-how-microsoft-
killed-its-courier-tablet/)

------
dagaci
I like the idea of dual screen on the phone, its quite natural to browse two
related pages at the same time and will improve that kind of experience. Will
it have pen support?

However i'm very dubious of what the dual screen experience will be like
bolted on top of Windows (NEO) and Android (DUO).

Somehow in my humble opinion Apple have been able to run rings around Google
and Microsoft when it come's to pure UX in mobile tech and given the past
history i fully expect that true in the future.

This is where i expect DUO will stumble, in the same way that Samsung fails
with its extensions and bolt on's.

------
AdmiralAsshat
All this time my old Nintendo DS Lite had been gathering dust in the drawer
because I thought it was strictly for _games_ ; now I realize its true calling
is to be a phone!

------
whalesalad
Ah, looks like Microsoft finally got around to producing some more gimmicks.

The catastrophe that is the Samsung folding phone didn’t send a strong enough
message to the industry I guess.

~~~
dao-
The MS device is a foldable phone with two screens, not a foldable screen.
Samsung's (initial?) failure is irrelevant here.

~~~
whalesalad
It won't sell. It's a gimmick.

~~~
smacktoward
No wireless. Less space than a Nomad. Lame.

------
EnderMB
I really hope that we see a single-screen Surface phone in the future.

IMO, Microsoft have done a fantastic job with the Surface Book. If they could
replicate that high-end build quality while providing a solid feature set and
a clean Android build, I can't see it not selling well. Throw a headphone jack
in, and I'd wait in line for it!

The dual screen is interesting, but I don't see its use just yet.

~~~
pdpi
Speaking of the Surface Book, my aging MacBook needs replacing, and I was
interested in seeing a Surface Book 3 release as an alternative. Sad it didn't
materialise.

~~~
bhauer
The Surface Laptop 3 looks very compelling though, especially with the Ryzen
option.

~~~
pizza234
The Surface Laptop unfortunately doesn't work as tablet.

I'm very "disappointented" by the event, as it seems that the Surface Book
series is dead.

If this is the case, I guess that the reasoning has been that who want a
powerful machine just buy a regular laptop.

It's a shame for those who use the SB both as tablet and dev machine (which is
the intended audience). At this point, it's not sure how the SPX will be
usable as dev machine (e.g. I guess it will have relatively little memory).
The vanilla SP is an alternative, but 12.3" is small for me (and can't imagine
for those who own a 15" SB).

~~~
EnderMB
I'm interested in how many people actually use their Surface Book as a tablet.

I know a load of people with the standard Surface that use it like a tablet,
but very few people that regularly use their Surface Book's detachable tablet
functionality. I can probably count the number of times I've ever wanted to
take the laptop apart on one hand.

~~~
pizza234
I use it a lot! The SB tablet is the state of the art (sadly, because
evidently there have been no advancements). Nothing is so light: even the
Surface Pro X is inferior (13.5"/730g vs. 13"/770g). This comes from the
interesting design choice of stripping as much as possible from the tablet
itself (the Surface Pro instead, is intended to be more functional, when in
tablet form, since it's coupled with lightweight bases).

In the past, I used it primarily to read electronic versions of several paper
magazines; this format is (IMHO) best read on a large screen - the sweet spot
is around 14, so 13.5 is the closest (I reckon the 15" is too big; the SB
laptop form factor has a bulky design).

In the present, I use it for studying (textbooks, mostly) - for textbooks,
even 12.x" is fine, so even a Surface Pro would do.

Having said that, I like it as a tablet so much that I've pretty much ditched
the base and bought another laptop for development. The SB laptop form factor
just sucks (IMHO), as it's very bulky, and Microsoft has an insane pricing
strategy, that makes it unjustifiably expensive for developers looking for a
serious dev machine. Nowadays it's more competitive due to being old, but the
16 GB models have never been competitive, both in price and form factor, to
competitors like the Dell XPS.

Of course, I don't imply that many people use it this way because I do, so I
really don't know the general use cases :-)

------
swiley
Another android phone.

These are all just wrappers around the latest qualcomm snapdragon with
whatever twist the hardware manufacture wants to add. Basic functionality in
all of them will be badly broken and there's more or less nothing you can do
to fix it.

At least the iphone ships with an ssh client and scripting environment now.
(not that I'm an iphone fan, it has it's own problems.)

~~~
com2kid
> Basic functionality in all of them will be badly broken and there's more or
> less nothing you can do to fix it.

I disagree.

The performance and battery life differences between different phones running
the same chipset is insane.

Read through [https://www.anandtech.com/show/14716/the-black-
shark-2-revie...](https://www.anandtech.com/show/14716/the-black-
shark-2-review/2)

For some benchmarks, the top phones are 50% faster! Storage benchmarks (not
shown in that particular review) can be even more dramatic. Battery life
differences can be huge (multiple hours) at the same capacity.

Each manufacturer customizes the heck out of the kernel, and also attached
firmware. LTE speeds can vary dramatically with "the same antennas". Same for
WiFi speeds.

The current Android phone I am using works great. It is surprisingly fluid and
rather nice to use, though I'd argue Windows Phone 7 was still _nicer_ (or at
least more fun) to use, that ship has long since sailed.

------
pdimitar
Not buying unless it runs [fixed and improved] Windows 10 mobile. I'm still
dreaming of a Lumia 950 XL with a good app store...

~~~
VikingCoder
Then you're not buying. "It runs Android and will release holiday 2020"
Literally the first line in the article.

~~~
pdimitar
Sure. Just expressing opinion.

IMO it was a mistake to give up on the Windows 10 mobile OS but it's also true
that MS has made too many mistakes for it to ever take off at the point where
Android and iOS have been developed for at least 7 years already.

------
nesky
Is the split screen device market a new upcoming segment or is it supposed to
be replacing an existing one? I've never thought that I need two iPhones or
two iPads connected to one another in a book like fashion like this. Who's the
market demographic for this type of product?

~~~
erikpukinskis
The only way it makes sense to me is this:

Apple designed the iPhone to be a pocketable one-handed companion device to a
real computer.

People started using them as their only computer. The changed the design
parameters enough that it made sense to offer a less pocketable device with a
much larger screen.

The thesis is: maybe that market can be segmented even further, by adding an
even less pocketable segment with even more screen space.

------
bcheung
I understand why they went with Android but I'm disappointed they didn't go
with .NET. I've avoided iOS and Android development because I'm not a fan of
those development environments. I would actually develop mobile apps if it was
.NET.

~~~
vatashian
Give Xamarin a go then. All the benefits of .NET on Mobile especially now that
Forms is mature and .NET standard is more prevalent.

------
seshagiric
Ok this may be first time when Microsoft phone announcements generate more
hype than iPhone

------
joombaga
> The Surface Duo features two 5.6-inch displays that can rotate 360 degrees,
> allowing it to be fully unfolded as a miniature unfold to 8.3-inch tablet.

Unless I'm misunderstanding, it seems like you wouldn't ever need more than
270 degrees.

~~~
belltaco
Needs 360 degrees to get to this.

[https://andro4all.com/files/2019/10/Microsoft-Surface-
Duo.jp...](https://andro4all.com/files/2019/10/Microsoft-Surface-Duo.jpg)

From this:

[https://livecenterimages.azureedge.net/livecenter-
images/lci...](https://livecenterimages.azureedge.net/livecenter-
images/lcimg-0fac6fe3-95ec-4837-86ae-c3b0c35c5847.jpg)

~~~
mattferderer
Seems like a nice way to protect the screen. I wonder how hard it would be to
place a small tiny notification screen on the 2nd image. I guess that would
make 3 screens then. I recall some similar prototypes that used a small e-ink
screen for notifications & a clock.

------
screye
If this releases now, I will buy it instantly. That thing is going in my
pocket.

------
joewee
I wonder if they will stop security patches after three years ?

------
cryptozeus
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dmaioTs0NH8](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dmaioTs0NH8)
@ mark 1:26:00

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saulrh
I've been missing my Nexus 7 since it finished dying and have been wishing for
a device with this form factor for years... but with a heavily-skinned custom
android distro I'm not touching it with a ten-foot pole. MS isn't _awful_
about release cadence and bugfix latency, certainly not as bad as cell network
providers or traditional phone OEMs, but there's a reason I run stock android
on Droid/Nexus/Pixel devices. Maybe if I can install a stock android ROM on
the thing.

(Disclaimer: work at Google, totally unrelated product, not the opinion of my
employer, etc.)

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acd
Microsoft has always been very good at making hardware! It would be
interesting with oled/lcd on one side and eink on the other side.

~~~
m0zg
This is often said by people who have never owned their hardware. I bought a
Surface Book when it first came out. I disagree. It looks good on the photos
if you've never used it, but it was kind of flimsy and buggy AF. I took it
back for a refund 3 days after purchasing it. And it's a flagship device. I
can only imagine what happens at the lower end of the product range.

~~~
Marsymars
> And it's a flagship device. I can only imagine what happens at the lower end
> of the product range.

I wouldn't really expect any difference. It's not like Apple's lower end
products are buggier than their higher end ones.

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legohead
this looks way better than the Samsung Fold. if you haven't yet, watch a
durability video on the Fold. the display is plastic and will get scratched
from basically anything (even your fingernail). Microsoft's version has glass.
also nice that it's using Android.

but...how will I mount it in the car for GPS?

~~~
belltaco
>but...how will I mount it in the car for GPS?

Just fold it?

[https://andro4all.com/files/2019/10/Microsoft-Surface-
Duo.jp...](https://andro4all.com/files/2019/10/Microsoft-Surface-Duo.jpg)

I would get a bigger mount for the opened device though, maps are always nicer
on bigger screens since you can see more.

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novok
What I don't understand is why the devices have huge screen bezels?

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marban
This thing looks like a 1983 Multi Screen Game & Watch.

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Causality1
It's ridiculous that there's a market for that monstrosity but I can't get a
normal phone with a flagship SoC and a 16:10 display.

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rbanffy
How many years after Apple's Knowledge Navigator?

~~~
recursive
32 years after Knowledge Navigator. 0 years after I first heard of it.

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rvz
I'm not sure if everyone forgot a day ago, but if Microsoft had just removed
the offline account setting on Windows 10, what could be the likelihood that
they could just enforce it in the Surface Line up, even including the Android
products?

Nice looking Surface lineup and hardware nevertheless, but after Microsoft
removing that offline setting, I think that was a big turn off and a no deal
from me for now, unless they reverse that atrocious decision to using online
accounts only.

~~~
MikusR
They did not remove it.

