

Pay with Loop - clarky07
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/loop/pay-with-loop#

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antr
Loop is a great hack, but my only concern with this system is that merchants
in Europe are many times obliged to ask for the buyers' ID when paying with
mag stripe CC. This means that users need to have their physical CC at hand at
all times. I know this ID thing is not the case in the US but this can be a
legal issue in Europe.

On another note, does anyone know why the US has not transitioned to chip and
pin cards?

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rsayers
I just got back from Europe where I used my mag stripe card quite a bit. In
the UK I was asked for an ID almost 100% of the time and merchants seemed do a
good job of actually matching data, and then matching my photo id to me.

In France it was hit or miss, I'd say maybe 25% of the time I was even asked
for an id for a transaction.

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Wintamute
Here in the UK (and I think much of Europe) we stopped using the mag strip and
switched wholesale to Chip and PIN in around 2004. What's more I live in
London and I'd say I now complete >75% of my purchases using the paywave
contactless payment system. I guess most point of sale devices still have the
mag strip readers on them, but I can't see people going for this in a big way
here ... its a cool hack but it seems like its sort of hacking a payment
technique that's a decade out of date.

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sjtgraham
Wow. A _lot_ of payment card related posts today.

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dangrossman
I submitted a link to this one a month ago that went nowhere; they're getting
traction today because the Coin story in the morning spurred interest. Some of
today's links are products announced in 2012.

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unsignedint
Considering merchants' reaction to NFC is already somewhat uneasy, I'm not
really sure how this would work out.

After using (and attempted using) NFC in many places, I started feeling like
NFC as a replacement of credit card is not a right direction considering it
doesn't really solve the problem of credit card (other than not carrying so
many cards with you) especially when you can use a credit card for just about
any purchase big or small.

Perhaps the only way these can take off is if you can approach as "NFC as
extension to cash" which may be why it was embraced widely in Japan for
instance, where micro transactions (and some extent, _any_ transactions) with
credit card is somewhat discouraged.

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themoonbus
Guys, chill out, I am perfectly able to carry more than one credit card in my
wallet.

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MichaelApproved
Of course, it's great that it's compatible with existing systems.

It'd be nice if the part that's making payment is disconnected from my phone
so I wouldn't have to hand over my phone to someone else. A potential short
term solution would be to allow me to lock my phone with a pin and still have
this work.

A lot of merchants want to see the physical card when making payment. I'd
imagine many would be skeptical of something like this.

It's really nice to see all these ideas trying to crack the payment code. Keep
at it!!

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tjko
I'm actually worried about security here...

I don't know much about magnetic strip card technology, so I'm curious to know
whether a malicious user could capture the signal and replay it.

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raverbashing
Yes, it can

It's still not clear to me how the card data goes to the POS equipment, is it
NFC or something else?

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pedalpete
In the video they mention that they 'broadcast' it, I suspect that means they
are actually pushing out a straight magnetic signal which seems to the reader
that a card has been swiped.

I don't think it could be NFC, as most merchant readers wouldn't have NFC
built in.

It also explains why they need the special case or dongle, it doesn't appear
that it can work with just your phone alone.

It's a pretty innovative hack, but on the security issue, if you card is
broadcasting it's data, then I assume anybody can pick it up, but they would
need to be REALLY close.

~~~
giarc
They mention in their video or kickstarter site that you have to be within 4"
of the mag reader.

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mattholtom
I worked for a mobile/online payments company in 2011, and the industry has
huge potential for disruption. The transaction volume is so high that even a
slice of a slice means huge returns. Cross one border and the
regulatory/compliance landscape changes dramatically too.

The winners in this space are typically those who can get the most device
manufacturers, banks, visa/mc/amex, and merchants to play nice.

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kristiandupont
All the merchants have excited reactions but there is a camera in the room and
I'm sure they've been told what's going on. I think if I were to pay like this
somewhere, the reaction would be more like "wait, did you just hack my payment
system? Please stay here while I call my manager."

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Shivetya
I prefer the security and convenience of having only two cards, a debit and a
credit card. Unfortunately for many, making it even easier to use their cards
will simply load them up with debt.

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matthewmacleod
I don't think that's legitimate. It seems incredibly unlikely that having to
use multiple different physical cards would ever be a barrier to someone who
was going to get into debt.

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antonius
Just when you thought you've seen the last card payment idea, lo and behold
there's another one. I'm fascinated with how many startups are in this space.

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adriaanm
Awesome tech, but I don't see myself handing over my phone in a busy
restaurant/bar -- you don't usually get to swipe your card yourself there.

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mikkom
The case is huge.. and actually I don't understand the problem they are
solving. Maybe I'm just too old.

~~~
dangrossman
The case is the size of a phone, because it's a phone case. If you prefer
something smaller, their first product is a 1.5" keychain fob.

The end-goal of Loop and other tech like it is to make your phone (or smart
watch) the only device you have to take with you when you leave home. You'll
be able to pay for anything, use your store reward/loyalty cards and open the
doors to your house with it. I'm almost there myself -- I don't carry keys, my
supermarket has an app for the loyalty card that scans my screen instead of a
card, I can pay at lots of stores with Google Wallet by tapping my phone on
the credit card terminal, and my drivers license slips between the phone and
its case.

The only thing nobody's done yet (AFAIK) is replace the "intelligent key" fob
for my car. I can't start it without that.

~~~
mikkom
I didn't mean width or height, I meant thickness, it seems to double your
phones thickness.

See the video at the kickstarter at about 2:30

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rtpg
So does this not work at all for PIN cards? Because I have seen very few swipe
machines at least in France.

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thejerz
The PCI people are going to have a conniption when they see this.

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gummydude
People tend to lose their phones than a wallet.

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joetech
What happens at the restaurant?

