

Startup Airline to offer all-you-can-fly subscriptions for $150/m - mef
http://planered.com/

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blhack
Am I the only one that absolutely hates these types of pages?

"We really won't tell you any specifics of what we're doing, but give us your
email address and we'll be sure to send you advertisements when we decide to!"

Do these things usually work? If it's a YC startup, or is being done by a
friend or something, I'll usually give up my email address, but when it's just
"we promise the moon! We'll respect your email, honest!", I usually skip it.

~~~
mayneack
Just use username+PlaneRed@gmail.com so you can filter it all out later if it
was a waste of time.

~~~
Retric
It's also vary easy to strip out username+<stuff>@gmail.com to
username@gmail.com. Honestly, if I had a list of email address I was about to
spam it's one of the first steps I would take.

~~~
IgorPartola
Then only use username+<stuff>@gmail.com and filter anything that goes
directly to username@gmail.com :). I never found spam to be a problem when
using GMail, and my e-mail address is publicly accessible in multiple places.

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kloncks
Cool idea. But

a) How in god's name do they keep costs to $150/month for only 9 passengers.
Those passengers will collectively pay $1350 a month for unlimited flights?
Are they assuming the majority will end up only flying once or twice? What if
they get mostly business guys that fly a couple of times a week. I don't get
pricing. One ticket costs more than $150.

b) What stops the TSA from simply stepping in and deeming this a security
risk? Limit goes from 9 passengers to 5. Or 4. Etc.

c) Even if the TSA doesn't step in and change the law, how does this guarantee
safety? I'm not a fan of TSA and as an Arab flying I'm permanently chosen for
the "random check"...but there's a reason airport security exists, no?

d) What about this team makes us think they can build it? They're bootstrapped
and trying to buy planes. Using early customer deposits. And their tech team
is recruited via a tweet (
<https://twitter.com/#!/PlaneRed/status/93572991077715968>) So seriously, if
these guys don't have tech talent or deep pockets, what do they bring to the
table?

e) There's no mention on whether the big airports would allow this to go on.
"Flying from New York to D.C." : Would that entail driving out somewhere
random in Jersey and landing somewhere random far away in Virginia far away
from D.C.?

f) "Luxurious" 9-person planes. Luxury here is subjective. Is it a Gulfstream
V or a Cessna Caravan?

g) Booking. Besides the fact that they're looking for tech geniuses to build
their system via Twitter, any idea on what booking will look like? Will I have
to book in advance? How big will the airline "fleet" be? If I'm on an "all-
you-can-eat" flight model, I'd expect to be able to log on today and book a
flight for Philly tomorrow or the day after. That's what Net Jets does.

I like what they're promising. But there are just a ton of really important
tough questions that they seriously need to answer.

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colinplamondon
The $150 is a teaser rate.

From their email:

"A few weeks before we start flying we'll begin selling subscriptions. We will
be rewarding our earliest supporters (the first 500), and those who recruit
the most friends to PlaneRed with $150/month all-you-can-fly pricing.
Obviously, the number of subscriptions we can sell at that price are pretty
limited. So please - tell your friends to ensure that you get one!"

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Shenglong
_skip TSA_ Excuse me? This entire idea, even if realistic, is fraught with
political risk: "Oh, you're flying 9 person-planes to avoid our law? One of
the major airlines is lobbying against you? Well... time to change the law."

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peteretep
More from Forbes: <http://blogs.forbes.com/edzitron/2011/06/29/planered/>

~~~
mef
Interestingly, they will exclusively fly 9-passenger planes in order to skirt
the TSA rule of screening for planes that fly 10 or more.

~~~
seanmccann
I must be the only one that doesn't mind going through the TSA screening. It
usually takes 2 minutes and isn't a big deal. The fact that these guys
circumvent the TSA screening rule ___could_ __almost make PlaneRed flights a
greater target for malicious activity.

~~~
jamesteow
"I must be the only one that doesn't mind going through the TSA screening."

Probably.

Lineups at the airport can be a lot longer than 2 minutes because of the slow
pace of screening. And frisking children and the elderly? I feel so much
safer.

I don't see why any terrorist would need to re-target airplanes. They did
their job in making flying into the U.S. as one of the most dreadful
experiences.

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eiji
Now I got it!

    
    
      ... starting at $150/m!
    

Add one or two zeros and you will be closer to the truth.

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mef
From the welcome email, which also links to their blog
<http://planered.tumblr.com/>:

Thanks for signing up!

Our goal is to change the way we fly. No more buying outrageously priced
tickets. No more lost luggage. No more middle seats in a cramped cabin. And no
more TSA.

By signing up we'll make sure you know what's happening as we build our
airline - and you'll be among the first to know when we're ready to launch.

A few weeks before we start flying we'll begin selling subscriptions. We will
be rewarding our earliest supporters (the first 500), and those who recruit
the most friends to PlaneRed with $150/month all-you-can-fly pricing.
Obviously, the number of subscriptions we can sell at that price are pretty
limited. So please - tell your friends to ensure that you get one!

~~~
decadentcactus
It was my knowledge that it was difficult to go lower on prices in any way
without losing money?

The larger planes could take advantage of economies of scale, the only way to
get lower fares would be to drastically reduce the cost of flying a plane in
the first place.

No lost luggage, more spacious interiors, and less TSA are always selling
points though.

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seanmccann
A two hour flight would cost at the very minimum $6000. With a maximum of 10
passengers, that works out to $600/ per passenger. I don't understand how they
can offer this for $150/mo. Perhaps they bombard passengers with
advertisements or do scientific experiments to them.

~~~
Bostwick
From their blog (<http://planered.tumblr.com/>):

We’d like to get subscriptions down to $150 a month. In fact, we’re
guaranteeing that rate to some early subscribers, and the top PlaneRed.com
referrers.

But, if at that rate we just can’t put enough planes in the sky to meet demand
- we’ll have to charge a little more on the subscription - or add a small $25
cost for each flight. (We know - that ruins the ‘all you can fly’ but we’ve
had several folks make passionate cases for doing so.) What do you think?
Which would be better $250 a month, or $150 a month, and $25 per flight?

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sedachv
If they're bootstrapped as they say they are, and can get revenue right away,
more power to them. Air taxis were supposed to be the hot new thing in 2008. I
think Ron Garrett (cofounder of what became Virgin Charter) has an account on
HN; I hope he'll comment.

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chrisbennet
How many people are going to click past the "Let us harvest your email address
and we'll let you know the details" landing page?

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bengl3rt
I want to work here. Does anyone know these people?

(Hi Mike! When's your RTW trip?)

~~~
kloncks
They're looking for "tech geniuses":

<https://twitter.com/#!/PlaneRed/status/93572991077715968>

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pitdesi
This is a really tough sell... There is no screening for planes smaller than
10 passengers if there is no "sterile" area at either airport. This means that
they'll have to fly into smaller airports, which (often) means you're further
from the city, with no rental car, public transportation, etc.

They will likely be flying small propeller planes, which many people don't
like... props make sense for these short routes though because they are often
faster, based on the fact that there is less time for takeoff and landing
(they don't spend as much time "reaching altitude")

I also don't like that they are trying to bootstrap based on folks buying
these subscriptions which they have yet to launch, and that they plan to
launch in a month. Very pyramid-scheme-like.

I would love for it to work, but I just can't see this business model
surviving. It reminds me a bit of independence air and Dayjet, both of which
lasted less than a year.

Also, this doesn't inspire confidence:
<https://twitter.com/#!/PlaneRed/status/93572991077715968>

~~~
rocktronica
That tweet frustrates the hell out of me. Am I wrong to read "tech geniuses"
as kind of condescending?

~~~
swalkergibson
I would think so. It seems like they are being genuine.

