
Show HN: Open Source alternative to services like Intercom.io and Smooch - mihok
https://github.com/minimalchat/client
======
sandGorgon
The hardest part is not the client and the server...but the CRM (the Intercom
part). Here's something a lot of us would use - we want to bring our own
socket API (for example pure websocket, xmpp or something like Pusher.com )
and connect it to a full fledged Intercom-like tool.

This is the "Gitlab for Intercom". The problem that happens is that people
usually don't want to rip out their client side messaging SDK, especially if
you have a mobile app.

I am personally looking to pay for something like this (we use Pusher.com
internally).

Are you focusing on the socket server or the CRM application (like Intercom) ?
Because the socket server part is a don't care for everyone. Pusher or
Firebase is super cheap. It's the CRM that's tricky. Smooch is one end of the
spectrum and it focuses on integration with other tools (helpscout,etc) while
Intercom is obviously a CRM. I don't think you'll be able to build both.

If you can build this out with excellent featureset like Intercom and can
integrate with something like Pusher (and not lock to your own server), I'm
gonna throw money at you!

~~~
mihok
Wow, this is incredibly valuable feedback, thank you so much! We appreciate
your candor (and encouragement!)

You're right in that the socket server is fairly easy to pull in using other
tooling. Our focus at the moment is to just build a stable set of pieces that
you can use to interact with your website visitor. The operator transports are
where things will get interesting, connecting to other tools, etc. This is
where connecting things like Pusher will shine, we hope.

Thanks again for the feedback!

~~~
sandGorgon
The gitlab-for-intercom has genuine value there, so if I were you, I would
just use a third party transport and build a killer product there.

Build something I ^H^H people want ;)

IMHO the rest can come later. Just my $0.02 . Excited to see what you come up
with.

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mihok
Hey all,

One of the creators, this is the first project we've taken from inception to
open source, and are working towards building a hosted service [0]. A big
motivator for building it was the high costs associated with competitors like
Intercom.io and Smooch

It mainly comprises of 3 code bases, the server[1], the client[2] and then an
application[3] to speak to the client.

As always would love to hear feedback, good and bad! Also if you have any
questions let me know :)

[0]: [https://minimal.chat](https://minimal.chat) [1]:
[https://github.com/minimalchat/daemon](https://github.com/minimalchat/daemon)
[2]:
[https://github.com/minimalchat/client](https://github.com/minimalchat/client)
[3]: [https://github.com/minimalchat/operator-
app](https://github.com/minimalchat/operator-app)

~~~
maxpert
Glad to see one more project, can already see some bugs :) would love to
contribute. Shameless plug [http://raspchat.com/](http://raspchat.com/) I have
done similar hobby project which runs server on Raspberry Pi at my work place
and it can handle quite some load. Last time it got posted on 4chan it was
spammed by ~5K connections constantly pounding spam messages, but it handled
traffic well (it did slow the whole thing down to it's knees).

~~~
mihok
Nice! please make an issue for the bugs!! We've done some initial load
testing, and are super pleased with using go channels as the server layer
medium.

------
a13n
This isn't an alternative to Intercom. This is an alternative to Intercom's
live chat feature. This is only a very small portion of the value you get from
using Intercom.

I think an open source alternative to Intercom would be super compelling,
just, this isn't it. You're missing the CRM, email automation, events, help
center, etc.

------
jjeaff
Wouldn't this be a lot more like a replacement for services like Live Chat?
Because I definitely would not be paying as much as I am for intercom if I was
only using the live chat feature. Their integrated abilities to categorize
users and program and schedule onboarding messages as well auto suggested help
articles are what makes it worth the price.

There are a ton of free live chat clients out there. What makes this one stand
out?

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gozmike
Hey everybody! Co-founder of Smooch.io here.

Really like what what you've built here, a lightweight and open source web
messaging system is definitely a useful component that a lot of websites could
leverage.

Wanted to clear up a common misconception that Smooch.io and Intercom are
solving the same market need. Although Smooch began life as a mobile-focussed
Intercom, as we've learned about our industry we've pivoted to address a need
lower down in the stack.

Essentially, we've discovered that the biggest impediment to having more
businesses taking advantage of messaging as a channel is the lack of software
that can provide rich access to the channels coupled with a powerful CRM and
deep integration capabilities. Most businesses didn't want to rip and replace
their current CRM and contact center investments, nor did they want to invest
in connector middleware. They expected messaging to be a first-class feature
of the products they already use and have trained their support teams on.

That's why we now focus on selling our technology as an API that can be used
by software vendors to add a complete messaging, customer profile and
conversation orchestration stack to their products. It's been adopted by some
of the biggest vendors in the customer-service space because it helps them
focus on the differentiated features (like workflow) that help them succeed in
market, while ensuring they can trust the "plumbing" to an enterprise-grade,
highly reliable platform like Smooch.

So we don't view Minimalchat as an alternative to Smooch. We view it as
another messaging channel to which Smooch can allow a business to connect.
Similarly, we don't view Intercom as an alternative to Smooch - we view it as
a (prospective) customer.

Finally, just noticed that you're in Toronto. If you like building Minimalchat
and care about messaging - we're hiring:
[https://smooch.io/about/#op-196776-software-
developer](https://smooch.io/about/#op-196776-software-developer) :-)

~~~
ukulele
> Essentially, we've discovered that the biggest impediment to having more
> businesses taking advantage of messaging as a channel is the lack of
> software that can provide rich access to the channels coupled with a
> powerful CRM and deep integration capabilities.

I'm an Intercom customer and presumably also a potential Smooch customer, and
I have no idea what this means.

~~~
gozmike
Thanks for asking for the clarification Eran. Definitely could use some here!

Essentially, we discovered that while in certain segments (like SaaS apps),
using messaging to communicate with customers is commonplace, greatly due to
companies like Intercom that provide great tools for these types of companies
to successfully communicate.

However, the tools Intercom provides just don't exist in a format that works
for most other businesses who use anything from traditional helpdesk software
like Zendesk to full-blown contact center suites like those provided by
Genesys and Oracle.

Since we believe in a future where every business is available over messaging
channels, we needed to ensure that the systems they use can provide access to
these channels. We had two choices:

1\. Build middleware that a business could purchase that would allow them to
connect a messaging channel (like a web messenger, Facebook or WeChat) to
their existing software. 2\. Open up our platform so that incumbent software
providers could adopt it to add messaging capabilities to their product.

For a host of reasons, we quickly determined that option 2 was the best path
towards making sure that a wide variety of businesses can communicate with
users over messaging. We've been hard at work making sure that this happens
ever since.

------
rgrieselhuber
I'd be more interested in an open source user analytics package that shows
which users are online, etc. that you can find in Intercom.

------
ayanb
Nifty start. The need for a hosted service like this is more for secure apps
where third-party services may have some privacy implications.

I think the default UI needs a little more work. Intercom also lets you email
users based on certain triggers, is there an email integration that you are
building towards?

Edit: Just curious, what made you code the server in Go?

~~~
mihok
Thats a good point re: secure apps/third party services. we also wanted to run
a hosted service for the lazy who may not want to bother learning how to run
each of the pieces ;)

Thanks for the feedback too, in complete honesty, it was a combination of we
were interested in the language, and overheard it was good with concurrency...
that was enough for us to give it a shot.

Edit: Also apologies for not answering your question re: email integration,
its going to be one of the first major integrations we do!

------
sunpazed
Nice work! Looks tempting... until you realise you need to integrate your
service with a whole heap of other platforms. Or build scale. Classic Build vs
Buy — are you building a core capability in your product, or are there more
important things you should be focusing on?

~~~
mihok
Thanks for the feedback :) Our initial "core" has been surrounding the live
chat, but our approach has been to build it into many separate pieces. This
allows us to focus on what we think are the major integration points next. As
well as ensure that the things that need to scale well, do, like our socket
server.

------
killix
Hi @mihok and everyone, Co-founder of Broid here. Have you had the chance to
look at our repo
([https://github.com/broidHQ/integrations](https://github.com/broidHQ/integrations))
? @ Broid, we believe in democratizing messaging and we do so by providing an
open standard using the W3C AS2 schema.

We are currently supporting more than 20 Messaging Platforms as well as
providing a Web Messenger (website & mobile) that has all the best
conversational features: carousels, cards, quickreplies, geolocation etc..

I would be happy to discuss with you about minimalchat and see how the Broid
community or the team can help you.

(We are looking for contributors to be part of the team.)

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mxuribe
Admirable effort...but why not focus on the front-end/app - the CRM side of
things - and simply develop on the shoulder of giants? By this i mean, maybe
consider using an existing, underlying messaging platform like matrix.org.
Visit [https://matrix.org](https://matrix.org) and scroll down to the "What is
this for?" section, to see what i mean. And, as others noted, this would allow
you to focus on the CRM portion, which is what end-users and clients would
value more (read: pay you money). Just a thought.

------
kasra85
Looks great! Maybe add more docs so it's easier to setup.

~~~
mihok
Thanks for the feedback! Its so easy to get tunnel vision on ease of setup
since we've been doing it for so long, so we'll definitely improve the setup
docs!

