
Glitter bomb tricks parcel thieves - tartoran
https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-46604625
======
will_brown
I just told this story on HN, but my car window was smashed on 10/13/18 and
the theives got my wallet and house keys.

They used my credit card at foot locker (~$500), The Store Manager confirmed
two guys made the purchase and corporate said they would turn over the video
if police just ask.

A month later the bank fraud dept informed me someone was trying to cash a
fake check ($1,600) against my account at an ATM using my ID (stolen from the
car) and they ATM video shows the guy and the would turn it over to police if
they requested it.

I even emailed the detective with chain and all he had to do was reply all,
but the detective refuses (“we don’t look into these things”). Meanwhile these
people have my address and key (even though I rekeyed) they may be lurking and
try to come in, and I should be entitled to know what these people look like.

I was attacked on HN for suggesting this but I’ll suggest it again, since the
author of this post already had video of these theives, there needs to be a
platform to post these videos for the public to crowdsource the identity of
these people.

I know there are not police resources to pursue every amazon purchase, but in
my case it was grand theft and it’s ongoing, and likely to escalate, but the
police are unwilling to do anything to help (but be damn sure they’d look into
it if they were the victims).

~~~
iamdave
_there needs to be a platform to post these videos for the public to
crowdsource the identity of these people._

And then what? Will the platform also have a portal that will let people en
masse vex the local PD with messages containing links to the video until the
precinct assigns an officer to the case?

What happens next? Is there going to be a timer or some kind of SLA on the
platform that notifies people in the crowd "Sergeant Jones still hasn't found
the bastard who stole from the Smith family down on the corner"?

Crowdsourcing criminal investigation, even a passive element of it like
identifying mugs from home security footage seems like a rabbit hole I'm not
sure we're prepared to go down (it also scares the bajeezus out of me because
the general population, sorry to say this, aren't the rational actors I want
involved in trying to identify perps so casually through 'platforms').

~~~
will_brown
>What happens next?

Well let me tell you of another event that occurred to me in 08/17.

I was kidnapped at gunpoint from a gas station, forced to drive my attacker
with a gun on my for 30 minutes, eventually after getting off the highway I
jumped out of my own car in gear, escaped and called the police.

First words out of the sergeants mouth responding, “cut the shit what really
happened.” Despite my insistence I’m an officer of the court myself (attorney
at Law) that there will be video from the gas station to prove my version of
events, I was even told, “we aren’t even sure if you own a car and if you are
just calling police for a free ride.”

In that case, in 24 hours I located my car and the gunman and called the
police and had him arrested. That’s not to say I did this voluntarily, luckily
the gunman connected my WiFi only iPad to the internet and I got the location,
of course I called the police first, who told me “they heard about my ‘story’
yesterday, and wouldn’t be going to the address until I drove to the station
and showed them the Apple email”. I did just that and after keeping me in the
parking lot for an hour and laughing at me 2 officers came out to me (this
station was closed on Sunday) and took down the address, drive away and called
my cellphone and told me go home they don’t see my car. Unsatisfied I went to
the address myself, found my car and the gunman, called the police yet again
and they finally came and arrested him.

He bonded out Monday at 8AM. He has since been rearrested, bonded out yet
again, rearrested yet again for violation of his bond vis—Avis his GPS tracker
I insisted on.

His trial is still ongoing. Someone stole my keys and ID, I should be entitled
to know what they look like when 2 videos are available, crimes against me are
ongoing, and the cost of the officers time (since you are so concerned about
their $150/hour rates...which seem entirely made up, no offense) is a 1 minute
reply to an email I forwarded him from foot locker loss prevention.

Edit: I forgot my conclusion, which is, people who engage in these activities
in many cases will even have friends and family who turn them in (i.e. the
unibomber). But even if they don’t a public platform would be very helpful in
deterring these activities, which is the ultimate goal.

~~~
loftyal
Jesus this reads like it's from some super corrupt 3rd country, not the US.

~~~
tokyodude
Get out of your bubble?

I used to think the USA was a "safe" place. Maybe it is compared to Somalia
but it isn't compared to Japan or Singapore. Once I got used to the safety of
these places I never feel safe in the USA anymore.

I used just take it for granted there were bad parts of town and that even in
the good parts of town I should be leery of people, avoid dark alleys etc.
Don't walk alone at night, etc. Then I lived in these other places where that
concept mostly doesn't exist.

As a concrete example it's common sense in the USA if I get a 3rd party car
stereo I should get a removable car stereo and always take it out or hide it.
I had 5 of them stolen and my car once and just took it all as "sucks but
that's that way life is, my fault for forgetting to take the stereo out or not
buying a lojack". But it's not the way life is. It's the way we've let it
become.

There's lots of other examples and AFAIK most of it is cultural. An example,
find a dropped wallet. In USA/Europe a large percentage of people have the
attitude "score for me! found free money!" Not sure if that percentage is 20%
or 80% but in Japan (and I think Singapore) the more common response is "OMG,
someone is really going to be in a tough spot. I'd better try to get this back
to them if possible". In the USA even if people had that attitude they might
rationalize that the police won't care and it might be true the police don't
care which is just another symptom of the same problem.

I have no clues how to spread the nicer culture to the West. It seems the
opposite "me me me" culture is impossible to fight.

PS: these kinds of posts always illicit irrelevant responses of the problems
in Japan and Singapore. I'm not saying Japan and Singapore are perfection. I'm
only pointing out this one area where they do better.

~~~
dang
> Get out of your bubble?

Swipes like that break the HN guidelines. Can you please edit them out of what
you post here? Your comment would be better without that sentence, and maybe
also the patronizing bit at the end ("these kinds of posts always illicit
irrelevant responses").

[https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html](https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html)

~~~
iamdave
I'm going to disagree with this being a "swipe" because at the root of it is a
critical cautionary tale that I think we should be sharing _more_ of on HN:

What you (the global "you") experience in the world and the results of your
interaction are not a template, and other people's experiences may sometimes
preclude them from truly realizing, appreciating and unpacking why people in
other social groups might see interactions with the constabulary (keeping in
context with this comment thread) or other systems of society a bit
differently.

As a matter of personal perspective, the suggestion to break one's bubble
isn't a swipe, but a request to entertain the thought that one's preconceived
notions about a given affair might change with the knowledge that their
experiences are not universal and exposure to a different angle.

Maybe the curt nature of the suggestion doesn't meet some arbitrary ideal of
discussion, but that doesn't invalidate the root point of the suggestion.

~~~
dang
That all makes sense. I called it a swipe because it was a personal ("your")
pejorative ("bubble"). It's not necessary to do that—posts get better without
it—and it routinely has negative side effects.

~~~
iamdave
_I called it a swipe because it was a personal ( "your") pejorative
("bubble")_

Matter of perspective, no, Dan? Would it have been less of a pejorative to
borrow a phrase from the latest incantation of our discussions of race and
culture in the US to say "check your privilege?"

Granted this isn't the place for a protracted discussion on dialogue here, I
just find the strong reaction to what is a very important clarion call to
evaluate ones own biases and experiences against a spectrum of biases and
experiences shared by every other human being, however curt or brief, taking
it the point of calling it a "pejorative" an interesting reaction-IMO.

------
tivert
If you're concerned about package thieves, just buy an outdoor cabinet and put
it next to your door with a note asking that packages be placed in it. I use
an Ikea Josef:

[https://www.ikea.com/gb/en/products/storage-
furniture/outdoo...](https://www.ikea.com/gb/en/products/storage-
furniture/outdoor-organising/josef-cabinet-in-outdoor-dark-grey-art-00168990/)

You don't even need a lock for it. If you can get the deliverymen to
consistently place packages in it, the thieves will have no idea if there's
actually a package at your door to steal or not _without actually attempting a
theft_. For extra deterrence, you can install a motion activated camera next
to it. The idea is to reduce the thieves' expectation of reward while
increasing their expectation of getting caught.

~~~
shaftway
Yeah, we had a package stolen off our porch, so we did that. It's a bench with
a liftable top. The plan was to put a padlock on it. All of our packages are
addressed to:

    
    
      Shaftway
      Place in Bench - Code 1234
      24601 Where I Live St.
      My City, ST, ZipZipZip
    

We order a lot of stuff, and probably average 3 deliveries per day. In the
last 3 months we've had exactly one package placed in the bench. And we never
even got around to putting the padlock on it. All a delivery person has to do
is lift the lid. Delivery people don't care. I probably wouldn't either if I
were one. I'm not going to read the boxes I'm delivering for instructions; I'm
just going to leave it on the porch like I do with 99.99% of other boxes.

~~~
lucb1e
> average 3 deliveries per day

Wow. I really wonder what the environmental impact is of just one household
doing this. I think I order something once every.. two months maybe? Three?
And if I could get the desired electronics in a local store, I probably would.

Edit: To reply to the three initial comments at once, I see your point. I was
thinking "but it's not just about the last mile, it's about getting that
package all the way from China or where ever it comes from"... but of course,
if I buy it in a store, it still had to come from china. Someone driving to
your home all day seems terrible at first impression, but even without
grouping the deliveries, I guess it might not be much worse than someone who
gets groceries by car. I'd be interested to hear about research that looked
into the topic.

~~~
bbarn
Compared to someone who leaves their home by car once per day to get routine
items, it's arguably a lot better since that delivery truck makes hundreds of
deliveries per round trip.

Compared to someone who is super frugal, list driven, plans ahead, has one
trip a month to get necessities, and grows their food in their yard, sure,
it's more impactful.

Perspective always matters.

~~~
maccard
>Compared to someone who is super frugal, list driven, plans ahead, has one
trip a month to get necessities, and grows their food in their yard, sure,
it's more impactful.

That's being disingenuous. There are plenty of more moderate options which are
perfectly viable for the vast majority of households, like planning a small
amount know advance and getting essentials twice a week, or integrating it
into other trips (commuting, school runs, coffee runs, walks).

~~~
NullPrefix
>topic being environmental impact

>coffee runs

Can't you just brew coffee yourself if you care about the enviromental impact?

~~~
maccard
Absolutely, but my point was simply that people are already leaving their
houses for necessity/pleasure, and if they need a daily trip to a shop they
should combine their trips, regardless of the reason for said trip

------
rdtsc
This needs careful consideration if you ever decide to do it. Depending on the
local criminal culture they could exact revenge. Then also know where you live
and can do a lot worse things than taking a package. Police might later be
involved but it might not be worth it. You are dealing with people who have no
qualms stealing so it's not too crazy to expect other rash and illegal acts
from them.

I can also see some intrepid crooks suing for glitter damaging their eyesight
permanently or some other bullshit claim. Some attorney or DA might decide to
get free publicity and see if they can swing a "injured by booby trap" case.

~~~
kawfey
I learned from Nextdoor, that a neighbor of mine put cat litter in an amazon
box, and later found out her car's driver side window busted in and the litter
dumped on the seat. I now just have packages sent to lockers and UPS/FedEX
access points, and I know a few who have packages delivered to their office.

The crappy part is that she captured clear detail of both events but police
couldn't be bothered. Nest and Ring have been doing their part to fight back,
allowing people to publicly post and set up neighborhood watches against porch
pirates et al, but there's still a ways to go before security camera footage
can be sent to the PD and automatically identify the offender via facial
analysis.

~~~
DickingAround
That is a real shame. If the police are not going to mediate property disputes
between people, they take a lot of risk those disputes will escalate into
violence. Perhaps really-good passive defense is enough (e.g. package lock
boxes) but I also hope the police understand the deeper reasoning around their
position and role.

~~~
netsharc
Having lived in a "3rd world" country, I know the police there is useless, but
it's interesting how things like resource issues (not enough manpower) is
slowly turning living standards of rich countries like the US and UK towards
"3rd world" levels.

~~~
Jyaif
Robbers and burglers basically have immunity now because the police is busy
with... I'm not sure what.

~~~
roseburg
Most departments are understaffed. Turns out all the negative press against
police is having long term impacts on how many kids want to grow up and become
a police officer.

Also property crimes always take a backseat to more violent crimes.

~~~
omegaham
Also, the background check process is _intense_ , (and deals with the exact
same understaffing problems) and it turns out that most people aren't willing
to wait for nine months to get vetted for an entry-level job.

~~~
kristofferR
It's insane that police officer is an entry level job, no wonder you have so
many issues with the police in the US.

------
Rainymood
I'm honestly really shocked by how casually people seem to steal these
parcels, like what the hell?

~~~
stingraycharles
As a European, I'm surprised that the postal services in the US just leave the
packages outside, rather than ringing the doorbell and/or delivering it to a
neighbor.

Over here in The Netherlands, pickup points are common (my local groceries
store is one), you can choose your delivery time (also in the evening) and
they will deliver it to a neighbor when I'm not home.

Why not avoid this whole problem with any of these options?

~~~
rconti
Nobody's home during the day. What neighbor? How do you know which neighbor
will be home, or which neighbor to trust? When 90% of your package recipients
are not home, you spend 3x as much time per package delivery.

Carriers offload responsibility by allowing the sender or receiver to opt-out
of signature/package acceptance, so why would they care?

Just one data point, but I've been having packages delivered to my home my
entire life and never had a single one go missing. Seems like a really high
cost to prevent something unlikely.

On the other hand, I had never had a home or vehicle broken into until someone
smashed my car window last night at the movie theater. So, there's a first
time for everything.

~~~
Emma_Goldman
This is also the norm in the UK.

If you're not in they try and leave the package with a neighbour. If that
doesn't work, they'll try again, and if you're not there again, try for for a
neighbour again. If that fails for a second time, they leave it at a nearby
depot for you to pick it up.

I've never heard of a package being stolen here in the UK.

~~~
King-Aaron
America: "It's a real problem! There is no solution!"

Overseas viewer: "This literally never happens here. Try solution (a), (b), or
maybe (c) and see if that helps?"

America: "Yep there is no solution in the entire universe"

Substitute "package theft" for: Gun crime / public healthcare / public
education / insert social issue here

~~~
rconti
I agree with all of your points except for the package theft one.

The package theft "solutions" proposed really are insanely inconvenient and
unworkable* in most suburban environments. I've seen all of the reasons listed
many places here, so I won't bother rehashing them. If I'm at work on Tuesday,
for example, a redelivery attempt on Wednesday doesn't really help, does it?

* unworkable in the sense that they're less efficient than the alternative of just allowing the rare package theft to occur

~~~
King-Aaron
My local Caltex/7-11/Fuel Stations all do package holding here in Aus, I
honestly had similar thoughts until they started doing it. In the last 12 - 18
months I'd say I've had completely seamless package delivery because of it.

~~~
rconti
Thinking about it a bit, I bet one reason package holding isn't more popular
in the US is the (very Australia-like) combination of suburbs, and people
driving to work.

Assuming your employer allows it, it's convenient to have packages sent to
work, AND if you drove a personal car to work, it's easy to drive your own
package home. This equation gets flipped if you use transit or live in a
multi-unit building where it might get easier to just hold it "downstairs".

------
fcbrooklyn
The video is well worth your time. The device works very well, and the fart
spray has a purpose, in that it encourages the thief to ditch the package as
soon as possible, enabling him to recover and reload it.

~~~
dgritsko
Presumably the last thief never disposed of the package and was therefore the
only one to discover the cameras. I wonder what they were thinking, and if
they'll come across the video. Wouldn't be surprised if so, it was on the
front page of Reddit yesterday.

------
ragebol
In the Netherlands, when I order a package and no one's at home when it's
delivered, it either gets delivered to my neighbors or to the post office,
with a note of where to pick it up. It's never left at my door AFAIK.

How is this not an option in the US?

~~~
mcphage
Generally because people don't want it. Shipping used to be a lot stricter
about signatures, etc, but people usually aren't home when the packages get
delivered, and package theft isn't a significant enough problem to make the
extra security worth the inconvenience.

~~~
chrisseaton
> package theft isn't a significant enough problem

This guy had his package stolen many times in a short space of time. Seems
like the problem is pretty bad?

~~~
dec0dedab0de
The United States is big, with many different areas that have different levels
of crime. Sometimes with affluent areas in walking distance of destitute
areas, which is a whole other problem. One location being robbed repeatedly is
not surprising, and not significant. If it were, Amazon would be requiring
signatures instead of just sending you another one when something goes
missing.

~~~
derefr
Amazon requiring signatures wouldn’t much help in _preventing_ the problem.
They’d just get a signature from the thief “just returning home” in the front
yard, find out later that it wasn’t a match, and then... nothing, really.
They’d know the buyer wasn’t liable, I guess? Doesn’t do anything for them,
loss-prevention-wise; they still owe the buyer the thing they ordered.

What Amazon _is_ doing is much more clever: whenever possible, they’re now
recording the serial number of the product they ship to you. This way, if the
police find it when busting a fence, they can (hopefully) get the fence’s
providers out of them and then actually bust _them_ , too (because now they
have real physical evidence—along with testimony—that that particular person
stole a particular thing.)

------
slig
Direct link: [https://youtu.be/xoxhDk-hwuo](https://youtu.be/xoxhDk-hwuo)

------
binarymax
I've had fantasies of much worse punishments for package thieves, like a paint
gun sentinel. I'd buy this if he'd manufacture it.

~~~
onemoresoop
While all we can do to revenge is sometimes a fantasy, I'd say be rational
when you turn your fantasies to reality, you might end up paying the
hospitalization for the package thieves.

~~~
b_tterc_p
Sounds like you hypothetically need something which is inherently dangerous
(scorpions) but not purposefully dangerous to the person who opens it (drone
scheduled to attack package owner).

As an aside, I don’t know if it legal to ship scorpions.

~~~
modeless
> I don’t know if it legal to ship scorpions

That's easy, simply refer to Exhibit 526.5: Restrictions on Mailing Live
Scorpions
[https://pe.usps.com/text/pub52/pub52c5_008.htm#ep203359](https://pe.usps.com/text/pub52/pub52c5_008.htm#ep203359)

~~~
b_tterc_p
How wonderful, yet disappointingly sufficient. Coincidentally, as suggested in
the rules, writing “Live scorpions” will probably deter people anyway.

------
klausjensen
I really enjoyed the this. The insane over-engineering, the well thought out
details (like the 30sec fart-spray to get them to ditch the package,
maximising chances of recovery), the harmless-ness of it. Loved it! :D

------
TheLoneAdmin
Hmm, I'd be worried about retribution. Spread glitter in someone's car, they
might come back and torch your house. Assuming they can remember where they
grabbed the package from.

~~~
slig
I'd be worried as well. Even if the criminals didn't remember where they got
the package, now the video is going viral and it looks like the shows his home
address on a map.

Edit: as someone pointed out it's not his address. I just re-watched the video
and it's written on the map that it's not actually his house address.

~~~
themoat
I cannot believe I know this...but the location on the map is actually the
McCallister's house from Home Alone, in Illinois, Mark lives in California.

I looked it up a few months ago...and I recognized the google map as soon as
it popped up on the video.

[https://goo.gl/maps/1sytkJCxFqn](https://goo.gl/maps/1sytkJCxFqn)

~~~
duiker101
He mentions that he used that address on the package too.

~~~
lawlessone
This was very well thought out.

------
DeepWorker
I'm from India and packages there are always delivered in person. The delivery
person knocks your door and if you're not there, the package is either
delivered to your neighbor or another delivery is attempted. Why is this
practice not prevalent in the USA?

------
cosmotron
What are people's thoughts on if this is staged?

Considering the views / subscriptions are the main motivation here, it might
justify the expenses poured into this project – that is, it would be quite a
waste if all that effort went into the build just to have no one actually take
it off the porch.

If actors were used, it would explain the lack of police involvement (it's
easy to say, "police weren't interested" ).

An obvious consequence of it being a production without disclosure is the
copycats that this will spawn.

Edit: just to add a bit more food-for-thought in response to comments such as,
"why do that to your own car?" or "why get sprayed with fart spray": what
makes you believe it's their own car (could be a beater picked up for a few
hundred dollars) or that the fart spray actually smells?

~~~
kaivi
I've had the same thought when I first saw it. Some suspicious things: thieves
talking to themselves, that lady throwing the box into her own garbage bin,
zero attempt at disassembly or closer inspection of the box, no police
involved.

Also GPS is just not that good for locating anything of that size in given
circumstances, and it would not have worked in the parking garage.

Too many things could have gone wrong here, but they did not. The design is
subpar in my opinion, for somebody who worked on a Mars rover. Custom printed
board plus a bunch of smartphones, seriously?

~~~
aqme28
>Too many things could have gone wrong here, but they did not. The design is
subpar in my opinion, for somebody who worked on a Mars rover. Custom printed
board plus a bunch of smartphones, seriously?

What would you propose? The best design is often the easiest/cheapest one, and
this looks like pretty simple.

~~~
AstralStorm
Those are very much not cheapest unless he had them lying around.

There are ready made cheap boards with identical functionality to a cellphone,
few dollars a pop. And yes, they run Android.

That said, this way he can claim it had something valuable inside in case it
is still taken.

~~~
HeyLaughingBoy
What hardware hacker doesn't? I have at least 2 Android phones and one Windows
phone lying around my house in various states of functionality. Hell, I've got
$200 Peltier coolers and $400 peristaltic pumps in boxes somewhere sitting
unused.

I don't even know what this Mark person did, but going by comments here, if I
wanted to build something similar, the only thing I'd have to go out and buy
would be the glitter stuff.

Don't discount the stuff us weirdos have in our basements :-)

~~~
ryanmercer
>I don't even know what this Mark person did, but going by comments here,

Oh man, watch the video on his YouTube. It's pure comedic gold.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xoxhDk-
hwuo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xoxhDk-hwuo)

------
MrBuddyCasino
Anyone else found it unsatisfactory that there was nothing about forwarding
the footage of the thieves to the police?

~~~
empath75
It's in the first minute of the video. The police don't care.

~~~
Someone1234
Given the police's complete inaction vigilantism was inevitable.

I wonder if an industry of decoy packages will spring up, maybe "sticky" or
"smelly" glitter. Or heck just go full ink bomb.

I wonder where the law stands on this? Can you really be liable if someone
steals your property then causes property damage using it?

~~~
matt4077
The law says booby-traps are illegal. Depending on the damage/injury you
cause, you will be prosecuted. Two wrongs etc etc

~~~
TheLoneAdmin
Booby-trap is usually defined as "to cause bodily injury when triggered".
Spreading glitter in someone's car isn't causing bodily injury. However, if
the glitter caused someone to choke and die, or blinded an eye, then a crime
would be committed.

------
anonu
This is an an awesome project... the kinda stuff I wish I had more time to
hack away at...

In the video he mentions his automatic bullseye dartboard project... even more
impressive than this glitter machine IMHO:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MHTizZ_XcUM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MHTizZ_XcUM)

Calculating a projectile's trajectory in realtime.... wouldn't even know where
to start.

EDIT: dartboard code from that youtube link:
[https://www.dropbox.com/s/rlmhdjoqzyumme1/darts.zip?dl=0](https://www.dropbox.com/s/rlmhdjoqzyumme1/darts.zip?dl=0)

~~~
breck
Is there a GitHub link?

------
criddell
Do you think the bomb maker could be held liable if the package were to be
opened in a moving car that subsequently crashed because of glitter getting in
the driver's eyes? I'd be a little nervous about doing this myself.

~~~
PakG1
IANAL, but is that seriously a legal risk? The guy would have to explain he
stole it.

~~~
jayess
Here in the USA, everyone is litigation crazy, so an enterprising lawyer would
probably happily file a suit against the maker if someone was injured because
of it.

~~~
duiker101
What if I just buy something very stupid that could scare someone but I
actually wanted it for myself? Or what if I actually bought the same device in
the video but I wanted it for some other use or for checking out how it's
made?

~~~
criddell
Intent matters. If you have a baseball bat in your car along with your glove
and cleats, you have a piece of sports equipment. If you step out of your car
with the bat and smash a car that cut you off in traffic, it's a weapon.

~~~
jwdunne
In the UK, if the police find a bat without a ball or some kind of proof it's
for sports, they can consider it an offensive weapon.

------
ljm
I appreciate this is HN so the main thread of conversation is going to
naturally tend towards security and tech. How to protect your stuff with
cameras and GPS trackers and what not.

Is such blatant parcel theft not indiciative of a greater societal illness?
Not simply poverty and drug abuse.

I find myself trying to imagine why I’d drive through suburbs with a partner
in crime and nab the odd parcel from a porch along the way. I could be looking
to fence something to pay for the next high, or I could be poor as hell and
looking to make ends meet. Or, maybe I might just think that the person I’m
stealing from is wealthy enough to deal without it and I simply need whatever
it is more than they do?

I wonder, because there’s a lot you can assume about someone living in a
pleasant suburb, ordering lots of Amazon packages. The likely colour of their
skin, their money, maybe even their politics. And we like to use attributes
like those to decide whether or not someone deserves something.

I’ve no idea, but I find it really difficult to explore this without trying to
understand why it happens.

~~~
pixl97
> not indiciative of a greater societal illness?

Pretty much been a thing since people have large enough societal groups
(larger than Dunbar's number), that some anonymity is allowed. We just get to
share these events via our high tech electronic networks and everyone gets to
see it.

------
Ajedi32
I'm really surprised at how many times he was able to recover and reuse that
device before it was lost for good.

It seems like during the last clip the stink spray failed to activate for some
reason?

~~~
aiven
Yeah, spray failed and because of this last guy kept the package. Probably
this is why it was the last video.

------
everyone
What I found interesting was that none of the people looked poor. Many of them
had cars, they seemed to have nice houses, they were all well dressed.

I reckon they are just average victims of 'asperational' media and general
consumerism and materialism, that is quite rampant in modern society. I reckon
they just want the latest gadget, or intend to sell it in order to get another
useless status symbol of some kind.

------
H1Supreme
I watched this video earlier today, and I've seen other videos where people's
packages are stolen off their front porch. One was a super busy street where
the porch was at street level and totally open for all to see. My first
thought is: Why are you getting packages delivered to your house if this is an
issue?

I live in a rural'ish area on a very low traffic street. I still get all my
packages delivered to work. All the offices I've worked in have never had a
problem with me doing this. My current office is a secure building with a
metal detector and armed security. No issues.

If someone's on the road, or out of the office constantly, then have the
package held at a UPS or Fedex store. Once UPS, Fedex, or USPS drop that
package off on your porch, it's your responsibility.

------
kwhitefoot
Why not use the sort of dye that banks use to protect ATMs?

~~~
mankyd
Fart spray and glitter are temporary and relatively harmless. Permanent dye in
someone's home are car is just being a jerk.

~~~
auiya
We sure wouldn't want to upset people stealing our belongings.

~~~
mankyd
I won't deny the criminality. I'm still not going to cause them thousands of
dollars in damage over it.

~~~
AstralStorm
Use UV active dye (usually transparent otherwise) so they get shiny. Say, a
package gets wet itself.

------
xenadu02
I recommend package drop boxes if package theft is a problem for you:
[https://www.amazon.com/b?ie=UTF8&node=17572893011](https://www.amazon.com/b?ie=UTF8&node=17572893011)

~~~
progval
Ironically, one of them has "assorted glitter colors"

------
ChuckMcM
Nice, I posted a link to the video yesterday
([https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18704553](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18704553))

I really like the reactions of all the folks who picked up the package. The
'fart spray' was a really nice touch. I was also thinking that if you could
aerosolize some cyanoacrylate when throwing that glitter bomb, it could make
for some good times. But there is a line you don't want to cross or you'll get
people into revenge mode. Glitter and farts seems pretty harmless.

------
irrational
In our area it was an Amazon driver who was stealing packages. He would
deliver his assigned packages, but then take any packages that were already
left on the porch from previous deliveries.

------
coryfklein
Wow the video codec just doesn't know what to do with that much glitter, does
it.

------
chrisseaton
I don't understand why the delivery people just leave packages on porches? Why
not leave somewhere safe and out of view? Or leave it with a neighbour?

~~~
astrodust
As a random delivery person do you know the neighbor's relationship?

If you know both parties personally maybe you can, but that's a rarity these
days for anyone outside of certain companies. Amazon's ad-hoc delivery service
never sends the same person twice.

------
emanuensis
For package thieves most of the problem, at least for those at home most of
the time, like me, is simply have the delivery man RING THE BELL. Why this is
not common practice for all deliverers, UPS/FEDEX/AZ etc. is beyond me. If the
delivery man is already at the front porch all he has to do is reach for the
bell.

------
linsomniac
This video has a couple scenes of people opening the package in what looks
like their own house. Like the guy vacuuming up all the glitter after the
fact, or the woman tossing the package in her trash can. Sure with Mark Rober
had given some details about what the police did in that case.

------
modzu
it's surprising and sad how 'average' the thieves all seem to be; i expected
to see somebody down on their luck, not a guy in a lexus or with a $2000 bike
in his room. im trying not to jump to conclusions about humanity. please help.

~~~
astrodust
Imagine how much money you could make hawking shit you stole on eBay and how
little income tax you'd pay on it.

Until you get caught.

Leasing a car isn't beyond the reach of petty criminals.

~~~
greedo
Ebay will report your sales if you reach a certain threshold.

------
gkfasdfasdf
Tangent, but my son and I used Mark's video on building a pinewood derby car.
He gives a list of 7-8 things to do to your car in order of effectiveness. A
theme in his video is that the car doesn't have to look fancy to be fast. We
implemented most of his recommendations and didn't have time to paint or
decorate the car. We ended up winning and we were the most unadorned car in
the pack.

TLDR: Mark is legit.

~~~
cwkoss
I built an aluminum forge and made some castings following one of his videos.
Only about ~$50 worth of parts needed (and $100+ in safety equipment to be
safe)

------
jakobegger
It's amazing how many people just use their cars to steal packages. If the
camera angle was slightly different, it should be trivial to track them down
(license plate).

I wish police would track down thieves more effectively...

------
techaddict009
Parcel picking seems a huge problem in USA.

I am from India. I didnt know about this untill recent. I gifted Kindle fire
stick to one friend in USA. They package was delivered and had note "Placed on
Back Porch". I didnt notice that properly and then found it was picked up :P
My friend didnt get it.

Thanks to amazon who bared the loss and recent one more again.

Hope govt. comes with some strict laws to fix this before it turns to huge.

------
tripzilch
The fart spray was the most brilliant part of the contraption, imho. If you
look at the video, you can see he pulled the trick numerous times with the
same (costly) device, mainly because the thieves were disgusted by the smell
and threw it out before they discovered there were four phones in the package.

------
apexalpha
I'm just amazed they leave packages outside your door for everyone to see and
grab.

Why don't they at least try the neighbours?

------
mirimir
Yes, he did a great job on design and construction.

But I wonder if sought legal advice before implementing. Because, as others
have noted, I gather that booby traps are illegal in the US. Maybe this one is
benign enough, but I rather doubt it.

Also, while it's true that thieves aren't so likely to press claims, what
about parents of juvenile thieves?

~~~
owenversteeg
I believe (someone more knowledgeable feel free to correct me) that booby
traps are only illegal when they hurt/damage people.

------
akeck
Stories like this, and other logistical issues I've personally faced (e.g.,
counterfeits), have pushed me back to shopping brick-and-mortar for certain
things. Yes, I have physically to go to a place to shop, but for some
expensive/desirable items, it's more discreet and simpler.

------
dplgk
I wonder how much time it took to get all these thieves? We get less people
stealing our packages in NYC.

------
linsomniac
All of the videos this guy, Mark Rober, does are worth watching.
[https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCY1kMZp36IQSyNx_9h4mpCg](https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCY1kMZp36IQSyNx_9h4mpCg)

------
WillPostForFood
Does this video seem fake/staged to anyone else? Particularly the reaction of
the thief, but also that they left the phones behind, the unlikely GPS signal
in the garage, he fearless approach to the crime scene. Nothing felt right.

~~~
loser777
It's definitely a possibility but:

\+ I think it's hard to guess what the reaction of a thief will be

\+ The only indication that there were phones inside appeared to be the tiny
holes for the cameras

\+ It appears he had a trace of GPS signals over time so that he would be able
to deduce it ended up in garage if it stopped transmitting there

I would say the "fearless approach to the crime scene" is probably the most
suspect bit.

------
irrational
It is interesting to note the various demographics: black/white, male/female,
older/younger, etc. There doesn't seem to be any pattern (other than being
unethical jerks) as to who steals packages.

------
poundtown
take one phone and repackage it in its old box. turn it on and throw it into a
amazon box and wait. once you have their address you can slowly exact revenge
via subtle methods that dont expose you. this glitter method would be like
kicking a shark in my neighborhood. made a good vid tho i really enjoyed
watching it. esp the fart spray parts.

------
dylan604
“Glitter: the herpes of all craft supplies. You can never get rid of it.” I
wish I was clever enough to have come up with that.

------
ttty2
What if somebody was driving and while it opens he has an accident and is dead
and/or kills somebody? What would happen?

~~~
craftyguy
Driving a car while opening a package is not exactly a safe activity to do in
the first place, regardless of what is in the package.

------
cabaalis
It'd the United States. Thief will sue for damages glitter bomb caused his
lungs, and win.

------
JCharante
So I guess parcel thieves should remember to open all their packages in a
faraday cage nowadays?

~~~
martin-adams
You'd need a portable faraday cage right. Otherwise you'd be tracked right to
it.

------
SCAQTony
Is this even legal or safe to have a glitter "bomb," or more accurately, a
spinning motor spraying glue if an accomplice opens the package within a
moving car? How about just a GPS signal to notify cops. The glitter stuff and
chemical spray is probably a civil liability as well.

~~~
myrryr
> How about just a GPS signal to notify cops.

Which would work if the cops cared about it at all... Which leads to the
glitter bomb being created....

~~~
SCAQTony
My understanding is that the police do care and Amazon is working with them...
and they are not using glitter or chemical scents like you advocate:

New York Times: [https://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2018/12/11/us/ap-us-
porch-t...](https://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2018/12/11/us/ap-us-porch-thefts-
sting.html)

CBS: [https://www.nbcnews.com/nightly-news/video/police-
department...](https://www.nbcnews.com/nightly-news/video/police-department-
teams-up-with-amazon-to-catch-porch-pirates-1396450883965)

~~~
seattle_spring
> My understanding is that the police do care

Oh you sweet, summer child.

------
jacquesm
PSA: do not piss off engineers with too much time on their hands.

------
amai
Why is not an option in the US to get your parcels delivered to your
workplace? This is quite common practice in Germany.

~~~
wuunderbar
People do it all the time; many US office workplaces are okay with it.

However, not everyone has an office situation like that nor should we need to
live in fear of getting items delivered to our home.

------
dmarlow
Why glitter though? I'd choose something that is far more difficult to remove;
like ink, motor oil, etc.

~~~
floatingatoll
He's using glitter that's as fine as sand. It coats every available surface
and sinks into the pores of all soft materials (such as leather car seats).

------
brightball
Do not mess with engineers

------
empath75
i dunno, 4 free iphones is probably worth dealing with glitter and fart spray
for a few minutes?

~~~
teraflop
Watch the video. The phones are hidden, and the fart spray is designed to make
the thief get rid of the package as quickly as possible rather than taking it
apart to see what might be inside.

~~~
mcv
Even so, wouldn't it be better to use 4 cheap cameras instead of 4 expensive
smartphones?

~~~
bsamuels
4 cheap cameras wont have lte radios

seriously, pick up x4 $30 prepaid phones from walmart and they'll do the job
perfectly

------
0898
I know I'm going to get downvoted for this, but glitter is a microplastic – I
hope we'll see it being used less in the future.

~~~
mcv
I want to upvote you for your concern about microplastics, but my rule is to
downvote people who complain about voting.

~~~
MrStonedOne
I have the same rule.

It sounds so whiny when they start their message decrying that they'll get
downvotes for something.

Its even worse when its not something they will get downvotes for.

That's when you realize that they probably get downvoted a lot because of how
whiny they are, only they always blame it on some other aspect because they
have no self awareness.

------
bookofjoe
Related: [https://www.foxnews.com/politics/viral-video-shows-man-
getti...](https://www.foxnews.com/politics/viral-video-shows-man-getting-
shocked-trying-to-steal-electrified-trump-yard-sign)

[https://www.foxnews.com/politics/viral-video-shows-man-
getti...](https://www.foxnews.com/politics/viral-video-shows-man-getting-
shocked-trying-to-steal-electrified-trump-yard-sign)

------
djhworld
I'm not sure what this proves other than being a honey trap and good YouTube
clickbait.

This has been done on YouTube before with people setting up unlocked bicycles
attached to some strong difficult to see rope bolted to a nearby structure
(e.g. fishing wire), waiting for someone to come and take it, and then laugh
when the thief goes flying over the handlebars as they ride off

It's justice porn, but at the same time it makes me feel uncomfortable
watching.

------
mikece
Nice work, but I think I am not alone in hoping we get to see photos of the
skunk-glittered thieves soon!

Oh -- and to the engineer who made that: you've got a billion dollar idea on
your hands if you include a camera that takes video from inside the device
when it's opened. I can think of at least 14 people to whom I would send one
of these for Christmas, birthday, etc.

~~~
woofcat
It was made by Mark Rober a former engineer at JPL who worked on the Mars
Rover projects.

------
decebalus1
I don't know what to think about this. It feels staged. I know, I know, the
guy is legit, etc.. but I guess the internet made me a skeptic. People go to
great lengths for making things viral. I remember various Reddit legit 'Gods
of science', very popular IRL which were banned for having bot accounts
upvoting their contributions so I trust nobody.

And if it's not staged, I see this as an open invite for vandalism, or worse.
Those people were pissed and unscrupulous. What's stopping them from coming
back and throwing a Molotov cocktail at your house or slashing your tires if
you park on the street? First thing I thought about when seeing this video
was:"THE GUY KNOWS WHERE YOU FUCKING LIVE".

Just ask a cop if he/she thinks this is a good idea. What was initially a
crime of opportunity can now escalate to something much worse.

Also, what if the thief opens the package when driving and hits someone? I
could easily see a lawyer or an ambitious DA going after the guy for booby
trapping a package.

Bad idea all around.

