
Amazon’s $23M book about flies (2011) - fwdbureau
http://www.michaeleisen.org/blog/?p=358
======
JacobAldridge
The original 2011 discussion - well worth a repost, and a re-read of the
comments too:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2475854](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2475854)

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snorrah
Google cached link in case you also get 502:
[http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:http://...](http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:http://www.michaeleisen.org/blog/%3Fp=358&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&hl=en-
gb&client=safari)

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paulcole
At my last job, I wrote a bit about this:

[https://sellerengine.com/top-5-myths-about-amazon-
repricing-...](https://sellerengine.com/top-5-myths-about-amazon-repricing-
software/)

It's a funny situation to be sure, but remember that somebody was trying to
sell that book, and their software screwed up in a way that just shouldn't
happen, preventing them from making that sale.

~~~
Apofis
It's very simple, if you use an Amazon Repricer that's retarded and you don't
set a max price, this happens.

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llimllib
I used to write software to do this; this comment from the previous time this
article was posted is spot on:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2478096](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2478096)

The company I worked for did this, if not before anybody else did, than at
least very nearly so:

> Then came the "phantom listers" \- agencies with software that spiders
> through the listings of legitimate on line book dealers looking for titles
> with few (or no) copies listed in Amazon. They then list them at inflated
> prices.

~~~
CamperBob2
With any luck, your former employer patented the general concept and then sold
the IP to Nathan Myhrvold, who will now sue everybody in the business for
eleventy billion dollars.

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throwaway13337
tl;dr: Price adjustment program feedback loop causes predictably ridiculous
prices.

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BashiBazouk
Algorithmic pricing is the main reason I rarely buy anything on Amazon
anymore. On the realistic end, I've had too many situations that I was
thinking of buying something, finally decide to pull the trigger only to find
the price had gone significantly up. Not just a 3rd party running out of
inventory and the lowest price moving to the next cheapest seller but items
sold by Amazon. Once I realized I had to use a site like camelcamelcamel.com
to track the price, Amazon was no longer the easy, trusted low price retailer.
Make me think about a purchase, I will. On the high end, most products you
look at have an insane high price, even on price fixed items that I can walk
to a store and buy anytime for MSRP. This article has an extreme example but
most items I look at have at least one offer that is 10 - 100x everyone else.
That this is not monitored and dealt with from amazon gives the whole site an
aurora of sleaze...

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rsuelzer
My friend and I built a proof of concept to post books for sale that were not
available on Amazon.com but were available on Half.com for a markup. When
someone orders on Amazon.com, place an order on Half.com and change the
shipping address.

~~~
misiti3780
were you able to make money using it ?

~~~
zeeshanm
I personally know someone who successfully arbitraged Amazon and Half.com.

There is so much potential out there.

~~~
misiti3780
can you explain more about how the arbitrage works ? I am confused how it is
possible. for instance, I buy a lot of used books from amazon.com (well, third
party sellers). when i one-buy click, the purchase goes through immediately,
and the sellar already has the book listed, so i am confused how it would even
be done.

~~~
55555
This is very easy and actually quite common between Amazon and Ebay. You would
list the title as Merchant Fulfilled on Amazon and when someone orders it you
would place the order yourself on Half.com using their shipping address and
pocketing the difference.

~~~
zeeshanm
To add to this, you can use Amazon Listing API to add/remove items that are
available on Half.com.

~~~
misiti3780
how did you go about finding the items that were on Half but not on amazon
though ? - manually ?

~~~
zeeshanm
Doing it manually is one way but not scalable. You can aggregate data either
using available APIs or by scraping websites. You can list books on Amazon
that are available on Half.com and give you a decent profit margin. It doesn't
matter if books are already listed on Amazon. Just make sure your offer price
is a little bit cheaper than the cheapest available copy.

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codeulike
The other day we wanted a copy of the children's book 'Vincent the Vain', a
short picture book about a gorilla. 'Daily Deal' are selling a copy for
£999.11. [http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/offer-
listing/0747584990](http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/offer-listing/0747584990)

But they're the only people selling a new copy, so its not a feedback loop as
in OP. So whats going on there?

~~~
paulcole
It might be a case of the seller using that price as a placeholder until they
get the book back in stock. Amazon prefers that vendors keep items in stock,
so this is one way to do that, even if you're currently sold out.

I used to work for a company making software for Amazon vendors and don't
think Amazon cares that much, but lots of vendors believe it is true.

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timdierks
In extremely illiquid markets, you'll see failures of the ability of the
markets to converge on clearing prices. Doesn't mean anything in particular.

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sspiff
Perhaps include in the title that this is from 2011.

I haven't seen these kind of things recently, but I'd be happy to be proven
wrong.

~~~
mrighele
Sometimes I have fun searching for generic stuff (like 'book') in Amazon and
then ordering by descending price. Right know for example you can get
"Educational Research: Competencies for Analysis and Applications (with
MyEducationLab) Value Package (includes SPSS 16.0 Student Version for
Windows)" [1] for a mere $11,259,120.28. Please notice that it is the value
package :-).

[1] [http://www.amazon.com/Educational-Research-Competencies-
Appl...](http://www.amazon.com/Educational-Research-Competencies-Applications-
MyEducationLab/dp/0135069149/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1443479094&sr=1-1&keywords=book)

------
yitchelle
Though not as expensive, but Amazon has an Apple keyboard for just under
$1000.

[http://www.amazon.de/gp/product/B005DQ0DFI?psc=1&redirect=tr...](http://www.amazon.de/gp/product/B005DQ0DFI?psc=1&redirect=true&ref_=ox_sc_sfl_title_1&smid=ALPJ49DNEL3HT)

~~~
smcl
Maybe someone from Amazon is reading HN - that's showing as €61 for me

~~~
tgb
The exchange rate is getting crazy these days!

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fwdbureau
Ah, I wish i could edit the link, and point to the google cache instead, but
seems that it's too late.. Feeling sorry now, must feel like a DDoS attack for
the person who wrote this, and I believe it won't stop until the article goes
away from the frontpage :/

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tomtoise
Link seems to have been hugged to death. Can anyone mirror/plaintext? Cheers.

~~~
ilya-pi
here you go — [http://www.peeep.us/48bfb370](http://www.peeep.us/48bfb370)

~~~
tomtoise
Appreciate it. That seems like a useful site - bookmarked :)

~~~
ilya-pi
thank you! :-)

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rtpg
Is it even possible to purchase $23 million on a credit card?

~~~
martin-adams
Yes.
[http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/8152278.stm](http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/8152278.stm)

~~~
kennydude
> It also waived the usual $15 overdraft fee.

That was nice of them

~~~
RaSoJo
What would have happened - if the person had just decided to abscond without
enquiring or paying this bill?

~~~
mikeash
You know the old saying. If you owe the bank a hundred dollars, that's your
problem; if you owe the bank twenty-three quadrillion dollars, that's the
bank's problem.

------
ilya-pi
Copy of this — [http://www.peeep.us/48bfb370](http://www.peeep.us/48bfb370)

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DanielBMarkham
Note: it could also be artificial price collusion.

------
acqq
From the comments on the Amazon page:

"What a steal!

By John Taylor Kesler on April 25, 2011, Format: Paperback

I was fortunate enough to buy this at the bargain price of $19,087,354 there
must have been a sale because the next day it was listed at $23M. I was very
pleased to find upon arrival that the book contained very useful information,
however to be honest I was expecting a few more pictures for the price paid. I
highly recommend this to all my associates, I have many acquaintances with
children in only the best private schools who will be buying several copies.
If the price has you worried, ask yourself the American question: "can you
really put a price on good education?""

~~~
anc84
I really wish Amazon reviews were useful and not a mixture of a) angry rants,
b) bought reviews and c) jokes.

~~~
jevgeni
I have a system, where I read the most negative reviews of the book. If the
reviews are eloquent and make a solid point, I don't buy the book.

If the negative reviews are mostly whiny,emotional rants without any valid
solid arguments, then the book is most definitely worth it. A case in point:

[http://www.amazon.com/Structure-Interpretation-Computer-
Prog...](http://www.amazon.com/Structure-Interpretation-Computer-Programs-
Engineering/product-
reviews/0262510871/ref=cm_cr_dp_qt_hist_one?ie=UTF8&filterBy=addOneStar&showViewpoints=0)

~~~
ctdonath
I'll second that method. Positive reviews are uninteresting; 1-star reviews
reveal whether there really is a problem/deficiency, as usually the complaint
is unrelated ("product arrived damaged"), misguided (expectations were
bafflingly far from what product is, "this washcloth is a lousy database
manager"), or a fluke (50,000 5-star reviews and one "one page was folded,
replacement was fast & free").

~~~
conanbatt
I directly read 2 star reviews. 1 star reviews are often super biased and
pissed. Much like in yelp, it contains things like "The shoes didnt fit" ,
"The delivery guy was mean" and stuff like that.

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bryanrasmussen
From the linked page - 502 Bad Gateway.

if there had been more money spent on hosting than on books we might have
avoided this situation.

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yc1010
Everyone is missing the point, this is an example of money laundering

1\. Get dirty cash from drug sales, prostitution, etc and buy amazon.com
giftcards in shops in US

2\. Input the codes into various amazon buyer account(s)

3\. Buy the book(s) from these account(s)

4\. Amazon takes a cut and pays clean money into authors bank account.

~~~
bluedevil2k
The best? Amazon takes a 30% cut and then the government (here in the US)
takes another 28% for income tax, 12.4% for SSN, and 2.9% for Medicare. You
get less than half your cash into clean money. Plus, there's a huge paper
trail of buyers and the million dollar book would likely set off flags on
every sale.

~~~
yc1010
See my 2nd comment below, this is definitely happening in electronics section
where Amazon fees are smaller.

Losing ~20% is not too bad when clean money from a reputable source arrives in
your bank account, if you are reselling lets say hard drives or phones.

