
Copenhagen Suborbitals: The world’s only manned, amateur space program - walterbell
https://copenhagensuborbitals.com/about-us/
======
walterbell
The most recent launch was August 2018,
[https://copenhagensuborbitals.com/missions/nexo-
ii/](https://copenhagensuborbitals.com/missions/nexo-ii/)

 _> The Nexø rocket class is a technology demonstrator in advance of building
the significantly bigger Spica rocket that will take our astronaut to space
... The rocket flew in a perfect line up to app. 6500 m, where the nosecone
was discarded, and the ballute did its job: Stabilising the rocket, and then
deploying the main parachute that carried the rocket down to a gentle
splashdown in the sea. The rocket was quickly recovered as planned – and even
the nosecone was found. This splash cannot be underestimated: It was the first
time we had a rocket land in a parachute, and that with a speed so low that an
astronaut would have survived the impact. Also, the DPR system proved to be as
successful as we hoped. This system, that uses a helium tank to maintain a
constant pressure in the fuel og oxidizer tanks, paves the way for a rocket
that can fly an astronaut all the way to space without the need for extremely
complicated turbopumps. In other words: The Nexø I and II has done their job
as concept demonstrators for the systems that now can be scaled up to the much
bigger, manrated Spica rocket class._

------
drmpeg
I was tangentially involved in the Nexo II launch. Alexandru Csete (author of
Gqrx) used my GNU Radio DVB-S2 transmitter code to send live HD video from the
rocket.

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uwSYv8eVQqQ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uwSYv8eVQqQ)

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYF8Am-
lt20](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYF8Am-lt20)

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uqwJu6cSBW4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uqwJu6cSBW4)

~~~
adim_web
Ron, both of you are famous in free software and amateur radio communities due
to your work, so thanks again.

I have some doubts though regarding the safety of manned launches here. Seems
like a serious issue to me and I hope it's not treated lightly.

~~~
HeadsUpHigh
>I have some doubts though regarding the safety of manned launches here.

I have some doubts about the safety of climbing mount Everest too. That
doesn't mean people shouldn't do it. People like to do risky stuff.

------
xae342
Cool project, but I always find it amusing when the word “suborbital” is used
since it’s sort of a fancy way to say normal or not space. Reminds me this
Feynman story:

> Or his questioning of space shuttle engineers: ''They kept referring to the
> problem by some complicated name - a 'pressure-induced vorticity oscillatory
> wa-wa,' or something. I said, 'Oh, you mean a whistle!' 'Yes,' they said;
> 'it exhibits the characteristics of a whistle.' ''

[http://movies2.nytimes.com/books/97/09/21/reviews/feynman-
do...](http://movies2.nytimes.com/books/97/09/21/reviews/feynman-
doyoucare.html)

~~~
darkmighty
I find the term is apt here, because 'space' is roughly defined as anything
beyond 100km from Earth's surface (which they're aiming for). But reaching
space is vastly easier than reaching orbit, which requires reaching a speed of
about 28000km/h or 17000 mph, which they're definitely not aiming for!

~~~
xae342
That makes sense, I think I still think of an object reaching space as it can
then stay there, vs just a peekaboo. :)

------
imglorp
I'm curious how a volunteer organization will achieve the culture and
technical maturity to make human rated hardware without a high probability of
a horrible death. Think about all the conditions in a long chain of events
that must all go right, in a launch, to avoid cooking, freezing, squishing,
cratering, asphyxiating, poisoning, exploding, or drowning your crew.

After decades of practice, NASA ended up under 1:100 odds of mishap at the end
of the Shuttle program, with some estimates at 1:25. It would be fair to say
all space programs need to go through a learning period where you blow a lot
of things up and discover all the failure modes. SpaceX ate through several
billion dollars on this path, before dialing in their launcher reliability,
and they still don't think they're ready for humans.

How will CS do all this learning and get everything right?

~~~
OtterCoder
Maybe that's not their primary goal? People have taken horrifying risks to
push frontiers throughout history. The Oregon Trail claimed an estimated
21,000 lives.* Perhaps they are willing to accept a higher risk of death?

*Though, despite the horrific toll, the final odds of death on the O.T., once the dust had settled, were about 5% to NASA's ~4%.

------
blendo
I wish them best of luck, but am more optimistic about Paul Allen's
Stratolaunch system: [https://www.stratolaunch.com/2018/08/20/stratolaunch-
announc...](https://www.stratolaunch.com/2018/08/20/stratolaunch-announces-
new-launch-vehicles/) They hope to orbit a 370kg payload in 2020.

That mass seems almost sufficient to send up a human.

Could we build a 300kg capsule to carry a 70kg human payload, a few hours of
air and power, parachute, heatshield, and enough thrust to de-orbit (with less
than 5-7G of acceleration)?

Stratolaunch is using a Pegasus rocket
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pegasus_(rocket)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pegasus_\(rocket\)),
which is obviously not rated for human spaceflight, but rich "explorers" might
be interested.

~~~
nickik
Stratolaunch is far away from anything human related. There are a couple
competitors who want to lift a couple 100kg to LEO by 2020.

They have not even built their own rocket yet and so far their efforts in that
direction have not impressed progressed fast. It will be 10+ years before the
launch a human, if ever. Given the existing competition, I don't think they
will ever get there.

Outside of BlueOrigin and maybe Virgin Galactic are close to human suborbital
flight.

------
vackosar
Is it open-source? As that could speed up development in the area.

------
jimnotgym
Why aren't we all doing this! Isn't this the dream of everyone who ever built
a model rocket?

~~~
z3phyr
Feasibility is the major contributing factor. Time, Space and Money are hard
to come by. Then of course there is the red tape from the respective
government involving permission for a very costly hobby. Then, the easiest to
acquire, knowledge.

~~~
quickthrower2
These people launch from international waters. They are a pirate space
organisation!

~~~
tomjen3
A pirate space organisation that gets the air space over them closed by the
government.

~~~
solarkraft
Air space over international waters can be controlled by a government?

~~~
Symbiote
"We fly our rockets from the military firing practice area ES D 139 in the
Baltic Sea, 20 km east of of the Danish island of Bornholm. It spans 70×35 km,
and are opened to us by the Royal Danish Navy for the launch time window. The
Danish and Swedish authorities are very helpful, and close the airspace above
for airtraffic in the hours of the actual launch."

[https://copenhagensuborbitals.com/about-
us/](https://copenhagensuborbitals.com/about-us/)

~~~
Risord
There is this quote: "If all of your money is not get wasted to your hobby,
your hobby sucks."

Updated: "...and won't require closing air space..."

------
ChuckMcM
These guys are super amazing! I worry that they will run up against the
MTCR[1] in their next step between their unmanned and manned version, since
driving out to international waters is 'exporting' as is flying above 100km
:-) It would be awesome if the Danish government would come out and publicly
sanction their efforts to cut off that potential mess.

[1] [https://www.nti.org/learn/treaties-and-regimes/missile-
techn...](https://www.nti.org/learn/treaties-and-regimes/missile-technology-
control-regime-mtcr/)

~~~
Shounak
Their website states that they launch from a Danish Naval base and they
receive help from Danish and Swedish authorities, so hopefully that means the
Danish government could be open to helping out with the MTCR too.

[https://copenhagensuborbitals.com/about-
us/](https://copenhagensuborbitals.com/about-us/)

------
crypt1d
This is awesome! I hope they get a nice bump in membership numbers after being
featured on HN.

Does anyone know if there a way to get more involved in the project (eg as a
volunteer of any kind)? I couldn't find anything on the website.

~~~
KSteffensen
They are very open. You can basically just show up in their hangar and have a
chat with whoever is around at the time. At least it used to be like this, I
haven't been out there for some years.

CS are already very well known in Denmark. Everybody with any sort of
engineering or science interest here knows about them.

------
mrfusion
What actually makes them amateur at this point? Wouldn’t it behiove them to
incorporate as a non profit perhaps?

~~~
henrikeh
They kinda are a non-profit. They are, AFAIK, a _forening_ (translates to
association), which allow them to collectively own assets and collect
donations.

------
walrus01
Something tells me that the space program is on hiatus:

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Madsen](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Madsen)

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Kim_Wall](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Kim_Wall)

~~~
yakcyll
He seems to have left the project four years ago. I suspect the murder might
have an impact on the public relations side of things, but I'm also pretty
sure people who do donate to them do their research better.

~~~
clan
Correct!

For those interested (and can live with Google Translate) they have a very
active and informative blog on:

[https://ing.dk/blogs/rumfart-pa-den-anden-made](https://ing.dk/blogs/rumfart-
pa-den-anden-made)

------
then
what about the african space program?

------
draugadrotten
One of the founders of Copenhagen Suborbitals are the now infamous Peter
Madsen

[https://www.theguardian.com/global/2018/jan/07/copenhagen-
ki...](https://www.theguardian.com/global/2018/jan/07/copenhagen-killing-
peter-madsen-kim-wall-murder-submarine)

~~~
Faaak
Just curious: what's the purpose of your post ?

~~~
jonsen
An example of entrepreneurial accomplishment. Peter Madsen desperately wanted
to go to space. So far he has made it to confined space.

------
unixhero
Hmmm. I think I might have to join this.

