
Dell Offers Computers Preinstalled with Ubuntu - watchdogtimer
https://insights.ubuntu.com/2017/11/14/new-dell-precision-machines-available-with-ubuntu-pre-installed/
======
mmjaa
I just recently purchased a "GPD Pocket", which is in my opinion the best
Linux machine I've ever owned. Its a unibody-like case (just like MacBook)
with a touchscreen, in a very small package:

[https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/gpd-pocket-7-0-umpc-
lapto...](https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/gpd-pocket-7-0-umpc-laptop-
ubuntu-or-win-10-os-laptop--2)

I've been a Linux user since day one of its release, and an "Apple laptop
user" since the day of the tiBook release - and these two aspects of my
professional life have always been a little incongruous to me personally.. the
MacBook is in my toolbox because it is, simply, a great laptop in terms of
physical comfort level, even if I'm not a huge fan of MacOS - the physicality
of the thing matters. And Linux, of course, is just plain powerful.

So the moment I realised someone produce a laptop that wasn't from Apple, yet
had very similar physical attributes (albeit smaller), which would also give
me a way to escape MacOS and run Linux as a first-class OS, I jumped on board.

The point is, I hope manufacturers continue this trend - to build a better
laptop than Apple, but make it really worthwhile for the user to install Linux
on it.

I've had a lot of systems, but my GPD Pocket is really one of my favourite
devices - the best of the hardware world combined with the best software you
can find, and when I open it up and start using it, I really don't have any
desire to buy another Apple machine.

Could this be the start of the exodus? Time will tell - the GPD Pocket has
many aspects that are not so great - but if they follow it up with an
improvement over its existing design, I will definitely become an ex-Apple
customer.

The physicality is important, and it seems its no longer an Apple-exclusive
desire to build such wonderful machines.

(Note: this means I don't find any of these Dells' particularly attractive for
the same reason .. but maybe someone has compared them in reality and knows
where I'm coming from here?)

~~~
mtw
I used once a 10" Asus Chromebook Flip. For $300, you get a reasonably fast
laptop with Linux and good keyboard. Great for vim, typing documents, and even
occasional netflix.

The real issue in these laptops for developers is the Atom CPU. I found most
packages or libraries I used do not support Atom or ARM CPUs. There are hacks
and other user-compiled packages but there are compromises. In the end, you
just want to get work done and not be bugged with limitations.

I'd pay good money for a similar laptop with an i5 or equivalent processor
though.

~~~
btschaegg
I've got a C100P and can't say I had a big problem with libraries. The only
annoying thing was that there are few really good text editors that work on
ARM, so the C100P was actually the reason I picked up Vim and Emacs.

My biggest problem was the Chromebook part. Getting your own linux distro on
the device is a hassle, the devmode boot screen is abysmal (I once
accidentally killed my system by touching the space bar), and in Croagh, Xorg
would stop working every few weeks, forcing me to set the whole thing up from
scratch again.

It's a really cool little device, and I still use it to play videos while I'm
washing the dishes, but the (vanilla) Linux options didn't convince me.

Edit: Actually, I've been thinking about buying the GDP Pocket for a while
now. Can anyone attest to how good the keyboard is? The layout seemed like the
biggest drawback to me...

~~~
mmjaa
The layout is awful at first but after a week or two of use, I got into it and
now I hardly even notice. Keep in mind though, the whole thing is quite
pocketable ..

~~~
btschaegg
That doesn't sound too bad. Thanks for the response!

------
krylon
The big deal, IMHO, is not so much that it comes with Ubuntu preinstalled, but
that it (I naively assume) contains only hardware supported by Linux.

I have been ridiculously lucky when buying hardware, but I am told it is not
that difficult, even today, to run into machines with hardware that is not
well-supported by Linux.

So I think I would actually prefer if vendors sold machines that have been
tested to work well with Linux, kind of like the "Designed for
Windows"-stickers on PCs and notebooks.

If a machine is made of hardware that Linux supports well, I do not care what
OS is preinstalled, since I will probably wipe it and install one myself
anyway. But having a guarantee from the vendor that I can do so without
trouble or fear of bricking my machine would be helpful.

~~~
teekert
I agree, but it would be a nice bonus not to have to pay for Windows at all.
This also gives a clear signal to Dell.

~~~
pjmlp
Dell charges you 100 euros more for Ubuntu than for Windows.

[http://www.dell.com/de-de/shop/notebooks-und-
ultrabooks/xps-...](http://www.dell.com/de-de/shop/notebooks-und-
ultrabooks/xps-13-9360-laptop/spd/xps-13-9360-laptop?~ck=bt)

~~~
jcranberry
On the Precision machines, which you can configure manually, switching from
Windows to Ubuntu makes the machine cost about 100 USD less. The price
difference is probably other hardware.

------
Sir_Cmpwn
My best Linux experience laptop continues to be the venerable ThinkPad X200
(circa 2008). It has _perfect_ Linux support - every single piece of hardware
works with drivers in the upstream kernel. It has good battery life, it's
lightweight, and it's very durable - it's almost 10 years old and both of mine
look brand new. The keyboard, RAM, disk, etc is all user-upgradable and each
screw is labelled so you know what to remove to get into which components. The
keyboard is the best I've ever seen in a laptop - and it's user replacable.
The laptop has WiFi, ethernet, bluetooth, a fingerprint reader, and a webcam,
all of which work perfectly with open source drivers. The hardware is so well
understood that I've also had most of it work correctly on NetBSD, Minix,
Haiku, and 9front. 9front! It's also supported by coreboot.

It's not an 8-core powerhouse, but I don't expect that from my laptop. It
compiles the Linux kernel in about 10 minutes on one (of two) cores. It runs
KVM just fine. If I need to do something really heavy I'll SSH into some
remote box that can handle it better, but I've done that pretty rarely. It
copes very well with almost any workload I've given it.

You can pick one up on eBay for anywhere from $40-$150. No other laptop even
comes close for me. Is it glamorous? No. Does it play games? No. But it's the
best damn laptop you will ever use.

~~~
the_watcher
A few years back, I decided I wanted to try out Linux after finally getting
tired of Windows (which I'd used all through school). I bought a Thinkpad X200
for $65 on eBay. I had Linux up and running on it in an hour, and used it
happily until I bought my 2013 11-inch Macbook Air (which for my money is the
perfect machine in terms of form factor, I'll use it until it dies). Thinkpads
are impressive machines.

------
bitexploder
Bought a 7520 and am keeping it on 16.04. could not be happier.

Highlights:

32 GiB of RAM

15" 1920x1080 FHD matte screen with no mic or webcam

1TB storage

Xeon processor (equivalent to top end Mac processor)

So... Many... Ports

Battery life with screen I picked is amazing

Ability to fully customize the beast

Painless Linux experience (truly).

Down sides:

Heavier than a MBP

A teeny bit of coil whine

Charger is 180W....and big too

Cost -- as much as a rMBP, but for the dollars the hardware is dramatically
better in the areas I care about. Go spec it out if serious and make own
decision though :)

I love this computer. I know some people may consider the 1920x1080 15" screen
not as nice as Retina (you can get a Retina density display on the 7520 if you
want), but I find 144ppi perfect for 15". Better than anything of yesteryear.
Also I was able to get /exactly/ what I wanted at each option for a reasonable
price and no compromises. Anyhow I can finally tell people this is a good idea
if you are comfortable on Linux.

~~~
enriquto
I just got the same... notice that besides the 1TB SSD you can put inside an
additional 4TB HDD.

the only problem is that turboboost does not seem to work out of the box, is
it working for yours?

~~~
bitexploder
You know..... I haven't checked.

I only kicked the tires on the discrete GPU.

I have been looking at this now. It seems, according to `turbostat` that one
core reaches 3000mhz (indicating turbo is not kicking in), but... see below:

I have [https://ark.intel.com/products/97463/Intel-Xeon-
Processor-E3...](https://ark.intel.com/products/97463/Intel-Xeon-
Processor-E3-1505M-v6-8M-Cache-3_00-GHz) so Turbo should hit 4ghz

I tried this:

[https://askubuntu.com/questions/871308/enabling-disabling-
tu...](https://askubuntu.com/questions/871308/enabling-disabling-turbo-
boost-16-04)

and put a 1 in /sys/devices/system/cpu/intel_pstate/no_turbo and it dropped
the cpu frequency from ~2700 to 2200 according to the `turbostate` command.
However, when I run i7z it reports a frequency of 3000 (maximum frequency
without turbo), which is correct, and a frequency of ~3600 mhz (freq
multiplier of 36x, which is one of a possible 40x, 38x, 37x, and 36x turbo
multipliers) so I /think/ it is doing the right thing. I am going to assume
turbostate is not correctly reporting the frequency using the correct
multiplier, but that may not be true.

It is definitely scaling the CPU speed. And, anecdotally, it compiles things
very quickly :)

What sort of investigations have you performed?

------
jonaswi
I was so tired of being forced to buy overpriced hardware from Apple that I'm
not even happy with just because I work with OS X.

I then bought a new Dell XPS 13 Developer Edition and was surprised that a)
the scaling does not even work with Dells own "tweaked" Ubuntu (even the
installer looked horrible) and b) "coil whine" is a thing at this price point.
I was so unhappy with it that I sold it and replaced it with an HP spectre
x360. Except for thunderbolt everything worked fine so for me there was no
real advantage over the "preinstalled" Ubuntu on the Dell.

~~~
bognition
If all you care about are CPU clock speed & RAM then Apple computers are
overpriced. I grew up salivating over another few hundred Mhz but honestly
computers are fast enough that I really didn't notice a difference the last
time I upgraded to a new computer.

Computers have evolved well beyond those basic specs and I buy apple products
because I care about the whole package. So until other manufacturers figure
out how to build computers that are sturdier, last longer, have better
screens, sync wifi hotspots across devices, etc... I expect apple to continue
charging more for a superior all around product.

~~~
jcranberry
I have a precision 5520, and if I'm using integrated graphics I get 8+ hours
even with the 4k screen. The build seems quite sturdy but I've only had it for
around 6 months so far so can't say too much about that yet.

------
Tepix
The headline was altered in a confusing way, this article is about the Dell
Precision line.

FWIW, I have a Dell XPS 13 9350 laptop with Linux on it (Ubuntu 17.10) and it
runs marvellously.

~~~
mherrmann
I have the same machine with Ubuntu 16.04 (pre-installed). I had a MacBook Pro
2014 before and am very happy with the switch.

Pros:

\- small and light yet a large screen

\- awesome battery life

\- $500+ cheaper than a comparable MBP

\- OS X's shell isn't bad, Ubuntu's is even nicer

\- I can customise Ubuntu to my heart's content

\- no stupid apps I don't want or need bothering me (iTunes, Garage Band, ...)

Cons:

\- screen less crisp than MBP

\- speaker quality worse

\- Ubuntu is not very clever about remembering the sound settings for my
headphones, have to re-plug and re-apply settings often (may be fixable/fixed
in 17.04)

\- web cam placement is in the lower left corner of the screen so the people
you chat with look up your nostrils.

My productivity is probably the same but the XPS feels much more like it's
"mine" and I'm not being force-fed stuff by Apple I don't need.

------
le-mark
Dell has been offering these for a long time. I bought a 1525n (laptop) with
Ubuntu pre-installed in 2008, it was my primary machine for years. I don't use
it often now, but it runs xubuntu 14.04 fantastically well.

~~~
UnfalseDesign
Same here. I bought a Dell Inspiron back in 2009 with Ubuntu pre-installed. I
still use it to this day though it is pretty much on its last leg. I think the
title is a little confusing. It should be that Dell is expanding the number of
computers they offer with Ubuntu. This title makes it sound like they haven't
been offering it for years now.

------
rekshaw
Have they fixed the Windows key? I remember from my XPS Developer Edition it
came pre-installed with Ubuntu but the windows key was not replaced with a
would-be-awesome Ubuntu key. A tiny detail, but still...

~~~
dijit
I would pay a non-trivial amount of money to remove the windows branded key
from mine. But the precision I bought this year did indeed have a windows
branded meta key.

------
ACow_Adonis
Still not a single one in Australia? :(

Honestly, it cannot be that hard...I'm this close to writing off future dell
purchases on principal...

That's as someone who loves his XPS 13 and had to put ubuntu on there
himself...

~~~
EspadaV9
I have been asking about their plans to bring these to Australia for at least
a year now with my recent message to them on Twitter not getting a reply and
their sales chat saying they aren't available. Unfortunately there doesn't
seem to be any laptop available in Australia that comes preinstalled with any
for of Linux, and the XPS does have good support, so to me it still seems to
be best option for now.

------
dijit
I bought a Dell Precision 5520 earlier this year. I have to say that the
Ubuntu it shipped with was not /quite/ there. But it did not suffer the custom
kernel woes of earlier XPS models which shipped with linux. It was mostly
stock Ubuntu.

After throwing arch Linux on the thing it was more akin to "old thinkpad"
levels of compatibility. I'm really impressed and not sorry that I gave Dell
my money. It's a rock solid machine.

~~~
jcranberry
Yeah I got one too, when the meta key didn't work at first my new computer
euphoria took a vacation until I did the fix they posted online. There were
also a few other changes I remember vaguely having to do before really feeling
like it was a personalized machine.

I love it though. Will say it can heat up a little fast, especially when the
GPU is enabled.

------
sandworm101
No they don't. [http://www.dell.com/en-ca/](http://www.dell.com/en-ca/) (to
which I am redirected from every link in the OP) has nothing other than Win10
or Win7pro. I don't know exactly who they are selling these Ubuntu laptops,
but it isn't to me.

[http://www.dell.com/en-ca/shop/dell-laptops-netbooks-and-
tab...](http://www.dell.com/en-ca/shop/dell-laptops-netbooks-and-
tablets/sc/laptops/alienware-laptops)

I'd jump at the chance to buy a Ubuntu laptop. Not for me, but for those
family members who want laptops but cannot stand windows. I already am going
to spend this chirstmas installing Linux on my parent's new machine, bought at
Costco with win10. I would have ordered them a dell Ubuntu laptop, but I guess
Canada is just too small a market. Victory to Costco and another "sale" for
Microsoft.

------
jasonjayr
That list is not really complete --- just 2 weeks ago, we needed 2 "small form
factor" desktops for a project, so I emailed our Dell sales guy, mentioning
"we're going to install Linux on these anyway, don't care about the windows
license". 3 days later, we had 2 x OptiPlex 3050's, with a fully functional
Ubunutu image right from Dell.

I'm not sure the Linux option was available for that via their web site, but I
have a sneaking suspicion that they support Linux on more systems than their
site indicates.

------
sremani
The pain-point for me with Ubuntu (I personally installed) on laptop is the
power management. Are these pre-installed models any better w.r.t power
management?

~~~
rlpb
I'm very happy with the battery life of my XPS 9360 running Ubuntu (17.10
currently). I get a full working day out of it.

So far (about six months) I've received some number of firmware updates (3-6?)
through fwupd. These are integrated well into Ubuntu and the Linux ecosystem
generally. The updates happen through UEFI and no other OS is required in
order to receive them. I believe Dell prepare the updates for this pipeline
themselves.

Disclosure: I work for Canonical and use the laptop for work. But my choice of
laptop, and money to buy it, is my own (it isn't a business expense; my
contract merely requires me to have and maintain my own laptop).

------
api
I don't like Ubuntu, but I'd buy one. The real meaning of this is that they've
validated the hardware to work against modern Linux.

------
triangleman
I thought they have done this for a long time, at least since they sold that
poor woman a laptop with Ubuntu, causing her to drop out of college.

------
oneeyedpigeon
Shame the laptops are all — I think — 15" and above. And shame that page
doesn't provide any information apart from a photo and the model number: at
least list the screen size, maybe processor etc. so I'm not _completely_ in
the dark having to dip in and out of each one.

~~~
Vinnl
I've got the XPS 13, which is 13" and comes preinstalled with Ubuntu as well.
These are merely _new_ models with Ubuntu.

~~~
oneeyedpigeon
Thanks for the info — the XPS is definitely one of a very small number of
candidates to replace my Macbook Pro 13". Is ubuntu totally seamless? What
would you say is the biggest downside to that laptop?

~~~
fpoling
I use XPS 13 (9350 model from 2016) with Fedora and it is mostly seamless. The
only thing that does not work neither under original Ubuntu nor with Fedora
was a "docking station", the extra that Dell provided that connects to USB-3
port and provided more ports, monitor connection and power. I just could not
get it to work with an external monitor without being too blurry.

Hardware-wise the biggest disappointment was screen. QHD+ resolution is nice
in theory, but the screen is just way too reflective. Using screen protector
helped somewhat to mitigate the problem, but it is still far from what you get
with proper mate screens. The screen can be a lesser issue if it could be
opened to a wider angle, but the max angle is just not enough to avoid the
reflections from surrounding lamps.

Another thing is the touchpad. It works OK but I do not understand why nobody
in PC world can match Apple. Even touchpad on MacBook Air from 2013 is better
than what Dell provides. And the issue is not the Linux drivers, as I run
Fedora on that MacBook Air as well.

On the positive side the cooling fan is very quiet, way better than MacBook
Air. Even under heavy load the noise is not distracting.

------
linkmotif
Does this mean you can buy a dell without paying for the Windows license?

~~~
slitaz
Yes.

When you select to configure your Dell, you can see how much you save when
choosing Ubuntu.

~~~
linkmotif
Is this a special section of the site or something? I’ve heard this for years
but when I’ve looked around in the past I never did seem to find it.
Especially configurations that show you how much you saved!!

Huge thing keeping me from buying a PC is paying for Windows. I’d prefer no
part of my purchase go to the Windows license. Hard for me to stomach paying
for Windows just to buy a computer.

~~~
chucksmash
It used to be marketed as "Project Sputnik" and was harder to find (I sort of
remember you had to start the configuration from a specific page and what a
pain it was to hunt around to find it).

I just bought another Precision 5xxx in September and the option was right
where you'd expect it to be in their configurator though.

------
sandGorgon
in India, most laptop vendors sell a version with Ubuntu. Which is why India
is kind of turning as the real market for desktop linux over the west - where
it is affordable for most people to buy a macbook.

This is a very large market that Fedora is potentially ignoring. I have much
better experience installing and running fedora on bleeding edge hardware
(NVME, etc) than any other OS. Currently I run a XPS 9350 non-developer
edition with Fedora 27 and everything works out of the box.

------
zeep
Good news but I prefer Fedora nowadays... Of course it is an easy switch and
being tested with Ubuntu means that all hardware should be linux compatible.

------
edelsohn
Dell XPS 13 battery bloated, warped keyboard and track pad, and Dell refused
to accept responsibility for the dangerous defective product.

------
dm319
Do you remember when people (well linux people) used to say that Microsoft
pressured companies into not providing linux? Was that true?

------
nyordanov
If only they'd put discrete PgUp/PgDn/Home/End keys instead of making people
use Fn+arrows.

------
slitaz
That is for the US. What about Europe?

------
ezoe
Dell Precision laptop has nVidia GPU. No thanks.

I want a laptop with 4k built-in display and no nVidia GPU.

------
arca_vorago
With an egregious EULA. I wouldn't touch a dell Ubuntu image with a ten foot
pole.

------
rbanffy
s/5/5 more/

~~~
akerro
True, I bought a Dell Inspiron laptop in 2013 and it was with Ubuntu pre-
installed.

~~~
rbanffy
I got myself an "n Series" Vostro in 2012 that came with Linux. Served me well
for several years.

------
benevol
I encourage all Linux users to buy Dell as often as possible. We need more
companies that actively support open source software. Next step will be open
_hard_ ware.

------
j7ake
They look kind of expensive (1000 plus dollars) compared to the refurbished
Lenovo x220 and up (200 to 500 dollars). How do they compare ?

~~~
Jonnax
You're asking how a brand new computer compares to a laptop from 5 years ago
with a 1366x768 screen.

~~~
deno
And those Dell laptops still come with 16:9 1080p screens. Meh.

~~~
julesallen
I've spent so many hours trying to get HiDPI working with Linux and have
returned two machines to Dell (thankfully their 30 day no quibble return saved
me twice). I do a fair bit of image editing and the GIMP is unusable and lots
of older X classics that are unlikely to be updated. Until HiDPI issues are
resolved I can't use Linux on the desktop on a daily basis.

~~~
deno
> and lots of older X classics that are unlikely to be updated.

[https://github.com/kaueraal/run_scaled](https://github.com/kaueraal/run_scaled)

------
pjmlp
As usual not on the German store.

