

Baby genius? - poppysan

Building off of VaedaStrike's thread, I decided to get your opinions.<p>I want to raise my child (2 yr old) for greatness, as every parent, but the hacker in me wants to augment his upbringing to aid the process.  Assuming these goals:<p>1.  Graduating High School by age 8-12.
2.  Enjoying Childhood despite the rigorous training
3.  Minimizing resentment for such hard labor.<p>Why graduate at an age between 8-12?  I want to give him time to explore many disciplines at an advanced level before puberty.<p>Disagreements with he goals aside - what would you do different to meet these goals?<p>Some steps I have taken so far -
1. Has him enrolled in a top-rated preschool
2. let him experiment with computers
3. piano instruction
4. read to him nightly<p>Its not much so far, but I'd love to get your input on what more I should do to reach the goals.
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jerf
There is no guarantee that is even physically possible. The jury is still very
much out, but we know the brain is still growing and developing in puberty and
even beyond. We aren't so clear on the implications of that fact. There is
some reason to believe certain modes of human thought simply aren't available
to you until a certain age and level of _physical_ development, and that these
modes of thought are required for higher level math understanding and in
general what we'd consider a sophisticated adult understanding of issues
across many fields. The age these things occur seem to vary and have unknown
dependence on the personal experiences of the child, but expecting these
processes to be done by 12 is probably hoping for too much.

The only way I could see "graduating high school" by 12 to be done is either
if you come up lucky and get a child with the necessary brain development
early, or you define "graduate high school" at a relatively low level.
(There's a world of difference between merely graduating, and graduating with
honors and heading to college... _everybody_ "graduates".)

~~~
poppysan
I believe the opposite. i believe that with the proper direction, any child of
"normal development" can excel. But I did not intend for the thread to turn
into a nature vs nurture debate. I was more looking for suggestions for hacks
or techniques for teaching or encouraging self learning (etc...).

~~~
jerf
What you said isn't the opposite of what I said. It's actually entirely
orthogonal.

You might want to spend some time with child development literature. It isn't
all that difficult to understand. I mean that as a positive suggestion, not a
criticism, and that it's much easier for a layman to get into than, say,
particle physics. Just be sure you keep an eye out for what is the result of
solid studies, and what is just some professor's pet idea somewhere, but the
former _is_ available, and it paints a complicated, but interesting, picture.

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hackinthebochs
Since no one saw fit to attempt to actually answer your question (don't you
just hate when people feel the need to give you their opinion rather than
answer your question), I came up with something: Talk to him _all the time_.
There was an article a while ago here (or maybe reddit) that studied the
amount of words a child hears before certain age between lower, middle and
upper class groups. The difference was massive. Upper class children heard a
huge amount more words by a certain age (I don't remember the exact range, I'm
guessing in the hundreds of thousands). This difference showed up in much
improved language skills for the upper class child.

Anecdotally, I've noticed this first hand. On my commute to work I've noticed
how different classes interact with their children (as approximated by race).
Black and Hispanic parents tend to give some distraction to the child so they
don't bother the parent, or are themselves distracted by a cellphone thus
ignoring the child. While white and Indian parents (likely middle to upper
class by context) tend to constantly interact with the child, asking
questions, speaking in complete sentences, etc. Just always having a
conversation with them. The differences were stark.

Another idea I picked up recently was to constantly attempt to give your child
age-appropriate decisions to make. This will train them to be able to weigh
options and decide on the best course of action for themselves. The example I
heard was when you're at the store, give the kid the option to buy two snacks
--absolutely anything they want. But just two. This may help them develop
decision making skills.

One more idea is to attempt to train their ability to delay gratification. You
may have heard of the "marshmallow experiment"
(<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stanford_marshmallow_experiment>) where a
child's ability to delay gratification as a young child was correlated with
their "success" as adults. Try to run the marshmallow experiment in your home
as a standard course. Let him have a bigger payoff if he can show self control
for some period of time: food, learning, whatever it may be.

Good luck with your future genius!

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simmer65
Your child will grow up with his own personality and interests. Let him follow
his dreams...not yours.

~~~
poppysan
He can follow his own interests and dreams as he wishes. But as a parent, my
job is to guide his development. And I choose to try to give my child an
advantage in his education. That is it...

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HardyLeung
You can always follow stories of famous prodigy.

Bad case - Ted Kaczynski (Unabomber) Good case - Terrence Tao (Fields
Medalist)

I especially suggest you check out Terrence Tao's because he writes a lot and
a lot of people write about him. I would consider him a success story as he is
super intelligent, smart, and clearly grew up fine. However, I remember he
warned prospective parents to "not do it".

Link: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terence_Tao> Quote: "At the age of two,
during a family gathering, Tao attempted to teach a 5-year-old child
mathematics and English."

~~~
poppysan
My wife brings up the Unibomber as well... That is one of the difficulties -
social development. I wonder if anyone has actively made attempts to focus the
child academically, without taking away from social development.

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Loginid
I think that you are using the wrong metrics.

Defining the results achieved by a certain age is a different thing than
defining the qualities that you seek to nurture.

By setting results based goals, you are putting your child in a subordinate
pass/fail position.

Who are you to define success for your child? It is their life.

By defining some qualities that you would like to nurture in your child, and
implementing strategies to help them develop, you would be acting as a
supportive participant in their development.

Milestone thinking can be very dangerous in this context.

~~~
poppysan
"By defining some qualities that you would like to nurture in your child, and
implementing strategies to help them develop, you would be acting as a
supportive participant in their development."

I think that is exactly what I seek to do. The goals are examples, and very
loose. As I said before, I would not be disappointed with my child for not
reaching them.

~~~
Loginid
Sorry, in trying to be succinct, I came off as harsh.

I'm not questioning your motivations.

I just think that it is healthier to make statements like 'I want to help my
child to realize their creativity' or 'I want to help my child realize their
programming potential' than to say that 'I want to help my child to do X by Y
years'.

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poppysan
Maybe I wasn't too clear... I don't want to force my child into any profession
or path. It is my duty as a parent to see him succeed at anything he chooses,
and a good education can't hurt.

Again - Disagreements with the goals aside, Has anyone done anything with
their children that has directly benefited their learning? Are their any
little known hacks/ techniques that you or your parents have used to encourage
excellence?

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paradox95
It takes a certain amount of natural aptitude to excel at that level. Don't be
disappointed or try to push too hard if he doesn't reach that level.

~~~
poppysan
I wouldn't be disappointed at all if he graduates at a normal age. I would
just like to try everything I can do to aid in his progress. Hopefully I can
establish some habits or give him some sort of boost to get the most out of
his childhood.

~~~
michael_dorfman
_get the most out of his childhood._

Wow, I'm flabbergasted. I've got four children, and I am not at all trying to
get them to "get the most out of childhood"; rather, I am trying to give them
gentle encouragement in the areas they show interest in, and expose them to
the wonders around them. Some people feel that children are like cups to be
filled up; others feel that children are like candles to be lit. I'm doing
everything in my power _not_ to push my kids.

~~~
hackinthebochs
>I'm doing everything in my power not to push my kids.

I don't understand this. Children are simply adults-in-training. That's what
they always have been for every species on this planet. It is our job as
parents to train them to be the best adults they can possibly be--for their
own future benefit. In this world, that means make sure they excel
academically as well as socially.

Not pushing your kids is the exact opposite of this. Most kids don't have the
motivation to study hard. It's your job to try to instill a love of learning,
while at the same time pushing them to try their best in its absence.

This modern idea of childhood as something to be cherished and protected for
its own sake misses the mark. Childhood is a very delicate time for a
developing child, so great care must be taken. But we need to realize that
childhood is only 1/5 of a persons life. We need to make sure we give them the
tools in that first 1/5 so the rest of their lives can be as fulfilling as
possible.

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Mz
I was a full-time parent and homeschooling mom for quite some time. I had no
such goals for my kids. I had very different ones. But I like the results I
got.

Some things you could try:

Instead of seeking to have him graduate by age 12, homeschool and pursue an
unschooling path which gives him the freedom to explore as he pleases.

Give real choices (decision making practice) every day starting now. Lots of
parents don't seem to do this. Some things I did: I let my sons pick two junk
food things at the grocery at that age. They could pick any two. I didn't do
any censoring. But they could only get two. I recently had a lengthy
discussion with my oldest about how this fostered decision-making ability.

Generally speaking: If the rules aren't working, change the rules rather than
punish the child.

I'm sure there's lots more, but, hey, if I really wanted to talk about this I
could be developing my languishing homeschooling and parenting site.

Peace and best of luck.

