

"Great Web Site, Pixar"  -- Seriously? - akent
http://daringfireball.net/linked/2010/05/10/great-web-site

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weego
I don't even really know where to start with the lazy stupidity of the linked
through posts.

Yes, your 0.002% market penetration new toy doesn't support Flash, and yes you
trawled the net for a site that had no alt content for it's Flash content
aimed at a demographic that will be 99% Flash enabled.

Marketing is not a business that deals in 100%s, neither is web development.
If you chose specifically to be in the 1% then there is no big message here,
no champagne room, no deep-rooted moral to martyr.

Disney had a demographic in mind and a marketing experience they wanted those
people to have and spent their money accordingly. Something any number of
companies do every day.

~~~
kiujhygfghjk
I think the point is that Pixar is owned and manged by Jobs. It's a little
like finding that MS-Bing doesn't work with IE8

~~~
froo
*owned by Disney and managed by Jim Morris (he produced WALL-E)

Although, you could argue that Catmull and Lasseter are more responsible for
this than Jobs is...

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immad
From 86 to 2006 it was run by Steve Jobs: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pixar>

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eli
I agree that they should also include content for non-flash browsers (in
addition to iPads, it's a heckuva lot friendlier to screen readers for the
blind).

But at some point it is fair to draw a line. A very small percentage of my
visitors are using IE5. My sites don't work at all in IE5. I don't intend to
address this problem.

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pragmatic
Tested it on my android based phone. Works.

I'm wondering what a media rich site _should_ do in this case. Can you really
afford to build 2 (or _n_ ) sites for every available device, when cheap
hardware (netbooks, phones) will play flash?

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crystalis
Maybe this is Apple's way of being the next Internet Explorer?

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CoryMathews
Goes to show that the Internet is still not ready to completely leave flash.

All the more reason why Apple needs to get over themselves and support flash.

Push HTML5 because yes it is better but support flash until it is no longer
used.

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Pheter
Regardless of the whole Apple/Flash issue:

Refusing to support older technologies helps encourage people to start using
the newer technologies. If everyone dropped support for flash (obviously this
wouldn't actually happen) then developers would be forced to use alternatives.
If flash continues to be supported then developers have less of an incentive
to replace their current solutions.

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weego
developers can only do what _most_ people can experience well. HTML5 uses
today are on sites where _most_ people use a primary alternative, and most of
these people have a vested interest (Youtube for market share on mobile
devices, hearts and minds and also future for licencing technologies etc).

It would be an irresponsible developer that let loose with full HTML5 site
aimed at "normal" people any time soon if they didnt provide a full standard
HTML version as well, which begs a huge budget question. Unless they have no
marketing department or CTO to answer to of course.

~~~
Pheter
Exactly, and if support for flash dwindles, then developers will move to other
platforms that "most people can experience well".

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matrix
I don't know about everyone else, but I'm thinking Flash bashing has pretty
much reached dead horse status. Possibly even "red smear on the ground"
status.

Worrying about what the pundits say isn't going to help us execute, unless the
pundit is someone with hard-won expertise and experience in what you're
doing/building. Just pick the right tool for your product and market and run
with it.

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jasonlbaptiste
There are logical times to roast people for using flash over html5, this is
not one of them. For really advanced animation like movie sites, Flash is
sadly still king. HTML5 can get there.

I also don't know how involved steve jobs is on a day to day basis at pixar
anymore. I'm pretty sure he isn't reviewing the website though.

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sosuke
Sure, I am a Flash developer and I also love my HTML/CSS/JavaScript too but
the comments on that page he linked out too just make me sad. When I saw this
on the new page I kind of hoped it wouldn't find it's way up, that kind of
misdirected hate just doesn't sit well with me.

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RyanMcGreal
From the flickr comments:

[http://www.flickr.com/photos/gruber/4594658152/#comment72157...](http://www.flickr.com/photos/gruber/4594658152/#comment72157623905977665)

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caryme
I think that the real irony is seeing this after Apple used Toy Story 3 as the
demo for iAd.

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joubert
I'm thinking more along the lines of: Toy Story _THREE_?

~~~
locopati
If you could guarantee money from extending an existing franchise, wouldn't
you? It's not like Pixar is releasing sequels every year or two for all their
movies.

~~~
joubert
I was just commenting as a film lover.

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locopati
As a fellow film lover, TS2 was enjoyable and I expect TS3 will be as well (in
the sense that even the worst Pixar film is better than many other attempts at
animated storytelling, at the very least in visual/audio quality).

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tszming
The site should detect iphone/ipad/ibad and display something like:
[http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2009/images/11/03/iphone.flash....](http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2009/images/11/03/iphone.flash.jpg)

It does not make sense to provide a link to download flash on these devices.

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lazugod
That is not Pixar's website.

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ergo98
On a serious note -- was John Gruber ever known for anything besides being a
ridiculously biased Apple apologist?

I do remember reading his site and enjoying it in the past. Now...holy shit I
can't stand it. It's like reading an eager hopeful of the politburo trying to
impress the communist ranks. All credibility has long gone out the window.

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hoffmabc
John Gruber is a retard. He eats every chocolate dropping Apple squeezes out.

