
Neanderthals Feasted on Seafood, Seabirds, Perhaps Even Dolphins - Thevet
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/26/science/neanderthals-fishing-ocean.html
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ajdegol
Can’t help but feel we wouldn’t have to go too far back in time to discover
people ate whatever they could.

Are you likely to find evidence of fruit having been eaten?

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TSiege
I think it's safe to say yes, given that human's evolutionary ancestors lost
the ability to produce vitamin C ~60 million years ago and there's no reason
to assume they didn't require a similar diet to our own. To your larger point,
that has always been the case from what I've seen from archeological and
anthropological studies. Take Pokeweed for example which is toxic unless it's
boiled three times in salt water.

However, the larger point of the article is that Neanderthals were a much more
intelligent and adaptable species than we've given them credit. Given this
evidence of food it would not be surprising if they found net sinkers or other
tools associated with fishing. It seems every time we learn more about
Neanderthals the more they resemble our species than not.

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zelly
Not only were they smarter than we give them credit for, they were smarter
than modern humans. There's nothing about intelligence that guarantees not
becoming extinct.

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zelly
They had bigger brains. In all the studies of humanoid fossils, there's a
clear relationship between brain size and ability to make tools etc. (which is
presumably caused by intelligence). It would be very strange that this is the
sole exception to that relationship. This relation is defined between
different species--irrelevant to the more controversial claim that brain size
matters between humans (of the same species) which is probably why you're
rejecting the idea.

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woodandsteel
Structure matters a lot. Look how intelligent crows are, in spite of having
such small brains. Humans do all sorts of things Neanderthals never did, so
maybe we have differently structured brains that allow us to do them.

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zelly
Humans never did anything either for approximately 100% of history. Newton
could have lived a caveman's life if his top priority was basic survival,
regardless of the quality of his hardware.

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woodandsteel
True, but if you are going to argue Neanderthals are smarter than homo
sapiens, you have to ask why they didn't do anything that humans couldn't when
both were foraging societies.

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ppadron
"And Saint Attila raised the hand grenade up on high, saying, 'O Lord, bless
this Thy hand grenade that, with it, Thou mayest blow Thine enemies to tiny
bits in Thy mercy.' And the Lord did grin, and the people did feast upon the
lambs and sloths and carp and anchovies and orangutans and breakfast cereals
and fruit bats and..."

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dmos62
I like it, but I don't get it.

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antepodius
It's a quote from 'Monty Python and the Holy Grail'.

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KineticLensman
Yes, a reading from the Book of Armaments, Chapter 4, Verses 16 to 20

...

Skip a bit, Brother

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dmos62
Is it widespread to only call mammals meat? I.e. is "fish meat" widely
understood to be a contradiction?

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dalore
We sometimes call fish "steaks". I often eat tuna steaks. So to me fish is
meat.

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Libeste
Steaks are cut across the grain of the muscle as opposed to fillets which are
cut along the grain. Tuna just happens to be large enough that you can do
that.

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ncmncm
I read a claim the the most reliable distinguishing quality between
neanderthalensis and sapiens was that the former was never found in possession
of something traded from far away. Would welcome correction or enlargement.

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bad_user
Another distinguishing trait is that Homo Sapiens are dreamers (e.g cave
paintings).

Not sure how relevant or true the claim is, but it's surely romantic.

Or we might simply be more aggressive and that's it. A species determined on
dominating its environment will win against one that's not, all other things
being equal.

Otherwise Neanderthals were larger than us and had similar cognitive
capabilities, they were also using tools and language etc.

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ncmncm
Neanderthals made cave paintings. Probably non-cave paintings too, but those
didn't last.

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onetimemanytime
Why is it shocking, you don't have the luxury to pick and choose...eat all you
can, including your own kind, if needed.

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Havoc
Somehow I can't picture that being a very feast like affair.

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magwa101
Dolphins?? I draw the line there those damn Neanderthals!

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droithomme
The poor little dolphins!

Ha ha just kidding, I've had dolphin it's very very good, but I feel it's
immoral and a little like cannibalism since they are probably smarter than us.

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contingencies
Pigs are supposed to be as smart as chimps, making them in essentially the
smartest animals out there except for dolphins and humans. However, we as
humans design, build and run industrial systems that breed, feed and torture
hundreds of thousands of them constantly, so we can eat them.

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slothtrop
They're intelligent, but I've never heard that suggestion. It's not as though
they use tools.

Years ago I thought the reason we didn't kill certain animals is they're cuter
than others. Maybe, but there's a perceived scale of demonstrated
consciousness. If an animal appears more intelligent and compassionate (e.g.
chimps), we're more put off on slaying them.

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fanatic2pope
Tool use in animals is fairly common. Generally we haven't seen it in the past
because we simply weren't looking.

[https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S16165...](https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1616504719300333)

