
GM lays off engineer who helped expose VW’s diesel fraud - sundvor
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/06/business/hermanth-kappanna-vw-emissions-gm.html
======
ptaipale
When I saw the NYT headline, it seemed to suggest that the GM engineer was
singled out precisely due to helping out in exposing the scandal. But when I
read the article, it turns out he's just one out of 4,000 other engineers.

We could probably make many other scandalous headlines from the same group of
people:

"GM lays off engineer who contributed to trade union organising his
colleagues"

"GM lays off engineer who only two years earlier contributed to patent XXX
which saved $$$ for the company"

"GM lays off engineer who was recovering from cancer and is now at risk of
relapse"

"GM lays off engineer whose seven dependents are now facing an uncertain
future"

This is not to belittle what Hemanth Kappanna did, but there are four thousand
stories out of which one is now lifted up, even though what he did previously
is, as far as we know, not at all connected to this position being terminated.
Contribution of Kappanna and his colleagues was to first to WVU and then the
world as a whole, not GM. So perhaps a job at GM shouldn't be his "reward";
something else should be.

But I hope that the NYT headline might help him with that.

~~~
SolarNet
Except that in this case his life is being uprooted due to the power the
company wields over his life.

Citizenship (or at least a green card) should be his reward.

~~~
ptaipale
My point was that the same is probably the case with many among these 4,000.

~~~
vsskanth
I believe the point here is some of these 4000 now have to entirely uproot
their life by having to leave the country.

The part that makes it tragic is that these people have no chance of getting a
green card in their lifetime and have to be at the mercy of corporations to
maintain their temporary visa status simply due to their nationality, no
matter how long they have been staying or working.

Getting laid off is an unfortunate reality that happens to people now and
then. It becomes especially nerve-wracking when it is tied to your ability to
reside in a place without having enough time to find alternate employment.

~~~
magduf
It sucks, but these people are not citizens in the country they work in, so I
don't see how they have any kind of right to stay here. They're only here
because the government here allowed it, for a while, with a temporary worker
visa.

Now, it seems pretty obvious to me that these people are probably much more
productive and better contributors to this country and its economy than most
of our own natural-born citizens, but the fact that we're losing them means
we're basically shooting ourselves in the foot. The US isn't the only country
where skilled engineers can find good work; these people should be able to
find good jobs in another country where they can get a better deal w.r.t.
immigration. Germany seems like it's much more welcoming to highly-skilled
immigrants, for instance.

I think this should be a cautionary tale to skilled immigrants.

~~~
ptaipale
I look at this from a different angle, and to me the U.S. seems very welcoming
to highly-skilled immigrants. They are very well-paid from European point of
view, not to mention others, and the society in general is used to absorbing
immigrant workers.

Germany and other EU countries have expressed their welcoming attitude to
immigrants in general ("Wir schaffen das"), often exaggerating the skills of
people who actually had no relevant training or competence at all (plenty of
quotes available for this). But the current discussion in EU about the recent
immigration wave has turned into a blame game of "why does Eastern Europe not
carry its share of the burden".

~~~
magduf
>I look at this from a different angle, and to me the U.S. seems very
welcoming to highly-skilled immigrants.

That was before Trump was elected.

------
vsskanth
It is important to note that this engineer is from India and has been legally
in the US for 17 years and still on a temporary H1B visa (conveniently not
mentioned in NYT)

If this person was from any other country, he would have a green card by now.
But now, he has to leave everything behind and go back. This is all too
familiar for Indian nationals working in the US. It has become way more
precarious for Indian families now due to the current administration
arbitrarily denying visa extensions for people in tech.

Hopefully he finds a good job in India, Canada or Europe.

~~~
throwaway082729
I'm in the same boat. 17 years here. Masters plus 15 years of experience.
Getting paid >$500k per year yet I'm dependent on my employer to stay here
legally. I'm still a temporary worker. I cannot take a sabbatical or take up
side gigs (consultant). If Canada weren't so cold, I'd already be there.

~~~
Robin_Message
If you're getting paid >$500k, would it be possible to do a bit of Mr Money
Mustache and then get some kind of high net worth visa. At >$500k a year, that
can't take more than a few years.

And you'll be retired too.

~~~
option
not if you have to live in Bay Area and rise a kid or two here

~~~
driverdan
Of course you can. That's around $25,000 a month in income after taxes. $5000
in rent, $1000 for food, $1000 for utilities and public transit costs, $2000
for misc expenses. That leaves $19,000 a month!

~~~
TomMckenny
Not saying that 500k isn't more than adequate but $5000 is only a one bedroom
now.

~~~
sb52191
That is patently untrue. I live in Silicon Valley, a few miles from one of the
big tech giants. I live in a 4 bedroom house (with three roommates) and our
collective rent is $4200 a month. Rent is expensive, but $5,000 for a one
bedroom is absolutely not the norm.

~~~
gardnerbickford
OP was talking SF, not the wider SV. That is a good rent though. That's 2009
SF prices. We were paying $4100 for four bedroom apartment back in 2009. That
same apartment is going for double that now.

SF totally jumped the shark.

~~~
fredophile
I just took a look at Park Merced to see what apartments and townhomes are
going for there right now. You can get 3 bedroom homes there for under $5000 a
month. Is it a trendy neighbourhood? No, but it does meet the criteria of
being in SF. I'm sure you could find similar deals in other non-trendy areas
like the Outer Sunset if you take the time to look.

~~~
TomMckenny
Yeah, but Walnut Creek is the same travel time to downtown. And it gets more
than 10 days of sunshine a year.

But even if my figure is wrong then it's only because I accidentally posted it
from three or four years in the future. But I suppose it's good news that a
one bedroom is only $40k a year rather than $60k. At the moment anyway. And if
you made 100k, then it's only 2.5 times more than taxes and leaves you a full
40% of your salary to thrive on, so that's nice.

------
jamesholden
I am surprised that this guy hasn't been given job offers at other places. He
did good things, is ethical, and is clearly skilled. It's a shame that people
like this are not properly 'rewarded' for their good deeds. Exposing the evil
of others should always be.

~~~
kenneth
Hiring a known whistleblower is a risk not worth taking, even if you are not
doing anything wrong. The risk vs. reward ratio is just too high.

~~~
cyphar
I am sure that this is the logic executives like to go through, but
whistleblowers aren't people who compulsively reveal company secrets. They
reveal secrets which the public should know about, and usually have to be very
large and important in order to justify the personal risk involved.

If your company is so ethically bankrupt that you can't afford the risk of
someone who would only reveal things that are of critical importance to the
public, then maybe you aren't the "good guys" anymore.

~~~
Krasnol
Is this a variation on "you don't need to be afraid if you have nothing to
hide" thing?

~~~
cyphar
It's more like "you don't need to be afraid of whistle-blowers unless you're
killing people through your actions". VW didn't make a small mistake -- their
evasion of emission standards has directly resulted in thousands of
preventable deaths due to air pollution (they also decided to unethically
poison monkeys in order to "prove" that the gasses weren't toxic). Again,
whistle-blowers don't just reveal secrets willy-nilly -- there is significant
personal risk to being a whistle-blower and very few people make such
decisions lightly.

The thing is -- everyone has something to hide, which is why that adage is
wrong. But not everyone is hiding a scheme they've cooked up to flaunt laws
(and lied to regulators for years when they came knocking) which resulted in
tangible deaths as a result. If you are worried that you have a scheme like
that on your books, then yeah you should avoid hiring whistle-blowers.

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jedberg
This is the perfect example of the flaws in our immigration system. This man
came here for grad school, was educated in America at a public institution
(paid for in part by tax dollars), then worked here for years, contributing to
our economy as both a worker and consumer (and probably putting in far more
tax dollars than he ever consumed), and now after 17 years, we send him back
to India.

We should be giving this man citizenship, not a ticket home.

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chengiz
Playing the devil's advocate here a little bit. We dont know the whole story.
Perhaps he was not good at the job GM hired him for, perhaps he didnt get
along with people, perhaps it was just as GM says, a blind restructuring.
Things like this happen all the time. The only difference here is the VW
scandal, for which all we know is he did good experimental work as part of a
team that turned out to be groundbreaking. If the emissions had amounted to
nothing, he'd be like any other experimental researcher. Was he instrumental
in opening the results to the public in any way? As in he strived against the
odds and backlash etc, playing a whistleblower of sorts? The article doesnt
say so I assume not. So I cant say the article has convinced me that he
deserves special treatment because of his role in the VW scandal.

~~~
AnthonBerg
I agree that we don’t know the reasons he was let go.

But!:

 _Of course_ he deserves special treatment for his role in the VW scandal,
because _of course_ we desperately want and need to build a society that
always actively encourages and never discourages actions like those he took.

– But: _Of course_ the _car industry_ cannot be relied on to give him that
special treatment. And we haven’t yet built the kind of society that does.

So it is incumbent on us here and now to give him that special treatment.

Not least to give the signal that we will help you if you help us. Keep you
safe. To remove doubt of that. As it stands, that doubt has increased, and the
expectation that the auto industry will retaliate has increased, so on the
table there is less apparent safety to do what he did.

~~~
barry-cotter
That’s not how this world works. Whistleblowers have their lives ruined,
almost uniformly. Edward Snowden, Chelsea Manning, William Binney, Jesselyn
Radack, Frank Ford, Joe Darby.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_whistleblowers](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_whistleblowers)

~~~
AnthonBerg
May I ask you to compare your comment with this quote from my comment: _“And
we haven’t yet built the kind of society that does”_.

Would you agree that there are indications that you did read too fast? – The
necessity of world-building and world-shaping is the core of what I was
attempting to convey.

So we actually agree ;)

~~~
barry-cotter
You have hope for change in this regard. I don’t. I’m not just saying that we
don’t live in that society, but that we never will. People don’t like those
who hold to their principles over their fellows and people aren’t changing.

~~~
AnthonBerg
Sincere thanks for an excellent reply. It’s better than I deserve for how
snarky and pseudo-clever my reply was.

I don’t always have hope. I think I’ll go for “or die trying”. Build that
world or die trying.

Those people won’t change. 100% agree. The others can learn and adapt and curb
risks and manage and mitigate and unify. Communicate.

It’s possible to build small altruistic groups. I think I’m willing to expend
effort on increasing the size limits.

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thrownaway954
"no good deed goes unpunished" \- unfortunately this is how things are in the
world. i hope things turn out good for him.

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victor106
This is so sad temporarily for Hemanth but permanently for the US.

Hemanth is already a hero and he's done more than what most would only dream
of doing. He has a bright future expect that bright future won't be in the US.

In the long term its more of a loss for the US if you consider the fact that
he already "earned" the US $23 billion

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nicolas_t
US visa laws are barbaric. Giving only 60 days to find a new job when one has
been laid off without prior notice. How is that supposed to be fair? H1B visa
have the effect of creating indentured slaves by placing all of the power on
the employers and prevent employees from having any negotiation power since
they are always under the threat of losing their visa...

While the US is still seen in a way as a dreamland to live and work in by
people in poorer areas, it seems to me anecdotally that more and more people
in developed countries no longer have any interest in moving there due to the
many issues surrounding visas, work conditions, living conditions, fun things
like CBP and overzealous immigration officers, etc... This is not a good thing
for a country that has long been successful in attracting the best and the
brightest.

~~~
neya
The US laws are better than most countries. In Singapore (for example), you
have just 30 days to pack your stuff and get out of the country, for instance.
And that's hardly enough if you've lived there for years and usually you've
accumulated a lot of stuff. It's not even enough time to sell all your stuff.
Usually people just give them away for free when they leave the country. I
know people who got 49" TVs for a ridiculous $100 from people leaving the
country.

At least 60 days is not so bad. Can it be better? Yes, sure. But not bad at
all.

~~~
SauciestGNU
Singapore is hardly a good counterexample, considering the authoritarian
nature of the place. "Disneyland with the death penalty" is a very low
standard for freedom and human rights.

~~~
neya
> Disneyland with the death penalty

Haha, that's a unique description and also a good point.

~~~
justin66
[https://www.wired.com/1993/04/gibson-2/](https://www.wired.com/1993/04/gibson-2/)

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yitchelle
I wonder if his role in exposing VW got him the job at GM.

I am also wondering why he is so focused on returning to the US. With his
skills and knowledge, there should be some opportunities in other parts of the
world.

~~~
throwayEngineer
Have you lived outside the US?

Even in Europe it seems standard of living is less (for professionals)

~~~
yitchelle
Not sure why you assumed that I am living in the US. I am not, I am living in
Europe.

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GreaterFool
17 years in US and still no permanent residence of any sort?! That's why I'd
never consider moving to US! If I chose a country to live in and they let me
in I want to have a possibility of either becoming a citizen or at least have
permanent residency (actually permanent; often permanent just means long-
term).

Is Green Card that hard to get?

~~~
ip26
Discussed elsewhere in this thread, but it depends on where you are from b/c
there is a per-country quota. There are many applicants for a Green Card from
India so it's hard if you are Indian. But if you are from e.g. Singapore there
are far fewer applicants competing with you so it's easier.

------
pif
> He said he had a lead on a job with another automaker [...] But the industry
> is suffering a slowdown,

I wonder how much of the slowdown is caused by more and more aggressive
emission regulations. Cars used to be definitely more responsive, and they get
more sluggish and more expensive to maintain with every new Euro standard
published.

Edit: I'm addig this to reply to some commenters. I'm not stating that car
comfort is more important than public health. It's just a fact that emission
regulations have pushed much fun away from the driving experience. And I
honestly wonder how this impacted the car making industry.

~~~
adrianN
If you want a responsive car, get an EV. If you want an even more responsive
vehicle, get a bicycle.

~~~
georgerobinson
I would quite like to own an EV, but are still too expensive for me! I also
read that the batteries do not like repeated full-throttle accelerations as it
causes excessive heat build-up and accelerated degradation on the cells. To
reduce this the car will often enter limp-mode before then, so it might not
even be appropriate for sports/track use.

~~~
cptskippy
> I would quite like to own an EV, but are still too expensive for me!

Without providing a specific use case or criteria then it's impossible to say.

> I also read that the batteries do not like repeated full-throttle
> accelerations as it causes excessive heat build-up and accelerated
> degradation on the cells

That's true and so is the statement "internal combustion engines used in
automobiles produce heat during operation that will cause them to fail after a
short period of time". But we know that ICEs don't fail because they have
cooling systems, so to do EV's batteries and motors.

> To reduce this the car will often enter limp-mode before then

If someone said "my ICE vehicle won't allow me to red-line it and reduces my
max RPMs when it's close to overheating to avoid damaging the engine" would
you see that as a bad thing? Would you assume red-lining and engine
overheating issues were common when driving an ICE vehicle?

If not, then why do you assume such behavior is bad in an EV?

While it is true that rapidly discharging batteries produces heat, it is also
true that most EVs have thermal management in place and most have active
temperature control systems for their battery packs. The Nissan Leaf is one of
the few EVs that does not have active temperature control systems, their packs
are air cooled. Also note that I said "temperature control" and not cooling,
Tesla's and other EVs can actively warm their batteries to increase
performance.

You should read up on the Tesla Model 3's track mode to get a better
understanding of what EVs are capable of: [https://www.tesla.com/blog/how-
track-mode-works](https://www.tesla.com/blog/how-track-mode-works)

~~~
gavia1
> Without providing a specific use case or criteria then it's impossible to
> say.

The use case for me is for a fun weekend car with occasional track use. It
must be fun to drive both at sensible, safe road speeds but also come alive
when pushed on track. It shouldn't cost too much (I paid £10,000 for the car I
just purchased that has both these characteristics), be affordable to
insurance, run and fix when required. It should also be possible to upgrade
and have a well supported aftermarket.

~~~
cptskippy
> Their motor torque for rotation has been done before, most recently in the
> Focus RS.

However unlike a traditional ICE, an EV has 100% torque with almost zero
latency.

> Brakes are, in 99% of cases, inferior to mechanical limited slip
> differentials for the sole reason that it's much easier to overheat the
> brakes on track

And the overheating problem is negated by virtue of the fact that it's an EV
and can take advantage of regenerative braking. While brake regen varies in
EV, Tesla's is among the highest. Taking your foot off the accelerator in
Tesla feels like you're stepping on the brake in most other cars. In track
mode a Model 3's regenerative braking force is further increased.

Another interesting aspect of regenerative braking is that it's
instantaneously applied unlike traditional brakes which suffer from pedal and
hydraulic lag.

~~~
georgerobinson
> However unlike a traditional ICE, an EV has 100% torque with almost zero
> latency.

Insignificant I'm afraid. A good track driver never has the engine outside the
power band, even on the slowest corners. In race mode almost all automatic
gearboxes do this for you. However, some auto gearboxes shift down on full
throttle, even in manual mode, which is frustrating if not infuriating, so
direct-drive is a welcome change.

> And the overheating problem is negated by virtue of the fact that it's an EV
> and can take advantage of regenerative braking.

If you're using regenerative braking on track then you're most probably losing
time, unless it can capture the kinetic-to-heat transfer from the pads and
discs. You should be maximum throttle right up until the braking zone, by
which point you're mostly using full pedal travel to get the car down to the
ideal entry speed and maybe even trail braking into the corner to improve
rotation.

However, now that I think about it, regenerative braking makes a lot more
sense on tracks such as the Nordschleife where for some corners you don't have
braking zones as such, but minor taps of the pedal to set up the weight
distribution of the car for the corner to improve turn in. This could be a
valid use case of regenerative braking.

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temac
It is always crazy to read those layoff stories with people let go overnight
for no reason and escorted out of building by security.

Must be hard to work knowing that can happen.

------
raincom
He should have applied for perm residency under EB-1. This EB-1 has many
loopholes, which many postdocs and Ph.Ds exploit. Bunch of citations, h-index,
review articles, letters from peers would do.

------
unixhero
He should join Tesla :)

~~~
eznoonze
No emission issue for Tesla I guess. But they may have battery issues.

~~~
unixhero
An engineer with strong critical thinking skills is what I imagine he can
bring to the table.

------
sgjohnson
re: H1-B et al immigration issues.

What the United States need to do is to completely abolish all welfare
programs and go back to Ellis island style immigration system.

Kills 2 birds with one stone.

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agumonkey
It astonishes me how society is so against exposing hurtful realities. At
least this way.

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RickJWagner
Such is life in corporate America. It rains on the just and the unjust.

