
Peter Thiel Speaks at the National Press Club – Live Stream - cjdrake
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ob-LJqPQEJ4
======
cconroy
It would be interesting to get a list of thoughtful people supporting Trump.
So far I have:

\- Peter Thiel

\- Scott Adams

\- Nassim Taleb??

Who else?

Most thoughtful people I follow pick against Trump and more or less believe he
is a threat to the Republic. I tend to agree with them mainly because of his
attitude toward the press (even though I agree they are biased against him)
and his proclivity to violent rhetoric.

Edited: formatting

Edit: I also want to clarify the biasedness of media was based on Wikileaks
coverage and the [0]social media blackout after the Comey's letter to
congress. I acknowledge their coverage of him probably helped him.

Edit: It is possible Taleb does not support DT, there is no direct evidence of
this. I added '??' to him. See this comment
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12838352](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12838352)

[0] [http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-10-29/social-media-
blacko...](http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-10-29/social-media-blackout-fbi-
emails-are-not-trending-twitter-facebook-buzzfeed-or-snapc)

~~~
Analemma_
Scott Adams thinks he is a wizard whose voice has hypnotic mind-control
powers, and that the Clinton Foundation personally bankrolls an army of trolls
to harass him on Twitter. In other words, he's delusional. He is not in any
sense of the term a "thoughtful person"

~~~
adnzzzzZ
>Scott Adams thinks he is a wizard whose voice has hypnotic mind-control
powers

He thinks Trump is a good persuader. And he is. Trump's use of confirmation
bias is very skillful and effective.

~~~
Analemma_
That's probably true! But the "he" in my sentence refers to Scott Adams, not
Trump. Scott thinks _of himself_ as a brilliant persuader, a theory that is
ill-supported by the evidence.

~~~
MichaelGG
FWIW I've used Scott's arguments to get at least 2 more votes for Trump.
Including one from a 20-something girl that was a diehard Bernie supporter. I
know, anecdotal.

What I find effective is asking people to really state exactly, specifically,
what actions Trump himself is going to do that'll lead to the downfall of
civilization or whatever they think's going to happen.

Clinton's dirty play with Bernie also helps quite a bit. And honestly, the US
accepting that kind of thing, openly (as in, act like this, have it exposed,
still become president) would be much more damaging to society.

------
cylinder
Really appreciated how he espoused how Boomers' optimism borne out of an
exceptionally easy and comfortable life has been dangerous for the country.
I've long felt the same about American optimism, but have been happy to see
that it's become much more mainstream to admit America needs a managed decline
of its empire this year thanks to Trump and Sanders. Boomers have pushed the
American culture of blind optimism into a reality distortion field which draws
the country into various bubbles: stock market bubble, housing bubble, war
bubble, etc.

Also enjoyed his statement that America needs to be a "normal country again."
I have been trying to convey this sentiment due to my understanding of other
countries. Most Americans probably don't understand how abnormal the US and
its government are in many ways. He says, a "normal country doesn't run a $500
billion trade deficit, intentionally run a broken government, five
simultaneous wars."

~~~
tzs
> Most Americans probably don't understand how abnormal the US and its
> government are in many ways. He says, a "normal country doesn't run a $500
> billion trade deficit, intentionally run a broken government, five
> simultaneous wars."

When you look at that trade deficit on a per capita basis, or as a percentage
of GDP, it then does look pretty normal compared to other first world
countries.

------
jonathanstrange
I cannot take anyone seriously who calls himself a libertarian. For Christ's
sake, learn something about the various traditions of right- and left-wing
libertarianism, study the basics of anarchism (e.g. Stirner), and read some
Adam Smith.

Libertarianism is either mislabeled right-wing liberalism, which has a long-
standing tradition, or it turns out to be no more than a fairly inconsistent
mix of classical liberal and anarchist ideas peppered with some generic right-
wing gun-nuttery and diffuse anti-government sentiment. You know, in the end
somebody has to pay for the military, police, firemen, ambulances, roads,
drinking water, sanitation, food safety, consumer safety (like not getting
electrocuted by your vacuum cleaner), schools, hospitals, ...

~~~
Analemma_
In general, I can take libertarians seriously... but not Peter Thiel. The
depth of his convictions can be measured in microns. He's the perfect example
of the "libertarian" who espouses that philosophy not out of any genuine
commitment to its ideals, but just because he wants lower taxes and more
leeway for whatever despicable business practices he has in mind.

For instance, he founded a company whose, no joke, entire raison d'être is
providing surveillance-as-a-service to increase the power of the State. This
is something I wouldn't even do, and I'm what might be derisively called a
"big-government liberal".

~~~
jnbiche
> In general, I can take libertarians seriously... but not Peter Thiel. ...and
> I'm what might be derisively called a "big-government liberal"

Thank you. I'm glad you've been able to distinguish between Thiel, perhaps one
of the most anti-liberty, authoritarian 'libertarians' in modern history.

I likewise take many liberals (and conservatives!) seriously, even if we do
not always agree. For example, one of my favorite congressmen is Alan Grayson
(a pro-liberty Democrat/liberal) and one of my favorite senators is Rand Paul
(a pro-liberty Republican/fiscal conservative). I don't always agree with
them, but I appreciate their willingness to stick up for their beliefs.

Sadly, people like us are relatively few and far between.

~~~
jonathanstrange
The point is that libertarianism is just one more whacky US misnomer for
_right-wing liberalism_ , which has existed since Bentham.

------
cm2012
He said earlier that people are tried of being lied to by politicians.
Meanwhile, only 30% of statements DJT makes are in any way true:
[http://www.politifact.com/personalities/donald-
trump/](http://www.politifact.com/personalities/donald-trump/)

------
louprado
PT clarifies that the "Wall" DJT wants to build shouldn't be taken literally.
It was just a metaphor (metaphor is my word not PT's) for a tougher
immigration policy. Wow!

Are there really people still capable of holding an idealized model of DJT in
their head while dismissing or spinning anything that doesn't fit that model ?

DJT was my childhood hero so I understand the desire to stay hopeful and avoid
thinking. _Never meet your heroes_ feels applicable here.

Edit: typos

~~~
tim333
I was kind of a fan of "Trump" after reading The Art of the Deal. It was only
recently I found the actual Trump didn't write any of the book and the guy
described was basically fictional.

~~~
louprado
I don't even think he read it.

There's a section in the book where _he_ says that he shouldn't be given too
much credit for the Wollman rink project, because the NYC government had
regulatory requirements that didn't apply to his construction team.

Only in a parallel universe would DJT give himself _less_ credit.

------
gragas
Well, there seems to be tremendous support behind what he is saying. The chat
is exploding.

My favorite takeaway so far:

[Thiel on Trump] "The media always takes him literally, but never seriously. I
think his supporters take him seriously, but never literally."

~~~
BryantD
A snapshot of comments from the chat:

"Hillary's only claim to fame is she is the only woman not to suck Bill's
cock. "

"god this interviewer. CUCKED"

"FBI Stumbled onto Huma's INS Policy to keep her from being Vince Fostered...
53 dead around hillary makes the mob look like Pikers."

"Liberals think Taxes are more important than Hillary Butchering People!!!!
Really?! Wake up peeps"

"Wikileaks will ultimately put the Clintons in prison and will hopefully allow
President Trump to prosecute the entire Obama administration past and
present!"

~~~
gragas
Let me reiterate Thiel's quote, which I think perfectly describes this
situation: "The media always takes him literally, but never seriously. I think
his supporters take him seriously, but never literally."

Most of Trump's HIGH ENERGY comes from him and his supporters saying over-
exaggerated things. Everyone who supports him understands that these things
are over the top, but they agree with the basic sentiment behind them.

Most people who dislike Trump, however, take everything he and his supporters
say literally. This is a mistake.

~~~
BryantD
Unfortunately, this leaves me with no way to distinguish between genuinely
alarming sentiments and exaggerations. I can't support blurring that line.

For example, you can say that Trump didn't _really_ mean you should vote
twice, and perhaps he didn't. On the other hand, that isn't stopping some of
his supporters from voting twice. So did he mean it? Or is he just
accidentally encouraging it because some people are taking him literally?
Either way is bad.

Trump's staff didn't kick the guy chanting "Jew-S-A" out of his rally. Conway
says she would have kicked him out, which is nice, but nobody on the ground
did it. Does that mean Trump thinks the chanter was just over-exaggerating his
racism? Would it be OK for Trump to chant the same thing, since we're not
supposed to take him literally?

I think it's preferable if people running for President make it clear when
they're being sincere.

~~~
gragas
You do realize that people are specifically voting against the ideology that
backs your opinion, right? People aren't voting for Trump because he's racist
or sexist; they are voting for Trump _because_ of the ideology behind moral-
elitist people like you.

~~~
vehementi
Wait, they're voting for Trump to spite moral elitists, not because Trump will
make america great again? That's their whole motivation - not trade deficit,
not immigration, not the economy, not jobs -- but to vote against moral-
elitist people like GP? Holy shit, that absolutely crushes the credibility of
Trump and all of his supporters. Wow.

------
euroclydon
That was a pretty effective comment Thiel just made: "I think the press never
takes Trump seriously, but they do take him literally, whereas his supporters
take him seriously, but not always literally."

~~~
louprado
But when DJT takes 3 days to evaluate whether the KKK should be denounced, his
non-supporters took that very seriously. Meanwhile while most of his
supporters took his eventual statement literally.

------
kafkaesq
Per HN's guidelines, there's no reason this post should be flagged. Anything
(of genuine public interest) to do with YC's accidental poster boy -- Peter
Thiel -- is definitely fair game as conversation material.

~~~
alecco
> 'Diversity has come to mean complete agreement with the establishment or you
> are out'

Way to prove him right. Now I'm going to see his whole speech.

------
pulisse
_If you 're a single-digit millionaire like Hulk Hogan, you have no effective
access to our legal system. It costs too much._

This is not an intellectually serious speech.

~~~
clydethefrog
Link to the actual quote.
[http://www.tubechop.com/watch/8509031](http://www.tubechop.com/watch/8509031)

------
throwaway274739
They really ought to be asking some tougher questions. At the end of the day,
Trump is a man whose platform consists of removing the rights of large cross
sections of the American public (Mexican-Americans, Muslims, women, etc.).

Supporting someone like that makes you a supporter of state sanctioned
violence against those people and I think every institution -- the media, law
enforcement, universities, businesses, etc. -- have a responsibility to
denounce this in the strongest possible terms.

This is not simply a disagreement on tax policy, it's about the fundamental
human rights of millions of Americans. To see a supporter of this sort of hate
receiving softball media treatment or condoned by respected organizations such
as YCombinator is disgusting.

~~~
ConfuciusSay02
Trump wants to deport illegal immigrants, something that is actually following
the law, and something that Obama has done by the hundreds of thousands
(millions?).

Trump wants to temporarily suspend immigration from Muslim countries that are
near ISIS controlled territory. Suspending immigration from dangerous hotspots
is something that has been done regularly by previous administrations.
Furthermore, non American citizens don't actually have any "rights" under
American law.

Trump wants abortion laws to be decided by individual states. Women in each
state will have their democratic voice about that issue at their state ballot
box.

You can quibble about how he says things perhaps, but to say that his platform
consists of removing rights of large cross sections of the American public is
just wrong and ignorant.

------
angry-hacker
Thiel is an interesting character but not the best speaker. I wonder how comes
is she so successful despite looking not very convincing, neither dominative
and confident person.

When the (boring) interviewer asked about the Gawker sex tape, he was
literally sweating and looking for water with his shaking hands.

A bit disappointing talk, nothing too interesting. Basically, he says media
takes Trump literally. Gawker's case has nothing to do with the first
amendment and he talks about the case from a very personal perspective --
destroyed lives, mobs attacking people -- doesn't really answer from the law
point of view.

Other answers were kind of dull, it's difficult to understand his ideas. But I
still feel like I would like to hear more. Maybe a better interviewer could
open him up.

~~~
cylinder
I think we are all tired of slick talkers and charismatics full of hot air.

------
uola
Sort of expected a better interview when I heard "The National Press Club".
This is mostly "What do you think about x? I think this and that" read from
notes.

~~~
purple-dragon
Unfortunately, the National Press Club is now merely a venue. It can be booked
for events like any hotel or conference center. Though the club itself still
has its own programming, part of the value for an outside party is that it can
borrow on the cachet of the name.

------
tim333
I just listened to Theil's argument for supporting Trump, roughly that there
are problems in America - soaring health and education costs, stagnant incomes
for many, excessive debt, financial bubbles, too many wars and denial of the
above by politicians, which is fair enough.

He then suggests Trump has the correct policy to deal with this by restricting
free trade, reducing wars, avoiding financial bubbles and government denial
and returning to the efficient government that built the highways and launched
Apollo.

The trouble I see with that is that Theil seems a bit over optimistic about
Trumps ability to achieve that stuff. If you look at Trump's record he tends
to leverage up and go bust which is not a good model for efficient governance
and bubble avoidance.

If you read Trump's Gettysburg speech it seems rather unlike Theil's picture
of him [https://www.donaldjtrump.com/press-
releases/donald-j.-trump-...](https://www.donaldjtrump.com/press-
releases/donald-j.-trump-delivers-groundbreaking-contract-for-the-american-
vote1)

~~~
ConfuciusSay02
If your measure of a candidate is how likely they are to be able to get things
done, I doubt a candidate like Hillary - who would be likely facing federal
investigations and impeachment proceedings on day one would be more likely to
get things done than Trump.

------
programminggeek
He seems like a reasonable guy and his points about how close minded the
diversity movement in SV is are interesting.

------
arcaster
Currently in class, anyone been capturing the stream? I'd definitely be
interested in an offline version.

~~~
snerbles
YouTube normally keeps a recording of the stream available after it's
finished.

------
xname2
The Clinton campaign's strategy on Wikileaks is repeating that the emails
could be fabricated. However, it is technically almost impossible. The tech
community has been mostly silent on this issue. For example, I did not see
@paulg twitter on DKIM verification.

------
misiti3780
He speaks in a very similar manner as Mark Zuckerberg, that is the first time
I noticed this.

------
rmcfeeley
Watching now. Pretty surreal

Will he end on a positive note or send countless liberal techies to the self-
medication cabinet this afternoon??

------
whiddershins
Why is this flagged?

------
postcarnival
Is this being censored from the homepage? I'm surprised I'm not seeing Peter
Thiel's speech on the homepage of HN.. seems fishy

~~~
sctb
No. This is the usual case of user flags and the flamewar software. See also
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12738677](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12738677).

~~~
grzm
Thanks for clarifying and providing the link!

