

Two Countries, Two Vastly Different Phone Bills - fideloper
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/24/business/two-countries-two-vastly-different-phone-bills.html?emc=edit_th_20140824&nl=todaysheadlines&nlid=67837012&_r=0

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petercooper
Three is awesome. I actually tether through my phone at work because getting
~10Mbps to myself over 3G beats sharing a 10Mbps leased line amongst about 20
offices. I always have YouTube or Twitch on in the background, etc, and never
run into any problems. I pay something like £20 a month.

To balance though, historically Internet access options were not good.. I was
on dialup until about 2003, and then pretty horrific 1Mbps DSL until at least
2009 or so. The UK has done a great job at catching up somehow.

~~~
cstross
Other things about Three:

* The monthly contracts (and higher value pay-as-you-go top-ups) come with "Feel at Home" roaming -- in about 12 countries worldwide you can use your inclusive minutes, texts and data with no international roaming fees, i.e. you get that all-you-can-eat data _overseas_. Countries listed include the United States; on one recent 2-week trip to the USA I was able to use my iPhone for data as if I was at home with no added charges.

* British phone tariffs do not charge you for receiving text messages.

* The all-you-can-eat is capped (small print) at a "fair usage" of 25 Gb/month. Tethering is disabled while roaming overseas on "feel at home", but not prevented at home.

* If you buy a smartphone from Three, they'll unlock it at any time, for free, on request.

* In non "feel-at-home" countries they'll give you 24 hours' data (capped at 500Mb) for £5. Not as good, but better than typical international roaming fees (at £0.5/Mb in the EU and up to £3/Mb outside the EU).

Those of us who are used to this kind of cell service boggle in amazement
about how backward the US carriers are.

The final irony? Three is pretty backward and expensive compared to what
Estonians get from their cellcos ... the UK is by no means the best world-
wide, it's just a handy point of reference.

~~~
xSwag
> The all-you-can-eat is capped (small print) at a "fair usage" of 25
> Gb/month.

I can tell you that this is wrong, I've personally had months where I've used
100GB+ of data over 3G and had no problems (this is on a £15 top-up). I don't
know if they throttle or not, I've never really noticed it.

> Tethering is disabled while roaming overseas on "feel at home", but not
> prevented at home.

I didn't get my handset from Three but I've been able to tether in Paris and
used at least 2GB when I was there.

~~~
oliverdavenport
The limit only applies when roaming with Feel at Home (free roaming). Data is
capped at 25GB, and I think calls are capped at 300 mins and texts at 3000,
too.

When not roaming, there is no limit on data:

> "Does all you can eat data come with any limits? The limit is how much your
> device can consume – if you were to actively use data or the Internet on
> your phone every second, of every day, in every month (and we would be
> worried if you were !!!!) you would, subject to the current traffic
> management requirements (which vary from time to time), use up to 1000GB per
> month. So in essence there is a limit of how much data you can actually
> consume which is up to 1000GB. All this means that you can have absolute
> peace of mind and enjoy all the internet you need on your smartphone,
> without worrying."

([http://www.three.co.uk/Privacy_Cookies/Terms_Conditions?cont...](http://www.three.co.uk/Privacy_Cookies/Terms_Conditions?content_aid=1220469566802))

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Falkon1313
I've always gone with the no-contract plans. I pay $35/month for the same
phone and unlimited service that one of my family members is paying $100/month
for. Really I don't see the point of the contract plans.

~~~
aceofspades19
I got my nexus 4 for 'free' on a contract and even if I bought it outright and
got on the cheapest plan with roughly the same features, I would've only saved
$5 a month. 5 * 24( 2 year contract) is only 120 so by going on a contract I
saved at least $100 on the cost of my phone. If you are smart you can save
money by going on a contract.

~~~
__xtrimsky
I don't think you researched well enough, 5$ saving is nothing. tell us which
plans you were deciding between.

For example Straight Talk, is 45$ / month, everything unlimited. And you can
use either AT&T's coverage, either T-Mobile's or Verizon's (and their phone
too).

And that's for everything unlimited, you can find cheaper if you don't need
unlimited.

~~~
aceofspades19
Well I'm in Canada so straight talk is unavailable. As far as I know there is
no provider that offers unlimited plans for everything at a reasonable cost.
I'm with Fido and my plan is $45/month with 200 mb data, 200 weekday minutes
canada-wide, unlimited evenings and weekends, unlimited SMS and MMS. The
cheapest plan they offer that includes data is $39/month. The cheapest plan
period that isn't prepaid that I've seen from any canadian provider is
$35/month. So if I spent $10 less a month which is $288 for 2 years, it would
just barely cover the cost of the phone and I wouldn't have any data either.
So in the best case I wouldn't save any money by buying my own phone.

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chrismeller
I would think that one of the "several factors involved" may dwarf regulation:
area.

The UK operators have 94,000 square miles to cover while US operators have a
little over 3.1 million, just in the lower 48. Obviously no single carrier is
ever going to cover 100% of either country (and in the US in in particular
they don't come even close), but the simple size of the problem in the US
drives their infrastructure costs way up.

If AT&T only had to cover the state of Michigan (96,000 square miles) they
could probably do it for less than $60 a month...

I agree that we don't have nearly enough competition in the US, but let's not
pretend that a few more "harmless" laws will make everything rosy and perfect.

~~~
abritishguy
Well that doesn't explain why it is cheaper for me as a Brit to roam using my
UK contract in the US than it is to take out a US contract. When I'm visiting
America I am literally paying less than you folks for your stuff.

I can go to US and use unlimited data for no extra charge.

~~~
chrismeller
No, it doesn't. Not knowing much about the UK market, I don't really have
enough information to base an opinion on.

My first wild guess would again be regulatory: do they have to eat the extra
costs involved so they provide you with the same price every month?

~~~
abritishguy
>My first wild guess would again be regulatory: do they have to eat the extra
costs involved so they provide you with the same price every month?

Nope, only one network does it (the same network in the article) and it is one
of their many great features.

~~~
chrismeller
As cstross mentions in another comment talking about Three it seems to be part
of a big "Fell at Home" marketing campaign. With no other obligation to do so,
I would simply assume they saw it as a good opportunity to stand out in a
crowded market.

The all-you-can-eat nature seems to include voice as well as data abroad, but
I haven't seen any mention of international _calling_. Calling another UK
number I'm sure works as normal, but presumably you still pay the regular
rates if you call a US number? They certainly do if they call you. If you're
just visiting the states for a week or two that's not nearly as big a deal
(use the free local calls from the hotel phone to order pizza), but longer
trips (school or business) would still involve meeting a larger group of
people and become cost-prohibitive (for both parties).

Combined with the limited number of customers who would be traveling
internationally at all and likely the ability to get some sort of bulk-
purchase agreement with whichever carrier in the US they use and they're
probably just happy to eat the (relatively) limited expense to get the added
customers.

Like I mentioned in another comment, it also plays heavily into our hatred of
limits. If I want to skip off to NYC for the weekend, I don't want to have to
figure out what to do about my phone first! The "don't worry about it, we've
got you covered" approach is probably working out really, really well for
them, even for the large majority of people who never travel... because they
might, one day. In the meantime they keep paying every month.

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abritishguy
I've always found it funny that it is cheaper to use my UK monthly rolling
contract in America (free roaming yay) than it is to have an American contract
- completely bizarre.

~~~
gress
Which contract is that, and from which operator?

~~~
robin_reala
[http://www.three.co.uk/Discover/Phones/Feel_At_Home](http://www.three.co.uk/Discover/Phones/Feel_At_Home)

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abritishguy
I would like to point out that the following part of the article is not true
(she was probably getting confused with broadband):

"Britain has forced companies to lease their networks to competitors at cost"

~~~
jackgavigan
Actually, the original mobile network licences issued back in the '80s
required that the licence-holders sell airtime to any service provider who
asks for it, at the same price and conditions offered to the service providers
owned/controlled by the licence-holders. That paved the way for MVNOs.

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ksec
Britain has forced companies to lease their networks to competitors at cost?

So anyone could just enter the market?

~~~
cperciva
_So anyone could just enter the market?_

Better question, why would anyone ever build a network if they are prohibited
from making a profit?

~~~
sgift
That kind of legislation usually is only relevant for the "incumbent" (because
the rules usually state "if you have more than x% of the lines .."), i.e. the
ex-monopoly provider who didn't build anything. It was build by tax payer
money and then given to them.

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kleiba
Just curious, but is it possible to give the costs for comparable contracts in
other countries, too?

~~~
seszett
I'm paying 20€/month in France, for unlimited calls (to France and a large
part of the world) and texts as well as 3 GB data (20 GB over 4G, but my phone
can't use that).

A phone isn't included in the contract (the contract can be stopped anytime)
but my provider (Free) also sells phones on credit, say an iPhone 5s for 49€
one time payment and then 16€/month over 24 months.

That makes a close equivalent of the US contract, for 38€/month or about
50$/month.

Also, in reality I'm paying 4€/month for this contract for the first 12 months
because of a promotion back in June.

~~~
emixam
Also noteworthy: you won't be charged if you use more than 3GB/month of data,
only the download speed is reduced

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__xtrimsky
I pay 45$ / month for everything unlimited with Straight Talk (uses AT&T's
coverage).

And my wife pays 30$ for 100 minutes, unlimited text and 5GB data with
T-Mobile.

even 67$ I find that pretty expensive.

~~~
mlucero
I am switching to that 30$ plan as a result of this post. Just saved me half
the cost of my monthly bill. Thanks!

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anemitz
It's worth noting that the billing methods for US and the rest of Europe are
very different when it comes to voice. For instance, it costs between 4c/min
to 26c/min to call a UK mobile phone. In the US it's < 1c/min. Outside the US,
the caller of a mobile phone is generally the party footing the bill for the
entire call.

The more interesting question I have is why would it cost 26c/min to call a
mobile phone? And since each carrier prefix may have a different cost, how do
consumers keep all these prefixes / carrier rates straight in their heads?

Edit: I'm looking at flowroute, plivo, and twilio.

~~~
martinald
Not correct and I don't know where you get those prices from. OFCOM has
regulated termination charges
([http://stakeholders.ofcom.org.uk/consultations/mtr/statement](http://stakeholders.ofcom.org.uk/consultations/mtr/statement))
in the UK. Right now they are at 0.8p/min but it is likely they are going to
rule to drop them to below 0.5p/min.

Edit: these are wholesale prices, so there will be some overheads for whoever
provides it to end users, but the crazy termination fees in the UK are long
gone.

~~~
anemitz
Where does the overhead come when you look at rates from carriers like
[http://flowroute.com/rates/](http://flowroute.com/rates/) or
[https://www.plivo.com/pricing/GB/](https://www.plivo.com/pricing/GB/) or
[http://www.twilio.com/voice/pricing/gb](http://www.twilio.com/voice/pricing/gb)

It might be that wholesale rates are capped but it clearly isn't pushing
prices down for consumers who want to call into mobile numbers.

~~~
martinald
2.65c/min on Plivo? The other prefixes are more 'premium rate' numbers, not
mobile numbers. That's about 1.5p/min.

Considering Plivo charges 1.2c/min for US numbers as a benchmark, the
difference between US and UK numbers is 1.45c/min or... 0.88p/min, exactly the
wholesale cost pretty much. So I think it is working.

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RichardFord
I pay about $75 for 2 gigabytes from Verizon, so I don't know where these
numbers are coming from.

~~~
abritishguy
Do you get unlimited texts and calls? Because without that the UK price drops
to £15/month.

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lostmsu
FreedomPop

