

Ask HN: What do I say to a university class about “women-only” opportunities?  - whyrusleeping

My school is being asked to participate in a Women in IT, all expenses paid event hosted by Microsoft. It includes mock interviews and general preparation for interviewing at big tech companies, and as such is a great experience for any student. The event is geared towards women and women get priority registration, men can fill the extra spaces that aren’t taken by women if there are any. I feel like this is a great event to encourage more women to get involved in the largely male dominated field. But after this event was announced to one of our more introductory classes, it blew up on that class’ forum, the men in the class felt that they were being “excluded” from this cool opportunity. We are going to go talk to the class again on monday, but I’m not sure what to say to them. On one hand, it does feel like it’s widening the gender divide by being a “women only” event. But on the other hand, it is rather intimidating for women to get into Computer Science when they walk into a 95% male classroom, and if more women joined, the gender gap would become narrower.
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trhtrhth
> felt that they were being “excluded” from this cool opportunity.

That's not opinion, it's fact, regardless of the motives for doing it.

> it is rather intimidating for women to get into Computer Science when they
> walk into a 95% male classroom

Did you intuit that, or is that the result of a real, repeated study?

Are you offering something similar for the men? That's what would make this
fair.

~~~
whyrusleeping
I agree that it is exclusionary, And if this event was something that we had
planned ourselves, I would try not to exclude anyone. (We put on club events
every week that we regularly invite the student body to). The problem is that
this event is Microsoft's thing, and we are kind-of at their whim. My comment
about women being intimidated in a 95% male classroom comes from actually
talking to different women in our program and hearing what they have to say.
And we arent "offering" anything, like I said, this is a Microsoft sponsored
event.

~~~
trhtrhth
You quibble about the term 'offer', but surely you could 'find' or 'discover'
something for the men.

And do you tell the women they are going to need to learn to interact with men
as part of a professional programming job? Are they only ok with that if they
are in the majority?

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whyme
Unfortunately, things like this are more damaging overall. i.e. Even if you
succeed and get some more women involved, you will have also created
resentment from men whom are not given equal opportunity, which then can lead
to women not being given equal opportunity.

I suggest you don't perpetuate the problem / don't participate.

~~~
whyrusleeping
I definetly agree... I was thinking of talking to the microsoft rep about it
and about what we've run into. Its difficult to say "no" when your department
is asking you to help plan and advertise this event from such an influential
company.

~~~
whyme
I wouldn't discuss with the Microsoft rep. This is a decision your school
needs to make.

You could politely decline to participate and provide your reasons for doing
so. If your department feels strongly enough about it then let one of them
volunteer to do it. If no one volunteers, then obviously they don't feel
strongly about it. Your declining to participate sends a strong message.

------
cjbprime
I think you already did a pretty good job of explaining it -- it would be
better if these initiatives weren't necessary, but when you're at 95% you
might need to do some bootstrapping work to start off a positive feedback
loop, and to share positive role models.

~~~
whyrusleeping
What types of bootstrapping would you suggest?

