
Sony sells off VAIO PC business amid prolonged industry slump - ChuckMcM
http://arstechnica.com/business/2014/02/sony-sells-off-vaio-pc-business-amid-prolonged-industry-slump/
======
sirkneeland
Few PC makers seemed to be consistently as willing to try wild new ideas with
their devices.

Whether it was because of Apple reasons ("we are too focused on a small number
of sure winners...oh and a G4 cube") or HP/Dell reasons ("we are really into
playing it safe"), there were just few companies that could do things like
Sony could.

I think it takes a certain amount (if not an outright surplus) of engineering
hands and manufacturing capacity to be able to do experiments like Sony's VAIO
division did. Think of the truly bizarre and occasionally beautiful devices
coming out of Nokia in their mid-2000s peak, or IBM in the era of their
"butterfly" keyboard..

If you look at those key ingredients for what it takes to "get weird with it"
(those surpluses of capability and capacity), I'd say the next ones to get
weird with it would be Samsung (need I remind you Samsung has in recent memory
tried a Galaxy with a curved screen, a Galaxy with a mini projector...), LG,
and a whoooole bunch of Chinese companies we probably haven't even heard of
yet.

But today, we take Sony off that list.

~~~
marincounty
Except for HP--they 'don't play it safe'; They epitomize the two year laptop,
and even two years is a stretch. At this point, I want longevity over
something gimmicky. I think I'll have to go back to 2003 in Stewie's time
machine and buy a toshiba P25-S607(still a functional computer years later--
with three cooling fans). As to Sony--I liked there products, but found they
seemed to breakdown too soon too? I really think consumers want an honest
computer company--get rid of the CEO's who don't know a soldering gun, from a
curling gun(HP again); get rid of the MBA's and give us stuff that is designed
to last. Apple was moving in the right direction, but they should put Linux on
every model they ship. Steve would understand the importance of that last
sentence, but I doubt the figure head would get it? While I'm on it--Apple if
you are listening--this is the last dollar you get from me. Mavericks is
terrible(you should have told your customers abut certain software just won't
work), and I heard you new MBP is hard to work on. Most Computer dudes are
poor. We don't make the big money you seem to think we do? If I was in charge
of the new Sony spinoff, I would design a computer that us built to last, and
is easy to work on. Build enough mother boards and store them in a mini
storage until your customers need them. Be different, and stress longevity
over incremental speed. Exploit the fact that most men don't like throwing
things away--especially things we once loved.

~~~
Einstalbert
100% unrelated but I noticed you put "we don't make the big money you seem to
think we do?" with a question mark at the end. It's not really a question, now
is it? I've noticed this typing behavior a lot online lately and I am not sure
if I missed a crucial lesson in English or if it's a new-age kind of thing, or
what. Not trying to be a prick, it just stuck out. I agree with your point on
HP laptops in more ways than I can count.

------
nfoz
They should have hired a 12 year old to point out the obvious flaws in their
products, which are typically quite good but with arbitrary gaping holes.

I hope the VAIO machines stay around, under the rule of someone that knows how
to transform their high-end products into high-end products that people really
want.

~~~
zaidf
It's not that they don't know about the flaws; it's usually bureaucracy and
compromises that lead to obviously broken features in products. That will take
more than a 12 year old to fix.

~~~
nfoz
Ah, I suspect you're right. How is this solvable? Management engineering??

~~~
nooneelse
In light of the "management engineering" slant, the way people organizations
seem to get made reminds me of the old meme that buildings in the far past
were 'designed' only to the extent that they didn't follow the exact design of
some other building which had fallen down. And in that vein, the answers by
zaidf and sirkneeland, are like: buildings above some size keep falling down,
so add a big central column in the middle to support the weight. Make all of
the building depend on that central column.

But buildings evolved to have arches and open domes, no central column needed.
Why can't the same be done with people-based control/oversight/management
systems? Building a beautiful structure dependent on all/many the members
around, not just a central support/dictator.

~~~
zaidf
Just because you have one person who makes the final call does not mean he
isn't reliant on other members of his team.

The way Gates describes his process resonates with me:

 _In terms of deciding what programs are going to do, a fairly large group
makes suggestions. Then there’s a filtering process. Eventually I’ll decide
which of the ideas makes sense, and I’ll make sure we have champions who are
personally involved in making that product succeed._

[http://programmersatwork.wordpress.com/bill-
gates-1986/](http://programmersatwork.wordpress.com/bill-gates-1986/)

------
druiid
This is pretty sad to me. Sony has a lot of great ideas and their style for
VAIO products I can't think of any other manufacturer than Apple with anything
approaching it.

Their tablet->laptop convertible machines especially are really good pieces of
tech. I know the one complaint about the flip13 is that the battery life isn't
super great, but the concept and design are truly cool. I've also worked
with/used the Duo13 and while the flip function is a bit weird, the whole kit
is really great.

Oh well, hopefully the new owners do something great (I know Sony is not
without issue).

------
ChuckMcM
Amidst the stories about Steve Jobs trying to get Sony to run MacOS on the
Vaio we now get this note that Sony is exiting the PC business. Its too bad,
I've owned a number of Vaio laptops over the years and have really liked most
of them.

------
wahsd
Wow. It's kind of sad how Sony seems to be just wasting away. I don't know
what PS4 sales numbers are like relative to XBox or even the older systems,
but it just feels like if XBox hadn't so royally screwed up with their
nonsense about not being able to lend out games, I feel like PS4 would be
grasping for air right about now.

~~~
kyriakos
depends where in the world you are i guess (regarding the consoles). also in
the long run people won't remember about the whole lending fiasco.

now to me sony laptops are a bit ovepriced. my last two PC notebooks were from
Asus and I am happy with them. They were at least 25% cheaper than similar
sony models.

~~~
dragontamer
Its a case of too late.

Sony Fit E15 was a good machine at a good price. But by the time Sony began
making these lower cost machines, they already solidified the "too expensive"
mindset.

People probably didn't even realize that Sony had a ~$500 line of laptops
(which, when upgraded to "reasonable" specs, would be closer to $750 or $800
of course... but that is a reasonably priced laptop)

------
swalsh
Hey all you guys who make PC's, here's an idea on how to make some money.
Build a good laptop, let me upgrade it, and support it.

Apple right now makes some of the best hardware you can buy, and they are
pretty profitable doing it. The problem is I can't upgrade it. I would spend a
fair bit of money for a good quality (materials, and parts) laptop. No one
seems to be doing that any more. Most laptops have these huge clunky plastic
cases, with cheap parts, and terrible support.

~~~
maxsilver
> Build a good laptop, let me upgrade it, and support it.

How do you define "upgrade it."

Lenovo sells the Yoga ultrabook, it's thin, affordable $800-$1,000, has a
great (in my opinion) build quality using soft touch plastic, includes a
Haswell processor, and you can manually upgrade the SSD and RAM. It has a
cheap wifi chip (no 5ghz? really?), but otherwise fits the bill you described.

Is the storage and ram enough? Or do you want more than that. Because I
imagine it gets really tricky to build a thin, light, sturdy and reliable
laptop that still lets you upgrade every single part.

~~~
ajross
Having DRAM and flash that aren't soldered to the board is indeed an important
aspect to "upgradable". I'd point out, though, that that "cheap wifi chip"
would be less of a problem if it could be, y'know, replaced. There is even a
connector standard (M.2, which is a combo mini-pcie and usb thing) for these
things that doesn't suck. Except it never works because the vendors whitelist
their components in the firmware.

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Zigurd
I'm surprised people are surprised. Sony has no server business. They are in
the thankless margin-less laptop/desktop business. That's a problem with no
solution.

------
wil421
Before I went off to Mac land I only used vaios from early 2000's to 2010.
They were all great computers but I am not sure they kept innovating it seemed
like minor updates to most models.

In my city they also had Vaio stores just like Apple and most of their
products were much better than Dell and Hp at that time. I enjoyed checking
them out from time to time.

