
Show HN: The Warby Parker of Men’s Jeans - thomson
http://www.mottandbow.com
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dy
Wearing a pair right now - well made jeans at a good price and excellent CS
with returns. Definitely solves a problem for me - now they just need
subscription billing :)

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alejandc
Thats great to hear! Will look into having a subscription offer in the near
future.

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eric3000
I am also wearing Mott & Bows right now - grey Horatios. I love the fit and my
wife does too.

Alejandro - I was wondering if you could share what you think about the future
of jeans in 5 years. You obviously have deep knowledge with Mott & Bow, so
where do you think jeans and denim is going? Will everyone be wearing
different colors of denim in 5 years? Will fit be more customizable and
tailored? Will Levis always be the dominant brand?

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alejandc
Eric, im glad you and your wife love the fit! We pride ourselves in having
developed great fits.

Those are great questions. The traditional denim colors will always move the
majority of the volume, but I do think taste is evolving, and with that you
see new colors being added each season. Take a look at our latest addition,
the Waverly's ([http://www.mottandbow.com/straight-
waverly-2-month.html](http://www.mottandbow.com/straight-
waverly-2-month.html)). These are a deep blue indigo color, a bit non
traditional but always clean.

I think Levis has done a great job (they have reached ubiquity in denim). The
cool part of our proposition is that we are offering designer denim (usually
offered at +$200 because of the superior material and handcraft that goes into
it) at half the price by going direct to consumer instead of the traditional
model (where prices reach 8x what they cost to make).

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jadlimcaco
Any chance you guys will do 30 length? 32 is pretty long for me. I'm 5"8 and
normally wear a 32x30.

Would be cool to do something like Jack Threads does. Put the model specs with
the jeans. (Height / Weight)

Also, maybe some pics with models with different body types as well. Helps
someone figure out how the jeans will look like on their body type.

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alejandc
Good point. Will add model specs in the next postings.

We just started out a few months ago so we purposefully limited the SKU count,
but will be adding 30 inseam for some of the styles that come out next year.

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Anjin
Seems pretty similar to Buck Mason:
[https://www.buckmason.com/](https://www.buckmason.com/)

They also do the whole home-try on thing for men's clothing.

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alejandc
Hi Anjin, a few differences from BM:

1- We are bringing the denim from one of the top denim mills in the world. 2-
Our home try-on is for sizing on the same item (you get two different sizes of
the same style), not trying to cross sell items.

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alejandc
Would love answering any questions you guys might have. Feedback is welcome
and appreciated! Started this a few months back as I could not find a premium
pair of jeans for $100.

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CocaKoala
Do you have any plans to offer a wider range of sizes? I'd love to buy some,
but I can guarantee you that the smallest size you have, 28x30, is going to be
too large for me; I'm currently wearing a pair of 27x27 Levis because Levis is
the only company I've been able to find that makes jeans which fit me.

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alejandc
What fit do you usually wear in Levis? When we started out a few months ago we
offered size 27 on skinny fit but there was no demand for that size, so we
decided to start the next styles in size 28.

The only style we currently have a size 27 is this one
[http://www.mottandbow.com/skinny/skinny-bleecker-resin-
rinse...](http://www.mottandbow.com/skinny/skinny-bleecker-resin-rinse.html)

I would love to offer more sizes but we have to find the demand for those. Any
clue how we can reach that smaller waist size demographic?

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CocaKoala
I'm currently wearing Levis 514, which according to their website is a
straight fit. In the past, I've also worn 527, which I guess is a boot cut? I
don't wear skinny jeans because I can't get over the "skinny jeans = emo
hipster" association that was made when my brain was still forming connections
like that back in the 90s.

It's kind of a tough problem; I can tell you that my demand for jeans is
pretty low, in large part because buying jeans is such a miserable experience.
In the best case scenario, I get to go to an outlet mall and search through
racks and racks of jeans; in the likely event that I can't find my size, I
have to be a 26 year old man asking a salesperson where they have "Boys size
14" jeans. This has never failed to be humiliating, and I hate having to do
it. As a result, I buy jeans four or five pairs at a time and wear them until
they all fall apart; this means I never have to shop for jeans more than every
four or five years, and it minimizes the amount of time I'm forced to engage
in what has never failed to be a totally shitty experience [1].

As a result, I'll occasionally come across services like yours that advertise
a revolution in jeans buying, and I'll think "oh hey, that sounds great! I
hate buying jeans, maybe these guys have made it better" and invariable I
discover that oh wait, they actually don't solve my problem. And then I
figure, "Well, I've got another three years of jeans-time left before I need
to worry about it, so whatever" and I forget about the service, because I
don't have space in my brain to keep a record of all the companies that might,
at some point in the vague, undetermined future, sell something that interests
me.

It's something of an assumption, but I'm guessing that most of the 'Petite
Adult Male' demographic is probably roughly like me; they've discovered that
it's really un-fun to have to ask where the kid's clothes are when they shop,
and so they minimize the number of times they have to shop. That minimizes the
window of time for which they actually demand jeans, and that means it's very
challenging for you to offer jeans for sale during the time in which they're
attempting to buy them; you basically get one chance and if you don't have
what they're looking for, they're lost as a customer forever.

I don't really have a solution for you; 27 inch waists are basically a weird
edge case that I happen to fall into, and it appears to be entirely possible
to flourish as a jeans company without selling them, so it's not like this is
dooming your company to failure. You likely know more about the selling and
marketing of clothes than I do, so maybe if I can give you some additional
context into why that demographic is challenging to reach, you'll have some
ideas?

[1]: One time, I tried to order 27x27 jeans online from the Levi's store. This
was a horrible mistake that led to me having to send back no less than three
different pairs of jeans that were random sizes with no relation to what I
ordered, and each time it meant almost an hour on the telephone trying to make
somebody understand that what I had ordered was 27x27 jeans and yet what I had
received was 32x35 or 29x30 or 30x30, regardless of what their records
indicated or what guarantees the previous phone call had left me with. It took
literally a month and at the end of it I ended up having to buy the damn jeans
in a store anyways.

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alejandc
Thanks for the detailed response! Will work on getting more traction so we can
expand the size offering!

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cgeoffwilson
In e-commerce, customer service is critical. these guys do a fantastic job.
Ecomm is a tough business and you need differentiators. So far so great for
M&B

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alejandc
thanks so much!

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jerryhao
Love the risk-free home try on program. Out of curiosity, does the program
extend to trying a different waist size in a different style?

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alejandc
Thanks Jerry! The home try-on is currently for help with sizing (as a lot of
guys are between waist sizes depending on the brand). It seems like a good
idea to offer it so guys can checkout different styles. Will look into it.

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natewinn
I have a pair of Mosco slim denim. Without a doubt the best pair of denim I
own. They're incredibly comfortable.

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alejandc
Thats great to hear Nate! We will keep on working hard to expand the line!

