
Big Nerd Ranch needs a loan - zdw
http://www.possibleprobable.com/?p=357
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aresant
Posting because I had zero context and had to research:

\- BNR builds software for mobile / desktop via
<http://www.bignerdranch.com/software/>

\- BNR has become "known around the globe for the quality of the experience we
produce", except to me [edit - read RunJake's comment]

\- Since 2001 BNR has been running trainings for other programmers and writing
well accepted texts on software dev.

\- They want to build an actual location, a la 37signals, to host their
trainings and develop a "monastery for learning".

\- They already secured a loan with which they purchased 13 acres near
Fairburn, GA in two transactions.

\- They need ~$4,900,000 to build the facility and cover debt, and SBA will
lend them 35% of the project at just over 4% interest.

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runjake
And I didn't mean to sound like I was lambasting you. Not everyone is familiar
with the Cocoa world.

I just wanted to point out that (most likely) the vast majority of objc/Cocoa
programmers in the world got started by reading his book (along with Kochan's
objc book).

~~~
aresant
Not at all - much appreciated and good to know!

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hugh3
While I'm not nearly rich enough to make the loan anyway, if I were I'd be
disinclined to give a better deal than the bank. It seems like a fairly risky
loan; your money is guaranteed by a property which probably can't be sold for
its construction cost and some shares in a business which may or may not go
broke.

~~~
RyanMcGreal
OTOH if the building is made to last, it will retain its value over time in a
way that a prefab construction with a 20 year lifespan will not.

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DanI-S
_Whenever I go to a really old, really cool building, I think, “This building
was built by men with chisels and hammers. How come the modern world, with all
its power tools and advanced materials, can’t build such cool stuff?” The
answer is “Banks won’t let you.”_

That's a fantastic opening sentence if ever there was one.

~~~
hugh3
If you wanna build a really cool building out of stone, save up your money
until you have enough to build it with cash. That's what the men who built
those cool old buildings did.

~~~
Alex3917
It also helps if you can wait until a period of enormous wealth inequality so
that skilled labor is basically free.

~~~
jfb
Wait?

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nikcub
Thats what Dubai and Abu Dhabi did.

Waited for the slave labour to arrive

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btilly
One reason the banks are going to be wary is that construction projects are
even more prone to cost and time overruns than software development projects
are. Thus they expect that the requested loan won't be the last, and if the
company doesn't have resources for it then things could go badly south.

Plus there is the fact that if things collapse half-way through you've got a
company which could be hard to get value out of, and a piece of land which
probably has the start to a foundation that will only be a PITA for whatever
anyone else wants to do with said land.

~~~
marcamillion
For some reason, I don't think that's the issue is here. They don't have much
credit history - seems to me that they have bootstrapped up until now - doing
everything from profits and retained earnings.

`Harsh penalties for prepayment in the first five years` that shows that the
banks are concerned that they have been debt-free or low debt (i.e. there is
no money in providing the loan, because they will likely pay it back quickly).

The bottom line is that the banks don't think they will make much, if any,
money on it.

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prawn
One of the comments made me laugh:

"Dear Aaron, If I had it, I’d give it to you! Mom"

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sliverstorm
> Some folks have asked about smaller loans. _This is would be great._

When you're asking for large sums of money and very non-trivial support of
others, it's probably a good idea to be extra careful with your typing. No
offense.

edit: I don't mean to nit-pick, it's just good to put your very best foot
forth on these kind of requests!

~~~
seunosewa
That's obvious.

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porter
As a recovering banker I can tell you that banks a weary of lending on these
Taj Mahal type projects because in the case of a foreclosure all that extra
work to make the building look nice doesn't easily translate into rents high
enough to justify the cost. Also, keep in mind most bankers have no clue how
technology companies operate. Another reason why this might be hard for you is
because virtually every commercial bank is getting hosed on commercial real
estate and many have exceeded the regulatory limit on real estate lending, so
the underwriting is much tighter.

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RyanMcGreal
Poor societies can't afford the luxury of throwaway architecture. With the
cheap prefab construction today, you're lucky if your commercial building
lasts until the mortgage is paid off. By then you'll want to rip it down and
reconfigure it to the new retail hotness anyway - witness the number of
'80s-era strip-malls currently getting rebuilt into big-box plazas.

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muffinman2010
There is a new site up by the guys/girls who created kiva.org:
<https://www.profounder.com/>

I think you would be a good fit for it.

~~~
gkoberger
Kickstarter is another similar way to get funding- although $5 million is
asking a lot.

