

What Will You Give Up For Your Startup? - kentonwhite
https://battlehardened.wordpress.com/2012/02/10/what-will-you-give-up-for-your-startup/

======
verelo
Very interesting, its kind of ironic that you probably started working for
yourself so you could enjoy more freedom only to have "the man" catch up with
you.

Rather unfortunate, luckily i don't rock climb but i'm sure we all run into
these things!

------
bhickey
I just got done talking with a friend who is an underwriter. Your underwriter
is clueless. Go elsewhere.

A mountaineering rider will cost you $2.50 - $7.50 per thousand dollars in
coverage.

------
Turing_Machine
I'm speculating that the difference between the rock climbing and your partner
smoking is that lung cancer doesn't usually kill people without warning. It
can take months or even years (there are exceptions, of course).

That would give the company plenty of time to find another key man (and the
insurance company plenty of time to cancel the key man insurance). Rock
climbing deaths tend to be of a more sudden nature.

~~~
danbmil99
Nah, without evidence I propose that it's simply that smoking is so common,
allowances are made. If every key-man insurance policy prohibited smoking, too
many deals would fall through and the insurers wouldn't have any business.
Rock climbing is just more esoteric and therefore easier to put a "NO" to.

------
hv23
I'm not too familiar with the intricacies of insurance but what would happen
if you _were_ to continue rock-climbing and mitigated your risks (by climbing
in a gym with toprope and a partner, etc.) such that you were never actually
fatally injured while climbing?

What's the risk there-- that some sort of injury actually does happen, you're
forced to reveal your hobby, and you'd be held personally liable/leave
yourself open to prosecution for negligence? Or would your premiums just
increase whenever the truth came out?

Sorry to speak in such negative hypotheticals, but I'm just genuinely curious
about what the terms of "giving up" something for insurance entails.

~~~
eli
Well, knowingly lying on an insurance application is a crime even if that lie
doesn't cost the insurance company anything.

------
aamar
If you have a hobby like this, allow additional time and energy and get
insurance quotes from several carriers. Something like snowboarding is (or
used to be?) treated seriously by some insurances and not by others. I don't
know how dangerous rock climbing is, but it seems kind of similar--the kind of
things that some will use to increase premium and some might ignore.

Given the circumstances, no doubt you (OP) made the right call, given the
timing of the deal. But you could still might be able to find and switch to a
more permissive/equally-good insurance policy down the line at some point.
Might take a couple years to get this done, of course.

~~~
bhickey
I can quote fatality figures at you, but I'm afraid I can't transform that
into useful statistics. For the most part, you have a lot of control over your
level of acceptable risk in climbing. If you want to top-rope in the gym with
a sober partner, you experience a much greater hazard driving to the gym than
actually climbing. Free-soloing El Cap in the nude is another story. The
estimates I've seen find the risk of serious injury to be far less than that
of playing high school football.

In most of the insurance policies I've seen, payout is typically refused for
fatalities over 6000m or 7000m. While I haven't purchased key person
insurance, I've never had a problem with buying a hazardous activity rider.

Are you sure you did enough shopping around?

Edit: For any climbers in the audience, I'd like to encourage you to join the
American Alpine Club. (<http://www.americanalpineclub.org/benefits/>)

------
tnicola
Your insurance questionnaire being more detailed had nothing to do with who
was the beneficiary of the policy (think about it - why would they care who
gets the money), but the fact that the death benefit was probably larger than
anything you would have applied for individually until now. The level of
detail underwriters go into is almost always 100% dependent on the size of the
cheque they have to write upon ones death.

If you took out the same size insurance policy individually from the same
company, the questionnaire would not have been any different.

------
kylemaxwell
I've thought about this before as well. My "hobby" has been computer gaming as
long as I can remember. I'm not doing a startup right now, but when I have,
the time demands required me to make a choice. It sounds silly, but in reality
we all find it difficult to walk away from something that's a major part of
your identity.

The trick is to find a way to feed the part of your psyche that wants that
activity / etc., maybe a substitute without the same drawbacks. Hiking instead
of rock climbing, or chess instead of computer gaming. Virtual methadone...

------
stingraycharles
I've got a similar problem; I've an avid rock climbing and alpinist too, and
used to be an alpine instructor as a hobby. I had to give that last one up,
due to liabilities: when a person I give training to makes a deadly mistake,
gets disabled, etc, the chances were too big some for some liability lawsuit
to occur.

It's a pity these things happen. Thank god I didn't have to give up rock
climbing altogether yet. I don't know whether I could make such a choice
(since both are enormous passions in my life).

------
AznHisoka
I'll give up anything except my health, relationships, and sanity. If I don't
make it, there's always Zen meditation to soothe my mind :)

------
dot
Now that you've sold your startup you could climb again, right?

I've heard a good break can bring your skills to the next level!

------
Domenic_S
"So I caved"

Heh.

That's a bummer. Are you going to take something else up instead?

~~~
whatusername
Based on that post - he could always take up Spelunking.

------
bjstewr
Brutal.. Maybe you could do some bouldering just for that taste

~~~
kentonwhite
Actually tried the bouldering angle. The underwriter had even less experience
with bouldering than with rock climbing. When I explained it -- no ropes, no
gear, just a crash pad -- the underwriter freaked and wouldn't consider
insurance even at a higher premin!

------
codeonfire
All I can say is Wow. You really needs to come back down to reality. It's
great you 'saved' your company by not rock climbing, but blogging about it is
a bit much. I'm not saying this to be mean, but the article is off-putting.

~~~
codeonfire
Well, ok downvoters, exactly what did you get from the article that I'm
missing? Or is it simply that you know the author personally? This is a
serious question.

