
Earn a Master of Information and Data Science Online - eplanit
http://requestinfo.datascience.berkeley.edu/index.html?s=linkedinspcpc&l=1020_mids_greenstates_skills-industry_comp-hightech_gen3apply-logo&utm_source=linkedinspcpc&utm_campaign=1020_mids_greenstates_skills-industry_comp-hightech_gen3apply-logo&utm_medium=link
======
codegeek
I have/had my eye on this one. I spoke to the admission counselor for this
program. Apparently, they assign each student one counselor if you join this
program. Here are some details:

\- 100% online [0] (you do have to visit the campus for a week during the
course)

\- Total price tag: $60,000 (Yes, pretty steep)

\- You can finish in 1-2 years depending on how much you can do

\- You must take the GRE or GMAT. No exceptions. I asked them. You also need
to apply to this like any regular MS program which means good GPA (3+ min but
you must have great work experience etc)

\- Here is the curriculum in case you are interested [1]

Overall, I was very interested in this due to the berkeley brand and 100%
online offering. But 60K seems too steep to invest and not to mention that I
have to take GRE/GMAT. After being in the industry (real world) for 10+ years,
I am just not interested in any of these exams. So I am passing. Will look for
cheaper options.

Forgot to mention that they are aggressively selling this. The counselor
called me like 15 times (literally) before I responded.

[0] [http://datascience.berkeley.edu](http://datascience.berkeley.edu)

[1]
[http://datascience.berkeley.edu/academics/curriculum/](http://datascience.berkeley.edu/academics/curriculum/)

~~~
washedup
Yea, I came to the same conclusions. $60K seems like a lot for any online
degree. Obviously there are still people working behind the scenes, but to me
a majority of the cost is covering the Berkeley brand. While that is very
attractive, I wouldn't pay more than $20,000 for this program. The knowledge
itself is very valuable, but attaining it should not be so costly when there
are amazing free resources all over the place.

~~~
taude
I like the Georgia Tech MS Computer Science [0] which was in the 8K range.
That seems reasonable for an online education that's mostly self-driven.

I hate the feeling pay to play of a lot of our higher-level education as it
seems that what you learn has nothing to really do with where you learn it.

[0] [http://www.omscs.gatech.edu/](http://www.omscs.gatech.edu/)

~~~
SwellJoe
So much of the value of going to a place like Stanford or Caltech or Harvard,
etc. is in the people you will interact with. In an online program, that value
is probably completely lost. Given that, I just don't see why someone would
choose this over a much more cost-effective program. While a "top tier"
university does look nice on the resume, I don't believe it is mandatory,
anymore. If you're competent and work hard, you can build a reputation in Open
Source software that will get you a job at most places, including the really
sought after places (I've gotten two recruitment letters from Google, and a
handful from other places), regardless of where your degree is from.

Of course, if you're competent and work hard, you can probably build your own
job from scratch in any number of software and technology fields.

~~~
ForHackernews
Not to diminish your accomplishments, but you should know that Google casts a
very wide net in their recruiting. I've been contacted several times by them
for positions that I am not even remotely qualified for.

~~~
SwellJoe
Yes, that's probably true; and I doubt I would actually get a job at Google
were I interested in one (I don't have a degree; I started my first company
before finishing any school). They were pretty specific about why they were
contacting me, and it was well-targeted for the position they were hiring for
(and my company co-founder currently works in that role for Google). But, I've
never posted anything anywhere ever that would indicate I'm looking for work,
so I don't get a lot of recruitment overtures except from people that actually
know what I do.

Anyway, that probably wasn't a useful addition to my point. I believe you're
more likely to get hired for a good company if somebody within the company
knows you, and you're more likely to know people in good companies if you go
to one of the "good" schools for your field. That doesn't happen with online
degrees, no matter how prestigious the school.

------
sonalid
I was a student of this MIDS program for one semester after attending Hack
Reactor in the spring. I took three classes this summer, which is the closest
thing they have to full-time. I can say without hesitation that it would be an
enormous financial mistake for most people to join the program.

Just a quick overview of some of the problems they have:

\- Poorly considered curriculum. Our data visualization class involved no d3js
or training with data viz tools. Students were told to teach themselves the
tools in their spare time while studying data viz theory (Edward Tufte, etc.)
in class.

\- Cost. There's absolutely no way to justify the $60k price tag, especially
with no in-state tuition option.

\- Choice of instructors. They're trying to increase the size of the program
too quickly, while throwing in new instructors with zero teaching experience.
These instructors also have part-time or full-time jobs outside of MIDS, so I
didn't even get my grades back for assignments from the first month by two
weeks before finals. It would often take a minimum of 2-4 weeks to get grades
back.

I've officially withdrawn from MIDS, and I'm attending Zipfian this fall. I
strongly recommend considering any and all alternatives to MIDS before even
applying.

------
tgeery
I know this price is pretty on par with the likes of Northwestern and other
great schools that offer similar online programs. But it seems a bit insulting
when schools like Georgia Tech are offering a $7k online Masters CS. A lot of
the infrastructure of modern college is online anyways, so I'm not sure that
putting the lectures online and removing the facilities completely is
progressive. Learning to scale these classrooms efficiently and continually
reducing the fixed cost per student seems to be what we're (me, without the
dedication/job willing to pay for this degree) waiting for. Especially, if the
goal really is to provide an education available to all online

------
p0ppe
You don't seem to be getting a Berkeley degree; "datascience@berkeley’s
technology service provider works with a different university to offer an
online data science program that is unaffiliated with the University of
California." (3rd page of the form). I wonder what that university would be.

~~~
guelo
Also wonder who the "technology service provider" is. Is it just a repackaging
of something like Coursera for $60k?

------
newppc
The biggest thing that hasn't been discussed yet is that the admissions
counselors and marketing seems to be entirely run by 2U.

Not saying this is not a good company or that online education is not good -
just that 2U is representing themselves as part of Berkeley Admissions.

Check this -
[http://2u.com/partners/berkeley/](http://2u.com/partners/berkeley/)

Was contacted by this person when I wanted to learn more about the program,
who's email signature looked like this:

 _Peter Wahlberg

Admissions Counselor

datascience@berkeley Admissions Office

UC Berkeley School of Information

pwahlberg@datascience.berkeley.edu

datascience.berkeley.edu_

But he also works for 2U - maybe only for 2U -
[http://www.linkedin.com/pub/peter-
wahlberg/67/800/27b](http://www.linkedin.com/pub/peter-wahlberg/67/800/27b)

Again this admissions counselor and the company are innovating in the
education space which is a good thing, but I do find it odd to misrepresent 2U
employees as Berkeley admissions counselors - especially when I talked to him
on the phone and he defended the $60k price tag by saying an MBA is $80k.

------
mililani
I think one is probably better off with earning a masters in statistics. This
just seems like another way for Berkeley to sell another expensive degree with
little supporting evidence that it will land jobs.

------
pwelch
The page has an icon that says "Hacker safe" but doesn't even use SSL when
transmitting your information.

~~~
Someone1234
Good catch. It also has "Your privacy is important to us" and a SSL-like
padlock. The web-server at requestinfo.datascience.berkeley.edu doesn't even
have a valid certificate (it is return Cloudflare's certificate). So if you
were thinking of typing in HTTPS manually then think again...

They do send the form to:
[https://salesforce.com/servlet/servlet.WebToLead?encoding=UT...](https://salesforce.com/servlet/servlet.WebToLead?encoding=UTF-8)

But as we all know if the form itself is in HTTP then it can be intercepted
and modified to send the info to an attacker's own web-server making the fact
that they're sending to a HTTPS-enabled server really rather meaningless.

HTTP form to HTTPS essentially breaks HTTPS's MITM protections, it only keeps
the encryption somewhat in-place (although with a successful MITM the
encryption is effectively disabled).

------
Someone1234
> Now you can earn a degree in data science from anywhere in the world.

Yet they ask for a US college GPA to even get to the form? Little confused. Is
that information used to determine your eligibility and why is there no "no
clue" option? A GPA is a very US-centric thing.

~~~
nemesisrobot
Maybe they just mean you can earn your credits from anywhere in the world, not
that anyone in the world can apply.

------
dhawalhs
As other people have pointed out that even though its an online degree it has
the same price as an offline one. Though it doesn't have the same credential
as Berkeley (or maybe the rigorousness), Coursera's Data Science
specialization [1] from John Hopkins costs $500. Recently they announced that
they have partnered with SwiftKey [2] for the final capstone project.

[1]
[https://www.coursera.org/specialization/jhudatascience/1](https://www.coursera.org/specialization/jhudatascience/1)

[2] [https://www.class-central.com/report/data-science-
specializa...](https://www.class-central.com/report/data-science-
specialization-switftkey/)

------
ajones
I spoke with Berkeley when deciding where I was going to apply and got the
sense that they plan on leaning on their more established programs to provide
instruction. While this may sound great, you won't get the specific data
science instruction that these curriculums require.

After an awful experience with Northwestern's online analytics program, I
don't want to touch any of these programs.

~~~
bequanna
As someone who is interested in Northwestern's Predictive Analytics program, I
would be interested in hearing your specific issues with that program.

~~~
ajones
I only got through one class, but have heard my concerns echoed by many who
are only continuing the program because the have invested so much into it.

The program is based on weekly discussion board posts and a few exams per
course. For the most part, I find myself attempting to put fluff into my posts
rather than meaningful analysis.

There are "sync sessions" throughout the courses, but they don't occur every
week. This is much unlike a MOOC, which provides a set of weekly lectures to
view and gain understanding.

There was zero project work in my initial class and projects at or below the
level of undergrad projects in more advanced courses.

I managed an A average while spending the absolute minimum amount of time on
the class.

When paying 4,000 dollars per course, I had hoped that the instruction would
be at the same level or better than that of a set of MOOCs. In the field of
data science, I believe the time can easily be directed towards side projects
for greater knowledge and similar employment prospects.

------
steinbecksrev
I don't know. If you want to pay-to-play, it's not a terrible deal, especially
considering that it can be just one year and you don't need to leave your job
to do it. Opportunity cost is the largest outlay when it comes to masters and
doctoral degrees, and this format essentially eliminates that. But yes,
networking beyond your cohort would be difficult. It would be really nice if
they had a good placement program, but I can't speak to that.

The real kicker here though is that these classes aren't open to other
Berkeley students. There are general equivalents in the Stats department, in
CS, and in the iSchool, but not tailored to generalists looking to add some
kind of "Data Science" specialization. The curriculum is really walled off
from the rest of the students, which is annoying because I want to take some
of these classes.

Anyway, I think the real question here is how much opportunity cost you can
avoid in the online format and the placement/salary you should expect coming
out of it.

------
mbrzusto
Or ... you could stay in the city and get an MS in Analytics from University
of San Francisco at the downtown 101 Howard campus.
[http://www.usfca.edu/analytics/](http://www.usfca.edu/analytics/) The program
is excellent, has a REAL practicum experience and boasts nearly 100%
employment 3 months post graduation. It comes in at about half the cost of
cal's program. [Full disclosure ... I'm an adjunct there] Here's what you can
learn in one year
[http://www.usfca.edu/artsci/msan/courses/](http://www.usfca.edu/artsci/msan/courses/)
The combination of location, instruction and work experience is unprecedented.

------
eranation
I'm taking the GTOMSCS from Georgia Tech, for less than $7,000. I asked
Berkeley if they have any plans to change their steep price tag ($50-60K), and
they said no, because I'll be allowed to go on campus and get all benefits of
an on campus student. I told them I don't plan to do so, and that I think I'm
paying a high premium for a "feature" that I don't use.

They didn't reply.

in G.Tech you CAN'T go on campus, although the degree is the same. I didn't
hear of a decrease in the on campus program enrollment there.

I think that if GT will show profit and that it didn't hurt their on campus
program (and that the program rigor is not affected) then other universities
will have to follow.

~~~
winslow
I just got accepted to the GT OMSCS as well for the January group. When do you
start or have you already started? What's your focus? I'm focusing on parallel
computing and machine learning.

~~~
eranation
Welcome aboard! I started in the first cohort (last Spring semester). I'm not
sure yet what focus to take, probably software engineering & databases and
machine learning, (we have enough credits to take both, but I guess we'll have
to chose one officially...)

I'm taking software dev process this semester, a bit of relaxation after
advanced OS (good course, but not easy)

------
platformeR
I find this to be an excellent offering and justified overall.. some may not
agree but:

You don't have to "go anywhere" to complete it. The course load IS
comprehensive. The tuition cost might be steep but in the end as the commenter
said, it is cheaper and vastly superior to a MBA.

From what I gained, the partner also works with the likes of Duke and American
U to bring the program online.. among others. Who cares & thank you partner.
([http://2u.com/partners/](http://2u.com/partners/))

This is the future and happens to be the future done right.

------
guybrushT
Its difficult to deny the need, relevance and popularity of the topic of this
degree. I just think that there may be a startup idea here: just offer an
opportunity to learn the curriculum as a vocational training/course over 4-6
months, along with a practical project at the end of it (say a Kaggle
problem). I can imagine a tie up with companies to solve problems, very much
like Kaggle and tie ups with companies looking for analytics talent.

~~~
bjterry
There are already a large number of bootcamps being formed for data science.
For example Zipfian Academy (former Berkeley students), Insight Data Science,
Metis (owned by Kaplan), Leada (a startup of former Berkeley students which
has our company as a partner), and probably others I'm not aware of.

------
eddotman
As others have said, $60k sounds steep for this. I wonder if these data
science programs will catch on. Having done my bachelors in 'nanoscience' \- I
feel that these data science courses are a little buzzwordy in a similar
fashion. I'm somewhat skeptical that these data science programs will exceed
the value of a graduate degree in stats, math, cs, etc.

------
grumblestumble
Are their any legitimate programs like these for Bachelor's degrees? I've had
my eye on doing something like this, but as I never completed my undergrad
before getting sucked into the tech goldmine, I'm ineligible. Online undergrad
degrees seem to mostly be diploma mills with no real value.

~~~
ForHackernews
In the US, probably the most legitimate option is Western Governors University
[http://www.wgu.edu/](http://www.wgu.edu/). They're an accredited, non-profit
institution. Obviously, it's not the most prestigious degree out there, but
it's not looked down on as being a for-profit scam like University of Phoenix
or similar.

~~~
icewater
Thanks for that info. Is this the only college that has an online bachelors
program or just the only one you are aware of?

~~~
ForHackernews
Many many colleges have online bachelors programs. This is just one that I
know has a decent reputation.

------
gbrock16
Here is another option from a different UC university if you are in the San
Diego area: [http://maseng.ucsd.edu/dse/](http://maseng.ucsd.edu/dse/)

~~~
oakleon
Hey thanks for posting this. It looks like a great opportunity for me! Are you
enrolled in this by any chance?

~~~
gbrock16
I actually just got enrolled into the program. It begins at the beginning of
October and this will be their first cohort for the program as it is brand
new.

------
sourc3
Based on this conversation, what are some of the Big Data/Data Science
programs with hands on experience that you guys think are worth the price tag?

~~~
sonalid
Zipfian Academy
([http://www.zipfianacademy.com/](http://www.zipfianacademy.com/)) definitely
has hands-on experience and is worth the $16k tuition. That's where I'm going
now that I've left the Berkeley MIDS program, where I learned almost nothing.

~~~
flanger
Thanks for the mention, Sonali! One of the founders of Zipfian Academy here,
happy to answer any questions you might have about the program.

~~~
sourc3
Would love to have something comparable in NY area! Too bad I cannot be in
Cali for 6 weeks :/

------
syrus
Note on the last page of registration that the degree is offered by another
online university and not affiliation with UCB.

------
iancarroll
I used to (and still might) get spam from this university, so they seem a bit
sketchy...

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marrone12
I wish they posted their curriculum somewhere.

~~~
ajones
Here you go!
[http://datascience.berkeley.edu/academics/curriculum/](http://datascience.berkeley.edu/academics/curriculum/)

------
tonydiv
Wow, how disappointing with the $60k price tag. Berkeley should be ashamed.

