
My experiment with smart drugs (2008) - pmoriarty
http://johannhari.com/2008/05/06/my-experiment-with-smart-drugs/
======
throwaway3173
I've been taking 200mg of Modafinil probably on average of 3 times a week for
the best part of 4 years now and it has certainly changed my life for the
better. It is very effective at raising my mood and motivation. I disagree
that it doesn't have a stimulant-like effect though. Before taking Modafinil,
I had a very high caffeine tolerance (I could drink as many cokes or coffees
as I liked and not even notice the effect). I usually have to limit the amount
of caffeine I drink to one coffee these days, or my heart rate goes through
the roof. It also makes my jaw tense (a common side-effect of stimulants,
apparently). I am quite a clumsy person at the best of times, but I've also
noticed that my co-ordination seems to be adversely effected (poor judgement
of space, etc) although my reaction times do seem to improve (I've surprised
myself sometimes catching falling objects that I'm sure I'd never catch if I
hadn't taken Modafinil). I haven't seen this effect documented anywhere
though.

~~~
onedev
Where do you get it? I'm very, very curious.

~~~
lumpypua
Not affiliated, but modafinilcat.com is amazing. 2 successful orders.
Subreddit with reviews and such here:
[http://www.reddit.com/r/ModafinilCat/](http://www.reddit.com/r/ModafinilCat/)

~~~
onedev
Thank you. My curiosity has been satisfied.

------
dustingetz
Modafinil and Startups (Daniel Tenner):
[http://swombat.com/2012/2/27/modafinil-and-
startups](http://swombat.com/2012/2/27/modafinil-and-startups)

Here is the conclusion:

 _" I will come strongly on the side of saying that anyone who wants to build
a startup should stay away from any regular or semi-regular Modafinil use, as
it will impair their judgement enough to make up for any apparent gain in
productivity, and I would further posit that any founder who takes Modafinil
regularly has a habit (as I did) of taking on potentially large, unknown long-
term liabilities for small short-term gains, which is not a good thing."_

~~~
ChazDazzle
The impaired judgement he experienced could just as easily be attributed to
his prolonged sleep-deprivation rather than the Modafinil.

~~~
spacemanmatt
Neither is recommended.

------
mf0rm137
Modafinil/armodafinil are great, but you can easily abuse them for replacing
sleep.. That was a long dirt road to come back from.

~~~
jmckib
I'd like to hear more about it, if you're willing to share.

~~~
Nrsolis
I've had a Modafinil prescription for more than a year. I've used fewer than
60 tablets in my whole life.

I needed every single one of those tablets though.

I travel extensively for work and I'm often called upon to be "on" when I
arrive somewhere, in their time zone, and/or drive to a final destination when
I arrive. Since sleep deprivation is something that has twice almost killed me
(or others) while operating a vehicle, I decided to get that prescription and
deal with the problem rather than continue to be unsafe.

What I can say is this: Modafinil works. The effect is very subtle but it very
clearly eliminates what might be termed "sleep pressure" or the effect of the
body trying to FORCE you to sleep. It doesn't actually do anything for your
sleep REQUIREMENT.

One nice thing about Modafinil: you can sleep on it. If you take a pill and
then have an opportunity to sleep, you can. It doesn't FORCE to to stay awake
like other stimulant drugs do.

So it'll keep you from nodding off at the wheel of a vehicle, but won't do
anything to help you perform at your BEST when you use it for an extended
period of time.

I take it very occasionally (say, once every month or so) and only for a 24
hour period. That kind of on-/off cycle is designed to minimize any side
effects and keep me from using it to replace sleep.

On another note: the US special operations community has been using Modafinil
(along with other stimulant drugs) to help solidiers/sailors/marines/airmen to
overcome the effects of extended sleep deprivation. I've confirmed this
directly with members of those communities and their experience mirrors mine.
Modafinil is a useful drug, with minimal reported side-effects, that is better
than other stimulants because of its low abuse potential and non-euphoric
profile.

~~~
ridgeguy
My experience parallels yours.

I occasionally take prescribed Modafinil for daytime somnolence resulting from
sleep apnea. On the occasions I use it, it's the difference between having the
energy and clarity to contribute or not being able to bring much at all to the
table.

The only side effect I've noted is a minor increase in anxiety, not enough to
be problematic.

It's been exceptionally helpful for me. YMMV.

~~~
onedev
How did you get it prescribed?

~~~
ridgeguy
It's part of my treatment regimen for sleep apnea, which includes a CPAP
breathing assist device. That's usually enough to reduce the low energy and
daytime sleepiness that come with sleep apnea. When it isn't, modafinil works
very well. So I was prescribed both the CPAP assist and modafinil after a
brief sleep study disclosed sleep apnea. The two other on-label uses for
modafinil (IIRC) are for narcolepsy and daytime sleepiness due to shift work.
Being prescribed for an on-label use is often important for insurance
coverage.

------
icelancer
Anyone interested in "smart drugs" must read HN's own gwern on the topic:

[http://www.gwern.net/Nootropics](http://www.gwern.net/Nootropics)

------
Xophmeister
I tried modafinil for about a month -- maybe a bit longer; I don't remember --
and believe it had the desired effect (although I'm not convinced that wasn't
a placebo). I felt more focused and, importantly, less prone to anxiety and
depression, without the unstable skittishness that, say, caffeine gives me.
(That said, it made my pee smell rather funky!) After researching as much as I
could, I felt the risk was acceptable. The only reason I didn't continue my
"experiment" was that it's a bit too expensive for the relatively mild
improvements. (e.g., A good holiday, as the article mentioned, has a similar
effect.) I considered trying to get it on prescription -- as it definitely
seemed to help with my anxiety -- but felt that, besides that being off-label
and therefore unlikely to be approved, it would be an somewhat unethical use
of NHS resources!

~~~
aantix
L-tyrosine may have a similar effect but cheaper. It certainly can replace the
daily cup of coffee for focus.

~~~
Xophmeister
I always suspected cheese was the answer

------
YuriNiyazov
L-theanine is #1 recommended by
[http://www.reddit.com/r/nootropics/faq](http://www.reddit.com/r/nootropics/faq)

~~~
blackobelisk
Worth mentioning but hardly comparable to Provigil

~~~
nkozyra
Not even the same ballpark.

L-theanine is meant as an addition to high levels of caffeine to reduce the
negative effects of caffeine.

------
graupel
On so many levels I am so tempted to try this, but I just can't bring myself
to - but I am in constant envy of co-workers who 'juice' and watch their
productivity soar.

~~~
Havoc
What exactly do you mean by juice? I'm guessing not the fruit/Veg kind...

~~~
raphael_l
"Juice" or "being juiced" is a pretty common term for any kind of steroids or
performance enhancing substances.

See for example:
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juiced:_Wild_Times,_Rampant_%27...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juiced:_Wild_Times,_Rampant_%27Roids,_Smash_Hits_%26_How_Baseball_Got_Big)

------
dogma1138
These things make me wonder how soon until all of our life will be based on
medicated states. Take a smart pill for work, and a fun pill for the pub...
While Modafinil and similar "smart drugs" currently don't actually improve
cognitive functions all that much and are most like a nanny for your brain
telling you to stop watching cat videos and work what happens when a smart
drug will actually hit the market? It only takes a tiny fraction of the
workforce to be taking those to create an avalanche. If true smart pill will
hit the market that say increases your cognitive function and concentration
and straps say another 50 or 100 IQ points (i know it's a bad measurement unit
for this but i don't have a better one) on you then even a single average guy
in your workplace is enough to trigger this. This is the same reason why we do
not allow performance increasing drugs in (most) sports, it's not because it's
unsportsmanlike or because they are scared people will stop watching, it's
because even a single athlete on those forces everyone else to take them just
to even out the playing field.

~~~
FidesFacitFidem
More of a side note; your comment sounds a little naive regarding PEDs in
sports. The idea that you can compete at the highest level and be drug free is
practically a myth. Anti doping in sports is laughable and anyone with a
intermediate knowledge on the subject could pass an olympic level drugs test.
Plain and simple, when there's vast sums of money and fame involved people
will cheat. (Whether it be an athlete taking PEDs or a banker insider trading)

~~~
dogma1138
I know that and you can see it in Olympic sports every time they introduce
some new drug testing method all the results go down a notch or 2. On that
level it's more about who has better technology and scientists than who has
better genes and works harder. But it doesn't mean we want this attitude
proliferating to the work force, no one should be forced to become a hyper
focused drone so he could code better to get a job, and if things continue
this way it might as well happen.

------
matznerd
Modafinil has actually been shown to have negative effects in high performers.
It is a wakefulness agent that promotes alertness and not necessary memory
formation. For the ladies out there regarding modafinil, provigil, and
adrafinil (an upstream analogue that requires no prescription in the us) watch
out as it can interfere with birth control.

I think what most healthy individuals looking into substances like this
actually want, are nootropics. I want to draw a line here between cognitive
enhancers and nootropics though. All nootropics are cognitive enhancers, but
not all cognitive enhancers are nootropics. Nootropics have to enhance
learning and memory, while being extremely safe and actually neuroprotective
(from the disruption of memory formation from chemical and physical damage).
Nootropics are generally safe and beneficial for everyday use and with the
racetams, Rhett actually have a better effect overtime.

------
mikerichards
So what's the modus operandi when going to the doctor? I've got some
legitimate symptoms - lack of energy, focus..especially in the afternoon, but
I'm wondering what people are saying to their doctors? Are you suggesting
Modafinil?

Also, what's the cost for a monthly supply with insurance?

~~~
bjwbell
A nap in the afternoon might be as helpful. I found taking an hour nap or hour
run after lunch helps with my focus/drive. Lifestyle changes shouldn't be
downplayed.

~~~
mikerichards
Unfortunately or fortunately, I don't live in Spain so that's not an option ;)

------
peteretep
I have a prescription for Provigil for jetlag, but like the author, I'd found
non-prescription channels for it before.

I've found it excellent for combatting tiredness, and it can improve my focus,
but nothing like the Limitless-esque drug the author talks about. Admittedly
I've only taken 100mg at a time, but still - about 5 hours after I take it, I
tend to become cranky. I get obsessive about things, rather than focus, and if
my obsession falls on the wrong thing, I find myself having wasted 6 hours on
writing up or investigating some hare-brained business scheme, rather than my
work.

I have easy, legal access to it, and I only take it these days if my sleep is
majorly disrupted. If I was getting the benefits the author was, I'd take it
every day.

------
teddyh
The story tells of how some guy took some drug and apparently had positive
effects. How does this anecdote affect me? Any medication _I_ use should be
tested in clinical trials and be prescribed to me personally, _or_ be deemed
safe for sale over the counter; i.e. non-prescribed use. Are other people
using these anecdotes as sufficient reasons to actually take random drugs? I
have to ask: Are these people _insane_?

If you have “ _an Everest of work_ ”, the solution is to _get less work_ , not
to take drugs. Be the person you are.¹

① (Not applicable to actually prescribed medication or care from a licenced
professional.)

~~~
wpietri
Does your doctor prescribe your caffeine and alcohol? How about your
artificial light and your exercise? Or perhaps your intake of B-complex
vitamins or various edible oils? The various natural dietary supplements
available at every Walgreens and CVS? All of these have known effects on mood
and productivity, and pretty much everybody just tries 'em and sees what
happens.

Nearly as many people have the experience of going to a doctor, getting
diagnosed with something moderately uncommon, and going through a trial-and-
error treatment process where they are guiding what happens as much or more
than the doctor.

So no, they are not necessarily insane. What is covered by prescription varies
a lot from country to country, and the line is at least as much about medical
economics as it is about safety. There are plenty of things that aren't
available over the counter not because they're more dangerous, but because
they were discovered after the FDA was created and because the financial
incentives are to keep them as prescription drugs.

~~~
teddyh
> _Does your doctor prescribe your caffeine and alcohol?_

Strawman. I _said_ “ _or_ be deemed safe for sale over the counter”.

> _many people have the experience of going to a doctor, getting diagnosed
> with something moderately uncommon, and going through a trial-and-error
> treatment process where they are guiding what happens as much or more than
> the doctor._

The key word here are, I think, “ _going to a doctor_ ”, as opposed to
unsupervised self-medicating, or at least without supervision of a trained and
licenced professional.

> _What is covered by prescription varies a lot from country to country_ […]

Yes; see my other comment.
([https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8869314](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8869314))

~~~
wpietri
That is not a straw man. My point is that the distinction between "thing I am
doing to my body alone" and "thing I am doing to my body with the involvement
of a licensed professional" is somewhat arbitrary.

Alcohol is not in fact safe for sale over the counter. But still, we sell it
over the counter. Having a licensed professional involved on average makes
some things better, but only on average, and only for some things. You don't
have to be insane to say, "For X, I know better than my doctor." Indeed,
that's an important component of people getting optimal treatment outcomes,
doctor or no.

~~~
teddyh
> _My point is that the distinction between "thing I am doing to my body
> alone" and "thing I am doing to my body with the involvement of a licensed
> professional" is somewhat arbitrary._

Then you should have made that point explicitly. Instead, it looks like you
are arguing against something I did not write.

And yes, the line is very arbitrary. However, that doesn’t mean that it does
not exist, or that you are free to set it anywhere you feel like without worry
or care. Unless you have the enormous resources to research on your own (but
you don’t, nobody does), you should pick some other party which _has_ done so
(scientifically) and has subsequently set the line somewhere. And unless you
have reason to doubt their veracity, you should adhere to that line. No, “ _I
feel like it, it could be fun_ ” or “ _I could make more money by using these
performance-enhancing drugs_ ” are not good enough reasons.

~~~
wpietri
The point was made by the comment taken together. But I did make that point
explicitly in the last paragraph. That you took the first sentence as if it
were a standalone argument is not something for which I feel responsible.

> that doesn’t mean that it does not exist, or that you are free to set it
> anywhere you feel like without worry or care

Speaking of arguing against something I didn't write...

~~~
teddyh
I still have trouble seeing it – it still looks very much like a classic
strawman attack to me. I’ll believe you when you say that this is not what you
intended, and that this is not what you see when you read it, but it is not
what I saw or see. I think we can respectfully agree to disagree here.

> > […] _that you are free to set it anywhere you feel like_ […]

I didn’t really mean you personally; I probably should have written “one”
instead of “you”. The reason I didn’t is that it flows much worse, and “you”
is also often used in that sense.

------
fezz
Modafinil is fantastic if you want to super-procrastinate on steroids. Rabbit
holes go on forever.

You have to have tasks all lined up and the interwebs unplugged (selfcontrol
doesn't help if you know how to disable it)

~~~
Implicated
> You have to have tasks all lined up

I rarely see this mentioned, but I cannot agree more. In my experience with
Modafinil, if I had tasks lined up before the effects took hold, I was golden
and would obliterate that to-do list/etc. But if I were left with 'nothing to
do', it was just like you described...the rabbit hole just got deeper.

So many people have had wildly different experiences with modaf (as with any
drug really)...for me it's biggest positive was that context switching,
mentally, became nearly 'free'. Generally my biggest hurdle in completing
tasks through the day is when I finish with one task in one context and am
tasked with unloading all of that information and jumping into something
new...this is where I procrastinate, or generally just struggle with
maintaining pace. While taking modafinil that penalty was seemingly non-
existent. I was able to bounce from problem to problem, project to project
with no mental penalty or friction. Quite amazing really.

Though I generally just don't find the sensation while taking them enjoyable
or even worth it in many cases...increased heart rate makes me and my hands
sweat (and smell), tight jaw and general inability to just 'relax'. I bought
60 nearly two years ago and have taken maybe 10 of them. I'm also a contractor
who doesn't work under any or much stress/pressure, which may have something
to do with my apathy towards their positive effects.

To each their own, I can absolutely see how this drug has and can change
people's lives.

------
orasis
In the past I mostly used modafinil for driving long distances, which it was
exceptional for. Now, I simply sip Yerba Mate the whole time and get a very
similar effect.

~~~
Shengbo
I can definitely recommend yerba mate to anyone trying to stop drinking coffee
or just people in need of a longer lasting stimulant with no crash afterwards.

------
duckingtest
I would describe modafinil as an internal task-switcher disabler. For this
reason, I don't use it often. For example, if I accidentally start reading
reddit, on modafinil this will probably end in writing long, thoughtful
comments for the whole day. The thought of stopping simply doesn't occur. My
stomach will rumble, but I won't feel hunger. Conversely, changing tasks in
response to external input becomes much easier.

This uncontrollable concentration applies to all levels on all tasks, which is
why modafinil kills creativity, at least for me. If I have lot of grunt job
that doesn't require creativity, sure, modafinil will make me plow through it.
However, in today's world valuable grunt work is rare, so it's not that
useful. It kills task-related mind wandering, it kills daydreaming, it kills
original thought. Sort of a zombie state really.

Constant use would probably make me a top burger-flipper at McDonald's or
similar, but that's it.

Another very big cons is its long half-life, which eventually results in sleep
deprivation. Sleep at normal hours becomes next to impossible.

Good for emergency situations when I have to be able to function despite
severe sleep deprivation (like not sleeping for one or two nights).

~~~
visakanv
> The thought of stopping simply doesn't occur. My stomach will rumble, but I
> won't feel hunger. Conversely, changing tasks in response to external input
> becomes much easier.

This sounds like my daily life, actually. (I'm pretty sure I have ADHD). I've
tried modafinil a couple of times, and interestingly, I have the opposite
reaction- I find that it makes me quicker on my feet, more 'on edge'. I
respond and react to things faster.

Interesting.

------
nashequilibrium
1) Well, its in vogue [http://www.vogue.com/946795/provigil-adderall-silicon-
valley...](http://www.vogue.com/946795/provigil-adderall-silicon-valley/)

2) Arrington also has an article on it [http://techcrunch.com/2008/07/15/how-
many-of-our-startup-exe...](http://techcrunch.com/2008/07/15/how-many-of-our-
startup-executives-are-hopped-up-on-provigil/)

------
josephpmay
As someone with ADHD who takes Ritilin, this seemed interesting to me as a
non-stimulant alternative. However, it appears that Modafinil is a "pro-
histamine" which would mean that it could aggregate allergy symptoms. I wonder
if anyone has ever studied the correlation between anti-histamine use and the
development of ADHD.

~~~
silencio
You should ask your doctor about Intuniv. It's a non-stimulant option only
approved for ADHD in children in the US right now, but my psychiatrist has
been using it off-label with adults pretty successfully.

In my experience, I've found it to be a very pleasing but subtle option, and
when taken with stimulants, reduced some of the unwanted side effects I
experienced. The only negative side effect I had from Intuniv was noticeable
hypotension, but since I didn't experience much ADHD-related change between
doses, I probably could have stepped down to a lower dosage to combat that. I
only stopped because I was trying to get pregnant, and once it's okay again,
I'll start back on Intuniv most likely :)

There's also Strattera, though I have no personal experience with that.

------
MattWilliams456
Very provoking article. A little correction though, although Sartre found
inspiration for his writing from his mescaline experiences (especially for
Nausea) he did not write on mescaline, he rather preferred amphetamines. On
the same note the lobsters only(!) stayed with him a few years not for the
rest of his life.

------
heyutoo
For mild depression, anxiety and ADHD, I've been using an all natural vitamin
supplement called EMPowerPlus from Truehope for the last three months. I've
noticed mild improvement in my mood. I've been on anti-depressants before that
didn't work.

Last week I went off of it for two weeks just to see if I could discern any
difference. I felt my mild depression return and I couldn't lift myself out.
With the supplement, I can.

Very expensive, but I'm going to keep using it as I feel the results are worth
it. Their website cites published clinical studies to it's efficacy.

Disclaimer: I have no relationship with the company other than being a
customer and I don't derive any direct or indirect benefits from sales of
their products. Just sharing this in case it helps someone and to see if
anyone else has experience with their products.

~~~
heyutoo
I've been mostly a lurker here on HN for the past few years, and haven't made
many comments.

So for the sake of my learning curve, can anyone clue me in to the reasons for
down votes? I don't take them personally. Just curious and wanting to learn.
Is it because the comment seems spammy? Or is it off topic? Sloppy writing?

~~~
Robin_Message
I didn't downvote, but: it seemed alightly off-topic; also it's in the worst
possible range of anecdote/bad science (N=1, no blinding, it's a vitamin
supplement so I suspect it contains no active ingredients anyway, you claim
anti-depressants don't work on you†).

gwern's articles on how they try out drugs is very good at explaining how to
do blinding etc. and is actually credible. Do something like that and you'll
definitely get upvotes.

† No judgement here, but the burden of proof is quite high when you're
claiming a properly tested medicine doesn't work and a supplement does.

~~~
heyutoo
Thanks for the feedback.

Really my purpose in the comment wasn't to convince anyone they should take
this. My intention can be summed up by "Hey, I tried this and it seems to work
for me and is safe; it's just vitamins. If it piques your interest, do your
own research on it and decide whether you want to try it"

------
pmoriarty
The wikipedia article on Provigil[1] mentions toxic epidermal necrolysis[2]
and Stevens-Johnson syndrome[3] as possible side effects. That's enough to
scare me off trying this particular drug.

[1] -
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Provigil](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Provigil)

[2] -
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toxic_epidermal_necrolysis](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toxic_epidermal_necrolysis)

[3] - [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stevens-
Johnson_syndrome](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stevens-Johnson_syndrome)

~~~
awalton
This was found as a part of an ADHD study of close to a thousand young
children, in which one kid _may_ have had SJS, and another kid had a non-
serious suspicious rash, and that was enough to kill the whole study with no
such repeat studies being done since.

So yeah, 1/1000 chance going by that study alone, which doesn't say much since
the drug has been prescribed millions of times in the US and abroad with no
significant mention of SJS outside of the study. In short, it's just ass-
covering medical paranoia.

What has been shown is that modifinil can mess with liver enzymes over time,
and that should be scary enough to tell people not to use the drug long-term.

My own experience with the drug is pretty similar to the article's, but
without the strange addition-like component this guy seemed to have. I was
able to quit cold turkey after a month without so much as an after thought,
and I still use it from time to time when my autoimmune disorder flairs up and
causes fatigue and brain fog that not even ten cups of coffee can cut through.

------
noname123
I tried Provigil two years ago and it came in powder format and I had to mix
it. It tasted bitter and had no pronounced effect me. I had better response to
coffee but then again they say placebo is hell of a drug.

~~~
ggreer
That doesn't sound like modafinil at all. I've never heard of it being sold
outside of pill form. Typical dosage is 75-150mg, making a powder easy to mis-
dose. Although overdosing on modafinil isn't possible, too much would result
in unpleasant side-effects: stomach pains, headache, nausea, insomnia, etc.

Also, the effects of modafinil are obvious. In addition to being coffee++, the
metabolites make your urine and sweat smell weird. If someone says modafinil
didn't work on them, it's probably because they ordered it illicitly and got
counterfeit drugs.

Are you perhaps thinking of a different nootropic? From your description,
piracetam seems much more likely. It typically comes in powder form, and its
effects can be charitably described as subtle.

Side note: If you're interested in nootropics and modafinil, I highly
recommend gwern's articles on the subjects[1][2].

1\. [http://www.gwern.net/Modafinil](http://www.gwern.net/Modafinil)

2\. [http://www.gwern.net/Nootropics](http://www.gwern.net/Nootropics)

~~~
gwern
> I've never heard of it being sold outside of pill form.

Powder is not unheard of: Air Sealed use to sell modafinil powder sourced from
Sun, which was apparently legitimate and quite competitive on a per mg basis.

But as far as I know, they were the only powder source and they shut down
quite a while ago (maybe 2011? I'd have to check my price-tables to see when I
dropped them), and only in the past few months have any new powder vendors
showed up (on the blackmarkets). So unless one of us is considerably off on
dates or my knowledge of modafinil sellers is less complete than I thought,
I'm not sure where noname123 could've gotten modafinil powder.

------
throwaway01010
I took dexedrine from middle school through college and my early work years.
Once I learned how to use it (which took a long time), it was an incredibly
fun drug that I could also use very effectively.

But I felt like it stole time from me, I could be productive and happy all
week on it, and then I'd be depressed and tired all weekend as a I took a drug
holiday. It was worth it to me when I was younger, but now that I have kids, I
can't trade time like that.

------
throwaway86809
You know what the worst thing is? I'm depressed, on antidepressants, can't
sleep, can't concentrate, always tired, unproductive, unfocused. I fall asleep
in meetings. I am not quite the target audience for this drug (I'm not
actually narcoleptic) but I'm pretty darn close.

And, as far as I can tell, it doesn't work on me. Ordered some from an online
pharmacy, took it for ten days straight... no detectable change.

:(

~~~
ridgeguy
I strongly recommend you get a prescription to try known real modafinil. You
simply cannot trust online Rx unless you have HPLC/NMR analysis capabilities
at your disposal.

------
fenaer
It's apparently also been shown to have positive effect on depression, when
taken with anti-depressants[1]. That alone makes it very attractive to me. Who
knows, maybe I'll try it some day if it gets proven safe but I can't bring my
self too at the moment.

[1]
[http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17729016](http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17729016)

------
t__r
I tried Modafinil (provigil). Its effect was mild at best, and it was hard to
determine whether this was a placebo effect or not. Ritalin, on the other
hand, was very effective, but it gives a bit of a cocaine-like high, which
scared me enough not to use it for more than a week. Luckily that was enough
to get me through that seemingly insurmountable pile of work I had to do.

~~~
throwaway3173
How much did you take?

------
hippich
I tried some indian knock-off in 2009 and some piracetam manufactured locally
(in Belarus,) none had any effect on me. I wonder if indian knock-off wasn't
modafinil at all. I had no any side effects even after bumping to 500mg. I
wonder if these drugs have selective effectiveness?

------
quotemstr
If you think Modafinil and Provigil are controversial today, wait until we
have genome-editing techniques for increasing intelligence. Transhumanism is
inevitable. I really do not understand the opposition to allowing individuals
to increase their intelligence.

~~~
throwaway3173
I don't think there's an opposition to it. People just don't want to shoot
themselves in the foot by gambling on Modafinil having no long term effects.

~~~
wyager
>I don't think there's an opposition to it.

There is _definitely_ opposition. It's mostly on religious grounds, a la "My
beliefs dictate that I should prevent _you_ from 'playing god', because that
privelege is reserved for my deit(y|ies).".

~~~
spydum
I bet they all consume copious amounts of coffee while saying it.

~~~
tacotime
Don't forget alcohol! Watching people climb up on a pedestal and try and tell
me that alcohol is somehow not a drug makes my blood boil every damn time I
hear it. I think it's hard to correct these people's thinking because our
society drills the very phrase "drugs AND alcohol" into children's brains from
a very early age including in the DARE programs in our schools. Somehow
everyone is okay with casual abuse of alcohol because they don't think of it
as a drug. "What else can you take into your body that fucks you up like
alcohol does, but is not a drug?" is the retort I've been using in recent
years.

------
TheGrassyKnoll
I can only compare this to my coffee habit. I _have_ to have it. No project,
especially a physical one, can start without it.

But, gotta be careful with stuff like this. It sounds great, but is it really
gonna be you who controls the drug ?

Maybe, but it might not always work out that way...

------
fr0ggerrr
The U.S. gives it to fighter jet pilots often, to make sure they stay awake.

------
rewqfdsa
Where can I buy Modafinil?

------
a-b
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modafinil#Adverse_effects](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modafinil#Adverse_effects)

------
amelius
I'm just wondering how people can order this stuff over the internet and
expect it to be the genuine thing...

It just sounds extremely incautious to me.

~~~
duckingtest
It sells in India for about one eighth of online's price. The price of ten
200mg Modalert pills is about $2.5. Counterfeiting simply doesn't pay, as it
would kill any return business for minuscule one-time gain.

------
jonnathanson
Worth reading:

[http://www.gwern.net/Modafinil](http://www.gwern.net/Modafinil)

------
blackobelisk
Sounds to me like a guy who's never taken adderall before

~~~
AnthonBerg
The effect is actually quite different. Much more subtle and therefore more
effective in a way - less intrusive. It's very much a _drug_ , though.

------
sparkzilla
Not so smart: getting busted for plagiarism:
[http://www.theguardian.com/media/2012/jan/20/johann-hari-
qui...](http://www.theguardian.com/media/2012/jan/20/johann-hari-quits-the-
independent)

~~~
dominotw
How is this related to the original article? Are you saying he might be lying
about his experiences ?

~~~
domdip
It's the same author. There's a pretty big overlap between plagiarists and
fabulists, so it's hard to put much stock into a subjective article like this.

~~~
james1071
Perhaps the drug made him a more prolific plagiarist.

