
Show HN: Eul – a lightweight desktop client for Skype, Slack, Gmail, and more - alex-e
https://eul.im
======
alex-e
Hi,

eul is a very lightweight and fast native desktop client for Skype, Slack,
Gmail, VK, FB, Jabber, Telegram, and Signal. Right now only the first four are
supported, and the rest should be done by the end of August.

Why did I create this? To solve two big problems I see with the current IM
solutions: there are too many of them, and the clients are ridiculously
bloated for what they are built to do. For example, everyone knows what a huge
resource hog the Skype client is. Even the Telegram client, which is supposed
to be lightweight, is using 1.3 GB of RAM on my desktop right now.

I'm obsessed with performance. The entire application is about 4 MB, and it's
never going to be more than 10 MB. In fact there are still many things to
optimize. It's native, so you don't need to download a 100 MB browser just to
use your IM client.

eul can display thousands of messages in one conversation without the constant
page fetching. The scrolling is instant and smooth. You can jump to any
message without waiting. I've tested it with 50 000 messages in one chat. No
lags, instant scrolling to any point, instant search. That should be enough
for most :)

This is a very early alpha release. A lot of essential features are still
missing (for example, images and other attachments are not supported yet).
Automatic updates will be released every day. There's a built in contact form,
please use it to submit bugs and suggestions.

Looking forward to hearing your feedback :)

Thanks

~~~
Veratyr
Three things:

\- THANK YOU! It's near impossible to find a client that isn't either run in a
console (admittedly not the worst problem) or horribly bloated (what the hell
are people thinking when the bundle a browser to show a single page!?).

\- What do you think of adding Matrix
([https://matrix.org](https://matrix.org))? The protocol is HTTP + JSON based
and well documented.

\- Have you thought about open sourcing? My guess is either you want to sell
this eventually or your coding standards are quite high and you doubt people
can contribute too much while meeting them. In the case of the latter, I'd
still like for it to be around, even if your standards for PRs would be too
high for me to meet.

~~~
ptman
I have to agree about matrix. In fact I think at this point effort should be
focused on bridging protocols to matrix instead of each different client
implementing support for protocols by themselves. Then the client can only
implement matrix support.

~~~
ge0rg
Protocol bridges always only provide a subset of the original functionality,
mostly because it's impossible to fully map one protocol to another.

Of course, the same problem can happen for a multi protocol client as well,
but at least it's not inherently impossible to solve it there.

------
danpalmer
Initial thoughts:

\- This is a native application, but does not use any native controls, so
currently lacks text selection or navigation, tab to change input focus, or
anything else you'd expect from a native application (apart from speed). One
of the things that bothers me most about the Slack application is it's lack of
interoperability with macOS, for example in drag and drop - this application
does not appear to be targeting that interoperability either.

\- Slack authentication doesn't appear to be working at the moment - it
directs me to my browser to authenticate, but after doing that I'm left in the
Slack web-app, not redirected back to the application.

~~~
alex-e
You are right. You can't even copy text right now. These little UI things will
gradually be implemented very soon.

Are you a member of multiple Slack orgs?

------
saagarjha
Looks really cool! Just a couple of questions:

1\. Are you planning to release this as open source? I really want this to
have a native Cocoa interface on macOS.

2\. When you say Gmail, do you mean email or Hangouts?

3\. Where are you getting these APIs from?

------
usharf
Is it possible to fix the scale factor for Linux desktop hidpi display? It
doesn't seem to pickup system global setting for the display. Does it use GTK
on Linux or what is it using otherwise?

~~~
alex-e
Yes, this will be fixed asap. I was testing the Linux build in a VM that
doesn't support hidpi, sorry about that.

~~~
usharf
Great!

------
mrmondo
Hey - I wanted to give you a BIG thank you for creating a native / non-
JavaScript client for this, JavaScript (no matter the framework) has been the
death of me and my peers with regards to desktop ‘apps’ for the last few years
and it’s so damn good to see someone stop, think and give a $#!+ about
performance. I’ll add that the last thing I (and I’ve heard my team say the
same) want is another app that has to run in a web browser.

When I get to work tomorrow I’ll be trying this out (knowing it’s in beta) for
XMPP / Jabber, if it doesn’t already support OTR encryption - that’d be a
killer feature. A big problem I see is that a lot of places want to or do run
internal XMPP/Jabber because they have engineers working that don’t want to /
can’t run ‘enterprise’ rubbish like Skype or those of us that are sick of
JavaScript heavy SaaS apps like slack - but then you’ll have a few managers or
project managers that still run Windows likely for excel or out of habit
etc... and they have to use Pidgin - which while it works across a lot of IM
systems - is very awkward and ugly as anything, so it gives the better
protocols a bad name, on Mac there’s Adium which is a pretty decent multi-IM
client but has stagnated somewhat. So a clean, easy to use, stable and well
performing chat client that supports XMPP/Jabber with MUC and OTR would be an
absolute killer.

~~~
jbg_
There is no mention of this supporting XMPP, but I use profanity for XMPP, and
love it. The fact that it's a console application may or may not suit your
tastes, of course.

~~~
alex-e
There is! Jabber == XMPP :) It will be supported very soon.

~~~
jbg_
Somehow I missed the mention of Jabber, but I think I was only looking at the
list of protocols that are already supported.

------
artworx
Windows Defender detects it as Win32/Lineage password stealer :(

~~~
edp
Even without defender activated, the fact that the binary is not signed is
triggering windows 10 security. Not an issue for me but you might want to sign
the binary to avoid this.

~~~
alex-e
Yes, that's a very important point. I'll update the website to notify the user
about the unsigned binary issue.

I can't sign them at this point, but I will apply as soon as possible.

Right now macOS and Windows 10 complain about an unreliable executable (as
they should).

------
ivcha
I appreciate all these new clients with some interesting twists, but I would
appreciate more if people spent at least a relatively small portion of their
time contributing to existing (very good and solid) messengers like Pidgin,
instead of re-inventing the wheel. Every now and then, someone hacks a new
client, which begs the question about the value of that effort.

------
ishu3101
How is this different from Franz -
[http://meetfranz.com](http://meetfranz.com) or Manageyum -
[https://manageyum.com/](https://manageyum.com/)

What technology & frameworks are used to create Eul?

Does Eul support being able to use multiple accounts of Telegram, Gmail, Skype
etc?

~~~
alex-e
These are basically browsers with multiple tabs open.

Eul is a native desktop app built in Go. It has all your contacts in one
place, it's much faster, and it uses an order of magnitude fewer resources.

Very good question about multiple accounts. Not right now, but it will be
implemented very soon. This is going to be another unique advantage.

~~~
samueldavid
What did you use to make the GUI using Go?

~~~
alex-e
I'm drawing it with OpenGL :)

~~~
hexmiles
cool!

i wanted to do something like that, di you use something like nanovg o is from
scratch?

have you considered doing a small tutorial/blog series, to explain how to do
somethign similar or can you raccomend a resource to learning?

~~~
alex-e
From scratch, I was inspired by gxui.

It's very basic right now (you can't even move a cursor with the mouse).

I will definitely write a couple of posts about this!

~~~
samueldavid
amazing, i always wondered why people don't create more GUI stuff with Go, the
performance of Go is pretty nice and a lot of good multi platform desktop apps
could be build using it, keep up the good work!

------
gtf21
This looks great - the Slack app is a massive PITA because it's so slow. The
only thing stopping me junking Franz for this is that Franz has whatsapp
(which you probably can't integrate into Eul anyway because it has to be the
web client).

~~~
alex-e
WhatsApp is very tricky, but not impossible.

~~~
gtf21
I thought it had to be via WhatsApp web, no?

~~~
mikkelam
Well there is
[https://github.com/tgalal/yowsup/](https://github.com/tgalal/yowsup/)

but i would not recommend using it

------
rijoja
I find this interesting, as I've been toying with similar ideas in head. In
particular the messenger / facebook side of things is of great value to me.
However implementing and more importantly maintaining support for this
protocol seems like something which will require a vast amount of time and
work. Could you briefly describe the status of this support and what hurdles
there are to overcome. Messenger used to be XMPP right, I remember and miss
the time when you could use pidgin to access this particular service!

------
acmecorps
THANK YOU FOR THIS!

My company uses Slack, and I _hate_ the iOS app, Windows app and the Linux
app. It's bloated and slow!

I paid for the Mailbird app, and I'd pay for a fast and efficient Slack app
too.

------
TheWiseOne
Is this just for IM (as in messages only) or does it also support audio/video
calls (at least for Skype)?

~~~
alex-e
Unfortunately right now it's IM only. I'm almost certain it's not possible to
implement Skype audio calls, but I'll look into that.

------
mikhailt
Please do consider paid version and/or donations to sustain the development.
I'd pay for a fast native app for Slack and others but I also know these
services would change over time and it would be nice to get updates.

~~~
alex-e
How much would you personally be willing to pay?

------
xur17
I've been getting frustrated with Slack for a while now, so thank you!

I'm running into some issues on my Linux machine with the login experience - I
sent you an email with more details.

~~~
alex-e
Thanks for reporting. I haven't received anything from you yet. The e-mail is
support@eul.im

 _edit_

Ah! I see it now. Went into spam for some reason.

------
i-j
'Great job' or should one say thank you for the trojan?

Trojan:Win32/Spursint.F!cl

:(

~~~
alex-e
Yeah, I know about this. The fix will be live soon. It's not a virus, nothing
is being sent anywhere. It's just poor implementation from my part.

------
urlwolf
Hmm, doesn't seem to log into slack. Linux version, FF as default browser. It
takes me into the web app of slack but eul stays empty.

------
deckiedan
Wow, awesome. Will you add IRC?

~~~
alex-e
I was considering adding IRC but I thought that almost no one uses it these
days (sadly!)

Ideally yes, I'd like to implement it. It's a stable protocol that's not going
to change, so there's not much cost in maintaining it.

What are you using IRC for?

~~~
Sammi
There already exist tons of high quality irc clients, so there's no reason for
irc support to be high priority. I see eul's reason to exist to be more to
alleviate the weight of having several low quality messaging apps open at the
same time.

~~~
alex-e
You are right. On the other hand it would be nice to have all protocols
supported in one app, so one day IRC support will definitely be there.

------
marczellm
Is that Gmail (as in email) or Hangouts? Is there Hangouts support?

~~~
alex-e
No, Hangouts is pretty much dead. It's email. You can add your gmail contacts,
and communicate with them through a chat-like interface.

------
allan_s
I'm wondering, what library do you use for skype ?

------
andrewjw
Would it be possible for you to upload this to the AUR?

------
relaxitup
When will the Windows build be available again?

~~~
alex-e
In about 6 hours.

------
methyl
Any chance to make it work on OSX 10.11?

------
omarchowdhury
How can I be 100% sure of security?

~~~
alex-e
I am most likely going to open source it, so you will be able to build your
own version and control everything.

For now I guess you can only monitor the traffic with a tool like WireShark
and see for yourself that eul only fetches current version for the autoupdates
and submits error reports.

------
fiatjaf
Slack, Skype and Gmail? What else?

~~~
alex-e
VK, FB, Jabber, Telegram, and Signal.

After that Viber and Discord most likely.

~~~
bakoo
... and Mattermost, please? :)

~~~
alex-e
Mattermost is the open source Slack alternative, right? I haven't considered
these smaller projects yet, because there are a lot of them. Implementing new
protocols takes time.

There are still a lot of crucial features I need to implement, but after eul
is out of beta, Mattermost support should be there.

~~~
Corrado
I understand it's early in the project and you are still nailing things down,
but please consider open sourcing your project. Not being able to support
things like smaller protocols (Spark, MS Teams, etc.) and legacy platforms
(IRC) go away when others have the ability to contribute. Don't get me wrong,
nothing comes for free and managing contributors is often times very
difficult. Regardless, I think it's worth it. Plus, being able to see the
source and build it ourselves is very important for this type of security
sensitive project.

Thank you for your effort and I'm looking forward to using Eul quite a bit in
the future. :)

------
RaleyField
This is pretty stupid. Dev machines come with at least 8 gb or ram, why would
anyone run a closed source software to save a hundred megabytes and risk
compromising their machine. Meanwhile the account is 1 day old and the exe is
being flagged by antiviruses.

~~~
lurker-
What a ridiculous comment.. I can assure you that the majority of the
developers do not own a 8GB dev machine, and surely you can see why this
application would be valuable for the average user chatting with their friends
on Skype/whatever on their 2GB, i3 laptop (assuming they're lucky enough to be
able to afford such a device).

I have browsed Show HN every day for over a year now, and I can't think of any
project that made me as excited as this (although
[https://github.com/google/xi-editor](https://github.com/google/xi-editor) and
[https://github.com/limetext](https://github.com/limetext) come close). I bet
that almost every Go developer on HN would love to read, study and learn from
his code, so how about we ask him nicely instead of attempting to attack his
credibility in hope of pressuring him into releasing his source code..

~~~
RaleyField
> attack his credibility

His credibility is already at 0, because he's an anon.

> in hope of pressuring him into releasing his source code..

Not my hope, I don't even install official slack client because I don't trust
it to be built by competent people (it's web app for me tyvm), my hope is that
everybody who installed this software formats their hard drives for the sake
of other people if not for themselves. How do you think things like this
[http://www.nbcnews.com/id/15316394/](http://www.nbcnews.com/id/15316394/)
happen?

EDIT:

> I can assure you

How? In a cursory attempt I couldn't find any meaningful statistics, but that
wasn't my impression when reading topics like this
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13038114](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13038114).

Also, 5 hour old account. Weird. Don't install warez people.

