
How Weight Training Might Change the Brain - pseudolus
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/07/24/well/move/how-weight-training-changes-the-brain.html
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dirtyid
Serious lifting or athletics in general necessitates cultivating competent
time management, planning skills and self control/discipline. Even more so if
you roll into dieting for maintaining weight class or generally aesthetics.
Once a lifter exhaust all novice and easy gains which doesn't take long, it's
down to planning multi week/month long meso cycles, trouble shooting and
learning about about your body, refraining from immediate gratification - i.e.
goal setting, developing weaknesses, fatigue management - just generally
embracing slow and steady progress. It's one of the few hobbies that can't be
rushed.

That said, most people never get this serious and conscientiousness is what
separates a long lifting career and snapcity (injury). A whole heap of
genetics as well, since people who are genetically gifted at lifting tend to
self select for staying in the hobby. Instagram culture also doesn't help if
your psychologically prone to social comparison. Finally if you progress far
enough, there the cost-benefit ratio shifts from health to strength, from
experience, some sort of injury is almost guaranteed. It's really one of those
things that should be embraced in moderation for the general population.
Moderation is really all you need, people only need to develop some function
strength and musculature for health benefits. You don't need to deadlift 600
pounds to inoculate your hips from shattering after a fall, indeed the road to
600+ will probably messy you up in the first place.

~~~
leet_thow
On the social comparison note, I don't regret 8 years of constant training in
the least, however I do suspect that if you do add a lot of musculature to a
tall frame it can be a bit intimidating in engineering cultures where most men
are out of shape and view the activity as "meatheadish."

~~~
dirtyid
That comment is more directed towards the increase in eating disorders, body
dysmorphia and negative thinking when comparing progress online. Particularly
in men. 5 years ago, 5plate is a solid deadlift, now junior women are pulling
that. And it's causing very brittle minded people grief and others to push too
hard ruinously when it's clearly not in their cards. Not to mention predatory
fake natties schilling nutrition supplements, photoshopped photos etc etc. The
gap between the average joe and top 0.01% is increasing as participation
increases. I'm sure expectations will normalize with time, but I've noticed a
distinct increase in unhappiness among people who spend too much time on
bodybuilding/powerlifting instagrams due to increasingly unrealistic
expectations. That's not unique to lifting culture overall, but it's a salient
development for a niche sport that rapidly gain popularity.

~~~
bartread
I'm not exactly sure what you mean by 5 plate, but if you're talking about 5 x
20kg plates on either end of an olympic bar (which is another 20kg), that's a
220kg/495lb deadlift and is still very much a solid deadlift.

For an 85kg man (average in UK is 83.6kg) that's as near as makes no odds 2.6x
body weight.

For a 70kg woman (average in UK in 70.2kg) it's more than 3x body weight.

Generally anything more than 2x body weight is considered a solid deadlift for
both men and women. Sure, not in powerlifting, but powerlifting is still
pretty niche even amongst people who lift regularly.

(For comparison, I weigh 97kg (14-15% body fat) and would be _over the moon_
with a 220kg deadlift. I'm heading in the right direction but a couple of
unrelated skiing injuries have prevented me from getting there... and of
course, I'm getting older, so who knows.)

EDIT: Corrected with ONS figures for average weights in UK.

~~~
dirtyid
~500lb is very much an aspiration life time goal for most trained men, even
revised army fitness standard full score doesn't ask for more than 340lbs.
Minimum is 140lbs. I think NASA / astronauts prescriptions is also a very low
sub bodyweight multiplier for reps to prevent atrophy AND MITIGATE INJURY RISK
in space which is key. That is probably what the general population should
shoot for.

On social media, the gold standard for bragging strong was 500 as little as 5
years ago, hence all the meme that 600 is the new 500 and now 700 is the new
500 everytime world records are pushed by elite athletes no one should be
comparing themselves to. But for some reason a lot of lifters tend to do this
even though very few people think if they train hard enough they can be faster
or comparable to Usain Bolt.

I think it's a unique development with the intersection of social media and
lifting culture. The bell curve for strength in the population hasn't changed,
but the top 0.01% are increasingly visible and it's causing a crisis in social
comparison that's not healthy. I don't know if it's a unique issue only for
people involved in niche powerlifitng/bodybuilding subcultures, I think it's
one of those situations where memes migrate up to general fitness/resistance
training enthusiasts and starts to affect casual viewers who like to compare.
There's also a fair amount of people who get into lifting due to self esteem
reasons.

~~~
saiya-jin
Hmm, maybe people doing lifting should focus less on some pathetic instagrams
and facebooks and more on real life, real people and real interactions

~~~
ip26
An unspoken truth about lifting, imo, is that a big chunk of the group is a
bit lonely & seeking social validation & attention. It's part of why they
lift.

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exabrial
Before I read the article, I don't want to be biased so I'll just comment
ahead of time... I want to note that a steady workout routine has helped me
_more than anything_ else to control emotional fatalism, anxiety, and
depression... and generally make me a more encouraging human being to be
around. It's just one data point among millions but for me it's solved a
myriad of issues.

~~~
exabrial
The article spoke specifically about cognition and not my experience
unfortunately. But it's interesting to note anyway that physical activity does
have a correlation if not a causation on mental capacity

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Kpourdeilami
for me personally the biggest benefit of weight training has been the
discipline it gives me. Once I stick to my gym plan, everything else in my day
falls to its place.

Knowing I have to be in the gym every other night from 10 to 11:30, gets me to
get my chores done quickly before 10 and not waste time on Reddit/Netflix all
night. I also listen to audio books between sets to make a better use of my
down time

For anyone looking to get started, I have been following a workout plan called
5x5 for a year and it’s been working all right for me. The idea is you do 5
sets of 5 reps of 5 different workouts and increase the weights you do by 5
pounds each workout

~~~
kasey_junk
Strong recommendation for the StrongLifts 5x5 iOS app. That said there are
some downsides to 5x5.

\- the lifts in it are simple, but also very easy to hurt yourself with if you
don’t have good form. Form work is not emphasized.

\- there is no flexibility work in it. It’s basically impossible to do
strength work without flexibility. To the point 5x5 should likely recommend
yoga as a central component or something.

\- while big muscle groups are very important, for lots of people isolated
muscle work is necessary to fix imbalances, old injuries, etc.

None of that should discourage people but realize that the sticker claims of
5x5 about time commitments and completeness aren’t really true.

~~~
vl
There are few things they don’t tell you about weightlifting:

\- stretching is critical and takes time, without stretching you’ll eventually
injure yourself.

\- eventually you’ll get some minor injury and will have to manage that and
wait for it to heal.

\- start by getting a coach to specifically learn good from and find your max
weights for different lifts. Strictly control trainer’s desire to add some
non-core exercises, once good form is established, dismiss the trainer.

~~~
dewote
Do you know of any recommended stretching routines?

~~~
vl
I just do stretches for the muscles I'm training.

This is good book:

[https://www.amazon.com/Stretching-Pocket-Book-Bob-
Anderson/d...](https://www.amazon.com/Stretching-Pocket-Book-Bob-
Anderson/dp/0936070641/)

This strap is really helpful:

[https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00065X222/](https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00065X222/)

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mevile
I recognize the value of these studies but I don't think they're worth the
pain and distress inflicted on these animals.

I can't put myself in the place of these researchers and see myself injecting
things that cause harm to the rats without feeling really shitty about the
situation. Are they just numb to what they're doing?

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m463
We've already figured out that aerobic exercise increases our cognitive
abilities

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aerobic_exercise#Neurobiologic...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aerobic_exercise#Neurobiological_effects)

Even though weight training isn't aerobic, couldn't it still increase our
state of fitness?

~~~
triceratops
> Even though weight training isn't aerobic

It's never been clear to me what "aerobic" really means. Heavy or many-repped
squat or deadlift sets will raise your heart rate plenty, and get you out of
breath.

~~~
ip26
It means that the majority of your energy is being provided by the aerobic
metabolic pathway. Raising your heart rate doesn't mean it's aerobic. There
will always be a contribution from the aerobic pathway, but if the
instantaneous demands are too high then anaerobic pathways provide most of the
power.

Intuitively, the pathway that's providing most of the power is the pathway
that gets the most training effect.

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rubicon33
Interesting to note, that it's theorized the brain actually developed because
of the need to control movement (muscles).

[https://www.ted.com/talks/daniel_wolpert_the_real_reason_for...](https://www.ted.com/talks/daniel_wolpert_the_real_reason_for_brains/transcript?language=en)

------
lyttlerock
Bit of a meta question: how applicable are findings in rats / mice to humans.
Does it differ based on the types of relationships the study is trying to
find?

I've always wondered this and have historically assumed the correlation must
be high - but never really dove too deep into it.

~~~
meow_mix
80% probability of failing in clinical trials (on humans)
[https://www.nature.com/news/preclinical-research-make-
mouse-...](https://www.nature.com/news/preclinical-research-make-mouse-
studies-work-1.14913)

~~~
keyle
Wow that's way higher than I expected. And it saddens me, all the tests we run
on these little beasts for such a small eventuality of success.

~~~
intuition
Animal studies are about models and proof of concept, not direct replication.
It’s silly to get hung up on that aspect.

Comparative Medicine is conducted with an awareness of the necessity for
additional translational research, and while pharmaceutical outcomes are
potentially total dead ends due to deeper biochemical pathway differences
(which are strongly rooted all the way down to genetic differences, even
across human subpopulations), one can easily get a sense of the value you of
animal studies via trauma and gross anatomical studies.

A surgeon won’t make the same cuts and blood vessel clamps in a porcine heart
transplant as with a human, but if you can transplant one pig’s heart into
another pig, human to human is next. Curveballs like blood transfusion (types
and factors) and immuno-suppression/rejection add overhead to making a
transplant work in humans, but the answers to the big questions all say it
will work.

So too with mice and rats and dogs and primates. To a degree behavioral
realities fit too, although humans have a far deeper grasp of abstract
concepts, so we’ll make leaps of cognition that render some animal models
invalid.

Humans and animals are both prone to compulsive behaviors, addiction, self
harm, but how we get there is often a little different since society and the
rule of law can lend layers of social padding that give us a second chance to
rescue ourselves before we violate norms and resort to pathological patterns.
So animal psychology compares along bolder, broader strokes and lines than
broken bones and wound care.

So 80% failure is just considering direct replication of practice, like a vet
going and doing the same thing to a person. Sometimes the vet can save the
day, but other times a human has a very different standard of care.

------
Hitton
>... weight training, accomplished in rodents with ladders and tiny, taped-on
weights...

This is awesome. How comes I'm hearing about that first time? And why are
there no videos?

~~~
jpindar
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4XBXUlvpeh4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4XBXUlvpeh4)

------
pagnol
Speaking of exercise, anyone want to go for a run together in Hong Kong?

~~~
woutr_be
I'm not into running anymore, mostly focussed on weight lifting, if you're on
HK island, go for a run on Bower Road, it's definitely an experience. I also
used to run in Happy Valley race course, it's nice and quiet there.

~~~
pagnol
Thanks for the recommendation, I’ll give it a try. I’ve been mostly running up
and down Quarry Bay Park, but it does get boring after a while and the
proximity to the highway probably isn’t too healthy either. I also love
cycling but in Hong Kong it seems too freaking dangerous for all sorts of
reasons.

~~~
woutr_be
You can do some cycling in Tai Po area, but down there, it's not the drivers
that make it dangerous, but other cyclists. They cycle like they walk, so be
prepared to be constantly cut off and have people stand in the middle of the
road.

If you're close to Quarry Bay, you might want to look into Tai Tam, it's a
nice nature park, there's several paths that you can take.

------
La-ang
Synopsis: Start training

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kgarten
in mice.

~~~
philmander
In rats

And it does change the brain in rats. It _might_ change the brain in humans.

