
Veterans want answers as new data shows rise in cancers over two decades of war - spking
https://www.mcclatchydc.com/news/nation-world/national/national-security/article236413328.html
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jalgos_eminator
I'm not sure about the increase since 2000 (could be better detection
methods), but the military is known to use a bunch of toxic chemicals. On the
motorcycle forums I frequent I have heard more than a few times about how "The
stuff we had when I was in the Army/Navy/AF would have cleaned this up in
seconds." And they were only talking about the degreasers and lubricants, not
the munitions or other chemicals that were hanging around the base.

Read about Agent Orange if you want to be pissed off for the rest of the day:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agent_Orange#U.S._veterans](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agent_Orange#U.S._veterans)

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scruple
I could write a novel about this. My father was exposed to and handled Agent
Orange in Vietnam. An uncle, as well. My uncle passed in 2007, riddled with
cancers, fighting the VA every step of the way. That man served nearly 35
years before retiring. Their generation coined the phrase "Delay, deny, and
hope that we die." due to their experiences with the VA.

I decided not to be a helpless by-stander when it was my fathers time to
contend with the VA. I took nearly 3 years off of my life and moved back home
to help him. He was eventually able to successfully obtain a disability rating
and was able to get prior/existing health issues linked to his exposure, which
secured disability back pay to the 90s. All of this, his experience and the
back pay, specifically, is something of an outlier, as we understand it. As we
understand it, most folks don't have the resources to navigate the system
successfully. It wasn't a massive financial windfall, but it meant that my
parents future was financially secure (their finances were in ruins by the
mid-00s) and once he was mobile again, with his health issues under control
and with an effective management plan in place, I was able to get back on with
my own life.

There are also inter-generational effects with Agent Orange, but they're not
very well understood (to my knowledge). That frightens me today, especially
now that I've had my own children. There's a whole other dynamic there, too,
in that I also served, and that I've been exposed to burn pits and a lot of
diesel fumes and high RF environments and some solvents and etc... I feel like
it's an inevitability in my own life's story that I'll eventually have to
contend with the VA, as well.

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linuxftw
Imagine the effect on the poor Vietnamese :(

My Grandfather was killed by the stuff too. He had a condition that wasn't one
of the conditions that the VA established as linked to it. I've found some
other cases online of other service members that had what he had. The other
game the VA plays is they'll dispute you were ever even exposed to it in the
first place.

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scruple
> Imagine the effect on the poor Vietnamese :(

I do, very frequently, in fact. I have many friends who are Vietnamese today
(I live in Orange County, CA), and they have many stories about extended
family in Vietnam and elsewhere about birth defects and such. My wife's mother
is Vietnam-born Chinese. She came to the US as a refugee. They have family
that was exposed as innocents caught in the middle of the conflict, just
trying to escape with their lives. There are countless generations of people
in Vietnam, and now abroad, that will never be properly acknowledged, let
alone compensated, for what we did to them. And, in some cases, what is still
happening to them today, as the byproducts of the herbicide can still be found
in their food supply.

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linuxftw
> let alone compensated, for what we did to them

Not 'we.' The war criminals running the government.

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afthonos
We don’t get to wash our hands of this. Particularly when we have neither
brought them to justice nor recognized any transnational authority’s
jurisdiction to do so.

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linuxftw
Maybe you're culpable, but not me. I've never voted for any politician that
voted for the Iraq war, and I wasn't around for Vietnam.

I advocate for the peaceful dissolution of the federal government because I
believe it's unfixable and unaccountable.

I believe the de-facto two-party system is illegitimate.

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scarejunba
Right, but culpability is like a spectrum. If I actually did it, I'm obviously
the villain. But if I prosper from its effects while only opposing it in the
abstract, then it's not obvious to me that I've actually reasonably washed my
hands of it.

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PureParadigm
It happened whether you "prospered" from it or not. How does that alone make
you any more culpable? You could argue a baby born today might have indirectly
benefited from it. Is that baby culpable to any extent?

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jMyles
Today's kids have a big responsibility in front of them. It won't be easy to
speak truth to the power that lies in the governments of the USA and China and
elsewhere, but it's absolutely obvious that these entities don't intend to
serve the interests of these children or their parents.

It is today's kids who must grow up ready to live in the absence of a powerful
state. Even if they aren't culpable, they are responsible.

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scruple
And we as adults have the responsibility of educating those future generations
by speaking that truth to power. I try to do my part, FWIW.

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ActorNightly
Not really surprising tbh.

Military vehicles and generators run on diesel, the fumes of which has known
links to cancer, especially without any emission controls.

Lead in ammunition probably contributes somewhat.

Tungsten in training ammo has links to cancer.

Stress and lack of proper nutrition probably doesn't help.

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AdrianB1
Tungsten is not used in training ammo because there is no need of high
penetration; it is used in live ammo.

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madengr
It’s used in frangible bullets. If you are in a shoot house, safer to use
frangible bullets, but probably not for the dust.

[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frangible_bullet](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frangible_bullet)

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grawprog
I'm sure the thousands upon thousands of depleted uranium rounds they fired
over those years had nothing to with it at all.

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rwcarlsen
The radiological hazard of depleted U is generally considered to by far
eclipsed by its chemical toxicity. I just want people to understand that any
carcinogenic affects depleted U exposure may have are far more likely to be
caused by its general chemical/heavy-metal toxicity. See
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depleted_uranium#Radiological_...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depleted_uranium#Radiological_hazards)

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cameronbrown
How do we know that both effects can't cause damage? Say you survive exposure
to chemical poisoning, later in life you may experience cancer.

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ceejayoz
We've got a pretty good idea of what cancer rates are for various levels and
types of radiation.

Toxic chemicals can cause cancer themselves - poisoning isn't the only option
there. Coal tar, for example, has no (or minimal) radioactivity, but is still
carcinogenic.

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adrianN
We actually have a rather poor understanding of long term effects of
radiation. We have decent models for amounts of radiation that kill you over
weeks, but long term low dose exposure is poorly understood.

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rdlecler1
Could this not be stress related?

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rdlecler1
Since this comment was down voted, this is a legitimate hypothesis.....
[https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.livescience.com/amp/65342-c...](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.livescience.com/amp/65342-chronic-
stress-cancer.html)

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mad_tortoise
Maybe if they hadn't been killing women and children with depleted uranium
then maybe, just maybe, they wouldn't be getting cancer today.

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ainiriand
It is more complex than that. I think that this simplification is hiding a lot
of hatred, not really helpful.

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m0zg
Address the root cause: don't start any more of these idiotic, unnecessary
wars.

