
India lifts ban on cryptocurrency trading - jmsflknr
https://techcrunch.com/2020/03/03/india-lifts-ban-on-cryptocurrency-trading/
======
proy24
Successive Indian governments fail to realize that protectionism and capital
control in reality have the exact opposite effect of what they intend. (after-
effect of British raj once bitten twice shy)

They tried to stop capital flight but instead people just started doing Peer
to peer FIAT transfers (WazirX owned by Chinese Binance) and trading via
offshore LLCs.

India needs to stop being a nanny state... In fact in a truly free market
Indians will often outperform global peers.

Being able to accept payments in crypto is a blessing for Indian firms looking
to corner the global blockchain services and consulting market.

~~~
inapis
Indian being a nanny state is an understatement. The govt simply has (and
always had) a high distrust of its citizens (emanating from the british raj).
Things have improved somewhat but as recent as 2015-16 you had to get your
documents attested from a pretty high ranking govt officer for simple stuff in
life and then also bring in the originals. If it was an online form, you’d
submit it then print it and then send it by post. It is not a hard task to
imagine the govts attitude when things get complex and require nuance to
fulfil.

On top of that the society in general has become cynical. The media is
constantly negative. This just leads to a vicious cycle where the govt just
becomes more distrustful of its citizens. I don’t know who came first - a
cyncial govt or a cynical society. But right now its a catch-22 which
frequently impedes progress in the country. Even for the situations where the
society and govt manage to break this deadlock is not celebrated and
acknowledged much. They are simply outgunned by the negative stuff and India
being as large and diverse as it is, negativity is aplenty.

The current ruling party (for all its other faults) managed to improve this
somewhat and at the same time managed to create another set of problems -
chief of which is creating a state of you vs me (in every fucking conversation
and discourse)

Indian state (or the society) simply can’t shake off being a nanny.

~~~
perl4ever
"Indian being a nanny state is an understatement"

To a non-Indian who's never been there, that sounds odd, because "nanny"
implies to me a level of control that I didn't think existed.

------
Zenst
It is worth noting that the initial ban predated by a couple of months to when
they replaced all currency bank notes :
[https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-37906742](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-37906742)

It had also removed higher value bak notes two years prior:
[https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2018/08/29/india-
replac...](https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2018/08/29/india-replaced-its-
currency-wipe-out-illegal-money-stashes-now-central-bank-says-it-didnt-work/)

Both initiatives born out of curtailing criminal activities of various kinds
at the time.

So the crypto ban happened during this period and may well of been born out of
that initiative against crime more than anything else and now that things have
settled down, the need for the ban became moot.

At least that is my thoughts upon this.

~~~
ignoramous
> Both initiatives born out of curtailing criminal activities of various kinds
> at the time.

It is a well-accepted fact that demonetization was a sham at best, a scam at
worst.

> So the crypto ban happened during this period and may well of been born out
> of that initiative against crime.

Again, what peculiar crimes exclusive to India are you alluding to that are
suddenly _extinct_ now? The ban was lifted because a successful court petition
ruled the government is paranoid at best and out-of-touch with reality at
worst wrt crypto.

At least, that is my thoughts upon this.

~~~
Zenst
>Again, what peculiar crimes exclusive to India are you alluding to that are
suddenly extinct now? The ban was lifted because a successful court petition
ruled the government is paranoid at best and out-of-touch with reality at
worst wrt crypto.

I wasn't alluding to any particular crime and the article does mention some
forms, though perhaps better explained by: [https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-
asia-india-37974423](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-india-37974423)

As another reply outlined, this did not impact the organised level of crime
and only the middle class and below, as sadly most initiatives seem to effect,
however well intended.

~~~
ignoramous
The article you cite was written just after demonetization was announced. It
simply speaks in the tone of hope and optimism from a journalist far removed
from the ground realities. The aftermath since then has left no doubts that
demonetization didn't do anything to curb any sort of tax crimes, whatsoever
[0]. Heck, a well-respect economist at the helm of the most important
financial institution in India, the RBI, resigned, _possibly_ in protest [1].

> As another reply outlined, this did not impact the organised level of crime
> and only the middle class and below, as sadly most initiatives seem to
> effect, however well intended.

Yeah, exactly: That's text-book sham.

[0]
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_Indian_banknote_demonetis...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_Indian_banknote_demonetisation#Reactions)

[1]
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raghuram_Rajan#Controversies](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raghuram_Rajan#Controversies)

~~~
calvinbhai
Could you cite more primary sources? It looks like India related entries on
Wikipedia were totally hijacked by paid wiki moderators[0]. Now I cannot trust
any India related entry on Wikipedia

[0][http://www.opindia.com/2020/03/delhi-anti-hindu-riots-
wikipe...](http://www.opindia.com/2020/03/delhi-anti-hindu-riots-wikipedia-
bias-edits-dbigxray-investigation/)

~~~
ignoramous
OpIndia is a Brietbart-esque website. I trust the Wikipedia moderators more
than OpIndia "journalists", who, not long ago, called for "war to defend the
Hindus".

The systemic way in which the neo-facist government is taking control the
narrative by tarnishing trust in institutions that have stood up well to
scrutiny is unnerving.

> Could you cite more primary sources?

I'm pretty sure any primary source that doesn't fit a narrative would be
dismissed as non-trustworthy because OpIndia wrote an "investigative" piece
that refutes those sources, or because a prominent right-wing person tweets
questioning the legitimacy and dismissing it as "fake news"? The incumbent is
playing abhorrable politics.

> Now I cannot trust any India related entry on Wikipedia.

Sure, trust OpIndia instead? The standard bearer for journalistic ethics.

------
ackbar03
Echoing a comment below, with the fed lowering rates again it seems like loose
money is here to stay for a while. I wonder if this will help eventually push
adoption for cryptocurrency. Now I'm not a crypto-currency nut, quite the
opposite, and I generally think blockchain is pretty useless, but you do have
to acknowledge digital currency is finding uses in venezuela and a pocket of
other countries where trust in the monetary system has completely collapsed.
Continual low rates and high debts will for sure not wipe out trust in the
financial system overnight but it definitely doesn't help

~~~
jMyles
Being harder money isn't enough. Orthodox money has the spiritual backing of
the world order - the industrial-era concepts of hegemony and warfare unto
imperialism.

Blockchain tech needs to show some real, actual functionality - a complete and
cognizable web3 stack - in order to be a critique on the level required to
actually change (or replace) monetary systems.

------
threwerw42343
Good. There is finally some competition to the Hawala monopoly, for
squirreling away India's wealth (it also doesn't involve sending slaves to the
Middle East for counterparty trades).

------
tim333
I think cryptocurrency trading is one of those things like drinking that is
counter productive to ban even if you don't like it much. Better legal and
regulated.

------
praveenweb
Crypto trading garnered everyone’s attention when Bitcoin kept rising upto
$20k and there was a huge FOMO.

During that time, there were a lot of Get Rich Quickly scams around Crypto
trading. Coupled with 24x7 online trading, a lot of people were losing a lot
of money. Taxation (for those who made money) around Crypto weren’t clear
either.

An exchange ran away with the money. There was also the money laundering
aspect. The Govt also wanted to curtail cash usage (Demonetisation happened)
and track the transaction trails.

Not saying if they are right but some of these reasons were triggers for the
original ban by RBI.

Casinos are banned in majority of Indian land and i’m wondering if the reasons
are the same. Would be interested to know what the Supreme Court thinks about
that in the current world.

------
ur-whale
I was curious why they banned it in the first place. From the article:

    
    
        "At the time, RBI said the move was necessary to curb ring-fencing of the country’s financial system."
    
        "It had also argued that Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies cannot be treated as currencies as they are not made of metal or exist in physical form, nor were they stamped by the government."
    

The second argument is beyond weird as most currency isn't material these
days, including India.

It's also worth noting that the ruling doesn't seem to have had any kind of
effect on Bitcoin's price.

Maybe the news is too fresh ... time to buy !

~~~
realusername
No country is recognising them as actual currencies, because once you do it,
that opens a whole lot of other issues for the country, suddenly they could
lose control on their money supply and that's a potential threat to their
sovereignty. It's much easier and safer to consider them as assets.

~~~
elp
If they had ever approached even the slightest level of acceptance of gold
they would have been okay as assets.

Now its more like betting at the track. Except that the track is probably more
regulated and insiders are less crooked.

~~~
realusername
For now I agree, right now it's pure gambling. However it's still pretty early
to say what will happen in the future about the cryptocurrencies.

------
billfruit
The title probably should say that the Indian Supreme court quashes the ban on
crypto imposed by the Government. It is most likely that the Government will
appeal against the ruling, because they seem not in favour of having crypto.

------
amriksohata
Crypto is the future regardless of regulation, denying it is like the people
who denied the internet taking off and social media would take off when we had
MSN back in the day.

Good on India for doing this.

------
simonswords82
I wonder what impact this will have on the value of various crypto currencies?

------
plastic_teeth
I wonder if this has anything to do with the fact that COVID-19 was just
confirmed there.

~~~
arcticbull
It almost certainly doesn't. COVID-19 is looking more and more tame by hour as
cases resolve and fatality rates drop. There's fewer active cases today than
yesterday, and fewer still than the day before. We're 34% off peak number of
active cases. Cryptocurrency is as scammy as always. Not sure one would
distract from the other.

~~~
markdown
> COVID-19 is looking more and more tame by hour as cases resolve and fatality
> rates drop. There's fewer active cases today than yesterday, and fewer still
> than the day before. We're 34% off peak number of active cases.

Source?

~~~
arcticbull
[https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/](https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/)
which lines up with the Johns Hopkins dashboard posted here recently.

