

Why Google TV is fundamentally flawed - thekguy
http://theexciter.com/articles/why-google-tv-is-fundamentally-flawed.html

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martythemaniak
"Imagine instead if the remote for a storage, OS and video-decoding “media
box” was an iPad(-like) tablet on which you did all the interactions and the
TV simply mirrored those when you where browsing, or presented the results of
such interactions, like playing a show from a playlist you just created."

I think the author missed the part where they were controlling the TV using
their Nexus Ones. Go watch the presentation again, they're already doing
exactly that. You can't complain a product is flawed if it is already doing
exactly what you want it to do!

Edit: Logitech already has iPhone and Android apps for their box:
[http://www.engadget.com/2010/05/20/logitechs-google-tv-
compa...](http://www.engadget.com/2010/05/20/logitechs-google-tv-companion-
box-includes-smartphone-apps-we/)

~~~
stcredzero
The iPad would also be an excellent adjunct device. As the price of such
devices fall, the interface possibilities will become readily available.

Also, just having an Apple/Front Row style remote with a menu driven interface
enables a whole lot.

The big attraction is the data. iAd style advertisements on these boxes will
be a treasure trove of consumer data.

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mikeryan
Kind of a weak argument.

The people that are working on these devices aren't idiots and they realize
that input is a problem.

Many cable operators are exploring the use of smart phones as remote (in fact
the Google TV demo used and android phone as its data entry device).

Vizio TV's are putting keyboards in their remotes as well.

What most people designing apps for TV realizes is that apps that require
heavy user input don't work well so they instead design apps that work around
these restrictions. Its a challenge but not one that is insurmountable. No one
is trying to turn your TV into a PC replacement they're just trying to extend
its capabilities a bit.

~~~
stcredzero
Right. Look at what Apple does with the very simple 6 button remote. The trick
is to come up with the right contexts and choices to cover the easy 80% use
cases.

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arbitraryperson
Google TV's developer page notes the importance of the user being able to
navigate with only five buttons (up, down, left, right and enter) here
<http://www.google.com/tv/developer/#navigation-is-critical>.

So this post seems a bit uninformed to me. I think google knows what they're
doing.

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alttab
This article "debunks" Google TV for no other reason that it isn't the cool
way dynamic web based TV should be as the author imagines it.

Title is sensational at best.

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utexaspunk
I have been using my Android phones as my remote for my Windows 7 media center
for quite some time. I don't see why this wouldn't be possible with Google
TV...

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jsz0
I'm skeptical also. Do people really want a search driven TV experience? TV is
the opposite of the Internet in many ways. I think people want content pushed
at them or presented in a buffet style interface. From the demo video Google
TV looks to be _very_ focused on search instead. The other thing that made me
skeptical was Google presenting the problem of a program being on multiple
channels. My cruddy cable DVR was able to figure this out years ago. TIVO has
always done a very good job at it. What's the problem there?

~~~
falien
My problem with them is data entry, which google wants to let me take care of
with my droid (and I'd love to). I have used search on a cable box exactly
once because it was as much of a chore to enter the query and sort through the
spectacularly awful search results as to scroll through all the channels
trying to find what I wanted. And yet, every time I actually have something in
mind I want to watch, I wish I could use an easy and decent search function.
Then theres the possibility of hulu style "channels" which still give a
buffet, but you get to stick to the sushi section of the buffet instead of
having no discernible organization.

Lots of what google is trying to do has been done poorly and in half-measures
before. A good implementation with all of them together has a ton of
potential.

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mitchellhislop
This guy clearly didnt watch the demo or read the developer docs.

And, I DO want a search based TV interface. I hate having to scroll through
several screens to find the show that I want.

~~~
thwarted
And the search interfaces that STBs do have are terrible, you can barely
search by name, and can't search by actor or anything like that.

But being able to scroll through a list is much better than having to watch a
scrolling list and having to _wait_ for the thing you want to scroll by.

~~~
mitchellhislop
I know on my STB, the list that the search returns is just the title of the
show (for instance, 30 Rock). It gives me nothing more than the title, so I
have to click around till I find the one that I want

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Jun8
I agree with the post in that in the long history of the "TV-Internet
convergence" starting with MS's WebTV in the 80s most people viewed the TV as
a tool to browse the web. That's why they failed because, as most people know,
the TV watching and Web browsing experiences are quite different.

Then, there's the problem of the input device. Ever enter a movie name for
search using the TiVo remote, AFAIK the best currently available? It's a pain.
Now, one thing Google TV gets absolutely right is that your phone will be your
secondary interaction device for your TV.

The real interesting question here is: will applications on the Google TV set-
top-box be able to access the tuner and EPG functions. TiVo has a nice SDK for
their boxes for years now, the reason you never heard of it because they don't
allow apps to access these features out of fear from content providers. If you
can write Android apps running on the STB that can access the video stream,
now that would be _super_ , but I don't expect to see this anytime soon.

~~~
mikeryan
"will applications on the Google TV set-top-box be able to access the tuner
and EPG function"

Only of the TV and this would only work with "Over the air" tv. In the US most
of us receive our TV and guide via our cable or satellite box and tune via
that mechanism. Google TV and competing products have no easy way of accessing
that data (the guide data and tuning).

There's some hacky ways of doing it but nothing really integrated.

~~~
utexaspunk
I have a Hauppauge WinTV HVR-2250 and Windows 7, which I use with the cheapest
basic cable package Comcast has -no STB, basically just analog and HD Clear
QAM of the local channels. Upon installation, Windows scans your signal and
asks your ZIP code and service provider, and that's it- the EPG is set up and
works great. Hardly what I'd call 'hacky'. If Microsoft can maintain a
database and have it work flawlessly, I don't see why Google couldn't...

~~~
Jun8
Getting EPG data is not a big deal, but may be costly if you plan to sell
services based off it, e.g. a single Tribune (EPG data monopoly in the US) EPG
data access costs around $10K. However, if you are developing apps for non-
commercial purposes, e.g. open source, you can get this data for $20/year at
<http://www.schedulesdirect.org/>.

The real problem is to access the video stream. Currently this is viewed to be
illegal (see the lawsuit in 2001 that pretty much sank ReplayTV,
<http://www.eff.org/cases/newmark-v-turner>).

~~~
utexaspunk
I'm guessing Microsoft has gotten a licensing deal with Tribune to get and
share the EPG data for Windows Media Center. As far as the video stream, I
wonder then how Microsoft/Hauppauge get away with it?

~~~
mikeryan
You're only getting access to the unencrypted channels. (and generally I
believe only SD?)

The vast majority of Comcast's channels and content can't be accessed without
a cable card or cable box.

~~~
utexaspunk
Yes- I'm getting SD analog channels + HD Local Channels (which the FCC
mandates they carry in the clear), although there _are_ CableCard PC tuners
out there, and from what I've heard, CableCards _are_ available from Comcast
(I just refuse to pay $50/mo, or whatever it is, to get the digital package).
I also use my Xbox 360 as a Media Center Extender to watch stuff I've DVR'd in
the bedroom. I don't see how this is really doing anything different than what
ReplayTV was doing. Maybe it's just that there aren't enough people doing it
to have drawn the ire of the media companies...

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anticucho
Here's how I imagine Google TV when I turn it on for the first time:

"This program is not available in your geographical location"

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microcentury
This looks like an article written to match a desired headline. The control
device is hardly 'fundamental' to the concept of a web-enabled TV.

