
Computing is Everywhere: Bret Victor and Dynamicland [audio] - mpweiher
https://postlight.com/trackchanges/podcast/computing-is-everywhere
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miguelrochefort
As much as I love this guy (easily in my top 10), I still can't say I'm able
to fully appreciate his work at Dynamicland...

I'll give it another try.

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gfodor
One thing I've never heard anyone ask Bret directly that I've always wondered
his answer to how does a world of Dynamiclands avoid further entrenching the
privilege of physical co-locality. The reason the Internet is an enabling
technology is because it levels the playing field: anyone can access the web,
and anyone can theoretically communicate with anyone else on Earth once the
planet is fully connected.

For Dyanmicland, it seems to be the opposite, where the world may continue to
break up into regions where the best minds may gather in order to collaborate
together physically. On the web, a young kid in the country can start working
with the best minds in our field by directly contributing to open source
software, etc. In a world where physical co-presence is further levered up as
a differentiated advantage for activating edges in a network of collaborators,
that kid is going to be stifled.

To me, I think it's critical that any kind of physically based dynamic medium
have a design which takes into account the trajectory of immersive computing
tech (VR/AR/haptics/etc) and have an intent to dissolve the dependency on
physical co-presence. I'm sure this has been talked about endlessly
internally, and I grok the tension between this and the thesis that using your
full body and physical matter in a humane space potentially lets you "think
unthinkable thoughts", but I haven't heard it spoken about.

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pronoiac
If you're wondering what it is, see
[https://dynamicland.org/](https://dynamicland.org/)

It's a multi-user interface, using objects on a table, via an overhead
projector and camera.

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hacker_9
So as much as Bret Victor is a visionary, all his ideas never scaled up to
real world requirements. Additionally attempts by other groups to implement
his ideas met failure, and have squandered millions of dollars by this point.
I really thought he might crack the scaling issue at some point, but instead
he has just applied his ideas to something that doesn't need to scale;
'dynamicland'.

Props for thinking out of the box, again, I guess. But a 5000 year art project
that combines paper and lights? I guess I'm not seeing the relevance.

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azeirah
Bret Victor is a researcher first and foremost, a visionary one at that, but a
researcher nevertheless; dynamicland is a work-in-progress. The vision is to
build social, collaborative workspaces where dynamic computation is as natural
as books, paper, pens, whiteboards; if not more.

If I understand his vision correctly, the paper and projector technology is
just transitional, the goal is not the paper and lights you see, the goal is
zero barrier-to-entry computation; smart, objects that enable and encourage
collaboration and discussions enhanced by the additional insights that a
computer the size of a room offers.

What groups are you referring to by the way? Are you thinking of Lighttable
and Eve and the like?

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duaoebg
I see Bret Victor more as a historian where he finds old ideas and re-
introduces them to people who haven’t seen them before. Presumably in the hope
that enough about the world has changed that this time the ideas will catch
on.

I work with 40 year old ideas that are so advanced that people think it’s
futuristic alien tech when they see it. Unfortunately the ideas will never be
popular because of problems with culture and fundamental limitations of the
median human comprehension.

So I see the achievement here as not one of technology but of creating a
culturally isolated and elitist institution.

~~~
deepaksurti
>> I work with 40 year old ideas that are so advanced that people think it’s
futuristic alien tech

Lisp is one such idea implemented. Can you please list the other ideas, very
interested to know.

~~~
duaoebg
It’s a counter intuitive practical fix to a theoretical solution that is
currently considered not to work. Because it’s considered not to work in
theory many academics won’t belive it works in practice even after I
demonstrate it working.

Once it became a money printer I stopped telling people about it. My plan is
to save a bunch of money and build an institution around it to push for
influence that way.

