
Private Equity company acquires .org registry - bhartzer
https://domainnamewire.com/2019/11/13/breaking-private-equity-company-acquires-org-registry/
======
nslocum
This is very troubling. I can't imagine why this would be done if they had
good intentions. Makes me want to check their financials.

Here's their most recent public tax forms which includes revenue, executive
pay, board member info, and more

PIR:
[https://projects.propublica.org/nonprofits/organizations/331...](https://projects.propublica.org/nonprofits/organizations/331025119/201841569349300514/IRS990)

ICANN: [https://www.icann.org/en/system/files/files/fy18-irs-tax-
for...](https://www.icann.org/en/system/files/files/fy18-irs-tax-
form-990-return-organization-exempt-income-tax-27may19-en.pdf)

Looks like they're paid quite generously.

~~~
spir
We should support public goods like the Ethereum Name Service
[https://ens.domains/](https://ens.domains/)

You can register a domain at
[https://app.ens.domains/](https://app.ens.domains/)

~~~
riffic
alternative DNS roots have been a thing for a while:

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alternative_DNS_root](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alternative_DNS_root)

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ted0
I work at Namecheap and we've been vocal about ICANN's decision to lift .org
price caps. Happy to answer any questions from an industry-insider
perspective.

P.S. Only upvoting for exposure, not endorsing the acquisition.

~~~
nroets
Are there any TLDs where the management are elected by the domain holders ?
The real world analogy I can think is HOA where the association (body
corporate) is run by trustees/directors who are elected by the property
owners. The association is incorporated as a non profit.

~~~
ted0
No there is no registry "coop" afaik but this would be very cool. Maybe in the
next round of TLD applications?

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jdkee
Does anyone know what policy at ICANN justifies this action? My understanding
was that certain TLDs are historically non-commercial and this free from
commercial constraints on registration.

~~~
Gabrielfair
Adding to this, does anyone know if there is a procedure in place to submit a
protest of an ICANN decision? There has to be a way for the public to issue a
request for re-evaluation, right?

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tehjoker
Definitely a case of capital being earned and not a power differential being
used to rip off the public writ large /sarcasm

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aaomidi
How...is this even allowed? Do people like us not get any say in this?

Fuck the ICANN.

~~~
xylol
To be fair, you seem to be quite explicit.

~~~
aaomidi
Yes because I feel like I was fucked with. Of course I'm mad.

Especially if they remove the pricing protections it might price me out of
owning my own domain.

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ajnin
PE firm appoints former ICANN executives to top positions. ICANN lifts price
caps on .org registry. PE firm acquires .org registry. ICANN executives
acquire stakes in PE firm.

I don't know how this kind of behaviour is qualified legally. Probably
something like "free market capitalism". But on a personal level this feels
just disgusting and corrupt. Things like the .org registry that are unique and
as such cannot be subject to competition should be controlled by a public
entity in the common interest. I say that as a long-time owner (or rather
renter) of a personal .org domain.

~~~
Iv
I feel that's something the EFF could sue against

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jbob2000
Well, that’s the end of .org. Private equity just wants to collect rent,
they’ll raise prices year after year just _because_.

~~~
dvdhnt
Not sure why this is being downvoted, it's the truth.

Rent seeking is a disease that stifles progress. I don't understand how the
same people who rail against overly aggressive patent, DRM, and copyright
protections can justify supporting rent seeking in the physical world.

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Iv
Time to fork ICANN. We knew this day would come, it is time for a DNS schism.

~~~
ohazi
There's no absolute law that icann will always be the one true registry. It's
mostly convention, inertia, and an expectation that they won't try to pull any
shenanigans. But I'm seeing an awful lot of shenanigans lately...

Remember when the browser vendors decided to make an example out of Symmantec
by revoking their root CA after repeated bad behavior?

At the end of the day, it's a bunch of private equity weenies who paid a _lot_
of money for a piece of paper, vs. the engineers who actually control which
piece of paper everyone's computer looks at.

We'd have to be willing to stare down a lot of angry people, but we could
absolutely win this fight if we really wanted to.

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gorgoiler
What’s the most equitable TLD for now, and for the future?

~~~
trpc
.sucks

~~~
gorgoiler
That’s actually a pretty interesting example — is this some sort of stick-it-
to-the-man anti-corporation performance art?

“[...] lawyers are infuriated that the dot-sucks registry was charging
trademark holders $2500 for domains and everyone else $10.“

“The .sucks domain registrar has been described as "predatory, exploitive and
coercive" by the Intellectual Property Constituency that advises the ICANN
board. When the .sucks registry announced their pricing model, "most brand
owners were upset and felt like they were being penalized by having to pay
more to protect their brands." Because of the low utility of the ".sucks"
domain, most fees come from "Brand Protection" customers registering their
trademarks to prevent domains being registered.”

[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ICANN#.sucks_domain](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ICANN#.sucks_domain)

It feels like many of the new TLDs are a shakedown on brands to force them to
land-grab their trademarks. At least .SUCKS is honest about it?

EDIT: oh my, this is juicy! Some real internet counter culture. This excerpt
from a letter of complaint from the .SUCKS registry to ICANN:

“[...] ICANN appears concerned that registrations on the .SUCKS registry will
be used to aggregate uncomplimentary commentary about companies and products--
the very purpose for the registry that Vox Populi identified in the
application it submitted to ICANN, and that ICANN approved.”

[http://www.circleid.com/posts/20150511_vox_populi_registry_s...](http://www.circleid.com/posts/20150511_vox_populi_registry_says_enough_about_sucks_accusations/)

EDIT2: I am reminded of some more domain history here, regarding Diageo
seizing the Guinness-Sucks.com domain names (also a nice blast from the past:
who remembers the _Your Rights Online_ section of SlashDot?)

[https://m.slashdot.org/story/14513](https://m.slashdot.org/story/14513)

[https://www.wipo.int/amc/en/domains/decisions/html/2000/d200...](https://www.wipo.int/amc/en/domains/decisions/html/2000/d2000-0996.html)

~~~
kjs3
The idea that the expansion of TLDs, sold as some sort of democratization of
domain names, was anything other than a money grab is a joke. It's exemplified
by ".sucks" forcing trademark owners being extorted to pay to protect their
brand. As soon as ".sucks" is played out financially, look for ".isshit",
".killsbabies", ".molestspets", etc., etc., to spring up to monetize hedging
haters.

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danvoell
Yikes. F This.

"ICANN made this deal much more valuable by removing all price controls on
.org."

Just thinking of all the Non Profits who have .Org and are going to get conned
out of fees in the name of capitalism. Obviously making price increase
assumptions here but this sucks. Is there anyway to stop this?

~~~
turc1656
Doubt it. Looks like a done deal. I think either the government or a
collective of citizens would have to sue on antitrust grounds, which seems
reasonable considering they control the entire .org TLD. But other than that,
don't see much of a way.

And considering it was controlled entirely by a single entity before, nothing
has really changed except the structure of the entity (profit vs non-profit).
Technically speaking, I don't think there is a requirement to prove consumer
harm from antitrust activity, but I could be wrong. Which would, in theory,
make such a case easier to win. Someone who knows a lot more than me on this
once told me that requirement was left out of the antitrust laws because it
was difficult to prove and there doesn't actually need to be harm to the
consumer for their to be harm in general (meaning at least to other
competitors). For example, a company can subsidize losses in one line of
business with profits from another and keep prices reasonable/competitive in
both areas while simultaneously stifling competition in the line of business
that's losing money. Consumers still receive a good price but the harm is to
the competition, which will cause company bankruptcies down the line and have
longer term consequences. It also creates a barrier to entry for any
prospective competitors. I think this was the real-world scenario that was
used to leave out a requirement of proof of consumer harm. In fact, I also
believe they don't even have to technically succeed they just need to merely
attempt to monopolize something to be guilty of a felony. But again, since
it's just changing hands from one entity to another, that might not fly.

~~~
SimbaOnSteroids
Imagine if they raise prices exponentially for organizations they don't like,
imagine if like the aclu or eef can't renew their .org because those
organizations run counter to their interests.

~~~
turc1656
That's an apocalyptic scenario and not one likely to survive legal challenge.
But if something like that were to happen, then I'd say that there is still a
workaround. I forget the name of the browser extension but there is definitely
something that exists that circumvents domain blocking by storing the domain
to IP list. I believe this is/was used mostly in the UK to get around their
governmental laws blocking certain sites so if you had a link to
www.blockedsite.com/article it would take www.blockedsite.com and replace with
the known IP address and route you there directly instead.

~~~
aYsY4dDQ2NrcNzA
> not one likely to survive legal challenge

Can you elaborate?

~~~
turc1656
I mean if they really did that there would likely be numerous paths to
successfully sue the private equity company now controlling the .org TLD.
Basic consumer protection laws require, for example, that buyers of like kind
be charged the same price. I think that law applies to physical goods and
commodities, but there is an argument to be made that domain registration is
not as much of a service as it is a commodity loaning program. Another avenue
could potentially be predatory pricing and price gouging laws. IANAL but I'm
sure there are many, many things they could cite in a civil suit to stop such
blatant ripoff schemes. In fact, I think if they did gouge them so obviously
and in such a targeted fashion, it would probably be a great case for getting
them torn apart under antitrust law since there is literally nowhere else you
can register a .org TLD.

~~~
my123
They could maybe add a mandatory arbitration agreement for future domain
renewals? And then do this.

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sundbry
fuck you ICANN.

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marmot777
Does this mean non profit organizations will end up paying more for domain
names? That seems sketchy.

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Mengkudulangsat
On an unrelated note, I've been dying for .sea TLD for a long time now (for
Southeast-Asia). Reckon many unicorns wanting to appear "regional" would love
this too.

Unfortunately, it's owned by the Principality of Sealand... an offshore
platform.

~~~
C1sc0cat
Why?

These regional vanity TLD's don't have are real day to day use

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kjs3
Time to wind down all the .org domains of more than trivial import.

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SanchoPanda
First thought: Sketchy.

Second thought: Actually I hope that they do raise prices. Sucks for the
squatters and the legacy owners, but the squatters more so given how many more
names they own.

~~~
q3k
> Second thought: Actually I hope that they do raise prices.

Can't wait for that price hike for my ~VIP~ 3-letter dot org domain that I've
been actively using for 11 years!

~~~
SanchoPanda
That's kind of the thing though, I want one as well. If you didn't get one 11
years ago you have been out of luck since then.

~~~
lilyball
So? Should only people who can afford high costs be allowed to own three-
letter domains? Worthiness is not defined by income.

~~~
SanchoPanda
I agree! Especially when it comes to dot org. The thought was more about how
first one there gets to keep it forever because it's cheap enough to hold out
doesn't feel great either.

~~~
lilyball
As long as they're actively using it, I don't see the problem. If someone is
squatting on a domain without using it, that's a different problem and should
be handled in a way that doesn't punish legitimate users.

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rswail
So I've been trying to buy my-name.org for years, but it's held by some domain
squatter. No idea where or why they are holding it and paying for renewals for
at least the last 15 years.

Maybe now they'll think it's cost-prohibitive?

It expires next year, any idea on how to buy a domain these days?

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chirau
Doesn't Craigslist have an .org as well?

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JeremySecond
Is there a reason _any_ domain has to be in private hands? Other than allowing
more rent-seeking.

~~~
profmonocle
I believe that _technically_ generic top level domains "belong" to ICANN, and
the registry operators (who collect most of the money) are just contractors
operating the infrastructure on behalf of ICANN. So PIR doesn't actually own
.org, ICANN could find a new contractor if they abuse their power.

Of course, that's in theory. In reality ICANN's contracts are very
controversial, and there have been plenty of accusations of corruption.

Honestly, I don't see why the GTLDs couldn't be operated by a non-profit. They
could charge as much as necessary to maintain the extremely high availability
the service requires without needing to enrich any shareholders.

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shmerl
Time to sunset it.

~~~
russh
And remove it from the email whitelist.

