

I really want to like Apple (but they don't like us) - rbanffy
http://www.dieblinkenlights.com/blog_en/i-really-want-to-like-apple

======
pcof
The cable nightmare should be enough to open up anyone's eyes. There's a line
somewhere that companies should not cross in their willingness to protect
their investments.. Apple trying to disallow other gadgets from using iTunes
is one thing. You may or may not agree with it but it does not sound too
weird. Standard cables are far, far beyond that line that should not be
crossed.

~~~
ubernostrum
I'm not ready to jump on this one.

For one thing, I have an iPhone, and I have a car with Microsoft Sync. Every
time I plug the iPhone into the car's USB port, it pops up "this accessory is
not made to work with iPhone". And then it works anyway (except for the part
where something is a little overzealous about reindexing the music on the
phone, and I'm not yet sure which side that one's on).

For another, the DRM point may be more important than the author makes it out
to be: there are plenty of systems where using the "wrong" cable will still
work, but with significantly degraded access (I still remember the first time
I had to buy an adapter box to use a DVD player with my TV). I'm not sure that
"sorry, you can't do that" is any better or worse than "you can do that, it
just won't be useful in any way".

~~~
rbanffy
The author can assure you the video halts while the iPod displays that dialog
("monologue" would perhaps be more appropriate) box saying the cable is not
compatible. It usually does so after a random period of time (between a couple
seconds to a couple minutes) playing the video on the TV. Any subsequent
attempt to play the video with the same cable results in the video being shown
on the iPod screen. One workaround is to reboot the iPod and restart playback,
but it is more hassle than I am willing to put up with.

It may be called "degraded usability" for some...

------
alex_c
I got my first Apple product - a MacBook - in December. The only way to
connect it to an external monitor turned out to be purchasing an additional
Mini DisplayPort[1] adapter for something like $45 - from Apple, of course,
since no one else was selling it.

The ONLY product in the entire world at the time that used the Mini
DisplayPort, as far as I could tell, was the MacBook. (well, maybe some of
Apple's new displays). Of course the adapter wasn't included with the MacBook,
and it's expensive as hell.

Not quite as bad as the linked article, but that was my first experience with
Apple as a company - left a bit of a bitter taste.

[1] <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mini_DisplayPort>

~~~
Kadin
I don't think that's Apple being evil, that's Apple being ahead of the curve.
They've always done that and I've thought it was generally admirable, although
sometimes it puts you as a customer further out on the bleeding edge than
you'd like. (E.g., I was very much unready to give up PCI when Apple decided
to ditch PCI-X for PCI Express. However, it was clearly where the world was
headed.)

They've done the "lead, don't follow" thing consistently since Jobs came back.
Ditching ADB and serial for USB; ditching SCSI for FireWire---I groaned at
each one of those calls, but they turned out to generally be the right ones,
just a year or two in some cases before the market was quite ready.

However, all that is quite different from the bullshit with the iPod video
cable discussed in the article. That's just outright consumer-hostile
behavior, and it's not traditional Apple ... it seems to be something new,
which has only started to happen in the last few years, and mostly in the
markets where they are dominant.

I still like a lot of Apple's products (I'm writing this on a 15" MacBook),
but it's as much evidence as I need to not want to ever have Apple dominate
the PC market. They're a wonderful company when they're the underdog, but a
harsh mistress when they're in charge.

~~~
jacobolus
They did the "lead don't follow" thing before Jobs came back too when it came
to hardware (indeed all the way from the beginning of the company to the
present, from mice and "plug-and-play" ADB connectors to 3.5" disks to the
first real consumer laptops (remember the Duo Dock anyone?) to really
embracing SCSI, laser printers, and then in the recent Jobs age, USB and
firewire and ethernet and DVD writers etc. etc.), it’s just that their
software stagnated for quite a few years and none of the next-gen software
research projects they dumped loads of cash into in the early-to-mid 90s
really panned out.

------
RyanMcGreal
FTA:

 _The point is, as much as I like Apple's attention to detail, its outstanding
industrial design, I can't justify buying a product that's not really mine.
Call me spoiled, but using stuff like Linux made me feel I am really in
control. The netbook is mine, and nobody will make my computer do something I
don't approve. If it ceases to work, it will be my fault._

This is exactly why I switched from XP to Linux rather than to OSX. I'd rather
tinker with _my own_ system than be passively impressed with the feature set
of _Apple's_ system.

------
asciilifeform
_I can't justify buying a product that's not really mine. Call me spoiled, but
using stuff like Linux made me feel I am really in control. The netbook is
mine, and nobody will make my computer do something I don't approve._

This should be enshrined as a sacred principle of programming, not unlike the
medical profession's Hippocratic Oath: "I will not build user-betraying
systems." It is not enough for us to swear not to buy them: the sheeple will.
And they have the most dollars/votes. We, the programmers, must refuse to
participate in their creation.

See:

"Ethics for Programmers: Primum non Nocere"
<http://glyf.livejournal.com/46589.html>

"The "you don't own your computer" paradigm is not merely wrong. It is
violently, disastrously wrong, and the consequences of this error are likely
to be felt for generations to come, unless steps are taken to prevent it."

------
mrshoe
_It's a cable! How incompatible with something can a cable be?_

Quite. Analog or not, cables carry a lot of technology these days.

To attribute this to some DRM effort is quite a large assumption. I wouldn't
recommend writing off a company like Apple based on an assumption like that,
considering it is almost certainly not true.

Granted, Apple does not usually go out of their way to make sure 3rd party
accessories are supported on future devices. They can be a bit reckless about
modifying interfaces, which tends to _accidentally_ break 3rd party products
(which Apple doesn't even always know exist). Heck, they frequently break
compatibility with their own older products.

I think there is a tradeoff here, though. MicroSoft is actually darn good at
backwards compatibility, and Apple is good at innovation. Striking the balance
is tough.

------
jorjelorero
Apple don't support non apple cables anymore, they do sell a cable that does
what you need. Either buy the dam cable or go back to firmware 2.0. I didn't
like it either, but they do have a reason to that (the octopus cable mentioned
in the support forum) and they are probably going to stand by it.

Its like asking for microsoft to support their new bluetooth mice on windows
95. If I had windows 95 I would like them to, but it is not their obligation.
I really wish they would support their freaking ABNT2 keyboards on macosx
(which they don't, although the box says so).

There is no guarantee that something that worked before a soft/hard upgrade
will continue to work, specially between major versions. Linux for christ sake
dropped support for a lot of things between 2.4 - 2.6 and no one was whining
about it. I mean, there is always someone whining on a linux forum...

~~~
rbanffy
"Its like asking for microsoft to support their new bluetooth mice on windows
95"

Actually, it's like Microsoft checking whether the mouse is made by Microsoft
and then refusing to work with it despite the fact it would work perfectly.

~~~
jorjelorero
Its not that, they check to see if the cable is an octopus cable, the problem
is that just apple make those right now.

------
jemmons
What I don't see here is any corroborating evidence that this is anything
other than a bug or a faulty cable. Did the author call AppleCare? Did they
tell him this was a DRM issue? Has he tried it with protected and unprotected
content? Has he tried a new cable of same make and manufacture? Has he found
any other users with this same problem (seems like there would be many)?

This is all basic troubleshooting that we would normally perform (or insist on
being performed) before passing judgement. And yet for some reason, if it's an
Apple product and you're new to the brand, you're somehow _expecting_ to be
screwed. So you blame any and every error on Apple and their _evilness_.

~~~
rbanffy
"What I don't see here is any corroborating evidence that this is anything
other than a bug or a faulty cable."

As for the faulty cable, unless the fault is really small, there is no reason
to believe there is one. The cable works flawlessly with other iPods that have
the 1.x software. I could not find any other cables from the same manufacturer
and, since it's just a cable, I threw out the box it came in without much
thought of that.

I contacted Apple support, but since the cable is not made by Apple and the
iPod's warranty is expired, they said I am pretty much on my own.

As for being new to the brand, I own (and have used then extensively in the
80s) a couple Apple IIs and a somewhat large collection of Macintoshes. Sadly
I don't have a Lisa or a NeXT cube (working on that and gladly accepting
donations), but, if that's not enough to make me a non-Apple-newbie, I
certainly don't know what would.

Did you even read the article? It's all written in the first paragraph...

~~~
jemmons
I read your article. I wish you'd have done my comment the same courtesy. You
address none of my points. You haven't tried another cable. You haven't had
the issue confirmed by support. You haven't tried with protected vs.
unprotected content. You haven't found other users with the same problem...
You can makes excuses for why you haven't done these things. They may even be
good and reasonable excuses. But until you rule out the obvious and likely,
your explanation of "my cable doesn't work because Apple doesn't like us"
sounds like something of a conspiracy theory.

Also, for what it's worth, I'm comfortable labeling any new iPod/iPhone user
who's most recent Apple hardware hails from over a decade ago as "new to the
brand".

~~~
gpotts5626
I did speak with Apple support. The rep told me that Apple does not support
any non-Apple cables. I asked her if she meant "made for ipod or iphone"
cables purchased at a legit retail store. She confirmed that they do not
support any non-Apple cables after the 3.0 update.

------
jvdh
This is not news. In 2007 it was already reported that video out stopped
working in iPods unless you used a new cable with an authentication chip:
[http://www.ilounge.com/index.php/news/comments/apple-
locks-t...](http://www.ilounge.com/index.php/news/comments/apple-locks-tv-out-
in-new-ipods-breaks-video-add-ons/)

------
freetard
Why would anyone want to like a company?

~~~
whatusername
Because capitalism is built on a series of MUTUALLY BENEFICIAL transactions.
So when I buy a product - I gain something because I now have the product and
the company gains because they've sold me that product presumably at a profit.
The reason I buy something is because buying it makes me better off.

I like things that make me better off - therefore it is perfectly reasonable
to like companies - esp ones that make important/complex things that I derive
a lot of benefit from.

~~~
RyanMcGreal
_Because capitalism is built on a series of MUTUALLY BENEFICIAL transactions._

It's not only that: capitalism is also built extensively on explicit or
implied _social norms_ that cultivate customer loyalty to a company that makes
and keeps _ethical_ as well as _contractual_ promises.

Market norms and values are what they are, but people live in social and
ethical worlds, and most people expect their business transactions to be
ethically as well as economically acceptable.

