
CRISPR machines that can wipe out entire species - eaguyhn
https://www.cnet.com/news/the-crispr-machines-that-can-wipe-out-entire-species/
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Insanity
It's horrible that people are dying because of malaria. I'm a bit divided on
this approach though, I don't know enough about the topic at hand to suggest a
different approach, but let me try.

Would it be feasible to suggest using CRISP to create another adaptation to
the gene, one that preserves the mosquitoes but makes them unable to transfer
the disease to humans?

Eliminating a species because we don't like it reminds me of speciesism as
Peter Singer outlines in one of his books. (Animal Liberation I believe it
was). Where humans assume another species to be inferior and have less of a
right to live a decent life.

I do think it's a normal response to value human life more. And in fact, I
also do think that in this case it makes more sense to safe the humans if no
other approach is viable..

~~~
shireboy
The article mentions they tried to engineer mosquitos to not carry malaria,
but it made them weak and so natural selection favored the non-engineered
mosquitoes.

As for the rest, yeah tricky business. By all accounts we have more value than
a mosquito, but as you move up the food chain what are the unintended
consequences?

~~~
Nasrudith
What about the effect of existing anti-mosquito measures? We aren't exactly
using pleasant chemicals for that.

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pvaldes
We have to learn first how to de-extinct a species.

The cascade of known, expected and unexpected comsequences from wiping
mosquitoes could be enough to distroy the economy of entire countries.

And is so easy to think in believable sceneries that is astonishing to see
people repeating again the mantra that nothing is proved and nothing will
happen.

Wiping mosquitoes in Africa could affect profoundly Europe, for example.

The same birds that save harvests in Europe each year, pass the winter in
Africa. Finding some alternative food, here and there, is not the same as
"finding enough fuel to not die in the return". Do we really want to start an
experiment that could lead to Europe losing decens of insectivorous birds
overnight and episodes of famine in many points of Europe?

Or... What if malaria strikes back being forced to jump to the next species of
mosquito available, those able to stand cold temperatures that can be found in
Scottland or Swedden?

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ascotan
"Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee;". But in our new
worlds we'll just CRISPR them away.

No more roses with thorns (they cause thumb injuries), sweet smelling stink
bugs, glow in the dark pets.

Can't imagine what could go wrong. Someone needs to be writing the movie plot
right now.

~~~
Balgair
A little dated, but here :
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oryx_and_Crake](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oryx_and_Crake)

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amelius
Frightening question: what if this technology could be targeted not at
species, but at races?

~~~
Tade0
You mean humans?

AFAIK human "races" are largely superficial biologically - there are some
correlations, but weaker than the variability between individuals.

~~~
system2
By the time DNA wars begin, we will be already very mixed as a planet.

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vagab0nd
I remember having a conversation with a friend a couple years ago, about a
hypothetical scenario where a more intelligent species would someday threaten
human existence. We'd then point to mosquitoes and say, _look how we hate
these little guys and they are still everywhere_.

Well, that was that.

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tomatotomato37
What technical limitations allow us to genetically target mosquitos with this
but not the malaria parasite itself?

~~~
sampo
This is a good question. I don't have a full answer.

The proposed gene drive causes male mosquitoes to produce sperm that, when it
fertilizes egg cells, will lead to only make offspring. After several
generations of this spreading, eventually all offspring will be male, and that
will be the last generation.

The gene drive does this by attacking the genes in the mosquito sex
determination system called doublesex. I guess, no-one has discovered a
similar vulnerable mechanism in the malaria plasmodium sex determination
genes. The malaria plasmodium is a single-celled organism, and it goes through
both asexual and sexual reproductive phases in its life cycle. But it does go
through the sexual phase, too.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doublesex](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doublesex)

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davesque
What will be the effect on humanity when we lose a constant source of
stimulation for our immune systems? Perhaps it will actually set us up for a
pandemic of apocalyptic proportions.

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chdaniel
this sound like that game — horizon zero dawn

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peteretep
ITT: people who live in countries that aren’t ravaged by malaria share their
vague feelings of doubt about whether or not getting rid of mosquitos is a
good idea

~~~
nkozyra
If you've been personally affected by malaria your immediate impulse is do
whatever it takes to stop it.

But we know nothing comes for free, no good human deed goes unpunished.

There's a lot of debate about whether destroying malaria-carrying mosquitoes
would have _any_ side effects whatsoever. Alternately, it may have some.

I don't think your characterization is fair, in other words. Those of us in
areas not immediately affected are insulated against that emotional response,
but we must be aware of the reality of malaria's toll. But destroying an
entire species is a draconian approach that should require a great deal of
thought.

~~~
krageon
> But we know nothing comes for free, no good human deed goes unpunished.

We know nothing of the sort. Perhaps this is something _you_ know.

~~~
ivanhoe
Pretty much all projects of large-scale human ecological interventions ended
up with some unexpected side-effect. It's extremely hard to take into account
all the variables and often you fix one issue, but create 10 new ones. Just
think of using myxomatosis to control rabbit population, or introduction of
cane toads in Australia in attempt to control sugarcane pests.

~~~
andrepd
Erradication of smallpox?

~~~
ivanhoe
Well, it's a bit different with viruses as they're not directly part of the
food chain for complex organisms - unlike mosquitos that are important food
source to many insects, fish and birds. For instance for some fish and their
fry the mosquito larvae are the primary food source, so if you destroy the
complete population of mosquitos you might also severely affect some fish
species. Some spiders and birds will also be left hungry. That can then affect
other ecological niches up the food chain, perhaps even cause a collapse of
the whole biotop system.

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avium
Not my area of expertise at all, but mosquitoes seem unique in nature in that
they can pick up diseases from one animal and spread them to another by direct
blood transfusion. I've long wondered if this might confer some kind of
advantage to the animals being bit, perhaps along the lines of how vaccines
work.

~~~
zimpenfish
Possibly also leeches -
[https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8073013](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8073013)

"many fish leeches directly transmit several blood parasites" "Consequently,
the leech is a potential vector of many pathogens, especially in regions with
an endemic spread of human and/or animal pathogens."

