
“Not everybody lives in California”: Tesla Model 3's frozen door handles - howard941
https://qz.com/1541060/tesla-model-3-owners-are-griping-about-frozen-door-handles/
======
elipsey
This spate of reports about performance and reliability problems for electric
cars in extremely cold weather has pointed out lots of problem with
reliability and reduced range. To be meaningful and useful, these really ought
to include comparisons to conventional internal combustion cars.

I lived in Fairbanks for a while, and I found that lots of things don’t work
well when it’s -40, especially cars. I had to plug in the block heater at
least a few hours in advance of starting, and then idle for at least 15
minutes before driving. A block heater and battery blanket were necessary but
sometimes not sufficient. My gas mileage was reduced by about half. There were
lots of cars with mechanical problems that only crop up in those conditions.
Some had doors, windows, or gas doors that would freeze. Relays and (starter!)
solenoids would get stuck. A few had heater cores that would would ice and
stop working so the heat and window defrost were not usable. Some displays
won’t work when they are cold. The manufacturers say they test for this stuff,
but it was obviously not fully addressed.

Don’t assume your ICE car is going to work well when it’s that cold. Nothing
works right when it’s that cold. When we use things in an environment that
differs greatly form that in which they were engineered and tested are bound
to surprise us. Even my bike didn’t work right up there. The grease in the
headset and wheel bearings got really viscous and stiff, the cables and
shifters were balky, and the breaks felt funny.

I actually managed to bike commute pretty often as a student, partly because
it was more reliable then driving. My ski jacket was made plastic so it got
really stiff and crumpley feeling like cardboard. When I got to school my
phone screen didn’t work, and my laptop wouldn’t turn on until it warmed up,
but the bike at least never made me late, which is more than I could say for
any car.

~~~
slededit
-40 is pretty rare for most of us, but -20c (-4 f) is not too uncommon in many parts of the mid-west.

My ICE car handled the polar vortex just fine. Although any marginal parts are
vastly more likely to fail, I imagine a lot of batteries were replaced.

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CharlesColeman
I just realized the other day that winter weather will most likely mean that
self-driving cars will more dangerous than conventional cars in much of the
world for the foreseeable future, until they can be made fully autonomous in
even the most difficult weather conditions.

Winter driving can be some of the most difficult and dangerous conditions to
drive in _for a human_. It's already bad enough after the first big snow when
experienced fair-weather drivers have to re-acquaint themselves with winter
conditions, but if they're driving skills atrophy in good weather due to self-
driving car use, it will be _even worse_.

~~~
stcredzero
_if they 're driving skills atrophy in good weather due to self-driving car
use, it will be even worse._

I remember driving in New Hampshire in the 80's as an undergraduate, thinking
to myself, "They drive like it's winter _all year!_ " If people only drove
when it was winter, perhaps they'd drive like I drive now in middle age: to
minimize the chance of collision. (As opposed to how I drove like a butthead
in my 20's.) No assuming the turn signal is true. No assuming oncoming traffic
will brake for you when you merge. (Unless you simply have no choice.) No
merging turns unless you have first actually seen the oncoming traffic.

On the whole, US drivers are too aggressive, and make too many assumptions. If
people could model the behavior of autonomous vehicles, maybe they'd drive
more rationally. (I'm Asian, and many would call my driving "Asian driving." I
just don't think it's the smart or rational tradeoff to risk any more than you
have to in the way of car damage, injury, or death just to get someplace a few
minutes faster. Really, that strikes me as just plain stupid.)

~~~
JoeAltmaier
In Iowa I like to say "Every summer Iowans quit believing in winter, and it
takes them completely by surprise." The first day or two of driving in snow
are a huge surge in accidents.

So no, its not auto-driving cars that make winter-driving skills atrophy. Its
summer that does that.

~~~
CharlesColeman
> So no, its not auto-driving cars that make winter-driving skills atrophy.
> Its summer that does that.

My point was that summer already makes _winter_ driving skills atrophy, but
self-driving cars will make _general_ driving skills atrophy at the same time.

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Barrin92
Reminds me of the case of an automated soap dispenser not reliably detecting
African American users.

The high concentration of tech in one particular part of only a minority of
countries will almost certainly lead to more of these occurrences.

The concentration of production and mostly homogenous workforce involved in
the process will undercut basic discovery processes that would expose these
sort of design in the design process, not when the products ship out to
customers.

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mirimir
Just spray with windshield washer fluid. Or straight anhydrous methanol, if
you like. Windshield washer fluid for sure won't damage the finish. Methanol
might, but probably not.

Methanol depresses the freezing point of water at low concentration. Adding
~10% methanol to gasoline was a classic for deicing fuel lines.

~~~
Zecar
Windshield washer fluid is generally methanol just fyi

~~~
mirimir
That was the point :)

But it does contain some water, and detergent. So straight methanol works
better.

Just don't drink it. And it's very biodegradable.

