

Ask HN: college degree - creativebeing

I want to be financially independent by age 35, as in im no longer forced to work. Would a college degree be worth it for the knowledge and salary increase in achieving this goal, or would it be better to learn on my own and be self employed.
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jmduke
There is very little chance that you will achieve that through a salaried
position, with or without a degree.

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pukka_my
College may not make a huge difference if you are comfortable living like an
adolescent when all of your friends are starting families, vacationing in
Thailand, buying whatever new iObject is out this October - but it makes a
huge difference if you want to do any of those things yourself. Right now I
doubt you're in a position to know for sure if you ever want kids or decent
furniture or to live by yourself. You may even discover that you enjoy working
and want to have a career past age 35, an age which probably seems much older
from your vantage than mine.

I think the HN community in general tends to underrate the value of college in
developing the kind of soft skills (project management, playing well with
others, critical thinking, learning how to study something new, writing &
presentation skills) that make a real difference in how good an
employee/manager/co-founder can be. I would never hire anyone without at least
a few years college experience - even if they kick ass at one or two things,
they would probably not be as prepared to develop into new roles and skills.

Also, college gives you the opportunity to engage with subjects and people
outside of your current interests/peers - whether or not that has a direct
impact on your career/life, it will likely make you a more empathetic,
tolerant and interesting human being.

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ameister14
Ok, well let's break this down for you. This isn't terribly accurate but it
should give you a place to start.

It's not unreasonable to expect an average 8% return on your money if you put
it in the stock market and hold it there for the next 50 years, particularly
if you just track indexes.

So assuming an 8% return, and no inflation, how much would you need to live on
72k a year? 900k. Oh, wait, you're going to pay capital gains tax. At current
rates (these will change) you need around 85000. That means 1.062 million.

Inflation exists. So, let's say that averages 5% a year. No problem, you make
a percentage return too. You're just going to have to live on a real value of
7.6% return on investment, which moves your starting bankroll up to around
1.12 million.

You're going to want more than that, though; medical expenses, buying a house
or car, college for children etc. will clean you out.

But let's say none of that applies to you. If you start working at 18 making
100k a year and using 72k of it to live on each year, after taxes you're in
debt already.

So, cut back on the living expenses and say you live in a small efficiency and
use about 2k a month. You can conceivably save 40-50k a year this way. It'll
only take you 23 years or so to make the amount you need if everything goes
perfectly, you never have a girlfriend or go out to bars and you're
conscientious about saving.

Now, this time can be lessened if you have a matching 401k or something, but
the return will be lower as well and there are liquidity issues there, so I
didn't have that included as an option.

So do the math yourself on cost benefit. Use average salaries as a guide and
recognize that money is only a small part of the reason people go to college.

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6thSigma
Did you factor in compounded interest with dividends and annual additions?
Over 50 years that will not be insignificant.

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ameister14
I didn't because I wanted to get the barest estimate first to give him a
general starting point. I also didn't factor inflation into the principal;
whoops on the latter.

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slajax
If you want to retire that early then a salary / comfortable job won't get you
there. Especially if you are as young as you sound and are already requiring
6k a month. Your best option is to skip the degree and go for broke on the
next big thing if you want to legitimately retire. That is provided you
actually have the means to do so and this isn't mania speaking. The problem
with a salary job is you get comfortable and buy more stuff until eventually
you make babies. You should revise your goal to "working for yourself" as it
sounds like what you actually desire is freedom. It's a much different
scenario to retire at 35 then it is to automate a passive income which affords
you freedom. 6k a month is only 600 customers at 9.99 recurring.

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jmole
How old are you now? If you're young, and you can hustle some financial aid
(not as hard as you think), then go for it.

A degree is more about access than knowledge, TBH. Go to a good school, find
some professors working on really cutting-edge shit, and work for them. That
will give you a better education than just about anything else. If you're just
taking classes, any non-Ivy school is going to give you the same education you
could get for free online (assuming you really put the effort in).

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creativebeing
im almost 21. The aid is certainly an option if i qualify as in need. So your
saying that the value is how much you learn and get out of it, not so much the
value the paper will give you into jobs?

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cmwelsh
As an entrepreneur, I often wish I had just invested the 4 years and gotten a
degree. The piece of paper guarantees you a minimum of 60,000 dollars per year
in America. It's a way for upper middle class kids to get their parents to pay
for an easy button into their first career. As an individual with that
privilege, it's a must-use.

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xiaoma
> _The piece of paper guarantees you a minimum of 60,000 dollars per year in
> America._

If only that were the case, it would be a much better investment.

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jchonphoenix
Depends on the university you go to.

Also, most kids go to college with the mindset that they're there to have fun.
If people actually attended college with the intent of getting a job and
didn't major in basket weaving (art history majors I'm looking at you) then
this figure would be much more likely.

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csixty4
Also depends on location. $60k might be a good entry-level salary in the
Valley, but starting salaries are lower in the midwest & east coast where the
cost of living is lower.

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creativebeing
ok, i realized i really messed up, its not 6000 a month, its per year. sorry
about that.

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creativebeing
i should add im going to be living off about 6000 a month during this time. so
if im earning 100k a year that adds up quick. but im nowhere near that atm.
Right now im working full time as a .net coder for a low wage as i just
started.

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Kluny
Where do you live? I live in one of Canada's most expensive cities, but I live
on less than $1000 a month. I am comfortable and don't feel poor, but a lot of
people would call my house a slum and my rations meagre. If you can practice a
little austerity, even 30,000 a year will allow you to accomplish your goal.

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slajax
Seriously? I live in Vancouver and used to live in Toronto. I don't know
anyone who can live comfortably on that amount. Hell I couldn't even live
comfortably on that in Nova Scotia. You must have some extreme couponing
skillz or something because 1k a month barely covers rent on a 1 bedroom in
the burbs here. Would love to know how you do it.

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nalidixic
Ditto. I'm in Calgary and there is no way you can live off 1k a month here
unless your payment free and even then it would be tight as hell on 1k.

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creativebeing
sorry, sorry, 6000 a year

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minimaxir
That's a rather...loftly goal. What kind of work are you doing currently?

