

Lollipuff (YC W13) eBay-like Fashion Marketplace without the Fakes - beambot
http://techcrunch.com/2013/03/17/yc-backed-lollipuff-is-an-ebay-like-marketplace-for-authenticated-designer-clothing-and-accessories/

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beambot
We recently did a survey for Herve Leger (tight bandage dresses) on eBay.
According to our experts, greater than 60% of the Herve dresses sold on eBay
were fake [1]. Heh, that means eBay profited more on counterfeit Herve Leger
than authentic ones.

This sort of thing drives us _crazy_. We're fighting against the counterfeit
epidemic head on. You can only hear so many stories about buyers ending up
with a fake $2000 Chanel (often learning that it's fake years later) or
sellers getting scammed after selling a legit item (unscrupulous buyers filing
fake claims, resulting in loss of both the item and sale money to the
seller)...

/Lollipuff co-founder.

[1] [https://www.lollipuff.com/blog/41/ebays-counterfeit-
epidemic...](https://www.lollipuff.com/blog/41/ebays-counterfeit-epidemic-
herve-leger-edition)

~~~
eurleif
>fake $2000 Chanel (often learning that it's fake years later)

If the fake is so similar to the real thing that it's possible to be fooled by
it for years, who cares? Who is harmed besides Chanel?

~~~
bebefuzz
As someone who is familiar with Chanel, the difference is night and day.
However, for someone new to the brand, it's not. A fake Chanel bag is made
with the most inferior materials and craftmanship. It's usually the newbies
that don't know off the bat. And, those who are knowledgeable deal with stress
and loss of money once they get the item in their hands.

~~~
eurleif
>A fake Chanel bag is made with the most inferior materials and craftmanship.

But apparently the bags are durable enough to last for years, so the materials
and craftsmanship can't be that bad.

>And, those who are knowledgeable deal with stress and loss of money once they
get the item in their hands.

The stress is caused by attachment to status symbols, and could be better
solved by letting go of such bullshit. And they would have lost the same money
by buying a genuine Chanel bag, which is only considered to be worth that much
money because of the brand.

~~~
dmohs
> But apparently the bags are durable enough to last for > years, so the
> materials and craftsmanship can't be that bad.

As a recently-converted believer, I recommend you take a look at a five-year-
old version of each and then make your judgement. The difference is
significant.

> which is only considered to be worth that much money because > of the brand.

Perceived value isn't less real simply because it is all in our heads ;)

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redact207
The concept of luxury brands still completely bewilders me. Living in Asia
where literally every girl clutches an LV, Chanel or Gucci bag, the abundance
of what ultimately is a social ranking tool serves to cancel itself out. The
fact that you're required to line up outside the store is downright insulting.

Apologies for the side-rant, the site itself fills a very real need and kudos
for that. I just feel some people would feel more validated carrying around a
bank statement instead of a handbag.

~~~
rjb
Wouldn't the opposite be just as bewildering then? There really is no
difference between buying a Hermes dress and buying Dickies overalls, right?
Each item makes a statement and each person is well aware of the statement it
makes. Both can be bought for practical reasons. Both make comments on social
placement. Both help people identify themselves. Both help find/identify
suitable mates.

I too find it so hard to believe people spend so much on apparel, but that
thought is no different than people finding it odd that I spend so little. Of
course, some items are easy to liquidate and others are not.

~~~
eurleif
>There really is no difference between buying a Hermes dress and buying
Dickies overalls, right?

There would be an aesthetic difference. But status symbols are about more than
just aesthetics. It's not like you need to buy overpriced brands just to get
things that look good. In fact, the existence of the fake goods this site is
trying to weed out proves that.

~~~
rjb
>There would be an aesthetic difference.

This is my point. People have value systems and brands and styles can be a
part of that. An inability to identify with someone buying overpriced goods
does not make the judgement process any different that their inability to
identify with the practicality of buying things at a fair price that look
good.

~~~
eurleif
But the judgement process _is_ different. You can only tell which brand is
better if you've heard of the brands. It's an external judgement,
internalized. But you can make an aesthetic judgement even if you've been
living under a rock.

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ameister14
My first instinct was that this appeared to be a very low volume industry and
a really small niche market of people that are buying second hand and desire
expert verification.

Then I thought about it for a while, and I can see where you're coming from. A
percentage fee seems like it could work with lower volumes.

I'm curious about the site's design, though. Why did you choose to organize
the auction the way you did, scrolling down one item at a time? It seems a bit
disorganized; are you planning on adding more categorization?

I notice you only accept three brands. Is there a legal or a verification
bottleneck that prevents you from covering others?

~~~
bebefuzz
Hi, thanks for your thoughts.

Authentication is a skill, and that's why other sites who decide to take on
all secondhand designers at once usually have counterfeits leak through.

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cm2012
My company sells fine jewelry on amazon, eBay, buy.com marketplace, Newegg
marketplace, shop.com and more. We connect to all of them automatically
through Channel Advisor, as do many large fashion companies. If you connect to
CA, you will have a world of sellers you can select from who wouldn't bother
with your small site otherwise. We all pay $10000 or more a year to use it so
it's serious businesses.

~~~
beambot
Thanks for the pointer! We'll definitely look into Channel Advisor as we start
taking on more power sellers.

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nedwin
TechCrunch yesterday: "If you think 10% is a good transaction fee for your
marketplace, then you will struggle"
[http://techcrunch.com/2013/03/16/marketplaces-businesses-
are...](http://techcrunch.com/2013/03/16/marketplaces-businesses-are-tough-to-
build/) TechCrunch today: Check out this startup taking on an encumbent with a
sub-10% (7%) transaction fee.

~~~
bebefuzz
:) Yep. We read this too, and we loved this comment:

Steven Cox 22 hours ago- The amount of margin a company can extract from the
marketplace depends on a couple factors: (1) Amount of competition within the
category, (2) the amount of value the company is providing that market
participants are willing to pay for (example: a listing site vs. a listing
site plus scheduling and billing tools), (3) the virality of the business
(lower CAC = ability to charge lower fees), and (4) the presence of a
recurring revenue stream (allows for lower margin per transaction).

No matter what margin the business decides on, the strategic decision each
company must ask is how much adoption is needed today vs. the expeted margin.
The higher the growth needed, the lower the fees need to be.

Once, I heard an early eBay Executive explain how eBay's initial low fees
allowed them to run away from other early auction sites. They were priced low
enough to where no one could undercut them and priced where the market
contributors deemed the fees reasonable. The other sites had two options:
charge less and go out of business or charge more per transaction to get the
same revenue output - which caused the market contributors to seek out a lower
cost solution (eBay). Game over.

Part art, part science... and a tank load of work.

~~~
nedwin
I definitely agree it's part art and part science.

"The higher the growth needed, the lower the fees need to be."

I don't think that's strictly true. If you had two companies and one had three
times the margin of the other, this gives them three times the revenue of the
other to acquire and service new customers.

Without the margin you need to go the massive VC route, which is what eBay
pursued. Depends on how you want to build the business I guess.

I run a marketplace too, good luck! :)

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minouye
Cool idea. One question: why focus on Chanel? Since Chanel has been using
holograms for years, isn't there more opportunity in focusing on brands that
aren't as easy to authenticate (e.g. LV which does insane volume on eBay)?

~~~
bebefuzz
Chanel is still very difficult to authenticate for most Chanel admirers. We
wanted to start off with the hottest most recognizable bags, shoes and
dresses.

