
Indiegogo fund raises enough money to buy video of Mayor Rob Ford smoking crack - muratmutlu
http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/rob-ford-crackstarter
======
iharris
Some context: Rob Ford is the mayor of Toronto, the most populous city in
Canada. This is the newest of numerous controversies during his time in
office.

Edit: it's also worth noting that Mayor Ford's relationship with the media has
been... colorful. Some funny cases include him calling 80% of journalists
"maggots" (1) and lying about a drunken outburst back in 2006 (2).

(1)
[http://read.thestar.com/#!/article/51a27b477b1eacc589c3f4ae-...](http://read.thestar.com/#!/article/51a27b477b1eacc589c3f4ae-
rob-ford-there-s-no-video-reporters-are-a-bunch-of-maggots)

(2)
[http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/story/2006/05/03/tor-f...](http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/story/2006/05/03/tor-
ford060503.html)

~~~
HorizonXP
The fact that this is getting such widespread attention is making Toronto look
like a farce, and as someone from there, it really upsets me. Now when I tell
people I'm from Toronto, it will be, "Oh, that's the city with the crack
smoking mayor right?"

Really unfortunate and despicable. Cannot believe we voted this idiot into
office.

~~~
soperj
To be fair, this: "Oh, that's the city with the crack smoking mayor right?"
Could also refer to Washington DC.

~~~
spamizbad
Washington DC would be "Oh, that's the city with the crack smoking mayor _who
was reelected_ , right?"

------
CoachRufus87
Obviously a lot of you guys don't like Mr. Ford and he doesn't sound like a
decent person, but why is this on HN? I fail to see how this relates to tech
or entrepreneurship.

~~~
raganwald
This political story is at the top of HN despite the guidelines for the same
reason that your remarks are at the top of the comments... _despite the
guidelines urging us not to comment on why something doesn't belong on HN_.

~~~
grimtrigger
Not all the guidelines make sense in all situations.

They are "guide"lines.

If someone doesn't believe this story belongs on HN and politely gives valid
reasons, I see no problem.

~~~
raganwald
I think we are agreeing with each other.

------
mladenkovacevic
I'm a Torontonian, and definitely not a fan of Rob Ford, but somehow it feels
like there is an ongoing, organized effort to get him out of the office and
out of politics (whether by the opposing parties, or some other organization).
Sometimes he really doesn't help the issue by somehow managing to charge head
first into even more trouble, but the string of various things he's been
charged/accused of can't be coincidental.

Now there's a video of him smoking crack (which it looks like nobody will see,
but trust us - it's there!), then there are some anonymous drug dealers who
swear that Rob's brother Doug was a major drug-lord back in the day (which for
some reason, just surfaces now).

I don't know... it's all a bit convenient and yet ethereal.

~~~
themstheones
He fired his chief of staff last week for telling him to go to rehab. This is
according to the Sun which, as newspapers go, has been his cheerleader for the
past ten years.

So you can't claim there's no substance to the drug allegations when his
highest ranking staff-member is advising him to get help.

~~~
mladenkovacevic
Is this the article? [http://www.torontosun.com/2013/05/23/rob-ford-told-to-
go-to-...](http://www.torontosun.com/2013/05/23/rob-ford-told-to-go-to-rehab)

Here's how that accusation starts: "But a source familiar with the situation
told the Sun...". So again, no names, no factual evidence, nothing concrete.
Just for the record I'm not saying that Rob Ford didn't smoke crack or that
his brother wasn't some kind of drug lord... in fact it wouldn't surprise me
at all. I'm just commenting on how relentlessly someone seems to be trying to
ruin their political careers.

As far as the Sun being Ford's cheerleader, yes it's true they are the token
"conservative" media outlet. Just as Fox News is the conservative source in
the US. But here's what I believe about their role in the media landscape. As
the most prominent conservative media, their job is to be so ludicrous and
untrustworthy that only the most hard-core conservatives would actually listen
to them. The John Stewart show is quite good at highlighting just how
ridiculous Fox News is, for example. This way you are left with other more-or-
less liberal mainstream media as the most accessible and most credible source
of news. This way you can channel all kinds of propaganda along with the other
"trustworthy" news. And that's how wars and surveillance-drones are sold to
tax-payers. Sorry for the conspiracy theory rant.

~~~
sbarre
You say "someone" but the people who are writing these articles are easily
identified and researched.

The two journalists who did the Globe and Mail piece are award-winning well
respected investigative journalists.

I doubt they would risk their careers, or waste their time, on someone else's
false claims.

~~~
mladenkovacevic
No I agree... Let's say these are absolutely responsible journalists with
solid sources and reliable evidence. What's really strange and somewhat
worrying is, why is this torrent of information suddenly coming out now. Both
Rob and Doug Ford have been in politics for years.

What if whoever has these anonymous drug dealers in their pocket has decided
for one reason or another to unleash them on the media and ruin the Fords'
reputations.

The possibility that our politics and public opinion is not controlled by
democracy, but rather some private (and possibly criminal) interests worries
me far more than whether Rob Ford indeed smoked crack or not.

~~~
sbarre
That's a fair question for sure.. In my opinion, the Ford brothers have been
escalating things with the media (who are more than happy to reciprocate) for
a while, and things just came to a head with this crack video thing, and
everyone decided "let's do this" and the gloves came off..

Oh, and I think they've been doing a fine job of ruining their own reputations
(I'm half-joking about that one but Rob Ford really does have almost-weekly
blunders)..

------
dmix
Ugh...

> UPDATE-- MAY 27, 2013, 9:46 AM EASTERN EDT: We have had no further contact
> with the people we believe to have custody of this video since the last
> update.

IMPORTANT UPDATE: Our confidence that we can consummate this transaction has
diminished.

~~~
themstheones
The fallback position of giving the money to addiction and mental health
charities was arguably a better outcome than giving the money to dealers.

And one of the reporters who saw the video was on the radio this morning
saying that three other copies are floating around.

~~~
mladenkovacevic
So it's a win-win-win.. the supposed drug-dealers are 200k short, the people
who originally donated money to defame and ruin a man's political career now
feel noble and charitable again because it turns our they donated to a good
cause after all, and Rob Ford's political career is ruined forever. Couldn't
have asked for a more wonderfully humanitarian outcome.

------
borgchick
Perhaps the drug dealers got smart, "hey, if we hand over the video showing
Ford smoking the crack we sold him, doesn't that prove we are drug dealers?
damn mo-fo, we outta here!"

~~~
sbarre
Well I had actually wondered as well about the simple logistics of accepting a
$200k payment.

Clearly Gawker would need some kind of paper trail before making that payment,
not just for tax purposes but simply because I'm pretty sure there are laws
that govern transfers that large..

So the recipient would have to declare that income at tax time (and possibly
even file paperwork on receipt) to at the very least pay taxes on it, which
would put them on the government's radar, which is something they may want
less than they would want $200k..

~~~
robotresearcher
It's still legal to use cash to pay for things. Let's not assume that we've
lost that ability until it happens. It's an important privacy we shouldn't
give up easily.

~~~
sbarre
I'm not sure that a US business can take out $200k from the bank, bring it
across the border into Canada undeclared, and give it to a random person
without any kind of paperwork or tracking..

Maybe I'm wrong! I'd just be pretty surprised about it..

~~~
robotresearcher
You're right about the border crossing. I didn't consider that. Canada wants
documentation after $10K.

<http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/publications/pub/bsf5052-eng.html>

------
cmbaus
This somewhat off topic, but I just got back from Toronto last week. Great
city. It has been 20 years since I've been up there and a lot has changed.

There are concerns about the development that is going on, but seeing new
urban housing going up is refreshing compared with many US cities which
effectively have no growth policies.

Based on the number of units that seemed ready to hit the market, I suspect
Toronto could see significantly lower housing prices in the future. I just
hope it doesn't end in financial ruin for the banks.

~~~
afterburner
On the other hand about 60,000 immigrants move to Toronto every year, so
there's plenty of people who want housing.

~~~
cmbaus
I think it good that developers in the city are able to meet the demand rather
than ignore it. I'd like to see this level of development happening in US
cities. It looks like progress.

------
Oculus
As a Torontonian, this is just embarrassing. Someone get this guy out of
office already..

------
Apocryphon
You know, I had been previously thinking about crowdfunding competitors to
Kickstarter. Like Google, that company has pretty much cornered the market in
mindshare to the point that kickstarting is synonymous with crowdfunding. Good
on Indiegogo, the West Coast/Silicon Valley alternative, for establishing
itself with this, I guess.

~~~
shawnc
IndieGoGo has nothing to do with this, aside from it being on their site. It's
a poorly written headline. If anything it should say 'Gawker fund raises
enough money...'

But yes, i'm very happy to see others succeeding at crowdfunding outside of
KickStarter, and I firmly believe those with large followings don't even need
to be using an outside source, but could be doing it on their own websites.

------
bsims
Is anyone else bothered by the fact that if the [Insert Kickstarter project
here] doesn't materialize there are few things holding the founder/creator
accountable?

In this case, if they don't obtain the video they are simply going to donate
$200k to a charity that they will "figure out what that is later if it comes
to it."

------
phaus
Weren't they originally claiming that his drug dealers shot the video? If so,
isn't it actually more harmful to society to give a bunch of crack dealers
$200,000 than it is for the mayor of Toronto to smoke crack?

~~~
xxchan
Compare who has more influence and therefore potential for harming the public
- two dealers with $200k or a crackhead mayor of a city with 2.6M inhabitants.

------
cmnzs
Interestingly, another candidate (George Smitherman) who ran against Ford for
the 2010 municipal election in Toronto admitted to being addicted to "an
illegal drug" before running for political office.

I wasn't living in Toronto when the election was going on so I didn't really
pay attention to the media re: the election, but I wonder how they portrayed
him at the time

------
sinemetu11
This is definitely interesting. It makes me wonder if there is a possibility
to crowd-fund more "information retrieval" like this.

------
ronnier
I have no idea who Mayor Rob Ford is, but I assume he must be to the right of
center for this to be the top item on HN.

~~~
chollida1
If only there was a way for you to look this up...

<http://lmgtfy.com/?q=Rob+Ford>

~~~
ronnier
It's more of a comment about the predictability of political articles on HN.

~~~
greghinch
And the predictability of the outright hypocrisy so many right -wing
politicians find themselves caught in...

~~~
pyre
But who else to tell us about the horrors is drug addiction than someone who's
been there? </sarcasm>

------
bob13579
Seems like a bait-and-switch. Horrible.

~~~
kmfrk
They will donate any surplus money to a charity relevant to dealing with drug
addiction.

------
quinndupont
And, there's a good chance that the video will not surface because Rob Ford
(or, you know, the way mob bosses wink) ordered the murder of the video owner:
[http://gawker.com/ford-staffer-tells-police-about-tip-
linkin...](http://gawker.com/ford-staffer-tells-police-about-tip-linking-
crack-video-509995085)

[Edit: uhm, tongue in cheek, obviously. But Rob Ford is pretty clearly messed
up with some dodgy people doing dodgy things.]

~~~
corresation
Do you realize you can actually face legal consequences for so flippantly
making such a claim?

~~~
quinndupont
Really? He's going to send the entire Internet to court on libel charges? Last
week his defender's came out saying that the video was fake or didn't exist.
This week, the Globe and Mail produced an article that was the result of two
year's of investigation that shows just how deep the Ford family is in the
drug business. Whether these allegations are true or not, at this point would
it be beyond the realm of possibility?

~~~
corresation
You aren't the entire Internet. And yes, random people saying random things
(through the bravery of seeming anonymity) have led to a number of well known
libel cases.

