
A Summer from Hell Is Coming to U.S. Airports - pseudolus
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-05-28/a-summer-from-hell-is-coming-to-u-s-airports
======
komali2
This article popped up for me as I stood in line at Atlanta airport for 40
minutes. They have 20 checkpoints, one is opened.

Finally they gave up putting everyone through the genital analyzer and just
had us all go through the metal detector, only first I had to get yelled at
for not putting my stuff in a bin ("but sir there are no bins"), then for
putting it in the orange bin ("orange means stop! Don't use the orange bin!"),
then for not going through the metal detector at I guess the flat out Sprint
they wanted me to go through it at.

The fuck is the point. This shit depresses my partner every time we travel. It
feels like we're cattle. It's dehumanizing and none of my representatives have
the power to do anything about it - why do I even have representatives?

Edit: to the poster who asked why I refer to men as "sir," then deleted their
comment, I'm not at all offended. I code switched to my southern dialect while
I was in Georgia. Using the honorific will typically garner me more good will
down here. If I was back in Wisconsin, it'd piss people off, so I don't use it
there, for example. Or anywhere else really cause it's kinda weird.

~~~
acct1771
> The fuck is the point. This shit depresses my partner every time we travel.
> It feels like we're cattle. It's dehumanizing...

It sounds like you understand the point of this program juuuust fine.

The effective rate of capture of dangerous weapons is pitiful (less than 10%
according to both their own internal audits, and external tests performed by
citizens).

At best, it was a jobs program for many lacking education, and was also good
reason to sell those backscatter machines that someone in Congress' cousin or
business associate's company was selling at the time.

~~~
devoply
What I found really interesting is all this shit treatment has not effected
tourism to the United States. I would think there would be huge backlash to
all of this, but nope US continues to be a popular spot for foreigners to
visit. They don't care about the dehumanization. If there was a huge backlash
they might stop to not hurt all the tourism dollars, but no they just keep on
keeping on.

~~~
creato
Because is it really that terrible? Yeah airport security is a bit annoying
and maybe you get sternly told to do something. So what?

The comments here make it sound like the TSA is committing war crimes or
something.

I think it's dumb, I think it's a waste of time, I think it's ineffective.

I also think that most of the time, most people spend 5-40 minutes in line,
get through it, and promptly forget about it. Expecting it to affect tourism
to the US seems totally absurd to me.

~~~
chrismcb
Yes it is terrible. It wastes billions of dollars plus additional billions of
dollars of time. It is unconstitutional. It doesnt do anything. And it
purports to make us safe by making us unsafe. We have to stand in line that
can easily be targeted, stands next to a barrel full of suspected explisives,
walk barefoot across a dirty floor, and potentially felt up.

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dtwest
I'd like to suggest an alternative to bashing the TSA. (most of the comments
on here)

Let's invest more in non-road infrastructure. We need bigger airports, faster
trains, better mass transit connections to these hubs.

Airports are over capacity in the US. I was in Chicago O'Hare yesterday, there
were about 100 people sleeping on the floor throughout terminal B and C. When
my flight boarded, nobody got up from their chairs, since they were waiting
for a different flight, at a different gate, where there was no seating. Not
only that, the roof was leaking, there were 10-15 buckets dispersed in the
terminal catching rain drops from the ceiling. This is potentially the most
important air transportation hub in the country and it is crumbling. There are
plenty of other examples of this around the country.

~~~
jefflombardjr
+1 for better trains and mass transit.

Air travel is a different story, I think we should think twice about
expanding:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Environmental_impact_of_transp...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Environmental_impact_of_transport)

We probably wouldn't even need half of the short to mid range flights if we
had a decent rail system. Amtrak is a joke though - at least in the North East
Corridor

~~~
nine_k
Trains make sense in dense areas, like Northeast, Northwest and parts of
California. And some trains there are.

US is unlike Germany or England or Japan, where the density of population (and
thus of railways) is much higher than in most of the US.

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minimaxir
I recently took a look at which of the large US airports had the greatest
delays/early departures:
[https://i.redd.it/y269yhk8x1r21.png](https://i.redd.it/y269yhk8x1r21.png)

It might be interesting to take another look overtime by season/year. (the
impetus was a tweet which identified that SFO has been getting worse over
time:
[https://twitter.com/felipehoffa/status/1111050585120206848](https://twitter.com/felipehoffa/status/1111050585120206848)
)

~~~
quadcore
_I recently took a look at which of the large US airports had the greatest
delays /early departures_

Haha nice. It could be interesting to have the same map for # of flights and
some others, and from there, determine a map which indicate when the airport
process may be in fault, not the conditions in which it operates. It seems
each airport has it's own pattern, so maybe it's possible to remove the
conditions from of the maps and what's left should be the process. I guess.

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sliken
The people who rushed the bill through to create the TSA correctly predicted
the problems the TSA would mature into. Lack of competition, federal
inefficiencies, too much power, etc. They included a sunset clause to end the
TSA, it was after all to handle the perceived increase in threat because of
9/11.

Problem is, no airport wants to take the risk of replacing the TSA then
becoming libel for anything that happens.

~~~
dredmorbius
s/libel/liable/

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AlexCoventry
This is the most ominous part of the article:

> _TSA staffers volunteer to take on unspecified work at the U.S.-Mexico
> border._

What are they going to be doing down there?

~~~
empath75
Collect a check doing nothing important at the border instead of an airport.

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thrower123
That's what you get when you run with no slack; any hiccup cascades.

~~~
lisper
No, it's what you get when consumers choose low fares. Slack costs money.
Extra capacity to make contingencies less painful is expensive. People don't
want to pay for it. It's not an unreasonable choice.

~~~
martinald
So if fares were higher airlines would spend that money on nearly always
unused planes sitting somewhere? Not quite sure that's what happens.

Ryanair in Europe must run at one of the highest load factors (over 95%
compared to American Airlines 80%).

Ryanair also has some of the lowest cancellation/delays in Europe too. They
had a fair few 737 MAX in service but don't seem to be suffering from mass
cancellations as far as I can tell.

~~~
jdsully
Seems to be what they used to do prior to deregulation and to a lesser extent
in the 90s/2000s. Every flight being full is a more recent phenomena and they
are getting better at it over time [1]. When flights aren't full you can pull
a plane out of its normal route and fly those passengers on the later one.

[1]
[https://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/flights/todayinthesky/...](https://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/flights/todayinthesky/2018/02/01/airlines-
set-record-filling-seats-planes-2017/1087532001/)

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huonpine
Every time there is a massive line for security check I think to myself "why
do they allow more people to cogenerate pre security check then on a plane"

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changoplatanero
Give TSA precheck to everyone.

~~~
snuxoll
Or we could finally just get rid of the agency altogether, I don't think I'm
alone hoping there will be a day when there's finally a straw to break the
camels back and shutter the entire TSA.

~~~
mprev
Genuine question from someone outside the US. I see lots of Americans object
to the TSA but is it the agency or the function that people object to?

I only ever flew once pre-911 but I seem to recall a security process here in
Europe not hugely different from today. What changed in the US with the
introduction of the TSA?

~~~
jessriedel
Airport security in the US used to be privately contracted until 9/11\. In the
aftermath, TSA security replaced the private security at all but a handful of
airports, and simultaneously tightened screening procedures. Over subsequent
years, the airport security experience got significantly worse in terms of
longer lines, privacy invasion, and more burdensome screening (although these
changed at different time and in lumpy ways). Because of this history and the
lack of alternatives, it's hard to tell how much of this is because the agency
is dysfunctional and how much is an unavoidable aspect of increased security
standards which are pretty widely supported by the general public (but not
HN).

~~~
briandear
I have the exact same “privacy invasion” at airport security on domestic
European flights.

~~~
qaq
you are taking off shoes and passing through full body scanners ?

~~~
mprev
The shoes, it depends on how big they are. The body scanners ... roughly a
third of the time.

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viburnum
Just make flying more expensive.

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fulafel
What's the estimated CO2e reduction?

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mjevans
Is there an alternate source that isn't auto-playing video + paywalled?

~~~
lisper
Just disable Javascript

~~~
stickfigure
Strange that this was downvoted, because it's actually _the answer_ for a wide
variety of news sites, including bloomberg.

I do not suggest disabling javascript globally, just for certain sites. The
reading experience is dramatically improved.

~~~
inetknght
I _do_ suggest disabling javascript globally and enabling it for certain
sites.

