
We Have Luxurious Jobs but We Are Not Aware of It - gedrap
http://blog.gedrap.me/blog/2014/02/27/we-have-luxurious-jobs-but-we-are-not-aware-of-it/
======
spindritf
Yes, working from home is great. It is a luxury. Working at your own pace is
also nice.

But working "on the Internet" means you're also comparing yourself to the
best, brightest, and driven. Then it seems like you're achieving maybe 10% of
what you seemingly could be, because you're setting your own goals based on
what you see out there.

It's like getting stuck in traffic. You can point out that I'm sitting in
climate-controlled car, listening to a podcast, drinking coffee, having a
better time than 99% of humans throughout history. It's true. I know it's
true. And I'm still frustrated that I can't go faster, and I rock in my seat
every time I move ahead a little as if trying to propel the car forward. It's
irrational, that's the point, no amount of explaining will make it go away.

~~~
aasarava
So what is the hack that keeps us from constantly taking our luxuries for
granted? Just as with the traffic situation, how often do we find ourselves
complaining about having to do the laundry or the dishes or vacuuming or even
heating up something for dinner -- all fairly small and easy tasks thanks to
the help of technology, which took much more time and labor in a previous
generation?

Yes, it's true that the complaining pushes us to find ways to make our lives
even easier. But in the meantime, why are we unable to sustain our enjoyment
for what we've got? If we could just change our thinking on this and begin to
appreciate the amazing place we've reached on a more regular basis, imagine
how much happier we'd all be. But what's the hack to do that?

~~~
TallGuyShort
I was given some brilliant advice by an older gentleman once: he said to find
1 or 2 things that enjoy more than most people, to let yourself really enjoy
those things, and be modest in all other things - and then you'll really be
happy, but be able to give more to those less fortunate. For instance, he
loved music, and he splurged to have a high-quality system in his car. And he
focused on really enjoying that, cut back in the rest of his life and gave
more to charity, and still felt like he was "living the life".

I've done the same thing. I love watching a good movie at the end of the day,
and I love visiting my home town. So I bought myself a nice TV, I take regular
trips back home, and I feel like I have it made all the time. I drive a _very_
modest vehicle and live in a _very_ modest place, but I really appreciate how
I live now and try to focus the rest of my resources on others.

~~~
msluyter
A book that may capture and elaborate on the above (esp. re: modesty) is "How
to Want What You Have" by Timothy Miller:

[http://www.amazon.com/How-Want-What-You-
Have/dp/0805033173](http://www.amazon.com/How-Want-What-You-
Have/dp/0805033173)

The typical "western" approach to happiness is: "I have X but I want Y,
therefore, to be happy I need to achieve Y." This book reverses the equation:
"I have X but want Y, therefore, to be happy I need to learn to want X." That
idea may sound radically counterintuitive on first hearing, but it's reflected
in many of the world's spiritual traditions.

What's especially great about it is that it approaches the subject from a
rational, scientific viewpoint, so if you find yourself turned off by the
spiritual side of buddhism or whatnot, the book will be welcome.

Also, music is a good call generally - the ability to play an instrument will
repay itself many times over a lifetime.

------
rjknight
No, we do not have luxurious jobs. Other people have really really shitty
jobs.

Software developers are just getting the kind of _relative_ pay and conditions
improvements that a much larger number of people took for granted in the 60s
and 70s. It's everyone else who is fucked.

~~~
Touche
This.

We enrich "business guys" with connections to billion dollar exits while we
ourselves make middle-class or slightly upper-middle class wages. Meanwhile
anyone willing to take out the loans to put themselves through Dental school
will eventually make more than we do and if they have the motivation to open
up their own practice, much more than we do.

~~~
throwaway812
I agree with the sentiment, but I think your facts are a bit off and reflect
HN insularity. The median 33% household income ("middle class") in the US is
$30,000 to $62,500 ( _household_ ).

Even if you are the sole earner in your household, it is still unlikely that
you make less than $62,500. If you do make less than that, ask for a raise. If
you don't make less than that, or your combined household income is more than
that, you are a member of the upper class, and you should try and remember
your privilege. (Hey, life's not so bad.)

~~~
allochthon
By any reasonable definition, being well-off means being able to take out a
mortgage on a house, afford occasional vacations to other parts of the world,
invest in the stock market, support a family, put your kids through college,
give to different charities, save for retirement, all in addition to helping
family members in need, which one would do under any circumstances. A software
developer _might_ be able to do these things in California, but only barely,
unless they have a very cushy arrangement or they've ridden an exit for a
startup. Those at the median household income in the US (or anywhere else) are
being shafted. The economy is broken.

~~~
ForHackernews
Hint: Don't live in California. There are plenty of well-paid software jobs in
places like Boston, Chicago, Northern Virginia, Atlanta, Florida, Austin, etc.

They might not have the glut of "hot" startups that Silicon Valley does, but
they have much more reasonable cost of living.

~~~
Touche
What I was alluding to with my comment was that software developers create a
tremendous amount of wealth while seeing little of it. That is as true outside
SV as it is inside.

~~~
nostrademons
I'd encourage you to set up shop as an entrepreneur, consultant, or ISV. Then
you will a.) get to keep _all_ of the wealth you create (well, minus taxes -
damn you Uncle Sam) and b.) get a true idea of how much wealth you _actually_
create.

Personally, I've done both the entrepreneur and employee route, and I created
_and kept_ a whole lot more money as an employee. I may go back to being an
entrepreneur in the future - I'm certainly a lot more skilled than the last
time I tried it - but the experience of founding my own startup and working 5
years in a big company has taught me a whole lot about the value that _other_
job functions create, like sales, design, management, finance, capital, etc.
It's really easy to look at your output as a software developer and say "I
built the thing that makes my company hundreds of millions of dollars, and I
only get to see hundreds of thousands of it", without realizing that none of
that hundreds of millions in value would've been created without marketing to
understand what people want, product design to understand how to supply it, UX
to make it usable, sales to let people know about it, management to make all
these functions work together, or finance to pay for it.

~~~
coldtea
> _I 'd encourage you to set up shop as an entrepreneur, consultant, or ISV.
> Then you will a.) get to keep all of the wealth you create (well, minus
> taxes - damn you Uncle Sam) and b.) get a true idea of how much wealth you
> actually create._

Or you know, you'll get an inflated idea of how much you "actually" created,
just because you get to tell people what to do, and belittle their
contributions because, after all you are in charge.

~~~
dasil003
When I start my own company I will definitely take credit for the business I
build. For the past 15 years I have been paid to build things for other
people, I have been praised and I have been well paid, but I certainly don't
claim credit for the creation of the companies that employed me. Even as a co-
founder in my current position, there is a huge difference between coming on
in a paid position and taking the risk to build something from nothing.

Developers sometimes get big heads because there is so much dead weight in the
corporate world pulling paychecks for bullshit. I get that we build stuff that
creates real tangible value. But just as people sometimes misunderstand the
challenge of our work and the value that we bring to the table, it's easy to
dismiss business-oriented entrepreneurs as just being privileged or having
inside connections—all of which may be true, but until you have the stones to
go put everything on the line and found your own company you don't have a leg
to stand in terms of proclaiming who is bringing what value. Without the
founder, nothing happens, period.

------
jader201
My wife, whose dad is a coal miner and works harder in one day than I've had
to my entire career, cannot figure out why I'm able to work from home whenever
I want, and why my boss isn't firing me because I often sleep in and don't get
online or make it into the office until maybe an hour after my "normal" hours.

Or how I can "just take off" whenever I need to go to the doctor, or for one
of my sons' doctor's appointments or events at school.

I've never known what it was like to not have this flexibility. I _expect_
this flexibility, and will not work for an employer that will not give me this
flexibility.

And these expectations only increase as I get further into my career or change
jobs. I'm even considering taking a contracting position making 80% less and
working 80% less, so I can spend 20% doing my own (productive) thing. What
other profession allows this?

So yes, I definitely think I personally take this for granted, and feel in a
way I'm spoiled, or at the very least desensitized to the fact that a large
majority have it _way_ more difficult than I do. I do try to keep this in
mind, though, but it is hard in the day-to-day grind.

So thanks for the reality check.

~~~
markkanof
Do you mean 80% less or 80% of what you currently make? You make good points
either way, just curious.

~~~
jader201
Oh, sorry, 80% of what I currently make. Big difference. :)

------
pmichaud
There are definitely amazing, luxurious aspects of programming. Something came
into view for me recently though, that I never realized before:

When I graduated from high school, I started my own little (tutoring) company,
and did software from after that, so I never had the experience of a "normal",
hourly job, like retail or coal mining or whatever.

Recently I had an opportunity to do a job like that and the mood struck me to
try it out for like a month. I realized something huge about our jobs versus a
lot of other jobs:

I make more than $100/hr sitting in my pajamas, and I'm totally blessed. But I
work my fucking ass off. My brain is fully engaged, and when I charge you $125
for an hour of my time, you got more than that value, because I was __working
__, firing on all cylinders.

What I realized in this other job was that even though I worked like 10 hours,
it felt like I didn't do much because... I didn't. My coworkers and I, we did
some stuff, chatted, laughed a bit, did another bit or piece, took lunch, etc.
We spent a lot of time just socializing, having down time, not thinking too
hard.

I also noticed that there wasn't really room to do "better". The nature of the
job sort of set a cap on how productive you could be during a given time
period, so the culture just grew around that. Think of a gas station attendant
sitting around watching TV most of the day, the night audit at the hotel, or
the guy flipping burgers when it's not lunch time.

That's when I really got the distinction between $10-20/hr work and $100+ --
we, collectively do difficult, mentally taxing work that requires long hours
of intense focus, and a dedication to craftmanship that most other jobs just
don't require. And we do that job under mostly under unreasonably tight
deadlines, often for employers that don't understand what we're doing and
therefore undermine us in many ways.

Yes, it's luxury in __many __ways. But it 's also a coal mine of its own sort.

~~~
dylandrop
_> Yes, it's luxury in many ways. But it's also a coal mine of its own sort._

Except you won't die from sitting home in your pajamas.

You will, however, be very to die for a multitude of reasons in a coal mine.

I'm a programmer. Yes, my brain is engaged constantly. But that's fun to me.
It's not like I rue the day I became a programmer and I had to perform the
terrible labor of sitting around with friends/acquaintances, sip free coffee,
and make web apps. However, if you're in a sweatshop, forced to work many
hours a day and likely suffer a variety injuries, you aren't doing as well.

~~~
lectrick
Sedentary jobs have sedentary risks:
[http://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/wellness/even-
with-e...](http://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/wellness/even-with-
exercise-long-periods-spent-sedentary-are-deemed-a-health-
risk/2011/07/07/gIQAicwRAI_story.html)

I own a GeekDesk and swear by it. Standing sometimes while coding makes a
difference!

~~~
vkjv
I was interested in these, but, zomg, it's hard to take the company seriously
with that faux-hawk dude on the front page.

~~~
mhurron
It's hard to take them seriously when they appear to be selling a block of
press board on a couple of metal stands for $1000.

To be fair, it seems all standing desks are insanely priced.

~~~
lectrick
For what it's worth, it's a well-made desk, although I too was a little miffed
that I had to drill directly into the pressboard wood during assembly.

You could always put your own desktop on the frame. (It's a very good frame.)

------
seanccox
Let's be careful with that term, "luxury". You're a well-paid and
comparatively comfortable wage slave, but just because you don't have to labor
in a mine or a burger joint doesn't mean you are experiencing luxury.

Luxury is what these people are living:
[http://www.forbes.com/billionaires/](http://www.forbes.com/billionaires/)

We would all do well to remember that the first 85 people on that list have as
much wealth as the 3.5 billion poorest people in the world:
[http://www.forbes.com/sites/laurashin/2014/01/23/the-85-rich...](http://www.forbes.com/sites/laurashin/2014/01/23/the-85-richest-
people-in-the-world-have-as-much-wealth-as-the-3-5-billion-poorest/)

That is luxury – a lifestyle only attainable by an infinitesimally small
number of people, and one that they protect with the might of laws they
author, politicians they buy, and force they command. It's important to keep
sight of where the upper limits of wealth are, lest you get confused about
your class or with whom you have the most in common.

~~~
wpietri
One of the interesting things that has happened with the increase in
inequality is the ability for more people to say, "No, I'm not rich. _that_
guy is rich." Because as inequality rises, the people you compare yourselves
to are much further away than they used to be. That's how people making 10x
the median income can, with a straight face, declare themselves to be "middle
class". Inequality itself is used to justify other inequality.

Having lived and traveled in developing nations, I am perfectly happy to call
what I have "luxury". Which is exactly what most of the world would call it:
[http://gumption.org/1993/memo/landmarks/global_income.html](http://gumption.org/1993/memo/landmarks/global_income.html)

~~~
ziel
I agree with you that what we have is luxury compared to much of the world.
Like you, I've seen this first-hand.

What I think is often missing from these discussions though, is that working a
low paying job in New York City, for example, also affords considerable luxury
compared to much of the developing world. That hypothetical person working
that low paying job might not feel that s/he is living in luxury -- without
some agreement on what constitutes basic comfort, it's quite difficult to
define luxury.

The problem, which I think you've identified well, is that even the idea of
basic comfort shifts as the economic landscape shifts. When the idea of basic
needs shifts, the idea of wealth shifts with it.

In general, I think it's good for those of us living in privileged areas to
recognize our blessings. I also think comparisons made to the developing world
tend to oversimplify the problems of inequality present here as well.

Also, not to single this comment out on the middle class thing, but I've seen
a few comments here which are equating middle class with median income. Middle
class is a social construct. It's not well defined.

------
sspiff
I have the option to work from home, but I dislike doing so, specifically
because it makes it easy for me to slack and procrastinate, and because I
dislike bringing my work into my home environment.

I can use the prying eyes of my peers to guilt me into getting work done,
sometimes. I also much prefer to be able to stand up, walk over to someones
desk, and discuss a problem (or some newly discovered exoplanet, or the price
of bitcoins, ...). Picking up a phone, sending an instant message or email
just isn't the same thing.

However, I'm very much aware about what a luxurious situation I'm in. I live
in one of the wealthiest countries in the world, get to do a job I love (most
of the time), and get paid plenty. Compared to most places in the world, this
place 50 years ago or even to other professions in the same country, I'm a
lucky bastard.

Doesn't mean I sometimes have a hard time concentrating, or would like to be
doing something other than the work assigned to me though, but I think that's
normal and would happen to anyone in any situation. First world problems, eh?

------
ryanmarsh
Yes, this. I've had jobs where I worked in the freezing rain, etc. etc. The
people cutting your grass are likely better than you. I'll just come out and
say it, they are, because their life SUCKS and they get up every day and just
do it. They have heart. Many people in our community have a disgusting sense
of superiority and entitlement. You just don't understand unless you've been
there.

What makes many people in this community vapid isn't that they're
uncompassionate towards people who have it harder, it's that they musn't
realize how well off they really are. It's not your fault that most of us
don't have the perspective that some of us do, but the lack of it is very
real.

I've been called an asshole many a time by young privileged employees that
complain about the free food, that we have certain core working hours, that
yes, you need to be at the team standup on time, and in presentations you
should pay attention to the presenter and out of respect put down your
device(s). Before someone picks those examples apart, if you are about to,
you're missing the point. Relatively speaking chances are you have absolutely
nothing to whine about in your work. Nothing.

~~~
d23
> Relatively speaking chances are you have absolutely nothing to whine about
> in your work. Nothing.

The problem with playing this game is that there are always bigger fish, and
there are always smaller fish. Do back-breaking work 8 hours a day? At least
it's not 10. Do it for 12 hours a day? At least you have a job. Don't have a
job? At least you're alive in America. Not from America? Etc.

~~~
ryanmarsh
It's called gratefulness, and we have none of it.

~~~
ilyanep
As much as I agree with the fact that we should all be grateful for our
amazing jobs, gratefulness is not the same thing as "not allowed to complain."

------
purplelobster
I never complain about recruiters. The fact that I'm being contacted
spontaneously is completely a positive for me, and it gives me some confidence
that if I were to look for a job again, my skills are in demand enough that I
will never starve.

~~~
waylandsmithers
I've always found it a little off-putting when people complain about this. I
get that it's probably annoying, and good for them for being in demand. But it
still comes off as a humblebrag.

~~~
oacgnol
Can't a man walk down the street without being offered a job?

~~~
logfromblammo
It's more akin to the "job offers" that a woman might get when walking down
the wrong sort of street.

The basal level of respect for me as a professional with skills and
preferences distinct from those of my peers is typically not present from the
recruiter shotgunning spam all over the network.

------
dabent
Early on in my career, I put my resume out to look for another job after a
layoff. Recruiters nearly called me around the clock. I expressed frustration
after the third call in a row in front of my wife. She reminded me what a
blessing it was to have so many people trying to get me work and so many
opportunities available, most which would give me a raise.

He father struggled after layoffs to find work in his profession, with long
gaps between jobs. I realized how blessed I was to be in this line of work and
stopped complaining, even about the copy/paste emails.

That said, there are different levels of competency in each profession, and
recruiters are just as prone to rookie mistakes and lazy work as coders are. I
have the luxury of working only with good recruiters and can filter the rest
easily.

I've also lived through relatively scarce times (2002) when it was hard to get
a recruiter to return my calls. I can imagine that many recruiters and firms
went under and know people involved in software who had to scramble to find
work (myself included). That does help me appreciate the 90% of my career that
work has been plentiful.

------
raverbashing
About working from home: I won't do it again, unless needed

I will go somewhere else (rent a room/desk if needed) and I'll work there.

Going from "work mode" to "home mode" is very important

"Living in the bubble of Hacker News does distort the perspective. We tend to
ignore how luxurious our jobs are. We shouldn’t forget that there is life
outside our communities."

Oh this applies to many more things than jobs.

~~~
aestra
>I will go somewhere else (rent a room/desk if needed) and I'll work there.

It is important when working from home to have a "work area" which is only for
work and nothing else. When you work from your bed you get in trouble.

------
imjared
I'm sitting at home with no commute, listening to music out of my computer
speakers, in a house that's heated to my liking and I'm wearing sweatpants.
For lunch I'll be baking a hot, fresh meal. At some point this afternoon I'll
probably take a short nap to refresh myself.

I'm pretty aware of it.

~~~
rckclmbr
I had a bad commute this morning, because I stubbed my toe on the way to the
computer room. Also, I'm not wearing any pants.

------
eterpstra
The Oatmeal pretty much summed up 6pm of every weeknight of my life (I'm a
stay-at-home developer, my wife is a medical resident)
[http://theoatmeal.com/comics/making_things](http://theoatmeal.com/comics/making_things)

~~~
gcp
1000x thanks for linking this. Hadn't seen it yet.

------
jboons
It's important to be reminded of this every so often. It definitely helps to
get through "tougher days" if you're able to have a little perspective on how
great things actually are, or how much worse they could be.

~~~
odonnellryan
I always wonder what people mean by "tough days."

~~~
guptaneil
The days you don't feel like getting out of bed. The days everything in your
project goes wrong. The days you think your idea is actually worthless and
you're a fraud. The days you dread your investors asking for a status update.
The days Murphy's Law is a bitch. The days you have a bug that just makes no
sense. The days your client is being an ass and you have no desire to deal
with them. The days your boss is in a bad mood. The days that one douchey
coworker just keeps getting in your face.

The days that make you wish you were doing something else.

I'm sure you've had "tough days"

~~~
odonnellryan
Oh yeah, I've had them - I wasn't being patronizing.

I just believe, due to the problem-solving behavior of
engineers/techs/programmers, we tend to tunnel-vision instead of looking at
the big picture.

If the big picture is going wrong, it's a problem. Now, a lot of bad days add
up to a bad big picture, but if you're planning right, and you have a bit of
luck, a few bad days will eventually get washed away, no matter the project.

~~~
Hannan
I think Spolsky's description[1] of working at the bakery explains best how it
works for me. My bad days don't seem to be anything catastrophic going wrong,
just a multitude of tiny frustrations. Basically the opposite for the good
days.

[1]
[http://www.joelonsoftware.com/uibook/chapters/fog0000000057....](http://www.joelonsoftware.com/uibook/chapters/fog0000000057.html)

------
jeena
Those other people, the OP is talking about, I know many of them. Many of my
friends are unemployed. But even though I tried really hard to convince those
of whom I thought had the head to do it, to start a IT education, or at least
start learning to code at home while they have no job yet. Still I wasn't able
to convince anyone. They all said that it is too hard and not something they
are interested in.

That was kind of sad that they would rather sit around waiting for a low payed
job instead of investing some efford for a brighter future.

I understand that not everybody is able do learn the stuff we do but many
people just don't want to.

------
mantas
Hooray to good current days!

I wouldn't call that luxurious job though. It's just that good programmers are
hard to find, thus salaries go up. It's the same in all jobs that require
specific skills that are relatively hard to learn. Doctors, lawyers, even
skilled construction workers make a ton if they're good at their craft.

And programming is not that easy when you think about it. I keep learning new
stuff every day in addition to paid hours. When I get stuck at smth, I keep
working on my head during night or weekend. I feel responsible for my code
quality and try to make it as good as possible by going extra mile. My GF (who
earns 6x less) comes from work and relaxes till her next shift. When I finish
work, that means I don't stare at screen, but I still keep it in my head.

I know bad programmers who make shitty wage for shitty code. I wouldn't call
their jobs luxurious in any way. I feel sorry for for people in other fields
whose skills are undervalued though.

P.S. Greetings from Vilnius

------
badman_ting
Speaking to my father once, he told me "Man, you got the tiger by the tail." I
try not to forget it. I don't always succeed at that.

He was more right than he knew -- maybe a couple years after he told me that,
the business whose revenues he tripled decided they didn't like him, fired
him, and he has been looking for work and underemployed ever since. He used to
have a yacht, now he works at a chain hardware store.

------
homakov
Why compare yourself to unsuccessful people? there are always plenty of them.
Almost anyone who can read & do maths can say "i'm smarter than 50% of Earth
population" so..

~~~
jebus989
Only 50% of people can say that

------
grdeken
It's basic economics. A lot of people can mine coal or cook a burger. Not a
lot of people can write or design software. The demand outweighs the supply
and hence, leverage exists for those smart enough to take advantage of it.

More importantly, engineers earn a fraction of the value they create for
employers.

It's the lawyers we should all be scoffing at...

------
beachstartup
technology workers complaining about recruiters is analogous to young,
attractive people complaining about people hitting on them constantly. it sets
off the same b.s. detectors in my brain.

to me, it's really just a childish and transparent way of bragging. even
reasonable people slip into these modes when they are faced with an abundance
of opportunity, most of which they don't want or feel are beneath them.

~~~
hnal943
Yeah, but I think the problem with cut-and-paste recruiter spam is that it's
not really an opportunity. Most of the "offers" I get don't match my skillset
and would not result in a job even if I pursued them. They simply increase the
noise in the channel and don't add any value to anyone.

~~~
logfromblammo
This is further compounded by the likelihood that the jobs advertised may be
sham postings that are only being spammed out to you to fulfill legal
requirements for restricted visas held by imported workers.

For your own amusement, try responding to one or two, and see what happens.

It isn't quite so posh when you discover that the job opportunities constantly
streaming into your inbox don't actually exist.

~~~
beachstartup
these are all symptoms of an industry that finds its workers in high demand,
which is the root of the issue we're discussing. people are complaining about
being in demand.

------
null_ptr
So how are we supposed to get to "the future", where people aren't wage slaves
any more but instead are free to pursue their real dreams and ambitions, if
those of us fortunate enough to make some headway should feel ashamed for
having done so? Give me a break.

~~~
acuozzo
You took the words right out of my mouth. Thanks for posting this.

------
alexeisadeski3
You significantly understate the luxury which we enjoy, as even the millions
of people searching for minimum wage jobs enjoy extreme luxury.

There are hundreds of millions of people living on under $2 per _day_. And
yes, that is adjusted for purchasing power.

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Percentage_population_livi...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Percentage_population_living_on_less_than_1_dollar_day_2007-2008.png)

------
moron4hire
It's this sort of thinking that prevents people from getting help when they
let their health slide and get depressed (notice that I didn't say it's this
sort of thinking that causes depression. Depression is a disease.)

Yes, "First World Problems", etc. But you have to realize that your problems
are actually problems. Just because other people have worse problems doesn't
mean you should just suck it up and "take it like a man.

If you're feeling like you just don't want to work today, and that feeling
perpetuates for more than a day or two, then you need to do something
different than what you're currently doing. We used to call it "in a rut", now
we recognize that it's a symptom of depression. And however mild it may be,
you wouldn't wait until cancer or a chest cold were really bad until you tried
to treat it.

What you need to do differently to treat your mind is going to be unique to
you. Maybe it's exercising more, maybe it's sleeping more, maybe it's eating
better, maybe it's just getting a hug from someone you love. Just remember,
engineer, first fix yourself.

------
samstave
No, I am keenly, almost obsessively aware of how lucky I am and how fragile my
situation can be.

I have three kids, a stay at home wife, make a considerable salary and have a
job I absolutely love and excel at.

But I am still fundamentally subsisting; my living expenses are just covered
by what I make and am not able to save a considerable amount. This scares the
bejesus out of me because all my kids are young: I have lots of expenses
coming up related to providing well for them.

The most important thought I have daily, which was reinforced by the subtext
of this article, is that education is the most important thing I can give to
my kids.

When there are people who are "struggling to find a minimum wage job for
years" to me, that means that they lack the education or skills to have a job
that pays more and is in more demand. This is a failing of many parties - but
it's the base of the issue.

I want my kids to be able to do whatever it is they want, but to have the
skills to actually make that decision for themselves.

So, I am profoundly a aware of my position, am thankful for it and am working
to ensure that I provide my children an even better life than my already great
one.

~~~
aidenn0
I have three kids as well, and have some small hope to offer (assuming your
kids are young): once the kids are at elementary school age, the financial
situation gets a bit easier. After school activities typically cost less than
preschool, and your wife may be able to get part-time work at that point.

Also note: with 3 kids, there is likely no place in the US where it is cheaper
to send your kids to a mediocre private school than to just move to a better
school district (unless you live in a rural area where your commute would
severely be affected). That's one thing that I would most like to change at a
policy level, but it's something that in the short-term will affect decisions
you make.

~~~
tapostrophemo
"...cheaper...to just move to a better school district..."

Unless, of course, you're stuck underwater in a house that you'd lose lots of
money on if you sold it.

~~~
aidenn0
Yeah, if you have a negative net-worth, you're in trouble.

------
rjurney
Before I got paid to compute, I drove a forklift and unloaded floor-loaded
ocean containers in 150F heat. I'm acutely aware that I'm spoiled to all hell.

Its too bad all students aren't required to perform 'real work' as part of
their education.

------
doktrin
I consider myself very fortunate, despite having a very strict [e.g.
practically nonexistent] work-from-home allowance. It's not something I take
lightly, for better and worse.

For instance, at the moment I spend ~40 hrs in the office and ~40hrs in grad
school and on side projects. As a result, I have very little time available
for leisure or even meaningful relationships. My extra-work effort is driven
in part by a fear of skill obsolescence, and competition with my peers - who
are among the best in the world at what they do.

At times I wonder if my priorities are a little backwards, but at times I feel
so driven I'm not sure I could truly relax even if I wanted to.

------
pawn
My dad likes to remind me of how much better my job is than what I could be
doing.

He's done construction work all of his life, and self-employed construction
for as long as I've been alive. Growing up, I often worked for him during the
summers after school was out. I've done all manner of construction work under
him, concrete work, plumbing, roofing, decks, fences, you name it.

He claims now that he had me doing all that so that I'd want to go to college
and get a desk job, and maybe he's telling the truth. There have been some
things I remember fondly about those days, but overall, there's no comparison.
We have it a lot easier.

~~~
badman_ting
Yeah, that perspective is crucial, I think. When I was a teenager I worked at
TJ Maxx for gas money. Retail/customer service type work can be and often is
humiliating and somewhat dehumanizing, and of course it pays jack.

I have coworkers who not only didn't do that, they didn't work anywhere else
professionally before coming to their jobs at our cushy employer. They're kind
of double-screwed: they don't know how sweet this job is vs other jobs doing
similar work, and they don't know how much they should be getting paid for it.
So they have good jobs, that they bitch about, for which they get paid half or
60% of what they should be getting. (The pay isn't why they bitch, they don't
even know they're getting underpaid.)

------
CodeMage
It's commendable to want to be grateful for what we have and not take it for
granted, but it should never be used as an argument against wanting to improve
our lot.

I can understand wanting to share your newly found sense of perspective with
everyone else, but I'd like to suggest balancing it a bit with the following
excerpt from The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy:

 _To Trin Tragula 's horror, the shock completely annihilated her brain; but
to his satisfaction he realized that he had proved conclusively that if life
is going to exist in a Universe of this size, then the one thing it cannot
afford to have is a sense of proportion._

------
seivan
60 hour work week to meet a marketing deadline. No thanks. If I could get a
1/3 for a job that has no requirement of producing something and fixed hours.
That way I can code for myself.

------
jokoon
Maybe.

That doesn't change the fact that I can't find a job in another sector just
because I know programming.

That fact is IT actually saves a lot of money to the extent that effect is
proportional to the sum of innovation.

It's true that it's an easier life to know programming nowadays, but that
doesn't necessarily mean you have a better life if you're a programmer, hired
or not.

I think programmers should not complain about anything or their job if they
chose to swallow the blue pill and work a programming job they don't like,
coding for a project they don't like.

I think you can complain if you got at least ideas for solutions that have not
been tried. If you don't, and you work a job you don't like, then don't
complain, because you're part of the problem.

Programming is not always about making a project work. Programming is mostly
about innovation and making new useful things and improving old things.

I don't understand why most of the IT landscape is still email and http and
html, technologies that have been created at the very beginning.

I think most jobs are luxurious jobs, but that's because the government is
more effective than in other places. If you do programming but you don't like
what you do, maybe it's because the work you're being given is just shitty.
Maybe it's better than doing a shit job, but sitting doing something you don't
like is as much turning people crazy than anything else.

------
lostcolony
Even reading some of these comments is a bit nauseating.

If you are a software dev, designer, etc, in almost any part of the world
where you can read this, you are massively lucky.

Nevermind the whole "You have internet access and can develop software for a
living? Welcome to the top 50% in the world", etc; there are people in your
area barely scraping by; if your only metric is others in the same economic
bracket, get out more.

One of my hobbies is a martial art. Many of the students there are in much
poorer straights than myself. One in particular, a young adult nearly out of
high school, and already working, rides 10 miles each way to work and the
martial arts school on his bike, because he can't afford public
transportation. He lives paycheck to paycheck, and has to work out special
payment arrangements with the instructor because of it. I don't really care if
his day job is 'easier' than mine (I did it once; it wasn't for me, but whose
to say it isn't for him); he has to stress how to cover bills, how to get to
work when not feeling great and facing a 10 mile bike ride there and back,
etc. I can call in and WFH because I have the sniffles. Or drive, because I
have a car, and the funds to keep up insurance, gas, repairs, etc.

If you enjoy coding, and you get paid enough for it to cover your bills and
stash some away, you are massively, massively lucky. Is it as good a break as
it could, or should (were this a utopia) be? No. But compared to the
unfairness many others face, you should be reveling in it, while trying to
affect change not just for yourself but those who are in harder circumstances.

------
phryk
"Even more people are getting their butts of the beds every morning, going to
the job they hate, just to support the basic needs."

And you think that programmers don't? I work as a badly underpaid php
developer and have slept on a couch in a ~35m² single-room apartment for the
last few years. I handed in my resignation this week, because this job causes
depressions that make me borderline suicidal. I'll have to live off of state
welfare, if I can get it, if I don't then I'll be homeless, but I just can't
take this shit anymore, so I'm taking the plunge and hope for the best.

For every well-paid and -treated programmer there are a whole bunch of
underpaid and ill-treated ones. Besides, what's so wrong about not wanting to
work? You as someone with a good grip on what technology can do should see
that we could've started to automate the production of things needed for basic
survival (food, shelter, energy…) decades, if not even longer, ago.

As far as I can tell, programmers have far greater chances to end up with
depression or burnout than most other jobs, so please don't act like it's all
sunshine and unicorn farts for all of us.

~~~
phryk
Of course we already have this sort of stuff largely automated; I meant in a
way that doesn't just make profit for a small minority of the population.

------
grownseed
From the sound of it, it's not so much a luxury problem but rather one of
integrity... If you feel like the comfort of your home or your lack of
motivation somehow make your job "luxurious", I'm sorry to say that the
problem is in all likelihood mostly with you and not the profession. I would
probably call that apathy and/or privilege.

I worked from home for quite a while, and the simple idea of getting rewarded
for not achieving anything made me feel guilty and inadequate. I also happened
to work in kitchens from a very young age for a few years, with ridiculous
hours and pay as one would imagine, yet I often consider getting back to it.
There's a particular sense of satisfaction in cooking that I've never found in
programming.

All jobs come with their upsides and downsides, and all professions have
people who get paid too much or not enough. I don't think you can lump in
personalities and activities together like that.

I realize my tone might come through as a bit harsh, and I'm sorry if it does.
I'm just a bit tired of the lazy well-off programmer stereotype, it undermines
a lot of us in several ways.

------
rikkus
Some of us are actually aware of this. It's good to point out what the world
is like to people who may not have first hand knowledge, but then they're
still not getting any by reading this article. I'd have liked to see the
author encourage others to travel, perhaps, whether geographically or
economically. It's difficult to have empathy with fellow humans without actual
contact.

------
lepunk
I'm fortunate enough to been able to do both manual labor and office work
(coding) too, so I think I'm less critical about my job compared to someone
who got a decent one straight out from uni.

After high-school I had a bunch of temporary jobs working with builders,
carpenters, etc in Hungary for less than £10 / day. I was happy because it
paid my day-to-day expenses.

Then I moved to London where I took a minimal wage "biorobot " job in a
factory for £5.5 / hour. I sincerely thought I have a great, well paid job. I
was happy

Then I applied for a startup as the first coder there, got hired and I'm still
with them after 6 years. I don't even know exactly how much I make on a hourly
basis, but I don't really care. I'm happy

It is all just perspective. You can be the happiest person on a very low
salary, or be depressed and cranky about your job even if you make millions.

I do think programmers deserve high salaries, and luxury like working from
home. Why? Because our profession is extremely unique. Every single day we
have the potential to solve a problem which never been solved before.

------
nzp
I absolutely get what you're trying to say, but---so what? How is programmers
being aware of their luxurious jobs going to help people with less luxurious
jobs? Will the situation for other people improve if people here merely stop
complaining about recruiters and procrastination? If they merely do a mental
version of catholic style self flagellation? Is this another variant of "eat
your dinner, there are children in Africa starving" routine? What good does me
eating my dinner do to a starving kid in Africa? Etc.

There's nothing wrong about complaining about relevant problems in one's
profession, even if those problems seem nice to have to other people, and not
complaining won't magically make other people's lives more comfortable. And
having a "luxurious" job that pays well is nothing to be compulsively ashamed
of if it's an honest job not involving exploitation of others (which
programming in almost all (?) cases is).

------
mch0lic
It's not really a problem in Lithuanian, but rather in the mindset of poorly
educated/older generation people there. Being Lithuanian I never received a
single word of encouragement from my friends or family, but rather was
threatened that starting business will lead me to poverty or I would simply
fail. Luckily, I spend quite a lot of time abroad (mostly SE Asia) and seen
how random local village person would start his burger stall, if that fails
try cooking some fried rice and even if that fails bringing money home try
selling noodles or whatever else. I mean those guys would never give up and
that's sort of mindset that let's you have a better life.

Personally I try not to spend to much time back home even I'm officially
running business there, I much rather stay in Mauritius as I do now, or go
back to SE Asia. Being around enthusiastic and happy people makes you one too
and once you happy money is no longer an issue, it just finds its way to you..

------
qwerta
Yet another bullshit article.

IT has zero entrance barrier, anyone can pick up tutorial from internet and
start software development. Many people give up after they find out that
software development is actually very hard.

And work from home is not luxury. Even East Asia textile sweatshops offer work
from home. It is just Californian startups who require total control over
their minions.

~~~
vbuterin
> Even East Asia textile sweatshops offer work from home.

I'd like to learn more about this. Intuitively, it makes sense for something
like this to be true; the "workers slaving away at assembly lines in factories
12 hours a day 7 days a week" meme seems a bit too ancient and well-
established to be accurate and we definitely don't see that many sources of
what the East Asia sweatshop lifestyle is actually like. Any links?

~~~
qwerta
It is story from asian friend. Every morning her family would collect batch of
clothes for sewing and return it finished at evening. Also Japan industry
during WW2 worked this way, lot of work was done in family homes, central
factories were only used for steel.

------
kayoone
Might be like that in the US, but in other parts of the world, being a
software developer is not that glorious. Average pay, constant high work
loads, doing very challenging work but being seen as a coding slave.. doesn't
matter much if you work from home or not in that case, most projects aren't
really enlightening.

------
ithkuil
Yes I realize some/most of us have a privileged job. However, I believe that
it's reasonable that people who are exceptionally talented expect something
better.

Sometimes you know you are exceptionally talented, they tell you, you know how
to build stuff, how to fix stuff, how to get to the heart of the problem, how
to learn new stuff quickly, how to write down code and documentation.

Yet you have move countries (sometimes at the expense of family and quality of
life) and/or spend hours every day commuting because your company values
physical presence above all that.

I don't think that's an unreasonable thing to complain.

Even if we are lucky, lucky to have talent or just lucky that the talent we
have is highly valued (unfortunately not all talented people are so lucky), I
still think it's reasonable to complain.

------
sergiotapia
Yes we make more money, but we also take our work with us and the stress that
comes along with mentally taxing work.

It's 11pm and I might be thinking of a problem at work I've been tangling for
for the past 4 days.

A gardner or a construction worker leaves work and _leaves work_, you feel me?

~~~
Tyrannosaurs
And your'e stacking that up against the stress the gardener or construction
worker has of losing their job and not having a million other options, or not
being able to support medical insurance for their family because of what they
earn?

Even excluding that, having worked in a fairly brain dead job I found the
stress of 9 hours a day doing something that dull WAY more stressful than
being able to use my mind but being under some pressure to do so.

~~~
sergiotapia
I'm not saying "we have problems, 'they' don't". I'm illustrating the fact
that EVERYBODY has problems. Software development isn't all peachy 100% of the
time. [Let's call it 80% of the time ;)]

~~~
countrybama24
Sounds nice

------
alecco
Yeah, I feel luxurious every weekend I spend working on somebody else's code
mess.

------
manuletroll
While this might be true for a large portion of HN's audience, there are also
developers stuck in shitty positions in countries where making $100K writing
software is a pipe dream. I'd be happy if I was paid a third of that.

~~~
mcv
I don't make $100K either. But together with my wife's income, we've still got
it pretty comfortable. You don't need $100K to live comfortably.

~~~
manuletroll
Indeed, and I certainly don't need $100K either. I don't even live in an area
where the cost of living is especially high, but I currently make _less_ than
what I was earning working on an assembly line in a factory. While I'm not
dirt-poor I'm unable to make any savings or plans for the future. As I don't
have much aside, I can't really try my luck in a better area as moving is not
free. At least I'm only responsible for myself, so there's that.

------
dmamills
I used to work as a line cook, I made ~$13/hr (Canadian) and I worked from
5pm-3am, about 6 days a week including weekends. It stole my life away from
me. The world of kitchens was hot, hostile, fast-paced and overall just
terrible. There were no sick days. I did it from age 15-22. It's not to say
that I didn't love it because I did, but it was hell.

Now I sit at a desk all day and get paid to type out a fancy language at a
leisurely pace for nearly three times as much. It's insane how hard I used to
work for so little, compared to how much I now get paid to work so little.

------
njharman
When I'm depressed/sad/whining and people ask "what's wrong" or "how am I
doing". They laugh when I reply with variation of "Good, I'm not being
genocided". But that is my serious reply. Like this article states, no matter
how "crappy" I imagine my (MUC, white, male, american) life to be, If I
rationally examine it It is magnitudes better than 90+% of the people on the
planet. Thinking about the people struggling to find drinking water or not be
killed by their neighbors puts things in perspective.

------
whitef0x
I think it is like anything. Every job has its benefits and its tradeoffs. It
is just that different jobs have different benefits and tradeoffs for
different people. If you enjoy your job as a programmer and you enjoy applying
algorithms to real world problem then yes, I agree it is a luxurious job.

However if you hate programming (which means you shouldn't be doing this job)
but for some reason (financial, social, etc) you continue to work in this
field then the tradeoffs could outweigh the benefits.

------
squigs25
I agree with this.

Look, if you don't enjoy programming/data/technology then you're probably in
the wrong field.

But I think it's ok to have to force yourself to work on the stuff you don't
enjoy as much. You just need to have adequate enjoyment from what you do, and
the self discipline to do what you enjoy doing. At the end of the day, you're
lucky to enjoy what you're doing half of the time, and to be making many times
more than the rest of the world's population could make.

------
ap22213
Yes, programming is very luxurious. And, I try to remind myself of that
everyday. I earn 2-3 times that of most of my non-programmer friends. And,
generally, it's been a luscious existence.

But, I think the mechanisms of my brain that make me good at programming also
make me prone to emotional stress, misery, mood cycles, etc. So, yeah, even
though I love programming, especially regarding the creative aspects, I also
sometimes wish I could have been born with different genes.

------
jebblue
There was a story on the local news last night that a bus driver in Austin is
making $117K. Just throwing it out there, like, what if you really like
driving a bus but only get paid $20K. That would suck. But if you like it and
can get paid 6 figures then I'd say that would be very cool. I knew a guy in
high school who dreamed and talked of nothing but owning and driving his own
bug rig. He was a pretty sharp guy, he just wanted his own truck and the open
road.

------
Suncho
The biggest problem with this whole situation is that we, as a society, are
forcing people to work when our economy doesn't need them to. If we needed
people to work, then the jobs would create themselves. There would be no talk
of job creation. It would happen on its own.

And people don't need jobs either. They never did. They need food and money.
Jobs just _used to_ be an appropriate way to obtain those things.

------
cuillevel3
I think we idealize our jobs. They're stressful and dangerous. Stress,
obesity, back, blood circulation and respiratory problems do kill eventually.

Then there is depression, working alone, never going outside.

But hey, you could always become a consultant: travel much, eat badly, work
everywhere, ignore ergonomics...

And one more thing, I wouldn't compare myself to the millions of unemployed,
or low-wage workers, but to the upper middle class.

------
CaptainSwing
I think that it is important to separate our understanding of relative
exploitation/privilege from notions of structural exploitation/privilege.

two points on this.

firstly, luxury is relative. As workers (I know its unpopular in the US, but
I, as a developer, would happily call myself, and other developers 'working
class' as long as we are handing over the products of our labor for a wage) we
are not earning as much money as our bosses expect to make from the product of
our labour, therefore however relatively luxurious our work environment and
living standards, we must remember that we are still being exploited. The
recent revelations about the silicon valley wage cartel
([http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/2014/01/15/silicon_valle...](http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/2014/01/15/silicon_valley_hiring_cartel_apple_google_and_other_accused_of_driving_down.html))
show one of the ways in which our wages are kept artificially low.

Secondly, not a critique of your sentiment, but an addendum, there are certain
senses that our 'luxurious' jobs are particularly precarious. When labour
costs increase the two methods that bosses/capitalists use to maintain a
profit are a) employing workers who will accept less and b) automating the
work previously don by workers.

More and more we are competing globally for employment, This applies to all
industries to some extent (if wages for electronics manufacture get too high
in China they will move to Thailand, etc), it is even easier to relocate soft
wave developer jobs, as there aren;t the same demands for the movement of
physical resources, building new factories, etc.

combine this with the fact that we are constantly creating the 'machines' that
will replace us. For example, designing complex web sites is much easier and
takes much less work using django, for example, than frm scratch, but that is
because django is replacing work that was previously done by workers.

These two methods of keeping labour costs down often combine in the form of
deskilling. If we make django do all the tough technical bits we can hire a
less experienced worker for less $$.

tl;dr Yes we have 'relatively' luxurious jobs, no that doesn't mean we its not
in our interests to get rid of the wage-relation, with all its ridiculous
contradictions in an age of plenty as we live in.

------
epx
There are hidden sacrifices and costs. 99% of my good friends in this
profession took depression medicine at some point of their lives.

------
MyNameIsMK
Dear Recruiter, You are a middleman. Your job is pointless. Your industry will
go "kapoom" soon. Enterprising young people are already figuring our ways to
automate you out of your job . Take me off your list. I am not a 'lead', or a
'prospective candidate'. Show me the money. That's what she said. Goodbye.

------
mikeash
Speak for yourself. I sure as hell am aware of it.

If you want to talk about how ridiculously unaware you were about how good you
have it, feel free. But please don't imply that I'm somehow equally dumb.

I do my share of complaining, but I understand that when it comes down to it,
I am _extremely_ fortunate when it comes to my job.

------
shn
Most of those recruiters do not deserve to be employed in the first place.
They lack basic empathy towards job seekers. They talk like they own you. I
have not met any of them yet that does not meet this description
unfortunately. I think having some power on other people's lives corrupt them.

------
danielsamuels
If you really don't like recruiters, feel free to send them to
[http://www.rankarecruiter.co.uk/](http://www.rankarecruiter.co.uk/) \- it's a
joke side designed to waste their time, just like they waste ours.

------
justinzollars
Thank you for posting this! I find the Silicon Valley a internally focused
place and I think we need more reminders from members of our community that we
are the exception and not the rule. Not everyone in the world can be a VC or
programmer.

------
balls187
Logic fail.

"We have it better than people who don't, therefore we shouldn't complain."

------
gren
"PS: I am available for hire! Feel free to contact me" at the end of the post
was a bit ironic.

Otherwise I quite agree with the post, we tech guys have chance to choose our
job.

------
gabriel34
There is always someone worse off than you, that doesn't mean your complaints
are invalid unless you live in a communist utopia.

------
loceng
You can be healthy and happy doing any task - so long as you have balance and
support and habits to support you.

------
solidsnack9000
Is our work really luxurious or just stable, rewarding and fairly renumerated?

------
xster
This is a Facebook post, not an article.

------
blazespin
Humble brag.

------
CmonDev
"We shouldn’t forget that there is life outside our communities." \- yes,
let's not forget there are lawyers, doctors, actors, pilots, CEOs and other
occupations that earn much more without having to re-learn a new API every
year... Let's not forget that major companies in e.g. Silicon Valley are known
for actively suppressing the salary growth. IMHO we are still underpaid and
under-appreciated.

~~~
genericuser
I view the constant learning and changing requirements of careers in software
development to be one of its largest advantages and draws over, how I imagine
some of those careers you listed are (others like lawyers and doctors I am
certain have their own knowledge bases they have to learn constantly). I get
to learn a new or modified API, language, or project domain every year if not
more frequently, and I love it. You viewing it as 'having to re-learn a new
API every year' indicates to me that you view it as a negative.

In regards to the under appreciated part, I also was well aware this wasn't a
job like fire fighting or being a doctor where I was going to be appreciated
on a daily basis, or even a job like teaching where I would get the occasional
student that appreciated me making all the thankless bastards I had to deal
with hopefully worth it.

I mean there is no reason you shouldn't try to find a place where you
personally don't have to re-learn stuff every year, and are appreciated. But I
like learning and being appreciated adds no value to me, I assume at least
some others feel the same.

I am always in favor of being paid more, but I would be hard pressed to argue
why I should be.

~~~
logfromblammo
The ability to continue learning new things (and also implementing them) over
the course of your entire career may be less common than you think.

Doctors and lawyers have a large body of working knowledge that they must
learn, but the portion relevant to their specific practice might not change
that much over their entire career. Software writers can get started on a tiny
corpus of knowledge, but a huge portion of it has to be updated on a nearly
constant basis.

It's like accelerating over the entire length of a foot race, except instead
of sprinting the 50m dash, you are running an ultramarathon. By the time you
retire, you have already forgotten more things than most people have ever
bothered to learn.

I have already written software for doctors and nurses, lawyers and
paralegals, rocket scientists, aircraft pilots, and other software writers
like me. Every job required learning a significant amount of domain knowledge,
even if only on a temporary basis. As a result, that quote by Heinlein from
Time Enough for Love--the one about specialization being for insects--
definitely applies. I can now convincingly bullshit any non-expert on
practically any topic after only about 2 days of Internet research.

That's because I have learned to identify and focus upon the core elements of
a problem and discard all irrelevancies. It may be odd to you, since you
probably have the same skill now, but the vast majority of humanity is
completely incapable of viewing a problem objectively. That is why we are
valuable. We are the Professors surrounded by billions of Gilligans. We are
the MacGyvers in a world of ticking time bombs. Bunsen and Beeker to a bunch
of talking animals. Lisa Simpsons beset by Homers. Farnsworths (and
Wernstroms) babysitting Benders and Frys.

That's why we get paid the big bucks.

------
dclowd9901
You're right! We should be paying them to do what we're doing! I've had it all
backward!

