
VAIO announces tiny laptop with tons of ports - miles
https://www.theverge.com/2019/7/9/20687252/vaio-sx12-announced-price-specs-release-date
======
miles
Reminded me somewhat of "A small notebook for a system administrator":

[https://habr.com/en/post/437912/](https://habr.com/en/post/437912/)

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19052688](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=19052688)

~~~
SECProto
Funny, to me it just reminds me of a standard laptop from a few years ago. I
have a consumer lenovo from a few years back, and it has all those ports
except the USB-C.

~~~
Buge
What laptop is that? Because this laptop has a lot of very weird ports (I'm
leaving out USB-C):

2 micro USB-B ports, one with quick charging 3.0, one with USB OTG so the
laptop can be used as an external mouse and keyboard for a different computer
even when not booted.

2 ethernet ports, one with power over ethernet supporting 3 different
standards for POE.

5.5x2.5mm power connector, fullsize SD reader, micro SD reader, 4 USB-A 3.0
ports (one always on), mini DisplayPort, full HDMI, 4 3.5mm audio jacks (in,
out, mic, headset), VGA, DB-9 connector supporting many modes, HD Mini SAS,
USIM card tray, PBD-12 pin connector, tripod mount, mount for attaching to a
wall via screws or via magnets or mounting to your arm.

And on the power supply there are 8 ports.

~~~
SECProto
I meant the original post reminds me of a standard laptop from a few years
back. the one linked on habr.com is quite unique and interesting. But the Vaio
SX12 linked in the original post just has a standard amount of laptop ports (3
usb-a, 1 usb-c, Ethernet, VGA, SD card, HDMI, headphone/mic).

------
yyyk
Half the comments seem to be surprised by VGA. But just about every 1080p
monitor has the port, and even Steam statistics[0] show that over 60% of their
users use 1080p, and about 75 percent use resolutions that are VGA compatible.
4K computer monitors are still uncommon - and Steam is likely tilted towards
higher resolutions.

In short: Most existing monitors support VGA, and probably a good deal of
those actually use the port.

[0]
[https://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey](https://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey)

VGA can do 1440p, but it's rare on these monitors, so I didn't count the 4.71%
2560x1440 users.

~~~
kelnage
And of course there are still a lot of VGA-only projectors out there
(especially the ceiling mounted ones in meeting rooms) - having a VGA port is
a godsend when you come across them!

~~~
yyyk
KVM switches are also a pain point - there are still many VGA-only KVMs which
can get pricey to replace. It's probably not a problem for the laptop use case
but it is for the home-lab setup.

~~~
flyinghamster
Amen to that. The exorbitant cost to replace my perfectly functional KVM
switch is what keeps me on PS/2 and VGA.

Does anyone make a backlit PS/2 keyboard, or are the power requirements too
high?

~~~
yyyk
A web search found that the PS/2 interface apparently survived for a while in
gaming keyboards due to advantages I wasn't aware of - apparently PS/2 had
slightly better latency and N-key rollover.

Even those keyboard switched to USB eventually. The only recently made and
currently available with backlight PS/2 keyboard I found is the "Zowie
Celeritas II" gaming keyboard (the manufacturer's page says USB+PS2, the
reviews say it ships with a usb TO ps2 adapter). However it's pretty
expensive, and the red leds might not fit your taste.

------
Ambroos
It's pretty funny how this has basically the same ports (besides the USB C for
charging) as my 2010 VAIO Z.

VGA is the most surprising one to still see. I wonder what the reasoning
behind that is. I can't really see them targeting the corporate market.

~~~
owenversteeg
VGA is incredible to have, yes, even in 2019. As a sibling comment says, it's
"for the people who actually have to solve problems". Nearly all projectors,
even new and expensive ones I've used, do not have HDMI. So there's an
adapter. But maybe the damned fragile thing is broken, or it's missing, or it
doesn't adapt to what you have (mini display port? USB-C? Who even knows!) or
it requires power, or God knows what.

There are a number of times I've had to present something, and the "non-VGA"
laptop crowd was unable to, for various reasons, but a VGA port will cut the
crap and get you an image on screen no matter what. It's wet? Stepped on it?
Bent pins? It'll still work, dammit. Maybe your slides will have a blue tint,
but you'll get em up there.

I'll give a personal example. I was at a party and the movie dude didn't show.
Only thing available was a banged up projector from the 90s with analog only
inputs. Everyone had new fancy laptops with no VGA. Someone had a totally
destroyed old laptop with water damage, screen falling off, but you know what
it had? Most of a VGA port. I bent off a few pieces of a paperclip, shoved em
in there, pointed that old projector at the side of a house, and filled the
night sky with sixty feet of glorious analog pixels.

I'd expect more support for VGA in a place like this. It doesn't just
guarantee your slides will get up on screen, it's a real hacker's port,
dammit!

~~~
myself248
> it's a real hacker's port, dammit!

Oh yeah, the i2c interface disguised as DDC is my favorite part. With a few
wires, you can interface any i2c eeprom with command-line tools.

But projectors, oh yeah, I hear ya. VGA came out in 1987 and rapidly became
ubiquitous. I think the Intel Skylake in 2015 finally shipped without
integrated VGA, that's as clear a mark as you'll find for the closing of a
chapter.

And the coolest thing is, except for a few weird VGA-on-EGA-connector attempts
in the very early years, VGA has always been one single standard connector for
the entire 28 years of its existence. And it's not gone, not by a long shot.
That decades-long legacy means it's the standard you're going to include if
you want your shit to be compatible with as much as possible.

Until my very most recent Thinkpad, I've had VGA the whole time, and got quite
accustomed to mocking the portless people (principally Mac folks) when they'd
show up without their adapters. "If your machine doesn't have the ports it
needs to survive in the world, it is incumbent upon YOU to carry the adapter
dongles", I'd sneer at them. "Your vendor invents a new port every few months,
I'm not going to stock all those adapters on your behalf."

Welp, the march of time is inexorable, and I'm now the schmuck toting around a
Mini-DisplayPort-to-VGA dongle that just takes up space in my bag and I know
someday I'm gonna leave it out because I haven't used it in forever. That will
therefore be the day I'm faced with a room full of Director-level people I
need to impress, and the wrong variant of HDMI-DVI-Thunderport-Nano-MHL-
whatever. And I know that damn projector still has a VGA port, just in case.

~~~
myrandomcomment
Bah. VGA needs to die. The number of times I needed to do a presentation and
find out they only have a VGA projector....for a product with a GUI that just
is not designed for that low resolution (on purpose.) To be honest I do not
think I own anything that is not 4K anymore that is a daily use item. I still
have retro computers, etc. but every TV, monitor and modem system is now 4K.

~~~
fyfy18
The majority of projectors in use (even if they do have HDMI) don't support
4K. Even if you buy a new projector you have to put some effort into getting
something that supports 4K (unlike say a TV where it's basically standard). I
imagine there are even newly built conference rooms / lecture theatres that
don't have 4K projectors for cost reasons.

Oh and then you need a laptop that supports it. If you laptop is more than a
few years old, it probably can't output 4K60.

~~~
myrandomcomment
Sorry, I mixed two items here. Projectors need to take HDMI and support 1080P.
Instead half the time I get handed a VGA cable and stuck at 1024x768 or worse
800x600 I should have separated the two rants. :)

------
znpy
Its just moronic how laptop companies are rushing to make smaller laptops at
the cost of basically everything.

A ThinkPad-X220-sized laptop would still be absolutely acceptable both in size
and weight, and could have all (or at least, most of) the ports that one could
need.

And swappable battery, keyboard, ram, disk etc.

~~~
Tharkun
I don't understand the appeal of anorexic laptops. Sacrificing repairability,
cooling, features, and connectivity. All so it can be thinner and lighter?
What's the use case for that? Are there really millions of people who walk
around with a laptop cradled in their arms every day? Surely these laptops
spend the majority of their active time either on a desk or in a lap? Have
desks become so flimsy that they can no longer support the weight of a laptop?
Have people grown so weak they can no longer carry one in their bags?

~~~
codingdave
> Are there really millions of people who walk around with a laptop cradled in
> their arms every day?

Yes. The sales force of almost very company I've worked at can be described
this way. And their computing needs are pretty basic. A browser, email, word
and excel mostly does it for them. They also need to be able to connect to a
variety of I/O for presentations at different sites.

This may not be a coder laptop, but it makes a ton of sense for sales.

> Have people grown so weak they can no longer carry one in their bags?

On this point, the answer is also yes. I got that weak after an bad accident.
My wife got that weak after falling 25 feet and shattering herself. Don't
assume that all users of laptops are young and strong.

~~~
marzell
Coders can and should use remote systems for heavy lifting tasks IMO. A laptop
should be setup more like a thin client and not have any ip on it that can be
lost/stolen.

~~~
rbanffy
I don't know why this was downvoted. As connectivity gets more and more
pervasive my laptop is increasingly only a front to a cloud instance
somewhere.

20 years ago I was running an e-mail client on my laptop. Now most of the
client runs on Google's servers.

------
userbinator
From a marketing angle, for this model they can also claim that VAIO means
"Very Ample Input/Output".

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaio#Etymology](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaio#Etymology)

~~~
Infernal
Versatile Analog I/O?

------
learnfromstory
I see tiny has been redefined. Doesn’t anyone remember when there were 6”
subnotebooks in the vaio catalog?

~~~
PebblesHD
As the proud owner and user of both a VAIO P and UX, I really hope they start
looking at some of the smaller niche products again as they’re some of my
favourite possessions. Even if they are occasionally impractical, being able
to carry a laptop in my pocket with full sized ports for diagnostics is
absolutely something I and many in my work community would be willing to pay
for.

~~~
cstross
If you’re a fan of that form factor you need to investigate GPD (Game Pro
Devices) and One Netbook, both of whom produce miniature PCs; GPD started with
the GPD Win, a pocket console-sized PC with a 5.5” screen optimized for
running Windows 10 games, then branched out with the GPD Pocket and Pocket 2,
7” screen subnotebooks (the first was a maxed-out netbook-spec PC, the second
gen upgraded to an i3 processor) and now the micro PC, with VGA and RS-232 and
a VESA attachment point (it’s intended for sysadmin/ops users who need to bolt
a tiny PC to whatever they’re working on). One Netbook are a bit more
consumer-ish, but do convertible notebook/tablet machines in the pocket size
range. And both companies are now doing subnotebooks with 8-9” screens and
beefier CPUs, in the 500-700 gram range.

You can find their stuff via Indiegogo (while kickstarting — they seem to use
it to generate publicity rather than for primary funding) or on Geekbuying.com
and other retail channels.

------
sowbug
See also GPD Micro PC:
[https://www.gpd.hk/gpdmicropc](https://www.gpd.hk/gpdmicropc)

Tiny, includes RS-232 port among others.

------
robmiller
Does it have a Memory Stick Pro Duo reader to go with the SD?

~~~
mitchtbaum
I'm pretty sure the SE version might.

Downside, you'll need a gold mine to pay for it.

------
microdrum
How cool.

I wonder if I’m the only one: I just placed an order for my first Windows
laptop in 11 years. The Thinkpad X1 Carbon Gen 7.

Apple’s overthin design, heavy aluminum, bad thermals, throttled chip,
soldered parts scam is over for me. Love macOS but fact is Windows is nice now
and I’m back to the fun days of weird and wild hardware. Feels great.

~~~
jotto
Are the thermals that bad? My understanding is that they had a bad incident
with a 6-core MBP in 2018, but they managed to fix it.

~~~
microdrum
It’s not going to melt down. The whole line just falls way short of benchmarks
for the chips. Linus Tech Tips did a good video on it.

~~~
kristofferR
Uhhh, I don't think you've seen LTTs recent video review of it - they came
away quite impressed at its performance and thermals:

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WxocVricANg](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WxocVricANg)

You've probably only seen an old video about the old models of the Macbook
Pro. ;)

------
chx
Misleading title. A 12.5" laptop is pretty normal these days. The One Mix Yoga
2S, the spiritual successor of the Vaio P, the first ever 7" laptop with a
proper CPU (=Intel Core instead of Atom) and proper storage (= SSD instead of
eMMC and then NVMe at that). I am in love with that thing.

~~~
lucb1e
It's still tiny for a laptop, even if a credit card sized laptop based on a
rpi would exist. A normal size is 15.6, large is above that and small is
below. You can't properly work on a screen smaller than 14" or so, and I'm
sure there'll be lots of people that tell me they work on this in the train
every day just fine (the logic being "when challenged, we can find many people
on HN that are fine squinting at a 7 inch 1366px screen, therefore there is no
majority calling this tiny"), but such a laptop's focus is on mobility and
travel, not comfortably doing desktop-equivalent work on it. That's why, for a
laptop form factor, I'd say it's tiny and not a misleading title.

~~~
robin_reala
_You can 't properly work on a screen smaller than 14" or so_

Bit of a blanket statement. I’m totally happy on my 11" Macbook Air still.
Full-screen browser on one workspace, full-screen Sublime on another and full-
screen terminal on the third. Trivial to cmd-tab between them, and the
portability gains massively outweigh any benefits of having all windows open
at the same time, especially if I have an external monitor available at most
workspaces.

------
egypturnash
I like how almost all the ports are on the right. You will _not_ want to use a
mouse with this machine if you're a righty, there _will_ be at least one cable
in the way.

~~~
fpoling
I am rightly, but a few years ago I tried to use the mouse with the left hand.
To my surprise it took just couple of days to adjust. Clearly with the right
hand I could press buttons faster, but the precision of mouse positioning was
just as good.

~~~
gsich
The precision required for a mouse is very low compared to writing. So it's
mostly preferrence or what is set as default.

------
nextos
The problem with some VAIO machines tends to be cooling.

My experience is that the fan controller is quite badly designed, and the
machine ends up being noisy. The fan RPMs oscillate a lot, even under no load.

I hope it is not the case this time, and we end up with a nice laptop that can
run Linux well. Options are limited, so an alternative with many ports from a
quality manufacturer is more than welcome.

~~~
teamski
Are you taking about recent VAIO machines? If yes name then.

~~~
nextos
For example, the very recent SX14:

 _" Unfortunately, Vaio commits a huge blunder when it comes to the fan
control. Ideally, the fan should not run at all while the device is idling.
The opposite is true for the Vaio SX14: The fan always runs with 32.5 dB(a),
which is definitely audible. Under load, the fan becomes much louder with 43.9
dB(a), which is annoyingly loud."_

[https://www.notebookcheck.net/Vaio-SX14-i5-8265U-FHD-
Laptop-...](https://www.notebookcheck.net/Vaio-SX14-i5-8265U-FHD-Laptop-
Review.418199.0.html#toc-emissions)

I really like some VAIO models, as I think quality is superior to Thinkpad. So
I wish they took a bit more care with these issues. Their recent fanless
convertible suffers from coil whine. Some online reviews discuss this too.

~~~
teamski
Ok good to know. Fan control is super important, the only one managing this
well with different and really working profiles seems to be Dell. Lenovo just
started to get better there (with the S940 which is quiet but because of heavy
throttling and no options for profiles, however better than the way around).

------
Causality1
God in heaven it actually has separate mouse buttons too. I forgot how sick I
am of having to crank my thumb three inches to the right just to make sure I'm
going to right click.

~~~
nfoz
It's a requirement I have of any laptop, and they're tragically hard to find.
It's the main reason I like these modern VAIOs and will probably get one.

I'd buy a Purism in a heartbeat if it had dedicated touchpad buttons.

My only other suggestions are some Dell Latitude 7xxx models (e.g. 7390,
7490), or maybe a Fujitsu. None of the Lenovo touchpads count anymore (why are
the buttons at the top!?)

~~~
gsich
>why are the buttons at the top!?

to use it with the trackpoint or the touchpad. You can use your thumb for the
touchpad and you'd be surprised how much better it is that way.

------
kelnos
I'm surprised it only has a single USB-C port (and possibly then only for
charging?). I too am generally annoyed by port proliferation (and appreciate
having at least one USB-A port!), but I've already started embracing USB-C for
things, so this laptop's setup would be a step back for me.

~~~
2muchcoffeeman
The single USB C and not the inclusion of a VGA port is the step back?

~~~
lucb1e
Yes. VGA is frequently used, but so is C. This device has zero usable C ports
it seems, it just has a C charger.

~~~
colejohnson66
Would you prefer it had a barrel jack for power and no USB-C?

~~~
lucb1e
I don't have any C devices myself, and given the issues I've heard with C
chargers, cables, and devices, I'm inclined to say "maybe". But I think the
answer is rather "no", because of course in the long run, this mess will
probably sort itself out and we'll be able to swap chargers super easily.

Two weeks ago a charger of mine finally broke on the hottest day so far (it
was getting hot since day one, ~8 years ago, but this day finally did the
trick), I ended up taking out the hard drive behind twenty screws and
unplugging the laptop keyboard, because I didn't have a replacement charger. I
wouldn't have had a replacement C charger either, but that would be different
in years to come.

I guess more universal chargers is more better. Looking at you, work phone
(Apple branded, and battery draining unlike any OS I've ever seen, so having
only one charger is super annoying).

------
als0
Where's the parallel port? :-)

~~~
mc32
RS-232 would be more useful though.

I like this departure from Apple’s custom of having as few ports available as
possible.

~~~
jjoonathan
...and if you press a button, a baggy drops out full of null modems, gender
changers, level shifters, diagnostic LED blocks, a wrench + diagonal cutter
for inappropriately placed nuts, and a male and female 0.1" header adapter.

One can dream!

~~~
myself248
Tellya what, on my old Toughbook I had done a shit-ton of modding, and when I
removed the 56k modem, I repurposed the RJ11 jack on the side to bring out an
internal (TTL-level) serial port from the CDPD module connector. With some
inline resistors to current-limit any stupidity I might get myself into.

Then in my bag, I carried an RJ11-to-female-headers cable, and a handful of
jumper wires of various genders and a handful of minigrabber clips. And a
butane-powered soldering iron, because you never know.

It was no Novena, for sure, but just having a TTL-level serial port made that
a hell of a hacking machine. This was in the heyday of the WRT54G and similar,
and I can't count the number of console ports I invaded with no more hardware
than a wisp of wire.

------
bsder
I thought Sony quit making VAIO computers at one point?

Am I wrong? Did they never leave? Did they come back? Or are these just
rebadged Chinese laptops?

~~~
blackoil
It is now made by VAIO Corporation. Sony owns 25%, rest it sold to Japan
Industrial Partners in 2014.

------
forgingahead
Can we install OSX on it? Will pay good money for that

~~~
Synaesthesia
You can install OSX on most intel based laptops, getting the drivers for
certain things can be a pain. For wifi and bluetooth you may need to replace
the internal card.

~~~
forgingahead
Sure I get all that -- my comment was that if someone made an easy to use
alternative with OSX on this machine (basically buy it and it works, simple
Hackintosh), there's likely a good market for that.

Anecdotally, I'd pay essentially up to what I'd fork out for a Macbook Pro
now. It just needs to work, the way Apple stuff works, without any headaches.
The problem with Apple machines for me now is that they've done all these
silly reductions in features that actively hurt my convenient use of it.

 __Edit, to clarify, I 'm talking about a legit copy of OSX purchased
properly, no piracy whatsoever. I just want the creature comforts of OSX on a
machine with ports! (and MagSafe too, if possible)

~~~
colejohnson66
> Edit, to clarify, I'm talking about a legit copy of OSX purchased properly,
> no piracy whatsoever. I just want the creature comforts of OSX on a machine
> with ports! (and MagSafe too, if possible)

Technically, by installing it on a computer that isn’t a Mac, you’re violating
the EULA. So it doesn’t matter if you purchased it, it’s still illegal to use
it for that purpose (but no one’s gonna stop you)

------
ape4
Ports are useful (to state the obvious). I like this.

~~~
ryanlol
What for?

------
tus88
Ultra premium compact laptops is what they have been known for since the early
2000s. I remember oogling over one around that time for similar reasons as
this one.

------
rbanffy
I really like lots of ports, but, quite frankly, when I'm on my desk, I'd
prefer to plug in a single cable over plugging in HDMI, Ethernet, USB and
power. I like the fact my monitor has a USB hub that connects keyboard and
mouse and, if the next one can do power, video, Ethernet and USB over a single
USB-C connector, I'm all in for it.

~~~
aembleton
Then get a USB-C hub with power delivery and have that at your desk with all
of your peripherals and power supply plugged in. Then you just plug the USB-C
cable in and you're away.

For example: [https://smile.amazon.co.uk/LETSCOM-Aluminum-Adapter-
Charging...](https://smile.amazon.co.uk/LETSCOM-Aluminum-Adapter-Charging-
Ethernet-
Gray/dp/B07RMH6256/ref=sr_1_5?keywords=usb+c+hub&qid=1563187684&s=gateway&sr=8-5)

~~~
rbanffy
That's one of the many reasons why I think a VGA port is kind of silly to have
these days.

------
cm2187
It is great that it has an RJ45 port, something that almost disappeared from
every other model of laptop. Unfortunately my experience with the movable
plastic thing they use is that it is not durable (it was on the original z
series from before the reboot). The plastic bracket bends and/or goes away and
the port becomes pretty much unusable.

~~~
milkthefat
The Sony z series RJ45 hinge was just a bad design. Having used other brands
that have this style port specifically the Dell latitude 7490 they function
much better. Dell will likely continue to have a laptops with dedicated rj45
ports for a long time at least on business models.

~~~
cm2187
How long have you used it? And do you use the laptop on your lap or static on
a table?

------
ravedave5
VGA?!

~~~
userbinator
Lots of (very, _very_ expensive) projectors still use it, and a good VGA cable
will work well beyond 1080p resolutions, so why not.

The connector is also more robust than the effete HDMI/DisplayPort/etc. ones
that have tiny pins, purely by being bigger.

~~~
nulbyte
Lots of old equipment a system administrator might work with also uses VGA.

~~~
myself248
My kingdom for the VGA port having an input mode!

A friend of mine has built a little raspberry-pi-laptop with an internal HDMI
switch and a USB device-sharing gizmo, so he can use it as a portable KVM for
sysadmin tasks. I wish that was more common!

------
dorfsmay
This just need a tracking and it's 3 buttons to be my idea of a perfect
machine.

------
aib
It's depressing to see what is considered "a ton" of ports nowadays.

------
charlesdaniels
It has often been said that you can't have a thin / small laptop that also has
a large number of ports... apparently this isn't such an impossible feat after
all.

If only it had a docking connector and hot-swapable battery.

------
rbanffy
Only now I noticed Japanese keyboards follow ASCII rather than IBM Selectric
on their top row. " over 2, just like my beloved Apple II+...

------
flattone
why are laptop bezels still being "slimmed down" while phone screens are
practically dripping all over the floor?

------
jaytaylor
Poor battery life is what I've experienced with all Sony laptop machines I've
used. Always a disappointment.

~~~
SllX
VAIO was spun off from Sony, though they still retain a stake. I don’t know
how much of your previous experience translates over, cuz I honestly don’t
know how much of Sony’s laptop design aesthetic was retained in the new
company.

That’s just a long winded way of saying, it _might_ be worth a fresh look, if
you feel up to looking into them.

------
jayalpha
Tiny with 12"? About 10y ago I had a Vaio 10" Laptop. Nice peace of hardware.

------
buboard
I m big fan of lenovo X series , and they also have docking port

------
sam1r
I love the title of this article. Is it just me?

------
paulie_a
It's amazing that netbooks are back in style again and it's made by Sony. The
reboot of 80s and 90s are over, it's the aughts.

~~~
ekianjo
Its not Sony. VAIO was sold to other investors by Sony years ago.

~~~
paulie_a
Well then a number of destinations on Google and bing need to upgrade their
marketing because review sites and ecommerce site have it as Sony Vaio. As of
late 2018.

But what does it matter. Vaio was always an overpriced under equiped piece of
hardware anyways. It was the monster cable of laptops.

------
bufferoverflow
And a ridiculous price for the specs.

------
arbirk
Tons of ports but no thunderbolt

------
bryanrasmussen
that underwhelming battery worries me, otherwise I am seriously considering!

------
ColanR
This looks like the same ports, plus a single usb-c and hdmi, that a Thinkpad
X230 has.

~~~
fencepost
Does the X230 have a mini displayport like the T430?

~~~
icebraining
Yes!

------
johnchristopher
No rs232 ? :( /s

~~~
Synaesthesia
Parallel port yo

------
flud
As a MacBook pro user with just usbc, all I can say is "good move"

------
AFascistWorld
Maybe they should foucus on making hub dongle great and reliable.

------
sova
Windows SCSI support has likely not changed since the nineties so... no thanks

------
badumtss
Call me ignorant, but who are still using VGA?

~~~
efraim
A lot of projectors in conference rooms and class rooms.

------
jongold
Suddenly Apple's plethora of dongles looks like the better option

~~~
tapanjk
Can you elaborate? What are the downsides of built-in ports that would make it
preferable to carrying dongle(s)?

------
teamski
Ports are good and what Apple does is ridiculous but it is also about which
ports.

Nowadays, I tend to miss real Thunderbolt 3 ports on USB-C, better 2 than 1
and with 4 lanes. This is what they totally forgot. So I could connect to an
ancient VGA projector but not to a common 2x 4k@60hz display setup? This
doesn't make sense.

------
balaam
I've only ever had horrible experiences with Vaio and it would take a lot for
me to consider trying one again.

(The screen broke with a month, then I spent 3 months in a horrible support
hell before finally getting refunded which wasn't even the outcome I wanted -
I just wanted it fixed. Contrast with the macbook I bought it, it worked for
several months, the hard drive died, I took it to a mac store and it was fixed
within the week. The ecosystem around the computer matters.)

