
COVID-19 Tests Don’t Cost Over $3,000 - alecco
https://www.factcheck.org/2020/03/covid-19-tests-dont-cost-over-3000/
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jtdev
Great job burying the true cost at the bottom of the article:

“Jennifer Kates, the director of global health and HIV policy at the Kaiser
Family Foundation, said in a phone interview, ‘there could be other costs
incurred.’ Visits to the doctor’s office and the emergency room can cost
patients money, she said, noting that some high-deductible insurance plans
could effectively charge patients who go to the ER $1,000 or more.”

~~~
34679
That's just an average deductible, too. If the cost is $100,000,000, they
could still say "effectively charge patients who go to the ER $1,000 or more.”
and not be wrong.

It also doesn't include the cost of coverage. I have a healthy friend under 40
with a healthy family, and he pays $1200 every month, with a $1,500
deductible.

So, if you pay $18k per year, it might cost you $1,000 or $1,500, but that
still doesn't tell us how much it costs for a person to go to the ER and get
tested for Covid-19.

For an accurate assessment, they need to report the cost for an uninsured
person, or report the total that's being billed to the insurance company.

------
helen___keller
Whenever you go to a hospital it's impossible to tell what the cost will be.
Literally, my doctor told me before my operation "I have no idea, probably
whatever your deductible is" when I asked the cost

Coronavirus test or not is just a detail

~~~
PragmaticPulp
> Whenever you go to a hospital it's impossible to tell what the cost will be.

Hospital emergency rooms are for emergency services.

Suspected Coronavirus patients should not be presenting to hospital ERs for
testing and care _unless_ they are experiencing respiratory distress or other
urgent symptoms.

Basic testing and diagnosis should be handled via local doctors. Please call
first to discuss the Coronavirus protocol.

Don't go to the Hospital unless you need urgent emergency care for something.
You will be charged urgent, emergency care prices.

~~~
jeltz
And that is what the hospital should have told him and then sent him home.
They should not have done the tests and charged him 3k for it.

------
yebyen
The original story as I heard was from a person who said that they were
mandated to get tested because of their risk of exposure. Now we learn from
the mandatory hospital stay, they got a bill for $3000 _and didn 't even get
the COVID-19 test?_

~~~
TulliusCicero
Yeah, the original story is only somewhat misleading here. They had to get
tested because of possible COVID-19 exposure, and doing so did cost $3000.

The real problem is that healthcare in general in the US has absolutely insane
costs, not something specific to the coronavirus.

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PragmaticPulp
The amount of misinformation surrounding COVID-19 and healthcare is
staggering. Some practical advice:

1\. Call your family doctor or a local doctor first. The emergency room at the
hospital is only necessary if you have immediately life threatening symptoms.
If you go to the emergency room, you will receive and be charged for emergency
care. This is expensive because it's for emergencies. Call your doctor first!

2\. Local doctor's offices have protocols for COVID-19 testing already. This
might involve some combination of staying in your car until a practitioner
comes to escort you, keeping your hands folded across your chest so you don't
touch anything, wearing a mask to minimize the spread from coughing, and going
in a separate entrance, and staying in a reserved back room that will be
carefully disinfected after you leave. Again, _do not go to an emergency room
and sit in the waiting room just to be tested_.

3\. The COVID-19 test itself is being paid for by government funds, as stated
in the article. However, you will still be billed for medical services
rendered such as the administration of the test. This is one reason why a
local doctor is much cheaper than going to a busy emergency room.

4\. Do not assume that you're positive for COVID-19 before working with a
professional to understand the risk factors and diagnostic criteria. They will
likely screen you over the phone to reduce the rate of false positives.

5\. If you are concerned about the cost, _please ask your doctor what your
options are_. This is not an uncommon situation and in many cases there are
low-cost or free options available.

------
jnmandal
Sure the test itself doesnt cost $3000, but you will be out around that much
money if you go to the ER to get tested. The article about the guy in miami
didnt even include a COVID-19 test and he was still billed $3270

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ianleeclark
I think the most important part of the story, regardless of its truth or not,
is the plausibility of the situation, and that is what allowed the story to be
viral.

~~~
PragmaticPulp
The real problem is that people are choosing to believe sensational headlines
instead of doing their own research.

I’m seeing a sharp increase in the number of young people who don’t understand
how their own health insurance works. They just assume it’s awful because
that’s what they read in the news.

I can’t tell you how many times I’ve had to tell people that generic insulin
is actually only $25/vial at Walmart instead of the hundreds to thousands that
they read about in the news. Yes, it's not identical to the newer, longer-
acting analogs that cost more, but it's an effective option for those who
can't afford the more expensive versions.

This kind of thing is actively driving people away from taking the 10 minutes
to understand their health insurance and seeking proper care.

~~~
ianleeclark
> The real problem is that people are choosing to believe sensational
> headlines instead of doing their own research.

I think the real problem is that people believe they could receive a 3k bill
for doing the right thing.

> I’m seeing a sharp increase in the number of young people who don’t
> understand how their own health insurance works. They just assume it’s awful
> because that’s what they read in the news.

As someone who grew up with parents who had health insurance, I still had to
see them choose to not go to the doctor due to costs. I saw medical bills
arrive. I've had to deal with calling to find out if the doctor I needed to go
to was in network, and yet still fearing that information was incorrect due to
the massive bill I could expect afterwards. I've seen a 5k deductible plan
staring me in the face.

Call it anecdotal all you want, but I'm not unique and this is the reason that
a lot of young people know their health insurance is trash.

> I can’t tell you how many times I’ve had to tell people that generic insulin
> is actually only $25/vial at Walmart instead of the hundreds to thousands
> that they read about in the news.

Assuming the other poster is correct that this isn't viable for everyone, it's
a little funny given how you're harping on about those millenials/zoomers and
all their lack of knowledge.

> This kind of thing is actively driving people away from taking the 10
> minutes to understand their health insurance and seeking proper care.

Most people, if they have the average ~4k deductible, are not going to go to
the doctor because they fear a 4k bill.

~~~
PragmaticPulp
> Assuming the other poster is correct that this isn't viable for everyone

I'm very familiar with it, actually. The idea that it's not viable for some
patients is further misinformation, sadly. If you want to understand further,
you can search for "insulin analogs".

The generic insulin available cheaply at Walmart _does_ work, but it also
requires dosing adjustments due to the different duration. If patients take
the time to adjust their dosages, it will work. If patients try to apply the
same exact protocol they used with a different insulin analog, they will have
problems. This is where the "doesn't work for everyone" myth comes from.

> it's a little funny given how you're harping on about those
> millenials/zoomers and all their lack of knowledge.

Please, I said nothing about "millenials/zoomers". Most of the diabetics I
know are neither millenials nor zoomers.

This is why I hesitate to discuss practical health care advice online. Too
many people want to turn it into a political debate. I never suggested our
system was great and I fully agree that we need to make changes.

But it's not doing anyone any favors to spread misinformation to amplify the
urgency for political change. It's critically important that we all work on
spreading the most accurate information to people so they can direct their
care responsibly within the bounds of our (flawed) system, rather than using
scare tactics to amplify the politically urgency.

~~~
claudeganon
Yale endocrinologists aren't "spreading misinformation":

>“Human insulins are a reasonable option for many patients with Type 2
diabetes,” said Yale endocrinologist Kasia Lipska, who often prescribes the
drugs for patients who can’t afford newer formulations. “But the drug isn’t
optimal for everybody. And human insulin sold at Walmart is definitely not the
solution to our insulin crisis.”

Nor are Diabetes advocates:

>For people with Type 1 diabetes, human insulins “are harder to live on, lead
to worse control, make it harder to hold down a job, impact quality of life,”
said James Elliott, a trustee at T1International, an independent patient
advocacy group, “and not everyone lives near a Walmart.”

[https://www.vox.com/science-and-
health/2019/4/10/18302238/in...](https://www.vox.com/science-and-
health/2019/4/10/18302238/insulin-walmart-relion)

You can't hide behind "not wanting to engage in political debate" when you
yourself misconstrue the reality of the situation to make it seem less urgent
than it actually is.

------
sschueller
So how much is the test?

Test costs USD ~190.- in Switzerland and all insurances are required to cover
it under basic care but only suspected cases get tested (You were in Italy,
Wuhan or in contact with people who were)

~~~
PragmaticPulp
From the article: The test is paid for by the government.

It’s the ancillary hospital services that cause the charges. If you go to a
hospital, you have to pay for the usage of the hospital. This is billed to
your insurance.

~~~
TulliusCicero
So, the test itself doesn't cost that much...but, _getting tested_ does cost
that much.

When most people are talking about the test, I think they're talking about the
whole process.

~~~
PragmaticPulp
> getting tested does cost that much.

Getting tested at _a hospital emergency room_ for 20+ different possible
viruses could cost that much, but you shouldn't be presenting to the
_emergency_ room for basic testing. That should be handled through your local
doctor.

The hospital emergency room is for urgent emergencies. ER doctors are rushing
to get things done. Unless you're having severe respiratory distress, you
should not rush to the ER for routine Coronavirus testing.

------
dalex00
In Germany I think the test is free if you show enough symptoms and had
contact to an ill person or you travelled to a sick area. If you do not match
those criteria but still want to be tested them the test costs 500. My company
covers those second scenario for free.

------
empath75
If we don’t guarantee free care for this, it’s going to spread unchecked
because people aren’t going to go to the doctor.

It doesn’t help that trump is going on tv telling people that it’s just a cold
and you should go into work if you have it.

~~~
jnmandal
Its really far too late for that. They are trying in NY (they made it free)
but you can't undo decades of societal conditioning so fast. Not to mention we
probably needed to get ahead of this three weeks ago since the incubation
period is so long. Folks w/ symptoms have been for sure avoiding testing over
the last couple weeks.

~~~
pbourke
> They are trying in NY (they made it free) but you can't undo decades of
> societal conditioning so fast.

I consider myself fairly well informed on these topics and I don't believe it,
either (though I'm not in NY). I believe that certain regulators and
governments _intend_ for it to be free, but I don't believe it will be that
easy when the provider billing and insurance systems get involved.

~~~
jnmandal
We'll see, the governor has ordered insurers to waive all costs
([https://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/485622-new-york-
insure...](https://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/485622-new-york-insurers-
ordered-to-to-waive-costs-associated-with-coronavirus)), and actually
California just did the same.

Maybe tax payers will end up paying in the end though, either through civil
courts or some kind of backward-effective legislation.

------
freewizard
\- my test suites runs <1s !

\- yeah, but spinning up the test env and loading data cost >3000s.

------
TeMPOraL
Some thoughts:

1) It doesn't matter how much the test itself costs. It doesn't matter whether
it even gets done. The only thing that matters is, how much you're likely to
pay _if you go_ to take that test. That's the only variable consumer is
considering.

2) Cool that "as of now, the two authorized testing agencies aren’t billing
patients for the tests" and that Medicare & Medicaid have a code for this
test. That's _as of now_. The $3000 story broke over a week ago, and nothing
here convinces me that this wasn't a representative number up until now.

------
andor
Test kits made by TIB Molbiol cost EUR 2.50 per patient. One kit can be used
for 96 patients (or up to twice that number if diluted), so cost of work is
spread over quite a few people. Their estimate for a reasonable price is EUR
10.00 including work.

Source (German): [https://www.tagesspiegel.de/berlin/tib-molbiol-berliner-
firm...](https://www.tagesspiegel.de/berlin/tib-molbiol-berliner-firma-
produziert-corona-tests-fuer-die-ganze-welt/25602142.html)

------
bArray
Wait... Is the US really charging for the tests? If they want to stop the
spread of the virus, the test needs to be free.

Actually, go one step further, they need to begin random screening. A lot of
people are not presenting severe symptoms and therefore are not going to the
hospital, but are still carriers.

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claudeganon
I find this kind of fact checking quite specious. The person wasn’t given a
COVID-19 test (presumably because the testing has been a disaster), but
visited the ER, was tested for 22 other respiratory pathogens, found negative,
and discharged.

Wouldn’t this be true for anyone who went to the ER under similar
circumstances? They would have to clear the same tests, pay the same ER fee,
etc before being given the COVID-19 test.

These preliminary cost hurdles to testing aren’t going to be removed simply
because the test itself is now required to be covered by health insurance and
Medicare/Medicaid. And what about the uninsured?

~~~
thom
Exactly, and I agree that this type of fact check seems to be on the rise,
where you carefully rearrange and redefine all the words in the initial
statement, and find some narrow way in which it's then not strictly true. Fun
game, but not especially enlightening.

~~~
runawaybottle
It’s literally the opposite of good investigative journalism. We’ve come full
circle from click bait to click bait fact checking.

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sagebird
For covid19 testing of low-likelyhood samples can you batch?

IE - take 64 samples, combine them, test it once.

If positive, divide and conquer?

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aguyfromnb
The interesting thing to me is the "who" and "why" of this disinformation
spreading. Would this be considered pro-Healthcare-For-All?

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tpmx
Nitpick:

Wouldn't surprise me if the _cost_ is $3k at this point. The _price_ is
another matter.

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a012
IIRC I was reading a comment on Reddit who said their family member's bill of
the test was $3000.

