

iPhones at Foxconn built, in part, by 13 year-olds working 16 hr/day for 70¢/hr - jimmyjim
http://www.businessinsider.com/apple-child-labor-2012-1/

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Natsu
I can make direct comparisons to the everyday reality seen in one American
factory. Sure, I'm the sysadmin, but I'm responsible for all the computers on
the shop floor, among other things. There's not a soul out there I don't know,
and I've seen what things are like when they work until 7 AM the next day to
finish things.

Here's how these conditions measure up:

* 12 hr shifts normal, 14-16 hour shifts common? Ouch. They must be at capacity. Sure, the guys have seen 70+ hour weeks of heavy labor and 20 hour days, but they're not that common, and they usually get their full weekend. Sure, it's normal that workers stand, but that's what makes working a shift that long so brutal (as well as heavy lifting & heat/cold). And I'm sure they don't have ergonomic mats to stand on in China.

* Inspections known in advance? That would be normal. You should expect them to spend roughly the week before the inspection trying to look good.

* Management clueless about what's really going on? Normal.

* Unions are illegal in China? Wow. I thought they were, you know, Communists or something. This being a "Right to Work" state, I've never dealt with unions either.

* Kids working under-age? Don't see that here. Your average US shop floor factory worker is an HS-dropout or ex-con (or both). Nobody works there because they want to and the burn-out rate is usually pretty high. In a good economy, it would be ~15% turnover per month, though that goes down almost to zero when jobs are scarce. I'm sure they need the money, but I sure wouldn't want to see kids needing to do that sort of thing. US workers make roughly 10-15x as much, depending on experience, though I don't know how the buying power compares.

* Worker dorms? We've only ever joked about sleeping in the parking lot after really long days. I thought those went out of style here centuries ago.

* Workers burn out really fast here, too. But we have Workman's Comp for those who get injured and MSDS sheets & safety gear for anyone handling dangerous chemicals. The Chinese are getting completely screwed here if they're getting injured and tossed aside.

* "One man got his hand crushed in a metal press at Foxconn. Foxconn did not give him medical attention." That sort of thing does happen here, except that you get medical attention. Oddly enough, _I_ gave someone medical attention for almost the same injury not too long ago. His hand just needed a few stitches. He did return to work on light duty the next day, though.

* Here, they just send you home if you're getting too much OT and they complain about how long things take, even if their estimates were totally unreasonable. I've never seen anyone get blacklisted or anything like that.

In short, we have it a lot better here, but there are quite a few things that
need improvement. The Chinese are really getting screwed on the safety side of
things. I don't know if factories are ever truly safe, but you can do a lot
better than that.

------
byoung2
There are companies that are committed to manufacturing in the US, despite the
effect on their profit margin.

 _Every Mag Instrument flashlight, no matter where in the world it ends up,
comes from a factory located in the U.S.A. and staffed by American workers_

<http://www.maglite.com/mag_commitment.asp>

------
makecheck
While the working hours are ridiculous, a couple things to keep perspective:

\- It's sensational to focus on an absolute value of 70 cents while ignoring
the buying power of 70 cents in China. This still isn't a _very good_ wage,
but the cost of living differences are huge; 70 cents should probably be
likened to the minimum wage in the U.S. (i.e. think "equivalent to a few
dollars an hour" not "pennies" as the article might have you believe). You can
Google several cost-of-living comparisons between China and the U.S.

\- A huge number of tech companies rely on Foxconn; this is not unique to
iPhones nor is it new. So mention of the iPhone is, again, sensational; this
manufacturing issue is pervasive.

~~~
Natsu
The safety conditions are the most ridiculous part. I'm especially leery of
allowing kids in there. I'm sure they need the jobs, but factories are unsafe
enough. US factories can see those kinds of hours at least some of the time.
They're probably that high because they're running at capacity.

You're right about Apple getting singled out. Probably because it generates
the most pageviews. I will give Apple credit, though, for at least attempting
to do something about the problem. That said, if they know when the
inspections are, they can sweep an awful lot of things under the rug.

Many of the problems are societal. In the US, nobody would cover up injuries.
Doctors would instead complain that you had an unsafe workplace if the
conditions got out of hand. And they could complain to OSHA if they were being
exposed to toxic chemicals. Those aren't really Apple problems, those are
China problems. That said, it's good that all this attention is being paid to
this. It's probably the only way that anything will get done. Keeping quiet
about the problems won't help anyone.

