
YC vs. Techstars, Launchbox, and DreamIT - wumi
There's obviously YC.<p>But there's also Techstars, Launchbox, and DreamitVentures, in the United States at least.<p>Three Questions:<p>1. Can they not all co-exist (does it have to be us vs. them? or can't we celebrate entrepreneurship in varied forms)<p>2. Why are people so irate when a good idea is cloned -- doesn't that re-inforce the strength of the idea?<p>3. Who will be the first (or does it exist) to do a YC in the under-developed world?<p>Certainly, Ashoka (http://ashoka.org/) already exists, but what about a focus on entrepreneurs/ mentoring and connections, regardless of whether its social or not.
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nreece
>> 3\. Who will be the first (or does it exist) to do a YC in the under-
developed world?

Kiva.org and Prosper.com seem to be doing quite well in this space.

A few I'm aware of that exist in India:

TIFAC ( <http://tifac.org.in/> ) Seedfund ( <http://www.seedfund.in/> )
Erasmic incubation fund ( <http://www.erasmic.com> ) Aavishkaar (
<http://www.aavishkaar.org/> ) TIE ( <http://bangalore.tie.org/> )

But I'm not sure how reliable and enterprising these are actually.

Wondering if there are any seed funding orgs like YC in Australia?

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wumi
Don't know of any in AU, but as far as kiva and prosper, that's not really the
YC / seed-funding model, that's the Mohammed Yunnis Micro-loan model.

Lending money to somebody and watching their progress is a lot different then
what Y C or any seed-fund does.

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jamiequint
The YC model is probably not generally applicable in countries spanning all
stages of economic development. Even though kiva/prosper are not exactly the
same thing, they may be the equivalent workable solution in the countries
where they are active.

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imsteve
I'm sure many groups better than YC will spring up, barring a major market
collapse.

It's hard to even look at YC in a positive light anymore. They've gotten too
greedy in just choosing the most ideal cookie-cutter groups that follow their
rigid profile of the ideal founders.

It just always seemed that YC had a bigger vision than making lots of cash. No
longer.

This is not unique to YC, many successful people admit later in their careers
that they would never, today, hire themselves. I just wonder if YC will
continue down this path or reach a point where they will turn around, stop
trying desperately to prove themselves and make a more meaningful difference.

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dshah
You're suggesting that greed (YC acting in their financial interests) is a bad
thing. I don't think it is.

What makes investors successful, is the same thing that makes startups
successful: Figuring out a pattern that works.

What YC is doing is betting that lots of small investments in hackepreneur
types is better than what VCs and other early-stage investors are doing.

Also, I don't see much evidence of them "desperately trying to prove
themselves". Looks like they're doing what any smart investment group should
do: Trying to attract great entrepreneurs that they think they can help. If
Paul and company were good at detecting and promoting talent in the life
sciences sector, that's what they'd do. But they aren't, and so they don't.

~~~
imsteve
This is really just a very early prediction on my part of where YC may be
headed. I, personally, feel very little animosity towards YC or their current
methods but have become more wary of their direction.

But yes, placing _too large_ of a priority on financial interests __is
__always bad.

Finding a pattern that works is a good strategy, but what's their fitness
function? This seems like an easy way to fall into the trap of only looking at
the short term. With the volatility of software startups, I can't blame them
too much for that.

It would serve their publicity greatly to show that they are still interested
in improving the situation for us regular hackers and startup founders who are
still at the bottom than appearing to just focus on their bottom line. This
does not require lots of money or diving into unnecessarily risky investments.

~~~
jamiequint
Its not really clear how you are suggesting YC change. What are you suggesting
they do?

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rokhayakebe
1\. i think over the years you will see several more companies like
ycombinator. you may even see something better. that is just how it goes, but
in the long run, seed fund will die. and companies will go straight from
doormroom to acquisition. add the fact that acquisition will be in the low
millions and high hundred of thousands.

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Tichy
"Who will be the first (or does it exist) to do a YC in the under-developed
world?"

I suppose politics are in the way - most underdeveloped countries don't have
capitalism, or am I mistaken?

~~~
SwellJoe
Some do, some don't. But most frightening to most investors is the
unreliability of the capitalism that does exist. See Kenya, for a recent
example. Would you invest in a company in a nation that may, or may not, have
a free market to operate in next year? Kenya has, for the past several years,
seen tremendous economic growth and development, much of it supported by
outside investment...but with the newly elected leadership, genocidal military
actions, and a return to the tribalism and cronyism that accounts for the
problems in the rest of undeveloped Africa, those businesses are fleeing and
the economy is collapsing...with the favorite people of the new president
dividing up the corpses of industry amongst themselves.

Russia, while not undeveloped, has seen tremendous investment over the years
from outsiders...and a very big amount of that investment has vanished into
the void that is a constantly shifting economic picture and the pockets of
former KGB leadership who leveraged their power into positions as "captains of
industry" as state-run services were privatized into their possession. Same
story...if you can't rely on the rule of law to protect your investments, you
not only take on the risk of investing in a new idea and unproven people,
you're also betting that the government won't rip it all out from under you
when it begins to succeed and give it to their favorite crony.

The US isn't unique in offering respect for rule of law (nor is it getting
better in this respect), basically free market, and checks and balances to
prevent any one person from wielding too much power over businesses, but it
has a long and stable history in these areas. Despite SOx, the US is still one
of the best places to start and grow a business...and no matter what happens
with the leadership of the nation, it probably will remain so for the
foreseeable future. This is also why investors like Delaware
corporations...well-understood and very slowly evolving corporate law.

So, it's not just capitalism, but consistency: the removal of one variable
from the risk side of the equation.

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DarrenStuart
1\. Yes 2\. not sure, fanboyism perhaps 3\. can't they already apply to YC?

There is also seedcamp over here in the UK/Europe.

~~~
wumi
it is simply unrealistic for thousands of startups around the world to get
invited to YC -- unless YC has plans for mega expansion.

plus, most startups through YC, even though they're web-based, don't really
have a reach to under-developed world

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DarrenStuart
I think web based start ups could be massive in the under-developed world.
They don't have the infrastructure as more developed nations. Look at Estonia
they have moved most of their infrastructure online and its working well for
them(well if you discount the russian cyber attack a while back). The problem
for these countries is internet access but there are lots of pretty cool
projects giving them access. Also with open source development tools wide and
the low computing power needed for developing web apps the barrier to entry is
a lot lower.

of course if anyone from these countries applyed and they had something that
sparked interest they would be invited over to YC interviews. Its not that
different than me applying from the UK.

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wumi
and web based mobile apps even bigger. 2.2 billion mobile phones vs. 700
million computers in the world.

I doubt more than 1000 people in under-developed world know what Y C is. Again
YC's reach is not world-wide -- not yet anyways.

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DarrenStuart
true, I only come here for the community not to get into YC though.

