
Microsoft CEO Satya Nadella Comes to Red Hat Summit - CrankyBear
https://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-ceo-satya-nadella-comes-to-red-hat-summit/
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ThJ
Two perspectives on the recent grand entry of Microsoft into the Linux space:

1\. Linux won in the embedded (ARM devices), mobile (Android) and server
spaces, and this is Microsoft bowing to that.

2\. This is Microsoft's embrace, extend and extinguish strategy from the 1990s
in a new wrapper. They just had to do it to an operating system this time.

Not sure if these perspectives are correct, but I'm just throwing them out
there as food for thought.

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TimTheTinker
> This is Microsoft's embrace, extend and extinguish strategy from the 1990s
> in a new wrapper

We're all right to be cautious about trusting large companies' motives when
they embrace an open standard. But I don't think there's any reason to invoke
_EEE!_ until they have introduced a proprietary (i.e. closed-source)
_implementation_ of something and then added non-standard extensions.

Since much of Microsoft's recent activity has been released as open source (
_MIT_ licensed, no less), I have a hard time believing Microsoft would go down
that road again any time soon.

Rather, I think they're building their business on providing the best and
easiest-to-use hosting and cloud services provided you're using their
excellent and free developer tooling. And I'm OK with that, since they're not
doing anything that is unfairly competitive. (Even AWS could start providing
VSCode extensions and they'd be on equal footing with Microsoft, though to win
they'd have to compete with MS's cloud directly.)

~~~
lokedhs
> But I don't think there's any reason to invoke EEE! until they have
> introduced a proprietary (i.e. closed-source) implementation of something
> and then added non-standard extensions.

That would be WSL wouldn't it? Their goal is clearly to avoid having people
moving to Linux as a development platform, and keep them on Windows.

The extensions are the ability for Linux processes to integrate with Windows
software running on the same machine. In a way, they're extending Linux with
Windows services.

~~~
carlosdp
> Their goal is clearly to avoid having people moving to Linux as a
> development platform, and keep them on Windows.

I think it's the opposite. There's little danger that Windows shops are going
to move to Linux. However, I know a bunch of devs currently using Macs that
would probably switch to Windows with nice devices like the Surface Pro and
access to real gaming and such, if only Windows was a suitable Unix
environment for their work.

They want devs using Macs and such to move to Windows, and I think it's going
to work.

~~~
acct1771
This comment tells me Purism et al need tablets next.

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gdsdfe
I think what Nadella is doing at MSFT is truly remarkable, refocus on adding
value and shifting from Ballmer's broken model ... interesting times.

~~~
loudtieblahblah
He's loving linux to death.

~~~
metildaa
Didn't some documents leak showing a Microsoft Evangelist killing Apple
centric conferences?

I know Microsoft tried to kill Linuxfest Northwest a few years back,
sponsoring it and taking control of 1/3 of the floor space, both approved
afterpartys, etc. This year they had a small booth that was staffed for one of
the two days...

~~~
bureado
Where is this coming from? I was the one organizing this sponsorship.

~~~
metildaa
Just what I observed that year, it reminded me of this:
[http://techrights.org/2009/07/15/ms-technical-evangelists-
li...](http://techrights.org/2009/07/15/ms-technical-evangelists-list/)

Most of the people I know stopped going to LFNW after the shitshow that was
that year, they still attend SeaGL and other conventions.

The exploding can of WD-40 that MS handed out that year was the cherry on top
of the hijacking of the main space, fake Azure credits, and poorly run
afterparty that MS put on.

Frankly, MS should not have been allowed to hijack LFNW that year. This year
MS was the only booth to not staff on Sunday, I'd hope LFNW doesn't waste
table space next year.

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asdfman123
King-Beyond-The-Wall visits Castle Black; understands he must join forces with
the southerners to fight the army of the dead because Winter is Coming.

~~~
sudeepj
I would have thought MS to be Warden of the North and Linux to be wildlings
(or free-folk) given the way they treated it/them in the past.

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BossingAround
What I wonder is, does anyone have OpenShift experience here? If so, what do
you think of it? And compared to Kubernetes? I know OpenShift is Kubernetes
plus extra features, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's better.

~~~
stuff4ben
Openshift is Kubernetes...with a few more things bolted on. Currently running
it at scale at Cisco and pretty happy with it and support from RedHat.

~~~
moderation
Openshift is a fork of Kubernetes...with a few more things bolted on. I think
the distinction is important. Development occurs in a separate repo and the
upstream Kubernetes code is backported into that repo. Similar to how Red Hat
handles RHEL.

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test001only
It looks like Google is loosing hacker confidence while Microsoft is gaining
them. Am not able to keep count of the number of times I have been burnt
because of Google's decision to drop support for their products, change
functionality after buying then and inane UI changes. Contrast that to
experience with Microsoft, I can't recall that many instances.

~~~
ilaksh
I consider myself to be roughly in the category of "hacker" in the context of
that sentence. I don't have confidence in The Google controlling everything
any more than I do with MS.

I used to be an MS developer many years ago. I will say one positive thing --
MS makes a lot of very useful development tools.

However, I'm amazed that people think it's not MS anymore. They have not
gained my confidence in any way in terms of this supposed altruism or
whatever.

Linux in some ways has been one of very few possible Windows competitors on
the desktop. The fact they they essentially decided to just swallow Linux into
Windows does not make me think they are more friendly to Linux.

They will set it up so that it will _seem_ like your are developing for Linux,
but due to some extensions or technicality it will only work on _Linux inside
of Windows_.

So from my perspective it is amazing that people think this is a good thing
for Linux.

~~~
MrEldritch
I doubt this will happen. For one thing, the dominant targets for Linux are
servers and embedded systems - both of which are cases where resource overhead
is pretty important. Running a Windows to run Linux inside of incurs a pretty
substantial overhead, so I really can't see any case where developers would be
willing (or even necessarily _able_ ) to spare the resources to install
Windows on their formerly-Linux-only targets just to maintain the convenience
of getting to develop for "Linux" on their Windows PCs.

And desktop apps developed for WSL will simply _never_ be Linux-compatible out
of the box at this rate, given that WSL does not contain any graphical or UI
functions; MSFT has been pretty clear about this right from the start, and so
I really can't see a scenario where people mistakenly believe just developing
user-facing applications for WSL will make them "just work" on Linux, given
that _all the UI code is on the Windows side_.

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bdz
Video of the full Q&A
[https://youtu.be/7YYqJZIvw2U](https://youtu.be/7YYqJZIvw2U)

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kitd
So we could yet see IBM Cloud private running on Red Hat Openshift, all hosted
by Microsoft Azure.

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outside1234
IBM Cloud isn't working, so that is entirely possible, especially versus IBM
having to shut it down.

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kmlx
neither is azure ;)

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jsgo
what's wrong with Azure?

I mean, if you're against cloud hosting that's fine, but what is wrong with
Azure specifically?

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shams93
Azure has become my go-to place to deploy nodejs, I used to use AWS
exclusively but Aws is brutally complex while Nadella's team have done an
amazing job with the clarity and usability of the azure UI.

~~~
shams93
However I still use AWS ses because nobody has anything that compares with ses
and Amazon's transactional messaging service I'm general.

