
Robert Mugabe, Strongman Who Cried, ‘Zimbabwe Is Mine,’ Dies at 95 - ishikawa
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/06/obituaries/robert-mugabe-dead.html
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RcouF1uZ4gsC
The more I see the stories of these leaders who led their country to
independence and then stayed on and became dictators, the more I appreciate
how unique George Washington was. His single decision to retire after 8 years
set up American democracy for success.

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positr0n
Even well before his presidency, right after the British surrendered, he had
to quash small scale conspiracies to have the army take power. And they would
have easily made him a military leader similar to Cromwell if he wanted.

Example:
[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newburgh_Conspiracy](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newburgh_Conspiracy)

~~~
RcouF1uZ4gsC
Good point. The very fact that we even have an elected President owes a lot to
him.

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mudil
Zimbabwe's trillion dollar notes are quite popular with numismatics. On eBay,
single $100 trillion dollar notes go for $10-30+ American dollars! I think the
most rare ones are $20 trillion dollar note, though.

[https://www.theguardian.com/money/2016/may/14/zimbabwe-
trill...](https://www.theguardian.com/money/2016/may/14/zimbabwe-trillion-
dollar-note-hyerinflation-investment)

~~~
skim_milk
I used to have a trillion dollar note and a large stack of million-dollar
notes before some idiot at work stole them. Instead of retiring early all they
got was my eternal disappointment. I keep wanting to replace my cash but the
price of Zimbabwe bucks keeps going up and up, 100-trillion costs $70+ now!
And when the notes were officially abandoned you could get whole bricks of
unused stacks of any denomination for super cheap! Someday I will just have to
take my losses and buy my 100-trill back.

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mudil
I have 100 sequential uncirculated and bound 100 trillion dollar notes that I
bought on ebay ten years ago for probably $5. I remember when you could buy
literally bricks of trillion dollar notes for a few dollars!

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ijpoijpoihpiuoh
Sometimes it seems there is no justice in the world. I guess because there
isn't. Terrible people who do catastrophic harm to millions of citizens live
in wealth and comfort to the ripe old age of 95. At the same time, innocent
children lose loving parents to disease and accident every day.

I just hope that Zimbabwe will never again experience so terrible a leader,
and that his legacy will live on as an example of how not to rule a country.

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agapon
I guess that there is no justice and no unjustice. The world is just very
random / complex.

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kilroy123
Coincidentally, I'm actually in Harare, Zimbabwe right now. I was told earlier
that there would be parties all over the city. Some will be celebrating but
many others will mourn his death.

Pretty surprising for me, a white westerner to hear that people will be
morning for the guy.

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sys_64738
People mourned Stalin.

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edmundsauto
My great great grandmother was a staunch fascist (living in the US) and
mourned Mussolini's death for a number of years, I'm told.

People don't understand why things are the way they are. Myself especially.
It's a fundamental human bias to think otherwise.

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billfruit
Of course he and his supporters have at times resorted to violence, but also
it is to be remembered that he led the fight to end colonial rule in Zimbabwe,
I remember during the Mandela memorial function many world leaders including
Obama had made the appearance, Mugabe was the one who got the highest
applause. IIRC Mandela didn't share the opinions of the western press
regarding Mugabe. Perhaps it might even be said that esp the British
Governments upto and including Tony Blair's didn't deal fairly with him for
decades together, and that had a major role in what he eventually became.

[https://www.thenation.com/article/robert-mugabe-and-the-
pois...](https://www.thenation.com/article/robert-mugabe-and-the-poisonous-
legacy-of-british-colonialism/)

~~~
krustyburger
The British government being “unfair” doesn’t excuse Mugabe’s tyranny or
avarice. And tyrants are usually very good at generating applause while they
are still in power.

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paggle
Power is power. Never paid any price for the horrors he inflicted on millions.

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scarmig
He was an authoritarian dictator with terrible economic policies and no
respect for human rights, but "horrors he inflicted on millions" is
overstating it a bit. He's not Idi Amin.

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paggle
He is much worse because his policies led to widespread starvation killing
millions. Not just killing 100,000 people. Both are terrible of course, and
should have died in a brazen bull.

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rayiner
Interesting to read socialists’ take on Mugabe: [https://solidarity-
us.org/atc/51/p4616/](https://solidarity-us.org/atc/51/p4616/)

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boomboomsubban
The world was largely pro-Mugabe in 94. That's the year that the British gave
him an honorary knighthood.

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scarmig
There seem to be a lot of people here perplexed about why, exactly, Mugabe is
celebrated, when there's so much there to (rightly) condemn him for.

Read up on Rhodesia, and more broadly the anti-colonial struggles in Africa.
Africans weren't even second class citizens: the vast majority were given zero
say in governance. Legal protections were de facto non-existent. And, in the
midst of the bush war, tens of thousands of civilians were killed by the
Rhodesian military.

Does that at all excuse Mugabe post-Rhodesia? Not at all. But it's important
to contextualize him if you want to understand why many still valorize him.

As a point of comparison, Americans celebrate George Washington for leading a
successful anti-colonial struggle and establishing a republic. But, a much
darker gloss is that he founded a white settler republic that enshrined a
brutal system of slavery in its Constitution and that regularly committed
campaigns of genocide against non-dominant ethnic groups. Indeed, British
restrictions on that was a substantial motivating factor for the white
American settlers to have rebelled.

Reducing Washington to that would mislead more than it reveals, but people are
doing the exact same thing with Mugabe. Focusing on Mugabe's very real sins to
the extent it obscures what people find compelling about him is limiting your
own understanding of the world.

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mmsimanga
I appreciate the attempt to bring another side to the debate but the point you
are missing is that it is us black Africans who are being critical of Mugabe.
We all experienced the oppression by the Rhodesian government. It his actions
against fellow blacks after "liberation" that we are criticizing. He presided
over the murder of 20 000 people[0]. A leader who presides over record
inflation no matter the excuse has failed and should step down to give someone
else a chance. He had to be removed through a coup as he was preparing to hand
over the country to his wife.

[0][https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gukurahundi](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gukurahundi)

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scarmig
It's tiring how any attempt to contextualize why some people like Mugabe
(which I don't! I repeatedly criticize him in my comment!) needs to be
represented as saying that he's not deserving of criticism or that the only
people criticizing him are white imperialists. Yes, he did plenty of bad
things, but someone who has only read a caricature of him will ultimately be
flummoxed when they meet a fan of his.

If you've had many encounters with Zimbabweans, you've run into people who do
think he is a hero. This would be perplexing to the average HNer who has only
read (accurate!) stories of authoritarianism, human rights violations, and
hyperinflation.

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mmsimanga
I understand the point you are making in this comment. The fervent support for
Mugabe can be confusing. TO expand on your answer and to inform HN crowd here
are some I think people support Mugabe.

1\. Once a hero, always a hero. Africans struggle to turn on liberation
movement leaders. We feel we owe them our freedom. For some people, liberation
movement leaders can never do anything wrong. This leads to my point two.

2\. Some families have always associated themselves with liberation movements.
It maybe the father joined the party or a son, sister, cousin joined the party
a long time ago and family feels obligated to support the party

3\. Mugabe was gifted speaker who tapped into the anti imperialist/colonialist
sentiment in Africa. He is loved by many Africans because he dared publicly
speak out against the West. He always loved Europe until they put sanctions on
him and then he turned towards the East.

4\. Mugabe ran on a tribal ticket. You will find more supporters in certain
tribes than in others.

The biggest reason he is still popular today is because of his anti West
rhetoric. Which is a pity but to each their own. I hope this sheds some light
to an HNer who encounters Africans who think the world of Mugabe.

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yostrovs
The Westerners may well be aware of Mugabe's end of colonization. But, someone
who has murdered is called a murderer. And should be treated as such. Stalin
stopped Hitler and industrialized Russia, but he's a murderer. Lots of people
in Russia adore him, and though I know full well why, I've never had anyone
explain to me why that is. But we have here an African who killed Africans, so
we are supposed to see the other side more clearly. Are the murdered Africans
supposed to count less heavily on our conscience?

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mmsimanga
I totally get where you are coming from and I agree with you. I also see the
point the parent comment was trying to make. If you meet 10 Zimbabweans you
likely to find a few who adore Mugabe. The comment was just to inform those
not so familiar with Zimbabwean politics and history. He is still a murderer
but sadly there are fellow Africans some very close to me who only see the
liberation hero. I just think it is important to understand where the other
side is coming from. I strongly disagree and think some of the opinions are
based on willfully ignoring facts but it is the world we live in.

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test1235
strongman?

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spaceflunky
That's a funny way of spelling murderous dictator

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bitwize
[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strongman_(politics)](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strongman_\(politics\))

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dagnysdildo
Another tyrant bites the dust, and good riddance.

