
Disney blocks John Oliver’s new episode critical of India’s PM Modi - pseudolus
https://techcrunch.com/2020/02/25/disney-hotstar-blocks-john-olivers-new-episode-critical-of-narendra-modi/
======
blackoil
BJP (ruling party) commands over a huge IT Cell and a larger fan base which
activates at very slightest triggers. Few years back a popular Muslim actor
(Aamir Khan) made a mild comment on increasing radicalism in Indian society
and incidents of lynching against Muslims. Within days everything related to
him was scorched, the app he models for got millions of 1* rating on Android.

A more recent incident is about an actress showing solidarity with students
against violence in JNU, a left leaning university. The next movie ratings
were grounded.

Bias of Indian media houses makes Fox feel like champion of truth and
journalism.

In a nutshell, nothing to do with Disney, it must be pragmatic decision by
Indian subsidiary to play safe.

~~~
ak39
This "IT Cell" is pretty active on Twitter. It is vicious and relentless.

I suspect it is present on HN platform too. I have posted two submissions (one
from NYTimes and another from The Guardian) on issues that highlight the Modi
government's continued descent into what writers are calling fascist policies.
Both my submissions didn't survive being flagged within minutes. I am not sure
if a concentrated group of users can achieve this objective on HN?

~~~
nindalf
In my experience, there are many Modi apologists on HN. In a recent thread
about people being prosecuted for using VPNs, they were out in full force
justifying the effective house arrest of several million people and the
suspension of basic human rights like Habeas Corpus.

And sure enough, they achieved their goal on that thread too - it was flagged
and removed from the front page within hours. We shouldn't allow anything that
tarnishes the reputation of our Dear Leader.

You don't even have to go find the original thread. The Modi apologists are on
this thread too. See if you can spot the person justifying murdering Muslims
for the crime of eating beef.

~~~
thrwaway69
I flagged this post after reading comments at the bottom and in my experience,
the reason why you see less political posts from india on the front page is
mostly due to the demography of the site and guidelines. Indian posts always
have little activity with or without political element and for few political
threads that do get some activity, lot of uninformed opinions posted within a
few minutes. People just aren't interested outside of HN too, I don't think
the IT cell mob will come in private political forums/guilds.

I might also point out indian news sites are horrible with tracking, adverts
and UI/UX. A blog post from someone on hn about mac revealed that an average
HNer spent very little time on the site compared to other places. So that
might skew things further outside of international sites.

Secondly, I can see who you might be referring to as modi apologist, I also
see similar attack from the opposite spectrum. Either doesn't seem healthy and
should be kept somewhere else.

1.34 billion people are a lot. That's 3x the size of US. We have greater
inequality and varying standard of living resulting in highly different or
counterproductive expectations from the system.

A farmer getting by barely with not much need for hyper internet connectivity
may not see the implications of laws that deteriorate freedom/privacy online.
They are in different hierarchy of human needs than someone living in urban
area with a lot of solved problems and some artificially created as a
consequences.

One want more roads, the other want more greenery.

One want availability and affordability, the other want quality.

There are highly controversial laws passed such as the act to give less
qualified people the same authority of a doctor so they can treat patients and
there were some consequences to it of course but it happened because someone
wanted it or at least thought it was a good idea than nothing. I have met a
couples like that and know personally.

Becoming condescending, calling everything propaganda or blindness because you
don't agree with it or think it's fine is a good way to cause hurdles in
leading to a compromise.

What you see online isn't representative of most things. People won't mention
about a product/service they don't face any problem with, they mention about
things they face problem with or have had a horrible experience most of the
time. It's easy to say nothing than a thank you. We ought to do it more but we
don't. The specific indian culture I have lived in doesn't encourage that and
sometimes even discourage thanking people because it's their job or things
should be like that encouraging people to share views in negative light more.

This isn't specific to india either but we have a tad bit more pressure to
live within segregated communities directly or indirectly. Marrying into the
same caste, income bracket or status quo. Interacting with people from the
same checks only.

I would recommend working for upping the quality of life for everyone and
things will stablize on their own but in the meantime, calling people modi
apologist will give you a knee jerk reaction from otherwise people who may
listen.

------
at_a_remove
Something something "it is only censorship if the government does it,"
something something "deplatforming _works_ ," something something "private
companies can do what they want."

I am a bit older than much of the Hacker News crew. I remember the right doing
this kind of nonsense and thinking it was lousy. Watching the left take this
sort of thing up a few decades later, only to act as if it could never
possibly happen to them, has been disheartening.

People keep forging shackles and never pause to ask if the manacles might fit
_their_ wrists, as well.

~~~
braythwayt
Private companies can do what they want, and like everything else, they are
subject to criticism for it.

If I run a conference and un-invite someone from speaking for whatever reason,
of course that is my right. And if members of the public want to criticize me
for it, and make their own choices about whether to business with me on that
basis, that is also their right.

This has nothing to do with this hand-wavey "Left" being hypocritical about
anything. It's a company doing what it is legally allowed to do, and various
members of the public having opinions about the company's choices.

If and when somebody is proposing a law to regulate that Disney has to give
anti-authoritarians a voice, and that same somebody also proposed a law
barring Disney from giving pro-authoritarians a voice, we can talk about
hypocrisy or manacles or double-edged swords.

~~~
dhimes
_Private companies can do what they want_

Not in the US. There are regulations on what you can do. A restaurant cannot
refuse to serve a person of color because of their race, for example.

~~~
balls187
Perhaps a more apt analogy would be companies cannot violate Federal Trade
Laws (easily) without facing serious repercussions.

While it may be unconstitutional to refuse service because of Race, it does
happen. Perhaps not overtly. Speaking from my own experience as a "person of
color", it's difficult to prove something happened because of my race.

And there are still plenty of examples of people's constitutional rights being
violated--such as when Starbucks called the police on two black men, who were
then arrested, despite not committing any crimes.

~~~
erichocean
> _While it may be unconstitutional to refuse service because of Race_

Sadly, it actually _is_ constitutional to refuse service based on race (or any
other reason)—it's literally part of the 1st Amendment (aka Freedom of
Association).

You are presumably referring to the Civil Rights Act of 1964 which bans
certain forms of exclusionary behavior and sort of "soft-repeals" that aspect
of the 1st Amendment. Like anything else passed by Congress, it can be undone
at any time. Unlikely, but in theory it could happen.

It's actually astounding (and a little scary) how much of modern American
culture and laws are built on top of legislation passed in the 1960s. That
legislation and subsequent enhancements almost functions as a parallel legal
system today to the one enacted by the original constitution (and the Anglo-
Saxon legal tradition more generally).

That said…I don't see a reversal coming any time soon and expect the Anglo-
Saxon tradition (such as it is) to fade into the dustbin of history while the
CRA and friends become more and more the law of the land over time.

In a very real sense "the law is whatever is enforced", and it's extremely
clear that even things like Freedom of Speech are going to be re-assessed in
the name of tolerance in the very near future. Europe already has much
stricter rules on speech, and I expect the US to follow suit.

(I also expect the 2nd Amendment to be effectively repealed in the next 20-30
years as the baby boomers die off and no one still alive cares about owning a
gun—but does care about not getting shot. I can easily imagine using the CRA
as the legal vehicle to do so, something like a "right not to be shot" or
whatever.)

~~~
balls187
I was thinking of the Equal Protection and Race in the constitution, aka the
14th amendment, but you are right. It was the Federal Civil Rights Act that
actually made it a crime to discriminate.

------
kozhevnikov
The relationship between HBO, Hotstar, Star India, and Disney was still
unclear to me after reading the article.

From the article:

> Hotstar, India’s largest on-demand video streaming service

> Hotstar is the exclusive syndicating partner of HBO, Showtime and ABC in
> India

> Star India, which operates Hotstar, and Disney, which owns the major Indian
> broadcasting network

From the wiki:

> Hotstar is an Indian over-the-top streaming service owned by Novi Digital
> Entertainment, a subsidiary of Star India, which itself is a wholly owned
> subsidiary of The Walt Disney Company.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hotstar](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hotstar)

~~~
abhi3
Disney Owns Star India which has subsidiary company Novi Digital Entertainment
that operates Hotstar. Hotstar is the exclusive syndicating partner of HBO,
Showtime and ABC in India. Around this time next month, Hotstar will also have
all the content of Disney Plus in India.

------
Spellman
I expect they can make the claim that "family-friendly" and sanitized
entertainment means never covering and exposing the "controversial" nature of
the people in power. After all, in Disney, we take comfort that everything is
alright and happy and everyone gets along! And further, people intentionally
play to visit this constructed world.

This is a reminder that opting out of controversy means tacit approval of the
existing power structures.

~~~
RcouF1uZ4gsC
Fighting existing power structures is exhausting and stressful. Most people
just want entertainment to relax, not fight existing power structures.

~~~
PaulRobinson
Not for me - or anybody else - to tell you how to spend your entertainment
hours, but I encourage you to read this webcomic and consider your own
choices: [https://i.imgur.com/2H8gZq5.jpg](https://i.imgur.com/2H8gZq5.jpg)

Those power structures are responsible for causing widespread misery. Inaction
is something you might feel comfortable with, but your children, grandchildren
and beyond may judge you for it if you never thought about where the lines
should be and acted accordingly.

~~~
waterhouse
If many people are substantially harmed by wasting their time and energy on
distractions, then those who waste less time will outcompete them. Whether the
mechanism is common wisdom analogous to "don't drink alone or before the
evening", parents teaching their kids in certain ways, religions that consider
much "wasteful" entertainment to be sinful, or genes that contribute to
conditions perhaps resembling autism where colorful flashy video registers as
annoying or even painful, the problem seems likely to create its own
solutions.

One of the premises of "Brave New World" is that all children are raised by
the State, and are forcibly (a) oxygen-deprived in the womb to limit their
intelligence and (b) subjected throughout childhood to indoctrination _and
hypnotherapy_ to make them say "I'm happy and content with my life, and my
only desire is to chase consumer goods". I'm not sure why so many people seem
to forget this.

~~~
icebraining
Brave New World is also fiction. I'm the first to agree that fiction can be
insightful and teach truths, but the fact that some author came up with a
concept proves nothing.

------
AlphaWeaver
In case anyone is curious, here's the link to the episode on the Last Week
Tonight YouTube channel:
[https://youtu.be/qVIXUhZ2AWs](https://youtu.be/qVIXUhZ2AWs)

~~~
joshschreuder
It is geofenced in Australia at least.

------
LinuxBender
Might this action invoke the Streisand Effect? [1]

[1] -
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streisand_effect](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streisand_effect)

~~~
weka
It definitely will and more people will definitely watch. How can these
companies be so out of touch? It's mind-baffling.

~~~
gliese1337
Maybe they're smarter and more moral than anybody ever suspected, and are
hoping for the Streisand Effect to come into play?

~~~
notahacker
I'm sure their motivations are primarily profit, but if appeasing Indians
appalled by the idea of criticism of their government was their sole concern,
they didn't have to put it on YouTube...

------
dilipray
To my dear American, Let's watch South Park episodes 200 and 201.

~~~
lallysingh
Unless I'm missing something, wasn't that from death threats to the authors?

~~~
6nf
No it was Comedy Central's decision, certainly not Matt and Trey.

------
olcor
This isn't exactly a democracy-crushing deal as most people paint this to be,
nor is this Disney trying to be family friendly. HBO shows, including ones
which definitely aren't family-friendly/politically correct, are on Hotstar
Premium, which is a paid subscription that costs about $15 a year. A majority
of the people don't use Premium , they watch a lot of hostar videos for free /
pay a smaller amount for sports, and neither of these options have HBO. A lot
of people have seen the Modi clip on Youtube already.

Personally I don't even think there was anything new in the episode, most of
it is common knowledge in India and the show is geared towards an American
audience which might not know the full picture. I guess it's just Hotstar
being ultra-safe, which IMO they don't need to be.

------
acd10j
As we speak there is huge Hindu Muslim Riot going on in Delhi which was
instigated by one of the BJP leader.

------
sub7
This isn't really surprising. India has no independent press. Stories are
routinely crushed.

~~~
snambi
Oh God... In India you can write anything you want. Press has no
accountability.

~~~
oh_sigh
You can write anything you want, as long as the government lets you access the
internet (e.g. Kashmir)

------
lordleft
This is ridiculous. India is a democracy. Spirited debate and criticism is
salutary and necessary. I am deeply disappointed by this decision. It only
strengthens those voices in the subcontinent that equate critique to betrayal.

~~~
skybrian
An update on India: [https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2019/12/09/blood-and-
soil...](https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2019/12/09/blood-and-soil-in-
narendra-modis-india)

(I have no independent knowledge, but it seems things are pretty bad?)

~~~
nsdfg
How Hitler's 'Mein Kampf' Became a Bestseller in India [1]

Hitler’s Hindus: The Rise and Rise of India’s Nazi-loving Nationalists [2]

[1] [https://www.mic.com/articles/120411/how-hitler-s-mein-
kampf-...](https://www.mic.com/articles/120411/how-hitler-s-mein-kampf-became-
a-bestseller-in-india)

[2] [https://www.haaretz.com/opinion/hitlers-hindus-indias-
nazi-l...](https://www.haaretz.com/opinion/hitlers-hindus-indias-nazi-loving-
nationalists-on-the-rise-1.5628532)

~~~
dntbnmpls
Germany and especially Japan, during ww2, were ardent supporters of indian
independence for obvious reasons.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_Legion](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_Legion)

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_National_Army](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_National_Army)

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azad_Hind](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azad_Hind)

So Hitler doesn't have as negative a connotation in india and most of the non-
western world just like Churchill doesn't have as negative a connotation in
israel or the west as he does in india or the rest of the non-western world.

History is much more complex than we are told it is. It isn't black and white.
That's why traveling is so important. You realize that everyone is living in
their own little bubble.

------
tombert
I am unfamiliar with the free-speech rules in India; could Disney get in some
kind of legal trouble for broadcasting this?

(genuine question)

~~~
smhenderson
The article states that what would be the responsible government body [0] was
not involved in the decision. My guess is that this is on Disney alone, just
them avoiding controversy as a general rule.

I'm not familiar with India's laws either but if it's anything like the US
than they are free to censor whatever they want, they are a private company,
not the government.

[0] _A spokesperson of the Information and Broadcasting Ministry, the
governing agency which regulates information, broadcasts, movies and the press
in India, said the government was not involved in any censorship discussions._

edit: grammar

~~~
reaperducer
_My guess is that this is on Disney alone, just them avoiding controversy as a
general rule._

See also: Disney releasing _Song of the South_ on DVD in Asia, but publicly
stating it will never see the light of day again in North America.

------
metaphyze
This sounds like a great way to get everybody in India to watch it.

------
ak39
If you are one interested in the Trump visit of India or Indian socio-
political dynamics and haven't watched John Oliver's latest episode, I implore
you did:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVIXUhZ2AWs](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVIXUhZ2AWs).

It ranks amongst his best and he presents a powerful summary of the current
Indian political dynamic.

Oliver introduces Trump's visit to India against the backdrop of a blithe
Indian media that seems more interested in figuring out whether the US first
lady and the President will make an unscheduled visit to the famous Taj Mahal.
The Indian TV reporter describes the Taj Mahal as the "enduring symbol of
love". There are also quick depictions of throngs of (Modi accolytes) fawning
at the US President's arrival and Trump's total lack of understanding of
recent Indian history vis-a-vis Modi's complicity in the Gujrat riots - Trump
calling Modi the great unifier and father of India (face palm).

This introduction is then used by Oliver in what is a complete 15 minute
virtuoso rout of any shred of reverence, esteem or dignity for both Modi and
Trump. Something to behold. Oliver does this with crucial evidence showing
Modi's divisive Hindu nation-state ideologies linked absurdly (only because it
is true) to Hitler's Nazi ideologies! It is simultaneously comical, absurd and
terrifying. Then there are revelations of the ruling party's (BJP's)
systematic attempt at revising Indian history in school curricula -
excoriating the proud history of India's secural founding "fathers" in favour
of aspects of bizarre creationist style text about the origins of different
races! (I balked).

This episode stands out as one of Oliver's best because he crafted the best
"shit sandwich" argument I've seen in a while. He neatly folds the absurd
proposition made by Trump that Modi is a unifier of the people. But only
ironically for the opposite reason! The Sunday punch lands with "Because
India, home of this enduring symbol of love (points to the image of the Taj),
frankly deserves a lot more than this (points to the mugshot of Modi)
temporary symbol of hate."

------
the_watcher
Somewhat important clarification from the headline: Disney blocked the episode
_in India_. Having not watched LWT in a while, I was confused about how Disney
could stop HBO (not owned by Disney) from airing an episode.

------
coldcode
This article title is disingenuous since its a previously Fox owned Indian
broadcaster decided to block something the Indian government might not like,
which is broadcast on HBO. I highly doubt Disney even cared or even paid
attention to it until the clickbait headline.

------
tshanmu
interesting tidbit - the video
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVIXUhZ2AWs](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVIXUhZ2AWs)
is blocked from UK IP addresses as well! works fine from US IP address though.

------
nnain
At least Modi/BJP have to live with it being available on YouTube. If they try
to block it, it'll get much more publicity amongst his supporters who won't
see it otherwise. There are few to none Disney subscribers here in India.

------
justin66
For a good time, read these comment threads and take a drink every time
someone engages in whataboutism.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whataboutism)

------
doitLP
Best way to ensure something you don’t want people to see goes viral: Ban it

------
tatersolid
Safari reports expired TLS cert. nice job TechCrunch!

------
yalogin
The other big thing here is Amazon censored/removed a Madam Secretary episode
that talks about religious extremism in India. At least with John Oliver's
episode, Hotstar might have feared retaliation from Modi but the Amazon thing
is bizarre.

------
three_seagrass
I just watched the episode yesterday on Youtube. There wasn't anything
excessively critical of Modi outside of Oliver's usual needling shtick.

He definitely called out how BJP party founders adored Hitler though.

[https://youtu.be/qVIXUhZ2AWs?t=499](https://youtu.be/qVIXUhZ2AWs?t=499)

~~~
nabla9
>excessively critical

Other than pointing out the fact that Hindu nationalists are hateful violent
supremacists who remove citizenship from Indian Muslims and are already
building concentration camps for them.

[https://www.hrw.org/world-report/2020/country-
chapters/india](https://www.hrw.org/world-report/2020/country-chapters/india)

~~~
eklavya
Assuming good faith I invite you to try and learn more about the CAA (law in
question). I don’t know why people keep saying it takes away citizenship of
Indian Muslims when it only provides citizenship to persecuted non muslim
minorities from neighbouring countries because of the promise made when the
partition on the basis of religion was done. The minorities are living in hell
in Pakistan (girl kidnapped from her marriage ceremony to be forcefully
“wedded” to a Muslim guy) and to a lesser extent in Bangladesh. Minorities
dropped from 20% to less than 2%. While in India it rose from 14M to 200M.

It also doesn’t give citizenship to people who have already not entered India
before 2014.

On the issue of non inclusion of Muslims, it’s just practically not possible
when you have more than 30,000,000 illegal immigrants from Bangladesh
according to 90s figures, unless you want to just give citizenship to
everybody.

India has extremists of every religion like everywhere else. Some people only
ever see Hindu extremism. They are either removed from reality or have an
agenda.

~~~
foolinaround
> when it only provides citizenship to persecuted non muslim minorities from
> neighbouring countries

Does it provide citizenship to non-muslim Tamils from SriLanka? Are'nt they
persecuted too? If not, why not?

------
neycoda
Why can Disney even block John Oliver? How did we get to this point?

------
jstewartmobile
Hollywood provides the same variety of _courtesy_ censorship for anything
which might offend the CCP.

The TV and the movies are primarily there to lie to us now.

~~~
braythwayt
I assume you're speaking of the Communist Party of China, and not the
Community College of Philadelphia?

Richard Gere has publicly stated that Hollywood extends courtesy censorship
for things that may "offend" the ruling government of China. His claim (which
I am in no position to validate or invalidate) is that this comes from a
combination of Chinese investment in global films, as well as the value of
distributing films in China.

He says his own career vanished when he chose to speak out on the subject of
Tibet.

------
lasermike026
Seems like censorship to me. Maybe we need new law to address this.

~~~
Finnucane
So, the US government should pass a law that would, I don't know, fine or
sanction some company because they _didn't_ release some tv show or movie? In
a jurisdiction the US doesn't have any control over? That in itself would have
some weird first amendment issues.

~~~
lasermike026
In short, yes. We have lasw that handles behavior in the international sphere.

------
m0zg
I'm surprised they air John Oliver's verbal diarrhea there at all. It's highly
US specific, and moreover US liberal specific. I don't see why Indians would
be interested in much of what he says _before_ it was banned. Now they'll
probably watch it though.

It's like some crank in Germany thought that Merkel was literally Hitler, and
spoke about it every night. Would you watch this in the US? I would not.

~~~
smt1
I disagree. Oliver seems to have a pretty international audience (and a
personal ancedote, I have cousins in India who watch him). He covers
international current events quite often and HBO content is widely distributed
internationally, not to mention YouTube etc.

