

Ask HN: 19-Years-Old & Managing A Team of 10 - 20 People, Need Advice - Houston

Earlier this year, I was hired by a start-up Internet marketing company to be their copywriter. However, my responsibilities have always been much more diverse than simply writing copy. I've essentially been the company's jack-of-all-trades, and it is something I greatly enjoy, as each day is truly a new day and nothing gets repetitive.<p>About a month ago, I was given the responsibility of heading a massive project that will essentially serve as the foundation upon which the company will rely on to grow larger and more profitable. Due to how large the project is, it requires quite a few employees if I am to meet the goal set by my boss, the CEO. As of today, I've hired 3 people, and am managing an additional 7 of our in-house employees. Lately, everything has been fine and well, but it is very apparent that for me to meet our goal, I will need to ramp up the number of employees working on the project.<p>And, with that... I run into a problem. My boss and his partner have personalities that are as polar opposite as can be. My boss is very hands off, but takes no bullshit, despises laziness, and when he wants something done, he demands you do it by any means necessary. However, his partner is a micro-manager, even in things he has no experience in, i.e this current project. He fastidiously manages a profits and loss sheet for every project we're running -- which I realize makes business sense -- but, it lends itself to him demanding maximum output from minimal resources, no questions asked.<p>With this particular project, profits will not start rolling in en masse for a couple of months after the infrastructure is in place. My boss knows this, as he understands what goes into it and has experience in launching similar projects of his own in the past. If I am to pander to only him, I would simply go out and get the employees I need to reach our goal. But, I can't pander only to him, especially since his partner sat me down and asked me to try to play the middle ground between him and my boss. However, the partner doesn't realize how long it will take for money to start rolling in, so if I continue to hire employees and he doesn't see money rolling in, he will automatically assume we are getting minimal output with maximum resources and want to either scale back the number of employees or can the project completely.<p>In my honest opinion, I need more employees. If we are to ultimately meet our goal, it is necessary. The current number of employees simply can't meet up with the work load, even if they were machines and pulled 80-hour weeks. But, again, if I go out and hire 7 more people (how many I intend on hiring), the partner will be very wary and most likely take it as me rejecting his input in everything, which I'm not doing.<p>Would you guys suggest I sit down with the partner to explain how I see things inside and out with regards to this project and it's needs? He listens, and is open to most things, so I think that if I came up with a report for him to read that justified the hiring needs, he'd be okay and at ease, and I could present the report to him the day before we met to discuss everything so I could simply address his concerns rather than explain everything to him AND THEN address his concerns in one swoop.<p>My main concern is not crossing either my boss or his partner. I don't want to step on feet, or indirectly infringe on their positions of authority, which I could easily do if I didn't hire the necessary employees because the boss believes I should do what I need to meet our goal or if I went out and hired the employees I need because the partner is wary. Any advice would be appreciated.<p>Also, I did think of a way to get more out of our current employees. Or, at least, one position within the many positions. Vaguely, the goal is to put up 1,000 websites by the end of summer (or the start of August) that are "profitable." To do this, we need designers, coders, me for content and then people to rank these websites.<p>Right now, the designers is where we're hitting a rut. To create 1,000 websites by the beginning of August (minus the ~50 or so we've created already), our designers as a collective need to design ~27/day, or ~135/5-day work week. Between 3 people, that's just not possible judging by their current performance. Each designer, on average, generates 15 designs/week. So, to generate ~135 designs/week, we need ~9 employees generating ~15 designs/week. Due to the nature of the websites, the designers can essentially design 1 template and replicate it 5x over by making minor alterations to their designs (mainly in the name of the sites and the phone numbers included on the sites). But, no one is really doing this because all of them have told me that they'd rather switch up their designs for this reason or that. I am an understanding person, and coming from a background informed by creativity (being a writer, and all), I get that they don't want to make the same design over and over and over because they're not able to be the artists that they are, which strips the fun out of what they do entirely. I don't like this, because I my personal philosophy is that you should enjoy your job, not wake up and despise it, which I'm afraid would happen if I demanded each designer make 1-template and do the replications, and then rinse and repeat for each new set of sites, but it would increase their productivity by a lot.<p>Should I stop being their "friend," and be their boss, and just tell them that they must do the replications? Mind you, this would mean I'm ignoring my personal philosophies. But, does that even matter in situations such as this? In a business context, whose success and failure depends on profitability more so than remaining 100% philosophically pure personally?<p>As you can tell, I've been thinking about this stuff a lot. I'm looking for people who have been in similar situations or have a lot of experience in managing bodies of people, so if possible, just throw a line or two about how your experience will give your advice credence.<p>Thanks, HN! You guys have been great so far for this type of stuff.
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gexla
Sounds to me like you guys are essentially spamming the search engines. I'm
not judging, but at this level there can't be much expectations for high
quality, and there doesn't need to be.

Automation is key here. You guys aren't going to design and create great
content for 1000 websites. Automate, automate, automate.

You guys are handling your designers wrong. Don't tell them anything. Just ask
for x number of fast and flexible designs. If they don't want to follow your
instructions, then cut them and find others. You aren't building works of art
here.

If possible I would have a developer code something which could take inputs
for layouts (CSS and HTML,) color combinations and some other elements such as
backgrounds and use that to generate 10,000 sites if you need to. What you are
really looking for here is to have a decent look but also to keep your sites
clear of foot prints which Google can follow. Your generator could also change
up things like class / div names. In this case all the designers would be
doing is helping gather the inputs and put together the layouts. Actually, you
wouldn't even need much in a designer putting together layouts if you were to
use a framework such as Blueprint, which already comes with command line tools
you could leverage.

I know people who could build 1K sites (and profitably) in a week using the
above methods with no help from others. You just need the right software tools
for the job. Go hit up the communities of people who are actually good at this
stuff and ask them. ;)

The less overhead, the easier it is to be profitable. It's similar to the idea
of domaining. Buy a domain and it only has to pay for the ~ $7 / year purchase
and the server it's sitting on. Info's are less expensive at as low as 79
cents per domain but they don't do as well with the search engines as com's.

If all else fails, quit and do this on your own if you are really that
interested in this sort of thing. I don't think these guys really know what
they are doing anyways.

~~~
Houston
First off, we're not spamming the search engines. Spam, by definition, is
unsolicited and is sent by someone who has little concern for who receives it.
The websites will all be highly-optimized, and optimized in such a way that
they are put in front of the eyes of those who are looking for a specific
solution to their problems; a solution we provide that is 100% legitimate. So,
by it's very nature, this network of sites is not spam.

That being said, I agree that automation is key here. But, automation ≠ bad
design and content. There are automated ways to go about generating quality
designs and content. All that's necessary is that the people manning the tools
to do so know what they're doing.

Point taken about the designers. Going forward, I will be making everything as
cut and dry as possible, i.e they should do A, B, and C, no questions asked.

I really like your idea about hiring a dev to code something that can output
mass websites that aren't 100% replicas of one another, so I will look into
that.

I don't doubt building 1K sites in a week is possible, but you have to
remember that while my knowledge of this industry is pretty advanced for my
age, I am still young, so I don't know what's all out there in terms of
software that makes the ability to build 1K sites in a week a breeze. So, do
you think you could recommend pieces of software that would assist me in that
endeavor?

~~~
gexla
I don't want to post that here. Give me your contact details and I will give
you more info.

~~~
Houston
You can send me an email at houston.barnettgearhart@gmail.com.

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Ataraxy
Simply put, you're hiring people to get it done in a specific way. That is
their primary purpose and that is likely what they are getting paid for.

They either are not privy to this information or are not interested in doing
what they are getting paid to do. It has nothing to do with them being a
friend or not.

As for your boss woes, you stated you're capable of documenting why your way
is the most plausible path you've been able to identify. If the other guy
wants this project done and is a numbers guy he should be able to be reasoned
with.

As an aside, if your project only requires templates with minor changes made
to them my suggestion is to simply hire 1 developer to create a small script
for you that will alter them programatically and your dilemma should be
averted.

~~~
Houston
The reason I brought up the "stripping them of their creativity" point is
because I have an aversion to the belief that you must pigeon-hole yourself
into a job that is not fun just because you need to make ends meet.

Pretty much everyone around me - friends and family, both - have always told
me that I need to go the traditional route of working the blue collar life to
achieve success. But, I've never been that type of person. I landed the job I
have now by rejecting that belief entirely, and I'm in a position to achieve
more success than those same people who hounded me to embrace it and I'm only
19. That being said, it obviously informs me in the business realm. I guess
I'd see myself as a hypocrite if on one hand I have this belief that you
should do what you love to do and not be forced into a job you hate because
you have to make ends meet, or because it is what is expected of you, while on
the other hand, I'm forcing the people I hire to do exactly what I reject.

I admit that I may have an immature view on things. I don't know everything,
nor do I have any intent to come off as knowing everything. Hence, this
thread! I've only been doing this for a couple months, but the nature of the
industry I work in requires that I adapt quickly and assume roles that
requires more experience than I have currently. To make up for that, I am
reaching out to those who know more so they can help inform my ultimate
decisions.

I am leaning towards being 100% business-minded, and suppressing my feelings
of hypocrisy, because in the end what will matter is that I got the job done
and put the infrastructure in place that catapulted the business into greater
profitability. Not whether I preserved my life philosophies. Nonetheless, I
think a good discussion could arise out of the whole preserve philosophical
pureness for the sake of money, or not dilemma.

Anyways, going forward I will for sure write out a report for the partner. It
may take me a bit to put together, as I will need to brief him on the history
of what exactly we're doing, but I think I can sway him to see my side.

And, I never thought about hiring a dev to create a script to alter the
designs programatically. I will definitely look into that. The only thing I
see being a problem is how the script would be able to make each change with
the proper font and color scheme, unless we developed a library of all
possible fonts and color schemes that our designers may use that the script
could access to make the changes seamless.

