

My Dip Into Domaining - bdr
http://ianab.com/log/1/my-dip-into-domaining/

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ryanelkins
> lezass.com (French for "the zass")

I have to say, not the first thing that came to mind.

It would be interesting to see how this would map out if you went further to
3,4 and 4,3 domain names. I'm sure there are quite a bit more 4 letter words
though, so that would be another thing to sort through.

~~~
WillyF
Yeah, I think he's definitely undervaluing that one.

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3dFlatLander
What method did you use to see if a domain was available? I was never able to
find a service that didn't throttle my usage when checking on a large list.

~~~
gizmomagico
I'm appalled that people on _HN_ are casually discussing ways to squat
domains.

Have you tried to come up with a good domain name that's not already taken?
It's _really_ freaking difficult, because squatter scumbags have taken
practically all of them.

There's not much left besides names like "heroku" or "meebo" that are
basically just strings of random characters, and working around squatters by
concatenating the name you'd actually want with "-ly", "get-" or "-app" is not
really a solution.

Your business model is extortion.

~~~
ohashi
This is exactly the discussion I expect from HN. It's taking a very
methodological approach towards an industry and I approve. I've been in the
domain industry for 7+ years now and it's a breath of fresh air to see more
people coming to the table with ideas like this (sorry, you aren't the first
to use these types of ideas, but I am happy to see more people trying these
types of methods).

As far as saying they are squatters and extortionists. I am going to have to
call bullshit. Cybersquatting is infringing someone's trademark. Unless the
author is buying something to infringe on a mark it is NOT CYBERSQUATTING.

As far as the extortion claim, it's also bogus. You think you deserve some
awesome domain for registration fee because you have some idea? Sorry. The
internet isn't about that. We all have ideas and there is no objective way
domains could be distributed other than a first-come, first-serve policy. Any
sort of 'use' based case is far too big a slippery slope to ever be
considered.

This sort of attitude seems to be the exact opposite of the author's (which I
admire) who has publicized an interesting way to try and find a good domain
name on the cheap.

~~~
_delirium
You "refute" his point with a non sequitur, essentially asserting that domain
squatters/extortionists aren't scumbags, because there's no good way to ban
the practice. But it could still be unsavory even if it's hard to ban.

I wouldn't say that the internet is"about" people just grabbing names and
doing nothing with them except demanding payments from people who _do_ want to
put up actual sites. That's not really having ideas or doing anything useful
for anyone; it surely isn't innovative. It might be _profitable_ , but I don't
really see any way to argue it's in the hacker spirit or particularly
laudable.

~~~
ohashi
You connect the two extortion and cybersquatting. Again, different things.
They can overlap sure, but cybersquatting has a narrow definition. Extortion
also does. Buying domains really doesn't meet the definition.

As far as doing nothing, they 'do' something. Most have nameservers and
resolve to something.

As far as demanding payments. That's funny, you want something but don't feel
obligated to pay. Nobody is forcing you to buy any particular domain. You
simply feel entitled for one reason or another.

I think first-come, first-serve is the least worst option and also is in line
with the spirit the internet was created. Allowing anyone to compete at
minimal cost. Just because you don't get software.com doesn't limit you from
selling software. If you really cannot come up with a name or put up some
money and buy a decent name perhaps you need to rethink what you're doing.

~~~
gizmomagico
Implying that domain squatters are scumbags was _this_ much of an assault on
your ego?

If you reserve lots of domains and wait for someone to want one of them so bad
that he's willing to pay hundreds or thousands of dollars, that makes you a
scumbag.

It's that simple, and it doesn't matter if this specifically falls under
whatever definition of "cybersquatting" you want to use.

> As far as doing nothing, they 'do' something. Most have nameservers and
> resolve to something.

You can't be talking about "parked" domains that resolve to a page full of
_shit_ , right? Please tell me that wasn't what you meant.

> As far as demanding payments. That's funny, you want something but don't
> feel obligated to pay.

Seriously? We do want to pay. We just want to pay the normal price for a
domain, and not whatever outrageous amount you feel like demanding for it.
Feel entitled?! What the.. Yes, most of us feel "entitled" to being able to
buy a domain at market value.

> I think first-come, first-serve is the least worst option and also is in
> line with the spirit the internet was created. Allowing anyone to compete at
> minimal cost.

By "compete", do you mean allowing anyone to compete in an auction for a
domain you have, and others want?

> If you really cannot come up with a name or put up some money and buy a
> decent name perhaps you need to rethink what you're doing.

As I said, it's really freaking difficult. An ideal domain name is a .com
that's somehow related to your product/service and consists of one or two
words in English, maybe with a clever twist. _These_ are the ones that have
practically all been taken by scumbags like you.

~~~
ohashi
Market Value. Price = what someone is willing to pay.

Did you forget basic economics?

Sounds like someone just didn't get their domain and wants to whine a lot.
Lots of whiners, so few doers.

~~~
gizmomagico
You should have stopped embarrassing yourself already.

Your price is not based on supply & demand or market value, but just how bad
someone wants the domain you're holding, which happens to be a perfect fit for
his product or service.

I've actually managed to personally come up with, and get two perfectly
fitting .com's for (two of) the products I'm going to make.

Those two domains consist only of words in English too. One of them is cutesy,
and the other is clever. I won't tell you the names, though, because that
would reveal my real name. But it really was difficult to come up with the
names, because of human scum like you.

If you're a "doer", then I don't even want to be one.

Thanks for playing.

~~~
ohashi
How bad someone wants = demand.

Sorry, you clearly don't understand markets.

~~~
gizmomagico
That's not applicable because you've done something to the supply, haven't
you?

All of your self-centered squealing here has been the result of your fragile
little ego getting hurt from being called a scumbag. But that's like me
getting upset about someone calling me a person. That's what I am. Scum is
what you are.

~~~
ohashi
It's amusing to see your limited ability to understand things. My ego has very
little to do with this, if you think calling me a scumbag is what the problem
is. I get called worse every day, it doesn't bother me. What irritates me is
those preaching about how bad something is without ever being able to offer a
better solution other than one that would suit them. They all simply want more
for themselves, it's not this perceived injustice that you couldn't get the
domain you wanted is a bigger issue. It's not. It's simply your greed.

Of course you will want to turn that around and say it's me being greedy. I've
paid large sums for domain names and guess what... I know how to earn more
money from it. Welcome to capitalism, quit your bitching and play the game or
shut up.

~~~
gizmomagico
> I get called worse every day, it doesn't bother me.

Really? Every day? I'm curious, why do people call you names? Is it because of
domain squatting, and if so, don't you think they might have a point?

> What irritates me is those preaching about how bad something is without ever
> being able to offer a better solution other than one that would suit them.

Would it make sense for someone to offer a solution that _didn't_ suit them?
There could be lots of potential solutions, but I'm not sure we agree on what
the problem is.

They could release all obviously squatted/parked domains, for example, and
prevent or limit their programmatic reservation. I wouldn't mind an increase
in price either, if it made squatting unprofitable, or there could be some
requirements for reserving a domain.

> They all simply want more for themselves, it's not this perceived injustice
> that you couldn't get the domain you wanted is a bigger issue. It's not.
> It's simply your greed.

Heh. So now wanting a domain is the same as being greedy? Or is it greedy to
want a domain that happens to be squatted? Either way, your comment didn't
make any sense.

> Of course you will want to turn that around and say it's me being greedy.

Greedy? Most people are, but greed is not really the problem here - it's what
you do.

> I've paid large sums for domain names and guess what... I know how to earn
> more money from it.

I'm sure you do. It's much easier to make money when you have no shame or
morals.

> Welcome to capitalism, quit your bitching and play the game or shut up.

Yes, I'm sure you'll continue doing what you do.

~~~
ohashi
It's like being famous. As soon as you have any profile people want to take
you down for whatever reason.

'Obviously squatted' - again back to a slippery slope. You clearly don't
understand how the markets work either. The best stuff is the most profitable,
price increases and such only reduce domain values at the margins.
Requirements for registering is a pretty laughable system. Go develop kids.us
or .mobi, last I checked they have requirements. Maybe .TV with super high
pricing. Sure you can find something available.

You want something for yourself and think a system sucks because it doesn't
suit you.

It's what we do. Uh-huh. It's no different than many forms of speculation or
real estate investment. People can hate on it all they want, those not making
money often do.

No shame or morals - another good argument coming from you. You have no idea
what I've done or how I do it, yet of course believe yourself to be all
knowledgeable and able to judge. You want to call me scum, but really you're
just some disillusioned asshole who falsely thinks they are on some moral high
ground . You are unhappy and want to bitch, I see many people just like you
every day, incapable of actually doing anything or figuring out solutions. The
author of the post takes a system and works with it to meet his needs. I
entered this business long after people knew what domains were and were
investing in them and was able to figure out profitable ways to invest.
Instead of actually understanding the systems and making them work for you,
they simply bitch it's unfair for them therefore it's wrong. They don't even
understand it isn't unfair for them, they simply are too inept to take
advantage.

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JoachimSchipper
As pointed out by gizmomagico before me, requesting domains you don't (intend
to) use is ethically troublesome.

~~~
ilcesco
It's pretty much like buying land. It's not like it's unethical to buy land if
you have no plans of building an house on it, imho.

~~~
JoachimSchipper
It's pretty much like claiming "new" land, to use an American analogy - you
pay a small administrative fee, that's all.

Is it ethical to claim as much land as possible, for the sole purpose of
selling it in the future to people who had the misfortune to come later? It's
clearly legal, but it's also abuse of a common good.

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vinhboy
Great post, you've taken something that I've always thought of as random
prospecting and applied a methodology to it. I am quite envious of your
critical thinking skills.

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vaksel
for this to be a true "dip" you should be trying to sell those to see how much
you'll make off them

~~~
techiferous
What's a good way to sell a domain name?

~~~
prawn
If they're Australian domains and you have a portfolio you want to offer, you
could try Drop.com.au who sometimes do specific auction sales in addition to
their daily droplists. I buy there now and then.

~~~
whatusername
how do you get around the Business Name / Trademark rules?

~~~
prawn
You can lay claim to a .com.au if the domain name is "closely and
substantially connected" to you as the registrant. This includes things like
selling a product or offering a service with that name.

auDA ruled a few years back that "domain monetisation" falls within "a service
that the registrant provides" (with a few exceptions).

Sales/transfers of domains were a bit painful back in the day but have been
relaxed now. There are restrictions (from memory, you can't register a domain
and then sell it within six months) but it does make speculation a bit easier
for domainers.

