
Young people 'feel they have nothing to live for' - thewarrior
http://www.bbc.com/news/education-25559089
======
whbk
I'm a couple years out of college and can't overstate how real this is (in
America, though I know the article is focused on the UK). Last summer I flew
back to my Midwestern hometown for a concert, and I still remember being
introduced to a friend of a friend. She was a college graduate one year
removed, vastly 'underemployed' [1], and living in her parents basement.

When my friend mentioned that I was just in town from SF for the weekend, she
asked what I did and after telling her, her reaction was something along the
lines of 'oh you're like a real grown up!' Her tone was one of embarrassment
and a begrudging acceptance of where she was, and it's one I've seen a fair
bit despite going to a pretty solid school. Not Ivy League, mind you, but a
reasonably high-ranked state school.

I really have no idea what the solution is, but I've thought a fair bit about
the as of yet unrealized ripple effects: Many of these people are in debt up
to their eyeballs. Given that, they're going to be much less likely to (or at
least will significantly delay) purchases of cars and real estate. Dating is a
lot harder when you're living at your parents', and I'm sure we'll see an
impact in the ratio of singles/families among my generation as a result. Then
there's the whole psychological impact of feeling they have nothing going for
them that the article focuses on. Pretty dismal scene.

[1] Honestly, I hate this term. It shouldn't be any surprise to us that when
we promote an 'everyone goes to college!' culture a la 'everyone's a home
owner!', coupled with an insidious lowering of standards in our education
system starting in the lower rungs of K-12, we'll have a mass of college-
educated individuals who can't find gainful employment.

~~~
vacri
The thing is that the current young ones are still of the belief that no-one
has had it hard before; that it was cruisy and easy for everyone before
(repeating the pattern of this thought - this isn't unique to gen Y, but to
young gens). One gen Y person in my office repeated the mantra to me that
"jobs were handed out like candy for the boomers"... yeah, if you were male...
and liked working in a factory or other menial jobs. If you were female there
was a stigma to working, options were pretty limited, and usually it was legal
to be explicitly paid a lower hourly rate.

The Western world we live in is safer in most regards than previously, whether
it's food or medical or military. Ten years of war in the middle east killed
only a tenth of the US soldiers killed in Vietnam, and there was _no
conscription_. Before the downfall of the USSR, there was a very palpable fear
of nuclear war in the West (justified or not) or a sizeable military invasion.
Civil and social rights for minorities and women were far, far behind where
they are now. In the consumer world, shit is cheaper and more disposable than
ever before. Much less need to put effort into maintaining things, just get
another one. Hell, even going to the dentist is far easier today with
improvements in pain control. What about support services for victims of
domestic abuse? Or rape? At least now there are some systems in place where
people can get support sometimes (if not always) and it's a recognised
problem, rather than in the boomer's youth, when it was a taboo subject and
there were no services.

So sure, complain about the current situation of Gen Y folks, but when people
complain about how 'easy' previous generations had it, these kinds of things
are why it sounds like self-indulgent whining - because they only focus on the
good things the boomers had and never recognise the bad things. Not to mention
the things that the Boomers did build and give to us.

Gen Y does have hurdles to face, but those hurdles don't have to be defined in
_how much worse it is than previous generations had it_.

~~~
danieltillett
Exactly. I don't know how much is gained by playing the generation blame game.
If we are going to solve problems we have to work together not spend all the
time blaming each other.

~~~
vacri
Well said. We're all in this shit together, and there aren't teams.

~~~
ericd
There most certainly are differences in interests and priorities between the
demographic groups, and many of them are conflicting. Teams isn't a bad
analogy.

------
sz4kerto
I think part of the problem is that we don't have real problems. Throughout
the last centuries every single generation had very fundamental challenges,
mostly related to survival. Wars, hunger, whatever. Now first you have to find
out what you want (career, gadget, car, traveling), then work for it, but the
problems are not as simple and existential as they used to be. Most challenges
are related to competition, pride and ego building, not to basic things like
finding a small shelter to stay in, acquiring food and raising as many
children as possible.

~~~
zacinbusiness
Yeah this is a problem. I think a lot of it comes down to cultural value
shifts. My wife asks her students why they choose major X or Y and they almost
always answer that they think it will help them to get a job. She then asks
why they want that job and they say that it's important to be stable and have
steady income. These are 18-19 year old kids, mind you. They should not be
worried about being stable, they should be plotting adventures and taking
risks. But the US has become so crippled by fear (of terrorism, joblessness,
the NSA whatever) that a whole generation of kids is growing up and simply
being as safe as they can be. And because they don't seek out trouble, they
don't get to feel the excitement of overcoming problems, and that's very
dangerous in my mind.

~~~
BSousa
I don't really agree with this. 50 years ago those 18-19 year olds were
working and getting married, and at 21-22 being fathers and mothers. But now
we accept that 18-19 year olds are still 'kids'. I don't know if this has
anything to do with the problem we are discussing, but I'm pretty sure at 19
you should be worried about a stable life. It is the best time to do so, maybe
just not 'go to college, get a job' stable since that doesn't seem to work
anymore.

~~~
zacinbusiness
I think we understand how the human brain develops now a bit better than we
did 50 years ago. And that at 19 you're basically not fully cooked yet. So
yeah, at one point you were thought to be fully developed by 19 and that meant
you should go get a job and put an oven in the kitchen for the little lady.
But now we know that your attitudes and opinions will (or at least are likely
to) change a great deal between 19 and 25. This also means your motivations
and what makes you happy will change. But if you're concerned with locking
down the 9-5 as soon as possible, then you're much less likely to find
something that actually makes you happy.

~~~
tomp
> And that at 19 you're basically not fully cooked yet.

That's because you only started cooking at 15/16\. If you had to be
responsible at 12, you would be very very adult by the time you reach 17.

~~~
Dewie
From what I've read, the brain develops until you're around 25. Does the
environment influence how fast your brain fully matures to a large extent?

------
rdtsc
> "I were suicidal at times coz I felt worthless and it just went on and on
> and I weren't getting anywhere."

That was hard to read and it is very serious stuff. Some might take a
derisive, cynical approach that "Well in so many countries people have to much
worse and how do these people from a first world country think that way". But
it is important to note that human experience is unique the pain one
experiences is often relative to their environment and their expectations.

Someone I knew was very successful and made millions of dollars (tens or so).
And then his accountant stole probably half of it and disappeared. Well this
acquaintance had contemplated suicide. And when word got out, many friends and
acquaintances were laughing at him. "He still had all this great wealth and
there he was ready to take his own life." But, the pain he was experiencing,
was real to him. And he was ready to take that step. The wisdom to understand
(maybe not agree with it, but at least to understand) comes a bit later in
life.

------
jxf
If you or someone you know is contemplating suicide, many countries have a
hotline you can use to find someone to talk to:

[http://pastie.org/pastes/9180833/text?key=uuqxmp5nxexuszswum...](http://pastie.org/pastes/9180833/text?key=uuqxmp5nxexuszswumy3pa)

If you don't have a phone (or even if you do), feel free to message me if
you'd like to talk to someone in the startup/tech community who's also worked
as a crisis counselor. Contact info's in my HN profile.

~~~
bobbles
If you're in Australia and you or someone you know needs help, contact
lifeline: [http://www.lifeline.org.au/](http://www.lifeline.org.au/) \- Call:
13 11 14

------
RodericDay
I would say that in a very self-aware, half-ironic, half-serious way, anti-
capitalism is one of the few things that gives my life that fuzzy feeling of
"meaning" these days.

I spend a lot of time thinking about how I can reconcile my software skills
with lofty goals of a more just society, but it's pretty tough. I think it was
the piratebay founder that said it was impossible.

In any case, yesteryear dreams like "starting a prosperous household" seem not
only unattainable, but hollow as well, in 2014. It's definitely weird being a
young adult these days.

ps. lmao @ "we don't have real problems". I guess massive underemployment,
environmental wreckage, domestic espionage, corporate wage fixing,
increasingly sophisticated advertising, etc. are all just a blip on the radar
compared to the fights of old boys. It's just not as romantic as it used to
be, it's the inter-generational equivalent to "poor people have
refrigerators".

~~~
clarry
> ps. lmao @ "we don't have real problems".

I think that referred to concrete problems that concern the individual and can
be solved by work. You need food to live. So people farm. People need houses.
So people build houses. That sort of stuff.

Yes, we have lots of problems now. But you can't grab a hammer and nails and
build a solution to massive underemployment while earning a living for it.

Food and houses on the other hand, at least in the western world, are more or
less solved. You don't need to build a house and a farm. You just need f __ing
money to get a house.

------
benjaminwootton
It must be miserable to be in your early 20s today. The prospect of high
student debt, more competitive job environment, polarising of wealth, a
housing bubble that perpetuates here in the UK. I'm only early 30s but I'm
glad I was born when I was.

IMO You really can't underestimate the importance of that last one, the
property bubble.

In the past young people could strive towards buying their own place, starting
a family, climbing the ladder, but that's so far out of reach nowadays that
many people can't even hope to play that game. One of the big drivers in many
people's lives has been pulled out of reach.

It can all feel like a treadmill even if you're in a good job so I can see how
young people who aren't working in a hot industry such as tech in a major city
to feel this way.

~~~
pawelkomarnicki
I don't agree that life now feels like "treadmill" — life is what you make of
it, if you live just to score fancy abroad vacations, buy new phone every year
and wear 10 pairs of Tommy Hillfiger jeans... well then your life is a
treadmill ;-) It's a matter of perspective and focus in life

~~~
lrem
Did you notice the key point? Property prices. They are out of reach.

A friend from my last office wants to buy a home. He has essentially a
guarantee of lifelong employment, with a salary that today equates to
something around 3000€/month pre-tax. He wants to own a small house in the
neighborhood where he's renting now. But he's searching for a few years now,
as he doesn't want to pay a _million_ for it. Yup, 27.7 years of pre-tax
salary for a small house. And mind you, this is not even a capital city.

~~~
lazylizard
i imagined singapore was unique..take the price of the
house([http://www.hdb.gov.sg/fi10/fi10321p.nsf/w/BuyResaleFlatMedia...](http://www.hdb.gov.sg/fi10/fi10321p.nsf/w/BuyResaleFlatMedianResalePrices?OpenDocument)),
multiply it by 2(because loans and insterest), divide it by the
income([http://stats.mom.gov.sg/Pages/Income-Summary-
Table.aspx](http://stats.mom.gov.sg/Pages/Income-Summary-Table.aspx))... i'm
always wondering how many singaporeans have a flat of their own...

------
nostromo
Have humans always been so defined by their work? Honest question. I
personally find a lot of fulfillment in my work. But I don't know how I could
expect a janitor at a truck stop to feel the same way.

I feel like the answer to this conundrum -- and in general the long term trend
of job obviation -- is to decouple an individual's worth from their economic
value.

But what would a world without work look like? I can imagine it being heaven
or hell.

~~~
trustfundbaby
> But what would a world without work look like?

Its something we better start getting ready for because technology gets rid of
far more jobs than it creates and will only continue to do so for the
forseeable future.

Eventually only super highly skilled and creative jobs (writing, art etc) that
can't be handled by robot/android/humanoids will be left to do and we'll have
to figure out how to allot a basic living wage to people with increments to
that coming based on ... specious things like their popularity ... maybe? (I
shudder to imagine this)

~~~
collyw
"Eventually only super highly skilled and creative jobs (writing, art etc)
that can't be handled by robot/android/humanoids will be left to do and we'll
have to figure out how to allot a basic living wage..."

That vision was sold to us in the 70's, but despite the technological
advancement, we are all working a lot more.

~~~
trustfundbaby
> we are all working a lot more

the ones who have jobs ...

that is not surprising. In a society where ones identity is tied to ones job
as tightly as it is in the US, its not surprising that as the job market
shrinks, the people with jobs will tend to work harder and harder to justify
having said jobs.

And when i talk about this scenario, I'm not talking about 10 20 or even 30
years. I'm talking 100, maybe 150 years from now that this becomes a reality.

------
Jare
You may imagine what it's like in Spain, where over 50% of young people are
unemployed and for the most part doing nothing at all. Part of me hates them
for not using that time to educate and prepare themselves, but hopelessness is
extremely hard to overcome, especially in a society full of distracting
elements like successful soccer teams, excellent weather or apparent
friendliness.

~~~
vacri
There is also the psychological problem of having been out of work for a long
time - returning to full time work is psychologically traumatic, and hard to
get used to. Obviously it's doable, but it's not trivial. Those of us who
already work full-time are used to it and have our lives built around it and
accommodate it, but to make the shift from long-term unemployed to full-time
worker is quite the lifestyle change.

A friend of mine works in occupational therapy, and part of what they do is
deal with this issue in getting people back to work. It's called "work
hardening".

------
mbenjaminsmith
Apart from people who are mentally ill (an immediate family member included) I
have very little sympathy for young people who can't find their own way.

I'm pushing 40 and have older siblings in their 50s. Only one of them went to
college right out of high school (more went later on when they could afford to
pay for it) and the others joined the military to get a start in the world.
All of my siblings -- minus the one under lifetime treatment for depression --
are successful today. They all have fulfilling careers and healthy families.
None of them had it easy.

My parents (begrudgingly) paid for (most of) my college. There was quite of
bit of resentment in my family as I had grown up assuming that I would go to
college and someone would pay for it, a fairly common belief at the time, at
least among my peers. After changing majors a couple of times my parents told
me I was on my own. I was angry at first and then I started a small business
with some friends, worked hard and finished.

After college I moved to another country and worked hard to get a career-path
job. After that I worked hard starting my own company in that field. Apart
from the degree my parents helped pay for I did it all on my own steam. Those
decisions I made -- finishing school, moving to another country, quitting a
job to start a company -- those were the ones that defined my life and paved
the way for the things that I enjoy today. (I'm not suggesting I've _arrived_
anywhere, just that I've acquired the tools to live a fulfilling life.)

Whenever I meet young people (and by young I mean just out of college) I'm
sometimes very impressed though I'm often shocked at how much they expect from
the world. The impressive ones seem to get it and are working hard either on
their own businesses or taking the most aggressive route through graduate
school somewhere interesting -- doing what it takes to carve out a niche. The
ones that don't impress me think that getting a degree (or even not getting
one) means they're going to have a comfortable life, free of hardship.

It's not just young people though. I see a lot of people my age who cynically
pick up a paycheck every month in a field they're not passionate about, that
they're not truly invested in. Then they completely fall apart because they
"got downsized" and they go frantic on FB looking for a lifeline. These are
the same people at different stages in life. If you're willing to dig in and
make your own way then you might get what you want out of life. If not then
don't be surprised when life goes sideways.

~~~
tomp
When you were young, things were different. Colleges cost less, capital was
weaker compared to workers, computers haven't yet taken over as many jobs as
today. Plus, we have the biggest financial crisis in the past 80 years. Still,
I'm sure you can find many people in their 40s, 50s that are much less
successful than you, doing rote, unexciting jobs, living paycheck to paycheck.
Not everyone can be a manager, business owner, investment banker, lawyer or
doctor - you need garbagemen, farmers, nurses, clerks, bartenders, in other
words, people in dead-end jobs. It is in no way their fault for not achieving
"greateness", that holds especially true for the stupid and for people from
poorer backgrounds, who by definition have less opportunities in life.

Furthermore, my generation (20-somethings) grew up in boom years, when
everything was improving and there was a very bright light at the end of the
tunnel, but when we actually reached adulthood, everything turned to shit and
many of my friends can't even get a bad job (I'm lucky, as I'm a programmer).
No wonder half of the young population is suicidal, and the other half
apathetic, we were raised with high expectations and then reality hit everyone
without a warning, it fucked up many people's emotions.

~~~
mbenjaminsmith
> Colleges cost less

My college cost $16k per year plus living expenses. It's a long story why I
was going there as opposed to a cheaper state school. My parents did pay for
part of it though I had to take out $20k+ in student loans and pay for the
last year or so outright.

> from poorer backgrounds

I'm from a military family, lower middle class.

> It is in no way their fault for not achieving "greateness"

I haven't personally and that really wasn't what I was suggesting.

> Furthermore, my generation (20-somethings) grew up in boom years

I was in college in the 90s, boom years. Things went to shit a year after I
was out.

> we have the biggest financial crisis in the past 80 years

While the current economy might be as bad as the Great Depression by some
measure, _you are not living through the Great Depression_.

[Edited for clarity and civility]

~~~
tomp
> I was in college in the 90s, boom years. Things went to shit a year after I
> was out.

Also, things started improving a few years after that, and the next 4 years
were _awesome_. This crisis has been going on for 7 years.

Unemployed young people really have very little to hope for. When the economy
improves, noone is going to hire a 32-year old who's hardly been employed in
the past 6 years. They are going to hire the fresh 24-year-old who's just
finished college. The first paycheck/job you get greatly influences the
overall wealth you're going to earn over your life.

~~~
mbenjaminsmith
> The first paycheck/job you get greatly influences the overall wealth you're
> going to earn over your life.

Bullshit. My first post-college job paid $550 per month. Deciding that this
wasn't the best way to live my life I networked until I found a lead _and then
chased a CEO for two months_ by calling him 2-3 times a week until I got a
job. And that was just the beginning, not some magical doorway into success.

> When the economy improves

That's a very dangerous assumption.

------
suprgeek
Some very troubling trends for young people today:

1) Education has become much more expensive than just 10 years ago - you
typically leave college with anywhere upto ~50K in debt

2) The Economy has changed - companies are making do with fewer people despite
huge demand - (basically a jobless recovery)

3) Asinine trend of "you need to have a job to get a job" \- basically some
one already employed has 2-3 job offers but some one starting out has no one
willing to take a risk on them

4) Some narrow sectors are indeed booming but most are locked out of them

~~~
rectangletangle
>Asinine trend of "you need to have a job to get a job" \- basically some one
already employed has 2-3 job offers but some one starting out has no one
willing to take a risk on them

This one is particularly relevant. It's literally impossible to get your foot
in the door these days. I've had three separate tech companies string me along
through multiple rounds of interviews, simply to say that the position was
axed due to them requiring someone with more "experience", or funding was cut
for the position due to the abysmal state of the economy. To be clear I wasn't
even properly rejected (that's much easier to deal with), the positions were
literally withdrawn.

Among my group of friends I'm the _lucky_ one to even land interviews. Most of
them are severely underemployed, or unemployed.

~~~
SixSigma
I'm a single sample point.

In three years I have gone from unemployment with zero experience and pay in
engineering to £21k per annum. I did this by doing part-time courses in
Autocad and then the same in Manufacturing Engineering, doing a year of
minimum wage to pay for the first year of courses.

But I share the fears and doubts of the poorly skilled individuals. With no
experience of the workplace or what it takes to be a decent employee that gets
somewhere.

Being unemployed is depressing and you have to be mentally strong to survive
it. Making chances for yourself is much easier said than done.

------
digitalengineer
"By offering employers wage incentives worth up to £2,275 we are helping
businesses to take them on. "

I've seen this in action. The jobs these kids got were from people who got
_fired_ in order to make room for them. As a company getting paid to have
someone perform work for you is real nice. _But it does not CREATE jobs_.

In order to pay for all these things our sales-tax rate was pumped up to an
all new high 21%...

------
Nanzikambe
Step one: Study something & complete studies

Step two: Discover you actually hate all professions associated with your
qualifications, or that your qualifications are useless in the job market and
your career goals were utterly unrealistic

Step three: Mooch at home unwilling to retrain or do something menial, or with
no relevance to your skill set to tide you over whilst you find something
better

Step four, establish your new NEET identity and blame society, everyone and
everything but yourself for your circumstance and the lack of a suitable high
paying job served on a platter

I say this as someone that hasn't completed any education beyond GCSE level (I
guess that's college in the US), and has never had any trouble finding paid
work several within 10 days and something that I want to do within 60 days of
that. I've worked throughout Europe, the UK and Southern Africa.

Apologies for the lack of empathy here, but it really isn't that hard. Just be
prepared to go _anywhere_ and do _anything_

~~~
amirmc
> _"... beyond GCSE level (I guess that's college in the US)"_

I'd say that's high-school for the US.

Your attitude of go anywhere, do anything, may have worked very well for you
but it's not actually possible for many people.

~~~
Nanzikambe
> Your attitude of go anywhere, do anything, may have worked very well for you
> but it's not actually possible for many people.

Why? I find it no less true today than a decade ago.

~~~
dagw
Some people have to/want to care for/about people other than themselves.

~~~
beaner
Some people, sure. Enough to account for this trend? Doesn't seem like that'd
be possible.

------
mcantelon
Immigration to the UK has created a labour surplus. It's not a coincidence
that the UKIP is doing well.

~~~
brazzy
No, it hasn't: [http://www.migrationpolicycentre.eu/migration-myths-
migratio...](http://www.migrationpolicycentre.eu/migration-myths-migration-
unemployment/)

~~~
benaston
Correlation is not causation. Sorry that was too easy ;P

~~~
brazzy
Try to understand what something means before you mindlessly parrot it. The
article I linked to shows that there is _no_ correlation, or even negative
correlation between immigration and unemployment. And that actually proves
pretty conclusively that there is no causation.

~~~
benaston
OK, my comment was glib, but I do understand the meaning of "correlation is
not causation". The link you provide attempts to refute the argument that
"immigration causes unemployment". You correctly point out that no correlation
was found in the case of the UK. My point (and hence my rather glib comment)
is that this lack of correlation tells us nothing about causation.

Importantly, taking unemployment overall conceals that fact that certain
portions of the workforce (i.e. the young and low paid) are disproportionately
affected by a rapid influx of young tradesmen and low-skilled workers.

------
dkarapetyan
This is a non-problem. One person can now do the job of a hundred but we have
more people than ever before. Increasing automation is only going to make this
trend worse. It is unfortunate that most politicians continue to peddle an
outdated idea of social worth and well-being.

I don't have a solution but then again most of these young people are far
better off than the generation before them so maybe they should stop being so
gloomy. Most of them have pretty much free access to all of life's necessities
and they are going to live longer than any generation before them.

~~~
ericd
A life of comfortable idleness is not a very good one. They can develop
hobbies, but it's hard in a work dominated culture to derive sufficient
meaning and pride from that.

~~~
dkarapetyan
I don't think that's true. The key is to approach something, whatever it is,
with focus and discipline. I've never met a person that satisfied that
criteria that I didn't like. My thinking is very unexceptional in this regard.

On the other hand, feeling that global market forces and dynamics should just
turn around and succumb to your desire for a job just so you won't be
depressed seems quite silly to me.

~~~
ericd
Governments can change the dynamics of global market forces (tariffs are a
good example of this). I don't think it's silly to lobby your government to
change things to benefit you and other citizens.

------
kenster07
The article's title is quite link-baity. That being said, it is obvious that
technology will displace more and more traditional human labor. Of course,
unlike in the past, human labor becomes increasingly unnecessary to sustain
said humans on a biological level. It's a trade-off, and the cognitive
dissonance is the "traditional" (20th century, Agent Smith) model of human
worth being rendered invalid by the realities of technological progress.

------
toddh
Such feelings are ages old. Friedrich Nietzsche thought of these feelings as a
long sickness that he was eventually cured of. He suggested laughter to be a
reaction to the sense of existential loneliness and mortality that only humans
feel. Having a job is a good thing. But that won't make the feelings go away.
It just hides them for a time.

------
scrrr
That's why I wonder why some European countries have voted more right-wing
parties. [1] (Most of the voters being employees, too.) More capitalism and
less welfare cannot be the solution, because aside from the moral obligations
[2] there's a real danger of social and economical instability.

Sure, you can throw lots of police at demonstrators, but for one there will be
more and more people who no longer can afford to buy your iPhones, and
secondly, at some point it might get really ugly.

I am blessed to live in a safe place and earn a lot of money. But I do feel we
need to put a part of it aside for direct help of the unemployed folks,
especially the young, and for programs to tackle these problems.

And if we don't it will could turn out to be a bad century. For all of us.

[1] I speculate they are exploiting the egoism that's in all of us for their
campaigns.

[2] If you don't think there are any, think about how much about your own life
is the result of chance, and how it easily might be the other way round. For
example you being a poor immigrant in a foreign country.

------
jbb555
This headline seems to be missing the essential word "some" at the beginning.

------
digitalengineer
I'd like to share this. I've read it a long time ago and it's about the
disappearing middle class in Argentina during the crisis of the 2000: Notes
about the middle class falling, from a Student of Architecture

...This, this was important, a moment where the life we once knew stopped
existing, and a group of students, in a class room that looked like and
abandoned building, realized it, all 60 of us at the same time.

We understood it the same way a kid understands photosynthesis: Because a
teacher coldly explained it to us, even used graphics… It happened 4 years
ago, almost a year after the December 2001 crisis. It was a social studies
class and this teacher, don’t remember if it was a he or a she, was explaining
the different kinds of social pyramids. We even had a text book with those
darn, cruel pyramids! The first pyramid explained the basic society. A pyramid
with two horizontal lines, dividing those on top (high social class) those in
the middle (middle class) and the bottom of the pyramid (the poor,
proletarian). The teacher explained that the middle of the pyramid, the middle
class, acted as a cushion between the rich and the poor, taking care of the
social stress.

The second pyramid had a big middle section, this was the pyramid that
represents 1st world countries. One where the bottom is very thin and arrows
show that there is a possibility to go from low to middle class, and from
middle to the top of the social pyramid. Our teacher explained that this was
the classic, democratic capitalist society, and that on countries such as
Europeans one, socialists, the pyramid was very similar but a little more
flat, meaning that here is a big middle section, middle class, and small high
and low class. There is little difference between the three of them. The third
pyramid showed the communist society. Where arrows from the low and middle
class tried to reach the top but they bounced off the line. A small high
society and one big low society, cushioned by a minimal middle class section
of pyramid. _Then we turned the page and saw the darned fourth pyramid. This
one had arrows from the middle class dropping to the low, poor class_. “What
is this?” Some of us asked.

The teacher looked at us. “This is us” “It’s the collapsed country, a country
that turns into 3rd world country like in pyramid five where there is almost
no middle class to speak, one huge low, poor class , and a very small, very
rich, top class.” “What are those arrows that go from the middle to the bottom
of the pyramid?” Someone asked. You could hear a pin drop. “That is middle
class turning into poor”.

I won’t lie, no one cried, though people rubbed their faces, held their heads
and their breath. No one cried, but we all knew at that very moment that all
we thought, all we took for granted, simply was not going to happen. “You see,
the income from the middle class is not enough to function as middle class any
more. Some from the top class fall to middle class, but the vast majority of
the middle class turns into poor” Said the teacher.

I don’t know how many people in that room suddenly understood that he/she was
poor. The teacher continued “You see, we have a middle class that suddenly
turns to poor, creating a society of basically poor people, there is no more
middle class to cushion tensions any more. Middle class suddenly discovers
that they are overqualified for the jobs they can find and have to settle for
anything they can obtain, therefore unemployment sky rockets: too much to
offer, too little demand. You see they prepare, study for a job they are not
going to get. You kids, you are studying Architecture because you simply wish
to do so. Only 3 or 4 percent of you will actually find a job related to
architecture.”

We all sat there, letting it all sink in. After a few months, it all proved to
be true. Even the amount of students that dropped out of college increased to
at least 50%. They either so no point in studying something that would not
make much of a difference in their future salaries, had no money to keep
themselves in college, or simply had to drop college to work and support their
families.

(Edit: spelling)

------
bayesianhorse
All things are empty. That counts doubly for things like patriotism, family
life, and career success.

Maybe this realization is just quicker? Maybe this also means a higher ratio
of people are happy because they embraced emptyness?

~~~
6d0debc071
> All things are empty.

And living in a certain way fills them. Not necessarily intentionally or to
our benefit.

Some music is beautiful to me, some acts are pleasurable, some pictures and
stories resonate. Maybe they're empty when taken objectively, but I don't see
how that constitutes an answer to the poverty of subjective beings.

We mostly seem to have things that, based on our histories and to some extent
our biology, we've learned to draw pleasure or pain from. And that learning
does not seem like it can easily be altered in a well designed manner. If it
could, psychology would be a vastly simpler undertaking:

"I'm depressed and I can't afford to do much more than eat."

"Don't worry, switch over to the Nihilism 2.0 release and then patch it with
Existentialism 3.1"

;)

------
benaston
This is the result of the government being so "open minded" that they end up
not looking out for the best interests of their own populous. By "open minded"
I mean rapidly (this being the operative word) removing all cross-border
controls with countries with wildly differing economies, resulting in wage
deflation and joblessness for a huge number of people.

Of course the people hardest hit are those at the bottom of the income chart -
the young. At the same time, the cost of living has rocketed as a result of
the mishandling of the banking sector, resulting in a housing boom (that from
a political perspective cannot be permitted now to be undone and has been
subsequently propped up by a heavily indebted the government). Again the worst
off have been non-homeowners (i.e. the young).

It's impossible to blame the current administration for all of it, you have to
blame the entire political establishment (all 3 main parties have been in
power within the last 15 years). Their worldview has to be questioned.
Significant errors of judgement have been made repeatedly over the last 15
years - Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Syria (no action taken by a hairs breadth
even after everything that had come before), the banking crisis, handling of
the educational system (including higher education), rapidly opening borders
to former eastern-bloc countries, limitless spying on UK citizens, no reform
of an undemocratic (not elected, but "appointed") European Commission, and
migration of law making powers to the EU without consultation and assent by
the public (through referendum).

~~~
bgarbiak
You're being downvoted - probably - for blaming "former eastern-bloc
countries" for the state of things in UK. Well, it's just not that simple.
From purely economical point of view the recent arrival of labor from Eastern
Europe was a positive, it added 0.25 percentage points to UK's growth
(according to research done by Treasury). That's no surprise, since the
immigrants are coming in for jobs (often for the low skilled jobs, since they
don't know language enough to start a career in their field), so don't demand
rents, education and healthcare right off. Non-European immigrations affected
jobs market negatively, yet only in two years of recent recession, in 2009 and
2010. There are, of course, other, non-economical aspects, and here it's not
so rosy. This article touches the issue from many points of view:
[http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/eu/10822956...](http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/eu/10822956/EU-
elections-2014-Is-immigration-good-for-Britain.html)

Then, there's Germany. The only country in Europe where young people have
relatively no problems with getting a job. Why? Germans keep their job market
closed, so that's seems like an easy answer. Yet, France and some others did
the same, and it didn't help. And surely, Germany is significantly stronger
economically that the rest. However, they too had a period of high youth
unemployment rates. So that isn't it either. However, in exactly that period
they introduced Nationaler Pakt für. Ausbildung und Fachkräftenachwuchs
(Vocational and Educational Training Pact) - a solution that allows young
people to simultaneously work and study. It's not a system with no flaws, but
it worked. Source: [http://www.worldcrunch.com/opinion-analysis/how-germany-
beat...](http://www.worldcrunch.com/opinion-analysis/how-germany-beats-the-
youth-unemployment-trap/training-pact-opinion-unemployment-youth-jobless-
labor-education/c7s11646/)

~~~
benaston
That's a mischaracterisation of my argument. I am blaming the political
elites, not the eastern bloc countries (who are blameless). If I had no
qualifications and I suddenly no longer needed a masters degree to come to a
country with a minimum wage 7 times that in my homeland - I'd be on the first
flight there.

Your discussion regarding the situation in France and Germany is pertinent but
widens the discussion beyond my narrow point.

Supply and demand is econ 101. If the supply of low wage labour goes through
the roof, then wages are compressed for a section of the population (the young
and low paid) that can ill deal with the effects.

Now you you might say, "well, we have the minimum wage in the UK" \- but there
are all kinds of tricks employers will use to circumvent this, and with high
supply, they can more easily get away with this type of behavior. Finally, the
minimum wage, is not actually a liveable wage for an independent adult in the
UK in 2014 (despite protestations, I'm sure), and so offers little in the way
of protection anyway.

