

Different funding model or scam? - Killjoy

My co-founder has a meeting this week with a group named Liberty Capital (http://www.liberty-capitalfunding.com/).  They offer money with future invoices as collateral.<p>Right now, my team needs cash.  We're pretty savvy (thanks to the HN contingent!), and still early enough where we need cash to get ramen profitable.  My first thought on this was, "SCAM" -- but is using future invoices as collateral just a horrible idea?  After all, you usually give up equity, which is trading future money for money now; not really that different than what Liberty claims to do.<p>Does this scream SCAM to you guys too?  What are your thoughts on it?
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pg
I've never heard of a startup doing this. And the site looks alarming.

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aristus
I used to work for a company that did this kind of brokering, or "cashflow
factoring", etc.

The basic idea is that they give you Y*X dollars now against X future revenue
from your organization, where Y is much lower than 1.0. You're selling a lien
against future revenue.

Usually they target lottery winners, manufacturers with firm orders, people
who have won monetary awards in lawsuits, etc. It's not a very good idea.

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jakewolf
I know people who loan money off of credit card receivables. Terms are usually
for 6 months and at a very steep interest rate.

What's a future invoice?

You're better off getting cash redoing their website.

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cperciva
This is a common financial practice in some fields -- you might have heard of
something called "securitization" in the news lately. :-)

That said, applying it to a startup seems rather weird. Normally the way
securitization works when future revenue streams are _predictable_ , which is
far from true for most startups.

I wouldn't call this a scam necessarily, but it certainly raises my eyebrows
enough that I'd recommend reading over the fine print very carefully to make
sure that you know exactly what you're agreeing to.

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dont
Invoice Factoring or "Receivables Securitization" only happens when the
receivables are well established. That is, when the invoice has been generated
and accepted by customer.

No legitimate funding exists before the invoices are crystalized. Definitely
not for "FUTURE" invoice

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Killjoy
HN comes through again! Thanks guys, those are my thoughts exactly!

