
'Anti-meme law' could see Mexicans jailed for posting insulting images - spking
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/anti-meme-law-mexico-insulting-images-veracruz-a8567041.html
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zaroth
Is there a defining feature of this (or other) cyber bullying laws that make
them antithetical to freedom of expression and the tools of oppressive
regimes, rather than laws which promote more civil and effective discourse in
the public sphere?

I want to say trolling is somewhat like obscenity—in that you know it when you
see it—but that is a deeply unsatisfying response when so much discourse
online is so polarized.

Because it’s Ok for me to disagree with, even hate and detest, what someone is
saying. It’s Ok for me to shocked and angered and deeply offended by a thing
you say. It’s not Ok for me to go around clubbing people when they do this.

I think the current laws on libel, defamation, and slander are appropriate and
fairly functional. Public figures in particular have a higher burden as well
they should.

The new generation of anti-speech laws here and in the UK I find are deeply
flawed and dangerous, and appear to me to be tools of oppression rather than
the opposite.

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danShumway
> in that you know it when you see it

I would contend that one takeaway from companies like Facebook is that this
phrase doesn't actually hold up all that well on a global Internet.

Facebook originally classified breast-feeding as explicit. At the time there
was actual controversy about whether or not it fit into that category (public
perception now is mostly that it didn't). Facebook's shift from "no
pornography" to "here's a giant document about exactly what is and isn't
pornography down to the number of nipples you show" feels to me like the white
flag of a company that has decided it no longer knows it when it sees it.

I think "you know it when you see it" works _very_ well for small, tight-nit
communities, and maybe not quite so well as soon as as you start operating on
the scale of a country. On that scale, I kind of prefer the narrower
definitions we have on stuff like libel and slander.

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msla
The problem with "you know it when you see it", even in tight-knit
communities, is that it's used to shut down discussion: If you know it when
you see it, then it's obvious, and if you're trying to argue the point, well,
only a troll argues the obvious, innit? Nobody could disagree in good faith,
so the only conclusion is that you're trying to make trouble and should be
shut down.

It's logically indefensible, in that there isn't enough to it to make a
logical case to defend it, which means the people proposing ideas like these
must believe that either their ideas are so widely shared that nobody would
ever try to attack it, or that they'll be able to destroy anyone who does
attack it through means other than calm, logical argumentation. That second
possibility frightens me.

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LinuxBender
I know a group of people that are sexually aroused by seeing someones eyes. It
is not a small or fringe group. There is another even larger group that are
aroused by feet. What are we to do about the feet pictures and videos?

There is a sub-group among them that are further aroused by sharing pictures
of child feet on facebook. Something about doing that in public makes it more
exciting for them.

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IronWolve
Memes and Editorial/Political cartoons have been our oldest way of poking fun
at government officials, of course they would want to ban them, and bullying
is the perfect cover to do it. Think of the children!

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riffic
Mexico does not seem very friendly to freedom of expression:

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship_in_Mexico](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship_in_Mexico)

[https://freedomhouse.org/report/freedom-
press/2017/mexico](https://freedomhouse.org/report/freedom-press/2017/mexico)

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hfdgiutdryg
"There were 25,339 homicides in Mexico [in 2017], a 23% jump from 2016 and the
highest number since at least 1997, the year the government began tracking the
data." (CNN)

Good to see that the Mexican government is focusing on what's important.

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Slorg
They need to stop it before the first memecidio happens.

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emodendroket
Well, it sounds like it has no chance of passing because both the outgoing and
incoming mayor have pledged to veto it. Unless I missed something.

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barnesto
not surprising considering the leanings of the new administration. AMLO is
more of a socialist than populist.

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naringas
your assesment is pretty imprecise.

AMLO has got nothing to do with this, he isn't even in office yet (though it
kinda seems like he already is).

this is really just a proposed law from a state legislature.

