
Adam Curry launches a new, open podcast directory - mikece
https://podnews.net/update/podcast-index-open-directory
======
flerchin
I remember when he did this 15 years ago. He hosted fraudulently uploaded
podcasts with ad-inserts. Along with his podcast network that literally stole
the names from several of the biggest podcasts at the time through their
Podshow Contract. This looks to be exactly the same. Scammers gonna scam.

~~~
filmgirlcw
Oh yeah I remember this too! Good times.

ETA: was his the venture backed startup that hired Scoble until they ran out
of money or was that something else

Edit 2: the Scoble podcast VC thing was different. But it too went up in
flames in spectacular Web 2.0 fashion.

~~~
leahey
Meevio?

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book-sandworm
Gave Adam Curry's content (No agenda) a shot a couple of years ago. They
created content that was at least flirting with creating their own dimension
(figuratively). It seemed more like they were interested in their ego's then
actually doing real research. To me it seemed fuel for unfounded conspiracies
and provoking for provocation sake.

Not sure how people this disconnected with the rest of the world are able to
create an "open podcast directory".

Pretty much seams like there is a platform wars going on when it comes to
podcast. Looking what youtube did to video content as a platform I think
companies like Spotify (Gimlit) smell blood when it comes to podcasting. Think
that would be a shame for that industry, podcasting collectives like
Radiotopia are awesome because of that, they have to lean on quality and
content. Not on some fancy algorithm that tries to keep you engaged as long as
possible. Looking at the content he creates, seems like the complete opposite.

What made podcasts awesome was that the platform was fairly neutral (rss
feed). Yes you have Apple podcasts, but I don't know anyone that really likes
podcasts and still uses that app.

~~~
pokstad
I use Apple Podcasts for simplicity. Is there a better app that still enables
Indie self hosted podcasts to proliferate? I’ve never run into any problems
with Apple Podcasts, it’s a low tech solution for a low tech problem.

~~~
leahey
Overcast is cool ([http://www.overcast.fm](http://www.overcast.fm))

~~~
specialist
Overcast is my current choice. (For iOS, I don't have Android so can't
comment.) I tried them all. I don't particularly like any of them.

I've requested a feature and reported a bug via their Slack. I'm hopeful
they'll get added and fixed, respectively.

I still don't have a way to easily binge on some large archives. Like History
of Philosophy without any Gaps.
[https://historyofphilosophy.net](https://historyofphilosophy.net)

And Malcolm Gladwell's Revisionist History doesn't sort correctly in any
podcast client I've tried, making it even harder to binge.

What I really want is a NetNewsWire (RSS client) that can play audio
(directly).

I also want client-side metrics and listening history. To help me remember
when I heard something, better determine if I'm actually listening to misc
content, etc.

~~~
ballenf
Castro has listening history. But it doesn't handle in-order bingeing of
podcasts any better than any other client I've tried.

It's puzzling how no one has done this yet:

\- play podcasts in chronological order, keeping x of them downloaded and
getting the next one when one is finished.

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cowmix
Not a huge Curry fan but I'm REALLY not a fan of the co-host of his podcast. I
have been reading John C Dvorak, in real-time, since the mid-80s. I challenge
you to find someone so consistently wrong about technology and be wrong in the
most douchebag way possible.

~~~
alexfromapex
I was excited when I saw the name because I thought it was about Kubernetes
but it’s just a pun about podcasts...womp womp

------
filmgirlcw
This is one of those ideas that is good in theory until you look at how it
will actually be used, as well as the actual problems it solves and doesn’t
solve.

For better or worse, Apple has been the defacto podcast directory for almost
every podcasting app for over 15 years. In the aughts, a number of startups
tried to take on that space (notably Odeo, which incubated and then pivoted
into Twitter) and all of them failed. Apple has been largely an absentee
steward, which has worked out well for podcasting. It wasn’t until Google
decided to take podcasts seriously about five years ago and launched its own
podcast directory. Spotify’s podcast directory started about five years ago
too, though took longer to build momentum.

All three are largely copies of one another — although Spotify has exclusives
in its directory that can only be played in its app — and most major podcasts
choose to submit their RSS feed to those directories, with some also choosing
to share with other services (Stitcher, Luminary, etc.) that can do some
fucked up stuff with the audio. It’s all a game of reach for a podcast
publisher, unless you choose you don’t want Luminary or Stitcher to insert
their own ads into your content — or you have an exclusive with some service
or another.

So now there is ostensibly yet another podcast directory, except it can’t
offer a good value prop for existing except that it is “open” — which sounds
good if you’re Alex Jones or you make content that has been kicked out of the
other directories — but will realistically impact only a small number of
podcasters.

The target audience, I assume is podcatching apps. Right now, most of them
scrape the Apple or Google podcasts directory to save the insanity of trying
to maintain their own directory.

So what value is there for this “open” directory to someone who has a
podcatching app? Well, nothing unless there is a critical mass of podcasts
submitted. Moreover, the service says it’s free, but is also asking for
donations, which makes me worry about the viability of the index longterm.
Given how difficult the market is for creating a third-party podcasting client
when Google, Apple, and Spotify exist with their own apps and established
indies (Overcast), I would strongly discourage anyone from building their own
podcatcher as anything more than a hobby project.

So what’s the point? Podcasters will still have to submit to the major indexes
anyway and podcatchers or client apps already have enough problems without
having to worry about a little-used alternative that doesn’t have a business
plan associated with it.

I’m all for open and I’m not mad this exists — but I certainly wouldn’t build
my app off its API.

~~~
mikece
The main problem it solves, as mentioned in another comment, is that this
project is not beholden to a corporate entity which is in turn beholden to its
shareholders. The "censorship of conservative content" has never been about
politics but about making advertisers happy: advertisers who demand that their
ad buys not be displayed with/alongside content they deem inappropriate for
whatever reason. It was the political right who used this tactic to great
effect in the 1980s, going after advertisers and boycotting companies
advertising on "non-family-friendly" media content (usually television). The
media companies want to keep the ad money rolling in so they made a content
pivot/censored content. The same thing is happening now; follow the money:
that's where the effort to silence is being bought and paid for. Companies
like Apple, Google/YouTube, Reddit, and Facebook are simply caught in the
middle of a political tug-of-war and trying to find the least crappy path
through it.

~~~
filmgirlcw
You’re not getting it. I understand the aim. I’m asking how it can solve that
problem if it doesn’t have massive mindshare for podcasters to use and submit
to?

Because simply having another directory in existence and requesting people
submit their feed to it isn’t going to be easy. And if the index doesn’t have
the content, it is useless, regardless of its mission.

~~~
markkanof
Well they could certainly seed their initial data by scraping Apple's
directory, like most of the podcast player apps do. As for not having mind
share, that's not necessarily a reason to just throw in the towel. Lot's of
problems have this kind of chicken and egg scenario. Get something up and
running and then try to chip away at the mindshare problem by getting
podcasters to list there and podcast players to use this directory.

------
css
I wonder how The Podcast Index will handle fraud. There are other directories
that are similar in that they allow anyone to submit without moderation and
that leads to spammers re-hosting other podcasts with ad insertion.

~~~
filmgirlcw
Yeah, fraud is a major reason other people don’t want to maintain their own
directories. And I’m guessing there aren’t a lot of fraud provisions built
into this by design. Because “open.”

------
runako
From Curry's Wikipedia page:

"In late 2005 Curry was caught making anonymous edits to the Podcast Wikipedia
page, deleting several sections concerning contributions made by fellow
podcasting pioneers, Kevin Marks and Stephen Downes, while adding material
that emphasized his own involvement with the development of the medium."

Edit: the entry goes on to quote Curry in a context where he admits performing
the indicated edits.

------
brian_herman__
Here is a link to the actual site:
[https://podcastindex.org/](https://podcastindex.org/)

------
normaldist
This sounds like a huge headache, but their heart is in the right place.
Premium/non-RSS "podcasts" are a terrible experience.

------
vzaliva
Years ago I was listening for one of early seasons of DSC for a year or so and
it was kind of fun. Few years later I've looked him up and his new show has
totally different vibe: grumpy old men with questionable political agenda.
From DSC days I reckon he was a good entertainer but sucked in business. Hence
I have little exepctations for his new venture.

------
hwj
There is also [https://fyyd.de](https://fyyd.de) (it is integrated into
[https://antennapod.org](https://antennapod.org)).

------
snori74
I was excited for a moment, because I was a listener of his "Daily show" way-
back-when distinctly remember when Apple got on board for example. At the time
he was legitimately a pioneer of the technology, terminology and the medium.

Unfortunately/fortunately? I'd pretty much not tracked him for 15+ years, so
had forgotten what a sleazy Bagshot crazy he's become. Sad.

------
jasonlfunk
"Apple is starting to tinker with their directory"

This is the first I'm hearing of it. What are have Apple been doing to their
index?

~~~
leahey
[https://www.theverge.com/2018/8/6/17655168/alex-jones-
infowa...](https://www.theverge.com/2018/8/6/17655168/alex-jones-infowars-
apple-itunes-podcasts-removed)

~~~
adolph
_“Podcasts that violate these guidelines are removed from our directory making
them no longer searchable or available for download or streaming. We believe
in representing a wide range of views, so long as people are respectful to
those with differing opinions.”_

Anything not distributed will be used as a locus of control. The justification
for the action is immaterial. The problem is that the action is possible at
all.

------
modmans2nd
Meh.... he’s a conspiracy crank

------
leahey
He went full alt right. This is likely owing to the deletion of podcasts with
hate speech. Just FYI.

~~~
mikece
That’s the great thing about free speech: hate is overcome with more free
speech.

~~~
brnt
Unless it isn't, see various oppressive governments. Nazi-germany showed how
to hack free speech into oppression through censorship, book-burning. Russia
showed and continues to show how to use techniques like generating multiple
low-effort angles to balkanize readership and lionize their time, thus sowing
confusion and discord. China.

Free speech won't and doesn't survive contact with the human race without an
effective defence, and history shows merely counting on people to use more
free speech leaves free speech and democracy open to coordinated brute force
attacks.

~~~
nailer
Book burning is the opposite of free speech.

So is the great firewall of China.

Russia chills speech with assassinations.

Nearly all your examples are proving the opposite of your point.

~~~
brnt
My examples are not your examples, and your statements at best holds true for
yours only.

The point is that merely thinking saying free speech should be free is not
enough. As you well illustrate, the debate on what exactly free speech is
means we need to define what falls outside of it very clearly.

~~~
nailer
Your examples were the CCP, Nazi and Russia. So were mine.

~~~
brnt
I gave examples of some of their strategies, on which I base my conclusions.
Your examples are different, and therefore support different conclusions.

