

Female developers as a perk - m4tthumphrey
http://lists.lrug.org/pipermail/chat-lrug.org/2013-July/009095.html

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mcv
The line between really great and really creepy is very thin here.

Yes, I too would vastly prefer working in a diverse work environment that
includes women, over working in a place that doesn't hire women on principle,
or does hire them, but they quickly flee. But I would not want to work in a
place that treats women as a commodity, or tries to attract male programmers
with them.

It's a matter of attitude, and that attitude does show in the way you present
this as a perk.

~~~
geon
It would really be important to express it tastefully. Describing female
coworkers as a "perk" is tasteless and possibly sexist. Saying that "we strive
to have a mixed gender workplace" is positive for both men and women.

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fecak
What seems to make this even more 'creepy' is the listing of ethnicities for
the women developers, no? That comes across as saying that the women are
somewhat exotic (from other countries). It almost seems like he's saying "if
you look French, Italian, and/or Spanish women, this is the place for you". I
would have thought it more likely for someone to give the home country for the
keg of beer than for the female employees.

The fact that he mentions junior just implies that the aforementioned women
are not only exotic, but also young. Definitely clumsy in delivery.

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splendidfailure
As a female developer, I wasn't terribly offended by line item #8 (regardless
of whether it was intended to imply diversity or it was a joke in questionable
taste), but I did find it strange that female seemed to equate to "junior"
developer in this context. Did I read that wrong?

~~~
Terretta
Because of the use of the slash in the original post, I suspect he meant this
as:

    
    
        ((junior||front end)&&(back end)) developers.
    

I took it to mean some of the developers in question would be senior (non-
junior) backend developers.

~~~
splendidfailure
I like your interpretation. If for no other reason, it would seem to back up
the idea that the OP is merely bad with words and was in fact describing the
current composition of his team (a team diverse in gender, ethnicities, levels
of experience, etc)

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m4tthumphrey
Have to say I would actually appreciate working with female developers, and
would definitely see it as an incentive when choosing a new role. I have spent
most of my career working only with guys and it's not very... fun. That said,
I think the OP was quite foolish to post it as a perk.

~~~
chevalric
I think the post doesn't translate very well on a mailing list. Although there
are (IMO) advantages to having an equal (ish) mix of the sexes on your team,
it's not something I would claim as a perk in a job opening.

~~~
k__
I would prefer a 4 day week and the 30 days holiday...

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TWAndrews
It's a bit offensive as it seems like it was intended, but the balance of men
and women is definitely something I take into account when looking at a
company I might join. An office full of just guys is going to make for a
limited company.

~~~
16s
A classroom full of guys is why some people (guys and girls) don't major in
engineering.

~~~
workbench
Bit of a strange thing to base the entire future of your career on. It's only
a few years of your life, deal with it.

~~~
nitid_name
The composition of your graduating class is a good indicator of the
composition of your peers in industry (at least in your age bracket).

There are some notable exceptions, like astrophysics. The crop of astrophysics
students where I went to school was >50%, while the established portion of the
industry I saw while in school was >90% male.

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JackMorgan
I seriously wish some of my last workplaces had even a small percentage of
female developers. It tells me the company cares about the equally valuable
and yet different perspectives both genders bring to the table. Additionally,
it helps balance workplace interactions: offices of just 20-something guys too
often feel like sweaty cave man clubs and frat houses. Same with age diverse
groups; older developers can have some good wisdom that is well balanced with
younger developer's energy. A mixed team can be far more hardy than a single
mono-culture.

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mathattack
As a guy or a girl, being part of a global diverse workforce is a plus. If the
work environment is too narrow, it does say something about diversity of
opinion.

Of course it looks like the OP was talking more about eye candy.

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adw
Guy who posted this is having his arse handed to him on the thread, it's worth
noting.

(Which doesn't excuse the original poster's casual sexism, but does speak well
of everyone else on the list.)

------
contingencies
Meh. Mars/Venus. We're still intergalactic bacteria with impossibly
irrelevant, tiny lives, clinging to space rocks floating in a void whose size
we cannot comprehend. Possibly under the toenail of a tiny creature up there
in the 'real' world. So what if we're chromosomed differently? We're all still
irrelevant. No meaningful kerfuffle here, move along...

