
Hardware fix for Dell “AC power adapter could not be determined” - onny
https://blog.project-insanity.org/2020/05/25/hardware-fix-for-dell-ac-power-adapter-could-not-be-determined/
======
yftsui
Dell Laptop PSUs has this for at least 15 years. Internally it use a DS2501 to
store the manufacturer, wattage, output voltage, output current, Dell SN and
check sum. It is more like EDID for power supplies, it is definitely not DRM.
It helps the laptop to understand how much wattage it can get from the PSU to
avoid over heating, and use the output voltage to determine whether it is safe
to use it to charge the battery.

The content is something like `DELL 01 AC 065 195 033 {23bytes} 01`, where 01
matches the revision number on the label of the PSU, 065 means it is a 65
watts adapter, 195 means the output voltage is 19.5V, 033 means the output
current is maxed at 3.3A. The {23bytes} contains the country where it is
produced, the Dell part number and date codes which I don't have enough data
to understand how that is coded.

There was a github project which provided tools to copy and reprogram the
chip, HP follows a similar protocol for its high end laptops, it is possible
for a Dell laptop to use a HP PSU, if the BIOS is not implemented correctly.

~~~
tjoff
Which I guess is among the things usb-c power delivery covers as well.

Usn-c for charging, despite its warts, are quite the game-changer. Especially
in these absurd times where batteries are non-replacable being able yo juice-
up from a power bank is fantastic. (yes you could do that before but it was
very niche and/or expensive and with less utility).

~~~
compumike
Side note: integrated batteries are still replaceable if you're handy. (Though
not quickly swappable like you're suggesting for more energy capacity over a
single day!)

On the MacBook Pro I'm typing on right now, I replaced my the battery myself a
few months ago. It took about an hour including a thorough cleaning of the
laptop internals and I documented it here
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CAYFDDxUxHA](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CAYFDDxUxHA)
. That's still 59.9 minutes longer than it would have taken if had a modular
battery, but about the same price in dollars. And a fun little weekend
project.

~~~
542458
Where did you get your replacement battery from? I was looking into replacing
my battery, and my options for sourcing the part appear to be Amazon or
iFixIt. The former’s reviews are show a number of people complaining that the
part they received was of poor quality and barely held a charge (although this
might be a vocal minority? Hard to tell). The latter is almost the price of
just getting Apple to do it in the country I reside. What route did you take?

~~~
mjcohen
[https://eshop.macsales.com/](https://eshop.macsales.com/)

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rkagerer
Now solder that component into an adapter that goes between your jack and your
third party power supply, and I'd buy it.

I don't even want to use illegit power supplies. Rather, I have a growing pile
of genuine Dell ones (and jacks) that developed intermittent connections on
that pin and no longer detect as authorized.

~~~
Doxin
At risk of kicking in an open door: have you tried using contact spray? I own
a can of contact cleaner 390 by Kontakt Chemie (I'm sure other brands work
similarly effectively) and that stuff is basically magic for intermittent
contacts. So far I've used it to repair a buttload of wonky plugs, corroded
battery contacts, as well as all the switches and volume knobs on my 40 year
old amplifier. the volume knob still amazes me most. it went from an awful
crackly mess to perfectly smooth and it still is perfect 5 years later.

Anyways long story short: give contact spray a try. Worst case the contacts
are deformed too badly and it wont work.

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javiramos
Does anyone have good recommendations for general office laptops? My company
bought about 10 Dell laptops and about half of them have a problem in which
they randomly shut off due to some thermal issue. Dell has given us a hard
time with the problem and have replaced some of the laptops with new laptops
that have had the same problem.

~~~
bityard
Which Dell laptops did you buy?

Dell manufactures the whole spectrum of laptop quality, from cheap Walmart
garbage to high-end mobile workstations. If you buy their consumer-grade
stuff, yeah, it's often junk. But their business- and professional-oriented
laptops are usually decent quality. Latitude and Precision, for example. I
have both of those and they've been workhorses for me.

Mid-range Thinkpads would also be a fairly safe bet.

~~~
tails4e
I've a precision 5530. On paper it's a lovely machine. In practice, lots of
graphics issues, docking station issues where screens flicker, etc. It's such
a shame for something so costly. It's a work laptop, I'd have returned it long
ago if I'd purchased it myself.

~~~
dijit
I have a 5520, so, the generation before.

Specced the heavens, max memory, ECC, Xeon.

I also had issues with the dock, but it was exclusively the dock, the TB16 is
a flaming hunk of garbage that has no business being on my desk.

The issues mostly stem from the fact that the USB controller (which powers
nearly everything in the dock) is shockingly terrible.

But, regardless, there are more issues because the 5520 (and probably 5530)
have only 2PCIe lanes to the thunderbolt port. I was surprised to learn that
"thunderbolt3" != "thunderbolt3" in all cases.

I have a 5k laptop that is a buggy pile of trash because someone tried to save
a dollar on a USB controller.

Honestly if I could lug this thing at Michael Dells' head I would do so I'm so
frustrated.

But anyway, the laptop by itself is fantastic, it does get toasty under full
load but I tend to disable the GPU so it's bearable. I considered getting the
new WD19 thunderbolt dock before I realised about the thunderbolt PCIe lanes.

------
anotheryou
usb-c on the XPS just says it's less then ideal wattage (if that's the case)
and still charges.

~~~
pietrovismara
But then you get the nightmare that is cpu throttling, don't you? Had the same
experience with a precision.

~~~
anotheryou
How would I test that?

I only use it for travel and watching movies. There as a short "brain freeze"
when plugging it in, but it continues to work normally.

The hardest part was finding a USB charger that:

\- has decent wattage

\- is not expensive

\- also charges non-c USB

\- does not explode (and bring down the whole trains outlets...)

\- throttles/splits current (instead of running hot, shutting down and leaving
your equipment uncharged for the night...)

I settled on this one:
[https://www.amazon.de/gp/product/B07PR8LDGL/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_...](https://www.amazon.de/gp/product/B07PR8LDGL/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o01_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1)

Only downside: no qualcom quickcharge 3.0 for the non-c USBs

~~~
pietrovismara
>How would I test that?

On windows you can use CPU-Z, on linux look up for some command line solution.

~~~
anotheryou
I'm on windows :)

Didn't do heavy load testing, but see the same ~2800mhz on AC/battery/usb-c
(it's an i5-6300HQ)

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klmadfejno
I was bit by this issue once. I was still using the original charger. The
issue wasn't anything wrong with the pin, but the power port had been slightly
pushed inward. Had to crack it open and solder it to the frame.

I don't buy dell laptops for this exact hardware flaw.

~~~
ac29
Newer Dell laptops charge via USB-C PD, and work with any compliant charger
you'd like. Actually that's not quite true - I believe they require 20V
support, and like most things USB C, just because its "USB C PD" compliant,
doesn't mean it supports 20V (most OEM phone chargers dont, for example).

~~~
cerberusss
What's funny is MacBooks don't require 20V. I've never tried with an iPhone
charger, but I've definitely charged MacBooks overnight with a common 12W iPad
charger (using one of those USB-A-to-C cables).

~~~
ac29
Yeah, I think MacBooks work fine via even via 5V chargers (albeit slowly).
Would be nice if Dell followed their lead.

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TaylorAlexander
Proprietary technology slows us down and increases waste.

~~~
umvi
But it also increases customer lock in which increases profits. Apple loves to
do this.

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lscotte
It starts out being Dell then switches to HP? Something funky about that
article.

~~~
jotm
Don't know what the issue was, but HP and Dell supplies are the same, they'd
be interchangeable if not for the smart charge features.

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umvi
Dell PSUs are the worst. My wife's XPS 13 PSU went bad after just 4 years of
use. I bought a Chinese replacement for a fraction of the cost. No drm issues
yet

~~~
nightfly
4 years isn't a bad lifetime for a laptop PSU. I know I kill the cables on
mine way before the 4 year mark.

~~~
ashtonkem
One of the underrated facts of USB-PD; replaceable cables. No need to replace
the brick if the insulation frays.

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glitchc
Wait... won't it still think every adapter is 90W, even if you plug in a 65W
adapter?

~~~
isatty
There is a disclaimer that mentions this.

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battery_cowboy
My dell died recently and I wasn't sure why, since all the components that I
could check were working. It seemed like the thing just had no power. I sent
it for recycling after stripping some parts, but now I wonder if this was the
issue I had. I didn't get a Dell for my replacement, so I'm happier now with a
lighter, nicer computer anyways.

------
1996
Do we really need DRM for AC power adaptors?

~~~
nojito
Yes because batteries and power adapters can kill you and/or cause a fire.

There was an engineer who showed how shoddy many phone chargers are and how
dangerous they could be.

~~~
AnthonyMouse
So what does that have to do with DRM? That's what products liability suits
are for. You sue the maker of the shoddy battery/charger. DRM can't protect
you from that -- what happens when you buy the whole device from the shoddy
vendor?

edit: Yes, of course some of the vendors will be gone or judgment proof. So
don't buy from disreputable vendors. Which brings us back to the original
problem -- if the user _is_ willing to buy from them, they could just as
easily be buying an entire laptop or a toaster for their kitchen. So solve it
the way you solve those instead of stamping out competition, because you need
to solve those anyway.

Or put it another way: If _OEMs_ really wanted to solve this, they would stop
overcharging so much for chargers and battery replacements so that people
wouldn't have to play the Chinese equipment lottery to avoid paying a 1000%
markup.

~~~
ThrowawayR2
Attempting to sue the overseas manufacturer of your no-name third party AC
adapter is pretty much the definition of futility.

