
Vipassana: 10 days of solitude and insights gained from it - ca98am79
http://www.curiousjuice.com/blog-0/bid/141396/Vipassana-10-days-of-solitary-confinement-and-insights-gained-from-it
======
initself
I completed my 4th course in December. Vipassana meditation is the single
greatest human experience that I know of. The experience of "wisdom arising by
objectively observing sensations without reaction" is easily the most profound
experience I have ever had and feels like a miracle every time it happens. The
answers we are all looking for to fulfill ourselves and become truly happy
certainly are inside of us. We just have to be willing to sit and do nothing
and watch as the "law of nature" (Dhamma) takes over and we act perfectly in
accordance with it from moment to moment, as it is, not as we want it to be.

In every retreat, I experience the most mind-numbing boredom, severe burning
fiery pain, full body bliss the likes of which I cannot even recollect
properly and a huge gamut of sensations in between all of these extremes. I've
misinterpreted the extreme experiences at given times and each retreat learn a
little bit more about their true nature. I can then apply what I learn to my
life when I experience boredom, pain and extreme joy and learn to experience
each "properly".

The trick is finding the ardent awareness that allows you to stay there, on
the path, without distraction. And then to learn how to stay that ardently
aware as you go through life. Hopefully the retreat doesn't stay an isolated
10 day experience but its import, particular the technique itself, is
something you can cultivate throughout your life, while sitting, walking,
standing and lying down.

~~~
sraj
Where can I take this course? I live in the Bay Area.

~~~
antoncohen
In the Goenka tradition Dhamma Manda[1] in Lake County is the closest to the
Bay Area, the center in North Fork[2] is the largest. Here is map of locations
worldwide: <http://courses.dhamma.org/en-US/maps/ca.us>

[1] <http://www.manda.dhamma.org/>

[2] <http://www.mahavana.dhamma.org/>

------
DenisM
My take on Vipassana, in a nutshell (having gone through one 10-day course):

An experience gets memorized based on its emotional strength, so, for example,
a strong negative experience (a trauma) will get memorized quite well. Later
on, in a sort-of realed situation one gets to recall and relive such stored
experience - the brain sort of "believes" it's important to remember. If the
re-living is also strongly emotional, the memory gets "hardened", but if the
reliving is less emotional the memory gets "softened". As you go through life,
most negative experiences gets softer and softer with each recall until each
one disappears altogether for lack of emotional response, and thus subjective
importance. However a small number of such memories become immortal - each re-
living of one such memory is as emotionally strong as the previous one, and so
the memory of the pain never weakens. Such stored memory is called "Sarkana".
The problem with carrying around too many Sarkanas is that eventually any
event in your life brings back a negative memory from the past, so you spend
your life reacting to something that happened long time ago and bears only
superficial resemblance to the present situation.

The immediate purpose of the Viapssana meditation is to learn the ability to
direct your attention where you want it to go, not where the pain pulls you,
to learn dispassionate observation of your own suffering. Bi learning to
ignore an itch on your nose, you also learn to ignore an itch in your soul.
The less emotional response you generate, the softer the memory becomes, until
it evaporates altogether. When completely through (a multi-year process), you
only react to the present situation, not to any ghosts of the past.

You can make a surprising amount of progress in 10 days, but you have to keep
at it to maintain the gains. I found it impossibly hard to keep meditating on
my own.

~~~
up_and_up
12 year meditator here. You describe well the process of cleansing/polishing
the memory.

> I found it impossibly hard to keep meditating on my own

Couple things to keep in mind:

1\. Daily practice in some form is the real key. Just get up and do it.

2\. There will be ups and downs, high and lows in meditation.

3\. Vipassana is a pretty austere form of meditation. You are directly
confronting the mind with little outside aid or warmup. Other forms of
meditation leverage breathing techniques, concentration techniques and other
practices that gradually bring the mind into submission, making the no-thought
part somewhat more easy to achieve. Search around or shoot me an email if you
want to know some other approaches.

~~~
endlessvoid94
I couldn't find an email to shoot you a message, so I'm responding here.

I meditated for a few months back in 2006 and it was fantastic. I, too, have
trouble maintaining it. What other sorts of practices would you recommend?

~~~
ebcase
Vipassana is a great practice — in my experience, finding other people to sit
with consistently has helped better than anything else. Like weekly or even a
few times per week.

------
uberuberuber
I completed my first 10 day Vipassana course recently, and genuinely believe
that a slightly modified version of the course should be an essential
component of any person’s psychological maturation/development. The course I
did was the ‘Goenka course’ (dhamma.org), and I would recommend it to anyone
interested in learning more about meditation. It is free of charge to attend,
and you can actually only donate to the organization if you complete the full
10 days.

The course is almost entirely rational and in the spirit of honest scientific
inquiry. The rules seem arbitrary and silly but they are very helpful in
quieting your mind, and enabling you to focus entirely on the practice at
hand. It took me until Day 3 to let myself relax and enjoy the absence of
tweets, posts and text notifications rather than feel anxiety about being
disconnected. Assuming one is there for 240 hours, I only have an issue with
~5 of those hours being a bit ‘woo-woo’ as The Amazing Randi would say. I
think of Goenka (the videos used in the evening lectures are available on
youtube) as a kindly grandparent who just wants the best for you but
occasionally tangents into bullshit. Despite his continual admonishments to
only believe what is rational, he seems to genuinely believe the magical
stories surrounding the Buddha, and it was distracting to have to segue from
‘this is a genuine insight into how the mind generates its own suffering’ to
‘oh wait he is talking BS’. If one replaces some of his more magical terms
that are almost Freudian (ie Sakarnas) with 'Maladaptive neuronal connections'
they actually make sense.

The sheer number of hours one is able to practice in this setting really
accelerates the development of concentration/mindfulness. I think of the ~110
hours spent meditating during the course as equivalent to 220 days worth of
30minutes/day practice, and feel like I have ‘time traveled’ past 60% of a
year of training. Happy to answer specific questions if anyone is considering
attending a course.

~~~
DenisM
>'Maladaptive neuronal connections'

That's a mouthful, and just as obscure for most people. Might as well go with
"Sarkana" - it's easier to pronounce. Besides, the script worked well for a
few thousand years now, there is hardly a reason to change it now.

But yeah, if you're scientifically inclined and the ancient Indian mythology
is rubbing you the wrong way, you can safely skip it, and it still makes
perfect sense in the end.

~~~
xk_id
(following up on uberuberuber's reply)

> Besides, the script worked well for a few thousand years now, there is
> hardly a reason to change it now.

Imo, that is a big fallacy. I believe religious beliefs can no longer provide
sound ground for adjustment in today's world. It is harmful to have within
your semantic environment both "spiritual" factors such as the notion of
"aetheric body", and scientific factors such as the notion of "space-time"
(which currently shape our civilisation). This is because the two belong to
inconsistent sets, so they conflict.

Edit: For a more relevant example, consider the implicit assumption of many
"spiritual" doctrines that there is a "soul", which is separated from a
"mind", which is separated from a "body". This contrasts with our modern
scientific assumptions, that there is just an organism-as-a-whole-in-an-
environment, which functions as such. The word "organism" is more recent than
"Sankharas"! As such, it doesn't carry with itself the older metaphysics.

Also, consider our modern scientific perspective that we don't drop into this
world from a vacuum – we come from an environment, the uterus. This, again,
stands in sharp contradiction with many "spiritual" doctrines.

~~~
ams6110
Your point of view is certainly not unique, but neither is it anything close
to universal. Many people myself included comfortably reconcile belief in a
"soul" and a "higher power" with the demonstrated accomplishments of
scientific research and study.

------
programnature
While I'm glad the author got useful insights into conventional reality, the
article sets a counterproductive tone about the point of the practice.

Vipassana is about directly seeing impermanence, dissatisfaction, and lack of
self in all sensations. The point of practice is to elevate your skill in
seeing those. Because direct comprehension of the so-called three
characteristics can reboot the mind in a way that is very analogous to how we
reboot the computer and remove malware.

Vipassana is not about helping you deal with your psychological issues at the
level of content. Its not a therapist-substitute. In fact it will often make
matters (temporarily) worse, if you actually follow the instructions and do
the practice.

Spending your meditation time pondering your "issues" is the biggest rookie
mistake you can make. People can do this for years, and never get anywhere in
their practice.

If you want to spend some time alone and contemplate your life, thats great
and quite possibly useful, but don't call it Vipassana.

~~~
javajosh
_> Spending your meditation time pondering your "issues" is the biggest rookie
mistake you can make_

This is worth repeating. This is a silent practice, and while thoughts may
arise (and very interesting ones, too!) learning to let them go, and remain
(mentally) silent was perhaps the biggest obstacle to progress for me
personally. Not sure if mental silence is a cause or effect of meditation, but
it's the closest thing to real happiness I've experienced.

------
dpnewman
i have recently done the 10 day course and it was one of the best things i
have ever experienced. have continued meditating (near) every day because it
keeps me returning to a sense of deep calm and focus and enjoyment – feelings
prior far more rare even tho i would have described myself as happy and
digging life. the new digging is at a deeper level and much of what i used to
perseverate upon seems reduced in import by orders of magnitude. practically
the whole notion of "intellect figuring out and resolving issues", seems now
completely a misguided process. returning to the state of calm fertilizes
better thought which crowds out the worries. worry process becomes reduced and
unmasked when it arises. the whole physical reaction cycle different.
awareness that how we feel (and happiness) is in our bodies – we know the
value of physical exercise. this is similar. a rigorous training that just
starts doing what it's advertised to do. veritably mind blowing, yep.

~~~
initself
I'm happy for you!

>> practically the whole notion of "intellect figuring out and resolving
issues", seems now completely a misguided process"

Makes me feel like all the book learning I ever did was all for naught (aside
from technical learning that helps me do my job).

~~~
dpnewman
thanks! ...but let me clarify. book learning is utterly awesome!! when i say
"resolving issues"... i mean purely the personal, subjective, 'worrisome'
kind... the endless spinning narratives we struggle within. the attachment to
solving issues these through out-thinking the anxiety: this process got
deprecated ;)

~~~
initself
Well, as you keep meditating, it becomes more and more clear that all the
answers you are burning to understand are found within.

------
initself
Guys, what you are calling "Sarkanas", the Goenka tradition is calling
"Sankhara".

<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sa%E1%B9%85kh%C4%81ra>

Nothing woo-woo about "conditioned phenomena". And it's not really a
"Vipassana" term as much as a philosophical term in general. That's just the
Pali name for it.

~~~
javajosh
Well, to be fair Goenka uses some rather charged terms as synonyms for
sankharas, such as "defilements", "impurities", etc.

------
b_emery
I once read a book called adrift [1], a true story about a man adrift at sea,
alone, for 76 days. The main takeaway that I recall was the profound
loneliness and the desire for human contact that he experienced. I sometimes
think of this I'm with friends and family, to try to really appreciate the
moments that I'm with them. Luckily, I don't feel the need to impose 10 days
of solitude on myself to obtain this realization (nor the other realizations
the gained by the author of the post).

[1] <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adrift:_76_Days_Lost_At_Sea> and
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steven_Callahan>

~~~
dpnewman
that the author and so many others here are describing fantastic learning
experiences suggest to me the word "impose" might be a little off.

even though you don't talk to or engage with people, the experience does not
ring of aloneness actually. i felt incredibly connected to other participants
and at the end when you begin talking again, there's a wonderful sense of
camaraderie. made a bunch of new friends.

------
gesman
I loved about the course: \- Amazing food \- Donation/karma-driven
sustainability. Sort of Open Source Meditation :) \- Silence (no bullshit
talking and no bullshit listening for 10 days) \- Heightened sense of
creativity achieved \- Heightened sense of humor achieved \- Great attention
to needs to everyone from organizers. \- It's funny - I always gave funny
nicknames to everyone.

I didn't mind: \- Goenka parables.

I didn't like: \- After suddenly switching to raw/vegetarian food - you'll be
running to the bathroom for an explosive, nasty dragon fart breaks day and
night. \- No clear plan to maintain gains. They suggest 1-2 hours daily
meditation afterwards which is impossible to maintain.

Overall: five stars (Quebec mountains location)

~~~
delackner
A lot of people discussing the 1 hour in the morning, 1 hour before bed
requirement. I also found this impractical, but lately I have been pondering
something that Goenka said on this subject: If you don't have enough time,
sleep less. When I heard this, it sounded ridiculous, since sleep is so
important for the body.

A theory I have been developing is that perhaps meditation that achieves a no-
mind state for a long period of time, may allow the practitioner's brain and
body to enter the same kind of restorative repair cycle that it normally only
enters during unconscious sleep (the only time a normal person's mind is truly
shut-off).

A variety of experiences have lead me to suspect this, most profoundly being
the night AFTER my 10 day retreat ended, when I was quite tired from a long
day, having stayed up past midnight, despite having gotten up at 4:30 am that
day for the final day of the retreat.

When I lay down to sleep, exhausted, I fell into a deep meditative state. I
got up and opened my eyes, took a walk around the block, went back to try and
sleep, and immediately was back in a meditative state. Gave up and just went
along with experiencing being in that state all night, since I was totally
aware, yet in the morning felt very rested despite having not slept a wink.

~~~
initself
Yes, there is no doubt that if you meditate two hours a day, you won't need to
sleep as much. You can basically assume you can lose about 1 hour of sleep,
safely.

------
eof
I went to one of these with a decade of moderate meditation under my belt and
just over a year of 'wanting to'.

I got extremely sick from a combination of rhinovirus and detox (I had been
smoking regularly); and left on the 5th full day.

My experiences with meditation had been primarily pleasant. I learned
accidentally following rote instructions at 18; and meditated regularly on and
off (mostly off as years went by) until I heard about this course (which is
free, including room and board), and it took just over a year until I sorted
out the opportunity to go.

I honestly feel/felt scared/respectful of the whole endeavor. Meditation is
what it would be like to learn to breathe underwater, if it were possible.

Our bodies know intrinsically we can't breathe water in; so when you are under
water you don't breathe. When oxygen levels are high its not really a thought,
but even with oxygen levels are low there is an inherent _aversion_ to
sucking/breathing in the water.

Meditation is like that, in the sense our commitment to sit for ~60 minus (or
10 hours a day) is akin to committing to keep our heads under water. The
difference is with meditation, the only thing limiting how long you can sit is
your will.

By sitting and not reacting to our thoughts we are eventually shown this
"layer" where we are unconsciously "holding our breath" in the same way we do
when we are under water with high levels of oxygen. Meditation effectively
"reduces the oxygen" thereby increasing the signal on the "i need oxygen"
circuit, so in the same way that being under water when oxygen is running low,
what was previously so subtle as to not be noticed consciously there is now
this new, apparent phenomena we can't help but be made aware of.

This is the mechanism, in my estimation, that meditation gives its benefit.
Essentially the 'secret' learned while meditation is that "you can breathe
underwater" and all this aversion you were feeling was a total waste of
energy; energy you didn't even now you were expending.

------
hosh
If you have that secret smile from your vipassana practice, I want to share
another practice that complements it. It is written in a book called, "Feeding
Your Demons", authored by Tsultrim Allione.

In some ways, this method works well to prepare people for vipassana. Yes,
yes, I know, you can always note any experience out; but some people are so
habituated to their trauma and were never put into a situation where they
dedicate themselves to doing nothing and observing everything. They will stare
at you incredulously as we babble on how awesome vipassana is.

------
lambtron
My take on vipassana:

[http://andyjiang.posterous.com/vipassana-meditation-ten-
long...](http://andyjiang.posterous.com/vipassana-meditation-ten-long-days-
and-a-few)

Humorous account of the ten days.

------
novalis78
Here is an interesting blog post on the principle behind vipassana:

"He sees the impermanent form thus “impermanent”.This is his right view.Seeing
correctly he becomes disenchanted.With the waning of delight wanes passion.
With the waning of passion wanes delight. With the destruction of delight and
passion the mind is de-tached. “Fully de-tached” thus it is said.
(Nandikkhayasuttaṃ, Samyutta Nikaya)

<http://tinyurl.com/vipassana-quote>

------
vellum
I came across this article on Longreads. The author had a more irreverent take
on his 10 day course in India, but in the end, he said it helped him deal with
stress better. [http://www.mensjournal.com/magazine/print-view/the-quiet-
hel...](http://www.mensjournal.com/magazine/print-view/the-quiet-hell-of-
extreme-meditation-20120821?src=longreads)

------
broabprobe
Oh wow, funny to see this on here as I just an hour ago applied to attend a
session. Thanks for sharing your experiences everyone!

------
webwanderings
Nice, very nice. I have them bookmarked for a long time but I have yet to
fulfill this desire to one day just get to it.

------
ZenoArrow
I've been to a 10 day Vipassana retreat. I appreciate people say it gave them
great benefits, but it did not sit well with me, so I share my story in the
interests of balance.

At first, things were fine. I adjusted to the silence quickly enough, the food
was simple but nutritious, and didn't mind the meditation (other than the pain
in my legs and back, but my request to sit on the back wall was granted).
However, mid way through (I think the 5th day), I went to sleep and
experienced a sensation I had never (to my memory) had before... as I closed
my eyes, I'd experience bursts of not too pleasant images (some of a sexual
nature, some more grotesque, etc...). Each image would last roughly a couple
of seconds, before moving onto the next. When I opened my eyes, the images
were gone, when I closed my eyes the images reappeared straight away.

At this point, I freaked out. I was worried that I'd done damage to my brain.
Unable to sleep, and feeling like I had to make conscious effort to breathe, I
contemplated what I could do. I didn't want to turn on the light (I had a
roommate), nor did I want to spoil the course for anyone else by making too
much noise, so I just stayed in bed, awake, for as long as I could (I calmed
down a little in this period). I eventually struck up the courage to get up
and speak to one of the course supervisors. Speaking to him helped, he advised
me to try to rest and he'd arrange for me to speak to the course teacher in
the morning... eventually I did get some sleep.

I spoke to the course teacher. He reassured me this was all part of the
process (such visions are not unheard of, but of course I can't say for sure
if you'll get them too), the way its sold is that its part of your body
letting go of these thoughts. I was not convinced. Furthermore, whilst I saw
the people running the course (including Goenka) were kind hearted people, I
felt isolated, unable to talk to those with a more neutral perspective.

Later on, I also took unkindly to the late night teachings, which again were
well intentioned and in some ways comforting, but occasionally said subtly
hurtful things. For example, love between couples was described as a business
arrangement (I'll love you if you love me). If you weren't paying attention
such comments would slip by, but at this point I was trying to fend for my own
sanity so I was paying more attention to such things.

That being said, I do believe meditation can be beneficial, just not in the
way the course was led (this is just my experience, other people found the
course beneficial). If they had taught the technique alone, and asked you to
practice it (without trying to tell you what it all means, about your ego
slipping away, etc...), then I think I would've taken to it more kindly.
Buddha was supposed to have emphasised experience over verbal teaching, so I
personally believe teaching the technique with simpler guidance would be
appropriate. I also believe meditation is a good way to come to terms with the
eventuality of death.

Again, I cannot tell you what you'll experience, and as you can see from
comments here it worked for others, but just in case you try it and it doesn't
work for you, please know you are not alone.

~~~
javajosh
_> At this point, I freaked out. I was worried that I'd done damage to my
brain._

That freakout, and that worry (which you apparently have since discovered was
unfounded, I hope :) is precisely what the meditation helps you deal with,
among other things.

And yes, it kind of sucks that the teachers can't speak more at liberty with
you. But there's a lesson there too: in the end, the answer to any trouble you
might have is to simply find the craving and the aversion. Find the ignorance
in your misery. You were safe and taken care of, and you felt you were at
risk. You were wrong.

Blaise Pascal famously claimed that all of man's problems stems from the
inability to sit quietly in a room, alone. And we are _not_ able to do it,
either. Vipassanna is the rather upsetting path toward learning to be able to
sit quietly in a room, alone. And it's very simple, but not at all easy.

~~~
ZenoArrow
"You were wrong." In what way was I wrong? Perhaps you don't understand that
whilst the panic attack was the 'straw that broke the camels back' so to
speak, it was the teachings and approach that I disagreed with most in the
end, the panic attack just woke me up to paying more attention to them.

"Vipassanna is the rather upsetting path toward learning to be able to sit
quietly in a room, alone." If that's all it was, I would've been happier with
it. Being told you create misery, that your love (unless you follow the path)
is shallow, that your ego will disappear, being told that Buddhism is
'scientific' and then being told the smallest particles in the universe are
'kalapas' of earth, air, fire, etc... wasn't exactly reassuring. I also
disliked the chanting (you don't have to do it, but I personally found it off-
putting to listen to).

I actually enjoyed practising anapana and vipassana (less so the third type,
can't remember the name), though of course you're not meant to enjoy it.
Becoming aware of the extra sensation you have of your body was pretty
interesting.

If the path you've chosen works for you, great, but please open your mind to
accept it might not work great for everybody. One of the saving graces of the
vipassana course for me is they didn't expect you to believe what they were
saying, but rather believe in your own experience. That sort of honesty I can
respect.

~~~
javajosh
_> In what way was I wrong?_

"I was worried that I'd done damage to my brain" implies that you believed
your brain was at risk from meditation. You continued through the course, and
yet your brain still functions. You assessed the risk to your brain as "high",
you came out of it (presumably) without brain damage, ergo your threat
assessment was wrong.

To put it another way, you were describing your mind state in a point in time
which was incorrectly assessing itself. It turned out that you did not do
damage to your brain. You thought your brain was at risk, and your own
experience showed that you were wrong to assess the risk so highly.

Yeah, I have (strong) disagreements with the discourses - not just the kalapas
thing, but the reference to higher- and lower existences, not to mention the
dogma of rebirth. It's mentioned in passing, but it contradicts earlier claims
of "non-sectarianism". In fact, it left such a bad taste in my mouth I left my
first course (5th night). I went back and almost left again, but mastered my
anger. The third time I was less angry. Now I just laugh - the Buddha (and
Goenka) are just products of their time, communicating as best they can with
the tools they have. The core observations, the core practice, doesn't require
any of it.

------
gearoidoc
If anyone's looking to find a similar course, I run a website called
Connectedtrips thats geared towards just that.

Here's a link to a list of our Meditation courses in the USA:

<http://tinyurl.com/b6zumq2>

------
particular_
DISCLAIMER: This post focuses more on the Goenka courses than Vipassana
meditation per se.

I'm quite surprised that no dissenting opinion has yet surfaced on the topic
of Goenka's courses. Most of the commentor's opinions here seem over-
enthusiastic, describing the Goenka retreat as 'the best thing in [their]
lives'. To me, this is a serious warning sign.

I have attended a 10-day retreat, which ended prematurely (on the evening of
the 8th day) because of my refusal to watch the evening lectures. While I must
agree with the commentors' positive opinions on the meditative experience, I
feel compelled to inform any potential attendees that despite claims of
'scientific rationality', the Goenka group is a regular religious sect.

When the course begins, the Vipassana technique is presented as an objective
tool to achieve insight into the workings of one's own mind and emotions. Mr.
Goenka presents himself as someone who merely happened to learn of the
technique and is now passing it on.

As the days progress, the scarce sleep and food schedule begins to take its
toll on the participants' bullshit detectors, and subtle religious notions are
slipped into the agenda. These include:

* The primacy of Vipassana over other religions * The unreasonableness of other religions * The unquestioned truth of reincarnation * The fact that our bodies are made up of some kind of vibrations

I remember finally 'snapping out of it' when Goenka started talking about
bubble chambers( <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bubble_chamber> ) and the
depressed scientist who made them. My bullshit detector went on overdrive and
I thought about all the things that had been said up to that point during
Goenka's video lectures and his taped talks. I realized that I had been subtly
manipulated into accepting certain ontological truths, such as the above.
These were not things I would have readily accepted coming to the retreat.

I also realized I had been planning to continue with Vipassana practice and
make it part of my life. Maybe help organize retreats in my home country.
Become part of this 'wonderful' movement headed by Mr. Goenka. This was
definitely not something I had in mind when I signed up for the course.

I know I will not convince anyone who is already engaged with the Goenka group
to rethink how they got involved, but I would like to sincerely warn anyone
who is considering attending:

You will not be alone with your thoughts and emotions during these ten days.
You will be accompanied by _THE RECORDED VOICE OF GOENKA_ , for 2-3 hours of
each and every day. Every meditation will start with his talks and chants,
every meditation will end with his talks and chants. From what I understand,
but have obviously not experienced firsthand, the grueling 9-day course ends
with a Love-bomb (<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Love_bombing>). I believe
these 'free' courses are set up to lure susceptible people into the
organization.

Please look into some critical views on any religious group before engaging
with one. On the internet, smears abound, but you may also find some grounded
critique that may shine light on the structure and purpose of the
organization.

~~~
bcjordan
Having completed a full course, I agree with you regarding the video content.
It went beyond practice guidance and veered into disappointing endorsements of
woo-woo.

The nightly videos start out objective and practice-focused, but by the middle
of the course Goenka suggests quantum-scariness explanations for the
sensations meditators are feeling.

As one retreat participant noted, in one of the nightly video talks [0]:

> [Goenka] mixes quantum mechanics with "psychology of enlightenment"

What makes it a bit more of a breach of trust is that by the time he breaks
out the full-on woo-woo, you're deep in the process—the days are flying by—you
purposely don't have your critical thought facilities active.

Aside from that sour note, I'd still suggest this course to others. Hitting a
stride with practice and tuning your ability to focus your attention on minute
sensations is a fascinating experience, especially if you've taken any courses
on proprioception, sensation and perception.

If you're a rationalist who already firmly rejects the ideas of mind-body
separation and reincarnation then you have nothing to worry about.

[0]: <http://www.vipassanaforum.net/forum/index.php?topic=1871.0>

~~~
particular_
The arguments made by the poster in your link really resounded with me. It
goes against my ethics to recommend these courses to people who are actively
seeking to jump-start their meditative practice.

As far as being a rationalist goes, I'm not confident that I can always keep
my mind free from unwanted social/religious influence, or allow myself to be
influenced in a controlled manner. I'm glad that this one off-hand remark
about bubble chambers actually awakened me from a cognitive stupor, but I
can't be sure that, under slightly different circumstances, I wouldn't have
ignored the doubts and the red lights going off somewhere in the back of my
head.

Cognitive blind spots are a real thing, and my guess is that many Eastern
religious groups are very sophisticated in how they use these blind spots to
appeal to intelligent, but unsuspecting, individuals. Eastern techniques of
religious indoctrination greatly differ from the guilt-based Christian
approach that most of us are familiar with.

I stand by my position: these retreats are not simply meditation courses. They
are a religious ritual held by a well-organized religious group. Moreover,
they are deceptively advertised as non-religious, and herein lies my problem
with them.

If someone wishes to learn meditation from a religious source, I think it is
wise to refer to an organization that is overt in its practice and beliefs.

------
orasis
I am building a hardcore vipassana app based on the noting technique. You can
sign up for the beta at <http://mindblownapp.com/>

------
milkman
As an adjunct to this article, I should mention an experimental project I
launched just yesterday called VOW of NOW. It's a 30 day program that tries to
instill meditation as a daily habit by leveraging powerful incentives:
<http://vowofnow.com>

A bunch of people are taking the vow already, and I'm excited and hoping it
works for them and is the beginning of a more zen life. We'll see. I welcome
everyone to try.

