
Two in Three Americans Now Support Legalizing Marijuana - uptown
https://news.gallup.com/poll/243908/two-three-americans-support-legalizing-marijuana.aspx
======
jaggederest
I think it's pretty transparently clear that even if you hate the drug itself,
there have been no obvious disasters in the legalized states. Tax revenue plus
no hugely obvious negative effects is a hard argument to deny.

On a broader level, this is exactly what federalism is about - states being
able to try things to experiment, without committing the entire country
irrevocably.

~~~
RIMR
I can even excuse being personally disinterested in Cannabis, but you would
have to be pretty entrenched in misinformation to hate cannabis itself. What
societal harm is there?

The biggest complaint I ever hear that isn't based on a non-truth is "it
smells bad".

~~~
dyarosla
Didn’t downvote you but wanted to respond-

Smells bad can itself be a big deal. Some people also have migraines that
result from inhaling second hand marijuana smoke. Moreover, many people don’t
want to smell the stuff in their daily commute- and the smell definitely
lingers longer, than say, tobacco, in an open space.

I’m not opposed to legalization, but saying that there’s no societal harm is
pretty misinformed too. Seemingly minor things like ‘smells bad’ can easily
make one hate cannabis.

~~~
Fnoord
I smell this every day in Amsterdam metro when I commute from work (the other
way around not so much). I'm currently a non-smoker.

If you 'smell it' you subconsciously feel like you are forced 'smoking it'
akin to involuntary second hand tobacco usage. Whether that is true or not I
do not know.

As a former tobacco and former casual marihuana smoker I dislike either of
these smells. I consciously quit both, both for very good personal reasons.

There are obvious health related risks to abstain smoking tobacco but for me I
have autism and marihuana can make me over-sensitised and get me into a
psychosis. This occurred numerous times.

Yes, there are benefits to marihuana and specifically CBD. My uncle had
terminal cancer and hash oil helped him against this pain (he was AFAIK never
pro-drugs or pro-marihuana before he got cancer). And there are disadvantages
as well. I'm a proponent of education and regulation, just like with alcohol.

~~~
citrablue
I also feel like when I smell someones body odor that I have unconsciously
been forced to ingest their bacterial waste. Living amongst other people, we
have to accept that there will be things we don't like about it.

~~~
Fnoord
There's this social norm where you don't cause discomfort such as noise or
pollution for other people. Some people overdo it with way too much perfume;
those are equally annoying.

The difference however is that although such might over-sensitise someone with
e.g. (undiagnosed) autism your example is not proven to be harmful for the
lungs, nor does it make you stoned.

~~~
citrablue
What's the latest consensus on secondhand smoke and cancer/COPD issues? I
thought the "I smelled cigarette smoke on the street" exposure was largely
found to have negligible health effects. (I think the "my partner smokes and i
live in a smokers house" exposure still causes issues)

~~~
acct1771
All smoke, regardless of what tier you're on, is respiratory
irritant/carcinogenic.

~~~
citrablue
But they are not all equally so, right? Seems like dose response would be
important to understand when evaluating for possible policy/intervention
determination.

------
uptown
Colorado Total Marijuana Sales:

    
    
      2014	$683,523,739
      2015	$995,591,255
      2016	$1,307,203,473
      2017	$1,507,702,219
      2018*	$1,022,245,511 (Through August 2018)
    

Source: [https://www.fool.com/investing/2018/10/20/theres-no-
stopping...](https://www.fool.com/investing/2018/10/20/theres-no-stopping-
colorados-marijuana-market.aspx)

I think it's going to be increasingly difficult for states facing budget
shortfalls to ignore this as a potential new source of tax revenue.

~~~
eof
Vermont legalized but set up no tax structure. Legal to grow and gift, but not
sell. There was a lot of pressure to get it legal, a veto from the governor,
and apparently no consensus on how to tax/license it.

~~~
apendleton
DC is in a similar boat for slightly different reasons: possession and use
were legalized by citizen initiative with the expectation that the city would
create a regulatory apparatus for production and sale, and then they were
forbidden from spending any of their money to do so by Congress, which has
veto power over their budget. So now it's in a weird quasi-legal gray area.

------
mabbo
In Canada, nothing has really changed. Everyone who smoked pot before still
does. Most people who didn't still don't.

We just aren't wasting any more effort policing something no one cares about.

~~~
eli
Hasn't it been like 5 days? Seems a little soon to draw conclusions

~~~
mabbo
There were some _very_ dire predictions.

... But you are still correct.

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wowzap
I just hope we don't end up like California and keep hundreds in fines for
smoking in public, open containers in cars, having more than 30 grams, etc.
People should be allowed to possess any amount they want, grow as many plants
as they want, etc. What's the point of legalization if a police officer can
still stop you and search to make sure you have under 30 grams? What's the
point of legalization if smoking weed still prevents you from buying a gun or
holding down a federal job?

I like Larry Sharpe's viewpoint here - Marijuana should be regulated like
onions.

~~~
xyzzyz
> I just hope we don't end up like California and keep hundreds in fines for
> smoking in public, open containers in cars, having more than 30 grams, etc.

I don't see why we should treat marijuana more leniently than we treat
alcohol. Drinking in public is already illegal in most places.

> What's the point of legalization if a police officer can still stop you and
> search to make sure you have under 30 grams?

Police officer cannot stop and search you without a probable cause.

> I like Larry Sharpe's viewpoint here - Marijuana should be regulated like
> onions.

Maybe, but let's regulate marijuana like alcohol first, and then, when we
regulate alcohol like onions, we can move on to do the same with marijuana.

~~~
wowzap
1\. Drinking in public in California is a $100 fine, smoking marijuana in
public is $250.

2\. Probable cause - "our drug dog is trained to detect over 30 grams of
Marijuana.", "I smelled marijuana and suspected an open container, asked to
see the open container to verify it was legal, open container held over 30
grams."

3.You're right about alcohol... fun fact - it's still federally illegal to
distill spirits.

~~~
jaggederest
> it's still federally illegal to distill spirits.

Without a distillery license. Which is not especially expensive, and is wholly
reasonable considering the significantly higher technical and safety threshold
of operating a distillery. Bathtub gin used to kill people.

~~~
BenjiWiebe
Pretty sure you can get some kind of really cheap experimental type of license
to distill as well.

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jsgo
I don't use it nor if it were legal tomorrow, I highly doubt that would change
(I don't drink either, for that matter).

That being said, with one of the major knocks (or at least scapegoats) against
it being crime, if they'd look historically at prohibition how organized crime
benefited from the prohibition of alcohol and ending the prohibition was a
sizable blow to crime, I don't see why they'd be so against it.

Dunno. Taxing it would be good. Regulating it should be okay. I really don't
see the cons of legalizing it when you have alcohol legalized (which I'm not
advocating for it not to be).

~~~
stevenwoo
Last time this was in the up for a vote in California my memory (could be
faulty) was three of the biggest opponents of marijuana legalization were
pharmaceutical industry, alcohol industry and the prison industrial complex.
There is not a citizen push to keep it illegal, it's businesses trying to
limit competition.

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rv-de
I really hope the legalization of Cannabis is going to make some progress in
Germany. If you are German and sympathizing with this - then please support
Deutscher Hanfverband
([https://hanfverband.de/unterstuetzen](https://hanfverband.de/unterstuetzen)).
They (and especially Georg Wurth who is heading this organization) are doing a
fantastic job promoting this request.

For me Cannabis legalization is a symbol for science and reason based politics
and legislation. And I am so sick of the fear mongering FUD-based reasoning of
CDU and AfD.

My personal theory for why right-wing politicians (except for those of the
extreme libertarian fraction) are so passionately against legalization of
Cannabis is because of group formation reaching back to their youth. You
identify with a group also by rituals, habits and enemies. And I guess they
just developed a bias against this other group of "hippies" who used to smoke
joints. And they carry this resentment with them into their adulthood and
agenda.

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baldfat
There are plenty of things to be concerned about but that fight has been lost.
Here I will quote a scientist. Personally I have plenty of friends and my
brother as examples what over use of pot can do to ruin lives.

> Now, as a scientist, I’m unimpressed with many of the widely used arguments
> for the legalization of marijuana.

1) “It’s natural!” So is arsenic.

2)“It’s beneficial!” The best-documented medicinal effects of marijuana are
achieved without the chemical compound that gets users high.

3) “It’s not addictive!” This is false, because the brain adapts to marijuana
as it does to all abused drugs, and these neural adjustments lead to
tolerance, dependence and craving — the hallmarks of addiction.

Conclusion: Still, I’m not against legalization. I simply object to the
astounding lack of skepticism about pot in our current debate. Whether or not
to legalize weed is the wrong question. The right one is: How will growing use
of delta-9-THC affect individuals and communities?

Though the evidence is far from complete, wishful thinking and widespread
enthusiasm are no substitutes for careful consideration. Instead of rushing to
enact new laws that are as nonsensical as the ones they replace, let’s sort
out the costs and benefits, using current scientific knowledge, while
supporting the research needed to clarify the neural and social consequences
of frequent use of THC. Perhaps then we’ll avoid practices that inure future
generations to what’s really important.

[https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/posteverything/wp/2018/0...](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/posteverything/wp/2018/05/25/feature/legalizing-
marijuana-is-fine-but-dont-ignore-the-science-on-its-
dangers/?utm_term=.237f9c0773e1)

~~~
leetcrew
> Whether or not to legalize weed is the wrong question. The right one is: How
> will growing use of delta-9-THC affect individuals and communities?

strongly disagree. the only question we should be asking about cannabis (and
other drugs) is "do they harm people who haven't freely decided to consume
them?". if not, there is nothing left to talk about wrt the law.

edit: unless i misunderstand your post and you are making a point outside of
legality?

~~~
baldfat
Well I could make the point that pot isn't harmless. Heck smartphones aren't
harmless and alcohol is responsible for 6% of all deaths. I see hundreds of
kids every week at work where parents are disengaged with their kids and super
engaged with their phone.

I think we have an issue with the questions we ask as humans. I am just making
the point that we need to look past our individual lenses but that's really
never going to happen to our community as a whole.

PS I am a life long abstainer of all vices minus my addiction to sugar.

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egwynn
To me it’s not a question about whether it’s good or bad that people consume
marijuana. It’s about whether taxpayers are currently getting anything near
what they pay for from the practice of enforcing prohibition. If 2x the people
start using marijuana but we get to cut the DEA’s budget by a factor of 10,
then let’s try diverting that money into initiatives that help people out.
Throwing people in jail clearly isn’t working.

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intopieces
Three in Three could support legalizing marijuana and it wouldn’t make it any
more likely to be be legalized.

Our legislatures are old enough to have written Reefer Madness.

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llamataboot
Seeing the rapid tipping point (look at the past 20 years) gives me hope that
we me see decriminalization of all substances in more countries (even the US)
during my lifetime.

I believe that prohibition just represents an emotional cognitive bias (drugs
are bad! drug users are bad!) as any rational evidence based analysis comes to
the conclusion that not only does prohibition not work for decreasing drug
use, it actually increases both the negative person effects of that use and
contributes to externalities like increasing the power/funds of violent drug
cartels in various parts of the world.

Portugal was a great experiment. It worked. Let's push for full legalization
or at least decriminalization across the board.

~~~
codyb
The big negatives in Portugal is the fact stuff isn't actually legalized.
Walking around Lisbon at night you're constantly accosted by thuggish groups
of dealers offering cocaine, hash, marijuana, and other drugs.

If you watch them from a bar or something you'll see people interact with them
and suddenly there are four of them around and they demand more and more money
after the person had already paid the agreed upon price.

I even saw someone get jumped by a group of these guys after he protested that
they had agreed to 20 euros for some weed and then wanted however much more.

They should make that studf legal so drug users can go buy quality drugs from
the pharmacist or whatever and cleanup the streets of all the semi-violent and
aggressive drug gangs that roam their cities.

~~~
b1r6
Are there no police in these areas to deter harassment/assault/robbery? If
not, that's certainly a contributing factor.

~~~
codyb
I never saw the police do a single thing and the gangs seem to focus
exclusively on foreigners which seems to be most of the people partying in
Lisbon while I was there.

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phakding
It's amazing to look back and see how the public support built up for this
over last 40 something years. I am not sure how many more years before this
country follows Canada or Uruguay.

~~~
craftyguy
> I am not sure how many more years before this country follows Canada or
> Uruguay.

At least two more years.

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dawhizkid
I get extremely paranoid on marijuana, and if I don't it just makes me feel
lazy and tired. Not sure if it's genetic or what but have never been able to
enjoy it.

~~~
onemoresoop
Try to use less. A lot less. Like a whole lot less. One puff only. MJ can
intoxicate you and its effects are nasty and very non enjoyable in high doses.
Try one puff and wait for 10 minutes and if you want more try another one.
Once buzzed learn its effects. Don't look for more unless experienced. Also, i
remember when i first started using it, it took me a month of smoking to get
to enjoy it fully. Same goes with alcohol. Remember the first time you got
drunk? Im sure it came with some consequences...

~~~
b1r6
This is a good idea. You can easily have too much, especially with the
stronger consumption methods we have today.

Also, think up some things you'd like to try while under the influence... Do
you have a favorite album or movie? Many things may be found to be
invigorating and enjoyable in a way you couldn't have described before.

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brianpc
The other one was too high to answer the survey

