
“A state of flow can be achieved by deep work” - robschia
https://www.robinwieruch.de/lessons-learned-deep-work-flow/
======
splintercell
Reposting my comment regarding deep work and how I achieved it:

Imagine your mind like your desk. Every morning it's empty. (Usually) You wake
up you load it up with all sorts of crap to entertain yourself, social media,
Reddit, hacker news etc, etc.

By the time you get to work, there is no place to put work stuff on that desk.
You try to put work stuff on it, but pretty much the whole desk is filled with
Twitter/Tumblr/Facebook shit. So even if you make some space for the work
stuff, sooner or later you focus on Tumblr again. Work stuff gets pushed out.

Generally in my case, by 2PM I manage to clear out all the distracting stuff
and get focused. The solution was this: BORE YOURSELF at every available
opportunity.

When I start my morning, I refused to pick up my phone and check out social
media (usually I would take a 45 minute dump just catching up on stuff posted
last night). Sure my morning chores became a bit boring, but I also became
more efficient (I started getting to work sooner).

Basically, by the time I get to my desk, I am so bored that the most
interesting thing I can do is work. And my work (programming) is a very
interesting task, it used to keep me engaged for hours and hours, it's just
that Social Media defeated it.

I do check social media. I check it around 2PM after my standup. That
'impulsive' desire to constantly check it is gone. I catch up on all the
social media in the evening or at night (but it doesn't create that compulsive
pattern anymore.

End result: My productivity has gone up by 5-6 times. I have a performance
enhancement story to work on and I managed to fix 6-7 bugs I found during my
work, and it turns out that it was a whole team's sprint's work.

~~~
jansenv
This is an interesting concept, but it still requires self control. I could
browse all day if I wanted but I WANT to get more work done, but I cant help
it. But when I get into that state of flow it seems like nothing can tear me
away from my work.

I'll try this.

~~~
Jemmeh
You can use something like StayFocusd to force yourself off it. It won't allow
you to reach the distracting websites no matter what you do. Forced boredom.

Though personally I've found if I just log out of facebook and my personal
email, that helps. I can't open a tab and have rewards in less than 2 seconds.
The extra few seconds to type in a password slows me down enough to just close
the tab again and get back to work.

~~~
secfirstmd
Yep couldn't agree more. It's actually embarrasing how many times I end up
seeing the Focus App blocking screen during a very distracted day.

------
smdz
I'm sure many programmers would have experienced deepwork. Ironically, my best
experiences with deep work were when I had broken legs and had limited
physical movements.

One disadvantage of deepwork is - your brain sometimes gets stuck into a local
minima/maxima when solving problems. As a programmer, I've written code in the
flow and then ended up refactoring a couple of weeks later.

I've also experienced dream-learning (and dream-solving) when working or
learning in this manner. However, deepwork and staying in the flow for too
long can make one feel socially insane.

Deep work - works best when things are planned in detail before you fall in
the flow. Any planning activities in between will just break the flow.

~~~
pizza
I agree. Really, standing up from a desk (should you be so fortunate as to be
able to, that is) and taking a walk feels like piercing through the ocean's
surface and taking a breath of fresh air. From certain submerged angles, the
refractive index of the water makes its boundary a silvery mirror, easy to be
mesmerized by.

------
extr
I'm going to be straight, a lot of this just seems like, at best, general
advice for getting things done that may or may not work for any given person.
At worst, some pseudo-scientific mumbo jumbo that references disproven
concepts. It's a red flag to me when paragraphs start with "Research shows..."
with no context/evidence in sight.

>You need to be aware of your finite amount of willpower.

Didn't willpower depletion fail to replicate last year?

> Research shows that a trained memory improves your ability to
> concentrate...There are many strategies you can apply to train your memory.

I was under the impression that working memory is one of the most difficult
(if not impossible) things to train or improve.

~~~
emilga
> I was under the impression that working memory is one of the most difficult
> (if not impossible) things to train or improve.

I'm not a psychologist, but the way I understand "improving your working
memory" is that it's not the number of units in working memory that increases,
but the conceptual complexity of each unit.

So, lets say that I practice Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu and have only 3 slots of
working memory.

If I'm a beginner, each slot may contain such elements as "pull his arm across
my midline", "pull his head towards me", and "post my leg on his hip". These
units are only a few of the steps you need to perform a successful armbar from
guard.

If I'm more experienced in the domain, each slot in working memory may contain
such elements as "perform an armbar", "if that fails do a pendulum sweep", and
"when I'm in mount perform an Ezekiel choke."

In each case, only three slots occupy the working memory. But the conceptual
complexity of each unit is an order of magnitude greater in the experienced
person's case. And the effect of the working memory is correspondingly
"improved".

A consequence of this is that the power of your memory is domain specific
(your memory is better in domains where you have more experience and
interest).

~~~
dhimes
I believe what you are describing is what they call "chunking."

~~~
dredmorbius
Any references to what "they" say about it?

(I'm investigating various questions including of STWM, ideas, and networks or
clusters of ideas.)

~~~
dhimes
This isn't bad:

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chunking_(psychology)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chunking_\(psychology\))

It's like a grocery bag for ideas. The more familiar they are the more you can
represent them with a single abstract concept in your working memory that
basically acts as a pointer to the various items contained in the concrete
implementation.

Here's another reference you may enjoy:

[http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2657600/](http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2657600/)

What is STWM?

~~~
dredmorbius
Thanks.

STWM: short-term working memory. A fascinating presentation by Sander van der
Leeuw on the interactions of that and anthropology:
[https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=80dR9Q2glgY](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=80dR9Q2glgY)

------
tluyben2
I find that things that prevent me from getting into deep work (as I
understand from the comments here, didn't read the book) is the crap involved
with 'getting to work' these days. Not a day goes by were I do not have to
spend a strange % of my time screwing around with settings, setup, libraries,
fixing libraries, (re)installing libraries etc. This is why I would like to do
embedded coding or game coding (it applies less and less there, but it applies
to the games I like writing) all the time; stuff is just _there_ and I do not
have to fiddle around with 'stuff'. I still do see a good place for IDE's like
Delphi & Livecode or closed source systems like q/kdb+; install and just start
working, no messing around with whatever badly built 3rd party stuff. Even
with containers it's not perfect; too many things are just deterring from what
I am hired for or, more importantly, what I want to be doing, which is writing
code. If I need something (trivial or complex) and open nuget search or (more
so) npm search, I know that now I will lose a _lot_ of time installing and
learning all kinds of mess I don't want to deal with as I _was_ in the flow.

I am teaching a few people programming so they might have a better life (they
asked me for that reason; I recommended to them to open a pizza restaurant in
a small mountain village and be happy but he) and they keep asking me things
like; 'why does Postgresql not contain a full search engine like elastic
search, why elastic search? why do I need to install a queue, why is that not
in Postgresql? why does this language library not have x, why not y? (also,
why do I need to install a webserver, why is that not included? Mailserver?
DNS server? etc)'. I know the answers and I know why it all is like that as I
lived through the years when it was, then wasn't, then was, then wasn't but it
does take me out of the flow and it makes me, sometimes, long for just
switching on a computer and _just_ having basic + assembly and that's it.

~~~
sotojuan
That's why the author, Cal Newport, can get deep work done easily; he's an
academic.

I can sort of get into deep work except my office is loud, cramped, and full
of distractions :/

------
hartator
I have read the whole book, it was a waste of time.

Mainly because Newport keeps contradicting himself. I remember a few
paragraphs before the end of the book, he was saying how he didnt want to make
a philosophical or moral point and just after said "having a deep life is the
best way of living". The full book is like this.

~~~
sotojuan
It's also a waste of time because it's a book. Deep Work, along with many
other non-fiction "self help" books HN loves, could just be a couple of long
blog posts. As a book it gets repetitive and tiring after the first half.

~~~
DarkTree
> Deep Work, along with many other non-fiction "self help" books HN loves,
> could just be a couple of long blog posts.

Sure, they _could_ be, but I would argue there is benefit to expanding them
into longer books.

I haven't read this specific book, but have read several other "self-help"
books and while the majority of them have shown repetitive themes, that same
repetition is what ingrained the overall message the author is trying to
disseminate. Reading a book over the course of weeks has a much more lasting
effect on me, than probably any blog posts I've read.

~~~
sotojuan
Fair enough. Maybe I just don't like self-help books as much as others do.

------
rebootthesystem
Wake up -> Go To the Gym (No Starbucks) -> Workout -> Shower -> Go to Work ->
Start working right away (no email, social media or distractions)

That's it. Simple as that.

In a few hours your brain will be "fried". At that point checking email and
messing around a little in social media might actually help you relax and get
back into it after an hour so so.

Oh, yeah. Eat.

No coffee. Ever.

~~~
tertius
Tell me more about this coffee idea.

I drink coffee.

I heard it said like this: "Drinking coffee is borrowing time from later
today. Drinking alcohol is borrowing time from tomorrow."

I did go for many months without coffee because if headaches. So I know it is
doable.

~~~
rebootthesystem
Humans did not evolve needing these stimulants. I think coffee is a habit far
more than a necessity.

~~~
verinus
Sure- for me it's a ritual to take a break work. And it works really well.

>Humans did not evolve needing these stimulants.

We have had no time do adapt evolutionally to the different requirements of
civilization. So I think this point is moot (we are built to hunt and gather I
understand).

------
emersonrsantos
"Happiness is like a cat, If you try to coax it or call it, it will avoid you;
it will never come. But if you pay no attention to it and go about your
business, you'll find it rubbing against your legs and jumping into your lap."
\- quote from William Bennett

------
nnx
My favorite book on the subject is "Free Play : Improvisation in Life and Art"
by Stephen Nachmanovitch. [https://www.amazon.com/Free-Play-Improvisation-
Life-Art/dp/0...](https://www.amazon.com/Free-Play-Improvisation-Life-
Art/dp/0874776317)

His description of the necessary fight with the "inner critic" more or less
lurking in everyone's mind - and especially in OCD/perfectionists - is really
interesting and got to me much more than Flow (haven't read Deep Work tho).

------
JustSomeNobody
I used to have no trouble concentrating on one thing. Now, it seems nobody can
work (or let anyone else work) without "multitasking". So, now I find it hard
to concentrate even when I am allowed to focus on one thing[0]. The single
biggest thing that helps with that is a timer and commitment to the timer.

[0] I guess I am so used to being distracted that I find I distract myself.

~~~
AlexandrB
I'm the same boat. I am now very rarely in any kind of state of flow (maybe
once every few months) and it feels more _shallow_ than it used to be.

~~~
petra
Isn't surfing the web or Googling, flow ? you can be totally focused on it
that you forget everything else , and times passes really quickly.

~~~
mirekrusin
Good one! Checking HN/fb for hours must be some kind of flow indeed.

------
superasn
My solution is a variant of the pomodoro where I work in 50-15-50-15- blocks
of time. In the 50 minutes i use coldturkey which blocks all access to social
media though i hardly ever use it.

I think 15 minute break is necessary because it helps you to refocus and also
prevents backache.

------
selmat
I observed that after 2 glasses of wine I'm more resistant to all kind of
distractions. I don't have tendency to open dozens of tabs in browser, switch
among unsolved things, check mails, smartphone etc.

Disadvantages are that I'm tired sooner and it's not sustainable drink alcohol
if I need to do something.

All-in-all, no practical solution....just interesting self-observation :)

~~~
nisa
Smoking a very small dose of weed has the same effect on me. However it's
difficult to get the dosage right (if it's too much I'm basically unable to do
anything) and it's not really working for difficult programming. However for
organizing stuff, writing down something already clear or for tasks in the
flat or just plain cleaning or mundane tasks it keeps me focused.

~~~
johntran
Smoking sativas is a hidden performance hack. Easier to recover from cannabis
than from drinking.

------
kordless
Distraction requires cognitive overhead to remain "skillful" at something,
especially if you are expected to create content with those skills.

Some jobs don't require as much cognitive overhead as others. Some jobs
require creative skills. If you look closely at labor laws, the distinction is
made between exempt employees and non-exempt employees. One type has volition
to determine how the job they are to do is to be done, the other has others
tell them what job they are to do and how they are to do it. One gets overtime
(the ones doing) and one does not (the ones observing).

It's important more people learn to achieve flow and create content by while
doing direct observing. Creating content comes "effortlessly" when in the flow
because the judgement of the observation doesn't get in the way. The judgement
is where all the work is.

------
strictnein
> "The state of flow can be caused by various events. It can be, like Mihaly
> Csikszentmihalyi says, “hearing to a song of a bird in the forest” or
> “sharing a crust of bread with a friend”."

Huh? I think we're getting a little too abstract here. Getting into a state of
"flow" requires three things for me:

1\. Work that doesn't suck. I gave my IDE the finger today. Double middle
fingers right at my screen. What I was working on really sucked. I need to be
working on something interesting.

2\. Decent amount of caffeine

3\. A song I can loop and listen to all day without it distracting me. Usually
something electronic. Brain.fm's "Focus" setting also works.

Headphones in, caffeine consumed, and the hours can move by quickly. Without
other interruptions of course.

------
jelliclesfarm
Deep work seems to be a derivative of Flow. Flow is a classic...it's about
finding joy..pure joy...no superlatives. Just joy.

While Flow was eye opening as a book..where I really experienced 'Flow' irl
was when I started reading Godel Escher and Bach by Douglas Hofstader. I think
it's a book I can pick up today or ten years from now and still experience
'Flow' as I did when I read it for the first time. What a gift!

------
jor-el
I once seen this [1] lecture by Swami Sarvapriyananda on Flow. I found it very
interesting and easy to understand.

[1]
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BGswR0tMqCM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BGswR0tMqCM)

------
hyperpallium
In landscape on mobile, 2/5 of the screen is taken up by social media icons.

------
TheOneTrueKyle
I have been struggling to get into the flow for the same reason that I have
trouble getting into meditation: I have bulging disks and chronic pain.

I can never completely focus on anything these days because I am constantly
focusing on the pain.

Does anyone else with chronic pain have advice for getting into a flow state
without being interrupted by pain?

