
Don’t buy the MacBook Pros even on sale, in my opinion - ksec
https://theoutline.com/post/4277/dont-buy-the-new-macbook-pros-even-on-sale-in-my-opinion?zd=1&zi=pydyvqbr
======
tomduncalf
Duplicate of
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16922476](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16922476)

------
scottfr
I got one of the new MacBooks at work. After a few months the 'G' key started
getting flaky. Sometimes it would work, sometimes it would do nothing,
sometimes it would trigger twice for a single key press.

I took it to our tech support, after spraying air and all the recommended
steps they could not fix it. They took it and gave me a new one.

After a month, the 'B' key on that new laptop started to be flaky.

Unless Apple manages to fix this, my next computers at both work and home will
not be Macintoshes. After over a decade of loving Mac laptops, I will either
be switching over to Windows (WSL looks great) or Chromebooks.

~~~
movedx
> (WSL looks great)

It's not. Consider just going with Linux if that's an option for you.

The WSL is quite weak in the knees. I tried switching to Windows 10, from
macOS, as my primary development operating system. I tried this for about
three months. I ended up reverting back.

Just remember, using any OS is about crafting a tool for plying your trade.
Windows, Linux, macOS, MS-DOS, they're all just tools to help you achieve your
goals and Linux is the most malleable and open of the options today.

With the way Apple are going, I've now got Debian (Linux) on a second SSD in
my PC and my 2014 MBP will be the last Mac I buy. Only iPhones and iPads have
stayed consistently good for me.

------
pavlov
My late 2016 MacBook Pro (15" Touch Bar) is the worst Mac I've ever owned. The
keyboard is broken with the same problems described by others, and the screen
has developed a color distortion that makes people look sickly green or pink.

It's disheartening how Apple followed up the absolute dud of the 2013 Mac Pro
(serious heat issues, pointless form factor) with another design disaster in
the Pro series.

------
filt
I bought my Macbook Pro in april 2016.

By october some keys were a bit harder to press, by december spacebar and a
few other buttons gave up.

I gave it to apple for warranty, it wasn't even a year old yet. They checked
it and wanted $200 for just doing the chekup with no fix (as it was my fault
that the keys were broken) OR i could pay $650 to get the whole top replaced.

My income is 100% dependent on having a working laptop so it was not really a
choice for me. I paid the $650. This was a few months back.

Now the "2"-key is feeling numb and I'm worried i'll have to replace the top
every 2-3 months...

~~~
ldh
I just went through something similar, getting the display replaced for $700.

While that was in the shop, I bought a similarly spec'd used Thinkpad for
under $500 and like it more in almost every way.

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matwood
The one thing that has to work is the keyboard. Based on the number of reports
I have seen, this issue appears to be fairly wide spread. Apple has so far
said nothing, except released a document about canned air. If we assume Apple
employees are using the new MBPs, then Apple should have some idea of the
increased failure rate.

There are have been a lot of MBP sales lately, so I'm cautiously hoping they
are dumping stock in preparation for an update at WWDC.

------
wstrange
Can confirm.

The keyboard on my touchbar Mac pro has a few sticky keys that make it super
annoying to type. The butterfly key design is just not sturdy enough.

The laptop is out of warranty, so for now I am using an external keyboard.

For a $3K laptop, this is not acceptable.

~~~
cma
Dell has started going with "maglev" keys to try and get things thinner.
Anyone have experience with them yet? Is the key feel any good?

[https://www.theverge.com/circuitbreaker/2018/1/9/16826146/ne...](https://www.theverge.com/circuitbreaker/2018/1/9/16826146/new-
dell-xps-15-2-in-1-laptop-announced-ces-2018)

~~~
woolvalley
At least dell laptop keyboards are fairly easy and cheap to replace.

------
crabasa
I have an early-2015 Mackbook Pro that I am absolutely clinging to because 1)
it works 2) it has all the ports that I need: USB, HDMI, Mini DisplayPort and
MagSafe.

That being said, it feels like it's slowing down. Has anyone had success
reviving the performance of their older machine? Anyone tried backing up and
doing a restore?

~~~
gct
Spinning disk or SSD? If the former, get an SSD.

~~~
rhinoceraptor
I think the last Macbook Pros to even support 2.5" drives were the 2012, non-
retina ones. That was also the last generation to support plastic circle based
media as well.

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w4tson
My “3” key quite often repeats on mine. I really dislike the keyboard.

The up and down arrow keys are so small it makes it really difficult to touch
type. Especially when coding and you’re navigating about using the keyboard.

It’s the stupid race to the bottom to get the worlds thinnest laptop at the
expense of functionality.

------
ktosobcy
LMFTFY: "Don’t buy the _NEW_ MacBook Pros even on sale, in my opinion"

I'm still on my old MBP2013 and kinda like it (first Apple computer and I was
sceptical). However new Apple offering is plain terrible…

Also: don't do squiggly, moving underline on hyperlinks... what a distraction!

------
peterhadlaw
After having my wonderful beast / tank of a MBA for so long, I was finally
excited to upgrade to my first ever MBP. Oh boy, let me tell you...

\- Broken keyboard, twice! \- Failed motherboard (wouldn't start). \- Now I
have waves of darkness/light on the bottom of my screen after leaving it to
idle for just a little bit that won't go away. Looks gross. \- It's so low
power tbh, the Macbook Air felt much snappier (I have the non-touchbar base
model). \- Honestly, the trackpad is just a smidge too big.

------
makecheck
Apple probably needs to be “broken up”, at least internally, to avoid the
spread of whatever poison is causing them to simultaneously ruin both hardware
and software experiences.

Any one of these fiascos should be enough for executives to start being
reprimanded. Everything from “no newest Apple device plugs into any other
newest Apple device” (sorry: “Courage”), to “must-have-been-High-when-released
Sierra” to “Mac Pro-for-limited-values-of-Pro”, not to mention destroying the
App Store for most developers and customers.

The worst part of all is I _can’t_ boycott Apple after all this because they
_still_ somehow manage to be least-crappy-alternative when considering many
other things such as security, etc.

The solution, then, seems to be to wait. In 2019-2020 when New MacBook Pro
arrives, it’ll probably be on backorder for 15 months as all Waiters from the
last few years line up to buy a real upgrade.

------
solomatov
The most important quote:

"What should you buy instead of all these bad computers? I have no earthly
idea."

Does anybody here had experience with XPS 15 or anything of similar form
factor of MacBook Pro 15?

~~~
Amezarak
So far, I think the XPS 15 is a great laptop.

Things I don't like:

\- No ethernet port. I guess most people think this is great, nowadays.
Unfortunately, I go a lot of places without wifi so I have to carry a dongle
around. Drives me crazy that the trend is towards removing ports and I can't
understand how anyone thinks adding yet another layer (usb/thunderbolt) to the
network stack is sane.

\- Fn keys default to alternate behavior;, e.g, brightening and dimming screen
instead of F11 and F12. There is a BIOS setting to change this, but it's
confusingly named. You have to turn the opposite one of what you'd think on.

\- I got the 4k screen. It's very, very glossy.

\- The arrow keys are very small.

I would highly recommend it so far, but I know people are picky about their
macbooks. I've also only had it for a few months. I like laptops that last ten
years, and I don't know if this one will make it.

~~~
fusiongyro
Fn + Esc on my Precision 5520 seems to switch it into function key mode, or
something. Found out about this yesterday, it may work for you too since these
are almost the same laptop. It also came with the ethernet dongle, but I never
really need it.

~~~
Amezarak
Yes, this works, but you have to do it on every boot, right? I had also just
found out about it recently and it worked but I was poking around in the bios
for the permanent solution.

------
mcdirty
I can't believe the amount of people who don't realize the Lenovo X1 Carbon
(version 6) is the powerhouse computer they've all been looking for. It's
linux compatible for devs. The only reason most devs are tied to OSX is
because of tooling. Mainly brew.

I bought the new x1 carbon and am never looking back to Apple.

~~~
solomatov
> The only reason most devs are tied to OSX is because of tooling. Mainly
> brew.

It's not brew. Linux package managers are much better than brew, IMO. It's the
fact that everything works out of the box and great build quality which makes
devs use OSX.

------
pdq
It's not the prettiest solution, but the transparent polyurethane keyboard
covers you can buy on Amazon are cheap $10 insurance against a dead MB or MBP
keyboard with the new butterfly design.

I've had mine for over a year now and the keyboard is in like new condition.

~~~
0xCMP
Oh wow, I hadn't even thought of that. Such a nice simple solution until they
release the next version (sometime 2019!)

My MBP 2014 is starting to die in subtle ways so I'm not sure how much longer
I have. Hopefully I last until the next release, but if I didn't at least this
could help keep it safe when I'm not using it docked on my desk.

------
AIX2ESXI
I've been really impressed with the Surface book Pro 3. Microsoft has been
stepping up their game for a bit now. From my experience Apple's repair costs
have been going up and the build quality has been going down in recent years.
I think the sweet spot for a professional work laptop is about $1300 - 1500
and getting 3-4 years use out of it. I generally get free laptops at work and
have a high end NUC desktop at home with nice mounted dual monitors for
intensive work.

------
brandonmenc
As a counterpoint, I love my 2017 MBP with Touch Bar.

Keyboard? Awesome. Best keyboard I've ever used. Not a single problem. Ruined
me for any other kind of keyboard.

USB-C? Best port ever. Nothing better than plugging a single cable into my
dock that powers everything and an external monitor.

Giant touchpad? Rules. Can't go back to the dinky small ones.

Touchbar? Better than F keys.

I have an Air that I open up sometimes, and honestly, the keyboard and
touchpad on it are nearly unusable for me after spending time with the new
MBP.

ymmv

~~~
nottorp
I don't suppose you touch type text all day?

Edit: I mean, I'm sure the emoji keyboard and large trackpad is better if your
work involves the mouse and any of those applications where you have to click
toolbar buttons a lot. Just not for typing.

~~~
brandonmenc
I touch type all day long. I'm a programmer. I also write a lot of long-form
emails. I've never typed faster than I have on the new MBP keyboard. again,
ymmv.

------
throw7
Sigh, why is finding a good quality modern keyboard so hard.

I bought a model m clone (unicomp) a year ago and now the left alt key will
get "stuck" and not register further keypresses. support just says to remove
the key and reseat. actually, i have to press really hard on the key and that
"releases" something so it works for maybe a week and then gets "stuck" again.
-.-

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holografix
Work handed me a 13 inch touchbar in Jan and I’m still shocked at how poor the
battery life is.

Really like everything else but it’s light years behind the experience I had
with an old “white” MacBook. No charging indicator, no sleep mode indicator,
can’t switch ram, no remote (yes I used it!), no battery led indicator
(remember the button underneath the Mac that lit up a battery level?)

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kevin_nisbet
+1, I'm also having keyboard issues on a new macbook pro. My symptoms are a
bit different, I get double key's on several key's at random. So a 'r' becomes
'rr', etc. Extremely annoying.

Apple has said they would fix it, but they would need the machine for 5-10
day's, and this is my primary work machine.

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bcheung
Same here. It still works but I see intermittent issues with mine. That and it
feels like I'm typing on a flat glass surface. There's no tactile feedback.
Feels like a tongue twister for my fingers. I use external keyboards almost
all the time because of it.

------
dfsegoat
I have a mid-2015 15" that has been rock solid... Is it safe to assume I
should plan to keep this thing healthy as long as possible?

~~~
i0n1
Maybe they fix/improve the keyboard on the 2018 model.

------
i0n1
I had the same problem with the 'b' key double input on single press. I
started using a silicone transparent keyboard protection to prevent dust and
small crumbs coming in. So far it's great!

I know this is very frustrating, so give it a try. It shouldn't cost more than
10-20$ and it's totally worth the price imho.

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lincolnq
yup, about once every other month a random key stops working reliably on my
touch bar macbook pro. it's a bad bad keyboard. the key seems to fix itself
after a few days though, so no brokenness seems to have been permanent but it
freaked me out and then pissed me off each time.

------
entee
Doesn't Apple have a ton of in-house engineers that use their hardware every
day and therefore must have these problems as well? Shouldn't they fix them if
only to keep their engineers from the pain?

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TausAmmer
I have macbook from 2007 something. I changed battery once, works fine.

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moltar
Just under a year of ownership and paint somehow scratched off the command
key. Now the backlight is shining thru the crack. So bad!

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petercooper
It's a shame because _other_ than the keyboard, the latest MacBook Pro has
been my favorite by far. I can't give it up as I'd find losing the 99% of good
stuff too annoying and may just buy another one and put a keyboard cover on it
straight away..

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merb
well the MBP 15" Pro Late 2013 also has a dust problem. Because it slows down
if you don't clean it up regulary because there is not a lot of ways to get
heat out of the thin layer.

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nottorp
Is the non emoji keyboard on the current MBPros identical (read: as shitty) as
the one on the emoji models?

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mozumder
I tried switching away from Apple but can't.

I went from a 2011 17" MacBook Pro (so good.. just too big) to an HP Spectre
x360 with 4k display, which was apparently a top-reviewed laptop.

The HP would be great if it didn't have such a shitty touchpad, where there's
a section that's always for right-clicking, even if you try to turn that off.
(It resets after every OS patch).

I went back to my 17" MacBook Pro. It's still just too good. I may switch to
the newer MacBook Pro models if they get the keyboard issue figured out.

And then there's the entire Unix development environment that's perfect on
Macs..

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Lionsion
I'm glad they were still selling the old version, which the old keyboard and
old USB ports, when my girlfriend and I got ours.

