
BlackBox - gregorymichael
https://www.blackbox.cool
======
oftenwrong
Yet another HN title that says nothing about what lies on the other side of
the link.

"BlackBox: a new shipping company from the creators of Cards Against Humanity"

Isn't that just a bit more descriptive?

~~~
biztos
For a second there I was _really_ hoping it was a return of the Blackbox
Window Manager.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blackbox](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blackbox)

~~~
Cerium
Me too! I use Blackbox for Windows (bbzero) in my Windows 7 machine. It works
well once set up, have to put apps in launcher and add to desktop menu.

------
scandox
"..without publishers or bloodsucking middlemen taking most of the money..."

Obviously publishers and bloodsucking middlemen are more or less synonymous in
this sentence. I'm on the board of a publishing company and have also worked
as an agent (a true bloodsucker).

Two things:

1\. In a practical sense it is easy to see publishers and agents as
bloodsucking middlemen. Once you've actually worked with lots of creators and
artists what you learn is that there'a very good reason for the middlemen.
Artists do not generally wish to have too much to be doing with their public -
especially not in a commercial sense. In the end of the day Publishers and
Agents give writers the thing they really need most: faith. It sounds like
corny bull - hell it is corny bull...but it's also incredibly important.

2\. I remember reading a great article about Fintech startups trying to "cut
out the middleman" and it had a great observation in it: the middleman is
there because the two parties don't trust each other - not because they're
stupid. I always think of that when I hear people trying this approach.

~~~
benjamincburns
#2 is soo spot on. As somewhat of a professional middleman (I'm an engineering
manager) I find quite often I've maximized the value I can provide when I've
negotiated away this distrust and effectively put myself out of a job. It
sounds a bit silly if you say it that way, but connecting people who wouldn't
have otherwise connected and getting them to play nice with one another when
they may not have otherwise done so is really quite rewarding and definitely
quite necessary.

------
qwtel
It seems like a cool company and much needed as well, but I'm a bit puzzled by
the political rhetoric mixed into the marketing page. It's not even that
there's politics involved at all (after all you could make the argument that
Tesla/SpaceX are like that as well), it's just how short-sighted it is.

Ignoring for a moment that the "bloodsucking middleman" of today were the hot
new shit in their time, what other than innocent looking gifs do we have in
way of them not becoming bloodsuckers themselves, once or if they reach a
position with that kind of pricing power? It's easy to act all nice when you
don't have a choice anyway...

Also, the company shipping the product from the producer to the customer seems
pretty "in the middle" to me, no matter their size or political ideas.

~~~
BHSPitMonkey
These are the makers of Cards Against Humanity you're talking about; it's
simply their sense of humor.

~~~
qwtel
that would make sense...

------
gsmethells
For a second there I thought the Window Manager Blackbox had risen from the
dead.
[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blackbox](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blackbox)

~~~
destructionator
I love Blackbox and still use it today, though I privately maintain my own
fork with a few bug fixes and hacks for my personal preferences. Best WM I
have ever used.

~~~
karim
I'm interested --- is your fork public?

~~~
destructionator
Not really. I made a github thing for it but I don't push often and a lot of
my changes have hard coded hacks for things I like but prolly wouldn't apply
to others (like I use an xrandr setup but rarely actually use the second
monitor except for youtubes etc., so I hacked "full screen" and "switch
monitor" to use those coordinates based on my setup.)

------
Animats
Oh, it's a fulfillment house. There are lots of companies which do that,
including Amazon and UPS. The site seems to be addressed to people who don't
know that. Nice art, though.

Not to be confused with "blackbox.com", which sells networking accessories.

~~~
sgentle
It may be that they are functionally identical to other fulfilment companies,
but if they do a better job of convincing their indie seller target market to
use them and respond better to their needs, it probably doesn't matter.

> Oh, it's team chat. There are lots of companies which do that, including
> HipChat and Campfire. The site seems to be addressed to people who don't
> know that. Nice UI, though.

> Not to be confused with "slackware.com", which is a Linux distribution.

~~~
joshkpeterson
Exactly. And if people are curious about the type of pain that might drive
people to a service like this, they can read about episodes like:

>"After fighting through FedEx's rigorous claim process they declared that the
package is not valuable beyond the cost of the paper it took to create this
handcrafted, original artwork," Scofield and Shuey wrote. "Even though the
package was insured, they aren't willing to pay the full $6,000 it cost to
create the intricate set and are only covering the cost of the materials."

[http://slog.thestranger.com/slog/archives/2014/12/17/fedex-l...](http://slog.thestranger.com/slog/archives/2014/12/17/fedex-
loses-enormous-hand-cut-setpiece-in-zoe-scofield-and-juniper-shueys-latest-
show)

~~~
whamlastxmas
I side with FedEx on this and it makes perfect sense. I doubt blackbox would
handle it any differently.

The problem is that $6000 is just an arbitrary price made up by a single
person. There's nothing stopping me from drawing a stick figure, saying I
charge $1 million for the labor that goes into this drawing, shipping+insuring
it for a ton of money, then attempting to convince FedEx it was damaged during
shipping to claim my money.

Additionally, FedEx did tremendously more than just pay for the materials. A
piece of Tyvek like that costs a few dollars, they paid out $1000 for it.

------
elliotpage
Tried to give this a go (It sounds cool and shipping that scales is a massive
pain) but the $5 press kit has $33 shipping to the UK! Guess this won't be
solving my shipping problems after all.

~~~
devitalizer
$61 to ship $5 press kit to Latvia. And takes a couple of weeks to do.

------
jseip
Immediately hit 'inspect element' on bb-animated-header

~~~
dpcan
That's one gnarly gif. Did the same thing.

~~~
nielsbot
Wonder if it's this guy's work:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Robertson_(animator)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Robertson_\(animator\))

~~~
nielsbot
It is:
[http://probertson.tumblr.com/image/149391046309](http://probertson.tumblr.com/image/149391046309)

------
magic5227
5% retail price? That seems quite steep.

I've personally shipped 1,000+ gifts for Kickstarter backers, I'd suggest
using Easypost.com unless you really need a warehouse. It's super cheap.

~~~
danpalmer
EasyPost aren't a "3PL" (third party logistics provider) though, just a layer
on top of shipping companies. Warehouse space and people's time is expensive,
that's what you're paying for. Even then, if you're just fulfilling a
kickstarter campaign, the tools that the shipping companies provide for small-
scale dispatch are plenty.

------
RobertLong
I really thought this was going to be my favorite yet evil puzzle game
Blackbox. [http://blackboxpuzzles.com/](http://blackboxpuzzles.com/)

~~~
function_seven
Just downloaded and started playing it. This game is fun, weird, and I can
already see frustration in my future.

ROT01 spoiler:

When I had to [ivou epxo nz ifbeqipoft] I knew this game meant business :)

~~~
Cogito
pedantic, but isn't that ROT25?

I helped beta test blackbox, was really fun and the developer was fun to work
with for the few pieces of feedback I had.

~~~
ryanmcleod
Hah yep. And once again I learn that I don't know the alphabet as well as
you'd think!

Thank _you_ for the help Cogito! FYI: New beta is going out soon ;)

~~~
function_seven
Oh, so _you 're_ the one responsible for me tossing my phone about and abusing
it in ways it was not intended to be used?

I'm on Stage 3 of [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kübler-
Ross_model](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kübler-Ross_model) right now,
pleading with the stupid lights to respond.

Seriously, this game is fantastic and frustrating. Good job.

------
lelandbatey
This seems like an interesting service, but I want too toss out a suggestion
for those looking to disseminate info about a product or service:

Tell me a story.

More specifically, use a hypothetical story to provide context and an example
of why the hell I'm reading your page. This is the explanatory copy on this
page:

 _Our mission is to help you sell and ship stuff directly to your fans for a
fraction of the cost and effort of doing it yourself. Blackbox works like a
co-op: if we all go in together, we get the cheapest pricing, the fastest
shipping, and the best service. The shipping is fast. We pay your sales tax.
You can customize the packaging and the inserts. It’s pretty great._

At the end of this, I still am confused about what you do. What would help is
a hypothetical use case and narative, and to demonstrate that, I'll invent
one:

 _Let 's say you're running a Kickstarter. You're a domain expert who's built
something awesome, and you've even successfully kickstarted a project to build
what you love. Now though, after having built all these gizmos you need to
ship those to your backers, and this is something you're NOT an expert in.
Looking in to shipping, you see it's going to involve complicated contracts
and procedures to ship your gizmo at any scale, and at a cost that FAR exceeds
your back of the envelope calculation of price and effort. You wish there
where some simple shipping service where you only worry about the packaging,
and they handle picking up from the manufacturer, storage, and shipping; a
service with straightforward pricing, and customer service oriented at helping
someone with your needs and your scale._

 _That 's where BlackBox comes in. Our mission is to help you sell and ship
stuff directly to your fans for a fraction of the cost and effort of doing it
yourself. Blackbox works like a co-op: if we all go in together, we get the
cheapest pricing, the fastest shipping, and the best service. The shipping is
fast. We pay your sales tax. You can customize the packaging and the inserts.
It’s pretty great._

I don't know if the above story accurately represents what it is that BlackBox
provides, but I hope you can see that having a story helps a reader answer the
question of "is this helpful or relevant to my situation or goals?".

~~~
cormacrelf
Personally I think it's fairly obvious from the first sentence what it does.
It's blunt and to the point, kinda like how the service seems to operate. I
enjoyed how efficiently and clearly the whole thing came across.

------
kajecounterhack
Sounds to me like yet another fulfillment service but maybe they take care of
more? Anyone know how it compares to fulfilled by Amazon or what comparable
services exist? I'm curious to know if it's cheaper or just easier. (Or both,
or neither!)

~~~
blazespin
it's a freakin co-op!

~~~
icefox
Yeah so what does that really mean and how will it be cheaper than using some
other distributor?

------
hartror
Who is the pixel artist?

~~~
eigenbom
Paul Robertson -- one of the best pixel artists of this era.

~~~
hartror
Ah I suspected as much. A local Melbourne boy.

~~~
eigenbom
Yep! We've got lots of great artists here. I met him once, shortly after he
did the Simpsons intro piece.

------
tux1968
Presumably you have to pay to ship all your inventory to them in the first
place. Didn't see any mention of that in the details.

~~~
fisherjeff
I'd assume you'd just have your finished product drop shipped to their
fulfillment center.

------
paulrosenzweig
So is this Gumroad but for physical goods? The sales flow is similarly out of
your hands, but it's super easy to set up.

------
Everlag
I'm interested to see how 'We pay your sales tax' works out.

Also, should there be an epilepsy warning for the header?

~~~
ajdlinux
That sounds like an... interesting accounting challenge. Are they actually
paying sales tax on behalf of the vendor, or are they paying sales tax in
their own name and acting as the legal retail seller?

~~~
wierdaaron
They're handling the CC processing and the whole checkout flow, too. It's not
so much a shipping company as a "sell stuff online" company. I don't get why
they're presenting themselves that way.

~~~
kennywinker
I'd guess because there are a lot of "sell stuff online" companies, but most
of them leave it up to you to handle the shipping.

------
empressplay
$35 shipping to Canada for a box of fortune cookies. Pass.

Unless you _only_ want to sell stuff inside the US. Then it's okay.

------
justrossthings
These guys spent more time on animating their team portraits than explaining
their product

~~~
culturestate
As a person who needs this kind of thing, I immediately understood what they
do and the value they provide. I think the messaging is quite well directed at
their target while staying within the CAH brand.

------
voltagex_
$50.75 US to ship to Australia.

~~~
cormacrelf
Depends on the item. Looks like the press kit's kinda large, because buying a
cool little pin from Max Temkin
([http://maxistentialism.com](http://maxistentialism.com)) says $10 for
shipping.

------
kdamken
I saw the TLD and thought to myself, "What a silly thing to end your url with.
This better be one badass website".

Then I opened the page and saw that gif, and they totally redeemed themselves!
Very mesmerizing.

------
brunorsini
[https://shotput.com](https://shotput.com) is a YC company also doing
fulfillment. It seems focused at slightly larger customers though.

------
aetherspawn
This needs an NSFW tag, like, when you open this page and your monitor starts
psychedelically flashing, everyone turns around and stares at you to shame.

------
dutchbrit
I actually saw the animated header and clicked the back button thinking it was
just a gif and no actual page (until I read the comments).

------
felipemesquita
Shipping the promotional material package to Brazil is quite expensive and
deliver date format is a bit confusing. Looks great for orders placed within
the US, though.

Regular Shipping Delivers 2/9-9/9 $43.25

------
skeltoac
I'm just going to watch that gif all day now. Thanks.

------
davnn
I always wonder about the conversion metrics when I see an artistic website
like that. I think the website would perform better without that huge header.

------
cercatrova
So like Massdrop but for any arbitrary product?

~~~
kajecounterhack
More like 1 big massdrop for specifically seller's shipping & fulfillment
costs (vs paying full price for shipping, negotiating fulfillment deals
yourself, or paying amazong to do it).

------
daxfohl
Lost me at 1489167 -> 1489280 -.>

F5

1489167 -> 1489280 -.>

At least _pretend_ to get your realtime data right before posting on HN.

~~~
wingerlang
They seems to link the stuff to this
[https://cdn.blackbox.cool/uploads/json/boxes_shipped.json](https://cdn.blackbox.cool/uploads/json/boxes_shipped.json)

Perhaps they do sent the real number, but it is being cached by the CDN?

~~~
daxfohl
Even if that's the awesomest tech available, the "realtime update" is so fake
and so immediately identifiable as such and so immediately confirmable as such
(and the most eye-drawing component of their homepage!) that the company loses
all credibility. Without knowing anything else about them, it's a pretty bad
indicator.

~~~
davnn
Do you really think people care that much about the counter?

------
dlevine
I believe that they were responsible for delivering the Exploding Kittens
Kickstarter.

------
brakmic
Some clickbaits deserve more than just a single "downvote".

------
blazespin
It's the sharing economy hitting creating companies. it's about freaking
time...

------
homero
That would go well with bitcoin

------
hazelnut
seems to be down

~~~
ryanlol
Works fine from London.

------
yAnonymous
"Quality and simplicity are more important than saving a few pennies on
shipping. Our price includes the beautiful Blackbox checkout button, our real-
time dashboard, and our dedicated customer support team."

"Artists own the relationship with their customers and can talk to them
whenever and however they want. That relationship works best without
bloodsucking businessmen in the middle."

Right.

------
stevenwiles
"BlackBox: The makers of Cards Against Humanity do another stupid thing and
get paid lots of money for it"

^ that is a much more accurate title

------
jethro_tell
That intro. Seems like they are selling headaches not shipping.

~~~
shash7
I agree its a bit in your face but it does a good job of getting your
attention instead of making it look like another garden variety slap-stick
startup web template.

------
Whostasay
Wow, what an offensive website! First thing I do when I visit websites like
that is to close the tab.

Hope they aren't a business. The horrible pixel art from 1980s doesn't help.

~~~
Trufa
I actually came here to comment on how amazing it looks, truly well done and
captivating.

