
Python support in Visual Studio 2017 - happy-go-lucky
https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/pythonengineering/2017/02/22/python-in-vs2017/
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symlinkk
Official support for Python, Node, and Docker in Visual Studio. Full Linux
shell on Windows. You know how almost every developer has a Macbook? I think
that might change.

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roryisok
Can someone explain to me what Linux shell has over powershell that makes it
so indispensable for developers? I'm a developer and I don't use Linux. I'm
dual booting Ubuntu at the moment because I want to get more familiar with
Linux, but I can't see how terminal/bash is so much better?

~~~
pjmlp
Not much, other than UNIX kind of workflows.

I use Microsoft products since MS-DOS 3.3 and my path into UNIX was via Xenix
and DG/UX, before GNU/Linux was a thing.

Being a developer doesn't mean using UNIX, rather producing software with
whatever tools our employer uses for producing business value.

Powershell is much better concept for a CLI, taken from Lisp and Smalltalk
REPLs than a pure UNIX shell.

~~~
terminalcommand
IMHO powershell resembles more smalltalk than lisp.

Trying to write powershell scripts without the ISE (Interactive Scripting
Environment) is very hard.

Also powershell is not suitable to just open and "bash" thigs out at it. For
example to download a file, you need to remember the corresponding .net
package. Or to list a directory, you use -without the alias- get-child-item
etc.

I think the verb+noun syntax and the ability to use all .net packages are
awesome. But you first need to do your research, find the modules, look up the
required parameters, put those in a file etc.

In bash, most linux users just "bash" things out, if you don't know something
no problem, you just "man" that.

Although the same thing could potentially established with powershell through
aliases and extra binaries/scripts for utilities like diff/curl, powershell in
its nature is a different beast.

I really like powershell, writing scripts with the ISE and the object oriented
design are really powerful. That's why I think powershell resembles smalltalk
rather than lisp.

In order to write powershell comfortably and efficiently you need to use its
development environment with GUI.

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pjmlp
I agree with you, just I don't get " powershell resembles more smalltalk than
lisp." part.

While FOSS Lisp environments are pretty bare bones text CLIs, that is not how
Lisp should like since Xerox PARC, TI and Genera days.

Sadly Lisp IDEs are all commercial, but the experience is pretty much
Smalltalk like, or even better, given that they also AOT to native code.

~~~
terminalcommand
I was never aware of the existence of a Lisp implementation with an IDE.

Now I see that there is. The two lisp books I read (Paul Graham's ANSI Common
Lisp and gigamonkey - Practical commmon lisp) always used text editors.

Whereas for smalltalk I installed a VM (scratch) that included a GUI.

And also even in an old issue(80s?) of Byte magazine dedicated to smalltalk
there were extensive toolings with GUI.
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7052479](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7052479)

"By resembling smalltalk" I wanted to mean that the user needs to interact
with a development environment to get the full benefits of powershell. And
that this is in its nature.

Nevertheless, I stand corrected. I never knew that there were lisp
implementations designed to work with an IDE.

~~~
pjmlp
You never heard of Lisp Machines or Mac Common Lisp?

Lisp stop being based on text mode environments in the late 70's, when it
moved out of mainframes into systems with graphical displays.

Many of the Smalltalk ideas were inspired from Interlisp-D, the Lisp
workstations used at Xerox PARC.

Text mode environments for Lisp is a GNU/Linux thing.

If you wish I can provide some links.

~~~
terminalcommand
I had heard of lisp machines as a term, but none of the others mentioned in
your comment.

Thanks for pointing out, I'll do some research on this topic.

If you have links easily accesible to you, I'd appreciate them, if not no
problem at all.

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madhusharma
Thanks for the info mate !!!!

