
“Get Out of Jail Free” Cards in New York - pjc50
http://marginalrevolution.com/marginalrevolution/2018/01/get-jail-free-cards.html
======
gfodor
These have been around forever, I grew up in NJ and a friend's father was a
cop so he had one. Definitely a corrupt thing that should be eliminated. A few
dynamics I remember:

\- many cops saw PBA cards as corrupt and insulting. So the rule of thumb was
you never offered these, you just let the card be visible when reaching for
your license. If the cop was in on it they'd then ask you about where you got
the card. It was a huge no-no to offer it not just because some cops didn't
take it but because even those who would could probably be offended by you not
deferring to their authority to decide to ask about it (ie offer to give you a
pass) or for being entitled. The net dynamic you wanted was the cop to of his
own volition see the card and decide if he wanted to cut you a break since he
knew you were connected to the police somehow. (Ie, total corrupt dynamic)

\- a big variable was if they took the card or let you keep it. If you were a
son or daughter of a cop you probably never got it taken. Otherwise you'd get
it taken if you would have otherwise gotten a ticket. If you were just being
pulled over for no good reason they'd probably not take the card from you so
you could "use" it again.

\- these were not gonna get you out of trouble if you did something more than
speeding, talking on a cell, etc. If you ran a light or stop sign it was
borderline. If you committed a felony or were drunk etc then flashing your PBA
card probably would have made your life worse.

~~~
mc32
Worse than the PBA stories is hearing about the diplomatic immunity
shenanigans all sorts of members of a diplomatic family would get away with.

Not sure how much was true and how much was exaggerated, but some were eye
opening.

~~~
kbenson
You might find this inderesting, _Cultures of Corruption: Evidence From
Diplomatic Parking Tickets_ [1]. Apparently, there's a fairly good correlation
(if I remember correctly, but the article, or at least a summary, is there to
check) between cultures with a lot of corruption and unpaid parking tickets
from their diplomats in NY.

1: [http://www.nber.org/papers/w12312](http://www.nber.org/papers/w12312)

~~~
aglionby
Interestingly Transport for London claims that the US embassy owes them ~£12
million in unpaid congestion charge fees, which exist as a disincentive to
drive in central London. The embassy claim it's a form of taxation and as such
they are exempt -- unsurprisingly TfL disagree. For context the next highest
amounts supposedly owed are by Japan, Nigeria, Russia and India.

[http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/us-embassy-
congestion_...](http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/us-embassy-
congestion_uk_5a58d331e4b02cebbfdb3e8e)

~~~
bwilliams18
Well if we successfully get a Congestion Charged passed in NYC the UK
consulate here can just offset charges with the US embassy in London.

~~~
roywiggins
Parking fines:

[http://time.com/3421587/diplomats-parking-tickets-new-
york/](http://time.com/3421587/diplomats-parking-tickets-new-york/)

------
untog
This is terrible, of course. Goes without saying. But what really interests me
that police officers are complaining about not having enough of these cards to
give out as Christmas presents. Complaining in public, in the clear light of
day!

That actually worries me more than the cards themselves in some respects,
because it means that the average officer's perception of what is fair is
utterly, entirely out of whack with reality. It's one, corrupt, thing for
these cards to exist under the radar as a means for officers to benefit, but
it's another to not even see why people would be offended by it.

~~~
imglorp
Police should believe in the Rule of Law, capitalized like this, as their
prime directive. Cards say otherwise, and that's the offensive part.

~~~
jay_kyburz
Yeah, the friends and family of a cop caught speeding should pay the fine
because they should know better.

Take these cards away and give the cops a massive pay rise. They are not paid
enough to deal with the shit they have to every day.

~~~
bradleyjg
How much in total compensation exactly do you think a say a ten year veteran
of the NYPD should make in a year all in (i.e. including all shift
differentials, uniform allowances, overtime, health care and other fringe
benefits, as well as the net present value of the 1/20th of expected
retirement benefits)?

What’s your estimate of the current average total amount?

~~~
jay_kyburz
I have no idea, but some quick googling tells me they currently earn around
100k.

I guess I was trying to say that even at twice that it doesn't sound like a
good deal to me.

Edit: I guess your comment suggests you think they are paid fairly. Are you
cop? Would you consider a career with the NYPD give current compensation?

~~~
bradleyjg
If you think $200k in total compensation is fair, then good news. They get
more than that.

As for the second part, I regret not getting a job with the NYPD out of high
school. If I had, I’d be just about ready to start collecting a six figure
pension (I’m in my late 30s).

~~~
wallace_f
Police work would not even make a list as one of the top 10 most dangerous
commonly-held jobs.

Also, the grandparent's comment may be true for at least a percentage of the
workforce:

[https://techcrunch.com/2016/10/03/police-complaints-
drop-93-...](https://techcrunch.com/2016/10/03/police-complaints-
drop-93-percent-after-deploying-body-cameras/)

~~~
Spooky23
Usually those stats focus on deaths or shootings, which have fallen as crime
has decreased and cars have gotten safer.

But, if you look at workplace injury and sickness, police don’t do well. They
have higher incidence of heart disease, higher probability of auto accident
injury, and other issues. It’s a tough gig.

~~~
wallace_f
Heart disease? It'll be hard to pin that one solely on police work, and not on
lifestyle choices.

~~~
selectodude
Cops have very high rates of alcoholism. Just because they're not getting shot
at doesn't mean they're not dealing with the worst society has to offer.

~~~
wallace_f
Discrimination and self-selection also exists among police. They intentionally
hire those with low IQs:
[https://www.google.com/amp/abcnews.go.com/amp/US/court-
oks-b...](https://www.google.com/amp/abcnews.go.com/amp/US/court-oks-barring-
high-iqs-cops/story%3fid=95836)

That is not to say there aren't honorable and amazing police officera who deal
with the worst of society; but our policing force has serious problems beyond
even the unbelievably awful militarization and race discrimination.

~~~
goialoq
124 is not a "low" IQ.

------
pradn
Related: [https://priceonomics.com/can-you-buy-a-license-to-
speed/](https://priceonomics.com/can-you-buy-a-license-to-speed/)

"The answer is the state highway patrol -- the men and women that most people
interact with only when getting ticketed for speeding. A number of the frames
read “CHP 11-99 Foundation,” which is the full name of a charitable
organization that supports California Highway Patrol officers and their
families in times of crisis. Along with engraved mugs, jackets, and leather
wallets, the foundation gives out the license plate frames as tokens of thanks
to donors who become “Lifetime Members.” Donors receive one license plate as
part of a $2,500 “Classic” level donation, or two as part of a bronze, silver,
or gold level donation of $5,000, $10,000, or $25,000."

~~~
kbenson
Sounds like someone could make a pretty penny selling duplicates, and possibly
also eventually flood the market enough as to make the identifier useless.
Make money while helping fight corruption. ;)

~~~
bri3d
Linked in the article from the grandparent post as well:

[https://forum.officer.com/forum/local-discussion-
groups/u-s-...](https://forum.officer.com/forum/local-discussion-groups/u-s-
states/california/127746-the-fake-11-99-plate-frames-are-out-of-control)

These have been a thing for years, are so readily knocked off as to be
irrelevant, and make many officers angry.

For a while the 11-99 "get out of jail" idea required you also pass your
membership card under the license (like the NY cards listed) but I haven't
heard of an officer even considering letting someone off because of 11-99 in a
long time (sourced entirely from the other side - spending a lot of time at
car meets and on auto forums).

~~~
TaylorGood
You register your cars with CHP on top of the membership card. It merely
starts with a license plate frame. If you say you’re a member they’re able to
look it up. Lying about that whilst pulled over is a bad look..

~~~
koolba
Is the registration part of the CHP core system or is the cop looking you up
using a private cell phone?

------
nitemice
As someone living outside America, the thing that makes this seem the most
unreal to me is the fact I've never seen it on any TV show.

Like, there are plenty of shows about/involving (fictional) police and
corruption, looking the other way, giving someone a free pass, etc. but I
don't remember ever seeing any where someone used a card like this.

Does anyone know of any? Or is it some sort of open secret that Hollywood has
just agreed not to talk about?

~~~
warent
I'm an American (born and raised) and this is the first I've heard of it

~~~
mieseratte
South Carolinian - we don't, insofar as I'm aware, have the PBA card but it's
a common enough thing to see folks with the local equivalent, a sticker, given
for donating to the local PBA group on the lower-left hand corner of the rear
windshield, such that an officer would see it when walking up to the window.

Now I have no idea of it's efficacy, but I've bumped into a few folks who
swear by it. Like the card it would be good for, at best, a warning on a
speeding ticket or another basic moving violating. Of course I've gotten the
same treatment by simply being respectful to the ticketing officer, so who
knows? As gfodor mentioned[0], there are likely certain dynamics to the
situation and I can imagine an officer seeing that as too on-the-chin.

[0] -
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16208934](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16208934)

~~~
JauntTrooper
Virginia has a sticker as well.

------
ryankupyn
The most frustrating thing about this is that these aren't even official
government cards (they're issued by the union instead), so it's harder to
crack down on them through your elected officials.

Even if you banned cards (and I'm not sure you could), unions might just shift
to making "Police Benevolent Association Family Member" license plate frames -
or any other token. I think the most efficient way to solve this might be to
have the law fall more lightly on everyone - reducing the benefits to
connected citizens relative to the their less fortunate neighbors.

~~~
bradleyjg
It’s plenty easy to crack down on them. It’s conspiracy to commit wire fraud
of the intangible right to honest services variety. That’s a RICO predicate.
The entire corrupt PBA organization could be rolled up. It won’t be, but it
could, and should be. Just need a US Attorney for SDNY or EDNY with the
stomach for taking on the Blue Wall.

~~~
solomatov
IANAL, but AFAIK, SCOTUS pared down honest services fraud.
[http://www.scotusblog.com/2010/06/honest-services-law-
pared-...](http://www.scotusblog.com/2010/06/honest-services-law-pared-down/)

------
blairbeckwith
I had an ex-girlfriend who was a professional athlete who had one of these
that was “given to her by a friend”. She had told me a number of things that
seemed like either lies or the result of being severely misinformed, so I
always kind of rolled my eyes whenever she mentioned it and assumed it wasn’t
real. She even called it this - a “get out of jail free card”.

Anyways, have been able to witness their use since, and it’s pretty shocking
how easy and effective it is to use. Really disgusting practice.

------
turc1656
_" A Christmas gift of institutionalized corruption."_

Perfectly stated. That's precisely what these cards are - a physical token of
nepotism and what I refer to as the "blue wall of bullshit". I had a very
close friend offer me one of those Gold cards for family members once (his
Uncle gave him one and his family is small and thus had extras). I told him to
keep it because even if I could use it to get out of a ticket, I'd rather take
the fine and keep my morality in tact. Plus, given my belief on these cards, I
doubt I could even muster the gall to present one. I mean, honestly, how
arrogant does a human being have to be to present that card when stopped by an
officer, expecting that the officer is going to basically be like "Aw shucks,
guess my hands are tied. Please try not to do that again."

~~~
cjalmeida
Cops have a lot of discretionary power and, unfortunately, operates with very
little information at hand. If you're for any reason in a "bad" neighborhood,
specially if you're non-white having one of those may be the difference
between a stop and go, or spending a few hours in a precinct.

------
Faaak
Coming from France, this seems completely unreal to me. Here, we've got three
types of "police":

"police municipale", which is paid by the city and has got very small rights

"police nationale" and "gendarmerie", which belong to the country, and have
got "full rights".

Here, you can't give donations to the force, and I can't event believe the
implication of such cards; it seems so "third world". It makes me afraid when
municipal police are given more rights (carrying a firearm, …) as they are
much more entangled with the mayor, the city, and the local people. The
gendarmerie for example all live in barracks and serve a bigger area. I would
think that they are less prone to corruption.

~~~
Y_Y
To me it seems that having gendarmes with big guns wandering around is very
third world and the civilised thing to do is have unarmed police like in
Ireland. Our police are mildly corrupt, but at least they don't shoot people.

~~~
jankotek
Instead Ireland has soldiers with assault rifles. They guard banks, shops
etc... I prefer civil police.

~~~
dmurray
The army occasionally escort trucks full of cash. I've never seen a soldier
here guarding a shop or a bank.

~~~
HumanDrivenDev
> I've never seen a soldier here guarding a shop or a bank.

As an anecdote - I have. It was somewhere in the southwest about 15 years ago.

------
ocdtrekkie
I suspect what works similarly is law enforcement charity license plates. Here
in Illinois, about six of these are related to police charitable organizations
or foundations:
[http://www.cyberdriveillinois.com/departments/vehicles/licen...](http://www.cyberdriveillinois.com/departments/vehicles/license_plate_guide/licenseplates.html)
(See the CP, PO, IP, HF, SO, and LE plates.)

While they may list being active or retired police, or a family member, for
eligibility, they also clearly state that any individual or corporate donor
can qualify, and that _all people who qualify for the plate must be donors_.
So in reality, being law enforcement or family is irrelevant: You must be a
donor to get the plate, and that's all that matters.

Willing to bet you won't get pulled over for minor infractions with any of
those plates on your car.

~~~
williamscales
Something similar exists in California with the 11-99 foundation (associated
with the Highway Patrol). Donors receive a license plate frame and I have
heard rumors that cars with those license plate frames are not likely to be
ticketed.

------
yongjik
Why limit the number of cards? If I were to really piss off these nice folks,
I'd issue a million copies and pile them in front of a busy Metro station.

(Of course, if I were a politician that will be a sure way to lose my next
election, I guess.)

~~~
f2n
The picture doesn't make it look too difficult to reproduce, why don't you
just print a bunch of cards? That was my first thought upon seeing these.

~~~
lbotos
1\. Cards are issued based on locality. 2\. Cards are signed by the issuing
officer. 3\. Cards are meant to be used in a local community, where the
ticketing officer recognizes the signee.

Source: Had my share of these cards. (Never used one)

~~~
f2n
1\. Okay so print out a bunch for your locality

2\. How much validation of signature is there? Do other police officers
memorize each others signatures? That seems unlikely

3\. I'm sure it'd be pretty easy to get a list of a large number of police
officers for any given locality.

------
Yizahi
Ahaha - [https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/theerant/any-mta-pd-
ota-t798...](https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/theerant/any-mta-pd-
ota-t79839.html)

So many entitled corrupt a$$holes in that thread. And they even call people
doing their jobs "tools", lol. Totally disconnected from reality.

~~~
poutrathor
> MTA is similar to the U.S. Govt it's a criminal organization. Theft is from
> commuters every day and passed on through outrageous salaries and pensions.

o m g

------
workthrowaway27
These are real, but they're not really get out of jail free cards. More like
get out of a speeding ticket or get out of running a red light cards. Another
thing that works is to be a nurse or fireman.

~~~
qwerty456127
"get out of jail" would make more sense. Jailing can happen to be
questionable, speeding or running a red light can't, it's simple and forbidden
for a serious yet easy to understand and hard to argue reason.

~~~
djsumdog
I did get out of a red light (I honestly though I cleared it, but maybe just
barely) and I do think it had to do with the PBA sticker on the back of my
car. It was just a regular civilian donation sticker.

------
patrickmay
The correct response to showing one of these cards should be "Oh, so you know
the law and you still broke it? Maximum fine for you."

~~~
geofft
That makes them a traitor cop, with the same (well-documented) negative
effects on their career as to cops who report on corruption in their
department, cops who enforce laws against other cops, etc.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_wall_of_silence](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_wall_of_silence)

------
fvrghl
Ultimately, this is the result of a lack of accountability by the police to
the people.

Call your representatives and demand that police make information such as the
number of stops, arrests, and reasons for cause public. You'd be surprised at
how much resistance you will encounter when trying to find these numbers.

------
josefdlange
My father got one of these from an officer he befriended in Chicago. It had
the officer's name and badge number on it, and my understanding is that the
officer who gives out one of these cards is willing to put his or her
reputation on the line as a reference for the recipient of the card.

The gravity of that gesture seems to be altogether lost with the people
described in this article.

------
harlanji
Knowing that cops will arrest on regular traffic stops if it's too cold for a
breathalyzer, creating an arrest record and thus creating challenges to
employment etc, makes this all the more gruesome to learn about.

------
68c12c16
I just found one on ebay...for only 10 dollars; and shipping is 2 dollars for
US domestic destination...

[https://www.ebay.com/itm/PATROLMENS-BENEVOLENT-
ASSOCIATION-Y...](https://www.ebay.com/itm/PATROLMENS-BENEVOLENT-ASSOCIATION-
YONKERS-NEW-YORK-BRASS-BLUE-AND-GOLD-TRIM/292415199723)

The product description says it's obsolete but I don't see any invalidation
cut or mark on the badge...seems to be still legit...

Not sure if there is one available for other states...

------
jeffyee
I recently found one of these in a car's glove box and couldn't believe it
implied it was a "Get out of jail free" card. Even seems to imply it has an
expiration date given the years written on it.

Here's a picture of it: [https://imgur.com/a/0TpcY](https://imgur.com/a/0TpcY)

------
dang
Another article here: [http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-
canada-42780382](http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-42780382), via
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16208884](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16208884)

------
EamonnMR
Sometimes I wonder if the worship of police and soldiers is an instinctual tug
towards the sort of warrior-caste that bronze age societies, for example, had.

------
thephyber
Cop in my family. Everything about the "blue wall" frustrates me to no end.

Instead of corrupt junk like this, I would much prefer what the US military
culture has evolved, recently covered on 99% Invisible[1].

A "get out of jail free" card is ridiculous on its face, but even worse, it's
effectively a joke which is extremely sobering if you think about it.

I have a cop in my family and I see what entitled attitudes are adopted by his
wife when she is pulled over for her illegally tinted windows and then acts
like she is too good to get a ticket because she is "in the club".

[1] [https://99percentinvisible.org/episode/coin-
check/](https://99percentinvisible.org/episode/coin-check/)

------
mrbill
I grew up in a law enforcement family. Stuff like this MIGHT get you out of a
speeding ticket at best - depending on just how fast you were going, your
attitude, and the mood of the officer that stopped you. Serious offenses meant
you were going to jail, period.

Here in Houston, you see people with a stack of "100 Club" stickers on their
back windows. A friend of mine who is a deputy for a nearby county said that
the bigger the stack, the more likely the driver is an ass and the more likely
they are to _get_ a ticket...

~~~
thephyber
> depending on just how fast you were going, your attitude, and the mood of
> the officer that stopped you

I agree with the assessment, but It frustrates me that only 1 of the 3
criteria have anything to do with the statutory law.

The rest has to do with prosecutorial discretion, which is the least objective
part of the law and opens up so many people to the "* privilege" criticisms
that are so common now.

------
rrdharan
An Audi RS6 used to park regularly in the commercial loading area right
outside my old apartment in Gramercy (17th and Irving).

It never got ticketed because it had “volunteer ambulance service” license
plates. Which apparently are a thing you can buy with a large enough donation:

[https://www.reddit.com/r/nyc/comments/1fojz9/can_people_with...](https://www.reddit.com/r/nyc/comments/1fojz9/can_people_with_vas_license_plates_park_anywhere/)

~~~
colanderman
Funny that no-one in that thread mentions the _actual_ problem with someone
parking in front of a hydrant (increases risk that they die in a fire due to
fire department being unable to quickly access it).

~~~
stevenwoo
Usually firefighters just run the hose through the car.

[https://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2014/04/10/boston-
firefigh...](https://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2014/04/10/boston-firefighters-
run-hose-through-car-parked-front-hydrant-east-boston-fire-
scene/U6jeEBScIhlW3YutCLPS8L/story.html)

~~~
colanderman
That's amazing.

------
tomaskafka
Hypothesis: USA is actually a richest third world country (with two first
world cities)

~~~
oliv__
Hypothesis: There are no first world countries, corruption is everywhere, the
only difference is the degree of subtlety

------
oneplane
I'm surprised about my lack of being surprised of this existing in (some parts
of) the USA. How can law enforcement function if it's not separated from
profit, greed or other common forms of influence?

~~~
thephyber
> How can law enforcement function

There are many critics that don't think it's possible. 40% of local city
budgets go towards "law enforcement" (the aggregate of police, prosecutors,
courts, and jails). Many rural sheriff departments are largely dependent upon
speed traps and "Civil Asset Forfeiture" confiscations of people just driving
through.

However, I don't consider the "get out of jail free" card as evidence of a
pay-to-play. There is no legal mechanism to enforce this, and in fact it's
probably illegal for a police officer to enforce it if the crime is
sufficiently problematic (there is always a little wiggle room with
"prosecutorial discretion").

Additionally, it's likely that any money raised goes towards a "charitable"
organization, as opposed to the police department's budget or directly into
the pockets of police officers.

------
ilamont
Friend went through the police academy run by the state police. One rule
verbally communicated to the cadets: Never, ever give another cop a ticket.

------
Sinnesloschen
FYI it looks like you can purchase one from the New York State Troopers:
[http://nystbenefitfund.org/index2.html](http://nystbenefitfund.org/index2.html)

Included in your purchase: You get some of the 2018 NYST Benefit Fund Window
Decals for your vehicles We issue you a NYST Benefit Fund Wallet Card with
assigned security ID code

------
cryptonector
Disgusting. Of course, if these got counterfeited to oblivion, the police
would just make an online system. This has to stop. The state legislatures
(and Congress!) need to step in. Judges lose credibility and may find
themselves forced to retire or resign -- judges should really never ever avail
themselves of this privilege.

Ultimately, the funding of police departments through fines needs to stop.
This one's on Bill Clinton, who added 100,000 police officers in 1993 by
having the U.S. government pick up the tab for two years. After those two
years local departments had to find a way to fund the new officers.

------
polyomino
Seems like an great candidate for something to counterfeit. Generate an
officer name/cell number pair for each card and then charge monthly for
someone to answer and say the card is real.

Since these are not strictly speaking legal anyway, there probably isn't much
recourse.

------
Shivetya
One would hope that with more body cameras and car mounted cameras that these
become impossible to use. As in make it a requirement that with every arrest
that any item presented during a stop must be captured by the camera, if not
discipline the officer

------
zpr
Live in NYC and can confirm these exist. A buddy of mine actually has acquired
several, and doesn't always use them on traffic stops, waiting for a "better
occasion".

------
taitems
Shit like this just makes me appreciate our state police force more. They
transparently tweet out every time a member of the force is fined for drink
driving, speeding etc, which is more often than not. Not saying they're
perfect, but it's something I'd like to see more of.
[https://twitter.com/VictoriaPolice/status/949795594603716608](https://twitter.com/VictoriaPolice/status/949795594603716608)

------
nashashmi
There is an equivalent to a PBA card and that is support the police union
charity kind. That gives some perks some times.

------
dawnerd
Seems pretty similar to fire fighters having special license plates/stickers.

~~~
turc1656
I thought those were so off-duty firefighters are able to respond to calls as-
needed, no? They usually have their personal vehicles outfitted with those
blue lights and the plates make it easy for any officers coming up behind them
to see that they are legit and didn't just buy the light on eBay so that they
could speed or do whatever on the road.

I could be wrong, but I am reasonably sure that's what those are for.

~~~
dawnerd
I know about those, but family cars, at least here, usually have some kind of
indicator they're a firefighter family.

------
Double_a_92
It's also called a "money bill" xD

------
gwbas1c
Oh, come on! No one needs these silly cards when name dropping works just as
well!

------
didsomeonesay
Also useful against speeding and parking tickets:
[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diplomatic_license_plates](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diplomatic_license_plates)

~~~
CobrastanJorji
That one makes more sense, though. Foreign diplomats basically can't be
charged with traffic crimes, and it's generally agreed internationally that
this is sort of okay. That's substantially different from a cabal of police
officers independently deciding to hand out "special treatment" tokens.

~~~
digi_owl
Still leads to family members of the diplomat trying to pull one. Not sure how
common it is vs the Hollywood depiction of same though.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diplomatic_immunity](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diplomatic_immunity)

Interesting chart at the bottom btw. Seems that in USA a diplomat or their
family can be issued traffic ticket, but can't be detained, prosecuted, or
have their residence searched.

------
beedogs
"ACAB" is a truism for a reason.

------
JoeAltmaier
If doctors help other medical professionals' family, the professional
courtesy. If a lawyer writes a will for a friend, that's just plain
neighborly.

If a cop respects another cop's family, that's suddenly corruption? I know;
law enforcement is different. But traffic tickets are not quite earth-shaking.
They're the flu-shot or will-writing equivalent.

Police face people every day, not very nice people, so we don't have to. Its a
great civilizing influence, both for criminals and for folks considering
potential vendettas, to know the police will handle it.

But to do their job, officers have to start from a solid foundation. They have
to know their families are safe and taken care of, like anybody else. That
their community respects them.

It's ethically questionable, of course. But so is writing a will for a friend,
or giving free flu shots to the neighbor's kids. Avoiding the expense (and
income tax!) and all that.

I've got way better, more important things to worry about than what's at
heart, a personal matter for law enforcement officers.

~~~
geofft
I do not understand your sense of ethics at all.

If the lawyer is in some way writing a will that benefits the friend more than
the other wills the lawyer writes, or (worse) benefits the lawyer, that's
unethical. If the lawyer is writing the will but just not charging, that
doesn't seem ethically questionable.

If the doctor is stealing flu shots from the clinic that could have gone to
people who couldn't pay for them except via insurance or another program, that
is definitely unethical. If the doctor ... happens to have flu shots lying
around? does this happen?? ... and has nothing else to do with them, healing
people is part of the doctor's mission.

Letting people go after they have committed a misdemeanor is _not_ part of a
police officer's mission. It's rather the opposite of it. If a lawyer takes up
a client's case, and argues weakly in court because the other side is a friend
of the lawyer's, that is absolutely unethical. If a doctor prescribes a
medication that the patient doesn't need because a family member works for the
pharmaceutical company, that is absolutely unethical. And _these things don 't
happen on a regular basis._

I'm sure that the doctor in your example would love to give flu shots to
everyone, or the lawyer would love to make sure everyone has a will - they
just don't have the time to write wills for everyone without pay. But the
situation with the cop is the opposite: the cop spends _less_ time _not_
pulling someone over. The cop does not have a limited amount of tickets they
can overlook; the cop actually has a limited amount of tickets they can write.
If the cop wants to give everyone a pass on speeding tickets, that seems
great. But they clearly don't - they are saying "I have one set of standards
for my friends, and another for everyone else," which is unethical. The doctor
and lawyer aren't saying that.

~~~
JoeAltmaier
Barter is supposed to be taxed. Its tax evasion. A small matter, but so is not
writing a ticket. After all, officers have discretion - the public safety is
their concern, not making money for the city. I've been stopped a couple of
times, only gotten a ticket once. Because I'm not a public menace, and that's
clear once the officer talks to me. No special card involved.

~~~
geofft
Huh, I've been stopped a few times, it's been clear I'm not a public menace,
and I still get ticketed. Maybe it's because I'm not white?

~~~
JoeAltmaier
Likely - I'm tall, white, middle-European looking and educated. I'm polite to
the policeman too. All that gives me an edge, undeserved or not I guess.

