
Penniless Yogi Baba Ramdev Controls a Billion-Dollar Corporation - dsr12
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2018-03-15/this-multibillion-dollar-corporation-is-controlled-by-a-penniless-yoga-superstar
======
gnufied
Can confirm - was in India this February and Patanjli Corp. is everywhere.
There are patanjli stores in small towns, big cities, posh neighborhoods and
slums.

My parents know ramdev like they know a family member. 10 years ago my dad
would start his day with yoga instructions from baba ramdev. FWIW getting
people to do yoga was definitely good, because middle aged Indian men hardly
do any exercise. So when Baba ramdev launched this line of products, somehow
my parents put absolute trust in him. Nothing would convince them to look at
finer print.

Patanjali corp. definitely looks like a heady mix of religion, politics and
ayurveda. FDA equivalent in India will have hard time finding faults in those
products because everything can be swept under the rug of "western
consipariec" and boy power they wield.

~~~
John4234
For people outside india reading this comment must know why even educated
people support ramdev. Its simple. Its the caste system in india. As per the
vedas(the bible of hinduism) only the brahmin caste should be allowed to
education. Basically they want entitlement by birth and not by capability.

------
orf
> Ramdev and Balkrishna laid off the strikers, who then alleged that the
> ashram’s medicines contained unlisted ingredients, including crushed human
> skulls. A lab test found human DNA.

Well that certainly took an unexpected dark turn.

Pretty interesting article and worth a read, he seems like an interesting
character. Based purely off this I'd say he seems to be a pretty unscrupulous
businessman who hides behind a veneer of yoga and piousness, but who really
knows.

~~~
xevb3k
Weirdly, I’ve seen human skulls for sale on eBay. I’d guess there are various
issues in adding them to medicines however...

But it sounds possibly more likely someone trying to get back at the company
to me. I mean, what’s the marketing value of adding human skulls to your
medicines if you don’t tell people about it?

Elsewhere medicines claiming to contain human flesh have been sold on the
black market, it’s all pretty horrifying:

[https://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/dec/31/chinese-
canni...](https://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/dec/31/chinese-cannibalism-
infant-flesh-outrages-world/)

~~~
marcelluspye
FWIW, ebay says it forbids the sale of human remains. If you do find real
skulls on there, you should probably report them.

[https://www.ebay.com/help/policies/prohibited-restricted-
ite...](https://www.ebay.com/help/policies/prohibited-restricted-items/human-
remains-body-parts-policy?id=4325)

------
vinayms
If Indian movies (no no not just Bollywood) had a site like tvtropes, this one
would be real life example of SmilingStealthySanyasi. Though many of the
modern sanyasis shun the stereotypical saffron robes (while maintaining the
essential flowing beards), they are living embodiment of this trope
nonetheless. Such characters were rife in Indian movies till late 90s. These
guys are typically evil, ranging from simple peripheral villains, to owners of
casinos with attached brothel services, to full fledged drug lords and
terrorists.

As for Ramdev, though we don't know yet if he is evil of that proportion,
there is no dearth of people speculating that he launders money, which is
worse. They also speculate who his clients are. But, of course, these
speculators don't have enough time, money and motivation to follow up and
provide proof; they wait and watch, hoping to say "I told you so" one day. But
since the political clout these sanysais wield is common knowledge, its
anyone's guess as to when the reveal will happen. These poor sods are more
likely to die of old age without ever uttering that.

~~~
aphextron
Funny, it seems we have our own Sanyasi here in the US as well. But instead of
Saffron robes, it's just a Saffron color face.

~~~
dang
Please don't do this here.

------
modi15
I use their toothpaste all the time. It has a very earthy organic flavor and
immediately contrasts with the strong 'chemical' taste of traditional
toothpaste.

To be fair, the toothpaste though is an exception. Most of the patanjali
products are similar to other products on the market - the only difference
seem to be that they skip the strong flavors/chemicals in favor of the basic
ones and market it as more 'organic'. The subtext is that they are also a LOT
cheaper so the market laps it up.

Indians have a widespread distrust of western personal care products and the
science of Ayurveda is considered superior. Patanjali has taken the first step
in monetizing this belief at scale. I don't think they would be the last.

Ayurveda is poised to go the way of Yoga. Everyone should get ready to hop on.

~~~
blindwatchmaker
Hop onto using products based on pseudoscience instead of stuff that's
actually clinically tested?

It seems pretty dangerous too:

[https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2755247/](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2755247/)

The number of people from India who fall for this nonsense is astonishing; it
would make more sense if it was just targeted at the poor and uneducated, but
it seems to encompass everyone. I guess education doesn't cure stupid.

~~~
mayankkaizen
Be careful when you try to paint an entire field with a single color. There is
a prevalent trend of doing this even though one can't even name 3 not so
typical ayurvedic medicines.

Ayurvedic system isn't completely pseudo-science, though there are some
nonsensical stuffs here and there. I mean when someone says ayurvedic system
can treat cancer, you have reasons to laugh at it.

I am not a doctor or even a pharmacist but my dad's been running a medical
shop since last 45 years. And he sells entire range of Ayurvedic medicines
along with allopathic medicines.

I know of hundreds of cases where ayurvedic medicines performed far better
than allopathic medicines. Yes hundreds of cases. In fact, even I myself have
recommended ( and have used myself) a particular ayurvedic medicine for
treatment of chronic fever where allopathic treatment just didn't work. And it
worked miraculously in every single cases. There are countless other examples.

My point is, don't call ayurvedic system pseudoscience just because it is
'intellectually superior' viewpoint. Have seen too many people calling
ayurvedic system bullshit even when they can't even tell the name of 3
medicines.

~~~
52-6F-62
If you’re trying to legitimize something that isn’t rooted in modern science,
I’d advise against the use of “allopathic” as the adjective of choice when
speaking of modern, science-based medical study.

The term was coined by a homeopathic doctor with he perceived intent of
siloing modern scientific medication and medical study rather than attributing
the legitimacy it’s earned due to the accepted rigours of the scientific
process.

Not that homeopathic or Ayurvedic is not necessarily effective, but unless
it’s submitted to the rigours of scientific study, it’s not science. Therefore
if it passes itself off as science, it is a pseudoscience. In that case it
doesn’t matter how many names anyone knows.

~~~
shardinator
Not science != not true

~~~
52-6F-62
Nobody said that.

The point was `not science != science`

Science is a course to best-effort prove things to be true—to that end it's
been the most successful yet. The reason it's been successful is rigorous
testing and data-gathering. And intellectual honesty. That's another
discussion, maybe.

~~~
shardinator
Yes fair enough, good points.

------
azifali
Patanjali manufactures products with manufacturing date in the future; No lab
tests of products - throw in plenty of arsenic, some cow urine and call it
Ayurveda. Sell it in the open market with the backing of the current
government. How easy can it get?

~~~
boruto
Do you have any source on arsenic claim?

------
intended
Worth noting, how nascent Indian markets can be swayed by popular sentiments
and nationalism.

Not that it’s bad or good. Just that it is.

Many people blindly buy patanjali material, even if it’s found to have issues
or high ash content or other problems.

~~~
sremani
People buy Apple products blindly too and so do they buy Pampers (diapers).
Indian markets are notnascent. How many people who do diddly squat research
but swear by the soaps in Whole foods? Are these people any different? The
whole world is looking for a way away from "synthetic" in the US the Whole
Foods etc lead the charge in India Pantanjali is the brand associated with it.

------
eklavya
I don't know there have been a lot of slander campaigns against this man and
for good reason. He has reduced the market of very large multi nationals by
about 50%

It's true that some of his products are cheaper because well they are cheap :)

But so what's wrong with that? Are the competitors any saints? You know what
use whatever you think is good, it's that simple. I use some of his products
because I like them and I know Patanjali is having a direct net positive
effect on the local economy.

------
steve-benjamins
> “Idealism is easy when you have nothing,” Karamveer told Pathak-Narain.
> “It’s what you do when you have fame, money, or power that matters.”

I know it’s cliche but it’s cliche for a reason.

------
mayankkaizen
My dad's been running a chemist shop for 45 years. He also sells ayurvedic
medicines. And he'd been associated with right-wing outfits in the past.

It is not like Patanjali medicines are better than other. Some of them are
(for example I personally use their toothpaste). It is more about cult system
and current socio-political environment in India.

These days, in India, 'hindu nationalism' along with 'anti-Congress' movement
is on the rise. And Ramdev has projected himself as an ultimate ambassador of
everything Hinduism or Hindu-Nationalism has to offer (Yoga, Ayurvedic
medicines, Made in India products, true ascetic life, spirituality etc etc).

The right-wing central government and rise of Ramdev are not two separate
phenomena. They are closely entwined. And they both support each other. As
things stand now, no political party can dare to touch Ramdev. He has too much
clout because of his countless followers. Even his traditional political
opponents don't want to mess with him.

His business is probably far bigger than described in many news articles. We
don't have financial numbers. His tax filings have been shady and noone can
question him. He's bought may be thousands of acres of lands from government
at 75-80% discount so that he can 'promote yoga and ayurveda'. I also read
somewhere he actually bought an island somewhere in Europe though not sure
about it.

Even a small town with population less than 15000 has at least half dozen
shops which sells only Patanjali products. No other FMCG company has this much
clout.

This is all about cult following and current rise of hindu nationalism in
india. Better ayurvedic medicines and Yoga teachers have always been around.
But Ramdev was there at the right time (widespread use of SM, anti-Congress
sentiments), did all the right things, projected himself as an ultimate
'patriotic and honest hindu yoga guru' effectively.

Now he is selling noodles, chocolates and cosmetic products in the name of
patriotism and spirituality.

~~~
jonhendry18
"Even a small town with population less than 15000 has at least half dozen
shops which sells only Patanjali products."

Is Patanjali some kind of pyramid scheme / multi-level marketing scam? The
situation described above sounds like what happens when a bunch of women in a
small US town start trying to sell Lularoe clothing or some other scam.

~~~
mayankkaizen
It isn't pyramid scheme. It is cult following. You can sell anything to anyone
if you effectively project yourself as a spiritual leader.

This guy even claimed that homosexuality can be treated by yoga. And his
followers send messages on whatsapp group which reads something like, "cancer
is not a diseace. doctors use it as a fear mongering tools for making money.
It is basically a vitamin B17 deficiency blah blah blah."

------
nabla9
Relevant Frank Zappa song. Cosmik Debris:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wtx4ZJ1cwI0](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wtx4ZJ1cwI0)

------
chauhankiran
Patanjali has give a tough competition to other products. I read in local
newspaper that, Parle's ( A popular biscuits company ) top level manager
saying that, his mother and other family members are eat Patanjali biscuits.
i.e. they have competition in their home even!

------
chatman
They sell untested, unapproved products. It is a govt backed corporation.

------
majos
Seems like some people are really into power, to the extent that they'll
forswear most of the things people generally use power to obtain (money,
material possessions, sex, etc) and just focus on the power itself as an end.

~~~
xstartup
Cash in the bank depreciates faster than power so. How do you tax power?

------
mkbkn
I have used some of the Patanjali's products. Some are good and healthier than
others and sometimes cheaper than the market price.

Oh yes, he has a dark side too. Relevant reading - Godman To Tycoon
[https://www.infibeam.com/Books/godman-tycoon-priyanka-
pathak...](https://www.infibeam.com/Books/godman-tycoon-priyanka-pathak-
narain/9789386228383.html#variantId=P-M-B-9789386228383)

------
sg0
One reason Patanjali products are popular is because they are significantly
cheaper than alternatives from Unilever or similar companies. With
demonetization in India, middle class is still experiencing cash woes (and
have less faith in the government), and will pander to cheaper FMCG
alternatives for their daily needs. I believe this company is either going to
crash or reduce its operations at some point in the future to remain
profitable (unless BJP stays in power for the indefinite future). Either they
will have to increase prices (due to raised wages of workers), which will make
their products less competitive, or they will have to really spend money on
replacing BS products that purportedly contains cow urine and animal remains.

~~~
abhigupta
Not sure if you have been to India but the "cash woes" were gone more than a
year ago :) Patanjali products are selling well because people like the
products and Patanjali doesn't seem to be driven by profit-motives ATM, thus
leading to lower prices.

~~~
srean
Well that's true if you redefine 'year', 'woe' 'profit-motives' etc -- a
necessary skill to have to support current government's narratives.

[http://www.business-standard.com/article/economy-
policy/atms...](http://www.business-standard.com/article/economy-policy/atms-
run-out-of-notes-here-s-the-reason-behind-the-massive-cash-
crunch-118041700331_1.html)

[https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/hyderabad/atms-
run-...](https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/hyderabad/atms-run-dry-in-
heart-of-hyderabad-bankers-say-stop-hoarding-cash/articleshow/63654928.cms)

------
openfuture
What an extraordinarily dangerous man.

------
vthallam
> Patanjali’s ayurvedic brand has soared in the climate of Hindu nationalism
> that lifted India’s ruling party, the right-wing Bharatiya Janata Party, to
> victory in 2014

This is wrong on so many levels. People got tired of corruption from the
previous Govt and voted for Modi who had a track record of clean govt for over
12 years. If Hindu Nationalism is a thing, BJP would come to power every time
because over 70% of the population in India is Practicing Hindu's.

~~~
aq3cn
Let them have a name for defeat of their ecosystem. Its apparent that we
devout Hindus are alone in the world. None of the world institution lean to
speak on behalf of us. It will not stay like this for long.

~~~
notyme
It is tragic that being "devout hindu" has turned into "Us vs. Them" when in
fact hindu religion advocates universality for all living beings (chetana)
even non-living (jada) but the profound lessons are conveniently overlooked
for sectarian politics. The core message of Bhagvata-Gita and Bhagvata-Purana,
two of the most revered scriptures is the "Everything is the Lord, there is
nothing besides the Lord" Bhagvada-Gita Chapter 7 Verse 19,

bahūnāṁ janmanām ante jñānavān māṁ prapadyate vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti sa mahātmā
su-durlabhaḥ

"Vasudevah sarvam iti", everything is the Lord there is nothing besides the
Lord.

Jesus Christ said "If you do not love your brother whom you can see, how can
you love God whom you cannot see?"

If "devout hindus/christians/etc" realize this message the World could be
heaven on earth.

After most hindu prayers there is invocation of "Shanti Shanti Shanti" i.e.
Peace Peace Peace to All.

It is most unfortunate that such ancient religion has forgotten its core
principle.

[0][https://www.vedabase.com/en/bg/7/19](https://www.vedabase.com/en/bg/7/19)

~~~
aq3cn
I made a statement saying that I feel that people of my community dont have
global voice. It is my perception.

You quoted/misquoted from here or there and proved me sectarian along with
saying we forgot our core principle.

Let me start:

Did you hear about this controvercy?

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_textbook_controvers...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_textbook_controversy_over_Hindu_history)

When I say I am alone, I mean that I dont expect my fair representation in
global stage as in the example above.

Looks like you know a bit about Gita. Allow me to ask two simple question?

1\. Why did Krishna guide Arjun to kill Kaurawa?

2\. Why did Krishna belive that Duryodhan does not deserve power?

If you cannot answer these simple questions, please dont preach me anything
about Gita.

~~~
notyme
You deleted your previous question while I was composing...

>1\. Why did Krishna guide Arjun to kill Kaurawa?

After Pandavas completed their 13 years of exile imposed by Kauravas and
demanded for half of the kingdom which was rightfully theirs, Duryodhana
adamantly refused. Lord Krishna wanted to avoid war so he went to negotiate
with Kauravas on behalf of Pandavas and he asked for just 5 villages instead
of half the kingdom, Duryodhana famously replied "Without war, I will not
yield even the amount of land on a pinhead",so war was inevitable.

> 2\. Why did Krishna believe that Duryodhan does not deserve power?

Had Duryodhana acceded to Lord Krishna's demand of mere 5 villages instead of
half kingdom, Duryodhana and inturn Kauravas would have lived but Duryodhana
was envious of Pandavas and that led to his downfall.

Initially, Arjuna is reluctant to take up arms against his own cousins but
Lord Krishna advocated that doing nothing is also doing something i.e.
tolerating injustice is also a sin as a warrior. Arjuna was thus convinced of
his duty as warrior and was victorious in this holy war/ dharma yudha.

Hence,it was Duryodhana's own undoing and in this "holy war", i.e. "dharma
yuddha", the Kauravas perished.

P.S: In India, the word "dharma" is mistranslated as "religion" but its true
meaning is duty. One of the key precepts of Bhagvata-Gita is to perform your
duties without expectation of fruit of your labour i.e. nishkama karma yoga.

Feel free to query further. Peace.

~~~
aq3cn
I deleted my earlier response, because it was not logically ordered for others
to make sense. So I rewrote it.

I still dont know if you agree with me on this that Hindus dont have fair
representation in english speaking global media or textbooks.

Your answers are factual, and lack psychological dimension. So let me add
another question.

From your answers, it appears that it was easier for Krishna to convince
Arjuna to kill his brothers & relatives than convincing Duryodhan of giving up
five villages. If Krishna was really a god or god like, why/how did he fail to
convince Duryodhan for giving up villages? What stoped him for pursuing
Duryodhan one more time? Why Krishna's "godly" influence didnt work on
Duryodhan? Why was war necessary?

few additions to your answer:

Dharma also means people with character, thats why Yudhisthir is known as
Dharmraaj. Its opposite is Adharmi (अधर्मी) which means undisciplined person.

I dont think Dharma yuddha will translate into "Holy war". Dharma also means
discipline or law. So Dharma yuddha means a war to bring law on the land. It
is similar to how various countries are attempting to bring self-sustaining
democracy in Afganistan.

~~~
notyme
The total count of human warriors participating in Mahabharata was
approximately 3,936,600[0]. Of which less than 10 warriors survive the
devastating war. Five Pandavas, Lord Krishna, Ashwatthama, Kripacharya etc.

>Barbarik

The character Barbarik[1] was so powerful that whichever side he chose
Pandavas/Kauravas they would grow immensely powerful and it was Barbarik's
obligation to fight for the weaker side hence he would keep oscillating
between both sides thereby killing everyone except himself. Hence Lord Krishna
asks his head in charity and in return Barbarik's head is planted atop a hill
overseeing the battle.

After the war, victorious Pandavas were rejoicing and there was banter between
regiments of Arjuna and Bheema that their leader was pivotal to victory. When
the warriors questioned Lord Krishna who was the "Achilles" of the war, the
Lord said why don't you approach Barbarik, he has witnessed the war with a
panoramic view. On questioning Barbarik responds, though for rest of you it
might seem that warriors from both sides killed each other, I saw from my
vantage point that the Lord's discus (Sudarshan Chakra) killed everyone. To
rid the earth of cruel and unjust kings the war was imperative as per the
Lord.

After the war, Lord Krishna visited Gandhari, mother of Duryodhana and
Kauravas. Gandhari was devastated on hearing death of her 100 sons, she asked
the Lord "O Lord, you are Bhagwan(God), if you wanted, you could you avoided
the war and spared my children but you didn't and let annihilation of my
children. Just as my family tree has been culled, I curse you O Lord that your
clan share the same fate as mine.".

The Lord merely smiled and accepted her curse because after destroying the
corrupt warriors, the most powerful family left was his own, the Yadavas or
Yadu-Vansh/Yadu-clan. Some time later, the large Yadava family (circa
~millions) gathered for a festival and during merrymaking were heavily
intoxicated which lead to eventual fighting in inebriated state and death of
entire Yadava-clan except Lord Krishna and Balaram.

>With the above backstory, now we can ponder why did the Lord did not stop the
war.

As Gandhari questioned, it was possible for the Lord to avoid war but he did
not to teach humanity the savagery of war, brothers killing brothers, uncles
their nephews.

>Bhagvata-Gita

The whole of Bhagvata-Gita is instructed by Lord Krishna to Arjuna but Arjuna
is merely a medium, every human being is the real focal target. It is
instruction on how to lead an ideal life and before death realize the supreme
goal of life i.e. moksha/salvation/one-ness with the Lord.

Had the Lord avoided the war we would not have Mahabharata war as example of
annihilation of 3.9m warriors.Back to the present age, it took us three
colossal World Wars to learn this ancient lesson. Clearly us humans need to be
reminded of our lessons repeatedly.

You are correct on Dharma-Yuddha not translating to "holy war", it was my
attempt to simplify the idea to western audience.

>On Hindu representation in western media:

Personally, though I am a practicing Hindu, I believe in the concept of
"universality" of ancient Hindu tradition and its modern counterpart from the
scientist Carl Sagan[2]

“The nitrogen in our DNA, the calcium in our teeth, the iron in our blood, the
carbon in our apple pies were made in the interiors of collapsing stars. We
are made of starstuff.”

All of us trace our origin to stars and yet we pigeonhole ourselves into
Hindu/Muslim or While/Black. If we are the same at the core and only
superficially different why waste precious breaths over petty differences.

Ending with another Carl Sagan quote:

“Every one of us is, in the cosmic perspective, precious. If a human disagrees
with you, let him live. In a hundred billion galaxies, you will not find
another.”

[0][https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akshauhini](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akshauhini)

[1][https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khatushyam](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khatushyam)

[2][https://www.goodreads.com/work/quotes/3237312-cosmos](https://www.goodreads.com/work/quotes/3237312-cosmos)

------
no1name
Businesses like that of Patanjali are the future of India. We are gonna see
many such mega corporations which connect to ancient roots of India. We need
better, more Indophilic, coverage of such businesses.

Dunno why Hacker News keeps removing my comments, as if I am saying something
wrong.

------
ratsimihah
Anyone else having trouble skimming this on mobile?

------
no1name
Baba Ramdev's business is an indicator of things to come in India. As India is
resurgent, we will see more such mega enterprises which connect to India's
ancient Hindu past. In many ways the ancient Indian civilization was much
superior to Western civilization. His business is successful because there's a
market for it. People are happy to connect with their forgotten past by
rejecting the West in a big way.

~~~
sumedh
> In many ways the ancient Indian civilization was much superior to Western
> civilization.

Like the caste system and burning of widows?

~~~
no1name
Hindu metaphysics is much superior to any work done in philosophy in the West.
But I suppose it's too difficult for you to understand as all you have done in
life is read NYT and watch CNN. When you see Hindus, you see caste and what
not. When you see Americans you don't see slavery. That's how your mind has
been whitewashed.

~~~
sumedh
Ah yes the classic finger-pointing excuse.

~~~
no1name
Better than steamrolling the debate by mentioning 'sati' and 'widow burning'.
How'd you feel if to every achievement of Western civilization that you
mention I said 'brutal slavery' (which actually finished the African
civilization) and 'burning of witches'?

~~~
KozmoNau7
Slavery in the US ended ~150 years ago and a couple of decades before that in
Europe. Similarly, the last known witch trial and execution in Europe was ~200
years ago. And outright witch _burnings_ stopped long before that.

By contrast, witch hunts _still_ happen in India, as well as gang rapes and
mutilations, on a level completely unheard of in the west.

And the caste system is _still_ in effect, although not officially.

I trust you've seen the massive protests, and I hope it's a sign that
something is being done. Based on reports of political corruption and
indifference from the population, unfortunately I don't have much hope for it.

~~~
no1name
Wow man, I appreciate your persistence. I am yet to hear of a scandal of the
scale of Telford and Rotherham in India. I heard that thousands of white young
working-class girls were kept in grooming gangs by Pakistani men. It'll be
really better for you if you peep in your backyard rather than using italics
in a passive-aggressive way to educate me about India. Also, I see no protest
about these grooming gangs and in fact Tommy Robinson who was reporting on it
was thrown in prison! This is the state of Western world, the harbinger of
liberal democracy!!! And I'd really really suggest that you come out of the
toxic bubble your media like NYT and CNN and WaPo have put you in. It's really
depressing to see that you have taken zero efforts to learn what's actually
going on. I guess you should use social media more actively and listen to and
talk to people outside your political spectrum to curtail your arrogance and
extreme lack of knowledge.

~~~
KozmoNau7
Personal attacks are absolutely uncalled for.

------
dingo_bat
> On a three-axis chart of holiness, capitalism, and lumbar flexibility, he
> occupies a point beyond anyone else on Earth.

I don't know why the author thinks capitalism and holiness are orthogonal.
Overall the article is full of these unfounded preconceptions.

------
Sharma
Not sure if Baba Ramdev is all good and clean or not but I myself have
used(and have been using) Patanjali's products and they are pretty good. If
they are all herbal and chemical free as they claim then all good. But even if
they are not, it would be same as using other products.

~~~
kranner
It would not be the same as using other products because lab tests have found
impurities exceeding safe limits in his edible products multiple times. This
is even mentioned in the article.

And nothing, not even herbs, are "chemical free." His whole shtick is based on
the age-old crap of denouncing industrial products as full of harmful
chemicals and projecting herbal products as nothing but beneficial.

[https://www.hindustantimes.com/india-news/baba-ramdev-s-
pata...](https://www.hindustantimes.com/india-news/baba-ramdev-s-patanjali-
products-fail-uttarakhand-quality-test/story-bXo4XySEajw7ZDby4GISML.html)

[https://thewire.in/politics/ramdev-patanjali-fails-fssai-
tes...](https://thewire.in/politics/ramdev-patanjali-fails-fssai-tests-fined)

~~~
aq3cn
You have only one sided story, why not dig up the response from official
spokesperson of Patanjali.

~~~
intended
I’m sorry, was it normal for us in India to go to Coca Cola or Maggie and get
their side of the story when people were being frightened about noodles?

Usually I just look at what the testing agency says

>Nearly 40% of Ayurveda products, including items from Baba Ramdev’s
Patanjali, were found to be of substandard quality by Haridwar’s Ayurveda and
Unani Office, a Right to Information (RTI) reply revealed.

Out of the 82 samples collected between 2013 and 2016, 32 failed the quality
test. Patanjali’s Divya Amla Juice and Shivlingi Beej were among the products
that failed to meet the quality standards.

Last month, the armed forces’ Canteen Stores Department (CSD) had suspended
the sale of a batch of Patanjali’s amla juice after it ‘failed’ a quality test
carried out at West Bengal Public Health Laboratory.

—————-

The company story will be the same “our material is safe and fine.”

~~~
aq3cn
I know the cases.

Amla juice controversy arose because food inspector didnt had its ingredient
table for Amala juice, so he matched it with Apple Juice ingredient table. Of
course, it would not pass the test and the product will be called substandard.
There are various such incidences where misinformation campaign on SM created
paranoia. Patanjali wanted Amala juice to be passed a ayurvedic medicine, but
they insisted on having it as consumer product. But you know Amala juice are
again available in cateen stores and the controversy has been resolved.

Please dont fall for one sided story, it would be good to look into official
response from the company. Even a judge has to listen to the story of criminal
before anouncing final punishment.

There are multiple food labs in country. It can be state or central govt
owned. Swamy Ramdev cannot cheat all of them, all the times.

~~~
busterarm
What ingredients does juice have besides water and juice? (okay, maybe sugar).
Most juice _is_ apple juice anyway because it's the cheapest thing to make and
its flavor can be masked. I can't imagine the gooseberry yield is enough to
meet the demand for the product.

What you're saying literally isn't corroborated anywhere online on top of not
making sense.

The testing authority said "unfit for consumption" and the company's official
position on this was that their amla juice is not a drink but a medicine and
that it should be tested by a different agency...

------
naruvimama
"Margo" and "Neem paste" were the only big brand-name neem based products on
sale in supermarkets until a few year ago. Now every MNC brand has a
neem/turmeric variant. It is no secret that a lot of Pharma companies steal
traditional knowledge systems, isolate the active molecules and patent it.
Modern medicine is also based on clinical studies and not full understanding
of all the side effects. Ayurveda is based on 1000's of yers of clinical
observations, with no commercial bias.

------
mrath
I went to India after three years last months. I had the impression that
everybody in India love Patanjali products. But once I am at home I never saw
a single Patanjali product. I was talking to my sister on this, she said the
products are not great. She was not they were bad, but more like soap does not
smell great. Oil smell worse than the competitors. She even said people make
fun of these products. Just a different view point. I went to India after
three years last months. I had the impression that everybody in India love
Patanjali products. But once I am at home I never saw a single Patanjali
product. I was talking to my sister on this, she said the products are not
great. She was not they were bad, but more like soap does not smell great. Oil
smell worse than the competitors. She even said people make fun of these
products. Just a different view point.

------
geek29
Another western group jealous about a "native" company beating western
cosmetic giants in their own game using traditional knowledge and branding.
Whoever is saying Patanjali/Ayurveda is pseudo-science is hypocrite. There is
hardly anything scientific when it comes to commerce and business. Instead of
asking questions like How "educated people trust this?" people should try to
know why people love those products..Most of the cosmetics and food-beverage
products are sold due to marketing not based on real merits be it on - being
healthy scientific or having excessive chemicals or organic. Patanjali is
smartly branding itself "indic" on top of existing yoga-fame of Ramadev. All
Patanjali has to do is offer products with less chemicals, even a marginal
improvement on quality is perceived as "superior" to existing cosmetics. Its
smart marketing and forces of open market acting..Giants like Coalgate and
others too have tried to offer products which sound "ayurvedic" which proves
ayurveda does offer solutions to common medical problems and cosmetics.

In 1990s, coalgate used to market its paste as salt free and superior as
indians used salt traditionally for mouth cleaning. In 2009 it came up with
toothpaste with salt and marketed it as "superior" bcoz it has salt. Few years
ago, carbon. And now "Neem" after Patanjali and Dabur(Meswak). So I will ask
counter question to person terming ayurveda as pseudo-science, just bcoz a
company markets itself using "modern clinical science" does not mean it
better. Same applies for Patanjali using ayurveda. There are other players in
indian market who offer similar products using ayurvedic solutions.

In summary, Ayurveda is not pseudo-science in fact has proven solutions for
generic cosmetic and common medical problems - just like any other culture
having their own alternate medicines. Western giants too have taken interests
and offer "ayurvedic" products. Patanjali has beaten its competitors
effectively. Also, MNCs which use science for marketing effectively control
"scientific" progress as MNCs put their own commercial interests first. In
such scenarios, competitors which employ traditional alternate medicines are
good counter forces. Today science is miss-used more.

