

Apple developing Flash alternative named Gianduia - mikecane
http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/10/05/07/apple_developing_flash_alternative_named_gianduia.html

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asnyder
This is definitely one of the fluffiest pieces I've ever read. There are
numerous client-side frameworks as this piece mentions, but none of them
really replace flash. Sure, the general development community is now finally
coming to accept that there are clearly numerous use cases that flash was
unnecessary for, but that doesn't replace flash.

We've had the ability to have rich internet applications in our browsers since
2005. There are literally hundreds of client-side frameworks, but I guess
since Apple is creating one, all of a sudden it warrants a mention. All of the
apple applications that were mentioned could've easily been done in any of
those. Why only mention Cappucinno, and Sproutcore? What do they have to with
flash? It's just complete fluffery, very frustrating.

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derefr
So, what's this other thing we need to have to be able to replace flash? What
else is flash currently doing for everyone that's so unique?

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liuliu
vector animation engine? I don't know much about SVG though.

~~~
est
and _streamable_. I remember in the 56k modem days the main Flash's feature is
streamable Web multimedia.

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callmeed
If Adobe was smart they would snap up 280North or a similar company now—and
offer it as part of their new html5/RIA initiative asap.

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sandofsky
The real Flash "killer" is whatever commercial product they release to compete
with the Flash artist tools.

The only people who care about Flash are those with investments. Artists don't
want to relearn tools, or worse; their worst fear is writing code as a
replacement for an animation timeline. The businesses that employ these
artists are happy with the existing pipeline, and any switch in platform looks
like a huge risk.

Every unbiased developer I talk to perceives a move away from Flash as a
better Internet. It seems we don't move for the same reason we're using QWERTY
rather than Dvorak keyboards. Regardless of their motivation, Apple pushing
Flash toward obsolescence is a net win.

The tipping point will be when someone, maybe even Adobe, releases a product
identical to existing tools.

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petercooper
Now it seems even more odd that Apple doesn't bother to include Lucida Grande
on the iPhone or iPad, since that forms the cornerstone of Cocoa's interface.
On the iPhone and iPad, they seem to use Helvetica instead (which is far less
suited for small text).

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mattparcher
I'm not sure I understand. As much as I love Lucida Grande, Cocoa != Lucida
Grande. Rather, Mac OS X : Lucida Grande :: iPhone OS : Helvetica.

~~~
petercooper
I see Helvetica on the iPhone platform as more of an aberration (and possibly
merely the result of license bickering, not through serious consideration). It
doesn't seem to make any sense to switch to it on the portable devices. This
has been partially mocked here: <http://blog.cocoia.com/2008/swiss-interface-
syndrome/>

Anyway, the screenshot of the Apple booking interface shows Lucida Grande in
use. When viewed on the iPad/iPhone, it'll have to drop back to Helvetica
instead of the intended font. Hopefully Apple will see sense, though, and add
Lucida Grande to OS 4.0 or beyond since its absence makes little sense.

~~~
cpr
It's not an aberration, it's part of the Jobsian Bauhaus design sense. He got
to force the main font choice on the phone, where he probably wasn't able to
on Mac OS X.

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petercooper
Maybe, but I can't buy it. They've stuck to the Lucida-esque Myriad Pro For
their display advertising and Web graphics, for the most part and Jobs could
have easily changed that stuff. That aside, can you imagine Helvetica
replacing Lucida on OS X generally? It'd look hideous :-( (And I'm a big
Helvetica fan - but it sucks for clarity at small point sizes.)

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Mazer23
So apple bought sproutCore right? How is this different? or is it a next step
from sproutCore?

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BSeward
Apple has a few frameworks floating around, internally and out. See
[http://rentzsch.tumblr.com/post/286536824/apples-myriad-
java...](http://rentzsch.tumblr.com/post/286536824/apples-myriad-javascript-
frameworks)

~~~
grinich
I was playing with PastryKit for a while.

<http://michaelgrinich.com/pastrytweets>

You can grab the code here. <http://github.com/grinich/pastrytweets>

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joubert
If they were, I'm pretty confident it wouldn't be called that.

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alextgordon
Not that I disagree, but this is from the company that bought us the "Mighty
Mouse".

~~~
joubert
and magic mouse (which I love)

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cjoh
Man, I first read this as Apple developing flash alternative named "Giardia:"
[http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dpd/parasites/Giardiasis/factsht_g...](http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dpd/parasites/Giardiasis/factsht_giardia.htm)

~~~
cubicle67
That's ok. I read it through somewhat bleary eyes as 'glandular' (as in fever)

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rmason
So this is going to be write once run once? Or in other words run just on
Apple hardware? Or run as speedily as iTunes or QuickTime does on the PC? Good
luck with that!

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Kilimanjaro
We don't need flash alternatives, we need support for SVG and canvas. SVG is a
fine alternative to flash and it is supported by all major browsers.

And browser APIs to fill the voids where flash also exceeded its animation-
only competency, like sockets (we already have them) and device control (cams,
mics, etc)

