
Why Skilled Immigrants Are Leaving the U.S - raju
http://www.businessweek.com/technology/content/feb2009/tc20090228_990934.htm
======
jcausey
I would argue that while this certainly sucks for the US in the short term,
it's awesome for the world in the long term. This is exactly what
globalization is good for -- expose talented people from all over the world to
the free market, get them to our level of expertise, and then have them go
back home and start the arduous process of improving local standards of
living.

~~~
illumen
Except the US has lower standards of living, a worse education system, a
terrible human rights record, really high obesity levels, and more poverty
than many other counties.

No wonder they are leaving... there's many better places to live:

<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World%27s_Most_Livable_Cities>

They also might be scared of being put in jail... with the US having 1 out of
100 people in jail... a massive percentage of them being non-white. The
highest level of incarceration in the world:
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prisons_in_the_United_States>

~~~
endtime
Your comment is ridiculous, irrelevant (true or not, none of those things
apply to the "skilled immigrants" in question), and intellectually dishonest.
Save it for reddit, please.

~~~
illumen
It directly applies to the skilled immigrants in question. Since there are
many better places in the world to live than in the US - what I said listed
some reasons why the US is not a very good place to live.

Why are highly skilled immigrants choosing to go elsewhere? The reasons listed
could be why they are leaving, and some of the reasons I listed are mentioned
in the article.

As a highly skilled immigrant myself(who isn't in the US), those are a few of
the problems I see with the US. There's lots of other good things, and bad
things about it of course, those are just some important reasons not to live
there.

I notice how you made a personal attack, rather than address any of the (true)
facts I listed. You're also living in the US, which makes your comment even
more questionable.

If you'd like to check what I said, the links listed have references to back
it up.

~~~
endtime
I'm not interested in getting into an internet battle, especially not at HN.
But I did not make a personal attack, I only criticized your comment (however,
you did question my credibility based on where I live).

The problem with your comment is that it was irrelevant to the issue at hand.
You're entitled to hold whatever political opinions you want, informed or not,
but this isn't a site about politics and it wasn't a topic about politics,
which is why your comment was inappropriate. If you want to rant about
politics, there are plenty of other places to do that. But I would request
that you allow HN to remain free of that sort of thing.

------
huherto
"Returnees said they were generally making less money in absolute terms, but
they also said they enjoyed a higher quality of life."

That is exactly my case.

The only thing I miss about living in the U.S. is the opportunity to work for
the very smart companies. (e.g Google, Amazon, etc.) But in any case if you
are successful in your start up, you can create the smart company atmosphere
yourself.

The barriers to migrate to the U.S. are absurd. I know people that have been
waiting for ten years.

------
uuilly
This is sad. In my opinion immigrants are the best Americans. They work the
hardest and they expect the fewest handouts. In DC the Ethiopian immigrants
had the highest rate of employment of any demographic group. At first they
work in parking garages and as cab drivers. But after a few years they own
restaurants and small businesses. In Silicon Valley I'd say over half the
people pitching VC's have a foreign accent. I think it's amazing that somehow
people who barely speak the language can figure out where the money comes from
and how to fund their dreams. Yet people who have been here for generations
complain about a lack of opportunity. Immigrants are our greatest asset. We
should be fast-tracking highly educated immigrants and make it nearly seamless
for them to move here.

------
queensnake
I hate to say it but, the ones with options are the good ones. The US is
likely still the more attractive for those who come by the shovel-full.

Also, this was surprising:

> Chinese complained of pollution, reverse culture shock, /inferior education/
> for children, frustration with government bureaucracy, and the quality of
> health care.

That Chinese elementary education is worse than the US' would come as a
surprise to most people I'm sure.

~~~
streety
I wonder how much of that is due to difference rather than genuine
inferiority. My understanding is that the learning style in the US and China
is very different. Disclaimer: I've never visited China and I've spent a grand
total of 3 days in the US. This may limit my ability to comment.

~~~
queensnake
I've /heard/, only, mind, that Chinese reading/writing is so hard that kids
spend up to 5th, 6th grade on it. Sure, schools in countries with Western
languages do too but, my impression from where this info came was that it ate
up a few more years of schooling all by itself.

~~~
steadicat
I really doubt that learning a hard language would be detrimental to their
education.

In many countries kids study 2 or more foreign languages and they are much
better off because of it. The more you learn, the easier it is for you to
learn more.

Plus, I've been studying Chinese writing and I don't think it's as hard as it
looks to an outsider.

------
jhaski
I heard from some of my international friends that new regulation has been
passed that makes it increasingly hard for foreign nationals to stay in the US
after university for skilled professions.

If this, I think that this will only be a detriment to the US, as we need the
best skilled workers to maintain our global edge.

~~~
ShabbyDoo
What American shouldn't want to import more taxpayers? The income threshold
over which a family is a net contributor to the government probably isn't much
about $60K. So, importing just about anyone with a skill would lead to a lower
tax burden for all. And, it would improve the lives of the lowest paid
Americans by creating more demand for basic services (house cleaning, lawn
mowing, etc.)

I understand the labor unions' reluctance to allow unskilled immigration, but
they ought to press toward allowing more skilled people as it would increase
the demand for their members' services. Interestingly, I think most unions are
now in favor of legalizing illegal immigrants -- kicking out 10M people seems
undoable, so they're best served by eliminating the illegal, un-unionizable
underclass.

------
jhaski
I heard from some of my international friends that new regulation has been
passed that makes it increasingly hard for foreign nationals to stay in the US
after university for skilled professions.

If this, I think that this will only be a detriment to the US, as we need the
best skilled workers to maintain our global edge.

------
known
Globalization sounds rational only when Wage Slavery is prevented in
developing nations.

------
thepanister
Well, If skilled immigrants are leaving U.S., and consider that there are many
skilled workers that are not in U.S., then maybe it's the time to make a
virtual Silicon Valley on the internet?

So regardless where you are, you can enter "the virtual" Silicon Valley, and
you won't have to apply for a visa!

~~~
chiffonade
> virtual Silicon Valley on the internet?

Yeah, that's called the Internet.

