
Peter Thiel: Silicon Valley Is a Totalitarian Place - skmurphy
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5511987/Peter-Thiel-says-Silicon-Valley-totalitarian-place.html
======
eesmith
"Silicon Valley is a 'tyranny' because it's the only place where innovation in
the United States really happened."

Wait, what? "Happened" is the past tense, right? As in, over ~250 years of
American history?

So, including Boston's Route 128, AT&T Bell Labs, and Edison's research
laboratory in Menlo Park, NJ (and GE)?

I assume that's only a certain type of technical innovation, as Hollywood and
Detroit are/were known for different types of technical innovations.

------
skmurphy
Thiel's opening statement to Fox Business:

"When people are unanimously on one side, that tells you not that they've all
figured out the truth but that they're in a sort of totalitarian place, that
they're in a one party state where they're not allowed to have dissenting
views. I think somehow Silicon Valley shifted from being quite liberal to
being a one party state. Those are two very different things."

~~~
eesmith
WTF?

Look at all those people not calling for a return to chattel slavery. Look at
all those people not calling for Venezuela to invade and take over. Look at
all those people not calling for mass suicides. Look at all those billionaires
not calling for a return to 90% taxation for the highest tax bracket and the
institution of a global wealth tax.

Indeed it is a totalitarian land.

/sarcasm, in case it wasn't obvious.

------
meri_dian
While the arcs of liberalism and conservatism bend apart from one another for
a time they eventually meet at same point.

~~~
eesmith
Could you elaborate?

The Nordic countries are often seen as some of the most liberal ones. How much
more liberal does (say) Sweden need to become before it meets conservatism,
and what would that look like?

~~~
meri_dian
It's about the means different political forces use to assert their beliefs on
society. Both sides are capable of authoritarianism.

~~~
eesmith
No country or society exists without some aspects of authoritarianism, and
there are far more than two types of authoritarianism, so this doesn't help me
much.

How much more liberal does (say) Sweden need to become before it meets
conservatism, and what would that look like?

~~~
meri_dian
Let me clarify what I meant in my original post. The aims of conservatism and
liberalism differ, clearly. Extreme forms of these dogmas still have divergent
aims.

But extreme liberalism/conservatism is by definition forced upon a society,
because it is extremism. In asserting their beliefs, the extremists mirror one
another in means and action even if their ends differ.

As we have seen, both Fascists and Communists are capable of delivering up
human suffering. In the midst of this suffering, the two groups use similar
means to achieve their ends.

~~~
eesmith
Thank you for the clarification.

Do I understand you right that Sweden is not an extremely liberal country, and
that it won't be extremely liberal until it becomes communist?

What I still don't see is how "forced upon a society" (or "authoritarianism")
is something which only holds for extreme positions.

We see that the US does good job of delivering up human suffering (high prison
rates, effective wage slavery such that people start their careers deeply in
debt just to get the required education, many ongoing military bombing
campaigns, etc.).

But the US is neither fascist nor communist.

In Sweden (to use the earlier example), companies are not allowed to
discriminate on sex, ethnic origin, religion, sexual orientation, etc. This is
something forced on society, yes?

There are 13 countries where atheists potentially face the death penalty. They
are not fascist countries.

I can't think of any country where some laws, based on the beliefs of
lawmakers, aren't forced upon a society. Including laws that a majority of the
population do not want.

So while I agree that what you say is true, it doesn't seem to be diagnostic.
"The tallest people and the shortest people breath" is true, but that's
because all people breath.

