
Netflix is basically remaking all of TV now - raleighm
https://qz.com/1280981/netflix-is-basically-remaking-all-of-tv-now/
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bmelton
> It can play with the structure to make the shows work better for its ad-free
> format

I think people underrate how big this is from a creator perspective. As
viewers, we typically appreciate when work is uninterrupted by commercials
(though some shows are more forgiving of them than others), but to my
understanding, it's quite difficult as a creative to segment your work out
into 12-14 minute segments, constantly building up enough momentum that people
will be riveted through the commercial long enough to stick around, and then
having to ensure enough recap is done after the break that it doesn't break
the narrative flow.

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AndrewUnmuted
I think it is misleading to label Netflix as being an ad-free distributor.
They in fact do generate revenue via advertising - it's just more modern and
hidden: product placement.

"According to Isaacs, brands pay $50,000 to $500,000 per episode for getting
into a Netflix or Amazon show. The price is calculated based on the popularity
of the show and how long the product will be showed in the episode. There are
two options for product placement in the shows: a logo in the background or a
real plot point in the story." [0]

This, to me, seems just as disruptive to the creative freedom of a program's
producers/writers/directors.

[0] [https://learnbonds.com/134772/netflix-killing-secret-ads-
sho...](https://learnbonds.com/134772/netflix-killing-secret-ads-shows/)

~~~
untog
People need to bear this in mind more often. I recall watching the second (I
think?) episode of Lost in Space the other day that absolutely crowbared in a
placement for Oreo cookies, how great they are and how much they reminded the
character of home.

It took me completely out of the show. I would honestly have preferred an
isolated 30 second ad to that. It does still affect the creative process, too
- your show needs to be one an advertiser wants to be placed on, so there's
every incentive to soften the show.

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resu_nimda
I agree with you in principle about product placement affecting the integrity
of the work, but what's funny is I didn't even think twice about that one.

Were there other products in the show? I remember looking for logos on the
rovers and seeing none.

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rayiner
Netflix is an amazing testament to the fact that copyright does promote the
creative arts. It started out as a mere middle man service trying to make a
cut in the transaction between content creator and content consumer. But show
and movie providers realized the true value of what they were licensing to
Netflix, forcing Netflix to create its own, new content. The result is the
best, most competitive market in television shows in American history.

Netflix never would’ve done all this if (a) they could easily just stream
other peoples’ content, and (b) other people could easily stream their
content. Instead, the logical business play would’ve been trying to leverage
network effects and lock in to keep consumer eyeballs on their service instead
of a competing service.

~~~
axaxs
I'm not sure that's Netflix's doing, though. I remember reading a few years
back that the market was trending towards TV shows. Apparently years ago,
being in a TV show was seen as relatively low pay/low class, and at some point
that switched. I do think Netflix helps competition, but I honestly don't know
anyone whose favorite TV show is a Netflix original. I'd describe their
content as good overall, but not on the level of AMC/FX/HBO just yet.

~~~
dofly
> but I honestly don't know anyone whose favorite TV show is a Netflix
> original.

I remember a year or two ago Stranger Things was a massive super hit. I mean
that's all reddit could talk about that year - it overshadowed almost every
other show at the time.

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woobar
Stranger Things was a surprise hit, but not as massive as really big cable
shows.

See comparison to Game of Thrones or TWD:
[https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=today%205-y&q=...](https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=today%205-y&q=%2Fm%2F0524b41,%2Fm%2F0131ln7y,%2Fm%2F0c3xpwy)

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aaronblohowiak
Seems like this might be a good time to mention that we're hiring! My team
works on availability and latency optimization through global demand
distribution and ensuring sufficient scaling.. If you are a Sr SWE or SRE,
ping me! Lots of other jobs open, too: jobs.netflix.com. /shameless plug

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Gorbzel
Problem is, this spam the market approach yields a lot of crap content.

I realize this is anecdotal (feel free to ignore), but most times I open
Netflix and go through almost everything they feature on the home
screen...before turning it off because there isn’t anything that looks good.

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jhall1468
So, you look at a bunch of book covers you don't like and call it "crap
content".

I can't even count the number of Netflix shows/movies that the description
didn't look all that appealing and the show absolutely was wonderful. Chef's
Table was probably the biggest example. It looks like a cooking show. In
reality is a beautiful documentary series about how world-renown chef's made
their way.

Don't judge a book by its cover.

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fabianhjr
Black Mirror has gone downhill in an effort to create a mass audience. (Mostly
the fourth season) What they do is create "hit" content that is very
consumable not necessarily great or timeless.

"We need writers who know the difference between the production of a market
commodity and the practice of an art" ~ Ursula K. Le Guin

That said, their documentary productions are way better than the crap
Discovery, History Chanel, et al. have been producing this past decades or so.

~~~
baq
Exactly. My guess is that's why they passed on The Expanse - it's a great
story that is absolutely impossible for the majority to watch because it
actually requires you to look up from your phone and pay attention. That's
also why sense8 got the axe.

~~~
jhall1468
Sense8 got axed because it was a $1 million niche show. The same reason they
passed on The Expanse. at $700k an episode. They are both wonderful
television, but the masses want Survival so that's the garbage we get. At
least Netflix and HBO still show actual TV.

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deft
Here's how I see it: Netflix and other streaming services are recreating all
of cable now. It's not a good thing, just wait. Networks moved to the current
cable model because its the most profitable. Netflix disrupted that in the
same way Uber disrupted Taxis, now they're both becoming what they sought to
change.

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transfire
Not actually all that happy about this. They were striving for quality at
first but now it's given way to quantity. I think the turning point for me is
when they canceled Marco Polo. I no longer could count of Netflix to be better
than the other guys, by allowing a show to come to a natural enjoyable
conclusion. There is nothing worse than a show that ends mid-story. I simply
don't bother to get involved in any show anymore unless I know it has had its
due run.

~~~
ghaff
There was a lot of narrative at first around data-driven decisions etc. As far
as I can tell Netflix and Amazon have realized it’s mostly a game of darts,
data it not. They don’t have to cater to mainstream tastes as much as the
networks. But picking hit shows still seems like a crapshoot.

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local_yokel
Well, they're certainly not doing anything differently than traditional
producers when it comes to taking the axe to shows after just 1 or 2 seasons.
Whenever I see a new Netflix show released, which seems to be just about every
week now, the first thing that comes to mind is "even if I like this, will
there actually be a second season?". This degrades the time investment of
immersing yourself in a show's characters and storytelling.

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scarface74
Netflix shows also don't force their producers to make 18+ episodes a season
that draw out plots. There are lot of serialized TV shows that would be better
with shorter seasons.

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a_imho
I don't get the appeal of streaming and find Netflix shows mediocre at best.
It could very well be just my personal preference but I find HBO shows much
better.

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baq
HBO also does streaming, so I don't get your point. If it's just 'most stuff
on Netflix is cheaply made crap', that's a fact the article more or less
states in it's body. That said, the expensive things are quite good, if rare.

~~~
a_imho
I prefer cable and don't bother with streaming, period (I'm not even sure
their streaming services are available here to their full extent, mind), thus
Netflix as a service is completely irrelevant to people like me.

Second, the description fits my experiences with Netflix quality quite well,
so I don't really care about them as a producer _either_ , regardless of the
platform.

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amelius
I'm still waiting for shows where the plot can be changed on demand.

~~~
bmelton
Call me odd man out here, but I can't imagine wanting that. My input could
probably improve a bunch of shows I consider 'bad', but if I think that, it's
usually because of either lazy exposition or predictable plot lines. For shows
I consider 'good', it's hard to imagine my input making them better, or on the
chance that it did, it seems like it would ruin my enjoyment of it.

Past that, since democratizing the plot would almost certainly yield a
regression to the lowest common denominator, it seems like a really fun way to
ruin quality television.

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chc
Obviously you can't fix incompetent creators with options given to you by the
creators, but I don't think that's the only possibility here. Ithink the most
useful possibility for a technique like that would be a "customize your
experience" kind of thing. Maybe some people want more action, while other
people want more romance. There are shows right now struggling and failing to
balance the disparate desires of their audience, and sometimes they'll miss
the balance so badly that nobody's very happy. Allowing somebody to just click
a "more pew pew now" button might actually benefit those shows. Possibly.

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alexashka
It's true - Netflix is the new television.

I can't help but wonder how long it'll be before there are ads, the price goes
up a lot or it gets split up into 'channels' where you'd have to pay
separately for separate set of content.

Another thing I think that's coming, is Netflix adding daily shows like the
Jimmy Fallon show or Ellen. It seems like a no brainer - they're trying it out
with David Letterman monthly series, and it's doing very well as far as I can
tell.

