
Poutine Dynamics (2016) - arayh
https://www.erudit.org/fr/revues/cuizine/2016-v7-n2-cuizine02881/1038479ar/
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Waterluvian
I mentioned this in another thread. I'm a bit concerned about the possible
effect of declaring "cultural appropriation" on poutine and other things.

In my city, and possibly Ontario, and maybe all of Canada, Shawarma Poutine
has become a big hit. It's poutine with Shawarma chicken shaved onto it. It's
glorious. All the shops I've been to are run and owned by either Iranians or
other middle Eastern immigrants.

So to me it's a beautiful success story of immigration in Canada. These
individuals are refining a brand new dish by combining middle Eastern and
Quebecois food.

If we call it cultural appropriation and wag our finger at it, we possibly
lose out on new things like shawarma poutine. What's the fear? That others
will embrace and adopt your culture?

I feel less strongly about this part. I'm probably wrong. But I wonder if it
has to do with the feeling I felt strongly as a kid. I played Bungie games
like Marathon and Pathways before Halo came out. And then Halo arrived and a
whole new breed of gamers appeared and made it their thing. They spoke like
experts at the lunchroom table. But they didn't grok Bungie and didn't know
the origins like I did. And it made me so inexplicably frustrated at them.
They were stealing my thing.

Edit: a lot of good responses that have opened my eyes to additional
perspectives. If you've gone this far, be sure to read the responses, too!

~~~
philistine
I don’t feel like anybody is asking for any shop to stop serving anything.

The paper is highlighting the dual identity of being Québecois: whenever
Canada celebrates anything Québécois it’s Canadian, but when it’s a bad thing
then that’s not Canadian.

I remember the terrible jokes at the expense of poutine when I was a kid. How
it was a horrible Québec thing. Now the jokes have stopped because poutine is
deemed wonderful, but poutine is no longer Québecois, it’s now Canadian.

That’s cultural appropriation, and the reasonable thing to do is to express
its existence, internalize the meaning of this act, and move on. No one should
stop serving poutine.

~~~
caiob
Last time I checked Quebec reaped the benefits of Alberta's oil sands...
didn't they?

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philistine
Are you like a Russian troll trying to sow dissent or something? We're talking
about poutine!

~~~
caiob
Nope. The OP is talking about cultural appropriation as if Quebec and Canada
were 2 different places. They’re not.

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beager
I thought this would be an examination of the fluid dynamics of poutine,
perhaps a revelation that fully-integrated poutine dishes are non-Newtonian
fluids.

Additionally: given the heavy cultural significance ascribed to poutine by
this “paper”, would it follow that the import of poutine in US places like New
York under the name “disco fries” constitutes an egregious form of cultural
appropriation and erasure?

I just want to enjoy my fries, man.

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cal5k
The title is fun, but this is a terrible paper. Yes, Canadians poke fun at
Québécois, and sometimes poutine is used (but rarely these days given its
popularity).

But a big part of Canadian culture is being “in on the joke”. We tend to love
it when we’re satirized in the media, particularly American media. I think
this appreciation for jokes made at our expense is partly responsible for our
high volume of comedian exports.

So we make fun of BC folk, they make fun of Torontonians; Quebecois make fun
of Acadiens; we all make fun of PEI. It’s not done from malice, just good-
natured ribbing about our differences.

This paper is a great example of research-free critical theory.

~~~
jperras
> It’s not done from malice, just good-natured ribbing about our differences.

I'm Québécois. My family has been Québécois for hundreds of years. My first
language was French but I spoke English from a very young age, and went to a
mixture of English and French schools. I watch Québécois movies and tv shows,
listen to Québécois music and radio, and cook traditional Québécois food for
myself and friends every chance I get.

I can't vouch for any of the other Canadian subcultures you've named, but I
can assure you that I never enjoyed the taunting, the name calling, the
literal physical violence (I got beat up many times as kid because I was "one
of those fucking French frogs"), and not to mention the inevitable eye rolling
and pointed questions about why my particular cultural heritage was even
allowed to exist in Canada.

Some people view us as some sort of blight that needs to be eradicated because
we don't fit the mould of what a "Canadian" is. I've had people tell me to my
face that they "can't wait for the French to just die off in this country",
and then laugh because they think it's a funny joke.

I'm not saying everyone is like that, and things seem to have softened in the
past few decades, but please don't believe that we enjoy being marginalized.

~~~
cal5k
I mean hey - that really sucks. It sounds like you've met some shitty people.

It doesn't change the fact that good-natured ribbing is really common in
cross-cultural contexts. I grew up in Ottawa, a really bilingual city, and
making fun of each other was part of how we all bonded in spite of our
differences.

Intent matters.

~~~
rfrey
Intent matters, but so does being aware of the effect of "punching down".
Ontario, specifically Ottawa and Toronto, dominate so much in Canada, that
people in repressed Quebec, impoverished PEI, or one of Ontario's western
colonies may not appreciate it as much as you think.

~~~
cal5k
I find this claim that Quebec is a repressed province bizarre, particularly
when more Prime Ministers have hailed from Quebec than any other province
(including Ontario):
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Prime_Ministers_of_Can...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Prime_Ministers_of_Canada_by_constituency)

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tracker1
Cultural appropriation of foods is completely natural and should absolutely be
encouraged... Do we really want southwest/mexican food without herbs based in
europe and spices from the east? Or, for that matter, removing tortilla chips,
or flour based tortillas. It's absurd to try to stop, and at a net loss to
society to do so. It's been happening forever and it's a net good.

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bungie4
Living in Northern Ontario, I'm no stranger to Poutine. All sorts of places
are popping up selling 'flavoured' poutines. Nothing beats the original. In
fact, the best poutine is found at chip stands with suspect food handling
standards. Not in fast food places nor even restaurants.

My personal favourite comes from the bush town of River Valley Ont. My god I
could go for one now and it's only 8:30am.

Hey, were all gonna die sometime!

