
The Diderot Effect: Shopping One's Way to Financial Misery - reyherb
https://businessmellow.wordpress.com/2016/06/19/the-diderot-effect-avoid-shopping-your-way-to-financial-misery/
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jimmywanger
I think the meta concept here is "congruence".

Once one gets something nice, you're trying to maintain parity between that
part of your life, compared to the other parts of your life, and you're
willing to spend moeny to do so.

From C.S. Lewis:

"The man who truly and disinterestedly enjoys any one thing in the world, for
its own sake, and without caring two pence what other people say about it, is
by that very fact forearmed against some of our subtlest modes of attack. You
should always try to make the patient abandon the people or food or books he
really likes in favor of the “best” people, the “right” food, the “important”
books. I have known a human defended from strong temptations to social
ambition by a still stronger taste for tripe and onions."

If you really like something, with a strong sense of self, you stop caring
about how all your stuff matches together.

~~~
cultofquack
For context, the exerpt is from the book The Screwtape Letters. A demon named
Screwtape mentors an inexperienced demon in how to torment humans (and drag
them down to Hell):
[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Screwtape_Letters](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Screwtape_Letters)

The book is in the public domain.

~~~
neomormon
Interesting aside: The book is dedicated to his best friend J.R.R. Tolkien.
Tolkien convinced Lewis to become a Christian:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J._R._R._Tolkien](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J._R._R._Tolkien)

~~~
teddyh
A _Catholic_ , even.

~~~
steverb
Tolkien was Catholic, Lewis was Church of England. Although I'm not sure what
bearing that factoid has on the discussion.

------
bhntr3
I just spent a few thousand dollars on new furniture for an apartment I just
moved into.

But I know I don't have this problem because my credit card company
immediately blocked the transaction and called me to make sure it was me
because it was "not in line with my previous purchase history."

If I keep it up, something tells me they won't call back to warn me I might be
succumbing to the Diderot effect. Hmm. Funny how that works.

~~~
tudorw
I'd like my cards to glow green or red depending on my rate of incoming vs
outgoings, not sure the card issuer would approve...

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hackaflocka
Well off people become bankrupt because of impulse buying decisions. Sounds
like marketers are pretty smart people, not stupid as the video at the end of
the article implies.

~~~
mark_chosenberg
Marketing methods actually working says more about customers being
dumb/irrational, than it says about marketers being smart, imho...

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voltagex_
This is made worse by tech I think. Got an Xbox, now I'd like to upgrade the
TV so it looks better with fast moving games.

Got a new laptop for work, but now my home desktop feels a bit slow by
comparison...

~~~
stuxnet79
I subscribed to Maximum PC and PC Gamer and my wallet has never been the same
:( Every issue I feel like my peripherals and hardware are out-of-date.

~~~
soylentcola
This is why I don't visit my local Microcenter unless I have something
specific I need to buy. Even then I typically put it off for a bit to see if I
really wanted that item or if it was more of an impulse/luxury purchase I lose
interest in.

When I got my current job (and matching salary bump) I built a new PC. It had
been 4 or 5 years since I built the last one and that one was assembled on
something of a budget. With the raise, I decided to go (for me) more high-end
because I wanted to celebrate my raise in a way that wouldn't really break the
bank if I later decided it was maybe a bit foolish.

So instead of my usual ~$800 budget for something that could handle all of the
"boring" daily stuff like web browsing, email, and file storage as well as
give a nice boost to rendering times when playing around with video, graphics,
and animation projects, I spent around $1500. Incidentally, it would also be
great for games so that covered all the bases for my computer uses.

It's been less than 4 years since I built that PC and I occasionally consider
an upgrade but I like to force myself to no less than 5 years between
"elective" upgrades. The PC is running smoothly. I don't have any real
bottlenecks outside the stuff you can't avoid without spending several
thousands of dollars (oh, boo-hoo, I have to play games at 2560x1440 even
though the TV/monitor is 4K native).

The incremental updates of processor generations and RAM speeds are certainly
nice but since I also suffer from this Diderot Effect, I like to do new PC
builds with all new parts to take advantage of all the improvements of the
past 5+ years.

I think on some level, I just like to occasionally take stock of the current
state of the art and put together a parts list, do the assembly, and feel the
satisfaction of a nice, clean setup that is running faster than the last
thing. So instead I just offer to build for friends when they are in need of
an upgrade. I still get to enjoy the hobbyist aspect and even though I don't
typically charge for the effort, they always leave me with a case of good beer
or a bottle of some nice Scotch.

~~~
stuxnet79
> I think on some level, I just like to occasionally take stock of the current
> state of the art and put together a parts list, do the assembly, and feel
> the satisfaction of a nice, clean setup that is running faster than the last
> thing. So instead I just offer to build for friends when they are in need of
> an upgrade. I still get to enjoy the hobbyist aspect and even though I don't
> typically charge for the effort, they always leave me with a case of good
> beer or a bottle of some nice Scotch.

I understand what you mean. I had waay more fun building my PC than using it.
Once it was all done and I had Windows 10 installed I had nothing else to do
and it was just sitting there. Let's just say that I was underwhelmed with the
final outcome, especially since I don't game much these days due to time
constraints.

I am thinking of getting a new case later this year and installing an
aftermarket cooler because this is the one thing I never got to do for my
current build, but oh boy the boredom afterwards :(

I would definitely be down to build a PC for anybody who was interested - no
charge. The work would be its own reward for me.

But yea, it is impossible to chase that high you get when putting together a
parts list perpetually as building rigs is an expensive hobby.

~~~
soylentcola
It's not something I want to do all the time. The last one I did reminded me
that it can still be a hassle when dealing with someone else's build.
Thankfully he was receptive to my advice regarding reasonable budget for what
he expected (no more requests for high-end gaming PCs under $600) and where to
put his money.

Still, a few months later it's like "hey, so there's sometimes this "ticking"
sound in the back of the PC. I think it's the power supply but I'm not sure."

"OK, well see if you can blow some canned air in there in case some bit of
plastic or paper got sucked in."

"No, it's not that."

"OK, well if it's defective, I still have the receipts so you can RMA it."

"Nah, that's too much of a hassle. I'll just order one. When can you swap it
out?"

Then I proceed to realize that he has no interest in doing this and I have no
free weekends to spend taking apart this PC and rebuilding it with another
PSU. It's one reason why small-time PC building businesses have always been
tough to run and why I never bothered to do it professionally. Any time
something is not working, I'll fix my own setup but when you build something
as a favor, it becomes your responsibility for life :/

------
DiabloD3
I understand this, but also not understand this at the same time.

Personally, I spend ridiculous amounts of money on things that are important
to me, while spending virtually nothing on items that I must have but do not
care about. However, I also err for quality over quantity.

What this describes is some sort of effect where everything in your life, by
my standards, becomes important.

Example: I own $500+ headphones, $2000+ in computer gear (computers, laptops,
monitors). I own a middle of the road phone (Nexus 5). I don't really upgrade
my computer, and replace it when it finally starts breaking down, so, about
every 6 to 8 years, which then I build another massively overkill machine. It
generally takes an average mid-tier computer all of those years to catch up to
mine. GPUs are the exception, and I used to upgrade those every 2 years until
everyone got stuck at 28nm; I've been stuck on a 7970 for awhile, due to
nothing really worth upgrading until later this year (Geforce 1000 series
_just_ came out, Polaris family Radeons in another 2-3 months), and I don't
even game like I used to, so I may just keep the 7970.

I own clothes I bought from Walmart that I replace every 3-5 years, the grand
total of nice clothes I own is two shirts and two pairs of pants, that I
bought on sale at JC Penney, and spent about $120 on, and I hardly ever wear
them.

I own a 7 year old 42" TV that I hardly watch, but has good enough visual
quality that the final generation of 1080p TVs are hardly different (better
blacks than anything else). The higher end 4k TVs ($1k+) are clearly better,
but I won't buy a new TV until a) mine actually dies, b) tomorrow's $500 4k
TVs look as good as today's $1k+ ones. This is assuming I even bother keeping
a TV. I do not own a game console.

I do not own speakers. I own extremely small library of Blurays that I am
considering selling. I hardly watch them. I own a $150 all in one printer.
Some of the furniture I own is as old as I am, or maybe older, and was left to
me when my mother passed away, it is solid wood and in good condition (all the
damage done to it, I did personally as a kid).

I own Victorinox Fibrox knives, but only four, only the ones I use (chef's,
mini granton-edge santoku, carving, boning), not a useless "complete set". I
do not expect to ever have to replace these, and I own a fine enough synthetic
wetstone to sharpen them myself, and generally keep them sharper than factory
sharp.

I own a single 10" Lodge frying pan, a 12" pan, 8" pan, and 4 quart saucepan
Mauviel M150S, usually insanely expensive (the 4 quart usually goes for $360),
picked up at a tiny fraction from a chef supply store dumping their
discontinued stock on Amazon. These, too, will last forever. I put more
mileage on my Lodge than I do on the rest.

I own a pair of normally $150 running shoes that I picked up for $60 that I
absolutely adore and try to treat well. I put about 5 miles into them every
day, so they probably will last 2 years at the absolute very most.

I don't eat out. I cook my own food, and aim for nutrition and flavor over
weird exoticness. I don't buy premade food generally, I avoid refined sugars,
grains, and non-foods ("junk food") frequently sold in stores. I aim for foods
that are in season or simply on sale this week, and then stock up and freeze
stuff. Bulk packages get turned into meal sized blobs frozen in good freezer
bags (never get the cheap shitty ones, good bags hinder freezer burn).

I don't own a car, yet I live in an area that you need a car. I am considered
low income for an area that it itself is considered low income. Although, the
irony, is I own a business, but I put my business before myself and pay myself
very little; I pay myself what I need to, not what I want to.

So, I don't know. Maybe I do understand this, maybe I don't. I generally buy
the best of something that meets my needs and is not too grossly overkill (I
like products that can grow with me) (my main computer is the exception to
this rule: overkill is best kill), and then own it as long as possible. I am a
staunch believer in the Buy It For Life movement. I do not Keep Up With The
Joneses. Their life is theirs, and I do not live their life, instead, I live
mine.

So, I don't know. I almost want to interpret the article as simply not being
an adult (not that I'm claiming I'm an adult, I'm only 33, too young to be one
of those yet), and letting childhood insecurities grab ahold of them and take
them for a ride. I don't resonate with that behavior.

~~~
bluedino
>> own a pair of normally $150 running shoes that I picked up for $60 that I
absolutely adore and try to treat well. I put about 5 miles into them every
day, so they probably will last 2 years at the absolute very most.

don't running shoes last about 300-500 miles? If you're running 5 miles a day
you're probably going to want to replace them in 4 months

~~~
DiabloD3
Walking. Does far less damage to both my legs and the shoes. It just takes
longer, yet burns almost the same amount of calories.

------
0x54MUR41
James Clear posted a great post about the diderot effect.

Why We Want Things We Don’t Need — And What to Do About It.

You may check it out here [1].

[1]: [http://jamesclear.com/diderot-effect](http://jamesclear.com/diderot-
effect)

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tluyben2
Never had any of this. Do not know many people who have that either. Does this
happen more in some places than in others?

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3chelon
I didn't make it all the way through the post. Too many exclamation marks -
after every sentence, it seems - and quoting Miley Cyrus was the breaking
point for me.

But seriously, do people really buy new watches to match their new cars? New
wardrobes to match a new pair of jeans? I never even knew this was a
phenomenon. Definitely first-world problems.

~~~
bprieto
Don't know about watches, but my wife has needed a new pair of shoes just
because she had nothing that matched a new dress, and then a new purse and
belt to go with the shoes, and then a jacket or a coat...

------
kome
rich people problems.

~~~
majewsky
Not really. If people were rich enough, it wouldn't be a problem for that. The
problem is with people who have some liquidity, but spend it on the Diderot
effect and thus become poor.

