
A Commodore 64 Is Still Being Used to Run an Auto Shop in Poland - Insanity
https://sploid.gizmodo.com/this-old-ass-commodore-64-is-still-being-used-to-run-an-1787196319
======
rullopat
The day that the C64 will break, they have to migrate to a “modern” solution
that requires 10 Ghz CPUs with 1024 cores, 20 TB of RAM, that will be running
on NodeJS that will have have a MongoDB database for transaction and that will
communicate with a VBA script running on the same host in a virtual machine
with Windows 2016 through Redis running in a container thanks to Kubernetes.

~~~
amiga-workbench
Modern """""""enterprise""""""" solutions in a nutshell.

Just throw in a shitty call-home activation DRM scheme and an authorisation
server with 50% uptime too.

~~~
forgottenpass
_Modern """""""enterprise""""""" solutions in a nutshell._

lul. My Java project with a bunch of maven dependencies and a slightly
unwieldy number of superfluous classes doesn't have anything on modern
startup's tech fetishism to over-complicate operating a website "at scale"
these days.

~~~
TeMPOraL
Funny days, when modern web development turns out to be more bloated than
Enterprise Java solutions.

~~~
amiga-workbench
Its depressing.

When the hell did it become normal to suck down 3mb of javascript and poke an
API just to display some otherwise static text on a webpage.

~~~
abritinthebay
When Ads became a thing. Most of that 3mb is 3rd party ad scripts and
analytics trackers.

Basically - when it became obvious that people wouldn't pay for content and
companies had to monitize the users.

It's lame, but.. well... suggestions?

~~~
stryk
Make content that is worth paying for

~~~
abritinthebay
Even when publishers do _people don 't want to pay for it_. This has happened
time and time again.

Also because _paying_ for content is ugly, hard, and not easy online.
Subscriptions are clunky and micropayments have never taken off.

------
ftvbffg
Year ago there were still many POS (point-of-sale) computers at retail stores
running with "Subiekt 4" in my town in Poland. I even saw one in supermarket.

DOS program from 1995.
[http://www.netsetup.pl/s4/img/Image2.gif](http://www.netsetup.pl/s4/img/Image2.gif)
Connected to old EPSON parallel-port dot matrix printer (those printers were
still surprisingly expensive).

I remember editing "Subiekt 4" to change VAT tax from 22% to 23%. 22% tax was
hardcoded. Over years there were many more tricks to keep it running, for
example "Hyperthreading disabler" program.

Year ago they were still running it in Dosbox but now it's migrated to
"Subiekt GT".

I prefer old DOS program because it was easier to copy, just xcopy program
folder to pendrive. New version uses MSSQL, and you have to reinstall and
activate online. And database sometimes breaks.

~~~
TeMPOraL
> _I prefer old DOS program because it was easier to copy, just xcopy program
> folder to pendrive. New version uses MSSQL, and you have to reinstall and
> activate online. And database sometimes breaks._

That's why I absolutely love SQLite. You get all the benefits of relational
databases while still keeping data in plain files and not having to install
system-wide stuff.

~~~
yeahdef
When it doesn't matter, like probably with the inventory of a small grocery,
SQLite can be a beauty

~~~
vertex-four
SQLite is more tested (as in code tests) than most other databases. Its
downside is that you can essentially only use it from one app at a time, and
not over a network.

~~~
ftvbffg
Subiekt 4 is based on FoxPro database, it can be used over network simply by
mounting SMB network share.

Just click "Share this folder" in Windows and run the same executable on
another computer.

~~~
vertex-four
Indeed, I was responding to GP's assertion that SQLite is only for data you
don't care about.

------
happy-go-lucky
Copy-pasting one of the replies from the page:

Reminds me of something my mom did a few weeks ago. She got a scam call from
some guy saying he was with Microsoft and he detected a virus on her computer.
(First clue it was a scam? They have an iMac. Why would Microsoft be calling?)

My mom started playing dumb and saying, “You mean my Commodore has a virus?”

“What?”

“Yes! I have a Commodore 64!”

“Uh..Do you have Windows?”

“Well, of course! I can look through them and see the birds outside! My cats
LOVE my windows...But I don’t let them up by my computer after someone told me
that computers have mice.”

“Uhm...Ma’am...Is there someone else there?”

“Nope! Just me, my 12 cats, and my 4 dogs!”

The guy hung up on her at that point. :)

~~~
beamatronic
Good on your mom. I am always curious about these scam call centers. How do
they staff up? Do they place an ad in the paper? Are the people who make these
calls normal folks like you or I who wake up in the morning, commute to the
office, sit in a cubicle and make these calls?

~~~
happy-go-lucky
Normal folks wouldn't do jobs involving trickery.

~~~
icebraining
You realize you're writing that in a forum where half the companies are
financed by advertising...?

~~~
happy-go-lucky
Is scamming advertising?

~~~
Grishnakh
No, you've got your Venn circles reversed. Advertising is a subset of
scamming, not the other way around. There's plenty of scams that don't involve
advertising; just look at Wells Fargo.

------
lasermike026
This demonstrates how small most computing requirements are. Bigger faster
systems to do what? Store an address book? Calculate taxes? Print invoices?
Most of our computing needs could be performed by a small embedded computer no
greater than a raspberry pi.

~~~
drzaiusapelord
The modern version of this is something with a big dumb GUI that is trivial to
train on. A CLI or text only approach is going to take longer to learn and be
comfortable with. I get TCP/IP with modern stuff which allows me monitoring,
remote access, remote upgrades, etc. We also get standardization.
Windows/Linux and USB aren't going anywhere anytime soon and even if they do
we can emulate x86 systems in a hypervisor. If your ancient non-x86 system
dies you either get lucky on ebay or you don't.

I also can't casually send the customer a text telling them their car is ready
or have my supervisor look at my metrics on what I'm doing with the machine.
Or a million other things on these old systems. Or you can, sorta, by
shoehorning in garbage like analog modems and swapping out floppies all the
time, but who wants to do that?

I think young people tend to fetishize old tech because they weren't there
when it was used. Floppy failures were common, IRQ issues, programs taking
down the entire OS, no real security, and "the computer" was something the
specialist at your shop took days of training to learn how to use and when he
wasn't there "the computer" was useless. Now its been vastly democratized and
has higher levels of ease of use. That comes at the cost of complexity.

~~~
TeMPOraL
Let me put it like this:

    
    
      productivity
          ^
          |                          old, complicated     /-
          |                               tools       /---
          |                                       /---
          |                                    /--
          |                                /---
          |                            /---
          |                        /---
          |                     /--
          |                 /---
          |             /---        /-------------------------
          +----------/--------------           modern, pretty
          |      /---                              "tools"
          |  /---
          |--
          ---------------------------------------------------->
                                                  experience
    

The modern trend of dumbing down interfaces (which is primarily happening in
the markets where you sell apps by how pretty they are, not how useful) indeed
makes it easier to learn them - at the cost of making the application less
functional, and less useful overall.

> _and "the computer" was something the specialist at your shop took days of
> training to learn how to use and when he wasn't there "the computer" was
> useless_

You say as if this was a bug. It's a _feature_. This is the fact for _any_
kind of complex, powerful tool - whether it's a combine harvester or furnace
or industrial laser cutter - takes traning to use to its full power. Making
software easy to use fully from the get-go only means making it not do much.

~~~
etjossem
> Making software easy to use fully from the get-go only means making it not
> do much.

False dichotomy. It is absolutely possible to write modern mass-market
software and also offer complex functionality that wouldn't be needed by the
average user. It is good practice from a UX perspective to avoid surfacing
advanced features unless the user is actively looking for them (in your
example, that's the experienced user).

I like the graph, though.

------
Dowwie
6 hours ago there was a [post to the original story]
([https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12603909](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12603909)).
That HN article was LATER marked dupe by THIS gizmodo repost.

This is essentially the opposite of what I'd expect to happen.

~~~
zeveb
And that original story is better, with more details.

------
jwr
Older usually means simple and simple is usually more reliable than complex.
Think about it for a moment — these guys don't have a problem with auto-
updates, viruses, or network intrusions.

As I write this, I'm looking with growing trepidation at the menus on my new
TV, especially the "Anti-Virus" section. Seriously?

~~~
tomatsu
> _I 'm looking with growing trepidation at the menus on my new TV, especially
> the "Anti-Virus" section._

Some of those "smart" TVs even have a camera and microphone. Your TV could be
spying on you. Isn't that nice?

~~~
TeMPOraL
That's pretty much straight out of Orwell's 1984.

~~~
orly_bookz
1984's technology has pretty much become a joke at this point.

Who cares about your TV watching you when you broadcast your every move all
day long, your spending habits are tracked and analyzed, and a passive global
actor could turn your phone mic on just about any time?

------
toomanybeersies
Related:

McLaren needs a 20-year-old Compaq laptop to maintain its F1 supercar

[http://www.theverge.com/2016/5/3/11576032/mclaren-f1-compaq-...](http://www.theverge.com/2016/5/3/11576032/mclaren-f1-compaq-
laptop-maintenance)

~~~
drzaiusapelord
McLaren decided to standardize on a conditional access card for security,
which made sense back then, but it used a pcmcia interface. None of these are
dealbreakers but it runs DOS which doesn't have modern drivers for USB
adapters or new laptops.

I imagine they could fix this in a variety of ways, but probably don't care
and the number of old HP laptops compatible with this system vastly dwarf the
number of F1's made, so there will never be a worry about not having one. Nor
is this laptop customer facing, so its low priority to make it "look good." I
also imagine booting up a hypervisor environment and dealing with dongles and
adapters might be annoying/too technical/too buggy for the mechanics to have
to deal with when they just want to work on a car and have an old but fool-
proof laptop with almost no wear and tear ready to go.

~~~
lmm
Could one run DosBOX or similar and have the host system pass-through PCMCIA
(connected via a USB adapter or some such)?

~~~
toomanybeersies
My experience with passing through peripherals to VMs is that often it doesn't
work very well.

Earlier this year, I was doing some embedded systems work. The board could
send serial data to the computer as a USB CDC device.

It wouldn't work at all in Windows, or a Linux VM in Windows, as Windows
wouldn't even recognise the device.

So I suspect that it may not be as easy or as cheap to use DosBox or a VM as
it is to just use old laptops.

------
hrgeek
Wow, that has my story beat. A few weeks ago I was shopping at a football
(soccer) gear shop and the man running it rang me up on a computer he’s had
since 1994. I want to say it was a Packard Bell, but I’m not sure about that.
He had to manually type in the product code of each item I bought, and then
printed out a receipt on a dot-matrix printer. Then he swiped my credit card
on his iPhone to complete the transaction.

------
JustSomeNobody
Wow. They should totally rewrite everything in React.

~~~
joezydeco
What are you, a luddite? It's Rust for everything now.

~~~
JustSomeNobody
Ah, yeah. I forgot what week this was.

~~~
heywire
Wait, did I miss the rewrite in Go?

~~~
joezydeco
We were too busy with the Haskell port to let you know. Sorry.

~~~
huskyr
Jeez, why don't they just rewrite it in Brainfuck.

~~~
HalcyonicStorm
Nah, fam, it would be so much more efficient to write it in Elixir

~~~
keeganjw
I'm going retro and writing this in Prolog. I'm so over these modern
languages.

~~~
jharger
Why stop there? Why not lisp?

~~~
sedachv
You can even keep the Commodore!

[https://www.c64-wiki.de/index.php/PROLOG_64](https://www.c64-wiki.de/index.php/PROLOG_64)
[https://www.c64-wiki.de/index.php/LISP](https://www.c64-wiki.de/index.php/LISP)

------
mrbill
Surprised nobody's mentioned the filter manufacturer in Conroe, TX that was
still using an IBM 402 and punched cards as recently as three years ago.

[http://www.chron.com/news/article/xx-4459714.php](http://www.chron.com/news/article/xx-4459714.php)

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pxCZ35y3O04](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pxCZ35y3O04)

------
WalterBright
I tried powering up some of my old 20-30 year old computers I'd stowed in the
basement. Only one of them booted up, the rest had various POST failures, some
even would make snapping noises and emit smoke. Older mechanical parts like
drives have grease in them which dries out and the moving parts freeze
together.

I suspect it is the result of bad capacitors that decay over time, but
nevertheless it is disappointing.

~~~
CannisterFlux
They mention this phenomenon often on the RCR podcast
[http://rcrpodcast.com/](http://rcrpodcast.com/) the problem tends to be the
power supplies going wrong, causing surges that fry the computers. New modern
power supplies for old computers is their recommendation, rather than risk
using the old supply and damaging good hardware. Too late now though!

~~~
WalterBright
That's good to know, but as you say, too late :-(

------
maze-le
A lot of banks still use COBOL systems from the 70ies in their backend
stack[0]. It might be the same issue with this small C64 for business: "Never
touch a running system"

[0]: [http://www.bankingtech.com/375941/cobol-bank-
it/](http://www.bankingtech.com/375941/cobol-bank-it/)

------
dgreenlieber
I love this, here is a straightforward technology getting the job done! Too
many sophisticated and advanced solution are being built for no reason.

------
userbinator
Commodore 64 software is still being developed quite actively by hobbyists, in
the form of demoscene productions:

[http://www.pouet.net/prodlist.php?platform%5B%5D=Commodore+6...](http://www.pouet.net/prodlist.php?platform%5B%5D=Commodore+64&page=1)

I recommend anyone curious about retrocomputing to watch a few demos --- it
can be quite surprising to see what can be done on hardware orders of
magnitude less powerful than available today.

~~~
happy-go-lucky
Impressive.

~~~
nocman
Most impressive.

:-D

(sorry, watched Empire again recently and couldn't resist)

------
skoczymroczny
Many shops/stores in Poland still use applications written for DOS for item
management and stuff. Sometimes they get an upgrade, meaning they get a
Windows install with the application running in DOSBox.

------
dcminter
Commodore 64C rather than the plain old 64 I think. Still very impressive! How
on earth is that disk drive still working!?

~~~
dogma1138
Older disk drives are considerably easier to fix, what often fails are the
mechanical parts usually springs, gears or drive bands.

And even when you do have a solid state component failure those are usually
fairly easy to diagnose and repair since they are all made out of pretty big
discrete components.

Not that long ago you could still easily fix a motherboard, these days it's a
royal pain with everything being integrated and with 8 or even 10 layer boards
the power planes are usually inaccessible to users, and signal integrity is so
critical that you can't even rebuilt the vast majority of traces reliably.

10 years ago you could easily replace the power distribution system on a
motherboard and even a large part of the chips, I've managed to replace the
network chipset on a few motherboards when it blew out because some genius
plugged a hot POE ethernet cord into it and the magic smoke came out.

Other than that replacing caps was a pretty standard procedure for reviving
old motherboards, even that these days is considerably harder.

~~~
PhasmaFelis
The drive for our old C64 developed a thing fairly early on where some spring
or other near the back would get out of alignment and the head would stop
reading. It basically just needed to be poked back into place with a
fingertip, but you had to open up the casing to do it.

After repeated repair requests from frantic seven-year-olds, Dad cut a hole in
the back of the drive just big enough to poke the blunt end of a pencil
through so we could fix it ourselves. I learned to detect the subtle change in
the drive's whirr when it was out of alignment, to distinguish that from any
of the other things that could go wrong (corrupt disks, usually).

------
jo909
Not to be too nitpicky, but it is not used to run "the auto shop".

It is essentially part of a drive shaft balancing machine. We should think of
it as the embedded controller and display of the machine to understand why
nobody would replace it while it is still working.

And I'm sure there are plenty of old machines around where some electronics
inside are literally or very similar to general purpose computers of the era.
But often the physical integration into the machine hides this.

Nevertheless impressive this thing is still running!

------
wiredfool
There's a liquor store in Washington that was still using C128s for their POS
system as recently as a year or so back. They had a couple of spares stashed
on the top shelf.

~~~
walkingolof
Go there, get a photo (or a couple) and post it here ! It would be very
interesting to see what software they use.

~~~
tssva
The Commodore 128 had two processors, a 8502 and a Z80, and could run in C128,
C64 or CP/M modes. The Z80 was used in CP/M mode. It would be interesting to
see which mode the software runs in. I know there is still a POS system for
the Commodore 64 sold and supported.

------
nickpsecurity
A local chain whose computer rebooted showed it to be using IBM's OS for POS.
Last copywrite was 1999. I found out that it was an customized version of
Concurrent DOS.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Concurrent_DOS](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Concurrent_DOS)

Its history is quite amusing compared to some other OS's with better design.
Last I heard was that the company's bigger stores upgraded to Fujitsu Linux
(???) that runs that DOS system in an emulated or extended way. The backend is
SCO Linux and mainframes. The self-checkouts, per the techs, run on Windows
Embedded for GUI, the DOS thing emulated in there somehow, and a connection to
backends.

It's clear they keep going out of their way with more complex designs and
configurations to prevent replacing that relatively-simple DOS app. Hilarious.

------
127001brewer
I still have a Commodore 64 with its original box and booklet (which includes
lessons in programming with BASIC).

~~~
amiga-workbench
I've got mine setup at work in the meeting room

[http://mos6581.com/pictures/commodore-64/desk.jpg](http://mos6581.com/pictures/commodore-64/desk.jpg)

I keep my IBM PC setup at home

[http://mos6581.com/pictures/5170-canvas/DCSF0009.jpg](http://mos6581.com/pictures/5170-canvas/DCSF0009.jpg)

~~~
tech2
Oooh, leaf-spring or micro-switch Competition Pro?

I loved my leaf-spring one, it was built like a tank. When friends destroyed
their Quickshot IIs in Daley Thompson's Olympic Challenge, mine just kept on
trucking :)

~~~
amiga-workbench
Its leaf-spring, personally I find them a bit unresponsive compared to the
micro-switch models.

~~~
tech2
Oh, sure, I probably pulled that thing apart several times over its life-span,
but I loathed the clicking and lack of reliability of the micro-switch based
sticks.

------
JunkDNA
My uncle still does inventory for his business (small dancewear retailer) on
an Apple II. I believe he recently "upgraded" to the IIgs because he started
having trouble getting parts.

------
headmelted
In the late nineties I used to work at a Quasar centre (a type of laser tag),
and the control system was a two-up DOS display built out of ASCII characters.

Even then, we joked about how old the computer was (a 386 IIRC, a long time
back now). It still strikes me that while the hardware in the packs failed
pretty often, I can't recall a single crash in that software the entire time I
worked with it.

I suspect in retrospect it was statically linked with few to no dependencies,
which probably helped a lot.

EDIT: I'm even older than I realized. Shit.

------
jug
Funny thing with the quote from Commodore USA's Facebook page. These guys are
irrelevant to Commodore 64's other than having bought rights to use the
name... :P Weird also how their Facebook page is still active, but their
website and forum is defunct with no effort made to clarify their situation
with their founder deceased since 2012.

------
tiben_
There was a similar case of an Amiga used to control GRPS heat and AC in a
school: [http://woodtv.com/2015/06/11/1980s-computer-controls-grps-
he...](http://woodtv.com/2015/06/11/1980s-computer-controls-grps-heat-and-ac/)

------
yitchelle
Don't change a working system.

------
ageofwant
I glued a raspberry pi to the back of an old vga monitor I use in the garage
to look up stuff on the tubes while pottering. There is no reason why that
setup won't still be going strong in 20 years, no moving parts, passive
cooling. Very much the same for the commodore I recon.

The tubes of course will move on tech-wise while the pi will get a few years
of updates before 2030's firefox is a bit to far for a 2005 arm processor.
Another 10 years may pass before a significant number of sites becomes
inaccessible on a 10 year old browser. And then it will still be useful as a
commodore emulator.

------
Pharylon
Probably a lot of spaghetti code doing those calculations. Time for a rewrite!
;)

~~~
mhd
I wouldn't even be sure about that. I could just be a simple formula with a
couple of lines of Basic. But all the prompts are using the right terminology
(and language), the output is just as you need it and no one ever wrote a
version that runs on something else. If it ain't broken...

Homecomputer programming was just so very accesible. I'm reminded of "Why
Johnny can't code"

[http://www.salon.com/2006/09/14/basic_2/](http://www.salon.com/2006/09/14/basic_2/)

------
JustSomeNobody
It would be nice to hear more details because there's some discussion around
how to replace this technology. An alternative perspective is to ask how much
longer will this technology need to run? At what point will the equipment used
to balance the drive shafts no longer be necessary because the older vehicles
are no longer road worthy? Sure, I'm assuming this setup is for older
vehicles, and that's why I'd like to hear more info, but the point is to not
simply think about replacing an existing technology when it's better to let it
run it's course.

~~~
striking
Balancing driveshafts is a very current procedure. The vast majority of cars
still use driveshafts today. And it's difficult not to use a computer to
balance them.

In this case, they just use a C64. If it ain't broke, don't fix it, right?

When it does eventually stop working (give it another decade or so), they can
probably just buy another C64.

And then after that one dies, probably, cars will no longer require
driveshafts. But who's to say; the prevalence of oil has survived much longer
than many expected.

------
mbrock
I wonder if there's a local computer shop that supports their computing needs,
like repairing the C64.

The waste and exaggeration in computers is astounding. We're driving SUVs when
we could be biking.

------
CyberDildonics
It seems like there might be some sort of a market for a very simple computer
that had every piece of the puzzle well documented and straightforward. Maybe
even have just about everything visualized so you can see what is going on
with your IO ports, interrupts, etc.

Unfortunately it seems computers just got more complex and less transparent,
but with modern technology I would think you could take a step back and make
things much more transparent.

~~~
chillingeffect
ironically, it seems whatever function this C64 does isn't well-documented so
it can't be easily ported to another platform. :)

I guess it's a question of "do you want to port the code or the platform" :)

------
vasaulys
I seem to recall reading that the original IBM PC was still in use at United
States National Weather Service outposts. Why fix it if it isn't broken?

~~~
LeonM
Because if it breaks, there are no spare parts, the people that maintained the
system are long gone and the software that it ran probably does not run on a
modern computer/OS.

Related: [http://www.zdnet.com/article/a-23-year-old-
windows-3-1-syste...](http://www.zdnet.com/article/a-23-year-old-
windows-3-1-system-failure-crashed-paris-airport/)

~~~
bigger_cheese
There are some old servers at my work.

The oldest box I've personally seen runs Windows 3.1 it is a specialized
measurement instrument (Microwave radar) with a hardware card that runs in an
ISA slot.

There are also a fair number of RS/6000 Unix boxes which are getting pretty
long in the teeth.

For spare parts I've heard sometimes engineers buy things like Scsi hard disks
off of ebay.

------
zepesm
Btw, there's first video: [http://www.trojmiasto.pl/wiadomosci/Warszatat-
samochodowy-za...](http://www.trojmiasto.pl/wiadomosci/Warszatat-samochodowy-
zaslynal-dzieki-26-letniemu-komputerowi-Commodore-n106004.html)

------
happy-go-lucky
It's been about five years since I bought this laptop (refurbished ThinkPad)
and I'm sure I'll be using the same laptop another five years down the road.
Many people are still using relatively old hardware and it meets most or all
of their needs.

------
kilroy123
At least you don't need to worry about them fixing something that doesn't need
fixing.

------
achr2
Are there any real-time operating systems out there currently that both run on
modern hardware (maybe a raspberry Pi) and offer a simple programming option
(not necessarily Basic, but something similarly approachable)?

------
davidgh
This is irresponsible. That machine has been out of support for decades. I bet
it's hacked and contributing every bit of its 1 MHz to a massive DDoS.

------
happy-go-lucky
I think there still is and will be a market for systems with as few resources
as possible, as long as they meet most computing needs.

------
syntex
It survived a flood, but how it survived all that industrial dust for so many
years?

~~~
blakeyrat
It's a Commodore 64. It has no moving parts (I assume the disk drive isn't
ever touched) and the CPU doesn't really produce enough heat for cooling to be
an issue.

The story would be perfect if it were an original C-64 instead of the C-64C
redesigned variant.

------
icantdrive55
So many auto shops/machine shops would be lost without access to older
computers. So much equipment needs to be plugged into parallel ports.

"If it works, why muck with it?"

~~~
lallysingh
Or new computers with $20 parallel port/serial PCIe cards...

~~~
detaro
Good luck getting old applications requiring ancient OSes to work on those.

~~~
Grazester
Run them in a VM? Guess that would be complicating things?

~~~
nibnib
Anything with critical timing that runs over a parallel port can be very
tricky to get working in a VM. It means running a realtime OS on top of a non-
realtime OS, with some abstraction layers added. A C64 is very deterministic
in comparison.

~~~
kevin_thibedeau
I've had luck getting DOSEmu to interact with parallel port hardware. Don't
know how well it would work on x64 though.

------
nathell
Previously:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10951404](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10951404)

------
honkhonkpants
This doesn't even strike me as being all that old. I still see plenty of IBM
3270 systems in warehouses and suchlike places in the USA. Those are at least
as old as a C64.

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grej
Duplicate from 14 hours ago:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12601820](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12601820)

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bitmapbrother
At first I thought it was a Commodore 128 because of its form factor. I never
knew the 64 came in that form factor as well.

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madewulf
This post and its comments totally feels like a post from Slashdot.

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jerf
Somebody in the area should offer to help them out. Someone who knew what they
were doing could pretty easily suck the whole thing into an emulator, and that
would keep them going probably for the next several decades, if they like,
without having to worry that the hardware going out will cause them problems,
or that the disks will crap out.

(I'd consider it myself but I'm about 2400 miles away.)

~~~
anarcat
You are assuming they need help. It seems to me they are doing fine.

Whatever your thing will run on, will it still work in another 30 years? Our
hardware is so flaky that everyone in the industry is depreciating at 3-5
years or less. Sure, platforms can stay the same, hardware-wise, but you'd be
really lucky if you can still run the same _software_ that you did before.

And yes, you can run an emulator, but who's going to maintain the underlying
platform? Is it going to be connected to the internet and be part of the next
gargantuan IoT DDOS attack.

What those guys is need is another Comodore 64, brand new. It has proven it
works, why change it?

We need to take a serious look at this stuff: this is what we should be doing.
Not writing yet another freaking web server, but stuff that can still be
operational in 30 years.

~~~
joss82
I wish I could upvote you twice.

This is so very true, I can't think of any device that will offer them any
kind of improvement over the brand new C64 scenario.

What device that is installed today will still be working 30 years from now?
Maybe some appliances without moving parts? Some raspberry PIs?

~~~
jerf
The reason to get on the emulator platform is that it only needs to be
something that can run an emulator and have a bit of hardware hooked up, which
is nearly everything that exists today. The "nearly everything that exists
today" will be easier to get a hold of, even in 30 years, than Commodore
hardware.

~~~
vidarh
Just recently Individual Computer released a C64 motherboard replacement that
is cycle compatible with the original, with the original IO ports etc.

On top of that there are about a dozen FPGA boards with a wide variety of C64
cores that will also give you more or less (depending on version) cycle
compatibility with the C64 and varous degrees of availability of ports.

I think you underestimate how long hardware compatible with these systems will
be available vs. the effort that would be involved in keeping an emulated
setup working across migrating hardware and OS models and ensure the hardware
interface they need keeps working for each new generation.

