
Show HN: A Global Co-Living Subscription for Nomads - brunooo
http://www.thecaravanserai.co/
======
archagon
This is a really interesting idea, though maybe a bit too expensive and, ah,
"hip" for my tastes. (Currently hopping from Airbnb to Airbnb flatshare,
paying $1000 or less a month for housing with internet and utilities included.
Would be even cheaper if I wasn't in Western Europe.)

I've been thinking lately of where I would like to live for most of my late
twenties and early thirties. I'm definitely a bit of a loner, but at the same
time, I like living as part of a close-knit community. I wish I could find a
little "tribe" of self-directed folks roughly my age in an old, creaky house
somewhere in the mountains... or on a remote island... or in a forest, or
something. Just people working on their projects, tending to their garden,
raising some chickens (or maybe some kids), enjoying the fresh air, and mostly
living away from the rest of society. An art commune for the 21st century, I
guess.

Unfortunately, if such a place exists, I doubt it has a website, and I
especially doubt they'd take in strays. Guess I'd have to organize it myself.
It's too bad I don't know anyone else who'd want to live like this. (And even
if I did, who knows if we'd get along?)

Maybe I'll just go and become a hermit.

~~~
caser
Hey archagon - you should check out our group: hackerparadise.org

We've already run a co-living, co-working trip in Costa Rica and are about to
begin another one in SE Asia.

~~~
jayshahtx
Hey Caser,

Very interested in applying - are you still accepting applications? I saw the
first trip starts this month.

~~~
caser
Hey Jay - yes we're still accepting applications. You can join us part-way
through.

------
larsberg
You've probably already thought about this, but you might want to make sure
clients understand the legal side of things. We've certainly had some cases at
Mozilla where remote workers had to be "reminded" that we could only pay them
if they maintained residency in their official company of employment, that
they would be in violation of the tourist visa they had traveled to these
other locations under if they worked there for 3 months, etc.

It's a bit of a minefield, and I only know the warnings that legal/HR tell
managers :-)

~~~
hackerboos
> You've probably already thought about this, but you might want to make sure
> clients understand the legal side of things.

I doubt that for $1600 a month this includes all the legal paperwork in order
to work in Portugal, Mexico and Indonesia.

It's another abuse of the visa-free status many Westerners are given by
countries that wish to attract tourists.

This is the second one I've seen today. First is here - [http://drrn.net/why-
did-i-move-to-thailand-to-bootstrap-my-s...](http://drrn.net/why-did-i-move-
to-thailand-to-bootstrap-my-startup/)

 __Edit: I 'm not aware of any new Thai visas being announced. It definitely
would have been mentioned on ThaiVisa.com. Please post a link. __

~~~
brunooo
Things are changing very fast atm, as most countries realize that it's a good
group of people to have.

Eg Thailands new 6 months Visa explicitly includes remote work.

~~~
personlurking
Portugal, as of a few years back, allows one to (theoretically) continually
renew their 90-day tourist visa. In a few other EU countries (like Denmark),
it's possible to stay an extra 90 days per their own non-Shengen laws.

[http://www.reddit.com/r/travel/comments/1e83wv/extra_90_days...](http://www.reddit.com/r/travel/comments/1e83wv/extra_90_days_visa_free_in_denmark/)

------
unfortunateface
Have you considered having some storage in the house that automatically
follows you around the world as you move from place to place ? i.e. your
belongings just turn up at the house you are currently staying in without you
having to deal with shipping?

Edit: to clarify/simplify

~~~
brunooo
That's very high up the list, bulk shipping of standardized boxes is the
favorite solution atm, but didn't do in-depth cost comparisons etc.

Just was stuck for a few days in the Alps with the overhead bin luggage for
Bali on the way back to SF, so i feel your pain.

How would you prefer to have it handled?

~~~
unfortunateface
I would love to be able to travel between one of your houses in London to Bali
with only a carry on luggage (e.g. a few days clothes and my laptop) - then
have a box of clothes follow me within the week.

Clothes are probably a good place to start. Having a simple cupboard draw that
is automatically sent would be good (cost permitting).

\- Most people shouldn't have a problem with you searching through this sort
of thing for illicit goods

\- I think it is mainly clothes that take up the bulk of space in peoples
suitcases

\- Clothes can be compressed for space/cost efficiency

Edit: added an extra thing!

~~~
brunooo
Love the modular idea of literally using the drawer (we plan something similar
for the kitchen cold storage).

Thanks!

------
jballanc
Wait...you've named your startup "Caravanserai" and you _don 't_ have any
destinations on the actual historical Silk Road? For shame!

Turkey is an amazing place to work and live, there's an incredibly vibrant
hacker community, and the people are some of the most welcoming in the world
(especially if you're a visitor). Istanbul rents on the European side can run
pretty high, but on the Asian side (and with the way the exchange rate is
going these days), I think you'd be remiss to leave it out.

If not Istanbul, Ankara has a bunch of universities and rents are considerably
cheaper. Bodrum, too, has relatively low rents and absolutely _amazing_
natural beauty. Ok, enough ranting...

Seriously cool concept, though. I look forward to seeing where you take it!

~~~
brunooo
Haha, true dat.

We looked at Istanbul, but it was prohibitively expensive, at least for our
Beta batch where we reserve certain safety buffer for things that could go
wrong and in the neighborhoods we looked at.

Coastal towns like Bodrum could be a nice choice, any areas in Istanbul we
should reconsider?

~~~
jballanc
Other places to check: Üskudar, Kadiköy, Maltepe, and Kartal...pretty much
anywhere along Bağdat street will still have a lively atmosphere, good access
to transportation, and low _er_ rents. The Asian side is actually growing
faster than the European side, so while Beyoğlu is still the focus of social
life in Istanbul, Bağdat Cadessi is pretty active. Also, Sabiha Gökçen Airport
(on the Asian side) has a growing number of very cheap connections to
destinations in the area.

~~~
brunooo
Thanks! Very much so.

~~~
dzenanr
Alanya is a beautiful coastal city in Turkey with reasonable prices.
[http://www.hello-alanya.com/](http://www.hello-alanya.com/) Sarajevo in
Bosnia is inexpensive and programmer friendly.
[http://www.sarajevotimes.com/hub387-launches-first-
regional-...](http://www.sarajevotimes.com/hub387-launches-first-regional-
startup-accelerator/)

------
titanomachy
Not to rain on your parade, but isn't it a bit disingenuous to compare your
cost with living in NY or SF? I mean, of course it's _much_ cheaper to live in
Lisbon or Mexico City, regardless of the particular accommodation.

~~~
polshaw
Yeah, anyone considering a digital nomad lifestyle isn't typically looking at
NYC or London; the most popular destination of Chiang Mai is rated at
$638/month all-in[1], and most have rent $300-$500 /month, not $1500.

I really love the concept but as presented it isn't appealing. The idea of not
having to deal with all the hassle of finding and organising accommodation is
great.. but they only have (and not even that yet) 3 locations. "hey you can
travel the world (3 locations)" doesn't have so much appeal. Obviously they
plan on expanding but the price is for now, not the future.

I suspect that if someone decides to stay for more than a couple of months
they will often splinter off into cheaper accommodation. Having the fixed fee
also makes it difficult to set up in the most sensible (cheapest) areas..
because the attraction of going it alone in those areas will be higher the
better value the area is.

It strikes me they would have been better off setting up a handful of these
locations _first_ as individual nomad/co-habitation accommodation, ironing out
all the issues, and _then_ introducing the go-anywhere subscription idea.
They've left themselves an awful lot to deal with in one go.

1\. nomadlist.com

~~~
brunooo
Hi! We tried doing as you described, but the way we wanted it to be can only
be done if you own the whole stack, thus building it ourselves.

It's a completely different target group, what you describe is being done
nicely by people like nomadhouse.io and a lot of single location providers.

------
gwbas1c
Sounds like someone just renamed "timeshare."

~~~
boo_radley
To me, this sounds like a very high end version of a hostel.

~~~
archagon
A hostel composed of single rooms with office space is... like... just living.
In a house.

------
lukasm
I was hoping that AirBnB would do something like that. Great initiative! I'll
add this to my list [https://github.com/lukasz-madon/awesome-remote-
job](https://github.com/lukasz-madon/awesome-remote-job)

~~~
dcarmo
Hey, great list! I want to start working remotely soon and will make sure to
go through most of the links you curated there. Thanks!

------
Red_Tarsius
Excuse my language, but this is fucking awesome. As an aspiring technomad and
serial minimalist, I want to thank you for such great idea and execution. My
only fear is that the current service might be quite steep for the average
nomad.

~~~
brunooo
Thanks, appreciated, including the language. The good thing is: We only need
120 good people to make it work.

And we hope there are many more in cities like NY, SF or London.

------
KevinBongart
The concept is really nice!

BUT WHY OH WHY THE SCROLL HIJACKING?

~~~
ryanSrich
This isn't scroll hijacking. This ->
[http://www.milwaukeepolicenews.com/#menu=source-
page](http://www.milwaukeepolicenews.com/#menu=source-page) is scroll
hijacking. Just because it's animating when you scroll doesn't mean it's
hijacking.

Hijacking is specifically altering the speed and or movement of the scroll.

~~~
artursapek
Oh my god. Why

~~~
whyaduck
That's going to look so retro in 2020 when they get the budget to replace it!

------
guard-of-terra
This is a very nice idea already.

What should they do to make me really happy? Be able to invest some sum of
money (or an existing property?) and enjoy a lifetime of co-living (they need
much more destinations, of course). This can be a nice mode of rapid growth,
property in exchange to co-living promise.

~~~
brunooo
I wish there was a "really, really upvote this comment" button on HN.

------
awch
I had been hoping that this would eventually emerge from the nomad community -
it's a great idea.

The inclusion of a moped or shared vehicle in each location would seal the
deal for me.

~~~
jessaustin
I can see why they didn't include this. I don't know about Portugal, but I've
driven in Mexico and I know people who have attempted to drive in Bali. If
you're not from there, I don't recommend it. You might be fine on most of your
trips, but eventually the assumptions you have about driving from your home
will be violated, and there will be an incident that will cost you money. If
the car belonged to this company it would also cost them money.

One of the perks of cheap locations is that hiring a cab is cheap. Also you
can ride a bike. Also driving is the _least_ relaxing way to experience any of
these places.

------
paulftw
While not sure about this particular business model, it is the first good use
case for container hotel rooms I've ever seen.

Standardized rooms all over the world, run as a network of independent
providers adhering to the international code of practice, advertised and paid
for on AirBNB (because we already have hassle free hotel check in experience,
why build another one).

... and stuffed with IKEA furniture we all know and love :)

~~~
brunooo
Containers are indeed a great idea for less permanent locations, otherwise
solid constructions beats containers after a few years.

------
tomp
This is a neat idea, but seems quite expensive, also the price comparisons are
a bit unfair.

I can't speak for NY, but in London, you could get a nice room in a shared
flat for 890 GBP (=1356 USD) on the edge of first zone, so the commute
(monthly Underground ticket for zones 1&2) would be a much more reasonable 130
GBP (=200 USD), far from 698 USD as listed on the site.

~~~
notahacker
Yeah, the effect of the price comparison for me was ... "hang on a minute, I
could add a desk in a shared workspace to my central London room rental costs
and it would _still_ be less than the rate for the hackerspace in Bali"

------
hruu
Interesting Project Question: How can you make sure, that every Nomad has a
place to stay in each destination? If you limit the time one can spend at a
destination, the living costs would be exponentially higher as the flight
costs technically affect the flat rate.

~~~
brunooo
Honest answer is we have to optimize this as we go. You can switch in monthly
increments, first come first serve, if this leads to problems there'd be
additional rules like that you have to switch every n month or can only spend
as many in one location per year etc.

------
codecamper
Internet in Indonesia is ridiculously cheap. For $500 a month you'll have a
very nice place in Bali. No need for a year lease.

3g Internet in Portugal is a little bit expensive. Not too bad -- about 2 euro
a Gig. 500 euros a month will get you a nice place. Not sure about how long a
lease you'd need to sign.

Mexico City. Why on earth would you want to go to Mexico City?

~~~
WildUtah
"Mexico City. Why on earth would you want to go to Mexico City?"

Because the most beautiful and exciting city on Earth is full of artists,
programmers, scholars, great street food, great fancy restaurants, museums,
history, good looking and outgoing young locals, sports clubs, perfect
weather, rugged mountain wilderness, organic ripe produce year round,
religious pilgrimage sites, great universities, live music and theatre, pretty
architecture, peaceful parks, lively squares and plazas, fast easy transit and
bikeshare programs, and a constant parade of special events.

Plus, if you're earning in euros or dollars, it's cheap.

------
justizin
Sign a simple lease, travel the world? This is incredibly tempting. ;)

------
tonyhb
I can't wait to do it. Definitely in. It's awesome that you're taking the leap
to make your spaces connected across countries. And a +1 for the idea of
moving boxes around from country to country.

As an aside I can't understand why, as a first step, co-working spaces in
different locations haven't partnered up to offer this to people looking to
move around and sort out their own accommodation. Having the availability of,
say, Regus offices, with the entrepreneurship and tech focus found in current
co-working spaces would be a huge plus.

~~~
brunooo
Hi Tony, thanks! WeWork is working on this, in Europe you have things like
[https://copass.org/](https://copass.org/) launched by Betahaus and others.

Co-working is extremely interesting for us, as there are many lessons why some
worked and scaled, and why most of it didn't. A lot to learn.

------
AYBABTME
This is an awesome idea and I'm very interested.

\- Are there more locations that are considered?

\- Is this meant to grow with demand, or be limited to a few first-come/first-
served offering?

\- It's not clear to me (maybe I misread) what happens when I move to another
country. Am I holding a lock on the rooms everywhere, or am I allocated a room
on request?

I work remote, and currently in school but once done, I totally want to start
moving around the world for periods of times. Q1 2016 is about when that
should start happening.

~~~
brunooo
A lot of, from Greek fishing villages to Oakland, growing by demand.

The rooms are allocated on request, month-wise, we hopefully figure out a good
& fair system for everyone and you're more than welcome to switch informally
with others.

------
deerpig
Isn't this just a new twist on time sharing, but in places that people who
haven't lived abroad think are "cool"?

$1,600 is more than a little pricey....

------
rohunati
It took me a while to realize that I was supposed to scroll. I spent like 15
seconds trying to click something. Might want to make that more obvious.

------
tosh
If they can provide decent internet I'm in.

------
sixQuarks
cool concept, but not sure Mexico City is a good location. I've heard it can
be very dangerous, especially in the evenings.

~~~
marquis
Mexico City has extremely affordable and good quality fibre internet in
central areas (where you would want to live anyway), and the food options are
amazing. It's as safe as long as you stay aware of your surroundings and use a
taxi service. Many parts of Mexico are safe to travel, especially in high
tourism areas. I assume the property would be in the Condesa or Roma area.
You'll see americans and europeans walking around everywhere and feel quite at
home.

~~~
WildUtah
"assume the property would be in the Condesa or Roma area."

I hope so. Polanco is too snooty. The Historic Center has gotten viable for
living with residential redevelopment and revolutionary traffic calming but
still has a touristy vibe. I like family-oriented Del Valle but it's probably
better for a 40 year old than a 20 year old.

Coyoacán's ayuntamiento discourages short term residents and has driven almost
all hotels out of the area, but would make a good location close to the
National University and lively streets and parks.

I think Startup Weekend was in the Condesa.

------
rajacombinator
Cool concept if I understand correctly but of course would have to see how it
plays out in practice. (Wonder how easy it will be to switch locations in
practice.) The price sounds a bit high for those interested in nomadism.
Beautiful website but I'd suggest taking "Hahaha" off the utility price and
just put a 0 or included.

------
nutate
You might want to look into localizing your numbers. Having amounts in USD/mo
and then showing it using a decimal as the thousands separator feels silly,
even though it makes sense in MX. Something like
[http://formatjs.io/](http://formatjs.io/) can help.

~~~
WildUtah
MX does not use . as thousands separator or , as decimal separator. It uses
the symbols rationally and correctly just as the other North American nations
do.

------
nathan_f77
This looks awesome, I'm definitely interested.

I also found Coconat [1] on HN, and got in touch with them over email.
Hopefully my wife and I will be visiting them when they open in July.

[1]: [http://coconat-space.com/](http://coconat-space.com/)

~~~
brunooo
There's so much incredible stuff around Berlin, favorite so far is
[https://www.google.com/search?q=Beelitz-
Heilstätten](https://www.google.com/search?q=Beelitz-Heilstätten)

------
lucaspiller
It's an interesting idea, but it's also pretty obvious this is a for-profit
venture by OP. Not that there is anything wrong with that, but I'd like to see
something similar in more of a cooperative legal structure.

~~~
brunooo
Agree (also waiting for someone to recreate Uber as a protocol).

Not sure where Artur is heading with nomadhouse.io , but that might be an
option.

------
ildella
Bug Report: on Firefox on Linux, after pressing "I'm interested" does not
appear any message. Maybe email is not even sent, a quick look show a ping
sent to intercom that could be enough. Chrome on Linux is ok.

------
cfontes
Nice idea... But I definitely would not live for more than a week or 2 in 2 of
the 3 places listed (Mexico City, Ubud). Lisbon is fine thought.

Why did you choose Ubud instead of other places in Bali?

~~~
brunooo
It's most central, so no matter if you want to surf in Uluwatu, have drinks in
Canggu or go spearfishing in Amed, you can reach all of Bali quite easily.

I do get the slightly bad esoteric rep Ubud has, but it also got a very
vibrant "getiing shit done" community.

Are your doubt more about location or other issues?

------
desdiv
Minor discrepancy:

On the global map, Mexico City is linked to SF, NY, and Bogotá, while the text
description says: "SF, NY or _Caribbean_ for a day".

~~~
brunooo
You're right, will update later today once the HN onslaught is quieting down a
bit.

------
jmknoll
Pretty cool idea, and beautifully designed website. Any idea on what this type
of design would be called and/or how its done?

~~~
brunooo
Hi, if you refer to the site you can fork it anytime at
[https://github.com/brunohaid/houseofcards](https://github.com/brunohaid/houseofcards)
but it's still utterly broken on mobiles, will release a better version
hopefully soon.

------
peterfa
Why did you decide for subscription model? It makes sense for me if you have a
network of 10+ locations.

~~~
brunooo
Thats the goal, 3 locations on 3 continents is the MVP so to speak.

------
elif
Can my girlfriend come?

~~~
brunooo
Sure, we even think about providing daycare on site, so if you want to spend
some quality time as couple / young parents that should be a good experience.

~~~
dzenanr
Any age restriction?

~~~
ibz
For the girlfriend?

~~~
dzenanr
In general, young or old, male or female, participant or companion?

~~~
brunooo
No age restrictions, actively gender balanced, we don't really make the latter
distinction.

------
lbotos
The biggest question becomes: income taxes.

Any ideas how that will play out?

~~~
brunooo
That's a giant topic, as always, especially if you choose to spend a critical
time threshold at a certain location (> ~6 months a year normally). We do plan
to offer informal advice on topics like this as a service, but there are so
many options (keep residing in your home country, choose a location like
Estonia etc) that it's hard to do this as a legally binding service.

But again: It's manageable, literally millions of people do it.

------
mlady
Something, something globalized gentrification.

~~~
brunooo
One could argue that global gentrification is inherently impossible...

------
blhack
Can I split the cost with my partner?

~~~
brunooo
Sure. Pricing is per room.

~~~
psykovsky
You do understand that is where hotels make money, right? And that you're
doing the opposite, right?

Now, joking aside, that is awesome!

------
stockkid
This is great.

------
chisleu
I just don't dig the locations. I'm not going anywhere close to large groups
of Muslim Extremists, or Narcoterrorists.

I guess I'm just spoiled by the relative safety of the US.

~~~
bryanlarsen
Many people in Ubon, Mexico City and Lisbon probably think the US is unsafe
after watching TV & movies set in inner-city LA and Detroit, Baltimore &
Albuquerque, et cetera.

~~~
chisleu
So? Ubon and Lisbon are too close to HOT wars being waged by violent
islamists. I have no intention of being within 100 miles of Detroit either...

