
Yet Another Major Russia Story Falls Apart - mkempe
https://theintercept.com/2017/09/28/yet-another-major-russia-story-falls-apart-is-skepticism-permissible-yet/
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asdfaefasdf
I think "falls apart" is overreaching. If the claim was that 21 states were
targeted by russian hackers, and only two states repudiate that, that's less
than a 10% error rate.

Keep in mind that state governments want to make sure they aren't deemed
incompetent. But anyone who knows anything about "the cyber" knows that there
are tons of legacy systems at both the state and federal level which are wide
open to possible attacks.

The suggestion that an adversary could "scan" the networks is totally within
the realm of plausability. This is the first step of a cyber attack, and while
an individual state may be able to conclude that they weren't successfully
attacked, it doesn't mean they weren't targeted to begin with.

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smt88
Among my circle (and among news outlets), the hacking of election machines
never got that much traction -- possibly because it has little-to-no bearing
on the fate of Trump's presidency. But I also think that it has something to
do with Jill Stein's attempt to uncover election hacking (in November 2016)
and the subsequent finding that there was no successful hack.

It's important to note that hacking of voting machines has no bearing on:

\- possible attempted collusion between Kremlin and Trump campaign

\- possible manipulation of US voters via fake news campaigns (likely legal,
but possibly illegal in some instances)

\- possible illegal firing of James Comey

So while this particular angle has started to fall apart, it doesn't really
have much bearing on all the angles that people (including Congress, the FBI,
and the DoJ) are still very interested in.

~~~
thatonechad
\- there has been no evidence of collusion between trump and the kremlin. And
unless they find hard evidence then he can't be impeached

\- the Facebook ads show divine America. Russian ads included black lives
matter, Hillary Clinton, and many left leaning targets. This wasn't an attempt
to elect one candidate or another it was an attempt to divide

\- James comey leaked classified material to appoint a special prosecutor as
he self admitted. He also perjured himself by lying to congress about deciding
not to prosecute Hillary Clinton months before she was even interviewed.
Congress now has two witnesses coming forward to prove this

This is one of many things falling apart. They won't pin trump on anything and
worse case Manafort will fry and that's it

~~~
smt88
> _there has been no evidence of collusion between trump and the kremlin. And
> unless they find hard evidence then he can 't be impeached_

Agreed, based on what's been made available to the public. But there does seem
to be the possibility of collusion between the Trump _campaign_ and the
Kremlin.

I think the campaign staff colluded (or tried to), but I also think the people
involved probably covered their tracks well enough that they'll avoid
indictment.

> _This wasn 't an attempt to elect one candidate or another it was an attempt
> to divide_

Given only the Facebook ads, this might be true -- I haven't researched the
content of the ads. However, there are many other sources (including things
not made public, but referenced by the CIA and FBI) that confirm that Putin
wanted Trump to win and the Kremlin was proud of Trump's victory.

Dividing the US is much less of a victory (in both moral and practical terms)
than actually impacting the outcome of the election, especially when the
victor would be much more pro-Putin than Clinton ever was.

> _James comey leaked classified material to appoint a special prosecutor as
> he self admitted. He also perjured himself by lying to congress about
> deciding not to prosecute Hillary Clinton months before she was even
> interviewed. Congress now has two witnesses coming forward to prove this_

This is basically "whataboutism". It doesn't really matter what Comey did,
whether it was illegal, etc. What matters is whether Trump fired Comey to kill
the Russia investigation. Trump himself said that he did. Trump is his own
worst enemy -- he probably could have escaped any obstruction charges just by
keeping his mouth shut or allowing his staff to tell him what to say about
firing Comey.

If Mueller can turn that into an obstruction charge, Trump will be impeached
(especially if Congress becomes more Democratic before then).

