
Lost Brother in Yosemite - Wonnk13
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/14/sports/dean-potter-final-yosemite-jump.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&module=photo-spot-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=0
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carsonbaker
I think part of the reason base jumping is banned in Yosemite has to do with
the spectacle of it. The National Park system was founded with a mission to
preserve the serenity of our land, and to give its visitors an opportunity to
experience solitude.

But Yosemite Village is a lot like a city today. Unless you get more than a
day's hike away from the valley floor, there's no hope of finding solitude or
serenity. The Merced, with all its plastic rafts and floaties, looks more like
a waterpark than a river. And the campgrounds have more RVs than tents, jammed
so close together you can't breathe.

When a guy in a wingsuit is whipping through the valley at 100mph, whooping
and hollering, it really is incongruous with the park's mission. As is drone
flying, mountain biking, snowmobiling, graffiti-art, and lots of other things
that disturb nature.

What would John Muir have thought about BASE jumping?

My feeling is that the restriction should be lifted, probably because it's
doing more harm than good, but I think both sides of the argument are
convincing, and it's unfair to point the finger at the NPS without trying to
honestly understand their motivations. There are a lot of news headlines that
read something like, "Rules to Blame in Yosemite Accident", and then leave out
the relevant counterpoints.

~~~
davidw
> mountain biking

A heavy, shod horse tromping around and pooping all over the place is going to
do far more trail damage than mountain bikes.

~~~
maaku
The damage is to the serenity enjoyed by the people hiking or horseback
riding, not the trail itself.

~~~
stickfigure
As a hiker, I would _much_ rather step aside for an occasional biker than deal
with the huge, easily startled, smelly beasts that shit all over the trails.

~~~
lbearl
As a hiker I would much rather step aside for a slow moving well trained
animal then dive out of the way for a mountain biker going downhill way over
the posted speed limit around sharp corners.

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cwbrandsma
Twin Falls, ID is right on the edge of the Snake River Canyon, with the
Perrine Bridge connecting it to all things north of the town's location. We
frequently have bridge jumpers, as it is allowed.

Last month a 73 year old guy died when his second parachute didn't deploy
correctly. He needed the second parachute BECAUSE HE LIT THE FIRST ON FIRE!

[http://magicvalley.com/news/local/video-shows-base-jumper-
on...](http://magicvalley.com/news/local/video-shows-base-jumper-on-fire-in-
deadly-accident/article_1f8a8349-dc22-5d95-8e96-5222109d37ab.html)

I don't mourn people who die doing crazy things, so long as they are smart
enough to know better. For some people, this is how they celebrate life.

~~~
arca_vorago
I just want to point out something that might be relevant, namely that as a
combat vet, I learned that adrenaline is a drug like no other, and it's also
extremely addictive. A key point that many adventure seekers fail to take into
account, and I think it can sometimes adversely affect their analysis of
situations at the moment of truth. Always be prepared to call something like
this off, up to the very last moment, don't let the excitement or pressure
overcome the logical side of things.

~~~
nosuchthing
I really hope more studies are done about how adrenaline addiction adversely
affects behavior of people, particularly in jobs where adrenaline inducing
events are common, i.e. police, sports/athletes.

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heynk
I think HN readers would enjoy 'Valley Uprising', a documentary about the
history of Yosemite, particularly around rock climbing with segments about
more recent BASE jumping. Dean is a main character, and the film excellently
captures the 'true' spirit of the valley, full of adventurers and dreamers.

[http://senderfilms.com/productions/details/809/Valley-
Uprisi...](http://senderfilms.com/productions/details/809/Valley-Uprising)

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CapitalistCartr
Although the stated reason for National parks to restrict it isn't safety, it
is a common complaint amongst objectors anywhere. BASE jumping is inherently
dangerous. That is no reason to ban it. The highest goal cannot be to make the
World a perfectly safe Disney park.

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cjensen
National Parks are preserves; they are not playgrounds. You cannot play loud
music. You cannot drive off road. You cannot parachute. You cannot hang-glide.
You cannot camp anywhere you like. There are many strongly enforced rules to
maximize preservation and minimize disturbance.

National Recreation Areas are playgrounds. National Forests are mildly limited
playgrounds. National Wildlife Refuges are strongly regulated playgrounds.
Using a National Park as a playground is immature self-entitlement.

~~~
cromulent
Sure, but there is some hypocrisy going on. They were created "to conserve the
scenery and the natural and historic objects and wildlife therein, and to
provide for the enjoyment of the same in such manner and by such means as will
leave them unimpaired for the enjoyment of future generations."

I think the jumpers are not impairing them for future generations, but some
others are.

More than 60 people have died on Half Dome and very few of them are BASE
jumpers. The cable path up there doesn't seem to "maximise preservation".

[http://www.yosemitehikes.com/yosemite-valley/half-
dome/half-...](http://www.yosemitehikes.com/yosemite-valley/half-dome/half-
dome.htm#half-dome-deaths)

~~~
cjensen
Jumpers interfere with scenery and the enjoyment of the same.

Choosing to allow some things while disallowing others is not hypocrisy. It's
thoughtful decision-making.

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ahlatimer
> Jumpers interfere with scenery and the enjoyment of the same.

How is this particular to BASE as opposed to any of the myriad of other things
that people are allowed to do in national parks? It seems to me that a horse
blocking my view would interfere with scenery, or seeing a line of people
walking up the cables, or climbers dotting the peak, or any number of other
things would interfere just as much, if not more. A BASE jump is over in
minutes. It can take days to climb some of the bigger faces.

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cromulent
Last time I commented on this topic on HN, someone called Dean a "career
criminal".

BASE is dangerous. Wingsuit proximity flying is super dangerous, whether from
a helicopter or from an object.

However, humans have spirit and some much more than others. These people are
generally awesome. I know a few of them. We should celebrate them, and mourn
them. Maybe they aren't the Wright brothers or Chuck Yeager, but there are
still frontiers out there and these guys are pushing them back.

~~~
pbreit
That's fine. Just do it where it's legal.

~~~
cromulent
OK, we would all like that, but if you are this personality type, trying to do
push the boundaries of human flight, then you don't really consider that. You
find the best place to do it and go for it. Sometimes the law is an ass.

If Dean had sat on his couch and ate himself into a 240kg shut-in, it would be
legal, no-one would be commenting and objecting to the cost to society. I
would like more Deans and less of the shut-ins. I think it's good for
humanity. I think it's a shame when we denounce one and accept the other.

~~~
stinkytaco
>If Dean had sat on his couch and ate himself into a 240kg shut-in, it would
be legal, no-one would be commenting and objecting to the cost to society.

Except people do object to that cost to society. Indeed, I'd say there's a
much large, more organized and effective political movement to end social
security and welfare programs for the disabled than there are people who
oppose BASE jumping in the national parks.

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sf_basejumper
I never thought I would wake up to see base jumping on hacker news.

I actively do wingsuit base jumping in Yosemite National Park. I will clear up
several misconceptions.

(1) The amount of work it takes to carry all the appropriate gear up to Half
Dome or El Cap will keep away anyone but the most serious jumpers. Removing
the reference of parachutes/BASE jumping from the National Parks Aerial
delivery law will not lead to a huge increase in jumpers. One of the problems
that plagues the BASE jumping death statistics is, that unlike rock climbing,
there is no physical barrier to taking on jumps that are beyond your skill
level. Thankfully there are no gondolas in yosemite as there are in the alps.

(2) Even then, El Cap and Half Dome are two of the safest jumps in the world.
Half Dome has at its best exit points a 16s rock drop; El cap: 22 s. For
reference, many of the deaths you read about in Europe are at places like
Chamonix where a 2-4s start is mandatory for surviving the jump. You can
literally slip/trip and do 3-4 somersaults off half dome or el cap and be out
of harms way.

(3) Proximity flying is not dangerous when done with reserve. Nearly all of
the youtube footage you see of people flying 10-15ft off the ground is that
person in a steep dive, at any moment they can flatten out their wings and
they will disconnect from the terrain. The latest versions of every
manufacturer's larger suits have all been documented flying up 50-150ft in
flares. You are putting yourself in the suicide zone if you are flying terrain
that requires you to have near your peak glide ratio for the full duration of
the flight.

It sounds like Graham and Dean's logic for talking themselves into flying the
line is "there is a point 15s before the terrain, where we can abort flying
the line." And that is why quite a few base jumpers will attribute lighting
and the fact that BASE is illegal to Dean and Graham's death. Flying in low
light will affect your ability to make judgment calls about glide ratio and
trajectory.

(4) The other risk I've experienced first hand is flying in cold temperatures.
Many jumpers will jump with bare minimum daylight in the early morning and
late evening. I've done this several times, and your arm wings are noticeably
more rigid as well as your body. I have enough $$ for the fine to not ruin me
financially, so I go later in the morning, but not everyone feels they have
this luxury.

(5) None of my friends nor myself do this for an adrenaline rush. I dislike
the feeling of fear or gambling. I enjoy charting out worst case and best case
scenarios and planning jumps that give me the requisite range of error. In
some ways it is remarkably similar to test driven software development. Check
out this National Geographic feature on the work that goes into planning a
Wingsuit base jump
[http://news.nationalgeographic.com/2015/05/150526-wingsuit-b...](http://news.nationalgeographic.com/2015/05/150526-wingsuit-
base-jump-moab-national-parks-blm-potter/)

(6) Those who are chasing YouTube glory are in the minority. Most of the
jumpers I have met so far are highly intelligent individuals somewhere on the
autism spectrum (Matt G, Zach T, Adrian W). There are guys like Pat Walker who
no one has heard of that are extraordinary pilots. You will never hear of or
see some of the best stuff going on in the sport, because most folks are just
doing it for themselves. Even if the sport were legal, you wouldn't see or
hear of these guys. I have never heard a wingsuit pilot hoot or holler while
in a national park. It's uncharacteristic.

(7) We are in the early days of wingsuit base jumping, I'd say it is akin to
the early days of Formula One. As the sport becomes more mainstream the death
rate will go down. The sorts of risks and stunts are more reflective of the
sport's early adopters rather than the inherent danger of the sport. Flying a
wingsuit off half dome and pitching in the middle of the valley is safer than
skydiving, driving a car, or taking a hike for any qualified individual.

(8) Emergency Services are budgeted ahead of time. The taxpayer is not getting
an extra bill from Dean and Graham's accident. Dean volunteered within park as
a rescuer for years. Show some respect and gratitude. Also, many individuals
are wealthy in the sport and will not be collecting their social security
check, so show some gratitude for that too. Most of our major
Obamacare+medicare costs come form overweight people and old people. There are
no fat wingsuit base jumpers. And when we die, you avoid us soaking up those
funds, so again ____off with your government $$ complaints.

(9) The time under canopy for most jumpers I know is less than 30 seconds on
average. Wingsuits are so small that it is hard to see or notice them until
the parachute opens. There are an approximate 300-400 wingsuit base jumpers in
the world. And no more than 2000 base jumpers world wide; you'll hardly notice
them in the park.

(10) For those with a regulatory hard-on, there is a licensing system in
skydiving that could be used to ensure that the wrong people are not jumping.
Requiring any jumper to obtain a permit verifying they have a D-license would
keep out the inexperienced.

I could keep going addressing the amount of penis envy present in this thread
and the comments of the NYTimes, but I'll just link to the SBA
[http://www.swissbaseassociation.ch/](http://www.swissbaseassociation.ch/)
It's only in the US that this is not considered a boring mountaineering
related mid life crisis sport. Legit everywhere else.

~~~
fivethirty
Thanks for writing this.

I still rank getting getting buzzed by some dude jumping the Captain while
climbing the last few pitches of the East Buttress as one of the more exciting
things that's ever happened to me. Maybe it was you, probably not though :)

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redwood
Good documentary on this topic out now: Sunshine Superman

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lfowles
> There is a sloping rib of a ridge there, a relatively unremarkable feature
> called Lost Brother.

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Simulacra
I can see both arguments for and against. I think the NPS is also concerned
with the spectacle of people thumping the side of a mountain in front of a
class field trip, and the liability on their part (because it's not if someone
will sue, it's when).

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hootydooty
I don't know how to feel about this. I feel bad because they died but then
again they were both illegally basejumping

~~~
base698
I guess you don't feel bad when someone gets killed jaywalking either?

For next time, the default when someone dies is sadness--FYI. It's something
in humanity that makes it so.

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pbreit
The several references to falling being legal but saving yourself with a
parachute being illegal were annoying.

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dohertyjf
Holy shit that last line gave me goosebumps, especially being a climber and
extreme sports enthusiast and knowing that Dean's spirit animal was the Raven.

