
Oracle to charge for Java from Jan 2019 - Pyppe
https://www.itassetmanagement.net/2018/05/01/oracle-to-charge-for-java-from-jan-2019/
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cwyers
> Oracle have announced that, “after January 2019”, Java SE 8 public updates
> will not be available for “business, commercial or production use” without a
> commercial license.

This is blogspam and FUD. Java SE 8 will be past EOL at that point. Oracle has
announced no intent to charge for updates to Java SE 11, which should be the
current release, at that point.

~~~
Annatar
What a shame. Just when I got my hopes up.

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sudhirj
Isn't this heavily misleading? This still seems like the charges for
continuing to use old versions of Java <= 8. The article doesn't confirm or
deny that staying on the latest version remains free.

~~~
theoctopus
This is some _incredible_ clickbait. The latest JRE and JDK will continue to
be free. What Oracle are charging for is continued Java 8 support.

~~~
dmix
What type of usage does Java 8 vs 9+ have in the real enterprise world? Isn't
that still a significant amount of companies and applications?

~~~
kamaal
A lot. For all practical purposes, it very hard to get projects to move to big
version numbers in large enterprises.

Its not as simple as just recompiling code. Something like the entire
ecosystem has to move, you will have plenty of compatibility problems, code
breakage and catch-22 situations.

This is not good news for Java.

Also a lot of 'Architects' will be forced to think if they will be made to pay
for Java later. Hence should they use something else to build their latest
projects?

~~~
BjoernKW
Moving to something else entirely is even more costly than just moving to the
next major version.

The EOL for JDK 8 has been known for quite some time now.

Architects who haven’t taken that into account yet have been negligent
regardless of Oracle charging for future updates or not.

Migrations almost always require quite some effort but there was plenty of
time to prepare in this case.

~~~
kamaal
Im not talking about the existing projects.

Either way, if it comes to a point where you have to pay for something like
using a programming language. Pay whatever you have to now. But start moving
to something other tech over time.

And yeah, don't start new projects in Java.

~~~
BjoernKW
You don’t have to pay for using Java. You have to pay for continued support
for a specific Java version.

You can even continue using JDK 8 for free indefinitely. Just don’t expect any
future updates from Oracle, security or otherwise.

If you absolutely have to use JDK 8 another option is OpenJDK, which unlike
Oracle’s JDK probably will continue receiving updates even for version 8.

I also don’t see why one shouldn’t use Java for new projects. With its huge
ecosystem and modern toolsets such as Spring Boot Java is a highly viable
option for developing new applications.

~~~
kamaal
Signaling is everything here. Once you've announced that you are going to
charge for something like this, you've also in a way announced you could
charge for other things as well.

At that point, you are just better off using something else to insulate you
from things like these.

>>Just don’t expect any future updates from Oracle, security or otherwise.

That's a very big problem for most shops.

>>With its huge ecosystem and modern toolsets such as Spring Boot Java is a
highly viable option for developing new applications.

Spring Boot isn't a configuration less framework. Its basically a _only one
configuration works_ framework, change something small and nothing works. Also
code comes out so unmaintainable no one apart from the original authors
generally understands anything about it.

~~~
BjoernKW
Your last statement simply isn’t true. I’ve been using Spring Boot for years
in a variety of configurations and it works absolutely fine.

~~~
not_kurt_godel
As long as we're going with anecdata, I'll add that in my experience Spring is
a goddamn nightmare. I've spent X too many times in dependency hell with it
and have vowed to never voluntarily use it again.

~~~
BjoernKW
That’s exactly the point of Spring Boot. It makes an opinionated choice of
libraries that work well together so you don’t have to.

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Nursie
OK, but from what I can tell this isn't a fee for using java in a commercial
setting, it's a fee for access to continued support/patching of Java 8.

Java 9 is out. Java 10 is out. I can see why oracle might want to cut down
their support costs and retire their older versions more quickly.

However this will blow up in their faces if a lot of software gets exploited
due to unpatched vulnerabilities.

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jarym
I don’t see anything wrong with charging commercial users for support of an
old product.

I’m no fan of Oracle of their sales practices but the title is very misleading
by omission

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BjoernKW
That headline’s sensationalist and misleading. They’re going to charge for
continued JDK 8 updates.

JDK (and JRE) 11 will be the latest version by then. Only companies which need
or want to stay on the previous version will have to pay.

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_Codemonkeyism
Poor journalism.

1\. It's about EOL SE 8

2\. "software running Java SE 8" \- the article needs to be clear about Oracle
Java, and Open JDK and others like Azul

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yetihehe
Oracle will charge for support of Java 8, not for all Java versions.

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ShardPhoenix
Note: this applies to new updates to Java 8, as a result of the upcoming Java
11 taking over as the LTS version. Oracle is not charging for Java in general.

As a result the headline and article come across as a bit FUDdy to me.

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dynjo
Cached version
[https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:VvTCsb...](https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:VvTCsb0dnUYJ:https://www.itassetmanagement.net/2018/05/01/oracle-
to-charge-for-java-from-jan-2019/+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=th&client=safari)

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dvfjsdhgfv
Even though the clickbait title is false, I wouldn't be surprised if Oracle at
some point decided it makes sense to kill Java by "monetizing" current
releases it in this way.

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RickJWagner
This changes things. For one, Red Hat is now offering OpenJDK support for
Windows.

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vpribish
right from the weasel's mouth:
[https://java.com/en/download/release_notice.jsp](https://java.com/en/download/release_notice.jsp)

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bArray
I'm not sure what the big deal is, they are charging for older version
support. Not only this, I've been using and would recommend people switch to
openjdk.

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DonHopkins
After all those years of endlessly arguing back and forth about which
programming language is the best, the poor Java evangelists have had the
blocks knocked out from underneath them, because now you can instantly counter
any number of technical pro-Java arguments and win the argument in one word,
by simply be saying the name "Oracle", and sadly shaking your head in pity.

~~~
repsilat
And what a turnaround for the CLR. People used to say, "Sure, C# is a better
Java, but Microsoft and closed-source etc..." Or, "Sure F# looks cool, pity
about..."

Microsoft's reputation isn't what Sun's was, but it's miles better than it was
under Ballmer and light-years ahead of Oracle's. Looks like the bulk of .NET
code is released under permissive licenses, too (?)

I don't know how much "hacker goodwill" buys you when you make old-people
tech, but Java has definitely lost ground to its main competitor. Maybe their
recent uptick in language development velocity will help things.

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DonHopkins
You need "hacker goodwill" to hire and retain great people like James Gosling
and Anders Hejlsberg. Oracle doesn't have a snowflake's chance in hell of ever
hiring anyone who can hold a candle to them.

~~~
kamaal
Beyond that, its also reasonable for them to charge for Java. Java is huge,
the ecosystem, the libraries and the software built using it. Its like you
have to spend money to build a technology which every one is using to build
awesome things, and you have to not only continue investing in it, but give it
away for free.

Sun spent like millions of dollars on Java, without earning a penny in return.
At some point in time you are a company and have to make profits.

Sending all that big money down the drain for others benefits, and no profits
for yourself is something no company will do.

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singularity2001
blogspam / FUD or not, Kotlin is the beautiful future

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dmix
What is a "named user plus"?

