
Why most public apologies suck - blakethorne
http://blog.statuspage.io/why-public-apologies-suck
======
ghaff
There was a good piece on public apologies by the media critic of Time, James
Poniewozik, before he went to the New York Times:

"Public apologies are different from, well, real ones. A real apology, between
actual private humans, needs to demonstrate true remorse and learning on the
part of the offender and needs to make the injured party feel better. But in a
public apology, the apologizer, and maybe even the apologizee, is beside the
point. The real point is the rest of us–the larger society, asserting the
norms and changing boundaries of acceptable behavior… A calculated, self-
interested apology at least tells the rest of the audience someone did
something wrong, while the apologizer figures that out in his or her own time,
if ever."

[http://entertainment.time.com/2014/02/27/defense-of-the-
fake...](http://entertainment.time.com/2014/02/27/defense-of-the-fake-
apology/)

On the other hand, there are situations where some group gets offended by some
statement or action and the apologizer doesn't really get the offense, and
neither do a lot of other rational people, but the easiest path forward is to
express a lack of intent to offend without actually apologizing.

------
endgame
I loaded the page, started reading and the ENTIRE PAGE scrolled away as a
giant "Lessons In Startups" mail-signup-modal rolled in from above. GO AWAY
YOU SCOURGE OF THE INTERNET.

~~~
TeMPOraL
I don't know if anyone ever reads those e-mail addresses or if they just go to
a big database, but this time it was enough and instead of an e-mail, I wrote
a very short opinion piece on this practice of modern beggary.

~~~
endgame
Given the dark patterns on some of those signup forms, it's more like UI
mugging than begging. Do you have a link to the opinion piece?

~~~
TeMPOraL
I don't; it was contained entirely in the e-mail address I submitted in the
form, and contained a single expletive.

------
jwise0
A year or two ago, I came across the following post on teaching young kids how
to apologize:

[http://www.cuppacocoa.com/a-better-way-to-say-
sorry/](http://www.cuppacocoa.com/a-better-way-to-say-sorry/)

The thing that struck me about it is that in the process of explaining the
core of what makes a meaningful apology to children, it does a really nice job
of reflecting where, exactly, most public (and, really, private!) apologies
tend to fall down.

A good addition to this article.

------
thedevil
This might get a negative response, but let me present a contrarian view:
apologies aren't always wise, even when you screw up and feel bad about it.

To explain with an example: I learned to dance salsa a few years ago. I wasn't
advanced, but I was pretty good. I was a favorite for many - I could dance
with a beginner and make it smooth and fun.

At first, I apologized for a mistake even if it was the girls' fault. But if I
apologized, the girl stopped following my lead and it would go pretty bad and
there was nothing I could do to fix it.

I learned not to apologize until the partner had danced with me a couple times
and learned to trust me. I suspect with public leaders, it's much worse
because most of their interactions are with people who don't know them well.

~~~
kibwen
This would be an argument against apologizing for mistakes that aren't your
own, which IME comes across as a sign of insecurity and low self-esteem.

~~~
meric
Apologising for mistakes that aren't your own can also be a sign of
supplicating - saying anything to get on the other person's good graces. If
the other person's in a confident and strong position often there's no need to
apologise for things that are not your fault. If you're dancing with a very
good dancer and you're a poor dancer, and she knew that to begin with, there's
no need to apologise. Instead, own your poor dancing ability. Exaggerate a
little your poor movements. Laugh. Often a person of high skill level don't
want to play with a person of low skill level might not even be the skill
difference but because they don't want to deal with the low skill level
person's insecurities. But if the other person is, for example, was the victim
for a crime, then you might apologise even though you weren't the person who
broke into their house.

~~~
kibwen

      > But if the other person is, for example, was the victim 
      > for a crime, then you might apologise even though you 
      > weren't the person who broke into their house.
    

Saying "I'm sorry" to someone that has suffered a tragedy isn't an example of
offering an apology, it's an offering of sympathy. It's a bit strange that we
overload the phrase in this way, but I can't imagine a situation where the
distinction wouldn't be clear from context.

~~~
meric
It could apply if the person apologising is part of the police force, or if
it's a family member of the perpetrator. I think it can be a little more than
sympathy - a person is apologising on behalf of the society the person is a
part of. A visitor to a crime ridden suburb is mugged. A passerby, feeling
ashamed of his neighbors could apologise with a meaning more than sympathy.
The scope of responsibility increases the less confident and less secure the
receiver of the apology is. That's what I'm getting at.

------
danielvf
Probably the clearest cut public apology in recent times was Tiger Woods
public statement in 2010.

[http://m.ajc.com/news/sports/text-of-tiger-woods-full-
statem...](http://m.ajc.com/news/sports/text-of-tiger-woods-full-
statement/nQcg7/)

~~~
asdfologist
I have to admit, I've never seen such a long apology that does not have even a
hint of self-justification. Kudos to him, though too bad it wasn't enough to
save his marriage.

~~~
ams6110
Trust betrayed can often never be restored. The transgressor may be forgiven,
but that doesn't mean it can ever be the same.

------
nsxwolf
Most public apologies are a variation on "I'm sorry you were offended".

~~~
asdfologist
... or worse, "I'm sorry _if_ you were offended".

~~~
ghaff
I'm not sure this is always a bad thing. No, I don't go out of my way to cause
offense. However, I've certainly said or written things that caused
individuals and even groups of individuals to be pissed off in ways that I
consider irrational. (And in ways many others would consider to be irrational
as well.) Under those circumstances, if pressed, I might use that sort of
formulation. Except under extreme duress, I'm not going to apologize for
something I'm really not sorry about.

~~~
mikeash
How about "I'm sorry I offended you"?

It's the same basic statement, except it places you as the active party,
rather than putting the onus on the person you're apologizing to.

~~~
TeMPOraL
But how to say in a polite and effective way, "you're behaving irrationally,
the offence is something you created for yourself; I feel bad that you're
feeling bad now, but I did nothing I should be apologizing for"?

I sometimes find myself tempted to use a non-apology like "I'm sorry if I
offended you" in order to short-circuit the irrational anger in the other
person quickly, so that we can get to the point of actually figuring out what
I've said that triggered the problem and how their reaction was wrong, and
what's the deeper issue underneath.

~~~
mikeash
"I'm sorry I offended you" is a perfectly reasonable way to express "I feel
bad that you're feeling bad now."

I personally don't understand why you'd feel bad about how another person
feels as a result of something you've said, but not feel that you should
apologize. To me, the two go hand in hand. It's not about "should," it's not
about right and wrong, it's simply about expressing the sentiment that you
regret what happened as a result of your actions.

Even if you said something totally innocent like "I like apples" and somebody
got offended at that because they're crazy, you can still _sincerely_
apologize for that if you actually care that they feel bad.

And of course you don't have to care that they feel bad. In many cases not
caring would be a perfectly reasonable response. In which case, don't lie by
saying sorry.

~~~
TeMPOraL
> _" I'm sorry I offended you" is a perfectly reasonable way to express "I
> feel bad that you're feeling bad now."_

Thank you. The whole subthread confused me mostly about how the word "sorry"
in English works.

> _it 's not about right and wrong, it's simply about expressing the sentiment
> that you regret what happened as a result of your actions._

Yes, exactly this.

~~~
mikeash
Well, I think a lot of English speakers are confused as well. There seems to
be this idea that "I'm sorry" implicitly means, "I fucked up, it's all my
fault, I'm a worm, I deserve to die," and so forth. But it's really just, "I
wish it wasn't so, and I'd do it differently if I could go back and try
again," or something along those lines.

------
Thriptic
A lot of public apologies likely sound fake because they actually are fake.
People frequently apologize publicly solely to maintain a good public image
rather than to truly signal remorse.

------
dclowd9901
Anyone who feels actual remorse goes through all of the key "requirements" of
an apology anyway without even trying. Maybe the biggest problem with public
apologies is that they are, in fact, insincere. If I was a board member of a
major company, a requirement I would have for a CEO is their ability to feel
responsibility and remorse.

------
klean92
"Apology is a sign of weakness"

I don't know if/when this culture will ever change.

One measuring stick will be when we see baseball pitchers apologizing to the
batters they hit (intentionally or not).

------
danieltillett
I would be happy with public figures like CEO’s not personally apologising for
the mistakes of their organisation if they also refused to take personal
credit for the successes.

------
grondilu
Miss Piggy recently gave a nice example:

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ei0cAaC1Yx4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ei0cAaC1Yx4)

------
TwoBit
The Fonz was trying to say "I was wrong," not "I'm sorry."

------
yuhong
I also dislike the lack of admission of wrongdoing in most settlements too.

------
Animats
Apologies by politicians and CEOs should be accompanied by a resignation.
There is a military tradition that they should be followed by ritual suicide,
but that tradition has declined.

~~~
Animats
On September 21, 1985, Hiroo Tominaga, a Japan Air Lines maintenance
supervisor, committed suicide following the crash of JAL Flight 123. The plane
had crashed due to maintenance errors, killing 520 people. He left a note, ''I
am atoning with my death.'' The CEO of Japan Air lines, Yasumoto Takagi,
resigned, after personally delivering apologies to the families of each
victim.

That is a proper apology.

[1] [http://www.nytimes.com/1985/09/22/world/jal-official-dies-
ap...](http://www.nytimes.com/1985/09/22/world/jal-official-dies-apparently-a-
suicide.html)

~~~
ojii
I hope you're not suggesting committing suicide is a proper way to apologise.

~~~
Animats
There are times when it's the proper way.

~~~
gnaritas
No, there aren't.

~~~
thelastguy
Well, actually, there are.

In Japan, if you have disgrace yourself and bring shame upon your family, you
_have_ to kill yourself. If you don't kill yourself, honor can _not_ be
restore to your family.

This means that when your wife goes grocery shopping, people will not sell her
food.

When your children goes to school, teachers will talk down on your children.
Students will bully your children. Neighbors will assault your children.

At work, all the women will call your wife a slut behind her back, but making
sure it's loud enough for her to hear it. Your wife's boss will make sexual
advances toward your wife because she is now no longer a respectable woman.

You clan members will disown your father and make fun of him for birthing such
a disgraceful son.

When disown by a clan, you and your family can no longer go to them for
support in any form (financial, emotional, social, etc).

Police will purposely pulled you over and give your a ticket.

You son will not be able to get a job because no one will want to hire him. No
one want to associate with a disgraceful person like him.

All these societal pressures will not stop until you kill yourself and bring
honor back to your family's name.

So yes, you _have_ to kill yourself, _if_ you don't want your family to
suffer.

~~~
gnaritas
> Well, actually, there are.

No, there aren't. Just because the Japanese have an old barbaric and dying
tradition of ritual suicide, doesn't mean it's proper in this day an age.

> In Japan, if you have disgrace yourself and bring shame upon your family,
> you have to kill yourself.

No you don't. Those "old traditions" are dying out and no longer seen as
necessary by the younger generations.

