
What are the limitations of forming an Engineering union? - mschip
I typically have a good idea for how the community will feel on a given topic - but I&#x27;m not so sure on this.<p>Of course buy in and undercutting is a limitation of any union - but what would be some of the less obvious negative effects on engineers specifically?
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gigatexal
Are they really needed? I think even mediocre engineers are probably so versed
in tribal knowledge within they firms that if they say they're overworked they
could be moved to other departments because losing an employee is often very
expensive. Not only that, unlike other assets, engineers get better over time
and become more valuable as they become more expensive. We can move firms,
start firms, or move laterality to other industries where our technical skills
are valued. A Union protects and supports a population with many more
unproductive enginneers than a place without one. We are not like line workers
at a steel plant as work is abundant and if a bit of effort is made a good
work life balance can be had.

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11thEarlOfMar
I don't have any specific limitations in mind, but I'd review the idea to see
what problems the union is intended to resolve. Unions originally existed to
resolve exploitation by manufacturing companies. Is the group of engineers you
are considering unionizing being exploited?

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seattle_spring
My girlfriend recently was forced to join a medical union for a new Medical
Assistant job. Her "perks":

* $38k / year (In Seattle, which is about $3/hr above minimum wage)

* 2% salary goes to union dues

* She can't get insurance for the first 3 months

* She was not allowed to negotiate salary, even though she got a 4.0 and a perfect score on her MA test. That means she got the same package as a high-school drop-out who got a 2.3 GPA in MA school and a barely-passing test score.

I, as a non-unioned software engineer:

* Make more than $200k

* Always get health-insurance on day one

* Can easily negotiate not only starting salary, but also raise amounts

* Am compensated on background, instead of an arbitrary "this is your first day, so you make the same as everyone else" leveling system.

* Don't have to pay anyone for the privilege

* Don't have to work with shitty co-workers, because they can be fired without the employer fearing retribution from a big, faceless union.

So tell me-- why in the hell would I want to join a union?

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bbcbasic
You expect a union to negotiate 400% raise for your SO and her contemporaries?
And thus transform a multi billion dollar supply and demand difference between
two completely different industries? Hmm. Maybe your expectations are a wee
bit high. I smell burnt straw.

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seattle_spring
Not at all. Sorry, I shouldn't have listed unrelated situations. What I would
never, EVER want, is the inability to negotiate salary. Paying someone with a
bad past the same as someone with a good past seems outrageous to me. I've
proven myself enough to warrant my salary. If I were part of a union, they'd
look at my years of experience and say, "alright you fit into the $110k a year
bucket. You get an annual raise of 2% every year. Check in a few months to get
your insurance card!"

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bbcbasic
Ok I see your point. Sorry to make my point so strongly but I saw it as
trolling but I was wrong.

Anyway a way around this would be for the union to not touch salary, but help
individuals get a good deal given that they are happy with their salary. I can
think of things like helping to ensure people know what they are getting into
with share options, and helping with the legal side of things if there is
unfair dismissal etc.

