
Is the Batman stock market heist possible? - maxko87
http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/134141-is-the-batman-stock-market-heist-possible?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=is-the-batman-stock-market-heist-possible
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elemeno
For the tl;dr - Some hyperbole plus proof that the author doesn't understand
very much about how an exchange such the NYSE or LSE works, how the financial
system around them works or physical security and thus he comes the conclusion
that it would be possible.

In real life though, it just wouldn't be possible.

1) Cutting all the connections to the exchange wouldn't be so easy. You're
going to have multiple connections with different physical routes out of the
building to minimize the chance that the exchange goes down due to a misplaced
backhoe.

2) Assuming you did cut the connections, that alone would almost certainly
trip the exchange's circuit breakers and halt trading. Even if the servers
located at the exchange itself didn't halt trading, all the outside entities
would lose contact and so you wouldn't get any trade confirmations back.

3) Even if you could execute the trades (somehow) clearing firms would almost
certainly refuse to honor the trades as being legit, and if no one else is
accepting that a trade got made, then for all intents and purposes it didn't
happen.

tl;dr for my bit - No.

~~~
mikeash
One of the more amusing lines of the movie is when Alfred says that they _may_
be able to _eventually_ prove fraud and get the money back. The trade was
executed in the middle of a televised hostage situation and subsequent high-
speed chase... why would it take more than thirty seconds to convince someone
it was not legitimate and reverse it?

~~~
majormajor
I assumed Bane had found the best hackers in the world with inside knowledge
of the system, as a supervillian would, and had them write something that
would obfuscate the origin of the trades in the "paper" trail. Basically
anyone who lost money that day would blame the break-in, some of them probably
did just as stupid stuff as it looked like Wayne did. So how would they know
Wayne's complaint was legitimate?

What didn't make sense to me was that they were able to continue the program's
execution after the outside connection was cut off—if they didn't need to
physically be there the whole time, why'd they need to go in guns blazing?
Heck, even if they need to be there, why not just slip the program to someone
on the inside along with a hefty bribe or threat or both? Other than to give
Batman someone to chase for plot purposes, that is...

I'm surprised how much more discussion that plot point generated than the
magic identity eraser, though.

~~~
andylei
1\. if there was a hostage situation inside the exchange. they'd stop trading
for all securities pretty much instantaneously. nobody's trades after the
start of the hostage situation would be honored.

2\. the exchange's data centers aren't even on wall street! most of the data
centers are in weehawken, nj. breaking into the NYSE would be about as
effective as breaking into a bank of america.

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rexf
The Atlantic covered this in July
[http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2012/07/banes-
pl...](http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2012/07/banes-plan-to-
bankrupt-batman-doesnt-make-any-sense/260191/)

1\. The exchange would likely reverse/cancel the trades 2\. Puts protect the
buyer (Bruce Wayne) against losses (resulting from prices lower than the
strike price)

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cleverjake
The NYSE can reverse erroneous trades. It may be possible to execute the
trades, but none of the effects shown would happen.

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dmishe
Well in the movie the said that they can reverse transactions, but it will
take time to prove

~~~
elemeno
They can be reversed in real life as well - it happens on occasion.

In the case of the film, it would be exceptionally unlikely that the trades
would be honoured anyway.

~~~
talmand
Spoilers:

In the context of the plot that would be fine. It only had to be an issue for
Bruce for a day or two for them to move forward with their plan. Which was to
show his incredibly bad decision making and to make him powerless to stop them
from taking over his company. To reverse the outcome of all that would have
been a far more difficult thing to accomplish than to reverse fraudulent stock
trades.

I always felt he had his money back by the end of the movie.

~~~
ulyssesgrant
but why would anyone believe bruce made those trades to begin with? It was
made extremely obvious (by the armed break-in and subsequent car chase) that
the trades were fraudulent.

~~~
talmand
That's all true, I would think that the heavily armed event would immediately
disqualify all trades during that time. That is, if people understood that
they were conducting the trades in the first place. That is the weak point of
the plot but like I said, it only had to work long enough for the takeover to
happen. It wasn't like the plan was to takeover the company for years to come,
just a few days to move forward with the plan to get access to the reactor. I
think it's unlikely but plausible. But hey, it's a movie.

But for the Bruce part, that's easy because part of the Bruce persona is
basically a dumb playboy that's rich despite himself. He has people who take
care of him and if he does something on his own then it often results in
something bad. Remember that he supposedly burned down his own house during a
drunken rage at his birthday party after kicking everybody out.

------
helipad
Spoilers? Still in the theaters..

~~~
zacharycohn
... then don't read the article?

~~~
PhrosTT
No this a huge plot point plastered on the frontpage. Not cool.

I guess Bain hijacks the stock market or something. Thanks for ruining that.

I've also learned some other points from irresponsible headlines.

~~~
Jach
Better go see it then to avoid further spoilers! I saw it with a housemate two
weeks ago on a weekday, the theater was nearly empty. But I agree with the
other comment that it's not a major plot point by itself.

------
torus
Bane coerces a trader ... to bet all of Wayne Enterprises’ stock on bad
futures

Couldn't he just short the future himself?

~~~
Tycho
Futures are promises to deliver an asset at a certain price (on a certain
date). Presumably Bane just offered futures at stupid prices.

Incidentally, being 'short' on a future means you _are_ the one promising the
delivery.

------
fleitz
Completely possible, but the method used is wrong, instead what you'd want to
do is flood the market with sell orders for stock that doesn't exist. If you
do it for a prolonged period of time it will destroy the value of the
companies' stock.

Talk to the CEO of Overstock about how it works.

Alternatively, talk to the Porsche family about how to turn the tables and
have the bank eat the losses instead of your stock.

~~~
andylei
> sell orders for stock that doesn't exist

naked shorting is only possible if you are a market maker. if you don't have a
locate, you can't short the stock.

also, how are you going to put up the margin required to short that much
stock?

> If you do it for a prolonged period of time it will destroy the value of the
> companies' stock

which is something that doesn't affect bruce wayne, because it doesn't matter
if the market price of his equity has dropped, he still has the same
percentage share of the company, which means he'd still retain ownership.

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shalmanese
Another question: Would the market even be able to absorb so many out-of-
market puts? One of the fundamentals of every exchange is that ever buyer
needs to be connected with a seller. When you're that far out-of-market, would
enough people have even been willing to trade with you that you could have
completed the trades?

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dreamdu5t
It's sad that with all of the world's information accessible to everyone, the
author has to write an article instead of just using Google to answer his
basic questions.

