
A “bike platform” that temporarily swaps one car parking space for ten bicycles - mr_tyzic
https://twitter.com/modacitylife/status/1147119109672448002
======
frankus
Local governments (at least in the US) seem to systematically underinvest in
experiments like this. Things like traffic congestion have a ton of weird,
largely unpredictable positive and negative feedback loops.

Seattle removed its waterfront viaduct from service for a couple of weeks
before changing over to the new $3.3B tunnel and traffic was mostly fine,
despite apocalyptic predictions of gridlock. It's not entirely unfair to claim
that they could have saved literally billions of dollars by just closing the
viaduct for a month or two and observing what happens to traffic patterns.

Or businesses that predict their imminent bankruptcy when a few parking spots
are removed to create a bike lane. Why not put down a few traffic cones to
delineate a temporary bike lane and observe what happens to traffic in and out
of the businesses?

~~~
Johnny555
I don't think something like this would be that successful in the USA - it's
not lack of parking that keeps most people from riding, it's lack of protected
bike lanes (or other "safe" routes), and lack of cultural acceptance of
biking.

Plus, open, street parking isn't that safe in a lot of cities, if I could ask
for some specific parking infrastructure, I'd ask for lockable bike lockers...
though I'd rather see bike lanes and other infrastructure that helps me get to
work safely.

~~~
CapricornNoble
In Japan the cyclists ride on the sidewalk, and use little bells that the
entire pedestrian population is conditioned to understand means "move over
please, I'm coming through". I've found bike usage surprisingly high in Tokyo,
Osaka, and Kyoto compared to my experience living in/near numerous US cities
(Philadelphia, Miami, St. Louis, to name a few).

Why the emphasis on bike lanes in US cities? Putting unarmored people on
unpowered vehicles on the same transit medium as multi-ton high-powered
enclosed vehicles with reduced visibility seems like a recipe for disaster.
Hell, I rode a motorcycle for a little while here in Japan and stopped because
I wasn't comfortable commuting to work and sharing the road with kei cars, let
alone Cadillac Escalades or F-150s like in America.

While riding on scooters in Hanoi with my Vietnamese friends, I learned the
"ways of the road" there: small things yield to big things. Dump trucks and
other large commercial vehicles drive however they please. Cars get outta
their way. Then cars drive however they please, and all the mopeds kinda swarm
around them and move over as necessary. Smaller vehicles are more nimble and
generally have better situational awareness, so they can react more easily.
Operators of smaller vehicles take it upon themselves to avoid death at the
hands of the larger vehicles. In a city where people on two wheels are like
95% of all street traffic....big vehicles have traffic priority. As an aside,
ALL motorists strike me as hyper-alert and competent compared to the typical
American. Vietnamese on Vespas avoid collisions at the last second with
lightning-quick reflexes and maneuvers that tough-guy American biker dudes I
know could never pull off. It's pretty amazing.

But cyclists in the States....they seem to argue "everything bigger than me on
the road must adjust to accommodate me", even though they are the physically-
smallest vehicles on the road, and the smallest minority of commuters. It all
seems ass-backwards to me.

~~~
BurningFrog
The Vietnamese traffic you describe sounds like a Darwinian system where only
the most skilled have survived and dare travel.

I'm sure it works, but probably at a cost of a lot of lives, and probably a
lot of people who just stay out of it.

~~~
CapricornNoble
Unfortunately, I doubt even the Vietnamese government has accurate accident
metrics per capita/per km driven to compare to other countries.

But there is no real way to "just stay out of it". The public transportation
infrastructure in Hanoi is pretty damn limited. There is a subway but I've
never used it. I was told the government is hesitant to expand it as heroin
junkies use it to shoot up. Your best chance is with taxis/Uber/Grab, so if
the car hits someone at least you aren't the person responsible.

Anecdata: there was one probably life-threatening/ending accident when I was
in Hanoi around Chinese New Years (dump truck vs moped). My Vietnamese buddy
said that accidents were rare, but when they occur they are almost always
gruesome. This isn't counting moped-on-moped scrapes that probably just result
in a few bruises. I did witness some totally reckless teens basically crash
through the traffic in front of them, knocking at least one woman off of her
scooter....those 2 guys promptly got their asses beat by the nearest traffic
cop.

------
g_sch
This concept would make a fun (thought) experiment for a street in the US.

Imagine a car parked curbside in a city street somewhere in the US. No one
complains, because this is how everyone expects street space to be used - as
storage for private cars.

Maybe there's a flatbed trailer attached to this car. Now add bike racks to
the flatbed trailer. Next, add a stairway or a ramp. Then, gradually lower the
trailer a little bit each day until it becomes a platform on the ground.
Finally, take away the car.

Measure at which point homeowners start complaining.

~~~
Steltek
I would hesitate to lock up my bike on a mobile object that could disappear
without warning. It would need a ton of messaging, failsafes, and perhaps
other things before I'd trust it.

~~~
randlet
You missed the point of his post. It's a thought experiment to demonstrate the
intolerance of bikes in the US.

------
Yetanfou
[https://www.denhaag.nl/nl/in-de-stad/verkeer-en-
vervoer/fiet...](https://www.denhaag.nl/nl/in-de-stad/verkeer-en-
vervoer/fietsen/fietsvlonders-een-plank-met-fietsbeugels.htm)

Here's a bit more information on the things, in Dutch. They have 10 of them in
Den Haag (The Hague), they are placed on a parking spot and left there for 3
months. Should there not be any complaints the thing will be removed and
replaced with permanent cycle parking within another 3 months.

The device seems to be free-standing and to rely on weight alone to keep it in
place so those of you who commented on the possibility of harvesting 10 bikes
at a time using a flat bed truck may be on to something. Then again, in the
Netherlands there are so many bikes around which are easier to steal that I do
not deem this to be a real problem, let alone the fact that those who attempt
to load it on a truck will probably not get very far.

~~~
tobylane
Similar thing here that Londoners can request from their borough.
[https://www.cyclehoop.com/product/shelters-
canopies/bikehang...](https://www.cyclehoop.com/product/shelters-
canopies/bikehangar/)

------
mynegation
It would be useful for cities with colder and snowy seasons like Toronto,
where between summer and winter bicycle traffic varies greatly.

~~~
dhritzkiv
These already happen to be implemented in Toronto as bike corrals which take
up the length of just under two car parking spots. They are removed for snowy
seasons and reinstalled in the spring.

Picture: [https://www.toronto.ca/wp-
content/uploads/2017/10/903d-Parki...](https://www.toronto.ca/wp-
content/uploads/2017/10/903d-Parking-Stall-Design-Bike-Corral-350x263.jpg)
More details: [https://www.toronto.ca/services-payments/streets-parking-
tra...](https://www.toronto.ca/services-payments/streets-parking-
transportation/cycling-in-toronto/bicycle-parking/)

FWIW, I feel more confident in parking my bicycle in these corrals than I
probably would if parking on the platform featured in the link, as the bike
corral is protected on the three sides facing the road.

~~~
acomjean
We have those “corrals” in Cambridge and Somerville ma (USA) as well

------
whalesalad
> A light, quick, cheap solution so good, it should be copied the world over.

It is. This can be seen all over... SF, LA, DC, Austin, Ann Arbor ... I have
seen this everywhere (in the US)

~~~
supergauntlet
Where in Ann Arbor? I live in it and have never seen a structure like this.

~~~
whalesalad
In front of the gay bar in Kerrytown. It's not a platform, but it's the same
concept. There is a steel barrier/structure placed there to block cars from
parking and the structure also serves as a bike rack.

~~~
betterworldb
map of the rest of them - they move year to year

[https://www.a2dda.org/wp-
content/uploads/ddabikeparkingFB_04...](https://www.a2dda.org/wp-
content/uploads/ddabikeparkingFB_042819.png)

------
punnerud
A lot of similar “bike platforms” in Oslo/Norway. Guide from the municipality:
[https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&...](https://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1&nv=1&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=no&sp=nmt4&tl=en&u=https://www.tiltak.no/b-endre-
transportmiddelfordeling/b-3-tilrettelegging-
sykkel/b-3-3/&xid=17259,15700023,15700186,15700190,15700256,15700259,15700262&usg=ALkJrhj7tkTPS9CqXI45eqd3xRT-_5snlA)

Google Maps of all the bike routes, parking and “bike-self-service-points”:
[https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mid=1oO7FZepl8zXxKmx22y...](https://www.google.com/maps/d/viewer?mid=1oO7FZepl8zXxKmx22yV91LUd1KZgYkU_&ll=59.92348788725151%2C10.730553549999968&z=11%20)

------
wvh
I've seen a couple of these in Helsinki with the cut-out shape of a car, so
they take the space of a parked car but fit a number of bikes inside. I think
it sort of hammers the point home in the city centre...

------
elif
Seems like a good way to regulate escooters. Better for cities than sidewalks,
better for companies than permitting the construction of infrastructure.
Flexible enough to adjust to demand.

~~~
kyshoc
Santa Monica is doing something similar for escooters, and calling them "drop
zones"[0].

[0]: [https://la.streetsblog.org/2018/11/08/santa-monica-
installs-...](https://la.streetsblog.org/2018/11/08/santa-monica-installs-in-
street-e-scooter-parking-corrals/)

~~~
dole
It's regulation, but it's kind of forcing infrastructure and government to
deal with a problem when maybe the model should be that these companies are
forced to rent small areas of corners, parking lots, etc. for corrals and
charging, kinda like the Fotomat drive-thru camera film development, or snow
cone stands.

Seeing dead scooters laying in the streets here for days sucks, and while
remarking the street makes sense in denser cities, it's a now semi-permanent
eyesore too.

~~~
bobthepanda
We don't require the same of cars. Why should we burden other modes of
transportation?

It's worth noting that overnight street parking was illegal in New York until
1950:
[https://www.nytimes.com/1996/03/17/realestate/streetscapes-c...](https://www.nytimes.com/1996/03/17/realestate/streetscapes-
cars-when-streets-were-vehicles-for-traffic-not-parking.html)

------
neilv
I like how this doesn't have a frame around it, and is just an extension of
the curb, including for safety reasons.

My city (walking distance to Boston, Mass., proper) seems relatively pro-bikes
by US standards, and was experimenting with placing a pipe frame bike rack in
parking spots, on at least one major street. But given the Boston-area
prevalence of texting drivers, drunk drivers, aggression over parking spot
scarcity (see "Boston space savers"), and high degree of animosity between
some drivers and bikers... that frame looked to me like a deathtrap cage, for
getting you mangled by a bunch of bicycles, if a car ever hit the frame at-
speed while you were inside.

------
jascii
My first thought? Bring a flat-bed and you have 10 bicycles.. Are there any
security features in this concept?

~~~
MichaelApproved
> Are there any security features in this concept?

The fact that you'd need a flat-bed to steal the bicycles _is_ a security
feature. People steal bikes because the penalty isn't serious. Who is going to
risk a felony and their tow truck license for just a few bikes?

~~~
jascii
The avarage bike around here retails for about $1500, so $15000 in a single
swipe isn't bad. I have seen an entire bike rack being pulled out of the
ground using a truck and winch, so yes it does happen. Research has shown over
and over again that penalty is seldom a factor in decision making, gain vs
perceived risk of getting caught is, and stealing a single bike is still a
felony. You don't need a tow truck license to own a flat-bed, craigslist is
full of them.

~~~
zulln
> The avarage bike around here retails for about $1500

Average bike on the street? Do you have any source of similar claim?

~~~
jascii
Its mostly an informed guestimate from spending time in bike stores and seeing
what other commuters ride. But here goes: In 2014 the average retail price was
$714 nation-wide ([https://www.statista.com/statistics/276088/average-retail-
pr...](https://www.statista.com/statistics/276088/average-retail-price-
bicycle/)) around here in Portland, OR people tend to prefer fancier bikes,
the shop I worked for in 2006 had an average retail about $1700 back in the
day but that was a higher end speciality store. In recent years e-bikes have
gotten extremely popular here, their retail prices range from $2500 and up,
skewing the average price point up further.

------
ripvanwinkle
I expect that among many of the bike friendly policies mentioned in this
thread one technological advancement specifically the cyclist / pedestrian
avoidance systems that new cars have started coming with will greatly improve
the safety for cyclists and ultimately increase the number of cyclists that
feel safe sharing the road with cars. I dream that it might actually lead to a
tipping point in areas where cycling make more sense than cars

------
remyp
A few years ago my neighborhood did one better and replaced two parking spaces
with a parklet: [http://moss-design.com/chicagos-first-parklet-in-
andersonvil...](http://moss-design.com/chicagos-first-parklet-in-
andersonville/)

People > cars, always.

------
75dvtwin
While bicycles are popular, it is hard to imagine that human-pedaled versions
will become a norm.

It is impossible to imagine them used in a heat of Miami, or Atlanta
(Georgia), or in Moscow.

There well populated and mild-weathered megalopolis (London, most southern CA,
north east China) -- but the speed, distance and volume of participants --
just do not make bicycles practical.

I think the long solution is really de-urbanization of these megacities that
act like a country-within-a-country.

On a separate note, I find the use of word 'platform' (even in quotes) is
unfortunate.

Platforms, I though, mean something that provides composeable building blocks
+ principles for a variety of yet-to-be-anticipated needs.

------
Rapzid
I'm not sure I understand. From a safety point of view I'd be concerned
locking my bike to something that is literally designed to be moved on a flat
bed.. From a space optimization point of view, why would you put a bike rack
in one of the only places you can park a motor vehicle while there is almost
endless amounts of space around for bicycle parking/storage(relatively at
least)?

------
DocTomoe
Something that often is neglected: Destroying Car parking for bike corals in
inner cities tends to affect out-of-towners, people who _cannot_ bike into
cities because of distance, disproportionally. Noone drives their car low
distances within cities because that would mean losing their spot.

~~~
aeharding
There are so many alternatives other than commuting by car and parking on the
street...

1\. Bus 2\. Bike 3\. Walk 4\. Carpool 5\. Move 6\. Parking ramps

^ And combinations of these, such as park-and-rides, parking outside the core
downtown area and bus/biking in, etc.

Not to mention, at least in my City (Madison, WI) there's thousands of off-
street car parking spots in public ramps, and removing 5 spots for 5 corrals
in high demand areas negatively affects nobody. Unless you happen to be the
0.00001% of downtown car traffic affected by this and needing to walking a
block or two from the nearest ramp to park your private vehicle is such a big
deal...

There's zero argument here.

~~~
DocTomoe
Not every city is Madison, Wi, which you yourself considered to be a special
case when it came to parking just seven little months ago.

And not everyone can bus - especially in America, where public transport is
essentially a sad joke. Not everyone can walk - distances are actually a
thing. Not everyone has the ability to find someone to carpool with (which
might either be related to different schedules or different locations). Not
everyone can move, especially not for rare city business (city living is
expensive, not everyone is a VC-funded startup engineer). And parking ramps
are a thing, but still limited - the issue is not with "parking options
exist", but with "parking options in sufficient availabilities exist".

That being said, I would love to see you haul a fridge three miles on foot to
your next parking ramp.

~~~
aeharding
What city do you live in?

EDIT Also I am a little confused by

> That being said, I would love to see you haul a fridge three miles on foot
> to your next parking ramp.

I thought we were talking about commuting? I am not saying get rid of your
car, I am saying perhaps don't commute with one every single day and then
expect to park on-street, because there might be better options...

~~~
DocTomoe
> What city do you live in?

A small town with about 7000 citizens some 50 kilometers away from the city I
work in in southern Germany.

No colleagues living near me, so no carpooling. Public transport, while
arguably a lot better than in the states, is so fractures that it means
leaving at 5 and returning at 21:30 - unless you need the "flexibility" of
attending late-evening meetings or after-work activities, then it pretty much
becomes unusable. Biking in? Sure, takes even more time (I average some 20
km/h, this is hilly terrain), and I am completely finished when I arrive. And
moving here? I would pay four times what I pay now in rent for the privilege
of living in an industrial wasteland.

Without the car, I could not do my job.

That being said, I am lucky that my employer provides a parking ramp at the
location I currently work at. When they make us move locations again, there is
a good chance streetcurb parking is the only option available to me.

What we need to do is to make cities places where cyclists, motor vehicle
drivers and pedestrians can coexist. I think playing the cheap, political
"divide and conquer" card by diminishing one side for the other will make them
worse for everyone involved.

For starters, we should check if we can just move vehicle traffic underground
for major arteries and use the space above for cyclists and pedestrians.

> I thought we were talking about commuting?

Ah, here's the misunderstanding. I am talking about access to the city,
regardless of frequency. The problem does not go away if you prohibit
commuting.

------
bluetwo
Seems like it would minimize the number of things you needed to steal to make
it worth your effort. One!

------
jandrese
I like the ones pictured lower in that Twitter feed where there is a big chunk
of car shaped metal between the bikes and the road. I had a concern with the
original that some asshole not paying attention to the road is going to
sideswipe the spot and ruin 10 bike tires at once.

------
_ph_
A great idea. Bike parking spaces can be set up without going through any
construction work so there is no big planning or paperwork required. If it is
deciced to make that a permanent installation, construction can be done then.

------
chance_state
>The fietsvlonder is a “bike platform” that temporarily swaps one car parking
space for 10 bicycles. If deemed a success, the curb is permanently adjusted,
and the structure is moved to the next location.

What makes it a success or failure?

~~~
Yetanfou
Success equals no serious complaints:

[https://www.denhaag.nl/nl/in-de-stad/verkeer-en-
vervoer/fiet...](https://www.denhaag.nl/nl/in-de-stad/verkeer-en-
vervoer/fietsen/fietsvlonders-een-plank-met-fietsbeugels.htm)

 _" Als er na 3 maanden geen ernstige bezwaren zijn van bewoners, dan wordt de
vlonder weggehaald en vervangen door fietsbeugels die blijven staan"_ which
translates to _" Should there not be any serious complaints within 3 months
the platform will be removed and replaced with permanent cycle parking"_

~~~
chance_state
Oh, interesting! Thank you.

------
amichal
We have one of these in my small, snowy Vermont town. I think it’s brilliant
since it’s easily removed in winter when the bike rack would hinder
plowing/sidewalk clearing.

------
tonymet
quick survey : how many readers actually ride to work?

~~~
Karrot_Kream
Why wouldn't you? I have a daily 10 mi. commute. In the spring and summer, I
almost never drive my car. I haven't driven my car in 2 months, come to think
of it.

~~~
CapricornNoble
"Why wouldn't you?"

The spring/summer weather hovers between 25-33 Celsius with 80%+ humidity. I
like arriving at my destinations not covered in sweat. When it's not brutally
hot and sunny....it's raining (this island gets twice as much rainfall as
__Seattle __). And we are regularly hit by typhoons. You can drive a car in a
weak typhoon. Good luck riding a bike during one.

The terrain is very hilly here, with many roads cutting across the island
having elevation changes of ~70m. Attacking hills like that might be a great
workout but I sure as hell wouldn't want to do it after a trip to my favorite
ramen shop or tempura restaurant (both of which are at sea level, down the
hill from me).

Finally....I'm a speed freak and a gearhead, and the experience of operating a
powerful car, daily, is its own reward. I wouldn't be caught dead on a
bicycle, but I also wouldn't be caught dead driving a low-powered commuter
vehicle shitbox.

Climate and geography are major factors which I think many Americans ignore
because most tech workers either live somewhere with mild weather, or live
somewhere with flat, bland geography (most of the country, really).

~~~
Karrot_Kream
> Finally....I'm a speed freak and a gearhead, and the experience of operating
> a powerful car, daily, is its own reward. I wouldn't be caught dead on a
> bicycle, but I also wouldn't be caught dead driving a low-powered commuter
> vehicle shitbox.

Why you would actively choose to contribute more to climate change for what
are essentially aesthetic/identity choices is beyond me, but many people do,
so I'm obviously missing something.

~~~
CapricornNoble
I'd bet a dollar that the delta in total-life-cycle emissions for replacing
every modified high-performance car with a crapwagon (kei car, Prius, etc...)
wouldn't even be a rounding error in humanity's climate change footprint.
Hell, building a container ship powered by an old Soviet nuclear reactor
instead of bunker fuel would probably be a greener use of civilization's
available time and manpower.

Secondly....I don't fear climate change. Humans are adaptable apex predators.
It might stymie our progress up the Kardashev scale, but I guess that's the
question:

Which is a more difficult resource problem to solve: having 10 billion
marginally-productive mouths to feed while maintaining a high-tech economy, or
having only 1 billion mouths to feed but being forced to recreate a shattered
tech base from scratch with almost-no easily accessible energy deposits left?

------
psychometry
I've long said that we need something like this for dockless bikes/scooters.
Just converting 1% of parking spaces in the city would drastically reduce the
"littering" problem.

------
cfieber
the real question is what colour it should be

~~~
Theodores
Typical HN comment. Always wanting to talk about the exact nature of the
fissile material, the startup neutron source and even the colour of the
reactor shield.

------
major505
Yeah... but in the end, you still have to ride a bike.

------
soheil
This introduces an element of temporariness into the fight between cars vs
bikes parking. I think the issue needs to be dealt with at a fundamental
level, do we as a country/city decide to use more bikes or cars? As far as I'm
aware there has been a decisive victory by the cars in the US over the past 50
years mainly due to oil companies pushing for it and lobbying against public
transportation. Using cars also pushes the boundaries of technological
progress, anything that requires more technology (ie. cars more than bikes)
will make the society more technological and will create more jobs in the
technology sector. Even if the solution to transportation can be solved
without as much tech, sometimes it may be desirable to create more tech for
the sake of creating more tech and not because of necessity because there will
be times when the same tech or expertise in tech can help solve an orthogonal,
but existential problem. (eg. we don't need to have a space station but we do,
ISS has allowed the creation of technological advances that have provided
benefits to society on Earth in areas including health and medicine,
transportation, public safety, consumer goods, energy and environment,
information technology, and industrial productivity [0])

[0] [https://www.nasa.gov/sites/default/files/files/Benefits-
Stem...](https://www.nasa.gov/sites/default/files/files/Benefits-Stemming-
from-Space-Exploration-2013-TAGGED.pdf)

~~~
rkangel
There is a chicken and egg situation with cycling and cycling infrastructure
(as there is with any mode of transport). Any method that allows for
incremental advances has got to be an improvement to the chances of increasing
cycle usage.

~~~
halbritt
I read a study a while back that suggested that there is a maximum of
approximately 6% of any given population will use cycling as a means of
transportation without cycling infrastructure isolated from automobile traffic
similar to Copenhagen.

I'm hoping that the growth of things like electric scooters will drive more
demand for such things.

~~~
davemabe
Do you have a link to the study? I'd love to read it.

~~~
halbritt
Oh, man. Uh... I'll try and dig it up tomorrow.

