
Europe’s flight-shame movement has travelers taking trains to save the planet - pseudolus
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/europe/europes-flight-shame-movement-has-travelers-taking-trains-to-save-the-planet/2019/08/02/1bd38486-ac96-11e9-9411-a608f9d0c2d3_story.html
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hannob
To put it in perspective: The only country where this has even a measurable
impact is sweden. It's not huge. And sweden has an excellent train system
compared to many other european countries.

I live in Germany. This discussion is all over the news. But it's not changing
the statistics.

In the end what will change habits is changing incentives. Conscious choices
for the climate will have a minor impact at best.

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ChuckNorris89
As someone living in Europe, the truth is they don't do that to save the
planet, those who do that do it because they can't afford car ownership or
they can but flying or driving is too inconvenient(security delays, baggage
restrictions, traffic, parking, etc.)

Anecdotal evidence: I moved to Switzerland after uni and was sold on the idea
that everyone there is super green and on bikes all day. Hard truth on the
ground was that all the locals were driving luxury German cars and only
students, expats, thrifty youths and the poor(for Swiss standards) were on
trains/bikes. Everyone I know with a solid income only commutes by car.

Still, public transport in most European cities is good enough that we can
live without cars and I'm thankful for that.

Edit: The article is paywalled for me. I'm commenting on what's only written
in the header.

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twiss
The article isn't about taking the train instead of the car, but about taking
the train instead of the airplane. Taking the airplane is way cheaper and more
convenient than taking the train at the distances the article is talking
about.

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klmr
Flying is cheaper and faster, but not necessarily more convenient. To find
cheap flights you often have to get to inconveniently located airports (the
great exception being London Stansted) at odd hours, often having to change
transport on the way, and lose a lot of time due to checkin and security
(which are in themselves massive inconveniences). And even when paying for a
better ticket the flight is often too cramped to do anything effectively. All
in all, you’d often not save all that much time by flying, and the time
actually spent in transit is mostly wasted, whereas a train ride affords you
the opportunity to work, read or watch movies.

Some people manage to read or watch movies at least on the flight itself but
personally my head hits the pillow before the plane even leaves the runway.
I’m not sure what soporific magic is at play here. Anyway, I avoid flying as
much as possible as a consequence.

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NikkiA
> the great exception being London Stansted

Do you mean "London City". Unless you're an incredibly rich footballer
Stansted is far from convenient to anything.

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klmr
I did mean Stansted but admittedly it’s probably the least convenient airport
from Central London unless you live close to the Liverpool Street line —
personal bias led me astray. London City is of course closer from many points
within London but is much smaller. That said, London’s other airports are also
relatively convenient, e.g. Gatwick and Heathrow via tube, Thameslink or
dedicated trains.

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lumberjack
Tomorrow I will be traveling all the way from southern Germany to northern
Netherlands. 6 hour drive. If I go by train it's 220€ with return. If I fly
from a nearby airport to a nearby airport (so with limited train use) it's
700€ to 900€ with return. If I rent a car it's 120€ plus 90€ petrol, return
journey.

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fxj
I doubt the price of 700euro for a plane ticket. I just checked and got
Munich-Amsterdam for 98 euros.

[https://www.google.com/flights?lite=0#flt=/m/02h6_6p./m/0k3p...](https://www.google.com/flights?lite=0#flt=/m/02h6_6p./m/0k3p.2019-09-12*/m/0k3p./m/02h6_6p.2019-09-15;c:EUR;e:1;sd:1;t:f)

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beatgammit
Which puts it around the same price, but with a train, you don't need to deal
with airline security. I'm sure the situation in Europe is less ridiculous
than the US, but it's still an extra process.

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fxj
It depends. For the euro tunnel train from Paris to London you have to go
through the same security checks like at the airport. But this is not the rule
and rather an exemption. However, there have been voices in the EU Comission
to perform security checks at train stations, too.

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Kaiyou
I'm from Europe. It's not to save the planet, it's all a matter of incentives.

