
Why don't black and white Americans live together? - gadders
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-35255835
======
cornholio
The article seems to suggest that latent racism from the banks, real estate
agents and white buyers remains the main engine for segregation even today.

While I haven't lived in US, it seems to me segregation can persist in an
unequal society even if racism is marginal: it's enough that buyers of all
races observe that higher blackness is correlated with poverty. If that's the
case, buyers will rationally flee black areas for the sake of property value.
Black affluent buyers will flee to white areas for the same reasons, but if
they are a minority they can't balance out. So depending on the correlation of
home ownership with wealth (strong in the US), you get a vicious circle where
black areas get blacker and their initial majority black residents become
trapped there due to declining property values, with the banking and
commercial sector entrenching the segregation due to risk aversion.

So once initiated, ethnic polarization is self sustaining even if the initial
instigators (racism) become largely irrelevant. Poverty itself becomes the
engine of segregation, so the only way to break the cycle is to promote
equality.

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humanrebar
"It may seem odd because we have stereotypes of the South, but residential
segregation levels are lowest in Southern cities such as Atlanta, Houston and
Dallas," she says.

...so they live together, but just in the South?

This piece had a lot to say about historical prejudice, but doesn't adequately
explain why segregation persists. A single anecdote and a throw-away stat
about profiling prospective home buyers don't explain things well at all.

~~~
angdis
Having lived in Baltimore for 10 years, I can say that there are multiple
causes for continuing segregation. There is no satisfying way to explain it
and no end in sight.

You are right that this about far more than realtors steering people one place
or another.

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brudgers
There are historical reasons, e.g. racism embodied in the 3/5ths clause of the
US Constitution. There's American mythology that racism is principally a
southern flaw even though there were no Major League Baseball teams in the
south when Jackie Robinson broke the color barrier...unless one considers
Washington D.C. a southern city and it is and was directly under the control
of Congress in which since the US Civil War legislators from southern states
have been in a distinct minority.

But even with free choice, it is worth considering the effects of Schelling's
segregation model. Across a large population small preferences go a long way.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Schelling](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Schelling)

[http://www2.econ.iastate.edu/tesfatsi/demos/schelling/schell...](http://www2.econ.iastate.edu/tesfatsi/demos/schelling/schellhp.htm)

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carlosnunez
This article is on point.

One only needs to go to NYC's Upper East Side to see this in action. Right
above the UES (Yorkville, specifically) is Spanish Harlem.

Before 96th Street? Multi-million dollar penthouses and rentals abound that
will impress your friends and family guaranteed. "Gourmet organic" bodegas.
Expensive-looking restaurants. Upper-middle-class creature comforts all
around.

After 96th Street? Projects. Junk-food bodegas. Domestic abuse shelters.
Police cameras. Unmistakeable poverty oozing through the sewers. It's
frustrating to watch.

(This contrast is even more stark in much of America. My girlfriend and I went
to Memphis during a road trip last year. She went to college there and wanted
to show me how quickly Memphis goes from "filthy rich asshole" to "filthy
shithole".

There was an approximate 2 block radius of really expensive-looking homes and
tree-lined streets that bordered the college. Outside of it? Endless
projects.)

------
hyperliner
It's sad but some older minority folks grew up fearing white racism or hating
whites, and never wanted to integrate. Maybe it's just a small irrelevant data
point, but a friend's grandmother went to her grave hating whites because her
white teachers from elementary through high school would tape her mouth, and
her sister's, with duct tape for hours for speaking Spanish.

The reality is that we live in a racist world, which continues to perpetuate
because blacks / Browns and whites are divided, for the most part, across
economic lines that will take a long time to be erased, and those economic
lines create cultural lines that are harder to bridge.

------
xamdam
According to Schelling's model even slight preference to be with your own
color leads to segregation [http://nifty.stanford.edu/2014/mccown-schelling-
model-segreg...](http://nifty.stanford.edu/2014/mccown-schelling-model-
segregation/)

~~~
cptroot
Here's an interactive link illustrating the same phenomenon:
[http://ncase.me/polygons/](http://ncase.me/polygons/)

------
presty
related article that I stumbled upon the other day
[http://goplifer.com/2016/01/02/why-i-live-in-a-white-
neighbo...](http://goplifer.com/2016/01/02/why-i-live-in-a-white-
neighborhood/)

------
steanne
"For there to be complete integration in the United States, more than half of
black Americans would need to move."

...or, you know, half the white people. Or a mix of both, and maybe throw in
other groups besides black and white.

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RogtamBar
I imagine it's because of fear and inconvenience.

[http://www.phillymag.com/articles/white-
philly/?all=1](http://www.phillymag.com/articles/white-philly/?all=1)

------
locopati
Let's not leave out the history of Sundown Towns[1]

[1]
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sundown_town](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sundown_town)

------
grabcocque
Is this a trick question?

I'm gonna go for "because the US is still a massively racist country."

~~~
humanrebar
Is the South less racist because it's more integrated?

~~~
ZeroGravitas
The actual quote is "residential segregation levels are lowest in Southern
cities such as Atlanta, Houston and Dallas" not "the South" generically.

