
World's first carbon fiber and Kevlar 3D printer [video] - wheresclark
http://markforged.com
======
nicpottier
Man, that is quite the hype video.

It doesn't look like it actually can print free standing carbon fiber parts
though, just reinforce existing PLA printed parts, which seems like a bit of a
nightmare from an alignment point of view.

Seems like that is a limitation of using carbon 'thread' as opposed to carbon
sheets. Aren't most carbon fiber objects made from sheets that are shaped,
baked and bound together? That doesn't seem like it would convert to fiber
very well.

In short, it seems like a neat way to reinforce printed parts, but in no way
does this seem to be the 'print carbon fiber' like they are selling it. You
can't just plug in a model for a 3D printed piece and get out a gorgeous cabin
piece.

As an additional aside, isn't there still a step of baking required? They
didn't talk about that, is it a different process? (perhaps the thread is
heated ahead of time?)

~~~
alirazaq
As far as I know, the only "printer" that can produce carbon fiber parts in
three-dimensions is the circular loom Toyota developed for the Lexus LFA.

[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AScfESzQzIQ](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AScfESzQzIQ)

~~~
fpp
And a more up-to-date video showing the carbon-fibre production process BMW
has created for their new i-series of cars -
[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kaoq8Mc4xxw](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kaoq8Mc4xxw)
(a shorter version on the fibre production by the US company that works for
BMW -
[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IeST0vfDuhw](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IeST0vfDuhw)
)

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Too
Very cool if it works but I'm not convinced by the video. I already know all
the applications where this can be used, how strong carbon is, how easy this
machine is and only fantasy sets the limit blaha etc. Show me something you've
already created and how good that is instead of pretending to try to break a
pencil sized object. Was the bike fork made in that machine or just a general
example of carbon fiber? I couldnt find the speed of printing either.

~~~
User8712
Agreed, they just keep showing this plastic rectangle, with a flat strip of
carbon fiber sandwiched in the middle for reinforcement. Wonderful, but is
that the limitations of this machine?

[https://markforged.com/wp-
content/uploads/2014/02/MF14_MK1_b...](https://markforged.com/wp-
content/uploads/2014/02/MF14_MK1_brick_3qtr_combo1.jpg)

If you look closely at the above image and squint your eyes, I think that's a
carbon fiber part it actually printed, that appeared in the video for a split
second. It would be great if we could see it close up. It would be even better
if they printed a second copy with plastic, and then demonstrated the
difference in strength.

Instead, they spent the entire video saying they're going to change the world,
and then I guess you're suppose to take their word on it, and just drop $5k on
the preorder.

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MechSkep
So this has popped up on HN before, and again I would caution that this is
snake oil. The sparse technical details they give are misleading, and they
still haven't shown that their fiber reinforced parts are anything special.

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dav-
They're having a live demo[1] at TechShop in SF on Monday (3/24/2014). I'm
thinking about going.

[1] [https://markforged.com/mark-one-demo-san-
francisco/](https://markforged.com/mark-one-demo-san-francisco/)

------
reustle
I thought what made carbon fiber so strong was that the fibers were weaved
together in sheets?

~~~
glenra
This new tech is not in general as strong as fiber woven in sheets. The claim
they make is that it's "1/3 the strength of the best carbon fiber composites
made today" and that to test this they measured resistance to bending "in the
preferred fiber orientation" Their process lays down continuous strands along
each layer but by its nature can't lay strands on the Z axis. So if you have a
part that needs to be strong in _every_ direction, this may not entirely solve
your problem. It solves _some_ of the problem, for _some_ use cases.

(It also _looks_ like it ought to be ridiculously slow.)

There's some answers at their FAQ (
[https://markforged.com/faq/](https://markforged.com/faq/) ), but not as many
as we might like.

~~~
retroafroman
This is an important point. The direction of the fibers makes a big
difference. The basic method of strengthening carbon fiber weave (which is
weaved at 90degree angles) is to alternate the layers so that they are 45
degrees apart, if laying up a normal flat part. When I created a longboard
(similar to Boosted Boards in length) it was still very flexible, even with
this method. The small part shown in the video is hard to bend, but so would a
wooden part that small.

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abhv
Can anyone explain what the "kinematic coupling" is, how it helps with bed
leveling, and why the same approach cannot be applied to any 3d-printer?

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stefan_kendall3
This could be what it takes to get effective gun printing going. As soon as I
can print effective guns, I will.

~~~
DanBC
Why?

Why not iust buy guns? Or buy gun parts and make them? What is it about
printing that's appealing?

~~~
stefan_kendall3
Guns are _extremely_ expensive, and I own many. I have many friends who wish
they could own guns but cannot afford them, and thus live alone without a
proper means of self defense.

I don't let anyone fire anything I own without an intro safety course and
firing practice with a laser bullet, so I don't intend to throw free guns into
crowds, but I do know that there is a large group of responsible people who go
unarmed for the sole reason that the price of guns is very, very high.

At $500/pop, I can't afford to be charitable. At $50-100, these become
birthday gifts.

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wheresclark
I just spent the last two hours thinking of stuff I could potentially make
with this. I wish I had a spare $5K.

~~~
stefan_kendall3
There's going to be a tipping point where 3D printers are good enough and new
enough that you can turn a profit selling printed goods. Like any
technological shift, people will flood the market, bringing down the profit
sold by printed goods to 0.

Buying at the right time means that you can more than recoup your investment.
I don't think we've reached that point yet.

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EGreg
I want to 3d print a space elevator with this :)

