
Microsoft Said To Be Considering A Free Version Of Windows 8.1 - robot_scream
http://techcrunch.com/2014/02/28/free-windows-8-1-update/
======
reefoctopus
Windows 8 is terrible. Free is still too expensive. It's Windows 7 with
reduced functionality and an app store. I've been using Windows on my work
laptops for the last 4 years because I use the adobe suite, and it's been
easier. I've been stuck with Windows 8 on my most recent laptop, and yesterday
I finally decided to switch to Ubuntu. Good riddance.

~~~
circa
what functionality is lost in Windows 8.1 that 7 had?

~~~
pearjuice
The traditional start menu. A proper desktop instead of a tablet-optimized
interface.

~~~
slantyyz
If you're a keyboard centric user, the start menu's not a huge loss as one
would think.

I used to think it was a big deal until I realized I stopped using the Dock on
OSX in favor of Spotlight to launch stuff. When I started using Win8 and
learned that I basically could keep the same habits by hitting the Windows key
and typing the first few characters of what I wanted to launch, I stopped
caring about the start menu.

I used to think the idea of a touchscreen laptop was stupid, but Win8 works
for me, and my main machine is still a Macbook Pro. I have a Surface Pro that
I use in place of my original iPad, and I think Win8 is quite good in tile
mode or desktop mode. It's still hurting in the area of power management
though.

~~~
bbradley406
While you can use the same keyboard habits, I find it much worse. The whole
screen gets taken over by a rainbow colored mess of an interface, instead of a
concise list in the corner.

------
300bps
"A free version of Windows 8.1? Those M$FT bastards are just trying to make
more money!"

    
    
      -- 90% of responses that will show up here
    

Anyway, Microsoft definitely needs to do something to eradicate the 29% of
desktop users that are still using Windows XP which is a security disaster-
waiting-to-happen.

[http://www.netmarketshare.com/operating-system-market-
share....](http://www.netmarketshare.com/operating-system-market-
share.aspx?qprid=10&qpcustomd=0)

~~~
okasaki
I imagine a lot of machines running XP won't be able to run 8.1. IIRC even the
minimum screen resolution of 1366x768 is above the popular old 1280x1024.

~~~
300bps
_I imagine a lot of machines running XP won 't be able to run 8.1_

Your imagination is completely wrong. Here are the minimum specifications:

[http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-8/system-
requirem...](http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-8/system-requirements)

 _IIRC even the minimum screen resolution of 1366x768_

Your memory is also completely wrong. Windows 8.1 does not have a minimum
resolution of 1366x768. In fact, if you review the system requirements link
above, you'll see that it works at less than 1024x768 but that certain
features require 1024x768.

Can you help me understand the purpose of your comment? I mean, obviously -
you had no idea what you were talking about. You even knew it because you used
weasel words like, "I imagine" or "IIRC". It makes me think you had some
agenda to spread FUD about Windows 8.1 not working on older hardware.

~~~
okasaki
My memory isn't wrong.

[http://www.microsoftstore.com/store/msusa/en_US/pdp/Windows-...](http://www.microsoftstore.com/store/msusa/en_US/pdp/Windows-8.1/productID.288401200)

> Required memory 2GB

> Required video card 1366 × 768 screen resolution; DirectX 9 graphics
> processor with WDDM driver

------
gegtik
Why are we not linking source articles? I thought we were just hating on
aggregators a second ago.

This links to the Verge which repackaged the original ZDNet article:
[http://www.zdnet.com/microsofts-monetization-dilemma-
bundlin...](http://www.zdnet.com/microsofts-monetization-dilemma-bundlings-
not-all-its-cracked-up-to-be-7000026852/)

------
Karunamon
It sounds a like this is going to be a gimped money-grab like "Windows 7
Starter edition" (where you can't even change the wallpaper).

Meanwhile, the other two major desktop OSes are completely free. Upgrades too.
The notion of paying for the basic software that makes your computer work is
quickly becoming outmoded.

~~~
viggity
Of course Apple can release cheap OSs, their machines cost twice as much as a
PC. The total cost of ownership should be considered.

~~~
Karunamon
The upgrades are also completely gratis. And again with the "Twice as much"
myth? Do I really need to link the article that shows the _discount_ being
offered on the new Pro machines with the workstation chipset?

And you're also not counting the reduction in cost from the bundled crapware
that comes on most every OOTB PC.

~~~
e40
The new Mac Pro is a joke. If you need to add more disks, you're adding an
additional $1,500 to $2,500 for the external disk enclosure. That puts the
base price, for 6 bays at $5,500! Now that is absurd.

~~~
Karunamon
I can add external peripherals to any laptop/desktop and drive the price up as
well. I'm talking out of the box.

~~~
e40
You are being disingenuous. The number of laptop users with a bunch of
external disks compared to desktop users.... very, very different.

This is about what is normal. My desktop machines have ALWAYS had more than
just the boot drive. My laptops have NEVER had anything but the boot drive.

------
forgotAgain
I have to admit, I dismissed the Chromebook when it was first introduced. It
seems at this point that it's really been a market changer.

~~~
Kurtz79
I believe that Apple aggressive pricing of the last operating systems (up to
the current "free") had much more influence on the decision, together with
Ubuntu progress in terms of usability.

Edit: Probably is all off these put together, nowadays most users simply do
not expect to pay for an updated OS.

------
pwthornton
I use Windows 8 every day at work. It's not that bad as some would have you
believe, but I like it less than Windows 7, and every release should be more
enjoyable and better. I consider Windows 7 to be the best version of Windows
ever. It has a pretty clean windowing UI, it's stable and secure and generally
just works.

It's an OS that really appeals to MS's core audience. Why mess with it?

I have my Windows 8 machine set to boot straight to desktop mode, and I have
the start menu back; so it's pretty similar to using Windows 7. But every now
and then you accidentally open up an app or file in Metro mode, and it's a
really disorienting experience when one of my windows is in metro mode and the
other is in desktop mode.

The core issue of Windows 8 is that it tries to merge two pretty good UI
concepts together, and in the process makes both worse. I like Metro as a
tablet and phone UI. I like the Windows 7 UI for desktop computing. It's when
you have to use Metro on a desktop or Windows 7 windowing on a tablet that it
all goes to hell.

I would suggest that MS end this, and make Windows 9 the best traditional
Windows it can. Aim it at businesses and people who want to use the same OS
they use at work at home. Focus on networking and cloud support (take OneDrive
even further), improving multithreaded support (make it easier for developers
to harness 4-12 and more core computers) and improving the file system.

The UI concepts of Windows 7 are pretty good. You can iterate on the UI and
add new features like Apple does with OS X, but there is no reason to get away
from windowing for desktop computing. It's a conceptual model that works well,
particularly for power users and work that benefits from multiple-monitors and
multitasking.

Microsoft should then spin off Metro into its own OS without the Windows name,
while still using the Windows kernel. This is what Apple does with iOS, and it
works very well.

I use OS X at home, and think Mavericks is what MS should be aiming for, not
Windows 8. Mavericks is the best desktop OS I've ever used, and, while I
really like iOS, I wouldn't want to use iOS on my desktop computer.

------
Piskvorrr
Not sure this will help: IMNSHO market already perceives COTS computers as
"costs $x, plus has Windows for free."

~~~
kenjackson
the OEMs don't perceive it that way. Acer could have two SKUs. One with the
free version at 199 and the non free version at 249. I think a lot will buy
the 199 version.

~~~
dsr_
Asus tried that with the EEE netbooks.

[http://blogs.computerworld.com/microsoft_strikes_back_at_lin...](http://blogs.computerworld.com/microsoft_strikes_back_at_linux_netbook_push)

(Money talks. Microsoft has a lot of money.)

~~~
Karunamon
It could easily be argued that the EEE machines didn't work because they were
too small, badly designed, and way _way_ underpowered.

I'd put the Chromebook up there as one of the first netbooks that were not
horrible.

~~~
Touche
EEE did work. They were highly successful and created the netbook category.

~~~
Karunamon
Yet the model line was eventually switched to windows and then killed off
entirely.

Heck the netbook as a concept has been rather dormant before the Chromebook
came along.

~~~
Touche
The Ford Model T was also discontinued, was it a failure as well?

------
Touche
That people are avoiding Windows 8+ is a side affect, it's not the problem.
The problem is that developers have been (and are continuing to) fleeing
Windows like it's the plague. The solution is to either radically make Windows
more developer friendly or open source Windows. At the very least open source
XP which you have no interest in supporting. Stick it on GitHub and accept
pull requests.

~~~
talmand
But I thought one of the bullet points of Win8 was that it was more developer
friendly.

When you say developer friendly, what do you mean by that? Seems to me you can
develop more or less whatever you want in numerous different ways. Are you
talking about developing on the core?

As for open sourcing a previous version, there's always something like
ReactOS, [http://www.reactos.org/](http://www.reactos.org/).

~~~
Touche
Microsoft's idea of developer friendliness is always aimed at high-level.
Windows is developer friendly _as long as you use their tools /languages_.
Developers want to choose their own tools, so they should make that easier /
more integrated.

~~~
talmand
I'm not a Windows developer, but I'm fairly certain there are options of
tools/languages for Windows development that are not offered directly from
Microsoft.

Again, are we talking about developing applications to run on Windows or
developing on the core?

~~~
Touche
Low-level applications/libraries. Things we take for granted on other OSes
like alternative shells, alternative terminal emulators, language bindings for
Win32 gui.

~~~
talmand
Ok, I understand now.

------
bananas
I hope this doesn't involve intrusive advertising or tracking. Firstly we're
all on a slippery path with that one but secondly can you imagine the
increased burden of _family tech support_? When relative X turns up with a
$250 windows laptop and wants the ads removed, its going to be painful to
explain.

I imagine this will actually cause more harm than good to the brand.

~~~
tunap
Ever since Vista, every time I run notepad Win calls home to Redmond to let
them know I did it(non-intrusive, granted). There are ~ 40 ways Windows phones
home to an MS IP when I open something or other these days. They call it
'metrics', I call it none of their business(look how they manipulate the data
to say 'most users don't use start menu, anyway'...bwahahaha). TG for 3rd
party firewalls, careful what you block...

~~~
bananas
Yes definitely aware of this. I ran wireshark on my workstation (MacBook) and
had Windows 7 in a VBox virtual machine. The amount of network traffic it
generates is insane. Prior to using the windows machine there was a little
mDNS traffic and some SSDP stuff from my router/television and nothing else.
Moment windows is online, thousands of packets everywhere. I didn't have time
to reverse engineer what it was doing (as I was debugging an SSDP stack) but
it's worrying simply from the complexity of filtering all of it.

------
chappi42
Just updated Windows 8(#) to 8.1. What a bullshit (still)!

It's not a question of money (free) but of simplifying the experience. It's a
bloody mess!

(#) Admittedly I didn't use Windows 8 often (mostly worked with Mountain Lion
and Ubuntu 13.04/13.10 however I was a longtime Windows user before (Win98 to
7).

~~~
chappi42
(just saw [this
article]([http://ignorethecode.net/blog/2014/03/02/windows_8_surface/](http://ignorethecode.net/blog/2014/03/02/windows_8_surface/))
on the hn frontpage which describes very well what I meant with bullshit and
mess. I kind of like the metro part but as I need the Desktop part... no
'love';)

------
shmerl
MS starts fearing really free OSes at last. Interesting times. What's next, MS
will open source Windows?

~~~
tunap
A few tens of millions of XP users would sure appreciate that, April 8th is
fast approaching. MS has extended MSSE updates for XP 'til 6/2015... can't
wait to see what they pull out of where next month.

PS: I could have sworn I saw XP workstations running on the ISS while watching
NASA archives couple days ago. I do not know how recent the archive footage
was...

~~~
frik
NASA uses Windows XP on A31 & T61 Thinkpad notebooks:

    
    
      As of 2010, the Space Station was equipped with 68 
      ThinkPad A31 computers along with 32 new Lenovo ThinkPad 
      T61p laptops plus a dedicated IP phone which also has 
      limited video phone capabilities. Work incorporating 
      those laptops into the station's LAN continued into June 
      2011. All laptops aboard the ISS are connected to the 
      station's LAN via Wi-Fi and are connected to the ground 
      at 3 Mbit/s up and 10 Mbit/s down, comparable to home DSL 
      connection speeds.
    

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ThinkPad#Use_in_space](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ThinkPad#Use_in_space)

~~~
shmerl
Didn't they get rid of it and started using Linux?

------
bluedino
I could see the benefit being people who have to re-install or want to upgrade
from XP/Vista can now do so for free - but wouldn't 9/10 of those people just
buy Windows or pirate it anyway?

For non-technical people, is losing Windows XP customers to Linux even an
issue for Microsoft?

They do have a good point about combating Chromebooks with a free version of
Windows. Will it run efficiently on Chromebook level hardware? The Acer C720
is a Haswell Celeron with 4GB of RAM which should be plenty. I'd be concerned
about the OS footprint on the SSD more than anything. 32GB vs 16GB would
double the storage cost of the machine.

------
hrktb
It would be interesting to see how "free" it will be.

I'm not sure how OSX is accounted, but I suppose it's now defined as
upgradable software coming with the hardware, the same way drivers are just
software for a device already paid.

Would Windows follow the same way of thinking and be free when bought OEM (as
the article hints at) or have a really free tier that anyone could download
for any hardware supported ?

It would be nice to have Microsoft let go a lower/barebone tier of windows and
focus on a premium version and additional services (unlimited skydrive
integration with automatic backups for instance) for profits.

------
talmand
Win8 was an attempt to convert from a desktop interface to a tablet interface.
But the thing is, I'm still using a desktop. There's no way you can convince
me to use a tablet interface on a desktop, especially when my monitor is not
touch enabled. You can offer it to me for free and I would still politely turn
you down. I already have Win7 on my current machine and it does everything
that I require. Why exactly would I take a step back in interface design when
I'm happy right now?

------
jmnicolas
As I understand it, Microsoft needs to keep Windows everywhere so they can
sell everything else (Office, Exchange, Server, SQL and Sharepoint).

Why don't they give Windows for free ?

~~~
chollida1
> Why don't they give Windows for free ?

I think you know the reason, its because they make a shit load of money
selling it.

It's not at all clear that they would be better off giving it away for free.

~~~
jmnicolas
Sure but they're loosing ground.

If I was them I'd rather make less money now and stay relevant for the next 20
years than satisfy my immediate greed and disappear* in the next decade ...

* disappear is too strong but my English being limited I don't have the word I need to convey what I mean.

~~~
venomsnake
Slide into obscurity is probably the phrase you seek.

------
philtar
I called it.

Here's what I said MSFT should do and it looks like they're on their way:

Have a free version of windows that sends back analytics, displays ads every
now and then etc.

The normal version of windows that's for enterprise/government/the rest will
get a significant price bump.

I made the mistake of not putting my prediction on the internet before the
free version was released. Now we wait for the price bump.

~~~
d23
Uh, what? Did you think everyone would kiss your feet and praise you as a god
if only you had put your random prediction somewhere on the internet?

~~~
philtar
Just a little bit of banter. Chill out.

------
AutoCorrect
Windows 8.1, so bad they're giving it away for free.

Seriously, doesn't this fall under monopoly no-nos?

~~~
nsxwolf
Is there another commercial operating system that isn't free?

~~~
frik
various UNIX (Solaris, etc.), QNX, z/OS, etc. (and OS like iOS/MacOS on non-
Apple hardware)

------
collyw
Yet again, both Microsoft and Apple following in the footsteps of Linux. Got
to love the articles like with headlines like these:

[http://www.wired.com/business/2013/10/apple-ends-paid-
oses/](http://www.wired.com/business/2013/10/apple-ends-paid-oses/)

~~~
aroch
This is an asinine comment. RHEL and SLED are enterprise-geared distros and
paid products.

~~~
Piskvorrr
True. On the other hand, MS has to fear XP replacements which are not Windows,
yet will run on the same old(er) HW that XP did; e.g. LXLE, which is geared
specifically towards this goal: [http://lxle.net/](http://lxle.net/)

~~~
slantyyz
The biggest XP replacements that are not Windows are iPads and Android tablets
-- at least for the majority of users who are primarily emailers and web
surfers. Not sure if a free version of Windows is going to stop the bleeding
there.

~~~
Piskvorrr
That's a good point as well.

