
Bikeshedding - somenomadicguy
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/bikeshedding
======
JonnieCache
This term always amuses me, because in british parlance "bike shed" is mostly
associated with the phrase "behind the bike sheds," the proverbial place where
illicit activities take place in the school playground: smoking, pubescent
sexual exploration etc. To turn it into a verb seems very racy indeed until
you find out what it actually means.

EDIT: I think the US equivalent might be "under the bleachers"?

~~~
kough
In case you were looking for confirmation – yes, "under the bleachers" is
exactly right, although it's a somewhat dated term at this point. Not sure
what the modern equivalent is but at least when I was in highschool (~2010)
there really was no way for anyone to spend any time under there except at
sporting events, which were very poorly attended.

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deanCommie
Does anyone know how to avoid this anti-pattern in group discussions?

I don't think starting from the more important issues is always the answer.
Assuming that: * the time for discussion is finite * discussions and meetings
expand to fill the time they have (meetings expand to fill the time they have)

It follows to me that in many situations it IS good to start with the easy
stuff, like the bike shed, to get it out of the way, and then spend the longer
period of time all the way to the end on the more significant subject.

But what can one do to prevent investing too much time on the bikeshed?
Timeboxing? And what happens if your box is over but no decision is made?

~~~
noxToken
You need to enumerate the goals of the meeting on a whiteboard. Literally
write them out so people can see. I have found this to be the most effective
method by far. When people have a meeting agenda in their email, it won't come
to mind during the meeting. When they see the topics ahead of them, they know
exactly what needs to be addressed.

Someone has to play the assertive, no nonsense authority. Meetings are ripe
for sidebar conversations. It only gets worse with more people, people from
different offices/sections/projects, closeness of participants, etc. Whoever
is running the meeting needs to ensure that the agenda is the foremost
priority. Keep the agenda conversation going while squelching pointless
conversation.

Keep a list of tabled topics. Not all sidebar conversation is bad. There are
tangentially related topics that need to be addressed as well, but they may
not take precedent over what is on the agenda. Those topics can also be
written on the board to circle back to if time permits. This has the added
bonus of growing the agenda while keeping the time allotted constant.

Understand why people argue and what is needed to make both parties happy. For
the longest time, I didn't realize that I was arguing poorly. I knew what my
point was and what I wanted to get across. I would listen to their reasons for
arguing their side, but I never got to their core beliefs. Sometimes you have
to outright ask what will it take to make them change their mind.

An underhanded trick that can be used (but not every time) is to give them a
sense of urgency: _Thanks for attending this meeting. I know we have a lot to
cover, but I have to leave in 45 minutes. If we focus, I know we can hit all
of these topics._ If certain topics are limping along, give a time check: _We
need to make a decision. I only have 25 minutes with 3 more topics to go._

~~~
mabbo
> Someone has to play the assertive, no nonsense authority.

This is one of the most critical roles a good manager can play. I've seen a
team cut its meeting hours per week in half because the new manager did this
well.

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ptaipale
What I've used to mean the same is "paperclipping" (discussing paper clips).

When planning for investments in a corporation, major stakeholders who are
clueless about important technologies (e.g. which hardware and software
platform to choose) spend their time on discussing where the paper clips in
office storage room should be procured, because that is a thing that they can
understand, and they can show how they care about even the smallest detail.

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Walf
If you feel like being disheartened, please consult this list:

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-
pattern#Examples](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-pattern#Examples)

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smcl
I am so glad to have learned the right word to describe this! I've tried to
employ the "drunk looking for his keys under the streetlight" metaphor before
but was met with confusion and blank faces. Maybe this is an easier to grasp
phrase

~~~
coldtea
> _I 've tried to employ the "drunk looking for his keys under the
> streetlight" metaphor before but was met with confusion and blank faces._

It also deals with another matter as a metaphor. It's about doing what's
easier but without effect, over what's effective but difficult.

Bikeshedding is about wasting time on non-important decisions.

So there's only slight overlap between the two concepts. The "talk about
furniture arrangements while there is a hole on the roof" parent mentions is
more apt -- but you can also bikeshed without any more pressing matter
present.

~~~
privong
> The "talk about furniture arrangements while there is a hole on the roof"
> parent mentions

The version I've heard is: "rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic" :)

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Fricken
'There are a thousand hacking at the branches of evil to one who is striking
at the root'.

-Thoreau

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bogomipz
This is definitely a great term and one that comes up frequently at work. I
would like to mention "yak shaving" as well. Since it seems there isn't a day
that goes by at the tech job where there isn't at least some amount of either
"bike shedding" or "yak shaving" going on.

[https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/yak_shaving](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/yak_shaving)

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ableal
The original Parkinson's Law book is well worth looking up, and a couple of
sequels are not bad either.

My favorite piece is probably 'Plans and Plants', already summarized here at
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=610761](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=610761)

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arielweisberg
It's not bike shedding it's code review! There we baked it into our process
and gave one party unilateral and unlimited leverage.

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roadman
In French language: to comb the giraffe.

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crawshaw
I am disappointed the Talk:bikeshedding page is empty.

~~~
pawadu
It is important that we have a good discussion going on about this very
important issue. I invite everyone to contribute to the talk page.

But first, should we use TAB or SPACEs in the talk page?

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digestives
[http://xkcd.com/1167/](http://xkcd.com/1167/) via
[https://twitter.com/crell/status/296506190190489600](https://twitter.com/crell/status/296506190190489600)

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saltycraig
The email that started it all (at least in the software world):
[http://phk.freebsd.dk/sagas/bikeshed.html](http://phk.freebsd.dk/sagas/bikeshed.html)

~~~
cnvogel
[http://bikeshed.com/](http://bikeshed.com/) \- with random colors on every
reload.

Quote: "(If you don't like the way we painted this bikeshed, try
bikeshedding.io, or the minimalist shed.bike. Or set up your own? That's the
spirit!)"

