
What a Russian Smile Means - dannyow
http://nautil.us//issue/61/coordinates/what-a-russian-smile-means
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ssambros
> There is even a Russian proverb on the topic: “Smiling with no reason is a
> sign of stupidity.”

No there is not. There is a saying that "laughter without a reason is a sign
of a fool" ("смех без причины - признак дурачины"), not smiling. I doubt any
American will consider unreasonable laughter to be normal.

~~~
sigfubar
I'm Russian, and I parse "смех" as equivalent to "laughter" and "smiling".
Yes, they're technically different words, but a person who smiles without a
reason looks equally as idiotic as another who laughs without a reason.

~~~
onemoresoop
In Romanian we inherit the same proverb and its direct translation would be
something akin to laugh like a fool (for no apparent reason)

~~~
onemoresoop
Romanian is not slavic but our cultures intermingle quite a bit

~~~
Chyzwar
Proverbs are not exclusive to one ethnic group.

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ClintEhrlich
As an American who spent a year as a visiting researcher inside Russia's
Foreign Ministry, I can confirm that these differences in decorum are very
real.

They are common knowledge in Russian society, and Russian diplomats are
trained to take them into account when emulating Western social graces.

Broadly speaking, in my experience Russians conceive of smiling as something
precious, to be shared with friends or family, not wasted on strangers
crossing your path. However, if you have occasion to interact with someone
(e.g., asking for directions), they may smile, particularly if something about
the conversation generates a feeling of closeness. I got a lot of smiles and
handshakes in Moscow from strangers when they found out I was studying at
MGIMO, since they (incorrectly) assumed it meant I'd snubbed Harvard or Yale.

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krzyk
I'm from Poland and here people don't smile like they do in USA.

Don't even get me started on "How are you?", I always want to reply honestly
to that, and I don't feel much obligation to reply back (I usually don't care
how some stranger feels, why should I?). That's probably the hardest in
learning English for me.

~~~
potatote
As an immigrant, that was one of the cultural adjustment that I had to do in
the US. In my home country in SE Asia, people usually ask "Have you eaten
(have you had a meal)?" as a greeting. It's easier to answer with "No, I
haven't." or "Yes, I just had lunch" for example.

But when I moved to the states for college, I was perplexed as to how to
answer "How're ya?" or "What's up?". :D I learned to answer that question with
a standard, "I'm good. Thank you". But even nowadays, I sometimes venture to
answer it honestly like, "I'm okay. [insert some really honest reason why I'm
just okay]" or "I'm busy, but it's all good".

This is just a small example of adjustment that I made as I try to settle in
my new home.

~~~
EGreg
I am in Russia now. I can say that people do smile normally if they feel like
the conversation warrants it. But there’s not so much “fake” tinseltown
hollywood pleasantry.

Americans in the US have a saying “if you don’t have anything nice to say,
don’t say it at all.” It is a culture very much fine tuned for business, which
is why you want to make sure to grease the wheels of an interaction, and there
is nothing to be gained by being straightforward with what you actually think.
It’s avoidance of conflict and closing of a sale.

I remember when my grandparents immigrated to the USA they would relate
stories like:

1) A woman would approach and say “hi, how are you”? And they would start
answering but she would just walk on by LOL

2) My grandfather would offer a seat to a woman but she just started yelling
at him for doing it.

Later, they adjusted. But even the word “you” — which Russians thought is
“rude” because there is no “polite You” for strangers — actually _is_ the
polite version of Thou, because (unlike the Amish) the English got so polite
that they just stopped using Thou altogether!

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usaphp
I would rather look at smiling people around me, even if the smile means
nothing, than looking at sad faces in Russia. Everytime I go back to visit
friends I notice how grumpy and angry most people look and you become to look
like that too - the more you look at them.

~~~
sattoshi
Not this. Having lived in Russia, this is something which is neither good nor
bad. It just is. The faces are not sad or grumpy, they are relaxed. Nobody
pretends to be happier than they are.

You just got used to smiles everywhere. There is nothing more to it.

At least in Russia, when someone smiles at you, it means something.

~~~
usaphp
When an average American is forcing his smiling just to make my day better it
means more to me than a grumpy face of an average Russian, and makes my day
better, and I don’t care if he is really happy or not, he made me happy,
that’s what I like about American smiles

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salgernon
I'm a US person. While going through aggressive cancer treatment and
concomitant depression, I was encouraged by my caregivers to smile as much as
possible to elevate my mood. They even encouraged me practice smiling while
alone. N=1, but this did seem to help. It seemed to lower my stress when
around other people, and I noticed that they would be smiling more too
(although this may just be because I was finally noticing something that was
going on around me.)

Otherwise I have "resting porg face".

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phyller
I see the smile, in my personal slice of American culture, to be a sign that
"I mean you no harm, I have positive intentions towards you", which is a
valuable piece of information, both to give and receive. And truthfully,
someone who is not feeling well disposed towards me and intends to make my
life more difficult rarely approaches with a smile. Perhaps in Russia people
are not so open about their intentions to each other and these outward
indicators have less value?

~~~
bearburger
> I mean you no harm, I have positive intentions towards you

But what is the point of smile as "intention indicator" if literally everyone
around are smiling to each other? Do you want to say that in the US seller
that trying to sell defective goods wouldn't smile?

~~~
phyller
Well usually everyone around you means you no harm. The person who looks at
you and doesn't smile is legitimately more likely to not care if you get hit
by a bus or not, even if they have no ill intention towards you. The crazy guy
whose alternate personality is telling him to stab you is definitely not
smiling but staring at you and muttering to himself.

Of course context matters. I don't trust a smile from a used car salesman. I
trust a smile more from someone I am playing basketball with, or that I pass
while hiking in the woods as they have no incentive to deceive me. And if I
don't get a smile from someone I pass while hiking in the woods I would be
more on my guard.

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hurpaDurpa
Sometimes I wonder how these sorts of cultural subtleties are compensated for,
when defining a set of clinical psychological personality disorders.

Cluster A (paranoia): [https://www.mentalhelp.net/articles/dsm-5-the-ten-
personalit...](https://www.mentalhelp.net/articles/dsm-5-the-ten-personality-
disorders-cluster-a/)

Cluster B (drama): [https://www.mentalhelp.net/articles/dsm-5-the-ten-
personalit...](https://www.mentalhelp.net/articles/dsm-5-the-ten-personality-
disorders-cluster-b/)

Clister C (anxiety): [https://www.mentalhelp.net/articles/dsm-5-the-ten-
personalit...](https://www.mentalhelp.net/articles/dsm-5-the-ten-personality-
disorders-cluster-c/)

Take either culture's description, and stack it next to the other, and the
incompatible resolution or reconcilliation between the two certainly sounds
like it could add up to any of those disorders.

When you listen to the sort of discomfort and culture shock that seems
implicit in these stories of adaptation, to the wrong set of ears, this all
might sound like mental illness.

Growing up in one place, and then living in another, only to feel the longing
pangs of nostalia and familiarity for what your childhood instict defines or
recognizes as normal, clash with the reality of a world turned upsidedown,
feels like a recipe for being plied with medication, if you tell the wrong
person.

It feels like this process scaled up to millions of people, is exactly the
sort of thing that drives conflict around the world.

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asveikau
I get tired of articles and people that put us Americans all in the same
smiley "how's your day going so far?" box. Maybe the average is like that in
most places, and sure you can draw contrasts to other places. But as a grumpy
east coaster living out west I find it somewhat irritating too, and I know I
am not alone in this.

~~~
GordonS
Hey, UK person here. Every time I visit the US or deal with customers from the
US, I'm bombarded with fake well-wishing, accompanied by equally fake grins.
You've given me some glimmer of hope that it's not quite _everyone_ in the US
who is like that!

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dsabanin
As a Russian, living in America, I would suggest not to take any clues about
social behavior from Russians. It's all shades of dysfunctional from the
bottom to the very top.

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stcredzero
_Even dealing with a simple “How are you?” felt complicated. People in Russia
didn’t engage in this kind of social script, and to her it seemed unnecessary.
Did they really want to know how she was? No._

This reminds me of my younger self. I would pause and reply with an
unvarnished and detailed analysis of my current status. Is it just me, or do
other people think that some cultures shifted a bit on the Aspergers spectrum
from other cultures? I certainly think that's the case for some subcultures.

------
kpil
It means you're drunk.

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jancsika
> If she answered honestly (“I’m tired”), which is what felt most natural, she
> worried she’d come off as rude.

I'm not understanding the word "natural" here. Would her honesty be given in a
spirit of satire, confusion, fear, something else?

For example, suppose in response to her saying, "I'm tired," I replied, "Now
that we've established your propensity for reflexive honesty in response to
unexpected questions, what is your bank account and routing number?"

Would she take the joke in a spirit of playfulness, or alarm?

Edit: clarification

