
How the Government Killed a Secure E-mail Company - Expeck
http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/elements/2013/08/the-government-versus-your-secrets.html
======
hga
" _If Lavabit lost its appeal to the F.I.S.C.R., and still refused to
coöperate, it would run a serious risk of being found in contempt; that’s how
most courts punish those who disobey its orders. The FISA court is no
different. According to the court’s rules of procedure, a party may be held in
contempt for defying its orders. The secret court may consider many
punishments—secret fines for each day of noncompliance, or even secret jail
time for executives. The idea behind civil contempt is that “you hold the key
to your own cell.” If you comply, the punishment stops. But hold out long
enough and your contempt may be criminal, and your compliance will not end the
jail sentence or displace the fine._ "

Any claims the FISA court is not a real court fail hard if the above is
correct. Which is pretty much has to be for the current system to work.

~~~
barking
Secret courts

extraordinary rendition

waterboarding

indefinite detention in a location beyond the reach of the judicial system

shoot to kill via drone

spying on the populace on a scale that the stasi could only dream of.

Spying on allies as well as enemies

What kind of a regime is that?

~~~
akg_67
USA -> USSR. US govt has decided to follow practices of USSR govt as it
considers them to be much more superior than the former USA govt practices.

------
LoganCale
The only way I can imagine secret jail time working is by publicly charging
that person with a crime they didn't commit to cover up the actual reason.
This is similar to what is alleged with the CEO of Qwest, who would not
cooperate with the NSA and was then charged with insider trading and is still
in prison.

However, what possible reason would the person have to remain silent about the
real reason they're in prison once they're already in prison?

~~~
hga
" _However, what possible reason would the person have to remain silent about
the real reason they 're in prison once they're already in prison_"

Look at Qwest CEO Nacchio's case. He claimed exactly that, see e.g.
[http://dailycaller.com/2013/06/13/jailed-qwest-ceo-
claimed-t...](http://dailycaller.com/2013/06/13/jailed-qwest-ceo-claimed-that-
nsa-retaliated-because-he-wouldnt-participate-in-spy-program/) and what
happened?

He's jailed for 6 years, I'm sure most people believe it's because he's eeevil
capitalist scum, and whatever the truth, everyone else in his position has to
take it as likely they'd suffer the same fate.

Now that this seems to have turned a corner it _might_ play out differently,
but "Do you feel lucky, punk?"

------
jteiiawer
Also re secret jail time: [http://www.rcfp.org/browse-media-law-
resources/news-media-la...](http://www.rcfp.org/browse-media-law-
resources/news-media-law/news-media-and-law-winter-2012/silencing-stories)

~~~
VladRussian2
>allows the BOP to monitor client-attorney communications.

here goes another one down the drain.

------
robomartin
_When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to
dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to
assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which
the Laws of Nature and of Nature 's God entitle them, a decent respect to the
opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel
them to the separation.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that
they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among
these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That TO SECURE THESE
RIGHTS, GOVERNMENTS ARE INSTITUTED AMONG MEN, DERIVING THEIR JUST POWERS FROM
THE CONSENT OF THE GOVERNED, --THAT WHENEVER ANY FORM OF GOVERNMENT BECOMES
DESTRUCTIVE OF THESE ENDS, IT IS THE RIGHT OF THE PEOPLE TO ALTER OR TO
ABOLISH IT, AND TO INSTITUTE NEW GOVERNMENT, LAYING ITS FOUNDATION ON SUCH
PRINCIPLES AND ORGANIZING ITS POWERS IN SUCH FORM, AS TO THEM SHALL SEEM MOST
LIKELY TO EFFECT THEIR SAFETY AND HAPPINESS. Prudence, indeed, will dictate
that Governments long established should not be changed for light and
transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are
more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves
by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of
abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design
to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty,
to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future
security.--Such has been the patient sufferance of these Colonies; and such is
now the necessity which constrains them to alter their former Systems of
Government. The history of the present King of Great Britain is a history of
repeated injuries and usurpations, all having in direct object the
establishment of an absolute Tyranny over these States. To prove this, let
Facts be submitted to a candid world._

(emphasis mine)

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Declaration_of_In...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Declaration_of_Independence)

Do yourself a favor and take a few minutes to read the full document. Now, if
you really care, play with it a little, modify the Indictment to reflect
current events and relevant grievances.

Frankly, it scares me. This is a 237 year old document that feels like we
might consider writing it almost verbatim today. I have to say that I have
never lived in fear of what my country might become. Now, with the actions of
this and the prior administration I really don't know what to think. Obama and
his regime have accelerated our descent into something indistinguishable from
what I remember as the country I genuinely love with the deepest corners of my
heart and mind. It really saddens me to the core in a manner that is hard to
express with words.

This is now the domain of tears, not words.

Who's fault it this? It's that of the political fundamentalists. Those among
us who choose not to think critically and, instead, vote like sheep, year
after year, always supporting their ridiculous parties, Democrats and
Republicans either out of self-interest or ignorance. This is on you and
nobody else.

You ought to be ashamed. All of you. You bunch of assholes. You now have a
front seat from which to enjoy the destruction of our Nation from the inside
out. This is almost like a slow motion train wreck happening right in front of
our collective eyes. Will you do anything to help fix it or will you sit
quietly watching the train wreck? Will you break ranks and vote the morons out
of office in a united show of political force by the people and for the
people. Will you hold all those you supported accountable for their lies and
actions? You probably wont. You will probably continue to vote like sheep,
supporting your petty fucking causes, missing the forest for the trees.

Fucking cowards.

~~~
kaonashi
Then realize it was written by a bunch of Aristocratic slave-holding white
men, who implicitly meant for the document to apply only to people like
themselves.

What the traditionally disenfranchised are thinking is: welcome to the fucking
club.

~~~
dx4100
Does that invalidate the arguments put forth in the document? Did it not
result in greater freedom for all and eventually lead to massive prosperity?

~~~
kaonashi
It definitely inspired people to resolve its core hypocrisy, which led to
positive effects.

------
rogerthis
I'd say that all this gov secrecy is right in the basis of the USA, from its
start. Just remember that almost all founding fathers were members of the free
masonry secret society.

\-- Oh, he is on conspiracy theory now! Let's ignore him.

------
joelrunyon
How is Mega not all over this?

I feel like this would be Kim Dot Com's favorite thing in the world to do
(sticking his finger in America's legal eye). Why haven't they rolled out a
privacy focused email service. Their tagline is the "the privacy company."

------
wildgift
This now gives an edge to all the big internet companies that offer messaging
services that aren't based on email.

------
AndrewKemendo
Completely aside from the main point, but I am curious as to why the New
Yorker chose to use umlauts for all of the instances of the word: "coöperate."
It's a latin word so I wouldn't expect to see that.

I wonder if it is a rendering trick or something intentional for tracking.

~~~
vizsladriver
It's called a diaeresis. It marks the start of a new syllable. They have an
article discussing its history at the magazine.

[http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/culture/2012/04/the-
cu...](http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/culture/2012/04/the-curse-of-the-
diaeresis.html)

~~~
AndrewKemendo
Ah thanks! Never knew about that.

------
AsymetricCom
Didn't Lavabit shutdown voluntarily?

~~~
samstave
In self-defense, and the pre-emptive defense of others

