
Hillary Clinton Announces Tech Plan - stryan
http://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/columnist/2016/06/28/clinton-tech-plan-reads-like-silicon-valley-wish-list/86474144/
======
jordanb
> attaching a green card to the diplomas of foreign-born students earning STEM
> degrees.

HAH! I knew this was going to be in there.

Of course it's a gigantic bailout to the universities. STEM grad programs are
already full of foreign nationals trying to get a slot in the advanced degree
H1-B track.

This would absolutely turbocharge that: buy a degree from whatever fourth rate
American university for $xxx,xxx and value is less in the degree than the
golden ticket that comes attached.

~~~
ak217
That is a pretty myopic thing to say. One of the biggest issues for the US
higher ed system is that foreign students who receive an education here often
can't stay or have to face ridiculous hurdles. In many thousands of cases, you
are also wrong about buying the degree: research grants to universities fund
those students' tuition and stipends, in exchange for good work.

Address the inflation of university budgets at the source of the problem.
Rejecting highly educated, successful foreign nationals who we have already
invested money in and who want to stay here and be productive in the workforce
is one of the stupidest things this country currently does. Rejecting this
proposal because you think it's a bailout for universities is cutting off your
nose to spite your face.

~~~
throwawaysocks
_> In many thousands of cases, you are also wrong about buying the degree:
research grants to universities fund those students' tuition and stipends, in
exchange for good work._

I think your parent was primarily referring to masters programs, not phd
programs.

FWIW I am pro-immigration in general, but I do worry about expensive diploma
mill masters programs becoming a way for wealthy immigrants to buy
preferential treatment. It's a legitimate concern with any "masters == green
card" scheme.

That said, anyone who opposes such a scheme for Ph.D. students or for highly
quality masters programs is insane.

~~~
jordanb
Because we have such a serious of shortage of people with PHDs?

[https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-B9Hv9N6bi1w/V2WBuW96arI/AAAAAAAAE...](https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-B9Hv9N6bi1w/V2WBuW96arI/AAAAAAAAExk/KyBUngeJYwEwMqLKZ_Zn_WyfOebhPrSGgCLcB/s1600/median%2Bscientist%2Bsalaries.png)

~~~
throwawaysocks
No, because as a nation we are actively investing in each funded Ph.D. we
train.

If we have too many PhD's then we should decrease the number of PhD's the
federal government funds. But as my original parent observed, paying hundreds
of thousands to train someone just to kick them out of the country is silly.

(Also, I think downward pressure on PhD salaries has very little to do with
over-supply, but that's for another article.)

------
rayiner
> It proposes investments in computer science and engineering education . . .
> and attaching a green card to the diplomas of foreign-born students earning
> STEM degrees.

These sound good in theory, but in effect they're an industry-specific labor
subsidy. When the government "invests" in STEM education, what happens is that
the companies that need to hire engineers save money both as a result of
reduced training costs and as a by-product of increased supply driving down
wages.

It's worth keeping in mind that STEM education isn't necessarily a public
good.[1] The benefits of education aimed at developing industry-specific
skills accrues mostly to those in an employer-employee relationship. Under
those circumstances, it's most economically efficient to force the employer
and the employee--rather than the public--to bear the cost of that education.

[1]
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_good](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_good)

~~~
seeingfurther
Isn't that a good thing? What would be some negative consequences?

~~~
arthulia
Wages going down and competition going up for people in the tech industry.

~~~
jordanb
Not just the tech industry too. There are plenty of areas of STEM which are
totally saturated with smart effective highly educated people and the result
is low wages and poor employment outcomes. Just look at chemistry or biology.

------
basch
2 things to remember.

1) "Fix Copyright" probably means TPP

2) Hillary uses a blackberry because she doesnt know how to use a computer
[http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/27/us/politics/hillary-
clinto...](http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/27/us/politics/hillary-clinton-
state-department-email-inquiry.html) nor does she password protect her own
computer [http://dailycaller.com/2016/05/26/shocking-deposition-
hillar...](http://dailycaller.com/2016/05/26/shocking-deposition-hillary-
clueless-on-using-computer-emails/)

~~~
basch
well im getting downvoted for this, BUT my point was

Hillary clearly didnt write this laundry list, it seems like almost a time
cube esque wishlist of every tech initiative possible. It just comes off as
political word salad, so different news aggregators can bite quote it, like
throwing paint at the wall.

"Hillary is committed to increasing the security of our government networks,
making it harder for hackers to gain unauthorized access."

Really?

------
basch
there is no reason to link to usatoday over the actual post, i move to replace
the link

[https://www.hillaryclinton.com/briefing/factsheets/2016/06/2...](https://www.hillaryclinton.com/briefing/factsheets/2016/06/27/hillary-
clintons-initiative-on-technology-innovation/)

~~~
arcanus
Good catch. In fact, after a quick glance, the original post appears _more_
informative than the usatoday. I 2nd the motion.

------
hasenj
Trump said something to the same effect in his campaign launching book
(Crippled America) where he lamented how the US makes it easy for illegal
immigrants but difficult for honest people who studied and graduated in
American universities but then have to go back to their home countries because
the US doesn't want them to stay.

~~~
Eyas
It is kind of difficult with Trump because he has actually said everything. In
a complete system of logic, you will find an argument made in support of every
good idea out there (but also, every bad idea out there).

In the case of Trump and tech immigration, he had argued for H1-B/green card
reform for skilled workers, as you have said, and against it, see
[http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-
meter/statements/2015/oct/...](http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-
meter/statements/2015/oct/28/donald-trump/donald-trump-didnt-realize-his-own-
website-called-/)

~~~
hasenj
The thing with his position on allowing university graduates to stay and work
in the US is that he only said it in the book. I've never seen him say it in a
public speech, which makes sense given that the majority of his audience seems
to have been blue collar workers who would not be so thrilled with the idea of
immigrant students taking well paying jobs while they and their children are
stuck in a rut.

------
simonh
Interesting. I expect a series of highly detailed policy announcements on
complex issues from Hillary over the coming months. I'm guessing she's
realised Trump will be completely out of his depth on anything like this and
unable to respond effectively.

~~~
talmand
I suspect Hillary is out of her depth on the subject as well. Her advisors, on
the other hand, may not. I see no reason Trump cannot hire advisors just as
experienced in the field as Hillary.

~~~
sigmar
>I see no reason Trump cannot hire advisors just as experienced in the field
as Hillary.

The "he can get experts too" argument is fine, except for the fact he has
publicly spoken out saying all experts are "terrible."

>Referring to criticism that he could be better schooled on matters of foreign
policy, Trump suggested he would do just as well, if not better than the
current or past administrations without anyone providing input.

[http://www.politico.com/blogs/2016-gop-primary-live-
updates-...](http://www.politico.com/blogs/2016-gop-primary-live-updates-and-
results/2016/04/donald-trump-foreign-policy-experts-221528)

~~~
talmand
Just because he's publicly stated all experts are terrible doesn't mean he
doesn't have them now nor will not in the future. If he didn't listen to other
people and their opinions then I seriously doubt he would be where he is
today. He's just letting his ego speak for him.

As for your quote, I could easily explain that is him saying he would do
better than previous administrations without anyone providing input, before he
seeks such input. He will do better without them, and he could do even better
than that with them.

~~~
simonh
We're talking about Trump though. The time between his experts issuing a
detailed complex policy document in his name and him completely contradicting
it in public is likely to be measured in hours, not days.

~~~
talmand
Well, since you know so much of the man and how his teams work, I'll defer to
your expertise.

~~~
simonh
I'm extrapolating from his repeated and persistent contradictions of himself,
which are a matter of record.

------
MrZongle2
I realize that Clinton -- like _any_ candidate -- has a platoon of advisers
for a wide variety of topics, and it is these people (rather than the
candidate) who comes up with the proposed policy.

But I can't help but immediately think that this was the candidate who
disregarded the sound advice of the IT and security professionals in the State
Department and had an entirely different bunch of people set up a faulty
alternative email service for her own convenience.

And then I wonder how much of a rosy "tech plan" will also be so casually
discarded when it becomes inconvenient.

~~~
thecolorblue
> ...faulty alternative email service...

Do you have a source for this? It was my impression that nothing was out of
the ordinary about her email server, and the rules around it were vague.

~~~
Spooky23
Do some Googling.

Anyone who isn't Hillary Clinton would be in prison right now for doing what
she did.

~~~
drabiega
I'm not a particularly big fan of Hilary, but as far as I'm aware, this used
to be pretty common among members of congress and senators, so you might have
to broaden your criteria a bit.

~~~
Spooky23
I actually like Hillary, and think she'll be a good president.

But she pretty obviously committed a felony.

------
intrasight
>attaching a green card to the diplomas of foreign-born students earning STEM
degrees

This should be for all accredited degree programs. Attaching it to specific
degrees is going to have all kinds of unintended consequences.

------
sz4kerto
So you can host your email server at home. /s

~~~
treehau5
Alternative headline: "FBI Suspect Announces Tech Plan"

------
davidcollantes
Where can one find the source for the tech plan? Is it on her website
somewhere? I have not been able to find it.

~~~
therobot24
i posted a link + comments in another thread

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12001367](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12001367)

------
tootie
Has she said anything about continuing the expansion of 18F or other
government digital services?

------
kelukelugames
Here is a link to the source.

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11997844](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11997844)

------
mindslight
> _Hillary rejects the false choice between privacy interests and keeping
> Americans safe. She was a proponent of the USA Freedom Act, and she supports
> Senator Mark Warner and Representative Mike McCaul’s idea for a national
> commission on digital security and encryption. This commission will work
> with the technology and public safety communities to address the needs of
> law enforcement, protect the privacy and security of all Americans that use
> technology, assess how innovation might point to new policy approaches, and
> advance our larger national security and global competitiveness interests._

Unsurprisingly, it's more Orwellian garbage.

To these "people", what's done at airports is security, even though it
manifestly makes everyone less safe by separating us from our luggage,
unpacking and displaying our stuff for all to see, stripping us of our tools,
and creating a perfect chokepoint for the scene of their next 24 hour tragedy.

It's not surprising that captains of the private surveillance industry
endorsed these policies, but individuals would have to be fools to think this
means anything besides more regressive information totalitarianism.

(also, "Doesn't she look tired?")

