
Alarm over talks to implant UK employees with microchips - paublyrne
https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/nov/11/alarm-over-talks-to-implant-uk-employees-with-microchips
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esotericn
Right.

So, without the implant, someone who wants to break in to my place of work has
to steal my card or convince me to give it to them.

With the implant, someone who wants to break in to my place of work has to cut
it out of my finger/wrist/whatever.

Well, I think I'm done with this interview. Best of luck, chaps.

~~~
BrandoElFollito
A bank of mine, years ago, proposed me to move to their biometric system on
their ATMs. Faster, easiet, no PIN to remember.

They also said "safer". I told them that I much prefer to give the gentleman
with a baseball bat my PIN then my hand.

They told me not to worry because it did not work with a detached hand. I
asked them if the gentleman with the saw also knew it.

I am still with a PIN.

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snuxoll
I feel like the question to ask here is _why_? What on Earth are the benefits
to implanting RFID chips into an employee to begin with that cannot be
achieved via traditional means like badges or smart cards?

This seems like a huge hassle for employees themselves, especially if they
decide to change employers and both for whatever reason want you to be chipped
- so now you have multiple chips implanted or have to remove one and replace
it with another. Again, for what benefit?

I'm not even going to get into tinfoil hat privacy territory, because it's not
like these are going to be active RFID chips so they'll need to be in close
proximity of a reader to be picked up. Worries like that are as far fetched as
the people who think the government is spying on you using RFID equipped
credit cards or transit passes (which annoyingly has led to most wallets these
days having a small faraday cage woven into them, I literally couldn't find a
wallet I liked a couple months ago that didn't have some RFID-blocking feature
and it drives me nuts).

~~~
peteretep
> What on Earth are the benefits to implanting RFID chips into an employee to
> begin with that cannot be achieved via traditional means like badges or
> smart cards?

No fan of the technology per-se, but presumably they can't be lost or stolen.

~~~
reificator
> _No fan of the technology per-se, but presumably they can 't be lost or
> stolen._

Yep, just like fingerprints can't be stolen. Wait, what are you doing with
that knife?!

~~~
adetrest
You don't even need a knife for fingerprints, you can lift them off of
whatever that person has touched.

~~~
reificator
Yeah but you can use a knife for biometrics and implanted chips.

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adetrest
... And this isn't even the Onion. I always have the feeling that the UK is
obsessed with surveillance and security in an even creepier way than the US,
but I can't quite put my finger on the reason. It's not like the US and other
countries aren't trying very hard to control and monitor their citizens, it
just feels a lot more dystopian in the UK. Maybe it's because
movies/shows/stories that are dystopian are set in the UK more?

------
King-Aaron
Fry: What if I don't want to be a delivery boy?

Leela: Then you'll be fired...

Fry: Fine.

Leela: ...out of a cannon, into the sun

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rstuart4133
I'm sure there is some novel combination of technologies out there that would
be a net positive to the employees. But rather than putting a bit of work into
finding it, they propose the cheapest, privacy invasive, spookiest solution I
can image. I guess we should be glad they didn't suggest a large tattoo on the
forehead. With the right camera's you could verify your employees tattoo
before they entered the building.

If they have of come up with something like FIDO2 embedded in the arm,
something that allows multiple identities and allows me to select which
identity is released by just thinking the right thing (perhaps move a muscle
or two) it would be useful to all sorts of things. (Finally a real solution
for the password problem.) Gee - I might even volunteer to pay for it myself.

------
speeq
Coming soon to an airport near you: the e-implant gates.

------
rleigh
Anyone who submits to this, and allows their employer to perform a surgical
procedure upon them in order for them to work, needs their head examining. I'd
personally be straight out of the door for a new job.

~~~
millenialdev
That's not how they get you though. They get desperate people to do it, then
build momentum in the number of people with it. Then sooner or later everyone
has one.

~~~
rleigh
That's definitely how these things are played, no argument at all. But, this
is one of the things I would never, ever compromise on. Allow my personal
being to be violated for a job. Never.

------
oldandtired
A lot of the clothing you buy has RFID in tags sewn into the item. If you
don't know this and don't remove these tags, you find that they will set off
the exit/entry scanner at various stores unrelated to where the item was
originally purchased.

I have a pair of shorts that this happens to on a regular basis. I cannot be
bothered to remove the RFID tag at this point.

So if RFID tags are inserted into your body, how often will you trigger such
scanners when you are doing your normal business?

~~~
Symbiote
What's the easiest way to detect this? Would an NFC phone app work in all
cases?

~~~
universenz
Easiest way to detect if there's an RFID tag is to put your shorts in the
microwave for 10 seconds. Jokes aside, the only cases I know of where the RFID
tag is sewn into the item permanently, is major Hotel chain towels.

------
mathw
You'd never sell this to people unless it was part of some bigger system that
let you load your travel pass, building access, car access, maybe even
contactless payment systems onto it. It'd have to be universal, completely
reliable and completely risk-free.

And it'd have to come with some substantial therapy for my proper anxiety-
disorder-level phobia of needles. I need that therapy anyway because I have to
be given drugs before I'll let anybody stick a needle in me for any reason at
all, but fortunately nobody's making a giant chip-inserting machine
compulsory.

~~~
LinuxBender
They also have to convince folks it is safe. The sealant used for the pet chip
injectors was causing cancer in animals for a while. Also, I dare anyone with
this implant to go within 500 meters of Defcon or Blackhat. Everything
unhackable is hackable there.

~~~
LinuxBender
What timing. See related [1]

[1] - [https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/article/3k9q49/how-i-
lost...](https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/article/3k9q49/how-i-lost-and-
regained-control-of-my-microchip-implant)

------
myrandomcomment
So the thing that is lacking here is the human user UI to go with this. What I
mean is some sci-fi like vision overlay that allows you to approve someone
reading the implant. If they had that and it means I never needed to carry an
ID, credit cards, cash etc. it would be very interesting.

~~~
goldfeld
Yes please technology take over my agency! I've been squandering and handing
it over for decades but please it's not been enough!! And since you're so
listening technology can you make me into a flying buzzing drone, any size
works!

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nitwit005
Wouldn't implanting something in a human be considered surgery? I doubt
getting a licensed medical staff to insert and remove the things will come
cheap.

~~~
aequitas
These procedures are mostly done by tattoo shops. From small RFID tags to
matchbox sized electronics. It's just considered a form of piercing.

------
rezeroed
I have no issue with this. I work at a place where I carry a card and have to
use fingerprint scanners. Fingerprint scanners are very moody. I suspect
temperature is one factor, coming in from the cold with cold fingers. There
are occasions where the things just won't allow me in. They're also revolting.
Sometimes you put your finger on and it slides in some sort of oily goop. On
other occasions you can feel a roughness of some dried crud. Undoubtedly a
viral and bacterial hot spot.

~~~
alexgmcm
I'd rather wash my hands than have some chip implanted in me.

~~~
rezeroed
Waste of time, waste of resources, inconvenient, intrusive - chips can be more
easily removed than fingerprints.

