
USDA let millions of pounds of food rot while food-bank demand soared - mooreds
https://www.politico.com/news/2020/04/26/food-banks-coronavirus-agriculture-usda-207215
======
Spivak
The article opens with the actual problem and then just seems to ignore it?

Any food bank can make a call and then just drive a truck to the warehouse
storing this food and fill it to the brim for free. We do basically the same
thing with grocery stores all the time. We get entire pallets. And even when
it gets to us we still end up having a good portion of it rot for the same
damn reason it’s rotting in the warehouse. We can’t afford to move it.

~~~
didntknowyou
people always think it's easy to give food away. at household portions, yes
definitely. but when you have warehouses of them it's a logistical nightmare
and sadly food goes in the bin.

------
WalterBright
Having the government control the food supply distribution is not a very good
idea.

During the gas crisis of the 1970's, the government decided to control gas
allocations to gas stations. Stations were allocated gas based on how much
they sold last year. Naturally, as demand shifted around over time (as it
always does) this led to shortages in some areas and gluts in others, and the
supply of gas never matched the demand for it. A big part of the gas line
problem was caused by this, as people were terrified that the local gas
station would run out of their allocation.

This problem vanished overnight when Reagan, as his first act in office,
repealed all the oil & gas price controls and allocation controls.

~~~
favorited
> the supply of gas never matched the demand for it

That was more a result of the fact that, as you mentioned, it was the 1970s
gas crisis.

~~~
WalterBright
The gas crisis was a direct result of the DOE's oil and gas price controls.

~~~
orwin
In europe too? Please explain or take me to a website with a complete
explanation of why US supply control fucked up western europe gas prices, i
find the stories behind the crisis interesting.

~~~
WalterBright
I don't know what happened in Europe at the time. I wasn't there.

~~~
favorited
But you _are aware_ of the fact that there were several global energy crises
throughout the 1970s, right?

The handful of wars and revolutions that took place in the Middle East, in
which the US certainly participated to some extent, caused global oil
shortages.

~~~
WalterBright
May I point out the Gulf Wars 1 and 2 recently, with no gas lines. Saddam set
all Iraq's oil wells on fire, no gas lines. That long running war between Iraq
and Iran, again, no gas lines. Gas refineries blow up now and then in the US,
with drastic cuts in production, and no gas lines.

I remember when Reagan repealed gas allocation and price controls. The gas
lines disappeared the next day. Not the next week, or month. The next day. And
never came back.

Quite a remarkable coincidence?

~~~
favorited
Lines at gas stations weren't the crisis. The fact that there wasn't enough
supply to meet the demand was the crisis. But price controls allowed more
people to afford _any_ gasoline. It would have been 4-5x as expensive without
price controls.

Of course there were gas lines at times in the 70s – there was an artificial
limit on the price of gasoline. And the supply was repeatedly cut to almost
zero, as oil exporting countries nationalized oil companies, went through
violent revolution, or embargoed countries who militarily supported Israel.

Carter had announced a plan to phase out Nixon's price controls, and Regan
removed them after he beat Carter.

~~~
WalterBright
> It would have been 4-5x as expensive without price controls.

There's no evidence of that.

> there was an artificial limit on the price of gasoline

Such price controls lead to shortages.

> the supply was repeatedly cut to almost zero

That never happened. There was plenty of domestic production. And there were
gluts in Florida simultaneous with long lines in California. This is
explainable only by allocation controls.

> Carter had announced a plan to phase out Nixon's price controls

Yet he didn't. Reagan did, as his first act, with the stroke of a pen. Reagan
didn't phase it out. He just ended it. Prices didn't go up, either. None of
the predicted calamities happened.

The gas crisis was a fake crisis caused by government price and allocation
controls. We've never had gas lines again, despite plenty of oil shocks, such
as multiple MAJOR wars in the middle east.

~~~
favorited
> There's no evidence of that.

Aside from the fact that the price of oil was 4-5x in Europe compared to the
US.

>> there was an artificial limit on the price of gasoline

> Such price controls lead to shortages.

 __That was the whole point __. You constrain the price so everyone can afford
a little of it, rather than a small percent affording for of it.

>> the supply was repeatedly cut to almost zero

> That never happened.

OAPEC literally embargoed countries that financed Israel (hello, United
States) for months at a time. Great for Texan oil companies! Bad for everyone
else.

> Yet he didn't. Reagan did, as his first act

His first act was literally in movies. His 2nd act was keeping the Black
Panthers from arming themselves in CA. _At least_ his third act was
negotiating dirty deals with Iran. The Contras hadn't offered enough money
yet.

> such as multiple MAJOR wars in the middle east

Oh, those wars where Western armies marched in to secure oil fields? I can't
imagine why Western oil companies would do well in that market...

~~~
WalterBright
> Aside from the fact that the price of oil was 4-5x in Europe compared to the
> US.

Gas prices have always been high in Europe due to heavy taxes. And as I
remarked before, when Reagan repealed the controls the price of gas didn't go
up at all.

> to secure oil fields?

Saddam set them all on fire. It took almost a year to put them all out if I
recall correctly. Don't forget the Iran/Iraq war, which lasted 8 years and
devastated both countries, including devastating oil production.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran%E2%80%93Iraq_War#Economic...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran%E2%80%93Iraq_War#Economic_situation)

But no gas lines.

> That was the whole point.

I'm glad you understand that point. But you may not realize that what the
person received in price controlled gas was more than made up for in many
hours waiting in line to fill up. Having people pay in time waiting in line
instead of pay in dollars is a terrible way to run an economy.

Another silly thing the government did was institute odd/even days based on
your license plate. Instead of decreasing the lines, it increased the lines,
because people would top off their tanks on Tuesday, just in case, because it
was illegal for them to buy on Wednesday. Lots of people would wait for hours
in line and buy a half gallon.

Reagan really did the country a great service by getting rid of that nonsense.

------
giantg2
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22813833](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22813833)

