
Ask HN: HN censoring Facebook licencing controversy? - Mayzie
So, I was actively paying attention to a particular topic that was on the front page recently, Facebook saying no to a licence change request from the Apache Software Foundation.[1]<p>This thread had over 750 points, and 250 comments. However, all of a sudden, after 12 hours of being present, it is being marked as a duplicate of [2], which has under 150 points, not nearly as many comments (approximately 130), and no presence on the front page (or the next 10 pages for that matter).<p>Surely policy should prefer the thread with the most activity and more points? Particularly when it&#x27;s on something I really wish to pay attention to (or rather, the commentary of HN participants which I value, of which [1] was receiving a lot of), given that it seriously affects the direction of present and future projects (which, at this stage, will no longer be utilising React).<p>Cheers.<p>[1] - https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=15050841
[2] - https:&#x2F;&#x2F;news.ycombinator.com&#x2F;item?id=15050705
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sctb
A moderator marked the later discussion as a duplicate overnight, which is the
default move, but didn't notice the disparity in discussion until a little
later and restored it. We've just merged the threads as well.

If you email us at hn@ycombinator.com, we will read it and respond. Users seem
to imagine that moderation happens in dark rooms with seedy agendas but the
truth is we're a part of the community and accessible. Once we've had an
initial cup of coffee and replied to the latest censorship-accusation thread,
that is.

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walterbell
Ranking history for the two stories: one story decayed over many hours, one
story was at the top of the front page for hours. Guess which one was marked
as a [dupe]?

[http://hnrankings.info/15050841,15050705/](http://hnrankings.info/15050841,15050705/)

Is there a way for users to "vouch" that a story is not a dupe?

Edit: Ranking of this Ask HN:

[http://hnrankings.info/15053297/](http://hnrankings.info/15053297/)

Edit2 (1440 UTC): the [dupe] tag has been removed and the story is back on the
front page, rank #11.

~~~
gus_massa
You can send an email to the mods hn@ycombintor.com with a small one paragraph
explanation of the details that are different and interesting in the new
article. Sometimes they agree and remove the [dupe] label, sometimes they
disagree.

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gervase
HN actively attempts to avoid flamewars and other types of unproductive
discussions on the front page, by means of de-ranking articles that have a
high ratio of comments to points.

I don't know if this is the case here, but it's a possibility.

~~~
kristofferR
"Flamewar" has become a weasel word for interesting discussion.

It's a shame HN actively combats debate, the only discussion allowed here is
about benign stuff where mostly everyone here agrees.

~~~
williamle8300
Yup. The new HN admin's feefees are easily bruised...

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aptwebapps
What's with the title? You're not alleging censorship in the body of your post
- instead you pose it as a question about what the correct policy for marking
dupes should be.

~~~
Mayzie
Well, I guess I just can't see any reason why a mod of HN would prefer the
older thread over the more active one, and thereby removing its position from
the front page and stop any further HN discussion altogether on the topic.
Even the older thread is not present at all on the front page, or any
subsequent pages.

Anecdotal, but it certainly _feels_ like an attempt to censor the topic at
hand. Now that I think about it, I agree that my choice of title wasn't the
best to be quite confrontational, but it is what spurred my creation of this
thread.

~~~
Mayzie
Wow, I did not intend for this thread to get on the frontpage, I was merely
trying to get an answer on why, and treated HN like Reddit. I need to look
into how the ranking algorithm works more. I certainly wasn't trying to start
anything. Sorry. :-/

~~~
walterbell
You helped return the story+comments to the front page, thanks.

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loceng
They listed it as a [dupe] and then it's gone - and now is this post removed
from the main page.

The post was clearly gaining rapid traction on a Saturday morning - it could
of easily hit 2000+ upvotes.

This is disturbing. HN mods better chime in.

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philbarr
Your link [2] came 1 hour before your link [1]. Don't think there's anything
malicious going on there, they just marked the one that came later as a dupe.

~~~
wongarsu
If marking something as a dupe would transfer points to the duped thread I
would agree. I would also agree if it was marked as a dupe within a reasonable
amount of time. But marking a popular, 12 hour old thread as a dupe of a
marginally older, unpopular thread and giving it the ranking of the unpopular
thread feels wrong and doesn't respect the intent the community has expressed
by voting.

~~~
philbarr
This seems a reasonable argument, and I think the mods should adopt your idea
of transferring the points to the duped thread (and possibly the comments?)

~~~
walterbell
And the post ranking!

~~~
loceng
I assume points being transferred would cover the post ranking.

~~~
walterbell
The ranking is based on arrival rate of points, ratio of comments, total
points, and other factors including manual moderator boost or demotion.

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csomar
It is possible it was flagged by too many users. Censoring can happen from the
users themselves and I think the "flag" button should be replaced or
deactivated for users with weak Karma.

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SirLJ
Unfortunately a lot of manipulation and de facto censorship is going on HN...
what a shame...

