
Apple prepares macOS users for discontinuation of 32-bit app support - e1ven
https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2018/01/apple-prepares-macos-users-for-discontinuation-of-32-bit-app-support/
======
BugsJustFindMe
I love many things about Mac OS, but one thing that I really truly absolutely
love with a passion above all else about Microsoft Windows is that a Win32
executable compiled 17 years ago in XP will still run today on a brand new
Windows 10 machine with zero fuss. There's something to be said for not
destroying the past in the name of progress. Not everything gets rewritten for
the shiny new system framework. Sometimes people make something great and then
die.

~~~
sebazzz
Windows XP? Even Deus Ex, which is compatible with Windows 95, runs on Windows
10. Note that such compatibility is also dependend on the game developer. If
the used undocumented methods or undefined behavior it may not run on more
modern OS. Especially games like The Sims have this issue - and ironically,
some relative newer AAA games.

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thinkythought
This is a huge crap sandwich if you need to use 32 bit version of pro
apps(especially pro audio apps, in my case) to use sometimes expensive plugins
that aren't compatible with the 64 bit version of the software, or aren't
without expensive upgrades or shim libraries.

Obviously you can work around this for new projects, but it leaves you in the
position of needed to keep an old machine or VM around just for opening old
project files that would be useless without those plugins. I've talked to
multiple people in this situation.

The 64 bit only switch was easy on iOS compared to this. Yes, there's new
versions of the applications themselves available, but a whole host of plugins
for audio(and i've heard video and photo apps) are going to get left in the
dust here leaving people in the lurch.

~~~
mrmondo
Glad to see the last of the old 32bit legacy go, of course the good thing is
if someone did want to run some ancient software that’s 32bit or even 16bit
you can still spin up a VM of a legacy OS that can run those binaries.

------
TazeTSchnitzel
This will be the final death of the Carbon API, since it was never supported
for 64-bit.

~~~
Aloha
that was my first thought when I read this - I just didn't think anyone much
cared about Carbon anymore - but it will be the last gasp of the traditional
Macintosh ecosystem.

------
goalieca
About time. There was only 1 generation of Intel macs that didn’t have 64-bit
and it is not supported by latest OS anyways.

~~~
rconti
Would that have been MacBook/iMac/Mac Mini type models?

I have a first-gen Mac Pro (August 2006) and it's 64-bit.

~~~
lostgame
The lower models in the 2006 line used 32-bit processors, including MacBooks,
iMacs and Mac Minis, while more expensive models favoured the 64-bit Core 2
Duo processors.

~~~
haikuginger
That's not accurate; first generation MacBook Pros used 32-bit Core Duo
processors as well, as did almost all the early-2006 models; the exception
being the lowest-end Mac Mini, which had a single-core 32-bit Core Solo.
32-vs-64-bit was never used for price differentiation within a lineup; Intel's
64-bit chips just weren't ready in time.

Late-2006 models, including the first-generation Mac Pro, moved from the
32-bit Yonah Core Duo/Core Solo architecture to the 64-bit Conroe Core 2 Duo.

------
exikyut
I guess this is the perfect place to ask: what virtualization platforms run
32-bit OS X (since I guess that's what it was called when it was 32-bit)
Really Really Well, and how/where can I learn about how to set everything up
perfectly?

~~~
hedgehog
I think there are a few options that can boot OS X including VirtualBox (x86),
SheepShaver (PPC), and QEMU (both?). The big missing piece for a good user
experience is video acceleration. From experience using OS X in VMs for build
it's pretty miserable with the software renderer.

~~~
exikyut
Yeah.
[https://github.com/John-K/qxlGraphics](https://github.com/John-K/qxlGraphics)
was last updated 3 years ago :(

------
orionblastar
[https://github.com/BlastarIndia/OSX-
KVM/blob/master/README.m...](https://github.com/BlastarIndia/OSX-
KVM/blob/master/README.md)

It is possible to run older MacOS installs in QEMU under MacOS or Linux on a
real Mac.

So if you need 32 bit MacOS apps just run an older MacOS in an emulator.

On Windows they shut out 16 bit apps in 64 bit Windows but DOSBOX and Windows
3.1 under DOSBOX solve that via emulation.

------
graeme
Is this the end of iwork 09?

I still have some manuscripts in Pages 09, as Pages 13 never added many of the
features. I guess I'll have to look for a new workflow.

~~~
throwawayfinal
Learn word. It's still best in class.

Or LibreOffice. Depending on the type of manuscript, Dryad or celtx.

Of course, I don't know your workflow.

~~~
epistasis
Yikes, Word on macOS is certainly nowhere near best in class. It's a
completely buggy heap of trash, as soon as numbered styles, images, or tables
of contents become important. On the plus side, Word doesn't crash as much as
Excel on macOS does for me. Pages, Numbers, and Keynote are far better on
macOS than their respective MS apps in my experience.

If I had to use Word for anything except the most simple documents, I'd
probably run it in a VM.

~~~
swdunlop
Hopefully, that will change in 16.9.0 with Office for Mac sharing a codebase
with Office for Windows:

[https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2018/01/office-for-mac-
final...](https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2018/01/office-for-mac-finally-has-
real-time-collaboration-in-16-9-0-update/)

~~~
mrmondo
Been beta testing this for quite some time, if anything it’s getting worse.
The performance of outlook and word is abysmal, random crashes, high CPU usage
under no activity and the list goes on.

------
sashk
Out of all apps I have I know of four which are 32-bit:

\- 3 of them are from my (older?) Brother Printer. \- 32-bit kdb+ I use
sometime for calculations

I can live without them. :)

------
FraKtus
Too bad that Apple never made AV Fondation having the same features than
QuickTime... How can we add dynamically video codecs to macOS ? How can we
extend the support of acquisition devices ? What API can we use to do video
editing... How can we support ProRes on Windows in 64 bits ?

------
johncolanduoni
I’m curious if they’ll drop support for 32-bit processes in the kernel or just
stop shipping fat libraries.

~~~
DaiPlusPlus
I’m curious what it means for Fat Binaries in general. Methinks this will be
the first time in a long while where Apple became a true CPU monoculture on
the desktop, previously they straddled 68k, PowerPC, IA-32, and AMD64. It
gives Apple an excuse to stop using Fat executables entirely - unless they
decide to look at using ARM on laptops...

~~~
jgowdy
They aren’t dropping fat binaries. ARM desktops and laptops are on deck. They
might make sense next year or in three years or never, but Apple is going to
leave that door open. They’ve learned the lesson not to be locked to a single
CPU architecture.

------
JohnTHaller
Sadly, it appears this will kill most of the Wine projects on macOS. It's a
bummer as I've used it for a couple Windows projects to run on mac.

------
d1zzy
Good luck with completely removing support to run 32 bit applications and all
those 32 bit videogames (which is the vast majority of them). Or any other 32
bit application that won't ever receive updates.

~~~
lemoncucumber
What makes you think Apple cares? Most serious gamers would already be dual-
booting Windows if they want to game on a Mac, and most casual gamers
presumably wouldn't consider it a dealbreaker to have older games stop
working.

~~~
shmerl
_> Most serious gamers would already be dual-booting Windows if they want to
game on a Mac_

I'd say serious gamers already switched from macOS to Linux if they don't want
to use Windows to begin with. Simply because you can run DX11 games in Wine on
Linux, but not on macOS. Borking 32-bit games would only accelerate this
shift.

~~~
tpush
Gamers who use macOS probably use a console for gaming anyways.

~~~
shmerl
Try running something like VtM Bloodlines on a console. It runs perfectly in
Wine on Linux on the other hand. And I suppose it would on macOS, at least
until 32-bit support will still be there.

------
shmerl
So no more 32-bit games in Wine for macOS users? Another reason to switch to
Linux for them.

~~~
kstrauser
Asking seriously: are there any 32-bit games so new that they wouldn't run
just as well under VirtualBox?

~~~
favorited
Which is not necessarily a big deal for someone sufficiently technical, but I
know my siblings aren't going to be running a different OS in a VM to play
games.

Out of curiosity, I just checked on my Mac and I see a few 32-bit apps. Steam
(surprisingly?) is 32-bit only, as are a couple of games. The games I actually
play on my Mac have 64-bit slices.

