

1700 PS3s turned into an Air Force supercomputer - sudonim
http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2011/03/rome_labs_supercomputer_is_mad.html

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wtallis
While the article doesn't mention it, this installation and smaller-scale uses
of Linux on a PS3 are the reason behind Sony's current legal messes regarding
the PS3: Sony sells the PS3 at a loss, and tries to recoup the cost on
software sales, but people buying a PS3 to run Linux never buy enough games to
make up for Sony's initial loss.

Sony issued a firmware update to disable the ability to install a different
OS, and that led to a class-action suit against them. In the meantime, George
Hotz wrote a hack to restore the OtherOS feature, and Sony is now trying to
nail him with DMCA and other copyright violations.

Somewhat complicating the legal situation are Sony's attempts to bring piracy
in to the equation: they've argued that removing the ability to run Linux was
necessary to prevent piracy, and that Hotz's hack facilitates piracy. Neither
claim withstands much scrutiny, as piracy did not become feasible until a Sony
employee tweeted their root key, well after they removed the OtherOS feature,
and not too long after Sony told the court that Hotz's hack had caused
irreparable harm, Sony patched the hole Hotz exploited.

It has also been noted that the PS3 is _much_ cheaper than IBM's Cell blades,
and that for certain kinds of supercomputing tasks, that more than makes up
for the lack of low-latency high-bandwidth interconnects.

~~~
boyter
Sony selling at a loss was 2 years ago. I can't imagine that Sony is still
taking a loss on the hardware considering how long it has been around and with
the refresh to the new slimmer version.

I would be curious to know if they are still losing money from them but I
highly doubt this is the case anymore. Anyone actually know about this for
sure?

~~~
wtallis
The removal of PS2 compatibility, economies of scale on BluRay lasers, and
newer fabrication processes for the Cell have helped Sony a lot, but the most
recent report I can find is from iSuppli at the end of 2009, saying that the
120GB PS3 was losing just under $40 when sold for $299, so the current $299
160GB is probably profitable by now, and the models with larger hard drives
should be making a good amount of profit.

Still, it's hard to say whether the hardware profits from the past year or two
would cover Sony's share of the Cell fab upgrade costs (the Cell has been
through two process shrinks), let alone make up for the steep losses incurred
early in the product cycle. I suspect that the overall long-term profitability
of the PS3 platform still depends heavily on their video game sales.

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sliverstorm
You realize whether or not games are the main source of profit, if the console
itself is profitable now they should be thanking the Air Force. Profit is
profit, whether or not it's the kind you wanted.

~~~
wtallis
The first 336 PS3s in this installation were bought well before Sony reached
the break-even point, and the PS3 Slim model that is now profitable has never
officially allowed the use of Linux or other operating systems. (Sony didn't
want to update the OtherOS hypervisor to support the new hardware in the
Slim.)

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cvg
This part of the article blew me away:

"The Air Force is also using the Condor to process ground-based radar images
of space objects, again with extraordinary clarity. Barnell shows images of a
space shuttle orbiting Earth at 5 miles a second. Without Condor processing,
the shuttle image is a blurry black triangle. With Condor processing, it is
sharp and distinct. It’s clear that its payload doors are open."

I really had no idea that you could process radar to this clarity with off the
shelf 2006 technology.

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wtallis
That depends more on the wavelength of the radar than on the post-processing.
As far as I know, radar post-processing is far more important for trajectory
tracking than capturing a single clear image.

A Ka band radar, for example, uses centimeter wavelengths, and W band radars
are 3mm waves. I've heard that the radars used for tracking objects in orbit
can image clearly enough to allow you to estimate the capabilities of an
enemy's spy satellite based on the sizes of its antennas and cameras.

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stewartbutler
Heh. Nice thing about airforce: REALLY BIG radar.

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albahk
Did anyone else think they were referring to Rome, Italy for the first half of
this story?

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Nugem
Not really, since the Italian air force is made of only 551 air craft.

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neutronicus
Doesn't Sony sell those at a loss? Ouch.

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jacques_chester
> To custom-build a supercomputer without using commercial off-the-shelf
> PlayStation 3s would likely have cost 10 times as much, Barnell said. In
> addition, the Condor uses a fraction of the energy that comparably sized
> supercomputers use. Portions of it — say 300 machines — can be turned on
> while the rest are off, depending on a job’s needs.

I bet this was true at the time, but today you can buy blade servers with
later generations of the same processors[1].

edit: nope. Just look at the per-blade price, yowza.

[1]
[http://www-03.ibm.com/systems/bladecenter/hardware/servers/q...](http://www-03.ibm.com/systems/bladecenter/hardware/servers/qs22/)

~~~
beagle3
This wasn't true at the time, and it is definitely not true today. You could
get similar performance at comparable price (then), and much better
price/performance ratio today -- you just have to buy reasonably cheap stuff,
not IBMs or HPs.

It's possible that by going to Sony, the airforce was able to ditch the tender
requirement (no one else is supplying PS3s ...) thus making it possible for
them to get things going, rather than waiting for 2 years until all the
paperwork is done (and then getting 2 year old technology, because that's what
has been bid on and approved).

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Nugem
oh I hope SONY sues them for modding their PlayStation(S).

