
DC's I-66 express lanes debut with $34.50 toll, among the highest in U.S - jseliger
https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/trafficandcommuting/i-66-express-lanes-debut-with-3450-toll-among-the-highest-in-us/2017/12/04/ad60ce38-d900-11e7-a841-2066faf731ef_story.html?utm_term=.ea556efcbc97
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dgritsko
>Here’s how it works: From 5:30 to 9:30 a.m. eastbound and from 3 to 7 p.m.
westbound, Monday through Friday, tolls will fluctuate to maintain a minimum
average speed of 45 mph; there is no cap on tolls. Put simply, as traffic
increases the toll rises to help manage the vehicles entering the roadway. The
tolls change every six minutes.

Seems similar to the "surge pricing" that Uber uses. This actually sounds like
a pretty good system for addressing insufficient supply (capacity of the
express lanes) -- what's the point of using an express lane if it doesn't
actually move traffic along more quickly?

I don't doubt that it's unfortunate to get stuck with a high bill, but that
seems like something that will shake out quickly as awareness of how the
system works increases.

~~~
sbjustin
You may not be from the area but I used to live there and moved about 3 years
ago.

The bigger issue is that these people have paid taxes for years to pay for
these roads which already exist and are now being told they can't use the road
without paying 10x more money. A road they paid for in the first place. This
isn't a toll road built which was funded privately and is trying to make a
profit.

~~~
kijeda
Wasn't it HOV only prior to this? Isn't it adding a new capability for single
drivers to use it that didn't exist before?

~~~
sbjustin
It wasn't always HOV only. It became one lane HOV, then all lanes at certain
hours and now the fees are through the roof.

~~~
pwg
Which location? Inside the beltway it was always HOV on all lanes during the
restricted hours from the moment it (inside the beltway) opened. That was part
of the "deal" made between VA, Arlington (the VA county with the majority of
the "inside the beltway" portion), and DOT to even get the road finally built.

The "single lane HOV" part was outside the beltway.

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kcorbitt
It would make good economic sense to switch to a utilization tariff for
basically all road usage, instead of the current gas tax. The technology is
there, with license plate readers and/or RFID toll meters. In practice this
would probably look like a $5-50 monthly bill that every registered vehicle
owner would get in the mail based on the roads they had travelled on and how
congested they were. If we set aside the dystopian concern about tracking,
this would definitely lead to a more efficient use of the public roadways and
more equitable distribution of the maintenance burden.

~~~
ProfessorLayton
Or we can have those that cause damage to the roads actually pay for it,
instead of regressively taxing the poor. A semi causes 1,400x more wear on the
same stretch of road than a car! [1]

[1] [https://www.lrrb.org/pdf/201432.pdf](https://www.lrrb.org/pdf/201432.pdf)

~~~
ProAm
They also buy way more gas and as a result pay more taxes.

~~~
rtkwe
Yes but their gas usage doesn't scale as fast as the damage caused by their
increased weight.

~~~
ProAm
Source? I honestly dont know, highways never seem that damaged between cities
tbh.

~~~
rtkwe
[http://archive.gao.gov/f0302/109884.pdf](http://archive.gao.gov/f0302/109884.pdf)
page 36

"A 1962 American Association of State Highway and Transportation Officials
Road Test Report shows that concentrating large amounts of weight on a single
axle multiplies the impact of the weight exponentially. Test results show that
an automobile axle weighing 2,000 pounds would have to pass over an interstate
highway 7,550 times to have the same impact as 20,000 pounds concentrated on a
single truck axle. As a result, the impact of heavy trucks on pavement is
disproportionately greater than the weight carried."

There's a lot of similar sources out there.

~~~
ProAm
Aren't most trucks multi-axle and have distributed weight?

~~~
rtkwe
Yes, but at an average of 40000 lbs over the 5 axles they are still multiple
times heavier per axle than a regular car.

~~~
ProAm
But they also buy multiple more of gas no?

~~~
rtkwe
Estimates put it at about 6.5 mpg not enough to make up for the exponential
way that their weight increases the damage they cause.

------
dschep
Why does all coverage and outrage about this seem to ignore the fact that it
used to be HOV ONLY before, and now HOV is still free? A $35 toll is still
less than the $125 ticket you used to get if driving alone.

~~~
sbjustin
It wasn't always HOV only. It is a road, paid for by taxes which used to be
open for all. Then it became one lane HOV, then all lanes at certain hours and
now the fees are through the roof.

~~~
8ytecoder
Have you considered car-pooling or public transit options? It seems like the
goal is clear - to have fewer cars on the road.

~~~
sbjustin
The public transportation in that area is a joke. It's embarrassing that the
metro is the subway for our nation's capital.

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calvinbhai
As a long time slugline commuter (on 395), I'm not really a fan of the express
lanes.

I-66 is already bottlenecked in the morning (267 merge 66, and before crossing
the river). Not sure how can they justify charging even $100 to add more cars
to that bottleneck during the peak hours.

Problem with the way express lanes are built, even on 495 (northbound), is
that the point where the express lanes end, and merge with regular lanes,
often are not equipped to handle the onslaught of the express lane traffic
into existing lanes.

So all the rosy theories that convince the express lanes supporters are true
until the last mile of the express lane, and then it is quite the opposite.
The express lanes have a small backup of about half a mile, and the regular
lanes often backup a mile or two.

I'm hoping that, with the proposed conversion of I-66 from HOV-2 to HOV-3 due
some time on 2019 or 2020, sluglines form along 66 and 267, giving rise to the
real rideshare transport system that has benefited those along I-395 for more
than 30 years!

This two stage conversion of a HOV-2 in peak directions, to express lanes with
HOV-3 is a great tactic to ensure commuters dont get super angry at once! (and
surprising that WaPost missed it, unless they didn't ;)

~~~
nealmcb2
The point is that they set the toll price to eliminate the bottleneck, i.e. to
get the traffic flowing at 45 MPH or more. The previous bottleneck was caused
by solo drivers who just ignored the HOV2+ restriction. So you have a new
choice, to pay and get a much more efficient and predictable commute.

------
mikeash
I suspect that their dynamic tolling algorithm is broken.

I drove I-66 eastbound this morning and the road was nearly empty until about
half a mile before the river. Then it turned into stop-and-go traffic. No
surprise, since the HOT portion ends and everyone wants to get across the
bridge into DC, which dumps everyone out into slow local streets.

It seems like they're trying desperately to limit congestion at this very last
part, when it's completely beyond their power anyway. They'll probably have to
give up trying to maintain their speed guarantees for the last little bit.

~~~
calvinbhai
Thats true irrespective of 66 having the express lanes feature/bug. Without
fixing the traffic crossing the bridge, everything else feels like a waste of
opportunity/money.

~~~
mikeash
Right, I don't mean that the bridge congestion is somehow the fault of this
scheme, just that it looks like the dynamic tolling algorithm is exhibiting
pathological behavior due to circumstances beyond its control.

------
dsp1234
FTA:

"Solo drivers, who before were barred from I-66 during rush hour, can use the
lanes if they pay. That includes drivers of hybrid vehicles, which are no
longer exempt. Motorcycles and vehicles carrying two or more people have free
use of the lanes."

This is a _new_ toll for allowing non-HOV drivers to use the HOV express lane.

~~~
mikeash
Nitpick: it's not an express lane, it's the entire roadway for this section.
Non-HOV drivers have to either pay or take a completely different route. HOV
drivers still get to use it for free, of course.

~~~
sbjustin
Exactly, which in turn burdens all the other roadways such as 29 and 50.

~~~
mikeash
They were already burdened by non-HOV traffic. They might get it a little more
during the expanded hours, but those could have been changed regardless. For
most people, this is adding an option, not subtracting one. I don't get the
outrage.

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niftich
This roadway is known as "I-66 Inside the Beltway". It was built in 1982 [1],
and runs from I-495 in Dunn Loring/Merrifield in the west to the Theodore
Roosevelt Memorial Bridge in the east, and except for short stretches, is
generally two normal lanes wide in both directions.

Prior to this most recent announcement, at directional peak times, only HOV-2
vehicles (and special exceptions) were allowed [2]. Similarly, for a few
additional hours on either side of the peak time, the corresponding shoulder
lane is open for some sections as an additional travel lane.

Now, during peak times, all cars need an E-ZPass-compatible transponder of
some sort to enter [3][4]. Outside of peak times, anyone can enter.

If you're HOV-2 and wish to avoid paying a toll, you need a switchable
'E-ZPass Flex', which has a physical switch on it to assert that you're
currently HOV. It's largely enforced by the honor system and vigorous police
presence. When it gets scanned and asserts that you're HOV, there is no
assessed toll and the road is free. If your Flex is set to non-HOV, you get
charged the current toll.

If you have a regular, non-switchable E-ZPass transponder, you get assessed
the toll, regardless of your vehicle's actual HOV status.

[1]
[http://www.dcroads.net/roads/I-66_VA/](http://www.dcroads.net/roads/I-66_VA/)
[2]
[https://web.archive.org/web/20171018010139/http://www.virgin...](https://web.archive.org/web/20171018010139/http://www.virginiadot.org/travel/hov-
novasched.asp) [3] [http://www.virginiadot.org/travel/hov-
novasched.asp#I-66HOV-...](http://www.virginiadot.org/travel/hov-
novasched.asp#I-66HOV-2TwoorMorePeople)

------
mnm1
At $690 every four weeks for just _one way_ , I simply don't see how this
isn't a land grab of infrastructure for the exclusive use of the rich. At
those rates even well paid engineers can't afford the trip. If the round trip
cost is the same, we're talking $1380 every four weeks. That's more than rent
in most places. At those prices, you could literally hire someone to sit in
the car with you for minimum wage and get by cheaper. Hell, for $70 a day, you
can have this person wait outside your work for 8 hours a day and you'd still
be better off than paying the toll ($60 for 8 hours at $7.50). DC already has
a long tradition of "slugs" so maybe this could be the next evolution: slugs
for hire. In the desperate society that infrastructure like this creates, that
could be a highly sought after job.

~~~
l1ambda
"For the rich" is simplistic thinking. $34.50 is the marginal cost
([https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marginal_cost);](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marginal_cost\);)
in other words, the price paid at the time the decision to use the lane is
made. Consider the situation of person who has an early meeting he needs to
get to, or a job interview on some particular day that he wants to arrive at
on-time. Or a person who needs to get their kid to a tournament on a
particular day. Studies show that people of all incomes prefer this sort of
thing for these situations (in particular, and perhaps surprising to some,
lower income people with multiple jobs who need to get from one to the other
on-time), because sometimes you'd rather pay and get something of a guaranteed
travel time that risk arriving late. Also, you may choose to only use the lane
in the mornings or afternoons, or certain days of the week, etc.

------
sbjustin
The thing that frustrates me the most about what they're doing in the area is
that their public transportation is still terrible.

Try taking the Metro from Vienna to Springfield. You have to get almost
entirely into DC, then change lines and come back out. Compare to other
systems which are much more efficient.

I believe there would be significant less backlash if the Metro wasn't awful
and more people were able to use it reliably without ridiculous wait times.

FWIW, I lived there and hated the metro and seldom used it. The tube in London
on the other hand - I wouldn't buy a car if I lived there.

~~~
TulliusCicero
And the metro would probably be non-awful if the area wasn't split up into a
bunch of different governments that often don't want to cooperate.

Transportation and housing authorities should be at the metro area level.
Lower than that just results in dysfunction.

------
Tyrek
DC's problem, as always, is one of congestion and access. If we sidestep the
tax burden ('we paid for it therefore we should be able to use it without
charge') issue, there's a fairly typical large-city congestion problem, which
is exacerbated by the lack of affordable housing in the immediate area.

The DMV area as a whole, especially the immediately DC-adjacent regions of
Maryland and Virginia, is one of the wealthiest areas in the country. There
are people commuting into DC from West Virginia(!). There's a fair argument
for a congestion charge, as has been implemented in major cities (London and
Singapore to name a couple), but the question then is one of access - the
Metro (subway) system is good for America, but absolutely abysmal for the
population density that it needs to serve. It doesn't help that the population
is fairly spread out once you get further out as well.

~~~
TulliusCicero
It's a chicken and egg problem. Americans hold driving in religious devotion,
and won't allocate serious resources to non-car modes until they're forced to.

I guarantee you those suburbs of DC are full of people hostile to transit. The
only way they'll support their own areas contributing and going along with a
regional transit plan is if they feel like they have no choice.

------
foxyv
As a bus rider, I love the toll lanes. They can set it to $1000 for all I care
at this point. It makes my ride to work so much faster. It's just too bad that
public transit is so fragmented and damaged in California. Anything that
allows me not to drive makes the state 10x more livable.

------
adrianmonk
The article mentions price gouging. Usually in that debate, the advantage is
it makes efficient use of resources but the disadvantage is it strongly favors
rich people.

So I have a partially serious idea: make the toll a function of how expensive
your car is. The government is going to record your license plate anyway for
electronic tolling purposes, so it can look up the car year, make, and model
and from there estimate its value.

The idea being that this probably gives a better signal of who needs to use
the toll lane. To a person driving an $80,000 car, a $5 toll is not nearly as
big of a sacrifice as it is for someone driving a beater.

Of course, this would be pretty difficult politically, but in principle it's
just a progressive tax.

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m-watson
Tedious comment, I know, but with the real title being "I-66 express lanes
debut with $34.50 toll, among the highest in U.S." And it not being DC's I-66,
this title is misleading. If the idea of DC being in the title is that
important, use DC Area I-66, but really, it is a Virginia thing happening
here, not DC.

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harmlessposter
Good. Every highway in the United States needs to be tolled in this manner.

------
distantsounds
And here we see how DC's politicians figured out how to profit from removing
Net Neutrality protections.

~~~
mikeash
Virginia politicians are the ones behind this project.

~~~
distantsounds
Because DC politicians definitely don't drive on those highways.

~~~
mikeash
Whether or not they drive on it is irrelevant. The project is handled by the
Virginia state government, not anybody in DC.

~~~
distantsounds
you're completely missing the relationship. DC politicians drive on roads that
are 'fast lanes' by 'paying more' for preferential treatment. sigh.

~~~
mikeash
You said they were profiting, now they’re paying more?

Are you sure you didn’t just misunderstand which jurisdictions were involved
here?

