

Universities will be 'irrelevant' by 2020, Brigham Young professor says - ca98am79
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/705298649/Universities-will-be-irrelevant.html

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evgen
Science labs will all be virtual? Yeah, right. Sometimes you need to get your
hands dirty and reading about it or watching it does not provide the same
experience. This guy seems to be really in-love with computer-mediated
education, but seems to have a big blind spot regarding the experiences it
will never provide and the weaknesses inherent in the medium.

The whole process of higher-education will change significantly in the next
ten years, but not so much that the university will disappear, become
irrelevant, or even be unrecognizable to anyone familiar with its current
form. File this one under "futurist with a book or contracting gigs to
sell..."

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heed
I know the comments below illuminate some good examples, but what experiences
specifically do you feel can never be replaced by a virtual environment?

I agree that it is not quite there yet, but with an increase in internet
speeds and some fancy videoconferencing it might not be that far off...

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tedunangst
The experience of plugging in a diode backwards vs a popup that says "pop".
When getting it wrong means you can't get it right (without replacing
components) you pay more attention to what you're doing.

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ilamont
People had similar ideas when television came out. Televised lectures were an
early part of the American public television movement and Open University in
the UK. Yet they never managed to make much of a dent in the established way
of educating people, mainly because interaction and the process of dialogue
does not easily carry over to the electronic realm.

The same can be said for many online education now -- asynchronous
communications with professors and classmates using email and discussion
boards is hardly a substitute for being able to raise your hand to ask
questions or start debates on the fly.

I've seen some interesting experiments in real-time online class sessions
using virtual worlds and other tools, but the technology still needs a lot of
work to make it easier for educators and students to use.

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evgen
Very true. Another point that often gets ignored by those who think online
education will replace standard lectures and discussions is the fact that a
decent lecturer can get a lot of feedback just by watching the non-verbal
responses to the progress of the lecture. It is not hard to notice when
everyone is bored, when most of the class has that universal puzzled look that
lets the prof know that she needs to go back and re-explain the last point,
etc. None of this comes through the real-time virtual channel and until this
problem is solved the online course will be a pale substitute for the real
thing.

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noelchurchill
Going to a more prestigious and expensive institution isn't just about the
diploma anyway. It's a 4 year long networking event where you build
relationships with people that will help you for the rest of your life. That's
something that can't be replaced by virtual classrooms and listening to course
material on your ipod.

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enra
Universities don't have monopoly on networking. Yes it's easy to network while
you're all students but it's also quite random. Probably only a handful people
of those early networks will be any use for you since people tend to go
different ways.

It's actually more effective to find your own area and network there.

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IsaacL
It's not just the networking; it's the status you get from going to such an
institution, especially if it's 'elite'. I guessing there are relatively few
18-year-olds who consider the networking potential of university, wheras lots
probably go as it's the thing they're expected to do. I'm a student now, and a
lot of my friends don't seem to have learning as their main priority, in fact
I'm not sure what their priority is. Thus, even if this guy's ideas do provide
a better learning experience, it's not like people will abandon uni for them.

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ori_b
Sorry, no. Even if you have courses where no labs are required, human
interaction and the high bandwidth of face-to-face communication with
dedicated teachers is invaluable.

90% of the value of universities is not in the lectures - I can mostly replace
lectures with textbooks already. It's in the ability to ask questions, the
hands-on experience I get, and the immersion in [and competition with] a group
of people with similar interests and abilities.

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amjith
"But BYU, he notes, might be a special case. Students will likely still flock
there for the two extra benefits the school offers: a religious education and
the chance to meet and marry an LDS Church member."

Are you kidding me, I thought that's why there are churches in this country.

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anamax
> Are you kidding me, I thought that's why there are churches in this country.

You already know the folks in your own church.

Think of it as cross-pollination.

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edave
Interesting, but I find it odd that he discounts how universities will change
and adapt. Will the university of today be irrelevant in 10 years? Absolutely.
But most universities are successful because they've adapted several times in
the past.

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TrevorJ
Universities will have to change, certainly, in order to respond to the ways
students are learning but there is still a need for some sort of
institutionalized vetting process (Read: diploma) for many types of careers.
Providing an employer a list of the lectures you listened to on youtube isn't
going to cut it if you are going into the medical field or if you want to
design bridges or airplanes.

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sfphotoarts
My university has existed for nearly 500 years, and I seriously doubt that
this new interwebs thing will change the world so much that universities will
become irrelevant. I cry Hogwash!

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ensignavenger
Wiley is one of the advisers to the University of the People project.

Interesting note, BYU is operated by the LDS Church, who also operates
Institutes of Religion with facilities near many colleges throughout the
world, and they are making tremendous investments in communications technology
and distance learning.

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haseman
This strikes me as a 64k will be enough for everyone kind of statement...

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haseman
Unless another institution springs up allowing rich kids to get drunk before
they're 21, I suspect the University isn't going anywhere.

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Scriptor
Right, because _everyone_ who goes to college is rich and primarily motivated
by alcohol, since as everyone knows most alcohol consumption for teens starts
in college.

University gives you the chance to have more or less complete control of your
time and at least learn to be responsible for yourself, before you get a job
and learn to be responsible for colleagues as well.

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haseman
Right, because everyone is serious all the time.

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boryas
Judging by how many lectures people skip with the justification that "the
notes are online" it seems like some parts of the current university set up
could possibly change with things like online video lectures. On the other
hand, a good professor will speed up, slow down, answer questions, etc.. which
will surely be difficult to bring to an online format.

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azharcs
Can someone point me out to the video "What If." mentioned in the Article. I
tried searching in Youtube but just couldn't find it.

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ca98am79
I think this is it:
[http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2855786550703993653...](http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2855786550703993653&hl=en)

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azharcs
Thanks a lot. :) This video made my day.

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johnnybgoode
While I'd be glad to see this happen, he's focusing on the wrong thing. As I
said in another thread (<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=642828>), even if
he's right about all of the new technologies, it might not be enough.

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keltecp11
What about Socializing? Or are we going to have the Matrix by 2020... or maybe
we won't even be around given 2012 is the end...right?

