
Uber loses ground in US as rival Lyft accelerates - gleglegle
https://www.ft.com/content/b4fb76a6-52dd-11e7-bfb8-997009366969
======
sergers
The company I work for, only has Lyft as approved service for travel and
expenses.

Everyone used Uber mostly, and then they announced Lyft is the only approved
one. Not sure why that decision was specifically made when majority were
expensing Uber trips

~~~
hammock
Finance (or maybe HR if it's an after-hours perk or something) gets
incentives/kickbacks? Can anyone that works in this area confirm?

~~~
lstyls
That's called commercial bribery and it's against the law in most states,
including California. Enforcement is pretty slack in the US (surprise
surprise) but given that it involves employees making personal profit at the
expense of employers companies generally would not tolerate this sort of
behavior.

~~~
lotsofpulp
Do airline miles, hotel points, and car rental loyalty rewards count, and
credit card rewards count?

Whoever is earning the rewards can earn quite a bit by choosing a higher
priced options since it earns them more.

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myth_buster
If you could see only one chart then I would say this is the one [0]. I was
under the impression that Lyft & Uber were on quite even footing.

> The reports of Uber's impending death are greatly exaggerated. - Mark Twain

[0]
[https://archive.fo/Q0gkJ/595ad70474d05aa1f7b15600fe5ccec2f25...](https://archive.fo/Q0gkJ/595ad70474d05aa1f7b15600fe5ccec2f257e9b6.png)

~~~
SilasX
But that's just the aggregate US figure, right? Individual cities, especially
"bellwether" ones, might show Lyft past the tipping point.

~~~
twelve40
No, it's not past the tipping point, the article shows graphs with 60-80% for
NY, SF and Boston.

~~~
BoiledCabbage
It's interesting, while I don't live in one of those cities, I've been meaning
to drop Uber over all of their apparent complete lack of ethics. I hadn't done
so yet, but this article has reminded me of it and I'm installing Lyft now.

As much as we hate to think it, both awareness and social proof in decision
making matter. And while I wouldn't have admitted it, part of it was thinking
in the back of my head that quitting wouldn't make a difference. Seeing the
graph showing the real impact of the #quituber campaign was both surprising
and to be perfectly honest a bit motivating to me to keep to my word to use
Lyft. Maybe not a full quit, but at least a 50/50.

------
bspn
I don't know if it's because I've been under a rock, but I noticed Uber
advertising on TV for the first time this weekend with a "everyone needs a
side-hustle" tagline. I noticed it because it's always a little jarring when
SV technology companies turn to traditional media advertising (I still
remember the Google SB ad), but I took it as a sign that Uber's organic driver
growth has taken a real hit recently and they're now having to actively work
to attract drivers.

~~~
ribosometronome
Uber has been doing a bunch of product placement before this. They've had some
relatively forced mentions on shows like SNL.

------
ars
I know plenty of people who say "I'm getting an Uber", while using the Lyft
app.

So Uber has definitely won in that department - all they have to do is not
screw it up (any worse than they already did).

People will forget, and over time that name recognition will give them back
the market share.

~~~
crisdux
There are plenty of examples of trademarks that became generic terms for
product or services where the initial trademark owner did not dominate in that
market very long. Heck I could argue a genericized trademark may be a bad
thing and signify the lack of uniqueness in the service Uber provides if all
other competitors are described using the same term.

~~~
largehotcoffee
>There are plenty of examples

Name five?

~~~
lpolovets
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_generic_and_genericize...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_generic_and_genericized_trademarks)

Aspirin, cellophane, kleenex, thermos, band-aid, crock pot, jacuzzi,
photoshop, etc.

~~~
georgyo
Shocking to me is that Tylenol is missing from that page. You hardly ever hear
it called acetaminophen, even in hospitals.

Edit: Even the main Tylenol page links is ambiguous:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tylenol](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tylenol)

It's a wiki, so I'll guess I'll add it.

~~~
keithnz
I think it's just a US thing, we (NZ) refer to it as paracetamol or the
equivalent brand name "Panadol", the others are more globally used.

~~~
SOLAR_FIELDS
I wish it was more clear. There are three main widely available OTC
medications that broadly cover main categories such as pain reliever, fever
reducer, etc:

Ibuprofen (known colloquially more commonly as Motrin or Advil in the US)

Acetaminophen (also known by chemical name paracetemol outside of the US and
brand name Tylenol in US)

Acetylsalicylic acid (also known as Aspirin, was previously a trademark but
now a generic name)

I always try to avoid using the brand names in favor of the actual chemical
names to dodge ambiguity and confusion (there are other brand names for
acetaminophen, acetylsalicylic acid, and ibuprofen over the ones I have listed
even in the US), but even then in the case of acetaminophen it cannot be
avoided. Further compounding (pun intended?) difficulty is trying to pronounce
acetylsalicylic acid to the layman instead of just saying "Aspirin". In the US
at least, you can get away with saying ibuprofen vs "Motrin" and acetaminophen
vs "Tylenol", but the Aspirin problem is a bit more of a difficult hurdle to
overcome in terms of layman's communication.

Slightly tangentially, when referring to airports I even have the same
problem. I always try to go by IATA airport code, but those apparently have
ambiguities as well: AUS is the IATA airport code for Austin-Bergstrom, but in
ICAO terms it's actually known as KAUS, presumably to avoid conflict with
other airports outside the US who might also answer to the callsign "AUS"

------
laretluval
I'm looking forward to the tell-all about Lyft's PR black ops against Uber.

~~~
RSZC
I've got a buddy who works for (possibly one of multiple?) Lyft's PR firm, and
has worked on that account.

You don't need any sort of 'black ops' when your competitor is busy generating
their own bad headlines. Instead you just call up your journalist connections
every time Uber does something stupid to make sure they saw it.

~~~
sillysaurus3
I don't know. It's very convenient that Lyft is seen as the do-no-wrong Uber
alternative.

Once the dust settles, it will be interesting to see whether Lyft is as
innocent as everyone presumes.

~~~
woodandsteel
Given how Uber operates, if Lyft is doing anything wrong, I would expect Uber
would already be publicizing it, and indeed be trying to make it look a good
deal worse than it really is.

------
dannylandau
Based on the chart below, Uber still owns 80% of the market. So, still in a
very dominant position.

I wonder why Gett is not figured in there.

[https://www.ft.com/__origami/service/image/v2/images/raw/htt...](https://www.ft.com/__origami/service/image/v2/images/raw/http%3A%2F%2Fcom.ft.imagepublish.prod-
us.s3.amazonaws.com%2F50d74d98-52d9-11e7-bfb8-997009366969?source=next&fit=scale-
down&width=600)

~~~
joatmon-snoo
Gett doesn't exist out of NY. Lyft does.

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werber
Anecdotal, but Uber has a social stigma with a lot of my left-er friends.

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chairmanwow
This article really fails to make a compelling case for Lyft other than the
switches coming from the #DeleteUber campaign. While I agree these market
share grabs from the underdog are huge, I feel like the author is overstepping
the wait of the data. Relying really heavily on narrative.

------
kennydude
Would love Lyft over in the UK. Uber is the only taxi company (they are a taxi
company if they like it or not) with an app which doesn't crash on launch

------
ravenstine
HN link is still paywalled for me, so here's the archived version of it that's
not paywalled: [https://archive.fo/Q0gkJ](https://archive.fo/Q0gkJ)

------
pdeva1
paywalled...

~~~
tyingq
The web link at the top of HN works, but the chart in the article tells most
of the story:
[https://www.ft.com/__origami/service/image/v2/images/raw/htt...](https://www.ft.com/__origami/service/image/v2/images/raw/http%3A%2F%2Fcom.ft.imagepublish.prod-
us.s3.amazonaws.com%2F50d74d98-52d9-11e7-bfb8-997009366969?source=next&fit=scale-
down&width=600)

~~~
swampthinker
I'm actually shocked that #deleteuber had that large of an impact. Maybe this
is the cynic inside me, but I feel like social media campaigns like those
didn't have much impact. Guess I was wrong.

~~~
erdle
at the end of the day it's just an app... there is no Uber infrastructure such
as a bus stop... very few real assets... and not a ton of IP if every car
company, Google, and others are competing.

they had a great brand and the only thing they had to do was not fuck it up
before they reached the next level. and instead they spent most of their cash
on fighting rivals, built a culture that is eroding the brand and behind on
the next thing in transportation.

~~~
valuearb
Getting your app on someones phone is a substantial, lasting competitive
advantage. Getting them to use it regularly is even more of one.

------
cavisne
"Lyft, which completed a $600m fundraising in April, has expanded into 150 new
cities this year " seems like this would skew the numbers a bit. Uber is
already everywhere it needs to be in the US. Lyft is irrelevant until they
prove they can compete internationally imo, they are way behind uber here

~~~
bsder
> Lyft is irrelevant until they prove they can compete internationally imo,
> they are way behind uber here

Why should they compete internationally?

From what I can see, international competition is wildly unprofitable, subject
to the whims and vicissitudes of local politicians, and subject to local
competition who understand their market far better than any foreign firm.

~~~
aianus
International travel is a major use case for these apps. When I'm traveling I
don't have my car with me and my usage of Uber skyrockets.

------
throwaway-1209
100% fake news. There's no way they actually have any ride data from either
company to back up this claim. In fact there's another bit of equally fake
news posted to HN right now that says that recent events have failed to put a
dent into Uber marketshare. "Journalists" should stop making shit up, and
instead stick to reporting facts.

~~~
ojbyrne
"...according to data from Second Measure, a research firm that uses
anonymised credit card data"

Perhaps not 100% accurate, but not 100% fake either.

~~~
throwaway-1209
Second Measure relies on undisclosed data sources of unknown accuracy. So this
is very much like those reports from "anonymous sources familiar with Comey's
thinking" (an actual quote).

