
Ask HN: Good Career Alternatives for 50+ - Gustomaximus
I&#x27;m in my 30&#x27;s doing marketing and am starting to feel like the old man of the teams I work with. I look around and there is hardly anyone over 40 and no-one 50+ unless they hit executive level. The industry is about new technology and working long hours. While there are exceptions, generally it doesn&#x27;t seem a good career to age in and I figure I have ~10 years...<p>..so as someone that likes to plan ahead. What do you think are good career options for the 50+? I&#x27;ve been trying to think of jobs were age is an advantage. The best I can think of is financial planning. Most people visit their planner when retirement is on their mind, so you&#x27;ll likely be meeting people of a similar group and mindset. Whereas in this industry being 21 and enthusiastic wont go far with many older people.<p>What does HN think are good options?
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Jean-Philipe
Do your own company. Hire people. Do projects for clients. I did this and I'm
pretty happy. Most projects have been interesting. Some clients have been
difficult, some are great and with those we stick. The team is happy. We hire
young and old; finally hiring without discrimination (or so I hope) and happy
about the results. Now we're in a stage where we can be picky about which
projects to accept. We start having some time for our own ideas as well.

Just expect a very tough first year :-)

~~~
bogomipz
Can I ask your background and what type of company you started? Were you able
to leverage you skill set for your company or did you just completely pivot?

~~~
Jean-Philipe
My background is computer science and programming. I usually take on the CTO
or lead tech position - but very hands-on and as little managing as necessary.
First thing I did after university was joining two guys with fitanalytics.com,
a size recommendation platform for clothing, doing well meanwhile. I was very
inexperienced when we started :-) later I teamed up with a former colleague to
start a software-boutique. Now we're ten people.

~~~
bogomipz
That sounds interesting, good for you taking the leap. Thanks for sharing.

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ben_pr
One of the best hires I ever had was someone that was 50+ about 10+ years ago.
He didn't have a technical background but wanted to be a programmer. It was a
big risk but in two years time he became my top developer out performing those
with 10+ years more experience. Now I primarily look to hire those with a few
white hairs as they are much more stable and cause a lot less personal issues
than those right out of school. If I was hiring and you really wanted to be a
programmer I would certainly give you a shot at it. If you want to be in
technology I don't see anything stopping you.

~~~
overcast
So I shouldn't dye my hair before running the interview gauntlet?

~~~
maxxxxx
Shave your head instead.

~~~
overcast
Blasphemy. My locks are impressively full.

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DrNuke
Start cultivating your own public image in the internet circuit of your field
/ industry and aim at becoming an internationally recognised expert in say
5-10 years. That way, your 50+ career might be made of a number of consulting
opportunities and advisory roles. I'm in my early 40s and in the process of
converting my three static websites for three different industries into blogs,
one at time within this year.

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ebbv
I'll give you my perspective as I'm nearing 40; I think there's no problem
being an older developer as long as you stay up on current technologies and
trends so that you can talk to your teammates and potential employers in their
own language. If you interview and you constantly sound dated or have to ask
for explanations on terms you don't recognize that will be an issue.

I honestly am the best developer I've ever been. I am constantly learning new
stuff and usually know more new frameworks and languages than young developers
I interview. I don't rest on my laurels. I think that's key.

Marketing I agree with you is probably harder, depending on the industry
you're marketing for and the company you're working for. Ultimately, though
there are objective aspects to marketing (e.g. running tests and seeing what
works) but if you are having to be a source of ideas, as we get older it may
be harder for us to come up with marketing and product ideas that truly
interest a younger generation. So if you really enjoy marketing and want to
stay in it, you may want to move to a company who is targeting people in your
age group. I think that's true for anyone, though. A 20 year old may not know
how to market to 40 years olds as well as a 40 year old.

If you want to get out of marketing and are looking for other career choices
that you can age gracefully in, I think the firs thing is to ask yourself what
you would enjoy doing and then from that list pick what you think you'll have
the opportunity to age gracefully.

~~~
randcraw
If the goal is to stay in marketing yet develop deeper skills, why not move
toward analytics -- esp. data mining? There has to be a huge potential market
for marketing analysts who understand marketing AND analytic metrics.

All the marketing people I know at large companies have little or no knowledge
of how metrics are acquired or whether they're accurate/precise. If someone
like the OP added skills in data mining and probability distributions,
especially if they could conduct experiments on databases to shape marketing
campaigns, they'd be worlds ahead of a) pure marketers or b) pure data miners.

In general, neither expert (a or b) knows enough to properly propose and
explore new marketing ideas. Someone who can 1) walk the analytic walk, yet 2)
speak the language of business and 3) understand consumer psychology and sales
priorities, ought to be an essential contributor indefinitely in a business
niche that should outlast us all.

------
replicatorblog
I'm in a similar boat, but I don't think you need to give up marketing. Sure
you may not be leading creative campaigns for Beats, but there are decent
paths to follow:

\+ Work for less cool companies: If you've worked for some impressive tech
companies, there are plenty of less hip companies that would like to learn how
"the big guys do it."

\+ Build up superb expertise in a specific niche: I've met many more senior
folks that survive just by building an maintaining a specific niche. Often
this relates to some arcane domain knowledge.

\+ Go into consulting: Building off the previous bullet, if you can develop a
niche, e.g. Healthcare + tech marketing, often startups will pay you a premium
for the "greybeard" advice.

I think the key thing is to maintain your technical skills. Sure, there will
be specific things like SnapChat that just befuddle "olds," but those skills
are a fairly small part of the mix. Good luck and let me know if you come
across any other good ideas.

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twoquestions
Work for a big/established/old company, where your experience will not count
against you. I'm 30, and at my office everyone calls me 'kid'.

~~~
callinyouin
> I'm 30, and at my office everyone calls me 'kid'.

Hey, same here. Well, nobody actually calls me that but I'm the youngest at 30
on my team, working for a company that has a pretty large percentage of
employees that have been here for 20, even 30+ years. I can't remember the
exact number but I want to say that something like 40% have been here for 10+
years. We're a medium size manufacturing company, so that's a lot of people.
It really is in stark contrast to what you tend to hear about the bay area.

~~~
amyjess
I once worked at a very small defense contractor. The company was about 12
people plus the owner.

I joined when I was 30, and I was the third-youngest employee. The second-
youngest was born in the same month of the same year as me, and I never got to
really interact with the youngest. Everyone else was in their 30s to 50s.
Unfortunately, I (along with a third of the company) got laid off a year and a
quarter in, but working there was an interesting experience. I had so many
interesting conversations with my coworkers.

And the owner of that company is a university professor (full professor, not
an associate) with two PhDs and a very impressive academic background.

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henrik_w
I turned 50 last year. I am still working as a developer, and I am still
loving it. As long as you stay reasonably up to date with the shifting
technology I think there will always be opportunities. For example, I started
coding in a proprietary language (PLEX from Ericsson), switched to C++, then
Java, now Python with a bit of ClojureScript. I get contacted by recruiters at
least once a month (mostly on LinkedIn) about other job opportunities, so
there is definitely strong demand.

A lot of people make the mistake of staying too long in the same place, and
gradually getting less and less "hireable". It is easy to just stay doing the
same thing, but you are hurting your future chances of finding a job if you
have to.

Also, becoming a manager seems worse to me from an employability perspective.
There is always a greater need for developers than for managers.

I also wrote about why developer is a good career here (applies to older
people as well): [https://henrikwarne.com/2014/12/08/5-reasons-why-software-
de...](https://henrikwarne.com/2014/12/08/5-reasons-why-software-developer-is-
a-great-career-choice/)

------
netman21
Industry analyst is a great role for 50+. I joined Gartner at 40 and it felt
like the beginning of my career. I am 57 now.

The big analyst firms like to hire people with expertise and a thirst for
knowledge. The job requires speaking and writing skills as well as expertise.
But I can attest that you can pick those up along the way.

I am writing a book on how to succeed as an analyst. Short version: pick a
space (has to have vendors in it), write about it, speak about it, be the
expert.

~~~
mooneater
I want this book! Can I get on a list to be notified?

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xyzzy4
Work for any large, globalized corporation, or company that's been around for
a while. There are tons of middle aged folk all over the place. Startups (or
companies that were recently startups) tend to have much younger employees.

~~~
maxxxxx
I can confirm that.

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AnimalMuppet
I hit 55 next month. I'm a software engineer. I'm in embedded systems, though,
not Web programming. Experience seems to be more valued in embedded systems;
perhaps there's more to learn there than there is in Web programming.

If you're doing marketing, embedded systems programming may not be the answer
you're looking for - you might want something that's more like marketing. Look
around, though, for the marketing area that requires and values experience. (I
am guessing in ignorance, but maybe account manager at an ad firm?)

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crawdog
My best advice: 1\. Never stop learning. This doesn't include the workplace.
If you depend on your job to train you, you will quickly fall behind. Find new
and exciting technologies and think - Would I want to work on this in the
future?

2\. Find roles that are outside your comfort zone. If you're a developer, try
sales engineering - a great mix of technology, sales and public presenting. At
the very least get a role that requires presentation skills (such as
consulting)

3\. Network, Network, Network... If you don't go out on a limb to start
something new, maybe your friends will. This will open up new opportunities.
As you grow in your career your professional network is what will open up
opportunities for you. Whether you start your own thing, or get poached to
work on new projects it will depend on who you meet and your personal
interactions with them. IF you don't interact with your peers you'll find
yourself stuck in the same role with few options to change.

4\. As an employee you are important, but not as important as the business as
a whole. So you possibly will find yourself in a position where you need to
change or leave. Embrace this opportunity to grow.

Go broad, then specialize!

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randcraw
1) Subject matter expert. If you know a business/customer domain well, you're
a decade ahead of fresh college grads. Many folks who have run their own
businesses have invaluable insight into the pragmatics of staying alive in
ways that a MBA just don't teach. This is especially true in contracting (e.g.
engineering serices or military procurement). Knowing regulatory hurdles and
how to navigate them is invaluable in domains where products/ services are
constrained by formal processes (GLP, GMP, FDA, etc).

2) Rainmaker - writer of proposals and attractor of funding for new projects.
This is an acquired skill (through experience of contract writing, practice in
the domain, past business contacts, and knowledge of feasible business
margins). In businesses where contracts are the life blood, this role is
simply the most important person(s) in the shop. And this work is almost
_never_ done by folks with less than a ~decade of experience.

------
MK999
Approaching 40 and starting to think the secret is smart people buy real
estate with the banks money and pay it back with renters, and the rest of us
work for a living.

~~~
xyzzy4
You can skip the hassle and buy leveraged index funds. The risks & returns are
similar.

~~~
mdekkers
you may have missed out on "the banks money" part

~~~
xyzzy4
Leveraged index funds borrow money from banks and invest it. For example if
you invest $100k in a 3x fund, it will borrow an additional $200k (from banks)
and invest it. Each day it will be rebalanced to maintain the 3x leverage.

~~~
nitrogen
Who repays the loan if the index crashes?

~~~
user5994461
From what I recall of the "leveraged" financial products I've seen. The magic
is that you get leverage*returns if it goes up... but you lose ALL your money
if it goes down.

I'm not saying that's how these index funds work, I don't know. Just beware of
anything leveraged.

------
rezashirazian
Although it seems like there are endless start ups with 22 year old CEOs and
executive, it's still easier to do business as a C level executive if you're a
bit older.

Of course it's somewhat useless to tell you just become a C level executive.
But building on top of what was already suggested, I think if you start your
own company, you'd have better chance of closing deals, making connections or
have people trust you because of your age.

With age comes trusts and experience, and you can use that your benefit.

You may have a harder time convincing venture capitalists to invest in your
company, I mean at 50 years, 80 hour work weeks and ramen noodle diets are not
viable options. But if you set up a consulting shop you'd probably close
contracts much quicker, expand your network much easier and succeed much
faster than a typical 22 year old. It's one thing to build an app and get all
kids to download it, it's another to be able to sit down with a client and
understand their needs and make them trust you with their money.

Experience and trust, use it your advantage.

------
carsongross
Option 1: Play the managerial game. It's soul crushing and the farther you get
up the more concentrated sociopathy you will encounter, but it is the lowest
risk/highest expected value path.

Option 2: Startup. You will probably fail and this has far more to do with
factors beyond your control than anything else, but you have a shot at being
your own boss on your own term. Very low expected value, tons of stress, but
potentially the best outcome.

Option 3: Academia. Go back and get a PhD in something you love and teach. You
will probably be an instructor, as tenured positions are rare and highly
competitive. There is also a lot of nepotism and favoritism in the more
subjective fields. Low reward (financially) but relatively low risk and lots
of lifestyle benefits if you aren't materialistic.

Option 4: Low cost lifestyle. Move to a low cost country and consult via
online work. I don't have any experience with this option, so I don't know how
risky it is.

As a meta-observation, only option 1 makes any sense for someone wishing to
form a family, which is psychotic.

~~~
amyjess
Is it sad that none of those options appeal to me at all?

I just want to be a 9-5 mid-level software engineer until the day I die.

~~~
LVB
Ha I get this sentiment. My dad was a barber. He didn't love it, but it was
just a stable part of life for 30+ years. It was a means to pay bills, and
enjoyment came from elsewhere.

I'm coming to the conclusion that while work can contribute to happiness, it
can also siphon so much willpower that I've got nothing left for kids, other
pursuits, etc.

~~~
xapata
It took me a while to realize most happy people don't love their work, but
nearly all happy people love their family and friends.

------
user5994461
You don't know how the tech industry will be in 20 years.

It's likely that the age bands will shift as people age.

~~~
rezashirazian
I think so too, the age bands will shift with Mark Zuckerberg.

~~~
bbcbasic
Did they with Bill Gates?

~~~
rezashirazian
Different era, different culture.

------
guyzero
How big is the company you're at? There are decent big companies out there and
they tend to be more attractive for older people for a bunch of reasons. Why
not look for a position at a FB/GOOG/AMZN/MSFT or some other larger company?

------
edw519
_I 'm in my 30's doing marketing and am starting to feel like the old man of
the teams I work with._

Ha Ha, you'd be a baby on my team. I'm 61, on a team of 20 people in a
department of 100 people. Age range 21 to 72. I find little or no correlation
between age and anything that really matters. Like quality of work,
deliverance of value, or wanting to be on the same team.

 _I look around and there is hardly anyone over 40 and no-one 50+ unless they
hit executive level._

That's just where you're at. I know hundreds of people in their 50s and 60s
doing great work who are not executives. Lots of them are programmers, too.
The happiest and most successful are doing stuff they love (or have learned to
love).

 _The industry is about new technology and working_

No. _Any_ industry is about satisfying customers. Don't confuse what's in
front of your face every day with what really matters.

 _..so as someone that likes to plan ahead. What do you think are good career
options for the 50+?_

Exactly the same as for 49-. Whatever's best for you. (More below)

 _I 've been trying to think of jobs were age is an advantage._

I can't think of a single job where age would be an advantage. Experience
maybe, but not age. I can think of a few where it would be a disadvantage: pro
basketball player is one. But that belies the point: You should be thinking
about a job where what you bring is an advantage: your skills, education,
passion, etc. Forget age and focus on this.

 _The best I can think of is financial planning. Most people visit their
planner when retirement is on their mind, so you 'll likely be meeting people
of a similar group and mindset._

Not sure I understand what you're trying to say here. If you love financial
planning, by all means do it. But if you don't, finding a reason to do it
doesn't make any sense. You're unlikely to find much success in any field you
don't love, no matter what the other co-factors are.

 _Whereas in this industry being 21 and enthusiastic wont go far with many
older people._

Oh yes it does! I have 18 people on my team under age 26 and I love working
with them!

 _What does HN think are good options?_

I don't know what the rest of HN thinks, but here's what I think:

Find what you love, what you're good at, and what puts food on the table and
do it! Pour your heart and soul into it, get better at it, and it would be
hard for you to NOT make the world a better place by doing it. Forget the
rest, what others think, what's trendy, what you think _may_ be important (but
probably isn't).

I've been programming professionally for 38 years and can't imagine doing
anything else. I hope I go another 38, no matter where the industry takes me.

My best advice of all: Take care of yourself now or you may not be able to do
much of anything in your 50s.

~~~
softawre
I feel like an upvote isn't enough but I really don't know what to say. Thank
you for this.

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JSeymourATL
> The best I can think of is financial planning.

Interesting times to shift into Financial Planning, evidently 'humans' are
still in demand. Betterment Adds Human Advisors, Casting Doubt On Pure-Play
"Robo" Investment Models > [https://www.fastcompany.com/3067717/new-
money/betterment-add...](https://www.fastcompany.com/3067717/new-
money/betterment-adds-human-advisors-casting-doubt-on-pure-play-robo-
investment-models)

------
mbrodersen
I am 47 and I have no problems getting jobs. The key is to stay current and
continue improving your thinking tools. An experienced 40+ develop who stays
current can totally out compete a young inexperienced developer who thinks
that coding is about typing fast. No it isn't. Otherwise companies would be
hiring secretaries instead of programmers.

------
webmaven
You've described my situation poretty well.

I am in my mid-40s and have been flailing around career-wise for a few years.
Here is my January "Who wants to be Hired?" post in case anyone has good leads
for grey-friendly remote positions:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13344823](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13344823)

------
thorin
I work with a guy who is 70. He's a test manager and one of the smartest guys
on the team. He also works on the side writing betting software. In the 80s he
wrote several hit games for the zx spectrum and also worked with psygnosis. I
don't see any reasons why you can't keep on programming but some people's
lifestyle definitely doesn't fit with startup culture.

------
rb808
I think its a good option to become a mid-level manager at a non-tech company
or local/fed government. Most industries need more tech tools and not many
managers know much about how computer systems work. If you do you're ahead.

Its a pay cut but hopefully less stress and more job security. I dont know how
you break into it.

------
webmaven
Related discussion here - _" Ask HN: Ever faced difficulties pivoting your job
or career later in your life?"_:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13528434](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13528434)

------
T-A
> The best I can think of is financial planning.

[http://www.foxbusiness.com/features/2015/09/17/50-is-peak-
ag...](http://www.foxbusiness.com/features/2015/09/17/50-is-peak-age-for-
financial-decision-making.html)

------
cobookman
Sales Engineering. Lots of older folk. I've noticed the field has a good mix
of older and younger folk.

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devsmt
To work with a small group of freelance, maybe people facing the same
problems, and to try the small business path seems the only way out for me.
One needs to be in the path for financial independence. The problem is real,
tnks for sharing your concern.

------
shams93
It's hard to plan when AI is a part of the mix. How many jobs will there be
for people of any age in 20 years, as primitive as AI might be now it's
already wrecking havoc with employment. In a healthy economy emlloyers cannot
afford to practice discrimination not even age discrimination.

