

How to Create a (Great?) Startup Office Space While Being Absurdly Cheap - dcharlton
http://dontrepreneur.com/2009/12/14/how-to-create-a-great-startup-office-space-while-being-abusrdly-cheap/

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tptacek
This article was totally reasonable and interesting until I got to this part:

Employee office chairs – $60 to $80 (must be ergonomic!)

Your office chair – $150 to $200 (it is worth it)

Huh? Now I'm left wondering what _else_ is wrong with this guy.

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dcharlton
Fair enough – the intent was to say as the founder you should splurge on
yourself a little – not to say you're providing others with inferior stuff. I
was able to find great chairs at an affordable price. When I can afford Aeron
chairs for everyone, I would do that!

I removed that part because it takes away from the point of the article.

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dcharlton
Employees in this office will have plenty of perks – including $100 travel
reimbursement per month, plus free lunch every day. I would not want to hire
someone bogged down into such minute details of chairs when the entire space
is obviously meant to make it as comfortable for them as possible.

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ardit33
are you kidding me? After the PC/Laptop/screen the type of chair is very very
important. Any developer that is worth something, knows that they will have to
sit down for long period of time, it better be a good chair.

If not, then it shows a lot about the employer. You risk looking like a
company that buys cheap desktops, and and small screens to save money, but
don't realise they are loosing tons in the way of lost productivity.

At home I have an $200 Ikea chair, and it is really nice. Not bank breaking
for sure, but I expect my employer buy something similar in comfort level.
Doesn't have to be a top of the line, but something that I can sit for few
hours at a time without breaking my back.

I learned it the hard way, but I will never work in a place that cheaps out on
chairs.

If you can't afford a $200 chair per employee, then you shouldn't be hiring.
You need founders, and they can bring their own chair.

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dcharlton
I think not hiring because you can't afford $200 chairs is silly-I can either
hire you now or wait until I can afford 600 chairs. There are part time
employees out there too! I was specifically referring to the fact that as an
employer I am doing the best I can to get good chairs within a budget. These
chairs are extremely comfortable and happened to be affordable.

I went to IKEA looking for chairs—and hated all of them. To me, these chairs
are very comfortable.

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tptacek
I think you're missing my point. Chair quality is a red herring. It's "visibly
splurging on the founder" that's going to kill you.

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dcharlton
If you stopped by our office I think you would say there isn't any splurging
anywhere-we aren't VC backed

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Scott_MacGregor
Very nice job on a $4,500 budget. I am impressed with your results.

It stands to reason that everyone is different and some people will not care
one way or the other about this, some will hate it and think it’s dumb, and
some will think it’s heaven on earth. I think when you hire if you look for
the type of person who truly appreciates this type of environment as much as
you do you will have a much better team for yourself. I think that someone who
finds this workspace as invigorating as you do will excel in this environment
more than they would in a drab one and may end up producing at a higher level
than someone who does not.

This color scheme and attention to detail is not for everyone, but it is for
you and your company--it sets you apart. It really seems to set the tone for
your company culture right now and I think you should stick to your guns on
this plan as you grow larger and try to hire those who share your appreciation
for it. Build a _GOOD TEAM_.

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frankus
I'm working at a fairly established small programming shop, and the boss
basically set a budget and let us choose our own desks and chairs.

Because I wanted a fairly fancy chair and didn't really give a crap about
having an "executive-looking" desk, I splurged on the chair a bit ($299 on
sale for $249), got a fancy n-way adjustable keyboard tray second-hand ($100),
and a Fredrik desk from Ikea ($149).

Chair: [http://www.officedepot.com/a/products/510830/Realspace-
PRO-9...](http://www.officedepot.com/a/products/510830/Realspace-
PRO-9000-Series-Recycled-Mid/)

It's super comfortable and adjusts in height, seat depth, back height, armrest
height and position, etc. The only downside is that it could use another half
inch of seat height (and I'm not even six feet tall)

Desk: <http://www.ikea.com/us/en/catalog/products/60115989>

I can't say enough good things about this desk. I've got the first of the two
top shelves about six inches above the desktop with two 19" monitors on it.
With bigger monitors I would take it down one notch, but there would be room
for dual 27" screens. I did have to put a couple of spacers to mount the
keyboard tray, as there's a cross-brace that's in the way.

Here's my setup: <http://img39.yfrog.com/i/fobj.jpg/>

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tptacek
We did this too and I advise against it. There are desks that people will find
that will screw up your space in unpredictable ways. Get everyone the same
desk.

(For what it's worth, we eventually standardized on the same Ikea Frederick
desk you like).

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mattking
One of the more horrific color choices I've seen in a while.

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tptacek
I like that it's colorful, even if the colors are kind of hamhanded; it's good
for your office to have an identity. I wish we could paint our offices (we
could, but we need to be able to trade up to bigger offices on very little
notice).

~~~
DTrejo
Instead of painting your office, you could print posters.

Assuming you can find a cheap printing place, there are tons of high
resolution creative commons images on flickr and elsewhere.

My university has a _super_ cheap copymat, it may be that a university near
you has similarly cheap prices.

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tptacek
Posters = clutter, and I'm already pretty cluttered:

<http://www.flickr.com/photos/45585199@N07/4186099566/>

It's a great idea, though.

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DTrejo
That's a good point: if there's a poster there then it can't be a white board.

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tsestrich
Interesting article, particularly in regards to the tax credit for office
spaces (I happen to be in Pittsburgh, might be useful knowledge for the
future).

I guess I don't agree with everyone else here, but I think it all came
together well and I actually enjoy the color choices

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jsb
Agreed - Also in Pittsburgh here. Looks like he was able to get office space
on the North Side that qualifies for that tax credit. Not a bad area at all -
just a short walk along the riverfront park to PNC Park/Heinz Field!

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dotBen
We did something similar with Citizen Space I in San Francisco (CS has since
relocated to the ground floor of the same building in a different space, with
decor less to my liking).

<http://www.flickr.com/photos/laughingsquid/294769682/>

As you will see from the photo we were able to create a very slick space for
little money - mainly using Ikea furniture.

I believe we worked out that our budget for 6 people was less than 3 Aeron
chairs.

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colinplamondon
I don't get what the point of hiring more employees if you don't outfit them
with the most productive tools. Great machine, great monitor, great chair-
5-6k max.

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dcharlton
Of course you get the best hardware - this article was meant to show that even
a non VC backed company could get an office up and running. Were the other
tips helpful?

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daemin
Someone once (okay, I forgot the article this was in) recommended that for an
engineering/programming office it's a good idea to get a pool (snooker,
billiards, etc) table for a recreational area. This helps lessen eye strain as
there are many different coloured balls at differing distances that one must
focus on and thus relaxes the eyes.

Also if you have reasonably even matches players it's quite fun to play.

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Tawheed
I wish he'd speak more about what prompted him to get an office space. Is it
because he's hiring more people? Did he consider virtual collaboration models
instead of a 'real office?' Did he just want to get out of the house?

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dcharlton
I am beginning to bring on part-time help and needed an office space so we
could collaborate. Plus the business needed to feel more "real"—this is a hard
concept to explain but what happens in your house can sometimes feel more like
a hobby.

~~~
Tawheed
Ah - got it. Just curious, but are you basically getting most of your part
time help from locals to Pittsburg? Any particular reason why you're not
sticking to virtual? Also, did you consider a co-working facility (not even
sure if they have any in Pittsburg, but they sure are cropping up everywhere)

~~~
dcharlton
I considered a co-working facility—I would have loved the collaboration, but
this was a great deal for some private space.

Working at home makes you treat things differently than waking up and going to
a space 100% dedicated to work. Maybe it's just me, but it seemed like the
right time after 12 months.

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BenS
The best startup office tip I have heard is buying sheets of 'Solid White
Tileboard' from home depot. It is a material used in commercial shower
installations that works well as a white board. 8x12 sheet is ~14 dollars.

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tptacek
That's pretty expensive, isn't it? (I assume those are inches, not feet).

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BenS
No, that is feet.

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tptacek
That is crazy-ass cheap. URL?

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tsestrich
This seems to be the same, but at Lowes. Correct me if I'm wrong:
[http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=productDetail&prod...](http://www.lowes.com/lowes/lkn?action=productDetail&productId=61082-46498-31023248&lpage=none)

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Tawheed
Looks more like kindergarten than an office space. Where are the crayons?

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apowell
What's a decent ergonomic chair for under $100?

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dcharlton
Bizchair.com around the holidays had some great deals.

