
Chromecast update breaks AllCast - cygwin98
https://plus.google.com/app/basic/stream/z13be5ajwpmvux5a304ccxsypuevhtcwgao
======
tylerkahn
[https://developers.google.com/cast/release-
notes](https://developers.google.com/cast/release-notes)

> Warning: The current Google Cast SDK is a preview SDK intended for
> development and testing purposes only, not for production apps. Google may
> change this SDK significantly prior to the official release of the Google
> Cast SDK. We strongly recommend that you do not publicly distribute any
> application using this preview SDK, as this preview SDK will no longer be
> supported after the official SDK is released (which will cause applications
> based only on the preview SDK to break).

~~~
ihsw
In the future, when video playback _isn 't_ restored and Google makes a public
admission that they _don 't_ intend on restoring it, would you mind if I
remind you of how you were naive and foolish?

When Google's next hardware product comes out, can we stop thanking them and
instead point out how they have a history of releasing products that give
users no control over what runs on them?

Google has far more technical expertise than any ISP, so it stands to reason
that they'll be using that to push down on users more than any other ISP has
in the past. We may yet regret clamoring for Google Fiber to be everywhere.

~~~
thezilch
Entitled much? What obligations does Google have here, exactly?

~~~
burntsushi
Huh? The GP comment never mentioned or implied the word "obligation".

~~~
thezilch
The ultimatum is for Google to restore undocumented functionality or publicly
state they don't support openness. And we're all fools to think Google will go
to the ends of the earth to support everything imaginable! Replace Google with
Apple in the GP to understand the entitlement and just how foolish we aren't.

~~~
burntsushi
Sorry, but I just don't see it. All I see is a complaint and a demand for a
feature. IMO, that's not entitlement. Entitlement would use words like "owe"
and "responsibility".

------
bru
The developer of AllCast, Koushik Dutta, gave his side in this reddit comment:
[http://www.reddit.com/r/Android/comments/1l2hez/google_block...](http://www.reddit.com/r/Android/comments/1l2hez/google_blocks_chromecast_app_that_let_you_stream/cbv8u0s)

~~~
zmmmmm
His response is a little bit trite when you read his previous post where he
more or less taunts Google about how he reverse engineered the protocol to
avoid the whitelist. In some way it almost feels like a setup - perhaps this
is all a strategy by Koush to flush Google out on this issue, and I suspect
they've been forced to confront it now before they were really ready.

~~~
koushikdutta
;)

------
Ironlink
Google has responded to a request for comment from The Verge.

We’re excited to bring more content to Chromecast and would like to support
all types of apps, including those for local content. It's still early days
for the Google Cast SDK, which we just released in developer preview for early
development and testing only. We expect that the SDK will continue to change
before we launch out of developer preview, and want to provide a great
experience for users and developers before making the SDK and additional apps
more broadly available.

~~~
nivla
> We expect that the SDK will continue to change before we launch out of
> developer preview, and want to provide a great experience for users and
> developers before making the SDK and additional apps more broadly available.

Then why are they offering it in retail stores like best buy? Sucks that you
buy something for feature X and few days later an update comes through getting
rid of it. Does anyone know how hard is it to reverse this update?

~~~
abraham
> Sucks that you buy something for feature X and few days later an update
> comes through getting rid of it.

You really shouldn't buy products because of an un-official feature hidden in
a preview of a developer SDK.

~~~
realcul
would you have the same reaction if Microsoft/Apple _actively_ blocks a user
functionality that the device and software is capable of... official or
unofficial the developer demonstrated that a scenario can work..why go out of
way to block it.. looks like this is a new trend for Google - maps on Windows
Phone, youtube app on Windows Phone....

~~~
BitMastro
Would you have the same reaction if you were using undocumented APIs in
Windows or iPhone private APIs and then they changed them?

There is an unofficial way and that is putting your device in developer mode.

~~~
nitrogen
_Would you have the same reaction if you were using undocumented APIs in
Windows..._

Microsoft is bad at many things, but until recently, they were very good at
backward compatibility. They knew people were using undocumented APIs, so they
went out of their way to preserve bug-for-bug compatibility in a lot of cases.

On the other hand, they also went out of their way to use undocumented APIs
and API changes to give Word an advantage over Word Perfect....

~~~
abraham
MS has only been good at backwards compatibility when it is in their best
interest. Usually because a major partner was the one using an undocumented
API with millions of users. In this case it was a person hacking some code
together on a product less than a month old with probably only a few thousand
people using the app that broke.

------
JSadowski
I've been using my Chromecast to play local content since day one. Then again,
I have a whitelisted application that I'm using and I'm not distributing it.
There is nothing really stopping developers from developing such services...
local content plays fine. Google just doesn't want you distributing them until
the dust settles and they lock down their API. If it takes them more than a
month or so to do so, or if they then prohibit such uses of the Chromecast,
then maybe you have a story, but until then -- geez.

~~~
selectout
Any chance you'd be willing to put the code up on GitHub so other Chromecast
users can just add it locally and whitelist it?

~~~
JSadowski
Sure... I'll throw up a gist... not the correct way to do it, crappy sender
UI, based on early code examples from Google, but it works:

[https://gist.github.com/jonathansadowski/6345103](https://gist.github.com/jonathansadowski/6345103)

Feel free to use / copy / fork, whatever. Basically, you can send any URL to
the receiver, and the receiver then loads that URL in its video element....
that URL can be local, remote, whatever... requires that you have a webserver
to serve your local content.

------
jlgreco
If I were somebody with a Chromebook that still had ChromeOS installed, I
would be very very concerned right now.

If you don't control your device's software updates, then the device is not
yours. It is as simple as that.

~~~
jonknee
We've had a long time to prove the disaster that is users controlling updates.
The majority of people are far and away better off having automatic updates.
It's also one of the big selling points of the devices though so I don't think
it should catch anyone by surprise. You're free to install another OS on your
device though (which is a good sign the device _is_ yours).

~~~
jlgreco
We've had a long time to prove that using automatic updates to remove features
is a recipe for disaster. In fact, I seem to remember a certain company using
forced updates _specifically_ to remove users' ability to install other OSes
on their devices...

Just because you can install another OS on your chromebook today doesn't mean
you will be able to in the future. Get out now, or you are making a gamble.

~~~
jonknee
> We've had a long time to prove that using automatic updates to remove
> features is a recipe for disaster. In fact, I seem to remember a certain
> company using forced updates specifically to remove users' ability to
> install other OSes on their devices...

They didn't remove a feature... They removed an undocumented setting for an
SDK that has warnings all over the place that the API is not final and to not
release an app until it is.

~~~
jlgreco
From my response to somebody else in this discussion: _" Hiding behind terms
of use on SDKs isn't something that mellows the sting of this to users who
probably don't even know what "SDK" means."_

~~~
Karunamon
Then shame on the developer for releasing an app for mass consumption based on
private and non finalized APIs, and then blaming Google when things break. I
understand that ragging on corporations is fun, but c'mon. Perspective ,
please.

~~~
jlgreco
"Shame on the developer" does not make this any better for the consumers
either.

~~~
Karunamon
The problem the consumers are having was generated completely and totally by
the developer of the app, not Google. If you as a developer write an app using
non finalized APIs, and release it, and the app breaks because that API
changed, it is completely and utterly _your fault_.

------
sologoub
Just got my Chromecast that I ordered in July and am profoundly disappointed.
For a device with such high potential, it really did not deliver on the
promise.

Here's what I expected: 1) AirPlay alternative via Google Chrome/Chromecast.
2) Reasonable picture quality and fit. 3) Possibly an office alternative to
Apple TV for presentations.

While yes, this thing can project your browser tab on to the TV, there is
severe lag, washed-out colors, and most importantly I have not been able to
play HTML5 videos in full-screen mode. Could be user error...

Amazon Prime Instant Videos do not play in full-screen mode either. But then
again, I didn't really expect SilverLight to work with Google's products all
that well.

Picture quality is terrible. I only tried it on a 720p TV, as tab mirroring
reportedly only supports 720p. Colors are washed out and lighting is off. Not
a big deal, but I also did not get 720p all the time, connection seemed to
fade in and out. This is on a completely not busy N router and nothing else
streaming.

What really got me though was spotty support in YouTube and Drive
Presentations going off-screen. YouTube has a nice library of international
films. I really like watching old Soviet movies from my childhood. They are
free to watch and I was stunned when Chromecast reported that the videos I was
trying to watch are not supported, even though there is a chromecast icon in
the player itself.

Lastly, Google Presentations ended up being cut off when projected in
fullscreen (yes here it's fully supported, but not on all videos... go
figure.). This last bit basically killed my hypothesis that we could get these
for ever conference room and project from both Macs and PCs. I was really
hoping this would work...

~~~
sologoub
Update:

Using YouTube with Nexus7 and Chromecast actually works a lot better than
using a Mac. That said, I have not been able to play a movie I had bought on
the Play store and downloaded to the device using the store app... again,
maybe user error.

------
ChuckMcM
I posted the register link on this story, seeing Koushik's comments it looks
very much like there is an intent at work here. That intent being that the
'crown jewels' of this device is sitting between what you see and the source
of that stream. I would guess that Google would consider doing what Hulu did
and inject 30 second commercials into that stream. Perhaps that doesn't work
if you call the streaming API directly?

A number of folks seem to make these 'linux/android to HDMI dongle' type
systems, I guess we're stuck making our own version of one.

------
smtddr
Well, I don't agree with what Google is doing assuming it's intentional.

But,

1)It's $35. I spend more than that on a week's worth of lunch.

2)I bet cyanogenmod will make an appearance. I'm just buying Chromecast for
the hardware.

~~~
jlgreco
There is always going to be a cost comparison that can be used to belittle
something. The classic is _" less than x days of coffee."_ Next step up is
apparently _" less than x days of lunch."_ What is the next one, _" less than
your car insurance"_ perhaps? $50,000? That is less than some _cars_ cost!
$100,000,000? That is somewhere around _ten shuttle launches_! A several
billion dollar shuttle program? _Please_ , just check out these national debt
numbers?

These types of price comparisons between unrelated things are almost always
worthless. You could make me feel ripped off over two dollars; I sure as hell
can feel ripped off over $35.

~~~
munificent
This is your friendly reminder that slippery slope is a logical fallacy.

~~~
abraininavat
This is your friendly reminder that jlgreco's is not a deductive argument and
that most of the logic we base our everyday decisions on would be called
logical fallacies. It's time for a Fallacy Fallacy, I think.

This is also your friendly reminder that jlgreco wasn't even employing
"slippery slope" logic. He wasn't arguing that employing a cost comparison
will lead inevitably to employing further cost comparisons. He simply pointed
out that one cherry-picks the level that best makes one's argument.

This is your friendly reminder that your post makes no sense.

~~~
munificent
This is my friendly reminder to finish my coffee before commenting on the
internet.

------
kayoone
Seems like 35$ for this device was too good to be true. Hopefully there will
be some custom ROM sometime, anyway i wanted to get one soon, but now i will
hold out as streaming anything to my TV would have been the killer feature for
me.

------
DonnyV
Well this device has gone from a "must have" to a "no thanks".

------
angryasian
Everyone wants to blame google, but because Chromecast requires a functional
HDCP link... its probably more due to content providers.

------
lampooned
Google basically just made Chromecast less useful than an Apple TV,

------
dicroce
I got news for Google. What stopped me from rooting my iPhone was a pretty
vibrant app store... that I would lose access to. Given that I already have
multiple ways to do Netflix and Youtube on my TV, I'll root my chromecast and
run something open that lets me do what I want AS SOON AS I POSSIBLY CAN.

------
djrogers
Open always wins!

~~~
nine_k
I'd love to hear about an open alternative for $35. Maybe something RPi-based?

~~~
dz0ny
Leapcast([https://github.com/dz0ny/leapcast](https://github.com/dz0ny/leapcast)),
nodecast are both on the way becoming the replacement for CC. All we need is
someone to port video acceleration to chromium browser. :)

------
espeed
My Chromecast arrived today. I set it up on my living room TV, and to my
surprise, my Nexus pad is also presenting the wireless TV in the kitchen as a
playback option. Is this a documented feature?

~~~
Rabidgremlin
Your wireless TV must support the DIAL protocol around which which Google Cast
is built: [http://www.dial-multiscreen.org/](http://www.dial-multiscreen.org/)

------
runn1ng
Can I ask for more context?

~~~
lazypenguin
The OP developed an app that allowed you to stream raw media files directly to
the chromecast. This is not possible by default, instead you're limited to
youtube, netflix and mirroring a tab in your browser.

OP's application doesn't use SDK but instead works at a lower level. This new
update broke his application and he is making the argument that it was a
directed update. They specifically removed a part of their code that allowed
for this functionality.

~~~
sp332
It can mirror a tab in your browser? Doesn't that mean you could just open a
video file in your browser and watch it that way?

Edit: looks like it's limited to 5 Mbps at 720p.
[http://www.anandtech.com/show/7186/google-chromecast-
review-...](http://www.anandtech.com/show/7186/google-chromecast-review-an-
awesome-35-hdmi-dongle/4)

~~~
aroch
Yes, but only for codecs supported by Chrome (basically mp4 and the occasional
avi). Anything that needs transcoding (or any file with high bitrate/multichan
audio) will cause extreme stuttering unless you have a machine with a fairly
beefy processor and GPU.

Casting a tab is like using logmein to watch a movie on another computer.
Casting either the RAW or the local file directly is like playing something
off a NAS

------
cjhopman
So there was a way for any random app to play whatever video it wanted on my
tv? And Google disabled it? Well gee, shame on them.

------
cygwin98
Is the new motto being _Do Evil_?

~~~
_nullandnull_
No, but Newspeak is the official new language at Google.

~~~
gosub
Well newspeak[1] was created by Gilad Bracha. He now works for Google, he was
one of the creators of Dart. So, almost.

[1] [http://newspeaklanguage.org/](http://newspeaklanguage.org/)

~~~
_nullandnull_
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newspeak](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newspeak)

------
badman_ting
It's not so much that I mind Google doing this, as I wish people would stop
pretending that Google is somehow more "open" or different from other
companies that restrict the functionality of their devices in similar ways.

~~~
myko
> I wish people would stop pretending that Google is somehow more "open" or
> different from other companies that restrict the functionality of their
> devices in similar ways.

This is the first device Google has done this with though, isn't it?

------
Kiro
Still getting one.

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dell1994
I guess google wants to control the platform. What is the surprise here.

