
List of 30 European Tech Visas and Work Permits - gonsanchezs
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1wLPGB2BdRxHWbdOXXtKAoCQimY_4RjBjRH8Grv3U0tI/edit#gid=0
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xacaxulu
American in Paris for 1 year working as a Senior DevSecOps Engineer (or
whatever they want to call us). Went from 225kUSD/yr in usa to 95kEUR in
Europe (most senior devs are lucky to get 75k, paris tech salaries are lagging
behind London, AMS and Berlin. I felt like I was getting underpaid until I
figured out (awkwardly at a dinner) that i make more than a lot of doctors and
government ministers. Plus the healthcare, subsidized transit, subsidized
lunches 20 days a month and TRUE vacation means I'm never going back to the
states.

All that being said, I'm bouncing to Berlin for a higher salary and a roughly
30 percent drop in cost of living compared to Paris.

Check out jobbatical.com

Amsterdam is a hot scene, Berlin is hot and affordable, dont come to Paris
unless you really speak French and or have deep Fintech/banking tech
background.

~~~
razorbladeknife
I get paid 250K EUR in Geneva for writing deadbeat Scala code for Banks. I
doubt anyone can match that in Europe

I am straight out of ETH Zurich so my experience is negligible.

~~~
ido
Switzerland is an outlier in many aspects for Western Europe :)

And not only in terms of earning - look for example at benefits you get for
having kids (amount of parental leave, cost of kindergarten, etc).

It’s like a weird capitalist Enklave in the middle of Europe. I’ll bet a lot
of people thought of having kids in Germany or Austria and moving to
Switzerland after a few years of taking advantage of generous benefits for
having young kids in the former.

~~~
kaybe
What is also common is to live at the border in one of those or France/Italy
and cross the border every day. That way you take advantage of the higher
wages and lower living expenses respectively.

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woahitsraj
Left the states a few years ago. After a 2 years stint in Toronto at a startup
I now work for a Swedish development agency in Gothenburg.

6 weeks of paid vacation, great public transit, and affordable housing all
mean I'm never going back to the states. If your considering moving to Europe,
I'd highly recommend it. Salary isn't everything in life.

Happy to answer any questions

~~~
danilocesar
What's so bad about Toronto? Ontario looks like a nice region to live.

~~~
Gpetrium
I don't think anything is bad with Toronto per say (maybe housing prices), he
explicitly said states, maybe life just pulled him to the EU

~~~
woahitsraj
Pretty much this but there are some gripes I have with Toronto as I posted
above

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te_chris
For some reason the UK Tech Nation visa isn't filled in. Proper name is Tier 1
(Exceptional Talent). Tech Nation are the 'designated competent body' for the
tech specialistaion - it's a generic visa for specialists who've been endorsed
by a body in the UK from their industry. It cost something like £600 all up
for the actual fees, then they sting you with an NHS surcharge which is now
£400 a year I think - another gift to immigrants from Mrs May. They only give
about 400-odd of them a year.

I've got the visa, I feel like the requirements for this visa should mention
that putting together the application process was a shitload of work because
it goes to a panel of industry people to be assesed, so is much, much harder
to get than a lot of the other ones which are more criteria based. Really, if
you want it, you need to convince the panelists that you'll add value to UK
tech somehow, beyond just being an employee.

Also, don't be like this guy if you don't get
it...[https://www.technation.sucks/](https://www.technation.sucks/)

~~~
jpatokal
> _Tech Nation, the Giant Ape, has no sign of intelligence and is there to
> destroy beautiful things that go beyond her comprehension ability._

Man, somebody's got an axe to grind...

------
0xfaded
I have a Danish startup visa and happy to answer questions.

One thing re funding I wish I understood before I moved here: Europe has no
favoured state laws which prevent governments from unilaterally propping up
local companies, startups are no exception. However, there is a "no one cares"
de minimus limit of 200k euros. Any published funding accompanying a startup
visa will come out of this amount, and in practice there are many other
schemes to receive money up until the 200k limit. Beyond that you start
applying for European wide funding schemes. I'd choose your destination on
other factors, since all state money is subject to the same limit.

~~~
new_here
I'm moving to Denmark in a month. A few questions, if you have time:

\- Do you have an opinion on the Copenhagen tech scene? Companies, talent,
access to funding etc.

\- How've you found integrating with the Danish culture?

\- Any suggestions for how to build your network there?

~~~
magduf
I have another question to add to this list (part of your question #2
actually): how is dating in Europe for an American?

~~~
Casperin
As a Dane, I'd say no problem.

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chrisseaton
It's strange when I think about it that I could tell you quite a bit about the
US immigration and visa system (and I've never even used it apart from a J-1
years ago) but I have absolutely no idea how my own country the UK does
immigration and visas.

~~~
gonsanchezs
Surprisingly, the UK is not that bad.

~~~
repolfx
Why is that surprising? The UK has had huge immigration numbers for decades
and a centrist/centre-right government that is (mildly) interested in
simplifying government procedures.

~~~
gsnedders
Because reducing the number of immigrants has been a hot topic politically for
over the past decade.

~~~
wongarsu
I think in most of Western Europe "limit immigration" is just the politically
correct code for "stop immigration of Muslims and other people from non-
Western nations". Skilled workers from Western nations are usually welcomed
with open arms.

~~~
consumer451
In England at least, there seems to be a significant “EU immigrants took our
jobs” factor as well. As I understand it, that perception was a significant
factor in the Brexit vote.

For example see: [https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/20/reality-
che...](https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/may/20/reality-check-are-eu-
migrants-really-taking-british-jobs)

------
Spooky23
Another avenue to consider is that Ireland allows citizenship by registration
for anyone with a grandparent born in Ireland. It’s a pretty easy process if
you qualify, and isn’t a visa, you are immediately recognized.

There are some gotchas. The US doesn’t acknowledge dual citizenship, and I
believe you must travel in/out of the US with a US passport. If you have a US
security clearance or wish to obtain one, you will have a problem as well.

~~~
gonsanchezs
Both Italy and Spain have the same regime. It can take a year or two to set
everything up, but you get citizenship and a passport (not a temp visa)

~~~
dmurray
Italy at least is much more lenient, allowing you to go back as many
generations as you like to prove Italian ancestry.

------
fooblat
Missing from the Dutch Highly Skilled Visa is that there is also an income
requirement based on age. I don't recall the exact numbers but if you are 35+
the income requirement is significantly higher. In any case, the required
level would not be a problem for most tech workers.

~~~
speleding
It's important to note that if you qualify for The Dutch Highly Skilled Visa
you will typically also qualify for the great "30% rule" tax exception, this
means that you get 30% of your income tax-free for 5 years, and the other 70%
will fall mostly in the lowest tax bracket. (Ostensibly to help you move, but
in practice really to make The Netherlands more competitive for highly skilled
migrants)

To qualify you need a salary of €54K (lower if you're under 30), which is
pretty easy to get in the tech scene so it's not uncommon for startups in
Amsterdam to have _all_ their foreign workers making more than their native
Dutch colleagues.

------
CalRobert
Another addition suggestion - the Dutch American Friendship Treaty.

If you're a US citizen, you've got ~$7500 in savings, and can employ yourself,
you can live and work in the Netherlands.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DAFT](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DAFT)

I emailed this guy a few times and he was always happy to answer questions -
[http://shawnindutch.com/](http://shawnindutch.com/)

------
johnchristopher
Why is Israel in a European list ?

~~~
aerodog
But not Turkey...(?)

~~~
TomMarius
Probably because the culture is separated, which is not the case with Israel?

~~~
gnulinux
I worked in a startup in Turkey (Istanbul) years ago (currently working in a
startup in Boston). The culture was pretty "Western". The office had a beer
fountain and my manager was really chill, it was an enjoyable experience. Not
sure if you would be able to find that in any other part of the country
though.

~~~
TomMarius
I heard Turkey has changed a lot in the past 5 years. Do you think it'd be the
same today?

~~~
gnulinux
I don't know sorry. This was ~7 years ago and I lived in the US since then. I
would guess it highly depends on the company. The company I worked for was a
hardware/iot/web startup that was doing really fascinating work, and got good
investment, and founders were graduates of best universities in Turkey. My
guess is if you research the company and see that the culture is something you
like, it's probably possible to find another company like that. Though I would
admit finding a job somewhere else in Europe is probably orders of magnitude
safer. I wouldn't do it today, but that's because I have a job I love in the
US.

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renholder
The information for Ireland isn't entirely accurate. There's two separate
lists for the availability of the Critical Skills Employment permit and the
second list requires a minimum annual salary of €60,000[0]:

 _Occupations with a minimum annual remuneration of €30,000 for a restricted
number of strategically important occupations contained in the Highly Skilled
Eligible Occupations List. A relevant degree qualification or higher is
required._

 _All occupations with a minimum annual remuneration of over €60,000, other
than those on the Ineligible Categories of Employment for Employment Permits
or which are contrary to the public interest._

For Sweden, the employment link referenced is for self-employment. The details
around regular, full-time employment can be found on Migrationsverket's
site[1].

[0] - [https://dbei.gov.ie/en/What-We-Do/Workplace-and-
Skills/Emplo...](https://dbei.gov.ie/en/What-We-Do/Workplace-and-
Skills/Employment-Permits/Permit-Types/Critical-Skills-Employment-Permit/)

[1] - [https://www.migrationsverket.se/English/Private-
individuals/...](https://www.migrationsverket.se/English/Private-
individuals/Working-in-Sweden/Employed/Work-permit-requirements.html)

~~~
gonsanchezs
Fixing.

~~~
renholder
Cheers! Just trying to help out.

To quote _Hackers_ [0]: " _We demand free access to data, well, it comes with
some responsibility._ "

[0] - [https://youtu.be/Rn2cf_wJ4f4](https://youtu.be/Rn2cf_wJ4f4)

~~~
gonsanchezs
Absolutely, I really appreciate it.

------
CalRobert
May I suggest an addition?

Ireland has a working holiday visa that lets students and recent graduates
come live and work for a year with basically no restrictions (no need for work
permit, etc.) It's the only EU country I know offering such a fantastic
opportunity, at least for US citizens (Canadians, South Koreans, etc. have
more options)

[https://www.dfa.ie/travel/visas/working-holiday-
visas/](https://www.dfa.ie/travel/visas/working-holiday-visas/)

It's fantastic for someone who probably could get their foot in the door but
needs to be physically present in the place to get started. Interviewing from
another continent is 100x as hard.

------
bjs250
Anyone have advice for junior SWEs? I will have a year of co-op experience by
the end of 2019, and was thinking of applying from the US to work in Germany
or the Netherlands for full-time junior positions.

------
based2
France: Passport talent: multi-year residence card of a foreigner in France

[https://translate.google.fr/translate?hl=fr&sl=auto&tl=en&u=...](https://translate.google.fr/translate?hl=fr&sl=auto&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.service-
public.fr%2Fparticuliers%2Fvosdroits%2FF16922)

[https://www.service-
public.fr/particuliers/vosdroits/F16922](https://www.service-
public.fr/particuliers/vosdroits/F16922)

------
scottlocklin
Missing: [http://www.czechstartups.org/en/start-up-
visa/](http://www.czechstartups.org/en/start-up-visa/)

------
mebassett
I'm not familiar with the immigration system of too many other countries. But
for the UK this is masking a lot of major differences between visas. For
instance, the Tier 2 visa requires an employer to sponsor it. The visa is then
tied to that job. That employer needs a license, et cetera. Whereas the tech
nation visa allows someone to come to the UK without a job and look, and then
change jobs easily.

------
Raed667
I moved from Tunisia to France 4 years ago, feel free to email, I'd be glad to
help with any information.

Email is in my profile.

------
superwayne
You could add Austria to the list: [https://www.migration.gv.at/en/types-of-
immigration/permanen...](https://www.migration.gv.at/en/types-of-
immigration/permanent-immigration/very-highly-qualified-workers/)

~~~
gonsanchezs
done

------
jve
@gonsanchezs, please add Latvia: [https://startuplatvia.eu/startup-
visa](https://startuplatvia.eu/startup-visa)

Cost: 100Eur

Family: Yes

Must be board member

Requirements: Not employed at other company or member of another board. Within
6 months 30'000 Eur investment, 18 months another 30'000;

~~~
gonsanchezs
done

------
akaralar
I’m in the process of applying for Spanish Highly Skilled visa and the company
told me that university diploma is required. I wonder where the author of the
document got his info on that visa, to make sure whether it’s required or not.

------
tyteen4a03
Thanks for the list - would love to see which countries are new-grad friendly
as well.

~~~
cr1895
Netherlands is pretty favorable.

Get an MSc and you'll have full access to the Dutch job market for a whole
year, then once you get a job you can get the highly-skilled migrant permit
(with less restrictive criteria I think). After five years and passing some
"integration" tests you can get permanent residence.

You're disadvantaged in some ways however because you're ineligible for the
30% tax ruling you'd possibly receive if you were recruited from abroad into a
highly skilled position.

Then again, once you've started working you can do some tax adjusting and
deduct a big chunk of your tuition costs from your first working year's taxes.
I'm not sure if this will be possible much longer, though.

~~~
joelbluminator
Graduates can receive 30% ruling...

~~~
cr1895
Only PhD graduates, according to the Belastingdienst.

[https://www.belastingdienst.nl/wps/wcm/connect/bldcontenten/...](https://www.belastingdienst.nl/wps/wcm/connect/bldcontenten/belastingdienst/individuals/living_and_working/working_in_another_country_temporarily/you_are_coming_to_work_in_the_netherlands/30_facility_for_incoming_employees/conditions_30_p_facility/conditions_30_percent_facility)

[https://www.belastingdienst.nl/wps/wcm/connect/bldcontenten/...](https://www.belastingdienst.nl/wps/wcm/connect/bldcontenten/belastingdienst/business/payroll_taxes/you_are_not_established_in_the_netherlands_are_you_required_to_withhold_payroll_taxes/when_you_are_going_to_withhold_payroll_taxes/etraterritorial_costs_and_the_30percent-
facility/conditions_attached_to_the_30percent-
facility/definition_of_expatriate_employee)

------
baybal2
I think details on issuance times are needed, some of those can easily be
taking half a year or more to get, other are known to routinely miss
advertised times (blue card)

~~~
franee
French tech talent visa (eu blue card) - 1 month for the visa itself. Then 3
months processing for the residency (applied dec got the card in mar).

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robk
This should include renewability and pathway to permanence and citizenship. UK
tech nation has permanence in 5 and citizenship in 6 which is quite compelling

------
jakozaur
FWIW: Some countries like Poland, don't have a special visa, but regular ones
are easily available. Reasonable quick (2 months) with low legal cost.

------
kyranjamie
Nice, I'd love to see a list similar to this, that includes tax relief as well
— similar to The Netherland's 30% ruling.

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winter_blue
This is amazing. Thanks!

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foobarbazetc
Which European city has the most SF-like weather? :)

~~~
evgen
If you are looking for cities with a decent tech scene then for SF weather it
is probably London and for peninsula and south bay weather maybe Barcelona.

