
Why the Lumia 800 is the first device I would switch to from an iPhone - shawndumas
http://www.marco.org/2011/11/13/panzarino-lumia-800-review
======
brudgers
> _"Since there are no other factors helping Windows Phone’s sales at retail,
> I don’t see how it’s going to move past the state it’s in today: a platform
> that reviews well but effectively nobody buys."_

Retail sales of WP7 phones will be driven by the same factor which drove
Android sales - handset manufacturers choosing to build phones running the OS.
See Nokia.

The reason this is likely to happen is that WP7 offers a far more stable
roadmap and sophisticated B2B relationship than Android. Not least among the
benefits are Microsoft's deep pockets, patent portfolio, and consumers' 20+
years of familiarity with the Windows brand.

On the development side, Visual Studio for Windows Phone offers a much lower
barrier to entry in terms of cost relative to the iPhone and a much lower
barrier to entry in regards to technical knowledge relative to Android (i.e.
cheaper development hardware relative to Apple and a more user friendly IDE
and languages relative to Android (YMMV)).

Furthermore, TouchStudio provides an onboard IDE to allow scripting by users
in a way analogous to bundled BASIC of the Commodore 64, IBM PC, or TRS-80.
Because Microsoft is approaching the phone as a true computing device, WP7 is
highly likely to gain traction in markets with low levels computing
infrastructure by leveraging the higher levels of cellular infrastructure
which is not uncommon in the developing worlds.

To put it another way, WP7 offers development opportunities in places without
app stores to people of diverse stripes who are interested in solving
meaningful computing problems and addressing acute needs without requiring the
investment in additional resources (i.e. computers for development).

In other words, Microsoft's strategy appears to include a definition of
developer in line with the early days of personal computers where every person
may be their own developer - in opposition to a solely consumer centered model
of the phone as primarily a media consumption device.

And that strategy truly offers handset makers the opportunity to radically
expand the smartphone market in ways that are more difficult to achieve with
Android.

------
lazylland
I don't think apps have a major impact on purchasing factor for the general
public. I would imagine that the most important web properties would already
have Windows clients.

I feel the real reason is that the hardware so far has been really bland and
nothing catches your attention. The Lumia has a fresh design that could
kickstart the 'wow' factor.

~~~
bergie
The fresh design is straight from N9, which has been selling quite well in the
limited markets where Nokia released it. And N9 reviews are also great, in the
tune of _the best phone you'll never be able to buy_.

Apparently Windows Phone 7 is also quite good, but I wonder if it still is
good enough to compete in an iOS-and-Android world. Maybe if Nokia and
Microsoft pour enough money there.

How about the mobile start-ups here, do you have any WP7 app plans?

------
funkydata
The apps will come and they will be better designed.

I do not know if anybody here has tried the Microsoft developer tools but they
are more advanced than anything even Apple has.

Expression Blend for example is something Android developers need badly. I
hope that with Adobe letting go of Flex that Google is going to poach a lot of
their IDE team like they did with Chet Haase.

What they are missing was a more open API and a more in your face marketing
attitude. Nokia will bring that to the table.

Microsoft has deep pockets and they need to be in mobile to stay relevant
(even if they earn more money suing Android manufacturers). You next phone
will be a Windows Phone.

~~~
polyfractal
I have a love-hate relationship with WP7 development.

On one hand, we have Visual Studio, a built in phone emulator, the .Net
platform and excellent documentation/tutorials. It's almost stupid how easily
you can create fairly advanced "form based" applications with WPF. Games are
fairly straightforward with XNA. The build in emulator works with VS like a
dream, dropping in and out of breakpoints, etc.

I could gush all day about the development environment.

However, App Hub (the place to actually publish your app) is an absolute
nightmare. Built entirely in Silverlight, it is buggy, clunky and unintuitive.
There is basically zero documentation, descriptions are vague or just wrong.
Stats about your app are at least a week delayed and are not detailed. You can
only see reviews for your app in _your_ local market (e.g. US market). My app
has a few reviews from England, but I have to use a third party tool to view
them.

I could rant all day about App Hub.

~~~
zwigby
From my experience with iPhone and iTunes connect (also not a great
application) I don't spend a lot of time in iTunes Connect. Are you spending a
lot of time in the App Hub? What I'm getting at is that this sounds like a
pretty minor thing in the grand scheme.

~~~
polyfractal
Oh, I agree entirely. The benefits of the excellent development environment
completely overshadow the poor App Hub experience.

And once you're at the point where you are submitting an app, you are already
committed. The poor experience won't stop you from submitting, and probably
won't stop you from developing another app.

------
knowtheory
It's worth noting that Apple spent years working on their own software tools
to retain a minimal level of software parity with Windows. Macs were dismissed
for _years_ as not having the same wealth of software that PCs had, especially
in the gaming world.

Nobody says that anymore.

~~~
mgcross
True, Steam and the Mac App Store have largely remedied that, but the amount
of titles available (and release date) are still quite a bit behind Windows.
I've also noticed my games (Source games in Steam and Minecraft) push more fps
when I boot my MBA in Windows 7. (although I don't fault OS X for that - it's
probably a developer/driver issue).

~~~
mitchty
Actually its probably partly OSX's fault too, the OpenGL rendering code tends
to go more for correctness over speed from what I've seen. That said, the
drivers aren't exactly speed daemons.

------
patd
Aren't those arguments very US-centric ? If Windows phones sell well in Japan
and in Europe, they could attract developers.

They are already marketing it heavily in Japan and Nokia is a European
company.

------
nagnatron
I have a Windows Phone device and work in an office where most people use OS X
and some have iPhones. I have yet to hear anyone prefer Andoid to Windows
Phone with some actually preferring the WP interface to the one on their
iPhone.

If I were buying a new phone today, it would really be a hard choice between
the Lumia and the iPhone 4(s).

~~~
untog
I bought the Samsung Focus S. Not as flashy as the Lumia, but it's still a
damn good phone that had stuff like front-facing camera that the Lumia is
oddly lacking. And yes, I love the UI.

------
epo
Intentionally provocative headline. He says it is a reasonable alternative if
he had to switch but not good enough as it stands.

~~~
mattdeboard
It's not provocative, it just leaves off the conditional at the end.

------
KnownSubset
I don't know why there complaints about the marketplace. The WP7 platform has
been a huge hit with developers; just take a look at what's out on the
marketplace: <http://www.windowsphone.com/en-US/apps>. From everything I know
the review process is leagues better than the Apple's in that you get actual
feedback about the issues whether or not your app is acceptable. Microsoft has
put out a podcast from Redmond that covers what is going on with the platform
to help developers <http://wpradio.podcast.windowsphone7.com/rss>.

Then there is the fact that they make it free for students to develop with
dreamspark accounts.
[https://www.dreamspark.com/Products/Product.aspx?ProductId=2...](https://www.dreamspark.com/Products/Product.aspx?ProductId=28)

~~~
oakgrove
"I don't know why there complaints about the marketplace."

Er, because there are 10 times the apps in their competitors' marketplaces.
Yes, wp7 has the low hanging fruit covered but there are many apps that cater
to niches that are not present. It's like Excel vs OO Calc. Yes, Calc can do
most of what Excel can do but it is the remaining few percent of functionality
that makes a non-solution for people. And it is a different subset for
different people. Just like with wp7 vs Android and iOS. What is so hard to
understand here?

------
vital101
Two months ago my contract was up with AT&T, so I decided "What the hell, I'm
going to purchase an iPhone(4)!". So I did. Turns out, after all the hype I
was completely underwhelmed by it. It's not that it's a bad phone, it's great.
It's just that the general OS feels tired to me. The interface. I ended up
playing with a Samsung Focus a few days later in the same AT&T store and
swapped my iPhone for it. I'm incredibly happy with this phone, and the Mango
update addressed many of my concerns. Microsoft did well on the core features
with this phone, which for a user like me is everything. I'm not a
particularly heavy app user, so the seeming lack of quality apps doesn't
bother me (even though there seems to have been an upturn in good apps
lately).

~~~
starwed
>It's just that the general OS feels tired to me.

What does this even mean?

~~~
MatthewPhillips
The OSX look is pretty old at this point. They've managed to update it in
spots but much of it is dreadfully ugly. Like this:

[http://admintell.napco.com/ee/images/uploads/appletell/bill-...](http://admintell.napco.com/ee/images/uploads/appletell/bill-
ios4-settings-320x480.PNG)

Note that Metro is pretty old too, it started with Windows Media Center, but
has changed a lot since then.

~~~
bluekeybox
Can you post a screenshot (or a link) to a similar page from an OS that
doesn't look tired to you? Not criticizing you -- just want to know what you
think.

~~~
untog
Can't speak for the OP, but the WP7 interface does not look tired to me:

[http://blog.tmcnet.com/blog/tom-keating/images/windows-
phone...](http://blog.tmcnet.com/blog/tom-keating/images/windows-phone-7.jpg)

That home screen is the perfect mix of iPhone (structured, but with minimal
ability to display info) and Android (stacked with widgets, but a mess layout-
wise).

The UI in WP7 is incredibly person-centric- I look up their entry in the phone
book, it shows me their updates on various social networks, as well as a
"history" tab that aggregates all our chats, e-mails and text messages into
one list. It's very slick.

~~~
Gormo
That shot of WP7 also looks a _lot_ less functional than the above one of iOS.
Apple's interface is well-organized; the purpose of each screen element and
the results a user should expect from manipulating it are fairly clear and
unambiguous.

The WP7 UI seems to be following Microsoft's recent "haphazard grid of
inconsistent elements" approach, which works about as well as the ribbon.

~~~
untog
How do you figure that? The WP7 tile list is a list of apps, just the same as
iOS icons. Except that apps can push a hell of a lot more information onto
their tiles than iOS apps can to their icons. I struggle to see how that is
less functional.

~~~
Gormo
With the exception of the single number-bubble, iOS icons don't include
dynamic information on them, and therefore aren't regularly changing in
appearance.

The icon to run the photo viewer in WP7 appears to consist entirely of a
thumbnail of an image from your photo album. That means that every time you
take a new photo, the image changes.

Your contact list application itself contains a grid of thumbnails of contact
photos, which is a superfluous feature, and may cause a lot of confusion if
other applications also contain a grid of content thumbnails.

Pushing information onto tiles is itself one of the key usability problems
with WP7. The controls that you interact with to invoke functions should not
do double-duty as general-purpose info delivery systems. Apple gets this
right; the ability of controls to convey information is limited to conveying
state information that indicates whether/when you need to interact with the
control itself, and the shape, placement, coloring, and imagery of the control
don't change for trivial reasons.

I understand the visual appeal of the Metro UI, but ultimately, this is
supposed to be a functional user interface, not a Mondrian print.

------
nemik
Does it bother anyone else that he hasn't really given any reasons why it's
the first device he'd switch to from an iPhone? Is it OS, battery life, UI?
What about it would make it his first choice?

All he does is whine about market conditions and reasons it will fail.

------
Freestyler_3
If no one dares to make the jump, it isn't going to happen. You should make
apps for this phone if it really is promising. Why would you want to be at the
end of the line when you can be first. Okay there is the risk that it's going
to be a short line, but what if it isn't. What if this phone becomes
successful and you are way ahead already making apps for it. If we would all
sit and wait for everything, nothing will happen.

------
iaskwhy
I haven't tried it but I believe there might be life even without apps. There
are a couple of things Windows Phone 7 might do better: dedicated camera
button (does anyone do the double tap to use the camera on the iPhone? I can't
remember doing it most of the times.) and better notifications via the home
screen. It would be enough for me to change if I needed to (which I don't,
iPhone 4 is the best device I ever had).

------
aratupe
I think the article title says it all. The author has NOT, in fact, switched.

/story

------
pilif
... also it runs internet explorer bringing the pains of having to do non-
standard web development hacks to the mobile world too. So from my very
selfish perspective, I really hope, Windows Mobile will never really take off
so that I don't have to really deal with Internet Explorer Mobile.

~~~
wofser
Windows Phone 7 uses IE9 and that is a darned good browser.

I dont know what browser Windows Mobile uses but its irrelevant since Windows
Phone 7 replaced it.

~~~
rimantas

      darned good browser.
    

…compared to IE7. Is it not a mix of IE7 and IE9?

~~~
freehunter
Pre-Mango update, it was a mix of IE7 and IE8. After the Mango update, it's
IE9's rendering engine, which gives it HTML5 capabilities.

