
A call to arms: Helping Internet services accept anonymous users - erkose
https://blog.torproject.org/blog/call-arms-helping-internet-services-accept-anonymous-users
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fchollet
It's worth noting that HN is among the websites that remove functionality for
Tor users (eg. registration). Despite all the talk on surveillance and
anonymity on here, HN does not make it possible to express opinions or reveal
information under real anonymity.

~~~
sp332
HN sometimes disables registration entirely. It's an experiment in creating a
large, long-lived community that doesn't degenerate over time. It's not
primarily a platform that promotes free speech.

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jacquesm
Instead of calling upon others to push yet others to accept anonymous users
why not rebuild these services and show the world how easy it is to deal with
anonymous users wreaking havoc on your website?

~~~
bicknergseng
Not to mention the total absence of anonymous user monetization strategies.

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erik123
Yes, this entire privacy scare is an opportunity to get rid of the advert-
based business model and offer the opportunity to privacy-conscious users to
get the same or a better service, in exchange for a few bitcoin cents, instead
of getting tracked so that the jackals can better precision-bomb you with
false commercial messages.

~~~
dspillett
_> to get rid of the advert-based business model and offer the opportunity to
privacy-conscious users to get the same or a better service, in exchange for a
few bitcoin cents_

Great in theory, but people in general do not understand the advertising model
or just don't care enough about being tracked that the micro-payment
alternative is attractive to them (even if there is a method of making it
essentially anonymous and untrackable). I'd be happy to pay small amounts for
an ad-free un-tracked experience, as may you, but we are in a minority small
enough that it isn't worth chasing (and to be frank, I'm cynical enough to not
believe I won't be tracked (more than just to ensure I got what the payment
covered) even if I did pay...

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joesmo
I have encountered this even on forums that insist on having all posts be
"anonymous" (usernames are anonymized). It was a rather sad experience to not
be able to get help with a medical condition I had at the time simply because
I wanted to be truly anonymous while posting about this rather stigmatized
condition.

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dredmorbius
The sad truth is that for large classes of Internet abuse, IP is a pretty
strong indicator of reputation, positive or negative, and the reputation of an
unknown (which includes exit nodes of VPNs and Tor nodes) tend to be well
below average.

Any _content_ based semantics are far more expensive than a DNS query (or
better: a local IP reputation table lookup). It's the online equivalent of
individual stereotyping based on obvious surface characteristics -- even if
only unevenly true, they're a cheap heuristic, and, as the saying goes, the
thing about stereotypes is that they often have an element of truth to them.

It's not just the big players who do this either. Lauren Weinstein, long-time
Internet privacy advocate, has taken to blocking entire TLDs which are
characterized by near total spam -- sorting out who's legit is just too much
work. And of course DULs are heavily used in email configurations -- very few
sites will accept email from such spaces.

I really like the idea of Tor and really wish it could be tractable, but
absent some alternate means of sorting out the good guys (and keeping bad
actors off of Tor, without penalizing others, _and_ remaining consistent with
goals of privacy and anonymity), that's going to be difficult.

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davidgerard
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Advice_to_users_usin...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Advice_to_users_using_Tor)

The trouble with Tor was that whereas Wikipedia edits from ordinary IPs were
only about half terrible, _most_ of what came from Tor was abuse. (Largely
obnoxious sockpuppetry, offensive usernames, etc.) They know perfectly well
this is the reason Tor is largely blocked from editing, they're pretending not
to know. Not addressing the actual reason comes across as disingenuous.

So, the discussions go: "WHY DO YOU HATE FREEDOM???" "Please stop urinating on
our carpet." "YOU JUST HATE FREEDOM!!"

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johnpmayer
Any site that uses Persona could be used anonymously through a trusted
identity provider that generates on-demand, expiring email addresses.

(sans traffic monitoring ofc)

~~~
gcr
That only works if a website has such a large userbase that many people use
the email service.

C.f. [http://xkcd.com/1105/](http://xkcd.com/1105/)

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Yardlink
Not just TOR but in China you have to use a VPN to access about half the
internet, and many sites restrict your access because you're connecting to
them from the VPN. Paypal threatened to ban me if I ever forgot to turn off
the VPN or accidentally withdrew money while in the wrong country.

Maybe the solution is more people using TOR and VPNs so sites will have to
face losing their audience if they don't accommodate them.

