
Regarding Reuters’s report that Apple dropped plan for encrypting iCloud backups - coloneltcb
https://daringfireball.net/2020/01/reuters_report_on_apple_dropping_plan_for_encrypted_icloud_backups
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manicdee
For the non-US folks like me, iCloud was a non-option from the start due to
data sovereignty. I am already skating on thin ice by sharing calendars
between devices using iCloud.

The way Apple can best address the privacy issue while still providing easy
backups is to build the iCloud backup functionality into macOS or Apple TV,
with facilities to provide rsync-style backups of encrypted volumes to generic
online storage services, of which Apple can be one provider.

I want something like Western Digital’s “My Cloud” devices, but supporting
Time Machine as first class citizen (eg using rsync) not via mounting a disk
image.

~~~
pfranz
In general, I think Apple's former ideology was "the computer was the hub"
back when the iPod was popular. At least 10-15 years ago that's transitioned
towards "the cloud is the hub" (I can imagine a bunch of reasons). The old
behavior has stuck around, but not really added to and I wouldn't be surprised
if it was soon dropped. I think the discontinuation of "Time Capsule" is an
example of this.

As another example, you can do backups via iTunes. Generally this was done
when you plugged in your device. They did add syncing over wifi, but it's
never been very rock solid and afaik you can't automate it since your never
plugging in your device. Every time local backups get brought up people say,
"but not everyone has a computer" which reenforces the focus on cloud backups.

~~~
manicdee
> Every time local backups get brought up people say, "but not everyone has a
> computer" which reenforces the focus on cloud backups.

Which is why I would like to see the focus on migrating this functionality to
their non-“computer” devices. Or add a separate device specifically to add
this feature.

Also the iTunes/Finder backup only works locally, can’t be used when I buy a
new device to configure it while in the shop.

~~~
pfranz
> Which is why I would like to see the focus on migrating this functionality
> to their non-“computer” devices. Or add a separate device specifically to
> add this feature.

I think that attempt was the AirPort Time Capsule (2008-2018). I'm sure it
would have added standalone iPhone backup and other functionality if there was
a strong audience.

> Also the iTunes/Finder backup only works locally, can’t be used when I buy a
> new device to configure it while in the shop.

Apple has had various "p2p" solutions. For awhile it was a physical device
that would effectively do a backup & restore to a new device. More recently
there's a wireless way to transition your phone that you can do yourself.

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parliament32
>Surely there are hundreds, maybe thousands, of people every day who need to
access their iCloud backups who do not remember their password. The fact that
Apple can help them is a benefit to those users.

Wait, so how does this work right now? "Hey I promise I'm so-and-so, here's a
totally-not-doctored scan of my passport, can you go ahead and send me
_literally every conversation, photo, calendar event, note and file I 've
downloaded_ since I've been in the Apple ecosystem? Thanks"

That's terrifying.

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musicale
If this bad publicity doesn't get Apple to offer encryption for iCloud
backups, I don't know what will.

~~~
MaysonL
They used to offer it, but found that more people were hurt by loss of
passwords (i.e. fail-secure backups) than were hurt by hacking. People who
lose all their family photos because they forgot their password get very angry
and sad, and it happens more often than you might think. I believe they
switched back in 2015 or so.

~~~
McAtNite
I don’t buy that defense. They could set it up to function exactly like local
encryption on your Mac.

When encrypting the drive it has you set your passcode. Then it tells you in
plain English that you can let them store a decryption key for you in case you
forget the passcode or you can store the decryption key yourself and risk
losing access to your files if you lose it.

It’s simple, easy to understand, and allows the user to decide what sort of
security they are comfortable with.

~~~
bradknowles
When I first enabled iTunes cloud backups years ago, it did exactly that —
gave me the choice of letting them securely store a copy of my cloud
encryption key, just in case.

I didn’t take that option, but the option was there.

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chmaynard
> For at least the last decade, Apple has offered truly secure encrypted local
> backups of iOS devices, using iTunes on a Mac or PC.

I don't see a citation for this claim. How do we know if this is correct?
Trust but verify.

> ... for most iPhone and iPad users it’s irrelevant, because they never
> connect their devices to a Mac or PC, and the overwhelming majority of them
> surely have no idea that the feature even exists.

That's precisely why Reuters didn't mention iCloud in its headline. For almost
all iOS device owners, backup means iCloud backup.

~~~
codys
iTunes/local backup works over WiFi without connecting the iOS device via usb.

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banku_brougham
The author’s hypothesis of how the FBI discussion happened is naive, seeming
almost like a straw man. Here’s what happened — Apple and FBI have been locked
in combat for years over this issue. Surely they’ve been served with National
Security letters, and had the full weight of the government pressing on them.

Apple was forced to compromise, and iCloud is pretty much everything.

~~~
machello13
I think you mistook his point. He's not arguing that Apple didn't acquiesce to
the FBI, he's just pointing out how ridiculous the idea is that Apple reached
out to the FBI to discuss future product plans (which is what Reuters says
happened).

