
I’ll never bring my phone on an international flight again - quincyla
https://medium.freecodecamp.com/ill-never-bring-my-phone-on-an-international-flight-again-neither-should-you-e9289cde0e5f#.58zrgizib
======
slyall
I read the comments here and I'm reminded of a Tweet I read yesterday:

"Next programmer bro who explains his clever travel information security hack
has to change his name to Mohamed Hussein Ali and try it at LAX"

[https://twitter.com/thegrugq/status/831316334973579264](https://twitter.com/thegrugq/status/831316334973579264)

------
helpfulanon
Fun fact - the "border zone" in which your 4th amendment rights are suspended
and you are subject to search, is 100 miles wide and overlaps where the
majority of Americans live and work

[https://www.aclu.org/other/constitution-100-mile-border-
zone](https://www.aclu.org/other/constitution-100-mile-border-zone)

~~~
temp-dude-87844
Every time I see this map (which, AFAIK, is a visualization by the ACLU and
not based on an official government publication) I wonder why Chicago and the
coastline of Lake Michigan is included. The border with Canada runs diagonally
down the length of Lake Superior, clears the Straits of Mackinac by at least
40 miles, and then continues southeast along Lake Huron to Sarnia and Detroit.

The entirety of Lake Michigan is within the borders of the US, so while this
entire "100-mile border zone" business is bizarre enough as it is, it's truly
disingenuous to include the lower Lake Michigan coastline. It makes me wonder
if this is an interpretational liberty taken solely by the ACLU, or if the
government's demonstrated behavior truly justifies what is shown on the map.

~~~
maxerickson
If you are sailing you apparently you only cross the border when you dock your
boat.

[http://www.great-lakes-sailing.com/canada_us_border.html](http://www.great-
lakes-sailing.com/canada_us_border.html)

I guess sailing from the Canadian shores of Huron to somewhere in Michigan
wouldn't be all that weird.

------
gyger
I suggest mentioning in the title that it concerns the US-border, I travelled
across a lot of international borders, that didn't care. Only some
international borders are a problem, one of these, the US one.

~~~
ThrustVectoring
I know of companies that do not allow employees to bring work devices into
China. That's probably a somewhat different issue of industrial espionage,
though.

~~~
type0
Then I'm sure US is doing fine in that regard, because american agencies are
morally superior to be involved in such a thing, cogh, cogh...

------
rch
Phones should load different profiles based on the password provided, with
some activity logged across profiles so none of them appear stale.

~~~
Spooky23
You're implying that people should behave in a manner that is a serious felony
in the United States and likely other places.

~~~
sosborn
Honest question: How is that a felony? I have multiple profiles on my home
machine. Does that make me a felon?

~~~
Spooky23
If you are asked to produce the contents of your property and provide access
to a subset of that property, that will be interpreted as either hindering
official action or lying to a federal agent. Lying to a federal agent is a
felony.

From the customs agent and legal point of view, there is no distinction
between hiding a secret compartment in your luggage and a device.

~~~
scintill76
> there is no distinction between hiding a secret compartment in your luggage
> and a device

Is it really illegal to have a secret compartment in your luggage? I mean, I
have no doubt it's highly risky and that they will make the case you've done
something wrong, but have you inherently done something illegal by merely
having a secret compartment? Maybe only if you've explicitly represented that
there are no other compartments? Or you've got contraband in there, or
something else they've explicitly inquired about that you claimed you don't
have? (But that's more about lying or existing laws, than the compartment
itself.)

If you turned over your phone for inspection and could see they were looking
in an app you don't use, are you committing a felony to not volunteer that
they should look in the other browser for your real history or whatever? If
having two profiles and only providing one is illegal, what about having two
phones? (like your "real" one in your luggage, turned off.) Do I have to
volunteer that when they asked for "my phone" that I actually have multiple?
What if I kept the "real" one at home -- do I have to tell them the one
they're looking at is only a subset of my property and doesn't represent what
they probably actually meant when they asked for "my phone"?

I'm not entirely sure where "the lines" are here, but perhaps the passcode is
part of it. Once they require that, they've crossed from dealing with physical
items physically crossing the border, passing into things that are in your
mind or physically located elsewhere. If they can require a lockscreen code,
there's not really any reason they can't require every other password since
those are "secret compartments" accessible from your phone, and if just having
an undisclosed compartment really is illegal, I guess you'd better volunteer
an exhaustive list of all your accounts...

~~~
Spooky23
If you have a desire to do some civil disobedience re some law that you have a
beef with, the customs area of a port of entry is a really bad place to start.

In many cases, the customs people have discretion to not admit you for a
variety of reasons. There's a tension between the process around physical
goods and digital data that isn't clearly understood by the law. Until the law
is more firmly established, you're better off not carrying stuff you care
about.

------
nkrisc
Until you're detained for not having a phone to turn over. I'm only half
joking.

~~~
trome
I recommend having a few $5 Androids on ya, they are both fun to play with,
handy, and will throw inquisitive 3 letter agencies for a loop.

~~~
psybin
"Is this the phone you use on a day to day basis"\- felony if you lie.

~~~
exhilaration
Option 1: "No, I left my phone at home."

Option 2: If you're at the US border and a US citizen, "Sir, I'm an American
citizen and just want want to get home" \-- citizens can't be blocked from re-
entering at the border.

~~~
dsp1234
re: Option 2

Define "blocked". Because Sidd Bikkannavar's recent experience tells a
different story[0].

"The document given to Bikkannavar listed a series of consequences for failure
to offer information that would allow CBP to copy the contents of the device.
“I didn’t really want to explore all those consequences,” he says. “It
mentioned detention and seizure.”"

[0] - [http://www.theverge.com/2017/2/12/14583124/nasa-sidd-
bikkann...](http://www.theverge.com/2017/2/12/14583124/nasa-sidd-bikkannavar-
detained-cbp-phone-search-trump-travel-ban)

~~~
canadian_voter
Do you think this is the document he was handed?

[https://www.cbp.gov/sites/default/files/documents/inspection...](https://www.cbp.gov/sites/default/files/documents/inspection-
electronic-devices-tearsheet.pdf)

A few highlights:

 _You may be subject to an inspection for a variety of reasons, some of which
include: [...] you have been selected for a random search. "_

 _You’re receiving this sheet because your electronic device(s) has been
detained for further examination, which may include copying._

 _CBP may retain documents or information relating to immigration, customs,
and other enforcement matters only if such retention is consistent with the
privacy and data protection standards of the system in which such information
is retained. Otherwise, if after reviewing the information, there exists no
probable cause to seize it, CBP will not retain any copies._

------
antisthenes
I have a prepaid plan that only works in the US anyway.

I never bring my US phone on international travel, because it just won't work.
Instead, I carry a cheap Chinese GSM phone that's wiped before every trip and
preloaded with some music and entertainment videos (TV Shows, etc.)

I buy the sim-card at my destination and throw it away when I go back to the
States.

I'm not sure this solves anything, but then again, I don't work for a company
that makes me required to be able to access sensitive data from any point in
the world. YMMV.

------
colemannugent
This might have been suggested before, but I think it's novel enough to
repeat:

You should be able to create two passwords for all devices. One, your
password, would allow you to use the device normally, the other, your
lastword, would start a silent erasure of the device. The device could even
present a fake successful authentication, like dumping you to some fake
desktop, while it erases your data.

While in this case it would not really benefit someone in situations like US
border crossings who have almost no rights, I think it would be very effective
at discouraging attempts to force people to divulge their passwords, as the
person entering the lastword would effectively be informing the device that it
was under attack. With something like this I would think that questioning
people for their passwords would be pointless.

~~~
outworlder
And then you get prosecuted for destruction of evidence, obstruction of
justice and whatever else they can come up with.

As said in other threads, the solution is not technology.

~~~
colemannugent
This assumes that law enforcement actually knows you will have evidence.

If the technology could remove everything that would be incriminating and
leave benign data you would just be another non-techie traveler.

~~~
eridius
They don't need to know you have evidence. All they need to know is that you
deliberately caused them to erase your device under the guise of unlocking it.
Which means your device _could have had_ evidence, and now you've made it
impossible to prove that it didn't.

~~~
idbehold
The burden of proof is still on them, no?

~~~
eridius
IANAL, but I don't think so. They don't have to prove that the data you just
wiped contained evidence of wrongdoing, they just have to prove that you wiped
the data after they asked for it. That's kind of the point of "destruction of
evidence". If they already knew the contents of the data, they wouldn't
actually need it, now would they?

------
spaghetti-guy
Signed up to pose two questions :-

1/ I legitimately do not know a lot of my usernames and passwords. I sign up
with a unique email that includes the name of the site (I'm not particularly
religious about the format of this and usually end up checking previous email
to figure it out). Passwords are saved in Chrome and I mostly don't remember
them. I'm sure I am not unique. Where would one stand with this scenario?

2/ Wherever I can, I use a U2F device as a second factor. Could one be
compelled to provide this along with the passwords (providing I can remember
them)? Where would one stand if the key was unavailable - i.e. lost/left at
home? Assuming they have a PC nearby for checking your social media accounts,
I'd very much doubt it had it's USB ports enabled so, even if I did provide
it, I would suggest they probably couldn't use it. Is there any documented
precedent for how this is handled?

------
oAlbe
_> Since most of our private data is stored in the cloud — and not on
individual devices — you could also reset your phone to its factory settings
[...] Then if you’re asked to hand it over, there won’t be any personal data
on your phone_

This makes me wonder: is it true? Is the data truly unrecoverable if you
factory-reset your phone? I doubt so. But maybe there's some special tool to
truly wipe a device (say like the equivalent of DBAN)

~~~
psybin
At least on an iPhone, erased is erased. On android some versions use full
disk encryption but many do not, it's a guess.

~~~
ajross
It's not a "guess". The last Android release that lacked support for block-
device-level encryption was KitKat, which shipped in 2013. Any device being
advertised with the "Android" trademark (to be fair: AOSP-based clone OSes
like Amazon's have been slower to evolve) over the last two years has that
support.

Please don't hijack an important security discussion to engage in meaningless
platform flamage. Users with Android phones have this available and they
should enable it, not be told that they need to "guess".

~~~
oAlbe
I have some questions actually. Is it something you need to enable on Android?
I seem to understand from the comment above yours that iOS has this enabled by
default. If so, how do you actually enable it?

~~~
psybin
Yes, it's impossible to disable the disk encryption on iOS. If you don't set a
passcode, the disk is still encrypted (but only with a per device key), this
prevents recovery of data after an erase.

------
andr
I'm interested to see how Apple will react to this, given their history with
the FBI. Right now, you can connect your iPhone to a computer and get all the
information off it - doesn't matter if you are iTunes or Cellebrite. It'd be
good to have a permanent way to disable this ability in the future, so that
your phone data cannot be siphoned out, even if you provide the PIN. Of
course, that's not the only way for data to be extracted, but all other
options would be considerably slower and less practical.

~~~
eridius
Apparently there already is. It's called Pair Locking, and it's something you
can do with Apple's Configurator software. Forensic data dumpers use the same
functionality that iTunes uses to talk to the phone, which uses a process
called "pairing", and Pair Locking makes it so the device refuses to establish
any new pairs.

------
lamerman
"And you can bet that countries like China and Russia aren’t far behind" \- I
am a Russian citizen and I cross the border of Russia very frequently and I
cannot agree with the statement. The worse thing I've been asked about was
"what is the goal of your trip". Getting your phone on the border of Russia is
something impossible, it's just unimaginable. I've never been asked to show
anything except for my passport. At least now and for the time before this
moment.

------
effingwewt
How sad that by now it's far easier to simply mail your stuff to yourself,
pick it up on arrival to destination, and mail it back to your house before
departing. I am beginning to hate my country so bad I can't wait to get out.
It feels nothing like the country I grew up in.

------
nojvek
In this age of digital instant copy, Facebook has made a lot of things the
norm. I watch TV shows and cyber stalking is seen as normal.

A good friend of mine was blackmailed by her boyfriend that her sensitive
pictures would be released on the Internet if she didn't return his calls. It
was the first time she realized that what was considered silly can really be
very serious. She deleted her Facebook and Twitter account.

I really want to see a big hack, sort of a global financial crisis level on
the surveillance govt is collecting for people to realize this shit can really
fuck society up.

------
hysan
If your rights are suspended at the border, then whose rule of law does apply?
Clearly not the US, then would it be the neighboring country like Canada? Or
is it some sort of no mans land? With more and more of these stories bringing
up the lack of 4th and 5th Amendment rights, I'm becoming curious as to what
can legally happen at the border. How would common crimes be handled in this
area?

------
greenyouse
Once customs and border patrol is holding you is there any way to back out?
Could you say something like "Uh... I think I'm just not going to enter right
now."?

(then back up your data, ship the computer device with an insurance policy,
and give the border crossing another shot)

~~~
outworlder
Certainly, 6 months later, when you are cleared for a hearing after getting
deported to who knows where.

Don't try shenanigans at the border.

~~~
greenyouse
OK, fair enough. Maybe just plan to not have your device like the article
says.

------
aplomb
If you have a Nexus Android phone, just change to guest mode or add another
user. It's a seldom used feature and limits what people can see or do with
your primary account - inspectors are unlikely to know as it's fairly low-key
when users are swapped

~~~
pfarnsworth
But if they do know, that's a good way to get yourself banned from entering
the country for lying to a border guard.

------
DanHulton
My current plan is to wipe my phone before travel and restore it on
destination. Nothing to unlock because there's no phone there.

Forcing you to restore your entire account is a whole 'nother level beyond
simple forcing you to unlock your phone.

~~~
maxxxxx
How do you do that with an Android phone? With iOS this seems pretty easy

~~~
hrehhf
I have used the Android development tools to make backups over USB and it is
fast. You can install just the command-line tools from
[https://developer.android.com/studio/index.html#downloads](https://developer.android.com/studio/index.html#downloads)
and use:

    
    
        adb backup -apk -shared -all -f backupname.ab
        adb restore backupname.ab

~~~
abeyer
Though be aware that this won't backup everything. (at least on a non-rooted
device)

Notably, if you use google authenticator for 2FA, it won't backup and you'll
restore a device that will no longer work as your second factor.

~~~
hrehhf
Thanks, that is good to know. I wish there was something as easy as the iTunes
backup for iPhones. There are Android apps that claim to do a more thorough
job but I haven't tried them.

~~~
maxxxxx
Titanium backup for a rooted device works great. If you have access to
recovery you can also do a Nandroid backup which gives you 100% restore
capability.

For non rooted this seems very tricky, that's why I asked. Most likely you
will spend hours getting your phone to work again.

------
janstenpickle
OK, those of us who know better travel without phones, what about people who
don't know better but have received information from me? The data about me on
their phone cannot be protected by me.

------
js2
_They may choose to detain you anyway, and force you to give them passwords to
various accounts manually. But there’s no easy way for them to know which
services you use and which services you don’t use, or whether you have
multiple accounts._

This would seem to imply lying, or at least deceiving, a federal agent. IANAL,
but
[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Making_false_statements](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Making_false_statements)

~~~
ruslan_talpa
Well ... two can play that game "any matter within the jurisdiction" of the
federal government of the United States and since you are not in that
jurisdiction this does not seem to appply :)

------
capote
It would be nice if there were a feature built in to phones to facilitate
this. Like, on the lock screen, an emergency wipe button that runs a procedure
you specify (log you out of everything, obfuscate which services you subscribe
to, etc) and this way as you're going through customs, you can gauge your risk
and at any point you feel uncomfortable, you discreetly click your button
before smoothly handing over your phone and password with a warm smile.

~~~
psybin
The area you are frog marched into is strictly no devices allowed, if they see
you with any electronics in your hand you will be pounced upon. This is very
obviously because people try to destroy evidence they have on their devices
once they discover they are screwed.

~~~
jedberg
They claim to be device free, but yet everyone has their phones out texting
and doing email as they wait in line. I've _never_ seen a border agent even
say anything, much less march someone away.

As long as you aren't taking pictures of the procedures they don't really
care.

~~~
psybin
The waiting line for immigration/customs is not the area I'm talking about,
this area is where you go once you fail the initial screening. In some
international airports like Sydney you will receive a $300 on the spot fine if
you have your phone in your hand, they're serious about it.

~~~
ue_
Australia does have some outrageous laws, so I suppose they want you not to be
destroying the things that are governed by those laws on your phone. But I'd
rather take the fine than have them find out, if I had such things.

------
accountface
They can detain me indefinitely if they want, I will never give my pin to
border security. I'm not going to bend to this bullshit by not carrying a
phone.

~~~
korethr
It's easy to say that now. When the pressure's actually on and a person now
has things at stake, priorities can change, and yielding starts to look like
the eminently sensible thing to do.

I suspect your tune may change when you find yourself in indefinite detention,
have missed your connecting flight, and your family/friend/spouse/boss has
called said phone and been told by CBP that you're refusing to comply with an
investigation.

~~~
accountface
No.

If my peers find it acceptable that I am detained indefinitely simply for not
unlocking my phone, then throw away the key because all is lost.

------
yakshaving_jgt
“Land of the free.”

------
yawz
_> Then if you’re asked to hand it over, there won’t be any personal data on
your phone_

That would probably look even more suspicious.

------
jdalgetty
When someone creates a dumb phone with a great camera and GPS this won't be a
problem for a lot of travellers.

------
taylodl
Seems to me Apple and Google should be working on "roaming profiles." You can
reset your phone to factory settings, or even get a rental phone at your
destination, and then quickly restore it from your profile. After all it's the
data you're interested in, not the device per se.

~~~
eridius
How is that any different than just backing up to iCloud and restoring it to a
new device?

------
pfarnsworth
Can border agents force me to reveal my personal email address and password?

------
Tepix
Feature Request: set auto-wipe on your phone that cleans it unless you enter
your cancellation code within the next x hours.

------
brachistochron
I had same strange situation a week ago when passing Ukraine border. Whats
purpose of this?

------
DigitalJack
I wish Apple would have a duress password that when entered would wipe the
phone.

------
dudul
The factory reset seems more practical to me than leaving your phone at home.

~~~
trome
Also, carry multiple phones of the same model. I've been throwing my main
phone anywhere besides in plain view and carrying a couple $5 Androids in my
pockets instead when going thru TSA, better they try to search one of them
than my main phone buried in my bag next to 2 others that look just like it.

~~~
scrumper
Keep in mind that it's a felony to lie to a customs & border patrol officer.
"Is this your main phone?" How will you answer that?

~~~
digler999
> "Is this your main phone?"

This is my main phone I use when crossing constitution-free zones.

> it's a felony to lie to a customs & border patrol officer

That makes me _livid_ : "Oh, sorry, the constitutional laws (that apply to
_us_ ) don't apply here, see it's not technically the US because reasons."
[lies to officer] "FELONY!".

~~~
eridius
Why does that make you livid? Did you think you don't have to obey any laws
simply because you're at a border? I guarantee you it's still a felony to
murder someone there, so why would lying to a federal agent be any different?

~~~
digler999
Because the purpose of law is to _protect people_. The purpose of murder laws
is to _protect_ people from the act of murder. The purpose of constitutional
law is to _protect people_ from tyranny.

~~~
eridius
I don't understand what point you're trying to make. My point is that you
can't reasonably claim that all laws go out the window just because some
constitutional protections are suspended. Saying that it should be legal to
lie to a federal agent under those circumstances is roughly equivalent to
saying it should be legal to murder said federal agent under those
circumstances (which is obviously not true).

~~~
digler999
you: "murder == lying"

me: "no it's not"

I don't claim "all laws go out the window". No clue how you reached that
conclusion.

~~~
eridius
The only other conclusion is that you think that the law against making false
statements is somehow special and it alone should be thrown out under those
circumstances. But there's no reason why that particular law should be
special, so the much more straightforward assumption is that you think laws in
general shouldn't apply in those circumstances.

------
setikites
Why not ship your phone to yourself at your destination?

------
inestyne
Try 'I am a born in America citizen on american soil, I want to talk to my
lawyer, no i'm not giving you my password. No I won't tell you why.'

