
The Zombie Preacher of Somerset (2009) - gwern
http://lesswrong.com/lw/69/the_zombie_preacher_of_somerset/
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joe_the_user
The thing about this is that a "philosophical zombie" actually is expected to
be absolutely indistinguishable from the outside from an ordinary person[1].
This person's stated self-reflection violates that and so this person couldn't
be philosophical zombie - or at least couldn't be deduced to be p-zombie
because of this behavior.

Given that the concept is basically utterly dull - there literally "nothing to
see here" \- I understand the impulse to liven it up by conflating a zombie-
like-person or person-who-says-they're-a-zombie with a p-zombie. But it's more
reasonable to discard the idea of immeasurable, inherent, atomic
consciousness/qualia/satience as something useful to consider and look at
measurable, meaningful versions of these labels.

And by the end of the article the author admits his example is an "imperfect
p-zombie" but I think that entirely misses the point of p-zombies, which
absolute hypothetical constructs or they are something else entirely.

"A philosophical zombie or p-zombie in the philosophy of mind and perception
is a hypothetical being that is indistinguishable from a normal human being
except in that it lacks conscious experience, qualia, or sentience. For
example, a philosophical zombie could be poked with a sharp object, and not
feel any pain sensation, but yet, behave exactly as if it does feel pain (it
may say "ouch" and recoil from the stimulus, or say that it is in intense
pain)" [1]
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosophical_zombie](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosophical_zombie)

~~~
cbd1984
> or at least couldn't be deduced to be p-zombie because of this behavior.

But that's rather the point of the p-zombie concept: Anything you can do, they
can do just as well, to all outwards appearances, it's just that they don't
have the true deep awareness of doing that you do... You _do_ have that,
right? You sure? _Really_ sure?

So there's no objective test which can distinguish between you and a p-zombie,
but there's still a difference. Poking into the nature of that difference is
either blasphemy or contrary to the spirit of the thing, your choice.

~~~
hugh4
> So there's no objective test which can distinguish between you and a
> p-zombie

Oh there is for _me_ , just not for anyone else. I know I'm conscious, but I
don't necessarily expect anyone else to believe it.

~~~
cbd1984
> I know I'm conscious

Ah, but do you really?

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unclebucknasty
Possibly among other things, it sounds like he was suffering from extreme
depersonalization. It's a dissociative state that can present after a
traumatic event, then persist.

