

Help wanted: Seasoned wikipedia editors to write a proper article about Fravia - pygy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Fravia
A mourning friend of Fravia, new to Wikipedia, is trying to write an article about him, but his lack of experience triggered the heavy hand of admins, and the article is currently a semi-protected minimal stub.
I didn't know Fravia until yesterday, so I'm in a bad position to help him personaly, besides trying to explain him the local, arid rules, but it's a bit hard to explain that to a man in sorrow. The stub is here : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fravia, and the WIP article here : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Fravia/WIP
On a related note, there seems to be little reliable information (in the Wikipedia meaning of reliable) about Fravia. He was more of an underground hero.
Having an eulogy or a tribute published in a respected publication may help sourcing the article. I know it's silly to have an eulogy written only for that purpose, but Wikipedia has become the default knowledge repository, and it would be a shame not to have an article about him. If (the friend of) a high profile hacker who knew or was influenced by Fravia read this, it would be nice if he could do something about it.
======
pygy
A mourning friend of Fravia, new to Wikipedia, is trying to write an article
about him, but his lack of experience triggered the heavy hand of admins, and
the article is currently a semi-protected minimal stub. I didn't know Fravia
until yesterday, so I'm in a bad position to help him personaly, besides
trying to explain him the local, arid rules, but it's a bit hard to explain
that to a man in sorrow. The stub is here :
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fravia>, and the WIP article here :
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Fravia/WIP>

On a related note, there seems to be little reliable information (in the
Wikipedia meaning of reliable) about Fravia. He was more of an underground
hero.

Having an eulogy or a tribute published in a respected publication may help
sourcing the article. I know it's silly to have an eulogy written only for
that purpose, but Wikipedia has become the default knowledge repository, and
it would be a shame not to have an article about him. If (the friend of) a
high profile hacker who knew or was influenced by Fravia read this, it would
be nice if he could do something about it.

~~~
pygy
Fravia knew RMS personally. Daniel at Wikipedia suggested to contact him for
writing a tribute.

Is there someone here who knows RMS?

~~~
tjr
I sent him some information on the matter.

~~~
pygy
Thank you!

~~~
tjr
No problem. Richard has sent the request for help on to some people who knew
Fravia better than he did.

~~~
rms
If he ever wants to post here he can have his proper username...

------
narag
A little suggestions: the people who knew him personaly could start putting
_factual_ information that they have easier access to: his real name, exact
birth and death date, where he was born, where he studied, where he lived,
someone famous in his family.

Other facts that would help: when his pages were published for the first time,
who helped with hosting, when he decided to change cracking content for
searching stuff, etc.

He gave some talks at conferences and knew some famous people. Who, when,
where? The family can assist with references. Don't forget to keep searching
Google: people that knew him could be writing right now something that could
be accepted as a reference.

And don't be confrontational with wikipedists! They seem to be taking a
constructive approach.

------
spatulon
Good luck, but I think it will be very difficult. I added the bit about DVD
Jon a few days ago, but was unable to find anything else even remotely
resembling a reliable source. If a passing reference to Fravia on DVD Jon's
blog is the best source we have, then the article is in trouble.

------
tptacek
Just a suggestion: it's a really bad idea to justify arguments on Wikipedia by
saying you're trying to memorialize someone.

<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:ISNOT>

Also, while Fravia's own site is a reliable source for raw facts about Fravia,
it's not a reliable source that establishes his notability. Nor is there any
such thing as a "Google Test" for notability (that argument gets tried and
fails in AfD's every day), nor is the "number of people trying to edit the
page" a reliable indicator of notability.

~~~
pygy
Zorbid talking here, actually :-).

I know all of that, and, for the best of me, I try to play by the rules, and
to give proper arguments for my views.

------
rchase
Here's a source (german):
<http://events.ccc.de/2009/05/06/sigint-2009-fravia/>

Somewhat skinny on details, but it's a start and mentions several other
potential sources.

Google translation: <http://bit.ly/qNv0K>

I have neither the time nor inclination to aid in creating the Wikipedia page,
but am very interested in seeing it done well.

-R

~~~
pygy
Thanks a lot. I expanded the article according to the post you provided.

------
whacked_new
Just wanted to say thanks for your effort, as a +Fravia semi-fan

