
337 whales dead in Chile in one of history's biggest beachings - benologist
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/dec/01/chile-337-whales-beached-stranding
======
danieltillett
I actually see this as a positive as it means the whale numbers are making a
great comeback now that (most) nations have stopped hunting them. Here in
Australia the humpback whale is back from 200 to 26,000 just on the east coast
alone [1].

1\. [http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-08-27/humpback-whale-
populat...](http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-08-27/humpback-whale-population-
shows-no-sign-of-slowing-down/6728660)

~~~
pbhjpbhj
Isn't the problem with such interventions that returning a species to previous
population levels can great an imbalance? What predates this species; are the
predators able to keep the levels down such that this species doesn't boom and
wipe out its food source?

Any sudden dramatic changes in population seem like causes for ecological
concern.

~~~
SideburnsOfDoom
> What predates this species?

Not much. This is pretty common, large animals are often at the top of the
food chain

[http://www.whateats.com/what-eats-a-whale](http://www.whateats.com/what-eats-
a-whale)

[http://www.whalefacts.org/do-blue-whales-have-
predators/](http://www.whalefacts.org/do-blue-whales-have-predators/)

------
Dwolb
This is so sad. I'm surprised the team were able to rule out human
intervention as whale beachings have been linked to military sonar exercises
[1].

A human analogy I've read is to imagine if an alien spacecraft descended into
our atmosphere and played noises all day so loud that our ears bled. The
trauma would be so bad we might not have another choice but to end the
suffering.

[1] [http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2013/jul/03/whales-
fl...](http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2013/jul/03/whales-flee-
military-sonar-strandings)

~~~
mjlee
Certainly in the UK and, in my experience, around the world, military
exercised are programmed, confined to specific areas and certain emitters such
as sonar are carefully logged.

That said, we know little about how currents and water bodies move so I'm sure
these researchers have something more concrete.

~~~
dfc
You should check out "War of the Whales" if you are interested in the
interaction between whales and naval training exercises.

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erdojo
This kind of claim should require more documentation before publication.

Not that I don't believe it's possible, but you'd think pictures would be
readily available by now, and a more precise location. I can see holding back
right after the discovery, but six months later?

Also would have loved to know when the mass beaching took place. Lots of
tectonic activity in that area. Someone else mentioned sonar...would have
liked to see if the event could be cross-referenced with military exercises.

Hope this story is further vetted and explored.

~~~
dfc
Did you read the article? The article seems to demonstrate that the scientist
behind the publication wants to wait to discuss the details of the stranding
until the paper is released: "She declined to disclose the conclusions, which
will be published by a scientific journal later this year."

~~~
knughit
Ugh. Scientific journals are for archiving information, not embargoing news.

~~~
dfc
The fact that you failed to even give lip service to peer review is strange
maybe speaks to your understanding of professional science.

~~~
hueving
The fact that you think that's why people wait speaks to your naive view of
how academia works.

The only reason they are waiting and not releasing on a preprint like arxiv is
because the journal wants to force all citations through them and will reject
the paper if they see an early release. It's disgusting.

~~~
jldugger
Not really, the fact that it's not published is that they're afraid someone
else will read it do the research again, submit it somewhere else, and get it
published faster, at which point reviewers for
$Journal_With_Actual_Impact_Factor will simply state "doesn't this replicate
the recent findings? Rejected"

Which is why rosalind sat on her crystallographies, hoping to figure it out
herself. And why the Wellcome Trust requires academics publish all data within
6 months of collection in such ironclad language that even Elvisier has to
honor it: [https://www.elsevier.com/about/open-science/open-
access/agre...](https://www.elsevier.com/about/open-science/open-
access/agreements/elsevier-agreement-with-the-wellcome-trust)

------
codezero
So, serious question. Why can't Japan use these whales for their research
instead of killing more?

~~~
oneJob
"research"

Also. This is sad effin news. And that's your response?

~~~
codezero
yes, air quotes are implicit, but the Japanese who do this research probably
believe whole heartedly in its necessity – it's worth having empathy for
others, even if we disagree with their motivations.

This is very sad news, indeed. Are you a vegetarian? That may seem out of
order, but, if you're eating meat, you're slaughtering animals as well, so,
just food for thought... food :)

~~~
beedogs
They probably don't wholeheartedly believe in its necessity. But the money's
good.

[http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/14/opinion/the-big-lie-
behind...](http://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/14/opinion/the-big-lie-behind-
japanese-whaling.html)

~~~
codezero
Thanks. That's really helpful. So basically Japan uses whaling under the guise
of research to leverage their ability to access fisheries that they might
otherwise be restricted from.

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hanniabu
I'm not refuting their claims that this isn't caused by humans, but I'm
curious as to how they are able to prove that.

~~~
dfc
Red tide?

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peteretep
One day we're going to find out there are whale apocalyptic cults.

------
unreal37
The scientist seems to be withholding information until her paper gets
published. That seems wrong to me.

~~~
samplonius
Yes, those damn peer reviews are so annoying. I recommend using journals that
don't bother to verify anything.

\- Ranjit Chandra
([https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ranjit_Chandra](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ranjit_Chandra))

~~~
Joof
It's cool; we can let a small, overworked group of people who may or may not
actually be very knowledgeable in that subject peer review it first. Might as
well keep the data private forever too because reproducing the work might show
something different.

~~~
Joof
I was up too late and grumpy, but the peer review process (while necessary)
does prevent good papers from being published in a reasonable time frame. And
acceptance is closer to random than you might expect.

Here's a review of the NIPs acceptance process.

[http://blog.mrtz.org/2014/12/15/the-nips-
experiment.html](http://blog.mrtz.org/2014/12/15/the-nips-experiment.html)

Stuff like arXiv is in theory very good for the actual process of science, but
so is having free, accessible journals and those don't necessarily exist in
every field.

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dclowd9901
Near Antarctica? Any chance of fluctuation of tide sizes due to global
warming?

~~~
pvaldes
Hum, this is a good point. We need more info about blubber thickness and sex
of the death whales. Is a very interesting problem.

------
hoodoof
Pings from submarines.

