

Designers need engineers - stdbrouw
http://stdout.be/2011/10/23/designers-need-engineers/

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joshmlewis
I come from more of a designer stand point and I've realized that sometimes
I've had "cool" ideas but when I go to plan out how that would look and the
process behind it in a programming language, it gets quite complicated pretty
fast.

I can think of the coolest UI's and 'experiences' but when you go to plan
those out and map out the structure you soon realize stuff is harder than it
appears on the outside. Kind of like a commercial I've seen recently that
shows a couple walking into their house and everything they touch or use
expands showing all the intricacies of modern conveniences. Things are so easy
to do nowadays without knowing really 'how' they work.

I think this is an interesting point in our history. We can pick up anything
nowadays without having a clue as to how it works. We lose sight of what it
takes to bring something from idea to reality. More people need to become
aware of how things work. This kind of makes me rant about how a lot of people
I see constantly refuse to learn how things work. I see friends that have cars
and they break and they just take it to a mechanic and let the mechanic worry
about knowing how it works. In a sense that's nice but in another sense it's
scary. I still may take my car to a mechanic but I at least know how it works
to a certain depth and what could cause the problem. The same scenario for
computers to proper zombie invasions. I'm guilty as much as the rest but I
still try to keep a handle on things.

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znq
>I think this is an interesting point in our history. We can pick up anything
nowadays without having a clue as to how it works. We lose sight of what it
takes to bring something from idea to reality. More people need to become
aware of how things work.

100% with you on that. But it's not just a recent development. Robert M.
Pirsig's book "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance" from 1974 deals with
exactly that "problem" or attitude many people have nowadays. The book is in
some parts kinda slow and hard to read, but I still recommend it to everyone.

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zen_and_the_Art_of_Motorcycle_M...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zen_and_the_Art_of_Motorcycle_Maintenance)

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RobertHubert
Here is my take for what its worth - Great products require great
understanding: The designer needs to understand what can be engineered, now,
what needs to be invented, and what can only exist in the future, and an
engineer needs to understand what the designer wants. And both teams or
individuals are responsible for the process and outcome. If you have a flimsy
designer that makes everything look pretty on paper but fails to communicate
the entire picture, the engineers will inevitably produce sub par work, not
because they're bad at their job, but because you did not give them enough to
work with, unless you have visionary engineers with a foot in the design
department as well. Then again if the engineers only think code code code they
will fail to meet the designer where it counts and again the product is sub
par. They are 2 parts of the same creative entity, one that lives and relies
on communication and understanding. This is unlike the "well oiled machine"
where each person or team resembles a mindless cog in some contraption...
These are companies that do not understand the ultimate relationship between
designer and engineer. It takes a designer with a stubborn focus on the big
picture and a razor focus on the tiniest details along with an engineer of
godlike skill to not just solve the puzzles set before them, but solve them
intelligently (there is a huge difference), while keeping an eye on the final
product. The two parts should always demand validation in their understanding
of what the other has communicated.

Build a team that does not simply 'do', but a team that thinks, communicates,
and understands; and create an environment that fosters this relationship.

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ed209

        It takes one designer...
    

no it doesn't. it takes a design team, just as it takes an engineering team.

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technoslut
I think his intent was to say it takes one person to make that final choice on
the design. If it wasn't then you are clearly in the right. Usually design by
committee ends up being a total disaster because the UI feels disjointed.

Ultimately I believe it was in reference to Jobs being the 'taste guy'.

Sidenote: While the Mac is certainly inconsistent in design (mostly iTunes),
iOS is far less so. I guess you can attribute it to Jobs always being
interested in the next new thing. In the last WWDC appearance by Jobs, one
could clearly see that he was more excited by iOS than Lion.

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michaelpinto
If you think about the phrase "designer" in its wider sense it's always an
occupation that's multidisciplinary by the nature of the gig. It doesn't
matter what type of design you are (industrial, graphic, fashion, etc.)
because you are always working with people outside of your profession. Many
people think of a designer as someone on a mountaintop who is going after "a
vision" -- well that's real a fine artist.

Designers on the other hand are always about making something for an end
purpose, and something that NEEDS to please an audience (be a client or end-
consumer). Design should be style thrown on top of engineering -- that's
decoration, which isn't what designers do. Designer solve problems, tell
stories and give their creations personalities.

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psweber
Designers and engineers have a codependent relationship. Either party can (and
should) learn to do what the other does, but a single person mastering both
fields is pretty rare.

I've see a lot of hostility between designers and Engineers. Engineers can
feel contempt for designers that dictate functional and UX decisions (often
without understanding the ramifications of their choices). Designers often
feel contemptuous towards engineers that are getting paid 2-3 times their
salary.

We probably all want to be on collaborative project teams. I wish they were
more common.

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markazevedo
Great article, though I would take it one step further and strongly nudge more
designers to take on more engineering roles (as many engineers also work to
broaden their skill set).

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TorbjornLunde
Many of us already are. :)

Will Miner spoke about web designer as a hybrid between designer and developer
at Build: <http://vimeo.com/7835308>

I feel like I’ll probably be a designer at heart, but I still want to learn as
much dev-stuff as possible. I’m going to use Django for my personal portfolio,
simply for the sake of learning it. I’m really looking forward to it. :)

Generally people need people of other disciplines. Developers need designers
as well, and we all need copywriters for instance.

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psweber
"no, designers don't need engineers. a project needs engineers just as a
project needs designers."

This.

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stdbrouw
When great design depends on great engineering to work its magic, as you see
with Apple products like their touch interfaces or, heck, even their lovely
lovely desktop keyboards, then design needs technology, or, put another way,
designers need engineers. It's English, don't read more into it than it says
:-)

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psweber
You are probably right. Everyone in this thread seems to be agreeing with each
other. We're just discussing semantics.

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jsavimbi
> good design depends on great engineers

Beware the teammate that champions the importance of their discipline over
that of others. Good design and engineering have many dependencies, but
neither should include an inflated sense of entitlement.

I wouldn't go too far out on this guy if I were you.

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dustingetz
comment on post from Jason Block:

    
    
      Conversely, a lot of engineers believe that you don't 
      need great designers--just great products. It's a 
      relationship that absolutely must be synergistic if 
      one wants to captivate an audience of millions with 
      their work.
    

lets qualify that. Apple clearly establishes markets where the first-to-market
guys couldn't. That's because they build products that make people feel good.
Need design and engineering synergy.

Apple was also originally a garage startup where their product was a jumble of
exposed wires on a breadboard. Need engineers.

Lets not lose track of the spectrum here.

