
Jeff Bezos and Blue Origin go all in on moon settlements - l33tbro
https://www.geekwire.com/2018/jeff-bezos-blue-origin-space-venture-go-moon-settlements/
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perilunar
> "Bezos laid out his vision for lunar settlement...after he received the
> National Space Society’s Gerard K. O’Neill Memorial Award."

Kind of ironic really. Bezos wants to settle the Moon and Musk wants to settle
Mars, but as O'Neill himself pointed out 40 years ago, the best place to build
human settlements in free space, not the surface of a planet (or moon).

What we should be doing is retrieving a near Earth asteroid and mining it to
build Bernal Spheres:

[http://space.nss.org/national-space-society-gerard-k-
oneill-...](http://space.nss.org/national-space-society-gerard-k-oneill-
memorial-award/)

~~~
ciconia
> Kind of ironic really.

No, what's ironic is the best piece of real-estate for all life is right under
our feet, no space ship necessary.

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dwaltrip
Yes, and 7 billion people are using it. Are you really surprised or annoyed
that a few members of a curious and novelty-seeking species want to explore
the great beyond?

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pmoriarty
The moon: the ultimate company town, where all the workers are completely
dependent on the corporation.

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tonysdg
Andy Weir (author of The Martian) wrote a fun little sci-fi novel titled
Artemis, which depicts almost exactly that -- the first lunar colony (largely)
dependent on a single company. Great book with a fun heist plot.

~~~
jkmcf
FWIW, even better is Ian MacDonald's Luna.

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gremlinsinc
Anyone still working on Space Elevators? Seems to me, if we could actually get
one of those going, maybe interplanetary travel could be much easier and more
economical. Sure Musk has made great strides with reusable rockets but imagine
saving on a lot of the fuel by using an elevator that might not require as
much or any rocket fuel (to exit the atmosphere), that could save a bunch as
well.

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eric-hu
This got me wondering. Earth-based space elevators are still out of reach with
current technology. What about a space elevator for the moon?

If we could build a lunar space elevator with existing materials, could we
develop industry on the moon to supply space travel cheaper than the current
model?

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eric-hu
Apparently yes, it is possible with today's technology and a lunar elevator
could be made to go higher:

[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lunar_space_elevator](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lunar_space_elevator)

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odammit
I’d prefer he focus on keeping the Roci burning hard and get us out to those
ring gates.

The moon is for amateurs.

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krat0sprakhar
_Bezos pointed out that the moon is conveniently located, reachable in just a
couple of days with the right rocket. Scientists have determined that it has
deposits of water ice near the poles that could be converted into drinkable
water, breathable air and propellants for refuelable rockets._

If this is true, it seems the moon has a lot going for it which is quite
surprising given Elon has been so bullish on Mars. Can someone explain what
advantage colonizing Mars has compared to Moon?

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ggg9990
Does it matter? There’s no point to any of this, it’s fun stuff for rich guys
like golfing or art collecting. Mars or Moon is just a matter of preference
like Pebble Beach vs. St. Andrews.

~~~
bhhaskin
No point to any of this? Except you know a permanent human settlement off the
planet and the trillions and trillions of dollars floating around out there in
asteroids. Humans have no future if we don't get off our little fragile
planet. I would honestly say it is one of the few things that do matter.

~~~
musage
Permant != self-sustaining, just extending to moon or Mars isn't "getting off"
Earth anymore than you putting your fingertip on a bookshelf doesn't mean
you're now "on the bookshelf". Whatever we build there, will be a lot more
fragile than what we have here. If we can't keep from destroying a rich
ecosystem, what would keep us from destroying any ecosystems we build on much
less solid ground?

That said, I don't disagree that it matters, just not in quite the way you put
it, that's a fantasy to me, a way to avoid the responsibility we actually do
have, the responsiblity that is actually real. At the very least, mining
asteroids beats scouring for ever more elusive resources on Earth. But humans
living in hollowed asteroids isn't a solution to overpopulation and pollution.
We can't build housing on Earth, but it's going to be _so_ different once
"we're in space". Yeah, right. Prove you can do it here or I don't believe it
for a sec.

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sgc
Pretty spot on. I have never seen any modicum of common sense in people
claiming going to extremely hostile environments to make them like where we
live is somehow a better solution than - by comparison- just tweaking what we
already have. It is just giving up on most of humanity.

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ncallaway
I'm a pretty avid fan of colonizing other bodies in the solar system (Mars,
Moon, etc).

That said, I don't know _anyone_ who would advocate for colonizing Mars is a
better solution that tweaking what we already have. It's a different solution
addressing a different problem.

We should _absolutely_ be improving and addressing the problems that we have
on Earth. I 100% agree with that. I don't see how that precludes us from
_also_ starting the process of colonizing another planet.

~~~
sgc
There is definitely a group of people who think humanity cannot survive
without becoming a multi planet species - now. I am not against exploration
and colonization at all, but I think it should receive the mindshare and
financial backing of an experiment, and not a proper solution to the current
existential crisis of our species. I wish we could capture people's
imaginations with incredible fixes to our own planet's problems the way we
manage to do with space exploration. It is obvious why this is difficult, but
without it we will partisan bicker ourselves towards extinction.

It sounds like we agree at any rate.

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smoorman1024
Can anyone comment on Bezo's claim that there will be so much more energy in
Space via Solar Power. Based on what I'm reading the acre of solar power
panels the ISS has generates less energy than what could equivalently be
generated on the Earth's surface. I cannot imagine the lack of night/day cycle
overcoming the amount of energy it takes to send an acre of solar panels into
orbit in the first place.

~~~
JoeAltmaier
Atmosphere reduces solar flux by 1/10 or so. That's a greater advantage than
the day/night benefit. Can't speak to the ISS panels - are they old tech?
Ultralight design limited their efficiency?

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smoorman1024
The panels must be old tech but that in itself would be a problem unless we
see solar panels leveling off in their efficiency in the near future. Whatever
you put into orbit is going to become outdated quickly. This is the source for
the amount of power generated for the ISS if you are interested.

[https://www.edn.com/design/power-
management/4427522/Internat...](https://www.edn.com/design/power-
management/4427522/International-Space-Station--ISS--power-system)

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megamindbrian2
I'd like some tasty space berries.

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xevb3k
How much is a banner Ad on the moon worth?

An advert visual to literally everyone on the planet has got to be worth the
cost of building a settlement hasn’t it?

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chroma
1\. The moon is thousands of kilometers around. It would take enormous
resources to make an ad big enough to be visible from earth.

2\. You don’t have to go to the moon to advertise to everyone. Just launch a
banner into low earth orbit. It would only need to be a kilometer or two wide.

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aqme28
It seems unethical to say that Jeff Bezos goes "all in" on moon settlements
while he is still clearly not putting all his investments into this project.

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amgin3
By the time Bezos gets a rocket to the moon, Musk will already have a
settlement on Mars.

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okonomiyaki3000
Nuh uh!!! My billionaire can beat up your billionaire!!

