
Decades of diesel use in Europe have created a public health crisis - pseudolus
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-10-08/europe-s-diesel-subsidies-are-causing-a-public-health-crisis
======
mhandley
If you look at the actual data over the last 25 years, it's clear that
London's air quality has steadily improved over time:
[https://www.londonair.org.uk/london/asp/advgraphssiteplot.as...](https://www.londonair.org.uk/london/asp/advgraphssiteplot.asp?CBXSpecies9=SO2m&day1=1&month1=sep&year1=1993&day2=1&month2=sep&year2=2019&period=roll24&graphtype=Image&Submit=replot+the+graph&site=BL0&res=6&cm-
djitdk-djitdk=)

There are particularly large decreases in Sulphur Dioxide and Carbon Monoxide
- the former due to reduced sulphur in fuel, and the latter due to catalytic
converters. But pretty much all the other metrics have continued to improve
too. Having worked in Bloomsbury for 30 years, I can definitely tell it's got
better.

But it's not good enough. When City Hall is hailing that air quality is
actually legal for the first time in ten years, that's both good and comical
at the same time. [https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-
london-42681113](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-42681113)

As an aside, I moved from London to the Bay Area for a number of years. Many
of the Londoners I knew who moved there developed terrible allergies after a
few years. Certainly I have less problem with allergies in London than I had
in Berkeley. This should in no way excuse London, but you have to get things
in perspective.

~~~
Stevvo
London is the only city in world that turns everyone's snot black, not even
Delhi or Beijing does that.

~~~
tomatocracy
I’ve lived in London for 15 years and I’ve never experienced that. I suspect
it’s something of an urban myth.

~~~
te_chris
Happens to me! It's mostly the tube I think though - airborne brake residue
etc, is what I've been told.

~~~
ptr
Me too, in the tube – definitely not a myth. A friend even got his white dress
shirt ruined by the stuff.

~~~
tomatocracy
That’s credible - it could be quite localised on the tube to certain stations
or lines if that is the case - I’ve noticed that I get black marks all over my
hands occasionally from the escalator handrail in some stations but it’s only
a small minority of the ones I’ve been to.

------
mikl
I’m sure the air quality isn’t great in London, but this article is a
hodgepodge of anecdotes and pollution stats.

But no actual facts about the claimed crisis. Not a single statistic about how
people are affected. No documentation of the existence of a crisis, much less
documentation of the claim that said crisis is caused by diesel in particular
(rather than just air pollution in general).

Would be nice if the author had spent some time finding some facts instead of
making everyone dumber with a sensational headline without a factual basis.

~~~
blue_devil
"Dieselisation" of cars in Europe: [https://www.eea.europa.eu/data-and-
maps/daviz/dieselisation-...](https://www.eea.europa.eu/data-and-
maps/daviz/dieselisation-of-diesel-cars-in-3#tab-chart_1)

Health effects of diesel Particulate Matter:
[https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/j.1440-1843...](https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/j.1440-1843.2011.02109.x)

------
davedx
On the plus side:

In the Netherlands, more electric cars were registered this year than diesel
cars.

[https://www.nu.nl/economie/6002670/dieselautos-in-nieuwe-
ver...](https://www.nu.nl/economie/6002670/dieselautos-in-nieuwe-verkoop-
ingehaald-door-elektrische-voertuigen.html)

This is actually a side effect of the Dutch government reducing business
ownership subsidies (bijtelling reduction) next year, but it's still a
positive effect, and very welcome in car congested Netherlands where many
people live quite close to major roads.

~~~
pi-rat
We hit >50% electrics for new car sales here in Norway earlier this year. It's
exploded over the last couple of years, only 5 years ago only a few % were
electrics..

~~~
rad_gruchalski
Not surprising considering how heavily taxed non-EVs are in Norway.

~~~
adrianN
You say that like it's a bad thing.

~~~
rad_gruchalski
No, it was an unemotional reply.

------
throwaway8941
Some parts of the world are still living in conditions resembling the Great
Smog of London, only it doesn't go away after a while, but stays for years.

For example, the _daily average_ pollution levels across all particulates
being tracked in my city (PM 2.5/10, CO, SO2, NOx, and some others) have been
several times that of the highest levels on the dirtiest day in London's
history for the last 10 years.

If we compare, say, our daily averages taken on the dirtiest ~1/3 days in a
year to the most polluted day in London's recent history, the ratio goes to
something like 10-200x, depending on pollutant.

[https://data.london.gov.uk/dataset/london-average-air-
qualit...](https://data.london.gov.uk/dataset/london-average-air-quality-
levels)

You'll never see it mentioned in big news outlets though. Who would give a
damn? It's certainly not London.

~~~
davedx
It is mentioned though:

[https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-
india-49729291](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-49729291)

[https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-pollution-
beijing/c...](https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-pollution-
beijing/chinas-capital-beijing-vows-air-quality-improvement-but-gives-no-
target-
idUSKCN1Q90TU#targetText=The%20World%20Health%20Organization%20recommends,and%20manufacturing%20plants%20in%202019).

People do give a damn. Unfortunately governments around the world aren't often
leaping to take effective action. It's the same with environmental issues in
general.

~~~
throwaway8941
Sorry, I should have been more clear in my whining. The largest cities are
being talked about, be they located in Europe or Asia. It's the smaller ones
who suffer the most and whose population has zero hope for any progress (or
simply doesn't care).

Beijing is a health resort compared to where I am located. At least my friend
claims so (he spent about 3 months there on a business trip back in 2011.)

I know of at least 3 cities in my country suffering from extreme air
pollution. You won't find any news articles about any of them.

~~~
a_t48
If you don’t mind me asking, which country are you in?

~~~
throwaway8941
Sure, I am from Kazakhstan. The same situation can be found in pretty much
every country in the region though.

I plan to take a lot of pictures during the upcoming winter, because almost no
one on the English-speaking segment of internet believes that there can be so
much pollution in the air, that it reduces visibility to 10 meters.

~~~
ohduran
Any light you can shed on this (pun intended, of course) is welcome. Still,
sounds incredible, is it just on peak times or on a daily basis?

~~~
throwaway8941
In winter time, almost every evening, from 6:00 PM through the night. Except
for windy days (from ~7 m/s upwards), which are pretty rare.

It's all because of the old Soviet heavy industry which hasn't been properly
maintained since 1991 (say what you want about USSR, but there was more
responsibility then), crappy gasoline, lots of old cars which made their first
100k miles in Germany or US, high sulfur coal being used in stoves... the
whole shebang.

Did I mention that some people use cow dung/rubber/plastic rubbish in their
stoves?

Yep, we're living on the same planet as you are.

~~~
jabl
Are you still using mazut as well?

~~~
mos_basik
Not the person you were asking, but I did a double take on your question
because I had thought growing up in the DRC that "mazut" _was_ the French word
for diesel. Turns out mazut is a separate thing. Also, it was definitely used
in the local heavy trucks up to the last time I was there in 2011 - ones like
this:
[https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5292/5509628757_f8219820b9_z....](https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5292/5509628757_f8219820b9_z.jpg)

------
jaclaz
>For decades, Europe will be united by filthy air and a slowly unfolding
public-health crisis caused by its embrace of diesel—something that was
supposed to heal the environment.

More than a bit hyped, there is a lot of Europe outside London (and outside
other European major cities).

~~~
paganel
The other big cities outside London are definitely worse, Paris or Berlin are
much more affected by the use of diesel because both France and Germany have a
higher proportion of diesel cars compared to the UK

~~~
camillomiller
The air quality in Berlin is simply the best among all the cities I’ve lived
in.

~~~
bitL
It depends on the street/proximity to a park or a major road. You are probably
living in a good area.

~~~
Ono-Sendai
In my experience Berlin has much better air quality than London.

------
sampo
Somewhat related: Fine particles (PM2.5) pollution in subway stations can be
30 times higher than in the urban roadside air above ground.

[https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2019/jan/09/london-
under...](https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2019/jan/09/london-underground-
air-pollution-report-concerns-northern-line-particulates)

~~~
Havoc
Yeah you can sometimes see it in the tunnels. One really should be able to see
pollution in like 20 meters of air...

------
frogpelt
I don't why but this kind of reporting really bothers me.

I understand that putting a face on a news story makes it more meaningful. But
it just screams anecdotal evidence to me.

Who cares what "one American" did?? Is the air in London bad? Then report it.
And don't try to prove it by saying one person has moved.

Also, pollution is most definitely a first world problem, not third world like
the writer somehow believed.

~~~
mikelyons
They do this because statistics don't sell news, emotions do.

------
Jonnax
It hits close to home when I'm reading that article and realise that I've
lived walking distance from the author.

My lungs have certainly become a lot more sensitive these days.

Pollution is something that becomes part of your day to day life, you just
don't notice it.

I tried cycling with a FFP3 dust mask recently and it was shocking to me how
much better it felt.

~~~
mikelyons
Would be interesting to see if you can measure any quantifiable effect from
wearing the mask.

------
swebs
The article doesn't really explain the difference in health risks between
diesel and gasoline. Would an American city with comparable traffic have
cleaner air due to gasoline use? Gasoline exhaust certainly doesn't smell as
awful as diesel, but that doesn't necessarily mean its easier on your health.

~~~
tialaramex
I feel like it does explain this, although it's not a Wikipedia article so it
doesn't break them down into a nice table for you.

NO2 output is higher for a modern diesel engine, and NO2 is poisonous. Not
like "Oh my god I think I breathed some NO2 now I need to go to hospital"
poisonous, but it's bad for you and wasn't there anyway. If Europe had decided
it hated diesel and petrol remained more popular (as in the US) there'd be
lower NO2 emissions in London.

PM2.5 (tiny particles) is higher for diesel. Again, breathing in a tiny
particle that will then permanently get stuck in your lungs, damaging them in
a minute but essentially irreversible way, is not going to send you to ER
immediately, but it keeps happening and cumulatively, especially over a
population, that means deaths.

As the article also points out PM2.5 doesn't even go away if you got rid of
internal combustion engines. Just rolling at speed causes tiny pieces of the
surfaces that come into contact to break off, probably a racist cyclist even
emits PM2.5 though nothing like a diesel truck. So this isn't a problem we can
entirely solve, but things like ULEZ aim to make it better, the argument is
largely that they aren't enough (and apparently for this journalist, won't
ever be enough).

~~~
tomxor
> probably a racist cyclist even emits PM2.5 though nothing like a diesel
> truck. So this isn't a problem we can entirely solve

Oh man i hate those racist cyclists :P

~~~
tialaramex
Hmm, maybe an auto-correct error or maybe while editing I thought I'd written
"racing cycling" and corrected to "racing cyclist" but actually I'd written
"racing cyclist" and the change gave us this error.

So yes, whether racist or not, and indeed even if using some less conventional
wheeled transport like a skateboard or shopping trolley - all fast wheeled
travel creates PM2.5 pollution and we just have to suck it up. I presume
maglev doesn't do this, but maglev isn't exactly at the top of the list of
cheap inner city transit options.

~~~
tomxor
I've done this many times, where it's not actually autocorrect directly in
error... it's me choosing the incorrect suggestion from autocorrect because
the correct suggestion is absent _and_ i've not looked carefully enough.
Probably so common because we tend to identify words by shape, so if the shape
matches we pick it.

------
pjbster
The Kings College sensor data is visualised on this page:
[https://www.londonair.org.uk/LondonAir/nowcast.aspx](https://www.londonair.org.uk/LondonAir/nowcast.aspx)

When I used to cycle in London I noticed that I struggled to recover at
traffic lights. On one occasion I thought "this is it" because I simply could
not catch my breath whilst my HR spiked. Most unpleasant.

------
vixen99
In spite of its known properties, diesel use was encouraged by Sir David King,
the chief UK scientific adviser from 2000 to 2007.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diesel_exhaust](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diesel_exhaust)
None of this was new. "Diesel exhausts, long known for their characteristic
smells".

~~~
Angostura
Encouraged primarily because of its lower CO2 emissions bang for buck. Its why
I bought a diesel car. The latest one with a 2016 engine performs rather well
in terms of particulates, thanks to the mandatory AdBlu system.

~~~
C1sc0cat
And the massive tax advantages

~~~
Angostura
Ecouraged _by_ tax reductions in the service of CO2 efficiency.

------
chha
Isn't this a general problem for large cities? A quick glance at Google gave
me [1], indicating that this isn't a problem limited to London.

[1] - [https://www.cbsnews.com/pictures/top-10-smoggiest-cities-
in-...](https://www.cbsnews.com/pictures/top-10-smoggiest-cities-in-us/3/)

~~~
Brakenshire
European cities are usually worse than American cities for many measures of
air pollution because the streets are more tightly packed, which means less
ability for the pollutants to disperse. Housing and pavements for walking also
tend to be closer to roads. On the other hand, the highest levels of pollution
are usually experienced by drivers, because they’re sitting closest to the
sources of pollution, in the flow of traffic and in effect just behind the
exhaust of the preceding car. So it may be that pollution levels averaged over
a city are not an accurate reflection of the health impacts on individuals, or
on certain subsets of individuals. You’re much more likely to be walking in
London compared to most American cities, rather than driving, but you’re also
more likely to be living right next to a road with a lot of traffic. Either
way, air pollution in London is a problem that has to be tackled, but it’s not
going to be that easy to directly compare different cities.

~~~
llampx
If you have a nice car, you likely have the windows shut, and the AC/heat on,
set to recirculate, and the air is filtered through a HEPA filter.

Meanwhile I'm on my bike, breathing all the fumes with no protection
whatsoever.

------
andreasley
There are now affordable devices available to monitor air quality at home.
I've recently bought one [1] that measures PM2.5, CO2 and tVOC amongst other
things. It's quite interesting to see spikes in particulate matter after crop
harvesting or in certain weather conditions and determine if there's an
apparent relation to difficulty of breathing.

[1]
[https://cleargrass.com/air_monitor/overview](https://cleargrass.com/air_monitor/overview)
(Website in Chinese only, unfortunately. The device can be set to english
though.)

~~~
Filligree
I've got one of those!

At risk of sounding like a commercial, you should get a Levoit HEPA purifier.
It'll clear that right up.

~~~
andreasley
I'm too paranoid to even connect the air monitor to the internet, so letting
it talk to other appliances is out of the question for now. :) But it's good
to know that HEPA filters are so effective against fine particles. I'll have
to check that out. Thanks!

~~~
Filligree
Oh, Levoit's purifiers do nothing like that; they're pure mechanical devices.
A high-static-pressure fan, a stack of filters, and some plastic, with a
minimal amount of electronics for dead reckoning status LEDs.

I just meant it'd clean your air. ;)

------
jsingleton
The air quality in Westminster this week is excellent. :)

------
robk
Yet somehow the taxis are not being replaced at nearly a fast enough rate.
These are surely one of the major polluters but they seem to have politically
captured the entire mayorality so there's never much complaint about them and
the avoid the ULEZ charges etc.

~~~
tialaramex
The rate of taxi replacement for old diesels is currently doubled, with the
lifetime of a (Euro 3, 4, 5) diesel taxi reducing from 15 to 12 years over the
years until 2022, so each year two years worth of old taxis will be too old
and replaced by ZEVs or other low emission vehicles.

Yes, they're a big polluter, but they're also moving a LOT of people around
the city, so that sort of cancels out. If anything the taxi drivers remain
annoyed that this means they're going to be buying a (very expensive even
after grants) new taxi sooner than expected.

The Mayor spent about £25M basically bribing those in younger taxis to upgrade
to ZEV anyway, paying them over £10 000 each in some cases to swap from an old
diesel (which would then either be scrapped or sold outside London since it
can't hit criteria to be newly licensed as a London taxi now) to a PHEV.

~~~
llampx
> Yes, they're a big polluter, but they're also moving a LOT of people around
> the city, so that sort of cancels out

How does that cancel out? It seems that it is a force multiplier.

------
newnewpdro
The last European city I spent much time on the streets of was Palermo, Sicily
around six years ago. The air was offensively bad during commute times in the
city center, and it seemed mostly caused by 2-stroke vehicles if memory
serves.

~~~
rob74
I guess you mean the ubiquitous Vespas (and other scooters)? I had the same
experience with Barcelona. Yeah, a transition to electric scooters would
definitely improve the air quality (and also the level of noise pollution) in
many Southern European cities...

~~~
pmlnr
In 2014, in Chegdu, China, there were converted electrical scooters (the bike
scooter, not the standing roller) everywhere. Quiet, efficient, no smell. It
was miraculous.

I'd really like to see that happen in the West, but there are some rather
idiotic people around who thinks the sound - like grinding metal with a
chainsaw - is part of the fun.

------
blue_devil
It should also be noted that as of 2015, the average age of a passenger car in
use in Europe is 10.7 years, with a mode of around 12 years, and max 17+
years. Out of a fleet of 252 mln, 123 mln or about 50% were 10+ years old in
2015.

Same for light commercial vehicles, and even worse - at 11.7 years average -
for mid and heavy commercial vehicles.

See page 9, 10 & 11 here:
[https://www.acea.be/uploads/statistic_documents/ACEA_Report_...](https://www.acea.be/uploads/statistic_documents/ACEA_Report_Vehicles_in_use-
Europe_2017.pdf)

------
PaulRobinson
Londoner with a diesel car (2016 Ford that is ULEZ compliant), here:

London's air is far, far cleaner than many other cities around the World. I
was in Paris last weekend, and I think that's more polluted because congestion
seems much worse in a much larger area than it does in London.

That does not mean it is clean or safe, however, there are challenges:

As the article points out, for many years the government pushed diesel, so
there are a lot of cars out there. They have advantages that make them
attractive to a lot of people (myself included), so if they're ULEZ compliant,
we'll buy them in part because the turnaround has made them cheaper on the
second hand market. Fleets of German cars are being bought, depreciated and
sold at knock-down prices.

Go to the biggest 2nd hand dealer in London (Cargiant), go to the Merc and BMW
hangar, and find me a petrol car: you'll be hard pushed, and when you do find
them, they're more expensive.

Electric is also not a viable option for the vast majority of Londoners. Where
I live (TW1), we're way outside central London, in Zone 4. Even here, off-road
parking is very much a rarity and exception.

The local council (Richmond) has thrown money at lampost charging stations,
and is installing around 250 of them across the borough. A borough of 195k
people are going to share 250 charging points. This is absurdly low.

What about public transport? It's true, London is one of the best public
transport cities in the World. I use the bus frequnetly, often to get to my
nearest tube (a 45 minute walk away), or use the train.

However, it's also expensive, and for most people driving - even with the ULEZ
and congestion charges - can make more financial sense.

It's interesting as well that the article calls out Marylebone Road and Hyde
Park corner as the most polluted spots.

Marylebone road is party to 4 major train stations: Marylebone, Euston, Kings
Cross and St Pancras International. Almost anybody trying to make a train
journey to the North of London or to avoid using a plane to get to Europe is
going to travel along Marylebone road. It's taking one for the team: those
taxis and cars are normally carrying people to get to those stations.

They're well served by public transport, but heavy bags and suitcases on the
London transport system is fractured: it prompts us to use cars instead. I did
this myself just this weekend when getting to and from St Pancras for the
Eurostar, because the alternatives were utterly draining.

And as for Hyde Park corner, well it's a central crossing point for many
routes out to the South, West and North of London and its centre. The
alternative would be to build ring roads that were once planned, but would
turn London into a motorway-centric city like Birmingham, which would just
encourage more driving.

Diesels need to get more expensive to own, electric needs to get easier to own
for those of us without driveways, public transport needs to get cheaper, and
the concentration of rail terminuses into a mile long stretch of road needs
rethinking long term (it's going to get worse with HS2).

But at the same time, we have it way better than many other cities.

------
dotdi
They moved back to Seattle right on time when it went up to become one of the
most polluted cities in the US[0].

[0]: [https://www.lung.org/local-content/_content-items/about-
us/m...](https://www.lung.org/local-content/_content-items/about-
us/media/press-releases/seattle-tacoma-area-sota-2019.html)

~~~
vkou
Seattle had horrible air quality problems for the past two years, because of
the wildfires burning in Washington and BC.

Usually, winds carry that smoke into Idaho, but due to abnormal weather
patterns, all that smoke was carried into Seattle and Vancouver.

------
diediesel
Somehow we can thank german car makers, which through the eu have imposed the
so called “euro” emissions “standards” that have 0 health benefits and non eu
made vehicles are taxed to death. Europe is filled with cars made in that
country that have been polluting for decades and consumers dont really have
options.

~~~
rad_gruchalski
What do you mean “no options”? It’s possible to buy American, Japanese or even
Chinese cars in Europe. Regarding the norms, nothing prevents the
manufacturers from building cars exceeding the minimum norms.

 _Edit_ : it’s also possible to buy a non-diesel car. New petrol cars are
actually cheaper than diesel. There are plenty of EVs available on the market.
Heck, even hydrogen, if one really wants to.

~~~
ollie87
In response to your edit: Petrol cars have always been cheaper than diesel
ones to buy in the UK. They cost more to service too. Usually you have to be
doing well in excess of 15-20,000 miles a year to make the extra expense worth
it.

Also, doing low mileage in a modern diesel can cause issues because it doesn't
get the opertunity to run the cycle that will burn the crap out of the
particulate filter.

~~~
rad_gruchalski
Hence diesel is so popular as fleet cars.

~~~
ollie87
At the moment, my Dad gets a company car though and the Tesla Model 3 just
popped up as an option on their portal. He and serveral of his colleagues are
in the process of swapping.

My Dad does about 20,000 miles a year for work.

~~~
tomatocracy
This is not widely known I think but there are significant tax advantages now
available in the UK for low emissions/electric cars provided as a benefit in
kind/through salary sacrifice schemes even where the car gets no business use
at all.

------
vondur
Do European countries not have emissions rules for their vehicles like we do
here in the US? (California to be specific) The diesels here have to use a DEF
solution to remove NOx emissions from them. In California, your vehicle has to
pass a smog emissions test in order to be able to drive it.

~~~
Barrin92
we do have emission rules and the article is very dramatic. (here's an
interactive overview that gives some idea
[https://waqi.info/](https://waqi.info/))

The air in London from my own experience is not great but it's also not much
worse than in many other large cities, and it has definitely improved a lot
over the last decade or two.

Other European cities at least in my experience are completely fine. I've not
noticed anything that sets Berlin or Stockholm apart from American cities,
definitely not to the point that'd be a reason for me to move.

------
Blackstone4
Maybe this will start encouraging politicians to re-think city planning and
transportation. Maybe they would go as far as banning diesel all together as
well as creating pedestrian zones. Electric scouters are currently banned so
they could overturn that.

------
pmlnr
More, and more interesting air quality data:

[http://aqicn.org/city/united-kingdom/city-of-london-sir-
john...](http://aqicn.org/city/united-kingdom/city-of-london-sir-john-cass-
school/)

------
rpmisms
This is a pity. It's sad that big oil won the ethanol/gasoline war, otherwise
we could all be driving clean-burning high-revving cars.

Even bigger pity that electric didn't win in the 1910s.

~~~
nwah1
Electric winning in 1910s would have been worse. Batteries were made of lead
acid, and electricity was generated from coal plants located inside of cities,
without even any scrubbers. Coal burning releases heavy metals.

Pollution deaths would've been sky high if electric cars "won" in 1910.

------
rb808
Sure but using diesel saved carbon emissions as its more efficient than
petrol. Surely that makes it worth it?

~~~
mywittyname
The difference in CO2 is marginal. Petrol produces about 10% less CO2 / km
than diesel at the same fuel-efficiency levels while diesel engines have about
20% better fuel economy than a similarly-sized petrol engine.

Of course, the petrol version will make quite a bit more power as well. When
you look at CO2 per HP, the differences are negligible.

------
eeZah7Ux
"One American decided to move home to spare his family."

Oh the irony. This tones sounds like FUD quite a lot.

The overall mortality rate in US is much higher.

~~~
magduf
Perhaps, but not because of air pollution. We didn't stupidly jump on the
diesel bandwagon.

~~~
ErikCorry
He was lucky with his first summer. 2019 had fewer wildfires than 2018, and
2017 was even worse:

"On September 5 [2017], ash from the Central Washington fires fell "like snow"
on Seattle and as far west as Grays Harbor County which borders the Pacific
Ocean. University of Washington meteorology professor Cliff Mass said the
situation in Seattle with "a smoke cloud so dense one would think it is low
stratus deck" was unprecedented in his 30 years of experience."

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018_Washington_wildfires](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018_Washington_wildfires)
[https://www.iii.org/fact-statistic/facts-statistics-
wildfire...](https://www.iii.org/fact-statistic/facts-statistics-wildfires)

I was in Oregon for the eclipse in 2017 and the air quality was really
terrible.

------
rob74
Has the anti-Diesel hysteria reached its peak yet? Some food for thought:

\- gasoline direct injection engines produce much more harmful particulate
matter than current diesel engines
([https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gasoline_direct_injection#Emis...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gasoline_direct_injection#Emissions)),
plus some carcinogenic gases like benzoapyrene.

\- a lot of the particulate matter emitted by cars comes from brake and tire
wear, which even electric cars have
([https://www.greencarcongress.com/2016/04/20160418-pm10.html](https://www.greencarcongress.com/2016/04/20160418-pm10.html)).

So blaming it all on Diesel engines is a bit short-sighted...

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Ottolay
The real answer is to get rid of fossil fuel powered cars - gasoline or
diesel.

~~~
rob74
Replacing them with electric cars will only solve part of the problem - see my
second point above. The real answer is probably to reduce usage of cars and
encourage walking, cycling and using public transportation...

~~~
mhandley
Last year I bought a particular sensor (I intended it to be a science project
for my son): [https://nettigo.eu/products/nova-fitnes-sds011-air-
quality-s...](https://nettigo.eu/products/nova-fitnes-sds011-air-quality-
sensor)

I carried it around with me for a few days in London, commuting in by train
from the suburbs. There were two places that had the highest particulate
levels. The first was in my kitchen when I was cooking (no comment!), and the
second was on the London Underground. Particulates were _far_ higher on the
tube than on the street in central London. So high I would have thought it was
a serious health risk for tube drivers. Presumably this mostly comes from the
steel wheels on steel track. I don't know whether ingesting steel particulates
is more or less healthy than other particulates though. Has anyone done any
studies into whether tube drivers have higher rates of health problems than
overground drivers?

Edit: table 1 of this paper confirms that the particulates on the underground
are mostly iron:
[https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/...](https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/769553/COMEAP-2018-04_WORKING_PAPER_6.pdf)

~~~
dunmalg
>Presumably this mostly comes from the steel wheels on steel track

Highly unlikely. Steel-on-steel is used because it lasts for YEARS without
needing replacing due to wear.

~~~
neka
Some of it is from that but mostly from the brake pads. You can see it collect
on those cylinders between carriages.

