
Ubuntu 16.04 proves even an LTS release can live at Linux’s bleeding edge - bpierre
http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2016/05/ubuntu-16-04-proves-even-an-lts-release-can-live-at-linuxs-bleeding-edge/
======
tajen
> now with 100% less "spyware"

> Canonical dug itself an even deeper hole when it went after [...]
> FixUbuntu.com for trademark violations.

1\. I find it both positive and daunting that the first section of this press
release is "They're not being assholes this time". Linux systems should be the
guardians of nonspying/noncloud systems.

2\. It's excellent they have a theme on stability. I'm not sure how many
customers it costs them every year. I personally when to Mac after my second
Ubuntu upgrade (1st: the mouse, 2nd: the network).

3\. I'd pay $200/yr for a free OS on a developer machine which just works,
where I don't even _know_ whether I'm running Gnome, Unity or KDE. I also want
UX improvements (the Amazon search) to be well-UX tested (or rejected) before
publication. Something like elementary.io, without the installation errors
(yeah I've tried), and with on-the-phone magicians if there's a problem.
Something like Mac OS X, but paid. I hope they'll do it one day, I wonder
whether there's enough customers for that.

~~~
teekert
You don't have to pay anyone for something that just works, take that 200$/yr
and pay it to yourself as you investigate if your hardware is well supported
by Linux.

Alternatively, go for System76 or Entroware hardware. That hardware ships with
Linux.

~~~
mwfunk
Time is money- plenty of people would trade $200 for not having to spend time
doing that. That's the sort of thing that's really fun and cool and
interesting if someone's a hobbyist and/or student and/or in the larval hacker
stage, but at some point in life after spending decades having to make sure
their hardware is supported by Linux/FreeBSD/whatever, the bloom can come off
that rose pretty hard and it's a blessing to just give someone money to worry
about something you don't want (or don't have the time) to spend time doing.

Of course, plenty of people do have plenty of time to read HOWTOs and hardware
compatibility lists and so on and still enjoy doing so- more power to them.
Especially if $200 (or whatever) is still a meaningful amount of money to them
that they need for other things. But I've always felt that a big reason why so
many people advocate that approach and present it as a rational choice is
because they themselves enjoy doing that and would do it anyway regardless of
the time/money tradeoff.

~~~
willholloway
I don't think Linux has that much of a hardware compatibility problem these
days.

I've built several intel PCs over the last few years without ever researching
hardware compatibility and every one Just Worked with a basic Ubuntu install.

Integrated wifi, and even AMD graphics cards are supported out of the box.

~~~
brerlapn
I've got an AMD laptop with AMD graphics and have to install the Catalyst
software to get responsiveness from Ubuntu graphics. If I don't completely
uninstall and purge Catalyst before allowing system updates, then reboot using
a custom boot command, then shut down and reboot (with the custom command
again), and then reinstall Catalyst, I end up with a machine that boots to a
black screen and is essentially useless until I wipe the drive and reinstall
from scratch. With 15.10 I thought this had changed with a new set of non-
Catalyst drivers, but the problem reappeared.

I hadn't expected this, as my previous two Dells with Intel or Nvidia graphics
hadn't caused any problems since years ago when wireless issues got sorted
out. Linux has made a lot of progress with hardware compatibility, but if you
find one of the weird issues it can be damn near intractable and user forums
are a maze to sort through.

------
StavrosK
Speaking of upgrading, I can't recommend this setup enough:

[https://www.stavros.io/posts/provisioning-your-computer-
one-...](https://www.stavros.io/posts/provisioning-your-computer-one-command-
awesome/)

My laptop was getting bogged down with cruft acquired in my homedir over the
years, so I decided to reinstall 16.04 from scratch. It took a few minutes to
get Ubuntu on the disk, and a single command to get every setting and
configuration file back on the machine, the way it was.

Not only that, but you can synchronize settings and installed programs across
computers as well. I love it.

~~~
0x6c6f6c
Something about `git clean` being capable of deleting your entire home
directory just sounds messy. It's a cool project, I think it could use better
implementation.

~~~
StavrosK
Yeah, definitely agreed. You _should_ use a better implementation, this one
just suits me.

------
alberth
Am I alone in being scared of the tone of this thread?

So many people are saying "yep, installed it and all works ok"

Were you expecting it to NOT work? This is a LTS release, I'd hope the Ubuntu
team tested it enough to ensure there isn't major issue.

Not to get off topic but maybe because I've solely run *BSDs for the last few
years I take for granted releases "just working".

~~~
deanCommie
Worse than that: "The only things that aren't working is the webcam and
suspend / hibernate, but I don't really care about those and suspend even
seems fixable."

SRSLY?

~~~
vespakoen
I go to great lengths to be able to run Linux, cannot live without a properly
functioning tiling window manager. I don't mind that the webcam support is
coming in a (couple of) year(s). As the laptop (re)boots in a couple of
seconds, I don't mind the shutdown when I go to bed (eco friendly even ;))

~~~
andreasvc
> I don't mind the shutdown when I go to bed (eco friendly even ;))

What exactly is eco friendly about shutdown versus suspend where it uses < 1W?
Besides, the wear and tear of repeated shutdown/powerup cycles might mean it
is a _less_ "eco" friendly option in the end.

I don't think the way you run your laptop has appreciable environmental
impact. The damage is in manufacturing and disposal. The best way to be eco
friendly is to buy laptops that don't need to be replaced as often.

~~~
witty_username
> Besides, the wear and tear of repeated shutdown/powerup cycles might mean it
> is a less "eco" friendly option in the end.

Assuming grandparent comment is shutting down the computer once or twice a
day, it should be fine, I'm pretty sure the hard drive isn't going to fail
from that.

------
vespakoen
My (6 year old) macbook pro got bricked and I was daring enough to get the new
Macbook Pro retina (MacBookPro11,4).

Before installing Arch (assuming I needed the latest kernel for anything to
work) I tried installing Xubuntu 16.04, and it amazes me how well it works!
After installing refind everything just seemed to work out of the box.

The only things that aren't working is the webcam and suspend / hibernate, but
I don't really care about those and suspend even seems fixable.

For anyone interested, I got the intel graphics drivers installer to run by
changing DISTRIB_CODENAME to "wily" in /etc/lsb-release and changing it back
to "xenial" after installation (make a backup: sudo cp /etc/lsb-release.backup
/etc/lsb-release)

~~~
phaemon
I don't know if it's the same webcam in the newest Macbook, but the the
reverse engineered driver works perfectly for me on a 2013 model:
[https://github.com/patjak/bcwc_pcie/wiki](https://github.com/patjak/bcwc_pcie/wiki)

Just follow the instructions exactly. If it doesn't work first time, try `sudo
modprobe -r bdc_pci` and then retry `sudo modprobe facetimehd` and see if it
creates `/dev/video0` (which means it's working)

For suspend, is it waking up after you close the lid? I fixed this with:

    
    
        sudo -i
        echo XHC1 > /proc/acpi/wakeup
    

Then give it a test. If it works, pop it into a startup service somewhere.

~~~
vespakoen
Webcam works now, thanks for that!

I added that script to echo XHC1 to wakeup here: /usr/lib/pm-
utils/sleep.d/100macfix without any luck (made it executable)

I also removed light-locker (that was the cause wakeup problems on my old
macbook pro (6,1), but no luck with that either.

I will play with it another time and report back here if I make progress.

~~~
phaemon
Awesome that the webcam is working!

For suspend: did typing the commands manually work at all? (it should
basically work until your next reboot)

I was assuming the issue is that when you close the lid, it sleeps for a few
seconds, then wakes again. Is that what happens, or is it something else?

~~~
vespakoen
Typing the commands manually didn't work either, I also tried disabling LID0
(sudo sh -c 'echo LID0 > /proc/acpi/wakeup')

No luck with that too, I verified the command working with

    
    
        cat /proc/acpi/wakeup
    

It shows

    
    
        XHC1	  S3	*disabled   pci:0000:00:14.0
    

When I close the lid it suspends, when I open it again I just get a black
screen (fans still on, no way to get to another tty)

I also tried suspending via the menu / power button: same results

~~~
phaemon
After a bit of poking around, this is perhaps a kernel bug that is fixed in
4.4.8

You could try upgrading your kernel if you're feeling adventurous. If that is
the issue, it will probably be backported at some point though.

~~~
vespakoen
Cool, I'll wait it out as it isn't really an issue for me, thanks for helping
out though, it's really appreciated!

------
moron4hire
Can we come up with a different archetypal bad/clueless user than "grandma"?
My son's grandma manned a crew-served grenade launcher and ran radio intercept
equipment in the Army and now owns her own database consulting company. The
way it's used brings to mind a crooked, old, white haired woman who spent her
life in the kitchen. That's increasingly not _anyone 's_ grandma. Using the
name in this way is both sexist _and_ ageist.

~~~
JetSpiegel
Can we not say people are generally dumb? Einstein is a person and he was not
dumb.

I can do syllogisms all day long.

~~~
moron4hire
Except you can't be "general people-ist".

It's funny. You'd think that, with our industry's reputation for being both
sexist and ageist, we'd work to try to understand how we've _gained_ that
perception, rather than just double-downing on it and claiming there is no
problem.

Here we go, why don't we just say "clueless user" instead? That would cover
all the Millenials who have to google search to find the Facebook login page,
too.

~~~
Dylan16807
People are less sympathetic to "clueless user" than grandma or grandpa. That's
probably also the reason to prefer grandma, not sexism.

~~~
moron4hire
-isms don't rest on whether or not negative qualities are being assigned, or if the assigned qualities make the character more sympathetic. -isms are about denying the agency of individuals, by treating everyone as objects that are carbon-copies of their demographic.

You're the first person in this thread to use the word "grandpa" in this
context. If it were really "just as good" of a term, it should be random
chance whether people use "grandma" or "grandpa". But there are eight
instances of the word "grandma" used in context in this thread alone, and the
first time anyone even thought to use "grandpa" was in trying to defend their
subconscious sexism, rather than try to use it as an opportunity to learn how
to reduce narcissism in their life and be more compassionate to others.

We all have narcissistic tendencies. Our contemporary culture promotes it and
contributes to its growth. We all have to work hard to fight the trend and
remove it.

~~~
Dylan16807
> You're the first person in this thread to use the word "grandpa" in this
> context.

That's because it's common to talk about "grandma's house" and similar things
with feelings of quaint comfort. The reason to pick that arbitrary sex is not
because of an -ism, it's because it's cliche. It's like using 'he' for unknown
gender. It's biased, and that bias is bad, but it's not done out of _sexism_.
It's not out of preference for people of either gender.

> treating everyone as objects

It's a rhetorical device. You're not _supposed_ to be talking about real
people. The stronger the disconnect there the better. That's why "clueless
user" is also bad. It makes things a bit too personal.

------
Rezo
Ubuntu LTS + a few carefully selected apps as upstream APT repositories or
PPAs is the best of both worlds; solid predictable base and the latest
software where it matters: Chrome & dev tools in my case.

Except for the browser and local dev tools, I don't think I miss or have any
use for desktop software. Everything from music (the Spotify web player is
excellent, if little known), videos, calendars to email all happen in the
browser these days, making it easier than ever to switch to Linux even as
desktop usage declines. Increasingly the OS should fade to the background
instead of trying to woo with apps or functionality. You don't have to provide
an office suite or an email client at all, and I think it would be interesting
to see what a distro could do with that kind of sharp focus. I think the core
apps of say GNOME, while of generally good quality, probably see fairly
limited use in practice.

Personally I look forward to not having to think about the OS until the next
LTS in a few years time. It's a great environment for getting stuff done.

~~~
pmlnr
You must have a rock solid internet coverage in your world. I do use offline
stuff.

------
mclemme
Installed it on my old laptop, a Dell XPS 15Z, and everything is running fine
so far. Only issue I had at install was control panel crashing right after
installing the nvidia driver, was solved with logging out and in again.

I don't see that much difference compared to 14.04. Everything just seems to
work.

A few packages that make the experience evern better: Guake for a quick access
(quake style) console. Kupfer for a fast launcher (I'm not a fan of the unity
launcher).

Edit: I'm waiting a while to install it on my main work laptop, a lenovo
t450s, since I use it with a dock and when trying 16.04 out on it (live usb),
it would sometimes crash when undocking :/

~~~
ust
I have the same machine (t450s), and I've just upgraded from 15.10. No issues
with docking, or even suspend for that matter.

~~~
mclemme
Are you also using the ultra dock[1]? I've got 1 DVI and 1 HDMI screen
attached.

I tried just when it came out, so could have been fixed in updates ofc.

[1] =
[http://shop.lenovo.com/ISS_Static/ww/emea/merchandising/opti...](http://shop.lenovo.com/ISS_Static/ww/emea/merchandising/options/images/large/_460_0_40A20090UK_V1.jpg)

------
paulmd
I ran into a bug in the installer myself: if you select "download and install
updates" then for some reason the dialog that says "We autodetected your
timezone as America/New York" cannot ever be closed (and it never unfroze for
me)

This is apparently a bug that spans multiple sub-distributions (Ubuntu,
Lubuntu, Xubuntu) and dates back to at least 11.04, it was reported over _five
years ago_. Now, _once you know the solution_ it's easy to get around, but it
was by no means easy to track down the problem - and who _wouldn 't_ want to
install fresher packages? It's kind of amateurish to allow major bugs like
that to linger in your installer for multiple years.

I was installing Lubuntu on a Liva X mini-PC with N2808 processor and eMMC
memory. I actually still couldn't get it to boot after I finished the install
- the UEFI doesn't see the eMMC drive as a valid boot target in the boot menu
and it just goes straight to BIOS. Not sure if I don't have GRUB installed to
the right place, or if there's some other Ubuntu-specific bug cropping up, or
what.

------
exratione
I just updated my Ubuntu mail server recipe for Ubuntu 16.04
([https://www.exratione.com/2016/05/a-mailserver-on-
ubuntu-16-...](https://www.exratione.com/2016/05/a-mailserver-on-
ubuntu-16-04-postfix-dovecot-mysql/)). It only took a day of work to find all
the holes and fall into them.

Everything core Ubuntu and core mailserver worked fairly well. The standard
issue Apache/PHP 7 seems to have some odd kinks around the edges, though - at
one point the only thing that worked to make it recognize a newly installed
PHP module package was to restart the whole server. I have to wonder if this
was something relating to systemd, but I'm not familiar enough yet to tell.

Subsidiary packages had a number of issues, but this is probably just standard
PHP ecosystem raggedness at the edges for a new distribution. The Roundcube
version installed via package is just outright broken due to bad symlinks, for
example.

On the whole I was pleasantly surprised as to how much of a nonissue the
transition to systemd was.

~~~
gzm
Hey there - thanks for your guide! I used it as a base for my own guide but
tweaked for Slackware64 14.1 ([https://gerardozamudio.mx/2015/04/25/slackware-
mail-server-w...](https://gerardozamudio.mx/2015/04/25/slackware-mail-server-
with-mysql-postfix-and-dovecot/)). I'm in the process of updating it for the
upcoming Slackware 14.2 release. I'd love to get your feedback on it if you
ever have some spare time.

------
Symmetry
It worked great for me on my Thinkpad. These days I have to use gekkio's PPA
to get xmonad working nicely with Gnome but that was available the first week
16.04 was out and everything installed smoothly.

~~~
nileshtrivedi
I have been facing networking issues. The network list completely disappears.
"sudo systemctl restart network-manager.service" is needed to bring those
back. Read somewhere that it has something to do with systemd.

~~~
KKKKkkkk1
This bug has been reported, but the Gnome folks need a Network Manager log to
fix the problem. Can you reproduce and send them the log? Here are the bug
trackers:

[https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=765831](https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=765831)
[https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-
manager/+b...](https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-
manager/+bug/1576314)

------
valarauca1
Installed 16.04 last Saturday no large issues but then my scope of
_customization_ is really small. Nvidia drivers also installed without an
issue which is honestly a first (for me on any distro).

~~~
pjmlp
Although I am mostly a Windows guy nowadays, I started using GNU/Linux
distributions back in the day with Slackware 2.0.

Tried dozens of distributions and spent endless hours trying out desktop
themes and other desktop customizations.

Nowadays I just use whatever defaults are there. Probably the only
customizations I do are related to power management and what should happen
when closing the laptop lid.

~~~
valarauca1
>Nowadays I just use whatever defaults are there. Probably the only
customizations I do are related to power management and what should happen
when closing the laptop lid.

Same boat. After ~15 years of nearly daily fighting with computers to do the
right thing. Fighting with them to look pretty WHILE doing the right thing
just seemed like wasted effort.

Also modern slackware is pretty nice.

------
KKKKkkkk1
What's kind of annoying is that Ubuntu has moved most of the system from
upstart to systemd, but user sessions are still managed by upstart. If I want
to customize my user sessions, I need to learn how to use a system that's
being phased out and is incompatible with the rest of the world.

~~~
Skunkleton
Come try Arch, you might like it here :)

------
kriro
My upgrade to 16.04 (Xubuntu) hit a rather unsuspected bump. During the
upgrade process my computer froze (the lone mechanical HD was at fault). Only
thing to do was cut the power/reset. Alas the upgrade was stuck in a limbo
state and I had to manually remove some stuff with dpkg but eventually
everything upgraded smoothly.

Interestingly I hadn't noticed that resolv.conf isn't a thing anymore and the
resolvconf package is used now...yikes how long didn't I configure a network
interface via the command line to not notice that :D

Runs very smoothly on my systems and my parents' systems.

------
listic
In 16.04 they broke importing a saved VPN configuration. Again. Previous time
they broke it with a previous LTS release, 14.04 (sic!) [1]

Another failure of such magnitude that affected me - breaking the switching
between keyboard layouts with Ctrl+Shift (to introduce a new dialog in place
of the one that worked for years) was in 13.10 - not the LTS release, at
least.

I wonder if they will fix the VPN by 16.04.1, due in July.

Sometimes I wish they were not so strict about time-based releases, if only to
allow for the bugs like this one to be fixed.

[1] [https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager-
op...](https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager-
openvpn/+bug/1294899)

~~~
cxseven
What did you mean about their strictness? Does Ubuntu not push out fixes for
critical problems like this except at certain times?

~~~
listic
I mean they rather strictly hold on to the release schedule [1]: _ready or
not_ , you can count on .04 version to come by the end of April, rather than
in May. I'd prefer that they didn't release with such glaring bugs as I
mentioned, even if a bit late.

[1] Xenial Xerus Release Schedule
[https://wiki.ubuntu.com/XenialXerus/ReleaseSchedule](https://wiki.ubuntu.com/XenialXerus/ReleaseSchedule)

------
gpderetta
So, in the last few weeks I updated an old Kubuntu 14.04 desktop installation
(which has seen little or no use in the last few years) up to 16.04. Now kwin
dies as soon as I login and I open any window. The underlying reason is
probably some badly updated package or config file. Still, attaching the
debugger I can see kwin segfaulting inside the Qt Javascript interpreter. I
have no idea why a window manager would need to run a javascript interpreter
nor why it would be a good idea.

Bottom line, tonight I'm installing Debian testing and switching to Xfce
(which I have been using for years on my latptop).

------
jejones3141
I did a double take at one sentence in the article: "In order to retain some
file browser functionality, Nautilus remains at version 3.14." That sounds
like the current version of Nautilus has no file browser functionality--which
struck me as ironic, because a while back I tried everything I found suggested
to stop Nautilus from changing my wallpaper (um, Unix philosophy?) to no
avail, and ended up reconfiguring Cinnamon so it would always run Nemo and
never run Nautilus.

I hope what was meant was that 3.14 had some particular features related to
file browsing that later versions dropped.

------
falcolas
Question for those who have an install of 16.04 - if you type `hostname -f`,
do you get the "command not found" error? I didn't have time to dig into it,
but the man pages indicated that `-f` was still a valid option, but it appears
that `hostname` was shifted to quasi-function.

I came upon this while trying to bring up my vagrant development box against
16.04, part of which was to set the hostname via `server.vm.hostname`.

~~~
mclemme
You mean in a console? Works fine here.

~~~
falcolas

        $ vu development-16
        Bringing machine 'development-16' up with 'virtualbox' provider...
        ==> development-16: Importing base box 'ubuntu/xenial64'...
        ==> development-16: Matching MAC address for NAT networking...
        ==> development-16: Checking if box 'ubuntu/xenial64' is up to date...
        ==> development-16: Setting the name of the VM: ubuntu-xenial-16.04-cloudimg
        [...]
        ==> development-16: Machine booted and ready!
        ==> development-16: Checking for guest additions in VM...
        ==> development-16: Setting hostname...
        The following SSH command responded with a non-zero exit status.
        Vagrant assumes that this means the command failed!
    
        hostname -f
    
        Stdout from the command:
    
    
    
        Stderr from the command:
    
        sudo: unable to resolve host ubuntu-xenial
        mesg: ttyname failed: Inappropriate ioctl for device
        hostname: Name or service not known
    
        $ vssh development-16
        Welcome to Ubuntu 16.04 LTS (GNU/Linux 4.4.0-22-generic x86_64)
    
         * Documentation:  https://help.ubuntu.com/
    
          Get cloud support with Ubuntu Advantage Cloud Guest:
            http://www.ubuntu.com/business/services/cloud
    
        0 packages can be updated.
        0 updates are security updates.
    
    
        ubuntu@ubuntu-xenial:~$ hostname
        ubuntu-xenial
        ubuntu@ubuntu-xenial:~$ hostname -f
        hostname: Name or service not known
        ubuntu@ubuntu-xenial:~$ which hostname
        /bin/hostname
        ubuntu@ubuntu-xenial:~$ \hostname -f
        hostname: Name or service not known
        ubuntu@ubuntu-xenial:~$ cat /etc/lsb-release
        DISTRIB_ID=Ubuntu
        DISTRIB_RELEASE=16.04
        DISTRIB_CODENAME=xenial
        DISTRIB_DESCRIPTION="Ubuntu 16.04 LTS"
    

Fun times.

~~~
mclemme
Seems very odd, here it works

    
    
      clemme@ubuntu:~ $ hostname -f
      ubuntu
    
      clemme@ubuntu:~ $ cat /etc/lsb-release 
      DISTRIB_ID=Ubuntu
      DISTRIB_RELEASE=16.04
      DISTRIB_CODENAME=xenial
      DISTRIB_DESCRIPTION="Ubuntu 16.04 LTS"

~~~
falcolas
Yeah, does seem odd. Looks like I'll need to ping Vagrant, since
`ubuntu/xenial64` is their managed box.

------
technofiend
Based on feedback here and on reddit, I plan to jump on with the next minor
release. Maybe Mate will fix the issues found in using the Citrix receiver on
Unity.

[https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/4h58mj/ubuntu_1604_i...](https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/4h58mj/ubuntu_1604_is_just_so_unstable/)

------
fouadf
I installed it from scratch on my laptop, had trouble installing chrome and
virtualbox. Two straightforward installs required me to fix using the command-
line, that was a deal breaker for me. Not the smooth start I was hoping for, I
don't have the time to manually fix everything. Back to 14.04

~~~
ergo14
It seems that the new gnome store thingie, does not pull dependencies when you
try to install deb file directly, not sure why (at least it does that in
ubuntu gnome 16.04). A command line install will indeed work just fine.

------
arca_vorago
I've been running 16.04 with cairo-dock, which has been my favorite non
i3/awesome setup in a while.

~~~
G43nm45ji
The only thing stopping me from using it is the window shadows. I wish there
was an easy way to turn it off.

~~~
lamarkia
The shadows are quite subtle. How does it annoy you?

You can disable through 'compizsettings'.

------
larrik
When I installed 12.04 LTS, I was shocked at how radically different it was
than 11.10, and that it was going to be an LTS release. This introduced Unity
as the default, among other changes, and I was concerned that they were being
too aggressive.

It's odd to be applauding them for this attitude, frankly.

~~~
pmlnr
I loved 10.10. That would have been a perfect LTS distro.

~~~
Santosh83
Yup. My all time favourite Ubuntu releases were 6.06 (Dapper Drake) and 10.10
(Maverick Meerkat); 14.04 has also been rock solid.

------
TazeTSchnitzel
I remember fglrx being essential for gaming, even if it was awful. Are the
open-source drivers better now, such that dropping fglrx support won't be a
big problem?

~~~
lamarkia
For most games, amdgpu is ok. If your game requires fglrx, then stick to 14.04
or 15.10.

fglrx does not work on 16.04 and all resources from AMD now go to amdgpu so it
gets fully useful by the end of 2016.

------
Thaxll
The Dell XPS 2016 doesn't work properly, there is a graphic bug where your
screen keeps flickering. It seems fixed using the 4.6 DRM kernel.

------
rdtsc
Anyone tried ZFS from 16.04 yet? How did that go?

------
herbst
Why is never anyone talking about using Ubuntu with Gnome 3? Mate is outdated
by design, LXDE a Win95 clone and don't even let us get started with unity.

The only 2 modern and productivity focused WMs (except from everything tiled)
are KDE and Gnome 3.

~~~
Karunamon
You say modern and productivity focused, I say bloated and opinionated. Gnome
and KDE seem to want to show off, while Mate/LXDE wants to get out of my way
and let me work.

Gnome brings nothing new or interesting to the UI table. An "activities"
system that doesn't match the way actual people use their computers, a mobile-
first design that I swear was cribbed from Microsoft, just with a rough file
taken to the window corners. (This looks more and more out of place when you
see something like, say, the Boxes app. Why does my virtualization tool look
like a tablet toy?), and oh yeah, developers who will break your shit and then
tell you its for your own good when you go to complain, if they respond at
all.

(Me? Bitter?)

KDE at least doesn't suffer from those problems, but I find the UI to be gaudy
(think WinXP Luna), and unless you like bright themes, unusable.

~~~
herbst
Personally i love to use Gnome because it gets out of my way so perfectly. Its
like it is only there when i just need it, and this works flawlessly with 2
screens (where most WMs including Metro have annoying issues)

It really comes down to personal preference, i am aware of that. But using a
UX style that was invented more than 20 years ago seems a bit strange to me as
well. (Cinnamon, Mate, LXDE, XFCE, ...)

I agree that it is a bit bloated. Before i had my current machine i used
fluxbox with FBpanel, because Gnome, KDE and unity would lag like mad.

~~~
mixmastamyk
It's because the "old styles" worked well and were easily discoverable, tested
over decades instead of at random whim.

The new fischer-price look and feel desktops however target grandma and
tablets, and are not what I need in a workstation at all. Mate is almost as
good as the XP/Classic theme was, it's all been downhill from there, where
every good new feature comes with debilitating regressions.

------
yandrypozo
what's the Linux's bleeding edge ??

~~~
Santosh83
Fedora Rawhide, Debian Sid, Arch, Ubuntu Development Version, OpenSUSE
Tumbleweed. Of these Tumbleweed waits a while before upgrading from upstream
so it's not literally the bleeding edge. So is Ubuntu Development version.

And only Arch and Tumbleweed are recommended to be used by plain users (as
opposed to developers and beta testers).

~~~
shmerl
Debian testing used to be recommended.

~~~
Santosh83
Yes, but Testing isn't a full rolling release AFAIK. It undergoes a lengthy
freeze before a new Stable is released and I believe manual intervention is
needed to continue staying on Testing. Plus security patches take a bit of
time to land on Testing from Sid, so the Debian guys don't recommend Testing
if you need the fastest access to security updates.

~~~
shmerl
_> Yes, but Testing isn't a full rolling release AFAIK. It undergoes a lengthy
freeze before a new Stable is released_

Not more than unstable really. The only difference, testing is more polished
overall. Other than that, they are both semi-rolling. Debian tried to reduce
freeze period for a while already, and the last one was shorter than one
before that.

 _> and I believe manual intervention is needed to continue staying on
Testing._

What kind? Normally it should just roll forward.

------
vintermann
When I clicked yes to upgrading Kubuntu to 16.04, it broke hard, into a state
which would be 100% unrecoverable for grandma (and quite likely the support
guy she would have shipped it too as well).

~~~
pen2l
There should be an Ubuntu-distribution called Gubuntu, (Ubuntu for grandmas).

No, seriously, there's a serious market for this -- Ubuntu's UI is crap (with
the little triangles indicating which windows are open? Give me a break, I'm
mid-20s and I have trouble seeing that). We cannot have that for our grandmas,
gnome would probably be better.

Also, grandmas don't need a lot of bells and whistles... only the absolute
bare essentials. Like wordprocessing and and internet browser... the
minimalism nature would make support easier for you.

Lastly, I guess consider Windows 7. Windows 7 was probably the high point in
terms of "oh, it's obvious how I do this..." for grandmas (I think the flat
theming in Win10 took that away).

~~~
Santosh83
Since a few years I've settled upon Xubuntu, because I like the Ubuntu base
and the XFCE desktop environment. Personally, I think it hits close to the
happy middle ground between lean and minimalistic on the one hand and flashy
with everything including the kitchen sink on the other hand. I think MATE
(UbuntuMATE) is also virtually equivalent to XFCE (Xubuntu).

Something like Xubuntu, UbuntuMATE, Linux Mint or elementaryOS might fit the
bill for grandmas (and for me, as I want something that just works, is
relatively simple and resource efficient and based on the traditional desktop
paradigm).

~~~
anthk
Not only for grandmas. XFCE with Compton is perfect for any user.

