
If I Were Google, I Wouldn’t Release A Native iOS 6 Maps App For Six Months - ryandvm
http://techcrunch.com/2012/09/19/if-i-were-google-i-wouldnt-release-a-native-ios-6-maps-app-for-six-months/
======
robomartin
Just throw an old 3GS or 4 in your pocket and use Google Maps by creating a
private WiFi hot-spot with your iPhone 5.

Wait a minute. The iPhone 5 doesn't do that. Hey, but it's longer, thinner and
faster. What else do you want?

It almost reminds me of Microsoft Word. Once MS Word got to the point where it
did pretty much everything the majority of users wanted it to do there really
was not reason to upgrade. As my own example, the only reason I upgraded some
of our systems to Office 2007 was because we needed 64 bit systems for Finite
Element Analysis and Office 2003 wouldn't go there.

I know that they'll sell a lot of iPhone 5's, but I really think that they are
starting to loose the magic. I, for one, don't really care about thinner or
lighter beyond the 4S. A little larger, maybe, but there are so many things
that the next generation iPhones could or should be doing that I can't imagine
why Apple would pull resources into trying to out-map Google.

3D fly-over map views? Really? How much money did they waste on that crap?

It's almost like Siri. It's a big smelly, smoldering pile of crap. I don't
know of anyone that actually uses it. And it sure as hell doesn't work one bit
like the TV ads. What a waste.

~~~
headShrinker
Yet another rant about how "Apple is loosing it". Very tiring. I can't wait
until people stop complaining and start being constructive again. I miss that
here.

Yes the maps blow. So let's talk about maps, not the entire complete product
which you seem to loth. No offense by this, just would like to move past
venting for the sake of venting.

~~~
aufreak3
Users are human and such generalization is what we "lusers" slip into when
we're so radically disturbed by something.

The post is a rant alright, but I'm pissed just the same that Apple's maps
doesn't recognize "The Music Academy" in Chennai. It knows my local street,
shows a hospital nearby on the map (with correct name) and yet when I put in
the name of the hospital in the box to find directions, it can't find the
location! The search results are total crap and unaware of the location from
which I'm searching (though I've already told it that [edit: I'm in India and
it gives autocompletion results to destinations in Austria ... by walk!).

I could go on .. but then again, this will be a rant as well. Here is a
"constructive" comment to Apple - put in a new maps app and refine it over
time alright, but let us keep the Google maps app alongside. Is that too much
to ask?

~~~
ryannielsen
_put in a new maps app and refine it over time alright, but let us keep the
Google maps app alongside. Is that too much to ask?_

If Google had a maps app, it wouldn't be too much to ask. Google doesn't have
a maps app; iOS has a maps app, which was powered by Google up until iOS 6.
If/when Google creates a maps app, I'm willing to bet Apple will approve it
for the App Store, just as they've approved Chrome and Gmail.

Apple's contract to use Google as the back-end data source for iOS's Maps app
expired and, for all we know, _Google_ refused to renegotiate another
contract. I doubt that's the case, but anyone asserting anything either way is
simply speculating unless they're sourcing from someone at Apple or Google.

~~~
aufreak3
whatever .. I reserve my right as a user (who's paid for the device) to have
expectations of functionality - the business side of things be damned.

For now, I've done an "add to home screen" of the google maps mobile device
page. Works _much_ better for me than the native maps.

~~~
ryannielsen
I never said you should limit your expectations. I was simply laying out
facts. You can like them or hate them, that's entirely up to you; I personally
don't care either way.

I'm glad you've found a more usable replacement for iOS 6's Maps.

------
veidr
The iOS 6 maps subsystem is the worst OS component regression Apple has
shipped since Open Transport 1.0.

It is _really_ bad, and if navigating a city is one of your key phone usage
scenarios, this change makes Apple's arch-rival's devices significantly more
attractive than they otherwise would be.

I carry around both the latest Apple phone and the latest Google phone, and
this is one area where the Google phone was already significantly superior,
even before this fairly astonishing regression in iOS 6. Now the gap is much
wider.

Google could (mostly) fix that for Apple by releasing a Google maps app, but
why should they?

~~~
zachalexander
I think it's a tricky question.

Wait six months: increases the pain iOS users feel, and possibly increases
migration to Android, but by how much? If you've bought an iPhone 5, in many
cases that means a 1-year contract (or renewal). And in six months, Apple may
have released a better Maps app that fixes the problem.

Release Google Maps for iOS sooner: iPhone users feel less pain, but Google
Maps keeps more users.

Actually though, the more I think of it, even in the latter scenario, Apple
still wins, because whenever they release their fixed Maps app, they win back
the entire market because they own the platform. So maybe the first strategy
actually makes more sense.

~~~
dannyr
Well, not every IPhone user upgraded the past week or so. Some people might
think twice about upgrading to the IPhone 5 based on the complaints on the
Maps app.

While there are people who are loyal Apple fans, there are some that are on
the fence. This might be enough to push them over to Android or Windows Phone.

Once you go to another platform, you're likely locked into a 2-year contract
and it's going to be hard for Apple to get them back.

~~~
evoxed
> Once you go to another platform, you're likely locked into a 2-year contract
> and it's going to be hard for Apple to get them back.

I think it would be very interesting though to see what would happen if Apple
did face some sort of collateral damage whether for this or some other
decision. Apple hasn't exactly found itself in many tight spots, or at least
doesn't let it show. If a significant chunk of users left and Apple decided it
was worth it to get them back, the fastest way to get over the contract hump
is just what they've done occasionally in the past: cut the price,
aggressively. Of course, this might not be realistic except in some warped
little technodoomsday scenario, but still... _I wonder..._

------
vosper
Mapping is, for me, the single greatest boon of smartphones. Nothing else is
appreciated in a pinch like a good map or routing - I could do away with
everything else.

For Apple to cripple such a fantastic feature and leave themselves at the
mercy of their arch-rival - whom they've been energetically suing - is
baffling.

~~~
joshu
I love the fact that I can parachute in to some random city and walk around
like I know what I am doing between maps and Yelp. I do not want to give that
up.

~~~
philjohn
Have you tried the new maps? The only real regressions I can see are poorer
satellite imagery coverage (big whoop - it's a gimmick for 90% of the time)
and non existent public transport routing. In my experience in the UK, the
public transport routing never really worked on the google provided maps
either.

The maps themselves are provided by TomTom and in the UK and Europe at least
they are very high quality, can't speak for the US.

~~~
masklinn
> The only real regressions I can see are poorer satellite imagery coverage

Map coverage of US campuses is also way down. Which makes a very small but
vocal segment (US uni students) completely lose their mind over the issue. If
you go to the apple/iphone subreddit, 9 out of 10 maps criticisms are US uni
campus.

On the other hand, considering how those things work, I'd expect non-US
locations to be just as downgraded as US campus (and testimonies in this
thread seem to confirm it)

------
Irfaan
_"If I were Google, I wouldn’t launch a native Maps app for iOS 6 for at least
six months, [...]"_

If I were in Google's shoes, I wouldn't be launching a native Maps app.
Period.

It's not like Maps is driving vast amounts of search revenue for Google. And
with the degraded functionality of Apple's own Maps app, Google's Map app has
become a reason for a buyer to consider switching to a Google-blessed Android
phone.

And I say this as a long-time iPhone user - Maps was an important application
for me. Now that it's become less functional, I'm going to actively look at
Android and WP.

~~~
rimantas

      > If I were in Google's shoes, I wouldn't be launching
      > a native Maps app. Period.
    

I hope Google does just that. It takes a nontrivial amount of stupidity to
think that Apple does not know shortcomings of its maps application and are
not working on fixing that.

Loosing iOS users for some barely noticeable amount of switchers is hardly a
good business for Google—do they even make money from Android phones someone
sells? I heard Microsoft makes more money than Google does.

~~~
Irfaan
" _I hope Google does just that. It takes a nontrivial amount of stupidity to
think that Apple does not know shortcomings of its maps application and are
working on fixing that._ "

I'm... not sure how to parse that sentence. I guess it's implying I have a
non-trivial amount of stupidity, which probably explains my parsing problem.

Transit routing is a _hard_ problem to scale - Apple has taken a shortcut and
pushed it off to 3rd party developers, who can tackle the much more
approachable problem of solving it on a city-by-city basis. Which make
sense... but this is still a _large_ regression as far as users are concerned.
And doesn't help folks that live in smaller cities.

Yes, Apple is probably working on this. But now we come to an odd signalling
issue - Apple has basically told 3rd parties that it is worth their time
investing in this area. If-and-when Apple opts to plug this functionality
hole, they've pulling the rug out from under these developers. And any app
developer worth his salt has to be factoring that.

And I'd be _really_ surprised if Apple steps in any sooner than the next iOS
refresh - fixing transit seems like a wonderful bullet point for iOS7.

" _Loosing iOS users for some barely noticeable amount of switchers is hardly
a good business for Google [...]_ "

Err... what are they losing, exactly? Users aren't inherently valuable. If
there's value these iOS users add to Google, I'd love to hear it.

Google is already generating local search and behavioral data via their large
Android install base. Beyond brand visibility (which is going to be reduced,
thanks to Apple's own offering), what does releasing their own native app get
them? A native version that, again I want to emphasis, Apple is actively
competing against their own product. Whatever Google releases, it is now going
to be a 2nd class citizen, without the OS-level hooks Apple's own solution
gets. And this assumes that Apple even _lets_ them release an app. This
wouldn't be the first time Apple has blocked Google from releasing an
application on iOS because it duplicates existing 1st party functionality.

Basically - _why_ should Google release their own app?

" _—do they even make money from Android phones someone sells? I heard
Microsoft makes more money than Google does._ "

I don't think I can adaquately address this in a response to a comment. Google
is not a charity, and Android does add to Google's bottom-line.

In closing - I'd fucking love it if Google released a native Maps app. I'm an
iPhone user that's gotten bit by this, and am sticking with iOS5 for now. But
I'm not going to hold my breathe waiting. Particularly when I don't see a
compelling reason for Google to save me.

------
bobbles
I'm pretty sure that 95% of iOS users don't even know that it WAS Google maps.
All they know is the maps on their phone suddenly don't have as much
information as they used to. (and hey that new flyover thing looks cool)

I don't really see holding out on a release being beneficial to Google, in
fact quite the opposite.

Now people will have an app called 'Google Maps' that will be the one they
know and love, and might even get them to consider 'hey, maybe i should check
out those Google phones as well'.

I'm personally going to hold out on iOS6 for a little while longer while some
of the issues get explained or ironed out.

------
ardit33
I am surprised Samsung didn't pounce on this opportunity in their marketing
materials.

Instead they are propping features like "Palm Picture Capture", "Tilt to
Mute", and other dumb things that nobody really cares about.
[http://images.latinospost.com/data/images/full/5424/samsung-...](http://images.latinospost.com/data/images/full/5424/samsung-
galaxy-s3-vs-iphone-5.jpg?w=600)

Things like this is what differentiates great companies, from ones that just
doen't get it. Users don't care about useless feature list, they care about
end experience.

------
swang
Anyone who says, "just use the mobile web version!" has never actually used
the Google Maps app (what do I even call this now?)

Not being able to visually see bus routes (without clicking on another link)
and the directions, and then also compare them to walking times is a big
feature missing in the mobile web version. It also suffers from a large "below
the fold" problem where on my iPhone 4S I cannot see the directions because
the inputs for the start and end location take up so much space. It took me a
while before I realized that Google had already loaded my directions.

The only upside to mobile is having access to bike routes.

------
mladenkovacevic
This is exactly the OPPOSITE of why I'm intrigued and impressed by Google as a
company. They just want people to have access to their services. They are not
about authoritative control over who gets access and locking their users in a
walled garden. Android is wonderful and Google's done a great job of
integrating their services with it.. but why shouldn't iOS users have at least
some of the same benefits (if Apple allows them of course)

~~~
hcarvalhoalves
"They are not about authoritative control over who gets access and locking
their users in a walled garden."

You think the iOS maps app was stagnant for such a long time because of what?
Because Apple is lazy?

It's obvious they don't want to be on the hand of a competitor. Google Maps
used to be free with a large API quota when released, remember? Then, once
everybody was using it, they updated the API and imposed a much more limited
free quota (almost useless), and released a premium version.

Well, I tried getting in touch with _anyone_ at Google to get a quote about
the price for their premium API. I couldn't even _talk to a human_ , let alone
pay for the service. Now imagine you're Apple, and how much Google would
charge.

~~~
vosper
But there's just no possible way Apple can win out of this - there is nothing
really comparable to Google Maps out there, and mapping has been core iPhone
functionality from the get-go. Many people rely on it every day. Even if
Google were charging a huge premium behind the scenes Google Maps have always
been presented as "the Apple iPhone mapping app" not "Google Maps for iPhone"
and so it'll reflect on Apple for messing it up, not Google.

~~~
Gustomaximus
Nothing comparable? I thought Microsoft and Nokia both have pretty decent
mapping.

~~~
hcarvalhoalves
Yes, my dad has a Nokia and the last time we travelled we used it's maps
application, not the one in my iOS 5. The old iPhone app is simply impossible
to use with 3G, it looks like it downloads bitmaps instead of vector data, and
takes ages to update.

------
jser
The lack of including public transit routing was a huge miss -- the "Designed
in California", everyone has a car confused the decision making.

I've found the Embark transit applications to be a great alternative (at least
for Chicago). It doesn't make up for other missing features like Street View,
but you'd be surprised how many users did not even know those features
existed.

~~~
bathat
Unfortunately, Embark's applications don't do inter-city transit, and they
only exist for a few large cities. Even with a 3rd party app installed, and
completely ignoring the regression in UX, iOS 6 has a major regression in
functionality. Try typing the following into Google maps: "Redondo Beach to
UCSB" Then look at the public transit options.

This is a completely plausible scenario, and look at how Google shines:

1) Seven different transit agencies are represented in the first four
suggested routes: LA County Metro, LA City DOT, Culver City Bus, Amtrak,
Metrolink and Santa Barbara Transit

2) Google has no trouble mixing and matching the agencies to find the best
route (but gives the user the option of reducing transfers).

3) Each route option only requires a subset of those, usually three.

4) Google knows that UCSB means University of California Santa Barbara, and
picks a reasonable location on campus

5) This journey works my iPhone 4, but not on an iPhone 5

------
neop
Many people here seem to be reading this as "Apple is stupid for switching to
their own map app". But I think reading it as "Google is smart for forcing
Apple to switch to an inferior map app" is a more realistic situation.

------
dannyr
I remember tech pundits years ago saying that Android needs a killer app. I
guess Android finally has one. It's Google Maps.

~~~
eavc
For me it was always Google Maps thanks to the navigation.

------
minikomi
iOS6 maps simply does not work in Tokyo. Here's a comparison my friend
posted.. Tokyo Station doesn't exist at all, and the level of details is
woeful.

[https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-
snc6/27725...](https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-
snc6/277259_2354251073403_1105258603_o.jpg)

~~~
kalleboo
This one's better: <https://twitter.com/ahm/status/248064518566051840>

The lack of train lines on the maps until you zoom in super-far is shockingly
bad. At least your friend managed to find things with his searches - most of
my searches for Japanese addresses just come up with "not found" error.
Apple's maps definitely seem far more car-oriented than walking or public-
transit oriented.

I've taken to carrying an Android phone along with my iPhone.

~~~
sukuriant
To be fair, they look about the same, they're just not marked and the transit
system isn't drawn in. It's just blank. If the transit system still exists and
is accessible in the back end, then it's not so bad and is actually about the
same --- just doesn't look as pretty.

Oh, and I'm not an Apple fanboy. The most recent piece of Apple hardware I
have is a iPhone 3G. My upgrade from that was a Motorola Droid and then a
Droid Bionic.

~~~
minikomi
It's really not usable.

Apart from having NO STATION (It's a really really big station - busiest and
one of the biggest in Tokyo) several different train line's terminals are
merged into one blue blip smack bang in the center.

There are no convenience stores / landmark shops (eg. mosburger) which ALL
Japanese use to find their way around due to lack of order in building numbers
(no street numbers.)

The 26, 27 etc. you see are numbered blocks which people use to find addresses
- not visible on new map.

No indication of one way streets in most cases. Shinjuku, like many dense
parts of Tokyo, has a lot of one way streets.

------
mjcohenw
I think Apple believes that their map app will eventually become as good as
Google's.

Also, by doing this, Apple denies Google the information about what locations
Apple's users are looking for and makes this available to only Apple.

------
TallboyOne
Christ guys, I count 5 misspellings of 'loose' and 'lose' in this thread. It's
NOT that hard.

------
kevinsd
If I were Apple, I would had been very pissed off with Google's inferior Maps
app for iOS than its Android one. If Maps is so core to a smartphone's overall
experience, perhaps it is better to break it from a competitor's control
sooner than later.

~~~
SquareWheel
You do realize Apple created the app, right? Google only provides the data.

~~~
neop
But Google placed restrictions on how Apple could use the data. For example,
Google did not allow Apple to have turn by turn navigation.

~~~
SquareWheel
I'm not familiar, is Google specifically blocking Apple from using that data
or have they simply not published an API for turn-by-turn yet?

~~~
X-Istence
Google requires a contract if you want to use their mapping data in
applications or if you go over certain free limits (which Apple's app
certainly did).

This contract allegedly contained terms that disallowed Apple from
implementing Turn by Turn directions in their application.

------
epoxyhockey
My bet is that the end users aren't even going to notice. I switched my
website maps from Google to OSM/Leaflet and absolutely no one noticed or cared
enough to email me about it.

Disclaimer: I didn't use OSM's default/ugly color palette. Disclaimer #2: I
_have_ used iOS 6 maps, and the most visible change (other than the color
palette) is that subway markers are clickable and that Yelp is more tightly
integrated into the pin details.

~~~
notatoad
End users maybe won't notice if they live in a major city and never want to
leave. My town (which is small, but not nowhere: a fairly major tourist
destination near a large city) has gone from detailed satellite imagery to no
more than about 500 total pixels. You don't need to be a power user to see
that kind of regression.

~~~
philjohn
Do you actually use the satellite imagery that often? Most people I know used
it once, to look at their house, then switched it back to the map view.

For Apple, they just need to license more satellite data, which they no doubt
will. Google maps satellite coverage was pretty sketchy in the early days too.

~~~
gman99
Well, it's kindof nice to get high resolution satellite photos when you're
getting walking directions in a city you've never been in. Atleast I found
this useful on Android.

Not a dealbreaker, I guess, I'd just be mildly annoyed if I lose that

------
headShrinker
Does anyone know why in the 5 years of the maps app it was never updated? Is
it possible Google didn't want to maintain the app on iOS? We are assuming
Apple had some control over whether the Google app stayed on iOS but the
contract was up, and it's possible Google didn't want to renew. After all,
Google has a web based app that works on iOS... Maybe that's all Google wants
to give.

~~~
raldi
Google didn't write the iOS 1-5 Maps app. Apple did.

------
hcarvalhoalves
Really? Although the maps show less information, I found the navigation
feature much more usable now. For me, it's the most useful feature since I
don't have a car with GPS and TomTom's app is pricey. Now I have it built-in.

For finding other stuff I can always use other apps or Google Maps mobile,
which is very decent too.

~~~
LoganCale
The routing is nice. The maps themselves are much less detailed and in many
areas have no detail at all or are completely incorrect, in the sense that
they show roads in places where there have never been roads, and roads which
have been there for 30 years are absent.

~~~
hcarvalhoalves
The maps are okay for me, but I'm in a big city (São Paulo). Since the map
data comes from TomTom, it should be decent, at least that's the GPS everybody
I know uses.

------
Gustomaximus
Has anyone used Ovi maps in iOS? I used to prefer Ovi Maps to Google Maps for
navigation type usage back when I used both a E71 and Android handset.

I wonder if Nokia has any ambition take advantage of the current situation?

~~~
fpgeek
Given that Nokia is already selling map data to Amazon for the Kindle Fire,
they almost certainly do. That being said, their means of taking advantage
might be pointing out their WP8 phones' relative advantage in this area.

------
pinaceae
If I were Google and my main stream of income was ads, I would not give a shit
about platforms and release map apps with ads for any relevant platform.

Not like Google makes significant money off of Android itself.

But, the more apps and platforms switch off it, less eyeballs will see your
ads. A bunch of apps switched to OpenMaps already, right? The whole GMaps API
bruhaha already forgotten?

But this doesn't fit into that nerd-rage fueled platform war narrative, so
disregard. First OS to include a neckbeard trimmer wins.

------
rdl
This clearly makes commercial sense for Google in the short/medium term, but
fails "don't be evil".

I got screwed by iOS 6 Beta's lack of transit directions in NYC this summer; I
had no reason to expect a serious feature regression, and I'm amazed this made
it to release. It might be a Cupertino vs SF thing, but really, even a car
owning Bay Area tech person is going to use the subway when visiting NYC or
some other cities, so even Apple employees though have prioritized it.

~~~
stickfigure
How does not adding features to a competitor's product fail "don't be evil"?

Sounds more like "don't be stupid". We don't see Apple distributing _Siri for
Android_.

------
steve8918
I would pay a lot of money for a native Google Maps app. It's the single most
used feature for me on my phone.

The only feature I want is the ability to download maps to the phone. Going to
another country and not having maps is debilitating. I spent $300 by not
realizing how much data I would download, and download a map while in the
middle of one of the Great Lakes in Canada. Being able to download maps while
at a wifi connection for the city that I'm in is crucial.

------
bdreadz
It's not mentioned here yet. In safari or chrome on iOS going to
maps.google.com works pretty darn well. Except for showing me what direction
I'm currently facing it is pretty darn close.

So if the new app is giving you that much trouble or you need that little bit
more of information that google provided you. Just open it up.

------
PhuFighter
heh. Google can't release a Maps app - mostly because that would be
duplicating a service that Apple already provides, and apple hates competition
!

~~~
nsp
This was more true in 2008-2010 maybe, but recently Apple has been much less
restrictive. There are 3rd party browsers (chrome, opera, Firefox)*, 3rd party
mail apps(gmail, Firefox), and 3rd part maps apps (tomtom).

That said, the lack of third party transit from apple is pretty horrible, and
the API for the maps app is pretty limited (you have to throw the start and
end points to your app, there's no overlays or anything like that)

