

The Rise of the Software Apprenticeship Academy - Croaky
http://bostinno.com/channels/the-rise-of-the-software-apprenticeship-academy/

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swanson
Is there some sweet spot for a developer with ~1-3 years of industry
experience? Most of these programs note that all you need is basic programming
knowledge - but is there anything out there for 'junior developers on the
rise' that are already learning and advancing but want to turbocharge or learn
under the leaders in the industry?

It's probably a lame excuse, but it's hard to trade in a steady paycheck for
six months of either paying tuition or going back to living on a student
stipend.

I _really_ like the apprenticeship model but I feel like the logistics don't
work out for anyone that isn't looking to get into programming for the first
time or just graduated college.

~~~
kauerrolemodel
If you have a good base of the right skills, I'd bet that some of theses
"learning and teaching" organizations (like ours, RoleModel) would be
interested in talking to you about a Jr. position and you'd get much of the
same training. You may or may not have to take a pay cut for a little while.

If you don't already have the right skills, my guess is that most of these
programs will still work for you. It's up to you about the financial issues.
It never ceases to amaze me how poor the practices of many environments are,
so not sure what 1-3 years means.

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megamark16
I have often wondered at the lack of apprenticeship programs in our industry.
We use unpaid interns at my day job and they basically sit on the other side
of the building do whatever odd jobs management can come up for them to work
on, instead of actually learning the specifics of what we do. The one intern
that we ended up hiring full time has slowly started working towards picking
up development skills, but it's definitely secondary to his other duties, even
though it would benefit the agency considerably if we could get him up to
speed.

I understand companies don't want to invest in people if they are just going
to leave, but on the other hand they spend so much money trying to find good
talent. I suppose you would have to take steps once they are up to speed to
make sure you're paying them enough to keep them around. If I knew that a
company had really invested in me and gotten me to where I am, I would be more
willing to stick around, certainly more so than for a company who hasn't
really invested in me (conferences, bootcamps, books, etc).

~~~
JaredRichardson
In my opinion the problem you're describing (people leaving after getting up
to speed) has more to do with the HR department controlling salaries. If you
get a bit of experience under your belt, and get good at what you do, you've
got to switch companies to get a raise that reflects your new level of
expertise.

There are some companies that will raise your compensation to reflect your
experience, but most won't. And that's the problem.

On the other hand, not training your team costs a whole lot more! Shipping
junk products can tank your company outright.

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moocow01
I'm curious what sort of success people are having getting hired after going
through one of these. Without knowing much about them, these feel a little bit
like the ITT tech of the startup world. Sometimes CS degrees rightfully get
criticized but I'd much rather have someone who went through the rigor of CS
fundamentals who can apply those fundamentals to whatever technology rather
than someone who went through what I assume boils down to a very in depth
HTML, CSS, Ruby tutorial.

~~~
JaredRichardson
For full disclosure, I work at RoleModel, one of the companies mentioned...
but I think the intention of all the academies is to be a lot more than
targeted, long-term tutorials. They'll provide a lot of the same information
you'd get from a CS degree, but in the context of a real-world projects
instead of classroom problems. And they'll provide a lot of the information
you ~didn't~ get in that CS program. Like real world software practices,
current tooling, and so on.

Yesterday we had a junior team member run into a problem with a data
structure, so that led to an off the cuff tutorial on data structures (linked
lists, hash tables, benefits, trade offs, etc) for several team members, but
in the context of the current project. And wasn't a part of the academy, just
how we mentor our team. We've found that kind of "in context learning" is much
more effective than many classroom environments.

I'm not sure how far back the idea goes, but I've only seen it recently, so
I'm not sure what you'll find in terms of formal employment rates. However the
RoleModel program is lining up sponsors. A "sponsor", among other things, gets
first crack at interviewing the graduates.
<http://craftsmanshipacademy.com/sponsor/> But I must say, I don't think
you'll find Ruby a bad skillset to have.
<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3404616>

I strongly suspect these programs are just the beginning of the backlash
against what many are calling the higher education bubble. People are tired of
graduating thousands (or tens of thousands!) of dollars in debt after
investing years of their life. These programs compress down the process, and
eliminate a lot of the non-core learning, to help you become productive as
quickly as possible.

I have a CS degree, but have seen and worked with a number of the people that
have come through the RoleModel mentoring program in past years. I think the
academy concept is a more formal iteration of that same idea. I'm looking
forward to our first class in a few months.

~~~
UK-Al05
Do you teach 'hardcore' cs? Like the master method for working out big O?
That's is what I think he is trying to say people might be missing.

There are plenty of tutorials on the internet about data structures,
relatively few about algorithm analysis.

~~~
JaredRichardson
Big O came up yesterday, but you're right... we didn't go that deep. There are
some jobs where you'll want that depth of background, but in my career they've
been rare. At the end of the day it's about finding the right fit for
yourself. This type of training will suit some, but not others.

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loungin
It's a bit dissapointing to me that they are all focusing on web
technologies/development. I know, we're at HN and webapps are popular, but
still... Are there any with a different focus? Drivers, firmware, OSS
development? (Dislaimer: currently doing web and GIS development, perhaps I'm
getting a little bored?)

I'm asking out of curiosity, being only 2.5 years out of college with a BS in
CS.

~~~
JaredRichardson
I think they're just scratching the itch they have... a lack of those skill
sets. If it catches on, I'm sure other companies will give it a try as well.

I have found the embedded industry to be a tad more conservative (That was an
understatement. ;) ), so it may be a bit longer before they pick up the model.

