

Live From Nokia’s Windows Phone 8 Press Conference  - vyrotek
http://techcrunch.com/2012/09/05/live-from-nokia/

======
lawdawg
I am the only one that finds Metro to be ugly (hate the color choices and
block-y design) and cluttered? This does not strike me as something I want to
see on my home screen:

[http://d35lb3dl296zwu.cloudfront.net/uploads/photo/image/769...](http://d35lb3dl296zwu.cloudfront.net/uploads/photo/image/7691/axv1309.jpg)

Regardless, I'm wondering if the average consumer feels the same way as well.
WP7 is not selling well, and WP8 (and the new Lumias) don't really
differentiate themselves that much from the previous iteration in terms of
what a consumer will see in the first few minutes of using the phone.

Also, this is DOA in the US if they are AT&T exclusive.

~~~
untog
I was surprised to see a view like that being promoted. I love Metro, but I
hate app makers that don't keep to the Metro aesthetic. When it's done right:

[http://www.extremetech.com/wp-
content/uploads/2012/09/nokia-...](http://www.extremetech.com/wp-
content/uploads/2012/09/nokia-920-820-lumia-leak-640x353.jpg)

I think it looks fantastic, and communicates more than the iPhone home screen
without the mess of the Android one.

~~~
lawdawg
Even in those two screens, everything just blends together (especially with
the white text on yellow tiles). Just seems like a usability nightmare imo.

Regardless, I don't find Android home screens messy at all (although there are
a few widgets that are poorly made), and with the customization ability that's
provided with custom ROMs, it can be as beautiful as you want it to be.

------
Spearchucker
Reading a lot of anti WP sentiment, and much of it directed at WP8
(surprising, because Microsft hasn't really revealed anything about it yet).
That said, the Lumia 920 is without a doubt my next phone. Granted, I'm in a
position where price means nothing to me, so the deciding factors are wireless
charging, NFC, offline maps (not the pseudo-variety Google offers), PureView
(even if it's only a 5Mp camera I'm betting it'll still outdo anything else in
a smart phone).

I accept that no two people share the same view.

~~~
vesky
The 920 has an 8Mp camera. I got the same feeling from all the blogs covering
the event. They all talked about it through a "doubtful" lens. I kept seeing
expression like "I gotta admit it's actually nice" and "this might actually be
worth owning" that clearly states their Apple/Android affiliation.

I used to be an Android fan but after using the Lumia 820 for a month
(unlocking it for a friend), going back to a Galaxy left me a bit sad. After
WP, Android seem childish and overly hard to keep uncluttered over time.

I just hope the 920 won't be too expensive otherwise I'm gonna have to deal
with samsung for another 2 years :(

------
untog
Nokia's new phones look fantastic. But their last ones looked fantastic, too.

PureView camera? Awesome. But all my friends share photos through Instagram.
No Instagram on WP8 = me not being able to share photos with my friends. So
right now, this former WP7 user is sticking with Android.

I really, really want to like Windows Phone- the UI is better than anything
else out there. But it needs more support from third parties, and fast.

~~~
mtgx
It seems Nokia's misleading "PureView" marketing has succeed as even tech
savvy people can get confused into thinking this camera is the basically the
same as the one in the PureView 808 smartphone.

It's absolutely 100% _not_. It doesn't have a high resolution for pixel
binning to make those images ultra clear, and it doesn't have pixel binning
_at all_. Also it doesn't have that super large sensor to capture much more
light. It has a regular smartphone sensor. This is what made Pureview be
Pureview. The new camera is nothing like it. It just adds some stabilization
technology, but that's no reason to still call it PureView, other than to
mislead people into thinking it's the same as the original.

I also think WP7 looked better than WP8. The small tiles make it look more
cluttered.

~~~
freehunter
Nokia has said that PureView _is_ the new kind of optical image stabilization,
not the megapixels on the sensor. It's not misleading, you're just not
understanding it correctly. The high MP count was part of the 808 PureView,
but it wasn't what defined it as a PureView. The optical image stabilization
was. The 41-MP sensor was just Nokia showing off.

[http://www.theverge.com/2012/9/5/3293041/nokia-
lumia-920-pur...](http://www.theverge.com/2012/9/5/3293041/nokia-
lumia-920-pureview-camera)

~~~
realugglan
The original paper presenting it earlier this year:

[http://www.nokia.com/PRODUCT_METADATA_0/Products/Phones/8000...](http://www.nokia.com/PRODUCT_METADATA_0/Products/Phones/8000-series/808/Nokia808PureView_Whitepaper.pdf)

"The Nokia PureView Pro imaging technology is the combination of a large,
super high resolution 41Mpix with high performance Carl Zeiss optics. The
large sensor enables pixel oversampling, which will be explained in detail in
this paper but in a nutshell it means the combination of many pixels into one
perfect pixel. PureView imaging technology is the result of many years of
research and development and the tangible fruits of this work are amazing
image quality, lossless zoom, and superior low light performance."

So yeah, PureView vs PureView Pro or something. Still feels more like widening
a brandname used on something that got people excited.

~~~
freehunter
Well it fits in with Surface and Surface Pro. Surface is a tightly designed
and controlled tablet running Windows RT. Surface Pro is the same tablet, but
running something a little more cumbersome but with the added bonus of being
more powerful to use. PureView is a tightly designed lens. PureView Pro is the
same lens with the addition of a gigantic sensor which makes it a little more
cumbersome to use but also adds an incredible amount more power.

Seems in line with how Microsoft has been branding since at least Windows XP.

------
patd
Apparently, it's not living up to the expectations of the stock market. The
stock is down 13%. Not sure what people were hoping for.

<http://www.google.com/finance?q=NYSE%3ANOK>

~~~
ghshephard
They've announced a product, but no pricing or availability. People will
immediately stop buying the current generation, but don't have the next
generation to purchase - and there is no idea when they will be able to. Nokia
just put the brakes on sales, and haven't indicated when they'll let up on
them.

~~~
MartinCron
But the brakes have been on sales for a while, as we have known that the
latest windows phone software won't work on the existing Lumia phones.

~~~
ghshephard
Well, let's just say then that they pushed a bit harder. The difference now,
is previously I could have purchased a phone, and then in some indeterminate
period of time in the future, upgraded to a new phone, and brought all my
applications (and, much, much more importantly for most people - my
familiarity with the platform) along with me. WP8 is pretty similar to WP7 in
terms of GUI.

But now - I know what that new phone is going to look like - so buying todays
phone is like buying the previous generation. Also - it was _demoed_ - so it
feels like it's going to be released any day now...

------
lawdawg
Wow, no prices or dates? Fail.

(Guess they just wanted to announce/show off the devices before the iPhone5
announcement ... but without prices or dates, the hype is going to fade into
non-existence).

~~~
Toshio
I am now convinced that they organized this event hastily once they knew the
date for the iPhone 5 event... kind of like what they did with surface to
front-run the Nexus 7 announcement.

Smacks of desperation if you ask me.

~~~
markmm
It will fail, this is the last chance for Nokia, I expect them to go out of
the smart phone business very quickly.

~~~
rbanffy
This is _really_ scary.

If Nokia goes out of business and its patent portfolio ends up in the hands of
a patent troll, there will be an effective entry barrier in the smartphone
market (because every current smartphone maker probably has a cross-licensing
agreement in place, only new players will be affected).

My bet is Microsoft will acquire what's left of Nokia and use patents
offensively against competitors where the CLA's don't cover them, but, even if
they decide not to do so, life will get a lot more dangerous in this space.

If that's the case, I hope Google acquires them. The peace of mind not to have
that IP in Microsoft's hands is worth a lot of money.

~~~
cooldeal
I came to HN expecting to read such a comment thread and I was not
disappointed at all.

------
vyrotek
Personally, I'm really interested in WP8 and I've held off renewing my
contract for a year just to see what will come out. We've had many Android
phones in our home and I'm kind of done with them. I would like to avoid the
updates nightmare between the carriers and google.

~~~
untog
If the experience of WP7 is anything to go by, you're going to be exchanging a
nightmare between the carriers and Google with a nightmare between the
carriers and Microsoft.

AT&T flat out refused to release an update for my phone, I had to do the WP
equivalent of rooting it and manually patching myself.

~~~
vyrotek
Ah, that's rough. I was pretty upset that Sprint didn't release more WP7
phones but now I see why they held off. Unfortunately, it seems WP7 was a
transition/beta device.

But, I think _it will be different this time_ with the huge bet they're making
with Windows 8 across lots of different devices now.

~~~
EwanToo
WP7 was the beta/transition, then it was WP7.5 that was the transition, now
it'll be WP8.

I don't see a lot changing - I've used a couple of WP7.5 devices, they nice,
but they're not significantly better, or cheaper than an iPhone, Galaxy S3,
HTC One, etc, so they're going to struggle.

Microsoft's best chance of marketshare seems to be the implosion of RIM, but
that's limited to what, 10% of the market?

------
mtgx
As a side note, Nokia's stock seems to have dropped 11% today. I guess
stockholders aren't too excited about the new devices and WP8.

------
markmm
Let's see how it sells compared to the iPhone 5 and Galaxy S3. Everything else
is moot.

~~~
madoublet
Sales are important. But, lets give them some credit. This is a really well
designed phone. And if the (less than impressive) iPhone 5 leaks hold, than
this could be the first phone that is arguably designed better than the
iPhone. That is pretty impressive.

