
The Bitter Regrets of a Useless Chinese Daughter - bitcurious
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/08/23/opinion/international-world/the-bitter-regrets-of-a-useless-chinese-daughter.html
======
spyckie2
The harsh reality of 1st or 2nd generation Chinese is that while many of us
went to the top universities and grew up with a modern, 1st world mindset, we
can't escape the fact that our financial and family background is from the
developing world, and we live in both worlds at once - our mindset is modern,
but the issues and problems of the developing world are still very much things
we have to deal with.

I first encountered this dichotomy at a young age, when I was invited to my
friend's house. It was a mansion in Bel-aire. Then another friend - a beach
house overlooking Santa Monica. I was too young to know at the time, but we
lived with no savings in a small apartment, and eventually bought a modest
house, but even then, our furniture was mix-mash, we did a lot of poor quality
self repairs, and were extremely careful about spending. Our life was focused
on frugality - I remember a lot of small things I found particular, like my
mom would reuse the paper towels to clean the dishes, and our TV was older
than me by 1 year - it was my mom's TV from college.

When I was in high school, I visited my grandparents back in Taiwan, and I
vividly remember the experience, not in a good way. They used to be rich but
gambled most of their wealth away, including most of their house. It left them
with this pitiful structure, a corner skeleton of what was once a majestic
courtyard house that had fallen into disrepair and was never modernized. The
structure wasn't fully enclosed so you had to sleep in a mosquito net, and
there was barely a modern kitchen and bathroom. Needless to say, I did not
want to go back.

I eventually worked at a real estate company and got a chance to view many
houses on the market in SoCal. One step into the house and you can immediately
tell a lot about the family's background. I remember 2 houses distinctly - a
rich Asian immigrant's house, and a rich Caucasian's house. The Caucasian's
was filled with relics of community - pictures of their involvement on sports
teams, pictures of grandparents leading town hall meetings - it felt like they
were rooted into the city and were an integral part of the community there. In
contrast, the Asian immigrant's house was filled with relics of achievement -
the doctorate was posted on the wall, lots of trophies and awards for their
kids. The imagery offers a lot of insight into family and community
development lagging behind income development in immigrant families.

From developing world living conditions, to a small apartment, to a modest
house, to seeing rich houses and mansions in Bel-aire - each of these provides
me a snapshot of way more than just income. Beyond wealth, there is poverty of
taste, standards, and expectations, family practices and emotional
intelligence that define many Asian family backgrounds. Beating your kids is
not the right way to raise them. Yelling louder is not the way to win an
argument. Hiding your faults hurts your family more than it helps. Our parents
came from humble, uneducated backgrounds, and modern society and the cultural
values it instills - while a gift from them - is something they themselves
lacked.

Interestingly enough, I have a lot of friends who feel a similar regret as
this article implies. Our parents have done such a good job of creating a
modern world environment for us that we don't see the developing world
heritage until much later. What it means is that it is hard to understand the
advice and mindset of our parents growing up, and only much later do we
appreciate their perspective and effort - when it feels too late.

~~~
sametmax
Your testimony reminds me of a kid I met in Mali. The guy was our guide, and
he spoke 6 languages, including 4 local dialects, french and english. He had a
cellphone and knew how to drive a 4x4.

He drove us to the desert, in a place at the north of Bamako known as the
Dogon's country. There, he asked us if we were ok to take a detour by his
parents village, and we agreed.

His parents were living with no electricity, using water from a well, in a
small mud-made house. They slept among the goats and chickens.

It made me realized he had to live between those 2 worlds, and it felt so
unreal.

~~~
spyckie2
When Asian parents says, don't get a literature degree, become a doctor, they
have a good reason to say it.

It's not necessarily this bad in terms of standard of living (the above
description would be subsistence levels, maybe less than 200$ a year), but the
median household income in China is about $12-15k US a year compared to $56k
in the US. And it's not that in China everything is cheaper so 12-15k goes a
long way - no, they just live with less. Things that we take for granted, like
insurance, available hospitals, quality goods, good customer service, safety
of food & goods (a big one we don't even notice) - these are the result of a
developed economy, and we definitely pay for it - we (as an economic whole)
have the additional income to allow for these things to exist.

Even with a 10% GDP increase per year, it would take China another 15 years to
get to US level standard of living. With a 5% GDP growth, it would take 30
years. These are just numbers to me (12k vs 50k living, I can see one is 4
times better!), but my parents know firsthand what the difference feels like
and it makes their urgency much stronger.

For reference, I think my grandparents would be living on an equivalent of
around $2-3000 a year based on what I know my mom gives them (and maybe other
family members).

~~~
kamaal
The term you are looking for is called _Abundance_.

A few days back I was discussing this with my friend who immigrated to the US
and settled there. I'm an Indian. We were discussing how his wife and kids,
who are Americans just do not understand his perspective of things from a
living standards stand point. The thing is sometimes its impossible to erase
the effect poverty has on you. When you go through tough times, your
benchmarks to save and invest get set based on the worst times your life has
seen.

And then that spills over to every purchase or life style decision you will
ever make. Be it clothes to car or whatever.

In India I've seen people who have been born in well off families a generation
early just fail to understand why the people who have just come out of lower
middle class/poverty don't take vacations, or don't buy expensive sneakers or
gadgets or even dine at good restaurants.

When I worked in the US, I used to be totally floored at the amount of
opportunities and abundance of every thing the country had to offered. To me
most of the complaints US citizens had looked like _cry me a river_ themed
whining. Eventually I realized every one just get seasoned to whatever they
have and that sort of becomes their new reality over time.

~~~
sturgill
Both my wife and I grew up quite poor (for US standards). We didn’t quite fit
in at university and had a hard time relating to our peers who grew up with
money (my wife’s parents encouraged her to not go to school but just stay and
marry local).

We’re doing well for ourselves, but still don’t really fit in among our peers.
We’ve coined a phrase for it: “your poverty is showing.”

It doesn’t matter how much I make: at the core I’m still a poor kid in a rich
world. Which I’m fine with; it’s what gives me drive. But I do worry about my
kids who are growing up like the rich kids I never liked...

~~~
genghisjahn
My parents didn't have a lot of extra money for things, so I rarely asked for
the moon. I only asked for things I thought they could provide. But when they
couldn't (not enough $), they couldn't and that was how it was explained. "I
know you want this, I want you to have it, but I can't." As a child that is
disappointing but understandable.

For my children, when they ask for something I'm rarely not able to buy it for
them. Instead of saying I can't, I have to say, "I won't" because, well...many
reasons but mainly because kids shouldn't have every damn thing that catches
their eye. But it is a harder case to make. I'm telling them it is in my power
to give them what they ask, but I won't do it.

That is harder to do.

~~~
sturgill
"We can't afford that" was the default phrase growing up. I didn't push back,
but I also didn't really learn (so to speak). Every one of my siblings (myself
included) followed a similar pattern: as soon as we started making money, we
bought what we wanted (because we finally could). We were only really taught
that "no" was because one couldn't, not because one shouldn't.

My social experiment with my own children is still very early, but we've taken
to using the phrase, "we don't think that's worth our money." Typically
followed with, "you can spend your own money on it if it's important enough to
you." Cheap crappy plastic toys that they're going to forget about in a matter
of hours? Not worth my money. Candy at the checkout line? You have a 50/50
chance of convincing me (see above; I'm still a sucker for candy).

The other side of this was growing up we bought the cheapest of everything. On
one hand, I can't go to the grocery store without looking at per unit pricing
(which is advantageous). On the other hand, I have a hard time choosing
between more expensive quality and less expensive junk. Some things are worth
spending the real money on (our tent that we bought from REI will last
forever; the Coleman tent we bought early in our marriage lasted for one
season). But in all honesty, I'm still learning which things fall into the
"buy it right and you only buy it once" category.

And when we're invited to fancy dinner parties and eating fancy food, I can't
help but think, "I wish they just had a stack of pepperoni pizzas..."

It's hard to hide one's poverty.

~~~
milesvp
>My social experiment with my own children is still very early,

So I had a profound life lesson at around 7 or 8 years old. I had grown up
near a corner store with a lot of nickel candies, so most of my weekly dollar
allowance went to candy. I had learned how to optimize that dollar, how many
laffy taffy, vs tootsie rolls, vs licorice, vs jolly rancher... so I knew how
much satisfaction a dollar could buy. One day, we were going through a jack in
the box drivethru and they had an ad for a stuffed Pinocchio for $5, and I
begged my dad for it. He in turn said something to the effect of, "if I give
you the $5 dollars would you still buy it?", and my mind immediately started
thinking about all the things I could buy with $5. I could buy all the candy I
could want, and still have some quarters left over for the stand up arcade
games. Needless to say, I didn't really want the Pinocchio doll, certainly not
for the price when it was my money.

Sadly, I have no idea how to reproduce this lesson with my daughter. She has
so many people showering her with stuff, that she has no concept of how to
maximize her utility with the money she has. And no one seems to keep the
diverse array of cheap candy anywhere any more, which makes me kind of sad.

------
40acres
I've been struggling with dream fulfillment vs. pragmatism for weeks now. The
dillema is this: I only have a finite amount of time on the weekends and after
work -- should I work on this side project idea that I want to turn into a
start up or dedicate the time to study for interviews and secure my future
with a high salary.

Its been gnawing at me for weeks now and I think after reading this I've made
my decision.. my parents are old and sick.. I'm the most successful child and
have been covering medical bills for the past year.. it seems irresponsible to
try to start a start up that will most likely fail instead of trying to secure
a higher paying job so that I can cover their bills and live more comfortably.
It may not be the glamorous thing to do but we all have responsibilities...

~~~
mrb
Here is a practical thought experiment that might help you: picture yourself
many years from now, on your deathbed; would you have more regrets of having
gone down path A or B?

~~~
adrianN
That is not very practical, as you don't know how the future will turn out. If
they start a startup and succeed they'll likely be happy about that decision.
It's very hard to figure out expected outcomes for actions, and it's not very
productive to think about worst-case (or best-case) outcomes.

~~~
mrb
I don't think I explained myself very well. You don't need to predict the
future. You just need to estimate the amount of regret you would have by NOT
doing something.

Living a fulfilling life is about minimizing regrets. People regret not trying
to initiate relationships with potential soulmates. People regrets not trying
working on a business idea that could have been very successful. People regret
not spending more time with family. Etc. The regrets you will have on your
deathbed are probably regrets you will have carried your entire life, and thus
regrets that will have haunted you and hampered you from living a fulfilling
life.

It turns out that in many cases, regrets are independent of the outcome. For
example you may not know whether a relationship with a potential soulmate will
fail or succeed. But you will probably have more regrets by NOT giving it a
shot at all.

~~~
BeetleB
>Living a fulfilling life is about minimizing regrets.

While I very much agree with your advice on thinking of how you'll feel on
your deathbed, I would be careful in your phrasing. People often make poor
decisions about the future because they are overly concerned with whether they
will regret a decision or not. You will find many who believe that focusing on
regret will get in the way of life satisfaction, and it is a perspective worth
considering.

For me, it makes sense to make some achievable goals (relationship, career,
hobbies/activities, etc). Then start paring and prioritizing. Without the
latter, I will always have more things I would like to achieve than is
possible, and will always have regrets - it's rather pointless.

------
dangero
This resonated with me as an introvert and I'm not Chinese. There have been
many times that I've realized, I should have spent more time collecting
connections and less time working in front of the screen.

I think this also relates to the values my parents gave me that I should work
for everything I have and hard work pays off. They never asked anyone for a
favor or special privileges, so I never put much value on networking. When I
get in a tough spot my natural instinct is to put my head down and solve the
problem on my own.

Calling in a favor requires future planning because you need to collect the
right kind of friends who also understand the value of passing favors. My
observation is that it's much more common for business types, not engineers to
think this way.

~~~
kos_
You don't need to collect the "right" kind of friends. This kind of thinking
strips the humanity out of the process. It's an understandable conclusion but
highly misleading.

The simplest heuristic to use that will get you to a better place - is to
maintain/grow the connect with people you care about. What does that mean? Why
do you care about certain ppl? How do they make you feel? What needs of yours
are they meeting? How well do you understand/misunderstand their needs?And
what is involved in maintaining and growing the connect through good and bad
times?

The world can be divided into people who think about these questions all the
time and those who don't. No guesses to who has more connections and is more
comfortable calling in favours.

The good news is you too can spend time on those questions even if you
currently don't. The more you do and deeper your answers get the more
satisfying your life gets.

A large part of the human brain is devoted to social connection. But you have
to learn and exercise it for the best results.

~~~
whorleater
> You don't need to collect the "right" kind of friends. This kind of thinking
> strips the humanity out of the process. It's an understandable conclusion
> but highly misleading.

I hate myself writing this, but I'm also going to say that you sometimes don't
have the privilege of making friends for friend's sake. I'm Chinese, and in
college I went out of my way to collect "useful" friends and curry favors
because I knew that my parents (poor immigrants from Shangdong) couldn't
support me if something happened, and I would rather die before asking them
for more than they've already given me. It felt slimy and grotesque to work
relationships in this way, but for me it felt like the only way to survive and
build a safety net.

------
ak39
I am not familiar with nuances of Chinese culture, but I was so intrigued by
the "guanxi" phenomenon that I immediately and gladly spent half an hour
reading about it and watching Youtube videos of the "guanxi" culture in
China.[1]

"Guanxi" is nothing other than socially institutionalised networks of non-
monetary favours and counter-favours. It happens in every culture actually but
the thing that makes "quanxi" uniquely Chinese, in my very recent opinion, is
that the folks living there have removed it from their subconscious, their
latent and dissonant reality and made it front and center of their everyday
thinking and living philosophy. They gave it a name! It seems they've accepted
it as part of a means of survival in a world of scarcity and in so doing have
collectively abandoned the shame associated with relying on favours. They've
removed the shame of accepting that it's not only merit or competency alone
that gets you ahead - because there are many competent in a land of 1 billion
citizens - but also who you know to get you to ply your skills.

Now it seems meritocracy, as it is explained in Jianan Qian's excellently
written article, is about how _competent_ you are with your "guanxi". Next
level shit, this.

[1] [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s2GBL-
IfY3Q](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s2GBL-IfY3Q)

~~~
TheRealDunkirk
Though there's no word for it here, this is also how the poor in the US get
things done. Where the middle class become insular, and simply buys someone's
time to do things they don't want to do, the poor trade favors with a large
network of contacts to do the things that they need to get done.

~~~
sangnoir
In the UK it's known as the "Old-boy network" between former students of all-
male elite schools (Eton being the most prominent). In the US, I'm guessing
the closest is frat-bros?

~~~
walshemj
The right frats and societies at the right university's I would imagine.

------
gregw2
The author's self deprecation is brilliant. She uses her "meager useless"
writing skills to broadcast to the one of the world's largest wealthy educated
(kind?) audiences, readers of the NYTimes (not to mention HN), also subtly
shaming anyone responsible for her mother's poor care past or future to the
broadest most influential audience she can reach. What more can a mother ask
for? I'm proud of her. Guanxi is not the only form of human influence in the
world... isn't the "pen mightier than the sword?" (Sometimes). I wish the best
for her and her mother.

------
cbhl
One of the least useful pieces of start-up advice I received in college was,
"if your startup fails, don't worry, you can go live in your parents'
basement."

Well, fine, if your parents owned their home, the worst you have to deal with
is the shame of failing. If I did a start-up and it failed, it's probable that
my parents wouldn't even have a basement for me to return home to.

~~~
kaskavalci
Hence you don't have a safety net and can't be an entrepreneur. If you can
take the chance of getting rich or becoming homeless, good luck with that.
Otherwise, 9-5 jobs are the only option.

~~~
eiurafhlfie
If you are middle class (~$30k-$70k per annum) you can be wealthy* by focusing
your spending on freedom, aka capital investments. I did not understand this
was an option before reading the blog of Mr. Money Mustache[0]. Reading that
and the Living a FI blog[1] may hopefully be as life-changing to you reading
this comment as it was for me.

* Wealthy in time to spend with those you love

[0] [https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/](https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/)

[1] [https://livingafi.com/](https://livingafi.com/)

~~~
YinglingLight
Woah, I've encountered me 4 years ago online. You sound just like I did.

To past me, I highly recommend audiobooking "Millionaire Fastlane". Do not let
the awkward title turn you off. It'll put you in a much more productive
mindset than Mr. Mustache.

~~~
sizzle
What impact did this book have on you? What have you achieved since reading it
that you otherwise would not have? Investments? What other books do you
recommend?

~~~
YinglingLight
I've adopted less of a scarcity mentality, and it reinforced the notion that
I'll never get rich and achieve my goals by staying the course in my career.
Not rich before age 65 at any rate.

Another book I recommend is "How to Fail at Everything and Still Win Big".
Adams has a great approach of using systems instead of goals.

------
obulpathi
I came to US about 10 years ago. Finished my PhD and spent about 4 years in
Software Industry. Saved some money. US has taught me a lot about
entrepreneurship and software. Now moving to India for good to work on my own
startup, spend more time with my hobbies and to stay close with my parents who
are in their 60's. It took me more than an year to convince my parents
(hardest to convince was my Mom) and my Wife. Looking back, I feel that is one
of the best, courageous and hardest decisions I have taken in my life.

Also thanks to YC for accepting my Startup in to their Startup School Advisor
Track. Namaste!

~~~
User23
It’s the right decision. You will be able to take what you learned home and
create wealth for thousands, if not more. India is going to surpass China in
the next century.

~~~
lovelearning
_India is going to surpass China in the next century._

Just curious, but this statement surprised me.

Surpass in what ways? GDP? Per capita income? Standard of living? Population?
Level of honesty? Level of corruption? Level of transparency?

Any studies you can recommend that reach these conclusions?

~~~
User23
We all know that diversity drives positive economic outcomes. India is by far
the most diverse large country on the planet. That combined with her diaspora
to the west and the consequent knowledge transfer, in addition to not being a
major strategic rival to the USA, adds up to an extremely positive medium to
long term outlook.

Yes there are major problems with corruption, it's true, but there are major
problems with corruption in China and the USA for that matter. It's just in
the USA the corruption is much more sophisticated and genteel. I mean this
positively and I honestly believe Indian corruption is going to move toward
the US model thanks to the large numbers of Indian nationals who have seen how
much better that kind of corruption works. It's a classic case of not letting
the perfect be the enemy of the less bad.

~~~
Majestic121
Do you have sources about diversity driving positive economic income ?

It seems to go without saying for you, but it's not that natural for me. There
are several examples of very homogeneous countries, such as Japan or Korea,
doing economical prowess.

~~~
User23
[http://news.mit.edu/2014/workplace-diversity-can-help-
bottom...](http://news.mit.edu/2014/workplace-diversity-can-help-bottom-
line-1007)

[https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.forbes.com/sites/ruchikatul...](https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.forbes.com/sites/ruchikatulshyan/2015/01/30/racially-
diverse-companies-outperform-industry-norms-by-30/amp/)

There are many many other studies, all easily queried. There’s also the
largest and richest country in the world as a case study.

~~~
Majestic121
The largest country in the world is Russia, and the richest is Iceland. Do you
mean the US ?

If so, what makes you think the US got successful because of diversity instead
of other factors ?

Similarly, there are studies showing that skill diversity is important, but
not bio diversity. For example this meta-study[1] : "Support was found for the
positive impact of task-related diversity on team performance. In contrast,
bio-demographic diversity had no relationship with team performance"

[1]
[https://www.researchgate.net/publication/228389271_The_Effec...](https://www.researchgate.net/publication/228389271_The_Effects_of_Team_Diversity_on_Team_Outcomes_A_Meta-
Analytic_Review_of_Team_Demography)

~~~
User23
>The largest country in the world is Russia, and the richest is Iceland. Do
you mean the US ?

I suppose this must be meant to be clever?

------
bxtt
As an Asian-American, I'm struggling through the same dilemma as well. I've
been given a huge opportunity to move to Asia and to initiate a program at a
Fortune 100 company, but recently my parents have gotten very ill. My dad was
recently diagnosed with cancer, and has had multiple surgeries. My mom has a
myriad of health issues, and I feel painfully selfish by not helping them.
They would never burden me, and pushing me to go pursue my career dreams.

I think this is an experience that most people will face in their lifetime. I
don't necessarily know if this is an Asian experience, and the discussion of
family burdens because in our culture the parents would never say a thing
about their illness. But, I don't think what they realize is that it puts even
more pressure on the children on accepting the right path.

~~~
appleiigs
I'm asian. I'm not american. I think weighing career dreams (a stereotypical
american thing) versus taking care my parents (a stereotypical asian thing) is
not even a close decision. When I look back at my life, I'm not going to
regret spending extra time in the office.

I'm in no way saying my opinion is correct, because everyone has different
values. I'm just sharing my surprise of the dilemma in your post and the
original article from my point of view.

In fact, my wife and I are a 1000 km apart because she has to take care of her
parents and my parents and job are here. we've lived like this for 6 years.

~~~
shady-lady
> When I look back at my life, I'm not going to regret spending extra time in
> the office.

Did you mean you're not going to regret not spending extra time in the office?
i.e. family > work or did you mean work > family

~~~
dragonwriter
I think GP meant “I have made the correct decisions in life by prioritizing
family over work so that I will not later regret spending extra time in the
office”.

There are two sources of non-regret:

Not _valuing_ the thing you would sacrifice is one.

But not _sacrificing_ the thing is another.

~~~
appleiigs
Thanks for understanding despite my unclear comment.

------
j45
Some wisdom that's not easy to imagine for ourselves, but statistically..

"Looking back on my high school years, all my relatives tried to talk me, a
top-ranking student, into majoring in science or finance in college. But I was
stubborn enough to stay with my favorite subject, literature.

Now I understand them. They knew very well that in life, things can easily
fall apart, and that those degrees are a promise of a steady, good-paying job,
and perhaps a ticket to freedom, too."

Feeling the shadow of how things can fall apart easily can be delayed until
one's 30's or 40s for the privileged, but everyone will see it.

~~~
sizzle
What did you end up doing with your literature degree if you don't mind me
asking. I hope you found your profitable niche, if not what is the barrier to
success?

~~~
j45
My point was the increased awareness of fragility as time goes on, regardless
of a science or arts education.

I didn't take literature, I was in sciences. Today those who are read, and can
write are able to write marketing, copy, communication and are valuable where
techies struggle to growth hack.

In university, it seemed friends in sciences had less of a sense of
themselves, but found a career easier. It was also noticeable that friends in
arts may not have had a clear path to a career, but seemed to have a clearer
sense of themselves, or at least an ability to explore and articulate it.

------
ummonk
The need for money and/or guanxi might be worse in China, but it's certainly
not China-specific.

Every time I see an example of police and the justice system running roughshod
over somebody I think "I need to be rich and well-connected so this won't
happen to me". The ability to get top medical care in America is also
dependent on having good connections, insurance, and/or deep pockets.

Of course, as an introvert, I'm relatively bad at creating and holding on to a
wide net of connections, so I have to make up for it with more money.

------
fspeech
"I tried to secure her a specialist appointment at Huashan Hospital, one of
the best public hospitals in Shanghai, only to discover that they were full
till the end of August. "

I am a little confused. Why is getting an appointment at the best hospital by
the end of August not good? Take the appointment. See a competent doctor you
can find now and then go to the best hospital for a second opinion.

~~~
faitswulff
If it relies on guanxi, your appointment probably would have been rescheduled
whenever convenient to those with better connections to the hospital. You
might schedule for August, but it's essentially meaningless if someone's
always a higher priority than you.

------
iamkp
If I do a search and replace of China with India, this article would still be
real and same.

------
femto
I read it as a commentary on corruption, contacts and money governing access
to things that should otherwise be accessible. People are so bogged down in
trying to survive the system, often for the sake of dependents, that they
don't have the time to change it.

Edit: Added bit about dependents.

~~~
fspeech
If every patient demands the "best" doctor then indeed no system could satisfy
everyone. If instead one settles for a competent doctor, esp. for a standard
case I don't see why such care can't be routinely accessed in a place like
Shanghai. Rural China is another story.

------
ConfusedDog
I am experiencing similar problems with my parents in China right now... it is
super stressful. Being a nerd throughout my life, I disdained people using
each other for achieving anything - I didn't think it's real friendship. In a
way, I was right, and in other ways, I couldn't be more wrong... I was just
too stubborn and selfish to accept their social rules. Now I don't even know
how to help my parents to do simple things like getting them a good doctor...

------
mnm1
> Why do we need to be rich or have guanxi merely to enjoy access to very
> basic public services?

I can't speak about China, butt this question was quite pertinent in communist
Romania. The answer should be fairly obvious. Because it's communist and the
government doesn't give a fuck about its people. That's likely why the
daughter is in America. That most certainly is how I ended up here. When it's
necessary to have connections in high places or a ton of money or both just to
get the doctors to not let you die or to get any decent healthcare, that's the
sign of a system that has failed most if not all of its people. We should
learn from this here in America because we are only a little ahead of this
type of situation with healthcare here. Instead of connections though, the
privileged here have good health care and the money to pay for it.

------
justicezyx
> After every social tragedy, victims are subjected to disdain on social
> media, rather than sympathy: “this happened to you because you are a loser;
> because you don’t have the right connections; because you are not making
> enough money.

Not true. People's reaction is same as ordinary people, sympathy and pity.

------
abhi152
It has less to do with China but more to do with the Author being so far from
the home. Tomorrow her Mom might need her more and the government can only
help that much. These are all the choices people make in life..

------
roadster1451
The author is too pessimistic about the healthcare system in Shanghai or
China. That's to say, the article is way too exaggerated and involve too much
mood. I think one of factor she thinks so is she is too far away from her
mother geographically. The lesson from her article: if you get sick, go to
hospital as soon as possible, don't wait.

------
m3mpp
You have this same problem as non-chinese or as non-daughter (son). It's the
issue of living far away from your parents and family, they get old, sick and
will die at some point and you can't do much, besides feeling guilt and
frustration. Whether your family is in China, Europe or wherever, same
feeling.

------
eb48
Woah..

 _spoilers ahead_

The author discusses her lack of guanxi and her decision to major in
literature as a detriment to her career path ... in the new york times. The
postmodernism is striking!

~~~
netsharc
Detriment to her career path? Did you read the right article?

More like her lack of networking deterred her from getting the benefits of
knowing people, benefits her peers can enjoy.

~~~
eb48
No, you should re-read the article.

She states that if she lacks networking, then she'd need to get by with wealth
-- which then she follows up in a significant part of the article with why she
doesn't have wealth due to taking up a less privileged career path.

~~~
netsharc
You're mixing success in career with success in life (wealth/status). She's
doing fine in her career path, right? If I want to be an accomplished
historian of e.g. Tibetan architecture, I can know everything in that field,
but it's probably not going to pay well because society doesn't care.

Then again, googling what "career success" means, the results say it's a
personal definition, so maybe we're both wrong.

------
fouc
This is a very bizarre story.

Not everyone has the inclination to develop connections, nor should they.

Not everyone is motivated by more "practical" careers.

The truth is if she had a chance to repeat her life, she'd probably still
choose to pursue her literary dreams.

She made the decision multiple times in her life to focus on other things
besides connections or going for some "practical" career. She knew there would
be different opportunities/costs regardless of the direction she chose.

It doesn't make a whole lot of sense to suddenly feel bitter regret about
this. That's just hypocritical.

~~~
DoreenMichele
Her closing remarks indicate it doesn't matter what choice she makes, she will
have regrets. The end of the piece indicates it is systemic, a damned if you
do, damned if you don't situation that shouldn't exist. It also describes a
situation where the system sets you up for failure, then blames you when you
fail.

They disappear people in China for criticizing the government. This strikes me
as a left-handed critique of China, hopefully one that won't come back to bite
the author.

~~~
helloindia
My thoughts went the same way. I hope this article doesn't cause problem for
the Author's parents back home.

------
willvarfar
So healthcare in China is two-tier? Excellent care for those with money or
connections, and bad care for everyone else?

The author works in America as a writer (and the prose is excellent! Hard to
believe English is a second language!).

Would things be any different if the mother lived in the states with her
daughter? Would healthcare be better for her, or would it only be better if
they were richer than they are?

As someone living in a country with working universal healthcare, I can only
feel exceedingly sorry for those living in countries such as China and USA.

~~~
cowmoo728
Two tier healthcare in China is more like the doctors refuse to do anything
for you, or the hospital refuses to admit you.

[https://qz.com/1206738/the-death-of-a-chinese-flu-patient-
re...](https://qz.com/1206738/the-death-of-a-chinese-flu-patient-reminds-
chinas-middle-class-their-lives-hinge-on-personal-connections/)

The new yorker has a much more in depth diagnosis of health care in China.

[https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2014/08/25/under-the-
knif...](https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2014/08/25/under-the-knife)

~~~
modells
That sounds like Valley Medical here in Si Valley. Ostensibly, they have to
"accept everyone" but realistically, they put people on buses and send them
elsewhere. Also, there are many specialties with zero appointments available
and no waiting list... they require calling up at a certain time like getting
Yosemite campgrounds. So much for capitalism and the miracles of being
"better" than socialism.

~~~
jacobush
It’s better at extracting value for the shareholders. Not that China is
socialist, it looks dead set on combining the worst of capitalism and the
worst of central planning.

------
RikNieu
A common trend I've noticed with successful founders in my small circle -
little responsibilities to dependents and a ridiculous abundance of just-in-
case-it-fails funds.

~~~
onion2k
Anecdotally, that's the opposite of my experience in startups.

The founders who had funds to fall back on (or a job they could easily return
to, or parents who could help them through tough times, etc) mostly either
failed outright or ran their startup for years without really getting
anywhere. I think the reason is that they didn't _need_ to succeed. They were
'playing' at startups. It didn't matter if they failed.

The fear of actual, _real_ failure is a fantastic motivator. Failing should
have consequences for it to matter and for it to drive you to succeed. That
doesn't need to be financial ruin of course; it could be that you truly
believe your startup is important and necessary, and that you're solving an
_actual_ pain. I believe that startups with that are more likely to succeed.
It'd be interesting to study it.

~~~
achow
That is true.

But what one of the two points of OP is while you are running a startup, which
would fail if you take your attention away, your chance of making it a success
would be orders of magnitude higher if you don't have to care about your aged
parents medical bills, or home mortgage, etc.

------
alexashka
That's a very well written piece. I don't know that it needs to be judged or
debated.

------
netsec_burn
Does anyone else think this reads almost like propaganda?

~~~
zbentley
Not at all. Propaganda for what?

~~~
netsec_burn
The whole thing read like it was painting a picture of US society being utopia
while Chinese society is restrictive where only a few make it.

I believe both to a limited extent, but it's hard not to get the feeling this
article doesn't have a spin. I knew I would be outspoken on this but I felt I
should mention it anyway.

~~~
ljj1122
you're looking at this from a strictly Western perspective, this story was
fairly similar something my mother went through when my grandfather in
Shanghai had a heart attack, and anybody with a similar background can tell
you this is something they've either personally felt or seen in a close family
member.

