
USA Sanctions Chinese Officials, Including Politburo Member, for Xinjiang Abuses - onetimemanytime
https://www.npr.org/2020/07/09/889406296/u-s-sanctions-chinese-officials-including-politburo-member-for-xinjiang-abuses
======
Leary
A very limited/ target sanction against a few members. They should actually
freeze the foreign assets of all Politburo members and work on technologies to
circumvent the Great Fire wall inside China

~~~
DiogenesKynikos
We don't need any more escalation. The anti-China hysteria in the West is
getting really out-of-hand. This is dangerous stuff.

~~~
TulliusCicero
There's some hysteria, but there's also plenty of reasons to be highly wary of
China, genocide of Uighurs among them.

~~~
simonblack
That's no different from The US's 'Manifest Destiny' and displacing of the
Native Americans.

~~~
TulliusCicero
Yes, and if the US was forcibly sterilizing Native Americans en masse right
now, I would consider that equally outrageous.

And to be sure, America's government does plenty of terrible things as it is.

------
onetimemanytime
Original announcement: [https://home.treasury.gov/news/press-
releases/sm1055](https://home.treasury.gov/news/press-releases/sm1055)

Treasury Sanctions Chinese Entity and Officials Pursuant to Global Magnitsky
Human Rights Accountability Act

~~~
peroporque
Good to see that at least the USA has the balls to act against the
"reeducation" camps. My country (Germany) should be the loudest voice against
it, but as usual we say nothing and hope nobody notices.

~~~
TulliusCicero
Everyone should be speaking out against them. The way China treats the Uighur
is appalling.

> The state regularly subjects minority women to pregnancy checks, and forces
> intrauterine devices, sterilization and even abortion on hundreds of
> thousands, the interviews and data show. Even while the use of IUDs and
> sterilization has fallen nationwide, it is rising sharply in Xinjiang.

> The population control measures are backed by mass detention both as a
> threat and as a punishment for failure to comply. Having too many children
> is a major reason people are sent to detention camps, the AP found, with the
> parents of three or more ripped away from their families unless they can pay
> huge fines. Police raid homes, terrifying parents as they search for hidden
> children.

[https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2020/07/andrew-sullivan-
chin...](https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2020/07/andrew-sullivan-china-is-a-
genocidal-menace.html)

------
dleslie
I don't think I've ever witnessed a HN discussion that has such a high density
of heavily down-voted comments. Amazing.

~~~
throwaway_pdp09
Those supporting china use downvotes as a way of trying to suppress other
opinions. I'm getting sick of it. It goes against the HN guidelines and is
just a dishonest tactic.

~~~
dleslie
I'm seeing my own observation getting downvoted heavily. Must be a nerve. ;)

------
finnthehuman
Imagine if 50 years from now the thing Trump is most remembered for is ending
the US' blind eye towards China.

Imagine if he's celebrated as the politician who finally acted on principal in
a time when the rest of Washington was looking the other way because of cheap
manufacturing. Hollywood was tailoring their products to appease the Chinese
government and be allowed in the market, anyone who wanted to do business
there like NBA owners and players were biting their tongues and hiding their
political opinions. But not Trump, he turned the tide and made America care
about human freedom again.

Ok, fine, crazy thought. But it raises the question, why aren't any of our
other leaders even pretending to try and be that person?

~~~
jdhn
I don't see how this is an unrealistic scenario. The rehabilitation of George
Bush's image happened faster than I ever thought it would. In a decade he
(Bush) went from a despised president who got us involved in 2 major wars,
eroded our civil liberties, and oversaw an almost unprecendented economic bust
to some loveable goof who paints pictures, has trouble putting on a poncho,
pals around with Ellen, and, most recently, has been praised for being
skeptical of a second Trump term.

~~~
chrononaut
Can you expand upon what audience you are referring to in context of the
"rehabilitation of George Bush"? Political scientists have remained pretty
consistent on his image over the last 20 years:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historical_rankings_of_preside...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historical_rankings_of_presidents_of_the_United_States)

~~~
jdhn
Audience means online communities that I frequent, which is primarily Reddit.

~~~
throwaway0a5e
People tend to be nostalgic for the years soon after their birth because to
them it seems like a time when everything seemed simple because they were too
young to be aware of the world.

Guess which age group has an outsize influence on Reddit?

------
ReptileMan
And there will be some some US citizens in China arrested on various charges
and the world will move on. It is not as if we are unfamiliar with this kabuki
play

~~~
baybal2
> some US citizens in China arrested on various charges

China regularly arrests dozens of foreign citizens on bogus charges every
month. This is what people saying that China's incarceration rate is so low
forget to say. A foreigners in China has a much higher risk to be extra-
judicially jailed.

And yes, US government largely shows that it doesn't give a .... when its
citizens are being jailed overseas, unless a huge media expose forces it to do
so.

~~~
oxymoran
This is why I am never going to China. They were behind the Equifax hack and
many other similar breaches. They are actively waging a cyber war against the
the US and it’s citizens. They have all of our info so they can piece together
who is sympathetic to their “cause” and who is a critic.

------
Robotbeat
Actions like these would be much more effective if we addressed our own human
rights abuses like concentration camps of refugees and others at the border,
rampant over-incarceration, and police brutality.

~~~
chub500
There's a surprising amount of tu quoque getting thrown around here.

[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tu_quoque](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tu_quoque)

Please before you call hypocrisy on the US government at least engage in the
quality of the action they are currently taking.

~~~
DiogenesKynikos
What the _tu quoque_ arguments show is that the US' actions have nothing to do
with human rights. The US cannot simultaneously support Saudi Arabia's war in
Yemen, itself kill hundreds of thousands of people throughout the Muslim world
in several different wars, and then turn around and pretend to care about the
human rights of Muslims in China.

This is about the US' geopolitical struggle with China over the question of
whether or not China will become an equal power with the US.

------
stunt
Viva human rights BUT only as long as it doesn't interfere with our interest.

Let's supply and equip KSA with bombs to kill minorities and majorities in
Yemen, and also blame Chinese for abuses against ethnic minorities. We are
terrified to death of seeing tear gas on streets but we supply bombs to the
Middle East.

And don't get me wrong. I think anything to stop abuses in China is great.
But, when I'm reminded about those double standards, I just realize it's all
bullshit.

I stopped reading politics. I only listen to people that talk about peace.
Everyone else is after some hidden agenda.

~~~
jacobush
What is acceptable is a sliding window. Too much cynicism, and we'll debate
what country _not_ to nuke next week.

------
buran77
The similarities with the actions taken against Japan in the late '30s and
early '40s are uncanny. Those actions were taken with full understanding that
they are most likely to provoke Japan into attacking US territories in the
Pacific due to the need to relieve the economic chokehold and as a response to
what the Japanese saw as an unprecedented insult (economic sanctions
increasing in severity but in particular freezing Japanese assets in the US
and assisting Japans biggest enemy, China). Wonder if eventually they will get
the same result again.

~~~
1PlayerOne
Unlike Japan, the Chinese economy is bigger and will be self sustaining enough
that a war with the US is unnecessary for that reason.

~~~
buran77
Sure, China's position today is nothing like Japan's 80 years ago. But look at
China's or Russia's actions and you see war and retaliatory actions today are
also not the same as they were then. Pushing your enemy into taking expensive
steps (plenty of options there, from proxy wars, to giving up nuclear
facilities, to alienating foreign investment in an attempt to take retaliatory
actions against US economic interests) is a result that has been achieved in
the past following the exact same script.

I personally don't believe these sanctions have "the right reasons" behind
them because the US selectively allies with countries with a similar legal and
moral track record as China. If the action is not taken on justice, fairness,
or moral grounds I think my implication above is pretty fair.

~~~
AnimalMuppet
> I personally don't believe these sanctions have "the right reasons" behind
> them because the US selectively allies with countries with a similar legal
> and moral track record as China.

What countries does the US ally with that have a similar track record as China
does _in Xinjiang_? The only thing recently comparable that comes to mind is
Myanmar, with the Rohingya. But I'm not sure to what degree the US allies with
Myanmar.

------
cies
Hypocrites (after the high up officials in charge of Guatanamo Bay are still
walking unsanctioned).

~~~
peroporque
I agree that the Falcons should be in prison, but there is a difference
between putting a few hundred political extremists in jail, compared to a few
million normal people based on their race.

So, no, not "hypocrites".

~~~
cies
> based on their race

It's simply without a trial. All states have nice words for why they have to
target whom they target. Let's not fall for propaganda.

The scale is different: true. But same-scale is not a prerequisite for
hypocrisy.

~~~
peroporque
Trials are irrelevant in China, because judges are part of the CCP.

the Uygurs are imprisoned based on their race. With or without trial makes no
difference.

