
Sleep: Everything You Need to Know - maroun
https://medium.com/the-healthy-life/b65f8e19ed18
======
drostie
One tip which I didn't see: set an alarm for _going to bed_ , not _waking up_.
You should be able to wake naturally, but artificial lighting changes your
perception of when you should go to sleep, shifting you from a naturally
23-hour circadian rhythm to a 25-hour one.

So just set an alarm for 11pm, and when you hear it, immediately stop what
you're doing, save any open documents, turn the TV or computer off. The next
30 minutes are for brushing teeth, settling into bed, and preparing for the
following morning only. By then you should be settling into a good night's
sleep.

~~~
superuser2
You're clearly not a student :). I'd love to choose when to go to bed, but
that's not really compatible with a workload challenging enough to appease
admissions counselors.

~~~
dredmorbius
If you think life's going to become any more considerate of your sleep
requirements, think again.

Use time-boxing as a scheduling mechanism. If you find you have more work to
do than time to do it, start lopping off items from your to-do list, and/or
identifying how you can accomplish a sufficient effort in the time available.

 _That_ is likely to be a far more useful life lesson than whatever subject it
is you're studying at the moment.

You _also_ have to learn how to schedule downtime. People cannot run 100%
24/7/365, and attempting to do this is at best very painful, and at worst,
literally, suicidal.

------
treeface
This post seems like one big, long unsubstantiated bunch of app spam for
"zeo". I don't think scientists understand the "fact retention" mechanism as
well as OP claims, for instance. It's fairly clear that sleep is important,
but there's a lot of unsourced information here that's presented as fact.

~~~
maroun
Thanks for your feedback! I worked for Zeo a year ago, however they've since
shut down so I have no affiliation to them. I'll be sure to go in add the
relevant sources.

~~~
treeface
Sure thing. I don't mean to imply that you are intentionally misguiding. Your
general advice (i.e. sleep enough and do it consistently) is good and the post
was fairly well-written. Cheers, good sir.

~~~
nkohari
I'm not picking on you specifically, but I think this is an example of a very
common problem on HN. Someone posts a very harshly-worded negative comment.
Then the OP responds to it, and the commenter walks back their comment and
praises the post.

It seems like once people realize they're communicating with other real-life
human beings, they are much more civil. Couldn't we try to consider that ahead
of time, and avoid the off-handed negativity in the first place? It would make
HN (and nonverbal communication in general) much more productive and
enjoyable.

If the two comments combined fully capture your viewpoint, why not say
something along the lines of, "Your advice is good and the post is fairly
well-written, but it sort of comes off as a product advertisement. You cite
scientific evidence, but you don't provide any sources, which makes it seem
unsubstantiated."

Just a suggestion.

~~~
gwern
> I'm not picking on you specifically, but I think this is an example of a
> very common problem on HN. Someone posts a very harshly-worded negative
> comment. Then the OP responds to it, and the commenter walks back their
> comment and praises the post.

Or they're being honest the entire time, and simply posted about the negative
part, because who wants to be that chucklehead going '+1' or 'Good post'
("that's what voting is for, dummy!")? Unfortunately, this then leads to
comment sections coming off as negative and essentially being a bugtracker for
a submission.

(Some relevant musings on this topic:
<http://lesswrong.com/lw/3h/why_our_kind_cant_cooperate/> &
[http://lesswrong.com/lw/372/defecting_by_accident_a_flaw_com...](http://lesswrong.com/lw/372/defecting_by_accident_a_flaw_common_to_analytical/)
)

~~~
doktrin
I view comments as a form of feedback. As such, they go both ways. As a
contributor, I would want to see sincere examples of both positive and
negative feedback. We don't only learn from mistakes, after all. Upvotes are
nice, but comments are generally considered to be more meaningful.

HN tends to err on the side of critical feedback, which is a reflection, in
part, of the evidence-driven ethos that permeates hacker culture. This is
generally a trait I hold in high regard, and take the downside as par for the
course. However, I agree with the parent in that having some empathy for those
we critique would improve the general tone of discussion here.

------
obviouslygreen
I really wonder how much sleep people lose worrying about their sleep habits.

Trying to micromanage everything from your sleep schedule to your work
schedule to your calorie intake to your fat intake to your social media intake
to your exposure to cell phone radiation results in being even more stressed
out than you would be if you weren't attempting to keep track of eighty
different pseudoscientific lifestyle prescriptions.

Go to sleep. Wake up. Eat food. Do those things, and try to enjoy life while
you have it... burning it trying to "optimize" everything is a painful waste
of time.

~~~
criley
I reject the idea that optimization leads to burnout. If you're consciously
thinking about ALL of those variables at once, yes, you will achieve burnout.

But the entire point of life optimization isn't to sit around thinking about
all of this, it's to build healthy habits that allow our "autopilot" to pilot
us down previously consciously decided paths.

You should be unconsciously a better person after reinforcing new healthy
habits, quite identical to your final phrase of "wake up, eat," etc.

If you're burning out with optimization, you are literally doing it wrong.

~~~
obviouslygreen
I've done this myself to a point, but the point I'm making is that there's so
much of this flying around and so much debate about so many often-
unsubstantiated 'optimizations' that there's often not any real reason to
believe they _are_ optimizations.

And if they're not, people are going to waste a lot of time trying to learn
new habits, then find out that they are no better off or perhaps worse, except
now they're stuck with new, bad habits to unlearn.

My argument is less with optimization than with spending too much time and
effort attempting it without actually gaining anything, or having a reasonable
expectation of the same.

~~~
umsm
> they're stuck with new, bad habits to unlearn.

I think the point of this is not to optimize for the sake of optimization but
to solve a problem. People have problems and they look for solutions. They try
anything that can help once all else fails.

------
Derbasti
As an audiologist, I would not recommend wearing earbuds all night.
Ventilation is important for your ears.

Also, your ears are very adaptable: plugging your ears with earbuds will
decrease the sound pressure by about 10 dB, which isn't really all that much.
As a hearing loss, it would not require treatment. Your ears will adapt and
you will still hear most startling sounds. In fact, your ears will have to
"concentrate" more, which is known to lead to fatigue.

------
DigitalJack
I thought it was a good article, but a lot of it seemed like opinion stated as
fact.

I wear ear plugs at night, but no mask. I suffer from "night terrors" however,
and when they strike I am very disoriented. The earplugs make that worse, and
I imagine a mask would be a bad idea too.

I use these earplugs because we go through a lot.
[http://www.amazon.com/SparkPlugs-Disposable-Earplugs-
Nascar-...](http://www.amazon.com/SparkPlugs-Disposable-Earplugs-Nascar-
Uncorded/dp/B0015TD50C/)

They are large, but still comfortable.

~~~
showerst
Totally anecdotal, but I suffer from occasional night terrors too, and have
found that an eye mask actually helps quite a bit. Something about the
consistent deeper darkness seems to stop me from 'waking up' and having a
spell. Mine were also much worse when I slept in new places, and having the
eye mask seems to eliminate that distinction as far as my body is concerned.

Between the eye mask, limiting eating large meals later at night, and cutting
back on caffeine, I've reduced my night terrors by about 90% in the past 2
years. YMMV.

~~~
johnchristopher
If you haven't done so yet you both should rule out sleep apnæ with your
doctor.

------
ashwinaj
Great article! I changed my sleep habits about a couple of years ago, almost
given up coffee, eat healthy and exercise regularly. I rarely ever feel grumpy
or tired in the morning and a lot of that is attributed to 7+ hrs of peaceful
sleep. You don't necessarily need an app for this, you just need a lot of will
power.

------
gingerlime
Interesting post, but I'm not sure if some of this advice can work for me.
I've tried earplugs, but to be honest, it makes me paranoid that I won't hear
the fire alarm or burglar coming in, which makes me much less relaxed. This
isolated feeling is also weird for me. Covering my eyes just feels
uncomfortable and also isolating. It's probably just me.

Also, I'm not entirely sure where I heard/read it, but I thought it's actually
good to wake up with (natural) light, which brings you into a more natural
cycle or something. I think I also heard it could help with jet lag, releasing
melatonin or something of that sort.

~~~
maroun
When you first see sunlight in the mornings it helps regulate your circadian
rhythm and it tells your body "The sun is out this is when I should wake up".
Which is why if you're traveling you want to make sure you wake up at the
right time locally and open the windows right away, it'll help reduce the # of
days in which you're jetlagged.

However if you're sleeping at home you want your body to sleep for as long as
it needs to, uninterrupted. That means no sunlight, no noise and no alarms. If
you get into a consistent schedule you're body will wake up at around the same
time everyday. However if you have sleep debt that you need to make up, you
also want to give your body the chance to sleep a little extra.

------
dllthomas
Consistency is key, I've heard time and again and my own experience seems to
support (FWIW).

However, perfect consistency is hard to maintain. Even if one avoids the late
parties and whatnot, eventually emergencies get in the way or illness comes
along and increases the amount of sleep required.

My question is, when consistency must falter, what piece is most important?
Going to bed at the same time, getting up at the same time, getting the same
amount of sleep, or getting at least some particular amount of sleep? The
article here claims it is not the last.

~~~
0x09
This is the part I wish he hadn't glossed over, especially since at least a
small handful of studies suggest that we naturally adopt > 24h cycles when
left away from light cues and set time responsibilities.

------
ChikkaChiChi
If you want to use a screen at night and you don't want to mess with your
sleep cycle, make sure you have a device with an AMOLED screen that has the
ability to run a profile that uses red pixels only.

Samsung Android devices like the Note and the Galaxy S3 have AMOLED. On the
Play Store, there is a free app called Galactic Night that will let you run
the device in red only. Add on another free app called Screen Filter, and
suddenly you have a device with perfect lighting that allows you to keep your
night vision and let your eyes rest while you drift off to sleep. CyanogenMod
used to have this feature; not sure if it still does.

Backlit LCD screens (even ones that use Flux or Red profiles) won't work
because even the black pixels are backlit. I've tried using a jailbroken iPad
with Color Profiles and it's just not the same.

Finally, you can use an e-reader but I recommend a light source you can add a
red gel to. This will have the same effect.

Source: I've been reading on a screen before bed since the days of the Palm
III. Also, I used to develop film in a real darkroom.

------
mlwarren
OP mentions that earbuds (plugs) are one of the best things he's done to
improve sleep. Has anyone out there reviewed a few different brands of
earplugs? I've used Hearos Ultimate Softness but I'm reading that there are
better plugs out there. It looks like the best consumer grade plugs have a NRR
of 33. Anyone have suggestions or insight into this?

~~~
dpeck
Completely anecdotal, but when we had our child I did night shifts, and wife
decided to use plugs to make sure she'd get enough sleep to be ready to go for
the morning.

She settled in on the soft silicone variety, like these
[http://www.amazon.com/Macks-Pillow-Silicone-Earplugs-
Value/d...](http://www.amazon.com/Macks-Pillow-Silicone-Earplugs-
Value/dp/B000067NMJ/ref=pd_sim_misc_4) but she gets the pharmacy or grocery
store brand. They let in enough noise that you're not completely isolated, but
dampen enough that you're able to sleep through usual noise like spouse
snoring, dogs waking up to stretch/scratch/re-position, baby gurgling over the
monitor, etc.

Edit: And they're much much more comfortable than the foam varieties tried.

------
ultimoo
I am surprised the article doesn't mention anything about alcohol and its
effect on sleep. Does anyone want to chime in on this?

~~~
gardarh
From what I understand being drunk when going to sleep relaxes the muscles
around your throat increasing your chance of apnea. The relaxed muscles around
the throat means that the airway closes yielding a similar effect to choking
(which is essentially what apnea is). The end result is that you choke
periodically throughout the night meaning that the quality of your sleep is
much inferior to what it could be; this is probably a large contributing
factor to hangovers.

Edit: My source is a knowledgeable person on the subject, feel free to
contradict or doubt the truthfulness of the answer - makes sense to me at
least.

------
ffn
Really interesting read... but out of curiosity, how does exercise play into
the sleep schedule? In order to maintain a good sleep rhythm, when is latest
one should exercise? Also I'd like to know where you get your supposedly free
stopwatches.

~~~
sakbhatn
Physical activity that makes you feel tired and/or relaxes your mind is very
good before going to bed as your thoughts will not wander and you will doze
off within minutes. I used to have this problem of going to sleep after
switching off lights and going to bed. I started doing simple exercises like
cleaning/arranging my room or relaxation yoga which would take my mind off
thinking a lot before falling asleep. Also I started reading books (not
e-books, which make you insomniac) for 15-20 minutes everyday before going to
sleep. You can exercise just before going to bed. For a free stopwatch you can
use your smartphone or alarm clock.

------
DocG
I think drinking cold water before bed is not as good as you make it to be.

Cold water is like shock to your system. It wakes your body up.

Your body needs to work on warming the water first.

Although water itself should be good, warm/hand temperature water should be
best.

------
antidaily
Who lifts _daily_? Don't do that, bud.

~~~
chollida1
> Who lifts daily?

I lift 5 times a week, with another day of cardio and I'm in my mid 30's. My
life is pretty good.

> Don't do that, bud.

Based on what information? Many popular lifting schedules call for 5 days on
and 2 off per week. I think your projecting your own personal experiences
here.

~~~
avenger123
I'm thinking of starting this up myself. Lifting weights has definite health
benefits.

Do you go to a gym or have a home gym? What kind of program are you following?

I'm thinking of half hour max early morning, rotating between major body
parts.

~~~
cdjk
Starting Strength is the way to go:

<http://startingstrength.com/>

The basic outline is that it's 5 exercises, three times a week, with three
exercises per day - you alternate some of them. It should take about an hour
including warm ups.

There's a wiki, but buy the book. For equipment, you'll need weights, a
barbell, squat rack, and bench. It's all stuff a gym should have, or is
relatively easy to find on craigslist for cheap.

------
brd
For anyone interested, heres a list of additional things that may help you
sleep: [http://www.favemaven.com/themaven/tips-and-tricks-better-
sle...](http://www.favemaven.com/themaven/tips-and-tricks-better-sleep)

I'm also a big fan of flux which lowers the amount of blue light emitted by
your monitor: <http://stereopsis.com/flux/>

Its one page from my first django project which has been abandoned for a
while. Its basically a curated affiliate link site (similar to what refer.ly
has become)

------
sneak
I don't trust advice from anyone who uses apostrophes with plurals. If you
can't figure out basic English, why should I be convinced you've figured out
things more complicated?

~~~
Hytosys
That's like dismissing Einstein's work because he pleasantly married his
cousin. Some people place less importance or stress on certain things than
other people do. Get over it, this article is truly helpful.

------
mrbill
Loved my Wakemate, but have since moved to all-Android. Are there any decent
equivalents to the Zeo/Wakemate that work with Android phones and are still in
business?

------
okonomiyaki3000
I usually sleep on my side but, when I do, I never dream. If I force myself to
sleep flat on my back, I almost always dream. What's up with that?

~~~
oyvindeh
There's a difference between not dreaming and not remembering your dreams.
Everybody dream every night.

This is just speculation, but perhaps you sleep better on your side, so that
you don't remember your dreams as easily? E.g. if you wake up several times a
night, you will remember more dreams than if you don't wake up during the
night.

------
throw7
One of things that helps me is a sleeping cap. Mine is just a thin lightweight
hat. I surmise this helps in the same way the article suggests to wear socks
to keep your extremities warm. The only thing is, I hate wearing socks to bed,
instead I wear the cap! :)

I also like to think the act of putting on my sleeping cap is also a nice
subconscious cue that it's sleep time.

------
ctdonath
What of being woken several times each night? I have two kids and two dogs and
a wife; between them all I'm woken at least twice.

~~~
NuZZ
According to an article I saw on HN a week ago, apparently, evidence shows we
evolved to naturally wake up once each night about half way through, for
around an hour. Of course, we went to sleep when it became dark and woke with
the sun. Something that isn't conducive with todays lifestyle.

<https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5542453>

~~~
ctdonath
I've seen the "first sleep" references too. That's not what I'm talking about.
Waking up naturally for a half hour in a pleasant relaxed state is one thing.
Having the dog bark "let me out or I'm peeing on the carpet" and having to run
downstairs, having the other dog jump on me at random intervals, having two
kids separately get me up for a half hour each fussing about whatever, and
having m'lady decide she must check her email at oh-dark-thirty, well, that's
quite something else.

------
rwmj
Does the headband really work? Detecting "brainwaves" and eye movements sounds
fairly dubious to me. Does it cover your eyes?

~~~
lurkinggrue
It is a bluetooth EEG headband.

<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EEG>

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_consumer_brain–co...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_consumer_brain–computer_interfaces)

~~~
stinos
... waiting for research of the influense of bluetooth on sleep, especially
when in close proximity to a brain :]

------
jonathanjaeger
I can't go without 10-15 minute power naps in the afternoon or evening.
Whether it's physically effective or just placebo, it feels essential. That
being said I drink coffee before the gym at around 7-8pm, which probably isn't
the optimal time (though I have no problem falling asleep at 12:30-1:30am
which is when I want to go to sleep).

~~~
maroun
Power naps can be very effective when used right (i.e if you're consistent
with them). In the last month of my semesters I switch my sleep over to
Polyphastic sleep schedule. 6 Hours of sleep at night and one 20minute nap in
the afternoon. It gives me more time to study for finals/finish up class
projects.

Check out this post for more information: <http://dustincurtis.com/sleep.html>

~~~
Dewie
Do you mean polyphasic sleep? If you sleep two times in a 24 hour cycle,
that's biphasic sleep.

------
sakbhatn
I agree with short naps concept but i think rather than following "the earlier
in the day, the better", another concept of mid-day napping can be followed.
You just need to take a short nap of 30 minutes ,15-20 minutes post-lunch.
That is the time we can easily fall asleep, also you feel very refreshed and
productive once you wake up!

------
nazka
If someone see my comment, there are many information here:
<http://www.supermemo.com/articles/sleep.htm> It is really big so the best
solution is to see it fast and read the summary. And it's worth it.

------
Abundnce10
How am I supposed to hear my alarm in the morning if I'm wearing
earbuds/earplugs?

~~~
maroun
If you're consistent you should reach the point to where you don't need an
alarm and your body is capable of waking up at the same time everyday.

However even if you're wearing earplugs you'll be able to hear an alarm, they
don't block off noise that much.

------
setrofim_
A very interesting post. However, it is making some strong claims without
really backing them up. It would be nice to see some citations.

------
binderbizingdos
no no no, i don't even need to read any of that. 6 hours sleep. perfect for
me. not tired, almost always in a good mood. very simple and effective. i
don't need no recipes, to know about deep sleep and all that.

you should not forget that people are very different. so don't try to impose
all these rules on everyone just because it works for you.

~~~
maroun
Thanks for your comment! At the end of the day you have to find what works
best for you. For some (lucky) people they can kick ass on just 6 hours of
sleep. For others, they need to be consistent and sleep for 7-8hrs.

I didn't mean to impose anything on anyone, just trying to share some of the
things I've learnt :).

~~~
binderbizingdos
ok, but your shouldn't make it look like rocket science. it's pretty simple
for me and maybe I'm lucky, but I guess the most important thing is to tell
people to experiment with their sleep. i would say most of these sleep issues
have a rather simple cure and you don't need sleep apps, wrist devices, zeos
etc.

------
andys627
What about waking up between sleep cycles?

~~~
maroun
You never want to wake up in the middle of a Deep Sleep or REM sleep cycle.
The best time to wake up is when you're in between cycles. Which is what the
"Smart Alarms" are supposed to do, they wait until you come out of a sleep
cycle to wake you up.

The Zeo is the most accurate (since it picks up brainwaves), however it's also
slightly uncomfortable and buggy. I personally use the Jawbone UP which works
good enough. All of the apps that say they do that aren't the most accurate
since they rely on the movement of your mattress. However I know some people
who swear by them.

------
repdetec
*than

------
13b9f227ecf0
You don't need to time sleep and you don't need to weigh calories. You just
need to make sure nothing is fucking up your true sleepiness and that nothing
is messing up your appetite.

You have sophisticated systems in you to govern consumption of sleep and food.
Just don't screw things up with drugs, digital stimulation, social isolation,
or junk food. It's all the same issue.

------
codewright
"Turbo shots" or "red eyes" in your coffee are a placebo btw. Espresso has a
lower concentration of caffeine than standard drip. So by putting a "turbo
shot" in your cup, you're actually lowering the caffeine concentration.

Wants to be hyper-rational and metric-aware about his sleep but didn't know
anything about caffeine?

Okay.

~~~
gerjomarty
I hear a lot about cutting caffeine after 3pm to have it not affect your
sleep, but I generally assume people are talking about coffee when they
mention this time. I care more about when I should stop drinking tea, which
apparently contains less caffeine.

Can I just halve the time required if tea has half the caffeine (let's say)?

~~~
nateweiss
There are some pretty good decaf black teas (not herbal) which are reasonably
satisfying if you want to have a cuppa later in the day.

If you're in the US, the Stash decaf range is IMO the best of the common
supermarket brands (the normal American teas like Lipton and Tetley are pretty
terrible in their decaf versions). If there's a gourmet store around, they may
have the English brands such as Typhoo or PG Tips in decaf, which are pretty
great. If you're in the UK then any advice on tea from the likes of me should
just be ignored out of hand... :)

