

I have well over 10 customers. I want to take my startup to the next level - greengarstudios
http://www.greengar.com/2010/08/10-customers/

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michael_dorfman
_Even though most of them have only used my free apps, I technically have
millions of customers_

No, you don't. Really.

You have millions of users. "Customers" are the people who have paid for your
apps.

Keep this distinction in mind.

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jacquesm
I'm not so sure the line is that hard. A customer is someone that you are
making money of, or maybe even someone that you intend to make money of.

Not someone that pays for your apps, and where would that leave services,
goods and other things that people pay for?

If you're in a long term relationship with a large number of people and they
don't pay you but you are making money off them in a different (for instance
indirect) way they are as critical to your bottom line as paying people would
be.

Free does not always mean you have no customers, free can mean you have
customers but the price is $0.

So, technically the guy has a sales funnel with 1 million people in it that
need to be converted to _paying_ customers.

If that distinction did not exist we'd never have to use the word 'paying'
attached to customers in that context.

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tomjen3
I can sort of understand why you would say that in a fremium situation every
person who signed up is a customer, but if you make money via ads, your
customer is whomever pay you for the ad space - not your users.

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jacquesm
As soon as you stop treating your users as though they are your customers
though you'll find out that the users view is a different one. Calling them
(or their data) a 'product' as I've seen some people do is really not the
proper way to treat people.

If people pay you for ad space then they're your customers _too_ , and will
need to be treated as such. But that does not change the other side much. And
plenty of companies have a freemium product _and_ ads at the same time.

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michael_dorfman
I don't think there's anything wrong with viewing the non-paying, ad-consuming
users of your product as "users" or "clients"-- it doesn't mean you need to
treat them poorly. But, you should remember who your customers are, and what
your business model is.

The original poster seemed to think he had "millions of customers". He didn't,
and doesn't, and that kind of fuzzy thinking isn't going to bring him any
closer to the day when he actually _does_ have millions of customers.

~~~
jacquesm
Here's my view of the pipeline or the funnel, whichever term you prefer, for a
membership / freemium site:

    
    
      - the world
      - visitors
      - recurring visitors
      - members
      - paying members
    

The transition from being a transient to being a customer to me happens
somewhere between the visitors and the recurring visitors stage, the point
where people start to invest in the site, maybe store some content there or
make some changes to the state.

All the people from 'visitors' (inclusive) down I'd label as users, and the
visitors themselves I'd label prospects.

Fuzzy thinking isn't going to bring him closer, but rigidly defining terms in
a way that is not suited to the current model (freemium services), but for
instance more suited to selling cars or shoes is also not going to help.

The lines are there, but the transition points are not quite as hard as they
are in retail.

Especially not in a subscription environment, users will deserve and demand to
be treated as customers long before they fork over their cash or it isn't
going to happen.

~~~
michael_dorfman
_All the people from 'visitors' (inclusive) down I'd label as users, and the
visitors themselves I'd label prospects._

I'd agree. And I'd label the "paying members" as "customers".

 _users will deserve and demand to be treated as customers long before they
fork over their cash or it isn't going to happen_

That's a key point. If you have to treat subscribers as if they were customers
when they are not paying (i.e., put significant resources into support, etc.),
your CAC is going to be high. That's not necessarily a problem in and of
itself, but it's worth paying attention to.

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ctb9
I believe the concept of 10 customers, as used (invented?) by Jason Cohen,
refers to willingly-paying users for some type of premium/freemium service.

That said, you seem awesomely successful, and I love the idea of taking your
venture to the 'next level' by recruiting and training others to join you.

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dLuna
This post makes me wonder what question the author is posing. Yes, you want to
take your startup to the next level. Do you want help? Do you just want to
tell us? Do you want recommendations?

Sounds like some really successful apps. Add some ads or start charging, and
you are set.

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greengarstudios
Help and recommendations are appreciated :)

My apps already contain some ads, and I have some paid apps as well.

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dglassan
What exactly do you mean when you say "I make what customers want, not what
they say they want."

If what they say they want isn't actually what they want,, then how do you
know what they want?

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greengarstudios
I learn what they want by observing them and considering their desires. I look
at what they do and how they behave. Add in some intuition and luck, and
that's pretty close to what I've done so far.

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drtse4
Since it looks like that all your apps are free, do you use iAds somewhere? If
you plan to build new paid apps, what about promoting them to your existing
user base?

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PaulJoslin
There is at least one premium app there, brain tuner premium. That has 87,000
'new customers' (whatever it means by new?) so around $87,000 revenue.

~~~
drtse4
That's _definitely_ not bad considering that from what i read is not so easy
anymore to sell apps in the store. But considering that the app is on the
store since '09 it isn't one of those big instant AppStore hits, so i guess
that the OP is aiming at seriously start building an app that has some
potential to become one of those. Additional info would be appreciated.

