
Loss of sense of smell a marker for Covid-19 infection - jacquesm
https://www.entuk.org/loss-sense-smell-marker-covid-19-infection
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jryan49
I had something a few weeks ago. I completely lost my sense of smell/taste for
a week. No congestion. 102 fever, very tired. I was out for a whole week. Mild
shortness of breath doing normal things. The loss of smell/taste was nothing
like I had experienced. It continued after my fever was gone. It was like a
switch was flipped and it was turned off. Usually congestion makes me lose
taste, but this was very different. Usually through breathing or snuffing a
bit I could smell or taste something. I couldn't even smell my baby's poopy
diapers. I was beginning to think it was never going to come back. One week
later out of the blue it slowly came back to normal. Everyone I know became
sick too with varying degrees of illness. One of them couldn't breath at 2 am
and went to urgent care and was given steroids. My co-worker with asthma ended
up in the hospital for a week. I'm starting to think we all had coronovirus.

Edit: i looked back and it was the 16th of February

~~~
toasterlovin
You had a fever and shortness of breath and you didn’t suspect coronavirus? No
offense, but have you been living under a rock?

~~~
jryan49
It might of been more than a month now. The virus was in the news on January
and then kind of disappeared out of the news. The way it was being reported
too was that it was contained in China and hasn't made it out. I thought maybe
I had it but it I thought it was unlikely considering the news.

~~~
toasterlovin
Fair enough. I guess the idea that a disease which had exploded in the way it
did in China could ever possibly be contained doesn't really make sense to me,
but maybe you don't live in a place with a lot of asian immigrants. I'm on the
west coast of the U.S. and there are just huge numbers of asian immigrants
here. There's just no feasible way a disease in China could somehow not make
its way here. Way too many flights and way too many people here with
connections to China.

~~~
jryan49
I'm in Philly, my wife travels through phl (intl airport) quite often for work
and we have a sizable Asian population. I was just naive to think we had a
handle on this thing.

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1996
I remember getting that a few years ago with some bad infection.

It is awful - nothing has any "taste" (using quotes as we often confuse taste
and smell. I could taste sweet/salty etc but this is a very small part of the
overall sensory experience compared to smells)

I would eat blue cheese and raw garlic to try to get some kind of taste,
because everything was insipid. So I would barely eat anything, unless I felt
hungry. Then, I would mostly eat pasta, because at least the texture was nice.
Only texture mattered.

Spices helped. Lots of them, put directly over the pasta. Meat felt like old
bubblegum, something hard to chew and without any flavoring.

In my case, it took more than a month to heal. I believe my sense of smell was
permanently altered because since then, I don't like anymore many things with
a faint taste that I loved before.

Raw mozarella for example still tastes like chewing boiled spaghettis. Only
the texture is different. I loved the aftertaste of mozarella before, but I
can't find any taste to it anymore.

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bentona
This seems like a potentially game-changing discovery - if we could trivially
diagnose 30%+ of cases, that could drastically diminish growth rate.

Are there standard anosmia tests? I'm wondering how to make this actionable in
the most efficient way.

~~~
75dvtwin
30% is a big number. Reducing number of silient carriers would be great.

I am also wondering if, in general, our societies would benefit from a
periodic self-quarantine, as a prophylactic measure.

I guess, if, after this pandemic is over -- we see fewer cases of H1N1 and
other upper-respiratory transmittable viruses -- we could conclude that
periodic, world-wide self quarantine should be written into laws of public
health.

May be every 5 years or so, for 1.5 months stop all non-essential travel, work
commute, public gatherings and so on.

Do not know if the above idea has any historical precedent, but, clearly our
world has developed into very inter-connected, redundant, essentially
unbreakable pathogen re-transmission network. So we need to respond to this.

~~~
LordDragonfang
Alternatively, just mandate giving service workers more paid sick days and
actually enforce the laws against making them come in while sick. Allow
telecommuting to be the norm. Implement better, universal healthcare.

As it turns out, lots of crazy leftist policies are actually good for the
public health.

~~~
75dvtwin
I am not sure that >"mandate giving service workers more paid sick days and
actually enforce the laws against making them come in while sick" ,

is an alternative to what I suggested earlier

> "... word wide self quarantine should be written into laws of public health.
> May be every 5 years or so, for 1.5 months stop all non-essential travel,
> work commute, public gatherings and so on...".

With regards to your note on >"... lots of crazy leftist policies .. ."

In my view, centralized control of public health, appears to be a bottleneck
to rapid response (not just because of process structuring, but also because
massive centralization of money appropriation mandate, becomes a mechanism for
unstoppable corruption spread, and non-meritocracy based promotions).

I never heard that conservatives are against telecommuting...

If anything there is, probably, a conservative sentiment _against_ massive
urbanization and globalization of supply lines.

~~~
joi_de_vivre
Ahh, indeed. Unlike the meritocratic private insurance industry, which
definitely doesn't benefit from and encourage corruption, "centralized control
of public health" would be a total waste of taxpayer money! It's not as if
every country with a system like that is exponentially more functional and
livable than those without!

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neonate
People often lose smell when they have a cold. Is this loss different?

~~~
phreeza
Isn't that due to mucus buildup in the nose? I think Covid doesn't have that.

~~~
nsxwolf
I had a cold once that led to a total anosmia that lasted for over a week
after my nose had cleared. It was very disturbing. I couldn’t smell anything
at all. Not peanut butter, ammonia, gasoline, anything. Then like a light
switch it all turned back on.

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andy_ppp
I had lost my sense of smell, had a very mild fever for 3 weeks that started
to turn into a dry cough. But yesterday all symptoms seem to have stopped.
Hopefully I’ve already had it but impossible to say...

~~~
francoisinsf
Did you get your sense of smell back???

~~~
andy_ppp
It seems fine now, but cough has returned, was getting worse but a really good
deep sleep seems to have helped (5htp + zinc + phosphatidylserine + 1mg
melatonin).

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vasco
I know this is not research, but two friends of mine that are reporting
symptoms of covid19 and report anosmia are also reporting ageusia (loss of
taste), not sure if this has been or will be confirmed by research though.
It's been around 4 days since they started complaining about this already.

~~~
nhebb
From what I understand, the sense of taste is intertwined with the sense of
smell.

[https://www.quora.com/What-is-the-connection-between-
taste-a...](https://www.quora.com/What-is-the-connection-between-taste-and-
smell?share=1)

~~~
shas3
It definitely is. I know a relative who lost their sense of smell and they
also report being unable to taste anything other than _plain_ salt, sweet,
pepper-heat, sour, and bitter. They have lost the ability to taste spices,
recognize different types of sour, etc.

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jacquesm
Full text: (site is going up and down):

Post-viral anosmia is one of the leading causes of loss of sense of smell in
adults, accounting for up to 40% cases of anosmia. Viruses that give rise to
the common cold are well known to cause post-infectious loss, and over 200
different viruses are known to cause upper respiratory tract infections.
Previously described coronaviruses are thought to account for 10-15% cases. It
is therefore perhaps no surprise that the novel COVID-19 virus would also
cause anosmia in infected patients.

There is already good evidence from South Korea, China and Italy that
significant numbers of patients with proven COVID-19 infection have developed
anosmia/hyposmia. In Germany it is reported that more than 2 in 3 confirmed
cases have anosmia. In South Korea, where testing has been more widespread,
30% of patients testing positive have had anosmia as their major presenting
symptom in otherwise mild cases.

In addition, there have been a rapidly growing number of reports of a
significant increase in the number of patients presenting with anosmia in the
absence of other symptoms – this has been widely shared on medical discussion
boards by surgeons from all regions managing a high incidence of cases. Iran
has reported a sudden increase in cases of isolated anosmia, and many
colleagues from the US, France and Northern Italy have the same experience. I
have personally seen four patients this week, all under 40, and otherwise
asymptomatic except for the recent onset of anosmia – I usually see roughly no
more than one a month. I think these patients may be some of the hitherto
hidden carriers that have facilitated the rapid spread of COVID-19.
Unfortunately, these patients do not meet current criteria for testing or
self-isolation.

While there is a chance the apparent increase in incidence could merely
reflect the attention COVID-19 has attracted in the media, and that such cases
may be caused by typical rhinovirus and coronavirus strains, it could
potentially be used as a screening tool to help identify otherwise
asymptomatic patients, who could then be better instructed on self-isolation.

Given the potential for COVID-19 to present with anosmia, and the reports that
corticosteroid use may increase the severity of infection, we would advise
against use of oral steroids in the treatment of new onset anosmia during the
pandemic, particularly if it is unrelated to head trauma or nasal pathology
(such as nasal polyps).

There is potential that if any adult with anosmia but no other symptoms was
asked to self-isolate for seven days, in addition to the current symptom
criteria used to trigger quarantine, we might be able to reduce the number of
otherwise asymptomatic individuals who continue to act as vectors, not
realising the need to self-isolate. It will also be an important trigger for
healthcare personnel to employ full PPE and help to counter the higher rates
of infection found amongst ENT surgeons compared to other healthcare workers.

~~~
EamonnMR
Oh no is this a permanent loss of sense of smell?

~~~
atwebb
This has been a personal fear, the death toll is significant, however being in
a younger demographic I am more readily concerned (personally, not trying to
be callous) with permanent disability. After seeing what SARS left people with
I had a new appreciation for the other side of "recovered". It seems too early
to tell long term effects, hopefully everything is temporary.

------
ErikAugust
Copy of article:
[https://beta.trimread.com/articles/8606](https://beta.trimread.com/articles/8606)

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ncfausti
Oh man. The girl I'm seeing just came back from traveling to Peru for spring
break last week. She said she hasn't been able to smell for about a week, and
most of the others in her group are reporting the same symptom.

~~~
RotaryTelephone
The girl you "were" seeing >:/

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askvictor
Starting to emerge that anorexia (loss of appetite) is a symptom in many
cases, might be related to not being able to smell or taste.

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robk
Google Trends shows a massive spike as well
[https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=today%203-m&q=...](https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=today%203-m&q=%2Fm%2F0m7pl)

~~~
ncr100
March 15 shows an uptick in "loss of smell" in USA

[https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=today%203-m&ge...](https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=today%203-m&geo=US&q=loss%20of%20smell)

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gerbilly
I had this starting around March 6th and it lasted for approximately a week.

I could _barely_ smell some things like say peppercorns, or coffee beans, but
the intensity was 1/100th of what it should have been.

I never had a fever or a cough but I did feel a bit more tired than usual.

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narogab
I lost my sense of smell when I took a zinc tablet to prevent covid-19
(serious but funny). Maybe I shouldn't have dissolved it in my throat (as was
suggested). Zinc is really bitter! My sense of taste is off too - nothing
tastes good.

Thanks to this thread, I won't know whether my diminished smell is from the
zinc tablet or I've contracted Covid-19!

Time will tell, maybe.

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nethergh0st
I had these symptoms back in early December. This was before we even really
knew about it in the US.

I was really sick for about 2 weeks, which included a mild fever for a couple
of days.

I remember thinking that I can't remember being this sick in a long time and I
wonder now if I had the Covid-19 infection.

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nyc_pizzadev
What about a headache and/or body aches? Been having mild symptoms of this for
the last week+ and I'm in a corona hotspot (NYC). Smell seems to be ok, but
I'm not sure of a good way to test other than smelling something strong.

~~~
Guillaume86
Headaches and muscle aches are typically symptoms of normal flu and not COVID
if what I read online yesterday is correct (can't recall the source sorry).

~~~
bestnameever
I read that a headache is a COVID symptom.

~~~
Jommi
Well Coronaviruses also are sometimes behind " the common flu". Headaches are
not unique to Corona.

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robk
As many people are taking zinc supplements it's worth noting zinc in high
doses causes this effect too so hard to say the effect being driven by covid
or zinc popping or both.

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mehrdadn
Is this full loss or partial? (article isn't loading for me)

~~~
cechmaster
For me I could still smell strong laundry detergent very faintly. But the
sense of smell appeared to be completely gone as if my olfactory nerve had
been snipped.

~~~
mehrdadn
Wow, thank you for sharing. I assume you're thankfully fine now? Can I ask how
long it took, how bad things got, etc.?

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joaomacp
Is this loss of scent permanent or temporary?

~~~
dragontamer
The virus only existed since ~November or December last year. There's no way
anyone could reasonably tell you if its temporary or permanent.

~~~
maxerickson
If most of the people that noted the loss from the infection also reported
that they got it back, that would be decent evidence that it was temporary.

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m0zg
This is dumb. Loss of sense of smell (and changes in the perception of taste)
is also a "marker" for cold, flu, and _allergy_. Allergy season is ramping up
as we speak.

Case in point: I had this a week ago. I'm pretty sure I don't have COVID19
though, even though I'm in Wuhan, WA.

~~~
empath75
Why don’t you think you’ve had it?

~~~
m0zg
No symptoms whatsoever. No rise in temperature (as measured from the forehead
using IR thermometer), no cough, no tightness of chest, no tiredness. My wife
and son had the sniffles shortly before (which is not a symptom of COVID19),
but also no fever or cough. I didn't even have the sniffles. I also work from
home, so I barely get out of the house even without a quarantine, other than
to go for a hike or to buy groceries. I've embraced social distancing years
ago. :-)

~~~
DangitBobby
Isn't a large proportion of cases asymptomatic?

~~~
m0zg
I have these symptoms (loss of smell and partial loss of taste) every spring.
_Millions of people_ have these symptoms every spring.

Let's not create even more panic than there already is. That, above all, was
my point.

~~~
DangitBobby
The desired effect of telling people about temporary anosmia symptoms that go
along with infection is to help them make more informed decisions about when
they may be infected and to quarantine themselves. The point is not to cause
"panic", but sometimes a little fear is actually necessary to motivate people
into action. In this particular case, slightly more fear is probably better.

~~~
m0zg
The "desired effect" here is Internet brownie points. Unfortunately this time
those brownie points could cost lives.

~~~
DangitBobby
There are much better places to accumulate internet brownie points.

