
Snowden’s biggest revelation: We don’t know what power is, nor do we care - npalli
http://pando.com/2013/12/29/snowdens-biggest-revelation-we-dont-know-what-power-is-anymore-nor-do-we-care/
======
Empact
"the only thing close to a politics around leaking is libertarianism, the
worst of all political worlds."

Funny how often libertarians get this treatment even after so many prominent
examples of representing the majority sentiment before the majority is ready
for it, e.g. on war and pot.

I'd say the worst of all political worlds is the one in which you blindly
support the actions of whichever leader bears your label.
[http://www.volokh.com/2013/12/24/liberals-conservatives-
swit...](http://www.volokh.com/2013/12/24/liberals-conservatives-switch-
positions-nsa-surveillance/)

~~~
gress
Eh? Confirmation bias-much? People have been against war, and pro-pot for
decades, and most of them have not been libertarians, unless you want to claim
the hippies were libertarian.

~~~
Empact
"Other people were also right" is not an argument against libertarians being
right about things.

And isn't that the point? We should be celebrating and expanding on the
opposition that exists, not dismissing it for lack of "our label".

~~~
gress
No, but it is an argument that libertarianism is incidental to them holding a
few views that happen to be popular.

Lots of people value freedom, and many of them are pro-pot and anti-war
because they believe the alternative to be oppressive.

Libertarians are a narrow subset of this who subscribe to an absolutist
philosophy that they believe will maximize freedom. Many people who value
freedom strongly disagree with libertarianism as a means to achieving it, even
though they sympathize with the desire.

~~~
baddox
Your characterization of libertarians as people with an absolutist philosophy
that they believe will maximize freedom applies only to a subset of people who
identify as libertarians.

~~~
gress
If true, that supports my point further.

------
squozzer
I think the conclusion is wrong. Many people care about many things. But most
of us aren't really equipped to lead a movement, and most self-organizing
movements lack the focus and ability to put aside differences to achieve more
than modest goals.

Put bluntly, we're (myself included) waiting for a King or Gandhi to take the
reins and lead us to the promised land. Snowden can't lead us from Moscow or
jail. The Dalai Lama and Suu Kyi have their own problems. And let's face it --
who wants their dirtiest secrets aired on CNN and Fox? Because that's the
price of fame.

------
teawithcarl
Mark Ames (Exiled, NSFW) new long reads have genuinely improved the
respectability and depth of Pando Daily, since its recent merger with NSFW.

------
l33tbro
People do care what power is. The problem is the media/leaders do not seem to
want to engage the public in a dialogue about the dimensions of the Snowden
leaks.

~~~
danielschonfeld
The reason for that is that all media in the United States (at least the power
houses that matter) is controlled by the government, whether directly or
indirectly. The last of our defacto checks and balances is basically gone too.

Compound that with a good amount of people who are mostly comfortable in life,
and yet get zero citizen based activism.

~~~
simbolit
I am not american, but from the outside it doesn't look like the media (power
houses) are controlled by the government. it more looks like the government
and business interests are so closely aligned (and often personally
contiguous) that there is no major disagreement between the media and the gov.
please, i would be glad to be shown otherwise.

------
nnx
This is probably my favorite (not strictly tech) news of the year!

It is brilliant and thrilling to read from start to finish.

I never read before about this story of the two NSA analysts defecting to the
USSR during the Cold War and 'whistleblowed' from Moscow many of the agency's
secrets in a similar manner as Snowden's - after being unable to do so
domestically.

This article is a great and sad reminder of the famous quote “Those who do not
learn from history are doomed to repeat it”.

------
f_salmon
> Snowden’s biggest revelation: We don’t know what power is, nor do we care

...until we feel the resulting pain, which means it will be too late b/c the
people in power will have built enough protections to ensure their position (=
even less democracy).

------
userbinator
Isn't it just voltage times current? :)

~~~
aspensmonster
Well, it's also R*I^2 and (V^2)/R.

