
Mysterious shackled skeletons found in ancient Greek mass grave - ngrj
http://www.cbc.ca/news/technology/shackled-skeletons-ancient-greece-1.3703346
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YeGoblynQueenne
>> a large ancient cemetery unearthed during the construction of a national
opera house and library between downtown Athens and the port of Piraeus.

Typical. In most of Greece one cannot dig to plant a turnip without striking
some relic of the ancient times.

It's not a joke. A friend's father who is a civil engineer has told me how the
law requires anyone who digs for a house's foundations to report any
archeological discovery to the authorities. Then all building work must cease
until the archeologists come in, do what the do best, and finally give the OK.

Unfortunately this may take a very, very long time (20 years in one case known
to my friend's father). This is because of the impossible bureaucracy in
Greece, but also because there is very little money to carry out the necessary
work.

As a result it is ...common that when something like this happens the person
who has the house built will pay the builders something extra to cover up the
finds and keep hush-hush about it.

I don't even want to think what treasures may be hidden under condos and
summer houses.

~~~
StavrosK
Yep, this is true. It's also one of the reasons why the subway in Athens was
delayed, as they kept finding ancient artifacts. Thessaloniki has one of the
main roads of the city half-closed because they found an ancient street
running below it when they tried to dig for the subway.

You can see it under the road, open and everything. I'll try to find a photo.

It sounds terrible that people would mess with artifacts like that (moving
them out of their property), but what can you do when your perfectly good plot
of land just turned into a decades-long liability because there's some ancient
stuff under it? It's not like archeology is the best funded of fields, either,
so archeologists don't have the resources to be quick about taking the
artifacts.

~~~
TeMPOraL
A common thing in Europe in general. My home city, Kraków, Poland, had its
market square renovation put on halt for almost a year when the initial works
uncovered things of interest to archeologists.

~~~
semi-extrinsic
This. I would go so far as to say anywhere outside the US and Australia (where
the cities have only existed for less than 3-400 years). But European
countries probably have stricter norms and laws for preserving old artifacts
than Asian and African countries (Maslow's pyramid etc. etc.).

~~~
jpatokal
As it happens, the construction of Sydney's shiny new light rail was almost
halted because they found a bunch of Aboriginal artefacts under the route:
[http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/call-to-halt-sydney-light-rail-
aft...](http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/call-to-halt-sydney-light-rail-after-
massive-indigenous-artefact-find-20160329-gnsxr4.html)

------
mcguire
" _" Perhaps with the DNA tests that we will do on these skeletons we may
confirm or not this hypothesis that these deceased, these young people could
be ... part of a coup ... an attempt by a noble to take power by force," said
Chryssoulaki._"

I would _really_ like to know the details of how _DNA_ tests could determine
that.

~~~
ChuckMcM
If they were all siblings (or related parents and progeny), it could be
eliminating a family.

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ChuckMcM
Makes me wonder if it will ever be a fashion statement to have a titanium
plate attached to some easily accessible bone which has a detailed history of
your life to that point on it. Figuring you'll get buried, time will pass, and
at some point someone will dig you up again and perhaps would have the
technology to read such data.

~~~
sandworm101
>>... and perhaps would have the technology to read such data.

Eyeballs? Do it in a couple different languages and your hip might be the next
Rosetta stone.

There was a 70s movie, and I assume a novel, about a spy with amnesia who had
a swiss account number engraved onto such a plate. But I cannot seem to google
it atm.

~~~
mti27
>>There was a 70s movie... Are you talking about the Bourne Identity TV movie
from the 80s? He washed up on shore and there was microfilm with the swiss
account number in his leg or something

~~~
sandworm101
No, it was an older movie. I think it started at a swiss hospital, the number
being visible via x-ray.

Bourne takes from so many spy stories that i doubt it possible to mention one
without seeing it somehow mirrored in Bourne.

\------------

For below (as I've hit the 3posts/hour limit) maybe I was thinking of bourne,
but only if he had a plate with the number on a bone. The thing I remember was
that the number only became apparent at the hospital during an x-ray, after
the accident that caused the amnesia.

~~~
Someone
The book is from 1980
([https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bourne_Identity_(novel)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bourne_Identity_\(novel\))),
and there was a film in 1988:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bourne_Identity_(1988_film...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bourne_Identity_\(1988_film\))

Are you sure it wasn't that one?

------
sandworm101
OP skips the most important detail: the shackles. We today do not appreciate
the effort needed to manufacture metal goods. Prisoners would never be buried
with such valuable objects. That fact alone tells me that this wasn't an
execution. This was human sacrifice. That's why the archaeologists are so shy.

~~~
throwanem
Why would sacrifices be any more likely than executees to be buried with
shackles still on?

~~~
JoeAltmaier
Because sacrifices have intrinsic value (spiritual value). The shackles can be
explained as part of the ritual.

Prisoners are just worthless people that you want to get rid of. Not only
would the shackles get removed before burial; so would their shoes etc. They
would be stripped and dumped.

~~~
Steko
Executions also have symbolic value and all sorts of people have been buried
with metal who were not human sacrifices.

> Prisoners are just worthless people that you want to get rid of.

That's not always true. Sometimes prisoners are important people you want to
set an example of. These aren't the first ancient skeletons with iron shackles
archeologists have found and the other ones (China, Rome, etc.) certainly
aren't all human sacrifices.

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jkot
Around that time Athens conquered many rival states. Aegina was similar to
Athens in wealth and number of ships, when it was conquered. Its temple is
greater (arguably) than Parthenon.

It was also common to take hostages (relatives from royal family and nobles)
from conquered states. Those were executed if conquered state rebelled.

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stygiansonic
Ancient Greece is full of interesting stories that rival Byzantine
machinations.

For example, Megacles, who was _archon eponymous_ during the attempt coup,
lead the reprisals that killed Cylon's supporters, after promising them safe
passage from the temple to stand trial. For this action, Megacles and the
Alcmaeonids (his noble family) were exiled from Athens for some time. (Later
on they returned to Athenian politics)

Perhaps the most interesting character from the Alcmaeonids was a fellow named
Alcibiades, who lived during the Peloponnesian War, which was mainly between
Athens and Sparta. (This is after the Persian wars, the events fancifully
depicted in the movie _300_ ) Coming from a rich family, he had an
aristocratic upbringing, counting Socrates among his teachers; Pericles also
helped raise him after his father was killed in battle.

Perhaps the best way to describe him is as a blend of JFK's womanzing, Bill
Clinton's charm and Donald Trump's flamboyance. (He supposedly had a lisp, but
curiously, this made him even more charming, but his "lisp" turned "R" into
"L"[0])

He became popular in Athens but obviously made some powerful enemies along the
way, and was forced to flee/defect to their rival city, Sparta, after being
accused of desecrating religious statues of Hermes in the city. (Could you
imagine if a prominent politician was accused of vandalizing churches or
destroying flags hung from people's houses after a night of drinking? Such was
the supposed outrage in Athens after this act.)

After some time in Sparta, he was accused of having an affair with the Spartan
King's wife and fled again, this time to Persia.

He eventually made it back to Athens, after some negotiations where he
promised that he could bring Persian support to Athens in their continuing war
against Sparta and her allies. (This support didn't materialize) Nevertheless,
he was given a military command and did manage to secure some victories for
Athens, but after one particular defeat, his enemies in Athens took this
opportunity to get him removed from command. After that, he went into self-
imposed exile, and not too long afterward, was assassinated, probably by
Sparta.

Some other interesting words with roots in Ancient Greek politics:

\- Anarchy: Athens was ruled by several _Archons_ , who were leaders each with
specific duties. So the word "anarchy" means something like "an absence of
leadership".

\- Ostracism: Once a year, Athenians would be given the chance to exile
someone. If they decided on this, they took a vote, by writing the name of the
person they wanted to exile. The names were written on discarded pieces of
broken pottery known as _ostraka_ or _ostrakon_ in the singular. After
successful vote, the person was exiled for 10 years; attempting to return
before this carried the death penalty. Interestingly, after the 10 years there
seems to have been no residual sanction against the individual, and
furthermore their property was returned to them.

0\.
[http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/E/Roman/Texts/Plutarch/L...](http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/E/Roman/Texts/Plutarch/Lives/Alcibiades*.html)

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adrusi
Maybe Plato's Cave was more than a thought experiment...

