
Ask HN: Advice for husband struggling with 2-career marriage? - careerspouse
I&#x27;m 40 and am a full-time software engineer.<p>My wife started working as a therapist, then found a career in sales and quickly moved up to a Director-level role leading a sales team. She&#x27;s proud of her success and does a pretty good job juggling that and family life.<p>We have two young kids.<p>I realized I have an issue with my wife&#x27;s job, feeling like it takes priority over our family. I feel I sacrifice small things regularly to allow her extra freedom for her job. I feel she budgets a disproportionate amount of energy and focus on her job, ignoring or putting off family-related duties or obligations that have a negative effect on the entire family.<p>When I think about my wife and her career, I&#x27;m proud of her success and I don&#x27;t think I have any issue with her earning more than me or having a &quot;better title.&quot; But I seem to have some issue with feeling less important than her job because I get annoyed when I feel that way. She tells me I&#x27;m unsupportive of her because I&#x27;m jealous of her success, but I just feel like I&#x27;m fighting for some respect for myself and I worry about a slippery slope of further sacrifice.<p>When we started dating, my side gigs got in the way of our dating lifestyle -- meaning it wasn&#x27;t totally acceptable for me to spend hours on nights and weekends doing contract work. The income was not necessary, so I slowly let it fade away. It was never something I felt actively bitter about, but no doubt it was a sacrifice I made to have more time for her. It comes up now because when she needs extra support for her job, it&#x27;s at my expense, and if I give her grief for that, I&#x27;m being unsupportive.<p>I&#x27;m realizing that what I&#x27;m dealing with might be a somewhat recent phenomenon, but also probably fairly common these days. I really do want my wife to be successful and happy, but I also don&#x27;t want to be required to live with this feeling of sacrifice. I&#x27;m trying to figure out if my feelings are rational or irrational.
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duxup
Couples therapy.

There's no real good way to really address this over the internet.

You might end up shopping around a few different therapists as different
relationships tend to IMO respond better to different therapists.

Don't worry about irrational or rational feelings, it is how you feel, that's
ok. Same goes for her feelings.

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inscionent
> I'm trying to figure out if my feelings are rational or irrational.

Your feelings are your feelings, rationality doesn't not come into play. Your
emotions do no define you unless you have allowed them control over you
actions. Processing and reconciling them with your identity is the only way to
the other side.

> When we started dating, my side gigs got in the way of our dating lifestyle

You aren't dating your wife anymore. I have no idea how much time has passed,
but your decision to take on less side work then, should have no bearing on
how much time your wife dedicates to her career now.

> She tells me I'm unsupportive of her because I'm jealous of her success

If the words, 'You are jealous of my success' came out of her mouth, I would
love to know what action or statement it was in response to. Are you
supportive? Are there things that she wants from you that you are willing and
able to do? Are there things you are not prepared to do? Discuss with her
honestly about your needs and short comings; with no expectations except that
she will hear you say the words.

> I just feel like I'm fighting for some respect for myself

Do you respect yourself? Long term relationships are work and can cause our
identity to be deeply tied to another. Reconnecting and accepting yourself is
difficult but is require for true lasting self respect. It cannot be found in
anyone else.

> I really do want my wife to be successful and happy, but

Is your wife happy? Is she in pain, over worked, lonely? Camaraderie around a
shared pain or difficulty can be reconciling.

> I also don't want to be required to live with this feeling of sacrifice.

You are married with children, sacrifice is the life you signed up for. It is
the blood, sweat and tears of raising the next generation, this is life. That
could be a bad choice for you personally, but realizing and coming to terms
with the facts of your situation is the first step to finding out how to make
it better.

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careerspouse
Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

The comment about jealousy of her career was part of a recent spat that came
about because I was annoyed at a situation related to her work travel. She was
going to be away for just a day and a half, but then asked to take the morning
before to exercise because she had been too busy at work the previous day and
she uses exercise as her escape, so she "needs" it. In my mind, that is
clearly saying, "my job was more important than exercise [OK, no problem], and
now my exercise is more important than my family." On the surface, that's not
a terrible statement, but then my mind says, "so that implies your job is more
important than your family," which to me is not OK. Ultimately, it's not a big
deal, she can go exercise in the morning, I can handle the kids and get them
off to school, and me to work. But this situation really makes me angry about
her priorities. As soon as I voice that, it's a fight and she actually turns
it into an argument about feminism and says I'm trying to make a power play
and keep her down. It's actually bizarre to me, to the point that I can't tell
if I'm crazy because of the way she is reacting -- have I really said
something to bring on a fight about feminism?

> Do you respect yourself?

That's a great question, and I always thought I did, but maybe not like I
should. I'm healthy, I have a good job (by most standards, extremely good),
but am I living up to my full potential? Probably not, and maybe that is
disappointing.

> Is your wife happy?

Right now, I'd say definitely not. She is overworked, and outside of work she
is going through a lot with a crazy family situation right now. She recently
told me she cried twice in her office one day, but then refused to talk to me
about it because "it's too stressful to talk about." That was another issue
that made me feel like I'm on the outside and her job is on the inside.

> sacrifice is the life you signed up for

Yes, I know this. The thing I'm having a hard time coming to terms with is the
disparate sacrifice between the two of us.

> realizing and coming to terms with the facts of your situation

I think this is the biggest thing I need to get out of this. It actually felt
like a weight was immediately lifted when I was able to realize and vocalize
this feeling that I might subconsciously be trying to sabotage her job because
I see it as a higher priority in our relationship than me. I'm now wondering
if I can embrace this role as the family catch-all that picks up
responsibilities she's unable to share instead of feeling resentful about it.
I'm hoping as long as I can recognize it as what it is, I'll be OK with it in
the long run. But as I mentioned before, the thought of a slippery slope of
sacrifice scares me. It's really not type of person I've ever been.

~~~
badpun
> Right now, I'd say definitely not. She is overworked, and outside of work
> she is going through a lot with a crazy family situation right now. She
> recently told me she cried twice in her office one day, but then refused to
> talk to me about it because "it's too stressful to talk about." That was
> another issue that made me feel like I'm on the outside and her job is on
> the inside.

It looks like your wife is in a crisis now. It would only make sense for you
to be supportive, by picking up a disproportionate part of chores or whatever,
so that she can get her back on her feet. However, if this situation persists
for a long time, I'd say you two should have a talk about her being in
constant crisis mode (with stress, crying etc.) being bad for both of you, and
what can you do to change it.

~~~
careerspouse
Good insight, thanks. I do notice some bouncing from crisis to crisis with
her. Not that all of them are manufactured -- some are very real and
unavoidable. However, she has a tendency to fall into the role of victim,
where these things in her life happen to her, and she's just trying to
survive. I would LOVE to figure out how to help her out of that mentality and
take ownership of all aspects of her life.

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csa
1\. I strongly suggest therapists — one for your and one for you and your
spouse. You may want someone more oriented towards coaching at the start. Note
that a couples therapist is an advocate for the couple, while an individual
therapist is for you. This will matter if your spouse might have some sort of
trauma, personality disorder, etc.

2\. Your wife seems to be in a place where she is asking herself a lot of
challenging questions. You seem to know this cognitively, but you don’t seem
to be accepting it emotionally. Given the situation you described in your post
and some of the replies, I’m not surprised her behavior is erratic. That
doesn’t make it “right”, but it does mean that one shouldn’t really be
surprised.

3\. Note that when she uses low blows like playing the feminist card (assuming
that it’s an exaggeration), thats a sign of desperation and confusion on her
side. Simply put, if you really are against her success, she should just leave
— I imagine that’s not really what she wants.

4\. I’m not sure where you are located, but dual incomes with kids to me
suggests that some of that extra income should go into help around the house.
This can be via a nanny, a house cleaner, someone to drive the kids around,
etc. The amount you choose to spend has a potentially wide range, but the
utility can be undeniably helpful. In many families this is done by extended
family members, but if you don’t have that option, paying money works. I see
lots of dual-income couples not near their families try to be superheroes and
maintain a high-paced lifestyle all by themselves — that’s insane.

Best of luck!

~~~
careerspouse
Thanks for your insight, good things to think about.

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Thetawaves
Don't discount your own feelings. They are real, and are forever with you.
Whether you can come to terms with the situation or push for a compromise is
something that you will have to answer for yourself. I think most healthy
relationships are built on communication/understanding/compromise, so you
should be able to express issues and needs and reach an equitable arrangement.

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lynnetye
Lots of great advice here already (especially #1 and #4 from @csa), so I'll
only add two things:

1\. A good exercise for you and your wife: take turns expressing how you each
feel and why you feel that way to one another. Then, take turns describing the
other person's feelings and frustrations _back_ to each other. Sometimes the
biggest source of frustration comes from feeling unheard. Doing this forces
you to actually listen (vs. waiting for your turn to talk) and helps
demonstrate that you're at least hearing and understanding where the other
person is coming from.

2\. After talking to your wife, you may find out that there really is an
unfair imbalance right now. If so, it's important to get a sense of whether
this imbalance is short- or long-term. Most couples where both partners work
take turns prioritizing each other's career. It sounds like you just need to
find out if what's happening right now is forever or not, and maybe get a
little more recognition from her for how much you're stepping up right now.

~~~
careerspouse
Thanks, it's so easy to forget that we'll never understand each other without
listening to each other.

Re: 2, I am beginning to embrace my role as it is now, and I feel so much
better about it already. Whether it's short- or long-term, I can take pride in
my ability to enable her to be the best mom and wife she can be.

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gshdg
Well, think of it this way: why should you necessarily be the one resentful
that she’s pursuing a career rather than homemaking full time? Why shouldn’t
she be the one resentful that you’re pursuing a career rather than being a
full time homemaker?

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pcunite
This is a really important moment in your life. You're on the right track
asking questions about it. I do have some actionable steps you can take.

1\. Please, please read the book "The Five Love Languages". Don't say another
word to her until you have this short book in your head. It will explain,
right away, the things you _need_ from your wife to feel loved and happy with
her. You have noticed resentment building in you (its good that you're self
aware and willing to talk about it). Being resentful can lead to you being
really aggressive in an argument which will drive her even more into personal
goals and then your marriage is over. Remember, she is still the one you fell
in love with. Right now, she is _high_ on success.

2\. When a person is selfish, it is extremely hard to take away the euphoria
they are feeling. For the purposes of this online discussion, it maybe you who
are selfish. However, because you're the one asking about it, know that you
will be the one to start the both of you down the right path. You will be the
one who understands what is really going on. That is a big job, and you'll
have to commit yourself to making the marriage last and work in a _better_
way.

3\. People are selfish. You, your wife, your children, the guy who cut you off
in traffic ... the people at work who think your wife is amazing _your husband
just doesn 't understand you_. She won't listen to them, unless its been your
tenth argument and you yelled at her again and have not met her _love
language_.

4\. You can be totally happy with your wife. She can totally respect you.
You'll need to use forgiveness and an ongoing understanding about how great
marriages work. You learn about software techniques all the time, you're on HN
after all! So now, spend a few moments learning about great marriages and how
they work from the book, "The Five Love Languages".

5\. Imagine, try to really imagine this, that your wife is unfulfilled as a
person and as a wife. She does not have bad intentions. She is emotionally
starving for something missing in her life. What if you could do, say, or in a
small way meet that emotional need? Would you be willing to do it? If you're
not, then someone or something else will!

~~~
careerspouse
Thanks, I've heard about this book a few times now, so I've just ordered it
for myself (and maybe my wife).

And jeeze, #5 there is speaking directly at me.

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codingslave
Trust your gut in these situations, and dont let anyone else tell you that you
are being irrational.

