
Julian Assange Got What He Deserved - Elof
https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2019/04/julian-assange-got-what-he-deserved/587008/
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mcherm
I would not paint Julian Assange (or Chelsea Manning) as a blameless hero like
Edward Snowden. But sometimes people do reprehensible things that are not (or
ought not be) against the law.

The primary objection against Julian Assange appears to be that he published
true information that others (like the US Government and the Hillary Clinton
campaign) did not want released. The US Government wants to extradite him
because Chelsea Manning asked him to help crack a password and he allegedly
said "yes" but never did assist in cracking it. I don't want to debate whether
that IS a crime under US law, but certainly I will claim that it SHOULDN'T be.

Yes, Atlantic - Julian Assange is not a nice person. And the Equadorian
government had excellent motivation to withdraw the protection of their
embassy. But no, Atlantic, that does not mean he deserves to be extradited and
stand trial in the US.

~~~
0815test
> (or Chelsea Manning) as a blameless hero like Edward Snowden.

Well, let's see, one of them went to Russia, the other didn't. Who is closer
to being "blameless"? And I thought that collusion with Russia is something
that people are somewhat concerned about, lately.

Also, why are you saying that Assange never made any attempt to crack that
password? Why then would he ever want to actively mislead Manning by
suggesting otherwise? That's a really fanciful scenario.

~~~
colejohnson66
> Well, let's see, one of them went to Russia, the other didn't.

Ah, the old “Snowden fled to Russia” trope. That’s false. He was in Russia
when the US canceled his passport. As a consequence of that, he was unable to
leave Russia.

~~~
jbharter
I've heard this too, looking for reputable source....

~~~
blihp
It was a very, very, _very_ well covered story at the time:
[https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2013/07/24/edward-...](https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2013/07/24/edward-
snowden-russia-moscow-airport/2582189/) (if you don't like USA Today, which
was just the top news source listed in my search results, just poke around for
'snowden airport' around the same time period in your preferred news outlet's
archives)

~~~
jbharter
Thanks, I was younger and not as interested in world news at the time.

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caymanjim
I agree. Early on, I thought Assange was a bit of a hero. He provided a forum
for people to reveal things that shouldn't be happening and shouldn't be
secret. I understand the need for government secrecy, spying, and
surveillance. I don't accept that it's ok for governments to break their own
laws to spy on their own citizens without warrants or just cause, however.

Assange wasn't simply doing this as a neutral party, however. He was playing
the same underhanded games as the governments. He was actively timing the
release of information and selectively revealing or withholding information to
suit his own political agenda.

I'd grown disenchanted with him well before the 2016 election, but that
revealed his hypocritical motivations in all their glory. He worked with the
despotic Russian regime and went on a personal attack against Hillary Clinton,
timing the release (and non-release) of information to intentionally disrupt
the presidential election.

Assange long ago became just another of the underhanded villains he claimed to
be fighting against.

~~~
tinus_hn
Hypocrisy is not a crime and people should not end up in jail for it. There is
a reason Lady Justice wears a blindfold.

~~~
Elof
Looks to me, based on public facts, that there is a reasonable case against
him being more than a hypocrite. Getting charged doesn't mean he will be
convicted... which is why Lady Justice wears a blindfold.

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norswap
Pfah. This is not, and should not be about personality. It's about what should
be considered lawful and what should be protected.

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rendall
That there is common-people support for the US position at all feels truly
crazy-town to me.

Those who support the US on this, should in principle also support extradition
of blasphemers to Pakistan, or anti-government protesters to China, from
anywhere in the world. If you disagree with that, I would love to hear your
perspective: please do articulate a principle of extradition that would
include Assange and exclude a blasphemer against Allah.

(Just, as a head-start hint, "I think Assange is a terrible person, therefore
he should be extradited" is not a principled perspective.)

That the mainstream US media inexplicably supports the US government's
position should alarm you. Yes, you, reading this. As above, I would love to
hear an articulated principle that cleaves Wikileaks from the wider community
of news media, that also does not allow for the arrest and prosecution of any
of the journalists who actually covered what Wikileaks wrote.

~~~
ThrowawayR2
> _extradition of blasphemers to Pakistan, or anti-government protesters to
> China_

A rather poor choice of examples, I'd say.

Extradition for blasphemy from the United States runs afoul of the dual
criminality requirement.
([https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_criminality](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_criminality))

The US also has no extradition treaty with China.
([https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_extradit...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_extradition_treaties))

~~~
rendall
I'm asking for the principle that divides one from the other, not the laws.

What prevents a reasonable claim that these laws you cite are unjust, given
that it is just to extradite a foreign national for the transgression of a US
law, that occurred on foreign soil?

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rinchik
Wasn't there an article on HN from Atlantic titled "You don't have to like
Assange to defend him" like yesterday?..

~~~
detaro
These are opinion pieces, so why wouldn't they publish two presenting opposing
ideas?

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thrwwy192783
Establishment media thinks julian assange got what he deserved? How shocking.
When will the atlantic and the establishment media get what they deserve? How
many illegal wars have they pushed? When are they going to end up in jail?

~~~
stmfreak
Yea, this smells like a coordinated hit piece to erode any public support
before trial. I expect we will hear much more about what a terrible person he
is on a regular cadence now.

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matt4077
The headline is somewhat tautologically true in the technical sense that, with
Ecuador, the UK, and the US each having an effective veto over legal action
against him, and all three being democratic countries with the rule of law
largely intact, whatever will come of this will tend to be the just
consequences of his actions that got too close and/or crossed the line of
legality.

Ever since Assange first got into trouble over violating a well-meaning hosts‘
house rules of hygiene (a perennial problem of his, apparently) there have
been accusations and conspiracy theories conflating the criminal and political
aspects. One should try to avoid this.

