
Tesla ranks last on influential JD Power quality survey - mudil
https://www.theverge.com/2020/6/25/21302804/tesla-ranks-last-on-influential-jd-power-quality-survey
======
itsoktocry
The comments here are weird and conspiratorial.

 _" the results immediately suspect."_

 _" makes me question just how influential this survey is"_

 _" one "survey".... what happened to integrity?"_

 _" Dodge looks like they paid a lot of money"_

The JD Power methodology is right there to read. If you're going to accuse
them of corruption, maybe a bit of evidence?

Or maybe, just maybe, Tesla has reliability issues. Many people outside the
tech circles have known about this for a long time. They are being sued for
paint issues. Panel alignment is terrible. I've seen videos of people going
through the car wash and water _leaking through the headliner_.

Do you really think that stuff happens with Dodges and Kias?

~~~
akmarinov
Surprised as well, Teslas are known for their quality issues and huge waiting
times for parts.

There are videos on the Tesla subreddit on checklists to go through to make
sure you get a decent car with few issues and dozens of horror stories on
people that didn’t go through those.

And I’m saying that as someone who wants one.

~~~
dhagz
I'm just hoping other companies can offer something coming close to competing
with Tesla in the next five years (my timeline for getting a new car). I'm
already leery of Tesla's autopilot being more camera-based.

~~~
xedeon
That might be quite a while. People have been waiting since the original Model
S came out in 2012.

~~~
new_realist
The reason is that other manufacturers make money.

------
Fezzik
Another article posted yesterday noted that the primary complaints were
related to the tech stuff in the cars (touch screens, Car Play, Android
whatever, etc...). Given how different Tesla’s interface is compared to a
traditional car it make sense that new users would gripe about those things
during the first 90-days of ownership.

Edit, the article: [https://arstechnica.com/cars/2020/06/teslas-are-the-most-
unr...](https://arstechnica.com/cars/2020/06/teslas-are-the-most-unreliable-
new-cars-in-the-us-survey-finds/)

and a quote: “Ars readers may not be surprised to discover that the most
troublesome of these categories was infotainment, which accounted for almost a
quarter of all problems.”

~~~
drcongo
They finished second bottom in the Honest John reliability survey too [1], so
maybe not just the infotainment system. Only Jeep were worse. I love watching
the mental gymnastics required to support Musk, it's the closest thing the
internet has to a spectator sport.

[1] [https://www.honestjohn.co.uk/honest-john-satisfaction-
index-...](https://www.honestjohn.co.uk/honest-john-satisfaction-
index-2020/honest-john-satisfaction-index-2020-the-results/)

~~~
Fezzik
I’m neither for nor against Tesla, but if someone is saying a car is
unreliable because people complain about the infotainment systems... that
seems deceptive. I think myself, and every driver I have ever talked with,
care about two primary things re reliability after the initial cost of a car:
how safe it is and how much it costs to maintain every xx,xxx miles. All this
other stuff is distracting and is trying to imply important aspects of a car
are inferior when they may not be.

Here are the pros and cons that honestjohn focus on re the Model S in their
“reliability” assessment: Pros -Excellent performance with usable battery
range. Impressive, huge touchscreen interface. Practical interior with plenty
of luggage space. Easy to drive.

Cons - Fit and finish could be better for a car at this price. Supercharger
network small, but growing.

------
slantaclaus
"Dodge and Kia were tied for the top-rated brand with just 136 issues per 100
vehicles."

I haven't read much more into this, but if a Dodge is more reliable than a
Toyota I'll eat a roll of paper towels

~~~
LyndsySimon
This is the "initial quality" survey. Reliability isn't really part of that.

------
jdhn
Dodge is on top instead of Toyota or Honda? This makes the results immediately
suspect.

~~~
bdcravens
It's in the first 90 days. Perhaps Toyota or Honda put additional features in
their car that require some tweaking? When I bought a new 2018 Accord, the
fancy display immediately had issues from day 1 and needed replacing. After
that, no issues.

~~~
slantaclaus
Usage of the word “Quality” rather than “Initial quality” in the article
headline makes it all look like some kind of lame hatchet job

~~~
bdcravens
Yeah, the submitted article's title doesn't tell the entire story. That's why
it's always important to comment on the article, not the headline.

~~~
slantaclaus
I disagree. Deception isn't cool and its worth calling it out when it happens.

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arprocter
Ram is listed separately from Dodge (I'm guessing they are technically
different companies now?)

Combined they'd get 277 which would put them last

Edit: correction - as stan_rogers says below, adding gives problems per 200
cars. 277 / 2 = 138.5

~~~
stan_rogers
It's problems _per 100 vehicles_. If you add them up, you get problems per
_200_ vehicles. If you go back to 100 vehicles, you'd have 139 (assuming they
round up).

~~~
arprocter
Good catch - I added an edit

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kdamica
The fact that Dodge and Kia top the list makes me question just how
influential this survey is.

~~~
rurban
Kia, yes, but Dodge looks like they paid a lot of money. Or their users are
really very happy. Ram users certainly are for sure.

For Mercedes and Volvo I think the costs of the repairs are also an important
factor.

~~~
bdcravens
This survey only covers issues in the first 90 days. In terms of repair cost,
anything that comes up in the first 90 days is likely covered under warranty,
so the cost of repairs would be $0.

~~~
rurban
Interesting. Now this completely changes my mind on these cars.

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bdcravens
"...the JD Power Initial Quality Study, which measures vehicle quality in the
first 90 days of ownership..."

Keep in mind this isn't a long-term reliability or quality measure. The more
innovative the car, the more likely it may need an adjustment or tweak in the
beginning.

------
detaro
dupe:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23637920](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23637920)

------
Ithildin
JD Power is a fake award invented by the auto companies to give themselves
anyway. I put zero stock in what gets awarded. It's complete BS.

~~~
bdcravens
"April 1, 1968: Dave Power and his wife Julie start the firm from the kitchen
table in their Calabasas, Calif., home."

"1969: J.D. Power enters the auto market with its first client, Toyota Motor
Company."

[https://www.jdpower.com/About-Us](https://www.jdpower.com/About-Us)

------
anorphirith
how to completely discredit your company (JD power) in one "survey".... what
happened to integrity?

~~~
bdcravens
Why do you say that? Are there legit issues with the methodology etc, or just
because they gave your favorite company a bad placement?

