
Google to keep employees home until summer 2021 - tysone
https://www.wsj.com/articles/google-to-keep-employees-home-until-summer-2021-amid-coronavirus-pandemic-11595854201
======
kyrra
(Googler, opinions are my own).

I'm also a WSJ subscriber, and saw this notification from WSJ before I checked
my email this morning. I think there are 2 important things to take from this
for those that didn't/can't read this.

1) From the article: "Mr. Pichai was swayed in part by sympathy for employees
with families to plan for uncertain school years that may involve at-home
instruction, depending on geography. It also frees staff to sign full-year
leases elsewhere if they choose to move."

2) This does not mean offices will remained closed. If Google is able, they
will open offices and allow people to return, if employees chose to. This is
more about giving people more options.

~~~
ocdtrekkie
The school year thing is going to be a big deal for a lot of employers.
Schools here are either doing full online or "hybrid", where half the time
your kid is at home. In either case, working five days a week at the office
isn't going to work for a lot of people this year, regardless of the safety of
being at the office.

~~~
shadowgovt
TBH depending on circumstances, working five days a week at home also won't
work for a lot of people this year.

I have family trying to raise two kids during this pandemic. Turns out,
children aren't just little adults who will go off and do assigned tasks
unsupervised; they require attention and crave personal feedback, and those
aren't things they can get from either teachers or peers in a distance-
learning configuration. Not in the quantities they get them in school. A lot
of working parents are going to find they're splitting their time between
their day jobs and keeping their children on their tasks, which will be a huge
adjustment for a lot of families (especially families with two working parents
who can remote-work).

I don't know that the US has a firm understanding of how much the babysitting
aspect of regular primary (and in some cases, high school) education adds
value, and the whole economy is in for a rude shock come Q42020 / Q12021 as
everyone's projections get missed unless companies are writing down goal-
hitting expectations right now.

~~~
AsyncAwait
> TBH depending on circumstances, working five days a week at home also won't
> work

I am aware that this is an extremely unpopular opinion, but in my opinion one
shouldn't have kids unless they have the means to dedicate sufficient time and
attention to them. That is maybe once you can take 2 days a week off as a
parent, or there's UBI or something like that.

Would avoid a lot of unhappy marriges, parents and children.

Of course, most people seek to 'leave something behind', even at the cost of
unhappiness for all involved.

I am not sure exactly what a good solution would be, but maybe 40+ hours a
week isn't a good deal anymore.

~~~
recursive
> in my opinion one shouldn't have kids unless they have the means to dedicate
> sufficient time and attention to them.

People that had sufficient time to dedicate to their children prior to the
pandemic no longer do. It's not reasonable to suggest that all prospective
parents should have forseen Covid-19.

~~~
AsyncAwait
You missed my point. Putting children in childcare is not 'having time for
them' before the pandemic. They didn't have the time required even before the
pandemic, it's just that there was a way to cover up for that lack of time
before.

~~~
ocdtrekkie
I'm pretty sure a kid only interacting with their parents for their whole
childhood is a good way to get some really messed up kids. One of the things
I've noticed really heavily during this pandemic is how much kids _miss out_
from school and social interaction. Childcare isn't just "store children until
I get off work", it's _engagement_. It's that child getting a variety of
structured and unstructured time with educators and other kids.

I could have all of the free time in the world, and childcare would still be
better for the kid than entirely time at home.

~~~
AsyncAwait
> I'm pretty sure a kid only interacting with their parents for their whole
> childhood is a good way to get some really messed up kids.

That is not an argument I am making. That is a good way to beat a strawman.

My point is not that they shouldn't be in childcare at all, but that society
should support such economic conditions that parents are allowed to spend more
time with their kids without having to compromise their economic prospects and
so that when they cannot send their children to childcare, say because of a
pandemic, it is only a minor inconvenience, rather than a significant burden.

> Childcare isn't just "store children until I get off work", it's engagement.
> It's that child getting a variety of structured and unstructured time with
> educators and other kids.

That's the ideal. When you're well educated, have the means to pick up the
best childcare for you kid you can find, have done the research, but there's
lots of families for whom, yes, childcare is precisely just "store children
until I get off work", not out of malice, but because their economic situation
hardly allows them to think about it much.

------
jonp888
Everybody seems to be celebrating the opportunity spend more time at home, but
I have the opposite view.

I live alone(it seemed like a good idea at the time[pre-corona]). My family
lives hundreds of miles away on a different land mass. At the weekends I can
meet up with people and do activities, but everything I used to do
midweek(e.g. swim training) is now shutdown indefinitely due to Coronavirus.

I am utterly miserable in Home Office. It means from weekend to weekend I have
no human contact with anyone except my reflection in the mirror.

I have no idea what to do. If I demand to work from the office just so they I
get the chance to occasionally chat to someone, it takes away valuable
capacity from people that actually need it.

~~~
nouveau0
I feel you. I'm going through the same thing. I'm an introvert who recently
became extrovert and I can't do 90% of the activities that made me an
extrovert.

Here's how I'm coping:

1\. Reactivated my introvert side with

    
    
       a) Reading more books
    
       b) Learning to play music
    
       c) Online singing lessons
    
       d) Exercising at home: i) Strength ii) Following through Supple Leopard (book)
    

2\. Going outside once a day for a walk. No exceptions.

3\. Chill at the emptiest park on the weekend.

4\. Going on a hike during on some weekends.

5\. Small talk and saying Hi to random people on the street.

6\. Cleaning the house

~~~
tutfbhuf
How can someone change from introvert to extrovert. As per my current
understanding this kind of thing is a very fundamental personality trait. Not
saying it's impossible to change, but curios how to do so.

~~~
anoncareer0212
It's all mindset...I leaned introvert in high school and was locked inside for
1-2 years coding after college, went hard INTJ. 18 months later, after a lot
of small changes (moved, added a friend group, got an apartment in the hip
part of town, pitched investors, more employees), I was a hard ESFP

It really makes me hurt to be stuck by myself for this long again. There's
some net benefits to introversion (more time, mostly), but theyre minimal and
don't increase much

~~~
disgruntledphd2
Myers-Briggs is a state measurement, not a trait measurement.

Filed under yet another reason why Myers-Briggs sucks.

------
danans
Google employee, but opinions are my own.

As a parent I'm grateful for the flexibility to choose where I work until next
summer, however it has become very clear to me that a large number of lower-
income essential workers who are parents are currently facing a major
childcare crisis because they have to return to work despite schools being
closed.

This is really revealing underlying disparities in childcare access and the
inequities in our education system. Given the immediacy and severity of this
crisis, people in my community are trying to figure out if they can repurpose
existing social service foundations, like school PTAs, to raise funds from
more well off community members to support others who are in this sort of
childcare bind.

But it's very hard going, not at the least because everyone is in their own
personal logistical crisis and it's hard to think about others' childcare
needs when you are trying to figure out your own.

~~~
mac01021
> lower-income essential workers who are parents are currently facing a major
> childcare crisis because they have to return to work despite schools being
> closed

Because I live in a middle-class bubble, I wonder what most of those folks do
ordinarily while school is out for the summer.

~~~
busrf
Depending on the area, many summer day camps are subsidized for low income
families.

~~~
danans
Many of these programs are also provided on school grounds. Of course the hard
reality is that many kids just slip through the cracks in our left to their
own devices for the summer.

------
eezurr
There's a lot of celebrating about working from home and the convenience that
brings, but there is no free lunch. A social trade off: now it is (the people
who WFH) your responsibility to separate your work/family/life boundaries. I
cant speak from experience (introvert, no family), but I think I understand
people enough that many will be lulled by the convenience/comfort and not put
enough effort into keeping those boundaries up. Expanding: your routine before
the shutdown (gym, night classes, public talks, etc). Each of those now
require two trips to participate (to and from), instead of hitting them up
after (or during) work -> more effort to keep boundaries up.

Additionally, staying in the same place all day cuts out hundreds/thousands of
opportunities (over a year) to meet people.

I disagree with people pushing for WFH to become the norm. As convenient as it
is, I think it is a net negative to society/our social fabric. IMO, life is
already too convenient. That being said, it may be possible for local
(neighborhood/town) culture to bloom. It will be challenging in our hyper-
political, 'can find people who agree with me anywhere in the world'
environment.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_place](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_place)

There was an HN post with great discussion that I cannot find about the wiki
article. Third place's were already in decline in the USA.

Lastly: This has been posted many times, but many of the employers costs could
be transferred to the employee in a WFH environment.

EDIT: I should add, I've been working from home for > 5 years and live in a
big city. I've watched my self discipline decline over the years (or maybe
that's due to getting older, or being too comfortable). It's been very
difficult to build a social network of friends.

~~~
whateveracct
Since working 100% remotely for a while now, I no longer spend the majority of
my time on work. It's easily shrunk to my #3 time allocation behind spending
time with loved ones + taking care of myself & my home. It's really tied for
#3 with hobbies/personal projects.

It's kind of shocking how many years I could've been forced to spend in the
office away from what's important. Cats have short enough lives as it is! And
I only get this one with my wife :)

Due to this, boundaries are pretty easy. I just use a planner & make sure I
stay on task. I fit it in whenever and just hit requirements for the week. Get
paid & spend the majority of life on things that directly benefit me. Highly
recommended.

~~~
unethical_ban
I think that is a unique perspective, and not invalid, but think about what
lets you do that. A salaried job with few meetings per day.

Hourly tech workers, or those who have to be available 9-5 anyway, don't have
this luxury.

I agree with the parent that WFH does have a lot of long-term potential
downsides/changes for society.

~~~
whateveracct
I forgot to add - I am "available" 9-5. If I get pinged or emailed, I do
respond. If something needs fixing or investigating, I'll jump in.
Availability & the trust-building it brings allows you to get paid for
existing.

I have a salaried job as a BigCo (not a FAANG or even a tech company) - If I
were to work hourly (say, consulting/contracting) I don't think it would be
too different. Pay would be more sporadic but also work requirements would be
more in my control so it just trades off. Eventually I'll probably drop the
BigCo job and get paid less but on my own terms as my finances allow.

I agree I'm in a position that allows for this. I had to get through school
and cut my teeth in industry before I could get a position like this. But I
knew I wanted it & pounced on the first company that would remotely hire
junior me despite my lack of remote experience. Pretty much every career
choice I've made was guided towards working remotely like this.

Pre-covid it was so trivial to find gatherings for shared interests (meetups,
clubs, tournaments, rec sports, art walks, classes) that I think society would
be fine if you stopped forcing people to associate with others that get paid
by the same corporation. All the things I listed are a bigger signal of shared
interests.

------
bluesquared
As someone at a non-silicon valley non-FAANG company, how are those guys
treating their hardware teams?

As an embedded hardware engineer, I've been coming in to the office on an "as
necessary" basis. Reading between the lines, I'm rolling my eyes. 99% of what
I do can be done at home with the equipment I have, yet our business unit has
been the one R&D group expected to have butts-in-seats the whole "shutdown"
due to being an "essential" (i.e. medical devices) business.

Hearing all of these tech companies taking the pandemic seriously is giving me
some serious grass-is-always-greener feelings.

~~~
jedberg
One of my family members works in hardware engineering here in the valley.
They have been going to the office seven days a week for weeks, but only four
hours at a time (and then working another six at home).

Their labs are open but at 1/2 capacity for social distancing, so they have to
trade off who gets to be in them (and have to wear masks the whole time, temp
checks, etc.)

Their deadlines haven't changed, and their counterparts in Asia are working
normal hours, so they have to work seven days a week just to try to keep up
since the lab is producing 1/2 the work it normally does.

~~~
otoburb
>> _[...] their counterparts in Asia are working normal hours [...]_

Bingo. Global competition and productivity will likely be the larger factor
than our (in)ability to balance work-life. I feel this pressure more so
managing a remote distributed team around the world, even though we're
software-only.

------
monkeydust
Think this is a smart move - a LOT of other companies spending energy trying
to figure out when and how to phase people coming back to the office, this
approach shifts it down the road and says lets just focus on executing here
and now.

Reality is if people did start coming back to office that could easily get
reversed in a few months.

So again I like the idea of kicking the problem down the road given what we
know today.

~~~
mox1
A friends company is planning on bringing 50% back to the office in October.

Which effectively means instead of 4-8 hours of Zoom meetings at his house, he
can take them sitting at his desk in the building, while the other 50% sit at
home.

Not sure how well that is going to work out. This is an old school Financial
company though, so it's not overly surprising.

~~~
Loughla
My (higher education) institution had a really nice gradual phase in plan.
Small shifts of workers for a few months when the state opened back up, with
more people coming in as we approached semester. An emphasis on in-person
classes, but with options for folks who were uncomfortable with crowds.

Then administration caught wind we were 14% off on students.

Two days later - mandatory, everyone back in the office, no remote work to be
allowed, for any reason.

It's depressing, and I have no other reason to type this out, other than to
complain, I guess. 99% of my, and the folks in my office's jobs can be done,
effectively, remotely. But that's not an option. Just ridiculous.

~~~
tome
> Then administration caught wind we were 14% off on students.

What does 14% off on students mean? 14% fewer students registering for
classes?

~~~
NotSammyHagar
14% revenue drop too. I think a lot of colleges would be happy with only a 14%
revenue drop! They must have thought not having in-person classes certain was
reducing student signups.

------
VikingCoder
I'm ready for high-tech, work-from-home workers to build a trailer park in
some remote location (as long as it has great internet), where you have to
quarantine for two weeks on the way in, but once you're in your kid gets to go
to school with other kids the same age, your infant gets to go to daycare.

I mean, really, a lot of Bay Area people would probably end up with MORE
living space in a mobile home.

Either that, or maybe I should just be trying to move to New Zealand.

~~~
ngngngng
I would love to move to New Zealand, but I don't want to renounce my US
citizenship and I don't want to pay double income tax.

~~~
tcbasche
It's always interesting when I hear US citizens whinge about paying more tax.
Heaven forbid you get a functioning healthcare system and a government that
actually governs

~~~
ngngngng
I was under the apparently mistaken impression that NZ was one of the
countries where I would have to pay US tax and NZ tax. I'm no opposed to
paying more tax for sane healthcare or functional government. But paying two
countries taxes would be prohibitive, and NZ is not exactly cheap.

------
paulpan
While this was probably a necessary move due to ongoing covid19 impact on
families as well as pressure from other companies (e.g. FB and Twitter having
announced broader WFH policies), it's fascinating to see Google do this and
how it'll impact their workforce in the longer term.

Google arguably pioneered the model of "office will have everything you need"
to incentive current employees to come to the office as well as lure new
recruits. It's been a win-win for the company and the employees: Google gets
focus/dedication and the synergies of colocation, whereas employees can enjoy
the many onsite perks.

One major irony is that for a company that sells products that facilitate and
enable WFH, such as the GSuite, it's actually not very open to allowing its
employees to WFH. Covid19 has seemingly forced the company to change, or at
least adapt in the short term.

But what happens in 2-3 years? As tech employees everywhere are used to WFH,
Google probably needs to de-emphasize the onsite requirement aspect and
consequently change their culture/workplace model.

~~~
Panini_Jones
I am not a fan of WFH. One thing I do wonder though is, now that I've bought
thousands of dollars worth of home office and gym equipment, why would I want
to forfeit that? I suspect many employees who sprung for the HM chair and the
standing desks won't want to leave those unused at home very easily.

~~~
esoterica
That's easy, just give up work-life balance and work another 40 hours a week
at home on top of the 40 at the office.

------
matthewmacleod
In some ways it’s actually kind of annoying to get a medium-term commitment.
My partner’s job at Google can be (and of course recently has been) done
remotely. We would rather move somewhere cheaper and closer to family, rather
than being chained to a particular office location.

Now we have confirmation that remote work is basically all fine, except we
can’t take real advantage of it because there‘s no reason to think it will
continue to be possible in the future.

I appreciate that companies are offering flexibility, but it would definitely
be better if there was more thinking being done about the long-term
restructuring of work.

~~~
titanomachy
I made the move anyway. We'll see how it works out long-term.

I'm enjoying being back home, especially since "home" is in a country that has
their shit together a lot more than the US does right now. That means I can go
to the gym, visit parks, and have a basically normal social life. I do miss my
friends in the (US) city I normally work in.

If my employer forcibly recalls everyone to the office, I might decide to take
a slightly lower-paid job in my home city, especially if the US is still
inundated with COVID cases.

~~~
ejvincent
You should be careful of the tax implications. WFH outside of the state your
employment center was based in opens you to possible complications around how
your employment is viewed by the IRS.

~~~
titanomachy
Yeah, treading very carefully there. This won't be my first complicated tax
year...

------
sushshshsh
If I was able to receive a definite answer from my employer about a real
remote date, I would have purchased a house for under 100k in Montana months
ago by now.

~~~
doopy-loopy2
I'm sure a small percentage of people would do the same!

On the other hand, I think the large majority of people want to go back to the
office (once it is safe to do so)

~~~
burlesona
Have surveyed this at my (large) office and it’s about 50/50.

I don’t know what the exact numbers would be aggregated across the entire
population, but from comparing surveys across my own office and several other
large companies I think there are two large minority positions (want to WFH
forever / want back in office) and a third slice of undecideds.

~~~
axk
Similar results at my (reasonably large) company:

* 20% want to go back to the office

* 30% want to WFH forever

* 50% want the flexibility to WFH 2-3 days a week

------
welfare
If everyone's moving to remote working. Do you believe this will push for
dumping wages as well? I don't mean moving jobs to India, but rather recruit
remote workers in relative low-income areas of the US?

Not discrediting the amount of skills available on the US East coast but why
wouldn't FAANG try to source new remote employees elsewhere in the US?

~~~
save_ferris
Some employers will probably try, but since I've moved to a lower-income area
of the US, I've noticed that there aren't a ton of other developers in my
community, especially with 5+ yrs experience.

I think location will factor more into salary discussions moving foward, but
it's not like there are a ton of software devs in South Dakota ready to take
the jobs of the SV folks.

~~~
Loughla
>it's not like there are a ton of software devs in South Dakota ready to take
the jobs of the SV folks.

Yet.

That's the point. They're in places like SV, because they're required to be,
right now. If remote work really takes hold, and folks can move to places like
South Dakota, I bet that changes. That's the entire point. Right now there
aren't folks out there, but there will be in the next 1-3 years, I imagine.

~~~
neonate
If this became a big enough trend, I wonder if it could lead to a
revitalization of rural America.

~~~
Loughla
I mean, the nearest town to me (pop.<600) has fiber internet. Many rural/small
towns have local co-ops that no one talks about who are offering fiber. What
else would you need?

~~~
charwalker
Personally, a fairly liberal set of laws in place to maintain my current set
of rights and options let alone those for my female partner. I won't be moving
to a state that insists in conservative social policies like banning abortion
and cutting education or basic infrastructure under the guise of lowering
taxes. I like living in a functional democracy, at as a state, and happy to
pay taxes for things like better schools and roads.

~~~
Loughla
That's actually one thing I really like about living in a Northern Rural area.
The rural attitude of 'live and let live' and 'leave me the fuck alone'
carries over to relationships and home life. Nobody really cares about my
relationship with my partner, as long as I'm willing to leave them the fuck
alone.

I say 'northern' rural area, just because I've never lived in a rural area in
the south of the US.

~~~
charwalker
I don't have anything against that or moving to a location that meets your
values.

It's more that I'd prefer to support schools and social programs, and have
those open to me as best as possible, than get away from it all. I've been in
a spot where if it wasn't for the ACA I'd be dead (specifically extension of
parents insurance until child is 26) and if I didn't have strong local schools
growing up I probably wouldn't have gone far. We do better when we work
together and pool resources for all, including the next generation. It's hard
for me to be a part of that by moving somewhere rural.

And I can't bring myself to move to a red state unless it's flipping purple
and willing to basically pull a Virginia. The social rights differences
between colors is serious and unfortunate.

------
siculars
What really hasn't gotten the same level of attention is the fact that
Googlers will be able to work from anywhere in the country their main office
is located in. I predict there will be some exodus of Googlers from places
like NYC, SF/Bay, LA and Seattle for places like Austin, Colorado and Florida.

Edit. I have two small kids and child care has been the bane of my existence
since March. This (and flex time) has definitely helped my families situation.
I'm grateful for the luxury and I'm deeply concerned for everyone who is in
this situation without this flexibility (friends and family included).

/Googler living in a middle state, thoughts my own.

------
d3ntb3ev1l
My how things change. Last year my manager and director at Google wouldn’t let
me be away from the office to work from another location for 2 weeks without
forcing me to take a family leave. To quote “remote doesn’t work, if you can’t
be in the office you need to take a leave or vacation”. Apparently those two
L7 geniuses weren’t consulted before this decision :)

~~~
FreakyT
Honestly, I still think remote work doesn't work.

The sole exception, however, that it can sort of work if _everyone else_ is
also remote.

~~~
muro
In a company with offices around the globe and projects all over the place as
well, remote or in-office makes very little difference.

~~~
C1sc0cat
really? ever have to work on project split like that?

Its easy for key features to be lost - and a lot of time and $ to be wasted.

I wont mention any names but I found out today that our team should have been
on a call about a major website rebuild - I have a suspicion that some key
areas have been missed.

~~~
dijit
I can say with all sincerity, that I have been on projects like that.

And because "remote' is such an incredible afterthought, co-dev production is
harmed immensely as a kind of collateral damage.

I have worked in companies that did this right, we had offices in
NYC/London/Bangkok and we did everything over RT tickets+IRC, mostly because
it was incredibly frictionless (yes, I know IRC and RT are not the best tools
in the world, but once they were set up and everyone was in people preferred
using them to taking in person meetings).

Contrast with today: we have teams in Sweden, UK, North Carolina, San
Francisco and Helsinki- and we use Jira/Teams/Confluence as our "tools"....
but they're so /slow/ that we have to be dragged through the coals to use
them, we much prefer in-person meetings, we much prefer hashing things out
over a coffee.. and thus, our co-dev is very much out of the loop, and it's
"odd" (as in, not default) to include them. So what happens is we carve out
bits of responsibility and we restrict immensely the communication channels..
in fact some peoples entire job is to ensure those communication channels run
smoothly.. and it's still very many shades of terrible.

I want to blame the tools, but really, it's the culture, if you're more
comfortable engaging over IM/Tickets w/e then it doesn't matter if you're
sitting 10ft away or 100mi away.

------
duxup
I worked from a company that was acquired and about 1/4the people in the
building were left working in a building for about 4x the number of people
there.

All the layoff horror aside, it was glorious working there for a while before
they started renting the unused space.

The executive bathrooms were real treat. it was always quiet, every common
space was sort of a private lounge.

I wonder if folks in the office are having the same experience.

------
grazhero99
I find it interesting how this situation is beginning to feel normal to me.
I'm only 20, so I've never really consciously lived through a world event of
anything even approaching this magnitude before. I'm finding that my whole
outlook on life is being majorly altered by all this. As utterly horrible and
tragic as everything is right now, I'm hopeful this will ultimately turn out
to result in some positive lifestyle changes for me at a personal level, as
long as I don't die.

~~~
mikestew
_I 'm only 20, so I've never really consciously lived through a world event of
anything even approaching this magnitude before._

Those of us approaching 60 haven't, either. Arguably the Cold War, but unless
I happened to watch _The Day After_ recently, I never gave that much thought.

------
varbhat
Good thing. I think that other major companies too will follow the same step
Google has taken now(WFH).

PS: Typing this wondering when the corona phases out.

~~~
eclipxe
Once there is a vaccine in the US, readily available.

~~~
yazaddaruvala
Keep in mind (from a pandemic perspective):

\- The current population density of urban and suburban areas, is prone to
pandemic scale events. However, density is great for a lot of reasons and this
trend will continue.

\- The latency and throughput of travel being so good, is prone to pandemic
scale events. However, current travel is great for a lot of reasons and
improving latency and throughput will continue.

\- Bio-engineering advancing quickly, will be prone to cause pandemic scale
events. However, we need to advance this domain for better medical treatments.

With these points above, the next large-scale, remote-work event is
guaranteed, the only question is when.

Keep in mind (from a for-profit corporation perspective):

\- They value stable productivity rather than productivity peaks and throughs.

\- Land, buildings and infrastructure are 15% of employee costs.

\- Pandemics are not the only form of churn requiring remote work, so are
natural and unnatural disasters, etc.

\- Reacting to the event, will always lag the event. Creating a vaccine or
cleaning up a fire / flood / earthquake will require a few months at the
least, everytime.

As a company making a decision today:

\- If the employees working remotely have less than 15% productivity loss (but
the company pays 15% less for real-estate), then remote-work is viable today.
Like with Google, et-al.

\- If the employees working remotely have a noticeable (i.e. 15% or more)
productivity loss, then remote-work is not a viable option. However, maybe the
increased stability is worthwhile for the company, and remote-work will be
deemed viable.

In either case, it seems like a no-brainier to start investing into tooling to
support automation or remote-work with increased productivity (Slack, Oculus,
remote controlled robots, etc). While the word "covid" will phase out, the
mentality of remote-work and hyper-hygiene (e.g. masks and hand sanitizers)
will only accelerate.

This is similar to the change of era where "parents allowed the kids to play
outdoors, unsupervised", these eras are sadly over.

------
jacquesm
The cynic in me sees the cost savings. Suddenly you're at work 24/7; no office
space or workplace overhead, no office perks or food.

~~~
kevin_thibedeau
You should be paid well enough that free food isn't a factor. This is truly a
FAANG world problem.

~~~
throwaway45349
There are many TVCs at Google for whom the free food is a non-trivial benefit.
Think about cleaning staff or other low paid jobs.

~~~
Shebanator
great point. I sometimes see TVCs absolutely loading their plates with food,
and it makes me think about what a blessing it is for them to be able to
access high quality food at least once per day.

~~~
yazaddaruvala
I agree "for them to be able to access high quality food at least once per
day" is a good workaround in the current economic climate but, is "blessing"
truly the right word?

Don't you think "access to high quality food anytime they want for their whole
family" (ideally through appropriate pay) be a minimum bar before they
consider themselves, or we consider them, even close to "blessed"?

------
neonate
[https://archive.is/8XT8c](https://archive.is/8XT8c)

------
akyu
And this marks peak tech salary.

------
lsllc
Anyone know what the US tax implications are of long-term working from home,
specifically for deducting "home costs" for the employee?

~~~
cycrutchfield
I’m not a tax expert but my recollection is that the 2018 tax reform bill
removed the ability to deduct home costs from your federal taxes. However,
some states may still allow such deductions.

------
acituan
As other comments mention protracted WFH reveals and expands many inequities;

\- A good chunk of the FAANG workers are young immigrants, which means they
cannot move back to their parents’. Whereas most of their American
counterparts can do this if they choose to and enjoy multiple benefits from
rent savings to moral support of having a community.

\- A good majority of the workers are single young adults. Multiyear shutdowns
including the office space will make couplings suffer. It is already harder
for immigrants to find partners (e.g. large intercultural gaps) but this not
only amplifies the current isolation but also delays people’s life goals
significantly.

\- A good portion of the workforce don’t have enough savings for a downpayment
and usually live in HCOL locations, which means they are renting smallish
apartments. When the primary locale is _home_ , it makes a huge difference
what that home is like. Be it sufficient noise isolation from neighbors, to
having space for exercise / hobbies (even more important where gyms and other
entertainment venues are closed), a dedicated office, a yard to get some
sunshine and fresh air.

I forsee mental health of these demographics taking an extra hit that will
ripple for the next several years, even decades.

------
aaroninsf
Absent from most coverage:

This and the related issue of school closure,

are necessitated only because in this country we were incapable of embracing,
or even in any meaningful way, articulating, the necessary and obvious
solution to this pandemic: • support individuals and businesses 100%, while •
developing effective test, trace, treat, and control

There is no mystery here. The examples of successful variants are everywhere:
literally, everywhere else in the first and some of the second world.

The arguments for UBI, single payer, and not least, the eradication of right-
wing indoctrination networks which cultivate a meaningful subset of the
populace to be uninformed, uninformable tribal victimhood-rage-junkies
divorced from consensus reality and hostile to science, have never been more
stark.

Yet nowhere are these self-evident truths being articulated, debated,
trumpeted, defended, forced.

Every vehicle which the right habitually paints as "left" liberal or biases
that I follow,

is so laughably mealy-mouthed, equivocating, both-siding, and self-constrained
in its framing, let alone advocacy, as to provoke nihlistic despair.

The question is not why Google is resigning itself to WFH.

The question is not why employees must now form micro-schooling pods out of
pocket.

The question is why there are not pitchforks and torches forcing the obvious
basic systemic change in this country necessary to bring us in-line with every
other functional variant of 21st c. intelligent capitalism.

We have been committed by short-sighted billionaires who backed social
tribalism as a tactic to wealth consolidation,

to a path of total cultural and political self-destruction.

So f--king tiresome and so, so, so unnecessary.

------
kshacker
So a mischievous question : if everyone can work from home, which means they
can work from anywhere and not really needed in USA, will Google reduce H-1B
applications for the next year?

------
aminozuur
I'm pleased to see that WFH is becoming more normal.

~~~
clvx
It isn't becoming normal, it's being forced due many factors: risk of getting
sick with no proper treatment, possible schools not opening which forces to
deal with your kids, no vaccine, etc.

~~~
aminozuur
"A Gallup poll found a majority of American adults working from home would
prefer to continue doing so “as much as possible” after the pandemic."

~~~
techsupporter
The word "possible" is doing a lot of work in that quote. Notably, if enough
people go back to the office because they prefer to do so--especially if
they're managers or others who can influence things like good reviews and
higher raises--there will certainly be a tipping point where more people see
themselves as "needing" to return to the office in order to further their
careers and money.

And if even more people return, the habits like remembering to make meetings
accessible to people who aren't physically present will fade. Not that
meetings were particularly accessible, even in many tech industry companies,
before. Conference room audio equipment is quite bad in a lot of places.

Possible seems to me to mean if almost all people in a company, group, or
department are working remotely, if working remotely isn't seen as a career
impediment (or working in the office isn't viewed as more of a boost than
working remotely would take away from), and if people can still participate in
groups, then perhaps.

What I figure we will see is a hybrid, where people are in the office a day or
two per week and at home the rest of the time. That still means you have to be
within commuting distance of an office and still have to make child care and
other appointment arrangements.

------
sushshshsh
The government wouldn't let Google create housing at the site of its office,
so it created Google offices at the sites of its employees :)

------
finnjohnsen2
Feel bad for people in the US, which seems to effectively to be back to
March/April.

------
ryanSrich
Why not work from home forever? If it works now it’ll work in a year.

------
lrnStats
This is the first person/company that actually has a realistic (still
optimistic) Coronavirus timeline.

Prior to this, everyone had unrealistic "fall 2020", then pushed to "January
2021".

This still assumes a vaccine and production of the vaccine will be finished in
under a year.

A more realistic estimate seems to be 2022.

I don't understand why this is so hard, you can look at pandemic physics to
know that Coronavirus is not going anywhere. And you can look at previous
vaccine and medical production to understand how long it takes to make
hundreds of millions or billions of vaccines.

Are most people willfully ignorant?

~~~
tmountain
I think it's such a hard pill to swallow that it's easier for a lot of people
to incrementally move the goal posts from a psychological perspective. Nobody
wants to suggest 2022--lest it become real from the mere suggestion that this
is the case. Everyone keeps talking about a vaccine, but I don't see a lot of
people facing the realities of what will be required for the vaccine to
succeed (70% of the population inoculated). Nobody wants to talk about the
potential for a less than desired durability in the vaccine (i.e., the
scenario where you might need to be vaccinated 4x per year). All of this just
seems to be too soul crushing and horrific to make it part of the regular
dialogue, and I understand why--the reality is brutal.

~~~
lrnStats
But increments cause bad decisions to be made.

------
vmception
Extend and pretend!

------
vmchale
So many non-government institutions can see what's obvious!

