
German plastics group highlights success of bottle deposits in recycling - endswapper
http://www.plasticsnews.com/article/20161207/NEWS/161209886/german-plastics-group-highlights-success-of-bottle-deposits-in
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mxfh
This also the story of failure and counterproductive incentives of the so
called _Mehrwegquote_ , multiple use deposit bottles, which used to be above
70% in the 90s and is now as low as 40% and was scrapped altogether as an
environmental politics target last summer, the original target was 80%.

The single use plastic bottle deposit was introduced at multiple of the cost
of the multi use bottle to boost use of the latter, but somehow that turned
out to have the opposite effect. Mostly because of by having a deposit on the
single use, it is perceived by most as being equal to multi use in it's
environmental cost footprint and single use having less logistical
requirements for retail.

Some German Background:

[https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einwegpfand#Die_Entwicklung_bi...](https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einwegpfand#Die_Entwicklung_bis_heute)

[http://refillables.grrn.org/content/western-europes-
experien...](http://refillables.grrn.org/content/western-europes-experience-
refillable-beverage-containers)

[http://www.toytowngermany.com/forum/topic/10497-the-
mystery-...](http://www.toytowngermany.com/forum/topic/10497-the-mystery-of-
bottlecan-deposits-pfand/?page=5#comment-2366929)

~~~
subpixel
That's disheartening to read. I found the way beer bottles were reused in
Germany truly impressive, especially coming from the US and knowing the scale
of waste the German system avoided.

~~~
mxfh
Beer bottles are doing fine, but pretty much everything else (bottled water,
soft drinks) went away to be replaced by single use.

You can still do a beer Club Mate diet by exclusively using returnables.

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matt4077
The beer bottle system has also come under pressure. It used to be that most
beer was sold locally, and that most breweries used the same bottles anyway.

Now, they choices have expanded and you might by a bavarian beer in Hamburg.
And many have started to use individually styled bottles to strengthen their
brand. These go to a local plant where, more often than not, they're now
destroyed and recycled instead of returned to their origin to be reused.

~~~
subpixel
[in old man's voice]

I swear Augustiner tasted so much better when you could only get it in
Bavaria.

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patrickk
The bottle deposit is called "pfand" here you can see a machine in operation
in a supermarket:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLKmr0uVhWo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLKmr0uVhWo)

Some more details on the program:
[https://www.reddit.com/r/germany/comments/18rpwa/i_have_a_fe...](https://www.reddit.com/r/germany/comments/18rpwa/i_have_a_few_questions_about_pfand_and_those/)

As an expat in Germany, I was very impressed by the whole system. You can scan
your bottles, get a receipt and use that to subtract from your purchase in the
supermarket (or get cash). If you have an empty beer crate full of empty
bottles, the bottom of the pfand machine in the video above has a slot and a
conveyor belt that scans the amount of bottles in the crate and adds it to
your total (8c per glass bottle). If you order your groceries online, the
delivery guy will collect your bottles and issue the discount on the spot.
Homeless people often gather enormous amounts of bottles after events, such as
Oktoberfest. People sometimes casually drinking on the street will leave glass
bottles next to the bin so that the homeless guys have an easy time finding
the pfand bottle to recycle.

~~~
danielbln
As a German, the thing I like most is that you never ever see bottle trash
lying around in parks or on the street, as any stray bottle is quickly (and I
mean within minutes) swept up by the homeless/less fortunate.

~~~
DanBC
It's nice that the streets are clean, but maybe we'd be doing better if we
just gave those people cleaning jobs that they can do plus some support with
staying in the job, and accommodation, and medical help if needed.

~~~
lmm
Sure, but that's not trivial. E.g. in many cases these are people who might be
unable/unwilling to work any kind of regular or fixed hours, so making this a
regular-employment job would hurt those people.

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edwhitesell
The state of Michigan had (has?) deposits of $0.10 US on all bottles & cans
when I grew up there. I never noticed how much it kept bottles, cans and other
items from becoming litter along roads and parking lots until I lived in
states with no deposit. It was a nice incentive to go out and pick up trash,
because the cans/bottles can really add up.

~~~
badwolf
Similarly to how Austin banned single use plastic bags. When I visit other
cities, I notice them everywhere, stuck in fences, trees and bushes, along
roads, under overpasses, etc...

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jorgen123
They call it urban tumbleweed.

And where people care about keeping their town clean, tax money gets spent on
removing the tumbleweed[1]. Which is why these bag bans are a general good
thing.

Source: [http://1bagatatime.com/learn/plastic-bag-clean-
costs/](http://1bagatatime.com/learn/plastic-bag-clean-costs/)

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philfrasty
There was this funny case here in Germany a couple of days ago where a man
made 45.000€ in bottle-deposit with scanning the same bottle over and over
again.

The judge called it a „logistical masterpiece“ because the guy had to scan
roughly 180.000 times.

[https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=de&tl=en&js=y&prev...](https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=de&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=de&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.n-tv.de%2Fpanorama%2FPfandbetrueger-
ergaunert-44-362-75-Euro-article19109861.html&edit-text=)

~~~
cnvogel
You forgot to quote the funniest part...

"This is already logistically a masterpiece," quotes the "Kölner Stadt-
Anzeiger" the judge from the process. "You did not have anything else to do
this day." The accused replied, "I've put a radio on the line because I was
too bored."

„Das ist ja schon logistisch eine Meisterleistung“, zitiert die Zeitung den
Richter. Der 37-Jährige habe den ganzen Tag nichts anderes gemacht, als den
Automaten zu befüllen. Der Angeklagte antwortete demnach: „Ich habe ein Radio
danebengestellt, weil es mir sonst zu langweilig war.“

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chronial
Missing in the article: the deposit for PET bottles is 25 eurocents.

I am living in Germany and I love the fact that it's rather high. I want to
recycle, but I'm also lazy :). Getting an euro for 4 bottles brought back is a
nice incentive to do so and a lot more tangible than “the environment“.

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ce4
That high return rate is due to the deposit of 25 cent (€) per bottle. Water
(20ct/1.5L) comes cheaper per bottle than its bottle deposit. There are people
who collect bottles in cities for a living even.

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endswapper
Bottle deposits are incredibly effective. Long-term I'd like to see deposit
programs for all materials.

California, also mentioned in the article, has people using bottle deposits as
an income at $.05/$.10 per bottle.

