
The Next Phase of the Retail Apocalypse: Stores Reborn as E-Commerce Warehouses - prostoalex
https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-next-phase-of-the-retail-apocalypse-stores-reborn-as-e-commerce-warehouses-11595044859
======
djhaskin987
I got a buddy who works for DSCO, a company which, among other things, sells
software that makes it easy for brick-and-mortar stores to sell products
online and have the products ship from the retailer's warehouses. Around the
time of the pandemic, they change their software so that the stores themselves
would look like warehouses to the software. That way, they could ship from any
of these so-called warehouses and then support ship-from-store on the websites
of their customers. This functionality was sort of in in demand before the
pandemic, but many potential customer said "no thanks, we'll build it
ourselves". After the pandemic hit, everyone went scrambling to DSCO for help
to support ship-from-store.

This article seems to talk about the next logical step away from ship-from-
store: turn the store into a shipping yard.

~~~
WrtCdEvrydy
Honestly I wish there was 'ship-a-replacement' to store.

If something is on Amazon, why can't I pick up from Home Deport and have them
ship inventory to Home Depot to replace the thing I just picked up...

~~~
cortesoft
If the item is at Home Depot and you want to pick it up... why not just get it
from Home Depot?

~~~
WrtCdEvrydy
Pricing.

~~~
lotsofpulp
How would you guarantee the item is not a counterfeit/broken in
transit/transported at the right temperatures/etc?

------
justinzollars
Expensive fulfillment warehouses. If you watch the 2000 interview of Jeff
Bezos - the reason he predicted he would beat retail was because the cost of
square foot of his fulfillment centers was a fraction of what retail pays.

~~~
lotsofpulp
I'm willing to pay Home Depot/Lowes/Best
Buy/Target/Costco/REI/Nordstroms/Apple multiples of what Amazon would cost to
ensure I don't have to waste my time searching through uncurated AliExpress
garbage.

~~~
greeniron
man, i often hear people complain about aliexpress, i just don't understand
it. i've been buying and using headscratchingly cheap products from china
through aliexpress, and seriously as long as you're not a complete newbie to
online shopping, it's not that difficult to find a legitimate store selling
perfectly usable generic or unbranded products at a fraction of the cost of
the branded version and they all work just fine. i've easily saved thousands
of dollars over the years this way. i don't understand why people are so
against this - a lot of what they buy from amazon or supermarkets in fact come
from china as well.

~~~
perl4ever
Is that stuff tested by Underwriters Laboratories?

It makes sense that if Amazon is just dumping the same stuff under fake
brands, why not go to the source. But anything that uses electricity could
burn your house down, couldn't it?

~~~
greeniron
i mean... that's a legit theoretical concern, but so far i've bought many dirt
cheap electronic products from ali for years and so far they've all worked as
advertised.

------
phendrenad2
As everyone moves to e-commerce, a lot of companies are going to be burned by
counterfeit products finding their way into their warehouses. This is a
problem Amazon just kinda ignores, because it has such a high volume that they
can just accept returns no-questions-asked. But when store-that-is-accustomed-
to-in-person-sales suddenly has a bunch of people returning items that are
wrong, they won't know what to do. Are the customers scamming them, sending
back the wrong item? Was it the supplier? The manufacturer's warehouse? Their
own warehouse? It's a tough problem, perhaps there's room for a 3rd party
company that only traces the source of counterfeits.

~~~
MaximumYComb
That's just for the products that can be proven to be fakes. There is also a
lot that just are shoddy that you cannot prove, in which case the store loses
a repeat customer.

Amazon has already lost me for products where I care about quality. The Pilot
G2-05 pens I buy in store ($5 each in Australia) have never had any issues and
all worked flawlessly until I drained them of ink. The Amazon 12 pack hasn't
had a single pen reach the end of its life.

~~~
m463
My favorite pens are pentel energel 0.7. Dark black ink, lowest writing
effort, never blobby or scratchy. I get them from Amazon, but would be
devastated if they started be counterfeited.

------
jedberg
They better make the experience much better. They don't pay the gig workers
nearly enough to care and get this stuff right. I don't blame the pickers at
all. The stuff in retail stores isn't labeled for warehouse style picking.

When my wife sends me to the store with the list, I have a hard enough time
getting exactly what she wants, and I already have a pretty good idea what she
wants since I live with her.

A poor hourly gig worker has no chance of getting it right.

~~~
function_seven
My local Vons keeps sending me $20 off coupons if I use their delivery
service. I've tried; 3 times. All failures.

First, their UI is confusing. I didn't realize at first that I could
specify—for each item—if I would accept a substitution or not. And I got about
70% of my order right, 15% wrong, and 15% missing.

The second time, I diligently went through each item in my cart and set my
substitution preference. This is another fail. The choices are (1) No
substitutions; (2) substitute with same brand, different size; or (3)
substitute with different brand, same size.

What I would like is “(4) Cancel the entire order if you can't fulfill this
item” and “(5) These _x_ items are all-or-none” But that's a logistical
nightmare I assume. They're not going to have the pickers drop the cart as
soon as they realize they can't find item #23 on my list. Nor can they criss-
cross the store verifying the must-haves before moving on with the rest of the
list.

And the failures are not just missing items. Substitution preferences are
subjective and personal. On my first order, they didn't have Diet Coke. So I
got regular Coke instead. When I got wise to setting the preferences, it still
resulted in getting the chips, but no dip.

Perfect, real-time inventory won't solve this. I can order an item that's in
stock, then get "front-run" by a shopper who's actually in the store.

FWIW, I have these issues regardless if it's Instacart or Vons' own delivery
personnel (They use both). And I don't blame the picker one bit. I used to
shop for my Dad when he could no longer drive. He was just as disappointed
with my results as I am with theirs :)

------
tijuco2
Why do people keep posting paid articles here? Most people don't have
subscriptions

~~~
zorpner
If you're not paying to read it, someone else is paying to have you read it.

~~~
taneq
And if you _are_ paying to read it, someone else is _still_ paying to have you
read it.

------
Melting_Harps
It's going to happen, this is actually why I've re-focused on Supply
Chain/Logistics as there is so much room for potential growth and re-capturing
losses within them as I saw working in the Automotive side of Logistics and
Supply Chain a few years back.

We're going through a very unique, but much needed, transition right now that
will likely bring about the automated warehouses, distribution hubs, and
transport depots we always read about in books and and sci-fi lore--and that
so many feared. It also re-enforces the need for UBI now more than ever,
something that not long ago was though to be impossible, yet is being pilot
tested by Andrew Yang and Jack Dorsey as well as other places in the US, and
even by YC itself!

I'm actually optimistic, and believe if we play it right it could in fact be
the seeds that allow for a Post-scarcity economy one day on Earth, as so much
is lost in critical supply chains, and having these over-extended
international based ones may have done more harm than good, as they
accelerated a race to the bottom system in terms of price and quality (even on
critical things like Medical Supplies/Drugs) as so much went to China but also
made most countries entirely dependent on the CCP and has way more Geo-
political consequences than we can predict.

Right now I'm taking a course in Supply Chain Operations and my final will be
analyzing the consequences from the displacement of critical manufactured
goods (PPE) to China and the affects it has had during the onset of COVID, and
now also recently due to the massive flooding in Wuhan and the surrounding
areas of China [1].

The most optimistic delays in lead-time are 2-3 weeks, but if COVID showed
anything, as we saw with Medical staff in the US and even Australia having to
go months without PPE and wearing trash bags in lieu of actual medical grade
PPE, is that its best to actually double that to get an accurate time.

But it wasn't all bad as it also saw many 3D printing hobbyists use the
technology for ACTUALLY MEANINGFUL potential instated of printing trinkets you
use to clutter a work desk. And some other companies, mostly in the automotive
Industry, pivoted to making breathing apparatuses.

1: [https://www.msn.com/en-us/weather/topstories/record-china-
fl...](https://www.msn.com/en-us/weather/topstories/record-china-flooding-
impacts-ppe-supply-chain-to-us/ar-BB16VX4L)

~~~
csa
> I've re-focused on Supply Chain/Logistics as there is so much room for
> potential growth and re-capturing losses within them

Could you expand on this some more?

I realized you spoke a bit about this issue in the rest of your post, but I
would love to read more specifics.

~~~
Melting_Harps
> Could you expand on this some more?

I could talk about this for hours, but I'll keep it as short as I'm still in
midterms week. The basics of Lean and Sigma Six are damn near antithetical to
the the Chinese model business model of flooding the Market with sub-par
quality, albeit incredibly cheap products. There are many reasons why this has
worked for them so far, but in the case with PPE it is literately a life and
death situation so it should be one of the few Industries that remain in the
nation.

So, rather than fumble with delays in leadtime, bad QC/QA and constant
shipping delays it is my contention that trying to bypass these incredible
losses [1] is a much better solution for all involved (including the
Environment), which inevitably leads to this [2] and we finally accept this
[3] and we can strategize with key talent that is now fleeing Hong Kong due to
the CCP's constant belligerence as they flow into Taiwan, UK, Australia and
the US and help them create far more viable and sustainable business models
with proper equipment and eventually displace the need for China in this
sector.

I think it can be done for food as well, as that is what I was primarily
focused on during my Ag apprenticeship (local, sustainable food/Ag supply
chains) and my return to culinary as I worked on farm to table models in
Europe and the US, and then tried to gather more info from Big Food
Multinationals when I was at IBM's Blockchain Lab program, which failed to
live up to it's potential and I got fed up with the status quo that made it's
'food safety' program a total farce and instead returned to the Culinary
Industry after I shuttered my startup. It was a shame as they had so many Food
multi-national's excited about the tech and would it could do to for their
bottom line: consider 40% of all food in transport is lost due to
perishability and fluctuations in temp/humidity.

Had my plan worked I would have been at SpaceX right now trying to learn their
internal logistical network of their food and beverage program to eventually
join Squareroots in the future, I was working at Kimbal's place, and try to
help be a part of the Team to create a sustainable model for the container
gardens for Mars colonization. Suffice it to say I can really nerd out on that
sector more than PPE but I'd probably end up doing a Grad Level dissertation
instead of actually doing the work.

1: [https://www.businessinsider.in/india/news/after-50000-ppe-
ki...](https://www.businessinsider.in/india/news/after-50000-ppe-kits-from-
china-fail-quality-tests-india-ramps-up-in-house-
production/articleshow/75173170.cms)

2: [https://www.bbc.com/news/world-
europe-52092395](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-52092395)

3: [https://nypost.com/2020/04/18/why-america-desperately-
needs-...](https://nypost.com/2020/04/18/why-america-desperately-needs-a-hard-
decoupling-from-china/)

~~~
csa
Fun!

Thank you for the reply — it got my gears turning in a very good way.

Best of luck with mid-terms!

------
Animats
Ship-from-retail-store doesn't work very well. You get some random subset of
what you ordered. The online ordering system needs to know the inventory to
make this work right. Right now, I can get quick delivery of a random subset
of what I order from Safeway, Doordash, or Costco. They send some random gig
worker into the store and mark up the prices. I'd rather have two-day delivery
of exactly what I ordered.

So how good are these new outfits at that?

~~~
Axsuul
Can you expand on what you mean by some random subset of what you ordered?

~~~
inerte
I think they meant "random subset of what you can order"

~~~
jedberg
No, they mean random subset of what you tried to order. If you use Instacart,
at least in California, there is a good chance that 1/3 of your items will be
"unavailable" and they just won't get it.

The problem is, if you order flour, milk, and sugar, and then they don't bring
the sugar, you can't make the thing you wanted to make. But you also can't
return the partial order.

~~~
monsieurbanana
And that's legal? The more you know...

~~~
usud7e2uehf
Speaking as a California scrooge, I still prefer it to the alternatives
honestly. My neighborhood has one mini-target and three local grocers one of
which is a co-op. All three local grocers are garbage, their quality is fine
but nothing wild and most of the price is for pretty looking food that doesn't
scare the local yoga moms. Also, because they are all small and the target had
to agree not to sell certain things the food variety available is not stellar.
Thanks to Instacart I can order from places with real prices and a wide range
of grocery products. Instacart is especially great because Amazon Fresh,
although better than the local options for variety, is also wildly over priced
and so if I want delivery+thrift Instacart is basically the only game in town
because the bar is that low. I am thrilled at the idea that some of these
local shops might finally have to adapt thanks to the increasing presence of
delivery services.

------
exanimo_sai
This is not really the next phase - retail has been on a downward trajectory
since the first online sale was made. The spiral down just buffered by a
global economy that was growing.

Working with Westfield back in 2008 there was talks already of redesigning
mall footprints to have smaller stores that can act as pop-up shops/
collection points etc. However there was an overall equilibrium achieved as
malls started playing into the idea that their differentiation was on
"experience".

Shopping and going to the mall remains a highly social activity. And I believe
will survive well past the pandemic. And perhaps stores will be smaller
individually and act as both in-store sales, collection points for online
purchases and pop-up stores to market new products.

~~~
2sk21
I think malls might be sustainable with just clothing and restaurants (and the
Apple Store).

------
acd
Local stores still can compete with speed and shopping experience. Ie the
future of stores is hybrid local/e-commerce.

I hope that there will be both types of stores in the future for the city
center to flourish. Imagine going as a tourist to a city which only had
e-commerce and not stores that would probably not be as fun experience as a
live city with local shopping.

~~~
fermienrico
I might be the only person who dislikes traveling. To me, traveling is an
expensive way to explore food, museums and maybe some overcrowded landmarks. I
went to Paris, Tokyo, and all we did was followed a guidebook of one touristy
place after another.

Instead, I prefer to save that money to do something here locally. Maybe go
get a nice dinner at the French Laundry. Or rent a convertible and cruise
around in Californian weather. Yes, just because it’s local doesn’t mean that
it’s any less. If I lived in Paris, I would want to check out my own city
thoroughly. Explore corners of Paris every weekend.

Traveling is overrated IMO. I hate the logistics, I somewhat dislike the
experience as a whole but maybe some places are fun. Especially like going to
Asian cities where it is a whole another world.

Here in America where I live, there is so much stuff to see already. Just do a
cross country road trip for 3 weeks. Totally unmatched experience.

Tourists, no matter how “covert”, are basically treated like a commodity and
no one really gives a shit about you as a tourist to come and explore the
culture.

Tourism was incredible 40 years ago probably when mobility wasn’t that
accessible. $400 flights to Asia and Europe has killed it for me just by the
virtue of explosion of tourism. I want genuine connection with foreign
cultures. Off beaten paths are actually quite beaten up, despite of what you
think.

~~~
kd5bjo
> I might be the only person who dislikes traveling. To me, traveling is an
> expensive way to explore food, museums and maybe some overcrowded landmarks.
> I went to Paris, Tokyo, and all we did was followed a guidebook of one
> touristy place after another.

> Just do a cross country road trip for 3 weeks. Totally unmatched experience.

It sounds like you do like travelling, but dislike the tourism industry. It’s
quite possible to get the same tourism experience you describe for Paris in
any major US city. It’s also possible to travel in Europe without feeling like
you’re visiting a theme park— ditch the guidebook and just wander.

~~~
brummm
Yeah, maybe not do the standard American thing and visit 5 countries in 2
weeks. Pick one of them and visit more places than just the capital.

------
mathattack
This is becoming more common in retail now. It requires a common set of
systems and databases for both the retail and eCommerce business. (Side note -
this is the scope of The Phoenix Project)

------
tux1968
Article appeared on another site without paywall:

[https://www.marketscreener.com/WALMART-INC-4841/news/The-
Nex...](https://www.marketscreener.com/WALMART-INC-4841/news/The-Next-Phase-
of-the-Retail-Apocalypse-Stores-Reborn-as-E-Commerce-Warehouses-30945947/)

~~~
jbhouse
Bless you kind stranger

