

Ask PG/HN: Why does PG list Sam Altman among the 5 most interesting founders? - philipDS

I wonder why he lists him here: http://www.paulgraham.com/5founders.html.<p>I have never met Sam Altman and never seen him speak in public, but if I didn't know about YC, I surely wouldn't have known about Loopt or Sam Altman. I live in Europe and Loopt is pretty much non-existent here (all 4sq/gowalla). So why is Altman such a great entrepeneur (in terms of strategy/amibition, as stated by PG)? What is extraordinary about the things he does or has done? Why isn't someone like for instance Jack Dorsey on the list?
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AndrewGCook
I just saw Sam Altman speak at YCNYC and I was impressed. I have never
actually met him or heard him speak before Monday, but one of his stories
really stuck out and went something like this:

"We were trying to get a big client for weeks, and they said no and went with
a competitor. The competitor already had a terms sheet from the company were
we trying to sign up. It was real serious.

We were devastated, but we decided to fly down and sit in their lobby until
they would meet with us. So they finally let us talk to them after most of the
day.

We then had a few more meetings, and the company wanted to come visit our
offices so they could make sure we were a 'real' company. At that time, we
were only 5 guys. So we hired a bunch of our college friends to 'work' for us
for the day so we could look larger than we actually were. It worked, and we
got the contract."

I think the reason why PG respects Sam so much is he is charismatic,
resourceful, and just overall seems like a genuine person.

~~~
secretasiandan
I'm sure many people view bringing in a bunch of friends to seem busier than
you really are positively. But I'm not so sure that I like it.

Is this not a deliberate and material misrepresentation of your company? If
this were a financial contract being sold, wouldn't this be fraudulent?

~~~
dsplittgerber
Geez, the point is that he is really fighting and going all-the-way for his
company. A lot of guys would have stopped on the original "No". A lot of guys
would have left after having sat in the lobby for a few hours. A lot of guys
would have ceased pushing when being asked to show "respectable" company
premises. See why he is so respected?

A comment from PG about him I will never ever forget even though I had never
heard of Altman before goes like this: "You can leave Sam Altman on an island
full of cannibals and when you come back a year later, he is the king of the
cannibals."

This is one of the most awesome character traits to ever have. You WILL be
successful by being like this, it's just a matter of time.

------
pg
Loopt is more successful than HN users would realize. Some of what it does
isn't consumer facing, and its users are (like e.g. Stumbleupon's) mostly not
HN users.

In any case, you can't measure someone by one company. The formula for the
success of a startup includes a random multiplier of roughly zero to a
thousand. You can see this from how common it is for successful founders'
second startups to fail.

I'm actually more impressed with Sam than when I wrote that. Since then I've
talked to him a lot more because he is one of the alumni working part time as
YC partners. He has extraordinary energy combined with the judgment of someone
twice his age.

~~~
akkartik
There's another reason second startups fail: they raise too much money too
early.

------
staunch
It's true Loopt has been something of a failure in the market. That doesn't
mean Sam Altman won't become the world-changing entrepreneur PG sees in him.

It's quite possible he's working on the "wrong" project. Many people have had
this experience: Traf-O-Data (Bill Gates), Atari games (Steve Jobs), Tribe.net
(Mark Pincus), and the list goes on endlessly.

If you had seen Bill Gates working on Traf-O-Data you might have said "that
guy is going places" even though Traf-O-Data was ultimately not an important
part of where he was going.

~~~
mtgentry
Love this "wrong project" concept. Have any blog posts or articles about this?

Most of us can see when other entrepreneurs are working on a project that
doesn't reflect their core strengths. It's much more difficult to identify
when we're the ones going down the wrong path.

~~~
staunch
I didn't consciously realize it, but I suppose this is a lot of what PG talks
about in "Why Smart People Have Bad Ideas"
<http://www.paulgraham.com/bronze.html>

~~~
glimcat
Because smart people act on their ideas.

------
jswinghammer
You can approach this in one of two ways. One is to ask why and the other is
to gather the data yourself and then just draw your own conclusions. From what
I've seen and know about Sam Altman the praise he gets is justified but you
might disagree. What you'll get from asking is interpreted responses from the
data but if you find out for yourself then you can judge pg's response
appropriately. This seems like a weird way to get background on someone when
there's google.com available.

~~~
philipDS
I wanted to hear some opinions. Checking out his talk at Startup School 08
now. Any other recommendations?

------
michaeldwan
Sam is one of the sharpest product guys I've ever met. YC office hours with
him are always valuable.

------
abbasmehdi
I think PG's opinion is based on Sam's personality. I don't know the guy,
neither do I know PG, but I'm assuming he likes what he sees in Sam, not just
what Sam has done so far.

Loopt isn't ever on my mind, neither anyone I know uses it - that sounds bad
for a 6 or 7 year old, mass market YC company/product from one of YC's most
prized and highest regarded/praised CEOs. So I think Sam might have picked the
wrong battle. However, Sam's property that pg likes him for (relentless and
tenacious) might be exactly what's preventing him from ditching the loop (no
pun intended) and keeping him ditching the idea or jumping ship altogether.
Even Sam’s tenacity can’t save a product people don’t care deeply for.

Or maybe I just give pg’s judgment of “people” too much credit by default, as
an extension of his judgment of companies/products. Maybe pg sucks at picking
winning people, but is great at strategy/tactics/products/ideas (just a
hypothesis).

Either way, the takeaway for me here is be a bull dog - but don’t bark at
walls, i.e. be tenacious, but find something worth being tenacious for.

~~~
abbasmehdi
Update: Just looked 'em up. They're trying to go from "fun" to "useful" by
hooking up with Groupon, I guess that would make them the social Google Maps
for Groupon. IMO that's using peer influence (teens) for group purchases
(teens don't have CCs usually). Unless, unless they use social influence to
bring new coupon purchasers for groupon (affiliate sales or reseller?) or are
able to tip groupons that have been historically harder to tip by getting
friends to get involved in activities together.

------
wccrawford
<http://www.paulgraham.com/notnot.html>

"But the most successful founder we've funded so far, Sam Altman, was 19 at
the time."

"I realized these tests existed after meeting Sam Altman, actually. I noticed
that I felt like I was talking to someone much older."

