
Ask HN: Mobile site - rangibaby
HN looks a bit fuarked on my iPhone now. Could you please change it back to serving the desktop version?
======
dang
I posted about this three times last night before going to sleep, feeling sure
that the info would get into circulation. Apparently not! Will explain
shortly.

Edit: Here's the story. We occasionally hear from users who say that all of
HN's problems on mobile could be fixed by adding one line of markup:

    
    
      <meta name="viewport" content="width=device-width, target-densitydpi=medium-dpi">
    

We tried it several times and found it didn't work [1]. Last night, we tried
again. It looked better than before, so we decided to leave it on for a while
and wait to hear from you all [2].

Unfortunately, what happened is what I feared most: total disagreement. Since
it was far from a clear win, we've rolled back to the status quo ante. I'm
sorry to disappoint those of you who felt it to be an improvement, but you
shouldn't have to wait too much longer.

Why not keep it and improve on its problems, or at least do a poll about it?
Because it was at best a stopgap until we can release the real solution we're
working on, which involves totally different markup. If the stopgap worked
well for most people, it would be worth keeping in the interim. But a stopgap
that doesn't actually stop the gap will create confusion. I feel like it's our
duty to be conservative here until we have something that actually works. It's
a high priority, and it's coming.

1
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7985687](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7985687),
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7330107](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7330107),
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6253835](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6253835),
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6253403](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6253403),
and probably others.

2\.
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9205798](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9205798),
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9205893](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9205893),
and
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9205858](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9205858).

~~~
IgorPartola
Honest question: don't you have the ability to see what it looks like for
yourself or is the only way to test a change like this is to release it to
production and measure the numbers of angry comments? Whether a small vocal
minority that loves tiny text on small screens agrees or disagrees, the change
was a strict improvement over the desktop on mobile version. Is this what YC
advises its companies to do? Change nothing as to not piss anyone off, no
matter how much damage that causes to the majority of the users? I find that
software people are terrified of any change. Move a button and they scream.
That does not mean that once something is developed it must stay that way.
dang, do you really believe there won't be a public outcry when the new markup
is released? Will you roll it back then because someone complained?

------
dpcan
No! Don't, please! It's sooooo much better on my phone now. I used to have to
zoom in and put and scroll all over. Text is wrapping now, so maybe some
aesthetics are lost, but usability is 100% better.

Also, this thread is going to get voted way up because the title just says HN:
Mobile Site. But not necessarily because the op doesn't like it.

------
flibble
The new version looks much better to me on iPhone 6. No longer do I have to
zoom in or use landscape mode to read the titles.

~~~
acqq
Up and down arrows should be more separated. Ideally up-down should be
undoable, I know it's harder to do.

~~~
DanBC
The upvote / downvote buttons have been "wontfix" for years now. :-(

------
ctrlrsf
I've been using [http://hn.premii.com](http://hn.premii.com) with great
success. Super slick UI and runs great as a full screen Chrome app. Missing
features are adding comments and upvotes, but it provides direct link to real
HN comments page where you can do that instead. Their Android app is good too,
but web client feels faster on my phone.

~~~
thekingshorses
Author here: You can download iOS/Android app too. It supports upvoting.

[https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/hacker-news-
yc/id713733435](https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/hacker-news-yc/id713733435)

[https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.premii.hn](https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.premii.hn)

~~~
qubitcoder
I just wanted to extend my appreciation for your work. It's by far the most
used app on my iPhone; even occupying a spot on the main navbar.

Occasionally, I've noticed scrolling performance degrades when viewing
comments (only for articles with many comments (>100). But force closing seems
to resolve the issue. Otherwise, it's rock solid and beautifully functional.

~~~
thekingshorses
iPhone 4s/5? I have 5s, and didn't notice that, but I also mostly use my
Android device.

It actually gets ycombinator page, parses DOM and generates JSON that I can
use in my app. I think that might be the reason.

~~~
qubitcoder
It's an iPhone 5s. It only occurs after I've used the app for a while, then
switching to an article with a large number of comments; scrolling can become
laggy enough to render the app unusable (i.e. scrolling even a small amount
takes over a second; lag seems to scale based on the comment count).

I'm guessing that if the DOM is parsed completely prior to rendering the
comments, that shouldn't be a bottleneck--unless the parsing step is re-run as
scrolling occurs to render comments dynamically.

Or given that a forced restart resolves the issue, perhaps it's a memory
issue; i.e. if the JSON data is held in memory for each article viewed, and it
continues to grow. This is certainly not a showstopper, and it's a fantastic
app! But figured you'd appreciate the info.

------
iphone_user
I second the request. Some things that makes it specially hard to read on
iPhone:

1) It wastes a lot of horizontal space with white paddings on both sides. It
may be a stylistic decision but takes valuable space that could be used to
show more words in a line, leading to less lines 2) There is no right padding
in the text lines, the text touches the right side of the inner container.

All in all it would be better to simply serve the Desktop version, maybe with
an slightly increased font size so it is more readable.

And please don't make the same mistake many sites (Slashdot among them) make:
trying to ram an ill thought bad designed new version on their faithful
userbase just for the sake of change and novelty.

There are things to improve but the best way to determine it is to actually
test it beforehand in the same environment it will be used in production.
These changes were definitively not tested on iPhone's Safari and it shows.

~~~
amirmc
> _"... just for the sake of change and novelty."_

I agree with the earlier comments you make (re spacing) but this change isn't
happening purely for the sake of it. Folks have been asking for a mobile-
friendly HN for a _long time_. Even though I'm not overjoyed with the version
I saw today, I'm glad it's progressing.

------
mproud
I use
[http://cheeaun.github.io/hackerweb/](http://cheeaun.github.io/hackerweb/),
except it doesn’t support writing comments directly (you have to click the
link go to the original page).

------
addedlovely
Could still be much better, but looking forward to not accidentally fat
fingering the comments link all the time.

I'd be happy to help improve, even working within the constraints of not
changing any of the underlying markup. Feel free to message me.

Also what's with the '.rotate180' CSS class in the stylesheet, as much as I
love reading upside down, I can't see why thats needed?

~~~
hoppi
Perhaps when the orientation of the phone is upside down it can automatically
rotate it for you.

------
tambourine_man
Yes, it's terrible on the 4s.

The menu doesn't fit the viewport and gets jammed if your username is more
than a few characters long (or you have many karma points)

You still need to zoom to hit the up/down arrows, so not much is gained.

~~~
jackgavigan
Looks ++ungood on the 5s too:
[https://twitter.com/jackgavigan/status/577121192664006657](https://twitter.com/jackgavigan/status/577121192664006657)

The menu even wraps on the iPad in landscape orientation:
[http://i.imgur.com/4ghJIufh.jpg](http://i.imgur.com/4ghJIufh.jpg)

~~~
IgorPartola
Are you here to read the menu? I spent a huge amount of hours reading comments
on HN on mobile. In fact it is the only site that does not work on mobile that
I don't refuse to visit. So while I don't understand why it took HN nearly 7
years to become slightly more mobile friendly, I will take any improvement to
its readability.

------
nether
No, I vastly prefer the mobile site on my phone.

~~~
Synergyse
+1, zooming all the time was getting tiresome. It could use a few small tweaks
in font sizing and margins, but its vastly improved.

~~~
ctrlrsf
I agree it's moving in the right direction. Zooming out and using landscape
gets annoying.

------
cauterized
IMO the idea of a mobile site is a good one but right now the font sizes are
definitely too large for comfortable reading (esp in landscape orientation)
where before they were way too small.

~~~
autoreverse
FWIW font size is ideal for me.

~~~
zodvik
Font size seem ideal on homepage. But, font-size for comments is smaller.

~~~
cauterized
It seems to differ per page. Font size on the homepage and threads page are
ridiculously large for me in landscape and ok in portrait. Font size on
article comments is ok now - think they may have just tweaked it.

Edit: I take that back. Still unreadably large in portrait.

------
hobarrera
Where _is_ this mobile site? I'm seeing the same old desktop version on my
mobile and no new "Mobile version" link.

I don't see any changes to this one to make it responsive either.

~~~
nailer
OP means responsive design, not 2010-era separate mobile site. Front page is
responsive (but still needs some fixes), comments pages are still super wide
and need scrolling on each line.

------
lvillani
I use HackerWeb ([http://hackerwebapp.com](http://hackerwebapp.com)) on both
my iPhone, iPad and Fire Phone (Firefox OS). It is a superbly executed HTML5
application.

~~~
jschulenklopper
+1 for a great app! It's a pity that it's a read-only view on Hacker News; you
can't upvote stories, comment or submit anything. It puts you in lurking mode,
alas.

And for the people thinking "How does that HackerWeb compare to the web app of
Lim Chee Aun?": it's the same as
[http://cheeaun.github.io/hackerweb/](http://cheeaun.github.io/hackerweb/).

------
Houshalter
[http://i.imgur.com/qr6MAwK.jpg](http://i.imgur.com/qr6MAwK.jpg)

This is absolutely awful, how do I fix this?

Edit: I guess that isn't so awful, but before you could see maybe 20% of the
links and zoom in as needed. Now it's forcibly zoomed in so much you can only
see one link and everything is squashed together.

------
bennesvig
The menu looks a little goofy, but overall the experience of reading the links
is now far better on my iPhone 6.

------
raldi
The new frontpage disables Android's double-tap-and-drag-down zoom function,
which is a gigantic regression for a site with tiny arrows and tiny links.

------
cddotdotslash
It's like they added a percentage width to some tables and now it's "mobile."
(Edit: spelling)

~~~
falcolas
Amazing the (IMO) improvements a few percentages adds to the readability on
mobile.

------
mostafah
It’s not a separate mobile site. It appears they’re adding a little
responsiveness to the current design. And that’s a great idea for this kind of
content.

------
rajyaswanth
I use this app on android,not sure about iphone app,its a decent one anomg the
lot.pretty much satisfied with it.
[https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.premii.hn](https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.premii.hn)

~~~
thekingshorses
iOS: [https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/hacker-news-
yc/id713733435](https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/hacker-news-yc/id713733435)

Or Just web: [http://hn.premii.com/](http://hn.premii.com/)

------
charlieegan3
I made this site for myself:
[http://www.serializer.io](http://www.serializer.io) it's linear and takes
content from r/programming and product hunt too but it's what I use for
reading HN on my phone.

------
logotype
Better! Just less left/right margins.

------
DanBC
Perhaps HN mods could have a poll on the different changes? I like big fonts;
I like the bigger buttons; I'm less keen on the big margins but I don't
particularly care about them.

------
bhauer
Lumia 930 here and I'd vote for reverting to the desktop site.

The new front-page zoom is so pronounced that only seven items are displayed
simultaneously (previously around 20 to 25). It is obviously easier to click
on article links, but not notably easier to click on comment links or the
voting arrows.

The comments page is the real problem. Where I used to see the whole width of
the comments page and was able to read without adjustment, the page shows the
left half of comments initially and I must zoom out every time.

------
anonbanker
Screw all the iphone users. HN is now usable on firefox/Android. Don't change
it back because Safari has rendering bugs.

------
pmontra
Yesterday version was better on my Galaxy S2 with Opera (blink engine). The
new one has left and right margins that reduce the area available for text.
That's much visible on the home page. The comments pages are maybe the same
but I've got the feeling that text is smaller because I don't remember having
to tap so often to read.

------
stesch
Were there any recent changes? Site looks a bit big on the iPad now. :-(

I don't really want to see any mobile version on my iPad.

~~~
nlh
Agreed - was just about to post this. The whole point of the iPad, IMHO, is to
give a "portable desktop" browser experience. I can't stand when sites do the
awkward in-between tablet version. Looks worse and less usable. I'm ok with
the idea of responsive design, but let's stick with desktop and phone as the
two versions.

------
colinprince
cautiously optimistic. keep iterating..

------
chimeracoder
Are the comments rendered differently on the mobile site, or simply the
homepage? For what it's worth, I'm still getting the desktop version of the
comments on Firefox for Android[0].

[0] User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Android; Mobile; rv36.0) Gecko/36.0 Firefox/36.0)

------
milankragujevic
Looks fine on Opera on Samsung. At least that's what I would call fine.
[http://milankragujevic.com/uploads/Screenshot_2015-03-15-16-...](http://milankragujevic.com/uploads/Screenshot_2015-03-15-16-59-37.png)

------
fugyk
For this reasons I have made pinch.js
([https://github.com/fugyk/pinchjs](https://github.com/fugyk/pinchjs)). It
enables desktop like zooming in mobile.

------
cturhan
Home page is ok but comments page is wide and I can't read them

------
izolate
The padding around the content on the page is a bit excessive.

------
geuis
Please get rid of the white padding on the sides. Takes up valuable area and
squeezes the center content too much. Particularly bad in landscape.

------
p4bl0
Mh, on my phone it is as it has always been (which is not good on small screen
operated with fingers). How do I see the mobile version?

------
evo_9
The header bar is pretty bad on iPhone5; needs to be totally reworked if you
are going to roll your own mobile like this.

Why not just use Bootstrap?

------
JDiculous
Looks like only the home page is responsive now. Viewing this thread right now
on a Samsung Galaxy S4 and the font is too small.

------
Mahn
The header looks a bit odd to me, but otherwise I find it a massive
improvement; no need to zoom any longer.

------
magoon
At least we can still zoom. +1

------
lettergram
I kinda like the mobile version, it seems to have a bit to go, but not bad.

------
rainhacker
I read it using flipboard on my iphone. Works like a charm.

------
xasos
On Chrome, you can do Menu -> Request Desktop Version

------
stangeek
Use the HN Cards app on iPhone, much better..

------
fa
Looks fabulous.

------
IgorPartola
Have I stumbled into some parallel universe? Let me get this straight: HN, a
haven for hackers, developers, entrepreneurs, and the big wigs of the valley
cannot get a webmaster to spend a day on making some really basic changes to
the CSS and HTML to make the site responsive on mobile, which is probably the
way lots of people read it. When a half hearted attempt is finally made,
people _complain_ and demand it be returned to the abominable state it
previously was because the experience is somehow worse on mobile? What the
hell is going on?! How is the experience worse? How is it that HN cannot get
help with this? There have been so many volunteers saying "just let me fix
it", yet it is a resource problem? Or is this some type of natural selection
for hackers who do not own mobile devices or have strong eye? This is so
backwards I feel like a teenage girl in that I cannot even.

------
jameshk
Well, we did ask for a mobile version, but not like this!

