
Ask HN: When you feel stuck in life - msleona
Hello,<p>I&#x27;d just like to give my two cents where I know no one gives a shit ever. I&#x27;m 29 years old. I finished with my Business Administration degree(major) and now I just feel completely LOST! Has anyone ever felt that way? You have the drive and motivation to get to your destination but once you are there -- you&#x27;re left wondering -- &quot;what else could I have done? What else is there to life? Because if this is all there is then I&#x27;m not happy.&quot; And, truth be told, I am not happy. I&#x27;d like to be something -- more than just an office person. More than just someone who works that 8-5 shift. I feel like a complete wreck. Has anyone ever felt this way?<p>I feel like I should go back to school but do I really want to rack up all that loan? I am already struggling right now. I just wish I knew where to start as a push and motivation.<p>What would you guys do if ya were in my shoes?
======
noname123
Usually on this site and Quora, when people have a post like yours, the
posters usually offer a piece of advice, that in my humble opinion, advices
are _useless_ because usually they say more about the advice-giver, what they
wish they could've done when they were younger (doctors/lawyers who studied
hard to make bank, advising all students to have fun when they're young but
how did they get there?), or tout their own successes when the advice-receiver
may or may not have the same background to be able to replicate it (people
here with STEM background touting meritocracy and hard-work will eventually
get everyone a job but when did you start learning coding and under what
circumstances??).

As a 29-year old, I'll offer instead my own personal regret about my 20's
without any panacea, I hope that it is relevant to your stated idea even
though it may not seem so at first:

Last night I came home after going out with a bunch of friends from a startup
at a "reunion outing" that we all used to work at several years ago,

We are all 28, 29, 30 now and we were 26, 25, 24 when we were hanging out
everyday at work and after work; and past the superficial remembrances of the
"all fun times we had," inside jokes of what-he-said, what-she-said, casual
bantering at the pool table and the double high-fives for the ladies and low
ass slaps for the bro's after the final game, on the back of the Lyft ride
home, I thought about how we never ever really fought.

Not talking about general boorishness caused by alcohol and clashing sensitive
male ego's, nor the passive-aggression between friends or acquaintances where
perceived slights/differences built up but never confronted, beef never
squashed instead squished down underneath the social surface that years pass
by, your group's "happy hours" turns from a "thing" into a remembrance - that
you heard only about XXX's wedding from your other friends who had been
invited but you feel only slightly annoyed because XXX has already become
someone who you used to know.

But really fight in a moment, air out your differences, coming into a fight,
knowing that you or the other person may not come out at end as friends
anymore, but you have a hope to salvage things, out of a conviction to be
authentic to yourself and the other person, out of an intent to love the other
person even if there is a such deep well of negative emotions, frustration,
hatred, feeling of injustice and inspired self-insecurity, that you can't help
but to still respect/admire the uniqueness/individuality of the person and
even a wisp of self-reconsideration of your own part in the sordid affair; and
hope you guys might come be able to come out the other side.

This is the my biggest regret about my 20's. That I have always ducked all my
opportunities to fight.

Instead of accepting the up's and down's in any natural relationships, I took
every setback, every feeling of feeling stagnant as an outlet to push people
away. Underneath the thin sheath of rationalizations is a dread of knowing
myself as who I truly who I am if I were to fight, I'll be exposed. So it is
with this never-said but oft-acted upon notion I've come away with a decade of
superficial trinkets instead of battle scars, and without the satisfaction
that I've truly ever loved.

~~~
djkrudy
Wow, this is great. Can we be friends because I love to argue with people I
know. If you don't fight, you never realize who you are, you just think you're
the same being as Pauly D, but you missed your "big shot" somewhere along the
line. One of the most incredible feelings I've ever experienced is severely
disagreeing with 3 friends but really feeling passionate about it, then
running into the woods to contemplate and cry, and then returning and getting
3 hugs. I want you to know that. It's a "You haven't lived until..." type of
thing.

~~~
Practicality
There are a reasonable number of people who think like this all the time:
[https://www.16personalities.com/entp-
personality](https://www.16personalities.com/entp-personality)

Just saying :)

------
sevenless
You aren't wrong. Most of us are stuck in conformist, drab and conservative
societies, where we're forced to participate in the market economy. This is
soul-crushing, and bad for nearly everyone, but especially those in poor
countries.

I recommend:

1\. Don't work hard. Try to reduce your productivity.

2\. Don't work long hours. Reduce your working week to the minimum necessary.
Most university graduates earn enough to live comfortably on 10 or 20 hours
work per week.

3\. Have less stuff. Go outside more, even if it's to play Pokemon Go.

4\. Do things for other people.

5\. Try to lead an innovative life. Don't wear a tie.

6\. Seek to abolish the existing world order.

~~~
antisthenes
This is one of those puzzling comments that I can't tell if tongue-in-cheek or
actually serious.

I like it! Life's too serious and people need some chaotic ambiguity to spice
it up.

> Don't work hard. Try to reduce your productivity.

Sounds good. Most people aren't as productive as they think they are, imho.
I'd rather not buy into their facade and just be as productive as I need to be
when I need to be!

> Don't work long hours. Reduce your working week to the minimum necessary.
> Most university graduates earn enough to live comfortably on 10 or 20 hours
> work per week.

Eh, I don't know where you live, but 10-20 hours of work would be a straight
path to homelessness. Unless you mean actual hours of productive work (in a
nominal 40 hour work week). Then it's a good target.

> Have less stuff. Go outside more, even if it's to play Pokemon Go.

Completely agree. Going outside in the summer and staying inside (a suburban
home) has changed my life for the better more than any other single thing.

> Do things for other people.

Any suggestions? What do you think most people would like done for them?

> Seek to abolish the existing world order.

I think the world order is doing a pretty good job in that on its own.

~~~
humanrebar
> Seek to abolish the existing world order.

Seems like abolishing world orders takes a lot of work. At least more than ten
hours per week.

~~~
lgas
You just have to abolish smarter, not harder.

------
aerovistae
I've been feeling this way since middle school.

I didn't really have any bad subjects in school, so I figured I could do
whatever interested me professionally, but nothing really strongly appealed to
me other than a paycheck large enough to eat out whenever I wanted. I
discovered programming was pretty fun, now I'm a software engineer, and I'm
just saving money for..... _something_. I don't know what.

I've been trying to figure out what I'm moving towards for years. I just don't
know where it's going. Marry, have children, buy house, continue office job? I
want to really care. I see so much wrong with the world and I don't have any
clever ideas on how to fix it.

I don't want to make an app, something that adds a little convenience but
doesn't truly make anyone's lives better. I want to fix something that's
manifestly broken. I envy Elon Musk above all others, because he's seen
terribly important things that were very broken, and had what it took to break
all barriers to fixing them. Needless to say I'm not Elon Musk. Most people
aren't.

I'd like to fix something social more than technological. I'd like to fix
something societal that's broken, like the fact that Congress is literally a
joke among Americans, that people feel so detached and isolated from the
people creating policy that we don't bother to vote because we don't think
it'll change anything.

But I don't know how to fix those things, so I keep working conventional jobs,
but I can barely bring myself to do them, because my heart isn't in it, and I
feel the years passing.

~~~
zacharycohn
You could come join us at 18F or USDS. :)

~~~
daveloyall
Waiting to see what the next administration does with ya.

~~~
zacharycohn
18F is not tied to the white house, so there should be no changes when the
next administration arrives, no matter who it is.

~~~
daveloyall
18F are still contractors, right? So you are kidding? :)

    
    
        > "...there should be no changes when
        > the next administration arrives..."
    

I understand that you are referring to some specific small category of
changes. You're saying that no new president can administratively close 18f.
Got it.

But, for the English word 'changes', there will be some.

If you had to place a bet regarding the future size of the USDS, what factors
would you consider when choosing where to put your money?

~~~
zacharycohn
No, we are federal employees.

------
anysz
PROJECTS !

You should embark on side projects. They will teach you so much more than
school ever will, and they will reward you in a way that nothing else really
can. If your projects can make money too, then that's icing on the cake. You
will be free.

I'm 25 years old with no degree, taught myself to code for the past 2 years
and got turned down for thousands of developer jobs. I ended up working in a
factory doing curtain assembly, and selling websites door-to-door after work,
until last month, where the first day I decide to go back to sports, I tear my
meniscus.

Thankfully, healthcare in Canada is free. However, with 250$ to my name at the
time of surgery, the future was looking really, really dark. Can't work, and
can't do door-to-door sales. Mother Nature has deadly accuracy with those
curveballs.

In the hospital bed, I'm having an existential debate of what to do with my
life (in the immediate future). I can sell my Macbook to stay afloat, but that
means that I can't build iOS apps anymore. I can ask my brother for money, but
he's just about the biggest asshole ever to have roamed the planet and we have
a trash relationship. After a lot of tears and self-pity, and telling my life
story to the nurse, I decide I'm going to throw life a curveball of my own and
invest all I have in a new e-commerce venture.

So I set up a quick WooCommerce site selling Pokemon Go apparel and blew 200$
of my 250$ on FB and Instagram ads, and believe it or not, within 3 days, I
nailed my first sale, and got approached by 2 Pokemon influencers to sell to
their following.

I'm now making about 2 sales a day, which amounts to 30-35$. It's peanuts, but
I've survived on less, and honestly, stuck in bed with a full zimmer brace,
super high on painkillers, 10 full minutes to do a washroom trip and I am
happier than I have ever been in my entire life. I'm trapped in bed for the
next month, but I have never felt more free. Maybe with this, I don't even
have to go to work again.

So that's my two cents, for your two cents. Find a project with potential and
work on it. It doesn't have to bring money, it may be learning to play
Californication on the guitar or implementing a hashing algorithm, but as long
as it's something you enjoy and makes you grow, this is IMHO what life is all
about.

~~~
rl3
> _... and got turned down for thousands of developer jobs._

Over what period of time? No offense, but I'm hoping that's an innocent
exaggeration. I'm not very familiar with the market for developers in Canada,
though based on that it sounds particularly brutal.

Either way, good on you for moving forward despite all that.

~~~
saganus
I think it's probably hyperbole.

If it's "thousands" as in 1002 rejections, that's almost 3 years of doing one
interview every day, from Monday to Sunday. Even if you assume two interviews
per day, that's still more than a year.

Edit: Assuming you only do one interview per rejection.

I wouldn't take it as an indicator of the job market in Canada.

I would think maybe he refers to having _a lot_ of rejections but still I
would hope it's in the order of 100 or so at most

~~~
khedoros
Or it could be rejections even earlier in the process, like not receiving a
response after sending in your resume to a job posting.

------
mouzogu
I'm 32 and I've had similar thoughts at least since I was 27. A kind of
existential crisis tinged with deep boredom and non-clinical depression.

I've found 3 things that have helped me deal with my depression/boredom:

1\. Have things to look forward to:

Always, always find things to anticipate and look forward to in the short and
long term. Whether it is something small, like a treat at the end of the day
or something big like a vacation or short trip away.

2\. Side projects & working towards self-employment.

Ultimately, the aim is to be the master of my own time. I no longer have to
wake up at 8am because I HAVE to but because I (may) WANT to. This for me is
so important. To be the master of my time. I'm 32 now, if I'm lucky to live to
70 you can say that I have about 14-20 years of productive time in me. I want
to use it for myself.

3\. Spirituality.

I know that this isn't for everyone. Personally, I find religion and
spirituality helps me to cope with every day issues. It gives me strength
where I might otherwise just find a gaping void of pointless-ness into which
to fall.

I hope this helps you. As mentioned by another comment try to avoid alcohol.
You won't find the answers you need a the bottom of a bottle.

~~~
shivaodin
Do you have a family? A family, an SO or kids is the best way to understand
life through other perspectives.

~~~
mouzogu
No, but I plan to start one soon. It's true that having children gives you a
new perspective on life.

~~~
dpark
Most people don't find meaning in the raising of children. It changes your
life a lot, but if you feel like your life is aimless and you're just on
autopilot, you'll probably feel the same after having kids. It's rare for a
person to define their purpose in terms of their kids and be happy about that.
Most people still want to have a self-actualized purpose.

------
mysticlabs
29 myself, and going through something similar. Millennials like us aren't
allowed to grow up, it doesn't matter how successful or educated we are. In
fact, the more we accomplish the more we are disinfranchised because society
merely wants us to be consumers, go to work, pay the bills, and try not to
cause any trouble. We aren't supposed to be anything more than consumer wage
slaves.

Our generation has been brainwashed since we were children with identity
politics, identity consumerism, and identity propaganda. We've been
demoralized to believe in a system that is so utterly corrupt and rigged
against us that there really isn't an answer to your question. You've already
screwed yourself with a useless college degree and likely debt, and literally
paid them to brainwash you into believing what they taught you actually has
relevance to the real world. It doesn't, which is partly why you're feeling
what you're feeling.

My best advice to you is stop doing what anyone else tells you, stop following
the path society wants you to, and in fact avoid the things you're supposed to
do. Start a daily meditation practice, take care of yourself, eat well, focus
your energy on creating value for others, and put all the distractions down
and go outside.

Don't subscribe to propaganda, don't identify with anything anyone else tells
you to, listen to your intuition, study things that interest you on your own
always. Learn to teach yourself whatever you're interested in. Stop expecting
the world or anyone else to hand you anything, and become the best problem
solver you can become.

Everything else is just noise.

~~~
dionidium
_> Millennials like us_

I think it's worth mentioning that almost none of what you've said is new to
Millennials. People were expressing the same sentiments in the 80s and 90s. My
parents and their hippie friends were expressing the same sentiments in the
1970s.

~~~
mysticlabs
While it might not be new, it doesn't change the fact that it is still
happening, and actually gotten worse. Many of those people you're referring to
likely ended up disenfranchised later in life as well, some of them may have
even ended up in jail (which happened to a few of my Dad's hippie friends).
Many of those people you're referring to never had the chance to grow up to be
functioning members of society which further illustrates my point.

If you gave me a choice, I would love to exchange the levels of corruption and
economic conditions from the 70's, 80's, and 90's for whatever the hell it is
we have today. There were 10x the possibilities then there are today, and
society in general was much more free compared to the present.

Our parents didn't grow up in a surveillance state, sure maybe they had some
run-ins with the police when out in public, but that was it. There is no
privacy anymore, and if you do or say anything that doesn't fit a politically
correct narrative you're not only unemployable, but pretty much ostracized
from society today.

~~~
dionidium
_> If you gave me a choice, I would love to exchange the levels of corruption
and economic conditions from the 70's, 80's, and 90's_

This is a pretty rose-colored view of the era that included the Vietnam War,
interest rates at 20+%, Iran-Contra, an assassination attempt on the President
of the U.S., the Cold War and the associated threat of total societal
destruction, the uncertainty surrounding the end of communism, at least two
deep recessions, a war in Iraq, vastly fewer rights for LGBT groups, much
higher crime rates in U.S. cities, the crack epidemic, the emergence of AIDS,
and so on and so on and so on.

Your generation isn't experiencing anything more novel than the ones that came
before it. Your problems might be different, in some ways, but the sky isn't
falling.

~~~
refurb
You missed the employment rate that sucked. Anyone who thinks the 70's were
better than what we have now has no idea what they are talking about.

------
kilon
I dont know If I am in your shoes but I am in a similar situation. I am lawyer
and my father is a lawyer and the past 5 years my brain went to a lockdown,
refusing to work , to make friends, to have a relationship. I tried to push
myself through this by changing career since it was obvious I was not happy.
It did not help.

Everybody was implying I was suffering from severe depression so I decided to
visit a psychiatrist. I was diagnosed with dysthymia , a condition very
diffirent to depression. It basically means, no motivation to do anything.

So I have been taking drugs, they did not help, however psychotherapy did help
me. After a year I realized that my problem was and still is pressure ,
pressure from my family but also and mostly pressure from myself. It killed my
fun and enjoyment , everything became a must do, and brain refused to work
under these conditions.

Now with the help of psychiatrist , I try to relearn how to relax and enjoy
the process, stop working hard and instead work easy and fun. It works but old
habits die last. So it will take years till I am out of the woods but the last
year I have been doing psychotherapy at least I see a steady improvement.

We are be taught that we are our brain , but this is simply not true, brain is
whole another monster and if you dont take good care of it , it will kick your
ass. I wanted to learn this the hard way and so here I am.

So there is hope dont despair, definetly see a psychiatrist and expert advice
is always helpful. The rest is up to you , go find what makes you happy and do
that, the rest will follow.

------
dotsamuelswan
Grain of salt / what works for others won't work for you / etc.

Don't leap back to school without carefully vetting whatever program has
caught your attention. A lot of hoop jumping, and a lot of curriculum that's a
decade out of date (or more) out there these days. I've tried to go back a few
times, and it's been a complete waste of time/money.

Read Pressfield's "The War of Art." It's cheap, it's short, and it's helpful.
There are a few passages that don't quit hit home, but it does one thing
really well. It gives you the kind of internal vocabulary you need to get out
of the "I'll do it tomorrow" sort of procrastination. "Tomorrow" is really
dangerous thinking when there's not an actual deadline. You'll be saying
tomorrow for years at a time, without actually moving the needle.

Move the needle every day. Do -something- that counts as forward progress.
Momentum goes a long way. Track what you're doing. "What gets measured gets
improved" sort of thing.

Be honest with yourself. What have you done that makes you think you should be
more than just another office peon? Put in the work. Stop wishing. Earn it.

~~~
dasboth
"Read Pressfield's "The War of Art." It's cheap, it's short, and it's helpful.
"Tomorrow" is really dangerous thinking when there's not an actual deadline.
You'll be saying tomorrow for years at a time, without actually moving the
needle."

+1 to all of this. The War of Art is excellent, as is the advice about
"tomorrow".

------
virmundi
I can tell you what not to do; I really mean this. Don't drink. At least not
for a while.

It could lead to suicidal ideation. Then it's possibly a literal death spiral.
You're depressed that you don't get anything done (hobbies, side project,
etc). This makes you more depressed. You don't get anything done. This
compounds the feelings of trapped/existential worthlessness. Eventually you
might come really close to suicide. No booze.

~~~
omginternets
This can't be upvoted enough. Drugs and alcohol are great, but they should be
used to celebrate good times, not to overcome bad ones.

~~~
lostPixels
Anecdotal counterpoint: I was in a rut much like the OP, and took a half year
off to explore psychedelic drugs, music festivals, and local art culture. A
couple of good acid trips really reset my expectations on reality and gave me
some much needed grounding.

With my newfound perspective, I took some professional risks that were
extremely advantageous in the long run. I likely would not have seen the
options, or have the fortitude to try them without a my sabbatical.

Never try this if you are depressed and looking for a quick-fix to your issues
though. If you are bored, scared of change, or unsure how to make life
choices, then I would suggest a good ole' high-dose acid trip in the woods.

Also, buy a cheap road bike and ride it 100 miles straight. Seriously, it will
change your life.

~~~
Joof
Acid is a good bit different from drinking though. You won't get addicted.

~~~
niccaluim
Experiences differ on this point.

~~~
Joof
Tolerance builds so quickly that it literally won't work taken too close
together. There aren't physical cravings either.

I feel that it could certainly be done too frequently, but it's very resistant
to being addictive. I suspect it would be easier to get addicted to tylonal. I
can't comment on other research chemicals, which are often sold under the
label of LSD.

Alcohol is well-known to be addictive and has organizations such as alcoholics
anonymous to get help.

------
patricius
This is a problem with living goal-oriented lives. We set out goals and by
working towards those goals, we are paradoxically eroding the feeling of
purpose, because what comes after the goal? Having finished a goal (finishing
your major in business administration), you know how this feels.

Instead, find out what activity you can do every day, potentially for the rest
of your life, that gives you meaning. For me it's eating lunch with my dad and
going to the gym to meet friends and stay healthy. And reading and learning.
These things don't sound profound, but they keep me happy about waking up
every day.

~~~
alonmower
Yes, this. As I've gotten older I've realized more and more that what you
choose to spend your time on day in and day out that really shapes your
happiness and who you are. If you're not enjoying/getting meaning out of the
process you'll likely not get it out of the result

------
Artlav
Feels familiar.

It's this rocket launch in super slow motion, the uphill battle of following
the standard script.

Finish school, finish the university, get a job, work on the PhD, survive the
lawsuit vs conscription army, finish the PhD, get a better job...

And suddenly you are in orbit. The last stage falls away, and there is
freefall.

There is no next step, nothing left to do, no battles left to fight. Feels
awesome, but gets old really fast. I lasted up there for about a year before
hopping on a random plane and spending a couple months in South America, then
slowly figuring out the things that are worth doing and things that aren't
worth doing.

5 days a week job is not worth doing, it eats away your sanity. 3 days a week
leaves much more time to work for projects of your own (or to come up with
them). Projects are worth doing, you never guess in advance how they would
play out, and the process is fun.

So, step one is to derail the current routine and get some thinking space
outside it's constraints. Step two is to figure out what you like to do and
how to be able to do it.

Not sure how well that would work for you - Russia is a cheap place to live
and most existential stuff is free, so my situation is quite a bit privileged
compared to what i heard about USA.

~~~
ivm
> We thought of life by analogy with a journey, a pilgrimage, which had a
> serious purpose at the end, and the thing was to get to that end, success or
> whatever it is, maybe heaven after you’re dead. But we missed the point the
> whole way along. It was a musical thing and you were supposed to sing or to
> dance while the music was being played.

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERbvKrH-
GC4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERbvKrH-GC4)

------
stevenkovar
Happiness, money, and love are great as a byproduct of effort, but destructive
as the main goal.

Do you want to feel fulfilled or do you want to be happy? My money is on the
former; for me this fulfillment comes from continually improving.

Focus on the process. The process of learning, of working, of talking, of
exercising, of being... everything you do, do it just 2% better than last
time. Try and be more of yourself and less of the someone you've thought (or
were told) you should be.

Practical advice:

1\. Don't go back to school; it's not a career advantage for most people
anymore. You can learn more in practice than in study.

2\. Find or create an active job—I mean physically active. Something hands-on.

3\. Get enough sleep, enough exercise, and enough sun/Vitamin D (in order of
importance); these plus a renewed focus on incremental improvements go hand-
in-hand.

4\. Don't be afraid to work less. Our culture is toxic with the obsession of
"what do you do" and "how much do you make" questions upon meeting someone.
The most fulfilled people I know start with "what do you enjoy most" or
"what's your story?" Working less makes your answer to those questions more
interesting.

5\. Exercise gratitude. By this, I mean find something every day you are
grateful for—this forces you to think creatively and to observe the small
things. It's simple, but this has larger implications for seeing the 'big
picture' and seizing opportunities you may otherwise miss.

~~~
gohrt
> "how much do you make"

what culture is this?!

~~~
daveloyall
Sometimes people volunteer this information very early in the course of
meeting. Maybe this is why...?

------
donretag
Undoubtedly, many will suggest traveling. I went traveling the world last year
for 10 months, although I did not do so because I "had the blues". I did so
because I found myself with no obligations and enough money to do so, so it
would be a great time to do it.

I had a fantastic time, but now I am suffering from the blues, not before. I
think of all the places I went to, and I simply cannot stand to be at work.
What am I doing here? Another trip?

If you are an American (can never tell on HN), then you may define yourself by
your job and profession. Treat your job as a paycheck and define yourself by
what you do in your free time. Of course, doing what you love is important,
but most people do not have that luxury. Many here on HN will disagree. Simply
get the job that sucks less, has a good work balance, and enjoy the other 16
hours of the day. Try living overseas with the culture is not as work focused.

~~~
monk_e_boy
Going to a 3rd world country opens your eyes to how 'free' we are.

In Bali you could just go and buy some stuff, set up a stall and sell it. Make
some cash. Try that in the UK.

Best thing is to go volunteer in an African school. Cheap to get there, you do
something amazing while you are there. And it'll change your life in a good
way.

~~~
donretag
Honestly, after spending a bit of time in Africa, they really do not need more
unskilled volunteers, but money to employ locals to do the same job. Locals
should be educated and then go on ahead to teach the next generation.

I did meet several skilled volunteers (doctors, finance directors) that are
bringing knowledge to areas that are severely lacking. Construction of solar
powered resources is popular.

------
gregn
I would say the answer is to read profound books, and then move. I was in a
situation where I drank continuously for several years because I was stuck in
a dead-end job in a dead-end town. The real thing to do is 2-fold:

1) figure out what the big story is, not the piddly immediate stuff; watch
Michael Wood histories, read Carl Sagan, read Bill Bryson's "A Short History
of Nearly Everything". Get interested in hobbies that will link you with
NATURE and the universe at large. Examples might be SURFING, HIKING,
ASTRONOMY, GEOLOGY, FIELD_BIOLOGY. These are important because it snaps you
out of the anthropocentrism that the myth of culture forces on us. You MUST
snap out of the delusional narrative society forces upon you in order to
_really_ make sense of your life. This means that you must read enough and
collect enough data to weave your own narrative to replace the off-the-shelf
one most people use. There are no easy versions of this. You must do it
yourself for it to work, and so that you can attain true mental and spiritual
freedom. I am not suggesting that you should become some out of touch hippy,
but instead gain a broader perspective. You can still go into business. Your
widened perspective will actually aid you instead of making things more
difficult for you. Steve Jobs for instance, went to India in the late 1970s
seeking audience with a famed Guru. It's a good strategy. Better than being a
drone.

2) Move!! Firstly, plan your move; consider your options carefully. While you
are researching, save up your money. There are a few places left in the U.S.
(I refuse to say which. It should be pretty obvious once you look) and in the
world where people are not totally congested in against one-another, where
people do not abuse consumerism and become flatulated and obese, where
soulless corporatism does not rule the minds and hearts of the local
residents. I won't tell you where they are, because frankly, I don't want
anyone to move there and ruin the tiny enclaves of peacefulness that are left.
Besides, you have to find them for yourself for it to work. Some people are
mountain people; some people are ocean people. You decide which one is for
you.

------
ddavidn
I'm 27, have had a great job for three years and very recently dropped into
this weird "stuck" state that feels similar to what you're describing. I feel
like a robot that gets up every day, goes to work, goes to bed, repeats.

I don't think the answer is the same for everyone, but my best times have been
when I was helping someone accomplish their dream company/project/etc. Self-
employment wasn't fulfilling for me in the way I had hoped, but sticking with
someone who has a great vision for something and being their support really
helped me to feel momentum for myself. Doesn't matter if I was making lots of
money, or just following the project and offering my opinion when asked.

My advice would be to seek out an opportunity, however small, to find
something that has meaning and momentum. Mentally put your office work on
autopilot, use your energy on the nights and weekends to find interesting
people and offer your unique perspective on what they're doing. I'm not out of
the woods yet, so take my advice (and all the other posters') with a grain of
salt. Hope this helps. Let us know how it goes.

Edit: The thoughts Derek posts over at sivers.org have been very inspirational
to me as well. He'll even answer your email if you ask him some questions.

------
sottitron
Here is what I've got for you. Maybe together we'll have four cents:

Sounds like you need to set some goals. In school you had them - they were to
get to here. Now its time to take stock and set some new ones. Then you'll
know where you're going and you won't be lost.

For what its worth, here is my mission statement:

At home, my wife, kids, friends and family will know they are loved and will
see it through my actions. At work, I will dazzle and always provide something
useful. For myself, I will invest the time and energy to keep myself present,
content, and healthy.

~~~
dasboth
That's a great mission statement, and it's not too lofty to be impossible to
attain.

------
r_smart
I did go through this when I got my first degree. I graduated with a degree in
writing and prepared to become a journalist and it was like the whole thing
turned to ash in my mouth. I just didn't want it anymore. I couldn't even
write anymore, and to this day, about 10 years later, I still don't write much
even though it was a hobby of mine from a young age.

The best solution I can offer you is to wait. Find a hustle (job you don't
mind doing that makes enough money for you) and let yourself recover a bit
until a new plan / opportunity emerges. For me, I got a job working as a bar
tender for a few years, then one day decided I couldn't wait on people any
more and I didn't want to be poor anymore. Enrolled in my local college for
Electrical Engineering and plowed my new path. But it took ~3 years for me to
be ready to do that. I had suffered a fairly crushing defeat and needed time
to recover and let a new plan gestate.

Be patient, and ignore the voice in your head that worries about how old you
are and how so many other people seem to have their course charted well before
you.

------
allendoerfer
First check if you treat yourself like a machine or an animal, that needs
maintenance. You can search for similar threads here, you will always find the
typical answers: Enough sleep? Good food? Exercise? Social interaction?

Once you have all that covered I would take a step back and get some vacation.
You seem to already have an idea what you want to do, so that is good. Maybe
try to specify it a bit more and lay out the steps to get there.

One of these steps could be going back to school. If you are not sure whether
you want to take a step, I would go like this:

1\. List alternatives

2\. Order by likelihood of success

3\. Take first you think you can do and still stay sane. You have to know
yourself whether or not you are a person that can take on debt and likes to go
to school.

~~~
antisthenes
> First check if you treat yourself like a machine or an animal, that needs
> maintenance. You can search for similar threads here, you will always find
> the typical answers: Enough sleep? Good food? Exercise? Social interaction?

Oddly enough treating myself like a machine allowed me to actually take
control of my life and improve many aspects of it. If anyone is curious, I
just took all my bad habits and turned them into sleep & physical activity and
made them my new habits.

------
bahularora
Life is a circle you feel lost then you find your way, only to find its not
your way, then you feel lost again, and it goes on till you die. Know this
that you will never find any deep meaning to life, its all there it is to
life. Its simple give happiness to others, be honest and just enjoy your time
here doing things you want to do and then leave in peace. Be happy or not its
immaterial, you can't be in one state for long anyway. We are all but a pale
blue dot in the vastness of the sky.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pale_Blue_Dot](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pale_Blue_Dot)

~~~
anysz
+1 most concise and accurate explanation of life so far

~~~
lastofus
I think Vonnegut got it down even further: "I tell you, we are here on Earth
to fart around, and don't let anybody tell you different."

~~~
kevinwang
Yet he did more than fart around

------
jason_slack
I am 39. I feel this way every few years. I look back on the previous few
years and realize that the ideas/goals that I had, I did not accomplish. I
then start to look for new ways to accomplish them. I still have a 8-5 that I
need to pay my bills.

So I start with the 1 hour a day idea. Goto work, come home, eat dinner with
the family. Then I get 1 hour to do whatever I want. No interruptions.

Then, well, it is Friday, perhaps I can take my 1 hour and goto bed an hour
later, now I have 2 hours.

Saturday and Sunday, maybe I can do 4 hours.

Oh, back to Monday - Thursday, 1 hour.

This makes me feel that: 1\. maintaining my 8-5. Bills paid. Wife is happy.
2\. I have time each and every day for my goals/ideas. Some more than others.
3\. I am making forward progress. 4\. I don't think about my 8-5 holding me
back, because it isn't anymore.

What do I do during my time: 1\. code 2\. EDM 3\. read about things that
interest me.

When I was struggling years ago with an 8-5 that I hated but needed to keep. I
bought a good pair of headphones and I used them everyday. I felt that it kept
me motivated (I could pump though them any type of music I wanted, mood
dependent) and it kept me a bit isolated from co-workers and I could just
focus on work. Sometimes distractions cause you to be stressed because it
increases the time it takes and therefor you feel behind in your day instead
of on pace.

One last thought. Can you get some exercise? For me, if I can I just feel
better.

Keep your chin up!

~~~
elmojenkins
Honestly, i feel like your answer highlights the problem.

Compromising to the degree at which you can accept that you only get 1hr a day
to yourself, is (to me) crazy. I am crazy too because I do the same thing.

It's hard to buy into the notion of working 8hrs and only getting 1hr for
yourself, and then being ookay with that. It's a tough pill to swallow.

~~~
jason_slack
It is indeed a tough pill to swallow. For me, I have a bills and a family and
I make that trade off to take care of them and still have time for my own
agenda.

In regards to the OP, I was trying to demonstrate that you should start with
that you can obtain and not make an irrational decision. I also read a tone of
depression in the OP's post and the last thing I would want to tell them is
"you are stuck, live with it." It's not true.

------
tominous
Here's the secret: motivation only kicks in AFTER you start doing something.
If you're waiting around for motivation to come out of the blue you'll be
disappointed.

So just start doing something. Choose one that appeals to you: help another
person, create something, build friendships. You've spent enough time
improving yourself through education, now it's time to focus outwards and give
back.

Second, structure. Set some recurring reminders for starting. In the past I
have used a dark trick: I asked a friend to be my "demotivator". His job was
to knock me off track. If I didn't meet my personal commitment on a given day
I would pay him $50. It worked extremely well.

~~~
dharmon
Strongly agree with the motivation bit.

On top of it I'd say don't just start working on something, but start on
something small. A ridiculous number of inventions, science, and companies
started out as solving some small problem or looking into one issue. If you
start out trying to solve a Big Problem (TM), you will get overwhelmed. Don't
be fooled by revisionists histories where people try to pretend like they had
some grand mission from the start.

A lot of young people have this feeling that they need to do something
important, but they feel overwhelmed. Then they end up doing lame stuff like
getting tattoos, funky haircuts, or weird clothes in an attempt to be unique.
Hint: If you can buy it or pay someone to do it, it is neither unique nor a
true expression of yourself. There is no shortcut.

Start working on something (anything!) to delight yourself. Then try to
delight one other person. Grow from there.

------
sbuttgereit
I would start by addressing why you say:

" _I 'd like to be something -- more than just an office person. More than
just someone who works that 8-5 shift._"

Why do you want to be "more" than that? For what purpose? The approval of
others? Because somehow, you'd be a different person or "feel" different than
you do now? Because somehow cube dwellers are lesser... and by what
standard... public opinion?

I think this is part of the core of the issue you face and you need to come to
terms with your motivations when saying such things.

Most people that are "something" more than average aren't actually trying to
be accomplished, they're dedicated to a problem, a profession, or an
avocation. Solving the problem, perfecting the skill are the goals and produce
the satisfaction and are the source of self-esteem... the acclaim is merely a
side effect and honestly not important.

Finding a good central purpose is key here. Something that you want to achieve
without regard if anyone else cares: this is not necessarily a career pursuit
either, and you can have more than one central purpose. The key though is that
_you_ have to care about... not anyone else. For some this is family, for some
this is closing business deals, for others it's programming.

Seeking acclaim is not a good goal: I've had friends kill themselves for
failing to achieve that when they made the approval of others the source of
their self-esteem. When you make approval your goal you effectively refuse to
judge what is worthwhile for yourself and outsource that to others; you stop
thinking and wait for the thinking of others. You loose your independence and
in the end, you become willing to compromise anything to keep the approval
coming... regardless if that's good for you or not.

(Edited for clarity)

------
Yetanfou
What I'd do? A few things, depending on whether you have any money left after
finishing that 'business degree'. If you do, I'd find myself a small farm or
even a plot of land to buy somewhere in the vicinity of, but not to close to a
population centre. I'd divide my time between working on that farm - first
(re)building a house, then - depending on the region you live in - growing
some produce for your own consumption, for friends and neighbours, to brew
beer, make bread, whatever. At the same time I'd try to find some work in my
area of interest, something to keep (or bring) myself up to date within that
field and to bring in some money. As living in this way is generally
remarkably 'cheap' you don't need enormous amounts of money.

Do this for a few years, make sure to keep up to date within your field, keep
connections within your field, don't become a hermit but also don't succumb to
the urge to blindly follow the herd chasing degrees and money.

After a few years your outlook on what to do next will be a lot more
developed. Maybe you'll decide to start out for yourself in your field? Maybe
you'll move abroad? Maybe you'll become a full-time homesteader? A builder?
You will be free to choose, not burdened with that loan (that is, not any more
than you're already burdened with it). Plus, you'll have the satisfaction of
knowing to be self-reliant, able to bake your own bread, brew your own beer,
repair your own house. When things go bump in the night you won't crawl under
the bed with a phone to call 911 and wait for the police which might - or
might not - show up. You'll go outside to see what made that noise.

If you don't have any money to get that plot or small farm I'd find myself a
job which pays enough to be able to buy it in a few years of hard work and
frugal living.

The major takeaway is to become self-reliant, less dependent on what other
people think of you. Be social when you want to, not when the situation
dictates you should be. Be 'real'. Don't act. Use your head, speak your mind,
cut the crap. It's your life, you get to decide how to live it.

------
hirzel
This is trivial compared to lots of good advice here, but I've benefited in
stuck times by cutting my hair. Of course, alone, this doesn't do much, but
sometimes that moment in the mirror with someone looking slightly different--
it helps me lock-in a course correction just a bit.

~~~
return0
My favorite thing to do when i don't know what to do is drink water.

------
ADanFromCanada
30 years old here. Not a grad, but been working for a long ass time. Been
through burn-out. Now I manage a team and my sole goal as a manager is to make
sure people are feeling good and happy as that leads to consistent
productivity.

Also relevant is the fact that up until recently (call it 8 months ago), I
would have mood swings and go through periods of depression as well.

Then I started exercising regularly. And I cannot be clear or emphatic enough
in this but as someone who uses drugs for mood alteration; who is intelligent;
who has a good career and is well respected; and who ultimately had no other
legitimate reason to feel depressive emotions, since getting into a regular
exercise routine, I've never felt more stable, positive and motivated in my
life.

Our bodies are designed to move. For me, it's plainly clear that the sedentary
lifestyle is what was at the root of my emotional issues.

I'm not saying you need to be a body builder or run a marathon. I do 15 minute
runs and moderate weights and meditation. I swear, it is night and day.

As a secondary suggestion which has also been extremely helpful and
beneficial, I'd recommend reading up on psychology, biases, and
neuroplasticity. The most impacting book I've ever read is "The Brain That
Changes Itself" by Norman Doidge. This book will give you a scientific/real
basis of understanding how your brain works; how your habits form and are re-
enforced, and how you can take control of these processes to literally shape
your own reality into whatever you want. Super powerful stuff. I've bought
probably 15 copies of this book for friends and relatives. Highly, highly
recommended.

Good luck!

~~~
dilemma
Doing really quick runs (5 minutes actually) helped me get started running.
From there you can go up to 10, 15 minutes.

Bought the book, also. An interesting thing to keep in mind is that we are
products of both nature and environment then we can change ourselves at least
partially by changing our environment - moving, new friends - and letting it
change us.

------
jvandyke
Yes, I have felt the way you do. I feel like this for a few weeks, then go
back to feeling a bit better and worth something. You are definitely not
alone.

First, you should find a counselor, any counselor, and open up to her/him.
Direct, immediate feedback from a professional "personal problem helper" will
help you. You can stop reading here and act.

Now, on to my non-professional ideas that you should probably skip but my ego
prevents me from omitting:

It sounds like you need goals like school gave you. Let's think about it. In
school, you had short-term goals (assignments, next exam), mid-term goals
(grades during a semester), and long-term goals (graduation, GPA). Our tech
work is terrible at these things except at very small companies where there's
too many obvious things to do, and very large companies where the career
ladder is so defined that you just need to show up and follow simple
instructions. In the middle lies the domain of the lost and the over-
motivated. Choose your path.

If you choose to go back to school, you'll have these goals again, but you'll
probably have the same problem and feelings again once you're done. Plus,
you'll have more debt and thus more pressure to be "successful", which is
probably counter-productive to your feelings.

Don't listen to people on the internet, including me. Nothing we say is true
for you. Try to take a general consensus and make your own decisions with that
input. There's wisdom in every comment above and below, but it's shaded by
bias, experience, and fallacies that are not your own.

Please, seek help. Don't waste any more time trying to deal with this by
yourself in your own head until you've been given a proven pattern for doing
so by a professional. Visit them with an open mind and few expectations and be
more frank and honest than you ever have before. You'll move whether you want
to or not. It's up to you to choose the direction.

Be well, do good.

------
buckbova
Happy?

My favorite quote from a Dennis Leary standup and I think his best recorded
routine.

“Happiness comes in small doses folks. It's a cigarette butt, or a chocolate
chip cookie or a five second orgasm. You come, you smoke the butt you eat the
cookie you go to sleep wake up and go back to fucking work the next morning,
THAT'S IT! End of fucking list! ”

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ffrOovd741s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ffrOovd741s)

I guess he's saying it's the little things.

------
Raphmedia
I'm feeling the exact way after having been told indirectly that the path I
have undertaken this year was a waste of time for the company I work at.
(Branching out from my job description and taking more tasks)

This made me take a look at the job market and now I feel like I have a lot of
doors open to me where I would otherwise be too scared/comfortable to leave.

The dread and anger, the feeling of being stuck, they all turned into
excitement.

------
GarrisonPrime
I feel ya. I became a doctor after many years of "following the path to
glory", but then became very depressed and felt my life suddenly became too
defined. My life had lost all of its magic. I finished residency just for the
money, as I had nothing else in mind to do. Then I lived with my mother for 2
years, drinking too much and doing nothing much other than teaching 8 hours a
week at the local community college to be able to pay my bills.

Then I decided "what the fuck, screw medicine", and decided to do something
radically different. So now I own an escape room business, and every day I hit
the ground running and eager. It's struggling a bit, and might not survive.
But at the moment I'm living my life for myself, so I'm willing to take the
bad with the good.

Good luck!

~~~
cylinder
Did you ever consider being a sort of traveling physician to underserved
people? I always imagined this as the adventurous route for doctors.

~~~
redrainbows
This is known as being a locum physician. I know some young doctors choose to
do this for a while because of the experience they gain from the added
responsibilities that come with an isolated location.

~~~
kaybe
It's not like doctors without borders, is it?

------
Avshalom
I graduated with a BS in physics minor in mathematics, in 2009. Then did
nothing for almost 3 years. I've been a stock boy at target for the last 4
now. Going back to school next month because I have the money and no
particular idea what else to do.

So I don't really have advice except maybe: save as much money as you can for
a little bit, see if that money starts looking like something: a trip, an
early retirement, school, a side project.

Beyond that go get screened for depression. See about counseling. I just
recently (~two weeks) got on citalopram because I'm trying to make this go
around of school a bit more productive. I don't know if it's helping yet but
that just goes to show how ludicrously mild we've gotten antidepressants now.

~~~
kbhn
I was on citalopram for a while, I can speak to the feeling of "is this thing
doing anything?" After a couple months I noticed that my emotions felt
bounded...I felt highs and lows, but the differences between the two were much
less pronounced than previously. I felt...robotic after a while? Like I was
going through my day on autopilot, but hey I was getting things done and
didn't feel like killing myself on the regular. For me, one of the most
pronounced side effects was a significant dampening on my libido; if you've
got a partner or wish to maintain an active sex life consider working with
your medical professional to find an alternative SSRI.

Give it time, and best of luck to you on your journey.

~~~
Avshalom
Yeah that libido thing was mentioned and the nurse practitioner that
prescribed it sounded very willing to switch to something else if it was a
problem, this was just what she felt was first line (well actually it was
going to be welbutrin but she didn't like my blood pressure).

That said... I'm one of those people that just has lows, and I'm not sexually
active so I'm willing to give this a shot for a while.

------
hypertexthero
A book that helped me in my life when I had similar questions is [Think on
These Things by Jiddu Krishnamurti][1], warmly recommended.

From the first chapter, The Function of Education:

> I WONDER IF we have ever asked ourselves what education means. Why do we go
> to school, why do we learn various subjects, why do we pass examinations and
> compete with each other for better grades? What does this so-called
> education mean, and what is it all about? This is really a very important
> question, not only for the students, but also for the parents, for the
> teachers, and for everyone who loves this earth. Why do we go through the
> struggle to be educated? Is it merely in order to pass some examinations and
> get a job? Or is it the function of education to prepare us while we are
> young to understand the whole process of life? Having a job and earning
> one's livelihood is necessary - but is that all? Are we being educated only
> for that? Surely, life is not merely a job, an occupation; life is something
> extraordinarily wide and profound, it is a great mystery, a vast realm in
> which we function as human beings. If we merely prepare ourselves to earn a
> livelihood, we shall miss the whole point of life; and to understand life is
> much more important than merely to prepare for examinations and become very
> proficient in mathematics, physics, or what you will.

[1]:
[https://books.google.com/books?id=IsldnzHkxpsC&printsec=fron...](https://books.google.com/books?id=IsldnzHkxpsC&printsec=frontcover&dq=think+on+these+things&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiK3Zj7o4fOAhWFdj4KHfXvCTAQ6AEIHjAA#v=onepage&q&f=false)

------
nappy-doo
I'd say:

* Almost everyone feels like this at some time. Don't worry that you're alone.

* Focus on small things. Get a little thing done every day, mark it off, celebrate that victory in a way that makes sense for you. Keep a list of the stuff you've done. It's very helpful to look back and say, "I applied for these two jobs, and I read this book, and I went on a hike with my mate."

* It's okay to not have it figured out. It's also okay to shift goals. Lots of people say, "I want to travel the world," and find out it's lonely or disconcerting when you don't speak the language; or, "I want to sail across the Atlantic," until they see their first small squall off the coast. It's okay to have a goal, try something and decide, "you know what, that's not for me."

* Don't feel like a failure if you don't fit someone else's mold. For example, if your parents wanted you to have a certain degree, or you listen to the HN echo-chamber of "startups or GTFO, LOSER!" Don't let someone else tell you who to be. It's hard enough to figure it out, it's worse when you listen to them and figure out it wasn't right at all.

* Get plenty of sleep, get plenty of exercise, eat well.

* Keep talking to others. It will help you figure it out. Listen to what you're saying more than you listen to what they're saying to you. You, LITERALLY, will be telling them what you should do to improve your situation. Once you figure it out, you'll be able to work on the first steps.

Good luck.

------
gradschool
If I were in your shoes, I'd find something I'm passionate about and build a
business around it, especially with your knowledge of business administration.
At 29 you've reached your prime :). I wouldn't go back to school and get more
student loan debt because I could learn whatever I want for free from Kahn
academy, or from all the videos put on line by Stanford and MIT, and I
wouldn't work for peanuts in somebody else's office, but might consider an
offer with a lot of equity. (Sorry for my dumb opinions. I'm just hoping to
keep this thread alive long enough for someone smarter than me to join in.)

~~~
danvoell
I'm 37. I've felt that way in the past. I've felt that way recently. I've had
successes and I've had failures. Most people don't wake up and say "I've made
it", if you are looking for that, it rarely comes. I agree here, except with
less concentration on "build a business around it". Find something you are
passionate about and build the hell out of it (software, pizza, wood product).
Don't build it for other people build it for yourself and become the best at
it. I've failed at businesses that I thought were completely earth-shattering
ideas, I've succeeded at businesses where people wanted the product and it was
painfully obvious because they were already buying the product elsewhere.

------
tumanian
Welcome to your Saturn Return. While its a random astrology term, alot of us
feel exactly the same way at the later end of 20s. Time to break the routine
and reinvent yourself. Things that worked for me: * solo travel. Helps to
break the envelope and find awe-inspiring things. __working out - your body is
your amusement park, and working out unleashes the feel-good chemistry.
Improves your mental state. __seeking our and spend time with people that
inspire you. Nothing motivates mere then success stories of people youre with.
__networking - the world is built by people and you cant build one by
yourself. __reading in depth - know something in depth. Pro 's are appreciated
in any domain.

Going to school could help to get credentials if youre switching fields. But
you can also get credentials by doing something.

I apologiee for sounding self-helpy and generic. Just my 2c.

------
gerbilly
I've felt this way.

When you are in school you are given a reward structure to work within, and
there is a definite end goal.

Now you are in an open ended situation with no set goal. The transition
between the two can be jarring.

I think it might be time to just experiment and try a few things that interest
you. Write an ebook, travel, code up an app, whatever appeals to you.

Sometimes we just need to wander a bit before finding our way. Every hero's
quest has a period of wandering aimlessly in the wilderness before finding a
worthy goal.

Don't just look for something to do, look for the right people to do it with.
Choose those people carefully. Especially leave behind people that aren't
right for you.

Later, after you've lived a satisfying life and look back, you'll see that all
the pieces of that life were there in this very moment. You just can't see
them now, but they will come together.

Trust in that, and don't worry too much.

[edit: more advice...]

------
shireboy
I'd lean toward _not_ going back to school unless you are very confident that
1) you are passionate about a career in X and 2) some time researching/talking
to people in career X shows that you would really need to go back to school to
do X.

Yes, what you are feeling is common. Some specific advice:

\- Don't dwell on it. Let these feelings be annoying and motivation to do
something else, but don't let them control you or steer you toward self-
destructive behavior or bad decisions (ie lots of debt, drugs/alcohol/etc).

\- Do try to move up and out of the funk by working toward a career that you
enjoy at least some of the time (there is no perfect job).

\- Look for things that you _enjoy_, are _good at_, and _could envision making
money doing_. If you already have ideas, pursue them. Even if it's writing a
book or doing a training video, blog etc. on the side for now, try. You'll
fail at some of it, but some will stick and you'll be started earning an
income at something you enjoy.

\- If you don't have any ideas, try a bunch of small things and see what
sticks. Volunteer at a hospital or food bank or Habitat build. Take a
community or online class in web design, art, language, etc. Talk to people in
detail about their careers and read about them.

\- Make a list of things you try and ideas and rate them by how much you like
them. Once you have a list, rate them by how likely it would be to earn an
income. That should narrow to a few things you both _could become good at_ and
_can earn an income_ doing. Be realistic, but optimistic about both "good at"
and "earn an income".

While most of that is about a career, and that is the gist of your question,
it's not all about career:

\- Find a cheap hobby (hiking, fishing, sketching, etc) and dedicate some time
to it.

\- Help other people. Volunteer, tutor, or just randomly do charity.

\- Find group(s) of people to belong to. A church, civic club, hobby club,
etc.

Once you have your potential career, hobby, and volunteering ideas listed, put
next steps for them on a calendar a week or a month at a time. Then stick to
the calendar. You will have a full life, be helping others, and be working
toward something you enjoy.

------
xemdetia
I find the best thing for me is to consume. Consume everything- books, movies,
scientific articles, news articles, things you haven't heard of before,
obscure channels. When I find myself lost it's really that I am searching, and
I need something to stand on- an idea, a book, a character, or an individual
that is truly invested in what they are doing.

I fully subscribe to the idea that you have to consume things that make you
think to create anything, and the only way you're going to be able to do
anything interesting to fuel your own fire is to create. It can be a self-
improvement, an actual thing, a societal group, or write a book- but you have
to consume enough to know what you even _could_ do.

~~~
selimthegrim
You have to consume to develop enough taste to reject the inevitable 10 bad
attempts at creation for every good one, as well as to gather a community for
feedback.

------
elwell
I appreciate your honesty. I believe you feel this way because you have an
accurate view of reality. Many of us are constantly fighting to ignore this
truth; trying to distract ourselves. The Bible says that "God has set eternity
in the human heart." We all naturally long for something of meaning _that
doesn 't pass away_.

If you aren't open to believing in God at this point in your life, I could
suggest that you focus on investing in those around you. That's an easy way to
take the pressure off yourself for having to live in a meaningful life. "A
generous person will prosper; whoever refreshes others will be refreshed."
Proverbs 11:25

------
cylinder
Do not go back to university. Focus on gaining a skill, one that allows you to
add value and solve problems for people. I'd much rather be able to fix your
AC than do your HR compliance.

Unfortunately in America, working on your own is problematic due to disastrous
health insurance system, and low wages for labor, and small business being
unable to compete with multinational giants. This pushes people to seek
comfort of corporations unless they're able to raise funds to start a
business.

Trust your ancestry. People were either farmers or artisans until very
recently. I think working in a corporate setting is swimming upstream for all
but a certain type of personality.

------
cathini
Hey! You are not alone. In cases like this, when you feel you have lost track
remember... Lewis Carrol once said "If you don't know where you are going, any
road will get you there." So breathe and try new things. Go to the library,
watch a movie, visit a museum, join a book club... Just be curious in places
you have never been but you are interested in. There is so much in life and
things to do that you'll be blown away. Trust me, serendipity will come and
you'll remember that you are alive, free and ready to explore and enjoy. I
send you lots and lots of love, baby. Everything will be OK. I promise.

------
djkrudy
I'd climb rocks and find Jesus. In the opposite order, but that sounds less
poetic :P Either way, I vouch for both and if you want to know more about
either, get in touch. If moderate success doesn't equal moderate happiness
then is our whole societal model of success equals happiness broken? I think
so. Love, -Daniel

~~~
noir_lord
The only way I'd ever be likely to find Jesus is if I fell off the rock for
about 3s (depending on height).

That and when I hit my thumb with a hammer since screaming "Random
fluctuations in the space time continumn damnit that hurt" just doesn't have
the same feeling.

~~~
djkrudy
noir_lord, if you're happy, then great. Just don't dig too far into your
existentialism or in my opinion you'll end up disappointed and confused with
the circularity of the reasoning. I hope sometime you say to yourself "No,
really, what is the actual point??? If the answer is REALLY nothing but random
fluctuations in the space time continuum then I don't understand why we don't
just all slit our wrists together. But life goes on, and mass suicide hasn't
happened, which I find inconsistant with your line of reasoning. That said,
I'm sure OP appreciates your input "Everything is meaningless, you should feel
lost and helpless cause it's the truth!"

~~~
noir_lord
I look at it the other way, I find it reassuring that the universe doesn't
give a shit about us, I'd find the various Gods posited over the years a lot
more frightening if they actually existed.

In that sense I'm happier in a universe without a higher power, I also get to
appreciate all the beauty there is in the universe for a brief period of time
and that to me is _enough_ in and off itself.

I think a lot of the reason people believe in religion is fear of
nothingingness or an inability to accept that in the grand scheme of things
they simply don't matter, basically it's a substitute for having to face
death.

The way I look at that is I didn't exist before 1980 and that didn't hurt..
and I fully expect to not exist sometime between now and 2060, the universe
was around before me and will be around after me and that's pleasing, given
the spectacular chain of events that had to happen in sequence over billions
of years for me to have existed at all how could I not.

~~~
djkrudy
In 1668 Francesco Redi disproved the theory that flies spontaneously generated
from rotting meat, a theory originally proposed by Aristotle. Since that time,
popular science has just shifted that theory farther and farther away from the
common era. When carefully and objectively observed, rotting meat does not
emit maggots, but since nobody around to observe meat, matter, molecules or
atoms billions of years ago... we can just squint at the farthest reaches of
the timeline and infer from the fuzziness that life must have spontaneously
generated...right? God is very scary and mean when he is misunderstood, we can
agree on that. You speak of beauty as an objective(even if relative) truth but
deny the concept of objective truths. You have an innate respect for
continuation and survival, but deny the order and purpose necessary to create
and sustain that framework. I'm sure you'd profess Newton's laws of motion,
but you deny them in your lack of theory of existence. I'm not trying to be
demeaning, I'm trying to leave no room for anything but a yes or no answer in
your mind. If you don't want to break it down to that, then cheers to a good
life my friend.

~~~
noir_lord
God isn't scary since he doesn't exist, The things people who believe in God
do are scary but then the things people who don't believe in God do are also
scary - or to be blunt I fear the People who believe in a God a lot more than
the God they believe in since I have evidence for the former.

There is no evidence of God in any of the ways that any of the religious texts
describe (and not in any way they don't describe but that's a different
subject), that we don't understand the process behind something doesn't mean
we just insert "God did it" and stop questioning, your central argument is
what is called the "God of the Gaps" argument
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God_of_the_gaps](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/God_of_the_gaps)
and it's notable that over the last millenia those gaps get smaller and more
distant in both time and space - we are a long way from angry Gods every time
it Thunders and Scarab beetles pushing the Sun across the sky in some ways and
apparently no further than we ever where in others, now it's possible there
might be things we can never know (there is no reason to presuppose that we
can learn everything there is to be learned) but that _still_ doesn't mean we
can just insert "Because God" or to put it another way, your claim that God
created life has exactly as much merit as my contention that a purple stuffed
elephant called Terrence did it since after all it's not on Atheists to prove
God doesn't exist, it's on the Religious to prove that he does.

Now this entire debate is pointless since your faith in God requires no
evidence (if there was evidence it wouldn't be faith) and my refusal to
believe in God (or Gods) is because there is no evidence (or to paraphrase one
of my heroes - "That which can be asserted without evidence can be dismissed
without evidence") so we reach a natural stopping point in this
debate...unless you have empirical proof for the existence of God?.

~~~
arisAlexis
I gave up these arguments since none of the two will change his mind ever.

~~~
djkrudy
Probably wise!

------
xigency
As the late Christopher Welch said,

Do not go back to college!

Don't! Do not do that. Go work at Burger King. Go into the woods and forage
for nuts and berries. Do not go back to college!

------
dominotw
_To seek fulfilment is to invite frustration. There is no fulfilment of the
self, but only the strengthening of the self through possessing what it craves
for. Possession, at whatever level, makes the self feel potent, rich, active,
and this sensation is called fulfilment; but as with all sensations, it soon
fades, to be replaced by yet another gratification. We are all familiar with
this process of replacement or substitution, and it is a game with which most
of us are content. There are some, however, who desire a more enduring
gratification, one that will last for the whole of one 's life; and having
found it, they hope never to be disturbed again. But there is a constant,
unconscious fear of disturbance, and subtle forms of resistance are cultivated
behind which the mind takes shelter; and so the fear of death is inevitable.
Fulfilment and the fear of death are the two sides of one process: the
strengthening of the self. After all, fulfilment is complete identification
with something - with children, with property, with ideas. Children and
property are rather risky, but ideas offer greater safety and security. Words,
which are ideas and memories, with their sensations, become important; and
fulfilment or completeness then becomes the word._

[http://www.jkrishnamurti.org/krishnamurti-teachings/view-
tex...](http://www.jkrishnamurti.org/krishnamurti-teachings/view-
text.php?tid=25&chid=61629)

So.. I guess start identifying yourself strongly with something. What that
something is not very relevant, cast a dice and see what sticks.

~~~
dsubburam
>So.. I guess start identifying yourself strongly with something. What that
something is not very relevant, cast a dice and see what sticks.

Nope, that's not what Krishnamurti's pointing to. He's pointing to the problem
with identifying with anything -- objects, ideas, personalities, character.
That this identifying strengthens the sense of self, which leads to a fear (of
death, death of the sense of self).

Just offering my words on the subject. Read him and make your own
interpretation. Better yet, inquire upon your own experience and form your own
understanding.

~~~
dominotw
the _solution_ is mine not Krishnamurthy's

------
RUG3Y
I'm just coming out of a long period of "stuckness." I work in software
development, but definitely feel the way you feel about my work.

For me, the lack of autonomy and freedom and everything that comes along with
having a normal job feels repressive. I was an artist and musician, and I gave
up, because "there's no money in it." Now I make money, but I'm sad.

I came to my wit's end. This week, I started writing on Medium. I write one
story a day. I get up at 6AM, pound out a thousand words, and publish. I also
started going to the gym.

I can tell you that this has made a world of difference. I feel like I have a
little bit of control over something. My job isn't the only important thing
about me. I'm a writer now. I will never tell anyone, "I'm a software
developer." I will say, "I am a writer."

I've also started having more, and better ideas. I think that writing and
having ideas can open up the whole world to us. Time will tell.

Eventually, I'd like to become self-sufficient and fire my employer.

I think if you begin to do something that stimulates you every day, you will
feel less stuck. It needs to be something that you do for yourself, and only
for yourself. Maybe you can take your lunch-break every day for a few weeks,
and write a bunch of business ideas down. Or maybe you can compile a reading
list of books that you are interested in, and read one a week.

I think if you try it, opportunities will present themselves.

Of course, advice is worth what you pay for it, but this is what works for me.

------
fsloth
What ever you do, remember to eat and sleep well and exercise. You may do
those already, but those are lowest building blocks of mental health and are
kinda the most obvious actionable answers to your question.

Just pointing those out because they are what I neglect occasionally when
feeling down and end up feeling ever more miserable.

Folllowing our intrinsic motivations is usually very pleasurable. Perhaps
there is some hobby you enjoyed that you've not done in a while?

"This" is what life is - and no one owns your life except you. Dreaming of
having a ferrari is a stupid dream. Rich peoples lives are potentially just as
hollow as median income ones. The only thing I'm aware to bring people joy
constantly is being able to follow ones intrinsic motivations. You don't need
to be 'something' to be happy - just you, and being able to be you. If you
feel there is nothing pleasurable in life you may have a depressive period.
Usually these pass - without medication. Note: it's quite common to have a
slight depressin after achieving a major life goal. After getting my MSc I
felt empty and dissatified - and am quite content now.

------
Broken_Hippo
I didn't real every comment - there are many. But here is my opinion: This is
pretty common in the late 20's. Lots of changes, then suddenly, it is the same
thing every day. I am about 10 years older, and my life has completely changed
since then, part luck and part my own choices. My advice: 1\. You aren't your
job. Concentrate on something other than work. Have a truthful answer to "what
do you do?" that isn't work. I'm an artist, but the pay is terrible, so I
gotta make money other ways. What do you do? 2\. But I understand the job has
a big impact. Take an honest look. Do you actually hate the work? Is it
tolerable? Stressful? Boring? Or are you simply coming to terms that your
dreams that you worked towards haven't quite come? There isn't much to do
about the last, but all the rest are fixable. You have a flexible degree, and
you can use it in different industries. Schools, retail, and so on. If you are
actually unhappy, see how far you can use that degree you have. 3\. If you are
in a relationship, decide if you are happy in it. If not, make changes. They
don't have to be extreme changes. This might be more true if you've been in a
relationship for many years, as both of you have probably changed since your
early 20's. 4\. If you are single or do not have children, start getting out
of the house regularly. It is difficult, but worth it. This isn't bad advice
with children, just harder, and possibly easier if you involve a child or
children in this case. 5\. If you have a weird thought that you might be
depressed or anxious, get this checked. Or if this doesn't seem to lift after
some time and action - or if action seems to be too much - get checked. It
won't take care of your problems, but it will make it much more likely that
you'll be able to take the action necessary to do them and get yourself un-
stuck.

------
MaximStein
This is a hard question and I don't think any advice written here can help you
more than just by pure chance. What you are describing can have a lot of
different reasons and needs a lot of different reactions.

My usual approach for friends and family, who are in a situation like that, is
to talk to them and trying to push them towards different possible directions.
While doing this I get a feeling what they feel comfortable with and are
interested in. Often people need those kind of pushes themselves. Our
intuition works great, when we walk in a directions and tells us if that is
something we're actually interested in. Once we have all opportunities at
once, it often is just too much for it and our intuition doesn't give any
feedback if we're actually interested in achieving that goal or not.

If you re interested I can take some time to talk with you on skype. I think 1
or 2 hours could be quite interesting for both of us. I would also appreciate
the challenge, as I usually do this with people I know for quite a bit
already. :)

------
ttcbj
For what its worth, I felt this way when I was 28. I ended up leaving a very
good job to start a very small business. Although its a tiny niche business,
it ended up providing an amazing life for me and my family. I am 42 now
(yikes!).

When I was 28, I had a specific dream (starting a business) but was afraid of
the risk. In your case, its not clear to me if you have a dream but don't know
how to get there, or if you wish you had a big dream, but aren't sure what it
would be. My advice applies more to the former than the latter.

My advice would be:

1\. If you are really dissatisfied with your job, look for a way to shake
things up. I left my good job to go to business school, then quit after a few
months when I realized I'd learn more by trying to start a business. Business
school wasn't the answer, but I wouldn't have quit the job directly, so it
facilitated things. Its hard to know in advance what will work, but if you are
stuck, try something new.

2\. Keep your eyes open for opportunities. The business I started was related
to experience and contacts from my previous employer.

3\. As soon as possible is the best time to take risks and make changes. It
won't be any easier to take risks as you add in more responsibilities (house,
kids, etc).

4\. Do your best at whatever you are doing, but don't worry too much if your
plans don't work out exactly as you thought. I thought I wanted to be an
industry titan. That was not in the cards. However, once I had kids, it turned
out what I wanted was a really flexible schedule. In retrospect, if I was an
industry titan, I suspect I would be looking for the exit (actually, given my
skill set, I probably would have been shown the exit).

I obviously don't know you, or much about you. But in my case, shaking things
up to pursue my dream really worked out well, FWIW.

------
drblast
Welcome to your 30's. I don't mean that to be dismissive, but more to tell you
that feeling the way you do is completely normal and has happened to just
about everyone I know.

Most of my life I felt like I was doing all the right things, but really I was
following a script that society had laid out. Do well in school, get a good
job, be successful, etc. Follow your dream! Achieve your goals! The problem
was that these things I've achieved wouldn't have been _my_ goals outside of
societal influence. Rather, they're appealing because of the money, respect,
and security that's afforded by my having achieved them. Left to my own
devices, I'd probably be a surfing or snowboarding bum with an interest in
math and music.

Now, society gives us a recipe for money, stability and respect. But that's
not a recipe for happiness, nor was it ever intended to be. And that's not
necessarily a bad thing...money, stability and respect are certainly not at
odds with being happy. However, many of us spend much of our young lives
trying to achieve financial and business goals without spending a minute of
time thinking about achieving happiness. You're brand new to this!

I didn't abandon my existing career or anything like that, but I did start to
question the societal script from square one; I accepted parts of it and
abandoned others. And I got involved in some meetup groups and made more
friends. Plenty of people feel exactly like you do. What if you all got
together and talked about that, or did something about it? It works.

Last weekend I was in a short film made by a friend I met recently. Making a
movie was never a goal of mine, but was my friend's dream. Helping make that
happen was incredible and fun.

But don't go looking for movie-making friends, unless that really interests
you. Look for friends. You'll probably get out as much or more than you put
in.

~~~
fsloth
Maslow's hierarchy of needs - a job fullfills the lower rungs of shelter and
sustenance but does not necessarily entail the pleasure of self-actualization.

------
jorgeaber
I'm 29 years old, I come from a CS background, I'm not religious and I've felt
that way as well. Like most of us here.

Watching this course has helped me a great deal: "Personality and its
transformations", by Jordan B. Peterson at University of Toronto.
[https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL22J3VaeABQAhrMCQUa6s...](https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL22J3VaeABQAhrMCQUa6sde_Y9DVbLYRv)

Here's a TEDx talk by the same professor that can serve as a glimpse of the
course:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tLteWutitFM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tLteWutitFM)

Not all of it is as scientifically rigorous as we are probably used to, but
It's plenty of valuable insights very hard to find anywhere else. I can't
begin to express my gratitude to that man.

I hope you find it as useful as it was to me, and I wish you well.

~~~
LeicesterCity
I watched about half of the first lecture, very interesting. What insights can
one draw from these series of lectures? Depending on the insights, I'm trying
to see if the time invested is personally worthwhile.

------
oryx123
Currently I am pretty much in the same position. I am about your age, also
about to finish my master in business. Can't provide a quick fix, sorry. I
guess it has everything to do with "knowing yourself".

And I think it is all about the environment you find yourself in. Taking a not
so full-filling job is nothing to worry about if you're surrounded by people
who make your life worthwhile and/or help you to do something else in the long
run. Being an isolated, merely self-sustaining cog in the wheel is what's
terrifying.

Also, I have to say I find your language a bit odd. Even though I agree with
your sentiment that working in an office is not a great prospect, your "more
than just.."-bit sounds a bit unhealthy. I mean if office jobs aren't for you
that's okay and if you happen to like them that's also okay. But why so
judgmental?

------
jonkiddy
A few thoughts immediately came to mind in regards to your post.

1\. You are intelligent. (you finished your degree, considered several
options, you are not making a brash decision, and you are seeking advice. All
very positive and responsible things to do.)

2\. You are looking for fulfillment in your education/work. (Find an
occupation that supports you, your loved ones, and then find fulfillment
outside of the 8-5.)

3\. Your entire post is generally self seeking. (Find fulfillment in spending
time with others, get in shape/fit, find someone that could use your help and
enjoy their friendship, volunteer your time/expertise to a worthy cause, pick
up a hobby that you always wanted to do. But the most important thing is to
find others to enjoy your free time with.)

Edit/Comment: I agree with others, drugs/alcohol should be completely avoided.

------
danso
A lot of people have felt that way, including me. And looking back, I can see
that I was wrong, no matter how absolute my feelings felt at the time.

But that's something you can hear and not believe, so motivational get-livin-
or-get-dyin sentiments will only get you so far. Setting a few long-term goals
and then a bunch of short-term goals is what you'll want to do so that this
down time isn't completely wasted. But thinking about these takes concerted
effort, just like any other endeavor.

You say you've just finished your degree. Have you found a job yet? Don't
think of getting a job as the end-all fulfillment of your life. At the very
least, it can be a stepping stone to other unforseen opportunities, i.e. Woody
Allen's aphorism about 60 to 90 percent of life being about just showing up.

------
Animats
If you have a real MBA, the most profitable thing to do is to find a company
that's in trouble, but fixable, and offer to turn it around for a fraction of
the company. They taught you how to do that in MBA school. The odds of success
at this are much better than doing a startup.

------
niftylettuce
You should watch my live stream every night at 8 PM EST. I code rapid
prototypes and startups. And I work on cool open source stuff.

[https://www.livecoding.tv/niftylettuce](https://www.livecoding.tv/niftylettuce)

I will inspire you to build stuff.

------
samlevine
> I'm 29 years old. I finished with my Business Administration degree(major)
> and now I just feel completely LOST! Has anyone ever felt that way?

Life is short, dark and unfair. The fact that you can recognize this means
you're conscious.

> I'd like to be something -- more than just an office person. More than just
> someone who works that 8-5 shift.

Do you want to be in the history books? Do you want a family? God willing, you
have a long life ahead of you. But opportunity cost is real when your life is
limited. You have to make decisions, and many of the most rewarding choices in
your life won't be fun.

School may or may not help you, but until you've defined your goals you can't
break them down into the pieces needed to achieve them.

------
jthowawy
Hi. You are not alone. I am the same age and I often feel the same. I know
that there are many other people that feel the same. Some even call it the
Quater-life crisis ([https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quarter-
life_crisis](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quarter-life_crisis)), although I
don't like putting everyone in the same bag.

That might be a symptom of depression (but does not have to be). I would
recommend the thing I did. Talk to a therapist. Psychotherapy helped me see
things from different perspectives, showed me new possibilities I did not see
myself. I am still in the process, but I feel so much better and liberated in
a way.

------
sumitjami
This is the phase where it really start.

Though I am younger but this is not age dependent.

This is an indication that something is missing. Some kind of 'emptyness'.

You will take a while to reach that conclusion. On reaching that conclusion of
'emptyness', I started something. I didnt know whether I was fixing it,
breaking it or something entirely tangential. But when I was well into what I
had started, I knew what do to. Perhaps something in disguise from this
([http://zenpencils.com/comic/157-amy-poehler-great-people-
do-...](http://zenpencils.com/comic/157-amy-poehler-great-people-do-things-
before-theyre-ready/)).

Best of luck, friend.

------
jkereako
Become a member of your local library and read. Choosing what to read can be
difficult, but a good place to start is to read books that have movie and TV
show counterparts which you like. I'm reading "Orange is the New Black" now.
I'm 60 pages in and it's just as good as the show.

> I feel like I should go back to school but do I really want to rack up all
> that loan?

Always remember that you can learn for free. There is Khan Academy, MIT
OpenCourseWare, edX, Saylor University and, formerly, Coursera (they charge
for some classes now). I truly believe you will learn more from MOOCs than you
will from classroom instruction.

------
DavidWanjiru
I don't know if this makes any sense, but let me try:

Everything a computer does boils down to a binary signal. Is the current on,
or is it off? Everything else is an abstraction built on that on/off business.

Life, as I see it, similarly boils down to two things: finding love, and
finding knowledge. Everything else is an abstraction built on these two
things.

We seek to become what we seek to become because those that become what we
seek to become are rewarded with love and knowledge. That thing we call
purpose in life, and becoming someone, and making something of yourself, it's
just love in various degenerate forms.

When we change the world, when we make a difference, when we make something of
ourselves, we are simply chasing love. We end up loving ourselves, and being
loved by others, and being loved by our gods.

The reason we become doubtful about life, I feel, is because we aren't sure
whether what we are doing is going to receive this reward of love. That's why
someone writing code for Adsense might feel like her job would me more
fulfilling were she writing code for cardiac pacesetters instead.

But the love we experience in life doesn't have to be tied to what we do in
life. We can love ourselves for the sake of loving ourselves, and without
needing reasons for doing so. We can hopefully find people who are going to
love us, and who we are going to love back, on similar terms. We may not be
able to change society's prerequisites for loving us, but we can certainly
change those prerequisites for ourselves and those close to us.

If we manage to do that, we won't need to become this or that in order to feel
loved. Then we can do the things that we do because they interest us, or
because they afford us a chance to work with people who interest us, or
because they allow us to be with people we love the way we love ourselves. If
that happens, it won't matter what you do in life, or the lengths of your
shifts. Coz you could be working an 8 to 5 shift, but playing in a local band
with an amazing bunch of friends, to people who love to hear your play. You
could found a start up and do well, and then cash out and quit to go raise a
family. You could be a social worker by day and an open source contributor by
night.

Love yourself.

------
Phemist
If you want to go back to school, do it abroad!! German and Swedish
Universities are basically free, and most if not all master's courses are
taught in English. Cost of living is generally manageable (You can live like a
king in Berlin on the amount you'd loan on average for a uni degree in
States). I cannot stress this enough. Broadening horizons, social circles,
learning new languages and cultures, travel opportunities in weekends. Oh, and
of course learning a new trade. Absolutely worth it.

------
tslug
Your degree is all about making sure you transform a bunch of effort into a
scalar value on a bank's hard drive somewhere which represents your company
net revenue. Put another way, your degree teaches you how to better execute an
extremely lossy compression algorithm which reduces the complex,
multidimensional value of what your company is trying to offer the world down
to a scalar and then evaluates your success based on the magnitude of that
scalar.

If that sounds inherently depressing, that's because it is. Scalar money
commerce is an old hack and a complete wreck that has not kept up with the
times, and you just got a degree in optimizing your endeavors to it.

As grim as that might sound in one sense, in another, you're also one of our
only hopes for getting past scalar money commerce to a better system.

Another way to think of your degree is as a way to isolate the people inside a
company from both the real and the psychological ravages of scalar money
commerce, or what I think any entrepreneur would agree is "the roller
coaster."

This is an extremely noble pursuit if that is your primary goal, as opposed to
focusing on the maximization of that scalar net revenue number. And in fact,
I'd argue that if you make this your goal, the key to treating your depression
will be to find the right group of people worth protecting.

------
ashark
Consider the types of goals you have pursued, what effect these have had on
you, and those you'd like to pursue:

[http://slatestarcodex.com/2016/07/18/pushing-and-pulling-
goa...](http://slatestarcodex.com/2016/07/18/pushing-and-pulling-goals/)

It's becoming neglected at this point, but the archives are solid:
[http://thelastpsychiatrist.com](http://thelastpsychiatrist.com)

Helps one cultivate a little perspective and introspection.

Maybe read Yates' _Revolutionary Road_. TL;DR is that having a self image
and/or dreams that don't match your actual ambition, commitment, and situation
is _fucking poisonous_. Read the novel though, if you've got time.

Think about how you can be happy. Like, what happiness even is or would be for
you. Consider consulting: Marcus Aurelius, Seneca, Epicurus and other
Epicureans, Ecclesiastes. Try Eastern sources if you like, but be aware it's
much harder to sort the wheat from the crystal-healing-easy-zen chaff than it
is with Western works. Don't expect too much with anything short of a
sustained, intense, _difficult_ struggle over _years or decades_ —in other
words, lower your the expectations of what you'll get out part-time work on
material aimed at monks who immersed themselves in this stuff all the time. It
can be _really_ good even just dipping your toes in it, but don't expect magic
or quick solutions—or solutions at all, for that matter.

------
KerryJones
I ran into this last when I was 26 and considered it my "quarter-life crisis".

Unhappy with work, no relationships seemed to be budding, didn't feel I was
making an impact of any sort -- I considered becoming a Tibetan Monk (I was
mapping plane flights).

I found my solution by doing the following:

1) Figure out what I wanted to look back at in the end of my life. What should
I have accomplished?

2) Paid very close attention to anything that made me happy. Do more of that.

3) Find a support network, whether family, friends, or strangers with similar
problems and ideals.

4) Set specific short-term and long-term goals, ones that you will enjoy.

\--------------

1) Involved a new career. I announced to my job I was going to be leaving,
though took my time in actually exiting while I found what I wanted to do.

2) I found I got tremendous amount of happiness from being out doors and
interacting with people. Hiking/camping/yoga helped me a lot.

3) I started paying attention to anyone I knew I could count on.

4) For me, this was finding a business venture that would impact the world
(been dreaming about this since I was 5) -- I've been working (and enjoying)
80-100 weeks because it's what I'm passionate about.

Also... general rule "Production is the basis of morale" \-- but production
has to be something that you feel is production. Working for your company may
not be production. Working on your sci-fi book may be.

------
eevilspock
No one can help you unless they know what you care about. You can't help you
unless you know what you care about.

When you feel deeply happy, what are you doing? What things matter to you so
much that they drive you do work more than anything else?

I dropped out of the EECS program at Berkeley because I felt like you did
doing those studies, but found so much joy and meaning working with children,
in my student job as an child care center teacher's assistant, as a summer
camp counselor for inner city Oakland kids, as a nanny for one year for a
newborn and her one year-old brother. I was determined to go into early
childhood education, to make education better.

I went abroad, got sidetracked, got married, came back to the states in the
middle of the first Dot Com boom, gut sucked into a coding gig, rose rapidly,
made lots of money, but found myself feeling oh so empty again. I finally quit
it all. I've been working on some non-profit projects, which feel meaningful
to me, but still something missing. So I started volunteering to work with
kids. It's been great. Now I'm looking to work with some of New York's 50,000
homeless kids. I'll do it for minimum wage if that is all I get. But I will be
happy. Hopefully I make a bunch of kids happy along the way.

------
timothyh2ster
Hang in there, this will past. Take what makes sense to you from these
comments; they are helpful. However it may seem otherwise, you do not have to
be rich to follow your dreams. You can find a way to jump up out of bed each
morning and say and mean(most days anyway) "I get to do this again today!" If
you do not have a spouse or children, wait on that until you get the work you
want. If you do have family this will work, but with family you are not making
decisions just for yourself; you will need to include them in this process.
The key is to find first what you like. This takes work. We bury what we like
deep inside so we won't be disappointed if we do not get it----but then we do
not get what we really want and nothing is more of a bummer than that. Second,
apply what you like to some work. And third, put the work first, not the money
or the praise, first, because now it is what you really want. This takes
effort and experiment and great willingness, but I have seen it work in so
many people. Finding what you like is not like . or just like preferences; it
is much deeper call to your insides. Learn how to be introspective, how to
look at yourself and your own mind. There is where the answer is to what you
seek.

------
azraomega
I've recently read "Man Search for Meaning" by Victor Frankl. I think it's the
comfort that we live in make us wonder if there's more to it. We don't
struggle with survival anymore. World is now covered by advertisement to urge
population to need more useless things. Things we think are innovations are
really just facilitating those needs - the need for acceptance, attention,
respect, entertainment. Getting bored? get some vines. Lonely? Check Facebook.
We don't really feel better doing those things after a moment. It wears off.
You do it again.

So is education. You get some, then you get some more. So is work, you get a
job, then you get promoted. You know exactly where you are going. You know
exactly how much money you need to live comfortably. Maybe you will find a SO,
get some babies like your mom keep asking you to do. Maybe that's the way to
go. Well, you get to see them for a couple hours before and after work
everyday. Maybe go hippie? Go all kumbaya. Maybe find Jesus? It's a peaceful,
harmonic society. Another day in paradise!

Realize you are not the only one suffering existential crisis. I have no
business giving you advice. All I can say is, I'm in your shoes. All I can
think of is to seize control of my own life. Truly understand something
thoroughly that you are good at and passionate about. Not for your employer,
not for trying to gain attention or respect. Just for you. Take whatever
opportunities you've got to travel, to meet other cultures. There are so many
possibilities, and you will power to choose your own path if you just be
extremely good at something. Know at what point money loses its value. Be good
and go forward.

------
clarry
I think I have a slightly different experience that ends up feeling much like
yours. I got a vocation, got a job, hated it, am quitting it in a few weeks. I
rented another apartment in another town; I'm moving and leaving stuff behind,
family included. For a year now I've been telling myself that I'm going to
study once again but I have the feeling that I can't stand another 5-6 years
eating noodles and accumulating debt, waiting for real life to begin. I really
don't know if I have the motivation to study. Even if I did, and finished my
studies, I'm not optimistic about finding a job I'll like. So would I go back
to square one yet another time?

I really feel like shit. And lost.

I'm thinking of starting a company and just trying to make a living doing
something I like. But past experiences suggest that other people won't like
the things I like enough for me to make a living off of it. Or I just won't
have the time and money to do what needs to be done. Kinda hard to concentrate
and plan on anything that takes longer than a month when you're not sure
whether you'll be able to pay the rent next month...

Did I tell I feel like shit? And lost?

Unfortunately, I've no advice to give you at this point. Good luck.

------
buzzybee
I think my main answer would be - seek to do really ordinary things well.
There are thousands to choose from. You could be interested in dinner parties,
or book bindings, or throwing darts. You don't have to seek power in the
economic and political sense to feel powerful, and it may run counter to your
nature to do so(in any direct way). Those are, in the end, just as ordinary as
the other pursuits, even if we direct more attention at them.

What makes the pursuit worthwhile is in whether it can pull you into doing
something more, externally speaking. You could aim for wisdom, leadership,
sense of community, or any number of other things, and end up building up to
something bigger than you imagined. But you have to make an active effort to
get the ball rolling or the gears turning, to learn the technical details, to
connect with others, to make commitments, arrangements, obligations happen
even when you know they'll stress you out. That's the fundamental difference
between "watching life slide by" (much of my teens and 20's) and feeling like
you are living in the moment.

------
marknutter
You're experiencing what I think a lot of college graduates experience these
days: institutionalization. You no are longer part of a system that tells you
what to do, when to do it, and how well you're doing it, with a promise of a
better future that has no basis in reality, and you're feeling "completely
LOST" as a result. It's normal, and it's curable.

You're asking if there is anything else to life, but likely you haven't
actually experienced a day of _real life_. I think you need to figure out what
life has to offer, and jumping right back into another institution is not the
way to do it. Discover the world, whether by travel or by engaging in your
local community. Meet new people, try new things, and above all, do not
conform. It will not take long for you to discover that life happening all
around you, but you've been sheltered from it. Once you discover real life you
will realize how worthless your Business Administration degree truly is and
laugh about how silly you were for thinking it was so important in the first
place.

------
millebi
It's not surprising that you're not happy with your education, that's a
"general" degree to be an "office pion" (I'm using the unpleasant description
for a reason). What you did was go to school for something/anything that got
you a degree... now you don't know what you want to do (and do with it).
That's backwards thinking. You need to find what you're passionate about and
then get an education for a job that does that. If you don't like being an
office administrator... why get a BA degree? Right? You need to try a number
of jobs, experiment (for not too long, remember you're looking for your
Permanent job... a.k.a. Career) with different jobs. Spend an afternoon and
think about the times you were really happy... is there a job doing that? Is
there a job relating to that? FYI: The age you figured out that "you don't
want to do this anymore" is immaterial, your first step was realizing this
fact. Now do something about it!! and go enjoy your life instead of just
slogging through it.

------
rufus42
It's nice to hear that everyone here (and yourself) are talking about job and
being productive or not.

Maybe it's hard to hear this right away after your major, but a job is just
one part if your life. As someone already wrote, also concentrate on your
private life, your body and social connections.

And, forget that you will be something super special or will feel super
special. You don't have to be Steve Jobs, probably won't be and nobody says
that Steve Jobs was a happy person.

Do what you feel is right for you at the moment, have a couple of good
friends, work out, and maybe look for a job which helps you for your "birds
eye view".

Have a look at Freuds "Über-Ich" [0] and maybe start to listen more at your
emotions than on money and job. Nobody says that both couldn't go hand in
hand, but after leaving a well paid job, starting at a very poor paid one but
with good friends, it's totally worth it.

[0] [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Id,_ego_and_super-
ego](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Id,_ego_and_super-ego)

------
sailfast
You're not alone in feeling this way. In the past, the things that have most
helped resolve the issue is to find a community that inspires you to do
better, to feel better. Your work may not provide this, and society at large
will not provide this - it comes from finding a community. This can be
activity based, religious, goal-oriented - they're all over but they can be
hard to find and some are more welcoming than others but that support network
is amazing.

Find a cause you care about and then find a community service organization
that will help you contribute. Serve food at a soup kitchen. Hack together
civic apps to improve how government serves citizens. If you're inclined
(don't need to be religious / dogmatic) churches can be great communities to
help spur you to think outside yourself, challenge you to be better and
inspire you to find your mission in the world.

Finding that community, that goal outside yourself can be extremely fulfilling
and helps to focus efforts and do good in the world.

------
Ru88
I think feeling lost is a key motivator in life to do things. Do anything.
Sure, it's ok to ask for advice, and it's ok to feel down and overwhelmed...
Just don't let it control you. Go out and help someone in need. It will give
you purpose, but more importantly it will give you perspective on your own
life. You'll find that there are people out there who haven't had the same
opportunities as you and you will have something to give them. Some knowledge,
some advice of your own, or even just someone to listen to. Do one small thing
every day. Read a book. Give something away. If you keep doing these things
something will click and fall into place, and you will be on your way to
filling that void. But actually it's not a void. It's natural for people to
feel alone or lost. Keep your chin up my friend. The sun is about to rise and
will soon shine warmly on your face. RU

------
neilellis
This is known as ennui - and is perfectly normal.

I think there is one solution that works very well.

Do something that benefits others - focus on how you can help others - maybe
go onto one of the Stack Overflow boards and answer some questions. Join an
online community, say in the start up scene, and give advice to others based
on your degree for example.

Remember - this too will pass - the sense of ennui is temporary. Don't equate
what you feel with who you are. This is a temporary feeling - just keep going,
even if you can't see the point. Eventually this feeling will pass and you
will have a huge sense of achievement that you passed through this.

I agree with others, recreational drugs are a definite no-no (alcohol very
much so) you need to keep your mind strong not weaken it.

Speak to your doctor/psychiatrist if this changes from ennui to depression -
it's always good to have support.

My best wishes for you, you can pass through this, just be patient with life
and yourself.

------
soneca
I would travel for a while (6 months _minimum_ , but possibly for years).

You get to know much more about yourself. If you are lost about who you are in
the circumstances you describe, why not change the circumstances completely.

Disclaimer + shameless plug: if you are worried about money for that kind of
traveling, try www.worldpackers.com (where you can exchange work for
accommodation). I work there and I personally know about tons of positive
feedback about how traveling for longer times changed their lives for better.
Obviously, my advice for traveling persists even if not traveling as a
worldpacker. :) Also, I am a personal reference for this kind of power, having
spending 6 months working and living at a NGO for homeless families in
Uruguay, them the same, but for 1,5 months at a NGO for children in Senegal.

My email is in my profile if you want to be put in touch to more people whose
life changed for better by traveling.

------
mfrye0
Yeah I've been there too. I actually had that realization while in college. I
saw my friends a couple years older than me who were graduating, but could not
find jobs, and were going no where.

It took me awhile, but you need to figure out what you want of life. For me at
least, I decided I wanted to help make the world a better place and be in
control of my own life. To create something and not rely on a 9-5 job for a
paycheck. I'm still figuring shit out myself, but I think I learn more by
trying and failing than I would ever learn in school.

Check out James Altucher. I read this a few years ago when I was in a similar
state of mind and this article really struck a chord with me.

[http://www.jamesaltucher.com/2013/12/the-ultimate-cheat-
shee...](http://www.jamesaltucher.com/2013/12/the-ultimate-cheat-sheet-for-
reinventing-yourself-2/)

I'm on year 3 :)

------
bpchaps
The advice I give people is - do things that will make yourself feel
interesting about yourself. Self motivation is the key, but you have to learn
to find it first. Stick your neck out into places that you normally wouldn't
and you'll find that things start coming together.

Where do you live? Depending on the city, it's relatively easy to get involved
in your local government by trying to fix "unsexy", but persistent problems.
It'll get you out into things you normally wouldn't do, it'll get you involved
with your city, you'll feel good about what you're doing, and it's something
you can even put on your resume if you're into that.

"Why has that light been out for two months?" sounds boring at first, but if
you pursue it to a certain depth, you'll start to notice some very interesting
depth. FOIA/FOIL is a great tool for this.

Good luck!

------
tolukareem
I have felt this way too, believe me... "Felt" because I got tired of the
feeling and sent in my resignation. I couldn't keep complaining and feeling
without doing anything about it while time raced. I'm 29 too and we can both
share how we look back and see how quickly everything seemed to happen, our
mates are almost all married!! Or are you married too..? Lol.

Well.. About 7 months later I'm coming across your post in my hacker
newsletter email and I have this to offer you (for your journey will be
different from mine) :

Books: The Miracle Morning by Hal Elrod, The Alchemist by Paulo Coelho, and
the Millionaire Fastlane by MJ Demarco.

Learn as much from your job while you read these and then follow your heart
when you decide to follow the signs.

Your yearning is the beginning. And whenever you're depressed remember Isaiah
40:31 (even though I don't use it.. Lol). The promises really happen.

------
pcglue
Find something that is more suited to you, whether it is another job, or some
entrepreneurial endeavor. For the longest time, I bought into climbing the
corporate ladder. It was making me unhappy and very unhealthy, mentally and
physically. Then I came to the realization that I don't want to be a manager
or an executive or even a tech lead. I just want to be a peon coder. That is
the sum total of my career ambitions. Once I realized this, I changed jobs to
a company that doesn't try to push or promote me into tech lead/management; I
am and remain a mere programmer by choice. And I have never been happier at a
job.

Not saying your ambition should be to be a peon, like it turns out mine is,
but you need to figure out what it is and do something that'll get you there.

------
ChemicalWarfare
There's a rather typical "I kicked ass and got stuff done, now what" syndrome
which happens to just about everyone to a certain degree.

After weeks/months/years of intense concentration and efforts aimed at
achieving a certain goal you're done and that goal is no longer there. This
creates a void in your mind and leaves you wondering "now what?". Happens to
me after every major project go live, sometimes even after a particularly
challenging development sprint.

For me personally the way to "cope" with this is to switch contexts completely
for a couple of days up to a couple of weeks (logistics permitting obv)- go
camping, fishing, skiing, buy a plane ticket to Europe etc etc.

This is not a universal recipe of course but is something that has worked for
me and other ppl I know.

------
Ghassan100
I went through this and yes I've been there. I found that: 1- helping others,
volunteering, the homeless that need us but we constantly ignore, and much
more. There are lots of causes that can give you a profound sense of being,
purpose and go into feeding your own well being. Surprise surprise, we are all
human beings after all and it pays to be less selfesh.

2- find your passion and get the time to follow it and do something about it.

3- It took me a long time to realize; and when I did it was a profound moment
for me; that all it takes to have an impact in the world is just to be me, the
good giving caring me. I don't need to be a superman, nor a celebrity and no
not Elon Musk or any other. Just good old me.

Hope this helps from my heart to you.

------
nathan_f77
I don't know if you'll find this helpful at all, but I can say that I'm
actually happy, and I feel like my life is pretty good so far.

I'm 27 years old, and I've been living in Thailand for the last year with my
wife. I'm doing some contract work for 20 hours per week, sometimes only 10
hours. I spend the rest of my time working on my own projects, either by
myself or with a small team. I love building my own projects, like games and
apps. Eventually I hope to build something that generates enough income to
live and travel without contract work, so that's what I've been working
towards.

I had a big improvement in my happiness recently, when I joined a local improv
group. I decided that I wanted to do some more acting and making films. So
I've made lots of friends, and a group of us are working on a short film,
which has been really fun. I felt like I was a bit isolated before this, since
my wife and I didn't know anyone here, and I was usually working by myself at
home. You might also be able to find some more happiness if you find some
local meetup groups to join, maybe get into a new hobby or activity.

My wife is teaching English in Chiang Mai. We came here so that she could do a
TEFL course, and then they found her a job. A lot of people just do this for a
year or two, as a way to explore a new part of the world. My wife doesn't want
to do it for much longer, and she's starting to study something new.

I started my "career" as an intern at a non-profit organization, and it kind
of ruined me for any jobs after that. I felt like I was working on projects
that actually made a difference and changed people's lives. Not business
software, emojis, or mobile games, but websites that would help people and
businesses donate goods to charities and hospitals around the world. Then I
spent some time at a startup in San Francisco, and I honestly felt like I was
wasting my time, even though they ended up being kind of successful.

You don't have to be an office worker. You don't even have to work 40 hours
per week. You don't have to own a nice house and a car. You don't have to get
married. You don't have to have any kids.

I'm not saying you need to become a full-time volunteer, or teach English in
Thailand, or start your own small business. Take some time and think about all
your options. On the other hand, sometimes it's really hard to get unstuck
unless you make a big change and just do something different for a while.
Maybe you just need to do something crazy.

------
paulpauper
It's easy to dismiss or generalize millennials as lazy or entitled, and maybe
some are, but we're on the same boat together - liberal and conservative, 'alt
right' and 'rationalist-left'. To the girl with the Tumblr page and Instagram
pictures, to the Trump supporter that reads Roosh V, it's authenticity and
shared narratives - whether it's about social isolation and awkwardness,
anxieties about growing up in a difficult economy, or how society neglects its
smartest - that forge common ground among differing ideological tribes and
people that otherwise would have nothing to do with each other.

------
iamaziz
"Life is a journey, not a destination."

~~~
Marcus316
And I just can't tell just what tomorrow brings.

------
blazar
As others have mentioned, you're probably having an existential crisis. This
isn't a bad thing so don't let the uncertainty of all of it bring you down,
this can happen to people multiple times throughout their lives. My suggestion
is to find a place where you can be completely relaxed so that you can think
through and figure out your emotions. Personally, when I need to figure
something major out, I go out on a clear nights sky and smoke a cigar under
the stars. You're the only person that has enough information to figure out
what you need to do, so treat it like every other problem, and think it
through.

~~~
blazar
also, if you aren't already, going to the gym/physical exercise can help
alleviate the frustration that you're probably feeling.

------
podcastrank
What do you mean by being more than just an office person? You can't create an
interesting and compelling career out of nothing. Think carefully about who
you are aspiring to be (this article can help
[http://www.artofmanliness.com/2011/02/08/create-a-life-
plan/](http://www.artofmanliness.com/2011/02/08/create-a-life-plan/)) and act
accordingly.

Some other's mentioned the "War of Art" to read. I would like to add "So good
they can't ignore you" by Cal Newport to read as a starting point for some
guidance.

------
FLUX-YOU
>You have the drive and motivation to get to your destination but once you are
there -- you're left wondering -- "what else could I have done?

Time to pick a new destination. Probably something a little more long-term,
like becoming a C-suite executive or starting a family. It took you 4-5 (or
more) years to get to your first destination. Plan something that takes twice
that amount of time.

If you literally just finished (as in 1-2 months ago), might be worth it to
take a vacation if you can afford it.

You don't even have to settle on a new destination right now, just stay active
physically and mentally. 29 is too young to autopilot your life.

------
subdane
At 29 you're starting to see beyond the ladder you've been taught to climb. Is
a new degree/job/relationship going to fill the void?

When I was in your shoes, I started to ask myself that question. I decided
that the source of my happiness wasn't going to come from the outside world
and that led to an ongoing curiosity about where it would come from. More
here: [https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/out-the-
darkness/201503...](https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/out-the-
darkness/201503/does-happiness-lie-within)

------
Mendenhall
Do whatever you want (that doesnt harm others). Want to do nothing for a year
or two or five, then do it. Want to hang out and drink at 5am and party, then
do it. Want to start a company, then do it. Taste what life has to offer and
grow from it and evolve. Imo you are at the age where you are coming into
yourself and finding out what you want to do. It can be confusing, scarey,
challenging and everything else. I found by doing what I wanted against even
social norms and sometimes at great loss, I learned what it was I really
wanted out of life. Best wishes, there is no wrong answer. Be you!

------
drrectangle
If you don't have a lot of responsibilities then you should do something fun
and risky. Go outside of your routine and get perspective. Go on a crazy trip,
talk to interesting strangers etc. Get off the internet :)

------
DyslexicAtheist
>> _What would you guys do if ya were in my shoes?_

I'd move. felt the same in my home country with 19 and left to Asia for 10
years then back to Europe, then moved around here "locally".

After reading this¹ I'd love to go back to Asia. I miss the food and vibrant
tech community and regional short trips to local crazy/weird/exciting/fun
places. The people I remember the most. If you can you should go! (anywhere,
just go!)

¹
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12137103](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12137103)

------
elmojenkins
I am in your shoes OP, I feel it too. There has to be more to this thing. The
thought of sitting in my office job for the next 30yrs makes me shake.
Seriously. I don't know that I can do it, or that I want to do it.

Bottom line, you need money. How you earn the money is up to you...How much
money you need to 'feel' comfortable is up to you.

If you can get a Masters degree (for free through employer or very cheap), do
it. Bachelors degrees are like high school diplomas, everybody has 'em these
days, and in 10-15yrs you'll want the Masters.

Buy a lottery ticket!

------
arbre
Here are a few thoughts:

\- Starting something new is hard, but it can get better after a while. Be
patient and maybe you'll discover a better side of your job, meet exciting
people etc.

\- Maybe you're not doing what you really like. Try to find what you're really
passionate about and do it.

\- Maybe you need a deeper meaning to your life. For me it was meditation. I
needed that deeper breath in my life and it gives me a lot of joy and hope.
For others it might be traveling the world, family, volunteering... Your
disappointment might be asking for such a change.

------
mathattack
My 2 cents:

Happiness is in the journey, not the company/product/money/measurable.

Happiness is shared with other people, and rarely an individual achievement.

But... Unhappiness can also be chemical reactions in the brain. There's
nothing wrong with seeking help if you're having any kind of emotional issues.
Quite the contrary, it's very admirable to seek out help. And admirable to get
on medication if that's what's needed. If the unhappiness is bad enough, don't
tackle it alone.

------
gthtjtkt
Yes. I always take solace in the knowledge that I could leave all this behind
and go live in a tent in the forest if I wanted to. But even that probably
isn't true because I've never been camping. I'd probably eat some poison
berries and end up like Christopher McCandless.

Working out helps a lot though. So does going outside, especially in natural
environments.

> I feel like I should go back to school but do I really want to rack up all
> that loan?

If you're not sure, the answer is probably 'no'.

------
gamebak
Besides what other guys mentioned, I think what you really lack is a good
focus on a long-term objective. I decided to experiment what I consider a
decent salary to live off monthly, then I've set my goal to retire... before
retirement. To do this I considered how much I would generate from the
dividend in stocks and other assets... there's a lot of reading and planning.

This is one suggestion what you could do, plus you'll put your money to work
for you, not just you for it.

------
smrtinsert
I remember reading about some CFO that was pissed he wasn't getting a CEO job
after two years. I remember thinking why did I just spend two years learning
nodejs.

------
kingkawn
Forget attempting deeper analysis your life needs stimulus. Talk to random
people stunningly (for yourself) openly, do things intentionally in new ways,
introduce a love of coveted disorder, and you will be able to think about your
work life as the person who knows what it takes to keep yourself engaged no
matter he circumstance. That person can lead you to the next good thing better
than any advice or new framework.

------
dep_b
I changed from 8-5 to being a freelancer and it's a pity that I didn't do it
before. I'm very lucky to be a programmer so I have to luxury to safely take a
bet like that given the current demand for (experienced) programmers, but I
think you need to take a risk. Start a business, chase a new career path. Some
people like the security of a job, some people need something else to feel
challenged.

------
Taylor_OD
When I find myself feeling this way its often because I am inadvertently
isolating myself. Are you getting outside? Do you hangout with friends?
Significant other? Dating? I don't rely on other people for emotional support
but being alone all the time without people to talk to isnt healthy and I
believe the case could be made that we are supposed to live in small
groups/pods/tribes.

------
tunnuz
This is not general advice, but since you asked: in your shoes I would move to
Europe and start a Ph.D. (possibly Northern Europe, e.g., Denmark or Sweden,
where you can live very comfortably on a Ph.D. scholarship). There are few
things as inspiring and challenging as pushing the boundaries of human
knowledge. It's also a great way to meet new and inspiring people outside of
your circles.

------
cschep
if you have the freedom.. TRAVEL! couch surf. meet people super different than
you. study their languages. invest in their problems.

eventually you'll find a new thing to do OR you'll be so excited to come back
to your own thing with a ton of wisdom.

step toward your life with open arms and love it. it will love you back.

final piece of advice: this is scary, but the fear lets you know you're still
in the game!*

*stolen quote

------
brentjanderson
I found that choosing to build a family has been the most rewarding decision
I've made, including a couple failed startups and an adequately successful
venture. Learning and growing have always been objectives for me, but the big
picture of learning to be a husband and parent have brought tremendous
meaning, purpose, and vision to my life.

------
kapv89
Someone from IRC gave me an advice for situations like these. It's dangerous
but works rather quickly if you manage to reach the other end. It goes
something like this:

"Do things that'll get you beaten up, killed, or thrown in jail. And if you
are lucky, you'd end up with a lot of money and sex, and a clear idea of what
you want"

------
ruffrey
There have been times when I used a goal as a distraction from other stuff.
When it was completed, I could no longer avoid things.

Other times I have reached a big goal and not been making new goals to
complete next.

In either case, for me the solution involves getting quiet and writing out how
I feel. YMMV, i am fairly introverted and work things out internally.

------
cristaline
You said you are not happy. This will help you:

1) Eat chocolate 2) Sports. Do something outside, even if it is walking 3)
Find a girlfriend or dating 4) Watch a movie 5) Do something exciting every
month 6) Take weekend breaks, go somewhere 7) Sleep 7-8 hours 8) Listen music
during work 9) Imagine yourself in 5 years, make that plan.

------
JSeymourATL
> I'd like to be something...

How do you define happiness and meaning? Pick a path and realize the path may
change, that's OK.

On this subject, Marshall Goldsmith is masterful >
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P7EJfWRv0VA](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P7EJfWRv0VA)

------
jsmith0295
Going back to school for what? I'm doubtful that simply choosing a different
major would make a huge difference. It sounds like what you're looking for is
more of a feeling of control over the work you're doing, and there's plenty of
ways to pursue that without going back to school

------
jpttsn
I'm younger than you, and the many others who joined the chorus here.

I'm curious if you feel that you _had_ a plan, earlier in life. In other words
did you expect to find a clearer purpose after finishing your degree? Or did
you have an idea for the longer term that ended up not working?

------
burdalane
I graduated from college 13 years ago and feel the same way. I've taken an
extremely passive route -- I never even left the college -- and have only
taken the path of least resistance. I learn things on my own, but they're so
unfocused that I don't do anything with them.

------
effectuation
Not sure if this may help, but consider reading this guy's stuff.

[http://thirdwayman.com/letters/why-i-kissed-time-
management-...](http://thirdwayman.com/letters/why-i-kissed-time-management-
goodbye.php?ims=blogaboutpage)

------
gohrt
Make friends at work or at a community hobby/social/religious/whatever group.
connect with people who are into what you are into.

find a mate, start a family, or join a family.

when you are busy, engaged with beautiful/intersting things or good people,
you don't feel stuck.

------
Yhippa
I'd be shocked if there were people on HN that haven't gone through that. I
know that.

I'll be short with my advice: 1) Be open to change 2) Take a risk and try
something different than what you're presently doing

If you can, change before others make you change.

------
neom
[https://medium.com/busyness-time/on-leaving-digitalocean-
and...](https://medium.com/busyness-time/on-leaving-digitalocean-and-what-s-
next-aa94a8f8c082#.wsexm5hkf)

Good courage, much love. <3

------
rebelidealist
Volunteer, someone wise said we are unhappy if we constantly think about
ourselves.

------
thomas2205
Don't feel lost, as said by Mahatma Gandhi...."Strength does not come from
winning, your struggles develop your strengths, when you go through hardships
and decide not to surrender, that is strength."

------
qpwoeirutyzzzz
You were sold a fantasy setting expectations beyond all probability.

Welcome to reality, now it's time to learn to enjoy your life and please try
not to leave a trail of destruction and waste in the process.

------
keeringplastik
What did you do prior to school? Seems there may have been some time between
HS and uni. What was going on that led you to pursue a business field? Why did
you choose business administration?

------
GarrisonPrime
Check out the book "How to Find Fulfilling Work" by Roman Krznaric. Literally
changed my life.

[http://amzn.to/2a2Dz71](http://amzn.to/2a2Dz71)

------
grdeken
Save cash. Travel. Expand your horizons. The answer will come to you.

~~~
smpetrey
Just caught the travel bug recently. I've never felt better.

------
msutherl
This doesn't work for everyone, but my approach this is to ask: what is the
intersection of my unique strengths and the most important problems to address
in the world? In answering this, you quickly discover you need a _philosophy_
, an idea of what future you'd like to see for humanity, and you need to
leverage experiences you've had. A few things I can recommend for starting
this journey:

\- Spend some time familiarizing yourself with your historical context, the
political and economic systems you operate within, and ethics generally

\- Do a broad survey of every single project you can find within your interest
areas. If you're into non-profits, check out the
[http://foundationcenter.org/](http://foundationcenter.org/) library/database.
If you're into startups, spend hours on Crunchbase / Angelist researching
startups. Ask around. Google a lot. Make lists!

\- Consider thinking through a cause prioritization framework. I have some
mostly related to the Effective Altruism community collected here:
[https://www.are.na/morgan-sutherland/cause-
prioritization](https://www.are.na/morgan-sutherland/cause-prioritization).
Bret Victor put together an amazing article re: climate change:
[http://worrydream.com/ClimateChange/](http://worrydream.com/ClimateChange/).
You can probably find other meta-level analyses. When you start to narrow in,
you search for various industry reports, check out bls.gov, etc. and start
getting used to looking for gaps and opportunities at that kind of meta-level.
Note: this information is hard to find and being familiar with it is one of
the main strategic advantages that good leaders have!

\- Spend a good long time, multiple engagements of an hour or so, writing down
what you think your unique strengths and skills are? Ask yourself: what do I
do when I'm procrastinating? What do I find myself doing a lot but that feels
very easy to me? Also ask people you know: "what am I good at?"

\- Don't underestimate serendipity. Reconnect with people from your past. Go
to meetups and networking events (but don't waste your time – scan the list
before and introduce yourself to the people that matter i.e. the organizers).
Explore online communities. Ask your friends if they know people that they
think you should know and get the intro.

Ultimately: take a structured approach to solving this problem. Eventually
you'll uncover and opportunity that you can't turn down. But don't forget the
research you've done because soon enough you'll be back at square one! Welcome
to the future!

------
SuperChihuahua
Find a side project! I felt the same and decided to write a book and make a
few games and other applications. I've never felt stuck since I began those
projects.

------
ktRolster
"To ease another's heartache is to forget one's own" \- Abraham Lincoln

Life isn't about work.....work is what you do so you can afford what you want.

------
Deckard256
Do something completely different. Go on a road trip. Join an art collective.
Volunteer to help others. Perspective comes from contrast and new experiences.

------
lucg
Congrats for your degree!

My 2 cents:

1\. You are not your work. You are not what you do.

2\. Do what you like/love and make sure to do it with other people.

3\. Don't do things to be successful in the eyes of others.

------
swsieber
Find ways to serve (as in give service).

Acting for others welfare will buoy you up. And I wouldn't be surprised if it
led to more fulfilling work opportunities.

------
napperjabber
Find something from your childhood that you wanted to do, but didn't because
of what ever reason. For me, it was learning Japanese.

------
Deckard256
Do something completely different. Go on a road trip. Join an art collective.
Volunteer to help others. Perspective comes from contrast.

------
rikelmens
\- What else is there to life?

Read Tao Te Ching and if you really understand what Tao is - you will know the
answer to your question.

With love I wish you good luck!

~~~
fluxquanta
I've found a lot of personal comfort in trying to follow the Tao, but at the
risk of sounding pedantic it's impossible to "understand what Tao is", and to
suggest understanding is possible goes against the Tao itself.

------
blairanderson
I was in similar shoes(business school and bored and boring desk/email/sales
job).

decided to go to a code school.

It changed my life.

Would do again.

------
rimutrees
Any work is awesome when you work with cool people - maybe find some folk you
want to work with.

------
Practicality
Build friendships, have life experiences. It will make you always eager for
the next experience.

------
jaybee123
Keep your head up and stay strong

------
virken2
i am in your shoes - so I'm going to Guyana as a volunteer to fly an air
ambulance - pretty sure that 90+ degree days, malaria, zika, piranha, sick and
injured people - will all help me to feel less stuck :-)

~~~
kaybe
Suriname was surprisingly good for my health, something about the air I think.
Now if I could only find more people to send me on short scientific errands
around the world..

Safe flying! How long are you staying?

------
iamneiltyson
Try watching "the cosmos" show on Netflix. Something can click .

------
pnathan
You have two basic tasks: maintenance and improvement.

(1) pay debt. Pay rent. eat. exercise. this is self-care stuff. It's
foundational to well-being. Fail at it, and you're going to be getting into
serious problems.

(2) While you're managing self-care, focus on the vector you're going. Where
do you _want_ it to go? Not where do your parents want, your elders want, your
friends what. What do you, the individual want? Write it down. Consider the
regularly for, say, 4-6 months. I.e., enough time to cycle through personal
emotional states. Ask yourself if what you want conflicts with your self. It's
not always going to be coherent. Then start setting your hand to that in your
free time.

If what you genuinely want is to conform, or to not, to be family-oriented, or
not: that's generally okay.

Some things to consider doing and learning, while you quest for finding
yourself occurs:

\- Religion is traditionally the touchstone for meaning and making sense for
humanity. While atheism is a rising tide, it doesn't cohere at all with
humanity's history. You should engage with religious beliefs. I am a Christian
and would advise to look here first ( ;-) ); there's also, in my opinion, a
lot of wisdom in Judiaism and Zen Buddism. As a subpoint, a
pastor/priest/rabbi is, theoretically, a specialist in answering "what is the
point of it all".

\- In the West, philosophy started as a non-theistic set of questions about
what constituted good, the good life, etc. You might find Socrates to be an
excellent read. IMO most of Western philosophy has been spent responding to
Socrates in some form - he started the conversation.

\- Spend time outside; not exercising, but existing in the natural world.
National forests etc. This is the substrate where civilization has been
embedded. It matters, deeply.

\- Start a few food plants in pots and tend to them; eat the produce. Learn
about them. The cycles of nature underpin our bodies and our minds.

\- Take up an art - music, painting, sculpture, etc. Spend time learning about
traditional art and its history. Art is one of the few timeless things in
history. Lives are poured out here; it's well to understand it.

\- Spend time with your parents and extended, if possible. Most people derive
at least some meaning from family. If you have siblings on speaking terms, now
is a good time to strengthen your relationship.

\- If you have a SO, I'd advise holding off on a kid. Get your head
straightened out a bit before giving the kid your problems. :-S

\- School is best considered as a means to an end. Loans are murder on
choices, since they force you to choose high-paying jobs and limit your
ability to do risk.

~~~
humanrebar
> Religion is traditionally the touchstone for meaning and making sense for
> humanity.

Agreed. This is a real-life example of Ecclesiastes, an amazing book for
cynics, skeptics, and people dissatisfied by practical advice.

The punchline of Ecclesiastes is complex but its:

1\. There's not really a point where you are fully satisfied with the things
the world offers. Nothing works: money, relationships, power, health,
accomplishments, family, charity, even religion.

2\. But the world was made to be enjoyable. Enjoy life. Have friends. Eat good
food and drink good wine when you can.

3\. Points 1 and 2 conflict a bit. Ecclesiastes doesn't really resolve the
tension, but Christian theologians and philosophers say that Christ and the
Gospel square that circle. As in, stop looking for tricks and start trying to
figure out who God is and what He wants. Because it's about that relationship,
not about habits, actions, or fine tuning our endocrine systems.

Anyway, that's a bit of a philosophical digression, but I think most of this
practical advice about exercise, travel, friends, family, etc. is OK and well
received, but in the end it just delays the existential crisis a little later.

~~~
pnathan
I was thinking of Eccl., but wanted to be a bit more generic.

------
iamneiltyson
Try watching the Cosmos show on Netflix. Something may click you.

~~~
daveloyall
You chose an interesting nickname, within the context of your comment. Tell
me, are you anyone else, too? :)

------
rhowells
I would check out garyvaynerchuk.com and get motivated.

------
DiffEq
9 times out of 10...if you did not major in Engineering or Science, Law, or
Medicine then you should not be going to college. It is a waste of money and
most importantly time.

~~~
legodt
Knowledge can have inherent value, and not all countries have the same sky-
high college price tags that many privately owned US institutions do. College
as career training is a relatively new concept, and not a very solid one at
that. Skills can be trained, but higher education can bring much deeper
qualities to students. Philosophy, fine art, and other humanities may not be
direct paths to employment, but they will make a more well-rounded, world-
exposed candidate.

If you are posting from a country with cost-restrictive higher education
though, I can empathize with your perspective.

~~~
keeringplastik
To be fair, getting a degree in business administration is basically asking
for a soul crushing corporate desk job.

~~~
legodt
I'm with you 100% on that one, although sometimes an MBA is the easiest route
to a higher pay grade without leaving a company.

------
rhowells
Check out garyvaynerchuk.com and get motivated.

------
hariis
Figure out a way to serve others

------
dmfdmf
Society puts a lot of pressure on people to follow the social norm; go to
school, get a degree, find a job, work the day, get a spouse, buy a house,
have 2.4 kids (whatever the average is today), save for retirement, grow old
and die. The only mandatory step is the last one.

Based on my observations some people are happy on this path and some people
are not, for a myriad of reasons. You are on step 3 and now thinking "wait a
minute, is this what I really want?". (Consider yourself lucky to have this
question now and not on step 5 or 6 which is a disaster). With out knowing who
you really are, what you believe and what you want to do with your life you
will be unmotivated, disinterested and ambivalent in your actions. It also
leaves you open to falling in with a bad crowd, doing drugs, drinking or
mindless sex, etc. as a substitute for a fulfilling life.

Nobody can answer the question of what will make you happy and unfortunately
the schools do virtually nothing to help young adults actually achieve
adulthood, which I define as being epistemologically independent, i.e you must
set aside social and family pressures and think for your self and decide what
YOU want to do. Thinking is a solitary act. You stand apart from society and
process information, decide what is true and false or right and wrong. When
you are done you can share your results with others (to share what you have
learned or to get help if you get stuck) but you can't share the process, it
is strictly yours. In today's world, finding solitude and being alone is
become harder to achieve. Society actually is suspicious of loners but, at
root, a thinker is a loner. Many people (the most unhappy as I can tell) are
actually afraid being alone. Here is a good article on the subject
[https://theamericanscholar.org/solitude-and-
leadership/#.VUc...](https://theamericanscholar.org/solitude-and-
leadership/#.VUcKaJNfalf) but I would argue that being a good follower
requires solitude too. We can't all be leaders but a follower must still think
to wisely choose who to follow.

With that long preface here is my advice;

1) Read that article I referenced above and reevaluate how "connected' you are
with social media, forums, email, smart phones, etc. Maybe its time to take a
break and be alone for a bit. Take a short vacation, a cabin in the woods or
at the lake and completely unplug and be alone with your thoughts without
interruption for a few days. Become comfortable with your self. Alone.

2) Read Ayn Rand's books "The Virtue of Selfishness" and "Philosophy Who Needs
it" and ignore the social pressure to dismiss her out of hand without actually
reading what she said. Think for yourself and decide if her ideas are true or
false. Ignore everything she wrote on politics, its a distraction to your
current problem.

3) Start writing a daily journal. You can't understand your self if your
thoughts, feelings, emotions, motivations are all floating around in your head
without clear identification and analysis. If you do only one thing on my list
do this.

------
Jugurtha
I'm in a somewhat similar situation. Almost 29, graduated as an Electronics
Engineer two years ago. I've been through many problems and it took 9 years to
complete. I might be stupid and stubborn not to do something else, but I
wanted to do it.

I live in a country where, when I wanted to buy electronics parts online
(because they weren't available here), they were stuck in customs and I was
asked to provide documents from college to attest I was an Electronics
Engineering student, and to get that document, I had to brawl because the
college administration lost my document and I had to persist to get them to
find it. I mean, even finding someone to make a quality PCB, I had to look
very hard because there seems to be one shop that does it (in a city of 5
million people). Buying online required a MasterCard and getting one alone was
challenging (challenging enough I started a blog and wrote an article to
inform people how to get one. More than 200,000 visitors and 700 comments in
two years). So it may seem like whining for a lot of people, but there are so
many things people take for granted you have to fight for and waste a lot of
time to find here.

My friend is a dental surgeon with quite a lot of success. Yesterday, he was
telling me how prosthetics and other things that cost like +2000 Euros in
Europe cost about 200 Euros here. Naturally, I asked him why aren't there
foreigners who come here if the deal is that good. He said unless they
teleport, go to the dentist, and teleport back again to their country, the
deal isn't that good. There's no "Healthcare tourism logistics". Hotels are
crappy and expensive, non-crappy hotels are expensive, visas take forever, and
the logistics that would make it a bargain are just not there yet. It'd cost
the same.

One of the main problems is the country has negative economic complexity. We
don't make things and it makes for systemic problems.. There's no electronics
industry, too much bureaucracy. I was to be hired by a big oilfield services
company that'd offer training and a stamp of approval on my résumé for
subsequent jobs, but they had problems and downsized and I wasn't hired.
Social proof is powerful: you weren't hired before, so we won't hire you.

You'd read on job offerings, it's either companies that require 5+ years
experience, or companies accepting junior/entry level/recent graduate and once
you check the requirements, the stack is huge (Mastery of C, C++, JAVA, .NET,
Python, Web development, Oracle, Cisco certified) for an entry level job of a
recent graduate. Without training provided.

I started programming since I was 9 years old, disassembled software at 14 to
unlock their potential, but have done it intermittently in a variety of
languages (from BASIC to x86 assembly to Python) and touched a lot of things,
but haven't stuck to just one single thing I can be an expert in. So
naturally, I get interested in Python and try to do a project in it, I hit a
roadblock in that project, I do a second project in Python and maybe let it
go. I'm also interested in other things. By the time there's something up, my
skills have diminished and I'm not "operational right now". I know a bit about
a lot and would know where to start to learn something specific, but it just
doesn't fly with companies today.

From an employer's perspective, I'm just a 29 year old with no experience.
Time flies and it gets harder both financially and morally. Companies other
than multinationals offer salaries that don't even cover transportation. I
think about projects and ideas and started working on a few which didn't work
out. I won't lie to you: after all those problems and the zero accomplishment
I have to show for at 29, it takes me mustering every ounce of mental strength
not to break down and face reality every single day. It's hard to resist
letting yourself go into accepting you're a loser when you check every
criteria and every single one of them just saps your self esteem.

It could always be worse, though. So hang in there. I read, think, and learn
about a lot of things. I help my friends, I try to spend some time with the
family. I try to improve in any way I can (whether time management or
cognitive skills, and recently on problem solving for I have a problem :) ).

------
paulpauper
The next step, typically, is to get a job. Whether that will create meaning in
life, hard to know.

------
meric
Tao Te Ching

------
jonnycache
Hey I am 25 live in the Uk for some context however relevant right I think I
know exactly what your feeling and I hope the answer I share lifts all anxiety
and ushers in peace.First off congratulations on finishing I can imagine it
was tough to complete but you did it! Secondly forgive me for any punctuation
or grammar mistakes I'm writing this from an iPhone as it's late here laptops
off and I'm reading hacker news before bed.

So you've played the game of life and at the end when we all believed
education lead to success we realise we have been bamboozled. The "feeling
lost" is because of this, you felt somewhere on a subconscious level that if
you achieved this thing then it would secure you potentially financially or
more so directionally as in it would lead you to the next step.What is evident
is that it hasn't and the reason why or part of the reason is that we have not
taken the time to truly get in touch with our true self the self that wanted
to be a artist but through social pressures or the need to conform like a pre
commenter put we have ignored that sentiwnt skill shouting within saying our
true desires until it became a whisper and then a faint cry.This was
reinforced by the fact that in school we know in X months time we will receive
a result dictating our progression to the next level or path this gets
repeated a fair number of times if you add up each exam each year up until
college (your equivalent to university) so we develop a carrot and stick
approach believing that the next thing will be better / progression and thus
drawing is closer to this ever elusive victory. It's a lie the wizard is just
a man being a curtain.In deadling with the going back to school premise you
mentioned I wouldn't if the reason was based on fear I.e scared of not wanting
to be a jobless person and so we go to what we have known all our life that
being education.If after months of mulling you honestly thought that this
would allow you to feel fulfilled and was your calling then by all means go
back to school.

Being more than a 9-5 \---------------------- Being more than a 9-5 that
emotion your feeling is your inner self the one you quieted earlier in your
life (for those that jumped to here please read prior to this it's mentioned
above ) that knows what you want and has always known.You are more but you've
played a game which teaches you to compete,quiet this type of self reflection
and expressiveness ,not be creative and not to go against the system which
churns out people that are meant to think a certain way. Your emotions are
powerful they are actually indicators to whether your flowing with life or
against it ,the true nature of humans is joy when I code or solve a problem or
workout or write an observation I feel joy I don't feel resistance.The
resistance your feeling is your inner senses telling you that something is not
right we are not flowing.

So what are you trying to tell me?That I can dodge bullets?
\----------------------------- Lol excuse the title I know when I get on a
prose like this it can come across stoic and impractical so I just took the
matrix quote as neo was feeling the same thing when answering Morpheus.

What I would do or better yet what I have done ...the first year of uni I felt
the same thing lost and I was just staring at my impending doom.So what I did
is this: -Be grateful you finished a huge degree and maybe through your
humility (which I respect)you didn't mention the joy or thankfulness of
completing that .When your constantly grateful you rarely feel jealously or
hate as your just grateful with being/existing.

-Don't give this a heavy weighting.This is just a situation no different than breaking a nail because it involves your life you may feel overwhelmed and therefore make rash decisions so treat this as anything else a momentary situation that has a solution that will come to you as the observation of something missing is the first step to finding it.

-Get honest with yourself what are you about do you like business or did you just do it as the prospectus of a reputable company sounded good? it sounds like your a very social person who wears their heart on their sleeve so maybe there's a talent you can leverage.Whatever it is find it.

-Take some time out anytime you feel lost its just a sign that we may be off track from our inner compass so maybe 2 weeks away if not possible then maybe a weekend away with just yourself.The reason I stress just you is because you need to get in tune with yourself which is achievable in quiet space so that you can hear that inner murmur of what you want to do turn into a roar.Note this isn't running away from the problem the problem exists within you,your going away to break the habitual ways of your life which have potentially got you into this chasing the elusive carrot activity.

-Remove the ego now there's people who are lawyers my because it was their God given talent but because it "paid well" this is ridiculous understand the need for pecuniary stability but for me to do something that's not aligned with what I believe to be my calling is not only fake but ridden with stress and unfulfillment and you can see that with 1 in 5 multi million dollar CEOs being depressed.So kick the ego if your inner self says you should be a dog walker then be a dog walker walk dogs with grace and poise and I guarantee you won't feel judgement or even care for what people say as you will be fulfilled you have a business degree so maybe you can make a business out of It why not .Taking a pause from social media may help you during this phase as social media flashes information that not only can trigger you to keep up with the Jones' but also harbours a competitive mindset which will have you doing things you don't want to do just to appear a certain way to your peers.

-meditate for 15 minutes twice a day the reason for this is that you need to still that mind I can imagine right now it's busy telling you all sorts of lies like people think I'm a failure in lost ,I wasted my life all these are lies and it's just the self which has always had a carrot at the end of the year waking up to find that there's no carrot coming this time as education is over.In stilling the mind your able to gain connection back to the inner self which is the true self.

-exercise more or start this is just the ying and yang ,night and day to meditation tiny Robbins says fear which you may feel is a physically thing so get the body fit as well as the mind.

Finally I would urge you to consider this most time we feel lost or stressed
or self defeating its because we have attached our self to a thing ... Take
this, you eat a banana but you would never say you are a banana as that is
ridiculous,but look at this you meet people and the first thing they say is
I'm insert your job here and Pause for admiration.You are not your current
situation the fact that you feel lost only once finishing your degree is
potentially down to the fact that during your degree you was a student you
associated with being a business student and it gave you a blanket and some
direction till all you was ,was a student .Now your not a student you have
lost that and hence feel lost but the truth was you wasn't a student that was
just what you were doing it wasn't the entire being that is you.

I am not saying be nothing and go the Himalayas and meditate for 15 years.Have
goals it's fine my goal is to grow spiritually physically and Mentally in all
ways possible I'm no fool we live in the weatern world so some goals cater to
the ways of this society but above all I have spiritual goals to ensure
whatever I attain I feel fulfilled and counter intuitively can live without as
just being gives me joy.Start tuning into your self and as you pay attention
to your self through )taking care of the self through the methods above )then
the self will communicate more clearly with you and I know for sure the path
will be clear.

------
csydas
It's hard to advise without sounding cliche. It sounds a lot like you just
aren't sure what makes you happy. You don't have to answer to anyone but
yourself when it comes to your happiness[1], so first off, don't think that
there is anything you're supposed to be: you don't have to be an office
worker, a millionaire, a philanthropist, an athlete, or anything you don't
want. You have no obligation to be happy, or sad, or excited, you should just
learn to be content with yourself, and if you're not, to find out what it is
that you'd like different. Not because someone else says you should, or you
think you should because of something you read, but something you think you
really like. It's the same concept behind people trying to lose weight or get
into an exercise regime - if you're not doing it for yourself, you are going
to burn out.

Take some time and just figure out what it is that makes you feel content,
what's close to your ideal self. When you picture yourself in your mind's eye,
what do you like about you? What don't you like, and wish were better?

Everyone has little things they wish they could change, but just make sure
you're making the changes for you, not to impress others. Be happy for
yourself first more than anything.

If the prospect of 8-5 doesn't appeal to you, figure out what would. A lot of
us don't really know what we want to do aside from real general vague
thoughts. That's the status quo, I think - driven people who have a specific
goal and focus are pretty uncommon, and many are directed by their peers.

Give it time - you're only 29, it's not like you're one foot in the grave. I'm
30 and I've been winging it since I was 18 and went to college. By chance I
found out I understood technology really well, and without having taken a
single technology course, I've learn tons about all levels of infrastructure
just by showing employers I could learn. This took me across the US, from a
meager support role to a managerial role at a University, and then from there
to China and to Russia with my partner. I still don't know what I want to do,
but I do enjoy where I am and who I'm with. I'm happy with my health (mostly),
happy with what my partner and I get to do for fun (ballet, opera, music,
dancing, biking), and I'm learning every day. None of this would have happened
if many years ago, I hadn't taken a good look at my life and realized I liked
nothing about it. I was out of shape, in a miserable relationship that was
leading to marriage, and was about to take office work because I thought I had
to - I took a long time to focus just on getting myself to a nice spot,
finding what _I_ wanted, and then moving outward towards bigger pictures.

I'm not saying pack up and move to Russia; but what I am saying is figure out
what it is you want for yourself. Be a little selfish. (Note: this doesn't
mean stop caring about others, it just means that you take some time to really
focus on yourself, getting yourself to a state where you are happy) The world
is a pretty wonderful place with a lot of cool people, and it's always
changing. Find something that works for you, cause I'm sure it's out there.

[1] = though, please make sure your happiness isn't straight up hurting
others...

------
tajen
I felt that way when I started my first job after a master of IT. I was meat
sold to companies, I didn't have leadership because I was a total junior, and
I didn't have weight to negotiate.

For the next 10 years, I have remained quite depressed. I have done many cool
things [1]. The core of the problem is understanding that, as opposed to nice
stories we study, we've understood that those startups don't "change
humanity", and 99.9% of us, despite excellent curriculum, will never have the
leverage to do what Elon Musk is doing.

As The Doc says: "I'll focus on the other great mystery of Humanity: Women".
Don't take it literally, but he means that getting a significant other,
becoming meaningful to the people around you, while keeping your health,
developing your wealth and casting your ethic and your culture: That's what
life is about. The job is only a part of that.

So go find the best job you can, and exercise a little every day to become the
best at it. Meanwhile find friends. Develop a network, across the globe, but
also in your country, and in your city, through all layers of population. One
day visit your local detention center with the family of an inmate, another
day set up the Internet for an elderly person. Offer big presents and organize
things for your nieces. You'll be a cog like you would have been if you
focused only on work, but you'll be a leader in your community.

[1] I stayed 8 months in my first country, came back for a job at home where I
stayed 2.75 years, left for backpacking in Australia, 6 months, +2.5 years in
an awesome job over there. Came back and created my product, became self
employed. People now look up at me and ask me for advice. But it's not a
secret that I'be been depressed all along the way.

------
h_o
Yes. I did a masters in computer science, and realised I do not want to be an
office person either. It doesn't make me feel fulfilled. I want to actually
help people, not help companies make money. I since started studying again and
did the medical school entrance exam equivalent in my country and got a
borderline acceptable score on my first go. I find out early August I have a
place or not starting September (4 more years of studying).

------
igorgue
Read more, seriously do.

It's quite easy for us (I'm 29 too) to get too caught up into the idea of
happiness we see on the news or all the public stories we know.

Many people you admire were what could be considered a failure at 29, but
that's not newsworthy, we always love the young ones, that they've figured out
everything by the time they're 23 or less (12?). That's not true for most
people, and doesn't mean you won't find happiness in the near of far future.

That's what helps me to get some perspective. Also know that regardless of how
successful you are your life impacts way more people than what you think.

It's tough, and it's something you'd have to experience I think many times in
your life.

------
hackaflocka
Expectations.

We are prisoners of expectations imposed on us.

On Omid Kordestani's twitter, I read the following: In the first 5 minutes of
your life they give you a name and a religion, and you spend the rest of your
life trying to defend both.

Think about the implicit expectations imposed on you by the labels you are
associated with (your "family", your "friends", your degree, etc.). And tell
yourself that it's okay if you don't meet those expectations, and instead
achieve something else.

Plus: don't drink, have lots of hobbies.

------
zeroer
> I can ask my brother for money > we have a trash relationship

Do you have a trash relationship because you've asked him for money too many
times?

~~~
MichailP
This comment just irritated the hell out of me. Who are you to pass judgement
on people you don't know? Like we all live in a just universe [1], and
everything bad that is part of your life is your fault, including bad
relationships with people.

[1] [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Just-
world_hypothesis](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Just-world_hypothesis)

~~~
sirrocco
He asked a valid question and passed no judgment. You seem to have a chip on
your shoulder.

~~~
thinkharder
That's not a question, it's a textbook example of the complex question
fallacy, which is dishonest rhetorical trickery. Also useful if you just want
to insult someone but pretend you're asking a question. If a person was just
interested in the guys relationship with his brother, they'd ask "how come
your relationship with your brother is so trash?", without the loaded
accusation at the end.

It's the same category as "so, have you stopped beating your wife yet?"

------
scribblegenius
Happiness can only be found within the Self. Not anywhere outside. Meditate an
hour a day and more your inner condition as you go. Heartfulness.org

~~~
deepcell
There is one real choice here. Agree with the meditation, it will make beings
realize the truth (most people are afraid to know the truth within them). We
human beings are all (without exception) trapped (I prefer this term instead
of enslaved) in the cycle of `Samsara` (loop), but there is a way to break
free from this machine, and `Meditation` is the key.

