

Defensive Gun Use (Including Data from Studies) - chatmasta
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defensive_gun_use

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xherberta
Quoting from the wiki... "Criminologist Marvin Wolfgang, who described himself
"as strong a gun-control advocate as can be found among the criminologists in
this country" and whose opinion of guns was "I would eliminate all guns from
the civilian population and maybe even from the police. I hate guns--ugly,
nasty instruments designed to kill people" defended Kleck's methodology,
saying "What troubles me is the article by Gary Kleck and Marc Gertz. The
reason I am troubled is that they have provided an almost clear-cut case of
methodologically sound research in support of something I have theoretically
opposed for years, namely, the use of a gun in defense against a criminal
perpetrator". He went on to say that the NCVS survey did not contradict the
Kleck study and that "I do not like their conclusions that having a gun can be
useful, but I cannot fault their methodology. They have tried earnestly to
meet all objections in advance and have done exceedingly well.""

He deserves credit for recognizing his personal bias.

Here is Wolfgang's 1995 paper, "A tribute to a position I have opposed."
[http://scholarlycommons.law.northwestern.edu/cgi/viewcontent...](http://scholarlycommons.law.northwestern.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=6854&context=jclc)

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jgeorge
Kudos to him for recognizing his personal bias and also to not allow it to
color his views of research. This is a hot button topic for many on both sides
of the issue, and it's rare to see someone - even in the research field - who
is capable of respecting a logical conclusion that disagrees with their
personal bias.

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chatmasta
I submitted this because I was taken aback by the numbers (would link direct
to study, but they're in book form). From the article:

> Higher end estimates by Kleck and Gertz show between 1 to 2.5 million DGUs
> in the United States each year.

> Middle estimates have estimated approximately 1 million DGU incidents in the
> United States.

> Low end estimates cited by Hemenway show approximately 55,000-80,000 such
> uses each year.

Of course, this does not mean that 55,000+ incidents _required_ the use of a
gun, but rather that a gun was actually used in defense.

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xherberta
I thought NPR's piece on Harper High in Chicago was an interesting look into a
culture where, despite strong gun control laws, many young people feel it's a
necessity to carry guns for defense. Do they NEED guns? I don't know, but how
do you convince them that they don't? What would motivate these kids to disarm
when they know the people they're afraid of are possessing/carrying firearms
illegally? (Ironically, the gun laws cause people to keep their guns in
abandoned buildings and under bushes, where kids can and do find them.)

[http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-
archives/episode/488/h...](http://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-
archives/episode/488/harper-high-school-part-two) (Act 3 in particular looks
at how kids obtain guns)

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JoeAltmaier
Also, defensive gun use rates are extremely sensitive to the rate of concealed
carry permits, which are largely independent of the rate of criminal acts.
Comparing the DGU/crime numbers is apples and oranges. In fact one can argue
that at some larger rate of gun carrying, criminal acts would dramatically be
reduced by DGU.

