
The U.S. government is set to borrow nearly $1 trillion this year - enraged_camel
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2018/02/03/the-u-s-government-is-set-to-borrow-nearly-1-trillion-this-year/
======
mobilefriendly
This article takes up Democratic party talking points by framing the
government's massive borrowing jump from $519 to $955 billion as caused by the
tax cuts. Yet the "blunt" CBO report the WaPo cites actually says just $136
billion in revenue loss is from the tax cut. So there's $300 billion in new
borrowing that's simply from runaway spending. So for the entire $955 billion
projected deficit next year, just 14% will be from the recent changes in tax
law.

~~~
rgbrenner
The 519 is a typo or something. The deficit last year was 666B:

[https://www.marketwatch.com/story/us-ends-
fiscal-2017-with-6...](https://www.marketwatch.com/story/us-ends-
fiscal-2017-with-666-billion-budget-deficit-2017-10-20)

So 955B is an increase of ~290B.. so roughly half of the increase is from the
tax cut.

~~~
mobilefriendly
No, we're already in fiscal 2018 as the baseline, the trillion dollar
projection is for 2019.

~~~
rgbrenner
The article says 955B for this year 2018. 666B was for 2017.

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axau
The title is not very useful; this quote gives some context: “It's the highest
amount of borrowing in six years, and a big jump from the $519 billion the
federal government borrowed last year.”

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matte_black
If the interest rate on this borrowed money is lower than inflation it makes
perfect sense to borrow money as the money that will be used to pay the loan
off in the future will be worth less and less.

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crooked-v
The Republican motto: "fiscal conservatism, except when it's us in charge".

~~~
athinggoingon
Obama added $9.3 trillion to the debt, more than any other president. That's
an average of about 1.2 trillion a year.

On January 20, 2009, when he was sworn in, the debt was $10.626 trillion. On
January 20, 2017, when he left, it was $19.947 trillion.

~~~
heimidal
It’s quite convenient to present those numbers without context.

In the context of prior performance and international circumstances, Obama
brought the deficit down from the end of the Bush era as a recession began to
recover, but the first few years required clear action. Trump, meanwhile, is
going to drastically increase the deficit during an economic boom.

It should be obvious that Obama’s deficits were strategically necessarily
while Trump’s coming deficit makes no financial sense.

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chiefalchemist
It's 2018. Framing this as political (i.e., party v party) is naive. Both
parties continue to bloat the budget. Different spin and rhetoric. Same ends.

In either case:

"We spend more on our military than the next eight nations combined."

Obama SOTU 2016

The rest is obvious.

~~~
Latty
I mean, the Republicans have been claiming to be "the party of fiscal
responsibility". Lying may be common in politics, but are we really at the
point we just give up and stop even commenting on it?

Also, while the Democrats may have still run a deficit, they _were_ reducing
it. It's not good, but to claim equivalence seems counter-productive. Claiming
they "bloated" the budget when they cut the deficit (roughly) in half (not
accounting for inflation) seems to be straight up misleading.

Not to even start with _how_ that money is being spent/where it comes from (or
not, as the case may be).

~~~
chiefalchemist
Right. War is Peace. Freedom is Slavery. They BOTH generate misinformation
while the masses claw and beg for basic service provided at reasonable value
(i.e., the taxes to waste and corruption ratio is reasonable).

Meanwhile, while everyone is sucked in the (Mad Magazine) spy v spy ruse the
money bubbles to the top - regardless of which side is promising the
otherwise.

Actions speak louder than words. Why anyone listens to, let alone trusts, a
politician is beyond me.

~~~
Latty
That sure sounds like a rationalisation to not bother.

Sure, I don't dispute the current system has huge flaws. It is the system we
live under, however, and trying to change that system doesn't require not
participating in it.

There is an obvious least-bad. It may not be everything I want, but it goes
from people I care about suffering seriously to not seeing as much progress as
I'd like. I'll take that every time, while also pushing for more serious
reform.

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Mikeb85
With current economic growth and expected growth from the tax cut as well as
low rates, it only makes sense to borrow.

Also, 'borrowing' in this sense means selling lots of bonds with a very low
face rate. People still gladly buy them...

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xbmcuser
Well if you look at the last 30-40 years. Republicans talk about improving
economy, lowering taxes and small government the deficit balloons up.
Democrats talk about increasing healthcare, other social services and
increasing taxes the deficit comes down and the economy actually improves.

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ggm
State borrowing is fine. It's where it's spent and what they chose to ignore
which worries me.

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fao_
Meanwhile, in india: [http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-
india-42899402](http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-india-42899402)

India's GDP: "The Gross Domestic Product (GDP) in India was worth 2263.79
billion US dollars in 2016."[0]

America's GDP: "The Gross Domestic Product (GDP) in the United States was
worth 18624.48 billion US dollars in 2016."[1]

[0]:
[https://tradingeconomics.com/india/gdp](https://tradingeconomics.com/india/gdp)

[1]: [https://tradingeconomics.com/united-
states/gdp](https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/gdp)

Your system is massively inefficient.

~~~
matt4077
As percentage of GDP, India is running a deficit more than twice as high as
the US (6.6% vs 2.8% over the last ten years).

But those numbers are meaningless for proving or disproving "inefficiency".
The US is obviously getting far better infrastructure/education/welfare
system/research/military/etc.

~~~
fao_
> The US is obviously getting far better infrastructure/education/welfare
> system/research/military/etc.

Is it?

Research is on shaky ground:

[http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2017/03/data-check-us-
governm...](http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2017/03/data-check-us-government-
share-basic-research-funding-falls-below-50)

[https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/dr-no-
money/](https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/dr-no-money/)

[https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2017/03/trump-
bu...](https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2017/03/trump-budget-cuts-
science/519825/)

[http://theconversation.com/men-get-most-of-the-research-
fund...](http://theconversation.com/men-get-most-of-the-research-funding-its-
a-serious-problem-for-women-and-science-85469)

[https://www.vox.com/2016/7/14/12016710/science-challeges-
res...](https://www.vox.com/2016/7/14/12016710/science-challeges-research-
funding-peer-review-process)

Welfare system is failing:

[https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2014/09/29/our-i...](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2014/09/29/our-
infant-mortality-rate-is-a-national-embarrassment/?utm_term=.8136e4325ad9)

[http://time.com/5090112/infant-mortality-rate-
usa/](http://time.com/5090112/infant-mortality-rate-usa/)

[https://www.npr.org/2017/05/12/528098789/u-s-has-the-
worst-r...](https://www.npr.org/2017/05/12/528098789/u-s-has-the-worst-rate-
of-maternal-deaths-in-the-developed-world)

[https://www.propublica.org/article/die-in-childbirth-
materna...](https://www.propublica.org/article/die-in-childbirth-maternal-
death-rate-health-care-system)

[https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/dec/05/america-
home...](https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2017/dec/05/america-homeless-
population-2017-official-count-crisis)

[http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-
canada-42248999](http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-42248999)

[https://www.ssa.gov/policy/docs/ssb/v70n3/v70n3p111.html](https://www.ssa.gov/policy/docs/ssb/v70n3/v70n3p111.html)

Education is failing en masse:

[https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2013/12/americ...](https://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2013/12/american-
schools-vs-the-world-expensive-unequal-bad-at-math/281983/)

[http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2017/02/15/u-s-
students...](http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2017/02/15/u-s-students-
internationally-math-science/)

[https://www.npr.org/sections/ed/2016/03/10/469831485/america...](https://www.npr.org/sections/ed/2016/03/10/469831485/americas-
high-school-graduates-look-like-other-countries-high-school-dropouts)

[https://www.forbes.com/sites/robertreiss/2015/11/17/how-
to-f...](https://www.forbes.com/sites/robertreiss/2015/11/17/how-to-fix-
education-in-america/#98109b5441c8)

Millitary is using shoddy, ancient tools:

[https://newrepublic.com/article/113484/how-pentagon-
boondogg...](https://newrepublic.com/article/113484/how-pentagon-boondoggle-
putting-soldiers-danger)

[http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/us-modernizing-
its...](http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/us-modernizing-its-nuclear-
arsenal-despite-criticism-over-weapons-a-932188.html)

[http://nationalinterest.org/blog/the-buzz/the-us-military-
re...](http://nationalinterest.org/blog/the-buzz/the-us-military-really-bad-
shape-19446)

[https://breakingdefense.com/2018/01/hasc-ew-expert-bacon-
us-...](https://breakingdefense.com/2018/01/hasc-ew-expert-bacon-us-not-
prepared-for-electronic-warfare-vs-russia-china/)

[https://breakingdefense.com/2018/01/armys-basic-illusions-
go...](https://breakingdefense.com/2018/01/armys-basic-illusions-gone-time-
for-futures-command/)

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SubiculumCode
Deficits in dollars aren't scary, unless they cause hyperinflation, IMO.

