
Ask HN: What is the best drone for hackers? - kposehn
I want to get a drone for two friends of mine that are unabashed hardware hackers, but I am not sure which to get. Could anyone in HN recommend one that is readily available? Preferably via Amazon.<p>Thanks all!
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grinich
It depends what they want to hack. Since you're saying "drone" I'm assuming
you want them to be autonomous in some way, and not just traditional RC.

When I was working on Tacocopter, we used 8-CineStars from Quadrocopter[1].
They were originally designed to fly pro cameras, so they have an incredible
payload, great flight characteristics, all carbon fibre, etc. Downside is
they're very expensive.

Most of our development was in the software, so we wanted a hardware solution
that "just worked" Dealing with DIY motor controllers that can burn out really
slows down the process. Aside, if you end up using the MicroKopter platform, I
reverse engineered a lot of their serial protocol for our telemetry stack--
check it out on Github[2].

The cool thing to me about MAVs is they essentially become a flying computer.
For your friends, I would pick the one that has enough power for decent
acrobatics+payloads, but more importantly the easiest software development
stack. Stuff from 3DRobotics is a good starting place.

[1] [http://www.quadrocopter.com/](http://www.quadrocopter.com/)

[2]
[https://github.com/grinich/mikrokopter](https://github.com/grinich/mikrokopter)

[3] [http://3drobotics.com/](http://3drobotics.com/)

~~~
baddox
We're also assuming he's referring to multirotors when he says "drone." An
autonomous model airplane would also be a drone. But it's probably a safe
assumption.

Anyway, I would add another big vote for 3DRobotics. They're the organization
behind the enormous and successful Ardupilot project, which is an open source
community that develops hardware and software for autonomous model vehicles
(helicopters, multirotors, airplanes, and cars).

Their ready-to-fly multicopters and planes are packed with functionality and
reasonably priced, although they are probably out of the price (and ability)
range of someone completely new to the hobby. As other people have said, it's
essentially a necessity to grab a toy quadcopter like the Syma X1 for around
40 USD to get a hang of flying them (and realizing how easy it is to crash
them) without the chance of a major financial loss.

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Zuph
Have they ever flown a quadcopter before? If not, I strongly suggest they
start with something cheap like the Syma X1 ($35 on Amazon). It's an amazing
value, and incredibly fun to fly. Very forgiving, and mildly hackable.

The biggest benefit is that it lets you build your piloting chops without a
huge financial risk. An acquaintance of mine is working to get drones into the
hands of professionals who aren't interested in becoming drone experts
(Realtors, etc), and he uses the Syma X1 to train folks before giving them the
keys to larger, more dangerous and expensive drones.

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ak1394
Crazyflie from [http://www.bitcraze.se/](http://www.bitcraze.se/) is pretty
cool. I own one myself, and I like it a lot. This is a tiny fully opensource
quad which can be flown indoors. Obviously, because of it's tiny size it
doesn't fly for too long and don't lift much.

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kposehn
Ok, a little more input.

Both are android users and prefer open-source hardware and software. The
Parrot AR 2.0 looked good at first, but I'm unsure as to the level of
community support for the android software.

They are also very skilled at low level programming, so some of the newer
Linux based drones are appealing.

~~~
pchristensen
I'd recommend the 3DRobotics Iris:
[https://store.3drobotics.com/products/IRIS](https://store.3drobotics.com/products/IRIS)

Runs the PX4 autopilot (which I believe is hackable), can be controlled by RC,
has good support for camera, gimballs, attachments, etc.

The Parrot firmware is closed and I don't know about other firmware
implementations, but the protocol is open so you can write clients to control
is - [https://github.com/felixge/node-ar-
drone](https://github.com/felixge/node-ar-drone) being one of the most well
known.

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cominatchu
The DJI Phantom & DJI Phantom 2 vision are both awesome. The Phantom 1 is
probably better if you want to put your own board in the air, as it has more
payload space. But out of the box the Phantom 2 is unbelievable with its
iPhone FPV & telemetry integration

If you have lots of time on your hands, though, you could build your own with
ardupilot: [http://ardupilot.com](http://ardupilot.com)

~~~
z02d
Just had a DJI Phantom under the christmas tree :-) Glad to read this here

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tlack
The AR Drone is the cheap, hackable way to do it. It's just a tiny PC running
Linux hooked up to four weak motors. You can control it via wifi, or replace
the flight software yourself if you are enterprising. Add their new GPS add-
on, and you can use the excellent QGroundControl. There are excellent projects
putting it to use for a variety of tasks.

Unfortunately it will be limited in its power, unless you do an extensive
engine and frame mod as shown here [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KESy--
N6ags](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KESy--N6ags)

The 3DRobotics Iris is an exciting new product that represents a more
flexible, pro-amateur level tool. They're made to be put to work, not flown
like a remote controlled helicopter, so you'll find good support for
programmability here.

On the other hand, it's almost $1k fully built out, compared to half that for
the Parrot.

~~~
Theodores
To take a car analogy, if motorsport was the aim, goal and objective but you
hadn't even learned to drive yet, then, it might be advisable to get a regular
car, maybe one that could be pimped to a certain extent, rather than fork out
the £££ for an F1 car or a WRC rally car.

The AR Drone is pretty deluxe for a starting point, plus it actually works out
the box and is affordable. Whilst having hours of fun with it one could work
out what the 'ideal' is actually going to be.

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brokenparser
The DIY.

Or build an AeroQuad:
[http://aeroquad.com/content.php?s=9af9c997f8aed9a3ad958e32bf...](http://aeroquad.com/content.php?s=9af9c997f8aed9a3ad958e32bffe81fa)

~~~
kposehn
This looks fascinating. Is it relatively easy to acquire all the relevant
parts?

~~~
mbrameld
Very easy. hobbyking.com carries almost everything you'll need. Check out
Flitetest's youtube channel and web site to see how easy it is to build your
own from parts.

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clebio
It really depends on the application. If you're talking about flight, and
autonomous-flight at that, keep in mind that airspace is highly regulated. (In
the US) The FAA requires RC pilots to be licensed (inexpensive and no test,
but still necessary) and RC flight must always be in line-of-sight -- usually
in very specific, designated areas. It's quite easy enough to build an
autonomous bird, with programmable way-points and such, which breaks all sorts
of laws. Start with the AMA:
[http://www.modelaircraft.org/](http://www.modelaircraft.org/)

There's a lot of specific distinctions between piloted-flight versus
autonomous ('drone') as well as size restrictions and such. First-person view
(FPV) requires a second pilot using grounded line-of-sight, as well
([http://www.modelaircraft.org/files/550.pdf](http://www.modelaircraft.org/files/550.pdf)).

I'm by no means trying to discourage you, just know if something might be a
federal offense!

~~~
clebio
Downvote with no comment? Thanks for that....

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trekky1700
I'd say, for a hardware hacker, one they build themselves. I'm building one
right now, have ordered all the parts for relatively cheap and it will be a
lot more powerful than a Parrot Drone and gives me more freedom with what I
want it to do.

~~~
JoblessWonder
Would you mind giving a quick run-down of everything you ordered? I've been
trying to price out a DIY quadcopter on HobbyKing.com but I'm always worried
I'm going to miss a piece that ends up costing a ton of money.

If you could include prices that would be amazing, but I can always look it up
if you can just post the parts!

~~~
seiji
I bought three small ones from
[http://www.helipal.com](http://www.helipal.com) recently. They come pre-
tested so when you crash them, you know you're the one who threw them all out
of alignment.

A proper quadcopter is different than those styrofoam quadrotor things you
see. A copter will take longer to learn how to not crash, but you have more
precise control.

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fit2rule
The best drone for hackers is the one they build themselves. There is
absolutely no point in buying a factory drone - you can make them yourselves
easily enough, and without much fuss - in fact RC drones is one of the
longest-running subjects that has attracted hackers over the years. If you
want innovation, learning, experimentation - check out the "DIY Foamies"
section on [http://rcgroups.com/](http://rcgroups.com/) forums .. there are
literally thousands of drone designs in there that the budding hacker can
enjoy, learn from, and exploit for their needs.

So please, stay away from the factory drones, folks.

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gratefulfrog
Arducoptor & Ardupilot are the way to go!

Forget amazon, that's not a place for hackers...

But beware of the hidden costs in Radio-Controlled flight - it's never a cheap
date...

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gpcz
This is a hard question to answer without knowing what types of problems your
hacker friends like to solve. For example, quadcopters tend to cater to
certain types of problems (mapping, precise control, etc), while fixed-wing
aircraft tend to cater to a different group (autopilots, longer-distance
flights, etc).

~~~
revelation
Can you give some pointers to projects workin on fixed-wing aircraft?
Autopilot would be what I'm interested in, but most everything I see are
quadcopters, and then with these remote-control gadgets that I don't care
about.

~~~
gpcz
Probably the nicest page I've seen on the subject is DIY Drones (
[http://diydrones.com](http://diydrones.com) ), which covers both fixed-wing
and copter-based UAV engineering. Their fixed-wing autopilot is called
ArduPlane ( [http://plane.ardupilot.com](http://plane.ardupilot.com) ).

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abbaselmas
try to build your own and i mean your own even your own flight controller from
scratch / use Arduino for flight control / use ecalc.ch site for your
combination / hobbyking may have everything you want but they suck at shipment
/ try something different if you want it to be named hacker's drone ;)

~~~
kposehn
They would be tempted, but then I can't have a drone land in their yard with a
bow attached :)

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ljlolel
What do you think of the 3DRobotics Iris?

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schwa
Stop calling them "Drones".

