
A Japanese inn owned by the same family for 1,300 years [video] - Thevet
http://vimeo.com/114879061
======
fotografritz
I'm the guy who made this video, so I want adress some questions from this
thread. Really interesting discussion by the way, I'm happy so many people
take an interest in this film!

Not really family/adoption:

To be honest, the whole history of the Houshi family is kind of a mistery.
There was no real documentation in paper back then. No photos, and paintings
or such were only for rich people. Yet, the whole town kinda grew around the
hot springs and this one hotel in particular. So the history of the hotel and
the family is very much connected with the history of the town. That's also
where the proof for the Guinness Bureau came from. They wouldn't just accept
them saying "yea, we old."

What changed in 2011: An even older hotel submitted their application.

Also: as far as I found out, that older hotel is not a straight "same-family"
business, or at least not anymore. I'm a bit sceptical of that posted source
below. There's an association for family businesses older than 200 years AND
still running, and that hotel is not part of that, Houshi is.

The daughters motivation: I shot this film over the course of six days, in
April and in June. When I was doing the interviews in April, the daughter
didn't actually know that her father decided that she should take over. I was
the one who told her during the interview (assuming then she was aware of it
of course). She officially started in May, and when I came back in June, she
was much more adjusted. She's actually doing pretty well. There's also a
second son, even working in the hotel, longer than the daughter. but according
to the father, he's not smart enough to manage the inn. The daughter is
actually much stronger and smarter than she thinks she is. That's why the
father chose her. In 1,300 years, no woman was the official owner of the inn.
However, they were allowed to be "temporary owners" until the son came of age
or someone was adopted. Yet, the father considers giving the daughter now the
title of Zengoro. She would be the first woman in 1,300 years to wear that
title. But it's not final yet. I consider going back there in a couple of
years to see what's changed.

The first born son gets trained from day one to become the owner. The daughter
wasn't properly prepared. Yet, she loves her family dearly and is caught
between her love, obligation and duty. For someone carrying the weight of
1,300 years and 46 generations, she is doing remarkably well.

~~~
chuckcode
Thanks for the additional info, be great to see those on the page as I had the
exact same questions.

Really like the movie - amazing photography, especially how the hot springs
became like their own character through the sublime water shots.

I'd be really curious to hear more about how the hotel has changed over time
and endured. I'd also be very interested to hear more about the daughter
taking over as this is a microcosm of a lot of tradition bending taking place
in the country.

~~~
fotografritz
I want to write an extended story about the whole thing and offer that to
several media along with the video, just like I did previously with another
short doc from Japan. So I kinda can't and won't give everything away under
the video. However, I try to answer questions or join a discussion when I can.
This thread in particular seemed very interesting, whereas other comments
elsewhere don't really make me join the discussion.

There's only so much you can tell with a short video on the internet.
Everything can only be a glimpse into a 1,300 year old legacy, and into the
mentality of three humans behind it.

------
datamatt
Not actually the same family, typically the new owners will "adopt" a son, who
is just the highest ranking manager:
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_adult_adoption](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_adult_adoption)

~~~
inklesspen
How is that not actually the same family?

~~~
baldfat
AS a father of three adopted children I ask the same. Adoption is family even
if they look different then your own skin they are family.

~~~
avar
Nobody's disputing that, but the Japanese custom for adult adoption is
something else entirely:
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_adult_adoption](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_adult_adoption)

So if you adopt a child and raise it as your own and that child takes over
your business, is it still a "family business? Yes.

But can you say it's still a "family" business if it's gone through the
Japanese custom of adult adoption? Arguably yes, because that person was
brought into their family as a legitimate heir.

On the other hand you could argue that it's no different than a family
business being sold in the western sense, it's just that in ancient Japan you
couldn't really buy and sell businesses, they were owned by clans, so this was
their mechanism for ensuring business continuity when there was no suitable
male heir.

I'm not taking a stance on whether it's still a "real" family business, but
it's important to understand that what the Japanese mean by "adoption" in this
sense is not at all what westerners mean when they use that word.

~~~
digi_owl
Another reminder that Japan extended their feudal period longer than most.

Then again, the west took on the practice of putting the founders name on a
corporations...

------
Ronsenshi
Very interesting.

I always wondered what would be morally just position on such long standing
establishments when it comes to inheritance of responsibility.

On the one hand kids of such family shouldn't be tied to the family business
if they don't find it fulfilling. On the other hand if they won't continue the
line traditions might die and with them such old an interesting places as this
one or any other.

But as datamatt writes, I guess adult adoption does help with that. If kids in
such family feel that they are not up to the task, their parents can adopt a
person (a man in this case) who will continue with this tradition.

~~~
protomyth
Happens with farm kids all the time. If no kids want to continue the land is
often sold or just rented out.

------
cookrn
One of the "world's oldest continuously ongoing independent company" [0] also
hails from Japan, although it became a subsidiary of another company awhile
back

[0]
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kong%C5%8D_Gumi](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kong%C5%8D_Gumi)

~~~
IndianAstronaut
It is simply amazing that a company has survived for so long. How have they
managed to maintain revenue, maintain a culture, manage tremendous social and
political change for centuries??

~~~
lmm
They were a temple repair company. It's steady work that hasn't changed a lot
(everyone respects the temples - there are monasteries in Europe of comparable
age to this company, but they were maintained by monks or "ordinary"
builders), and not an easy market for outsiders to break into.

------
alexyes
"Until 2011, it held the record for being the oldest hotel in the world."

I wondered what happened in 2011

~~~
chadzawistowski
This confused me, too. The record officials must have discovered an older
hotel?

~~~
kuboa
Nishiyama Onsen Keiunkan hotel somehow proved they were older. (Founded in
705, run by the same family for 52 generations.)

Tofugu has a nice article about the centuries old establishments in Japan:
[http://www.tofugu.com/2014/10/28/over-a-thousand-years-of-
se...](http://www.tofugu.com/2014/10/28/over-a-thousand-years-of-service-
japans-oldest-businesses-reign-supremely-old/)

------
cLeEOGPw
The daughter seems to be very depressed and clearly isn't intending on
continuing this tradition.

~~~
jzelinskie
There is an anime about her very situation. It's called 花咲くいろは (Hanasaku
Iroha). It's pretty interesting if you don't have any familiarity with
traditional Japanese inns. Be warned: PA Works (the studio that created it)
likes drama!

~~~
pbhjpbhj
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanasaku_Iroha](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanasaku_Iroha)

------
jpatokal
The inn's English homepage: [http://www.ho-
shi.co.jp/jiten/Houshi_E/home.htm](http://www.ho-
shi.co.jp/jiten/Houshi_E/home.htm)

Rates start from Y9900/person (~US$83) for a midweek stay with two meals,
although better rooms and meals can cost considerably more.

Reviews seem a bit mediocre though: this is a large ryokan geared for large
groups, and not particularly luxurious as far as these things go.

~~~
troels

        Please use Netscape Navigator and the Shockwave plug-in to see this site in its full majesty
    

Ancient, indeed.

~~~
dredmorbius
Realize you're talking about a 15 year span on a 1,300 year one. The changes
we're seeing in media technology are a distraction for this company. It may
well long outlast the Web.

------
peter303
Until 19th century promulgation of corporations mainly families, governments
and religions could own property. The corporation allowed large groups of
unrelated people to own property and pass it it on to new managers and owners.
This filled the gap of having organization between the size of a
small[family]business and a local government.

Of course there are isolated examples of corporations before the 19th century,
but they tended to be the exception until the legal system got the property
rights thing down. Governments were stingy granting corporate charters or long
lifetimes.

------
rokhayakebe
Genuinely curious:

Why did you choose to show a negative angle? For example, without context: 1)
the father sounds macho, 2) the wife appears to have never been in love, 3)
the girl is entirely unhappy.

Did they approve this final version?

~~~
fotografritz
I honestly didn't want to be it negative, but here's the thing:

the story is what it is.

I would loved for it to be more positive, but the state I interviewed them in,
everything seemed gloomy. There's even a line from the father, which I cut,
where he says it like: "For Houshi, there has never been a worse time than
this". this includes the many natural disasters they faced, when the entire
ryokan went up in flames or when half the family went to war and they became
some sort of hospital for the army's soldiers instead of a hotel.

This particular moment I captured now is indeed quite negative, hence the
story feels like that. But it is the Houshi of that moment. If I would make it
more positive with the material I got, I would feel that I betray them or fake
the story. And going from the interviews, there are rarely any positive
statements. I even ended my last interview with the daughter saying:
"everything you told me was so negative... I want the film to end on a
positive note. Can you tell me something positive?" She contemplated for a
while and then said two funny things. How she practices the Shamisen with her
mother and feels like she is much better than her but would never say that.
And also how she likes western style hotels much more than japanese style
ryokan. But for several reasons, I couldn't use those lines.

1) the father's not macho, it's actually quite complex. as I said before, the
family, and him in particular, have a very different understanding of what
"family" is. There's no difference between family and business to him. Both
are the same thing. It's easy for us to judge that, but it's how he was raised
and his father before him. It's the way they walk. It's a cultural difference.

It took me a while to understand that and to accept his way. I tried to show
and explain his situation in the film, why he's doing what he's doing, so
others might understand. His only purpose in life is to keep the ryokan. Or
else he alone would fuck up the entire history of the family. It's a big
weight to carry, most of us can't even begin to comprehend.

that being said, he really was unbelievable sad when his son died. He is also
a father, and not a monster. He's more a dutiful samurai.

2) yes and she never expected it. the wife is really obedient, she accepted
her fate a long time ago and never asked for more. we might not like it, but
that's how she is.

3) not entirely unhappy. the interview with her was her first chance to vent
and to talk about some issues that she couldn't talk about with her parents or
her friends in a long time. she is indeed quite lonely, so it was very
emotional. She cried several times during the interview but I didn't want to
embarass her like that by actually showing it. However, there are things she
enjoys and finds happiness in. She travels to Tokyo once a month to visit
friends, she also loves her small dog. There's also a second daughter, who's
married with kids, and she enjoys spending time with them. And despite all,
she loves and admires her parents dearly. Or else she wouldn't have come back.
And as I said above, the interview was made in April and she is doing much
better now.

a big theme of the film is the flow of time and the changes they bring. Houshi
is always in motion. This film shows also just a moment in their long history,
and it happens to be a very decisive one. When I traveled there, I didn't know
about the whole situation. The film as it is, was the story unfolding to me.

Let me end with a quote from Zengoro:

"It’s not about choosing family or this ryokan. The most important thing is,
to keep this 1300 years old family business. You would say we are in the
bottom of the situation but some ancestors also thought their ages were in the
bottom. So people don’t notice when things are going well, then there is
already some sign of going downhill. And when you noticed that it’s going
worse, things are already working towards a good way again."

------
peter303
Of course this is helped by the Asian valuing of ancestry. A families can be
traced back two thousand years to when Chinese states were being established.
(And some of these records were destroyed forever by communist excesses that
did not value them.) Europe went through a period (400AD-800AD) were ancestry
record keeping was not valued or done and continuity was lost.

------
icosahedron
I hope they find someone to adopt or marry who will care for this hotel.

As someone else pointed out, the daughter seems to be sad. I hope she is able
to find someone to make her happy and is able to let her do what makes her
happy.

------
suyash
Anyone having good luck watching the video? I have tried all 3 major browsers
and none are buffering and playing the media seamlessly. Maybe it's Vimeo's
player that is bad.

~~~
dredmorbius
youtube-dl FTFW.

~~~
fotografritz
I'd rather you not.

~~~
dredmorbius
Then remove your video. If you're posting content to the Web, it's inherently
downloadable. Most of us see that as a benefit.

1\. I don't really care what you think.

2\. You're not going to stop the vast majority of downloaders. Go study King
Canute.

3\. Video playback is vastly superior under local clients than in a Web app.

Controls are uniform, I don't have to deal with buffering, I can
start/stop/pause without hunting for controls in different places in different
GUIs, I can vary playback speed, have pitch adjust to speed, mute audio, etc.,
I can queue up several videos without hassling with browser tabs, and I don't
have the problem of trying to track down which browser tab, in which window,
on which desktop, is playing and/or making noise (it's far easier to find and
track down my video player(s)).

While the Vimeo Web player is decent, it does a miserable job at
starting/stopping and repositioning playback.

Most of what I download I delete immediately on viewing (or after a few
seconds of playing). Some, yes, I keep. Most of it's for research purposes.

As it turns out, I skimmed through your video rather quickly with the sound
off. Pretty, but frankly not all that interesting.

And you're pegging yourself as another creative who 1) I'd never have heard of
before but 2) has identified himself as really not constitutionally suited to
online realities.

~~~
jamespo
If 1. is true the rest of your post is redundant

~~~
dredmorbius
The audience is, implicitly and deliberately, more than just him.

Hence: an online public forum.

But thank you for your kind words.

