
Solitary Jailhouse Lawyer Argues His Way Out of Prison - jkuria
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702304023804575566201554448476.html
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Locke1689
This really highlights the unreliability of eyewitness testimony (well, and
corruption in the DA's office and police department, but that's another
story).

Perhaps one upside to the coming ubiquity of cameras is an increased
availability in actual evidence for crimes.

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joe_the_user
Well,

While unbiased eye-witness testimony might be well unreliable, the story
mostly shows DA and corruption.

He got out of jail by showing the people who testified against him were quite
biased indeed - They were "motivated" to act by police and DA threats and the
DA had systematically lied concerning this process...

It's also rather heart-rending to read how he had to engage in fraud to
discover the truth and naturally this fraud was then held against his
appeal....

~~~
shrikant
[Interestingly] The judge Robert Holdman who shot down his appeal because of
this fraud, has a (IMHO) history of being overly harsh.

[http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:ZrFEGVE...](http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:ZrFEGVEd8DsJ:www.judicialreports.com/2007/12/post_82.php)
(search for 'Holdman' on that page)

~~~
joe_the_user
When I reading the story, that part was just screaming at me. In my limited
knowledge of the law, the guy got incredibly lucky in having illegally gain
evidence accepted in a court of law (from a defendant).

It's mind blowing to think about being in a situation where the only way to
get justice is to break the law. It sounds good in action movie but in real
life, it's appalling...

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yxhuvud
Being a foreigner, it's mind blowing that how evidence is procured matter.

Evidence is evidence. If there were illegal actions while collecting it, then
those actions should be prosecuted, but evidence is still evidence and should
be used.

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jarin
In the US, we (as a collective) hold sacrosanct the rights of a person against
illegal searches and self-incrimination, as well as the 'innocent until proven
guilty' doctrine. The idea is that it's better to let a criminal go than to
convict an innocent person.

Disallowing illegally obtained evidence also has the effect of discouraging
the police from illegally obtaining evidence in the first place and reducing
opportunities for corruption. Of course, in this case it didn't work out so
well, but you would see a lot more stories like this if sources of evidence
weren't important.

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dkarl
_Disallowing illegally obtained evidence also has the effect of discouraging
the police from illegally obtaining evidence in the first place_

Exactly, and arguably it's the only effective deterrent, because courts will
be very lenient towards law enforcement officers doing their job, simply out
of pragmatism. Law enforcement officers don't all have a precise understanding
of the law, there are gray areas in the law anyway, and on top of that, the
law is constantly evolving. Prosecuting police officers for illegal searches
would be harmful, impractical, and _extremely_ unpopular, so the use of
illegal searches and evidence obtained from them would become routine if that
were the only deterrent.

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chapel
This is a great story of someone fighting against oppressive forces to gain
his freedom. I really hope he wins his lawsuit against them, this being one of
those cases where he really deserves something for the time lost. As an aside,
I can see this being made into a movie already.

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tibbon
Why does 'the system' seem to make this process so painfully slow and
seemingly reject requests for information/appeals arbitrarily? It seems much
of the 15 years here was spent playing paperwork games with the legal system.

~~~
anigbrowl
I don't know about the state of NY, but the entire federal court system only
takes up about 2.5% of the federal budget - when you think about it, it's the
least expensive branch of government by far. The flip side, though, is that
there are far more cases to be heard at any given time than there are courts
and personnel to hear them, and complex technical rules which have to be
complied with. It seems very inefficient and arbitrary, but generally all of
those rules were created in response to so some failing in the previous
version. Every so often the 'legacy code' becomes unmanageable and a relevant
part of the law is redrafted or similarly overhauled.

For example, California switched over to a completely new set of jury
instructions known as CALCRIM for criminal trials a few years ago, designed to
eliminate a lot of unnecessary confusion and legalistic cruft which had
accrued to the previous version, known as CALJIC. But even drafting those from
scratch takes years. My reference copy of CALCRIM is about 2500 pages over 3
volumes. And that's just criminal - there's a lot more for civil trials. A LOT
more.

Think of it like encountering Unix as a complete newbie. You know what
computers are for and what they can do, but but actually learning unix at the
command line is pretty complicated, no?

~~~
gersh
Are there too few judges? Is expanding the judiciary an option? Are too many
lawyers incompetent?

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krakensden
There is definitely a significant judicial shortage at the federal level, but
most crimes don't wind up there.

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Detrus
What are the typical consequences to the corrupt prosecutor and police
department in a case like this?

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chapel
Unless they blatantly broke the law in some provable way, probably nothing.
Though as with the guy in this case, he can sue the State/City for wrongful
imprisonment and other issues.

~~~
Detrus
So this guy proving his innocence by exposing corruption does not prove their
corruption? There must be some fun technicalities there.

~~~
rorrr
Nobody is watching (or prosecuting) the prosecutors. That's very very sad.

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rdl
This is one of many reasons I oppose capital punishment. It is odd that
conservatives, who claim government is often the problem, not the solution,
would entrust the state with the power of life and death.

~~~
gnaritas
Not really, as the conservative opinion has little to do with logic or
consistency; it's all about maintaining the status quo. They simply dislike
change, many seem to wish progress stopped around 1890 or so.

~~~
philwelch
That's a literal definition of "conservative", but there's plenty of instances
of "conservatives" (in the US) trying to change things--conservatives were the
most enthusiastic proponents of the War on Drugs, which changed the US legal
system dramatically, as well as the War on Terrorism, which involved a whole
mess of other "innovations". In many cases, conservatives are the ones wanting
to change things and civil libertarians (i.e. liberals) were trying to
maintain the status quo.

~~~
gnaritas
Those are examples of them trying to change things back to how they think it
used to be. In both cases, they see it them defending themselves and their
values against those who disrupt their world.

That's not trying to change things, that's trying to stop change, in the
former case, stopping the invasion of the growing drug culture and in the
latter the repulsion of those who want to _destroy their freedom_.
Unfortunately, in these cases, they don't mind giving up other peoples rights
in the name of safety, because their entire world view is dominated by fear.
So yea, liberals tried to maintain the status quo of things like civil
liberties, but those are the exceptions, not the rule.

So it isn't just the literal definition of conservative, it's the prevailing
attitude of nearly every one that I've met. They aren't just coincidentally
called _conservatives_ , nor are progressives coincidentally called such
either. Both are fairly accurate descriptions of the general attitude of both
groups; not everyone fits both groups, but most do, whether they admit to the
label or not.

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WalterBright
I hope he does become an attorney.

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gallerytungsten
Me too.

So many attorneys, so few good ones.

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rms
Warms my cold leftist heart.

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MichaelApproved
This is an inspiring story and every time I hear about something like this I
wonder how much money each year of my life would be worth behind bars. Years
of not knowing when/if I'd ever be released.

This man is suing for 60 million and will probably get a settlement for less
but still large sum. If he were to get $10 million, would that be enough for
10 years behind bars?

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donaldc
_This man is suing for 60 million and will probably get a settlement for less
but still large sum. If he were to get $10 million, would that be enough for
10 years behind bars?_

No. At least, not if it were me.

But then again, if it were me, no amount of money would make me feel that
justice was done. I'd want to see the prosecutor and anyone else involved in
the frauds that got me convicted do some time themselves.

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schwit
The DA and cops are in it for convictions not justice.

Anyone in the police or DA's office who had a hand in railroading him should
get 10 years in jail.

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jjcm
This would make for a wonderful plot for a book/movie. I'd watch/read a much
longer version of this article.

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danahn
The headline is disappointing given the contents of the article

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c4urself
from this story and others i read on HN: there is something really wrong with
the justice system in america.

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ditojim
movie please.

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mobileed
I feel anyone who abstruct justice by withholding evidence should
automatically go to jail. This guy was railroaded on so many levels, the DA
should go sit in jail for same amount of time this innocent person did.

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badmash69
Hey HN, I mean no disrespect to any of the parties in this story -- but hey
isn't this forum about HACKER NEWS ?

The only inspirational stores I wanna read about HERE are about fellow
hackers' finding Seed/ VC funding and their successful exits. Or about cool
programs and code. Items pertaining to Technology , Free Markets and
Capitalism.

For all other life-affirming and inspirational stuff , I could always go to
reddit.

~~~
anigbrowl
Get used to it. Law has a good deal in common with programming, many hackers
have a strong interest in and commitment to civil liberties, and this is a
story about a man who overcame obstacles most entrepreneurs can barely imagine
- by teaching himself how to hack the legal system. It's not just inspiring,
but instructive.

~~~
jkuria
Yep, beside the obvious triumph of justice against near-insurmountable odds,
it made me realize some of the setbacks I've faced as an entrepreneur are
complete child's play compared to what this guy went through! I got off my
ass, hit the treadmill for half an hour, cleaned up my space and have been
working since!

