
My mom and dad’s house might explode, but Comcast wants its cable box back - wheelerwj
http://sethclifford.me/2012/11/01/my-mom-and-dads-house-might-explode-but-comcast-wants-its-cable-box-back/
======
grecy
I know this is going to be unpopular, but...

Comcast is a business, and their goal is to make ever increasing profit. Yes
it's horrible your family and hundreds of others lost everything due to a
natural disaster, but that's not Comcast's fault or problem. When you signed
up for service from them, I'll bet it's in the fine print that you are
responsible for returning the cable box.

If it got stolen, that's not Comcast's problem.

If your hot water service burst and spilled water all over the cable box,
that's not Comcast's problem.

This is the world we live in. You can't choose to have the benefits of cheap
cable, then complain when the company wants to keep making profit, and
enforces a contract you signed.

EDIT: To be clear, I personally hate that this is how the world works, but I
accept the reality that it's true.

~~~
Steko
"Comcast is a business, and their goal is to make ever increasing profit."

And part of that is Brand Management AKA not looking like dicks after a
hurricane level event and adding to people's misery.

~~~
jrockway
Brand management is only important when you have a choice of service
providers. It's not like you can switch your cable service from Comcast to RCN
or Time Warner if you want to. They already bribed the appropriate government
officials to ensure that that is not possible. And now they want $500 for
their $39 cable box and there's nothing you can do about it.

(You might write to the state's attorney general's office. I'm sure enough
complaints will result in a token slap on the wrist, if that makes you feel
any better.)

~~~
HarryHirsch
It might be fun to let them drag _you_ into court and see what happens if they
demand USD 500 for their ancient Motorola 4100 Surfboard, considering that
today a new, more capable modem is less that USD 100. I would take the chance.

~~~
rfugger
Most likely they would just put the unpaid bill on your credit report and move
on, leaving you with tarnished credit and no recourse.

~~~
HarryHirsch
The usual procedure about disputed debts applies.

~~~
readme
Sure, and the credit bureaus will not side with you. Because you actually do
owe the debt.

~~~
jrockway
The credit bureaus have sided with me every time I've made a dispute.

~~~
wheelerwj
really? I did not even know this was a thing? do you have examples? can i pm?

------
dfjacobs
A hurricane just blew threw, your neighborhood has just been declared a
disaster area, your house is about to explode, and you're freaking out over a
return charge that you haven't even been billed yet? IMO, Comcast isn't the
only ones with their priorities out of whack here.

If you do eventually get a bill for not returning the cable box, just go to
the local Comcast office (the place you were supposed to return the boxes to)
after things have settled down, and explain the situation to a local employee
who actually has some discretion in how to respond to the situation. I'm sure
you won't be the only one in the area with this problem. Expecting call center
reps thousands of miles away, who have probably heard every variant of 'the
dog ate my cable box' story at least twice, to waive the charge immediately,
without any proof, and no directive from higher up, is asking a bit much. I'm
guessing the Comcast staff in the hurricane zone have a few more pressing
concerns right now than adjusting bills that haven't gone out the door yet.

~~~
mech4bg
I was coming here to post the exact same thing. Perfectly summed up - why are
they stressing themselves out about such an inconsequential thing right now?

Yes Comcast handled it badly, but if I were worried my house was about to be
destroyed, I would not be thinking about disconnecting the cable box. (In fact
I have had my house flooded, and I can tell you nothing like this ever even
crossed my mind).

------
JeremyBanks
There's a follow-up by The Consumerist. Once _they_ got in contact with
Comcast, Comcast predictably changed their tune:
[http://consumerist.com/2012/11/01/comcast-knows-that-your-
st...](http://consumerist.com/2012/11/01/comcast-knows-that-your-storm-
ravaged-house-might-explode-would-really-like-its-cable-box-back/)

~~~
smsm42
Right, just as I said above - once it is escalated to the level where people
are allowed to think it becomes completely possible to be flexible.

~~~
Evbn
Consumerist performed the escalation.

------
enoch_r
If your toaster is destroyed in a hurricane, Target does not replace it. If
your car is destroyed in a hurricane, Honda does not replace it. So if your
cable box is destroyed in a hurricane, I don't see why Comcast should be
expected to eat the cost of replacement. You're renting an item with the
express provision that failing to return the item means you've bought it.
Expecting Comcast to provide free hurricane insurance for all their cable
boxes just doesn't make sense--it's like expecting the furniture store to
refund all the money you paid for the furniture in the house.

~~~
Turing_Machine
But it's not "their" cable box. It's Comcast's cable box. IMO, it would be
fine for Comcast to charge for damage due to negligence or intentional
vandalism, but not due to circumstances beyond the homeowner's control. Do
they charge if the box is damaged by lightning, e.g.? Certainly my old cable
company didn't, but I don't know about Comcast (I got rid of the cable after
Comcast bought the company I had).

~~~
enoch_r
Interesting. I see the box as rented equipment, temporarily owned by the
homeowner. Anything that happens to the box during the rental period is
something the renter is responsible for. I'm actually surprised that your old
cable company replaced the lightning-damaged box.

But judging from the response here, clearly lots of other people think of the
box as a part of Comcast's infrastructure that happens to be portable. And
from that point of view, it makes sense for Comcast to eat the cost--just like
they'll eat the cost of their cable lines being torn up in the hurricane.

And I suppose that if the vast majority of people have the latter view when
they're signing up for cable, then Comcast should probably change their
policies to fit that model, and just charge for loss or damage caused by the
user.

~~~
Turing_Machine
"Anything that happens to the box during the rental period is something the
renter is responsible for."

Most rental contracts (for anything) that I've seen make the owner responsible
for normal wear and tear and so-called "Acts of God".

If you rent an apartment, you're not generally responsible for the rebuilding
costs if it gets blown away in a hurricane or tornado.

Here's an example lease:

<http://www.sitenet.com/toolkit/lease/database/l12.htm>

------
mikeash
No doubt their homeowner's insurance will cover this cost along with
everything else. There's no particular reason for Comcast to eat this cost,
although they probably could be more diplomatic about it.

------
wheelerwj
I posted this because while I was not affected by Sandy, I did lose my
apartment to a fire a few years ago and had to deal with the same thing from
Direct TV. I got send to collections for the cost of the satellite, the
receivers, and the failure to maintain the last part of the contract even
though I was homeless.

I am a business person and I understand that profitability is the bottom line,
but these companies make billions of dollars and this is unacceptable behavior
from community members. Those rules and return policies are put into place to
prevent theft, not to handle disasters, personal or national.

~~~
Someone
On the other hand, imagine the effort Comcast would have to make to verify
each such claim. If they don't verify such claims, I bet they will get at
least a hundred scammers for every real claim, once their leniency becomes
known.

In this case, the only thing I see is that this may not be the best moment to
bring that message, but I also wonder how anybody would even think of giving
Comcast a call so short after this happened to them.

~~~
wheelerwj
haha, that was my first thought too. But thinking back, I was on the phone
within a day or two... I guess we all deal with stress differently.

"Honey, the house is on fire..."

"I better call Comcast and cancel internet for the winter."

------
njharman
I don't see a problem with that. If party 'A' has something belonging to party
'B'. Just because the property is inaccessible or destroyed doesn't suddenly
evaporate's 'A' responsibility for returning it.

Comcast should provide a grace period 30-60 days, but that's about it.

~~~
gm
Agreed. Not sure why people see a problem with this simple principle.

It's not like they would be ok with Comcast saying "We're having cash flow
issues, so we took the liberty of charging you double this month"

~~~
wmf
Not in this particular case, but sometimes I feel like "the customer is always
right" has become a license to steal for some people.

------
InclinedPlane
Why this is justified on Comcast's part: the equipment is rented, if it's lost
due to a natural disaster then that's still on the renter unless you've
insured for that loss otherwise. Note that it would make sense for Comcast to
offer such insurance as a service fee, although it's likely this is covered
through homeowners insurance.

Why this is dumb on Comcast's part: this is day 2? post Hurricane and now
Comcast's greed is front and center in the national press. This is not smart,
especially considering the relatively small amount of money at stake here. How
much does Comcast spend on advertising? With this move they've basically
erased the equivalent of tens of millions of dollars in advertising for far
less value in return. No company wants a PR failure of this magnitude.
Especially considering that Comcast is already one of the most hated companies
in existence.

This was not a good move for Comcast and they are going to lose far more than
they could possibly gain.

------
deathmetal
I think we have to be really careful about anthropomorphizing companies.

The CEO has to make rules, one of which is that they charge fees for all boxes
so that people have no incentive to try to game the system. The rule must be
consistent across the board. He or she also knows that the people implementing
this rule will be low-paid and are not the right people to make the choice
about what excuse to accept.

Further, he or she (the CEO) realizes that if your house is destroyed, you're
going to put in an insurance claim, including possibly for any lost property
belonging to services contracted to the house.

For this reason, they're not cutting you a break. They need a consistent
policy that doesn't have any loopholes. It's not much different than computer
security, actually. You eliminate ambiguity and make upstream rules.

That isn't to say it doesn't suck. Then again, it's a drop of suck in an ocean
of suck. I've seen the pictures of some of the devastation and my heart goes
out to the people there. If I thought they needed my services, I would give
them a discount.

This brings me to the meat of this rambling post: go Consumerist style but
instead of complaining to Comcast, offer it up to them as an opportunity. You
mentioned how they often go out and do community initiatives. Suggest to them
that they reach out to the recently devastated and offer a free cable hook-up
and services with monthlies at the regular rate. You never know, it could work
out for them, since all the devastated homes will need some kind of internet,
and whoever makes it easiest may win over the harried homeowners.

------
whichdan
Comcast boxes are such a ripoff. They used to be $3/mo, and now they're at
$7/mo. A brand new DOCSIS3 modem is less than $90[1], and the ones most people
rent are bottom of the barrel DOCSIS2 modems.

[1] [http://www.amazon.com/Motorola-SB6121-SURFboard-DOCSIS-
Cable...](http://www.amazon.com/Motorola-SB6121-SURFboard-DOCSIS-
Cable/dp/B004XC6GJ0/)

~~~
jrockway
Of course, $7 a month is a bargain not to have to call customer service and
attempt to provision your own equipment.

------
droithomme
Comcast's position is not unreasonable here. If your car is destroyed in a
flood or accident, you still owe on the payments.

------
andybak
So the question is - was the supervisor at fault or was the system set up in
such as way as to tie the hands of the supervisor so he was unable to make any
other decision?

Of course there are shades of grey inbetween but I'd be fascinated to know
exactly where the blame lies inside Comcast.

------
rgbrenner
One word: insurance

Why would comcast let them off? Is the bank going to let you off on the
payments of your home or car if it gets destroyed? No, of course not... it
will be covered by insurance. Why would comcast be any different?

~~~
Turing_Machine
Because it's their box. Not yours.

------
malkia
At the same time... Verizon (never used them, was on T-Mobile, now AT&T and
TWC for cable) - [http://news.cnet.com/8301-1035_3-57543855-94/verizon-
offers-...](http://news.cnet.com/8301-1035_3-57543855-94/verizon-offers-phone-
charging-and-free-calling-for-sandy-victims/)?

"Verizon offers phone charging and free calling for Sandy victims"

Yes, easy way to get more customers to sign for you in the future... Comcast
just failed there...

------
alttag
Curiously, why in the world wouldn't Comcast have insurance on equipment the
rent out? Sure, primary coverage may/should be with the renter, but why in the
world won't they have secondary coverage in the event of total loss (including
death of the renter, etc.)

Could it simply be that at the rates they charge, a box is easily paid off in
a couple of years, and any additional rental fees are pure profit?

------
Anechoic
This isn't the first time something like this has happened:
<http://www.wsfa.com/Global/story.asp?S=14672228>

You would think that would have a procedure in place to address these types of
situations, for good PR at least.

~~~
pasbesoin
Exactly. The country experiences multiple such natural disasters each year,
although most are much more localized.

Where it the/a reasonable policy for dealing with them?

Surely, this is an area where a little application of oft vaunted "best
practices" might actually be appropriate?

(Local crews and crew management should be able to at least approximately
validate the legitimacy of such claimed circumstances.)

------
sremani
I do not care if Comcast in business of making money or they have fiduciary
responsibility to their stock holders. The timing is wrong and inappropriate
esp. when people lives coule be in danger and their entire life saving is in
jeopardy.

Comcast get a handle of this stupid situation.

------
armored_mammal
I mostly hate the choice between 'renting' and 'buying' these boxes when you
don't have any control over them and might get dragged into court for doing
so.

------
latchkey
Would homeowners insurance cover the loss?

