
Hawaii "button pusher" refusing to cooperate with FCC, internal investigators - mysterypie
http://www.staradvertiser.com/2018/01/24/breaking-news/schatz-to-lead-hearing-on-alert-systems-in-wake-of-hawaii-blunder/
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ghufran_syed
Great, this is why we have a constitution and bill of rights - he has no legal
obligation to speak to them, and of course, if by accident he said something
that was incorrect (“I had tuna for lunch” when he actually had salmon) he
would be guilty of breaking a federal law, “lying to a federal officer”.

Useful background info: “Don’t talk to the police” video from a law school
class [https://youtu.be/d-7o9xYp7eE](https://youtu.be/d-7o9xYp7eE)

~~~
dragonwriter
> Great, this is why we have a constitution and bill of rights - he has no
> legal obligation to speak to them

That's not at all true. Now, it may be true that it is not a _crime_ not to
speak to them, it almost certainly is a legal obligation attached to his
employment and he quite likely will be fired for cause if he continues to
stonewall.

~~~
mywittyname
Sounds like he will be fired anyway. At least stonewalling may prevent any
criminal action against him.

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gph
Weird, but really shouldn't almost the entire focus be on the terrible design
and the people responsible for it in the first place? Why does Miyagi still
have his job? Unless the "button pusher" was also the developer I don't see
what having him cooperate really accomplishes. I think we all generally know
what he did. He clicked the wrong thing. This was practically an eventuality.

~~~
ryandrake
The focus is surely going to be on finding a scapegoat to blame quickly and
coming up with a story that the public can understand that makes this all that
scapegoat's fault. The scapegoat will not have the word "manager" in his
title. The button pusher should be only talking to his union rep and/or lawyer
at this point.

~~~
sampo
Everyone "in the know" already knows HI-EMA has incompetent management because
such a bad user interface was allowed to be in use. This hunt for a scapegoat
just sends a signal that the management also has no intention to improve
themselves.

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zero_k
The whole society is getting short-changed by the idiots trying to make a
sacrificial goat out of her/him. Anybody who doesn't understand why s/he
doesn't talk, should read Sydney Dekker's books (in particular, "Just Culture
-- Restoring Trust and Accountability in your Organisation"). We need the NTSB
to do the investigation, they are non-blaming and serious professionals
concerned about the FUTURE not the PAST -- i.e. making sure it doesn't happen
again.

I seriously want to give a hug to the person who mis-clicked. If you have seen
that UX design, you know as well as anyone else, that indeed, most would have
mis-clicked over time.

The people investigating this are making a huge mistake.

~~~
ashleyn
If they want a sacrificial goat, take a look at the people who both
commissioned and developed that terrible user interface. I saw it on Twitter.
It wasn't much better than that Far Side cartoon that put "Wings Fall Off"
next to the backrest button on an airplane seat.

~~~
gargravarr
Yes, but what's easier to lay the blame on - the expensive system that the
government commissioned and will have to publicly say isn't good enough (and
thus need to commit to spending money on improving it), or the cheap contract
employee who can be summarily fired.

I don't blame the guy for not talking any more - he's (rightly) scared of
being crucified for misclicking.

~~~
Anticapitalist
He's an exempt member of a union, not a contractor.

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Spooky23
Any investigator is going to be on a headhunt.

The smart move is to stfu, call your union representative, and don’t talk to
the police until your lawyer makes the appropriate arrangements.

~~~
ams6110
And what is there to say, really? "I clicked the wrong thing." The reason why
that was likely to happen is blatantly obvious to anyone who has seen the
screenshots of the interface.

Edit: And STFU is smart advice in any situation where there is even a remote
chance you will be charged with something. You can always make a careful
statement later on advice of counsel. Nothing is lost by remaining quiet at
first.

~~~
ColinDabritz
Have we actually seen the real interface? There was the first round, which was
a mockup many were told was a 'screenshot', and a follow up that was a second
mock up that was closer.

[http://www.civilbeat.org/2018/01/hawaii-distributed-phony-
im...](http://www.civilbeat.org/2018/01/hawaii-distributed-phony-image-of-
missile-warning-screen/)

It's a common enough UI issue to be immediately clear to a professional how it
happened though.

~~~
scoot
"HEMA can’t publicize the actual screen because of security concerns — the
system could then then be vulnerable to hackers, Rapoza said."

The level of incompetence is astounding!

~~~
nulagrithom
It's unreal.

> “We asked (Hawaii Emergency Management Agency) for a screenshot and that’s
> what they gave us,” Ige [Hawaii Governor] spokeswoman Jodi Leong told Civil
> Beat on Tuesday. “At no time did anybody tell me it wasn’t a screenshot.”

So the governor asked for a screenshot and they sent him a "mockup" instead of
the actual interface?

I can only assume the actual interface was somehow _even worse_ than the fake.

~~~
Psilidae
Given all of the incompetency here, including the awful UI, and the password
on a sticky note that got leaked, I wouldn't be surprised if the links
themselves leaked info like: "Send missile alert (confirmation password is
hawaii1)".

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paulie_a
I hate to sound like a nut but I still feel like their crappy system got
hacked and they don't want to admit it

When I was a teenager I realized you could set of the emergency alert system
with a dtmf 4 digit code on some 144mhz with a ham radio.

I never did it, but I pretty much expect that to be still possible.

The reason I say this is because yes, it is possible someone got the wrong
button, but shit software like this probably has vnc with no auth/useless auth
so someone can activate remotely

~~~
xienze
I’m not sure it was hacking, I get the feeling that these events may be
intentional to kind of kick the tires on emergency systems and human
reactions, perhaps because the powers that be are expecting stuff to go down
in the near future. I mean we had Hawaii, then Japan, and in my neck of the
woods our nuclear power plant issued a false alarm as well. It just seems
really odd, all these things happening in close proximity.

~~~
Psilidae
This would make a bit of sense. I think someone on here mentioned how the
whole incident really highlighted that the general public has no fucking idea
what to do if they receive a message like this.

While it's worryingly similar to crying wolf, I would hope that this does lead
to more of the general public (even outside of Hawaii) actually thinking about
how they'd handle and react to an imminent threat.

------
brudgers
Reminds me of "Don't talk to the cops":
[https://thisistrue.com/dont_talk_to_the_cops/](https://thisistrue.com/dont_talk_to_the_cops/)

------
gesman
By now pretty much everyone knows the technical reason for mishap and probably
excessive resources are assigned to fix it.

Mandatory witch hunt is failing apparently due to good union/legal firewall.

Wish we could see that more often.

Too many good people fallen to that.

------
pfarnsworth
He's probably doing that on the advice of his lawyer, and I totally agree.
Politicians are in witch-hunt mode, and as he stated, he already gave a
statement and doesn't want to get goaded into making a statement that might be
used against him. I think that's smart.

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rectang
The top comment on the article is screaming for button-pusher blood:

> _So, as it turns out, the culprit who induced panic among over a million
> Hawai 'i citizens isn't nearly as contrite about his mistake as his
> superiors would have us believe. In spite of legions of supporters who have
> urged us to drop demands for his dismissal, he now has the audacity to be
> uncooperative in the investigation into the serious event that he alone
> triggered? Then TERMINATE him...._

Bloody obvious why cooperation is being withheld.

------
blackrock
The guy should get a lawyer.

This was a poorly designed software interface.

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droopybuns
This person in incredibly well advised.

Operators should not be blamed for government-mandated, piss poor alert
systems. The government is responsible for this fiasco, not the button pusher.

They have nothing to gain and a lot to lose by complying with an
investigation.

~~~
Theodores
Not necessarily, they could have just gone into some 'fight or flight' mode of
'freeze'. They could be at home, under the duvet, totally afraid to look at
the phone or email. Every day could be the day it is faced up to but the duvet
chosen instead. They could also have run off to stay with a friend not seen
since a long time ago and able/willing to harbour them.

If they had clicked the wrong button in a moment of distraction then that
might not be the end of the world, that could be fessed up to. However, what
if they were pissed off with their micro-manager and thought that their
'accidental click' would result in the manager's scalp? A whole lot of things
would then need to be looked into and it might not be a simple accident at
all, but the visible result of a lot of festering office politics.

------
indubitable
I think refusing to cooperate is generally the smartest play. Investigators
aren't asking questions to help you exonerate yourself, they're aiming to get
you to incriminate yourself as deeply as possible.

An officer asks you, "Do you know why I pulled you over today?"

\- Yes = admission of guilt. You're screwed.

\- No = indication of disregard for law, recklessness, and no situational
awareness. You're even more screwed.

\- Good afternoon officer, I'd rather not answer any questions. Would you like
to see my license and registration? = Bingo.

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p90puma
> The employee has since been reassigned to an unspecified job at HI-EMA but
> has not returned to work since the incident, Anthony said.

>The employee has not been disciplined but faces the possibility of
punishment, which could include termination, Anthony said.

Is this normal in the US. Govt. that you can not go to work for 2 weeks and
there has been zero disciplinary action?

~~~
dragonwriter
> Is this normal in the US. Govt.

HI-EMA is not part of the US Govt.

> that you can not go to work for 2 weeks and there has been zero disciplinary
> action?

It's true most places, not just in the US and not just in the public sector.
They did not indicate whether he was away with or without leave, and if he was
on leave for medical (including psychiatric) reasons, there are privacy
considerations which might prevent revealing that.

OTOH, if he is away without leave consequences are near certain, but the
disciplinary process in the public sector may be slow (and it may deliberately
be deferred in this case to maintain leverage for his cooperation in the
investigation, which probably had more critical importance—especially if it's
not a hunt for a scapegoat—than an attendance problem.)

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idlewords
Are we all operating off of a single screenshot, or has there been a public
video of what the process looks like, start to finish, including any
confirmation steps?

(Bonus points if the video is not of the actual live interface.)

------
SubiculumCode
Legal advice, most like. Or he could have done it on purpose, mentioned his
plan to someone, and is scared as hell now. I mean, we don't know anything.

