
The Superbook: Turn your smartphone into a laptop for $99 - brahmwg
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/andromium/the-superbook-turn-your-smartphone-into-a-laptop-f/description
======
DigitalJack
Motorola did this 5 years ago. Nobody cared.
[http://www.digitaltrends.com/buying-guides/a-complete-
guide-...](http://www.digitaltrends.com/buying-guides/a-complete-guide-to-the-
motorola-atrix-the-only-phone-laptop/)

I think the main problem is who wants to carry around a laptop that you have
to plug your phone in to use? That's a pretty big "Accessory." I mean, if you
already are carrying something around as big as a laptop, why cripple it with
phone hardware?

I think a more compelling use-case would be a phone dock video and usb
connections. But I don't know if even that is compelling enough to be
successful.\

I've thought that a phone would make a great trackpad for a laptop. Maybe
instead of the phone being the laptop, it just integrates nicely (app sync,
etc...) and you socket in as a trackpad and secondary "info" display.

~~~
kajecounterhack
My buddy had an atrix and he got the laptop dock; it was actually OK, but
since it was limited to that one phone it didn't work out long term (he
switched phones about a year in).

There are probably folks who don't do much more than word processing and
email, in which case this (a screen + keyboard + battery for your phone) might
actually be useful. I feel like this is the niche that tablets w/ keyboards
fill -- this will have to compete directly with those. It has the benefit of
the trackpad, which feels more like a full laptop.

~~~
fit2rule
I still have a Lapdock. I use mine as a handy workbench
monitory/keyboard/battery setup for the plethora of small device I have that
fit in its squid-like cable adapters: raspberry Pi's, beagleboards, and so on.
If but for that stupid decision to make non-standard i/o ports, the Lapdock
probably could have been a more useful general-purpose dock, already.

That's really something to keep in mind. Superbook is one thing, but its
really just a fixed Lapdock with a different ethos regarding interoperability.

------
ajiang
Oh hey guys, this is us. Thanks for posting!

I wasn't going to post our product in HN, since tech-specs wise this tends to
be a high-end audience, but I wanted to share a little bit about what we're
trying to accomplish and the reasoning behind the entry level specs.

The Superbook is the attempt to prove that the concept of device convergence
and the benefits of continuum are exciting enough to 1) get most people to not
need a laptop and 2) to provide mobile-first economies to have an affordable
option to do work without switching OS or need to buy another device.

Is it going to replace the MBP in silicon valley? Not yet. Most of the time I
require higher specs too. But for most of the world that uses their laptop
primarily for browsing the internet, writing documents, and watching movies on
a larger screen - it's enough. And it's also affordable enough that everyone
can try the concept out. We're aiming to build both the hardware _and_
software that makes this possible, with enough flexibility that you can run it
on any Android phone and with no technical knowledge needed.

What's probably my favorite use case: having come from a non-profit background
(YC S14, Bayes Impact) it's really awesome to see tech impact the world. We
are really really excited to be working with the Nelson Mandela Long Walk to
Freedom Education Project to provide Superbooks to kids in South Africa so
they can learn without restraints. Even having the basic keyboard, mouse, and
display will provide a great opportunity to better take in content and engage.

Happy to pop back in [doing Kickstarter support for the next hour] and answer
questions if folks on HN are curious. We're also in SF, so feel free to reach
out and drop by to see the prototypes! (email in profile)

~~~
larrik
Is there any way your hardware would support something like being the KVM for
a headless server (or family member's computer that you are working on) or
something?

~~~
apendleton
Seems unlikely, given that it lacks any kind of networking (it relies on the
phone for that). Of course, with a phone plugged into it you could use an
android VNC app.

~~~
larrik
I meant physically plugging it in.

------
soared
How many times do we have to watch this exact kickstarter project fail to
deliver? There have been countless made for phones, raspberry pis, and
tablets. Maybe they'll ship, but the ux is trash especially considering you
can get a chromebook for $100 more.

What is the actual benefit of this device? Instead of toting around a
chromebook, you tote around the shell of a chromebook? My laptop is never 'out
of sync' that problem was fixed years ago. IF I wanted laptop productivity
I'd... use a laptop?

~~~
chaostheory
I'm not really sure why people keep thinking that you're supposed to lug this
around. If I were to get this, I would only use it at home when a keyboard and
bigger screen would be nice; or I would buy one for the office and the house.
imo the whole point of this is so you wouldn't have to carry anything huge
anymore.

~~~
dpark
Then why a laptop form factor? Laptops exist to be lugged around.

~~~
mikestew
If I'm going to park one at home and at the office, it's going to have to be
better than what $99 buys you. Hell, my desk keyboard alone costs more than
that. So I compromise with that teensy eensy screen and (what I have to guess
to be...) a mediocre-at-best keyboard so that I ... don't have to carry it
around? Why not a docking station into which I can plug whatever screen and
keyboard I desire?

I dunno, I don't care to come across as a hater, but this looks like one of
those things that is cool at first glance with all kinds of possible use
cases, but you buy it, reality kicks in, and it gathers dust after a month.

~~~
chaostheory
I don't disagree with your desire for better quality, but as of this moment;
I'm not aware of any competing products that allow your phone to transform
into a laptop. The only one I was aware of is a Motorola product from 2-3
years back. If there is one, feel free to link to it.

Your complaint sounds a lot like the complaints that people made when the
iPhone first came out: nitpicking the specs and disregarding the paradigm
shift that it brings to the table.

~~~
dpark
This isn't a paradigm shift. This is dock for your phone. It's literally the
same paradigm as a laptop dock. You plug in your device and get to use it with
a bigger screen and keyboard. That's all.

I've been proven wrong before, so it could certainly happen again, but I just
cannot see this being a widely-desired product. How large is the set of people
who want a tiny, low-powered laptop that is useless without a phone tethered
to it? This is a geek fantasy, where we imagine that having a single computing
device is better somehow, despite there being no meaningful scenarios that
this enables.

~~~
chaostheory
> This isn't a paradigm shift. This is dock for your phone. It's literally the
> same paradigm as a laptop dock.

This is NOT a laptop dock. You speak as if there are already tons of other
docks for phones. I'm not aware of any aside from that old Motorola dock. Am I
wrong?

You can say the same thing about the iPhone. "It's just a Blackberry without
the keyboard... or a Palm without a pen." "The app store is not anything new
that we haven't seen from the carriers" The list goes on.

> How large is the set of people who want a tiny, low-powered laptop that is
> useless without a phone tethered to it?

I don't know but I do know in Asia (and in places like Manhattan) there are a
lot of people who live in tiny apartments and who primarily use their phones
as their primary (or really their only) personal computer. This would be
useful for them. It may not be this company that popularizes this design, but
I predict it will be widespread in the coming years.

> despite there being no meaningful scenarios that this enables

ok this is already not true. Not having to carry something as big as a laptop
is already a meaningful use case.

> This is a geek fantasy, where we imagine that having a single computing
> device is better someho

It's not a fantasy when 1. someone has already made it and 2. when you look
beyond the suburbs and your own needs and taste. Not everyone needs a super
powered laptop or for that matter can even afford one. Also not everyone knows
how to sync their phone with their other computer

~~~
dpark
> _You speak as if there are already tons of other docks for phones._

I didn't speak that way at all. This isn't a new category of device or concept
(given Motorola's device and Continuum from Microsoft), but that's not the
point. A paradigm shift is not merely defined by the creation of a new
product. "Hey, I taped a duck to a car. Everybody needs a duckcar. What a
paradigm shift!"

The point is that this isn't a useful product for the vast majority of people.
Who wants to sit on the couch using their laptop with a phone awkwardly
tethered to it? Who wants to have a laptop that they can't simply hand to
someone else to use (without also handing them their phone, or having them
install some app on their phone, which must also run Android). Who wants to
invest $100 (more after the early bird kickstarter stuff is done) in a device
that has a crummy screen and probably a crummy touchpad and keyboard when they
could buy a better chromebook or similar device for $200, and end up with a
laptop that doesn't have the same shortcomings? Who's needs are better filled
by this than by a separate device?

Again, I think this is a geek fantasy. We see two devices that are both
computers and think "hey, we should merge these". But that doesn't provide any
_utility_. It doesn't save much if any money. It doesn't enable new
functionality. It does exactly what mikestew said: it gathers dust.

This is very much like the Asus Padphone. It sounds interesting to merge a
phone and a tablet like this, but it's not actually useful. You just end up
with a tablet that's useless without the phone. It's not a better experience
in any way.

~~~
chaostheory
> This isn't a new category of device or concep

Neither was the iPhone or the iPad ("it's just a bigger iPhone")

> The point is that this isn't a useful product for the vast majority of
> people.

How do you know for sure? This isn't a device that's targeted for HN users.

> But that doesn't provide any utility.

It does and you still haven't disputed my point: Not having to carry a 12in
laptop in the subway. There are also plenty of people who are too poor to
afford a laptop. They can afford this. Also there are also a lot of people who
can't afford cloud features and don't know how to sync a phone and laptop.

> that has a crummy screen and probably a crummy touchpad

There are many people who don't care about the specs in this world. Not
everyone is a techie and not everyone wants the very best.

> It doesn't enable new functionality.

No it doesn't for us, but it does for people who don't own a separate desktop
or laptop. You have to look beyond yourself, your own social circle, and the
suburbs that you live in.

> Who wants to have a laptop that they can't simply hand to someone else to
> use

Similar to how a lot of smart phones really suck on battery life, I can
imagine accessories being made for this - like a case with a clip or better
yet a case with a slip cover that you can slide the phone into. Even then at
this price point and given the demographic that they're targetting, this
probably won't be a problem.

> This is very much like the Asus Padphone. It sounds interesting to merge a
> phone and a tablet like this, but it's not actually useful.

That's funny. Everyone, including myself, made fun of Samsung for doing the
same thing with the Note. Phablets have been selling just fine for years now.
Again just because it's not useful for you personally, it doesn't mean that
there isn't a market or need for it. The only thing that the Asus Padphone
proves is that ideas are cheap. Execution is where it counts.

~~~
dpark
> _Neither was the iPhone or the iPad ( "it's just a bigger iPhone")_

The iPhone was a paradigm shift because it was SO MUCH BETTER. The iPad was a
paradigm shift because it was a new form factor that people wanted. It solved
the problem of reading on a small phone screen (especially before large screen
phones were common) and the problem of lugging/holding a laptop for reading.
It also got better battery life than most laptops and phones at the time.

In what way is this a better experience?

> _How do you know for sure? This isn 't a device that's targeted for HN
> users._

Who is the target, then?

> _It does and you still haven 't disputed my point: Not having to carry a
> 12in laptop in the subway._

How does this solve the problem of carrying a laptop? It is effectively a
laptop, just a less useful/more limited one. Yeah, you can just not carry
this, and I guess that "solves" the problem, but you can also just not carry
your laptop and the problem is solved the same way.

> _There are also plenty of people who are too poor to afford a laptop. They
> can afford this._

These hypothetical people can afford a high-powered phone and $100 for a
glorified dock but can't afford $150 for a dedicated chromebook. You think
this is really a large population of potential customers? You think a lot of
people who cannot afford $150 are going to spend $100 on a clearly non-
critical device?

> _Also there are also a lot of people who can 't afford cloud features and
> don't know how to sync a phone and laptop._

Your hypothetical customer base seems really farfetched. If you "can't afford
cloud features", you probably can't afford a $100 dock. In reality, this
customer base is largely using the free 15 gigs from Google. The people who
can't afford to pay for more exist, but they're not likely to be buying this,
and they're not likely to be using high-end phones with huge amounts of
storage either, so the problem of syncing is a bit of a red herring anyway.

As for not _knowing_ how to sync a laptop and phone, no one does that manually
anymore. You use web-based products for most things and the stuff like photos
gets gets synced automatically.

> _No it doesn 't for us, but it does for people who don't own a separate
> desktop or laptop. You have to look beyond yourself, your own social circle,
> and the suburbs that you live in._

Are poor people supposed to be too dumb to realize that they would be better
off buying a chromebook for only a little more? Your children can use your
chromebook for homework while you check the news on your phone or take it with
you to the store. You can leave your chromebook for your spouse when you go to
work. You can still use your chomebook when your phone battery is dead. This
is not a replacement for a laptop. It's a phone accessory. The kickstarter
page says so clearly.

Do you imagine that there is an army of poor people holding exactly $100 and
desperate to spend it on luxury technology and not, say, basic necessities?

> _That 's funny. Everyone, including myself, made fun of Samsung for doing
> the same thing with the Note. Phablets have been selling just fine for years
> now. Again just because it's not useful for you personally, it doesn't mean
> that there isn't a market or need for it. The only thing that the Asus
> Padphone proves is that ideas are cheap. Execution is where it counts._

Maybe type "asus padphone" (or "asus padfone" since I guess I spelled it
wrong) into a search engine to see what I'm talking about before responding
dismissively? The padfone wasn't a "phablet". It was a phone that could mount
in a tablet dock to become a tablet. It was a niche item that didn't catch on
despite multiple iterations because a tablet that's useless without a phone
and costs almost as much as a standalone tablet has a pretty small market of
mostly gadget geeks.

~~~
chaostheory
> The iPhone was a paradigm shift because it was SO MUCH BETTER

Yes. Now techies know that in hindsight. However before it was released many
of us complained that the specs were crap and that it didn't have a physical
keyboard which is why I used it as an example. The same thing happened with
the iPad when it was derided as just a "bigger iPhone" and that "there have
been plenty of good enough Windows based tablets in existence".

> In what way is this a better experience?

I'm not going to repeat my other points a 3rd time. I've already made my
points in my previous replies.

> It solved the problem of reading on a small phone screen (especially before
> large screen phones were common) and the problem of lugging/holding a laptop
> for reading

What if you don't want a separate tablet or can't afford a decent one? What if
you don't want to lug around anything the size of a tablet? There are also
issues with sync. These are all common issues for non-techies living in urban
areas with little living space.

> These hypothetical people can afford a high-powered phone and $100 for a
> glorified dock but can't afford $150 for a dedicated chromebook.

The first chromebooks launched at $350 with decent ones at $450 (using your
example "Why would anyone want to buy a chrome book when a real laptop is $50
more? What features does it have that MS laptops dont? Why would anyone buy a
device that only works if you hvae an internet connection?"). Given time,
better logistics, and scale; $100 probably isn't going to be the long term
price for this type of dock so there will eventually be a greater price
difference than just $50 (within 1-2 years it'll be priced at $50 and maybe
even less). History has proven time and again that electronics get cheaper,
faster, and better over time. Aside from price, there's also the issue of
syncing between two devices.

> In reality, this customer base is largely using the free 15 gigs from
> Google.

There are millions of people who can't afford a phone with Android proper
(bundled with Google services and apps) and therefore don't have the free 15
gigs. There are also a lot of people who get charged exhorbitant fees for data
(wifi and mobile). This only seems far fetched if you no experience with
developing nations or even provinces.

> Do you imagine that there is an army of poor people holding exactly $100 and
> desperate to spend it on luxury technology and not, say, basic necessities?

I don't have to imagine anything. Even in China's poorest remote countrysides,
many farmers own LCD TVs. Some even have a satellite dish to pair with it.

> Maybe type "asus padphone" (or "asus padfone" since I guess I spelled it
> wrong) into a search engine to see what I'm talking about before responding
> dismissively?

The problem with this example is the same as citing the Motorola Atria (or
Motorola's docking phone). Only a specific phone model from a specific
manufacturer can use the dock. This is really different from being able to use
ANY Android phone. Also most people don't have access to telecom phone
subsidies which shave off a few hundred $ off the true price. The PadPhone was
released at $550 without a keyboard which is a big difference when you compare
it to $100.

~~~
dpark
> _Yes. Now techies know that in hindsight. However before it was released
> many of us complained that the specs were crap..._

You're making the mistake of assuming that because occasionally new products
are dismissed incorrectly (iPhone, iPad), that means other new products being
dismissed are being incorrectly dismissed. New products get introduced quite
frequently and most of them never gain any traction.

> _I 'm not going to repeat my other points a 3rd time. I've already made my
> points in my previous replies._

Yeah, you haven't actually enumerated real problems that this solves. You are
ignoring real issues with this design (useless without a phone) and claiming
benefits it doesn't have (no need to carry it? Cheaper?). The only benefit
seems to be that you don't need to sync it.

> _What if you don 't want a separate tablet or can't afford a decent one?
> What if you don't want to lug around anything the size of a tablet? There
> are also issues with sync. These are all common issues for non-techies
> living in urban areas with little living space._

Then you don't buy an iPad. I'm not sure what your point was with all this.

> _The first chromebooks launched at $349 (using your example "Why would
> anyone want to buy a chrome book when a real laptop is $50 more? What
> features does it have that MS laptops dont? Why would anyone buy a device
> that only works if you hvae an internet connection?")._

Yeah, the first chrome books were too expensive and basically no one bought
them because they were a terrible buy. I feel like you're making my argument
for me at this point.

> _Given time, better logistics, and scale; $100 probably isn 't going to be
> the long term price for this type of dock so there will eventually be a
> greater price difference than just $50 (within 1-2 years it'll be priced at
> $50 and maybe even less). History has proven time and again that electronics
> get cheaper, faster, and better over time._

Yep, Chromebooks are getting cheaper too. In 1-2 years a Chromebook will
probably cost $100. I don't know why you imagine that this think will drop in
price but a Chromebook prices will stagnate, especially since this this is
basically just a Chromebook without the processor.

> _Aside from price, there 's also the issue of syncing between two devices._

You are way overstating this issue. The set of people who can install the app
and get this working overlaps hugely with the set of people who can manage
basic sync.

> _There are millions of people who can 't afford a phone with Android proper
> (bundled with Google services and apps) and therefore don't have the free 15
> gigs. There are also a lot of people who get charged exhorbitant fees for
> data (wifi and mobile). This only seems far fetched if you no experience
> with developing nations or even provinces._

And people who can't afford Android phones are the target market? Which is why
this thing only has a qwerty keyboard and an American power plug?

If I couldn't afford a full fledged Android phone, I also don't know if I'd
spend $100 on a dock that requires Android to operate. That's a risky
purchase. Does the app even work without Google services? (I honestly don't
know.) Will your phone be powerful enough for the dock? (They require a pretty
high spec phone.)

> _I don 't have to imagine anything. Even in China's poorest remote
> countrysides, many farmers own LCD TVs. Some even have a satellite dish to
> pair with it._

Yep, because a TV and satellite provide real entertainment value. The question
is what value this dock delivers to that poor rural farmer that makes it worth
$100.

> _The problem with this example is the same as citing the Motorola Atria (or
> Motorola 's docking phone). Only a specific phone model from a specific
> manufacturer can use the dock. This is really different from being able to
> use ANY Android phone. Also most people don't have access to telecom phone
> subsidies which shave off a few hundred $ off the true price. The PadPhone
> was released at $550 without a keyboard which is a big difference when you
> compare it to $100._

You're right. These guys have perfected the English keyboard and American
power plug dock that rural farmers in China have been waiting for. This is
definitely not a bad product and the past failures of similar products do not
in any way indicate the lack of a market, only that the product wasn't
perfect. But this product is perfect for the rural Chinese market they are
clearly aiming for with their English Kickstarter page and high end phone
requirements. They fixed the one and only problem which was that previous
products didn't work with as many phones.

Edit: At this point, I should point out that you aren't even arguing that this
is a good product anymore. You're arguing that some hypothetical future
version that costs half as much could be a good product.

~~~
chaostheory
> You're making the mistake of assuming that because occasionally new products
> are dismissed incorrectly

Well your mistake is that my assumption is less correct than yours. What makes
you 100% sure that your dismissals are correct? Right now the market hasn't
proven either of us right. Give it 3-5 years. Right now the Kickstarter
campaign is in my favor.

> Yeah, you haven't actually enumerated real problems that this solves.

I can argue that you're ignoring problems I bring up just because it doesn't
apply to you personally. Having to carry a laptop everywhere is a real pain
point which increases depending on where you live. Just because it isn't a
problem for you personally it doesn't mean that it's not a real problem that a
lot of people face, even in the US. It's hard to understand this if you've
never lived in a dense urban metro. People don't usually go straight home to
their closet sized apartment. They stay out for hours before going home and
usually they don't have a car.

> You are ignoring real issues with this design (useless without a phone)

It's like arguing headphones are bad because you can't use them without an
audio device. This is just a bad argument. Both headphones and this dock
augment the products that they pair with; not being an independent product
doesn't make it bad.

> Yeah, the first chrome books were too expensive and basically no one bought
> them because they were a terrible buy.

Yet the price eventually came down and now they're a force to be reckoned with
even though they still have most of the weaknesses that pundits complained
about. It's still possible to buy a real laptop for a little more cash. I'm
pretty sure this favors my side of the argument and not yours.

> The set of people who can install the app and get this working overlaps
> hugely with the set of people who can manage basic sync.

How can you be so sure about this? Installing an app is much easier than
syncing two or more devices. Besides this isn't only issue preventing sync,
which again you're conveniently ignoring.

> And people who can't afford Android phones are the target market? Which is
> why this thing only has a qwerty keyboard and an American power plug?

I was speaking about the long term potential of the device, and not short
term, initial quarterly sales figures. Chromebook wouldn't exist if Google
made its decision solely on the 1st year of sales.

> I also don't know if I'd spend $100 on a dock that requires Android to
> operate.

It probably wont' be $100 by the time it reaches those markets.

> Yep, because a TV and satellite provide real entertainment value

And phones with installed movies and video games don't?

> But this product is perfect for the rural Chinese market they are clearly
> aiming for with their English Kickstarter page and high end phone
> requirements

Yes it totally makes sense for them to market a Chinese product for American
Kickstarter backers. /s rural China isn't the only part of the developing
world either. You're thinking in too limited of a time frame and too small of
a geographic area as well as demographic, it doesn't have room for vision.

> At this point, I should point out that you aren't even arguing that this is
> a good product anymore.

The iPhone wasn't a good product. It was a revolutionary one with lots of
flaws. The same goes for the iPad and a lot of devices that made a major
impact. This one included. Whether or not this company succeeds is another
matter, but I fully believe that this class of device will be part of the
future.

~~~
dpark
> _What makes you 100% sure that your dismissals are correct?_

Nothing. I said in my first comment that I could be wrong. I'm pretty
confident that this is not anything but a niche product at best, but I could
be missing the use case.

> _I can argue that you 're ignoring problems I bring up just because it
> doesn't apply to you personally. Having to carry a laptop everywhere is a
> real pain point which increases depending on where you live. Just because it
> isn't a problem for you personally it doesn't mean that it's not a real
> problem that a lot of people face, even in the US. It's hard to understand
> this if you've never lived in a dense urban metro. People don't usually go
> straight home to their closet sized apartment. They stay out for hours
> before going home and usually they don't have a car._

This device doesn't solve that problem at all. Unless you assume you're going
to buy two of these things, one for the office and one for home, at which
point you're clearly talking about people with significant amounts of
disposable cash who could solve this many other ways. A cheap desktop/laptop
at home and remote desktop to work solves this for work stuff. So does
OneDrive or Office 365 or Google Drive or DropBox or Box or a number of other
services that you can definitely afford if you would even consider buying two
of these just to avoid carrying your laptop home because you want to hang out
in a bar for a few hours.

> _It 's like arguing headphones are bad because you can't use them without an
> audio device. This is just a bad argument. Both headphones and this dock
> augment the products that they pair with; not being an independent product
> doesn't make it bad._

It makes it bad when the alternative is a standalone device that solves all
the same problems and delivers many extra features for little extra money.

A better analogy than regular headphones might be noise-cancelling headphones.
You can buy a set of noise-cancelling headphones that operate by themselves. A
hypothetical set of headphones that cost $30 less but can't be used by
themselves because they rely on the phone to pick up the ambient noise would
be a terrible option. It's not enough cheaper to justify the need to tether to
a phone for functionality that the standalone product delivers better.

> _Yet the price eventually came down and now they 're a force to be reckoned
> with even though they still have most of the weaknesses that pundits
> complained about. It's still possible to buy a real laptop for a little more
> cash. I'm pretty sure this favors my side of the argument and not yours._

It doesn't favor the argument that this specifically is a good product. If you
can pick up one for $30 in a few years, I might feel differently.

> _How can you be so sure about this? Installing an app is much easier than
> syncing two or more devices. Besides this isn 't only issue preventing sync,
> which again you're conveniently ignoring._

If you can install an app and use it for this, you can install an app and use
it for sync. Sync isn't rocket science. You're also conveniently ignoring the
other issues with this device, such as the fact that most apps don't support,
e.g., resizeable and multiple windows.

> _I was speaking about the long term potential of the device, and not short
> term, initial quarterly sales figures. Chromebook wouldn 't exist if Google
> made its decision solely on the 1st year of sales._

I actually don't think it has much long-term potential either, because by the
time this device hits a reasonable price point, chromebooks and laptops will
still be close.

> _And phones with installed movies and video games don 't?_

No moreso than laptops/chromebooks with the same videogames and movies
installed. If you mostly want to watch movies and play games, you can also buy
a tablet for $50 and probably be happier than you would with either of these
options.

> _Yes it totally makes sense for them to market a Chinese product for
> American Kickstarter backers. /s rural China isn't the only part of the
> developing world either. You're thinking in too limited of a time frame and
> too small of a geographic area as well as demographic, it doesn't have room
> for vision._

I was using your example. If you rephase it in terms of any other developing
area, the same criticism applies, because there's no developing area I'm aware
of using North American plugs and an English qwerty keyboard. I get that you
think this product will develop into something useful over time, but I think a
standalone laptop will always be right there costing barely more and
delivering more value.

I think they're targeting the US audience because you've got to market
something like this to people with significant disposable cash because it
delivers little actual value beyond novelty.

> _The iPhone wasn 't a good product. It was a revolutionary one with lots of
> flaws. The same goes for the iPad and a lot of devices that made a major
> impact. This one included. Whether or not this company succeeds is another
> matter, but I fully believe that this class of device will be part of the
> future._

Could be, but I doubt it. We'll see.

~~~
chaostheory
> This device doesn't solve that problem at all. Unless you assume you're
> going to buy two of these things, one for the office and one for home, at
> which point you're clearly talking about people with significant amounts of
> disposable cash who could solve this many other ways.

It still solves a problem that exists, which is maybe why they've already met
there Kickstarter goal 10 times over. People in developing nations may have
different problems this would solve.

> A better analogy than regular headphones might be noise-cancelling
> headphones.

A new convoluted analogy isn't going to change the fact that "this isn't a
viable product because it's 'useless without a phone'" is a terrible argument.

> If you can pick up one for $30 in a few years, I might feel differently.

So now you're saying it's viable but just too expensive? It's going to hit
that price one day and maybe even below.

> If you can install an app and use it for this, you can install an app and
> use it for sync. Sync isn't rocket science.

This is definitely not true outside of techies.

> by the time this device hits a reasonable price point, chromebooks and
> laptops will still be close.

I think I've already pointed this out, but detractors of the Chromebook used
the same reasoning as to why Chromebook would die. They were wrong.

> If you mostly want to watch movies and play games, you can also buy a tablet
> for $50 and probably be happier than you would with either of these options.

Since it's just a screen and keyboard, you do realize that this is a cheaper
tablet right? The only reason it's not cheaper now is because only one company
is aware of this device class's future and potential. Besides, I've already
proven my point that people in developing nations spend money on non-life
critical electronics.

> because there's no developing area I'm aware of using North American plugs
> and an English qwerty keyboard.

There's a country called the Philippines that meets this criteria with a
population of 100 million. Even if that didn't exist, have you seen an East
Asian keyboard? It's basically a western keyboard with extra ideograph
(hanzi/kanji) characters on top of the letters. Repurposing this device with a
different keyboard and power cable wouldn't be hard. Nitpicking unimportant
details can stop people from seeing the big picture.

> I think they're targeting the US audience because you've got to market
> something like this to people with significant disposable cash because it
> delivers little actual value beyond novelty.

Yes for now, and apparently people here do see value in it.

------
surprised_dev
Always when I see concepts like this I feel like it's a great idea but after
few minutes I really can not think of a use-case for me.

First I would like to have a phone with x86 cpu so I could run the same
software as on my desktop, without real desktop cpu it will be hard to use
device like that as laptop replacement.

Secondly why would I like to carry something like that instead of normal
laptop. I understand I can buy e.g. two devices one for work one for home but
still why not just have a two laptops and sync stuff using cloud.

I think it's not a future, the future is folding device that could work as
phone and unfolded as laptop. We are not there yet to combine everything in
one device that would be useful for every use-case.

~~~
maxxxxx
I would like a docking station that has a fast CPU and lots of RAM. When the
phone is plugged in, you can use the computing power of the docking station
instead of the phone CPU. And it should run windows or OSX apps.

~~~
0x6c6f6c
And it would.. what? Use the display of your phone?

Otherwise you're literally describing a computer.

~~~
maxxxxx
Sorry, forgot the 27 inch screen, external mouse, keyboard and USB Hub. In
short, my phone contains the OS and my data and it can be used on small
screens or multi-monitor setups.

~~~
mikejmoffitt
You've described using a phone as a mass storage device.

~~~
mikestew
He just described iOS/MacOS/iCloud (s%/iCloud/Dropbox, or whatever you prefer
for centralized storage). If I'm going to use the phone just for data, then I
might as well open that presentation from iCloud from my MacBook that's
plugged into my 27" monitor and Das Keyboard (insert your kb of choice).
Because _that_ I know works. Experience tells me kludgey rigmarole like the
proposed or even the Superbook just don't work as well as you hoped when you
POSTed your cc number.

------
rsync
I'm confused by this stretch goal:

$1M - Option to upgrade to 1080p HD screen (w/ additional cost)

... which would suggest that the original screen spec is _actually lower_ than
"1080p" ?

Obligatory: [https://xkcd.com/732/](https://xkcd.com/732/)

~~~
Roboprog
Re: 1080p.

We lived with 480 _i_ in our most-used display for a _very_ long time :-)

(comment written on my aging MBP with a 700-something screen, rather than
1080/retina class display)

~~~
FussyZeus
We also lived in caves for a long time too, I don't see people lining up for
that.

LCD's are so damn cheap now there's really no excuse for anything under 1080p.
I've seen chromebooks with 4K displays for $300.

~~~
Roboprog
Forgot to mention: once you reach a certain pixel density, you really hit the
point of diminishing returns. 4K x 2K on a small laptop screen is going to
look much the same to my aging eyes as 2K x 1K on that size.

Now, give me a nice 40 to 50 inch 4K on my desk, and that sounds pretty nice.
I can sit back a ways, and not have to focus on something 2 feet away.

~~~
FussyZeus
I have a 28" 4K on my desk and the picture is absolutely stunning. I'd imagine
any more dense than that I'd have a hard time appreciating, but I think it
matters way more in terms of where the display is relative to your eyes. For
example, my monitor is usually about 12" away from my face, whereas my TV is
about 7 feet. A 1080p picture looks just fine compared to a 4K picture at
those distances, I never feel like I'm missing anything.

------
Artlav
As cute as this is, it's missing the core issue - a phone lacks real OS and
real software. It does not, usually, come with anything on it that is
available on the regular desktop/laptop.

This would take severe hacking to work around.

Either (1) a software ecosystem should get evolved around the ARM/Android-like
platform (that is, the project is a bit too early), or (2) there should be a
virtual machine that is rather lightweight and transparent under Android to
allow the PC software to run.

Seeing that this is ARM, i don't expect the (2) to be a real option. (1) might
work if you constrain yourself to open-source Linux environment and is good at
coding/admin, but as soon as your work would need anything proprietary or
anything from Windows things would collapse.

TL;DR: The mobile and PC tech is converging, but we are not there yet.

~~~
hyperpallium
[http://termux.com](http://termux.com)

~~~
Artlav
Sure, Android is more or less Linux, so lots of the usual stuff would work.
This is pretty much what i mean by (1).

------
unwiredben
This reminds me a lot of the Palm Foleo, a device I worked on ten years ago.
It was mini-laptop sized, designed to be a phone companion, but it worked over
Bluetooth and actually ran its own applications, just using the BT connection
for continual data sync. This one has a much better chance of actually
shipping, and the advance of computing power has made it a lot more viable.
Good luck.

~~~
tmzt
Yeah, you basically invented the netbook a few months too early, and marketed
it as an accessory when it was a full-fledged computer hardware-wise.

By the way, did the GPL code used on that ever get released, assuming the demo
units counted as distribution?

~~~
rcarmo
I don't see the point of asking any of these questions in this fashion...

~~~
tmzt
No intention to offend or accuse here, just two points that stuck with me from
that time and which I've been curious about. To my knowledge only a few
developer units were released and remained property of Palm, hence my caveat
in asking the question.

As to the first point, I was personally excited to see a small ARM-based
laptop, and dissapointed when it's capabilities and marketing as an accessory
led to its denise. Not that the unclear direction of Palm's software at the
time helped. It was the right call and yet disappointing.

------
buckbova
Kind of like webtop.

[http://www.geek.com/mobile/motorola-webtop-3-0-brings-ics-
to...](http://www.geek.com/mobile/motorola-webtop-3-0-brings-ics-to-big-
screens-1480457/)

Not sure why the idea didn't pan out. Maybe lack of apps that translated to
the bigger screen.

~~~
ccozan
I still have the Atrix 4G and the Moto Lapdock. Amazing tech, ahead of the
time. With the current smartphones, with multiple cores and 3-4Gb RAM, this
would have worked like a charm. Webtop was nice, but lacked the processing
power.

This thing is cute, but Motorola may have some patents on the technology.

------
projectramo
Can anyone comment on the likelihood of being able to create this for the
amount they propose?

I have been burned by hardware devices on kickstarter, and I have heard my
hardware friends say that it is much harder, and sometimes they can tell right
away that they cannot deliver the product for the amount raised.

I don't know if that is true here or not. Just wondering if someone knows if
this can be done.

(I know, keyboards and monitors already exist.)

~~~
gerbal
Given the parts look like they're off a bargain basement chrome book just
without the expensive processor and ssd, the hardware will be low quality, but
they can probably hit the $100 price point.

~~~
tmzt
Isn't that SSD on the ARM versions just an eMMC, so close in price to a
MicroSD card.

------
optforfon
You can get a cheap Chromebook (which, though inexpensive are actually quite
nice quality wise), install crouton on the chromebook, install Lil'Debi on the
phone and have an X-server connection over USB. It'd cost about the same and
you'd get to have an extra usable device

The way I see it, the only way I think it can really take off (as a niche
product) is if the screen and keyboard are amazing (like a Pixel) and it's
ultra thin (thinner than a Mac Air). Then I'm sure there is a crowd that wants
to have their whole lives on their $700 super flagship cellphone and will have
this very slick interface for when they want to access it with a bit more
screen and keyboard.

I didn't really read into the details, so maybe you guys are already doing
this, but you could also have the whole setup work from any given computer
with a keyboard and screen

If you have something like that.. you could charge a LOT more.

Very slick kickstarter btw. Wish you guys the best =)

~~~
az0xff
All of those installation steps and disjoint applications make this comment
sound like one of the early detractors of Dropbox commenting on its Show HN
thread.

------
xur17
I'm curious how much removing the cpu and graphics chip from a laptop shaves
off the price. Chromebooks all already near this price range, and they work as
standalone devices, which is nice.

I'm picturing myself at the airport awkwardly plugging my phone into my
laptop, and trying to find a good place to sit it next to me.

------
schnevets
I don't understand why these products are always pitched as a consumer product
when this is an enterprise dream come true. People are fickle and refuse to
change their personal habits, but using my phone as a thin client sounds a lot
more appealing than having separate laptops for work & play.

~~~
jszymborski
The problem I see with this is that, even if the phone is work property, it's
still often used for play as well as work (because who carries around a work
mobile as well as a personal).

Blackberry tried to address this problem, but I think we all can agree that
they were unable to address pretty much any problem at that point.

A little OT but...

I'd very much like to see a Qubes-like OS for my phone, so I can use one VM
for e.g Work, another for Banking, another for Personal, so I don't have to
worry about a messed up permission system or my Banking creds being leaked by
some rando gobble-all-your-info app-of-the-month.

Of course that's just a dream until battery life and ARM CPUs approach laptop
performance.

~~~
jonknee
> The problem I see with this is that, even if the phone is work property,
> it's still often used for play as well as work (because who carries around a
> work mobile as well as a personal).

A lot of people carry around two phones, specifically the same type of people
who have two laptops.

~~~
jszymborski
> A lot of people

Well, I'll push back on the phrase "a lot", but point taken.

~~~
jonknee
I guess it depends on your circles, but most professionals I know have
multiple phones. It is not as common in tech circles I guess. Most attorneys I
know have two. Ditto for finance people. If you've ever done e-discovery work
you will want two devices!

~~~
jszymborski
I've definitely given it thought in the past but disregarded it as silly, but
you might have convinced me!

------
spraak
The creator posted in here that they didn't want to post this on HN because
it's not the target audience. Clearly it's not with so many comments about why
you wouldn't use it.. but I think it's a great thing for its intended audience
(especially given the price) which seems to be much more casual computer
users, or maybe even moreso, people who don't have a computer but have a smart
phone.

------
jandrese
It would probably be a bit fiddly given how every phone is a little different,
but it would be cooler if you could slot your phone into the case instead of
having it dangle from a cable.

That said, I'm not sure there is much point to this when you could just carry
around a netbook. The phone integration is almost guaranteed to be glitchy
thanks to fragmentation on Android and trying to use apps outside of their
expected environment.

~~~
diadatp
They sell a "Universal Side Mount" as part of their "Superbook Special"
bundle. That should solve the dangling from a cable issue and enable front
facing camera use.

------
bryanlarsen
The idea of using your phone as your main computer definitely seems like it
could be the future. You can hook it up to something like this, or a USB-C
monitor with a keyboard attached, or to a TV via MHL with a bluetooth
keyboard, or whatever.

And tablet software is close, but doesn't quite feel right. This sort of thing
just needs to get popular enough that software makers respond with the needed
tweaks.

The problem is path to market.

Normally power users are the early adopters. They're willing to try new stuff,
to put up with bleeding edge hassles to get their needs met. But this isn't
for power users, phones and mobile apps aren't powerful enough.

Somebody just needs to find a willing early adopter and it should take off.
Maybe an industry like logistics, maybe somewhere in the third world.
Chromebooks had a similar problem, but they found a niche in education and now
have sufficient volume to push into mainstream.

------
danr4
This is something I think Apple should focus on. Well maybe after the car they
are building.

They already control both hardware and software aspects of their devices, so
compared to other companies, they are in the best position to make it so that
all their devices are basically the same device, only with a different
interface and form factor.

This doesn't mean they shouldn't work separately - if I'm playing a game on my
computer, I still want to be able to text using my phone. But if I just
arrived home and I was in the middle of a conversation, while reading an
article, I want to be able to put both on my computer screen in a flick of a
finger.

It looked as though as it was going to happen a few years back, when several
companies tried to do something like this (Asus, Motorola) but now it looks
like the idea was abandoned.

~~~
glhaynes
It sounds like maybe you want Apple's "Continuity" features, especially
Handoff? It's not _quite_ as simple as your scenario (you'd have to do two
separate "handoffs", one for the article, and one for the conversation), but
it's close.

Here's a description of them today; their OS updates this fall will also add a
universal clipboard. [https://support.apple.com/en-
us/HT204681](https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT204681)

~~~
mikestew
The texting conversation would already be waiting in iMessage. The article is
just a ⌘-Tab away. To me, it seems even easier than the original desire to
swipe. Don't do anything, it's already waiting for you. :-)

------
mark_l_watson
I like the idea but the price seems to be $150, not $99. The price point seems
critical. I paid $190 for an HP Stream 11 and it makes a great travelling
Linux box. If the eventual price were < $80, and with the advantages of having
your whole environment on your phone, then that sounds good.

I tried to get an adapter for my Samsung Note 4 would use an external HDMI
monitor, but did not find much joy. If a few phone manufacturers would
standardize on a docking standard so being able to walk up to a Kiosk or a
docking station when visiting other companies, travelling, etc., then that
would serve a real need.

------
post_break
I wish it could dock the phone behind the screen or something. I don't want to
have my phone connected to this thing like some sort of tether through a USB
cable.

~~~
kajecounterhack
+1 even a velcro strap that feels really solid. The side phone-holder
attachment is a little flimsy looking.

~~~
PieterH
Velcro strips that you cut to size are cheap and surprisingly useful as a way
of anchoring your phone on e. g. your dashboard.

------
Qworg
MSFT has the "phone becomes a computer" with Continuum already:
[https://www.microsoft.com/en-
us/windows/Continuum](https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/Continuum) (but
you need a Lumia... :| )

Having a laptop form factor is very interesting though - it brings in a lot of
questions too. Is it a dumb peripheral? What does it need access to on the
phone?

~~~
0x6c6f6c
It's one of the main points to Ubuntu Phones as well, convergence from
phone/tablet to desktop.

Plug it in and use it as a full scale desktop experience.

It's only available on the newer models as the entire system is beta and under
testing though.

~~~
Qworg
Very cool, thanks.

There's definitely a marketing bridge to cross here - when Steve Jobs released
the iPhone, it wasn't "your iPod as a phone!", it was "here's a magical device
that does things you never imagined were possible".

I've yet to hear a good pitch for any of these systems that appeals broadly
outside of tech. =/

~~~
0x6c6f6c
I don't find extremely compelling arguments, but there's points to be made.
Having a phone that's also your computer is convenient, so having a
desktop/laptop dock for your phone that would seemlessly interface would be an
interesting take. Remove the $900 work laptop and instead purchase a
smartphone capable of everything you need for your business. Most employers
provide smartphones already, so if you can manage the ecosystem for the
company standards, you could effectively cut your costs in half for every
employee.

Plus, licensing costs would also drop, having only one device rather than two.
A phone that requires a license on top of the work computer is just doubling
cost. A single device has a single license.

Honestly, I see how it could be useful, but the arguments aren't exactly
convincing. At a personal level, I could see how a strong smartphone could be
beneficial to have as a simple docking solution whether I go to work or home,
plus constantly having it charged would be nice- Those lapdocks have batteries
that charge the phone while it operates, same for desktop dock solutions.

All in all, I'd buy into it if I liked the ecosystem the phone offered at
every level- but now you need to convince me on how the application offering
is for Android/iOs/Windows/Ubuntu on likely ARM devices in terms of mobile
applications, scaling up to desktop applications.

------
drusepth
They really should have made this slightly thicker to let you store your phone
in it when in use or travelling. Having a phone dangling off a short dongle
all the time is incredibly inconvenient when using a laptop in most places.
Forcing that tether to even use the laptop is even worse.

------
figers
I like the idea of one core device to use for Mobile and desktop modes, but if
you have to carry around a laptop anyway, why not just get a Chromebook that
has full chrome browser and can run Android apps OR really any laptop...

I want my mobile device to have this experience when I connect a rollable or
foldable screen, bluetooth foldable keyboard and mouse.

------
thejeremyweaver
Dear Apple,

Please make a similar "accessory" for iPhones. I'd gladly pay 5x or more, and
I'm probably not alone.

~~~
sneak
Give them another year or three to unify macOS and associated hardware onto
ARM and you will absolutely get your wish.

------
zokier
Statements like "incredibly powerful computer" describing a smart phone always
ring false and bit silly to my ears. I'm not saying that phones haven't made
great advances in the past years, but still that "incredibly powerful
computer" is about as powerful as 10 year old PC.

~~~
lrem
Haven't PCs stopped getting more powerful quite a few years ago? The only
exceptions I see is swapping spinning disk with ssd and ever-growing gaming
GPUs. If you're not gaming, in a couple years you might be hard pressed to
spot the difference in performance.

~~~
zokier
The past couple of years (maybe since Haswell, or 3 years) have been slower
progress, but on the other hand I'd say the low hanging fruit on mobile chips
have been picked too by now and the progress there is also winding down.

People have been chatting and surfing and whatnot just fine with their 200MHz
Pentiums at the time, so its not that surprising that it might be bit
difficult for many people to truly appreciate just the amount of power
available these days. Of course Wirth's and Parkinson's laws do not help here
either.

Just for fun, here is a small comparison with 9 year old CPU and 3 year old
CPU:
[http://www.anandtech.com/bench/product/55?vs=837](http://www.anandtech.com/bench/product/55?vs=837)

~~~
lrem
You're actually consistent with what I had in mind. A 3 year old quad core is
2-3 times faster than a 9 year old dual core, in most of the embarrassingly
parallel benchmarks. I.e. despite all the process improvements, computing
power per core stagnated. Personal computers mostly remain at two cores, four
accessible at a premium. Personal computers are simply fast enough and the
progress is better used by moving more pieces off the motherboard onto the
CPU. If someone needs more power, then he's considered to be building a
workstation or a server and charged way more than for personal stuff.

I have no clue if you're right about arm progress saturating, I haven't been
following that.

------
turtlebits
The resolution is a huge showstopper. I feel like the creators know this
because the actual resolution isn't listed anywhere (11.6" HD display is all
over the place) but 768p is at the very end of the page.

And since the panel type isn't listed, I have a feeling its going to be a
cheap TN panel.

~~~
jseliger
_And since the panel type isn 't listed, I have a feeling its going to be a
cheap TN panel._

Er... it is $100. Lots of things are going to be compromised to hit that price
point. I'm reminded of the various $200 laptops out there, like the HP Stream
11: [http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2016/01/review-hp-improves-
it...](http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2016/01/review-hp-improves-
its-200-laptop-a-lot-but-its-still-a-200-laptop/). They have many drawbacks.
But their price is incredible.

I've put a lot of $200 laptops in Department of Education programs not because
they don't have drawbacks but because they're functional and still allow
incredible bang for buck.

------
jsight
What is the advantage of this over something like a Chromebook? It seems like
throwing a phone-grade CPU in it and giving it a little more capability would
be more worthwhile than being completely dependent upon a tethered phone.

~~~
bigjimmyk3
It's also one less device to manage connectivity on (connect to wifi, pay for
data plan, etc.).

~~~
jsight
Well, if that were the primary concern then USB tethering would work just fine
as a solution.

------
nommm-nommm
>. Any IDE built for Android can be accessed by your Superbook.

Is there any semi decent Android IDEs? I can't imagine there's a lot of people
who are interested in coding on their phones.

~~~
solnyshok
do not forget about running any linux ide in chroot. Phones with 2gb can do.
phones with 4gb of RAM are good at it. google e.g. "Linux Deploy" app on
playstore

~~~
nommm-nommm
Interesting, thanks for the info.

------
0xmohit
Seems grossly misleading to call it a laptop.

8 inch or so phones already exist which have a better resolution. Is there
much point in having a bigger screen with lower resolution?

~~~
duderific
Yes, the keyboard.

~~~
Zikes
[http://www.walmart.com/c/kp/usb-otg-
adapters](http://www.walmart.com/c/kp/usb-otg-adapters)

Honestly the resolution is the one thing stopping me from ordering a
Superbook. 768p may "technically" be HD, but you can't honestly market it as
"upgrades with every new phone" when the display is so far behind the phone
that drives it. I realize it has a big impact on cost and battery, but for me
it's simply 1080p or bust.

------
Wildgoose
Isn't this essentially just a Chromebook?

Why not just buy a chromebook, share your internet connection, charge from its
USB port and use the same Google Drive (or Dropbox)?

------
jasonlfunk
I think this is the future. One device that works everywhere. Ubuntu tried it
unsuccessfully. I doubt this one will succeed either. But eventually someone
will.

~~~
0x6c6f6c
Ubuntu still hasn't finished it. They showed demos in alpha but their newer
phones actually do it now, although the entire Ubuntu Touch program is still
beta.

------
roberdam
[http://maruos.com/](http://maruos.com/) Related, you can try it if you have a
Nexus 5 today.

------
thatfrenchguy
"future proof" "768p screen".

Yeah, sure.

~~~
0xmohit
See the queue for the _future proof_ shell.

------
leojg
I find this project quite interesting.

Do you think it could provide a good development environment?

I was thinking that with something like Eclipse che this could be useful when
traveling

~~~
numbsafari
Assumes you have a reliable connection, no?

------
Rajneesh123
Awesome laptop

