
The Story of Schiit Audio (2014) - skinnyfoetusboy
http://www.head-fi.org/t/701900/schiit-happened-the-story-of-the-worlds-most-improbable-start-up
======
hoipaloi
NwAvGuy is the truly interesting story, NwAvGuy was some anonymous person who
went to audio forums and warred on Schiit pointing out technical problems with
their products and the way they do their marketing. I guess someone said if he
knew so much about audio why didn't he go out and design and build his own
stuff and so he did exactly that designing a headphone amp that has
"legendary" status, and then he disappeared... His headphone amp:
[http://nwavguy.blogspot.com.br/2011/07/o2-headphone-
amp.html](http://nwavguy.blogspot.com.br/2011/07/o2-headphone-amp.html)

~~~
bravura
Some previous discussion about NwAvGuy on hacker news:

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7451062](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7451062)

------
miles
Here is a PDF version of the book put together by darinf:

[https://mega.co.nz/#!RU0SVD5I!9Dn7tK_tXDvjoRCfJ7vV5JFn43-lu1...](https://mega.co.nz/#!RU0SVD5I!9Dn7tK_tXDvjoRCfJ7vV5JFn43-lu1avhxivLnbMWqE)

with Jason's blessing:

[http://www.head-fi.org/t/701900/schiit-happened-the-story-
of...](http://www.head-fi.org/t/701900/schiit-happened-the-story-of-the-
worlds-most-improbable-start-up/3720#post_11041582)

------
ScottBurson
_“Yeah, but sometimes you just gotta say, ‘what the heck!’” (Except without
the h and e, replace with f and u.)_

?? You call yourselves Schiit Audio but you can't bring yourself to write
"fuck"??

~~~
yitchelle
That's why their name is Schiit Audio, not Shit Audio. It all part of their
cunning marketing plan.

------
darklajid
I didn't know about this company.

Can anyone explain to my if this [1] is something more than snakeoil?

1: [http://schiit.com/products/wyrd](http://schiit.com/products/wyrd)

~~~
ggreer
Some of their products are worse than snake oil. When powering off, Schiit's
Asgard amp can output enough DC to damage some headphones. One Head-Fi user
recorded a video of this happening. NWAvGuy tried to get answers from Jason
Stoddard and ended up being banned from the Head-Fi forums. The whole fiasco
is summarized on NWAvGuy's blog.[1] Of course NWAvGuy isn't the most tactful
person, but Head-Fi's reaction seems quite overzealous.

1\. [http://nwavguy.blogspot.com/2011/07/banned-at-head-
fi.html](http://nwavguy.blogspot.com/2011/07/banned-at-head-fi.html)

~~~
cthalupa
>Some of their products are worse than snake oil. When powering off, Schiit's
Asgard amp can output enough DC to damage some headphones.

Early versions of the product came without a power relay, with the implication
being you should have the volume pot all the way down, and unplug your
headphones before ever turning the amp on or off. That is fairly standard
precaution with the higher end of audio equipment, which both Stoddard and
Moffat came from. Not so much in the market that they were targeting with the
Asgard.

Since then, they've added a relay to all of their amps that need one, and have
offered to add one to any amp that was sold prior to this for free.

Stoddard goes over the incident with the Schiit side of the story at
[http://www.head-fi.org/t/701900/schiit-happened-the-story-
of...](http://www.head-fi.org/t/701900/schiit-happened-the-story-of-the-
worlds-most-improbable-start-up/765#post_10463052)

NWAvGuy wasn't actually banned for his interactions with Schiit, but due to
the very strict advertising rules at Head-Fi. [http://www.head-
fi.org/t/584763/the-wizard-appreciation-thre...](http://www.head-
fi.org/t/584763/the-wizard-appreciation-thread-long-live-the-wizard-the-
former-ha-appreciation-thread/150#post_8144761)

The Asgard never actually permanently damaged or destroyed any headphones. The
Schiit Lyr, however, did kill a $1.5k pair of Ultrasones Ed 8s, but this was
due to an actual defect with a specific unit. Schiit replaced the Ultrasone
and the Lyr for the owner.

~~~
ferongr
>That is fairly standard precaution with the higher end of audio equipment

No it's not, that's called bad design. Unless high-end now stands for "poorly
designed gear sold for 10 times what they're worth".

~~~
cthalupa
I don't know of many big ticket amps you can turn on before you turn on your
big ticket preamps and don't run a risk of having an expensive bad day.

Why? Because you are amplifying the turn on signal from the source or preamp.

Every time you have ever turned audio equipment on and heard that thump or
pop, you are hearing the same phenomenon that ran the risk of damaging
headphones left plugged in. It just so happens in most cases the amount of
power involved isn't significant, but it does become so once you enter the
realm of high powered amplifiers.

There's nothing inherently wrong about a design that doesn't include a muting
relay because it is supposed to be understood how the device is operated, in
the same way there's nothing inherently wrong about a car design that doesn't
lock the gas tank while the car is online and running - you are supposed to
know you shouldn't fill up your gas tank while the vehicle is on, and if you
do so, there are risks. (Yes, sparks from the engine compartment of running
cars can and do cause fires while refueling, albeit rarely)

~~~
seanp2k2
There's also nothing wrong with cars which don't pop the lock back open if the
car is off and the key is in the ignition, except that when such a technology
exists, is pretty cheap / easy to implement, and can save users potentially a
lot of trouble, why would you _not_ implement it?

I would argue that there _is_ something wrong with amps / pre-amps which pop
when turned on: it's sloppy design which doesn't even save much cost, and the
risk is huge for end-users. Humans make mistakes. I don't think anyone would
propose that a checklist be used every time you want to turn on your hi-fi
because some EE (or very likely some Chinese ODM) wanted to save a few wires
and a few cents.

~~~
Curmudgel
> There's also nothing wrong with cars which don't pop the lock back open if
> the car is off and the key is in the ignition, except that when such a
> technology exists, is pretty cheap / easy to implement, and can save users
> potentially a lot of trouble, why would you not implement it?

If you drive an armored car, then you wouldn't want the doors to automatically
unlock whenever you put it in park. An ICE agent was killed three years ago in
Mexico because of this feature.

[http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/the_americas/armored-
suv...](http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/the_americas/armored-suv-could-
not-protect-us-agents-in-mexico/2012/02/13/gIQACv1KFR_story.html)

------
bootload
_"... But when it came time to order screws, that $800 almost brought the
whole mess down. ..."_

The best line from this factory tour at SME [0], a maker of high precision
audio [1] is, _' we make our own screws'_. [2]

[0] History of SME,
[http://www.sme.ltd.uk/content/History-1307.shtml](http://www.sme.ltd.uk/content/History-1307.shtml)
[1]
[http://www.sme.ltd.uk/content/History-1307.shtml](http://www.sme.ltd.uk/content/History-1307.shtml)
[2]
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2xQkexHT-M](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2xQkexHT-M)

------
andyidsinga
Skimming the Contents - this really caught my eye and I had a good laugh:

"Chapter 6: The First Order Is…For Something We’re Not Selling"

...I'll at least be reading one chapter :)

------
karambahh
I knew nothing about Schitt, next to nothing about audio, but I hold a MSc in
EE and CS and I'm the CTO of a Saas company. This book is definitely a good
read, full of insight and fun to read

------
CamperBob2
From the company's 'About' page:

    
    
       Do you seriously make your stuff in the USA?
       Yep. We worked long and hard to get our designs and 
       chassis so they could be assembled by first-world labor 
       for prices similar to the Chinese. ...
    
       But wouldn’t it be cheaper doing it in China?
       Maybe. But we’re not going to find out.
    
       Well, hell, all your parts are probably Chinese anyway, 
       right?  Um, no. The majority of our parts, on a total 
       cost basis, come from right here in the USA, from 
       companies manufacturing their products in the USA. ...
    

As the Least Interesting Guy in the Hardware World, I don't always start
companies, but when I do, I always make sure to insult 75% of my potential
market.

~~~
cthalupa
I'm not entirely sure that I'd consider that insulting, but, from the forward:

    
    
      Be memorable—this isn’t about getting everyone to like you, 
      this is about getting some people to love you.
    

The company isn't built around catering to a massive amount of people, but
instead a niche. And there's definitely a market out there that is very much
swayed by the "Made in the USA, from parts sourced in the USA" line of
rhetoric

~~~
CamperBob2
Yeah, absolutely, and I really like a lot of what I'm reading in the .PDF that
darinf put together.

But this is still an instance of taking the low road. We all live on the same
planet, and commercial jingoism isn't the way forward.

Edit: if you "aren't sure if you consider it insulting," try reversing the
roles. Imagine a Chinese company that brags about how they avoid using parts
and labor from the US whenever possible. How do you suppose that will play in
Peoria?

~~~
throwawayaway
official chinese military grade stuff? sign me up. people who are opinionated
can sometimes be talented, i don't take it as a negative indicator.

~~~
CamperBob2
Who in the world said anything about "military grade stuff"?

This site seems to be trying to be the next Digg.

~~~
throwawayaway
you did!

> Imagine a Chinese company that brags about how they avoid using parts and
> labor from the US whenever possible.

chinese military grade stuff?

yes, i am the entire website you have interacted with for years to attain ~5k
of karma.

~~~
CamperBob2
So Chinese military contractors sell high-end consumer audio equipment in the
US now?

~~~
throwawayaway
you didn't specify high end consumer audio equipment.

anything made within those restrictions has a high chance of being made by
capable people and as such would be a positive indicator for a buyer such as
me.

i gave the military grade stuff as an example of something made within those
restrictions by capable people.

~~~
CamperBob2
Looks like I woke up on the wrong side of the fence. I'll show myself out.

