
WWDC 2019 Keynote Livestream - AlexeyBrin
https://www.apple.com/apple-events/livestream/?xyz
======
bt3
Nice to see a new Mac Pro, but no one has mentioned price. The "entry level"
Mac Pro from 2006 was $2199 and $2999 in 2013 (the last update). Even the top-
of-the-line "trashcan" Mac Pro was ~$6500 with 12 cores.

I don't doubt the hardware is top-notch again, but an 8-core machine (I get
it's Xeon), with a 256GB SSD and 32GB of RAM with a nice graphics card for
$6000 is ludicrous. Is the new case and a "revive" worth the 100% price
increase for a base model? Or has Apple come to revelation that pro's will pay
any price?

Sidenote - 6k monitor is beautiful but $5000? The live stream I'm following
jokingly mentioned the stand is $1000 extra (is that true?). Have we truly
moved into $1/ pixel territory?

~~~
mikestew
_The live stream I 'm following jokingly mentioned the stand is $1000 extra
(is that true?)._

Yup, it was on the screen and the presenter spoke the number without even
cracking a smile. Must have practiced in the bathroom mirror for _hours_ to
pull that off.

~~~
cs02rm0
Somehow I doubt they'll be selling $1000 monitor stands in a few years.

I can't quite believe they were saying someone would turn one of the monitors
90 degrees to write code. Why anyone would spend $6k on a monitor to write
code is beyond me.

~~~
thefounder
I believe that girl never wrote a line of code. Why would you use a vertical
monitor to write code???

~~~
bradlys
More lines viewable at a time. Most places have line length limits and they're
well below full screen width. There are people I've worked with who enjoy
reading and writing code on a vertical orientation.

~~~
thefounder
That's something new to me. I though people want more horizontal tabs/columns.
Scanning a very "tall" display(like this 32" one) doesn't seem very
comfortable to me.

~~~
atq2119
The ability to understand code at a macro level improves the more code you are
able to see at once, because scanning with your eyes is more efficient than
scrolling can ever be. So using a portrait orientation for your monitor does
make sense.

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mikestew
So they brought back the cheese grater Mac Pro. Now, was that so hard? Let the
shutting up and money-taking begin...

However, watching them demo the new one is just a painful reminder of what an
over-priced bad idea the trashcan was, and we had to put up with that shit,
and the apologetics to go with it, for six years. Demo's not done, but I'm
hoping I don't have to listen to Ive's smooth British accent telling me it's
the best, we really mean it this time. Get the person that slayed the
management dragon to get this thing built and let _them_ do the voice-over.

~~~
H1Supreme
Do we know if the expansion slots will take 3rd party products? Or, is it all
proprietary?

~~~
monocasa
Looks like fairly arbitrary PCI-E, but I'm going to throw out there that kexts
need to be Apple notorized now so the driver situation might be rough.

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toyg
Feeling a bit “everything old is new again”. So they’re finally making a
“real” power desktop again, and the big thing about iPadOS is a multi-window
feature that we’ve basically had since Windows ‘95... even the macpro design
looks like a direct riff on their own 20-year-old “cheesegrater”.

I mean, I’m obviously happy (although i’ll likely never be able to afford a
macpro). But all the rivers of (digital) ink spent on the “paradigm shift” of
iOS-like forms and conventions now look pretty silly.

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oh_hello
Sign in the Apple is a great idea for users. I can see developers not wanting
to adopt it due to loss of customer data. I'm curious to see how adoption
plays out.

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ixtli
I think its a big deal that they're able to capitalize on the user data abuses
of Google and Facebook by making a single sign in service simply because "we
wont give everyone your entire contact list when you click this button."

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muterad_murilax
Link for viewing in VLC etc:

[https://p-events-
delivery.akamaized.net/3004qzusahnbjppuwydg...](https://p-events-
delivery.akamaized.net/3004qzusahnbjppuwydgjzsdyzsippar/m3u8/atv_mvp.m3u8)

~~~
knd775
This one wasn't limited to certain browsers/platforms like they have been in
the past. You could just go to apple.com and it was there for everyone.

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Tomte
Much useful stuff, but why oh why can't I tag photos? Or have a sane folder
management in Photos?[0] Or edit MP3 metadata in Music?

There's lots of low-hanging fruit on iOS. But they've been left hanging for
years now.

[0] Despite that I've taken the plunge into managing all my photos on iPad's
Photo app. But it's painful.

~~~
sebazzz
One thing I'm missing is a decent way to monitor your data plan[0]. Even my
previous Windows Mobile 10 (formerly Windows Phone) had this.

[0] Yes, there is something, but it doesn't reset automatically. It doesn't
limit. It doesn't notify. It is not more useful than the packet count of the
TCP/IP properties in Windows.

~~~
ixtli
This is a good example of how the consumer pays for so-called "competition"
between service providers. The practical effect is that they collude to fix
prices and never work with downstream/upstream companies to provide obvious
features like the one you're asking for.

~~~
briandear
> The practical effect is that they collude to fix prices

Any proof of collusion? Is Apple really working with AT&T to make you use more
data? There's absolutely zero evidence of that.

~~~
ixtli
Whoops sorry, i said that wrong. I was talking about things like this:
[https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/20/technology/att-verizon-
in...](https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/20/technology/att-verizon-investigate-
esim.html) (att and verizon colluding to price fix.) I dont think apple is
colluding with carriers.

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threatofrain
The new Swift UI framework reminds me so much of Flutter.

~~~
tonyedgecombe
I think that was the most interesting part of the presentation. Does it mean
the end of AppKit and UIKit?

~~~
simongr3dal
It looks like SwiftUI just gives a better interface to Appkit and UIKit than
before.

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tcoff91
Finally a new mac pro. I hope I can get my company to buy me one. If i could
shrink my huge C++ compile times that would be awesome.

~~~
whalesalad
If you don't need macOS you can get a lot more hardware for your buck w/ PC
hardware.

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thefounder
Is it just me or the pro display is overpriced?

2nd why do they compare it(a led display) with an oled pro display from Sony?
What a bunch of misleading marketers!

~~~
imagetic
There are also rivals to that sony monitor in the $4000 range for reference
hardware. It's extremely misleading. It is a really nice display though, but
$5k is a painful price point. I would have preferred a retina 27" with those
features, 4k is more than enough.

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tosh
I wonder how they force a full desktop-web experience for Safari on the iPad.
macOS user agent?

~~~
saagarjha
Probably. I wonder if sites will start gating on screen sizes?

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freehunter
This is what I don't really get about "request desktop site" or this kind of
announcement... I don't know the last site I saw that serves different layouts
based on browser agent, it's all based on screen size and resolution. Unless
Apple is spoofing a higher resolution on an iPad, I don't see what will
change.

That being said, on Bootstrap (and Bootstrap-like sites) turning the 2018 base
model iPad on its side will give you a col-md layout which is usually enough
to trigger the desktop size.

~~~
saagarjha
See Google Docs.

~~~
freehunter
Will the new desktop site mode actually enable Safari features that mobile
Safari does not support? I can actually name a few sites that don't work in
mobile Safari because the browser doesn't support features those apps need
(AWS Cloud 9 is one) but I don't think just requesting a desktop site would
actually make those sites usable.

------
satysin
Overall that was a very good WWDC keynote IMHO.

The Mac Pro and Pro Display XDR certainly seem to deliver on what "everyone"
has been asking for over the past few years. Those prices are in another solar
system to consumers so we will without question hear a lot of moaning that
Apple are over-charging and such which isn't really true. The reality is that
kind of performance is _way_ beyond what a consumer would need and those
prices are perfectly in line with similar devices.

Some nice additions iOS/iPadOS (Am I the only one who is irked it isn't
iPhoneOS, iPadOS, etc??) that certainly makes the iPad Pro a more _Pro_
device.

I bought and returned an iPad Pro back in February because iOS was a huge
limiting factor. I said at the time "iOS on iPad Pro is two years behind the
Pro hardware" and I stand by that but it seems iOS 13 with bring that down to
one year behind the hardware.

Hopefully in 2020 we will see iPadOS mature to the point that the iPad Pro is
a true professional device.

Info on macOS Catalina was basically zero though. Some new apps to replace
iTunes which we have known about for months now. Sync moving into Finder. The
only interesting thing was Voice Control which is think is superb. I always
champion accessibility so seeing Apple expand voice control is great. I feel
they can improve the experience as there was a lot of needless filler words
but it is a great step.

Some interesting improvements to Safari on iOS/iPadOS but no word on what, if
anything, is changing with Safari on macOS? With their new extension model
coming into effect with Safari 13 I was hoping to see Apple say something
about improvements to adblocking/tracking as we will be losing access to
Unlock Origin which is a huge blow and I am unsure if I will be able to use
Safari without it tbh.

Sidecar will be nice although it is a damn shame that the iPad Pro screen will
be the _better_ screen with its beautiful 120Hz Pro Motion display compared to
the lower resolution 60Hz one in the MacBook Pro. Hopefully we will see Pro
Motion screens in next years MacBook Pro!

For me personally the most interesting new feature is "Sign-in with Apple" and
their unique email forwarding service. I have always refused to use the Google
sign-in but with what Apple showed I think I would use Sign-in with Apple. At
least for new services that I am unsure about at first. For all Apple's faults
I respect that they do take users privacy seriously.

So with the exception of macOS news I thought it was a very strong keynote
that positions Apple well for the next few years providing they deliver on
their words with the Mac Pro! The only _mistake_ was mentioning the price for
the new display accessories. $999 for a stand wasn't going to go down well and
the audible groan was amusing.

Now to check out the actual _developer_ news over the next few days :)

~~~
simongr3dal
> no word on what, if anything, is changing with Safari on macOS?

Probably because the WebKit team is doing it's own thing and releasing stuff
when it's ready. Their blog is pretty interesting to read[0], at least when
new changes are happening.

[0]: [https://webkit.org/blog/](https://webkit.org/blog/)

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jibanes
This monitor the "Pro Display XDR" is to glossy for hours of coding imho. That
is, you don't need 6k for coding either, so that's probably not their
audience.

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intellix
No mention of the refresh rate for the monitor? Seems strange that it's not
mentioned so I'm guessing it's 60Hz which sucks when you've used 144

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lewis1028282
Was U2F or FIDO2 or WebAuth announced for Safari? Chrome, Firefox and Opera
have it, about time Safari added it too.

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balls187
The find My tracking, and activation is very worrying.

~~~
ihuman
How come? You can already do that with Find My Mac; this is just making the
remote locking ability more lower-level.

~~~
balls187
While Apple has been pretty good with privacy, there are long been rumored
exploits in apple hardware (iirc snowden talked about it) used by state
intelligence agencies.

Providing this capability gives an additional vector to be exploited.

It also may be implemented less securely in other devices, as other
manufacturers see the market appeal, leading to more invasive tracking.

And, while I generally trust Apple, I don't like the idea that Apple can lock
me out of my device should they choose too.

~~~
scarface74
It’s much easier just to buy location data from the cell phone providers. They
were selling it willingly.

~~~
toyg
Selling? State authorities get it for free in most countries.

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HugoDaniel
Who is going to give up that money on an Intel in 2019 ?

A few months later it will be running at half the speed due to new sploits
being found.

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dx7tnt
$999 just for the stand for the new display! Audible laughs all round.

~~~
mxfh
and a $199 VESA adapter to escape from that to a more versatile $50 monitor
arm.

That stands height range looks laughable for the size of the screen.

The comparably huge bezel was cleverly hidden with the black backdrop.

~~~
theshrike79
$50 monitor arm for a $6k monitor? You are braver then I am.

~~~
mxfh
I even sit on chairs half that price, so now you know my net worth ;)

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briandear
Apple could literally cure cancer and people would complain about the price or
lament that it doesn't also cure diabetes.

~~~
tsmarsh
I work for Novartis. We did cure a couple of cancers using bespoke
technologies that don't scale particularly well. The prices are ludicrous
($250-500k), but then it does take a team of scientists weeks of time per
patient and its a single treatment... but it doesn't cure diabetes.

The Apple-ifying of cancer treatment has started.

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alexashka
I don't get iPadOS - it's just macOS with every power user feature disabled.

But then again, I just don't get iPads...

~~~
nightski
-

~~~
matthewmacleod
Is it really that hard to imagine? There are a significant number of computer
users out there who want to do things like use Facebook, check their email,
order stuff from amazon, do a bit of web browsing, watch a bit of Netflix,
read a book… a tablet covers those use cases in a form factor that’s a bit
more convenient and portable than a laptop, and with a bigger canvas than a
smartphone.

I get that they might not fill a niche for everybody, but it’s not hard to see
the use-cases, right?

~~~
reaperducer
_Is it really that hard to imagine_

It's not. People just like to hear themselves moan on the internet. It beats
working.

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yohann305
MacOS, iPadOS, iOS. Mark my words, in 5 years Apple is going to come up with a
brilliant idea: merge all OSes into one! BRILLIANT! (sarcasm)

~~~
alexashka
Don't forget watchOS and tvOS :)

~~~
mattl
homepodOS!

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no1youknowz
The 6k screen is mind blowing. But, you know there is a macbook pro with a 6k
screen somewhere deep in apple labs.

Hopefully in time for when apple does the switch to arm in 2022. Apple, my
money will be ready!

Edit: damn the price is high, alright, I'll pay $10k for a mac pro developer
edition! :P

~~~
saagarjha
6k on a 13” display?

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owl57
Why not? I'm typing this on a fairly typical 2k 5" display, so, about the same
pixel density.

~~~
gjm11
You probably hold that 5" display a lot closer to your eyes than you want your
computer screen to be.

