
3D printing titanium: Learning to learn from success - pencerw
http://pencerw.com/feed/2015/8/6/3d-printing-titanium-learning-to-learn-from-success
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pencerw
Hey all, just posting an update to some older work that I did (and that got
posted here by someone else) a few months ago.

tl;dr: It's totally possible to print titanium bicycle parts, but the business
model needs a bit more work still.

For reference, this is the thread from my last blog post on the subject:

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9216474](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9216474)

Cheers, Spencer Wright

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Obi_Juan_Kenobi
My layman impression of the part is that it looks like a traditional piece. Is
there anything about it that couldn't efficiently be done with traditional
machining?

If not, is the next step to leverage the additive process to produce a unique
design? Meshes, hallows, etc.?

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taneq
This was my thought - it's an awesome read and 3D printing definitely has its
place, but its strength is generally in one-off or very-short-run custom items
rather than building mass produced parts.

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pencerw
Those are definitely good use cases, yup. There are a few things I can do to
increase the value of this part (or similar ones), and in general the high end
cycling market tends to require a lot of 1) lightweight structures, which
additive is good for, and 2) customization.

It's also worth thinking about this in context: Even without offering any
customization, the cost to buy my part in batches of ~40 actually works out
pretty well (caveat: this is a decidedly high end bike part). With forged,
machined, and composite parts, that's an _extremely_ low purchase quantity; in
most cases, you'd never come close to amortizing the tooling & setup time.

That said, I'm _definitely_ interested in exploring other products, and new
business models for how to sell them. This part is just the first step in that
process :)

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PhasmaFelis
I wonder if it's possible to 3D-print titanium mail (aka "chain mail") at a
competitive price? Titanium is great stuff for high-end mail, strong,
lightweight, shiny, and corrosion-free, but it's even more insanely labor-
intensive than ordinary aluminum or steel mail, especially if the links are
welded or riveted for strength; prices appear to start at well over $2000 for
the equivalent of a T-shirt.

I think you'd want to print it in a sort of collapsed/"wadded-up" form, to
reduced the print size and to insure you can get enough separation between the
links that they don't bind together. You'd need some pretty fancy algorithms
to translate the client's measurements into a wad of printed mail that will be
the right shape/size when spread out, but once you got that down you could
just plug in the numbers and watch it go. If you could get the price down to
something decent, I think you'd get a lot of business from SCAdians/fantasy
fans/etc.

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jackcarter
Here's a video about 3D-printing a dress, which uses the "wadding-up" solution
you mention:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdRswasftfI](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdRswasftfI)

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wanderfowl
Knowing nothing about 3D printing, this was among the more awesome things I've
read this week. Thanks so much for the detailed write-up, particularly
focusing on the unknown-unknowns.

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pencerw
:) Thanks!

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jlebrech
Would it be possible to 3d print a light mesh and finish off the process with
anodization?

that way the part would be 3d print more rapidly.

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pencerw
Anodization is definitely an option - you can do some pretty wild colors, too.
And a mesh is in the works :)

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jlebrech
how much faster is 3d printing a mesh rather than a solid, you could 3d print
a lot more, then chuck it in a bath to gain thickness and strength.

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pencerw
Build time scales pretty closely with the volume of material you're printing,
but meshes often require less material to achieve the same mechanical
properties. As far as post processing to improve mechanical properties goes:
I'm not aware of anything like that, unfortunately. Titanium has a pretty high
melting point and a very good strength/weight ratio, so I'm not sure what you
could add to improve it.

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jlebrech
does that mean you could 3d print joining parts and connect them all with
carbon tubes?

post bike kits to people for them to assemble.

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pencerw
Yes! Once I get the seatpost (this part:
[http://pencerw.com/feed?tag=seatpost](http://pencerw.com/feed?tag=seatpost))
done, I want to start working on a full bike frame, made to order and
assembled individually.

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jlebrech
I think connecting (carbon) tubes could be a way to go.

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pencerw
Yeah, for sure. Carbon fiber tubing is great when you need a long structural
element - no need to print that, in my opinion.

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JabavuAdams
Thanks for this -- what a treasure trove of information! I love being alive in
2015.

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chrisbennet
The page I get is "about.blank"

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dang
The URL was mangled but I think we fixed it.

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chrisbennet
Works now. Great reading!

