
KiCad Joins Linux Foundation to Advance Electronic Design Automation - paddi91
https://www.linuxfoundation.org/press-release/2019/11/kicad-joins-linux-foundation-to-advance-electronic-design-automation/
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xvilka
Hopefully, EDA tools for chip-design will get similar attention too, as well
as a "normal" CADs. Software like LibreCAD[1] and FreeCAD[2], Qucs[3],
gEDA[4], Yosys[5] and Symbiflow[6], Chisel/FIRRTL[7], OpenROAD initiative[8],
Degate[9], and many others.

[1] [https://librecad.org/](https://librecad.org/)

[2] [https://www.freecadweb.org/](https://www.freecadweb.org/)

[3] [https://github.com/Qucs](https://github.com/Qucs)

[4] [http://www.geda-project.org/](http://www.geda-project.org/)

[5] [http://www.clifford.at/yosys/](http://www.clifford.at/yosys/)

[6] [https://symbiflow.github.io/](https://symbiflow.github.io/)

[7] [https://www.chisel-lang.org/](https://www.chisel-lang.org/)

[8] [https://theopenroadproject.org/](https://theopenroadproject.org/)

[9]
[https://github.com/nitram2342/degate](https://github.com/nitram2342/degate)

~~~
gravypod
Is there a high level overview, for programmers, of how chip design software
works? Something I eventually want to investigate is building some of those
pieces of software but I have no idea where to get started learning about that
ecosystem. From a software perspective I have a good understanding of how
source gets turned into machine code, which gets packaged into shared object
code, which then gets linked into a binary. How do those steps work for HDLs?
What standards are involved? How do you test that each of those steps works?

~~~
HarryBeadle
Take a look at Verilog-to-Routing - an educational/research tool that is open-
source.

[https://github.com/verilog-to-routing/vtr-verilog-to-
routing](https://github.com/verilog-to-routing/vtr-verilog-to-routing)

~~~
gravypod
That looks like a great resource! Thank you!

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ur-whale
Kicad is an amazing tool. Not easy to get into, kind of like vim in that
regard, but when mastered, it's really powerful.

With that in place, I wish it had:

    
    
       . Something to import LTSpice files directly into its schematics tool (or even better, go back and forth)
       . A rough but well integrated auto-router
       . A better parts library management system (the current one is really bad).
    

But even without those, designing electronics circuits with KiCad is a blast
once you've mastered it.

And it's free ...

~~~
mdszy
> A rough but well integrated auto-router

If you're depending on an auto-router, you're doing it wrong.

~~~
leoedin
There's a lot of autorouter hate in the electronics community which I think
has a basis in truth, but is in danger of losing sight of the big picture.

Autorouters can be terrible. They mainly are. The reasons are partially with
optimisation algorithms (although these are getting better), but primarily
with poorly defined constraints.

Currently a schematic holds the physical connections and maybe a little bit of
extra data - some pins might be "power" pins, or maybe a net or two is defined
as a high current net - but broadly the circuit metadata which is highly
relevant for routing is held in the designers head.

When you lay out a board you're always thinking about high current and high
frequency (and especially high current high frequency) paths. You're looking
for paths to ground, you're isolating sensitive analog regions from noisy
digital regions, you're making sure the ground plane is uninterrupted. You're
basically making thousands of tiny tradeoffs based on an understanding of what
the board should be doing. If a computer doesn't have that knowledge, of
course it can't effectively lay out a board.

If we can improve schematic annotation and part representation to properly
hold this information then there's absolutely no reason autorouters can't be
better than manual layout. If we can combine it with simulation then
autorouting should really be the only logical choice. If you can almost
completely avoid EMC testing by carefully defining all the high frequency nets
and letting the autorouter find a design which is optimised for RF
performance, then why wouldn't you? An EMC chamber costs thousands of dollars
a day - you can easily spend 10s of thousands just on the testing alone, not
to mention redesign costs.

~~~
mdszy
There are tons of rule of thumb routing design choices made that lead to being
able to route incredibly complex PCB's which becomes a topological problem.
Rules that would need to be either programmed into such a system, or somehow
potentially AI could use a huge corpus of board designs and schematics to make
a better auto router.

My point is that as they stand currently, autorouters are absolute trash and
you should not be depending on them.

The only real place they work is when you have a trivial routing situation but
it would be incredibly tedious to route by hand, like a bus with 100+ traces
or something.

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kyaghmour
Most importantly, KiCad needs funding:
[https://funding.communitybridge.org/projects/kicad](https://funding.communitybridge.org/projects/kicad)

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amelius
How/where are people getting their PCBs manufactured and assembled? Are cheap
chinese services reliable? How do you protect your IP when using manufacturing
services?

~~~
mdszy
1\. I use PCBWay, a chinese fab that can manufacture small quantities for like
$5 (+$18 shipping if you want them fast) but they arrive in five days.

2\. Protecting your IP with your PCB design isn't something you can really do.
Any PCB can be reverse engineered very easily. Besides, if you're asking this
question on a random internet forum, I have to doubt you have any serious IP
to worry about.

~~~
lsllc
Can vouch for PCBWay, inexpensive and fast (even with DHL shipping from
China).

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josteink
Nothing bad about KiCad (don’t know it), but the Linux foundation have
recently been caught neck deep in what seems like a (needless) identity
politics controversy.

TLDR: it kicked out white males trying to mostly have a reasonable
conversation on Twitter from attending its events, while allowing an openly
and viciously racist and sexist black woman to attend the same event, with her
asking for “safe spaces” to top the irony.

Needless to say, my respect for the Linux foundation has plummeted. They’re
clearly off my donation-lists now.

