
Ask HN: Last 7 invoices haven't been paid, what now? - papaver
I&#x27;ve been working with a &#x27;friend&#x27; of mine on his website for the last year.  I was paid by check which was sent to my place while I was traveling and lost track of which invoices were paid.  After consolidating everything in the last month I realized that I haven&#x27;t been paid for the last 7 months.<p>We had a contract that stated I could bill them monthly a max amount.  I never heard negative feedback regarding my work, only positive conversation and full steam ahead.  I took over the code a year ago from a development firm, and am the sole developer on the project.<p>All efforts of communication on my part have been met with radio silence.  Emails, texts, phone calls have not been returned for the last 2 weeks.<p>What do I do now?  I&#x27;m short of cash at this point and not sure bringing a lawyer in will help as they have significant more money than I do.  Is it legal to revert all the code I checked in for the last 6 months long as it doesn&#x27;t break anything?<p>Any advice would be appreciated.
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anigbrowl
Absolutely bring in a lawyer. Reverting the code is a bad idea because a)
unless they're clueless they have made backups and b) that could allow them to
sue _you_.

You are fortunate in that you have an actual contract and a paper trail, which
puts you far ahead of most claimants in 'I got exploited' situations. Organize
everything and bring it to a lawyer, who will explain your options and then
offer to write a demand letter on your behalf. If the matter is as clear-cut
as you say, then you should be able to ind a lawyer who will handle it on
contingency. If you don't have a lawyer, call your state or country's Bar
Association and tell them that you have a contractual dispute involving non-
payment in the amount of $xxxx, and they'll recommend some lawyer sin your
area that arelikely to handle disputes of that scale. Most lawyers will give
you a free consultation.

Of course, look through your contract carefully first - it might include a
clause that requires the matter to go to mediation or arbitration. The more
familiar you are with your contractual situation and the better organized your
paper, the faster and cheaper resolution will be.

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jqm
If they haven't paid you for 7 months, and aren't returning your phone calls
nor emails, they probably aren't planning on paying you.

If it's not a lot of money, forget about it, tell them you aren't doing
anymore work for them, stay on top of things better next time, and move on.

If it's an amount of money that justifies chasing, I have had luck showing up
physically at people's businesses. If you can't do that, I guess a lawyer is
your only option.

Not to be a downer... but you probably aren't ever going to see this money.
They may not have it. Maybe you can offer to take some of it a bit at a time
rather than wopping them with a thousands of dollar bill at once? But be
careful about doing any more work of them of course.

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davismwfl
So I am guessing that this is a side thing and not your primary business.
Because 7 months of non-payment would easily equate to $100k+ at reasonable
rates. Missing that kind of income would be pretty obvious for a small team
let alone 1 person.

Given that, my bet is the amount is relatively small and not worth litigating
or really starting a war over. Don't post publicly on Facebook, Twitter etc,
it does you no good but people/companies will see and remember it. Most
usually not in the positive way.

Unless the amount is significant just write it off. I get when you need cash
that this can be a hard thing to do, but it is the most likely outcome anyway,
so put your efforts into finding a new source of funds.

However, that said, after you get it in your head that you aren't getting paid
(changes you mindset), then try this. Send a personal email, voicemail and
text saying something like: "hey look, I worked for 7 months for you and yea,
I'm an idiot and didn't stay on top of my invoices, but man, I am hurting and
could use the payment like we agreed." And say you are willing to take it in
some smaller chunks instead of one lump sum if that helps his team out.

Your friend may have initially just screwed up too, and now be embarrassed
that he got so far behind. He may have wanted to pay you, then realized the
sum is larger now then he has free cash. But if you offer him a hand and a
graceful way out, he may surprise you. At worst, he doesn't answer and you
haven't lost anything more than a little time to write a note and make a call
etc.

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greenyoda
If you're short on cash, you should probably be looking for a client that will
actually pay their bills. Tell your "friend" that your work on the project
will stop until the work that's been completed has been paid for.

What else you can legally do depends on the terms of your contract. To protect
yourself, you probably shouldn't take any action until you've talked with a
lawyer. You don't have to bring an expensive lawsuit against them - just pay
the lawyer for an hour to review the contract and advise you of your legal
rights and responsibilities.

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smt88
Don't revert the code. Even if you don't "break" anything, he could make an
argument that you caused damages, and he could sue you. Furthermore, damaging
his business isn't going to make him richer and more likely to pay.

You could, of course, say something like this:

"Because you have failed to pay me for my work, I feel it would be morally
justified for me to revert all of my changes unless we reach an agreement in
the next 10 days."

You're not actually saying you're going to do it. You're just saying you think
it would be ok.

~~~
greenyoda
_" Because you have failed to pay me for my work, I feel it would be morally
justified for me to revert all of my changes unless we reach an agreement in
the next 10 days."_

That's unlikely to be effective. As soon as they heard that, they'd just make
backup copies of all the code and change the passwords on their servers.

 _" You're not actually saying you're going to do it. You're just saying you
think it would be ok."_

A statement like that could be considered to be extortion, even if made as a
hypothetical. If you owed me money, and I told you "that's a nice car you
have, it would be a real shame if anything were to happen to it", you'd take
that as a threat, wouldn't you?

~~~
smt88
You're right, it could be considered extortion. I'll retract that as even an
implied recommendation.

In this case, it doesn't seem like they have a contract, so the remedy might
be to just "undo" the deal as best they can.

Unfortunately, without a contract, there probably isn't a statutory remedy,
and they'd have to go to court. That's why I said s/he definitely should _not_
actually revert the code.

My suggestion also took into account the 1st Amendment, which protects speech
that has content. In this case, s/he's saying "this is how I feel about it"
and "it would be morally justified", both of which have content beyond any
sort of implied threat.

All that said, I'm not a lawyer, and no one should take anything I say as
legal advice.

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tjr
I'm not a lawyer, but on a personal level, this article has always resonated
with me:
[http://philip.greenspun.com/politics/litigation/philosophy.h...](http://philip.greenspun.com/politics/litigation/philosophy.html)

~~~
papaver
thanks for the article, very enlightening.

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brudgers
If you invoiced according to the contract and weren't paid and are not
receiving replies to communications your friend is a deadbeat. I suppose you
could lawyer up. That's a medium term strategy. The short term should be based
on the assumption that you will never be paid. Some people are just assholes.

The way to reduce this sort of risk is screening clients and requiring
retainers applicable against final invoice. And no favors for friends. I mean
the reciprocal of you lowering your rate or being flexible on terms is your
friend paying more than the standard rate under terms more favorable to you.
Somehow that is not where people usually come from.

Don't be anyone's bank.

Good luck.

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logn
You might find a lawyer who will work on contingency. This is probably small
time but you might find a young attorney to write some stern letters.

Also each state has a set amount of interest that applies to unpaid invoices
if no other fees or interest have previously been agreed to. Look up the
statutory interest and start computing and invoicing your late fees.

It's tough to know how much pressure to apply. You don't want anything to blow
up in your face. For 7 months of unpaid work, it's a big enough deal that a
lawyer could really help.

------
dormento
How close is the friend in question? I would not assume malice outright. I
advise to check if your friend is alright, he might be sick or in jail.

~~~
papaver
I've known him for a couple years and we have hung out regularly. I'm quite
sure he is alright because of his regular posts on facebook. I've attempted to
contact his business partner as well with no avail. I've seen him pull this
sort of radio silence with other people when he did't want to deal with a
problem.

~~~
smt88
Social pressure is very effective. Comment on one of his Facebook statuses:
"I've been trying to reach you for weeks, but you haven't responded. Could you
please call me?"

If he doesn't respond to that, you could get more extreme by posting your own
status and tagging him in it: "I've been working for @[friend] for months, and
he hasn't paid me or responded to my emails. Anyone have any suggestions?"

Phone calls, in-person visits to his office, and emails to other friends or
employees at his company will also be effective. It's very easy to ignore a
personal email. It's very hard to ignore something that starts to affect your
reputation and peace of mind.

Other than that, you might have some luck selling the debt to a collection
agency.

You can, of course, always sue him, but if you don't have a pretty tight
contract, it would be more trouble than it's worth.

~~~
greenyoda
_" If he doesn't respond to that, you could get more extreme by posting your
own status and tagging him in it: "I've been working for @[friend] for months,
and he hasn't paid me or responded to my emails."_

Make possibly defamatory public statements about someone, especially someone
you might end up in a legal battle with later, is not a great idea.

And using these kinds of tactics in an attempt to resolve a business dispute
could hurt your reputation with potential future business clients.

~~~
smt88
It is not defamatory because it's provably true. Defamation must be false.

~~~
greenyoda
There's always the possibility that the other party did send a check, but it
didn't arrive for some reason.

