

Ask HN: Would you hire me if this was my resume? - mikeyy
http://docs.google.com/fileview?id=0B0Su2VXWhOROZTQ4MTZkYjUtZjgxNS00MDNjLTkwYWQtZTczYTU1MGNmMWNh&hl=en

======
beilabs
Few things that jumped out at me

You're 18, you have no right to use the word plethora. What will you use when
you're 19?

Your CV is too long. Meant to fit on 2 pages.

Remove all color. Black and white only! If you must have color then make a
snazzy website.

You are talking about your technical skills, this is meant to be on a cover
letter, take Jquery for example, you mention

"This is a very useful prototype framework, eases and simplifies my everyday
job a lot more than if I was using javascript alone."

Chances are that your future employer knows all about this! Why even mention
this line?

Often you need to tailor your previous experiences to the job your applying
to. I take it you want to work in security rather than development? Do I have
the right impression?

Btw, where are your hobbies and other interests outside of coding/being on the
web? Often people are hired who are a good fit for the company, simply being a
shit hot developer is sometimes not enough.

Best of luck with the job search though, this should get you a lot of
exposure, tips and tricks.

~~~
Locke1689
_Your CV is too long. Meant to fit on 2 pages._

To be precise, in the US a resume is meant to fit on two pages. A CV
(literally, your life's work) can scale up to a small binder after many years.
That said, the poster is talking about a resume, not a CV.

~~~
gaius
CV is the British term for resume.

~~~
meroliph
I thought it was the Latin term for Curriculum Vitae.

~~~
frisco
Which is basically the British (or academic) term for resume.

------
ErrantX
Ok wicked; you fall directly into the demographic I hire - young, security
consultant/programmer.

This is subjective but it's not a very fine tuned CV. I would still interview
you (there is something there for sure :)). It is a great start though; and
this is how I would _personally_ improve it...

First off the prose is a little up/down. One one hand there is a lot of
Buzzword jargon and on the other you have sections like the Pornhub job -
which reads like a novella. :)

Little asides aren't all that useful (e.g. ", fun experience" in the CakePHP
section) - it's good to be casual/funny in a CV, but not like that.

 _CV's should be entirely jargon free, written in the simplest of English and
avoid long paragraphs_

Back to the Pornhub section. No hiring manager will care how you got the job.
They care about two things - what you did, and why you left. You also list a
_lot_ of work

You should keep the section fairly rigid - naming the job, employer (if
possible) and a short bulleted list of:

\- things you did

\- responsibilities you had

\- stuff you learned about

These could be technical things, or social "teamworking" things.

 _Listing Jobs on a CV is crucial - but keep them succinct and informative_

Under technical skills you've basically listed Programming
languages/frameworks. There is no need to put a remark for each one. Managers
will know what they all are (and if not - it's irrelevant to them) and will
really be only interested in your experience with them.

You've also mentioned a lot of security testing in the jobs section - but no
mention of that here? If you are good at it these are your most marketable
skills!!

If I write a CV for someone I usually write the "mundane skills" like
programming languages as a list with the length/amount of experience. Follow
that up with a short prose section "I started programming in PHP at the age of
15 and quickly progressed into other languages, picking up OOP and MVC as I
went...".

 _Then_ I would deal with the marketable skills - stuff you can offer than no
one else can. Either as an extended list (preferred) or prose.

 _In a CV you need to plug why you are an asset - knowing programming
languages is only a marketable skill if you're in the upper echelons of said
language :)_

Education is your best section (though a little more information about classes
you took might add colour).

What you are missing is an "about you" section. For me this about the most
important bit; you have to sell yourself and your interests and someone who
will be an asset to the company. You should explain, for example, some of your
_relevant_ interests (no one cares you read and swim :)). I usually talk about
my interest in social networking and how people interact, my belief in privacy
and how that syncs with working in the security/forensic industry.

Be passionate.

Some final tips:

\- Bullet points on CV's are fine, I'd even say encouraged

\- Brevity is a gift. Us poor hirers have to sift through hundreds of these a
year - make it easy on us :)

\- Formatting is only useful if your applying for a design job. Tasteful
highlighting is fine but otherwise 12pt text, nicely spaced with neat headings
is preferred

\- At least once mention about working in a team and how you got on with that.

\- Discuss your aspirations in a way that a) appears to benefit the company
but b) does not compete with it and c) does not make assumptions about
possible promotion/career paths at said company - e.g. "Long term I want to
become a leading expert in the field of fuzz vulnerability testing"

That's all I can think of now. Bear in mind this is _just_ me (though a lot of
what I say will be mirrored by others) and the kind of CV I prefer.

But hopefully there are some tips of use :)

~~~
mikeyy
Woah, thanks for the feedback. Out of everyone, I've got the most from you and
it really is going to help me out when I get back to making it a final draft.

So...concise but informative. Got it!

Are you an employer? :)

~~~
ErrantX
If you want any more advice or a proof read later on then send me an email.
Always happy to help.

I interview for the company I work at (there's no formal structure but I guess
you would call me second in command). We're UK based though and only a small
portion of our work is in the kind of field your into.

What you _should_ do is hit up tptacek[1] here on HN. I think he's much more
into that arena, US based and almost constantly looking for new blood :) At
the very least he might be able to point you at suitable employers.

1\. <http://news.ycombinator.com/user?id=tptacek>

~~~
mikeyy
Thank you!

I will get back to working on the resume sometime during this week and get
back in touch with you as well as tptacek, hopefully I can get a shot at
something!

------
seasoup
Drop the mention of pornhub. You have plenty of companies listed there and
don't need it. You risk alienating people by having it. Unless you are
applying to a porn company, in which case you can keep it.

Also, you list your title as back end developer, but javascript, jquery and
web development are all front end related. PHP and Ruby are also web related,
and so even though you often do back end work with them, having them along
with javascript and jquery make you seem like a front end developer. So,
change up your title or start mentioning more back end technologies you've
worked with.

Remove your age, not relevant and people will disregard you as inexperienced,
judging you for your age before they even talk to you. Good luck!

~~~
gaius
Well, that is a more general rule. I see stories of people who send out
"hundreds" of CVs and get no response. In truth your CV should really be
considered a framework, that you customize to each application based on the
job ad.

A CV is a sales document, you mustn't lie on it, but its purpose isn't to be a
completely objective file on you. It's purpose is to get you an interview.
Every CV I have ever sent has been tailored to show that I would be a great
fit for _that job_. If I have say 10 skills and they want 5 of them, then
those are the 5 I'll list for my last job experience and simply not mention
the others except perhaps in passing.

Specifically to the OP, 5 pages is _far_ too long. At your level, even 1 page
is enough. And be careful with "experience" because it doesn't mean what you
think it means. Basically, programming that you were not paid for, or is not
"famous" (e.g. well-known open source) doesn't count as experience for the
purpose of this. I'm in my 30s and I have more experience than you've been
alive. Now, I'm cool, but most of the people who read that will immediately
disregard you.

------
mnemonicsloth
Suppose an interviewer asked you, "Why should I hire an 18 year old kid?"

You'd tell him that your skills matter and your age doesn't, right?

So why mention your age at all in a document that's supposed to be about your
skills?

~~~
mikeyy
From that viewpoint I agree, it makes it much more clear. I'll have to keep a
note on my forehead to not tell people my age since it's irrelevant.

------
dedward
It would probably have landed you an interview at my last round of hiring. A
CV rarely lands you a job - it just gets you in the door.

While finding someone who's curious, smart, and capable at a young age is what
I've looked for when hiring junior technical people - (I want the real
hackers, not the paper graduates who can't think for themselves) - the trick
is in weeding out those who think they already know it all and are above
everyone else, making them difficult to work with, and potentially dangerous
to a team in the long run.

Some of what is in your CV belongs in a cover letter tailored to the job you
are applying for - stick to clear skills and experience and keep it short. Put
the details and adjectives, if you feel it's really necessary, in the cover
letter - and keep that short too - save the rest for the interview... because
that's where, at least in smaller shops, the real test is - whether you are
going to fit into the team or not.

~~~
mikeyy
Darn, I was too late! I'm glad you liked it though.

Oh, I completely agree with you on the "paper graduates". I find myself to be
very social, I don't let my ego go over my head, after all there is no reason
to.

I did get pretty carried away with what I was going for. I was going brain
dead from trying to think of what and how to write it, so I came to ask for
HN's help. :)

------
mightybyte
One thing that jumped out at me was your PHP section. "used PHP numerous
amounts of times" just sounds awkward. It's probably just poor grammar, but to
me it communicates more (although maybe incorrectly). To me it says that your
PHP experience is probably limited to small bits of code here and there. And
saying that 4 years of experience makes you an "expert" reinforces this idea.

The summary here is that you shouldn't interpret what you have done. Just
communicate the facts. If I happen to think that one can spend a lifetime
mastering a programming language, then you've already put up a barrier between
us. If you had spared me the interpretation and had just told me that you've
been programming PHP (or insert favorite language) for 4 years and that you
love it, you'd be off to a much better start.

------
p858snake
* Don't let information split over pages where possible, It's better to move them onto the next page so they are all together (Eg: you're education, CakePHP sections).

* I would also consider putting page numbers on them (In a small font, so if people print it out they can easily sort them)

* Also what paper settings are you using, It seems landscape to me? Use A4 or Letter (Depending on your local standard) and portrait mode, since most bosses like just to pile up the resumes and other documents they receive together and to be able to easily look at them, Having to flip them around is just a pain.

------
jazzychad
Bandwidth exceeded in google doc viewer. I'd like to read this over and give
you some feedback, but currently can't. Consider uploading it to scribd or
something similar?

~~~
mikeyy
Hey, I uploaded it for you on scribd.
[http://www.scribd.com/full/31453326?access_key=key-1ar7q299r...](http://www.scribd.com/full/31453326?access_key=key-1ar7q299rycwowads2jy)

:)

~~~
jazzychad
Thanks! Sorry for the delay; I've sent you specific feedback in an email.

------
AlexBlom
My biggest comments are as follows:

1) There are three points in your resume (page 1, 2 and last page) where there
is a title, 1 point and the rest is on the next page. Try to keep each job on
the same page where possible.

2) For most recent graduates a resume of about 2 pages is generally expected &
appropriate.

Hope this helps.

~~~
mikeyy
So it's basically more toward how I have everything laid out besides what my
actual skills are? Shitty.

~~~
GiraffeNecktie
Yep. And the fact that you still think your resume is about your actual skills
is a problem since it reflects a certain level of immaturity. Your resume is
not about you or your skills, it's about the gap that exists at your future
place of employment and how your skills can fill it. One of those skills is
probably going to be effective and appropriate communication that addresses
the problem at hand (in this case how you're going to fill the gap at your
future employer). If you can't do that in two pages, there's a problem.

~~~
AlexBlom
This too. Resumes should be customized for the position. Don't simply apply
forpositions either. Call them up. Ask what type of person they are looking
for, how they will evaluate candidates, what makes somebody successful in the
role?

THEN customize the resume (and they know your name!)

------
Emore
I take it you saved a HTML file to PDF with PDFmyURL? Well, don't. If only to
avoid the horizontal pages.

Also, make your profile one concise paragraph. I like the non-bullshit words
in it right now, but trim it.

------
tzs
Fix the English. A large fraction of the sentences are awkward and in some
cases read like a bad automatic translation from some foreign language whose
grammar is not very English-like.

------
jodrellblank
Bits like this: _have had some colorful experiences with computers; Came up
with the name after learning shuck is another word for bragging or boasting.
Get the idea?; Undoubtedly more set in the back of my head.; Darn. Jobless._

Horrible fluff, too informal style for the rest of the document, like you're
trying to befriend the reader of a fiction story.

 _"After talking, I began working a located many more security problems that
needed to take precaution."_

It's nonsense, how did that get past your proof read... oh.

It looks like you have some good points to make, but I'd never have found them
if I wasn't hunting for things to comment on. Good bits:

Pornhub - keep the job in; finding a vulnerability, reporting it and turning
it into a job, that's a great thing to have in there. Maybe describe it as a
site with however many users/hits/revenue and more details available.

PHP, Javascript, jQuery experience. Knowledge of XSS/SQLi/salted password
hashes.

Security flaw finding - if you did any for money then put that as work, if you
did any for free put that as some kind of personal development / evidence of
interest.

MyTrueColor, Shuckit, Neverblue - draw more attention to these as examples of
motivation and interest (if they are valid - mytruecolor and shuck.it don't
seem to load).

Github similar site - Yes keep this (what did you do, specifically?)

What competitions did you win?

Rewrite it into a page or so and keep the focus on what you did / can do in
technical terms, what you have done, and what you want to do for {prospective
employer}.

~~~
mikeyy
Thank you for the response, I will keep these details in mind.

The GitHub similar site was <http://www.kinspir.com/>, which I helped them
back in April of 2009.

I won two competitions in my area, which were C++ and VB.Net when I was in the
9th grade, first place for both of those competitions. I then went to state to
compete against around 50 other contestants in each of those languages and got
2nd place and 4th place in the state. Wasn't able to compete at any FBLA
competitions during my whole high school year, since I had an expulsion from
school at the end of my 9th grade year.

