

Mind your slanguage: teenagers finding it hard to speak without slang. - RiderOfGiraffes
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/8388545.stm

======
crux
The basic question of teaching students how to speak and write in appropriate
registers has been an essential project of schooling for a very long time.
Everything else in here is fluff or misinformation. The author of this article
clearly had a paucity of material at his disposal, because he almost
immediately flies wildly off the rails and just starts paragraphs about any
form of non-standard language he can find. Slang, argot, jargon, foreign
loanwords, accents, dialects: all of these disparate topics she lumps under
the umbrella of 'slang', and solicits 'experts' to just provide some sound
bite, any sound bite, about any of the above, so she can fill out space.

The BBC, sadly, is consistently wretched when it comes to reporting about
language.

I have to say, though, I do appreciate the subcurrent of racist fearmongering
that she could slip in there. Even though the article is allegedly about the
dangers of slang and its overuse, she manages to wend around to let us know
that our beloved English Cockney (a non-standard variety, of course) is itself
under threat by some barbarous cocktail of foreign influences. Oh, and
hoodies!

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mechanical_fish
I find it awfully hard to speak without slang, too. The bad news is that most
of my slang is at least twenty years old, so teenagers might tend to look at
me funny, the way I used to look at middle-aged people when I was a teenager.

The good news is that most of my slang is at least twenty years old, so it's a
cherished and time-honored part of the traditional English language and is in
all the dictionaries.

As you get older it becomes easier to notice how rapidly one can start an
ancient tradition. It only takes a couple of decades. Your kids won't
necessarily know the difference between venerable wisdom and some nonsense you
invented back in college.

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ZeroGravitas
I wonder if they intentionally put in the translation of "Sik - cool" in the
sidebar to emphasise how ridiculous the opening contention of this article is.
Or is "cool" no longer slang, daddy-o?

~~~
DannoHung
Perhaps they actually meant "sick"?

I do find it amusing that both moist AND dry can mean the same thing. "I'm
ghost" is an awesome bit of slang though. I like that one very much.

Something funny that I've started seeing a bunch of people use with the recent
release of Modern Warfare 2 is "Oscar Mike" because of its use within the game
for "On Mission" or "On the Move".

------
selven
So when this slang-using generation grows up and joins the real world they
will become the real world, and slang will become acceptable there and
everyone will understand it. I fail to see the problem.

~~~
RiderOfGiraffes
That might work if generations were discrete, but they're not. I've recently
tried to hire a programmer, and while some of the candidates were excellent
programmers, none could stand up and give any kind of explanation to a
customer of anything. My customers are conservative (to say the least!) and
none of the candidates could change their language style to match the
listener.

In many industries getting a job early and having work experience is very
important, and your employers and colleagues will all be older. Being able to
communicate effectively outside your peer group is critical for many jobs.
Those that have the skill will benefit. Those that don't could easily get left
behind.

Inability to communicate effectively outside your peer group doesn't matter
much if you just program and don't try to talk to VCs, bankers, customers or
potential mentors.

~~~
wglb
VC chatter I have heard "let's see if the dog hunts" and "augered in" "he is
making a crater" "flow me the document".

The author of the article seems to have a view of language that as subject to
authority. This view fails to understand how language develops.

~~~
RiderOfGiraffes
There is a difference between slang and jargon. Jargon is specific to the
domain of discourse, and uses words that are sometimes neologisms and
sometimes ordinary words given particular technical meanings, the better to
communicate quickly and accurately.

Slang is to use words that create "tribes" or sub-cultures, often to create
bonds and connections with your peers, and often do not involve significantly
new or specific ideas.

In each case, using your own dialect (slang or jargon) with your peers is one
thing, but the ability to drop to a possibly less precise, possibly less
efficient, but generally more widely understood common language is important.

That's what the article is about - the apparent inability of the target group
(in this case teenagers) to use language appropriate to their listener.

Most half-way competent children of my generation used completely different
language at school as compared with home. That's to be expected. What concerns
me is the mono-linguality that seems to be emerging.

Yes, it is what it is, and probably nothing can be done about it, and maybe
it's not a problem. But recognising that it's happening is at least
linguistically interesting.

~~~
ZeroGravitas
A recent study claimed that (at least in written text) youngsters were
actually better than previous generations at writing for a particular audience
and switching modes appropriately ( _kairos_ ).

I find it amusing, but unsurprising, that something that gets people all upset
(txt messaging and email "slang") is actually shown to enhance kids skills. I
really wouldn't be surprised to hear the same about spoken slang.

------
kiujhygfvgbn
Bovril Morning, Squadron Leader.

Squadron Leader What-ho, Squiffy.

Bovril How was it?

Squadron Leader Top-hole. Bally Jerry, pranged his kite right in the how's
your father. Hairy blighter, dicky-birdied, feathered back on his Sammy, took
a waspy, flipped over on his Betty Harper's and caught his can in the Bertie.

Bovril Er, I'm afraid I don't quite follow you, Squadron Leader.

Squadron Leader It's perfectly ordinary banter, Squiffy. Bally Jerry...pranged
his kite right in the how's yer father...hairy blighter, dicky-birdied,
feathered back on his Sammy, took a waspy, flipped over on his Betty Harper's
and caught his can in the Bertie.

Bovril No, I'm just not understanding banter at all well today. Give us it
slower.

Squadron Leader Banter's not the same if you say it slower, Squiffy.

(<http://www.ibras.dk/montypython/episode42.htm#2>)

------
tokenadult
"Appropriacy simply means using the right variety of language for the right
context"

And what is wrong with the term "appropriate usage," which is much better
attested in dictionaries, for that?

The article is somewhat confused, because it's not clear whether the concern
is really teenagers using teen-specific slang, which they always do as part of
participating in youth culture, or NOT using standard adult English. Maybe
today's teens in today's schools in Britain don't read much classic literature
and aren't exposed to worldwide adult usage of English. That would be an
argument for improving the quality of the school lessons. But improving the
school lessons, while producing graduates who can communicate with speakers of
English of all ages from many places, might not reduce use of teen slang for
teen-to-teen communication.

------
kiujhygfvgbn
From the article: "Appropriacy simply means using the right variety of
language for the right context -

The OED disagrees, there is no such word as "Appropriacy". There is
appropriate and appropriateness.

~~~
mmt
I'm not sure if it's in my nature or my Unix-tradition nurture, but I prefer
shorter words, like "propriety."

------
stilist
Who knew language could change?

I demand a meeting with the Board of Governance for the English Language.

------
bokchoi
I love the side bar with the slang terms defined. It reminded me of an article
in the NYT in 1992 about grunge slang in Seattle... which was made up on the
spot during an interview:

<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grunge_speak>

------
dylanz
There isn't a problem with slang, until you work with those who do not speak
English as their primary language. A lot of aid workers I've spoken to
actually practice speaking without slang, as the life/death things they need
to explain to others needs to be understood.

------
yesimahuman
I talk in slang like crazy, but I find it really easy to switch into different
speaking modes. I think the issue could be that some kids aren't having enough
experiences where they need to switch modes.

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Semiapies
Welcome to 1957. Or 1857.

------
ramchip
If you want kids to master English better, don't ban slang words. That would
be hiding the symptom. Encourage them to read books instead.

------
rationalbeaver
This article, or at least the headline, really belongs on the Onion.

------
joubert
Yes but no but yes but; Sally is a slag 'cause she ain't even done nothin' or
somethin.

~~~
kiujhygfvgbn
Whereas: "Bumped into biffo in the rug the other day, didn't he fag for you at
big school?" Would be perfectly acceptable.

~~~
joubert
I think some people around here haven't seen Little Britain.

