
The World’s Richest Families 2020 - pseudolus
https://www.bloomberg.com/features/richest-families-in-the-world/
======
H8crilA
Imagine being Jerome Powell and saying with a straight face to the cameras
that the Fed monetary policy has absolutely nothing to do with inequality.
Pitchforks get ever closer.

Robin Williams on the topic:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=etQeFJ2lbbo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=etQeFJ2lbbo)

~~~
rayiner
I’m not sure billionaires are the problem with respect to income/wealth
inequality. We’ve always had mega-rich families, but what’s driving the anger
against wealth inequality now?

The new phenomenon we’re seeing now is the pulling away of the upper middle
class from everyone else. I think that’s the real source of anger against
inequality. I don’t think most people really care that there is some
billionaire out there. All billionaires combined earn just 1% of all income,
so it’s not like they’re sucking up a huge part of all income. People get mad
when they feel like they’re competing for real world resources, and there just
aren’t enough billionaires to do that. But the Facebook engineer making
$500,000/year? They’re the ones buying up the houses and driving middle class
people out of neighborhoods.

I’ve been listening to the new New York Times podcast “Nice White Parents”:
[https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/30/podcasts/nice-white-
paren...](https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/30/podcasts/nice-white-parents-
serial.html). The first couple of episodes talks about the conflict between
lower income Black and Hispanic parents and high income white parents in a
Brooklyn neighborhood school. I think when people get mad about income
inequality, for the most part they’re reacting to that sort competition for
limited resources in American neighborhoods. And the “rich people” that are
competing for those resources aren’t billionaires, but the upper middle class.

~~~
flashgordon
""" But the Facebook engineer making $500,000/year? They’re the ones buying up
the houses and driving middle class people out of neighborhoods. """

Wait this sounds like demonizing the FB engineer for making the 500k even
though he would now have to pay millions for a medium size/class/type home
that was previously owned by (and sold for) a crazy amount by said "middle
class".

I get very worried when I see this sentiment where somehow the employees of
these companies are responsible for killing the previous fabric but what is
driving them to these decisions is somehow sacred?

~~~
rayiner
I’m not demonizing anyone. But the inequality that affects every day people
directly—rising housing prices in formerly middle class suburbs, competition
for good school districts, rising prices in restaurants, etc., is driven by
the large growth in upper middle class salaries. (My parents wouldn’t have
been able to afford the 1,100 square foot 3BR 1950s house I grew up in at
today’s prices. The neighborhood isn’t full of parked Saudi money. It’s the
explosion in upper middle class incomes.)

Housing prices in full Silicon Valley suburbs aren’t exploding because of a
handful of billionaires, it’s because of a vastly larger number of engineers
making $500k.

~~~
flashgordon
I do apologize for the over reaction :). Engineers like anybody else are going
to flock to where the money is (the intent of capitalism). To me it sounds
like Engineers aren't wilfully driving away middle class as much as
congregating closer to their employers for convenience. No? The same 500k eng
would drive up a price no matter where they are located. So instead FB should
limit salaries so that these engs cannot inflict this (unwilling) damage?

------
rayiner
> But even a pandemic hasn’t stopped the relentless growth of their fortune.
> The Waltons are richer than ever, adding $25 billion in the past year to
> take their combined fortune to an estimated $215 billion

To put things into perspective, the entire Wolton fortune, accumulated over
decades, would bankroll the ongoing COVID lockdowns for about a week.

~~~
lapcatsoftware
If we could have a hard lockdown for 4-8 weeks and still come out the other
end in good financial shape, that would be amazing, and really get the virus
under control. If a small number of families could make that happen, let's do
it.

~~~
sokoloff
That reads like “If a small number of families could forfeit several
lifetimes’ of fortunes accumulated via serving the needs/wants of vast swaths
of population, let’s take their money and do it!”

This seems like something that is much more properly paid via broad-based
taxation, not by seizing wealth from a small number of families.

~~~
lapcatsoftware
> That reads like “If a small number of families could forfeit several
> lifetimes’ of fortunes accumulated via serving the needs/wants of vast
> swaths of population, let’s take their money and do it!”

"via serving the needs/wants of vast swaths of population" is completely
false. The article was about inherited wealth. When you inherit wealth, you
didn't serve the needs of vast swaths of the population. You were simply born
to the right parents.

------
ianai
Things I like to think I’d do if I made 10^9 every 2 weeks:

-pay everyone making minimum wage or below 100$ for registering to vote. Cost about 170m.

-devote some portion of it to animal safety and care taking. Even stuff like sanctuaries for feral cats, dogs, and other non-adopted creatures as opposed to euthanasia.

-public libraries that provide services people otherwise wouldn’t have. Like a public square almost. Have a clearing house match up community interests with speakers and the like. Ie inviting religious people or leaders from religions foreign to the community to come in and discuss their beliefs and culture. I also want people to be able to request and invite things like lectures from theoretical physicists. Also do stuff like letting people request time on musical equipment in the building to learn how to play - or even just see if it’s for them.

Granted, all of this would probably negatively affect that biweekly 1 billion!

~~~
bravo22
First you'd have to convert your 1BN gain of non-cash assets to cash every 2
weeks.

~~~
frgtpsswrdlame
That wouldn't be very difficult.

~~~
lotsofpulp
You think the demand is so high that increasing the supply of shares for sale
won’t have an effect on price?

~~~
ianai
Yes, look at the average daily volume for stocks. There’s plenty of
opportunities for cashing out when you have that sort of asset.

~~~
bravo22
You'd also run out of that asset pretty fast.

~~~
ianai
Doubtful. Bill Gates has been spending a lot of his time looking for ways to
spend his wealth to help humanity. He’s not close to running out of wealth
either.

I sense that you’re looking for a denialist argument against this concept and
potentially in bad faith. “If it’s not possible to actually cash out on 1B
every two weeks then discussing the things we’d do with it is pointless.”

------
2OEH8eoCRo0
Koch

>Family's political network is planning to engage in nearly 200 federal and
state races in 2020.

Why not take all of that and put it toward green or fusion research?

~~~
CamTin
Because their power rests on fossil fuel revenue?

~~~
2OEH8eoCRo0
Unsustainable. I'm not a billionaire but I think it would be wise to own the
next big energy source.

~~~
sebazzz
I wonder at which point you can be considered a bad person, if you have money
and actively work against mankind - which ignoring climate change is IMHO.

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ffggvv
the intersting bait and switch that always seems to happen is people point at
billionaires and then use their wealth to justify raising taxes on dentists
that make 200k. Whereas the billionaires can just offshore their wealth.

they are used as scapegoats but the damage is done to working professionals
like family physicians

~~~
gonzo41
I was listening to the BBC the other day and someone was something they
estimate there's 32 Trillion dollars in tax havens the world over. I've never
understood why some small country just doesn't invade a tax haven and seize
the money. I know it wouldn't happen but it'd be a great way to disrupt crime
in the world.

~~~
lotsofpulp
Because there isn’t 32 trillion in cash laying around with in various island
vaults.

This thread is rife with lack of knowledge about what wealth even is and how
to re distribute it to society.

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schnable
> With that much money, you could pile $1 million onto each of the 19,368
> seats in the Walton arena and still have enough left to give Walmart’s 2.2
> million associates about $90,000 each.

Does this measurement mean anything to anybody? It doesn't help me visualize
anything.

~~~
gonzo41
They really need a serious billionaire tax. Something fun like: If your a
billionaire and at your death your collective wealth was greater than 2
Billion. You get a public statue with a plaque that overlooks all slimy stuff
you did to make that money. Also you can give your kids 1 Billion and the rest
is returned to the government.

Maybe even throw in a street name or something.

~~~
dencodev
They would just put the money and company shares in trusts. It wouldn't change
anything.

What we really need is for capitalism as we know it to die. It's unethical
that people are having to worry about starvation, not having a roof, and not
having access to medical care in the US while Mark Zuckerburg is colonizing an
island of Hawaii and suing native residents out of their family land.

~~~
adjkant
I'm all for killing capitalism, but that doesn't magically solve the
inheritance problem. If they would put it all in trusts, then make laws to
prohibit that. You need to close all the loopholes of inherited wealth, which
goes far beyond trusts as well.

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jessaustin
One might have expected Georgina _Bloomberg_ to make this "top 25" list...
does the founder have to be dead?

~~~
kristjansson
FTA

> The ranking excludes first-generation fortunes and those fortunes controlled
> by a single heir.

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RickJWagner
Sam Walton made a fortune by offering people goods priced lower than anyone
else offered. He also pioneered no-questions-asked return policies.

Wal-Mart has done a lot of good for people with lower incomes. Prices are low,
employment is usually easy to come by.

It's not home to the finest of goods, but when the chips are down Wal-Mart is
your friend.

------
burtonator
What would happen over time if a specific class of people had an unfair
advantage?

I did the math and Bloomberg has ALREADY earned back all the money he spent in
the election by literally doing _nothing_.

\- They pay _dramatically_ less taxes. Often zero percent on many transactions
and with money hidden overseas or in specifically designed financial
instruments for the rich.

\- They have connections you don't because they send their children to ivy
league schools, the ENTIRE purpose of which is to act as a filter for the
rich.

\- They own the means of production.

\- The working class won't stand up for their rights, won't unionize, and
consistently ...

\- They can bypass state taxes entirely by lying about where they live.

I've started FOUR companies now. Sold three. I'm NOT a communist. Capitalism
is amazing - but it's fundamentally broken.

All the criticisms that US conservatives have previously applied to the Soviet
Union now apply to the US.

\- The government picks the winners. \- Government and corporations are in bed
with one another to the point where we have a centralized control of power.

The BEST reform we could have, and fight for, is adequate taxation. Make the
rich pay the SAME % as everyone else. NO tax benefits for corporations for
moving to a specific state/city. Uniform state taxation.

The extra money we make from making the rich pay their fair share, without
having YOU subsidize them, should go to help ALL Americans pay for health
care, education, etc.

If you're a Christian it's what Christ commanded you to do. If you're a good
person it's the RIGHT thing to do because it helps your fellow man. If you're
a capitalist it's the right thing because it will SAVE capitalism.

~~~
dencodev
The rich shouldn't pay the same percent. 20% of my income in taxes has pretty
profound changes to my life. Bezo's getting taxed at 90% means he has fewer
megayachts and fewer private jets and fewer private islands. That 20% means a
lot more to me than that 90% means to Bezos. That is how we should measure
value.

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TazeTSchnitzel
They must be 260,000× engineers.

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ed25519FUUU
> _That’s partly testament to long-standing advantages vast wealth affords.
> Bolstered by years of strategic diversification and family offices that can
> rival investment banks in their scope and sophistication, the 0.001% can
> weather economic and social turmoil._

Interesting how this article points to their tactic being some kind of
sophisticated investing strategy, and not the federal reserve bailing out
stocks and lowering interest rates to prop up property prices.

The whole article reads like a desperate attempt to keep people from realizing
our own government props up these rich families at taxpayer expense.

