
Why Apple “Killed” the MacBook Pro - bsg75
https://www.forbes.com/sites/ewanspence/2019/10/12/apple-macbook-pro-steve-jobs-tim-cook-powerful-macos-ios-iphone-defeat-broken
======
pentae
All that complaining (hey I agree with all points) but he still doesn't really
explain why Apple killed the Macbook Pro other than "iPhone" and doesn't even
mention sales figures or anything else at all. "iPhone" is only half the
reason anyway - it's App Store. Apple wants that 30% slice of pie and they get
far more off iOS users than MacOS users.

Apple just has to update the Mac lineup so its 'good enough' to not let the PC
market cause a net growth loss, and to keep iOS developers from leaving.

~~~
fnordsensei
Also, maybe they are dragging their feet until they can throw out Intel and
put an A-series chip in there.

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todd3834
I still love my MacBook Pro. It doesn’t feel dead to me at all. I’m okay
knowing that iPhone and iPad are making lots of money for the company.

Yes, as a VIM user it took a minute to adjust to the missing ESC key. However
converting the Caplock key to esc turned out to be a great ergonomic benefit
for me. Yes I know there have been issues with the keyboard but they are
resolving that. Yes the Touch Bar is a little gimmicky but it’s not bad, kind
of neat and doesn’t cause a problem.

I’ve never been happier as an Apple customer as I am now. The products seem to
continually improve and raise the bar for what I expect from a computer. I
always feel bad for my co-workers who have to use Linux on ThinkPads or
Windows.

Disclaimer: I used to work for Apple years ago and it was a great experience.

~~~
LIV2
> Yes I know there have been issues with the keyboard but they are resolving
> that.

They've said that a couple of times. I'll believe it when I see it.

> I always feel bad for my co-workers who have to use Linux on ThinkPads

Why? I mean I've worked as a sysadmin using macs since they switched to Intel
but at this point I'd switch to an X1 Carbon running Fedora if my 2013 Retina
died. (And yes I had one of the newer ones at my last job)

~~~
VvR-Ox
I don't believe it as it just gets worse and worse.

I always pity the people who think they are "more productive" with a MBP while
our Linux-on-TP users seem to be quite fine with their tools for at least half
the price.

On top MBP users seem to need much more money for stupid little apps which
happen to be free on linux to be even "more productive".

The newest keyboard is a piece of sh _t - it feels like no physical feedback
at all.

When they need an upgrade they need a f_in new MBP! Most of the parts can't be
replaced anymore - this is really insane O.o

~~~
mrighele
> The newest keyboard is a piece of sht - it feels like no physical feedback
> at all.

Maybe it was the plan all along, to get people used to a virtual keyboard once
they get rid of the physical one (yes, I'm joking).

------
pram
This guy writes about one 'Apple KILLED the MacBook Pro' article almost every
week. Go ahead, take a look at his previous articles lol.

~~~
abvr
Yes, but he isn't exactly wrong about it either, and sure it seems as though
it has really affected him, but Apple too need to take a look into their near
past, and introspect things. Sure, they seem to be suddenly overcompensating
the Mac fans by launching things out of the blue like the new Mac Pro or the
iMac Pro, but with no real incentive to the average user to upgrade into their
desktop hardware anymore, for one the price tag itself would turn off desktop
enthusiasts who would prefer to either just build their own rigs, or go for
other tower vendors, and moreover the latest Mac hardware just doesn't offer
anything remarkable for their prices other than premium aesthetic looking
machines that one would assemble themselves. Sure, people trash the trashcan
Mac Pro but it was something truly original at the time and still maybe. And
the same goes for the Macbook Pro line.

------
xt00
Apple and other companies should totally experiment with new things like Touch
Bar and keyboards but try them out on stuff like the Mac book or products
where it’s not like the hard core work laptop.. I mean 7 years ago literally
everybody I knew bought a MacBook Pro because it was the best hands down but
now I know virtually nobody who does.. its totally not upgradeable (soldered
ram and SSD), super expensive, keyboard is who knows what’s happening there,
Touch Bar — nobody asked for emoji bar.. and oh yea the once basically
flawless trackpad is now ludicrously big for what reason again and has a
haptic click instead of a real mech switch..

If somebody could make an updated like 2013-2014 timeframe retina MBP with
replaceable nvmE disk, replaceable LPDDR5, I think people would love that..

I honestly can’t figure out how to replace my 2012 Mac book pro.. maybe Linux
laptop from somebody? Any suggestions?

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Yuval_Halevi
I'm now using MacBook Pro while writing this answer. My fingers are almost
melting

It doesn't matter how good they will do the next Mac

They first of all, have to fix the problem that it gets too freaking hot

~~~
duiker101
How hot does it get? I recently noticed that my mid 2014 gets easily to
80/85°C (~180°F) and I would have hoped that in 5 years this would have
improved

------
chx
The sad thing is, Apple is on the USB-IF and could've donated their Magsafe
patent to USB C and made the magnetic connector an option the USB C (not a
requirement, too expensive, probably) and they could've kept a magnetic
connector for all their USB C laptops , it would've come for free for the iPad
and tomorrow, of course, the iPhone could have one too. It's not like other
manufacturers having this option would be worse than Apple not having it!

There is a Kickstarter which promised and showed demos of running Thunderbolt
over a magnetic connector. I do not think it's a scam, we will see, but what I
am saying, this is not out of the realm of possibilities. Yes, it's tricky
running 40gbps over pogopins this small but if Apple helped? That's vastly
different.

------
_ph_
The MB Pro certainly isn't dead. But it is currently going into a direction, I
wouldn't call "pro". There is still a lot of engineering going into them, they
look so clean inside. But I think it is going into the wrong direction. I am
currently using a late 2015 MB Pro and agree with everyone who claims this
might have been the pinnacle of the MB Pro evolution. Certainly I appreciate a
compact and elegant laptop that can be easily carried. But it is most of all a
work machine and needs to perform accordingly. I don't need to say anything
about the new keyboards, they are an obvious failure. On a pro machine, I
would expect an HDMI port, at least one USB A port would be nice too. And of
course a full sized SD reader, as this is the format used in most cameras
today.

The biggest issue though for a professional machine is the repairability. If
you need a machine for work, you cannot give it up for several days if not
weeks when there is an issue. Also, considering how expensive the machines are
when purchased, a repair should be reasonably priced. It is not acceptable to
throw large parts of the laptop away, if the screen connector or the keyboard
breaks. So the benchmark for a real pro machine would be, that a technician
can exchange the main components in a few minutes. Be it battery or keyboard.
Considering how small modern SSD modules are, there is also no good reason not
to offer at least one m.2 disk in the machine.

------
Klonoar
It is so, so frustrating to read these kinds of things.

You can bemoan the state of the MBP all you want (and yes, much of it is
valid), but here's the thing: realistically, Apple doesn't have to care
because no other company produces a laptop that's as well made and long-
lasting.

I've been trying to find a laptop that doesn't fit the following - it's mind-
boggling how bad this industry is once you try to leave Apple's walls:

\- It cannot look like something a 14 year old gamer would flock to, complete
with lights and design trends straight out of a Bayformers film. This
invalidates any "gamer laptop" short of some Razer models, and the Razer
models have notable fan issues (among other things).

\- After using a MBP for years, I refuse to go back to something that's made
with cheap materials. If it bends the frame when I type the middle of the
keyboard, it's out (so we can throw out most System76/Clevo stuff right
here...)

\- People like to look good. Apple products legitimately look good. I don't
want to give that up. It cannot look bulky, clunky, and generally not
fashionable - short of... what, one HP Notebook that I could find, the rest
are just abysmal. You see non-Apple people wonder about the obsession with
thin laptops and so on - this is it. People legitimately do buy with fashion
in mind.

\- No other laptop is as well integrated on both the software and hardware
side as Macbooks are. You can tinker and get it close, sure, but the reason
that Apple can sell less powerful hardware is because the system is so
optimized for it.

Apple's killed it in the past decade or so on all of these. Keyboard issues
start coming up? Why would they care? Where exactly are you going to go...?
They'll fix it when they get to it and you'll like it.

You won't find another laptop and ecosystem as well integrated as the one
Apple's made over the past decade. It doesn't exist.

For crying out loud, if System76 could just sell a cloned MBP shell that'd be
amazing.

End rant, I guess. This has been a personal pet peeve of mine for weeks, the
laptop industry is so abysmal all around.

Edit: Yes, before anyone points it out, Thinkpads are well made and long
lasting. They do not visually look good in my opinion.

~~~
thiht
> no other company produces a laptop that's as well made and long-lasting

Of the top of my head: Dell XPS 13, Huawei Matebook X Pro, Thinkpad Carbon,
Surface Books.

Saying MBP are unique is ignorant.

~~~
Klonoar
Yeah... no. It's not ignorant, given that the MBP is pretty widely regarded
for what it is. Few of those stick up (and I noted in my edit, before you
commented, that yes - the Thinkpad et al are well built, but they are _not_
good looking).

------
schuke
The MacBook Pro isn’t bad or dead. Judging from people’s complaints, it’s more
like Apple needs a MacBook Pro Max: bigger, heavier, faster.

~~~
plorkyeran
Or perhaps just the MacBook Pro, and then they could rename the model
currently labeled that to just MacBook now that they've discontinued the model
that previously filled the slot.

------
amoudi
Well, if you want to say that Apple killed the MacBook Pro, mention the
keyboard and the touch bar at least.

------
jtthe13
People on HN should know better than to post "forbes contributor" articles.
It's a glorified tumblr (hover on the little "i" next to the author) where
anyone with a half baked, superficially-informed opinion gets to write BS
under a Forbes banner. To the author's point: Got a couple of Apple laptops in
the past year and I agree this generation of keyboard is a miss. But in the
meantime it's not like other laptop manufacturers are hitting it out of the
park. Isn't it just that the laptop product is a mature form factor with only
room for incremental improvements?

~~~
LargoLasskhyfv
Let's wait until 2025, and see if someone reintroduces something similar to

[1]
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_ThinkPad_Butterfly_keyboar...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_ThinkPad_Butterfly_keyboard)

or even tries an ergonomic layout, maybe split keyboard on larger models.

------
teilo
Ewan Spence is the John C. Dvorak of mobile technology, except that he's not
at all entertaining. He's a product of the sham that is the Forbes Tech
Council.

------
elcaminocomplex
This same author posts almost daily click-baity hit-pieces about Apple on
Forbes.

[https://www.forbes.com/sites/ewanspence/#2805a79a1089](https://www.forbes.com/sites/ewanspence/#2805a79a1089)

