
A Dark Room: The Best-Selling Game That No One Can Explain  - sizzle
http://newyorker.com/online/blogs/elements/2014/06/a-dark-room-the-best-selling-game-that-no-one-can-explain.html
======
sillysaurus3
_“I want to kindle the creative spirit in others,” Townsend told me over
e-mail. “My games are open-source because I want people to learn from them, or
use them to build their own things.”_

Notice how open sourcing their product had no impact on their sales. I'll be
so happy when defensive software licensing dies after people realize code
isn't worth protecting.

(Some code is worth licensing. It was most of Id Software's revenue stream.
I'm referring to all other code that isn't designed to be licensed, which
people still insist on being paranoid about protecting.)

~~~
nanidin
It's worth noting that the web version is open source, but the version for
sale on the iOS Appstore is not open source.

~~~
hmsimha
Shouldn't it be open source under the terms of the original game's license?
([https://tldrlegal.com/license/mozilla-public-
license-2.0-(mp...](https://tldrlegal.com/license/mozilla-public-
license-2.0-\(mpl-2\))) Or is a port not considered a derivative work?

~~~
_delirium
A port is a derivative work, yes, though the MPL has a kind of unique rule for
derivative works. You can combine MPL-licensed source files with non-MPL-
licensed source files, as long as all changes to the original MPL-licensed
source files stay MPL.

I think what's really happening though is that they're not relying on the MPL
at all for permission to do the iOS port, but on a direct license from
Townsend. It sounds like there is even some kind of formal business
relationship (the article is a bit vague on it, but it _sounds_ like Townsend
is involved in the port and getting a share of the profits).

~~~
hmsimha
My impression (based on the article alone) was that the author of the ios
version is pretty much benefiting from the sales exclusively. Perhaps I missed
something or there are sources that provide more information on the matter,
but Townsend saying 'of course you can adapt it for the iPhone' almost sounds
like he left money on the table.

If he isn't getting a share of the sales and didn't explicitly provide a
license to release the ios app under different terms, then I feel it _should_
be open source (at least the parts derived from the original).

~~~
amirrajan
This is false. Of course Michael is benefitting from the sales and the work he
put in.

~~~
hmsimha
> Of course Michael is benefitting from the sales and the work he put in.

Based on... what? You don't see it as possible that when granting permission
for the iOS adaptation he just assumed it would be freely available, like the
original? (at the time of my previous comment, there was no response from the
author of the iOS port)

~~~
amirrajan
>Based on... what?

Okay. Let me make sure sure everything is _crystal_ clear:

\- I found the game online via a tweet.

\- Viewed source and saw's Michael's contact information.

\- Emailed him and asked him if I could do a for-pay rendition of it on iOS
and that I'd split profits with him.

\- He agreed.

\- I built it with his oversight/input.

\- He get's a 50% royalty on all sales.

\- And now? Well, Michael and I get to deal with ADR clones that just wrap the
original via PhoneGap.

\- And what do the clone say when we try to report them to Apple? "hey! it's
open source!"

~~~
hmsimha
Thanks. I was merely arguing that based on the article, we don't really get
clarification on whether Townsend was being compensated. When I replied to
your previous post I didn't realize you were the author of the port.

------
amirrajan
I'd be happy to answer any questions if you have any.

~~~
sixQuarks
I'm surprised this game hasn't earned you enough to retire on. It's been #1 on
the paid list for a long time, I figured you guys must be rolling in the
dough, but in the article it says you would need to repeat the success of the
game every year for you to quit your day job. That's unbelievable.

How can flappy birds be making $50k per day, and your #1 paid app only makes
$2k per day?

~~~
amirrajan
We've had 630k downloads to date. 30% goes to Apple. Michael and I split the
rest. From my half, the IRS gets 45%. So my net so far is $120k.

Now, given that we're no where near the #1 spot, we're averaging about $1,000
a day. But that figure is dropping too. ADR is a depreciating asset with a
life span of two years I'd say (making this assumption based on what I've seen
with other paid apps and their rank history).

~~~
sixQuarks
Wow, I'm shocked at how less frequently paid apps are downloaded. Don't get me
wrong, 630k downloads of a paid app is very impressive, but it's ridiculous
that you only make ~$100k out of the deal.

Do you have any statistics on how far players have made it in your game? I,
for one, downloaded the game just to see what it was about. This is not my
type of game, so I quit after only playing about 10 minutes.

Reason I ask is that you could test this out as a freemium app. Free to
download, but after a certain period, the user has to pay to continue.

Let's say 20% of people that download it are hooked. If you get 20x the
download rate on free, that means you could have a 400% increase in revenue.
It might be worth testing out.

~~~
amirrajan
We didn't want to break the immersion. ADR simply wants to be that game you
pay for one time up front and enjoy (hopefully). No strings attached. We
simply request that you gift the game to someone else if you like it :-)

~~~
sixQuarks
Well, the good news is that you have 600k fans. The next game you put out will
probably be a hit as well.

------
jmduke
A Dark Room is a fantastic game, and I'm super happy for Michael and Amir's
success on the App Store.

That being said, I think the atmosphere is far superior on the browser:
[http://adarkroom.doublespeakgames.com/](http://adarkroom.doublespeakgames.com/)
(But throw them the $0.99 too!)

------
casey_lang
It's fantastic to see this game finally get recognized. Amir is a great
developer and it has been a lot of fun to watch the game progress over the
past few months.

He's maintained a developer blog throughout the process. It's a really
interesting read: [http://amirrajan.net/a-dark-
room/](http://amirrajan.net/a-dark-room/)

I first learned of A Dark Room when Amir presented it to the local Dallas Ruby
group. His presentation on development in RubyMotion is worth a read as well:
[http://amirrajan.net/12k-lines-of-RM/](http://amirrajan.net/12k-lines-of-RM/)

~~~
Steuard
Reading his developer blog, I was completely caught off guard when he said
(weeks in) that he had only then realized that there was a second phase of the
game. Good for him for not just saying, "Oh, wow, never mind!" at that point!
(But also, it's interesting that he found the first phase alone worth
recreating. It's engaging, but most of the game's depth of story comes later.)

------
0x0
Reminds me a lot about
[http://game.notch.net/drowning/](http://game.notch.net/drowning/) \- or is
this the inspiration for that?

~~~
mijoharas
I was just looking to see if anyone had commented that as I was thinking the
same thing, does anyone know which was first?

~~~
0x0
After playing a while, this game turns out to be a lot bigger than expected.

~~~
mijoharas
agreed, it's fun too!

------
orik
I remember playing this with my co-workers as an in browser game when it got
posted to HN last year. It's a must-download app IMO.

Here's the previous discussion.

[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5961205](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5961205)

EDIT: I didn't realize the game had been monetized. Is it worth the 0.99c over
the HTML5 original?

~~~
rweir
it seems likely that it is worth 1/3rd of a coffee, yes.

------
kqr2
Are they planning an android app? It looks like there is a clone currently on
the app store but it would be nice to support the original:

[https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.ariyalion....](https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.ariyalion.darkroom)

~~~
james33
Yes, they are using Ruby Motion and are apparently testing the beta Android
support right now, aimed at late summer launch.

------
ironchief
Interesting note, it is written in Rubymotion (not Obj-C or Swift). Here are
his comments:

"It just felt like everything was thought through, distilled down, and
presented in a form that was immediately familiar to me given my Ruby
background (and the “Ruby mindset”)."
[http://blog.rubymotion.com/post/82087136696/rubymotion-
succe...](http://blog.rubymotion.com/post/82087136696/rubymotion-success-
story-a-dark-room)

------
bcardarella
Why do these articles never include links to the content they are reporting
on? This is the web, not a print magazine.

~~~
codyb
The New Yorker is a wonderful print magazine which posts some (all I think if
you have a subscription) of its articles online, primarily for convenience. I
think for many of its audience, the smattering of links that could accompany
an article like this might truly take away from the intended atmosphere if you
will the article and publication intends to provide.

Certainly for me I find it refreshing and I try to read their magazine as much
as I can. I've learned plenty and can choose what I'd like to follow up on
myself as opposed to through the guidance of the editor, author, or web
designer who is creating the online edition. And the flow is never disrupted
by text which indicates a link whether in the traditional blue with underline
or otherwise.

We can all google, but to enjoy an article is a pleasure in its own right.

~~~
judk
It's not just about following up, it is about separating fact from fraud and
building a culture of honesty and accuracy, especially in the modern era where
fake information is so easy to create and spread.

------
james33
Amir was here in OKC this past Tuesday giving a talk on RubyMotion. It was
pretty interesting hearing him talk about the process and how the game sat on
tens of downloads a day for 3 months before seemingly randomly shooting to the
top of the App Store and now to 600k+ downloads.

------
mcphilip
There's a loosely defined sub genre of incremental games if you enjoy A Dark
Room:

[http://www.reddit.com/r/incremental_games](http://www.reddit.com/r/incremental_games)

------
moomin
"The improbable best-seller is a variation on primordial text adventures like
Colossal Cave Adventure and Zork"

In as much as Doom is, yes.

------
adamsrog
Bought this game right before a flight. (Come to think of it, the only time
I've bought games on the App Store was prior to a flight.) Was intrigued by
all the feedback left in the App Store. The hours of entertainment were well
worth the $0.99.

------
NicoJuicy
I'm going to eat now, cheat mode on:

window.setInterval(function(){

    
    
      $("#gatherButton").click()
    

}, 5000);

window.setInterval(function(){

    
    
      $("#trapsButton").click()
    

}, 5000);

window.setInterval(function(){

    
    
      $("#end").click()
    

}, 20000);

~~~
mathgladiator
If you want to directly cheat, you can just look at the memory and then set
the values to things directly.

------
VeejayRampay
"A Dark Room doesn't require any particular permissions".

I wish other game developers would take note.

------
notastartup
you should add google text ads.

    
    
        Buy Cheap Fireplace 
        Don't miss out on our 50%
        discount offer. Limited
        time only.
        https://fireplaces.biz

~~~
hyp0
An intriguing idea... the text content enabling relevant ads. The problem is
it would break immersion (even text ads, because they bring in the outside
world).

I wonder if there is a way to incorporate ads, so that it does not break
immersion? e.g. non-trading aliens visiting earth, being puzzled by the ads.
Perhaps some way of mocking them. Or, a game based on ads - finding
similarities between them; or links (similar to wikipedia-based games).
Unfortunately, I would guess that reacting to ads might breach Adwords' terms
of service.

It could be done in a positive way, like TV shows about advertisement (The
Gruen Transfer; those best-of compilations). This is kind of crazy, but: given
text content, _rating_ ads, for best targeting, worst targeting, controversial
targeting, etc.

------
bherms
Black Swan - Nassim Taleb

[http://www.amazon.com/The-Black-Swan-Improbable-
Robustness/d...](http://www.amazon.com/The-Black-Swan-Improbable-
Robustness/dp/081297381X/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1402701647&sr=8-2&keywords=black+swan)

~~~
gwern
Wow, because random apps have _never_ shot to the top of the listings! Gee
whillikers, that sure was an unpredictable black swan, totally outside
previous reference classes!

~~~
bherms
Taleb talks about books/movies/etc becoming successes with little to no
predictability. Games fall into this category. Hard to tell which games will
become runaway successes, especially from small studios. But you know, it's
cool, you can just be a dick about it instead.

~~~
gwern
> Taleb talks about books/movies/etc becoming successes with little to no
> predictability

No, Taleb loves to sophistically equivocate between meanings of 'black swan'
to neutralize any criticism. Did a perfectly ordinary phenomenon in network
dynamics and winner-take-all scenarios happen? Taleb takes this as an example.
Does someone point out that this is consistent with all past experience and
non-power-law distributions like log-normals? Oh, suddenly, he means black
swans are totally unpredictable things like 9/11!

~~~
bherms
Well, he actually calls things relating to those areas mentioned (arts, etc)
as grey swans because they do happen, but you can't really predict which of
the multitude of things coming out will become the next runaway success.
Either way, seems to be a sore spot for you. Chill out.

