
New Study Documents Depleted Uranium Impacts on Children in Iraq - umadon
https://ahtribune.com/us/3500-depleted-uranium-impacts-on-children-in-iraq.html
======
reacweb
All these images are terrible, but it doesn't match my understanding of
radioactivity. I thought the lessons learned from Hiroshima and Nagazaki was
that radioactivity was causing very few mutations (far less than expected),
but instead was causing mainly sterilities. I am not an expert, but teratogene
effects are generally caused by chemical products. If uranium is similar to
lead, it should cause neurologic diseases, not this kind of pictures.

I do not want to minimize the consequences of war, but this article has no
plausibility.

~~~
Recurecur
Agreed. It's much more likely the deformities are the result of chemical
exposure or other factors. The scary sounding "4.5 billion year half life" of
DU is synonymous with it not being very radioactive at all.

DU is toxic, but the main hazard is inhaling the dust. That's likely not a big
issue unless you're near impacting rounds...

~~~
saiya-jin
What the heck? The article clearly says: Every round of DU ammunition leaves a
residue of uranium dust on everything it hits.

We talk about semi-desert environment where dust flies all around, and it
doesn't become easily locked in soil like in more humid environment. If you
live a kilometer downwind from place where an A-10 smashed some iraqi tanks
with DU ammunition, you have clear source of exposure.

~~~
Recurecur
>If you live a kilometer downwind from place where an A-10 smashed some iraqi
tanks with DU ammunition, you have clear source of exposure.

Sure, depending on how well the extremely dense (1.7x the density of lead,
remember?) dust remains airborne. Also, the dust concentration is likely to be
so low that far away that it's extremely low exposure.

Don't lose sight of the fact that the article provides zero factual evidence
that DU caused those deformities. It's strictly guilt through association.

------
latchkey
Living in Vietnam, I see kids on the street clearly suffering from the effects
of agent orange, all the time.

------
josho
With a “half-life of 4.5 billion years” does that mean these areas are going
to be permanent toxic waste lands?

Regardless why isn’t there a growing movement to call the perpetrators of this
war criminals?

~~~
infinitone
> Regardless why isn’t there a growing movement to call the perpetrators of
> this war criminals?

You're kidding right?

Before the US invasion, the largest protests in the world happened all over
the world against it and it didn't do anything.

> Social movement researchers have described the 15 February protest as "the
> largest protest event in human history"

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/15_February_2003_anti-
war_prot...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/15_February_2003_anti-war_protests)

~~~
dev_dull
Thankfully the war in Iraq was the last time our intelligence agencies mislead
the public.

~~~
dmix
It's fascinating to reread just how bad these stories were:

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Niger_uranium_forgeries](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Niger_uranium_forgeries)

> In March 2003 [..] it reportedly took International Atomic Energy Agency
> (IAEA) officials only a matter of hours to determine that these documents
> were fake. IAEA experts discovered indications of a crude forgery, such as
> the use of incorrect names of Nigerien officials.

The CIA and foreign intelligence services did do _some_ good work to try to
correct that particular false narrative - something originally spread from
Iran's intel service no less (which sounds a lot like the discredited 2016
'dossier' which came from questionable Russian sources). But they clearly
didn't do enough. Probably because they were on the brink of getting new
massive sweeping powers.

This one's my favourite CIA story from that era, just straight-up blatant
disregard for the law with zero repercussions:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2005_CIA_interrogation_videota...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2005_CIA_interrogation_videotapes_destruction?oldformat=true)

~~~
dev_dull
I sincerely hope I never hear the phrase "Russian dossier" again in my
lifetime. The CIA seems to follow every place this phrase shows up.

------
roenxi
I don't like articles this blatantly manipulative; it is an unfortunate
character flaw if anyone thinks the most important part of a military invasion
are photos of 10s of mutated children.

This particular instance is horrible but also unimportant. The US killed
literally thousands of civilians when they invaded in 2003. There is a long,
long list of worse things that the US military has done; even ignoring
anything prior to the Iraq invasion in 2003.

------
dddeeerrr9999
Looks like depleted uranium bullets probably have similar to effects to lead
bullets.

[https://miningawareness.wordpress.com/2016/09/29/the-
toxicit...](https://miningawareness.wordpress.com/2016/09/29/the-toxicity-of-
depleted-uranium-du/)

~~~
DoctorOetker
when you say "lead bullets" do you mean gun bullets, or armor piercing bullets
/ projectiles? a normal bullet does not vaporize and contaminate the whole
area in the same way vaporizing projectiles do...

~~~
birdyrooster
Depleted Uranium is not designed to vaporize. It has a boiling point (3818°C)
more than twice that of lead (1740°C). It's atomic mass of 238 is considerably
higher than Lead's 207.5. It packs quite the punch when put into a slug, but
does not reach temperatures where it could vaporize. Certainly particulate
matter would be ejected from the impact, though as with most slugs.

That said, what was done here is despicable and it is clear evidence of a war
crime.

~~~
saagarjha
> It's atomic mass of 238 is considerably higher than Lead's 207.5.

Atomic mass has little to do with an element's boiling point.

~~~
birdyrooster
But it has to do why it packs quite a punch. I agree it's worded awkwardly.

------
Santosh83
And this is why China is hated passionately in the West. Because it is the
only credible potential deterrence in the future against the West doing
whatever they want on whomever the want (outside their territories that is).
It is of course possible that China itself will turn into another hegemonic
military power with scant regard for non-Chinese lives the way the US has been
for decades, but nevertheless in a multi-polar world it will be more
problematic to simply invade whichever country you wish, when other
significant powers have economic/geopolitical interests in those countries.

~~~
tempguy9999
> And this is why China is hated passionately in the West

No it isn't, it's the government that we find deeply grubby. And this subject
is unrelated to china.

~~~
saiya-jin
I wonder where is a deep hate for other brutal dictatorships du jour like
Saudi Arabia, a great friend of US no matter how many atrocities they do
internally or externally.

China deserves all the bashing it gets (and some more), but news of past weeks
are _very_ biased only and precisely against it. Like it would be, I dunno,
orchestrated or something.

~~~
tempguy9999
> like Saudi Arabia

It gets some hate, whether it's proper measure thereof, I dunno. Good
question.

> China deserves all the bashing it gets

For clarity it would be helpful not to conflate the entirety of china with the
chinese govt.

> are very biased only and precisely against it

Probably talking about "crushed bodies and broken bones". Rather sets the
tone, don't you think?

OK, genuinely: give us some good news stories that are genuine (ie. not
chinese government propaganda). It would be nice to hear another side.

~~~
tempguy9999
@saiya-jin: You complained about anti-china news, I asked you for something
more positive - I'm still interested.

~~~
saiya-jin
I don't have any china-positive news per se and I don't follow them closely
enough. Just pointed some feelings I have about China being all over the news
these days. I do care more about stuff like Turkish offensive into Syria or
continuous Yemen massacre orchestrated by Saudis.

Don't know about any Chinese external meddling like this, I guess we can call
it a positive story considering these days.

~~~
Santosh83
Right but of course for the Western world China's largely non-violent
crackdown on the Hong Kong protestors (with even the proposed law being
repealed today) is a much more heinous atrocity than millions of Yemeni
children literally starving to death because of SA's arrogant assurance of
Western backing at any cost.

