

Why 3 MIT Grads Want to Send You an Empty Box - joallard
http://www.wired.com/business/2013/05/one-click-selling/

======
downandout
The problem they are trying to solve is real. Many people don't know or want
to know how to market things they don't want anymore. They just want to sell
them. This is the same reason that Google now offers assistance with Adwords
campaigns - many businesses don't want to have to become Internet marketing
experts, but need customers.

I think that without a local presence where items are screened, fraud/product
misrepresentation/stolen items will be a significant issue - perhaps enough to
sink them. They are essentially saying "hey, use our eBay account to sell
stuff and we'll send you money". They have serious logistical issues to deal
with, but I wish them luck because they are solving a real problem with
potentially massive rewards if they can get it right.

~~~
georgemcbay
"The problem they are trying to solve is real."

It is absolutely real for me. I've got like two closets full of older but
perfectly fine stuff (like the laptop I replaced with the laptop I bought this
year) that I would feel bad throwing away but I don't want to bother selling
through normal means (and none of my immediate friends is interested in
having).

I would absolutely use this service to get rid of the stuff even if the
offered price were marginal. In my case, I'd even be fine shipping the stuff
out for free if the box shipping were pre-paid (but I may be an extreme case).

Having too much stuff is a first world problem, for sure, but sign me up.

~~~
wtvanhest
The problem is real for me too. What is really crazy is that I may actually be
too lazy to snap a picture and email it.

When I had more time and less money I would buy camera equipment from people
on CL, and resell it for huge mark ups. Most people just wanted it gone and
were willing to get a little cash.

I bet they do a lot more volume than people are giving them credit for. I also
think a smart phone app that allows you to take a photo and immediately send
it to the company would increase their potential merchandise.

~~~
zwily
They have an iPhone app which makes the whole process very slick, including
taking pictures. I haven't tried selling with it yet, but it looks nice.

------
axxl
Interesting idea, however I just don't think the issue with selling most items
is the box. The post office has plenty of free boxes you can take, and if it's
a bit too big you can usually pad it with newspaper. They specifically say
they're only supporting small objects so that ruins any argument about
something big. When the author says "As someone who hardly ever sells anything
online in part because I never have the right box", I just don't feel like
this solves some of the issues that seem to be bigger in selling.

Now the other aspect of the service, which is where they will post the item
for you and set up the description, price etc and handle dealing with the
customer, that's where the value seems to be. Most people don't sell items
online because they have to set up an account, figure out pricing, make sure
they have good ratings so people will still buy for them and deal with
chargebacks.

~~~
jarrett
For me, the biggest hurdle to selling my personal items online is flaky and/or
malicious buyers.

On Craigslist, buyers tend to be extremely flaky. Every time I've sold
something there, I've wasted substantial time with people who arrange meeting
times and don't show up. This happens many times per item. It's also overrun
with scammers, although those are easy to spot if you know the signs. (Bad
grammar, being unrealistically enthusiastic to the point of offering _more_
than the asking price, mentions of out-of-state or overseas transactions,
etc..)

On eBay, you have the ever-present risk of fraud. A typical scam goes
something like this: Someone buys your item, you ship it, the buyer files a
dispute, and eBay/PayPal take back the money. The scammer was planning to file
a dispute all along, even if you did everything right. There's very little you
can do to combat this, in part because eBay tends to favor buyers over
sellers.

If Sold takes on all the hassle and risk of consumer-to-consumer selling, then
I'll definitely consider using it.

~~~
bittercynic
For me, the worst part about using ebay is the stench.

Ebay has done so much to build ill-will with sellers over the years, and with
the recent fee increases it was almost too much for me to continue. I decide
to hold my nose and list a couple of items anyway this past week, but the
listing page is now broken in both Firefox and Chrome on linux!

Enough is enough.

It is a shame, though. The users generally seem to be pretty good, and I
almost always enjoy dealing with them.

~~~
jarrett
Yeah, I haven't sold anything on eBay in a while. The fees I could maybe deal
with. But the fraud was what really drove me away.

------
callmeed
Video is great. App/service looks solid. But marketplaces are _so tough_ that
I feel you almost HAVE TO START IN A NICHE and take the bowling pin strategy
[1].

Look at Yardsale–they're a YC company and doing essentiall the same as Sold. I
haven't seen much press about growth or follow-on funding.

Poshmark, on the other hand, is niche-focused (women's fashion) and seems to
be growing well. Raised $15.5M. [2]

[1] <http://cdixon.org/2010/08/21/the-bowling-pin-strategy/>

[2] [http://techcrunch.com/2012/12/04/poshmark-
nabs-12m-series-b-...](http://techcrunch.com/2012/12/04/poshmark-
nabs-12m-series-b-led-by-menlo-ventures-to-expand-its-mobile-fashion-
marketplace-beyond-ios/)

------
rj2hhhhh
I'd say that this is a really cool approach. The number of times that I have
wanted to sell an item but procrastinated thinking of the posting + shipping
hassles are countless. This obviously is targeted at a lazy ass like myself
and my bet is that there a bunch like me around. Good luck to these guys. I
for one plan to try it out.

------
jlgreco
Irrelevant nitpick, but including punctuation in their trademark makes their
marketing materials pretty hard to read: _"Not only are Sold. boxes free, but
they come pre-paid, pre-labeled, pre-insured, tracked, and filled with bubble
wrap"_

Reading this stuff requires two passes for me.

Anyway, neat company. Unfortunately I don't think I have anything they would
be willing to sell. This is something I would be interested in trying if I
did.

~~~
earh
Yahoo! had similar problems

------
sdfjkl
I'd use that in a heartbeat. Here in the UK, there's only eBay and Gumtree
where you can realistically sell used stuff and both are a total pain in the
ass. eBay doesn't really want private sellers and lets you feel it, plus it
forces you to use PayPal, which won't let you have your money for 21 days
after you sold something. Gumtree is full of scammers and bullshitters and few
buyers.

Please bring this to Europe, we need it too.

~~~
mietek
This is so true. I can't believe how bad the online auction space is right
now, and it's been like that for years!

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J_Darnley
From the terms: "[You may use us if] You have access to a compatible
smartphone, mobile device or other device that is supported by our platform."
Isn't a web browser supposed to be all you need these days? This looks to be a
greater downside than the fact it is US only.

~~~
Noughmad
The US-only thing I can understand, because international shipping is
expensive and payments are difficult. But really, why do I need a phone with a
particular OS just to send them a few pictures?

------
joshdance
It is a great idea. I hope it works. I tried selling some memory and an iPhone
on the service. Neither was accepted. The memory was too old, and I didn't
have the actually iPhone (I was selling it for someone else) to take pictures
of. I tried to use stock photos but didn't go. Overall, liked the idea, liked
the service, liked the app. Hope it takes off.

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acgourley
The devil is in the details, not the idea, here. But I hope they can get them
right!

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quinndupont
Either I'm missing something (or just struck upon a brilliant idea), but the
important point of sending you an empty box isn't that they save you a trip to
the postal office (although this is a nice side effect), but that the empty
box psychologicaly induces you to sell your items, and Sold takes a cut on the
sale. Just as charities figured out long ago, if you send someone a dollar or
even a quarter they'll donate, same goes with an empty box. It is just too
easy to sell something, and besides, they sent you this nice box! I think the
psychology of this strategy is genius.

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marknutter
Why is the "MIT Grads" part even relevant? Can't this idea stand on its own
two feet?

~~~
ExpiredLink
I remember having seen this idea before. The hard part is to implement it.

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natemc
Sounds like a beefed up Glyde. List your games/movies/books and when it sells
they send you a SASE and they handle all the money etc. All you have to do is
list condition, item, and price (it will suggest based on market value) then
just put the item in an envelope when it sells.

Was the only way I was buying/selling PS3 games for quite some time.

------
taigeair
I'm reminded of startup in Europe that bought junk from you, sent you a box,
and sold it. I met the founder at an event. Forgot the name though. It's a
hard one to scale and not that easy to make money with...

Also reminds me of <https://www.getyardsale.com/>

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dxbydt
Send me an empty box ? Why not send me a Google Glass. I'll put on the glass,
look at the object I want to sell, and say "Glass, Sell!". It will then take a
picture of the object, upload to cloud, run a few ML algos to figure out a
competitive price point & vendor site ( ebay, amazon, niche ) & list my item
on vendor with a auto-generated description ( standard summarization algos ).
If it were smart enough, it would run a second price auction of the item on my
behalf, perhaps flag bidder bots as well, and auto-tweet me when the item was
sold. I'd walk out the door with the object & an unmanned Google Car would be
waiting outside. Toss the object into the car & the amount gets credited to my
Google Wallet. Fun times...

~~~
eru
If the item is small enough, the tacocopter could take it on its return
journey.

------
mtct
>As someone who hardly ever sells anything online in part because I never have
the right box, I am clearly the target market for Sold.

Yeah, if something so trivial like find the right box stop you from make
money, Bryan, selling is really not something for you.

------
melvinmt
Or.. you can just order free boxes at USPS:
[https://store.usps.com/store/browse/subcategory.jsp?category...](https://store.usps.com/store/browse/subcategory.jsp?categoryId=subcatMSS_B_Free)

~~~
dbh937
It doesn't seem like you actually read the article. The service doesn't just
send you a box, but appraises and lists the item you're trying to sell.

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kevingibbon
Love the idea and execution (from watching the video). I put a bunch of random
crap I had lying around on ebay and started the auctions at a dollar. I would
have happily used Sold and saved the shipping hassle.

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philsalesses
I tried to post an iPhone but got stuck when I didn't post enough description.
They emailed once reminding me but then that mail got buried and I forgot.
They have an opportunity to fix that problem creatively, by maybe using
different interfaces for different products, where each post screen is
uniquely tailored to posting that specific product optimally.

They're definitely in the right path, but I think like any startup, they have
some wrinkles to iron out. Luckily they have an amazing team and I think
they'll do just fine in time.

------
realdlee
I've been a seller on eBay on and off since 1995. Selling is inconvenient and
shipping has always been the biggest pain point. After the sale, it's rare
where I feel like my time selling on eBay was well-spent, but it's kind of fun
and I find it interesting to see how much my unwanted stuff can fetch.

I'm interested in seeing how Sold progresses. For the niche, pricier items
that Sold is focusing on right now, I'd be more willing to invest the time to
handle the sale myself since the payoff is presumably higher.

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kriro
Seems legit to me. I feel quite a bit of pain that can be solved. I usually
just don't sell stuff because it's quite the hassle to go out, get a box, ship
the stuff at the post office etc.

If they can just solve that for some fee I'd be pretty happy already. Buyout
from Ebay/Amazon is likely if this works.

Basically I'd like my workflow to be: Put stuff on Amazon/Ebay...when it's
bought the postman will come the next day and pick it up and deliver it for
me. Kind of like a reverse Amazon-Prime.

~~~
Domenic_S
Hmm, that's the workflow already. If you're shipping at least one Priority
package, the postman will pick up your packages for free. They'll deliver
boxes to your door for free, too.

~~~
kevingibbon
USPS only pickup somewhere between 10-2 M-S and its still a pain unless you do
it a ton.

Don't mean to take anything away from sold (amazing product) but we are
starting a company that takes care of the shipping, for anything. Check it out
if interested <http://shyp.co>

~~~
Domenic_S
You can leave the package on your porch, and they pickup sometime that mail
day, same effect as taking it to the post office. Takes about 4 clicks to
request the pickup.

It's a pain if you don't have boxes and tape and whatever, that's true --
looks like your service handles that for you which is pretty sweet.

~~~
kevingibbon
Thanks! Agreed about the porch but that only works for items of small value.

Another huge thing people don't realize is box size. In most cases you can
save up to 50% off the shipping price if you can fit your item in the tightest
box possible. There are only a few sizes USPS provides for free using priority
mail.

We have about 20 different box sizes to take advantage of this.

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csomar
Here is my take: Just send me the box, and I'll put the stuff. I don't want to
take a photo and list it and then agree on the price. If I did that, I'll just
go and sell it on eBay on my own. How is it different?

So I give you the stuff. You figure out if it can sell. You take a good
percentage cut. You deposit the money for me. Just make the process
transparent in case I cared about the details.

~~~
hcarvalhoalves
I believe the difference is that they find the optimal price, deal with
annoying buyers and pick it up at your house.

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ereckers
Sounds cool and the mechanics of it seem to be really well thought out.
However, the service seems to provide a lot of value-add that will eventually
have to be paid for. "Sold" will have to make a pretty compelling argument to
the seller that losing 25%? from just doing it themselves is going to be worth
it.

Which gets me to thinking, do services like Gazzelle make money?

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orangethirty
This is really interesting. I wonder how they will handle customer service,
returns, etc. But its nice to see them try something new. Marketing/sales are
quite challenging. Many great products have fled due to nor being marketed
appropriately. Anyone interested in marketing as a service (Api based)?

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danso
I think the motivation behind the service is definitely sound...I'm just not
sure that the service, as described, solves the most pertinent pain
points...and part of the problem is, the pain points are different depending
on whether you're a very casual seller, or a regular one (i.e. several
products a week).

For example, the auto-marketing of the product:

> _With Sold’s app, you take a picture of the thing you want to sell and write
> a description. The company uses a mix of algorithmic and human judgment to
> figure out how much you can probably get for the item and sends you the
> proposed price. If you accept, Sold posts your product on whatever online
> marketplace the company determine is best—eBay, Amazon or smaller niche
> sites, depending on what you’re selling._

OK, let's assume Sold's price assessment goes without a hitch (and that's a
big, big if)...there are a few things that it seems users will always want
control of. If Sold decides my product would work best on eBay, then is there
the appropriate configuration options so that I can define minimum bid and
user reputation?

And if so, how much convenience does Sold's wrapper over this process give me
over just directly using the service itself? And is it worth the fee that Sold
charges (I'm assuming that it charges some kind of overhead)?

Now if I were selling lots of things in a fairly regular interval...how does
Sold scale? If I were a craft maker/vintage seller, why would I pick Sold over
Etsy, for instance?

~~~
jarrett
> If Sold decides my product would work best on eBay, then is there the
> appropriate configuration options so that I can define minimum bid and user
> reputation?

I don't know if this is the case, but I'd hope they would completely abstract
away the particulars of eBay vs Craigslist vs anything else. I.e. you wouldn't
have to know or care about minimum bids or buyer reputation. Sold just tells
you the price, you accept it, and they pay you. Problems with the eBay buyer?
Sold absorbs that time and money cost. At least that's how I would want it to
work.

> And if so, how much convenience does Sold's wrapper over this process give
> me over just directly using the service itself?

If all the effort and risk of selling an item is abstracted away as I
suggested above, then that would be a great deal of value added, at least for
me.

> Now if I were selling lots of things in a fairly regular interval...how does
> Sold scale?

I don't know the numbers yet, but I'd have to guess you'd be better off
managing your own sales and shipping at that point. You could still use a
marketplace site like Etsy or eBay. But I don't think you'd want a second
layer of middlemen, which Sold is. It sounds like Sold is for one-off,
consumer-to-consumer transactions.

------
jonny_eh
I could swear this has been tried many times before. I could be wrong though.
Best of luck to them!

~~~
jlogsdon
Gazelle[1] does it for devices. _edit:_ I thought they sent you a box, but you
have to ship it to them yourself.

[1] <http://www.gazelle.com/>

~~~
slg
They will only send you a box if they think your product is worth enough. They
also greatly reduced the number of products they buy recently. It used to be
virtually any gadget, now it is mostly limited to recent smartphones and Apple
devices.

------
tenpoundhammer
I think the main problem most people(not people on hacker news) have is that
they value their crap higher than anyone else values it. When they add in the
actual cost of their time the end result is that most people would rather keep
the item or give it to charity.

------
jroseattle
Interesting concept, but I question how defensible this service would be. It
seems both Amazon and Ebay could simply offer this as an add-on service, and
really...who is going to be better positioned to develop recommendation
algorithms for marketing products?

~~~
eru
Customer service will make a huge difference. So that could be their moat.

~~~
jroseattle
I'm not sure I would expect customer service to be the difference maker in
terms of separation from the competition. With Amazon, you're talking about
existing world-class customer service. And doing customer service well at
scale is a capital-intensive business.

The separation from competition that I would see as valuable are the two other
aspects of the service: algorithmic sales and logistical support.

Great ideas from these guys, but in terms of the resources to work with, all
things considered I'd rather be in the position of the incumbents than the
scrappy startup.

------
tikhon
This is a great competitor to Gazelle, a Boston-based startup that is doing
really really well.

------
angrydev
Amazon runs a service like this, I'm surprised it's not better known:
[http://services.amazon.com/fulfillment-by-amazon/how-it-
work...](http://services.amazon.com/fulfillment-by-amazon/how-it-
works.htm?ld=NSGoogleAS)

~~~
xur17
Sold is handling the pricing, listing, and dealing with customers. I sold a
few things through Amazon FBA, and while it was pretty easy, I still had to
list the items, and change the price a few times.

This takes it a step further, and deals with all of the headaches associated
with selling. You just take a picture, place it in a box, and you're done. I
can definitely see a market for this.

------
btilly
Reminds me. Some day I should sell that mint condition Aibo ERS-210 that I
have gathering dust. It was a gift from my sister that didn't fit my life, so
has spent most of its time in a box, with the original manual.

------
nextstep
This seems like really cool service. I don't think the name "Sold" is a smart
choice, however. It quickly gets confusing in a "Who's on First" sort of way
when talking about this service in conversation.

------
shurcooL
Now this is something I want.

Assuming the price I get is over half of what I'd expect to be able to get for
it myself if I put in a lot of time, effort, and luck.

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lucb1e
Although the title is obviously clickbait, it's one of the few that make their
promise totally true. They really do want to send you an empty box!

------
mesozoic
This is cool. I sell on eBay a lot but would totally use this, except I mostly
want to sell crap they probably wouldn't take.

------
jchrisa
Fuck this is awesome. Can I invest in them?

------
canthonytucci
You'd think three guys from MIT could come up with a better idea.

The whole point of this is to generate enough press to sell to ebay or amazon
right?

------
thoughtcriminal
I like the idea, I just can't picture someone like my Aunt Jeanne using the
service.

~~~
sharkweek
I imagine my dad, a man so engrained in the craigslist marketplace, would
really struggle with any sort of technological advancement in this system. He
likes the "old-fashioned" way of posting the item himself at a price he wants
to sell for then having someone come by to check it out.

Anything else is going to be too complicated for him.

