

 Snowden be damned: Government renews US call record order - codesuela
http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2013/07/snowden-be-damned-government-renews-us-call-record-order/

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s_q_b
That press release is very odd. It negatively impacts the standing arguments
in the pending litigation, and it's also just flat strange for the government
to release information about classified surveillance programs.

It almost reads as a personal message to Snowden, which fits with the
generally ham-fisted manner in which the affair thus far has been handled.

There was a legitimate chance to get him to come back and stand trial in
Hawaii, but the government instead went into full bore attack mode.

Threatening powerful nations like China and Russia, grounding the plane of a
sitting head of state, and having an NGO deliver a personal message that said
essentially "we consider you a traitor, so expect to be treated as such..."
The list goes on.

The most frustrating part is that these tactics had the exact opposite of the
intended effect. When other countries ignored our threats, it made us look
impotent. When Snowden was not on Morales's plane, it made us look inept. When
we delivered a threat to Snowden, it underscored exactly how beyond our reach
he really is.

Morality aside, this is just bad tradecraft.

~~~
jmduke
_That press release is very odd. It negatively impacts the standing arguments
in the pending litigation, and it 's also just flat strange for the government
to release information about classified surveillance programs._

I don't mean this as a criticism of you, as I know everyone has different
opinions, but it frustrates me because criticizing the United States for being
more transparent about their surveillance programs while also previously
criticizing the US for lack of transparency seems unfairly hypocritical.

I think a lot of commenters have made the United States into a villain; it
doesn't matter what they do now, it'll be construed as the wrong move.

~~~
s_q_b
The transparency argument rings hollow to me. Either you believe it's
permissible for them to conduct this surveillance, or you don't. If you don't,
then the solution is to stop the programs. If you do, then it helps that the
programs remain secret.

How does it help anyone if the government tells me they're spying on me?

As an aside, look through my comment history. I doubt you'll feel that I'm
making the US into a villain in this scenario.

~~~
sneak
> Either you believe it's permissible for them to conduct this surveillance,
> or you don't. If you don't, then the solution is to stop the programs. If
> you do, then it helps that the programs remain secret.

This is a very good point.

As much as I fiercely despise these programs and the men that designed and
enacted them, if one thinks that they're permissible, then keeping them as
secret as possible makes logical sense.

