
One of few places on Earth where an international boundary can be seen at night - vinnyglennon
http://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/IOTD/view.php?id=86725&src=fb
======
chrispeel
See also the South/North Korea border:
[http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2725415/Nasa-...](http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2725415/Nasa-
satellite-images-North-Korea-secretive-space.html)

~~~
bendykstra
Also, East and West Berlin, still distinguishable by the streetlamps which
have not been replaced since reunification.

[http://www.theguardian.com/world/shortcuts/2013/apr/21/astro...](http://www.theguardian.com/world/shortcuts/2013/apr/21/astronaut-
chris-hadfield-berlin-divide)

------
Theodores
One man decided that border in a matter of a few weeks having never been to
India before.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radcliffe_Line](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radcliffe_Line)

He left after drawing the line, burning his papers and not accepting payment.
So nobody really knows why the border was decided to be where it is yet untold
billions have been spent defending it and lighting it up.

Oh, and that border cost ~500,000 lives.

------
mattzito
Once flying from the US to Delhi, a flight attendant came to get me in the
middle of the night, and waved me over to an open window row to show me the
border. It's quite pretty, but it is striking how few lights are on _other_
than the border itself.

~~~
chimeracoder
> It's quite pretty, but it is striking how few lights are on other than the
> border itself.

A few reasons for that:

1) The border between India and Pakistan is one of the less populated regions
of both countries, for a variety of reasons.

2) Many cities in India have a variety of load-mitigation ordinances in effect
to reduce power and water consumption. I'm not sure what the state is these
days in Delhi and nearby areas, but it's similar to what's done in parts of
the US, just on a larger scale.

3) Power is expensive! In the US, it's astonishing how much electricity we
waste, even (or especially) at night. India is overall a less wealthy country,
so people naturally conserve electricity much more than we're used to over
here.

------
derefr
I first misread this as "international date line can be seen at night" and was
questioning for a moment whether everything I knew about time zones was wrong.
(Though, I do imagine there are some good pictures to be taken where it's 4PM
on one side of a border and 5PM on the other side, and very different things
are happening as a result.)

------
dest
I wonder how many MW are spent on this border

~~~
pp19dd
Good question.

Wikipedia entry claims 150,000 floodlights but I question the origin of this
number. It showed up out of the blue, in a single edit, and none of the cited
sources have the said number in them. Two pieces of information that the edit
added are that there are (A) 0.15 million lights, and (B) 50,000 poles they're
on: [https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Indo-
Pakistani_bo...](https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Indo-
Pakistani_border&diff=next&oldid=630098351)

Trying to trace A or B just shows articles that obviously quoted wikipedia,
and they use either version of 0.15 or 150,000 depending on when they were
written. At this point, the wiki entry number is almost imaginary, being
circularly reinforced by web articles referencing it.

~~~
dest
thanks for the research.

this article [http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2033886/India-
Pakist...](http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2033886/India-Pakistan-
border-visible-space.html) may give further insight. from the picture, one can
estimate that lights are separated by approx 20 meters, and the length of the
lighted border is about 2000 km. This gives about 100 000 floodlights, which
is consistent with the Wikipedia figure. Those lights seem rather powerful. I
would not be astonished if they were 1kW each (might be much smaller if made
of LED, but the yellow-ish color suggests it's not). This gives 100 MW of
lighting power. Crap, that's a lot.

------
1971genocide
I am usually for open borders but pakistan is really an exception. They have
too many problems - They in the past used to openly fund terrorist militias in
both India and Nepal.

Until they sort themselves out its a good idea to create a donald trump style
wall between them and India.

~~~
cocoawhale
This comment is so discriminatory. India and Pakistan basically have the same
problems. Both countries are quite screwy. Read real books on both countries
rather than just reading new articles and you would know this.

~~~
1971genocide
Nice for you to assume my ignorance.

Pakistan and Saudi Arabia both fund extremist Islamist groups, but no one
seems to acknowledge it since both are US allies.

India has its problems but no where the level of Pakistan. The people of
Pakistan are extremely brainwashed with religious extremism. I know that
because I went to a school filled with them and also Indians. They openly
justify terrorism - we are not talking about uneducated people, but extremely
educated - cream of the crop pakistanis.

I would love to live to see pakistan became a better country but its people
are so backward - its going to take a lot of time to solve all the problems
they have.

~~~
JumpCrisscross
> Pakistan and Saudi Arabia both fund extremist Islamist groups, but no one
> seems to acknowledge it since both are US allies.

I thought it was a well-travelled non-secret in U.S. diplomatic circles. The
Atlantic ran an article [1] a few years ago that caused quite a stir, in part
by showing that the U.S. has active invade-and-defuse ("render safe") plans
for Pakistan.

[1] [http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/print/2011/12/the-
ally-f...](http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/print/2011/12/the-ally-from-
hell/308730/)

~~~
1971genocide
Did Obama ever come out and condemn pakistani actions ?

He criticized India for its backward views on women - and no words on the
saudis.

I view both Pakistan and Saudi Arabia to be the most vile countries with
extremely vile societies - I used to think its just the govt. But having lived
in the middle east and known a lot of saudis and pakistanis I am disappointed
to say that the people are not much more different that the terrible views
spewed by their govt.

But somehow the countries that require the most attention are Iran and Syria ?

~~~
WildUtah
_Did Obama ever come out and condemn pakistani actions?_

Obama took big risks in the 2008 campaign to accuse Pakistan of harboring
Usama ibn Laden. Hillary and McCain both condemned him for telling the truth.

The national media and national security PR machine attacked Obama for saying
it but Obama stood firm. Obama also promised he'd go into Pakistan and kill
ibn Laden whatever the diplomatic cost and then he did it.

Obama also told us exactly why the Iraq adventure would be a disaster in 2002.

I don't like the police state policies Obama enforces at home, but we're lucky
to have him. The next few presidents are unlikely to be as brave, honest,
visionary, or competent when it comes to foreign policy. The Washington
insider machine will be back in power far too soon.

------
20kleagues
As a Pakistani I feel genuinely sad that so much is being spent on enforcing
borders when there's so much poverty on either sides of the border in the
southern regions.

~~~
grokavi
And as a South Indian I feel cheated that the money I pay as tax is being
wasted this way in what is essentially a North Indian problem.

~~~
thrownaway122
The propensity to fight pointless wars is a human problem not specific to any
particular grouping of humans.

~~~
grokavi
Yes, but I'm not paying for the wars humans are waging all over the globe. I
would rather have power in Bangalore than waste it this way.

~~~
cmadan
AFAIK, you are. India has contributed millions in foreign aid to rebuild
Afghanistan and contributes a significant number of troops to UN peacekeeping
forces.

~~~
grokavi
Unfortunately, you are correct. I am paying for all the evil deeds of India.

