
Gotham 7.5K: A Rare High Altitude Night Flight Above NYC - davidbarker
https://www.storehouse.co/stories/r3rcy-gotham-7-5k
======
HCIdivision17
The images truly are breathtaking.

His note about the streets seeming like neurons is interesting, but I hope I'm
not the only person who immediately thought the shots resembled an exaggerated
extruded version of a chip's layered layout.

(Here's sort of a small version:
[http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e0/Cell-
Proc...](http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e0/Cell-
Processor.jpg) )

It's a bit odd: the scale of the city is not quite large enough to look like a
modern processor's layout, yet is tens/hundreds of thousands of times larger.
The scale of complexity is boggling.

~~~
silvio
New York as a Microchip layout was the main theme of the intro of 'Hackers'.
Check out around 0:40

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9c4KG_8iTZM](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9c4KG_8iTZM)

~~~
kilovoltaire
Wow perfect reference.

Btw just in case you didn't know, you can link to specific times in youtube
videos, e.g.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9c4KG_8iTZM&t=55s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9c4KG_8iTZM&t=55s)

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sokoloff
One of my favorite things to do with new passengers is take them up and down
the Hudson River corridor, an airspace that "tunnels through" the more tightly
controlled airspaces of Newark and Laguardia. From the Verrazanno Bridge up
the Manhattan side of the river at 1000 feet and exiting over the Tappan Zee
(or vice versa, southbound on the Jersey side, or a round trip) is
unforgettable for passengers.

These images are breathtaking, but the nofilter, in-real-life version are even
moreso, IMO.

~~~
larrys
How difficult is it to get clearance to fly a helicopter or airplane over
Manhattan as they did? It seems like an unnecessary risk given the population
density. For that matter wouldn't it be possible for a terrorist to get
approval by creating a ruse of a legitimate (but non essential) reason?

~~~
ganeumann
NY ATC hates giving VFR clearance in the area. Too much jet traffic to deal
with. If you can get a word in edgewise, they'll often let you out over NJ
(watch out for the Teterboro jets!) but I never see anyone heading out over
Manhattan. You need to be above 2000' to be legal because of the height of the
buildings and then you're starting to get into the altitudes the jets are
using on approach to JFK or LGA.

Over the Hudson River (East River too) is VFR (uncontrolled) airspace up to
1500 feet [edit: this was changed to 1300 feet in 2009, after the accident
referenced below] bank to bank up to the George Washington Bridge. My flight
instructor told me that the radar shadow of the buildings makes it difficult
to control, but I don't really know if that's the reason. You don't need ATC
permission to fly there.

It's a zoo, though, pretty dense helicopter and small plane traffic, and
everybody's looking at the big buildings, not the other planes. In 2009 a
small plane and helicopter collided, killing 9 people. I've flown up there
once, and it was totally worth it, but I probably wouldn't do it again.

~~~
sokoloff
That's not been my experience. I can regularly get my choice of the Hudson at
2000 or lower with a clearance (1100-2000 requires a clearance in most
places). At night, I prefer lower as the buildings are more impressive when
you're below the top of them. On a nice summer day, the VFR corridor can be a
zoo, so I'll sometimes take the clearance at 1500 just to stay in less
congested airspace.

If LGA is landing 13 or Newark is using 11/29, then you have a conflict with
the airspace over the river, but it's very rare for Newark to use 11/29, and
LGA traffic counts aren't all that high to present a conflict. Plus, if you're
on a clearance and being controlled by LGA tower, they'll turn you if they
need to to accommodate a departure or an arrival.

I often hear pilots complain they can't get a clearance through NYC Bravo
airspace, but I've only once been turned down in probably 50 attempts. That
was a Thanksgiving Wednesday when they had a radar outage and they were
turning everyone away who wasn't landing inside the Bravo. I've found NYC tri-
Bravo controllers some of the easiest and most accommodating approach
controllers to work with.

~~~
larrys
Total envy that you (and the parent commenter) actually get to do this type of
thing. (Meaning fly private planes or helis).

~~~
ganeumann
Most people can learn to fly. It's a bit pricy but maybe not as bad as you
think. Easier to do than drive a car, except for when you make a mistake. Look
for a flight school nearby. The intro flight is usually at a steep discount.

There is absolutely nothing like flying a small plane. My first night solo
(flew down the shore, over Atlantic City) is one of my best memories.

~~~
tlrobinson
"except for when you make a mistake"

That's the part that concerns me...

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chdir
Love them. Why disable right click though?

document.getElementsByTagName('img')

[https://d12oemfd9cl6ha.cloudfront.net/i/images/imgs/27839146...](https://d12oemfd9cl6ha.cloudfront.net/i/images/imgs/278391461073204345/original.jpg?w=2048&h=2048&crop_mode=fit&v=1)

[https://d12oemfd9cl6ha.cloudfront.net/i/images/imgs/27833893...](https://d12oemfd9cl6ha.cloudfront.net/i/images/imgs/278338934178992040/original.jpg?w=2048&h=2048&crop_mode=fit&v=1)

[https://d12oemfd9cl6ha.cloudfront.net/i/images/imgs/27833887...](https://d12oemfd9cl6ha.cloudfront.net/i/images/imgs/278338875039968515/original.jpg?w=2048&h=2048&crop_mode=fit&v=1)

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gandalfu
For comparison, here is the view from the Empire State at night with 30s
exposures.

Not only his pictures are visually stunning, but also incredibly difficult to
capture.

[https://www.flickr.com/photos/63499655@N02/sets/721576298051...](https://www.flickr.com/photos/63499655@N02/sets/72157629805159101/)

~~~
morcheeba
That's 30 seconds at f9 at ISO 100. They were shooting at 3200-6400, at
f1.4-2.8

Counting down, that's 30/100, 15/200, 8/400, 4/800, 2/1600, 1/3200 ... so same
aperture cuts it down to 1 second.

Then increasing the aperture 1/f8, 0.5/f5.6 0.25/f4 (1/8second)/f2.8
(1/15second)/f2 (1/30second/f1.4).

That's still difficult to capture, but a wide lens and/or image stabilization
will help. Getting all 50 megapixels sharp would be hard to do.

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mlrtime
I'm sure many would love to get high-res versions of these pics, any chance
he'll make them available?

~~~
nikanj
[http://pastebin.com/m0ww3pGK](http://pastebin.com/m0ww3pGK)

~~~
ars
You should not run all those in parallel. It's rude.

To anyone who wants to use that script: Remove the & on line 9.

~~~
mfkp
Meh, I think cloudfront can handle it. That's what CDNs are for.

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callmeed
I've worked on some web things for Vincent in my days in the photo industry.
He's always been a favorite photographer of mine. His technical ability and
attention to detail in photography is mind-blowing.

What's even more impressive is he took to cinematography a few years back and
seems to be just as skilled.

If you haven't seen them yet, check out his tilt-shift images:
[http://agonistica.com/tilt-shift-photography-by-vincent-
lafo...](http://agonistica.com/tilt-shift-photography-by-vincent-laforet/)

And here is a commercial he filmed:
[http://vimeo.com/17355509](http://vimeo.com/17355509)

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miahi
There was an interview for Fstoppers a while ago, in which he gives more
details about the shooting:

[https://fstoppers.com/aerial/gotham-above-exclusive-
intervie...](https://fstoppers.com/aerial/gotham-above-exclusive-interview-
and-air-bts-video-vincent-laforet-50982)

------
discardorama
FTA: > Had we gone just a few thousand more feet up (around 11,000-12,000
feet) we would have needed oxygen masks!

Really? I was roaming around at the top of Mauna Kea last summer (14K'), and
hiked to the top of Mt Lassen too (10.5K'), but never felt the need for ozygen
masks.

~~~
th0ma5
Regulations require it, also air likes to cling to to the surface, plus you
had a chance to acclimate and/or are experienced with such a thing.

~~~
pc
The regulations actually don't require it. Under FAA rules for general
aviation ("Part 91"), you need oxygen between 12,500 and 14,000 feet if you
remain there for more than 30 minutes, and it's only once you climb above
14,000 feet that the pilot unequivocally has to have it. You need to get to
15,000 feet before the passengers have to have oxygen provided.

(More:
[http://www.faa.gov/pilots/safety/pilotsafetybrochures/media/...](http://www.faa.gov/pilots/safety/pilotsafetybrochures/media/Oxygen_Equipment.pdf))

~~~
ksherlock
Additionally, a cold winter night means dense air which means more oxygen. As
far as his lungs/brain are concerned, it's not 7,500 feet, it's more like
6,000 feet.

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pimlottc
Note, the Vimeo video is not embedded, it's just an screenshot. Confused me
for a bit there...

~~~
miahi
Here's the video: [http://vimeo.com/115292381](http://vimeo.com/115292381)

------
trhway
strange colors - bluish/greenish like toys - real or camera/filter quirks?

One can wonder what images this camera would produce
[http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/146909-darpa-shows-
off-1-...](http://www.extremetech.com/extreme/146909-darpa-shows-
off-1-8-gigapixel-surveillance-drone-can-spot-a-terrorist-from-20000-feet)

"With an imaging unit that totals 1.8 billion pixels, ARGUS captures video (12
fps) that is detailed enough to pick out birds flying through the sky, or a
lost toddler wandering around. "

~~~
pepve
"White" light sources are generally not really white. For example compared to
sunlight ordinary light bulbs are a bit orange and fluorescent tubes have a
green hue. Our brain mostly ignores these differences, but a camera sensor
does not. The author might have turned up the saturation on these images
though, I don't know how strong the difference is supposed to look.

~~~
moogleii
Somewhat related:
[http://la.curbed.com/archives/2014/02/las_new_led_streetligh...](http://la.curbed.com/archives/2014/02/las_new_led_streetlights_are_changing_the_way_movies_look_1.php)

NYC is supposed to complete its switch to LEDs by 2017 (but no idea on the
current progress)

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kapkapkap
Can someone explain the rainbow-like colors? This is from the
lenses/postprocessing/other?

~~~
dudus
I think that's time square. So the colors are real, from all the big screens
with ads that stay lit at night.

~~~
sbalea
Yes, that is Times Square and the theatre district. It really is that colorful
at night

------
cookiesboxcar
can anyone speak to the non-obvious (like more megapixel) advantages of
shooting this on the medium format Mamiya that he mentions? I've always been
intrigued by MF cameras, but they cost so much more causing them to be
inaccessible (to me anyway).

~~~
cjbprime
My understanding is: 1) More megapixels, 2) a larger sensor (more than twice
as large) means more signal-to-noise at each pixel site which means less noise
in low light, 3) the Mamiya has far greater dynamic range (around one stop
greater, double the amount of light).

~~~
Matsta
You're correct. What I'm wondering is why they used a 1DX instead of a Sony
A7S? The ISO range on the Sony would of probably outdone both Canon and the
Mamiya.

Taking photos at ISO 409,600 would be pretty awesome IMO.

~~~
fennecfoxen
You don't really want photos at ISO 409600 _per se_ , though, you just want
photos at the lowest ISO that can get you the necessary depth-of-field for
your shot (here extended with tilt-shift lens) at whatever shutter speed
avoids being too shaky. And _then_ you want as high of a dynamic range of
possible, so you can distinguish the brightest brights from the darkest darks
in a single shot.

If you can do that already with the sensitivity you've brought, higher ISO
doesn't buy you anything...

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msane
These remind me of some of the scenes in the end of the movie "Enter The
Void".

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nichochar
I would love to purchase these in high res and frame them, where can I do
that?

~~~
ssully
The photographer mentioned in the comments that they are working on it now.
They should be up at the site below, or if you are impatient you can use the
contact form to ask.

[http://fineart.laforetvisuals.com/](http://fineart.laforetvisuals.com/)

------
brokentone
Vincent Laforet was also one of the first to shoot a video on the Canon 5D
MkII - also involving helicopters over NYC.
[http://vimeo.com/7151244](http://vimeo.com/7151244)

------
hn_user2
Those images are amazing. Great photographer, and great idea at this unique
perspective. Although I think the height above the city drama was a bit
overplayed.

~~~
X-combinator
Again, Just freaking Awesome!

------
sokoloff
An acquaintance of mine manufactures a reasonably-priced gyro mount for in-
flight photography and videography and is based out of NY.

He has some excellent sample videos on his site from the NYC area (Statue of
Liberty, GW bridge, Rockefeller Center ice rink, etc):

[http://www.aerialexposures.com/video3.htm](http://www.aerialexposures.com/video3.htm)

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iwince
Truly amazing! I wonder what would happen to a large city like that if in a
blackout for 3 days.

~~~
mcjiggerlog
No need to wonder:

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City_blackout_of_1977](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York_City_blackout_of_1977)

~~~
iwince
Yep that's what I was thinking, "Thirty-five blocks of Broadway were
destroyed".

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davidw
As someone with a bad fear of heights: beautiful pictures but... _shudder_.

~~~
fnordfnordfnord
The narrator in this one claims to fear heights and electricity.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FGoaXZwFlJ4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FGoaXZwFlJ4)

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shanwang
Wooooooww, this is the most amazing photos i've seen for a long time.

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ck2
Reminds me of the scene from Contact

    
    
         - they're alive

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ChuckMcM
I so want a 2880 image of that for my desktop background.

~~~
Raphael
If you take off the parameters, the images are 3000x2000.

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jkot
Hm, how high can drone/baloon legally fly?

~~~
discardorama
Without permits, I think it's limited to 500 ft. Not that high, I'm afraid.

~~~
uptown
The FAA says 400 ft. for UAV.

~~~
davidw
Idle curiosity: I wonder how high a hobbyist unit could fly straight up before
running out of batteries.

~~~
PanMan
I was wondering about that as well. According to the manufacturer, the DJI
Phantom[1] (a common consumer drone) has a max vertical speed of 6 m/s. So in
10 minutes (battery lasts about 20, 10 up, 10 down), you could reach 3600m.
Higher than these pics were taken! (you remote probably won't reach that...)

Not sure if the max speed is up or down... [1]:
[http://www.dji.com/product/phantom/feature](http://www.dji.com/product/phantom/feature)

~~~
davidw
The heck with down, it'd be interesting to try a one-way trip! I wonder how
the thinner air up high affects things.

~~~
matheweis
For the one way trip:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GfxdeRx2fLA](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GfxdeRx2fLA)
(Not me or anyone I know, that is a pretty stupid flight).

About the thinner air... I regularly fly a hexacopter at 7500' (MSL here in
the mountains).

With all other things being equal, the thinner air means you have to run the
motors at much higher speeds to appreciate the same lift, and the resulting
loss in battery life is pretty significant. The same configuration that gets a
30 minute flight a 1000' MSL will only do about 12 minutes at 7500'.

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ceejayoz
Truly stunning photographs. Wow.

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rajat2109
Amazing!!!!!!

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rajat2109
FUck!!!! Beautiful images!!!!!!

