

The Ordeal of Immigrating Legally  - cwan
http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2011/04/the-ordeal-of-immigrating-legally/237166/

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bbb
Case in point: the American tax payer has payed for about 4.5 years of my
graduate CS education, which, according to my visa documents, exceeds $200,000
in total cost. I'd like to stay, (re-)pay taxes, and I already had a six-digit
job offer from a well-known American company. Further, my home country's
embassy submitted, in writing, that they have no objection to me staying in
the US, even permanently. Nonetheless, I'm getting "kicked out" this summer
within 30 days after I graduate.

I trust there must be good reasons on a global scale... but in my local view
this makes only limited sense.

(Btw., this is the J-1 visa home residency rule, for those who care. I need to
live in my home country for at least two years before I can apply for an H-1b.
Two years at home is just long enough to settle in and make moving _again_ not
very attractive.)

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michaelpinto
I think people in the tech industry "get it" when it comes to immigration, but
that flies in the face of so much of the xenophobia I see out there. Maybe the
tech industry should invest in some educational outreach efforts to at least
try and change the tide of things? I see too many talented people come to
America only to pack and go home a few years later.

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hugh3
I've never really seen any sort of xenophobia in the US. It's one of the least
xenophobic places in the world.

The real barriers to foreigners coming to the US are all bureaucratic.

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alextp
How is your experience in the US? Is it mostly NYC, New England, and
California (or big cities in other places)? From what I hear rural america
(which controls a disproportionate share of the voting power) tends to be more
xenophobic, specially around the border with mexico.

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tokenadult
_From what I hear rural america_

Should I take this in the natural way that a native speaker of English would
take it, to mean that you have never personally been to rural America? Where
else have you been, and what other countries' attitudes toward immigrants are
you comparing to the United States, which has one of the highest rates of
legal immigration in the world?

I should explain that I have spent much of my life in rural America (where my
mother grew up, and where most of my aunts and uncles and cousins live). The
rural Americans I know have been very accepting of my wife, a first-generation
immigrant, and generally accepting of immigrants to the degree of often hiring
immigrants as their various business ventures scale up.

I have also lived outside the United States, although only on one other
continent, and in my years overseas I have met quite a few people from a
variety of countries who report that their countries of course also limit
immigration. Is there any country in the world today with no restrictions at
all on immigration? Where is it? Who emigrates to settle there?

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grandalf
I don't see how anyone can justify barriers preventing people from immigrating
to the US. A 100% open policy would be the best humanitarian approach and
would also lead to the most economic growth.

~~~
lionheart
While I completely agree that in theory a 100% open policy would be ideal,
practically there is no way the US could accommodate the sudden influx of
immigrants that would result if we were to completely open our borders.

100% open immigration from Western Europe, Canada, Australia, and similar
countries... could possibly work.

100% open immigration to anybody who speaks fluent English... could possibly
work.

But opening up our borders completely to Eastern Europe, Asia, South America,
Africa would create complete chaos.

As an immigrant to the US from the former Soviet Union I know how hard it is
to really learn the language, the culture, and assimilate to the point where
you're actually leading a decent life and being a productive member of
society.

It took my family about 4 years to really get situated and both of my parents
are highly educated with a very strong work ethic and we had previous family
living here.

And we had to be supported by welfare and other government programs for 3 of
those years.

Although obviously a net gain over time, it takes a lot of resources to bring
an immigrant into the American fold and we don't have enough of those
resources to open our doors to everybody right now.

And it wouldn't even be good for the immigrants. With a large influx of people
from their country coming in, most would probably just settle somewhere
together, assimilate much slower and possibly even turn to semi-criminal
activity like many Russian immigrants I knew in New York.

No, we need to change our immigration policy, but not just by opening up the
doors.

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grandalf
Well, then at least we should increase the number of immigrants by upwards of
10% per year until a point where nobody is turned away.

The more immigrants we get, the more channels will exist for assimilation.
Many colleges and universities are having a tough time staying in business,
and major cities like Detroit are falling into decay b/c nobody wants to live
there.

When you consider how hard people have to work elsewhere even to get by,
pretty much anyone with enough gumption to come to the US would eventually
attain a middle class lifestyle, then many would exceed it.

And even if some remained very poor, it's probably better to be very poor in
the US than in many developing nations.

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uvdiv
_Well, then at least we should increase the number of immigrants by upwards of
10% per year until a point where nobody is turned away._

I see where you're coming from (trying to avoid economic shock with abrupt
policy changes), but since millions of Mexicans are already immigrating extra-
legally, would it make a meaningful difference?

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grandalf
I think it would slow things down a bit and allow firms in the US time to
begin offering services to the new immigrants... it would also give would-be
immigrants time to brush up on their English before they arrived.

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splat
A classic flowchart on the hassle of legal immigration:

<http://reason.org/files/cb299f0134ca8bb75243c69caa92eea7.pdf>

