
Mozilla's New Fira Typeface - potch
https://github.com/mozilla/Fira
======
fdb
It's designed by Erik Spiekermann:

[https://twitter.com/espiekermann/status/382189483031949312](https://twitter.com/espiekermann/status/382189483031949312)

~~~
mortenjorck
To anyone wondering, this is kind of the typographic equivalent to "by the
way, this JS library was written by John Resig."

~~~
ChikkaChiChi
Words I can understand, thanks!

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crazygringo
Very nice. It's awfully similar to Droid Sans, but the slightly lower
x-height, and more more "playful" elements (like the gap in the lowercase 'g',
the curve at the bottom of the lowercase 'l') make it bit more playful and
legible. Above all, it feels more balanced, and accomplished, than Droid Sans.

Excellent work.

~~~
msutherl
You know, I just don't think a humanist sans with a lot of character is the
right choice for an operating system.

~~~
lambda
I wouldn't think that bubbly windows with cheesy drop shadows and gee-whiz
transparency effects would be the right choice for an operating system,
either. And yet look at the last decade's design trends there, too.

Honestly, a somewhat playful humanist sans looks just fine in context, and a
lot cleaner than many other trendy OS designs recently.

~~~
msutherl
I have to agree with you on that. I was really looking forward to iOS 7 being
a step forward in that regard, but it's as bubbly as anything else, and
inconsistent to boot. At least Helvetica is nice and neutral.

I think the word for all of this is _kitsch_.

------
zanny
Hey look, its already in the AUR:

[https://aur.archlinux.org/packages/otf-fira-
sans/](https://aur.archlinux.org/packages/otf-fira-sans/)

[https://aur.archlinux.org/packages/otf-fira-
mono/](https://aur.archlinux.org/packages/otf-fira-mono/)

[https://aur.archlinux.org/packages/ttf-fira-
sans/](https://aur.archlinux.org/packages/ttf-fira-sans/)

Who needs firefox OS (I do have the in-browser emulator running, though), I
just changed my system font to this. I'll have opinions after a days usage.

~~~
d0m
Everything is in the AUR man ;)

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andmarios
Interesting. The character for greek k (kappa - κ ) is wrong though. The
vertical line of the greek k doesn't rise above the rest of the character. It
might seem small but it really strikes as ugly and wrong for anyone used to
the language.

~~~
saidajigumi
Since it's on Github, consider filing a new issue if someone hasn't gotten to
it already:

[https://github.com/mozilla/Fira/issues](https://github.com/mozilla/Fira/issues)

~~~
Avitas
Are the italic versions actually oblique (slanted)? In other words, is there a
typographic standard for labeling typefaces italics and oblique? I seem to
remember that there is a distinction.

~~~
jamestnz
>is there a typographic standard for labeling typefaces italics and oblique

As I recall it, oblique type uses the regular glyphs just slanted, whereas a
'true' italic typeface employs modified glyph versions having additional
calligraphy- or cursive-like flourishes.

In the following picture I've just made using Arial and Times, both fonts are
claiming an 'italic' version. The Times one really is italic by the above
definition, while the Arial one is 'oblique'.

[http://imgur.com/UVUZb5F](http://imgur.com/UVUZb5F)

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potch
Direct link to the specimen page:
[http://mozilla.github.io/Fira/](http://mozilla.github.io/Fira/)

~~~
mundizzle
cool, they made the text contenteditable so you can see how things looks
outside of their pre-canned text...

------
TheSwordsman
This is a beautiful looking font and I could definitely see myself adopting it
when typing papers.

I'd love to use it in my terminal, but my only problem is the zero isn't
dotted or slashed. My terminal font is stupid-small (I think 10pt), and the 0
and O looking similar has bitten me in code a few times.

Well, shit...

~~~
Nzen
Here's a programmer font intended to be very legible at 10pt
[http://www.arcavia.com/kyle/Software/ProgFont/index.html](http://www.arcavia.com/kyle/Software/ProgFont/index.html)
However, he accomplishes that feat by redesigning some english letters.

~~~
BetaCygni
What are you talking about? This font is a disaster, everything looks the
same.

------
jammmuel
I'm not a fan. I just don't get why they adapted FF Meta. It's overly complex
(the 'g' for example), and not a great display font. They should strive for
simplicity, rather than individuality. Android's Roboto and iOS's Helvetica
Neue achieve this, my personal preference being for for latter.

~~~
devindotcom
Yeah, the kink in the lowercase y, the gap in the g, and a few other touches
don't scale down well IMHO. I am a big fan of the trend of designing free
typefaces for general use like this, though.

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wernah
I'm really curious as to why they would use images over font-face in the style
guide examples [http://www.mozilla.org/en-US/styleguide/products/firefox-
os/...](http://www.mozilla.org/en-US/styleguide/products/firefox-
os/typeface/). As a designer you want to see how the typeface performs in the
wild, not snaps of it with some arbitrary aliasing.

It's not a bad typeface, although the kerning on the light weight needs a lot
of work. If you're wondering what I mean, look at the word 'quick'.

~~~
nnash
>I'm really curious as to why they would use images over font-face in the
style guide examples

>style guide examples

You just answered your own question

~~~
wernah
Could you elaborate as to how? Examples aren't synonymous with rasterized
images. They use font-face in the example column where they display Open Sans.

It's not a big deal but I just didn't understand your response

~~~
nnash
It's mainly because the raster images are going to be more accurate than
@font-face as they'll display properly amongst all browsers and OSes just like
a PDF would.

edit: Also the most obvious reason (which I forgot to mention) is that they
are type specimens and type specimens are (AFAIK) always done in raster
images.

------
Samuel_Michon
Hmm. Looks like FF Meta optimized for screens. Odd that Mozilla and Erik
Spiekermann felt this justified having its own name.

I made a quick side by side comparison between Fira and Meta Pro:
[http://i.imgur.com/Oo3yeYx.png](http://i.imgur.com/Oo3yeYx.png)

~~~
josephlord
Well for one thing FF Meta isn't free or Free and is probably also
trademarked.

Having an OFL (Open Font License) font of high quality is a good thing.

Also OFL licensed is Andika
([http://scripts.sil.org/andika](http://scripts.sil.org/andika)) which I'm
using in an app for children as the letters are mostly in the form that they
would be handwritten was the best I could find in a few hours searching (free
and paid) and most of the licenses for use in apps looked very expensive.

~~~
Samuel_Michon
I agree, licensing seems the most plausible reason for releasing it under a
different name.

Also, I like Andika. To me, it looks like a proportional-width interpretation
of Monaco, a monospaced font that has shipped with Macs for the last few
decades.

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monaco_(typeface)](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monaco_\(typeface\))

------
VeejayRampay
Looking forward to the next version of the typeface, Firaga.

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cypher543
I'm not a typography expert, so this looks like a hundred other fonts I've
seen. Why does every OS need its own custom font?

~~~
miloshadzic
Imagine Erik Spiekermann commenting here or on LtU how all programming
languages look the same...

~~~
fusiongyro
At my work, one of the astronomers once sent a feature request that ended with
this sentence: "I am not a software engineer, but I know enough about
programming to know that this must be easy enough to do."

~~~
miloshadzic
It may be a case of grass being greener on the other side but working with
astronomers sounds pretty cool.

I work on web stuff and get requests like that all the time.

~~~
fusiongyro
This particular user is the exception. For the most part, they're pretty
understanding of how overworked we are. They tend to be content with
workarounds and don't expect good performance. This is mostly because they all
write code themselves and their own code is pretty lousy. To them, what we do
is just a means to an end and they're not interested in appreciating the
journey, as it were.

On the other hand, this classic xkcd is occasionally accurate. You get a few
of these obnoxious ones from time to time:
[http://xkcd.com/793/](http://xkcd.com/793/)

------
stevewillows
The dot on the lower case 'i' is so high! Outside of that, it looks alright,
but still needs some work.

~~~
josephlord
I think it is as much that the capitals are a little short but the i next to
the capital F in Firefox is where it shows up.

Will be interested to see if it bothers me in real use.

------
ChikkaChiChi
I like it but I tried it on two different monitors and it looks reddish?

I'm guessing that's something to do with anti-aliasing but I haven't noticed
it before...

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thomasjonas
I'm not sure about the hinting on the font, or maybe it's the rendering in the
browser. It just doesn't seem that smooth.

~~~
bluedino
It's the serifs on the lowercase letters.

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tommmmmm
Overall I like it a lot, but I don't like that the sides of the capital M are
so slanted. It sticks out a lot in the third screenshot:
[http://mozorg.cdn.mozilla.net/media/img/styleguide/products/...](http://mozorg.cdn.mozilla.net/media/img/styleguide/products/firefoxos/typeface/example.png)

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cpeterso
The typeface's original name was Feura:
[https://twitter.com/espiekermann/status/359353798663221248](https://twitter.com/espiekermann/status/359353798663221248)

    
    
      Why change from Feura to Fira? English-speakers pronounce it as “Fjura”, not “Foyra”. And
      Fjura sounds like Führer. Not good.

------
sillysaurus2
Does anyone know how/why Helvetica wound up the most appealing font?

Publishing content with Helvetica font seems to give the content an automatic,
unconscious boost in credibility. Why is that?

It seems to be a primal reaction rather than a learned behavior. Helvetica
looks the best to me because it looks the best, not because someone else said
so.

~~~
kahirsch
There's a documentary about Helvetica that's available on Netflix (US).

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helvetica_(film)](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helvetica_\(film\))

~~~
normloman
Feel free to skip this movie. It's mostly old white dudes gushing about how
great helvetica is.

~~~
alayne
The "old white dudes" of course being many of the top type designers in the
world including Hermann Zapf who dislikes Helvetica, Spiekermann, and many
others.

~~~
normloman
Doesn't matter how famous the designers are. It's still just a typeface. And
the people in the movie are getting worked up over it.

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nwienert
Letter spacing seems wide and overall kerning seems messy, but I don't know
much about fonts.

Here's a link with some actual screenshot examples:

[http://www.mozilla.org/en-US/styleguide/products/firefox-
os/...](http://www.mozilla.org/en-US/styleguide/products/firefox-os/typeface/)

~~~
skoob
It's designed so that the different weights take approximately the same width,
so that does mean that the lighter weights have larger tracking (ie spacing
between letters) than the heavier weights.

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dsego
I love the small g. Notice the differences between normal and italics
(especially a, e, f, g, k). It's not just slanted, but curvier as well. Really
makes it stand out.

~~~
mikehotel
The italics ampersand is especially stylized.

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quarterto
Nice! I wonder if they deliberately made it close enough to FF Meta that the
Firefox wordmark is recognisable?

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nwh
Not a fan of it all, but massive congratulations for them including the
different weights properly.

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Eduard
Hm, currently no capital letters ''XYZ'' on the demo page.

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ksikka
Nice font! The demo site could use taller lines. (increase line-height)

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digitalzombie
The zero and O is similar aw. Other wise it's pretty nice.

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dutchbrit
Nice font face, just a shame that Mozilla spends time making web fonts while
their actual browser is crap at rendering them. Sa-a-aaad....

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MushCraze
I like it!

Clarity, share, curve. Bold, italicize.

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magg
is this gonna be the default font on firefox desktop and mobile?

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antonpug
Ugly as fuck. Can anyone make something that actually beats Helvetica Neue?

~~~
alayne
Adrian Frutiger's typefaces are very good. Univers and Avenir in particular
have nice neutral designs.

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caiob
Fira mono looks good.

~~~
pygy_
Indeed. I have two quibbles with it, which I've already submitted on Github:
the position of the asterisk and the shape lof the lower case r (looks like a
small caps i).

Otherwise a very good font.

~~~
mVChr
Agreed on the lowercase r. Tried replacing the Source Code Pro with Fira Mono
in Sublime and this immediately stuck out as annoying to me.

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gprasanth
Obligatory link to xkcd - [http://xkcd.com/927/](http://xkcd.com/927/)

~~~
quarterto
A font isn't a standard, it's an identity. "Oh, they're using a non-primary
colour? I'll stick to RBY, _thanks_."

