
4-Day Fast - jmbake
http://48things.com/2017/02/09/four-day-fast.html
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jimmies
The whole amino-acids thing that the author talked about made me cringe a
little bit. "Amino-acids" is just basically the fancy word for "proteins" (I
know there are amino-acids that aren't proteins, but let's not be nitpicking
here) and in turns, "proteins" is just another fancy word for "shit we eat
everyday." It doesn't matter that much what form it is (meat, plants, milk,
powder), when digested in your body, it's proteins. Proteins give your body
energy. Proteins are not some magical alternative shit to your food, it's
actually food.

"Oh I don't eat, but I '''take in''' amino-acids" is like saying "Oh I don't
drink, but '''take in''' dihydrogen monoxide."

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zacharyz
Yep - in the intermittent fasting community, BCAAs (which the author was
probably taking) are known to kick you out of the fasting state.

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MikkoFinell
Literally anything except water does that.

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empath75
> Steve Jobs was a regular faster.

He also died of cancer at a fairly young age after trying to treat it with
diet instead of medical treatment. Probably not the best health role model.

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ams6110
To be fair, pancreatic cancer doesn't offer much hope even with treatment.

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influx
Steve had the only form that was treatable and didn't treat it until it was
too late.

"In spite of pleas from family and friends, he tried to cure himself through
acupuncture sessions, drinking special fruit juices, visiting "spiritualists"
and using other treatments he found on the internet.

Some cancer experts have said that Mr Jobs may have extended his life or even
survived if he had promptly tackled his cancer aggressively with
scientifically proven medical treatments."

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rexpop
I fast for three days before I travel. I've done so since reading[0] that it
might strengthen the immune response, and I loathe illness while traveling.

Frankly, I am just happy to see HN talking about diet and health. My my
inclination is to believe any medication or therapy must either overcome my
diet or support it. I can think of nothing with a bigger impact on our
physiochemistry.

0\. [https://news.usc.edu/63669/fasting-triggers-stem-cell-
regene...](https://news.usc.edu/63669/fasting-triggers-stem-cell-regeneration-
of-damaged-old-immune-system/)

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rsync
Can we contrast fasting like the op is describing (with coconut milk, protein
supplements and bone broth) vs. fasting with _literally zero_ calories ?

If you're pursuing "weight loss" or fat loss or general
fitness/wellness/lightness, I think any form of fasting is useful and
interesting.

However, it seems to me that if you are optimizing for starving cancer cells,
forcing weak cells into apoptosis, depleting your sugar stores, resetting
insulin resistance, etc. ... that is to say, if you're pursuing the more
interesting, second order benefits of fasting - you really should be doing the
zero calorie kind.

I do a 24 hour fast once weekly with just (black) coffee and water ... I guess
I cannot speak to how difficult zero calories would be for 2-4 days ...

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MikkoFinell
Consuming anything else than water will actually break the fast. Yes that
includes black coffee.

People who "fast" while consuming coffee, broth, exogenous ketones, and other
caloric substances still experience the benefits from caloric restriction.
Still not actually fasting though.

~~~
rsync
"People who "fast" while consuming coffee, broth, exogenous ketones, and other
caloric substances still experience the benefits from caloric restriction.
Still not actually fasting though."

If the coffee is black it has zero calories and is identical (in terms of
caloric restriction) to tea or water ... so I don't think it belongs in the
same group as broth ...

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Silhouette
_Well, I lost 6.7 pounds and 1.9% body fat during my 4-day fast._

How much of that went back on again shortly afterwards, though? I have
sometimes lost several pounds very quickly as a result of dehydration, but
this is generally not healthy and the loss is temporary. I've sometimes been
sick and not had much of an appetite, resulting in staying in bed for several
days and hardly eating anything. Again, I lost several pounds, but even with a
modest and very healthy food intake for the next few days, much of the weight
then went back on again as my body recovered.

~~~
pdimitar
That is the really important question here. I wish the author would answer
you.

I believe fasting has long-term health benefits but I am not at all sure it
can actually help with regular weight loss and general health re-balancing.

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themodelplumber
I enjoy reading stories about people fasting. Someday I may try it myself, but
I know I tend toward a sort of sensory disconnect, so I'm biased toward such
hyperbolic stuff. I wish I could be more like some of my friends who are more
balanced in their routine; fasting is foreign to them, but they are naturally
fit and kind of Zen in their own way. They can just do "normal" very well and
no experiments seem necessary.

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partycoder
Well, anatomically modern humans evolved around discontinuous food
availability, so fasting may play a more important role than we think in our
metabolism.

For example insulin and the growth hormones interact, and being well fed can
have counter-intuitive consequences.

e.g: Overfeeding kids might be counterproductive for their growth.

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pizza
It's the exogenous ketones bit that I'm interested in. Dr Richard Veech has
had some interesting publications out on dextro-betahydroxybutyrate [0]. In
short, d-bhb is like an entirely separate macronutrient (not
fat/carb/protein/alcohol) that is readily metabolizable and has higher
thermodynamic efficiency- this translates to lower-metabolic damage post brain
trauma, much better underwater breath holding times, something like a couple %
power output increase for athletes, etc.

Thing is, the d-bhb production process is really expensive, and it's also
pretty unpalatable (and needs to be eaten en masse).

[0] [http://drveech.com/](http://drveech.com/)

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scottlocklin
Fasting is definitely underappreciated. As are cold showers and deep breathing
a la Wim Hof.

~~~
naasking
Hot baths are also good for your body. Any activity where your body has to
work hard to establish homeostasis is a form of exercise.

~~~
pizza
Like.. almost dying? ;)

~~~
sergiotapia
Ah, the Saiyan way.

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kyriakos
Anecdotal but I noticed that when I travel abroad for over a week I always
lose some weight (enough to be considered weight loss and stay for a while).
Even if I feel like I make unhealthier choices during my trip. Is it possible
that a change of diet habits has the similar effects and essentially all we
need is constantly changing routine?

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aidenn0
I definitely sleep poorly on days when I fast. Often I wake up 2-3 hours
earlier than usual and am wide awake.

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foota
Do you feel tired that day?

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aidenn0
Yes, I feel about the same as if I had gone to bed late the night before.

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omar3550
Hey Guy! Just read your post. Can you tell me whether Ketones/amino acid
supplements are supposed to prevent you from your muscles breaking down? I am
losing crazy muscle (lost like 20+ pounds in 4 months) and would love a
solution to prevent it from happening.

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uoaei
See a doctor. This isn't normal.

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dsp1234
_There are two main sources of fuel for the human body: ketones (derived from
fat) and glucose (derived from carbohydrates)._

Ketones aren't a fuel, they are byproduct of burning fatty acids.

As an analogy, Ketones aren't wood (fuel), they are ashes (byproduct).

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philip1209
beta-hydroxybutarate, a ketone, is the primary energy source while in a fasted
state, and is analogous to glucose in use by organs. It directly provides
energy to the brain and the heart.

Source: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beta-
Hydroxybutyric_acid](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beta-Hydroxybutyric_acid)

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rpwverheij
If you want the fast to have a detoxing effect, skip the 2 - 4 cups of coffee
per day

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enraged_camel
There is no such thing as a "detox". It's a myth.

[http://www.webmd.com/diet/a-z/detox-
diets](http://www.webmd.com/diet/a-z/detox-diets)

[https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2014/dec/05/detox-m...](https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2014/dec/05/detox-
myth-health-diet-science-ignorance)

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nickgrosvenor
Breaking a 4 day fast with a starbucks sandwich is so 2017...

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helloindia
->"The biggest thing that this fast has taught me is just how much I eat out of habit or boredom instead of actual hunger." . For some people(like me) it takes only a bit of education and careful diet plan to realise this. For the author it took a 4-day fasting.

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soared
Kind of odd how the author reads into his sugar free gum and and ketosis so
deeply but didn't say anything about missing two regular workouts and losing
so much weight.

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Terribledactyl
The weight loss is completely normal and expected. A lot of the weight came
from water bound up in the starch reserves, it'll come right back after eating
carbs for a few days. Similar weight "loss" would be seen transitioning into a
diet with <100g carbs per day but with normal, or even excessive caloric
intake.

