
AlphaGo Teach – Find new and creative ways of playing Go - Jach
https://alphagoteach.deepmind.com/
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hibikir
Many comments seem to miss the real significance of this.

This is not a joseki dictionary, and it doesn't play 50+ moves for you. This
is AlphaGo Master's explanation of how it sees the opening. Humans have a very
good understanding of endgames, and we might understand opening in a single
corner, but when it comes to whole board knowledge, we are way worse than
AlphaGo is.

As it happens, AlphaGo disagrees with human play a whole lot, just in this
subset. There's well known fuseki strategies played by professionals that
AlphaGo thinks are downright terrible, and it shows lines of how it would play
against them.

Sure, it'd be nice to have even more moves and alternatives, but this is
really nice, as it helps us in the parts of the game where we are the weakest.

Compare this to what Alpha Zero is teaching us about chess: It has interesting
opinions regarding a few openings (Goodbye French Defense) but ultimately it's
saying that our opening knowledge is very sound, but that it will not just
crush humans, but traditional chess programs in the middle game.

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smallnamespace
When an AI is demonstrably so far beyond human ability that to even comprehend
it requires the AI to help explain itself, you start to take Singularity
futurists a bit more seriously.

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romaniv
This doesn't make sense. Computers do stuff that people don't "comprehend" all
the time. In fact, in the past, one of the fundamental appeals and drives
behind AI was to make systems that could explain themselves, not requiring
complex analysis and experiments to understand what's going on. (And vice
vera, systems that could understand humans without programming.)

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smallnamespace
> make systems that could explain themselves

Yes, but currently the systems we are building have no sense of will or
agency.

If we succeed in building systems that _do_ have more complex objectives, then
how can we be sure that the human and machine's objectives are aligned? How
can you be sure the system is explaining itself to you in an honest way?

Note that there were two different goals in building computers and software:
1) building things that have full control over and 2) building things that are
more and more clever and useful.

In the limit, those two goals can come into sharp conflict.

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natosaichek
Is there a way to do anything other than just run through this single opening
set of moves? Not a lot of exploration here, or ability to 'find new and
creative ways of playing go' Or am I missing something?

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ggggtez
There are lots of branches. If you don't understand go strategy then you're
not going to get much out of this

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natosaichek
I've played thousands of games of go. I understand go strategy. I don't
understand the interface.

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syntaxing
I got super excited for a second...I thought this was Google releasing a
working "virtual teacher" where it teaches different strategies of Go and
allows you to play against it with different level of difficulty.

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partycoder
I think it is comparable in function to Kogo's Joseki Dictionary, curated by
Alexander Dinerchtein (3p). e.g: [http://eidogo.com/](http://eidogo.com/)

Just that it covers the entire fuseki rather than just a corner.

As you get deeper into a branch it doesn't provide many variations, nor it
explains why a variation is better than another. Joseki dictionaries sometimes
will tell you one move is a mistake and show you how to punish it.

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deegles
I don't play Go at all, but I would love to learn from a self-adjusting
AlphaGo tuned to win (say) %50 of the time. I feel like a whole new generation
of players could be born from a "from scratch" approach.

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OiNG
I missed the part where it said the win percentages are relative to black
winning (as opposed the the currently playing side), and thought alphago was
saying the best response to black opening with both 4-4 and 4-3 was tengen...

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dmoy
Oh this is cool, is it basically giving you a view of what alphago thinks the
win % is for a given board state while you're playing? With undo that's
awesome.

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make3
no, it's a very small precomputed tree of moves. you can only click on an
increasingly small subset of tiles after each move

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dmoy
Damn :( Thanks for clarifying though

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ddebernardy
It would be sweet to play a whole game against AlphaGo at some point. Is
anyone aware of when we'll be able to do that?

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aloisamae
There's a project called Leela Zero on Guthub which appears to be Alpha Zero
without it's neural network weights. I doubt it'll get the proper weights any
time soon though.

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soVeryTired
Surprising that it thinks the winrate for black is so low. I wonder what it
would think of a komi of 5.5 instead of 6.5?

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moomin
Is it just me, or does the board go asymmetric way too fast?

This may be a UI issue...

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jonbarker
Clicking on the circles seems to do nothing in Google Chrome.

