
The Origin of Banking (2016) - dedalus
http://jonathanstray.com/the-origin-of-banking
======
throw0101a
See also the history of debt:

> _A major argument of the book is that the imprecise, informal, community-
> building indebtedness of "human economies" is only replaced by
> mathematically precise, firmly enforced debts through the introduction of
> violence, usually state-sponsored violence in some form of military or
> police._

> _A second major argument of the book is that, contrary to standard accounts
> of the history of money, debt is probably the oldest means of trade, with
> cash and barter transactions being later developments._

* [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Debt:_The_First_5000_Years](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Debt:_The_First_5000_Years)

~~~
rootw0rm
As an anarchist, I feel this is necessary here:

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-
aggression_principle](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-aggression_principle)

~~~
littlestymaar
For the record:
[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarchism](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarchism)

The NAP comes from libertarianism, which is as far as you can get from
anarchism.

Anarchism means free cooperation between people with no transcendental rule
apart "everyone is equal", while libertarianism (and the NAP) means "private
property is paramount".

Anarchism was born in the 19s century as a part of the socialist movement,
while libertarianism is an alt-right movement which grew in the US during the
cold war, as a reaction to socialism.

~~~
lisper
Both anarchism and libertarianism have one thing in common though: both are
adolescent utopian fantasies, completely unworkable in the real world because
they are not evolutionarily stable strategies.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolutionarily_stable_strategy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolutionarily_stable_strategy)

~~~
WaxProlix
What is and is not an evolutionarily stable strategy will always be defined by
the environment in which populations exist. A change in environment will
disrupt any equilibrium. Capitalism as it exists now, for instance, might seem
to be an ESS, but a change in conditions could change that. Similarly, on a
long enough timeline, the vast, vast majority of strategies (so far) have
proven non-viable. Doesn't mean they don't work for some groups, or for a
time.

(I suspect your downvotes are from mudslinging with 'adolescent' and
'utopian', which sort of clash with/give the lie to your air of dispassionate
analysis)

~~~
lisper
I didn't intend for it to be dispassionate. The NAP doesn't work because it
would require a suspension of the laws of physics. If you are unwilling to
engage in violence _on principle_ then your resources will get taken from you
by someone or some thing who is less willing to be bound by principle. It's
really that simple. Anarchists and libertarians who subscribe to the NAP are
no different from the adherents/victims of Ramtha's School of Enlightenment
who think they can use quantum mechanics to cause objects to materialize with
the power of their minds. I think the adjectives "adolescent" and "utopian"
are quite apt in both cases. (And it doesn't surprise me a bit that I'm
getting downvoted. Adolescent utopians and cult leaders rarely react well to
being called out. But I care about the truth more than I care about HN karma.)

------
eigenvalue
Link rot for academic sources is ridiculous. Several of the links to academic
paper PDFs are broken. There really should be a better way of dealing with
this. I guess university IT departments remove user accounts when a professor
or researcher leaves the school, and that results in deletion of all files on
their personal academic sites. Would be nice if there was an accepted,
standard way of "rolling over" these files to the next school where the person
ends up.

~~~
throw0101a
I think that's why DOIs were created:

* [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_object_identifier](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_object_identifier)

Also: archive.org

~~~
Breza
DOIs and complete citations go a long way toward addressing this problem.

------
vbsteven
If you are interested in this type of stuff The Baroque Cycle by Neal
Stephenson is an entertaining read that touches some of these topics circa
1650-1720 in Europe. More specifically the switch from bills of exchange to
the foundation of some central banks on which currencies are based.

~~~
dredmorbius
TBC got me started on an exploration of the history and ideas of money -- also
touched on in _Cryptonomicon_ \-- but it's only just a start. Though an
entertaining one.

------
gumby
Don’t forget that every debt (and I like the small one of the news agent)
expands the money supply; you reduce it every time you pay your cc bill or
cash that check.

------
unixhero
I remember this cartoon video as well. I found it instructive:
[https://youtu.be/mII9NZ8MMVM](https://youtu.be/mII9NZ8MMVM)

~~~
snarfy
Here is another that is pretty good:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3HdmA3vPbSU](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3HdmA3vPbSU)

------
Thieum22
See also The Ascent of Money by Niall Ferguson - it gives a good overview of
the history of banking and related subjects: [https://www.amazon.com/Ascent-
Money-Financial-History-World-...](https://www.amazon.com/Ascent-Money-
Financial-History-World-dp-B002XVDFOW/dp/B002XVDFOW/)

------
sus_007
The source is already dead.

[https://web.archive.org/web/20190703012118/https://jonathans...](https://web.archive.org/web/20190703012118/https://jonathanstray.com/the-
origin-of-banking)

