
Amazon Key is a new service that lets couriers unlock your front door - stevekemp
https://www.theverge.com/2017/10/25/16538834/amazon-key-in-home-delivery-unlock-door-prime-cloud-cam-smart-lock
======
hypersoar
My parents installed a lockbox on their porch for packages. They include the
combination to unlock it in the delivery address, which works most of the
time. It's secure enough for the task and obscures whether or not a package is
sitting out indicating you're not home. Plus, if it falls, the failure is
contained. You could even get all cloudy-wowdy about it, if you want. Have the
delivery folk use NFC, or some such, to get in. I find the "include the code
in the address" solution pretty elegant, though. This seems to me like a
better solution for their suburban single-family house.

...in fact, it's _so much_ a better solution that I can't imagine Amazon
hadn't considered it. They could easily sell Amazon Qubbies with the same
pitch they're making here. I can only conclude that the real goal is to get
you to install those cameras.

Side-anecdote/thought: I used to live in a mixed-use building with 20 units,
or so. One of the businesses downstairs was a DVD rental place (this was only
a couple years ago; they're still there!), and they volunteered to accept
packages for the upstairs residents. Little informal services like that can
add up to something that can't be replicated by all the technology in the
world, and I worry a bit about the consequences of seeking to obsolesce them.

~~~
elsewhen
> I can only conclude that the real goal is to get you to install those
> cameras

I suspect that the ultimate goal is to grant home access to their home-
services pros (ie home cleaners) while you are away.

~~~
mseebach
Why can't the real goal be the stated one? It's already very beneficial to
Amazon, serving to further build a moat around Amazon being where you buy
everything.

This constant lazy conspiracy theorizing every time a large company does
anything is really grating.

~~~
dplgk
But it's also a worthwhile exercise. Should we just always take them at their
word? History has proven we shouldn't.

------
staticelf
> All this raises a big question, however: will Prime customers trust Amazon
> to monitor their homes around the clock, and to know when it’s okay to
> unlock their doors for a stranger? And will the benefit of having your
> packages delivered quickly and securely outweigh any concerns about privacy
> and security customers might have?

Probably, but I wouldn't. The idea of giving a company full access to your
locks is a bit wtf in my books.

~~~
afarrell
Question for those more familiar with 4th amendment jurisprudence than I am:
if you give a group of strangers access to your home, does that remove your
expectation of privacy in that area? If so, does that make evidence against
you gathered through warrantless searches of that area admissable in court? Or
would it only expose you to evidence in plain view/hear/smell?

My intuition is that granting consent for some action to one group of
strangers does not grant consent to a different group of strangers, but I am
not a lawyer.

~~~
eqmvii
You only consent to allow delivery people into your home, not the police. The
4th amendment doesn't have a trickery loophole, your reasonable expectation of
privacy is always with respect to the police, not to other businesses and
people you give trust to. The police can't set up a fake carwash and then
warrantlessly search all of the cars that show up just because you're handing
over the keys and consenting to let strangers in. Your home would be no
different.

Another, perhaps better example: a landlord typically has a set of keys and
the right to access a tenant's apartment. In a commercial building, those keys
could be held by any number of "strangers" on the maintenance staff. The
police still need a warrant, they can't just ask the landlord for a set of
keys. That's really not any different from having the "keys" held by Amazon
staff members.

There are lots of instances where a person's expectation of privacy is low
with respect to specific people/businesses but high with respect to the
government, and that doesn't weaken their 4th amendment protections.

~~~
patentatt
For all those reading this, remember that you should never rely on Internet
forums for legal advice, the poster above may or may not be a lawyer, but is
certainly not your lawyer.

~~~
EADGBE
"The choice of a lawyer is an important decision and should not be based
solely upon advertisements."

------
rdl
If I had a house set up with a single room (foyer, mud room, etc.) with an
external door openable with this, and an interior door openable only by me,
I'd love to have the ability for Amazon to drop packages there. Keep the room
on video, make sure the front door has logging, and it'd be pretty reasonable
overall.

~~~
bradbatt
That's a solid idea. Will be interesting to see if things like this change how
new homes are designed.

~~~
davidkuhta
For a second I thought you were commenting under /u/jurassic and envisioned an
uber-altruistic future where homes are built to include an entryway for the
homeless to escape winter cold.

~~~
simias
I find it amusing that you consider that an "uber-altruistic" future would
mean having homeless people sleep on the floor of a small empty entryway. I
think there's probably a better and more efficient way to solve that problem.

~~~
davidkuhta
I wasn't meaning that the open entryways were a solution for homelessness,
only that a society which was accepting of a design element incorporated into
their homes which was intentionally for utilization by and to the benefit of a
stranger could reasonably be described as 'uber-altruistic'.

------
brndnmtthws
Give Amazon a key to my home? Hmm. They want to listen to me inside my home,
watch me with a camera, and also be able to unlock my front door?

"It's safe, you can trust us! We'll never spy on you!" \-- Jeff Bezos

~~~
kawsper
Pardon my ignorance, but how is Amazon watching customers with a camera?

~~~
24gttghh
Well, they could conceivably watch as you enter/exit your home, but if you
have Alexa already then I would think they could infer from silence or lack-
thereof whether the home is occupied.

~~~
dbbk
Alexa doesn't open any connection to Amazon servers until you say the hotword
'Alexa'.

~~~
24gttghh
One could still infer from a lack of 'Alexa' hotword prompts over a span of
time whether the home was occupied I reckon.

~~~
twothamendment
That kinda logic doesn't work. Just because someone doesn't use Alexa for
hours doesn't mean they aren't home. It happens every night.

~~~
24gttghh
I will elaborate further: inspect usage trends of Alexa to determine
anomalies, i.e. times of no usage in the day when the owner isn't home.

------
dvcrn
Is delivering packages really that hard in the states?

Where I live almost every apartment has post boxes in the entrance area.
Amazon drops the package in there and when I come home all I have to do is
touch my key on the machine and it spits out my package. More advanced
machines even send you emails when something got delivered.

~~~
Rainymood
What I think the most silly thing I keep seeing in America is packages being
"delivered" (read: left) on your front porch or doorstep ... like, why?
Someone now can just grab it!? If someone is not home, what happens here
(Netherlands) that the package gets delivered by the neighbours and you get a
little note it was delivered to the neighbours. Neighbours aren't home? Try
the next one until the delivery guy gives up or doesn't care anymore and
delivers it the next day.

~~~
bradstewart
Probably 90% of my packages are delivered while I'm at work. My neighbors work
as well (as the least those I know--the handful of houses on either side of
me).

I prefer to have a few packages a year go missing (which Amazon will always
replace) than always end up having to pick things up from the post office.

My normal USPS delivery person is kind enough to deliver packages to my back
door which helps. AMZL/UPS/FedEx aren't so accommodating though.

~~~
bad_good_guy
You could try getting your packages delivered to work?

~~~
acranox
I'm sure that's been thought of. People who walk, take transit, or bike to
work probably don't want the hassle of lugging a package home if it's anything
larger than would fit in your backpack. Having stuff delivered to your home is
a convenience. Hauling stuff home from work subtracts from that convenience.
If I walk around my neighborhood in the late afternoon I see little Amazon
packages on everyone's porches. No one seems to be stealing them. I can see
people who will want this Amazon Key thing, but I can see a lot of people for
whom this addresses a non-existent problem.

------
24gttghh
>The courier then gets a prompt on their app, swipes the screen, and voilà,
your door unlocks. They drop off the package, relock the door with another
swipe, and are on their way.

Yah, except when they forget to re-lock your door. No thanks. If anything the
door should auto-lock after the door is initially opened, but I still would
not allow a delivery person access to my home. I'm sure most delivery persons
are fine but I have not heard good things about the "courier services" Amazon
has been using lately.

~~~
craftyguy
> If anything the door should auto-lock after the door is initially opened

No. If anything, people will hopefully realize this is probably the worst
possible idea for privacy and security they could possibly do in their homes
and tell amazon to piss off.

~~~
24gttghh
I'm not sure if you're disagreeing with me, but I agree that this is a
terrible idea from amazon.

~~~
craftyguy
I was disagreeing with your one comment that implied this would be OK if they
auto-relocked, by arguing that none of this is OK at all. I generally agreed
with the rest of your comment though

~~~
24gttghh
The fact they don't even auto-lock is just one of many things wrong with this
idea; is what I was trying to say I suppose :)

------
wilwade
Let's think about this for a minute. (ignoring if the tech works)

1\. For people without a security system, there are many simple ways to get
into a house. If you are worried about people getting into your house, you
might not want this, but you better also already have a nice security system
(that is also not on a botnet).

2\. At least for us, we generally recognize our UPS & USPS folk that deliver
to our house.

3\. This has a log and video of the drop off.

4\. Who do you trust more? The people delivering your package or the random
person driving around the neighborhood looking for packages that would imply
you are not at home? (or just grabbing your package)

All that said, usually someone is at home when we get deliveries so I wouldn't
buy it (also don't use Amazon much). But I don't see the reason for the
backlash.

~~~
jgrahamc
_2\. At least for us, we generally recognize our UPS & USPS folk that deliver
to our house._

I would not recognize the Amazon subcontractors that visit my house/office.
They are optimizing for least cost.

~~~
zimpenfish
Article specifically says this is restricted to Amazon Logistics delivery. No
subcontractors.

~~~
zippergz
I regularly get deliveries from Amazon Logistics. It’s always a random person
in their own car, no uniform. Indistinguishable from an Uber or Postmates
driver.

------
losteverything
There are a few on my route that would embrace this. They are Amazon addicts.
Over 550 parcel deliveries a year. Trust has been won by Amazon.

~~~
TrueGeek
We get tons of Amazon boxes plus a 30 lbs bag of dog food every Wednesdays
from Chewy.com.

I've always felt bad for our UPS driver. He's a nice guy, very carefull with
the boxes and almost always wraps them in plastic if it's going to rain. What
should we get him for Christmas?

~~~
losteverything
A. Cash B. Cash C. Cash

No dunkin, please. No bottles of wine, please. No home made cookies, please.
No gift cards, please.

Cash is best and greatly appreciated.

Look at it this way... If everyone gives cash it is a nice stash. (only 43%
tip me and i bust my butt)

Having 10 $5-15 dunkin cards (the most i had one year was $135 Dunkin. And i
don't even like dunkin!) cant buy your spouse a nice christmas gift

How much? My range is $5-$400. $35 is a sound number

~~~
bad_good_guy
I'm sorry, but I'm not sure if I understand.

You are complaining that _only_ 43% of the people you deliver to tip you?

Why does a delivery person get tips? We are already paying for delivery...

~~~
iak8god
I wouldn't even know how to go about tipping my delivery person(s). I started
home delivery of a newspaper last fall and the service got pretty bad right
after the holidays (the paper is now consistently halfway down the lawn rather
than on the covered front porch, where it was ending up consistently before
Dec 2016). I'd be happy to tip, but the billing and payment is all handled
online, and this is a person I've literally never laid eyes on. Parcel
delivery suffers from the same problem. I'm a heavy user of Amazon, but never
present when UPS comes.

~~~
losteverything
Here is what many do.

Week or 2 before Christmas tape a card/envelope to your door. One marked "UPS"
and the other "USPS"

(my town USPS delivers most Amazon like dog food and UPS delivers heavier
Amazon packages)

~~~
659087
Sounds like a great way to "tip" people who are neither UPS or USPS.

------
gnicholas
So how would this work if you have an alarm system? The door would unlock,
they'd come in, but unless they're also given the alarm code then it would end
up going off.

This seems like a pretty big stumbling block, because asking people to give
out an alarm code means that anyone who ever delivers to your place can get
into your house later (unless you change the delivery code every week or
something, which would be an ongoing hassle).

~~~
ahjushi
From my understanding a delivery person cannot get into your house at any time
--you are not giving them any code to your door. They are scanning a barcode
on your package via the camera, and that will be their "key". No package, no
key. Good consideration about the alarm code, though even with it they
couldn't get in unless they have a verified delivery.

~~~
gnicholas
Yeah, they're not allowed to get into your house at any time...but if they
remember the code and then come back later they can disarm your alarm system
after breaking in. Maybe you get an alert or a call from your alarm company,
but if they can disable the loud ringing then they can make off with a bunch
of stuff before anyone shows up (and without the neighbors thinking anything
is awry, since they wouldn't hear anything abnormal).

edit: I'm curious to know whether the people downvoting this comment have an
alarm system and are happy to give out their alarm code, or if they're people
who do not have alarm system and just think that, at a glance, this seems
paranoid. I have an alarm system and have never given out the code to anyone.
We've thought about giving it to some people whom we trust, but after we
thought about it decided against.

------
kleff
For packages wouldn't selling a mailbox with this smart lock system make much
more sense than full access to the entire house?

~~~
toabi
DHL in Germany offers sth. like that:
[https://www.dhl.de/de/privatkunden/pakete-
empfangen/pakete-z...](https://www.dhl.de/de/privatkunden/pakete-
empfangen/pakete-zuhause-empfangen/paketkasten.html) \- without the smarts.

~~~
chrisper
Amazon has lockerboxes too.

~~~
toabi
Which you can put in front of your house? In Germany "Amazon Locker" just lets
you deliver to post stations where you then can fetch it.

~~~
chrisper
My bad. From the URL I thought it was about Packstation. That's what Amazon
Lockers are.

But in the US there are apartments that have something like a "Packstation"
for residents only.

------
dalbasal
I've called things a silly idea before and been wrong, so who knows.

That caveat in place, this might be a time to start from the bottom of the
idea tree and try some of the more obvious limbs. If the problem this solves
is absent deliveries, don't we just need bigger mailboxes or maybe even smart
mailboxes?

Maybe they're thinking about this differently. Maybe it's about building
trust, or just getting amazon smartstuff into homes for some other underpants
plan. At face value, a cloud connected lock seems excessive.

~~~
redm
I had similar thoughts. Has Amazon posted any statistics on package theft when
packages are left at the front door? I'm wondering if Amazon is acting of
perceived fears to strengthen it's foothold in the home or trying to reduce
losses by subsidizing a somewhat complex solution?

~~~
brianmartinek
With one of my recent Amazon deliveries, a picture was taken of the package
sitting in front of my mailbox. It was accessible through the Amazon app when
I received the delivery notification. It's an apartment building, so it was
nice to know where it was left since the location of packages delivered seems
to vary based on which company delivers it.

My very first thought when I saw it was this was a solution to prove that a
delivery took place in cases of package theft.

------
moocowtruck
I see one big issue with this...sure mr amazon man can open my door but...
what he going to do about my 160lbs st bernard an rottweiler who don't
understand he's the amazon man :P) my rottweiler is the most obedient dog i've
ever had, but he is also a security guard master.. and i don't know how to
convey to him since he already doesn't appreciate the mail person, that amazon
person is ok.

~~~
csours
I would flip that on you: What kind of liability would you incur if you signed
up for this service, knowing you have a protective dog?

~~~
walshemj
In the UK dog bites are the most common cause off time of sick for posties

------
jeddawson
It'll be interesting how this works at homes with pets. I could see that being
a major concern for a household that would otherwise be fine with an in home
delivery. Will Amazon have couriers that are diligent enough to ensure an
escaped cat is returned?

~~~
johnernaut
It's also worrying for households that have animals that are not particularly
friendly toward strangers. Would the delivery person be able to press charges
should a home owners dog bite them?

~~~
criddell
Yes, you are responsible if your dog bites somebody. They might not press
charges, but they would likely sue you (or Amazon's insurance company would
directly or through a subrogation company).

~~~
mholmes680
You should probably talk to your own home insurance company as well. Owning
certain breeds raise your premiums already (at least ours does), and enabling
strangers into your insured property to now potentially interact with those
breeds probably needs coverage.

------
gotchange
> When a courier arrives with a package for in-home delivery, they scan the
> barcode, sending a request to Amazon’s cloud. If everything checks out, the
> cloud grants permission by sending a message back to the camera, which
> starts recording. The courier then gets a prompt on their app, swipes the
> screen, and voilà, your door unlocks. They drop off the package, relock the
> door with another swipe, and are on their way. The customer will get a
> notification that their delivery has arrived, along with a short video
> showing the drop-off to confirm everything was done properly.

So, you only need a valid smart card, a working Amazon courier app and a
balaclava to gain an unencumbered access to any of these homes?

~~~
eli
Um, sure, or just break a window

~~~
fenwick67
I always bring this up too. However, when somebody breaks a window, you know
what happened. When somebody just randomly unlocks your front door while
you're out, it's not apparent.

~~~
eli
My threat model is getting robbed. I expect I will know if this happens
regardless of mode of entry.

------
neuigkeiten
It will be very interesting to see if this gets traction.

I would never ever give a company access to my home. But maybe the next
generation will not have a sense of privacy at all. But rather accept that
mankind kind of grows together into one huge brain.

From my perspective, I wonder: Are there not enough places where Amazon can
drop off packages? In my street, all kinds of shops will accept parcels for
you.

Are new houses these days built with "drop off" areas that can be opened with
an access code?

------
cpcallen
On the one hand, I can definitely understand all the "nope" in this thread.

On the other hand, I wonder why the camera is a required part of this system.

~~~
michaelt
Two reasons:

1\. To avoid the Amazon driver getting the blame for things done by your
kids/partner/dog/whatever.

2\. To keep the drivers honest.

~~~
zimpenfish
3\. To keep the customers honest

------
jarym
So say I live in Germany and Amazon gets served a warrant in the US to
facilitate in remotely unlocking my door. Amazon could theoretically unlock my
front door from their HQ in the US.

What are the legal ramifications of this? We're not talking about access to
data anymore, but potentially access to physical locations that would
otherwise be outside of direct US jurisdiction.

~~~
dubcanada
I don't mean to sound rude, but doors are not exactly hard to get through.
They are rather easy, chances are if they get a warrant it doesn't matter that
Amazon can open your door, so can the police. And wasting time calling Amazon
rather then just smashing your door down (or knocking) seems like a bit much.

~~~
jarym
Not rude but there’s a difference between forcing your way through a door and
having a door unlocked for you (and via a legal means outside of the physical
jurisdiction of the door).

It shouldn’t matter how ‘tough’ the door lock is either way. 4 digit ATM codes
are easy to break too - we still expect them to provide a level of protection

------
kpwags
I'm sorry, but I don't really feel comfortable letting Amazon into my home.

To be fair, I feel the same about UPS, FedEx, USPS, etc.

~~~
danielsamuels
There's actually a super simple solution for your concerns - don't choose the
"in-home delivery" option.

------
quotha
A vampire cannot just enter your home -- you have to invite him in!

------
floatingatoll
I was confused that the article fails to mention that UPS, at least, expressly
prohibits drivers from crossing the threshold unless you’re taking a package
from them with outstretched arms. They can’t even “set it down inside”,
kindness or not - doing so is a violation. Or used to be when it last came up
for me, anyways.

------
youdontknowtho
I'm going to watch the thread over time, but given other threads I've read on
HN, I would have expected far, far, more privacy maximalists. Compare this
against one of the popular "love to hate" subjects like telemetry gathering or
surveillance. (Yes, I get how some people see them as the same thing.)

------
synicalx
How do we abbreviate this? Door unlocking as a service, DUaaS?

Seriously though, this leads to so many questions.

\- Why would anyone give a COMPANY access to their house? And why are people
ok with random strangers roaming around their house, amongst all their
valuables?

\- What happens when the inevitably unpatched/out-of-support IoT lock gets
jacked? Will people be forced to buy another $250 lock/camera set every year
or two so they can keep receiving updates?

\- Is theft/break-in insurance even valid if you've given someone else the
proverbial keys to your house?

\- What's your recourse if the delivery driver, or the dog walker swipes your
Rolex?

I will never wrap my head around why people are so eager to spend lots of
money to erode what little privacy they have left, in exchange for very very
little.

~~~
TheSpiceIsLife
I believe people buy all sorts of gadgets just because they are things they
don't already own, or they do already have one similar but then find a new one
that has slightly better styling / matches their decor better / has a new
feature, or someone they know has a better one so now they have to have the
best too.

And that is about as much thought that goes in to it.

~~~
synicalx
Sadly, that matches my experience as well. Everything is built with a
lifecycle that is closely related to the release date of the next model.

------
jo909
Even without privacy concerns etc, I could not use that. The only door lock
that I can change is the one to my apartment, but there is another locked door
at the street entrance.

I would not want to subject my neighbors to couriers asking to be buzzed in
all the time.

------
kmano8
At a past apartment in the city, I gave a key to the front mud-room area to my
UPS guy. It was the best thing ever.

That said, Amazon subcontractors routinely leave packages on my front stoop in
the city in spite of the sign I have the asks for packages to be dropped over
the side fence. A number have been taken -- and I wouldn't say it's not their
fault packages get stolen in cities, but it's common sense leaving something
on a stoop probably isn't a great idea.

UPS/Fedex seem to always drop over my fence.

No way I'd trust amazon to execute this well in the first few years.

------
sashk
When Amazon deliveries are always left under sign "Don't leave your package
here, leave it few feet away", I will trust some random dude to open my front
door in order to deliver my package.

------
calvinbhai
Great concept.

I have used a few smart locks (until last year), and I must say the experience
has not been anything close to good or amazing. Batteries are drained almost
all the time, the lock can sometimes refuse to work.

For Amazon's Key service to work well, they need to have the locks work very
reliably. The lock may be the Key's weakest link (not in terms of security,
but in terms of reliability).

~~~
alistairSH
Interesting. What brand lock were you using? My father's beach house has Yale
z-wave locks and they have been reliable enough.

~~~
calvinbhai
Nice. mine were initial versions of Lockitron. And then an August(didn't have
much patience to test it, so returned it). Haven't tried Yale Z-wave (is it
standalone? or is it bundled with a security service?). I'll give it a try
when I move next time.

~~~
alistairSH
Ah, yeah, I was skeptical of the upstart brands.

Yale and Schlage seem to be reliable (Dad has used both, his rental agency
prefers the Yale on all homes for consistency).

Z-wave and Zigbee are two of the common home automation protocols. So, you'd
use those locks (or other devices) in conjunction with an automation hub (I
use Samsung Smartthings, Dad uses a Vera). Some will also integrate with the
Nest system or Alexa, but I'm not sure if that's directly, or via one of the
hubs I mentioned.

You can build your own "security" system with these. Quotes because adding
cellular/phone support isn't usually directly supported, though there are ways
to hack it together.

I have mine set with timers, motion sensors, a Nest thermostat, and light
switches. I'll add cameras eventually - waiting to see how the Nest video
doorbell works out (if it's good, I'll likely cough up the money and go all
Nest camera).

~~~
calvinbhai
Thanks for that info!! Will certainly try these options next time! Just
curious, how often do you need to change/charge batteries?

~~~
alistairSH
Annually. They don't die in that time, but better safe than sorry (and locked
out on a rainy day).

~~~
ghaff
I have a Schlage smart lock and still keep a spare key hidden. I'd never trust
the electronics 100%.

------
gerardnll
That's great, 250$ for a lock that saves time to couriers. A trip to a pickup
point costs much less (walking 3 corners for me)...

~~~
Klathmon
And a trip to a pickup point for me is about an hour of travel time and having
to find a parking spot in a crowded street.

Isn't it nice that they offer multiple options for multiple different people
with multiple use cases?

~~~
gerardnll
Distance aside, 250$ is crazy for being able to receive packages when you're
not home. Modern society problems at its finest.

~~~
Klathmon
It's not $250 to receive packages when you're not home, it's $250 to receive
packages securely without the possibility of them being stolen from your front
porch.

And it's just a different "implementation" of many other products that have
been invented to do the same thing. [0] is a "package lock box" that gives a
similar result for $230. But it's ugly, won't store larger boxes, and is often
harder to get your delivery people to use.

If your packages are getting repeatedly stolen, I don't think it's any more
"crazy" than you replacing a faulty computer part in your PC. Yes, that's a
"modern society problem" as well, but it's not crazy in the slightest...

[0] [http://a.co/efwOSZf](http://a.co/efwOSZf)

~~~
EADGBE
Also, you're buying a smart deadbolt and indoor security camera...

------
wnevets
No thanks, this is not a product for me. Just leave the package in front of my
door. Who is this meant for?

------
theDoug
Walmart has also previously announced a similar idea. I'm curious how insurers
will respond to this.

~~~
dingaling
I'd say it's most likely that insurers will just consider it falling under the
current guest-exemption clause i.e. any damage or loss caused to your home or
contents by people you invited onto the premises is not covered.

Truly caveat emptor, unless the retailers themselves start carrying third-
party insurance like tradesmen often do.

------
peterwwillis
Why does the postal service leave all Amazon packages on front stoops? They do
in Baltimore, anyway, as a matter of policy. The USPS packages they bring back
to their facility for you to pick up. This key service seems kind of like an
intentional workaround for that problem.

------
josefresco
Lot's of "nope" here. While it's okay in my neighborhood for a delivery
service to leave my packages on my front deck, there are many others who would
not be comfortable with this. For those people, I see this as a huge draw.

------
LinuxBender
Is this the same couriers that throw packages over fences and do long-throws
onto porches?

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alistairSH
Outside of mixed urban neighborhoods, is this really a problem that needs
solving? I try to have packages delivered to my office for convenience, but
still have plenty delivered to my home, where they sit on the front stoop
until I get home.

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FidelCashflow
Not a chance I'd use this "service" for any purpose much less install any kind
of "smart" lock on my primary residence. A place used for AirBnB, maybe I'd
use a more featured lock but never at my home.

------
DonHopkins
Darn, I was hoping it was a service for remotely scratching car paint by
drone.

------
djrogers
> Amazon only trusts its own delivery team to handle this work.

If this includes the ‘any guy with a minivan’ amazon flex drivers, then I’m
out - I’ve heard way too many wacky stories about them to trust that enough
for a lock.

------
jlebrech
I love amazon lockers, you don't have to worry if some idiot has been or not.

i'd also like to see "don't deliver to my house option", meaning i'll come and
pick it up from a depot the same day.

~~~
itafroma
> i'd also like to see "don't deliver to my house option", meaning i'll come
> and pick it up from a depot the same day.

This almost exists in Portland, OR at least: many items have an option for
"one-day pickup":
[https://smile.amazon.com/gp/campus?campusId=CAMPUS_POR](https://smile.amazon.com/gp/campus?campusId=CAMPUS_POR)

I say "almost" because it's not same-day: it's overnight.

~~~
jlebrech
by same day, i mean as soon as it's at a close enough depot for me to pick up.

------
major505
Leaving a camera inside my house connected to amazon servers, and allow entrey
of works while I'm not home?

No Thanks. I still preer 2 big locks and a big dog taking care of my home
while I'm not there.

------
deanCommie
"It's okay, it's Amazon!" (Reference:
[https://youtu.be/xf9V2l7l5Z4?t=26](https://youtu.be/xf9V2l7l5Z4?t=26))

~~~
voidmain0001
I hadn't seen that clip before. Well played, and thank you!

------
sillyquiet
I don't hate this idea, but we have a large Anatolian shepherd mix that is
perpetually guarding her 'meadow', so don't think this will work for us.

------
johnhenry
Initially, I saw this and thought it was an AWS service. Then, I realized how
bad of an idea it is to allow third-party access to non-revokable private
keys.

------
tryingagainbro
Amazon delivery person sees a marijuana plant ...call the police. Etc etc. No
thanks.

I'll pick it up at a delivery hub or keep coming back./

------
Nikkau
Next step: Amazon guys have to wear a shock collar by contract, an IA oversees
every drop and stun him if anything suspect happen.

------
api
Am I the only one who finds this creepy?

Of course I also find all these home voice assistants with always-on
microphones unbelievably creepy.

------
dpeck
Its about the home services delivery angle. The courier is just the simplest
one to explain to get some level of adoption.

------
beedogs
Amazon hasn't had a good idea in almost a decade, and this hare-brained scheme
isn't bucking that trend.

------
Dowwie
This is not the first offering of its kind and it won't be the last. It just
happens to be Amazon.

------
_Codemonkeyism
And someone takes a good look at your possessions and someone else comes 3
week later to take them.

No thanks.

~~~
prklmn
This hits at the overlying issue...you are not trusting Amazon with access to
your home, you are implicitly trusting the person working for Amazon, oh who
by the way may not be making a liveable wage, with access to your home.

~~~
_Codemonkeyism
I'm not trusting the vetting process Amazon is applying, especially after I
experienced many problems with people working for Amazon Logistics.

------
bradknowles
Amazon has a camera to unlock the front door to my house.

Nope. Can’t ever see that going wrong.

------
NiklasMort
or you know you could just do delivery on a specified time...like in most
countries I know of

------
cooervo
Fuck this is VERY CREEPY. Giving a company the power to enter your home. Why
is this even considered normal.

------
artur_makly
why not just crate fortefied boxes that get retrofitted to houses instead?

------
interfixus
Over my cold, dead body.

------
ryanpcmcquen
No, just no.

------
rusk
No. Just no.

------
epalmer
No, no, no. Not my house.

------
mtgx
Yes, give Amazon contractors the key to your house. I'm sure nothing could go
wrong.

~~~
anc84
"Oh, hi Alexa, I didn't realise you were here already. Carry on. I'll be next
door then."

------
jcun4128
Man this and WalMart haha

Edit: oh well I'm setting up my own home camera facing the door and hopefully
with opencv can tell if it's not me but that's a dream/future goal at this
time.

The bot net is an interesting question Cloudflare I guess or use high load
design like node, will see.

Edit: will add I want this because I will be living by myself and maintenance
people have keys/can open my door if I'm not there. Probably a dumb concern
but oh well I'm poor too.

I realize proof is in the pudding, bought the parts, started the repo will see

Overall though sounding like a luddite, not keen on strangers having a key
into my home despite liability on their behalf. If there was a second door
with regard to package dropoff that would be something.

------
cjsuk
Err no. Whoever came up with this idea should simply be taken outside and
shot. Actually whoever allowed it to get to this state of development should
be shot. The ideas guy and the worker bees are just doing what they say.

There is nothing good that could come of this. Nothing even slightly at all.

~~~
YPCrumble
Haha that's reminiscent of people who said AirBnB was a crazy idea!

~~~
overcast
AirBnB is a crazy idea. I wouldn't let strangers stay at my house, let alone
walk in to deliver a package.

