
Robinhood replaced “call” and “put” with “up” and “down” - tejasmanohar
https://twitter.com/AustenAllred/status/981561481530609664
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hn_throwaway_99
Honestly, this doesn't surprise me at all. The interface in Robinhood makes me
think it can only be useful for people that have 0 idea what they are doing.
Case in point: their graphs (at least on Android) have no labled Y axis!
Seriously, WTF.

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micaksica
> their graphs (at least on Android) have no labled Y axis!

It's the same on iOS.

I can't say I'm happy with Robinhood. It's dumbing down something that can get
you into a world of financial pain if you don't know what you're doing.

If they want to target people that don't understand what they are playing
with, they shouldn't be giving away options/crypto access/margin buying to
people that don't understand those concepts. Expect a lot of people to lose a
lot of money. /r/stupidfinance has some pretty great posts in which people
were left in the cold after playing with fire in RH.

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abaldwin7302
I know very little about stock trading. I shouldn't get in a world of
financial pain if I don't trade on margin (Robinhood Gold Buying Power) and
only transfer money I can afford to lose right?

That is treating Robinhood like a casino. I recognize I don't know what I'm
doing at the casino. Therefore I don't use a credit card to buy casino chips
and I have a hard stop-loss of a couple hundred bucks that's budgeted as
entertainment money.

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nosefrog
What's wrong with removing the jargon from stock trading?

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chimeracoder
> What's wrong with removing the jargon from stock trading?

Because you're removing all specificity from it at the same time.

If you show me that screenshot without the text in the tweet, I'd have no idea
what action it actually refers to. It could mean you're buying or selling an
option. Or it could mean you're buying or selling a stock (potentially short
selling). It could even mean you're buying stock on margin.

In fact, buying a call option is probably not even the _most_ reasonable
interpretation of "I think that this stock will go up", because purchasing the
stock outright would be the default workflow. Especially since it doesn't even
specify a timeline for the option[0]! Am I betting that it will go up today?
Next week? Next month? Next year? There is literally no way to tell from that
display.

And quite honestly: if you know about the distinction between buying equity
and buying a call option, you will care about the difference between the two.
And if you _don 't_ know about the distinction, you have no business trading
options, because you'll undoubtedly screw yourself over.

[0] Timelines matter less than you'd think, because you can sell an option
early to recoup its value and call options are always worth more alive than
dead[1]. But it still matters, because buying an option that expires in a
month is a very different bet from buying an option that expires in a year.

[1] In other words, you never exercise an option early even in markets where
it's permitted.

~~~
truthteller11
So much BS in your post and most of everyone ("elitist") here. If someone came
here say this kind of thing about programming they would be voted to hell.

ie. If you do not know how pointers work you have no busines programming
because you'll undoubtedly screw your app.

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existencebox
I don't think your analogy holds water, if only from the fact that "pass by
reference vs value" is rooted in pointer knowledge, and is rather key to "not
screwing up your app." (And as sister posts pointed out, messing up an app
usually does not put ones finances on the line)

I also disagree with the core thrust of your post, but that's subjective so
I'm listing this second. As someone who went from "financially clueless" to
trading options over the last few years, I got to see my own mistakes
firsthand, which were at least initially rooted in not understanding the
implications of various vehicles and the patterns by which to use them, and
that was even after quite a bit of time practicing in simulators.

No, I absolutely agree with the parent that there's a risk to not only trying
to spoon-feed gambling (which is honestly how I see options, take it or leave
it) under the guise of investing to uninformed consumers, but in splitting the
jargon so a new entrant can't even easily bootstrap their knowledge by looking
up the terms.

(I find it additionally funny to be arguing this, as I'm normally a staunch
opponent to the Accredited Investor laws, but there's definitely a continuum
between "keep poor people from using these vehicles" and "everyone and their
grandmother can now shoot themselves in the foot without the most base
validation that they know what they're getting into or have the tools to do so
with eyes open")

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truthteller11
> so a new entrant can't even easily bootstrap their knowledge

This is where the pointer analogy works. You don't need to use, but by knowing
what a f pointer is, you increase your knowledge about the domain as you've
put, by knowing the difference of "pass by reference vs value".

And messing up an app does not put "owns" finances at risks. But may put
others by tons of different ways of bad written software (if released or used
anyway). So you have more responsibility with software because it MAY affect
others and not just yourself blowing your own money.

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perl4ever
Losing your own money can affect other people, if you are an adult with
dependents, for instance.

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truthteller11
Are you too self-centric to be able to understand or you're just being
annoying?

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perl4ever
I have no dependents, so no, I wasn't making a self-centric comment. And it
was just one example of how losing money can affect other people.

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acchow
This is so bad.

I know people who actually think it's just about betting it go up or down,
like the higher orders don't exist (the greeks).

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chollida1
This is clearly photo shopped right?

I mean going up vs going down?

and the high vs medium risk statement is, at best, debatable.

If this is real, can anyone shed light on how they ensure a user has the
capital required to purchase options? ie if I purchase 1 calls of GOOG and
they expire ITM what does Robin Hood do if I dont' have $10,000 in cash for
the exercise?

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jitl
In the thread they say Robinhood doesn’t allow selling calls if you don’t hav
the shares already.

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chollida1
Sure, that makes sense, but i asked about buying calls and not having cash to
settle the transaction at expiry.

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Basketb926
According to Robinhood, "If you don’t have enough buying power to exercise
your option, we’ll sell the contract in the market for you about 1 hour before
it expires." [https://support.robinhood.com/hc/en-
us/articles/115005656423...](https://support.robinhood.com/hc/en-
us/articles/115005656423-Expiration-Exercise-and-Assignment)

~~~
perl4ever
That seems scary to me, because even if it normally works, if it fails, it's
presumably not something customer service can "make ok" especially because
they aren't charging you commissions and you are, as they say, the product not
the customer.

At this point, customer service of the major discount broker I've used for
many years is so abysmal that the last thing I want is a free alternative that
promises to do more for me. It makes me think of how impossible it is to deal
with Google when something goes wrong with their free offerings.

I think social media has become a societal problem because there is so much
revenue available from exploiting addictive behavior, and the logic has to
lead to brokers trying to catch up. If you are sensible with investing, the
system doesn't need or want you.

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sterban
I believe this is just under the "Discover" option. When selecting an
expiration, it is displayed as Call/Put.

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austenallred
Nope, this is under FB -> trade options

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Apocryphon
Is there a currently updated Twitter or a Tumblr catching ridiculously silly
app UX decisions like this? Similar to:

[https://twitter.com/internetofshit](https://twitter.com/internetofshit) or
the defunct Read the Fucking HIG

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fogzen
As if we needed another reminder that Wall Street is a casino underwritten by
the taxpayers. A welfare program run by the Fed for the rich. A market for
fools, not a necessary institution to capitalize business.

I guess it's better than trading slaves.

~~~
perl4ever
Surely it can be both a casino for the ignorant and a necessary institution
for the educated and intelligent.

