
Amazon Retools with Unusual Goal: Get Shoppers to Buy Less - prostoalex
https://www.wsj.com/articles/amazon-retools-with-unusual-goal-get-shoppers-to-buy-less-amid-coronavirus-pandemic-11587034800
======
ilamont
_To lessen the burden on warehouses, Amazon has been contacting its third-
party sellers and encouraging them to ship items themselves rather than
through its “Fulfilled By Amazon” program, said people familiar with the
matter. Sellers pay a fee to Amazon to be part of the program, and Amazon has
spent years trying to expand this service. But with its delivery network
taxed, the company is opting to forgo the fee in the interim, one of the
people said._

The fee to participate in FBA via Amazon Seller Central is $40 per month.
Eliminating that fee is a drop in the bucket to most medium to large volume
sellers, who now have to contend with extra shipping costs if they ship FBM (M
= Merchant) or the even more expensive "Seller Fulfilled Prime" in which
seller is responsible for getting the goods to customers in _two days_.

What Amazon should be doing to encourage more FBM sales is reducing the per-
item fees associated with each order, or adding other incentives.

Another side effect of having sellers ship FBM are millions of orders are
going through the US Post Office instead of Amazon's transport network or UPS.
The USPS needs that package revenue, with junk mail down sharply and some in
Washington calling for the service to be privatized
([https://www.vox.com/2020/4/12/21218151/usps-bailout-
privatiz...](https://www.vox.com/2020/4/12/21218151/usps-bailout-
privatization-amazon-trump)).

~~~
moron4hire
Wait, I don't understand. So sellers pay Amazon a fee to use FBA, Amazon wants
to discourage FBA right now, so Amazon has _removed_ the fee... thereby
eliminating that miniscule barrier to using FBA?

~~~
dannyw
There is a small, nominal fee for FBM, Fulfilment by Merchant. This is
distinct to FBA.

~~~
moron4hire
So they are dropping the FB _M_ fee, not the FB _A_ fee? That's not what the
quoted text indicated. I can't read the article to see if the context changes
the meaning.

~~~
woodrowbarlow
(i think) when OP says "eliminating that fee is a drop in the bucket", they
mean that sellers who switch from FBA to FBM would no longer need to pay
(eliminate) the FBA fee... but saving $40/yr isn't much of an incentive when
you suddenly have to deal with all your shipping yourself.

------
baltimore
I wonder if one of the ways they are trying to lessen demand is by showing
over-estimated delays in shipping. I've gotten every recent order delivered
much faster than estimated at the time of purchase. (Sample size about n=5)

~~~
Kye
Still waiting on my desk chair to ship after 10 days with an estimate of May
4-5. It was "out of stock" when I ordered, then immediately "in stock" after.
That probably has something to do with the delay.

~~~
sieabahlpark
When that happens just cancel your previous order and start a new one. Have
done that a few times

~~~
Kye
I don't order often enough to justify Prime, so the wait so far isn't much
worse than normal. Not being able to sit at my computer has given me some
much-needed perspective on how I use it, so it's not all bad.

------
Finnucane
I've made my contribution by not ordering anything from Amazon. Though pretty
much every ecommerce site of any significance is stressed to the max right
now. And B&H is, as usual, closed for Passover. Still trying to support local
businesses as much as I practically can.

~~~
paypalcust83
I'm crossing my fingers that the two SSDs I ordered in B&H's last order window
ship today because their stores are closed and the warehouses are on reduced
hours.

Always buy from _good_ small businesses first (vote with your wallet).
Megacorps are unfortunately a practical, but depressing, evil last resort.

Btw, Instacart (YC S12) works here in Paradise, CA with a smaller chain
discount grocery store! :) (Local CVS ((still listed on IC)) closed due to
loss of customers, there is a Walgreens franchise in-town ((not on IC)) and
CVS delivers medications by mail for free right now.) And our most recent
shopper was lightning fast and a good shopper too.

~~~
nickvanw
> Always buy from good small businesses first (vote with your wallet).
> Megacorps are unfortunately a practical, but depressing, evil last resort.

Not to be a downer, but if you're looking for _good_ businesses, B&H is likely
to score no higher than Amazon by most criteria. They:

\- Don't pay appropriate sales tax:
[https://www.theverge.com/2019/11/14/20964980/b-h-photo-
taxes...](https://www.theverge.com/2019/11/14/20964980/b-h-photo-taxes-
lawsuit-new-york-state)

\- Discriminate against Hispanic workers:
[https://www.cnn.com/2016/02/29/us/bh-photo-
lawsuit/index.htm...](https://www.cnn.com/2016/02/29/us/bh-photo-
lawsuit/index.html)

\- Discriminate against non-Jewish employees:
[https://www.jpost.com/diaspora/new-lawsuit-claims-b-and-h-
di...](https://www.jpost.com/diaspora/new-lawsuit-claims-b-and-h-
discriminates-against-non-jewish-employees-571983)

~~~
learc83
I noticed that all of your supporting evidence is articles talking about
allegations made in lawsuits. What were the results of these suits? Were any
of the claims substantiated?

~~~
nickvanw
I believe the tax lawsuit is still pending, the most recent documentation I
can find from the NY AG is a summons from mid-November of last year:
[https://ag.ny.gov/sites/default/files/2019.11.14_nyag_v._bh_...](https://ag.ny.gov/sites/default/files/2019.11.14_nyag_v._bh_-
_summons_complaint.pdf). There is a corresponding press release from the NY AG
office: [https://ag.ny.gov/press-release/2019/attorney-general-
sues-b...](https://ag.ny.gov/press-release/2019/attorney-general-sues-bh-foto-
electronics-defrauding-new-york-out-millions-sales)

The 2017 case was settled
([https://www.dol.gov/newsroom/releases/ofccp/ofccp20170814](https://www.dol.gov/newsroom/releases/ofccp/ofccp20170814)),
with B&H agreeing to pay $3.2mm in back wages and "hire a workplace consultant
to correct its employment practices and conduct"

They settled a similar 2007 case by distributing $4.3m in monetary relief:
[https://compensation.blr.com/Compensation-
news/Performance-T...](https://compensation.blr.com/Compensation-
news/Performance-Termination/Performance-Employee-Appraisal/BH-to-Pay-4.3M-to-
Settle-Suit-Alleging-Pay-Bias-Ag/)

My point is not that B&H is bad, but that "support small business" doesn't
mean that you're supporting an ethical business.

------
specialist
My new power tool arrived in just its own original mfg box. Instead of being
reboxed by Amazon.

Maybe because of FBA? (Reviewing the order details, I can't figure it out.)

Whatever the reason, woot! Less is more.

~~~
arprocter
We had something back-ordered on Amazon (from before all this crazyness
happened) and it eventually arrived in a Sam's Club box

~~~
throwanem
That's happened in the past with items I've ordered, as what appears to have
been part of an arbitrage scheme - list items on Amazon that Walmart.com sells
for less, and when you get an order, reorder it from Walmart.com with the
Amazon buyer's shipping info. Every time it's happened and I've checked prices
on Walmart.com, they've been ~20% lower than what I actually ended up paying.
Seems like a cute little grift, all in all.

------
cordite
I’ve started looking to ebay and Newegg a bit more.

However these days Newegg seems to be more a marketplace for Chinese sources
and proxies of Chinese sources.

Ebay has been okay, though sometimes they don’t even get the goods into the
transport network until after it was promised to be delivered.

------
zeveb
Why not just raise prices on non-essential products? That will decrease sales
and increase profits. Everyone wins that way: the folks who need essential
products win, because the bandwidth available for their needs is increased;
the sellers win; Amazon wins; and people who want non-essential products and
are willing to pay for them win because they can still get them.

The people who want non-essential products but cannot or do not want to pay
the current price do not win, but they are no worse off than being unable to
buy at all.

~~~
jefftk
While that would probably work, it may not be legal:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Price_gouging](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Price_gouging)

~~~
dannyw
Is Uber surge pricing price gouging?

~~~
jefftk
Some people think so!

But price gouging is usually defined as being in response to emergencies,
which a pandemic is and a sharp spike in Uber demand may (a tsunami) or may
not (bars closing at 2am) be.

------
neonate
[https://archive.md/hbzHu](https://archive.md/hbzHu)

------
TekMol
IIRC paywalled sites without workaround are not allowed on HN. The link should
be changed to an alternative source. Here is one:

[https://nypost.com/2020/04/16/amazon-wants-customers-to-
buy-...](https://nypost.com/2020/04/16/amazon-wants-customers-to-buy-less-as-
demand-skyrockets/)

Regarding the content: Wouldn't it make more sense for Amazon to simply show
products that are fulfilled by the seller directly? This way they could still
make their cut but do not have to do the delivery.

~~~
Wowfunhappy
Here’s the workaround for WSJ:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16906571](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16906571)

~~~
jasode
Fyi... the above workaround with Google/Facebook acting as referrer/redirect
for the url hasn't worked in years. And especially if the browser has already
visited WSJ a few times and hasn't been restarted with a fresh session. Notice
in the following video that browser status bar says _" Incognito"_ and yet the
Facebook redirect still doesn't work:

[https://imgur.com/a/LKHW9OB](https://imgur.com/a/LKHW9OB)

The "?mod=rsswn" also doesn't work anymore. Disabling javascript doesn't work
either. Popular sites like NYTimes and WSJ do more sophisticated things than
just checking cookies. My memory fails but I think the last time I looked at
this, the sites sniffed HTML5 local storage or something not obvious.

[I didn't downvote your comment.]

~~~
tomrod
This adtech arms race is ridiculous.

The link shouldn't even resolve if they require paying customers, unless
signed in.

