
China launches second trial space station - RyanMcGreal
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-37370278
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Tepix
Interesting quote from the BBC article:

> If all this makes you worried about China's long-term cosmic ambitions, then
> you are not the only one.

I think it's dumb that China is not allowed to participate in the ISS.

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djsumdog
> If all this makes you worried about China's long-term cosmic ambitions, then
> you are not the only one.

I too saw that as a weasel phrase. Propaganda isn't limited to countries we
claim don't have free speech. Little things like this are probably not due to
government's direct control over media, but they're a result of the natural
fears people tend to have been given due to their government's political
stance and foreign policy.

The western world depends on China to be their manufacturer. Many of our
startups and industry that deal with durable goods are dependent on their vast
manufacturing power. Yet we use their government as a means to also hold them
at an arms length.

Why not let our space agencies work together?

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komali2
I don't understand how "national security concerns" is not a valid risk. Of
all the countries in the world, China is 1 of 2 that are actually capable of
standing up to US military might, and the only _real_ advantage the US has is
a more robust intelligence system via satellites. Satellites that for example
can early detect missile launches, track missiles, guide missiles, etc.

If I was a US military adviser I would absolutely be putting full pressure on
avoiding any situation that gives the Chinese _or_ the Russians more insight
or access to the space program.

I think war and military stuff is stupid and antithesis to the advancement of
the human race, but I can see how someone who's job it is to be concerned
about that sort of thing is very concerned about that sort of thing.

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794CD01
When you get to the point where you truly think it's a problem that someone
else on the planet could potentially "stand up to you," it's time to
reevaluate your own behavior.

~~~
CountSessine
Why?

As a non-American, I would much rather have the US in that role than any other
country in the world. In diplomacy and international relations the United
States has conducted itself with fairness and honour, and is generally
regarded outside of her borders as an honest broker.

If you want to know what the world would look like without a strong,
democratic, law-abiding nation as supreme military power, read up on recent
news about the South China Sea and the 11-dash line. Look at the honesty and
even-handedness with which America has approached border disputes with it's
neighbours, and then look at what Japan, Vietnam, and the Phillipines are up
against. In the world view of China's leaders, the strong do what they can and
the weak suffer what they must.

~~~
794CD01
In diplomacy and international relations, the US has killed countless
civilians, used nuclear weapons, launched unjustified invasions of other
countries, deposed democratically elected foreign leaders for opposing
American interests, and to this day spies on everyone we possibly can. Maybe
you're the one who should do some more reading. Or at least watch a movie.

If you think the US has behaved better than other countries, that's
reasonable. But that's not the same as behaving well. And a far cry from
behaving well enough to be entrusted with "supreme military power".

~~~
CountSessine
_In diplomacy and international relations, the US has killed countless
civilians_

The United States has also conducted at least 4 wars since the end of World
War II; should America be condemned for not having smart bombs in the Korean
war?

 _, used nuclear weapons_

...to end World War II and save countless lives, US and Japanese, by avoiding
an invasion of Japan. Just the fact that the US was able to end the horrible
incendiary bombing of Japanese cities and force Japan's truculent leaders into
immediate surrender argues that the use of nuclear weapons in World War II
saved far more lives than it cost.

But historical revisionism wins out against lost memories of the worst war
ever fought and only barely won.

 _, launched unjustified invasions of other countries, deposed democratically
elected foreign leaders for opposing American interests_

The United States is tremendously powerful, and yet generally acts with
restraint. And would the world have been better off if more countries had
allied themselves with the Soviet Union?

 _, and to this day spies on everyone we possibly can._

If American power and influence has created a world so stable and peaceful
that there are Polly-Annas who believe that espionage isn't universal and
endemic among all nations, then that is a very good thing in my opinion.

 _But that 's not the same as behaving well. And a far cry from behaving well
enough to be entrusted with "supreme military power"._

Nature and international relations abhors a vacuum; no one 'entrusted' the
United States to the role they now occupy. Would you be happier if China
filled this vacuum?

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quirkafleeg
Obligatory nitpick:

> Yang Liwei became the first Chinese person to go to space

Should probably be the first Chinese _national_ to go into space. The first
ethnically Chinese person in space was Chinese-born Taylor Wang.

Interestingly, in a pub-quiz question kind of way, the first Chinese-born
woman in space was... Shannon Lucid.

~~~
bilbo0s
Well... as long as we're nitpicking historical details...

Lucid is CHINA-born...

not Chinese-born.

She's not ethnically Chinese.

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quirkafleeg
> Lucid is CHINA-born... not Chinese-born.

What is it you think "Chinese-born" means?

> She's not ethnically Chinese.

Yes, that's why I said Chinese-born and not Chinese.

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lucb1e
> If all this makes you worried about China's long-term cosmic ambitions

Uh, as a non-American, not more than America's. Why should it?

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crystalmeph
The Chinese talk about maybe sending a man to the moon, and they've launched a
couple of these space stations, but they've only done 5 crewed launches since
2003, and the last one was 3 years ago in 2013. It seems like China is doing
the bare minimum to show that they have the capability, but doesn't actually
have any real ambitions in this area.

~~~
794CD01
If you actually wanted to get anything done in space, it would be far more
efficient to send a robot. The only reason to send a person is to prove you
can.

~~~
elsonrodriguez
Doing it because you can is a fine reason.

In addition to that however, sending a human crew to Mars will result in more
digging, surveying, water prospecting and life hunting being done within the
first month of exploration than all of the rover missions combined.

The added benefit of having humans in space, especially if their reason for
being in there is because that particular bit of space is in the way of earth
and a planet, is securing the legacy of the human race by putting our eggs in
more than one basket.

To that end, I'll flip your assertion back on you: The only reason to send a
robot to space is to prove that you can, especially if we don't follow it up
with human missions.

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creshal
> In addition to that however, sending a human crew to Mars will result in
> more digging, surveying, water prospecting and life hunting being done
> within the first month of exploration than all of the rover missions
> combined.

Remember, this isn't just wishful thinking. We can do a side-by-side
comparison:

The Russian Lunokhod Moon rovers were engineering marvels, vastly
outperforming most of NASA's Mars rovers… and they're barely worth a footnote
in our exploration history of the Moon, because Apollo astronauts collected
more data during lunch breaks than the Lunokhods in a good week.

~~~
magila
I don't think the outsized mindshare of the Apollo missions has anything to do
with the amount of data they collected. In fact one of the major criticisms of
the Apollo program is that it produced relatively little scientific knowledge
for the amount of money that was spent on it.

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Shivetya
I figure it this way, the more they invest in space and science to allow for
probes to other planets the less they will spend on their military. Now if we
could our country (US resident here) to follow suit

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JumpCrisscross
> In August, the country launched the world's first quantum satellite, aimed
> at achieving "hack-proof" communications between space and ground control.

This is possible now?

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yoha
In short: because measuring effects the information, tampering cannot be
concealed.

