
Windows chief Terry Myerson out as Microsoft reorganizes - justinv
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/03/29/microsoft-reorganizes-splits-company-into-2-divisions.html
======
VonGuard
Microsoft makes the most stable, easiest to use desktop OS, especially since
Apple started slowing dwindling MacOS to make it into some kind of iOS
varient.

Windows still drives me nuts, has ads, gets stuck in tablet mode when I'm on a
desktop, and has driver issues from time to time, but the OS has grown to
become my favorite desktop environment in the past few years, if for no other
reason than that everyone else keeps screwing around and tweaking things that
don't need tweaking. Linux GUIs have been getting all fancy with it, Apple
thinks desktops are just for making Apple software, and yet Windows remains a
great place to play games, watch movies, browse the Web. It's by far and away
the fastest, most responsive desktop GUI out there. I hope it gets back to
basics.

~~~
VexorLoophole
Mixing some things together, uh?

You can't tell me that you windows drives you nuts, and keeps tweaking and
tweaking making it worse. Still it is (your opinion) better as linux GUIs or
Apple's one.

And as arguments you mention playing games, watch movies, and browse the web?!
All three are possible on all mentioned systems. The last two even in the
completely same way as on windows (besides user interface).

I am just glad that i switched to the other two options and never had to look
back. Apple also fucks up things. Still a pretty solid system for my use case.
Also i am not able to see the iOS-varent movement you mentioned. Also Linux
GUIs get better and better. It shocks me everytime what Windows Users tolerate
while bashing the other two system, when i have to configure something on our
AD (only used Windows Server in house). Inconsistent GUI Designs on expensive
software, xbox gaming center preinstalled on a SERVER EDITION, everything
shuffeled together, ...

~~~
fhood
Owner of windows 10 desktop, windows 7 laptop, and macbook pro here. Windows
can go to hell. So many important things are crazy inconsistent. When plugging
headphones stops being a complicated and finicky process I will consider re-
evaluating my opinions.

Also do you know what the difference between a Windows fuckup and a macOS
fuckup is? The macOS fuckup makes news while the Windows one in business as
usual.

And there are adds. Built in to my OS. Fuck that.

~~~
wbkang
Actually Windows has one of the easiest ways to switch between Audio outputs,
right from the taskbar. I have no idea what you are talking about.

~~~
fhood
I don't think you have used a Mac recently then. When you plug headphones in,
the sound outputs through the headphones. And it works if the computer was off
when you plugged them in. Or asleep. Or closed. I probably care way to much
about this.

~~~
gokhan
> When you plug headphones in, the sound outputs through the headphones.

That's how Windows 10 behaves for me. I already knew it, but just tried again
for you playing a movie using VLC and plugging in my headphones. Works like a
charm.

~~~
fhood
No pop-up menus?

~~~
gokhan
No nothing. Also, forgot to mention another test, went to hibernate while the
sound playing through laptop's speakers, plugged in headphones while the
machine is off, started the machine. Sound was coming through the headphones
after the boot. I'm on a t450s.

------
orev
I hope this gets them to focus Windows 10 back on corporate uses, or at least
giving back some reasonable aspect of control. Candy Crush ads built in to
Windows Pro is just absurd. MS already lost the mobile war, so they should be
focusing on where they really shine, not trying to dumb it down to straddle
multiple markets at once.

~~~
RexM
I have Windows 10 Pro and haven't ever seen an ad.

I'm genuinely curious what the difference is between my install and yours.

~~~
maxsilver
Windows 10 Pro has advertisements in the Login screen background, and the
Start Menu -- by default, on every fresh install.

Yes, you can turn these advertisements off easily. But considering how much we
pay for Pro (~$200), there shouldn't be any advertisements _anywhere_.

~~~
ocdtrekkie
To be clear though, these "ads" are solely for Microsoft/Windows features, the
most third party they get is being "suggested" apps on the Windows Store. Some
people may not perceive them as "ads" (and Microsoft claims they aren't, as
laughable as that is), because they are connected to Windows features, you'll
never get sent to a third party webpage from these things.

And I don't think they're actually paid ads, for either the suggested apps or
the rare occasion they've put an "ad" as the lock screen background. They've
promoted the Surface on it before, and then for Tomb Raider, I think they were
mostly pushing the idea of "hey, you can get games in the Windows Store now",
rather than it necessarily being a paid campaign with the game studio.

~~~
Nullabillity
> And I don't think they're actually paid ads, for either the suggested apps
> or the rare occasion they've put an "ad" as the lock screen background.
> They've promoted the Surface on it before, and then for Tomb Raider, I think
> they were mostly pushing the idea of "hey, you can get games in the Windows
> Store now", rather than it necessarily being a paid campaign with the game
> studio.

So you're saying MS doesn't profit if you buy a Surface or something from the
Windows Store?

~~~
ocdtrekkie
No, nor I didn't suggest otherwise.

------
maxxxxx
'and one transition we have been planning for is for Terry Myerson to pursue
his next chapter outside Microsoft. "

Gotta love corporate speak. Do they even realize how awful that is?

~~~
komali2
What else are they gonna do? "Fuck this guy amirite boys? Eat shit Terry!"

Personally I have no problem with politeness, even if it's a veneer. There's a
reason cities full of millions of people can function without clawing
eachother's throats out, and it's got nothing to do with Law.

~~~
maxxxxx
This is not politeness but it's a cynical play with words. They should just
say "We have decided to replace Terry Myerson".

~~~
komali2
Doesn't that do a disservice to Terry? The guy's been there what, two decades?
They probably are grateful to him for their time there.

Why load headlines with any form of negative language whatsoever? Why plop any
mines into future interviews he may have with other companies?

~~~
maxxxxx
It's clear to everyone that he has been fired. Otherwise they would have let
him resign by himself.

Saying "we have been planning for is for Terry Myerson to pursue his next
chapter outside Microsoft" is a stab in the back. Not only did they show him
the way to out but they also gave him a kick in the ass while on the way out.

~~~
komali2
"Fired" is such a loaded word. There are many reasons for a company to want
someone to leave, and not all of them necessarily "negative."

Off the top of my head, when the oil and gas market dipped in 2014, tons of
great engineers lost their jobs because the companies simply didn't have work
for them. Or a CEO that's _really good_ at 5-50 startups simply not being a
good fit for scaling 50-100 and upwards of 1000s of employees. Etc.

~~~
maxxxxx
Trust me. He has been pushed out forcefully. Otherwise he would have resigned
to "spend more time with his family".

~~~
pasabagi
To me, 'resigned to spend more time with his family' sounds like corp-speak
for 'had a mental breakdown', or, 'succumbed to alcoholic dementia'.

------
cwyers
This provides a lot more detail on what's going on, instead of focusing on the
(admittedly shocking) news about Myerson:

[http://www.zdnet.com/article/heres-how-and-why-microsoft-
is-...](http://www.zdnet.com/article/heres-how-and-why-microsoft-is-splitting-
up-windows-in-its-latest-reorg/)

------
ThrowawayR2
Interesting. Terry Myerson was the head of the Windows Phone division through
WP 7, 8 and the early part of WP 10 and bore at least some responsibility for
its (lack of) success before being promoted to head of the Windows division as
a whole. The inclusion of the much derided tie-in ads in Windows required at
least his tacit approval.

The general impression was that he was one of Satya Nadella's darlings. One
wonders what finally felled him?

~~~
halo
Windows Phone was good.

The subsequent attempts to turn desktop Windows into Windows Phone were
infuriating and ill-conceived. Almost everything that I liked about Windows
Phone did not translate to the desktop.

~~~
notafxn
Windows Phone was definitely NOT good. It was stable, and it was visually
appealing. But it was always "almost there". It always gave you the impression
that the next update would get there, but updates were super slow, if you
would get them at all.

~~~
ocdtrekkie
Windows 10 Mobile gets updates every month, just like Windows 10 does. (Also,
it's fun to measure how much faster Windows Mobile phones are still patched
for major vulnerabilities than Android phones. Even the Pixel took like three
extra months to get the KRACK patch.)

~~~
notafxn
Android is a really really low bar.

------
oregontechninja
Linux (various OS's on that kernal) have been objectively more stable and
easier to use than windows since windows 8 came out. I plugged an Ubuntu
machine into my work network and could print to any printer without installing
any extra drivers! Updates ONLY when I want them. Also, no bloatware or
unnecessary personal assistant tied to every search feature. Microsoft
should've just polished windows 7.

~~~
chrisper
Ubuntu installs by default updates automatically. Even if you choose no
automatic updates during install.

------
quantummkv
It's a bit disconcerting to see the apparent narrow mindedness of educated,
technical people in regards to the forced windows update system. Linux's way
of manual updating is better than windows, only because the only people using
Linux are capable of understanding security issues and will update as soon as
is is convenient.

The majority of the windows user base is of people who do not understand and
maybe do not want to understand the security issues. Windows had the option to
manually control the update process in windows 7. The HN demographic updates
on time, grandma and the guy in accounting don't. They won't update until a
major security issue reaches the mainstream. Even then the majority don't
update simply because unlike us, they do not have the knowledge to do so.

Microsoft had to make a hard choice, and they made the hard choice. That hard
choice is the reason 98% of wannacry infections were on windows 7 and barely
1% on windows 10.

If ubuntu somehow ends up replacing windows in hands of the general public,
don't be surprised to see the same update system to appear in it.

~~~
pritambaral
> If ubuntu somehow ends up replacing windows in hands of the general public,
> don't be surprised to see the same update system to appear in it.

If that happens, don't be surprised when a fork of Ubuntu comes out without
the forced updates.

> The majority of the windows user base is of people who do not understand and
> maybe do not want to understand the security issues. Windows had the option
> to manually control the update process in windows 7. The HN demographic
> updates on time, grandma and the guy in accounting don't. They won't update
> until a major security issue reaches the mainstream. Even then the majority
> don't update simply because unlike us, they do not have the knowledge to do
> so.

The choice doesn't have to be between 'update now' and 'update never'. There
are more polite ways of pestering people into doing something good, than
completely hijacking their system.

The choice doesn't have to be between 'security updates AND feature updates,
together' or 'nothing at all'. The "feature" updates don't have to include ads
and auto-reinstalled Candy Crush. The "security" updates don't have to auto-
enable explicitly disabled telemetry settings of users.

All of the development machines in my office either auto-apply security
updates or prominently nag us to manually apply updates that can/could not be
automatically applied. None of them reboot in the middle of a development
session. None of them auto-install feature updates or ads or sponsored apps.
All of them run Kubuntu LTS.

------
RcouF1uZ4gsC
If I read this correctly, Windows is no longer a top level division of
Microsoft and is a part of Experiences and Devices.

This is huge. Few companies have reinvented themselves as many times as
Microsoft has. From developer tools (BASIC) to Dos to Windows to Office and
now to Cloud and Services.

Under Nadella, Microsoft has regained the agility for which it was famous for
under Bill Gates.

~~~
contextfree
Sort of. Windows shell/app/device teams got merged with other "experience"
teams (i.e., Office), while Windows platform teams got merged with other
platform teams (i.e., Azure)

------
atomicnumber1
Reading all these comments concludes...

Windows 10 - Nightmare

macOS - Slow & buggy.

Linux - No Apps & Games, Frequent changes in fancy GUIs

I think we've run out of options here. It's 2018 and we still don't have a
solid Operating System. This is really sad.

I just hope fuchsia takes off really well.

~~~
jyrkesh
Lol, we still don't even know what Fuschia really IS.

------
mistermann
I really hope they make fixing the long standing Windows usability issues a
priority rather than adding even more "features" that nobody wants or uses.

~~~
slantyyz
If they fixed my two biggest pet peeves with Windows 10, I'd be so, so happy.

My number one pet peeve after switching back to Windows from Mac is the
search.

On Mac, I used a hotkey for Spotlight to launch apps. It always found the
right stuff, even with typos.

On Windows, the Search results can be ridiculously bad even when you spell
things correctly. Given how MS owns a search engine and that Apple doesn't,
you'd expect it to be much, much better.

My number two pet peeve is that there are two types settings - the new Windows
8/10 settings and the old Windows Control Panel. I don't know why it's taking
so long to consolidate them, it unnecessarily complicates the user experience.
Just pick one and go with it.

~~~
Multicomp
I gave up on Windows Search long ago. These days, I disable Windows Search
indexing entirely, and use the Void Tools software called "Everything" \- it
needs a new name so you can use it as a verb (I Everythinged for the file
sounds wrong), but other than that, it is a near-flawless, INSTANT search.

Once, I was searching and searching for a particular file, couldn't find it
anywhere. Was starting to wonder if I had deleted it or lost it...so I went
looking and found HN users referring to this Everything thing.

I installed it, checked the box for "run Everything now" on the finish wizard,
the window loaded, I typed the name, and poof, there the file was, 27 (or
whatever, way more than 5) directories deep. My jaw hit the floor, and the
rest is history.

~~~
slantyyz
Yeah, I get it. The first thing I disable on any Windows machine is the
"search the web" part of search. I _never ever_ want a web search when I'm
using the Windows search box. That default behavior drove me nuts.

The only thing I really use it for is launching apps (via the Windows key), in
the way I used to use a hot key + spotlight on Mac.

------
kerng
This is provably good for Microsoft. I watched a couple of presentations and
Myerson never came across as very savvy in presenting their technologies. Not
sure about his internal doings though, but they should have always used
someone else to demo and present things.

------
sumitgt
Putting Scott Guthrie in charge of Cloud and AI seems like a great move.

------
guelo
100% men. No women in a memo mentioning about 20 execs.

------
ssahoo
I hope the new windows chief will take updates mess on top priority.

------
Bhilai
I remember last year Microsoft did some major reorgs as well. Is it typical
for Microsoft size organizations to re-org so much ?

While re-orgs are probably good for re-organizing the workforce around a set
of goals but I think for lower level managers and individual contributors
these are very distracting. Constant change in leadership affects employee
morale.

------
johnmalatras
As someone joining Windows and Devices group out of college this summer,
should I expect this to affect me?

~~~
canekong
Hey John, I work at MS too and welcome! As for how this may impact you, you
should speak with your recruiter and connect with your hiring manager. Please
do not hesitate to ask.

Personal experience differ, but here's my story. When I joined MS 9 years ago
it was in the midst of the big layoffs, and my recruiter reached out
immediately after news broke and made sure that everything is still in place
and I am still due to start in the summer after my graduation, and I've been
happily working here since.

Good luck!

~~~
johnmalatras
Awesome, thanks for sharing your experience! I’ll reach out to them if I don’t
hear anything. Looking forward to joining you all!!

------
jbob2000
He's lead windows for the last 21 years. He gave us Windows 2000, ME, Vista,
8, and 10. I am not surprised his time is up.

Microsoft has lost the next generation of computer users to Android and iOS
because of their regular release of completely botched products. The
enterprise company I work for just rolled out their Mac program and we are
slowly transitioning from Windows.

It's time for a shake up.

~~~
cwyers
Steven Sinofsky led the Windows division from 2009 through 2012.

