
3D crosswalk in Iceland helps slow down speeding motorists - lando2319
http://icelandmag.visir.is/article/photos-video-3d-crosswalk-isafjordur-helps-slow-down-speeding-motorists
======
malgorithms
There is an analogy here to the slippery-slope of attention-getting ads on the
Internet. Once upon a time an ad was just a static (not even animated) banner
of a certain size and shape. 468x60 was one of the earliest, IIRC. Advertisers
invented new formats ("skyscrapers", "xl-leaderboards", "300x250", and so on),
and also they got animated, and then they started expanding outside their
areas, and so on; each new ad temporarily performed literally dozens of times
better than the previous due to shock value.

A year or two after a new, more intrusive format became ubiquitous, its
performance would fall back to the old format's, and, worse, the old format
would fall even further because it was too subtle. So in the long run, the
money would stay the same, but the pages got uglier, formats got crazier. The
game theory is clear: everyone is incentivized to upgrade to the new formats,
but once there, no one is better off (neither the publishers nor advertisers),
and the readers themselves are far worse off.

We're seeing this now with traffic signals: if every crosswalk in the world is
replaced with this 3D version, we'll see a temporary boost in safety, but in
the long run it may return to normal and in my opinion, our world will be
uglier. I don't like our public spaces covered in optical illusions.

In my area I've started to see red lights that are so bright you are
temporarily blinded at night if you look at them. And they've even begun
attaching strobing white LED's to the center of some of them. I would guess
these perform great in short-term studies. Just like flash ads with games in
them.

~~~
sjwright
France (and quite probably other European countries) is an excellent example
of this. Zebra crossings are so common that they're almost completely ignored
by drivers.

In Australia they're used relatively sparingly which makes their presence
noticeable to drivers. You don't need to do anything clever, just make them
sufficiently uncommon.

~~~
megablast
Yeah, and you have to cross without one, because they are too far away. I
wouldn't use Australia as an example of good driving rules. You are allowed to
get away with murder in Australia if you are driving a car.

~~~
sjwright
Not having a painted crosswalk is fine, it just means pedestrians will cross
without a potentially misleading sense of entitlement to the road. Zebra
crossings tend to be reserved for very high traffic areas, schools, etc. And
they're usually very well signed, often with flashing amber lights.

As for your other comment, that's crap. Australian drivers don't get away with
squat compared to England or France. Our roads are almost infuriatingly
sensible to the point of tedium.

I thought brits were pretty good, but nowadays half of them don't use their
indicators and the other half go 15-30 MPH over the motorway limit. (Citation:
just got back from three weeks of driving in England and France.)

------
drunkonvinyl
Helps to have a concept of scale here. This is a tiny town in the remote
fjords in northern Iceland.

The speed is likely caused by tourists looking around and not paying
attention, so grabbing their attention will probably work in this case.

Starting point in maps street view - zoom out and walk around the town for 5
min - you'll gain a better perspective on what's going on here:
[https://www.google.com/maps/@66.0739609,-23.1207479,3a,75y,3...](https://www.google.com/maps/@66.0739609,-23.1207479,3a,75y,315.36h,80.84t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sHv3QpAr4H10qxhPyZvd8Og!2e0!7i13312!8i6656)

~~~
Tomis02
>The speed is likely caused by tourists looking around and not paying
attention

I suspect it's Romanians, as they're really bad drivers. For example, in
Romania drivers will not stop at a crosswalk to let you pass unless you stare
at them for a few seconds to make eye contact, and even then it depends on
their mood and how hurried they are. They're basically a menace on the roads.

~~~
snowAbstraction
Why would you suspect Romanians in particular in Iceland? Why not citizens
from other European countries who as have relatively many road fatalities per
capita?

I am usually most worried about Americans since many have little experience
with roundabouts and they are used to turning right on red, often in practice
without a full stop. This is very dangerous for cyclists and pedestrians.

~~~
Tomis02
> Why not citizens from other European countries who as have relatively many
> road fatalities per capita?

When it comes to pedestrian safety, the only EU country with a record that can
match Romania's is Latvia, but it has a population that's 10 times smaller.

[http://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-
explained/index.php/...](http://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-
explained/index.php/Road_accident_fatalities_-
_statistics_by_type_of_vehicle#Pedestrians_particularly_at_risk_in_Baltic_countries_and_in_Romania)

> I am usually most worried about Americans since many have little experience
> with roundabouts and they are used to turning right on red

Except the crossing in the article has nothing to do with roundabouts and
turning, just stopping to give way to pedestrians, which is something Romanian
drivers are very bad at. I'm speaking from experience.

~~~
falsedan
> _When it comes to pedestrian safety, the only EU country with a record that
> can match Romania 's is Latvia_

The roads in Latvia are OK, but they have (signal-controlled) pedestrian
crossings on 60 mph highways… and uncontrolled ones on 40-50 mph.

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StanislavPetrov
The best way to slow down motorists is a 3d speed bump. Not a 3d illusion of a
speed bump - an actual speed bump. They have speed bumps littering the side
streets in certain areas of Queens and Brooklyn. If you don't slow down, and
take care, these large speed bumps will simply wreck your car - and they are
much easier to install than these 3-d paintings.

~~~
SeriousM
I don't like speedbumps, but they work.

~~~
hellofunk
You're not supposed to like them; and really the only people that are
inconvenienced by them are those going to fast anyway.

~~~
BoorishBears
That's not true, my car scrapes on them at practically any speed.

People with slightly higher cars than mine scrape because they try to brake,
forcing their suspension to compress, then go over the bump.

There's so much ceremony to going over a speed bump that I think plenty of
people not going that fast are inconvenienced. whether that inconvience is
worth the net benefit is a separate issue.

~~~
GordonS
Same hear, Nissan 350Z scrapes most speed bumps even going as slow as is
possible.

Also, they don't work for a lot of cars - I see lots of cars (presumably
without stiff suspension) fly over the things at quite high speed. It seems
that at certain high speeds, if you straddle them just right, you don't have
to slow down at all.

~~~
BoorishBears
Yup, on cars with soft suspensions you can actually get _more_ clearance by
_speeding up_ right as you reach the speed bump, since weight transfer will
push the front end of the car up

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DrScump
In Santa Clara, California, there are several crosswalks at intersections not
controlled by a traffic light. There is an ongoing problem with cars not
properly yielding to crossing pedestrians (I mean, like, _ever_ ). I almost
got killed in one twice in one week. As a driver, I get rude treatment (and
some near-collisions) when _I_ stop for pedestrians. A pedestrian was _killed_
in the one near Halford a couple of months ago.

The city solution: enforcement? Ha! No, they put in a new fancy overhead
signal of a style completely unique (and, to my reading, non-compliant with
the actual vehicle code) at one of these crosswalks (just west of Kiely).

The problem: when a crosser presses the call button, a _pair_ of overhead red
lights _flash_ for a fixed cycle of time. But (in CA, anyway), a _flashing_
red light means "stop, and _proceed when safe_ " by law, but the signage
simply says "Stop on Red".

So, people are confused as to how long to stay (the full cycle? or only as
long as it occupied? or only as long as the _near_ half is occupied? or, ?)...
and almost half continue to blow through the intersection regardless.

Ambiguity in such contexts is inherently unsafe.

~~~
chrisseaton
> In Santa Clara, California, there are several crosswalks at intersections
> not controlled by a traffic light.

Isn't that what a zebra crossing is for? Give pedestrians permanent right of
way so they can always go and don't need a light and everyone understands that
they need to yield.

~~~
vostrocity
On a road with high traffic speed and not enough visibility of pedestrians
waiting at the side of the road, most motorists won't yield

~~~
lozenge
What about a pelican crossing? Red yellow and green lights for cars like at a
junction, activated by pedestrians pressing a button. Wikipedia says these
only came to the US in the year 2000, which seems ridiculous.

~~~
jschwartzi
People still blow past them, in my experience. The only real way to make roads
safer for pedestrians is to remove all the cars.

~~~
grkvlt
Wow. Surely (and especially if there are red-light cameras) that'd be an
automatic ticket, with fine and points? Same for not stopping at a zebra
crossing. I can't say I've ever witnessed this sort of behaviour in the UK,
except maybe as exceptional events shown on 'World's Worst Driver' clip shows
on TV...

~~~
jschwartzi
It happens to me at least once a month. It's regular enough that you have to
pay attention whenever you're crossing here, even if you have the right of way
and you're in the middle of the road and there are bright flashing lights
indicating your presence.

I think about 25% of drivers should have their licenses pulled, because it's
my experience that they don't have the judgement to operate a motor vehicle
safely.

------
dsego
In my city a lot of new crosswalks have white stripes on a bright yellow
background, a lot of them with blinking LEDs. In several places even the sign
has a flashing light. Nobody will stop on an ordinary zebra crossing anymore,
it doesn't even register. As for the interesting patterns to draw attention,
they tried it in a different town in my country near a school, painted the
stripes with different colors. Didn't last, police says not according to road
regulations. And then someone brought up the famous zebra crossing in the
capital near the zoo, where the pattern was realistic zebra stripes. That was
promptly repainted as well.

~~~
merraksh
Only tangentially related, but here's a piano-inspired crossing in Warsaw,
Poland:
[http://www.trekearth.com/gallery/Europe/Poland/East/Mazowiec...](http://www.trekearth.com/gallery/Europe/Poland/East/Mazowieckie/Warsaw/photo1335047.htm)

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jorjordandan
These 3d perspective drawings are much less convincing in real life than they
are in images, because in real life we have depth perception and our viewpoint
is constantly moving. This only looks good from that exact viewpoint.

~~~
tarr11
The article shows pictures of 5 different angles on that crosswalk, and they
all seem to work.

~~~
lozenge
All of them are in the very middle of the road. The illusion will be broken if
you aren't driving through the centre.

------
GonzaloCamacho
MUTCD Manual for Uniform Traffic Control Devices. The US Federal government
has its MUTCD and each state has its MUTCD. All of them are generally the
same. Uniformity is critical in driver behavior. The lack of uniformity on
traffic controls is and will cause random behavior from drivers which likely
will reduce safety. Streets are not games. The lives of people and children
are in the line.

------
Animats
Wonder what Tesla's vision-based automatic driving makes of this.

~~~
kyberias
Doesn't Tesla rely on much more than just visual imagery? I mean it can drive
at night.

~~~
CNJ7654
"I mean it can drive at night" So can I :D

~~~
kyberias
Not very well without lights you don't. Although I'm not sure whether Tesla
can either. :)

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laythea
I predict that the bits of the illusion will deteriorate with the paint on the
road, leaving a big mess :)

------
chrischen
Sounds like it'd work until everyone knows about it. What about an actual 3D
object there (speed bump)?

~~~
robbrown451
Because a speed bump has a different purpose, and has some negatives
associated with it (which is why you don't have speedbumps at every
crosswalk). This should work even when people know about it, because the real
point is to draw attention to the crosswalk. Probably the people who know
about it, are less likely to hit someone in the crosswalk anyway, it's the
people new to the area that are most likely to be dangerous.

Now if they put these everywhere, they'd stop losing their effectiveness.

------
jon_adler
In the UK, we have "New Layout Ahead" signs everywhere. Once erected, they
seem to stay in place forever and increase noise. Is there any evidence that
these are beneficial?

~~~
GordonS
Not just new layout signs - we seem to be _bombarded_ with signs!

Seriously, some places there are just so many signs that you couldn't possibly
take in the information they provide in time. And the majority of the
information they provide isn't useful.

One of the things I hate the most are the digital signs that are springing up
everywhere. These things are _expensive_ , and >99% of the time they are
distracting me with _pointless_ messages about watching my speed, not drinking
and driving, not driving while tired etc. Such a waste, and surely causing
more harm than good.

~~~
Boothroid
Reminds me of the annoying passenger announcements on South West trains:
[http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1205027/Passengers-f...](http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1205027/Passengers-
fury-train-companys-31-announcements-32-minute-journey.html)

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ntheont32tnh
I feel like this points to a bigger problem. Why do drivers feel the need to
drive faster than the speed limit? Why do drivers and pedestrians hate each
other so much? This really feels like a band-aid on a much larger problem. And
it also seems like the type of thing that will make people react even worse
once they realize the situation. Like those signs that say, "Drive like your
kids live here." Fuck you! I don't have any kids and I don't like kids. (Not
really, but I know people who think like that.) I've seen people drive way
worse between speed bumps to "show the man" that they can't be controlled.
It's ridiculous, but solutions like this engender anger while maybe slightly
reducing accidents (if at all). THere's a bigger problem we need to understand
and all the games we're starting to play with parking between traffic and bike
lanes, and cross walks that are farther back from the intersection, and other
such remedies are papering over it.

~~~
Boothroid
The sooner we get self driving cars to control the idiots that cannot control
themselves, the better. That said, they are trialling fake 3D speed bumps here
in the UK and it makes me furious! I would far rather simply have have average
speed cameras everywhere.

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dsego
Interesting, apparently this is already a thing in India and China
[http://tris.com.hr/2016/05/3d-zebra-i-nacrtana-provalija-
na-...](http://tris.com.hr/2016/05/3d-zebra-i-nacrtana-provalija-na-cesti-
recept-za-sigurniji-promet-i-pravednije-drustvo/)

------
shasheene
Why weren't a series of speed bumps suitable?

~~~
radiorental
Plowing in Winter perhaps?

~~~
protomyth
Yep, plowing and speed bumps don't mix. My workplace bought removable speed
bumps. At the first snow, they maintenance folks unscrew the speed bumps from
the roads / parking lot that are owned by the college. When the snow melts,
they put back the speed bumps. Also, speed bumps with ice accumulations are
just nasty.

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bkyan
The concern I have with this scenario, is that I'll get conditioned to ignore
this kind of stuff as a driver, and will manage to hit something real that I
mistake for an optical illusion.

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Pica_soO
To have a continuous effect, this would need some persistent e-inkpaper to
redraw cars, obstacles or similar stuff on the road.

Also, sorry to say it - but the speed limit is set by the common lowest
denominator- meaning, a old guys reflexes, in a fully loaded lorry with the
worst possible breaks must stop at the smallest acceptable visible range at
clear weather.

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williamle8300
This is a bad idea. Once it loses its effectiveness it'll leave the drivers in
a worse state.

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justinucd
Attention should be drawn to pedestrians, not necessarily to the crosswalk
itself

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wavefunction
Article captions reference '08 Something Good - Utah Saints

Welsh lad the first time e seen a running man ->

"IT'S LIKE IT'S FLOATING ON AIR The townsfolk of Ísafjörður say they have
never seen anything like it."

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mrep
Am I the only one who thinks that humans might be pretty good at adjusting
speed for risk?

Not to sound cruel, but having everyone slow down might not be worth the cost
of all these precautions.

~~~
roel_v
"Am I the only one who thinks that humans might be pretty good at adjusting
speed for risk?"

You probably are, because humans are horrible at recognizing and adapting for
risk.

------
ThomPete
For how long though? This will become normalized after some time.

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swayvil
I want the pattern for this. I suppose it's easy enough to make my own, but a
pattern would be nice.

I live on a street where people drive too fast.

~~~
bnegreve
Take this picture from above, that's basically the pattern.

[http://icelandmag.visir.is/sites/default/files/styles/articl...](http://icelandmag.visir.is/sites/default/files/styles/article_body_image/public/thumbnails/image/isafjordur_7.jpg?itok=tK-k9lUU)

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saagarjha
I wonder how well it would work in the dark.

~~~
QAPereo
Well, if you can’t see the road, there’s a problem in and of itself. Assuming
good headlights, which I think you’d want in Iceland, and assuming modern road
paints, it should work. If not, just stick a road light over it.

~~~
hanoz
Yes but how well would the _illusion_ work in headlights?

~~~
QAPereo
It should work, modern headlights are no joke, but I admit that I’m not sure.
If you have enough light to perceive a broad range of colors it _should_ work.

~~~
ncallaway
The shadows would appear wrong when lit by headlights, which might be a little
bit disorienting. The shadows are rendered as if a light was high overhead.

I think the illusion would still work fine, but feel subtly "wrong" to the
driver. Probably good enough to get people to slow down, though.

------
eps
It's all smart and clever until someone gets distracted, slams the breaks,
gets rear-ended and breaks the neck.

~~~
bryanlarsen
The speed limit is 18mph. No neck breaking can happen at that speed.

~~~
tzs
That's faster than you are moving when you are executed by hanging (about 17
mph for long drop, 13 mph for standard drop), so I would not dismiss the
possibility out of hand.

~~~
sparrish
Ah... but it's your whole body weight on your neck at that speed that breaks
it. Unless you've managed to seriously misplace your seatbelt, I don't think
you can achieve the same result.

------
rangibaby
I have seen something similar but not the same around Japan for years. A good
idea.

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microcolonel
This is why self-driving cars need lidar (and maybe radar) as well as cameras.

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burntrelish1273
That's awesome! :D

Palo Alto should try this on El Camino Real. ;)

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rocky1138
Does it actually work?

------
gt_
also eye-patch resilient :)

