
Show HN: Please Don't Rob Me - noppe
http://www.pleasedontrobme.com
======
nl
It always surprises me people think this is a real issue. For many "victims" a
more effective algorithm would be something like this:

    
    
       If victim's age > 25 && < 60
          If hour of day > 10 and < 17
             Rob house
    

That algorithm will fail in many cases of course, but I'd argue it covers a
much larger number of people than the supposed problem identified here.

For added safety, the implementor may add this feature prior to the "Rob
house" step:

    
    
       Knock on front door

~~~
captainmuon
An old trick I've heard is to have someone call the house's landline while you
are robbing it. As long as the phone is ringing, you can be reasonably sure
that no one is home.

~~~
meowface
A lot of families, including my own, will not answer the phone if they're
asleep or busy. Or more commonly, if the caller is not recognized on caller ID
they'll just let it ring.

~~~
TheCraiggers
If you call the same number 10 times in a row, or let it ring for minutes, you
can be reasonably sure nobody is home. Most people would at least get pissed
and pick the phone up, if only to slam it back down.

~~~
Houshalter
Well now your phone is linked to the robbery. One call might be explainable
but 10 is pretty suspicious, especially if you do it at multiple crimes.

~~~
billmalarky
I'm sure it's not too hard to anonymously get a phone number. Google voice
perhaps?

~~~
praxulus
Payphones.

~~~
xanderstrike
Far too low-tech for HN.

------
reuven
It's an interesting idea, tracking people's current locations based on their
sharing on social networks, and cross-referencing other databases to find out
if someone is at home.

But this seems like a very high-threshold way to find out whether someone is
home. I mean, if I'm really interested in robbing someone, am I really going
to go through the trouble of searching through social networks, cross-
referencing information from people in my area, and only then starting to
figure out which homes are (and aren't) worth robbing?

And of course, there are a number of very important variables that such an
analysis ignores: Whether the person lives alone (or is renting the place out
via AirBNB), whether they're in a building or single home, whether there is a
burglar alarm, how good the police force is in that city, how easy it is to
get into (and out of) the home in question, and whether there's anything worth
stealing.

So it's an interesting experiment, but telling people to remove their names
and geographical information from Instagram to avoid being robbed strikes me
as a bit far fetched.

I run an e-mail list for people who live in my city (Modi'in, Israel), and we
now have nearly 3,000 subscribers. People are constantly saying, "I'm going to
be away on vacation during such-and-such a period of time. Does anyone need a
short-term rental?" That strikes me as a far greater invitation to mischief
and robbery than Instagram or any other social network.

~~~
newaccountfool
You may not do this for say, robbing joe blogs. But what happens if your going
to rob a celeb who has 50k+ of jewlery in their house and you know they're
going to be out of town filming for three weeks, or that they are doing a PR
night so you have 8 hours before they return.

There are examples of this, popularized by the movie The Bling Ring[1].

[1][http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bling_Ring](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bling_Ring)

~~~
greggman
Does a celeb with 50k+ jewelry not have an alarm system? I suppose there are
some that don't but I guess I'd expect most do.

------
poisontofu
Is the name meant to riff on [http://pleaserobme.com](http://pleaserobme.com),
a 2010 site with similar aims?

~~~
chippy
And which got a huge amount of publicity about it.

[http://techcrunch.com/2010/02/17/please-rob-me-makes-
foursqu...](http://techcrunch.com/2010/02/17/please-rob-me-makes-foursquare-
super-useful-for-burglars/)

[http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/twitter/7266120/Please...](http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/twitter/7266120/Please-
Rob-Me-website-tells-burglars-when-Twitter-users-are-not-home.html)

------
watwut
Mine home address is available to anybody from local yellow pages too.

Privacy is indeed important, but fear of robberies is not the reason why we
should protect it. Nor is someones home address the supersecret info I
desperately need to protect. There were maybe two facebook post triggered
robberies worldwide. It is much easier to rob one of hundreds seemingly right
now empty houses robber goes around every day then to analyze pictures and
maps to find one random target.

~~~
luch
You might be surprised by the robbers' creativity and drive. For example, you
can't put anymore the time and day of a wake in the local newspapers, since
burglars used this info to break into the houses of the dead's relatives. Same
thing for weddings.

~~~
cowsandmilk
Not sure where you live, but every obituary in the newspapers where I have
live have time and dates for services.

As a quick example, [http://www.tributes.com/obituary/show/Mary-Ida-
Cammisa-10153...](http://www.tributes.com/obituary/show/Mary-Ida-
Cammisa-101531021)

------
emilssolmanis
The whole point of it is kind of moot though, an impulse burglar would just
roam the neighbourhood to find a target and one with a specific target has
better ways of finding out if the house is empty than 1 inhabitant posting to
instagram... Not being at home is not what elicits criminal behaviour.

------
lnanek2
Doesn't seem very indicative of a good place to rob to me. If I'm not home, my
wife usually is, and if we're not, the landlord also lives in the house, not
to mention the dogs. The only things I own worth stealing are my computers
anyway and those are all portable and stuffed in a backpack every weekday,
locked in a hotel weekday nights, and often with me off at a hackathon on
weekends. So if I'm taking a picture away from my house, most of the time the
only thing I own worth anything is with me. If I was a robber I'd rather case
houses in person.

~~~
djur
It seems like 'any house, during normal working hours' would be just as
reliable a bet as a house determined through this kind of snooping.

------
mobiuscog
Reponsible behaviour would be informing just the owner of the photograph that
they are potentially making themselves vulnerable.

Sharing the information with the internet at large is just being irresponsible
in order to try and show off, no matter how many disclaimers are on the site.

~~~
rcavezza
Agreed.

"PDRM is meant to demonstrate how easy it is to find out where someone lives
and if they are at home or not. The aim of this site is to educate and empower
people to protect themselves better while using social media."

The target audience of a website like this is us on HN, not the people who
need to receive the message about privacy.

~~~
Tyrannosaurs
The two groups aren't mutually exclusive. It never ceases to amaze me how many
people with a deep understanding of technology still seem to over-share in
this regard.

~~~
MichaelApproved
"over-share" is a relative term. How many of them actually get robbed as a
direct result of "over" sharing?

------
namnatulco
I think it's far more interesting and productive to use facebook posts for
this, rather than GPS coordinates in EXIF data and comparing it with a phone
book (which is essentially what they're doing, according to the about page).
Facebook posts often contain much more information and that information is
easier to extract.

Realistically speaking, neither of these cases will be addressed. Although
properly using the privacy settings can help, the entire reason people use
tools like these is to express themselves about things they're seeing, and
that usually doesn't happen at home. This coupled with the fact that the risk
is extremely low, and that there are much better ways for a burglar to obtain
this information, I don't think this is the best way to go about privacy
awareness. It was probably fun to build, though.

------
Aoyagi
Why on earth is that site made primarily for touch controls? Am I the only one
who finds these sliding (vertically or horizontally, doesn't matter) sites
with tons of empty space and huge fonts extreme impractical or even obnoxious?

------
VLM
Classic "individual" vs "any" design pattern.

You want to find my specific kid for nefarious purposes or rob my specific
house, modern technology makes that about a billion times easier than decades
ago.

You want to find a kid for nefarious purposes or rob a house, any moron can
find the nearest elementary school or drive around a subdivision watching cars
pull out in the morning and swing back in 5 minutes and technology doesn't
help very much at all. If anything technology makes it worse, too easy for
nosy neighbor with an omnipresent cellphone to make a call.

So it's being marketed as technology makes it easier for a random scary dude
to go after a random victim, but in reality the problem is crazy addicted
coworker, crazy ex, crazy relative, not just random scary dude.

------
philbarr
As an aside, it is official UK policy to NOT respond to reports of someone's
house alarm going off. If you ring 999 they'll ask you if you can actually see
someone in the house robbing things and if you can't, they won't send anyone
out.

The reason is that too many house alarms go off by accident, they don't have
the manpower to check them all.

~~~
rickyc091
Yep, I was just going to say. Right when I moved into a new apartment, I
didn’t know the security code to the alarm so it went off for a good 20
minutes. You could hear the alarm on the street, but no one seemed to care or
pay too much attention to it. It reminded me of this
[http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/13/opinion/bike-
thief.html](http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/13/opinion/bike-thief.html)

------
marincounty
I thought a a lot about this:

Anyone can rob your house/most apartments if they look like Construction
workers/Landscapers.

Hide your jewelry where no one will find it; you might need to know a little
bit about construction though.

In the end, make sure you have an ip cam that captures license plates, and a
few in your house.

A smart criminal will have flip up plates, and wear desguises though.

Maybe that jewelry should go into a safe dep. box? Make sure you have no
active judgements though? They can snatch it all up. They can also empty out
your bank account. Be proactive, and don't give them a cent. Become Judgement
Proof--if you have any one you trust your life with?

Burying in the backyard is not a bad idea, but don't do it drunk. I know a guy
who lost $800,000 in Muir Beach after a night of hard partying. He woke up and
couldn't find remember what he did with his ill gotten money, or maybe that's
just what he told his wife?

------
chippy
It should (and the the previous PleaseRobMe.com also made this mistake) use
the word "burglary" rather than "robbery". Edits - this could just be a
British difference rather than a US one, if so, my bad!

Robbery is about theft (usually using force) from a person, whereas burglary
is unlawful entry to and theft from that person's property. Since the person
is not going to be there, the property is empty and ripe for burglary.

A more interesting and challenging PleaseDontRobMe would focus on where the
target is, away from home securities, who they are with, the security
situation of the country, the best escape routes relative to their location,
locations of police, CCTVs etc. Much more interesting geographically in my
opinion!

~~~
meowface
This is not just a British difference. Robbery always involves some form of
threat or assault in the US, legally speaking. And colloquially speaking too,
except in recent years where the word has lost some meaning.

The US vs. British difference is the verbage of "burglary" (though
interestingly this article also confuses robbery with burglary).
[http://grammarist.com/usage/burgle-
burglarize/](http://grammarist.com/usage/burgle-burglarize/)

------
comeonnow
IMO, the how to protect yourself should be more prominent and perhaps on the
first slide/page.

I stopped using Instagram because I couldn't keep up with me post-dating my
activities. It was more of a chore to remember to post a week or so later and
'pretend' I'm doing such activity now, instead I just didn't bother sharing.

I got a brand new car a few months back, and even though I wanted to share a
pic (not to gloat) I knew it would be easy to track down, and due to where I
live it's easy to see whether I was home or not. Not a rare car by any means,
but how many '14 plate cars in particular colour in a particular model do you
see in any one area? Matching cars could be 5-10 miles apart easy

Does anyone else think like this?

~~~
jarek
Car theft scenarios:

\- look on instagram for nearby recent photos of fancy cars to steal

\- visit neighbourhoods where rich people live and look for fancy cars to
steal

------
anjc
There're a lot of comments saying thieves are too thick to use technology for
robbing people. Maybe some are, but there are plenty of tech-savvy people with
no scruples who might use information like this. To-order car thieves use
plenty of technology to do their business, for example. And furthermore, I'm
sure we all know plenty of houses that were mysteriously robbed at an
opportune moment (the night everybody went on a trip, for example).

Thieves mightn't be cross-referencing databases using various API's, but
they're not so thick as to miss opportunities that might present themselves
through Facebook posts etc.

I don't see a problem with increasing awareness of the possibilities.

~~~
GFischer
The tech car-thieves use is pretty amazing, I work for an insurance company,
and we've seen almost any kind of deterrent being easily defeated.

Some have gone to the extreme of bringing and installing an entire car
dashboard to bypass custom keys.

I've seen videos of devices that purportedly copy most common alarms. Heck, it
apparently costs U$ 5.

Snopes thinks it's fake:

[http://www.snopes.com/autos/techno/lockcode.asp](http://www.snopes.com/autos/techno/lockcode.asp)

however most mainstream news sites report it as true:

www.cbc.ca/news/canada/manitoba/new-5-device-easily-unlocks-car-doors-for-
thieves-in-winnipeg-1.2288826

[http://arstechnica.com/security/2013/06/after-burglaries-
mys...](http://arstechnica.com/security/2013/06/after-burglaries-mystery-car-
unlocking-device-has-police-stumped/)

~~~
anjc
Yep this is exactly what I mean. BMW's get stolen around here often, robbers
programming new keys without breaking a sweat, and knowing how smash windows
and get in without setting off the alarm:

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DshK4ZXPU9o](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DshK4ZXPU9o)

When the risk/reward of theft is skewed so poorly in a thief's favour, and
considering that there's a precedent of unscrupulous technological usage, I
don't think it'd unrealistic for people to monitor social networks in this
manner to look for opportunities.

In your experience, are certain new cars more likely to be stolen? I suppose
any car can easily be taken by waking the owner up at night with a weapon in
their face and asking for the keys...

~~~
GFischer
I can't answer your question about new cars :) (also, I work in Uruguay, very
different from the U.S.).

Your remark about any car being easily stolen reminded me of

[http://xkcd.com/538/](http://xkcd.com/538/)

------
abolishme
So, essentially:

    
    
        - if instagram?
          - if on_vacation?
            - if shared_home? == false
              - if dangerous_pets? == false
                = rob_them
              - else
                // wait  
            - elsif roommates_home?
              - if dangerous_pets? == false && if security_system? == false
                  = rob_them
              - elsif house_guests?
                - if house_guests_home?
                  // wait
                - else
                  = rob_them
              - else
                = kill_pets + rob_them
            - else
              = rob_them
          - else
            // wait
        - else
          = chill_with_friends
    

Seems legit.

------
justinpaulson
It would be obviously difficult to pull off, but I'd like to see some
estimations on how many robberies occurred based on information gained form
social networks. I am guessing it is such a small percentage that these fears
are completely irrational. If you are going to take the time to make this site
and present this argument, I'd like to see some shred of data to substantiate
your claims that social networks are really endangering the "careless people"
who use them. Especially if you are going out of your way to call those people
careless.

------
rubiquity
When I look at your site on my iPhone 5 in landscape mode the title changes
from "Please Don't Rob Me" to just "Rob Me". You should consider fixing that.

------
peaton
You've got some browser height compatibility issues [1, 2]. (I'm on Chrome on
a macbook.)

[1]
[http://cdn.imghack.se/images/c226811e44f418ab538c336f156d1b3...](http://cdn.imghack.se/images/c226811e44f418ab538c336f156d1b33.png)

[2]
[http://cdn.imghack.se/images/db6a53b635f7d471f747117aada7f2f...](http://cdn.imghack.se/images/db6a53b635f7d471f747117aada7f2f7.png)

------
berkay
Serious question: What do people rob these days? It seems like there is
nothing that can be easily transported and sold in most houses.

~~~
roel_v
TV, computer, phones, cash, jewelry, clothing, any type of appliance, power
tools, medicines, alcohol, cigarettes, toys, ...

I'm not sure what kind of houses you have in mind that have nothing that can
easily be transported and sold... Except for the furniture, most houses are
full of stuff, and most of it can be sold.

~~~
guard-of-terra
My TV is 37 inch, trying to haul that in the street should raise some
eyebrows. And it doesn't have that much resale value.

~~~
berkay
That's what I was thinking. Stuff in my house is either too bulky or don't
have much resale value (as stolen goods). Our house was burglarized while
living in Switzerland, and they did not touch any of the electronics,
presumably too bulky. Cost of replacing the broken window/frame was the most
costly aspect.

From all the things listed, jewelry seems to be the most likely target.

------
datashaman
Umm, how do you use it? All I see is copy, no Start Here... Also, no
scrollbars, and no way to scroll down to see all the copy.

------
webmaven
This has been done before (2010):
[http://pleaserobme.com/](http://pleaserobme.com/)

------
quaffapint
It always amazes us when we see families post their vacation photos on FB and
such, while they are still on vacation.

Can't you just wait till you get home to do that? Is it that critical, or do
you just like announcing that hey, we're not home.

------
tall
I have a better idea, re-brand this as, find the best places to vacation.

Step one look at picture. Is the area they're in awesome? Step two go to area,
or repeat step one.

Way better than robbing people nonsense.

------
riquito
Shouldn't they provide attribution and license of each photo took from
Instagram? (I do understand that this would de-anonimize the photos).

------
judk
This is a knockoff of a years-old site
[http://pleaserobme.com/](http://pleaserobme.com/)

------
zzkt
[http://iknowwhereyourcatlives.com/](http://iknowwhereyourcatlives.com/)

------
RossM
Perhaps this could be better used as a heuristic for delivery companies to
select a delivery time?

------
Istof
Maybe Instagram could be sued for not striping EXIF information (aka metadata)
from pictures?

------
cell303
Speaking of irrational fears: I always fear that I forgot my keys while
leaving my flat. Now I know that I just need to post some holiday pictures of
myself on instagram and eventually somebody will show up to help me get back
in - for free!

------
bx_
Typo: "sing in" should probably be "sign in"

~~~
jimmytidey
I rather like it as an idea though, how would it work? I hum a tune that only
I know, it lets me in?

~~~
serf
I like the idea of it as a form of protest more. Like a sit-in, only way more
obnoxious.

a tune-dependant sign-in procedure would doom me and the other 'arrhythmics'
among us.

------
pcvarmint
If you're not home, then how can you be robbed?

Robbery != Burglary.

------
1337biz
Kudos to the project! I believe the best way to make people aware of privacy
issues are sites like this. These "wtf am I doing?" moments are really
educative.

------
serf
I wish that my scroll wheel would translate into horizontal movement, since
you chose a carousel style presentation.

------
finitecase
Thinking of the 2012 election, mitt robme

better ban yellow pages or anywhere else addresses can be found

