
Things They Don't Teach You in School - shawndumas
https://www.netmeister.org/blog/semper-ubi-sub-ubi.html
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746F7475
> Who here is a feminist? (Two, three hands go up, timidly.)

> Wait, let me ask another way around: who here thinks that all people,
> regardless of gender, have the same rights and should be treated equally?
> (All hands go up.)

> Congratulations, you are all feminists.

It's too bad that current feminism/SJW movement has so corrupted the feminism
"brand" that I do not feel comfortable identifying as one and probably who
more hands don't get raised. The definition given doesn't match what currently
feminism is about.

~~~
rubbsdecvik
> It's too bad that current feminism/SJW movement has so corrupted the
> feminism "brand"

I've started to think of the SJ movement as analogous to the GNU/GPL movement.
From a high level, it's easy to see it as extreme and difficult to identify
with, but if you give it some time and thought, you start to see the merits of
the argument.

Note, one does not always have to agree to think there are merits. Once I saw
SJ advocates in this light, it also became much easier to see that much like
the software license debates, there are a spectrum of beliefs; Not all GNU
advocates are alike, just like not all SJWs are alike.

> The definition given doesn't match what currently feminism is about.

I have not seen evidence that this has changed. I have, however, seen opinions
that I don't agree with, but ultimately stem from that working premise.

~~~
fit2rule
I think that all movements have to deal with the agent-provocateur problem,
sooner or later - which is to say, any time you make an enemy, if you don't
allow your enemy to become you properly, then you will become your enemy.

This is what happened with feminist movements: they became the very frothy-
mouthed totalitarians they were resisting. Because they didn't do enough to
deal with the totalitarians that were attracted to their platform of power,
gained in the rising days of the feminist movement, and must now share that
platform with a vast array of differing views, somehow aligned with feminism,
but nevertheless diluting the goals of very subject and thwarting it in a
direction not originally intended.

All movements have to deal with this factor, it seems. Its a social one.

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unabst
So I guess this was a comedy piece? Some more serious issues I've noticed:

#1. They don't teach you that teachers are paid to put up with you. Employers
aren't paid to put up with you. They're paid to fire people who waste their
time and interfere with the work that needs to get done.

#2. They don't teach you how to not waste people's time. Some of the group
activities that force mingling are the worst. Most real work does not require
communication, especially at entry level positions. Take instructions once,
and just deliver what is being asked of you.

#3. They don't teach you what's being asked of you. Students show up at class,
deliver homework and take exams, with the occasional project maybe. Work is
all exams. It's about your constant output that is monetarily valued by your
employer, which is always being examined. Homework and exams have no value.
But the degree has value, right?

#4. They don't teach you the degree has little value.

The list can go much longer, but even if you're a Harvard PhD, until you get
this, you're a fraud. And even if you're a high school dropout, if you get it,
you're in business. Employers don't really care where you're from once you're
in the building. They just need things to get done.

(The degree acquiring experience can be spectacular for you regardless of
where you go actually, but degrees just aren't worth what they used to be, for
sure.)

~~~
onion2k
_#2. They don 't teach you how to not waste people's time. Some of the group
activities that force mingling are the worst. Most real work does not require
communication, especially at entry level positions. Take instructions once,
and just deliver what is being asked of you._

That assumes some sort of weird universe where instructions are always
perfect. I don't live in that universe. _Every_ person who does paid work of
any sort should be questioning their instructions, communicating with their
colleagues about the instructions, and giving their manager feedback if the
instructions are incomplete or if the situation changes. That applies to
everyone from people writing complex software to people paid to literally just
dig holes.

The notion that communication skills are universally important across all jobs
is entirely true.

~~~
unabst
Communication skills are important, but you need to know when to shut the fuck
up. That's what's universally important and entirely true.

Instructions are never perfect. It's whether you can get the job done anyway,
once you know what is being asked of you, which is mostly a one time
initiation. Ever see someone repeatedly asking and questioning what is being
asked of them? That's someone who is going to struggle for the rest of their
lives in every professional environment someone accidentally put them in.

Supervisors don't want to hear about imperfections that you could have worked
around yourself. You aren't being paid to call and talk and yap. You're being
paid to deliver. Your approach is academic already, and goes to prove my
point. Instructions only need to meet you half way. In fact, less the more for
you. This is why it's completely academically backwards. The more you get done
with fewer instructions, the more valuable you are because you cost less time.

Imagine a Postal Worker questioning the features on their mobile device (which
clearly suck). They're being paid to work with it, not question it and talk
about it.

Communication skills are important, but communication itself is an absolute
bottleneck in any workflow (with emphasis on flow). Minimize communication
volume, and maximize communication value. Work is no excuse to talk.

But that doesn't mean all work is anti-academic. Most of it is though. The
best academic jobs will always be in academia.

~~~
onion2k
_Work is no excuse to talk._

I understand that there are people who prefer to work in silence,
concentrating on nothing but the task at hand, but the suggestion that
everyone should be like that is idiotic. There is a wide variety of people in
the workplace; we aren't all the same. The idea that office hours should be
limited to work and nothing else betrays who we are: living, sociable human
beings.

~~~
unabst
Right. You continue to exemplify my point.

Talkers truly underestimate the bandwidth it takes to engage someone properly,
and if you're not engaging someone properly, your presence is just insulting.

If you're in an open office without walls or cubicles, and people kept talking
to you, you wouldn't get anything done. Their excuse? That they're living,
sociable, human beings. Well, tell that to your boss.

Think of a busy kitchen. People don't talk beyond the signals required to
advance workflow. Of course, everyone can chat when they're not busy. But
that's also when the business isn't making any money. Restaurants close to
take you off the clock.

Think of all the jobs that require focus, like programming and writing. Think
of all the jobs that are so much easier with focus, like almost every job.

Of course, if you like to talk, just get a job that requires it. Waiters get
to talk while they wait for customers, and get to talk with customers.
Journalists, teachers, lawyers, consultants, entertainers.

And my suggestion was to know when to shut up, not that everyone must work in
silence. There is a time for communication, and for your presentation skills
to shine. It just isn't "whenever I feel sociable because that's who I am,
yo". But that's school! Get it?

And all this, they DO NOT TEACH IN SCHOOL.

~~~
RobertKerans
Right, sure, knowing when to shut the fuck up is very important. But learning
to be good at communication, and learning social skills is brutally important
in life. Learning when to speak and when not to speak and how to speak to
other people is so important: how are people supposed to learn this if you
teach them to just shut up and take orders? If you learn good social skills,
you do better in life, and you don't learn social skills by not interacting
socially. Also, school is a point in life where there is literally no downside
to constantly asking questions, all the time. You even say, teachers are paid
to put up with you: well, in that case, make them work!

~~~
unabst
For the most part, they don't teach either. They don't teach good
communication skills, nor do they teach you to shut up. Typically, students
will talk, and get scolded when the teacher doesn't want them to talk. That's
not a lesson. It's a power grab.

They don't teach how to ask questions either. They need to.

I know these things because I have had to teach them to every person that I
hired. The modern system was suppose to create a smart and dependable work
force by teaching students how to study, which is basically how to follow
instructions and absorb anything handed to them. Except, that is only a small
fraction of most work, and even the studying part they stop doing because it
was never fun or important to them, or they never got good at it to begin
with. Because, ironically, most schools don't teach you how to study. They
just _make_ you study.

------
Radim
An impressive collection of tips!

Highly relevant plug: for students / fresh grads wishing to bridge the
academia-industry gap, we offer a free Incubator programme [1]. There we
mentor talented students from partner universities on such practical matters.

We do specialise in machine learning, but most of the tips here apply 100%.
Surprisingly -- at least to many ML students coming from academia -- even
(especially?) the "be boring" bit of advice. People can get so hyped up about
the latest ML fads that they miss the forest for the trees, so to speak.

[1] [http://rare-technologies.com/incubator/](http://rare-
technologies.com/incubator/)

~~~
8note
That looks pretty interesting; I might apply.

One question about the non-optional meetings: when are they? If I am in PST,
will I have to skip sleep or work to attend?

~~~
Radim
Lev, our main community liaison, lives in London.

We've had students from all over the world though: from Brazil to Europe to
India to Japan. So I wouldn't worry about this too much. If the will and the
motivation is there, we'll find a time that makes everyone happy.

~~~
8note
Alrighty. In that case, I will send in an app. Word2Vec looks both interesting
and challenging.

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c218807
>Black lives matter

So, how do we stop them from killing each other?

You're probably now going to tell me that cops are racist but copy in the USA
are assholes no matter your race.

[https://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-
the-u.s/2013/...](https://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-
the-u.s/2013/crime-in-the-u.s.-2013/offenses-known-to-law-
enforcement/expanded-
homicide/expanded_homicide_data_table_6_murder_race_and_sex_of_vicitm_by_race_and_sex_of_offender_2013.xls)

~~~
cantbecool
Those statistics are eye opening. I wonder why they are never touched upon
during the numerous debates during election season in the US.

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zerooneinfinity
Stop trying to be the smartest guy in the room and lighten up. Those are my
tips.

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xiaopingguo
Scandinavian languages already have "programmering" for "computering" if you
want to sound quaint.

------
jonjonBoy
Leave Donald Trump alone bro.

