
Paper as a Substrate for Circuits - robin_reala
https://www.bunniestudios.com/blog/?p=5259
======
asditnionio
They missed the single biggest advantage of a breadboard: tinkering. You can
cobble a circuit together with no plan at all, trying things out until it
works. It's ideal for rapid prototyping, especially for students. With most
other systems you lose a ton of work with each change.

~~~
jdietrich
The high parasitic capacitance of solderless breadboard makes it unusable
above about 10MHz. You also have to deal with unpredictable contact
resistance. PTH ICs are increasingly hard to find. Breadboard is fine for
basic classroom experiments, but practically useless for most prototyping
applications.

Electronics hobbyists would be well-advised to learn SPICE as quickly as
possible - breadboards are an endless source of frustration once you move
beyond the basics.

~~~
bsder
> The high parasitic capacitance of solderless breadboard makes it unusable
> above about 10MHz. You also have to deal with unpredictable contact
> resistance.

Most of which really isn't a problem with digital circuitry and
microcontrollers because most of the peripherals are on board and your
communication buses are all low speed (most <1MHz--USB being the exception).

The biggest issue with modern circuits is that even your low-speed clock lines
need to have series termination resistors-- _even at low speed_ \-- _even on a
PCB_. This is a weird artifact for an amateur to grasp.

The issue is that even the cheapest digital chips nowadays have super high-
performance transistors on their I/O. Consequently, a 10 cent microcontroller
can respond to a 1GHz signal bounce or reflection on a 100KHz clock line. And,
oddly, an FR-4 board makes this worse, not better than a solderless
breadboard.

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Animats
Cute. Makes sense especially for RF prototyping. But a 60W power supply? Too
high power. There's a reason for Fire Resistant 4 board stock.

This has the look of something that works well only for people with really
good skills at working with tweezers at tiny scale. Many YouTube videos of
people doing surface mount work are like that.

------
rsre
I've personally tried this using cooper tape when I had to make a quick SMD
prototype.

Having the ability to take notes _on_ your circuit is fantastic.

~~~
madengr
I have built a few antennas out of it. Works quite well for prototyping.

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fian
When I was taught basic electronics in the early 80's we prototyped on
cardboard by pushing in thumbtacks as connecting points then soldering the
through hole components and bare, solid core copper wire onto the thumbtacks.

The solid core wire was quick thick and could be bent into rigid paths before
soldering so there was little risk of shorting if you were careful. A few dabs
of hot glue could be useful sometimes to keep close wires separate.

I wonder if you could do something similar today with smaller specifically
designed tacks to replicate modern SMT solder pads. You'd need some good
magnification to place the tacks.

------
amelius
They didn't mention conductive ink?

[https://www.bareconductive.com/make/5-things-you-can-do-
with...](https://www.bareconductive.com/make/5-things-you-can-do-with-your-
electric-paint-10ml-tube/)

------
bsder
The problem with this whole article is an assumption of _soldering_ with a
second assumption of the presence of a microscope.

The lack of soldering and microscopes are what makes breadboards so useful for
amateurs.

Side note: we call them breadboards for a reason--because they were originally
_bread boards_ \--with clips, screws, and wires.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:1920s_TRF_radio_manufactu...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:1920s_TRF_radio_manufactured_by_Signal.jpg)

~~~
zokier
> Furthermore, while Chibitronics focuses on providing _solderless solutions_
> for younger learners, the techniques shared in this post targets _engineers_
> who have the skill to routinely assemble modern SMT designs

(emphasis mine)

~~~
bsder
If that's the case, I'm even _more_ confused as to why he posted this, not
less.

As an engineer, my options for prototyping boards are quite expansive because
I have money to spend and computer tools at my disposal. These choices range
from old-school etching of PCBs; new-school CNC engraving of PCBs; cheap, slow
boards from China; to expensive ($1000), fast boards from the US.

Doing this on paper with copper tape is a cool hack, I just don't see a lot of
benefit over other options.

~~~
mchahn
> cheap, slow boards from China

I've bought about a dozen chinese prototype PCBs for $0.20 a board and
experienced 6 days from order to arrival at my door (using $19 shipping).
These are tested boards with 6 mil features up to 100x100 mm. And I've done
the board designs using their free online editor. This has been mind-blowing.

Check out easyeda.com. (I'm not connected to the company, yada, yada, yada).

------
amelius
What I want is a cheap printer that can print PCBs.

~~~
opencl
Small CNC engraving/milling machines suitable for making PCBs (and with the
benefit of being able to drill the holes for you) can be had for around $200.
Microcenter sells one.

~~~
borgel
I thought there was no way that could be true, but it is [1]! I'd love to try
out out and see how well it works in practice.

[1][http://www.microcenter.com/product/473125/mini_cnc_engraver_...](http://www.microcenter.com/product/473125/mini_cnc_engraver_machine)

