

Answering The Should I Go To College/Drop Out? Question For Young Entrepreneurs - jasonlbaptiste
http://jasonlbaptiste.com/personal/answering-the-should-i-go-to-college-or-drop-out-question-for-young-entrepreneurs/

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zeemonkee
Part of the problem is that the university, in its current form, is outdated.

Young adults are kept in their cocoon for far too long. Michelangelo started
work at 14; young people now start at 24 or older. Productive years are
wasted, people accumulating debt rather than saving, living in a bubble rather
than doing something useful.

The university traditionally was for the top few % - the children of the
wealthy, as a few years of freedom before taking on the family firm, and a
select few of the lower classes as a ticket to government and upper
management. Nowadays companies use a degree as a lazy jobs filter and its
scarcity value is gone.

This is not to devalue education itself. People have longer working lives, and
may change careers several times - either because they get bored or the
economy changes under their feet. Short, useful periods of education and
training throughout your working life may be a better way than 4 years early
on in your adulthood that soon pass into irrelevance, leaving you with decades
of debt.

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r0s
Having eschewed higher education for "real world experience", I have to admit
I regret that decision.

As valuable as working under small business owners has been, years later I
wish I'd learned more about technical aspects such as managing finances or
accounting. This could have been learned directly and efficiently in school,
freeing energy to focus on actual business method.

On the other hand, I am only now mature enough to learn seriously and apply
myself towards goals. If only I'd gotten there before my study skills have
atrophied. Self teaching myself programming has been both rewarding and
frustrating.

The bright side is I'm debt free, and can choose any outlet for creative
energy. The darker outlook is perpetual catch-up with peers, and somewhat
narrow skill sets.

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jefftougas
For every 1 Zuckerberg there's at least 1000 other people who dropped out to
start a company who crashed and burned. Also, just learning to finish big
things that you start is a very handy skill to learn and practice, school is
no exception.

~~~
jasonlbaptiste
Correct. On the flipside, just because you finish college, doesn't mean your
startup will magically succeed either. It's more the fact that you can finish
something that you can make have value for yourself. Too often we think we
need to rush out and leave college for good, as if at 19, the opportunity to
do a startup will disappear in 3 years.

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ljlolel
You should read lots of blog posts, but I find books much more interesting.
They cover a topic from end to end, rather than giving you an out-of-context
sliver of an idea.

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jobeyonekenobi
From a UK point of view - I left University in 2001. I finished paying off my
student loan this month. And this is strictly because I have a very well
paying job (I believe that you do not start paying off the loan until you earn
>£18k per annum). The job I have has nothing to do with my degree (getting a
First in Multimedia Design and Virtual Reality didn't count for a lot 10
months after those 767's got flown into the towers). However, I do believe,
had I chosen to do a degree that was actually useful, I may have felt that
higher education was the only way. As it is, I could have got a job at 18,
arrived where I am now at 26 instead of 31 and then got my company to put me
through a degree at their expense. Not done much research, but if there was an
option to study a large amount of entrepreneurialism at degree level, then
this would really float my (and a lot of other peoples) boat.

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brianbreslin
This is always a tough question to answer, as the answer is always "well, it
depends"

That being said. Every single one of these people who thinks you can
substitute a few books and going to a bullshit networking event for the
experience of college is completely full of crap. College FORCES you to create
bonds that many would honestly never have the opportunity to do so on their
own. They also build social objects which become pivotal tools later in life,
if you are smart enough to take advantage of them.

This is the same argument for the "Should I get an MBA?" crowd (of which I am
one of those wondering that Q). You don't go to college to learn linear
algebra or financial statistical modeling. You shouldn't be going to learn a
trade. You should be going to learn. You should be going to engage. You should
be going to experience new things. You are going to build your network.

You are much more likely to meet better partners/cofounders in college than in
high school or at random networking events. At least the college has
marginally vouched for them.

Should you drop out? Sure if you've tested your idea, and people other than
your mom and nerdy neighbor think your idea is cool. If you can tell 5 or 10
people who you would consider "normal" about your idea and they get that it
solves a problem, then drop out and run with it.

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abyssknight
Great article, and hits everything I usually say to people asking this
question. Now I can just post a link to this post every time someone asks this
question on HN. Meta-meta-meta posting. :)

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wccrawford
The first thing a potential employer should ask is 'Why didn't you finish
college?' And you had better have a good reason. Even if they don't ask it out
loud, they are thinking it.

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Sufian
LOL I am in College and I am waiting until I leave to start my business full
time. so I suggest to have a back up by having the grades from college.

~~~
jasonlbaptiste
the degree is certainly worth something, but it's usually the least important
factor in the backup plan. it's the experience of college on a personal and
intellectual level that makes it worth it.

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andreshb
Don't look at your college degree as a backup plan. Study something you will
really enjo (I'm a Poli Sci Major).

I met my future cofounders, employees, managers, at school. But if you want to
stay in school "just in case" you need a degree for a job, you are wasting
your time. Go to school because you want to learn, not because you want a job.

~~~
r0s
> Study something you will really enjoy

It's kind of a paradox though, it's hard to have real passionate interests
when you've never been out of school, traveled, lived.

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eof
Hrm. I really really don't understand all this advice to go to school. Just in
general, but for entrepreneurs, _especially_.

It's all roses and candy corn, 'meet smart people' (okay, assuming you got
into a top 10% school), 'start projects not businesses' (okay if you have a
scholarship or family-backing), 'show that you can finish something.'

What about the fact that it is 4 years of your life? What about the fact that
you are going to come out of it with a degree, the main thing you're aiming
for, that is nearly worthless if you are an entrepreneur? What about the fact
that you are likely going to come out of it with 60k+ in debt?

This doesn't even consider the opportunity cost. That is four years you could
spend traveling the world (meeting smart people), building companies not
projects (and finishing them), potentially having some savings rather than a
house-worth of debt. Not to mention the swagger that comes with pwning the
world in your own way.

You want to be a teacher? Yeah, go to college, you gotta. Doctor, lawyer, same
thing. But you want to make a million bucks before you're thirty shipping
products? Four years of dicking off between the work you have to do for
classes, 75% of which bore you is just a stretch to me as a good idea.

If you want to be top in your field while pushing the cutting edge of what's
possible and what's not, go on and get your PHD and paid-access to brilliant
professors, then yeah, go to school. But you are like .01% then.. not the
typical 'go to school or don't' thing.

The question being answered in this article is "are there benefits to going to
school?" And obviously, there are.

But the real question should be, "for an entrepeneur, is it better to spend 4
years struggling and working and building a business, learning as you go, or
spend 4 years going to college and paying 60k for the privilege?"

When you frame the question that way, I think it's quite obvious that the vast
majority of the time, going to school is a negative equity move.

~~~
ljlolel
Some of the best friends you make will be in college: life-long friends. These
tight bonds are forged from living very close to each other, possibly in the
same room, every day for years. In the real world of apartments and houses, a
friendly visit can easily take a half hour commute each way and is centered
around a big event. In college, you walk down the hall and just hang out.
Moreover, in your classes, you learn both the quality of your friend's effort
and how well you work together. A mutual trust is formed over these months and
years that are hard to form in the real world. In college, you will find your
cofounder, whether they be friends or friends of friends.

~~~
eof
> Some of the best friends you make will be in college:

...

If you go to college.

You could also move to a college town, save the 60k and hang out with your
college buddies that live in the apartment below you.

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royrod
Good post, and I think it's great that Peter Thiel is providing an alternate
viewpoint re: "stopping out"

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rick_2047
I read the post and realized how many of the points are rendered moot in the
Indian education system :C, these two make me really really sad.

 _Meet as many smart people as possible_ : If you are not in the top notch
schools you don't get to see a lot of them. And even when you make it into the
best ones chances are that half of the class is not that intellectually
simulating. I mean they are great at there course work, sure, but don't really
want to think of anything else.

 _Study Subjects that are new and challenging_ : Indian colleges do not follow
the choice based credit system. It's the college's way or the high way.
Although there are 2-3 subjects per semester you absolutely love, the rest
offset the fun by loading you with things you are not interested in.

Another point, most of the engineering students in India do not want to be an
engineer. They want to get into a good MBA program.

~~~
slpsys
I would look at this article as being about opportunity cost though, not
necessarily that each of the bullet points must be extant in a program in
order for you to enroll or stay in college. Ask yourself: would I be _more_
likely to meet smart people on my own without college? Would I be _more_
likely to study and engage subjects that are new and challenging? Not that I'm
not implying an ultimatum between college and sitting around at home; it's all
dependent upon your own motivation and circumstances (e.g. move to a city, if
you think that would increase the likelihood of those things). However, anyone
who's successful and hasn't gone to college _or_ made sure to attend to those
aspects has likely just gotten lucky.

~~~
rick_2047
Cannot agree more about your motivation point. Yes college played a role in me
meeting some of the most fascinating people, but the rate is not as much as I
would want. And as for the challenging subjects part, well I would just say
college really made no difference there, well apart from telling me what I
should learn.

