
Emirates Says Bookings to the U.S. Fell by 35% After the First Travel Ban - JamilD
http://fortune.com/2017/03/09/emirates-bookings-fell-35-after-first-travel-ban/
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reacharavindh
I guess I added to that 35%. I'm a brown guy(Indian) with a beard amd often
mistaken for middle eastern. I live in the US. I put off International travel
plans because of all the craziness going around. They weren't essential travel
though. I would've, but now I saved up some money before I move out of the US
permanently in July ;-)

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tajen
So... which country earned your respect? Out of interest in people's
perception of human rights.

~~~
reacharavindh
Moving not because I don't respect the opportunities in the US, or that the
country has treated me so badly that I wanna escape and go somewhere. But
because I had to make a choice between settling down in the USA vs settling
down in Denmark. Current political climate and the prospects of this
administration didn't do much to convince me that USA was any better.

If anything, I'm thankful to the USA for many things in the last 6 years I
lived here. Most of it for the awesome friends I made here. But, my Visa
always reminded me that I'm just a visitor, and the ~10 year wait for a green
card doesn't really make the USA attractive to me anymore.

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shambala
How did you get into Denmark? I heard they shut down their Green card scheme.

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reacharavindh
Haven't gotten into Denmark yet. My girlfriend is Austrian and we're moving
there together. AFAIK, I get a residence and work permit as we're moving
together and that she is a EU national who would be working as a
Asst.Professor there.

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Semaphor
That sounds weird. It's pretty easy to get those if you want to marry, but her
being your girlfriend shouldn't help outside of the formal letter of
invitation.

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rhblake
One doesn't need to be married in order to be covered by the EU rights in
question. Straight from the source:

"The following family members of an EU/EEA citizen or Swiss citizen, who is
exercising his/her right to free movement in Denmark, or of a Danish citizen
who is exercising or who has exercised his/her right to free movement in
another EU/EEA country or Switzerland, has the right to have a visa
application processed in accordance with EU regulations:

* spouse

* cohabiting partner aged 18 or over <\----

* ..."

See [https://www.nyidanmark.dk/en-us/coming_to_dk/visa/visas-
unde...](https://www.nyidanmark.dk/en-us/coming_to_dk/visa/visas-under-eu-
regulations.htm).

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nojvek
I can imagine that. I am a permanent resident of US but for the fact that I am
brown, I am avoiding all unnecessary trips.

Going through TSA is a very uncomfortable experience.

~~~
chrisper
Brown like Indian or Brown like Arabic? Does it even make a difference?

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vinay427
Decidedly anecdotal: Not the OP but I am brown like Indian with a non-Muslim
name and have never had any extra scrutiny at security, except for one
"random" screening on my boarding pass that involved some TSA swab check. I am
a citizen, but I haven't heard of any non-citizen family friends or relatives
that have expressed anything out of the ordinary.

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refurb
_and have never had any extra scrutiny at security, except for one "random"
screening on my boarding pass that involved some TSA swab check._

Interesting. I'm a white guy and I've gone through secondary screening (swabs,
detailed questions, etc) probably half a dozen times over the past 2-3 years.

And I have a US passport!

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DanAndersen
White American here. In the past 3-4 years (probably a couple dozen flights) I
have gotten some level of patdowns and hand-swabs literally every single time
I go through one of those millimeter-wave machines. Every time, without fail.

My belief is that it's because I had gone through some pretty substantial
weight loss in the past, and so my body skin/muscle/fat density is all screwy
around the midsection, and thus it sets the machine off.

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exclusiv
My white buddy got stopped and frisked traveling around Europe with me every
time. He has a legit beard. They even asked if they could put their hands
inside his pants (inside the waist band). Beards are suspect these days no
matter what your background.

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m0llusk
As a nation of immigrants steeped in commerce this is catastrophic
mismanagement of some of humanity's greatest resources.

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codecamper
I would like to see SV leaders stand up to this garbage. Make public
statements saying that you will be moving more jobs out of the US because of
Trump's actions.

I don't know why people have down voted this. Trump has all the markings of a
fascist. Fascists must be dealt with... you don't just tiptoe around them.

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Mikeb85
Pretty sure that's a terrible idea.

Like the law or not, that's who your nation voted for, and the government has
the power to make life very difficult for corporations.

Also, let's be real here. The travel ban doesn't affect these SV companies.
How many employees are going to be coming from Syria, Iran or Yemen?. Are the
positive optics worth the difficulties? The public is already weary of
corporations becoming too powerful, this will only feed into that distrust,
and possibly alienate ~50% of the population.

Political statements in either direction are almost always a losing
proposition for corporations.

~~~
__derek__
> the government has the power to make life very difficult for corporations

If we're at the point where companies need to fear arbitrary punishment by the
government for partisan reasons, the rule of law is dead. I'm not ready to
concede that point.

> Also, let's be real here. The travel ban doesn't affect these SV companies.
> How many employees are going to be coming from Syria, Iran or Yemen?. Are
> the positive optics worth the difficulties?

You may be interested to learn that a slew of companies signed an amicus brief
in Washington v. Trump[1], including:

> Airbnb, Uber, Twitter, Google, Facebook, Apple, Microsoft, Dropbox, eBay,
> GoPro, Lyft, Spotify, Yelp and Levi Strauss & Co

So, in their estimation, the answer appears to be "yes."

[1]:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Washington_v._Trump#Amici_curi...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Washington_v._Trump#Amici_curiae_and_proposed_intervenors)

~~~
Mikeb85
> If we're at the point where companies need to fear arbitrary punishment by
> the government for partisan reasons, the rule of law is dead. I'm not ready
> to concede that point.

Trump has already stated his desire to apply tariffs to companies that operate
outside the US, assuming he follows through, moving employees outside the US
for spite is a losing proposition.

> You may be interested to learn that a slew of companies signed an amicus
> brief in Washington v. Trump[1], including:

Look up the definition of "amicus curaie".

Anyhow, legal avenues are fair game. But actively hurting the American economy
to prove a point will only turn public perception against them. Americans
(heck, even those on HN) are already weary of how much power companies like
Google, Facebook, Microsoft, Apple, Uber, etc... have over them...

~~~
__derek__
> Trump has already stated his desire to apply tariffs to companies that
> operate outside the US, assuming he follows through

And he'll need lots of luck getting both Republican-controlled bodies of
Congress to pass those tariffs.

> moving employees outside the US for spite is a losing proposition

It doesn't have to be spite. Doing so out of practicality (see, e.g.,
companies' increasing their presence in Vancouver) is a more effective
statement, anyway.

> Look up the definition of "amicus curaie".

Is there anything in particular you want me to learn?

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cyberferret
As an Australian resident, but of sub-continental descent, I am re-evaluating
travel plans to visit the US again. Love the place, have friends and
colleagues there, but just not wanting to put up with the risks & hassle
involved.

It is interesting that a Middle Eastern carrier is reporting a drop like this.
It would be a good exercise to compare the ME->USA travel statistic against
their other routes. I know that Emirates is a popular carrier here (Australia)
to get to Europe etc. Also would be interesting to corroborate against
statistics from Qantas, Cathay Pacific etc. as well as other ME carriers like
Etihad.

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beezischillin
I do get that websites need advertising to survive, however 100% volume
autoplaying ads with dubstep, I could seriously live without. (and I like
electronic music.)

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Iv
I just don't want to have an algorithmic test handled to me at the border and
risk deportation if I don't get the answer "right". Canada is fine.

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enbbaatran
Honestly I cannot see why anyone would want to visit the USA these days. It
sounds like you're "welcomed" with an intrusive interrogation and if you get
through that you have to endure:

* the world's crappiest food, and too much of it

* loud, raspy, nasal voices

* constant risk of being shot

OK the country looks beautiful but you can get stunning natural scenery
elsewhere on the planet with added culture

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fuckoffmate
you might try actually visiting and finding those aren't truthful :)

Most people I've found who think that are young and poor or left, how
perspective changes once you escape that!

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christofosho
"Or left"...

People are not political opinions. Not to get into a debate here, but neither
of you are providing evidence for your claims, and relying on confirmation
bias is not a good way to prove something.

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sandworm101
Know who really cares? Not Emirates or airlines. Talk to Disneyworld. Talk to
real estate agents who are seeing middle east buyers heading to Vancouver and
London rather than New York. Emirates delivers the people but the real loss is
to those doing business with those people once they land.

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vanjoe
Is Vancouver really in the class of london and new York? (I've lived my whole
life in a Vancouver suburb, and I'm curious how the world views us)

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sandworm101
It depends. The city isn't great for locals, but the overseas investor sees
different things. They look for stability and ease of entry. A good airport,
reasonable immigration and stable house prices. Even the local efforts to
stabilize prices through the new taxes are seen as safe in that they reduce
the chance of a bubble burst. If you are looking for a place to park money in
real estate, Vancouver is on the short list. If you are a local looking for
work or wanting to start a business, that is a totally different story.

