
Association of low to moderate alcohol drinking with better cognitive function - hirundo
https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamanetworkopen/fullarticle/2767693
======
kleinsch
Not sure about this exact study, but studies like this usually ignore
confounding factors that cause people to abstain. The headline leads people to
think that they should drink a bit to achieve the result, but that’s usually
never the case.

For example there were a bunch of studies about how sleeping 10 hours per
night has lower mortality rate than sleeping 12+ hours (oh no - are you
sleeping too much?!?), but upon further review they realized that people who
are really sick or alcoholics are more likely to sleep 12+ hours per night.

In this case, wouldn’t be surprised if there are reasons people fit into the
zero drink category (health issues) that are associated with cognitive
decline.

~~~
Scaevolus
Many studies like this don't exclude abstaining alcoholics that _used_ to be
heavy drinkers, so you'll get strange results like "people drinking no alcohol
are more likely to get liver cancer than moderate drinkers".

------
jedimind
That's quite the dangerous trade-off. Doubt that it's worth it:

"Countless scientific studies have espoused the idea that a glass of red wine
a day can be good for the heart, but a new, sweeping global study published in
The Lancet on Friday rejects the notion that any drinking can be healthy.

No amount of alcohol is safe, according to The Global Burden of Diseases
study, which analyzed levels of alcohol use and its health effects in 195
countries from 1990 to 2016."

[Source: [https://www.npr.org/2018/08/24/641618937/no-amount-of-
alcoho...](https://www.npr.org/2018/08/24/641618937/no-amount-of-alcohol-is-
good-for-your-health-global-study-claims)]

~~~
henearkr
Probably the "healthy" part of red wine is resveratrol, but in this case you
can just have resveratrol in red grape (whole or its juice) or even in
supplements.

~~~
orev
Grapes (and especially grape juice!) are probably not much better. They
wouldn’t have the carcinogenic alcohol, but they have enormous amounts of
sugar, which causes its own large set of health problems.

~~~
biolurker1
Fructose from fruits is not considered bad unless you have a source

~~~
henearkr
I think that the precise reason is that when it comes from fruits fructose is
always accompanied by fibers, even in juices.

Purified fructose is probably not very good.

------
wcoenen
Correlation is not causation. For example, having a healthy social life may
promote both alcohol consumption and cognitive function.

~~~
orev
You can’t have causation without correlation.

Not saying that’s that case here, but people like to casually throw around
“correlation is not causation” as if pointing out the logical fallacy is
itself a sufficient rebuttal.

~~~
wcoenen
I didn't really mean it as a "rebuttal", as the paper is careful about not
claiming any causal link.

I meant it as a warning to the reader to be careful about drawing conclusions
like that. To establish causation you'd need a study where alcohol consumption
of the subjects is controlled by the experimenters. That would eliminate the
effect of confounding factors that influence both alcohol consumption and
cognitive function.

------
vezycash
Or the study is studying something else: self control i.e. those who can take
alcohol without becoming addicted.

Additionally, if we're to take the view that stressed mammals seek out mind
altering substances, then this can be said to be a study of well-being.

~~~
serpix
when you grow older alcohol switches from being pleasant to being perceived as
a poisoning. Two beers and I feel ill, like something is wrong with me and I
cannot drink more.

~~~
jshaqaw
I’m sure there is truth in that. I also find that life responsibilities may
also account for some of that. At 21 I could have a few drinks at night and
then just be sluggish the next day. Now between kids and career those downkey
recovery days are a lot harder to absorb!

------
ag56
My pet theory is alcohol helps us build and maintain relationships. And whilst
even a little alcohol harms us, the physiological benefits of having a strong
social group out weigh that harm.

~~~
rmdashrfstar
Are you sure you’re building anything foundational if you need to be drinking
for it to occur?

~~~
_se
Yep, try it some time. Believe it or not, reducing inhibitions helps build
close friendships by making is easier for people to get to know one another.
Who could've guessed?!?

~~~
rmdashrfstar
It’s simply unbelievable!

------
rybosworld
I've read other studies that suggest as you go higher up the IQ ladder, people
are more likely to partake in drug/alcohol use. I'd be willing to bet they've
stumbled upon the same phenomenon here but they've got the causation
backwards.

------
lopmotr
There's also a large study showing that binge drinking in early pregnancy is
beneficial for the child's IQ. But the only statistically significant result
was if it was done in the first 2 gestational weeks which turns out to mean
"before fertilization".

However, there are so many confounding variables it's not funny. One
interesting thing they controlled for was the mother's binge drinking habits
because binge drinking mothers tend to have higher IQ than non-binge-drinking
mothers.

------
rmdashrfstar
I’m just waiting to read “This research was funded in part by the Molson Coors
Brewing Company”.

Ask HN: Should I start drinking regularly?

~~~
Arnt
It was funded by the Friends of a Mediterranean Diet Society ;)

Make a proper dinner every day, with actual ingredients, eat it in peace, with
a glass of wine. It'll do you good, and leave separating the effect of the
wine from the effect of the other mediterranean staples to the pedants.

[https://www.amazon.com/fnord/dp/0091925320](https://www.amazon.com/fnord/dp/0091925320)
for example.

~~~
jedimind
The scientific research I read doesn't agree with that:

"Countless scientific studies have espoused the idea that a glass of red wine
a day can be good for the heart, but a new, sweeping global study published in
The Lancet on Friday rejects the notion that any drinking can be healthy.

No amount of alcohol is safe, according to The Global Burden of Diseases
study, which analyzed levels of alcohol use and its health effects in 195
countries from 1990 to 2016.

While the study's authors say that moderate drinking may safeguard people
against heart disease, they found that the potential to develop cancer and
other diseases offsets these potential benefits, as do other risks of harm.
The report urges governments to revise health guidelines to suggest lower
levels of consumption."

[Source: [https://www.npr.org/2018/08/24/641618937/no-amount-of-
alcoho...](https://www.npr.org/2018/08/24/641618937/no-amount-of-alcohol-is-
good-for-your-health-global-study-claims)]

~~~
Arnt
I've seen such studies too, and I'm sure that with sufficient discipline, you
could manage something like a mediterranean diet (rich in pasta dishes, fruit,
vegetables, low but not zero on meat) but without wine, without pancetta,
without mozzarella, etc. But I don't think that's what mostly happens. The
friends I've had over the years who started focusing on avoidance either
failed (by giving up the attempt) or eventually ate mostly prefab food.
Without alcohol, to be sure.

Anecdote alert: I'm sure abstaining from alcohol hasn't hurt the acquaintance
I saw this weekend, but she doesn't look healthy. She's focused on abstention,
and IMNSHO a focus on abstention is not the path to a well-rounded diet.

Neither is a beer can and a bag of peanuts, of course.

------
twic
The crucial numbers:

> Low to moderate drinking (<8 drinks per week for women and <15 drinks per
> week for men)

'Drink' doesn't appear to be a standard amount of alcohol; the numbers are
from self-reporting, so I suppose it could be a half of shandy, a stein of
doppelbock, or anything in between.

~~~
dchest
There is a standard drink (differs by country, I believe UK even has labels
showing the amount of standard drinks contained) -
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_drink](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standard_drink)

This study is from US, so:

“For example, in the United States, a standard drink contains about 14 grams
of alcohol“

Not sure if that’s what subjects reported, though. But I guess MDs, PHds and
reviewers would have taken it into account.

------
sangfroid_bio
Does JAMA network handle the journal translations or are they done by the
authors?

------
ardit33
Obligatory chart:

Ballmer Peak [https://xkcd.com/323/](https://xkcd.com/323/)

Since alcohol is a suppressants, I think in low doses it calms down some parts
of the brain that are normally hyperactive, and lets other parts take over.

I personally code better after a beer/cocktail late at night.... maybe two,
but not more. It seems that alcohol helps my brain to concentrate at night
only. For some reason never during the day. It kinda ruins my productive day
if I have any during the day (during lunch/brunch, for example).

~~~
f1refly
I have that very same effect. I'd like to explore if it's only placebo, but
unfortunately you can't really self-study because you already know if you're
intoxicating yourself or not...

