
Reality we perceive is a sequence of interactions produced by a collapsed chaos - r4nd0m_jump
I will use word &#x27;interaction&#x27; instead of &#x27;observation&#x27;.<p>We are very limited by language we use, so picking terms we use to describe certain phenomena is very important. We can&#x27;t always pick the best one, some things can&#x27;t be easily described. That&#x27;s why we have abstract tools like math to approach this.<p>Observation happens and ends. Interaction can lead to another interaction, leaving more degrees of freedom and possible states.<p>I imagine underlying fields being and interacting in such way that it defines quantum properties of particles and their further interactions.<p>Everything is chaos, it just depends on which side of chaos you happen to be.<p>When particle interacts with something else (other particle) fields produce interaction based on previously collapsed chaos, other interactions follow further collapsing chaos in a tree (branching like) structure.<p>What we describe as our reality is a result of a sequence on interactions, a collapse of infinite probabilities into a single sequence as governed by underlying structure of fields.<p>When you look through the window what you see is what is one of infinite number of possible realities. You see the one that is allowed by underlying quantum field structure.
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quickthrower2
Are you asserting this?:

[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Many-
worlds_interpretation](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Many-
worlds_interpretation)

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r4nd0m_jump
I think this goes much deeper, it tries to explain randomness in quantum
realm. That's interesting thing to think about. What I say is, ok there is
randomness, and you have these quantum behaviors of particles, how do you end
up perceiving reality. I think that every bit of reality is one possible
branch of random choices made according to structure and constraints of
quantum fields. I would say that different fields are like funnels for degrees
of freedom of quantum interactions.

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hhs
Could all this be within a system? Would there be edges or boundaries?

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r4nd0m_jump
I think the key to answering your question is to try to explain space which is
very hard with our human evolved intuition.

We acquired so strong intuition about space, edges and boundaries. I tend to
think that space we have available in the universe is again result of current
state and degrees of freedom in which inherent randomness can be channeled.

It also has memory in quantum fields, that's why we don't collapse into
singularity all the time.

Also I think that inherent randomness is unbounded meaning that it can produce
space as long as it is possible due to quantum field structure and properties
we happen to have.

Other quantum field configurations might have different smaller or bigger
universes, but I think they all feed on the same source of inherent
randomness.

Why I think there are other universes, well simply because evolution as a
process has proven to be very efficient in finding solutions in a large search
space, not only in biology. Thus quantum field structures might be a result of
many evolutionary iterations even before time we know began. Majority of which
probably doesn't allow for a Universe like ours, some Universes might got even
luckier who knows :)

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hhs
Interesting response.

This makes me think of the concept of cognitive closure in philosophy. In
essence, humans can understand things only up to a limit in the chain of
evolution - just like an animal, for example, an ant can "understand" things
only up to its limit. This provides a better context:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_closure_(philosophy)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cognitive_closure_\(philosophy\)).

Is this something similar to what you mean?

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r4nd0m_jump
Yes exactly. Thanks for bringing that up!

Mental models humans create for different things like space and time, are
heavily influenced by the structure of our brain neural network and previous
experience. I would say that structure however plays much greater role in
creating mental models in compare to experience. Not sure if a research exists
on this subject? Probably yes? Findings would definitely be interesting to
make further conclusions on cognitive closures regarding humans.

I think the main weapon for shaping and playing with our mental models is
abstraction and reduction. With these we might be able to extend the limits of
our understanding of things beyond what we inherited from out evolutionary
history.

That way we developed tools like mathematics which further enables us to prove
theories completely opposing "common sense" and intuition.

I think we have preconditions to extend our limits of understanding
significantly. What do you think?

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hhs
Good points.

I do wonder about the "unknown unknowns" of tools that are accessible to
humans. You mention one tool: "mathematics which further enables us to prove
theories completely opposing "common sense" and intuition."

I'm curious if humans are closed off to advanced tools. For instance, an ant
is closed off to the tools accessible to us (i.e., math and science). Does
evolution need to move forward, for instance, via emergence (i.e.,
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emergence](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emergence)),
and construct new species? And will these new species be able to tap into more
advanced tools?

You also write, "I think we have preconditions to extend our limits of
understanding significantly." It could be. For instance, are humans at a level
now where they're able to advance brain parts, structures, or wirings and
manually be able to "extend our limits of understanding"? It's possible. I
think this is where we get back into the "unknown unknowns" territory and how
evolved we are in tapping into and changing the limits of cognitive closure.

I do wonder where we are in terms of evolution. Is it possible that there are
gaps in our knowledge of evolution? There are theories like "panspermia",
which opens up evolution to a unique scale and I wonder how this might play a
role in our understanding of cognitive closure.

Any thoughts on empirical literature that talks more about the role of
evolution and how different species are cognitively closed off to certain
tools?

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qnsi
Man, just live your life. Stop trying to figure this shit out, it’s impossible

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r4nd0m_jump
I enjoy life more when I figure out stuff like this.

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zunzun
How then are the effects of hallucinogens accounted for?

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r4nd0m_jump
Good question

Those are higher level triggers affecting visual cortex.

Ultimately in order to perceive reality visually, photon needs to interact
with your eye machinery (again on quantum level) resulting in nerve impulses
being sent to your visual cortex, which decodes and interprets visual signals.

Hallucinogens mess with the chemistry of the brain affecting how it interprets
reality.

Although those are higher level triggers they do not bypass quantum part,
different reality gets created due to different chemistry in the synapses of
the brain.

To conclude, event when you are hallucinating you are experiencing reality but
in a messed up way.

