
macOS 10.12 Sierra: The Ars Technica review - mercutio2
http://arstechnica.com/apple/2016/09/macos-10-12-sierra-the-ars-technica-review/
======
colemannerd
I feel the biggest disappointment in Sierra that this review didn't really
harp on is the lack of new features for non-iOS users. There's not that much
in this update and the end user features that are available right now are
solely focused on iPhone users. As an android user, I can't use siri on a day
to day basis, I can't do automatic unlock with my watch, etc. You'd suspect
that most mac users have iPhones, but that's not been my experience since most
developers use mac but also use android.

~~~
jws
The Photos upgrade for "moments" is quite nice, assuming you use Photos to
store your photos.

The storage upgrade where they can remove forgotten debris files and then
migrate your unused files to the cloud is great for most people.

I realize most HN readers have already drawn their saber and are 2/3rds over
the gunwale at my suggestion that a computer make a decision about the
disposition of a file, but this one feature is going to reduce my "friends and
family tech support debt" by about 75%. A couple of clicks and I can fix their
full computer. In the process of that I have quietly gotten them to backup
their documents to the cloud so when I get the "my computer won't turn on"
call I don't have to spend hours extracting and recovering their hard drive
because they NEVER backup. Thanks to "apps", I can finally convince people
that paying $1.99/mo for cloud storage isn't some evil plan to loot the world
economy. People are used to small payments for computer services.

~~~
CJefferson
The 'migrate to the cloud' is no good for backups -- it doesn't put files in
the cloud which you actually use regularly!

~~~
mhurron
No sync service is good for backing up. Delete it locally and it's deleted
remotely, same with making edits to a file.

~~~
toomuchtodo
Dropbox. I disable syncing for certain files, and its only stored in Dropbox.
I need access again without using a web browser? I turn on syncing for that
folder again and the files are synced back locally within a few seconds to
minutes.

I priced out getting an external SSD drive ($300 for 1TB). Its cheaper for me
to just buy a year of Dropbox at a time (1TB @ $100/year if paid annually).

[https://www.dropbox.com/en/help/113](https://www.dropbox.com/en/help/113)

~~~
totalrobe
Why would you compare the cost of an SSD in this case?

You can get a good 1TB HDD for $50.

~~~
toomuchtodo
A mechanical drive is more likely to fail if exposed to shock or magnetic
fields; unless its safely encased in a rack in a datacenter, its not an
acceptable form of data storage.

~~~
michaelmrose
Citation needed. You don't need for the drive to never ever go bad you just
need for primary and backup not to fail in the time window required to replace
the drive. Most of planet earth relies primarily on magnetic storage including
people outside the data center.

~~~
toomuchtodo
I need citations that mechanical drives will fail from shock or magnetic
fields? I'm not going to waste my time googling references for that.

> Most of planet earth relies primarily on magnetic storage including people
> outside the data center.

Right. And I'm arguing SSDs are sturdier in that regard when not safe in a
chassis somewhere. SSDs can withstand higher shock forces, have no glass
platters or mechanical arms that can contact each other, and are not affected
by magnetic fields.

~~~
Tiksi
It takes quite a bit of shock force [1] and a pretty insane magnetic field [2]
to damage rust.

Also you could buy 2 6tb hdds [3] for the price of that single ssd and mirror
them for another level of redundancy, so in my book they come out way ahead of
ssds and cloud storage for backup/archival purposes.

1: [http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/a-sturdy-
companion,758-2...](http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/a-sturdy-
companion,758-2.html)

2: [http://superuser.com/questions/568336/what-is-the-
tolerable-...](http://superuser.com/questions/568336/what-is-the-tolerable-
magnetic-field-in-tesla-for-a-hard-disk)

3: [https://smile.amazon.com/Marshal-7200RPM-Internal-
MAL36000NS...](https://smile.amazon.com/Marshal-7200RPM-Internal-
MAL36000NS-T72-Especia%EF%BD%8Cly/dp/B01AU6IOSS/)

------
whitecarpet
At the end of the review, the author also complains about Apple neglecting Mac
hardware which 'is no longer running circles around the rest of the PC
industry'.

I had the same thoughts a few weeks ago—I needed to buy a new notebook and
coming from many years on several Macbook Pros, I was disappointed that Apple
hasn't done any significant refreshes for years. So, I decided just to get a
nice Thinkpad and put Ubuntu or Windows on it. This journey—and it was a
journey taking weeks—was infuriating and I realized that Apple is still way
ahead, even with three years old hardware.

To make it short: I faced so many frustrations on the other side just to buy a
non-Apple notebook. I lost so much time with find the right notebook that I
finally decided for a three year old Macbook Pro maxed out with a Intel quad
core HQ CPU—which runs circles around all current notebooks, performance-wise
and battery-wise, even the just launched Kaby Lake U series.

Here just a few of these disappointments which brought me back to a 'coasting
platform' as the author says: even the best trackpads in the non-Apple-world
are still crap, Thinkpad suffer from display lottery (two suppliers two
qualities), displays not matching Apple quality and brightness, PWM for
brightness control, hidpi screens are still not fully supported by the OS as
on macOS, on Windows it's ok, on Ubuntu so-so, but never the consistent
crispiness of macOS, good non-Apple-hardware is not cheaper, Thinkpads can get
really, really expensive, too much choice with little difference, worse
quality control, battery-time never matches Apple's, very often tacky designs
(except Thinkpads), innovation takes wrong direction (who needs 2-in-1s), 5K
display support (Windows is kind of capable, Linux not), wake-up problems
(notebooks don't come back from sleep and if something is not working,
trackpad, Wifi, etc.)...

It's often very small stuff but my notebook is my daily driver and it's
shocking that a three year old MBP still crushes all brand new notebooks from
competitors.

~~~
NovaS1X
I see this train of thought in Apple-centric forums like MacRumors and here on
HN. The typical "I can't believe Apple is doing X!" or the "Why hasn't Apple
upgraded X yet, Apple is dead! I'm moving to X company now".

I work in IT. I see and use many different laptops all the time. These people
really don't get how bad a lot of the other options are, even when they look
great on the companies marketing page.

The reality is that innovation in laptops died when the tablet and phone boom
took the market by storm. Apple hasn't been innovating with the Mac, but
neither has anyone else. Any new MacBook Pro will be just another step above
the already steaming pile of trash that the majority of "PC" laptops are.

------
overcast
Just a heads up, for anyone running the now "unsupported" 2008 MacPro's,
MacBooks, and the like.

[http://dosdude1.com/sierrapatch.html](http://dosdude1.com/sierrapatch.html)

Worked perfectly for me. Patches the installer, reboot, install as normal,
reboot, run the post patch stuff, reboot. done.

Been running the GM release for the past week with zero issues on my Early
2008.

~~~
no_protocol
It seems like there are a lot of tools, patches, and installers in the
Hackintosh/"not quite supported Mac" realm that are supposed to be blindly
trusted by users. It's like a few guys figure something out and release a fix
but they are rarely explained or documented.

Do you know if there is a forum thread or mailing list or site documenting
what this program does with source available?

~~~
s_kilk
Reminds me of the android scene, loads of random forum posts, zips uploaded to
rapidshare and blind trust in hacked installers.

It's been a few years since I last built a hackintosh though.

~~~
overcast
The newest patcher, downloads the installer straight from Apple for you, and
then you patch that.

------
JoshGlazebrook
"And finally, Apple Watch unlocking also requires 802.11ac Wi-Fi because of
the way the software determines the distance between your watch and your Mac.
That list includes:

MacBook (Early 2015 and later) iMac (Late 2013 and later) MacBook Air (Mid
2013 and later) MacBook Pro (Late 2013 and later) Mac Mini (Late 2014) Mac Pro
(Late 2013)"

I have a Mid-2012 Retina Macbook Pro, and I actually upgraded the wifi card to
the one in the Late 2013 because I wanted 802.11AC (It's one of the few things
that are not soldered to the board). It works without any issue, I wonder if
it will work with this apple watch unlock feature.

~~~
newman314
This mcard is supposed to work on unsupported Macs. I personally do not care
for the mobility features as I do not use iCloud so YMMV.

[http://www.quickertek.com/products/mCard.html](http://www.quickertek.com/products/mCard.html)

~~~
snuxoll
Save yourself some money and just buy this: [https://www.amazon.com/SEENIGHT-
Bcm94360cs2-Bcm94360cs2ax-Bl...](https://www.amazon.com/SEENIGHT-
Bcm94360cs2-Bcm94360cs2ax-Bluetooth-
Wireless/dp/B01F3I300U/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1474472939&sr=8-1&keywords=BCM94360CS2)

Apple uses bog-standard Broadcom wireless chips for their AirPort Extreme
cards, this one is advertised as "mac-compatible" but any of the BCM943X cards
will work as long as they are standard mini-PCIe cards.

~~~
JoshGlazebrook
Same kind of thing, but for the retina macbooks make sure you get one like
this: [https://www.amazon.com/SEENIGHT-
Bluetooth-653-0029-BCM94360C...](https://www.amazon.com/SEENIGHT-
Bluetooth-653-0029-BCM94360CSAX-
BCM94360CS/dp/B01F3G92C2/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1474473438&sr=8-1&keywords=BCM94360CS)

The retina macbook pro has 3 antennas for 3x3 MIMO, the one you linked to only
has two.

This is really only needed if you have the 2012 retina macbook pro as they
didn't switch to 802.11AC chips until 2013.

------
killbrad
So unless I want to use Siri on my computer (I don't) or tighter integration
with iPhones (which I don't use), this update brings mostly nothing of
significance.

~~~
nicky0
Yes and as a Mac developer, thank god for that. None of my apps broke this
year!

~~~
heartbreak
Seems you don't use Seil or Karabiner. Lucky.

~~~
Kudos
I'm sure they mean the apps they made, not the apps they use.

------
Gimpson
It was unclear to me from the review, does the Spotlight Siri integration now
let us type "Remind me to put out the trash cans when I get home" in Spotlight
and have it perform the same action Siri would have done? I feel like for the
couple of things that Siri parses well, it's way easier to use than the app
itself, but I'm not going to speak into my computer in my open-plan office.

~~~
pboutros
No, it doesn't receive text input, just voice right now.

~~~
pavlov
That's a strange design choice.

~~~
thesmok
Well if you are going to use keyboard anyway, why not just create a reminder
yourself instead of asking Siri to do it?

~~~
MarkMc
Because I don't know how to create a reminder in macOS, but I know how to type
a sentence

------
yokohummer7
> if you’ve got a Mac with a fan and that fan is currently spinning loudly,
> triggering Siri will slow it down so that the fan noise doesn’t interfere as
> much with your speech.

These kinds of small details make me happy. Nice touch as usual, Apple.

------
apocalyptic0n3
If you're running any Logitech hardware, specifically mice, I recommend
waiting to upgrade. Numerous issues have been reported (see [1][2][3]). For my
Marathon M705 mouse, I cannot use back/forward and scrolling is only half
working, plus the Logitech Control Center is crashing randomly and actually
uninstalled itself this morning without warning, which is always cool.

[1]:
[https://community.logitech.com/s/question/0D53100005UytQy](https://community.logitech.com/s/question/0D53100005UytQy)

[2]: [http://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/253784/logitech-
mou...](http://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/253784/logitech-mouse-
scrolling-weird-after-sierra-update-soggy-inertia-effect-in-nati)

[3]:
[https://community.logitech.com/s/question/0D53100005UPFcp](https://community.logitech.com/s/question/0D53100005UPFcp)

~~~
veidr
Various Logitech gear has broken (sometimes grayscreening the entire Mac just
by existing) with every major OS X update ov the last half dozen or so.

Most of these issues can be solved by using a third-party driver and never
installing any of the Logitech software.

------
syncsynchalt
I'm fascinated by this line: "In macOS Sierra, ECN is enabled for 50 percent
of TCP sessions. So should you run into a creaky old firewall that hasn't been
updated in the past decade and a half (it happens), then clicking the link
again will probably solve the issue."

Introducing congestion features to a network is always scary (you can
blackhole your clients and even trigger unintended behavior that affects the
health of the network) but introducing non-determinism in your TCP connections
seems like an odd way to do it.

~~~
glhaynes
See also their previous non-deterministic usage of IPv4 vs. IPv6:
[http://arstechnica.com/apple/2015/09/os-x-10-11-el-
capitan-t...](http://arstechnica.com/apple/2015/09/os-x-10-11-el-capitan-the-
ars-technica-review/11/) (paragraph that starts with "When an iOS 9 or OS X
10.11 application")

------
api
I don't see "second fiddle to iOS" as _necessarily_ a terrible thing.

OSX is a fine operating system. It's stable, strikes a great compromise
between power, security, and ease of use, and is useful for pretty much
anything you want to do with a present-day desktop.

I personally want Apple to keep it _mostly_ the same but polish it, make it
more secure (without making it less useful!), and improve things like
stability and performance. Other than that I'm fine with it as-is.

~~~
xufi
Same here, Granted (I just moved to it really 3 years ago) I really wish they
also paused OS release/delay them a bit longer. By looking back on older
versions, I wish we had another Snow Leopard like version since some of the
latest releases seem to be not completely polished but I welcome the new
features as well

------
israrkhan
With Siri in macOS, Cortana in Windows 10, and Google Now in chrome.. The
operating systems have turned into data mining software. This is an alarming
trend. Companies are no longer making money from operating systems by selling
licenses, but using their software platforms for harvesting personal user
data. Cross-device and cross-browser tracking is catching up. And the worse
part is that majority of consumers don't really have a choice

~~~
agmcleod
How does voice dictation enable data capture that wasnt already doable before?
They already have calendar apps, browsers for web searches. The things you
type pipe through the OS already. I'm not saying your concerns aren't valid,
just that I don't see how these make it more about data mining.

~~~
israrkhan
voice dictations were local. The data you stored in calendar did not go to
cloud, and even if it did, nobody correlated your calendar with your web
searches or your location. Various pieces of data existed in their own Silos,
without needlessly going to cloud.

These personal assistants are combining data from all sources (your contacts,
location, search history, calendar, across devices) , correlating and storing
it in one place to build a personality profile. This has huge privacy
implications.

------
blakesterz
Quite a bit written there on APFS:

[http://arstechnica.com/apple/2016/09/macos-10-12-sierra-
the-...](http://arstechnica.com/apple/2016/09/macos-10-12-sierra-the-ars-
technica-review/7/#h1)

 _Sounds_ like it's going to be awesome, especially the snapshots and clones.

(I love that the author of this review has B.A. in Classics from Kenyon
College and he records a weekly book podcast.)

~~~
FullyFunctional
I can't be the only one who is massively disappointed that, not only did we
not get ZFS, but APFS forgoes the most important feature - data checksumming -
with a snobby hand-wave of "trust us", yet includes it for meta data.

Sure, APFS is a tremendous improvement over HFS+ (Hardly Fail Safe), but such
as missed opportunity.

------
rleigh
Did they update the FreeBSD userland? The neglect to the core of the system
the last few years has gotten increasingly more annoying to deal with. There
are now glaring incompatibilities due to the age of a lot of the core tools.
Stuff as basic as "readlink -f" works everywhere except on MacOS, simply
because they haven't bothered to update it in a decade...

It also looks like the OpenGL support is untouched for yet another release
from the article, and that's another pain point for me, since it's the poorest
supported of all major platforms at this point.

------
cmsimike
I was mostly disappointed with Siri on macOS - there is no homekit support.
The dream of sitting on my computer and verbally turning off the lights was
premature. I still have to reach for my phone =/

Everything else Siri could do seems a bit pointless (to me) on a computer. The
latency added by asking Siri to do something makes using keyboard and mouse
much quicker, I feel.

~~~
blowski
Not just you asking, but Apple processing it while you wait to see whether it
understood correctly.

The only time I use Siri is calling people when I'm wearing gloves. I don't
see it changing on a computer.

My biggest problem with Siri is that half the time it feels like muttering
magical incantations - get the words in the wrong order and the spell doesn't
work.

------
STRML
Be aware: Sierra breaks Karabiner and Seil. You'll need to use Karabiner-
Elements, which has far less functionality than Karabiner. Notably, you can't
remap caps lock and you can't assign to more than 2 keys, so caps-lock "hyper"
is out.

~~~
thesmok
You _can_ remap Caps Lock. It's even in the
[readme]([https://github.com/tekezo/Karabiner-
Elements/blob/master/usa...](https://github.com/tekezo/Karabiner-
Elements/blob/master/usage/README.md#change-key)). I was using Seil on El
Capitan and after upgrading to Sierra I went to the Seil website and I see it
says "use Karabiner elements now". Ok, I uninstalled Seil, installed Karabiner
elements, got configuration example from readme file and it works as it did
before. I use it to switch keyboard languages with Caps Lock key.

~~~
STRML
That's great to know. So all that's missing is the ability to map more than 2
keys so we can get `hyper` back.

Seems this is the place to look: [https://github.com/tekezo/Karabiner-
Elements/blob/master/src...](https://github.com/tekezo/Karabiner-
Elements/blob/master/src/core/grabber/include/manipulator/event_manipulator.hpp)

------
rch
The only compelling 'feature' of this release, is that now I won't have to
deal with most of software I use telling me I need to upgrade.

------
cycomachead
I miss John Siracusa's reviews.

This is a fine review, but not a Siracusa Review.

------
jorgecastillo
I miss Snow Leopard and I miss pre-iPhone Apple!

------
hackbinary
As much as I like Mac OS X, when does Mac OS XI come out? (I've been using it
since the first pre-release).

~~~
CGamesPlay
It doesn't. They dropped the X. It's 'macOS Sierra' now.

------
xhruso00
Have they finally updated packages like php and ruby? They were so outdated in
10.10/10.11

~~~
itafroma
> Have they finally updated packages like php and ruby?

PHP:

> ▶ /usr/bin/php -v

> PHP 5.6.24 (cli) (built: Aug 8 2016 16:58:37)

> Copyright (c) 1997-2016 The PHP Group

> Zend Engine v2.6.0, Copyright (c) 1998-2016 Zend Technologies

Ruby:

> ▶ /usr/bin/ruby -v

> ruby 2.0.0p648 (2015-12-16 revision 53162) [universal.x86_64-darwin16]

~~~
xhruso00
+1 for PHP

/usr/bin/php -v

PHP 5.5.36 (cli) (built: May 29 2016 01:07:06) (10/11)

-1 for ruby (2.3.1 is the recommended now)

ruby 2.0.0p648 (2015-12-16 revision 53162) [universal.x86_64-darwin15] (10/11)

------
gcatalfamo
No useful new features for power users...I am a bit disappointed.

~~~
nicky0
I guess you won't be buying it then.

~~~
CJefferson
No I won't, I spend the day downgrading my machine back to El Capitan (first
time I've ever done an OS downgrade).

Also, unless things improve rapidly, my next machine won't be a mac.

~~~
nicky0
You were so offended by lack of new features that you actually downgraded?

I suspect there must be more to it than that.

~~~
CJefferson
No, I downgraded because cocoa builds of emacs randomly crash (fixed in git
head), as does TeXShop (not obviously fixed yet). Also some other apps weren't
running because of gatekeeper changes I didn't bother to investigate
seriously.

The lack of new features meant that I had no motivation to try to fix my
problems / run git heads of software / figure out gatekeeper.

