

Ask HN: How did you find your company & job? - vrikhter

So this may seem like a simple question, but how did you find the company you are working at now?  I've been using: crunchbase, linkedin, reading techcrunch, etc as well as a ton of coffees, beers, 'career advice' meetings.  Every time I find a company I go through an extensive search of who works there, what they do, what the demand is for their product, etc.  This helps for discovery, but of course will inevitably help during the interview.<p>I know there are many companies that I am still missing.  Is there a service out there (not recruiters) that can play matchmaker with the characteristics that I am looking for in a company?
======
zacclark
I was waiting in line for an iPhone 3G when someone called out "I need a web
developer, who's interested?". We talked for a few minutes in line, then I did
an interview the next day.

I'm still working with them now.

~~~
vrikhter
Ha, best story yet!

------
apike
I got my job at Apple from the 37signals job board. Today is my last day, but
it was a great experience. (Wish me luck with my new startup!)

The employment inquiries and offers I've received from startups in the past
have mostly come through meetups and events I've attended or organized. Figure
out where the smart people are congregating and go have some beers with them.

~~~
tjarratt
As another former Apple employee that left for a startup, I feel compelled to
say congratulations and good luck.

Hope you enjoy your new life!

(on topic) Meetups and events are perfect ways to find job opportunities, as
long as you're willing to put in some effort. Any time you can show off your
skills, some app you wrote, or provide advice for someone else, you are
impressing people and proving your worth.

------
GBKS
Researched the top companies all over the US and then researched how the top
people in the industry present themselves and what their portfolios look like.
There's a lot of random browsing involved in that, but also just knowing who's
good by having followed the industry over time. Job boards are also a good
starting point.

Then I built the best portfolio site possible based on the research. It was
slightly customized per company, for examples with a simple "Welcome Company
X" which (I think) made a good impression.

Then, sent out the links via email to around 20 companies and tried to follow
up as much as possible without seeming pushy. Some people responded after two
weeks, some didn't. My current company responded within a day. Within 3 days,
they had sent me a test, I finished it and sent it back, we had negotiations
and I had accepted their offer. Two weeks later I moved from San Diego to NYC.
Their responsiveness and professionalism was a big plus.

I've been reviewing portfolios for years, but have had terrible experiences
with recruiters. They do a great job at hyping people up, only to let you down
when you look at the actual work done. So we're posting a lot on industry
forums, Twitter, etc and also asking for recommendations through employees and
friends to find new people.

------
smwhreyebelong
HN "Who's hiring", linkedin jobs, even craigslist.

My personal experience with recruiters has not been as good as I would have
liked. The recruiters I dealt with mostly did keyword searches on technologies
and experience (e.g C++ dev with 3 yrs of experience) ignoring the other
skills (teamwork, passion, how excited the person is about the company, etc.)
Most recruiters use means that the companies themselves could use(LinkedIn,
job boards, etc.) If the founders of the startup are not willing to invest
time to find the talent and rather pay hefty fees to the recruiters, not sure
if I would want to work for that startup anyway.

The ideal company would be one that you just "come across" than go out
looking. For example, a product you heard about somewhere that got you really
excited, or an idea that you had and while searching for who is working in
that space, you find a company that was doing something very similar.

~~~
vrikhter
I agree with you on the recruiters point, heck most searching through resumes
today is keyword based. Wouldn't it make sense to have something similar to
match.com for employers and employees?

~~~
smwhreyebelong
I agree that it's all keyword based. I think it's because machines can only
capture the objective factors of a job search. Things like : "will you get
along with the team", do you like the people you'd be working with, etc are
very subjective and not easily captured by computers.

Meeting people at events, getting recommendations from other people you trust
allow one to evaluate the position at a much more subjective level and make an
estimation of the human-elements of working at the startup.

------
rictic
Shortly after moving to the bay area – knowing exactly zero people for a
hundred miles – someone linked to freebase on reddit. I found what they were
doing so compelling that I volunteered on their message board[1]. They saw
that I was local and invited me down for lunch.

One of the best things that's ever happened to me.

1]
[http://lists.freebase.com/pipermail/developers/2007-Septembe...](http://lists.freebase.com/pipermail/developers/2007-September/000628.html)

------
Xurinos
One time, I decided I wanted a software job in a specific remote area. I
connected with numerous recruiters to maximize my interviews per plane trip to
the area. The ultimate win came from watching for jobs in the area through
craigslist that did not obviously come from some generic recruiting farm. It
took me two plane trips' worth of interviews in five months, and I landed that
craigslist job.

If I were to do it all again, I realize now that the most powerful tool for
all this is to make use of connections. I do not mean the feel-good stuff you
get from LinkedIn. I mean actual communication with people via phone, email,
whatever. User groups, conferences, whatever... Network well, and the job hunt
becomes a lot easier.

The other thing about networking is that you can get an idea of WHO you want
to work with. Usually that is more important than the actual kinds of work in
our field.

Lacking the network, I would look for ways to bypass having to communicate
with HR... or just venture forth on my own.

------
rada
Technical mailing lists. Almost all have an accompanying job list and often
the most interesting jobs get filled from there.

------
dord
Craigslist is a good place to start, but you need to be discerning. Find one
that has realistic expectations for the job they are asking, and generally
it's a good thing when they don't give you a price tag right up front because
that means they will pay you based on what you're worth and not some arbitrary
number.

My job asked a simple question, what was the title of the book written by
37signals, which reveals a lot about their perspectives. They also included
enough information in the Craigslist ad that convinced me they were a
technically strong company.

~~~
vrikhter
I actually haven't used craigslist as much. Will check it out some more.

But this still goes back to my point that craigslist, like monster and all
others is a basic listing service of available opportunities. Is there
anything out there, like a match.com for employers and employees?

~~~
dord
I'm not sure but I think what you are looking for is a network of reliable
professionals who you can work for and rely on for support. Something like
this, I suspect, you could try to get rolling through a service geared towards
professionals, like LinkedIn, but the real answer I think would be to find
your own network, or find someone who has a network and tap into them, you
know, IRL :)

I met a guy through RAC last year who has projects come up every few months
and knows a lot of people and it's been a great professional relationship for
both of us. He's the only person in my network, and I definitely couldn't make
a living from it, but it's a good start.

I guess the key to what I'm trying to say is meet people and when you find
good ones hold on to them!

~~~
vrikhter
It wouldn't necessarily have to be geared for individuals. I think there are a
ton of companies out there in the 20-50 employees that are doing well, not
getting a lot of publicity, but have a tough time finding great people. As I
do finding them. This is where a service like this makes sense to me.

------
jackfoxy
From an ad on Craig's List. My wife showed it to me on a Sunday morning. I
said "yeah, I know who these guys are, but I don't know them". They had
originally written the software where I worked at the time, but had quit and
moved on to form a start-up. I had never met them.

So I sent my resume and a cover letter on a Sunday morning. 27 minutes later I
got a phone call. 2 hours later I was interviewing. Longer story short: I
became employee #8 including the founders, we were purchased by a Fortune 200
company a year later. Still there after 5 years.

------
varjag
I got my 2nd job on IRC, and hired for the current job (4th) by a former
colleague from the 2nd one. Got an offer in a channel as well.

All those hours on IRC did pay off!

------
ja27
Through a friend / former co-worker. We've worked together at university and
at two companies and almost two other companies.

At the first company, I just happened to let him know I was looking for a job
at the right moment. His group needed someone right away and I was a great
fit. Unfortunately that company started to come apart 2 years later.

He moved on first, to what became my current company. He pitched hiring me and
I went to lunch with his new boss and some other guys a couple times. When
they finally needed another person, I was an easy sell. I've been there for a
number of years now, through some rough times and an acquisition.

I tried to follow the same guy to two other companies when times were tough
where I was. The new companies were ready to hire me, but the first one ran
out of money and the second one just couldn't afford me.

I don't think we'll try again unless we finally start our own thing. We've
tried twice in the past, but at this point in our careers we can't really
tolerate a "ramen" profitability period.

------
aaronbrethorst
tl;dr version: I've always found jobs through my personal network: friends or
friends of friends. I've never really used a recruiter or searched a job
board.

Microsoft 2003-2007: I was attending WWDC on a student scholarship and ran
into a Lead Program Manager I'd known during my internship the previous
summer. He was working on Visual Studio and needed a UI-focused person.

Skytap 2007-2009: My girlfriend at the time had an old boss who was looking
for Program Managers at his new company (amusingly, he's working on recruiting
me for his current employer).

Dibspace 2009-May 2010: Started it with a friend.

Contracting work May 2010-Now: I have two in-flight contracts for Rails and
iPhone work. The iPhone project came about because I knew a guy whose company
might need one and I cold-called him about it. The Rails project was a friend-
of-a-friend thing. I'm putting together a proposal for another iPhone app
contract right now (to start later this summer). I heard about that one
through another FOAF.

------
agotterer
Found my position at CollegeHumor through techcrunch (crunchboard) about 4
years ago. We are hiring...
<http://www.crunchboard.com/opening/detailjob.php?jid=8209>

My personal experience has been primarily through introduction in my network.
The majority of my network I met at meetups and events. I have tried getting
work through recruiters, but never actually excepted a job they set me up
with. Most of the companies they sent me to were uninteresting and very
generic.

I think the best way to find a job is the reverse approach. Don't wait for
listings that 2000 other people are applying to. Put together a list of the
companies you like/want to work for and start contacting the right people
there. Take apart company directories, break email codes and get your resume
to the right people. Even if its the wrong person they will often forward it
to the right person (or ask them to).

(Edited)

~~~
vrikhter
So do you think a service that helps you narrow down the list of companies for
you to work would be helpful?

~~~
agotterer
Possibly. As a developer who wants to make a difference and work on
interesting projects. I have to go to a number of different sites to get all
the current job posts. That doesn't bother me, plus you have companies like
indeed that aggregate it all together for you. My problem is lack of good
companies/positions and information being posted to begin with. "Hot" startups
usually don't need to blast their job post all over the boards, I bet they get
plenty of traffic to their /jobs page or people who send in their resume at
random. My second issue is that most job postings are by recruiters on tech
boards. That means all these "great" sounding listings have no company name to
go with it and you have to then deal with a recruiter who doesn't care where
you work as long as he places you quickly and takes their cut. So I'm not
positive what a service that narrows down the listings would do? I'm unhappy
because job boards are fundamentally broken to begin with.

------
chops
My first job as a programmer came as a suggestion from a friend who convinced
me to apply and interview for a startup where he was working (Cayen Systems,
<http://www.cayen.net>). At the time, they were doing MS Access applications.
(They've since grown much - I was employee number 4 or 5, now they've got 20
or 30, and they deal much more extensively with Web Apps than with Access).

I left after a few years to start my own startup, even though that original
idea never materialized, and I contracted for 4 years (including to my former
employer) before starting a different startup (and the one I currently work
on).

And while I only had one official job as a programmer employee, it was awesome
working there, and a great experience. Best boss I could have hoped to have
had. He wasn't a programmer, and he trusted his programmers to make technical
decisions.

tl;dr: Friend worked there.

------
abyssknight
I'm probably an outlier here, but I work for a major defense contractor. I
found my job by applying, having the right (albeit obscure) skill set, and
being willing to learn. That said, I take it you're not looking for the
typical cubical desk job. :)

I'd start with your personal network. I moved to a new position within the
company recently; one that I shouldn't have been able to apply for. The only
reason I was even considered was because my new manager (read: single meeting,
first impressions) saw that I wanted to do the job, and was passionate about
it.

She called the hiring manager and a week later I was in an interview. The
following day I had an offer.

Your network is the fastest way in. If you don't have one, grow one.
Contribute to open source, attend user groups, get out in the world -- and
always have a business card.

------
andywood
I was contacted by a contingent staffing company (I think they found me on
Monster) about contract work at Microsoft. This intrigued me at the time, so I
took a 6-month contract, during which I earned respect and made friends. They
extended the contract a couple of times, and then I was encouraged to apply
for a full time position. I still had to do a regular interview loop, but I
think their perception was colored by the fact that they had already seen a
lot of my production code, and thought it was good.

This was perfect for me, because due to the way my mind works, I would much,
much rather "interview" by doing a few months of real software development,
than by floundering around on the spot with clever questions about manhole
covers, weighing billiard balls, egg drops, etc.

------
redorb
I worked for him out of high school; building the add-on to his house... Then
in his factory building the product we sell for 2 years (very hard work,
bending metal around a bender 3-4k times a day) ~ then he helped me land my
first computer gig (ebay lister). I did that for 2 years then came back to the
company as the only IT person.

Have since basically doubled internet revenue.

 __My answer; networking... one of my old friends worked in the factory and
knew the guy needed some odd end help building a add-on to his house.
Currently he is building me a new office onto our new building... I still feel
the need to go independent though; cause of stupid office politics.

~~~
vrikhter
You are correct, networking is most always the best course of action. Nothing
beats sitting face-to-face with someone.

------
JoeAltmaier
I work at my own consulting company. 5 colleagues were tired of "working for
the man", we rented an office and started calling other colleagues. Now (3
years later) we're down to 3, have full-time work and are fairly happy.

------
igorgue
They found me listed at the "DevelopersForHire" wiki page:

<http://code.djangoproject.com/wiki/DevelopersForHire>

------
jswinghammer
I was contacted via LinkedIn by the CTO at my current job. I'm friends with
one of the other developers here who is well thought of. I wouldn't have ever
come across this job otherwise. I'm horrible about doing research about
companies I want to work for.

I did a few things before starting though like checking page load efficiency
and seeing if implementing css spriting would help load time. I mostly did
that so I'd have more information about how the site worked before I started.

~~~
cmars232
I was also recruited via LinkedIn for my current job.

------
Aaronontheweb
I'm working for the family business currently - it was a good opportunity for
me the learn the ropes of running a business right out of college and it gave
me a chance to help my father out with some issues he was having in my area of
expertise. I'm working on starting my own startup as an extra-curricular
project, but the lessons I've learned from working here have been fantastic
and I keep learning new ones every day.

------
ajuc
I've been in students club of computer science, meet many people from older
and younger years that were interested in programming. We were doing hobby
projects and starting in team programming competitions.

At the last year of studying I've mailed one of friends from that club (he was
working in one of a few big software companies in my city) asking if they
would want me. I've been interviewed and got a job.

------
bdickason
I was recommended to my job by a former co-worker. We were both miserable at a
previous company. He started here and brought me on.

I've actually helped friends lately look for jobs. As a tech person in NYC,
I'm constantly meeting people in startups who are looking for great people.
It's an easy intro e-mail and then my work is done!

Do your friends know you're looking for work?

------
yummyfajitas
I found my current job on the Stackoverflow job board. That same week, I
received an offer from another great company that I found via HN.

------
paul9290
I got my job by using Facebook. I first went to job sites, found a job I
wanted and then searched the company on facebook to see employees who listed
they worked there. Then I looked through all listed employees for a mutual
connection between our networks to get referral, interview & job. Took me two
weeks to land my current gig doing this.

Good luck.

------
aardvark
When I decided I was ready to move on from my last job, I went over to the
library (2 blocks away) to update my resume during my lunch hour. I saw that
the library had an opening for a programmer, so I applied. I was called for an
interview two days later, and they hired me the day after that. I didn't even
have time to send out any other resumes.

------
heliodorj
I got my first job after college through a posting on efinancialcareers.com
that turned out to be a recruiter. I got my current (and second job) at a
startup through a posting on LinkedIn.

I recommend going to meetups through meetup.com and checking the message
boards and email lists for those meetups. Plenty of quality leads through
Meetup.

------
derwiki
Became friendly with the organizer of the Silicon Valley New Tech meetup,
mentioned to him I was looking for a Python job, he put me in touch with the
director of engineering at my current company. Networking _works_ -- but I
should point out that I didn't get to know the organizer to try to get
something out of him.

------
kingkilr
I was discussing doing some contracting work with someone, which I mentioned
to a friend of mine, who told me not to sign anything before talking to him. A
few days later I asked if that meant he was looking for contractors, I was
working with them within a week.

tl;dr: I knew someone who had his own company.

------
TomasSedovic
I work at Red Hat. I heard about the company ever since I heard about linux,
but I didn't realize they have an office in my city before a colleague from my
previous employer went there.

When I started looking for a different job, I knew a bit more about them and
they were the first company I looked at.

------
zackola
37 signals job board, desperately seeking a Ruby job in NYC after building and
selling a small Rails app created with a friend in our spare time. The
specialized job boards seem to have worked pretty well for me, the interviews
(the good ones at least) are all about what you have done passionately.

------
dannyr
I got my current job through Twitter.

I can't exactly remember how we ended up following each other but I know it's
because we are both Django guys.

I met up with him for coffee once and when there was a job opening where he
works, he tweeted about it. I replied to him and sent my resume.

------
subwindow
I got my current job via Dice, and the last two via Monster. I wish it weren't
the case, but it is true.

I first always look through friends and on smaller job boards, but haven't had
much success getting full-time work this way (although it has been very
successful for contract work).

------
notaddicted
I did research to find tech companies in my area, picked a dozen that looked
like a reasonably good fit, and sent them a cover letter. Marketable skills
should get you a few bites -- some people may call/meet you even if they
aren't hiring, which can help you gather information.

------
malvosenior
My best job options have always come from investors and ceos of startups. The
best thing you can do is do your own startup and even if it doesn't work out,
impress vcs and mentors along the way. You'll have your pick of options
waiting for you on the other end.

------
CatalystFactory
My current manager visited my school for a brown bag lunch talk. I asked her
questions during and after the lunch. I continued the discussion over email
and eventually that turned into an internship. After the Bar, it turned into a
job and the rest is history!

------
jonah
2x Through former co-workers and clients who had moved on to new companies.

2x From cold calls - "Hi, I noticed some issues with your website/app, here
are some specific recommendations..."

1x Started my own company, carried over all my connections.

------
WesleyJohnson
I've only had two jobs in the industry. The first was found in a local paper.
I was hired entry level and moved up from there and the experience was
invaluable.

Current job was found through monster.com and is also proving to be well worth
my time.

------
scompt
Through a local python user group. I introduced myself at the beginning and
said I was looking for a job. Over pizza and a beer afterwards, somebody
mentioned an open position. I applied, interviewed, and that's where I am now.

------
HeyLaughingBoy
I found my last two jobs in the same way: a recruiter placed an ad in
comp.arch.embedded and I followed up on it.

Dunno if this still works: I've been here for over 10 years and haven't looked
at Usenet in about that long.

------
kamme
I always got jobs through tips from friends, I don't like recruiters and such
to be honest.

I always feel they don't care for my jobhappyness, while friends won't advice
a bad job (or at least not on purpose).

------
dagw
My girlfriends boss introduced me to a former colleague of hers. Later I
called him up and asked if he was hiring. He said no, but to keep in touch. So
I did and one day he called and offered me a job.

------
theprodigy
I got my first job through a family connection, but in general you should not
shy away from recruiters. A good recruiter can get your foot in the door and
have opportunities that you might not know about.

------
kineticac
First job out of college (2005) I was contacted when I posted my resume on
Monster.com. Second job was at a startup which I got through a headhunter.
Last one I made for myself! It's the best way =)

------
mitchellhislop
I got my job because I did a speaking engagement with my old employer, and my
current employer (then competitor) was also speaking. Several months later, I
got offered a job there.

------
cadr
I was at an open house at TechShop. We were going around the room introducing
ourselves, and on person described where he worked. I immediately asked "are
you hiring?" He was.

------
wazoox
I founded my company with two former co-workers and zero money. Hey, isn't
this the expected answer here on HN?

~~~
vrikhter
+1, haha

------
angelbob
Found them on the local Ruby meetup mailing lists. It's a pretty good place to
look, at least for Rails jobs.

------
svnv
I got my job through facebook, a friend from university was looking for
developers for his startup.

------
sjs382
Craigs List.

~~~
tjarratt
If you're willing to sift through the noise you'll find something worthwhile
and people that will respect you for the work you do. Craigslist isn't my
first choice, but it is reliable; lots of people use it everyday.

~~~
spudlyo
I also landed my current job via Craigslist. Some companies post there
directly, and it's pretty easy to spot and weed out recruiters.

------
djb_hackernews
craigslist. It's easy to search and narrow down results. Also really like
indeed.com.

Current position was looking for someone way more senior. But I was nearly an
exact match for what they needed and it's worked out great.

------
leftnode
Following a Twitter feed that posts tech jobs in the Dallas area.

~~~
vrikhter
Nice to see activity in Dallas :) I lived there for 3 years and left this past
January. Good people down there.

------
ryanwanger
Met the founders of the company at a local entrepreneurs event.

------
Apreche
Craigslist every time.

------
awa
I got my current job through my school career services.

------
pjdavis
Oddly enough, responding to a newspaper ad.

~~~
GFischer
I got all the jobs I've ever held responding to newspaper ads. (using job
boards is not that common yet over here in Uruguay)

I can tell you, though, that it's not the way to high-paying jobs.

I've gotten decent enough to get job offers from friends recently :) (though I
declined as it wasn't a good fit)

------
myoung8
Hacker News

~~~
chrisclark1729
My girlfriend set up an informational interview for me in December 2007 with
my future boss. I was not shy about saying I was willing to take a job, but
wasn't pushing too hard or selling. We just had a straight conversation and by
February 2008 I met some others within the company and started in March 2008.

