
Chelsea Manning released from prison - nerdy
http://www.cnn.com/2017/05/17/politics/chelsea-manning-release/index.html
======
rosalinekarr
This is long overdue. Chelsea will probably be doing interviews soon, and
since [she's already been pretty outspoken about internet freedoms][1], she
may even bring some much needed attention to issues like net neutrality,
government surveillance and the never ending erosion of our online rights.

Let's hope the media doesn't tear her apart.

[1]:
[https://twitter.com/xychelsea/status/847264510247190532](https://twitter.com/xychelsea/status/847264510247190532)

~~~
RcouF1uZ4gsC
Unfortunately, many of the people that need convincing with regards to net
neutrality and online rights also view her as a traitor with mental problems
and thus "normal, patriotic Americans" should not worry about these things,
except to prevent "liberals" from creating more "regulations" for companies
and putting up barriers to keep our law enforcement from finding the
"terrorists'" plans.

~~~
TheGirondin
This comment is so loaded with strawmen and vitriol I don't think it meets our
communities comment guidelines.

~~~
IanDrake
It's really not. Some people do feel this way and pointing it out isn't
vitriol.

The worst thing that can happen to a cause is some crazy jackass being held up
by the media as the spokesperson.

I was on board for the tea party until the media grabbed a few nut bags and
made them the de facto spokespeople for the cause. It was purely about limited
government until it got co-opted.

~~~
kingkawn
I feel as though I am gathered at the feet of a dispirited grandparent, being
told tales of the purity they would have espoused if they hadn't been so
rudely interrupted by the persistent existence of the world undermining their
certainty.

~~~
otempomores
In my hay days the youth still behaved.. We were stealing apples all day.
Todays youth..they form a line to the shop that would make the krauts proud.

------
adamnemecek
"During one of his final acts in office, President Barack Obama commuted
Manning's sentence in January, thereby giving her an early release date."

For anyone else wondering where this is coming from.

~~~
grandalf
While I'm very pleased that President Obama commuted the sentence of Ms.
Manning, I'm also disappointed that he did not do more to change the policy
about classifying information that allows classification to be used as a form
of propaganda (by classifying the stuff that contradicts the message we're
meant to believe about a war).

~~~
lojack
Don't mean to be a pendant, but he didn't pardon her. Officially her
punishment was commuted. The former forgives the crime and the latter simply
reduces the penalty for the crime.

~~~
smnscu
Don't mean to be pedantic, but the word is pedant (a person who is excessively
concerned with minor details and rules or with displaying academic learning),
not pendant (a piece of jewellery that hangs from a chain worn round the
neck).

~~~
lucideer
The mispelling may have been intended as an ironic joke.

~~~
EvanAnderson
There's actually a running joke on The Skeptics Guide to the Universe podcast
about this very thing. Several years ago they received an ironic pedantic
correction from a listener who, in the correction, mistakenly used the word
"pendatic". It's been a joke there ever since.

------
raverbashing
Now the question is: will Assange follow up with his promise?

~~~
miles_matthias
He has since amended his requirements. Listen to his interview here:
[https://theintercept.com/2017/04/19/intercepted-podcast-
juli...](https://theintercept.com/2017/04/19/intercepted-podcast-julian-
assange-speaks-out-as-trumps-cia-director-threatens-to-end-wikileaks/)

~~~
lightbyte
"Amended his requirements" aka "Oh shit, I didn't think you'd actually do it.
I was only kidding!"

~~~
korzun
> "Amended his requirements" aka "Oh shit, I didn't think you'd actually do
> it. I was only kidding!"

?

He was never going to do it in the first place. Do you really think that a
president would reverse a pardon if Julian Assange did not stand by his words?

~~~
lightbyte
I think you misunderstood what I meant

>He was never going to do it in the first place.

That is what I was implying. Julian didn't think Obama would actually commute
the sentence so said he'd turn himself in for free PR points.

------
ceejayoz
Sort of. She's on unpaid active duty with the Army still while her appeals
wind through the legal system, and thus subject to the UCMJ.

[https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2017/05/14/chel...](https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2017/05/14/chelsea-
manning-wikileaks-transgender-soldier-donald-trump/101594390/)

~~~
le-mark
This is what I was going to remark on and maybe someone can clarify, but I
don't believe the Army has any such thing as "unpaid active duty". The
military doesn't just make up stuff like that. If you're on active duty,
you're getting a check and accrueing time in service. Seems like sloppy
reporting. Also considering:

> After the 2013 sentencing, the _ex-intelligence agent_ changed her name to
> Chelsea Manning and identified as transgender.

Enlisted MI are hardly 'intelligence agents'.

~~~
rascul
There certainly are methods of punishment the Army uses which includes taking
one's pay while they are on active duty. It's not clear to me though how it's
done in Manning's case.

Edit: NBC reports it as voluntary excess leave.
[http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/chelsea-manning-set-
be-r...](http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/chelsea-manning-set-be-released-
prison-still-not-free-n759676)

------
wand3r
I signed the petition. I am cynical and really don't take much civic action;
but this helped. This taught me to be less cynical; she taught me to be more
courageous.

Thank you Chelsea, welcome home

------
hectorr
I have very mixed feelings about what Manning did. I also respect the moral
courage it took to do them, and to face the consequences.

~~~
Aloha
I think she served a more than adequate punishment for her crime (if anything,
she should have only had serve something less than 5 years).. and I wish her
all the happiness that life has to offer.

~~~
mjgoins
Her punishment was illegal under the 8th amendment, and her "crime" was
protected whistleblowing.

~~~
Aloha
I don't think putting someone in extended solitary confinement is reasonable
in almost any circumstance (and very not reasonable in this case). But I don't
think what she did is protected whistleblowing (she basically aired the
'sausage making' of US foreign and military policy, not highlighted a specific
violation of US law) - on the other hand, I think the length of the sentence
ought to be proportional to the gravity of the crime.. 35 years is overkill by
an order of magnitude, she should have gotten 1-5 years.. with 2 being an
ideal.

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Unbeliever69
Hopefully, she doesn't disappear, but uses her popularity to stand up and
fight for what she believes.

~~~
rmc
She's been in prison for ~7 years, and I'll bet it was a pretty strict prison.
I'm prepared to let her recovery and heal first. She is under no obligation to
be under the spotlight from tomorrow.

------
btbuildem
> She was released from United States Disciplinary Barracks at Fort
> Leavenworth in Kansas around 3 a.m.

3am?! A parting kick to the head, or a ploy to avoid publicity?

~~~
skrause
If you were to be released on the 17th, would you rather go at 3 am or 10 pm?

I would like to go as early as possible. 3 am is not as good as immediately at
midnight, but I wouldn't consider it a kick to the head.

------
pavel_lishin
I hope she's alright after this; there might be people literally gunning for
her, even if she wasn't trans.

~~~
beaconstudios
I think the "having been a whistleblower in the most powerful government on
the planet" part of Chelsea's story is considerably more risky than the "is
transgendered" part. There aren't many people running around "gunning for"
trans people in the same sense that there are people "gunning for" informants.
Primarily in the sense that in the latter case they use actual guns.

~~~
angry-hacker
But he was not a whistleblower, there was nothing important to leak besides
bunch of state's secrets. The leaks held no value.

~~~
beaconstudios
I'd argue that the Collateral Murder videos triggered considerable controversy
and criticism against the US military's attitude to airstrikes. The cable
leaks also caused a fair amount of political embarrassment. So it depends on
what you consider to be valuable - I'd say direct evidence of airstrikes being
triggered against civilians with minimal oversight alone is valuable to a
citizenry that wants to keep tabs on military accountability and push for
change.

~~~
GVIrish
If Manning had only leaked the video in an attempt to bring light on what she
perceived as a war crime, she would've had a case as a whistleblower.
Indiscriminately leaking thousands of documents where she had no idea of the
contents, is not whistleblowing. That's why she ended up with the sentence
that she did.

~~~
beaconstudios
and yet her sentence was commuted where Snowden remains a fugitive.

------
panzer_wyrm
While not rotting in prison is great - isn't it strange that Manning was
pardoned, while there are a lot more pardon deserving persons among the other
whistleblowers of the era.

Nothing good or interesting came from those leaks. And they were legitimate
threat to US security. And Snowden ones were responsible, curated and only in
the areas where rights of US citizens were infringed.

And yet he is stranded in Russia (1/6 of the world, so not bad).

What is the lesson - if you leak, leak more severe?

~~~
masklinn
> While not rotting in prison is great - isn't it strange that Manning was
> pardoned

Manning was not pardoned, her sentence was commuted. She is still considered
guilty on all grounds on which she was convicted.

> And Snowden ones were responsible, curated and only in the areas where
> rights of US citizens were infringed.

> And yet he is stranded in Russia (1/6 of the world, so not bad).

> What is the lesson - if you leak, leak more severe?

Snowden has not been sitting a in a US prison for years (in pretty difficult
conditions) after a sentencing which many found excessive and unfair.

So the lesson is rather more "get sentenced to rank reduction to E-1,
forfeiting of pay and allowances, dishonorably discharged and 35 years in
prison and you may see the last part reduced to only ~6 years afterwards".

Oh don't forget the 6 years include a significant duration as POI at Quantico:

* checks by guards every five minutes

* not allowed to sleep between 5 am (7 am on weekends) and 8 pm

* required to remain visible at _all times_ , no sheets, pillow built into mattress, and blanket designed for unshreddability

* sleeping attire limited to boxer shorts

* 6 × 12 ft (1.8 x 3.6 m) with no window, containing a bed, toilet and sink

* allowed to walk for up to one hour a day, meals in the cell, shackled during lawyer visits

Not to disparage Snowden, and his reasons for not coming back seem sound, but
political asylum in Russia isn't exactly Manning's last 6 years.

~~~
VLM
There's a lot of people working hard to bring those conditions back to the
workplace.

------
pmarreck
Good.

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matt_s
Why is this on Hacker news?

~~~
aparadja
Hacker News isn't exclusively about startups and software.

~~~
matt_s
Oh my mistake. Maybe it should be renamed to "News, commented on by hackers"

~~~
CiPHPerCoder
That's a great idea, but it's kind of wordy. Maybe something short and pithy
like "Hacker News" would work?

------
pfarnsworth
As far as I'm concerned this is the first thing that Obama did that was a real
progressive act. Thank God he did this. If only he did the same for Snowden.

~~~
fixermark
It's unlikely Snowden will ever get a pardon.

Functional governments have a vested interest in not forgiving blatant
disregard for their laws, regardless of the morality of the acts that led to
the disregard. It's possible (but probably unlikely) that he could have been
pardoned, found innocent, or had a sentence commuted had he turned himself in,
but escaping the reach of American justice? There's very little incentive for
a country to reward "Break the law then run from our jurisdiction,"
independent of the details.

Snowden's successfully attained a life probably free of American legal
influence. His reward is a life free of American legal influence.

~~~
pfarnsworth
I agree. And I doubt his fate is going to get any better in the future,
unfortunately.

~~~
fixermark
His fate is pretty good as-is, right? I hear Russia is a beautiful country.

~~~
pfarnsworth
I wouldn't characterize it as pretty good. He's living day to day, and at any
point Russia could change their minds. Snowden basically sacrificed his life
and freedom for the rest of us.

------
vivekd
I disagree with what she did, she probably made the world a much less safe
place and caused thousands if not millions of deaths through wikileaks role in
inciting the Arab spring. Still I'm convinced she did it with the best of
intentions and the genuine belief that she would make the world more peaceful
and open. I guess she was naive so I'm glad to see her released early.

~~~
skrebbel
This is the attitude that keeps dictators re-elected. Vote for stability!

