
Breakdown Palace: R.D. Laing’s radical asylum - zbentley
https://www.topic.com/breakdown-palace
======
dang
[https://www.madinamerica.com/2013/11/living-one-r-d-
laings-p...](https://www.madinamerica.com/2013/11/living-one-r-d-laings-post-
kingsley-hall-households/) is a story that happened at one of the post-
Kingsley Hall houses. It is one of the most remarkable things I've run across
randomly on the internet (though it turns out to be an excerpt from a book).
If you read it, don't bail before you reach the punch line.

That the 20-year-old patient had read The Divided Self and specifically asked
to be sent to this place indicates how famous Laing was at the peak of his
celebrity.

------
pizza
Reading RD Laing was an important experience for me. I recommend the Divided
Self, the Politics of Experience, and The Politics of the Family for others
trying to work through their low points.

If you want a sense of what the guy was like, here's a short 3 min video
titled "Forgetting Depression":
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pKOxp2q2lss](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pKOxp2q2lss)

Another good interview with him here. Probably recommend this one more, it
really contrasts his approach and humanity from typical orthodoxy of the time:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k0ZvZAG_XRg](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k0ZvZAG_XRg)

~~~
jdietrich
_> a sense of what the guy was like_

I feel obliged to point out that Laing was a notorious asshole in his personal
life.

[https://www.theguardian.com/books/2008/jun/01/mentalhealth.s...](https://www.theguardian.com/books/2008/jun/01/mentalhealth.society)

~~~
TheOtherHobbes
I went to see him give a talk in London in the 80s.

He was clearly drunk and not very coherent. It was sad.

------
foobiekr
R. D. Laing is mentioned in Adam Curtis' "The Trap" as well.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Trap_(TV_series)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Trap_\(TV_series\))

------
alan-crowe
The article dates this to not long after 1973.

To put it into an international context, lobotomies were performed in the USA
from 1936 until 1972 peeking in 1950 [https://www.aier.org/article/how-
government-prolonged-loboto...](https://www.aier.org/article/how-government-
prolonged-lobotomy)

R. D. Laing was reacting against horrifying practices. Viewing him in his
historical context lets us see what drove him to be so radical.

------
DoreenMichele
I have trouble imagining that the opening scene of this piece -- where Laing
takes his clothes off and sits naked with a naked girl until she finally
speaks after 200 days of not speaking -- would not result in this day and age
in some kind of scandal or court case with accusations of sexual misconduct.

 _Ronnie continues to push the notion that “sanity” is a social construct, and
that behavior labeled “mentally ill” by the dominant culture is often behavior
that’s rebellious with good reason._

I think there is merit to this idea. Among other things, we conveniently label
homeless people as "crazies" as a means to dismiss them and justify callous
disregard for their welfare.

~~~
Fellshard
You lattermost accusation is based on the idea that we label them 'crazies' to
dismiss them, rather than noting that some homeless people are homeless
because they suffer mental illness and are displaced from any place that would
otherwise care for them, while other homeless people are homeless for very
different reasons.

I would neither recommend lumping homelessness into a single category like
that, nor assuming that the vast majority of people call all homeless people
'crazies'. Neither generalization is helpful.

~~~
DoreenMichele
I don't quite know how to engage your comment. I frequently try to give voice
to those who so often have no voice. A lot of people here recognize me and the
role I try to play in that regard.

I'm guessing you have no idea who I am.

Years ago, I had a college class on _Homelessness and Public Policy._ I also
spent 5.7 years homeless, during which time I was quite open on HN and
elsewhere about my situation and views.

I got back into housing September 8, 2017. I continue to write about
homelessness.

A paid piece I did while still homeless:

[https://www.ecnmy.org/engage/getting-a-bank-account-can-
be-t...](https://www.ecnmy.org/engage/getting-a-bank-account-can-be-tricky-
when-youre-homeless-so-heres-how-i-did-it/)

A piece a college student wrote about me after I got off the street:

[http://alexandralindelof.com/story-
package/](http://alexandralindelof.com/story-package/)

An article where I was interviewed, then misquoted and misgendered:

[https://www.sandiegoreader.com/news/2017/sep/08/stringers-
pl...](https://www.sandiegoreader.com/news/2017/sep/08/stringers-plastic-bag-
ban-led-hep-health-crisis/)

(Related correction written by me:
[https://sandiegohomelesssurvivalguide.blogspot.com/2017/09/f...](https://sandiegohomelesssurvivalguide.blogspot.com/2017/09/for-
record.html))

My old homeless blog, most of it written while I was homeless:

[https://sandiegohomelesssurvivalguide.blogspot.com/](https://sandiegohomelesssurvivalguide.blogspot.com/)

I don't remotely have a one dimensional view of homelessness. My observation
that homeless people are often assumed to all be "crazies" as a dismissive
tactic is based on years of experience with the topic.

~~~
bsder
> I don't remotely have a one dimensional view of homelessness. My observation
> that homeless people are often assumed to all be "crazies" as a dismissive
> tactic is based on years of experience with the topic.

It is dismissive, but more than 50% of the homeless population have mental
health or substance abuse issues, so it's not entirely incorrect either.

The problem is that the general population doesn't generally encounter the 50%
of the homeless that don't have these issues since those folks are busy
working and simply trying to exist.

~~~
DoreenMichele
Many housed people have mental health issues. They aren't treated like they
can't be fixed, etc.

I tried to write some about that here:

[https://streetlifesolutions.blogspot.com/2019/06/a-people-
fi...](https://streetlifesolutions.blogspot.com/2019/06/a-people-first-model-
for-addressing.html)

~~~
bsder
> Many housed people have mental health issues. They aren't treated like they
> can't be fixed, etc.

Actually, they mostly get ignored. I'm not sure that is much different.

I can assure you from personal experience that getting someone mental health
treatment against their will is very difficult even if they are housed. In
some ways, it's more difficult as being "housed" is considered some level of
competence mitigating against forced treatment. The US has a remarkably high
standard before we decide to force people into treatment or hospitalization.

As for the 50% of homeless who don't have substance or mental issues, I happen
to agree that the US healthcare system absolutely needs to be fixed (this
would help both the housed and homeless).

As for a "job", we're probably not going to see eye to eye--I simply do not
believe that there are enough jobs to go around regardless of "housed" or
"homeless" and we need to start having the conversation as a country as to
what the solution here is. People requiring an "income" in order to validate
their "existence" is an idea that needs to end.

------
B1FF_PSUVM
(Excursion on the title)

Curiously a search such as
[https://www.google.com/searchq=Breakdown+Palace](https://www.google.com/searchq=Breakdown+Palace)

comes back with: "Showing results for Brokedown Palace / Search instead for
Breakdown Palace"

but the results are about a poorly rated movie, not the well-liked Steven
Brust book.

Culture fragmented, have we.

~~~
el_benhameen
Could also be a play on the Grateful Dead’s “Brokedown Palace”.

~~~
SynthCann
Ding ding

