
Osama bin Laden Is Dead - ssclafani
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/02/world/asia/osama-bin-laden-is-killed.html?_r=1
======
jrockway
Osama bin Laden's legacy lives on with every traveler being herded through
body scanners, with every illegal search in our 120-mile-radius Constitution-
free zones, and with every warrantless wiretap.

Until his legacy dies, he lives on, as strong as ever.

...

Can I at least bring a tube of toothpaste with me when I travel now?

~~~
richardw
Sadly, his real achievement was simply the idea that a small aggrieved group
of people are capable of achieving something with the terror impact of 9/11.
Before, it was always only in the realm of distant possibility, a far-fetched
story told in books or movies. That can never be erased.

Hopefully the emphasis on terror will be reduced, though. Bad driving, bad
diet and many other causes have definitely killed more people each than 9/11
since it happened, but it's a lot easier to focus on an external enemy you can
see, especially when it has a shark-attack-like amplification on our
perception of danger.

~~~
mattmanser
Dude, go learn some history.

Just two recent examples are the 'troubles' in Northern Ireland and Jewish
terrorism in Palestine before the British withdrew. They are both examples of
effective terrorism campaigns done by small groups.

Just because it happened in America for the first time doesn't mean it's not
happened in the rest of the world many times.

~~~
JoachimSchipper
9/11 does seem to be an outlier in (public terror)/#attackers, though.

~~~
simpleTruth
I have no idea how you can measure such things, but several serial killers
have terrorized large areas for fairly long periods of time. 9/11 may have
been dramatic, but it was over fairly quickly so the _terror_ was short lived,
and it also took several people which hurts on the / attackers side.

PS: I watched it live on TV missed the first attack, but saw the other two get
reported and personally I was never really that strongly impacted. More WTF?
than run for the hills.

~~~
TillE
My favorite cheap method of terrorism is the DC sniper times ten. It requires
no real coordination and very little money, yet causes a huge sustained
impact.

Fortunately, it seems that the number of motivated crazy people in the world
is fairly low.

> personally I was never really that strongly impacted

I'm guessing you don't live in the New York area. Events can seem a bit unreal
if you have no personal stake in them. It may seem trivial next to the loss of
life, but looking at that hole in the Manhattan skyline where the towers used
to be is still a bit tragic.

~~~
simpleTruth
Yea, I was thinking of the whole DC sniper thing. There was a similar indecent
at an army base (fort hood), but the random nature of the targets and the
length of time between attacks was far more threatening to people.

I could see a changed "Manhattan skyline" as a significant impact for many
people. For a while I could see the section of the pentagon hit by the
airplane outside my window, but there is little lasting visible impact on the
structure. Internally, they did a fair amount of renovation for example added
some glow strips on the floor pointing to the exits which seems like a good
idea, and gas makes which seems less useful (and more creepy). You can even go
on tours of the pentagon which seems risky, but I suspect the benefits
outweighs the risks.

However, that's all fairly long term effects. As to being up close and
personal, a coworker of mine was in a conference room when 1/2 the people at
the table where taken yet he had no problem going back to work at the
pentagon. Sure, it's a target, but numbers suggest being a truck driver to be
a far more dangerous profession.

When it comes down to it terrorism is simply not that effective. Several paces
have had sustained terrorist attacks for long periods of time and people don't
react that much.

------
pnathan
Summary (from the speech broadcast on CNN):

* In August '10 a lead was uncovered. Obama directed followup.

* Lead was strengthened over time until it was isolated that bin Laden was in a compound in Pakistan.

* Obama gave the order and an American commando team went in, had a firefight, and killed bin Laden. His body was brought out.

* No Americans were harmed, and civilians were attempted to be protected.

* The Pakistani government was notified (speech did not say if this was pre-event or post-event).

And, transcript! [http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/2011/05/02/osama-bin-laden-
de...](http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/2011/05/02/osama-bin-laden-dead)

~~~
shadowsun7
The New York Times has just released a 7 page obituary profiling the life and
influence of Osama Bin Laden:

[http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/02/world/02osama-bin-laden-
ob...](http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/02/world/02osama-bin-laden-
obituary.html?hp=&pagewanted=all)

It's a great read. I'm wondering how they pulled it off, though - did they
have the copy for an obituary filed away, and pulled it out and edited when
the news broke?

~~~
pak
Yep, that's exactly how obit departments at major media outlets operate.

<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Obituary#Media>

------
abalashov
Not even a whimper of cheer for Osama's death from me, given the abysmal
foreign policy and national security state failure of the last decade. As
another commenter said, "Osama bin Laden's legacy lives on with every traveler
being herded through body scanners, with every illegal search in our 120-mile-
radius Constitution-free zones, and with every warrantless wiretap."

Besides that, it's simply not like me to cheer for anyone's death, in
principle, especially a figure the TV adamantly asserts we're supposed to
hate. It's not that I doubt the veracity of the reasons given so much as I
loathe demagoguery and spectacle.

~~~
abalashov
Although, I have always doubted the omni-tentacular, ubiquitous, far-reaching
character ascribed to Al Qaeda as an all-powerful international terrorist
conspiracy. It's not that I doubt its existence per se, it's just that I know
damn well that every shadowy international conspiracy ever raised by any
government has been vastly exaggerated into a comically gassy caricature of
its real self, vide the International Communist Conspiracy of yore.

Edit: In a way, bin Laden's death is probably a net loss for the American
military and foreign policy establishment (does there even need to be an 'and'
there?). So much propaganda mileage was squeezed from him that I am sure there
is some ambivalence as to whether he's more valuable dead as some bullshit
"vindication" vs. alive as a perpetual bogeyman.

~~~
hasenj
> I have always doubted the omni-tentacular, ubiquitous, far-reaching
> character ascribed to Al Qaeda as an all-powerful international terrorist
> conspiracy

In the Arab world, this image is ascribed to the Zionist-Right-Wing-American
conspiracy. Some radical conspiracy theorists even claim that all current
revolutions in the Arab world are plans by the Zionists to change Arab regimes
without resorting to a full-scale military invasion.

~~~
abalashov
Which is strange, given that most of the imperiled or 'changed' regimes are
not especially anti-Israeli. I mean in reality, apart from the perfunctory
rhetorical barbs for domestic consumption.

~~~
hasenj
Some of these conspiracy theorists are themselves a part of the propaganda
machine for the various ruling regimes, but what troubles me is that some
people actually find these ideas plausible: "You know brother, the Americans
are not asleep like us, they calculate things well".

------
russnewcomer
This is a much more complex piece of news than most Americans think. I just
hope they don't show his body on TV. That's going to just incite and inflame
jihad-minded fighters.

And I sure hope this doesn't make the U.S. pull out of Afghanistan in the next
90 days like NBC just implied, because that would be bad for everyone in that
country.

 _EDIT_ if OBL really was killed in a mansion in Islamabad, that changes a lot
in relations between the US and Pakistan. If he was killed in the FATA, then
it's pretty meaningless operationally, it's just a news deal that will inflame
the jihadi world for a while.

 _Edit2_ Abbottabad is in NWFP, so not exactly Islamabad and a different
interesting. If Obama didn't get Pakistan's permission before going, that is
interesting. Not going to change wars on the ground except for a inflammation
in jihadi tensions.

~~~
marshray
_really was killed in a mansion in Islamabad, that changes a lot in relations
between the US and Pakistan_

Everyone in Pakistan already knows that the US has been killing people with
drone strikes for years and years now. They're far more aware of it than
Americans.

It's hard to see that there are many Pakistanis who are going to dislike
America _more_ for having actually gotten OBL. On the other hand, ending US
missile strikes in Pakistan can only help.

~~~
brianpan
I think russnewcomer was implying that if he was in a mansion, the Pakastani
government must have known more about his whereabouts than they said they did.
Which would potentially affect US-Pakastani diplomatic relations.

~~~
afterburner
It's no secret that many in the Pakistani intelligence community were overtly
pro-Osama. It doesn't mean the whole country or government shared this
feeling, nor that the intelligence community is still as pro-Osama (or at all
given the jihadist attacks in Pakistan in the last few years). This kind of
complicated situation has existed in Pakistan for a long time, and the US is
fully aware of it. To a certain extent this kind of situation exists in most
countries in the region.

------
lanceusa
I'm going to offer a healthy bit of skepticism here but it frightens me the
way this is being reported.

Specifically: "...justice has been done". American military and C.I.A.
operatives had ...shot him to death.

Obama: "I authorized an operation to get Osama bin Laden and bring him to
justice."

Obama: "His demise should be welcome by all who believe in peace and human
dignity."

Is that how we conduct justice now? I am not satisfied by this outcome. I
would rather have had him in custody showing we hold the higher ground when it
pertains to morality and justice. Its no surprise to me now that our morality
and judgment is an illusion which I thought, ever since I was a kid, was what
made America great. The fact that Obama plays off people's emotions in his
speech to gain support for this outcome is purely disgusting.

And lastly, you believe this because the media and Obama says its so?

~~~
mekoka
> Is that how we conduct justice now? I am not satisfied by this outcome. I
> would rather have had him in custody showing we hold the higher ground when
> it pertains to morality and justice.

I'm confused as to what you're unhappy about and who you're blaming for this
outcome. Some courageous soldiers attempted to get an elusive mass murderer
and bring him to justice. During the attempt there was a firefight and he was
killed in the exchange.

It is obvious that this outcome is upsetting for a lot of people, but not for
the same reasons than yours. This man caused a lot of griefs to many families,
not only in the U.S., but also throughout places in the world where Al Qaeda
has stricken, (including Afghanistan). Some scars are still not completely
healed.

Those words, "His demise should be welcome by all who believe in peace and
human dignity", simply serve as solace for the fact that they were unable to
take him alive.

Now, turning this into an Obama thing is your own prerogative. Was he taking
credit/responsibility in the video? To some extent certainly, but I didn't
perceived him trying to play with people's emotions.

~~~
bad_user

         This man caused a lot of griefs to many families
    

A lot more people die each year from heart disease, and yet, what's the budget
for health-care versus military?

Your government did a lot more damage to the US by the corrosion of your
constitutional rights, actions received with cheers and applauds ; because
2000 people or so died in the 9-11 attack.

But every 34 seconds a person dies from heart-disease in the US. Do the math.

    
    
         Some scars are still not completely healed.
    

Oh, get over it -- I'm pretty sure the American soldiers that invaded Irak
(based on bogus WMD stories) left a lot more scars.

~~~
mekoka
I'm not American, I don't even live in the U.S. You have no idea where I'm
writing this from, so please stop making assumptions.

The world is rather a complex place. People die every day from various causes
on the planet. It still doesn't justifies people like you stepping on a
pedestal to ask them to be philosophical about someone who wronged them, just
because people die from heart attacks every day.

The present issue is Osama Bin Laden, not heart diseases or any of the other
issues you're trying to bring to the table. If you like to open Pandora's
boxes, we might as well just close the discussion.

The fact remains that Osama Bin Laden and what he represented were wrong for
the world and now he's dead. Many of us who were not particularly affected by
his actions think that they are particularly laudable for dictating to others
how they should react. I don't know you, so I will refrain from painting a
portrait of what I perceive you to be, based on your speech. I will just ask
you to please be a bit less sanctimonious.

~~~
bad_user

        Osama Bin Laden and what he represented were wrong 
        for the world and now he's dead
    

Truly I don't know you and where you are from, but from where I'm standing:
Osama bin Laden is now a martyr, he's now more relevant than ever (post 9-11)
and true justice was not served.

One way to crush the free will of people, taking away their rights, is to make
them fear an invisible enemy. My parents saw it happen in my country; my
grandparents saw it too.

So dance on the streets if you want, but tomorrow you'll realize nothing
changed for your well-being, and in fact the "terror" continues, because
people allowed it to happen.

------
sp332
As usual, Al Jazeera English has excellent coverage and a much broader
perspective: Live video <http://english.aljazeera.net/watch_now/>

~~~
paul9290
Does Al Jazeera English broadcast 24/7? I dont have cable but have
wished/hoped for a CNN that streams 24/7 on the net. Maybe Al Jazeera is this
Internet news channel I've hoped for?

~~~
axomhacker
I have no cable. Al Jazeera/CNN/NBC on Roku have been far more useful than
cable was. (Yes Al Jazeera has a 24/7 live stream on Roku "Newscast" channel).

------
joe24pack
finally. Can we stop the stupid patdowns of innocent travelers and disconnect
the porno scanners at the airports now? I have to travel tomorrow and I'd
rather not go through that crap again.

~~~
zyphlar
No, because terrorism is decentralized and the millions of people who
(rightfully) hate us now will be even angrier. Which will justify further
control of the populace for safety.

~~~
joezydeco
I'm with ya, even through the downvotes. Why does everyone think the rest of
Al Qaeda is going to just give up and go home?

~~~
marshray
Because the ones smart enough to organize, finance, and lead the operation
will see it as a suicide plan, one that they won't be able to pass down to
others. There will probably always be some dudes thinking of themselves as
part of the franchise, but without photos and tapes they won't really know who
they're taking orders from.

They'll have an authentication problem.

~~~
memoryfault
You are assuming that we are dealing with rational people who have rational
thoughts. That couldn't be further from the truth. People who plan the mass-
murder of others around the world are completely irrational, and I am very
confident that there are tons of people with money, organization, and
leadership that will step up and try to continue Bin Laden's efforts.

~~~
danenania
"People who plan the mass-murder of others around the world are completely
irrational"

Clearly untrue. Perhaps it is easier for you to view an enemy as a lunatic
monster bent on senseless destruction, but nearly every mass murdering
organization in the world, whether it's a terrorist group like Al Qaeda or a
military power like the US, has very concrete motivations and objectives for
its actions, and is well versed in the logic of power. Realpolitik is deeply
rooted in a rational worldview. You may disagree with the premises or the
reasoning (I certainly do), but calling Al Qaeda 'completely irrational' is
way off.

~~~
swombat
Actually, I think it's one of our great strokes of luck that the people who do
this are largely insane and irrational, rather than careful, methodical,
intelligent planners. For example, the shoe bomber, the underwear bomber, the
guys who tried to drive a burning car through the too-narrow entrance of an
airport, and so on. Most of these people are irrational, and that's incredibly
lucky for us.

~~~
khafra
[http://www.gwern.net/Terrorism%20is%20not%20about%20Terror.h...](http://www.gwern.net/Terrorism%20is%20not%20about%20Terror.html)

------
meterplech
I am pretty impressed that Twitter is still up right now. As far as I can tell
there was no fail whale during this whole news break. Big moment for the site
I think.

~~~
ZachPruckowski
Well it's occurring overnight for Europe and a lot of US-East. That probably
cuts the traffic in half.

------
dr_
This is just fantastic news! I stare at the rising Freedom Tower out my window
as I write this, and there's a sense of closure to what was a rude awakening
to a new century.

From Andrew Sullivan on Daily Beast: "12.08 pm Can I say how deeply moving it
is that a man named Barack Hussein Obama gave the order for the operation that
killed Osama bin Laden?

The pre-eminent symbol of our the multicultural, multiracial society of the
future defeated the pre-eminent symbol of the darkest, bleakest throwback to
medieval religious fanaticism. Im not ashamed to use the following language:
Good defeated evil. And hope rekindles again."

~~~
marshray
_"12.08 pm Can I say how deeply moving it is that a man named Barack Hussein
Obama gave the order for the operation that killed Osama bin Laden?"_

That's perhaps the most superficial thing I've ever heard.

~~~
ubercore
Is it? His point is about multiculturalism in our society, and using his name
is a pithy (and, imo, appropriate) way to make that point.

~~~
marshray
I didn't read the piece by Andrew Sullivan that's being quoted, so I don't
know what his point really is. It was taken out of context in the post above.

It reads to me like he's taking a person's foreign sounding family-given name
as a proxy for something which he claims is deeply meaningful. To me, that's
the very definition of 'superficial'.

When it's done with skin color it's called 'racism'.

~~~
ubercore
Haven't read it either, just basing it on "The pre-eminent symbol of our the
multicultural, multiracial society", and I'm not sure why you mentioned racism
here

------
hasenj
He was as good as dead for a long time now anyway. It's not like he was
personally managing and planning all of alqaeda's operations or anything. The
significance of this event is mostly symbolic.

Look at Iraq: alqaeda's influence in Iraq wasn't destroyed by the death of
Zarqawi; it was destroyed when the locals stood up and took arms against them.

~~~
MatthewPhillips
Symbolism can be important. Especially when at the same time this happens, a
wave of democratic revolution is sweeping the very region this man was said to
"represent".

~~~
trebor
And yet, if that symbolism is twisted to martyrdom it makes democratizing the
Middle East infinitely more difficult. I sincerely hope the US government
hasn't created a martyr, and that they do have documented proof this was Osama
Bin Laden (in case his death is denied). Part of me is still awaiting the
extremist's response to all this.

I don't rejoice over his, or anyone's, death.

------
tectonic
Will the Bill of rights be reinstated now?

~~~
Vivtek
That quaint document?

------
espeed
Hitler was confirmed dead 66 years ago today:
<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/May_1>

~~~
lotusleaf1987
Can we make May 1st a national holiday? We have President's Day for two
presidents, can we have something similar for Hitler/OBL?

~~~
swombat
May 1st is already in national holiday in many parts of the world.

~~~
thomas11
Ironically enough, made a national holiday in Germany by Hitler.

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Workers%27_Day#Ge...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Workers%27_Day#Germany)

------
aterimperator
"The worst thing to post or upvote is something that's intensely but shallowly
interesting. Gossip about famous people, funny or cute pictures or videos,
partisan political articles, etc. If you let that sort of thing onto a news
site, it will push aside the deeply interesting stuff, which tends to be
quieter."

~~~
gexla
This is huge news for the U.S. We can argue whether this is the sort of news
which should be posted here, but it will likely have a huge emotional impact
for the U.S. Our nation came to a standstill on 9/11 and this story will
likely have some impact on productivity. ;)

~~~
tzs
Not just the US. There were a lot of foreigners who worked in the World Trade
Center and died on 9/11. I recall shortly after that day reading that for some
large number of countries, 9/11 was the largest terrorist attack on their
citizens.

~~~
DrStalker
As an Australian the direct effect of 9/11 on us was tiny, but the effect of
the US's reaction has been huge.

~~~
cheez
How do you mean?

~~~
westicle
They invaded two countries, one of which was tangentially connected to some of
the people involved in the hijackings which has resulted in quite a lot of
innocent deaths.

Pretty major story of the past decade.

~~~
cheez
I read that saying the impact on Australians has been huge so how has it been
huge?

------
Sukotto
It's a shame they couldn't capture him. "Shot in the head while resisting" is
very inconvenient for those of us who wanted to be sure he faced justice.

Personally, I think it probably went down more or less as reported. Namely
that he was killed in the firefight. Probably not on purpose.

I know a _little bit_ about close-in operations like this one must have been
and, well, it's hard to keep a guy alive who is (1) shooting at you and (2)
would rather die than be captured. Hell, it's hard enough extracting hostages
alive and they _want_ to live.

~~~
JoeAltmaier
Add to that: sick and feeble from years of dialysis. It would probably not be
feasible to abduct an invalid from his bed while being shot at.

------
wcchandler
Is anybody else saddened by the fact that we are in celebration of an
individual's death? I fail to see the differences between his and our
philosophies.

~~~
tkahn6
> Is anybody else saddened by the fact that we are in celebration of an
> individual's death?

No. Welcome to the real world. Someone who has killed tens of thousands of
people and who wanted to kill you, is dead. Be happy.

~~~
mortenjorck
Can we at least be solemnly happy rather than giddy happy?

~~~
pvilchez
In Stephen Harper (Canada's current prime minister)'s statement, he said that
'Canada receives this news with sober satisfaction.'

------
nopassrecover
[Not HN] - Assuming this qualified as interesting/useful to hackers, which I
disagree with but obviously it's on the front page, this is two paragraphs (at
least currently?) saying Bin Laden is dead, statement to come, i.e. completely
devoid of information.

~~~
sandipc
that's because it is breaking news. We are still waiting for President Obama's
official statement address to begin...

~~~
nopassrecover
So shouldn't we wait to hear the facts/details first? I believe HN is about
intelligent discussion, not idle speculation.

~~~
intended
I suppose the source of the data is giving this greater weight.

------
offshoreguy
Now let's repeal the Patriot Act and all the legislation passed under the
rubric of fighting terrorism.

------
kloncks
Osama Bin Laden really shouldn't have used his real address on Sony's
Playstation Network...

------
Osiris
ABC News has released a timeline of the events that occurred on Sunday as well
as the 5 years of events that led up to identifying the location.

[http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2011/05/obama-
gives-...](http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2011/05/obama-gives-order-
bin-laden-is-killed-white-house-time-line.html)

------
jim_h
President Obama will make a live announcement about it.

[http://thelede.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/05/01/live-video-of-
pr...](http://thelede.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/05/01/live-video-of-president-
obamas-address/)

~~~
Cushman
It's a little weird that it still says 10:30. No one there can update the
placeholder?

~~~
tokenadult
[Update] Killed by a firefight by American operatives on the ground in
Pakistan just in the last day, according to the President's speech.

From Los Angeles Times report:

"Sen. Dianne Feinstein, chairwoman of the Senate Intelligence Committee,
related the news to mourners at a memorial service for political consultant
Kam Kuwata. Feinstein said Obama was announcing it on TV as she spoke.
However, she announced the news well before Obama began to speak."

[http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-pn-
osama-b...](http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-pn-osama-bin-
laden-dead-20110501,0,4081556.story)

------
fosk
It seems like his body has been buried at sea, this makes me think a lot.
Where's the body? After 10 years why not wait at least tomorrow before making
his body disappear the same day when he has been killed?

~~~
inoop
At the very least return the body to his family, or bury it according to
muslim tradition.

edit: burial at sea is in accordance with Islam, why is apparently why they
did it.

~~~
enjo
I just can't believe they do something so colossally stupid. How is the world
to believe that he's dead if you serendipitously destroy the evidence like
that?

------
jmspring
Across the US, people are firing up Team America: World Police.
<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sWS-FoXbjVI>

------
marcamillion
I am not American...but I feel like one today!

Wonderful news!

~~~
marcamillion
What's with the downvotes ?

Makes no sense.

------
sudonim
<http://www.whitehouse.gov/live>

As of 11:09 pm est, it is either over or hasn't started.

Image: <https://skitch.com/sudonim/r7b7f/the-white-house>

~~~
Osiris
It hasn't started yet. I'm watching NBC news and they're filling time while
waiting for the President to speak.

------
Osiris
As reported in the Huffington Post, Obama instructed the CIA to step up
efforts to find Osama just 3 days ago on April 28, 2011.

[http://www.huffingtonpost.com/gary-s-
chafetz/post_1988_b_854...](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/gary-s-
chafetz/post_1988_b_854932.html)

According to the article, Obama was concerned that the Taliban might gain
political influence in Afghanistan after U.S. troops leave and if so, they may
invite Osama back to the country. The believe is that killing Osama will help
prevent the Taliban from regaining control.

~~~
trickjarrett
Interesting. According to commentators, on NBC I think, he was killed a week
ago during a drone strike and we've been waiting for complete confirmation
beyond any doubt.

~~~
chime
Obama mentioned Abbottabad, Pakistan. I found this interesting 6 day old
article:
[http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5gIlvWfWJc...](http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5gIlvWfWJcFpKOoDK5H8qTospdcYA?docId=CNG.668db339b5281631a2728698bc86c7e0.181)

~~~
julianz
Heh, Petraeus should have kept his eyes open :)

------
ramki
Osama Dead. Does it mean anything positive to us. Nothing. Just Nothing. -
Osama is not living in a forest, but a mansion..say it again with me..a
fucking big mansion at a stone's throw away from a military academy in
Pakistan. - This mansion is located in a colony of retired Pakistani military
officers. - And last but not the least, al-Qaeda is not just Osama. In fact it
now looks more evident that al-Qaeda is operated by ISI itself. God knows how
many terrorists are still harbored in Pakistan. We know for the fact that the
ones who attacked Mumbai are there. And we know that Dawood Ibrahim is living
in a even bigger mansion in the same Pakistan. (For the uninformed, Javed
Miandad's son and Dawood Ibrahim's daughter are married sometime back). Do you
feel like asking "Can India do the same thing as US did today?" Now, that's
what I call a joke. Go ahead and watch Obama putting a smug face and praising
Pakistan's support in this operation.

------
toblender
I found it odd that we are celebrating a death. Seems somewhat barbaric.

~~~
johngalt
We are celebrating the triumph of good over evil. The celebration would be the
same regardless of death or capture.

------
mmaunder
Aj Jazeera being rebroadcast on CSPAN1 with analysis on this. Nice.

------
jakewalker
Damn. Already went through my allotment of 20 NY Times stories.

~~~
jerf
You're not missing anything as the title covers nearly everything, other than
that an announcement will be made by the President shortly.

------
quizbiz
Correct me if I'm wrong but apparently twitter broke the story?

~~~
NZ_Matt
It's interesting going back and looking at google realtime search and seeing
how the story broke.

It appears that @rawls on twitter was the first to call it
<http://goo.gl/6FMtV>

~~~
waterlesscloud
One of the very early tweets was from...The Rock.

Which almost makes sense.

<http://twitter.com/#!/TheRock/status/64877987341938688>

------
HonestJane
So is he dead? If you don't have someone's DNA, how does a sister's DNA prove
you are the one dead? It could have been a brother. It's not that I really
don't believe it, just why don't they show the proof? A photo can be
photoshopped, but everyone knows it when it is. We aren't babies to be
coddled, we saw the first photo and no one freaked out. Before we knew it was
fake. Even the Muslims who still liked him were like, "yawn". So show it.
Prove it. Why are we always having to ask Obama for proof of everything. This
isn't about him and he shouldn't make it that way again.

------
omouse
Cool, so the war in Afghanistan is over?

------
HonestJane
How is it that you can verify someone's DNA,as opposed to say, their brother,
without their own DNA? So what if they say they had his sister's DNA to
compare to? It could be his brother who was living there and died. How does
that prove it was him? I'm honestly asking this, not trying to be difficult. I
know photos can be photoshopped, but everyone can debunk those. Obama should
show his death photo and let us decide.

------
FrojoS
I wonder if he would have been found had he used the Internet (TOR etc.) to
stay connected with the world, instead of his courier. No idea.

------
endtime
Given that this was clearly months in the making, the timing (just as
reelection campaigning is about to start) is, uh, auspicious.

That said, good riddance.

------
ramki
Bin Laden did not die in some remote cave in the mountains - but in a
residential compound in the same town as Pakistan Military Academy

------
stanmancan
‎"I mourn the loss of thousands of precious lives, but I will not rejoice in
the death of one, not even an enemy. Returning hate for hate multiplies hate,
adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot
drive out darkness: only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate: only
love can do that." \--Martin Luther King, Jr

------
statictype
Important news. But,

 _Off-Topic: Most stories about politics, or crime, or sports, unless they're
evidence of some interesting new phenomenon. Videos of pratfalls or disasters,
or cute animal pictures. If they'd cover it on TV news, it's probably off-
topic._

<http://ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html>

Flag please.

~~~
HardyLeung
Note the word _Most_ , instead of _All_.

The paragraph right above that sentence: Anything that good hackers would find
interesting. That includes more than hacking and startups. If you had to
reduce it to a sentence, the answer might be: anything that gratifies one's
intellectual curiosity.

I find it interesting, and the story gratifies my intellectual curiosity
beyond belief. Also remember that hackers are typically young and a large part
of their psyche can be defined by that monumental event happened almost 10
years ago. Hey, if you look carefully you might find startup opportunities out
of understanding of this significant development.

~~~
statictype
Honestly, you could make that argument about _anything_.

I'm curious: In what way does the story gratify your intellectual curiosity?

~~~
silvestrov
Hacking society: hiding for so long.

~~~
statictype
Please. I'm talking about the article this discussion is about. There's
nothing remotely informative in there about 'hacking society'.

------
pessimist
Oil falls 1% on the news, stock futures up by 0.5%, dollar up also
(expectation of reduction in war expenses?).

------
iridium83
In an ideal world Osama bin Laden would have been captured with the help of
the Pakistani military and handed over to the International Court of Justice
to be tried and executed. There is a fine line between justice and revenge.
Extremists can use this to incite more violence.

~~~
Tycho
Extremists can use anything to incite more violence.

But I'm pretty sure that capturing him and putting him on trial (or even
keeping his body) would be more inflammatory, since we might have seen
kidnappings and ransoms to get him back.

------
antihero
How do they know it isn't just some guy that looks like Osama? Did they take
his DNA a while back?

~~~
trickjarrett
They're saying that we've had his body for a week, it's only coming to light
tonight because word leaked through congressional aides. Presumably they were
waiting for confirmation beyond doubt.

~~~
citricsquid
obama stated the operation was performed today (May 1st)

------
zdw
Just to clarify, is this politics? Should it be flagged?

The January 9th AZ shootings articles were all flagged and pulled from the
site - I'm having trouble seeing the difference between that piece of news and
this.

~~~
mikeknoop
Consider this, had HN been around in 2001, would the World Trade Center news
have been flagged?

~~~
prodigal_erik
There was legitimate engineering discussion to be had about the unexpected
success of the World Trade Center and Pentagon attacks. But when you strip
away the politics, this story is merely "hated guy gets whacked", so what's to
discuss for hackers or entrepreneurs? Flagged.

------
wrm
Live feed is down. Check out <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K8j8LpwDo7Q>.

------
geuis
The live feed just came on air at 8:35pm PST <http://www.whitehouse.gov/live>

------
benthumb
[http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a031700binlad...](http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a031700binladenweak#a031700binladenweak)

[http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a091001rawalp...](http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a091001rawalpindi#a091001rawalpindi)

[http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a070201renal#...](http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a070201renal#a070201renal)

[http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=amid1201Osama...](http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=amid1201OsamaToraBoraLung#amid1201OsamaToraBoraLung)

[http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a011802Mushar...](http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a011802MusharrafOsamaShuffledOff#a011802MusharrafOsamaShuffledOff)

[http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a092306osamad...](http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a092306osamadeadagain#a092306osamadeadagain)

[http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=alate2007CIAO...](http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=alate2007CIAOsamaKidneys#alate2007CIAOsamaKidneys)

[http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a0309OsamaBin...](http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a0309OsamaBinElvis#a0309OsamaBinElvis)

[http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a012304Muelle...](http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a012304MuellerOsamaFakes#a012304MuellerOsamaFakes)

[http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a121301murkyv...](http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a121301murkyvideo#a121301murkyvideo)

[http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a091601noinvo...](http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a091601noinvolvement#a091601noinvolvement)

[http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a092801osamad...](http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a092801osamadenial#a092801osamadenial)

[http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a122601ninete...](http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=a122601nineteenstudents#a122601nineteenstudents)

------
rbanffy
What part of "no disintegrations" didn't they get?

------
shomyo
Nice try! <http://pics.livejournal.com/1hvorost/pic/0005twh4>

------
maxxxxx
I wonder what the nutcases will make out of that. \- Why did Obaba wait that
long? \- What did they cover up by burying him so soon?

------
grandalf
The question is, who will be the next third world "evildoer" that all
Americans come to know by name by virtue of US propaganda?

~~~
cheez
Tupac.

------
mmaunder
Mission accomplished.

~~~
mortenjorck
Eight years to the day, strangely enough.

------
fredBuddemeyer
you can add a eulogy here <http://littlebiggy.org/viewSubject/4618207>

------
georgieporgie
Tangentially, I'm kind of disappointed at the spontaneous, flag waving, "USA!"
chanting crowds. I understand the sentiment, but having seen too many street
parties celebrating the death of Americans, it seems rather low class.

~~~
viggity
We are celebrating the death of a murderer. When you see people in the middle
east in the streets, they are celebrating the deaths of civilians. That is the
difference, and a big one at that. I hope he rots in hell.

~~~
oinksoft
The label "murderer" should only accompany a guilty verdict.

~~~
viggity
He was the self professed architect of 9/11. Give me an fucking break. Hitler
was never tried in court, does that make him not a murderer?

------
shareme
Obama just won re-election, if this is true..assuming if he can get gas prices
down..

~~~
sigzero
Why? He was only following the plan laid down by the previous President.
Nobody in their right mind should credit this to Obama. The US Military should
get the full credit. They are the minds and planning behind what happened not
any President.

~~~
ajays
At a tactical level, you are correct: the credit goes to the US military.

But you have to give credit to Obama too. Bush had his eyes focused on Iraq,
and let BinLaden escape a few times. I still vividly remember, at some press
conference a couple of years after 9/11, Bush was asked: what about Bin Laden?
He callously replied, "I don't worry about Bin Laden. I don't care about him."
So, if Obama had continued Bush's policy, we would not have got Bin Laden.
Obama changed the policy and made Bin Laden priority #1 again, and you have
the results today.

~~~
jamesbritt
_Obama changed the policy and made Bin Laden priority #1 again, and you have
the results today._

And you know this because of a comment most likely made to avoid giving bin
Laden more public attention or further elevating his importance?

Regardless of what one thinks of George W. I have a hard time believing he
didn't want bin Laden dead or captured any less than anyone else in the USA,
and these kinds of public statements are no way to divine what the CIA has
been sent out to do.

~~~
ajays
You must be a mind-reader to know what GWB was thinking of when he made that
comment? (This is not an ad-hominem attack).

All we have to go by is GWB's actions and words. The actions at Tora Bora
alone are a strong datapoint; but over the years, I remember reading several
articles from people actively involved, claiming that insufficient resources
were being tasked for hunting Bin Laden. This particular quote from his news
conference fits very well with everything else that we saw was going on, hence
it is very believable. There was also one Whitehouse Correspondents' Dinner,
where GWB joked about looking under the sofa in the WH for Bin Laden. I myself
remember asking myself (and in discussions) countless times, "why aren't we
making Bin Laden priority #1, and not Saddam?". Do you remember how we hunted
Saddam? Do you remember anything comparable for Bin Laden after the first
couple of years?

If you would like to counter this statement of GWB, you are welcome to provide
evidence (news articles, etc.) to buttress your claim. All I know is: I was
frustrated with us not putting sufficient resources into tracking OBL, and
when Obama forcefully said that we'd be making him enemy #1 again, I was
delighted.

~~~
jamesbritt
_If you would like to counter this statement of GWB, you are welcome to
provide evidence (news articles, etc.) to buttress your claim._

My point was that "news articles, etc.", as well as 3rd-hand accounts and
hearsay, are likely insufficient to determine just what the CIA is up to.

But maybe Wikileaks has something.

------
lotusleaf1987
Wow, I was getting a little nervous Obama might be a one-term president, but I
think that without a doubt he will be reelected now--healthcare reform, his
contrast to the Tea party, and handling of the recovery from the financial
meltdown.

I'm sure Qaddafi is freaked out right now. His son and grandkids, and now
Osama. If they got Osama, Qaddafi doesn't have a chance.

Edit: I can't sleep! So optimistic now, I bet the stock market goes up a few
hundred points tomorrow also.

~~~
michaelkeenan
If you think that Obama will be re-elected without a doubt, you should go to
intrade.com and bet on it. Here's the contract, currently indicating a 69.9%
chance of re-election:
[http://www.intrade.com/v4/markets/contract/?contractId=74347...](http://www.intrade.com/v4/markets/contract/?contractId=743474)

~~~
webXL
Wish I bought this contract yesterday morning:
[http://www.intrade.com/jsp/intrade/common/c_cd.jsp?conDetail...](http://www.intrade.com/jsp/intrade/common/c_cd.jsp?conDetailID=728609&z=1304349986433)

------
lwat
I'm convinced he's been dead for several years, we'll see what kind of
evidence they have.

~~~
long
What kind of evidence do you have?

~~~
Devilboy
<http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8120236576648647371#>

Also the fact that his recent 'yearly videos' do not contain any new footage
of the man. Experts in the EU have declared the videos 'fake' so the CIA
stopped sending them the videos for analysis.

------
kevinchen
I was really hoping this could avoid Hacker News.

~~~
jhuni
This site has gone downhill

~~~
jhuni
In fact, I think I am pretty much done using this site. I will read from
planet Clojure instead.

------
brolik
Osama shouldn't have used his real address in his PSN account.

------
pt
Trump will now ask to see the death certificate!

------
sid_g
Does this mean no full body scanners anymore?

------
gluecode
Good riddance.

------
hardcoded
Obama has just been re-elected. Fait-accompli. Churchill? Give me a break.

------
bokchoi
Mission Accomplished

------
known
Why it took 10 years? Justice delayed == Justice denied

------
dirtyhand
Good job 007

------
digamber_kamat
He was staying in a mansion in the capital city of Pakistan. Pakistan has
fooled United States for so long and American blood is on their hands. Hope US
shows courage to punish the Pakistani army and rest of the Jehadi complex.

------
hrabago
[Deleted] Don't know why this is being downvoted. I was sharing an analysis of
what could happen as a consequence of this event.

~~~
tokenadult
He may become a lot shorter on followers as a result of this. Meanwhile, there
is upheaval in a wide variety of Arab countries, which will probably have
important national security implications for the United States--possibly for
the better--even if Al Qaeda disappears.

P.S. I am listening to live coverage from the BBC just now (relayed by
Minnesota Public Radio), and the most interesting thing about this evening's
report is that apparently Bin Laden was found in a villa in Islamabad, the
seat of government of Pakistan.

~~~
hrabago
Hopefully for the better. Al Qaeda has proven very resilient, so hopefully
this breaks them down.

