

You got the programming fatigue? - eintnohick

I've recently started programming a new startup of mine full time and found that I am severely limited to how much work I can do because of physical fatigue - notably eye strain (pain) and wrist pain (carpel tunnel).<p>I have started wearing wrists braces on each hand to help with the wrist pain and that helps. And for my eyes I often wear polarized sunglasses and switch between staring at my laptop screen and hooking it up to my LCD TV.<p>I guess I'm kind of wondering if you guys have the same problems or if I'm sitting on the computer way to much. Also, what do you guys do to minimize, eliminate such physical problems like this?
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GeneralMaximus
Physical pain is to be expected when you work on a laptop. I use my PC for
long hours without any kind of discomfort, but working on the MacBook for even
a few hours tires me out. Here is what I suggest:

1\. Try using a desktop computer, if you can.

2\. If you can't use a desktop, get a separate monitor, keyboard and mouse for
your laptop. Use this setup when you're coding at home.

3\. Learn and use Emacs or Vim. They're seriously better on the wrists. If you
cannot invest time in one of these editors, learn whatever editor you're using
right now _properly_. Make use of keyboard shortcuts whenever possible, and
avoid the mouse/trackpad like the plague.

4\. Use a dark color scheme in your editor and make it fullscreen. You won't
believe how much cognitive strain it eliminates until you've tried it.

5\. If you're using Windows, use the Windows Classic theme. On Linux, try
using whatever monochrome theme you can find. The Mac already has a monochrome
theme. Staring at wild colors and funky visual effects makes you feel tired.
Eliminate these distractions.

Just this much for now :)

~~~
baguasquirrel
Additional tip on emacs: swap the Ctrl and Caps keys. If you are on Mac, use
Aquamacs because it allows you to use the option key instead of the control
key, which is awkwardly positioned on both PC and Mac.

If there was anything Sun got right in its workstation design, it was where
they put the damn control key: next to your pinky, where it belongs.

~~~
trop
Some people argue that swapping ctrl and caps isn't good. See
<http://xahlee.org/emacs/emacs_pinky.html>. Xah Lee says use a good
keyboard... Not sure if this is true. I'm perfectly happy using the control
key by reaching down with my left pinky...

~~~
d0mine
I find Xah Lee's arguments unconvincing.

 _On a typical PC keyboard of today, the Caps Lock is the most difficult
modifier key to press, and is pressed by the weakest finger pinky._ </quote>

On keyboards I've encountered Caps Lock is right on the left of an A key on
the home row - it is easy to type it (and certainly easier than the Left
Ctrl).

 _It makes the left pinky do 2 pinkies's work._ </quote>

You press Caps Lock instead of Left Ctrl - the same work.

 _It forces the left hand to strain into spider legs positions, or forces your
right hand to flies about wildly if the letter key is near the middle of the
keyboard (e.g. T, G, B)._ </quote>

The standard practice is to press the Right Ctrl (right hand) + t,g,b (left
hand) - no flying.

 _It renders many Control-‹key› spots void, since now with only one pinky many
otherwise good Ctrl-‹key› spots are hard to use._ </quote>

The Right Ctrl stays therefore there is no need to use only one pinky. The
most frequently used Ctrl-<key> combinations in Emacs is point movement
commands. Caps Lock makes it easier to type some of them e.g., C-n/p.

 _The left hand now constantly shift from home position._ </quote>

See my comment to the first quote.

------
seanb
Unless it has been diagnosed as carpel tunnel syndrome, I would guess that the
wrist pain is actually a more general "repetitive stress injury" (RSI). Proper
posture helps a lot for this, as does taking regular mini-breaks to let your
wrists rest. Software RSI break timers help; I use AntiRSI on my mac. The idea
is to let your arms hang down for 10 seconds or so every 5-10 minutes. Take
longer breaks regularly, and stretch your wrists, arms and shoulders.

Google 'RSI wrist stretches' (or exercises), etc. The book "It's not Carpal
Tunnel Syndrome! RSI Theory & Therapy for Computer Professionals" is highly
praised, but I haven't read it personally.

I've found that a trackball is much easier on my wrist when I'm forced to do
any mousing. The Microsoft Natural Ergonomic Keyboard 4000 helped too, but I
couldn't stand the space bar's noise and action -- it's worth looking into a
more friendly keyboard anyway.

Edit: As for eye strain, try to focus on something in the distance while
you're letting your wrists rest. Human eyes aren't particularly well suited
for focusing close-up for long periods of time, so you should let them relax
once in a while.

~~~
hachiya
I agree, a lot of "carpal tunnel" is most likely RSI. This lady explains it in
great detail here:

<http://www.aboutcts.com/moreon_cts.html>

Her main site is <http://julstro.com> which pertains to the whole body, but
the aboutcts.com site deals specifically with carpal tunnel issues.

------
Osmose
A lot of people keep their hands at the keyboard for long periods of time;
excessive use of keyboard shortcuts keeps you in the same position for longer.
I find that typing in bursts works better for me; I hold my chin, lean back,
etc. while I ponder what to code next. Rather than keeping your wrist in the
same position a lot, it gets to flex and move around.

I had a lot more pain while coding at home because I would sit at the computer
more often, but when working at an office, I have to get up and talk to people
more often, and it really makes a difference.

As for eye strain, getting a dark color layout for your code editor of choice
and keeping most of your GUI dark helps. Black text on a white background is
like staring into a lightbulb.

~~~
GeneralMaximus
May I suggest Zenburn? It has to be one of the most beautiful and comfortable
color schemes out there. Available for both Emacs, Vim and a host of other
editors/IDEs.

<http://slinky.imukuppi.org/zenburnpage/>

~~~
likpok
I prefer wombat. It's a gvim only scheme (unless you know a guy who
interpolated it for 256 color), but it is veeeery nice.

------
trop
Sadly, I think a lot of this isn't physical but psychological. The stress of
programming for a job will express itself in your body, despite the best
mitigating techniques (keyboard layout, editor choice, screen color scheme,
typing breaks, posture).

During intense job-related programming sessions, I'd have all sorts of hand
and back aches. When programming just as intensely on a personal project, no
aches at all.

~~~
jamesk2
Getting your circulation going helps relieve both eye strain and wrist pain.
I've had both on very stressful projects. Get into the habit of working on
your cardio. It's been shown that cardio does help with stress management and
brain function.

------
wrbishop
I've been been an active developer for over 35 years, and I can say paying
attention to ergonomics is one of the key aspects to longevity. When any part
of your body starts to hurt, please pay attention, and take immediate action
to adjust, shim, change keyboards, etc in order to stop the aching or pain
before it gets any worse, and shut the pain down. It's your body's way of
telling you that a change needs to be made. A single gig just isn't worth
slamming your potential.

Better chairs, desks, keyboards, and VERY IMPORTANT arm supports to keep your
wrists straight while you type. Also, don't pound your keyboard. A gentle
touch is always best. If a mouse is a problem, try a trackball (Kensington),
or even a "foot mouse".

There are lots of sites on minimizing eye fatigue. Looking away from the
screen every 10 to 15 minutes to refocus on something far away is helpful.
Also, don't scrimp on your monitor. Use a large display that is crisp and has
good contrast.

Being cheap on the hardware you are "bound" to make seem wise in the short-
term, but the long-term consequences are disabling.

Please, don't compromise with pain or discomfort.. It only gets worse.

------
kevinold
I didn't have the eye strain problems, but did have pain in arms, wrists,
under and around my shoulder blade for my right hand. I used my right had to
mouse. Was working on a project that "must go live" and the last month of
implementation I spent 60 hours a week coding. Seriously.

Big mistake. A day after the launch I could not type, mouse, anything with my
right hand as my muscles would ache and lock up.

At work I had a desktop, at home a laptop. The laptop was on a desk that
violated every law of ergonomics known to man. The chair was a cheap $79 chair
I got in college from the local office supply store. More mistakes.

Fast forward a year, I'd begun to notice that my right arm/hand ached all the
time and the area between my shoulder blade and spine constantly held a knot.

My PCP prescribed pills and sent me to physical therapy. That helped a little
but the side effects from the pills made me feel drunk all the time. The PT
used a technique called "traction" that I later found out was chiropractic in
nature. That stretched my neck and seemed to help the symptoms. That an
excercises and an occasional pill when I had a bad flare up seemed to help
manage things.

Fast forward another year and after an ergonomic makeover (explained below) I
was hurting again and figured I'd go see a Chiropractor which my family (all
Chiro success stories) suggested I go to. Wow! I've just celebrated 1 year of
Chiropractic care and feel amazing! It's not solved all of my issues and I
still have to manage my time in front of the computer, but it forces me to use
it wisely.

Here's a list of items that have helped me:

\- Read everything you can about Ergonomics

\- Buy an Elevator for your laptop -
www.griffintechnology.com/products/elevator - By itself it isn't high enough
for me so I have 2 thick text books under that as well to keep my eyes at a 90
degree angle from my screen

\- Buy a good chair. I broke down and bought an Aeron chair from a used office
supply store. One of the best moves I could have made.

\- Take loads of breaks, stretch, excercise. Push ups, lateral pulls, "give
yourself a hug" all relieve tension and strain. Find any and all stretches for
your neck and upper back.

\- Sleep. Really, look at the code you've written when you're fatigued and
look at code you've written when rested. My CTO says that "every programmer
has 4 good hours of code in them a day". That doesn't mean to work 4 hours,
but that you need to listen to yourself when you're "spent". Accomplish the
toughest tasks first thing, then once your "spent" do the menial tasks that
take effort but little critical thinking.

\- Go to a Chiropractor. I kick myself for suffering literally for 2 years!
For the wrist pain, they can pop your wrists and relieve the pain.

Good luck and I hope my suggestions help someone.

------
sowbug
If you just started a new job, it's likely you also changed your work layout.
Ergonomics can make a big difference.

In my case, I eventually figured out that I need my desk at a specific height.
Being even an inch off causes burning and tingling in my arms after a couple
days. So every time I move offices, step 1 is adjusting the desk height.

On the eye strain, have you switched monitor brands or OSes with your new job?
Small things like color temperature or type of LCD subpixel rendering can take
a while to get used to. One configuration isn't inherently better than
another; it's just novel and different, and your eyes might be doing a little
extra work recognizing slightly different glyphs on the screen. If this is the
cause, then the discomfort should go away soon.

------
firefoxman1
I found these wrist stretches very helpful: <http://www.fitsugar.com/309088> I
also read somewhere that staring at a computer screen for a long period of
time weakens the eyes. It suggested that every 20 minutes you should get out
of your seat and walk around, concentrating on objects different distances
away. Also, make sure you maintain good posture when sitting at the computer.

~~~
iigs
_I also read somewhere that staring at a computer screen for a long period of
time weakens the eyes. It suggested that every 20 minutes you should get out
of your seat and walk around, concentrating on objects different distances
away._

I don't have any scientific proof of this but I try to do it when possible as
well. Once or twice per day I try to go outside and focus on things as far
away as possible and try to make out detail. It definitely makes me more
relaxed when I sit back down to work again.

------
bengtan
I use Workrave ... <http://www.workrave.org/welcome> to periodically force
myself to take short breaks.

~~~
windsurfer
In Ubuntu, go to Settings > Preferences > Keyboard > Typing break and check
the box "Enforce typing break". You can customize it based on how often and
how long the break lasts, as well as the ability to postpone the break, or not
if you're like me who keeps postponing the break.

------
windsurfer
I find that a nice looking font face helps loads. A large, sub-pixel smoothed
font is wonderful on the eyes. And nice relaxing colours help too. I keep my
terminal on a salmon-y colour text on a dark grey background.

As for the wrists: invest in a good chair and use Vi :)

------
dws
If you're working near florescents, try moving or turning them off. If you
made an unlucky draw in the gene pool lottery, the fast flicker from
florescents can interfere with your eyes' ability to focus, which can lead to
eye strain. Taking a periodic break to stare at something distant is good. My
optometrist claims that getting a 15 minute dose of indirect sunlight (looking
at something outside with a blue sky background) is even better.

An eye exam will also rule out something like cataracts, which usually hit
when you're a lot older, but may arrive early if you made a particularly
unlucky draw from the gene pool.

------
10ren
_eyestrain:_ optometrist said to focus on something far away every so offend.
This relaxes the eyes. I also got some eye drops to help relax them (called
"clear eyes" or something)

 _wrist pain:_ for me, _coldness_ was a big factor, so I have fingerless
gloves onhand, rub my hands warm when sore, and of course try to keep the room
warm. Awkward posture and being tense were also factors. And, for the first
time ever, I went to the trouble of automating my common tasks in vim (esp.
mapping keys to macros).

Straining an injury can make it permanent. Having done it myself, I sincerely
do not recommend it.

------
olliesaunders
If your injuring yourself by using the computer where others aren't there's
something about you, or the way you're using the computer that's causing you
injury.

The best advice I've found is to just check, every 10 minutes or so, am I
comfortable? How could I relax? Ask these questions of your fingers, wrists,
arms, elbows, back, neck etc. Sit correctly (google for advice on that) but
don't be tense.

I also found the Alexander Technique quite useful
<[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_technique>](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_technique>).

------
jacquesm
I have an old SGI keyboard that I'm absolutely partial to and a simple dual
screen setup with two fairly large monitors a good 2' (60 cm) away from my
head.

It works, but after sitting for > 10 hours I have to take a fairly long break.

move my desk up (or down) 2 cm and I end up with very had shoulder pain. It
took a lot of trying to get it right.

Chair is a fairly cheap office chair but it has lots of stuff I can change to
force changes in position during the day.

I removed the armrests because they make my arms hurt like hell.

------
dmfdmf
You might look into the work by Dr. Sorno. I know people saved by his methods
from RSI/CT... I don't necessarily agree with his repressed anger and
hostility hypothesis but I think the basic idea that the mind can generate
these body pains for reasons we don't understand. Fortunately his techniques
work regardless of the specific psychology involved. Start
here..<http://podolsky.everybody.org/rsi/>

------
dylanz
1\. Vim (black background)

2\. Dvorak (use a typing tutor (like ten thumbs if on OSX))

3\. Kinesis (not needed after 1 and 2 are fluent)

Almost left computing because of the pain, but after heeding the above 3
points, I'm back at 100%. No pain, and to top it off, I type faster. Win-win
situation :) Oh, and get up and stretch every hour or two. If back pain is an
issue (compressed L4 here), then get a desk you can stand at, and a comfy
architects stool.

------
DocSavage
For your eyes, you might want to check out F.lux: <http://stereopsis.com/flux>

That helped me a little. I also bought a Kindle DX and use it to read PDFs and
some web articles converted to PDF. Since the Kindle isn't backlit, it lets my
eyes rest vs staring at the big monitors and laptop screen.

------
beaker
I wear a pair of Gunnar Optiks to help reduce eye strain
(<http://www.gunnars.com/>). They have a slight magnification and anti-glare
which do seem to have a positive effect. Plus when I have them on I feel like
I am in "work mode".

------
cmars232
Try changing your posture and work environment from time to time. I regularly
switch mouse hands, for example.

Also, dark color scheme is best. I have harmless floaters in my eyes but they
make bright white backgrounds look like a freaking protozoan dance party.

------
MrEs
Is this a joke? How old are you? You're feeling tired and injured using a
computer? WTF?

Imagine you had a real labour intensive job, rather than our soft, easy, cushy
'jobs'...

Imagine digging fence post holes all day, trenches, laying bricks, anything
else really!

Wow what a pathetic, meek, frail society we have become where people wing
about how hard it is to sit on your ass all day long!

Edit: I guess I should add... sure I can understand mental fatigue; sometimes
we work with mind numbing, brain twisting complexities. But that just means
you should go make a coffee, go for a 15 min walk by the river, whatever. But
physically, if you're saying 'computing' is hard... surly this is a joke/troll
... !?

~~~
dbz
I'm not trying to feed the troll here, but I feel it should be noticed that
this is a hacker community, and hackers don't generally dig fence post holes
all day, trenches, or lay bricks all day. I'm sure some do, but programmers,
who program for a living, _need_ to be in front of a computer of some kind.
Not all _hard_ jobs involve labor. I'm guessing you've never had to sit in
front of a computer and think logically for a week -getting very little sleep
all the while. If you had, you would not only have _not_ written that post,
but would learn that thinking, and not moving while you think (limited
movement), can be _stressful_ and _hard_ to say the least.

Well, that's my two cents, and from my point of view, and I am sure others
share it, when you said " _But physically, if you're saying 'computing' is
hard_ ," I dare you to do something some of the greater "computers" (people
who computer) have done. You know, like make an operating system from scratch
without ever seeing code of one, you know, like Steve Jobs did, for example.

Ok. I hope that didn't come out as a rant, and if it did, I apologize, but
think about it, computing can be hard.

~~~
MrEs
Sure devving is hard! I've most certainly had my share of ~100 hour weeks, no
doubt they are horrific! They ruin you! (My partner doesn't enjoy them either
:P) And I'm sure whatever crazy devving sessions I've endured, they are but a
drop in the ocean compared to what people a required to pull off when they are
taking the first steps in a start-up.

However it’s actually a topic that my best mates and I talk about quite often!
How lucky we are that we can sit in our air condition offices all day,
drinking coffee straight from a coffee machine, with our nice 26” LCDs, a
plant beside us and our high back chairs... While others we grew up with come
home wire sore backs, sun burnt, trash hands that just constantly hurt. Heck
quite a few have even lost fingers. Sure our computer jobs can be stressful
but that’s why we do it, for the kick, we have the drive, we love the
challenge.

Yea no shit nobody on here digs fence posts... they wouldn't be bloody winging
about sitting in a chair all day if they did ahahah. Surely some of you have
had ACTUAL REAL, physically hard jobs in the past? While putting yourselves
through university or the like? I had some SHOCKING jobs going through uni
from kitchen hand to digging bores/water holes on farm land in outback
Australia. Maybe that’s where my appreciation of what a physically intensive
job means, stems from?

My point is.. How lucky are we!?!

Anways, watch me get down voted to hell because this isn't what others want to
hear about our 'precious lifestyle'. But I fail to understand how your body
can get SORE from sitting in a cushy chair for 15 hours a day ... !? WTF!

~~~
jodrellblank
_Anways, watch me get down voted to hell because this isn't what others want
to hear about our 'precious lifestyle'_

Watch you get downvoted for being unhelpful, unsympathetic and trollish.

 _Maybe that’s where my appreciation of what a physically intensive job means,
stems from?_

Why are you talking on and on about physically intensive jobs when the OP is
not saying "It's too much effort", he's saying "it's wrecking my wrists and it
should not, what am I doing wrong?".

 _Yea no shit nobody on here digs fence posts... they wouldn't be bloody
winging about sitting in a chair all day if they did ahahah_

They would if their family survival depends on income from sitting typing and
they can't type because of knackered wrists.

 _But I fail to understand ..._

That's a failure in your understanding.

