
Dwarf planet Ceres boasts organic compounds, raising prospect of life - givan
http://in.reuters.com/article/space-ceres-idINKBN15V2LO
======
blauditore
Why is it generally assumed that organic compounds and (liquid) water are a
necessity for any form of life?

Of course, all life on earth is based on these things, but that doesn't
necessarily mean that something considerable as a life form couldn't arise
from complex chemical processes with different elements and at different
temperatures.

For example, electronic circuits are non-organic and independent of water, but
still capable of complex behavior. Something remotely similar to human-made
robots using e.g. sun light as power source _might_ have spawned on a planet
with lots of metals and silicone. Of course this exact robots scenario is
highly unlikely to occur - in reality their brains/circuits would probably
work in a more evolution-friendly way - but you get the gist.

~~~
jerf
The alternatives tend to have a lot of problems that seem very difficult to
overcome:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypothetical_types_of_biochemi...](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypothetical_types_of_biochemistry)

It's not just some sort of failure of the imagination. The idea that life
might be really weird isn't a new idea; everybody's read and/or seen the same
science fiction you have too. But if it's going to exist in this real
universe, it has to follow the real rules of the universe, and it's not
particularly obvious that there are any alternatives that can even
theoretically work.

~~~
csours
Somewhere out there silicon based life is having the same argument about
carbon based life.

~~~
jerf
Did you read the link I provided? Intelligent silicon life has good reason to
believe that carbon life is quite a bit more likely than their form of life.
Just as we have good reason to think intelligent silicon life is very
unlikely.

My point is precisely that this isn't just random chauvinism, which is rather
than being some sort of way-cool open-minded "whoa" opinion is really rather
insulting to the huge number of scientists who have considered this matter
very carefully. There are a _looooooooot_ of good reasons to think carbon is
the only possible substrate for life in this universe, and a _lot_ (still
italicized, but with fewer "o"s) of good reasons to think water is the most
likely choice.

~~~
ianai
If silicon life makes so little sense then maybe we could get further if we
were using organic compounds for computational equipment. I.e. Maybe there's a
link between computational ability and the factors (raw materials and 'above')
that make the basic components.

~~~
collias
There's some research going into this now.

Here's an article about it from this past summer:
[https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/07/160714120650.h...](https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/07/160714120650.htm)

A researcher at GA tech has built a simple computer out of neurons:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wetware_computer](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wetware_computer)

And I remember reading about storing data in DNA strands, but I can't find the
article at the moment.

Anyway, it's a really interesting area of research. I expect we'll only see
more of this stuff in the near future.

------
importantbrian
I hope it's not the protomolecule.

~~~
lsllc
That would be Phoebe.

~~~
crowbahr
[http://www.esa.int/Our_Activities/Space_Science/Cassini-
Huyg...](http://www.esa.int/Our_Activities/Space_Science/Cassini-
Huygens/All_about_Phoebe)

"Indicating a surface containing distinct locations iron-bearing minerals,
bound water, trapped carbon dioxide, silicates, organics, nitriles and cyanide
compounds. Phoebe is one of the most compositionally diverse objects yet
observed in our Solar System. The only body imaged to date that is more
diverse is Earth!"

So... there's a chance!

~~~
importantbrian
What if Daniel Abraham and Ty Franck are really writing from the future?

------
Pigo
_I think these organic molecules are a long way from microbial life_

I know we're just supposed to accept click-bait headlines, but it bothers me
more with space exploration because there is nothing more fascinating than the
final frontier dammit! It doesn't always have to be about finding life,
especially for people like me who doesn't believe there is any.

I blame Orson Welles.

~~~
jameskegel
I'm not picking on you, so forgive me if my curiosity is direct; I'm curious
if you could take a few moments to explain why you think there is no other
life out there and what led you to that assertion.

~~~
Pigo
No problem, I don't get heated over internet banter. And like I said, it's a
belief, I don't have any proof just as no one has proof there is. But mostly I
subscribe the Fermi paradox when it comes to beings that would be akin to us,
single-celled organisms up to Internet armchair-scientist organisms. The only
plausible that makes sense to me I first heard from Kaku
[https://youtu.be/liFhgUinrZU?t=2m45s](https://youtu.be/liFhgUinrZU?t=2m45s)
But to me that's where scientific endeavor starts blending into spirituality,
and completely out of our grasp.

I only made my first comment because I have a passion for space, and believe
it's the greatest human endeavor. People being constantly teased with finding
life does a disservice to a pure science that is unequaled in majesty and
wonder.

~~~
Sir_Substance
>I said, it's a belief, I don't have any proof just as no one has proof there
is.

Does it not seem statistically improbable that in the entire universe, life
only occurred once?

Personally I think if I believed that, I'd have to accept a creator deity of
some kind as well.

~~~
rocqua
Presume that life only exists for a finite amount of time, and let the
universe exist for a long time, and the odds of life existing simultaneously
go down.

You can probably manipulate the odds by changing both life-time and life-
probability to be anything you want. Add restrictions of life being able to
interact causally (i.e. they coexist long enough for a light round-trip) and
things get even harder. Then consider how long it takes for life to be capable
of interstellar communication and things probably get even more tighter.

To get even closer to foolproof, presume a correlation between sufficient
technology for interstellar communication and sufficient technology for self-
caused extinction-events (nuclear, climate or otherwise).

So, there is a very big difference between 'did other life ever exist?', 'does
other life exist right now?', 'will we ever have any kind of interaction with
other life?' and, 'will we ever meaningfully communicate with other life?'

------
Cyphase
Well yea; don't they watch The Expanse?

~~~
TeMPOraL
I recommend s/watch/read/. I'm just finishing the second book, they're great
so far.

~~~
Cyphase
Crossed my mind, but more people watch it / know it as a show. Thanks for
mentioning that it is in fact a book series.

TBIAB!

~~~
TeMPOraL
I'm enjoying both very well. My inner Kerbal is quite satisfied with the show;
the physics in it is mostly OK.

~~~
codesnik
but what isn't ok is so cringy :(

------
martincmartin
Please note that "organic" in this context just means "contains carbon," it
doesn't necessarily come from organisms.

