
‘Technological fraud’ discovered at Zolder cyclocross worlds - tetraodonpuffer
http://velonews.competitor.com/2016/01/news/uci_detains_bike_cyclocross_worlds_394233_394233
======
horv
Although this is the first time something like this has been found in
competition, I can remember a few prior allegations or instances that many
people have found suspicious. So I don't personally find this to be a complete
shock.

One thing I find interesting, for road cycling at least, is that the UCI
mandated weight minimums could make it easier for a rider to attempt something
like this. Many of the bikes need weights in the seat tubes to bring them up
to the minimum weight, so the extra weight of a motor and battery wouldn't
stick out as much. If they were to lower the 6.8kg minimum, a bike with motor
and battery might end up weighing noticeably more than the average bike in the
peloton.

~~~
CydeWeys
Weight minimums are good for keeping a level playing field by keeping the cost
to entry "low" by keeping it to the thousands. They're also good for safety
reasons, both for the rider and others they might crash into; there's no
incentive to try to cut too much weight in a way that could impact safety if
there's a weight floor anyway.

The scanning is simply going to have to become pervasive.

~~~
thaumasiotes
> safety reasons, both for the rider and others they might crash into

What is the benefit supposed to be of getting hit by a heavier bike?

~~~
geraldcombs
It's not the weight of the bike. It's the risk of a "stupid light"[1]
component failing when you're at the front of the peloton and taking out you
and most of the riders behind you.

[1] A component which has had its strength and durability compromised in the
interest of saving weight.

------
patdennis
Here's a good demonstration of the kind of tech we're talking about here from
Greg LeMond
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vKgJ_Uhwfno](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vKgJ_Uhwfno)

~~~
deutronium
Neat! I'm curious how much those kind of bikes cost, more for laziness than
anything else ;)

Edit: [http://cyclingtips.com/2015/04/hidden-motors-for-road-
bikes-...](http://cyclingtips.com/2015/04/hidden-motors-for-road-bikes-exist-
heres-how-they-work/) \- Has some cool photos on how they work

AUD $4,300 - eek!

~~~
SixSigma
Why not just buy an eBike, there's a few under $1500 in this best of, and one
sub $500

[http://electricbikereview.com/top-10-electric-
bikes/](http://electricbikereview.com/top-10-electric-bikes/)

~~~
hengheng
Decent road bikes (the one that you use more than 10k miles per year) are more
than $2000 on their own. The electrical components go on top of that.

------
Nutmog
For competition, it makes sense not to allow motors. But why is this also
somehow taboo for recreational cyclists? That's something I never understood.
They pay thousands for carbon fiber bikes and special wheels all to make
pedaling easier, but they could spend a fraction of that on electric
assistance which could have the same effect - do less work to ride the same
distance.

~~~
irl_zebra
It is absolutely not. In fact Specialized makes a couple models. They're a lot
of fun, but don't have wide adoption because they're a bit clunky and
certainly much heavier than many bikes. Plus they're quite expensive. The
people spending that much on a bike aren't the casual riding type typically
and are racing (where is is against the rules), and the casual riders rarely
spend that much on a bike.

I think they get much more widespread adoption when the systems get lighter
and cheaper.

[http://www.specialized.com/us/en/bikes/electric](http://www.specialized.com/us/en/bikes/electric)

~~~
tetraodonpuffer
there's already several fairly refined e-bikes around, look at the offerings
by Haibike for example, only a few models are available in North America, but
in Europe there is a very large selection

[http://www.haibike.de/produkte_liste_epower_en,3004.html](http://www.haibike.de/produkte_liste_epower_en,3004.html)

this said anecdotally I am seeing more and more people on e-bikes here in
North America too, bike commuting every day these days at least a few times a
week I get passed by somebody riding one of them, did not happen at all until
a few years back

------
marcoperaza
Not as hilarious as more low-tech cheating:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7E4vRtC7IcY](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7E4vRtC7IcY)

~~~
nailer
What am I looking for here?

~~~
michaelt
At the 13 second mark you'll see the rider at the front of the pack, in light
blue, getting approached by a car with the same colour scheme. Now try to keep
your eye on that rider to the end of the video.

~~~
nailer
Thanks!

------
tetraodonpuffer
I am wondering how long before only one bike is allowed for the stage, and
there are tamper-evident seals on the bottom bracket for all bikes.

This said I wonder what principle(s) the "handheld detector" was operating
under, maybe it could detect the winding(s) of the electrical motor via
inductance or something?

~~~
alistairSH
In cyclocross, a single bike is a non-starter. Muddy courses lead to frequent
bike changes and fast pit exchanges are part of the sport (not unlike pit
stops in F1). Even at the amateur level, the top racers have two bikes and a
mechanic in the pit to hand-off and clean bikes when the racer swaps them out.

~~~
userbinator
I think what the parent might be meaning is that a single manufacturer
produces all the bikes, so they're exactly the same, there's tamper-evident
seals, and the teams are given the bikes just before the race.

This sort of high-tech cheating reminds me of Smokey Yunick's various tricks (
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smokey_Yunick](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smokey_Yunick)
)

~~~
sharkweek
Way too much money in having the big name bike sponsors all involved.

------
hobolord
UCI will be releasing more information tomorrow, so hopefully there will be
pictures. This is huge news because while there have always been allegations,
nothing has ever been confirmed. Seems like they used some handheld device to
quickly check bikes that were in the pit.

~~~
ChuckMcM
Apparently they found a bike with a motor in it, in the pit of one of the
riders :
[https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=y&pr...](https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fsporza.be%2Fcm%2Fsporza%2Fwielrennen%2Fveldrijden%2F1.2559848&edit-
text=&act=url)

------
xgbi
> “I feel really terrible,” Belgian national team coach Rudy De Bie told
> Sporza. “This is a disgrace. I never imagined something like this would
> happen to our team. Why would a rider do this? Especially at such a young
> age. And who is responsible for her? I’m embarrassed on her behalf.”

Oh yeah? I can't imagine such a cheat would pass overhead of the coach. It
feels like VW executives saying it was a couple of zealous engineers..

~~~
nl
Cycling (especially on a national team) isn't like other sports. Most riders
have their own coach or trainer, and the national team only rides together for
a few times a year.

For example, Lance Armstrong's "coach" Chris Carmichael (notoriously) had
little to do with his training (Michelle Ferrari developed his training
programs). Carmichael probably knew about his drug use, but it's likely there
are plenty of other similar cases where a national coach had even less
contact.

"National Coach" is often more akin to a manager/selector role.

Notably, in this case her father was her trainer. Apparently her brother is
currently serving a suspension for EPO use[1].

[1] [http://cyclingtips.com/2016/01/more-details-emerge-about-
mot...](http://cyclingtips.com/2016/01/more-details-emerge-about-motorized-
doping-at-cyclo-cross-worlds/)

------
DanBC
How much motor and battery can you get in a competition bike frame?

How much advantage can that provide, after taking into consideration the extra
weight?

~~~
zootam
[http://www.vivax-assist.com/en/produkte/vivax-
assist-4-0/viv...](http://www.vivax-assist.com/en/produkte/vivax-
assist-4-0/vivax-assist_4-0.php)

“This model has three settings,” he explained. “It produces between 50 to 75
watts for about an hour and a half, does 150 watts for an hour and in its
highest setting, produces 250 watts for up to 30 minutes."

It can provide a substantial advantage at the high levels of competition.

~~~
alistairSH
Wow. I never imagined an in-frame motor/battery would produce that much power.

250W for 30 minutes is more than most non-racing recreational cyclists can
manage.

~~~
userbinator
Look at some of the brushless motors used in RC cars and planes ("drones" as
the terminology seems to be today...) --- the power densities are absolutely
amazing.

Here's a 4kW (more than 5HP!) motor that's less than 5cm in diameter and 10cm
long:

[http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__21967__turnigy_c5...](http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__21967__turnigy_c580l_580kv_brushless_inrunner_motor_4000w.html)

One problem with fitting these into a bike is that they require plenty of
active cooling to not overheat, but it shows that such power densities are
definitely possible. Especially if for intermittent use with long periods of
cooling. 4kW is also extreme overkill if all you're after is a small
competitive advantage. As for batteries, 250W for 30 minutes is 125Wh, around
the same energy as a typical 9-cell laptop battery.

~~~
hengheng
Problem with those motors is you have to get from 10krpm down to 60-110rpm at
the crank. This carries a surprisingly huge penalty in weight and efficiency,
up to a point where it's a good idea to just choose a different motor.

------
Luc
I am inclined to believe her when she says it's not her bike. In legal terms,
the chain of custody was likely broken, and a lookalike bike got accidentally
brought to the officials.

We'll see soon enough. With the amount of cameras and witnesses around it
shouldn't be too hard to get to the bottom of this.

It will be interesting to see how the battery was hidden.

In Dutch: [http://www.demorgen.be/sport/van-den-driessche-fiets-is-
van-...](http://www.demorgen.be/sport/van-den-driessche-fiets-is-van-vriend-
zou-nooit-vals-spelen-b2bcd4b0/)

~~~
dmurray
How could somebody have accidentally added a hidden motor and some electrical
controls to a racing bike? Why would someone "on her team, who sometimes
trains with her" have such a bike? It seems quite clear that either there was
cheating, or a very inventive attempt to frame her.

~~~
Luc
> How could somebody have accidentally added a hidden motor and some
> electrical controls to a racing bike?

I don't understand. Are you suggesting that's what I'm implying?

> Why would someone "on her team, who sometimes trains with her" have such a
> bike?

Because it's a bike from a previous season she sold to them (a well known
practice that even pro teams engage in to make some money on the side from
bikes they get from sponsors), and they added the motor? And it's not someone
on her team.

> It seems quite clear that either there was cheating, or a very inventive
> attempt to frame her.

There's no logical necessity for choosing only those two scenarios. Here's
another one: some guy bought an old bike of hers, added a motor so he could
seem like a tough guy (in case he kept it secret), and it got mistaken for one
of her bikes.

------
SixSigma
UPDATE: UCI confirms motorised doping uncovered at cyclo-cross World
Championships

> Van den Driessche was eventually forced off her bike on the final lap when
> she was struck by mechanical problems and ended up walking with her bike.
> Her bike was taken for inspection along with several other bikes after the
> race. It gives Van den Driessche the dubious honour of being the first rider
> to be discovered to be using a motor.

Which is slightly different to yesterday when it was reported as being
discovered in the pits.

------
marshray
Serious question: Why are cyclists such cheaters?

~~~
sharkweek
Let me introduce you to a little sport called baseball!

Also, I'm 99% sure the NFL's world is about to come crashing down when there
is some sort of forced acknowledgement of how many players are taking HGH

~~~
marshray
American professional sports are commercial entertainment.

Cycling can't seem to decide whether it's a clean contest of human performance
or a contest of artificial performance enhancement.

