
Take Naps at Work - aarohmankad
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/06/23/smarter-living/take-naps-at-work-apologize-to-no-one.html
======
rectang
For the last 8 years at work, I napped for 12-40 minutes basically every
afternoon. I headed out into the parking lot and slept in the back of my car.
(I bought the model I own after testing to make sure the back was nappable.)

My most productive, creative time was the hour or two in the late afternoon
following the nap.

All my co-workers knew the deal and so did my boss. Nobody else napped, but my
napping was normal and accepted.

The idea of giving that up if I ever go back to a "normal" butts-in-seats
company seems stupid and uncivilized.

~~~
wereHamster
If your boss and coworkers new about it, why didn't they provide you with
space inside the building to take naps? It's stupid having to walk outside and
nap in your car. Google has special quiet rooms where people can go take naps
and relax during the day.

~~~
hrktb
I think quiet rooms or rest spaces are difficult to maintain when there's too
few people using them.

At one company it ended up being a temporary closet room with printer supply
and all kind of stuff people randomly tossed in to clear the way. At my
current company there's so few people using it it smells dusty and closeted to
the point it's unusable to relax.

ad-hoc places worked better for me, like small meeting rooms that are unused
at noon, actual storage rooms that are actually very clean and tidy compared
to temporary ones, or even a park bench when weather is nice enough

~~~
TeMPOraL
One of the reasons I like to come to work late and leave late - in the evening
there's always a conference room available to hide in and do some productive
work, and there's even a good chance that by 5PM, all my cow-orkers will be
gone, so I'll have the whole office room for myself to either work or take a
nap first and then continue to ~8 PM.

My SO doesn't approve of this schedule though, so I do this only on days we're
not going to see each other.

------
beilabs
When I worked in China (5000 engineer company) we'd have our lunch in the
canteen, I found that many returned to their desk for the last 15 minutes of
their lunch break.

Out came the pillows, all lights were dimmed and calming music played through
the PA system. No-one spoke, made noise during this time; quick power nap of
15 minutes did the trick for a lot of people. Definitely something I approve
of; I've a small mattress in my office just for such occasions.

~~~
samsonradu
Curious if you were able to do the same? From what I've seen asians have this
ability to pretty much sleep _anywhere_ , planes, trains, buses anything. The
crappy chairs and noisy engines don't seem to bother them.

I don't think I could ever fall asleep in the lunch break, the morning coffee
and the light outside doesn't let my brain go off.

EDIT

I really don't mean to offend anyone, just curious whether the ability to fall
asleep in uncomfortable environments is something asian-specific.

~~~
yomly
One thing I've noticed is that people in the UK are way more considerate about
and sensitive to noise whereas the opposite is true to Asians.

Go to China and the level of ambient noise is much higher, whether that is
people talking louder or having no qualms playing music from their phone
speakers at any time of the day.

So at a guess, I think that cultural conditions probably lend themselves to
people of Asian heritage learning to sleep under noisier conditions. Of
course, these are all anecdata and generalisations so ymmv - fwiw, my personal
observations are somewhat in line with yours.

~~~
laumars
I cannot comment about Asian culture but conditioning does have a large part
to play in how people sleep.

Personal anecdote: when I grew up my parents lived on a busy main road so I
was used to sleeping in noisy conditions. I then moved to a quiet village - I
love how silent it is on a night - but I now cannot sleep in hotels nor
anywhere else unless it's absolutely silent.

~~~
yomly
Agreed, I am comfortable (almost too much so) sleeping anywhere.

They say in the army, your survival is predicated on being able to catch a
wink wherever possible.

As for sleeping in quiet places, one thing I've noticed is that my tinnitus is
only audible when I am _not_ in a city, as such there have been times where I
remember I have tinnitus and am temporarily unable to sleep because of it.

------
have_faith
>Sleeping on the job is one of those workplace taboos — like leaving your desk
for lunch

What kind of company is it a taboo to leave your desk for lunch?

~~~
bcoughlan
Here's a quote from a "day in the life" sheet I was sent after a phone
interview with Susquehanna. I didn't continue with the job interview for this
very reason:

"SIG partners with external caterers to provide a buffet lunch of main
courses, salads, soup, and dessert, and it changes on daily basis. So you grab
a plate and head back to your desk to eat; it will give you some time to catch
up on the latest tech and market news on the net as you eat."

~~~
mpfundstein
software improvement group?

~~~
MichielCuijpers
Software Improvement Group (SIG) = [https://www.sig.eu](https://www.sig.eu)

~~~
mpfundstein
yes. that is why I asked. I had good experience with the Software Improvement
Group and can't recall such tyranny.

------
peterburkimsher
Lunchtime naps are common in Taiwan. Someone will turn off the light in the
office at the start of the lunch break, and turn it back on at the end.

That change of lighting encourages everyone to take a rest or leave, because
staying will disturb the people who want to rest. It also saves a little
electricity, I suppose.

~~~
gurkendoktor
I've only experienced this in a university, not in an office, but it was
really easy to fall asleep when everyone around you does the same (even easier
than alone, IMHO).

------
freeflight
I'm really envious of people who are actually able to take naps because it
just doesn't work for me. By the time I actually "phase out", for which I need
at least like 20-30 minutes, most of my lunch break would already be over,
resulting in me waking up all groggy and irritated.

~~~
eloisant
Being able to sleep anytime, anywhere is basically something you can train to.
When you do, it's extremely powerful to stay alert.

As a starter you don't have to make actual naps, just close your eyes and rest
for a few minutes.

~~~
freeflight
Everytime I try that it leads to the same outcome: By the time I relax I feel
so good about that state that I'm just pissed off when I'm forced out of it,
so I don't even want to get there in the first place.

You maybe know about any good online resources for nap training?

~~~
awiesenhofer
No resources needed, you just have to keep at it:

    
    
      * lay down
      * set a 20 minutes timer
      * close your eyes and try to relax, don't open them until the timer rings, even if you are not sleeping
      * repeat daily, ideally around the same time every day
    

Took me a week but now I sleep almost instantly

If you have troubles getting up afterwards, try a powernap: drinking one cup
of coffee right before napping. The caffeine will kick in at about the same
time your nap ends.

------
daxfohl
Better: eat less lunch. Ever since I've started having no more than a moderate
bowl of low-cal (not "diet", just not "vitamix'd pizza") soup, the second half
of the day is just as productive as the first. If I eat enough for a food
coma, I go home; I'd provide no useful anything for the rest of the day, nap
or no, so no sense hiding it by merely being around.

~~~
oridecon
Isn't more about the type of food you eat instead of just calories? I tried to
eat less but then I end it up having to eat again in the middle of the day.

~~~
daxfohl
I don't know. I've been limiting myself to ~400 kcal. About half of the time
this is chicken, veg, and whole-wheat noodle soup. That's still a reasonable
size portion, and I guess has some vitamins but I'm not a vitamin counter by
any means. I do whatever makes me feel good, and this does the trick for me. I
used to go to restaurants a lot more, but now hardly ever. And I really do
stick to the "if I'm not going to be useful I go home" thing, and fortunately
I'm in a group that's fine with it so long is it doesn't affect deadlines.
Maybe once a month I'll cave to the urge to eat a big whatever and immediately
regret it.

------
oneeyedpigeon
> Naps at work can make you more productive. Maybe don’t be this obvious about
> it, though.

That image caption sums up the prevailing attitude for me, really: don't be
obvious that you're being more productive, especially if it goes against the
grain. Better to toe the line and be less productive. There are many examples
of the same phenomenon, beyond just napping.

------
innopreneur
In India, this seems to be common in households. You would find family members
taking an hour or so nap after lunch. Even during festivals or occasions, host
arranges nap session for guests. Though it is seen as unprofessional in
offices. Until few years ago I used to think those people as lazy and
unproductive but now perspective seems to be changing.

------
suneilp
I like meditation better. I want a meditation room at work, complete
isolation, with options for sitting and lying down. Deep meditation has become
useful for me to relax and recharge. Also, when you get good at it, it helps
you solve things faster when you get stuck on a problem.

~~~
aryamaan
Tell us more. How do you (deep) meditate?

I do meditation here and there and mostly follow this:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4928060](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4928060)

------
lz400
The difficult part for me is avoiding napping during 50% of my conference
calls.

~~~
weavie
I did at one point consider trying to hook into my web cam so I could feed
prerecorded footage of me being awake allowing me to nap without anyone
noticing. This was at a point where meetings were compulsory, excessive and
completely pointless.

~~~
mpfundstein
genius idea

------
overcast
I work about 5 minutes from my house. I get to go home, in silence, grab some
food, and nap in my own bed. It makes ALL the difference in the world.

------
spike021
At my job, I always feel like it's frowned upon to take a nap. In most cases
we're a "as long as you get your work done, we can be flexible with hours"
kind of shop. But the moment I close my eyes even for just a few short
moments, someone either taps me or later mentions "man, you look exhausted,
are you okay?"

Power naps make me feel more refreshed, which I'd assume people would want out
of their coworker/employee late in the work day, but maybe I'm wrong.

------
blhack
I don't think I could physically fall asleep at work. Are people really this
tired while they're at their offices?

It seems like if you're so tired while you're at work that you actually want
to take a _nap_ , then maybe there is another underlying problem.

~~~
yokisan
> It seems like if you're so tired while you're at work that you actually want
> to take a nap, then maybe there is another underlying problem.

There is: tiredness. Often, but not always, due to lack of sleep. A nap is the
solution.

If you need 8 glasses of water a day to be at peak-performance but for
whatever reason only manage to drink 7 in the morning, why not have that final
glass sometime during the day? Same with sleep.

In fact it's absurd to think everybody can store energy upfront and power
through 9 hours of activity without falling off towards the end.

Naps are natural.

~~~
Scarblac
But it's not normal for adults to sleep so badly that you need naps during the
day, apart from having very young kids. So other than that I'd say there may
well be an underlying problem.

~~~
schtitt
If you could help me and 25% of everyone [1] figure out that underlying
problem, we would be super grateful!

[1]
[http://www.bbc.co.uk/science/humanbody/sleep/articles/sleepd...](http://www.bbc.co.uk/science/humanbody/sleep/articles/sleepdisorders.shtml)

~~~
Scarblac
I was going to argue that that article itself lists a number of underlying
problems and what can be done about them, but that number is much higher than
I expected and clearly there are many people who just don't sleep well during
the night.

Consider my opinion changed.

------
ck425
I've regularly taken naps at lunch too and found they make a big difference to
afternoon productivity. I've found walking also has a similar effects,
especially on grass. I normally do one or the other depending on how well I
slept the night before.

How long do people find most effective? I've found either 12 min or 30 min to
be best for me. 30 min if I'm particularly tired, 12 min if not. If I go
longer than 12 I get foggy for around 30 min after.

------
flor1s
Here in Japan it's very common to take naps during the day. Personally I don't
take naps but I try to take enough rest during the night. Taking naps during
the day might actually hurt your ability to sleep in the evening.
[https://www.verywell.com/30-days-to-better-sleep-go-to-
bed-o...](https://www.verywell.com/30-days-to-better-sleep-go-to-bed-only-
when-sleepy-3973903)

------
drmanny
What if your boss is about to catch you napping under your desk and you have
to call a friend and convince him to call in a bomb threat so you can escape?

~~~
logfromblammo
A bomb? George's desk is built like a bunker! I'll hide under it until they
sound the all clear!

------
nstricevic
I nap for 20 minutes every day at work (at my previous company, for 4 years or
so and now since I'm working remotely). Here are my steps for taking a nap:

1\. Find a good place to nap. Use the same place every day. I used to nap
under my desk on a lazy bag at my last job.

2\. Quickly find a comfortable position. Quickly fix everything that bothers
you (like watch on your wrist or anything else that's making you
uncomfortable).

3\. Start breathing from your stomach - not your upper torso. Your stomach
should raise up and down, not your upper torso.

4\. Relax your whole body. In the beginning, start by relaxing one by one
region. First your toes. Then your lower leg, then your upper leg. Then the
other leg... Until you relax your whole body. It should feel as your mind is
separate from your body. Like it could go out of it. Your body should be
completely numb. Later, as you progress, you will be able to relax your whole
body with a few breaths. As if some force flows from your stomach and removes
spasm from your body as you breath out.

5\. Start removing thoughts from your brain. As you start thinking about
something, just stop. Another thought comes in. Kill it. Just kill thoughts.
You can think only about your breathing. Nothing else.

That's it. With these steps, I'm able to feel a sleep in just a few moments. I
use that all the time.

Bonus: I have a special position that I "developed" that mitigates office
sounds. I nap on my back, slightly turned on left side. I put my left ear on
the pillow or a lazy bag. I put my right hand over my right ear and over my
head. That way, a pillow isolates my left ear, while my right biceps isolates
my right ear from sounds. I found this to be very effective.

Good luck napping.

------
amelius
I'll make sure that article is visible in my browser while I'm taking that
nap.

------
partycoder
In Japan this is called inemuri. However there is etiquette associated to
sleeping on the job.

I've heard in some cases there are secret nap meetings where all the attendees
agree to take a nap.

~~~
logfromblammo
That's brilliant. But how do you safeguard against a defector reporting
against the rest of the group?

~~~
partycoder
Taking naps is seen as a good thing, it means you are tired from too much
working. In fact, some people fake it.

------
comstock
My feeling is that apart from really essential meetings (and those are very
few) your schedule should be pretty open and sleep/break/nap when you want
(ideally at home).

Then use metrics other than bums on seats to measure performance.

------
Osiris
My office had two small nap rooms in the break room. A small bench-like bed, a
blanket, and a sliding door that makes a dark room. It's bed really to take a
20 minute break to refresh and refocus.

------
elchief
I wonder how long it takes things like work productivity tips on HN to filter
out to the real world?

~~~
maxxxxx
Probably never. Naps are nothing new and companies who believe in them already
have nap rooms or similar. Same for open office layouts. It's pretty well
established that a lot of people hate them and find they hurt productivity but
companies still use them.

~~~
elchief
Maybe. What I was trying to say is that you generally see pretty forward-
thinking stuff on here, or in the SF computer industry in general, but it
often doesn't (yet) apply to the average worker

------
closed
Before I started drinking coffee, I had a solid nap flow going. Now that
coffee is in the picture, I'd probably just lay there for 20 minutes twitching
:/.

~~~
quotemstr
Don't worry: your tolerance will eventually reach a level such that you would
have to consume physically impossible amounts of coffee for it to have any
effect.

~~~
closed
"Congratulations you have reached complete habituation + crippling
dependence!"

------
rdtsc
Don't unless you're sure people won't talk behind your back and management
won't get the wrong impression. "Look at so and so snoring while we are
working hard getting stuff out of the door".

Rationally you'll explain and show the article from NYT, and they'll agree.
But irrationally they'll still form an opinion and stick to it.

~~~
rectang
Another reason to prefer working remote, at least part of the time!

------
notadoc
I don't understand napping, never have. Are you really that tired that you
must sleep in the middle of the day? Maybe you just need better rest at night,
or maybe you need to exercise more or eat better food? Unless you're a toddler
then napping feels like compensating for something else.

To each their own, if it works for you that's great.

~~~
Delmania
> I don't understand napping, never have. Are you really that tired that you
> must sleep in the middle of the day?

I exercise 5 times a day, and I eat a very clean diet. Not keto or paleo, but
definitely low in carbs, high in fat and vegetables etc. I still sleep for 20
minutes at lunch. Human adults are tuned to feel sleepy after being up for 8
hours or so.

------
aluhut
I'm pretty sure that it wouldn't be allowed where I work. Even though it's an
US company, it's being led by Germans and in some offices they will already
complain if you eat too long. "Take Naps at Work. Apologize to No One." would
be a pretty dangerous statement there.

~~~
th4dv
> Even though it's an US company

It always amazes me when someone just assumes that US companies are somehow
superior to the rest of the world. I've worked for a couple of US based
companies and the experience was shit compared to other non-US companies I
worked for.

~~~
aluhut
I wouldn't say "superior". I don't know anybody who'd have assumed that at
all. You must have gotten that wrong somehow. Especially in my business,
people assume German companies to be far more superior (which is also not
really true based on my experience).

However, you do expect some kind of "business culture" especially because the
company usually forces the advertisement for it onto you whether you want or
not. Our floor are plastered with Fremdscham posters and phrases in english.
Often you also hear a manager in a meeting praising some new trope from the
East Coast regarding office layout or similar.

What really sticks with is the informal "you" though. It's really helpful most
of the time.

------
menzoic
NYTimes HQ has 3 nap rooms on different floors. Not sure how many people knew
about it.

------
pmarcelino
I've been doing naps at work for the last year, since I started to try
polyphasic sleep. Naps play an essential role in my polyphasic strategy. Those
30 minutes I spend sleeping after lunch save me some sleep hours during night.
You can get some data points about naps and its importance in this book (which
I recommend): [https://www.amazon.co.uk/Sleep-Myth-Hours-Power-
Recharge/dp/...](https://www.amazon.co.uk/Sleep-Myth-Hours-Power-
Recharge/dp/0241975972/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1498658901&sr=8-2&keywords=sleep+book)

------
ltwdm
I think age plays a role too- a few years ago I would have laughed at the idea
of someone having to take a break and rest in the middle of an 8 hour period
to regain energy. But I can now clearly see how that matters.

------
ksk
Do the companies who allow naps see it as a perk or a necessity? IOW, if you
see naps as beneficial would you be OK with people taking them during a
product release, or a service interruption?

~~~
twobyfour
A nap being a "necessity" doesn't necessarily mean that taking it at whatever
time you want is a necessity. Take the nap before or after the release; or
after service is restored. It's not that complicated.

FWIW, I don't see why it would have to be either a perk or a necessity, rather
than a potential productivity booster that shouldn't be mandatory but can be
beneficial to both the employee and the company. I would put things like
allowing employees to listen to music on headphones while at work into the
same bucket.

~~~
ksk
>Take the nap before or after the release; or after service is restored. It's
not that complicated.

But if it is indeed a potential productivity booster, why would you skip the
nap during service interruptions or product releases?

~~~
twobyfour
Because most people can still be productive without a nap, just marginally
less productive. And in many cases time is money.

Unless your service interruption is lasting all day (in which case you have
bigger problems), it's much better for the company to get the site back up in
10 minutes than to wait 30 minutes for you to finish your nap and then get it
back up in 8 minutes. Especially if you're losing $10K in revenue (or more)
for every minute of downtime.

Whereas the work you'll be doing once the service is back up can be done more
efficiently or creatively or thoughtfully after a nap, but won't suffer from
being pushed back half an hour.

Releases, well, that depends on your release process.

~~~
ksk
I wasn't arguing one way or the other. I wanted to see if people thought it
was a massive boost or just a marginal one. Seems like you think its marginal.

~~~
twobyfour
I'd suspect it differs from person to person. I guess I answered as I did
because the way the question was phrased set up what seems to me to be a false
dichotomy.

When you say "perk", I think of something that's offered to attract employees
because it goes beyond what's typically expected from a baseline office (be it
free soda, gym memberships, or $3000 chairs).

When you say "necessity," I think of something the employee can't be
reasonably productive or present without (a desk, an internet connection, a
keyboard, a restroom).

There's a lot of stuff that fits in between or outside those two categories.
There are things that are above the absolute necessity baseline but too much
within the level of expectation to be considered a perk. Free coffee comes to
mind. So does a microwave in the break room/kitchen. Or (on the west coast) a
casual dress code.

Others aren't there specifically to make the job more attractive to employees
- but may have that effect on some (an open floor plan; a well defined
professional development ladder). You'll notice that some of these are neutral
or a turn-off to other employees. They also tend to be things that the company
leadership will help make the company more effective.

So I don't see something like allowing headphones while working as either.
It's too mundane and expected to be a perk; and as an employee I may consider
it a necessity, but I'm pretty sure my employer just sees it as part of a
relaxed culture and a way to mitigate the distractions of the open floor plan.

Naps are certainly not a necessity from almost any employer's POV. An employee
is generally expected to be able to be productive without one; and they're far
from an expectation in any job in the US. They're certainly not necessities.
For some employees they'd be seen as a perk, while (as this HN discussion
seems to demonstrate) others would disdain a culture that accepted naps. But I
suspect that companies that allow them consider them to be a part of the
culture rather than a perk - something that's less about making the job seem
attractive and more about creating a more pleasant and effective work
environment.

Does that make any sense?

------
rosege
There are definitely days when I've wished my workplace had a nap room. Maybe
I've had a busy few days and I just get a bit more tired than normal after
lunch. It makes sense to me - if I'm tired at 2pm then I normally have another
3.5 hours until clock off. If I dont nap they wont be very productive. If I
could nap I would only lose half an hour then be productive for the other 3+
hours. I would probably stay longer anyway so its no lost time to my employer
anyway.

------
beat
One of the nice things about working from home, for me, is the ability to take
the occasional nap when I'm dragging. It takes me about 15 minutes to get what
I need... once I hit a half hour, it becomes counterproductive as I'm starting
to "sleep" rather than "nap".

Most nights, I do get sufficient sleep, but I need the occasional nap anyway.

------
peterkshultz
A study by NASA found that the optimal time for a nap was 26 minutes.

The lengthy study can be found
[here]([http://www.jetlog.com/fileadmin/downloads/NASA_TM_94_108839....](http://www.jetlog.com/fileadmin/downloads/NASA_TM_94_108839.pdf)).

------
SirLJ
This is the greatest benefit of working from home (or second greatest if you
have a lot of traffic to fight)... Around lunch, do a quick 30min exercise,
protein shake, lay down, read a bit and fall asleep for 30 minute and you'll
feel like you have one more productive day in the afternoon...

------
baby
I'm all for this, but I think it's also important not to eat too much for
lunch and to do sport, you probably won't feel like taking naps during the day
as much.

------
kraftman
Or you could work shorter hours and get a decent nights sleep.

------
fixesCrashes
And here I'm, on a holiday, pretending to provide IT support to five
employees. The other 90+ employees chose not to work on holiday. I hate
society...

------
inestyne
This goes back to the days when people drank much more, at work, at lunch,
etc...

In a drinking culture, nodding off at your desk is a very very bad thing
because it means you can't handle your liquor and this just could not be
tolerated. Due to all the drinking, with management and clients, if you had a
problem your were a liability. It's insane but it was another time. Not my
generation but I've had conversations.

Napping now, with the amount of real work we all do. The stress level we are
willing to carry. It's just not anybody's business anymore.

------
quotemstr
I find nap rooms useful for those days when I've been there all night and need
to have a semblance of functionality for meeting the next day.

------
oridecon
My coworker used to take a nap and fart really loud without noticing. I'm not
trying to be funny I just worry I might do the same.

~~~
weavie
What was the worst thing that happened to your coworker as a result of his
farting?

~~~
oridecon
It's just pretty embarrassing. I understand some people don't care (like him
because he was told about it by multiple people) but I do.

------
malkia
Where I work, go/nap is respected. If I see a teammate napping, I would try to
be less noisy, and leave him/her to rest.

------
sgspace
Napping is fireable offense at my company. :(

------
deskglass
How do you take naps? It takes me an hour or two to fall asleep. I don't drink
coffee.

------
carrja99
I quit energy drinks 3 months ago, taking a nap during lunch has been
immensely important.

------
raoulr
Technique around here is to nap in the car. 15 minutes is usually enough to be
refreshed.

------
bakul
I found that I _don 't_ feel sleepy after lunch if I work while standing up.
But if I sit in a chair I can feel sleepy and a five minute nap makes for a
more productive afternoon than fighting the sleepiness. Has anyone else
observed this effect of curing after lunch sleepiness by standing up?

------
bitwize
I'll take "fast tracks to a pink slip" for $800, Alex.

------
cortexio
nytimes.. i'll skip

~~~
dang
Please don't post unsubstantive comments to HN.

~~~
cortexio
it being "unsubstantive" is your opinion. I think it's important to look at
the author/company behind the article, so i can determine if it can be taken
seriously or not.

