
Will Industry Agree to a Meaningful Do Not Track? - Garbage
https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2012/04/will-industry-agree-meaningful-do-not-track
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methodin
Do Not Target would then be equivalent to security cameras, so I see that is
the ultimate outcome.

You cannot viably eliminate tracking via Do Not Track... the entire modern
Internet is based on the concept of tracking.

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makecheck
The "do not track" concept relies on 3rd party decency and you don't have to
look much further than the spam in your Inbox to see how well _that_ works. A
do-not-track request is like saying "please don't take my lunch money"; that
request would be honored by almost everyone but do you think it would change
what a bully does? If you put something valuable in your front yard with a
sign that says "property of Joe Smith", sure it might stay there a few
hours...but eventually someone will come along and take your property anyway.

In the real world you might be able to find witnesses and involve the police
to deal with a theft. On the Internet there's nobody to report a "do not
track" violation to and no reliable way to punish anyone who simply ignores
what you say. The 3rd party doing the tracking can be _anyone in the world_.

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philwise
I can't see how the online business can afford to allow Do Not Track. Put the
other way: you can only have gmail if you agree hand over your personal
information to Google.

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tjoff
_Put the other way: you can only have gmail if you agree hand over your
personal information to Google._

That would be soo awesome!

Also, from where comes this belief that tracking generates such an absurd
amount of money? It _must_ be some sort of "it will be valuable in the future"
thinking going on because today it can't mean much.

 _IF_ tracking was so effective it would be something that the customer wanted
(and there you have it - that's how the online business will survive, by
actually producing something that the customer wants). Now it's just sad and
the only real feature of tracking and content aware ads is that when there
have been an ax murder you will get a discount on axes - which is so bad it is
kind of funny.

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mononcqc
This thing about discount on axes would likely still happen without tracking.
Tracking in itself will allow to do things like do frequency capping (do not
want to display the same ad 400 times to the same person), give higher values
to displaying ads many times (second time is worth more!), or to display ads
to someone we know has visited one of the ads' customer websites.

The general idea is to be able to do this kind of regrouping, and it is, for
all purposes, anonymous past what a browser can usually send (IP addresses
allowing to derive geographical location) unless you try to use tracking to
generate some very precise information on a user. This is generally useless to
do because real information will come from third parties and you don't need to
do all that work by yourself.

That is to say, I'm much more worried about a company like google doing
tracking when they know my mobile phone number, age, gender, name, occupation,
etc. Than any third-party tracking business that will pretty much never know
these things for sure, except when a business like Google or Facebook will
tell them about it.

In general though, all of this tracking is much less worse than whatever use
of a credit card I make, given they openly do much more invasive searches and
can do far more with this information than most online businesses, limited to
displaying ads that might or might not fit my likings better.

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serverhorror
After reading all 3 parts of the series the thing that bugs me most right now
is:

Heck, those are great ideas! I'd like to write a tracking system that does
everything possible to collect the data and uniquely identify the users! It
doesn't sound that hard.

I wonder how many of those tracking companies find the "Privacy Awareness"
articles actually to be very nice "How to better track your users" articles.

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gouranga
Sorry for the shortness of the reply:

No.

Simply because it's contrary to capitalist ideals.

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EvilTerran
As long as the ads & analytics industries continue to see the options as
"meaningful Do Not Track" or "indiscriminately grab all the data you can",
then I agree.

However, as the article suggests:

 _If [the industry refuses a meaningful Do Not Track], Internet users who do
not want their online reading habits recorded by invisible tracking companies
will have only one choice: use ad blocking tools to stop online tracking code
themselves. In order for this to work, they will have to block a huge portion
of the advertising on the Web, too._

If indiscriminate tracking keeps becoming increasingly obnoxious and/or
insidious, it will eventually overcome the users' apathy, and they'll fight
indiscriminate tracking with indiscriminate blocking. Users have the power to
kill the internet tracking industries, they just don't have the will (yet). A
meaningful Do Not Track option would show that the industries were willing to
compromise with the users, which would go a long way to defuse the growing
will to do away with them.

Refusing to compromise with the people who have the power to destroy you is
never a good plan in the long term. Ask Louis XVI, or the Tsars.

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gyardley
If enough people use ad blocking technologies, the ads and analytics
industries will simply switch to server-side / invisible-to-the-end-user
options.

The only reason why tracking and ad serving isn't done like this today is
because it's a pain in the ass and there's high switching costs. Make current
practices unprofitable, and switching suddenly looks appealing.

A lot of previously theoretical workarounds are being quietly turned into
commercial products these days. As a consequence of all the privacy fuss,
there's a good chance you'll end up with less privacy than before.

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EvilTerran
Eh, it's an arms-race, if the tracking systems move on-server, then adblock et
al will adapt to still block them, or be replaced by something that does.

I could see either the trackers or the anonymisers coming out on top. Or we
could end up with single-user:single-identity type walled gardens and darknets
running side-by-side.

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eof
They probably won't agree, though I have no basis for that claim other than
witnessing capitalism-in-motion for so many years.

However, does it really matter? With things like ad-block, ghostery, noscript,
etc; in the end the consumer more or less has the final say. Awareness of
these type of plugins will only become more ubiquitous over time as the world
becomes more and more tech savvy; and/or this tracking has a negative effect
on consumers that they actually feel.

If someone cares enough to look for a do-not-track setting, likely they can be
bothered to find a plugin that enforces it.

In the end though I agree with `methodin`; the line for tracking is really
fuzzy without breaking basic functionality. The nature of the internet is such
that users are going to have to take their anonymity, in-so-much as they
desire it, into their own hands; and tools that make it easy for them will
continue to be, and I presume grow, ever more successful.

