
The Origins of Hatred for Pigeons (2016) - poppypetalmask
https://www.audubon.org/news/the-origins-our-misguided-hatred-pigeons
======
lb1lf
"Poisoning pigeons in the park" by Tom Lehrer

Spring is here A-suh-puh-ring is here Life is skittles and life is beer I
think the loveliest time Of the year is the spring I do, don't you? 'Course
you do But there's one thing That makes spring complete for me And makes every
Sunday A treat for me

All the world seems in tune On a spring afternoon When we're poisoning pigeons
in the park Every Sunday you'll see My sweetheart and me As we poison the
pigeons in the park When they see us coming The birdies all try an' hide But
they still go for peanuts When coated with cyanide

The sun's shining bright Everything seems all right When we're poisoning
pigeons in the park We've gained notoriety And caused much anxiety In the
Audubon Society With our games They call it impiety And lack of propriety And
quite a variety Of unpleasant names But it's not against any religion To want
to dispose of a pigeon

So if Sunday you're free Why don't you come with me And we'll poison the
pigeons in the park And maybe we'll do In a squirrel or two While we're
poisoning pigeons in the park We'll murder them all Amid laughter and
merriment Except for the few We take home to experiment

My pulse will be quickenin' With each drop of strych'nine We feed to a pigeon
(It just takes a smidgin!) To poison a pigeon in the park

[https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=yhuMLpdnOjY](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=yhuMLpdnOjY)

~~~
TheHegemon
Apparently it's a popular theme:

Do you ever have that feeling that you want to punch the ceiling

So you stamp down on the floor, you can't take it anymore,

In your search for absolution there is only one solution,

Kick a pigeon in the park.

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YZstUnhT6eI](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YZstUnhT6eI)

------
justboxing
I've been shat on by pigeons about half a dozen times in 3 different
countries. It's a consequence of living in cities as Pigeons are mostly urban
dwellers, the same way you probably stepped on dog shit cos the owner didn't
scoop it. I don't hate pigeons though, I befriended one guy (could be a girl,
who knows) in my patio a year ago here in San Francisco. He had a slight
cripple from getting his leg run over. He shows up at the same time every
morning for his feed. I usually give him leftover rice or bread and sometimes
pumpkin seeds.

I love pigeons. Pigeons are very smart birds[1] and are supposed to have
understanding of advanced concepts like time and space.[2]. Humans
understandably hate them cos no-one likes getting "shit on" like literally.
And since we have guns and poison, we find justifications for mass killing of
a species that we declare is a 'nuisance' to our lives.

Vaguely related: Mike Tyson Defends the Pigeon:
[https://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/05/04/bird-week-
mike...](https://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/05/04/bird-week-mike-tyson-
defends-the-pigeon/) ]

[1] How Smart Is This Bird? Let It Count the Ways -
[https://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/23/science/pigeons-can-
learn...](https://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/23/science/pigeons-can-learn-higher-
math-as-well-as-monkeys-study-suggests.html)

[2] Pigeons are smart enough to perceive abstract concepts like time and space
- [https://qz.com/1147518/pigeons-are-smart-enough-to-
perceive-...](https://qz.com/1147518/pigeons-are-smart-enough-to-perceive-
abstract-concepts-like-time-and-space/)

------
jvannistelrooy
I'm one of those people who dislikes pigeons, and it's interesting to read
that at least my belief that pigeons can spread disease doesn't hold much
truth.

Personally, I can't relate to the explanation that "pigeon haters" don't like
nature crossing over into their orderly city environment. For example, I do
like the tons of blackbirds and sparrows in my city.

~~~
Someguywhatever
I lived in a building which was "affected" by pigeons, they filled the nearby
balconies with their feces. It was disgusting. I complained to management,
nothing was done. They were loud and annoying early in the morning, crapped
all over everything, it was maddening. Although pigeons are pretty smart, you
can teach them to fear you and even to fear coming anywhere near your balcony,
which is what I did. By constantly scaring the bejeesus out of them every time
they came near. They eventually decided that the pleasure of crapping on my
balcony wasn't worth the terror I would inflict on them.

~~~
Rjevski
I had a pigeon problem at one of my previous gigs. The fire escape (where we’d
frequently go out to smoke/vape, or try to) was a biohazard area. There was an
inches-thick layer of fecal matter coating the ground, it was crackling if you
attempted to walk on there, and the smell was toxic. Nevertheless, the pigeons
appreciated this situation and were nesting in there. _Something_ was
regularly killing them (either a predator or disease) and so someone had to
undertake the perilous task of disposing of the bodies otherwise they’d stink
up the place even more. I still remember sending an invoice with a “dead
pigeon removal” line item.

------
cwmma
> They’re certainly noisy, and they defecate on people and property with
> abandon (and in great volume—a pigeon produces a hefty 25 pounds of
> excrement per year), but you can say the same about lots of animals.

No you really can't, I have never been shat on by any wild animal besides a
pigeon. What animal besides a pigeon shits on a statue so much it visibly
coats it in a layer, squirrels certainly don't.

Seriously it's the shit.

~~~
LoSboccacc
as anecdotal as it might be I've been shat on by a seagull and let me tell you
it isn't pretty.

Dublin has a real problem with those pests.

~~~
eecc
In San Marco square, Venice I saw a seagull fly over a tourist and snatch a
pizza right out of his hands. Pretty smart and agile animals, can’t say the
same of pigeons (although it’s somewhat a blessing, considering their numbers)

------
trukterious
An interesting word I learnt from listening to Daniel Dennett: _synanthrope_.
Such creatures include pigeons, rats, barnswallows, bed bugs. They benefit
from living around humans without providing much in the way of return service.

There does seem to be a trend for embracing and celebrating animals which
formerly have been considered ugly or pestilent. For example my son was
recently introduced to a tarantula named Miss Fuzzyboots. In parody we have
Hagrid of the Harry Potter films trotting out dangerous and/or repulsive
beasts for class appreciation ("They're seriously misunderstood creatures...")

Is this a sort of moral/aesthetic inversion or are we genuinely expanding our
'circle of empathy'?

[http://adami.natsci.msu.edu/blog/2013/04/the-evolution-of-
ci...](http://adami.natsci.msu.edu/blog/2013/04/the-evolution-of-circle-of-
empathy.html)

------
wemdyjreichert
I don't like pigeons because they overbreed and have become a nuisance. They
also poop, a lot. That's reason enough.

~~~
Taylor_OD
The geese in Chicago are the same way. They have dominated the lakefront in
some areas. Walking in grass is a guaranteed way to step in nasty green bird
shit. They also are fairly large and can be intimidating if you get too close
to them.

I love having animals around but without any real predators these birds seem
to over breed.

~~~
lainga
Even up here in Canada, there are people the government hires to keep the
population of our national animal down, which apparently involves going up to
them and pulling their heads off (very easy because of their thin necks).
Because the alternative is, yes, you can't use any grass area for 5 months out
of the year.

~~~
Kluny
This sounds like the plot of the book Wringer, but I never imagined it was a
thing in real life. Really?

~~~
lainga
After looking at the book, yes, it's the exact same. They can be grounded in
groups by shotgun first, like in the book, although I've heard they're stupid
enough to be approached and killed barehanded. In other seasons they spray the
eggs with oil while the parents are gone, and then replace them in the nest,
to starve the eggs of oxygen and prevent the chicks from developing. If you
take the eggs outright the geese will just lay more.

It would be nice if we could open hunting season on them and let them all get
killed in a sporting way, but they're said to be repulsive and inedible.

Here's a government publication on it dealing with my area specifically
(southern BC).

[https://www.ec.gc.ca/mbc-
com/6D2B893B-C671-41AF-8439-713305D...](https://www.ec.gc.ca/mbc-
com/6D2B893B-C671-41AF-8439-713305DB384C/Handbook_Canada_Cackling_Geese_e%5B1%5D.pdf)

------
tagrun
Is this an American thing? The author is talking about "hatred for pigeons" as
if it's something universal, but that's pretty much strange for me.

~~~
sergioj97
I'm from Spain and even though we generally despise them and also refer to
them as "rats with wings", I don't believe I would say I hate them.

I mean, they can be annoying. But if I see someone feeding a group of pigeons
the last thing I'm going to think about is how annoying those pigeons can be.
I feel like the article describes the hatred for pigeons as something almost
anthropologically interesting because of it's magnitude and lack of actual
sense, and I certainly only consider them a little annoyance.

However I don't live in a big city so maybe it has to do with that.

------
DoubleCribble
I thought this was a solved problem. Is there some reason why we don't have
more urban raptors? Are the city pigeons so fouled with urban byproducts that
their consumption eventually kills off any unwitting predators?

~~~
Tade0
There are several problems, but one is that raptors tend to well, fly off
eventually.

There are currently three hawk families in Warsaw - one of them occupying a
nest built specifically for this purpose which nevertheless was empty for five
years before the new couple moved in.

~~~
User23
The other is that raptors are very bad at dealing with cars. Their
evolutionary strengths are seeing far and killing fast. Traffic? Not so much.

Rock doves and crows on the other hand deal with or even benefit from cars.

------
User23
Pro-tip to not get shat upon by birds: look at the ground and avoid the areas
where you see bird poop.

