
Ask HN: What do you do when you suddenly feel like not working anymore? - budhajeewa
1. It&#x27;s Saturday morning.<p>2. You start coding in your side-project.<p>3. A couple of hours go by.<p>4. You feel like, &quot;I&#x27;m tired. Let&#x27;s do this tomorrow.&quot;.<p>5. You also would like to ship it ASAP too.<p>What do you do?
======
no1youknowz
Firstly.

> 5\. You also would like to ship it ASAP too.

Take that away from your mindset immediately! You can't do anything ASAP. I am
a firm dis-believer of, "I can build it in a weekend".

Take a bit of paper and actually map out the project. Break it down into small
pieces. Now start to work on the first piece, then take a break if needed.
When you start again, work on the next.

Doing things this way, gives you multiple benefits:

1) allows your brain to focus on the task at hand. Otherwise it starts to
focus on the entire project and thats when you short-circuit.

2) gives you a sense of accomplishment and you see your project go from start
to finish.

3) allows you to easily come back to the project if you decide to take a long
break from it.

It's also important that if you see things that you want to change. STOP! Take
out another piece of paper and write down things for version 2. Now carry on
with the work.

It's also worth mentioning, perhaps to keep some kind of journal with notes.
So you can tell yourself things to investigate should you come across them in
dealing with a problem.

Once you have finished and shipped version 1. You can then decide if you want
to start again or wait until other things happen. Such as a community forming,
you get stars on github, do a show HN. Whatever the ultimate goal is for the
project.

Or you can decide to write another side project.

Ultimately, it's your time. Learn to use it well.

Btw, this is coming from someone who has built 40 side projects that easily
could be their own SaaS start-ups thus far.

~~~
davelnewton
ASAP doesn't mean "immediately", it means "as soon as _possible_ ". What's
"possible" depends on what's being done and expectations. Managing
expectations is key.

------
Tade0
I do chores - it's a great tool for gauging how unwilling you are to code at
the moment.

Yesterday my bathroom sink received some much needed care.

Also eventually you'll get so fed up with this that you'll gladly return to
your side project.

Conversely guilting yourself into programming when you really don't want to is
one way to abandon any after-hours work altogether.

~~~
jkmcf
This is one of my favorites, especially if the chore has been ignored for a
while.

~~~
Gandria
chores are my best thinking time! I can't recommend doing the chores for
restoring intellectual productivity plus the very probable (if you're not
living alone, but satisfaction either way) boost from doing good by your
roommates.

I am certain that the benefits of doing chores for intellectual stimulation
arise from the very familiar, routine like properties of most household
chores.

Chop wood, carry water, as excellently pointed out below, is the most
demonstrative chore I can think of right now: some task that's manual,
involves a element of physical labor, and repetitive.

I began to notice my attention and motivation becoming more pronounced in
cycles, when I began writing in languages that are heavily defined as boiler
plate syntax and library based languages. Somehow the repetition, but with a
small amount of variation in eg the cell of a array being addressed, dulled my
personal flow of thought. Because I was spared from having to think beyond my
immediate line's purpose, because all kinds of detail from memory management
to types was sweetly abstracted away, I became more disengaged from the very
process of thought involved in what I am writing. Even on the 3460 where

------
davelnewton
Chop wood, carry water.

In other words, keep on keeping on. "A couple of hours" of focused work is
actually fairly productive, more productive than most people get. It's like
writing: do a little bit every day, pretty much no matter what, and it'll get
done by accident.

~~~
projectramo
My advice is identical to this.

However, it’s worth noting that you should expect to not want to do things
sometimes. Often pushing past the first part is the key.

Set. Minimum amount to accomplish. Nothing ambitious but something you can
easily do. (2 hours if you don’t have kids. 45 min if you do)

If you find yourself not wanting to do it week after week then you might
consider changing your role. Partner with a CTO, raise money, write about it
etc.

You don’t have to do what you love, but you should avoid what you hate.

~~~
davelnewton
I'd amend this--you cannot always avoid what you hate. You can try, but life
often gets in the way (as do the dirty dishes).

------
afarrell
1) Assess I'm feeling any one of HALT - Hungry, Angry, Lonely, Tired.

If I'm feeling hungry, I'll make myself a healthy meal. Tired? Take a 20
minute nap, then do some jumping jacks and listen to up-tempo music. Lonely?
Call it quits for the day and go find social interaction. Angry? Either I need
to re-examine my expectations for myself, Take a step back and get a better
understanding of my tools, or stop using selenium and switch to
[https://www.cypress.io/](https://www.cypress.io/)

\----

> You also would like to ship it ASAP too.

Things take time. Either cut the scope of the project or work on accepting
that things take time.

~~~
chrisper
I agree with HLT, but your anger evaluation is too simple.

There are so many different things that can lead to anger. Many different
causes which might have nothing to do with your expectation. Often it also
happens that the first thing that comes to your mind that you think is making
you angry is not the real reason. Builtup frustration and stress can lead to
being angry at anything at anytime.

As you can see, always reexamining your expectations might not work.

~~~
afarrell
True. Anger is a more complex emotion than it seems

~~~
davelnewton
I'd argue it's _more_ complex than most others--it can be a "stand-alone"
emotion, or an amalgamation of several others.

------
Ocerge
If it’s a side project, just stop and wait for when you feel like working
again. For me, forcing myself to work on something that isn’t putting food on
the table just builds resentment.

~~~
octosphere
> For me, forcing myself to work on something that isn’t putting food on the
> table just builds resentment.

I know this feeling. A lot of people burn out quickly on Github when their
shiny new toy fails to make money at every turn. Even with clear and adequate
payment channels used (Patreon / Paypal / Gumroad), the feeling of financial
failure (can be) enough to kill a project.

------
bryik
Write documentation. I know that sounds the same as "keep working on it", but
it's surprising how often going through updating/fixing docs gets me unstuck.
And if it doesn't, at least I've done something productive.

If the docs are fine, there are usually other things to improve or experiment
with (file organization, build process, tests, editor plugins...etc).

~~~
afarrell
hypothesis: Writing docs for your project helps because it leads you to
clarify concepts in your mind and thereby reduces the cognitive cost of
working with those concepts and thereby makes future work less hard.

------
ohwaitnvm
Exercise. Bike, blade, or run. I go and rollerblade the Embarcedero.

You get some sun, you tire yourself out in a different way, your eyes get to
focus more than two feet in front of you. There are people around but you
don’t have to be social if you don’t want - moving at a different speed means
you can still think on your mental problem.

Finally, you work up an appetite that sitting at a computer just doesn’t give
you, and you can reward yourself with some nice noms that you feel you’ve
earned and will give you the energy to return to code work.

Edit: I forgot to mention podcasts or audiobooks. If you want some external
input for your mental stimulation you can do that at the same time!

------
anoplus
> _5\. You also would like to ship it ASAP too._

I suspect number 5 is a stress factor. I believe stress can cause fatigue
and/or procrastination.

Try to accept the situation. Take your time and enjoy the task.

------
DyslexicAtheist
I push myself when I don't want to do it. But also limit myself to the
allocated time when motivation is aplenty. Especially the latter.

btw John Cleese is an amazing inspiration on how to be (consistently) creative
[https://genius.com/John-cleese-lecture-on-creativity-
annotat...](https://genius.com/John-cleese-lecture-on-creativity-annotated)

~~~
lavamantis
Wow, what a great and unexpected talk by John Cleese. Thanks for that.

------
rsweeney21
Discipline is doing the thing you should be doing, even when you don't _feel_
like doing it. It's also sometimes called perseverance. Discipline is a skill
you can develop.

I've started two successful companies (one bootstrapped, one VC backed) and
they both took an enormous amount of discipline and perseverance. I'm now on
my third and it's pretty much the same, but many things are easier this time
around.

So, what do I do when I don't feel like working anymore? I keep working. :-)

------
halayli
_what you 're about to read is anecdotal, subjective, and comes from personal
experience. Take what resonates with you._

Sometimes it is what it is, just accept it and do something else.

From my experience, the factors below highly impact this behavior:

1\. Is the project too big to chew on? 2\. Are your tasks very well defined
and the finish line is clear? 3\. Is the expected outcome for fun or you're
hoping to make it big when it's done? 4\. Is the project solving a problem you
care about dearly or a general problem you're trying to solve to make a
business out of it? 5\. The project is very motivating, everything is going
well but you're unaware that you're working on a very uninteresting task
that's part of the project and you're chewing on it slowly as a result.

When you sit on the chair and you feel it's kicking you off to get up instead
of sucking you in then probably there's a conflict of interest between what
_you_ think you should work on and what your brain is interested in working
on.

Do consider the possibility that you're probably assigning yourself a boring
project or a project that deep down you don't care about or it's too big and
overwhelming.

As we gain more experience and pile up failures, it becomes more challenging
to get on a project. From my experience, the best projects I worked on are
ones that have no monetary value nor related to launching some sort of a
business and I am working on them just because they have challenging and very
interesting problems for my taste, or they solve a problem I face.

------
philiphodgen
Go run a quick 5K. Or 3K. Or brisk walk around the block. Get the blood
pumping.

Make a to do list of the tasks you are attempting to achieve today. Do one
thing only today. When it is all too overwhelming, break it down into tiny
self-evident steps. Micromanage your brain.

Not too much coffee.

~~~
iamNumber4
>> Not too much coffee

Or more coffee/caffeine if you have add/adhd. If you can drink a pot of coffee
before bed and then go right to sleep, then caffeine might do the opposite to
your brain chemistry and level you out. Talk to your doctor, as that you might
need something more than caffeine to function. Think of your brain in the
aspect of a cpu, where as some cpu’s natural clock speed is a little slower
than the average, some are faster and easily distracted. So you might need to
adjust something to not burn out a days energy to fast, and feel like the
poster does.

Running releases different chemical compounds that affect the brain, so does
smoking, eating, drinking caffeine, etc... you could be deficient on vitamins
and it could be diet.

Everyone is different, and it will take trial and error until you find a
working balance. Which means talking to your doctor about how you are feeling
and, also taking the time to self-reflect on how you are actually feeling
every day to gauge what’s working and what’s not.

~~~
BrandoElFollito
I have exactly this with coffee.

I would even say that it makes me sleepy sometimes, and certainly never
interfere with sleep or sleep patterns.

The kind or volume of coffee did not matter (some coffees I like, style other
not but the lack of impact is the same).

Interestingly my brother is the same with coffee

------
iamNumber4
Do something analog. Find something to do that is not with a computer until
you get tired of that. Then build a balance chart, draw a circle, draw lines
to quarter it, then lines between those. You should see a what looks like a
wagon wheel. Each spoke is an aspect of your life. Label each spoke with the 8
important things in your life. This will show you the importance of keeping
the spokes “8 things in balance. One spoke could be your job, another your
side project, another your family, a hobby, social/friends, downtime, etc...
the wheel represents you, giving to much time to a single spoke makes the
wheel lopsided and it won’t turn. So as you devote your time to things,
imagine which of the 8 is suffering and not getting your time. Try to devote
equal time to each.

This is the best way I have found to get things done, and not get burned out/
or saying things like “my give a damn is busted.” It also gives you 7 other
things to do when you feel like you do now. Then after you do one of the
others see how you feel, go back to the one you didn’t feel like doing or do
one of the other things until you feel like it.

------
chrisper
What's the point of doing something you do for fun if you force yourself to do
it? To me that is a contradiction and which is why I don't do side projects
anymore since I started doing coding for full time.

------
vanzorn
1\. Set a Pomodoro timer (25 minutes).

2\. Tell myself "just work on the project/problem for just five more minutes."

3\. __* Work and allow no interruptions __*

4\. Pomodoro timer rings.

5\. "Wow. I didn't notice time passing."

Almost always, the satisfaction of surpassing the 5 minute goal is enough
encouragement to continue for a good long while.

Personally, this works as well (if not better than) changing my work venue.

------
ghthor
Go for a long walk, until I'm so hu angry I could eat anything I pass that
smells good. I stop and pick something out I want to eat and eat it. Then go
lay outside in the shade and let my mind wander about how amazing and strange
the universe is, and how thankful I am that I am experiencing life.

------
chewz
From my personal experience programming (for my own pleasure) has three phases
just like any other addiction.

1) Expectations phase where I love opening my laptop, touching the keyboard
etc. and I have some sketchy ideas what to do.

2) Extatic phase - where I am working for 16-18 hours solving problems I
didn't expected I would be able to solve and writing a code that I later keep
re-reading just to appreciate it's dense beauty.

3) Diminishing returns phase where I am still trying to get some kicks from it
but it isn't coming anymore.

If you are in a phase 3 then it is clearly a time to stop, get sleep, do yoga,
meditate, go for a run or get on a bike. Don't look at a laptop for a few
days.

------
j45
Time away from the keyboard makes you more effective at the keyboard.

Take a break, let your brain breathe. Do some other tasks, hobbies or chores
and you'll find yourself thinking about code soon enough.

------
lagadu
It'd Saturday. I'll be doing stuff I enjoy, not working.

~~~
optymizer
Some of us actually enjoy coding and love spending our free time on side
projects. 'Work' is coding someone else's crap.

------
sandworm101
Sleep. Just finshed a long week. Slept from 9pm until 8am. When work is done:
sleep. Eat. Exercise. Chores. Then "fun", if there is enough time sunday
night.

~~~
walshemj
That sounds so very sad - there is far more to life than work.

~~~
unixhero
His health will be improving, sufficient sleep 8hrs+ and excessive. Very good
in my mind. Sounds like a solid monk mode approach.

------
sh87
Know why. To push myself i need to know why. Without it, i get distracted too
easy. I’ve now returned back to the tried and tested way of writing down (in a
personal wiki) my long term goals and how I plan to get there. And a personal
notebook (updated every 1-2 days) shows me my near term tasks. I go thru the
wiki frequently, cleaning up and rearranging things. This keeps my long term
visions in check and gives me purpose and motivation to complete my tasks.

------
yitchelle
I go and do something non-tech. Shoot some hoops with my kids, groceries
shopping, chores. Anything but tech. I find that it gives my brain a rest.

------
Rantenki
45 yr old developer here, been at this for a long time...

While it can be tempting to just push through, that can be dangerous.
Sometimes that "meh" feeling is a symptom of burnout. Did you have a long
week? Lots of hours? Put out some fires? Decompressing now will be better than
fully burning out in a few months with some shoddily coded side project to
show for it.

That said, it's also possible that you need to "chop wood, carry water" as
mentioned by another poster, but if you do that, take a moment to look at your
side project from another level. Are you slogging because of some
architectural debt, or because you're just poking at the problem to see what
works? Personally, I get bogged down when I haven't thought through the
problem at a higher level. Sometimes I'll just write a series of steps to get
from where I am, to where I need to be, and identify the thing I am dreading
doing.

TL;DR: Sometimes you need a break, sometimes you need to step back and take a
10k foot view of what's bugging you, and sometimes you just need to push
through. It depends ;)

------
aregsarkissian
Start with shipping from day one. Before any coding. If it's a web app create
a new hello world project push it to a git repo. Get a cheap server from a
hosting company deploy your hello world app to it. Point a real domain to it
and install an ssl cert on it. Now you have an actual app running on the open
web. From then on you can iterate by completing one endpoint/controller action
at a time and immediately pushing that live and getting user feedback on it.
Then on to the next one. One additional point is that you can get a generic
domain name which will allow you to endlessly pivot your app without having to
setup a new domain and hosting if you change your idea. This implies that you
always have just one side project that will change over time and never work on
multiple side projects.

------
bdcravens
If you're asking on ways to combat the urge to stop, I'd create a Trello
board, and split it into the smallest pieces possible. Even if you have to
stop, perhaps you can work on a 10-minute piece. Typically, those small wins
keep me going.

------
caio1982
If you feel like that constantly and it doesn't matter which side-project it
is, you should consider that you may be going through a burnout. Only a long
time away from the offending activities might restore your energy to do them
again.

------
RickJWagner
I tell myself: "Holy crap, look at how much money you're being paid. Do you
remember the labor jobs you used to have?"

Then I think about some nice things I'd like to buy. This is usually enough to
get me going.

------
Insanity
No solution here but I have been struggling with this for a couple of weeks
now (5ish) but just in general, not only for side projects.

Thus I am quite interested in this thread myself :)

------
ojhughes
It’s Saturday morning, I would do something I enjoy then see how I feel. No
point feeling guilty about a side project get outdoors and enjoy life

------
bigwheeler
I think it’s probably important to figure out WHY #4 happens. If this is
something you’re passionate about, or something that you need to pay the bills
soon, I would think that your motivation or excitement level wouldn’t wane so
quickly.

After those couple hours, if you stop working on it, what do you do? Do you
take a break and get back at it? Or do you follow through on waiting til
tomorrow?

~~~
budhajeewa
I usually return to it an hour or two later.

~~~
bigwheeler
I think that sounds like a pretty good "work" to "work break" ratio. 2 hours
on, 2 hours off, and then maybe 2 on again? As long as you're feeling like
you're flowing for the time that you're actually working, getting 2 solid
hours of uninterrupted work in, followed by a couple more later in the day, is
probably more productive than many devs!

------
gtani
You need at least half day break from focused pursuits. After that channel
energy into other focused pursuit

\- playing guitar, piano etc

\- studying math, EE, physics

\- learn foreign language

\- sports, yoga

------
harlanji
Keep working on open source to court attention, avoid becoming homeless. Keep
working after becoming homeless and most friends have left. Now considering
crimes to get shelter via jail... felony would help employment via protected
status. Unsure if I’m joking, as those are our society’s chosen incentivized
paths.

------
skrebbel
On a Saturday? Come on. Point 5 can wait till Monday (yes, it can). I'd go
outside and enjoy the sun.

~~~
freehunter
A side project is usually something you work on outside of business hours. So
weekend work isn't something that can wait until Monday, because Monday is
back to real work.

------
skor
I write code that generates music, controls external gear.

[https://lowveld.bandcamp.com](https://lowveld.bandcamp.com)

Once I accomplish something that sounds good to me, I put it on and go back to
my side project ;)

------
tmaly
Use the pomodoro technique, it is ideal for this type so situation. It helps
you get into the flow. Having a list of focused things you need to complete
before you apply this technique is also a requirement.

------
Apreche
I never feel like working. Work sucks. It's summer. Go to the beach.

------
firemelt
Anyone have a good book/article for the exact topic?, What's on my mind is
deepwork by cal newport

I'm working on my thesis but have a hard time to keep the motivation high

------
jf22
I just stop and do it tomorrow.

------
sam0x17
I come here

~~~
shafyy
Me too!

------
slimshady94
Play guitar to backing tracks on youtube. Plan my next workout.

------
sam0x17
Start yet another side project

------
Zelmor
Do sports. Dig up the garden and get into raising your own vegetables.
Gardening is the spice of life.

------
extralego
Pat yourself on the back for working a couple of hours then go online and
write comments about lazy homeless people looking for handouts.

~~~
technofiend
Don't forget to upvote any thoughts and prayers threads. Slacktivism at its
finest.

But seriously although I hate to delve too deeply into stereotypes the fact of
the matter is many people like me on HN and elsewhere may be somewhat
introverted by nature. And yet to answer the original poster's question I find
volunteering or otherwise doing something to get me out of my shell
invigorating when taken in small doses.

This is something I never would have discovered on my own: my wife's
crowbaring me out of my comfort zone is the only reason I know.

But even volunteering aside there are many things you can do that (stereotype
again, sorry) satisfy our predilection to learn new things and if not solve
problems then learn how others solve problems. For instance two of my favorite
things I've done were taking Citizen's Fire Academy and Citizen's Police
Academy put on by the City of Houston. I don't want to be a firefighter or
policeman. But getting to see the behind-the-scenes view into their world was
fascinating. And when else will you get to go up in a ladder truck, ride in a
police helicopter or put on bunker gear and watch as flames roar by a few
inches over your head?

They actually present what they do in great amount of detail and are happy to
take questions and even demonstrate their equipment and techniques. For a nerd
like me it's damn entertaining.

It made me better appreciate what those people do for a living and and very
thankful for the opportunities IT afforded me. It's a little more concrete for
me that I'm very unlikely to be set on fire or shot while learning how to
integrate CEPH and Kubenetes.

Tl;Dr: If you're bored or unmotivated with a side project do something
completely different and outside your comfort zone to get perspective.

~~~
extralego
No objections to this! As a very introverted person myself and clearly not
against posting comments on the Internet, my intentions here are merely to
inspire consideration of challenges in overcoming prejudice.

I love the HN community but I doubt the HN community loves me back. I really
struggle with the libertarian Darwinism so popular here. This thread concerns
what it might call a weakness but I would call a necessary element in beauty.

It’s like ‘negative space’ in motivation. If we were always inspired, we might
not be any different than drones. To lack a sense of purpose or connection
with a task is useful to society. It makes a space for connection. When we
engage with new things, it can improve our society. _But_ it can also do the
opposite; particularly when resources don’t allow for new engagements. _Such
is the case for homeless people!_

Humor is not always funny, and I know my kidding here is not entertaining. I
just hope for a better world for my children and I believe in the people of HN
to make that possible. I just fear them missing the opportunities to do so in
the name of pride and self-justification.

This post gives me hope. And your comment as well, although I know it was
meant as a lesson. And to be certain, it was that too.

