

Evaluating Extraordinary Claims - scott_s
http://norvig.com/prayer.html

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marknutter
I went through the physics program at the university of Minnesota and the
point at which the rigorous nature of the scientific process really hit home
for me was when I successfully reproduced the results of the famous Milikan
Oil Drop experiment for measuring the fundamental charge e and having my
professor tell me that even _that_ experiment had controversy over whether
Milikin was "picking bubbles" with bias. Real science is hardcore; you better
have phenomenal data and explain every potential source of errors and what
exatly those error margins are.

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josh33
tl;dr - There is an author/domain expert in Intercessory Prayer claiming there
is scientific evidence backing up the benefit of praying or thinking
positively on behalf of something/someone. This article proves the evidence is
flawed based on scientific process and concludes the evidence that isn't
flawed points to a non-correlation between intercessory prayer and how it can
help. He does say that religion and science don't have to mix.

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stygianguest
Personally I don't really like the wording of 'extraordinary evidence'. In
fact, for most extraordinary claims the level of evidence the scientific
community requires isn't that extraordinary at all.

There is also a very real danger of misinterpreting the adjective
'extraordinary'. Take for example statistics. It might be tempting to say that
a higher correlation and/or significance is more extraordinary, but I would
say any significant result should suffice.

My point is that, 'extraordinary' should not apply to the result, but to the
experiment itself. To test an (extraordinary) hypothesis, we should design
experiments as if we really want to disprove the hypothesis.

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pella
interesting:

This is the first study to link meditation and positive psychological change
with telomerase activity.

<http://dx.doi.org/10.1016/j.psyneuen.2010.09.010>

 _Background: Telomerase activity is a predictor of long-term cellular
viability, which decreases with chronic psychological distress (Epel et al.,
2004). Buddhist traditions claim that meditation decreases psychological
distress and promotes well-being (e.g., Dalai Lama and Cutler, 2009).
Therefore, we investigated the effects of a 3-month meditation retreat on
telomerase activity and two major contributors to the experience of stress:
Perceived Control (associated with decreased stress) and Neuroticism
(associated with increased subjective distress). We used mediation models to
test whether changes in Perceived Control and Neuroticism explained meditation
retreat effects on telomerase activity. In addition, we investigated whether
two qualities developed by meditative practice, increased Mindfulness and
Purpose in Life, accounted for retreat-related changes in the two stress-
related variables and in telomerase activity._

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PhilWright
I have a simple rule of thumb.

When someone makes an extraordinary clain I require an extraorderinary level
evidence. I think that praying to a supernatural entity for help qualifies as
an extraordinary claim. So far the evidence has not matched the level of the
claim.

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steveklabnik
The site was 503'ing for me. Google Cache:
[http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:R1K0HwG...](http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:R1K0HwG7f7MJ:norvig.com/prayer.html+norvig.org/praer&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us)

