
Lennon or McCartney? Can statistical analysis solve an authorship puzzle? - slyall
https://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2018-07/asa-lom072718.php
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garyrob
Interesting that they peg "The Word" on McCartney. I'm pretty sure I remember
a quote from Lennon where he used it as an example of how he (Lennon) liked to
drive one note home. Lennon's sticking on one note is a point made in the
article, using "Help" as their example. In "The Word" there are plenty of
other notes, the song keeps on stressing the one note where he sings the word
"word":

Say the word and you'll be free / Say the word and be like me / Say the word
I'm thinking of / Have you heard the word is love?

In the first three lines "word" is by far the most stressed note, and they are
all the SAME note. In the last line the stress is on "heard", which rhymes,
and is again the same note.

I think there's something wrong with their model where they aren't looking for
repetitions of stressed notes, which would actually be totally consistent with
their existing characterization of Lennon's melodies.

~~~
HenryTheHorse
I'm a little conflicted about the authorship of "The Word". The chord
progression is very Paul and the chorus is very John.

> In the first three lines "word" is by far the most stressed note, and they
> are all the SAME note. In the last line the stress is on "heard", which
> rhymes, and is again the same note.

That's how it's supposed to work. The downbeat (or the accent) is on "word" in
each line and in the last line the lyric changes to "heard" instead of "word.

So I'm neither expecting syncopation here nor am I noticing anything unusual
there.

~~~
garyrob
> So I'm neither expecting syncopation here nor am I noticing anything unusual
> there.

I'm not either, but that doesn't have anything to do with the point. The point
is that their classification model has Lennon staying on the same note, and
that happens with "The Word" if you give the importance to the highly stressed
note (which, as you point out, is on the downbeat). But, partly because the
stressed notes are surrounded by other notes, they are assigning the melody to
McCartney.

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S_A_P
There is a book that attempts to piece together the ownership of the
Lennon/McCartney/Harrison/Starr catalog called Beatles Songs(appropriately).
It uses anecdotes, interviews, guesswork and black magic in order to attribute
song ownership to the respective Beatle. From reading that book, spending 5
years immersed in a Beatles rabbit hole, and some other ways only legal in a
few states I can say that a beatles song will mostly be sung by the main
writer of the song. The major exception is the songs written for Ringo. The
period around Rubber Soul is where things get murky as they were starting to
assert themselves as individual songwriters and giving criticism/notes to each
others songs. Where early beatles songs would have been a Lennon/McCartney
writing collaboration of varying amounts, at that point John was the creative
force of the band and wrote most of the original works. As Paul came into his
own and started asserting his creativity, songs would be a collaboration after
they were written. Paul was more of a producer with a great "feel" on how to
make a song. From what I remember from the book Beatles songs, the author
attributes the bulk of the song to Lennon, and gives partial credit to Paul. I
think this seems about right. This song strikes me as something John wrote and
was "punched up" by Paul. Coming from each writers perspective, they probably
feel that they were more responsible. John may have written the song, but I
seem to remember that Paul wrote the melody line on guitar, which is the main
idea of the song.

I know people try to put each Beatle into a box and I they had their indulgent
tendencies. However, I think they were really just 4 people that when put
together were able to make music that few others could. Each of them has a
moment where they are the weird, sappy, schmaltzy, psychedelic or rock n roll
song writer. Its a lesson that I feel could also be applied to management when
building a team. Find your "beatles". People that when you put them together
create better output than each of them could alone.

~~~
tabtab
If you listen to the Beatles' own accounts, they didn't appear to pay much
attention to authorship until near the end of the group. They got together,
kicked around ideas, made suggestions in a more or less organic way with
little attention to source or credit. It was a workman-like "git-er-done"
approach. The reason they grouped "Lennon/McCartney" credit together early was
in part to make collaboration smoother.

In the latter years of the group, they became more possessive and isolated,
for whatever reason, and collaboration was less organic. It illustrates that
money and fame DON'T make one satisfied. Egos and personal demons lived on and
perhaps got magnified.

~~~
S_A_P
Totally agree with that. I would also argue that the last few albums showed
songwriting that was less inspired than the early stuff. It was brilliantly
executed and produced, but not quite as creative or cohesive. I think that
dovetails nicely with your last point.

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tabtab
Re: _Stylometry--the use of statistical techniques to determine authorship--is
best known for identifying the Unabomber as Theodor Kaczynski_

I see different accounts. Many imply his brother "cracked" the case by
fingering him as a suspect, not some FBI statistical wizardry. Perhaps
stylometry added to the evidence, though.

As far as The Beatles, a large part of their success is the juxtaposition of
contrasting styles, in my opinion. Lennon had a sarcastic style and McCartney
a more optimistic sound. Too much Lennon is whiny, and too much McCartney is
syrupy and cheesy. Mix and/or juxtapose them and you get a great balance and
contrast: flavor AND spices.

~~~
bagrow
Your descriptions of their styles (sarcastic-vs-optimistic, whiny-vs-syrupy)
are reasonable for their lyrics, but this analysis seems to focus only on the
instrumentals, the melodies, chords, and so forth.

Their lyrical differences are reflected in the melodies, of course, but I
would not describe Lennon's chord choices as "sarcastic", for example.

~~~
tabtab
Hmmm, what is a "sarcastic" chord? Minors?

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graycat
Sure, do distribution free two sample hypothesis test.

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john-foley
No.

~~~
quadrangle
Indeed.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betteridge's_law_of_headlines](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betteridge's_law_of_headlines)

