
Green card applicant banned from ever coming to USA because of a checkmark - hiphipjorge
https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/chasing-american-dream-anton-kravchenko/
======
djmips
I know this from my own experience, HR departments in most smaller companies
in the US are unfamiliar with US immigration laws and are sometimes cavalier
about the forms. When a mistake is made they think that it's just an oopsy and
it'll work itself out. They have to fill out I-9s all the time even for
American employees. It would be easy for someone to just fill it out by rote
not realizing the horrible consequence. Also speaking from experience, even
specialist lawyers make mistakes so getting an immigration specialist does not
inoculate you from a game over situation. The decisions are often arbitrary
and not consistent. This is even more an issue when directly dealing with a
border agent who has infinite power, is not a lawyer, yet has to deal with
nuances of immigration law. You can't appeal (unless perhaps you go the
congress route but I've am not familiar with that option). All the people here
who bravely sit in their high tower and pronounce judgement about this
consequential error have either never had to face the same situation but I'm
sure they've all had bad speeding tickets and other bureaucratic errors go
against them. I'm sure they feel much different then even when the
consequences are not as severe. And if you really just think tough luck you
deserved it then you are just a bad person.

------
peter_d_sherman
This might help; it might not:

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ombudsman](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ombudsman)

Excerpt:

"Members of the United States Congress serve as federal-level ombudsmen in
their oversight capacity over federal agencies, and employ staff specifically
dedicated to legal compliance enforcement and investigations of
maladministration on behalf of constituents."

So, maybe write to some of the members of United States Congress, and/or the
people that work in their offices (staffers)...

Also see:

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ombudsmen_in_the_United_States](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ombudsmen_in_the_United_States)

Opinion: The U.S. could use more Ombudsmen, specifically at Federal, State,
Local, and Agency levels...

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Separation_of_powers](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Separation_of_powers)

"Separation of powers, therefore, refers to the division of responsibilities
into distinct branches of government to limit any one branch from exercising
the core functions of another. The intent of separation of powers is to
_prevent the concentration of unchecked power by providing for checks and
balances_."

Not saying I'm right... those are just one man's opinions...

Anyway, good luck with your case!

------
25mph
The morale of the story: don't sign incomplete forms.

As for the GC case, I believe he can still make it work if he makes enough
noise to get noticed by governor-level politicians. As a backup plan, he can
immigrate to Canada: about the same culture, with only a few minor
differences.

Whether he really needs to make it work is another question. As I get older,
from time to time I entertain the idea of eventually retiring to a cheaper
country, as the likely alternative is be robbed by the cruel healthcare system
in my 50s or 60s.

I agree that America is the best place for ambitious smart single dudes
without health problems, but as those dudes get older, they quickly realize
that their exceptionally well paying job doesn't buy them a house near their
workplace (especially in SF!), that all the family related things are
ludicrously expensive and that any moderately severe health issues will empty
their nice 500k savings accounts real quick.

~~~
tinus_hn
How can you avoid signing ‘an incomplete form’ when so much problems can be
caused by marking a checkbox? How can you avoid someone doing that after the
fact?

~~~
gus_massa
I think he should have checked the fourth box. [IANAIL]

If someone else completed this, the problem is that to check the fourth box
you must add some "Alien or Admission number" that the other person didn't
know. It's easier to check the first box that doesn't ask more questions.

Edit: I like the explanation in
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21932422](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21932422)

------
foobarbazetc
The only real way to get something like this fixed is (if you live in SF
proper) to contact Rep Nancy Pelosi’s office, or Sen Feinstein or Harris’
offices.

I know someone who had their GC application indefinitely postponed by USCIS
until Pelosi’s office started asking questions. Then it was magically
approved.

~~~
wbl
My mother had to do the same with her Congresscritter.

------
ggm
Although it is possible this kind of insanity could be legally reversed, the
personal strain and financial cost would be huge. Purely pragmatically and not
because it's right, I would get on with my life in some other country and try
to put this behind me.

What a stupid situation

------
RcouF1uZ4gsC
> When taking the job, I signed an incomplete I-9 application, which later was
> completed by the employer stating that I was a U.S. citizen.

This seems real shady on the employer’s part. I wonder if that is something
they encouraged.

------
himinlomax
Remind me of a UK national I know who used to work for one of the biggest US
corporation in the 90s. He was based in the US and had to come to a trade show
in Europe at the time of his work permit renewal. For some reason that's still
unclear, it was denied. As he had a rather high level position, the company
set their best lawyers on the case. The CEO was even involved and phoned his
connections. Still no dice.

He ended up working for one of their European offices. The weird part is that
he could still travel freely to the US without visa, so it was not even some
security agency interference (and it was before 9/11 anyway.)

------
duelingjello
This guy (immigration lawyer) is good at resolving these kinds on SNAFUs.

[https://www.kuver.com/](https://www.kuver.com/)

------
nine_zeros
US immigration law is so draconian with so many gotchas, it's impossible for
any person to keep track of all the actions they need to take.

This linkedin post is an example of one of those gotchas.

Does anyone know that employers need to reverify I-9 docs for visa hires
everytime they get a new ead card or a new I-797? Does anyone know that
drivers license needs to be renewed every single time? Whoch means taking an
appointment, standing there for a day and showing the same shit documents all
over again? Only to receive the drivers license after 2 months by snail mail?

Does anyone know that this has to be done even if they change jobs?

Does anyone know that if they move from one location to another they not only
have to refile paperwork with USCIS, they also have to update every change in
their address?

Oh btw, god forbid the USCIS cannot process documents in time (six months).
They will then straggle along for 180 days or 240 days or god knows what
number of days apply to what cases. What happens to I-9 in these cases? What
happens to drivers license in these cases? Is the employee supposed to
continue working or what?

What happens if the employer forgets a step? What happens if a lawyer makes a
tiny mistake? What happens if the arrogant jerk of border control makes a
mistake during reentry in the US? Why does the US consulate need to have
everyone give an appointment with ALL documents again and again just to stamp
a visa? What happens when they delay the process?

And I haven't even started talking about green card yet. Imagine doing all of
the above for 10 years, 20 years and then being trapped for a gotcha in some
paperwork somewhere? A mistake by a lawyer, by some employer. Wtf!!! Are they
supposed to abandon their family, kids, friends and leave the country for this
gotcha?

Are they saying that USCIS never makes mistakes?

I could go on and on. The process is incredibly bureaucratic and nightmarish.
People lose their mental and physical health dealing with this shit. Families
get separated routinely because of bureaucratic anarchy.

And this is all for EDUCATED workers and immigrants. This does not even
scratch it for refugees, daca and others.

My serious advice to anyone who likes their life is to not come to the US. If
you are already in the US, exit now. Take your job and projects with you. Go
to another country where you can focus on your family, kids and maybe a
business.

------
teilo
This is an unpopular position, but nevertheless it is the truth: No one has
the right to emigrate to the United States. No one. No other country is
criticized so heavily for having stringent immigration policies, this despite
the fact that the US immigration policies are some of the loosest in the
world.

~~~
lotophage
I don't think that this was being argued. Being denied a Green card is fine,
but doing so on the basis of an obviously tampered form doesn't seem fair.

------
cheezegrayter
This story doesn’t pass the smell test. Author claims their employer did the
necessary and expensive legwork to get them a US work visa, then author signed
an incomplete I9 and their employer filled it out incorrectly without double
checking the necessary documents, then the people responsible move and the
company folds. I guess stranger things have happened but seems likely to me
this was visa fraud.

~~~
SamReidHughes
If he didn’t overstay and had nothing to gain from the wrong checkbox being
marked, that doesn’t make much sense.

~~~
cheezegrayter
I think it does if you are skeptical of the author’s account. I think it makes
sense that someone not authorized to work in the US would lie on their
paperwork after previously expressing frustration at the immigration process

~~~
SamReidHughes
For OPT, the employer (apparently) doesn’t take part in the process of getting
the visa. I think the best skeptical take would be that maybe he didn’t tell
his employer he had OPT status, so maybe he avoided filling out that part of
the form, signed it, and hoped for the best.

~~~
pandaman
He could not have OPT in 2012 (it requires a year of study), when this form
had been faxed. He states as much, mentioning that his life was different
"During the first year in the U.S." right before telling about this job.

So the best skeptical take is that he went to work illegally, was given I-9
and did not fill it because there was no box for his status at the time
"alien, not authorized to work". Then the employer, who is hiring illegals and
is not exactly straight edge either, filled it for him. This does not make
much sense, though, since it would not matter for the employer without the
section 2 of the form, which lists documents proving the eligibility for work.

He still broke the law but, maybe, not to the degree where he earned a ban
from the U.S. This depends on how long he worked illegally.

~~~
SamReidHughes
Maybe. It's one "academic year." If he was on the F-1 learning English before
that, does that count towards the one academic year of study?

~~~
pandaman
It might if he had been in English classes, accredited to issue OPT. Seeing
that OPT is available only for bachelor and master degree level of education
and he states that he started with the elementary level of English it does not
seem very likely even ignoring the fact that he also writes he only spent 6
months studying before passing TOEFL and applying to a business school in CA.

------
notatoad
>Obviously, it was a genuine human error

i'm not sure what about that is obvious.

And even if we accept that this was human error, when the form you're signing
says in big print multiple times that you can go to jail for filling it out
wrong, maybe don't just skip that section? I understand that this is a hard
situation for this guy, but simplifying this as "one checkmark" is pretty
silly. His argument that he didn't check that box is beside the point - he
signed his name to an inaccurate form, which still puts him in the situation
of misrepresenting his identity.

The guy wasn't some refugee fleeing a country under exceptional circumstances,
he was a well-off professional moving for work. there's no excuse for not
hiring an immigration lawyer to make sure all the paperwork is absolutely
perfect in addition to taking a huge amount of care and double checking
everything.

~~~
redis_mlc
> there's no excuse for not hiring an immigration lawyer

1) You're quite the zero-tolerance guy, aren't you?

Except it's not that simple. Form I-9 page 1 is to be filled out by the worker
within one day of starting a new job, and page 2 afterward by the employer
within 2-3 days.

So you don't have time to have your immigration lawyer actually look at it,
unless you got some pre-filled form, which doesn't normally happen. In fact,
you fill in page one and return it to the employer for the next step.

2) Having said that, I appreciate the original blog post bringing this to my
attention, and plan to be more careful with this form than the last dozen
times I've signed it.

I'm pretty sharp with US employment, tax and passport forms, yet that's the
first time that I've heard somebody being banned for an I-9 mistake.

~~~
maximente
something seems off though. IIRC with an I-9 you need to also provide
artifacts supporting your ability to work in the US. it's curious that the
article doesn't mention what documents he used and if they were appropriate
for a different category.

since he didn't have a green card at that point nor US passport obviously,
what documents were used to supply that evidence? e.g. "i used X and Y, which
US immigration should plainly see does not support a claim of being a US
citizen"

~~~
pandaman
Indeed.

1\. The form has been faxed in March of 2012 judging by the text on top.

2\. According to his linkedin profile he was going to a business school in
2012 and 2013.

3\. His article states that he has taken OPT to work for a year after
graduation and at the end he got job offer at MuleSoft, which was in 2014.

So what was his work authorization in or before March 2012? It could not be
OPT since he just started his degree in 2012 and OPT requires a year of study
( [https://www.uscis.gov/opt](https://www.uscis.gov/opt) ). He does not seem
to have any work authorization other than OPT in 2014, when he has taken the
job in MuleSoft so he has not started his GC application at the time
(otherwise he'd had an EAD and would not need to go to Argentina for a year to
get an L1 visa in the first place). So, given only the information from
Linkedin I cannot see how he could possibly be authorized to work at the time.
The fact he has not filled I-9 correctly just corroborates this.

