
Thousands of U.S. judges who broke laws, oaths remained on the bench - hhs
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-judges-misconduct-specialreport/special-report-thousands-of-us-judges-who-broke-laws-oaths-remained-on-the-bench-idUSKBN2411WG
======
chidog12
> Judge Les Hayes once sentenced a single mother to 496 days behind bars for
> failing to pay traffic tickets. The sentence was so stiff it exceeded the
> jail time Alabama allows for negligent homicide.

> Johnson’s three children were cast into foster care while she was
> incarcerated. One daughter was molested, state records show. Another was
> physically abused.

Speechless... Makes my blood boil

~~~
meddlepal
This is the kind of stupidity you get with elected judges.

~~~
pmoriarty
The problem isn't that judges are elected, but that it's nearly impossible for
voters to make an informed decision.

In the last election, I tried to find out about the local judges on my ballot
and could find virtually nothing.

The media has been neutered in to an infotainment machine, so there's very
little investigative journalism left even on issues of national or
international importance, much less on small issues like who your local judges
are and how they rule.

~~~
chrisseaton
> The problem isn't that judges are elected

I'm pretty sure it is... why would you elect a judge? They're not supposed to
apply any opinion just interpret the law technically. What are people voting
for them based on? Their political affiliation? That's _absolutely bonkers_.

~~~
basementcat
The reality is there is quite a bit of wiggle room in the interpretation of
the law. Someone who is conservative and 'tough on crime' may want a judge who
is biased toward stricter prison sentences. Someone who is more liberal may
want a judge who shows more leniency and is biased toward finding other ways
to rehabilitate the guilty.

Its kind of like how two competent people can implement a POSIX compliant
operating system in different ways (microkernel or monolithic, emacs vs vi,
systemd vs sysvinit).

~~~
analyte123
Systemd does not aim for POSIX compliance:
[https://github.com/systemd/systemd/issues/6259#issuecomment-...](https://github.com/systemd/systemd/issues/6259#issuecomment-312494264)

------
orf
> In Texas, a judge burst in on jurors deliberating the case of a woman
> charged with sex trafficking and declared that God told him the defendant
> was innocent. The offending judge received a warning and returned to the
> bench. The defendant was convicted after a new judge took over the case.

> In Indiana, three judges attending a conference last spring got drunk and
> sparked a 3 a.m. brawl outside a White Castle fast-food restaurant that
> ended with two of the judges shot. Although the state supreme court found
> the three judges had “discredited the entire Indiana judiciary,” each
> returned to the bench after a suspension.

> In Utah, a judge texted a video of a man’s scrotum to court clerks. He was
> reprimanded but remains on the bench.

Damn.

~~~
js2
Here's the Indiana one if you want some more color:

> Back in May, three Indiana judges got into a fight. It was the crescendo of
> an incident brimming with colorful details: a gaggle of judges drinking the
> night before a judicial conference, a failed attempt to visit a strip club
> called the Red Garter, a brawl in the parking lot of an Indianapolis White
> Castle.

> The altercation apparently started sometime after 3 a.m., when one of the
> judges, Sabrina Bell, raised a middle finger at two men yelling from a
> passing SUV, and ended after one of those men shot two of the judges.

...

> Bell "was intoxicated enough that she lacks any memory of the incident."

...

> The court says its penalties are designed "not primarily to punish a judge,
> but rather to preserve the integrity of and public confidence in the
> judicial system" and, when necessary, to remove those who are unfit.

[https://www.npr.org/2019/11/14/779339897/3-indiana-judges-
su...](https://www.npr.org/2019/11/14/779339897/3-indiana-judges-suspended-
after-white-castle-brawl-that-left-2-of-them-wounded)

~~~
Kinrany
This actually sounds... better? The initial line read like the judges shot
each other.

Did they even break any laws?

Getting too drunk to visit a strip club and raising a middle finger to someone
is not what I expected to be among the worst examples.

------
godzillabrennus
I mentored a convicted felon through Defy Ventures a few years ago.

He had a wonderful idea for an app. Something that stuck with me for the last
few years.

Why isn’t there a yelp for the public sector including the judicial system?
Every day you walk into a court room how do you know what to expect?

If you are suddenly in front of a judge that decides your life’s fate wouldn’t
you want to pull up historical data that tracks and publishes the judges
decisions, the feedback from others who have been in your place, and be able
to contribute after your experience?

Wouldn’t the same be good for police? So citizens can pull a badge number and
see what people in that community have to say about that cop?

He wanted the app to have a panic button where users could predefine their
most important emergency contacts to be pushed to social media and texted with
a link to livestream what is going on (e.g. local news outlets, family,
friends, lawyer(s), etc...) as the app would be broadcasting audio/video of
the event unfolding.

Defy Ventures is more designed for helping someone start a food truck business
than building software. The idea stuck with me though and with the renewed
focus on keeping power in check it should exist. If anyone wants to talk with
this man who came up with the idea let me know.

~~~
wang_li
It would turn into what every review system on the web is: a place to get
petty revenge. Make people use their real identity and have criminal liability
for lies of commission and omission, then you might have something. But
probably just one more mechanism for idiots to go to jail.

~~~
godzillabrennus
You could do drop down answers to rate officials instead of free form text.
Don’t know how it would work for verifying a real identity. Maybe require
Moderation and only licensed lawyers can approve a new user?

~~~
missedthecue
A cop does normal things: no one leaves a review

A cop leaves a ticket that a driver thinks is unfair: 1 star review

Every cop would have a one star rating, which basically tells us nothing
except that some people are salty, justifiably or unjustifiably. Impossible to
know for certain.

------
dependenttypes
Not sure if this is relevant to this but I would like to remind you that a US
judge can order to you be sterilized without your knowledge and you can do
nothing about it nor can anything be done to the judge.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stump_v._Sparkman](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stump_v._Sparkman)

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buck_v._Bell](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buck_v._Bell)

~~~
defen
That's a sensationalized way of describing it. Judges can't just decide to
have random people sterilized. The mother petitioned the court to have her
minor daughter sterilized. The judge made a large number of procedural
mistakes in granting the petition, but the Supreme Court ruled that he didn't
act outside of his judicial capacity. The general rule is that judges can't be
held personally liable for mistakes they make when acting in their official
capacity as judges.

~~~
dependenttypes
> Judges can't just decide to have random people sterilized

They can if someone petitions for it.

> The mother petitioned the court to have her minor daughter sterilized

And I can petition to have you sterilized. If the judge accepts it you will
not be able to hold him responsible. He does not need to listen to you nor do
you need to know about it.

> The general rule is that judges can't be held personally liable for mistakes
> they make when acting in their official capacity as judges.

Meanwhile doctors, drivers, etc can be held personally liable for mistakes
they make while working.

~~~
defen
So in your opinion, if I petition a court for permission to kill my neighbor
"because he's really annoying", and for some reason the judge says yes, he
won't be held liable? Because I disagree. Judges do not have the ability to
blanket "bless" actions so long as someone petitions for it. You have to look
at the specifics of the case.

~~~
nitwit005
As long as it survives appeal, judges can basically rule whatever they want.
Plenty of crazy rulings have gotten through the courts. Remember that time
they ruled it was okay to toss all the Japanese people in internment camps?

~~~
defen
Judges could also order that "fugitive" slaves could be returned to their
"owners", or that people convicted of treason could be vivisected, if you go
far enough back in time. I'm not sure what point is being argued here. If you
want to make judges personally liable for following the law and/or for making
mistakes, why would anyone become a judge?

~~~
Mirioron
If you make soldiers personally liable for following orders then why would
anyone want to be a soldier? I'm not saying this to be funny. Most other
professions can be held responsible for doing their job, but doing it very
poorly that causes harm to others. But somehow judges are exempt.

~~~
defen
They're not liable for following lawful orders, though, even if the results
are horrific and they personally disagree with the order. That's why no one
gets charged when a drone strike blows up a wedding and kills 23 children.

------
rayiner
There is some horrible conduct detailed on here, but also not so horrible
conduct:

> They included a California judge who had sex in his courthouse chambers,
> once with his former law intern and separately with an attorney; a New York
> judge who berated domestic violence victims; and a Maryland judge who, after
> his arrest for driving drunk, was allowed to return to the bench provided he
> took a Breathalyzer test before each appearance.

Judges in all these states are elected. Should an elected official be
_impeached_ for any of this conduct? Maybe the one who had sex with an
attorney, if the attorney had cases before the judge (but the article doesn’t
say that). The other stuff is bad, but is it impeachable?

By lumping together really heinous conduct with things that probably should be
disciplinary violations that don’t result in impeachment, it’s hard to know
what the magnitude of the problem detailed in the article actually is.

~~~
ZeikJT
I think people are leaning further and further into retribution instead of
rehabilitation. People make mistakes and we need to realize that unless the
mistake is really heinous then we don't need to absolutely destroy their
entire lives. We just need them to learn from the mistake, possibly pay a cost
(therapy, fines, temporary unpaid leave, etc), and then rejoin society as
social and economic contributors.

I'd rather not pass individual judgement on these cases presented but it seems
to me that some of these are more damning than others.

------
tomohawk
All judicial positions should have a set term, after which a new judge is
appointed to the position, even at the Supreme Court level.

For example, at the Supreme Court level, if each position was an 18 year term,
each offset by 2 years, then a new justice would be nominated every other year
to serve no more than 18 years. If a judge left early, the position would be
filled until the end of the term.

This would prevent some of the shenanigans where partisan judges wait until
the political winds are blowing in the right direction before stepping down to
ensure that "their side" doesn't lose out.

This would also prevent judges serving for several decades with no realistic
way to remove them.

Having served once, a judge could be renominated, but would have to go through
the approval process again.

~~~
smt88
> _All judicial positions should have a set term, after which a new judge is
> appointed to the position, even at the Supreme Court level._

The problem with this is exactly the problem with all term limits: you can
"sell" your decisions at the end of your term.

Example: Kentucky's former governor pardoned some incredibly repulsive people
because they were donors (or connected to donors)[1] and he had already lost
his election.

1\. [https://www.kentucky.com/news/politics-
government/article238...](https://www.kentucky.com/news/politics-
government/article238437623.html)

~~~
tomohawk
You can't fix stupid. There is no perfect system. But, we can do better.
Requiring judges to go through a periodic review to continue seems like a good
thing to try.

------
yyyk
Not surprising at all. The original case establishing Qualified Immunity
wasn't about mere police officers - it was about a state judge, and only by
extension local police since they followed the judge's order. The main
decision was giving state judges all but _un_ qualified immunity[0]. When you
give a group of people power to do almost whatever, it's not a surprise the
bad apples stay and multiply.

[0]

[https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Pierson_v._Ray/Opinion_of_the...](https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Pierson_v._Ray/Opinion_of_the_Court)

[https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Pierson_v._Ray/Dissent_Dougla...](https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Pierson_v._Ray/Dissent_Douglas)

------
a_puppy
Reuters focuses on a few shocking cases, like Judge Les Hayes's treatment of
Marquita Johnson -- which was truly awful! But it's important to keep this in
perspective.

Reuters' investigation found 5,206 cases where people were affected by
judicial misconduct over a period of 12 years, and the article noted two other
investigations had found 3,500 cases and 2,251 cases each. For comparison,
state courts in the USA hear approximately _one hundred million_ cases per
year. [1] So there's evidence for misconduct in approximately 0.0009% of
cases.

(And I'm guessing most of that misconduct was nowhere near as bad as the
Marquita Johnson case, or the other examples they mentioned; they picked the
most shocking examples to showcase in the article.)

[1]
[https://www.bjs.gov/index.cfm?ty=tp&tid=30](https://www.bjs.gov/index.cfm?ty=tp&tid=30)

------
trentnix
There are two justice systems: One for the politically connected. One for
everyone else.

Who watches the Watchmen?

~~~
SkyBelow
It is a bit more complicated than that. There is a tiered system based on your
connections, class (wealth), gender, race, appearance, and other factors
(these factors are not weighted equally). To further complicate it these
factors are weighted differently for different categories of crimes.

~~~
throwaway0a5e
>To further complicate it these factors are weighted differently for different
categories of crimes.

And weighted differently by local norms.

~~~
trickstra
And by the amount of publicity they receive.

------
openasocket
Some commenters are asking about what we can do to fix this, so I thought I'd
list some potential action items off the top of my head:

\- Getting rid of elected judges will certainly help, though it looks like
Hayes wasn't elected but appointed by the city council. I'm not totally clear
on how local judge appointments work, but it might make sense to consolidate
this power at the state legislature, which will have more visibility and
accountability than the city council. In general, I think a lot of our issues
with civil rights and justice reform could be helped by consolidating more
power at the state level rather than the city/county level, and creating a
clear hierarchy of power between the statewide and local entities.

\- People talk about having term limits for judges, but I'm not totally sure I
agree with that. It's something to consider though, and worthy of study.

\- Improve funding for public defenders. It might make sense to require
municipalities to match their budget for prosecutors with their budget for
public defenders, or some fixed percentages. Elevating the office of public
defenders and making it a viable career path, much like being a career
prosecutor, would go a long way.

\- Look into expanding when you can rely on the services of a public defender,
like in traffic court for more minor offences. For some people a hefty fine
can make them destitute, and they need someone to advocate for them and make
sure the fines assessed are fair.

\- Strengthen national organizations for public defenders, like the NAPD,
through grant programs.

\- Increase liabilities for judges in the event of gross misconduct. This
should include not just suspensions but monetary fines (which I know can be
levied for lawyers engaging in misconduct). This can be done not just with
legislation, but possibly legal action. And there might be grounds for civil
rights lawsuits against municipalities and states that fail to properly vet
and discipline judges conducting this sort of gross misconduct. Generally
speaking judges are not personally liable for any actions they take on the
bench, but the bodies that are supposed to oversee them could be.

\- The Justice Department should perform more investigations of these sorts of
systemic civil rights violations, much like they did in Ferguson and
Baltimore. It should be expanded to the point where they aren't just
conducting these reviews after some bad behavior gets headlines, they should
be conducting random audits to improve accountability. This can be backed up
with legislation requiring the Justice Department to conduct regular reviews,
to ensure this is happening consistently and doesn't vary from administration
to administration.

------
vmception
> They included a California judge who had sex in his courthouse chambers,
> once with his former law intern and separately with an attorney

and got caught both times

------
debt5000
us judges must taste how a jail feels like before administering it.

------
alexashka
This article is depressing.

What I find troubling is not only what's in the article, but what's left out.
There is no call to action, there is no information provided as to what a
reader can do, to help fix this disaster.

It leaves you feeling deflated, because now what? Now you go about the rest of
your day with this burden of knowledge.

This is very common with these types of stories - it's not enough to complain,
you need to provide a set of potential solutions or else people begin treating
these stories the way they do homeless people - they just learn to ignore
them.

Maybe that's what these newspapers want or are coerced into - that'd be the
darkest and most sinister interpretation.

~~~
Invictus0
Reuters is just a newswire agency: it just does research and provides the
facts. Downstream news outlets like Fox and NBC are the ones that will put the
spin on it, and boutique outfits like commondreams and Mother Jones will give
you the call to action if they cover it. The problem with Mother Jones and
publications like it is that they have a pretty strong slant (they are trying
to persuade you, not inform you) and they also don't run stories that go
against their narrative, thereby omitting information that may inform
you/provide greater context or nuance.

In any case, the solution here is the same as always; write to your
representatives or get involved in a protest (all variations on "advocate for
change").

~~~
pessimizer
> Reuters is just a newswire agency: it just does research and provides the
> facts.

Reuters isn't some neutral-fact agency. Reuters does tons of editorial, and
has an overall editorial slant, but its customers are news outlets, not
readers. Articles written from vague perspectives can run in a wider variety
of publications.

What you're reading here is highly editorial (though I like it.) Reuters is
choosing to report on an issue that could be interesting to people by
highlighting a few individual stories of lesser appeal. They could have not
covered this and covered anything else (there was no "news" event.) They could
have taken the position that _too many judges_ had been removed from the
bench, implying that there was a bias against judges. The reporter made a
journalistic choice to investigate the crimes of judges. The reporter then
made the editorial choices to report it though these particular examples, and
to highlight criminal judges still serving rather than criminal judges that
have been removed, or even the relatively low crime rates in judges as a
demographic as compared to many other demographics. Reuters then made the
editorial choice to publish the piece - which may have been preceded by
sending it back with suggestions to change previous editorial choices, or
maybe even handing it off to another journalist to finish.

The idea that there are neutral fact-delivering voices of god somewhere is
destructive, and easily taken advantage of by the people who own these voices
of god. The Moonies bought UPI.

------
jimbob45
> Instead, the judicial commission and Hayes reached a deal. The former Eagle
> Scout would serve an 11-month unpaid suspension.

Do these articles not get reviewed before publication? How is being an Eagle
Scout relevant to this story?

~~~
augustt
Why not? It's an interesting point that he was a Boy Scout, an organization
whose statement is "to prepare young people to make ethical and moral choices
over their lifetimes", and he went on to be a terrible human being.

~~~
mdorazio
Worth noting is that the Boy Scout organization itself declared bankruptcy as
a result of ongoing scandals and lawsuits.

~~~
082349872349872
If BSA is bankrupt, would it be an opportune time for the Girl Scouts of
America to admit boys?

~~~
cptnapalm
They recently stated that they have no intention of doing so.

