
Lost sense of smell may be peculiar clue to coronavirus infection - baxtr
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/22/health/coronavirus-symptoms-smell-taste.html
======
jackschultz
Rudy Gobert, the guy in the NBA who was first to test positive and did the
whole touch the microphone things at one of his interviews before the test
even, came out about his lack of smell and taste. I was thinking his name
could be brought up in that article considering his famousness of patient 0 in
the US sports world.

Hopefully this doesn't give people more fear in thinking about their own
symptoms, but on the other hand, seeing an odd possibly symptom can really
help make them take it more seriously overall.

[https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/fn6kh0/rudy_gobert_giv...](https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/fn6kh0/rudy_gobert_give_the_people_a_twitter_update_loss/)

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farresito
A few days ago my mother mentioned that she had gone buy groceries, stopped
before a florist, and tried to smell some lavender, but for some reason could
not feel absolutely anything, which she found interesting, as it has a
relatively strong smell and she didn't have a cold. Looking back, none of us
felt particularly great around that week, so I wouldn't be surprised if that
had been covid-19. I guess looking back it makes more sense. It seems a lot of
people go through it barely having any symptoms.

~~~
deepsun
I've also heard that 93% of people who think they have Covid-19 are wrong.

~~~
bpodgursky
You've heard nothing and have no data, because we don't have any Covid-19
antibody tests, so we have no clue who has had and recovered from the disease,
unless they were tested while contagious.

~~~
kippinitreal
Not to support a dataless claim...but...isn't the fact that ~90% of tests come
back negative (and tests are hard to get) indicative of their point that the
vast majority of people who think they have the disease, do not? AFAIK the
testing is not random at this time.

[https://covidtracking.com/data/](https://covidtracking.com/data/)

~~~
MikeAmelung
No, because by the time they get around to testing you, you could be
completely devoid of the virus, or it could be only in your lungs, or the test
just fails for whatever reason.

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stkai
Anecdote: I've had anosmia for exactly a week now, without any nasal blockage
or any other symptoms of covid-19. It seems to be slowly getting better as of
today (I can smell cologne, a bit). My doctor's office said they wouldn't test
me, but that I should assume I'm infected and stay at home.

~~~
rabidrat
Location?

~~~
stkai
Seattle

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robocat
Some good comments on another article:
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22648580](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22648580)

“This seems like a potentially game-changing discovery - if we could trivially
diagnose 30%+ of cases, that could drastically diminish growth rate.”. I
agree, especially if the symptom shows up early.

"Rapid Clinical Evaluation of Anosmia - The Alcohol Sniff Test" \- see
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22650256](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22650256)

Google Trends shows trending before the Anosmia articles AFAIK):

[https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=now%207-d&q=%2...](https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=now%207-d&q=%2Fm%2F0m7pl)

[https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=today%203-m&ge...](https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=today%203-m&geo=US&q=loss%20of%20smell)

“I lost my sense of smell when I took a zinc tablet to prevent covid-19
(serious but funny). Maybe I shouldn't have dissolved it in my throat (as was
suggested).”. Another comment mentioned Zinc in high doses can cause Anosmia.

Lots of good anecdata from people that have lost se se of smell/taste.

“ Post-viral anosmia is one of the leading causes of loss of sense of smell in
adults, accounting for up to 40% cases of anosmia. ”.

I tried searching for how common this is a symptom for flus/colds. It appears
to be rare, but if anyone can find some hard data that would be grand.

------
ccleve
What I'd like to know is, what percent of people with Covid 19 can smell and
what percent can't? That would tell us if it is a good discriminator.

In an ideal world, everyone who had Covid would not be able to smell, and then
we could justify doing a second, more reliable test on them. Anyone would
could smell would be ok.

~~~
fragmede
In an _ideal_ world we'd have infinite tests (that take 0 seconds to get
results) and not need to rely on symptoms that may present differently, or may
not even present in some patients. We'd be able to test everyone daily,
multiple times, for the virus (nose/throat swab), and for antibodies (blood),
and have a system setup for contact tracing. We'd find a way to do that that
doesn't infringe on our peace-time civil liberties.

We don't live in an ideal world, unfortunately. In the absence of a Covid-19
test, we could test for the _flu_ , because knowing I have the ordinary flu,
or not, vs Covid-19, is still valuable information, especially in places where
there is still no ban against large gatherings.

With a few order of magnitudes more testing, whatever the disease, we could go
about our normal lives with only slight modifications, rather than this
upheaval we're currently undergoing.

~~~
mandelbrotwurst
Are you sure that you're less likely to have Covid-19 if you have the flu?

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Reason077
For some people I think this is just a normal response to respiratory viruses.
My ex would swear she lost her sense of smell (and taste) whenever she had a
cold.

This is not something I can recall experiencing, though. If anything, my sense
of smell seems enhanced when I'm sick. Strong smells often seem more intense
and make me feel worse, even smells that normally wouldn't bother me much.

~~~
rob74
The "common cold" virus is also a coronavirus, so that makes sense. That would
still help in differentiating if you have the flu or Covid-19. I only heard of
getting more sensitive to smells in connection with migraine (totally
anecdotal evidence)...

~~~
notanote
Rhinovirus is another well known cause for a common cold. A quick search
result: webmd [1] gives 10%-40% for rhinovirus, 20% for coronavirus. CDC [2]
has rhinovirus as the most common cause, and adds: “ Other viruses that can
cause colds include respiratory syncytial virus, human parainfluenza viruses,
adenovirus, human coronaviruses, and human metapneumovirus.”

[1] [https://www.webmd.com/cold-and-flu/cold-
guide/common_cold_ca...](https://www.webmd.com/cold-and-flu/cold-
guide/common_cold_causes)

[2]
[https://www.cdc.gov/features/rhinoviruses/index.html](https://www.cdc.gov/features/rhinoviruses/index.html)

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throwaway_pdp09
Loss of sense of smell isn't uncommon for cold or flue. Oddly it may depend on
what you've got in a way I can't explain. I remember utterly losing smell,
then starting to recover it in a pub just before closing time when one of the
bar staff was splashing brasso
([https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brasso](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brasso))
around to clean the taps. I literally could no smell a thing beforehand. Yet
I've had cold/flus where that didn't happen. It would be interesting to know
why one coronavir does and another doesn't.

FYI loss of smell is known to be an early symptoms of parkinsons IIRC.

~~~
gameswithgo
if you have turbinates in your sinuses, and they inflame when sick/allergic,
it can reach a tipping point where you can't smell any more. So one flu may
inflame them more than another, or you have have grown more/larger turbinates
later in life where you more easily lose your sense of smell.

perhaps covid-19 cause the loss via some other mechanism entirely, I have no
idea.

~~~
throwaway_pdp09
Interesting, I've never come across the term.

[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turbinate](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turbinate)

FYI for others. Thanks for that

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jpster
Is it me or is this discovery an incredible stroke of luck for the prospects
of stopping this damned thing? Might this help otherwise asymptomatic people
self-diagnose and take proactive quarantine measures? And these measures would
help drop the R-naught.

~~~
mynegation
Does not look like sensitivity or specificity of anosmia is good enough by
itself as a diagnostic criterion.

~~~
im3w1l
The specificity is high enough, certainly better than for having a cough, to
tell everyone with anosmia to self-quarantine. I agree that sensitivity is not
great.

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troughway
For people who are asymptomatic, how long before it's completely purged from
the body?

I ask because there is a lot of "asymptomatic people may not remain
asymptomatic" type of discussion whenever a thread on this coronavirus comes
up.

~~~
epc
Anywhere from 14 to 37 days, based on this article
[https://www.mcknights.com/news/coronavirus-may-live-in-
patie...](https://www.mcknights.com/news/coronavirus-may-live-in-patients-for-
up-to-37-days-new-study/) which references this study:
[https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6...](https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736\(20\)30566-3/fulltext)
(scroll to heading "Findings").

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mehrdadn
Related but off-topic question:

Does anyone know how long coronavirus is known to last (even rough estimates)
on dry/wet surfaces at cold/room temperatures?

The practical consideration here is, if I buy something from (say) a
supermarket, and (say) someone infected had sneezed on it that day, how long
and in what manner would it be helpful for me to leave it outside/in the
fridge/etc. to help prevent transmission of the virus? For refrigerated or
frozen goods, how much should I expect this duration to be affected?

~~~
alistproducer2
CDC says they found live virus on Grand Princess surfaces 17 days after
passengers left

[https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/23/cdc-coronavirus-survived-
in-...](https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/23/cdc-coronavirus-survived-in-princess-
cruise-cabins-up-to-17-days-after-passengers-left.html)

~~~
mehrdadn
Oh damn. Thank you!

~~~
lotsofpulp
The CDC report only indicates finding RNA, which is NOT the same as finding a
live virus, so that CNBC article is clickbait.

>SARS-CoV-2 RNA was identified on a variety of surfaces in cabins of both
symptomatic and asymptomatic infected passengers up to 17 days after cabins
were vacated on the Diamond Princess

[https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6912e3.htm?s_cid=mm...](https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6912e3.htm?s_cid=mm6912e3_w)

Here is someone qualified discussing CDC report:

[https://mobile.twitter.com/aetiology/status/1242254105155973...](https://mobile.twitter.com/aetiology/status/1242254105155973122)

~~~
mehrdadn
Oh thank you!

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oxymoran
If the virus replicates in the throat and the nose, I would think we should be
gargling with diluted hydrogen peroxide and flushing our sinuses out with
strong saline solution.

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stainforth
And by extension your connected sense of taste would be altered as well. 2
years ago I had a cold or the flu and for a while after, ketchup had a
distinct difference, where it almost tasted like a fancy mustard

------
known
[http://archive.vn/610TO](http://archive.vn/610TO)

------
known
[http://archive.vn/49LZD](http://archive.vn/49LZD) if you can’t smell the
garlic/onion you may be infected with Coronavirus

