
Ask HN: How do people with successful careers play the game? - nns
When you work in an extremely dynamic environment full of smart people and just good work is not enough to take you forward, what else (besides best quality work) should you concentrate on?<p>Edit - There&#x27;s some incredible gems of advice in the comments here (especially for a mid-level career person like myself). I&#x27;d like to thank everyone for taking the time out and contributing and writing their thoughts down.
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marypublic
Read this book: [http://www.amazon.com/How-Star-Work-Breakthrough-
Strategies/...](http://www.amazon.com/How-Star-Work-Breakthrough-
Strategies/dp/0812931696) and do what it says.

(I am a senior technical resource in an environment like you describe. Read
this after I was pretty far along but it basically sounds like how I operated
to get where I am.)

Don't waste time. Be mission/vision focused. Be polite to everyone always. Be
helpful whenever possible. Be _insanely_ organized. Do not be That Guy/Gal who
is always forgetting things, late to meetings, doing the wrong thing, asking
stupid questions about stuff that's already been covered in meetings, etc.
Seek and respond to constructive feedback on your work. Do the sh#t work
without whining. All of this will build human capital with other people in the
organization, which will both practically give you more resources of help from
others to draw on in your work requirements, but also increases your
visibility with people who aren't on the front lines doing the work (e.g.
Management). That visibility gives you the means to move in whatever direction
you might desire. It also (for want of a better way to put it) usually tends
to help make you layoff-proof because people know you are competent,
professional, and have some flexibility to work as part of a team.

None of this means you are anyone other than who you are. Don't kiss anyone's
a##, but also don't be an a##hole. At the end of the day with two people even
remotely similar in "technical" capability, personal behavior will matter for
increasing your effectiveness within any organization.

~~~
Allower
Wow, i thought that was common sense..

~~~
arnold_palmur
Agreed - that book seems interesting, but I wonder how much is obvious
workplace common sense and prudence.

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percept
In a truly dynamic environment there should be more opportunity to figure out
where you can best contribute as a team member. (Work is about more than
simple technology.)

Maybe you're blocked in some areas, but are there others where you can help
with your unique combination of knowledge and experience?

It doesn't even have to be directed at the core of the project. Some teams
aren't good at creating infrastructure; maybe there's a need in the areas of
documentation, devops, or bug tracking and fixing. Stuff others don't want to
touch.

Consider starting there. (And always be thinking about your next move.)

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tixocloud
Be helpful.

A lot of people talk about playing the game. You don't have to play any game.
Besides delivering the best quality work, Be helpful to everyone around you -
including your boss, his boss, your peers, etc. Emotional intelligence is a
huge component in driving one's career forward. Be sensitive to everyone
around you. Know when to say and what to say at which time.

In addition to marypublic mentioned about being organized, I would say being
able to communicate/articulate your ideas and turn them from complex details
to simple nuggets of information.

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sinelanguage
Neil Young said it best, "keep your head down and walk forward". Don't just
look at the people who you perceive are moving forward, look at the ones that
appear to be standing still, and what do you think is the difference?. Sure
there are those that have moved forward due to being able to dramatize with
success the superficial things and say/wear/do/hangoutwith all the right
things and trick higher ups into believing they have more real authentic
capability than they actual do, but that only lasts so long. Where you really
move forward is in your authenticity. If you authentically love what you do,
and you excel at it, and you look forward to advancing it forward no matter
where you work or what you're paid, then you're pretty much invincible. You
will naturally exude passion for your chosen skillsets, you will embrace all
that is thrown at you with gusto, and people will naturally gravitate towards
that. Most of all, pay it forward. Mentor those around you in the same
skillset area, and make a difference and demonstrate that even though you are
an expert and SR level in your field, that the success of the team is rooted
in the power of everyone being able to produce at the same level as you. When
you do that, whether you are intentionally trying to impress your superiors or
not, it won't matter, they will notice, and if they don't, then you have some
choices to make. In field of dreams, the phrase, "if you build it they will
come", applies to you as a person, if you become the highly skilled, sr level
expert, that exudes passion and innovative mindsets, people will come, they
will gravitate towards it and you will be successful. Maybe not as fast as
those just phoning it in and playing the parts really well, but slow and
steady always wins the race. I work in a highly competitive environment and I
am not even a full time staff, yet because I practice what I just preached,
whenever a PM needs dev work done, my name usually comes up very early in the
conversation. That wasn't a calculated thing on my part, I didn't play a game,
I didn't coax anyone my direction, I just work really hard because I love
being a developer, I constantly evolve and advance my skills because I feel
empowered when I build more advanced things with code, and my authenticity and
passion is obvious and authentic and people with good intentions will always
appreciate that and gravitate towards it. Now does this work EVERYWHERE? Hell
no, but its up to you to decide what works for you in terms of where you work,
and don't compromise your authenticity just to move up or make more, its not
worth it in the end.

~~~
AtmaScout
That was very well said. Thank you.

I knew a VP who always seemed to move up, even though his projects failed. It
eventually caught up to him. He wasn't being authenticate.

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alexpotato
Every company/organization/group etc has multiple "dimensions" that they use
to determine who is valuable and who is not.

For example, in a technical organization, one dimension might be ability to
quickly create production level code. Another dimension might be ability to
refactor legacy code.

In a sales organization the dimensions might be different e.g. ability to make
existing customers happy vs ability to find new customers.

NOTE: even in the same company, one group may have different dimensions than
other groups.

The key is to:

a. figure out which dimensions your company/group/manager are using to define
value

b. if there are multiple dimensions, try to find the ones that are
easiest/most natural for you but are hardest/least natural for others

c. focus on maximizing b

d. profit

Case in point: I once worked at a high frequency trading firm. I was one of
the few people WITHOUT a STEM PhD. However, I was much better, relatively
speaking, at over the phone customer interactions/support. Within a month of
being there I was made Head of Customer Support purely as a function of being
the group member with the best people skills.

Another key point, be wary of creating "Unspoken Covenants" e.g. "If I do X,
my manager should do Y".

No they don't.

Go to your manager and say propose a mutually beneficial agreement. e.g.

You: "I would like an increase in salary/title/benefits/vacation days. I know
that's a big ask but I know you value sales/code quality/production rate,
correct?"

Manager: "Why, yes I do!"

You: "Great. I can improve that thanks to %ABILITY. If I do that can I get my
initial ask?"

They should be saying "Hell yes!!" at this point. If not, you may have either
misjudged what they value or you are dealing with someone who doesn't believe
in mutually beneficial agreements.

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partisan
Sounds like a great place to be. I would say you should pick someone who you
admire most in the group and try to emulate their behavior.

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rubiquity
I would work on finding an environment where only high quality work matters.
If you're in an environment where ass kissing matters you aren't actually in a
high quality environment.

~~~
im3w1l
This sounds intuitively true to me. I assume the reason it was downvoted was
because someone thought it was terrible advice. I'd appreciate hearing the
counterargument.

~~~
mead5432
Here is a counterpoint:

To a certain extent, you always have to play some politics wherever you work
unless it is just you with maybe one or two others. Some workplaces are less
influenced by them (tech being an example when compared to finance or
management consulting) and other games are played without realizing it on both
sides (Do you tell your boss their idea is "stupid" or do you try to explain
the reasoning why your idea is superior? Alternately, your boss won't be too
excited to bring you in on a new idea if you only tell them their ideas are
stupid).

You work in an environment with people. The better you do, the more people
with whom you will likely have to interact and the more you'll probably have
to play the game. Environments that deal with human interaction are going to
be subject to some form of politics simply because people are going to be more
inclined to assist those they like over those they don't (quality of work
being fairly comparable).

If you don't like the political atmosphere of where you work, there is nothing
wrong with that. The best option is to probably find another place to work
that has fewer games (or more, if that's what your into). Politics tend to be
a cultural thing and changing the culture of a workplace is... hard. Unless
you are in a position of power, you won't be able to drive that change without
bringing people to your side which, ironically, requires that you play some of
the games.

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iamjoday
networking, mentoring, Be a protege, evengelise your work, volunteering work
not asked/expected from you.

Also be polite, respect others and smile.

Simple it may sound but it is often lacking for whatever reasons.

Also, don't confuse it with politics or playing game... it is as important as
being smart and hard-working...

Nash, [http://joday.com](http://joday.com)

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bjourne
What is a successful career to you?

