
Let the Fountain Pens Flow - CaliforniaKarl
https://www.nytimes.com/2018/12/26/style/fountain-pens.html
======
mfringel
I started using fountain pens a couple of years ago, and still do for my daily
writing.

I write rather a lot; I don't bring my laptop into meetings unless I need to.
Combine that with my handwriting being relatively neat, small, and stylized,
and I needed something with a sufficiently fine nib, and ink that would flow
well through it.

It turned into a fascinating optimization problem, during which I ended up
down the rabbit hole of nib sizing (European nibs tend to run wider than
Japanese nibs), notebook paper (there are plenty of good notebooks that are
fountain-pen friendly, and that Moleskine notebooks are both comparatively
expensive and the paper just isn't great), and different types of ink (which
brands run "wet" or "dry", etc.)... and all of this is before getting into
eyedropper-conversions, nib repair, and all of the other craft-related things
one can get into.

I started with (and still have) a Pilot Metropolitan and a Platinum Preppy
that still see use, although I've gone over to a Kaweco Special FP and a Pilot
Vanishing Point (both with extra-fine nibs) for daily writers.

The current "daily writer" tuples are:

1) Pilot Vanishing Point (extra-fine nib), Pilot black cartridge ink.

2) Kaweco Special FP (extra-fine nib), Faber-Castell Carbon Black ink.

...preferred notebook is the Kokuyo Campus High Grade MIO notebook (A5 paper,
80 sheets, ~$6.50 each).

That all being said, I still use ballpoint pens on airplanes; the Pentel BK77
Superb (fine point, black) works just fine.

~~~
JohnBooty
This is why I won't let myself get started on fountain pens. I tend to go down
the rabbit hole _hard_ when I pick up a new hobby, and fountain pens have
always seemed like such an enticing rabbit hole to dive into!

Three months into the hobby I'd probably have two desk drawers full of pen
paraphernalia and a credit card bill full of shame! Not that other pen freaks
do this. I just know I would.

(and I'm left-handed....)

~~~
jgtrosh
Sounds like you'd fit in just right with the others at r/fountainpens

~~~
JohnBooty
Ha, that's the problem, right?

I fit in with obsessive gear geeks a little _too_ well, and can't afford a new
time- and money-suck of a hobby.

As somebody who enjoys playing games, managing to avoid the MMO craze entirely
was a struggle and an achievement...

------
joshu
Not quite the same, but I've been getting into technical pens because normal
pens don't work as well in my plotter. I've found a lot of different failure
modes in all sorts of writing implements so far... Example output:
[https://twitter.com/joshu/status/1074836822751010816](https://twitter.com/joshu/status/1074836822751010816)

~~~
blhack
Ohhhh! What pen is that? I'm actually a big fan of using sharpies in plotters
(made some drawings like this:
[http://blog.blhack.me/show?p=colorBook](http://blog.blhack.me/show?p=colorBook))

The problem is that they run out of ink very quickly. I've been looking for a
more "pro" version of them, and it seems like your pens might be a good place
to start!

~~~
joshu
I started with sharpies originally but they get exhausted very easily.

I am currently using Koh-I-Noor Rapidograph on Bristol Board paper from
Strathmore or Canson

------
jypepin
I grew up in France, where schools don't allow you to use anything else but
fountain pens.

They don't teach you how to use one - to me, it's always been the same thing
as using a ball pen, except you trade the convenience (you have to change the
ink cartridge) for practicality (you can erase the ink with special eraser)
while keeping some style (it's still ink, not pencil, kept for drawing).

Getting a new pen felt weird at first, but just like a new pair of shoes, you
end up accustomed to it.

So it's interesting to read about fountain pens in America, where people talk
about having to "learn" how to write with a fountain pain. It's seen as such a
special, luxury or just nerd thing, while in France, it's just something
common nobody really pay attention to.

~~~
daxat_staglatz
This also explains why Americans tend to doubt the usefulness of learning
cursive writing: it is feels terrible and is quite slow when using ball point
pens, but smooth and fast with a fountain pen.

~~~
finaliteration
> the usefulness of learning cursive writing

Honest question - What do you see about it as being useful? I was taught to
write in cursive when I was younger but I honestly don’t feel like it has ever
been all that useful (especially given that most of my communication and
writing is done on a computer/smartphone).

~~~
Doxin
It's much faster when you learn it properly and write it with the proper
instrument. Ball point pens are _awful_ for cursive, but when writing with a
fountain pen you'll almost automatically switch back to cursive.

~~~
MrMember
I've never used a fountain pen, how well do they work for lefties? I sometimes
have problems smearing ballpoint ink with my palm, do fountain pens smear
more, less, or about the same?

~~~
1123581321
I’m a lefty and fountain pen smearing is an issue. Doubtless there are
techniques and inks to optimize for quick drying better than I managed, so I’d
encourage you to try and find out for yourself. It depends on how you’re able
to position your hand and I’ve only ever managed to write by dragging either
all the time or inadvertently when trying to keep my palm raised. It’s a shame
because the pens and their output can be quite elegant.

------
pbhowmic
I did my schooling in India where, in those days, they transitioned us from
pencils to pens in grade 5. Most notably, we were never allowed to use
ballpoint or even felt-tip pens, it always had to be a fountain pen. I have
never lost my love of the fountain pen. I bought a Kaweco just a few months
ago.

~~~
jogjayr
I remember being excited when I went into standard 4 because I could finally
use a fountain pen. Then I went abroad for 4 years and when I came back,
fountain pens were gone - history.

------
sandGorgon
If you are like me - and yearn for the feel of ink, yet the convenience of a
ballpoint..then do try using a rollerball.

The hack here is to use some very specific refills and use it inside your cool
Rollerball.

For example I use a Signo 307 refill (which is smear, water and tamper proof
and specially designed for anti-document signing fraud) inside my special
edition Waterman.

The other super cool Rollerball refill is the Pentel Energel. That's as close
to an ink pen experience you'll get.

~~~
rwmj
I have a TWSBI and several Lamys, which are great, but the pen I buy and use
in bulk is the Uniball UM-153S rollerball. All the fun of a fountain pen
without the hassle of dealing with ink. It's the pen for notes and shopping
lists. From my Amazon orders, I seem to buy a 12 box of them at least once a
year.

To Mitsubishi Pencil Co (makers of the Uniball): please make a green ink
version!

~~~
ricardobeat
I just saw them in green yesterday (and a host of metallic inks) in a Coop
supermarket, also available online: [https://www.amazon.de/Uni-Ball-
UB-157-Tintenroller-Spitze-St...](https://www.amazon.de/Uni-Ball-
UB-157-Tintenroller-Spitze-
Stück/dp/B00HT78XYC/ref=mp_s_a_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1546171227&sr=8-2&pi=AC_SX236_SY340_QL65)

~~~
rwmj
Yes I have this set too :-) However it's slightly different from the UM-153S,
in particular the nibs are narrower and not quite so nice to write with. (I
will admit I'm now being very picky indeed - all of these pens are far
superior to biros).

------
MBCook
You can get a Pilot Metropolitan from Amazon for about $14, and there are
other fountain pens that are a little cheaper. It’s not like you need to spend
$120 to start trying.

I started maybe two years ago with a set of Pilot Varsity disposable fountain
pens that I bought from Amazon for $9 or so. I liked the feeling so when one
of them started to run low on ink I decided to buy a ‘real’ (non-disposable)
fountain pen.

That was when I found the Metropolitan. If I’d known I could’ve bought a pen
for so little I would’ve bought that instead of the disposable ones to start.

They’re so much smoother to write with and don’t require anywhere near as much
pressure as a ball point pen. I’ve started thinking about improving my cursive
because of playing with fountain pens.

If you do any writing at all, give it a try. I use mine at work for taking
notes in meetings.

~~~
andrelaszlo
I like the reviews on
[https://www.penaddict.com/top-5-pens/](https://www.penaddict.com/top-5-pens/)
They have sections for different budgets etc. I have no connection to them, my
handwriting is terrible. I just like the site :)

------
ggm
I used to write with a 0.2 Rotring in school in the seventies. It was not
designed for this task, and worked poorly (not unrelated to my general lack of
dexterity).

However, it had one supreme advantage over others: I kept my tiny 1/8th of
hash wrapped in foil, in the tiny devo-like removable butt screw on it. A
fatter nib might well gave worked better, but this one was mine...

------
pseudolus
The aesthetic value of fountain pens is undeniable but for the left-handed
amongst us who refuse to twist their writing hand into some bizarre
contortion, the fountain pen will never be viable. My personal left-handed
recollections of using fountain pens all involve smears of ink on the side of
my hands and smudged lettering.

~~~
phaus
I'm left-handed and there are several techniques for writing left-handed with
a fountain pen. They don't all involve twisting your writing hand into "some
bizarre contortion".

I collect vintage fountain pens, mostly about a hundred years old with
flexible nibs that allow for fancy copperplate calligraphy. These kinds of
pens are very delicate and some of them are so sensitive that if you don't
know what you're doing you can destroy them pretty easily. With a little bit
of work and a little bit of practice I was able to learn to write with them
the way they were intended.

If you had an interest in fountain pens, don't let something like this kill
it. With a small amount of effort you can find a technique that works for you
without being uncomfortable.

~~~
dorchadas
> I'm left-handed and there are several techniques for writing left-handed
> with a fountain pen. They don't all involve twisting your writing hand into
> "some bizarre contortion".

I'm just curious if you've ever tried the mirror script technique? I remember
reading in Isaacson's biography that Da Vinci wrote everything in the mirror
script not to code it but because that's how left-handed people were taught to
write. I figure that it'd work just as well in modern days, though obviously
not if you needed someone else to read it.

~~~
pseudolus
I tend to scrawl directly over the path of the text I'm writing. I'm aware of
several writing techniques that I could adopt although I have to say that I've
never even considered the mirror technique. I'm very surprised that they even
bothered teaching an alternative method to left-handers to write during Da
Vinci's era as I was always under the impression that, up until fairly
recently, the strategy simply was to force people to write with their right
hand regardless of their natural inclination.

~~~
dorchadas
I was under that impression as well, but Isaacson implied that that's a more
_modern_ way, relatively speaking, at least when compared to Renaissance
Florence. Which is partially why I was interested in seeing if you had tried
it.

------
drgoodvibe
I'm in my mid 30's and have been collecting fountain pens for a few years now.
Not a a lot of vintage but I have a few rare limited editions and high end
stuff not because of status or collectibility but because I love the materials
and look and feel. To be honest, it's the tactility of it. Being all digital
all the time makes me miss the closeness to the words when I'm actually
writing with a pen and paper. And when you have this wonderful somewhat piece
of art of pen and ink to write with it makes writing different - more emotive
somehow. There are plenty of pens now that suit any particular style and
budget which is great. It's a great hobby to be honest.

~~~
dorchadas
I'm about 10 years younger than you, and have always been interested in
fountain pens, even before I started becoming more cynical about technology.
Any advice on how to start collecting them? Or even just finding good ones to
use?

~~~
komali2
Your best bet is probably the subreddit. It's extraordinarily active.

------
tzhenghao
Growing up in Malaysia, we students made the transition from mechanical
pencils to using pens in high school. I pretty much hated ballpoint pens due
to the increased force needed to make ink stay on paper (lots of fatigue when
you write 700 word long essays). I grew up using Pilot G1 and G2 gel pens. I
finally caved and bought myself a Pilot Kakuno fountain pen while I was back
in the motherland a week ago. I doubt I can move back to ballpoint again, but
still keep one in the travel backpack just in case I need it to fill up
customs forms in the plane.

~~~
adfm
I like how chunky and oddly modern the Kakuno is. It even comes in a clear
version and is easily converted.

------
HSO
Plus ça change…

 __ _In this coldly pixelated age, old-fashioned writing implements make a
small but meaningful comeback_ __

I used to be sympathetic but am getting quite tired of this trope. Without
having researched it, could it be that this started a few years after the
introduction of the iPhone?

[1] H. Wallop. The return of the filofax. The Telegraph, Feb 25 2010.

[2] P. Paul. A paper calendar? it’s 2011. New York Times, Jul 29 2011.

[3] L. Kellaway. Digital diaries are no match for our paper past. Financial
Times, Aug 31 2014.

[4] A. Chemin. Handwriting vs typing: Is the pen still mightier than the
keyboard? The Guardian, Dec 16 2014.

[5] C. Martin. Moleskine notebooks adapt to the digital world. New York Times,
Apr 18 2015.

[6] The Economist. Schumpeter: On the cards. Mar 14 2015.

[7] N. Sovich. The handwritten to-do list makes a comeback. Wall Street
Journal, Sep 08 2016.

[8] A. Birrane. Why paper is the real ’killer app’. BBC News, Jan 23 2017.

[9] K. Wong. The case for using a paper planner. New York Times, Jan 4 2018.

[10] ∞

I guess one factor is that the industry is fighting a rearguard battle and
paying PR agencies to place this sort of article in popular media[+].
Admittedly, they got me: Before the introduction of the Pencil, I did indeed
fall for it and buy a few high-priced "good" pens by the likes of Montblanc
and Faber-Castell plus overpriced stationery.

But I'll be damned if it wasn't all this fucking nostalgia that got us into
the current mess, even though there are so many good things happening. And it
is nostalgia that is holding us back or slowing our speed forward, to a better
world than the old, retrograde shit.

So yea, I tossed the pens, effectively. No use for paper anymore. Attachment
to old shit, for oldness's sake, has become toxic in my mind in the last few
years.

___________________________

[+] Something similar seems to be happening too in watches, after the
popularization of smartwatches after 2015. I see a LOT, really a lot, of ads
for watches in magazines and newspapers (which I consume mostly in PDF version
of the print magazine, so no microtargeting going on there).

------
JoeDaDude
This old article blames poor penmanship on ball point pens (rather than
keyboards) and considers them a poor replacement for fountain pens.

[https://getpocket.com/explore/item/how-the-ballpoint-pen-
kil...](https://getpocket.com/explore/item/how-the-ballpoint-pen-killed-
cursive)

------
chrisseaton
In the UK I think every school child still learns to write with a fountain pen
around the age of seven. There's one particular cheap plastic pen that
everyone used to have that stationers sold in bulk. I had to do a sort of
thesis about a topic I was interested in and hand-write it in a fountain pen
to become a 'master scribe' or something like that - I did mine about special
effects in film.

~~~
jdietrich
One of the many, many lies I was told at primary school: "You need to learn to
use a fountain pen, because you have to use one at secondary school". _Nobody_
used a fountain pen at secondary school.

~~~
JohnBooty
Similar to the lie I heard about computers from one particular teacher in high
school: "You can't use a mouse, because nobody uses a mouse in the real
world!"

This was in 1994 and it hadn't been true for quite some time!

(In her defense, WordPerfect 5.1 was a heck of a lot more productive with
keyboard shortcuts, especially if you had the little "cheat sheet" to place
atop the function key row on your keyboard, and of course developers and other
engineers know the benefits of minimizing the need to remove one's hands from
the keyboard as well)

~~~
komali2
Someone told my friend that they would be forced to use VIM at work as an IT
requirement, at university in 2015.

Even if he was only using remote terminals I can't see how this is a sane
thing to say to a class of students.

~~~
JohnBooty
That's hilarious. Knowing how to us vi(m) is a valuable skill (and one I lack
sadly) but you only really neeeeeeed to know if if your IT role involves
working on random remote systems.

As a software developer that has never been an issue for me. I can think of
only one or two times in my whole life I was working on some random server and
didn't have pico/nano available. And even then I think I was just able to use
sftp to edit it with my local editor of choice.

------
Ice_cream_suit
I have a number of fine Jinhao pens, that I use for all my work related
writing.

At around $3,inclusive of postage, they are a bargain.

Their nibs might need some adjusting. They also do a line of Montblanc
clones...

I have had a few Lamys but prefer the Jinhaos.

~~~
themodelplumber
I like the Jinhaos too. At the price, they are extremely cost-effective and
they make really versatile sketching tools. Here's a quick drawing for fun:

[https://www.instagram.com/p/BSrsp2cgq-e/?utm_source=ig_share...](https://www.instagram.com/p/BSrsp2cgq-e/?utm_source=ig_share_sheet&igshid=1404236e72a9e)

------
exabrial
Learning to write with a fountain pen is sort of like playing a violin but on
a small scale. Presure, direction, speed, stroke, and technique all play a
huge part.

------
cyberferret
I always carry at least 2 fountain pens with me when travelling - even with
the possible hazards of leaking etc. Just find writing with them is so much
fun, plus - less fatiguing. Writing with a fountain pen means I don't grip the
pen as hard and _have_ to use a lighter touch so as not to damage the tip.
That leads to more writing time with less hand cramps and tiredness.

I just got some new Iroshizuku inks [0] for Christmas, and can't wait to try
them out.

[0] - [https://www.gouletpens.com/collections/pilot-
ink?limit=24&of...](https://www.gouletpens.com/collections/pilot-
ink?limit=24&offset=24&slot=collections%2Fpilot-ink)

------
jackvalentine
I got given a mall voucher eight years ago and decided on a whim to get a Lamy
Al-Star with it. I’ve been using it ever since as my daily pen. I keep a paper
diary in an a5 notebook using it and have filled almost 10 volumes. In recent
years I have de-emphasised verbose writing and started sketching small maps
etc in it as well.

Nothing I do is particularly groundbreaking or interesting, but I like the
exercise!

------
yesenadam
When I was learning to draw years ago, I read in a book comparing every kind
of pen, that steel nib + ink is incomparably the best for drawing. (Not a
fountain pen, just a steel nib stuck into a wood or plastic holder) And indeed
it is! Vary the stroke width as you go from super-thin to thick, (or change
ink colour to whatever you like at any moment), or change between bendy and
stiff nibs, there's nothing like it. Also they're cheap and last for many
years.

When I was in high school in the 80s I never used a ball-point, but only
Artline, with their weird fibrous tip that didn't last long. Then when
Uniballs came along I used nothing else for many years, black and blue. Now I
find most ball-points are fine for writing, they mostly have a rollerball feel
compared to the ones a few decades ago. But for drawing, steel nibs.

------
HelloFellowDevs
My calligraphy is awful, but I've dipped a toe in fountain pen related items
to attempt get into a ritual of writing. It's been fun so far, the usage of
fountain pens have improved my chicken scratch for sure. I've got the entry
level starter kit of a Pilot Metropolitan and a Bullet Journal.

------
billfruit
One brand I found nice is the the Chinese make Jin Hao, which makes all-metal
bodied pens, at quite low prices.

------
sieabahlpark
> Packed around a table with notepads and test pens, the group, ethnically
> diverse but mostly men, lacked the slick appearance you expect of customers
> at a luxury boutique.

Why do we have to know the demographics? How is it pertinent info, and why is
it bad that it was mostly men?

~~~
ternaryoperator
The demographics are the least of it. The whole article reeks of a kind of
superficiality and condescension: "...who had the handsomeness of a 1950s
young dad, thick hair like mink, broad shoulders, a warm handshake."

I do wish that when newspapers describe a trend, they would stop trying to
write literature and simply provide the information. If I want more detail
with off-topic asides, I'll subscribe to a magazine or read blog posts.

~~~
JohnBooty
Honest question. How would one write about a trend/subculture/community/etc
without... writing about the sorts of people who comprise it and the community
itself? As somebody who's always been into pens but never taken the plunge
into fountain pens, I found this to be the most interesting part of the
article.

Sure, it could have been a simple list of links about places where one can buy
pens or whatever. But I already have Google and a Reddit account for that.

If I'm reading an article in the NYT or some other publication, the bare
minimum I'd expect would be for them to for them to bring some things to the
table that I can't get from thirty seconds of Googling or looking for the most
popular relevant subreddit.

~~~
ternaryoperator
I am totally on board with your point. Giving color to the feel of a community
is indeed an important part of reporting. And I think in that context, the
inclusion of demographics make sense despite OP's displeasure.

What I object to is the characterization of a single individual based on his
looks ("Hair like mink"). Not only does it tell the reader nothing useful, it
doesn't give any sense of the community being covered. It's just a superficial
aside, which if removed from the article would not lessen the reader's
understanding.

~~~
JohnBooty
By all logical measures, what you say about those superficial descriptions is
of course correct.

However illogical it may be, though: I enjoy reading them! Though in this
case, perhaps the article would have been better served by a picture of this
person (who's apparently a big deal in the pen world)

Certainly there is some threshold after which I'd consider those physical
descriptions distracting. I'm not sure what that threshold is.

------
sunpazed
As a keyboard jockey, you’re liable to get RSI, as I did — as such, I’ve been
using a fountain pen for nearly 20 years. You use much less pressure when
writing, and it’s great using a pen that you don’t have to throw away.

My two Lamy 2000’s have been going strong for many years. But even a cheap
Lamy Safari can last just as long.

If you’ve never tried a fountain pen, strongly suggest you do.

------
jlarcombe
Pelikan Souveran and Diamine inks, highly recommended. I don't write as much
as I used to, but it's always a pleasure. I also have a Lamy Safari and a
Shaeffer Prelude with some different nib sizes and filled with contrasting
inks, for variety.

------
mongol
My terrible handwriting is my largest regret. I don't know why it turned out
terrible. Maybe I did not pay enough attention how to hold the pen properly in
school. I have a feeling I am too tense. Really hard to break that habit.

------
tnecniv
I really like fountain pens, but I've ruined too much stuff with ink spills.
Maybe I'm just clumsy.

Also I burn through legal pads as scrap paper and I imagine I would get bad
bleeding on that paper.

~~~
archon
If you like fountain pens enough to give them another shot, a couple
suggestions:

> but I've ruined too much stuff with ink spills.

Try a pen with replaceable cartridges instead of an ink well. Pilot makes pens
like this, and I'm sure other companies do as well.

> Also I burn through legal pads as scrap paper and I imagine I would get bad
> bleeding on that paper.

Yep, legal pad paper is pretty much the worst thing ever for fountain pens. I
won't recommend specific brands because everybody has different tastes on
paper, but spend some time on /r/fountainpens and you'll get several dozen
options for paper that works great with fountain pen ink.

~~~
tnecniv
I'll give it a thought. I'm not tied to legal paper but I do a lot of quick
math and scratch work so I would like to have a disposable paper option.

------
hetman
For the veterans. Can anyone make any ink recommendations for inks that don't
bleed to the point of completely obscuring the text when the paper is later
exposed to a little water?

~~~
abtinf
Two of my favorite inks are waterproof: Noodler’s Baystate Blue is gorgeous
and removable only with bleach or _very_ hard scrubbing (filling a pen with it
is something of a terrifying ritual); and Noodler’s Warden series Bad Black
Moccasin is everything-proof and the smoothest ink I’ve ever used.

~~~
hetman
Ha! I had not actually considered that an ink that is hard to get out of paper
might be hard to get out of your skin as well!

------
hprotagonist
hmm. i noticed this trend about 5 years ago. Glad to see it hasn’t peaked yet,
fountain pens are great fun.

My calligraphy hand is trash, though — thankfully that’s mostly irrelevant for
the sort of writing i normally do!

