

Swartz didn't face prison until feds took over case, report says - danilocampos
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13578_3-57565927-38/swartz-didnt-face-prison-until-feds-took-over-case-report-says/

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erichocean

        If Swartz had stolen a $100 hard drive with the JSTOR articles,
        it would have been a misdemeanor offense that would have
        yielded probation or community service.
    

If this doesn't illustrate how messed up the system is, I don't know what
will.

~~~
twoodfin
I don't think that's accurate. The contents of the drive and what he intended
to do with them could have easily led to stiffer penalties.

Imagine it was a $100 hard drive with a few dozen copies of newly released
films. Or medical records from a hospital. Or credit card numbers.

This is a red herring.

~~~
count
...But it wasn't those things. That's the whole point, isn't it?

~~~
OGinparadise
Maybe the jstor articles were valued at what jstor charges for them
individually. In that case you're talking about millions of dollars in value.

Another point: if you break into a house to steal a $5 watch you are looking
at a lot more than just $5 theft. Aaron was charged with the equivalent of
breaking and entering

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ytadesse
Unfortunately, this comment will probably get filtered to the bottom but this
has to be said:

Since the story of Aaron's passing, this site has been home to a lynch-mob
asking for Ortiz's head on a plate. I wish I knew enough about federal
prosecutions to say whether or not this one was _far_ different from the norm
- hell, I wish I knew enough about depression and suicide to say whether or
not the prosecution was the primary reason for this sad turn of events - but,
regardless, the users HN have been relentless ... almost as if they wished
harm on Carmen Ortiz.

I'm pointing that out for a reason. Bullying and outright harassment come in
many forms. The end result of these actions are at times not the result that
anyone truly intended even if they imply it with their words/actions. You
can't on one hand accuse the feds of being overly aggressive while
simultaneously doing the same to Ortiz and her family.

Let the law and the current investigations run their course before there are
more unwanted consequences of this tragedy.

~~~
declan
I suspect that nearly all of the people on HN would be happy if Ms. Ortiz
simply resigned.

The worst-case for Ms. Ortiz, post-resignation, is that she gives up short-
term gubernatorial aspirations and quits to take a $1,500,000-$2,000,000 a
year gig as a partner at a large Boston law firm advising on white collar
criminal defense.

This is not exactly a horrible fate. In fact, most people would consider
trying to bring that about the opposite of "wish[ing] harm on Carmen Ortiz."

~~~
ytadesse
The problem is, some people here on HN have been very aggressive in their
attacks over the past few weeks - far worse than simply saying "she should
resign".

In addition to that, I've seen people sulk and get visibly agitated for long
periods of time after poor performance reviews at work. Now, compound that by
thousands in the public doing that - and then some. Think about the effect
that has on someone's mental well-being.

~~~
declan
Threats of violence or physical harm, if any were posted, are wrong and beyond
the pale.

But some of the comments you criticized above are far tamer than much of what
passes for discourse in American politics nowadays: "Someone needs to be held
accountable. Ortiz is someone." "Carmen Ortiz needs to go. She's a publicity
hound" "Someone needs to be held accountable. Ortiz is someone."

Nothing wrong with saying any of those things. If you have a high-profile
position in the U.S. government (Ortiz was confirmed by the Senate), you
should expect scrutiny if you screw up. If Ortiz wants to restore her "mental
well-being," one option would be to resign and take that lucrative law firm
gig. That she has not done so suggests she assumes she can weather this storm
and criticism of her will eventually die down. HN readers have the right to
challenge that assumption.

------
lancewiggs
I wonder about the reverse problem. Are there any worthy yet unpopular cases
that Ortiz not take up while she was pursuing these ones?

------
mikec3k
Carmen Ortiz needs to go. She's a publicity hound just trying to make a name
for herself rather than someone who actually respects the law.

~~~
saraid216
You've described maybe 80% of the people who have commented on this case.

~~~
malkia
And you are repeating what the rest of the 20% have said.

------
josephlord
This article linked from the parent actually seems a better explanation.

[http://dankennedy.net/2013/01/24/the-swartz-suicide-and-
the-...](http://dankennedy.net/2013/01/24/the-swartz-suicide-and-the-sick-
culture-of-the-justice-dept/)

------
arbuge
One only hopes that this will lead to wholesale reform of the US attorney
office in Boston in particular, and the plea bargaining process in general. It
is unfortunate that it took Aaron's sacrifice to make this happen if it does,
but it would at least be something positive coming out of his tragedy.

------
berlinbrown
How did it go from state/civil to a federal case?

~~~
Steko
_But the sweeping nature of federal computer crime laws allowed Ortiz and
Assistant U.S. Attorney Stephen Heymann, who wanted a high-profile computer
crime conviction, to pursue felony charges. Heymann threatened the free-
culture activist with over 30 years in prison as recently as the week before
he killed himself...

The Boston U.S. Attorney's office was looking for "some juicy looking computer
crime cases and Aaron's case, sadly for Aaron, fit the bill," Elliot Peters,
Swartz's attorney at the Keker & Van Nest law firm, told the Huffington Post.
Heymann, Peters says, thought the Swartz case "was going to receive press and
he was going to be a tough guy and read his name in the newspaper."_

~~~
rosser
_Heymann, Peters says, thought the Swartz case "was going to receive press and
he was going to be a tough guy and read his name in the newspaper."_

The Law of Unintended Consequences strikes again...

EDIT: The notion I was trying to capture is perhaps better expressed by
saying, "Be careful what you wish for." Heymann got all the things Peters
accuses him of wanting, just not exactly in the form he was presumably hoping
to receive them.

~~~
twoodfin
Why do you take Peters' claims about Heymann's motives seriously?

~~~
rosser
I think you might be reading more into my beliefs wrt Heymann than is
warranted, given what I said. (N.b., "Peters _accuses_ him of wanting"; "the
form he was _presumably_ hoping to receive them.") I don't pretend to have any
direct knowledge of Steve Heymann.

That said, based on what knowledge I _do_ have of him, his being a notches-on-
the-belt and consequences be damned type of Federal prosecutor fits the facts
well enough — in fact, better-enough than all the other alternatives
_combined_ — to consider my opinion accurate enough for an internet forum.

------
RockyMcNuts
can't help wondering to what extent the government's war on Manning,
Wikileaks, Anonymous was related to Swartz's harsh treatment, whether he was
perceived as working with groups actively opposing government policies, and
therefore as a hacktivist in the same category as enemies of the state.

~~~
roc
All the available evidence says "no". This is just how our our system treats
absolutely anyone who presents a prosecutor with a chance to shine up their
resume.

The only reason we seem to be hearing about Swartz, Manning, the Duke Lacross
Team, et al. is that they have a socio-economic standing that most of the
victims of this particular brand of "justice" do not.

~~~
mpyne
Manning is a Private First Class (E-3) in the U.S. Army, he's better off than
someone in a ghetto I guess but he had no better socioeconomic standing than
many other individuals who can commit computer crime.

His infamy is due to the particulars of his case and because the hacktivists
have latched onto him as a rallying point because of the association with
WikiLeaks.

~~~
roc
I was considering Manning's association with WikiLeaks and thus the larger
'free information' [1] online concern as part of his social standing. Because
as soon as he became the name behind that leak, it was.

As opposed to, say, the less-visible alleged members of Anonymous and Lulzsec
who are likely facing the same exact sort of prosecution 'strategy' as Swartz
[2], but because they aren't or are lesser parts of those crowds, no-one's
paying much attention. Even though, criminals though they may be, it's just as
likely their prosecutors are pursuing their cases with that same lack of
justice or proportionality.

[1] in the FOIA sense, not in the piracy sense.

[2] I definitely draw a distinction between Manning and Swartz's prosecutions,
as Manning being enlisted, gives the prosecution a distinct ability to go so
much further with it.

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baritalia
Swartz was a crackhead and a criminal. It's a good thing he's no longer with
us.

~~~
jacquesm
What I wouldn't give to see Aaron posting here instead of you.

~~~
mpyne
Agreed!

