
Could we reboot a modern civilisation without fossil fuels? - jonbaer
https://aeon.co/essays/could-we-reboot-a-modern-civilisation-without-fossil-fuels
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philipkglass
A very interesting question, and I think that the author _mostly_ identifies
correct answers. (TLDR is "Yes, if the survivors keep population-to-resource
ratios low enough until they can tap energy sources more abundant than wood
and hydropower.")

 _So, would a society starting over on a planet stripped of its fossil fuel
deposits have the chance to progress through its own Industrial Revolution? Or
to phrase it another way, what might have happened if, for whatever reason,
the Earth had never acquired its extensive underground deposits of coal and
oil in the first place?_

The second phrasing here is not actually the same as the first. A society
rebuilding a century after some great collapse would have significant
advantages over a never-exploited-fossil-fuels-at-all scenario. They'd have
access to large quantities of refined metals just from the ruins of the old
civilization. Likewise many machines to imitate, even if the old versions were
no longer in working condition. Also lots of books remaining, including
valuable diagrams even if the language is hard to understand.

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tbihl
Unfortunately, I can't access the article.

I think that I take the opposite stance from you on rebooting society,in that
I'm decidedly more bearish. Not only do I not think we'd reassemble on the
scraps of yesteryear, but I think it'd be frightening how fast our society
could go from normal operation to unrecoverable given the complexity of things
we rely on, the physical distances in our supply chains, and the general near-
shortages of everything, everywhere, that just-in-time logistics affords us.
Plus a lot of people are likely to flee back home before the window to do so
shuts, further dismantling the complex web of interdependence.

And I'm thinking on the order of a couple weeks.

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philipkglass
I'm talking about a century or so after a mass collapse of civilization and
human populations, like in the article's opening scenario:

 _Imagine that the world as we know it ends tomorrow. There’s a global
catastrophe: a pandemic virus, an asteroid strike, or perhaps a nuclear
holocaust. The vast majority of the human race perishes. Our civilisation
collapses. The post-apocalyptic survivors find themselves in a devastated
world of decaying, deserted cities and roving gangs of bandits looting and
taking by force.

Bad as things sound, that’s not the end for humanity. We bounce back. Sooner
or later, peace and order emerge again, just as they have time and again
through history. Stable communities take shape. They begin the agonising
process of rebuilding their technological base from scratch. But here’s the
question: how far could such a society rebuild? Is there any chance, for
instance, that a post-apocalyptic society could reboot a technological
civilisation?_

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kenshaw
I also can't access this article -- would love to check it out, if/when it's
back online.

No idea if this article mentions the book, "The Knowledge" by Lewis Dartnell
(see above) -- however I would highly recommend the book if anyone is
interested on the actual "knowledge" necessary to reboot a civilization. It
goes into some depth on the actual chemical/mechanical processes involved in
building modern technology, and more-or-less outlines the steps to go from
"stone age" (or at least "post-apocalypse") tech back to something like
"modern" technology. Really interesting read, that also is illuminating on how
modern technology (and thus civilization) is so much more deeply complicated
than most probably realize.

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philipkglass
The article is by Lewis Dartnell and ends with a call to visit
[http://www.the-knowledge.org/](http://www.the-knowledge.org/)

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avmich
The article doesn't mention a possibility to make a good energy storage in
form of alcohol, produced from organic materials by biological processes.
Wonder if that's a viable option.

