

Scribd's decision to dump flash pays off, user engagement triples - njohnw
http://techcrunch.com/2010/06/19/scribds-decision-to-dump-flash-pays-off-user-engagement-triples/

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watmough
It's a huge relief to look at a file on scribd and have the file be HTML,
rather than flash.

I used to avoid scribd, but now I'll happily use it. As well as the pauses and
slowdowns, even the flash text rendering is wretchedly bad in comparison with
the HTML rendering I get in Safari.

Scribd have done a great job in moving over to HTML, and I'd expect the growth
to keep coming. Good on them!

Can't find the transition item here on YCN, but the first article of the
transition to HTML is:

<http://coding.scribd.com/2010/05/17/facing-font-in-html/>

~~~
nailer
Same here. I was using OReilly Safari the other day, which also hosts PDFs
like Scribd. I kept cutting and pasting sample code from I book I'd purchased,
then wondering why the code had ransom spaces inserted into it that kept
breaking things.

And then I remembered: Safari is Flash, Scribd is HTML. This is why Safari cut
and paste doesn't work.

Scribd dudes: please talk to OReilly.

~~~
goodside
Safari Books Online can use either HTML or Flash. I'm writing this from my
iPad and I have SBO open in the next tab.

~~~
nailer
Thanks, I didn't know that! Would be a better default.

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andrewvc
This raises the question, who can afford to build an internet application in
flash these days? It seems that making heavy use of flash in any new product
would be a big mistake.

Edit: s/begs/raises/

~~~
hexis
That question is raised, not begged.

<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Begging_the_question>

~~~
lsb
Just like how "mad" became "angry" instead of "crazy" in American English, or
how "bade" more often rhymes with "fade" instead of "sad", the meaning of
"begging the question" is becoming "begging one to ask the question".

~~~
hexis
I understand your point and have sympathy for it, but I just can't go along
with it. I know it's just the grumpy old man in me, but I still prefer to push
back (gently, I hope) against the misuse of words and phrases.

~~~
omaranto
I think you mean "against the use of words and phrases", as it is not a misuse
to give them their current meanings. ;)

~~~
hexis
This is rapidly turning into Humpty-Dumpty-ism.

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humpty_Dumpty#In_Through_the_Lo...](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humpty_Dumpty#In_Through_the_Looking-
Glass)

------
jorgeortiz85
Great example of pivoting. (As Chris Dixon said: "Ask yourself: if you started
over today, would you build the same product?"
<http://cdixon.org/2010/06/14/pivoting/>)

Another tidbit I found interesting:

 _Now that the company has its HTML5 and iPad strategy in place, Adler says
they are focusing on making Scribd more social and less reliant on search
engines. Today, the majority of their traffic comes from Google, but Scribd is
putting a greater emphasis on the social by closely integrating with
Facebook._

If Facebook (rather than search) becomes the principal way that people find
content online, that could spell big trouble for Google.

~~~
Raphael
We surf and encounter things serendipitously. This does not replace search
when we want something specific.

I also pose the reverse: if Google could gain traction in the social space,
that could spell trouble Facebook.

------
gruseom
I'm surprised at the meanness of some of the comments (is it contagious from
TC or something?) and I'd bet five bucks that some of the very people who
slammed Scribd for _not_ doing this are now slamming them for doing it.
Therefore I want to say again that this is the most impressive technical pivot
I've seen a startup do in a long time. What they're accomplishing here is a
lot more difficult than it appears, and it's only going to get better over
time -- probably much better. This is a real contribution to making the web
more usable for all of us.

~~~
Lewisham
I agree, I've started uploading my conference presentation slides to Scribd,
and it's a much better experience than Scribd's Flash implementation ever was
(and Slideshare's, for that matter). I tried the two sites multiple times over
the years, and I never felt that there was a better experience than just
putting the PDF for download.

However they achieve it, with "HTML5" or hacky auto-generated HTML markup
standards from before, it's a wonderful technical achievement that should be
applauded.

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japherwocky
I wish they should have listened to everyone who told them how annoying the
flash was in the first place, years ago.

All's well though. Here's to hoping this sparks an even bigger movement to be
rid of adobe on the web.

~~~
amock
I think that years ago the technology wasn't ready to do what they wanted it
to do.

~~~
Yaggo
If you look at scripd's source code, you cannot really call it "HTML5". It's
the same old nested DIVs with absolute positioning and class names such as
"only_ie6_border". Plus some CSS3 eye candy. Hard to see why it couldn't have
been implemented years ago.

~~~
amock
It's not just about HTML5, it's about browser support and speed for the
features they use. Browser performance has increased dramatically in the past
few years and many people have upgraded to browsers with much better standards
support. They still have some hacks, but they can also take advantage of HTML5
when it's available like they do with @font-face.

------
amanuel
I too always avoided Scribd due to its slowness. I generally kept looking for
the original pdf on google rather than suffer at Scribd.

The new HTML5 version is awesome. Thank you Scribd for dumping Flash. I look
forward to reading many pdfs on your site going forward.

------
axod
> "User Engagement Triples"

Overly vague. Does that mean 3 times the page views? Nothing much seems to
have changed on any traffic measuring sites (quantcast, alexa, etc).

~~~
snowmaker
Specifically, time on site.

~~~
axod
<http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/scribd.com> doesn't really show that, but then
alexa is always to be taken with a pinch of salt.

~~~
bbatsell
Alexa data is to be taken with the sodium content of the Dead Sea.

------
rmc
> Now that the company has its HTML5 and iPad strategy in place, Adler says
> they are focusing on making Scribd more social and less reliant on search
> engines. Today, the majority of their traffic comes from Google, but Scribd
> is putting a greater emphasis on the social by closely integrating with
> Facebook.

So rather than relying on Google for most of your traffic, you'll rely on
Facebook. Sounds like you're just changing one master for another.

------
BenS
Most of what Trip talks about is FB connect and recasting. I like the flash to
html switch, but can someone explain why the flash to html5 conversion would
increase time on the site for regular web users?

(I find it easier to understand why people who discover scribd through FB
would spend a lot more time on site than someone who reached scribd via
search)

------
rmason
They rode a trend. They were in the right place when the press wanted to trump
an anti-Flash story line. That PR is what tripled their engagement.

To me the document viewing experience went backwards and judging from the
comments on TechCrunch I am not alone.

~~~
miketuft
Exactly, and if you actually look at the numbers on Alexa:
<http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/scribd.com> The Pageviews/User and Time on Site
went down since they released it in May. It's all PR BS.

~~~
bdr
You really shouldn't trust Alexa's numbers for anything.

~~~
jfager
Once a site's above a gameable threshold, Alexa's a decent metric of how
unsophisticated users interact with it. If that's an interesting demographic
to you, you can probably get some value out of Alexa numbers.

------
util
I wonder if the numbers he quotes are based on comparing users forced to use
the Flash view vs the new view. It sounds like instead he's largely referring
to trends over time.

How's the new interface compare in terms of load time?

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mixmax
you need flash to watch the interview.

Oh the irony.

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rortian
This might be nice, but from what I can tell it does seem to work very well:

<http://www.scribd.com/doc/21569338/Formulas-for-the-MFE-Exam>

At least before, people could read this.

~~~
bbatsell
I just reviewed the entire document, and it renders 100% perfectly for me
[Safari 5.0 (6533.16, r61351)].

~~~
rortian
Thanks for the data point. Did the square roots render over the quantities.
I'll have to check browsers, but Opera was a no go and Chrome is okay but not
great.

~~~
bbatsell
Here are two sample screenshots from formula-heavy pages:

<http://i.imgur.com/LwODR.png> <http://i.imgur.com/XNrN4.png>

~~~
rortian
Thanks.

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jeb
User engagement is a convenient metric to use, because it's something that
only they have access to internally. If pageviews had gone up, that would have
been proper proof that their strategy worked.

This is similar to a diaper company changing the fluff on the diapers and
releasing a paper saying customer satisfaction is much higher.

