
The New York subway-map wars, continued - J3L2404
http://www.capitalnewyork.com/article/culture/2010/12/915879/new-york-subway-map-wars-continued
======
blahedo
I can't believe that an article about the contentiousness between different
design styles doesn't actually have clear pictures of the designs being
discussed! Here's a few I've been able to track down:

\- A 1966 map, in the style Vignelli replaced:
[http://www.nycsubway.org/perl/caption.pl?/img/maps/system_19...](http://www.nycsubway.org/perl/caption.pl?/img/maps/system_1966_a.gif)

\- Views of the 1972 map:
[http://www.nycsubway.org/perl/caption.pl?/img/maps/system_19...](http://www.nycsubway.org/perl/caption.pl?/img/maps/system_1972.jpg)
<http://subway.com.ru/maps/1972.htm>
[http://www.visualcomplexity.com/vc/project_details.cfm?index...](http://www.visualcomplexity.com/vc/project_details.cfm?index=266&id=266&domain)

\- The 1979 map:
[http://www.imageexchange.com/mvx10/engine.cgi?cid=Z4uJrwOtIs...](http://www.imageexchange.com/mvx10/engine.cgi?cid=Z4uJrwOtIsa9zDeFgq10KpTKpL&store=nytm&page=default&basecat=maprepro&return=sku50&body=sku10&sku=18181)
[http://gothamist.com/attachments/nyc_daveh/Fig.-3---
79-orig....](http://gothamist.com/attachments/nyc_daveh/Fig.-3---79-orig.jpg)

\- A 2008 map, an update of the 1972 Vignelli:
[http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2008/04/30/nyregion/Vign...](http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2008/04/30/nyregion/Vignelli-
Subway_FINAL.jpg)

\- A current 2010 map in the 1979 Tauranac/Hertz style:
<http://mta.info/maps/subway_web_full_map_Jun10.pdf>

And finally, an interview with Michael Hertz about the development of the 1979
map: <http://gothamist.com/2007/08/03/michael_hertz_d.php>

EDIT: and a page that contains both the current map (in Tauranac/Hertz style)
and the KickMap referred to in the article:
<http://www.kickmap.com/pages/7_wholemap_comparison.html>

------
siculars
Great breakdown of an argument that has going back and forth for years here in
NYC. In a similar vein, anybody who has some extra time and interest should
take a look at <http://nycbigapps.com/>. The deadline has been extended two
weeks further into late January. There is a Meetup this morning if you happen
to be in the neighborhood,
[http://www.meetup.com/NYCBIGAPPS/calendar/15493668/?a=cr1p_g...](http://www.meetup.com/NYCBIGAPPS/calendar/15493668/?a=cr1p_grp&rv=cr1p).

------
trafficlight
I hate websites that don't let you click on the image for a larger version.
Especially when the article is about something visual.

------
barrkel
From a tourist's perspective, the problem with the NY subway system (compared
with other subway systems) is that multiple stations have the same name, but
may be in very different locations. Usually it's on the same street, but not
always; e.g. Fulton St, in both Brooklyn and Manhattan.

As to the map itself, the current one is far too crowded in spots because it
hews too closely to physical geography, leading to difficulty making out the
association between labels, lines and stations until one is familiar with it.

------
willyt
Most subway maps in Europe are diagrams because the urban fabric of the city
evolved in a chaotic patchwork fashion; you can't easily explain London on a
diagram. The urban fabric of New York is a grid. New York developed on top of
a diagram. This is such a crucial part of how you understand the city that it
doesn't make sense to me that you wouldn't acknowledge this in a diagram which
is explaining a system which is laid out to serve another diagram: the city
grid. One of the fundamental principals of modernism is that form follows
function; the second guys map is more functional.

~~~
jamesbritt
That's only partly true. The early city was the standard sprawl-out-from-farms
kind of thing. Later on, Manhattan was planned pretty well. But the outer
boroughs are still a mix of grids and patchwork.

------
ljegou
Thanks for this very interesting report of the conference. The positions and
arguments are well and shortly exposed. The boundary between diagram and
geographical map is in question with subway "maps", and the graphic design is
still a challenge.

I'm glad to see that the subject of map design is alive and expanding with new
media. However, i'd like to see more references to semiology and perception
psychology :-)

------
cageface
This line cracks me up:

 _Chances are, though, that if you're giving it that much thought, you're the
kind of person who generally assumes that the good guys lost._

------
klbarry
The maps are always fine on subways and very useful. The maps on buses,
however, are non-existent or for the wrong routes. In addition, there's very
rarely an announcement for stops. I would use them much more if this were
fixed, as it's so much mental energy to always worry about my stop.

~~~
jim_h
While the maps might be bad, they need to update the routes too. Some routes
are horrible and there are stops on every other block. In some areas it can
take 6-8 minutes to get through 1 lane streets to go 2 blocks.

