

At peak, Spain gets 53% of its energy from wind - zzkt
http://greenmonk.net/spain-gets-53-of-its-energy-from-wind/
*during high winds at 5:50am on a Sunday morning
======
aneesh
This, while impressive, is not a routine occurrence. It was due to abnormally
high winds. Consider the following quotes from the Guardian article:

"High winds over the weekend supplied 53% of Spain's electricity"

"Experts estimate that by the end of the year, Spain will have provided a
_quarter_ of its energy needs with renewables, with wind leading the way ..."

[http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2009/nov/09/spain-
nati...](http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2009/nov/09/spain-national-
record-power-windfarms)

~~~
shaddi
The linked article is a bit ambiguous, but remember that electricity is a
subset of a country's total energy needs.

------
pieter
I think this blogpost debunks this pretty good:

[http://uvdiv.blogspot.com/2009/11/spanish-wind-power-
exposed...](http://uvdiv.blogspot.com/2009/11/spanish-wind-power-exposed.html)

Spain only gets about 9% of energy from renewables on average, which is much
less than a lot of other countries. The 53% number is very deceptive IMHO, and
really shows that you can't count on wind for reliable energy.

~~~
ghshephard
Not debunking at all, the first words in the article were:

"Ok, not all the time, but last weekend at 5:50am on Sunday morning (8th Nov)
Spain set a new record, hitting 53.7%"

Which instantly made it clear that this was an exception. I don't think
anybody is suggesting that you can provide all of your power requirements from
Wind, but - clearly, Wind can be an important part of your renewable portfolio
in some cases. Obviously Solar, GeoThermal, Hydroelectric, Conservation,
Efficiency all have important roles to play as well.

~~~
pieter
The title of this post was edited after I posted, it was something like "Spain
gets 53% of its energy from wind" first.

~~~
TomRaftery
As the author of the article I can categorically refute this.

The title of this article was never edited.

And WordPress has obligingly saved all of the post revisions so I can quite
easily prove this, if necessary.

~~~
pg
He means the title on HN.

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kilps
For everyone who keeps saying that this is only at peak, that doesn't mean
that it isn't important. If you can generate that much wind, then store the
energy with pumped storage - you are still getting far more overall renewable
energy than you would have otherwise.

~~~
sketerpot
Assuming perfect energy storage, the number you want is the _average_ power
production. You get this by multiplying the maximum output by the capacity
factor, which is 21-23% in Spain.

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chrisb
Impressive.

But the headline is slightly deceptive, as 53% is the maximum ever recorded.

What's more impressive is the that over the 24 hours presented the
contribution from wind never drops beneath 30%.

Contrast this with the current UK renewables target of 15% by 2020
([http://www.decc.gov.uk/en/content/cms/what_we_do/uk_supply/e...](http://www.decc.gov.uk/en/content/cms/what_we_do/uk_supply/energy_mix/renewable/res/res.aspx))

~~~
dbz
I don't see how it is deceptive. It's stated quite plainly that it is a
record, and not a normal occurrence. (None of this is spoken in a harsh, rude,
or sarcastic tone.) How would you say it differently? (Real question.)

~~~
iujhgfvvgbhnj
The title suggests peak energy demand, in fact it achieved it at minimum
energy demand (early hours of Sunday morning)

It's like an airport saying that all it's flights were on time at peak - then
saying that they didn't mean thanksgiving, they meant that on sunay morning
they peaked by getting both flights out on time.

------
zzkt
*during high winds, at 5:50 on a Sunday morning

------
narag
I can't see it from the article: are they talking about total _generated_
energy or _consumed_?

In Spain our government has banned new nuclear plants, so we have to buy
electricity from France, that produces it using nuclear plants anyway.

The high percentages of wind power is no wonder. There are _a lot_ of
generators installed.

~~~
barredo
> so we have to buy electricity from France

Lie.

    
    
      Year	Electricity - imports (million kWh)
      2000	9000
      2001	11945
      2002	12166
      2003	7588
      2004	7588
      2005	9800
      2006	8700
      2007	8300
      2008	8773
      2009	8773
    
      Year	Electricity - exports (million kWh)
      2000	5600
      2001	6230
      2002	7832
      2003	4138
      2004	4138
      2005	4400
      2006	7500
      2007	11400
      2008	14520
      2009	14520
    

Source: Cia Factbook.

More: <http://twitpic.com/5zscj/full> And more:
<http://twitpic.com/5zxm3/full> 2nd chart show how much % of Portuguese
electricity is imported from Spain

Source: Red Electrica Española (Spanish grid operator)

France exports electricity to other countries such as Belgium and such (70k
kWh last year)

Last link shows consuption, production, imports and exports of electricty in
Spain:
[http://www.indexmundi.com/g/g.aspx?v=79&v=81&v=82...](http://www.indexmundi.com/g/g.aspx?v=79&v=81&v=82&v=83&c=sp&l=en)

~~~
samuel
Thank you for your eye-widening comment. It's surprising how we swallow "well
known facts" as this (everybody pretends to know that we import energy from
french nuclears), without any research.

The comment you answer wasn't mine, but it could have been. Thanks.

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sketerpot
And most of the time, it has much lower wind production, and they make up the
difference by burning a lot of natural gas. This sort of thing is why the
natural gas companies like wind so much.

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Luc
... last weekend at 5:50am on Sunday morning. Still impressive though.

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cgherb911
As a kite surfer I enjoyed your post.

