
Standing desks are on the rise - matan_a
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424053111904199404576541011003270644.html
======
michaelbuckbee
I investigated the different standing desk options and found most of them
lacking for my requirements.

The biggest obstacles were that I'm 6'4" tall and need a desk that can support
3 big monitors.

I ended up making my own (admittedly non on the fly adjustable) standing desk
out of shelf track - the closet shelf system they sell at Home Depot or
wherever.

My keyboard shelf is 40 inches high and the monitor shelf is 52 inches high.

Total costs were around $100 and it only took an evening to put together.

[EDIT] - Pics of build and final desk at -
[https://www.dropbox.com/gallery/3175742/1/StandingDesk?h=8d1...](https://www.dropbox.com/gallery/3175742/1/StandingDesk?h=8d1c44)

~~~
mapgrep
Are you powering both external displays off the iMac? I didn't know that was
possible; the tech specs on the current 27" show it can power just one
external....

~~~
michaelbuckbee
The right one is powered by a mini display port -> DVI and the left via a USB
> DVI converter.

The leftmost one is rather slow to refresh, so I use it mostly for our company
geckoboard dashboard and for autotest output. The right monitor is a Dell
Ultrasharp with component inputs from the Xbox and Wii.

------
kristiandupont
I was considering getting a Milk table (<http://www.milk.dk/>). I know the guy
who designed it and it's awesome but I decided against it because of the
column in the middle. I need to stretch my legs. So I bought an X12 instead
([http://www.holmris.com/htm/..%5Chtm%5Csortiment%5Cx12%5Cx12....](http://www.holmris.com/htm/..%5Chtm%5Csortiment%5Cx12%5Cx12.html)).

Both of these are from Denmark and for the past 14 years of working as a
software developer there, I have always had adjustable desks. They are simply
everywhere and it was only recently that I realized that this is not the
situation world wide (I currently live in Spain and I had to order mine from
Denmark!).

This makes me wonder if there is an untapped market in, say, the US for these?
I could never go back and I think most people who have tried wouldn't. It's
not only the matter of standing up -- just making small adjustments during the
day when you change position a bit feels really good and I am sure is good for
the back etc.

~~~
johnyzee
I'm Danish and have often wondered about this too - there are so many options
here for electric height adjustable desks and everyone has them, from banks to
car dealerships. I would never work somewhere that didn't offer this, I even
got one for my home office: <http://imgur.com/A1eS2>. Set me back about a
thousand dollars, about what I spent on a cell phone every other few months.

Mine is from <http://www.conset.dk> (Danish) by the way. Huge selection of
frames (one, two or more columns) and you specify your tabletop yourself
(size, position and dimensions of the cut-in, bezel, finishing
(oak/maple/cherry)), all online.

------
saturdaysaint
It's too bad that kneeling chairs are often unmentioned in these discussions -
they offer the main benefit of the standing desk (a natural/healthy position
for the spine) with much less cost (< $100), set-up and foot/joint strain.

You can see a variety of these with a simple Google image search. Your legs
just rest comfortably underneath your body, so you don't strain your back
trying to counterbalance your leg (the main problem with chairs). I have a
cheapo office chair and a $75 kneeling chair that I switch between (basically
just when I feel any twinge of discomfort). After getting used to this setup,
I don't really have any back pain.

~~~
fceccon
I agree, I bought a Varier Balans five months ago and it improved my posture a
lot and I don't have back pain anymore. The first weeks I had some knee pain
though, now I try to remember to stretch the legs every half an hour.

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bajsejohannes
Reading this reminds of pg's article about how PR works:
<http://www.paulgraham.com/submarine.html>

It reads as an ad as much as a newspaper article.

~~~
biot
Before clicking through, based on the title alone I was fully expecting a
quote from a manufacturer on how they're selling desks like hotcakes, but
didn't see any desk brands mentioned which surprised me.

~~~
markmccraw
If it's actually a PR plant, being in the top results (or ad I suppose) in
Google for related queries might be enough. Unlike the suits example from the
essay, people looking for standing desks probably aren't going to go to a
local store and instead will use the Internet to look up brands/models and
where to buy. Sure, you are sharing with your competitor, but if it's the
difference between the story getting published or not it would still be worth
it.

------
raldi
I recently got a standing desk and quite enjoy it. They are definitely viral;
once a few people get them in an office, everybody wants one.

I even wrote a set of Perl scripts to keep track of how much time I spend
sitting vs. standing, and how it changes over time.

The only problem is that I don't know of any good studies on what stand / sit
ratio is medically recommended. Too low and you get back and other muscle
problems; too high and you get joint problems.

~~~
astral303
You shouldn't be getting joint problems standing around all day. If you are
getting something like that, these issues might be arising from fatiguing of
the muscles from having to support yourself standing all day. When your
muscles are fatigued, you end up supporting yourself less with the muscle and
more with the joint, so you get weird "wear" patterns, things misaligned
slightly. For example, the front of the thigh pulls more on the thigh bone
than the rear of the thigh. That can cause kneecap soreness (patellofemoral
tracking gets all whack). Muscles in your core can fatigue, and they are also
essential to maintaining correct posture.

The fix in that situation would be to work on basic leg and core strength. A
set of ankle weights, straight leg raises, side leg raises, calf raises, some
basic "good all around" core exercises (forget the crunches, think plank) can
really help you avoid joint-related issues from standing all day.

~~~
raldi
I'm not feeling joint problems _now_ ; I'm concerned about ones later in life.

See also: [http://healthland.time.com/2011/04/13/the-dangers-of-
sitting...](http://healthland.time.com/2011/04/13/the-dangers-of-sitting-at-
work%E2%80%94and-standing/#ixzz1O43u6dzd)

~~~
DanielRibeiro
From a article from two years ago, when this rage wasn't at its peak:
<http://www.hazards.org/standing/index.htm>

------
stephenjudkins
I've been loving my adjustable desk. I spent the majority of my time standing,
but sometimes it's great to sit down.

I purchased a (relatively) inexpensive hand-cranked base from
<http://www.kitchensource.com/table-bases/gb-1000-1001.htm>. I also got a
cheap ($30) 48" x 24" x 2" wooden tabletop which I was able to sand, finish,
and easily mount to the base. I added a desk-mounted monitor arm
(<http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001IWOBGI>). The price for all of this
compares extremely favorably to most other adjustable desks I've found.

This setup has been a huge help for my back issues. If I were to try to
quantify the cost of having a sore back that renders me unable to be active,
it'd be vastly higher than what I payed for this setup. If I am offered a
position where I need to go into an office, I would make offering me a similar
setup a precondition of me accepting the offer.

------
redsymbol
I found an easy way to try this out a couple of weeks ago: five cinder blocks.
Stacked three high to hold the monitor, and two high to hold the keyboard.
Their mass forms a very solid support, yet it's light enough to use on almost
any desk.

I needed to find a separate small stand for the optical mouse too, and I do
sometimes wish I had a little more surface area at keyboard height. Still,
it's cheaper and easier to install than a dedicated standing desk... and very
easy to "uninstall" if you change your mind.

If you try this, be sure to put a piece of cloth or paper underneath the
blocks, so that they don't scratch the desk surface. You also will probably
want to get something decorative to cover the blocks; molded concrete isn't
the most attractive office decor :)

~~~
slackerIII
Reams of copier paper are also great for propping up your monitor. No
scratching and easy to find in a lot of offices.

------
lowglow
They're called workbenches and have been around for years.

~~~
rjd
Yeah I picked a nice cartography desk setup for $1 each a few years ago.
People where just ditching them.

I had one set up for standing, and a second set low for computer (so my rising
chair could be used).

Following all the rage around these I might look at grabbing a tall saddle
stool and adjust the computer desk unto standing height as well.

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marknutter
Funny, I went as far as the credit card entry form of
<http://www.geekdesk.com> today but stopped short of sending the order. I
looked for cheaper alternatives, and found <http://www.ergodesktop.com>, which
is still pretty damn spendy.

What I want is a solution that's easy to setup, and is _portable_. I work at a
variety of locations and would like some mechanism for turning any surface
into a standing workstation. I think I may whip up a few prototypes in my
spare time.

~~~
sreitshamer
I made 2 boxes out of plywood and put my desk on them. It was free (I had the
scrap plywood). And it wasn't quite high enough (lower back pain) so I added
1x4s until it was high enough.

Pretty portable too I guess. You'd need someone to help you lift the desk
on/off the blocks.

~~~
marknutter
Ha. I'm talking portable as in airplane portable.

------
jwwest
Standing desks seem to be the new fad. I don't believe that sitting for 10+
hours a day is healthy, but I don't believe that standing that long is healthy
either.

The bigger problem lie in what motivates us to spend so long at our desks
without breaks. I think there's a culture of "strap the developer to his
chair" that we need to break out of.

If you're taking breaks every 2 to 3 hours to stand up, get a drink and walk
around a while, I can't really see it being as bad as everyone's making it out
to be.

~~~
subsection1h

      I don't believe that standing that long is healthy either.
    

You're right, which is why many people with standing desks alternate between
sitting and standing. Some use motorized standing desks and others, such as
myself, use tall chairs.

------
zach
When I moved into an empty office last year to work on my startup, I had a
dilemma. I didn't have a desk or chair. At my last couple jobs I had an Aeron
and I knew that a good ergonomic chair is worth the expense. I haven't had
back problems and I like it that way.

I wanted to get a "good" chair like a Leap but, as a cheapskate, I didn't want
to spend the $400 they cost (used of course). So instead, I cut the Gordian
knot and spent the money on the desk instead of the chair. I managed to score
a well-used custom standing desk and barstool-height chair on Craigslist.
Paired with a thin standing mat, it's been awesome and has even helped me
sleep better.

The sore feet at the end of long days went away after a month, I'm always
shifting position and I generally feel like I have more energy. Standing or
perching on a stool both feel better than sitting and you never have that "I
have to get back up? I just sat down!" feeling.

I haven't missed flopping into that desk-chair gravity well, so adjustable
height isn't that exciting. If you think you want to stand, go for it.

------
typicalrunt
I switched to a standing desk a year ago and love it. I didn't want to invest
too much into it at first, since I didn't know if I'd like it, so I got the
Fredrik desk from IKEA (~$149).

<http://www.ikea.com/us/en/catalog/products/60141484>

I'm just over 6' tall and it work perfectly for me. The only detraction is
that you cannot adjust the height after you build the desk (unless you take it
apart again).

------
shriphani
I wanted to get a standing desk. Does anyone have experience with one of those
desks in hospitals that are used to serve meals to patients ? That would be a
solid piece of furniture for me.

Edit : I mean something like this : [http://www.amazon.com/Invacare-Over-Bed-
Table/dp/B000QA0EHI/...](http://www.amazon.com/Invacare-Over-Bed-
Table/dp/B000QA0EHI/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1314912099&sr=8-1)

~~~
michaels0620
While not flimsy, they do not need much pressure to deform and flex. If you
type heavily the table may bounce a bit. Not much, but enough to be
distracting. Keeping your laptop closer to the side with support might help.

------
wyclif
I am interested in starting a company that builds and sells standing desks.
I'm a technical guy, but ideally I'm looking for a partner who knows far more
than I do about marketing, manufacturing, and supply-chain logistics. My goal
is to do it lean startup-style, and develop an MVP first. My email is in my
profile, or reply in this thread.

What do you want from a standing desk? What would get you to buy a standing
desk?

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rwmj
My treadmill desk:

[https://rwmj.wordpress.com/2010/01/25/treadmill-desk-
part-6-...](https://rwmj.wordpress.com/2010/01/25/treadmill-desk-
part-6-hopefully-the-final-summary/)

Yes I'm still using it, about 1 year after making it. I moved it to a
different part of the house so I can look out of the window though :-)

------
imperialWicket
For the viral popularity of stand up desks, the available products leave much
to be desired. The general consensus in the comments is that a few of the
offerings are great, but quite expensive for what they offer.

I recently joined the crew of diy stand-up deskers with this:
[https://plus.google.com/105852617539894761688/posts/F4sN8nUd...](https://plus.google.com/105852617539894761688/posts/F4sN8nUdQMK)

By my specs you get shelves/desktop 48" wide, where you have one 28" deep
desktop, one 24" deep large shelf, one 14" deep display shelf, and two 12"
deep accessory shelves. It's pretty modular, so you can configure however you
like. It is nowhere near as adjustable as something like the geekdesk, but for
about $300 you could build two...

~~~
michaelbuckbee
That looks pretty cool. What's on the adjustable arm to the left of the desk?
Mic?

~~~
imperialWicket
Thanks, it definitely meets my needs. The arm is a halogen lamp.

I forgot to mention the build supports desk heights from 30" to 52".

------
CoffeeDregs
I'm a fan of using standing desks and wanted to figure out how to convert my
home desk [which had 4x4" wooden legs] to a standing desk. I did so by:
getting 4 12" 4x4s; nailing beam caps
(<http://www.strongtie.com/products/connectors/BC.asp>) onto one end of the
4x4s; lifting the desk while my wife slipped the 12" 4x4s under the desk legs.
$30 and 15 minutes work -> nice wooden desk -> standing desk.

* Note: I didn't attach the beam connectors to the desk legs since my desk is lodged in a corner and I didn't want to mess with the legs, but I'd recommend attaching them...

------
sodiumphosphate
I work in my bedroom with a notebook computer. It took no convincing for me to
throw out the desk and chair, because I was so weary of sitting all day.

My solution is simple. I slapped a desk top onto my chest of drawers, with a
nonslip mat underneath to keep it from sliding. Pardon me for not running to
grab the measuring tape, but it's at about my elbow height (I'm 6'2").

I stand at it most of the day, and when I get tired I just unplug everything
and move to my bed for awhile. I can't take my external display to bed, but so
far that's never really bothered me.

I think later on I may get crazy with some square steel tubing, and build
myself a standing monstrosity.

------
deweller
I switched to a standing desk 3 months ago. It has been a great thing for me.

My thoughts to those who want to try it:

\+ Give it time. The first 3 days were hard. After a week, it started to feel
normal.

\+ Get some padding. I'm using a cheap Yoga mat. I've heard gel mats are
ideal.

\+ Suck in that gut. If you practice keeping your lower stomach muscles tight
when you start. This will help your back muscles learn to be straight.

\+ Put both feet on the ground. Leaning on one leg isn't good.

\+ Move around. Sway from side to side. Pick your feet up regularly. This
helps keep your body and legs healthy.

~~~
evro
I found an old half medicine ball (not sure what it's called) laying around my
parents house and I stand on it at my desk. It felt weird at first but I'm
used to it now and it seems to keep my muscles working.I'm not sure exactly
what it'll do to me in the long run though.

------
mbh
I think the most ideal would be a desk which can be moved up or down via a
mechanical handle bar. I have seen them in practice. That way if you get too
tired you can lower it and sit.

~~~
technomancy
I just have a recliner next to my standing desk.

~~~
zacharycohn
Same here. I tend to cycle between my homemade standing desk (a chest with two
amazon fresh boxes on it), my 70s style recliner chair, and a couch.

------
measure2xcut1x
I used a standing desk with eye level dual monitors on clamp-on arms for 45
days this summer. I felt like a check-in person at an airline. I found it
uncomfortable in my lower legs but I think it was better for my spine and hip
alignment. Since I have gone back to the chair I am more productive.

See occupational hazards of standing at work:
<http://www.hazards.org/standing/index.htm>

------
teaspoon
I decided to prototype a standing desk before buying, to make sure it was
something I'd really use. The prototype is just a cardboard science fair
display on top of an adjustable keyboard stand:

[http://distillery.s3.amazonaws.com/media/2011/06/22/f59c2c49...](http://distillery.s3.amazonaws.com/media/2011/06/22/f59c2c497a0a4d6192392d8dfa13960e_7.jpg)

It actually fits me so well that I haven't bothered to upgrade.

~~~
dmix
That looks like it would be painful on the neck after a couple of hours.

Id recommend getting a monitor and keeping it at eye level.

------
jarin
I'm addicted to the L-shaped IKEA Galant desks, so I just extended the legs
all the way and then put a bunch of my old PHP and Flex books underneath for
extra height. I find it helps significantly to raise the monitor so that the
top edge is at eye level. You definitely need some kind of stool to sit on
occasionally, or it is very tempting to just go back to a sitting desk.

------
hugs
I recently got into building with grid beam. (Found out about it at a Maker
Faire.) Consider grid beam an open source version of Erector Sets or a life-
size Lego Technic. Building your own standing desk out of grid beam would be
the super cool thing to do. Grid beam is a very old idea, but I think it's due
for a comeback. Maybe DIY standing desks is the killer app?

~~~
mathgladiator
Wow, I love the idea; thanks for turning me onto grid beams. I need them!

~~~
hugs
Yeah, grid beam is (alas) a highly underrated tech. I've also created my own
version recently -- a Lego Technic compatible version I'm calling "bitbeam" -
bitbeam.org. Don't know where it'll go, but it sure is fun!

------
tomjen3
I have wanted one for some time, especially with the threadmill attached (I
never get any exercise ever, so it would be a cheap way to get into shape and
properly be my only real chance).

For those of you who already have a standing chair, how often do you use it in
the standing position versus sitting down? How long time does it take to get
use to using a standing chair?

------
beej71
I have a standing desk, and my biggest problem is sore foot soles, of all
things. Fixed with lots of foam padding underfoot.

------
ed209
I tried it for a week and enjoyed it, but I needed to split the time with
sitting too. On the hunt for an electric height adjustable as my current setup
is not practical!
[https://plus.google.com/109940267018696224506/posts/B144cQj7...](https://plus.google.com/109940267018696224506/posts/B144cQj7cBn)

------
mechanical_fish
I see nobody has mentioned the Ergotron Workfit yet. I am very pleased with
mine.

I think the adjustability, allowing you to move from sitting to standing at a
moment's notice, is pretty important. If it weren't for that the various DIY
solutions would be as much as you really need.

------
PakG1
I just purchased some shelving parts from Ikea and made my own. It's supposed
to be a bookshelf, but it works great as a standing desk. I love it. Had to
buy a mat for my feet though. My floor is hardwood, and I was surprised by how
much my feet hurt!

------
rhygar
Varicose Veins are on the rise.

~~~
niels_olson
Doc here. True. However, the societal health care burdens of obesity and
chronic back pain are far higher than varicosities. Personally, I opt for the
standing desk and a bar stool on standby if I want a break.

Occupational standing is probably the number one risk factor for varicosities,
even ahead of gender

<http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21846281>

<http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14531170>

However, the role of prolonged sitting on varicosities (mechanistically
plausible due to such factors as pelvic venous congestion and increased
intraabdominal pressure) is simply unknown.

<http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12934754>

------
robot
Standing for long periods of time negatively affects your blood circulation
and may cause varicosis. Not that sitting eight hours a day is healtier, but
its one hidden risk of standing that you should know.

~~~
xtracto
Yeah, both my mother and my father are biologists who do a lot of laboratory
work. They, along with chemist friend have told me that one typical health
issue in laboratories is circulation problems due to extended standing
periods.

That's why I approached the half and half idea of standing/sitting for my work
:)

------
xxpor
Amazon has had these for a long time. They are just the normal door desk with
longer legs.

They are no frills. Just a door, with 4 (4inx4in?) wooden legs attached. I
loved the look of them when I was there this summer.

------
Hyena
I set up a standing configuration yesterday by putting a side table atop my
desk and it's been great. If I keep liking it, I'll do a more complete
solution that actually costs me money.

------
brendoncrawford
I had a local carpenter build me a custom standing desk for about $300
including supplies. This is IMO the best way to go for the value.

------
prg318
I put my keyboard on top of my iMac and just stand up at work sometimes. Works
just as well. Sitting for so long cannot be healthy.

------
georgieporgie
Here is my ASCII art rendition of my sub $50 standing desk, from the side and
from the front:

    
    
        +--    ----------  <== monitor platform
        |        |    |
      --|        +----+    <== keyboard platform
        |        |    |
        |        +----+    <== cross-brace
      --+--      |    |
    

It consists of 2x4s for the frame and two pine boards for the platforms. The
base legs are 30" long. The uprights on the sides are now 48.5" tall. The
space between the uprights is 36", spanned near the bottom by a 2x4
(originally, I used an Ikea X-brace, but it's a PITA getting it set up without
bonking your head without a solid cross-piece to start with).

The upper monitor/laptop deck is a 48" long, 16" deep, 3/4" thick pine board.
It's wide so that I can fit multiple monitors, though I'm finding that a
single monitor is better for my neck (less twisting). The keyboard platform is
a 36" long, 16" deep, 3/4" thick pine board. These are laminated boards,
consisting of several strips glued together. They're sold shrink-wrapped at
home stores and you can get them paint grade or stain grade.

The keyboard platform is about 44.5" off the ground, and they monitor platform
is about 53.25". I currently have about 9" height difference between the
keyboard and monitor platforms, which works well for the monitor and monitor
stand I'm using (a swinging stand from Monoprice).

The keyboard and monitor platforms are supported by L-brackets made out of
glued-and-screwed 2x4s. I made it a point to support the pine boards for about
3/4" of their depth, so that they don't break under stress.

Here is a crude drawing of the L-brackets which support the monitor and
keyboard platforms:

    
    
        +------+
        | *    |  <== asterisks are drilled holes
        |--+---+
        | *| /    <== 45-degree cut block for extra bracing
        +--+/
    

Currently, the platforms have holes drilled, and put two bolts through each
end to the L-brackets (the bolts screw into threaded inserts which I put into
the L-brackets - Google "threaded wood insert"). Then, the L-brackets are
through-bolted to the uprights.

I built this particular desk so that I can disassemble it. As such, it uses a
series of holes drilled 1" apart in the uprights and the L-brackets. This
allows me to move the platforms up and down. Of course, it turns out that this
is a bit silly, since the holes don't really line up all that well (i.e. get
out the hammer and whack away to get that bolt in), and once I found the
position I like, it's not moving. If I were doing this over again, I would use
several QuickGrip clamps (and maybe a drilled hole + a screw for safety) to
hold everything together while I figure out the geometry, then I would run
just drill the necessary bolt holes at that point.

As it stands right now, the desk is a bit wobbly (the monitor sways very
slightly as I'm typing this). Using the Ikea metal cross-brace will probably
help with that. A simpler solution (which would be important in earthquake-
prone areas, btw) would be a small L-bracket at the back of the monitor stand,
screwed into the wall behind the desk.

~~~
imperialWicket
Great job! I used a similar design, and love it so far.

------
webstermath
Just built my own. Nice to see silicon valley following my example.

