

Facebook Places Will Crush Foursquare - mcknz
http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2368011,00.asp

======
mansilla
While I'm no 4sq/gowalla fanboy, to say that Facebook pwns all location based
checkins, and "that's a wrap" is a bit premature. Facebook also hosts photos
and has made it incredibly easy to upload them, tag them, and share them.
However, it is absolutely no replacement for Flickr. Flickr does it better,
and continually makes it better.

Foursquare and its contemporaries are very clever on how they get users to use
their service. Foursquare has opened up APIs to keep it simple, and their user
actions are already syndicated to the Facebook/Twitter. Foursquare has built
game and reward mechanics that are genuinely engaging.

My newest startup is in the events/activities space. Facebook also has an
events app/module, and it's second rate and barely scratches the surface on
both the consumer and provider end of events. I fully plan on leveraging
Facebook events to compliment my product. It doesn't have me running for the
hills.

This is herd journalism.. the demise of [x] because [Y] has entered the
market.

~~~
travisp
>However, it is absolutely no replacement for Flickr. Flickr does it better,
and continually makes it better.

To an extent, you're correct about this. There are large numbers of people for
whom Facebook is no replacement for Flickr. However, I, and many others have
not posted a picture to Flickr for years (I once had a pro account event),
because posting a picture to Facebook seems to be the easiest way to share it
with everyone I care about.

But yes, calling the end of Foursquare is a bit premature. It does raise
interesting points, however.

------
grellas
_I'm always shocked when people on the witness stand recall with crystal
clarity what happened on a night two years ago. You know some of that is made
up. Facebook Places would certainly take the guesswork out of such things._

The impact of location-based services on the legal system reminds me that the
root meaning of "alibi" (in the Latin) is "elsewhere" (from the broad idea of
"other there," _ibi_ being the Latin word meaning "there").

This to me is a somewhat creepy reminder that modern technology does not
necessarily mean unalloyed progress. With the good comes the bad, and the bad
here is a long-term trend by which people can be traced more and more easily
in where they are and what they do. In the right hands (true friends), this
can be great; in the wrong hands, maybe not so good.

~~~
Gianteye
Well said. I wonder how vulnerable this system would be to griefing.

I can just picture people being as annoying about posting your status at
places your not as tagging you in collages of their favorite ponies.

------
Legion
In February, this same publication declared, "Google's Buzz Puts Facebook,
Twitter On Notice": <http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2359017,00.asp>

I'm detecting a pattern.

~~~
josefresco
The source article's headline is declaring the war already over.

The article (with a tamer headline) you cited is summarized quite well by the
author towards the end with this statement "My gut gives it a 50-50 chance".
Not exactly the same type of statement as the former.

------
alxp
People put up with Twitter and Foursqure updates because you choose whom to
follow. Facebook relationships are reciprocal so I'll get flooded with
Facebook places updates from my aunts going to church even though I'd never
actively choose to follow them on a site like Twitter.

It reminds me of the Achewood blog post where Roast Beef relates a
conversation with Ray where Ray thinks McDonalds starting to sell fancy coffee
will put Starbucks out of business.
[http://rbeef.blogspot.com/2008/01/mcdonalds-vs-starbucks-
vs-...](http://rbeef.blogspot.com/2008/01/mcdonalds-vs-starbucks-vs-ray-vs-
me.html)

~~~
ja27
I'd assume just like Farmville and everything else, with one click you can
hide all Facebook Places updates. You just can't pick and chose who to receive
which updates from. It's either hide the person or hide the app, not 'hide
this app for this person'.

------
wihon
This isn't necessarily the place to bring this up, but I take it I'm not the
only one who finds 4sq and pals a bit creepy?

The 'scary' side of social media has long been a favourite topic in the
mainstream press - and in this case, I think they might have a mild point. I'm
sure that 100% HN users are fully aware of the risks of storing personal info
online, and will act accordingly - but so many more web users honestly don't
have a clue. I've also heard ad agencies and potential employers talking about
tracking 4sq users...and I'm not sure I like that either.

Am I overreacting?

~~~
Shakattack
After reading this, I was a little creeped out:
<http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2010/jul/23/foursquare>

But my general policy with posting online content is if you put it online,
don't be surprised when people find out. I think the ad agencies tracking 4sq
check-ins is key to monetizing location based services, and I'm all for it
because it just makes sense. When/if this happens, 4sq and others will
hopefully be transparent about it, so users know what they're getting into.

But if you don't want people/companies to know where you shop, don't check in.
Simple as that.

------
ivankirigin
The utility of location based services has a strong network effect. For
finding friends, they need to be on the service. For coupons & deals, business
development is far easier with a larger audience.

Interestingly, one way to be ubiquitous is to open up the service as a
platform. That means that it makes sense for Facebook to let Foursquare &
Gowalla use the platform. Those using Foursquare and feeding into Facebook
make Facebook more useful.

It also matters whether location is a way to drive engagement for Facebook, or
if they expect deals to be a major revenue driver. I highly doubt even a large
effort on local deals and coupons would earn significant revenue for Facebook
relative to their astoundingly successful ad system. They aren’t mutually
exclusive of course, in that they can have hooks for their ads to leverage
places. Ignore for a moment that mobile ads are universally horrible and
Facebook doesn’t have any (yet).

This makes me think Foursquare can still grow by being the best place to find
deals. From what I’ve seen, Foursquare’s business development is rock solid.
Also, Foursquare’s mission isn’t about location based checkins but to make
cities more useful. So I think everyone will be just fine.

------
Shakattack
Maybe, but I'm not sold yet. Yeah Facebook has 500 million plus users, so even
if there's a 1% conversion rate they'll have the same or more users than
Foursquare. That's huge, especially because Facebook has a much more diverse
audience than Foursquare.

But...I can't help but think about Buzz. Gmail had those 170 million users.
Sure Twitter was around, but how could Buzz fail when there was this huge
existing audience to use it? But today I don't use Buzz at all, and Twitter
around a dozen times a day.

Facebook Places has potential, but it's way too early to think Foursquare will
be "crushed"

~~~
josefresco
They key difference I think is that Google accounts or gmail accounts were not
used as the hub of social interaction (like Facebook) when Google launched
Buzz. All the hipsters had built these huge networks on Twitter and Facebook
already and now suddenly had to re-assemble a social network from scratch
based on their GMail address.

If history was different and everyone used their Gmail account as their social
identity, things would have been different as Twitter would have just been a
'feeder' service like 4sq/Go are now.

~~~
Shakattack
That's a good point. But I also wouldn't call Facebook my all encompassing
social identity. I don't update my status with everything I tweet; I don't
even sync up Foursquare and Facebook because I don't want everyone on Facebook
knowing where I've checked in (and I don't think I'm alone because 20% of
Foursquare users sync up with Facebook). Many people just find it annoying,
but the bigger reason is that I'm not really that 'close' with all my Facebook
Friends. If I post a check-in to facebook, I'd only want a fraction of the
people to know.

I haven't gotten the rollout yet but hopefully Facebook realizes this and
makes Places something you can use with some of your friends, and not all of
them.

------
arice
Yishan Wong makes some interesting points:

[http://www.quora.com/Are-Foursquare-and-Gowalla-going-to-
sur...](http://www.quora.com/Are-Foursquare-and-Gowalla-going-to-survive-now-
that-Facebook-Places-has-launched)

------
samratjp
This is kinda bad news for Loopt if anything. I was sure facebook would check
out Loopt towards sqrt(4^2) before the competition does.

------
Julie188
Facebook Places doesn't include many places yet
([http://www.networkworld.com/news/2010/081910-facebook-
places...](http://www.networkworld.com/news/2010/081910-facebook-places-
problems.html))

But even if it did ...why would I trust FACEBOOK to be my location app. I
enjoy Facebook, but I don't trust it -- I certainly don't want it tracking my
whereabouts.

------
DanBlake
I think its way more likely that if/when twitter launches a location product
similar to foursquare that /that/ will do them in. Facebook is for a different
type of relationship (at least to me) whereas 4sq/twitter is more selective-
Who do I want to follow. I feel that twitter could completely replace 4sq, as
their is nearly 100% overlap in that space anyways.

------
Tichy
Depends on why people check into places. Is it their daily human need to
publish their location? Or is it that they saw a silly idea and decided to
have some fun playing along. If the latter, why wouldn't they use 4square for
that instead the serious FB?

~~~
mansilla
Checking in, in terms of social interactions, is like a deconstructed form of
interacting. I've been thinking about how we've deconstructed personal
interactions, and how we've arrived at these one-button-click/automated
communiques:

Meeting in person > talking on phone > sending an e-mail > sending an SMS >
posting on someone's wall > creating a general friend-syndicated update >
[<poke>, <like>, <check-in>]

~~~
Tichy
I can't imagine that is sufficient interaction in the long run.

------
chronomex
They said this when Yelp added checkins too. I'll believe it when I see it.

(Foursquare user #657)

