
Ask HN: What should I try to do while still in college? - neodude
I've just finished sophomore year at a good liberal arts university.<p>I have two more years left here; what should I try to do? What should I bias for? What do you, someone who is no longer in college, wish you did, and found most useful during your time there?<p>More about me:
So far, I've spent most of my time learning how to do work, then how to do hard work, and about myself (ADHD, etc). (In fact, I'm procrastinating right now.) I spent most of my childhood doing what I was interested in (lego, then computers), which doesn't develop the skills needed for college.<p>I'm a Computer Science and Mathematics double major, but I'm not sure if I'm clever enough for pure math; I am aceing the CS classes, though. I'm vaguely participating in a startup-like venture, but there is little pressure, and hence little actual startup atmosphere - but still good experience. I've thought many times about dropping out (of college), but I seriously don't have a plan, aside from the vague notion of "going to SF and figuring something out". Besides, it seems like a good idea to get a college degree + the CS/Math sophistication alongside it. Nevertheless, I'm quite bored, by the vapid partying (which I refuse to take part in - decimating my social life), the happy-go-lucky attitude of most people, and lectures + homework in general.<p>My life goals? I want excitement (see ADHD, above). Maybe with computers. The current startup frenzy seems to fit like a glove, but I've only heard about it on the internet.
======
menloparkbum
Go out with as many women as possible. Once you join the startup life the
women will be few and far between.

~~~
wumi
_Nevertheless, I'm quite bored, by the vapid partying (which I refuse to take
part in - decimating my social life)_

Doesn't seem like he may be too interested in this.

~~~
menloparkbum
You don't have to do jell-o shots to go out on dates or have a social life.

~~~
mechanical_fish
Amen. Do not go to the vapid parties, but do go to parties. Learn to throw the
parties yourself if you have to. They don't have to be big at first -- a lot
of the best parties I've known had less than a dozen people.

I assure you that somewhere, somehow, there are groups of non-vapid people on
or near your campus. Find them. Try clubs of all sorts, film societies, drama
clubs (cast or crew!), amateur sports, music groups, anime or SF
conventions... whatever. Just find them.

~~~
krschultz
You don't find girls at parties. Truthfully, you don't WANT to find girls at a
party. Any girl after the first month of freshman year who will hook up with
someone she met at a party - has already done so. The best route is to find an
activity that you like and meet people through that, then you actually have
something in common and a chance to spend time talking sober. That forges real
relationships, which ultimately are a lot better because you have someone to
lean on not just someone to hook up with. But truthfully, having someone is
important and hardly precludes you from being in a successful startup. There
are 20 of us now at my startup and only 1 or 2 are single.

------
wallflower
#1 regret (which I will probably make up, job quitting possibilities) - Not
going abroad - Doesn't necessarily mean studying abroad but traveling for
month+ outside your home country during inter-school summer vacations

~~~
neodude
I come from Hong Kong (luckily not too damaged by deafeningly
unindividualistic culture) - and spent the two years before college in Norway
(<http://www.uwc.org>). Also quite constrained by financial difficulties.

~~~
wallflower
Finances are a limiting constraint.

> My life goals? I want excitement (see ADHD, above).

Interesting article with a twist:
[[http://articles.moneycentral.msn.com/Investing/StockInvestin...](http://articles.moneycentral.msn.com/Investing/StockInvestingTrading/CanYogaHelpMakeYouRich.aspx)]

Re: fear and finances, this presentation from Ignite Portland might alter your
thinking: "Once upon a time, in the midst of war, I went to Afghanistan with
one hundred dollars to my name, a one-way airplane ticket and no promise of a
job." [<http://is.gd/Bvc>]

I would recommend doing what you fear. Growth comes from pushing yourself. As
a contrived example, if talking to beautiful women scares you.. talk to
strangers in controlled situations (art galleries, sporting events). One of
the best ways to meet people is where you have continuity - e.g. you see them
regularly. Some of the most interesting people I know are interesting because
they know people of all interests, vertical groups. Join groups that you have
an interest in but are not already skilled in. True networkers connect people
who might never meet together.

Sometimes a personality test can help you learn more about who you are. People
like to give advice but sometimes don't because it might offend
inadvertently.. perhaps you can talk to someone who is known you for a long
time and ask them for advice? This one linked below is expensive but better
than the Myers-Brigg test. <http://www.kolbe.com>

------
gm
Do EVERYTHING you can that will not be economically feasible (travel for a
month or three) or even possible (spend a summer at Cambridge University in
England). You will live to regret not doign these things when, after you get a
job, you get two measly weeks of vacation per year.

Use it all up: take extra classes, join a club, make a friend from another
race, etc...

~~~
dnaquin
Two weeks _paid_ vacation.

~~~
graywh
Agreed. Don't forget that unpaid leave is often an options.

------
ctkrohn
See what else is out there. Computers might be fascinating, but until you
learn about a bunch of other fields, you will never know if they're what
fascinates you most. Take as many classes as you can in as many areas as
you're interested in, and be sure to take lots of classes outside your major.
Finish more than one major. Join a sports team or club where you'll meet
people you wouldn't otherwise. Save the specialization for your senior thesis,
grad school, or for your job. Try to meet people with a wide variety of
interests, so you can make a truly informed decision between majors and career
paths.

Others may tell you to choose an field of study early on and become an expert.
I definitely admire that goal, but I don't think college is the place. Most
underclassmen have no idea what really interests them; I certainly didn't.

------
tlrobinson
Others have suggested great things to do outside of class, but I have some
related to CS.

Take a compiler course (or several). This really should be required, but
unfortunately it wasn't at my school until after I graduated. Also, lots of
algorithms and other "real" CS courses. Now is the time to learn that stuff.

Avoid the "trendy" courses (Stanford Facebook application class, I'm looking
at you) and go for the hardcore CS stuff. The rest you can easily learn on
your own, but I found having a professor and structured course was invaluable
for the CS topics.

Of course everyone is different, but that's my opinion.

~~~
neodude
I'm trying to, and planning to, take as many hard, hard courses at college as
possible, for precisely that reason. When is the next time in my life when
someone will hold me accountable to learn something really hard? I don't think
it'll happen again.

------
mechanical_fish
Ask around. Find the professors who are the best at teaching Introduction to X
(where X is any field) and take their classes. The teacher is more important
than the subject matter, almost every time.

Useful values of X: statistics, biology (esp. molecular biology), linguistics,
statistics (I mention it twice because it's twice as important), economics,
first-year chemistry, physics. Skip organic chemistry unless you want to be an
M.D.

Keep practicing the essay writing. If you can get good at that, or at least
_comfortable_ with it, it's _better_ than a second major.

Which brings me to my radical suggestion: Drop the double major. Double majors
are a waste of valuable time: You could be taking a sprinkling of intro and
second-year classes in a bunch of different fields -- including at least one
class from every _excellent_ prof on campus -- but instead you're spending
time taking boring classes from bad lecturers just to check off boxes for your
second major, which _will not matter to anyone, ever_. [1]

(My school made me have a minor. I minored in history, which was a nice change
of pace from physics, and was enjoyable, and made me practice all that
writing, and I found an excellent history prof and took three of her classes.
All of which was good. And yet... if I hadn't been forced to take the _fourth_
history class, which was required of all history minors, I could have done the
econ class instead, from the _really good_ econ professor who was recommended
to me. I regret missing that econ class to this day.)

Make a choice: e.g. if you like to program, are leaning toward startups, are
aceing CS classes, and are not feeling "clever enough for pure math", major in
CS -- that's where the marketability is, anyway. Then dump the math major --
just add math classes to taste. Then, add _other_ classes to taste. If, as you
say, you're "quite bored", you need to try something different. Mix it up a
little. Archaeology. Japanese. Music Theory 101. Accounting. _Something_.

[1] There are only two times that double majors make any sense. One is if
you're a premed. Another is if you're so hopelessly fascinated by the classes
in your second field that as a senior you discover that you've accidentally
come within two credits of your second major -- might as well finish it off.

~~~
neodude
Thanks for the advice. It rings very true - lately, I've begun to bias for
good profs, and good profs only. They make everything worthwhile.

Actually, I'm taking intro to islam this summer quarter, from a really good
prof (though some say he's just really arrogant). But the class is extremely
well organized and he really knows his stuff. Should be awesome.

------
izaidi
Get heavily involved in a campus organization that suits your interests. If
such an organization doesn't exist, start one.

~~~
neodude
I'm involved in two things: the newspaper, and this 'programming' group. The
newspaper's been fun - I'm quite interested in the whole gambit of publishing.
The programming group hasn't done anything because no one wants to spend time
in it - I've been programming alone all my life, so it's no different if no
one is doing it with me.

~~~
izaidi
That's good to hear -- I ran a paper in college and it was an awesome
experience. This is such a hugely transformational period in publishing that
knowing the ins and outs of the business makes you aware of how many
opportunities there are right now. My current startup is intended to help
small magazines and campus publications establish an online presence and being
able to draw on personal experience makes me way more confident in its ability
to succeed.

But yeah, I was in a similar boat in terms of the ADHD and not fitting into
the general party culture and everything kind of fell into place when I
started focusing on doing stuff that was actually fun to do and not so much on
stuff I assumed I was supposed to be doing (i.e., my homework).

~~~
neodude
Interesting - it is definitely an awesome time to be in publishing. I redid
(as all freshmen tend to do) the paper's website, which was a huge learning
experience.

A lot of publications seem to have problems getting themselves online -
collegepublisher is the witness. So you seem to be in a viable area.

Most of the misery was from schoolwork, which is improving slowly. The social
side is at a standstill, because I really don't like beer. It's a catch-22
from where I stand. I think I've always _just_ focused on what was
fun/interesting and ignored much else, which you can't do in college, at least
academically. I want the liberal arts anti-focus, but of course didn't realize
it would be this hard.

~~~
culley
Drinking <> Socializing

If you learn nothing else, learn that.

It is perfectly possible to go to a kegger and drink water all night and still
have a good time meeting interesting people and talking to them about
interesting things.

Find those interesting people. Keep looking at different parties until you do.

I still keep in close contact with friends I met at University, and would not
trade that experience for the world.

~~~
mrtron
Exactly.

Do whatever you want, and don't let others stop you. If you enjoy going to
parties - go. Someone deciding to get out of control and funnel a pitcher of
beer doesn't mean you can't be standing 20 feet away having a great
conversation with interesting people.

The same goes with joining a club of any sort. I mildly wish I joined the
entrepreneurship club - but didn't since the majority of people there were all
talk and no action.

That suggests another point - you will likely regret NOT doing things more
than doing things. It is the time to experiment and potentially make some
small mistakes.

------
boucher
If you're planning on a career in programming, I'd recommend trying to get an
internship somewhere before you graduate. If you think you might want to start
a startup, go that route, but it won't hurt to do an internship at a big
company either (it's actually probably better than working at one after you
graduate, but I wouldn't know first hand).

If you want to go the startup route, I'd recommend just sending emails to a
bunch of startups you like. Most of them probably aren't actively seeking
interns, but would be at least intrigued by the opportunity.

------
spencerfry
My biggest regret from college is not getting more involved with the
activities/groups my college offered. I was plenty active around campus
socially, but I was only in one group my entire four years. (Well, two if you
consider being a computer assistant a group.) You will gain a lot and not feel
as if you missed out on what your college has to offer by participating -- not
to mention all the friendships you'll build in the process. Get out there and
join groups!

------
Spyckie
College, after sophomore year, tends to be less about the classes and more
about the people. Choose as many classes as you can solely based on the
professor's character/infamy. Those people will inspire you and help you
choose what is interesting.

Also, try to see as much of the world as possible, and this doesn't just mean
traveling. I'm thinking about people like this person at TED:
<http://www.ted.com/index.php/talks/view/id/233> \- try to find these people
and get connected with what they're doing.

------
Kevin_Johnson
First off, since your a sophomore, your plans will change. Bet money on it.
Don't get caught up in specifics of where you want to be. Instead take
advantage of the powerful abstractions where you can to work out what "axioms
of life" you want to design your life with. That's your homework assignment in
the unwritten curriculum of the university. The vast majority of people fail
that lesson, good folks recognize it and get it partially right, the great
people master this lesson, implement, and refine it for the rest of their
lives.

Always consider your personality. My regret may be exactly what you DON'T want
to do. Having said that... Being a physics students at very good engineering
school, and having participated in student design competitions my only regret
is not having taken more pure mathematics. In science and engineering, if it
works, there's your evidence. You have shown it can happen. Mathematics I
viewed, at the time being so simple minded, as a set of neat tricks for
solving physics problems (or engineering problems, which at the time I thought
of simplistically as merely applied physics problems). The reason I regret not
taking more pure math isn't the theorems or skills I missed getting, it was
the mindset. Every profession and field looks at the world in a particularly
special way. It's a more abstract version of the saying "If all you have is a
hammer, every problem looks like a nail." I'm actually doing research in
graduate school now in mathematics and I'm really glad for it. The perspective
from being a bit physicist, a bit engineer, and now a bit mathematician really
gives one a lot of versatility, and that's where the variety of experience in
the "hard subjects" pays off. You see, everyone who has specialized to be only
one thing, think university professors, are like shaft mines. The specialists
dig deep to get at the really rich seams, but they pass by a lot of pretty
good stuff following the very richest dig through their subject. Take a bit
more breath in your studies and you will see lots of good stuff, and how it's
connected together.

Finally, have fun too. Every day of my undergraduate schooling was a cycle of
learn, work, play, build, fight, drink, sleep, and repeat tomorrow. It's the
best that could have happened in spite of being exhausting, all consuming,
obsessive, and unrelenting. I loved it because to me that is fun.

Best of luck to you.

------
slackerIII
If you want to do the startup thing, notice people who are smart and more
ambitious than you and spend your time hanging around with them.

If you want to have your pick of a quality corporate job and find your
excitement elsewhere, build something tangible you can point to during an
interview. It doesn't have to be complicated, it just has to indicate that you
can accomplish something on your own.

Remember that becoming an expert in anything takes 10 years, so assuming you
are around 20, think about what you would like to be an expert at when you are
30 and start working on it regularly.

Edit: One more thing -- college can be one of the last times in your life when
it is trivial to make new friends. Make as many as you can, and try to hang
onto the good ones after you graduate.

~~~
neodude
I don't think I'd be able to survive corporate. I had a summer job doing IT-
ish things in a small accountancy a couple years ago, at the end of the two
months I was about to kill myself from the boredom and monotony.

That expert advice is valuable - thank you. I'm currently interested in
programming language theory (prompted by steve yegge), we'll see where that
takes me.

I'm trying hard with the friends thing, but there are precious few who don't
"submit" to the partying culture.

~~~
culley
to be blunt...

Pull your head out of your ass.

The world works as a social organization.

You don't have to sacrifice beliefs, but you do have to actually socialize.

And yes, that does mean going to parties and learning how they work just like
you go to class and learn how to do homework.

~~~
neodude
You're right. I'm also depicting the social organization - and my resistance
towards it - in rather polarizing terms. A large part of the problem is
choosing socializing over doing something fun/interesting, which I've learnt,
only a while ago, that you gotta do.

~~~
culley
And your assumption that socializing isn't fun or interesting...

~~~
neodude
Not sure. Probably because I tried a few times and was bored - and just wanted
to get back and do stuff.

But I get your point. Thank you.

------
romainl
Pick up skydiving!

I did during my military service (compulsory between sophomore and junior year
at my engineering school in France), and there's nothing better for your ADHD.
Seriously, it looks very ballsy from outside, but it actually would fit super
well with your craving for learning and discovery - plus it will help solve
the women issue, see comment #1 :-) And it's the best way to meet people as
crazy as you are but completely outside of your usual circles (kind of saved
my life when I moved to MA ;-).

------
sah
Travel while you can do it cheaply. Take as many electives as far outside your
majors as you possibly can without graduating later; college is better at
giving you exposure than skills anyway. Make friends that you want to have
parties with. Meet people who do things you know nothing about; you'll have
fewer chances to do that in the working world.

Drop out if you know you have better things to do with your time, and you can
spend time around a large group of people with varied interests anyway.

~~~
culley
btw - Cheap Travel is just that...

I spent 6 weeks in Scotland for <$1k including airfare.

As a student, you are used to skipping meals, sleeping on couches and sharing
a room in Hostels.

When you get older, those things are all out and everything gets much much
more expensive (my most recent vacation to SF cost me $2k for a week).

~~~
tialys
Can you type up some suggestions/things you did?

~~~
culley
I found a jump on jump off bus tour that took me on a loop of scotland and
allowed me to get on and off the bus as many times as I wanted, and then got
off at every stop for at least a day if not a couple days.

I brought a tent and never used it.

I hacked the hostel sleeping: by being the last one back to the room every
night I never had to worry about the drunk asshole waking me up in the middle
of the night. by finding hostels that allow you access to the rooms during the
day, I took a good 4 hour nap every afternoon when no one was about.

I ate at bakeries for breakfast / lunch. Plus some fruit or cheese. Which you
can carry with you and always have available.

One big meal out at a restaurant every day (or cook a big meal with a group)

Hang out in the lobby in the morning and ask if you can tag along as people
head out. (I spent 4 days in the very very north by just asking if I could
come).

Ask other people what they liked / didn't like about where they've come from.

Hitch hike.

Hike. \- I saw Sea Otters in a small cove while just bush walking for the day.

Visit Museums - REally really creepy stuffed animals in dense quantities.

I spent several days with a chap from Canada. We got 10 - 1 pound coins, and
proceeded to "place a bet" every block all day long while walking around
Aberdeen. We bet on number of women in the next block, number of dogs, color
of doors, etc. No duplicates on the bets and alternate making them up. We even
bet on kids running around a play ground. At the end of the evening the "big
winner" got to buy dinner for both of us at a curry joint.

------
SCVirus
Smoke weed (or do tantric yoga) until you become conscious on a new level
(you'll know when you have, if you have difficulties smoke more stronger weed,
hash, oil, use a vapourizer or take it orally after extracting it with fat
(bake < 300f) or alcohol).

Take mush (of the psilocybin variety) until you understand the nature of the
change in consciousness created by the mary jane.

(you can try mescaline anytime after mush if you so wish, it will likely help
you either understand the changes or find the connection, but would likely be
counterproductive before mush is taken in a significant dose)

Take LSD until you feel an unshakable connection to the universe (start with a
massive dose, theres no time like the first, listen to The Beatles [anything
after Help! is best] and The Doors for assistance 'breaking on through to the
otherside').

Then smoke DMT until you reach 'DMT hyperspace'. (Do not let fire touch the
DMT, only touch the flame to the glass [and even then not /right/ under the
DMT] take big hits you gotta take 3 big hits and hold them in before you
become unable to smoke [mildly difficult]; keep trying.)

At this point you will understand your consciousness in a way science could
never teach you, and you won't have to ask us anything about what you should
do, you will already know.

~~~
Prrometheus
I'm not going to advocate substance abuse, but if you are going to do it then
you might as well do it in college with experienced friends looking out for
you.

That said, I find people have different biological reactions that determine if
they will enjoy a particular chemical experience. If you have no interest in
it or don't enjoy it, then don't worry about it. If you do have an interest in
it, then do it responsibly.

~~~
SCVirus
Psychedelics are counter-addictive. They are only abused by those who have
severe problems with generally 'abusing' anything that makes them feel good
(and psychedelics don't 'make you feel good', they simply remove the mental
barriers allowing you to feel that way if you so choose). All substances
mentioned with the exception of LSD exist in nature, DMT is produced in the
human brain and is responsible for near death experiences, and possibly dreams
(and is the most powerful psychedelic listed; claims that psychedelia is
unnatural are unfounded). LSD is highly similar to LSA (which occurs
naturally). There are not issues with 'biological reactions' with these
substances, except issues that cause mush to be far more potent on some
individuals (start with a .25 gram dose [will do basically nothing in 99% of
people, but will let you know if you are hypersensitive]). The only long term
'issues' people develop from long term psychedelic use, are creations of their
own minds. When mental barriers are broken down, when you /truely/ have
control of your mind-- its just like having root access, do something wrong
and you might fuck something up. Do whats natural, nothing you see, think or
feel on psychedelics is anything but natural.

~~~
Prrometheus
I've heard of people having issues with DMT and LSD, of the four you
mentioned, though they might have been dosage issues.

Weed is the only one of the four you mentioned that I would have no trouble
with doing if it were presented to me, and DMT is the only one that I would
definitely not do without more research.

~~~
SCVirus
And yet you do DMT everytime you sleep (most likely), and certainly it is
released during near death experiences. Unlike all of the other substances
mentioned it is is produced by the human brain, and is the cause of many
natural brain states.

(I do not, of course, recommend anyone go out and try DMT without first
experiencing other psychedelics in the order given, or in fact without doing
the research.)

I highly recommend you do that research.

<http://erowid.org/>

<http://wikipedia.org/>

Psychedelic use is not to be taken lightly. It is not a form of recreation
(shouldn't be), it is a method of deep introspection, of breaking down mental
barriers, a journey within yourself (among other things which really cannot be
explained until you have reached the state of understanding that usually
occurs with mush or mescaline use. This too is not an absolute, but is common
to most peoples 'route' in this journey.)

Use of entheogens is, of course, not the only route to these states, tantric
yoga can perform the same function as cannabis, and years (or decades) of deep
meditation can take replace the use of mush, LSD and DMT.

------
ucdaz
College was the best years of my life. Here are my guidelines.

1\. Learn as much as you can from class and people.

2\. Build authentic relationships. A lot college friendships usually last a
lifetime.

3\. Follow your passion. Studying a subject you enjoy learning, and don't
force yourself to learn something you don't like for the sake of making more
money.

4\. It's always good to take a break once in awhile.

5\. Don't take college for granted and cherish your friends. When college is
over, you're going to miss it.

------
Ravenlock
Do as much extracurricular stuff as you can manage with as much time as you
can give it, in whatever interests you. I was also a CS major, and my free
time went to theatre. I actually ended up with two degrees, the second one
being theatre, so I guess for me it was a little more than extracurricular,
but the point stands. Now that I'm out of college and have a wife and job, I
find it infinitely more difficult to find time to do any acting/directing/etc,
and it's something I really miss and I'm very glad I did it in college while I
had the chance.

Might not be theatre for you, obviously. Might be music, might be hiking,
might be journalism, might be Ultimate Frisbee playing, whatever. Find
something that isn't related to what you'll end up doing 9-to-5 after you get
out, and explore that thing.

EDIT: slackerIII's point about making new friends is also spot-on. Luckily,
extra-curriculars can make that easier so the two tips go hand-in-hand. ;) The
social atmosphere of college is completely unique (at least in American
society; I realize you may or may not be US-ian), so open yourself up to it
and take advantage.

~~~
neodude
Not intending to get a job or get married (is the former actually feasible?),
but will keep your advice in mind. I'm trying to get out hiking and climbing
(I'm in the northeast), but (this) college is so much work.

~~~
Ravenlock
Is getting a job feasible? With a CS degree? Yes, it can be done. ;) What were
you planning on doing after college other than getting a job?

~~~
neodude
No, I meant the other way round - is it feasible not to get a job out of
college? I was thinking the startup route, but again, that idea is still the
vague-move-to-Valley plan.

~~~
Ravenlock
Ah, okay. In that case, I have no idea. ;) Based on the number of startups in
existence, I would guess that yes, it's probably feasible, but I didn't go
that route so I won't have anything useful to say about it.

------
pjuska01
Take your best idea and RUN WITH IT! Don't quit college - the degree DOES
matter; But use that free time and run all aspects of your "startup" business
- create it, deploy it, market it, refine it. You can do that AND keep your
classwork up. Once you're out in the post-grad world, the pressure is on - so
take advantage of it NOW and see those ideas come to life!!

Go on an info-diet, CREATE, don't CONSUME.

------
saundby
Start doing some part-time businesses now. Get with classmates, especially
classmates outside your major, put together something quick and dirty and see
if you can make a few bucks. You'll learn what you need to complement your
skills & personality and get some experience balancing different parts of your
life, going through the whole business start-deliver-grow-falter-fail cycle.
Invaluable experience and killer resume/interview material.

For social groups, find groups _outside_ of college. You'll be able to connect
with people at all stages of life, and you won't be an outsider the day you
graduate. Find something with a worldwide presence, whether it's the group or
just the activity itself. I did medieval re-enactment, I connected with not
only other medievalists worldwide, but all historical enthusiasts. Travel?
Free room and board and often transport from the more established co-
enthusiasts. Instant networking, too--jobs, advice, backing, prospects, you
name it.

------
logic_fiend
I'm currently in my last year of computer science. This will be my second
degree, the first being a B.A. in Philosophy. I definitely think that your on
the right track with the comp.sci./math double major. However, like you, I
find the comp.sci courses easy and, for the most part, really uninteresting.
Not that the info. isn't useful, it has mostly to do with having to sit
through lectures where the professors have been teaching the same courses for
years now and are utterly bored with the material as well. Unfortunately, a
degree seems to be the main currency with employers, despite the fact I don't
think that a comp.sci. degree adequately prepares you for becoming a competent
programmer.

Ultimately, I would recommend sticking with your program but pursuing your own
programming and mathematical interests on the side (if you have time) in order
to sustain and augment your enthusiasm for your future profession.

Best of luck.

------
keefe
For one thing, don't be too quick to underestimate the value of socialization.
You don't have to be a vapid partier just looking to hook up, but making
social mistakes is much less costly in college than it is in the business
world. Find some groups that interest you, and there are probably girls there
that share that interest - it's much harder when you're out.

Is there some programming project you're passionate about? In college, it was
horse racing and poker for me. Always trying to make a quick buck, I know.
Anyway, the only real way to learn about writing code is to do it. Your first
project will probably fail, so don't sweat it.

If you like this craze, pick an easy language and write a web application. You
can get a VPS running for $20-$50 a month, and you could install SVN on there
as well. Anyway, have fun and observe yourself - and make sure to study your
algorithms!

------
Prrometheus
Participate in the COMAP Mathematical Contest in Modeling. It was the 4 best
days of my undergraduate career. I did problem B in 2005, here's a link to the
problem set:

[http://www.comap.com/undergraduate/contests/mcm/contests/200...](http://www.comap.com/undergraduate/contests/mcm/contests/2005/problems/)

------
tialys
Wow... you sound just like me. I have the same issues with working, and the
same desire to work in startups or similar. Honestly, I think it helps a lot
to know that I'm not alone.

I actually just got this account as I only discovered this site a few days ago
(and I love it!) so I don't know if there is an easy way to get in contact
with you, but I think it would be interesting to get your name and maybe an
AIM screen name or the like.

My advice? Make friends, and do whatever whenever while you can. Also, I have
an internship in a big business now, and I hate it. It's boring, slow and
totally uninteresting. Still, I'm glad I did it. It's something worth
experiencing and it's given me new motivation to get good at something and
start a business. Find out what you want, and don't stop until you get it --
even if you hate it, the experience is good.

------
natch
Male bonding activities are never wasted time. Seriously. Even something as
small as going along on a beer run, might get you a position on a board twenty
years from now, or a great job in an amazing place, or, by far the most
valuable of all possibilities, crash space on a sofa in San Francisco.

------
dkokelley
I'm in the same boat you are, my friend. I'm taking two classes over the
summer to start my Jr. year on time.While I can't give you advice from
historical experience, I can tell you what I'm doing.

Right now I'm using this time to save up some money. I know that I ultimately
want to start a company, but I don't know what type (startup, lifestyle) or
even in what industry. I do know that I like technology, but I don't think
that I would be able to use my skills to compete in that industry, though I
may be able to use my knowledge there to give myself an advantage somewhere
else. Right now I'm doing what I can to see what my interests are, so that I
have a plan after college.

I see college as two things: A way to meet people and build my network, and a
plan B should the "own my own business" plans fall through.

------
webwright
Be careful avoiding things that other people enjoy because you think they are
vapid. Try to enjoy them instead.

Travel a LOT-- long trips (3-4 weeks per trip if you can swing it). It's very
hard to pull this off after college for most people.

I'll echo the "meet women" sentiment. For some, it can be hard to meet women
after collenge-- especially if you get a job at a startup (most people meet
women at jobs and women are notoriously absent from startups).

Career-wise, if you want to do a startup someday... Either find a cool startup
that you can work at (be picky) or build something that you'd really love to
have yourself but no one has made yet.

------
thomasswift
take art 101 or design 101 or calligraphy 101, something that forces you to
learn the basics of design and composition.

~~~
ovi256
Wish I could upmod you more than once. Having an artistic (in the proper, good
sense) sensibility and simply good taste will improve your designs
tremendously.

You see, one clever fellow named Steve Jobs did exactly that. He took a
calligraphy class that turned him onto design. Later he became pretty well
known for his great products.

On a side note, good taste helps even in the small things or the things you do
not design yourself but simply choose: clothes, business card designs, and so
on.

~~~
thomasswift
thanks, I had some free spaces left when I was pursuing my comp sci degree and
took one composition/design class. It helped me to look at other things
besides just code. I did wish I took some more because it was interesting and
somewhat applicable.

------
alaskamiller
What's your ADHD symptoms like?

I remember a period of my life where I would have to spend hours on a single
page of a book because I wasn't able to retain anything. I should have went to
the doctors about it.

~~~
neodude
Fleeting thoughts, constantly. Spending a lot of time bringing myself back
from mini-tangents inside the brain; in mid-sentence, distracted by
thought/sight/sound/smell and hence lost train of thought (dozens of time a
day).

I seem to do reading fine, but retain very little from the reading, in
comparison with classmates. I've mostly been taking math-y classes (cs, math,
phys). Physics was very difficult. Writing essays is even more difficult -
this is the source of most of my academic troubles.

------
andreyf
I was in a similar boat as you 2 years ago, and I wish I did two (seemingly
contradictory) things different: 1st, go outside of your majors - take some
acting classes, some poetry classes, some philosophy classes. 2nd, understand
your majors - take a couple of hours to research every class your major
offers, and decide which ones sound appealing early on - at Rutgers, I
finished a CS BA without taking a compilers or OS course, which was, in
hindsight pretty clearly, a mistake.

------
auston
I'm 21 myself, so I don't know if I qualify as an advice giver but...If you
want to meet like minded people, you've started in the right place.

With this in mind, depending on what metropolitan area you are in/near there
should be events... like BarCamp [<http://barcamp.org/>] or Refresh
[<http://refreshingcities.org/>].

Traveling is definitely something I recommend as well.

------
PStamatiou
Start a website or blog. It is the single best decision I have done in the
last decade. I have found many interesting people online that are interested
in the same things as me and many interesting people have found me through it.

And yes, go out with as many women as possible too. I made the mistake of
going to an all-male college.. well just about (~30% female at Georgia Tech).

------
vaksel
My advice, is a little different from the rest. All those things are good and
all, but it doesn't hurt to lay the ground work for your future.

I recommend that you start coding your statup now. This is the best time for
it. You have no expenses. You have very few commitments. And you are
surrounded by a lot of other smart ambitious people that you can tap. Clubs,
professors, classes, will make it easy for you to find out who the smart
people are. So if you run into a problem, you can easily find someone to help
you understand it.

And this way the times when your startup grows very slow, you'll have some
other things to play with. Honestly if you don't have an idea now, start
throwing some ideas in your head, pick one and start coding, if you change
your mind along the way, change your product, you have plenty of time to get a
winning combination. And remember, it doesn't need to be rocket science,
Facebook is nothing more than a big database.

But this shouldn't be your only concern, you have to multi-task. Honestly the
startup life is pretty shitty. You work all the time, you lose touch with most
of your friends because you constantly skip going out, and unlike college
where you are surrounded by women of your age, you end up being pretty much a
monk, seeing two-three women your age during the week. So spend that time in
college having fun.

a) start lifting weights. Trust me, it'll do wonders to your social life and
for your self esteem. Honestly if you are afraid of going to the gym, buy a
set of weights at a store and workout at home. I actually prefer that because
you don't spend the extra time of driving to the gym, and can do it whenever
you have free time.(i usually work out when I watch TV since I'm in front of
it anyways)

b) Join some activity clubs. Honestly you sound like you have no idea what fun
things you like. So look at all the clubs at your college and join a bunch and
see what you actually like.

c) if you want excitement there is nothing better than buying a motorcycle.
Start off with a Ninja 250(used). The reason is that its a starter bike(it'll
run you like 2K used, 3K new, they hold their value really well). Granted its
a little dangerous but thats part of the excitement. Then once you get the
basics down, upgrade to a 600cc bike(the most expensive one will run you like
7 grand). And don't upgrade to a 1000cc bike because those are the killers.

d) get laid, Honestly college is probably the easiest time of your life for
that .You are surrounded by women your age and as long as you are even
remotely in shape you'll get a positive answer. If you wear glasses get
contacts. Don't fool yourself into thinking that you'll be knee deep in women
once you graduate. Like I said, w/o going out I see maybe 1-2 attractive women
my age. And if you hate the party scene in college, you'll hate the bar/club
scene when you graduate. You don't want to end up like that guy in the 40 year
old virgin movie. And trust me, if you ride a bike, have a decent physique and
no glasses, in college? You will have NO problem getting women's numbers. All
you have to do is initiate the conversation.

e) take a road trip, just get into your car and head some place 2000 miles
away.

f) obviously there are many other exciting things to do, but I don't know your
money/location situation, so I dunno if you can afford to go sky diving, or if
you live near an ocean so you can learn how to surf/ride a jet ski

~~~
hugh
Anyone can afford to go skydiving once, and it's worth doing.

------
bobochan
N == 1 in my sample but a few random things that I did in college that have
made me happy ever since: meet you future spouse; make lifelong friends; learn
a foreign language; play in a band; act in a play; and find a life long sport
that you enjoy.

------
cousin_it
Everybody's saying run run run, time's running out! I beg to differ. You'll
have time enough for things you don't want to do, later in life. For now, kill
time, relax and don't do stuff you don't want to.

------
mdakin
Try to meet everyone. Remember, keep track of, and develop real relationships
with all of the people you click with.

------
paraschopra
start doing regular blah blah on HN ;)

------
knv
Smoke pot.

