

Help me surprise Catherine - codysan
http://surprisecatherine.com/

======
chasing
If the community puts up $12k for Catherine to attend this program (which, to
echo other sentiments, seems _really_ expensive for a three month iOS
intensive given what's available out there for free, both content and
community)...

If that happens, Catherine should -- after she's graduated and is making a
nice income (which she will be, as an iOS developer) -- pass it along and give
$12k back to help the community somehow. Give it to a program in NYC that's
helping give underprivileged kids access to technology, for example.

That would seem fair to me. It does seem a little weird to beg for donations
so someone who already seems pretty smart and well-connected can further their
career a bit (in an expensive way -- see above) when there are so many ways
$12k can be used to really change someone's life. Or many people's lives.

~~~
balls187
This is love. Not begging.

Catherine isn't asking. Her boyfriend is, and he's doing it without her
knowledge (presumably).

He wants to support his girlfriend and her passion for iOS development, and
he's asking for help from people who might feel some empathy.

I received some scholarships & grants to go to college, I suppose that means
I'm obligated to create my own scholarship fund?

~~~
7Figures2Commas
According to a WSJ article[1] a few days ago about Flatiron's $5.5 million
funding round, "More than 98% of its students get jobs through the Flatiron
School’s placement efforts."

It's hard to criticize someone for asking for help (you have to do what you
have to do), but if the Flatiron School is truly this successful at preparing
attendees for real-world development and helping close to 100% of them find
work after just four months (as opposed to four years), I think it's to be
expected that some folks are going to be less empathetic.

Interestingly, despite Flatiron's $12,000 tuition, the WSJ article says "The
school’s student acceptance rate is less than 8%." That suggests they're not
just accepting anybody who can pay; ostensibly they are filtering for
ability/accomplishment. If this is the case, and the placement figures are
accurate, there's no reason Flatiron (and programs like it) couldn't make
their money on the back-end. Assume that graduates are placed in entry-level
positions paying $80,000 on average. A 20% placement fee would earn Flatiron
$16,000, $4,000 more per student than tuition. If you assume a class size of
30, and a 98% placement rate, you're looking at an _additional_ $116,000 in
revenue per graduating class.

Yes, there's risk with this model, but if these schools are truly capable of
placing nearly all of their students in in-demand development jobs after just
four months, the risk seems modest. After all, when the market turns, the pool
of people willing to pay $12,000 for a four month program is going to dry up
anyway.

[1] [http://blogs.wsj.com/venturecapital/2014/04/09/flatiron-
scho...](http://blogs.wsj.com/venturecapital/2014/04/09/flatiron-school-
raises-5-5m-to-teach-tech-skills-place-graduates-in-jobs/)

~~~
balls187
Ponying up $12k shows some amount of initiative, as does applying, and
sticking through the course.

I know we're getting off-topic here--

Generally, I'm all for having more people who are qualified to write code, but
I'm opposed to For-Profit Education systems as I believe incentives aren't
aligned.

Right now, Flatiron needs to establish itself as credible, and worthy of your
tuition and time, by separating itself from the other would-be "L2Code
Schools." So it's in their best interest to be highly selective.

But what happens when they hit critical mass? The risk of turning out like the
Art Institute, where they no longer care about the quality of applicants, and
are instead focused on revenues.

------
unicornporn
I don't think putting up a .com and making it to the front page of Hacker News
will make this much of a surprise.

Open source projects need money (hello OpenSSL) and children are dying. Paying
for someone's Objective-C/Xcode tuition isn't my number-one priority at this
time. Perhaps someone else will swallow the bait.

~~~
balls187
And just how much have you donated to Save the Children & open source?

~~~
tdsamardzhiev
5-numbers. And yes, this e-beg cr*p shouldn't be on HN.

------
andymoe
Wow. Best of luck to both of your but I have to say a dev boot camp for iOS is
the last thing I would ever consider spending 12k on even when I was just
learning Objective-C.

Now blowing 12k on a trip overseas together after a 2 year long distance
relationship... that's something that I could get behind.

That said, please please make sure the class sizes are very small and the
instructor ratio is like 1:5 max. You will be paying a premium and if they put
you in with 30 other people or even 15 (60k/month for them btw) you are just
getting ripped off.

For 12k you could hire an experienced iOS dev to teach you this stuff in a
couple hours a week. Even if Catherine paid 125/hr (and I bet someone would do
it for less for the hell of it) that's still almost 100 hours of 1:1 time.
Just food for thought. I'll donate anyway in hopes you take a nice vacation :)

PS. My friends website of as many tech schools as he could find says the rails
program @ Flatiron has 32 people to a course -
[http://schools.techendo.co](http://schools.techendo.co)

~~~
dpweb
32 x $12k. 4 months. Medicine? No, iOS programming. Note to self: Start Tech
school.

------
sarreph
Have you exhausted all possible scholarship options? Try a curveball approach
at The Flaitron (I'm sure you may have already, though) and anywhere else
where educational funding may be available.

I didn't think I'd be able to make it to a WWDC scholarship from the UK until
I went past the usual funding bureaucracy at my university and went directly
to the head of dpt who was kind enough to authorise a bursary for me.

I don't think money should ever hold people back people skilled and
intelligent enough from the educational resources and creative outlets they
can use to the full to prosper.

It's one of the tragedies of our time.

I wish you all the best!

~~~
codysan
She has been emailing Adam, the president of The Flatiron School about it.
There is a $750 discount off the tuition, which she would qualify for, as well
as a payment plan where 50% of the tuition is due up front, with the remaining
50% due over 6 months after graduating. I'm not sure if she is 100% eligible
for that, but that would certainly make things much easier.

I agree that it is sad that money is what holds people back. It's a cruel
system that I can't wait to see ripped to shreds by new & easier access to
education.

I appreciate the kind words! :)

~~~
notajuggalo
Easier access to education? $12k for 3 months is not easier access to
education. That's just silly.

Start with Paul Hegarty's iOS class on iTunes U, it's free and it's terrific.
Do all the assignments (if you get stuck you can find other people who have
done them and see what they did but I really recommend doing it yourself.)
Sign up for NSScreencast.com and watch 1 or 2 a day, taking notes. Go read as
much Ray Wenderlich stuff as you can that's not dated (some of the stuff on
his site's kinda old, but no matter.) Then build an app and put it in the app
store, it can be lame but you have built so many practice ones it's good to
actually get something in the App Store. Go read some stuff at objc.io, some
stack overflow, whatever.

You are now an entry-level iOS developer. I just saved you $12,000 and you
don't have to beg strangers on the internet for donations. Seriously, $12,000?
I guess it's true: the best way to get rich in a gold rush/bubble is selling
pickaxes. There are enough great resources out there that you are silly if you
do this.

~~~
codysan
I was saying how $12k for the education is NOT easy.

Thank you for the tips. I will certainly pass them on (as well as read up
myself!).

I mentioned this in a reply to you a little lower, but I'm not trying to beg
here; I am offering design services, and she is selling hand-sewn stuff on
Etsy.

~~~
smallfluffycat
come on, you and I know you want people to click on donation button

------
notajuggalo
If it's a good investment in her career she should just go get a loan.
Alternatively, if she has a passion for programming and the skills you say she
does she can take 12 weeks of her own time and learn to be an entry-level iOS
developer for a lot less than $12k.

Begging is unseemly, and the whole "you can be a programmer in 3 months just
give me $12k" thing is also kind of uncool.

~~~
karmajunkie
I don't think you read the page clearly. She's already a programmer; she's
trying to accelerate her learning process. Which frankly is worth the $12k,
but getting an uncollateralized loan for that kind of thing can be difficult.

~~~
piratebroadcast
Fuck the haters. Keep it up! You should use twitter to reach out to writers at
Mashable, Fast Company, etc and tell them this story. This story has feel-good
written all over it.

~~~
codysan
Thank you! I'm gonna try and reach out to some tech bloggers and see what
happens. Official accounts of Mashable, Fast Company, etc seem to just tweet
their articles, with no @replies ever.

------
noonespecial
I really hate when people ask for help or advice achieving a certain goal and
what they get in response is a bunch of yap about how they shouldn't want to
do that in the first place.

But I dislike stuff like "The Flatiron School" even more so. I want to help
you and Catherine. I remember too well driving junk-yard cars for days
straight only to spend a few hours with my long-distance _[1]_ because plane
tickets were impossibly out of reach. The others are right though: I'd sooner
donate to send you guys on a cruise than essentially give money to the
"Flatiron" folks.

I know that seems entirely unhelpful. Sorry.

 _[1] I did marry her in the end and that sweet suffering has become part of
our collective mythology, now imparted to our own wide-eyed children. Succeed
or fail, you 're doing the awesome part right now._

------
rurabe
She's very lucky to have you.

Have you heard of Hacker School in NY? Not only is it free, I think they offer
$5k grants for female programmers who need living expenses. Generally the
candidates for Hacker School and DBC/Flatiron don't overlap much, but if she's
a programmer who's just moving to a new language, it might be worth looking in
to.

~~~
codysan
She applied to Hacker School back in December, but unfortunately she was not
accepted. I didn't know about that $5k grant though, that is pretty amazing!

~~~
eshyong
Did she try reapplying? They're accepting Summer applicants right now.

------
muyuu
Woha $12000 for a semester? things are getting out of hand...

------
caycep
A couple of thoughts:

1) What is the educational value of a course at Flatiron School - is there any
accreditation? 2) What are the other options: graduate program at good program
(Stanford, UW Seattle, Berkeley, or if NYC, why not check out the NYU digital
arts program or the new Cornell initiative that Bloomberg has been touting)?
Internship or entry level job into Google or another organization that has
good mentorship? Granted, these may be even harder to get into, since
competition is w/ CS majors from stanford/mit...

Just my thoughts musing out loud, not actually in the CS field, but it's
interesting to ask - what's a good steppingstone for a young person just out
of college into a CS-related job?

------
romanovcode
If I give her money will she give me returns as profit with 20%+ of my sum
after she graduates and starts making 100k?

~~~
LogicX
You just described [https://www.upstart.com/](https://www.upstart.com/) which
is something she could consider.

------
CesareBorgia
Disclaimer: I help run App Academy

You may want to look into our program
([http://appacademy.io](http://appacademy.io)). Students only pay us if they
find jobs as developers after the program. In that case, the fee is 18% of
your first year salary, payable over the first 6 months after you start
working.

It's web focused, not iOS focused, but we do have a strong emphasis on
fundamentals, and grads have often picked up iOS on the job within a few
months.

------
steele
If you like it, promote it; if you don't, just flag it. (I flagged it because
this isn't content or discussion)

------
jonathanjaeger
How is this begging? You don't have to donate, you can hire him as a designer.
And he's offering a discount. If you A) need a designer B) want to help him
and his girlfriend out, that's an added bonus.

People "donate" on Kickstarter when they pledge money to a project without
pledging enough for a full reward, but we don't consider that begging. It's
patronage. Not everything has to be black and white where if you give $5 here
that means you're a bad person because there's someone less fortunate out
there who could have used the money. If you think it's not worth it, then
donate elsewhere.

------
microjesus
This culture of begging is really starting to get to me. I'm all for helping
non-profits, and those that cannot help themselves. Student loans if it's that
important, guy.

------
piratebroadcast
I used Upstart.com to fund thoughtbots Rails program. I highly suggest looking
in to that. Also, youre an awesome boyfriend. Good luck, dude. Wife that girl
up.

~~~
codysan
Woah, looking into that now. Thanks!

And I'm just playing catch-up for all the things she's done with me.

(and I'm working on that wifing thing)

~~~
smoyer
I'm a big fan of wifing the right person when you find them but ... your
implication is that you live your lives in ways designed to make each other
fulfilled and happy. __Never stop doing that. __It 's that important. Good
luck from a happily married man (almost 27 years). Now I need to deliver tea
in bed.

------
warmwaffles
Mind sharing some of her works? I'd like to see what she's done before
considering donating.

------
wayanon
Hi Cody - good luck with the fundraising. Wouldn't it be ironic if you and
Catherine ended up developing a site/app to help thousands of others worldwide
to fund their college courses?

Kickstarter for education - perhaps it exists already?....

~~~
morgante
upstart.com and pave.com are similar in concept to that.

------
Rakathos
Just bought a makeup bag from her Etsy shop that my girlfriend is sure to
love.

Good luck!

~~~
codysan
You are the best!

Funny story: she set up that Etsy a couple days before visiting her family in
Florida, and actually lugged her sewing machine on the plane just so she was
able to take any orders while away. Just to give a glimpse of how great she
is, hah.

------
christiangenco
Unless I've missed a major price crash, Will's 1 BTC donation[1] is worth
substantially more than $43.

1\. [http://imgur.com/zAqhqTk](http://imgur.com/zAqhqTk)

------
dpweb
$12k, 4 months! Wow. Sucks to be in college nowadays.

This guy (along with being boyfriend-of-the-year apparently) has the right
idea.

Ignore these people. Debt === slavery! You are doing the right thing.

(Only #3 of his approach is begging. #1 & #2 are _advertising_ ) People get
really angered at begging lately it seems..

p.s.. I'd say to give back to the "community", just make an app like watsi or
something, and not spend your life's work finding more efficient ways to find
people to f--k within a 10 mile radius..

~~~
f0nd004u
It's not college. It's "hacker school". Lots of these out there advertising
that they'll take you from zero skill to web/mobile developer in 3-4 months.

------
pkfields
I think as a boyfriend that is really sweet. Forget what she should or
shouldn't be studying or where, you are being incredibly supportive.

------
Splendor
> There’s four ways to help

Should be "There are four ways to help".

~~~
codysan
Oops, fixed! Thank you!

------
smallfluffycat
crappy e-begging

