

YC s11 Rejected Applicants: This is the real test. - ericmsimons

I almost didn't get my Eagle Scout rank when I was in Boy Scouts. It wasn't a matter of it being too hard, I just thought it was easier to walk away from all of the years of work I had put into it and do other things. What was the point? It's just a stupid badge, right? Then I ran across an article from Mike Rowe, the creator of the show "Dirty Jobs", new face of Ford, etc. He's an Eagle Scout. When asked what he would say to Scouts about becoming Eagle, he said this:<p>http://meritbadge.org/wiki/images/3/30/Mike_Rowe-Dirty_Jobs_Eagle_Letter.pdf<p>tl;dr Becoming an Eagle Scout is proof that you aren't a quitter. You get shit done and are a relentless pioneer.<p>If this bump in the road rattles you enough to close shop, you shouldn't be an entrepreneur. The most successful entrepreneurs have failed more times than they can count. Each "failure" teaches you something...how to build an unbelievably great company.<p>Want to be a great entrepreneur? Get shit done and be a relentless pioneer. That is the real test of entrepreneurship.<p>PS - I got my Eagle Scout rank.
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follower
> If this bump in the road rattles you enough to close shop, you shouldn't be
> an entrepreneur.

I question the value of telling someone they "shouldn't" be an entrepreneur.
Even that they "aren't" an entrepreneur.

Closing shop doesn't have to be a permanent thing.

Didn't get accepted for this round of YC? Decide what that means for you, then
continue to live your life.

~~~
ericmsimons
If rejection makes you stop building the company that you envision, love, and
put all of your effort behind, then you will never succeed running a startup.
This may be a bold statement, but I'd love to hear what Jobs, Gates, Zuck, or
anyone else with expertise in the area have to say.

~~~
gumbo
I definitely agree with this. If you applied to YC to have your project
validated by @pg and associates. Then you should think twice about your real
motivations. Only close shop when you're sure your idea is not a good one or
that you KNOW that you're not able to achieve it.

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erikpukinskis
I got to the badge below Eagle (Life) basically as fast as it was mechanically
possible to. I'm not sure when exactly, but by 8th grade at the latest. Then
all of my friends dropped out of scouts when we got to high school. I ended up
being Senior Patrol Leader and running the troop for a couple of years, and I
avoided working on an Eagle project for a while... I had time.

Then at some point I decided I'd rather do something that other kids my age
were also doing, so after much hand-wringing I quit Boy Scouts and joined the
theater. I ended up being the lead in the school musical senior year, and I
sung in choirs all through college. I did light opera. I joined a gospel choir
and performed in baptist churches all across the state.

I also developed a deep belief that I could try totally new things that were
outside my comfort zone, and excel at them.

I sometimes wonder whether I should've stayed and gotten the Eagle. Finishing
things is certainly a weakness of mine. Maybe if I had spent those last two
two years of high school hanging around with 13 year olds and building a
bridge in the woods I'd be a better finisher. But I'd be a worse artist. And
I'd be a more cautious person.

This is the second time I got rejected from YCombinator. And quitting is the
furthest thing from my mind. But I'm glad I quit back then.

------
katieben
Girl Scout Gold Award recipient here just got rejected. (: I'm looking for a
cofounder if anyone knows anyone interested in working on a social startup.
I'm more interested in finding passionate people than people with a particular
skillset.

~~~
follower
You might want to look into why the images on pages like
<http://yellowrubberball.com/why-yrb/> on your site hang off the side of the
page in Chrome 10.0.648.204 on OS X.

I noticed it on the home page too.

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devan
Disappointed.

I've got nothing against YC, but I've seemed to go into "success is the best
revenge" mode ha.

To be honest it's a good wake up call, I need to stop treating my start up as
a lifestyle business.

Dropping out of university at the end of this term and i'm pushing forward
with it.

Decisions been made.

~~~
bconway
Have you considered whether you're following a fantasy? Maybe you should seek
advice from someone you trust who doesn't drink the HN/TechCrunch Kool-Aid.
Somehow I doubt you were rejected from YC due to lack of effort.

~~~
devan
I've been working on the idea for a while now, in a nutshell it's a less
bureaucratic version of paypal. I've been seeking advice from a lot of
different sources. To be honest, i think the main reason is the fact that i'm
a sole founder and that I've been doing everything on my own. Which is stupid,
but it isn't easy to find technology entrepreneurs my age in the UK, or ones
who are as committed.

The prototype has been developed, so I'm going to take it to market within the
next few weeks. Then apply to YC again in the winter, with a bit more
grounding and social proof.

It's not really the money I was hoping to receive it's the
support/advice/mentorship, especially on legal matters. Most of the lawyers
i've spoken to don't really have a clue about the SAAS model.

~~~
ericmsimons
Although bconway is trying to look out for your better interests, I'm going to
advise you to go with the route you just mapped out.

Maybe your idea isn't the "one". Maybe you can't pull off running a startup.
Maybe you aren't in the right place at the time.

But I'm betting that the preceding paragraph is all false. And even if I'm
wrong, at least you put your balls on the line and did something you believed
in. The story of your startup will beat an infinite number of drunken frat
stories any day.

Safety Net: You can always head back to college if things get ugly.

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piousbox
Yes and no. I was in freelance photography before switching to programming
(weird, huh?). I thought repeatedly: I can't just give up photography, that'd
make me a pussy. I should aspire to do what I love.

Then I dumped professional photography and became a programmer, and I am
freer, better paid and happier than I would be otherwise. Quitting one thing
let me find another that is better.

I guess, the real difference is that someone (Mike Rowe) tells you want to do:
don't quit, it's better. But if you don't know what's better, then you don't
know if you are quitting the wrong path to pursue a right path, or what.
Decisions you make in absence of a judge are always uncertain. And who has the
authority to judge me?

~~~
ericmsimons
I totally agree regarding trying new things. If something interests you more,
then go and do it. But if you walk away from something just because you got
your ass kicked, that's just lame. Maybe that might lead to something better,
more likely not. I think a hybrid model where you do something that you love
while you keep your options open is a good approach :)

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alexl
I got rejected twice. However, I have a different idea for a startup. Non web
startup, not based on coding. Based on the fact that I never even got a reason
why I was rejected, I thought I'd apply differently this time. Saved my
application in a file and then posted it here:

[http://thypope.posterous.com/my-latest-y-combinator-
applicat...](http://thypope.posterous.com/my-latest-y-combinator-application)

Tried to make them think. I believe they're in a loop of... self-indulgence,
really. Since I think they do their best to stay the $#@! away from taking
risks with any "unorthodox" ideas.

~~~
ericmsimons
I skimmed the first paragraph of your application...

Listen, I hate to be a Debbie Downer, but I wouldn't have invited you to an
interview either (regardless of the BS jargon in the application). Here's why.

1\. You are a single founder.

Doing a startup alone is sooooo hard. The only way they would consider having
a solo founder is if you're a programmer. (see #2)

2\. You're are not a programmer.

It's hard to explain. Being a programmer changes the way you think of ideas.
You know what is possible, what is plausible and where that intersection
between the two is. Your ideas may be fantastic, but I wouldn't be surprised
if they weren't plausible. It's not your fault. You just need to learn how to
code if you want to understand what I'm talking about. On top of that, a
startup CEO typically plays 'engineer' for at least a year or two before
moving up to a lofty management position (but YC looks for hackers - the kind
of guys who never stop checking in code at their companies).

3\. Your attitude sucks.

You got rejected from YC. Shit happens. It's irresponsible and immature to
blame YC because they didn't decide to fund you. Entrepreneurs don't sit and
complain when rejection happens - they work harder to ensure it won't happen
again.

This is not meant to be a mean post against you. You can continue doing your
thing your way, but I will almost guarantee that you will not succeed in
running your startup.

~~~
alexl
I sincerely hope that you did get the point - that was a "kamikaze"
application not meant to get me in, but meant to get them out of their self
righteous loop! You appear to not have read the whole thing. Okay, you didn't
have to, of course. But you completely proved my point: that's what they also
do. This is why I tried my best to get their attention woken up at least for
this one application. Maybe they'll start waking up before reading other
applications in the future, as well! I believe they never got the point that
this is not a programming-centered idea. Not a software startup at all. I want
to make hardware, to put it shortly.

Not meaning to brag, but I applied for another incubator as well, and got to
the last stage. I was dumped there, but they did say I came across as
technically strong and with relevant and solid experience. Among their tests
was a programming test. I sent two e-mails explaining how I'm not a coder but
how I'm not supposed to be one. And they passed me to the next stage.

Again, I think you proved the point I was trying to make with Y Combinator
flawlessly. Not as an offence to you, though.

And yes, I understand that you weren't trying to bash me but to help me
instead. Thanks for that.

~~~
ericmsimons
I get that it was a "kamikaze" application. The fact of the matter is that YC
looks for hackers, which you are not. It doesn't mean you're lesser. It just
means that you shouldn't be surprised when you get rejected from YC.

I don't understand why/what you're protesting. If you want them to look beyond
software startups, that would be very foolish of them as their area of
expertise is software.

~~~
alexl
Well, I don't live in The Valley. Not in the US, actually. I thought it would
be reasonable to assume that people calling themselves investors would look at
anything. Right now it looks like that guy from Mountain View was right: if
the iPhone's popular, everyone's doing something related to the iPhone. Which
is fine, as it's their choice. But it seems that if you utter the word
Blackberry, you get fined or arrested for disturbing public order. And if you
even think of Nokia, Gov. A. Schwarzenegger himself will punch you in the
throat.

Okay, I didn't know that. I will remember it next time I have to deal with
such people. Good to know.

What I think is obviously missing? Simple, Y Combinator's main page displaying
a huge banner that says "we don't care about anything non-software, go away."
It would have warned me right from the start. They never explicitly say it,
they just heavily hint at it (e.g. they ask for your github ID, which you
don't need unless you do some sort of coding) and I'm here to say quit hinting
and just admit it out loud. But I believe that's also typical - what we hint
at, it's actually an axiom. What we recommend, it's actually required. I
believe that's not right. Simple as that. No hard feelings.

~~~
ericmsimons
You're taking what Silicon Valley media reports and slapping it onto the face
of YC. YC's most successful startups are not "iPhone Apps". DropBox, Heroku,
CloudKick, Justin.TV, etc. These are real guys tackling real problems. Your
sarcastic remarks belittle their accomplishments, which is immature at best.

"Though we fund all types of startups, we're especially interested in
web/mobile applications. We've been thinking about that problem longer than
anyone else, and by now can visualize much of the space of possibilities."

This means that they are more comfortable investing in an area where they're
the experts. If you're going to blindly apply to a VC without reading their
"About" page, that is you being irresponsible, not a problem with the VC.

~~~
alexl
My point exactly - again! "They are more comfortable in that area" means "they
don't actually invest outside that area." I feel I could have saved some time
if I knew this before I applied for the first time.

But yeah, I get it, you can't conceive them ever being wrong, for some reason.
I have nothing against that, it's an opinion and it's as personal as a
haircut.

~~~
ericmsimons
No, it doesn't mean "they don't actually invest outside that area", it means
that you have to have a kick ass team and product for them to even consider
taking you. You don't have a team, which is what probably killed your
application from the start.

Again, this is all posted on their website. Digging around on the internet
would reveal even more information. You should have done this in the first
place before applying to a VC.

~~~
alexl
Yeah, but that whole single founder thing is so messed up. They don't really
send you the message that they rarely take single founders on board. You have
to find horror stories on the net. One of them is about a guy who had two
other co-founders or so, but those couldn't just move for three months. They
had families and lives. So the guy moves to SF and they tell him "we really
hate single founders." So, if the other co-founders are not there, it's like
they don't exist at all. I do have a guy, an engineer who would do a lot of
the required work, but moving him to the US is an idea from another planet. He
is part of the team. There's no doubt about that. He just doesn't want to be a
legal co-owner. He doesn't want that responsibility. He's also much older than
me and has a different perspective. But Y Combinator, suffering from ADHD,
won't have the patience to consider all that. That was kinda my whole point.
I'm still not sure you got it.

~~~
alexl
Wow, we reached the limit of the sausage string. I have to reply to my own
comment :)

I still believe I can do it "alone," i.e. with just that other guy. I'm just
gonna go get the needed money elsewhere and forget about Y Combinator. That
blog post or whatever you want to call it, is my opinion on them.

~~~
ericmsimons
I would consider it slanderous but to each their own. I think there are more
respectable (and polite) ways of protesting though.

------
gumbo
For some reason the rejection has bumped my productivity. I've produced so
much today than I haven't done since months now. I guess the rejection made me
feel like I don't need help, Start-up is about business and if for some
reasons* YC feel like our idea don't worth investing in (I doubt it) or maybe
we are not good enough to execute then it's up to us to prove the contrary.

------
jason_slack
I turned 18 before I could complete my Eagle. But Boy Scouts had a lasting
impact on the way I live my life.

There are many things I have tackled in my life because I have the courage to
stand up and do something others might not.

A scout is trustworthy, loyal, helpful, friendly, courteous, kind, obedient,
cheerful, thrifty, brave, clean and reverent.

~~~
ericmsimons
I agree. I'll never forget this one, though...

"Always be prepared."

Best advice to live your life by (especially when running a startup).

~~~
jason_slack
Agreed...sometimes being prepared means knowing what to do when the unknown
arises

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contactdick
Yes and No. A good entrepreneur needs to be able to execute and part of that
is spending time on the right ideas and features for that idea. I'd say the
ability to assess sensibly the question 'Am I working on the best thing I can
be at the moment' is more important than dogged pursuit of a single goal.

~~~
ericmsimons
Have you ever bootstrapped a startup? I've never bootstrapped a startup where
we weren't hell bent on getting our shit done until our vision was complete..

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DarrenLyman
I am also an Eagle Scout! I have been hired at previous "jobs" because I
obtained the rank. Just remember the sky starts where the ground ends! Just
get it off the ground, and your in the sky... :)

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dtyleryork
Just got rejected as well. Amen, brother

~~~
ericmsimons
Best of luck to you, sir! :)

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bdclimber14
I'm also an Eagle Scout and earning it is one of proudest accomplishments.

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dpakrk
There's always something to look forward :)

