
Ask HN: Are there any software jobs in nature/animal conservation? - petargyurov
Hi HN. Lately I have been thinking about what I really want to do in life; what really brings meaning and joy to my life. I am currently finishing up my solo &quot;start-up&quot; project, and we will see where it goes, but in the mean time I have been doing some introspection and thinking about the future.<p>I am a software developer (mostly backend, some frontend and some data analytics). I personally don&#x27;t really have any desire to work at FAANG. I also don&#x27;t really have any desire to write CRUD for some generic company that pays well either.<p>I want to explore more meaningful avenues of work. Preserving nature, animals and their habitats, is one cause I have been thinking about. I know that most projects are very hands-on, requiring mostly hard labour or specialised research efforts. However, I&#x27;ve been wondering if there is a demand for software in these projects? Particularly in terms of specialised tooling and&#x2F;or data analytics?<p>I suspect that most research projects don&#x27;t have the funding to afford anything beyond the bare requirements. The same probably goes for government sponsored programmes; again, this is all speculation.<p>Does anyone have experience as a software dev in these fields? Where might one start looking ?<p>--<p>Because I am sure some people will mention it, yes, volunteering is an option. But money is an unfortunate living requirement in today&#x27;s society (unless you plan on going off-grid entirely).
======
jefurii
It's most certainly better for your soul, but get ready to take a pay cut.
After a short career in game development and a much longer career in
museum/library/archives, my take is that our societies values are out of
whack: the more your job benefits your community and the planet the less you
will get paid, and vice versa. It's even worse for social services.

You'll also take a hit in your reputation among other developers, most of whom
seem to have gone into it for money and don't seem to care whether or not
their labor is doing anything to benefit society.

Good work is still worth doing of course. You just have to count the work
itself as one of the benefits.

"Work as if you live in the early days of a better nation."

~~~
linuxftw
> the more your job benefits your community and the planet the less you will
> get paid, and vice versa. It's even worse for social services.

In a free market economy, this is an entirely false statement. People pay for
the things they value. They more they value it, the more they pay.

Compare the amount of hours spent playing video games to the amount of hours
spent touring museums. It's not close. People value video games much more
greatly than museums.

Just because _you_ value certain things more than others doesn't give them any
intrinsic value.

~~~
fock
well, if museums would drive the same marketing campaigns (read propaganda or
simply media based manipulation), this might easily change... Also generally
the amount of time you can spend in museums is somehow limited, as most don't
allow you to be active (like videogames do in a sort of lobotomied way).

As for your example: if you compare the amount of time people play in
bands/sing in choirs (often without any direct money involved, e.g. around
church or school) you've got an obvious example that people don't naturally
"pay more for the things they value" (or see the need to pay or get payed at
all). I value this very much and if someone was coming up and saying: pay up,
I'd say - come on guys, let's do this on our own.

~~~
linuxftw
> this might easily change

This is a perfectly testable hypothesis in the free market. You can start a
museum and market it, and see if you generate a profit. If you don't, then you
have to fund it yourself (pay) or hope a handful of others value it and pay.

> often without any direct money involved, e.g. around church or school

There's much money involved in organizing people and having venues for
whatever it is they do inside those venues. In these cases, the people paying
for these organized singing events are what you would consider a patron.
Churches and schools aren't free.

Modern instruments cost a lot of money, lots of labor to produce.

As far as just some friends getting together and signing because they enjoy
it, that's obviously free. But it's not a service that someone else is
providing to you, that's just something you're doing because _you_ feel is has
value. What would be more analogous would be having a civic center where
people perform and.... people pay money to enter the venue and be entertained.

Some people greatly value libraries and museums. I don't. Those people should
pay for them. If from time to time, I might want to use their services, I
would gladly pay. If there was a membership required, perhaps I would enroll
if I felt the cost was worth the benefit. This happens every day for many
other industries.

Anyway, the root of the point was that people don't value librarians so they
don't get paid as well as programmers. This is true. If it wasn't true, they
would be paid more. I know this really hurts the socialist sensibilities of
people on this site, but it's the cold hard truth.

~~~
fock
> Modern instruments cost a lot of money, lots of labor to produce.

well, I'm not sure, how the trumpet from 1970 differs from a modern instrument
(and yeah, people are still using these, where I play), but yeah, "lot of
money, lots of labor" ><((((*>

And btw., one of the bands I'm in plays sometimes for money, but incurs no
cost for membership or anything. It's just there.

~~~
linuxftw
> well, I'm not sure, how the trumpet from 1970 differs from a modern
> instrument

I consider a trumpet a modern instrument. How did you procure said trumpet?
Did you pick it from the wild trumpet tree? No, of course not.

Someone mined the copper and zinc, refined them, someone combined them into
the alloy brass, someone formed that brass into a trumpet. Of course, the
trumpet wasn't conceived magically, it was something that went through
countless iterations and revisions as instrument building matured. Then
someone had to sell the trumpet to you. Unless you were at the factor-direct
trumpet store, it was shipped to a retail location or warehouse where you then
purchased it. Money and labor was invested just so you can obtain the trumpet.

How much labor goes into making a trumpet? Lots. Someone realized there was a
market for trumpets and invested a good bit of capital to produce them.
Improvements in manufacturing (aka, market efficiency) has resulted in high
quality trumpets being produced cheaply, same as anything else. I'd say, the
entire price structure of the trumpet (or much of anything, really) is
entirely labor based. The metals exist in the ground. Digging them up is free
(purchasing mineral rights notwithstanding) in terms of needed to pay the
earth for them.

Much like libraries, there are places you can rent musical instruments like
trumpets. These are often 'required' for education purposes, so why doesn't
the government just have a trumpet library same as the book library? Don't you
enjoy music? Why don't you demand taxes pay for instruments for the homeless
that can't afford their own instruments? They're so enriching and such.

All those things exist because people voted with their money to make sure they
exist. It's not because some greater good commanded their existence.

------
dougmwne
Yes there are jobs and yes the non-profit industry needs your talents.
Software jobs in the industry fall into one of 4 buckets in my experience.
Don't expect much career growth or pay. Most of the work is in support of
fundraising. Be willing to work at a vendor that serves the non-profit
industry.

\- Web development. Nonprofits need websites. Sometimes they may have a dev on
staff, usually they at least have a digital director that can work with devs
at web dev vendors. These vendors are usually solely focused on the non-profit
market.

\- CRM. Non-profits fundraise and they need people to manage the donor
database. Usually this is bought from a vendor that specializes in non-profit
CRM and those vendors also have devs/DBAs.

\- IT. Non-profits need IT to manage networks, phones and equipment. Often
they work with IT vendors.

\- Devs for conservation work. This is more rare. Still, some non-profits have
staff scientists, GIS people, and devs to build out conservation tools, such
as data collecting apps, data visualizations or other things. This is rare
because most non-profits are trying to convince the government to do the
science because the government has much more money and power to recruit. It's
rare and maybe a bit of a vanity project to do any science out of the non-
profit, though there are a couple of groups that do that.

~~~
jefurii
In my personal experience working in nonprofits there is a tendency for
organizations to have the actual technical work done by vendors rather than
staff unless the work is central to the mission of the organization. There's a
feeling that this is cheaper than trying to hire and maintain staff with those
skills.

~~~
dencodev
It may be less about it being cheaper, and more that you know what your budget
is for a given year but perhaps not what it is three years from now. You can
spend this year's budget with confidence and not worry about having to lay off
your dev staff next year when donations dry up. It also requires management
expertise to manage a software building team - not something a lot of non-
profits have.

~~~
dchasson
I learned from your perspective here. Thank you for sharing your experience.

Interesting, because this trade study could be conducted by an engineer and a
manager in a small company and still have starkly different results in the
weighing of concerns.

Most of my early career was solo. I recognize the importance of a good team,
but as a business you (even non profits and myself solo) have to understand
the bottom line for all stakeholders.

If anyone else could expand on this person's ideas, please do!

------
ericvanular
Check out [https://enviro.work](https://enviro.work)! I'm the founder and
created the site because I felt similarly to you. Aligning personal values and
your career is a great feeling

~~~
petargyurov
Thanks! From a cursory look I can't see anything that immediately applies to
me but it's a good resource to find companies. Will take a deeper look later.

------
msrpotus
Check out Tech Jobs for Good:
[https://techjobsforgood.com/?q=&impact_areas=Environment&imp...](https://techjobsforgood.com/?q=&impact_areas=Environment&impact_areas=Food+%26+Agriculture)

Big NGOs also need technical people, too. Check out the Humane Society, Sierra
Club, Greenpeace, Compassion in World Farming, etc. They aren’t going to be
the highest paying jobs and there are all sorts of downsides but it’s a way to
use your skills to make a difference in the world.

~~~
balladeer
Many would just need, at least me, a decent salary for sustaining comfortably
(in my case that would be fine in just 50% of my CTC or even less) but a
stellar medical insurance (yeah, I want that covered!) and work-life balance
which also includes being treated and respected as a human being.

------
walleeee
Not exactly conservation, but there's plenty of computational work (and
funding!) in plant biology.

I do web development and data engineering for plant phenomics automation in a
plant bio lab. Crop optimization (e.g., for abiotic stress resistance, reduced
fertilizer requirements, atmospheric carbon sequestration, yield) basically
requires digital surveillance infrastructure on the same scale we've
(regrettably) developed for humans, except for plants. Nobody really
understands how phenotypes develop as a function of genetic, physiological,
and environmental factors; but we need to if we want to maintain the viability
of agriculture in the face of climate change etc.

You won't get paid like you would in a more traditional software development
position, but it's enough to live on. Let me know if you'd like more
information.

~~~
pknerd
I am interested to know details but I am in Pakistan. I work (Ed) on multiple
technologies but mostly python these days for ETL and automation. Learning Go
too. Check out [http://adnansiddiqi.me](http://adnansiddiqi.me)

~~~
walleeee
Hi Adnan. Unfortunately I'm only familiar with the situation in the U.S.
Pakistan may have different agricultural practices and a different funding
landscape. Here are a few links about the motivation and current state of the
art if you want to read more.

[0]:
[https://science.sciencemag.org/content/327/5967/818](https://science.sciencemag.org/content/327/5967/818)

[1]:
[https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/pce.12107](https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/pce.12107)

[2]:
[https://academic.oup.com/jxb/article/66/18/5429/482901](https://academic.oup.com/jxb/article/66/18/5429/482901)

[3]:
[https://linkinghub.elsevier.com/retrieve/pii/S13601385110020...](https://linkinghub.elsevier.com/retrieve/pii/S1360138511002093)

[4]:
[http://www.plantphysiol.org/cgi/doi/10.1104/pp.114.243519](http://www.plantphysiol.org/cgi/doi/10.1104/pp.114.243519)

There is a ton of software-oriented work involved, from robotics and embedded
devices in the field, to data engineering (containerizing and automating
pipelines in grid, cloud, and HPC environments), to web development (creating
research portals), to simulation of growth processes and modeling yield as a
function of genetic/physiological/environmental factors, etc. Python is very
widely used for all of the above. Go not as much, but Singularity (Docker for
HPC, basically) is written in Go iirc.

If you want to discuss more let me know and I'll contact you directly.

~~~
pknerd
Sorry for the late response. What I meant that I wanted to know about remote
working possibilities. If you could guide or help then let me know.

------
rgovostes
Your website says you studied science and have built software for spreadsheets
and for 3D printing.

I work with oceanographers. There are many who get by with rudimentary
programming skills but love the help of developers who can help them build
tools to analyze and disseminate their data. They love spreadsheets because
they don't know how to make databases.

Having mechanical or electrical engineering or CAD skills helps them design
enclosures for instruments, having software skills helps them add autonomy.

However it is not a field where, at least as I've seen, engineers have free
rein to improve processes simply for the sake of improving them.

You are right that research funding is tight and in most of the world it is
getting tighter. Right now many projects are burning through funds while
scientists babysit their kids; the research vessels are only now trying to
resume operation.

------
ellissd
A few years ago Bret Victor wrote a long and wonderful essay lamenting the
lack of attention to climate change in the tech industry. No specific job
opportunities, but it's a wonderful read about how technologists can
contribute to solutions.

[http://worrydream.com/ClimateChange/](http://worrydream.com/ClimateChange/)

------
Razengan
I don’t know of any opportunities, but if anyone’s taking ideas for products
in this domain then I would like an app or website that links volunteers with
animal shelters, farmstays and other places that could use a few extra hands.

It could be like a combination of Airbnb and Couchsurfing etc. that serves a
specific niche.

~~~
petargyurov
[https://www.workaway.info](https://www.workaway.info) is what you're looking
for

~~~
Razengan
Thanks. From a quick scan of the site and their safety information page, it
seems they do not handle payments between users like Airbnb does, or do they?

And since they require an upfront membership fee, has anyone here used
Workaway? How was your experience?

~~~
petargyurov
Yes, the membership fee is a bit annoying but I paid because my girlfriend and
I were planning on volunteering abroad - then the pandemic hit.

So I haven't actually done one of these workaways.

> it seems they do not handle payments between users

Most of the offerings you will find on there will only provide you with
housing, maybe food, in exchange for labour. Some do pay, but I strongly
suspect that it is in cash.

~~~
Razengan
> _Most of the offerings you will find on there will only provide you with
> housing, maybe food, in exchange for labour. Some do pay, but I strongly
> suspect that it is in cash._

Ah I do not require payment for myself, I just thought some hosts may request
payment for accommodation or the initial moving-in costs (paperwork etc.)

------
nico_h
There is this development company that’s doing good work (the “improve
people’s live in developing country kind of development”):

[https://catalpa.io/work-with-us/](https://catalpa.io/work-with-us/)

They are based in East Timor and were founded by an Aussie and an American
(U.S.) and they allow remote work.

~~~
petargyurov
That looks very interesting, thank you. And they need a backend dev!

------
roncanepa
Start investigating biodiversity informatics. There are a lot of different
aspects in this space: genomics, georeferencing, image processing for feature
extraction, etc, as well as typical distributed systems infrastructure.

~~~
pknerd
As a Python developer I once used BioPython for rNA/DNA related data
exploration and liked it. Could not figure out how I could explore this niche
further due to lack of domain knowledge and a clear path.

------
KineticLensman
Some tangentially relevant observations based on volunteering at a raptor
conservation trust in the UK.

The trust maintains a visitor park that provides bird displays and experience
days for the general public. The gate takings and donations fund conservation
activities in the UK (raptor nest boxes, bird hospital, bird surveys) and
overseas activities (e.g. reducing poisoning of wild birds by game poachers).
The Trust itself is very much an outdoor organisation, with key staff
supporting bird care and site infrastructure. There is a small back office
that supports ops, marketing and merchandising, using COTS software. Academic
research is conducted but in conjunction with local universities, which is
where data crunching, etc, happens. There are a small number of on-site
student placements, primarily for those in biology / zoology courses, and the
placement activities seem fairly practical in nature. I suspect that most
similar organisations follow a similar pattern, with a relatively small COTS
software footprint and a focus on practical tasks rather than software
development / data analysis.

That said, I started volunteering to support an office-based marketing
function: management of a massive photo library and video editing to support
marketing and outreach functions. After six months of doing this, COVID-19
happened and most office staff started WFH, with office-based volunteering
suspended because it involves hot-desking. When the park started to reopen, I
switched to COVID-related activities such as queue management (‘space
marshal’) and cleaning. Although some tasks are menial, I’ve learned much more
about how the trust works on a daily basis and I’ve got to know the key bird
staff much better.

One of my key insights, as an ex-software professional, is how much I didn’t
know about how conservation actually works, and how specific conservation
organisations actually operate. But getting hands-on with some of the less
glamorous tasks is a good apprenticeship and a way of building trust in the
industry, if you have a long-term interest in directly supporting
conservation.

~~~
petargyurov
Thanks, that was insightful and encouraging.

------
mistrial9
Bay Area listing service, world scope?

[http://www.greenjobs.net/](http://www.greenjobs.net/)

ps- contact them and help with the cert!

------
digitalutopia
Find a grad student working on research projects in the field. Every area of
focus will have different requirements but almost all wildlife related field
work involves some form of data entry that involves transfer from data in a
notebook to excel or some CAD program. Challenges include no access to cell
data, wet environments, battery management, etc. That being said, if it cuts
down on tedium, most researchers will find a way to pay for it.

I've seen a plant identification app disrupt the process of species
identification with field guides. I suspect that there are a lot of tedious
classification projects that professors assign to undergrad researchers (find
photos with wildlife) that can be entirely automated.

------
ForHackernews
There are several startups working on conservation/anti-poaching initiatives
using image recognition and/or drones.

[https://airshepherd.org/](https://airshepherd.org/)

[https://wildlifeprotectionsolutions.org/](https://wildlifeprotectionsolutions.org/)

[https://observer.com/2017/05/artificial-intelligence-can-
sto...](https://observer.com/2017/05/artificial-intelligence-can-stop-
elephant-rhino-poaching-in-africa/)

------
dencodev
I applied to and was interviewed for a non-profit in the area that serves to
connect volunteers with non-profits that need their help. Maybe they just
really didn't like me in the interview (I didn't get that impression at all)
but even offering my senior software developer skills _for free_ to _any_ non-
profit, I have not heard back with anyone wanting my help and it's been
months.

------
iicc
[https://oceanmind.global/careers/](https://oceanmind.global/careers/)

------
joefreeman
I'm about to start at Optimal (in London). It's not exactly conservation, but
I like to think it's not far from it. Some details on the Who's Hiring post
[1]. Best of luck otherwise.

[1]
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23702401](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23702401)

------
gulato
I wouldn't say I "write software" but I have a computing job in the field of
animal/landscape ecology research with a pure CS background. I guess I'd say
it's part scripting ETL type jobs, some parallel processing stuff, and ... I
guess I'll call it DevOps to keep it short.

Make friends with people in national-level government organizations (whatever
would be most like USGS wherever you live) or university "geomatics" type
people. A good start would be those involved with remote sensing (satellite
[radar or optical]/drone/other sensors). These are the people that know of or
are sitting in these types of jobs.

If you want a web dev type job find a way to get experience with scripting for
ArcGIS Portal.

------
pvaldes
It depends on the country, probably.

I would suggest you to assure first a well paid job and use your free time for
volunteer activities. Nobody should be doing science before 50 Yo. Not at this
moment when postdocs are being paid 300 euro/month. Is committing economical
suicide and starting a family first and having kids should be your priority.

About oceanography. If you can read spanish (if not, you can always google-
translate it) you may find interesting this recent piece of news.

[https://elpais.com/ciencia/2020-06-30/dimite-la-cupula-
del-m...](https://elpais.com/ciencia/2020-06-30/dimite-la-cupula-del-mayor-
organismo-oceanografico-de-espana.html?rel=lom)

Your mileage may vary

~~~
fock
you missed two 0s for our postdocs annual net salary. But hey, generalization
is so great.

And while I understand that in most parts of the world, it's paid a lot worse
and you might have problems making ends met, I don't really get, how you want
to solve these problems (interlinked with nowadays capitalism) by getting more
kids (wow, just 30t of CO2/year more "output") and helping the 1% redistribute
an even larger fraction of the wealth to themselves (which are imho the only
really "richly"-paying jobs.)

~~~
pvaldes
Some people want to have kids

~~~
fock
yes? if you want to have kids by 30, a PhD probably isn't right for you. A
career in science might as well probably not work out. So what, not everyone
needs to procreate?!

~~~
pvaldes
Do I need to sacrifice my children to have the privilege to be allowed to
solve _your_ problems?

Okay. Good bye, science.

------
mepiethree
Not sure about preserving nature and animals directly, but there are lots of
software jobs in clean energy (I'm hiring SWEs for Kevala right now). These
could indirectly have a big impact on preserving nature via slowing climate
change.

------
hprotagonist
If you’re in the UK look at SMRU. [http://www.smru.st-
andrews.ac.uk/](http://www.smru.st-andrews.ac.uk/)

active group, good work, and they’re a semi-commercial autonomous wing of st.
andrews.

------
jamil7
Remote sensing is being used as a tool to help fight deforestation by a few
startups and tech companies. There aren't many jobs yet as I think it is still
mostly an academic area but it's something to look into.

------
abawany
This is not directly answering your query but you might sometimes be surprised
at the positions available at major companies that work towards your goal of
nature conservation. For example, I had a stint at Siemens working on an
project that managed customer site environments. This meant doing things to
help them conserve energy and helping them save money by reducing power waste.
I am guessing Siemens doesn't come to mind as an environmental pioneer in
spite of their work on wind power, etc. but there you are: it was functionally
one of the more gratifying jobs I had.

------
linuxftw
> However, I've been wondering if there is a demand for software in these
> projects?

No, there's not a demand for software in this arena. All this stuff is
dominated by grants and politically charged funds.

------
grawprog
When I was working in that field any 'software development' I did was
alongside everything else I did. Most of that was online database and website
work and some scripts to make analyzing data easier. I still spent far more
time doing field work, writing reports and hustling for grant money though.

~~~
petargyurov
May I ask where that was? That sounds like a good deal to me, to be honest
with you - I don't mind getting my hands dirty - it breaks up the monotony of
development sometimes.

------
jbob2000
Nature and animal conservation is a political issue. The best use of your
skills would be to aid in the lobbying efforts for tighter regulations and
more money for developing countries.

You might save a tiger, but in the year it took you to save him, Brazil cut
down 8 million hectares of the rain forest for palm oil.

~~~
havelhovel
Lobbyists require data. Existing wildlife laws require enforcement. Political
support requires mobilization. All of the above can be helped by smart,
enthusiastic developers. If more people help out, we can save the tiger and
the forest.

~~~
jbob2000
All of this requires political support. You can't collect the data if you are
not allowed to or if your results are silenced. Enforcement requires political
will, otherwise the criminals never get prosecuted or flee to their home
countries.

Until we get "the establishment" to care about this, doing any work in this
field is simply for vanity or to make you feel good.

~~~
havelhovel
> doing any work in this field is simply for vanity or to make you feel good

Making blanketing, dismissive claims about everyone who works in a specific
field is a great way to end the conversation.

------
fiftyacorn
I worked on a forestry grant platform for a while. It was interesting, but at
the end of the day it was the same software problems I solve everywhere else

------
nhhoxf
Hey, we are working on this www.bexbox.cc

Drop me an email at nhh@downforce.com. We don't have a framework for hiring at
the moment but might do very soon.

~~~
petargyurov
I've sent you an email :)

------
hkiely
I would have to imagine a large amount of work in the animal conservation
space would be in the hardware market.

------
thedevindevops
What country is this?

~~~
petargyurov
I am in the UK but I am willing to relocate.

~~~
dougmwne
I would not bother with the US if you would need work visa sponsorship. No
non-profit I've ever worked with ever had the resources to do that. You might
have better luck with consulting where they don't need to relocate or sponsor
you.

------
probinso
droneseed

inaturalist

Cornell ornithology lab

eesa

Caltech JPL

USFWS

MBARI

blue point conservation science

NOAA

Sitka technology group

conservation x labs

sail drone

uw escience institute

greenridge sciences

Oregon carbon

m science (marine research)

Tortuga agtech

conservation metrics

~~~
petargyurov
Thank you for listing these. It's a great starting point.

~~~
probinso
I always find it easier to find companies once I have a list to work from,
even if they're not in the geographic area that I'm looking for

------
seltzered_
A few thoughts:

\- [https://4returns.earth/network/job-
listings/](https://4returns.earth/network/job-listings/) is in the
regenerative ag space - lists some tech jobs if you search for them. (e.g. try
[https://4returns.earth/network/job-
listings/?searchval=devel...](https://4returns.earth/network/job-
listings/?searchval=developer) )

\- Conservation is only one area, and the term 'conservation' itself is a
frame I've been more critical of after reading papers like
[https://www.uv.es/jgpausas/papers/Pausas-
Millan-2019_BioScie...](https://www.uv.es/jgpausas/papers/Pausas-
Millan-2019_BioScience_Mediterranean-Basin-changes.pdf) which have been making
me think some of the problems we have might be more with abandoning land for
the city. Another frame of thinking about about is how/where you want to live
and go from there - I'm really questioning whether one should live in "today's
society" \- that doesn't mean going off-grid entirely but living in a way
that's local/bioregional oriented..

\- I'm skeptical of the tech-focused effort on only looking at co2 because it
doesn't account for the other problem areas (google "planetary boundaries
framework" to learn about biodiversity collapse/nutrient flows and how those
are much bigger problems), but there's the airminers folks:
[http://www.airminers.org](http://www.airminers.org) . Again, while this falls
more in the tech frame I'm not sure I'd spend time on it.

\- While I disagree with some of the recommendations around 'effective
altruism', it's another path worth considering if your survival requires
making money at the moment. You could say, work at a mapping or weather-
related company spend then leverage the experience later on for more direct
action. At the moment I haven't quit my dayjob yet but am taking an "Ecosystem
Restoration Design" course
([https://www.gaiaeducation.org](https://www.gaiaeducation.org)), donated to
various things, and participate in a study group around these topics
([https://earth-regenerators.mn.co](https://earth-regenerators.mn.co)) and
feel like that so far has helped in developing a perspective before jumping
into anything.

\- almost forgot, Patagonia's Action Works seems to have a really good
platform for finding tech volunteering on environmental projects:
[https://www.patagonia.com/actionworks/](https://www.patagonia.com/actionworks/)

~~~
petargyurov
Thanks, that's very useful! Will read through those links.

> developing a perspective before jumping into anything

Probably the biggest takeaway here, for me. Each domain is more complex than
it appears on the surface.

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de_watcher
You mean making conserves?

