
Apple engineer uses Lego to rebuild Antikythera mechanism - gommm
http://news.cnet.com/8301-17852_3-20025264-71.html
======
jacquesm
What should really blow your mind is the precision of the original
metalworking and gearing, _well_ before the age of clockmaking and
watchmaking.

An item like that to spring in to existence without any record of a history
leading up to it or a history of devices descending from it really makes you
wonder whose imagination it sprang from and why it wasn't recognized that
these principles had further application, or, alternatively could point to
lots of stuff (including knowledge) getting lost.

~~~
Luyt
It's a wonderful piece of engineering indeed, but not the first one. Gears
were used long before that ([http://www.nptel.iitm.ac.in/courses/IIT-
MADRAS/Machine_Desig...](http://www.nptel.iitm.ac.in/courses/IIT-
MADRAS/Machine_Design_II/pdf/2_1.pdf)), as early as 2600 BC for opening doors,
lifting water and measuring distances. Archimedes used gears for all kind of
stuff in 330 BC (See <http://www.mlahanas.de/Greeks/ArchimedesGears.htm>)

An explanation for that fact that so few devices remain that a record of
history seems to be missing, could be that they were made of metals (copper,
bronze, etc) which were quite precious in that time, so the devices probably
got recycled. Image that, some warrior smelting a few antikythera machines to
forge a sword!

~~~
jacquesm
Sure, but there is a bit of a difference in precision between a man sized gear
or one that would not be out of place in a modern gear driven clock.

I think you got confused by the wording of "precision of the original
metalworking and gearing", original as in 'not the lego version', not
suggesting it was the first use of gears.

~~~
jberryman
In a clock precision in the metalwork in the gears is important to cut down on
friction, etc. But I'm not sure if the saem can be said for this ancient
computer.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems like what is important here is
simply the ratios of the number of teeth on the different gears.

I mean obviously all the parts have to mesh when the device is cranked but it
doesn't have to turn terribly smoothly to work.

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RiderOfGiraffes
Previously on this subject:

<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1992756>

<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1992715>

<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1991659>

<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1991557>

<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1990493>

<http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1988818>

None of those have much discussion, but it's interesting just how many
submissions there have been about the antikythera:

<http://searchyc.com/submissions/antikythera?sort=by_date>

~~~
blahedo
In particular, this one: <http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1992756> has a
link to a blog post by the guy that made the video with some of the background
on that, which is particularly value-added.

------
bryanh
Check out the guy's actual site with tons more technical detail:
<http://acarol.woz.org/antikythera_mechanism.html>

What an impressive achievement. I think this is what we want all of our pet
projects to be...

------
noonespecial
I've always thought that "Math with gears" would be a fascinating elective
course and should be included with most engineering programs.

~~~
Luyt
You will love the mechanical analog ballistic computers of 50's:
[http://www.boingboing.net/2010/05/19/how-a-1950s-ballisti.ht...](http://www.boingboing.net/2010/05/19/how-a-1950s-ballisti.html)

It explains all the mechanics used for adders, integrators, differentiators,
etc... very insightful.

~~~
bshep
Love the videos!

------
kunjaan
Kudos to the director as well. The video wowed me as much as the machine it
self.

~~~
cormullion
Making of post here:

<http://blog.smallmammal.com/>

------
spanx
Just a clarification on the source story. I work at Digital Science, who
commissioned this video. Andy had actually already built this device (we
didn't sponsor building it), along with a Babbage difference engine. He
brought them a long to Sci Foo this year, and i believe the filming took place
around that time.

I've seen both the devices in the flesh, and they are little works of art. Not
sure if he's planning on building any more.

------
evgeny0
The video is definitely very impressive, but I'm still far more impressed by
the fact someone made this in 100 BC than that someone re-created it in 2010
AD. I had never heard of the Antikythera mechanism before.

~~~
sliverstorm
Well of course, that's why the Antikythera mechanism is so unique. But that
doesn't mean making it in Lego isn't kickass!

------
jonursenbach
This is probably the first time in my life that my jaw has literally dropped
while watching an invention/recreation in action. Absolutely incredible.

~~~
frossie
Direct link to the video:

<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLPVCJjTNgk>

------
pavs
He is a long time redditor. Gave some more info in this reddit post:
[http://www.reddit.com/r/science/comments/ej948/lego_antikyth...](http://www.reddit.com/r/science/comments/ej948/lego_antikythera_mechanism/)

------
cbo
Say what you will about Apple, their products, or their business model, but
I've always found their engineers to be the pinnacle of quality and hacker
culture.

------
Clarity1992
For me the professional production of the video makes a ridiculous difference
to how much I enjoy news like this. It's really nicely put together.

Related to that, the way it was posted on CNET added nothing to the
information in the video and reminded me that I'm getting increasingly irked
by reposting culture.

Hacker News is good because it links to original content with a snappy title
and then space to discuss below. Which leads me to wonder why this item links
to the CNET article and not straight to the youtube video?

------
davidchua
Beautiful! When I first read about Antikythera sometime back, it fascinated me
to learn that 2000 years ago, someone has created what seems to be the first
computer.

I wonder if the Ancient Astronaut theories could actually hold water.

------
jonhendry
The same engineer also built a Lego Babbage difference engine:

<http://acarol.woz.org/difference_engine.html>

Anyone know what Mr. Carol works on at Apple?

~~~
eftpotrm
Just while we're thinking this sort of thing, people might be interested to
see <http://www.meccano.us/>. I believe Tim helped Andrew on his Lego
difference engine, and he's now working on the Analytical Engine.

------
Luyt
Brian Dunning wrote an interesting article about the Antikythera Mechanism:

<http://skeptoid.com/episodes/4184>

 _"Astronomers and astrologers probably could not have afforded it. It could
have been used as an education tool. Most likely it was built for wealthy
Romans who had some interest in its features, probably not too different from
early adopters who wanted to have the first iPhone with all the cool apps."_

~~~
pohl
_...probably not too different from early adopters who wanted to have the
first iPhone with all the cool apps._

Suckers. Didn't they know to wait a few centuries for the 2nd gen?

------
ygd
Reminds me of this: <http://xkcd.com/659/>

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dmoney
This is offtopic, but it makes me angry every time someone uses Lego
(singular) as a collective noun. When I was a kid they were always called
"Legos". I never heard someone say "I built X out of Lego". I don't know if
it's worse that they try to enforce this artificial use of language, or that
everyone goes along with it. "Lego bricks" sounds artificial too, but at least
it sounds plural.

~~~
sp332
LEGO(TM) is a trademark, which means (in the USA at least) that it should not
be used as a noun. The company risks losing the ability to assert its
trademark if they don't enforce this. The "proper" use is: LEGO(TM)-brand toy
building blocks.

Yeah, I know it sounds dumb and no one will ever call them that, but calling
them "Legos" or "Lego" isn't correct either.

------
curiousyogurt
According to Aristotle, we uncover theoretical knowledge by exploring that
which has no practical (action-based) or productive (product-based) result;
and what we possess is that which is known only for its own sake, for the
sheer pleasure of knowing.

I've often thought a similar distinction can be made in engineering, where the
product is created for its own sake, for the sheer pleasure of seeing it
exist. This is one of those. An amazing piece of work. Bravo.

------
damoncali
For those interested in mechanical calulation, check out the Curta Calculator:
<http://curta.org/>

I have one of these. It's amazing.

------
ck2
Gears doing math and the adding is especially amazing.

Then realize they figured that out over 2000 years ago.

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CallMeV
Their next task will be to build the Babbage Difference Engine out of Lego.

~~~
CallMeV
Too late. They already have. :)

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neovive
Truly amazing level of detail! Hopefully the plans are made available for
others to learn from.

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gsivil
Does anyone know if some body has created an emulator for the Antikythera
mechanism?

