
Tech Bootcamps in Palestine - galazzah
https://www.visitpalestine.tech/bootcamp
======
dopeboy
I went to Gaza in the summer of 2016 and did a mini-AMA here on HN [0]. In
short, it was a tremendously rewarding experience and I'd highly recommend it.
The Gazans I met were driven, friendly, and very curious about what life in
the states was like.

Happy to answer any questions not addressed on the site.

[0] -
[https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11858963](https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11858963)

~~~
yostrovs
Is calling them Gazans accepted? Some time ago they'd be referred to as
Palestinians.

~~~
dopeboy
You know, I actually don't remember if they referred to themselves as
"Gazans". I definitely remember colleagues calling them that.

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hacktavist
Visited Palestine in 2016 - such humble people and sad to see how they are
treated. This is an awesome initiative and would be awesome to help out with.

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mlevental
i haven't been to palestine (yet) but one of my closest friends is palestinian
from west bank (and i've been following the occupation closely since i met him
10 years ago). it is astonishing to me that they're running this in gaza as
well as west bank. i wish them well and wish i could support the effort
somehow.

~~~
isostatic
Logistcally getting in/out of Gaza is far more difficult than the West Bank. A
western passport means you get get to places like Ramallah by simply driving
there, some checkpoints you barely need to slow down, others they stop you and
check your passports, but even late at night at Qalandiya, a British Passport
works wonders (Different story if you're from the west bank of course)

Gaza on the other hand requires a ton of permits to get in

~~~
mlevental
from what i've heard from my friend (who has both passports) the waits at
checkpoints in the west bank are potentially interminable. now he does have
both passports so that might be why

~~~
isostatic
Depends so much on the checkpoint, time, method and mood. If you're a white
family driving back from Bethlehem to Jerusalem at 8pm with a foreign
passport, you'll barely notice it. If you're an Arab looking young male
walking through qualandria at 8am with a West Bank ID card, you're screwed.

Gaza is a different ball game, it's always quiet, almost eerie at Erez, but it
will still take over an hour to get out from being dropped off. Getting in is
a little quicker.

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zallarak
I visited Palestine last year and met a few university students. They were so
hungry to learn but lacked the resources. Great initiative.

~~~
hacktavist
Awesome!

------
anoplus
As someone who lives in the region I am delighted to see initiatives like
this. I wish in the future companies and personals will create bonds across
the harsh borders.

~~~
petra
Bnds accross the border are a good thing for sure, but I don't see how this
will change anything today, and the only way forward to a Palestinian non-
extreme democracy which is a precondition for peace, is through local
resistance.

~~~
notahacker
Engaging Palestinians in international collaborative projects which treat them
like normal human beings and are aimed at doing something other than
reinforcing their antipathy towards Israel is a helpful step towards non-
extreme democracy

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bsaul
Honest question : there are a few engineers in SV that are jews. Are they
allowed to come in ? (and is it safe for them to do so ?)

~~~
galazzah
Yeah its perfectly acceptable and safe to do so, as you can read in the FAQ.
Palestinians (I am one) have nothing against Jews

~~~
cobookman
"Avoid wearing outward signs of support for Israel (and, if possible, symbols
of Judaism) inside Palestinian areas as you may be mistaken for a Settler
intending harm"

So you are saying it's not safe for a Jew to come. As wearing a kippah can
lead to altercations.

~~~
tomcooks
As much as wearing a kyffeia in any jewish neighborood can lead to some
friendly 5vs1 improptu meetup in a dark alley with some of the local
"security" (Rome ghetto would be an excellent example).

~~~
bsaul
i'm not sure where you've been in israel but i've stayed in tel aviv and
jerusalem a few times, and there are muslims absolutely everywhere from all
ages and looks... Maybe kyffeia is something different because it carries an
image of violence, and not just political fight ? Much like wearing a nikab
should be fine in most if the US , but carrying an al quaeda flag in new york
wouldn't probably be a good idea..

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Kluny
I applied. Who knows, maybe my job will let me take a month off :)

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slim
If I apply, do I need go through israeli cutoms/police/checkpoints?

I might have problems or be expelled

~~~
peterburkimsher
I travelled to Hebron and Bethlehem last month.

Crossing the checkpoint was very easy. I just took an Israeli Egged bus to the
settlement, visited the Cave of the Patriarchs, and walked to the checkpoint.

The Israeli guard didn't mind, just glanced at my passport and visa slip. A
Palestinian hostel owner who happened to be on the street asked where I was
staying. I told him I was going to stay with my friend Mo, who is a
CouchSurfing host with hundreds of references, extremely hospitable, and truly
legendary. You must visit him. That hostel owner said he knows Mo, and told me
it's the right way!

I wasn't sure about how to take a bus and didn't want to pay for a taxi, so I
walked for 45 minutes to Mo's place next to the university. During that time,
people struck up conversations 3 times. That's more outgoing than the previous
3 days in Israel! People were happy to see a tourist there.

Water shortage is an issue. I was told that the Palestinian authorities can't
improve the water supply because it's controlled by Israel. Palestinians pay
double taxes, to both governments. Israeli shekels are used. It's peaceful,
although the streets look like images from the news of bombed-out areas in
Syria after 10 years of peace to rebuild and start businesses. What is more
comfortable to you, riches with inequality or people living in equal poverty?

Israel, on the other hand, is rich and clean, with a good bus network (except
on Fridays). People are more wary of strangers, though. I hadn't made an
opinion of the political situation until my visit.

Re-entering Israel was easy, on a bus from Bethlehem to Jerusalem. Some
military came on board and looked at the passports and visa slips, but didn't
cross-check anything online.

On the way out at Ben Gurion airport, they didn't ask where I'd travelled on
that trip. Instead, they noticed I'd been to Malaysia several years ago, and
asked me many questions about that (Malaysia is a Muslim country). I had no
problems with the Taiwan passport sticker [1]. They gave me another passport
sticker [2] with a barcode beginning with "5", meaning I'm low-risk. They
didn't check electronics. Most likely, you won't have a problem. If you're
from a "Muslim country" then perhaps you can visit through the border with
Jordan instead, just to avoid Israel. But Israel's quite nice to visit too
(the sunset over the ocean from Haifa is beautiful).

[1]
[https://www.facebook.com/TaiwanPassportSticker/photos/a.1466...](https://www.facebook.com/TaiwanPassportSticker/photos/a.1466957400280696.1073741832.1465796757063427/1571504209826014/?type=3&theater)

[2] [https://bemusedbackpacker.com/2017/01/16/what-to-expect-
at-i...](https://bemusedbackpacker.com/2017/01/16/what-to-expect-at-israels-
airport-security/)

~~~
chimeracoder
> I travelled to Hebron and Bethlehem last month. Crossing the checkpoint was
> very easy

What's your ethnicity, what passport are you traveling on, and what's your
family's religion (not your own personal religious beliefs, but your
background)? Based on your username, I'm willing to bet that your situation
isn't particularly applicable to the concerns OP expressed.

Israeli security is no joke, and they perform a degree of profiling that is
explicitly illegal in the US (and some European countries, though to a lesser
degree). There's some recent pushback against this and a few recent victories
in Israeli courts for Muslims and non-Muslim Arabs, but the degree of
profiling that occurs legally within Israel is still _way_ further than what
most other countries practice.

People who are from the US and Europe - _particularly_ if they're white and
_especially_ if they're Jewish - generally have a good impression of Israeli
security because they're rarely subjected to the most intrusive parts. People
who are Muslim - especially if they're dark-skinned or Arab-looking - tend to
have much worse experiences.

I know this will get downvoted because it's not the experience that most HN
readers will have, but it _is_ the experience that slim expects that they'll
have, as evidenced by the very question they asked.

~~~
peterwwillis
Well, I can attest to the security at least.

I almost missed flights from and to Israel twice because of their security. In
one case, I took the wrong train and arrived at the airport under an hour from
my flight, so they did extra screening and I barely made it. In the other, as
I was boarding my flight, they refused to let me on (saying I should have
known to come to security early - I was three hours early) until I went
through two rounds of brief interrogation and they brought my carry on bag
through security again, and broke the main zipper, and refused to pay for it.
In another instance, my flight was delayed on the tarmac until several
passengers (who had been sitting quietly) were forceably removed.

------
toomanybeersies
This is a cool initiative.

I've always been a bit bummed that as software engineers, there tend to be
less overseas volunteering opportunities than other forms of engineering.

I'll be honest and admit that I just want to go to cool places and do work
there. There's always lots of roles for civil and mechanical engineers, as
well as doctors, but there's never much need for software engineers in the
jungles of Cambodia or the beaches of the Solomon Islands.

------
John_KZ
Unfortunately the only reasons these "bootcamps" exist is to creater cheaper
workforce for tech companies. They don't provide good education, just
specialization in the areas that the tech companies decided they want.

~~~
forvelin
Isn't it a good step towards a greater good ? If tech companies start to hire
from ME, regardless of country, those people can make an impact for their own
homelands.

~~~
gaius
Depends what you mean by greater good. Offshoring is pretty good for Western
managers. No appreciable benefits for Western shareholders or customers, and
big negatives for Western workers.

What about the offshore workers? They might benefit for a short time until an
even cheaper location opens up, that’s all. Once the jobs are mobile, they
will keep moving.

Far better to create indigenous industries.

------
geverett
I traveled to Gaza to mentor with Gaza Sky Geeks in December. While I was
there Trump decided to recognize Jerusalem as the capital of Israel and the
leader of Hamas decided to respond by declaring a 'Day of Rage'. My writeup of
that experience here: [https://medium.com/@gillianim/what-its-like-in-gaza-on-
a-day...](https://medium.com/@gillianim/what-its-like-in-gaza-on-a-day-of-
rage-8940ce42871) The TL;DR is that the majority of Palestinians are trying to
live normal lives and don't care much about international political chess. As
a foreigner I felt completely safe. Many Jewish people have mentored at Gaza
Sky Geeks and had no issue. I traveled through the Erez checkpoint and didn't
have my passport stamped, though I'm pretty sure some malware got installed on
my computer when they took it away for 'screening'. Logistically, I had to
apply for permits about two months in advance, and you never know whether
you'll get in or not; but all in all my experience at all checkpoints and
entrance/exit to Israel was straightforward. It was an incredible experience
all around and I was so impressed with the Palestinian people in Gaza that I
met. Happy to answer any questions for people thinking of going!

------
cvaidya1986
Tech like chess is a great unifying force.

------
mudil
Is Gaza still controlled by Hamas?

~~~
ExcelSaga
Very much so, yes. They’re not completely unaware of the need for PR though,
so you’re unlikely to be hassled. Unlikely, but I for one wouldn’t take the
chance. I realize that sentiment around this issue is massively polarized, but
the reality is complex. Nobody likes to talk about what persona non grata
Palestinians are in other Arab nations, and the degree to which their current
circumstances are the result of that. The reasoning for that policy of
containment by Arab nations ranges from political expediency, through racism,
into genuine fear. It’s worth understanding the rationale for the whole
spectrum before making a trip to Gaza.

It’s not as simple as people on either extreme of the issue would have you
believe.

------
lurker9
gotta be careful, might get bombed by the israeli's

~~~
dang
Would you please stop posting unsubstantive comments to Hacker News?

[https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html](https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html)

~~~
lurker9
what is not substantive about raising awareness regarding the genocide that is
underway in Palestine? Trying to silence this makes you complicit in the
abuses occurring there.

~~~
dang
The problem with replying properly to a comment like this is that it would
take me perhaps an hour to put the pieces of the reply together and perhaps
another half an hour to go over it to make sure most readers will get what I
mean. The more inflammatory the topic, the more critical it is to avoid
misunderstandings.

It's not that I don't think the question matters or that I don't care or don't
want to reply properly—especially to such a horrible accusation as justifying
genocide. It's that I literally—in the general case—can't. Even 5 of me
couldn't.

So I'll just say that your comment broke this guideline, among others:
"Comments should get more civil and substantive, not less, as a topic gets
more divisive." The only thing that posts like "gotta be careful, might get
bombed by the israeli's" and "what a slimy little weasel he is" do is rile
people up and make this site worse. So you can't post like that here.

[https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html](https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html)

------
Method-X
You don't need an expensive coding bootcamp. I honestly think you'll get more
value from something like [https://edabit.com](https://edabit.com) or
http//codewars.com

~~~
tomcooks
I don't think this is what the website is about, is it? Give it another read.

Edit: ahh I see it was casual spamming of your own site.

