Hacker News new | past | comments | ask | show | jobs | submit login
Demo Day Is Coming: Ranking the 500 Startups Spring 2013 Batch (mattermark.com)
13 points by dmor on July 22, 2013 | hide | past | favorite | 10 comments



I'm one of the batch founders (Binpress). I know most of the companies on the list intimately, and most of the data is completely inaccurate (some is even ridiculous - 2 companies have 0 employees according to this chart).

I hope no one, and especially investors - take this site seriously. We're doing well, but some of the other companies are counting on the upcoming demo day for a last push to their fund raising efforts. Mattermark would serve themselves and their users better by doing some actual diligence on the companies before publishing this data, instead of just aggregating old crunch-base data and Alexa rankings.


I see as an iterative process. Right now the most readily available data are things like Alexa rankings, twitter followers, etc. which are an imperfect proxy for how well a company is doing. As Mattermark gets traction, I am sure that they will add additional, more reliable sources and that companies will have an incentive to keep their information up to date


I see that Mattermark charges $499/month for its "professional" plan. If you're suggesting that the data it's using is imperfect, I'm curious as to why you believe anyone would have an incentive to pay this amount before Mattermark has the ability to acquire better data?

For what it's worth, there are already a ton of other sources of data for private companies (Dun & Bradstreet, Experian, FactSet, infoUSA, CB Insights, PrivCo, etc.).


None of the companies you mention target startups, that's the niche Mattermark is going after. Re: paying and imperfect data, I would turn the argument around: the fact that people are willing to pay money for imperfect data, proves that there is demand for this.


CB Insights and PrivCo absolutely have data on startups, and just because a company is a "startup" doesn't mean that it won't have any visibility in some of the other sources I listed.

As for imperfect data, billions are spent every year on all kinds of weight loss supplements of questionable value. That doesn't mean that there's necessarily going to be demand for your weight loss supplement.

Here, I see little more than an amalgamation of free data from sources like CrunchBase, AngelList, Twitter and LinkedIn along with a proprietary momentum scoring system that is designed to track a startup's growth but for which no efficacy/validation data is presented. I don't see any reference to the specific metrics that are inputs to the scoring system, but the mention of "traffic graphs, app store ranking, inbound links, social media stats" suggests that the aforementioned free data is what is being used.

Of course, "growth" in the abstract is an ambiguous concept and, I would argue, a poor one to try to measure for private companies:

1. What is growing matters. A B2C startup may have a lot more traffic and social media activity than a B2B startup, even though a B2B startup in a lucrative market could be growing its revenue at an exponentially higher rate. This is why angels and venture capitalists will always have to hit the phones and the streets: you can't find the B2B startup that inked $500,000 in deals with Fortune 500 companies in its first six months of existence if you're just looking at Alexa stats or Twitter followers. This information simply isn't being released publicly. If you want an advantage, you have to seek out non-public information. It's why some hedge funds, for instance, go to great lengths to physically monitor in real time the supply chain movements of companies they have or are considering positions in.

2. Very young companies can more easily grow at a faster rate than more mature companies. Going from 0 to 1,000 visitors in the period of a week is generally easier than going from, say, 20,000 to 30,000 in a month, but the former is arguably likely to be a lot less meaningful than the latter for most businesses.

3. How big you need to grow to have a sustainable, highly-profitable business varies substantially from company to company and market to market. In other words, it's all but impossible to distill "growth" down into a single number that allows for an apples to apples comparison of companies in different spaces and at different stages of development.


So you're saying, it's fine to start with mostly incorrect data because if you get traction eventually the data will get better? I'm not sure I follow the logic. In the meantime, they're doing a disservice to the companies they're reporting on and investors who might be buying into it.


Actually, yes. It is a chicken and egg problem, you need to start with something. Re: startups, they can contact Mattermark to correct the information. Re: investors, this is just another datapoint and should certainly not be the main decision factor. Some of them already take a look at this and other data (app store downloads, etc) themselves, this is just more convenient.


Even gaps and errors may not be a problem for a service like this, as long as the site provides the best info available, the info is not deceptively skewed (the errors don't serve some calculated agenda), and the info improves over time.

In particular, the spreadsheet has become much more filled with plausibly-true details in the few hours since this was first posted. Sometimes publishing half-wrong material is the best way to flush out corrections, even if such a process seems a little distasteful.


I agree. It reminds me of the old UNIX saying: "Documentation is like sex. If it is good, it can be really really good. If it is bad... well, it is better than nothing" :)


I am totally down with investing in any company that can deliver the goods with zero employees :-) But more seriously this sort of stuff is just startup-porn as far as I can tell. Kind of like guessing the outfits folks will wear on the red carpet on Oscar night.




Guidelines | FAQ | Lists | API | Security | Legal | Apply to YC | Contact

Search: