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Something that you can buy for 300 Euro outsells something else that costs 30,000 Euro. The two things can be roughly used for the same purpose.

I would not be surprised to hear that more paper and pens are sold in Europe than computers.

In Europe there are many cars for less than 500 euros. Even new ones are something around 6k euros. Those of course aren't sedans like but they're still cars.

In Barcelona we're suffering a process of making the whole city available for bikes and its one of the most wonderful things you can see. Almost everyone uses bikes to go work. It's healthy, it's confortable, and you don't need to pay taxes or insurance. I think it's a brainless option.

BTW: I forgot to mention my city runs a public bycicle program since 8 years and it's a total success. For 40€/year you get full access to a bicycle to move around the city without restrictions. I think it was the smartest move the city did.

I don't think you can pass a technical inspection with a 500€ car. At least not in Germany. Here the only cars you get for that price are obviously broken cars (accident, missing major parts, etc.) or cars that did not pass the inspection.

A Ford Fiesta 92 is around 500 euros in Spain. I don't know how is it in Germany, but here at Spain you even can get cars for 1000 wich are pretty decent and pass the inspection.


How often you buy a vehicle, be it a bike or a car is not that much to do with the price of it, but is more to do with how much space you have and how well the current one works, or whether you are bored of it.

Besides, you cannot accidentally spend £30 to fill up a small drawer unit with bikes, cars or computers, which you can do quite easily with paper and pens, I have found.

Also, the prices are not quite as you present. Some people with not much money manage to buy old cars that cost £100 and some people with a lot of money buy new pushbikes that cost over £5000.

But you can have a bike and a car, like you can have a computer and pens. Sometimes you can use a car, sometimes a bike.

The article doesn't address these statistics. Or kid bikes. Also not seeing motorbikes, which seem quite popular in Europe.

I'm surprised that bike sales are that far off from car sales anyway. Expected most people that grow old enough to ride to buy one.

Very informative otherwise.

>Also not seeing motorbikes, which seem quite popular in Europe.

Yes, mopeds are very, very, popular in Italy.

I don't understand your point as it hasn't been the case for +60 years.

what hasn't been the case? that more sheets of paper and more pencils have been sold than computers? I'm almost certain this is the case, even in the gadget-awash United States.

The article talks about bikes outselling cars. Hence I'm referring to bikes outselling cars. I'll be happy to talk about "paper and more pencils have been sold than computers" on Reddit, but not on HN.

what hasn't been the case was bikes outselling cars. It hasn't happened. And not it is. Seems significant.

> what hasn't been the case was bikes outselling cars. It hasn't happened.

Are you kidding me? Of course it happened! How many cars do you think were sold in 1900?

The statement we're talking about is "... it hasn't been the case for 60+ years". 1900 was 113 years ago.

I think he means the bikes outselling cars part

It's significant when you look at the numbers of people who commute on their bike daily rather than their car. In Copenhagen something like 50% of adults ride their bike to work. I'm sure it's the same in e.g. the Netherlands.

There is a 180% tax on cars in Denmark which is a pretty major disincentive for driving a vehicle. I have a friend who bought a used VW Passat wagon (5 or 6 years old) in Denmark for $90,000 USD.

Having cycled Copenhagen, I have to say it's wonderful. Everyone is on bikes all the time, and the city always prioritizes bicycles over other vehicles. I'd love for the same to be true in Palo Alto, but realistically a high vehicle tax would have to be done at a state level. The problem is that California is so diverse, that there is no way a farmer in Fresno or Bakersfield is going to be able to handle a large auto tax.

The only way we're going to be able to get people out of cars here in the Bay Area is to increase spending on cycling infrastructure, as well as transit. Thankfully with cycling infrastructure, many cities, including Palo Alto, are finally getting serious about making more bicycle boulevards and bike lanes. For a long time cities in the Bay Area have either just payed lip service to the idea, or have been mired in red tape so that they couldn't roll out new cycling infrastructure without an environmental review.

On the transit front, I'm not so optimistic. There's just such a quagmire of competing transit services in the region, that it's impossible to get any kind of a cohesive system together. Either you have a central authority which dictates the entire route map which will tend to neglect various regions, or you get what we have now which is hyper-localized transit authorities which don't service the needs of the region very well. As a result, companies just implement their own systems (ala Google, Facebook, Apple, Box, etc.) which are exclusionary and have become icons of gentrification.

There is a 180% tax on cars in Denmark which is a pretty major disincentive for driving a vehicle.

True, but Danes buy cars nonetheless (especially if they have kids). It's fairly typical to only have one car per family, though.

I have a friend who bought a used VW Passat wagon (5 or 6 years old) in Denmark for $90,000 USD.

A used Passat from 2008 will cost you roughly $30,000 USD [1]. Expensive, I know, but nowhere near $90,000.

1) http://www.bilbasen.dk/brugt/bil?Category=P&PriceFrom=0&Pric...

Did you read the article?

I read the article and think that he/she makes a good point. The point this person is trying to hit is: does this imply that more people do not like the style of older bicycles or that people are making lifestyle changes to ride bikes instead of driving cars or that the economy is not the greatest and people are getting bikes because of it? The article compares 2 markets (bikes and cars) where it doesn't fully reflect the market (only shows new cars/bikes). The full market is probably quite a bit harder to get data for (and that's probably why they don't show it) but it would really give a much better indication of what is happening.

I almost feel like this article is misleading because bicycle production is much higher than automotive production. See the following link under "Bicycle vs. car production"


> Something that you can buy for 300 Euro

And repair yourself when something goes wrong.

I have a car, it works well. I haven't taken it to go to work since end of may. I don't plan on buying a new one until this one dies of old age, hopefully in a decade or so.

Basic car maintenance falls under responsible ownership.

I'm a cyclist, but I know how to fix the common things on my vehicle.

I'm sure there are people that own bikes that are clueless in fixing them, much the same as there are people that own cars that haven't a clue. That doesn't mean there aren't people out there that could strip and rebuild either on their own.

Totally agree. I think this is a case of scrambling for headline before press date. There is nothing here but common sense.

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