My point is that it's not even remotely practical to convince enough of the population to "value privacy" so much that these things won't be built or to even remotely hinder them. The population of earth is just too large. "HN readers" aren't some magic special bunch that cannot be replaced.
> This mercenary mentality is not some unchangeable part of human nature
No, it's just basic game theory. The more people that refuse to sign up for these "unethical" things, the higher the reward for those that do. And those rewards are very small compared to the pressures involved.
So even if you succeed in convincing a ton of hackers to join your cause, you've done what? Raised the salary from $250K to $750K a year for the people that do defect? That's nice, but the actual effect on privacy is zero.
"My point is that it's not even remotely practical to convince enough of the population to "value privacy" so much that these things won't be built or to even remotely hinder them. The population of earth is just too large."
When you get enough people educated and caring enough about some issue do something about it, what you have is a social movement. Such social movements have a long history of bringing about significant changes, especially when they are well organized.
If there are enough HN users caring and doing something about privacy, there is no doubt in my mind that positive, significant change will come about. HN users might not be "magical", but they are pretty special in that most of them are very technologically savvy (especially compared to the typical internet user), with a deep knowledge and understanding of the very technologies which make the surveillance state so effective.
Knowledge is power, and we have to recognize that collectively we hold a lot of power in our hands. Our collaboration with the surveillance state or our opposition to it, our advocacy for and work to build privacy-respecting alternatives could be a major game changer.
Quite apart from the effectiveness of such opposition are the ethics behind it. Some of us believe that we should do what's right even when the odds of success are against us.
The argument of inevitability is the argument of a fatalist.
Yeah, so what if the incentives increase on the other side?
That's what hard work is made of. No one said this is easy. Far from it, it's hard.
And if its inevitable, so note that the success of the government to pass CISPA and its variants was considered by some to be inevitable.
And hackers have generally been at the forefront of keeping the net safe.
It's only after the government started going after them, and SV built a narrative of - interesting challenges-talent-fair,just but outsized rewards, that the equation shifted.
> This mercenary mentality is not some unchangeable part of human nature
No, it's just basic game theory. The more people that refuse to sign up for these "unethical" things, the higher the reward for those that do. And those rewards are very small compared to the pressures involved.
So even if you succeed in convincing a ton of hackers to join your cause, you've done what? Raised the salary from $250K to $750K a year for the people that do defect? That's nice, but the actual effect on privacy is zero.