Either way, a very cool interactive experience. The only criticism I have is that they completely ignored mobile/tablet/non-Flash -- it's a Flash-based game, but if you visit the site on a non-Flash device you don't even get an alternate "Sorry, your device is not supported" message.
I brought it up because I'd have an easier time seeing a label run by an ex-goon engaging in this kind of marketing, as opposed to one like Atlantic.
"Here's the deal, folks. You do a commercial - you're off the artistic roll call, forever. End of story. Okay? You're another whore at the capitalist gang bang and if you do a commercial, there's a price on your head. Everything you say is suspect and every word that comes out of your mouth is now like a turd falling into my drink."
- Bill Hicks
I felt something playing this game. It has surprisingly good ambiance and seeing a bunch of pixel characters who have accepted their fate and were waiting for death, to me, gave it a level of emotional attachment I did not expect after I read the tag 'advergame'.
One thing you have to realize is that it's very hard to make games nowadays without some kind of income. If you are lucky, you only have to slum it for a few years and then you make a hit on the side. But more often, you have to do whatever it takes, unless you are willing to keep your day job.
I actually still agree with the Bill Hicks quote, but I feel there is some wiggle room when what is produced is actually a game, and in the end, does not fit the constraint of standard advertising.
IMO if more advertising were like this, the world would be a better place, and Bill Hicks would have been less angry.
And here I will quote Tool's Eulogy, which was about Bill Hicks, if you didn't know:
"He had a voice so strong and loud and I
Swallowed his facade cuz I'm so
Eager to identify with
Someone above the ground,
Someone who seemed to feel the same,
Someone prepared to lead the way, with
Someone who would die for me."
Just because a voice is loud and you agree with it, doesn't necessarily mean that it is entirely correct. I love the shit out of Bill Hicks and I still feel the world would be a better place if he had lived long enough to foster the change he felt he needed. But I still don't feel his quote applies to this game.
Regardless, I agree with your points. It's not always bad to sell something if you want to get the rest of your works heard. It's all a big game, and most people have to play to some degree to be able to do what they love.
Sure.. but then don't go mixing those two things up. There is work (entertainment or otherwise), and there is art. That some people cry unfair because they want their pie and eat it isn't really my concern.
I didn't argue that the game creator is somehow evil, I just actually feel my brain hurting from dumbness intruding when I read people talk about "artistical merit" in the context of this "game" (the gameplay mechanics are a bit limited to call it that, but that's a whole other can of worms). The response to that? "Yeah, but" and downmoderation. Oh well, oh lol. What else is new.
On another, the motivation and goal of the creation, at least to me, outweighs such considerations by order of magnitude. And on that level I don't consider that, or much anything really, "art" by any stretch of my imagination.
Which means yes, I would consider the exact same thing art or not art depending on by whom, why and how it was created and presented.
That may not be fair, but it's my firm opinion anyway. Yeah yeah, people gotta eat. I know that. (I do think that technically even that is a decision, but I'll accept that in this in context.) But what people do NOT "absolutely have to" is to consider themselves as artists, or to be considered by me as such. They'll have to settle with mediocre.
Eulogy was about L. Ron Hubbard.
It was stirring and idealistic when I was in my 20's.
However over the years my instinctive distrust of the world of commerce diminishes as I realise that humans live, swim and breath in commerce. It was here before art-with-a-capital-A and it will outlive it.
The other thing to remember is that art-with-a-capital-A was largely an invention of the Romantic movement. Artist-as-lone-hero and all that. It's not an eternal truth and in fact it creates a fictional view of the Artist that I distrust more over time.
Who is talking about commerce? It's about using emotion to lead people to make irrational choices. If you need rice and I farm rice, and I sell you some rice, that's commerce. It has however NOTHING to do with anything Bill Hicks ever ranted about. So don't flatter yourself I'd say, your insight isn't really one.
"The other thing to remember is that art-with-a-capital-A was largely an invention of the Romantic movement"
The idea that washing your hands is a great idea for doctors and in general is also fairly recent; so?
"in fact it creates a fictional view of the Artist"
No, it simply raised the bar. How can it be fictional if people existed and exist that fit the description? That's just wishful thinking on your part so you don't feel too bad for going back to sleep.
You also make the claim that all advertising is about trying to make people make irrational choices. But if I post a billboard that says "Come try our pancakes!", am I really trying to make you behave irrationally?
There is certainly plenty of "bad" advertising, and campaigns that artists would be better off not associating themselves with, but the blanket statement just doesn't fit.
Michelangelo. Shakespeare. Leonardo Da Vinci. David Lynch. William Wordsworth. Alfred, Lord Tennyson.
All of these people, and many more, made things that were essentially adverts - commissioned pieces designed to promote a particular institution.
doesn't constitute an argument either, does it. So there's not really anything there to argue against; just an assertion. Meanwhile, to me it's "fairly obvious" that this ain't art, and therefore "the fuck" is perfectly sufficient.
"Quoting a comedian is not really an argument."
Oh yeah, because a comedian is by definition funny, and not ever insightful.
Good thing people don't react in a butthurt, predictable fashion, or anything. Haha.
Kinda spiking the irony meter here. You asserted that there's no artistic value and, what, expected people to accept that as a valuable part of the conversation?
Commercial music? Artists who make a living selling their work? Commissioned pieces? Art doesn't have to be produced by the idle rich and the impoverished and starving. It's hard to define art precisely, but your definition seems to be at odds with the generally accepted one.
Are we to assume that Mr. Hicks never promoted his gigs, and performed them for free?
Everyone's selling something. Try talking to an actual professional artist and ask them if they're following their dreams and expanding boundaries or if they're mass-producing different variations of the same 2 paintings they've been able to sell consistently in between kissing asses at galleries.
Well duh. However, I see what you did there. Why the arbitrary qualification? Why does it have to be a professional artist, why not an albino one, or someone who only has 8 fingers, or an artist period? Oh right, because then your argument kinda falls on its face.
From this comment all you've really said is that you and Bill Hick (probably) wouldn't think this is art. Nobody here could argue with that. But it says nothing about what art is or who is an artist.
Bill Hicks was referring to talking about something you basically only have a monetary interest in.
> Chex Quest, made by Digital Café, is a total conversion of The Ultimate Doom. It was released in boxes of Chex Cereal in 1996, becoming the first game to be included in a cereal box. When it was released, it increased sales by over 200%. It then went on to win both the Golden Reggie Award for Promotional Achievement, and the Silver EFFIE Award for Advertising Effectiveness.
Get off my lawn.
Oh, and then go back and play The Legend of Zelda all the way to the end, and then come back here and say it was good.
Also, you have a lawn? Lucky bastard.
I personally don't believe that repetition in electronic music even implies a sub-par track, but that's highly subjective of course, and we know where you stand.
Some of the most groundbreaking and beautiful music to me is found on the Basic Channel and Chain Reaction labels, with tracks that are extremely minimal and would probably sound repetitive to many listeners.
Plus 8 has a long history of incredible and innovative artists and tracks. It really depends on how you define electronic as well. If Chain Reaction is repetitive, Plus 8 less so, Warp less so, but even less are labels like Wax Trax! that had much more dynamic and traditional song structures from their artists (industrial). Do you consider them electronic? Subjective. Labels like Mo Wax delivered far less repetitive offerings than Warp artists, and just as compelling. Ghostly International takes takes us back to more traditional electronic offering if Mo Wax and Wax Trax! aren't 'electronic' enough for one's definition.
Really, there are just too many to name, even with the constraint of stripping out electronic music subjectively deemed 'repetitive'.
But I take your point though. Warp Records, especially at a particular time in electronic music's history, was one of those special and legendary labels that every genre seems to have one or two of. They were home to some of the most compelling and innovative artists of their generation, and rather than having just one or two, they were home to many. Might be the best electronic music label in history for strength of talent and how deep their roster went.
And I too have a lawn, but you don't need to get off it, -instead you can hang out on it and bring your vinyl. I've got a few crates of some incredibly good and rare discs and a 1200 on which to play them ;)
On that note, if you have not seen this site yet, be prepared to have the rest of your afternoon's productivity destroyed:
I posted to first version of the site to Hubski a while ago but I can't find it. I think the author has updated it since then, but the general look and flow is the same. Incredible wealth of historical knowledge, complete with audio examples.
But as you say, it's not a bad thing... just like how a lot of electronic music today is also not a bad thing.
Although I would add that Ninja Tune, Rephlex, Brainfeeder and Planet Mu all have some great artists too.
Actionscript 3 was such an enjoyable language to code in, though I haven't been able to use it professionally in over a year due to demand; the extent of my 'interactive' work has been hacky, ill-performing CSS3 transforms, and WOW are they limited.
It is both funny and sad that in these days of the "open" web it is actually much, much more difficult to get good cross platform results when doing anything with graphics/sound.
What's more today the first cause of WebGL not working lies more in the graphics card periphery. OpenGL drivers on Windows are often an aftertought given DirectX prevalence, and on Linux some drivers are simply unstable with 3D acceleration, regardless of WebGL. Besides, short of software fallbacks like llvm-pipe or OSX, you can't invent features not supported by the card. Onve overriden WebGL actually works well on my embedded HD2000, but bugs in the driver make the whole thing randomly unstable, hence it is blacklisted by browsers (chrome://gpu even lists and links to bug reports, and lists Flash Stage3D as blacklisted too).
As for number counting, while the number of people running into WebGL problems exists, it has been drastically reduced since a year ago, when the number of people running into Flash problems for years, and is not shrinking.
ALso, there's not just graphics on X-Type, but correctly timed HTML5 audio too.
: "Override software rendering list" in chrome://flags
The story with Flash was much more single-vendor-dependent despite the half-hearted noises Adobe made over the years about supporting alternative implementations.
That said, I've started playing with Three.js lately and it's impressively straight forward and filled with capability.
These days I do Objective C, but I still love AS3 & the Flash API. I just wish browsers would implement it natively (a JS version of the API), as opposed to the HTML canvas and (currently) flaky support for audio.
That's the kind of game design that the game industry needs to learn from.
Plus it's not like most AAA games nowadays punish you for anything at all to begin with, so having you actually hit a situation where you have to experience the inconvenience of loading a save that takes you back 30 seconds is ultimately just a waste of everyone's time.
Last I will add that I am not a gamer as an adult but I thoroughly enjoyed this "game". My 5 year old daughter completed the game after I did an had no trouble whatsoever with the controls and the story line (I read the text for her). There is definable a market out there for non-gamers who would invest more time into games if the target was not as narrow. This market is likely larger than the Call of Duty/SOCOM market.
So to wrap up.. This is no my cup-of-tea per se, but it is one of those things that can cross boundaries and bring new customers into a market if executed as well as this is.
Dubstep Guns: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hDlif8Km4S4
It is tongue in cheek and that is part of the charm.
WARNING, POTENTIAL SPOILER ALERT:
If you beat the game you see a video clip of him that is specific to the game.
I'm using Chrome stable on Ubuntu 12.04. I have no extensions besides Adblock Plus. This is the only page I've encountered that crashes Flash on my computer.
I love electronic music. But, I can not get into Skrillex or American Dubstep for that manner. I feel like im missing something...
"That's the worst turnip I've ever tasted!"
"Sir, that's a daikon radish."
"Well, then, it's not bad then."
I think a lot of it has to do with expectation. I find brostep good cleaning music, actually -- the quick change of pace works for it. I also find a bit of emotional release from it -- there's something in the contrast for me, at least.
But nobody I've ever met likes every type of music. :)
Dubstep can be awesome however.
Dubstep was invented in Europe in the 90s and came out of the early techno scene. The shit these douches are making in California is completely unrelated.
If you're correcting someone on nomenclature please be more accurate, and if you're trolling, please be funnier.
I live down the street from Hardwax, for fuck's sake.
The UK scene has its own independent subbass heritage. People in the london scene at least aren't generally that aware of what comes out of europe, especially back in the web 1.0 era we're talking about.
Check out this from 2000: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=doMX6su9Ue0
And this from 95: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sjQZxMoF8Kc
Both pure london sounds.
Burial in particular was already doing that sound without having ever having heard of basic channel, until kode9 showed it to him.
Also living next to hardwax doesn't qualify you to know about tunes. My mum used to live near blackmarket and she hasn't got any dubs at all.
EDIT: Also technically the R&S lot took that sound from english people like Mad Professor in the 80s :P
That's why people differentiate dance music so carefully. When people talk about dubstep they aren't talking about a halfstep drumloop and a falling 808, they're talking about Third Base, Plastic People, Big Apple, Music House and Red Stripe. When people talk about berlin techno they're not just talking about 909s on the up and white noise filter bleeps, they're talking about Hardwax, Berghain and D&M.
The internet has kindof put a top to this and it's a shame. The creative engine of the london underground which produced dubstep and everything before it is chasing its own tail right now, devoid of new ideas, and it's partly for this reason IMO.
I do wish it wasn't Flash though. Not that I have anything against Flash itself when used the right way, but I feel like it's really hard to "own" a Flash game.
Unlike, say, iOS apps that you can download and come back to 6 months later, Flash games are a lot more of a flash in the pan (sorry…) and I think it's a shame in cases like this where the end result is so great and so much work obviously went into it.
Edit: And took me from somewhere near 100% battery to 67%. Crazy
I figured this was for an album or something. I hadn't heard his music before, but it is now on my radar.
Well done and spotted.
On how we all told each other that blowing into the cartridge actually worked, but it didn't. I used to do it as well of course, I'm amazed by how that "technique" turned into some sort of urban legend.
Seriously though this is awesome! Much better than Halo 4 A+
EDIT: SPOKE TO SOON THERE IS DUBSTEP! Sweet.
the game was a bit simple, but have nice touches.
Here we have a modern artist, heard by millions, being swamped with prices, yet his music when in the context with a game which even was especially designed with the music in mind, can't hold up to the old classics in any way.
Soundtrack of most N64/SNES Games >>> Skrillex :D
To all downvoters: i personally am annoyed by the music after 2 minutes of playing, can't deal with this
Out of curiosity, isn't going to a page where you already know from the start you aren't going to have anything nice to say a bit, trollish? :)