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Why aren’t you more serious? (rubenerd.com)
123 points by luu 10 months ago | hide | past | favorite | 90 comments



I'm the author of the post. Sincerely appreciate all the words here, this legit made my morning.

I wonder if part of this has to do with fewer people writing in their own space anymore. Most people post in sanitised UIs of Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, etc. So seeing a personal page is confronting, unless it's a vanilla theme. Not sure. Either way, I'd love to see more people maintain personal blogs again. And with RSS! Maybe we need to resurrect something like Technorati.

Cheers :)


I think it's precipitated by the shift of the Web from an early-adopters world that is mostly exploring the idea of being online, to one where the property-ownership ladder has taken precedence.

The idea of being a "serious professional" is entangled in that of "the personal brand" and thus in your identity being your property. But it's not just that: it's also that this property has some assumed virtuous pattern of development(in the sense of Aristotle), and something that is not that pattern is incorrect, and possibly threatening because it disrupts their preconceptions of what is right - and it's always a preconceived thing, young kids aren't afflicted by this. They'd like to take the content - because it's valuable - while protecting those beliefs, so an urge rises to lash out, dismiss everything, give "helpful hints" about what to do better, or call it degenerate, because changing a belief is hard within oneself.


What you're saying here makes sense to me, except the part about kids. It's typically kids I see going back and fourth with "No, mine's better... No no no, mine's better-er! Yours is dumb..." The ability to accept differences is something I observe more often in the mature & wise.


> I wonder if part of this has to do with fewer people writing in their own space anymore.

It's not just the blogosphere. This trend is everywhere. People don't just post vacation photos for friends, they try to become influencers. They don't throw parties, they try to be come DJs, they don't hack on little open source projects, they try to start passive income lifestyle businesses.

Everything's a hustle, everything's for money.

I don't know if this is born out of economic necessity because the middle class is hollowing out, or more just culture shifting to equate "success" with "rich". But it seems like fewer and fewer things are just... fun... anymore. It's always gotta be for something.


Hey mate, great post! I think that there's a slight renaissance in regards to blogging and personal websites. Of course, I could be biased as I "resurrected" mine two weeks ago :).

I will be building a new RSS reader/platform soonish. I will definitely think on the topic of resurrecting Technorati.


"Sanitized" Twitter certainly has that conflict too - and its relatively accepted there that no, people don't just post about one thing if they don't want to, while at the same time some people do complain about it.


I was thinking more in terms of the UI/decorations, but this is a fair point. It's curious people don't complain that I talk about trains/coffee/anime among my FreeBSD and OpenZFS tweets. Maybe it is about expectations.


Defs +1 for personal blogs and RSS feeds. That way you can add them to personalised webrings as well using something like openring.


You have a very nice website. some_furry's is great too.

This is the kind of thing I miss from the web of the 90s and early 2000s. A vocal minority might complain that it doesn't look like Medium with the useless hero image of a laptop in a desk, the 45 trackers and analytics and paywall, but I silently enjoy both the content and the personality, so thank you both.

Might be the culture I live in or I'm getting old and stopping to care, but I frankly wouldn't have a problem putting this as a reference link in some internal documentation or in Slack. We have a Manga Guide to Databases in our work library since forever, so maybe the mascot is fitting. A furry-themed blog would fit too, of course, as we have a few O'Reilly books (but none with a wolf unfortunately). Jokes aside, I find the mascots of both sites tasteful and nicely drawn, btw.


Thanks, that really means a lot :). I agree, we definitely lost something special after the early 2000s. We got standards compliance and rid ourselves of IE which is awesome, but I think we lost a part of the web's soul in the process.

I've been preoccupied lately with how we can encourage more people to blog again. I think everyone has something interesting to say, and shouldn't be constrained by what a specific social network permits (technically, or with content).


Maybe people don’t read much content on blogs with rss these days.


That's unfortunately true. Remember when Twitter et.al. used to support RSS? Social networks had a vested interest in removing it, because it means you don't need to go to their pages. It's up to all of us to bring it back.


Why not run ads?

Not trying to say you should just interested in your motivation :)


It's a reasonable question. I'm not against advertising per se, but thesedays it comes with a lot of tracking and JavaScript baggage that I don't want. My blog also isn't there to make money, it pays for itself by being something relaxing and useful (for me) to write.


> Either way, I'd love to see more people maintain personal blogs again.

The basic problem is that in terms of foregone consulting hours, writing a personal blog and hosting it using custom software is roughly the equivalent of purchasing and then purposely totaling several Teslas per year.


I'm not sure that's entirely true.

Things you need to run a blog:

1. Server, preferably secure. This can be set up in an afternoon, maybe on a Saturday or Sunday. You can also probably find Ansible or Chef scripts to automate the provisioning.

2. A directory on the server to hold website content - time to set up is dependent on latency to your server, but is essentially instant.

3. A web server set up to serve content in said directory - probably an hour or two to get a reasonably simple setup.

4. Probably an SSL cert - can be automated with Let's Encrypt, including making your server aware of the cert. Initial setup, maybe another hour.

5. Something to make the content. I like Hugo, but there's lots of other static site generators. Choose a pre-made theme that is the least objectionable to you. It might take another afternoon to get this all set up between browsing themes and writing some seed content.

6. Something to get the content to your server (or you can just keep the whole setup on the server!). I use rsync to deploy a build whenever I commit to the Git repo holding my blog.

Nice to haves:

1. A domain name. It makes your website easier to find, and people are more likely to remember that over an IP address. This will be about a half hour to an hour to set up depending on how shitty your registrar is.

All in all, I spend $5 a month running the server that hosts my blog. I maintain it and built it during hours when I wouldn't have been paid or worked anyways. So I'm out $60. Everything else is free (mostly as in beer, but some is also as in the other kind of free).


And if you really don't want to think about the server, Jekyll/Hugo/Next.js should all work pretty well with Github pages.


To clarify, what I meant was more that if you're using something like Hugo then (for you) that's off-the-shelf software, not custom software. Think about how millions of dollars of consulting revenue the people who actually wrote that framework probably turned down in order to create that instead.

Not to mention that once you've created software like that, each individual blog post might well take literally hundreds of hours to write.


But that's a total non-sequitur? You don't need to write your own blog system, so why assume that's what people would have to do?

(Also, a basic blog system is really not that much work if you decide to go for it)


> You don't need to write your own blog system, so why assume that's what people would have to do?

Fair enough, I just assumed it was running software the author had written himself, didn't see that it was actually Hugo.


That applies equally well to many other activities. Think how many potential consulting hours squandered when you were instead wasting time traveling the world, falling in love, tending a garden, raising children, cooking meals for friends, writing your memoir, dying after a long, satisfying life.


I'm 53 and still laugh at fart jokes, let the dog lick my face, and wear shirts with collars as "office camouflage" only when necessary. I am way ahead of you on the timeline and will let you know when it's time to grow up.

Media publishing is about having a target market and not worrying about the segments you don't hit. Late night comedians don't worry about not having Rush Limbaugh listeners in their demographic and vice versa.

As you rightly say, your blog posts are part therapy and part knowledge transfer. That doesn't mean the "technical publishing" meta-tag doesn't also reasonably apply and brings a segment of readers with certain expectations.

I really appreciate that you opened the curtain a bit on their concerns and your disdain for them.

They aren't your customers and never will be

Saddle up the unicorn and keep riding


The day I stop laughing at fart jokes, enjoying doggie kisses, and start dressing like a standard-issue, business casual office drone, I hope someone hauls me off to a doctor to get checked out.


Amen! If loving those things is wrong, I don’t want to be right.


> Late night comedians don't worry about not having Rush Limbaugh listeners in their demographic and vice versa.

I mean, the lefty late-nights may not be hitting that market right now, but that doesn't mean that a competent one couldn't hit it without compromising the model.


I really wish we didn't put so much pressure to be professional and serious all the time. Working takes up 1/3 of my life currently and I can't actually be my self. Another third is sleeping. So for only 1/3 of my time I can actually act like my self. I hate that there is a pressure to talk a certain, act a certain way, express my self a certain way. I think we really need more of a emphasis on being human, less "circle back" and "work streams", more jokes, more smiling and experimenting.


I am shocked and dismayed that people are emailing you because your blog is too fun and diverse.

It reminds me of my wish for anyone who is even semipopular on the internet, whether it be through a blog, Youtube channel, etc. I wish for them to ignore the comments. Log into your email, select all, and delete. That might be healthier, not just for you but for the world, because you would not be dragged down by their negativity.

I wish that you and others could remember that it takes a certain kind of person even to begin writing an email to a stranger with a blog. They are likely neurotic, https://web.archive.org/web/20170430010047/https://www.truth...

I am surprised by what people say in the comments sections of various websites. But I am equally surprised when I see the author take them seriously and give them the dignity of a reply. Or a Youtuber who seems like a healhty happy intelligent person with interesting content start to talk about some of the crazy things people have been saying in the comments. "Why are you even listening to those people?" I think. But I try to remember that I myself would probably be tempted to wonder if they're right or to start replying --- and get ensnared.


If you're browsing the site on a mobile phone like I was, you probably won't see the image of the mascot on the right-hand-side. Even if you click the "mascot" link, you'll just go to a text description of it.

The image is here: https://rubenerd.com/rubi@1x.jpg


That was so confusing for me. I got worried that he must have pulled the shockingly inappropriate mascot.

It's the socks. Those mismatched socks are clearly triggering the kinds of people who serially straighten out picture frames.


Anybody who takes the time to email a blog author and shriek about the (very modest) anime girl they have on their website clearly has problems.

I'm starting to worry a little about the number of "people exist who do that??" moments I've had lately.


No, stupidity can't possibly be unexpected.


Speaking of the mascot, I admit I was a little put off by Rubi (that's her name!) at first. But, upon further review, she's just a normal schoolgirl-looking character with mismatched socks, drawn in an anime style. She's totally SFW, so, I can only guess my negative association was initially driven by "anime girl" stereotypes. She doesn't turn me off from wanting to read any more of the author's posts, provided they have something on a topic I'm interested in.


[flagged]


Eh. It doesn't look "hiked up" at all to me, and, truthfully, the outfits the cheer team wore at my high school show a lot more skin.


See, here's the bug in "I know it when I see it" benchmarks for lewdness: they only actually report on the beholder's internal reaction. You're only telling us it made you uncomfortable because your brain fetishized some part of the image.


Hey that’s a cute drawing


Aw thanks, I'll let my partner know :).


Shamefully I have to admit that I originally created my blog because I thought it would help my career.

But posts like this one here show me that it was cargo culting from the get go.

I have much to say, but to date dismissed most of it, because (oh the irony) I thought I shouldn't make this personal space of mine too personal.


It's also totally valid to separate different aspects if that's what you are more comfortable with (e.g. have two distinct feeds). That's the nice thing about your own blog, you get to make those decisions as you prefer.


That struggle is real, especially when grappling with imposter syndrome or a shy personality too. Half the reason I love reading personal blogs is seeing the author's personality.

An old boss of mine said you can't truly fake enthusiasm. That's stuck with me since.


I just went over my most recent post and the overwhelming feeling is... embarrassment? Stage fright? Cringe?

Do you ever get back to any of your old posts and think "wow, this is just bad"?

I mean, I envy you for being able to just own all this, complete with the blog mascot, which to me is the ultimate power move here.

How does one obtain this power?


Definitely! My old posts are cringe to an extreme.

I think turning 30 helped with some perspective; I don't care [as much] anymore. "Yeah my partner is a manga artist and drew me a mascot, so what?" In my early 20s that wouldn't have even computed.

But I think the best thing I've found is to own it. Quote your past self, make lighthearted fun of it, and show how you've grown and what you've learned. Between that and not taking things too seriously, it also disarms a lot of trolls.

It's also helped in unexpected ways. People at AsiaBSDCon remembered me as the guy who blogs about BSD. I got Allan and Benedict laughing on a BSD Now podcast at a bad joke I wrote in an otherwise-technical post. That felt really good!

I empathise that it's trivial to discuss, but hard to internalise. CBT would say if you do it enough times, you feel better about it. That's probably the real answer.


"I originally created my blog because I thought it would help my career."

I did too and it worked very well.


> inclusion of posts about cooking garlic are a waste of time and somehow detract from my serious technical and political posts.

I know people who would say that everything could use more garlic. I suspect that would also extend to blogs.


I generally take the amount of garlic in any given recipe to be a suggestion. I find that, most of the time, doubling the garlic makes a much more flavorful dish.


If my neighbors can't smell I ate garlic last week, it's not enough garlic.


Personal blog posts are like garlic: they keep away the undead?


In some ways I feel like I have the opposite problem. I like to occasionally write tech related articles but my blog mainly features information related to my hobby and that’s what most people follow my blog for. Now I feel weird if I want to post a tech related article because everyone will get notifications for it when they’re expecting hobby related posts


I struggled with this too. I used to have separate blogs for different interests (especially anime, for fear of judgement, some of which has since come true in some of the comments below!) Eventually I merged them back to save on maintenance, and I'm glad I did.

People should expect that a personal site necessarily has your interests. I don't think it'd be weird at all for you to post tech-related content. And you never know, there might be an intersection with your exiting readers you didn't know about.


How are the notifications handeled? If it's by RSS, you could set up an RSS feed for just your hobby posts, which I imagine have a separate tag.


Email through jetpack plugin on a Wordpress blog. I have actually thought about looking into suppressing certain things but I am not sure there are many options for this plugin. I could create a different post type maybe as this only sends out updates on regular blog posts.


Tired: RSS

Wired: ActivityPub


I've never understood the need to be an ongoing drone. Is this really the sort of thing people want in life, or is it from some notion of work makes the person? Some days I love what I do, most days I like what I do, occasionally I hate what I do. In none of those days do I define myself by what I do.

Good on you for writing what you want to. If someone wants to focus purely on a single subject that's great FOR THEM. Personally, I'm rather saddened by the fact that I keep starting and stopping blogs for decades; I'm also thrilled to see someone who has kept one up for 15 years. Great stuff!


To both rubenerd and some_furry - keep doing what you're doing. You write articles for your own enjoyment and your own communities. As you probably realize - you have no obligation to cater to anyone but yourself. :)


ahh yes be more "serious"

I wrote a collection of posts about a political event a few years ago. They were aimed a politically naive posh young professionals.

The posts were sweary, crude, but crucially written in my _own_ style.

The actual subject was very serious.

when they were widely shared on facebook (~37k impressions of 2 minutes or longer) I was amused by the "Oh I do wish they wouldn't swear" or "why are they making dick/vag jokes"

They couldn't seem to grasp that if I'd have written in in a dry, clean style, not only would they have not read it, but they wouldn't have understood my point.

Humour, irreverence and swearing are all tools to convey a meaning, point or story. Used well (I am fully willing to admit that I have not been masterful in my use) they can create a mental image far stronger than any other metaphor.

So I commend your post, you dick. <3


Serious question: Is Shatner being serious here? https://youtu.be/lul-Y8vSr0I?t=20


He later did an entire album called "Has Been" in this style, so I suspect so. Here's a taste:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ainyK6fXku0

I know this because Ben Folds had a hand in it, and I'm a long-time Ben Folds fan.


What? Has Been is 1. Great and 2. definitely not in the style of his rocketman cover

After the success of Has Been, he did go back to the corny covers style of making music though

There's literally only one cover song on Has Been, so it seems really weird to put the album in the same category


A gawdawful hairpiece ....


Rock on - so true - the web used to be a safe place to express oneself; now, saying the wrong thing results in hundreds of negative comments and F/J-finger wagging.

It would be great to get back to more individualism on the web.


I still can't understand why he'd write about cooking garlic! ~


> They claim that my writing is too jovial, my site mascot drawn by Clara is inappropriate,

I get a lot of similar feedback for using art of my fursona in my blog posts (i.e. for the purpose of added emotional inflection).

The feedback was sufficient enough to warrant a dedicated response post: https://soatok.blog/2020/07/09/a-word-on-anti-furry-sentimen...

Personally, I find the rubenerd site mascot to be tasteful. The shades of green and blue complement each other well, and the skirt's length isn't risque enough to raise my eyebrows. (But then again, I'm not exactly a prude.)


So many comments. Just wanted to say, never seen furry stuff before and found the art on the linked page quite pleasant. I’m flabbergasted that this is some kind of issue for anyone. Methinks the lady doth protest too much. I for one found my furiousity piqued by the imagery.


The best part is, them protesting against the furry stuff has brought it more to everyone's attention. They've written paragraphs and paragraphs on this thread alone, which sort of draws the eye. I love the Streisand effect.


I think most of the issue comes from the fact that there is such a thing as a "furry fetish." In fact, if you have "showdead" on, you'll see a couple of comments referring to furries as "degenerates," which I think comes from this association. I, for one, find the blue and white fox to be pretty amusing, kind of like the "this is fine" dog.


The people who say "degenerate" are the people with a fetish for seeking out targets to hate because their lives are empty.


Put yourself in the shoes of someone who wants to send these articles to their manager to support an idea/project of theirs. It absolutely detracts from the professionalism of the post.

Any joe-schmo can string together smart sounding words. You need to signal to me that I need to take these words seriously, and when you mix in your otherworldly passions, I can’t take them seriously, it’s too unfamiliar to me.

Aside from that, what it is about the anime and furry culture that pushes its participants to include it in everything? Every once in a while, I see a post on the cringe subreddit of some young man who has peppered anime and fursonas all throughout a school presentation. What is driving the need to include this in everything?


> Put yourself in the shoes of someone who wants to send these articles to their manager to support an idea/project of theirs.

That is, frankly, your problem and not the author's. The author has already taken the time to distill their knowledge into text, put it online, and allowed you free access to it.

> It absolutely detracts from the professionalism of the post.

From the author's perspective that may be a feature not a bug. Maybe they don't want to come across as professional. It's their writing and their little corner of the Internet. They can create as they please.

> You need to signal to me that I need to take these words seriously

No, they need do no such thing. If you want to extract value from what they've already taken the time to create and share, it's up to you to figure out how.

You're a grown-up. If you can't figure out whether text is enriching and useful to you or not without it being presented with just the right imagery, color, and font, that's on you.

> and when you mix in your otherworldly passions, I can’t take them seriously, it’s too unfamiliar to me.

This is a good sentence. Here you are correctly articulating that it is you who is having trouble assimilating the content they've shared. That's your choice. They have the freedom to put it out there and you have the freedom to ignore it if it's not to your taste. Everyone can do what they choose and everyone wins, for their own personal definition of "win".

> Aside from that, what it is about the anime and furry culture that pushes its participants to include it in everything? Every once in a while, I see a post on the cringe subreddit of some young man who has peppered anime and fursonas all throughout a school presentation. What is driving the need to include this in everything?

It's an important part of their identity and one that has fairly broad negative connotations. They rationally want to normalize it so that they can be their best fully-actualized self without having to deal with shame or criticism like your comment here.


I agree with this post 100%. If a technical post solves my problems, as long as the images are SFW and not too distracting, I'm good with it. Even if they are a bit distracting, that's what reader mode is for, isn't it?


>What is driving the need to include this in everything?

This is just an armchair psychology theory, but I feel like it is just the need for social validation in the absence of it, as well as an attempt to prove that their interests/passions that are considered to be for "weird" or childish people can belong to "normal" adult people too. Hence why they never forget to remind people at any point in a regular discussion about that interest, as if it is a regular everyday thing that a lot of people are into.

And in the meantime, it is also sort of an interest/passion that isn't about an activity (very unlike most other interests/passions), but rather about being a different entity as a person, which makes it more difficult to detach yourself from that interest, as it literally is solely about being another form of yourself.

Overall, I agree with your sentiment however. Having furry content in a technical blog post would essentially prevent me from sharing it with my teammates, no matter how good the actual technical content of that post is.


> Having furry content in a technical blog post would essentially prevent me from sharing it with my teammates, no matter how good the actual technical content of that post is.

I don't disbelieve you, but I do have a question!

Why?

Why is furry/anime/whatever inherently disqualifying, regardless of the quality of the technical content?

(n.b. None of the art is adult-oriented, if that's what you're worried about. I made an editorial decision on day one to keep the artwork featured on my blog 100% worksafe, even if the discussions aren't always.)

Is it a fear that "Nobody will take me seriously"? This didn't stop the EFF. https://twitter.com/EFF/status/1307037184780832769


> Why is furry/anime/whatever inherently disqualifying, regardless of the quality of the technical content?

It isn't inherently disqualifying, unless it is plastered everywhere where it doesn't belong, like in the middle of a lot of unrelated conversations or in the middle of a professional technical blog post.

For example, if you just have a furry image in your website header, but the content of your technical post itself is on-point and doesn't have a bunch of unrelated furry stuff, most people will have no issues sharing your content and recommending it to others.

For a good example of that, take a look at the website of the guy who did a lot of impressive work and research and became famous for the YOLO image classifier[0]. His website features my little pony characters. He is very openly into it. His MLP-themed resume made as a halfway joke is extremely infamous on the internet. And then take a look at his technical blog posts. He writes really well and doesn't let his interests detract him from quality writing. And no one who is interested in reading about the technical topics he covers seems to have any issues with the content of his posts at all.

0. https://pjreddie.com/


It’s disqualifying because, in the case of furries, it started as a sexual fantasy. Much of the furry community sees fursonas as a sexual choice.

If you included pictures of scantily clad people in all of your posts, I would also hesitate to send it to my manager.

Anime has a huge sexual following as well. There’s an entire industry around printing anime girls onto body pillows for these fans to sleep with, for example.


The amount of... failure to understand what you're talking about is on the level of white people trying to explain native american cultures after watching half of Pocahontas while half asleep.

Furries started as a sexual fantasy like The Colbert Report started as a serious news show. It didn't. The Colbert Report was intended to satirize news outlets like Fox, but art imitates life and you gotta talk about the real world at one point or another. Furries started as panels and room parties at science fiction cons and guess what, humans do this thing where art imitates life and is a reflection of of humanity at large.

But, you seem to have made it a goal to intentionally not understand what you're talking about and argue in bad faith, looking for validation of your limited worldview.

To counter your point: My boss actively suggests to people a wide mix of books on subjects, including [The Manga Guide to Cryptography](https://nostarch.com/mangacrypto) and within my company it's not uncommon to see people making MLP references, references to anime and manga (including BNA, Aggretsuko, Hello Kitty, etc) and more.

If you can't read an article for the contents & think critically about its construction and presentation, did you even go to college? Or did you fake your way through that degree? Or were you just not challenged through high school to think and that's where your 4.2 perfect GPA came from?


>Furries started as a sexual fantasy like The Colbert Report started as a serious news show. It didn't. The Colbert Report was intended to satirize news outlets like Fox, but art imitates life and you gotta talk about the real world at one point or another. Furries started as panels and room parties at science fiction cons and guess what, humans do this thing where art imitates life and is a reflection of of humanity at large.

I don't think many care. It's a pop-culture, one of the random interests people adopt to feel "different" in the 20th/21st century (I guess kind of like "occult circles" in the 19th century or similar).

How would one feel about a 30-40 year old "goth"? Exactly.

In the juvenile 21st century culture it might be considered an acceptable passtime for someone over 20-22, but in the end it's no better than being a "goth", a "biker", a "raver", a "b-boy", a "trekie", a "new ager" or similar cringe-worthy identities people cling on to find a community in the absense of a real community of people.

Real community being the variety that focuses on the actual character, personality, work, and behavior -- not on people having some niche affiliation/interest in order to be included.


I know plenty of "aging ravers" who are well into their 50s and 60s (and for that matter - yes, goths over 30, too). Just because a community formed around a common (possibly frivolous) interest doesn't make it "not a real community". I'm part of a certain music community - the actual music itself isn't the draw to me (not to say I don't like it, but it's definitely not my favorite) - it's the kindness of the people. If I might ask - what kind of community are you a part of, and why does it make it better than the community I'm part of? And why even gatekeep what makes a good community?


>I know plenty of "aging ravers" who are well into their 50s and 60s

Sure, my point wasn't that they don't exist, but that it's a sad clinging.

>Just because a community formed around a common (possibly frivolous) interest doesn't make it "not a real community"

In my book it does. For one it makes it exclusionary. And what when you lose interest in the "frivolous interest" later? You lose the friends or alienate some of them? That's not much of a community then to begin with.

>And why even gatekeep what makes a good community?

Shouldn't I rather ask this question to you? After all, you're the one who accepts a community that's gatekeeping based on an interest!


> Sure, my point wasn't that they don't exist, but that it's a sad clinging.

That's like...just your opinion, man. :)

> In my book it does. For one it makes it exclusionary. And what when you lose interest in the "frivolous interest" later? You lose the friends or alienate some of them? That's not much of a community then to begin with.

That isn't what happens, though. They are still your friends, you can still do other things with them! Maybe you met someone at a board game convention, both over the years you stopped playing games (hey, life happens) - doesn't mean you can't or don't meet up with them for dinner, a music event, or...

> Shouldn't I rather ask this question to you? After all, you're the one who accepts a community that's gatekeeping based on an interest!

Aha! Here is the issue. The communities form around those interests, but there's nothing saying you can't join the community without having a heavy interest in it. Probably having some sort of passing interest is how you find out about the community in the first place, but it isn't a requirement. It feels to me that you're making a big assumption about a lot of communities that you've never personally interacted with.


>That's like...just your opinion, man. :)

Yes, but either all opinions are equally valid, and things are just matters of taste, or some opinions are more valid than others (not mine necessarily, just some). In which case, one might want to consider whether this one is more valid - and whether being a goth or a furry after teenager years makes much of a sense.

If your argument is some variety of "anything should go" or "whatever doesn't actively hurt someone else is ok", or "it's a free country", or "whatever gets you through", then sure, can't argue with that...


Why would you be any more likely to loose friends found through something like that than through any other community when circumstances change?

And most communities are based on something, be it interest, experiences, location, profession, ... - which community is not "gatekeeping" through some factor? If you exclude people from your social circles because they "don't belong (anymore)" is orthogonal to that, and not a thing unique to relationships through interest-based communities.


Mind you, normies, who come to socialize, are a big problem there as they bring their normie standards and are infuriating.


Just because there is a connecting characteristic you want to simplify it to something can be a "real community".


I think your documentary is biased, as it’s been made and hosted by a furry themselves.

On the Wikipedia page about furry fandom, it says:

> The furry fandom has its roots in the underground comix movement of the 1970s, a genre of comic books that depicts explicit content.[5] In 1976, a pair of cartoonists created the amateur press association Vootie, which was dedicated to animal-focused art. Many of its featured works contained adult themes, such as "Omaha" the Cat Dancer, which contained explicit sex.

As well, it even has a section dedicated to sexuality, where it states:

> In a different online survey, 33% of furry respondents answered that they have a "significant sexual interest in furry", another 46% stated they have a "minor sexual interest in furry", and the remaining 21% stated they have a "non-sexual interest in furry".

Although you may not engage with it sexually, it very much has a sexual following.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Furry_fandom


I read your articles, thanks for sharing. A community of people can loudly declare whatever they want, it’s their actions that determine who they are.

Go and look at some surveys from furries, like the ones listed in the Wikipedia article. Although they say it’s not about sex, they respond differently in private.


> I think your documentary is biased, as it’s been made and hosted by a furry themselves.

What do you consider an unbiased news source?

CNN? https://www.cnn.com/2018/11/14/us/furries-culture/index.html

Vice? https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/bjmq9d/how-the-furry-comm... https://video.vice.com/en_us/video/gothic-cocktails-with-ton...

Psychology Today? https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/animals-and-us/20170...

Almost every expert who has seriously studied the furry community has come to the same consensus: The public imagination is wrong, often hilariously so.


>Almost every expert who has seriously studied the furry community has come to the same consensus: The public imagination is wrong, often hilariously so.

Almost any expert who dared say otherwise would expect a backslash, being called fascist or whatever, and probably cancellation. So there's that.


> It's disqualifying because, in the case of furries, it started as a sexual fantasy.

I don't know where you heard that, but it's incorrect.

There's a documentary that delves into the history of the furry fandom: https://youtu.be/c2N1sFWRRf8

> Much of the furry community sees fursonas as a sexual choice.

No, this is a myth that a lot of people outside our community believe.

If you have a fursona, that's supposed to be a representation of you. Fursonas are about identity. It can also be about one's queerness (which is probably fair to say in general, considering 80% of the fandom is LGBTQIA+), but being queer doesn't mean "being sexual".

https://furscience.com/research-findings/sex-relationships-p...

https://www.theguardian.com/fashion/2016/feb/04/furry-fandom...

(Yes, there is a side to most fandoms that focused on adult entertainment, but that's not all of it.)


>> It's disqualifying because, in the case of furries, it started as a sexual fantasy.

>I don't know where you heard that, but it's incorrect.

Maybe that's technically incorrect, but you should check out how the early coverage of furry culture was presenting it as[0]. Here is an interesting excerpt:

"Early portrayal of the furries in magazines such as Wired, Loaded, Vanity Fair, and the syndicated sex column "Savage Love" focused mainly on the sexual aspect of furry fandom."

0.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Furry_fandom#Public_perception...


I wouldn't share a link with my colleagues that contained any cartoon emoting at all, because they would find it (and by association me) infantile and cloying, and I would expect that assessment, in a professional setting. The species or art style is not, for me, the heart of the issue; it's just that people in my line of work are generally not receptive to this method of communication. This same sector of the world would also not respond well to, say, shorts and t-shirts in the office, for almost exactly the same reasons. There is no way in hell I will ever be able to change this, but I would be able to effectively destroy my own credibility by posting links to cartoon-annotated technical articles.

My online sphere of interactions includes both furries and otherkin and we generally get along fine. I don't like that this sort of boundary matters, but it does, and I'm not in a position to do anything about it.


I understand, wrong thought undermines conformism. Though I don't find idea sharing to be a problem, I just speak from myself, I don't get knowledge from one source and a manager won't read a wall of technical text anyway.


> Put yourself in the shoes of someone who wants to send these articles to their manager to support an idea/project of theirs. It absolutely detracts from the professionalism of the post.

I, as a hobbyist who blogs about things in my spare time for my own amusement, owe no obligation to random people's managers.

In 99.9999% of cases, that also includes my own manager at my place of work. (And even then, my only obligation is to not talk about things that aren't meant to be discussed publicly.)

> Every once in a while, I see a post on the cringe subreddit

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ePnrEolRopU

> What is driving the need to include this in everything?

I've answered this on my about page.

https://soatok.blog/about/




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