Just some random theorizing here for fun, this is getting off topic of the cool hack:
>Hidden electric motors have been used to cheat in real pro cycling. If they can’t always catch it there Peleton etc. have no chance.
Though this is getting off topic, I'm not sure I agree with you. It's not necessary to always catch something in a situation like this after all, as with video games it is more about keeping down the rate, and permabans on discovery with retroactive stat updates may also discourage by raising the risk even if one might get away with any single instance. There is also the fact that stakes are just plain lower, things like Zwift are mostly about fun, getting into shape, and competitions to the extent that competition helps some people with A & B. It's not like there are massive cash prizes and sponsorships and so forth on the line in the same way the pro sports has. So lesser reactions could still work.
And the purely electronic world does have some additional potential tools, if we want to theorize about if a given community really got concerned about cheating. While as this example shows right now the needed data is very minimal, it's not as if an open API couldn't have a lot of biometrics, resulting in major data sets that could be kept around indefinitely. Which obviously has major privacy implications too, but purely from a cheating angle I suspect it'd be a challenge to get everything right vs sufficiently powerful ML analysis on a data set like that from millions.
I mean, at the end of the day the fact is that a human being assisted by an electric motor just isn't thermodynamically the same system. With sufficient resolution (possibly not feasible on real roads, but quite possible for a contained standalone system) the energy budgets and how they interact with human physiology just won't add up right.
Now I personally am not a serious bike rider at all, just casual for exploration of the countryside on my own, and while I have a bunch of family members who are they're all out on roads and aren't into the tech side as much. So I honestly don't have any idea what level of privacy/creep tradeoff people would accept in data collection vs cheating and any other benefits (better personalized AI training suggestions? maybe?). Still though, it's an interesting cat and mouse game, and I'm not sure I'd bet on the mice if the cats have enough data collection, memory and computing power on their side.
All of which not merely could but should even more be open, so that people can see exactly what is going out and have full control over it.
> There is also the fact that stakes are just plain lower, things like Zwift are mostly about fun, getting into shape, and competitions to the extent that competition helps some people with A & B. It's not like there are massive cash prizes and sponsorships and so forth on the line in the same way the pro sports has.
There's have been at least 2 deaths related to use of Strava and probably many unreported near misses, all to have your name at the top of a list on a system you have to pay to use [1]. Cheating is widespread in any online game that has a decent audience, often for no discernable benefit. Humans are not rational, especially when it comes to competition.
>Hidden electric motors have been used to cheat in real pro cycling. If they can’t always catch it there Peleton etc. have no chance.
Though this is getting off topic, I'm not sure I agree with you. It's not necessary to always catch something in a situation like this after all, as with video games it is more about keeping down the rate, and permabans on discovery with retroactive stat updates may also discourage by raising the risk even if one might get away with any single instance. There is also the fact that stakes are just plain lower, things like Zwift are mostly about fun, getting into shape, and competitions to the extent that competition helps some people with A & B. It's not like there are massive cash prizes and sponsorships and so forth on the line in the same way the pro sports has. So lesser reactions could still work.
And the purely electronic world does have some additional potential tools, if we want to theorize about if a given community really got concerned about cheating. While as this example shows right now the needed data is very minimal, it's not as if an open API couldn't have a lot of biometrics, resulting in major data sets that could be kept around indefinitely. Which obviously has major privacy implications too, but purely from a cheating angle I suspect it'd be a challenge to get everything right vs sufficiently powerful ML analysis on a data set like that from millions.
I mean, at the end of the day the fact is that a human being assisted by an electric motor just isn't thermodynamically the same system. With sufficient resolution (possibly not feasible on real roads, but quite possible for a contained standalone system) the energy budgets and how they interact with human physiology just won't add up right.
Now I personally am not a serious bike rider at all, just casual for exploration of the countryside on my own, and while I have a bunch of family members who are they're all out on roads and aren't into the tech side as much. So I honestly don't have any idea what level of privacy/creep tradeoff people would accept in data collection vs cheating and any other benefits (better personalized AI training suggestions? maybe?). Still though, it's an interesting cat and mouse game, and I'm not sure I'd bet on the mice if the cats have enough data collection, memory and computing power on their side.
All of which not merely could but should even more be open, so that people can see exactly what is going out and have full control over it.