> Withdrawn mostly from Reddit in favor of early 2000’s style forums that I pay money for
I've never heard of such forums. Does anyone have any examples of these? In particular ones that you pay for, but I'm interested in free ones too.
It's a niche space, but it's a niche space I enjoy, for all of its faults.
And kind of thought that no one believes in that anymore, that it was a 90s thing - at least when considering the absolute mad UX that is prevalent today. Some sites must deliberately pretend to process your decision for close to a second just to annoy you.
100ms latency is bad but privacy banners with stupidly obvious dark UI patterns (where they are even deliberately breaking the law) are worth it? In what universe does that make sense? There is something seriously ill with the web today.
Maybe this article is a cure. Not one I imagined but I'm intrigued.
If research shows users aren't sure if something happened then fix the UI to give some feedback to the user that their action was registered. This will likely involve a small delay even if it's just in the user's perception of the feedback but less than presented in the articles.
It's been much too long since I've run or participated in a UX study so maybe it's a good time to get back into it.
Not just to deliberately annoy you, but also to try and sell to you.
If you go do your taxes on a very popular tax site, you will eventually get to pages that say things like "finding all your deductions!" or similar with progress bars. Well that's not really happening because that was done in milliseconds, instead that page is trying to upsell you to the Premium or Platinum or Uranium version.
My laptop died during this one month of travel I’m doing, and I’m stuck doing everything on mobile. (No apple licensees where I am.)
I bought a keyboard for my iPad, it’s still painful AF. So I began avoiding and canceling unimportant tasks because
of their inconvenience.
And then I realized: how much of this mindless garbage do I accept on my plate just because I am trying to „optimize my productivity“?
(Typed with two thumbs. Perhaps hypocritically?)
I tried blocking it for lapses of time but it didn't reduce my addiction. What did work was logging out of Facebook. The annoyance of having to log in and stop my flow was enough for me to stop using Facebook. Now I use it less than once a month when I want to contact some company that only has a Facebook page.
The sheer annoyance to re-log-in made me quit FB in about a week.
Basically ad/js blockers elevated to content selectors, somewhere halway between full functionality and reader mode of the core content of a page.
I see a literal tsunami of tiny projects like that on HN and various other places, and I suspect it's quickly gaining the characteristics of a product category — how much would you pay, or give away, to reclaim a distraction-free highly-focused web experience? Not sure about individuals (most mainstream users), but in businesses, offices, on the clock? That makes a stupid amount of sense. ("stupid" because, heh, it's seeking a solution for a problem we created in the first place, businesses deploring the consequences of things whose causes they cherish, should we say champion in modern lingo.)
: not that kind! https://www.pictorem.com/collection/900_Pawel-Kuczynski_blin...
! Block the hot network questions for focus
! Get rid of the distracting "Blog" area
superuser.com,stackoverflow.com,stackexchange.com###sidebar > div:has-text(Blog)
! This banner reappears for me
! Block the left sidebar that takes up space
* Fun side fact (as if this comment was enough of a tangent already), you used to be able to request a _free_ physical copy of the x86 reference manuals. Not sure if that's still the case, but younger me was _thrilled_ when I found out and received that small library in the mail.
Click again to see if you did something wrong and, yes, youe action was registered 2 times causing all kinds of trouble.
To all SPA developers around the word: show me if I interacted and show me if something is loading.
The trope of someone closing reddit, only to open reddit again, is a microcosm of that. If you were actively participating in the decision making and thinking clearly, you would never make that mistake. Something else is driving your trawl.
What are the names of these early 2000's style forums? I would like to join them too.
(1) - https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/leechblock-ng...
Continuing to think "inside the box" of built-in Firefox tools you could pair it with different windows in different profiles, train yourself to open the "addictive" sites only in the throttled profile. I don't have the Containers add-in installed, but I wonder if you can throttle Containers separately (and if not, might be an interesting feature request).
It might be worth writing some sort of extension or wrapper website to enforce this.
If it takes 8 seconds to load a website I could see someone just opening a bunch of tabs and coming back to them later. This suggestion avoids that (among other accomplishments).
With full blocking I used to cheat by disabling the block, and then "forgot" to enable it again.
With delay-based blocking I'm also cheating: instead of waiting for the delay I get up and do some minor chore. I used to feel smug about how clever I was, sabotaging my own block. Until I realized what a positive change this was.
PS: I've waited 40s to submit this comment. You'll need another plugin to recover the text if you submit and then hit the delay page. Or submit before the timer runs out.
Link to the extension which in turn links to the git repo: https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/delaywebpage/
But the block repeats every few hours, and I'm pretty sure that clicking on a link within the same tab repeats the block then (maybe depends on the page). So yes, the "dosage" of how many delays you get is not very well controlled for. Still, I'm using this setup for years and it definitely does something for me.
I had to go back and make sure what was being said was actually the case which now makes me question what one does with all that latency time... just sit and breath and try not to totally freak out? I don't want to come off as too crass on this, but this type of self-regulation is just totally missing the mark (unless I'm missing something here).
Firstly, if you are addicted it's too late, your willpower is shot. Blocking a site to retrain yourself is a good idea.
Humans are creatures of habit. If putting up a temporary fence forces you to build the habit of swimming between the flags - when you take away the fence your monkey brain is hopefully stuck with the good habits.
It's also a single person, vs a billion dollar industry that is spending a shit tonne of money trying to get them addicted.
> After years of trying various methods, I broke this habit by pitting my impatience against my laziness. I decoupled the action and the neurological reward by setting up a simple 30-second delay I had to wait through, in which I couldn't do anything else, before any new page or chat client would load (and only allowed one to run at once). The urge to check all those sites magically vanished--and my 'productive' computer use was unaffected.
>At various times, I thought of doing it with an X modification, Firefox extension, a Chrome add-on, an irssi script, etc—but none of them worked too well (or involved a lot of sustained undistracted effort, which was sort of a Catch-22). Then I hit on a much simpler solution:
>I made it a rule that as soon as I finished any task, or got bored with it, I had to power off my computer.
I suppose this the result of a feature of the human being: be lazy as possible. Rather than write code for poor quality networks (which in my experience are prevalent in rural areas and in older parts of cities) simply declare “we need faster mobile networks for all!”
I suspect this will be a never-ending battle, and developers might consider caring at some point, to reach those eyeballs that will never have the cutting edge mobile networks.
Or, don’t, and said eyeballs will be slightly less likely to become addicted, if this article is to be believed.
I favor extensions that give an alert or block the site after a certain time. More effective and less anger inducing for me personally.
I browse HN or reddit a lot when I put something in motion that will take 4-30 seconds to complete. Because who can wait tens of seconds for something.
Then 15 minutes later...
But if I know that I’ll probably have to wait just as long for the site to load then perhaps I’d just sit and endure, maybe...
Make room for yourself to notice you're doing something you don't want to do aka mindfulness and that space allows you to change your behavior.
Here is a little proof of concept I did awhile back to see how tight I could make a responsive page with a good amount of graphics. The whole page is two server calls (one is for the fav icon). It loads in about 400 ms total from github or in less than 200 from Godaddy shared hosting: https://pbskidd.github.io/cockenoe
Maybe it's good not to upgrade to the latest iPhone?
I've investigated going to a true dumb phone, but that's not nearly as feasible now as I would prefer. The Nokia 3310 is the only reasonably priced option I can find; and all the boutique, low volume dumb phones are absurdly expensive.
I switched to a Nokia 8110 a couple months ago, and really want to like it, but the basics are too poorly done. On the 8110 in particular, the keys are quite small, and their debouncing is terrible. I worry the debounce might be the same for other phones in that family, which all seem to have the same guts. A single keypress is very often interpreted as a double-press, which makes T9 frustrating and the predictive mode practically impossible.
There's no way to switch the ringer off, without opening the cover and navigating two layers of menu. The music player is borderline useless, a shame considering it has a microSD slot.
At least on my network (Vodafone NZ), MMS messages don't work in either direction - basically you have to ring someone back when they try to send you one.
The idea of having maps is nice. But, in practice, I've just reverted to noting directions in a notebook that I carry anyway. So, while maps was one of the main reasons I tried a Nokia KaiOS phone, it's not a requirement for the next one.
The Firefox addon LeechBlock NG can delay access to sites. Of course, that can't stop you from opening Chrome - which as far as I can tell, you can't uninstall from Android.
And limit my speed to 256KB/s which sounds like a lot and 15 years ago that was really fast, but it's enough to stop me from gorging on YouTube videos, which interestingly are less addicting when viewed at a maximum of 480p.
Adding latency is not necessarily the best route, because some apps (looking at you, gmail) send tens of requests in sequence just to load the main page.
But if anyone knows of any nice GUI tools that are similar do share!
EDIT: Just thought I'd mention how I use it. Basically I use it like the chrome network tools, but I intercept POST requests to the server and try to much with the data that's sent to make sure the backend isn't blindly trusting the client, or to see if there's weird ways I can break the code with special input, etc.
This makes going to web app sites (the bad sites) fairly slow. Especially when I have to serially temp-whitelist 4 domains each requiring a reload of the page every time I visit.
But normal web sites that don't suck pop in instant and fast.
Legally dubious, but no other way of managing the 1% of users who are using 95% of the bandwidth in a way you'd not provisioned for (because then your economic model is broken).
Which good ones are still around that are not specific to a certain topic? I am interested in this.
Since he said "that I pay money for", I'm assuming somethingawful maybe? Are there any others that are still good and active?
 - https://github.com/sitespeedio/throttle
Gonna start using "nightmare rectangle" instead of "computer" from now on ...
The underlying problem is that addicting people is core to the business model of facebook, twitter, and many other sites. With the web coupled to the profit motive there will always be infinitely more resources put towards making sites addictive than making them user-friendly, ie, encouraging healthy user habits. If the web was treated as a shared, public utility with no-strings-attached funding for developing shared tools like social media as well as supporting user-written clients for everything, effective tools for this that anyone can easily use would proliferate and web addictiveness and these clunky solutions would be nearly a non issue.
This is basically the dream of socialism. Utility set free from the malignant requirements of profit. I think it's much closer to people's original dreams for what the internet could be before venture capital crept in and came to rule everything.
(In the dial-up days, before tabs, my workaround was to have 20 IE windows open.)
(HN is one of them - but only on my mobile device)
I don't know a lot about Android development but could you use the Android VPN APIs to add latency to requests? I might use an open source app that adds this kind of functionality.
This is why I deleted the reddit apps and use the mobile site instead. Having only one page at a time really helps from sitting forever in an infinite scrolling list.
invidio.us with "thin mode" on
Are there any extensions anyone can recommend for doing this comprehensively across all the popular sites / 3rd party comment engines?
If you want to know how it works in Linux:
I played MMOs compulsively. They basically hijacked the reward center of my brain to the point where what happened outside of the game seemed completely irrelevant to me. I didn’t even see the point of showering.
During “moments of clarity” I understood perfectly well exactly what was happening to me, how the game was specifically designed to put me in that sort of state, how fake and toxic it all was.
So during these “moments of clarity”, I would take some of my life back by deliberately sabotaging myself inside the game so I wouldn’t want to play anymore.
I destroyed all my valuable items and deleted my characters.
When I came back, I told support it was an accident and they recovered the items and characters for me...
So then I gave all my valuable items to other players, thinking support couldn’t take those back from those people, because that would be creating free duplicates.
So I told support it was an accident, and they recovered the account and created duplicates of all of my lost items.
So I did that again, this time handing all the items to someone I knew.
Support again recovered the account and created duplicates of everything, but warned that they wouldn’t be able to do this a third time because of concerns about in-game markets being disrupted by duplicates.
So I did it again.
This time they recovered the account, and some of the items, but none of the most valuable ones.
Even then, I still wanted to play.
So this time I did the same, deleted all my items, deleted my characters, and created a new email account on yahoo.
I made that yahoo account’s username and password both something complicated I would never remember. I changed my game account’s email to that yahoo account, confirmed the email change, changed my game account’s password to something long I would never remember, changed all the game account’s personal and contact information to nonsense, logged out of the yahoo account, logged out of the game account, and closed the incognito tab.
I tried, but I never figured out a way to recover that account.
So I created a new account. Several times, but always repeatedly sabotaged myself during moments of clarity. Eventually, after a few weeks, I completely lost interest in trying and could finally do other things with my life.
I’ve used this same tactic with every game since. Total gameplay hours over the last 10 years have been maybe 50 hours or so for Fallout 3, and that’s it.
I don’t play anything anymore. Life has turned out unreasonably good since then, too. Career in software exploded.
Maybe because of redirected compulsivity.
Now I’m having a similar problem with workaholism.
I guess the real-world implementation of my prior solution would be to give all my money away, burn all my bridges, and go meditate in a forest somewhere. That doesn’t seem like such a great idea, though, especially with people depending on me. I’ll have to figure out a different solution for this one..
it's enough to block all cookies on YouTube and comments stop loading
And I already convinced my boss to switch to Firefox.
️ from Vinay (an old friend)
2011: Black Mirror
2020: Nightmare Rectangle
Reddit with Spectrum internet latency feels like water.
I've found that if you can break the habit of reaching to some site when you're bored the addiction falls off pretty quick.
Programming has a lot downtime sometimes - waiting for a build or a long test run - and there's sometimes a steep context switch to working on something else. (At least for me if I start something new I'll forget what I was working on before) It's those times when I found myself on Twitter or Reddit.
One thing I've been trying to do instead is read an actual book - non-fiction does ok, I can usually follow the argument reading a few paragraphs at a time. And Kindle makes it easy to read in your browser and pick up where you left off on an e-reader.
One tricky thing though: I blocked YouTube only to be reminded that Google's login still goes through a YouTube domain, so I inadvertently made it harder to login :(.