Time for a dev forum on migrating away from Google Play Services.
I remember reading a while ago that iOS is an attractive OS to target because the users tend to spend more in apps than the average Android users. If the average Chinese users spend even less it may be a disincentive. Not sure if this is still the case.
It only takes one critical app not working for the customer to think their tablet must be 'broken' because their friend can run the app and they can't.
Only for applications targeting Chinese users in China, behind the GFW, which is a special kind of a market abet a large one. If a developer is not targeting that market, not using Google services is using a spoon to dig a trench.
To me it feels like a store for developers. When looking for even something simple like a qr code scanner I ran into a lot of one off developer type apps that require specific hardware and other apps or programs installed to even function. I found even the explanations hard to describe.
> He added that the firm had set aside $1bn (£801m) to encourage developers to make their apps compatible, and said more than 45,000 apps had already integrated the firm's technology. But he did not name any of them.
I agree that F-Droid missed a golden opportunity to work with a company to provide potentially millions of users with more control over their devices.
I mean I know the capabilities are limited because the search is supposed to work offline and doesn't call home for help, but if you don't know the exact name of the app you're looking for, then the experience is a little more tedious.
Just slap a captcha on there or something or avoid bots
They are like the comment section under an article: useless.
Fake positives are much more common with products.
I'm still waiting for a reasonable phone that will allow me to install my own OS and, more importantly, dump the OS and go with something else when it annoys me.
I'm no supporter of either Apple or Goog, but applauding a mass spyware device from the CCP would be satire a couple years ago.
It's not like they have a track record of subverting phones for targeted genocide or anything
Say what you want about the chinese, but they're not the only ones playing that game.
The original comment is literally comparing Huawei favouably to US counterparts, though
China is not a liberal democracy and is guilty of many human rights violations.
If you want to use Huawei devices, go ahead, it's a personal choice, but preferring Chinese devices for security or privacy reasons is just plain stupid.
And the parent's argument is textbook whataboutism.
Yes, the US has active spying agencies. Irrelevant for the topic being discussed.
the history excludes any other country but China..
is that what you meant?
To me, OP put things in perspective.
Unless it looks like the NSA gets Apple and Google to put in back-doors, the products are still significantly safer than Huawei which is just an arm of the government.
Or someone who is kept completely away from you by those sworn to protect you?
Google and Apple and etc are controlled by the American government. The one who can actually do something to you.
The CCP can't do anything to me. Try getting to me. The USA has power over me. The CCP has zero power in my life.
So yes, I would prefer my spyware to be sending my info to someone with zero capability to put it to use.
A phone without all of them would be the best deal but, as an European, I'm 100% sure that assuming all three of them are spying on people using their phones, currently the Chinese are the least likely to give any data about me to my government.
EDIT: Since people don't seem to believe me. Just look at this  NPR article from this morning, which quotes: "The Chinese, are our No. 1 intelligence threat."
EDIT: Since people don't seem to believe me, just look at this  NPR article from this morning, which quotes: "The Chinese, are our No. 1 intelligence threat."
What country do you buy your phone from ? Censoring China, waterboarding US, genocidal Israel, negationist Japan ?
Nor Huawei or Google or Apple are from Israel, and the discussion is about a product launched by Huawei, a Chinese company with deep ties with China's Communist Party.
The US got there first, but it seems other countries have been rapidly catching up.
Random Chinese made IOT devices phoning home to servers in China is definitely a thing, but has nothing to do with Huawei.
Devices that need to legitimately phone home for something tend to do so by requesting servers within or close to the country they were developed in.
Imagine people getting riled up at the thought of Apple phoning home to a US-based NTP server..
In fact at least two of your articles are about them putting spyware on iPhones, which undercuts your point further.
Sorry are you saying that Huawei users are thick or something?
(If you have evidence of Huawei phones having software preinstalled that uploads a user's whatsapp conversations and whatnot to some IP then be my guest! But I don't think you do...)
If you can't unlock the bootloader, that means you can't change the OS or root the phone.
This upset developers, especially since Huawei pays XDA Developers to promote their sub-brand (Honor) with sponsored content. It's ironic to see Huawei ads plastered all over XDA when Huawei phones are not developer-friendly at all.
It's definitely a device for tinkerers and open source enthusiasts, but the price and the number of different projects supporting it is pretty exciting.
Some more technical details on the project:
So people try, just that the core consumer market don't care/or aware of what such choices actualy mean for them still - hence, many do fail.
But some nice more open phones comming and getting better on prices. Until then, a good old supported phone for alternative OS that you can root and the likes of old samsungs, moto and pixel phones just seem to be the safer bets.
But doable today, just effort above what you would really want to be doing still.
It's a reasonable phone for me, but I don't have especially high requirements.
This is the major failure I see here. Basically, no one wants Huawei's blobby bloatware with system level privileges any more than Google's blobby bloatware with system level privileges. If the world thinks that you are a Chinese spying company, you do not combat that by shipping more crap. They had a good opportunity to either extend AOSP or to make HMS open source. Instead, they imitate Google poorly.
Unless you want to put as many engineering dollars into it as Google does, you'd be better off to keep near vanilla AOSP, and build stuff on top as APK's.
I’m sure you can still use apps like YouTube and Gmail via the phones browser, that’s what I do on my iPhone.
It actually is national security (https://www.google.fi/amp/s/www.cnet.com/google-amp/news/tru...)
Sure in practical terms it is not used as such. This time it’s just ammunition for trade war. But taking it at it’s face value is more amusing.
I believe that even "innocuous" games (started playing AFKArena lately) collect the IP address of my phone and tell the lovely Chinese gov who I am, where I am, etc. (AFKArena policies have the word Tencent a lot in them).
I am not trashing security agencies. I am merely stating that lines in the sand never seem to stopped them before and most likely won't stop them now (or in the future).
Whether it could be the AT&T case, or a bribed sys/net admin, "they" want it all and they got the budgets to get it done.
It also launched without Google Services. This could be great push towards completely open sourced Android platform.
Also, the bezel around it makes it look like a device that's a phone and a camera instead of "hiding the fact" that its a phone that happens to have photo capabilities. I really like the design.
Too bad for the lack of Android/Google apps, for I would have considered getting one.
I genuinely have no idea what the back of my phone looks like. All I'm concerned with is the quality of the photos it takes.
Apple is not known to make "ugly" devices. Their devices are practical and engineered thoughtfully.
Having the camera in the top left corner as opposed to the center seems like a mistake to me. Especially since they are promoting the camera to be a significant upgrade. Put it front and center!
Apple's history on device (at least with Jobs) always was have a fully functional revolutionary machine that was easy to use and beautiful inside and out. They've been that way since the Macintosh. The look was much user-friendly and approachable. They even signed the inside of the box as if they are presenting a piece of art. Even the font-face they introduced was to promote artistry in the technical world.
My point is, the iPhone 11 is an amazing device, but the look of their biggest new feature, the cameras, does not fit well with their history of artistic prowess. Steve Jobs would have never OKed this design placement.
Huawei should market the shit out of that.
Blackphone (maybe used to) sell a hardened version of the Android phone without the google spyware but version 2 was really expensive and made in small quantities.
This Mate30 will be mass-produced.
They could make this the favorite privacy phone.
(Well privacy from the US surveillance state)
I am sure some enterprising folks on XDA will come up with a nifty easy utility to "googlyfi" your new Huawei phone.
Also won't surprise me if some phone shops will take the initiative and do it out of the box before selling it to you.
You won't be able to root Huawei phones, much less customize the stock OS to any meaningful extent. You also won't be able to change the OS (to something like LineageOS).
The world is more grey then most people think, but people have short memories. Mostly because people don't really care and just want to life and provide for their loves ones.
And phones in China already ship without the Play Store.
Previous Huawei phones have all had a fairly robustly locked bootloader. Now it seems there is quite some incentive for them to make the bootloader unlockable to make inserting GMSCore easier...
One could imagine an underground network of US based people reflashing these phones to have Google services.
This is probably a key conversation. In other words, we don't really know yet what part of GMS dependent apps will or will not work.
Fortunately the U.S. didn't kill all Chinese manufacturers, Samsung and the rest are overpriced compared to them.
Does anyone know why, if I can bypass it?
The reason is, that you won't get battery savings if random app can keep your radio busy. Since mobile carriers managed to kill WAP-Push some 15+ years ago, the only way to get push notifcations is to have a long-lived TCP connection open.
However, that opens another can of worms, there are multitude of timeouts on the way between your phone (including your phone) and the push messages server. Most apps would get this wrong, and they would have to cooperate together anyway (radio is global resource on your phone, it won't switch to low power if another app is busy chatting).
So on Android phones that come with Google apps, the task of managing push notifications is handled by Google Play framework (and also whatever Amazon is using), by single long-lived connection, used for all push messages, and not by apps themselves.
Anybody remember the way Blackberry handled this before proper push messaging? The data connection was completely dead, they just got the mobile companies themselves to do it over the phone call connection (SMS?) to indicate when there was something to read at which point the data layer came up. Really efficient in those days, except you obviously paid a fee for 'Blackberry service'
From the privacy aspect, I believe all notifications are end to end encrypted actually. Same as Apple.
I would actually be interested in being able to choose the server used for this service, and would enable it without hesitation if I could use my own server for instance.
Your phone has a persistent connection to it so that the GCM can "notify" your device when you receive a push.
The alternative is to have a custom Android OS linked to your own push provider and then convincing app server developers to send pushes to that instead.
Unfortunately, whether we like it or not, it's hard to get away from.
None the less; this seems like a very impressive piece of hardware.
However - eventually services and the phone will be separate and eventually end up with phones like we did with the browser selection option thrust upon you giving you the choice, even if you choose to go with what you had originally.
Fun times ahead and in the end, I feel that the consumer will get a better deal in the end and as geeks who love to hack away at our phones - may get an easier life.
1.Your phone Operating system
2. gallery manager.
4. Google music player.
5. google video player.
6. Youtube app.
there's more but your time is precious and maybe you allready know all these but don't care.
let's imagine your phone was a person.. he had like gazillion types of cancer. from birth.