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India is easing sourcing norms for single-brand retailers like Apple (techcrunch.com)
73 points by jmsflknr 52 days ago | hide | past | web | favorite | 53 comments



Now is the golden opportunity for India to do exactly what they did. Seems like China is trying to wait Trump out and see someone else in the WH to whom they could dictate the terms and tell through which exit of the Airforce One they need to go. But that outcome seems increasingly unlikely as time goes on, so big businesses are coming to Jesus wrt workforce diversification. That's a good thing. India could use some of that sweet, sweet economic growth too.


India has habit of being at the golden opportunity than missing it completely.

The problem with India is that internal demand for products is negligible, people aren't spending, everyone's saving! And a lot of people don't have employment. It's overburdened by taxes.

Country has many manufacturers but no retailers willing to sell the produce.

Country is developing very fast, when you can't buy pvc pipe, MDF, custom cut glass online?

There is no company selling screws online in India, strange!

Local businessmen do not want to take any risk.

When internal demand and supply is dead. Opening market for iPhones gonna put downward pressure on currency.

I am not saying, it's a bad move. It's welcomed move, I suggest India open its market for foreign manufacturers and companies, so that they are able to sell here anything duty free.

But this will lead to a massive correction on the currency value which is long overdue.

If currency loses it value entirely, I think the government will mandate private household gold be sold to the government at fixed rate set by government which will be used to pay for gas/petroleum import once the currency tanks.

India's currency will definitely tank if it opens itself up.

But there is massive amount of household gold which can be used to support the currency and bring it back up.

This will honestly make people more equal specially in country where there are many havenots, strengthening the currency should be lot more important.

Annexing private gold holding should be next big step after demonetization.


India theoretically could have taken advantage of trade war. But for that to happen it needed 3 things:

1. Skilled workforce

2. Infrastructure

3. Rule of law

Present India lacks all 3 in one or the other way and indeed moving towards authoritarian government with shutting down internet at will, arresting people for post critical of govt or it's ministers [1] [2] [3] [4]. Looking at what's happening with economy, fudging economic numbers, large young unemployed youth, faltering manufacturing sector. These are ticking timebomb.

Obviously the major beneficiary has been south east Asia, especially Vietnam. Not sure India can take advantage.

[1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_censorship_in_India

[2] https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-46631911

[3] https://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jun/13/indian-police-...

[4] https://m.hindustantimes.com/india-news/arrested-over-a-face...


Those problems are nothing new. India doesn't have an entirely literate population which contributes to lack of skilled workforce and slow pace of Infrastructure building. Add to it the democratic nature(unlike China) of politics which stalls mega projects for years.

As for the rule of law, India is severely underpoliced[1].

While the current Government is indeed authoritarian, it's a major improvement over the previous ones when we include national security in the picture. Also, the region where Internet was shut is Kashmir, which is heavily infested with Pakistan-backed terrorism.

1. https://www.quora.com/Why-is-India-underpoliced-even-after-b...


If people of India wants a authoritarian government they have one.

Like Trump uses China to gather support from population and disregard the economic reality, current Indian govt uses Pakistan. These are just political moves. It results in loss of average citizens freedom and affect economics, but help the incumbents as history shows.


>Obviously the major beneficiary has been south east Asia, especially Vietnam. Not sure India can take advantage.

They need to get rid of income taxes and GST.

Honestly, if they do not do this now - there will be nothing to tax in future.

Permits, licenses also need to be removed barring some sectors which include healthcare, education and food.

Also land is a big problem in India, government should overtake all the land and lease it out for good use and not allow any person or entity to own land. People seeing land as a store house of value is really bad thing!

Get done with import duties because this is making local manufacturers weak (use indigenous shoddy tools you end up with shoddy output), remove unfriendly rules which prevent foreign players from selling their expertise here.

Annex private gold holdings, it will be next big thing after demonetization. It will make the citizens more equal.

People should know if there is anyway to get rich is not by hoarding land or putting money in bank, but by starting business.


> People should know if there is anyway to get rich is not by hoarding land or putting money in bank, but by starting business.

India still has a long marathon ahead, might take a decade or two to just let people start business easily [1]. When it cannot even help keeping existing business open, its wishful thinking to create an environment to flourish business.

But don't worry economy is not important factor in Indian politics, so its alright the incumbents will continue to pursue other agendas especially the one which secure them vote bank based on divisive politics.

[1] https://www.doingbusiness.org/content/dam/doingBusiness/coun...


> If currency loses it value entirely, I think the government will mandate private household gold be sold to the government at fixed rate set by government which will be used to pay for gas/petroleum import once the currency tanks.

Which section of the Constitution permits the Government to do that?


The problem with waiting for another president is that both Democrats and Republicans hate China alike. And China can't afford to wait because they are sitting on a demographic time bomb due to 1 child policy (10 years left or so). So I do think Xi's approach is going to undo a lot of progress that China has made under previous presidents (when they still had a concept of term limits).

I'm really rooting for India here, the largest democracy with fast growing economy and very young population. Even if 21st century is going to be dominated by Asia I'd rather see India take the leading role than China. Among other things it would also make sure that East Asian disdain for darker skinned people and China's obsession with surveillance won't become a dominant global culture.


>Among other things it would also make sure that East Asian disdain for darker skinned people

India is no panacea on this front. Modi is a Hindu nationalist and if you're expecting India to be a democracy in the vein of Western liberal democracy with enlightenment values, you're in for a surprise.


India is not perfect, its democracy is full of cacophony with racial and tribal undertones. But once the results are out the transfer of power is clean and peaceful.

It is not Norway or Sweden, but its not an autocracy. India built its version of Democracy that is worth it.

Modi and Hindu Nationalism are the present - they were not there in power 7 years ago and 7 years from now, a new PM and Party will come.

India is no Turkey and farther away from China.


I also once thought this. But I'm not sure anymore. They're creating their own Rohingyas by declaring 4m people non-citizens [1]. One state was dissolved and remains under curfew under a constitutional sleight-of-hand (the federally appointed governor assented for the people to dissolve the state).

The Supreme Court doesn't appear to have the will to stand up to the govt. In fact, it actively encouraged the disenfranchisement of citizens.

The press has been largely brought in line. [3]

India may be well on the path to becoming a Turkey.

[1] https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/asia_pacific/a-crackdow... [2] https://www.economist.com/leaders/2019/08/10/modis-revocatio... [3] https://www.economist.com/asia/2019/08/22/when-indias-govern...


Press Council of India is supporting the curbs on media reporting in Kashmir.

Supreme court of India is giving passes to meet people in curfewed Kashmir, and asking them to just meet and not do anything else (i.e. report on human right violations).

It is amazingly surreal to see this repeat again. Anyhow, how can a democracy use medieval rule like curfew on 10 Million people. Entire province disconnected from the world and themselves.


J&K is in a traditional state and while the current state is not desirable it is somewhat necessary due to the potential for terrorist attacks.

China on the other hand has put entire state's population in concentration camps and changed demography in other occupied territories such as Tibet.


So why are politicians detained? Those who swore on Indian constitution?

The reason here is not fear of terrorism, because the security theatre exists perpetually, but India does not want its suppression of a minority population to be aired out openly in media esp western and social media.


They had to do this to ensure security of the region. Almost two days ago, protestors had killed a truck driver who was a local[1]. I wonder what would've happened had there been no heavy security deployment.

1 https://www.dnaindia.com/india/photo-gallery-jk-police-offic...


Politicians pelt stones too? The communication blackout is to make sure Indian atrocities in the region are not aired out to the world.


You're talking about NRC accord which was signed by Rajiv Gandhi in Assam. For HN readers, Assam is a North-Eastern Indian state which has suffered from decades of illegal immigration from Bangladesh. The issue was back at forefront when the Supreme Court directed the Government to update NRC in 2013[1].

Contrary to what the parent claims, it's unlikely that people who loose citizenship will be kicked out of the country as India doesn't have any agreement with neighbors in this regard.

1 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Register_of_Citizen...


It'd be good, just saying, if you read some non-biased Western sources too, such as some Indian media perhaps..


Hindu Nationalism has been present in India since British times. In Punjab, they used to be called Arya Samaj (Society of the Aryans) and majority of their ideas have been adapted today by RSS. In 1984, anti Sikh pogrom Hindu Nationalists supported killings of Sikhs on the ground, supporting such acts by distributing motivated pamphlets among politicians, and by calling for ‘de-Turbanization of Sikhs’. In 1992, Babri mosque was demolished by Hindu Nationalists. 2002 Gujarat pogrom against Muslims was perpetrated by Hindu Nationalists.

It is disingenuous to say that Hindu Nationalism is a recent phenomenon of last 7 years. It has a long history by now in India.


Unfortunate you use the word arya and then fud it just like the Aryan invasion theory that is stoked up to prop up the Dravidian nationalism. The word Arya is different from the racial Aryan. Arya in sanskrit means , the seeker of truth. I dont want to go into the details here , but there are places where seekers are called arya or arya-puthras (kind of ties down to oh-sons-of-truth as referenced in the Gita).


Arya Samaj themselves claim to be Aryans. Lala Lajpat Rai, one of its heads, explains it in detail in his book explaining Arya Samaj to the western world. He wrote the first book in English tailored towards western audience, and he himself said that.


Thank you for this. The Western supremacist attitude of GP's comment really bothered me too.


What’s western supremacist about pointing out the ethnic and religious nationalism of the current Indian government


> a democracy in the vein of Western liberal democracy with enlightenment values

I might add that I don't disagree with the Indian government being Hindu nationalistic, and I am happy to discuss the flaws of the Indian government, but not under this notion that we are somehow in the same bucket as China, and that only the west is holy in the world.


>but not under this notion that we are somehow in the same bucket as China

I didn't say India was the same as China.

>and that only the west is holy in the world.

If you're a minority of any kind, you're better off living in a Western liberal democracy than anywhere else in the world. That doesn't make it "holy", but that does make it better.


Umm ... Sikhs, Buddhists, Jains, Parsis are all minorities in India. India has it's own share of troubles in minority relations, but they are no different from the race issues dealt with in many western democracies.

Does the US count as a Western liberal democracy? Because the incarceration rates of Black people in the US would certainly suggest otherwise.

The biggest factor in how well off people are in any country is economics, so unless you match up the economic factors, making any comparison of this sort is not useful.

India's treatment of minorities is much better compared to the treatment of minorities in Pakistan, Bangladesh, and Sri Lanka. While China is not a fair comparison because of different economic models, India does much better than China none the less.


>Does the US count as a Western liberal democracy?

In US, you are free to eat beef. And some people have depression which is reportedly only gets better if they consume beef. You can Google "read meat+depression" to learn more. If you are in India, pretty sure it will be very difficult for anyone to follow that diet.

Where is freedom of speech in India? All these things are anti minority.


Marijuana has medical uses and relieves anxiety for a lot of people, and yet the US is beholden to pharmas pushing addictive drugs while so many sit jailed for minor marijuana possession charges. I am pretty sure that is a violation of rights too.

The availability of low cost prescription drugs definitely is a part of fixing class warfare, that the US is doing nothing about.

And last I checked, chicken, lamb, pork are meats too, and the studies are on vegetarians and there are contradicting studies too. And if you want to tell me that people need to eat only beef to get better, then you better have some solid evidence for that.

India needs work in free speech, no doubt. But minorities do get to have a voice. They are free to participate in the democracy, publish newspapers, write books (and there are plenty of books written about addressing casteism in India).

I never argued India is perfect. I am just telling people to get off the high horse. There are things India does better than the US too. And unless the west is willing to absorb the Asian population, the comparison is particularly useless since people are not just going to be uprooted and moved to the US.


Modi is a Hindu nationalist who is democratically elected.

While I appreciate what Western democracies are doing w.r.t. Human Rights, they have their fair share of bad treatment of minorities. Racial discrimination comes to my mind.


> due to 1 child policy (10 years left or so)

If I understood this comment correctly, after another 10 years the 1 child policy will no longer be in effect? What are the chances it'll be extended? What are they doing to prepare for the population boom?


The current issue right now is that as China develops they're going through the same demographic decline a lot of other developed nations are going through, and it's not certain that removing this outdated cap on their population growth will actually solve their demographic problems. They got rid of their one child policy 3 years ago when they realized there was a population crunch in their labor force coming.


Due to past 1 child policy China's average age is on par with US now, and much higher than other developing nations. But the level of development is still very low relatively speaking. 10 years from now they'll have 400 million old people, plus another 100 million sick from pollution and other public health issues. From my conversations with party members their plan is to automate the doctors by then.


But isn't it basically take care of by automation? They simply do not need that many workers now.


I would walk back the commentary about Democrats and Republicans hating China. They have issues with China’s government, but it’s unfair to lump all of Democrats, Republicans and China into a single sentence.


I dunno, the context was around mr Xi (not the Chinese pop at large) and in that context poster could have a point.


Biden's son got > $1B from the Chinese not so long ago to run a private equity firm. If anyone thinks he's got that money for his good looks, they're very naive. The Chinese got Joe by the balls, he's very "friendly" to them, publicly as well. And Bernie can't tell a business negotiation from a hole in the ground. Those two are the most likely candidates at the moment.

Needless to say, the "CEO move" of the next person in the WH will be to "undo" just about everything the previous president has accomplished, and this in particular will be reasonably easy to undo (because the other side is eager to return to the status quo whereby they just steal our IP and fleece us to the tune of hundreds of billions of dollars a year through currency manipulation). On top of that the next president will be under intense pressure from their corporate donors to undo it.


> Biden's son got > $1B from the Chinese not so long ago to run a private equity firm.

I was surprised how little attention that story (https://nypost.com/2018/03/15/inside-the-shady-private-equit...) got in the media.


It's as though the "free" press wasn't actually "free", I don't know. Seems like the scandal of the century: a leading presidential candidate with a massive monetary tie to a foreign power. It's not the only foreign power he has ties to, either. He also has oil/gas related ties to Ukraine.

Yet all we hear in the news is made up bullshit about Russian oligarchs co-signing Trump's loans (retraction coming today BTW).


> previous president has accomplished

I think "accomplished" comes with positive connotations. To successfully achieve a task, you need a task with a defined goal. And unless the goal was global chaos, there are no accomplishments here.


Trump extracted transactional Trade treaties with Canada, Mexico, South Korea and Japan.

Name another president who re-shaped American trade with that many treaties - I cannot think of any one in the past 50 years.

An over-extended america wants vacation - stylistically it make look a bit different but substantively "american retrenchment" is baked in 2016 no matter who the president is.


What were the fundamental changes in the treaties that make you think it was a success?


That's an intensely newspeak usage of "liberalizes".


Why is that? It's a relaxation of regulation, and that's commonly called economic liberalisation. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_liberalisation_in_Ind...


Probably doesn't know where the term 'liberal' comes from. In America it's fairly common to have alternate meanings attached to these kinds of words.


Oh I'm well aware, but word comprehensions shift over time and within the common American understanding using the word "liberalizes" seems to be intentionally slanted.


TechCrunch is only focusing on the tech part. Reuters, Bloomberg are also going with 'liberalizing' in their stories. Besides, every global company has been lobbying for these relaxations so it is liberating!


Apple - We can't make iPhones in the US and tariffs don't work

Also Apple - Tariffs made us move production to Brazil and India.


This isn't about manufacturing.


“To boost sales in India, Apple has started to assemble several iPhone models locally and reached a stage where it can begin to export to overseas markets phones produced in India. Assembling phones in India allows Apple — as it does to other phone makers — to enjoy some tax benefits that Narendra Modi’s government provides.“


That is already happening. That is not the change that happened recently that this article is about.


This is hardly news, they're just letting them sell phones online.


That is not it.




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