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Show HN: PCBs with Full-Color Graphics (littlebird.com.au)
140 points by schappim on July 17, 2019 | hide | past | favorite | 38 comments



So this is something I've been involved with for the past few years. This is _not_ the first PCB with full-color graphics. A company out of Shenzhen called Makernet was doing something similar to this, and produced some interesting boards for me [1] and Maker Faires in China.

Additionally, others have gotten very, very good at putting alternative coatings on PCB. You can do remarkable work with spray paint and a vinyl stencil. Others have done multiple colors of soldermask on the same board. You can get very good results with black and white silkscreen, and using the standard complement of soldermask colors, something any board house can do very easily.

The problem with _all_ of these solutions is that these coatings do not work in a reflow oven. The issue with UV printing is that you can not put it through a reflow oven. This is important, because you do not want to put the coating/image on after you populate and solder -- parts would get in the way, etc.

The solution I've found is pad printing [2]. This is a process that is similar to silkscreening t-shirts, but instead of pushing ink through a screen, a design is picked up by a silicone pad and deposited on a PCB. I've done this with 'blockchain token Tide Pods' (I made a blockchain of Tide Pods), and various designs for other 'artistic' PCBs. Pad printing also has the advantage in that every city has a shop that does pad printing, and provided the design you want to print is small enough, this is very easy to contract out. Pad printing is highly geared towards mass-production, whereas UV printing is low-volume on the order of dozens or hundreds of units.

This isn't to diminish how cool this is. There's an entire community of people building artistic PCBs out there that would love this capability. Only wish there was a bit more information about obtaining, setting up, and producing UV color PCBs

[1]https://imgur.com/wgmO1jK [2]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4rTrSIKjpNY


Hi, I'm Marcus from Little Bird.

>> Makernet

I believe they were only doing pad printing/silk printing.

>> The problem with _all_ of these solutions is that these coatings do not work in a reflow oven.

PCBs can be printed on before population with parts (although not always required depending on the design).

We bake our PCBs, specifically in reflow ovens. We adjust our colours so that they match the target colour after heating cycle completes.

>> The solution I've found is pad printing

We looked into pad printing, but it was too limiting in terms of setup time and graphics.

It also lacked the ability to for mass customisation of products.


Makernet was a little cagey about their process, but my samples show shading in the color. They were using a full-color process where any (or all) colors could be produced in a single pass.

You are right that pad/silk printing would be too limiting if your goal would be to print anything. The goal of pad printing is just to put _a_ color on a board, and then modify your design to that (or two colors, with the tide pod). There are definite tradeoffs. Good work.


Marcus,

Great that you're doing so well! I used to buy some components off you when LB was still a part time thing for you... many many moons ago. Love that you're still exploring and pushing your own boundaries!


Thanks Craig!

The real credit should go to Maddy who consistently does the drudge work day in, day out. This frees me to explore things with the amazing JP Liew.


Is this type of technology ready for mass production? What kind of price breaks are we talking about?

I’ve worked a lot with exposed pcbs or pcbs that are shown on business fairs or shows, so it’s very interesting.


>> Is this type of technology ready for mass production?

We are using it today in production on https://www.littlebird.com.au/collections/shakeup .

>> What kind of price breaks are we talking about?

Shoot me an email on marcus@ and we can talk more. If you're an open-source / indi-hw-dev we're looking at $0.


Interesting. What's the maximum size you're currently equipped to handle?

I'm thinking "printing on an existing ~ATX motherboard". ;)


Our existing machine is around an A3 paper-size (297 x 420 mm / 11.7 x 16.5 in), but you can scale it up even bigger.


Ok, we've taken first-everness out of the title above. We tend to do that anyway, because such claims are a bit baity and a lot unverifiable.


Beautiful! If you are interested in making custom designs for a process like this (or even for the regular PCB processes) then you might want to check out SVG2Shenzhen which lets you export from Inkscape to KiCad on all PCB layers.

https://github.com/badgeek/svg2shenzhen/


You can also get good results by dithering images and using the default bitmap importer packaged with KiCad! I posted a link to some images below, been using the technique for a while now. Not as sexy as full colour but it works with damn near all fabs.

https://www.gboards.ca/product/gergo-kit


Hey, this is very cool, and excellently-executed. It would be very neat to have clear cases on stuff like this, such as the game controller presented as an example.


What I'd like to see is a silkscreen design where the traces are coloured, for educational purposes.

If every ground point was black, and every V+ trace coloured red, it would help students not to short out their boards.


Every PCB CAD package I've ever used gives you this view while you're laying out the board, so the easiest way would be to just take a screenshot of that.

If you wanted to get a bit fancier then generate it directly from the Gerber files. :)


This is totally doable.


Nice!

If you're interested in graphics using more traditional manufacturing, halftone can work well on PCBs. It's not too hard to do with your favourite raster graphics and CAD packages. If you use KiCad, here's a shameless plug for a toy project: https://github.com/ianrrees/kicad_halftone .


I like the idea, do you have a photo of the end result (on a PCB)?


I actually do this with my programmable keyboards! There's some images on the site if you browse around :)

https://www.gboards.ca/product/gergo-kit


Thanks! I've updated the examples on the github repo to include a PCB. It's not the most artfully done thing, but I think gets the idea across.


First, I really like how these turned out. I'm sure the market for this is niche conpared to the overall market for PCBs, but a great option for those who want it.

Second, I hadn't heard of the CC public patent license before, but it seems like a good way to go to keep an idea "free", rather than not pursue a patent.


The market is niche but not necessarily the profit pool. Dell buys PCBs from Foxconn who buys the components in large bidding processes from commodity vendors who probably are eking out basis points of profit. Whereas if someone’s making this for a hobby project or a piece of home decor they might be willing to pay $20 for the printing. Could be a very nice profit stream.


Neat! This seems like an easy DIY.

I have a bunch of experience making PCBs at home using laser printer toner transfer. Next time I have an opportunity to build something, I will try to transfer an underlying image onto the silk side of a one-sided PCB, followed by the silk screen layer itself. Probably, I will merge the images digitally to do it in one transfer.

Typically, PCB layout software doesn't support that sort of thing, but when I do toner transfer, the artwork ultimately ends up in a mirror-imaged .PNG file anyway. That can easily be merged with color imagery.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lyS37xjVvC8 is it similar to that, using inkjet printing + coating (which the UV light would be used to cure)?

Edit: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flatbed_digital_printer has some info on UV printers, seems you can get inks which are themselves curable under UV.


I'm Marcus one of the co-founders of Little Bird. Yup you can get some inks that are curable (primarily designed for doing cases), you can also get UV curing top-coats.


These look lovely.

Can you talk a bit about how the PCBs will work in production?

How do component silk screens work? What about fiducial marks? Do machine vision systems (when looking for fiducials) cope with the graphics or do they get confused?


>> How do component silk screens work?

Component silk fiducial marks/screens/ident layers (where necessary) are merged into the graphic being applied.

>> do they get confused?

Naturally the milage will vary depending on your Pick and Place. We use a CHM-T48VB, and have yet to have a problem. It would be interesting to test what the limits are...


I'd purchase that first PCB just for the Memphis design on it.


Thank you for putting a name to this. We've been calling it attack of the 90s. I guess things took a little longer to get to Australia.


This could be a thing for custom keyboards.


That's my gameplan :)


I can’t believe that nobody has ever applied a full colour decal to a pcb before, but this is still pretty awesome.


Yeah the results can be pretty sexy. Here is a higher res photo of what can be done:

https://files.littlebird.com.au/Screen-Shot-2019-07-18-09-36...


The thing is, there have been full color PCBs available in the past, apparently just not recently. I've ordered a few CMYK screened PCBs before, I'll see if I can dig them up again because they're gorgeous. It feels a tad disingenuous to be saying they have the first ever, but they're likely the only ones currently doing it.

Edit: I forgot to mention, these are far more refined than what I have, the ones I have have a noticeable amount of dithering and are generally lower resolution. They're still full color though!


Looks amazing, well done.


This is awesome!


[flagged]


Boards sold on makeymakey.com (since moving away from the US based SparkFun Electronics Inc for production) are made in China, are no longer open-source, lack the gold finish PCB (now silver), moved from AVR to PIC, and no longer Arduino compatible.

So who is making fake makey makeys?

[Edit]

It should be noted that the ShakeUp has a gyroscope, accelerometer and temperature sensor and has way more alligator inputs than product sold on makeymakey.com .

It is also made in Australia whilst being half the price of the competition...


I thought the guys who made Makey Makey made it open source and released the files for anyone to make and contribute back to.




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