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I think the difference here is that apple explicitly does not have an "anti malware" configuration section of the MacOS control panel. There's configuration for automated system updates, which most technical people understand to mean security patches and things that are equivalent to windows hotfixes and servicepacks.

I am with the "two wrongs don't make a right" people here. Zoom was reckless and their casual disregard for the initial security report left a very bad taste in my mouth. I'm now highly unlikely to use one of their products willingly. But having Apple initiate unattended removal of software that a person willingly installed on their own workstation machine is also unacceptable, unless they specifically opted in and checked "enable" on something that is very similar to windows defender.






If Apple removed a piece of ransomware that you installed would you have a problem with that?

Do you think anyone would have installed Zoom if they knew that it would allow any random website to activate your camera?


No, and I'm 100% in agreement with the need for it to be removed, it was clearly malware.

The question I see is really that Apple doesn't inform its users of the existence of this feature, unless you really search for it. Having something as simple as a functional-equivalent to Windows Defender with its own icon in Control Panel, which is fully enabled in the default operating system installation, should be sufficient.

Personally, unless I am specifically aware of the existence and enabled status of some anti-malware application, I don't think it's a good precedent to set for operating system vendors to start silently removing software from peoples' machines. Really all it should take is apple making people aware of the feature's existence.


While I agree with you that I wouldn't want any such thing operating silently on my own machine, I increasingly wonder if it's not the sensible default for a lot of people.

For a bunch of my family members, even simple errors mean almost nothing to them. They'll stop what they're doing and wait for help even on an error that (it seems to me) they could have simply read and addressed themselves. They've never examined the system tray, and dismiss any popups that come from it. Making them aware of systems like this only serves to confuse, because they don't really understand the problem it's addressing in the first place.

Machines for power users aren't going away. There are more operating systems than you can shake a stick at, and the number keeps growing. But for a lot of users information can be paralysing, and I wonder if having a strongly managed and simplified system akin to a phone isn't a better idea.


One could speculate in whether that is a conscious decision, since it would weaken the illusion that only Windows gets malware.

> Do you think anyone would have installed Zoom if they knew that it would allow any random website to activate your camera?

Yes, I'm quite confident that millions of "normal users" would still have installed Zoom knowing that.


> There's configuration for automated system updates, which most technical people understand to mean security patches and things that are equivalent to windows hotfixes and servicepacks.

Microsoft do exactly the same, and have done for over a decade now:

> Malicious Software Removal Tool is a freely distributed virus removal tool developed by Microsoft for the Microsoft Windows operating system. First released on January 13, 2005, it is an on-demand anti-virus tool ("on-demand" means it lacks real-time protection) that scans the computer for specific widespread malware and tries to eliminate the infection. [...] The program is usually updated on the second Tuesday of every month (commonly called "Patch Tuesday") and distributed via Windows Update, at which point it runs once automatically in the background and reports if malicious software is found.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malicious_Software_Removal_Too...

> Having something as simple as a functional-equivalent to Windows Defender with its own icon in Control Panel

MSRT is independent from Windows Defender.




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