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The clearest example to me that Tiobe does not reflect reality is the Javascript chart:

https://www.tiobe.com/tiobe-index/javascript/

Javascript in 2019 only has 0.5% more market share than in 2004?

2019 has basically every new UI (and many rewrites of old ones) being built in Javascript, 2004 it was being used for the occasional drop down menu.

(Even if you include Typescript, the only compile-to-JS language in the top 50, it still only gets to 2.7% today compared to 2% in 2004).

See also C unassailably at number 2. I think we can all agree that in 2019, there is more active development in Javascript, than C - Likely it's benefiting from their methodology giving it credit for C++ and C#, so at least we can theorise about that one, but I really have no idea for Javascript.




Part of the problem is that their methodology is based heavily on performing web searches for the phrase "$LANGUAGE programming".

Lots of developers use Javascript in the course of their work. Few of them will refer to their work as "Javascript programming" -- they will typically use either a broader term, like "web development", or a more specific one, like "React development". Neither of these would influence TIOBE's rankings.


If I want to find the MDN page for destructuring assignment in JavaScript I know I don’t need to add JavaScript or MDN, I can just search for “Array Destructuring”, and the top half dozen results are all JavaScript.


And if I want to search for say which of call/apply takes an array, or even confirm what version of php a new flag is introduced, I’m not searching for “$language programming $feature”.

I’m using DDG bangs to reduce the noise from the start and take me straight to a site specific result : `!mdn function apply` or eg `!php preg_split`.


> 2019 has basically every new UI (and many rewrites of old ones) being built in Javascript

yeah... no

> See also C unassailably at number 2. I think we can all agree that in 2019, there is more active development in Javascript, than C

bubbles, bubbles, bubbles. the immense majority of large companies I see start new GUI projects in Java, C#, C++, ... daily. Count the hundred of thousands of programmers working for gigacompanies like Samsung (with more than 40k devs), ATOS (122K employees, mostly devs), CapGemini (211k employees, mostly devs), etc... they are far from all doing JS.


I've noticed this issue a lot more recently. Developers who live in a language / platform bubble that assume that the large majority of paid developers are using whatever trendy language and less than 24 month old framework they're on etc.

Listen kids. A colossal amount of the software engineering that takes place on this earth is paid development for closed source apps and services. It's not on GitHub. It's not written in JavaScript. It's not done on Node.js. A great deal of it doesn't happen in California. And it dwarfs the amount of software on GitHub or GitLab.

It happens in Java and C++ and C# and Visual Basic and other not-sexy languages and involves writing crappy enterprise interfaces and tons of backend code.

The great thing about TIOBE is its a good indicator of what jobs are being hired for. That's why it doesn't match whatever trendy expectations most people expect to see in a languages ranking. That's why Visual Basic is always ranked so highly. Because the actual world of paid software engineering and your mental view of that world are wildly different.

Personally I think TIOBE is very valuable for what it's for. I tell young developers to use its top 10 list as a guide for where to invest your time IF you're taking a "safe" approach to career skills and employability. If you use one of the other guides for that, you may decide that learning new and exciting languages might be optimal for employment. Generally speaking that's not the case.

If one wants filter bubble expectations met, I recommend sticking to language rankings that are solely based on GitHub and other publicly available source code.


> Typescript, the only compile-to-JS language in the top 50

Clojure is right next to it on the list. It’s not only compile-to-JS but 100% of the people I know using it use it that way.




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