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Good. Piracy must be eradicated if culture is to survive.



Culture != commerce. The very fact that piracy is sustained by volunteer communities should speak for itself here, but if you need more evidence, consider:

> The scope of music collected on What.cd was almost incomprehensibly vast: More than a million distinct “releases” of songs, albums, and bootlegs.

> Bach cello suites. Obscure Chinese indie rock. Nigerian hip-hop. Thai psych-funk from the 1970s. Every release of Miles Davis’ Kind of Blue, including vinyl rips and remasters. UK techno tracks that were pressed on vinyl in the 90s, with only a few hundred copies made, and uploaded by dedicated crate-diggers.

> The collections of Spotify and Apple Music may seem infinite, but What.cd had thousands of albums that were not available anywhere else—and now, are not available anywhere at all. The site had about 800,000 artists as of early 2016...

from https://qz.com/840661/what-cd-is-gone-a-eulogy-for-the-great...


Piracy may well be a requirement for culture to survive beyond that which is mandated and approved by the major content owners.

In fact, once something enters the public domain, copying it, consuming it, drawing attention to it, documenting it, analysing it, archiving it, reusing it, in short, using it; is absolutely vital to keep those facets of culture a part of our heritage. And it is completely legal.

But between the public domain and the moment cultural artefacts are created is a vast gap where copyright shields everything from those acts, even when nobody is monetizing it, and when all that stands between losing it forever and maintaining it for future generations is a couple of pirates who ripped a copy at an opportune moment.

The current copyright status quo is killing culture. 28 years of copyright protects the creator, life plus 100 years just protects the profits of some faceless megacorporation or rent-seeking artist's estate.


Not arguing that there's no loss but Redacted, What.cd's successor, is currently at 840k releases and 725k artists. As far as pure numbers are concerned that's a decent recovery.


This is a rather strange take considering how large and quality the cultural (music, movies, tv, games, books, art, etc) communities are in the pirating scene.

If anything piracy is essential to the survival of culture. The more we barricade our works into locked off walled gardens the more likely we are to lose them. The music piracy scene is a large reason why a lot of music is still around today.

Bands and Artists whither away and die but the music lives on. How do you make that happen when all the music is locked behind DRM on streaming services?

Likewise goes for gaming communities that have reverse engineered the online services for long dead games. It's cracking and its piracy to distribute these games but they maintain vibrant communities for abandoned games.

I fear that with the increased reliance on streaming services, other gated content providers, and the increased effort to force copyright compliance that a lot of what we consume nowadays will become lost internet history.


> This is a rather strange take considering how large and quality the cultural (music, movies, tv, games, books, art, etc) communities are in the pirating scene.

> If anything piracy is essential to the survival of culture.

The book pirating scene is poor though. Outside of YA best-sellers and the usual K. Dick and Pratchett there isn't much to pirate if you are into anything not completely maintstream.


Can't say I agree, Libgen alone has plenty more.


You have plenty of private boards with absolutely everything you want.


I think that's a type of self-constructed self-assuring extrapolation. The concept that because the things that one individual wants are available, surely all things for all individuals are available.

Looking at my paper books; Pooley's Flight Guide 1985; FIDO - Flying Through Fog; The Engineering History of the North of Ireland. Just three volumes out of thousands that are slowly slipping into oblivion.

The long tail of the Internet is not long enough to preserve all knowledge, particularly at the rate libraries are discarding old and 'unwanted' books.


GP did say "absolutely everything." Surely the intent was that "all things for all individuals are available."


They don't have the book I am currently reading (or any from that publisher), Die Wand/The wall from Marlen Haushofer - french translation, though but I'd be glad to be proven wrong.

Mind you this is the kind of book I buy, even in ePub format.


People passionate about something are much more responsible than actual legal rights holders.

Rights holders only do the absolute minimum to preserve the culture they own, countless movies available in the commercial space are the worst quality versions of those movies and people passionate about those movies will go as far as tracking down multiple versions to take the picture quality of one, cut scenes from another, the sound from another and the subtitles from a fourth to make definitive best image, best sound, no cuts version and they do all that for free.


> Rights holders only do the absolute minimum to preserve the culture they own ...

I mean, this is not just true, but even more clearly so when you look at things beyond the (fairly niche and not legally sanctioned) 'piracy' scene. There is solid scholarship showing that content which has entered the public domain is far better preserved and accrues far more references, compared to very similar content which is still copyright-encumbered. So it is clearly the case that, while having some copyright is likely good for culture, we have way more of it at present than would be justified.


I know I’m short a night of sleep but:

I’m pretty sure you two are in complete agreement.


I misread "not just" as "just not", but after staring for a while, I don't think they're arguing.


They are, but it took me a second read too.


Is there a keyword for that kind of version improvement?


Huh? Piracy: permissionless copying, extending, including, remixing, transforming, retelling, inspiring; is culture.


>Piracy: the unauthorized use or reproduction of another's work.

Doesn't seem inherently bad to me. It would be bad if it were for your own commerical benefit but if done for the preservation of culture for example it could be justified. If we couldn't copy CD's some music or video games might be lost forever -- even though copying is forbidden by the licence.


Humans learn by copying and adapting. Pretty awesome culture we'd have if artists and musicians of days past would have to jump through DMCA-hoops.

I can picture it...sorry Mr. Picasso great artists don't steal...they go straight to jail. Besides, your art ain't all that. Mr. Mozart, we are sorry to inform you that Symphony No. 37 violates Mr. Haydn's intellectual property and has to be removed from the musical canons for all eternity (just like pretty much all of Mr. Händel's work)

Arguably the greatest US piece of music culture (Jazz) would be banned completely because it's the worst possibly offense. Live streaming piracy with no shame.

etc. pp.


We had culture before copyright, we'll have culture after copyright.

All that needs to be eradicated is the obsolete middle-men acting as gatekeepers to our shared culture for profit.


The middle-men are the most desperate about tyrannical copyright laws. The content creators don't need IP to survive and create, because they can always monetize their content in some form. But for the middle-men it's their only means of income.


We're actually at a point where the supposed middle-men are clearly acting against the creators' best interest, in many ways. Which means we're mot even dealing with middle-men anymore, just pure copyright trolls.


Copyright needs to be eradicated if culture is to survive.


Without piracy, "culture" is exactly what the IP overlords say it is, nothing more noting less. Do you want to live in that world?


You're so short-sighted it's amazing. We've seen numerous times how things lacking copies are lost to time, Doctor Who is probably the most prominent example, had people pirated it, we might still have something that has a big cultural value.

Piracy is also the only way a lot of us can get access to content, georestrictions are a huge annoyance for far too many of us literally no way to get paid access for years and years and years. That's not fair treatment.


All culture is a lie and persists only in the telling. If we don't copy those movies, they don't really live on ..


Only a Sith deals in absolutes.


Since this statement is an absolute truth claim, perhaps the one making it is a sith?


This comment will eventually cause the deletion of this entire thread. Congratulations.




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