Weight-wise, it's under the Macbook Air... Feature-wise (and pricewise), it's closer to the MBP.
* XPS13: 2.7lbs/1.23kg
* MBA: 2.75lbs/1.25kg
* MBP (13.3"): 3.02lbs/1.37kg
* XPS13: 13.3" 3840x2160 (or 1920x1080)
* MBA: 13.3" 2560x1600
* MBP: 13.3" 2560x1600
* XPS13: 3xUSB-C 3.1 (TB3, PD, DP USB3.1 Gen??), headset, MicroSD
* MBA: 2xUSB-C 3.1 (TB3, PD, DP, USB3.1 Gen2), headset
* MBP: 4xUSB-C 3.1 (TB3, PD, DP, USB3.1 Gen2), headset
* XPS13: i7-8565U (GPU Intel UHD 620): $1590 (+tax)
* MBA: i5-8210Y (?) (GPU Intel UHD 617): $1400 (+tax)
* MBP (no Touch Bar): I5-7360U  (GPU Intel UHD 640): $1500 (+tax)
* XPS13: $1840
* MBA: $1800
* MBP (no TB): $1900
* XPS13 - Ubuntu: 1599€ / 1819$
* XPS13 - Windows: 1729€ / 1967$
* MBA - i5 - 2089€ / 2377$
* MBP - i5 - 2489€ / 2832$
* MBP - i7 - 2849€ / 3242$
Entry models (256GB, 8GB, i5):
* XPS13 - Ubuntu - HD : 1289€ / 1467$, has a i7 instead of an i5 !?!
* XPS13 - Windows - HD: 1309€ / 1490$
* XPS13 - Windows - UHD: 1479€ / 1683$
* MBA - i5 - 1599€ / 1820$
* MBP - i5 - 1999€ / 2275$
* MBP - i7 - 2359€ / 2685$
I noticed that dell doesn't offer customization. They have many different configurations but some combinations are missing e.g. no 256-16-UHD option.
That being said I find it difficult to rationalize Apple's prices. I'd like to replace my ancient MBA but I'm not willing to pay 400€ for their new MBA, just to get an inferior CPU.
Not to mention the huge price difference for higher-end configurations.
I'd be very interested how well dell notebooks last - do they have similar 'design flaws' as the current gen Apple notebooks (keyboard, display cable)?
I have 9360, it has pretty annoying coil whine. The touchpad has some play which is extremely annoying, for almost a year I always used a trackball instead. Now I've gotten used to it somewhat, but still it irks me every day when I have to use it. Headset port stopped recognizing dedicated microphones at some point, probably some driver/software problem on the Windows side.
For work it is okay and I chose it basically because the Macbook Pros of the time already had the horrible keyboards and touchbar. In retrospect I should have gone with Lenovo, at least their keyboards are much better and they have actual docks, which are very convenient for work. Touchpads are still crap, though they may have improved since T440s.
Compared to the late 2013 Macbook Pro I have the MBP has better hardware, but I prefer Windows and Linux to OSX.
(512GB SSD, 16GB Ram, i7, UDH)
* XPS13 - Ubuntu: €1820
* XPS13 - Windows: €1899
* MBA - i5: €2119
* MBP - i5: €2589
* MBP - i7: €2949
Entry model (256GB, 8GB, i5):
* XPS13 - Ubuntu - HD (with i7): €1429
* XPS13 - Ubuntu - UHD: Not offered in this config
* XPS13 - Windows - HD (with i7): €1399
* XPS13 - Windows - UHD: €1599
* MBA - i5: €1629
* MBP - i5: €1800
* MBP - i7: €2159
Apple is a bit more competitive here, mostly because Dell raised their prices, though interestingly the high end Apple options cost more here and the low end Apple options cost less.
My current laptop is a 2017 XPS 15. The Windows wifi drivers were rubbish on launch, but they finally patched it early last year. Durability wise it's been fine (Though not yet at usage levels of lifespan that I can say much about long term wear), as were my previous Dell laptops (An Inspiron and XPS Studio in the 2000s)
It's just one data point, but I have an XPS 13 model 9350 that's now 3 years old (used daily) and I haven't had any faults develop yet.
The screen isn't covered with Gorilla Glass and gets marked up the way Macbooks used to. The monitor hinge has a little slack in it and the power connector is a bit loose.
The trackpad has been surprisingly good. The keyboard is decent. I also like the fact that I was able to swap in 32GB of memory and an NVME SSD of the make and model of my choice.
Mine came with a Fujitsu SSD, I think. I swapped in a much larger Samsung 960 Pro. I've ordered several of these for others and they all came with a Samsung OEM unit of equivalent performance.
In summary, the hardware doesn't suck and it runs Linux, which is the best part.
I'll pass it onto the kids once I get one of these shiny new ones and will be replacing the keyboard and fan when I do. Some of the plastic covering on a few of the keys is starting to come off and the fan bearings are starting to go so sometimes it's louder than it ought to be.
It runs really well, there's a minor issue with the touchpad but it does still work well enough that I haven't done anything about it.
Dell continue to push out firmware updates. I bought a USB-C monitor (that acts as a USB-A hub) and I power it via that.
Screen is beautiful, of course in certain light conditions the gloss is a negative, but it looks beautiful often and has great brightness.
My next laptop will either be a System76 or another XPS Developer Edition. I really appreciate what they have done.
512GB/16GB i5 2239€
512GB/16GB i7 2599€
Are you looking at the same thing?
bt didn't work with wifi, changed the wifi card, but still troubles
weird display dimming when reading white on black and no official patch (can link you an unofficial one)
speaker blown (don't eq them)
battery bloated (replaced for free even out of warranty)
hard to get to sleep
very short screws, can get lost if you don't use lock tight after opening it once
I was starting to regret my recent-ish purchase of a System76...until I saw even this new XPS maxed out at 16Gib. I specifically bought my Galaga Pro because it was the only 32GiB + matte-screen (well, not _that_ matte) laptop I could find, though it was a bit more expensive than this new XPS.
If you're looking, I think its great, though one big bummer is there's no good dock (single-connection, 2x2k displayport out), in part because its USB-C can't charge it. I literally have 6 things I plug into it at work each morning (power, keyboard, mouse, headphones, HDMI monitor, miniDP monitor). Some docks would cut that down, but I feel like if I can't get down to 1 it's not worth it.
The W-series isn't nearly as sleek as the XPS, although the T-series ones are looking pretty good these days!
T450 (has 2 dimm slots) but not T450s (smaller, has 1 dimm slot + 1 soldered module)
4= display size (14’)
5= cpu generation (here: Broadwell)
So an equivalent to the new XPS would be a
Thunderbolt is only available from T470 onwards (not in the x270)
The Reddit ThinkPad forum is your friend here.
I also swapped the Killer wireless for an Intel unit.
I've never bought anything from them since.
I could not disagree more with you as a developer.
- The X1 Carbon lets me use Nvidia GPUs using an eGPU.
- It has a much, much better keyboard. On my MBP, I hit this problem:
- The high end models don't force you to get a touchbar.
- I love having more port diversity and number of slots vs. the MBP. No dongle life for me.
- As an added bonus, I got the X1 Carbon Yoga, which has an OLED display. The display is gorgeous with fabulously dark blacks.
The one thing that I miss from the Macbook pro is it has a much better trackpad. But overall, I am very happy with the switch, and it's overly simplistic to just say "Macbooks stand on their own".
Though overall, I couldn't be happier with the switch.
I completely agree that the lenovo is a better laptop, for similar reasons to the ones you've mentioned.
I think the 'Macbooks stand on their own' comment is more along the lines of "you either operate in the macOS space, or the 'everything else' space. There isn't much crossover due to the large shift in workflow between macOS and windows". This rings true for me - I have the option of using a mac for work, but I prefer to run windows on a lenovo because the hardware is just better. I can deal with windows 10's quirks, and I just run a VM for all my linux needs - no half-assing it with the BSD terminal in macOS.
Besides that, how does linux work on your macbook?
I think Google has swung more towards Linux laptops, but honestly, this, the T or X series from Lenovo, maybe System76 are the only realistic choices I see there personally. And at the end of the day, Linux and Mac offer pretty similar programming experiences.
While I understand the merits of supporting everyone's toaster, it would be nice to see an unofficial truce around a couple of key laptop models. If I could get a ThinkPad X1 Carbon or a Dell XPS13 and absolutely know it would work, I would seriously consider moving on from my launch-day original 2012 rMBP. Unfortunately, that's still the best available option for someone who's primary job is something other than writing code but writes code and admins servers sometimes.
When my machine started refusing to charge, my "next day on-site service" extended warranty turned into "you called 20 minutes too late, so it's actually in 2 days" and then "Oh, while we confirmed the appointment time with you, we never did with the tech, we'll find out when they're coming" and then "Oh yeah, they're not actually coming today, you have to take another day off work too". Then, after the tech managed to replace my main board without any ESD protection and it started completely hard locking up every 5 minutes (even in their own diagnostic tool and the EFI setup tool) it took me several days worth of phone calls and emails before they swapped it out.
Of course, about a year later, I started having problems with the SECOND laptop they'd sent me and had to send it back to have parts replaced. A few months later, right after the warranty expired, the screen started going crazy. I've found the right place to hit it to fix it whenever that happens (about once a month).
Next machine I get, I'm going back to an X1 Carbon.
I'm pretty careful about turning everything off -- for example bluetooth, etc. For maximum power savings I use a very high contrast colour scheme and turn the backlight down using xblacklight. Indoors, in the library for instance, I can happily turn it down to 7-11%. Outdoors, I usually need 70%. If I'm on the train or bus (I often work on the go), then I'm usually about 20%. The backlight is really the biggest thing to consider. It helps to spend some time in Powertop and see what's draining the battery.
Another important thing is that I run as little disk access as possible. Even with only 8 gigs of memory, I have no swap partition or swap file. I try to stay out of the browser and do as much as possible with TDD -- files will be cached by the OS. As much as possible I have no VMs running (obviously with the lack of memory) and as we've pretty much moved over to Docker this has helped out.
Apart from that I'm pretty anal about my machine. I don't allow anything to run that I'm not completely aware of. I've got a processor monitor running and if I notice it spike when I'm not doing anything, I track down what's going on. Same thing with memory.
Ah.. One more thing. I almost always have the WIFI turned off, unless I'm actually communicating with someone. I tend to work using pomodoros and spend 5 minutes every half an hour checking my email, etc. But I try to keep offline documentation, etc available.
I'm going to be replacing this machine soon (I think it's 3-4 years old now). I'll probably end up buying the V63's replacement (I forget the model number). It's supposed to have about 10% more battery, so I'm looking forward to seeing if I can relax some of my habits. If I'm not grinding the machine too much I can usually get 9-10 hours. However some days I only manage 6, which is a pain.
What does affect me is the glossy display...
Mostly though, I'm jealous of a friends' macbook keyboard and trackpad. My particular xps is not amazing in those areas
The trackpad of the XPS is worse than the macbook, but at least it feels OK. Overall, I prefer the input methods of the XPS.
However, the battery life is terrible after upgrading Ubuntu LTS from 16 to 18 as it doesn't sleep properly. I wrote a more detailed review of it here (2018 version, not the new one just released): https://unop.uk/dell-xps-13-ubuntu-review/
Now I know where to put the tape! ;)
For the rest of the specs, seems to make the MBA look like a pretty fair deal so long as you like the Apple ecosystem.
Also worth looking at the Lenovo X1. Similarly light and powerful.
Edit: My only complaint with the XPS13 is the ports ... it's definitely one short (power, monitor, USB peripherals) which forces you to get the expensive dock. Not cool.
I am waiting for the right time to buy an ubuntu laptop, but it still seems like a MBP is the better choice. You're just much less likely to run into some weird hardware driver issue.
I guess it used to be quite a bit cheaper to get a non-apple laptop, but it seems like the other companies have figured out that you can charge more for a "premium" product..... Looking at the above comparison, price would not be a differentiator for me. ( Do I really care about what amounts to a ~$300 price difference if we were looking at literally same specs? )
It's too bad because I'd love for there to be a real, price conscious alternative to an apple laptop, but that doesn't seem to be the way the industry is going. It seems like every year dell and lenovo creep closer to apple pricing.
Similar specs to the XPS13 and weighing in at around 1KG.
But for some reason Asus don't sell the 16GB models in the UK :/
The MBA is a weird machine, to me, as it's almost as heavy and almost as expensive as the Pro, with far worse specs.
That said, the XPS 13 has been the best experience I've had with Linux on a laptop. The bundled Ubuntu install works out of the box, but even on other distros it's not difficult to set up, and I've not encountered any driver issues, which have been common on every other laptop I've installed Linux on. It helps that it's a great quality laptop in general - anecdotally in my office, we see far more hardware issues with the latest Macbooks than with XPSs.So I'd recommend it for anyone who wants a Linux or Windows laptop, or is considering switching away from Mac without compromising on hardware quality.
Dell dropped the ball by giving this laptop two TB3 ports and one that only does USB.
I didn’t realise at first, this was due to the difference in USB vs Thunderbolt.
It's definitely confusing and a bit frustrating that it's different if you're in a scenario where the bandwidth matters, but at least it's just numbers rather than devices outright not working.
Some of us do work in actual offices and not in some coffee shops down the street. ;)
Whoah, what's up with that? Not sure why you're inferring this coffee shop story or why you're doing this smug posturing thing but it's pretty obnoxious.
USB-C adds additional pins for alt-mode as well as a higher power delivery allowance, but the USB data protocol part of it is the same as any other type of port of the same spec.
That was a serious miss on Dell's part. I'm not sure why they did that?
Makes it a little annoying for users.
That would effectively mean I have zero ports free when charging and with my permanent Yubikey plugged in. It's never been an issue in practice, but I also wish that Dell would remove the ambiguity and make them all TB3 ports.
You can't transfer data between two Macs using USB-C to USB-C cable that comes as a charger...
I anticipate that 2019 will be the year when we'll get monitors that are the "dock", so in practice most users will use at most a single port.
I plug in my laptop and the monitor comes on, my keyboard and mouse start working over USB, my speakers start working because I turned the builtin soundbar off and enabled the in USB-C/3.55mm DAC that's also built into some Dell monitors, and even my printer and a synthesizer that I use as a practice (piano-)keyboard are are ready to go.
In the past, when I was connecting a laptop to a monitor I had two options:
1) Use a proprietary dock. This is as convenient as the usb-c cable, but you can use it with a single brand of devices. Also, in the case of the usb-c cable you are free to move the laptop around the desk. Not so easy with a dock.
2) Plug the monitor and the peripherals directly the ports of the laptop. When you have to switch laptops frequently, it feels like this process is taking ages. It also looks ugly to have an octopus laptop on the desk.
Having said that the dedicated usb-c docks are notoriously problematic. I have tried a lot to find a single one with more than 3 star reviews, but it seems impossible. At least, I have not heard complains about the built-in docks inside monitors. In this case though, you have to make some sacrifices in the number and variety of ports. For example, in my case, I do not have ethernet.
I'm more hesitant in practice because the USB3 hub in my current Dell display didn't get along with my computer and would cause blue screens when used. Easy to avoid, I just don't have the USB hub plugged in.
As things get more and more integrated, a problem anywhere in the system means the whole thing doesn't work and you can't avoid the busted parts.
That's a general issue: laptops are pretty integrated and even in your tower it's pretty hard to patch the mobo (and let's not get into the issue of upgrading your L1 cache.
I started computing on a machine (PDP-6) on which you could add instructions with a wire wrap pencil. That's clearly impossible today, but with modern manufacturing, increased integration typically means increased overall reliability.
On the plus side, issues like mine ought to become less common with an integrated device, since it would become impossible for Dell to not test their USB hub when they plug in the display cable.
And I suppose I've considered a thunderbolt hub for the convenience and decided against it just because of what they cost. If that sort of integration were "free" with displays, yeah I'd probably take it.
I wouldn’t recommend buying one if you saw one — the power delivery spec only goes up to 100 W!
I'd either go with a hardware combination that you or a trusted reviewer has tested, or wait another year or so for the bugs to get worked out.
EDIT: Or just avoid Dell, they seem to be behind the curve on figuring out Thunderbolt 3.
Personally I want a 15-inch laptop with Linux preinstalled or perfectly supported, a great trackpad, a bright screen so I can work outdoors, and USB A so I can plug in my mech keyboards without dongles because I lose them all the time.
I do not use Linux on my XPS15. It's just a personal preference but I prefer Windows on my personal machines. I use many virtual machines on the laptop, and those have no issues, but that is a bit different than running it as a OS ;).
But I do love the laptop a lot! That is quite annoying that there are some Linux problems and that you pay a bit extra for MS. I stick with using Linux at work when I am purely doing development work, and at home when doing casual stuff, like a little coding, gaming, and web browsing I prefer Windows.
I do use a mech portably...I like to carry one in my laptop bag and set up at a picnic table at a nearby park. I'll use the built-in keyboard for light work but with heavy typing I need the mech for ergonomics.
The only thing I'm really missing is an ethernet port on the laptop itself, but that's hard in this form factor.
What issues do you have? I do not notice a difference from the xps13 quality.
Poor USB-C support (sometimes ethernet died, sometimes screens changed resolutions...). The problem kept changing from BIOS update to BIOS update.
Then the USB-C harware failed: I could use it only if my laptop stayed perfectly still.
Only a few hours of battery life.
Speakers died after 3 month.
The 2 first points were fixed after years of hit and miss BIOS updates. It felt like beta testing the product.
Tons of complains from many users on Dell forum, with zero help from Dell.
Given the price of the machine, it's a damn shame.
- coil whine under load;
- poor heat sink, under little load i7 goes to 100C and CPU throttling kicks in;
- sometimes 'w' button seems to be 'stuck' in pressed state even when it's physically un-pressed; seems to be a firmware keyboard bug, since I've seen same problem on another XPS 13;
- I've had to replace Killer WiFi card, because RTT for packets spiked up every time card was scanning for networks;
- that 'spidey-fingers' webcam;
- that 'Content Adaptive Brightness Control' when gamma-level goes off every time you switch from black to white image on the screen;
- unable to replace battery, since even when I've ordered battery from authorized service center they gave me non-official third-party battery which was not accepted by laptop;
- connecting 4K@60Hz is kinda problematic, since you need to find USB-C adapter which supports it;
lol, that's a weird one, but solved with the external keyboard
that's a weird one, how to turn that off? (win 10)
I do really wish I could've got the laptop without the 4k screen because on a 13" laptop I would rather save the battery life and not have a glossy screen, alas, it wasn't available last year in Australia with 16GB RAM. It does seem that this year though it is available.
I use an external 4k screen and don't have any issues, although I am using the Dell TB16 dock. The more annoying issue is that you can use 4k@60 over HDMI since it isn't supported by the Intel GPU, you need to use a DP connector.
I've had several XPS13s with keyboard issues. I honestly cannot consider it a "developer edition" when the keyboard is wonky. Contacted HP support every time, found them trying to ignore the issue while whole support forums where mobbing up in anger over the issue. Finally they admitted, but nothing happened. I'm on a T420 now, while I really-really wanted to support suppliers that provide Linux-out-of-the-box machines.
I have HP probook where you can replace the keyboard easily. When I got the machine with "premium" keyboard, a few keys were wobbly, made different squeaky sounds and had overall inconsistent feel to them. I went to HP website and ordered a replacement -- it came with other keys being bad. I called HP and they sent me replacement for replacement -- the same story -- their keyboards are just so cheaply made and quality control so lacking, that you have to be very lucky to get one with all keys working consistently.
Keyboards are the worst part of the laptop these days.
(okay I had to contact HP several times as well, but that was a server unit, and after some calls/ceremony it got adequately serviced)
I don't use the Killer WIFI because my OS doesn't support it yet. Perhaps I'll be able to complain about that later in the year.
Sometimes I regret not picking up a Thinkpad X1 C6 (I have lifelong Thinkpad keyboard envy, since owning a T something many years ago), but they're way more expensive and I keep reading about disappointing manufacturing problems with those things, and I know that'd be a pain to deal with in my location.
Similarly, I sent a X1 Carbon back this summer due to missing Linux support -- suspend, touchpad, CPU scaling, and lots of small bugs.
(I'm quite happy with my older X1 though)
Anyways, I suggest sending it back and ask for refund next time to get a laptop with coil whine. There is only one way to teach manufacturers that this is unacceptable.
It is part of Intel's shenanigans to improve battery life.
CABC bothered me on my surface book too, fortunately they allow you to disable this. It previously (pre-9350) required a firmware update but can now be switched off using the latest intel display driver control panel.
Next machine's another X1 Carbon for me (I had the 1st gen before this).
At least with Apple, you can take it to the store for authorized service.
Ah, so it's a common issue. I also have the 'w' problem on Dell Lattitude E7450.
- The touchpad is just garbage compared to the MBP, to the point I have an even more keyboard centric setup on it than my desktop, because I want to drop it out of a window every time I use the touchpad.
- Fans. I've accepted that most laptops will run active cooling more than any radiative chassis MBP, but the issues are that while the fans run constantly, they also change speeds constantly in both Windows and Ubuntu. They'd be far less annoying if they ran at a higher, but steady RPM by averaging response over a large time window. Manually managing fans feels like 1998. Also, for a $3.5K laptop that runs fans constantly, these are some of the jankiest, most rattling prone fans I've heard. Most colleagues with XPS 13/15 have sent them in for fan replacement at least once.
A more niche gripe is that 16:9 is the wrong aspect ratio for a professional laptop.
- Screen quality and brightness.
- Keyboard (why I can't just get a new MBP).
- Hardware configurability.
- Many hardware issues at first, especially in linux, were quickly and effectively fixed by Dell driver and firmware updates.
-Many issues with power management, where I would close the lid and it would sleep, only to wake up later randomly. I would find it in my backpack blazing hot with fans at 100%.
-This was the 4k model, and at that point windows barely supported that resolution so the experience was awful with all but the most robust apps. Any legacy app was unusable. I expect this is better now.
-The speakers on 2/3 gave off a poppy, static sound during boot.
-Network connectivity is horrible. Sometimes the adapter would just turn off, requiring a restart. Resuming from sleep would take a full 60 seconds to connect to known networks. Insane
It seems all the trackpads got worse when they went button-less to copy Apple.
Maybe the Latitudes have a better touchpad? I don't mind the Lenovo T-series touchpads and they look similar.
I also own MBP13 - and I prefer the keyboard on my Dell over it.
What aspect ratio is more fitting for a professional laptop? 4:3?
Sidenote: I've also read about decent openbsd support for the older version of this laptop. 
It is the graphics card? Or it does have better build quality or better keyboard or something? Build quality is important to me since I use my laptop all the time.
I sort of understand why computer makers like glossy screens: because they just look better to the causal shopper. OK. But in a laptop that is aimed at professionals? People that stare at the screen all day long are sophisticated enough to know that a matte screen is just better.
I'm often on the train and I do not envy the poor souls that work on an enterprise-bought laptop with a glossy screen and that have to swing their heads the whole time to avoid reflections from the train window.
BTW, a thorough (p)review of the 9380: https://www.ultrabookreview.com/24336-dell-xps-13-9380/
By contrast, well-designed glossy displays minimize internal refraction and also cause light at high angles to reflect, reducing the amount of ambient light which pollutes the display. The result is that the display appears much brighter in any setting, black are blacker and do not get washed out by brights. Colors show higher dynamic range, and small details are crisper. In addition, well-designed glass glossy displays (such as those on the MacBook Pro) are actually visible and easy to use outdoors in full daylight. Even when reflections show up on glass displays, it's easy to see past them because they're full optical reflections with correct depth in stereo vision, meaning that you can correctly focus on the screen without focusing on the reflection.
Glossy displays are bad under basically two conditions:
* They are warped plastic, such as on older Dell laptops, causing weird shiny glossy glare at all angles that cannot be ignored.
* You have positioned your screen so that there is a small but very very bright reflection behind you, and cannot tilt your display.
Now I have Thinkpad X280 with the mate screen and I really like it. Reflections are just not there and I can tilt the screen 180 degrees.
I considered getting one. But they don't come with on-site warranty in my area -- and the warranty can't be upgraded to include on-site service. Not sure what their deal is with that. Makes me think they're crappy machines that are hard to service. Or maybe Lenovo just don't want my business?
Comfort: I don't need to adjust myself or the screen's position depending on the light.
Power saving: My brightness can be lower, because it's not competing with reflection.
To me, these greatly outweigh any advantages of a glossy screen.
On thing which may be important: I require a dark desktop theme.
- Glare for one, never had a glossy screen not be horrid with glare.
This... just doesn't track my experience, at least with MBPs up through 2015. "easy to see past [reflections]" is a subjective point even if what you're saying about the optics is 100% correct.
Retina displays are great in some ways but for me a typical open office plan lighting will do the job of providing distracting light reflections on any glossy display, and depth of reflection has never made them any less distracting than, say, someone standing behind me -- sure, you can focus on something else but it doesn't mean they're not a distraction. Not a problem with matte screens unless there's sun-bright direct light. And for outdoor use, sure, that can be a problem, but if I'm picking between any retina model and my mid-2012 non-retina antiglare/matte MBP, the latter has won every time. Which is one of the reasons I'm typing this on that same model and dreading the day it outright breaks or falls out of OS update.
Now if you're more worried about any subpixel smudginess, it's never bothered me, but OK, that's a fair personal preference. And as for scatter through matte from light sources degrading images, outside of bright daylight, I've never even noticed on-screen quality being compromised.
But who knows, maybe your perceptual wetware works differently. And if you like glass/glossy displays, congratulations, you have plenty of options, and that's great. None of that is enough reason to assume it's a global experience.
That does not work for a laptop - the glass surface is too close to the pixels for the "focus past the glass" to make a difference.
The light which is not "at high angles" reflects into your eyes from the surface you are focusing on (+/- 0.5 mm).
You have misunderstood. You are focusing past the reflection, which will appear to be many meters "past" the glass.
But still glossy displays seem to have plenty to reflect right into your eyes.
Because developers like sharp text (as opposed to smudged due to the diffusion filter) and better color and saturation too.
Not all of us work under back lights we cannot avoid...
I mean, it might be a personal preference, but it's not like some objective law that developer === matte screen (like eg. 3D artist === discreet GPU).
A matte screen should be default for this one.
I always enjoy it when someone arrogantly poses a subjective statement as fact from a position of arbitrary authority. I like it especially so when there are a plethora of reasons against their position as in this case.
Way to stereotype..? I guess I am not sophisticated enough because I prefer a glossy screen.
> I'm often on the train and I do not envy the poor souls that work on an enterprise-bought laptop with a glossy screen and that have to swing their heads the whole time to avoid reflections from the train window.
We unsophisticated commoners work from desks and where I don't seem to have this problem.
Depends where you work and if you have control over the lighting. I used to have a horrible time with overhead fluorescent tubes, glare and flickering. To the point where I'd have to climb up and disable them. Thankfully they've gone out of style.
However on a laptop it seems silly. Last thing I want to see in my new expensive screen is my ugly mug reflected back at me.
In all three places you can move it easily (and it being a laptop makes moving it even easier).
Hundreds of thousands of developers have MBPr's which are glossy only.
The number of people doing something does not strengthen your argument. Even more so given that Apple does not offer matte displays.
Actually it very much does, it just depends on the nature of the argument.
Here it's very relevant. It's not silly to put a glossy screen on a laptop if tons of people buy it -- and even prefer it.
No for sure there are people who want MacOS -- but again those people don't have a choice if they want a Apple they get gloss. So the argument does not hold.
People buy apple despite glossy screens, not because of glossy screens.
Or if the iOS thing is a red herring, and tons of developers still buy Apple products regardless.
I'm not an iOS/macOS developer and still use Apple products (and just about everybody else in my company). And in most dev conferences for totally unrelated stuff (Golang, Rust, Java, etc.) the number of MBP yielding devs is 50% or most (and most of the speakers even more so).
If apple offered a matte MBP then you would have numbers that could mean something. You have many users using glossy displays because that is all that apple offers. It does not mean they actually prefer glossy screens.
I remember when apple stopped offering matte and TONS of people were outraged.
They did offer a matte and glossy option and some point, and moved on to glossy only. Safe to assume the buyers have spoken?
There was a huge backlash. People hates it. Apple pushed forward anyways. They knew they had a monopoly on Apple hardware and the iPhone would ensure they could make silly decisions without backlash.
Has the market spoken about removing evey single port from their laptops ? Donglegate ? There are many other things apple did that people have been very vocal about.
also billions of flies can't be wrong about dung.
And they aren't: dang is nutricious and very beneficial to flies, they are right to consume it.
That's irrelevant, as what matters here is what makes sense for a company to offer -- not what someone thinks is "better" for themselves. And that's a popularity metric.
They have a coating to reduce glare. Consider them half glossy/matte.
I just love how good it looks. That makes it better for me.
Suggesting that people who like glossy screens are unsophisticated is just unwarranted gatekeeping.
Not all glossy screens are bad, just the ones released relatively recently are.
Sony was making near perfect high end LCDs with glossy screen, glass surface, AND real AR coating.
In comparison, later design panels simply had glossy polycarbonate with poor still poor surface finish.
Laminated and "one glass" screen also do come in varying quality levels. One glass screens with AR coatings are very, very good, but ones with poor lamination, and mismatched refraction indexes are horrid.
"The group I'm conveniently in is more sophisticated." Mmm, hmm. Matte screens suck because everything is blurry and smeared. I mean, if your work/life balance is out of whack and you have to work in moving vehicles, I could see the need. But professionals that work someplace other than sweatshops prefer glossy screens with sharp pixels.
Non-touch-screen models are matte.
At least that was the case for my XPS 15, and I was told it is a fairly general rule that touch screen laptops are glossy.
A matte screen isn't just better. You get that weird prism-like diffraction of light, that turns a white pixel into coloured dots. Personally I much prefer to maybe have to move my machine occasionally to avoid a reflection than to have that weird fuzziness. For a laptop screen, anyway.
The only problem is that you cannot open the display up fully. They block at 160° or so.
In many situations it would be super useful to have the laptop opened up 180°. In a plane for example. Or when it sits on a desk in a laptop stand and you use an external keyboard.
Running a laptop comparison site myself (https://www.productchart.com), I wonder if we should add '180°' to the filter list. It seems like an odd feature. It's super useful to me. Never heard anybody else talk about it though.
Obviously both our experience is anecdotal but if it was driving purchasing decisions you'd see more laptops that can open 180 since the design trade-offs are relatively minor in the overwhelming majority of cases.
But typing on a vertical keyboard is probably not awesome.
But then you don't have the option of a matte screen. And that is essential for me.
I am waiting for the day we have matte touchscreens.
Why would you do such atrocity and how can you really keep clean a non-smooth surface which you constantly touch with your fingers are two issues that I better not think too much about.
I am typing this comment using one of these.
Taking into account the context of this story, does it make sense to add "Linux" to the OS list?
With that, your site would be very useful to me, without it, not so much.
Never buying a Dell again. Their support were worse than useless, insisting that somehow installing Linux had caused the problem.
I'm eagerly waiting for my first Purism laptop, then I can get 30 mins of my day back.
About the only thing I don't do much is use it as a tablet as its kind of heavy, even though I have the Dell pen for it.