Definitely sucky, I was waiting for and would have upgraded to an SE2 in a heartbeat. It's the perfect size and I really don't understand why folks no longer want phones that can be used in one hand or fits into a pocket.
I don't think it's a case of "folks no longer want phones that can be used in one hand or fits into a pocket"
I think it's more a case of the companies saying "what you want is a bigger, shiny screen so you can use it like a computer, nobody has small phones anymore, don't be left out"
They have gone from a useful accessory, to a status/fashion symbol where bigger and faster is always better*
* For a given value of better
(Obviously some people actually do want bigger screens because they need it for things, but I would say they are in the minority)
I'm not convinced that it's the minority that want it though. It probably _is_ the minority that _need_ it.
But if I look around, I see a bunch of crappy big screens around, because "bigger is better" right? And sometimes, those bigger screens really are crappy. Some of them are decent quality, but they tend to also cost a packet, just like the iPhone, but not as crazy expensive as an iPhone. Still there are a lot of big crappy screens to be found around.
It's not people who changed their mind, it's Apple.
Most people never wanted small smartphones. It's particularly true in Asian countries. When I first came to Korea in 2010, some people jumped on the Galaxy Tab, because it was the first Android device that was big enough (and believe me, it was terrible tablet in many ways, and even worse a phone).
Apple probably doesn't want to bother selling niche products in highly saturated markets anymore, especially given that the SE was also a lower margin model. For one American/European consumer that is unhappy, they'll probably sell ten iPhone Xr's somewhere else.
I love the SE because of the form factor. Would have bought the next one.
But I have to imagine a lot of SE buyers were doing so based on price rather than because it has an awesome form factor. Apple is now serving the cheap side of the market with the 7, which will probably make the cheap buyers a lot happier than the SE.
I had a 6S work phone for half a year, then decided to try an SE for a few weeks (and send it back if I liked the 6S better). So I had both at the same time. SE won hands down.
You would probably be wrong. I had a 5S before and got the SE.
Really like the form factor and to me this is peak Iphone. Everything after this is a downhill ride for me.
What I like about the SE is the small form factor, supported by a vendor who I know will keep providing OS / Security updates. All the status and 2FA applications I need running on a supported platform.
I've used every iPhone since the 5, including the SE, and I think the X is the best phone they've ever made, so much that I don't plan on upgrading until next year's refresh.
The only reason I'm not buying a second one right now to keep as a backup is that the SE's small screen eventually will not be worth supporting by my favorite apps. My guess is by this time next year, I'll need a new phone just to be able to use them.
I find it hard to believe us small phone people will be taken care of by Apple ever again.
I love my SE. I'll probably get an over-sized Android in the future just for web browsing and watching movies, but I'll keep my SE until it breaks for everything else where some measure of security is important (auth keys, emails, communication, etc.), and I'll probably replace it with another SE when it does.
Yeah. I like my SE and I'll keep it as long as I can (which will probably be for another year before I start running out of storage) but if I were in the market for a new iPhone today I'd go with the 8. It's not that much larger than the SE, it's certainly a lot cheaper than anything in the X series and it has wireless charging, not to mention a home button. Now that Apple has eliminated the SE the 8 is the best phone they're making.
The problem with Apple is that their iOS products older than 2-3 years are becoming quickly unusable.
I have some old iPads and I cannot install anything necessary like Firefox because their iOS is too old and there is no update available (happens with iPad mini).
Or battery life deteriorates much quicker than in a typical Android phone (happens with iPhone 6).
Or because next software update had made device totally unusable (that happened to iPad 1 which become literally unusable due to apps/browser crashes).
While everyone is moaning the demise of the SE do note that iOS12 supports the SE and the 5S. My guess is Apple is doing this to hold onto the small form factor customers long enough to make the final decision on small form factor product.
I am a happy owner of an SE and I am afraid of the moment it breaks down. Can anyone recommend an alternative compact phone with similar build quality and the same features in terms of software and hardware?
I'm still using an iPhone 4S 64GB with a Third Rail removable battery case. Blog posts like this make it clear that there's a market for small-screen phones, even though none of the usual companies are building them. I think it's time to give up hope for Apple, and build a new ecosystem.
Old iPods are very hackable [1]. There are suppliers making replacement backplates, click wheels, extended capacity batteries, and SD card adaptors. There's plenty of room for a Raspberry Pi Zero in the back, although I use a PQI Air Card. It can't run touchscreen apps though, which rules out maps/cameras/typing/many other apps.
Is there a touchscreen that can fit inside 103.5 x 61.8 mm? That's the part I would need to build my own iPod successor.
My kids have SEs, and I have an X. I appreciate the X oh so much in comparison. I absolutely love swiping up instead of clicking a home button. I delight in FaceID which works flawlessly even as I’ve lost 20 pounds and the shape of my face has changed fairly significantly over the last year.
Most of all, I can actually type on the X, whereas when I go back to the kids’ SEs I can’t figure out how I ever got anything done on that thing at all.
Headphone jack? Where we’re going, we don’t need jacks.
The one and only downside of the X is that it must, must be in a case. I never put my iPhones in cases and never managed to crack one. The X with its all glass back, super slim profile, and curved edges is just too damn slippery.
The bonus of putting the $1,000+ device in a case is that the camera bump disappears and the thickness ends up just about right for me.
Wireless charging has been great, especially once I got one that held the phone raised up instead of flat (easier to position on just one axis) and rated for 10W.
The size of the X I feel is so much better than the SE and still perfectly usable one handed.
I really really don’t miss the home button. I find it so damn clunky on the SE now after getting to live without it on the X, and particularly double clicking home (versus the swipe up and to the right on the X) is just tedious.
I assume the extra waterproofing you get without the home button has literally saved my device several times by now.
I had an iPhone 4. And 5. And 5s. It’s a beautiful device. But it’s by no means an insurmountable pinnacle of design.
I honestly haven’t look that closely at the new lineup, but I’m just not currently in the market for an upgrade. The X covers every use case and leaves me wanting nothing. The home buttons on all my iPhones always wore out, got sticky, or eventually unresponsive after a few years. I’m somewhat curious what will ultimately take down my X, if I don’t drop it hard, I can’t see what about it could possibly wear out.
Last year my iPhone 5 died while on a flight, so I stopped in duty free to buy a new one. I was about to pickup an iphone X when I realized that I couldn't stand it up on it's end and take videos, which I do on a daily basis when practicing my instrument. There was an iphone SE 128GB sitting next to the iphone X for less than 1/2 the price ... I expect to use this phone for another 3 years until they've slowed iOS down enough to make it unusable.
Unexpectedly, the killer feature for me ended up being, "Can I record myself drumming without needing some stupid attachment?"
I just preorded a new iPhone XS to replace my pixel, but I think I have to agree.
The iPhone 5s was the first iPhone I ever bought and the experience was simply magical. The phone itself was so beautiful, and the operating system just gave it this unbeatable cohesion.
I hope the iPhone XS can replicate at least some of that feeling, and I'm willing to let it. But I'm also skeptical of that.
I guess Apple strategy for this is: if you need secondary device for situations where it is uncomfortable to use your primary big screen iPhone - buy Apple Watch cellular, if you just want cheap entry to iOS - there is older gen phones (iPhone 7 for this year). Probably those who just want a small primary phone is a niche (and not very profitable) market.
As a developer the SE is a pain because the screen is so much smaller (especially horizontally) than every other model. Things that fit on other iPhones are big issues on the SE.
This will make life easier in the long run. And I’m guessing this is true for Apple too.
But I get why people loved them. I like the 6 screen size and don’t want to go back, but the SE feels ‘right’ somehow.
"Apple removing the iPhone SE from sale does not mean you can stop designing for its resolution soon.
Non-Plus iPhones can be used in zoomed mode, which means they’ll have the same logical resolution as an SE."
Fwiw as a developer, being able to debug shaders, tinker with ARKit and have some sort of middle-ground baseline specs as my primary/everyday device is a huge win for me personally.
When „designing“ views I tend to face challenges from the other end of the spectrum: „what am I going to put here so there‘s not too much empty/negative space on the larger screens without making the layout look empty or clunky?“
Every part of this is wrong. But the "notch trend" bit is hilarious. The idea that the notch is a "trend" Apple started on purpose, rather than a design element that was necessitated by making a full-screen phone that still needs to have 9 sensors and devices pointing forwards is laughable enough, but the idea that Apple would refuse to implement another design because of the "notch trend" is full-on goofy. Apple doesn't think or work that way.
If you increased the effective resolution the touch targets would get very hard to use.
I don’t think the notch is a factor in this.
Apple knows how many they sell. I’m guessing their sales metrics show it’s just a tiny tiny portion of sales. The fact it’s no longer similar to other phones they’re still selling means the economy of scale isn’t there anymore.
I love the SE, but this is my biggest gripe - apps don't consistently work well on them, which IMO is one of the features of the Apple ecosystem (compared to Android, which is a shitshow of different device sizes/landscapes).
It's funny how a few years ago iOS developers griped about things when the iphone 6 plus suddenly came out. Of course back then, autolayout was still only 1-2 years old.
Agreed. Having to support both the iPhone SE and the iPhone X aspect ratio is really difficult since they are on opposite extremes. I'm quite pleased with the removal of this size configuration - hopefully in about 2 years we won't need to keep supporting it.
The little cross in the corner of tech crunch articles is very annoying, especially since it redirects you to some clunky, slow loading news aggregation page. Also the page redirects you as you scroll past the end of the article. If you scroll down, then back up, the article is no longer there! Absolutely bizarre and aggravating UI/UX...
The SE or it’s equivalent will be back. It’s going to be smaller than the XS, with an edge to edge display, no home button, and no headphone jack. I think it’ll be in the next 6 months, but if not, within 12 for sure. It just makes sense. The only reason we didn’t get one this week is to keep the “new” lineup simple.
I don’t know about best, but I do love the form factor and wish they had refreshed it. I’ll end up getting an Xs but I’ll miss having a phone comfortably in my pocket.
I guess the emerging market play didn’t work out? Or perhaps the Chinese market got to where large portions could afford the oversized screens sooner than expected?
I hope they make another. I'm on the 8. The X's screen is too large for me to use comfortably.
I would happily buy an SE2 and use that. Wouldn't mind a higher price either if it had specs to match the larger ones. I just want to be able to use a phone one handed and not be too distracted by it.
Damn. The SE is my fave too. BUT, I only owned a 4s prior. So my experience is rather limited. My GF has a 5c, and the SE is lighter than a 5c.
The 6 and later versions were too big, for bigger screen needs I have an iPad mini. Which also seems on a glide path to obsolescence.
If we were limited to one Apple mobile device per person by decree, then maybe the bigger iPhone would make sense.
Understanding that Apple wants to avoid hyper-customization a la IBM PS/2 AND wants to maintain an air of avant-garde, some decent products have to be sacrificed.
A poster made a comment about working with the SE's limitations when designing apps for the SE. Some apps (such as Amazon) looked very crowded on my SE. Another (Manhattan Metal Prices) looks great
Maybe the SE died because it forced unwanted simplicity on app devs.
I just think they are planning to launch a Xr Mini next year.
With the iPhone SE body size they could fit it with 4.7" Display.
If they had kept the iPhone SE in the lineup, and introduce Xr next year, the reaction from people will likely be Apple bump the price of small iPhone from $349 to $599 / $649 ( Assuming $100 to $150 cheaper than Xr )
Now that iPhone SE is gone. They can make a new iPhone entry next year. Instead of replacing something with a more expensive model, they are giving you something new. It makes you value it differently. I think that is how it is going to work out next year.
iPhone 8 > iPhone Xr > iPhone Xs. Each with two different Display size.
So I have had pretty much every iPhone. I did like the 5's size. I had a 6 and 6P and skipped the 7. The P was to big. I have an X now and did not thing I would like it (carrier was willing to give $300 trade in on the 6P for an X). I LOVE it. The face unlock rocks. It is a bit bigger then I want but I can ride the train (others comments here) and use it with one hand. Just need to hold it a bit more towards the middle of the hand. The OLED screen is amazing and the camera is pretty good. That being said if they made a smaller X I would get it. I have also switched to CarPlay for pretty much everything while driving.
I got sick of switching SIM cards when I traveled.
Anyway, grew to really love it.
The size is perfect. It's flat and perfect without a case.
Biggest feature: It has Apple Pay, a home button, and a thumb reader... I feel like such a putz trying to use Apple Pay on the X... like, "Hey hold on, Mr. Merchant, I have to take my sunglasses off and smile at my phone for it to authorize my credit card..."
I hate that we have lost the thumb reader. Facial recognition isn't better, doesn't feel more polished, and we just threw out something damn near perfect for something that's meh at best.
This is a well written article, but I can't help but wonder.. was TechCrunch inspired by my response yesterday to their XR article? The thought makes me chuckle.
"The people’s iPhone is still the SE.. made for human-sized hands, includes TouchID, headphone jack, is reasonably priced, and is the lightest phone they’ve ever shipped..."
I feel this way about the Nexus 6p, another beautiful phone that will never be back. These phones had a kind of identity that modern ones don't. Nowadays they're all the same.
I got a Nokia 6.1 (new model) and it's absurdly good for the money and I truly love the design.
The black and copper looks premium against my GF's iPhone 8, It's easy to hold, it's milled out of aluminium and strongly built, it's smooth, fast (Android One is great).
And it cost a fifth of what an iPhoneX costs here.
I even liked their cheeky piss take of the Johnny Ive videos.
Seconded - we bought a Nokia 7+ for work for Android 9 beta testing (cheapest phone that gets beta updates). Nice hardware and everyone in the office likes how it looks - I'm using it as my everyday phone.
iPhone SE topic: are there any manufacturers that take older iPhone model guts and repackage them with different bodies and screens?
I would love to use an iPhone (Google doesn't do privacy) but I can't justify spending 2 to 3 times the price on something I regularly break or lose... (I generally avoid fragile expensive utility items).
Personally I love big screen phones - I don’t talk much on them but do use he web a lot so it makes sense.
My mum thought only talks on her phone and she really likes something small and simple. We got her an SE to avoid going the Android route... if her SE needs replacing and we can’t find an apple replacement then it will have to be the Android route.
The irony is that when the Android phablets came out, Jony Ive got on camera and said unequivocally: “we tested it and the iPhone 5 form factor is the right size for single handed use.”
I wish he would just explain his thinking on this. It’s such a fundamental design decision.
Killing their own good ideas is what Apple does best.
Magsafe. Firewire. Cheese grater Mac Pro. Appletalk. Rosetta. Pre-2015 MBP. Original iMovie and iWork apps. The list goes on.
I'm pretty sure they didn't remove firewire from the MacBook line until the Retina came out, which had USB 3 and Thunderbolt. Both of which are faster than Firewire.
R is the new SE.
The profitability was too low on SE or was not shouting enough ´luxury´ so they retired it for a more expensive yet still value targeted new model.
My 6s might as well be dead, with each os update it runs slower and slower... now just scrolling the screen lags to a level that makes it mostly unusable... thanks Apple.
1. Battery was replaced 3 months ago
2. I run it in "low power mode" already, otherwise it's a brick.
3. Battery Health (Beta) reports:
- Maximum Capacity 100%
- Peak Performance Capability
Your battery is currently supporting normal peak performance
I can touch the screen and it acts as though nothing is happening...swipes, taps, etc... then seconds later it will run through all the things I've been trying to do all at once... pretty much unusable at this point.
This is the downside to phones that get frequent updates. My iPhone 5 got a ridiculous number of updates (2-3 major versions) over it's life but got worse with each one.
I have a Samsung S tablet that got one major update (installed literally the day I bought it) but is exactly as same in terms of performance and utility as the day I got it. It's still perfect. Probably has some terrible security flaws, though.
The iPhone X fits perfect in my hand. I upgrade from iPhone 6 and didn't notice any difference in size. Actually use it first.
When I have to use a button to open a phone now it feels like using a fax machine. It's so incredibly sluggish, slow and clunky.
And, when I look at an iPhone with huge borders on the edge (iPhone X goes right to the edge) it gives me claustrophobic anxiety because it's so small.
People are so afraid of change. Aside from the price, there's really no reason not to upgrade.
Seriously I love the SE too. And I was coming from large screen Android world to it as my first iOS device. Maybe they'll revive it by the time mine is ready to die...
