One thing that it does do is take away the turntable GUI (or hardware) and replace it with a two-field upload form, radically reducing the amount of know-how required to perform beat-matching. That's just really scratching the surface of what a lot of "live" DJs do (as they're called these days), as many are bringing instruments like drums and saxophones (see Big Gigantic), keyboards and vocoders (see Lorenz Rhode), their voice (see Gallago), and traditional African drums (see Black Motion), let alone simple song selection and set progression - "reading the crowd".
When the tool comes along that can style-transfer two songs in the same way that it can for images, then I will admit that AI is on the verge of taking our music-creating/music-playing jobs. But for now, I'm satisfied that there's a bit more to the depth of DJing than that what an AI can learn.
I posted some general responses here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17852736
We're aiming to make the process as simple as possible, so anyone can make mashups/mixes, and will add on customizations over time. Our focus first and foremost will be to make sure that the core process is solid before we add on to it.
Our AI does do more than beatmatching as well. Though a lot of that is going to be more evident in our mix AI, which we've been focusing on recently.
(But I'm also hoping that this doesn't further dilute the music industry by making music "production" even easier. Pop music is already "algorithmically solved", and other genres aren't as unique as any fan would like to think.)
We're also DJs/producers, and as a DJ, I somewhat disagree with AI ever taking our music-creating jobs. Perhaps playing music will be somewhat more automated in the future, but history shows that creating music will just become more complex and more interesting as we continue forward. Think about it: There are still _professional_ drummers out there, people just paid to drum, when drum machines exist. There are entire orchestras that are paid almost the same salary as developers, yet the Vienna Symphonic Library lets a single person on a keyboard play an entire orchestra's score. The truth is, compositions have classically exploited the modern technology of the day to their own advantage, and I don't see that stopping anytime soon. I can even imagine a world where the independent singer/songwriter suddenly becomes more capable than ever, with AI allowing them to orchestrate entire film scores by just playing a piano or a guitar into their computer. But I don't see the creative aspect of music dying just because we built a machine to organize some stuff better for us.
But at the same time, photo style transfer is...impressive. It's interesting to me that so many engineers are focused on creating machinery that learns the photographic signal subspace, but there's not too many working on the audio signal subspace.
They try to only play relevant portions of songs, includes many other DJ rules that Mashups of 2 songs do not.
I'd argue that mixes in their current form could replace a DJ at a small bar patio.
- Really simple and intuitive start. I created my first mashup within first 2 minutes and at all times knew exactly what I was doing
- Inbuilt virality. People will show off their produced mixes to their friends and on social media.
- Actually solves a pain point. How many of us have tried mixing songs and gave up? This gives a sense of creativity while taking care of all the complexity.
Even though I don't know how they'll monetize this, it seems a really well thought out product.
Here is my first try: Disclosure - Bang That + The XX - On Hold = Hold That
Depending on how you define product, this is a major show stopper. I'd say a product can't be called well thought out, if it doesn't have monetization thought out from the start. Although there is always advertizing, I guess..
But very nice tool/toy nonetheless!
There are currently 3 major DJ software products - Serato, Rekordbox and Traktor - the ability to quickly throw together a few different tracks into a mashup could be a nice killer feature for one of them to acquire.
Or, playout software for a bar - queue up a load of music of a similar genre and have an automix created.
There's also MIXXX which is open source:
As an aside, Mixxx is an awesome piece of software, it's not quite as slick as Serato et al, but it works fantastically if your controller is suitably mapped, and is timecode vinyl agnostic which is a nice plus.
- licensing will be difficult without a paywall, I'm pretty sure this site is "illegal"
- there is no way to keep tweaking manually to correct bad sounding parts etc, which limits usefulness
As it happens I work on a similar iphone app called Pacemaker, which solves both of these problems (using spotify login and a bunch of edit tools, respectively)
The video is pretty good too:
Edit: Here's an example of an utter failure that illustrates my hypothesis: it mixes a song that has a traditional verse/chorus/verse structure with a techno track that's a monotonic crescendo. The algorithm doesn't know what to do about it (the correct answer, although not leading to great music, would be to use parts from the begginning of the crescendo track so not to overpower the pop song.)
Edit 2: Here's an easy one it gets wrong: track 1 has great loopable instrumental grooves that go on each for a few bars before rap vocals kick in. Track 2 is a person talking. It should not be overlapping vocals, it should just highlight the instrumental loops.
Covers on top of the original was a surprising success:
Pure drum tracks plus acapella:
Basically mixing any pop songs work -- here's a very very very good one with Sepultura + Pet Shop Boys
... the point being that pop music is very very regular in its verse/chorus/verse narrative curve.
DJ AssultPink - Ass ' n ' TT
Although the BPM detection usually works, It seems to have trouble getting the songs synced in phrase - 2nd tracks come in starting on the 3rd bar or something.
EDIT: 4 hours remaining... hmmm.. feeding it a 400 track playlist probably wasn't a good idea
I tested - Run DMC - It's like that vs Funky Town.
https://rave.dj/U4BPJ9duII-o9Q (gets off-sync later sadly)
None of these are perfect but Rave is A LOT of fun to mess around with, there's no denying that.
Just provide ~50 or more songs for best results
Michael Jackson, Janet Jackson & The Wurzels...
Scream Harvester: https://rave.dj/talVuJvYAn6zbA
Nasum & Napalm Death: Face the Children
: https://rave.dj/yjDMS4Pu0a81ZA (Napalm Death: Suffer the Children vs. Nasum: The Masked Face)
Du By The Hast
Ended up hiding it with an ad blocker rule.
To address a few points I've seen on here:
We do more than just beatmatching. That said, most of our recent technical advancements are done on our mix AI, as it's been our recent push.
Give mixes a try (which work better the more songs you give them)!
We'll be pivoting back to mashups soon as well to continue improvements on that AI, particularly rolling in some of the improvements we developed through the mix AI.
Our goals have really been to bring mashups and mixes to those who don't have the technical ability first and foremost, and focus on making it as accessible as possible. We want to make sure our baseline is solid before targeting customizations. I feel paraschopra's post really captured what we wanted to achieve.
Ultimately, we're still at the beginning of what we want to do, and have plenty of improvements on the way.
* Awesome job, here are some feature suggestions:
* The ability to rate the mix/mashup as the author
* The ability to rate as an audience
* visual of the algo's understanding of the songs sound profile and how its lining them up
* The ability to select the time-range of the song which must be included/excluded from the mix
* ability to ask it to weight a repeating frequency of a song
* name of the artist/track/video playing displayed
Where are you guys located?
RE: "ability to ask it to weight a repeating frequency of a song" - you'd want songs to appear in your mix more than once?
Thomas the Tank Engine vs Biggie Smalls
This was the easiest as it's just a vocal track laid onto a beat, but it really jumps the tracks around a ton, seemingly randomly. It at least doesn't jump mid-measure though and fits with the beat.
Modest Mouth (Modest Mouse vs Smashmouth)
The Neil C original is a classic, and really fits two songs together that don't belong near each other. Rave plays the intros in sequential order, with vocals overlapping all over. They really need a central channel filter to see if they can pop the vocals out from the instrumentals. This is really a tuesday-surprise lunchroom casserole of a mashup, with a rather abrupt ending.
Korn vs Taylor Swift
This one really works because of some of the more complex editing on Isosine's part. The rave one is a disaster. Feels like you're standing in between two parties that are blasting two jams, that just happened to have their drops/choruses line up.
Kanye West vs The Beatles
This is a personal favorite, and I think it works because of how long the Hey Jude intro is. It really means you forget about Kanye completely until he jumps in. It works because of how slow of a buildup Hey Jude is. The Rave version has no nuance here. They speed up Hey Jude, up-pitching it in the process and making it sound like Raffi or some other child entertainer. They down pitch Kanye, making him seem like some gangsta thug. It really doesn't work at all.
I really want this to become better, but I feel like it needs to be trained more tricks (vocal separation for one) to really be worth it. Also minor QOL improvement would be to allow you to preview tracks before you add them to the mix. Hard to find one that's a good audio only rip of a song sometimes.
Very pleased with the result.
What I find very interesting is, the stability of the system. There must be quite the heavy load on the machine: retrieval, analysis, tempo matching, mashup creation, encoding and all on a ~11 hours HN-related stress test.
Was better than I expected, this is kind of a stress test
I giggled all the way through it. A bit of better volume balancing where the two songs overlap and I'd play that at a party with no regrets...
Perhaps the algorithm would do better with better quality versions of the track rather than youtube quality?
Have you considered using BunnyCDN instead of Stackpath for the CDN? It'll probably be much cheaper.
Here's the Killers with Eminem: https://rave.dj/3OYTG3uFFUrMIg
Daft Punk + Justice: https://rave.dj/Lpr1oWauUIIeaA
Chrome 68.0.3440.106 on an iMac Pro.
All fine now.
Supa Hot Fire + Linkin Park:
A known bass drop + Sia - Chandelier: