Q1 2016 5312 units, revenue $6,746m
Q4 2016 4886 units, revenue $5,739m
Q1 2017 5374 units, revenue $7,244m
I hate the USB-C dongle and do miss MagSafe, but I wouldn't trade the new machine for the old one.
After everything I'd heard, particularly about the keyboard, I put off buying a new Macbook. Ultimately, I was forced by circumstance to buy one, or I'd have coasted on my 2-year-old MBP for a few more years. I feel sheepish about that plan now.
1. The price - Personally I don't think it is justified to essentially bump the "actual" MBP (meaning touchbar and 29w processor) by $500 for what we get. The original retina 13" were similar price wise at release, but the display was a massive upgrade. The touchbar not so much.
2. No kaby lake - this is an intel release timing issue, if you want Kaby Lake wait a few more months.
3. Questionable utility of the touchbar - I own one and it is useful for anything with linear editing...so audio or video. Otherwise I just use it for media functions just like I would with physical keys (I don't use the function keys.) It could be more useful in the future given more software support.
4. Dongles - This is another temporary problem until devices are all USB-C.
5. No magsafe - Sad, but there is one advantage in that you can now do power/display/connectivity all over one port...and I can't go back from that. I have an LG 4k monitor with USB-C so I just plug in one cable and get my 4k display, mechanical keyboard, and speakers just from that. And I can rearrange my desk to put my laptop on either side of the screen. For me I'm either plugged in at my desk or wireless elsewhere, so tripping over a cable was never really an issue for me once we hit the 5+ hour battery mark.
6. The keyboard - I love it, and switch off from my Whitefox with Cherry mx blues on my desk. Most mobile keyboards feel squishy to me but the new switches they are using give a lot of stability and a pretty solid click as well, even though they have such little travel.
What I've learned from all this discussion about usb-c is that some people replace all their peripherals and secondary devices on a much more aggressive timescale than I do. For me dongles would likely be an annoying companion, with few or no usb-c devices ever plugging in to it, for the lifespan of this MPB if I bought one today.
My next one in 3-5 years, that might be a different story. But for this one, now? All-usb-c is a turn-off, as it'll be years before that's a "feature" that makes me say anything other than "oh, that's an unfortunate limitation".
None of them are USB-C and I don't plan on replacing any of them soon.
With the possible exception of external hard drives, USB-C doesn't offer any benefits over my existing interfaces.
No need for a dongle for your DisplayPort monitor, just get a DP->USB-C cable, done, I'm running a 4k monitor at 60hz this way.
Same for your hard drive, it is probably micro-usb on the other side, just get a micro-USB to USB-C.
You don't need new stuff, just new cables, which is annoying but not anywhere near as bad. Protocol is the same, just a different shape.
It's nice to know the protocols my devices use aren't redundant, but you won't find me rushing out to adopt USB Type-C cables.
The only port I find myself missing so far is HDMI. Having to carry a USB-C to HDMI adapter (actually multiple since compatibility is an unmitigated disaster) is quite annoying. I rarely use thumbdrives, but carrying a USB-C<->female A adapter isn't a big deal since it's so rare and I can just toss it in my bag.
For a primarily desk-sitting laptop you're getting a docking station of some sort (monitor or actual) so you get all the above ports with it. I also don't upgrade components there very often either. I do admit this was annoying so far - as the release of the laptop far preceded any decent docks. Single-cable docking though is pretty neat, and a definite upgrade if minor.
Really it ended up being a USB-C to HDMI, female A, and ethernet that I need to toss in the bag. The latter two I expect to use a few times a year at most.
I dont get all this so much dongle talk when you just need one good adapter.
I've asked our office admin to purchase the Juice Systems flat dongle with Ethernet, as that one handles gigabit, for anyone who gets the new Macbook.
Also, as far as I know, none of the all-in-one dongles, not even the normal adapter that Apple sells supports 4k/60Hz. Only 30.
Disclaimer: not affiliated, just a good product.
Since I only have 2 ports on my non-Touch Bar model, I really wish someone just made a USB-C hub. All of the existing hubs have USB-A ports and one USB-C only for power pass through, but they can't handle the bandwidth required for certain things like 60Hz 4K. At least I have a gigabit USB 3.1 adapter that gets me ~930 Mbps on my local network.
So weight basically :)
If one upgrades their mac with every new release, it usually ends up being a 200-500 hit per year depending on market conditions. The more expensive peripherals usually will fetch a decent amount on ebay as well.
So for the average cost of around ~$30/mo, one can basically have the latest mac with the latest peripherals all the time.
Or one could upgrade every 5 years as well...
Almost everything you list are things that would be stationary on your desk, so either you are buying the wrong machine if you don't plan on removing it from the desk, or you'll benefit from having all connected to a dock that can connect via 1 cable to your machine.
Pretty sure they don't make USB Type C adapters for PS/2.
At some point, inconvenience to part of the user base has to be outweighed by convenience to everyone else. The new MBP fits a 15" screen into a form factor that is edging in on where 13-14" laptops were not too long ago. The new 13" is edging into where 12" laptops used to be. Given that lots of "pros" and "road warriors" suffer through 12-13" laptops for size/weight reasons, that's a pretty huge benefit that might easily justify the loss of ports for a big segment of the user base.
Why'd you get a 13"? If the 15" was close to the same size/weight would you have gotten the 15"?
Also, nobody does that, stop making excuses.
1 port to charge the computer,
1 port (with USB-C to lightning cable, $19) for the iPhone,
1 port (with USB-C to plain old USB dongle, $9) for the Apple Watch,
1 port (with USB-C to lightning cable, $19) for the AirPods
That makes 4 ports, and I have 2. Thus, hub it is.
But yes, the problem is not USB-C per se, the problem is the small number of ports unless you pony up for the TouchPad model.
The only major pain point is really the monitor.
Guess they didn't mean it after all.
You're crazy if you think that 4-conductor rectangular non-reversible connector was going to be the end-all be-all for USB forever. We had to upgrade eventually. Be thankful that this change is being relatively swift and reasonably future-proof. USB C should be good for quite a few more years.
This is going to haunt technical support for literally decades.
Because you can still run the USB 1.0, 1.1, 2.0, and 3.0 protocols over it
I wish they had simply called it "ngSB" or something like that. People understand the need for converters; it's the branding that's terrible.
USBC is no less Universal than micro USB.
USB-C != USB 3.1
USB-C != Thunderbolt 3
I think it's reasonable to wonder how often this is actually in issue in practice. I don't have a new MBP (or any peripherals for that matter), so I can't speak to this directly.
Do you have a new MBP or know anyone personally who does? Have you or they had any issues with cable incompatibility?
> including official Apple ones
part here. If Apple had planned it better, all their USB-C cables (starting with the Macbook One) could do all the functions they need for any Apple product going forward. But even today, if you walk to an Apple store and buy a bunch of USB-C Apple products, you'll probably have to color code them yourself to not mix them up, because it won't work if you do. All Apple is helping here is saying "if you have a cable with an intsy tiny serial number print starting with X, use it only for Y". Gee thanks, that sure is a great ecosystem you got going here Apple.
There's a reason why Apple 1997 - 2007 pushed interoperable standards hard (examples: USB-A, 802.11B and then G, Firewire, mini-DP). None of these had connectors that you could confuse, including when switching between different Firewire standards, and these buses did fairly complex things as well. They even had a powerbook generation with two different Firewire ports so people don't get left hanging with their old Firewire devices. That's all under Steve Jobs and Jony Ive, just Ive not being the one in charge of doing these decisions.
So yes, ideally all Apple cables would do everything imaginable, but I understand why they didn't choose to do that.
Well, anything but USB 1-3! :face-with-tears-of-pain:
Also, all the ports may look the same, even fit the same port, but they're not the same, which is a terrible user experience.
All in all, I can say I understand nothing about usb-c with confidence except I don't have any usb cables to stick in the ports and nowhere to stick the usb cables I do have.
Thats true of some laptops, but the new macbook pros allow any connection (power/display/whataver) to any of the usb-c ports. When I'm lying in bed I can now roll over and just swap which side of the laptop the power cable connects to.
(Well apparently the ports on one side of the machine are a bit faster, but I don't know of any USB devices which can take advantage of even the slower speed USB 3.1 provides. I certainly don't own any.)
You realize that USB ports aren't always "up & down". Sometimes they're sideways. Sometimes they're reversed.
As someone with a USB C phone who is trying to convert all my devices to it: reversibility is far from a necessity, I did just fine for years with USB B on my phones, but it is extremely nice to not have to even think about direction. And now, it is noticeably annoying when I have to use MicroUSB.
I had the same reaction to the loss of magsafe. It was such a cool hardware feature, but ever since all-day batteries became the norm it's just not the same world as when we had to be constantly plugged in at every meeting, cafe, etc. Remember those days of always searching for outlets at cafes, and the rats nest? Mostly gone.
As you said, there is not major failings in the new MBP ... but it comes after 2 years wait, in a side event (i.e. not really the big front stage for this "Back to the Mac"), with muddled message. Apple has made bold decisions in this Mac but didn't follow up by giving the impression it was behind it. You get USB-C, yeah, hopefully maybe some third party will do cool stuff, like screens because Apple is not doing those anymore, ... It is also bad timing with the phasing out of the Wifi Router dropped like that as an unremarkable footnote despite being key in cloud feature like "Back to my Mac" or "Time machine". There was a definitive feeling that something was off.
MacRumors all black buying guide, Apple regular lack of comment about its future plan made that feeling even worse.
Twice in a month after that, Apple had had to confirm that they are still committed to the Mac, both to the public and to their own employees ! That's what people are concerned about. Nobody wants to buy into a dying ecosystem and Apple 2016 has done very little for the Mac. We will see how 2017 turns out, but I'm part of the people that prefer to wait until November 2017 to see if Apple is now sliding the MBP into a bi-yearly release cycle to decide if it is time to think about a plan B.
edit: Forgot to mention. I think on its own that the new MBP is a great machine, I'm itching to get one. I'm actually delaying the purchase decision as much as possible for the reason mentioned above.
While I've had this feeling at times in the recent past myself, there's a kind of irony in this conversation being reinforced by the new MBP. Apple committed the time and resources necessary to essentially build an entire new iOS device and integrate it into the Mac, including the Touch ID sensor, and add explicit support for it in the majority of their applications (over two dozen, ranging from the little freebies like Notes and Preview up to all of iWork, FCP, Motion and Logic).
Whether one thinks the Touch Bar is "worth it" -- or even the right approach to adding touch support to the Mac -- is a different debate, of course, and worth arguing about. But if Apple wasn't committed to the Mac product line, it's hard to see why they would have bothered. This isn't something they just hacked together at the last minute to make it look like they've been doing something; they've really been doing something. For the Touch Bar to make sense it's going to have to show up on the non-pro Macbook this year, and I suspect on the Magic Keyboard.
I think the real anger is around what's going on with the desktop Mac line, particularly the Mac Pro and the Mac mini. I suspect that the new "trashcan" design had some kind of critical flaw that left Apple in a Catch-22 situation: they can't upgrade it without changing the design, but the market is too small for them to spend a lot of money changing the design again.
I suspect that the custom hardware has something to do about it. They have basically custom everything and a cooling solution that probably prevent them to shop around for easy GPU upgrade. The engineering cost must be awful just to duplicate the performance level you can get with off-the-shelves component. Even server grade components can fit in tiny "alright looking" cases nowadays.
Apple seems like it's lazily milking its userbase, but I think the truth is that it spends so much time and attention on pointless crap that all the stuff we care about on HN looks half-assed in comparison.
It looks going pretty ok to me.
I have almost 50Gb of free Dropbox storage btw, through referrals + events like the space race. But that's not really a fair fight anyway, since (aside from Dropbox) no one offers free space in exchange for actions..
For cost comparison (UK pricing);
So, Google wins on free tier, but Apple takes it on options and cost thereafter, and 15GB arguably is still insufficient for "OS storage" in any real tangible terms.
 no I don't have data. I do know plenty of Dropbox users though, and next to none of them have any extras.
You might be interested in this:
It's not the same as having the builtin magsafe, but if you NEED safetly (eg: people tend to trip over your wire), it's wook.
Apple should make a MagSafe USB-C connector. I would buy that in a heartbeat.
Has anyone seen or personally heard of someone yanking their laptop, of any brand or model, onto the floor via the power cable? I haven't. I instinctively think it's a risk, but reality says otherwise. It seems to me like a solution looking for a problem; the only reason I ever suspected that it's a real problem is that Apple made the Magsafe connectors - maybe they had some data that I didn't. Now I suspect it was all to address unfounded fears in consumers.
I've seen it happen plenty of times with cell phones, however. I wouldn't mind a Magsafe connector for an iPhone.
What an argument. Do you happen to have Auto insurance? How about fire insurance? Did your house burn down even once? Mine didn't so far and yet here I am still saying fire insurance is very much needed if you own a house.
And that is exactly what the MagSafe was. Insurance incase this happens. And as you can already tell by the other responses, this does happen. And even if it only happens once, you will look at thousands of dollars worth of damage.
So, no thank you with the non MagSafe MacBooks. Having a choice if I want that yanked off my table to the left or the right depending on which USB-C connector I used to charge it is not a selling point.
Now if you're at your desk you're probably plugged in to power and a few other things that aren't break-away. If you're not at your desk you're probably not plugged in. The biggest snag I've always hit is the headphone connection. It's the most likely to get yanked if your headphones get caught up on a chair.
It was a convenient solution at the time. Now it's a bit of an anachronism.
If you like insurance, get a break-away USB-C cable for each of your devices: https://griffintechnology.com/us/breaksafe-magnetic-usb-c-po...
I'm much more careful at placing my HP power cable on the ground and up to the desk and never got my pc pulled to the ground.
The magsafe connection gets pulled out of my Macbook with enough frequency that I know I'd otherwise be slowly bending the power port on a standard DC adapter.
I've never seen a problem with that either. I've seen plenty of wear on the jackets around connectors on cables.
If there only was a dedicated surface capable of recording movement, linear or otherwise.
Nvidia 1060 graphics! I don't need faster or more power efficient CPU as much as I need faster and more power efficient GPU!
Fine. Shut off the 1060 when I'm running on battery, but let me have it when I'm plugged in! Let me have the best of both worlds!
Isn't this a larger problem? It's not just graphics anymore; it's the ability to work on basic ML. Even the top of the line GPU you can fit in a laptop is barely enough to handle this, and Apple seems to prefer to believe that need doesn't exist.
Hell, even the Mac Pro has anemic and HUGELY overpriced compute options.
And forget about Vulcan.
And, after having a number of laptops (and an iMac) die from heat death due to the ball grid array solders of the GPU wearing out, I'm done with discrete GPU's in anything other than a desktop box.
Better in this day and age to prototype on the macbook, then offload the heavy lifting to a dedicated ML box or, at the rate things are going, to Amazon...
They did use to make 17" laptops; calling those portable was really stretching the word.
I'd love to have an external desktop class GPU at home so I can play games or goof around with OpenCL and VR. Then I can simply unplug the laptop & use the integrated graphics chip when I'm on the road and need power efficiency.
This has been discussed before: similarly configured PC laptops cost just as much or more.
* Razer Blade 14" [http://www.razerzone.com/gaming-systems/razer-blade]
* Alienware 13" [http://www.dell.com/en-us/shop/productdetails/alienware-13-l...]
* Alienware 15" [http://www.dell.com/en-us/shop/productdetails/alienware-15-l...]
* Dell DE workstation [http://www.dell.com/learn/us/en/555/campaigns/xps-linux-lapt...] 
So basically every other power machine in that price range has better specifications for less or equal pricing (including premium niche brands like Razer)
 These come with Ubuntu preinstalled if you want too!
Edit: Just for grins I thought I would break down the comparison of the Macbook Pro 13" against the Razer Blade.
Stats: MBP 13 (max configured), Razer Blade
Price: $2,499, $2,299
CPU: i7 DUAL core, i7 QUAD core
GPU: Intel Iris (integrated), Nvidia GTX 1060
RAM: 16 GB LPDDR3, 16 GB DDR4
Disk: 512 GB PCIE SSD, 512 GB PCIE SSD
Display: Retina (2560 x 1600), QHD w/ Touch (3200 x 1800)
Basically, the Razer Blade destroys the performance of the MBP for $200 LESS.
Edit 2: The price discrepancies get even worse when talking about the 15" laptop...just saying.
* Quad core CPU
* >= 16 GB RAM
* >= 1 TB SSD
* Retina display with resolution at least as good as the MacBook 15"
* Battery life at least as good as the MacBook 15"
* Weight at least as good as the MacBook 15"
With those requirements---if you can meet them at all, which most can't---the price gap shrinks substantially.
The Razer Blade, for example, is $2700 for the QHD+/1TB option, and it's not obvious if it can meet the last two requirements.
The Alienware in a similar configuration is $2600 depending on the graphics card but the best screen option is 1080p and again, not obvious if battery is good and the weight is just a joke. No amount of money is going to get me to carry a > 7 pound laptop.
And that's without going into more subtle issues like build quality, track pad quality, etc.
That one repair dude with the 4+ hour YouTube videos that's always bashing Apple did a Razer Blade/MBP comparison video and the MBP disk transfer speeds blew the Razer out of the water.
I agree the MBP is super ridiculously expensive, but no one for a second should think there's an alternative in any price bracket.
Razer Blaze SSD test: https://youtu.be/bOXxyeKWd80?t=2254
MBP SSD test: https://youtu.be/bOXxyeKWd80?t=2669
For the same price, other laptops seem to offer more power, in exchange for less battery and a few other niceties.
I'm writing this from a MBP (magsafe-and-escape-key mbp) that I love. To me, it makes no sense to say "Macbooks are just like these windows pcs but way more expensive", but neither does saying "there is no alternative to a MBP".
A lot of laptops are competing. Some of them are premium, expensive machines, with high price tags and nice features and quality. The macbook is one of them, with its own set of unique advantages, but also compromises. Some people think they are the best. That's it.
Disk speed, battery, build quality, and screen resolution seem to be the big ones. There don't seem to be any alternatives with the same set of features. All of the machines brought up as an "alternative" are missing one or more of those which means they aren't really an alternative.
I do agree that you're also signing up for a set of compromises when you buy a MBP, but AFAIK there's not an "equivalent" machine elsewhere that I can find, which to me seems a bit strange.
I hate analogies, especially car ones, but for this situation it really does seem to fit. There are three big German car makers. BMW, Audi, and Mercedes each have "equivalent" sets of cars. You can pick and choose between them and while there are might be small features that one offers over the others there are definitely "alternatives".
With the MBP it feels like there's only one, and when looking for an alternative everyone's suggesting a Toyota Camry. Yes, it will get the job done but it's not really the same class of thing.
> Apple advertises 10 hours with light usage
I heard a lot of users were reporting less:
It really depends what you're doing. I have a cpu meter running all the time and often see electron based apps (spotify, slack, atom) idle on 5-10% cpu usage for no reason. Just having one of those programs will eviscerate your battery life - its impossible to get 10 hours if the CPU isn't asleep most of the time.
That said, in fairness Atom seems to be getting better with each release. But spotify seems to keep getting worse. I've caught it pegging an entire core a couple of times in the last few weeks - just sitting on 100% cpu usage despite having no music playing. I think it was rendering an animated ad in the background or something, despite my paid account. Its really no wonder people don't get 10 hours battery life out of their machines. This shit is the new flash.
Anecdotally a redditor is claiming ~7 hours?
I've got a XPS 15 9560 and the battery life sits around 7 to 8 hours for "basic" tasks at around 30% brightness (which is still quite bright). This is running Fedora 25, so it's probably a bit longer under Windows. Not going to reach the 10 hours of a MBP, but it's still quite good.
CPU: I7-6820HQ 
RAM: 16 GB LPDDR3 (LPDDR3 is important here...it is "low power" DDR3...so it is under clocked for batter life)
DISK: 1 TB PCIE SSD
GRAPHICS: Radeon Pro 455 w/ 2GB mem
DELL Alienware 15:
RAM: 32 GB DDR4
DISK: 1 TB PCIE SSD + 1 TB 7200 RPM HD
GRAPHICS: GTX 1070 w/ 8GB RAM
* Build quality is subjective and the MBP is certainly thin but the Alienware r3's are sturdy and well-regarded
* Battery life, the Alienware 15 r3 has a 99 whr battery that gets ~6 hr of light use  which I think is very comparable given the purported 3hrs of use users are reporting for Apple 
* Every computing stat is better than the MBP by a large margin
* Alienware is $200 cheaper (the unit I configured had a G-Sync panel on it so I would guess the price goes down or stays same for 4k IGZO version...)
* Note: Alienware rotates the models it has on it's sight and currently the IGZO 4k screen is not available but that model is out there and will probably be back soon. The review I linked to reviews the IGZO 4k configuration.
But hey, it sounds like you aren't a compute power focused person (like me...I am irrationally so)...so check out the XPS 15 (9650):
Max model is $2499 which is $700 cheaper! And, quite honestly hits every point you want...including build quality, track pad, and weight!
- It seems to have around 6 hours surfing time on a battery while the macbook has 10.
- It seems to have a worse screen with bad viewing angles.
- The razor weighs 1.93 kg while the macbook weighs 1.37 kg. This makes quite a difference when you e.g. travel a lot by public transport or by aeroplane. The razor also is marginally thicker (3 mm)
- The razor has USB 3.0 while the macbook has USB 3.1
- The razor has a drastically slower SSD than the one of the macbook
- The razor has shitty speakers, while the macbook has pretty good ones.
- The keyboard seems to have some issues like the function and mediakeys not being lit.
In the end it is pretty obvious, that they are completely different machines. The razor is a mobile gaming machine optimized for gaming performance, while the macbook is a high quality general purpose laptop, optimized for performance in general.
- I don't know about the screen, but having owned both, viewing angles are not an issue on either. I _believe_ the MBP has better color accuracy, but the blade is no slouch with full sRGB coverage and 75% Adobe RGB 
- I travel a lot by airplane and weights are going to be a personal preference, but I don't notice a difference...and I take public transit for 40 minutes and have a 2 mile walk to work. But again, personal preference.
- Perhaps I am not in the know, but the Razer Blade has USB type-C (TB3) as well as USB type-A (ostensibly serving 3.0). MBP has 4 TB3 ports if I understand it correctly, so it has more, but I don't think it fair to say the Blade has none.
- I don't know if the SSD is "drastically slower"...but it might be slower. Both are PCIE nVME SSD drives, the blade specifically has a Samsung SM951. Not the top of the line, but certainly not a bargin bin drive. And for the price difference, you could replace the drive in the Razer with something better if you want...whereas the MBP is soldered on.
- I don't know, I am not terribly impressed by any laptop speakers in 13" form factors...but personal preference. I would have to agree, owning both, that I think the MBP has a slight edge as they don't distort at Max volume and the Blade does slightly...but I wouldn't say the difference between is huge.
- Razer blade media keys are lit, the function labels are not...which is terribly annoying for me (but media _are_ lit).
> In the end it is pretty obvious, that they are completely different machines. The razor is a mobile gaming machine optimized for gaming performance, while the macbook is a high quality general purpose laptop, optimized for performance in general.
I would amend this slightly by saying the Macbook is a high quality general use laptop. Nothing about it is optimized for performance in my mind (LPDDR3, Retina not 4k, etc.). Most of the choices trade performance for battery (IMO). To be clear, this is not bad.
The Razer is definitely a mobile performance focused machine...
But the only reason I bring it up is because I was refuting the claim:
> This has been discussed before: similarly configured PC laptops cost just as much or more.
And I think it is pretty clear that for the hardware, the MBP is definitely more expensive than other options (by significant margins).
I totally agree and in my opinion this makes the laptops not really comparable.
Battery life can also lead to higher cost (e.g. display with lower energy consumption).
But I would also qualify the performance statement a bit. If you neither play games nor use Cuda, a graphic card is unimportant. If the applications you use are not or hardly parallel, a dual core might even perform better.
BTW: I checked again and the Samsung SSD has read speeds of 2.150 GBps and write speeds of 1.550 GBps, while the Apple one has read speeds of 3.1 GBps and 2.1 GBps write speed.
I think there is a lot of confusion with what I was trying to say. I wasn't claiming MBPs are "bad"...just refuting the claim that similarly spec'd laptops are about the same price. And I still believe that is a reasonable point.
Regarding the drives, I found some links quoting those figures ...although synthetic benchmarks in the wild seem to give different results (~2.0 GBs read and 1.3 GBps write). I wonder what a synthetic benchmark with those two laptops would be like side to side. It may very well be the benchmark tool in both videos is artificially limiting drive performance...which would also be reflected on the Blade who knows.
(As an aside, even at 2.0 GBps read and 1.3 GBps write that is still very fast)
I guess that depends on what "similarly" means.
The Dell XPS 15", for the same price has a far better processor, far better video card, 32GB of RAM, 4k screen and a 1TB SSD. The Macbook has a touchbar?
I'd love to see the laptops that cost more...
The non-Touch Bar laptop with four TB3 ports and Touch ID would've been the _absolute_ best Mac for pretty much everyone who was waiting for a new one (battery life sacrifices for weight/size savings aside).
That 15" users _have_ to get a Touch Bar is a slap in the face to those users, imo.
People who hunt-and-peck and haven't memorized keyboard shortcuts (basically everyone) are going to love the touch bar.
What keyboard shortcuts? I touch type, but nearly all the keyboard shortcuts I know use the lower part of the keyboard (ctrl- or cmd- or alt- some letter or number). I know F5 to refresh, but never used it on my Mac since the media keys were set to be the default and were more useful to me anyway.
The only thing that occasionally causes me to do a double-take about the touch bar is the non-physical escape key. And even that has not honestly been much of an issue for me.
Probably a good thing, since F5 to refresh is a Windows thing and does nothing on the Mac.
I'd miss them I think.
Not enough money (or an actual need) to upgrade at the moment, thankfully.
That said, I think that putting a display under the trackpad as well or instead would have a bigger payoff.
I have trouble with the pinky finger on my right hand. I should be using it to hit the "p" but... I dunno, it just doesn't happen that way. Sorry, Mavis Beacon, I tried.
I've got a handful of function keys memorized, but I frequently miss if I'm not looking down. I'd never try to Alt-F5 on Windows without looking.
How many Macbook Pro users fit that profile?
The vast majority.
Mac users, sure. But almost all macbook pro users I know tend to be saavy.
I can understand a company buying the new MBPs simply to replace old ones, but personally I will wait a year. My 2009 MBP still does the job.
I have seen the Touch Bar in person and I don't hate it but it does seem like an unnecessary cost and battery drain (just like Force Touch come to think of it).
My biggest problem with the latest Macbook "Pros" is that they don't give me what I want. All I wanted is a Macbook Air with a screen that isn't 6 years old. For me the 13" Air was the perfect form factor and compromise between power and portability (eg the 12" Macbook is too much of a compromise).
And while not giving me what I want they went and made everything more expensive.
I'm sitting here typing this on an Dell XPS 15, a laptop I bought late last year when it became clear Apple wasn't going to produce what I wanted. It's reasonably nice but honestly I hate it as it's just not polished like a Mac and OSX is (I'm using Windows 10). Even simple things like forwarding videos with a two finger swipe on a Mac just works (even on VLC). On Windows it's just... horrible.
Then again I do have 32GB of RAM and a 512GB Samsung Pro 850 in it and all up I think it cost like $1400. Oh and I can play Civ6 on it.
IMHO the real cause of this backlash against the new MBPs is a combination of frustration and even a sense of betrayal. That may sound like hyperbole but people love their Macs. My 13" Air was the best laptop I ever owned and it vexes me no end that Apple (again IMHO) screwed it up.
It's by no means a bad machine (retina is nice, keyboard is generally quite nice and crisp), but I'm not elated, particularly given that it was some $500 more expensive than the MacBook Air that it replaced.
When my 2011 MacBook Pro (the one with the faulty graphics card that would eventually die) was in for service, before the replacement program, they called me and said "Oh, we noticed that your trackpad button felt a little weird, so we're replacing it, free of charge". This was on top of replacing the logic board for free as well, even though at that point the replacement program hadn't been announced yet. The next time the graphics chip failed they just ended up replacing the laptop with a brand new 2015 model for free (top of the line model too, which was nice).
I'm really curious as to the WiFi thing - I'm definitely not the only one with the problem (see my post here https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13494910 with some links), but I haven't seen it widely reported at all.
I always do this because I know they will have a cancelation, and I really hate booking a week out for something that is bothering me today.
I'm a bit disheartened that even the original Apple dongle effects this problem.
More details (and screenshot of the WiFi performance) here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13494910
Prior to this machine, I was unhealthily attached to an MBA 11" from 2012 and I was more than dubious that I'd break that attachment. Since I got the new MBP, the MBA hasn't moved once from the spot where is waiting for a re-install ready to give away.
On TouchBar: Yes, it definitely has its advantages and disadvantages. I dig the touch ID login. Escape key issue only annoyed me a time or two, but I'm not a heavy VIM user, and the ESC key is actually wider than most people realize (space to left of it is actually additional touch target for the key, so you actually have an easier to type ESC key in actuality)
It was such a superior idea that there can only be one possible philosophy behind the move to abandon it, and that is that longevity is actually bad for apple, especially during the end of Moore's law for personal computing. My 2011 MBP is very unlikely to become obsolete in a technical sense. The battery life is still good, and the processing power is more than sufficient for anything that would not be more cost-effectively computed on a cloud instance or a desktop anyway.
That may seem like a great deal of inference, but I don't think it's unjustified. Why else would they opt for inferior technology?
I know for a fact people do sit around and talk about how to make things cheaper.
It's a philosophy that is reflected at apple through just about every corporate decision they have made. The inability to make incremental upgrades to any apple product, or perform repairs without it being a part of the apple business model. Or Air pods, which are basically an off season april fools joke.
The MagSafe adapter has itself gone through iterations which make them less backwards compatible and less functional. A major problem for power cables is that force at the joint between the rigid connector and flexible wire is prone to failure.
The original magsafe adapter solved this problem . a small amount of force at the problem area provided sufficient leverage to disconnect the power. This ensured that it was hard to use the power cord in such a way that promoted early failure, and gave the user the option of two orientations, potentially lessening the stress to the affected joint. They phased this design out for the much less sleek looking bulky orthogonal connector, which stays firmly locked in place through all sorts of damaging configurations, while providing no other justification for the "design" choice.
That this product was particularly prone to failure is made evident in the class action settlement, although you may read this as you like. https://www.adaptersettlement.com/
So before you accuse me of being a conspiracy theorist for proposing that computer companies sometimes break your property for profit, You might actually want to read about what the courts are saying, although the case in regards to the deceptive trade practices when rolling out iOS 9 on older phones is still unsettled, the facts very much are settled, and only the courts and the defense lag.
There's also another good reason why specifically Apple wants to get rid of MagSafe (as opposed to it just not being worth it anymore). And that's the fact that MagSafe has insidious problem of laptops sometimes just not charging, and you often don't even notice. I myself have started experiencing this issue with my current laptop and external display - I went for almost a whole day without it charging and didn't realize until I hit 10% battery, and since then, it's been a bit finicky, sometimes requiring me to poke at it several times before it charges properly. I don't know if it's the port or the cable that's having the issue. In any case, I would imagine this issue makes for a non-trivial amount of AppleCare support. And since MagSafe isn't really pulling its weight anymore, now that we have long batteries and can plug the cable on either side, the downsides outweigh the upsides.
The problem is that my computer, which resides on a table, is connected to the wall, which does not reside on the table. If there is a gap between the wall and the table, and the computer must be connected to the wall in order to accumulate energy, then the cord must necessarily cross that gap.
Since the table and the wall are not connected, they are not path connected, which you will note, is a statement which only relies on the topology of the space in which my computer is embedded. Which side I connect my charger to does not change the topology of space-time, so your argument doesn't seem relevant.
First, there is no such animal as a person sitting in a cafe with a laptop who is not plugged into the wall.
This is easily observed by simply entering a cafe and looking at the people in it. It doesn't matter that people's batteries CAN last a long time without being charged, most people simply don't do that unless there is no other option.
Second, I don't bring my computer home and plug it into a stationary dock to allow it to charge like some kind of cordless phone from the 90s. I pick a spot where I want to perform my computer tasks, and when my battery gets low (as it often does because claims of long battery life are largely based on some wildly ideal case) I go grab my charger from the other room and plug it in wherever I am sitting.
This is THE typical use case for a laptop computer. Note my use of capital letters. The use case that you have described is strange to the point of being an anomaly. A person who behaves this way is likely not a person at all, but rather a character in the sims.
My charger comes to me. My house was built with outlets every 10 feet or so along the walls for almost exactly this purpose. I do not do all of my computing immediately adjacent the walls, and I frequently just leave my computer where it is while I go do something else.
Do you not behave this way? If your laptop gets low, do you resignedly go back to your safe table, or do you stay on your couch, like a god damned American.
Then you should not come to European cafes where you don't get a power socket, unless you happen to be luckily seated close to the one used for the vacuum cleaner.
Zero sympathy for anyone whose laptop is destroyed tripping over the power cable while charging a half-full 12-hour battery at a coffee shop.
Charge-over-USB beats one-side MagSafe for nearly all of us.
The very fact that MacBook pro doesn't make fan noise is enough for me to pay the premium.
It feels cheap and wasn't as productive on it. I played with it for 5 minutes so take this with a grain of salt
I'm going to rant here for a minute: IMO keyboards are a great example of "bike shedding" and the law of triviality. There are tons of options for layouts, key mechanics/switches, etc and everyone has to use a keyboard, so everyone has their preferences. At the end of the day, the only objective way to compare keyboards is by your max typing speed, but this metric is almost 100% irrelevant. When does anyone ever type at their max speed for any practical purpose? For most people, the worst a keyboard can be is mildly annoying. At best, you'll forget you're even using one. Don't even get me started on people who learn Dvorak for speed or practicality...
Even if I could get used to everything about the new MBP's keyboard, buying a laptop that is noticeably louder feels like a really selfish move.
I guess there are just segments of people that disagree then. I find the new MBP keyboard abhorrent. The keys are too shallow, and they have far too little give; you're literally typing on a hard plastic surface. I love going home in the evening and getting my Thinkpad's keyboard, even though I'm not really a fan of that keyboard.
This is why I recommend that anyone wanting to purchase a MBP visit the Apple store and type on one. Maybe it won't bother you, but it bothers me, hence, I think folks should try it before they buy it, and Apple makes that fairly easy to do.
Best case the keyboard feels great but a day later and it feels terrible.
Now it's possible that it was just mass web hysteria. My cynical brain thinks that 1) people are gullible and want shiney 2) their previous MBP was getting too old so they bought the new
It's possible that sales != love
What's so good about it?
What happens when you trip on your charging cord and destroy a USB-C port?
On the one hand: I miss MagSafe.
On the other hand: I will not miss the stack of old frayed MagSafe cables I've collected over the years, and am hopeful that the aftermarket will finally provide me with a reliable power cable.
Worth knowing about me to qualify my opinion is: I don't use external monitors or keyboards. I don't ever want to use a configuration of my computer that will make me unhappy or feel less productive when I'm not at a desk, because I strongly prefer being able to work wherever I happen to be.
The only time Magsafe breaks like it's supposed to is when it's sitting on my lap and my leg bumps it, pushing it straight up. Which is just an annoyance, not a safety feature.
I am definitely going to miss MagSafe and am hoping the third party market comes up with something that will emulate it enough to where I don't have to worry about my laptop going flying because some cut doesn't watch where he is walking and accidentally kicks the cord.
Yeah, if you have it sitting on your desk and slowly pull on it the magnet will hold... but give it a quick tug, laptop will stay, cord will come with you.
Magsafe might be better than breaking a connector, but those aren't the only choices that exist. There is a far better solution, and it's really odd that Apple hasn't figured it out.
For me, I have a 2012 non-retina MacBook Pro and the magsafe works fine for me on that. I think this is one laptop people consider heavy though. (Personally I am alright with the weight and love its plethora of ports).
Maybe it's useful to some, and I agree it's great engineering... but it's never once worked for me in practice. I only find myself cursing when my leg bumps it and it stops charging.
Also as far as tripping over a cable it is unlikely to happen to me, given I leave my laptop at my desk charging overnight so I rarely ever use a power cord away from my desk (given the average 8 or so hours of battery.) Pretty much only when traveling, but even then it will likely just be charging while I'm not using it.
However, the other day I put my laptop down on a wooden chair which I thought was flat... :-(
So it ends up being rare that you have the laptop plugged in while you are actually working with it.
The MacBook 12 is probably the best laptop I've owned even if spec wise it was a downgrade from the MacBook Pro 13 I was previously using.
It's compact, extremely light, the keyboard is okay-ish (you get used to it), the display is the best I've ever seen anywhere on any kind of machine, and the battery longevity for casual browsing, some video/music, and coding, is out of this world. It can easily last me at least 6 hours of medium usage; if I use it sparingly (not much video for example) it can easily go to 8+ hours.
I have nothing bad to say about this laptop. The keyboard could've been slightly better but at the thinness of it, it's pretty adequate.
4K video out is flaky as hell. Hope Apple can address this with future software updates
Q1 2017 sale should've benefited from Mac Book refresh, but Apple essentially sold the same number of units as Q1 2016.
Increase in revenue came from higher pricing strategy in US and Europe.
Don't expect that to stick. Apple is in worse shape than these numbers indicate.
How many other companies sold 18,455,000 PCs and tablets last quarter? Sales of PCs and tablets are declining everywhere, not just at Apple. These results look pretty good in that environment. Microsoft Surface revenue was actually down 2% last quarter YOY.
I wouldn't rule out creative accounting, or actual fraud. The leaks, the analysts, the press, all said Apple was moving less product. Now Apple self-reports "all-time records" left and right.
It amazes me that some people are so strongly steeped in the anti-Apple bandwagon that they sooner believe they're committing fraud than that their products are actually popular - despite being able to walk outside their house for a few minutes and see a dozen people using one.
> than that their products are actually popular
At the same time, they have recently had a couple quarters where they were down year-over-year, so there is definitely incentive.
As to whether they would ever deceive investors... Apple is usually more ethical than your average company, but they have had lapses in judgement before (eg: just google for Apple and "backdating", "antipoaching", "EU consumer law"), so I don't rule anything out.
That said, I have a little regret posting that comment, since it's pure speculation, possibly tinfoil-hat territory.
I don't get the MBPTB backlash, I ordered one 2 days after they announced it and I would absolutely not go back to my previous MB Air or swap to my wife's 1-year-old rMBP. I never touch type on the function row anyway so having to look down is a non-issue and at least now I can customise the bar to do what I want rather than what Apple prescribe.
> All the bad press you are talking about is pretty tiny news
> the MBPTB backlash
The fact is, most people are not going on sensationalist tech blogs at all, and those that do are mostly not swayed by articles or nerds on the internet telling them what they can and can't buy. Other people think more independently than people like to believe (there's probably a name for this fallacy), it's just hard for some people to understand that someone else could have different priorities.
Those articles and comments are for and by people who have mostly already made up their mind. Blogs preach to the choir. People read and upvote things that confirm the beliefs they already had. Android fanatics will continue to screech about the lack of a headphone jack on the iPhone or full size USB on the Mac regardless, and weren't ever going to buy one anyway.
Yeah, the headphone jack removal probably put some people off the iPhone 7, even I admit it's an inconvenience and has been annoying. But despite all the bad press, it's just not, overall, the world ending problem that reddit/Hacker News would have you believe.
I won't pretend Apple has never broken the law or acted immorally, but profit and sales reports aren't like anti-poaching agreements. They have to go through so many people who can catch or oppose them, are so regulated, and are so directly and unambiguously illegal, that there's virtually no chance Apple is deliberately and directly falsifying them.
The "Apple Hype Peaked; nowhere to go but down" and "Does [decision or product] prove Apple as lost its way?" articles are pretty much the canonical lazy tech-journalist's go-to piece when there's nothing else to write.
I say this as a longtime Apple fan who is reluctantly concluding they're moving away from me (don't like the new laptops, don't like paying RAM markups, don't care about always-on voice, etc.)
If you think Apple is lying, I'd strongly encourage you to start shorting now - that won't stay secret long, and you'll make a bundle!
Q1 2017 should have seen the release of huge pent-up demand with the new MacBook Pro.
I bought one, and returned it, and got a 2015 refurb instead. keep my magsafe, i like the keyboard better, upgraded screen from what I had before (i really like the retina, and didn't have one for years), and about $1000 less.
I like the newer keyboard, but it's louder, and bugged more people in the rooms I shared.
That said, if/when a new refresh comes around with a 32g option, I'll be there.
Since when has a privately-owned company that pulled in revenues of $78B in a quarter ever been considered in 'bad shape'?
My team is responsible for tech specs for a huge global enterprise. We A/B survey people for different hardware starting with our Windows 10 rollouts. Very, very few people, even tech people report any difference in satisfaction with PCs with 8GB vs 16GB or more, price optimized i5 vs fast i7, etc.
The three things that most affect satisfaction are SSD, not telling people what the specs are, and giving them Macs.
Normal people give no shits about 95% of the handwringing complaints.
Note, I never had one and I really don't give a crap about what Apple does with its product line. But you can't deny that a lot of developers, particularly people who post on HN, have been predominantly MBP users for the past decade. And I can understand they care about connectivity and battery life, and probably a lot less about the TouchBar.
Also you have a weird definition of "enthusiasts". The ones I know don't buy laptops, much less Apple computers.
 I have to admit, it's funny they still haven't understood that Apple never did.
I think though what many of us are complaining about is that "Pro" used to mean a machine that was targeted at us, i.e. Professionals. I guess now it just means "high end" but I remember a few years ago the Macbook Air was targeted at the "pretty things" market.
I remember about 5 years ago my brother a professional animator complaining about how Apple dumbed down Final Cut Pro X to the point it wasn't usable in his domain. These days his shop doesn't use Macs any more (typically a staple industry).
I've a friend too, who works in automotive industrial design who won't touch a mac because it just doesn't have the power he needs.
My sister is a professional photographer and up until a few months ago I wouldn't have hesitated to recommend her a MBP but in all conscience nowadays I can not. This dilemma actually forced me to look at Windows laptops and I'm amazed how much they've come along in the last while.
So it's not just "us" that feel abandoned by Apple, but professionals from other walks of life. It's fair enough, if its a segment that doesn't make as much money for Apple as it used to, and as a business they have to make business decisions.
As professionals we have to make these decisions too, and if Apple isn't the right tool for the job we need to source one that is. But, there was a few years there where it felt like Apple was our friend. They made some amazingly pro-friendly gear. It seems those days are waning, and that relationship is coming to an end, and some of us feel a little jilted.
On the one hand, we hope that this "friend" will hear our protests and change their ways but we know deep down that won't happen. On the other we have to give the best advice to our friends and acquaintances as to what is a good device for them. We, as in "those sorts of groups" have a responsibility to critically evaluate new hardware in this light.
Back to the issue, most complaints I've seen/heard are from actual professionals who wants - or needs - magsafe, more RAM, more ports, more storage, more speed, or better batterylife.
The new MBP doesn't give you much more than what you already have, and for people having machines starting to wear out, buy another of essentially the same thing feels like a bad deal.
For me personally the biggest issues are magsafe and no RAM upgrade beyond 16GB. I simply run out of RAM all the time, but I would prefer not having to switch to windows simply to get more than 16GB RAM, with all the pain that would entail. Magsafe because it have saved my machine several times while on the road or working from home with kids running around.
I'm actually in the camp which would prefer more battery but this seems more like the effects of forum echo chamber reinforcement than anything like a strong trend.
Sure, this is an edge case but that doesn't minimize my requirements for 32gb of ram. I'll be buying a new laptop next year to replace my 2015MBPr and it will definitely be one that has 32gb minimum. That is, at this point, more important by far than OSX to my workload.
If they were real enthusiasts, they would be for things like the Thunderbolt 3.0, the TPM, the touchbar, the excellent battery life and noise levels...
If they were real enthusiasts, they would know about USB-C more than "Hurr durr dongles"
I thought the touchbar was nice, super responsive, looked better than I expected. I thought the keyboard was great for typical typing. I'm a spacemacs/vim user, and yet I found no problem with the escape key on the touchpad. Not really enough time to truly evaluate, but the first impression was "This is really nice." Like walking into a really nice kitchen, or sitting behind the wheel of a high end car.
My expectations had been tempered by all the naysaying about it, so perhaps because of that I was very impressed.
If my mac were a few years older, I'd buy one in a minute. I actually find myself wishing my mac was a few years older to justify upgrading.
That said, I'm not happy about only having USB-C. Mainly because I really like magsafe. My power cable gets kicked out several times a week, and sometimes a day. And on laptops of ages past (HP), the power socket has been the first thing to break on me. There are options out there for magsafe style USB-C cables, so that might mitigate.
The Touch bar I'm less enthusiastic about. There are times when it comes in handy, but I rarely use it and accidentally interact with it quite a bit while typing.
Yes, some of the HN crowd may have over-dramatized the decline of the new Macbook Pro. However, the financial report's "Mac" category includes Macbook (not Pro), Macbook Air, iMac, etc. Since all those different Mac variations are baked into one opaque category, it's possible that the new Macbook Pro sales numbers were bad but it was offset by strong iMac sales. A +1.1% increase in sales quantity (+62000 units) may not be all that impressive.
Here it is:
So for this quarter 5,374,000 Macs were sold generating a revenue of $7,244,000,000.
See also the Brexit and Trump victories nobody saw coming (except everyone who voted for them).
TL;DR, before you were paying for a Benz and getting a Benz. Now you're paying for a Benz and getting a Saab. While the Corollas of the computer world all got their usual refresh and upgrades.
FWIW, I voted Remain and wouldn’t have voted for Trump. I also admit that I didn’t see either result happening.
Let's look at the models below that ASP:
- 13" Macbook Air for $999/1199 for 128/256GB
- 12" 256GB Macbook for $1299
- 21.5" iMac for $1099/1299 for 1.6/2.8GHz and 1/2TB HD
- Mac mini for $499/699/999
So, the only current generation Mac on that list is the 12" Macbook and the entry level model barely makes it in. So assuming the ASP here isn't too far from the median it seems to suggest the majority of Mac sales are last generation tech.
Also bear in mind that we don't precisely know what this number includes. Does it include peripherals for Macs? Possibly not. It probably includes AppleCare though you'd think. So the hardware ASP is likely lower.
I honestly don't think these numbers are as good for Apple and a testament to the success of the latest refresh as some would suggest.
Probably by this time next year the Macbook Air will probably be gone. The USB-C landscape will be better no doubt. I really wonder how those numbers will look.
Probably due in part to pent up demand for the higher-end Macbook Pros, but since the touchbar models are significantly more expensive, likely due to that as well. Will be interesting to see the ongoing trend, but I would guess that people keep buying these machines.
It's fast and touchbar is fun to use. Was reserved b/c of donglegate but it's not a big issue.
People are missing out with charging their laptops with usb c. I have a 265000 mah battery that I can use to charge the laptop.
So, yeah, people/companies are buying the new Macs. But, if it was my own personal machine I would already have returned it to the store.
I wouldn't wish this on anyone
A similar argument might be said about "displays over display-port" or "displays over VGA".
If you "wouldn't wish this on anyone", would you mind sharing why? If suppliers aren't complying with the spec, or the spec is inadequate, I would like to understand why.
DisplayLink is pretty awful. Especially on macOS, due to limitations of macOS, they are laggy, don't display certain apps correctly and more.
There are quite a few docks out there (I know Asus had one) that use DisplayLink technology to show external displays.
I wish I could plug my 2 screens and the ethernet cable directly into the macbook. However, since Apple decided 2 USB-C port is enough, I'm left with a pretty crappy dock that don't even send power through the port. Hell, I can't even plug a tv screen into the laptop without a dongle (no HDMI).
This is absolutely infuriating. Don't buy this crap.
Dell sells one that is pretty good and used by a lot of my friends.
There are many many comments you can easily find where Mac users give specific reasons as to why they prefer them, such as macOS and its Unix-ness, build quality, screen quality, attention to detail, battery live, and the sorry state of Linux on the desktop.
To insist on the reasons you're giving is acting in bad faith.
Please stop reading between the lines and making baseless accusations. This is not what I said at all. I own a Mac. And most of the reasons I mentioned apply to me as well.
It took 2-3 years for Nokia's handset revenues to collapse, from when people started noticing warning signs and complaining that they were falling behind.
If you are you making a prediction that Apple's total revenues are about to collapse, these results really don't support that idea. PC sales have been declining for years overall.
That's a very vocal but ultimately tiny sliver of their customer base.
Programmers make up a tiny percentage of the target market.
Being able to get more cores and CPU power than a top of the line iMac for cheaper than the base iMac helps a lot in any motion work. Access to Nvidia GPUs and therefore GPU rendering engines completely changes your workflow for 3D and product design work. Products like Surface studio are way more valuable to illustrators than an overpriced Cintiq or a TouchBar.
Ten or so years ago you'd see plenty of Macs on the cutting edge of creative work, not the case now I mean heck they can't even consume VR content let alone create VR content.
Of course the average person is not complaining, in reality the average person can use a 10 year old PC for what they do with it. Facebook, stream music, maybe email....
In reality, most people can use pretty old PCs these days but laptops in particular do get beat up over time and eventually they get outdated enough that it may be time for something newer. I could use my 6 1/2 year old MacBook but I definitely prefer my 2 year old one.
But most people care about money, so when a consumer needs to overspend on a piece of hardware that is less competitive than previous generations it matters. So the geeks need to inform the people that don't know enough to know they might be wasting their money.
Technical people have a tendency to say stuff like "No wireless. Less space than a Nomad. Lame." when the iPod is announced.
What happens when those same professionals are jumping ship to alternatives (After Effects>FCP, mbp wait-outs,etc) and those advocates no longer give that same support?
Personally, I hope that they can continue true to their pro advocates.
they refreshed the Macbook product line for the first time in years.
That should have resulted in a big infusion of growth.
What it's done is demonstrate the popularity of the product line.
I bought my Lenovo developer laptop in 2014. It now runs Windows 10 and is even snappier than when it ran Windows 7.
What is Apple's fiscal year?
Apple’s fiscal year 2017 runs from September 25, 2016 through September 30, 2017.
Tech press and internet forums foaming at the mouth over <insert change here> don't represent reality when it comes to people actually using and buying <insert product name>. News at 11.
Apples to apples the Mac declined as did iPhones.
"How could they remove legacy USB...."
"How could they remove the headphone jack..."
"Steve Jobs would never ..."
"I need an escape key..."
Funny how some of you make the quintessential part of the free market - customer feedback - sound like a bad thing.
Comments like: "Apple is doomed", "Touchbar is useless/gimmick", "Nobody wanted a thinner MacBook" are not costumer feedback.
Apple has lost everything that made them special, just as Microsoft did a decade and a half earlier. They'll probably remain quite profitable for the mid-term, though... just like MS did under Balmer.
He had his share of bad/terrible calls (Vista, killing IE, one UI everywhere, missing the smartphone market window, etc) but overall, he wasn't just a lame duck riding on the success of Gates.