To all you guys & girls that got 'rejected', don't be down, be UP. This is your chance to prove the spotters at YC wrong. Do it anyway, by any means that you can think of and make them regret not selecting you.
Even if only stellar ideas were presented with great teams behind them then YC would still be able to select only a limited amount of those. Chances are that you'll make it and those chances are not that much different from the projects that did get selected.
And you have at least one extra motivation, to make whoever made that selection at YC think, oops... we should have picked that one.
Being selected by YC is not a guarantee of success and not being selected by YC is not a guarantee of failure!
Best of luck to all of you, both those selected and those not selected.
I understand that you're probably angry, perhaps a little confused too - but insulting the intelligence of people who have in the past proven that they are anything but stupid, isn't going to earn you any brownie points.
I see YC as a tool to be used in helping your startup achieve it's goals, there are many others out there of varying qualities - you shouldn't see it as the destination of it.
Personally, I'd love to hear about your startup in 6-12 months time (if you've continued with it) and how well you're doing, so if you do continue with your idea and you're a squijillionaire by that time, drop me a line. My email is in my profile. Feel free to call me all sorts of four letter words and tell me I was wrong :)
And I will report back about my startup on demo day in August -- I'd rather it be a "you can succeed if you weren't accepted" story rather than a "told you so" one, because frankly I think pg et al. are perfectly confident with the startups they have chosen. Unfortunately I have two very challenging startups at the same time, but fortunately both are well under way!
Edit: None of the websites in my profile are my startup unless it explicitly is prefaced with startup:.
Ah gotcha, well then I shall retract my previous statement.
I wasn't aware of the quote :)
But still the offer stands, I love talking to people about their startups (as well as my own) and discussing various perspectives. I think lines of communication are important!
Well actually I'm glad you pointed it out. I'm sure several people had thought/would have thought it was an arrogant quote.
Yes, there should be a way of communicating more easily. Why isn't chatterous embedded in HN? I've been tempted to create a portal that keeps track of startups (techcrunch and wikipedia are no good for this). It would probably be a waste of time... or would it?
I'd be shocked if the emails weren't all identical -- even if it only took five minutes to compose each email, that would be a week of work.
And after all, for 99% of applications there's really no need to say anything different. For the 1% where some extra explanation is useful, they can send separate emails later.
A waitlist would imply that people were basically good enough, whereas pg has always said that if they like a group, they'll take them - it's not as if there is a number of accepted groups that is set in stone.
Wow, fine, whatever. Then use your god damn imagination as to what the strata could be. My point is that they could have prepared more than one type of rejection e-mail.
That's the significant thing I'm adding to the discussion, so please respond to that, rather than trying to disprove some other minor point I'm not even trying to make.
If I sound like I'm pissed, it's because I am. This happens all the fucking time on HN, and the snarky replies are the ones that get upvoted.
Uh..ease up. He's pretty much just repeating their criteria verbatim, which are relevant regardless of what the strata names are. If they're prepared to fund 1,000 companies they think are _really_ likely to make it, I think that implies there's no need for strata. The only way 'close' would make sense is if there were a cap, otherwise I'm sure they'd still accept a not-quite-ready idea they really, really liked.
Thank you for explaining what his post said. And thank you again for then paraphrasing his post. And, a third thanks, for ignoring the main argument in my last post, and continuing to nullify the types of e-mails that I pulled out of my ass, specifically, the "close" e-mail.
And, yet, I'm still at a loss as to why it is unreasonable to think that there could be different generic e-mails sent out to different groups.
>>If they're prepared to fund 1,000 companies they think are _really_ likely to make it, I think that implies there's no need for strata.
Only if every company not accepted was rejected for precisely the same reason, and this reason could not at all be broken down at all. Do you think that is likely?
Perhaps somebody could list out all of the YC philosophies of acceptance, and every type of generic e-mail that wouldn't make sense to send; then we could use deduction to solve this mystery of no stratified rejection e-mails.
All I set out to do was test the hypothesis: Were there different rejection letters sent, because it seems pretty reasonable that there would be. Maybe some letters would contain feedback, albeit generic? After all, they need to make a conscientious decision to accept/deny, why not have a few reasons for denying? I even proposed a method to test out this hypothesis.
Thank you to everyone who did the MD5 to verify that there was only 1 type of e-mail sent. That's what I was looking for.
But when I get in return, and not just on this thread, are people talking about the YC acceptance process as if they are part of YC, or (in this case) paraphrasing the fucking rejection letter or YC application notes, I find that to be really annoying. I can read and understand things myself. It would be a disservice to myself if I didn't express that annoyance.
Thats the MD5 we got as well with the website. Oddly, when I did `echo "We're sorry … Y Combinator Staff" | md5`, I got a different sum (f807496243cc18b53929b313c410f64a).
//edit: The website seems to strip out blank lines, while echoing it doesn't. Solves that (trivially minor) issue I suppose.
Of course the YC connections were the first things on my mind. I don't think you can equate them to hard cash. It's just that the cash would have given me the chance to quit consulting and go 100% on my idea. But it's not the end of the world.
I think second to the valuable networking opportunities YC provides, the money that could be spent not worrying about rent and the bills for at least a couple months is not insignificant. I know personally it's not a huge deal to have that money and we're continuing regardless of rejection, but that kind of money could possibly shave off a few months of development time where I don't have to worry so much about classes and contract work to pay for stuff at the same time, while I would also have an opportunity to work in person with the other developer in the group...someone who lives across the country from me (but that I've gotten to know well over the years online).
I know we could get $10k+ from other sources, but when it's not from a venture firm like YC and it's instead from our own savings and from friends/family like we have considered before, it's a lot harder to accept.
I don't know how to say this gently, but YC money should be harder to accept. After all, they don't have a pre-existing relationship with you, and friends and family do.
It's a bit as if you're saying that it is easier to accept money from 'strangers'.
Personally I think that if your idea has merit and 10k is the big issue that you should get an extra job, save like the devil for the next 10 months to a year and then do it anyway. And face up to the fact that if 10k is the real problem that your idea may not have as much merit as you think after all.
I know this sounds quite harsh but good ideas + good teams are not going to go down because of a little bit of $.
Haha, please be as harsh as you originally meant to be, I know what you mean.
I find any money hard to accept, stranger or not. To me, applying to YC (and all the possible consequences) was a harder decision than the decision to not accept friends/family money because it is from "strangers", and that's money I typically find hardest to accept.
However, while in a way preexisting relationships can be helpful, sometimes they can be a negative. I have lots of friends but not many that can honestly afford to chip in anywhere near that much (we're all entering that phase of student loans and new families). I have family but they usually want extortionate shares or interest in exchange (think like half of revenue for chipping in $20k at the beginning), plus the whole time provide the massive emotional burden of "you're a failure to this family if you don't succeed wildly". So given the alternatives, I'd prefer a more impartial stranger or group of strangers that don't do something like that, that can provide me with more than just money and a lot of international nagging.
That being said, I'd be stupid to think that $10k is a big issue. It's not, I hope it never comes to that, and I never have thought it to be at any point...in fact, this topic is the first time I even considered the idea of $10k or even $20k being a big issue, and I had to laugh at it. I have more than that in my savings alone, and although I like to have a little financial cushion at all times, I would consider using most of it for the startup if need be. It's just not money I can easily part with for the sake of working fulltime on the startup during the summer when the original pre-ycombinator plan was to do that anyway, just with some low maintenance/effort contract work on the side at the same time to take care of the small bills and inevitable money we'll need anyway.
I have no doubt that YC provides great networking opportunities. My question was in direct response to nanexcool's comment that the cash would have given him the chance.
Yeah, but I was guessing nanexcool's reason for saying that was similar to mine and it turns out I wasn't too far off ;)
I doubt many people are just going to give up right now after rejection even (and especially) if they had a good idea, it's just that YC would have helped a ton.
Of course not! I'm still going to do my thing! I'm just going to have to continue consulting to pay the bills. That's all I'm saying. The money would have let me work full-time on my startup.
My business model (tentatively) is the typical freemium with some ads. I will as you say, try to grow it from revenues generated. So the rate of growth will be tied to the revenues. I do not plan (now that YC is not an option) on raising capital.
if $$$ is a problem, can either bum around relatives and see if you can convince them to give you the loan or get one of those 10-30K @ 0% APR for 9 months credit card offers.
im looking for a technical co-founder,. i think i have the funding bit figured out if i found a technical co founder. at least i know a bit of people wit moola
If you are smart, you will be able to succeed anyway. Somehow it escapes us that companies can be built without being in SV and knowing everyone there. Sure, it would be a heck of a lot easier if we were there and did make connections.
I'm not sure what exactly lead up to this scenario, how MS was able to talk with IBM execs, but you have to give MS credit for securing this business deal:
Well I'm going to throw a different idea out there. I applied to YC with a friend last year, we were rejected.
It was a very difficult idea to pitch.
We thought our idea was the best thing since sliced bread and all of our friends told us so (this should have been a warning sign... false positives)
We went on to building it anyway.
We got a version built, up and running in a couple months after initially dragging our feet. It basically worked, but poorly - we never took into account that battery life would be an issue on the phone app.
We got a little disheartened, started bickering and eventually the thing failed - before we even launched.
Somehow we had gotten the idea in our head that we needed YC to be successful. No, we needed a good idea and our idea was, at the time, not so good.
Not being accepted isn't the worst thing in the world. Everyone thinks their idea is the best idea EVER... We sure did.
The partnership broke down as a result of us forging ahead anyway without really looking at our product and only talking to people who only gave us positive answers.
Anyway, moral of the story for us? Being rejected was the best thing that could have happened for us.
I learned a lot about the other person during this process and also a lot about myself. I'm not bulletproof.
On reflection, I also learned that being unwilling to discuss my idea openly with others for fear of it being stolen was stupid. We would have discovered flaws early on and saved us a lot of trouble.
Some people tell me it's stupid, I ask them why and we discuss it. Some others tell me it's interesting, and we discuss it. Some tell me it's great and we discuss it.
I refuse to accept simple answers now and discuss as many different aspects as I can think up. I also appreciate other's perspectives on it.
This has also helped cement the idea in my head and I can pitch it relatively easily now. I've come up with a solution to a problem, rather than having a solution and looking for a problem.
Will I apply to YC again? Probably, I'm not sure. I've got a clearer head now - not so caught up in the hype.
To reiterate, getting rejected is not the worst thing in the world. It's just one avenue in the startup process. you should think of YC as a tool to help you get where you want to be, rather than the destination.
We got our beta up and running this weekend, and we're fixing up bugs so we can expand and planning our commercial launch, so it's not the worst thing in the world. Better to get rejected at 18 when you've never done anything web-related before than to get rejected for the same circumstances at an older age.
Hopefully I'll see all of you posting about your launches on HN! I'm certain I'll be posting in a month or so and I'd love to see everybody do the same.
Why is age such a bad thing :) I'm 20 and we also got rejected, but one of us happens to be in her 50s and doesn't consider this the worst thing in the world (or even, the worst thing to happen to our startup).
Same here. We have a team of 20-year olds an one 52 year-old. The grandpa of us bunch didn't see the same excitement in this opportunity as the young'uns did. Rejection here as well...would have been a heck of a summer in San Francisco, instead it will have to be an awesome 4 months in Bloomington, IN, home of Indiana University!
Our 3 person startup's disappointment at YC rejection is strongly correlated with age. The ancient one in our group (ha) is disappointed but thinks the challenges we've faced to even get started were more problematic than what we're going to miss out on, while I'm sad we're missing out on the connections, and the youngest seems to be most disappointed over everything YC could have given us. It's our collective first rejection, may there be many more until we just bootstrap and get this startup going anyway! :D
Age is seriously but a number. Who cares if your 18 or 52. In fact having a dynamic team with experience people and young people is great. Our company is run by a guy that is in his late 30s and the co founder is in his early 30s and I can honestly say that a young guy couldnt do half the stuff these guys can...
Sometimes age is totally a good thing :) And btw im 24 and on my second startup so I beat you 18 year old shits.
Correction: you haven't beaten the 18/19/20/whatever year-old shits...yet. Give us a few years to be 24 :)
Age does matter. People of different age have different priorities, bottom line. Our 52 year-old has children our age and is much less concerned with the exciting opportunities engendered through YC and much more focused on just getting the business off the ground with something to show for it.
Maybe if we were both more clear about the point we were trying to make, we would agree :) Fact of the matter is that age isn't a sole determining factor of one's entrepreneurial mindset, but it nevertheless plays a role, albeit small or significant depending on the person. I've partnered with a mid-30's guy who in the end wasn't fulfilling his responsibilities because he was in the midst trying to get a job and feed his wife and son.
I'm now experiencing a partnership with a mid-50's guy. I'm working alongside him and several others my age. What can I say? I am experiencing exactly what I speak of right now. We have different personal goals but the beauty of it all is that no matter our personal goals we are all headed in the same direction.
So no hating here. Both young and old make for great entrepreneurs, just many times with different personal goals. What exactly are we arguing?
I guess that depends on what you're doing. For me? Not so much as being rich and famous as it is about paying the bills while helping solve problems people have.
Also, you're making me feel older than I should. Please get off my lawn ;)
20? You're old, man. You're like leather jackets and top hats. You've seen the 80s. It's like wack.
I'm one of those annoying disciples who thinks that being rich and famous is the totally coolest part of America, and I bug everybody else trying to be it. Either 7 years from now I'll grow up, or 2 years from now I'll totally be one of those hip Hollywood cats.
There's a quote often attributed (I don't know for sure if he actually said it or not) to comedian Bill Murray on the topic of being rich and famous that says something along the lines of "Try being just rich first and see if that isn't enough for you." Seems like an approach worth considering.
I loved the YC process. They asked the right questions on their application form - which helped us a lot in getting a clearer idea of the venture. The prospect of an interview also pushed us to develop a demo quicker than we would have (which we just finished - didn't submit before the deadline).
So thanks to the YC process itself, we NOW have a presentation deck ready and a demo and can charge full steam ahead regardless. YC for us would have been a nice-to-have, not essential. We have a fairly interesting idea and a background which included two of us having founded startups in the recent past (one of them being www.alertle.com - check it out for UI design), being speakers of Ruby on Rails and AJAX at conferences, and work experience at other startups and places like Merrill Lynch. And of course, a CS background. We didn't even get an interview.
I'm assuming the calibre of teams accepted would have been pretty extraordinary this year. Good luck to all! :)
I feel as if rejection here shouldn't really be a motivating factor! There should be so many reasons above proving YC wrong to be a motivated entrepreneur. But whatever gets you going I guess...
I hope you enjoy your move to the Bay area. It's delightful.
And, if you want to get to know some people in the Hacker community, http://HackersandFounders.com gets together every couple of weeks. Let me know you're coming, and I'll buy you a beer. :)
I think that we all wish that we could get the YC sessions, but we actually have a lot of cool people show up to our meetups that you can talk with and learn from. I always have at least 3 or 4 great conversations that I learn from.
We have guys who're working on their 4th and 5th startups. We have guys attend who have exited and are looking for the next go around. We have startup owners that have been in business for several years.
A lot of guys are just starting out on their own, and are interested in feedback on their apps, or whatever they're working on. And, people generally buy pitchers of beer, so if you're broke, you don't have to worry about it. :)
My concern is good neighbourhood, is closed to tech events and of course has to be ramen-affordable too! I know it's possible to find the best of everything.
Personally I'm partial to the Mountain View/Palo Alto area. Not exactly ramen-affordable though. Sunnyvale/Santa Clara is cheaper, but it's all strip malls and tract housing.
> PG: can we _still_hang_out_ with you guys on meetup nights. I'm serious.
If they let anyone who wanted come, then it wouldn't be so exclusive and it would lose some of its value. I know I'd love to go to those meetups if I were in the area, and so would 423442342 other people.
I have seen from others that kept watch to see if their beta was visited and they were not. I don't believe they test out most of the web applications that get submitted. So not having one didn't hurt you at all. They say it is good to have a beta, but I don't really believe it. Even in the interviews it is said they spend less then a minute checking out any beta. It is apparently just not really important.
What really matters is your determination and team. A few hundred words hardly puts them in a position to provide you valuable feedback on those factors.
Sure, other things matter more, but getting feedback certainly wouldn't hurt. Especially feedback coming from YC, because I respect their opinion and tend to think they know what they are talking about.
And, obviously, if I got feedback, I could always ignore it and be in the same position as I am now. I'd rather have more information than less.
A rejection doesn't mean there was anything wrong with your application / start-up / you personally at all.
All it means is that there were other start-ups that caught their attention more.
You have to remember that they look at this as a business process, and a huge part of that process is "can we make money off of this as well"; it's tough to ascertain that over a video.
Keep on trucking, and I'm sure you'll do fine. It's 90% perspiration anyways.
Feedback wouldn't necessarily be very useful. The feedback might be a meaningless number such as '42' in the Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy Deep Thought (which doesn't really explain the result of the question).
Absolutely fueled the fire. Don't consider it rejection as much as "non-selection" as someone else said. It doesn't mean you have a bad idea or aren't good at what you do. There are just so many spots. If you believe in what you have, you find a way to make it work.
The fact that it might be a good thing is personal (aside from the added desire, which could very well be the final straw to motivate whomever to do whatever). I was a bit nervous about quitting my job - that decision has been made for me.
Rejected too here. =) But, the disappointment feeling is not as huge as i thought it would be.
Maybe the YC process itself has been beneficial in terms of helping us refining the idea, and also maybe because we have agreed to give our best shot on it, and whatever happen, we'll keep charging ahead. After all, Colonel Sanders got 1009 rejections and still came up as successful entrepreneur.
So, please wait for our launch announcement on HN sometime in short future! Good luck all!
Imagine the possibilities if we gathered all the troops (rejected troops that is) and brainstormed one sweet startup. Not realistic but how cool would that be?
What does it mean when you didn't receive a rejection email.
BUT
You also didn't get anything saying you got it.
Was there a point that they just stopped reading the applications?
I wonder if we can set up a private forum for all of us this summer that develop our idea anyway. Maybe we can share ideas/thoughts and beta test each other's stuff.
At the end of the summer, if we get a lot of us, we could create a a big page for all of to show off our stuff.
A friend of mine got rejected two (maybe three?) years ago from YC applying solo and his rejection explicitly said they were looking for teams for the program and not individuals.
Again, this was at least two years ago so things may well have changed.
first time applying and first rejection. i am a little disappointed, i feel very passionately about my idea and was hoping pg+co would be too - but ah well, it's going to happen anyway to happen regardless. best of luck to all and hope that everyone moves forward with their ideas as well.
Even the best application will max out at [choose-your-pessimism]% chance of success. Apply elsewhere and often. And apply for YC again next time. Max out quality and quantity of applications for funding. If it's a good idea, you'll get your money/support you need.
If someone wants to be a technical partner with me just email me digizal08@gmail.com its a e-commerce company that will make money off the bat.
Plus I at least know a few VCs if I were really serious about funding, I just need a technical co-founder which is why im guessing I got a flat out rejection.
There's probably too many rejections to give any feedback. I mean if there were 10,000 to 20,000 groups that applied it would be impossible to send a reason in the email to each group. Besides it all comes down to a numerical rating (sauce for the goose). Kudos to the bird with a golden egg.
I think two years ago, the last they posted their numbers, there were 421 applications. This year, I'm just guessing, but likely somewhere between 2 to 4 times that.
They are no longer posting their numbers, so don't ask.
Don't sweat the rejection. It's probably very difficult to get accepted to ycombinator. The odds are probably better winning a royal flush or x... than getting accepted to ycombinator. Cudos for the three strikes law....
Maybe worth a shot regardless, but from talking to other people I know applied and also rejected in the past few minutes (including myself), we seem to pretty much all fall under that "good but pushed out by the best" category.
